# Tools for sampling



## Ranietz (Oct 17, 2009)

Hi.

I made my first little sample library in Kontakt today. I recorded lots of samples from a Vst synth in Sonar just as a test. I split up the recording into audioclips in Sonar and got ready to export them as Wave files when I realized Sonar can't export multiple audiclips at once. In other words, I had to export the clips one by one and giving them an useful name(272 times!!!) It took me over one hour and that's something I do NOT want to do again.

So the question is: what do sample library developers use to simplify the process of splitting up an audiorecording into appropriate audiofiles with useful names? I imagine they're dealing with thousands of audiofiles. I tried searching this forum but I couldn't find anything useful. I could swear there was a thread about this somewhere but I can't find it.


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## Thonex (Oct 17, 2009)

Ranietz @ Sat Oct 17 said:


> So the question is: what do sample library developers use to simplify the process of splitting up an audiorecording into appropriate audiofiles with useful names? .



Welcome to my recent world :lol: 

I use Nuendo with Macros for editing and naming and batch processing. That's where I live most of the time.

Nuendo has a very useful re-namer and batch name etc.

I too wonder why this feature is so overlooked by DAWs.

Cheers,

AK


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## _taylor (Oct 17, 2009)

In Sound Forge you can do regions. 


either auto region your file or do it manually, then extract and export to a multitude of formats with a sequential name. Very fast.


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## Ranietz (Oct 17, 2009)

_taylor @ Sat 17 Oct said:


> In Sound Forge you can do regions.
> 
> 
> either auto region your file or do it manually, then extract and export to a multitude of formats with a sequential name. Very fast.



Is that Sound Forge Pro or Sound Forge Audio Studio?


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## _taylor (Oct 17, 2009)

I'm not sure about the studio version. I used SF 9 at my last job. There is a demo trial, you could see. 

Also,if you're on a PC, there is a free app called Wavesour that can do exactly that. http://www.wavosaur.com/


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## mikebarry (Oct 17, 2009)

I regret to inform you there is little that can be done to bypass the tedious nature of sample preparation. At cinesamples we do it all by hand on Pro Tools HD. Pro tools is a proven engine and the standard even though it is slower and has no offline bouncing. You might wish to consult a music or dialogue editor for little tips on work flow.

Even though this is least fun part of the whole process it is by some measures the most important so you just got to go slow and steady and give each sample the attention it deserves.


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## _taylor (Oct 17, 2009)

mikebarry @ Sat Oct 17 said:


> I regret to inform you there is little that can be done to bypass the tedious nature of sample preparation. At cinesamples we do it all by hand on Pro Tools HD. Pro tools is a proven engine and the standard even though it is slower and has no offline bouncing. You might wish to consult a music or dialogue editor for little tips on work flow.
> 
> Even though this is least fun part of the whole process it is by some measures the most important so you just got to go slow and steady and give each sample the attention it deserves.



I disagree, If you prep all your files right in your host, Export one single file ( instead of 280+) load up SF, load your exported file, auto region, extract regions ..done, then go make a sandwich and enjoy your saved 2 hours.


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## Ranietz (Oct 17, 2009)

Thanks _taylor. Sound Forge Pro is a bit to expensive so I'll take a look at Wavosaur.

mikebarry: It's not the preparation of the samples that cause the headaches (although that process is also long and tedious). I can do all the editing I need in Sonar, it's when I want to export the audio from Sonar everything gets reeeeeeeally boring.


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## mikebarry (Oct 17, 2009)

Well that might work for you but we have given this a ton of researching and found this to be the most solid way to do it for us - when dealing with thousands of files. I know some other developers do it by hand also. I bet some people do it in sound forge.

Quite often we are working with up to 15 tracks and multiple mixes, and when you want precision trimming and trusted fades not a single application will match pro tools' power.
And pro tools' sonic implant is very subtle, - its just a very well crafted audio engine.


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## _taylor (Oct 17, 2009)

But those 15 tracks and multiple mixes still end up in a single stereo file.

I can see that with a room mix, close mix etc.. how things could get a little complicated, even still, careful planning pre-render and close attention to detail when you cut it into regions, you'll still shave time. 

Sound forge is a very capable app. and I'm sure does many other things pro-tools can't. Vice-versa sure, but to think SF is an amateur app seems naive. 

All good. Whatever way works. As long as it's done and done right. Just trying to help the guy save many hours of non needed labor.


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## Ben H (Oct 17, 2009)

EDIT


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## Ranietz (Oct 18, 2009)

Ben H @ Sun 18 Oct said:


> There are several all-in-one apps that can do it all for you automatically these days, slice/dice/normalise/autotrim/loop/map etc, but I prefer to draw on the strengths of few apps, rather than use just the one.



I don't agree with you there. I prefer using as few apps as possible. It's such a shame since Sonar can do all I need except I need it to be able to export multiple audio files at once (and an auto naming feature would be nice).


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## germancomponist (Oct 18, 2009)

You can do it in Cubase 5.


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## Ben H (Oct 18, 2009)

EDIT


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## Mr Greg G (Oct 18, 2009)

germancomponist @ Sun Oct 18 said:


> You can do it in Cubase 5.



How do you proceed?


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## germancomponist (Oct 18, 2009)

When you go to the export page you can select all tracks you want and export them all with one click. No mixing, all tracks as they are.


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## Ranietz (Oct 18, 2009)

germancomponist @ Sun 18 Oct said:


> When you go to the export page you can select all tracks you want and export them all with one click. No mixing, all tracks as they are.



But what if you have multiple audio clips on one track? Can you export them as separate audio files or is it just one file per track?


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## germancomponist (Oct 18, 2009)

Ranietz @ Sun Oct 18 said:


> germancomponist @ Sun 18 Oct said:
> 
> 
> > When you go to the export page you can select all tracks you want and export them all with one click. No mixing, all tracks as they are.
> ...



I think it is one file per track. 

BUT, you can select all audio parts in a track and use the function in the Audio-editor-menue "as a new audio clip". Then all clips will be transformed into new single audio-clips. I have not experimented this but I think it will do it.


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## Ned Bouhalassa (Oct 18, 2009)

What about Redmatica's Keymap? Seems like a great way to get things done quickly, no?

http://www.redmatica.com/Redmatica/Keymap_1.5.html


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## MacQ (Oct 18, 2009)

Keymap is built for this. It's the reason I'm buying a Mac. Sample and sell my hardware modules ... progress.

~Stu


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## Hans Adamson (Oct 18, 2009)

Does anyone know the requirements for redmatica? I could not find them on their website or in the on-line manual. Which Mac models will the software require?


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## Dynamitec (Oct 18, 2009)

I'm using soX (http://sox.sourceforge.net/) a lot. It's a command line utility with zillions of features. I you have knowledge in scripting languages e.g. JScript, VBScript, batch jobs (.bat or .sh) or other programming langauges you can combine both to build a custom workflow doing exactly what you want.


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## Pzy-Clone (Oct 18, 2009)

germancomponist @ Sun Oct 18 said:


> Ranietz @ Sun Oct 18 said:
> 
> 
> > germancomponist @ Sun 18 Oct said:
> ...



yes, i have done this quite a few times in cubase...
just do all your editing, on one track, mulltiple trax...whatever, then select the audio parts, and select the "bounce to new audio clip" or whatever its called.

now you dont have to export anything, becouse all the new files are saved to you project folder :D

And you can set up a hotkey as well, i just press B, and its done.
Doesn give stuff a sensible name tho....just adds a "1" after the original file name.


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## MaraschinoMusic (Oct 18, 2009)

Ranietz @ Mon Oct 19 said:


> Redmatica doesn't exactly advertise on their web page that their products is Mac only, neither is it easy to find out what the product costs...



I actually emailed them enquiring whether the product was for Mac only or if there was a PC version - and they replied and said "It is against our policy to divulge this sort of information..." What a bunch of wankers!

Back on topic, at a recent guitar sampling session I recorded all the takes into Logic, using a click track for the performer. Each articulation and/or alternative take was recorded onto a separate track, starting each note on the barline. When I'd finished recording I selected all the tracks and cut them on the barlines and as they were all selected they all were cut at once with one click per bar. Than I converted all the regions to separate WAV files (one click on a menu item) and saved to a new folder. Each one is given a unique name automatically by virtue of a number appended to the file name when the regions are converted. Here's where it gets interesting. I wrote a little utility in Delphi to rename the files based on certain tokens within the automatically generated file name, and finally trimmed & normalized all the files with the Sound Forge batch converter. It took about half an hour to sort, rename and process the entire lot (not including the three weeks it took to write the Delphi utility...) However, if there was one application that could do all that any quicker, I'd sure like to have it!


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## agoz (Oct 26, 2009)

Musictronics @ Mon Oct 19 said:


> I actually emailed them enquiring whether the product was for Mac only or if there was a PC version - and they replied and said "It is against our policy to divulge this sort of information..." What a bunch of wankers!



Hi David, the question was actually:
"Is there a PC version planned, or is it Mac only?" 

and the reply was:

"Hi Dave,
unfortunately we can't comment on (possible or not possible) future products..."

Andrea
Redmatica


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## Mr Greg G (Oct 26, 2009)

Hi Andrea, you have to admit the answer wasn't very clear.


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## mikebarry (Oct 26, 2009)

I have Keymap and the other two products (EXS Manager, Autosampler). As far as I know Keymap is mac only and EXS24 only. There is an update announced to becoming in October (I emailed him over the summer) from which you can interface directly with Kontakt making it a Kontakt programmer as well as EXS24.

It is an excellent application for doing RR's quickly or basic mapping things. That auto slice feature isn't fine tuned enough to work in my case - even though it may work for things like drum kits. I tried it with some string patches and it didn't work as well. It's very well conceived in general thought it has a few small flaws. 

However it is nothing you cannot do in the exs24 programmer in Logic, which is perhaps half as fast.


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## polypx (Oct 26, 2009)

Maybe Andrea's english isn't fantastic, but Keymap definitely is. I couldn't live without it.

It's Mac only at the moment. Version 2, which will support Kontakt files directly, is due at the end of this month.

Dan


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## bryla (Oct 26, 2009)

Mike how do you do RR in exs without keymap?


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## agoz (Oct 26, 2009)

Mr Pringles @ Mon Oct 26 said:


> Hi Andrea, you have to admit the answer wasn't very clear.



You are absolutely right, but the point is that you can't really expect to ask a company about future unannounced products, and get a clear answer.

David made it look like he asked if there is a PC version available *now*, to which a "It is against our policy to divulge this sort of information..." answer would have been absurd.

So, no "bunch of wankers" here.

Andrea
Redmatica


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## gregjazz (Oct 26, 2009)

Hey Ranietz, you might find this section of the Orange Tree Samples blog useful: http://www.orangetreesamples.com/blog/category/articles/diy-sampling/ (http://www.orangetreesamples.com/blog/c ... -sampling/)

There are some cool tricks about sampling explained, including how to name and organize your samples for quick and easy mapping.


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## Ranietz (Oct 26, 2009)

gregjazz @ Mon 26 Oct said:


> Hey Ranietz, you might find this section of the Orange Tree Samples blog useful: http://www.orangetreesamples.com/blog/category/articles/diy-sampling/ (http://www.orangetreesamples.com/blog/c ... -sampling/)
> 
> There are some cool tricks about sampling explained, including how to name and organize your samples for quick and easy mapping.



Thanks Greg. I found it very useful. I never thought of using .bat files. I remember I used to make lots of those in the good old DOS/Win3.1 days. 8)


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## gregjazz (Oct 26, 2009)

Yeah, I'm surprised there's so much power in .bat files. It definitely beats spending $20-30 on batch renaming software, too.


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## Stevie (Oct 27, 2009)

Well, meanwhile Redmatica is still undecided whether to mention if there will be a PC version or not, you could try this one:
http://www.samplerobot.de/english/index.php

Btw, it's Mac and PC.


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