# Creating a 1 year self-learning plan?



## shponglefan (Dec 12, 2019)

I've dabbled in wanting to learn orchestral music composition (particularly soundtrack-style composition) for the past couple years. But I've never made a full-on plunge to learn and develop the skills over time.

For the next year, I want to build and follow a focused learning plan to try to develop these skills as best I can.

I'm not looking for course or theory material per se, but rather a practical approach (e.g. exercises, projects, etc) for using such material for deliberate learning/practice.

To that effect, I have access to a couple of the Evenent courses (Cinematic Music: From idea to Finished Recording, and Trailer Music Redefined), a number of Mike Verta video lectures, and a handful of books on composition, harmony, orchestral composition, etc. Though I've found I too often fall into the trap of consuming such material passively, so I want to change that.

I'm also not completely starting from scratch, as I have some rudimentary musical composition skills and music theory knowledge. Most of my interest has been in electronic music and synthesizers. Orchestral composition is a different beast I am finding.

Does anyone have any particular suggestions on how to approach this?

Any and all advice is welcome.

(Also, I do work a full-time job so I am trying to build a plan that can accommodate that. As much as I would love to be a full-time student, I need some way to pay those bills!)


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## jonathanparham (Dec 12, 2019)

I've recommended a few times Alain's Scoreclub. Orchestrating the Line 2. I was just on another thread of Orchestral Things to avoid. Orchestrating the Line courses one and two dealt with the majority of what I read in the thread. I work the courses between my other gigs.


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## Nova (Dec 12, 2019)

shponglefan said:


> I too often fall into the trap of consuming such material passively, so I want to change that.



This is such a struggle for me. Studying composition can be like drinking from a fire hose. Hope to see some good suggestions here for putting things into practice.


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## Frank1985 (Jan 3, 2020)

Bumping this, also looking for a similar one year plan, something practical in which I can learn and make music at the same time


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## VinRice (Jan 3, 2020)

I'd recommend Scoreclub as well. Be aware that you need to be able to read music and to get the best out of actually do the exercises (which I managed about half of). The strength of it is that it's a properly structured set of courses.


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## shponglefan (Jan 3, 2020)

VinRice said:


> I'd recommend Scoreclub as well. Be aware that you need to be able to read music and to get the best out of actually do the exercises (which I managed about half of). The strength of it is that it's a properly structured set of courses.



What sort of exercises does it include? That seems like something I'm definitely after, so I'd like to know a bit more about what is included.

I notice they have some sample videos on their site, but can't find any examples of what sort of exercises they use.


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## ed buller (Jan 3, 2020)

shponglefan said:


> I've dabbled in wanting to learn orchestral music composition (particularly soundtrack-style composition) for the past couple years. But I've never made a full-on plunge to learn and develop the skills over time.
> 
> For the next year, I want to build and follow a focused learning plan to try to develop these skills as best I can.
> 
> ...



First make a list of ten pieces of music you wish you'd have been able to write. Be realistic. Picking the ring cycle isn't helpful.

Then import each piece as a stereo recording into your Daw. Save each one separately so you end up with ten sessions. 

Pick one. Start at bar one and try , by ear to work out what it is you are hearing. build your template as you go. If it starts with high Tremolo strings.....load em up......muted Horns...load em up. Your job is to make a copy that would fool the composer. Whilst this is happening make a note of the things you like about this piece. Have a note book you can scribble in . Everytime you come across something that really peaks your interest , write it down. Once you have a full mock up that sounds as close as you can get it....do a simple piano version. Something you can play fairly easily. There are loads of piano versions of film scores you can buy cheaply. lot's of Hans Zimmer and John Williams. By the end of this process you will have learned. 1.How to program realistic mock-ups. 2. How to create full orchestral arrangements and 3 what the bare bones harmony is for them !...It will also be music you like !

good luck

ed


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## Frank1985 (Jan 3, 2020)

shponglefan said:


> What sort of exercises does it include? That seems like something I'm definitely after, so I'd like to know a bit more about what is included.


It does look interesting. Expensive as well, but I feel I can use that to my advantage and work twice as hard to justify the fee. Course contents are listed here..https://scoreclub.net/the-courses/


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## jonathanparham (Jan 3, 2020)

shponglefan said:


> What sort of exercises does it include? That seems like something I'm definitely after, so I'd like to know a bit more about what is included.
> 
> I notice they have some sample videos on their site, but can't find any examples of what sort of exercises they use.


 You can ask at the site. I've taken four of the courses and currently working through the 2nd Orchestration course. In the Essentials class and Counterpoint 1, after each section, there is a printed assignment to work on. On the modes and orchestration classes, he 'verbally' tells you what to do. I asked about this and Alain says he finds students get more out of it when they take their own notes as opposed to having a summary after each section.
For instance, the lesson I just finished was on broken chord accompaniment using 5ths and octaves. During the lesson, he emphasized Resonance, pedal, etc. There are plenty of on-screen written examples, and film/classical music analysis examples. BUT at the end, there was no Assignment 
#1 do this, #2 do that etc. I just wrote 6 examples in different keys using what I learned.
There are course outlines at the site and some brief video examples of some classes. NOTE this is not midi mockup and he emphasizes writing by hand. I study, write, and then mock up with samples. During the class, he mocks up a lot of what he writes as well.


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## Frank1985 (Jan 5, 2020)

Been looking into Mike Verta....how are his videos structured? There doesn’t seem to be a way of previewing the content. Are they timestamped and/or divided into chapters, and is course material (work sheets, assignments etc.) provided?


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## David Kudell (Jan 5, 2020)

My plan so far for 2020 is to write 30 seconds of music a day. Doesn't have to be polished. It's just to challenge myself because otherwise I tend to get stuck just playing with my template and not writing anything. 

So far I have a library of 3 new themes I can use for future scoring projects!


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## shponglefan (Jan 5, 2020)

Frank1985 said:


> Been looking into Mike Verta....how are his videos structured? There doesn’t seem to be a way of previewing the content. Are they timestamped and/or divided into chapters, and is course material (work sheets, assignments etc.) provided?



Mike's videos are basically open-ended lectures on specific topics. They aren't particularly structured and aren't nearly as formal as other online lecture/course material I've found.

That said, there is usually a lot of good stuff in his videos especially given the length (the videos I've bought range from 3 to 5 hours in length).


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## muadgil (Jan 24, 2020)

shponglefan said:


> Though I've found I too often fall into the trap of consuming such material passively, so I want to change that.



Hi
Regarding that particular issue, I used to often watch/listen very valuable content, and had the feeling that I was learning a lot of things. But then, all these info were too much to process and memorize, so the immense majority were drawn into Oblivion...

Then I applied to myself one single element of discipline, a bit time consuming while watching these lessons, but very efficient :

*TAKE NOTES*

Clearly a game changing process for my brain and learning experience.
Doing that, my mind has to understand, formulate, organize and sum up the informations. So they go deeper into my memory, and are available instantly when I have a doubt or forget about something.
I now have a growing workbook of composition learning which is for me a great thing.
Of course it's only a part of the experience, I have to practice piano, learn to get more fluent with my DAW, and work on all the multitude of things you have to master to compose good music.
But this particular taking handwritten notes thing is helping me BIG time.


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## Studio E (Jan 24, 2020)

jonathanparham said:


> I've recommended a few times Alain's Scoreclub. Orchestrating the Line 2. I was just on another thread of Orchestral Things to avoid. Orchestrating the Line courses one and two dealt with the majority of what I read in the thread. I work the courses between my other gigs.



^^^This^^^


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## jononotbono (Jan 24, 2020)

I have the Scoreclub - Essential Composer Foundation Training Course. It seems excellent. I say "seems" because I'm still on the Study Guide and haven't even started the main course. This is why...






Trying to actually have all that sorted. "Without Hesitation". It's a lot of work if you didn't nail this stuff in earlier years. Wish I had time to not do anything else but everything else gets in the way at the best of times. It's my years mission to do this course (and many other other things).


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## Studio E (Jan 24, 2020)

jononotbono said:


> I have the Scoreclub - Essential Composer Foundation Training Course. It seems excellent. I say "seems" because I'm still on the Study Guide and haven't even started the main course. This is why...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I'm still working on this myself but don't let it slow you down too much. Sit down for 15 minutes a day and force yourself through all 12 major scales. Then maybe take another 15 minutes to force yourself to improvise in the worst keys for yourself. It'll all come together pretty quickly if you are a keyboard player at all.


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## jononotbono (Jan 24, 2020)

Studio E said:


> I'm still working on this myself but don't let it slow you down too much. Sit down for 15 minutes a day and force yourself through all 12 major scales. Then maybe take another 15 minutes to force yourself to improvise in the worst keys for yourself. It'll all come together pretty quickly if you are a keyboard player at all.



I can play all the major scales, and I'm almost there with all 3 Minors. Natural Minor is the easiest, followed by Harmonic and then Melodic. The thing is, this isn't just learning where and what the notes are (of which, as an example, if you memorize T T ST T T T ST - that's the formula for the Mj Scale and you can work out all the others from that - but I'd much rather have this memorized by playing them and hearing them so I do not have to think of formulas etc). It's also learning how to sort of play the Piano so it's taking time because both are different animals. It's so frustrating! Perhaps I should just move on a little further because this is taking me ages.


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## Studio E (Jan 24, 2020)

jononotbono said:


> I can play all the major scales, and I'm almost there with all 3 Minors. Natural Minor is the easiest, followed by Harmonic and then Melodic. The thing is, this isn't just learning where and what the notes are (of which, as an example, if you memorize T T ST T T T ST - that's the formula for the Mj Scale and you can work out all the others from that - but I'd much rather have this memorized by playing them and hearing them so I do not have to think of formulas etc). It's also learning how to sort of play the Piano so it's taking time because both are different animals. It's so frustrating! Perhaps I should just move on a little further because this is taking me ages.



I've taken his course. You're ready with what you have.


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## jononotbono (Jan 24, 2020)

Studio E said:


> I've taken his course. You're ready with what you have.



I feel need to nail the chord aspect first.


All major, minor and diminished triads, and dominant sevenths in all inversions in all keys.

Wondering why Augmented Chords aren't listed? Or Sus Chords?

Do people here know all of this stuff? Without hesitation? I know people love to talk but I'm wondering how many people know this stuff.

I think I need a course on Chords. And one of Anti Depressants as it make realize how little I know.
Still, it's important to know one's place in the Universe rather than being deluded.


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## youngpokie (Jan 24, 2020)

jononotbono said:


> I can play all the major scales, and I'm almost there with all 3 Minors. Natural Minor is the easiest, followed by Harmonic and then Melodic. The thing is, this isn't just learning where and what the notes are (of which, as an example, if you memorize T T ST T T T ST - that's the formula for the Mj Scale and you can work out all the others from that - but I'd much rather have this memorized by playing them and hearing them so I do not have to think of formulas etc). It's also learning how to sort of play the Piano so it's taking time because both are different animals. It's so frustrating! Perhaps I should just move on a little further because this is taking me ages.



Hey @jononotbono

For what it's worth, I had a piano teacher 100 years ago and her advice on scales was something I remember even today. She basically gave me 3 suggestions:

- Play scales in different rhythmic patterns, as if they were actual melodies with, with pauses in between notes, like a riff. Starting with one pattern and running it across different keys, etc. It actually makes playing scales a lot of fun, kind of like banging them out. I remember Ta - taTa - taTata-tataTA pattern that was a lot of fun, the last tone was a repeat octave down.

- Play scales to develop muscle memory, not the memory of tones and semitones. So she wouldn't allow me to actually look at the keyboard while playing, of course after a while.

- Every time I sat down at the piano, I was supposed to start with scales, sort of like warm up for the brain and fingers.

And by the way, I never had to play through the entire set of key signatures in one go, it was always not more than 2 or 3 keys per day if I remember right. Mondays C-Eb, Wednesdays D-F, you get the idea.

EDIT: I was really really slow at first, but as time went on it became easier to play them faster. There were other things involved too: not more than two octaves at first and learning proper fingering for piano players.


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## toomanynotes (Jan 24, 2020)

The only advice you ever need is to 'develop your ears'! I think it takes alot of passion and roughly 10yrs to develop a craft in any job. Even Mozart's best memorable stuff was written at least 10 years after his first serious compositions. I doubt there's anyone who knows or cares of his early stuff written as a child. 
It's all in the ears...it'll come.


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## InLight-Tone (Jan 24, 2020)

jononotbono said:


> I have the Scoreclub - Essential Composer Foundation Training Course. It seems excellent. I say "seems" because I'm still on the Study Guide and haven't even started the main course. This is why...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Try to give it 30-60 minutes a day. I think working on developing your keyboard skills will ultimately help you write better music and far FASTER in this VI game. Watch Mike Verta run through ideas a mile a minute all under his fingertips. That's a good place to be!


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## InLight-Tone (Jan 24, 2020)

toomanynotes said:


> The only advice you ever need is to 'develop your ears'! I think it takes alot of passion and roughly 10yrs to develop a craft in any job. Even Mozart's best memorable stuff was written at least 10 years after his first serious compositions. I doubt there's anyone who knows or cares of his early stuff written as a child.
> It's all in the ears...it'll come.


Yes I agree, 1 year is NOT a realistic goal to obtain any kind of competency, more like at least 5 years...


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## jonathanparham (Jan 24, 2020)

jononotbono said:


> I have the Scoreclub - Essential Composer Foundation Training Course. It seems excellent. I say "seems" because I'm still on the Study Guide and haven't even started the main course. This is why...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


1) My apologies to the OP as I hope we haven't derailed folks looking for developing a one year plan
2) I agree with others about the piano, scales, and ear training. 

Now, don't make this too hard and over think things. I think its about being comfortable at the keyboard so when you say D min, you can: spell it aloud AND find it on the keyboard. Having done a few of Alain's courses it's really about the 'line' as Alain puts it. It's about writing a melody, accompaniment, secondary melody, or ostinato and being able to support that.
You don't want to have a lack of harmony getting in the way of that. That's all. By the end of Essentials for composers you'll get into the harmony and voice-leading.
Don't beat yourself up. Just practice. I like how Mike Verta put it over the holidays, 'Take away the loops, rhythms, and layers. Can you FIND this on the piano?'


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## jononotbono (Jan 24, 2020)

jonathanparham said:


> 1) My apologies to the OP as I hope we haven't derailed folks looking for developing a one year plan
> 2) I agree with others about the piano, scales, and ear training.
> 
> Now, don't make this too hard and over think things. I think its about being comfortable at the keyboard so when you say D min, you can: spell it aloud AND find it on the keyboard. Having done a few of Alain's courses it's really about the 'line' as Alain puts it. It's about writing a melody, accompaniment, secondary melody, or ostinato and being able to support that.
> ...



Yeah man. I appreciate your post. I also don’t think this is derailing anything. Everything being discussed is part of studying.

Also, I noticed you worked on Happy Death Day. Loved that film man!


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## jonathanparham (Jan 24, 2020)

jononotbono said:


> Also, I noticed you worked on Happy Death Day. Loved that film man!


 Thank you. I really enjoyed mixing that one as the story really intrigued me. I have turned down horror projects before as early on in my career I remember being single in NYC, reading horror scripts in bed and honestly just having a hard time sleeping. I felt that particular project was an exception as it felt like a suspenseful murder mystery meets Ground Hog day. Also, that was my first Blumhouse produced gig.


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## borisb2 (Feb 7, 2020)

shponglefan said:


> Any and all advice is welcome.



I was in a similar position last year (made a break from the electronic music industry and started again last year in orchestral writing). My approach was the following:
I had a closer look at various curriculums of music schools to categorize the topics and in what order I best approach it. It came down to to a sorted list with courses I linked to the topic:
- ear training - various apps
- melody - scoreclub memorable melodies, artofcomposing
- harmony - Piston Harmony, Aldwell Harmony books, Norman Ludwin modern harmony, Jazz theory book, Rick Beato videos
- counterpoint - scoreclub applied counterpoint
- composition and form - Alan Belkin Composition book, chaplin classical form book
- orchestration - scoreclub orchestrating the line, Norman Ludwin Orchestrating (15 lessions, focusing on the strings)

.. and of course always applying the content .. thats the tricky part if you have a fulltime job

Especially the combination of scoreclub (great way of practically teaching how to approach orchestrating the line) and Norman Ludwin (in all his books he uses score excerpts and analysis to explain his topics) has a great value
I found Mike Verta courses entertaining but the actual information (still mostly fairly general) too hidden in 4 hour videos of ranting about the modern film industry .. usually each course boiled down to only a couple of bullet points

good luck


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## jonathanparham (Feb 7, 2020)

borisb2 said:


> - melody - scoreclub memorable melodies, artofcomposing


How did you like this? I'm working through Practical Counterpoint 2 and the 2 line writing makes me wonder about the melody course. How did it impact your writing? Your Process?


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## ProfoundSilence (Feb 7, 2020)

scoreclub's motivic mastery is a masterpiece, even for someone just reviewing it - that one really came together


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## borisb2 (Feb 7, 2020)

yes .. both the melody course from scoreclub (Memorable Melodies through Motivic Mastery) as well as ArtOfComposings "Fundamentals of musical composition" course teaches all the important aspects of creating good melody lines in a modern straightforward way: when to combine leaps from what direction, leading tones, good phrasing etc. .. 

Interestingly, when comparing to Schoenbergs famous composition book - it really connects the same dots


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