# Dominus Pro



## JonSolo (Oct 9, 2019)

Ok...


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## cqd (Oct 9, 2019)

God damnit..

**checks bank account**..


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## paoling (Oct 10, 2019)

Hello guys! Yes it is a little teaser of something we have been working on for a while. It shouldn't take that long. And yes, for who was thinking about Dominus 2 this is it! But we joined the Apple thing of calling Pro everything. The fact is that this new version of dominus is a complete renew library with twice the content of the original, new articulations and stuff! You can also sing some stuff in English and most of the important phonemes are covered. 

Feel free to ask anything! We may not have all the answers yet


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## M0rdechai (Oct 10, 2019)

Super interested here!

Obvious questions would include:
- Library size?
- Price range?
- 'Upgrade price' for Dominus users?
- Release date?

I realize some or most of this info is still 'hush hush' or unclear...


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## lgmcben (Oct 10, 2019)

This is dangerous. I'm outta here.


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## VVEremita (Oct 10, 2019)

What is the impact on the original Dominus? I know that it will add more syllables and marcato, but will there be changes in sound or functionality of the original content? Like scripting or editing of the original samples? Or does it simply "add" to it?

Either way, I use Dominus a lot and I am very much looking forward to this.


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## OleJoergensen (Oct 10, 2019)

Thank you Fluffy audio.

I bought Dominus choir half a year ago and love it!
look forward to greater use of it with the Pro version.
I hope it also can be used for beautiful choir composition and not only action as the short Teaser 
.....hoping for a short “beautiful” teaser


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## Peter Satera (Oct 10, 2019)

Will the pro version influence the pricing and/or availability of the original? As we've seen with other libraries, initial releases can be discontinued for more expensive yet similar alternatives.


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## tommalm (Oct 10, 2019)

Oooh! Nice! Are you adding the ability to route microphone positions to separate Kontakt outputs?

Looking forward to hearing more!


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## AllanH (Oct 10, 2019)

This sounds like a very promising upgrade. Dominus has a wonderful tone and good work-flow. I'm very much looking forward to the "pro" details and pricing.


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## paoling (Oct 10, 2019)

M0rdechai said:


> - Library size?


now it is 53 Gb ncw compressed. Almost double the size of the original Dominus.


M0rdechai said:


> - Price range?


We still are deciding but substantially less than double the price of Dominus if you include the introductory price. Consider that, except for maybe the GUI and some part of the scripting, this library is taken from a session that was equal in time than the original Dominus. So it is a more "complete" library now.


M0rdechai said:


> - 'Upgrade price' for Dominus users?


The entire retail price of Dominus Choir will be discounted. You can think about Dominus Choir Pro as a kind of Bundle between Dominus Choir and "Pro". We thought about doing also a version with just the new features without the content of Dominus Choir 1, but we thought it would be confusing to our customers.



M0rdechai said:


> - Release date?



Not too long! We have to receive a few demos, make walkthroughs and make some noise about it, but the library is ready!



VVEremita said:


> What is the impact on the original Dominus? I know that it will add more syllables and marcato, but will there be changes in sound or functionality of the original content? Like scripting or editing of the original samples? Or does it simply "add" to it?



Dominus Choir Pro has 3 patches: Legato, Marcato and Staccato. The legato patch is the old "legacy" one, but with added features and 120 new syllables to play with. The new features (monophonic legato, 12 word syllables instead of 6, various bugfixes) will be ready for an update of the original Dominus Choir. Also we have now split all the ending syllables so if you had before "ULCRUM" now you have "ULCRU" and"UM" so you can write "ULCRUS"

Dominus Marcato and Staccato will be very similar with an entire new set of syllables to play with. They are 60 syllables (+60 releases for the Marcato), but they are not conceived like the legato patch. For example if you want to sing DOMINUS in the Legato patch you have to write: DO OMI INU US and you have to specify a predefined length for each syllable.

With the Marcato patch you can write DO MI NU-US 
Each syllable will have like 12 different "releases" so when you raise the key you will hear the release of that syllable. 

With the Staccato patch there are no releases, but just 60 syllables. You can use the Staccato also to have a more "impactful" sound over the Marcato (or to simulate something like a fp).

While Dominus Choir was quite easy to use, the new articulations in Dominus Choir Pro are even more easy, because you just play them in the most natural way (but there are a lot of things under the hood to make them to sound good at any kind of speed).

One note about languages: the selection this time was not done over the most used syllables in latin choir music, but on the most used phonemes. 

That's why was essential for us:

1) to include all the vowel combinations: AE, AI,AO,AU, EA,EI, etc.. If you use Italian language as a kind of simple phonetic language you can use it to create english sounding words. If an Italian would write SILENCE in the way that he hears it he would write SAILENS or SA AI ILE ENS in Dominus Choir Pro. 
I love you is written AI ILO OVI IU
This is very intuitive for us Italians, but also for Spanish and German speakers, whose languages tends to have a sound that is mostly represented by a single letter.

2) Someone says that it is impossibile to understand what a choir sings. I disagree. But what is true is that some consonants sound very similar. M and N, for example, D and T, P and B. This help us a bit.
We can use word similarity to construct more words. 

For example if you want to sing AMAZING GRACE, you can write AMESIREIS (A AME ESI IRE EIS in Dominus Choir Pro Legato) and it will sound like AMAZING GRACE. 
In Dominus Choir Pro Marcato you can write A ME SI RE I-S or better A-M ME-S SI-R E-I I-S (the release is a consonant that follows the preceding consonants) to have a more connected sound.

In the end. We have thought a lot about how to make a convincing choir, with one of the easiest interfaces ever, with the most beautiful and versatile sound we could do 

Oh, this was a long reply!
@Peter Satera No we won't discountinue the original Dominus Choir as I said we are working on an update which includes some of the features of DCP! In general we don't like to discontinue products we are proud of

@tommalm No there aren't individual Kontakt outputs, but I will try add it it if it's easy to do!

And yes I think we have finally fixed that stupid "move your modwheel and resave bug!"


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## Theodor Andrews (Oct 10, 2019)

I can't wait!!! 💙


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## Drundfunk (Oct 10, 2019)

It will never stop....... . Will it ever stop......? Why are you doing this to me Paolo.....? You know you think you are at a point where you have it all and can save your money for food, but no.......... . Thanks Fluffy Audio! Can't wait!


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## I like music (Oct 10, 2019)

Absolute bastards...!!!


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## FinGael (Oct 10, 2019)

HAL LE LU JA-AH


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## micrologus (Oct 10, 2019)

Fantastic!


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## wcreed51 (Oct 10, 2019)

I don't suppose you've made it SATB


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## lgmcben (Oct 11, 2019)

Do you also have children choir included in this package?


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## erikradbo (Oct 11, 2019)

FIII-NAAA-LLYYY, Marcato style


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## Ihnoc (Oct 11, 2019)

paoling said:


> One note about languages: the selection this time was not done over the most used syllables in latin choir music, but on the most used phonemes.
> 
> That's why was essential for us:
> 
> ...



Sounds a lot like the Genesis implementation which I think is pretty fluid. Coming from Vocaloid I'm used to this kind of process. Looking forward to it; Dominus was already on my radar, now even more so!


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## I like music (Oct 14, 2019)

I had a dream that someone broke into my house. When I went downstairs to investigate, they threw a knife at me, but instead of hitting me, it hit a box of Dominus Pro, which was sitting on the kitchen table. And I think I remember trying to shove the broken pieces of the CD (I know, a CD) into my computer, crying all the while. This is not a joke. I need to get therapy.

Also, it reminded me, that in real life this scenario could actually never happen, because it hasn't been released yet. @paoling surely it must be released today so that I can finally process my weird dream?


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## I like music (Oct 16, 2019)

Bump @paoling


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## I like music (Oct 18, 2019)

I'm about to go 'Kersten vs re-peat' all up in this place, if I don't get a response... 

OK, just kidding, but it is very hard to contain my excitement... Any rough ideas when we might get demos or more info?


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## NickDorito (Oct 18, 2019)

Chill bro


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## OleJoergensen (Oct 18, 2019)

I like music said:


> I'm about to go 'Kersten vs re-peat' all up in this place, if I don't get a response...
> 
> OK, just kidding, but it is very hard to contain my excitement... Any rough ideas when we might get demos or more info?


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## I like music (Oct 18, 2019)

NickDorito said:


> Chill bro



Almost always good advice. NOT IN THIS CASE. But I'll try it and see what happens.


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## paoling (Oct 18, 2019)

Hello guys!

Usually when we announce a library we release it in a couple of weeks at max. This time even if the library is ready we are still finishing a couple of things before.


Why? Because this library is actually three things:
1) Dominus Choir Pro
2) Update for Dominus Choir 1
3) A nice freebie for everyone

While 1 and 3 are ready, we are doing 2 and we are preparing the material for a big release of 1.

We have strived to release it before another "big" release that's happening soon from a fellow developer, but I sincerely don't know if we can make in time. Obviously it will happen with some anticipation before BF.. 

I'll post here news when they come!


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## Kony (Oct 18, 2019)

Thanks @paoling for the update - really looking forward to this!


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## Manuel Stumpf (Oct 18, 2019)

paoling said:


> 2) Update for Dominus Choir 1


So does the new Dominus Pro include Dominus 1?
I mean does it make sense to buy Dominus 1 when you are going to buy Dominus Pro?


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## I like music (Oct 18, 2019)

paoling said:


> Hello guys!
> 
> Usually when we announce a library we release it in a couple of weeks at max. This time even if the library is ready we are still finishing a couple of things before.
> 
> ...



Thank you! Just something I was confused about. If existing owners buy this, does it essentially replace Dominus, or would I technically have two separate libraries on the HD? I'm assuming it'll all get rolled into one.


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## paoling (Oct 19, 2019)

Manuel Stumpf said:


> So does the new Dominus Pro include Dominus 1?


Dominus Choir Pro includes everything that Dominus Choir (1) has and the new "Pro" additions. If you buy Dominus Choir and want to upgrade to "Pro" you can just pay the difference.



I like music said:


> If existing owners buy this, does it essentially replace Dominus, or would I technically have two separate libraries on the HD?



The all the original Dominus' samples are now contained in Dominus Choir Pro. We'll try to make that if you have any project done in Dominus 1 it will still open and play as it should. But in the beginning for safety, best to avoid wiping your original Dominus if you have any project using it.


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## paoling (Oct 19, 2019)

If you want to have a listen
Daniel James is having a look at Dominus Choir Pro now! :D


This was completely unexpected but it's super cool!


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## erikradbo (Oct 19, 2019)

Watching, has he covered Dominus already?


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## paoling (Oct 19, 2019)

A bit, but he's going to make an extensive play later I guess! I don't know


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## erikradbo (Oct 19, 2019)

And I have to sleep . Will watch tomorrow if available.


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## paoling (Oct 19, 2019)

(by the way this is an opportunity for me to hear the first reaction to a library and tweak a couple of things. I already spotted a couple of things that may need a fix)


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## erikradbo (Oct 19, 2019)

paoling said:


> (by the way this is an opportunity for me to hear the first reaction to a library and tweak a couple of things. I already spotted a couple of things that may need a fix)



Nice. Must be a good feeling in general to see other people use your creation.


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## cqd (Oct 19, 2019)

DJ really doesn't like the spitfire crowd..


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## Kony (Oct 19, 2019)

Watching the DJ twitch now - sounds amazing!


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## erikradbo (Oct 20, 2019)

Watched it too. Sounds really great!


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## I like music (Oct 20, 2019)

erikradbo said:


> Watched it too. Sounds really great!



Do you have a rough time stamp for where he shows Dominus?


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## erikradbo (Oct 20, 2019)

I like music said:


> Do you have a rough time stamp for where he shows Dominus?



2:30-ish


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## I like music (Oct 20, 2019)

erikradbo said:


> 2:30-ish



Thanks a ton!


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## axb312 (Oct 20, 2019)

Sounds good, once again hoping Dominus comes through for 229 USD this BF, so one can pick up Dominus Pro later...


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## I like music (Oct 20, 2019)

This sounds so goddamn good. Great job on adding the Marc and Stacc's!


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## paoling (Oct 20, 2019)

Thank you guys! For us it was really useful to see how an experienced user would approach the library. We have thought about a couple of fixes (releases for the Marcato articulation and an overview of the tuning for the Marcatos) before the release.


Thank you Daniel!! :D


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## Drundfunk (Oct 21, 2019)

Going to watch it at the end of the week I guess. Don't have much time before the weekend (whatever a weekend is tho. No idea)


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## I like music (Oct 21, 2019)

Drundfunk said:


> Going to watch it at the end of the week I guess. Don't have much time before the weekend (whatever a weekend is tho. No idea)



It sounds excellent. Dominus itself was excellent, but I felt the missing Marcs and Staccs took a bit away from it. Those have been added, and it sounds fantastic! It is about 45 minutes of noodling, and he's just trying to come up with swear words.


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## Drundfunk (Oct 21, 2019)

I like music said:


> It sounds excellent. Dominus itself was excellent, but I felt the missing Marcs and Staccs took a bit away from it. Those have been added, and it sounds fantastic! It is about 45 minutes of noodling, and he's just trying to come up with swear words.


Thanks man, sounds like fun. Guess I know what I will do on one of those days other people call weekend


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## jonesdip (Oct 22, 2019)

I bought the original Dominus last BF sale and after an initial play I haven't had cause to use it until just recently. I included two tracks in a Cubase session - love the sound. The library is on a Samsung T3 SSD USB drive but for some reason it takes a really long time to load (I'm talking many minutes). By elimination I proved it was the 2 Dominus tracks which take so long. Even just loading the library in a standalone version of Kontakt 5 or 6 takes a lot longer than other libraries. I sent a support request to Fluffy but received to feedback. Anyone else have this issue - any suggestions. I've done the usual Batch Resave etc. with no effect. It's frustrating because I love the choir!


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## I like music (Oct 22, 2019)

jonesdip said:


> I bought the original Dominus last BF sale and after an initial play I haven't had cause to use it until just recently. I included two tracks in a Cubase session - love the sound. The library is on a Samsung T3 SSD USB drive but for some reason it takes a really long time to load (I'm talking many minutes). By elimination I proved it was the 2 Dominus tracks which take so long. Even just loading the library in a standalone version of Kontakt 5 or 6 takes a lot longer than other libraries. I sent a support request to Fluffy but received to feedback. Anyone else have this issue - any suggestions. I've done the usual Batch Resave etc. with no effect. It's frustrating because I love the choir!



Woah! This exact thing happened to me. My template loading time went from 4mins to 7mins and I identified that it was Dominus, for some reason. If I open a new instrument and try to load Dominus, Cubase stops responding for a few minutes. I think performance is absolutely fine, once loaded, but the loading is definitely an issue. I had thought it was to do with me moving stuff from my computer to my Laptop, but actually, I'm having the exact same problem...


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## paoling (Oct 22, 2019)

Hello! We have solved this problem also and this will be available in the update. Dominus engine has to load most of the samples entirely in memory, to make his own syllable jumping around the library. This will always make it a little heavier than DFD only patches. But the main cause of this was that the samples in D1 are separate files in a folder. We spotted that packaging them in nkx format (as it happens for all Kontakt Player libraries) solves this issue and the library loads instantanely. 

That's why Dominus Choir Pro and the update for Dominus Choir will have their samples packaged.


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## I like music (Oct 22, 2019)

paoling said:


> Hello! We have solved this problem also and this will be available in the update. Dominus engine has to load most of the samples entirely in memory, to make his own syllable jumping around the library. This will always make it a little heavier than DFD only patches. But the main cause of this was that the samples in D1 are separate files in a folder. We spotted that packaging them in nkx format (as it happens for all Kontakt Player libraries) solves this issue and the library loads instantanely.
> 
> That's why Dominus Choir Pro and the update for Dominus Choir will have their samples packaged.



The day just gets better and better! Thanks, just wanted to make sure I hadn't messed something up.

@paoling I had another dream. An old hag came to me and told me that anyone who releases their library in November will have bad luck. She said that any sample developers that want future good luck, should release their libraries on the 22nd of October. Not sure why she was so specific, but you know how curses go. It is best not to risk it.


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## jonesdip (Oct 22, 2019)

paoling said:


> Hello! We have solved this problem also and this will be available in the update. Dominus engine has to load most of the samples entirely in memory, to make his own syllable jumping around the library. This will always make it a little heavier than DFD only patches. But the main cause of this was that the samples in D1 are separate files in a folder. We spotted that packaging them in nkx format (as it happens for all Kontakt Player libraries) solves this issue and the library loads instantanely.
> 
> That's why Dominus Choir Pro and the update for Dominus Choir will have their samples packaged.


Wow! I'm so pleased with this reply. I had a feeling that something like this was the case. Will the existing Dominus be updated or will I need to upgrade to Dominus Pro to resolve this issue. Not that I wouldn't do that at sometime but obviously the budget......


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## I like music (Oct 22, 2019)

jonesdip said:


> Wow! I'm so pleased with this reply. I had a feeling that something like this was the case. Will the existing Dominus be updated or will I need to upgrade to Dominus Pro to resolve this issue. Not that I wouldn't do that at sometime but obviously the budget......



Looks like there's an independent update coming for Dominus 1 (so you won't have to upgrade to Pro to resolve this issue). At least how I read it.


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## paoling (Oct 22, 2019)

Yep!


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## erikradbo (Oct 24, 2019)

Excitement wise I'd like to see this thread get to 5000 posts first . Please don't wait too long because of "another 'big' release that's happening...from a fellow developer" .


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## lgmcben (Oct 24, 2019)

erikradbo said:


> "another 'big' release that's happening...from a fellow developer"


While we wait, let's speculate which developer he's referring to.


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## ism (Oct 24, 2019)

Well the closest direct competitor - and arguably the only real competitor to Dominus is - and correct me if I'm wrong - is the Insolidus / Silka series. So maybe there's another one of these coming?


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## erikradbo (Oct 24, 2019)

ism said:


> Well the closest direct competitor - and arguably the only real competitor to Dominus is - and correct me if I'm wrong - is the Insolidus / Silka series. So maybe there's another one of these coming?



There might be another current attention stealer as well, without ruling out Silka v2 by any means.


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## paoling (Oct 24, 2019)

Nono. It wasn't a choir library. It was today and since Dominus Choir Pro is going to be one of ours priciest libraries ever (not for Dominus 1 users) we wanted to be able to release it, before the today's release would steal a bit all the attention...


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## axb312 (Oct 24, 2019)

paoling said:


> Nono. It wasn't a choir library. It was today and since Dominus Choir Pro is going to be one of ours priciest libraries ever (not for Dominus 1 users) we wanted to be able to release it, before the today's release would steal a bit all the attention...



Would be nice if it's somewhere around 400 USD (roughly 229 USD x 2 minus a lil extra).

Just my 2 cents...


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## erikradbo (Oct 24, 2019)

paoling said:


> Nono. It wasn't a choir library. It was today and since Dominus Choir Pro is going to be one of ours priciest libraries ever (not for Dominus 1 users) we wanted to be able to release it, before the today's release would steal a bit all the attention...



Yes it was - I think - obvious you were referring to BBCSO, at least from my side it was some silly sarcasm in that discussion on whether you were referring to a new Silka release .


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## ism (Oct 24, 2019)

erikradbo said:


> Yes it was - I think - obvious you were referring to BBCSO, at least from my side it was some silly sarcasm in that discussion on whether you were referring to a new Silka release .



And I just thought it would be fun to take you literally and speculate wildly


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## paoling (Oct 24, 2019)

axb312 said:


> Would be nice if it's somewhere around 400 USD (roughly 229 USD x 2 minus a lil extra).
> 
> Just my 2 cents...


Dominus Choir 1 is 379. How could Dominus Choir Pro be 400?


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## jtnyc (Oct 24, 2019)

axb312 said:


> Would be nice if it's somewhere around 400 USD (roughly 229 USD x 2 minus a lil extra).
> 
> Just my 2 cents...



Lots of things would be nice, but that is a very unrealistic expectation. $229 is already 40% off the price of Dom 1 so doubling that to arrive at a price makes no sense, and your lil extra off is about another 16% ($58) lower. Not so lil.


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## axb312 (Oct 24, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> Lots of things would be nice, but that is very unrealistic expectation. $229 is already 40% off the price of Dom 1 so doubling that to arrive at a price makes no sense, and your lil extra off is about another 16% ($58) lower. Not so lil.



460 USD would be fine too...

Just saying what would make the lib approachable for me..no offense intended! Cheers!


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## erikradbo (Oct 24, 2019)

The most expensive choirs are currently around 599€ (Whitacre, 8dio), which I always found to be just a bit too high. But if the content is right in Dominus Pro and ends up in that price range...maybe. Excited to see the walkthroughs to get a feel for how much the new recordings adds.


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## Geoff Grace (Oct 25, 2019)

paoling said:


> Dominus Choir Pro includes everything that Dominus Choir (1) has and the new "Pro" additions. If you buy Dominus Choir and want to upgrade to "Pro" you can just pay the difference.


This might be a good installment plan, for those who can't come up with the full price all at once: first buy Dominus Choir and later upgrade to the Pro version.

Best,

Geoff


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## JonSolo (Oct 25, 2019)

We have all been wishing for an adult version of Genesis...this might be it. With the DJ video it is looking really promising.

While I am getting used to the interface, it has not been particularly easy with Dominus. After watching the video it appears some of that may have improved (unless I have just been doing it wrong, ha, could be). I always liked the way 8DIO did the multi consonants in Lacrimosa...maybe a blend of the two...

Ah well, we shall see...soon...right? Heh.


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## paoling (Oct 28, 2019)

Hello Jon. We strived to make Dominus as easy as it could. The Legato patch needs to have the words' rhythm set in advance, due to the way it works. The Marcato and Staccato patches are a lot easier to use since you can just write your word and play. In my opinion it is the easiest wordbuilder ever (no need to "pianoroll" the words inside an editor, for example)


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## JonSolo (Oct 28, 2019)

Sounds great! Looking forward to it!


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## constaneum (Oct 28, 2019)

paoling said:


> Hello Jon. We strived to make Dominus as easy as it could. The Legato patch needs to have the words' rhythm set in advance, due to the way it works. The Marcato and Staccato patches are a lot easier to use since you can just write your word and play. In my opinion it is the easiest wordbuilder ever (no need to "pianoroll" the words inside an editor, for example)



Paolo, are we able to do legato ah, oo, mm all those with Dominus Pro?


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## bvaughn0402 (Oct 28, 2019)

I'm SO getting this when it comes out.


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## paoling (Oct 29, 2019)

constaneum said:


> Paolo, are we able to do legato ah, oo, mm all those with Dominus Pro?



Dominus Choir Pro includes everything in Dominus 1 and this was already possible in Dominus 1.

Regarding mmms. There is going to be a little surprise coming out in the next days


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## VVEremita (Oct 29, 2019)

Are the marcato / staccato / legato patches made to work best on their own or would there be a benefit it combining them for more realistic phrases? Are they consistent in volume, feel and possible syllables if Dominus is used with the traditional "church" approach? 

And yes, Dominus has the best wordbuilder!


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## micrologus (Oct 29, 2019)

paoling said:


> Regarding mmms. There is going to be a little surprise coming out in the next days



Mmm!


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## paoling (Oct 29, 2019)

VVEremita said:


> Are the marcato / staccato / legato patches made to work best on their own or would there be a benefit it combining them for more realistic phrases?


The work on their own, but you can stack the staccato and the marcato together to have a stronger attack for the marcato (by using the modwheel to control the marcato and the velocity for the staccato, you can have your own fortepiano patches).



VVEremita said:


> Are they consistent in volume, feel and possible syllables if Dominus is used with the traditional "church" approach?



They are consistent in volume, they are different in feel and syllables because the Marcato and the Staccato have a different syllable set than the Legato. But mostly you would be able to recreate the same stuff with all the patches, considering the amount of syllables now present in the legato and the fact that the Staccato and Marcato are thought to cover a wide range of phonemes.


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## I like music (Oct 29, 2019)

paoling said:


> Dominus Choir Pro includes everything in Dominus 1 and this was already possible in Dominus 1.
> 
> Regarding mmms. There is going to be a little surprise coming out in the next days



I like that you are describing it in days now. So _definitely_ less than a week?!


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## VVEremita (Oct 29, 2019)

I guess the surprise is the freebe mentioned earlier and not the actual release? Although I sure hope we'll have the full version soon.


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## I like music (Oct 29, 2019)

VVEremita said:


> I guess the surprise is the freebe mentioned earlier and not the actual release? Although I sure hope we'll have the full version soon.



Oh I see. Yes, I read that too quickly. Damn.


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## jbuhler (Oct 29, 2019)

Have you settled on a price yet for the upgrade from Dominus? I'm trying to figure out how much money to reserve...


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## Geoff Grace (Oct 30, 2019)

Oooooo...

Haunted Choir Freeeeebieeee

Thanks, @paoling!

Best,

Geoff


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## bote (Oct 30, 2019)

Upcoming (soon) need for a good M&F choir. Wotan and Freyja bundle is 495 euro. Willing to be sold on Dominus Pro if it is competitively priced , or priced higher for a demonstrably better product. So.....
Finger on Paypal.


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## paoling (Nov 3, 2019)

It is a wonderful day, isn't it?


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## JonSolo (Nov 3, 2019)

Drum roll, ha ha


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## ProfoundSilence (Nov 3, 2019)

paoling said:


> It is a wonderful day, isn't it?


I got scared, never saw the original post, thought you slipped dominus 2 by me entirely

staccato/marcato? done

where do I sign?


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## Theodor Andrews (Nov 4, 2019)

It's a perfect day today 🙂


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## M0rdechai (Nov 4, 2019)

there may or may not be a website to check on this lovely day


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## paoling (Nov 4, 2019)

Dominus Choir Pro


Visit the post for more.




www.fluffyaudio.com


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## M0rdechai (Nov 4, 2019)

So when it says 

FEATURES

*Many bottles of wine drunk with the male choir*

Does that mean that if you buy this library you get to drink those bottles with the choir, or does it mean you get the empty bottles sent to you?


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## I like music (Nov 4, 2019)

paoling said:


> Dominus Choir Pro
> 
> 
> Visit the post for more.
> ...



Oh, nice! The discount for Dominus 1 owners. Is that figure that's mentioned in the email subtracted from the 549 or the 649? Just wasn't sure!


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## paoling (Nov 4, 2019)

From 549, so you'll end paying the upgrade just 170$


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## Kony (Nov 4, 2019)

paoling said:


> From 549, so you'll end paying the upgrade just 170$


Wow amazing - thanks!


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## cqd (Nov 4, 2019)

What's the story, should I delete the old dominus once this one is downloaded?


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## paoling (Nov 4, 2019)

cqd said:


> What's the story, should I delete the old dominus once this one is downloaded?


As we said in the mail we have sent to you, if you have projects that you still want to open, please avoid deleting the old Dominus Choir.


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## I like music (Nov 4, 2019)

paoling said:


> From 549, so you'll end paying the upgrade just 170$



You're wrong. Your sentence implied that I would be paying this at some point in the future. I turns out I had already purchased it so it should have been "you ended up paying the upgrade just $170."

Fantastic value for the upgrade. Better price than I thought! I'm very, very, very happy at this moment.


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## JonSolo (Nov 4, 2019)

Wow. What a generous offer for previous owners! Downloading now!

So excited...


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## I like music (Nov 4, 2019)

JonSolo said:


> Wow. What a generous offer for previous owners! Downloading now!
> 
> So excited...



My connection is so slow it says it'll take 7hrs. But then I finish work in 7hrs so I guess it was meant to be!


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## JonSolo (Nov 4, 2019)

Installing now...


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## jbuhler (Nov 4, 2019)

paoling said:


> As we said in the mail we have sent to you, if you have projects that you still want to open, please avoid deleting the old Dominus Choir.


If we are upgrading to Dominus Pro is there any reason to upgrade Dominus itself to 1.2?


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## JonSolo (Nov 4, 2019)

Email said it (v1.2) "loads faster" but also not backwards compatible....hmmm.


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## paoling (Nov 4, 2019)

If you keep just the patches of the original Dominus and point them to the new samples folder you can then throw away the old samples.


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## I like music (Nov 4, 2019)

So if I'm downloading Dominus Pro, I _can_ technically just get rid of all my original Dominus stuff, right? Doing a new template which is nearly finished. All I had to add was choirs, so I'm assuming that'll be fine going forward?


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## JonSolo (Nov 4, 2019)

Are there no predefined word presets in Marcato patch?


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## paoling (Nov 4, 2019)

JonSolo said:


> Are there no predefined word presets in Marcato patch


Not yet. The main reason is that you can almost do any kind of word with the Marcato patch. I'll explain how in a video the next week, but if you check the manual you'll guess how. The similarities in the sound of consonants makes it able to create any kind of world. For example you can write di ia ai con ro ol to sing a believable "vi-control"


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## HardyP (Nov 4, 2019)

paoling said:


> If you keep just the patches of the original Dominus and point them to the new samples folder you can then throw away the old samples.


So it means 1.2 is a full download with a complete new set of samples, right...? Just was wondering, bcs even the update was supposed to be 7hrs ...?


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## jbuhler (Nov 4, 2019)

Downloaded and playing with it. Initial impressions: excellent sound and really fun. Usefully extends the capabilities of the original Dominus. The marcatos and staccatos are great. Finally a choir that can sing sharp syllables at a lower dynamic level that doesn't sound like the volume has just been turned down! yay!

Some (very minor) complaints: its range of English syllables is still less than ideal because it doesn't have a lot of English consonants, and especially the combinations. Maybe there's a trick to getting them that is not immediately apparent. But many of English consonants don't yield to simple substitution of voiced and unvoiced consonants. This is really only an issue if you need the choir to sing intelligible English words. If you are ok with it just singing syllables and syllables strung together to form the impression that words are being sung (the majority of uses I need it for), it is great. 

I also wish it came with preset words for the staccato and marcato patches. At least in the version I have, these patches only come with the four preset words.

Finally, I wish that the add a word defaulted to placing the keyswitch at G0, adding to the existing placement, rather than defaulting to C-2.

I do want to reiterate that my initial impressions of the library are great, I'm very happy with Dominus Pro, and the introductory price for existing users is especially good.


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## I like music (Nov 4, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> Downloaded and playing with it. Initial impressions: excellent sound and really fun. Usefully extends the capabilities of the original Dominus. The marcatos and staccatos are great. Finally a choir that can sing sharp syllables at a lower dynamic level that doesn't sound like the volume has just been turned down! yay!
> 
> Some (very minor) complaints: its range of English syllables is still less than ideal because it doesn't have a lot of English consonants, and especially the combinations. Maybe there's a trick to getting them that is not immediately apparent. But many of English consonants don't yield to simple substitution of voiced and unvoiced consonants. This is really only an issue if you need the choir to sing intelligible English words. If you are ok with it just singing syllables and syllables strung together to form the impression that words are being sung (the majority of uses I need it for), it is great.
> 
> ...



Tell me more about your internet connection...

(Also great review, thanks! I'm a few hours away from the download finishing!!!)


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## Oliver (Nov 4, 2019)

downloading  7mbit/s


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## zvenx (Nov 4, 2019)

paoling said:


> If you keep just the patches of the original Dominus and point them to the new samples folder you can then throw away the old samples.


ouch. which I knew this 2 hours ago before I dumped my old one. Time to go for a backup 
rsp


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## whiskers (Nov 4, 2019)

So, not to be dense, but if I don't have the original Dominus, and get this, I'm not 'missing' any content, right? This is just like Dominus expanded, correct? Sounds lovely!


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## I like music (Nov 4, 2019)

whiskers said:


> So, not to be dense, but if I don't have the original Dominus, and get this, I'm not 'missing' any content, right? This is just like Dominus expanded, correct? Sounds lovely!



I hope so!!! I just went and deleted Dominus, and also most of what I had downloaded of Dominus 1.2, to make space on my SSD for this ...


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## Mucusman (Nov 4, 2019)

whiskers said:


> if I don't have the original Dominus, and get this, I'm not 'missing' any content, right



Correct. With Pro, you get _everything_ (inclusive of the content of the original Dominus package).


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## I like music (Nov 4, 2019)

39 minutes to go till download is complete...


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## Danny (Nov 4, 2019)

Downloading....6.0 Mib/s - 2 hours remaining.


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## jbuhler (Nov 4, 2019)

Oliver said:


> downloading  7mbit/s


I was between 6 and 9 most of the download. It took maybe 90 minutes. I'm not entirely sure as I had it running in the background.


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## Oliver (Nov 4, 2019)

45 min


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## Robert_G (Nov 4, 2019)

Watched the demos but not completely sold. Was watching the part on 'overlapping' of men/women....noticed that they can be seperated or overlapped. However there is no overlap control for bass/tenor or alto/ soprano. Some notes give just bass....some tenor....some both....which gives an unequal amount of voices depending on the notes you play.

Genesis has turned me into an auto divisi snob, and considering that Genesis is less than half the price of Dominus....i dont see the value here.

At least Stezov Wotan/Freya recorded all 4 sections seperately so i could write all 4 sections onto seperate tracks basically giving me some sort of divisi. Divisi in Dominus is basically impossible....and Wotan/Freya is cheaper too.

Im not seeing $700 U.S. in value.
I will say that the Dominus wordbuilder blows the competition away though in that regard, but if Dominus had auto divisi....that would make them #1 in choirs.

Its unfortunate....because i like everything else about Dominus....but you have to have control of how many voices you hear from note to note. Genesis is the only choir that gets that part right....and I guess Wotan/Freya...but with extra programming required to make it work.


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## ProfoundSilence (Nov 4, 2019)

fair criticism, I often wish it was separated as well, however I prefer dominus alot compared to many other choir products

that said, dominus sounds vastly more organic than the other options, so I'll likely continue using dominus/EWQLSC for ff. 

also worth mentioning that genesis doesn't have male or female voices


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## whiskers (Nov 4, 2019)

man i am so sorely tempted by this.


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## Robert_G (Nov 4, 2019)

ProfoundSilence said:


> also worth mentioning that genesis doesn't have male or female voices



Boys (Soprano and Alto), and Girls (Soprano and Alto)....just at the junior level.


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## Robo Rivard (Nov 4, 2019)

I got an email with my coupon to upgrade to Dominus Pro. Is it limited in time?... This is my last week at work, and it will be a few months before I can spend money again on sound libraries.

In the meantime, I'm downloading the 1.2 update. Thanks a lot!


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## erikradbo (Nov 5, 2019)

Judging from the demos, what pro adds is suitable for more epic pieces. Or does it do those softer choral pieces that dominus 1 did, but better?


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## I like music (Nov 5, 2019)

erikradbo said:


> Judging from the demos, what pro adds is suitable for more epic pieces. Or does it do those softer choral pieces that dominus 1 did, but better?



I downloaded it but haven't had the chance to play with it too much. Actually, the stacc and marc articulations that are new, seem to have a good quieter dynamic range too, meaning that you could do quieter phrasing. The marcs could perhaps be overlaid with the legatos for a a bit more force when required (without going full epic) so I think that for the price difference, it adds something across the range.

The team also mentioned more syllables for the legato piece too I believe (meaning there is more content for the choral piece). Also, monophonic legato I'm very happy with (though that might be in 1.2, I'm not sure!).

However, the marcs and staccs have definitely made this library move into a new territory where it couldn't go before. Not sure if that helps. I'm sure @paoling can answer more accurately.

Love the library, though.


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## ProfoundSilence (Nov 5, 2019)

paoling said:


> From 549, so you'll end paying the upgrade just 170$



so it's 170$ during intro for us Dominus owners?


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## jbuhler (Nov 5, 2019)

ProfoundSilence said:


> so it's 170$ during intro for us Dominus owners?


They do charge state sales tax if you are in the US so it’s $170 plus that. But otherwise just add the code that you should have received in an email to get that price.


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## CromoFX (Nov 5, 2019)

Anyone else waiting for the email with the upgrade-code? 
(maybe it's because I bought dominus six days ago ... ?)


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## AllanH (Nov 5, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> They do charge state sales tax if you are in the US so it’s $170 plus that. But otherwise just add the code that you should have received in an email to get that price.



That is "new". Maybe they have a subsidiary or reseller in the US. I don't recall that last time. Thanks for the heads up.


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## funnybear (Nov 5, 2019)

Had a play with it today. The tone is very nice as before and the new marcato great.

Two questions for FluffyAudio

- what is the little cog wheel on the right of each word builder word line supposed to do? Does nothing when I click on it.

- with the new syllables, can I expect to build any Latin based word? I tried a few that have connecting syllables missing. For example “Isabella”.


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## paoling (Nov 5, 2019)

A few answers!



whiskers said:


> So, not to be dense, but if I don't have the original Dominus, and get this, I'm not 'missing' any content, right? This is just like Dominus expanded, correct? Sounds lovely!



Yes. Dominus Choir Pro includes everything of Dominus Choir.

@Robert_G What makes Dominus special is the feeling you get when you play it under your fingers. It just works, with no kind of hassle. While the Marcato and the Staccato patches are conceptually similar to what you can find in a few other libraries, the legato patch is developed with a concept that after two years is still one of a kind. By interconnecting little snippets of pre-sampled words, joining them with the vowels and adding on top a legato that works polyphonically, you are able to play a singing choir with the same ease that you would use to play an organ. And it sounds connected because it is originally sampled connected. Two years ago, when I first made a scratch of a script to prove that the idea was working I made a quick song, just by playing with my computer keyboard in Ableton Live (I drew the dynamics later) and this came up in like 2 minutes:



What we made here with Dominus Choir Pro is to expand the core functionality of the library and also adding staccato and marcato: articulations that are already performed good in a few other libraries (Strezov, Oceania, Ark I, etc.)

(I'm not personally a fan of libraries where you can stitch together bunch of microphonemes, which give the illusion of freedom to write any text but rarely sound authentic)


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## paoling (Nov 5, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> Some (very minor) complaints: its range of English syllables is still less than ideal because it doesn't have a lot of English consonants, and especially the combinations.


Yes it misses some english consonants. But as it was in Dominus Choir, what makes most of the sound of a word are the actual vowels that makes it. You can try to swap S for Z, M for N, T for D, P for B, and so on. This doesn't mean that you can build every word, but in general it feels that the sound is right. That's why in the overview video we wrote a phrase"VOISONON" to make "Voice of love". The correct "italian" transcription of this phrase would be "VOISOVLOV" but in the context of a choral sound it sounds like Voice of Love because the sound of a choir itself is not completely intellegible. As soon as you respect the vowels, it would sound fine. And that's why we added all the vowels combinations like AI IO AU EI OI, etc.




jbuhler said:


> I also wish it came with preset words for the staccato and marcato patches. At least in the version I have, these patches only come with the four preset words.



That's true that something we need to add. But also, we thought that despite 60 syllables seems not too much to cover a complete text, the same rules apply. So, for example if I have to write Latest Posts (the first thing that comes to my mind looking at the page here :D) you can write it in the Marcato Patch like: "LE-EI DE-ES BO-OSH". It sounds like Latest Posts! Try it :D 

At least, to my ears it is better than 90% of other wordbuilder based libraries, and sounds lovely :D


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## paoling (Nov 5, 2019)

Robo Rivard said:


> I got an email with my coupon to upgrade to Dominus Pro. Is it limited in time?...


No. The coupon doesn't expire. It may change its value though, if we'll ever change the RETAIL price of Dominus (not soon though). And also, from now on, the upgrade coupon that people would receive when they'll buy a discounted discount Dominus Choir 1 will grant a price reduction equal to the amount of what they've paid, to avoid someone doing the trick of buying Dominus Choir 1 discounted, to get a bigger discount on Dominus Choir Pro.



erikradbo said:


> Judging from the demos, what pro adds is suitable for more epic pieces. Or does it do those softer choral pieces that dominus 1 did, but better?


Softer Choral pieces can be done with Dominus Choir 1. I guess that the beautiful piece by Mattia Chiappa: Crystallization


Could have been done with Dominus Choir 1 as well. What Pro adds to the legato patch is a monophonic mode (which is not intuitive to play as the polyphonic legato to me, but it may be useful for certain kind of pieces where every voice sings a different thing), 30 new words to pick up thesyllables from, which makes about 120 new syllables to play with. Other languages are now possible. 12 syllables words are possible, instead of the 6 of the original.


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## EvilDragon (Nov 5, 2019)

paoling said:


> It sounds like Latest Posts! Try it :D


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## paoling (Nov 5, 2019)

I like music said:


> he marcs could perhaps be overlaid with the legatos for a a bit more force when required (without going full epic) so I think that for the price difference, it adds something across the range.


Thank you for your kind words I like music!


You can surely overlap Marcatos and Staccatos because they are based on the same syllable set. I find it a bit trickier with the legatos, though, since the syllables are different and the legato "auto-advances" to sing the whole word according to the settings that you have set. The only way to do this would be to make words of a single syllable with either the marcato and the legato and recall them with keyswitches.





ProfoundSilence said:


> so it's 170$ during intro for us Dominus owners?


Yep.




CromoFX said:


> Anyone else waiting for the email with the upgrade-code?


Cromo is your name similar to a famous synth? (I don't want to disclose your identity :D) because we have tried to write you but somehow the mail is rejected. If so we can talk via PM here.


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## bvaughn0402 (Nov 5, 2019)

Any chance you might take like 10 words or phrases and do a tutorial on how you might try to pull it off with the library? Maybe even do a poll and let people vote on their top 5-10?


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## jbuhler (Nov 5, 2019)

paoling said:


> Yes it misses some english consonants. But as it was in Dominus Choir, what makes most of the sound of a word are the actual vowels that makes it. You can try to swap S for Z, M for N, T for D, P for B, and so on. This doesn't mean that you can build every word, but in general it feels that the sound is right. That's why in the overview video we wrote a phrase"VOISONON" to make "Voice of love". The correct "italian" transcription of this phrase would be "VOISOVLOV" but in the context of a choral sound it sounds like Voice of Love because the sound of a choir itself is not completely intellegible. As soon as you respect the vowels, it would sound fine. And that's why we added all the vowels combinations like AI IO AU EI OI, etc.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I quite agree, and all the diphthongs are great. You can make it sound like it is singing English even if you can't set all the words of a given text. I was just cautioning someone who thought they might be able use it to set any text that it still has constraints and you will frequently encounter many English words that it can't do convincingly. That's not meant as a knock: you are quite right that Dominus sounds better, has more variety of syllables, and is far easier to use than any other word builder I've used. I'm delighted with the library! I'm sorry if it came across otherwise!

The list of preset words in the shorts would be useful not so much for setting specific texts but to easily add combinations that sound word-like when composing. I use the legato preset words a lot for this. Just load up a bunch in the keyswitch panel and then go without worrying about building combinations myself. Since I don't usually care overly much what the choir is actually singing, but only that they sound like they are singing intelligible words.


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## paoling (Nov 5, 2019)

Two questions for FluffyAudio


funnybear said:


> - what is the little cog wheel on the right of each word builder word line supposed to do? Does nothing when I click on it.



The little cog recalls the wordbuilder. It's the same thing than clicking the wordbuilder button on the selected word. If you are already in the wordbuilder it does nothing 



funnybear said:


> - with the new syllables, can I expect to build any Latin based word? I tried a few that have connecting syllables missing. For example “Isabella”.


You can write ISABENA. It sounds like Isabella


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## CromoFX (Nov 5, 2019)

paoling said:


> Cromo is your name similar to a famous synth? (I don't want to disclose your identity :D) because we have tried to write you but somehow the mail is rejected. If so we can talk via PM here.



Yip, that‘s me ... 😜 ... wrote you a PM, thanks Paolo!

Frank


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## paoling (Nov 5, 2019)

bvaughn0402 said:


> Any chance you might take like 10 words or phrases and do a tutorial on how you might try to pull it off with the library? Maybe even do a poll and let people vote on their top 5-10?


Yes, this is a crazy week, we released the library Monday morning and I had a flight for Switzerland in the afternoon. I want to do a tutorial about working with Dominus Choir, because I feel that after two years of using it I'm one of the most experienced with it (along with the incredible composers who made the demos for us). 

I'd prefer to use a few words from the dictionary than a pool. I fear the kind of stuff you can throw at me :D

Oh by the way I just found a nice thing:








This is a little guide on how to pronounce the alphabet for us italians.

Now let's use this list to make a word like: 

What's New (other stuff that I saw here)

UAZNIU = UA AZNI IU now in Dominus we don't have AZNI so we can use AZI so U UA AZI IU. But it sounds better to split in two words: UAX MIU and use keyswitches to recall them. It sounds like What's New


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## jtnyc (Nov 5, 2019)

Any chance Dominus 1 with go on sale for Black Friday?


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## paoling (Nov 5, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> Any chance Dominus 1 with go on sale for Black Friday?


Sure! 

Anyway, from now on, new Dominus Choir customers will receive a coupon to save just the money that they've spent to later buy Dominus Choir Pro. So it's not either better or worse to buy Dominus Choir before one day eventually buying Dominus Choir Pro.


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## jtnyc (Nov 5, 2019)

paoling said:


> Sure!
> 
> Anyway, from now on, new Dominus Choir customers will receive a coupon to save just the money that they've spent to later buy Dominus Choir Pro. So it's not either better or worse to buy Dominus Choir before one day eventually buying Dominus Choir Pro.


Good news!


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## Nicola74 (Nov 5, 2019)

I have just played with Dominus Pro this afternoon and it is absolutely great!! The sound, the playability... wow!
I have noticed that in the sustain patch the syllabes comes always a little bit after the beat, with one single long note or with a phrase it is the same. Is there a way to have them exactly in time?
Anyway even if I am still learning using this library, my first impression is absolutely positive...Dominus Pro is really wonderful!!


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## paoling (Nov 5, 2019)

Nicola74 said:


> I have just played with Dominus Pro this afternoon and it is absolutely great!! The sound, the playability... wow!
> I have noticed that in the sustain patch the syllabes comes always a little bit after the beat, with one single long note or with a phrase it is the same. Is there a way to have them exactly in time?
> Anyway even if I am still learning using this library, my first impression is absolutely positive...Dominus Pro is really wonderful!!


Thank you!

What is the sustain patch? 
With the Marcato and the Staccato you can adjust the preroll. If it's all way to the left, the sound is instant but the consonant part of the word is cut. If you increase it, you get a delayed sound but a better pronunciation of syllables. Obviously this optional delay is fixed, so you won't get funky timing problems according the syllabes that you sing.

In the Legato patch there are a few options. They are quite well explained in the engine video for Dominus Choir 1. In short: my favourite method is to anticipate the starting syllable a bit until it sounds right. Other methods involve disabling the preroll, so killing the attack (not suggested) or using the input quantize feature to play randomly before the beat and then the choir will sing that word precisely on the beat automatically. 

The time taken to pronounced the S in SA AI ILE ENS (Silence), is not counted so the A part will last exactly the full length of the values soecified.


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## Nicola74 (Nov 5, 2019)

paoling said:


> Thank you!
> 
> What is the sustain patch?
> With the Marcato and the Staccato you can adjust the preroll. If it's all way to the left, the sound is instant but the consonant part of the word is cut. If you increase it, you get a delayed sound but a better pronunciation of syllables. Obviously this optional delay is fixed, so you won't get funky timing problems according the syllabes that you sing.
> ...



Yes, you're right, Legato 
Thanks for the suggestion!
I have met Mario Lanaro in Verona a couple of weeks ago in the conservatory and we talked also about you, in a very positive way.


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## JonSolo (Nov 5, 2019)

I think the Marcato and Staccato are really helpful game changers for this library. The Legato works really well too. This library is a huge step up and truly will become my go to for softer adult vocal parts.

Just well done.


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## erikradbo (Nov 6, 2019)

paoling said:


> Softer Choral pieces can be done with Dominus Choir 1. I guess that the beautiful piece by Mattia Chiappa: Crystallization
> 
> 
> Could have been done with Dominus Choir 1 as well. What Pro adds to the legato patch is a monophonic mode (which is not intuitive to play as the polyphonic legato to me, but it may be useful for certain kind of pieces where every voice sings a different thing), 30 new words to pick up thesyllables from, which makes about 120 new syllables to play with. Other languages are now possible. 12 syllables words are possible, instead of the 6 of the original.




Thanks! Yes, that was my impression, that even though Dominus Pro expands the original concept legato-wise it's primarily the marcatos and staccatos that are new. I'm currently set in that area since lots of other choirs are doing it, as you say, so maybe I'll pick up Dominus 1 as a starting point. Will there be an upgrade option to pro for us purchasing dominus 1 after the pro release?


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## paoling (Nov 6, 2019)

erikradbo said:


> Thanks! Yes, that was my impression, that even though Dominus Pro expands the original concept legato-wise it's primarily the marcatos and staccatos that are new. I'm currently set in that area since lots of other choirs are doing it, as you say, so maybe I'll pick up Dominus 1 as a starting point. Will there be an upgrade option to pro for us purchasing dominus 1 after the pro release?


Yes we are thinking of a system that if you buy Dominus Choir for the amount of x $, you can save x $ to buy Dominus Choir Pro. So you won't lose any money in the upgrade.


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## MichaelHo (Nov 6, 2019)

First of all: i really enjoy Dominus, and now even more with your generous free update to 1.2.

I am wondering if I really need the Pro version, as I already have Oceania (perfect Staccato) and the EW Hollywood Choirs.
Any thoughts?

Further suggestion to poaling:
You should add a comparison chart, easy to understand, for standard vs pro


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## jbuhler (Nov 6, 2019)

MichaelHo said:


> First of all: i really enjoy Dominus, and now even more with your generous free update to 1.2.
> 
> I am wondering if I really need the Pro version, as I already have Oceania (perfect Staccato) and the EW Hollywood Choirs.
> Any thoughts?
> ...


Oceania doesn't give you the staccatos and marcatos at soft dynamics. It is actually not all that easy to find good sounding syllables at lower dynamics—most libraries just have you turn down the volume, which doesn't really manage the task very well. The Ark 2 choir does soft syllables, but it has a very limited number of syllables and the men's and women's choirs are not as cohesive in full choir as the Ark 1 or Oceania choir, both of which do loud syllables. Not to mention that Dominus Pro gives you a lot more syllables and they do a better job of approximating words. I haven't yet tested Dominus Pro against Oceania in full orchestra, choral shouty, Carmina Burana-style setting, but it's already evident that Dominus Pro can handle the dynamic contrasts of that kind of writing much better.


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## Geoff Grace (Nov 6, 2019)

paoling said:


> Sure!
> 
> Anyway, from now on, new Dominus Choir customers will receive a coupon to save just the money that they've spent to later buy Dominus Choir Pro. So it's not either better or worse to buy Dominus Choir before one day eventually buying Dominus Choir Pro.


It may be better for some users to save on the front-end via a Dominus sale and then spend more on the back-end to go Pro, while other users may prefer to buy Dominus at full price and then spend less on the back-end to upgrade. Still others may prefer to buy Dominus Choir Pro from the start, rather than buy Dominus and then upgrade. 

It's nice that you've built in some purchasing flexibility.

Best,

Geoff


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## axb312 (Nov 9, 2019)

So, this lib is pretty expensive...Is it worth it?


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## paoling (Nov 9, 2019)

I forgot to quote, so he edited his post, now my reply has nonsensical references. Here's the original:






Answer:
Then buy those libraries axb312.

You complained with us and on KVRAudio about the original feature set of the original Dominus Choir. It was clear that the library was designed for a specific kind of choral singing and no-other-person complained about it.

You asked us to lower the cost of Dominus Choir during this summer sale. Where on this earth customers dictate the sale choices of developers?

You wrote us to put Dominus Choir Pro at 395 (225+170), here in this very same thread and on our facebook account. Other users replied that this was nonsense. You told us it is overpriced via facebook.

We are constantly seeing customers thanking us for the generous offer of this sale, complimenting us by saying that Dominus Choir (and Pro) is by far their favourite choral library ever. I just see here people thanking us for the generous offer.

Many of our users have almost any choir library out there. Somehow, they put Dominus at 1° place of their list.

So please, don't buy it. Buy instead Lacrimosa, Insolidus, Requiem Pro (whose retail price, by the way, is about the same as Dominus Choir Pro).


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## paoling (Nov 9, 2019)

By the way, I believe that his question is completely legit. And anyone should consider if it's worth it comparing to the available options. But it comes after an array of messages and emails complaining about the pricing or the features of the library. I am sincere: if you are unsure, don't buy it.


Leaving the drama zone for a while, we are receiving quite a little cool video screencast/reviews about Dominus Choir Pro:

This is the amazing screencast of Mattia Chiappa's Crystallization. I'm in love with this piece, it has really a lovely mood.




This instead is an overview video by Mikael "Mike" Baggström


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## ProfoundSilence (Nov 9, 2019)

big difference between feedback and demands. 

if dominus pro is overpriced, it's not your problem, paolo is the one who has to recoup. 

as an owner of requiem pro, and plenty of other choir products - and someone who has sang in choirs, I preferred dominus over literally anything when it came to realism. granted it was niche - this expands on its core kit, and I'll be happy next paycheck to improve my base choir


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## JonSolo (Nov 9, 2019)

This choir is quite a feat. When you really dig into the word builder, especially the legato, you really see the value of this choir. My initial take on Dominus was that it took a bit to get it to work well and sound as good as the demos. And I still think understanding the work flow of DP is needed to get the most out of it. But in spending a little time with it this week, I already have incredible (from my point of view) results.

It will be a principle vocal library for sure for me.


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## Ashermusic (Nov 14, 2019)

I cannot believe how gorgeous Dominus Pro is.


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## quantum7 (Nov 14, 2019)

I don't see anything on the Fluffy website to upgrade from DC to DC Pro- is that coming soon? I apologize if this has already been answered.


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## I like music (Nov 14, 2019)

Ashermusic said:


> I cannot believe how gorgeous Dominus Pro is.
> [/QUOTE





quantum7 said:


> I don't see anything on the Fluffy website to upgrade from DC to DC Pro- is that coming soon? I apologize if this has already been answered.


If you have DC I believe you should receive an email with an upgrade code which you can use when checking out. At least that's how I remember it was.... Maybe email support if you didn't get the mail


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## quantum7 (Nov 14, 2019)

I like music said:


> If you have DC I believe you should receive an email with an upgrade code which you can use when checking out. At least that's how I remember it was.... Maybe email support if you didn't get the mail



Thanks! I guess I didn't get that email....or perhaps it got mixed up in my SPAM.


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## psmk31452 (Nov 14, 2019)

I hope that it's okay to post a question regarding the dowload/install of Dominus Pro.

I upgraded from the original Dominus and I installed the downloader and as it was extracting the rar files I received the message, "Oops, something went wrong"

I then moved the installed files from the sample drive and then repeated another download and again, I got the same result. Rather than acting crazy and continuing to repeat this process and expect a different result, I perused all of the responses in this post and I dont see that any one else has had a problem.

I sent an email to support and I'm sure that I'll hear back, but I was wondering if anyone else had a suggestion or had a similar issue.

Again, if this is the wrong forum I sincerely apologize and feel free to move my post.

Thank you.


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## pulsedownloader (Nov 15, 2019)

psmk31452 said:


> I hope that it's okay to post a question regarding the dowload/install of Dominus Pro.
> 
> I upgraded from the original Dominus and I installed the downloader and as it was extracting the rar files I received the message, "Oops, something went wrong"
> 
> ...



Hi there, please drop us an email to [email protected] and we'll help you resolve your issue right away 

Thanks!


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## paoling (Nov 15, 2019)

Hello, we also have received the mail from you..! I guess that's an issue related to the free space you have left on your disk. To install Dominus Choir Pro you have to be sure to have at least 110 free gb on your installing drive. Otherwise (with the current version of Pulse) it will download / install anyway but it will get stuck at a certain point. The upcoming version of Pulse seems to advert the user when there's not enough space left to install the library.


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## paoling (Nov 15, 2019)

quantum7 said:


> Thanks! I guess I didn't get that email....or perhaps it got mixed up in my SPAM.


Hello Quantum, yes we have sent an email with an update code the same day we have released Dominus Choir Pro. If you can write us and we'll send the code again!


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## psmk31452 (Nov 15, 2019)

paoling said:


> Hello, we also have received the mail from you..! I guess that's an issue related to the free space you have left on your disk. To install Dominus Choir Pro you have to be sure to have at least 110 free gb on your installing drive. Otherwise (with the current version of Pulse) it will download / install anyway but it will get stuck at a certain point. The upcoming version of Pulse seems to advert the user when there's not enough space left to install the library.




Thanks, for getting back to me.

I will continue this via a support ticket.
Just wanted to say though...this sample drive is 2 TB and I have over 970 GB available.

The problem must be something else. Probably user error.


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## psmk31452 (Nov 15, 2019)

psmk31452 said:


> Thanks, for getting back to me.
> 
> I will continue this via a support ticket.
> Just wanted to say though...this sample drive is 2 TB and I have over 970 GB available.
> ...




I just wanted to do 1 last follow up to maybehelp someone else who might have this probelm. I'm aware that I'm unique/special in that it appears I am the only one that has had this happen to them on the install. Below is my last response to support, who by the way were tremendous in their assistance.

Thank you, Emmett.


All is well.

I just un-installed Pulse and re-downloaded and reinstalled Pulse and then Dominus Pro.

Now all is well.

If you want a reason as to why...I haven't a clue.

I'll chalk it up to Quantum Mechanics or it's a strange world sometimes.


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## cqd (Nov 15, 2019)

psmk31452 said:


> I'll chalk it up to Quantum Mechanics or it's a strange world sometimes.



Mercury retrograde dude..


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## MillsMixx (Nov 17, 2019)

Just downloaded and having a play for the first time. Loving it! Download was fast for me and the tone sounds really great! 

Can we save the words that we create as a preset or is this feature not possible?

When creating words I couldn't figure out how to go to a particular syllable and swap it out with a new one without having to click the "<" back button and start anew. This can easily be done with Strezov & Realivox libraries and wondering if I'm overlooking something.

Additionally I've been having a difficult time forming certain words because when I click on a syllable it opens up a new list of additions that don't give me options to what I've looking for to finish the word.
I'm thinking this just might take some getting use to as I'm not familiar with phrase building.
For instance I saw Danial James spell Fa-Q and I can't even do that.

I'll dig though the manual a bit a see if i can spend a little time with this. Love the Marcatos!


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## paoling (Nov 17, 2019)

Hello Mills!

We may add a feature for saving the words in the future.

Unfortunately swapping out syllables is not conceptually possible, at least in the legato patch. Every syllable in the legato patch is like a piece of Domino, where the head and the tail of the syllable (the two vowels) must precisely fit into the preceding and following syllable. If you remove a syllable with like ORA you can fit only another syllable with an O at the beginning and an A at the end. So we would have to create custom "syllable panels" for each vowel combination.

This system is the secret behind Dominus Legato smoothness which is the main reason why it is so loved. Dominus picks up the syllables from a pool of pre-sampled words and let the user create his own words which sound musical and smooth, because they were actually sampled from musical and smooth singed words. Most of the copy-paste operations that were typical when working with older libraries (which contain different patches for legatos, for prem-ade phrases, for polyphonic sustains) are handled automatically by the engine in the Dominus Legato patch. 


In the Marcato and Staccato patches however this may be possibile, because they don't need to be connected by design (and this is the reason why yo can do it in Realivox and Strezov libraries).


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## Denkii (Nov 23, 2019)

I posted this question in a wrong thread so I'll post it again in this one:
How does Oceania hold up as a substitute for pro if you already have it and just want to get the regular version?
Does anyone have experience with that?

I'd love to go for pro but that would exceed my budget so it's our of the question.


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## jbuhler (Nov 23, 2019)

Oceania is very good, but restricted to higher dynamics. It also has a limited number of syllables and you have to choose each manually by keyswitch if you want to do something other than cycle through them. Dominus Pro, by contrast can do both loud and soft syllables, and with different kinds of attacks. It can also do words legato and the number of syllables it has is much higher. Dominus Pro is not quite as easy to play out of the box as Oceania, because Dominus Pro has many more options. Oceania is designed to mix well with large orchestra and it does so with minimal work. I have not yet tried Dominus Pro in this configuration but I imagine it will work well, but I can't yet say how easy it is.


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## I like music (Nov 23, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> Oceania is very good, but restricted to higher dynamics. It also has a limited number of syllables and you have to choose each manually by keyswitch if you want to do something other than cycle through them. Dominus Pro, by contrast can do both loud and soft syllables, and with different kinds of attacks. It can also do words legato and the number of syllables it has is much higher. Dominus Pro is not quite as easy to play out of the box as Oceania, because Dominus Pro has many more options. Oceania is designed to mix well with large orchestra and it does so with minimal work. I have not yet tried Dominus Pro in this configuration but I imagine it will work well, but I can't yet say how easy it is.



I've felt that it mixes quite well with a large orchestra. It doesn't overpower it, but in most contexts that I can imagine writing, Dominus will more than cover things. If I ever do decide to write what the young kids call epic, I'll always have Lacrimosa!


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## jtnyc (Nov 24, 2019)

Is it normal to get charged tax from Fluffy? I'm in the US. Haven't really seen that on sample libraries before.


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## Brian99 (Nov 24, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> Is it normal to get charged tax from Fluffy? I'm in the US. Haven't really seen that on sample libraries before.


I’m in the US and i wasn’t charged any taxes. I just purchased Dominus for $199


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## jtnyc (Nov 24, 2019)

bzyboy said:


> I’m in the US and i wasn’t charged any taxes. I just purchased Dominus for $199


Really? I put Dominus in my cart and it totaled at $215.92. I haven't hit purchase yet. Hmmm...


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## jtnyc (Nov 24, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> Really? I put Dominus in my cart and it totaled at $215.92. I haven't hit purchase yet. Hmmm...


Ok, for some reason if I add my email at checkout it adds tax, if I leave blank, it doesn't and totals at $199. Weird...


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## artomatic (Nov 24, 2019)

Just upgraded to Dominus _Pro_ from Dominus - for $170, with code!


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## axb312 (Nov 24, 2019)

artomatic said:


> Just upgraded to Dominus _Pro_ from Dominus - for $170, with code!


When did you buy dominus?


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## jtnyc (Nov 24, 2019)

Hey everyone, probably a silly question but does the sustain pedal work as expected with Dominus? As in, can I use it to sustain notes while I lift my hands to play the next chord? Just about to hit buy -

Thanks


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## artomatic (Nov 24, 2019)

axb312 said:


> When did you buy dominus?



Last year or so...


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## jbuhler (Nov 24, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> Is it normal to get charged tax from Fluffy? I'm in the US. Haven't really seen that on sample libraries before.


Most sample libraries I buy these days are taxed. I live in Texas. Someone on here recently said California doesn’t charge tax for online software purchases.


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## jtnyc (Nov 25, 2019)

bzyboy said:


> I’m in the US and i wasn’t charged any taxes. I just purchased Dominus for $199


So I was was mistaken, it insists on my zip code (New York) and when I add it, tax is added. What state are you in?


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## Brian99 (Nov 25, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> So I was was mistaken, it insists on my zip code (New York) and when I add it, tax is added. What state are you in?



i’m in California


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## paoling (Nov 26, 2019)

Hello, we are contacting Fastspring regarding this issue. In our shop everything should be VAT-Included in case there's one. (I hate when I go to a shop, thinking that I'm paying that price and on checkout I see the price increasing because of VAT).


Recently something has changed regarding VAT on a few states in the US, but I thought that in that case the VAT should be on our side as well as it happens with EU purchases.


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## jbuhler (Nov 26, 2019)

paoling said:


> Hello, we are contacting Fastspring regarding this issue. In our shop everything should be VAT-Included in case there's one. (I hate when I go to a shop, thinking that I'm paying that price and on checkout I see the price increasing because of VAT).
> 
> 
> Recently something has changed regarding VAT on a few states in the US, but I thought that in that case the VAT should be on our side as well as it happens with EU purchases.


I will say that in the US we are used to sales tax being added to the listed price rather than being included, so it's not a big deal so long as you know that you will be taxed. I'm pretty sure when I bought Dominus no tax was charged, but when I bought Dominus Pro, the tax was charged, so perhaps something changed with Fastspring with respect to the collection of sales tax in US.


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## John57 (Nov 26, 2019)

*Where Does FastSpring Collect Taxes?*
_ 
*U.S. Sales Tax*
Some sales in certain states may be subject to sales tax. Sales of physical products shipped to residents in California, and sales of digital products, subscriptions, and physical products will incur a sales tax for residents in all U.S. states and regions except for Alaska, Delaware, Montana, New Hampshire, Oregon, AA, AE, AP, AS, and Puerto Rico. FastSpring complies with the rules and regulations in each state. Recent changes have been made in reaction to the Wayfair Act. To learn more about this, check out our blog post: https://fastspring.com/blog/care-wayfair-state-tax-ruling/._


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## jtnyc (Nov 27, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> I will say that in the US we are used to sales tax being added to the listed price rather than being included, so it's not a big deal so long as you know that you will be taxed. I'm pretty sure when I bought Dominus no tax was charged, but when I bought Dominus Pro, the tax was charged, so perhaps something changed with Fastspring with respect to the collection of sales tax in US.


I'm in NY and this is the first time I've been charged tax on a downloadable VI or Plugin and I make regular purchases from JRR, Plugin Boutique, Time and Space, Best Service, The Unfinished, Sound Dust etc..


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## jbuhler (Nov 27, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> I'm in NY and this is the first time I've been charged tax on a downloadable VI or Plugin and I make regular purchases from JRR, Plugin Boutique, Time and Space, Best Service, The Unfinished, Sound Dust etc..


NI collects tax, and has for several years. I'm pretty sure a few others have started this past year as well, though I haven't been able to locate additional examples (since I haven't yet organized my tax receipts for the year).


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## Monkberry (Nov 27, 2019)

I'm also in NY and so far I've only been taxed for Fluffy, Herman Samples, and Native Instruments. It's gonna be painful if it's starts happening on some of the more expensive Orchestral Libraries.


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## paoling (Dec 1, 2019)

Hello guys!

We have contacted Fastspring and this is what they have replied:
_Regardless of your settings, US taxes will always be NET, meaning the price defined for a product will be considered tax exclusive. In non-US countries where tax is collected, the appropriate tax rate will be added to the order automatically (after discounts are applied) and buyers will be charged the full amount. Your proceeds will be calculated from the list price._

We can have put in place VAT included prices for European orders, so our users won't find the added tax as a surprise in their chart, but it seems that we can't do anything for specific US countries where sales-tax is collected :(

Oh, just a reminder: Dominus Choir Pro intro pricing is ending in 48h!


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## ptram (Feb 16, 2020)

I know, that you all out there tested this choir (and not only this one) against this piece! And I tried it, too!

(Dominus Pro, but only the Legato articulation, that should be the same in the Plain Dominus).

Funeral in Taberna

Paolo


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## ptram (Mar 2, 2020)

There are no words!

I mean, I run out of the ten words allowed in a patch. It would be great to have more words, since pieces with long lyrics can go over the 12x10 matrix.

The workaround is to open a new patch. In Logic, one could use folders to keep track compact and see the score in the same line.

However, I fear opening two patches for each line of the score would double the memory required. More words per patch seems easier.

Paolo


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## jbuhler (Mar 2, 2020)

ptram said:


> There are no words!
> 
> I mean, I run out of the ten words allowed in a patch. It would be great to have more words, since pieces with long lyrics can go over the 12x10 matrix.
> 
> ...


As far as I can tell, the size of an instance of Dominus depends on the number of syllables you have loaded. So adding words to an instance of Dominus will increase the size of the instance. Repeating a syllable in the instance, however, does not increase the memory. It seems like Dominus does not share samples across instances in the same multi. That is, two instances of Dominus require reloading any syllables repeated between instances. So the savings of more words in one instance is simply the number of repeated syllables in that instance. That in turn suggests the optimal way of loading Dominus is to keep variants of words in the same instance as much as possible.

To reduce track counts in Logic, I load Kontakt multis with multiple instances of Dominus in different midi channels and use articulation sets to select the word. I haven't tried Dominus on a long text yet, though—I only worked with twenty some words and rhythmic variants (three instances of Dominus in a Kontakt multi using articulation sets to trigger words). So I'm not sure how that work flow would hold up to more words.


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## paoling (Mar 2, 2020)

jbuhler said:


> Dominus depends on the number of syllables you have loaded. So adding words to an instance of Dominus will increase the size of the instance


Yes and no.

Since the syllables are picked up from a pool of presampled words, some syllables may not increase the amount of RAM needed if they are present in previous words. But, potentially you can load up to 30GB in a single instance of Dominus if you really fit it with very long words with all the mics active.

The limitation of 10 words was also due to this fact. If we'd done a system of pages, we could have given the impression that's completely normal to make an entire mass on Dominus and someone may have complained about the limitation in RAM.

In anycase adding an instance of Dominus won't consume much more RAM, because the shared samples between all instances are loaded from the same memory pool. Even if, for the user, different instances of VSTs seem completely separated, actually the VST is loaded once with different GUI instances, as much as the tabs in your browser.


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## jbuhler (Mar 2, 2020)

paoling said:


> In anycase if I'm not wrong adding an instance of Dominus won't consume much more RAM, because the shared samples between all instances are loaded from the same memory pool. Even if to the user different instances of VSTs seem completely separated, internally the VST is loaded once with different GUI instances, as much as the tabs in your browser.


Thanks for the clarification! This is what I wasn't sure about. I thought Kontakt worked as you described it, but when earlier I loaded a duplicate instance of Dominus and checked the RAM usage in the activity monitor, it looked like the size of Kontakt had increased about the size of the samples. But running it again now, I see that it's not the case and Kontakt only increases negligibly with the second instance of Dominus.


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## Wunderhorn (May 8, 2020)

I wonder if it was possible to create some more textural sounds with Dominus Pro. I am thinking of textures we heard in more minimalist settings. Specifically I am thinking of John Adams here (Harmonium for example). Is that possible to achieve? Do the short articulations have enough round-robins for that?
And if it is not possible I'd love to know if there are some extensions planned for the future that might perhaps be able to cover such ground?


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## ptram (May 9, 2020)

Wunderhorn said:


> I wonder if it was possible to create some more textural sounds with Dominus Pro.


From the tests I did, it seems that there are no round robins in the Staccato instrument. Obviously, there aren't in the Legato instrument. I didn't try yet with the Marcato.

But maybe there is a way to trigger them, and let's see if I just didn't find it.

Paolo

EDIT: This is a try with simulated round robins made with pitch bend. Unfortunately, the bending effect is clearly audible. Maybe @paoling can implement scripted round robins making use of different notes of the same syllable?

Fake round robins in the first part, no round robins in the second one. Inspired to Harmonium, but at a much lower speed to check round robins.

EDIT 2: I added a sequence with the piece at real speed. All notes with simulated RR.


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## OleJoergensen (May 9, 2020)

Just a dream...
Will there be sampled solist that will fit well with dominus choir?
It would be wonderful!


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## TintoL (Jul 30, 2020)

Sorry to revive this thread. 

I am very interested in Dominus. But, I do have some doubts:

1- Does dominus choir has the ability to turn OFF the built in reverb? 
2- Is the library mostly dry or wet?


Thanks in advance for the help.


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## JTB (Jul 30, 2020)

You can turn off the reverb by sliding the slider to the far left. There are four mic positions. The Close is dry enough to use with another reverb.


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## TintoL (Jul 30, 2020)

JTB said:


> You can turn off the reverb by sliding the slider to the far left. There are four mic positions. The Close is dry enough to use with another reverb.



Awesome. Thanks a lot for your answer. I think Dominus is a GO for me. 

Thanks a again for taking the time to answer me.


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## JTB (Jul 30, 2020)

No sweat. 
It's a great sounding library.


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## ProfoundSilence (Jul 30, 2020)

I answered this on a previous thread, that you started






Dominus choir reverb


Hi all, I am interested in buying Dominus choir from Fluffy audio. Just like I saw in one recent thread here, I find that the reverb heard in the dominus demos page sounds kind of weird. I wanted to ask anyone who owns Dominus if it's possible to turn that reverb OFF, and how much reverb is...




vi-control.net


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## Joulupukki (Aug 1, 2020)

I am a big fan of the original Dominus choir. The sound exactly meets my needs. Therefore I did not immediately switch to the Pro Version after release cause there was no need to do that. Nevertheless the expanded possibilities appeal to me. Does anyone know the current upgrade price ? I don't see any information anywhere on the subject.


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## Casiquire (Aug 1, 2020)

How do you get the choir to change notes exactly at the beginning of a new syllable? Does anyone know fairly precisely how early the note needs to be hit?

And how come lower dynamics often sound like there's no legato at all?

I'm trying not to be too disappointed by this library but it hasn't been instant gratification at all. The more I learn the more I warm up to it, but changing notes directly on a new syllable (which is the vast majority of all choral writing) seems extremely difficult to do smoothly


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## ProfoundSilence (Aug 1, 2020)

Casiquire said:


> How do you get the choir to change notes slightly exactly at the beginning of a new syllable? Does anyone know fairly precisely how early the note needs to be hit?
> 
> And how come lower dynamics often sound like there's no legato at all?
> 
> I'm trying not to be too disappointed by this library but it hasn't been instant gratification at all. The more I learn the more I warm up to it, but changing notes directly on a new syllable (which is the vast majority of all choral writing) seems extremely difficult to do smoothly




The phrases work automatically with your daw tempo. 

Playing each syllable in manually is not how it's designed, and it'll give you a hard time if you fight it on that. Simply program the phrase ahead of time, then it'll automatically run through the phrase as long as you've got some notes held down.


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## Casiquire (Aug 1, 2020)

ProfoundSilence said:


> The phrases work automatically with your daw tempo.
> 
> Playing each syllable in manually is not how it's designed, and it'll give you a hard time if you fight it on that. Simply program the phrase ahead of time, then it'll automatically run through the phrase as long as you've got some notes held down.


Sure but that's different from most choir writing. Even the demos on their site treat it as capable of handling melodic choir writing. If it's not capable of that simple thing, then it's my only big library disappointment as well as being misleading


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## ProfoundSilence (Aug 1, 2020)

Casiquire said:


> Sure but that's different from most choir writing. Even the demos on their site treat it as capable of handling melodic choir writing. If it's not capable of that simple thing, then it's my only big library disappointment as well as being misleading


????

It's not different at all, normally you have notes written on a page in advance - that's how choral music is written, and that's how it's performed. The reason it works well is because it knows before the transition to the next syllable so it transitions before the note would land. 

You can a.) use the product the way it was designed or b.) try to completely ignore it and treat it like every other choir product and get... well get the same results. 

How many wordbuilder type choirs do you own?


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## jbuhler (Aug 1, 2020)

Casiquire said:


> Sure but that's different from most choir writing. Even the demos on their site treat it as capable of handling melodic choir writing. If it's not capable of that simple thing, then it's my only big library disappointment as well as being misleading


Most choirs don't do words. Set the rhythm of the syllables in Dominus. Then compose the parts you want in the DAW. This usually works best if the parts follow the syllabic pattern but it can handle well an idiomatic melismatic setting too. Just move the notes in the DAW faster than the rhythm of the syllables in Dominus to create the melisma. If you want independent syllabic patterns, you need to use multiple instances of Dominus. You can also play them in in the same fashion, and that will often, though not always, yield better results.


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## zvenx (Aug 1, 2020)

Contemplating upgrading to Pro. I trust people are still happy with it?
Whilst I know I can really crank up the volume in Kontakt, I find the volume in Dominus very low in its default setting, even with f samples with the modwheel cranked all the way up. Am I the only one finding that so?
rsp


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## Peter Wayne (Aug 1, 2020)

Casiquire said:


> I'm trying not to be too disappointed by this library but it hasn't been instant gratification at all. The more I learn the more I warm up to it, but changing notes directly on a new syllable (which is the vast majority of all choral writing) seems extremely difficult to do smoothly


Use the Marcato patch and end the word before the next word starts. You need to have a gap between to make sure one word ends before the next starts to get a smooth transition.

See this quick mock up I did of "Invincible" from WoW to show this point in another thread a while back. Although since I made this I've gotten a lot better at using the library. So it sounds really rough to me now. LOL. Anyway, my point is I use the Marcato patch 90% of the time and have been able to get very smooth transitions.


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## RonV (Aug 1, 2020)

Joulupukki said:


> I am a big fan of the original Dominus choir. The sound exactly meets my needs. Therefore I did not immediately switch to the Pro Version after release cause there was no need to do that. Nevertheless the expanded possibilities appeal to me. Does anyone know the current upgrade price ? I don't see any information anywhere on the subject.


The upgrade price should be the current Dominus Pro price (or sale price) MINUS what you paid for Dominus. With the original purchase, Fluffy Audio usually sent an email with a discount code to use at checkout to purchase Pro.


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## jbuhler (Aug 1, 2020)

zvenx said:


> Contemplating upgrading to Pro. I trust people are still happy with it?
> Whilst I know I can really crank up the volume in Kontakt, I find the volume in Dominus very low in its default setting, even with f samples with the modwheel cranked all the way up. Am I the only one finding that so?
> rsp


Marcato and Staccato give a different work flow. They are also punchier and louder than is the legato choir. The legato choir doesn't really get above forte. Staccato choir goes a bit louder, but the marcato choir will go to a real fortissimo.


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## Ashermusic (Aug 1, 2020)

The best advice for ANY sample library has been given in this thread. Work with it the way it is designed to work instead of trying to bend it to your will. Watch videos and/ or RTFM so you understand it.

They are not real players, they don’t listen to your instructions and try to follow them.

Dominos Pro is a great choir library and I love the sound, but sometimes I have to choose another because it wasn’t designed to do what I need it to do.


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## paoling (Aug 1, 2020)

Hello!

After doing the heavy scripting for the first Dominus, I've started working on the demos. Then I realized a few things and I promised myself to do a tips and tricks video. I still have to do it :-(
So here's a few of them

1) The library really benefits from the slight randomization of realtime playing. Then...
2) You can tune the overall amount of each note by disabling the velocity lock, setting all the velocity of the part to 64 and then crafting them in your DAW.
3) In general any relevant control should be accessible in your DAW by just moving the notes around, or crafting their velocities with the point 2.
4) The legato works by letting a small gap between the notes that you want to legato. The rule is: "Whenever there's a new note, it will play a legato from the closest note that's inside the "release/legato" timeframe". If that slider is way to the left, you will almost playing the library without legato (unless the gap from the two notes is very narrow).
5) The vowel/legato/consonant display is quite useful to understand how the library works:

Basically, instead of having any prerecorded phrase, the engine dynamically crossfades between static sustained vowels (of which you can decide the length with the word editor) and "consonants" which are actually dynamically extracted from a bunch of presampled 4 syllable words in the library. In the original Dominus these words were 50, in Dominus Pro they are about 80.

You can think about these words like the ARCs in Insolidus. The engine knows were to pick the appropriate vowel/consonant/vowel combination in this word "database" and places them rightly between the presampled vowels in the engine. To make the effect really smooth we keep these crossfades as long as we can in a way that works like this, for esample for the word MARIA

Consonant Layer:
MAA--------------AARII--------IIAAAAAA---------Aaa..(release sample)
Vowel Layer:
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAIIIIIIIIIIIIIAAAAAAAAAAAAA

The engine decides how to crossfade these words, according to the length of the word and the speed of your bpm tempo. That's why you need to input the words in advance. If you notice the stress on "Maria" would be on the I, which you may want to happen on the beat. But the ARI syllable must be played in advance to allow for the maximum smoothness.

And this is just what happens when you play a single key that lasts an entire word.

There are several rules about what happens when you play a note while the word is playing.
If you didn't release any note:
the new note will auto-sync with the rest of the playing word, and then begin from the vowel or the consonant layer according to where you are in the word. If you want a new note to perform or not the consonant, just move it slightly ahead or behind the beat, and its sound will drastically change.

If you released a note, it will do that plus point 4) and perform a legato before switching to the sustained vowel part/consonant layer. It's like there are three layers at this point.

It's was so tricky to code it, but I guess it was worth the effort. I was truly amazed when I first played the library after hours of coding/debugging/optimizing.

In Dominus Choir Pro, the staccato and marcato patches work in a very simple way: just play the notes and when you release them all the engine would advance to the next syllable.


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## X-Bassist (Aug 1, 2020)

Ashermusic said:


> They are not real players, they don’t listen to your instructions and try to follow them.


What? I was preparing a back room for them all to live in! You mean I don’t get a human choir with this purchase? Wow, next your going to tell me I’m on VI control which stands for virtual instrument, instead of Varying Ignorance Control, which is what I need control of. Crazy.


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## Wunderhorn (Aug 1, 2020)

zvenx said:


> Contemplating upgrading to Pro. I trust people are still happy with it?
> Whilst I know I can really crank up the volume in Kontakt, I find the volume in Dominus very low in its default setting, even with f samples with the modwheel cranked all the way up. Am I the only one finding that so?
> rsp



I find the marcato in pro is way more useful with instant gratification. And yes, overall I find Dominus Pro the best all-round choir that I have ever used.
And yes, there is more volume possible in the marcatos and staccatos.


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## Ashermusic (Aug 1, 2020)

X-Bassist said:


> What? I was preparing a back room for them all to live in! You mean I don’t get a human choir with this purchase? Wow, next your going to tell me I’m on VI control which stands for virtual instrument, instead of Varying Ignorance Control, which is what I need control of. Crazy.




I find people approaching them with the attitude, "dammit, you will do what I want you to do" even when that was clearly not what the developer intended.

In theory at least, we are smarter and more adaptable than programmed recorded digital snapshots but you wouldn't always know that here


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## Casiquire (Aug 1, 2020)

I think I'm being misunderstood here. I know i have to pre-program the words and syllables, and that's totally fine! The issue comes when I want the note to change on a new syllable.



jbuhler said:


> Most choirs don't do words. Set the rhythm of the syllables in Dominus. Then compose the parts you want in the DAW. This usually works best if the parts follow the syllabic pattern but it can handle well an idiomatic melismatic setting too. Just move the notes in the DAW faster than the rhythm of the syllables in Dominus to create the melisma. If you want independent syllabic patterns, you need to use multiple instances of Dominus. You can also play them in in the same fashion, and that will often, though not always, yield better results.



This is what I'm curious about! How much faster seems to get smooth results? I haven't been able to find that magic amount.


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## jbuhler (Aug 1, 2020)

Casiquire said:


> I think I'm being misunderstood here. I know i have to pre-program the words and syllables, and that's totally fine! The issue comes when I want the note to change on a new syllable.
> 
> 
> 
> This is what I'm curious about! How much faster seems to get smooth results? I haven't been able to find that magic amount.


You just change the note with the syllable and it changes pitch with the syllable in good legato fashion. Sometimes you have to experiment a bit with the timing to get the right effect. But it rarely takes a lot of work. As @paoling says, it often works better to play it than to draw it. And using the dynamic syllable meter on the GUI as a guide can be helpful in getting the timing right as well.

If you aren’t already doing so, I would recommend starting with it with the full choir in one instance and using the real notes keyboard layout. (The manual discourages this mode because it can lead to peculiar voice leading and doublings but for learning the mechanics or just general noodling I find it to work best.) Then practice changing chords on syllables using one of the longer preset words like “Crucifixus” in basic half notes so you get used to how the mechanics work. Once you learn how the instrument responds, then change the syllabic rhythmic patterns in the word editor or on the Words palette and work with that. Once you get the hang of those basic mechanics breaking parts out to separate tracks and instances and adding melismas is easier to understand.


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## Casiquire (Aug 1, 2020)

jbuhler said:


> You just change the note with the syllable and it changes pitch with the syllable in good legato fashion. Sometimes you have to experiment a bit with the timing to get the right effect. But it rarely takes a lot of work. As @paoling says, it often works better to play it than to draw it. And using the dynamic syllable meter on the GUI as a guide can be helpful in getting the timing right as well.
> 
> If you aren’t already doing so, I would recommend starting with it with the full choir in one instance and using the real notes keyboard layout. (The manual discourages this mode because it can lead to peculiar voice leading and doublings but for learning the mechanics or just general noodling I find it to work best.) Then practice changing chords on syllables using one of the longer preset words like “Crucifixus” in basic half notes so you get used to how the mechanics work. Once you learn how the instrument responds, then change the syllabic rhythmic patterns in the word editor or on the Words palette and work with that. Once you get the hang of those basic mechanics breaking parts out to separate tracks and instances and adding melismas is easier to understand.


Thank you I'll try that out!


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## ProfoundSilence (Aug 1, 2020)

awesome paoling, did not know about the velocity lock for sculpting the phrase


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## paoling (Aug 1, 2020)

ProfoundSilence said:


> velocity lock


For me it is essential. A few times the upper female voice tend to be a lot more prominent, so with the velocity lock thing you can then rebalance the choir to highlight an inner part.

Another tip: if a voice is not going to change, please keep it straight long, don't repeat the same note. Basically the endine automatically decide which is the "master" note, which acts as a counter for all the syncronization things that happens while a word is playing.

With all of what I said, here a comparison between two pianorolls.
This is something that would sound so so on Dominus:






This below would sound better. Actually I don't know how it sounds, because I just put random notes on a pianoroll (without having the library on hand on my laptop atm), but it's a more "Dominus-friendly" kind of MIDI. It's also more similar to what someone would play, with a slight anticipation and randomization between the notes and legato on the notes that don't change. Notice the gap between the notes, to allow for the legato.







Also this below seems exactly like the one above, right? Wrong, in Dominus it would sound quite different. Notice that a few notes end and begin at different points. 
These small changes have quite a big impact on how a phrase in Dominus would sound like but the beauty is that it's all notes, velocity and modwheel. No additional more controllers needed, maybe just a few keyswitches to change the words. And you can control an entire choir. 
This is the kind of editing I'm used to when working with the library, to highlight a few parts, to reduce the sound of a particular consonant and so on.


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## esimone00 (Aug 2, 2022)

paoling said:


> now it is 53 Gb ncw compressed. Almost double the size of the original Dominus.
> 
> We still are deciding but substantially less than double the price of Dominus if you include the introductory price. Consider that, except for maybe the GUI and some part of the scripting, this library is taken from a session that was equal in time than the original Dominus. So it is a more "complete" library now.
> 
> ...


Can you play legato with chords in the regular Dominus?


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## paoling (Aug 3, 2022)

esimone00 said:


> Can you play legato with chords in the regular Dominus?


Hello, yes, it was the basic core functionality of Dominus. And actually performs better when played polyphonically and omorhitmically (like block of chords with maybe passing notes here and there).
This is a video of Dominus Choir

Fun fact: we reharsed the Dominoes scene quite a few times because the pieces kept falling flat on the table :D

Also remember that there's a cost-free upgrade path between Dominus Choir and Dominus Choir Pro.
Basically anything you spend when buying Dominus Choir (either if it is in sale or you buy at retail price) it will account as a discount when buying Dominus Choir Pro by using a coupon code that we send to you when you buy Dominus Choir.


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## peterharket (Sep 25, 2022)

jtnyc said:


> Hey everyone, probably a silly question but does the sustain pedal work as expected with Dominus? As in, can I use it to sustain notes while I lift my hands to play the next chord? Just about to hit buy -
> 
> Thanks


Did you find out an answer to this? I downloaded their freebie Haunted Choir featuring a poly-legato patch, but the sustain pedal does not work with that patch...


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## micrologus (Sep 25, 2022)

No, you can't.


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## peterharket (Sep 25, 2022)

micrologus said:


> No, you can't.


Okay, so you really need an extra set of hands to actually utilize the poly-legato?


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## micrologus (Sep 25, 2022)

peterharket said:


> Okay, so you really need an extra set of hands to actually utilize the poly-legato?


Why? You usually play 4 voices...


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## peterharket (Sep 25, 2022)

micrologus said:


> Why? You usually play 4 voices...


Well, if I play a tight harmony in the right hand (say four fingers), the only way I can poly-legato transition to a new chord with four notes as well would be to get my left hand superimposed on my right hand, and that's just a mess - I would need my sustain pedal to hold the chord for me while I reposition my right hand to lay down a new chord. But I'm curious how you play - is it two notes in each hand, and then you use two of your other free fingers in each hand to lay a new voicing?


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## micrologus (Sep 25, 2022)

You just play in _legato_ style, like an organ.


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## jtnyc (Sep 25, 2022)

peterharket said:


> Did you find out an answer to this? I downloaded their freebie Haunted Choir featuring a poly-legato patch, but the sustain pedal does not work with that patch...


As Micro wrote, you cannot.


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## jtnyc (Sep 25, 2022)

Something I really really wish Dominus had is the ability to sequence words. You can key switch them, but having a word sequencer would be game changing for me. Imagine the flexibility and fun of being able to play for an extended period of time with several words flowing from one into the other. I'm really surprised they didn't add it in the pro version. I don't have pro, but would be way more likely to upgrade if that feature was added.


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## Casiquire (Sep 25, 2022)

jtnyc said:


> Something I really really wish Dominus had is the ability to sequence words. You can key switch them, but having a word sequencer would be game changing for me. Imagine the flexibility and fun of being able to play for an extended period of time with several words flowing from one into the other. I'm really surprised they didn't add it in the pro version. I don't have pro, but would be way more likely to upgrade if that feature was added.


I'm confused, doesn't the word builder do that? I may be misunderstanding


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## jtnyc (Sep 25, 2022)

Casiquire said:


> I'm confused, doesn't the word builder do that? I may be misunderstanding


The word builder lets you build words with a combination of syllables. A word sequencer would allow you to then sequence those words in a specific order allowing you to just play and have one word follow the other. The only way to do that now is with keyswitches. Yes you can create a "word" with a few words in it, but it is limited in how long it can be. 

Even a tie switch between the words would be great, allowing you to have the 1st word be followed by the 2nd etc. But a simple 10 slot sequencer at the bottom that allows you to input corresponding (word) numbers in any order you want would be the way IMO. 8Dio has this in Insolidus.


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## esimone00 (Sep 27, 2022)

I'll be honest, after owning Dominus Pro now for a few months, it's not the easiest vst to use. I find myself reaching for 8dio Insolidus more, because it's just ready to go much faster. The word builder is rather confusing. Also, does anybody have the issue where it takes 16 seconds for the notes to play after you touch the keys? It shouldn't be a Kontakt loading issue because the track at that point has been loaded for minutes already. I want to like Dominus Pro because of the sound, hype, and price tag.


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## Wunderhorn (Sep 27, 2022)

esimone00 said:


> I'll be honest, after owning Dominus Pro now for a few months, it's not the easiest vst to use. I find myself reaching for 8dio Insolidus more, because it's just ready to go much faster. The word builder is rather confusing. Also, does anybody have the issue where it takes 16 seconds for the notes to play after you touch the keys? It shouldn't be a Kontakt loading issue because the track at that point has been loaded for minutes already. I want to like Dominus Pro because of the sound, hype, and price tag.


I have the exact opposite experience, 8Dio collects dust with Dominus Pro in use. I find the word builder pretty straight forward and easy enough to use. It could get improvements but it is so much, so much easier than the old generation of choirs like Requiem etc. Just create something you like, save a snapshot and load that instrument.
No issue here to have the notes not playing immediately. The only issue I found so far is the GIF animation stopping after a while.


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## esimone00 (Sep 27, 2022)

Wunderhorn said:


> I have the exact opposite experience, 8Dio collects dust with Dominus Pro in use. I find the word builder pretty straight forward and easy enough to use. It could get improvements but it is so much, so much easier than the old generation of choirs like Requiem etc. Just create something you like, save a snapshot and load that instrument.
> No issue here to have the notes not playing immediately. The only issue I found so far is the GIF animation stopping after a while.


I'll have to look more into the delay issue, and maybe send them a support ticket. Sometimes I just need a legato Ahh, and it seems more complicated than it needs to be but that's just my opinion. I will definitely spend more time with it though.


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## OleJoergensen (Sep 27, 2022)

I also think its a bit time consuming to use but the tone of this library is gorgeous!


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## esimone00 (Sep 27, 2022)

OleJoergensen said:


> I also think its a bit time consuming to use but the tone of this library is gorgeous!


Do not disagree there.


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