# Thoughts on New PC Build?



## S R Krishnan (Sep 27, 2018)

I would appreciate feedback on the build. 

i7-7800X
ROG STRIX X299-E GAMING 
G Skill RIPJAWS 3200 MHZ - 4X16 GB
Samsung 500GB 860 EVO M2
WD Black 4TB Performance Desktop Hard Drive 7200 RPM
ZOTAC GeForce GTX 1050 Ti OC Edition 
Corsair 750D
Corsair RM850i
Corsair H115i pro Liquid Cooler


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## Pictus (Sep 28, 2018)

S R Krishnan said:


> I would appreciate feedback on the build.
> ROG STRIX X299-E GAMING


If you ever want to use Thunderbolt, need a different Asus model compatible with Asus ThunderboltEX 3.
https://www.asus.com/Motherboard-Accessory/ThunderboltEX-3/specifications/





> ZOTAC GeForce GTX 1050 Ti OC Edition


For audio I prefer AMD GPUs like RX 550/560
DPC latency is better with AMD graphic cards


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## S R Krishnan (Sep 28, 2018)

Pictus said:


> If you ever want to use Thunderbolt, need a different Asus model compatible with Asus ThunderboltEX 3.
> https://www.asus.com/Motherboard-Accessory/ThunderboltEX-3/specifications/
> 
> 
> ...



Thank you so much. I will definitely take a look at them!


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## Damarus (Sep 28, 2018)

Any reason you wouldn't opt for an 8700k instead? Also, 9700k is just around the corner!


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## S R Krishnan (Sep 28, 2018)

Damarus said:


> Any reason you wouldn't opt for an 8700k instead? Also, 9700k is just around the corner!


This motherboard supports upto 128gigs of ram when intel x series processors are used.


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## shomynik (Sep 29, 2018)

Looks good... although for my recent 7820x build I opted for noctua tower cooler and define R6 case, both for silent performance. But, my temps (OCed to 4,7) are not the best, hovering around around 40c idle...these chips, though are powerfull, are running hot.

The only thing I would sudgest is, maybe go for AMD gpu as it is a known thing around VIC that nvidia drivers introduce latency, not much but it's there. Not a myth, I measured it myself using LatencyMon and replaced all the cards in my 3 machines.

Much of luck with your build,

Milos


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## S R Krishnan (Sep 29, 2018)

shomynik said:


> Looks good... although for my recent 7820x build I opted for noctua tower cooler and define R6 case, both for silent performance. But, my temps (OCed to 4,7) are not the best, hovering around around 40c idle...these chips, though are powerfull, are running hot.
> 
> The only thing I would sudgest is, maybe go for AMD gpu as it is a known thing around VIC that nvidia drivers introduce latency, not much but it's there. Not a myth, I measured it myself using LatencyMon and replaced all the cards in my 3 machines.
> 
> ...



I'm also opting for Noctua or NZXT now. I also have an AMD build in mind that I'm comparing with the current one.

Ryzen Threadripper 1920x
ASUS STRIX X399 E GAMING
G Skill FlareX 16 GB 3200 MHZ
Samsung 500GB 970 EVO
WD Black 4TB Performance Desktop Hard Drive 7200 RPM
ZOTAC GeForce GTX 1050 Ti OC Edition
Corsair 750D
NZXT Kraken RL-KRX62-02


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## Pictus (Sep 29, 2018)

For Kontakt the Intel build is better, look at this chart from
http://www.scanproaudio.info/2017/08/14/first-look-at-the-amd-threadripper-1920x-1950x/

Also no working Thunderbolt for Threadripper, but the GIGABYTE X399 AORUS XTREME
and X399 DESIGNARE EX have a Thunderbolt header and Level1Techs made the
Gigabyte Thunderbolt 3 PCIe card to work with a hack(not available) as you can see in
the last video here, the situation may change in 2019...


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## JohnG (Oct 2, 2018)

Hi @S R Krishnan 

Not sure if you're going to use the computer for gaming as well as computing, or what kind of music you write. The initial build you put down seems a bit more expensive in a few areas than you might need if you are "only" using it for music.

Maybe it would help if we knew a bit more about your objectives?

John


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## igwanna (Oct 2, 2018)

save money on the ram, other brand less Mhz absolutely no diference in the real world. Put that money into a better cpu


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## chimuelo (Oct 2, 2018)

Good luck saving on the RAM.
Gskill is a good product and price point.
Samsung would be cheaper but you dont get the blinking lights,


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## S R Krishnan (Oct 3, 2018)

JohnG said:


> Hi @S R Krishnan
> 
> Not sure if you're going to use the computer for gaming as well as computing, or what kind of music you write. The initial build you put down seems a bit more expensive in a few areas than you might need if you are "only" using it for music.
> 
> ...


Hi John. Thanks a lot. I'm building it for film scoring purposes . I'm not planning to use it for gaming


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## S R Krishnan (Oct 3, 2018)

Pictus said:


> For Kontakt the Intel build is better, look at this chart from
> http://www.scanproaudio.info/2017/08/14/first-look-at-the-amd-threadripper-1920x-1950x/
> 
> Also no working Thunderbolt for Threadripper, but the GIGABYTE X399 AORUS XTREME
> ...


I'll definitely check it out. I think I won't be needing thunderbolt at the moment. Yes I did check that before choosing Ryzen. Thanks!


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## S R Krishnan (Oct 3, 2018)

igwanna said:


> save money on the ram, other brand less Mhz absolutely no diference in the real world. Put that money into a better cpu


Absolutely. Thanks


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## chimuelo (Oct 3, 2018)

But the faster MHz on RAM really benefits AMD CPUs.
Not sure if that was early Ryzens, but it’s a new redesign of x86 that doesn’t adhere to all of the Intel protocols. Pretty Much started from the ground up instead of making Athlons faster and hotter.

Gaming geeks love the AMDs and fastest RAM you can afford.
Won’t know how audio works with overclcked RAM and CPU Cache until somebody actually tests their DAWs with overcloud caked RAM.

Would never waste money on an Intels RAM Design though.
Heat spreaders and blinking lights means extra money.
Samsung is basically the same RAM OEMs use.
But some heat spreaders for 10 bucks.
Lights are probably cheap too.


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## igwanna (Oct 3, 2018)

chimuelo said:


> But the faster MHz on RAM really benefits AMD CPUs.
> Not sure if that was early Ryzens, but it’s a new redesign of x86 that doesn’t adhere to all of the Intel protocols. Pretty Much started from the ground up instead of making Athlons faster and hotter.
> 
> Gaming geeks love the AMDs and fastest RAM you can afford.
> ...




the ROI of that is much smaller than the investment made on the CPU.

faster branded ram costas insanely more yet gives an increment of 1%
if you save that money and get a better cpu you can get up to 10% better speeds either faster core 8700K for example or a good multithreaded one like the 2700x from amd


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## Damarus (Oct 3, 2018)

igwanna said:


> the ROI of that is much smaller than the investment made on the CPU.
> 
> faster branded ram costs insanely more yet gives an increment of 1%
> if you save that money and get a better CPU you can get up to 10% better speeds either faster core 8700K for example or a good multithreaded one like the 2700x from amd



x2 - also waiting for the 9700/9900k specs


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## chimuelo (Oct 3, 2018)

igwanna said:


> the ROI of that is much smaller than the investment made on the CPU.
> 
> faster branded ram costas insanely more yet gives an increment of 1%
> if you save that money and get a better cpu you can get up to 10% better speeds either faster core 8700K for example or a good multithreaded one like the 2700x from amd



Agreed, but I’ve read how more than 1% is gained on AMD.

On Intel folks can go with the cheapest and do just fine. 
I use DDR4 on 1 of my rigs, 64Gbs. Samsung 2133 in 16GB DIMMs.
Works fine, and the fans blow air right down the spaces in between the DIMMs.

IIRC it was 360 for the entire kit. Right before the supply started decreasing from switching plants over to SSDs. Prices still suck last time I looked.


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## igwanna (Oct 3, 2018)

shouldnt the fans blow air out/upwards and not in/dopwnwards?


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## igwanna (Oct 3, 2018)

also whats the 250$ card for? you intend to run graphics?


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## Mornats (Oct 3, 2018)

S R Krishnan said:


> I'm not planning to use it for gaming



Ditch the Nvidia graphics card if you're not interested in gaming. They tend to add a chunk to your latency compared to AMD graphics cards. I'd guess you just want a card that will drive whatever monitors you're plugging it into.


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## igwanna (Oct 3, 2018)

use the one incorporated in motherboard if its an intel. save money on ram speed and brand and graphics card, get better cpu and 64gb ram at least


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## JohnG (Oct 3, 2018)

igwanna said:


> use the one incorporated in motherboard if its an intel.



This is good advice. Use onboard graphics port and skip the video card altogether.

Definitely DON'T get a Geforce / NVIDIA card for audio, since some of their drivers are a PITA on latency. They have improved their drivers, but some still cause problems.


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## Pictus (Oct 3, 2018)

Damarus said:


> x2 - also waiting for the 9700/9900k specs


https://wccftech.com/intel-core-i9-9900k-and-core-i7-9700k-cpu-price-leak/


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## Damarus (Oct 4, 2018)

Where is everyone seeing Nvidia graphics cards causing latency? I've only come across one thread with synthetic benchmarks on old hardware?


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## Mornats (Oct 4, 2018)

If it helps, I just ran Latency Monitor and got the result below. This is on the following system:

Asus Maximus Ranger VII motherboard
Intel i7 4790k overclocked to 4.5ghz
32GB Corsair Vengeance Pro RAM
Nvidia GTX 970 GPU


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## igwanna (Oct 4, 2018)

i dont get this latency thing. latency to which kind of output? image latency? sound latency? what?


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## Mornats (Oct 4, 2018)

Sound latency. The Nvidia drivers are reported to add to it quite a bit.


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## URL (Oct 4, 2018)

Mornats said:


> Sound latency. The Nvidia drivers are reported to add to it quite a bit.



How do they add, in what way do you notice, soundcard only is possible to use 256 insted of 64 in your soundcard latency settings?


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## Mornats (Oct 4, 2018)

Hard to say for sure as I've only ever had an Nvidia card in this PC (perils of being an amateur with a gaming/audio PC) so I don't have any before and after tests. I can usually get 128 buffer and record ok with that but can't do 64 even with only a couple of tracks.


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## shomynik (Oct 4, 2018)

Mornats said:


> If it helps, I just ran Latency Monitor and got the result below. This is on the following system:
> 
> Asus Maximus Ranger VII motherboard
> Intel i7 4790k overclocked to 4.5ghz
> ...


Mine, with gtx 750ti, was about 200 uS. Now, with amd card is about 20.


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## shomynik (Oct 4, 2018)

URL said:


> How do they add, in what way do you notice, soundcard only is possible to use 256 insted of 64 in your soundcard latency settings?


Now when I think about it, those are microseconds, right? I guess it can't be a noticable thing but only a compulsion of getting a lowest possible latency lead by this software (LatencyMon). But I don't doubt it's there. I guess these values, despite being higher than with AMD cards, are green for a reason.


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## Pictus (Oct 5, 2018)

About the latency/Nvidia

Guys the site http://www.resplendence.com/latencymon have information.
I also recommends to read the thread https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=503585&p=7067247
I posted some tips there that may help if you have problems.


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## URL (Oct 6, 2018)

What is latency in this case If it meens that I can go from 128 latency in my daw to 64,what does it in tracks to make the switch, I cant really see the problem, okey the drivers... When I install my Asus grafic card based on Nvidia I only install the grafic driver, not 3D, Audio etc. for the Card, If I game I game on a other partion with all the driver installed. It would be Interesting to see the benift of switching...then I need a other grafic card....


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## jmauz (Oct 6, 2018)

I use a Geforce card in my main machine and if there's any latency it's not noticeable and does not affect tracking or my use of MIDI controllers. I've done sessions with up to 20 tracks recording simultaneously as well as dozens of MIDI tracks playing orchestral samples. AND I was playing to a click so if there was significant latency I would've noticed.


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## JohnG (Oct 6, 2018)

Just because you see one guy's test and LatencyMon looks green doesn't mean "it's all ok." For one thing, they don't all turn out green -- mine certainly didn't -- and for another, why use a card that is going to be literally the worst generator of latency on your system?

Without a doubt, it's better to use the onboard graphics these days, or at least not Nvidia. The processing draw of onboard graphics, many years ago, was substantial, but today its negligible.


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## jononotbono (Oct 6, 2018)

JohnG said:


> Without a doubt, it's better to use the onboard graphics these days, or at least not Nvidia. The processing draw of onboard graphics, many years ago, was substantial, but today its negligible.



How does this fair for using 4k screens? 

I need to do some more reading.


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## jmauz (Oct 6, 2018)

Moreover how does it fair for us using *3* 4K screens?


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## jononotbono (Oct 6, 2018)

jmauz said:


> Moreover how does it fair for us using *3* 4K screens?



True. But don't forget the 1080p TV on the wall and the 1080p Touch Screen.


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## chimuelo (Oct 6, 2018)

igwanna said:


> shouldnt the fans blow air out/upwards and not in/dopwnwards?


So they say.
But I use triple barrel high rpm fans in 1U ATX Supermicro Chassis.
Intake fans in the front blow air over mobs through the DIMMs and out the back.
Loud as Hell too.


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## chimuelo (Oct 6, 2018)

Xeons now have on chip GFX, triple monitors too.
Pretty much a higher binned i7 from what I can tell.


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## URL (Oct 7, 2018)

Onboard drivers do not support Dp...or?


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## shomynik (Oct 7, 2018)

chimuelo said:


> So they say.
> But I use triple barrel high rpm fans in 1U ATX Supermicro Chassis.
> Intake fans in the front blow air over mobs through the DIMMs and out the back.
> Loud as Hell too.



chimuelo, we have a mole in your case! 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/feat...-america-s-top-companies?srnd=businessweek-v2


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## chimuelo (Oct 7, 2018)

That’s fascinating stuff isn’t it.
I’m waiting for my commission for promoting Chinese espionage in Europe and the USA.


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## shomynik (Oct 7, 2018)

chimuelo said:


> That’s fascinating stuff isn’t it.
> I’m waiting for my commission for promoting Chinese espionage in Europe and the USA.


Haha yes, you sure did sold it on me. I was very close to ending up with a xeon system for the last build, those mobos really look beautifully done and ready for audio.


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## Damarus (Oct 8, 2018)

Pictus said:


> About the latency/Nvidia
> 
> Guys the site http://www.resplendence.com/latencymon have information.
> I also recommends to read the thread https://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=503585&p=7067247
> I posted some tips there that may help if you have problems.



I didn't actually fully read this until now. This is a comparison of a 3-year-old Nvidia card, and who knows the rest of the setup. And the measurements are in Microseconds... 

even if it was off by 100 microseconds:





would .1 ms really make a difference?


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## Pictus (Oct 8, 2018)

Some people have problems with Nvidia, some not...
The ones with problems that changed to AMD have their problems fixed.
That is what matter.


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## Øivind (Oct 13, 2018)

I see the ASRock Z390 Extreme4 has onboard outputs for
1x HDMI 4k @30hz
1x Displayport 1.2 4k @60hz
and
1x D-Sub with 1920x1200 @60hz.

Probably good for TV, main screen and touchscreen @jononotbono 

Not the cheapest MB around, but certainly not the most expensive either.
Aaaand it has a front panel USB type-c header!


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## JohnG (Oct 13, 2018)

Pictus said:


> Some people have problems with Nvidia, some not...
> The ones with problems that changed to AMD have their problems fixed.
> That is what matter.



Are you recommending "change your CPU instead of the graphics card?"

A bit extreme if so.


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## Damarus (Oct 13, 2018)

JohnG said:


> Are you recommending "change your CPU instead of the graphics card?"
> 
> A bit extreme if so.



I think the AMD reference was to the graphics card.

AMD = Radeon


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## JohnG (Oct 13, 2018)

Damarus said:


> I think the AMD reference was to the graphics card.
> 
> AMD = Radeon



Thanks -- I thought I must have misunderstood!


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## Pictus (Oct 13, 2018)

Yes, AMD = Radeon


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