# POLL: How many faders do you use on your midi controller? (edit with pictures on page 2)



## companyofquail (Jan 17, 2021)

I am just listing a few numbers. Pick the one that is best suited to your setup. Also please post any relevant info CC being used and/or about buttons or knobs.


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## Ray Toler (Jan 17, 2021)

My primary controller is a Kurzweil K2600XS. I have the 8 faders configured for lots of different things (Omnisphere, u-He synths, etc.) as well as custom configs for several libraries.

The bulk of my "daily drivers" are Spitfire libraries, and I control most of them with the following configuration:

Expression (Volume)
Dynamics (Timbre)
Vibrato
Variation
Tightness
Mix 1
Close Mics
Ambient Mics
For Kontakt-based libraries, I often substitute the Kontakt volume control for Tightness (which I've found I rarely use) if I'm not using a pre-balanced template.


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## companyofquail (Jan 17, 2021)

Ray Toler said:


> My primary controller is a Kurzweil K2600XS. I have the 8 faders configured for lots of different things (Omnisphere, u-He synths, etc.) as well as custom configs for several libraries.
> 
> The bulk of my "daily drivers" are Spitfire libraries, and I control most of them with the following configuration:
> 
> ...


Thank you for the additional info. I love reading stuff like this.


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## companyofquail (Jan 18, 2021)

hopefully a few more people will post their settings.


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## bill5 (Jan 18, 2021)

? Why are there only even numbers? And why is the question posed about sample libraries only?


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## AlexRuger (Jan 18, 2021)

FaderMaster Pro, set up like this:

-CC 1
-CC 11
-CC 7
-CC 2
-CC ? (set to "selected track's volume in the Cubase generic remote -- don't remember which CC)
-CC 81 (close mics)
-CC 82 (mid mics)
-CC 83 (far mics)

I could honestly maybe use 4 more, maybe even 8 if I'd like some Quick Controls available.


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## Gerhard Westphalen (Jan 18, 2021)

With my Faderport mod I was happy with just 1. 4 is probably the most you'd ever need if you have buttons to bank.


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## companyofquail (Jan 19, 2021)

bill5 said:


> ? Why are there only even numbers? And why is the question posed about sample libraries only?


thank you for the questions:

1) because i am only interested in making something with even numbers at the moment.

2) because i am not worrying about it working well with DAW since that would be out of scope for the project. typically i make things that i want because i cant find them for purchase. in my setup i use a dedicated control for daw control therefor i only want a small dedicated CC fader box for my VST control. 

i just like to see what other people are doing in order to take those things into consideration when putting my project together. and then if some other people want to buy it they can.

here is an example of something i made in the same way and then ended up making for other people quite a few times:


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## companyofquail (Jan 19, 2021)

Gerhard Westphalen said:


> With my Faderport mod I was happy with just 1. 4 is probably the most you'd ever need if you have buttons to bank.


thanks! this is kinda what i was thinking. still working out the details of the interface but its getting close. have a meeting with my software guy tonight.


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## companyofquail (Jan 19, 2021)

also, i guess i should post my setup 


2 banks on one 4 fader controller

expression
dynamics
vibrato
tightness
close
tree
ambient
reverb


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## Loïc D (Jan 19, 2021)

companyofquail said:


> thank you for the questions:
> 
> 1) because i am only interested in making something with even numbers at the moment.
> 
> ...



Wow, Eurorack in a waffer ! So cool.

Ok, my settings :
Fader 1 : #1 modulation
Fader 2 : #11 expression
Fader 3 : # 21 vibrato (Spitfire, Infinite series)
Fader 4 : #4 variation (Spitfire, OT)
Fader 5 : #16 [email protected], [email protected] 
Fader 6 : #17 [email protected], [email protected]
I'll set soon a Fader 7 for attack (Infinite series)

I don't use faders for mic positions because... I don't have enough RAM for mic mixing (sobs sobs).

My controller is mainly SL MixFace, which has presets.


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## Loïc D (Jan 19, 2021)

Besides, I'm surprised that you don't mention 9 faders as it is a fairly common setup (8 tracks + 1 master for DAW, but also the 9 regular drawbars on Hammond).


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## companyofquail (Jan 19, 2021)

Loïc D said:


> Besides, I'm surprised that you don't mention 9 faders as it is a fairly common setup (8 tracks + 1 master for DAW, but also the 9 regular drawbars on Hammond).


i am only asking about what people use for vsts. check the previous comments for a further explanation. but maybe i can make a 5 fader version that can be chained together. who knows. we shall see how many people give that as a useful setup for vst.

this idea started out as 2 faders with a joystick but the hardware will not cooperate(in size) for how i wanted to do it. so i decided to make a fader box and then make a joystick with x/y pad box as a second unit to be used separate or together.

definitely thank you for your questions and opinions though. that is exactly what the poll/thread is for.


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## mikrokosmiko (Jan 19, 2021)

Cc1, 7 and 11 for me. But also a bunch of knobs for other controls depending on the synths I add to the orchestral template.


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## Jack Weaver (Jan 19, 2021)

I was relieved to see that your video was from 2011. 

I'm really looking forward to an extremely economical footprint and profile. Your _wonderfully crafted_ lunchbox from 2011 would definitely be difficult to fit on a desktop these days and its verticality would inhibit the direct signal from audio speakers and view to extra video monitors. 

I find good use for all 8 faders of my current Korg nanoKontrol2. When I switch from Spitfire libraries to VSL Synchron libraries and soon to MSS, etc., there are tons for cc's I still have to switch manually - or use the little knobs above the faders to have control over everything. 

Certainly, the ability to change cc Presets quickly _manually_ would be an important feature that wouldn't affect form factor. So I'd find two banks of cc Presets acceptable. 

However, I'd like to see that joystick. I'd finally be able to quickly control Zebra the way it wants. 

Also, small manual knobs above the motorized faders would offer more cc control with little use of space on the face of the unit. 

I'm really looking forward to this product. Thanks for letting us have input on it. 

.


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## companyofquail (Jan 19, 2021)

Jack Weaver said:


> I was relieved to see that your video was from 2011.
> 
> I'm really looking forward to an extremely economical footprint and profile. Your _wonderfully crafted_ lunchbox from 2011 would definitely be difficult to fit on a desktop these days and its verticality would inhibit the direct signal from audio speakers and view to extra video monitors.
> 
> ...


thank you so much for the input. yes i agree that the lunchbox i designed for elektron boxes back in the day def could not work with this type of idea. this thing will be .75" thick or less. it will have dual led color buttons on it that will be assignable to do a few different things(CC or midi note, immediate bank select, as well as used for onboard editing). it will work straight out of the box to do most common things people will need with a lean towards spitfire libraries because thats what i use most. then after that there can be community feedback on features. ill most likely release the source code a year or so after it is produced, that way people can edit it to work the exact way they want or hire someone to do it for them. i want to do it in the way where its a product that fully works out of the box BUT can be coded to do exactly what the user wants if they have the skill set to do so or can hire someone.

just talked to my software guy tonight and we should be sending off for the prototype board next week. we are going to meet again on monday. i have also attached a photo of the joystick i want to use. they are about 35 bucks off the shelf from a company in japan called TBM.


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## Will Wilson (Jan 20, 2021)

Korg NanoKontrol2 setup mainly for use with Spitfire Libraries, rarely use the baked in Reverb but have it there so I can easily set to zero.

- Expression
- Dynamics
- Vibrato
- Reverb
- Close
- Tree
- Ambient
- Outriggers


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## companyofquail (Jan 20, 2021)

Will Wilson said:


> Korg NanoKontrol2 setup mainly for use with Spitfire Libraries, rarely use the baked in Reverb but have it there so I can easily set to zero.
> 
> - Expression
> - Dynamics
> ...


thats a pretty good setup. 2 things come to mind:

1) what reverb(s) do you use and how(channels or busses)?
2)you gave me an interesting idea to use a midi button for reverb at 2 different levels. was thinking starting out with OFF and 50%


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## Shredoverdrive (Jan 20, 2021)

companyofquail said:


> thank you so much for the input. yes i agree that the lunchbox i designed for elektron boxes back in the day def could not work with this type of idea. this thing will be .75" thick or less. it will have dual led color buttons on it that will be assignable to do a few different things(CC or midi note, immediate bank select, as well as used for onboard editing). it will work straight out of the box to do most common things people will need with a lean towards spitfire libraries because thats what i use most. then after that there can be community feedback on features. ill most likely release the source code a year or so after it is produced, that way people can edit it to work the exact way they want or hire someone to do it for them. i want to do it in the way where its a product that fully works out of the box BUT can be coded to do exactly what the user wants if they have the skill set to do so or can hire someone.
> 
> just talked to my software guy tonight and we should be sending off for the prototype board next week. we are going to meet again on monday. i have also attached a photo of the joystick i want to use. they are about 35 bucks off the shelf from a company in japan called TBM.


Nice! May I ask if you are going for a return to center behavior or a free joystick? Asking because I use a X/Y pad and the return to center behavior is a no-go for me.
Thanks!


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## companyofquail (Jan 20, 2021)

Shredoverdrive said:


> Nice! May I ask if you are going for a return to center behavior or a free joystick? Asking because I use a X/Y pad and the return to center behavior is a no-go for me.
> Thanks!


definitely NOT return to center. this is why the joystick has to be specific and is a little pricey. i even tried "modding" some expensive return to center thumbsticks by removing the springs and they just don't feel good enough. i am envisioning the other module to have both a joystick and x/y pad that has a few different behaviors. still trying to figure out the interface as i am not completely happy with it yet but will post info on it when i get to a point that i feel like it can be properly discussed. thank you very much for your input and question.


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## Shredoverdrive (Jan 20, 2021)

Sounds good! Thanks for the answer!


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## Denkii (Jan 20, 2021)

Expression
Dynamics
Vibrato
And a fourth one for anything else that I want to control that I rebind if necessary for the instrument I'm working on at the moment.


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## quickbrownf0x (Jan 20, 2021)

Nine here, I guess.


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## Will Wilson (Jan 21, 2021)

companyofquail said:


> thats a pretty good setup. 2 things come to mind:
> 
> 1) what reverb(s) do you use and how(channels or busses)?
> 2)you gave me an interesting idea to use a midi button for reverb at 2 different levels. was thinking starting out with OFF and 50%


1) I usually use ValhallaRoom with maybe some ChromaVerb or NI RC48 as a secondary reverb, always on Busses.
2) Hadn't thought of re-purposing a button for Reverb). I have configured all my S, M, R buttons to actually send notes which I can use for Keyswitches.

I then have all the transport controls setup as you would expect, I don't currently have anything setup for the pots across the top.


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## companyofquail (Jan 29, 2021)

9 illuminated buttons, 5 faders, 3 1/8" jacks(for hardware midi connectivity or chaining units together to get 10 faders, 15 faders etc or other units i make later), and 4 tiny lcd displays to give you feedback for editing the unit. there is not software from the computer. just a usb class compliant device that that also has a midi output so it can be used standalone or with a computer.

right now the 4 lower buttons are for selecting banks or if two buttons are long held it opens different edits for the buttons or faders. midi channel, midi cc, or note value(for buttons) so you could use them for CC or for keyswitching.

feel free to make any suggestions as its still in prototype phase and i need to design a solid aluminum enclosure.

the lcd screens are recessed so that they are only noticeable during editing.


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## Gerbil (Jan 29, 2021)

SL Mixface. Two banks of 16 faders, 16 knobs and 16 buttons, all mapped to everything from vibrato to fx and mics.


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## companyofquail (Jan 29, 2021)

Gerbil said:


> SL Mixface. Two banks of 16 faders, 16 knobs and 16 buttons, all mapped to everything from vibrato to fx and mics.


wow! that is a lot of control. may i ask what the large vsts you are using with this amount of controls? i really like the idea of something like this in the future but i am not sure how much i would actually use it. also i really wish that spitfire would standardize their microphone cc specs. for instance it would be nice if CTAO and mix 1 and mix 2 had a universal CC at the least. so basically just setting aside CC numbers for certain positions across the board. i know in a lot of libraries it is the same but in the larger libraries it is different and i would like them all to be standardized.


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## Gerbil (Jan 29, 2021)

companyofquail said:


> wow! that is a lot of control. may i ask what the large vsts you are using with this amount of controls? i really like the idea of something like this in the future but i am not sure how much i would actually use it. also i really wish that spitfire would standardize their microphone cc specs. for instance it would be nice if CTAO and mix 1 and mix 2 had a universal CC at the least. so basically just setting aside CC numbers for certain positions across the board. i know in a lot of libraries it is the same but in the larger libraries it is different and i would like them all to be standardized.


Spitfire, 8dio, Samplemodeling... just lots of different products. Eg for SStO I have the mics mapped to the first six knobs, pan and gain to the next two and the mutes to the buttons. Then the faders for everything from tightness to timestretch and the next bank to control fx inserts that I place in Kontakt for sound mangling. Because they're always the same it is very easy to get used to which control does what. I can't imagine not using it now


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## Robert Kooijman (Jan 30, 2021)

Still enjoying my self-build MIDI cc-controller.
Expression CC11, Dynamics CC1, Vibrato CC16, Attack/Tightness CC18, Decay/Release CC17, Portamento time CC5, Filter Q CC71, Filter cutoff CC74.

It's compact 195x105x15 mm with eight 60 mm faders.
Uses a tiny Teensy LC controller, which together with Arduino software is great for these things.


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## IgneousOne (Jan 30, 2021)

Maschine Jam with it's touchstrips. Dynamics, expression, vibrato volume etc.


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## Bear Market (Jan 30, 2021)

I'm using a Kenton ControlFreak with 16 faders. My template is built around Spitfire's SSO and my faders are setup as follows:

1. Vol (cc 7)
2. Exp (cc 11)
3. Mod (cc 1)
4. Vib (cc 21)
5. Attack (cc 15)
6. Release (cc 17)
7. Tightness (cc 18)
8. Speed (cc 16)
9. Stretch (cc 19)
10. Variation (cc 20)
11.
12. Spot (cc 26)
13. Close (cc 22)
14. Tree (cc 23)
15. Ambient (cc 24)
16. Outrigger (cc 25)

When I'm playing in lines I usually have my index finder on the modwheel, and my middle finger on expression. If I'm feeling adventurous and have one of those days when I overestimate my dexterity, I put my index finger on vib, with middle finger on mod and ring finger on exp.

I have setup another "multi-purpose" bank to control my other libraries.

I also have a JL Cooper FaderMaster, but found the 60mm faders on the ControlFreak to work better for me (since I can keep my wrist anchored while moving the faders).

Something I really appreciate with these old school fader controllers is the solid build quality and the display that shows cc values as I move the faders.


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## companyofquail (Jan 30, 2021)

Robert Kooijman said:


> Still enjoying my self-build MIDI cc-controller.
> Expression CC11, Dynamics CC1, Vibrato CC16, Attack/Tightness CC18, Decay/Release CC17, Portamento time CC5, Filter Q CC71, Filter cutoff CC74.
> 
> It's compact 195x105x15 mm with eight 60 mm faders.
> Uses a tiny Teensy LC controller, which together with Arduino software is great for these things.


i love stuff like this. great job!


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## companyofquail (Jan 30, 2021)

Bear Market said:


> I'm using a Kenton ControlFreak with 16 faders. My template is built around Spitfire's SSO and my faders are setup as follows:
> 
> 1. Vol (cc 7)
> 2. Exp (cc 11)
> ...


thats a nice setup. i am looking forward to buying SSO throughout this year.


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## companyofquail (Feb 4, 2021)

turned in the board to my machinist for feedback today and should have the case drawn up next week. then get it 3d printed soon after as well as order the prototype boards once the box is verified to work with the board or we make adjustments.


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## Jack Weaver (Feb 4, 2021)

With only one digit on the display, how will you know of the cc values above 9?

.


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## companyofquail (Feb 4, 2021)

the 4 digit display at the moment is only being used for setting up the unit. they just indicate what the values of the buttons and faders are when you are editing each one individually. it is not a reflection of anything else. so right now just for cc value, midi channel or midi note(for key switching with the buttons). the lcd will actually be recessed so that you dont notice them when you are using the unit unless you need to edit the control value. this allows the unit to not need software for programming.


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## companyofquail (Feb 4, 2021)

i also added a video of the 3d file to my instagram(in signature)


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## companyofquail (Feb 17, 2021)

sent off for the pcb prototype last week and started the design for the machined aluminum box earlier today. gonna 3d print it soon. i will be using shorter caps for the buttons on the production model. hopefully have some working videos in the next 3-4 weeks. all the lines in the render will not be there in production, it will be completely smooth.


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## IFM (Feb 17, 2021)

I actually only use three or and X/Y setup. The other half of the tablet are buttons for articulations.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Feb 19, 2021)

None. I just use the good ol’ mod wheel. Other than that, I’ll draw in data as needed.


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## chimuelo (Feb 22, 2021)

quickbrownf0x said:


> Nine here, I guess.


Same for me but it seems Drawbars for Hammond B3 aren’t as popular as they once were. I actually use 17 in total, with the 9 mentioned being buried on page 2. Then there’s 5 x 1/4 pedals, 4 x buttons for toggled FX, 5 more for Keyswitches, then 9 knobs as AUX FX manual over rides..


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## companyofquail (Mar 6, 2021)

got the first 3d print of the box. need to make some adjustements to the fader slots and the holes got printed a little too small for the screws to go in so we gotta look at that next week.


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## companyofquail (Mar 9, 2021)

picture of the 3d print on the s49 mk2 for reference of size. the feet are going to be positioned so that it can sit right beside the transport and hang off the keyboard. that way it will fit on more keyboard sizes.


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## Denkii (Mar 9, 2021)

companyofquail said:


> picture of the 3d print on the s49 mk2 for reference of size. the feet are going to be positioned so that it can sit right beside the transport and hang off the keyboard. that way it will fit on more keyboard sizes.


Now I want one. Where do I sign up?


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## companyofquail (Mar 9, 2021)

a visual for the placement of feet.


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## companyofquail (Mar 9, 2021)

Denkii said:


> Now I want one. Where do I sign up?


ill start a new thread once i get the product to a point that i am happy with. right now i am waiting on the prototype boards to come in. you can also follow the instagram page as i will be posting stuff there once the protoboards are built and troubleshooting begins.


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## PeterBaumann (Mar 9, 2021)

Using an M-Audio Oxygen 61 here and have just remapped a lot of the buttons and faders to work better with my new template.

Before now, I was using CC1 and CC11 pretty much exclusively, perhaps also pitch bend but rarely.

Now I've got
1. Modulation (fader)
2. Expression (fader)
3. Pitch Bend (wheel)
4. Volume (fader)
5. RR Reset (button)
6. VEPro Instance Enable (button)
7. VEPro Instance Disable (button)
8. Transport Controls all configured (buttons)
9. 4x Knobs for Send 1-4 levels
10. 1x Knob for Panning
11. Previous Track (button)
12. Next Track (button)

Think that's it!


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## companyofquail (Mar 29, 2021)

we have been able to move forward with the software and found chips to suit all my specifications. we are sending off for another prototype today or tomorrow. here is the 2 channel version. not much to look at yet. we will also be 3d printing a case for it in the next week or so. ill post that as soon as it comes off the printer. this little guy will be about 4.5"x2"


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## PaulieDC (Mar 29, 2021)

PeterBaumann said:


> Using an M-Audio Oxygen 61 here and have just remapped a lot of the buttons and faders to work better with my new template.
> 
> Before now, I was using CC1 and CC11 pretty much exclusively, perhaps also pitch bend but rarely.
> 
> ...


Nice list! I've been pondering what to set many of the available controls to, on my SL MixFace, and this gives me ideas. 👍🏼


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## PaulieDC (Mar 29, 2021)

companyofquail said:


> we have been able to move forward with the software and found chips to suit all my specifications. we are sending off for another prototype today or tomorrow. here is the 2 channel version. not much to look at yet. we will also be 3d printing a case for it in the next week or so. ill post that as soon as it comes off the printer. this little guy will be about 4.5"x2"


That's all I'm after, CC 11 and CC1. The MixFace can cover all the rest.


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## companyofquail (Mar 29, 2021)

PaulieDC said:


> That's all I'm after, CC 11 and CC1. The MixFace can cover all the rest.


after much use of my prototype and bouncing ideas around this was pretty much right for me as well. the little button at the top can swap between cc11/cc1 and cc21/cc19 or will allow you to reprogram the faders(with the aid of a midi monitor)


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## FrankieD (Mar 29, 2021)

I got two S1's especially to control Vienna CC's and and then one for each instrument section of my mock ups. So a total of 16 faders, motorized.


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## companyofquail (Mar 30, 2021)

FrankieD said:


> I got two S1's especially to control Vienna CC's and and then one for each instrument section of my mock ups. So a total of 16 faders, motorized.


Are you using the motorized faders for cc information(mod, dyn, or vibrato)? If so how are you liking them?


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## FrankieD (Mar 30, 2021)

Yes, I use the S1’s for CC data, that’s the main reason I purchased the S1’s. I had an Avid Pro Control for many years and loved it. Faced with having to draw in and manually edit large numbers of tracks with CC data as is necessary for orchestral mock ups, seeing how Avid stopped supporting the Pro Control about five years ago, it was a no brained to get the S1’s. They are basically a smaller and less functional Pro Control.


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## PeterBaumann (Mar 30, 2021)

PaulieDC said:


> Nice list! I've been pondering what to set many of the available controls to, on my SL MixFace, and this gives me ideas. 👍🏼


Added a couple more buttons this week - found out you can create custom midi functions in Logic so set 3 of the buttons to Velocity 1, 75 and 127 now too.


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## David Kudell (Mar 30, 2021)

A fader for click volume and one for the video guide track volume will change your life.


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## companyofquail (Mar 30, 2021)

David Kudell said:


> A fader for click volume and one for the video guide track volume will change your life.


That’s a solid idea! I’ll check this out.


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## companyofquail (Jul 16, 2021)

Just wanted to give everyone an update. I have been trying to source chips for 2 months and the last info I got from stm is 2 years. So unfortunately I am not sure how long it will be before the fader modules are available unless we can find a similar chip with the same size or smaller footprint.


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## artomatic (Jul 16, 2021)

3


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## IFM (Jul 17, 2021)

companyofquail said:


> Just wanted to give everyone an update. I have been trying to source chips for 2 months and the last info I got from stm is 2 years. So unfortunately I am not sure how long it will be before the fader modules are available unless we can find a similar chip with the same size or smaller footprint.


One chip plant fire and here we are.


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