# Gustavo Dudamel and the Simon Bolivar Youth Orchestra of Venezuela



## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 10, 2007)

In case anyone hasn't been reading about Gustavo Dudamel, the incoming musical director of the LA Phil, the face of classical music has changed forever. I went to see him conducting the Simon Bolivar Youth Orchestra of Venezuela last Friday at Disney Hall, and I still get tears in my eyes every time I think about it - over a week later.

First, the orchestra. There's a 30-year-old program in Venezuela with 250,000 kids - yes, a quarter of a million - from very humble backgrounds who are given music lessons at an early age. This orchestra is the top players from that program, mostly college age, and you've simply never seen or heard anything like it. You really have to go to a concert to understand what I'm saying, but they just play their hearts out with unbelievable enthusiasm. I mean, the string players are literally jumping out of their seats when they hit accents - it's just pure joy. And they're also fantastic musicians, but it's the love and intensity that's so remarkable. You've never heard Beethoven's Fifth played like that.

This puts our educational priorities to shame, of course. There's no class issue involved, as there often is with classical music - this is just the joy of music, and really the joy of life. I hope everyone gets a chance to see and hear them, because it was one of the most incredible events I've ever experienced.

Then Gustavo Dudamel. OH MY GOD! He came through that program, and he conducts with the same kind of enthusiasm and then some. Everything I've said about the orchestra is even more true of him. You've never seen a conductor as exciting, intense, charismatic, and exuberant as him. The concept of the crotchety, staid player in the back of the string section is totally gone; you won't see musicians reading books during rehearsal when they're not playing - you know the attitude. No way - he's just too positive a leader for that to happen. I don't know what else to say, but he's changed the whole concept of conducting.

One of the first things I said was that he's the perfect person to succeed Salonen in Los Angeles, and it turns out that Salonen said the exact same thing. Salonen is so extraordinary that anyone else would have been a let-down, but Dudamel is totally different and phenomenal in a different way. He also has fresh, unique ideas about the music, and you hear everything in a whole new way.

Classical music will never be the same. It's exciting, relevant, accessible, and...how can I put it...well, as musicians we all understand how music is the center of the universe, how it *is* the human spirit. Seeing Dudamel conduct that orchestra makes that as obvious as a hard pinch in the butt; even the most insensitive fool couldn't miss it.

Of course they got a long standing ovation after the first piece (Beethoven's Fifth). It was a pretty rowdy crowd for a classical concert! I'm so happy my daughter was there; my wife said she feels sorry for anyone who wasn't.

Just when you think everything that can be done with music has already been done, someone comes along and completely reinvents it. I hope you all get a chance to see/hear what I'm raving about, because it's really inspiring.


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 10, 2007)

Oh, and John Williams came up and guest conducted the Star Wars theme. That was fun.


----------



## sbkp (Nov 10, 2007)

I've been looking forward to seeing/hearing him with the LA Phil since I read a little about him several months ago. He officially "arrives" in 2008 or 2009, doesn't he? I'm glad that he's appearing before that -- I'm going to have to find out when the next opportunity is.

And I didn't know about the Simon Bolivar Youth Orchestra of Venezuela. Thanks for the heads up on that!


----------



## VonRichter (Nov 10, 2007)

I have the entire BBC proms performance by this orchestra and conductor of Shostakovich 10th symphony. Top notch orchestra for sure, excellent players.

Dudamel took the tempo _way_ too fast in part of the 3rd movement though, blowing past some of the best parts and losing their effect. Very good performance otherwise. Maybe the 3rd best I've heard live. Aside from the 3rd movement flub, the rest of the tempos were excellent and true to the score.

******
Anyway, none of these orchestras or conductors mean a damn thing for the "future of classical music" unless they program contemporary works. Until then it's just more of the same.

Orchestral music as an art form is dead meat as long as orchestras keep playing Beethoven's 5th every night for the trillionth time.


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 10, 2007)

Go see Dudamel conduct live, VR. You won't agree with yourself for one second. I've heard Beeethoven's 5th too many times too. This is a whole new concept of what classical music is - it changes everything.

And I'm not one to spout hype. This man has reinvented conducting.


----------



## JohnnyMarks (Nov 10, 2007)

Sounds v. v. cool. Thanks for posting Nick.


----------



## VonRichter (Nov 10, 2007)

Nick Batzdorf @ Sat Nov 10 said:


> Go see Dudamel conduct live, VR. You won't agree with yourself for one second. I've heard Beeethoven's 5th too many times too. This is a whole new concept of what classical music is - it changes everything.
> 
> And I'm not one to spout hype. This man has reinvented conducting.



You're assuming I haven't been following the Simon Bolivar Youth Orchestra for a long while now. For example a couple weeks ago I linked to an excellent performance by them in another topic on this very forum. I also own 2 CD's with this orchestra (Dudamel conducting) Beethoven 5 & 7, and Mahler 5th. Disappointingly, the recordings are but a pale shadow of this ensemble live, not even remotely doing their live performances justice. I much prefer the tapings of live broadcasts I have which are mostly good to excellent.

***
Now back to the point of my previous post which was missed entirely:

I can listen to B's 5th plenty of times without tiring of it. Great piece.

The point is that Beethoven's are alive and creating right now, dying in the gutter, with no avenue for performance. Just because a composition is old doesn't make it better.

What would be _genuinely_ noteworthy is if these orchestras and conductors actually become more than museums again, by this I mean *program new works*.

Or maybe composers should just kill themselves since they are so marginalized at this point. Why bother when the latest version of Beethoven warhorses is all that matters? What is the incentive not to kill yourself?

This is important. A future where "art" music is a relic of the past is an ugly, worthless, unlivable future.

***

PS 
About "magical" performances... These can strike anywhere at any time, and certainly XYZ orchestra or conductor does not have a monopoly on this. It's awesome when it happens.


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 10, 2007)

I'm not saying I like staid FM 91.5 programming, VR. No question, we need to hear new stuff too. But the opposite of what you're saying is also true: just because Beethoven is 250 years old doesn't mean it's not still valid.

What you want is a mixture.


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 10, 2007)

Also, this wasn't a magical performance in the usual sense that everything aligned for one night and it all came together. Again, it's a whole new approach to classical music.

That's what I'm so excited about.


----------



## VonRichter (Nov 10, 2007)

Nick Batzdorf @ Sat Nov 10 said:


> Also, this wasn't a magical performance in the usual sense that everything aligned for one night and it all came together. Again, it's a whole new approach to classical music.
> 
> That's what I'm so excited about.



B's 5th is B's 5th. 

All you can do is either do it justice with a kick-butt performance, or ruin it. 

The art of the composition itself remains unchanged regardless.

Personally, I categorically accept that there are many fine players/performances in the world and have been through history, and that more than one orchestra and/or conductor can/will/has accomplished dynamite performances, and will continue to do so regardless of what is written on this thread.


----------



## VonRichter (Nov 10, 2007)

Hmm.. .Dudamel's general conducting approach is good direct faithfulness to the scores. He's no radical with interpretations like Bernstein etc. I like Dudamel precisely _because_ of this faithfulness to the scores.

Here's an illustrative example.

Here's the 2nd movement of Shostakovich 10th, an excellent performance by this very ensemble and conductor: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dE20wO4wD9M

Now... especially if you have the whole broadcast taped in high quality, it's quite a dynamite performance (excepting a rushed part of the 3rd movement which I mentioned earlier). I'd have loved to be there as I love the piece.

But where is the "reinventing conducting" and "whole new approach"? I don't hear it. Sounds exactly like Shostakovich 10th is supposed to sound.

The performance is mostly strictly faithful to the score. There isn't anything "new" or unusual about it. There are no special liberties taken with it through the entire piece. And that's a very good thing. 

It's an exciting performance and faithful reading of a great piece for an unusual occasion. Thumbs up.


----------



## Trev Parks (Nov 11, 2007)

Alongside several stand out proms I attended, this one came second only to the Compagnie Roussat-Lubek and Boswaid String project prom. It wasn't the conducting that seemed particularly innovative, that's not to say I'm no admirer as I think Dudamel's a terrific musician, but the vibe of the concert was like nothing I've experienced in a concert hall (and I was stuck up in the Gods!). Perhaps its because the players had had time to get to know and love the music that prompted them to play with such gusto and enthusiasm. When compared to the usual 2/3 hour rehearsal with a stand-in before the big gun flies in from abroad for the performance in the evening (and the players looking so serious because they're literally sightreading). Anyway, it was a brilliant concert and seeing players enjoy themselves whilst playing so well was a pleasure.

As to the issue of contemporary programming, I do agree. However, I took a friend who has very little interest in classical music to this concert a/ because I'd heard the hype and thougt it'd be a good intro and b/ it was good old Shosty's 10th; one of the best. To him it was as new as anything in that it was the first time he'd heard it, so this issue is rather relative to the listener's experience. What grabbed both our ears were the potbpoilers by Ginastera and co towards the end as neither of us, and many in the audience I suspect, had heard them before.


I don't know much about American concert hall programming but, reading Greg Sandow's blog and those of a like mind, it reads that audience numbers are dwindling and conductors and programmers are, somewhat perversly, falling back on established classics to try and revitalise a dying industry. So I imagine it is very frustrating being a composer over there. In Europe, the far east and so on I don't think that's the case just yet.


----------



## IvanP (Nov 11, 2007)

Wow....thks for sharing that Shostakovich allegro!!!


----------



## VonRichter (Nov 11, 2007)

Trev Parks @ Sun Nov 11 said:


> It wasn't the conducting that seemed particularly innovative, that's not to say I'm no admirer as I think Dudamel's a terrific musician, but the vibe of the concert was like nothing I've experienced in a concert hall (and I was stuck up in the Gods!). Perhaps its because the players had had time to get to know and love the music that prompted them to play with such gusto and enthusiasm.



Dudamel himself remarks on the unique atmosphere of the event during the intermission interview. When asked if they always play this way, he says something along the lines of "oh, no no, it's the special occasion and energy of the event, it has us all unusually excited".

I've found that special events have often been some of the best performances I've experienced. Especially when they double up on all the instrumentation just for shameless volume 



Trev Parks @ Sun Nov 11 said:


> As to the issue of contemporary programming, I do agree. However, I took a friend who has very little interest in classical music to this concert a/ because I'd heard the hype and thougt it'd be a good intro and b/ it was good old Shosty's 10th; one of the best.



Heh... :D of course, Shosty's 10th isn't exactly "old" in a literal sense. 1953 isn't that long before Beatles albums and so on. Certainly the 10th isn't exactly a common symphony program item, although it's stature has been rising steadily as it's superlative genius becomes more and more appreciated. Certainly it belongs amongst the greatest compositions _ever._ There is so much thematic integration and twisting of motives that it takes close study to really grasp it's full magnificence.



Trev Parks @ Sun Nov 11 said:


> To him it was as new as anything in that it was the first time he'd heard it, so this issue is rather relative to the listener's experience. What grabbed both our ears were the potbpoilers by Ginastera and co towards the end as neither of us, and many in the audience I suspect, had heard them before.



Almost always, when my non-art-music-listening associates get dragged to concerts by me, it's the non-warhorse works they like the best, not just cheesy potboilers, but even rampantly complex and discordant contemporary stuff. They have little interest in Brahms or Haydn etc. 

I suppose the potential lesson here is that, since absorbing most long-form music on first listen is impossible, interesting timbral ear candy or catchy tunes/riffs or both might be in order to sucker people into more complex larger forms. Brahms will likely sound like endless dull droning mush to the random uneducated listener weened on 2 minute ABA pop ditties.

Heck, the greatest genius in the world isn't going to absorb and internalize Mahler's 5th on a single hearing. But at least it's loud :wink: 



Trev Parks @ Sun Nov 11 said:


> I don't know much about American concert hall programming but, reading Greg Sandow's blog and those of a like mind, it reads that audience numbers are dwindling and conductors and programmers are, somewhat perversly, falling back on established classics to try and revitalise a dying industry. So I imagine it is very frustrating being a composer over there. In Europe, the far east and so on I don't think that's the case just yet.



It's dead meat in America. Once in awhile an opening warm-up trifle will be a truly contemporary piece, but that's about it. It's a horrifying state of affairs. 

It's long been socially unacceptable to listen to serious music in America. That has let up slightly over the past decade, but not much. Popping in some Stravinsky for your crush is still a great way to stay a virgin until you're 30. :?

Growing up, I personally suffered all kinds of social humiliation for my refusal to conform to corporate robot drone totalitarian mainstream radio and MTV. My brain was never content with an endless string of ABA trifles. I didn't know a single person who had a clue what I was on about. they thought I was nuts. In fact, right now, at the location where I am currently imprisoned, I do not have a single person to share music with or talk with, since my mentor died many years ago. It's a lonely road. The internet is my only connection to the real music world these days.


Cheers,
-Soon To Be Rotting Dead & Forgotten In The Gutter Genius


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 11, 2007)

Then my suggestion is to go see Dudamel conduct live when you get a chance. Until then you'll only think you know what I'm talking about.

Because you don't, and you will in two minutes when you see it.


----------



## rJames (Nov 11, 2007)

VonRichter @ Sun Nov 11 said:


> Cheers,
> -Soon To Be Rotting Dead & Forgotten In The Gutter Genius



There is always work for a genius. Find your audience. (they are looking for you)


----------



## José Herring (Nov 11, 2007)

Having conducted professionally 5 orchestras I'll say that this guy is brilliant. His orchestra is top notch. This is a great program Valenzuela has if it's producing this caliber of talent. Provided the general apathy of the LaPhil doesn't kill his enthusiasm this should be one big boost to the symphony in this area and perhaps internationally too.

If this guy does get airplay then yes he'll appeal to the masses. Just through his enthusiasm alone. He's got a bit of Leonard Bernstein in him conducting wise.

imo, he's as good as it gets these days.


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 11, 2007)

I think he's better than Leonard Bernstein. Bernstein was a *great* composer - West Side Story is brilliant (by coincidence we just watched it last night) - but he was into theatrics when he conducted. The hair flapping all over, etc. With Dudamel it's for real.

That doesn't mean I think Bernstein was an idiot, of course, but as far as major league conductors go he wasn't my favorite.


----------



## VonRichter (Nov 11, 2007)

Nick Batzdorf @ Sun Nov 11 said:


> Then my suggestion is to go see Dudamel conduct live when you get a chance. Until then you'll only think you know what I'm talking about.
> 
> Because you don't, and you will in two minutes when you see it.



The clip I linked, if you would actually watch/listen_ is_ a live performance. As live as it gets. And it's kick butt.

Show me a better live performance of Shostakovich 10th.

People who were at the show have superlative things to say about it just as you are saying about your Beethoven concert.

Are you suggesting they are liars or that this is a poor performance? A poor example of this orchestra and Dudamel's conducting?


----------



## José Herring (Nov 11, 2007)

Bernstein was a great communicator of music. He could communicate the most complex and deep music in a way that your everyday person could understand. That's what made him a brilliant conductor. This stems from his impeccable understanding of how to execute phrasing in music as well as an innate ability to understand music and it's many, many shades and variety of spiritual expression. He also had a great love of people. That's what made him a genius. Not any real inherent technical abilities.

I'm a bit of a Bernstein fanatic. Have been since I studied in New York. Though always not technically correct there's something extremely special in his performances. I know it's him conducting before I've even read the CD cover.

Maestro Dedamel has some of the same fire and brilliance. Maybe lacks a little bit of the nuance that Berstein had but I haven't seen him conduct live yet so I don't know. Technically Dedamel has a command of the technique of conducting and looks like he's got an impeccable timing sense.

In todays market looks like LA Phil picked a winner. There's no way a conductor like that could be brought up in America. The economic pressures and lack of support for artistic growth of our young people make it impossible for a guy like Dedamel to happen here. It's a damn shame really. We've all had to give up our artistic ideal before we've reached our potential just in order to stay alive and make a buck. This is the ultimate reason why I stopped perusing a classical career playing and conducting. And why so many of my Juilliard classmates have either become lawyers or doctors or lunatics. There's just no tolerance these days for a classical artist to do what he needs to do to reach his ultimate potential. 

Venezuela is lucky that they have a program that supports these kids no matter what economic background they come from. It's truly the way it should be.

Sorry for drifting off topic.

Jose


----------



## Aaron Sapp (Nov 12, 2007)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S6q7RCAcaBk

I wish more conductors would do this...


----------



## Scott Rogers (Nov 12, 2007)

..........


----------



## VonRichter (Nov 12, 2007)

Scott Rogers @ Mon Nov 12 said:


> This is not a "poor performance", and I have no doubt it was entertaining in and of itself, but it does not quite do justice to the _composer's intent_. The tempo is slightly more than one Maezel click too fast, averaging at least 184 bpm, whereas it has a clear marking of 176 - which is a critical difference in this temporal neighborhood and for the types of figures which dominate. As a result, some of the anger is lost, and this comes off as if there are extra points for bringing it in at under 4 minutes. And when rushed like this certain effects are diminished, such as the syncopations from 79 - 82. There are other ensemble issues; that three-note motive in 8ths is supposed to be brought out very deliberately and very "tempo giusto", but at times it gives the impression of being rushed "just to keep up". The overall effect of the performance is that it feels like a mad dash for the finish line, rather than the tightly calibrated controlled rage it is scored to be. Shostakovich is basically giving the middle finger to Stalin's corpse in this movement.
> 
> -S



Woah, you might consider being a little more careful about saying such blasphemous things on this thread! >8o


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 12, 2007)




----------



## VonRichter (Nov 12, 2007)

Nick Batzdorf @ Mon Nov 12 said:


>



Now _THAT_ is an impressive debate tactic! An amazingly convincing argument, to be sure. <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3


----------



## aeneas (Nov 14, 2007)

Scott Rogers @ Mon 12 Nov said:


> The overall effect of the performance is that it feels like a mad dash for the finish line, rather than the tightly calibrated controlled rage it is scored to be. Shostakovich's intent was basically to give the big middle finger to Stalin's corpse in this movement.


I felt the rush too, and I agree with all the points raised about the missed syncopations, the "controlled rage" that was not very clearly conveyed, and everything. Showing Stalin's corpse the finger truly was a revenge over decades of frustrations. Sostakovich showed Stalin the finger several times in the face, something that no one was able to do and live. Shostakovich is my hero in many ways. Going a bit OT with this but I have to mentioned it: the biggest defiance was his 9th symphony, which was announced as a beethovenian grandiloquent opus to celebrate the Soviet's (Stalin's) victory over the nazi Germany. For those who did not hear it, don't miss it, it is an absolute joy! At the opening performance, it proved to be the total opposite of what Stalin expected - a sort of a Haydn-esque joke, you can hardly imagine a more hilarious symphony. So instead of the big ass-kissing, Shostakovich has thumbed his nose and gave the Big Brother a huge middle finger, right in the dictator's face, and in public. The consequences were dramatic for the composer's life, but I won't enter into details. Fortunately, Stalin lived only nine more years after that event. Shostakovich outlived him by almost 20 years.

End of 'middle finger' OT.

This Dudamel guy is obviously on the top of his game. I have watched some other pieces on youtube, and he seems to be the perfect conductor for that type of orchestra, and for that type of show. For he is part of a show, in the good American sense of it, in the sense of some Bernstein's performances. However, IMHO, Bernstein had a unique way to get to the core of the music and to make the orchestra to translate profound things no one would have ever suspected being there in some very well known pieces. Being a composer himself, a very good one, Bernstein had a profound understanding of music. I don't know about this Dudamel, he is young, and he looks very in control of everything he is doing. As a personal observation, I wish he would make it more about the music and less about the orchestra and the show. Maybe it's just me, but I got this strong feeling that the emphasis was put on the performance and not on transmitting musical thoughts to the audience, but to entertain it instead. I may be wrong about that. I truly believe that being in the concert hall must have been a really electrifying experience.


----------



## Trev Parks (Nov 14, 2007)

Scott Rogers @ Tue Nov 13 said:


> Trev Parks said:
> 
> 
> > As for there being "plenty of angles to view this piece from", the only angle that matters is the one the composer chose. Yes, there are plenty of pieces where a locked in and specific tempo is the last thing you want, but this is not one of those pieces.



I'll never agree with this in a month of sundays, especially not with live music. I've played in contemporary ensembles where the most precise directions given have been only quite loosely adhered to _in the composer's presence_. I'm thinking back specifically to Lontano and a performance of a work by the notoriously finnickity Brian Ferneyhough. What he wrote was very detailed but we did not play it EXACTLY as written at the specified tempo and he didn't seem to mind (maybe even notice) the fact. And that's at the extreme end. 

I recently watched the British composer James MacMillan conduct one of his works and what was written in the score was, again, not being played exactly (in comparable passages to the Shostakovich example). I can think of dozens of similar cases where my ears have pricked up because of such deviations, from Lutoslawski conducting his piano concerto to a crapped out VHS I have of Stravinsky conducting the good old Le Sacre.

Like I said, I understand the point you're making but I find it rather academic having heard it live. Certain passages were blurred and perhaps stumbled over but a ferocity was gained by the increased tempo that lit up the concert hall. I don't think precision is the be all and end all, even in this movement. Its the soul of the work that matters to me and the middle finger was waving large (_hmm..what a curious sentence!)_. It may not be everybody's ideal tempo (and I'm aware I'm in the minority in not minding it in the least) but its what was decided at that moment in the concert and its what worked for me in the context of the surrounding movements. If its a recording, I'll give some ground away, but live...no way.

As for coming bang in on 176bpm out of the blue, I'll offer anybody a week's free washing up and bath cleaning if they can _bring an orchestra in_ at 176bpm and hold it, 3 seperate times with a movement of a different tempo preceeding it. I'll bet my right nut no-one can, no matter how good - based mainly on never having been conducted by someone who has achieved (wanted to achieve?) it. But, sure, I am digressing here and I'd love to slip the marigolds on and be proved wrong because this probably reads like I'm a right pompous dick =o 

Regardless, its nice locking horns with other passionate musicians about this. Makes the world go round better than money.

PS: VR, I have an old tape of Shostakovich playing part of his first piano concerto when he was still under 30. He indeed was a terrific performer so if I ever manage to source a working VHS player, I'll transfer it and post it up for you.


----------



## Trev Parks (Nov 14, 2007)

Scott Rogers @ Tue Nov 13 said:


> This is conducting 101. Tempos _can_ be memorized, and they can even be maintained with an acceptable +/- degree tolerance leeway in a Tempo giusto situation like this. In fact, the conductor here _did_ maintain the tempo pretty consistently.
> .



Didn't see the +/- .....I wont argue against that. Its not difficult to be roughly in the right area give or take a few bpm.


----------



## VonRichter (Nov 14, 2007)

aeneas @ Wed Nov 14 said:


> Shostakovich is my hero in many ways. Going a bit OT with this but I have to mentioned it: the biggest defiance was his 9th symphony, which was announced as a beethovenian grandiloquent opus to celebrate the Soviet's (Stalin's) victory over the nazi Germany. For those who did not hear it, don't miss it, it is an absolute joy! At the opening performance, it proved to be the total opposite of what Stalin expected - a sort of a Haydn-esque joke, you can hardly imagine a more hilarious symphony. So instead of the big ass-kissing, Shostakovich has thumbed his nose and gave the Big Brother a huge middle finger, right in the dictator's face, and in public. The consequences were dramatic for the composer's life, but I won't enter into details.



Hey, you can go off-topic about Shosty all you want. His biography is endlessly fascinating. 

Speaking of the 9th, and since Bernstein came up on this thread, here is a live performance of Shostakovich 9th with Bernstein conducting the Wiener Philharmonic, along with a lengthy pre-concert talk where he discusses the piece, and many more discussions between movements, pointing out some specific musical jokes and so on that the piece is famous for.

Part 1
http://youtube.com/watch?v=4CmqpVgZjE8

Part 2
http://youtube.com/watch?v=r1qoPz112pU

Part 3
http://youtube.com/watch?v=qeiTX6MkPcc

Part 4
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Jivm7Gq9Gzs

Part 5
http://youtube.com/watch?v=M_v6eyo_asw

Part 6
http://youtube.com/watch?v=1Vsp4S1Mr7o

Part 7
http://youtube.com/watch?v=OylOu8YRGrs


----------



## aeneas (Nov 14, 2007)

VonRichter @ Wed 14 Nov said:


> Hey, you can go off-topic about Shosty all you want. His biography is endlessly fascinating.
> 
> Speaking of the 9th, and since Bernstein came up on this thread, here is a live performance of Shostakovich 9th with Bernstein conducting the Wiener Philharmonic, along with a lengthy pre-concert talk where he discusses the piece, and many more discussions between movements, pointing out some specific musical jokes and so on that the piece is famous for.
> 
> ...



Awesome! THANKS for posting it! A great music lesson! :!: 

Hearing Bernstein I was stroke by the vocabulary he used, it was like in my previous post I was quoting him without knowing it. Truly rewarding to find a few thoughts of mine 'confirmed' by such an authority! I only regret he didn't use the expression 'giving the finger', but 'thumbing his nose' was close enough! 8) 

Strange how great minds think alike! 0oD


----------

