# A piece on a DAW, then a Notation program



## ptram (May 24, 2020)

Hi,

While everybody is trying to make the best sounding piece, I'll expose myself to shaming by presenting versions of a piece sounding very bad. The goal is – showing how the same piece can be transformed when passed to a different tool.

A premise: all the tools involved in this test are capable of producing the highest quality. The results in this post depend exclusively by the way I used them. That is not at their best, but just the raw product of a file format conversion. This is to shown nothing else than which can be a 'starting point' from which one has to begin when switching from a DAW to a notation program.

This test was exclusively made for my own curiosity, while checking the available tools and trying to decide the best workflow. I decided to make it public, because it may include answers to questions I asked myself several times, and are asked often by many others.

First, a mockup from a famous piece made with Logic and the full VSL VI library. Played on the keyboard, and carefully edited.

Promenade for Logic and VSL VI Full

I exported the piece as a MIDI file, and loaded it into Dorico 3.5. All the symbols in the score were then copied in my Dorico file. The result is therefore an interpolation between my actual playing, and the dynamics I entered in the score as music symbols. The score is played back by VSL Synchronized SE Vol. 1/+, with expression maps I prepared. Please note this library is much more limited than the full one (but the expression map is also more manageable…).

Promenade for Dorico and VSL SY SE

Finally, I switched the playback template to NotePerformer 3. It's interesting to see how much more energetic its interpretation is. I've noticed, with other projects, that NP is very vigorous, as usually are the best performers.

Promenade for Dorico and NP

Lessons learned:

a) a mockup made with a DAW can sound more realistic;

b) even a notation program with advanced playback features, like Dorico, is still fighting against the limits of making notation and playback coexist;

c) NotePerformer is much easier to use than a traditional library – call it into action, and it will immediately work; it also includes a lot of techniques, that traditional libraries may not include, if not with expensive additions;

d) the small library of VSL can sound very good, if one looks behind the disaster I did with this test;

e) a mockup has to be made or refined in a notation program after having been converted; it can't sound immediately as good as in a DAW. Take in this example the entrance of the strings: a human player will play it soft; the machine will not understand that a 'mf' can also be delicate. Or staccatos: the machine may make them too short, ignoring the context.

Paolo


----------



## Bollen (May 28, 2020)

A very interesting experiment indeed! I have to say I drew the same conclusions as you... However, you forgot one alternative! That is to write the score in Dorico and then edit the performance within it. This mp3 I attach was completely done in Dorico (rather rushed), I wrote the score and edited the performance as I went along... I could've spent a lot longer on it getting it just right, but it was enough for what I needed it for at the time. Personally, for people like me that really work/think in notation, it's pretty good!


----------



## ptram (May 29, 2020)

Or, you can even record in realtime in Dorico, and then work on the balance between automatic dynamics and the manual data in the velocity lane.

In any case, the difference between a DAW and Dorico is that in Dorico you have an intelligent assistant - the converter of score symbols - with which you have to deal with.

As you show with your beautiful piece, this can lead to great results!

Paolo


----------



## ptram (Jul 28, 2020)

Bollen said:


> … write the score in Dorico and then edit the performance within it. This mp3 I attach was completely done in Dorico


Sorry if I forgot to ask it to you at the time, but which sound libraries did you use? They seem all very good!

Paolo


----------



## Bollen (Jul 28, 2020)

ptram said:


> Sorry if I forgot to ask it to you at the time, but which sound libraries did you use? They seem all very good!
> 
> Paolo


Ooph! It's hard to remember, but basically orchestral instruments are VSL, the choir is EW and there's also a few Kontakt synths and samples like wind and stuff. If you want specifics I can look it up, let me know.


----------



## ptram (Jul 28, 2020)

Bollen said:


> If you want specifics I can look it up, let me know.


It would be very interesting, but don't waste your time after my curiosity. I bet you would have done the same great job with any instrument!

Paolo


----------



## Bollen (Jul 29, 2020)

ptram said:


> It would be very interesting, but don't waste your time after my curiosity. I bet you would have done the same great job with any instrument!
> 
> Paolo


How could I not after such flattering words! Here it is:

(All VSL Instruments are VI, not synchron)

Piccolo flute *VSL*
Flute 1 *VSL*
Flute 2 *VSL*
Oboe 1*VSL*
Oboe 2 *VSL*
Clarinet in Eb *VSL*
Clarinet in Bb *VSL*
Bass Clarinet *VSL*
Bassoon *VSL*
Contrabassoon *VSL*
French Horn 1 *VSL*
French Horn 2 *SampleModelling*
French Horn 3 *SampleModelling*
French Horn 4 *SampleModelling*
Trumpet 1 *VSL*
Trumpet 2 *VSL (muted)*
Trumpet 3 *SampleModelling*
Trombone *VSL*
Bass Trombone *WARPIV*
Tuba *VSL*
Tympani *VSL*
Taiko 1 *VSL*
Bass Drum *VSL*
Concert Toms *VSL*
Taiko 2 *Kontakt Factory Library*
Cymbals *VSL*
China Gong *VSL*
Wind Machine *VSL*
Tam Tam *VSL*
Bowed Gongs *Custom Instrument (played through Kontakt)*
Tubular Bells *VSL*
Anvil *Cinesamples Metallurgy*
Harp *Chocolate Audio Glissando Harp V2*
Celesta *VSL*
Piano *Galaxy Vienna Grand + (VSL and Metallurgy for FX/Prepared piano)*
Earthquake *Cinesamples Metallurgy*
Random Mutation *Bolder Sounds BOB Granular instruments*
Washer Dryer *Bolder Sounds Washing Machine and Dryer Loops and Hits*
Synth 1 (wind howl) *Custom Instrument (played through Kontakt)*
Synth 2 (Dune) *Alchemy Camel Audio*
Sopranos *EW Symphonic Choirs*
Altos *EW Symphonic Choirs*
Tenors *EW Symphonic Choirs*
Baritones/basses *EW Symphonic Choirs*
Violins 1 *VSL + Dynamic Sound Sampling Orchestral String FX*
Violins 2 *8dio* *Agitato and Adagio* *+ Dynamic Sound Sampling Orchestral String FX*
Violas *VSL + Dynamic Sound Sampling Orchestral String FX*
Cellos *VSL + Dynamic Sound Sampling Orchestral String FX + 8dio CASE Strings*
Basses *VSL + Dynamic Sound Sampling Orchestral String FX + 8dio CASE Strings*


----------



## ptram (Jul 29, 2020)

Bollen said:


> Here it is:


A very carefully hand-picked instrumentarium!

As I see, creating a virtual orchestra that could reproduce as faithfully and effectively as possible such a complex piece was not easy. There are combinations of timbres and instrument's choice that deserve much attention. You created your own original mix of straight+extended techniques. And it was not in a DAW!

Paolo


----------



## Bollen (Jul 29, 2020)

ptram said:


> A very carefully hand-picked instrumentarium!
> 
> As I see, creating a virtual orchestra that could reproduce as faithfully and effectively as possible such a complex piece was not easy. There are combinations of timbres and instrument's choice that deserve much attention. You created your own original mix of straight+extended techniques. And it was not in a DAW!
> 
> Paolo


Yup! It's quite easy with Dorico's independent playback of voices. One of my favourite features, but they could've made it a bit easier to use....🙄


----------

