# This looks interesting.



## BassClef (Jan 25, 2021)

... new Waves plugin. Might be useful to small home studio types like me.


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## BassClef (Jan 25, 2021)

OK... so I bought it and... IT SOUNDS GREAT. It also comes with 12 Headphone algorithms that are designed to completely flatten 12 different popular headphone models. I have on of those... Sennheiser HD280Pro, but they do not have one for my HD650s. 

Perhaps we'll see someone mix a track in that actual control room and then again using this plugin, to see how close the mixes are.


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## Mornats (Jan 26, 2021)

Looks good for me too. Do you find it helps you hear how your mix may sound on speakers? Are you getting good results from it so far?


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## Markrs (Jan 26, 2021)

Waiting on a comparison to dsoniq's Realphones, as I have that and pleased with it, but trying to understand what this would offer extra, or improvement on creating the virtual mix room.


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## BassClef (Jan 26, 2021)

There is some kind of voodoo going on in that plugin. Keep in mind... I'm a trained musician but just a hobbyist in composition and using VIs. AND I do this in an untreated 12 foot square office with a pair of Focal's cheapest monitors. (Alpha 65) Yes I do have room issues! (and age related hearing loss)

The voodoo actually makes the headphones disappear, so I actually feel like I'm sitting in front of speakers. The sound is much cleaner, I'm assuming due to the elimination of room issues. This seems most apparent in the low end and low miss. I've already revisited a few compositions and was able to "clean them up" because of what I could now hear.

So far I have only used my Sennheiser HD-280 Pros because that is one of the 12 that the plugin has EQ's for. I need to spend more time A/B-ing the headphones with and without the plugin in and A/B-ing the headphones with and without the specific EQs. Next I'm going to try my Sennheiser HD-650s even though only have EQs for the 600s and 800s.

Today I'm going to listen to the speakers with this plugin "on" which SHOULD sound bad! I will have to remember to turn off the plugin when using the monitors and when bounding out the composition.

I wonder how much difference there is between this and their first NX monitoring room which is the "Abbey Road Studio 3" control room. So far I really like this $35 plugin!


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## BassClef (Jan 26, 2021)

One big downside... very CPU intensive, especially when using the head tracking!


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## pmcrockett (Jan 26, 2021)

BassClef said:


> I wonder how much difference there is between this and their first NX monitoring room which is the "Abbey Road Studio 3" control room. So far I really like this $35 plugin!


As a user of both Abbey Road Studio 3 and the older NX that doesn't have studio branding, I wonder this too. Frankly, I'm not inclined to shell out for an additional studio space when what I actually care about is the quality and usefulness of the spatialization. I don't think Abbey Road Studio 3 is objectively better than the older NX, which doesn't emulate a real studio, so I'm not convinced additional studio emulations are worth bothering with. I guess I could demo Ocean Way, but I'm not sure I'm even motivated enough to do that.


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## BassClef (Jan 27, 2021)

pmcrockett said:


> As a user of both Abbey Road Studio 3 and the older NX that doesn't have studio branding, I wonder this too. Frankly, I'm not inclined to shell out for an additional studio space when what I actually care about is the quality and usefulness of the spatialization. I don't think Abbey Road Studio 3 is objectively better than the older NX, which doesn't emulate a real studio, so I'm not convinced additional studio emulations are worth bothering with. I guess I could demo Ocean Way, but I'm not sure I'm even motivated enough to do that.


Thanks for the reply. Since You have more experience with this plugin (I only have a few hours) how do you handle the output volume inside the plug-in? If I leave it at the default “0” db, I do get clipping as the documentation suggests, and that clipping does show in my DAW as well 

Do you simply back off of the plug-in volume by a few db and then turn up the volume on your headphones to compensate?


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## pmcrockett (Jan 27, 2021)

BassClef said:


> Thanks for the reply. Since You have more experience with this plugin (I only have a few hours) how do you handle the output volume inside the plug-in? If I leave it at the default “0” db, I do get clipping as the documentation suggests, and that clipping does show in my DAW as well
> 
> Do you simply back off of the plug-in volume by a few db and then turn up the volume on your headphones to compensate?


Yes, that's how I've always dealt with it.


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## Monkey Man (Jan 27, 2021)

I had to dig a bit to find the headphone EQ-correctin list, so here it is.

These EQ compensations apply to all Nx plugins:

Audeze EL-8 (Closed-Back)
Audeze iSINE 20
Audeze SINE
Audio-Technica ATH-M50x
AKG K-702
Beyerdynamic DT-880 (250 ohm)
Beyerdynamic DT-990 (250 ohm)
Sennheiser HD-280 Pro
Sennheiser HD-600
Sennheiser HD-800
Shure SRH-440
Sony MDR-7506
Disappointed that my Sennheiser HD25-1 isn't supported.


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## filipjonathan (Jan 27, 2021)

Guys, how does this work with Sonarworks?? Or is it either or?


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## BassClef (Jan 27, 2021)

Good question but I've never used Sonarworks. I read somewhere what company Waves got the 12 headphone EQ's listed above to use with the NX plugins, but I can not remember the name of that company. (maybe Canopener Studio) I spoke with Waves today and they do not yet have a list of future additions to the current list of 12.

I'm looking forward to trying this with a pair of Beyerdymanic DT-880 Pros (on the list) and a pair of Sennheiser HD-650s. (MassDrop - version not on the list)


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## pmcrockett (Jan 27, 2021)

filipjonathan said:


> Guys, how does this work with Sonarworks?? Or is it either or?


They don't really do the same things. Sonarworks flattens the headphones frequency profile but doesn't imitate monitors or an acoustic space, whereas this emulates the monitors and space and corrects the headphones to match to profile of that space. If you have headphones supported by NX, I'd use those instead of using Sonarworks with NX. If your headphones aren't supported, you can try mixing the two and see if you like the results -- ultimately, the goal is to set up a mix environment that makes mixing as easy as possible for you, so whether NX + Sonarworks is beneficial is likely to be a subjective call.


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## filipjonathan (Jan 27, 2021)

pmcrockett said:


> They don't really do the same things. Sonarworks flattens the headphones frequency profile but doesn't imitate monitors or an acoustic space, whereas this emulates the monitors and space and corrects the headphones to match to profile of that space.


So I _could _technically use them both?


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## filipjonathan (Jan 27, 2021)

BassClef said:


> Good question but I've never used Sonarworks. I read somewhere what company Waves got the 12 headphone EQ's listed above to use with the NX plugins, but I can not remember the name of that company. I spoke with Waves today and they do not yet have a list of future additions to the current list of 12.
> 
> I'm looking forward to trying this with a pair of Beyerdymanic DT-880 Pros (on the list) and a pair of Sennheiser HD-650s. (MassDrop - version not on the list)


Fortunately my main cans are BD 990 which are on the list so I might demo the plugin and see if it works with Sonarworks.


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## pmcrockett (Jan 27, 2021)

filipjonathan said:


> So I _could _technically use them both?


Yes -- sorry, edited my post after you quoted.


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## filipjonathan (Jan 27, 2021)

pmcrockett said:


> Yes -- sorry, edited my post after you quoted.


Gotcha. Thanks!


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## Trash Panda (Jan 27, 2021)

Sonarworks advises using their correction as the last plugin in the chain, so you’d just disable the headphone correction in NX and run Sonarworks afterwards.


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## robgb (Jan 27, 2021)

You can flatten your headphones using an impulse response. You can get one for most headphones here:









AutoEq/README.md at 2dff3b2666357204076e9e064426a8762b992718 · jaakkopasanen/AutoEq


Automatic headphone equalization from frequency responses - AutoEq/README.md at 2dff3b2666357204076e9e064426a8762b992718 · jaakkopasanen/AutoEq




github.com


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## Monkey Man (Jan 27, 2021)

BassClef said:


> I spoke with Waves today and they do not yet have a list of future additions to the current list of 12.


Thanks man. Bummer.

I know my HD25-1's are old, but they're natural-sounding and solid. I can only hope Waves creates a compensation for them.

In the meantime, I'll take a look at the site @robgb pointed to. Thanks Rob. :emoji_beers:


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## Monkey Man (Jan 27, 2021)

Dayum. The link for my HD25-1 brings up a 404 error. The MkII one does not, so I'm guessing that's bad luck?

Call me naive, but I assumed I'd only have to DL an IR file and pop it into a convolution plugin of my choice and insert it on the master bus last, or if using Nx, before an instance thereof. Instead I'm confronted with one of the deepest rabbit holes in recent memory. Am I missing something?


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## Markrs (Jan 27, 2021)

Monkey Man said:


> Dayum. The link for my HD25-1 brings up a 404 error. The MkII one does not, so I'm guessing that's bad luck?
> 
> Call me naive, but I assumed I'd only have to DL an IR file and pop it into a convolution plugin of my choice and insert it on the master bus last, or if using Nx, before an instance thereof. Instead I'm confronted with one of the deepest rabbit holes in recent memory. Am I missing something?


I felt the same looking at the site.

You can an either use the EQ instructions to EQ flatten your headphones or use the downloadable .wav files in a convolution reverb.

Here is the but about using convolution reverbs 








GitHub - jaakkopasanen/AutoEq: Automatic headphone equalization from frequency responses


Automatic headphone equalization from frequency responses - GitHub - jaakkopasanen/AutoEq: Automatic headphone equalization from frequency responses




github.com


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## robgb (Jan 28, 2021)

Monkey Man said:


> Dayum. The link for my HD25-1 brings up a 404 error. The MkII one does not, so I'm guessing that's bad luck?


It didn't used to give 404 errors. But if you download the AutoEq package and unzip it, there are IR files for many, many headphones. Just grab yours from there, or use the EQ settings if you prefer.


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## BassClef (Jan 28, 2021)

As I stated earlier... the head tracker part of the plugin plays hell with my older iMac. (likely to be upgraded soon) I contacted Waves to see if there is a way to prevent that head tracker from loading when I add the plugin to my master bus. They said no, so I just have to let it load then turn it off. 

For those using this or other Waves NX plugins, do you leave the plugin loaded on your projects and just turn it off/on as needed or do you only add it when you want to use your headphones, and then unload it before saving the project file?


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## Trash Panda (Jan 28, 2021)

I don't use this particular plugin, but I leave any plugins like this or Real Phones on the monitor bus in Reaper so it's not attached to projects or on the listen bus in Studio One.


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## Monkey Man (Jan 28, 2021)

robgb said:


> It didn't used to give 404 errors. But if you download the AutoEq package and unzip it, there are IR files for many, many headphones. Just grab yours from there, or use the EQ settings if you prefer.


Thanks mate!



Markrs said:


> You can an either use the EQ instructions to EQ flatten your headphones or use the downloadable .wav files in a convolution reverb.
> 
> Here is the but about using convolution reverbs
> 
> ...


Thank you Mark.

I must be dumb (well, I knew _that_), 'cause like yesterday I keep goin' 'round in circles on that site.

If someone could edumacate me by pointing directly to a link, it'd save lil' ol' me a bunch of further, fruitless calcumalation.


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## kgdrum (Jan 28, 2021)

@Monkey Man
My friend I can’t help you with this software but I never like hearing you talk about going fruitless!


🍌 🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌🍌


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## pmcrockett (Jan 28, 2021)

BassClef said:


> As I stated earlier... the head tracker part of the plugin plays hell with my older iMac. (likely to be upgraded soon) I contacted Waves to see if there is a way to prevent that head tracker from loading when I add the plugin to my master bus. They said no, so I just have to let it load then turn it off.
> 
> For those using this or other Waves NX plugins, do you leave the plugin loaded on your projects and just turn it off/on as needed or do you only add it when you want to use your headphones, and then unload it before saving the project file?


I keep it on the monitor chain in Reaper because that doesn't affect rendering, but if your DAW doesn't have anything similar to that, just put it last on the master bus and bypass it whenever you're not on headphones or are rendering.


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## cuttime (Jan 28, 2021)

Just a heads up: This is a v.12 plugin that is only compatible with *Metal Graphics compatible Macs*. I knew better, and still got bit. There is no v.11 AFAIK.


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## Monkey Man (Jan 28, 2021)

Thank you for the heads-up, Brother cuttime. 



kgdrum said:


> @Monkey Man
> My friend I can’t help you with this software but I never like hearing you talk about going fruitless!


Ha! We have a little Unicorn Trio™ happening here between you, me and cuttime, Brother KG.

Oh, the laughs we had back in the day.


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## cuttime (Jan 28, 2021)

Monkey Man said:


> Thank you for the heads-up, Brother cuttime.
> 
> 
> Ha! We have a little Unicorn Trio™ happening here between you, me and cuttime, Brother KG.
> ...


Representin'.


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## kgdrum (Jan 28, 2021)

Monkey Man said:


> Thank you for the heads-up, Brother cuttime.
> 
> 
> Ha! We have a little Unicorn Trio™ happening here between you, me and cuttime, Brother KG.
> ...


Wow! I guess it shouldn’t be surprising that a monkey just taught a drummer something!
All of this time I never connected cuttime from Motunation,lol 

hi @cuttime 👋


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## Monkey Man (Jan 28, 2021)

Shame on you, Brother KG! 

I'd tell you to go spank the monkey but it'd be more-appropriate for this monkey to give you a spankin'.


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## kgdrum (Jan 28, 2021)

Monkey Man said:


> Shame on you, Brother KG!
> 
> I'd tell you to go spank the monkey but it'd be more-appropriate for this monkey to give you a spankin'.


Unfortunately I continually spank the monkey more than I should! 😂


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## Russell Anderson (Jan 29, 2021)

Throwing in another mention if Realphones - I use that software and have a few times reached for the knob of my monitors because I’d realized it was far too late to be playing music that loudly - _but I was wearing headphones _



BassClef said:


> For those using this or other Waves NX plugins, do you leave the plugin loaded on your projects and just turn it off/on as needed or do you only add it when you want to use your headphones, and then unload it before saving the project file?



I usually open it any time I’m using headphones, and then just turn it on/off after. Realphones has a small cpu footprint (from what I’ve noticed anyway - no head tracking though)


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## FlyingAndi (Jan 29, 2021)

I just demoed Nx Ocean Way Nashville. I deactivated the head tracking. A few minutes later the plugin crashed.
After a restart, cakewalk didn't find the plugin anymore. Does anybody have similar problems?


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## Teldex (Feb 6, 2021)

FlyingAndi said:


> I just demoed Nx Ocean Way Nashville. I deactivated the head tracking. A few minutes later the plugin crashed.
> After a restart, cakewalk didn't find the plugin anymore. Does anybody have similar problems?


Hi FlyingAndi

I’m a Cakewalk user, and have just purchased the NX Ocean Way Nashville. No problems with the plugin so far.

Cakewalk by Bandlab is on the list of supported hosts for the plugin. Are you using the VST3 version?


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## FlyingAndi (Feb 6, 2021)

I should have posted an update: the problem seems to be Convology XT. Only if I have both plugins running I get crashes and gui problems. It's the same with Convology XT + KONTAKT. 
The Convology support told me that there will be an update at the end of the month that should fix the problem.


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