# Notation for two same pitch notes played simultaneously



## EvenFarther (Dec 21, 2019)

Hello, whenever notating two of the same note, let's say two F's with an octave apart, and we are adding a flat, natural, or sharp sign to it, do we add it to both? or just one of them? I've never been able to figure it out so I'm asking here.


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## tebling (Dec 21, 2019)

Two notes an octave apart aren't the same note, so they each get an accidental sign.


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## mikeh-375 (Dec 21, 2019)

As @tebling says. If one is spekt differently, it's always prudent to mark the others note's spelling in brackets as a reminder to avoid confusion or hesitation, especially -but not only - when the language is beyond common chords. If the octave notes come in different places within a bar, I also notate in reminders. Although this isn't necessary, I do it anyway because there's no harm in it. Whatever you do, common sense, clarity and a performers perspective should prevail in notation matters.


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## chillbot (Dec 21, 2019)

mikeh-375 said:


> As always, common sense, clarity


True this. Like if you're basically within a certain scale, adding extra not-technically-necessary accidentals can be confusing or cause hesitation as mikeh says. But if you're in a chromatic passage... some courtesy "reminder" accidentals don't hurt, sometimes in parenthesis... it helps if you play an instrument, notate it how you'd want to read it.


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## JohnG (Dec 22, 2019)

Your first answer is correct.

An addendum, however, if you're recording with live players:

In London and Los Angeles, if you're notating for film music, it's pretty typical to write without key signatures. It's not a hard and fast rule, but typical. It's also typical for the score to be a "concert" score, that is, all the notes are at concert pitch, even for French Horn or B-flat trumpet that are transposing instruments. The exception is instruments like piccolo or contrabass or contrabassoon etc., that sound an octave above or below where written; those instruments are notated on the score where written instead of strictly at concert pitch.

In two places I recorded this year (Bulgaria and Tokyo), they prefer "transposed" scores, so that transposing instruments (like B-flat clarinet) are shown in the score exactly the same as in the part (that is, transposed).

In Nashville those guys will read anything you throw at them (same in London and Los Angeles, really).


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## Living Fossil (Dec 22, 2019)

EvenFarther said:


> Hello, whenever notating two of the same note, let's say two F's with an octave apart, and we are adding a flat, natural, or sharp sign to it, do we add it to both? or just one of them? I've never been able to figure it out so I'm asking here.



The answer has been given (each note gets an accidental), but to make the confusion a bit bigger let me add that there was one publisher who used (or still uses) accidentals only in one octave which then meant (or means) it#s relevant for all octaves in that bar as long there is no other information.
Unfortunately, i don't remember the publisher's name - i only remember it was a European one and i came across this case in the early 90ies. 

EDIT: in the previous version i had written "editor" instead of "publisher"...


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## bryla (Dec 22, 2019)

JohnG said:


> In two places I recorded this year (Bulgaria and Tokyo), they prefer "concert" scores, so that transposing instruments (like B-flat clarinet) are shown in the score exactly the same as in the part (that is, transposed


That is called a transposed score. Writing the score with notes written as sounding notes is called a concert score.


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## JJP (Dec 22, 2019)

Good advice here. The rule to remember is that accidentals apply only to the exact pitch in the same octave. Pitches in other octaves need their own accidentals.

Not using key signatures is common in LA, but not preferred by players. If the music is clearly in a key USE KEY SIGNATURES. It gives the player the tonal center so they can more easily hear the music when they look at it. It also makes keys like D-flat easier to read.


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## JohnG (Dec 23, 2019)

bryla said:


> That is called a transposed score. Writing the score with notes written as sounding notes is called a concert score.



Yes -- somehow had a binary brain flux error (BBFE). Bryla is correct.


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