# The brilliance of Stravinsky



## dcoscina

It took me literally decades to get into this composer's music but now that I have, I am totally addicted. I just picked up the Robert Craft Naxos boxed set of all Stravinsky's ballets and the interpretation and performance by the LSO is flat out awesome. Recordings are pristine as well. I bought the conductor's scores to both Le Sacre and The Firebird because I'm endlessly fascinated by the staggering detail in the orchestration. 

Not surprisingly, I don't find current film scores all that interesting. I might learn some production things from them still but musically, not so much. Not anywhere near as much as pouring over Stravinsky's works as far as command of the orchestra and musical construction. 

bloody amazing


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## nikolas

Well...

I have to say that it took me 15 minutes to get into Stravinsky and another 10 to confirm it. Went when I was quite young to see Disney's Fantasy and I was floored by Stravinsky's music (The rite of spring). Then I came across his Symphony in 3 movements and the 1st movement confirmed what I thought: He's simply amazing! Other works also confirmed that, although his jazz attempts do not exactly appeal to me... :-/

However, I will say that Stravinsky's music (in ballets) drew the blood out of dancing: The initial choreography was based simply too much to the music, and now the music survives much more than the actual choreography does. Same goes for his other 2 early ballets. In that respect I'd say that Stravinsky's music is not the best example for practical film scoring.


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## sluggo

I feel like I once heard that Stravinsky was asked to do a film score and responded by saying he needed 1 year and $100,000. 

He wasn't hired.


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## jleckie

The Rite of Spring is a personal all time favorite. Stravinsky was a true musical genius and way ahead of his time.


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## antoniopandrade

I feel that film scores and concert music should stop being compared. They are different genres, made for different purposes, on different timelines, with different creative objectives. One is absolute music, made for the purpose of being musically interesting, the other is made to support a greater storytelling medium. Musically, it's natural that concert music will be more compelling, because listening to film scores on their own is not listening to the full package, you're missing out on what they're meant to support. And Stravinksy and many other genius of composition and orchestration spent many months and even years slowly constructing and refining their pieces, whilst some film scores have to be produced in less than a month. Of course they will have different musical results.

I for one adore the work of the concert music masters, but I also love how a film score makes me feel during a movie, and I try not to compare those two, because to me, they are wholly different experiences.


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## Goran

antoniopandrade @ Sat Oct 20 said:


> I feel that film scores and concert music should stop being compared. They are different genres, made for different purposes, on different timelines, with different creative objectives. One is absolute music, made for the purpose of being musically interesting, the other is made to support a greater storytelling medium. Musically, it's natural that concert music will be more compelling, because listening to film scores on their own is not listening to the full package, you're missing out on what they're meant to support. And Stravinksy and many other genius of composition and orchestration spent many months and even years slowly constructing and refining their pieces, whilst some film scores have to be produced in less than a month. Of course they will have different musical results.
> 
> I for one adore the work of the concert music masters, but I also love how a film score makes me feel during a movie, and I try not to compare those two, because to me, they are wholly different experiences.



Very well put, sums up my position on this question as well.


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## Farkle

sluggo @ Sat Oct 20 said:


> I feel like I once heard that Stravinsky was asked to do a film score and responded by saying he needed 1 year and $100,000.
> 
> He wasn't hired.



That quote/scenario was actually attributed to Arnold Schoenberg. 

Mike


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## ed buller

I heard that disney asked him to tweak the Rite for Fantasia !!!

he told them to bog off

e


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## nikolas

ed: And at the same time they did edit to shite the score, and put it in Fantasia... It appears that the score was missing the (C) copyright sign, and thus the problem. I think the same thing happened with Ligeti and his atmospherers and Kubric.

Both these are at my mind myths, but could very well be true...


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## EastWest Lurker

The first time I heard Sherman Walt of the Boston Symphony pay the opening bassoon part of "Le Sacre" I was hooked on Igor.


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## kgdrum

As a long time Stravinsky fan,I suggest you find Stravinsky conducting Stravinsky I have on both CD's,LP's and used to have on SACD.
These are with the Columbia Symphony,the performances are breathtaking and IMO you get to hear the pieces performed as the composer wanted them performed ,tight
,angular full of life w/energy and precision! Totally awesome performances as Igor intended his brilliant works to be performed.


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## kgdrum

Farkle @ Sun 21 Oct said:


> sluggo @ Sat Oct 20 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I feel like I once heard that Stravinsky was asked to do a film score and responded by saying he needed 1 year and $100,000.
> 
> He wasn't hired.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> That quote/scenario was actually attributed to Arnold Schoenberg.
> 
> Mike
Click to expand...


I don't know about the quote but Schoenberg is brilliantly amazing!


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## germancomponist

jleckie @ Sat Oct 20 said:


> The Rite of Spring is a personal all time favorite. Stravinsky was a true musical genius and way ahead of his time.



+1


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## EastWest Lurker

kgdrum @ Sun Oct 21 said:


> As a long time Stravinsky fan,I suggest you find Stravinsky conducting Stravinsky I have on both CD's,LP's and used to have on SACD.
> These are with the Columbia Symphony,the performances are breathtaking and IMO you get to hear the pieces performed as the composer wanted them performed ,tight
> ,angular full of life w/energy and precision! Totally awesome performances as Igor intended his brilliant works to be performed.



I actually think Stravinsky was a brilliant composer but lousy conductor and his versions are among my least favorites.

I think Boulez was the man for Stravinsky.


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## kgdrum

Boulez is my favorite contemporary conductor,I have probably 30 or 40 CD's of him conducting various composers works and even his own compositions which most people don't like but I adore!

Have you heard the series Stravinsky conducting Stravinsky/Columbia Orch ?
For me it's breathtaking!

But agreed Boulez is amazing!!


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## Nick Batzdorf

Ooh ooh ooh!

I couldn't disagree more with the esteemed Jay Asher.

Stravinsky is by far my favorite conductor of his own music. He's always a lot dryer than anyone else, for lack of a better word, and ironically that's how he brings out the emotion.

I have a record of him conducting L'Histoire du Soldat on one side and the Pulcinella Suite on the other, and it's incredible. The whole point to Pulcinella is that it's *not* a typical baroque piece, and every other version I've heard is too lush.


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## jamwerks

Stravinsky, in the top 5 for me. I'm constantly studying his language and orchestration.
Terrible conductor imo (and in the opinion of many).

BTW Boulez is a marketing name (e.g. it's a Neumann, it must sound great). There are sooo many better conductors out there. For Stravinsky, I suggest Esa-Pekka Salonen


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## Nick Batzdorf

E-PS is great for Stravinsky, no question, but not better than The Man himself.

I have a bootleg recording - a legitimate one made in the booth through the hanging stage mics - of a Green Umbrella concert I went to at Zipper Hall a few years ago with E-PS conducting members of the LA Phil (although some of the pieces were played without a conductor), and it is seriously heavy stuff. We were sitting above and in front of him, and it was amazing watching him conduct.

Among other things, they played the Octet for Winds and Dunbarton Oaks. Just awesome.


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## YuHirà

It's a main influence for John Williams too. In his concert music and his film music, he often uses orchestration tips and musical patterns from Petrouchka and The Rite of Spring.

By the way, the best version I ever heard for The Rite of Spring, imho, was conducted by Michael Tilson Thomas with Boston Symphony Orchestra for Deustche Grammophon. The performance and the mix are really impressive!


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## dcoscina

I enjoy the MTT San Francisco recording for Le Sacre but the Robert Craft Naxos recordings are actually pretty great as far as feel and tempo are concerned. Boulez I find to be a little too clinical and lifeless though I do have his Stravinsky boxed set from DGG.


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## EastWest Lurker

YuHirà @ Sun Oct 21 said:


> It's a main influence for John Williams too. In his concert music and his film music, he often uses orchestration tips and musical patterns from Petrouchka and The Rite of Spring.
> 
> By the way, the best version I ever heard for The Rite of Spring, imho, was conducted by Michael Tilson Thomas with Boston Symphony Orchestra for Deustche Grammophon. The performance and the mix are really impressive!



That is my second favorite. MTT was assistant conductor of the BSO when I was at Boston Conservatory and even then you could tell how brilliant he was.


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## David Story

Le Sacre changed the world. With Igor's own recording you can glimpse why. A new aesthetic brilliantly presented. Any work of that magnitude will have many valid interpretations but my favorites are Boulez and Gergiev. They are better overall in coherency and detail. Yet the composer finds gems that others overlooked, and gives you a sense that this is really something you've never heard before.

The Stravinsky influence in film, TV, games, etc, began 100 years ago and continues. It's iconic music. Firebird, Petruska, The Rite, Symphony of Psalms, Symphony in Three Movements, The Soldier's Tale and more are quoted and imitated all over the media. Including jazz and rock adaptations.

I love Goldsmith and Ravel, but Stravinsky invents more cool orchestrations than anyone. For example, the metallic pitched percussion ensemble in the Requiem Canticles sounds edgy today.

I agree, IS is one of the top 5 of all time.

You can rave about Stravinsky without the slightest risk of being classed a lunatic.
-Shaw

Thanks for the thread


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## YuHirà

> That is my second favorite. MTT was assistant conductor of the BSO when I was at Boston Conservatory and even then you could tell how brilliant he was.



And now, he is also a brillant teacher :D 

I highly recommand http://www.amazon.com/Keeping-Score-Revolutions-Stravinskys-Spring/dp/B000JBWWTW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1350918602&sr=8-1&keywords=Keeping+Score%3A+Revolutions+in+Music (this documentary about The Rite Of Spring), presented by MTT, and the interactive presentation of the score with insights from him.


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## Nick Batzdorf

By the way, check out Jerry Fielding's score to "Straw Dogs."


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## dcoscina

YuHirà @ Mon Oct 22 said:


> That is my second favorite. MTT was assistant conductor of the BSO when I was at Boston Conservatory and even then you could tell how brilliant he was.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And now, he is also a brillant teacher :D
> 
> I highly recommand http://www.amazon.com/Keeping-Score-Revolutions-Stravinskys-Spring/dp/B000JBWWTW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1350918602&sr=8-1&keywords=Keeping+Score%3A+Revolutions+in+Music (this documentary about The Rite Of Spring), presented by MTT, and the interactive presentation of the score with insights from him.
Click to expand...


I dare say it was this wonderful show that FINALLY turned me onto Stravinsky's Le Sacre. It all just made sense. Great reading of the piece too!


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