# Vista VS Soaring Strings



## Soundbed (May 14, 2021)

For a few more hours, Vista is on sale for $249 — the same price as Soaring Strings without a sale.

I don’t own either, and I’d be interested in reading thoughts / pros & cons of each.

What do you like / dislike about each?

How do they compare / contrast?


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## Casiquire (May 14, 2021)

To my ears, Vista has a warmer vintage sound and SS is brighter, and they sing lines very differently from one another. I can't think of any other library that expresses the same way as SS. The difference between SS and the next closest library just feels wider to me than the difference between Vista and CSS, for example. I'm definitely keeping an eye on this thread though to see what users who own both have to say


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## artinro (May 14, 2021)

I have, use, and love both libraries. I will say, however, that Vista handles P and MP in a way I personally find preferable to SS. Both are excellent in the higher dynamics. Both libraries do a beautiful job making a crucial melody shine. Both libraries have what I consider to be a very important feature for legato strings: Same-note "rebow" legato. I agree with Casiquire that Vista is a bit warmer and SS a bit brighter, so I think context and preference might dictate when you'd consider using one over the other. Also worth noting that SS is a single curated mic position while Vista allows the user to mix decca and close mics. 

Both really superb libraries.


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## Batrawi (May 14, 2021)

just for reference this is SS vs Vista teaser theme
View attachment Vista Teaser Test.mp3



I don't have either, but from what I gathered is that both share a very similar basic feel & performance in terms of vibrato and energetic movement in the transitions. Vista can sound more expressive though thanks to the more dynamic layers and (occasional) portamento between wide legato intervals


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## Casiquire (May 14, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> just for reference this is SS vs Vista teaser theme
> View attachment Vista Teaser Test.mp3
> 
> 
> ...



Does Vista have more layers? I thought they were both 4


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## muziksculp (May 14, 2021)

I have Soaring Strings, but don't use it much. I need to give them some attention. 

Today is the last day to grab Vista at the discounted price, but I'm still most likely going to pass on Vista, not sure how wise of a decision this is, anyways I'm more interested in the upcoming Pacific, and Voyage libraries. 

Here is Cory's review of Soaring Strings. I think one can easily darken their sound if they are a bit on the bright side, it's always easier to darken compared to brighten strings timbre.


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## jazzman7 (May 14, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> just for reference this is SS vs Vista teaser theme
> View attachment Vista Teaser Test.mp3
> 
> 
> ...



Excellent! Did you do the SS version?


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## Sovereign (May 14, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> I have Soaring Strings, but don't use it much. I need to give them some attention.
> 
> Today is the last day to grab Vista at the discounted price, but I'm still most likely going to pass on Vista, not sure how wise of a decision this is, anyways I'm more interested in the upcoming Pacific, and Voyage libraries.
> 
> Here is Cory's review of Soaring Strings. I think one can easily darken their sound if they are a bit on the bright side, it's always easier to darken compared to brighten strings timbre.



I'd skip Vista if you're seriously planning on getting Pacific or voyage.


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## Batrawi (May 14, 2021)

Casiquire said:


> Does Vista have more layers? I thought they were both 4


You're correct. I just checked their websites. But Vista has ppp as the lowest dynamic while SS has pp. Both can go up to fff.


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## muziksculp (May 14, 2021)

Sovereign said:


> I'd skip Vista if you're seriously planning on getting Pacific or voyage.


Thanks. Appreciate you helpful advice. 

Yes, Finally decided. I'm skipping Vista, and looking forward to what Pacific, and Voyage will offer.


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## Casiquire (May 14, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> You're correct. I just checked their websites. But Vista has ppp as the lowest dynamic while SS has pp. Both can go up to fff.


Ah so Vista has better lower dynamics. Interesting.



Sovereign said:


> I'd skip Vista if you're seriously planning on getting Pacific or voyage.


The first rule of this forum: any time someone asks for advice, recommend a library that hasn't even come out, sight unseen lmao


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## Batrawi (May 14, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> Excellent! Did you do the SS version?


yep. have to admit it's not perfectly massaged as I was just trying to quickly put it together when I was at my friend's studio


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## muziksculp (May 14, 2021)

I noticed that Musical Sampling hasn't released any thing new as far as newer strings libraries, the Soaring Strings, and Adventure Strings were I think released back in 2016. 

I wonder why they have not done anything new for strings all these years ?


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## Sovereign (May 14, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> You're correct. I just checked their websites. But Vista has ppp as the lowest dynamic while SS has pp. Both can go up to fff.


The issue I have with Vista is the lowest dynamics appear indistinguishable from the louder ones, as if you're crossfading between one or two layers at best. I blame the insane amount of vibrato on those lower dynamics. Soaring strings lowest don't feel like pp either.



Casiquire said:


> The first rule of this forum: any time someone asks for advice, recommend a library that hasn't even come out, sight unseen lmao


Considering he's expressed interest in acquiring those upcoming libraries the recommendation makes more than sense.


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## Mike Fox (May 14, 2021)

The good news is that you can’t go wrong with either one! I love SS so much, and it’s perfect as a stand-alone or as a layering tool. It just sings.


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## jazzman7 (May 14, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> yep. have to admit it's not perfectly massaged as I was just trying to quickly put it together when I was at my friend's studio


It's great! You give lessons? haha. I would love to see the part breakdown. I just got Vista and Con Moto and the interplay between the sections to achieve this has been tough for me. Been writing a similar piece to demo these VI's out. I Gotta work on those harmonies!


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## Batrawi (May 14, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> It's great! You give lessons? haha. I would love to see the part breakdown.


thanks mate. If I ever found the midi file I will message it to you. in the meantime I recall @Sovereign (?) also recreated this piece with CSS (?) some time ago, so probably he can also share his rendition with you


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## jazzman7 (May 14, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> thanks mate. If I ever found the midi file I will message it to you. in the meantime I recall @Sovereign (?) also recreated this piece with CSS (?) some time ago, so probably he can also share his rendition with you


Thanks! I've changed the underlying Sections in the piece I've been playing with a dozen times. Things get SO much easier when I throw a bit of Chord padding underneath, but I won't learn anything that way!


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## ChrisSiuMusic (May 14, 2021)

Don't own SS myself, but I've been using Vista layered with CSS recently to add that extra creaminess and passion to the top lines. So beautiful!


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## muziksculp (May 14, 2021)

ChrisSiuMusic said:


> Don't own SS myself, but I've been using Vista layered with CSS recently to add that extra creaminess and passion to the top lines. So beautiful!


Thanks for the feedback. 

I have SS, and like it quite a bit, but need to use it more. 

I'm passing on Vista (I would rather save for Pacific or Voyage), maybe Pacific, and Voyage will be creamy enough, that they don't need to be layered with any other library.  I'm loving the demos of both Pacific, and Voyage. I think Pacific will be out end of next month ? it sounds wonderful.


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## ChrisSiuMusic (May 14, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Thanks for the feedback.
> 
> I have SS, and like it quite a bit, but need to use it more.
> 
> I'm passing on Vista (I would rather save for Pacific or Voyage), maybe Pacific, and Voyage will be creamy enough, that they don't need to be layered with any other library.  I'm loving the demos of both Pacific, and Voyage. I think Pacific will be out end of next month ? it sounds wonderful.


I really enjoy those demos as well. We'll have to see! I'm sure Jasper's as eager as anyone to get them out, and done right.


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## clonewar (May 14, 2021)

Sovereign said:


> Considering he's expressed interest in acquiring those upcoming libraries the recommendation makes more than sense.


Do we know for sure that Voyage strings is basically going to replace or be a superset of Vista? I’m close to pulling the trigger on Vista but am interested in the upcoming libraries too.


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## jazzman7 (May 14, 2021)

For the curious, Here are 2 versions of
View attachment Vista Alone.mp3

View attachment Vista Con Moto Phrase.mp3


a quick 4 bar phrase That I have had fits getting polished. (Aint happened yet).

Vista Legato
Vista Legato W a gentle layer of Con moto Sustains underneath

No Reverb or Processing for either of these


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## Toecutter (May 14, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> For the curious, Here are 2 versions of
> View attachment Vista Alone.mp3
> 
> View attachment Vista Con Moto Phrase.mp3
> ...


Sweet theme jman7! But ugh the bumps in almost every transition is what drives me nuts in Performance Sample legatos, it's like the players are having a severe case of hiccups and the sound bounces every other note. I heard it too in Pacific, not that extreme, but it's also there. Voyage seems more balanced and smoother judging from the rough demos.


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## jazzman7 (May 14, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> Sweet theme jman7! But ugh the bumps in almost every transition is what drives me nuts in Performance Sample legatos, it's like the players are having a severe case of hiccups and the sound bounces every other note. I heard it too in Pacific, not that extreme, but it's also there. Voyage seems more balanced and smoother judging from the rough demos.


Thanks! A noodle to get to know the VI's. Those transitions have been a sore spot, agreed. Trying to find ways to offset or cover them. To be fair, my experience with this Lib is fairly zilch, which means I'm not even close to doing it justice. My Harmonizing in parallel doesn't help! Time to see if I can improve things with countermelodies wherever possible. Jasper won't be looking over his shoulder at me composition-wise anytime soon!


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## jazzman7 (May 14, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> Thanks! A noodle to get to know the VI's. Those transitions have been a sore spot, agreed. Trying to find ways to offset or cover them. To be fair, my experience with this Lib is fairly zilch, which means I'm not even close to doing it justice. My Harmonizing in parallel doesn't help! Time to see if I can improve things with countermelodies wherever possible. Jasper won't be looking over his shoulder at me composition-wise anytime soon!


I simplified the Vla phrasing underneath the Opening Vln's to reduce simultaneous Transitions. Learning to write around my VI's seems to always be part of the game whether I like it or not. 

OLD
View attachment Vista Con Moto Phrase.mp3


NEW
View attachment Vista Phrase 2.mp3


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## Soundbed (May 14, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> just for reference this is SS vs Vista teaser theme
> View attachment Vista Teaser Test.mp3


Thanks! This helped a lot!


artinro said:


> I have, use, and love both libraries. I will say, however, that Vista handles P and MP in a way I personally find preferable to SS. Both are excellent in the higher dynamics. Both libraries do a beautiful job making a crucial melody shine. Both libraries have what I consider to be a very important feature for legato strings: Same-note "rebow" legato. I agree with Casiquire that Vista is a bit warmer and SS a bit brighter, so I think context and preference might dictate when you'd consider using one over the other. Also worth noting that SS is a single curated mic position while Vista allows the user to mix decca and close mics.
> 
> Both really superb libraries.


great thank you!


Batrawi said:


> I recall @Sovereign (?) also recreated this piece with CSS (?) some time ago, so probably he can also share his rendition with you


Could you post the Vista teaser theme using CSS if you have it, @Sovereign ?


ChrisSiuMusic said:


> I've been using Vista layered with CSS recently to add that extra creaminess and passion to the top lines. So beautiful!


Sounds like layering butter with whipped cream!


Mike Fox said:


> The good news is that you can’t go wrong with either one! I love SS so much, and it’s perfect as a stand-alone or as a layering tool. It just sings.


Great to hear.


clonewar said:


> Do we know for sure that Voyage strings is basically going to replace or be a superset of Vista? I’m close to pulling the trigger on Vista but am interested in the upcoming libraries too.


hard to know exactly but I imagine the many dynamic layers and section size differences will come into play in addition to more articulations


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## Soundbed (May 14, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> I have Soaring Strings, but don't use it much. I need to give them some attention.
> 
> Here is Cory's review of Soaring Strings. I think one can easily darken their sound if they are a bit on the bright side, it's always easier to darken compared to brighten strings timbre.



Cory always does such great videos. Thanks for finding this!


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## Soundbed (May 14, 2021)

Darn, looks like I missed the Soaring Strings flash sale in January. It was 60% off, more than the past two Black Friday sales.


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## Sovereign (May 15, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> Could you post the Vista teaser theme using CSS if you have it, @Sovereign ?


Ah, sure. Here it is.


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## Kony (May 15, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> But ugh the bumps in almost every transition is what drives me nuts in Performance Sample legatos, it's like the players are having a severe case of hiccups and the sound bounces every other note. I heard it too in Pacific, not that extreme, but it's also there.


You've made the same negative comments about particular PS libraries in numerous threads now - is there any reason why you keep repeating this?


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## Kurosawa (May 15, 2021)

Sovereign said:


> Ah, sure. Here it is.


I hear there's no need for getting Vista myself at the moment when I have CSS


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## ChrisSiuMusic (May 15, 2021)

Kurosawa said:


> I hear there's no need for getting Vista myself at the moment when I have CSS


Certainly not a necessity imo, rather an additional colour.


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## Soundbed (May 15, 2021)

Sovereign said:


> Ah, sure. Here it is.


Thank you! Ah yes there’s that CSS vibrato at the end.


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## ScarletJerry (May 15, 2021)

Soaring strings has a great sound, but it's very different from Vista. Vista has a sweet, romantic legato portamento in the high registers of the violin, and Soaring Strings does not. That's a pretty significant difference, and something that is uniquely Vista, which adds the icing on the cake when it's layered with other strings libraries.

Scarlet Jerry


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## novaburst (May 15, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> just for reference this is SS vs Vista teaser theme
> View attachment Vista Teaser Test.mp3
> 
> 
> ...



SS is more exposed hear, where as Vista is dampened behind a deeper bass or low end

But i love the graininess of SS but both have there merits


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## Jk86 (May 15, 2021)

I own both and since picking up Vista I haven't reached for any other string library for legato lines. For me its the room sound and how it blends with their other libraries and the type of music I do. 

Honestly though I don't think you can wrong with either


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## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

Kony said:


> You've made the same negative comments about particular PS libraries in numerous threads now - is there any reason why you keep repeating this?


I didn't think it was an unreasonable criticism. In fact, Jasper lists it as one of the libraries limitations:

"_There is some level of ambience-bleed / “bump” on the hard attacks if they’re played in standalone isolation or you’re using mostly decca. This simply comes with the territory of pulling samples from connected performances on the same pitch in an ambient room._"

I had to rewrite a phrase I put up on here because the harms underneath had too many simultaneous transitions which helped expose this issue. Plus, it forced me to write a better, more flowing set of harmony lines. I love my PF stuff but went into it with my eyes open. Toecutters' reaction to my post was actually on the mark.

CORRECTION UPDATE: The quote from the PS site is referring to the initial attacks, not the transitions
 Thanks for the heads up, artinro


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## artinro (May 15, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> In fact, Jasper lists it as one of the libraries limitations:
> 
> "_There is some level of ambience-bleed / “bump” on the hard attacks if they’re played in standalone isolation or you’re using mostly decca. This simply comes with the territory of pulling samples from connected performances on the same pitch in an ambient room._"


Hey Jazzman, nice piece you're working on! I believe that limitation by Jasper refers to the initial attack of a note, though, not the transitions.


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## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

artinro said:


> Hey Jazzman, nice piece you're working on! I believe that limitation by Jasper refers to the initial attack of a note, though, not the transitions.


Thanks! ...Dammit you be right! I should've read more carefully, but the "making my point" gravy train was rolling!


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## Casiquire (May 15, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> Thanks! ...Dammit you be right! I should've read more carefully, but the "making my point" gravy train was rolling!


I agree with the principle though. Totally true. And the bumps do bug me too


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## Kony (May 15, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> I didn't think it was an unreasonable criticism.


It wasn't about whether the criticism is valid or not, it's about the fact that Toecutter repeats this same point in various threads. That's bordering on trolling. So the question remains: what is the point of popping up in various PS threads to make exactly the same criticism? This question isn't directed at you btw.

I'll also repeat the same point I made in another PS thread (which you are already aware of), that these libraries are "not for purists" - with Jasper's updated branding on the Voyage page: "created and designed _*specifically *_not for purists" - and "hate noise? run". 

Jasper is probably the most open developer when it comes to any limitations of particular libraries, which you've acknowledged with that quote from his site. The negative responses to this imply that certain individuals know his libraries are not for purists, but they want to complain about any imperfections anyway. Does this seem reasonable?


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## Toecutter (May 15, 2021)

I don't know how to answer that or what do you expect me to say. It's a forum about VI, we chat, share examples, opinions and try to help each other to make good buying decisions and get the most out of our libraries. I've been helped so many times, avoided feeling buyer's remorse, changed my mind about stuff I thought I didn't want... just trying to return the favor? Sorry if some of my negative comments make you feel weird, it wasn't my intention (I feel silly explaining myself about fake instruments XD) but I can't pretend I don't hear red flags in certain libraries, PS or not. This stuff ain't cheap!


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## Kony (May 15, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> I don't know how to answer that or what do you expect me to say. It's a forum about VI, we chat, share examples, opinions and try to help each other to make good buying decisions and get the most out of our libraries. I've been helped so many times, avoided feeling buyer's remorse, changed my mind about stuff I thought I didn't want... just trying to return the favor? Sorry if some of my negative comments make you feel weird, it wasn't my intention (I feel silly explaining myself about fake instruments XD) but I can't pretend I don't hear red flags in certain libraries, PS or not. This stuff ain't cheap!


So if I understand this correctly, your criticism of PS products is legitimate and helpful, whereas this is your response to anyone disagreeing with you about PS:



Toecutter said:


> Most vocal supporters are PS testers and it becomes difficult to get unbiased opinions



Have you got any examples of any posts you've made where you've "helped" other members here by pointing out imperfections in products by Spitfire, CS, and other developers etc - using the same patronising, negative tone which you've adopted when addressing PS products? 



Toecutter said:


> Sorry if some of my negative comments make you feel weird


What makes you think anyone is feeling weird?



Toecutter said:


> I feel silly explaining myself about fake instruments


And I feel silly explaining to you, once again, that PS libraries are not for purists, and that Jasper is probably the most open and transparent developer when it comes to limitations and imperfections.



Toecutter said:


> help each other to make good buying decisions and get the most out of our libraries. I've been helped so many times, avoided feeling buyer's remorse, changed my mind about stuff I thought I didn't want... just trying to return the favor?


And yet there are many members who have no buyer's remorse when it comes to purchasing PS products - but you label them PS testers. And since Jasper advertises imperfections and limitations in his products, how are you "helping" by turning Jasper's transparency into a negative?


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## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

Kony said:


> It wasn't about whether the criticism is valid or not,


Agreed




Kony said:


> it's about the fact that Toecutter repeats this same point in various threads. That's bordering on trolling. So the question remains: what is the point of popping up in various PS threads to make exactly the same criticism?


I can't make a specific comment or judgment on that since I have not seen all of his comments on the subject, but You both seem like pretty reasonable and generous people. There is probably room for good discourse 




Kony said:


> This question isn't directed at you btw.


Yep. Knew it from the start. : )





Kony said:


> I'll also repeat the same point I made in another PS thread (which you are already aware of), that these libraries are "not for purists" - with Jasper's updated branding on the Voyage page: "created and designed _*specifically *_not for purists" - and "hate noise? run".
> 
> 
> Jasper is probably the most open developer when it comes to any limitations of particular libraries, which you've acknowledged with that quote from his site. The negative responses to this imply that certain individuals know his libraries are not for purists, but they want to complain about any imperfections anyway. Does this seem reasonable?


Jasper is a boutique Dev with Boutique pricing. The bargain hunter side of me is not happy with the Budding Artiste in me that coughed up the $$ 

I will say that the times I thought some of my VI's were totally useless, I found myself eating those words after long use and insight. A violin can sound horrible until you really learn to play it. The Legato transitions may be a shade bumpy on Vista, but if I really learn how to handle the instrument, it could wind up being a feature rather than a bug


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## Batrawi (May 15, 2021)

a fact is a fact.. whether disclosed by the developer or whether discovered by consumers.. so I hosestly see no harm if anyone (or the same person) keeps re-stating them whenever they are valid to answer the OP's question (who might not yet be aware of the fact)... simple


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## Jett Hitt (May 15, 2021)

I recently bought Vista. I wish I hadn’t. Now I’m gonna wind up buying Pacific. Damn boutique developers.


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## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

Jett Hitt said:


> I recently bought Vista. I wish I hadn’t. Now I’m gonna wind up buying Pacific. Damn boutique developers.


Ha! Yes, I bought Con Moto then asked Jasper about a loyalty discount on Vista. He said that was only for the initial offer some time back. I was disappointed, then the next thing you know he does a flash sale on Vista. Now I'm in the deep end of the Boutique pool and I'd better start learning to swim! Thanks, Jasper!


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## Oakran (May 15, 2021)

I'm too weak I just bought it... you never have enough strings libraries right ^^
The sound is superb and combined with the Con Moto strings it's just insane...
Vista is also quite useful for fast passages and even maybe runs. I've to try out; in any case it's a cool purchase !

Here's a quick test showcasing CM and Vista together (Cellos only):


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## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

Oakran said:


> I'm too weak I just bought it... you never have enough strings libraries right ^^
> The sound is superb and combined with the Con Moto strings it's just insane...
> Vista is also quite useful for fast passages and even maybe runs. I've to try out; in any case it's a cool purchase !
> 
> Here's a quick test showcasing CM and Vista together (Cellos only):


O yes...they are a pretty pair


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## Jett Hitt (May 15, 2021)

I’ve been using Vista to layer BSS, which I bought because I loved the cellos. But those cellos sound even better with a bit of Vista sprinkled on top. I like it.


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## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

BSS Pro?


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## Jett Hitt (May 15, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> BSS Pro?


Berlin Symphonic Strings from OT.


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## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

Jett Hitt said:


> Berlin Symphonic Strings from OT.


Isn't there a Pro version? I heard people say it makes a huge diff which one


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## muziksculp (May 15, 2021)

I came across this review of Musical Sampling that was posted on YT today. Showing both Soaring Strings, and Adventure Strings. I thought it might be helpful to post it on this thread.


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## Jett Hitt (May 15, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> Isn't there a Pro version? I heard Diff people say it makes a huge diff which one


Na, as far as I know, only Spitfire does that.


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## Toecutter (May 15, 2021)

Sorry OP I don't want to derail the discussion but I need to clarify something here. @Kony I'm going to ignore the insults because I don't think you are thinking straight right now but please don't misquote me. The full quote about PS testers isn't my response to "anyone disagreeing with me about PS". I've never done that! Here's the complete post and link for context:

"I agree with most of your sentiments here but the support part is not accurate. He provides support if you have legitimate issues, he helped me before. Everything else, especially how PS is perceived in this forum, 100% agree. *Most vocal supporters are PS testers and it becomes difficult to get unbiased opinions during pre-release*. I loved that Jasper offered a limited range violin from Vista, you can't be more transparent than that. I tested it, didn't like what I heard and move on with my life. I hope we get demo patches for Pacific too!"





__





Looking for reassurance about an odd feeling Performance Samples give me regarding their customer support policy


I must be brutally honest: a lot of these comments are acting as if he's this misunderstood genius who is above anyone asking him any questions he deems to be stupid lol No matter how you want to spin it, he's running a public business and there is a pretty simple duty of care and way to...




vi-control.net





What an insufferable asshole I am, right?

So I looked and there were 5 threads about Performance Samples in the last months (news, sales and discontinuation)






Performance Samples - Pacific - Symphonic Strings


I know it's been discussed a little in the Voyage thread, but I decided it might be worth making its own thread: Based on this play-list of samples written in super-early pre-alpha, ESPECIALLY the legato: This is sounding to be SUPER promising, after so many disappointing symphonic-sized...




vi-control.net








__





Performance Samples discontinuation sale (Con Moto, Caspian, Fluid Shorts I) - ends April 30th


Just saw this, I don't know why these libraries are being discontinued - they're niche little gems! https://performancesamples.com/




vi-control.net






https://vi-control.net/community/threads/performance-samples-spring-flash-sale.109350/






__





Vista VS Soaring Strings


For a few more hours, Vista is on sale for $249 — the same price as Soaring Strings without a sale. I don’t own either, and I’d be interested in reading thoughts / pros & cons of each. What do you like / dislike about each? How do they compare / contrast?




vi-control.net








__





Looking for reassurance about an odd feeling Performance Samples give me regarding their customer support policy


Hello, Performance Samples' work sounds certainly very interesting, with early examples for Voyage sounding impressive to say the least. However, what gives me an odd feeling is that in their FAQs, their first FAQ is: Do you offer customer support? As per the EULA, Performance Samples is not...




vi-control.net





I have about 20 posts total in these 5 threads, something like 4 posts per thread? They range from criticism to requests, praise, and a few posts defending myself like I'm doing right now. 20 posts in 5 topics I care about, crazy I know. I have nothing to hide, everyone is welcome to read my posts and contribution to the forum, what I like and what I don't like.


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## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

Jett Hitt said:


> Na, as far as I know, only Spitfire does that.


Ha, I was doing some Spitfire thinking there... Actually, the reference I saw was to Synchron Strings, Not BSS. My bad


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## Jett Hitt (May 15, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> Ha, I was doing some Spitfire thinking there... Actually, the reference I saw was to Synchron Strings, Not BSS. My bad


Oh yeah VSL does that too.


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## toddkreuz (May 15, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> just for reference this is SS vs Vista teaser theme
> View attachment Vista Teaser Test.mp3
> 
> 
> ...



Nice work man! Sounds super!


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## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

toddkreuz said:


> Nice work man! Sounds super!


SS?


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## Kony (May 15, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> Sorry OP I don't want to derail the discussion but I need to clarify something here. @Kony I'm going to ignore the insults because I don't think you are thinking straight right now but please don't misquote me. The full quote about PS testers isn't my response to "anyone disagreeing with me about PS". I've never done that! Here's the complete post and link for context:


Not sure if you are being deliberately disingenious or whether you're genuinely unaware of what you post. As for your claim that the post was taken out of context (it wasn't since you're making shill accusations), here's another post which resembles the previous point you made about PS supporters being testers:



Toecutter said:


> Not to my surprise, it was the same guy who wrote a demo for Performance Samples before and did the exact same thing on the Vista thread. Shills man, shills everywhere


As for 



Toecutter said:


> I'm going to ignore the insults because I don't think you are thinking straight right now but please don't misquote me


So you're going to ignore perceived insults by insulting me? And you weren't misquoted - the quote was taken directly from your response to a positive comment about PS libraries.



Toecutter said:


> I have about 20 posts total in these 5 threads


You actually have 14 posts in the Pacific thread alone including references to King Kong legato bumps for example (which many people disagreed with you about).



Toecutter said:


> there's a difference between having a nice natural flow and having *friggin king kong sized bumps in every other phrase*





Toecutter said:


> Grab a headphone and listen, it's exactly that. King Kong sized bumps. Semantics. I find it hard to not notice. I know you are Jasper's right hand man and is too emotionality invested but please don't let that cloud your judgment


But if anyone should disagree?



Toecutter said:


> I know you are Jasper's right hand man and is too emotionality invested but please don't let that cloud your judgment



In terms of exposed use of the libraries.



Toecutter said:


> I do very exposed work and these noises and bumps wouldn't cut it.


Again, for the umpteenth time, suggest you re-read the "specifically not for purists" branding on Jasper's website. 



Toecutter said:


> I have about 20 posts total in these 5 threads, something like 4 posts per thread?


And in each thread you've posted derogatory and patronising comments about PS. Can you share any examples where you've adopted the same negative, patronising approach to other developers - in equal measure (not just a one-off statement)?


----------



## Toecutter (May 15, 2021)

Kony said:


> And you weren't misquoted - the quote was taken directly from your response to a positive comment about PS libraries.


Not true: https://vi-control.net/community/th...mer-support-policy.108951/page-2#post-4816299

Click the link, read my response that you misquoted, and the comment I was responding to. I was actually defending Performance Samples' support. I can't take you seriously if you keep distorting things like that.



Kony said:


> Not sure if you are being deliberately disingenious or whether you're genuinely unaware of what you post. As for your claim that the post was taken out of context (it wasn't since you're making shill accusations), here's another post which resembles the previous point you made about PS supporters being testers:


Because they are testers! The post you quoted (again without any context) is from a response to DarkestShadow giving a very harsh response to someone who had something negative to say about Pacific. Here's the complete quote:

*"That's CLEARLY an opinion ffs... didn't deserve the petty slap in the face. Not to my surprise, it was the same guy who wrote a demo for Performance Samples before and did the exact same thing on the Vista thread. Shills man, shills everywhere :thumbs-down:"*

Here's the link in case you need a reminder: https://vi-control.net/community/th...-symphonic-strings.108748/page-3#post-4814122

I don't understand why you keep selecting parts of my posts and misquoting me to create this false narrative that I'm after Performance Samples just because I don't like the bumps in the legatos. My opinion! And btw, I was wrong about the King Kong remark... it's more like Godzilla-sized bumps







Complete quote in context:
https://www.vi-control.net/communit...pacific-symphonic-strings.108748/post-4815765



Kony said:


> And in each thread you've posted derogatory and patronising comments about PS. Can you share any examples where you've adopted the same negative, patronising approach to other developers - in equal measure (not just a one-off statement)?


No I can't because that's *your *opinion. For every negative comment I made about Vista or Pacific, I can find a positive comment about Performance Samples. But I won't bother trying to convince you because you clearly have some personal shit against me and I don't like abusive people that act the way you are acting now. You have the right to think whatever you want, but please stop misquoting me, that's not cool! I don't understand what you are trying to suggest with these random accusations but there's nothing nefarious about my criticism regarding Vista and Pacific. Even Jasper knows that, like *literally* knows that. Some here keep spamming the guy with random drama but you are only wasting his time


----------



## toddkreuz (May 15, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> SS?


Referring to your skills.


----------



## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

toddkreuz said:


> Referring to your skills.


Sounding Super. I'll cop to that haha


----------



## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> Not true: https://vi-control.net/community/th...mer-support-policy.108951/page-2#post-4816299
> 
> Click the link, read my response that you misquoted, and the comment I was responding to. I was actually defending Performance Samples' support. I can't take you seriously if you keep distorting things like that.
> 
> ...


On the bumps, I notice if I follow the rule that sez "Lay off the Mod wheel!" Those bumps drop to mortal size. I pulled back the controller data a bit and it made a huge difference. Judicious use of the Mod can give quite a bit of control with only a small sacrifice in vol which can be made up in a number of different ways. So many Vi's, so many different workflows


----------



## Denkii (May 15, 2021)

Some nice demos in here.
I could do without the keyboard warrior filler episodes.


----------



## Kony (May 15, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> misquoting me


How so? I've given more than one example where you've made a personalised criticism on more than one person making positive comments about PS. How is that being misquoted? 

And you keep ignoring the pertinent point that these libraries are not for purists - is there any reason why you're ignoring this? The fact that you're criticising PS libraries or the developer for providing imperfect samples (which every dev does btw), when the developer is advertising the fact that the samples are imperfect, is a bit like going to an Indian restaurant and complaining that the food is spicy and you prefer roast lamb with two veg. 

If you really wanted to offer constructive comments to potential buyers - to help avoid buyer's remorse as you say - you might also say that Jasper is a very generous developer who frequently offers significant discounts on his products. So people can wait until a library is out in the market and being used with more relevant feedback without FOMO. In other words, there will be plenty of opportunities to hear them in practice.



Toecutter said:


> you clearly have some personal shit against me


Not true. I've avoided making personal comments and haven't said anything about you as a person - just that you've posted frequently negative comments about PS libraries in numerous threads. The fact that you can't give examples of doing the same thing to other devs in other threads speaks volumes. 

In any case, this wasn't derailing the thread as you stated - the OP asked for feedback regarding Vista vs Soaring Strings. I'm addressing the fact that your feedback appears to be negatively biased. I don't need to say anything else now - the point has been made, and I'll continue to call you out when I see you doing that in future PS threads. 



Denkii said:


> I could do without the keyboard warrior filler episodes.


Noted! I'm leaving off here - my point has been made.


----------



## Toecutter (May 15, 2021)

Kony said:


> How so? I've given more than one example where you've made a personalised criticism on more than one person making positive comments about PS. How is that being misquoted?


Not true and I already linked the original posts you misquoted, I don't think you even check the stuff you are posting but it's alright. I can live with that!



Kony said:


> If you really wanted to offer constructive comments to potential buyers - to help avoid buyer's remorse as you say - you might also say that Jasper is a very generous developer who frequently offers significant discounts on his products.



I literally did that * *




__





Performance Samples - Pacific - Symphonic Strings


I know it's been discussed a little in the Voyage thread, but I decided it might be worth making its own thread: Based on this play-list of samples written in super-early pre-alpha, ESPECIALLY the legato: This is sounding to be SUPER promising, after so many disappointing symphonic-sized...




vi-control.net





"That's one thing Performance Samples never fails to deliver, always have good intro prices and loyalty discounts." - literally me  CLICK



Kony said:


> And you keep ignoring the pertinent point that these libraries are not for purists - is there any reason why you're ignoring this?



Addressed that one too but I'll let you dig further into my post history because you chose to ignore a lot of stuff, not only the constructive criticism but also the positive things I had to say about Performance Samples. Including praising Jasper for being one of the few developers to pay regular rates to his demo writers. It's like I'm stuck in some weird Twilight Zone episode.


----------



## Casiquire (May 15, 2021)

I'd be much more bothered by the negativity if it wasn't a direct response to an example that really, truly demonstrated the criticism. I find this way less egregious than, say, someone bringing up a dongle policy nobody was talking about, or a user interface issue that wasn't part of the conversation. It was a response to an example posted in which the bumps bothered me too, so i think it's relevant, regardless of previous comments in other threads. Everything since then has been kind of unnecessary. Though i do appreciate the comments that the bumps mostly only come out when the modwheel is being used. That's useful info


----------



## jazzman7 (May 15, 2021)

FWIW Vista and a bit of Con Moto underneath

Old Bumpy
View attachment Vista Con Moto Phrase.mp3


Newer. Less Bumpy
View attachment Legato 17b.mp3




Notice I said LESS bumpy haha. Still needs massaging


----------



## Banquet (May 15, 2021)

I just bought Vista in a bit of a GAS moment when I saw the sale was on but due to end. It has a completely different tone to Soaring Strings, but, on noodling around, I did find it a bit similar at times to BBC SO, which surprised me! Once I started writing for the string parts it didn't sound so similar though.

After having a couple of hours with it, I really like Vista... I love the tone and it's lovely to write with because it's so full sounding - it's amazing Vista only has 5 violins! SCS has 4 and sounds much thinner. Although I've read that people are layering Vista with CSS, I really like the sound of Vista layered with SCS. which brings some fizz and stringiness to the top and perhaps helps cover the 'bumps' - although I confess I'm not really hearing these bumps as much as some are. When I ride the mod wheel it seems quite smooth. There does seem to be a lumpy attack at times, but I've not had a chance to explore much so far and I'll have to have a better listen to the examples which I've only heard on my phone. I do love the tone but find it almost too sucked in at times, which is where, for me, SCS helps add a bit of sparkle on top. What are people using for the shorts with Vista?


----------



## Kony (May 15, 2021)

Casiquire said:


> I'd be much more bothered by the negativity if it wasn't a direct response to an example that really, truly demonstrated the criticism.


That wasn't the case in the Pacific thread and I acknowledge that this has built up based on the sum of Toecutters negative PS posts in various threads. And the criticism does bother me because it's clearly stated that the libraries have imperfections, that they are not for purists, that the issues being mentioned do not render the libraries unusable, and that there are a lot of positives which are being ignored. Such as PS libraries being infinitely more playable and expressive than most other libraries I've used - a point clearly lost in this thread. If the criticism had run along the lines of "Vista is great but be advised that some legato transitions are a bit bumpy so not ideal for exposed writing in some contexts", that would have been helpful and okay. But to say the players had hiccups, and that the bumps are enormous is misleading and inaccurate.

The other gripe is that Toecutter clearly has an axe to grind - his protestations that he has made some positive statements elsewhere merely serves to add a level of fake neutrality given the acerbic and patronising nature of his comments. Put another way: do you think Toecutter has turned some people off buying PS libraries based on his wildly negative comments? Do you think that's fair to the dev given that the libraries are actually very good? Have you yourself experienced buyer's remorse after purchasing a PS library? I don't think I've ever seen a comment on VI-C indicating regret at a PS purchase. Have you?


----------



## Soundbed (May 15, 2021)

Thanks for all the input. I cannot find anything in my collection that sounds quite like Vista. Hearing the examples provided here and making my own*, I mostly pay attention to other libraries’ differences. 

There’s something silky and full of “tone” that I like about Vista. I associate it with ribbon mics and well made recording equipment ... I know it’s more than that, but it’s difficult to put my finger on what makes it “sing” so well relative to other libraries. 

Spent a bit today playing with MSS and CSS and BBC and others VS *the 5 violins demo patch of Vista; it’s really difficult to get the same tone/timbre as Vista, even if I can occasionally get a similar “slurred” legato (or whatever one wants to call it).

I can now see / hear how Soaring Strings might have a bit more ‘reedy’ presence, maybe a bit more rosin or different mics + instruments + room that makes it sound a bit “brighter”.

I’m tempted to get Vista while it’s still $249 but part of me wonders if I’ll like Pacific or Voyage Strings “enough” to splurge on the other articulations and dynamic layers for even more $. (Section sizes are not my primary concern at this point.)


----------



## Soundbed (May 15, 2021)

Banquet said:


> I just bought Vista in a bit of a GAS moment when I saw the sale was on but due to end. It has a completely different tone to Soaring Strings, but, on noodling around, I did find it quite close to BBC SO at times, which surprised me! Once I started writing for the string parts it didn't sound so similar though.
> 
> After having a couple of hours with it, I really like Vista... I love the tone and it's lovely to write with because it's so full sounding - it's amazing Vista only has 5 violins! SCS has 4 and sounds much thinner. Although I've read that people are layering Vista with CSS, I really like the sound of Vista layered with SCS. SCS gives some fizz and stringiness to the top and perhaps helps cover the 'bumps' - although I confess I'm not really hearing these bumps as much as some are. When I ride the mod wheel it seems quite smooth. There does seem to be a lumpy attack at times, but I've not had a chance to explore much so far and I'll have to have a better listen to the examples which I've only heard on my phone. I do love the tone but find it almost too sucked in at times, which is where, for me, SCS helps add a bit of sparkle on top. What are people using for the shorts with Vista?


Right! I too had a moment where it felt like certain notes and dynamic mod wheel settings had BBC sounding remarkably similar to Vista 5 violin demo patch. Then it sort of went away when I changed things ... but it was pretty surprising for the moments when I was getting them sounding similar; because I wouldn’t think of Vista and BBC as sounding similar.

And yes Vista is really fun to write with. The melodies sort of spring from your fingers. Switching to others felt a bit like playing notes and using Vista felt like playing melodies.


----------



## constaneum (May 16, 2021)

I dont have Vista but i'm lately fond of using Soaring Strings to layer with SSS Pro. Here are two of my latest music featuring new orchestral setup which i'm quite happy with the results. You can hear the strings legato in actions. For these two pieces, the strings setup are 0db for Soaring Strings and -3db for SSS Pro (Outrigger mic only)

1. A Hustle Bustle Town



2. Ancient Dragon Qiu Long


----------



## Peter Hirdes (May 16, 2021)

Just grabbed Vista and I am really excited about the sound. Can anyone tell me how to trigger the rebowing of notes? Could not find any information about it especially as there is no official walkthrough or manual which is a pity.


----------



## soulofsound (May 16, 2021)

Kony said:


> The other gripe is that Toecutter clearly has an axe to grind - his protestations that he has made some positive statements elsewhere merely serves to add a level of fake neutrality given the acerbic and patronising nature of his comments.


You seem to have an axe to grind with him. Play the ball and not the man, however abrasive his comments.


----------



## Banquet (May 16, 2021)

Peter Hirdes said:


> Just grabbed Vista and I am really excited about the sound. Can anyone tell me how to trigger the rebowing of notes? Could not find any information about it especially as there is no official walkthrough or manual which is a pity.


I think you hold sustain pedal and play note again.


----------



## Casiquire (May 16, 2021)

Kony said:


> That wasn't the case in the Pacific thread and I acknowledge that this has built up based on the sum of Toecutters negative PS posts in various threads. And the criticism does bother me because it's clearly stated that the libraries have imperfections, that they are not for purists, that the issues being mentioned do not render the libraries unusable, and that there are a lot of positives which are being ignored. Such as PS libraries being infinitely more playable and expressive than most other libraries I've used - a point clearly lost in this thread. If the criticism had run along the lines of "Vista is great but be advised that some legato transitions are a bit bumpy so not ideal for exposed writing in some contexts", that would have been helpful and okay. But to say the players had hiccups, and that the bumps are enormous is misleading and inaccurate.
> 
> The other gripe is that Toecutter clearly has an axe to grind - his protestations that he has made some positive statements elsewhere merely serves to add a level of fake neutrality given the acerbic and patronising nature of his comments. Put another way: do you think Toecutter has turned some people off buying PS libraries based on his wildly negative comments? Do you think that's fair to the dev given that the libraries are actually very good? Have you yourself experienced buyer's remorse after purchasing a PS library? I don't think I've ever seen a comment on VI-C indicating regret at a PS purchase. Have you?


I don't care about the axe, i don't care about the Pacific thread, i don't care about buyer's regret, i don't care about purists. In the moment, the criticism was warranted. I was about to post it myself before i saw he beat me to it. That's really all 🤷


----------



## muziksculp (May 16, 2021)

constaneum said:


> I dont have Vista but i'm lately fond of using Soaring Strings to layer with SSS Pro. Here are two of my latest music featuring new orchestral setup which i'm quite happy with the results. You can hear the strings legato in actions. For these two pieces, the strings setup are 0db for Soaring Strings and -3db for SSS Pro (Outrigger mic only)
> 
> 1. A Hustle Bustle Town
> 
> ...



The combo of SS with SSSPro Strings sound very nice. Thanks for sharing, and the tip. 

Oh.. what libraries are you using for the Asian Instruments ?


----------



## Banquet (May 16, 2021)

Wow, I've had a day now, playing around with Vista and WHAT a sound... just lovely... I wasn't sure if I would regret buying but I'm so pleased I did... such an amazing tone and really goes well (in my opinion and to my surprise) with SCS. This is going to get a lot of use... oh my...


----------



## muziksculp (May 16, 2021)

Hi,

OK, I did a decision reversal today  

With the help of some extra GAS, I decided to check if VISTA was still on sale, and to my surprise, it was. So, I just hit the Buy button, and got it for $249. 

I don't know if this was a wise decision, but I will surely find out once I use it, and see if my extra GAS was a good thing.  Given all the praise, and postive feedback it keeps getting, I doubt I will regret having this library. 

I'm still very interested in the upcoming PACIFIC, and VOYAGE libraries. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## artinro (May 16, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> OK, I did a decision reversal today
> 
> ...


Hope you enjoy it as much as I do, @muziksculp


----------



## muziksculp (May 16, 2021)

artinro said:


> Hope you enjoy it as much as I do, @muziksculp


Hi @artinro ,

Thanks  

I'm sure I will enjoy it. I will test it as soon as I install it, Downloading SOLO now.


----------



## jazzman7 (May 16, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> OK, I did a decision reversal today
> 
> ...


Hey! You did it! For all the occasional weirdness, that tone is killer...mello... Which helps make it an easier fit with other VI's in all sorts of situations. Considering PACIFIC is gonna be a Grand, not a bad addition at that price. Looking forward to your reactions as you get into it


----------



## Soundbed (May 16, 2021)

constaneum said:


> I dont have Vista but i'm lately fond of using Soaring Strings to layer with SSS Pro. Here are two of my latest music featuring new orchestral setup which i'm quite happy with the results. You can hear the strings legato in actions. For these two pieces, the strings setup are 0db for Soaring Strings and -3db for SSS Pro (Outrigger mic only)
> 
> 1. A Hustle Bustle Town
> 
> ...



Great, thanks for sharing, I always like hearing your music.

off-topic; Did you also use CSW for these (are you still finding CSW useful)?


----------



## jazzman7 (May 16, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> CSW for these (are you still finding CSW useful)?


Love to hear the answer too. I'm starting to look for a bread and butter winds VI myself


----------



## muziksculp (May 16, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> Hey! You did it! For all the occasional weirdness, that tone is killer...mello... Which helps make it an easier fit with other VI's in all sorts of situations. Considering PACIFIC is gonna be a Grand, not a bad addition at that price. Looking forward to your reactions as you get into it


Hi @jazzman7 ,

Yes, I finally couldn't resist.  The timbre, and legato quality of VISTA are its strong points, and what made me go forward with purchasing it. 

I think I can use it to add a special flavor to many other legato strings I have, and also use it unlayered. 

I'm confident it will be a very useful library to have. 

Also Thanks to all the great feedback from you, and other members of the forum, who have been praising it a lot, posting wonderful sounding demos of VISTA, this gave me the added confidence to go forward with purchasing it. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## jazzman7 (May 16, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Hi @jazzman7 ,
> 
> Yes, I finally couldn't resist.  The timbre, and legato quality of VISTA are its strong points, and what made me go forward with purchasing it.
> 
> ...


Excellent! I've been helped in so many ways on this forum. Of course, my wallet is muttering in the background, "Yeah right. Thanks. Thanks a lot!" haha


----------



## Soundbed (May 16, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Hi @jazzman7 ,
> 
> Yes, I finally couldn't resist.  The timbre, and legato quality of VISTA are its strong points, and what made me go forward with purchasing it.
> 
> ...


now if only spitfire would release the ARO mid high strings with legato selections

was that my out loud voice?


----------



## Jacob Cadmus (May 16, 2021)

I’m a SS user, though Vista does sound really good. I hope to have them both at some point for different use cases.


----------



## muziksculp (May 16, 2021)

Jacob Cadmus said:


> I’m a SS user, though Vista does sound really good. I hope to have them both at some point for different use cases.


By the way, VISTA is still at the discount price today, $249. if you can buy it before it goes back to the regular price.


----------



## ALittleNightMusic (May 16, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> Right! I too had a moment where it felt like certain notes and dynamic mod wheel settings had BBC sounding remarkably similar to Vista 5 violin demo patch. Then it sort of went away when I changed things ... but it was pretty surprising for the moments when I was getting them sounding similar; because I wouldn’t think of Vista and BBC as sounding similar.
> 
> And yes Vista is really fun to write with. The melodies sort of spring from your fingers. Switching to others felt a bit like playing notes and using Vista felt like playing melodies.


Which mic mix were you using for BBCSO and Vista? I am trying the free Violins patch from Vista (nice of PS to provide that) and found BBCSO much, much drier. If anything, I found SSS closer to Vista. I compared Vista to SSS, BBCSO, MSS, VSL Synchron Strings Pro, and Hollywood Opus Violins 18. In the end, I didn't think Vista was any better or more special than any of those. In fact, it strikes me as much more limited, even when comparing legato, especially if you look at MSS or SySPro.


----------



## szczaw (May 16, 2021)

Isn't NSS much better value with similar 'emotive' high strings vibrato ?


----------



## DawdlePuss (May 16, 2021)

Here's a quick comparison of the decca mics versus the close mics on Vista. I didn't use any additional plugins on either.


----------



## jazzman7 (May 16, 2021)

DawdlePuss said:


> Here's a quick comparison of the decca mics versus the close mics on Vista. I didn't use any additional plugins on either.


Very Nice! Hats off!


----------



## AndyP (May 16, 2021)

For lack of Vista, I made a comparison between Con Moto and Soaring Strings.
Con Moto is darker, the Soaring Strings are very bright. Both layered they are a dream combination.

Reverb is a bit Seventh Heaven Scoring Stage 2.2.


----------



## Toecutter (May 16, 2021)

AndyP said:


> For lack of Vista, I made a comparison between Con Moto and Soaring Strings.
> Con Moto is darker, the Soaring Strings are very bright. Both layered they are a dream combination.
> 
> Reverb is a bit Seventh Heaven Scoring Stage 2.2.


They match very well  SS is so expressive but it lacks any bottom end, I always have to give the basses and cellos a boost. Con Moto helps but I think it's overpowering SS and losing all the sweet detail. Maybe bring CM back a notch or two, just to give SS some support without the side effects?


----------



## jazzman7 (May 16, 2021)

Just for giggles, I threw a Sunset String slow bend up near the end on the Violin Melody. You can hear the nice slide from C to D. No processing or reverb on any of the the VI's, VISTA, CON MOTO, SUNSET

View attachment 5 9 2021 Legato Idea 25.mp3


Having Sunset Playing Nicely with Vista... In the words of Thomas Crowne when he placed the Monet on the mantlepiece....


----------



## AndyP (May 16, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> They match very well  SS is so expressive but it lacks any bottom end, I always have to give the basses and cellos a boost. Con Moto helps but I think it's overpowering SS and losing all the sweet detail. Maybe bring CM back a notch or two, just to give SS some support without the side effects?


You are right, Con Moto is somewhat concise here in the low range. And I notice that Con Moto has more room in the samples. Did this out of the box, I think only with close mic and some eq it would be a little less intrusive.


----------



## Soundbed (May 16, 2021)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Which mic mix were you using for BBCSO and Vista? I am trying the free Violins patch from Vista (nice of PS to provide that) and found BBCSO much, much drier. If anything, I found SSS closer to Vista. I compared Vista to SSS, BBCSO, MSS, VSL Synchron Strings Pro, and Hollywood Opus Violins 18. In the end, I didn't think Vista was any better or more special than any of those. In fact, it strikes me as much more limited, even when comparing legato, especially if you look at MSS or SySPro.


I really don’t recall, and it could have been ear fatigue because I was playing them all back to back for a while. I only have BBC Discover if that helps. I was not comparing legato, only tone.

interesting that you didn’t find it “more special” ... might be a grass is greener phenomenon I was experiencing...


----------



## jazzman7 (May 16, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> I really don’t recall, and it could have been ear fatigue because I was playing them all back to back for a while. I only have BBC Discover if that helps. I was not comparing legato, only tone.
> 
> interesting that you didn’t find it “more special” ... might be a grass is greener phenomenon I was experiencing...


I didn't find the free Violin patch terribly useful myself. I already had Con Moto and it took about 5 minutes after I started playing it for me to realize how nice an addition Vista would be. The more I learn the instrument, the happier I am with it.


----------



## Soundbed (May 16, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> I didn't find the free Violin patch terribly useful myself. I already had Con Moto and it took about 5 minutes after I started playing it for me to realize how nice an addition Vista would be. The more I learn the instrument, the happier I am with it.


I’m still kicking myself for not getting con Moto violas.


----------



## jazzman7 (May 16, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> I’m still kicking myself for not getting con Moto violas.


Damn shame it had to be discontinued. I figured If I didn't pull the trigger before it was gone I'd be kicking myself too.


----------



## Jett Hitt (May 16, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> I didn't find the free Violin patch terribly useful myself. I already had Con Moto and it took about 5 minutes after I started playing it for me to realize how nice an addition Vista would be. The more I learn the instrument, the happier I am with it.


What is the free violin patch? I don't think I got that.


----------



## ALittleNightMusic (May 16, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> I really don’t recall, and it could have been ear fatigue because I was playing them all back to back for a while. I only have BBC Discover if that helps. I was not comparing legato, only tone.
> 
> interesting that you didn’t find it “more special” ... might be a grass is greener phenomenon I was experiencing...


In general, I think libraries are a lot more alike than they are made out to be (especially here on Vi-C - it doesn't really matter in professional work. Look at AKD as an example, still happily using CS2). There are tonal variations, for sure. Vista does not sound exactly like another string library. Even microphone choice could make that difference though, not to mention positioning, hall, players, mixing, etc. But tonal variations are super subjective and there isn't a clear objective winner out there. And then in terms of editing / technical aspects, all the hoo-ha about how the PS legato is so superior and playable compared to other libraries - I didn't find that at all.


----------



## Toecutter (May 16, 2021)

I'm chatting with another Vista user on FB and was sent this audio clip of the violins with examples of noises, glitches and even phasing (10s in, that's new to me). I like the tone of Vista but this is the sort of thing that kept me from buying it after my experience with the freebie. According to the fella this is all over the library, not only the violins, he seemed annoyed  I said he should have read the library limitations, which he did but "never thought it would be like this". It worries me that Pacific and Voyage may have the same issues and be compromised, at least for my uses. I don't think the "not for purists" motto or a website disclaimer should warrant a get out of jail free card for not having better quality control, not at this price point. Listen with headphones, do you guys really think this is acceptable?


----------



## Batrawi (May 16, 2021)

...Ok since I couldn't find the midi file for the Vista Teaser theme, I decided to quickly redo it again for those who might need it (@jazzman7 , @biomuse). I used LASS this time (the quickest way/library I could think of to finish this quickly), so yeah -WARNING- it sounds DAMN HARSH...

View attachment LASS-Vista Teaser .mp3


----------



## jazzman7 (May 16, 2021)

Jett Hitt said:


> What is the free violin patch? I don't think I got that.


It's on the PF website


----------



## Blakus (May 16, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> I'm chatting with another Vista user on FB and was sent this audio clip of the violins with examples of noises, glitches and even phasing (10s in, that's new to me). I like the tone of Vista but this is the sort of thing that kept me from buying it after my experience with the freebie. According to the fella this is all over the library, not only the violins, he seemed annoyed  I said he should have read the library limitations, which he did but "never thought it would be like this". It worries me that Pacific and Voyage may have the same issues and be compromised, at least for my uses. I don't think the "not for purists" motto or a website disclaimer should warrant a get out of jail free card for not having better quality control, not at this price point. Listen with headphones, do you guys really think this is acceptable?


Sorry, but all that sounds glorious to me. Those noises are players giving it everything - rare in the sample world. If you don't like it, just use one of the hundred other tame/safe/sanitized libraries out there and move on, son  Jasper is pretty clear about this.


----------



## jazzman7 (May 16, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> ...Ok since I couldn't find the midi file for the Vista Teaser theme, I decided to quickly redo it again for those who might need it (@jazzman7 , @biomuse). I used LASS this time (the quickest way/library I could think of to finish this quickly), so yeah -WARNING- it sounds DAMN HARSH...
> 
> View attachment LASS-Vista Teaser .mp3


Appreciate you doing this! My gosh, there are only two different lines? Def can hear the different parts better. Violin and Viola over Cello with Bass in the octave. O my.... What a difference this perspective gives. Many thanks! Gonna play with this


----------



## Mike Greene (May 16, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> I'm chatting with another Vista user on FB and was sent this audio clip ...


This is getting very suspicious. Don't get me wrong, VI-Control is definitely the place to discuss product issues, but I'm starting to agree with Kony that you seem to have an axe to grind with Jasper.

You're in just about every PS thread, and often with _"JB, I know you're reading"_ remarks. And then recently posted a pic of Jasper lifted from his Facebook page. It's a bit stalkerish.

I'm not a fan of anonymous profiles, and this is one reason why. You're lifting Jasper's pix from his FB page, but he has no idea who he's dealing with. It's a little creepy. (To be clear, Jasper canceled his membership last year, so I'm not actually sure which threads, if any, he's read.)

This isn't helped by the fact that your email address is a throwaway and you seem to be logging on to the site through a proxy. I'll grant that people may have valid reasons for doing that, but from where I'm sitting, it smells like "agenda."

So please chill on anything PS related. Thanks.


----------



## Soundbed (May 16, 2021)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> In general, I think libraries are a lot more alike than they are made out to be (especially here on Vi-C - it doesn't really matter in professional work. Look at AKD as an example, still happily using CS2). There are tonal variations, for sure. Vista does not sound exactly like another string library. Even microphone choice could make that difference though, not to mention positioning, hall, players, mixing, etc. But tonal variations are super subjective and there isn't a clear objective winner out there. And then in terms of editing / technical aspects, all the hoo-ha about how the PS legato is so superior and playable compared to other libraries - I didn't find that at all.


cool, thanks. yeah you're right (I finally got to try it) the tone does sound quite similar to SSS, again a surprise to me considering the section sizes. 5 violins sounding a lot like 16 violins.

i do wonder what vista and con moto were recorded with (mics and gear; was it run through tape, etc.)...?

it's not necessarily superior, but it is inspiring (vista legato) with that tiny hint of slur which is too quick for most other packages to do with their "portamento" ... 

... i am a bit torn but i think, maybe, i have spent enough on PS libs until Voyage or maybe Pacific ... maybe


----------



## ALittleNightMusic (May 16, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> cool, thanks. yeah you're right (I finally got to try it) the tone does sound quite similar to SSS, again a surprise to me considering the section sizes. 5 violins sounding a lot like 16 violins.
> 
> i do wonder what vista and con moto were recorded with (mics and gear; was it run through tape, etc.)...?
> 
> ...


Well if it inspires you, that seems to be reason enough to buy it  I saved $250 because it certainly did not do that for me.


----------



## artinro (May 16, 2021)

Blakus said:


> Sorry, but all that sounds glorious to me. Those noises are players giving it everything - rare in the sample world. If you don't like it, just use one of the hundred other tame/safe/sanitized libraries out there and move on, son  Jasper is pretty clear about this.


Agreed. It sounds like someone looking to complain. He isolated a few notes that had some player noise and decided to rock back and forth unnaturally without moving the MW at all…no one uses a library like that. If he tries to actually write a musical line, he won’t notice the noise, especially in a mix. So, long story short, yeah I thinks it’s totally acceptable.


----------



## constaneum (May 16, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> The combo of SS with SSSPro Strings sound very nice. Thanks for sharing, and the tip.
> 
> Oh.. what libraries are you using for the Asian Instruments ?


 Thanks man. I'm using Chinee Kong for the Asian instruments.


----------



## Johnny (May 16, 2021)

@Toecutter, I'm in no way dismissing what you are saying, Vista is noisy, yes... But 18 players in a room are noisy, they are human  But in a composition when layering with other string libs? I found it to actually be really useful!! Vista brings that added life I couldn't get with existing string libs! ( I think...) And don't worry, I'm the Vista fence too  Haven't bought it yet and I'm waiting for Pacific to decide between the two. But anyhow, I haven't ever tried the freebie patch despite downloading it months ago- so I did! Here's in context with Century Strings 2.0  Let me know what you think? It sounds kina buoyant in a quick mix! (Anyone else, please chime in too and let us know your thoughts on Vista!) Thx all!


----------



## constaneum (May 16, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> Great, thanks for sharing, I always like hearing your music.
> 
> off-topic; Did you also use CSW for these (are you still finding CSW useful)?


thanks man. Yup. These are purely done using CSW for the woods. CSW remains as my current main woodwind library. Understood it has some flaws but there's always a workaround solution.


----------



## muziksculp (May 16, 2021)

constaneum said:


> Thanks man. I'm using Chinee Kong for the Asian instruments.


Cool. They sound great, but I'm still unable to get a clear answer if their QIN 2 Engine is a true 64-bit plugins, or it's still 32-bit but uses a wrapper to work in 64-bit mode. 

Thanks.


----------



## Jacob Cadmus (May 16, 2021)

Noise floor and player artifacts IMO are icing on the cake of these libraries. In many cases they add to the air and make them sound less fake and plastic.

Also, those “glitches” are last-note releases before the next-note attack that authentically chain together rebows and repetitions. It’s a trait consistent across many of PS libraries.


----------



## constaneum (May 16, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Cool. They sound great, but I'm still unable to get a clear answer if their QIN 2 Engine is a true 64-bit plugins, or it's still 32-bit but uses a wrapper to work in 64-bit mode.
> 
> Thanks.


Their plucks and winds are great. Bow instruments a bit so so but they do offer some phrases which sounds good for deco context. Actually cross checking, it somehow opens up jbridge wrapper. so yeah, unlikely 64 bit.


----------



## jazzman7 (May 16, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> ...Ok since I couldn't find the midi file for the Vista Teaser theme, I decided to quickly redo it again for those who might need it (@jazzman7 , @biomuse). I used LASS this time (the quickest way/library I could think of to finish this quickly), so yeah -WARNING- it sounds DAMN HARSH...
> 
> View attachment LASS-Vista Teaser .mp3


Here it is! The first take of my version of the teaser theme with Vista. Work to do, Timing, tone, dynamics, but it's starting to sound more like the real deal. No processing, Reverb, whatsoever. Decca Mic only


View attachment Vista Demo Theme attempt.mp3


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## jazzman7 (May 16, 2021)

Johnny said:


> @Toecutter, I'm in no way dismissing what you are saying, Vista is noisy, yes... But 18 players in a room are noisy, they are human  But in a composition when layering with other string libs? I found it to actually be really useful!! Vista brings that added life I couldn't get with existing string libs! ( I think...) And don't worry, I'm the Vista fence too  Haven't bought it yet and I'm waiting for Pacific to decide between the two. But anyhow, I haven't ever tried the freebie patch despite downloading it months ago- so I did! Here's in context with Century Strings 2.0  Let me know what you think? It sounds kina buoyant in a quick mix! (Anyone else, please chime in too and let us know your thoughts on Vista!) Thx all!


Killer! Great work!


----------



## Toecutter (May 16, 2021)

Mike Greene said:


> So please chill on anything PS related. Thanks.


I read you chief, loud and clear! Truly sorry, I'm not some crazy bastard, just wanted to discuss Performance Samples... I respect you and your leadership here, so please don't think I'm being confrontational or can't read a room. Feel free to moderate this message if you don't think it's fair to listen to my side. I'll be very brief and never talk about Performance Samples again XD



Mike Greene said:


> This is getting very suspicious. Don't get me wrong, VI-Control is definitely the place to discuss product issues, but I'm starting to agree with Kony that you seem to have an axe to grind with Jasper.


There's no axe to grind, out of 700 posts, only a small fraction is about Performance Samples. You should see the Audiobro and Eastwest threads XD As a potential buyer of one of PS upcoming libraries, I'm legitimately trying to understand what to expect from a $1000 library, especially when the company exempts itself from support or discontinue few-years-old libraries. I admit I've used my knowledge that Jasper indeed reads these threads (see below) to raise as much discussion as possible about those issues so he receives real feedback from users and other potential buyers. I'm obviously a minority here and people don't seem to care about noises and imperfections... so yep, lesson learned, I guess I'll gtfo and never buy another Performance Samples library again. Which absolutely sucks because I love the tone of Vista and was hoping Voyage would address those "issues" 



Mike Greene said:


> You're in just about every PS thread, and often with _"JB, I know you're reading"_ remarks.


I was contacted by two of his friends-collaborators on two different occasions telling me he was reading the posts. I find it funny that he chose to leave the forum and yet tries to influence discussions. I thought I would say hi now and then just for the giggles. It didn't sound this immature in my head but as I type this... yep, not proud at all.



Mike Greene said:


> And then recently posted a pic of Jasper lifted from his Facebook page. It's a bit stalkerish. You're lifting Jasper's pix from his FB page, but he has no idea who he's dealing with. It's a little creepy.


That was totally out of line, there are no excuses, I can only regret my dumb joke  In this meme world, I didn't think it through and put *#winning* over one of Japer's pics as a compliment for financially compensating his demo writers. It was supposed to be a positive thing but it backfired. I apologized, removed the image and will apologize as many times as necessary. Sorry, really am, will never do something like this again.

Over and out! Sorry everyone, wish Performance Samples and JB the best of luck! I value Vi-control a lot more, there are plenty of other libraries to obsess about XD


----------



## Toecutter (May 16, 2021)

Johnny said:


> @Toecutter, I'm in no way dismissing what you are saying, Vista is noisy, yes... But 18 players in a room are noisy, they are human  But in a composition when layering with other string libs? I found it to actually be really useful!! Vista brings that added life I couldn't get with existing string libs! ( I think...) And don't worry, I'm the Vista fence too  Haven't bought it yet and I'm waiting for Pacific to decide between the two. But anyhow, I haven't ever tried the freebie patch despite downloading it months ago- so I did! Here's in context with Century Strings 2.0  Let me know what you think? It sounds kina buoyant in a quick mix! (Anyone else, please chime in too and let us know your thoughts on Vista!) Thx all!


Thanks Jhonny, I can't give you my feedback here but I'm very interested in hearing about Century Strings 2. Do I have your permission to write you with a few questions?


----------



## Samy Cheboub (May 16, 2021)

When I programmed the Star Wars intro, I had to overcome several obstacles to get a credible result. One of them was this "simple" line (attached below). I struggled with it but things started to take shape when I used Con Moto Violins. Among all the violins libraries I own, it was the only one that gave me the tone and the legato I was looking for. Among other things, I also added a layer of Vista (violin, viola, cello) which came out when 99% of the mockup was done...Otherwise I would have used it as the main library.

I have been programming for over 15 years and after using it on several projects I can say that if I had to keep only one library for legato strings, it would be Vista. 

Jasper has done an amazing job capturing what no other company has managed to capture.


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## Soundbed (May 16, 2021)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Well if it inspires you, that seems to be reason enough to buy it  I saved $250 because it certainly did not do that for me.


Oh my, I found a Con Moto Kontakt multi I’d previously saved with SSS violas, so apparently I’d previously discovered that SSS tone sort of matches the Vista / Con Moto vibe... guess I’m becoming Dory (short term memory failure)

@Samy Cheboub you said “I also added a layer of Vista (violin, viola, cello) which came out when 99% of the mockup was done” — great mock-up! What do you mean “came out”? You left vista in or took it out?


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## artinro (May 16, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> @Samy Cheboub you said “I also added a layer of Vista (violin, viola, cello) which came out when 99% of the mockup was done” — great mock-up! What do you mean “came out”? You left vista in or took it out?


I don’t want to put words in @Samy Cheboub ‘s mouth, but I believe he means Vista was released when he was already 99% finished with his SW mockup. He then added Vista to what he already had (Con Moto etc..).


----------



## Banquet (May 17, 2021)

Well I now can't see myself being able to resist Pacific when it comes out and that's going to be $1000 so I better get saving! There's so much life, energy and emotion in Vista and it's so playable. I wonder where it will fit in with Voyage in terms of them both being chamber sized? Is Jasper re-doing the strings for Voyage and, if so, what will be the difference?


----------



## Blakus (May 17, 2021)

Samy Cheboub said:


> When I programmed the Star Wars intro, I had to overcome several obstacles to get a credible result. One of them was this "simple" line (attached below). I struggled with it but things started to take shape when I used Con Moto Violins. Among all the violins libraries I own, it was the only one that gave me the tone and the legato I was looking for. Among other things, I also added a layer of Vista (violin, viola, cello) which came out when 99% of the mockup was done...Otherwise I would have used it as the main library.
> 
> I have been programming for over 15 years and after using it on several projects I can say that if I had to keep only one library for legato strings, it would be Vista.
> 
> Jasper has done an amazing job capturing what no other company has managed to capture.



Preach it, brother! Great string programming - sounds amazing.


----------



## Johnny (May 17, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> Thanks Jhonny, I can't give you my feedback here but I'm very interested in hearing about Century Strings 2. Do I have your permission to write you with a few questions?


Sure can! HAha, fire away : )


----------



## Johnny (May 17, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> Killer! Great work!


Thx, having some fun with that Freebie Vista Patch! It's beginning to sell me


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## Oakran (May 17, 2021)

Samy Cheboub said:


> When I programmed the Star Wars intro, I had to overcome several obstacles to get a credible result. One of them was this "simple" line (attached below). I struggled with it but things started to take shape when I used Con Moto Violins. Among all the violins libraries I own, it was the only one that gave me the tone and the legato I was looking for. Among other things, I also added a layer of Vista (violin, viola, cello) which came out when 99% of the mockup was done...Otherwise I would have used it as the main library.
> 
> I have been programming for over 15 years and after using it on several projects I can say that if I had to keep only one library for legato strings, it would be Vista.
> 
> Jasper has done an amazing job capturing what no other company has managed to capture.



It sounds fantastic


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## Russell Anderson (May 17, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> I think one can easily darken their sound if they are a bit on the bright side, it's always easier to darken compared to brighten strings timbre.


I remember hearing the opposite; but I think both are doable. Lowpass, sample rate reduction, tape for darkening, saturation and EQ for brightness. I think I have heard people say both ways as general rules... "it's very hard to do [either], easier to do [either]" :D


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## Samy Cheboub (May 17, 2021)

Thanks guys.

Regarding the noises/resonances, it often happens that they are masked by other instruments. Of course, it depends on the context and the mix. 

But here are four tips to bypass a disturbing noise on a very exposed line.

Example :



Tips 1_automate the legato knob and deactivate it on the problematic note :






Tips 2_I often use several pitched versions of the same instrument which allows me to have a bigger section and also to choose the version that works best :






Tips 3_use the FFF overlay :






Tips 4_use a lower dynamics value and compensate with volume :








artinro said:


> but I believe he means Vista was released when he was already 99% finished with his SW mockup. He then added Vista to what he already had (Con Moto etc..).


Yes


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## Batrawi (May 17, 2021)

DAMN YOU ALL... I pulled the trigger


----------



## Russell Anderson (May 17, 2021)

The moral arc of the universe is long, but it bends towards _n. _


----------



## Soundbed (May 17, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> ...Ok since I couldn't find the midi file for the Vista Teaser theme, I decided to quickly redo it again for those who might need it (@jazzman7 , @biomuse). I used LASS this time (the quickest way/library I could think of to finish this quickly), so yeah -WARNING- it sounds DAMN HARSH...
> 
> View attachment LASS-Vista Teaser .mp3


Very nice of you to include the MIDI file, thanks! It's a bit off topic b/c it's not about comparing Vista to SS but I took a moment to throw it at SSS, CSS, VSL Elite and MSS. Initial thoughts...

MSS — To approach Vista's legato style with MSS in the violins, on the more prominent "quick slide" (or position shift) transitions, I can switch to portamento and fiddle with the speed and port offset controls to get the effect. Maybe not quite as convincing, but for the "not purists" it serves the purpose. The tone is a bit different of course; I have some tricks for that and actually really like the overall sound with my adjustments, even though it sounds different.
SSS — Quite difficult to get the legato style with SSS for me; there isn't a subtle intermediate setting I could find between fingered and port transitions. Tone is pretty similar, as previously discussed above.
CSS — has a very similar legato "style" on this melody (I'm sure no one here is overly surprised). Tone is pretty similar, although the Vista "active bow" sound is different from the CSS vibrato.
VSL Elite — well, I cannot get it very close in the legato side or the tone, not very surprising. 
By the way I have been using the Soundcloud link for Vista b/c the video had ocean sounds. 

(Didn't save or bounce any of my tests; was only fiddling and changing settings and didn't try to arrive at a finished, share-able "mockup" of the Vista demo using other libs.)

Conclusion so far: Vista is a great library for the kind of legato it has. It seems closest in the free 5 violins sampler to the slower CSS transitions. It (also?) seems a great "advertisement" for Pacific, if you want larger sections and will pay $750 or more for the addition of:

Spiccatos
Pizzicatos
Marcatos
Trills (HT+WT)
Unmeasured Tremolos
Sordino Sustains
Harmonics / Soft Sustains
FX (risers and various hits)
... up to 14 dynamics, in addition to potentially similar legato.


Batrawi said:


> DAMN YOU ALL... I pulled the trigger


Whoa really? I still feel tempted ...


----------



## Soundbed (May 17, 2021)

downloading Vista now...


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## Soundbed (May 17, 2021)

Russell Anderson said:


> The moral arc of the universe is long, but it bends towards _n. _


As in _n_ number of sample libraries in our collections?


----------



## Russell Anderson (May 17, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> As in _n_ number of sample libraries in our collections?


I'm new enough here that I'm only pretty sure the joke is "_n_" referring to the optimal number of libraries. Which I probably just ruined 

that aside, I'm in the same boat as some others. I want Vista pretty bad, but I'm waiting for Pacific + Voyage, as that's money I'll need to save anyway. Or potentially just spend on the Cinematic Series. . . but golllee, if Vista isn't pretty much the most gorgeous library I've ever heard to date.

Any chance you'll post those Vista demo renditions performed on multiple libraries? That's a youtube view you could expect me to forfeit to you with pleasure


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## Soundbed (May 17, 2021)

Russell Anderson said:


> Any chance you'll post those Vista demo renditions performed on multiple libraries? That's a youtube view you could expect me to forfeit to you with pleasure


Possibly! I don’t know when/if I’ll have time...bc it will be “unfair” if I don’t take time to make each sound as good as possible.


----------



## Batrawi (May 18, 2021)

Having noodled around with the library for some time now, I (unexpectedly!) have absolutely no regrets with this purchase even though I still consider the sale price is high for an only-legto-library... Vista exceptionally executes what it's designed for and playing with it is a pure joy and inspirational for lyrical/romantic music.. I literally feel that my fingers are gliding in melting butter 😄and the library effortlessly sings for this type of music... One thing I'd really wish Jasper had done differently is to instruct these player to calm the f#%k down just a bit when playing those vibratos. More than often their intensity contradicts the library's purpose or potential capability of also being able to nail the "soft/romatic" sides of things... but... it is what it is.. I'll just hope for a regular vibrato update that is very unlikely to happen, yet while still enjoying the library for what it is!


----------



## Sovereign (May 18, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> I'll just hope for a regular vibrato update that is very unlikely to happen, yet while still enjoying the library for what it is!


It appears that update is called Pacific, or Voyage if you dig 'em smaller.


----------



## muziksculp (May 18, 2021)

Sovereign said:


> It appears that update is called Pacific, or Voyage if you dig 'em smaller.


Yes, that's right. But they will also come with a hefty price tag.


----------



## Batrawi (May 18, 2021)

Sovereign said:


> It appears that update is called Pacific, or Voyage if you dig 'em smaller.


but these are large sections sizes no?


----------



## Russell Anderson (May 18, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> but these are large sections sizes no?


Voyage is chamber. I’m with you by the way, the vibrato at lower dynamics makes the dynamics sound sometimes more like volume. And for every other aspect of the library it is largely unmatched for passionate and sometimes grave.


----------



## Batrawi (May 18, 2021)

Russell Anderson said:


> Voyage is chamber.


so will it come with gentle vibrato then! I haven't heard any so far from the demos... need to take another careful listen though


----------



## Batrawi (May 18, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Yes, that's right. But they will also come with a hefty price tag.



Hopefully not if we'll not be forced to buy an all-in-one package.

Quoting from the website:
"How will it be released?
All subject to change, but most likely strings, woodwinds, brass, and percussion – four separate modules. Each module will not necessarily be the same price."

But again the important question is, is it going to be molto vib again (like it always has been the case with all PS strings so far)? I think there is not enough info about this yet.


----------



## gst98 (May 18, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> Hopefully not if we'll not be forced to buy an all-in-one package.
> 
> Quoting from the website:
> "How will it be released?
> ...


Certain bits of Voyage he re-recorded because they were too molto esp. Con moto has less vib than vista and I think Voyage and Pacific are going to be less than Vista.


----------



## Jett Hitt (May 18, 2021)

gst98 said:


> Certain bits of Voyage he re-recorded because they were too molto esp. Con moto has less vib than vista and I think Voyage and Pacific are going to be less than Vista.


Which means that Vista will still have application if you buy Pacific.


----------



## muziksculp (May 18, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> Hopefully not if we'll not be forced to buy an all-in-one package.
> 
> Quoting from the website:
> "How will it be released?
> ...


But Pacific is only Strings (Symphonic). So, I don't think it will be split into modules. Voyage, Yes, since it is a full orchestra.


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## lettucehat (May 18, 2021)

I would not get your hopes up about Voyage leaving a “legato hole” where you can save by continuing to use Vista. It really seems like the modules will be sections, not articulation by articulation (not even OT do that). Sorry if I’m misinterpreting though.


----------



## Soundbed (May 18, 2021)

And now, Soaring Strings is on sale, too! 

$129 









Soaring Strings - Great String Samples & Libraries | Musical Sampling


Soaring Strings Samples is focused solely on emotive legato and sustains, providing a simple and easy way to create great sounding melodies and string beds in no time.




musicalsampling.com


----------



## Peter Hirdes (May 18, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> And now, Soaring Strings is on sale, too!
> 
> $129
> 
> ...


Great time! Just bought Vista


----------



## DivingInSpace (May 18, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> And now, Soaring Strings is on sale, too!
> 
> $129
> 
> ...


I am currently trying to talk myself out of this


----------



## jazzman7 (May 18, 2021)

A sale on Soaring had my wallet nervous, but Adventure too...PLUS BUNDLES? Great! That's  just Great! I'm just getting ready to install another 4TB SSD to handle all the crap I just bought last week! Now this! haha


----------



## Soundbed (May 18, 2021)

DivingInSpace said:


> I am currently trying to talk myself out of this


same


jazzman7 said:


> Great! That's  just Great!


yup


Peter Hirdes said:


> Great time! Just bought Vista


yep


----------



## Russell Anderson (May 18, 2021)

Batrawi said:


> is it going to be molto vib again (like it always has been the case with all PS strings so far)? I think there is not enough info about this yet.


If I am not mistaken, there are pianississississimo layers (5 _p_‘s seriously) so it should be capable of smooth playing down there at the souffle dynamics. There are soundcloud examples of it. Whether there are vibrato options/articulations featuring less molto vib, couldn’t say. Best bet is certainly a soundcloud diving session.


----------



## Peter Hirdes (May 19, 2021)

I just noticed some weird volume jumps during playing back recorded notes with Vista. Each time I stop the playback the note under the playhead jumps up in volume. Has anyone noticed that bug too? I work in Logic with Kontakt 5. Any idea where the problem could be?


----------



## lettucehat (May 19, 2021)

Yeah I get that too, kind of scary at first but I got used to it. It only happens on the armed/selected track right? Might be related to chase being on?


----------



## evilantal (May 19, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> And now, Soaring Strings is on sale, too!
> 
> $129
> 
> ...


My wallet likes this!
Although they have been on sale for $99 recently as I recall


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## Jett Hitt (May 19, 2021)

Peter Hirdes said:


> I just noticed some weird volume jumps during playing back recorded notes with Vista. Each time I stop the playback the note under the playhead jumps up in volume. Has anyone noticed that bug too? I work in Logic with Kontakt 5. Any idea where the problem could be?


Same here. It seems harmless enough, though. It’s definitely related to the armed track.


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## jazzman7 (May 19, 2021)

Jett Hitt said:


> Same here. It seems harmless enough, though. It’s definitely related to the armed track.


Same here


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## Soundbed (May 19, 2021)

Peter Hirdes said:


> I just noticed some weird volume jumps during playing back recorded notes with Vista. Each time I stop the playback the note under the playhead jumps up in volume. Has anyone noticed that bug too? I work in Logic with Kontakt 5. Any idea where the problem could be?


I believe I've gotten this with plenty of Kontakt instruments, not only Vista. I test and demo 2-3 new instruments per week (side hustle) not only for Kontakt so I can't remember which ones they are but it's not a new issue in my experience and does not seem limited to Vista, if I remember correctly.


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## Soundbed (May 19, 2021)

evilantal said:


> My wallet likes this!
> Although they have been on sale for $99 recently as I recall


True, in January although I got very few emails about that sale (and missed it). During Black friday in 2019 and 2020 i think they were $129 so $99 is definitely low and $129 is BF/CM pricing. Adventure strings too!


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## Peter Hirdes (May 19, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> I believe I've gotten this with plenty of Kontakt instruments, not only Vista. I test and demo 2-3 new instruments per week (side hustle) not only for Kontakt so I can't remember which ones they are but it's not a new issue in my experience and does not seem limited to Vista, if I remember correctly.


mmh, I have a lot of Kontakt instruments and I have never had that before...


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## Peter Hirdes (May 19, 2021)

lettucehat said:


> Yeah I get that too, kind of scary at first but I got used to it. It only happens on the armed/selected track right? Might be related to chase being on?


Yes, on the armed track. It might be related to midi chase but I need that always on , why should I switch it off because of a single instrument?? it’s definitely a bug


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## lettucehat (May 19, 2021)

Peter Hirdes said:


> Yes, on the armed track. It might be related to midi chase but I need that always on , why should I switch it off because of a single instrument?? it’s definitely a bug


Ok I didn't even tell you what to do or deny it was a bug. Just thinking out loud.


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## Peter Hirdes (May 19, 2021)

Oh yeah , no problem. i was thinking out loud too 😉


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## Soundbed (May 21, 2021)

I made this for myself but maybe others will be interested. It's not an attempt to make every library sound as good as it can. It was a simple listen to Vista compared / contrasted to other libraries (not yet bought Soaring Strings) to hear how they might be similar and different and how they might blend. 



Mediocre mod wheel, similar MIDI. Again this was only to see which combinations sounded reasonably nice together, how well they played together and separately. I only highlighted my favorite combinations. Hope this is helpful to others but I did not go out of my way to make every package sound like a finished performance; I was listening for "broad strokes" in the general timbre and timing differences across the packages. I show the MIDI predelay (offset) in the upper left. Some of the legatos mesh better (or worse) than others. This was not an exhaustive test, only a brief experiment to refer to later when I want to remember a few key points I discovered. Performance Samples Vista, Performance Samples Con Moto, AudioBro Modern Scoring Strings, Cinematic Studio Strings, Spitfire Symphonic Strings, VSL Elite Strings aka Vista w/ MSS + CSS + SSS + VSL Elite + Con Moto. Each library was adjusted to sound reasonably close to Vista's "out of the box" volume level relatively, except VSL Elite which I left a little on the quiet side because it can add a nice layer of detail that way.

Oh and there are some "volume bumps" in Vista violins, in the middle of the mod wheel especially, that you'll likely want to dip occasionally. I demonstrated one of them. Not a big deal but worth mentioning considering the previous conversations. And not difficult to do with automation.


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## Peter Hirdes (May 23, 2021)

Peter Hirdes said:


> Yes, on the armed track. It might be related to midi chase but I need that always on , why should I switch it off because of a single instrument?? it’s definitely a bug


in the meantime I have contacted the support. we found out that it's actually up to midi chase In Logic. if you deactivate control changes here, the playback issue disappears. By the way this concerns ONLY playing back a recorded region, printing the midi is absolutely fine. Hope this helps everyone who had the same issue.


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## constaneum (May 23, 2021)

evilantal said:


> My wallet likes this!
> Although they have been on sale for $99 recently as I recall


grab it. it's a very good tool to work with SSS. I'm loving the combination. i'm using it to replace SSS' Close Mic. Highly recommended.


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## MikeRolls (May 26, 2021)

Peter Hirdes said:


> in the meantime I have contacted the support. we found out that it's actually up to midi chase In Logic. if you deactivate control changes here, the playback issue disappears.


Did you just deactivate Control Changes here? It didn't make any difference for me..


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## Kurosawa (May 29, 2021)

Oh man, I don't know if I should go for Soaring Strings now or if I should wait for VISTA at a later point of time (Or instead go for Pacific later)


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## constaneum (May 29, 2021)

Kurosawa said:


> Oh man, I don't know if I should go for Soaring Strings now or if I should wait for VISTA at a later point of time (Or instead go for Pacific later)


VISTA gonna more expensive than soaring strings i guess but VISTA will have more flexibility. I'm loving soaring strings for what it's good at.


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## Soundbed (May 30, 2021)

I’m now the proud owner of both Vista and Soaring Strings. I put them and some others in a “test” session and balanced each of the instrument groups/sections to match Vista for LUFS on a few phrases — each product balances the cello, viola and violins quite differently! — and Vista had the least high frequencies obvious.

From “muted” to “bright” oob EQ profiles, each package ranked like this for me:

Vista (least highs)
MSS (Kontakt EQ off)
SSS
CSS
Soaring Strings (most highs)

I found it interesting b/c CSS is usually considered “dark” but that didn’t mean “opposite of bright” in this group!


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## constaneum (May 31, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> I’m now the proud owner of both Vista and Soaring Strings. I put them and some others in a “test” session and balanced each of the instrument groups/sections to match Vista for LUFS on a few phrases — each product balances the cello, viola and violins quite differently! — and Vista had the least high frequencies obvious.
> 
> From “muted” to “bright” oob EQ profiles, each package ranked like this for me:
> 
> ...


How are you liking soaring strings so far? For those who's curious how soaring strings sound when blend with other string libraries. Here's what you get when blending soaring strings with SSS



you'll notice the strings sound from 1 min 15s - 2 mins 10s and a more obvious / exposed strings lines on 2 min 40s onwards. I'm basically replacing SSS' Violin 1, Viola, Cello and Bass' Close Mics with Soaring Strings.


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## Adam Takacs (May 31, 2021)

Another piece that demonstrates Soaring Strings.
I used Adventure strings tremolos for the intro part, a touch of VSL Lyra strings, Spitfire harp gliss, but the main library is Soaring Strings.
I love the library and $129 is a great price for it, I think.


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## constaneum (May 31, 2021)

Adam Takacs said:


> Another piece that demonstrates Soaring Strings.
> I used Adventure strings tremolos for the intro part, a touch of VSL Lyra strings, Spitfire harp gliss, but the main library is Soaring Strings.
> I love the library and $129 is a great price for it, I think.



yes. Soaring strings is sounding very good with what it's good at. a very beautiful piece, btw


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## Adam Takacs (May 31, 2021)

constaneum said:


> yes. Soaring strings is sounding very good with what it's good at. a very beautiful piece, btw


Thank you! Yes, Soaring Strings is a great library, I also bought it during a sale, it was very worth it.


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## novaburst (May 31, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> I made this for myself but maybe others will be interested. It's not an attempt to make every library sound as good as it can. It was a simple listen to Vista compared / contrasted to other libraries (not yet bought Soaring Strings) to hear how they might be similar and different and how they might blend.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I am being totally honest MSS are sounding very nice indeed even against CSS, MSS seems to have a lot of depth, Vista sounds nice too, CSS sounded good but predictable, Elite was a bit on the thin side but i know its a smaller library,

Been checking out your utube Vids must say thanks for the time and effort you have been putting in, it is so valuable and i have learned a few tricks from them.


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## Soundbed (May 31, 2021)

constaneum said:


> How are you liking soaring strings so far? For those who's curious how soaring strings sound when blend with other string libraries. Here's what you get when blending soaring strings with SSS
> 
> 
> 
> you'll notice the strings sound from 1 min 15s - 2 mins 10s and a more obvious / exposed strings lines on 2 min 40s onwards. I'm basically replacing SSS' Violin 1, Viola, Cello and Bass' Close Mics with Soaring Strings.



Great piece! I have only just started playing with them. I may make a quick video. At first blush the vibrato and legato loudness seem fairly pronounced, but I appreciate that they are consistent. The tone seems quite bright... they are sort of like Vista’s brighter sounding brother.

I am getting more and more convinced about the real power and flexibility of blending multiple strings libraries. Even if they were aimed at similar techniques.



novaburst said:


> I am being totally honest MSS are sounding very nice indeed even against CSS, MSS seems to have a lot of depth, Vista sounds nice too, CSS sounded good but predictable, Elite was a bit on the thin side but i know its a smaller library,
> 
> Been checking out your utube Vids must say thanks for the time and effort you have been putting in, it is so valuable and i have learned a few tricks from them.


Thank you! Yes MSS after the 1.1 update has shown me how legato that has the flexibility of these more “longer form” transitions can sound, without the molto vibrato. AudioBro added the molto button and espressivo divisi but it’s still not as heavy handed as these others in the vibrato dep’t. Much smoother and still quite a rich tone. Great for blending, and unobtrusive for media composition (or scoring, as the name suggests).


Adam Takacs said:


> Another piece that demonstrates Soaring Strings.
> I used Adventure strings tremolos for the intro part, a touch of VSL Lyra strings, Spitfire harp gliss, but the main library is Soaring Strings.
> I love the library and $129 is a great price for it, I think.



really great! Thanks for sharing.


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## Levon (May 31, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> I’m now the proud owner of both Vista and Soaring Strings. I put them and some others in a “test” session and balanced each of the instrument groups/sections to match Vista for LUFS on a few phrases — each product balances the cello, viola and violins quite differently! — and Vista had the least high frequencies obvious.
> 
> From “muted” to “bright” oob EQ profiles, each package ranked like this for me:
> 
> ...


I'm still on the fence about Soaring Strings. I've already got Vista. The SS sale is still on today. Is there an advantage to having both in your opinion? Cheers.


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## Kurosawa (May 31, 2021)

I'm also still undecided and don't know if I should buy Soaring Strings or go for Vista


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## Nullhertz (May 31, 2021)

I personally love the "brighter" tone of Soaring Strings a lot. It somehow cuts through the mix without sounding annoying in the high frequencies and at the same time there is still a good portion of warmth in it. I have used it recently in a theme for a documentary if anyone is still in need of another user-example:


(Soaring Strings start at around 0:58)


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## AndyP (May 31, 2021)

I've decided that Soaring Strings is the better alternative to Vista for me, so I'm sticking with SS. Until Pacific and Voyage appear at some point ... (Why save if there is no more interest on saved money anyway). Hollywood Strings are also not bad for this type of sound.


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## Kurosawa (May 31, 2021)

Any experience of layering Soaring Strings with CSS? Does it work?


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## Levon (May 31, 2021)

Reasy said:


> I personally love the "brighter" tone of Soaring Strings a lot. It somehow cuts through the mix without sounding annoying in the high frequencies and at the same time there is still a good portion of warmth in it. I have used it recently in a theme for a documentary if anyone is still in need of another user-example:
> 
> 
> (Soaring Strings start at around 0:58)



Really enjoyed your track! 

I've decided to grab Soaring Strings!


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## Soundbed (May 31, 2021)

Levon said:


> I'm still on the fence about Soaring Strings. I've already got Vista. The SS sale is still on today. Is there an advantage to having both in your opinion? Cheers.


They are on opposing side of the brightness spectrum, but directed at a similar use case. Vista has a close mic, SS does not. Vista is inspiring to play. SS is extremely functional and capable, but for me slightly less "inspiring". SS has slightly faster vibrato and slightly more pronounced (louder) legato transitions.


Kurosawa said:


> I'm also still undecided and don't know if I should buy Soaring Strings or go for Vista


I just posted a video that _may_ help (not sure, because some don't like these kinds of videos but others do). 

In this video the mod wheel will not be moving. That is because I am not listening for "interpretations of the legato scripting". I am listening for the legato transitions as scripted / recorded / programmed.



Kurosawa said:


> Any experience of layering Soaring Strings with CSS? Does it work?


I'd say they don't sound too bad together! I would probably put a dynamic lowshelf on SS because there is some sub/low end that peeks through even on the high strings unnecessarily. It brightens up CSS for sure. Really adds some crystalline shine to CSS imho. Some would call it "detail" other would call it a "hyped" high end, subjectively.

Other combinations that work imho: SSS with anything in my video above except CSS. MSS with almost any of the others. Vista with most (all?) of the others. SS with ... all of the others, I think? Need to spend time with my kids on this US holiday now. 



Reasy said:


> I personally love the "brighter" tone of Soaring Strings a lot. It somehow cuts through the mix without sounding annoying in the high frequencies and at the same time there is still a good portion of warmth in it. I have used it recently in a theme for a documentary if anyone is still in need of another user-example:
> 
> 
> (Soaring Strings start at around 0:58)



WOW! This is gorgeous! I will listen to it several times I think.


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## ALittleNightMusic (May 31, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> They are on opposing side of the brightness spectrum, but directed at a similar use case. Vista has a close mic, SS does not. Vista is inspiring to play. SS is extremely functional and capable, but for me slightly less "inspiring". SS has slightly faster vibrato and slightly more pronounced (louder) legato transitions.
> 
> I just posted a video that _may_ help (not sure, because some don't like these kinds of videos but others do).
> 
> ...



Thanks for doing that comparison video! All sounded good to me (not a fan of Soaring String's standalone tone though). Similar comparison I did with the Vista freebie patch which convinced me not to buy it given I have MSS, CSS, SSS (along with HWS and SySP).


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## Soundbed (May 31, 2021)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Thanks for doing that comparison video! All sounded good to me (not a fan of Soaring String's standalone tone though). Similar comparison I did with the Vista freebie patch which convinced me not to buy it given I have MSS, CSS, SSS (along with HWS and SySP).


Thanks for watching! Yes I agree they all sounded good. I found that spending a little time up front to "balance" each instrument section more or less consistently across packages really helped evaluate their differences. (Meaning: some are more "violins heavy" while others are more "cellos heavy" out of the box, if all the Kontakt volumes are at unity.)

About the tone of SS, I expect it will become my blending choice when I want things to be bright and shiny and crystalline. Wonder how different it sounds versus Vista with some OTT  (only half kidding).

I may expand to HWS, VSL Elite and others someday when I have more time. As it is I published that video with at least 3 typos (super rushed) and need to get back to doing what I get paid to do.


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## Futchibon (Jun 27, 2021)

Vista is on sale again for another day at $249. How are people feeling about V and SS these days? I have and love SS but I just love the sound of Vista, and I also love playable libraries, so very tempted. I had trouble splitting the two so went with SS because it was cheaper, but man, Vista sounds so good!


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## ism (Jun 27, 2021)

Here's an (particularly) stupid little noodle I did to just compare Vista to SS (I have SS, but this is using the free 8vs Vls from vista):





It consists of a simple line in Vista, then repeated with SS, then repeated back with Vista on top of some 
Tallinn, then repeated again with SS + Tallinn.

It's a particularly crude noodle, but I think it serves to isolate the difference between the very specific nuance Vista and SS. And it's the smoking gun for me of how (in this particular sweet spot) Vista is in a whole other league over SS


The dimensions of this, I think, are something like this

- the detail of the chamber size sections. It matters less in busier mixes, but the more you leave space in the mix, the more important (and utterly gorgeous) it becomes.

- the spatiality of the tree mic, SS being dry. There's a certain musicality, that I conjecture interacts signficantly with the nuance and detail of the chamber size, and there simply no way to simulate the glorious spatiality of a good tree mic in a good hall. In louder and/or more stylized mixes, SS is fine, but here Vista has a huge advantage.

- the general Vista flowyness of the legatos into the progressive vibrato - which is slightly better than SS at least when exposed, presumably this is Jaspers big innovation. Not sure exactly what this is, but it's certainly very flowy.

- the particular delicacy of the flowing of the legatos/ arcs at lower dynamics - which are somehow more that SS's "defensive" basketball player stance. It's as if the lower vista dynamics allow more vulnerability, whereas SS is more like a basketball team crouching on the defensive, before making the next big push to the soaring higher dynamics. I vastly prefer the Vista lower dynamics to SS's. 

- the slightly more delayed progressive vibrato in Vista as compared to SS.

- the particular warbly quality and intensity of the vibrato, combined with the unobliterated detail of the small section size (again, assuming you leave room for it in the mix).

- the specifics of the dyamics - the 4 dynamics layers is a sine quo non here.

- the choice of soft and hard attack - but especially the soft attack, which I can't get enough of, and note how this echos Tallin and the other OT libraries.

- I think - tentatively - that the Tallin strings tend to somehow "ground" this nuanced quality, possibly in their non-vib contrast, whereas in an busier all Vista mix, you're have to be constantly be careful to not obliterate this nuance.

So is Vista worth the extra $150 over soaring strings? For this kind of nuance, absolutely.


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## Futchibon (Jun 27, 2021)

ism said:


> Here's an (particularly) stupid little noodle I did to just compare Vista to SS (I have SS, but this is using the free 8vs Vls from vista):
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Curse you and your sweet spots ism, they’re costing me a lot of money! 

Seriously though, thanks again for another detailed and thoughtful response. Have you considered doing a thread on your ‘best in class’ opinions of strings and ww libraries? It would be no light undertaking given the detail you put into your posts, but I’m sure it would be hugely appreciated and quickly stickied.

Yes, I’m going to have to get it. It just sounds beautiful.


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## Soundbed (Jul 29, 2021)

Samy Cheboub said:


> When I programmed the Star Wars intro



I listen to this tiny clip about once every two days (on average). Where can I hear the rest?


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## Samy Cheboub (Jul 29, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> I listen to this tiny clip about once every two days (on average). Where can I hear the rest?


here it is :


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## Denkii (Jul 29, 2021)

How the second video ended...





Staypuft would be proud.


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## muziksculp (Jul 29, 2021)

Vista is the Smooth peanut butter string sound.

Soaring Strings is the Crunchy peanut butter string sound.

Both are tasty, but I prefer my peanut butter smooth most of the time.


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## Samy Cheboub (Jul 29, 2021)

The last time I wanted to express how much I love Performance Samples but I realize that I forgot to mention there is also a layer of Soaring Strings (cello and viola) in the strings extract.
Soaring Strings is a great library.


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## Futchibon (Jul 29, 2021)

Samy Cheboub said:


> here it is :


Amazing work Samy! What would be your recommendation for one brass library for orchestral writing? Have you used, and what is your opinion of, Infinite Brass? Cheers


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## Samy Cheboub (Jul 29, 2021)

Futchibon said:


> Amazing work Samy! What would be your recommendation for one brass library for orchestral writing?


Thanks !

It's hard to choose because I use/like everything.

If I had to make a classification :

1_Berlin Brass - Spitfire Symphonic Brass
2_Cinematic Studio Brass - 8dio Century brass
3_Cinebrass - Hollywood brass

The problem is that there is very good stuff in each. For example, I can't live without Cinebrass and yet it is in third position.

Spitfire Symphonic brass or Berlin Brass + Angry Brass Soloists + Majestic horn could be a good "stand-alone combo"



Futchibon said:


> Have you used, and what is your opinion of, Infinite Brass? Cheers


it started badly but it improved a lot. I would definitely buy it someday as Synchron Brass.


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## ism (Jul 29, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Vista is the Smooth peanut butter string sound.
> 
> Soaring Strings is the Crunchy peanut butter string sound.
> 
> Both are tasty, but I prefer my peanut butter smooth most of the time.


Excellent metaphor.


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## VSriHarsha (Jul 29, 2021)

I always liked the tone of Soaring Strings, which is in my buy list.


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## Argy Ottas (Sep 7, 2021)

Samy Cheboub said:


> When I programmed the Star Wars intro, I had to overcome several obstacles to get a credible result. One of them was this "simple" line (attached below). I struggled with it but things started to take shape when I used Con Moto Violins. Among all the violins libraries I own, it was the only one that gave me the tone and the legato I was looking for. Among other things, I also added a layer of Vista (violin, viola, cello) which came out when 99% of the mockup was done...Otherwise I would have used it as the main library.
> 
> I have been programming for over 15 years and after using it on several projects I can say that if I had to keep only one library for legato strings, it would be Vista.
> 
> Jasper has done an amazing job capturing what no other company has managed to capture.



Hi @Samy Cheboub  Really impressive strings programming, well done! 

May I ask you what did you use for the Marcato lines?

I own Con Moto, and I am considering buying either Vista or Pacific.
If I choose Vista, which I love the tone, I will lack in articulations, but listening to your example makes me feel optimistic that such phrases can be achieved by Vista.?

Thank you - AΩ


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