# NI not supporting High Sierra anymore?????



## cuttime (Sep 14, 2021)

I just tried to upgrade Reaktor and got this revoltin' development:


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## kgdrum (Sep 14, 2021)

cuttime said:


> I just tried to upgrade Reaktor and got this revoltin' development:


@cuttime 
Wow,I’m sorry to hear this.I upgraded to Mojave in March to get as up to date as I can to minimize and hold off these kinds of technological sucker punch’s as much as possible……. Are you using a 5,1 and do you have a metal card?
So far I can’t install Massive X and Modo Drum because my rig doesn’t support AVX but otherwise I really like Mojave and the MP works well in Mojave.
Planned obsolescence sucks doesn’t it?


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## cuttime (Sep 14, 2021)

kgdrum said:


> @cuttime
> Wow,I’m sorry to hear this.I upgraded to Mojave in March to get as up to date as I can to minimize and hold off these kinds of technological sucker punch’s as much as possible……. Are you using a 5,1 and do you have a metal card?
> So far I can’t install Massive X and Modo Drum because my rig doesn’t support AVX but otherwise I really like Mojave and the MP works well in Mojave.
> Planned obsolescence sucks doesn’t it?


Nope, an iMac, not metal. I wish there was some warning. I just updated Kontakt two days ago with no issue.


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## cuttime (Sep 14, 2021)

I just double checked this at the NI website and it looks like everything has a 10.14 minimum OS now.

EDIT: It looks like Kontakt still supports 10.13, but I wonder how long that lasts.


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## kgdrum (Sep 14, 2021)

Maybe someone affiliated with NI can get you the latest version of Reaktor that will work with you Mac,have you reached out to NI?


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## cuttime (Sep 14, 2021)

kgdrum said:


> Maybe someone affiliated with NI can get you the latest version of Reaktor that will work with you Mac,have you reached out to NI?


I opened a support ticket. Waiting with fingers crossed.


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## jcrosby (Sep 14, 2021)

cuttime said:


> I just tried to upgrade Reaktor and got this revoltin' development:


Thats a real shame. Unfortunately this is the devil's bargain we're stuck with as mac users. Apple's obsession with annual updates forces many developers to abandon OS's much quicker than they did just 7-8 years ago... As far as Kontakt? Sadly probably not long


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## cuttime (Sep 14, 2021)

If Native Instruments' software was M1 compatible, I'd feel better about it.


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## Bman70 (Sep 14, 2021)

There's no reason to be on High Sierra anymore. Mojave supports everything HS does, and I loved it when I upgraded from HS to Mojave... it was the last stable, beautiful version of OS. 

Catalina is like a rocky beta version, but overall I've gotten used to it. I can still get my work done. From my research, I've heard Big Sur is more like Mojave. Apparently Catalina was the dark night of OS. I'm considering upgrading now that most developers have caught up.


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## kgdrum (Sep 14, 2021)

Bman70 said:


> There's no reason to be on High Sierra anymore. Mojave supports everything HS does, and I loved it when I upgraded from HS to Mojave... it was the last stable, beautiful version of OS.
> 
> Catalina is like a rocky beta version, but overall I've gotten used to it. I can still get my work done. From my research, I've heard Big Sur is more like Mojave. Apparently Catalina was the dark night of OS. I'm considering upgrading now that most developers have caught up.


Cuttime is using an iMac that doesn’t have a metal card so he can’t upgrade to Mojave.


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## cuttime (Sep 14, 2021)

Bman70 said:


> There's no reason to be on High Sierra anymore. Mojave supports everything HS does, and I loved it when I upgraded from HS to Mojave... it was the last stable, beautiful version of OS.
> 
> Catalina is like a rocky beta version, but overall I've gotten used to it. I can still get my work done. From my research, I've heard Big Sur is more like Mojave. Apparently Catalina was the dark night of OS. I'm considering upgrading now that most developers have caught up.


I have a BTO i7 iMac that has 32 gigs of RAM. It will not upgrade past HS, and serves my purposes well until possibly very soon?


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## Bman70 (Sep 14, 2021)

kgdrum said:


> Cuttime is using an iMac that doesn’t have a metal card so he can’t upgrade to Mojave.



Oh wow, must be pre 2012 then. Don't many VIs need Metal now? But upgrading hardware isn't fun. Except when I upgraded to a 2019 MB Pro 16", everything went pretty nice and it felt like no bump at all going from my 2013 iMac.


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## cuttime (Sep 14, 2021)

Bman70 said:


> Oh wow, must be pre 2012 then. Don't many VIs need Metal now? But upgrading hardware isn't fun. Except when I upgraded to a 2019 MB Pro 16", everything went pretty nice and it felt like no bump at all going from my 2013 iMac.


Not that I know of. The only Vis that require metal that I know of are from Waves, and I am not heavily invested in them.


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## dunamisstudio (Sep 14, 2021)

Welcome to the never ending Mac support loop.


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## kgdrum (Sep 14, 2021)

The barrier I see more often with my Mac is the lack of AVX support so I can’t use Massive X and Modo Drum on my MacPro.


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## cuttime (Sep 14, 2021)

kgdrum said:


> The barrier I see more often with my Mac is the lack of AVX support so I can’t use Massive X and Modo Drum on my MacPro.


Funny thing is, my Mac supports AVX.


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## kgdrum (Sep 14, 2021)

cuttime said:


> Funny thing is, my Mac supports AVX.


WTF! lol 😂


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## Pier (Sep 14, 2021)

jcrosby said:


> Thats a real shame. Unfortunately this is the devil's bargain we're stuck with as mac users. Apple's obsession with annual updates forces many developers to abandon OS's much quicker than they did just 7-8 years ago... As far as Kontakt? Sadly probably not long


Exactly.

Apple ¡s to blame here as they introduce numerous breaking changes on every OS update which forces devs and users to keep updating to the latest version, buying new devices, etc.

Kontakt on Windows still can be used in *Windows 7*.









Specifications







www.native-instruments.com





I definitely prefer the UI of macOS, but I'm glad I moved my DAW machine to Windows. I have full control of my hardware and can expect many years of backwards compatibility.


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## dunamisstudio (Sep 15, 2021)

Pier said:


> Exactly.
> 
> Apple ¡s to blame here as they introduce numerous breaking changes on every OS update which forces devs and users to keep updating to the latest version, buying new devices, etc.
> 
> ...


That's exactly why I moved to Windows. I like the OS but I had upgraded to the latest OS Apple would allow on my machine. (10.11 on 2008 Mac Pro) At some point I could live with using older versions at times but then newer software would release and wouldn't support what I had. Didn't like trash can or all in one iMac's and can't afford new Mac Pros. So i switched to Windows and built a fast machine at a lesser cost.


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## cuttime (Sep 15, 2021)

Well, NI answered my ticket and told me I'm SOL. They said that they are working on Catalina as the sole minimum requirement for Komplete. I guess I'll have to live with this until I muster enough cash for an M1 machine that doesn't exist yet to fill my needs.


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## José Herring (Sep 15, 2021)

I can't understand why they wouldn't just say it's "unsupported" but you can still try it? I've run into this problem on the PC side (the dark side) because I think I was the last person on the planet to upgrade from Windows 7 so I just ran for years programs that were unsupported on Windows 7 but worked fine. I mean seriously it's not like NI recoded all their software yesterday. So why not let users install at their own risk? Makes no sense.


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## Pier (Sep 15, 2021)

cuttime said:


> I guess I'll have to live with this until I muster enough cash for an M1 machine that doesn't exist yet to fill my needs.


Or sacrifice a goat and/or one of your kids to get a Mac Pro Intel tower.


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## cuttime (Sep 15, 2021)

José Herring said:


> I can't understand why they wouldn't just say it's "unsupported" but you can still try it? I've run into this problem on the PC side (the dark side) because I think I was the last person on the planet to upgrade from Windows 7 so I just ran for years programs that were unsupported on Windows 7 but worked fine. I mean seriously it's not like NI recoded all their software yesterday. So why not let users install at their own risk? Makes no sense.


When I run Native Access is when I get the error and it simply refuses to download. Are there separate installers available elsewhere?


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## José Herring (Sep 15, 2021)

cuttime said:


> When I run Native Access is when I get the error and it simply refuses to download. Are there separate installers available elsewhere?


I think they have you by the cojones with Native Access. If you miraculously find a way to install an old version it will just try and update automatically.


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## kgdrum (Sep 15, 2021)

NI tech support has been known to provide links for people who have problems with installing via Native Access. After the install you just need NA to authorize.
*Edit* @cuttime 
I just saw your earlier post that NI had a lame response,that’s unfortunate.
I’m also parked with my Mac I’m using Komplete12Uw/ Mojave on a 5,1.
So I guess I’m parked just where I am in the NI universe for the near future. 👍


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## pulsedownloader (Sep 15, 2021)

When signing software (making an installer file that is recognised by your system and which won't show up as a dangerous file) Apple can enforce certain limitations on the "signature" - one of which is that it can only be used with a specific OS (less support for them). So if you want to roll out a new version of your program and then sign it, it might no longer work with an older Apple OS at no fault of your own.

It's pretty frustrating for users and developers


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## MartinH. (Sep 15, 2021)

José Herring said:


> I've run into this problem on the PC side (the dark side) because I think I was the last person on the planet to upgrade from Windows 7



Nope, I'm still using Win7 as my primary OS. If necessary I can dual boot to Win10 for some things that just don't work on 7, but I still strongly prefer the look and feel of 7. I'll likely soon buy a new PC which will force me to fully switch to Win 10. Do you have any advice for making this transition less painful? Like a guide to follow for debloating the OS from crap that I don't need or a list of things that will be awkwardly different?


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## José Herring (Sep 15, 2021)

MartinH. said:


> Nope, I'm still using Win7 as my primary OS. If necessary I can dual boot to Win10 for some things that just don't work on 7, but I still strongly prefer the look and feel of 7. I'll likely soon buy a new PC which will force me to fully switch to Win 10. Do you have any advice for making this transition less painful? Like a guide to follow for debloating the OS from crap that I don't need or a list of things that will be awkwardly different?


Respect. Windows 7 still the best OS I've ever used. But, I had to switch because of Cubase. I'm sure Cubase 11 would still work on Windows 7 but didn't want to risk it. 

The update was painless. It updated in the background with no issue. I was still even using the computer as it was updating. It was amazing really. 

I then went to the Presonus website and optimized Win 10 for audio based on their specs. The only really things to watch out for is that I had to deactivate Cantina and also OneDrive. Eventually because OneDrive wants to sell your soul, I had to uninstall it complete. But for some reason. 

One annoying thing is that for some reason I'm locked out of downloading and saving files into my Program folder. Installing programs is no problem but if I want to save files to any folder in my program folder I can't. I have yet to figure out why and I've spent way too much time trying to figure it out. So I have to download onto my desktop first and then drag the file into the Program folder. PIA.


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## MartinH. (Sep 15, 2021)

José Herring said:


> The update was painless. It updated in the background with no issue. I was still even using the computer as it was updating. It was amazing really.



A friend updated an old pc recently too and was amazed how well that worked. I'll probably be keeping my old Win 7 PC as it is and the new one will come with a fresh Win 10 install. 




José Herring said:


> One annoying thing is that for some reason I'm locked out of downloading and saving files into my Program folder. Installing programs is no problem but if I want to save files to any folder in my program folder I can't. I have yet to figure out why and I've spent way too much time trying to figure it out. So I have to download onto my desktop first and then drag the file into the Program folder. PIA.


Could this be a file-permissions issue? 




José Herring said:


> The only really things to watch out for is that I had to deactivate Cantina and also OneDrive.


Do you mean Cortana and the voice recognition stuff? I believe all modern voice-recognition features work by recording audio all the time and sending parts of it that it thinks are relevant to some cloud-server to be stored and interpreted. I'm not comfortable with things like that. Is there a complete guide for turning all such things off?


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## José Herring (Sep 15, 2021)

MartinH. said:


> A friend updated an old pc recently too and was amazed how well that worked. I'll probably be keeping my old Win 7 PC as it is and the new one will come with a fresh Win 10 install.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes Cortana.

It is a file-permission issue on the Program folder but everthing I've tried can't undo it, I've changed all the permissions, ect. ect... Nothing working here. It's weird because I'm seriously the sole administrator on this computer.


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## Pier (Sep 15, 2021)

MartinH. said:


> Is there a complete guide for turning all such things off?


Yeah of course. I also hate those things and turn them off.


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## KEM (Sep 15, 2021)

Well that’s not good… I’m still on High Sierra and have had no plans at all to update…


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## gsilbers (Sep 15, 2021)

cuttime said:


> Well, NI answered my ticket and told me I'm SOL. They said that they are working on Catalina as the sole minimum requirement for Komplete. I guess I'll have to live with this until I muster enough cash for an M1 machine that doesn't exist yet to fill my needs.


that sucks. i have the virus TI which is not catalina compatible.

BEtween avx, metal and all those random tech that affects us absolutly fuckin zero imma gonna look closely to linux :/

I have the mac pro w sierra and bought an m1 laptop. so thats sierra, high sierra, mojave, catalina, big sur, big sur m1...
and there is nothing ... nothing but no fukin reason why i woudlnt be running all the same stuff im running in my old mac. Logic has zero reason not to work in high sierra. komplete and the fiasco launc of massive X and its "AVX requirement" nothing i tell ya! 
just tech companies being fucking greedy and polutting as much as they can sell us the envirmental propaganda w/o us not noticing.

ok... my Old man yelling at cloud rant is done.


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## cuttime (Sep 15, 2021)

gsilbers said:


> that sucks. i have the virus TI which is not catalina compatible.
> 
> BEtween avx, metal and all those random tech that affects us absolutly fuckin zero imma gonna look closely to linux :/
> 
> ...


Y'know, Massive with AVX runs just fine on my machine. Let's see how long that lasts.


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