# CSS vs. Soaring Strings



## Less Miles (Jul 23, 2016)

Does anyone own both and care to compare? I own CSS, and love it. The sound of SS reminds me a little of CSS, dryer though. There is a certain air and realism in the SS sound that I'm intrigued by. 

Anyone know section sizes? It doesn't sound *too* huge.

I realize it's limited to legatos, so how do those compare?


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## dogdad (Jul 23, 2016)

Less Miles said:


> Does anyone own both and care to compare? I own CSS, and love it. The sound of SS reminds me a little of CSS, dryer though. There is a certain air and realism in the SS sound that I'm intrigued by.
> 
> Anyone know section sizes? It doesn't sound *too* huge.
> 
> I realize it's limited to legatos, so how do those compare?



I have both and to me they are very different sounding.

CSS to me sounds unhyped, which may come across as darker, possibly duller. To me that's a good thing in the sense you get a neutral string sound and you can dress it up the way you want. IMHO a very, very good base tone.

SS is the opposite - It sounds like it's ready for the soundtrack, so to speak. Much brighter, more in the high mids than a boosted treble though. Really cuts through.

CSS is not super wet but is definitely wetter than SS. SS by comparison is pretty dry.

I think of CSS as a stand alone lib. Now, I don't normally use one string sound 100% of the time. I usually layer libraries or at the least switch between them by using the best bits of each one to best represent a piece, but CSS could stand all on it's own, for me at least.

SS on the other hand is my go to, ultimate layer library. It makes all my other strings really shine for those passionate moments. It's the secret sauce that really brings the lines to the forefront. I rarely use the legatos by themselves. I do though use the ensemble soft sustains alone and I love them. A beautiful sound.

In summary I would say, in tone only - CSS is warmer, fuller and SS if more cutting, present and pretty dry. I like my strings wet and SS to me is too dry to use without some verb. Luckily it sounds great with many different verbs. SS may be limited in sections and in articulations but it's sound is very malleable.

Both libraries sound like medium sized sections to me. I'm not sure of the exact sizes but they don't sound huge. I love this as it lends itself to blending with other libs without sounding like a giant synth.

They are both great and I wouldn't want to be without either. They also complement each other really well. The two combined are my new "hero" string sound. I love them and recommend owning both.


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## jaminjamesp (Jul 23, 2016)

dogdad said:


> I have both and to me they are very different sounding.
> 
> CSS to me sounds unhyped, which may come across as darker, possibly duller. To me that's a good thing in the sense you get a neutral string sound and you can dress it up the way you want. IMHO a very, very good base tone.
> 
> ...



That's some good info. Is there a delay in the legato as there is in CSS?


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## Less Miles (Jul 23, 2016)

dogdad said:


> I have both and to me they are very different sounding.
> 
> CSS to me sounds unhyped, which may come across as darker, possibly duller. To me that's a good thing in the sense you get a neutral string sound and you can dress it up the way you want. IMHO a very, very good base tone.
> 
> ...



Nice detailed post. Much appreciated. Any chance you could share some music of the two layered together?


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## kavinsky (Jul 24, 2016)

jaminjamesp said:


> That's some good info. Is there a delay in the legato as there is in CSS?


of course there is. cannot be otherwise

As for the topic, I agree with the above. SS is a great layering tool for the emotional/high energy legato passages.
Actually I can't remember any library with this kind of expressive vibrato, nothing comes close in this regard.

I don't own CSS, but I use SS with CS2 and it sounds beautiful.


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## drpenguen (Sep 4, 2016)

can anyone tell me which one can play faster melodies.... fast legato
especially at 100bpm, and 16th note legatos, arpeggio style(repeating loop) without sounding
machine...
i know CSS has short notes, but i am not interested in short notes...
thanks


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## prodigalson (Sep 4, 2016)

drpenguen said:


> 16th note legatos, arpeggio style(repeating loop) without sounding
> machine...



Nothing can do that 100% successfully


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## zeng (Sep 4, 2016)

prodigalson said:


> Nothing can do that 100% successfully


What about 8dio's agitato legato arpeggio? I think it was made for fast this.

https://8dio.com/instrument/agitato-legato-arpeggio-for-kontakt-vst-au-aax/


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## prodigalson (Sep 4, 2016)

zeng said:


> What about 8dio's agitato legato arpeggio? I think it was made for fast this.
> 
> https://8dio.com/instrument/agitato-legato-arpeggio-for-kontakt-vst-au-aax/



Just like any library, you'll find some figures at certain tempos will be perfect but other figures just won't. no library can do this flawlessly and perfectly.


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## Hywel (Sep 5, 2016)

prodigalson said:


> Nothing can do that 100% successfully


Perhaps not even most LIVE string players...


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## drpenguen (Sep 5, 2016)

zeng said:


> What about 8dio's agitato legato arpeggio? I think it was made for fast this.
> 
> https://8dio.com/instrument/agitato-legato-arpeggio-for-kontakt-vst-au-aax/



its good on fast melodies... not arpeggios loops !
its not a RR library...


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## ScarletJerry (Sep 5, 2016)

kavinsky said:


> of course there is. cannot be otherwise
> 
> As for the topic, I agree with the above. SS is a great layering tool for the emotional/high energy legato passages.
> Actually I can't remember any library with this kind of expressive vibrato, nothing comes close in this regard.
> ...



Kavinsky,

Can you be more specific? I have both CS2 and SS and I never thought about using them together for legato. Do you basically duplicate the melody lines or is CS2 used in a supporting role with SS taking the lead for legatos?

-Scarlet Jerry


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## galactic orange (Sep 5, 2016)

prodigalson said:


> Just like any library, you'll find some figures at certain tempos will be perfect but other figures just won't. no library can do this flawlessly and perfectly.


I'm wondering if it's possible to get your parts into the DAW at a (slower) tempo that sounds good and then time stretch the audio to match your faster tempo. The effect should be different than when the MIDI part is just played faster. I'm not saying this will necessarily give you a better result and there might be artifacts from time stretching (actually time compressing), but it's something different you could try.


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## kavinsky (Sep 5, 2016)

ScarletJerry said:


> Kavinsky,
> 
> Can you be more specific? I have both CS2 and SS and I never thought about using them together for legato. Do you basically duplicate the melody lines or is CS2 used in a supporting role with SS taking the lead for legatos?
> 
> -Scarlet Jerry



Yes, CS2 does not have the same level of detail in regards of expressiveness of vibrato, so you can blend them in where you want to be a little more dynamic and emotional. It just brings the missing level of soloistic details that I really miss with my usual go to libraries.

The legato transitions themself have a lot more pronounced and, well.. soaring quality to them. Its just no comparison to LASS/CS2 etc

Try it for yourself

Certain libraries sound better on specific lines,
you probably use CS2 as your base library and something else for shorts for example, it's the same concept really.
I just really love how Soaring Strings sound in terms of legato, but it's obviously not a "bread and butter" type of library, so I prefer having the best of both worlds.

Just don't overuse it, I find it hard to mute Soaring Strings sometimes just cause they are so awesome, but I force myself to do it to maintain the needed level of contrast between the sections, and it's hard to manage its vibratos sometimes, they are too prominent even with lower velocities.

I'll try and upload some demos to back it up


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## drpenguen (Sep 5, 2016)

there is no dynamics on CSS at all... its kid a joke... i am not liking it at all... 
its kind a ok to layer with ur main library, (as third layer - btw, not second)
but there are cheaper ways to get that same feeling... i would probably use it once in a while, when i am board!
sorry, but, its sounding like thin sheet of paper compared to others... 
and its not that cheap either! 
i would be more happy if there were only couple of articulations and a great dynamic sounding strings!
but this is not the case!
sorry guys....


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## dogdad (Sep 5, 2016)

ScarletJerry said:


> Kavinsky,
> 
> Can you be more specific? I have both CS2 and SS and I never thought about using them together for legato. Do you basically duplicate the melody lines or is CS2 used in a supporting role with SS taking the lead for legatos?
> 
> -Scarlet Jerry



You can or you can create custom patches by either creating a multi in Kontakt or a patch (track stack) in Logic. From there you can adjust the volume of each until you get the sound you're looking for. For me, I'll create a few of these with different balances or maybe one shifted up an octave so I have them ready to be loaded when I need them.

In regards to fast playing I use CS2. I don't use the legato but the spiccato patches with the live mode enabled. I have yet to find a library that sounds that good for fast playing (runs/arpeggios). I asked Alex if he'd implement that feature into CSS and he said he'd think about it.

IMHO, one library can not do it all. I just focus on the strengths of each library and combine where needed. I should also point out that I never have a patch that fits everything. It's good to have a starting point but all my patches usually get changed or adjusted to fit the peice or section in the end.


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## Christof (Sep 5, 2016)

drpenguen said:


> there is no dynamics on CSS at all... its kid a joke... i am not liking it at all...


No dynamics at all?
Please explain more precisely what you mean.
I use CSS almost all the time because of the great tone and dynamics.


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## Silence-is-Golden (Sep 5, 2016)

drpenguen said:


> there is no dynamics on CSS at all... its kid a joke... i am not liking it at all...
> its kind a ok to layer with ur main library, (as third layer - btw, not second)
> but there are cheaper ways to get that same feeling... i would probably use it once in a while, when i am board!
> sorry, but, its sounding like thin sheet of paper compared to others...
> ...


Sorry, but this post cannot be taken too seriously in my view, sounds more like you're 'trolling' as is sometimes referred to in 'slang'language.


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Sep 5, 2016)

drpenguen said:


> there is no dynamics on CSS at all... its kid a joke... i am not liking it at all...
> its kind a ok to layer with ur main library, (as third layer - btw, not second)
> but there are cheaper ways to get that same feeling... i would probably use it once in a while, when i am board!
> sorry, but, its sounding like thin sheet of paper compared to others...
> ...



May I ask what kind of demos / tracks with CSS you are referring to? Honestly I have to disagree here in all points you mentioned in your post. Not to be harsh but I think that is such a *blatant and most amateurish plus none contributing comment* *to topic* someone can do which btw unfortunately leads me to this conclusion about you: Either you seem to have no idea of what you are talking about or you were not really paying any attention to the demos / tracks which were done with CSS Strings since its release.

You know to a certain degree I understand that there are different tastes out there, but saying "CSS at all... its kid a joke... i am not liking it at all..." Plus "
sorry, but, its sounding like thin sheet of paper compared to others...
and its not that cheap either!" is the most undifferentiated observation someone can do ecspecially without pointing out why he is of such an opinion.

You know such comments from people like you show me that Alex Wallbank has done everything right.

Curious to know how your midimockups sound like..


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## Jimmy Hellfire (Sep 6, 2016)

drpenguen said:


> there is no dynamics on CSS at all... its kid a joke... i am not liking it at all...
> its kind a ok to layer with ur main library, (as third layer - btw, not second)
> but there are cheaper ways to get that same feeling... i would probably use it once in a while, when i am board!
> sorry, but, its sounding like thin sheet of paper compared to others...
> and its not that cheap either!


Nonsense.


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## drpenguen (Sep 6, 2016)

hold ur horses everyone  
just changed the pass... i have no idea where this post came from. 
besides, i like CSS... especially love the bass 
hope this helps!


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## Silence-is-Golden (Sep 6, 2016)

drpenguen said:


> i have no idea where this post came from.


From you I guess? Or dr. Penguen is a synonym for dr jeckle & mr hyde? ( in terms of split personality, not referring to the cruelties!)

Anyhow..... whoever wrote it is apperently back in his cage and we can all live happily ever after now since everybody loves CSS again


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## Jimmy Hellfire (Sep 6, 2016)

drpenguen said:


> i have no idea where this post came from.



It must have been the little brother. Or perhaps the dog that usually eats the homework. That unruly mutt.


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## prodigalson (Sep 6, 2016)

drpenguen said:


> hold ur horses everyone
> just changed the pass... i have no idea where this post came from.
> besides, i like CSS... especially love the bass
> hope this helps!



Ah yes, obviously a troll hacking your highly sought after and vulnerable VI control account.


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## ein fisch (Sep 30, 2016)

drpenguen said:


> hold ur horses everyone
> just changed the pass... i have no idea where this post came from.
> besides, i like CSS... especially love the bass
> hope this helps!


confirmed troll


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## passsacaglia (Sep 30, 2016)

dogdad said:


> In regards to fast playing I use CS2. I don't use the legato but the spiccato patches with the live mode enabled. I have yet to find a library that sounds that good for fast playing (runs/arpeggios). I asked Alex if he'd implement that feature into CSS and he said he'd think about it..



I'd LOVE that!!! Hope he reads this!


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## nicedevill (Sep 30, 2016)

This is exactly post I wanted to see because I'm considering buying CSS, because, you know, we can't have too many good string libraries!

Can more CSS owners share their experience with this library (CSS), like, why would you recommend it and similar?


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## Jimmy Hellfire (Sep 30, 2016)

I would recommend it because in this age of many high quality string libraries, it still manages to stand out. It sounds wonderful, it's practical and easy to work with, and on top of that, it's really surprisingly affordable compared to other current "high class" string libs!

One thing I really love about it is the short notes. I can do stuff with them that just doesn't work with my other string libs. Things just get too flubby and mushy. Try doing a little short note piece for a quartet and then blow it up with a huge string library. It just gets lost. With CSS, I can do just that. The shorts are crisp, snappy, super-tight and on point and can be very aggressive if needed.

The overall sound of the library is gorgeous ... wonderful sense of detail. It's lively, it has texture, just made for storytelling. At the same time, it's not an overly "hyped up" sound. It's not slashing through the stratosphere with that hyped top end that some libraries have, and it's also not combed down and overbuttered too much for "lushness". It's a lively, vibrant, animated, but at the same time elegant and somewhat dark sound. As such, it reacts very nicely to adjustments: you can easily round off the edges, or give it a bit more soaring highs with EQ if that's what you need.

The same goes for the ambience. I love it. It's not a "dry" library, absolutely not, in fact, the sense of space that the microphone positions provide is convincing and beatiful. But it's "tight". It's not mushy, it's not boomy, and it doesn't have a really long reverb tail, not even the far mics. You get the depth of the sound stage and the liveliness of an ambient recoding, but you don't have that omnipresence of THE ROOM that makes some other libraries a bit more of a case of "love it or leave it" or "either it works or it doesn't". That's just perfect for me. And again: this also makes it very flexible. It's very easy to add a touch of reverb using a nice plugin if that's what you need. But the library sounds wonderful without any kind of additional processing too.


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## WindcryMusic (Sep 30, 2016)

nicedevill said:


> This is exactly post I wanted to see because I'm considering buying CSS, because, you know, we can't have too many good string libraries!
> 
> Can more CSS owners share their experience with this library (CSS), like, why would you recommend it and similar?



CSS has become my favorite string library ... in fact it's become my favorite SAMPLE library, without question. I would echo everything Jimmy said about it. Personally I've not yet felt a need to use anything other than the default mix mic position, which is a first for me.

The only minor, minor negative I could say is that the simulated con sordino isn't 100% convincing when fully exposed ... but when I layer it with Albion's con sordinos, the results are magical. I've been layering Albion 1/2/One in with CSS a lot in general, with CSS in the foreground and Albion basically adding in a touch of that Air Lyndhurst "airiness", and I am thrilled with the results I am getting.


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## NoamL (Sep 30, 2016)

Everything Jimmy said is spot on, but the most important point to me is that CSS sounds like how strings sound in a room not on a CD.

The expressiveness of the library comes from the detail & musicality of the recordings not mixing hype.

Before that, the main library that made me feel this way was LASS. There are too many developers out there who are premixing and shaping their libraries to get you "that amazing Hollywood cinematic sound out of the box!" well the problem is if you want something else you have a product that's already been so drastically treated it's impossible to get back to square one. These libraries also deliver false expectations of how beautiful and glamorous strings sound live! Hollywood Strings is already strings with a ton of makeup on; with Soaring Strings I get the impression that there's more makeup than strings...


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## dogdad (Sep 30, 2016)

passsacaglia said:


> I'd LOVE that!!! Hope he reads this!



Me too! I really hope he adds this feature from CS2. For me, it's what made it and continues to make it stand out.


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## NoamL (Sep 30, 2016)

The F#0 patch can do fast legato, runs and arpeggios quite well imo.


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## fgimian (Oct 3, 2016)

I own CSS too and it's just such an amazing library with imho the best legato I have ever heard in a string library. It's also very simple to use and functional.

My only gripe with it (and this is subjective) is that it is rather dark sounding. As such, I do tend to reach for EQ to brighten up the air frequencies and make it pop, which it really does. The only other point is that CSS is played with a good amount of vibrato, so when playing chords, it can sometimes sound a bit too much if you want a smoother sound. The non-vibrato recordings don't support legato transitions so they are of limited use.

My current favourite combo is Albion ONE strings for layering and CSS for the leads. This combo appears to work really well. I would use CSS for layering if I wanted something more "passionate" hehe, due to the extra vibrato


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## Vik (Oct 6, 2016)

Here's a review of Soaring Strings for those who are interested.


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## Musicam (Oct 6, 2016)

What kind of choir in this track?


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## Vik (Oct 6, 2016)

Musicam said:


> What kind of choir in this track?


I don't know (I just posted the YT-clip, I didn't make it!).


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## passsacaglia (Oct 6, 2016)

Vik said:


> I don't know (I just posted the YT-clip, I didn't make it!).






Musicam said:


> What kind of choir in this track?



In the CSS video he mentioned he uses Lacrimosa choirs  Could be the same?!


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## URL (Oct 6, 2016)

I think he use Lacrimosa choirs as maine choir and Metropolis ark...


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## fgimian (Oct 6, 2016)

I must admit that the legato of Soaring Strings sounds incredible. Pretty much on par with CSS but it does seem to be very nice for lead legato lines. As mentioned in the video though, due to its lack of articulations, it should be an addon library as opposed to your main string library.

Personally, I use CSS and Albion ONE for core strings (similar to the fella in the video) and find that combo to be great. However, Soaring Strings would be a great addon in future.


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## Vik (Oct 6, 2016)

It (Soaring) is probably perfect for the kind of adagios which Barber and Mahler have become famous for.


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## garyhiebner (Oct 7, 2016)

Vik said:


> Here's a review of Soaring Strings for those who are interested.




This is off topic, but the kid doing this review is super talented. Just saw on his Youtube channel that he's only in 9th grade. That's crazy! He's got some awesome gear and flipping good composing skills. Scary what the kid is going at that age.

[ulr]


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## mac (Oct 7, 2016)

And all I had at his age was a stick and a hoop lol. He is a really nice guy though, and has a good attitude. Obviously can play the shit out of the piano. He's off to see a certain Mr Zimmer soon too, so I hope it works out for him!


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## Zookes (Oct 7, 2016)

Wow!! so fortunate at this age to have such skills !

Very good parents also to secure this for him. I hope he is thankful of this...


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## Vik (Oct 7, 2016)

I like what Soaring Strings does, but have the feeling that with a good library with good control over vibrato one would be able to pretty much achieve the same thing. If that's correct, I guess the question is whether it's a good idea to get a dedicated soaring strings product or rather invest in a more complete library. And if one does that, one also get multiple mic positions and other functions.
OTOH; Soaring String's sustain patch has five dynamic layers, unlike most other libraries out there, and a special three layer patch with only the three softest layers. That can be very useful.
How many dynamic layers does CSS have?


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