# Absynth 5 will no longer be supported or purchased



## Markrs (Sep 7, 2022)

Native Instruments have decided to retire Absynth 5 and will no longer allow you to buy it and it is not included in Komplete 14.

Posted on they NI forum.

Hey folks. Absynth 5 is no longer part of the Komplete bundle. Of course some of you will be sad, some of you will be angry, it's understandable. Keeping this old synth up to date to modern standards was becoming a challenge, this without even bringing any improvement. Decision has been made to end it's sales and development to be able to focus on other tasks. You'll still be able to use it on Windows 10/11 or on Macs up to MacOS 12. 

@MATAKAO Regarding FM8, Battery and Reaktor, these are still in Komplete and will get updates:


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## LearningToCompose:) (Sep 7, 2022)

Can you still download it?


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## Markrs (Sep 7, 2022)

LearningToCompose:) said:


> Can you still download it?


If you already own it, you should still see it in Native Access.


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## Maarten (Sep 7, 2022)

Markrs said:


> Native Instruments have decided to retire Absynth 5 and will no longer allow you to buy it and it is not included in Komplete 14.
> <snip>


Thanks for posting this. That clears it up :-(


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## Pier (Sep 7, 2022)

It's not surprising. I don't think Absynth is very popular these days to justify the investment of maintaining it and updating it. I wonder what will happen with Reaktor and Battery though.

I'd be very surprised if NI updated Battery. People using Live and Bitwig have no need for it and I'm guessing that's the vast majority of NI users that'd be interested in Battery.

About Reaktor... who knows. Personally I've never liked using the synths and effects inside of it. The modular environment was super cool like 10 years ago but it's gotten pretty outdated compared to stuff like The Grid in Bitwig. Also I guess people using Reaktor are a minority of the NI userbase.


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## NuNativs (Sep 7, 2022)

I'm nostalgically sad for this.


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## kgdrum (Sep 7, 2022)

NuNativs said:


> I'm nostalgically sad for this.




+1

Absynth is a beautiful sounding synth.


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## José Herring (Sep 7, 2022)

Damn, and I just learned how to use it after all these years.


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## zvenx (Sep 7, 2022)

Abysnth was the first software that I really really craved for, but I stopped using it years ago alas.
rsp


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## jules (Sep 7, 2022)

José Herring said:


> Damn, and I just learned how to use it after all these years.


It's always like that ! That's why i only use presets.


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## Crowe (Sep 7, 2022)

If you're on windows, this probably won't have much of an effect for you anywhere in the next 10 years.

If you're on Mac... well, it's expected stuff stops working within a few years isn't it.


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## Pier (Sep 7, 2022)




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## doctoremmet (Sep 7, 2022)

Brian Clevinger - what a genius! Just received the Rhizomatic mail with the link to the video above. Came here to post it but Pier beat me to it.


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## GtrString (Sep 7, 2022)

The search for identity has finally ended, now it really has become Absynth..


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## Nico5 (Sep 7, 2022)

Absynth (in a box) was one of my very first soft synth purchases soon after its release.

It still holds a spot on my subjective soft synth Mount Rushmore and I’m convinced it has inspired numerous of the current best soft synths.

I still find it sonically competitive with many modern synths - but it was pretty obvious that NI had given up on it quite a while ago.

Commerce and art aren’t always a good longer term mix. 

Fortunately there’s a still increasingly vibrant scene of new (with founders of all ages) music software and soundware development companies, that aren’t yet beholden to outside capital investment and/or giant corporate parents. I’m finding myself more enthusiastic than ever about spending my money with those independents. I‘ve found more innovation and better customer support in that group than with many of the established companies.


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## ptram (Sep 7, 2022)

Probably, the most modern of their synths.

The changes in top management seem to start producing their effects.

Paolo


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## Nico5 (Sep 7, 2022)

ptram said:


> The changes in top management seem to start producing their effects.


The changes in top management ownership seem to start producing their effects.


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## ptram (Sep 7, 2022)

Nico5 said:


> The changes in top management ownership seem to start producing their effects.


As far as I remember, the two founders were invited to leave their place a couple years ago.

Paolo


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## Nico5 (Sep 7, 2022)

ptram said:


> As far as I remember, the two founders were invited to leave their place a couple years ago.
> 
> Paolo


That's very standard when ownership changes hands. A change in management is one of the effects of ownership changes. Everything trickles from ownership.


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## tc9000 (Sep 7, 2022)

Ahh damnit! One of my all time fave preset collections is @emptyvessel's Entropia for Absynth 5:









NI Absynth: Entropia - PRICE DROP -129 presets - emptyvessel


In light of the recent announcement by NI to end of life Absynth I've reduced the price of the pack to 10 euro to see about getting it into a few more hands while Absynth is still running on current hardware/OS. Entropia: 129 patches for Native Instruments AbsynthAll based around 900Mb of origi




store.emptyvessel.co.nz





I guess I'll be able to use it for a while... Maybe I'll record some stems before it breaks due to a random update


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## Pier (Sep 7, 2022)

Honestly this is more of an issue for Mac users.

I'm certain Absynth will keep working fine on Windows for years.


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## Nico5 (Sep 7, 2022)

Pier said:


> Honestly this is more of an issue for Mac users.
> 
> I'm certain Absynth will keep working fine on Windows for years.


Indeed! -- However, one day (depending on the host one uses), one might have to wrap it in a plugin chaining type of tool like Unify, Bidule, PatchWork or similar to allow it to continue to work in future VST3 only hosts.


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## cedricm (Sep 7, 2022)

Pier said:


> It's not surprising. I don't think Absynth is very popular these days to justify the investment of maintaining it and updating it. I wonder what will happen with Reaktor and Battery though.
> 
> I'd be very surprised if NI updated Battery. People using Live and Bitwig have no need for it and I'm guessing that's the vast majority of NI users that'd be interested in Battery.
> 
> About Reaktor... who knows. Personally I've never liked using the synths and effects inside of it. The modular environment was super cool like 10 years ago but it's gotten pretty outdated compared to stuff like The Grid in Bitwig. Also I guess people using Reaktor are a minority of the NI userbase.


If NI decimates its synth offering in Komplete, it should do the same with its pricing.


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## Pier (Sep 7, 2022)

cedricm said:


> If NI decimates its synth offering in Komplete, it should do the same with its pricing.


Well they've added a couple of PA synths so...


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## jtnyc (Sep 7, 2022)

While I don't Use Absynth all the time, I do like it and I own quite a few preset expansions. Some from NI, some from The Unfinished and some from Simon Stockhausen. This is a bummer...

It feels like we are buying VI's that have a time limitation on them and one day they will cease to exist... Just doesn't feel right. I know it's old and upkeep and all that, but.... yeah.... not so bad with Absynth, but what happens to the thousands of dollars spent on Kontakt libraries when they phase that out? 

Yikes!


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## HCMarkus (Sep 7, 2022)

A good reason to keep my Cheesegrater in the machine closet.


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## givemenoughrope (Sep 7, 2022)

Anthony Distefano's youtube page might the best Absynthing I've heard. https://youtube.com/user/ANTsynth


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## Living Fossil (Sep 7, 2022)

This reminds me about NI removing Spektral Delay some (many) years ago (with the "old" owners).
Spektral Delay is still missed a lot and I still don't know the reason why it was removed.
(There is a similar plugin by Melda but its GUI/Editing functionality could be better)

Absynth is a software legend. Some of its sonic capabilities completely blew my mind when I first heard it and I used it a lot until Zebra2 was released.

Having seen B. Clevinger's statement I think it would be great if NI would overthink its retirement and decide to keep it supported...
Maybe an online petition would be a good idea...


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## HeliaVox (Sep 7, 2022)

I loved Spektral Delay. And Vokator. And now Absynth. It was a good run though.


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## method1 (Sep 7, 2022)

RIP a real classic. We shall miss you in your absynth.


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## kgdrum (Sep 7, 2022)

I received an interesting Rhzomatic email from Brian Clevinger the creator of Absynth,see here:

Native Instruments has removed Absynth from its product line. As some of you remember, Rhizomatic was the original developer of Absynth, which I why I’m writing here. 

At this point I don’t know if it will be possible to continue Absynth outside of NI. But I want Absynth’s unique features to remain available to musicians. For years I’ve had major plans for Absynth, and although this is a disappointing turn of events, these ideas could manifest as new stuff from Rhizomatic. So the future looks bright if not entirely clear. 

Many of you were customers from way back in the early days of Absynth. I want to thank you for your support over the years and for making amazing music with it!

I’ve made a video where I talk a little about the situation, plus some music made with Absynth: 

There is a new Rhizomatic plugin currently under development, as well as other stuff, but more on that later!

Cheers,
Brian Clevinger









Absynth 2000-2022, a statement from Absynth's creator


NI has removed Absynth from their product line. This is a statement from Absynth's creator Brian Clevinger, plus some music made with a single instance of Ab...




rhizomatic.us20.list-manage.com





*edit* I just noticed the video was already posted but not the written release so I will leave it here for people that prefer reading the statement.


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## emptyvessel (Sep 7, 2022)

tc9000 said:


> Ahh damnit! One of my all time fave preset collections is @emptyvessel's Entropia for Absynth 5:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


💚
Entropia is based on the same samples as my TAL Sampler packs Entropy and Dystopia at least but the end result came out very differently because of the uniqueness of Absynth. I'm working through porting the TAL Sampler packs to Pigments and likely Falcon but it'll take a while. Entropia will live on 

In the meantime if anyone fancied Entropia but didn't grab it, it always was a relatively expensive pack due to the size of it (129 patches/900Mb samples) and the effort that went into it, how about I run an EOL discount and cut the price from 40 euro to 10. If this upsets current owners please do get in touch and I'll sort something out.








NI Absynth: Entropia - PRICE DROP -129 presets - emptyvessel


In light of the recent announcement by NI to end of life Absynth I've reduced the price of the pack to 10 euro to see about getting it into a few more hands while Absynth is still running on current hardware/OS. Entropia: 129 patches for Native Instruments AbsynthAll based around 900Mb of origi




store.emptyvessel.co.nz





Also if you want to join in any discussion over the (possible) future for Absynth and find out about Brian's plans for his products as Rhizomatic I have a Facebook group for the Absynth and Rhizomatic community where Brian and many of the usual Absynth suspects are active members.








Absynth & Rhizomatic community | Facebook


A place to discuss Native Instruments Absynth and the work of creator Brian Clevinger under his Rhizomatic company name. As you know to find information about Absynth is rather difficult, so here we...




www.facebook.com


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## proxima (Sep 7, 2022)

I'm disappointed. The sounds that came out of Absynth seemed so unique compared to other NI offerings; I was hoping they would overhaul it in an Absynth 6. I did not see them making it obsolete, but maybe Apple Silicon was the straw that put them over? They seem to have made a decision not to sell products that won't at least eventually get an Apple Silicon port. 

I loved hearing what others did with the synth but absolutely hated the interface. Ah well, we have an unbelievable collection of synths at all prices now. I'd love to see what Brian Clevinger could come up with paired with a UI dev that meshes with me a bit more (Plasmonic is...not for me). But not every synth is for every person.


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## Crowe (Sep 7, 2022)

GtrString said:


> The search for identity has finally ended, now it really has become Absynth..


That was a decent pun.

Look, Absynth hasn't had more than a stability update in *years*. The only thing that has changed is that it's now certain that it won't be updated anymore, which we all suspected. It's not unusable, it doesn't _need _any updates, it hasn't disappeared.


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## Digivolt (Sep 8, 2022)

Markrs said:


> If you already own it, you should still see it in Native Access.


What happens for people upgrading from Komplete <14 to Komplete 14, does the act of upgrading mean you give up the ownership of Absynth or do you still own it ?


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## gamma-ut (Sep 8, 2022)

Digivolt said:


> What happens for people upgrading from Komplete <14 to Komplete 14, does the act of upgrading mean you give up the ownership of Absynth or do you still own it ?



You still own it unless at some point in the future you sell the upgrades that gave you access to the product in the first place. As A5 has been in Komplete for donkeys years, the chances are the base Komplete you own to qualify for K14 had it anyway.


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## averystemmler (Sep 8, 2022)

Absynth was, in spite of the bonkers interface, the synth that made the basics of synthesis click for me some 12 years ago. And begat a lifelong love of comb filters.

Given the cornucopia of softsynths we have in 2022, I can't see myself using it for anything more than nostalgia now, but I'm glad NI isn't poofing it out of Native Access the way they tried with some of their products a couple years ago. So long as I can use the current version for as long as my OSes will run it, I can't complain.


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## Bee_Abney (Sep 8, 2022)

To me, it is one of the most interesting sounding synths and one of my favourites. There are very few other synths that give me tingles the way Absynth does. It may not be gone; but it has received its own dolorous stroke.

Being new to this world, I was not aware of the length of time since the last meaningful update, so I had still been hoping for something.


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## Scottyb (Sep 8, 2022)

Nothing lasts forever but still heartbreaking. One of the very first soft-synths I used. I have to wonder if there's enough outpouring of support from the community, might NI have a change of heart? Sounds like the developer would love to make it happen. Seems like they could make something work to keep it going.

Or at the very least allow him the opportunity to continue it himself, if he likes?


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## Bee_Abney (Sep 8, 2022)

It's a pathetic tribute, but here is a quick piece in honour of the wonderful, moody, mysterious delights of Absynth. Just three instances of the synth and two effects buses using Absynth as an effect.


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## Michel Simons (Sep 8, 2022)

I actually rediscovered it fairly recently. Most of my contributions to a friend's song consisted of Absynth. I even believe that most of that came from Empty Vessel's Entropia.


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## kgdrum (Sep 8, 2022)

@Bee_Abney 

Beeyonce! 

You should sing more what a beautifully unique voice! 🎶❤️🎶


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## kgdrum (Sep 8, 2022)

emptyvessel said:


> 💚
> Entropia is based on the same samples as my TAL Sampler packs Entropy and Dystopia at least but the end result came out very differently because of the uniqueness of Absynth. I'm working through porting the TAL Sampler packs to Pigments and likely Falcon but it'll take a while. Entropia will live on
> 
> In the meantime if anyone fancied Entropia but didn't grab it, it always was a relatively expensive pack due to the size of it (129 patches/900Mb samples) and the effort that went into it, how about I run an EOL discount and cut the price from 40 euro to 10. If this upsets current owners please do get in touch and I'll sort something out.
> ...





Purchased Thanks 👍


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## nolotrippen (Sep 8, 2022)

Crowe said:


> If you're on windows, this probably won't have much of an effect for you anywhere in the next 10 years.
> 
> If you're on Mac... well, it's expected stuff stops working within a few years isn't it.


I returned to good ol' 2017's High Sierra just to keep the ol' Photoshop running. Loving it and have two Mac running it. I'll stick with it just to keep gems like Absynth humming.


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## CrystalWizard (Sep 8, 2022)

Sure Absynth was very old in SW terms. Sure, it would cost Ni a lot to rewrite (although i wonder, what do their software engineers do these days beside chase Apple). Sure, they would have made more money selling A6 then it cost to build. However none of the parasites in the C-suites would have made a extre penny in bonuses, so...no A6. All imo, sorry if it"s strongly worded but i stopped supporting NI back when the crippled Battery(v3-4). NI mostly just sells Kontakt libraries, they haven't built a top synth in years (and i don't count Massive "X").

edit: I am on Windows so i will likely get plenty more fun with Absynth, thankfully.


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## Crowe (Sep 8, 2022)

nolotrippen said:


> I returned to good ol' 2017's High Sierra just to keep the ol' Photoshop running. Loving it and have two Mac running it. I'll stick with it just to keep gems like Absynth humming.


Right? I do the same with windows 2000 and XP.


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## MartinH. (Sep 8, 2022)

Pier said:


> About Reaktor... who knows. Personally I've never liked using the synths and effects inside of it. The modular environment was super cool like 10 years ago but it's gotten pretty outdated compared to stuff like The Grid in Bitwig. Also I guess people using Reaktor are a minority of the NI userbase.


They need to keep Reaktor supported for their own Reaktor based synths like Razor and Monark to keep working. Some of them aren't that old. 

Sorry if this has been mentioned before, I didn't read the whole thread. 

Sad to see Absynth be dropped, didn't use it much but there are some cool presets in its library. I expect it'll keep working for a long time on Windows, some of the synth plugins I still use have been discontinued like 10 years or so ago. As always, DRM is the main concern for the future...


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## Crowe (Sep 8, 2022)

MartinH. said:


> They need to keep Reaktor supported for their own Reaktor based synths like Razor and Monark to keep working. Some of them aren't that old.
> 
> Sorry if this has been mentioned before, I didn't read the whole thread.
> 
> Sad to see Absynth be dropped, didn't use it much but there are some cool presets in its library. I expect it'll keep working for a long time on Windows, some of the synth plugins I still use have been discontinued like 10 years or so ago. As always, DRM is the main concern for the future...


I'm not too worried about Absynth DRM though.

I still remember playing around with Absynth, 20ish years ago.

Long before I ever bought it.


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## EvilDragon (Sep 8, 2022)

CrystalWizard said:


> they haven't built a top synth in years (and i don't count Massive "X")


Massive X is a top synth, it really sounds excellent, absolutely cream of the crop.


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## emptyvessel (Sep 8, 2022)

MartinH. said:


> They need to keep Reaktor supported for their own Reaktor based synths like Razor and Monark to keep working. Some of them aren't that old.
> 
> Sorry if this has been mentioned before, I didn't read the whole thread.
> 
> Sad to see Absynth be dropped, didn't use it much but there are some cool presets in its library. I expect it'll keep working for a long time on Windows, some of the synth plugins I still use have been discontinued like 10 years or so ago. As always, DRM is the main concern for the future...


they've said that Reaktor will get Apple M1 (etc.) support early 2023 so it seems there are no plans to retire Reaktor, I hope they take the M1 update as an opportunity to tidy the old thing up a bit though! I'd be surprised if Reaktor goes away given it launched the entire company but who knows, when money becomes the main (only?) priority all manner of strangeness ensues.
Thanks to those who picked up Entropia both now and previously, I hope you enjoy the presets and maybe the samples are also useful in other ways.


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## Crowe (Sep 8, 2022)

emptyvessel said:


> they've said that Reaktor will get Apple M1 (etc.) support early 2023 so it seems there are no plans to retire Reaktor, I hope they take the M1 update as an opportunity to tidy the old thing up a bit though! I'd be surprised if Reaktor goes away given it launched the entire company but who knows, when money becomes the main (only?) priority all manner of strangeness ensues.
> Thanks to those who picked up Entropia both now and previously, I hope you enjoy the presets and maybe the samples are also useful in other ways.


How long will you keep this price going? I was planning to check it out tomorrow.


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## Spiral Gruv (Sep 8, 2022)

I'm quite sad about this. Absynth was the synth that got me into NI and soft synths in general. I've enjoyed countless hours playing this bad boy. To my ears it has a unique sound that hasn't been matched since. I realize that this probably isn't a big money maker for NI and likely isn't going to be used on the next trap hit, but I think this is a mistake. The user base for this instrument seems to be extraordinarily passionate for it's age. I wonder if there is any way we can convince NI to give it back to Brian or if there is some other way to keep it alive. Anyway, I'm off to go make some sounds with my old friend as a small personal tribute.
(Also glad to see Evil Dragon popping up to correct the record as usual.)


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## emptyvessel (Sep 8, 2022)

Crowe said:


> How long will you keep this price going? I was planning to check it out tomorrow.


I've no plan to change it back. I don't do sales or intro discounts, this is really just a change of price to see about reminding people the pack is out there and to make it a price that isn't too much of a risky purchase for people when the future of the plugin itself and how long it might work for is a bit uncertain. So, no rush


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## Paj (Sep 8, 2022)

Coincidentally, I recently recovered some Westgate Sounds Absynth presets so I revisited the Groove3 Absynth tutorial, which seems to cover every button and feature. The capabilities are still quite a testament to the developers. I do like the new and shiny things but I'm going to keep Absynth in my arsenal like a Sharpe's rifle.

Paj
8^)


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## jblongz (Sep 8, 2022)

Pier said:


> It's not surprising. I don't think Absynth is very popular these days to justify the investment of maintaining it and updating it. I wonder what will happen with Reaktor and Battery though.
> 
> I'd be very surprised if NI updated Battery. People using Live and Bitwig have no need for it and I'm guessing that's the vast majority of NI users that'd be interested in Battery.
> 
> About Reaktor... who knows. Personally I've never liked using the synths and effects inside of it. The modular environment was super cool like 10 years ago but it's gotten pretty outdated compared to stuff like The Grid in Bitwig. Also I guess people using Reaktor are a minority of the NI userbase.


One super convenient feature of battery is using the expansion libraries in other daws easily. For example I can load a kick menu for specific expansion and audition them freely rather than search and dragging them into a drum rack. Both have their advantages, but Battery 4 is still good for workflow.


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## CrystalWizard (Sep 8, 2022)

EvilDragon said:


> Massive X is a top synth, it really sounds excellent, absolutely cream of the crop.


Indeed it does. I was about to add that to my post (but had to go out), it sounds fantastic but the two freinds i know who have it say it has a horrible UI, and i've seen many people state similar. I would have to dig through a bunch of threads and call the two friends as i no longer remember what the issues were. I suppose since i have demoed neither MX nor anything else from NI in a while perhaps i'm wrong. I still stand by the rest of my post.
and FTR i'm always glad to see ED pop in, his post are usually quite informative.


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## Marcus Millfield (Sep 9, 2022)

Can one see Rhizomatic as a spiritual successor to Absynth?


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## doctoremmet (Sep 9, 2022)

Marcus Millfield said:


> Can one see Rhizomatic as a spiritual successor to Absynth?


Is is not a synth, but Brian Clevinger’s company. Their currently only released synth is Plasmonic which shares a certain set of characteristics with Absynth, but is not to be seen as a direct successor imho.


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## Marcus Millfield (Sep 9, 2022)

doctoremmet said:


> Is is not a synth, but Brian Clevinger’s company. Their currently only released synth is Plasmonic which shares a certain set of characteristics with Absynth, but is not to be seen as a direct successor imho.


Ah ok, gotcha!


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## TomislavEP (Sep 9, 2022)

I'm a big Komplete fan, but I was never much of a user of these classic NI products, namely Absynth, Massive, FM8, and even Battery. Still, I'm well aware of how much these meant to some and of their historical role, so I'm sad about Absynth 5.


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## EvilDragon (Sep 9, 2022)

CrystalWizard said:


> but the two freinds i know who have it say it has a horrible UI, and i've seen many people state similar


The UI is much much better than Absynth's.  It is not immediately intuitive, but one read through the manual and you'll be set for life. It all makes sense once you grasp it.


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## doctoremmet (Sep 9, 2022)

Massive X is a fantastic synthesizer, that somehow never gets the recognition it deserves. (I am guilty of this as well, I hardly ever mention it for some reason). A lot of this is personal preference-based and some of it is also just an echo chamber effect of some of the initial negative reception of the synth upon release (I gather).

Another fantastic Native Instruments instrument is Super 8. Great interface, and more importantly, a very good sound.

In terms of sound, I have to say that of all the many synths I own (hard- and software) the NI synths (together with U-he) are (still!) the ones with the most pristine, most impressive range of sonic quality. I am really hoping for a 2023/2024 Reaktor 7 release. Reaktor -to me- is still the best software synthesizer ever conceived, in terms of how good it sounds. So, from my POV, this talk of NI “losing its edge” so-to-speak is largely due to the fact that these Berlin based geniuses are (and have been) quite literally the ones who have continually raised and set the (current) bar. And that bar is at a level that leaves little room for improvement.

Yes. I too mourne a bit for Absynth. But it has had a 20+ years run. And like Crowe says, it’ll be usable for years to come. Sometimes in order to achieve new goals a bit of creative destruction is in order.


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## Pier (Sep 9, 2022)

jblongz said:


> One super convenient feature of battery is using the expansion libraries in other daws easily. For example I can load a kick menu for specific expansion and audition them freely rather than search and dragging them into a drum rack. Both have their advantages, but Battery 4 is still good for workflow.


I do think there's a market for something like Battery although it's much smaller than it used to be 20 years ago. TAL recently released TAL Drum and it's great.


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## Pier (Sep 9, 2022)

EvilDragon said:


> The UI is much much better than Absynth's.  It is not immediately intuitive, but one read through the manual and you'll be set for life. It all makes sense once you grasp it.


Personally I find the UI intuitive and easy to use. The browser is still terrible though and I always miss features like drag and drop of the effects.


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## givemenoughrope (Sep 9, 2022)

givemenoughrope said:


> Anthony Distefano's youtube page might the best Absynthing I've heard. https://youtube.com/user/ANTsynth


To elaborate, AD's use of Absynth is a great example of cornering mostly one style/aesthetic with one appropriate synth and exploring as much as possible with it. I wish he had made a preset pack for many of these.


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## EvilDragon (Sep 9, 2022)

doctoremmet said:


> Another fantastic Native Instruments instrument is Super 8. Great interface, and more importantly, a very good sound.


Yeahhhhh I love Super 8. Just silky!


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## Axl (Sep 9, 2022)

Absynth has a wonderful character and sounds great. The one thing holding it back is the tiny Uni and the way you dial in values, very frustrating.
Using it as an effect plugin can produce really great sounds.

Now that A5 is dead, hopefully the original designer can make something in a similar vain, only 20 years younger.


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## Radim H. (Sep 9, 2022)

Hmm, so this is not necessarily a bad thing, if Mr. Clevinger somehow reacquired the rights to Absynth.


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## Pier (Sep 9, 2022)

He could just release a synth with a similar architecture and a different name. There's nothing NI can do to prevent that.


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## kgdrum (Sep 9, 2022)

Pier said:


> He could just release a synth with a similar architecture and a different name. There's nothing NI can do to prevent that.




Utilizing a similar architecture,update the gui,add a couple of enhancements to update “Absynths” wayward cousin’s capabilities and Mr. Clevinger would certainly have a hit on his hands.


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## proxima (Sep 9, 2022)

kgdrum said:


> Utilizing a similar architecture,update the gui,add a couple of enhancements to update “Absynths” wayward cousin’s capabilities and Mr. Clevinger would certainly have a hit on his hands.


So you think NI is leaving money on the table here?


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## kgdrum (Sep 9, 2022)

proxima said:


> So you think NI is leaving money on the table here?




Absynth imo is one of the most revered synths from back in the day that people still love.
There wouldn’t be threads about this on various forums if people didn’t care.
In my book synths like Absynth, & Alchemy were great synths that if they were updated (GUI)and still available,yes people would definitely buy.


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## Pier (Sep 9, 2022)

proxima said:


> So you think NI is leaving money on the table here?


Exactly. I seriously doubt NI made the decision blindly just because.


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## kgdrum (Sep 9, 2022)

Pier said:


> Exactly. I seriously doubt NI made the decision blindly just because.




Not blindly but NI & the accountants running Soundwide guiding these marketing choices might be wrong on some of their decisions.


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## Bee_Abney (Sep 9, 2022)

Does Absynth 6 need to reuse code from earlier versions? If not, then a new name puts its ownership in the hands of the coder. Obviously, without backwards compatibility. As I see it. But what developer would want to be so tied to a past work without backwards compatibility and the name for marketability?

I think we are better off waiting to see Rhizomatic's next product and judging it independently.


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## proxima (Sep 9, 2022)

kgdrum said:


> Absynth imo is one of the most revered synths from back in the day that people still love.
> There wouldn’t be threads about this on various forums if people didn’t care.
> In my book synths like Absynth, & Alchemy were great synths that if they were updated (GUI)and still available,yes people would definitely buy.


You might be right. But a few thoughts:

I think NI has a reasonably good sense of how much it costs and what their revenue is for developing synths. They've been keeping Absynth running on new OSes for years and years (with an unclear amount of dev time required - we don't know the code base). They know the direct sales of Absynth (I assume negligible), and they also know how many Komplete users bother to actually download it. They might even know about usage depending on what tracking is available. That's a lot of data we don't have.

For an overhaul, it would probably be much more than a re-skin. And if you do an overhaul, you almost certainly break backwards compatibility. Examples: Massive X, Zebra 3 (long announced to not be backwards compatible), etc. The major counterexample I can think of is Omnisphere, in which version 2 was a more moderate overhaul of the UI, added features, but did not seem like the kind of ground-up reworking that many synth developers prefer when coming out with a new version. 

They know how much this kind of overhaul likely costs from doing Massive X, and the market for synths has gotten pretty competitive, but they probably have a reasonable idea of the market for individual sales and how a synth like Massive X might help sales of Komplete (e.g. some editions of Komplete are a bigger deal than others). Again, that's a lot more data than I have certainly.

Maybe they didn't use this data, or maybe they did but with pessimistic assumptions. They could sell off the Absynth IP if 1.) A buyer out there was willing to do what you say and 2.) The result would not compete so directly with NI products that the transaction loses money on net. Maybe they'll still do this, but I doubt it: most synth developers seem to want to start from a more modern codebase they understand than to try to work with a huge and old codebase.

People love old versions of Windows, or Mac OS X. Microsoft and Apple anger people routinely by deprecating versions and even removing beloved features big and small. But they do know a lot more than I do about the pros and cons of their decisions. I'm sure they make mistakes, but I'm also sure that I'd make more mistakes without their data and expertise.


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## Luzebel (Sep 9, 2022)

Good night sweet prince. It was so great at creating foreboding atmospheres.


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## Pier (Sep 9, 2022)

kgdrum said:


> Not blindly but NI & the accountants running Soundwide guiding these marketing choices might be wrong on some of their decisions.


Yeah everyone can make a mistake. All I'm saying is NI must have metrics and they probably decided the investment to keep absynth alive for ARM wasn't worth it, let alone create a new version.


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## tc9000 (Sep 9, 2022)

Pier said:


> He could just release a synth with a similar architecture and a different name. There's nothing NI can do to prevent that.


Anagrams of "absynth" (using https://ingesanagram.com/):

Ashby NT
Ashby tn
baht syn
bahts ny
bans thy
bant shy
bath syn
baths ny
bays nth
bhan sty
hasty nb
nabs thy

Words contained in "absynth":

shanty
Ashby
antsy
bahts
baths
hasty
nasty
tansy

I really like *BathSyn* or *shanty *if anyone does go down that route


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## Brian2112 (Sep 9, 2022)

Newer is not always better.
Haven’t used Absynth in years but having it in the toolbox is essential for me.
It still makes sound that nothing else can.
I am already sick of Barfing wavetable synths. Wavetables are cool but how many synth bass patches do you need? (not that synth bass is the only thing it can do but Jesus!).


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## proxima (Sep 9, 2022)

Brian2112 said:


> Haven’t used Absynth in years but having it in the toolbox is essential for me.


I appreciate that you enjoy Absynth, but how is something you haven't used in years really essential?


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## Pier (Sep 9, 2022)

tc9000 said:


> Anagrams of "absynth" (using https://ingesanagram.com/):
> 
> Ashby NT
> Ashby tn
> ...


The first idea that came to my mind was Abisynth...

... but then I remembered Young Frankenstein... sorry Fronkonstin.


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## leonthomasian (Sep 9, 2022)

GtrString said:


> The search for identity has finally ended, now it really has become Absynth..


ha ha ha, that was a good one!


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## tmhuud (Sep 9, 2022)

awww I LOVE that Synth. Eons ago I scored a film that was 80% ALL Absynth and the rest Camel Audio products. Gave the film a really nice cohesive identity and unique feel. So sad to see support dropped for it.


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## TomislavEP (Sep 10, 2022)

doctoremmet said:


> Massive X is a fantastic synthesizer, that somehow never gets the recognition it deserves. (I am guilty of this as well, I hardly ever mention it for some reason). A lot of this is personal preference-based and some of it is also just an echo chamber effect of some of the initial negative reception of the synth upon release (I gather).
> 
> Another fantastic Native Instruments instrument is Super 8. Great interface, and more importantly, a very good sound.
> 
> ...


If you ask me, with the potential of Massive X, all the firepower that comes with Reaktor and the official NI ensembles, not to mention the synth-based Kontakt libraries, the fact that those legacy products probably won't be seriously updated in the future is no such a big deal. Of course, this is just my perspective as I was never an active user of classic synths by Native.

I was also always wondering why VI synths from NI don't get more praise overall. Native is certainly one of the pioneers there with a long tradition and most of their products are highly polished. Personally, I doubt that I would ever need to look elsewhere for virtual synths, even if the cost wasn't the factor.


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## Bee_Abney (Sep 10, 2022)

Apparently the Fender Stratocaster is being discontinued. If you have one already, it will no longer receive updates or support, and eventually will stop working. It will stop working for you much sooner if you play with a Marshall amp.

It's alright though, there's always something else, something new, right?

(Did I overdo it?!)


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## Marcus Millfield (Sep 10, 2022)

Bee_Abney said:


> Apparently the Fender Stratocaster is being discontinued. If you have one already, it will no longer receive updates or support, and eventually will stop working. It will stop working for you much sooner if you play with a Marshall amp.
> 
> It's alright though, there's always something else, something new, right?
> 
> (Did I overdo it?!)


I get that. From a business standpoint, there's nothing to gain for Fender from such a low quality product.

#runs


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## Bee_Abney (Sep 10, 2022)

Marcus Millfield said:


> I get that. From a business standpoint, there's nothing to gain for Fender from such a low quality product.
> 
> #runs


Kill him.


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## doctoremmet (Sep 10, 2022)

LCD Soundsystem, Losing My Edge:

“I hear you're buying a synthesizer and an arpeggiator and are throwing your computer out the window because you want to make something real. You want to make a Yaz record.

I hear that you and your band have sold your guitars and bought turntables.
I hear that you and your band have sold your turntables and bought guitars.”

Seems like without Strats and Absynth these lyrics are now hopelessly outdated. Ah well, we still have cowbells and as soon as those are taken off the market, I’ll call Chas Smith.


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## Marcus Millfield (Sep 10, 2022)

Bee_Abney said:


> Kill him.


What, again? 🤦🏻‍♂️


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## Bee_Abney (Sep 10, 2022)

Marcus Millfield said:


> What, again? 🤦🏻‍♂️


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## RogiervG (Sep 10, 2022)

i, back then, wanted to love it.. but i found the gui was/is a mess, and the presets so so..
i never really touched it since
so, no problem for me that they discontinue it from now on


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## Michel Simons (Sep 10, 2022)

RogiervG said:


> i, back then, wanted to love it.. but i found the gui was/is a mess, and the resets so so..
> i never really touched it since
> so, no problem for me that they discontinue it from now on


Heresy!!


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## RogiervG (Sep 10, 2022)

Michel Simons said:


> Heresy!!


but.. but...


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## tmhuud (Sep 10, 2022)

Marcus Millfield said:


> What, again? 🤦🏻‍♂️


You only die twice…ER, I meant you only LIVE twice. (Or something like that)


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## gamma-ut (Sep 10, 2022)

TomislavEP said:


> If you ask me, with the potential of Massive X, all the firepower that comes with Reaktor and the official NI ensembles, not to mention the synth-based Kontakt libraries, the fact that those legacy products probably won't be seriously updated in the future is no such a big deal.



The thing about Absynth is that, though they can be a bit tricky to tame, it has a fairly unusual set of features that make it quite hard to reproduce the things it does well in other synths. You have things like feedback effects in the filter section and some waveform and FM tricks, coupled with the envelopes and real-time controllers that you'd have to wire up in some kind of modular to replicate.


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## doctoremmet (Sep 10, 2022)




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## Mornats (Sep 10, 2022)

tc9000 said:


> Anagrams of "absynth" (using https://ingesanagram.com/):
> 
> Ashby NT
> Ashby tn
> ...


Nasty Shanty works for me.


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## kgdrum (Sep 10, 2022)

Pier said:


> Yeah everyone can make a mistake. All I'm saying is NI must have metrics and they probably decided the investment to keep absynth alive for ARM wasn't worth it, let alone create a new version.




Well if you consider just here @VI-C : this thread was created on Wednesday (today’s Saturday) so in about 3 days this thread has generated about 100 posts and over 3000 views. From my perspective this shows that YES ,there’s still a market for an updated Absynth. I hope Brian Clevinger somehow decides to create a new synth based on what he did with Absynth with some improvements and modernization.
Absynth is still a great synth that has an audience and potential client base. I still think if it was ever updated and improved Absynthian2 would be an extremely popular synth.


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## TW5011 (Sep 11, 2022)

I don't have any insight into Absynth's development, but I have been a programmer at a billion-dollar IT company, and I'll add that keeping software up-to-date is not always a trivial task, even on Windows. (Don't even get me started on Mac compatibility issues.) Sometimes apps have a third-party dependency (which can be like a plug-in for developers) that isn't updated and gets broken in later versions of Windows. That can require rewriting much code because part of the framework becomes broken. And even moving up to the next version of the compiler (which converts the code into the app) can cause issues (which you wouldn't expect, but it has happened). And over 20 years, that's a lot of technological changes. So sometimes maintaining an old app can become more work than it's worth. Also to note, if there are developers that don't know the code but are tasked with upgrading it, that can be extremely difficult and time-consuming. Code is not always easily readable, and there's not always documentation or comments explaining why things are done a certain way. (I've inherited code like that, where just reading it is a chore, and having to modify it is risky. It doesn't mean the original developer was bad in any way, because it made sense to him, but it might not make sense to someone else if not documented with that in mind.)

There's also the issue that it is taking NI a long time to get full M1 compatibility, and at this rate, by the time they get everything ready, Apple might require another round of upgrades. 

Again, I don't know anything about the decision-making process on Absynth, but I'm just saying there could be deal-breaker factors that we don't know about.


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## Inherently (Sep 18, 2022)

Bee_Abney said:


> ...in honour of the wonderful, moody, mysterious delights of Absynth...


The vocal entrance really got me - another blast from a different past - good stuff!


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## Bee_Abney (Sep 18, 2022)

Inherently said:


> The vocal entrance really got me - another blast from a different past - good stuff!


Thanks! It's the solo tenor from 8Dio's Requiem. Requiem seemed like the most appropriate library to go to. I'm still feeling sad about it all!


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## badabing (Sep 18, 2022)

Hope I won't get in trouble for suggesting this, but if the issue with keeping old NI plugins running is not being able to authorise them in future, aren't there cracked versions floating around that you could use (hypothetically)? Not an ideal solution but at least you'd be able to open old projects.


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## Bee_Abney (Sep 18, 2022)

badabing said:


> Hope I won't get in trouble for suggesting this, but if the issue with keeping old NI plugins running is not being able to authorise them in future, aren't there cracked versions floating around that you could use (hypothetically)? Not an ideal solution but at least you'd be able to open old projects.


Our licenses are perpetual, so I don't think we'd be doing anything illegal in using a cracked version. But possibly we would in downloading it and possibly having it installed.

The bigger practical problem overtime will be as it was with 32bit plugins - system developments will leave it behind. Possibly in a way we can cope with, possibly not. You already can't use Absynth 5 on a recent Mac or in Cubase without a shell of some kind.


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## Michel Simons (Sep 18, 2022)

Bee_Abney said:


> The bigger practical problem overtime will be as it was with 32bit plugins - system developments will leave it behind. Possibly in a way we can cope with, possibly not. You already can't use Absynth 5 on a recent Mac or in Cubase without a shell of some kind.


Is that in the newest version of Cubase?


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## Bee_Abney (Sep 18, 2022)

Michel Simons said:


> Is that in the newest version of Cubase?


Yes. I don't have it, but I think that it doesn't run VST 2 anymore.


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## Pier (Sep 18, 2022)

Bee_Abney said:


> Yes. I don't have it, but I think that it doesn't run VST 2 anymore.


It does except when running natively on ARM Macs.


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## Michel Simons (Sep 18, 2022)

Pier said:


> It does except when running natively on ARM Macs.


Ah, ok. I have Cubase 12, but I haven't really used it yet. I first want to finish all / most of my unfinished pieces without being slowed down by new / changed features. But good to hear that I should be able to still use it in 12.


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## sean8877 (Sep 18, 2022)

Michel Simons said:


> Ah, ok. I have Cubase 12, but I haven't really used it yet. I first want to finish all / most of my unfinished pieces without being slowed down by new / changed features. But good to hear that I should be able to still use it in 12.


I was worried about the same thing as far as running my VST 2 plugins on Cubase 12. I finally upgraded to v12 and can confirm no issues running the VST 2 plugins (in Windows at least).


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## auralsculpture (Oct 21, 2022)

Markrs said:


> Native Instruments have decided to retire Absynth 5 and will no longer allow you to buy it and it is not included in Komplete 14.
> 
> Posted on they NI forum.
> 
> ...


Rain it with NI Support Chat. The few operators I have chatted with all support Absynth continuing in some form and have promised to pass on the feedback


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