# Orchestral Colors Question: How do you create this sound?



## NathanTiemeyer (Mar 2, 2018)

Hey all! Over the years listening to many soundtracks, I've come across this particular combination in mostly traditional orchestral scores and I absolutely love it.

I've tried to replicate with samples, but I just haven't achieved a result I've been happy with.

In most cases, I believe it's a combination of a xylophone hit, coupled with high winds and high brass all playing together at the same time, usually used for accents in the orchestration. (Although I could be wrong and missing something, so please let me know!)

You can hear it used all the time in John Williams and Alan Silvestri scores, and I've provided an example here so you can guys can actually hear what I'm talking about 



Here's an alternative link if the Youtube link isn't working:
https://clyp.it/zkrn0ans


In this example from Henry Jackman's (brilliant) Jumanji score, from 2:00 on this accent can be heard over and over and is used in many instances.

How would you go about recreating this sound?

What instruments are all actually present to your ears?

What library would you use the xylophone / mallet percussion from? I've yet to hear one that fits well to my ears.

Thanks in advance!


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## bryla (Mar 2, 2018)

Video not available


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## NathanTiemeyer (Mar 2, 2018)

bryla said:


> Video not available


Post updated!


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## NoamL (Mar 2, 2018)

Yeah this is a stereotypical effect. It was even included in *Symphobia 1* as a multi called "Jeep Fight"!  So there can be no doubt Jackman is doing a parody of older composers here.

The effect is made from the following -

1. Trumpets, minor chord in root position
2. Winds, same chord an octave higher
3. Xylo, either doubling winds or an octave above

You can vary it, like at 2:29 he uses horns & trumpets; a few times before that he leaves out the trumpets and just does a wind+xylo chord. It will all sound good as long as you do little "uh oh" gestures with the chords.

I would have to transcribe it, but I think the reason you are getting an Alan Silvestri vibe (I would also name Ira Newborn as a possible influence for this stuff) is because it all revolves around the octatonic scale. Perhaps those minor chords are populated from the underlying octatonic harmony or from the octatonic scale that is shifted one over. Again just a hunch. With the C octatonic scale, you can populate the chords Cm, Ebm, F#m, and Am. Alan Silvestri used this kind of trickery all over_* Predator.*_

By the way, *this is some damn great music.* I will have to check out the entire score... I never knew Jackman was attached to this film. He is one of the absolute best people working in Hollywood right now. _*Wreck It Ralph*_ is another great score full of "old" musical ideas completely rejuvenated and revived.


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## Eric G (Mar 2, 2018)

No need to guess Nathan.

Buy Alan Silvestri's entire score from Back to the Future on http://www.omnimusicpublishing.com/backtofuture.html (Omni Music Publishing). What you are looking for is all over the score with every note and every instrument used to create the effect. 

Which Samples can create the effects? That will be trial and error but what a head start by looking at the exact notes and instruments used.

Oh and they have scores by Goldsmith, Elfman and Horner. I have them all and each one is a revelation.


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## Piano Pete (Mar 2, 2018)

I would probably reach for the instruments that you hear and orchestrate accordingly: trumpet, flute/pic, and xylophone. It only sounds like, as NoamL pointed out, that they are just doubling in octaves, either with the full harmony doubled or not. With this sort of thing, I have seen it done both ways, so it really does not matter whether you add the extra harmonic content; it is personal taste more than anything. For clarity's sake, you may choose to leave the full chord in a single instrument group and double in octaves for the rest. In these moments of harmonic balance, mostly chord voicing, think about how bright you want it to be. That will usually dictate how open you voice a chord. I typically figure this out at the piano, as that is a nice neutral timbre for me to purely react to how the "chord" is balancing. As always, consider the instrument you are writing for and its tendancy in that range. You could easily muddy it up. I hate doing this with samples, as I have found they rarely translate well to the real deal; experience with the real instruments is the best way to develop this mental catalog. 

In this situation, you should just be able to grab those exact instruments, use either staccato, staccatissimo, or marcato patches and go to town. I do not know if a specific library is going to be your cure-all. Start experimenting and alter the ranges/notes to fit whatever texture you are working with. If it is punch you are looking for, if you have short/loud sample patches, how you orchestrate it will determine the success--of course this is without me knowing any specifics; this is a general statement. One of the first things I would suggest to consider is to take care and listen to the displacement in register between the contrasting sections. This sort of juxtaposition will help it snap to the foreground. Additionally, near the beginning of the example, the trombones help add some umph to the stab; you may experiment more with this or not. 

Happy hunting!


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## NoamL (May 3, 2018)

Hey Nathan! Thanks for introducing me to this score a couple months ago. I ended up creating a mockup of it in my spare time. PM me if you want the MIDI transcription.


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## NathanTiemeyer (May 4, 2018)

NoamL said:


> Hey Nathan! Thanks for introducing me to this score a couple months ago. I ended up creating a mockup of it in my spare time. PM me if you want the MIDI transcription.



Hey Noam! You're very welcome! I would absolutely love a copy of the MIDI! That's so incredibly generous of you! :D PM sent!

So, speaking of this thread ... After seeing Avengers: Infinity War, I have listened to Alan Silvestri's wonderful score for it over and over again. I can honestly say this is the most epic and emotional score of Silvestri's career! (Not to mention, the film is incredible!)

Anyway, here's an excerpt from a track used in the movie which Silvestri calls upon this wonderful orchestral color once again!


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## fixxer49 (May 4, 2018)

NoamL said:


> Hey Nathan! Thanks for introducing me to this score a couple months ago. I ended up creating a mockup of it in my spare time. PM me if you want the MIDI transcription.


ahhh - NOW i remember why i picked up the OST! my thanks as well @NathanTiemeyer. i loved the sound of this OST and have been using it as a reference for the last few months (including on the goldsmith transcription i posted a while back.) they nailed the "throwback" vibe.


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