# Help choosing a Midi controller. SL Mixface or Icon Platform for Logic ?



## AntonR (Nov 2, 2020)

Hello, I'm on the way to buy a controller which will replace Touch OSC.
I've read a lot about both products, but some points are not 100% clear

I'm on Mac with Logic and use an Icon Keayboard. I don't need the transport functions and can live without mixing with it. It's mainly for CC's.

1. Icon Platform X+ : Does it works without the M+ ? Easy to assign midi CC's in Logic ?

2. SL Mixface : Any problems with Logic Pro or if my keyboard is not a StudioLogic ?

3. Extra question : Why people seem to don't like motorized faders for midi CC ?

Thanks!
Anton


----------



## JonS (Nov 2, 2020)

I got an SL Mixface before they dropped the price by $50 and highly recommend it!!


----------



## AntonR (Nov 2, 2020)

JonS said:


> I got an SL Mixface before they dropped the price by $50 and highly recommend it!!


Tanks for your answer. Are you using it with Logic and another keyboard than the SL series ?
Is the CC assignation easy in Logic ?


----------



## JonS (Nov 2, 2020)

AntonR said:


> Tanks for your answer. Are you using it with Logic and another keyboard than the SL series ?
> Is the CC assignation easy in Logic ?


I use it with DP and assigning CC is easy peasy Japanesey.


----------



## stonzthro (Nov 2, 2020)

AntonR said:


> 3. Extra question : Why people seem to don't like motorized faders for midi CC ?



AFAIK there is no such thing barring some workarounds. I did have is somewhat working with an old Mackie controller, but there were serious issues of reliability. Would be great to have for sure!


----------



## rojarvi (Nov 2, 2020)

I’m not using Logic but have been using Cubase on Mac with SL Mixface - in both wired and wireless mode. Also, I’m not aware of any shortcomings when not using SL keyboard. I don’t have one. It’s a solid unit and I chose it over Icon because of Bluetooth. I can also highly recommend it.


----------



## ALittleNightMusic (Nov 2, 2020)

I have the Mixface and it is awesome in many ways - but I don’t like that you can’t change the fader caps to make them easier to grab for midi CC control and they’re stiff. So I bought a Nakedboards MC-8 which is great (and has longer faders).


----------



## scoringdreams (Nov 2, 2020)

I own the Mixface, and can say that the faders matter a lot, motorised of not. And the Mixface does not have grip-friendly faders - I would recommend the MC-8 or Icon option if you need the feel of a real fader.


----------



## AntonR (Nov 3, 2020)

Thank you all for your input! That's really helpful.

- I thought about the nakedboard but i'm not sure because of what I read concerning the configuration. It looks a bit difficult for me :/

- I get the point concerning the faders of the Mixface. It would need 2 fingers per fader instead of 1, right?
That would be ok.

- I finally found the answer concerning the Platform X+. It seems to work alone even if presented as an 'extension' of the M+.
I would still be grateful if somebody can share their experience with the CC assignation on Icon Platform, because I had already some troubles with the commands of an Icon-keyboard.

Sorry for my english, and thanks again!


----------



## rojarvi (Nov 3, 2020)

Yeah, I'm using faders of Mixface by 2 fingers (sort of pinch) and agree that if you want to do some very fast controlling by throwing the faders around quickly it might not be the best for that use case. But on the other hand, these faders are solid and accurate.

For quick control stuff I'd suggest testing Android tablet with TouchOSC and setting up a XY pad there. I'm experimenting with one atm.


----------



## StefanE (Nov 3, 2020)

AntonR said:


> I would still be grateful if somebody can share their experience with the CC assignation on Icon Platform, because I had already some troubles with the commands of an Icon-keyboard.


It's very easy to configure. I use it with Cubase/Win for several CC and all the buttons as keyswitches. The quality is very good. I am a newby and selected it because the long faders (100mm) have been recommended by a lot very experienced people. For me it seems a bit too long. I also underestimated the size of the platform. If these two aspect are no issue for you I would buy it again.


----------



## AntonR (Nov 3, 2020)

StefanE said:


> It's very easy to configure. I use it with Cubase/Win for several CC and all the buttons as keyswitches. The quality is very good. I am a newby and selected it because the long faders (100mm) have been recommended by a lot very experienced people. For me it seems a bit too long. I also underestimated the size of the platform. If these two aspect are no issue for you I would buy it again.


Cool ! Are you talking about the X+ or M+ ?


----------



## StefanE (Nov 3, 2020)

AntonR said:


> Cool ! Are you talking about the X+ or M+ ?


X+


----------



## AntonR (Nov 3, 2020)

Ok, I was starting to get used to the idea of the 60 mm faders of the Mixface with 2 fingers...

I hesitate now again 

So the X+ should work with Logic but it's true that the faders look maybe too long for my needs

At least it's good to know that both products are possible with my setup


EDIT :

After more research, it seems not so easy finally. Logic users have some issues with Icon products (as I experienced already). So I won't go with the Icon Platform.

Concerning the Mixface, I still don't know if the CC assignation works fine in Logic Pro. Can somebody confirm it ?


----------



## Paulogic (Dec 7, 2020)

I'm considering the MixFace too because I could also use the buttons for changing keyswitches.
I think that the fadercaps could be easily changed with those from DJ TechTools.
Their Chroma caps only cost a few €/$ for a set and are compatible with a lot of faders.


----------



## swampskeleton (Dec 7, 2020)

AntonR said:


> After more research, it seems not so easy finally. Logic users have some issues with Icon products (as I experienced already). So I won't go with the Icon Platform.


Looking into the Platform M+ for use in Logic myself. What have you learned in particular?


----------



## Loïc D (Dec 8, 2020)

Paulogic said:


> I'm considering the MixFace too because I could also use the buttons for changing keyswitches.
> I think that the fadercaps could be easily changed with those from DJ TechTools.
> Their Chroma caps only cost a few €/$ for a set and are compatible with a lot of faders.


I’m in the same boat.
I would replace the caps by fader caps.
Can any SL user here confirm it’s possible?


----------



## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 8, 2020)

Loïc D said:


> I’m in the same boat.
> I would replace the caps by fader caps.
> Can any SL user here confirm it’s possible?



Not that I have found - granted I didn’t pull on them extremely hard. I don’t think they come off though.


----------



## JonS (Dec 8, 2020)

Love the SL Mixface!!


----------



## AntonR (Dec 9, 2020)

swampskeleton said:


> Looking into the Platform M+ for use in Logic myself. What have you learned in particular?


Sorry I can't remember exactly because I made this research 1 month ago, but I found bad comments from logic users. Probably on google, youtube and thomann. It was enough to discourage me as I already owned an Icon keyboard and the midi functions never worked, even with the built in 'logic pro mode'. The customer service answered to my request 2 years later to tell me that they had lost my request!
Since that time I'm on the fence about Icon.


----------



## Kent (Dec 9, 2020)

I just got the X+ and had no issues with Logic. (I did have an issue connecting it to my computer but once I understood it doesn’t like my hub all was well.) tested out the stock “Logic Pro” setting, which was flawless, but am using it for motorless CC control, which is also flawless. YMMV.


----------



## Gerbil (Dec 9, 2020)

Loïc D said:


> I’m in the same boat.
> I would replace the caps by fader caps.
> Can any SL user here confirm it’s possible?


I wouldn't want to try! I have no problem using two or three faders with one hand on the Mixface, although I prefer to just use one and an expression pedal.


----------



## swampskeleton (Dec 9, 2020)

AntonR said:


> The customer service answered to my request 2 years later to tell me that they had lost my request!
> Since that time I'm on the fence about Icon.


Yikes, this and the user above mentioning trouble with USB hubs are enough to keep me away. Thanks for sharing your experiences.


----------



## Marsen (Dec 9, 2020)

AntonR said:


> I would still be grateful if somebody can share their experience with the CC assignation on Icon Platform, because I had already some troubles with the commands of an Icon-keyboard.
> 
> Sorry for my english, and thanks again!



So, here I am.
Logic User and owner of Icon M+, using it just as an Midi- Controller.
It does work. Midi-CC programming is super easy.
The faders are from high quality.

The only con is: Sometimes CC's ars hanging (like in sleepmode). You have to move the faders a couple of times, and it's working again. But I heard these problems even from the most expensive faderboxes. (Don't remember the name, Christian Henson is using them too).

The bad reviews regarding Icon on Youtube are related to the transport and Plug-in control usability, which can indeed be a pain in the ass.
But as far as you're using it just as Midi CC faders, all is fine. The 100mm faders are very nice for perfect dynamic rides in combination of dynamics & expression. I also use it for vibrato.


----------



## Marsen (Dec 9, 2020)

swampskeleton said:


> Yikes, this and the user above mentioning trouble with USB hubs are enough to keep me away. Thanks for sharing your experiences.



I have it connected to a usb-hub: No problem at all.


----------



## Kent (Dec 9, 2020)

Marsen said:


> I have it connected to a usb-hub: No problem at all.


Yeah, I got a new hub and so far no issues here either. My old one was just old.


----------



## Loïc D (Dec 9, 2020)

So, mixface users, is a 50mm fader long enough to ride CCs? 

TBH, I’ve spent hours trying to turn my MCU Pro to a midi controller using BOME, but it’s a pita (long, not stable, and the lack of CC feedback from Logic when playing makes this half-useless).


----------



## swampskeleton (Dec 9, 2020)

Cool! Good to know there are workarounds and Icon Platform success stories as well.

If anyone ever finds a way to get the motors playing back CC data (on any control surface) in Logic lmk! From what I've read here and elsewhere, there is no elegant way to do this at present. For now, I am going to put an order in for the MC-8 and save a bit of $/desk space.


----------



## Loïc D (Dec 9, 2020)

swampskeleton said:


> If anyone ever finds a way to get the motors playing back CC data (on any control surface) in Logic lmk! From what I've read here and elsewhere, there is no elegant way to do this at present.


I confirm.
Not possible.
Your only hope comes from Smart Controls but that would require a hell of a time to set it for each track of a 200+ template. Even so, it’s not guaranteed to function well. And it will ride the automation of SmartControl linked to the CC, not the CC itself - yes there’s a difference in Logic.


----------



## swampskeleton (Dec 9, 2020)

Gotcha, yes I recently saw a thread on Logic Pro Help about this process (using a custom script by Ski of Artz ID) and wondered if that was a possible hack. Seems laborious to setup indeed, and if you want to add a new track mid composition you're out of luck... I wonder if there is any other hope in Logic's scripter plugin? Exploring that is a bit out of my league.


----------



## Paulogic (Dec 10, 2020)

That hubs can give problems is well known, Win or Mac. If you have a decent, recent powered USB
hub, everything works fine. I had issues before with NI S61, Modal Skulpt and some other USB
devices.

I read in a review that the icon's work fine, but need to reboot as you switch from DAW control to
Midi control, is this correct? Then the mixface would be easier as only a button press will do the
switch.


----------



## Loïc D (Dec 10, 2020)

Paulogic said:


> I read in a review that the icon's work fine, but need to reboot as you switch from DAW control to
> Midi control, is this correct?


Yes, I don’t own it but I’ve seen reviews.



Paulogic said:


> Then the mixface would be easier as only a button press will do the
> switch.


Yes, that’s a big advantage for this device imho.

On an MCU, hitting shift+instruments, then Flip allows a fader control for Smart Controls. Iirc there’s a feedback from Logic to the device that allows moving faders and ride automation on the fly (touch mode).
But it’s automation, not CC lanes : if you display Modulation in edit, the lane is flat. Not a universal solution then.


----------



## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 10, 2020)

Loïc D said:


> So, mixface users, is a 50mm fader long enough to ride CCs?
> 
> TBH, I’ve spent hours trying to turn my MCU Pro to a midi controller using BOME, but it’s a pita (long, not stable, and the lack of CC feedback from Logic when playing makes this half-useless).



It’s better than a Nanokontrol (which I believe is shorter) but not as good as the Nakedboards MC-8 which has longer faders.


----------



## Marsen (Dec 10, 2020)

45mm faders...


----------



## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 11, 2020)

Good news for SL Mixface owners - I've confirmed with Studio-Logic that the faders are removable (just use a flathead screwdriver to pop them off). I've ordered some new caps and will be testing them out this weekend. The fader throw is shorter than the MC-8 (and the faders on the Mixface also seem stiffer so maybe not as good for CC control), but the Mixface does have additional features like DAW control.


----------



## Paulogic (Dec 11, 2020)

I assumed this would be possible. Most faders have the same kind of build for the caps.
We already did this on our low-budget stereo/disco mixers 40 years ago.
We were all going to be professional dj's...LOL


----------



## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 12, 2020)

Looks and works great - so much better for my purposes than their default caps.


----------



## Gerbil (Dec 12, 2020)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Looks and works great - so much better for my purposes than their default caps.


Do the faders edge right up next to the knobs?


----------



## Loïc D (Dec 12, 2020)

Gerbil said:


> Do the faders edge right up next to the knobs?


My question too, what would be the ideal cap dimension ?
Can it handle long ones like on MCU, Avid S3, etc.?


----------



## JonS (Dec 12, 2020)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Looks and works great - so much better for my purposes than their default caps.


Those caps look great!! Where did you get them and what kind are they?


----------



## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 12, 2020)

Gerbil said:


> Do the faders edge right up next to the knobs?



There's a little clearance so the knobs can still turn. The faders are elevated more than the stock ones (higher off the board), but doesn't impact anything.



JonS said:


> Those caps look great!! Where did you get them and what kind are they?



Amazon -


----------



## JonS (Dec 12, 2020)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Looks and works great - so much better for my purposes than their default caps.


Those look amazing. Just ordered same ones in white with a black stripe!!


----------



## Paulogic (Dec 13, 2020)

Very nice. When you use them, does the mixface move to? I know it has magnets to
"glue" itself to a SL keyb but on a desk it may be moving easily.


----------



## Gerbil (Dec 13, 2020)

Paulogic said:


> Very nice. When you use them, does the mixface move to? I know it has magnets to
> "glue" itself to a SL keyb but on a desk it may be moving easily.


It comes with a very effective rubber sheet that prevents any travelling.

I took the faders off my old PC1600 and they fit perfectly, if a little high, but I'm fine with the pinch caps so put them back.


----------



## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 13, 2020)

Paulogic said:


> Very nice. When you use them, does the mixface move to? I know it has magnets to
> "glue" itself to a SL keyb but on a desk it may be moving easily.



Doesn’t move if I use the rubber mat it comes with.

However, I do prefer the MC-8 for MIDI CC control. And in terms of DAW functions / mixer, I have my Kontrol S61 in front of me which works better (and I may grab a Aoftube Console 1 Fader). So, probably going to be selling the Mixface.


----------



## Windbag (Dec 15, 2020)

swampskeleton said:


> [...]If anyone ever finds a way to get the motors playing back CC data (on any control surface) in Logic lmk! [...]



I'll have to dig it out as I haven't been using it but I have a Behringer Motor 61 that I got specifically for tonewheel work, and I recall getting at least as far as having the faders move to match drawbar presets. That was the whole idea as I didn't want to mess around with latching if I keyswitched in some preset and broke the fader-drawer position link.


----------



## Gert Keunen (Dec 18, 2020)

Marsen said:


> So, here I am.
> Logic User and owner of Icon M+, using it just as an Midi- Controller.
> It does work. Midi-CC programming is super easy.
> The faders are from high quality.
> ...


Dear Marson, good to read, but also very frustrating: for days I'm trying to set up a M+ and/or a X+ as a custom Midi-controller, but without succes. Looks everywhere, tried a lot of things, but the faders are not corresponding the CC's I programmed in iMap. Just can't find where the problem is.
I followed the official video for custom setup made by icon, I tried to unplug all other controllers, I tried different settings in Device setup, etc etc. Also midi-learn is not working.
Any tips? 
(I work with Cubase Pro 11 and iMac Catalina)


----------



## Marsen (Dec 18, 2020)

Gert Keunen said:


> I followed the official video for custom setup made by icon, I tried to unplug all other controllers, I tried different settings in Device setup, etc etc. Also midi-learn is not working.
> Any tips?
> (I work with Cubase Pro 11 and iMac Catalina)


Do you mean this video?


----------



## Gert Keunen (Dec 18, 2020)

Marsen said:


> Do you mean this video?



yep!


----------



## Marsen (Dec 18, 2020)

Here you see, how I have programmed it, using the faders from CC1, CC11, CC21 and so on.


----------



## Gert Keunen (Dec 18, 2020)

Marsen said:


> Here you see, how I have programmed it, using the faders from CC1, CC11, CC21 and so on.


OK, thanks. I did the same. 
So, after programming iMap and Send Data:
- opening Cubase: M+ is not corresponding
- so: turn off M+, turn is on again (in Consumer Define Mode) and then opening Cubase: M+ is corresponding (and device is set-up in Device Setup/ Mackie Control)
- but: no CC-messages are send from M+ to Cubase

I tried this with only M+/B+ connected; with only X+ connected (directly to the iMac): no succes.
With all my other equipment (Komplete Kontrol S61, Maschine mikro, Touché, Joué, CC121), there is no problem; all midi-signals are like they have to be.
also: in MPC-mode, the M+/B+/X+ are working perfectly. But NOT in consumer mode. 
Just can't find where the problem is (I also send a ticket to iCon, but no answer)
Anyone here has an idea?


----------



## Marsen (Dec 18, 2020)

Gert Keunen said:


> OK, thanks. I did the same.
> So, after programming iMap and Send Data:
> - opening Cubase: M+ is not corresponding
> - so: turn off M+, turn is on again (in Consumer Define Mode) and then opening Cubase: M+ is corresponding (and device is set-up in Device Setup/ Mackie Control)
> ...


Icon support is very very slow, but they react fast on Youtube comments.

Did you change the mode on the hardware controller?
I don't remember excactly how it was, but one of the faders get redlighted.
Also, I don't know wether it has something to do with Catalina (I'm on Mojave).


----------



## Fabrice321 (Mar 28, 2021)

OK, thanks. I did the same.


Gert Keunen said:


> So, after programming iMap and Send Data:
> - opening Cubase: M+ is not corresponding
> - so: turn off M+, turn is on again (in Consumer Define Mode) and then opening Cubase: M+ is corresponding (and device is set-up in Device Setup/ Mackie Control)
> - but: no CC-messages are send from M+ to Cubase
> ...


Hi, since the post,
Is someone has figured out this problem with CC’s on the plateform m+ ? It seems that a lot of people want to use the plateform as a midi controler 

I’m on logic and I have the same problem, the message does not transit.

if someone has a answer, don’t hesitate 😀

thanks


----------



## Kent (Mar 28, 2021)

Fabrice321 said:


> OK, thanks. I did the same.
> 
> Hi, since the post,
> Is someone has figured out this problem with CC’s on the plateform m+ ? It seems that a lot of people want to use the plateform as a midi controler
> ...


I use the X+ as a CC controller with Logic, and the only problem I encountered during setup was that it didn’t like the hub I was using. Plugging directly into the computer works great.


----------



## Fabrice321 (Mar 28, 2021)

kmaster said:


> I use the X+ as a CC controller with Logic, and the only problem I encountered during setup was that it didn’t like the hub I was using. Plugging directly into the computer works great.


Thanks 

what version do you use ? Perhaps it’s this,

I’m in 2.15 beta and I tried 2.03 but nothing is sent.
I’m on Mac (Big Sur)


----------



## Kent (Mar 28, 2021)

Fabrice321 said:


> Thanks
> 
> what version do you use ? Perhaps it’s this,
> 
> ...


Can't help with Big Sur—I did it on Catalina!

However, I used 2.06, I think.


----------



## PaulieDC (Jun 10, 2021)

Gerbil said:


> Do the faders edge right up next to the knobs?


I found ones that do. Posted a link:





FINALLY Found the Right Fader Caps for the StudioLogic MixFace


I ordered these fader caps from China, arrived today and they are exactly what we need for expression and vibrato, etc, on the MixFace. First, the final outcome: I only want the expression sliders with the new caps, I'm OK with ther pinch version for the remainder which are SpitFire and Berlin...




vi-control.net


----------



## Westher (Jul 14, 2021)

Someone in here using the SL Mixface in Studio One? If so, can you explain how to get the faders to send midi cc data? f.e. in an orchestral library CC11 is often mapped to "expression". How can I add midi cc to the fader so I can automate the expression while playing?
Pretty much the same as the modwheel on a midi keboard is CC 1 by default.
Thanks!


----------

