# Disney buys Lucasfilm + Star Wars 7



## noiseboyuk (Oct 30, 2012)

http://edit.hollywoodreporter.com/news/disney-buy-lucasfilm-405-billion-384448 (http://edit.hollywoodreporter.com/news/ ... ion-384448)


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## Brian Ralston (Oct 30, 2012)

Yup. From Variety!



> *Disney buys LucasFilm, new 'Star Wars' pic planned
> Walt Disney Co. pays $4.05 billion for George Lucas' company*
> 
> _By: MARC GRASER_
> ...


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## spectrum (Oct 30, 2012)

Whoa!!


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## Brian Ralston (Oct 30, 2012)

from The Mouse directly with more details.

http://thewaltdisneycompany.com/disney-news/press-releases/2012/10/disney-acquire-lucasfilm-ltd


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## José Herring (Oct 30, 2012)

That's like a tectonic plate shifting.


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## madbulk (Oct 30, 2012)

josejherring @ Tue Oct 30 said:


> That's like a tectonic plate shifting.


Heh. I liked that.


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## Brian Ralston (Oct 30, 2012)

"I sense a disturbance in the force, I have not felt since...."

=o _-) o-[][]-o


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## Kralc (Oct 30, 2012)

Why, why, why, why does there need to be a Star Wars VII? I'm legitimately intrigued to see how it's done though. 
But, if it's more Williams Star Wars, that's okay with me.


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## SamGarnerStudios (Oct 30, 2012)

As long as they get a good composer. I have a feeling Williams will say no to this.


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## noiseboyuk (Oct 30, 2012)

SamGarnerStudios @ Tue Oct 30 said:


> As long as they get a good composer. I have a feeling Williams will say no to this.



Me too.


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## Kralc (Oct 30, 2012)

Yeah, especially if it's a new trilogy (which it no doubtedly will be).


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## germancomponist (Oct 30, 2012)

At the end (maybe in 2020): One big company will have bought all companies around the world. Isn't this the logic result of our system?


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## Nick Batzdorf (Oct 30, 2012)

I'm curious how the numbers work out, i.e. how the "franchise" is worth $4.05 billion. You know, how much the action figure licensing is worth, the Halloween costumes, etc.


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## SamGarnerStudios (Oct 30, 2012)

Theyve done a great job with the Marvel stuff they bought, so hopefully they can do that again.


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## stonzthro (Oct 30, 2012)

Johnny Depp can play Han Solo's drunk pirate brother who lives on a candy making space planet!!!

My kids will love it!


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## Danny_Owen (Oct 30, 2012)

So if Williams were to pass on the gig, who would you most like to see compose the latest episode?

If we're going down the classic star wars orchestral sound I'd love to see what David Arnold or John Powell could do, alternatively a Zimmer, Newton-Howard or Newmann score could be interesting...


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## choc0thrax (Oct 30, 2012)

I can almost hear the blackberries clicking as agents furiously make calls... This is going to be one of the fiercest gig competitions ever.

They'll never do it but I'd kill to see a movie based on Knights of the Old Republic. Set thousands of years before the events in the existing films and following Darth Revan as he struggles to regain his memory and powers. His struggle between the light and dark side...


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## park bench (Oct 30, 2012)

> As long as they get a good composer. I have a feeling Williams will say no to this.


hopes against hope this doesn't happen...

This is a 50/50 split... It could either be great (better than the 'prequels') or horrible ('prequels part 2')


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## Leosc (Oct 30, 2012)

Danny_Owen @ Tue Oct 30 said:


> Zimmer



Please, for all that is holy, no. Hans is just not laid out for that. 
Arnold on the other hand - why not. A lot closer to Williams's style and legacy, in my opinion.


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## Ned Bouhalassa (Oct 30, 2012)

Please respect our members. You wouldn't say that about me, ie: "Oh no, not Ned" on the forum, so don't write that about any member, please.


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## Ed (Oct 30, 2012)

They should make a Star Wars reboot, where its all "real" with shakey cam are dirty real sets :D


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## Ned Bouhalassa (Oct 30, 2012)

What do you mean, "They should..."? 1000 to one you're on the money!


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## Ed (Oct 30, 2012)

Luke should also be played by a black lesbian girl. Can't wait to see the 3D version.


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## Leosc (Oct 30, 2012)

Ned Bouhalassa @ Tue Oct 30 said:


> Please respect our members. You wouldn't say that about me, ie: "Oh no, not Ned" on the forum, so don't write that about any member, please.



I most certainly would if I thought so. No artist, whether on this board or not, is beyond criticism (not that I expect HZ to care about any of this anyway). And as I hope I made clear: I don't think his style is suited for Star Wars. In fact I'd like to be proven wrong on that - but don't take my reservation as a lack of respect.


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## Ed (Oct 30, 2012)

I love Hans' work but I do agree that his style does not lend to Star Wars, unless they did a reboot (I joked about) and change the entire feel of what Star Wars is. Its like Danny Elfmans Batman, Danny was perfect for that and Hans was perfect for Nolans vision of Batman.


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## choc0thrax (Oct 30, 2012)

Ed @ Tue Oct 30 said:


> I love Hans' work but I do agree that his style does not lend to Star Wars



OMG, you're so banned.

I agree that I don't think Zimmer would suit Star Wars but who knows, we don't know what the film will be. Zimmer's been pretty good at scoring a wide range of stuff. I think we'll also have a better idea once we hear the Superman score.

I think my pick would be for John Powell to score this thing. Of course it depends on the director and if they have a goto guy... though of course the director could always just David Julyan the composer's ass and tell him to hit the road...

Now which director should be brought in for this.... hmmm, no one immediately springs to mind.


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## Ed (Oct 30, 2012)

Well Superman is a reboot and will be very different in style than the original films and closer to Nolans Batman from what Ive seen so far. If Star Wars 7 is the same feel as the rest of them I think Hans would be inappropriate for the same reason Williams would be inappropriate for a Michael Bay film. It just isnt classic Star Wars if it doesn't sound like Williams which is why all the spin offs are just trying to rip off his style.

Powell can do anything


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## Kralc (Oct 30, 2012)

I'd love Powell to score it, hell I'd preorder 10 copies of the album right now.


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## choc0thrax (Oct 30, 2012)

Ed @ Tue Oct 30 said:


> Well Superman is a reboot and will be very different in style than the original films and closer to Nolans Batman from what Ive seen so far.



Well we'll see.. it's hard to just by that teaser trailer. I'll be interested to see how this turns out as WB/Nolan weren't happy with an early cut.

Something else to speculate on: Who will score the new Indiana Jones films now that Disney owns that too.


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## nikolas (Oct 30, 2012)

germancomponist @ Tue Oct 30 said:


> At the end (maybe in 2020): One big company will have bought all companies around the world. Isn't this the logic result of our system?


As long as I'm the CEO of that huge company... No problem then! :D

Now, Star Wars 7?!?! Hmmm... wasn't Star Wars 1-2 and not so much but still 3 complete rubbish with Jar Jar Bing and the rest. Bring on the one ring to rule them all fools! 

Disney buying LucasFilm??!? hmmm... Wasn't Disney in such deep financial trouble? I honestly don't remember but I do remember that this Martian Guy... who went and was stronger than anyone else and that nobody ever watched ... this... this... John Carter (NOW I remember)... flopped huge time?

hmmm...

EDIT: Nope, John Carter didn't flop after all (according to imdb). Sorry 'bout that...


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## Kralc (Oct 30, 2012)

I think Paramount still has the distribution rights to Indy, and Disney has said they're not planning on making one any time soon. Or something like that.

But if it was happening.....Daft Punk, obviously. Tron Legacy style with a CGI Harrison Ford.


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## noiseboyuk (Oct 31, 2012)

I'm depressed about the whole thing. Practically the only good thing you can say about the Star Wars prequels is that they were independently financed and made, and that they fulfilled Lucas' vision. They may have been awful, but they were independently awful, and proud to be so. Lucas has always said it was so important to him. Now, it feels like his last principle has been bought, sold and merchandised.

And so a new franchise is born. Until now, the Star Wars films have been (in theory) story-driven. Lucas had an original trilogy and a prequel story he wanted to tell - of course, famoulsy, Lucas was as excited about the toys as the films, but the story brought the worlds into being. They made billions. Now it's owned by a coroporation with a duty to return profits. These films will no longer be driven by anyone's story, it's just a case of making dough. I think we're as likely to see a Star Wars XX as we are a Star Wars VII.

After Sith, there was a palpaple sense of relief. The series had been butchered, murdered - now, at least, it was over and we all had enough peace to grieve. With this new deal - shame it wasn't announced today on Halloween for full effect - the corpse will be reanimated. Now, to deal with the obvious - there's a very good chance that the seventh movie will be better than the previous three. There's also a very good chance that the franchise will be rebooted ("Hmmm, a hideous phrase that is"). It will probably go the way of all the other series, and be played to 30-50 year old males, with the teens in thrall and in tow. Oh, and Skrillex will do the score.

Which would be the last thing that makes me depressed. I'm a lone voice - I don't like the Nolan Batman films. They are part of a wave that has robbed children of their movies (yeah I know the adult origins - culturally Batman was a kids series when I was a kid). There's almost no films for kids to watch now other than animation. My fervent hope against hope will be that Disney will find a way to keep this a kids / family series - just make it GOOD. Better than good, excellent. The chances, I fear, are slim.


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## Tatu (Oct 31, 2012)

Bring in Michael Giacchino and the tinkly-snappy small metal percussion! And some good quality, traditional writing that he does so well.

I hope they won't just do Dark Star Wars in the vein of the success of Nolan's Batman trilogy and the - most likely - big hit; Dark Superman Begins. There's plenty of room for stories in the SW universe though, so by all means Disney, give it a shot...


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## Ganvai (Oct 31, 2012)

So Star Wars 7 arrives 2015... not so far away... I'm really wondering who will direct this movie and who will produce it? Jerry Bruckheimer? At this time I can't imagine anyone doing this job.

I really fear they will make it more child-oriented.


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## noiseboyuk (Oct 31, 2012)

Tatu @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> Bring in Michael Giacchino and the tinkly-snappy small metal percussion! And some good quality, traditional writing that he does so well.
> 
> I hope they won't just do Dark Star Wars in the vein of the success of Nolan's Batman trilogy and the - most likely - big hit; Dark Superman Begins. There's plenty of room for stories in the SW universe though, so by all means Disney, give it a shot...



I did think the most obvious directorial candidate here would be JJ Abrams, and if he did do it Giacchino would surely follow. It's pretty much a best case scenario I reckon - but he might well decline as it's too similar thematically to Star Trek.


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## Lex (Oct 31, 2012)

noiseboyuk @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> - but he might well decline as it's too similar thematically to Star Trek.



...cause they are both in space?

alex


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## noiseboyuk (Oct 31, 2012)

Lex @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> noiseboyuk @ Wed Oct 31 said:
> 
> 
> > - but he might well decline as it's too similar thematically to Star Trek.
> ...



Yes.

Longer answer - although they are of course quite different in many ways, Star Wars / Star Trek have long been two sides of the coin. They've been the two biggest space franchises throughout the 70s-90s. It would be pretty strange to have them both handled by the same person. Not saying it definitely won't happen, but it's a serious consideration.

Incidentally, Damon Lindelof (producer / co-writer of Star Trek) yesterday tweeted:



> My twitter feed: 38% : "You should write the new Star Wars!" 47% : "Don't fucking touch the new Star Wars!" 15% : Undecided.


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## choc0thrax (Oct 31, 2012)

I can't think of a director who I'd be comfortable seeing direct the next Star Wars.

Definitely not JJ. I don't want Giacchino anywhere near Star Wars.

Although... I wouldn't be surprised to see them do a Star Trek-esque reboot of Star Wars that takes place at Jedi academy. Can't wait to see Taylor Lautner force choke Joseph Gordon Levitt.


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## Kralc (Oct 31, 2012)

Ganvai @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> I really fear they will make it more child-oriented.


The original Star Wars was made as a sort of fairy tale, aimed at children. And as cliched as it sounds, there was a certain magic in that film, magic I hope Disney/Kennedy can reproduce. 

I feel conflicted about the film though. I kinda don't want it to happen, but extremely interested to see how it's handled.

I don't see Abrams taking the job though.



choc0thrax @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> Can't wait to see Taylor Lautner force choke Joseph Gordon Levitt.



Nah, just replace Luke, Leia and Han with the Twilight cast, and we're in reboot business.


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## Ned Bouhalassa (Oct 31, 2012)

Acall @ 30/10/2012 said:


> Ned Bouhalassa @ Tue Oct 30 said:
> 
> 
> > Please respect our members. You wouldn't say that about me, ie: "Oh no, not Ned" on the forum, so don't write that about any member, please.
> ...



It is your style that was the problem. Criticism is one thing, but what you said just came off as mean. Again, would you say those lines about me or Ed or Jose or Frederick, etc? You can say what you mean in ways that are more respectful. And this is the kind of respect that is money/power-blind, the same for all.

BTW, and FWIW, I have reprimanded big-name members for lacking minimum respect.


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## re-peat (Oct 31, 2012)

Jeezes, Ned, you are being silly. (Where is the rock 'n rolling Ned of before?) There's was nothing whatsoever wrong with Acall's remark, and it certainly wasn't 'mean'. The man simply expressed his doubts about Mr. Zimmer being the ideal composer for a Star Wars job. Maybe the choice of words was a touch lively, but still: perfectly innocent.
Forgive me, but if such contributions already qualify as mean and disrespectful, you have (1) overlooked a massive amount of posts in the past, it seems to me, and (2) you have an equaly massive amount of interventions ahead of you, trying to call members to whatever politically correct order it is you want to call them to. (And I seem to remember you didn't like that type of work?)

The subservient Zimmer-fixation of this forum is beginning to get somewhat pathetic, if you ask me.

_


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## noiseboyuk (Oct 31, 2012)

Ganvai @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> I really fear they will make it more child-oriented.



I missed this - I want them to make it child-oriented. Star Wars should be. It just needs to be GOOD. There's an absurd school of thought that says that the darker something this, the better it is. That notion needs be resisted with all force.

The Empire Strikes Back - widely regarded as "the dark one" and the springboard for all the modern dark blockbusters - was actually a certificate U in the UK.


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## Ganvai (Oct 31, 2012)

No, don't get me wrong.

I just fear they make it more child-oriented in the way Jar Jar Binks was and that pseudo-cool young Anakin in Ep1... it got very artificial and awkward.

Ewoks are allright  I also don't want a Dark (Jedi) Knight trilogy again.


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## Ned Bouhalassa (Oct 31, 2012)

And you, Piet have a lot of time on your hands.


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## mark812 (Oct 31, 2012)

noiseboyuk @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> Incidentally, Damon Lindelof (producer / co-writer of Star Trek) yesterday tweeted:
> 
> 
> > My twitter feed: 38% : "You should write the new Star Wars!" 47% : "Don't fucking touch the new Star Wars!" 15% : Undecided.



Hm, it wouldn't be my favorite scenario.._Prometheus_ was such a crappy movie. But on the other side, Lost S04 E05 is one of the best TV episodes ever written..so I may be wrong. 

Powell, Zimmer and Giacchino are my favorites for this job. Although I wouldn't mind Thomas Newman scoring it..not at all.


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## RiffWraith (Oct 31, 2012)

How about starting a petition to get MV as the composer? :D


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## R.Cato (Oct 31, 2012)

RiffWraith @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> How about starting a petition to get MV as the composer? :D



That was exactly my thought when I went to vi control and saw this thread here. :D


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## Danny_Owen (Oct 31, 2012)

Haha I thought the same thing! 

I'm not sure anyone who hasn't handled high profile A-list movies would be able to stomach following JW's footsteps on his most iconic series though..! MAJOR Bowel Movements would be abound I'm sure.


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## Daryl (Oct 31, 2012)

RiffWraith @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> How about starting a petition to get MV as the composer? :D


Who?

D


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## mark812 (Oct 31, 2012)

Daryl @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> RiffWraith @ Wed Oct 31 said:
> 
> 
> > How about starting a petition to get MV as the composer? :D
> ...



Mike Verta?


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## RiffWraith (Oct 31, 2012)

mark812 @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> Daryl @ Wed Oct 31 said:
> 
> 
> > RiffWraith @ Wed Oct 31 said:
> ...



Yup!


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## Alex Cuervo (Oct 31, 2012)

Truth be told - I'd kinda love for them to go a wildly divergent direction, like Trent Reznor or Clint Mansell, just to see all the freakout/meltdowns that would occur on this board.


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## Danny_Owen (Oct 31, 2012)

How about... Desplat?

That'd be... weird. Lol.

Silvestri might be a contender- he did at least two of the Marvel scores (Marvel of course also owned by disney).

Ooo speaking of Disney, Alan Menken? Now that'd be interesting! I don't see it happening but I'd love to see it.

Apologies, I'm getting far too carried away with this!


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## Leosc (Oct 31, 2012)

noiseboyuk @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> I missed this - I want them to make it child-oriented. Star Wars should be. It just needs to be GOOD. There's an absurd school of thought that says that the darker something this, the better it is. That notion needs be resisted with all force.



I concur. The-6-year-old boy of a friend of mine is a huge Stars Wars fan, old and new trilogy. By all means, keep the franchise _approachable_ for everyone. A thing that makes the old trilogy so great and has kept it alive for so long. But don't _cater_ to children, or frat boys, or teenage girls too much.


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## Alex Cuervo (Oct 31, 2012)

Pixar is proof that you can craft smart narratives that appeal to all ages. I have no fear that Disney can accomplish this.


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## choc0thrax (Oct 31, 2012)

Alex Cuervo @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> Pixar is proof that you can craft smart narratives that appeal to all ages. I have no fear that Disney can accomplish this.



http://seekingalpha.com/article/964961- ... -to-disney

I don't know why I didn't think of it before but someone like Brad Bird with the entire Pixar braintrust behind him would certainly be my #1 choice. Damn, then it'd be Giacchino... oh well can't have everything.


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## synthetic (Oct 31, 2012)

I vote Joss Whedon writer/director (maybe for ep 8) and John Powell to score. If he can do that well with cartoon dragons, imagine when he gets SW.


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## EastWest Lurker (Oct 31, 2012)

synthetic @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> I vote Joss Whedon writer/director (maybe for ep 8) and John Powell to score. If he can do that well with cartoon dragons, imagine when he gets SW.



+1.


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## choc0thrax (Oct 31, 2012)

Longtime Whedon superfan but The Avengers was terrible. Now that's likely due to 200 executives breathing down his neck but it'd be the same or worse on Star Wars.


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## mverta (Oct 31, 2012)

Hi guys 

Yes, Williams' score to Star Wars is why I decided to become a composer at 5 years old. Yes, I've done lifetime of study of his music, and yes, I work for Lucasfilm/Disney on official Star Wars projects regularly. And yes, I understand why my inbox exploded yesterday.

But here's my thinking on doing the music for future Star Wars projects: 

Cage Match


_Mike


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## Matt Baron (Oct 31, 2012)

As a long time Star Wars fan I can say I'm happy seeing anyone besides Lucas directing the movie, even though I don't see it being good no matter what happens.


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## noiseboyuk (Oct 31, 2012)

choc0thrax @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> Alex Cuervo @ Wed Oct 31 said:
> 
> 
> > Pixar is proof that you can craft smart narratives that appeal to all ages. I have no fear that Disney can accomplish this.
> ...



I've seen Bird and Stanton's name mentioned in several news reports. Stanton?! That surely is impossible. Bird's a good shout, but the whole "brain trust" thing doesn't have the weight that it did - Cars 2 and John Carter both came via the brain trust.

Still, Bird has done no wrong yet. I'm a big fan, but I'm not sure his sensibility is quite right for Star Wars. Hard to put my finger on it...


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## choc0thrax (Nov 1, 2012)

noiseboyuk @ Thu Nov 01 said:


> choc0thrax @ Wed Oct 31 said:
> 
> 
> > Alex Cuervo @ Wed Oct 31 said:
> ...



Those Cars movies are Lasseter's fault. Dude just wants to sell Toys. 

The brain trust has the best track record around. You can't hit it out of the park every time. Pixar is unique in Hollywood in that it'll spend 2-3 years writing the script. Contrast that with everywhere else where development barely exists anymore due to 1-step deals.


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## noiseboyuk (Nov 1, 2012)

choc0thrax @ Thu Nov 01 said:


> The brain trust has the best track record around. You can't hit it out of the park every time. Pixar is unique in Hollywood in that it'll spend 2-3 years writing the script. Contrast that with everywhere else where development barely exists anymore due to 1-step deals.



I want to believe... I DID believe. John Carter did sooo much damage, because its fundamental problems were story / character problems, the very things the brain trust was famous for. But I guess you're right - take the whole sweep for the last 17 years and it's still a batting average off the scale really.


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## Mike Marino (Nov 1, 2012)

> Hi guys
> 
> Yes, Williams' score to Star Wars is why I decided to become a composer at 5 years old. Yes, I've done lifetime of study of his music, and yes, I work for Lucasfilm/Disney on official Star Wars projects regularly. And yes, I understand why my inbox exploded yesterday.
> 
> ...



Watched your explanation and I understand what you're saying. Now put your name in the hat!


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## choc0thrax (Nov 1, 2012)

noiseboyuk @ Thu Nov 01 said:


> choc0thrax @ Thu Nov 01 said:
> 
> 
> > The brain trust has the best track record around. You can't hit it out of the park every time. Pixar is unique in Hollywood in that it'll spend 2-3 years writing the script. Contrast that with everywhere else where development barely exists anymore due to 1-step deals.
> ...



Yeah but the brain trust wasn't really involved in John Carter. Stanton had a few Pixar people help out to some degree but this was a Disney film. I wouldn't be surprised if the writing process was pretty different from usual for Stanton.



Oh and pretty off-topic but had to post it:

Darren Aronofsky's Noah Delayed Due to Flooding

Darren Aronofsky (Black Swan, The Wrestler) has been filming his "Noah" film, based on the Biblical tale of Noah's Ark, at Oyster Bay, NY. To make it as realistic as possible, the director built a massive ark, which measures 450 feet long, 75 feet tall and 45 feet wide. Unfortunately, it was never meant to be sailed. With production wrapping up within the next few weeks, the ark was forced to deal with flooding as Hurricane Sandy passed through Oyster Bay. Emma Watson, one of the actresses on the film, pointed out the irony of flooding being the cause of problems for the production. 

Congrats to Emma on getting in there early on the irony front.


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## Consona (Nov 1, 2012)

noiseboyuk @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> I'm a lone voice - I don't like the Nolan Batman films. They are part of a wave that has robbed children of their movies (yeah I know the adult origins - culturally Batman was a kids series when I was a kid).


And what do you think of Burton's Batmans? Is it material suitable for kids?



Ganvai @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> I really fear they will make it more child-oriented.


Star Wars Episode VII: Jar Jar Binks Rises. :cry: But seriously what needs to be done to make new Star Wars great again? I'm very sceptical.



choc0thrax @ Wed Oct 31 said:


> (...) but The Avengers was terrible.


Yea and I still cannot see the reason why so many people loved this film.


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## noiseboyuk (Nov 1, 2012)

eyedee @ Thu Nov 01 said:


> i would love to see a Paul Greengrass take on Star Wars, hand held, darker and grainy. i love seeing the amazing backgrounds but it would be cool to have some shallow depth of field and bokeh action.
> 
> as far as score, gosh, if not the man himself…
> 
> actually if they really flipped it, it would be sick if Trent and Atticus scored it.



You have just described my own personal hell.

And I have no issue with any of the people mentioned. I just want it to be, ya know, for kids.

(10 bonus points if anyone gets the quote in the previous sentence)


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## choc0thrax (Nov 1, 2012)

Greengrass actually shot a little demo for Disney earlier this year:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JasWflHDDMs&feature=relmfu (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JasWflHD ... ure=relmfu)

Apparently he didn't get the job but I felt his authentic documentary style really captured the darkness of space.


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## Tatu (Nov 2, 2012)

James Horner. 'nough said.

o[])


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## Tatu (Nov 2, 2012)

I have a feeling, that who ever directs the next SW, doesn't really matter... It's the producers running that show and Special Executive Consulting Producer George Lucas aside them.

I'd like to see Neill Blomkamp, or some other young, rising star there though.


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## snowleopard (Nov 2, 2012)

Can't be worse than Revenge of the Sith. Though I suppose it can. 

Remember, this is a corporate owned entity, all about making money. Keep that in perspective when predicting what will come of this.


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## dpasdernick (Nov 3, 2012)

SamGarnerStudios @ Tue Oct 30 said:


> As long as they get a good composer. I have a feeling Williams will say no to this.



Hmmm... maybe they should get a good film maker 1st.


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## dpasdernick (Nov 3, 2012)

germancomponist @ Tue Oct 30 said:


> At the end (maybe in 2020): One big company will have bought all companies around the world. Isn't this the logic result of our system?



Spot on Gunther. We'll all be buying everything at Buy n Large like in the Wall-E movie.


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## Tatu (Nov 8, 2012)

dpasdernick @ Sun Nov 04 said:


> germancomponist @ Tue Oct 30 said:
> 
> 
> > At the end (maybe in 2020): One big company will have bought all companies around the world. Isn't this the logic result of our system?
> ...




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=76NqXff4Ub0

In the mean while.. this seems interesting:
http://www.vulture.com/2012/11/star-war ... riter.html


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## choc0thrax (Nov 8, 2012)

Fantastic news about Michael Arndt writing. He's easily one of the best out there.


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## choc0thrax (Jan 24, 2013)

http://www.slashfilm.com/j-j-abrams-to- ... isode-vii/


Guess we know who's scoring Star Wars now...


I'm estimating that half of today's Twitter traffic is lens flare jokes.


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## Guy Rowland (Jan 24, 2013)

Star Wars VII: Another New Hope


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## mverta (Jan 24, 2013)

What you need to do is go back and listen to "The Battle of Yavin" from the first _Star Wars_ score, and take in the Doctorate-degree's worth of orchestration, thematic development, and harmonic mastery in just that _one cue_, and get real fuckin' clear that nobody today could even begin to touch that level of writing. Nobody. Least of all Michael freakin' Giacchino.

I have transcribed nearly every note of music John Williams has ever written for the screen, and today, after 30 years of study, I am still gobsmacked by half of it. It's absolutely fucking amazing. Fucking amazing. 


Look, I got real about _Star Wars_ decades ago; it's over, and it's never coming back. Whatever they do now is a Disney product trading in on 30 years of goodwill generated by a film in 1977 that changed everything. George Lucas hasn't been the George Lucas of 1976 since about 1980, and they don't make movies like that anymore - which is just as well, because nobody can score them.

So it'll be different. It'll be the sort of mediocre-passing-for-good-absent-any-real-competition that all Abrams films are, and that'll be it. 

But personally, as a guy whose entire life path was created by the transcendent musicality of that first score - who is still utterly humbled by its content - so much about all of this turns my stomach and offends my musical soul to its very core. 








Here I am standing with three of the original R2's up at the Archives, when I was hired to do the new CG R2-D2 for Lucasfilm. The Archives are the only place you can still find _Star Wars_, and the music? You're never hearing that again. 




_Mike


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## Casey Edwards (Jan 24, 2013)

Ever since I've seen this whole 'new Star Wars' debate surface I've thought to myself there are only 2 composers that I can think of off the top of my head that would probably satisfy my Star Wars universe needs and that is Joel McNeely and Mike Verta.

And Mike, I couldn't agree more with you man! That cue has always floored me. I seem to agree with most things that you say. At least orchestrally that is. :wink:


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## Guy Rowland (Jan 25, 2013)

Mike - I know exactly what you mean. The Battle For Yavin in particular is just extraordinary. I only got the soundtrack itself a couple of years ago, but when I was 11 I had The Story Of Star Wars, which was 50 mins of the entire sound track - dialogue, sfx, music, which I listened too daily (to me, Ben Burtt is as much of a hero as John Williams). When I listened for the first time to The Battle For Yavin on its own, it was an absurdly emotional - at once an appreciation of how muscially complex it was, how perfectly it served story and - most of all - how it acted as a time machine putting my right back in my seat at the Bromley Odeon when I was 11 watching it, incredulous, in 1978. Yup, I welled up.

So I'm one of those who has this life-changing connection to the original Star Wars. In fact, I'm far more hardcore than most, in that I've always considered Empire and Jedi lesser films - structurally flawed in the case of Empire (where's the ending?) and too derivative in the case of Jedi (oh, it's the same ending). Don't get me wrong - they're both great sequels and I love them, but something unique happened in 1976 in pre-production, in Tunisia, in Elstree (I had no idea that the inside of the Millennium Falcon existed 20 miles from where I first watched the movie), in Van Nuys and in Anvil Studios that created something bigger than the sum of its incredible parts.

And then 1999 happened.

We all know the rest, the sorry tale of what would be the greatest cinematic disappointment for a generation that transcended right into bitterness and despair (actually, for me, the Matrix Reloaded was even worse, but that's another story). As you said, Mike, the George Lucas that made the first trilogy had died. Still there were flashes of brilliance - the Pod Race still holds up as a self-contained 15 minutes - but despite Tunisia, despite Burtt and Williams - the soul of Star Wars had been completely crushed.

And so what now?

We've got Michael Arndt - a relatively brief but impressive track record. And we've got JJ Abrams and (widely assumed) Giacchino. Abrams was the first name that came to mind when they announced this a few months ago, but I soon wrote it off as too on-the-nose. Star Trek and Star Wars have always been two self-contained universes with no overlap, it feels a bit sacrilegious to contaminate them with each other even by personnel.

And yet you can see why his name was irresistible. Star Wars VII's primary role is to find the soul of Star Wars again. All the elements (bar cast) were tried in 1999 - again, including Williams - and were found wanting, and for that we can all blame Lucas forever. But JJ pulled it off with Trek. The franchise itself was in far ruder health than Star Wars of course, but nevertheless there was an unmistakable and uncanny feeling of joyous familiarity as we were introduced to the soon-to-be crew of The Enterprise - that despite an entirely new cast (barring one cameo), production and technical team, they had at once restored what was great and given us something entirely new. Precisely what is now needed in Star Wars.

From my initial "nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo" when I heard Disney had control, I'm come right around. I'm excited again (and thus ready to be disappointed again). And I'll say this - I think it would always have been a mistake for Williams to revist this. Just as it would be a mistake for any new composer to emulate him. And this comes from someone who hears that soul of Star Wars in those magical 1976 recordings at Anvil (oh hearing those cue idents on the extra takes of the titles on the CD!!!) Because Star Wars was always more than the sum of the parts, having tried and discarded the same parts three times in eps 1, 2 and 3, it's time to now try something different - new parts.

At the risk of incurring your wrath, Mike, I'm a HUGE Giachinno fan (regardless of whether or not he owes half it to his orchestrators). His raw, stripped down and emotional LOST helped build that world. His incredible, sublime work in the first 10 minutes of Up, a cornerstone of one of animation's crowning achievements. The knowing dazzle of The Incredibles. Best of all, I hear a storyteller, and my god we all need one.

I want something new. Something not for people of my age, and certainly not for thirtysomethings, but for kids again - where we can giddily jump on the coat-tails, just like adults did in '77. The last thing I want is The White Jedi Rises - a technically impressive, well acted, bleak, dark, joyless dirge of a franchise built for the Apple demographic. But I do want the soul rediscovered - as Disney did last year with The Muppets - without slavish adherence to the past. I'm setting myself up for a fall I guess, but.... well.

I DON'T have a really bad feeling about this...


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## IvanP (Jan 25, 2013)

Guy Rowland @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> His incredible, sublime work in the first 10 minutes of Up, a cornerstone of one of animation's crowning achievements.
> I DON'T have a really bad feeling about this...



Sorry to be an ass...

Giacchino's UP VS Iglesias' Lucia (2009 / 2001)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LaLegF2hAxI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c0DmANsHQZs


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## Guy Rowland (Jan 25, 2013)

Oh lordy, let's not have another plagarism thread. The point about Up is that it works so fantastically to picture - every storytelling beat is sublime.


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## TheUnfinished (Jan 25, 2013)

Oh for heaven's sake... Not another "Two of the several hundred million pieces of music that exist, sound vaguely similar at some points and then different at others" thread.

Can we not just accept that sometimes we write music and something that we've heard before can enter our subconscious? Or that sometimes when you start a tune it can naturally lead most pleasingly in one direction and that because of this occasionally the same tune (or similar tunes) will be written? Or that it's just possible with the finite number of notes we have to work with that occasionally two (or even two hundred!) artists will write something similar?

And then maybe move on?

Or shall we start listing all the melodies and motifs we think John Williams borrowed for the original trilogy as well? Until we're all sat in a circle firmly staring up our own arses?

[/rant]


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## IvanP (Jan 25, 2013)

Chill out guys...I agree with most of the things said...just saying the guy it's not perfect.

Up works perfectly well in those 10 minutes. After that, the music is not so memorable. And, well, there's quite some kudos on the warmness of that sequence in the use of that melody...

Same for his work in lost and MI...some nice moments here and there, but I still need to find a soundtrack where I get WOWs everytime...this was ye Star Wars OST for me and still is. 

Can't find a finesse in his writing as close as there was in Williams'...maybe the guy is just too busy with too many projects at the same time, instead on focusing on a single one at a time...

Still, can't blame the guy and I agree with Mike's points. 

We seem to look for a way of doing music that is not being done anymore. 

MI3's love theme is incredible, to me. But it's contemporary drama scoring...wouldn't work in Star Wars, would it?

If the closest thing to modern Star Wars was John Carter, I'd better hire David Arnold and his orchestrator to repeat the work from Stargate, at least that was really fun and thrilling because it was so old school without any other intention besides being bold. 

I attended, years ago, a John Ottman conference when he had just recorded Superman Returns. 

I think he admitted to be struggling while mixing his own themes with Williams'. At the time, there were talks with Singer of doing a remake of Logan's run...

So it was Ottman's having to deal with Williams and Goldsmith's shadows. 

Ultimately, he said that he got relieved that Logan's was cancelled because of that much pressure. 

Giacchino's take on Star Trek was intelligent, but, also, the movie was a complete reboot. 

SW VII is supposed to bring back the original characters, so it's not like a reboot, isn't it?

Pfff...honestly, I don't know if it's a win win situation as people say...


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## FriFlo (Jan 25, 2013)

Anybody, who understands music theory knows, it is kind of impossible not to sound almost like something else with those kind of tunes. Sorry, but this is not a cover up at all ... I am no big Giaccino fan, but he does solid work.


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## IvanP (Jan 25, 2013)

FriFlo @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> Anybody, who understands music theory knows, it is kind of impossible not to sound almost like something else with those kind of tunes. Sorry, but this is not a cover up at all ... I am no big Giaccino fan, but he does solid work.



That's my point....never said it was plagiarism. 

Just saying that these tunes are made of licks and things in our popular and folklore, so they won't be 100 % original, which is actually my point. Can Giacchino come up with a full, original, game changer theme as William's did? I'm not saying that they shouldn't have influences (think Korngold and etc)...but the music was a game changer. Can he do that, too?

And, still, you need to make it work to picture, and that's where the real chops are too...

And yes, he does, but is it consistent enough for the rest of the film? The rest of UP is a completely, different soundtrack. 

My point is that the guy has what it takes to stand up to the test, but can it be enough for being as memorable as it was, taking into account the changes in film scoring while looking back at that moment?

Wow...pretty hard stuff...and that's where I'm not sure if his whole work within a picture could be good enough.

Up's work show that he understand's really well film scoring. And that he can make a theme works within a context, a picture and such. 

So, if there's a guy that would use the original themes - and thus, adapt them to all the new score with such success - hire that guy!

But if you'll need to use those themes and also interlace them with new ones...now that's where it's going to be complicated...

Will you use Han and Leia's theme every time they say goodbye or kiss? Or would you try and come up with your own?

Would that original theme work within a JJ Abrahms modern film aesthetics?
No? In that case, better find a new theme? Hmmm...how to make it sound better than the original one? WOW...that could be scary, wouldn't it?

I always wondered why Williams didn't use more of his old themes (as in "more exposed") in the prequels. 

We only get to hear Yoda's theme in SWIII when he's saying goodbye to Chewbacca and that cue didn't even make it into the official soundtrack. 

Why? Is it because the new aesthetics and more rhythmic oriented score didn't allow for re-stating in an "old" way the old themes? 

I don't know, but Williams clearly chose to go a different route in scoring the prequels. Why would getting back to old school would work between the new ones?

Super 8 was meant to be a look back at the 80s...I don't think there was real magic behind it besides it being a well studied exercise of Spielberg's and Goonies mixed with Gremlins. 

As much as I'd love to happen again (and yes, I would giggle with Han and Leia's theme on screen again), Mike does have a point...it might not happen again an a different route would be more suitable...and, thus, a different director, a different composer.


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## Tatu (Jan 25, 2013)

Casey Edwards @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> Joel McNeely



This. Indeed.

I love his Shadows of the Empire score (one of the first scores I bought back in the good ol' days). Brilliant and on par with JW on every level, IMO.


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## mverta (Jan 25, 2013)

If I had Giacchino as a student I could teach him how to develop an idea, not just generate one; that part he has down just fine. Unfortunately, films are longer than 30 seconds.


_Mike


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## Brian Ralston (Jan 25, 2013)

My Disney "insider" tells me NOT to assume it will be Giacchino. They (Disney) knows how important Williams is to the franchise. And that Disney will ultimately control every aspect of this franchise, not JJ. I have to trust them to some degree. Their exact words to me were "It will be Williams." Also...with Kathleen Kennedy running Lucasefilm under Disney...and every film she has been, it has been Williams as well.

Now...whether that ends up that way or not...we will see. But...there it is...


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## ryanstrong (Jan 25, 2013)

Brian Ralston @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> My Disney "insider" tells me NOT to assume it will be Giacchino. They (Disney) knows how important Williams is to the franchise. And that Disney will ultimately control every aspect of this franchise, not JJ. I have to trust them to some degree. Their exact words to me were "It will be Williams." Also...with Kathleen Kennedy running Lucasefilm under Disney...and every film she has been, it has been Williams as well.
> 
> Now...whether that ends up that way or not...we will see. But...there it is...



I LOVE the idea of one last revelatory score by the almighty Williams. It would be an amazing testament to his ability; to hear a truly WILLIAMS score to this next round of Star Wars and not some wishy washy score but a risky Williams. But we may be too far past that point?

That said, another part of me is interested to hear some other guy to give it a shot!


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## dgburns (Jan 25, 2013)

mverta @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> If I had Giacchino as a student I could teach him how to develop an idea, not just generate one; that part he has down just fine. Unfortunately, films are longer than 30 seconds.
> 
> 
> _Mike



No,no,no,no.

Don't go there Mike.

You're better then that.


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## Guy Rowland (Jan 25, 2013)

Brian - interesting.... somehow I can't see Williams himself wanting to do it though.


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## TheUnfinished (Jan 25, 2013)

Williams is Williams, but I don't think that means nobody else can write Star Wars music. The worst thing that could happen is that they hire someone really good and they just turn out a Williams pastiche.

I would like to see someone else take over the franchise, simply because I don't think even Williams himself can now match what he did for the original trilogy. So there's little point in trying to go down the same road again.

This is a fantastic opportunity for whoever does get the nod, as there are very few opportunities to write sch thematic scores these days. As long as tedious people like us don't keep banging on about how it's "not Williams" until we're blue in the bum.

Personally I'd like to see John Powell do it. A cross between Bourne and How to Train Your Dragon might be a nice fit for a family action sci-fi saga.


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## ryanstrong (Jan 25, 2013)

What do you all think will be the most asked question from the Director/Producer and crew during the production (film wise and score wise) of these films...

*1. Is this too much like the originals?*
(meaning there is a constant desire to be different)

OR

*2. Does this respect the originals?*
(meaning there is a constant desire to pay homage)


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## Guy Rowland (Jan 25, 2013)

TheUnfinished @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> Williams is Williams, but I don't think that means nobody else can write Star Wars music. The worst thing that could happen is that they hire someone really good and they just turn out a Williams pastiche.
> 
> I would like to see someone else take over the franchise, simply because I don't think even Williams himself can now match what he did for the original trilogy. So there's little point in trying to go down the same road again.
> 
> ...



Yes, absolutely. If it were Powell (which I strongly suspect it isn't), I think he'd make it really fresh.


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## Ian Dorsch (Jan 25, 2013)

mverta @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> If I had Giacchino as a student I could teach him how to develop an idea, not just generate one; that part he has down just fine. Unfortunately, films are longer than 30 seconds.



:(


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## mverta (Jan 25, 2013)

TheUnfinished @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> Williams is Williams, but I don't think that means nobody else can write Star Wars music. .



What is Star Wars music? 

It's Neo-Romantic. Nobody can write that particular idiom like Williams. So if you want to say that Star Wars can exist without Neo-Romantic music, sure it can, but it won't be Star Wars, it'll be something else. Which it already is. I've said it before- Star Wars has been gone a long, long time. The closer you try to get to what it was, the more glaring the paleness of its imitation; do something else, and it'll be something else with a Star Wars label on it, like the Star Trek reboot was.




_Mike


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## ryanstrong (Jan 25, 2013)

mverta @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> TheUnfinished @ Fri Jan 25 said:
> 
> 
> > Williams is Williams, but I don't think that means nobody else can write Star Wars music. .
> ...



You are exactly right Mike. If only we could hear a Star Wars score by Ravel. But yeah Neo-Romantic... no one does it.

Alexandre Desplat's could be fitting? Not some of his recent Argo/Potter stuff, but I adore his score for Coco Before Chanel.


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## mverta (Jan 25, 2013)

But, see, that's the issue. Spielberg has been grooming Giacchino since his video game days, and Abrams since whenever, and to date, they've sort of been trying to do this Spielberg/Williams-Lite thing. It's as "pastiche" as it gets, and a compelling argument for why pastiche has a bad reputation.

It's exactly why using Williams' Superman theme was a mistake for Superman Returns - the second that music stops, it's painful. I felt bad for John Ottman; he never had a chance. 

So, really, it would've been best to go an entirely different direction; somebody doing Star Wars in a totally new context; music and all. Abrams is a Star Wars fan, and Giacchino wanted to be Williams like most of us, and there's no way they're going to ditch all that and not live out their childhood fantasies.


Look, I remember when the prequels were announced. Half of my vfx employees left to go to ILM to work on "Star Wars." I got it; we'd all gotten into the biz because of that film; how could you not live out the dream and go to ILM and work on Star Wars?

A few months later, one of them FedEx'd me a traffic cone he'd stolen from the employee parking lot, upon which someone had sharpied "ILM - Incredibly Low Morale." None of them stayed for the second movie.

And for me, when I got the call from Lucasfilm to work on my first official Star Wars project, doing the CG R2-D2 for them, there was no way I could resist. I mean, it's Star Wars! And it's Lucasfilm! and the Archives! and R2-D2! ... 

It's just too tempting, and that's the problem. 

I say "problem" advisedly. Overpopulation is a problem. The next Star Wars movie isn't a real "problem" by any real measure, but one I feel strongly about anyway. 


_Mike


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## germancomponist (Jan 25, 2013)

mverta @ Sat Jan 26 said:


> It's just too tempting, and that's the problem.
> 
> I say "problem" advisedly. Overpopulation is a problem. The next Star Wars movie isn't a real "problem" by any real measure, but one I feel strongly about anyway.
> 
> ...


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## Daniel James (Jan 25, 2013)

Personally speaking, I never cared at all for Star Wars. I didn't see it when I was young and when I eventually got round to seeing it, it didn't capture my attention...The music was technically great but on a personal level didn't emotionally connect with me the way I can tell it did with many of you.

So seeing that Disney bought the rights to the franchise I would much rather see them reboot it for a new generation than to try and appease the film goers of an age of cinema now past. I would love a 'second chance' to be drawn into the universe and see it the way many of you do, its just up to this point the old films just don't get me there.

Star Wars set the stage for what films could be back then I would love to it do the same for modern cinema....without all the baggage its inevitably going to have 

-DJ


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## mverta (Jan 25, 2013)

I know... bunch of us crabby old-timers pining for the days of cinema past, when fucking film music was worth a fucking fuck.



_Mike


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## choc0thrax (Jan 25, 2013)

Daniel James @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> Personally speaking, I never cared at all for Star Wars. I didn't see it when I was young and when I eventually got round to seeing it, it didn't capture my attention...The music was technically great but on a personal level didn't emotionally connect with me the way I can tell it did with many of you.
> 
> So seeing that Disney bought the rights to the franchise I would much rather see them reboot it for a new generation than to try and appease the film goers of an age of cinema now past. I would love a 'second chance' to be drawn into the universe and see it the way many of you do, its just up to this point the old films just don't get me there.
> 
> ...



What... what movies do you like? Curious.

I'm not sure they're going to be able to please you this time if you don't care for the original films. It's hard to improve on what was already fantastic storytelling. I mean who doesn't like the Joseph Campbell monomyth? Whether it's Jesus, Luke, or Neo, the human race is programmed to like this stuff...

...Though I guess some people are immune - like a friend of mine who isn't a big Star Wars fan but when asked his opinion on Punisher: War Zone, he says it was "pretty sweet" and "no complaints"... so his opinion is invalid.

Maybe Disney should take a radical departure from the originals and make the film a sort of tone poem with a loose narrative. Joaquin Phoenix as Vader during his years at the imperial academy. The kinky origins of his outfit. Not to mention the desolate nihilism of Johnny Greenwood's force theme.


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## Casey Edwards (Jan 25, 2013)

Daniel James @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> Personally speaking, I never cared at all for Star Wars. I didn't see it when I was young and when I eventually got round to seeing it, it didn't capture my attention...The music was technically great but on a personal level didn't emotionally connect with me the way I can tell it did with many of you.
> 
> So seeing that Disney bought the rights to the franchise I would much rather see them reboot it for a new generation than to try and appease the film goers of an age of cinema now past. I would love a 'second chance' to be drawn into the universe and see it the way many of you do, its just up to this point the old films just don't get me there.
> 
> ...



When it comes to Star Wars music, just keep your BRAAAMS away from my Brahms and we'll be cool man. o-[][]-o


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## Daniel James (Jan 25, 2013)

choc0thrax @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> Daniel James @ Fri Jan 25 said:
> 
> 
> > Personally speaking, I never cared at all for Star Wars. I didn't see it when I was young and when I eventually got round to seeing it, it didn't capture my attention...The music was technically great but on a personal level didn't emotionally connect with me the way I can tell it did with many of you.
> ...



Films I seem to enjoy the most are either big 'epics' like Gladiator, The Last Samurai, Braveheart etc and gritty thrillers like Man On Fire (Actually pretty much any Tony Scott film) 

-DJ


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## Stiltzkin (Jan 25, 2013)

Daniel James @ Sat Jan 26 said:


> Films I seem to enjoy the most are either big 'epics' like Gladiator, The Last Samurai, Braveheart etc and gritty thrillers like Man On Fire (Actually pretty much any Tony Scott film)
> 
> -DJ



Man of Fire was an incredible film, really enjoyed it - and a top notch score by H.G.W


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## Guy Rowland (Jan 26, 2013)

I think we have a pretty good idea of what we're gonna get from Star Wars VII - what we got in Star Trek, which of course is why Abrams has the gig. Not a total re-invention, not a re-creation either. And I think that's spot on.

Mike, you mention Abrams' Star Trek film like it was some kind of disaster. I'm a Giacchino fan and I think Star Trek was one of his weakest scores, but I still view the film as a whole as a terrific success. Indeed, it's probably the best Trek movie (nb - NOT the best score, but that to me is massively of secondary importance). If you disagree that the film itself broadly worked, you are in a minority - a 95% Rotten Tomatoes critics rating, 91% user rating = a successful movie.

In Star Trek: The Motion Picture, there is a celebrated sequence where we see the Enterprise for the first time. I've read reports of folks reaction to this tour de force by Goldsmith as a high water mark in scoring. I clearly remember seeing this scene when I was 14 at the cinema, and to me it was horrifically overwrought, pretentious and - above all - BORING. And not a crotchet of criticism is intended towards the legendary Goldsmith from a minnow such as I, it's all aimed at Robert Wise (and possibly the writers). As filmmaking, it was horribly bloated and full of itself, part of a film that couldn't handle the weight on its own shoulders.

Fans cite Star Trek II as a series highlight. I agree it was MUCH better. Significantly, they shot it with a TV crew for a fraction of the budget of I and got in a new director and writers. They went right back to basics, found a decent story to tell, and brought out the characters of the characters. I'm not a Trekkie, I can't tell you Horner's score was like, but I see far fewer people referring to it than Goldsmith's.

There's a simple moral here. A film can be great with an OK score, while a great score cannot save a poor film.

Star Wars is perhaps a harder case. Star Wars IV was that rarest of marriages where everything was firing on all cylinders. The casting, the effects, the sound design, the production design, the score, the editing.... even the script were all outstanding, and they made something greater than the sum of those terrific parts. We're focusing on one outstanding element that the composer himself could not subsequently equal (though his later SW scores never fell below very good). But I think its foolish to either on the one hand try to recreate that magic, or on the other ignore it.

And anyway - we know what we're gonna get. It may make MV howl in protest when in 2015 he hears an original theme and then whatever Giacchino (assuming it IS he) dovetails into, but my predication is that, regardless of how his soundtrack CD plays, he will serve the film well. I couldn't hum a note of his Trek score, but I do know that it wound up as a very good movie. His skill as a composer and a storyteller were sufficient to do the primary job required of it. I understand why that is depressing for some, but there it is.

Much as I care - deeply care - about how great musically Star Wars IV was on its own, I certainly won't consider the new film a fail when it fails to live up to it, as it surely won't. Don't get me wrong, I want Giachhino to dig deep, to get uniquely inspired, I want that score to be as good as humanly possible. To me, most of all, that means having a little of Williams' gift for telling story, ahead of his technical skill in orchestration etc. If he can do that - and all the evidence suggests he can - AND Arndt / Abrams tell a great story, it'll be a result.


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## IvanP (Jan 26, 2013)

So, if it's a JJ Abrahms take on "get the magic back" with the old cast (hopefully without Lindeloff uresolved secret tricks), we've seen that before:

It's Super 8. Did it work? Not to me. I felt as sort of the "80s movies: the broadway show". 

I enjoyed more Star Trek because it was a fresh start...but, still, there was a stink of teenage rebels without a cause surfing in space than any other thing (let's get drunk and let's hit each other after the party). Good for the youngest fans, bad for mythology. 

My guess is that SW is going to be in between, and hybrid, as a test for the other two movies...We'll get that new cast and blinks to us, lost Star Wars children, but also also new, younger characters for the new generations...expect some goofy characters for the new ones too... (Disney needs to sell merchandise, remember?)

As for the bad guy, knowing Abrahms, hopefully it won't be a Godzilla based one...again, but I assume some Harry Potter kind of "Force power" battles will arise, slow motion cries and explosions with one of the romantic themes of Williams behind for blockbuster show and nonsense story telling. 

And some calculated applause moments (yeah, let's put that for the oldest fans, they'll be raving) as in "I Love you. I know", but this time it will be Leia saying that. 

The only good thing is that, at least, we will get the feeling of real camera movements, not Lucas' general-medium-close shot without even a dolly.


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## Guy Rowland (Jan 26, 2013)

Yeah, I was kinda disappointed by Super 8. Loved the first half, then it was just kinda dumb. That was all script problems more than directorial ones though. For that, we're all rooting for Michael Arndt.

I'm no Trekkie, but it seemed to me that the mythology of Star Trek was great. I understand all that early stuff fit in with the legends well. As for bad guys - isn't it Benedict Cummerbatch in the new film? That's pretty down-to-earth.

I'm guessing Hammil, Ford and Fisher will all show up, but it will be handing over the baton. Maybe it'll go as far as Generations in concept, but my gut feeling is that it'll be more cameo than that.

And I'd cheer at Leia saying "I know" - Fisher would pull it off, too.


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## Kralc (Jan 26, 2013)

Guy Rowland @ Sat Jan 26 said:


> I'm guessing Hammil, Ford and Fisher will all show up, but it will be handing over the baton.


Have you seen what Hamill looks like now? He'd show up on screen and nobody would have a clue who he is...


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## Guy Rowland (Jan 26, 2013)

Kralc @ Sat Jan 26 said:


> Guy Rowland @ Sat Jan 26 said:
> 
> 
> > I'm guessing Hammil, Ford and Fisher will all show up, but it will be handing over the baton.
> ...



I suspect Carrie Fisher won't be wearing THAT Jedi costume either, love her though I do. They'll be the three wise men in this. Though still bickering I hope.


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## mverta (Jan 26, 2013)




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## Martin Brannigan (Jan 26, 2013)

Just as a slight off-topic reminisce, my Dad had a business trip to Los Angeles and was invited to the Premiere of the original Star Wars film.

We were all super excited for him but then found out that jet lag had gotten the better of him and he had fallen asleep in the cinema and
missed the whole bloody film !!


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## JonFairhurst (Jan 28, 2013)

I'm less concerned about the director and composer and more concerned about the writer(s) and the quality of the script. Thankfully, Lucas won't be penning the dialog.

Cause in the end, it all comes down to how many "younglings" survive...


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## snowleopard (Jan 29, 2013)

Agree completely with Jon. It's the writers and script(s) that are paramount. Not just dialog though, story structure, character development, etc. That was the downfall of the prequels more than anything else.


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## ryanstrong (Jan 29, 2013)

I do think the writers are key here, but with any great film I think you are only as good as your weakest link here so I'd love to see a true great collaboration of a director, composer, cinematographer, CGI team, production crew, writers etc.

That's a lot to expect but we are talking about one of the largest franchises in cinema history here.


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## choc0thrax (Jan 29, 2013)

The thing to worry about is the time frame they expect to do this in.


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## Guy Rowland (Jan 29, 2013)

choc0thrax @ Tue Jan 29 said:


> The thing to worry about is the time frame they expect to do this in.



Well... 2015. 2 years. We don't know how long Michael has been working on the script already, but I'd be surprised if he isn't way past first draft. Given that, the timescale looks fine to me.

One rumour I heard through a convoluted source is that they were going to reign in the CG massively on this pic, do more in camera. That means longer for pre-production, shorter for post... a lot shorter hopefully. Again, don't have any alarm bells ringing.

Star Wars IV first draft was, I believe, 1974 and it was a horrible mess. They shot in 1976.


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## JonFairhurst (Jan 29, 2013)

Using practical effects, rather than CGI, would be a tip of the hat to the original. More than anything, I enjoy seeing the sets, props and costumes when I watch the first two films. It wasn't quite up to "2001 ASO" realism, but it was still impressive.


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## choc0thrax (Jan 29, 2013)

Guy Rowland @ Tue Jan 29 said:


> choc0thrax @ Tue Jan 29 said:
> 
> 
> > The thing to worry about is the time frame they expect to do this in.
> ...



Well we don't know where Arndt is with the writing. True maybe he's deep into it but who knows. They'll still need to bring in Lindelof to make sure no one knows why anything is happening.

More practical effects will mean shorter post until they panic and decide to replace it all with CG later. Normally I can't stand a lot of CG but I was actually really impressed with what they did on Star Trek.

I still think this is a pretty ambitious time frame for something as massive as Star Wars. Of course that can work for or against you. The one thing to remember is that film making is a crapshoot. 8)


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## Kralc (Feb 6, 2013)

http://www.slashfilm.com/disney-confirm ... -episodes/

:|


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## R.Cato (Feb 6, 2013)

+1 for a Chewbacca standalone film. :D

This is crap. I actually don't want to know everything about the life of some characters. It takes away the mystery, especially Yoda's.

I guess Disney sees him as the most family friendly character. So we can expect Wall-E with a better grammar..... :?


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## Guy Rowland (Feb 6, 2013)

R.Cato @ Wed Feb 06 said:


> +1 for a Chewbacca standalone film. :D
> 
> This is crap. I actually don't want to know everything about the life of some characters. It takes away the mystery, especially Yoda's.
> 
> I guess Disney sees him as the most family friendly character. So we can expect Wall-E with a better grammar..... :?



+1... I was getting all optimistic. But now... I got a bad feeling about this...


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## Kralc (Feb 6, 2013)

I really hope it's not Yoda.
Though I wouldn't say no to "Yoda: Jedi College" Where we finally learn why Yoda speaks that way...


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## JonFairhurst (Feb 6, 2013)

Gag. This sounds so ...Disney.


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## NYC Composer (Feb 6, 2013)

Careful there. I'm a Disney stockholder, darnit. I want RAGING STAR WARS SUCCESS.

I must admit after the first frisson of pleasure because I enjoy sc-ifi, I came back down to earth and realized what crap the whole thing is. Opinions differ wildly on this, but I really see these films being mainly for the 13 and under crowd.

Going back to an earlier post, what a film Man on Fire was. It still gives me chills. Between that and The Good Wife, I miss Tony Scott desperately.


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## Kralc (Feb 6, 2013)

Well not as bad as Yoda, but still...
http://insidemovies.ew.com/2013/02/06/s ... boba-fett/


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## choc0thrax (Feb 6, 2013)

Han Solo is Harrison Ford. A young Han Solo would require a time machine or extensive CG to make him look young. Oh wait, they probably just want to cast someone new as Han... Here's a site that suggests Garett Hedlund should play him:

http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Who-Shou ... 35567.html

My vote would actually be for a huge asteroid to kill all of us.


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## Brian Ralston (Feb 7, 2013)

Dear Disney,

We had a stand alone "episode" with the Wookies....please for the love of all that is right in this world, don't let it happen again.



o[])


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## Guy Rowland (Feb 7, 2013)

I know what that link is.... I can't bring myself to watch again... my toes would curl so far they'd just snap right off...


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## Brian Ralston (Feb 7, 2013)

Guy Rowland @ Thu Feb 07 said:


> I know what that link is.... I can't bring myself to watch again... my toes would curl so far they'd just snap right off...



Oh come on Guy...you know you want to. 

May the force be....ahh.....you know the drill.


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## Ganvai (Feb 7, 2013)

Oh really, I would love some Han Solo Solo-Movie but just with Harrison Ford.

Must there be a Spin-Off? Anybody remembers the Ewokdisaster

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnx_nEvWQsY


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## Tatu (Feb 7, 2013)

Ganvai @ Thu Feb 07 said:


> Oh really, I would love some Han Solo Solo-Movie but just with Harrison Ford.
> 
> Must there be a Spin-Off? Anybody remembers the Ewokdisaster
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pnx_nEvWQsY


 :D 
I've never seen that one... or perhaps I did as a youngling and simply set it nicely next to all the other bad memories that I've successfully blocked away. o


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## Ben H (Feb 7, 2013)

Caravan Of Courage was okay, IIRC.

Well it was as a kid, IDK how it stands up today as I have not seen it since it was first released.


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## Ed (Feb 7, 2013)

Oh who cares what they do, surely cant be worse than what Lucas did to it.


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## JonFairhurst (Feb 7, 2013)

Read the book, Alice in Wonderland, then watch the original Disney movie. Or try the same with The Jungle Book. Then, before you spend money on firearms, remember that the people responsible are probably already dead and gone - and potentially in a very warm place.

Yes. It can be worse than what Lucas did to it.


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## Ed (Feb 7, 2013)

JonFairhurst @ Thu Feb 07 said:


> Yes. It can be worse than what Lucas did to it.



You must have a higher opinion of the prequels than I do.


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## JonFairhurst (Feb 7, 2013)

Let's be honest, the prequels were weak, but they weren't hugely different than what came before. By the third film, the franchise had already turned into a kiddie thing.

Alice in Wonderland and Jungle Book, on the other hand, were completely redesigned in Disney's whitewashed image.

I'd rather that they would shoot a murder mystery based on this: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... z2KF7EVIWy


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## handz (Feb 7, 2013)

Episode III was good... 

They should finally film Shadows of the Empire.


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## choc0thrax (Feb 7, 2013)

JonFairhurst @ Thu Feb 07 said:


> Let's be honest, the prequels were weak, but they weren't hugely different than what came before. By the third film, the franchise had already turned into a kiddie thing.



Let's do a comparison between ROTJ and the prequels:

ROTJ: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... xj8I#t=64s

AOTC: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hi5jjXTPtyY

I think ROTJ comes out on top although AOTC is clearly dealing with bigger themes. The theme of sand for example.


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## Ed (Feb 7, 2013)

JonFairhurst @ Thu Feb 07 said:


> Let's be honest, the prequels were weak, but they weren't hugely different than what came before. By the third film, the franchise had already turned into a kiddie thing.



Honestly? 

Looks like you need to watch *Red Letter Media's reviews* on all 3 prequels. Then you will realise how badly written and made they are and why Lucas lost his mind in CGI, cuz its just easy to sit in a chair all day next to no set and a massive green screen!


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## JonFairhurst (Feb 7, 2013)

How we feel about the films depends on point of view. I was a young man when Return of the Jedi came out, and absolutely hated it. The Ewok thing was beyond lame. The shark had been jumped.

When The Phantom Menace arrived, I had three kids of pod-racing age, and the whole family found the film entertaining, Jar-Jar aside. Different perspective, difference experience.

Frankly, the original is the only one that I truly like. The Empire Strikes Back has always felt a bit hollow to me - not terrible by any means, just not all that compelling. I think it's a story arc issue. Much of the film lacks a proactive protagonist. 

Then again, for many, this is their favorite. I can see that as it has the most serious tone.

For me, the last two prequels were especially bad. But maybe you don't appreciate how deeply I detest Alice in Wonderland and The Jungle Book. To me, these were like criminal acts. So when I say Disney could do worse, I don't mean that Lucas did well. I mean that Disney has it within its corporate capability to rape the franchise to new depths.


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## Darthmorphling (Feb 7, 2013)

This past summer my kids and I watched the entire saga. It was hard for me to sit through Ep 1 and 2, but my kids loved them the most. 

I do worry what Disney is planning, especially with all of the talk about standalone movies.

What gives me hope is that Abrams is attached, and Disney did a wonderful job with Pirates.

Episode 3 is easily better than Jedi though. Order of preference: 4, 5, 3, 6, 2, 1


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## choc0thrax (Feb 8, 2013)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nF_lJTGKFP0


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## Guy Rowland (Feb 8, 2013)

choc0thrax @ Fri Feb 08 said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nF_lJTGKFP0



Precisely. For 5 minutes.

I actually thought III was possibly even worse than I and II - definitely I actually. Red Letter Media have the monopoly here on complete insight - structure and character is permanently to cock among all three prequels - but you just take it on best / worst bits. Sure ep 1 has Jar Jar, but hey, it's for kids (ducks). But it has the podrace, the best single sequence in any of the prequels. The build up and the race itself is genuinely good I think (and Ben Burtt at his finest).

Ep II has the love story. This can't be erased even with powerful mind rubbers. It has nothing else, except one cool sound design moment when those mines blow up in space. It's only Ben left now.

Ep III tries hardest and falls furthest. The fight on the lava flow... for heavens sake. The delusions of appealing to an adult audience undo the kid defence of epI - indeed the certificate locks kids out which is ridiculous. And it's just awful. And most of all....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nF_lJTGKFP0

Jedi's no picnic either, but it's Citizen Kane next to these three. Actually I'm with Jon - only the first one is REALLY good.


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## midi_controller (Feb 8, 2013)

Darthmorphling @ Thu Feb 07 said:


> Episode 3 is easily better than Jedi though. Order of preference: 4, 5, 3, 6, 2, 1



WHAT?!?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RFvAeS ... age#t=151s

I rest my case. This is, by far, my favorite moment in all the films, and one of my favorite cues by Williams. :D

(Sorry for the mono sound, couldn't find one in stereo)


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## dedersen (Feb 10, 2013)

Ed @ Fri Feb 08 said:


> Looks like you need to watch *Red Letter Media's reviews* on all 3 prequels. Then you will realise how badly written and made they are and why Lucas lost his mind in CGI, cuz its just easy to sit in a chair all day next to no set and a massive green screen!


Wow, thanks for linking those reviews. Some of the funnies reviews I have ever seen.


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## Ed (Feb 10, 2013)

dedersen @ Sun Feb 10 said:


> Ed @ Fri Feb 08 said:
> 
> 
> > Looks like you need to watch *Red Letter Media's reviews* on all 3 prequels. Then you will realise how badly written and made they are and why Lucas lost his mind in CGI, cuz its just easy to sit in a chair all day next to no set and a massive green screen!
> ...



Glad you found it!  The Star Trek ones are brilliant as well.


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## choc0thrax (Feb 10, 2013)

I follow Red Letter Media on Twitter so I always know when new videos are up. I think they're great but wish they'd stop going so easy on some of the films they review.


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## Ed (Feb 11, 2013)

choc0thrax @ Sun Feb 10 said:


> I follow Red Letter Media on Twitter so I always know when new videos are up. I think they're great but wish they'd stop going so easy on some of the films they review.



You mean with Half In The Bag reviews or just the Mr Plinkett ones? I didnt like the Half In the Bag stuff when I first watched it but after I came to terms with it not being Mr Plinkett I watched all of them.


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## Darthmorphling (Feb 11, 2013)

midi_controller @ Fri Feb 08 said:


> Darthmorphling @ Thu Feb 07 said:
> 
> 
> > Episode 3 is easily better than Jedi though. Order of preference: 4, 5, 3, 6, 2, 1
> ...



The entire last half of Jedi is just mediocre at best. Vader's redemption being the only bright spot.


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## choc0thrax (Feb 11, 2013)

Ed @ Mon Feb 11 said:


> choc0thrax @ Sun Feb 10 said:
> 
> 
> > I follow Red Letter Media on Twitter so I always know when new videos are up. I think they're great but wish they'd stop going so easy on some of the films they review.
> ...



Yeah, half in the bag. I actually think Jay is quite funny. And it's pretty rare for me to find internet based comedy dudes funny. So far it's just these guys and David Thorne, who JohnG turned me on to.


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## Guy Rowland (Feb 21, 2013)

Mark Hamill weighs in...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2013/feb ... wars-movie


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## R.Cato (Apr 30, 2013)

Anybody else got the rumors that J.J. Abrams said John Williams will write the music for Ep VII during the press conference for Star Trek in Berlin?


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## choc0thrax (Apr 30, 2013)

R.Cato @ Tue Apr 30 said:


> Anybody else got the rumors that J.J. Abrams said John Williams will write the music for Ep VII during the press conference for Star Trek in Berlin?



It looks like it'll probably be Williams. Giacchino recently said: "He has been a great inspiration to me over the years," he continued. "He has been a great teacher to me and good friend and I would love nothing more than to hear more of his music from that universe."

"If it were up to me I would say 'John, you must do it.'"


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## Brian Ralston (Apr 30, 2013)

Brian Ralston @ Fri Jan 25 said:


> My Disney "insider" tells me NOT to assume it will be Giacchino. They (Disney) knows how important Williams is to the franchise. And that Disney will ultimately control every aspect of this franchise, not JJ. I have to trust them to some degree. Their exact words to me were "It will be Williams." Also...with Kathleen Kennedy running Lucasefilm under Disney...and every film she has been, it has been Williams as well.
> 
> Now...whether that ends up that way or not...we will see. But...there it is...



See? As I was saying... :wink: 

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/62210


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