# My Furman AR-117 Voltage Regulator is finally dying



## DannyDep (Jan 15, 2015)

I can't complain because it has seen almost 20 years of use in my home recording studio.
So I am replacing it with a Furman F1000-UPS which will provide UPS as well as Voltage Regulation for my DAW and other big boys toys.

My question is, for anyone who has purchased any hardware lately, are you also purchasing the additional insurance being offered?

When the rep asked me if I wanted to purchase this additional insurance I said, not thanks, since the Furman lasted so long.
He replied, "that was then when people cared more than they do now.... everything is made in China today..."

Just curious if anyone who has purchased hardware lately was finding "quality" problems with their purchase and whether or not stuff was breaking down much sooner than they anticipated.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Jan 15, 2015)

First of all no. Extended warranties are never worth it. Only insure what you can't afford to replace.

But I also wonder whether your AR-117 can't be repaired.

On the other hand, I also wonder whether a UPS isn't a better thing to have anyway.


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## Dryden.Chambers (Jan 15, 2015)

really depends how your power is in your neck of the woods IMO. I found I did not need power regulation where I am now and am all Furman UPS now, but there are certainly areas of the world where it is a good thing to have. If you know a electrician if might be good to have him test your power, and if it's terrible you may even know this.


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## DannyDep (Jan 16, 2015)

Nick Batzdorf @ Thu Jan 15 said:


> First of all no. Extended warranties are never worth it. Only insure what you can't afford to replace.
> 
> But I also wonder whether your AR-117 can't be repaired.
> 
> On the other hand, I also wonder whether a UPS isn't a better thing to have anyway.


Yep, having the UPS was the reason I decided on not trying to repair the AR-117.
I hope that the new build quality is at least as good as that unit. :|


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## DannyDep (Jan 16, 2015)

Dryden.Chambers @ Thu Jan 15 said:


> really depends how your power is in your neck of the woods IMO. I found I did not need power regulation where I am now and am all Furman UPS now, but there are certainly areas of the world where it is a good thing to have. If you know a electrician if might be good to have him test your power, and if it's terrible you may even know this.


Exactly, I live in the Tampa, FL area and unbeknownst to me when I moved down here, we are the "Lightening Capital of the USA".

When the AR-117 was working properly, I had noticed the LEDs having a range from 117 to 123 on a regular basis. Occasionally the 126 LED would light as well.
I bought a Power Monitor and the voltage looks fine registering between 120 and 122.

What was happening with the AR-117 is that when I would first turn it on I could hear a popping sound (like popcorn popping) and then the Input LEDs would not remain at a constant voltage for too long.
But like I said, 19+ years of service was more than I ever expected especially since 10 of those years have been down here in the Tampa area.


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## DKeenum (Jul 29, 2016)

I searched "Replacement for Furman AR-117" and this thread popped up. Mine died, but I too can't complain. I bought it in the simmer of 1991. Talked to Furman and they said it is probably un-repairable. Now I am looking for a replacement.

Maybe need to go with the UPS, but the AR-117 served me so well for so long, I'm thinking about replacing it with something similar. My voltage seemed to always show a little low, but my equipment seemed to last forever. I, whether it deserved it or not, have always credited the AR-117 for that.

So... any suggestions?


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## synthpunk (Jul 29, 2016)

Try getting it repaired.



DKeenum said:


> I searched "Replacement for Furman AR-117" and this thread popped up. Mine died, but I too can't complain. I bought it in the simmer of 1991. Talked to Furman and they said it is probably un-repairable. Now I am looking for a replacement.
> 
> Maybe need to go with the UPS, but the AR-117 served me so well for so long, I'm thinking about replacing it with something similar. My voltage seemed to always show a little low, but my equipment seemed to last forever. I, whether it deserved it or not, have always credited the AR-117 for that.
> 
> So... any suggestions?


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## DKeenum (Jul 29, 2016)

aesthete said:


> Try getting it repaired.


Furman suggested it as a lost cause. Their story: If the board is the problem, there are no replacements available. But if it were some part besides the board, then the parts are "off the shelf." I'm open to try for a repair. But it is 25 years old.


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## synthpunk (Jul 29, 2016)

It's not a repair I would personally trust to local repair shop unless it's someone I really trusted. Might be worth a shot unless you want to spend another $400-600 on a new 8x. It could be something as simple as resistor, cap, or ratty power cable, or something larger like the transformer or the board like you said. You could also look for a another 117 used. There some on reverb.com and ebay for $200+ and I bet that is near what you would pay to send it back to Furman for repair with shipping, bench time, etc and no guaranty it's not DOA in the end.

Edit: 1800 reference removed.



DKeenum said:


> Furman suggested it as a lost cause. Their story: If the board is the problem, there are no replacements available. But if it were some part besides the board, then the parts are "off the shelf." I'm open to try for a repair. But it is 25 years old.


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## DKeenum (Jul 29, 2016)

I'm thinking replacement. I just bought a new Big A-- iMac, and in thinking back, I'm crediting my AR-117 to my equipment lasting a long time. I'm, going on a little faith here - I know so little about electricity. I do know that when we play out live, low voltage gets us. We've never thrown a circuit breaker, but the PA starts cutting out unless we use 12 gauge extension cables. We always ask for 2 outlets on separate breakers and then use 12 gauge cables if we need extension cords.

Since my first post I've been doing a search and the two replacements I've come up with are the M-8X AR and the P-1800 PF R. You mentioned both.

Edit: the P-1800 PF R is not a voltage regulator.


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## synthpunk (Jul 29, 2016)

Mac has its own built in protections and voltage regulation, but you can never be too safe. I use a older transformer for my studio gear like the Furman, and computer based specific one for my IT.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Jul 29, 2016)

That's actually a good point, aesthete.

I'm doing the same thing - I have a big 1:1 isolation transformer box for audio stuff and a UPS for my computers - but I was never really conscious of why that makes sense!


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## wst3 (Jul 31, 2016)

There are a wide variety of power problems, and a wide variety of solutions to those problems. 

I can't imagine a scenario where you do any harm - other than to your bank balance - but as with many things, simpler is still better.

Power Line Noise, and especially spikes - these can be handled a number of ways, but a well constructed 1:1 transformer is probably the most effective and efficient, and as a bonus you gain galvinic isolation from the rest of the power system.

Larger - equipment damaging - spikes and dips - avoid MOV based power strips, not only do they do very little to solve the problem, they can cause problems. There are series mode surge protectors available from SurgeX and Middle Atlantic (and others, I'm sure). They cost a little more, but they are well worth it.

High or Low voltage - this one really should be solved by your local utility. It is in the tariffs that they must regulate voltage to some spec, check it out. If that doesn't work out then you are kind of left with a choice between a UPS and an "auto-former" - a fancy transformer that can be used to regulate voltage. The downside for either one is that they can introduce noise into your audio, different types of noise, but they can both be quite noisy.

Power outages - this is where a UPS comes in handy. Look for one with "true sine wave" or some similarly worded output - you'll get very little line noise, and no high frequency hash that can be a noise source or worse.

Ideally, if you are in an area where power outages are common, your best bet is probably an appropriate UPS fed through an isolation transformer. But that's pretty pricey.

If power outages are not a common problem, and your line regulation is reasonable then I'd use an isolation transformer to feed surge supressors in front of all the audio gear, and a smaller UPS in front of the computer.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Jul 31, 2016)

I have a 1:1 transformer box made by a company called MidiMotor. They were in and out of business in no time flat in the early '90s.

Too bad, 'cause it's great.


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## chimuelo (Aug 2, 2016)

They were great rack units.
I started having glitchy read outs on stages with lots of lighting.
Went to SurgeX and have had great luck.
The high end Furmans are quality units but thier lower end stuff, even the PL Plus are not as good.
On more than one gig Ive talked to techs that claim they get too hot and need spacing.
WalWarts falling out, etc.
I rely on stable voltage more than UPS so for me the extra money for SurgeX is worth it.

Just dont make things like they use to.


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## DKeenum (Aug 5, 2016)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> I have a 1:1 transformer box made by a company called MidiMotor. They were in and out of business in no time flat in the early '90s.
> 
> Too bad, 'cause it's great.


So... what do you guys recommend? For the UPS, is something like this enough? http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/BackUp1000 My search for a 1:1 Transformer brought up something that looked like you'd need an electrician to install, so I'm thinking I'm missing something. 

The technical stuff has me confused. I started with the Furman M-8X AR, but I'm more that willing to modify that idea. I just want to protect this investment.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Aug 5, 2016)

Usually 1:1 transformers go by the breaker. They isolate your house from the grid. The box I have isn't made anymore, unfortunately.

The answer to your question depends on what equipment you have. And if you just want to protect it from voltage spikes, a surge protector is all you need.


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## DKeenum (Aug 6, 2016)

Thanks, Nick. That makes sense.


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## wst3 (Aug 6, 2016)

Nick is sort of right...

If all you need is surge protection then a surge protector will do the trick, but spend a little extra and get a series mode device.

However, almost everyone will benefit from an isolation transformer as well. Lower noise floor, less waste heat, additional protection from spikes... and they aren't horribly expensive. You only need to get one large enough to handle your studio, protecting your entire house might seem cool, but I don't even want to guess what that would cost<G>! Take a feed from your service entrance to the isolation transformer and then to a sub-panel. Ask the electrician to configure it as a separately derived panel and you'll be all set.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Aug 6, 2016)

Sort of right?! I'm always 100% right about everything. 

By the way, I meant to say that my isolation transformer isn't one that goes by the panel. It's a box that sits in my room.


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## DKeenum (Aug 6, 2016)

Thanks guys. I think I finally understand.


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## synthpunk (Aug 6, 2016)

Nick, does it sort of look like this one ?
*http://tinyurl.com/gwlc8ce*




Nick Batzdorf said:


> Sort of right?! I'm always 100% right about everything.
> 
> By the way, I meant to say that my isolation transformer isn't one that goes by the panel. It's a box that sits in my room.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Aug 6, 2016)

That looks like a good box, Synthpunk. It has two outlets that I assume divide its 250A (which is good) as needed, while mine has ten with different ratings, but I think it'll do what you need it to do. And the price is good.

This is moot, since the box isn't made anymore, but I found this online:

http://www.trademarkia.com/midi-motors-hum-buster-74576972.html


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## Nick Batzdorf (Aug 6, 2016)

One caveat: isolation transformers can vibrate and hum (acoustically) a little. Mine doesn't, but you may need to move it somewhere if it does.

This shouldn't be a big issue - as long as you have it under a desk or something it'll be fine - but don't be surprised.


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## DKeenum (Aug 9, 2016)

Update: Talked to a friend who has experience in building clean rooms for Intel. He liked the idea of the Transformer over the Furman Voltage Regulator. In fact, he really liked the Tripp Lite Transformer. So he told me to add up the wattage usage in the studio. Everything seems to be relatively small except for the amp (old Alesis RA-100). It uses 600 watts.

So now I'm looking at the Tripp Lite IS1000 Isolation Transformer.


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## synthpunk (Aug 9, 2016)

I would usually not recommend plugging any power amp into the transformer line. This can inhibit the needs of the amplifier circuit and cause issues.


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## DKeenum (Aug 9, 2016)

synthpunk said:


> I would usually not recommend plugging any power amp into the transformer line. This can inhibit the needs of the amplifier circuit and cause issues.


My friend told me to ask about this, and I forgot. DOH! Thanks for posting that. I guess that lowers my wattage needs to something closer to 500 watts. Should I avoid any other pieces of equipment with the transformer? Mic Pre? Hardware Compressor? Guitar perm/amp sim.? ADAT? (I don't ever use it)


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## synthpunk (Aug 9, 2016)

Everything else should be fine, just amps (& powered monitors) usually are the exception to the rule. As Nick mentioned you should look at something specific for your I.T. like a UPS (which usually have very good protection specifically for computer equipment). The APC units are very good. I have a older Belkin I run into a APC. This also give you (depending on battery size) offline power for your I.T. during power outage. US tour guys never have to buy any of this shit, we just recycle it from old tour rigs


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## DKeenum (Aug 9, 2016)

Again, Thanks. I have an APC UPS on the list as well.


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## wst3 (Aug 10, 2016)

curious why one would avoid plugging an amplifier or powered monitor into an isolation transformer... I've done it many times, never had any problems. In fact an isolation transformer can tame some of the noise we all expect (and love?) in guitar amplifiers.

Not to be confused with the (poorly named) balanced power transformers. That's another topic entirely, and hotly debated amongst those those in the know.

If a transformer is humming you need to teach it the words! No, come to think of it, if a transformer is humming you probably have a loose laminate or two, and you should probably have that corrected.


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## synthpunk (Aug 10, 2016)

Was not referring to guitar amps wst. Try plugging a Bryston 4B into a transformer and see what happens to the Bryston. 

A journeyman electrician/tour tech taught me never to limit a power amplifier in anyway.



wst3 said:


> curious why one would avoid plugging an amplifier or powered monitor into an isolation transformer... I've done it many times, never had any problems. In fact an isolation transformer can tame some of the noise we all expect (and love?) in guitar amplifiers.
> 
> Not to be confused with the (poorly named) balanced power transformers. That's another topic entirely, and hotly debated amongst those those in the know.
> 
> If a transformer is humming you need to teach it the words! No, come to think of it, if a transformer is humming you probably have a loose laminate or two, and you should probably have that corrected.


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## wst3 (Aug 10, 2016)

If one sizes the isolation transformer properly (and chooses a well designed model) it won't current limit the amplifiers - not even Brystons (dang I do wish I could afford one or two of those for my studio!) And the improvement in S/N ratio will probably be worth it (although the aforementioned Bryston power supply is extremely well filtered!)

I had the opportunity to repair a couple of those years ago - turns out one of the biggest pitfalls to repairing studio gear is using gear you can't possibly afford!!!


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## DKeenum (Aug 11, 2016)

For the UPS, do I also add up my wattage needs (Computer and HDs) and choose accordingly?


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## synthpunk (Aug 11, 2016)

I do not think you have to worry unless you have the John Powell machine 
room 



I would look at getting the largest battery size you can afford. Some people complain when they only get 5-10 minutes backup. There are some great deals on Ebay on older APC's. I would recommend a new battery unless one comes with it on any older unit.


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## DKeenum (Aug 11, 2016)

Thanks! No, no big machine room!


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