# Inflators, Compressors and Limiters, Oh My ...



## clarkus (Jun 2, 2014)

I've settled my reverb needs for the time being. If you're curious about that topic, we can talk (I found a good solution, according to my ears). But I'm writing about another key part of the post-production / mixing world. 

Anyone have any favorite products for mastering that do compression and the like? 

Logic has plug-ins, but I assume if I'm willing to throw cash at this problem, I can get a better result? Feel free to disagree if you like Logic's compressor options. 

What I am personally interested in is the overall track level, and getting it all "Within a range." If the overall sonic quality is enhanced or warmed up (as some product manufacturers claim), that's okay, too. 

I'm simultaneously soliciting advice on my mixing technique, as this is contributing, I think, to the overall volume of my music wandering all over the map. 

But there's quite a bit of dynamic range in what I'm doing as well. So I'm shopping again. 

Here's a product that was recommended to me, just to get the discussion going: 

The Sonnox Oxford Inflator 

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/InflatorNat/


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## clarkus (Jun 2, 2014)

And here's the Sonnox Oxford Limiter.

Intended more, I think, for my generalized purpose: for mastering a piece of music & getting it all within a range.

Anyone using this?


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## gsilbers (Jun 2, 2014)

there is plenty of those products. 
it depends what you are doing. 
i use the hell out of them for my stuff. 
but woudlnt use it for classical or theatrical unless i think it really needs it. 

sonnox is good. 
there is also ozone. waves L1, L2 and L3. 
slate digital fg1
melda plugins has plenty. 
also there is the free plugins like channel form airwindos which brings the loudness level up. 

also keep in mind that track level does not equate to loud tracks. so i can have a track thats its levels are the same as brian tyler tracks (his shit is LOUD) and reack 0db but when you listen to it side by side his stuff sound louder. 
so inflator plays a role for this tyle of things but also good mixing, gear and ear helps.


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## ghostnote (Jun 2, 2014)

Using the Inflator a lot. Check out the PSP Vintage Warmer.


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## tmm (Jun 2, 2014)

I don't always compress. But when I do, I use Molot and TDL Feedback Compressor II.

Because they're both great, and both free.

For limiters, I use Waves L2, b/c I got it for a crazy deal ($20 or something like that), and it works perfectly.


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## Oliver_Codd (Jun 2, 2014)

Fab Filter Pro-L - by far my favorite limiter for the stereo bus. You can get things very loud without destroying your mix. 

Fab Filter Saturn - Really powerful saturation plugin. Definitely look in to this one, and all Fab filter plugins for that matter. 

Waves API 2500 - awesome compressor. Sounds great on drums and guitars. 

Waves R compressor - Sounds good on everything. 

Oxford Inflator

Hardware favorites: 2-1176, api2500, empirical labs distressors.


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## ThomasL (Jun 2, 2014)

Ok, here is the boring reply...

It's just tools. Does a $5 hammer do the same job as a $500? Yes. Is there a difference between them? Yes, but it would take a "pro" to understand the difference. And yes, a beginner can buy a $500 hammer and wave it in front of his friends but he will use it as a $5 hammer.

Logic has all the tools you need. Learn them, understand them. Then, when you start to see (hear) their shortcomings, look elsewhere. When that time comes you even know in which direction to look (listen).

If you have money to spend on the matter, spend it on knowledge, in whatever form you may find it.

Not too helpful perhaps, if you don't like this answer there are some good options above...


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## germancomponist (Jun 2, 2014)

ThomasL @ Mon Jun 02 said:


> Ok, here is the boring reply...
> 
> It's just tools. Does a $5 hammer do the same job as a $500? Yes. Is there a difference between them? Yes, but it would take a "pro" to understand the difference. And yes, a beginner can buy a $500 hammer and wave it in front of his friends but he will use it as a $5 hammer.
> 
> ...



+1!


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## Resoded (Jun 2, 2014)

Well what about nail guns then? I could swear my fine woodworking eh... craftsmanship... improves with it.


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## clarkus (Jun 2, 2014)

Hi, Thomas L:

"It's just tools. Does a $5 hammer do the same job as a $500? Yes. Is there a difference between them? Yes, but it would take a "pro" to understand the difference."

I am all about the humility. I am meeting with my engineer friends who are kindly offering me some instruction in how they go about their job. 

But I'm also working on the not-too-distant future to get some of music on my laptop off my laptop in satisfactory form.

Surely not all compressors are created equal.


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## NKM (Jun 2, 2014)

I like melda .

I agree that so many plugins are so similar that take the same plugin and add a better GUI and label the noise function analog and people will swear by it. 

But I choose melda because the bundle covers everything I enjoy the workflow and their ability to not forget those small things that many great sending plugins do. A compressor that does not have a wet / dry parameter for example.


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## clarkus (Jun 2, 2014)

Concise video on the Waves virtual plug-ins (with just a bit of sales-pitch)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-Jcg-UoJe8


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## germancomponist (Jun 2, 2014)

Knowing your tools is much more important than having so many... .


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## ThomasL (Jun 2, 2014)

clarkus @ 2014-06-02 said:


> Hi, Thomas L:
> 
> "It's just tools. Does a $5 hammer do the same job as a $500? Yes. Is there a difference between them? Yes, but it would take a "pro" to understand the difference."
> 
> ...



I did not mean to sound patronizing but I guess it may have sounded like that. I think you'd be surprised how many songs that have been made with stock plug-ins, in satisfactory form 

I know at least two producers that swear by Logics multiband compressor and wouldn't change it even if they got paid 

Of course not, all compressors are created equal, in that case there would be only one. But they function in the same way. If you learn one it's much easier to learn the next.

Logics compressor is capable of emulating different types of compressors. Like an SSL 4000 Bus Compressor for instance. Read some more about it here:
http://www.logicprohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24264


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## clarkus (Jun 2, 2014)

Thanks, Thomas. Will view. Always eager to do just fine with what I already have, when possible.

It's not hard to sound patronizing if you know what you're talking about, just as it's not hard to sound stupid when you don't.


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## ThomasL (Jun 2, 2014)

germancomponist @ 2014-06-02 said:


> Knowing your tools is much more important than having so many... .


I know a friend-of-a-friend whom is a golfer that only carries the iron 7, he even uses it as a putter. He's damn good!

NOTE: I am not a golfer...


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## dgburns (Jun 2, 2014)

i think the Logic plugs are very good.Good enough in fact to be able to only use them for just about everything.
That said,i think that the GUI design is a big part of how you go about getting your sound.Try the same eq settings,one on a graph style eq,and one with knobs a la vintage eq.You might be more tempted to go to extreme setting on a knob then on seeing a graph with the treble line boosted above the top,even though both may be representing the exact same underlying settings digitally.Same goes for a vu meter versus bar graph gain reduction.in fact,in the Distressor manual,there is a mention about this very thing.Bar graph leds will give you the impression of more gain reduction than a vu meter that responds more slowly.
For me,one of the challenges with some stock plugs are the gui,such as the multiband compressor in Logic.For some reason,i just don't get on with it,but I do like the mcdsp m4000.I think the biggest differences are the way the things re-act based on the settings,not so much the actual algorithms underneath the hood.
Other than the SSL channel strip,take away all my non stock reverbs,comps and limiters,and I can still get to the finish line no problems with the stock stuff.


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## Hannes_F (Jun 2, 2014)

NKM @ Mon Jun 02 said:


> I like melda .



I must admit that I only _really _understood compressors and expanders after using the melda plugins. I know, I know, it's a shame. To tell the truth I _had thought _I understood it but in hindsight I hadn't really. But their GUI is instructive for learning what is going on and so are their tutorial videos.


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## marclawsonmusic (Jun 2, 2014)

ThomasL @ Mon Jun 02 said:


> If you have money to spend on the matter, spend it on knowledge, in whatever form you may find it.



This is really brilliant and wise advice. Only in the past 1 year, from much reading on this forum, AND listening on my own, have I learned to hear things like reverb (various kinds) and compression in a mix.

One cannot say enough about ear training and its value on orchestration and engineering. What tool to use? When to use it? How much to use? The only gauge is your ear.

I am only a novice, but I know that the best engineers can still render a proper mix with any DAW stock plug-ins. They may not prefer it, but it IS possible. 

Anyway, +1 to ThomasL's advice. It's really more about your ear than anything else. The only thing you can give to that is time and lots of conscious listening.

I am thankful for vi-control,
Marc


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## re-peat (Jun 2, 2014)

marclawsonmusic @ Tue Jun 03 said:


> (...) It's really more about your ear than anything else. (...)


True, of course, but in-the-box mixes, especially when consisting of tracks that aspire to create the illusion of being something else than what they actually are, bring with them all sorts of problems that you can’t hope to solve with just trained ears alone. You need good ears to determine the problems, sure, but after that, you want the right tools to solve them with.

It helps, I find, if one first learns ― not just read about it, but *really* learn ― about what is available and what it is best used for. Knowing about what sort of situation asks for compression and which situation is better served with an expander, what sort of audio signal could do with a bit of transient designing, which dynamic problem is best tackled with multi-band compression, or when a dynamic EQ is preferable, or when it is better to ride the faders manually (which, I strongly believe, it very, very often is), or … when it is wiser to not use any dynamic processing at all … 

You also have to learn to know ― very important ― when EQ’ing, rather than compressing, is the best way to go. Instead of compressing summed signals, for example, it might be much better to simply EQ the basstrack a little.
And you also have to know that you can very much influence the behaviour of a compressor if you EQ the signal first … 

On top of that, you should also get thoroughly familiar ― did I just say ‘thoroughly’? I actually meant: super-hyper-mega-ultra-thoroughly ― with the sounds you use (not just their timbre, but above all their sonic characteristics). Because, if you don’t know your sounds intimately, there’s no way that you can process them effectively. Pizzicati from one library might need an entirely different treatment before they begin to sit well in a mix than pizzicati from another library … Harps ― other example ― need constant attention too, especially their glissandi, because many of them generate tons of low-end energy during a gliss that can cause a compressor, which was set to ‘mild processing’ to suddenly go into full squashing mode. And there’s thousands of examples like these.

And I’m not finished yet: you also have to learn, especially when working with sample libraries, that dynamic processing already begins at the stage of programming the tracks. Choice of velocities, articulations and CC#7/CC#11-automation is not just a matter of timbre and expression, it also has dynamic implications (with some instruments and libraries more so than with others of course), and you should know that and consider it. Because it all has the most profound bearing on what sort of dynamic processing may be needed and will work best, later on during the final stages of the production.

So, all of the things mentioned above are *very* different ― and of tremendous importance in the way they are different ― and if you don’t know about any of this, and simply slap on ‘some compression’ or ‘some limiting’ because you read somewhere that that is what you’re supposed to do, then yes, it doesn’t make one bit of difference what tools you use, cause you’re going to end up with poor-sounding results anyway. 

But if you *have* learned about all of this, done enough excercises and experiments with various tracks and mixes, and have familiarized yourself with the peculiarities of the dynamic behaviour of virtual instruments and in-the-box mixes, then the game changes completely. Then, a critical choice of tools makes complete sense, because then you have the expertise to know what sets one tool apart from the others, and when which tool is best suited for the job at hand.

At which stage, and only then, so no sooner, I would humbly suggest some of my favourite dynamic processors:
(1) ProDSPAudio’s Dynamic Spectrum Mapper (a true favourite, and one of only a dozen plugins, like the Clariphonic, I would instantly buy again if I had to start over)
(2) Flux Alchemist (complex, difficult, but when set right: sensational)
(3) Melda DynamicEQ (before the Melda, I always used the Powercore’s DynamicEQ which I liked even more. And Sonalksis has a terrific dynamic EQ as well.)

I also reach for, depending on the situation, the Inflator, the UAD Precision collection, Logic’s Enveloper and various compressors and stuff. 
(I very rarely use straight compression though, finding that most virtual and/or sampled instruments lack already more than enough dynamic life as it is.)

And I am very pleased to also own an Anamod ATS-1 (hardware analogue tape simulator) and a Thermionic Culture Fat Bustard (valve mixer) which both bring a very musical type of dynamic processing all of their own to a mix. I only mention this to share the experience that quality hardware gear instantly diminishes the need for much plugins. Both of these boxes, for example, compress quite magically, without ever causing the results to sound ‘obviously compressed’, boxy, squashed or small (like all too many plugins do). I often even use the ATS-1 as a sort of limiter, after discovering that it does that very well, and you can never tell that I did.

Shouldn’t this thread be in the “Post Pro & Mixing Discussion” sub-forum?

_


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## StatKsn (Jun 3, 2014)

I was mostly using Waves R-comp (very simple - has a nice internal limiter when it gets too loud), also some DC8C (very flexible, but of course complex and lacks GUI curve to see what's going on).

Recently I'm moving to TDL Feedback II... which covers the most thing I want to do with comps (the peak/crest knob and the dry mix knob are the killers) and still manages to be simple. AND it's free.


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## korgscrew (Jun 3, 2014)

I use The Glue on the master buss and Fabfilter - Pro-L. Maybe Fabfilter Pro-Q if it needs it.


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## Consona (Jun 3, 2014)

TDR Feedback Compressor II for compression. It's free.

TB ReelBus for warming things up. Free trial, 19.95 € to buy.

Both plugins sound great imo.


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## Vin (Jun 3, 2014)

Consona @ 3/6/2014 said:


> TDR Feedback Compressor II for compression. It's free.
> 
> TB ReelBus for warming things up. Free trial, 19.95 € to buy.
> 
> Both plugins sound great imo.



& TB Barricade for limiting. As good as any of the much pricier alternatives like Pro-L, Elephant or Sonnox Limiter.

Also, my favorite EQ. And it's free.


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## StatKsn (Jun 3, 2014)

Hi Vin, TDR VOS Slick EQ is really good. I cannot believe it is free as I could not find a one with similar character in the market. Almost no resonance and can be very subtle to be in-your-face.

For a more saturated (even slightly compressing?) EQ, I liked Maag EQ4 but the price tag can be a bit steep.

Speaking of http://varietyofsound.wordpress.com/ (VOS), RescueMK2 is also free, a M/S limiter/stereo expander. Very useful for a subtle stereo mixing.


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## clarkus (Jun 3, 2014)

I could move this over to “Post Pro & Mixing Discussion” if it's not too late. Which I suppose it is. Duly noted.

This is terrific perspective. Thanks.


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## rayinstirling (Jun 3, 2014)

I'm with re-peat on the Melda Productions MDynamicEQ
It's just so versatile.

EDIT: after reading through again I realize, using the term "versatile" means nothing until we know what we want and have some inkling on how to achieve it.


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## wst3 (Jun 3, 2014)

one more opinion<G>...

a dynamics processor is a very valuable tool, and while it is true (to a point) that they all do the same thing, it is equally true that there are significant differences.

Is it trying to emulate an old favorite (think UA 1176, dBX 160, SSL Bus Compressor, etc)?

Does it go beyond what the old hardware was capable of (think Melda, FabFilter, Waves, etc)?

Most compressors that emulate hardware have limited control, and even more limited reporting. 

While I learned to use compressors by watching little needles bounce back and forth I'm not convinced it is the best way to learn.

Same thing applies to controls - I love that the 1176 has a fixed threshold, and I control the relationship between the input signal and that threshold. But it is just as useful to be able to leave the input level alone and adjust the threshold.

And we haven't even begun to discuss the sound of the device - soft-knee vs. hard-knee, feed-forward vs. feedback, tube or FET or resistor as gain element... and so on<G>!!

How do you decide which one(s) to use?

I'm really not sure, other than learning as much as you can about how dynamics processors work, and then learning the differences between all those different features, and by learning I mean learning to hear the differences.

There is a reason you'll likely find both the 1176 and the LA-2 in a commercial studio rack. One works great on (most) vocals, the other works great on (most) guitars... your assignment is not just to figure out which is which, but why one might have advantages in specific application... if that makes sense.

I don't own Logic, but it is my impression that every DAW platform comes with a variety of processors, and I think that is probably a great place to start.

Once you feel comfortable start downloading demos from FabFilter, Melda, Izotope, Sonnox, etc. If you don't mind the initial outlay, I think the UAD plugins are about as good as it gets, and you can demo all their plugins for 14 days, although your wallet might complain if you like them!

Last thought - while multi-band dynamics processors are awesome, I would not start with one. Start with a wideband compressor, and once you understand how that works then add the complexity of the multi-band family!

(aside - can't tell you how many hours I spent connecting 2 and 3 way cross-overs to compressors back in the bad old days!!!)


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## Arksun (Jun 3, 2014)

I'd much rather let others do the mastering and worry about getting the mix right. But if I'm having to make a track 'loud' myself using a limiter, I still like the old Voxengo Elephant, now at v4. Its pretty tweakable.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Jun 3, 2014)

No question, a great engineer will produce a better mix than mine with a compressor he or she pulls out of the toilet. That's true of every tool.

But what Bill says. The hammer really does make a difference. You only have to put an LA2A on a pop vocal once to hear how it can compress a pop voc 15dB and still sound really good! Try that with the one in Logic.

And put, say, The Glue next to the Logic compressor and listen to the difference. Or - this is pretty dramatic - try Waves L3 or iZotope Ozone on a mix. Then run it through the Logic limiter.

You know Munch's "The Scream?" That's you.


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## clarkus (Jun 4, 2014)

Thanks, Nick - So this begs a question, which is my original one. 

I hear loud & clear the comments about adjusting volume individually through automation & other means, that sampled music sometimes actually lacks dynamics, so you need need to wary of squashing it further, etc. 

I've been steered to several sources, online and off, for my continued education. But I am going to be mixing music here, and a compressor need not be a huge investment.

To cut to the chase, of the products mentioned, what is recommended on the master bus? If one wants to improve on the Logic Plug-In?

A friendly interface & not too crazy expensive are my criterion. 

Some will color the sound of mix more than others, some respond to dynamic changes very quickly, some less so & so will be less transparent in their operation ... I know there are variables. But I've found this Forum to be more valuable than most of the information on the web. A lot of you have been doing this for years & have good reasons for your opinions.

For the master bus (not for vocals, specifically, or guitar, or drums) what do you tend to go to?

Oliver Codd write: "Fab Filter Pro-L - by far my favorite limiter for the stereo bus. You can get things very loud without destroying your mix." 

And Re-peat gave a nice, detailed list of favorites with admirable specificity:

"At which stage, and only then, so no sooner, I would humbly suggest some of my favourite dynamic processors: 
(1) ProDSPAudio’s Dynamic Spectrum Mapper (a true favourite, and one of only a dozen plugins, like the Clariphonic, I would instantly buy again if I had to start over) 
(2) Flux Alchemist (complex, difficult, but when set right: sensational) 
(3) Melda DynamicEQ (before the Melda, I always used the Powercore’s DynamicEQ which I liked even more. And Sonalksis has a terrific dynamic EQ as well.) 

I also reach for, depending on the situation, the Inflator, the UAD Precision collection, Logic’s Enveloper and various compressors and stuff. 
(I very rarely use straight compression though, finding that most virtual and/or sampled instruments lack already more than enough dynamic life as it is.) 

And I am very pleased to also own an Anamod ATS-1 (hardware analogue tape simulator) and a Thermionic Culture Fat Bustard (valve mixer) which both bring a very musical type of dynamic processing all of their own to a mix. I only mention this to share the experience that quality hardware gear instantly diminishes the need for much plugins. Both of these boxes, for example, compress quite magically, without ever causing the results to sound ‘obviously compressed’, boxy, squashed or small (like all too many plugins do). I often even use the ATS-1 as a sort of limiter, after discovering that it does that very well, and you can never tell that I did."

... hardware is duly noted. 

Other candidates?

And I'm sorry if this seems redundant. Just trying to focus the inquiry a little & perhaps that will be helpful to others here , too.

Thanks so much.


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## clarkus (Jun 4, 2014)

This is the Fab Filter Pro-L that Oliver mentioned, for anyone else in need:

http://www.fabfilter.com/products/pro-l ... er-plug-in


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## jneebz (Jun 4, 2014)

This is a fantastic thread for novices like me...and one of the reasons I love this forum. Re-peat, your post is gold, thank you for sharing that information.

-Jamie


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## clarkus (Jun 4, 2014)

Waves L3 discounted:

http://www.waves.com/plugins/l3-multima ... _5DY3w_wcB


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## jneebz (Jun 4, 2014)

If you open an account you can save an extra $20 on the Waves L3 here:

http://audiodeluxe.com/products/waves-l3-multimaximizer-native (http://audiodeluxe.com/products/waves-l ... zer-native)

I'm not affiliated, just working with a tight budget and like getting deals :wink: 

-Jamie


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## waveheavy (Jun 5, 2014)

clarkus @ 2/6/2014 said:


> I'm simultaneously soliciting advice on my mixing technique, as this is contributing, I think, to the overall volume of my music wandering all over the map.



I've got a lot of the mixing tools mentioned here. But I think the Logic stuff is darn good. It's simply a matter of knowing how to properly use it.

Setting initial mix levels, simply do a rough mix (in mono), yes, in mono. Lot easier to hear mix balances in mono, and also notice any phase issues, as they will show up in mono. Usually a good idea to set the initial levels somewhere in the low yellow. Then check the master buss level, with nothing on the buss yet.

Once you've got the initial 'static' mix and panning, no EQ, no comp, no effects, everything balanced with each other, no phase issues, then that's where you want the track levels to stay.

Then slap on a buss comp, set no more than 1 to 1.5dB of compression. It's only to handle the occasional overs, very occasional overs.

The way you maintain your 'static' mix levels when you begin to add effects (EQ and comp next) is, you A/B check what the effect did by 'matching' the before after volume levels of the track. If the track level was -9dB, and you add an EQ or comp that boosts the level, reduce... the level in the effect plugin to match the -9dB track level prior to putting that effect on. That way you keep your initial 'static' mix levels throughout, and... you actually hear the difference of what that effect did. The buss level(s) will go up some when all tracks are done, but shouldn't be enough to matter at this point if you set the initial levels in the low yellow ranges. If the master buss level is too high, set all the instrument tracks to one group, then pull all their faders down together a bit, then get rid of the group assignment.

The mix should sound almost finished once you're done with EQ and comp. Then goto stereo monitoring and add whatever verb effects, etc. 

With a buss compressor/limiter, if you boost it so it's showing 'red', then your mix is distorting. Time to re-set all the instrument faders again using a group assignment.


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## waveheavy (Jun 6, 2014)

clarkus @ 4/6/2014 said:


> I've been steered to several sources, online and off, for my continued education. But I am going to be mixing music here, and a compressor need not be a huge investment.
> 
> To cut to the chase, of the products mentioned, what is recommended on the master bus? If one wants to improve on the Logic Plug-In?
> 
> A friendly interface & not too crazy expensive are my criterion.



The Waves L1-LL, L2, L3-LL Ultramaximizers are still some of the most transparent plugins to use on the master bus, they're not that expensive. There are other brands of course. I like the Waves also because of ease of use. I notice not that many folks know how to properly use it.

Waves:
On the Waves bus comps, you have 3 sets of bars, Threshold, Out Ceiling, and Attenuation. The Attenuation bar turns red to let you know when you're beginning to degrade the original quality of the audio. 

In between the Threshold and Out Ceiling bars there's a small up-down arrow button. That button slides both the Threshold and Out Ceiling settings down together at the same time. You begin with Threshold and Out Ceiling set to 0.0, then while your mix is playing you use the slider button to drag both settings downward until you begin to see red hitting in the Attenuator bar. When you begin to see red in the Atten bar, that is the maximum amount of the comp you can use on that specific mix without it distorting or degrading the original quality of your mix. Then you slide the Out Ceiling setting back up near 0.0 (I recommend -0.3 to -0.5 on the Out Ceiling to help prevent intersample peaks).

Once you slide the Out Ceiling setting back up to around -0.3, that's when you'll get your loudness increase. If too much, move the Threshold slider up to where you want. But if you slide further down the audio will Atten more and begin to degrade the audio. 

Because the L2, L3-LL, etc., are brick wall type limiters, they won't allow the Out Ceiling to go beyond the -0.3 setting unless you really move the Threshold way, way down. But drive it in the red and you get the sound a lot of the EDM styles use today. The Oxford Inflator works in a similar way as these particular Waves types of comp/limiters. 

Ozone 5 is especially good on the master bus because it will also show you intersample peaks which can distort your finished audio. It's a little bit more difficult to use though.


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## clarkus (Jun 6, 2014)

Thanks, Waveheavy, for a very thorough response and for actual instructions.

I'm meeting an engineer next week for an in-person lesson, so am putting off equipment decisions for now. Especially as the consensus seems to be that the Logic plug-ins are really not bad.

I wonder if you have opinion of Fab Filter, which was mentioned ealrie run this thread right next to the Waves Products:

"Fab Filter Pro-L - by far my favorite limiter for the stereo bus. You can get things very loud without destroying your mix. 

Fab Filter Saturn - Really powerful saturation plugin. Definitely look in to this one, and all Fab filter plugins for that matter."


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## waveheavy (Jun 7, 2014)

clarkus @ 6/6/2014 said:


> Thanks, Waveheavy, for a very thorough response and for actual instructions.
> 
> I'm meeting an engineer next week for an in-person lesson, so am putting off equipment decisions for now. Especially as the consensus seems to be that the Logic plug-ins are really not bad.
> 
> I wonder if you have opinion of Fab Filter, which was mentioned ealrie run this thread right next to the Waves Products:



The Fab Filter Pro Q will probably wind up being my main goto EQ. 

But like others here have said, it's not essentially about gadgets. It's understanding how to use what you have. 

Like my Waves comp/limiter example above, lot of people have it, but just pull the threshold down until it does something, not really understanding what the Atten bar going 'red' is telling them. 

Going into a studio for some training by a pro mix engineer is a very... smart move. By that should learn how best to deliver your work. You can get them to show you how to get the most out of your DAW's plugins.


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## waveheavy (Jun 7, 2014)

Nick Batzdorf @ 3/6/2014 said:


> No question, a great engineer will produce a better mix than mine with a compressor he or she pulls out of the toilet. That's true of every tool.
> 
> But what Bill says. The hammer really does make a difference. You only have to put an LA2A on a pop vocal once to hear how it can compress a pop voc 15dB and still sound really good! Try that with the one in Logic.



Not trying to bust anyone's bubble here, but in all honesty it's not standard to use just one compressor (like the LA2A) on a track with runaway dynamics. Often 2 or sometimes 3 comps are used in series.

Here's another example I don't mind sharing:
If you're going to use compression to try and tame a track with runaway dynamics, it's better to use more than one comp hit a small amount instead of one comp hit a whole lot (i.e., lot of gain reduction). 

The LA2A is a tube type that adds warmth, but it doesn't have real fast attack/release characteristics. So get too much past -3 on gain reduction and it will begin to give a 'pumping' sound. Use 2 of them in series hitting no more than -3 gain reduction and you'll get its effect and tame dynamics without the pumping. (But if you do want that pumping effect, like on a synth, now you know what to do to get it with one LA2A, driving it harder).

This is one of mixer's standards using compressors. It's better to use just a little bit on tracks that need it, then another on a group bus to help gel similar instruments, and then another on the master bus, each one hitting a little. All that adds up, and you'll have an easier time with keeping your gain staging at each step of the mix.

If you are wanting the listener to hear the obvious effect of a compressor type, disregard all the above, go for it. No rules, except what the genre requires.

Another point; the real analog hardware, like the LA2A analog outboard unit, has more headroom than the digital plugin emulations. Same with most any outboard analog compressor, EQ, or whatever. Some of the best pro mixers out there are using a hybrid mix setup, some digital plugins, some analog outboard gear, analog summing, etc. With something like a Great River outboard analog EQ in the effects chain, you can get by with boosting frequencies a whole lot more than you can with digital plugins.


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## marclawsonmusic (Jun 7, 2014)

waveheavy @ Fri Jun 06 said:


> The Waves L1-LL, L2, L3-LL Ultramaximizers are still some of the most transparent plugins to use on the master bus, they're not that expensive. There are other brands of course. I like the Waves also because of ease of use. I notice not that many folks know how to properly use it.



Hi waveheavy and welcome to the forum!

I just wanted to say thanks for this mini-tutorial here. I thought I knew how to use my L1, but I was not paying enough attention to the Attenuation indicator.

Now I know how to better use this tool. Many thanks!
Marc


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## waveheavy (Jun 7, 2014)

marclawsonmusic @ 7/6/2014 said:


> waveheavy @ Fri Jun 06 said:
> 
> 
> > Hi waveheavy and welcome to the forum!
> ...



Thanks, and you're welcome.

Dave


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## jcs88 (Jun 8, 2014)

I'm still getting most of my mastering stuff from Logic's content and the SSL stuff from Komplete Ultimate 8


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## Stinki (Jun 8, 2014)

clarkus @ Sat Jun 07 said:


> I wonder if you have opinion of Fab Filter, which was mentioned ealrie run this thread right next to the Waves Products:
> "



Fab Filters' products are generally very good, and their user tutorials are the best.

Also highly regarded, for the mix buss, and worth a trial, are the Neve/Steinberg/Yamaha collaboration Compressor and EQ known as the RND Portico: 

http://www.steinberg.net/en/shop/vst/rn ... ugins.html


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