# Suggest me a guitar interface for direct recording with spdif out...



## bosone (May 15, 2021)

as described in the title...
I'm looking for an interface for direct recording my guitar and reamping it with software (guitar rig, amplitube... using heavy distortion!) with an spdif out. 
it should have a very low background noise.
now I'm using a focusrite isa ONE but, when i put in some heavy distortion, it has a really annoying fuzz and noise

i cannot use an interface with USB out because i already have my ASIO soundcard (Creamware Scope System)

thanks!


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## Dewdman42 (May 15, 2021)

I think the IK Axe IO is the best one I've ever seen for recording guitar direct. doesn't have SPDIF though.

It does have built in support for re-amping and numerous other guitar features..and it sounds and feels sweet. 

But you'd have to use USB... why can't you use two USB devices?


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## gsilbers (May 15, 2021)

bosone said:


> as described in the title...
> I'm looking for an interface for direct recording my guitar and reamping it with software (guitar rig, amplitube... using heavy distortion!) with an spdif out.
> it should have a very low background noise.
> now I'm using a focusrite isa ONE but, when i put in some heavy distortion, it has a really annoying fuzz and noise
> ...


axefx 








Fractal Axe-FX II Preamp FX Processor Review


“This thing is the greatest invention ever for electric guitarists,” Dweezil Zappa told Premier Guitar at last year’s LA Amp Show as he gushed over Fractal Audio’s new Axe-Fx




www.premierguitar.com


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## bosone (May 15, 2021)

Dewdman42 said:


> I think the IK Axe IO is the best one I've ever seen for recording guitar direct. doesn't have SPDIF though.
> 
> It does have built in support for re-amping and numerous other guitar features..and it sounds and feels sweet.
> 
> But you'd have to use USB... why can't you use two USB devices?


I have looked at the AXE IO but I cannot couple an USB audio card to my PCI Scope System that works with ASIO...
is the line out very noisy?


The AxeFX is defintely too expensive for me!


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## Dewdman42 (May 15, 2021)

what do you mean by "couple"?


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## bosone (May 15, 2021)

Dewdman42 said:


> what do you mean by "couple"?


using both my scope in ASIO and AXE IO USB audio in Sonar...

the solution would be to route AXE IO line out to one of my Scope Audio In, but I fear the resulting noise...


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## Dewdman42 (May 15, 2021)

you can use more than one audio device in Sonar regardless of whether they are both USB or both PCI or anything else. They both will appear in Sonar as available devices and you can use them at the same time.


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## bosone (May 15, 2021)

I have tried but only one ASIO driver shows in sonar.
if I use Scope in ASIO mode then I am forced to use only that. no other audio device can be used at the same time...


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## rrichard63 (May 15, 2021)

Dewdman42 said:


> you can use more than one audio device in Sonar regardless of whether they are both USB or both PCI or anything else. They both will appear in Sonar as available devices and you can use them at the same time.


I don't have Cakewalk (as the current version of Sonar is called) installed and can't check on this right now. But if it does let you use multiple ASIO devices at the same time, it would be unusual among DAWs. At least on Windows. The Mac operating system might be different.


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## bosone (May 15, 2021)

Honestly I have tried a second usb card but I don't see the corresponding asio drivers showing. The only asio in and out I see is the scope ones... I don't know how to check!
The axe io has asio drivers?


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## chimuelo (May 15, 2021)

Connect an Antelope FPGA rack to Scope via Digital I/O.
Haven’t tried that but if a Lynx I/O via AES/EBU-SP/DIF works an Antelope rack should work.


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## Trash Panda (May 15, 2021)

bosone said:


> as described in the title...
> I'm looking for an interface for direct recording my guitar and reamping it with software (guitar rig, amplitube... using heavy distortion!) with an spdif out.
> it should have a very low background noise.
> now I'm using a focusrite isa ONE but, when i put in some heavy distortion, it has a really annoying fuzz and noise
> ...


Do you get the fuzz and noise when you’re running a dry signal?


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## Dewdman42 (May 15, 2021)

not all audio devices have ASIO drivers. You'll have to check with IK to see if they provide them or not. You can sometimes use ASIO4ALL and get it to work that way too.


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## darkogav (May 15, 2021)

I hear good stuff about the Zen Go. I dont have it so can't comment. But it has SPIDF out.






USB Audio Interface | Zen Go Synergy Core | Antelope Audio


Zen Go Synergy Core is a USB audio interface that is bus-powered and features 2 discrete preamps and 37 Synergy Core analog-modeled effects included.




en.antelopeaudio.com


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## Dewdman42 (May 15, 2021)

Honestly for GUITAR work I highly recommend you get a device such as the AXE IO which is designed for guitar high impedance signals. You can always use a direct box for that too, but the AXEIO has an adjustment knob to dial it in and some tech they invented, and truly..its the best my guitar has ever sounded and felt through software sims. Plus it has hardware channels designed for re-amping, etc.

If it were me, even If I had to Switch Sonar over to use the AXEIO while recording my guitar part and then switch back to your other audio device for the rest of the time, that would be preferable in my mind then trying to mess around with SPDIF, etc..which is unlikely to find in a guitar-oriented device also.

Anyway, if not that one then just get a DI box and plug your guitar into that and from that go into your existing Audio interface. That will take care of the impedance more or less and should be good enough to record your guitar through whatever sims you want.

but for re-amping that is a complicated topic because technically if you are going to re-amp through an external real guitar amp..you will need and want the output from your DAW to be high impedance to send through the amp. That's where the AXEIO comes in again..but if not, then you have to buy some other hardware if you want to translate the output from your audio device into high impedance suitable for typical guitar amps, pedals, etc


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## RAdkins (May 15, 2021)

Check out the Motu hybrid ultralite mk5.


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## rrichard63 (May 15, 2021)

bosone said:


> I'm looking for an interface for direct recording my guitar and reamping it with software (guitar rig, amplitube... using heavy distortion!) with an spdif out.


What is the purpose of the SPDIF output? What outboard gear will it connect to?


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## bosone (May 15, 2021)

Thanks again for the reply!
the reamp will be done via software and the noise really comes in wen i apply heavy distorted hi-gain models. I know the noise would be there even if i connect a real hi-gain amp, but this noise is different, very "electrical background", don't know how to describe it!

i chose SPDIF because I have several SPDIF in my setup, provided directly by my scope cards.

I will definitely try a di box: i have a Boss DI-1 somewhere in my room, purchased in a second-hand market decades ago!


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## wst3 (May 16, 2021)

If you are limited to ASIO for any of your devices, and you are using Windows you are out of luck. There is no way to aggregate ASIO drivers under Windows, at least not with usable latency (Asio4All does it, but adds way too much latency).

However, if you are using Sonar or Cakewalk, and your devices have WASAPI or WDM drivers you can aggregate devices, and there is no hit with respect to latency except that which might be part of a poorly written driver (and WDM is not as well known as ASIO, so it happens.)

I use multiple USB audio interfaces - UA Apollo Twin USB, Presonus 1818VSL, and Line 6 Helix) and they can work together. It's been a while since I configured them, but I think Presonus supports WASAPI and Line6 supports WDM, both in addition to ASIO.

Anyway, if your devices have alternate drivers you can make this work.

As far as a guitar input goes - I use the Apollo Twin almost all the time to access the Unison plugins. It works well, and the instrument input impedance works well with my guitars.


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## Dewdman42 (May 16, 2021)

I would just get a DI and use it with your existing audio interface then. Record the dry guitar signal so you choose software amps later. Find one that is well regarded for electric guitar. There are cheap ones and better ones and expensive ones, not all are equal and usually active ones are better but the boss would be a good test for you and might serve you fine.

Some audio interfaces will have some of the audio inputs setup to receive a wider range of input signals and impedance; and they will label them as “instrument” inputs. That is usually good enough for a lot of people, but a DI will probably eliminate the hum problems you’re having without a DI


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## darkogav (May 16, 2021)

bosone said:


> Thanks again for the reply!
> the reamp will be done via software and the noise really comes in wen i apply heavy distorted hi-gain models. I know the noise would be there even if i connect a real hi-gain amp, but this noise is different, very "electrical background", don't know how to describe it!
> 
> i chose SPDIF because I have several SPDIF in my setup, provided directly by my scope cards.
> ...


can you post example of noise?

did you try this? its free. you can also tweak the frequency.



Using Hum Removal




FWIW.. high gain on single coil pickups is a reality in life.


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## Trash Panda (May 16, 2021)

bosone said:


> Thanks again for the reply!
> the reamp will be done via software and the noise really comes in wen i apply heavy distorted hi-gain models. I know the noise would be there even if i connect a real hi-gain amp, but this noise is different, very "electrical background", don't know how to describe it!


If you’re not getting this hum on a dry signal, there is a good chance the issue is not your interface. Are you running an overdrive pedal in front of the high gain amp? If not, digital amps tend to get very unpleasant when you crank the gain.

Typically it’s best to run an overdrive pedal with the volume cranked to 10, drive at 0 or 0.1-1, tone to taste in front of the amp. Then since you have a “hot” signal running into the amp, you can get that thick, saturated distortion at a much lower gain level without all the digital nastiness.

Try that first to see if it clears up the issue before dropping more cash. Also, which program are you running? Some tend to have more unpleasant artifacts in their amp Modeling than others.

And this may be obvious, but make sure you’re running the output of any high gain amp through a speaker emulation or impulse response, or nothing will make it sound good.


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## dohm (May 17, 2021)

I may be missing the point, but it seems like a Kemper would solve all your problems and give you everything you need for studio recording. I love mine. It also has spdif output and works like a champ for re-amping configurations. It is not an audio interface for your DAW, but I'm assuming you have something else for this based on your description.


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## bosone (May 17, 2021)

dohm said:


> I may be missing the point, but it seems like a Kemper would solve all your problems and give you everything you need for studio recording. I love mine. It also has spdif output and works like a champ for re-amping configurations. It is not an audio interface for your DAW, but I'm assuming you have something else for this based on your description.


yeah, if only it was less expensive... 
never tried it, anyway, but i have read wonders about it


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## GtrString (May 18, 2021)

If you cant plunge for a Kemper or AxeFx, try find a used Eleven Rack. It is really good, can do what you want and works well with spdif.


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## easyrider (May 18, 2021)

Dewdman42 said:


> I would just get a DI and use it with your existing audio interface then. Record the dry guitar signal so you choose software amps later. Find one that is well regarded for electric guitar. There are cheap ones and better ones and expensive ones, not all are equal and usually active ones are better but the boss would be a good test for you and might serve you fine.
> 
> Some audio interfaces will have some of the audio inputs setup to receive a wider range of input signals and impedance; and they will label them as “instrument” inputs. That is usually good enough for a lot of people, but a DI will probably eliminate the hum problems you’re having without a DI


You do know the Focuwrite ISA One has a high class DI input don’t you ?


https://pro.focusrite.com/category/mic-pres/item/isa-one#images


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## bosone (May 18, 2021)

I know and I'm even using it, with spdif connection to my card
That's the noisy problem...
I will record some examples when I have some time...


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## easyrider (May 18, 2021)

bosone said:


> yeah, if only it was less expensive...
> never tried it, anyway, but i have read wonders about it


You are using the DI input of the ISA one ?

I have owned this unit and there should be no noise from it like you describe... Have you checked your gain levels and are not distorting the soundcard input?

Fair bit of nonsense already posted in this thread tbh....people suggesting DI boxes etc....the ISA one is a pro unit.


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## easyrider (May 18, 2021)

bosone said:


> I know and I'm even using it, with spdif connection to my card
> That's the noisy problem...
> I will record some examples when I have some time...


The reply you got was suggesting to buy another DI....😩


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## easyrider (May 18, 2021)

bosone said:


> I know and I'm even using it, with spdif connection to my card
> That's the noisy problem...
> I will record some examples when I have some time...


Please post a link to your actual card.


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## bosone (May 18, 2021)

thank everyone for the kind interest! 
my main card is the creamware - sonic core Scope system, definitely high-end
the trouble I have with the ISA ONE is when I add distortion / high gain amps to reamp my guitar. the background noise is very "unpleasant" and not "realistic", I know that cranking the gain on a real amp result in noise, but it is a different kind of noise, i don't know how to explain!
so, I thought the reason was something "broken" in my signal chain, but when i built my setup I chose ISA ONE because it has a direct in and the digital out, so I thought the noise would be minimized.
The problem is very evident at the release of the notes: i cannot sustain the note for long because at some point the background noise becomes dominant and it's not "musical" at all!

usually i recorded the guitars using the DI gain about at half. the signal did not clip and the sound was nice...at least with the clean signal or mid-distortion.
now I found that keeping the ISA ONE DI gain to the very minimum somewhat helped in reducing the noise i have with high-distortion.


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## easyrider (May 18, 2021)

bosone said:


> thank everyone for the kind interest!
> my main card is the creamware - sonic core Scope system, definitely high-end
> the trouble I have with the ISA ONE is when I add distortion / high gain amps to reamp my guitar. the background noise is very "unpleasant" and not "realistic", I know that cranking the gain on a real amp result in noise, but it is a different kind of noise, i don't know how to explain!
> so, I thought the reason was something "broken" in my signal chain, but when i built my setup I chose ISA ONE because it has a direct in and the digital out, so I thought the noise would be minimized.
> ...


Please post your signal chain. And a link to ACTUAL card.

Can you record a clean DI input from the ISA one into the Soundcard into your DAW?


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## bosone (May 18, 2021)

easyrider said:


> Please post your signal chain. And a link to ACTUAL card.
> 
> Can you record a clean DI input from the ISA one into the Soundcard into your DAW?


the card manufacture is this: https://scope.zone/ but the scope I have is not sold anymore (Scope Pro, 15 DSP + Pulsar II, 6 DSP)
I go straight into the ISA ONE DI input with the guitar, and from here with SPDIF Cable to the scope digital it. the ISA ONE is the clock master.
Scope handles all my physical inputs, that are routed software to Cakewalk ASIO input
.
I will try to record it next week, now I'm quite busy and away from my PC! 

thanks again!


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## Dewdman42 (May 18, 2021)

easyrider said:


> You do know the Focuwrite ISA One has a high class DI input don’t you ?
> 
> 
> https://pro.focusrite.com/category/mic-pres/item/isa-one#images



He mentioned the scope system and I was assuming it doesn’t have instrument level input. If there is an instrument level input then I agree, use it! 

There are numerous audio interfaces that include at least a couple so called “instrument” inputs which are essentially built in DI’s. I’m sure the focusrite one you describe must be a nice one I do not keep track of all of them. If that is what the op already has then yea first step is make sure to use the correct input.


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## rhizomusicosmos (May 19, 2021)

There are two things I would suggest:

1. Guitars, especially with single coil pickups, tend to pick up stray EMI from other equipment. I've had this happen with my Strat Plus -- simply shifting position can change the level of interference from monitors and computers, etc. Guitar pickups are coils of wire and can be great antennas, so perhaps try moving away from your computer and find a position that makes a change to the amount of noise.

2. Grounding: I see that the ISA One has both AES/EBU and optical digital connections. Are you using an optical cable to connect to the Scope card? Try a balanced analogue connection from the ISA One to the Scope and check how it sounds over both the analogue and digital paths from the preamp. You may find that just connecting a balanced analogue cable will clean up grounding noise, if that is the problem.


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## bosone (May 20, 2021)

Thanks again
Usually I recorded my guitars with the DI gain at about half.
I discovered that just by turning the DI gain at minimum the noise is much lower.
Even at half gain the signal did not clip and I have quite a lot headroom (6-7 db maybe).
with the minimum gain the signal is quieter but the results with the hi-gain amp models are much better.
I will continue my tests and post the results as soon as I have time to work more calmly

meanwhile thanks a lot to everyone!


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## Dewdman42 (May 20, 2021)

Guitar noise can be created by various things. gain staging(ie, the level) is important of course, but you can also get ground loops, impedance mismatching and other things which generally cannot be rectified by simply changing the level. Bad shielding in the guitar electronics can cause noise...certain kinds of lights in the room, etc. If you sit facing your computer screen while you play, can sometimes bleed into the pickups, etc..

For getting your guitar signal into the computer, you have to worry about ground loops...there are all kinds of ways for ground loops to leak into the signal...your computer is connected to networks and midi interfaces and all kinds of things that can potentially create ground loops...this is a significant source of noise in guitar rigs, IMHO.

Guitar cables can create loss of signal and noise also. Most of the noise you are getting is between your guitar pickups and the DI. Once the signal is line level (after the DI), there is probably not much new noise happening...especially if its balanced.

I feel like you are trying to use the FocusRite in order to use SPDIF, in hopes that will eliminate the noise, but the noise is not coming from that link, it will be coming from your guitar more than anything. I think if you have a properly matched instrument input for your guitar, and have reduced noise possibilities...you should not notice much of any difference between using audio line level cables between FocusRite and Scope....or SPDIF. While it might seem clever to use digital for that, there are other issues such as clock sync and so forth...But the main reason for preferring SPDIF in that situation would be to avoid an unneccesary conversion from digital to audio, only to be converted back to digital again in the Scope. but the noise is most likely NOT coming from the line level audio cables between those interfaces.....its coming from your guitar to the DI...and/or a mismatched audio input for the guitar.

About that, you have mentioned level adjustments, but with guitar you have to worry about matching impedance, which is not the same as level. HEre's a brief article

https://www.soundonsound.com/sound-advice/q-what-are-correct-input-impedances-guitars-and-mics
Guitars and guitar amps and pedals are are all basically around 1M ohms. (one million). That FocusRite is rated to take instruments (on the proper input) between 300k and 1M ohms...so theoretically it should handle your guitar...but bare in mind that is a fairly wide range of impedance, the DI is designed accept a wider variety of source material..which or may not be ideal for electric guitar. Using a DI that is as close to possible to a typical 1M ohm guitar amp input will really be most ideal to make most effective use of your guitar's pickups...and yes..that will help eliminate noise! It will also make your guitar feel and sound better.

If you have the right analog DI, you can plug that directly into your Scope, rather then messing around with SPDIF or concerning about digital sync, etc. The line level connection between DI and Scope will not add appreciable noise nor ruin the sound, in fact it may warm it up a bit anyway, IMHO might even help for guitar work. The reason you would use SPDIF with the FocusRite is because it has to be converted from analog to Digital in the FocusRite...so you don't want to convert it back to analog and then back to digital in the Scope again. By using SPDIF you avoid that extra conversion (and latency). But...if you use an analog DI...then there is no latency added and no conversion added, and you can make sure you get a DI that is ideally suited for the guitar pickups you are using.

The nice thing about that IK AXEIO is that you can adjust the impedance from 1M ohm all the way down to 2k. Here is what they say about it:



> AXE I/O’s patent pending Z-TONE® circuit lets you dial in impedance from 1 MOhm (“sharp”) down to 2.2 kOhms (“bold”) that interacts with your pick-ups.
> 
> At the maximum impedance, you’ll find your sound tighter, sharper and more precise. Increase the load and the sound becomes more thick and bold.



See here: https://www.ikmultimedia.com/products/axeio/

They also have an analog DI box you can use, that I think would be ideal for you...






Z-TONE DI


Active DI/preamp with advanced tone shaping




www.ikmultimedia.com





In this case you would run through the DI, run balanced line level cable to your Scope and be done with it, but numerous ways to adjust the impedance and other factors to fine tune the way your guitar interacts as if plugged into a real guitar amp. Your guitar pickups generally want to plug into a 1M ohm guitar amp..that's all I'm saying.


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## rrichard63 (May 20, 2021)

Dewdman42 said:


> I feel like you are trying to use the FocusRite in order to use SPDIF, in hopes that will eliminate the noise, but the noise is not coming from that link ...


I think this is the essential point. Just make sure that whatever DI you use doesn't overdrive the Creamware interface's analog input, and that the connection between the DI and the interface is balanced.


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## easyrider (May 20, 2021)

Dewdman42 said:


> Guitar noise can be created by various things. gain staging(ie, the level) is important of course, but you can also get ground loops, impedance mismatching and other things which generally cannot be rectified by simply changing the level. Bad shielding in the guitar electronics can cause noise...certain kinds of lights in the room, etc. If you sit facing your computer screen while you play, can sometimes bleed into the pickups, etc..
> 
> For getting your guitar signal into the computer, you have to worry about ground loops...there are all kinds of ways for ground loops to leak into the signal...your computer is connected to networks and midi interfaces and all kinds of things that can potentially create ground loops...this is a significant source of noise in guitar rigs, IMHO.
> 
> ...


Another post telling the OP to buy a DI......sigh.....


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## Dewdman42 (May 20, 2021)

rrichard63 said:


> I think this is the essential point. Just make sure that whatever DI you use doesn't overdrive the Creamware interface's analog input, and that the connection between the DI and the interface is balanced.


Yes

Any DI used needs to have levels and impedance matched on both sides. It should be guitar level on one side and the other side should be either line level or mic level with appropriate impedance. If the Scope has mic level inputs then the DI needs to match that. If the Scope has line level inputs, then the DI should output that. both level and impedance need to be matched. This is all a critical part. But on the front end where the guitar plugs in, the reason I am recommending this particular one is because it is highly tuned for electric guitar! And in my own experience this thing has delivered the best amplitube sounds I have ever gotten out of this same guitar. Matching and tuning that input impedance plays smoother and cleaner and it just feels and sounds "right".

There is a cheaper one from MOTU, I have one of those also...Its like $30-50 or something..but the one from IK sounds WAY better. And definitely this AXEIO sounds better then any other instrument level input on any audio interface I have ever tried... There are other analog DI's out there too, which are targeted specifically for electric guitar and I highly recommend that.


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## Dewdman42 (May 20, 2021)

so actually I just had a short look at the ISA ONE manual. The input impedance on the instrument input is basically switchable to either 470k or 2.4M ohms.

Typical EGuitars and amps are 1M ohms. So you tell me...is that optimized for electric guitar? Will it be "good enough?" Perhaps. Certainly if the OP already has it he should try it, and sounds like he is.


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## rrichard63 (May 20, 2021)

Dewdman42 said:


> so actually I just had a short look at the ISA ONE manual. The input impedance on the instrument input is basically switchable to either 470k or 2.4M ohms.
> 
> Typical EGuitars and amps are 1M ohms. So you tell me...is that optimized for electric guitar? Will it be "good enough?" Perhaps. Certainly if the OP already has it he should try it, and sounds like he is.


The OP should make sure he has tried the 2.4M ohm setting, because too high a value is better than too low a value. If I recall correctly, 470K ohms is indeed too low for some electric guitar pickups (not too low for others).


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## Ian Dorsch (May 21, 2021)

Another post in support of the idea that the noise is almost certainly coming from the guitar and other devices in the studio environment (ie electromagnetic interference, ground loops, etc), not the interface.

I had a similar experience when I upgraded to a new DAW PC a few years ago - the old machine had a rolled steel case w/500W PSU, the new one had a steel frame but more plastic in the construction, a 1000W PSU, a huge vent on top of the case for exhaust fans, etc. Suddenly all of my instruments with active pickups had all this disgusting electronic noise.

The low tech, free fix for me was to find a place in the room where the interference was minimal. I found that if I moved a few feet from the PC and turned 90 degrees away from the tower and monitors, the signal would clean up to the point where it was acceptable. Not a 100% solution, but maybe better than spending countless hours and hundreds of dollars trying to troubleshoot hardware.


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## easyrider (May 21, 2021)

Power conditioners work wonders....I will not use my guitar or amps without one of these...



My studio has them peppered around the place.


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