# Did I steal from a soundtrack? (Fantasy Style Idea)



## Lionel Schmitt (Aug 6, 2019)

Hi!

I'm working on some orchestral fantasy trailer tracks for a label and something in my head tells me that something too similar to this one track idea I have is somewhere out there and I heard it but don't remember haha.
So, is there some music that this idea may be too close to? (Certainly there are many similar pieces, but maybe something that goes beyond similar and makes it a copy)

A few seconds of piano sketch with the main ideas here - thanks for checking!


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## JohnG (Aug 6, 2019)

it's that first move to the flat-5 sounds quite reminiscent of one of the main Harry Potter motifs. Maybe that's it?


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## Lionel Schmitt (Aug 6, 2019)

JohnG said:


> it's that first move to the flat-5 sounds quite reminiscent of one of the main Harry Potter motifs. Maybe that's it?


Maybe... I have only listened to a tiny bit of Harry Potter some time ago, so I'm not sure. But you wouldn't say it's too close, right? Funnily Harry Potter vibe was a reference, so that's not too bad. :D

(edit) Do you mean that part at 2:06? This could be what ringed in my head harmonically...


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## Zero&One (Aug 6, 2019)

Harry Potter, and I've not seen them either


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## kyleogren (Aug 6, 2019)

very very similar to Harry Potter, I would say its pretty obvious that you took melodies and harmonies imo. Just a slightly different rhythm, but overall it clearly sounds like a Harry Potter rip off to me (whether consciously or not). Just my 2 cents!


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## JohnG (Aug 6, 2019)

I would do something else.


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## Rob (Aug 6, 2019)

definitely Potter... almost identical
1:09 of the video


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## Lionel Schmitt (Aug 6, 2019)

Thanks everyone. 
Looks like that Harry Potter part either cam out subconsciously when coming up with this (hmmm... barely remember having heard this theme, so not sure it sunk so deeply) or I just came up with it myself. Either way... I'll see if I can change it enough or do something else indeed.


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## Lionel Schmitt (Aug 6, 2019)

Would you say this one is quite safe? I'm trying to keep the overall idea but change the Potter bits...


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## brek (Aug 6, 2019)

Still has that b6 > 5 > #4 movement in the same rhythm at the very beginning. Right off the bat that makes it feel quite borrowed from HP.

Feel free to ignore any specific composition direction, but I would consider at least aiming for a different target note at the end of the phrase. D and F are the other choices in your chord, but those wouldn't be satisfying here as the point of this musical moment is to pull us out of the ordinary and into a mystical world. So what about an E instead (and change the harmony note too)? This is harmonically closer to HP, but, more importantly, the melody is not quite so "on the nose".

This is a nice piece, by the way.


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## Diablo IV (Aug 6, 2019)

Whatever you end up doing, don't throw it away, stash it for your own pleasure. Sounds amazing. What piano did you use?


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## Zero&One (Aug 6, 2019)

Personally, I prefer 0:42 onward. And it's away from the "potter notes"


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## Denkii (Aug 6, 2019)

Flame's lawyers and his Musicologist would sue you for less and still win.
But yeah...Harry Potter-ish


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## synergy543 (Aug 6, 2019)

JohnG said:


> it's that first move to the flat-5 sounds quite reminiscent of one of the main Harry Potter motifs. Maybe that's it?


The Katy Perry roe was over two notes, so now we're down to a single note? JW owns the flat 5s. OK, well, thank goodness there are 11 others still. Whew! Sometimes limitations helps inspire creativity.


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## JohnG (Aug 6, 2019)

synergy543 said:


> The Katy Perry roe was over two notes, so now we're down to a single note? JW owns the flat 5s. OK, well, thank goodness there are 11 others still. Whew! Sometimes limitations helps inspire creativity.



The four people just on this thread alone who took the time to listen all think it sounds like Harry Potter. It's not just one note; it's that move in this particular context that catches the ear.


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## NoamL (Aug 6, 2019)

It's not just the b6-5-#4 scale degrees that make it sound like Harry Potter

it's also that it copies the same rhythm as the Potter melody (quarter, 8th, dotted quarter), it's the same tempo, it's the same meter (6/8ish), and above all, it's also in the same place in the overall structure - the 2nd measure in the 8 measure form, or the "answer" of the A phrase, however you wanna think about it.

Even the measure before is very similar, you have two strong beats of *5*, *5* before you do the b6 5 #4 move. JW's melody is b3 *5* b3 *5* b3 6 5 #4.

This is why Katy Perry lost that lawsuit btw - not that she deserved to lose, but it's understandable that she did. I bet her lawyers stood in court and said "you can't copyright the minor scale!" like the way Adam Neely wants to frame this case, and they talked about how "Jolly St. Nick" and other folk songs also have a b3-2-1 melodic progression. And meanwhile all Flame had to do is play the songs back to back and rely on the jury's intuitive understanding that this is the same tempo, the same general instrumentation (an ostinato synth), the same general genre of music, etc etc....

The point I'm trying to make is, it's *not* that JW "owns" b6 5 #4 but rather you can't use those notes in a context that closely recalls his work.

Danny Elfman uses these same notes and it sounds like different music because.... it's different music....


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## Lionel Schmitt (Aug 6, 2019)

Thanks for the feedback and ideas everyone! 

Although I feel my ignorance of musical terminologies kicking me in the back pretty hard haha! 
If you use the note and harmony names I have exactly zero idea what you mean! 

Will be looking up on this to understand better and analyze the Potter score more rigorously by ear and play on piano next to mine - I should understand the similarities just based on that. 


Diablo3 said:


> Whatever you end up doing, don't throw it away, stash it for your own pleasure. Sounds amazing. What piano did you use?


If I can't send it to the publisher I may indeed just write it as a standalone track! 
I used Cinematic Studio Piano with some mic position mixing.


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## Rob (Aug 7, 2019)

how about taking an analytical approach... what are the elements that give HP's theme its personality... Rhythmically, it's an ancient dance, a Siciliana. The melody has a lullaby-like feel. Harmonically, it's minor, and to convey the magical and slightly unsettling climate the simplicity of the minor arpeggio/scale is enriched by one or more "outside" notes. With these guidelines, you have the chance to remain in the same ambience of the original without the need to literally copy from it...


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## Lionel Schmitt (Aug 7, 2019)

Rob said:


> how about taking an analytical approach... what are the elements that give HP's theme its personality... Rhythmically, it's an ancient dance, a Siciliana. The melody has a lullaby-like feel. Harmonically, it's minor, and to convey the magical and slightly unsettling climate the simplicity of the minor arpeggio/scale is enriched by one or more "outside" notes. With these guidelines, you have the chance to remain in the same ambience of the original without the need to literally copy from it...


Well, I'm not necessarily trying to do something really similar to the Potter score but I more try to keep the overall idea, since a lot of it is not derived from that score and I wouldn't want to trash it because of some parts... 
But I could come up with another track with that approach and still do the current one, but keep it away from any publishers.


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## Lionel Schmitt (Aug 7, 2019)

Another attempt to keep the overall track and changed things a bit more + added a new theme. 
 

Haven't dived into the suggestions since I'll need to research it all as a total theory noob! :D 
But well, luckily I have time till mid December so I'd be good Frankensteining it to death or doing something else...


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## I like music (Aug 7, 2019)

Sounds a lot like that rapper Flame's song...

But seriously, other than that, at _one_ point it sounded very Potterish. I'd personally view it as an homage at that point, but not similar enough otherwise to consider it a rip-off. I guess most laypeople like me would at some point go "Ah, inspired by Harry Potter"


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