# Do you use Console Emulation Channel Strips for Mixing Your Orchestral Music ?



## muziksculp (Dec 2, 2021)

Hi,

With so many console emulations channel strips available today, I was curious if they are a good choice to be used for mixing Orchestral Music ? 

Anyone using them as part of their mixing workflow ? and if Yes, which one/s do you like to use ? 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


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## Studio E (Dec 2, 2021)

I do. I’ve been accused lately of buying into the hype, haha, but seriously, I always feel a certain weight added to the low end, and sense of glue, a sense of a wider image, and they frequently have really nicely musical EQs. My favorites are probably the SLLs from Plugin Alliance.


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## Henu (Dec 2, 2021)

No, I find to get better results with transparent processing using mostly Fabfilter stuff. I like my sampled orchestra clean most of the time! Only some analog- styled compressor or EQ on single specific (solo) instruments or groups if needed and some slight buss processing depending on the project. Completely dependant on the sound I'm after.


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## easyrider (Dec 2, 2021)

Yay….let’s add more $49 channels strips to a Library already recorded through a million dollar console and FX chain with top tier microphones!


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## rrichard63 (Dec 2, 2021)

There are as many as three distinct comparisons here: 

* Channel strip plugins versus no processing (or as little processing as possible)
* Channel strips versus plugin chains consisting of separate compressors, EQs, etc.
* Plugins that emulate analog gear versus plugins that are as clean as possible

Which comparison(s) are you interested in?


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## rrichard63 (Dec 2, 2021)

... and the answer might also depend on whether you're trying for a concert hall orchestral sound (and which period -- baroque, classical, romantic, modern), or for a cinematic orchestra sound, or for something else entirely.


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## muziksculp (Dec 2, 2021)

rrichard63 said:


> There are as many as three distinct comparisons here:
> 
> * Channel strip plugins versus no processing (or as little processing as possible)
> * Channel strips versus plugin chains consisting of separate compressors, EQs, etc.
> ...


Basically the Popular/Classic Console emulation Channel Strips , i.e. Neve, SSL, Focusrite, AMEK, ..etc. 

Since I'm guessing they can unify the overall mix, and character, and have handy tools to sculpt each channel of your mix.


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## Seymour Caiman (Dec 2, 2021)

I like using the modular Waves Abbey Road Mastering Chain as a channel strip for glue.


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## doctoremmet (Dec 2, 2021)

Seymour Caiman said:


> I like using the modular Waves Abbey Road Mastering Chain as a channel strip for glue.


Came here to say this ^. Also: Kazrog True Iron and Waves TG12345 sometimes (on inserts).


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## Zanshin (Dec 2, 2021)

These days, for me: Goodhertz Tiltshift and Tupe.


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## RevivalSoundStudios (Dec 2, 2021)

Yes, but very subtle such as driving a neve channel a bit, or a slight(0-1db boost) in the upper frequencies for a string section as an example. Fab filter does the heavy lifting though and is mainly used for subtractive EQ.


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## dgburns (Dec 2, 2021)

Plugin Alliance SSL E, plus Kush Clariphonic at times. I go easy on the settings. I like that comp and expander section.


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## Living Fossil (Dec 2, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> With so many console emulations channel strips available today, I was curious if they are a good choice to be used for mixing Orchestral Music ?


I think it's a bit strange to ask such questions in an abstract way.
It only makes sense in combination with an acoustic feedback.
Which would be people posting examples for what they did.

Otherwise it's worthless or easily damaging question on the internet, since, as we know, some of the influential Youtubers often set trends that are quite problematic (to put it very politely).

Choices that are made in the production process are – as @rrichard63 indicated – deeply interwoven with the music in question.
A reverb that makes a dreamy feltpiano piece sound good (if one likes that aesthetic) will completely destroy a piece that's written in a pianistic idiom.
In the same way, an orchestral piece with an elaborated voice leading will require a completely other production process that one, where the orchestra is more treated like a synthpad.
etc.

So, honestly, without audio examples the answers aren't worth too much (except if one is familiar with the production style of the one who answers). 

Said that, i don't see any reason to use a restricted console EQ when i can have something as fantastic as the Kirchhoff EQ (or TDR's Nova, etc.).
And for the compression part of channel strips: these do the exact opposite of what's mostly good for sampled instruments. They compress instead of letting the instrument "breathe".
What usually is needed, is refined dynamic EQing (that's why i mentioned those EQs)

Saturation can be good, but it's a completely own topic. Also: the used algo has to match the spectral behaviour of the instrument in question.
I remember when setting up True Iron for the Brass section some years ago, i used e.g. different algos for the horn as for the trumpets and trombones.
Etc.


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## easyrider (Dec 2, 2021)

Cut the mud add some top end fizz with an EQ

Channels strips are a waste of time on a Pro recorded library...They already been shaped going in with far superior gear than a plug.

Why complicate things?

Channels strips are useful for say recording my acoustic guitars and drumkit...But why would I add an SSL channel strip to Spitfire Chamber strings?


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## dgburns (Dec 2, 2021)

easyrider said:


> Cut the mud add some top end fizz with an EQ
> 
> Channels strips are a waste of time on a Pro recorded library...They already been shaped going in with far superior gear than a plug.
> 
> ...


Vive la difference. Now pass me a baguette.


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## doctoremmet (Dec 2, 2021)

easyrider said:


> But why would I add an SSL channel strip to Spitfire Chamber strings?


I do stuff like that just for fun.


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## easyrider (Dec 2, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I do stuff like that just for fun.


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## DJiLAND (Dec 2, 2021)

I use Softube Console 1 and Fader. No other reason, simply because it's convenient.
I do a low cut first with Console1, then I create a character, and then I do surgery with the Pro-Q3.


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## Petrucci (Dec 2, 2021)

I use tape emulation on Master buss and I remember watching Paul Thompson videos on YouTube using something like UAD Neve 1073 EQ/Preamp on Spitfire strings and winds so why not?))


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## muziksculp (Dec 2, 2021)

Zanshin said:


> These days, for me: Goodhertz Tiltshift and Tupe.


Interesting, I don't know anything about these channel strips.  

Thanks.


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## muziksculp (Dec 2, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I do stuff like that just for fun.


I like doing this type of stuff too. 

i.e. Using Teledex Impulse on Spitfire Libraries, to make them OT'd libraries.


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## muziksculp (Dec 2, 2021)

Living Fossil said:


> I think it's a bit strange to ask such questions in an abstract way.
> It only makes sense in combination with an acoustic feedback.
> Which would be people posting examples for what they did.
> 
> ...


LOL.. You wrote the longest reply, yet didn't answer my question, but rather criticized my post. 

THANKS


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## sostenuto (Dec 2, 2021)

easyrider said:


> Cut the mud add some top end fizz with an EQ
> 
> Channels strips are a waste of time on a Pro recorded library...They already been shaped going in with far superior gear than a plug.
> 
> ...


11th commandment = Pro recorded libs shall not be corrupted with Channel Strips ! 

Penalty _ _Jordan Rudess tracks pumped into casket 'til grass wilts. _


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## Trash Panda (Dec 2, 2021)

Lindell 80 from PA adds some nice vintage sound for 70s era scores. Crank up the gain, add some medium highs and even modern sounding brass gets a vintage Williams feel. 👍🏻


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## Geoff Grace (Dec 2, 2021)

Favorite Channel Strip Plugin? (2021 Edition)


I didn't want to necro a 6-year old thread, so I figured maybe it's time for an updated opinion. I'm looking for a channelstrip plugin. I had settled on the Scheps Omnichannel, but I've since decided I really don't want to buy into the Waves ecosystem so that's no longer an option. So. I'm...




vi-control.net





Best,

Geoff


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## muziksculp (Dec 2, 2021)

Trash Panda said:


> Lindell 80 from PA adds some nice vintage sound for 70s era scores. Crank up the gain, add some medium highs and even modern sounding brass gets a vintage Williams feel. 👍🏻


I agree, the Lindel 80 adds that special 70's era Mojo.  

THANKS


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## jamie8 (Dec 2, 2021)

Uad Neve DFC


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## muziksculp (Dec 2, 2021)

I wonder if there are any YT videos showing some orchestral libraries getting some famous channel strip plugin treatments, and comparing how a mix sounds with and without the console channels. 

I don't think I came across any. But I didn't specifically search for them. They are usually Pop/Rock videos, mixing the typical Bass, Drum-Kits, Guitars, Vocals, ...etc


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## onnomusic (Dec 3, 2021)

I'm in the "whatever works for you" category. That being said, there's plenty of people that use channelstrip or "vintage" EQ plugins. Tom Holkenborg being one for example.


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## muziksculp (Dec 3, 2021)

onnomusic said:


> I'm in the "whatever works for you" category. That being said, there's plenty of people that use channelstrip or "vintage" EQ plugins. Tom Holkenborg being one for example.


Same here. If it sounds good to you, then it is good. What is used doesn't matter.


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## Living Fossil (Dec 3, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> . You wrote the longest reply, yet didn't answer my question, but rather criticized my post.


That's not even true.

Your question was (in the first part):


> With so many console emulations channel strips available today, I was curious if they are a good choice to be used for mixing Orchestral Music ?



And in the second part of my post i named different arguments why i don't think it's a good idea per se and what alternatives i think are better (e.g. usage of a dynamic EQ). Or i mentioned True Iron. etc.

But maybe you have set up your mind in advance (by assuming console emus will sound great and make everything better) and therefore wasn't interested in those arguments. So, probably you just didn't read my post in its entity.

And the so called "criticism":

I suggested that people who use channelstrips post examples of some of their mixes.

Seriously, i think that would be much more helpful. 
I've heard some of such examples, and i think they usually speak for themselves.
They also would show, in which scenario such a procedere could be good and in which not.
And i don't think that's a "critique" of your initial statement but rather a way to improve the usability of this thread.


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## Brasart (Dec 3, 2021)

Abbey Road TG Mastering Chain is on my mastering template, I would usually use it for very light EQ and compression last in my chain (just before limiter).

I used to have the SSL Channel-E on my buses, and now I use their latest SSL EV2, but I usually bypass the compressor and use something else instead.

There's a lot of plugins I use but that's as far as go with channel strips


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## easyrider (Dec 3, 2021)

Glue, Heft, girth, separation, weight, mud, fizz, sparkle,

Is the console used in Abbey Road crap? 😂

One is paying for the sound of these libraries recorded in spaces through hardware we can only dream of….

Unless there is a creative reason to pollute the signal chain of the samples we have bought I just don’t get it….

Recording your own sounds is a different matter…

Removing low end build up for a more efficient mix is standard good practice…

But putting $49 SSL emulation on every channel of an instrument already recorded through a Million Dollar console is nuts! IMHO…

That is what we have paid for!

Here is a lovely chocolate cake made by a pro chef with double cream from the highlands….

Im about to eat a slice…..but I’ll pour some evaporated milk on it just before I take a bite…😂

Cause it glues everything together!


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## Petrucci (Dec 3, 2021)

jamie8 said:


> Uad Neve DFC



How do you use it? I was interested in it for a long time but didn't get it.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 3, 2021)

DJiLAND said:


> I use Softube Console 1 and Fader. No other reason, simply because it's convenient.
> I do a low cut first with Console1, then I create a character, and then I do surgery with the Pro-Q3.


Same. I traditionally find channel strips too restrictive but Console 1’s workflow is incredible - plus I can swap out each part of the channel strip with another module or a UAD plugin. Don’t need anything beyond that apart from the Q3 surgery if needed (though the Console 1 SSL 4k is pretty good) and any dynamic EQ. Throw some reverbs in and a mix bus chain, and you're good to go.


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## doctoremmet (Dec 3, 2021)

easyrider said:


> Glue, Heft, girth, separation, weight, mud, fizz, sparkle,
> 
> Is the console used in Abbey Road crap? 😂
> 
> ...


I guess you also frown upon the use of a reverb on sampled acoustic instruments, seeing how they’ve got a baked in room sound and all…


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## Trash Panda (Dec 3, 2021)

easyrider said:


> Glue, Heft, girth, separation, weight, mud, fizz, sparkle,
> 
> Is the console used in Abbey Road crap? 😂
> 
> ...


Not everyone worships at the altar of Her Lady’s Purity of the Samples. Sometimes people *gasp* WANT to change the character for their own reasons. It’s almost like it’s a subjective thing or something crazy like that.


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## easyrider (Dec 3, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I guess you also frown upon the use of a reverb on sampled acoustic instruments, seeing how they’ve got a baked in room sound and all…


Depends what reverb….😂


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## easyrider (Dec 3, 2021)

Trash Panda said:


> Not everyone worships at the altar of Her Lady’s Purity of the Samples. Sometimes people *gasp* WANT to change the character for their own reasons. It’s almost like it’s a subjective thing or something crazy like that.


Most people I know haven’t a scoobie what they are doing when it comes to mixing….all the gear and no idea….

just cause a plugin exists…doesn’t mean it’s needed…

half the time the extra processing causes even more issues


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## SyMTiK (Dec 3, 2021)

I don't necessarily use Channel Strip emulators, but I do like using more colored eqs on certain instruments to give a bit of color. My go to is Soundtoys Sie Q. I tend to use FF Pro Q3 for more surgical cleanup, and then use Sie Q to add a little color and final shaping where needed. Also great on the master!


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## jamie8 (Dec 3, 2021)

Petrucci said:


> How do you use it? I was interested in it for a long time but didn't get it.


its just plain clean sounding and the eq is amazing just use a tiny bit to give it a bit of punch , or sparkle . it is so transparent but sounds better than any other eq or comp i have used including the Uad emulations... , have tried it against the actual ssl plugins latest ver 6 stuff and others as well, this one seems to my ears the best, i went back and forth comparing it for about a week . i would come in and listen eq and then eq on a different plugin like the neve chanel strip the ssl chanel strip etc and then go away so as not to fatigue my ears and then come back the next night. it has a great stereo width as well and as long was you don't go crazy with it and mess up the phase... by widening it so much it is amazing. compressor is very smooth and limiter is as well, there are not a lot of demos on this.,,,, videos and such and i took a chance . now resides on my master bus and is a permanent fixture in my work flow very low dsp use compared to other uad stuff as well .


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## Petrucci (Dec 3, 2021)

jamie8 said:


> its just plain clean sounding and the eq is amazing just use a tiny bit to give it a bit of punch , or sparkle . it is so transparent but sounds better than any other eq or comp i have used including the Uad emulations... , have tried it against the actual ssl plugins latest ver 6 stuff and others as well, this one seems to my ears the best, i went back and forth comparing it for about a week . i would come in and listen eq and then eq on a different plugin like the neve chanel strip the ssl chanel strip etc and then go away so as not to fatigue my ears and then come back the next night. it has a great stereo width as well and as long was you don't go crazy with it and mess up the phase... by widening it so much it is amazing. compressor is very smooth and limiter is as well, there are not a lot of demos on this.,,,, videos and such and i took a chance . now resides on my master bus and is a permanent fixture in my work flow very low dsp use compared to other uad stuff as well .


Thanks a lot for your experience with it! Guess I'll try to demo it and see how it goes!))


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## aeliron (Feb 17, 2022)

Zanshin said:


> These days, for me: Goodhertz Tiltshift and Tupe.


How does it compare to Izotope's spectral shaping stuff? Wondering whether to pick up Tiltshift but I have Izotope.


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## Zanshin (Feb 17, 2022)

aeliron said:


> How does it compare to Izotope's spectral shaping stuff? Wondering whether to pick up Tiltshift but I have Izotope.



Tiltshift is basically a really easy-fast tilt style EQ with independent high and low cut filters. It's nice for quickly adjusting something to be more dark, more bright, etc. It's great for working fast. However, since that post I'm basically using Kirchhoff-EQ for nearly all EQ needs. It's also very fast to use and cpu light, but also incredibly comprehensive in it's options... one of which is a tilt style EQ.

Izotope... I have Mix & Master Bundle Advanced but I haven't used it much. The Izotope stuff seems pretty good, I am just not as familiar with it.

All the Goodhertz stuff is worth demoing! Tupe, Midside, Faraday Limiter, CanOpener Studio (when wearing headphones), and Good Dither are all on my master (along with Newfangled Elevate).


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## MauroPantin (Feb 17, 2022)

I just use the iZotope stuff, Neutron et all, don't know if it counts. It works best for me with mixing in terms of getting the job done quickly. Not looking to enhance the sound, just trim the fat and get it balanced and sounding proper. When I have to do too much mixing I know I have an arrangement problem.

I also really like the Exponential Audio verbs and use that almost exclusively, except for some impulse responses I have from a Bricasti. A friend was kind enough to let me create a few presets and capture the IRs for them.

And that's 99.9% of my mixing kit. I don't want to fiddle with this stuff forever, by the time I get to the mixing stage I want to get it out the door. 

The only thing I use outside of that ecosystem is Audiothing's BlindfoldEQ. It's free and has the right idea, IMO.


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## jazzman7 (Feb 17, 2022)

For purely Orchestral, I haven't found a channel strip to be any kind of Go to for me. In spite of the multimillion dollar rooms and consoles, I find myself having to do a bit of EQ here and there on a number of the "Best" Vi's out there. 

CSS can use a bit of judicious top end here and there. 
Vista gets dull and thuddy on the lows and mid lows and needs to be carefully dried up depending on the moment. 
The SAS violins benefit from a small cut around 3k or so. 
Sometimes a multiband compressor can be useful. 
Also, making various VI's sit together usually require a nip and a tuck here and there to get the cohesiveness you want. 

Most of this is scalpel work and I try to think subtractive first. If you know your Strip well, I'm sure sitting one on a Master bus to tweak things at the end can be useful, but I generally don't need a Howitzer to kill flies. (Upsets the neighbors). 

However, if you are in to Hybrid or just want to mangle, warp, and have some fun, Ignore what I just said!


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## clisma (Feb 17, 2022)

One of my orchestral templates has had the PA Lindell 80 on all tracks and busses for about a year now. I very much like what it does to the sound and it's great for grabbing a quick compressor or EQ (never seem to need the gate). The high end shelf is quite nice if dialed in judiciously as well. The fact I can randomize ALL the channels and add subtle noise is also useful, though I generally don't do the latter.

Also, 32-Channel from Harrison is really, really simple to use and butter-smooth. The EQ is proportional by design and seems to never sound bad/harsh. Useful filters and dynamic section (the Leveler Mode is my favorite by far), plus the ability to rearrange the modules in any order make it a strong package for not much money, especially when on sale like recently.

If I'm looking to only massage things slightly, I usually go for the 32-Channel.


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## Gabriel S. (Feb 18, 2022)

That's a very personal thing...and actually having that kind of console saturation can be also a bad thing depending on what you want.

That's like the discussion about summing mixers. I tried MANY of them, even the most expensive ones like the Chandler Mini-mixer and I always end with the impression that it is not worth it, and better investing in other more important stuff (room acoustics, monitors, other kind of hardware, etc). Same for Console Emulation plugins...At the end sometimes we focus on fancy things while 80% of the mix is about non fancy stuff: volume balance, automation, frequency balance, treating resonances and masking. But that's my personal and biased opinion.

My conclusion is: try it and do a blind A/B test with and without, with gain matching to the highest degree of accuracy. Then, if you don't hear the difference, why bother. Or, if you hear the difference, you will be able to judge if you like it or not.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Feb 18, 2022)

For folks that like using a channel strip, I just ordered this new MIDI controller that's purpose-built for controlling channel strips https://rocksolidaudio.co.uk - apparently works (or can work) with nearly every channel strip plugin (and others). Entirely done through mouse mapping. I imagine it'll give the type of feel that Console 1 does, but with the flexibility to use with any plugin.


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## clisma (Feb 18, 2022)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> For folks that like using a channel strip, I just ordered this new MIDI controller that's purpose-built for controlling channel strips https://rocksolidaudio.co.uk - apparently works (or can work) with nearly every channel strip plugin (and others). Entirely done through mouse mapping. I imagine it'll give the type of feel that Console 1 does, but with the flexibility to use with any plugin.


That looks great! Might well get one if you report your favorable impressions back here.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Feb 18, 2022)

Also, speaking of channel strips, the highly regarded Fuse Audio Labs VCS-1 is 50% off this weekend at their site.


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## muziksculp (Feb 18, 2022)

clisma said:


> One of my orchestral templates has had the PA Lindell 80 on all tracks and busses for about a year now. I very much like what it does to the sound and it's great for grabbing a quick compressor or EQ (never seem to need the gate). The high end shelf is quite nice if dialed in judiciously as well. The fact I can randomize ALL the channels and add subtle noise is also useful, though I generally don't do the latter.


Interesting. I have the PA Lindell 80, but never tried it on orchestral tracks. Thanks for the feedback, I will test it, and see what it does to some of my libraries. 

Thanks.


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## muziksculp (Feb 18, 2022)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Also, speaking of channel strips, the highly regarded Fuse Audio Labs VCS-1 is 50% off this weekend at their site.


Don't know much about this one. What makes it special compared to many other Channel Strips ? 

Thanks for the heads up on the sale.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Feb 18, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Don't know much about this one. What makes it special compared to many other Channel Strips ?
> 
> Thanks for the heads up on the sale.


Well-featured and sounds good. 3 preamp models, 5 band EQ (instead of 4 that most channel strips have), mid/side mode for the EQ, width knob, flexible side chain routing, full featured compressor/limiter and gate/expander sections. Modeled to have an SSL vibe, but more expansive than that. Has a group mode that allows you to easily visualize and tweak all strips in your project from one screen (similar to CLA Mixhub). Zero latency, low CPU - but has an HQ mode as well.


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## G_Erland (Feb 19, 2022)

About that idea that the samples sound so good you shouldnt touch them - i once read an sos article about mixing adele, recorded in a top notch room, carefully chosen super vintage mic, very experienced engineer, expertly set up neve mic pre, eq, compression chain. Its hard to believe you could get an objectively better signal - but the mixer went to town on the vocal eq in the mix like you wouldnt believe. After all that, using just an old waves eq or something.


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## Mark III (Feb 19, 2022)

If it sounds better to you, use it, after all aren't we in a "creative" industry? 

Even running a fake noise floor helps glue samples together very well.


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## muziksculp (Feb 19, 2022)

Mark III said:


> If it sounds better to you, use it


Yup. That's my rule. It doesn't matter what you use, if the tool you use gives you the sound you want, then use it.


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## nuyo (Feb 19, 2022)

Don't think about it. I use Fabfilter because they don't have a sound. The only analog emulation I use is the API EQ by Waves. Because it has pre selected bands. I only use it to make a sound nicer.


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