# Doepfer keyboards



## MediaComposer88 (Aug 15, 2014)

In my quest for the perfect (currently non-existent) MIDI controller, I came across Doepfer keyboards and read it is quite popular with professionals.

Still, I couldn't help thinking: why would you pay that much for a keyboard containing a Fatar keybed also found in far lower priced models by for instance StudioLogic? Any reasons why the Doepfer keyboards are still in a different league (because of the electronic parts perhaps)?


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## ed buller (Aug 15, 2014)

hi

i'm not sure you can get the same action in a studio logic keyboard. Certainly the one i have is NOT the same as the doepfer

e


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## ed buller (Aug 15, 2014)

opps

appears this puppy has the same:

http://www.studiologic-music.com/sl-990-pro-specifications.html (http://www.studiologic-music.com/sl-990 ... tions.html)

e


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## muk (Aug 15, 2014)

Never understood that myself. It must be the sturdy case and/or the electronics. If you already are in that pricerange I'd personally go with digital pianos in a heartbeat over any midi controller. To me, the keybeds of midi controllers just weren't sensitive enough for subtle, nuanced playing and didn't feel right. I have never played a Doepfer though, only various Fatar keybeds.

So, if you are willing to spend big include some digital pianos in your search. They lack midi controller features obviously, but I could easily add them at a low cost (TEC Breath Controller, Korg nanoKontrol for sliders...). And to me their keybeds were much more enjoyable to play.


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## ed buller (Aug 15, 2014)

which would you recommend ?

e


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## muk (Aug 15, 2014)

I'm using a Roland FP 7F and it's great for me. But I don't know whether they are still in production. I also tested a Kawai Mp 10, which had a good keybed too. Liked it slightly less than the Roland though. A cheaper option was the Roland FP 4F. I really liked that keybed. It wasn't on the same level as the 7F exactly, but for only half the price it held up very well. Then there were some Yamaha's I have forgotten about as they haven't convinced me.

A newer one that I haven't tested is the Roland A-88. It has the same Ivory Feel-G keybed as the FP 4F, and costs less than a Doepfer. Some fancy controller options are on board as well, but I don't know if they are any good. If my budget was under 1000$ I'd definitely give this one a try, and some of the Casio models which tend to be decent at a low price.


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## JW (Aug 15, 2014)

Hey MediaComposer88, 

I'm in the same boat as you...quest for a terrific 88 key midi controller with an outstanding key bed. I've been wanting to hear some feedback from Deopfer users too. 

I'm also looking into the *Physis K4*. Unfortunately, I don't even know if it's really available in the US yet. While trying to look for honest feedback about this board, I haven't been able to find too many posts about it. It's rather expensive too. 

http://www.physispiano.com/products.php?physis-piano-k4---k5 (http://www.physispiano.com/products.php ... no-k4---k5) 

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that the Arturia Keylab 88 might be the way to go...although, I too have read about the poor customer service that many owners have complained about regarding the Keylab series, and the software bugs don't leave me feeling very confident about purchasing it when it becomes available. I suppose I will wait and see. Maybe they have ironed out all the current issues? 

I may just spring for the Kawai MP7. Any users of the MP7 want to chime in about it's shortcomings or strengths as a midi controller? 

Thanks in advance,
JW


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## proxima (Aug 15, 2014)

JW @ Fri Aug 15 said:


> I may just spring for the Kawai MP7. Any users of the MP7 want to chime in about it's shortcomings or strengths as a midi controller?


I have an MP11, its heavier and larger sibling. I like it as a MIDI controller - the pitch bend and mod wheels are up slightly instead of way to the left, it has a really convenient control for "local off" and midi zones (I like to use its internal piano sounds when just playing). The MP11 has enough space on its top to hold a small keyboard, trackpad and mouse, and a nanokontrol (there aren't many controls included besides the basics), and it looks like the MP7 doesn't have that room. 

I think the MP7 might be a good option, and it's spared some of the downsides of the MP11's fancier action: weight and consistency. The wooden action of the MP11 (and Yamaha's CP4, for example) can lead to issues with humidity causing sticking keys, uneven spacing, etc. Given damage during shipping, I went through more than one MP10 (and then MP11 after it was released), because they were basically broken on arrival. I've never played the MP7's action, though, so I can't compare it to the MP11/CP4/etc I've tried.


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## JW (Aug 15, 2014)

Thanks for chiming in Proxima! I appreciate your feedback. I'm really into the Kawai MP series feel. The MP11 is awesome, but out of my price point. I liked the action of the MP7 when I played it. I'm leaning strongly toward the MP7. Thanks again.


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## ed buller (Aug 15, 2014)

Hi

thanks for all the suggestions but these are much pricier items than either the studio-logic or doepfer £1200 for the kawai 

e


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## snattack (Aug 15, 2014)

I have a Doepfer LMK2+, very happy with it. I bought it because:

- excellent keys (Fatar made)

- it's the thinnest 88 weighted keys controller avaliable = better ergonomics at the workstation when mounting it on a custom made installation under the desk

- built into a hardcase = convinient when I need to use it live, any other keyboard weights at least double inside a regular hard case (which also needs to be bought separately)

Drawbacks:

- cannot change CC number on the expression pedal

- no controllers except modwheel & pitch wheel (I'd like to have a second wheel for vibrato control as the LMK 4+ has).


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## Uncle Peter (Aug 15, 2014)

It seems that the driver for the LMK2+ doesn't work very well with Win7. I think it's just a generic midi driver but having contacted their support the answer was to connect the USB cable to an external USB hub. But that doesn't fix the bug either. 

The bug being that the driver isn't recognised a lot of the time.. so I have to pull the USB cable out and reinsert it in the hope that the computer recognises it. It's quite annoying. 

Any fixes anyone? ta


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## PeterKorcek (Aug 15, 2014)

snattack @ Fri Aug 15 said:


> I have a Doepfer LMK2+, very happy with it. I bought it because:
> 
> - excellent keys (Fatar made)
> 
> ...



Thats what he said  Have the LMK2+ as well, been moving with the keyboard several times so its sturdy construction came in handy, keys are fantastic, con is the aforementioned lack of proper controller environment


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## proxima (Aug 15, 2014)

SilentBob @ Fri Aug 15 said:


> I cannot recommend the *MP11* as a midi-controller because of the keys. It's impossible to reach velocities near 120 and beyond. On the other side low velocities are difficult to control. Fortunately the dealer took the MP11 back. But as an instrument / Digital Piano it is fantastic and a joy to play.


I literally just tested this on my MP11. I could certainly hit 127, and the low end performed about as well as my MAudio Axiom25 (in that it's difficult to go below 30 reliably with the normal touch sensitivity). So it's completely false that it's "impossible" to each velocities near 120. 

Of course, you can adjust the sensitivity curves, even playing in one to your liking. Did you try this?


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## holywilly (Aug 15, 2014)

We had ordered 5 Studio Logic keyboards for our studio and all of them are sending weird CC signal after couple months of usage. Not recommend Studio Logic keyboard anymore! Although the keys are quite nice to play.


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## MediaComposer88 (Aug 16, 2014)

That's some good feedback here.



holywilly @ 2014-08-16 said:


> We had ordered 5 Studio Logic keyboards for our studio and all of them are sending weird CC signal after couple months of usage. Not recommend Studio Logic keyboard anymore! Although the keys are quite nice to play.



Now, that's quite a scary story. Was it with different models or 5 times the same one?


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## eric aron (Aug 16, 2014)

here using Kawai MP 10, the best piano keyboard i ever had, no velocities issues, very precise touch and response, properly weighted. until now all other brands (i tried and bought so many) don't come close. will soon change it for a VPC 1, as i dont use the internal sounds and need all the top space for control surfaces. 

a cheaper and lighter alternative with still good response can be the Yamaha CP33, which i use for abroad concerts. 

i also have a Studiologic VMK 188 plus in another place, but mediocre compared to


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## holywilly (Aug 16, 2014)

MediaComposer88 @ Sat Aug 16 said:


> That's some good feedback here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



We orderd VMK 188 Plus 2 years ago, all of them have been sending "unexpected CC signal" after one year of usage, and one of the keyboards has several bad keys issue.

we have a Kurzweil PC3 and a Korg Triton Pro X, both are working like tanks, extremely solid.

Now my studio is looking for new master keyboard solution, I've heard lots of good feed backs of Doepfer, is this keyboard rock solid for decades?


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## Ozymandias (Aug 16, 2014)

holywilly,

Well, the action is Studiologic, so I wouldn't like to place any bets. :lol:


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## MediaComposer88 (Aug 17, 2014)

holywilly @ 2014-08-16 said:


> MediaComposer88 @ Sat Aug 16 said:
> 
> 
> > That's some good feedback here.
> ...



Thanks for these insights! I read about this "unexpected CC signal" with StudioLogic boards elsewhere too.


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## 24dBFS (Aug 17, 2014)

Hi MediaComposer88,

I use both StudioLogic and Doepfer LMK4 and the keys are indeed from the same Fatar factory in Italy but this is the only thing they have in common.

I tried both customer services when I had issues and Studiologic tech support was basically unavailable while a Doepfer guy called me on a given number I left in a mail within 1 hour. He explained all I needed to know and I was good to go within minutes.

For me this is a huge difference when you are on the clock and something happens (my LMK4 PitchWheel needed resetting and he did it with me on the phone in 5 minutes).

Another huge difference is the quality of the product, Doepfer is build more like a tank in a hard case while my Studiologic is made of a very cheap plastic, about the quality of the buttons and sliders I say just that - poor - nothing like the Doepfer. 

OK, the technology behind Doepfer's MIDI brain is an old one but it is reliable and working 24/7 without any bells and whistles. No sliders or pads and only few knobs but it just works for years now in non-stop mode. 
Few friends of mine took the LMK4 out of the case and build those inside their producer desks for immediate reach.

The Fatar keys are very good and the feel is different from Roland, Kawai, Yamaha or any M-Audio etc. 
In Europe you can find them on eBay but in the USA they are not so easy to get used.

Cheers!


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## Walra48 (Aug 17, 2014)

I agree with 24dBFS. I have a Studiologic SL-880 Pro which I purchased new in 2004. Absolutely fabulous keyboard action but the fit and finish is not very good. Mine has lived all its life in my studio so it has had a pretty cushy existence. Would not want to take it out on the road though.
The Doepfers do have the same keyboard, but the build apart from that is much more solid, I mean REALLY solid. They also have another advantage that many composers like, in that they can be removed easily from their cases and integrated into a studio workstation. (see James Newton Howard studio pic below). Seems trivial in and of itself, but this feature combined with the Fatar key action and the rock solid build makes it IMHO very compelling as as THE keyboard controller for a lot of media composers.


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## snattack (Aug 17, 2014)

Uncle Peter @ Fri Aug 15 said:


> It seems that the driver for the LMK2+ doesn't work very well with Win7. I think it's just a generic midi driver but having contacted their support the answer was to connect the USB cable to an external USB hub. But that doesn't fix the bug either.
> 
> The bug being that the driver isn't recognised a lot of the time.. so I have to pull the USB cable out and reinsert it in the hope that the computer recognises it. It's quite annoying.
> 
> Any fixes anyone? ta



I use mine in Windows 7, no problems here.


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## MediaComposer88 (Aug 18, 2014)

Again, some good info here. Considering the many posts I read (here and elsewhere) on StudioLogic's lack of service and quality control (same goes for M-Audio and Arturia by the way), I think I'll stay away from them.


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## samphony (Aug 18, 2014)

I use the lmk4+ build into my desk and I love it.


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## Jetzer (Aug 20, 2014)

Just bought the Doepfer lmk4+. Really excited. 

Got tired having some arm & back problems. I already have a nice desk system, but its a couple of centimeters off with my current keyboard, that can't go right under the desk. And I really wanted the 88 keys, vs the 66 keys I have with my Sl MkII.


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## G.R. Baumann (Aug 20, 2014)

The only thing I never understood was the position of the wheels, instead of beeing on the very left side, where you can rest your hand, they positioned the sliders there. It sucks! LOL

AFAIK, you can also adjust the dynamics relation of the black and white keys.

Since when do we have Doepfer?

About 20+ years? The TP/40GH keys are certainly still a very valid option, despite the VPC1 being in a different league.


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## BGvanRens (Aug 20, 2014)

Well I own the Doepfer LMK4+, I play it with joy. It is really built like a tank in my opinion. People in my environment call me nuts for spending this much on a midi-controller. But I'd like to call them nuts for attempting to mix songs on 30 euro cans.

I wonder though, for that amount of money they could make a MIDI control with wooden keys? For me it was quite a downgrade when I first played the Doepfer, being used to the Kawai MP8II. (wooden keys)


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## tabulius (Aug 21, 2014)

Walra48 @ Sun Aug 17 said:


> They also have another advantage that many composers like, in that they can be removed easily from their cases and integrated into a studio workstation. (see James Newton Howard studio pic below). Seems trivial in and of itself, but this feature combined with the Fatar key action and the rock solid build makes it IMHO very compelling as as THE keyboard controller for a lot of media composers.



I have LMK2+ and I really like it. It has all the features I need and good key action. However I didn't find it easy to be removed from the flight case. Does anyone have good tips how to do this? What I saw that I couldn't do it without possibly damaging the keyboard.


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## Jetzer (Aug 24, 2014)

Well, it seems it is not easy to be removed from the case at all. 
You really have to go into the electronics, which are attached to the case. 

I guess I have to contact Doepfer and ask if they can deliver me one without the case. Not keen on doing it myself, risking damaging the keyboard. I guess it is possible, but I'm not doing it without contacting them first.


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