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I mocked up a bit Mozarts Figaro..

Amazing. The spatialization could be improved a bit more (the 2nd version definitely is an improvement!). But the sforzandos of the strings and winds (did you use the portatos for Berlin Winds at 0:08, 0:20?) they are just terrific.

2nd listen: to increase the spatialization, I think maybe move the winds back a bit to sit nearer to where the horns are? (especially the flutes) Also at 1:27 the violins "A" doesn't sound connected to the rest of the phrase, and their sixteenths at 1:30 are too fast (they're not grace notes right?). Also at 0:27 those spiccatos should be more like short staccatos... Really nitpicking here... ;) man, the woodwinds just sound fantastic... you are gonna make me buy Berlin Woodwinds Alexander!!!
 
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Amazing. The spatialization could be improved a bit more (the 2nd version definitely is an improvement!). But the sforzandos of the strings and winds (did you use the portatos for Berlin Winds at 0:08, 0:20?) they are just terrific.

2nd listen: to increase the spatialization, I think maybe move the winds back a bit to sit nearer to where the horns are? (especially the flutes) Also at 1:27 the violins "A" doesn't sound connected to the rest of the phrase, and their sixteenths at 1:30 are too fast (they're not grace notes right?). Also at 0:27 those spiccatos should be more like short staccatos... Really nitpicking here... ;) man, the woodwinds just sound fantastic... you are gonna make me buy Berlin Woodwinds Alexander!!!

Hej Noam!

Thanks a lot. I will try that out. Actually I am working right now on the piece. Winds are Berlin (revive + legacy). When you buy them: Please tell the OT Guys why! :D I used the legato patches actually. My tip: Mix both versions together, detune the lines to color timbre which betters also the blend. Also eq the shit out the instruments, which means..try to use a mix of closed and room mics, but reduce the oompf and unnatural build up frequencies which occurs when stacking. Another trick is make "zig / zag" curves with cc1 to intensify vibrato. There is going a lot of stuff there in programming actually.
 
Another trick is make "zig / zag" curves with cc1 to intensify vibrato. There is going a lot of stuff there in programming actually.

Very interesting!

I knew about the "detuned layering" thing which overally gives a bit more presence. I have an idea about where you EQ to prevent build up, but would be very curious to see how you manage these zig-zags so it doesn't give a "bumpy" feeling.
 
Hi Alexander,

Thanks for sharing your mockup of this famous piece and my compliments for the result!

By accident, I had a version almost ready of this work on my HD. So please allow me to upload it here. I started the mockup to test VSL Synchron Strings, mainly because the classical style of the Nozze should fit the this VSL library very well I hoped. While working on this I decided to have the full orchestra version after all. All instruments are VSL based, except for the timpani. I used Elite Orchestral Percussion, that has such nice wood hits in their timpani offered, as I understood, this was quite common in Mozart's days.

Anyway, what a masterpiece of music this is, I tried to follow all indicated articultions in the score as much as possible. It was a challenge to have everything as I wanted: presto legato, up down bows, maintaining clarity a.o..

So here we go, a different version in many aspects: interpretation, verb settings etc.. I hope you all enjoy also this one, your feedback is more than welcome...

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/mozart_lndf-mp3.13461/][/AUDIOPLUS]

[AUDIOPLUS=https://www.vi-control.net/community/attachments/mozart_lndf-mp3.13461/][/AUDIOPLUS]
 

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Hi Alexander,

Thanks for sharing your mockup of this famous piece and my compliments for the result!

By accident, I had a version almost ready of this work on my HD. So please allow me to upload it here. I started the mockup to test VSL Synchron Strings, mainly because the classical style of the Nozze should fit the this VSL library very well I hoped. While working on this I decided to have the full orchestra version after all. All instruments are VSL based, except for the timpani. I used Elite Orchestral Percussion, that has such nice wood hits in their timpani offered, as I understood, this was quite common in Mozart's days.

Anyway, what a masterpiece of music this is, I tried to follow all indicated articultions in the score as much as possible. It was a challenge to have everything as I wanted: presto legato, up down bows, maintaining clarity a.o..

So here we go, a different version in many aspects: interpretation, verb settings etc.. I hope you all enjoy also this one, your feedback is more than welcome...

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/mozart_lndf-mp3.13461/][/AUDIOPLUS]

Hej Erik, Cool. Let me listen on my monitors then and I will make a couple of notes to give you some feedback. Thank you in advance for sharing. Looking forward to your version!

@NoamL I loaded up an update and I putted the winds, especially the flutes more back. You were completely right with that!
 
Hi Alexander,

Thanks for sharing your mockup of this famous piece and my compliments for the result!

By accident, I had a version almost ready of this work on my HD. So please allow me to upload it here. I started the mockup to test VSL Synchron Strings, mainly because the classical style of the Nozze should fit the this VSL library very well I hoped. While working on this I decided to have the full orchestra version after all. All instruments are VSL based, except for the timpani. I used Elite Orchestral Percussion, that has such nice wood hits in their timpani offered, as I understood, this was quite common in Mozart's days.

Anyway, what a masterpiece of music this is, I tried to follow all indicated articultions in the score as much as possible. It was a challenge to have everything as I wanted: presto legato, up down bows, maintaining clarity a.o..

So here we go, a different version in many aspects: interpretation, verb settings etc.. I hope you all enjoy also this one, your feedback is more than welcome...

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/mozart_lndf-mp3.13461/][/AUDIOPLUS]


OH Erik. I listened a couple of times to your version. Before I do write an essay I would like to ask: What was or is your goal with that mockup? Was it for personal studies (like harmony, form, melody, orchestration) or maybe just testing synchron strings out of the box or are you aiming more to make a realistic performance? <--- If this is the case I have a couple of more notes..and so I ask.

First thing just in general: You should not only rely on markings and illustrations in the score. You can and should use the score for reference which is always a good thing to do, but you should use a live recording for reference too! Did you do that? From your comment I would say not really, right?
Anyways let me know if want an indepth feedback which is aimed more to the real thing what I was talking about. Because there I have a lot more to say..Thank you :)
 
OH Erik. I listened a couple of times to your version. Before I do write an essay I would like to ask: What was or is your goal with that mockup? Was it for personal studies (like harmony, form, melody, orchestration) or maybe just testing synchron strings out of the box or are you aiming more to make a realistic performance? <--- If this is the case I have a couple of more notes..and so I ask.

First thing just in general: You should not only rely on markings and illustrations in the score. You can and should use the score for reference which is always a good thing to do, but you should use a live recording for reference too! Did you do that? From your comment I would say not really, right?
Anyways let me know if want an indepth feedback which is aimed more to the real thing what I was talking about. Because there I have a lot more to say..Thank you :)

Hi Alexander,
I made this mockup for I think many of the reasons you were talking about. Not one very specific one, except maybe the outcome of the SyS. I listened to a few recordings, mainly with the old instruments (Marcon a.o.), not so much with the bigger orchestra's.
I didn't use on of them as reference track btw.
As mentioned your feedback is welcome!
 
Incidentally, I played the "real or fake" test of @DarkestShadow for half a dozen music supervisors here in Hollywood who believe they can tell the difference, and none of them scored any better than a coin toss would have. I think this piece would do the trick too.
I think that aswell.
And really fun to hear that I did so well with this compilation! :geek::geek:
It's sure good for ones own mockups to know what sounds convincing and what not.
 
Thanks! Well I didn´t felt to much verb, but according to very dry recordings it has a bit more reverb. My setting is influenced by big orchestra recordings in a hall.
Yeah I guess its a matter of taste :P. Like normally I like a big sound but here for me it could be a little bit dryer
 
Just mock up that first agile run in the beginning. It teaches you a cool orchestrational preset.

Hey Alexander, amazing mock-up and a really outstanding intro. Could you please tell us what patch you used to get this blurry but still (for me) natural sounding run at the beginning?

I hope it's not a specific kind of run library, as they aren't really playable, but given the natural result it wouldn't surprise me that much:)
 
Hey Alexander, amazing mock-up and a really outstanding intro. Could you please tell us what patch you used to get this blurry but still (for me) natural sounding run at the beginning?

I hope it's not a specific kind of run library, as they aren't really playable, but given the natural result it wouldn't surprise me that much:)

No run library.
I used for Cellos / DB MA 3 (8va Sus Rep), for Violas Hollywood Strings (runs), for Violins a mix of Chamber Strings (Violin agile runs), Short Spics from Berlin, Bassoon from Berlin (Shorts and legatos layered) + free solo violin from Performance Samples. Rest is programming and the way how I changed the patches from the factory presets. Also I equed the instruments (sometimes a lot)
 
Hi Alexander,

Thanks for sharing your mockup of this famous piece and my compliments for the result!

By accident, I had a version almost ready of this work on my HD. So please allow me to upload it here. I started the mockup to test VSL Synchron Strings, mainly because the classical style of the Nozze should fit the this VSL library very well I hoped. While working on this I decided to have the full orchestra version after all. All instruments are VSL based, except for the timpani. I used Elite Orchestral Percussion, that has such nice wood hits in their timpani offered, as I understood, this was quite common in Mozart's days.

Anyway, what a masterpiece of music this is, I tried to follow all indicated articultions in the score as much as possible. It was a challenge to have everything as I wanted: presto legato, up down bows, maintaining clarity a.o..

So here we go, a different version in many aspects: interpretation, verb settings etc.. I hope you all enjoy also this one, your feedback is more than welcome...

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/mozart_lndf-mp3.13461/][/AUDIOPLUS]

Ok, I will not comment the whole track (the post would be like 5 pages long), but the a part of the track and the comments I will do here but will apply to your whole track because they are general things I will mention.

1. Your intro Run:

1. It misses definition and slur. By definition I mean you still need to hear those accented shorter notes by slur I mean you need to hear that the transitions start to sound slight of out tune and that they have this kind of fuzz. How to achieve that? Use not that legato patches alone. Use Spiccato articulations playing at quite dynamics, use slurred articulations on the Vloas more prominently because the Vloas is the glue from the CB / DB to the Bassoon. Where is your bassson? The bassoon is here important for the color imprint of that run. Listen to your run and then to my run. In my run you can clearly make out the bassoon as the coloring counterpart instrument. Those things which I mentioned for the strings here applies also for the bassoon. Your whole run doesn´t work at all because it is to clean, too even and it misses the single note punctuations which comes from the rebowing from the strings (retonging from the winds).

2. Next part

Your winds pop in and they don´t sing. They are flat dead there. Put more love into the CC1 and really think of like a woman you adore and that you want to flirt with her using those winds. They need a musical swell and more vibrato and a natural short descrescendo. Another point: Your passing notes are almost inaudible but they are crucial for the melodic frame there. (7 seconds). These are details of course but they are important in such piece. Use for that situations shorter articulations like a short portato or a normal short aritculation and layer them there. Those passing notes need definition. Also the orchestration and timbre there is wrong. First time Focus is Oboes, second time Flutes stacked with Clarinettes. Your second time is still Oboe focus which is not authentic.


3. Your loud tutti String part

Your Violins doing the divisi leading line are too long, they don´t swell, they have no accent, they just are dead flat out straight without a decrescendo, they have no audible gaps.So, to better them: Use an accented molto vibrato patch OR if you not able. Take your most expressivo Violin patch available layer a short articulation over it to pronounce the note. Ride a controller curve with a short swell to maximum with a followed drescendo. Make short pauses. Shorten release times because otherwise the soup with blur too much.
Your second part of the theme needs much shorter notes, some kind spiccatissimo articulations with shorten release times. Otherwise like in your example you have "mush" again.
Your timpani is total unmusical and too loud, it is like the guy at the timpani thinks: You know what I have my own concert here. The timings of the timpani ARE NOT on the grid they need to accent the musical violin crescendo, they need to emphasize that. Your timpani needs to be quiter in timbre and timed a bit later.

Ok, apply those things to your other parts I am pretty sure you can improve those things in your mockup. :) And don´t get me wrong: I appreciate that you posted your mockup here and I encourage others to do so as well. You can only learn when sharing your experience.

One last general idea or tip: Work with your ears and not with what the developer tells you to do. So when you feel that the legato or whatever patch doesn´t work good, shit on that and take another patch. In the end it doesn´t matter what you use, it only matters that it sounds good in the end.
 
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Very nice Mockup Alexander, I for one prefer version A as it tames a bit some loud dynamics. I'm sure you already tried it but I would consider just reducing reverb decay of version A while keeping the same reverb mix asset. I could be wrong but perhaps reducing the tail of the late reverb could give a bit of less hangar like effect to the mix.

a cool work!
Luca
 
Wow!!! I'm speechless this truly sounds incredible. Sure there a great level of definition in the mockup but what amazes me the most is the expression you were able to render. Remarkable job!
 
Ok, I will not comment the whole track (the post would be like 5 pages long), but the a part of the track and the comments I will do here but will apply to your whole track because they are general things I will mention.

1. Your intro Run:

1. It misses definition and slur. By definition I mean you still need to hear those accented shorter notes by slur I mean you need to hear that the transitions start to sound slight of out tune and that they have this kind of fuzz. How to achieve that? Use not that legato patches alone. Use Spiccato articulations playing at quite dynamics, use slurred articulations on the Vloas more prominently because the Vloas is the glue from the CB / DB to the Bassoon. Where is your bassson? The bassoon is here important for the color imprint of that run. Listen to your run and then to my run. In my run you can clearly make out the bassoon as the coloring counterpart instrument. Those things which I mentioned for the strings here applies also for the bassoon. Your whole run doesn´t work at all because it is to clean, too even and it misses the single note punctuations which comes from the rebowing from the strings (retonging from the winds).

2. Next part

Your winds pop in and they don´t sing. They are flat dead there. Put more love into the CC1 and really think of like a woman you adore and that you want to flirt with her using those winds. They need a musical swell and more vibrato and a natural short descrescendo. Another point: Your passing notes are almost inaudible but they are crucial for the melodic frame there. (7 seconds). These are details of course but they are important in such piece. Use for that situations shorter articulations like a short portato or a normal short aritculation and layer them there. Those passing notes need definition. Also the orchestration and timbre there is wrong. First time Focus is Oboes, second time Flutes stacked with Clarinettes. Your second time is still Oboe focus which is not authentic.


3. Your loud tutti String part

Your Violins doing the divisi leading line are too long, they don´t swell, they have no accent, they just are dead flat out straight without a decrescendo, they have no audible gaps.So, to better them: Use an accented molto vibrato patch OR if you not able. Take your most expressivo Violin patch available layer a short articulation over it to pronounce the note. Ride a controller curve with a short swell to maximum with a followed drescendo. Make short pauses. Shorten release times because otherwise the soup with blur too much.
Your second part of the theme needs much shorter notes, some kind spiccatissimo articulations with shorten release times. Otherwise like in your example you have "mush" again.
Your timpani is total unmusical and too loud, it is like the guy at the timpani thinks: You know what I have my own concert here. The timings of the timpani ARE NOT on the grid they need to accent the musical violin crescendo, they need to emphasize that. Your timpani needs to be quiter in timbre and timed a bit later.

Ok, apply those things to your other parts I am pretty sure you can improve those things in your mockup. :) And don´t get me wrong: I appreciate that you posted your mockup here and I encourage others to do so as well. You can only learn when sharing your experience.

One last general idea or tip: Work with your ears and not with what the developer tells you to do. So when you feel that the legato or whatever patch doesn´t work good, shit on that and take another patch. In the end it doesn´t matter what you use, it only matters that it sounds good in the end.

Thank you Alexander for your detailled input, to keep it short: I need to come up with something better apparently! I'll fire the timpani player today btw, who the hell he think he is. :)
I'll let you know when a next version is presentable. Thanks again, enough material to reconsider.

I can't find the woodwinds mistake btw: do you mean m.8-m10? In all scores on ISMLP there is twice the oboe stacked with the horns. Maybe you're referring to another spot?

btw: I wasn't able to upload this track into Soundcloud becaused it matched with a copyrighted existing performance that I even wasn't aware of: "Marriage of Figaro, KV 492" by Anton Nanut. I found this later on Spotify.
 
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Hi Alexander,

Thanks for sharing your mockup of this famous piece and my compliments for the result!

By accident, I had a version almost ready of this work on my HD. So please allow me to upload it here. I started the mockup to test VSL Synchron Strings, mainly because the classical style of the Nozze should fit the this VSL library very well I hoped. While working on this I decided to have the full orchestra version after all. All instruments are VSL based, except for the timpani. I used Elite Orchestral Percussion, that has such nice wood hits in their timpani offered, as I understood, this was quite common in Mozart's days.

Anyway, what a masterpiece of music this is, I tried to follow all indicated articultions in the score as much as possible. It was a challenge to have everything as I wanted: presto legato, up down bows, maintaining clarity a.o..

So here we go, a different version in many aspects: interpretation, verb settings etc.. I hope you all enjoy also this one, your feedback is more than welcome...

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/mozart_lndf-mp3.13461/][/AUDIOPLUS]

Wow, you did a superb job with this. And it is extremely interesting to compare with Alexander's version. You have a very few rough spots, as does Alexander, but I prefer the VSL sound for Mozart. I'm glad you posted this.
 
Wow, you did a superb job with this. And it is extremely interesting to compare with Alexander's version. You have a very few rough spots, as does Alexander, but I prefer the VSL sound for Mozart. I'm glad you posted this.

Paul, I appreciate your positive feedback. But..actually I have humbly to disagree. The VSL version is very different from what I have done here. And I don´t want to be rude to the poster, but it is in my opinion very ovbious. Regardless why that is (programming / samples) is another different subject which I tried to explain to Erik. I hope that this ok to say, but please go and listen to beethoven sized live performances by karajan, Muti etc.
 
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Paul, I appreciate your positive feedback. But..actually I have humbly to disagree. The VSL version is a farcry from what I have done here. And I don´t want to be rude to the poster, but it is in my opinion very ovbious. Regardless why that is (programming / samples). I hope that this ok to say, but please go and listen to beethoven sized live performances by karajan, Muti etc.

I often wonder why those of us who truly love music sometimes hear things a bit differently from each other. Perhpas it is because I have old ears. Please do not take my preference for VSL samples in this case as a criticism of your work Alexander. Your work is marvelous!
 
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