# Can a Mouse affect the play-hand? Trackpad or Mouse?



## Snoobydoobydoo (Jun 16, 2021)

I noticed that when i start my DAW,
i always click around first a lot:
listening to current Projects, tweaking stuff, and getting lost in everything before i lay hand on the keyboard and record something…therefore i use the mouse, 
like an hour or more.

Im on a Mac and use that Magic Mouse, which isnt the most ergonomic beast around. It doesn’t hurt my hand in any way, but i noticed that when fiddling around a certain time before touching the keys, that the hand (im a lefty) is stiffer than the right paw. No cramps anywhere.
Im way (!) slower with my left at the piano. Yea, lack of training also.

So im asking myself if it makes sense that when holding and pushing a mouse for a certain time, could lead to an uneven play.
I mean, isnt it a bad habit to use a hand for a very unnatural position while the other one is more relaxed?

My right hand rests mostly on the flat Mac keyboard and feels not as stiff when i switch to the Piano.

So, shouldnt i change my behavior when it comes to playing? Or would be a Trackpad to exchange the mouse be an idea?
I read some people are pretty happy with a trackpad in a DAW.

Or am i just overdramatizing the idea…


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## Markus Kohlprath (Jun 17, 2021)

I have a trackpad on the left side (lefty too). On the right side I have a mouse which is fixed on the table and I use it only for clicking. So I can hover over an item with the trackpad and click with my right little finger. Sometimes this is faster. Or more ergonomic if you wish. Especially if you have to click and drop which isn't so comfortable with the trackpad alone. My most used keycommands I all have on the number pad of the apple keyboard so I can use a keycommand and click with my little finger without having to move my right hand.
I even got a trackball on the left side of the trackpad. There you can click and fix the mouse pointer to a command which turns the trackpad in a very useful fader or x/y pad on the zebra2 perform page e.g. With this I can work without moving my hands a lot which as I find is a very comfortable and ergonomic workflow.


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## Snoobydoobydoo (Jun 17, 2021)

By “click and drop” do you mean Drag and Drop? Do you use the three finger dragging?


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## pmcrockett (Jun 17, 2021)

I was getting hand/wrist pain with a regular mouse, but I switched to a vertical mouse six or eight months ago and haven't looked back. Vertical mice keep your hand in a more neutral "handshake" position instead of flat on the desk, and it definitely helps with joint strain. As a lefty, though, you may have some trouble finding a vertical mouse, since most are designed for right-handed users.

I've considered trying a trackball, but I'm happy enough with the vertical mouse that it's not a pressing concern anymore.


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## turnerofwheels (Jun 17, 2021)

I started getting shooting wrist pains about 10 years ago. Now I clear a section of my desk or use a table for my mouse so I can wrest my elbows and move my wrist as little as possible. If I don't use proper posture, I pay for it immediately, if I do, I have no problems.


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## SlHarder (Jun 17, 2021)

pmcrockett said:


> I switched to a vertical mouse six or eight months ago and haven't looked back.


I switched to a vertical mouse and had an immediate improvement in hand and wrist pain, no pain even after long sessions of midi or photoshop. I also find that my mousing around seems more accurate and efficient. I'm righthanded. Unfortunately left handed vertical mice can be more expensive.


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## Saxer (Jun 17, 2021)

I built my own mouse pad that is fixed to the arm rest of my chair. So I can sit relaxed and upright while using the (bluetooth) mouse.


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## Markus Kohlprath (Jun 17, 2021)

Snoobydoobydoo said:


> By “click and drop” do you mean Drag and Drop? Do you use the three finger dragging?


Yes Drag and Drop of course- bad english. Sorry. 
Yes the three finger dragging I use also but only to move windows. Somehow I feel more comfortable with my method moving items around.


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## Fab (Jun 17, 2021)

Snoobydoobydoo said:


> I read some people are pretty happy with a trackpad in a DAW.



I used to use a macbook trackpad/magic trackpad only, then I used it only for my left hand and a normal mouse for my right when I had a 2 computer set up.

Now I use only a regular mouse (right handed) and only every now and again do I use the trackpad for DAW control. IMO it feels way slower with a trackpad. Considering that I have more experience with a trackpad over a mouse overall I'd say it's clear which is better.

The bad side of it is that it does make my hand ache noticeably more than with the trackpad, but I get things done quicker so it's worth it for me.

I don't know about how it would affect hand stiffness for playing the piano, as I'm a guitar player so my left and right hand are doing different things


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## jonnybutter (Jun 17, 2021)

I’m a piano player and I switch off between a trackpad a trackball - mostly trackball. I did get hand and wrist pain when I used to use a mouse. I don’t know if being a lefty makes any difference (I’m one too). Also, learn as many key commands as you can! There’s a key command for almost everything on a Mac ; )


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## Snoobydoobydoo (Jun 18, 2021)

Markus Kohlprath said:


> Yes Drag and Drop of course- bad english. Sorry.
> Yes the three finger dragging I use also but only to move windows. Somehow I feel more comfortable with my method moving items around.


I just received a trackpad 2 for testing. Hmm feels good, moving is as fast as with the mouse. But I wasn’t aware of, That the pad can be Pressed down everywhere and creates a click (sound and function can be disabled) but it’s a bit confusing that it can be pressed down with a bit of force. I thought that you can only press the left and right bottom corners down.

My main problem in Logic is zooming and scrolling withe the Magif Mouse
A lot of times when programming a synth, I accidentally scroll a bit with the Magic Mouse and some knobs or sliders Chance unnoticed…can be a Showstopper.


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## jonnybutter (Jun 18, 2021)

Snoobydoobydoo said:


> I just received a trackpad 2 for testing. Hmm feels good, moving is as fast as with the mouse. But I wasn’t aware of, That the pad can be Pressed down everywhere and creates a click (sound and function can be disabled) but it’s a bit confusing that it can be pressed down with a bit of force. I thought that you can only press the left and right bottom corners down.
> 
> My main problem in Logic is zooming and scrolling withe the Magif Mouse
> A lot of times when programming a synth, I accidentally scroll a bit with the Magic Mouse and some knobs or sliders Chance unnoticed…can be a Showstopper.


Use key commands. Let go of your pickle..I mean MOUSE


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## Markus Kohlprath (Jun 18, 2021)

Snoobydoobydoo said:


> I just received a trackpad 2 for testing. Hmm feels good, moving is as fast as with the mouse. But I wasn’t aware of, That the pad can be Pressed down everywhere and creates a click (sound and function can be disabled) but it’s a bit confusing that it can be pressed down with a bit of force. I thought that you can only press the left and right bottom corners down.
> 
> My main problem in Logic is zooming and scrolling withe the Magif Mouse
> A lot of times when programming a synth, I accidentally scroll a bit with the Magic Mouse and some knobs or sliders Chance unnoticed…can be a Showstopper.


Yes thats the main reason I don't use the magic mouse any more. And scrolling as well as zooming is what makes the trackpad for me the first choice and sets it apart from anything else. Forgot to mention that. Just swipe with two fingers and you go left and right , hold the cmd key and you zoom in and out. It's a breeze and much better and faster than any key command imo.


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## jonnybutter (Jun 18, 2021)

Markus Kohlprath said:


> Yes thats the main reason I don't use the magic mouse any more. And scrolling as well as zooming is what makes the trackpad for me the first choice and sets it apart from anything else. Forgot to mention that. Just swipe with two fingers and you go left and right , hold the alt key and you zoom in and out. It's a breeze and much better and faster than any key command imo.


Did you say ‘hold the alt key’? ; ). Everybody should do whatever works for them - there is no ‘best way’. The topic was ‘saving your wrists and fingers from pointing devices’ so for me that means a.) using a trackball or pad, and b.) touching the pointing device a minimum amount. For others it’s something else. Yes, the trackpad is good for scrolling and zooming.


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## Markus Kohlprath (Jun 18, 2021)

jonnybutter said:


> Did you say ‘hold the alt key’? ; ). Everybody should do whatever works for them - there is no ‘best way’. The topic was ‘saving your wrists and fingers from pointing devices’ so for me that means a.) using a trackball or pad, and b.) touching the pointing device a minimum amount. For others it’s something else. Yes, the trackpad is good for scrolling and zooming.


Cmd not alt key. Just noticed when sitting at the computer. Edited my post above.


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## Snoobydoobydoo (Jun 18, 2021)

jonnybutter said:


> Use key commands. Let go of your pickle..I mean MOUSE


I do, but not for scrolling or zooming.




Markus Kohlprath said:


> And scrolling as well as zooming is what makes the trackpad for me the first choice and sets it apart from anything else. Forgot to mention that. Just swipe with two fingers and you go left and right , hold the cmd key and you zoom in and out. It's a breeze and much better and faster than any key command imo.


 I have not come to that point of comfort yet, it still feels like a bigger trackpad of any Laptop, which i always find exhausting to work with for a longer time.

mhhmm i think i need to see someone in action /person working with it in Logic to see how they “really” get along with it.


What bothers me the most is that the pad can be pressed down like a mousebutton. If i turn off that this triggers a function, i still press it down randomly. That takes away some precision.

I noticed that i strongly tend to use my middle finger for a leftclick (i have that habit because of using right handed mouses forever w/o mirroring their buttons).


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## Markus Kohlprath (Jun 18, 2021)

Snoobydoobydoo said:


> I do, but not for scrolling or zooming.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


But for normal clicking you can just softly tip with the finger. Right click with two fingers. It's not necessary to press down the whole pad which I don't like either. Hope I understand right.


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## Snoobydoobydoo (Jun 18, 2021)

Markus Kohlprath said:


> But for normal clicking you can just softly tip with the finger. Right click with two fingers. It's not necessary to press down the whole pad which I don't like either. Hope I understand right.


Genau. Well, i just press the pad down accidentally sometimes, feels a bit limiting in the heat. Will test it for some days. But maybe if i would see someone use it in reality in Logic more efficiently than with a mouse, my doubts will fade and ill keep that thing.


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## jonnybutter (Jun 18, 2021)

Markus Kohlprath said:


> Cmd not alt key. Just noticed when sitting at the computer. Edited my post above.


Not trying to bust your chops. You said you don’t use key commands and then use the alt or cmd key! That is a key command. Whatever works!



> Use key commands. Let go of your pickle..I mean MOUSE


I do, but not for scrolling or zooming.


I sometimes zoom with the ring on the trackball (or option-drag down on curser in logic) but that’s if my hand is already on it. It very fast to use keys to zoom in and out. I also scroll with keys. Easier on the hands. There are also inexpensive controllers, like the Berhinger X touch. I hate mousing around, probably because I started on a Mac. Take care of your hands if you can! Cheers


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## Markus Kohlprath (Jun 18, 2021)

jonnybutter said:


> Not trying to bust your chops. You said you don’t use key commands and then use the alt or cmd key! That is a key command. Whatever works!


That's obviously a misunderstanding. I use a lot of key commands.


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## Snoobydoobydoo (Jun 21, 2021)

So, my personal conclusion is that the trackpad is not for me. Im much slower and unprecise with zooming, and the three finger drag has a delay on it when letting it go. Was worth a try but for the price…nääy.


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