# Big Fish Audio Custom Kontakt Loop Interface



## Big Fish Audio (Aug 18, 2011)

Here at Big Fish we have been working on our new custom Kontakt interface. This is a great way for our Kontakt users to use our loops in a whole new way. Check out this video to see what it's all about. Keep an eye out on our new releases as many of them will have an option to buy the product in kontakt format with these new features. Epic Drums II is the first to be released with this custom kontakt formatting with many more to come.

Check out our tutorial video here!
http://youtu.be/VFYSx82YdHI

Our Kontakt formatted products will include patches of each construction kit, allowing for quick and easy arrangements of the parts. In addition there are "sliced loops" patches which lay out each individual slice of a loop on the keys to create new and original custom parts. Finally, the Kontakt version contains various patches of multi-samples to help you supplement the loops from this library. You'll find patches of drum rolls, percussion fx, risers, low frequency hits, as well as a number of "one-shots" of many of the instruments in this library to help you create custom parts, fills, and endings. All in All, we're sure you'd agree that Epic Drums II is the new standard for drums and percussion for the modern film score.


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## zvenx (Aug 21, 2011)

looks very interesting....
thanks for sharing... 

rsp


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## noiseboyuk (Aug 21, 2011)

Looks very nicely done!


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## Jarkko Hietanen (Aug 21, 2011)

That actually looks very nice. I love making my own percussion work using single shots but sometimes I finish off the manually done stuff by layering heavily edited/effectized loops in the mix. Really makes things interesting and full sounding. This interface has a lot of things I'd appreaciate when messing around with those loops.


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## Brobdingnagian (Aug 21, 2011)

Well done. This is very creative and shows great foresight, innovation and takes into account a pragmatic workflow. Looking forward to putting some of these thru their paces.
-B


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## Ztarr (Aug 21, 2011)

Nice. What about for people that have already purchased Epic Drums II?


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## Big Fish Audio (Aug 22, 2011)

Thanks for the comments everybody. We're glad this will be put to good use by many of you. This is definitely version 1.0 of this type of formatting of our products. We would definitely like to develop new features and functionality to make it even a better workflow using our loops in kontakt. In addition we will soon make these available in kontakt 5 format, taking advantage of a big upgrade in time stretching of the loops as well as many additional effects. Very cheap crossgrades will be made available for anybody who purchased a different format and would like to get the kontakt format as well. Simply call our toll free number and someone in customer service will help you out. (800) 717-3474


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## stonzthro (Aug 22, 2011)

Nice work!


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## jamwerks (Aug 22, 2011)

Seems very well thought out. Nice work !!


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## gsilbers (Aug 22, 2011)

good but if i cant use these sample loops in commercial music libraries then ill pass for now.


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## zvenx (Aug 22, 2011)

did you read that somewhere and I missed it?
rsp


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## studioj (Aug 22, 2011)

hmmm the license agreement is sort of vague in that regard... saying use is license free for use in a derivative work but then going on to say not so in "music libraries" even if it is a derivative work. What does Big Fish define as a music library? Sometimes stuff that I create custom for a client gets shot down in the end and becomes part of my "library". I would think this would apply to a lot of folks here. This new interface looks very cool but I would need more clarification there before making any purchases.


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## Big Fish Audio (Aug 22, 2011)

A little clarity:

Our Kontakt Loop Interface will be included on many new upcoming releases and not just Epic Drums II. Epic Drums II is released through our "Funk/Soul" Brand of products. Many of the Funk/Soul branded libraries do have the restriction of use in "Muisc Libraries". 

We would define a music library as a collection of recorded music that can be licensed to customers for use in film, television, radio and other media. In most cases it is licensed on a nonexclusive basis. I don't think we would classify a personal catalog of music you are trying to sell as a "music library", unless you were licensing the music with non-exclusive use like a "production music library" company would do. 

Any Big Fish Audio library on our site (non funk/soul) *will not* typically restrict "Music Library" use, and if it does we most likely have included an option to get our "special use" license. This special use will allow you to use these products in music libraries as long as you meet a few of our conditions.

BFA license excerpt: 
_A "special use" license may be requested from Big Fish Audio, free of charge, if you wish to use this product as part of a musical work intended for use with music libraries (some conditions apply, and Big Fish Audio retains the right to refuse any request that does not meet those conditions)._

I hope this isn't causing more confusion but the bottom line is that the majority of products that will be released with the Kontakt Loop Interface won't have an issue with using the content for music to be used in a music library.


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## Ztarr (Aug 22, 2011)

Wow so I have to pay for the Kontakt version if I already own the previous version? 
Excuse my french but that sucks and is a huge turn off towards future BFA purchases for me.


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## gsilbers (Aug 22, 2011)

Ztarr @ Mon Aug 22 said:


> Wow so I have to pay for the Kontakt version if I already own the previous version?
> Excuse my french but that sucks and is a huge turn off towards future BFA purchases for me.



+1. maybe a small update fee. 

and for the licensing i understand, i guess its mainly so garageband composers/loop composers/video editors dont use these loops and compose the already composed versions of song. 
which sucks cause i use maybe one guitar loop and mangle it around or use bits and pieaces and getting a custom license for that is some red tape i dont wanna follow.


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## studioj (Aug 23, 2011)

Thanks for the info big fish audio. It sounds like its maybe not that big of a deal to get a "special case" license. There is probably just certain criteria that have to be met as gsilbers points to. Can this license be granted on a per purchased sample library basis? I wouldn't want to have to contact bfa for every track of mine containing bfa samples that ended up in my library (where it could be potentially licensed non-exclusively). again the kontakt interface looks top rate, very interested in checking it out.


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## Big Fish Audio (Aug 23, 2011)

StudioJ, the special use license is not issued per track but is issued as a blanket over the entire product the special use license has been granted for. Once we've granted you a special use license for a product you are good to go from that point on.


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## Stephan Lindsjo (Aug 31, 2011)

I wonder how long it takes to know if you will get a license for Epic drums 2?
I wrote this mail to you a week ago:

I need a special use license for epic drums 2 before I purchase the product. I'm a composer that mix loops from different libraries and also program drum patterns myself and make original music from the loops. I read on vi-control that you need this type of liscense to be able to liscense music with loops from epic drums 2 at music libraries. Take a look at my portfolio at audiosparx and you'll see what I compose for your decision:

Thanks in advance
Kind regards
Stephan
http://www.audiosparx.com/sa/artist/sou ... 27F7B55EAF

I'm still waiting, why?
/Stephan


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## gsilbers (Aug 31, 2011)

Stephan Lindsjo @ Wed Aug 31 said:


> I wonder how long it takes to know if you will get a license for Epic drums 2?
> I wrote this mail to you a week ago:
> 
> I need a special use license for epic drums 2 before I purchase the product. I'm a composer that mix loops from different libraries and also program drum patterns myself and make original music from the loops. I read on vi-control that you need this type of liscense to be able to liscense music with loops from epic drums 2 at music libraries. Take a look at my portfolio at audiosparx and you'll see what I compose for your decision:
> ...



he mentions this on a few posts above:

Our Kontakt Loop Interface will be included on many new upcoming releases and not just Epic Drums II. Epic Drums II is released through our "Funk/Soul" Brand of products. Many of the Funk/Soul branded libraries do have the restriction of use in "Muisc Libraries". 

but dunno if epic drums 2 is included or not there. 


at the same time... 

i cannot deal with this sort of stuff from big phish audio. i do some high profile shows that needs a very fast turn around or just worrying if i did or not clear that drum groove// or that extra step. 

id say make anything wiht the new kontakt interface to be open and not have to do a 
extra step for clearing the rights. and not have patches that have construction kits.


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## Big Fish Audio (Sep 1, 2011)

We do want to make sure everybody understands this. When you purchase a product you can request a special use license immediately after purchase. This library will be a a blanket license for all samples on the specified product. This license is good for eternity, and in addition you will not need to request a special use license for any further use of the samples of that product.


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## gsilbers (Sep 1, 2011)

Big Fish Audio @ Thu Sep 01 said:


> We do want to make sure everybody understands this. When you purchase a product you can request a special use license immediately after purchase. This library will be a a blanket license for all samples on the specified product. This license is good for eternity, and in addition you will not need to request a special use license for any further use of the samples of that product.



maybe Stephan's post was overlooked:


wonder how long it takes to know if you will get a license for Epic drums 2? 
I wrote this mail to you a week ago: 

I need a special use license for epic drums 2 before I purchase the product. I'm a composer that mix loops from different libraries and also program drum patterns myself and make original music from the loops. I read on vi-control that you need this type of liscense to be able to liscense music with loops from epic drums 2 at music libraries. Take a look at my portfolio at audiosparx and you'll see what I compose for your decision: 

Thanks in advance 
Kind regards 
Stephan 
http://www.audiosparx.com/sa/artist/sou ... 519100&CFT OKEN=ca0f8842e49cc3f6-4BB53822-B727-15E2-9606A427F7B55EAF 

I'm still waiting, why? 
/Stephan
________________


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## KMuzzey (Sep 1, 2011)

I must echo the previous poster's response, Big Fish: when writing to the [email protected] address for a special use license, or for any other reason, I've never ever ever received a reply. Ever. And I've written a few times since 2006-ish. If you're listing, as part of your terms and conditions, that one can email BigFish for a special use license, perhaps you could use an email address that is able to receive incoming email and reply. When I did need tech support with a library (the apple loops had audio clicks in some of them) I called directly and was given an email address, and that person then forwarded me to a tech support email person.

Kerry


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## Big Fish Audio (Sep 2, 2011)

We do apologize for any delay some of you may have had on our customer service emails. Occasionally we do find some email addresses that are blocked by our isp or end up in our junk folders. We do try to respond as quickly as possible to all incoming customer service emails. 



Big Fish Audio @ Mon Aug 22 said:


> Any Big Fish Audio library on our site (non funk/soul) *will not* typically restrict "Music Library" use, and if it does we most likely have included an option to get our "special use" license.



Again for clarification, we have a contractual obligation with most of the libraries produced by the Funk/Soul team not to allow use in music libraries (Including Epic Drums II). While other libraries on our site that have music library restrictions will be given "special use" licenses, the majority of funk/soul libraries are not eligible for "special use" licenses.

We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause. The great majority of products on our site don't restrict you at all from music library usage and with over 2,400 products on our site, and growing, we're sure you'll be able to find what you are looking for.


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## Stephan Lindsjo (Sep 2, 2011)

where do I find info about the license before I purchase a product on your site?


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## Audio Glitch (Sep 3, 2011)

> Again for clarification, we have a contractual obligation with most of the libraries produced by the Funk/Soul team not to allow use in music libraries (Including Epic Drums II). While other libraries on our site that have music library restrictions will be given "special use" licenses, the majority of funk/soul libraries are not eligible for "special use" licenses.



Right... :wink: and you have a team of dedicated lawyers with headphones on analyzing music non stop to determine which users have special licenses, which users do not, and which users download the loops off of torrent sites? Sounds to me like a gimmicky license to make more money 

Shouldn't the goal be to design sounds and tools for us to make music and to make money. Why do we need to buy special licenses to make money with your products? Isn't buying the product enough. If you want to make more money per unit just raise the product price rather then offering all these fake license options.

I never did get this concept


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## noiseboyuk (Sep 3, 2011)

Stephan Lindsjo @ Sat Sep 03 said:


> where do I find info about the license before I purchase a product on your site?



I agree, this information needs to be BIG, BOLD and CLEAR at point of sale. A list of products which need an extra license and a definitive list of products which can't be licensed at all for library would also be useful.


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## Audio Glitch (Sep 3, 2011)

> agree, this information needs to be BIG, BOLD and CLEAR at point of sale. A list of products which need an extra license and a definitive list of products which can't be licensed at all for library would also be useful.



+1 although,given the restrictions, if the terms were big bold and clear perhaps they would not sell nearly as many units unlike the way it is now with users buying products and not knowing about these special fake licenses.


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## P.T. (Sep 5, 2011)

This looks like a great product,
But I have to ask why a special license is required for certain uses if that license can be easily acquired at purchase, if requested.

Why isn't it simply a part of the main license?

ALSO,

I was just listening to Epic Drums 2.
Is the reverb burned into the samples or is it added?
Are the samples dry?

I guess this is also a general question about the libraries.


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## Andreas Moisa (Sep 6, 2011)

The Samples are dry and sound great!


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## stonzthro (Sep 6, 2011)

I contacted Big Fish about using some samples in a music library and never heard back. I used the email on the site and called and left a message - nothing. 

I would guess a lot of the construction kit libraries on Big Fish's site are probably culled from pre-existing production music tracks, which is one big reason to not allow it. As for the single hits and such - it's just lame business on their part. No one else does that (that I can think of).

With so many developers out there, there's no reason to buy something with such restrictive licensing terms. You buy a sample library, then realize later you need it for a production library track and have to hunt down something similar so you can create the track and buy it again from another source. Stupid.


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## Stephan Lindsjo (Sep 6, 2011)

Here's the answer I got:

"Hi Stephan,

Thank you for your inquiry. We are not able to provide a special use license for Epic Drums 2 due
to contractual obligations with the producer of this product. If there is another product you are
interested in, please email me directly at [email protected] and I will get back to
you immediately as to whether a special use license can be issued." 

I still wonder where I find info about the licenses of your products before I purchase them?


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## Big Fish Audio (Sep 6, 2011)

Below is an excerpt from our license agreement that goes on most of our "construction kit" products. Please note that issuing these license agreements are FREE. We are not making any extra money on these licenses.

_a "special use" license may be requested from Big Fish Audio, free of charge, if you wish to use this product as part of a musical work intended for use with music libraries (some conditions apply, and Big Fish Audio retains the right to refuse any request that does not meet those conditions). _


Stonzthro - I'm sorry about your trouble getting though to our customer service. When did you leave a message with us? Perhaps you can PM me and we'll take care of any issues you need to take care of. 

P.T. - The samples on Epic Drums 2 are dry. The online demos have added verb on them for overall effect. If you want to check out some samples click on the "free sample pack" tab on the Epic Drums II product page. There you can download a few free samples from the product.


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## Ed (Sep 6, 2011)

Big Fish Audio @ Tue Sep 06 said:


> Below is an excerpt from our license agreement that goes on most of our "construction kit" products. Please note that issuing these license agreements are FREE. We are not making any extra money on these licenses.
> 
> _a "special use" license may be requested from Big Fish Audio, free of charge, if you wish to use this product as part of a musical work intended for use with music libraries (some conditions apply, and Big Fish Audio retains the right to refuse any request that does not meet those conditions). _



How isolated would someones usage have to be in order for you to refuse?


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## stonzthro (Sep 6, 2011)

PM'd and got a return fast - we're now on track to getting my licensing issue addressed. Thanks to whoever is Big Fish Audio!


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## Big Fish Audio (Sep 6, 2011)

Ed @ Tue Sep 06 said:


> How isolated would someones usage have to be in order for you to refuse?



Basically we want to insure that people aren't using the main demo mix or recreating the main demo mix with the loops and submitting those to production music libraries. We want to ensure how people are using the samples before issuing the "special use license".


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