# Gibson files for bankruptcy



## gsilbers (May 1, 2018)

yep .. finally happened 

https://www.musicradar.com/news/gibson-files-for-bankruptcy


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## fretti (May 1, 2018)

Wasn't that just a matter of time?


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## MatFluor (May 1, 2018)

Here official announcement from the Claim Agent:

https://cases.primeclerk.com/gibson/


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## pmcrockett (May 1, 2018)

Maybe BandLab will buy them and release their guitars for free.


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## gsilbers (May 1, 2018)

so., wouldnt be time to buy an epiphone ? or wait? 

also, do you guys think guitar center will suffer or they would just get another set of brands?


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## fretti (May 1, 2018)

gsilbers said:


> so., wouldnt be time to buy an epiphone ? or wait?
> 
> also, do you guys think guitar center will suffer or they would just get another set of brands?


When I look at my local music store they already have lot's of other brands. Gibson and Epiphone are maybe 20% of their whole stock...but given how dusty many of them are, they will probably have a few in stock for the next years.
Also already have an Epiphone. Great guitar, but the originally white neck is more yellow nowadays so probably want to go for something darker


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## whinecellar (May 1, 2018)

Maybe in a crazy twist Opcode will rise from the dead and rescue them...


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## Fab (May 1, 2018)

ahh man that would suck, luckily I own the guitar I want already. Surely they will be bought up, or a deal of sorts then we shouldn't see much deviation from the standards and production quality right?


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## gsilbers (May 1, 2018)

there are some articles the ceo saying its due to change in tastes, purists who only want 50s era guitars and rosewood legal imports. 
but if they had the ability to have tascam, cakewalk, onkio etc.. they coudlnt of easily done a much better job in having better synergy amont them. 
its not secret that guitar based music has going down hill for a while. yet plenty of guitar centers with tons of guitars no one is checking out. and barley any home audio prodcuts. guitar center imo is the next one to go if they dont clean up their act. 
gibsons has an enormous brand recognition and could of transition to all things home pro audio. bring in all those guitar players to the computer music world. have good interfaces, or ways to combine interfaces with plugins and software like UAD and native instruments is doing. somehow leverage physical products vs software. 
but im guessing that since the headquarters is in nashville tenesee they thought guitar and guitar based music will keep on thriving and somehow millenials would get with it... somehow. so imo its a managing issue and holding on to the past too strong. 
im guessing a chinese company holding will buy them up and use the brand name. although, its a lot of debt.


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## Soundhound (May 1, 2018)

I don't know the details, but Gibson's policies have alienated a lot of people for a long time. Heritage was started by Gibson employees and they've been making the great Gibson guitars the last 20 years. I've got a Japanese Les Paul that's the best I've ever had.

For people of my generation, Gibson and Fender were the two main food groups. Oh well, nobody really plays guitar much any more these days. A lot of people strum them, but not many people play the shit out of them. (shredding doesn't count, faster isn't better)


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## gsilbers (May 1, 2018)

Soundhound said:


> I don't know the details, but Gibson's policies have alienated a lot of people for a long time. Heritage was started by Gibson employees and they've been making the great Gibson guitars the last 20 years. I've got a Japanese Les Paul that's the best I've ever had.
> 
> For people of my generation, Gibson and Fender were the two main food groups. Oh well, nobody really plays guitar much any more these days. A lot of people strum them, but not many people play the shit out of them. (shredding doesn't count, faster isn't better)



i went the other day to guitar center and saw some very good epiphones and next to them where lower cost gibsons that where double the price. the epiphones looked and felt much better. and i see the comparisons in youtube vs high gibsons and seems, imo, a huge stretch to market the real gibsons with a huge markup while the epiphones seemed almost , if not the same. its a 60 year old technology so it seems hard that nowadays it cannot be made at a cheaper pricepoint. i mean, they should cost more if they are made beter etc. but $2k to me just feels wrong. 

they had several competing products, a wierd product category and no real ryme or reason why one guitar would be better than another one. so its hard to choose or figure out. gibsons are better just didnt cut it for me. there where several re-issues or the gibson les paul. you say there is a japanese version... and there is several epiphones and everything just mushed together in a sea of obtuse choices filling a 2 story wall that no one grabs past the 2 row. 

gibsons should of enter the world of computer music a long long time ago. do the amp modeling/midi guitar/DAW /interface integration and get a whole bunch of gibsons loyal customer from baby boomers to gen x.


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## ironbut (May 1, 2018)

gsilbers said:


> so., wouldnt be time to buy an epiphone ? or wait?
> 
> also, do you guys think guitar center will suffer or they would just get another set of brands?



https://www.digitalmusicnews.com/2018/04/17/guitar-center-bankruptcy/


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## DoctorGuitar007 (May 1, 2018)

I know many of Gibson’s current problems are being blamed on their current CEO, but the quality issue has been around for years. Even back when I bought my Les Paul in 2004 I was told to ensure I tried the guitars in store and if I found one I liked to buy that exact model; new Strats at half the price could safely be bought, untried, on-line, but never Gibsons.


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## gsilbers (May 1, 2018)

ironbut said:


> https://www.digitalmusicnews.com/2018/04/17/guitar-center-bankruptcy/



hey! thats the guitar center i go to in westwood and pico blvd.


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## ironbut (May 1, 2018)

Looks like a nice one (my local is strip mall city!).
Some folks are saying GC's closing would bring back mom and pop music stores?
Personally, I never liked the big box concept for music stores. 
Terrible places to hang out!


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## lumcas (May 1, 2018)

Can't wait to see the first batch of Gibson by Behringer cheap guitars


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## fretti (May 1, 2018)

Chinese Holdings have the money though, and they often (/always) only want the name of the brand.


gsilbers said:


> i went the other day to guitar center and saw some very good epiphones and next to them where lower cost gibsons that where double the price. the epiphones looked and felt much better. and i see the comparisons in youtube vs high gibsons and seems, imo, a huge stretch to market the real gibsons with a huge markup while the epiphones seemed almost , if not the same. its a 60 year old technology so it seems hard that nowadays it cannot be made at a cheaper pricepoint. i mean, they should cost more if they are made beter etc. but $2k to me just feels wrong.
> 
> they had several competing products, a wierd product category and no real ryme or reason why one guitar would be better than another one. so its hard to choose or figure out. gibsons are better just didnt cut it for me. there where several re-issues or the gibson les paul. you say there is a japanese version... and there is several epiphones and everything just mushed together in a sea of obtuse choices filling a 2 story wall that no one grabs past the 2 row.
> 
> gibsons should of enter the world of computer music a long long time ago. do the amp modeling/midi guitar/DAW /interface integration and get a whole bunch of gibsons loyal customer from baby boomers to gen x.


Well Epiphone is part of Gibson...
It‘s like with Nike shoes, without the logo they are sold for 50 instead of 150 or even more. A friend of mine bought a Gibson Les Paul in 2014 for ~2500€ I think it was. I played it and it‘s neither better nor worse then my Hagström or Lag (wich cost together still less than his Gibson). It‘s quality wise nothing special. For the price the minimum I expect.


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## PaulBrimstone (May 1, 2018)

gsilbers said:


> hey! thats the guitar center i go to in westwood and pico blvd.


After pecan pie at the Apple Pan!


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## ptram (May 1, 2018)

gsilbers said:


> but if they had the ability to have tascam, cakewalk, onkio etc.. they coudlnt of easily done a much better job in having better synergy amont them.


I couldn't even imagine that the very weak presence of Tascam, with exellent products for which you couldn't even reach a support contact, was due to import issues with rosewood. I was thinking it was a matter of great creatives with a desperate lack of management.

Paolo


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## gsilbers (May 1, 2018)

ptram said:


> I couldn't even imagine that the very weak presence of Tascam, with exellent products for which you couldn't even reach a support contar, was due to import issues with rosewood. I was thinking it was a matter of great creatives with a desperate lack of management.
> 
> Paolo


lol

they could easily spin off tascam+cakewalk+gibson(epiphone) to an all in one bundle. 

seems the main burden was that 2014 aquisition of a electornic company (okayio maybe?) where they went the other way to consumer market. maybe they thought baby boomers who buy guitars will buy gibson line of electronic stuff?


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## Mattzart (May 1, 2018)

gsilbers said:


> hey! thats the guitar center i go to in westwood and pico blvd.



Haven't been to that one in almost a decade. Bought some M-Audio monitors from there. Is it true Guitar Center got rid of the pro audio section? I used to feel like a kid in a toy store walking in there.


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## KEM (May 1, 2018)

Was always a Fender guy myself, but it’s crazy to see such a monumental brand like Gibson file for bankruptcy, but given that they always sold so-so quality guitars for $5k and up I’m not that surprised it caught up with them.


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## SoNowWhat? (May 1, 2018)

This makes me sad but, only in recognition of the history of Gibson. As @KEM says, they've been selling a product that does not match with its price point for many years and I guess that's caught up with them. Along with some questionable decisions by management and prevailing market forces. We will see what falls out of this eventually I guess.


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## MaxOctane (May 1, 2018)

gsilbers said:


> its not secret that guitar based music has going down hill for a while. yet plenty of guitar centers with tons of guitars no one is checking out. and barley any home audio prodcuts. guitar center imo is the next one to go if they dont clean up their act.



Hard to imagine otherwise. Guitar Center has massive stores ($$$ in rent) and tons of employees, but I've spent very little with them over the years because their inventory just isn't interesting to me. In 20 years, I've bought a bass, an electric, and two acoustics (~$4200 total).

Now these days I'll just plunk down $300 for the new Spitfire or Sonokinetic, several times a year.

And as for hardware products, GC never has what I want in stock. Lots of giant keyboards... who's buying those in enough bulk to keep them afloat?? Meanwhile the rest of the world is Euroracking and buying small components for the corner of their bedrooms....


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## gsilbers (May 1, 2018)

MaxOctane said:


> Hard to imagine otherwise. Guitar Center has massive stores ($$$ in rent) and tons of employees, but I've spent very little with them over the years because their inventory just isn't interesting to me. In 20 years, I've bought a bass, an electric, and two acoustics (~$4200 total).
> 
> Now these days I'll just plunk down $300 for the new Spitfire or Sonokinetic, several times a year.
> 
> And as for hardware products, GC never has what I want in stock. Lots of giant keyboards... who's buying those in enough bulk to keep them afloat?? Meanwhile the rest of the world is Euroracking and buying small components for the corner of their bedrooms....



so true. 

i wanted to get a small audio interface and they only had two. the apollo and the scarlett. but they had tons of those huge piano players romplayer that i hardly see anyone buying. also the guitars... so many of the same thing. 

there is so much gear that couldbe sold thats on the home recording market. euroracks is a perfect example. 
so many of those desktop type synths. even software of at least a place to try them.


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## gsilbers (May 1, 2018)

Mattzart said:


> Haven't been to that one in almost a decade. Bought some M-Audio monitors from there. Is it true Guitar Center got rid of the pro audio section? I used to feel like a kid in a toy store walking in there.



it looked very cool back then. 
the mall infront (pico mall) is also going be shut down and production offices will take its place btw.


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## John57 (May 1, 2018)

I remember that a Radio Shack that had a pro audio section in Denver at one time.
I remember Mars and had brought equipment from them. Gone

I also remember Robb's music which I brought my Korg M1 at the time. The sales people were very smart and so much fun to work with as well. Gone

Guitar Center, I could care less. They had the software and hardware but no service. They had MIDI controllers that I was interested in but only one sales people in the store with customers waiting. They shot themselves in the foot.


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## Steve Lum (May 1, 2018)

pmcrockett said:


> Maybe BandLab will buy them and release their guitars for free.



Insider joke of the week award, richly deserved, brilliant.


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## Mattzart (May 1, 2018)

gsilbers said:


> it looked very cool back then.
> the mall infront (pico mall) is also going be shut down and production offices will take its place btw.



The westside pavilion is being shut down?!? I thought it was just the Macy's, no?

I moved back to Venice last year after 5 years away and lots of new development since then. Some streets are unrecognizable these days.


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## PaulBrimstone (May 2, 2018)

gsilbers said:


> it looked very cool back then.
> the mall infront (pico mall) is also going be shut down and production offices will take its place btw.


The mall was never the same after the bookstore closed down.


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## Leon Portelance (May 2, 2018)

I still love my 1955 Les Paul gold top and 1970 Dove.


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## Zak Rahman (May 3, 2018)

lumcas said:


> Can't wait to see the first batch of Gibson by Behringer cheap guitars



They're called "Harley Benton". They are fast getting a good reputation. I tried one of their 7-strings with active pickups and fanned frets. It is incredibly fun to play. The intonation is perfect. It stays in tune. Part of me wanted to hate it because it was so cheap, but actually I have used it for plenty of recordings since getting it. It's not like the clients can tell the difference anyway hahaha.


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## ghostnote (May 3, 2018)

Soundhound said:


> For people of my generation, Gibson and Fender were the two main food groups. Oh well, nobody really plays guitar much any more these days. A lot of people strum them, but not many people play the shit out of them. (shredding doesn't count, faster isn't better)



Honestly. I used to play Gibson, they're great, but their quality went down over the years and they missed common trends. Yes, I'm not a fan of trends either, but if I can choose between a heavy guitar with a thick neck, with limited playability on the higher frets and a japanese made, hi quality guitar, with much better playing comfort for half of the price, then they screwed up if you ask me. Albeit that those superstrat models pushed the whole guitar thing into a sports thing.


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## fretti (May 3, 2018)

ghostnote said:


> Honestly. I used to play Gibson, they're great, but their quality went down over the years and they missed common trends. Yes, I'm not a fan of trends either, but if I can choose between a heavy guitar with a thick neck, with limited playability on the higher frets and a japanese made, hi quality guitar, with much better playing comfort for half of the price, then they screwed up if you ask me. Albeit that those superstrat models pushed the whole guitar thing into a sports thing.


Yeah my Lag „Les Paul“ weighs probably 1/3 of a Gibson...have to admire how Slash was able to run around the stage for 2h while being drunk with that weight


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## Tod (May 3, 2018)

I've got an Epiphone Sherdan (made by Gibson) I bought in 1963. Everything is original, including the Bigsby. It's in mint condition except it needs a fret job and the finish on the back is pretty worn. It's always been my goto guitar and I played it professionally for over 40 years.

My left hand went numb on me about 12 years ago and I reluctantly had to put it aside. I have no desire to sell it, I keep thinking, someday, maybe, ha ha.


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