# Just what I expect more of from the Party of "No"



## José Herring (Nov 24, 2010)

I've always contended that Democrats can't keep it in their pants, but that republicans can't pass up a chance to do something illegal with money. This confirms my bias.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_delay_trial


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## clarkcontrol (Nov 25, 2010)

+1

basically the right has better access= more power

power corrupts


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## chimuelo (Nov 26, 2010)

This Brotha' had a chance to play for table stakes, but took the first petty ante offer that came his way.
What scares me is that we the taxpayers spend billions in FBI and DOJ salaries catching our elected officials stealing money.
They even have such nifty names like the " Congressional Corruption Task Force. " We should be more afraid of these clowns than some dumb underwear bomber that cant even light a match.

Crackhead 101 classes teach beginner drug dealers how to preserve their stash in the freezer with the Baking Soda until the quantity can be broken down into 20's and 40's for the suburbs, and 5's and 10's for the Hood.
Obviously he had recently returned from Rehab and after a few Tony Robbins and Al Sharpton classes, and a new suit he went off to DC to represent the little people that he cares so much for.

I would love to see these guys pay down the deficit, by allowing them to keep stealing, but then at least return all money when caught, and pay for the salaries to those who catch them.

Tom Delay deserves to be jailed, and hopefully will be punished, but for what he did in this video below, he should have been stripped naked, and stoned by Progressive Liberals in front of San Franciscos' City Hall.

http://www.google.com/url?url=http://ww ... 0GeJZPgY2A


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## Andrew Aversa (Nov 26, 2010)

Who is saying that Republicans should be jailed while Democrats shouldn't? What a straw man. Both parties are subject to corruption by special interests, which is why we need campaign finance reform. However, guess which party opposes that.


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## chimuelo (Nov 27, 2010)

You should research the Federal Reserves' lobbyists from 2009 that helped silence the " super Majority " while the Supreme Court loosened existing " campaign finance legislation."
Harry Reid, and the Obama team wanted this to be silent since their Union Bosses could hide even more dummy corporations to advance their causes.
But it actually allowed the evil CEO's of Wall Street and Global Banking institutions to dictate who would come and go into the Capital in the last election.
So whoever is sitting in the House and Senate while such laws are passed are the guilty.
But naturally the new " GOP " electees want their fair share of the cash. They must pay back their sponsors, and bring home the Bacon for a year, while pretending to be involved in such important issues as the TSA nonsense, and extended Unemployment benefits that now surpass even European entitlements.
But in late 2011 after the new members are ready to get down to business and paid back their coffers, it will be time to posture again and collect cash for the upcoming elections.
So if nothing gets done, dont be surprised.
You sent the same morons to DC that I did, and the meatgrinder will not allow any changes to be made. Its just not in " their " best interests.
So this is why I see my vote as being worthless anymore.
We have a new branch of Government called the Federal Reserve that isn't accountable to Americans, but rather Global Banks.

God Bless The USA.................................


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## Ed (Nov 27, 2010)

chimuelo @ Sat Nov 27 said:


> We have a new branch of Government called the Federal Reserve that isn't accountable to Americans, but rather Global Banks.



:roll:


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## midphase (Dec 1, 2010)

More madness from the GOP:

http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/12/01/ ... tml?hpt=T1


Why oh why don't we all march on Washington and demand all 42 of these clowns' resignation?


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## Andrew Aversa (Dec 4, 2010)

Welp, looks like the Republicans are doing exactly what anyone with a brain thought they would do - they're blocking new legislation, including tax cuts for the middle class. Their true colors finally show. Who cares about giving 98% of Americans relief? If the rich can't have their tax cuts, NO ONE can!


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## midphase (Dec 4, 2010)

http://www.slate.com/id/2276583/


Republicans have a near monopoly on complaints about government spending. Dozens of new Tea Party candidates were elected to Congress on a promise to clean house. But data going back two decades—to stick to Simpson's crude metaphor—show the milk is mostly coming from Democratic states, and the sucking is being done by Republican states.
The "red" states up in arms about government spending receive the largest share of it. This is not a new finding, but research by economist Gary Richardson at the University of California-Irvine backs it up. Richardson provides insight into how the paradox came about and what it means for the future.


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## P.T. (Dec 4, 2010)

I was listening to a news story about the recent overturning of that law about lifting limits on corporate giving and allowing it to be anonymous.

Funny thing is they mentioned that it was not just about corporate money, but union money as well.

That puts a different light on this issue that the democrats have been going on about.

As I see it, corporations give to both parties though they may give more heavily to republicans.

On the other hand, how much union money do you think goes to republicans?
Pretty close to zero I would think.

Why is it that no one ever talks about that aspect of it?

Again I want to point out that I don't vote for either of those parties as I refuse to help elect people who are destroying the Country.

Off topic, but something I have to say.

Finally someone said what I have been asking about for a long time.
Robert Reich said we could fix soc sec by lifting the cap on on the amount of their salaries that the wealthy pay on soc sec taxes.

The first party to actually do something to make the obscenely and criminally unfair soc sec system more equitable will garner at least some respect from me.


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## midphase (Dec 4, 2010)

A couple of issues with your post P.T.

First of all...care to guess who has more money to give to politicians, unions or corporations? I think you'll find the balance tilted heavily in favor of corporations (who in turn favor Republicans).

Secondly, Unions are trying to protect the small guy, unlike the corporations who are trying to put more and more money in the pockets of the shareholders while paying their workers less and less. Why are you equating the evil of anonymous corporate donations to the relatively well intentioned Union donations? I just don't see how the two are even similar.


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## snowleopard (Dec 5, 2010)

Agree with Reich (and PT) on Social Security cap. It's absurd the way it's set-up now.

While unions don't give as much money as corporations, and I hear what you are saying, the principle is still the same. Two wrongs don't make a right. There should be much stricter rules on donations, regardless of who is giving them to whom. That's the root of the problem.


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## midphase (Dec 5, 2010)

Chimuelo,

I have such a hard time figuring out whose side you're on in all these discussions. To say that your posts are enigmatic to me would be an understatement.

From the little that I know of you, I get the sense you're a performer in Las Vegas, so I would assume that you are a member of the local union and that you're feeling the pinch of the recession as much as any of us. Your name would also indicate an Hispanic family origin, and your knowledge of vintage gear coupled with a son who is married (or soon to be married) I would also surmise that you're in your mid-40's or higher.

Judging by my completely theoretical profile of you, one would think you'd be one of the first people to get up in arms over the mess that conservatives have perpetuated on the American public over the last 20 years (mostly in the form of deregulation, lower taxes for top earners, diminishing the power of unions, and on and on). Are Democrats partly responsible for some of these policies...of course. The question does arise as to how many of these decisions were compromises made under pressure from the Republican party who has been so good at putting pressure on the Democrats (as we are seeing today with these Tax extension issues).

In my opinion -- in a forum comprised mostly of musicians and composers working as benefit-less freelancers in the mid to low income level (for the most part) or needing to subsidize their artistic passions with a non-industry job -- it should be almost impossible to find someone who sides with conservative ideals since most of these ideals go 180º opposite to the interests of this crowd. 

So it is more than a little surprising for me to read posts which defend the corporate interests over unions, or even vilify unions...I just don't get it.

PS.

This has got nothing to do with people's right to express whatever opinion they so choose, but rather just puzzlement as to why so many people are going out and both supporting and voting for parties which do not benefit them whatsoever. What's the Matter with Kansas? Indeed!

http://www.amazon.com/Whats-Matter-Kansas-Conservatives-America/dp/080507774X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1291592015&sr=8-1 (http://www.amazon.com/Whats-Matter-Kans ... 015&amp;sr=8-1)


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## Nick Batzdorf (Dec 5, 2010)

chimuelo is on neither side. He feels that both parties are totally corrupt so it doesn't make any difference.

I disagree. It makes a huge difference.


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## rgames (Dec 5, 2010)

I understand where Chimuelo's coming from - do you guys really think the unions have our interests at heart?

Take a look through the pages of the IM - it's basically a bunch of old white guys telling musicians how to vote, to boycott Delta, to do whatever (don't think for yourselves - do what we say!). Plus, the unions place more restrictions on their members than any corporation ever did.

Do you really think the unions are that much better? I'll say this: more people get their healthcare benefits from corporations than from unions, the coverage is better, and it costs a lot less than it does through the union.

Plus, a huge amount of money goes from corporations into the arts and other philanthropic activities. Name a major corporation that doesn't spend millions of dollars in support of an orchestra, or a museum, or other form of philanthropy - I can't think of one. What does the union do other than collect dues and tell you how to think? That's not a rhetorical question - I really want to know!

Sure, corporations make a lot of money. And they have a lot of very rich employees/owners/boards. But they still do a lot more for society than any union ever did.

rgames


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## Dan Mott (Dec 5, 2010)

R james. You look a little bit like Mike Verta. Nice!


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## midphase (Dec 5, 2010)

Richard,

I think that your assessment is limited by looking at unions in a very narrow slice and giving corporations a whole lot of credit.

Unions are responsible for just about every basic worker right which exists in this country. They have impacted minimum wages, benefits, and safe working conditions which would have otherwise gone unchanged. To really see the benefits of unions to society, you really need to go back well over a century and get a grasp of what working conditions were like before them. I think it can be easy to simplify unions' role today as simply a PITA, but to do that would be to spit in the face of organizations which we actually (as a society) owe a lot to.


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## snowleopard (Dec 6, 2010)

Midphase - I'm not comparing the two. What I'm saying is that the system is corrupt. It's corrupt to it's rotten core. Bribery runs rampant. The unions play into that system, and I've seen very little effort on their part to change campaign finance or lobby laws. 

This is not trying to imply that they are equal to what corporations are (generally) trying to do. 

I also fully agree that the split between the working class and the super wealthy is the most ignored, least talked about, media story out there. Even Ben Bernacke didn't question that for a second on 60 minutes, though he almost brushed it off to education. At the rate we are going with the split in the classes, we're on the brink of causing serious social collapse. Our country has become a plutocracy.


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## chimuelo (Dec 6, 2010)

Brotha' Man MidPhase, thanks for a fair shake on the profile.
I am a very young 54 though.
I also retired from the Union Trades here 2 years ago and was recently denied my benefits, so I retained counsel. It seems as though I must take it on the chin and then stand back up again to fight over and over. 
I'm Hispanic through association only. I never even met a Mexican or American Indian until I moved to Vegas in '84.
I came form St.Louis where you join a Union right out of High School. In my case I joined the Musicians and the Concrete workers. Then went to College only to get a my first Vocalist pregnant, hence the need for a day gig while pursuing my musical career at night.
Unions are great because you can always go on a tour and come home to get on the out of work list and go pour more Mud, to continue raising a family and buying more gear. I have done so since I was 19 years old, nothing has changed but rather evolved, just like our beloved sampling technology. You either grow, or go.

What really angers me though is the hypocracy I have seen from Politicians who have created this class warfare nonsense, that has caused business to suffer, and also racism is being used to divide us, when no such racism exists. This sickens me as I was one of the few White boys shovelling Mud. It's 80% Mexicans and they are hard working good people. We got along great becasue the old timers would sing those Romantic macho Mexican songs all day which I eventually learned and started singing as well. In this hot weather here you must whistle while you work.

But what angers me most is my wife and I are both contractors, and we are now considered rich by these elites in DC becasue our combined incomes appear as though we are wealthy. Far from reality actually.
The checks come in our names, but we are responsible for the gross income even though we take a fraction of the pay as our net income.
For the first time ever we had to cancel our contracts in December and Janurary since we are unsure of the amount of our tax debt in 2011. We decided in September to stay below the cutoff point. Sad for our band mates, but I cannot see having a tax bill of 10,000 USD, when we usually have a combined debt of 4500-5500 USD. Now I know what my liabilities will be and have prepared for them.
I also have to be conservative with our incomes as I have a young son I am trying to raise, and I also have to make sure he excells and doesnt get brainwashed and stolen from me to serve in some politicans war thousands of miles from home.

I see our politicans as the problems I face, not the Unions that screw me or the corporations that wont adjust my payscale to current times. They alone have caused the problems we have economically, and they can point their fingers at each other all they want.
Just look at the job losses reported last week. Record numbers during the busy Holday season, and they date back to the Depression.
This is caused by uncertainty from our " leaders " who are more concrened with winning than representing.
I feel terrible knowing that my bandmates will struggle for 2 months, but just think about how many other small businesses and contractors made the same shitty choice because the elite in DC continue using us as pawns in their pathetic class warfare games, and sending our sons and daughters in harms way AGAIN. My oldest son served since he was 19 and now flys Commercial Jets.
If he would have died while serving, just so some young Saudis could continue parking their Yachts in Monaco, I would have probaly been jailed for doing something foolish.

But do you see my point..? I eat shit from all sides, and the reason is becasue guys like me and my wife who work hard and ask for nothing, are forgotten and now we are put in a class warfare game where I am an evil contractor.....??? WTF is that suppose to mean. I provide jobs and have for years, and becasue these clowns allowed our financial system to collapse while they profitted, I now become a target and pawn in their pathetic games...?
I often post hypocracy here as a way to avoid my anger.
When I feel that I am better represented by Jon Stewart or Steve Colbert, it's a sad statement. But thanks to thier humor I can enjoy the hypocracy, instead of losing my motivation to succeed.

I hope that all of us can continue making the most out of our talents and love for music.
Without that I have no clue how I would have enjoyed my life as much as I have.
The Music will never die no matter what these Jergoffs in DC create.......


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## midphase (Dec 6, 2010)

The main problem with politicians as I see it is the tight connection to money.

How come I don't see any of these tea idiots rally up against doing completely away with campaign donations or lobbying groups? 

If I was king, I would establish a federal election fund which any citizen with a number of signatures can apply for. So whether you are Joe Smith or the head of HP or eBay....you get the same exact amount of money to spend on your campaign and that's it! No more, no less....everyone gets the same opportunity...isn't that what the USA is about?

As far as Lobby groups....let's outlaw the fuckers. They amount to nothing more than legalized bribery!


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## José Herring (Dec 6, 2010)

[quote:e8802cfdb2="midphase @ Mon Dec 06, 2010 10:18 am"]The main problem with politicians as I see it is the tight connection to money.

How come I don't see any of these tea idiots rally up against doing completely away with campaign donations or lobbying groups? 

If I was king, I would establish a federal election fund which any citizen with a number of signatures can apply for. So whether you are Joe Smith or the head of HP or eBay....you get the same exact amount of money to spend on your campaign ò  ª   —•-  ª   —•6  ª   ˜3Ÿ  ª   ˜4  ª   ™3  ª   ™i  ª   ™G  ª   ™û  ª   ™5ñ  ª   ™6%  ª   ™H;  ª   ™HX  ª   ™NŒ  ª   ™P0  ª   ™Y™  ª   ™YÉ  ª   ™†/  ª   ™†£  ª   ™‡  ª   ™‡r  ª   ™•m  ª   ™—  ª   ™˜€  ª   ™˜  ª   šx“  ª   šx½  ª   š„›  ª   š…I


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## Nick Batzdorf (Dec 6, 2010)

I'm a person who lost all respect for McCain after he abandoned that along with all his other principles, the pinnacle being when he chose stupid Sarah Palin as his running mate.

And I simply can't comprehend why you would want to take the argument that this is how democracy is supposed to work. Are you really unaware of how money influences government and buys votes? Or do you just enjoy pissing off people like me.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Dec 6, 2010)

> A big part of the problem right now is that extreme Republicans have been able to squelch the moderates in the party. The best solutions aren't one side vs. another, or even watered-down compromises. The best solutions find creative ways to achieve common goals. Polarized partisanship is unable to support hybrid solutions.



I agree. And the first sentence is why we have polarized partisanship.


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## chimuelo (Dec 6, 2010)

Bernie Sanders would be the best watchdog if they cut his leesh.
The problem is that several of these corporations have not outsourced many of their manufacturing facilites and have rather balanced themselves so they can still maintain that they are an American based corporation. Before they are chased away to China or Mexico they should be brought back to the fold.
A certain level of patriotism needs to be excercised here, and yes even allow Unions to negotiate concessions to keep the jobs in the USA.
I cannot find a single person I agree with, or party, but oddly I see certain progressives that I admire becasue they risen through the ranks and stood by their principles, regardless of the pressure to claim an affiliation.

Jon Fairhurst 
You see what I find most frustrating, the lack of comprimise.
Right now I see our President finally stepping in during the lame duck instead of throwing yet more work at Nancy Pelosi, who has lost the edge now.
This year was entirely wasted from the lack of comprimise, and hundreds of thousands of jobs could have been saved if these elites would have thought about the consequences of the lack of action.
Sadly they have allowed the newest GOP electees to appear as saviours now as the DNC majority is about to cave in with the mantra of extended Unemployment benfits as their sloagan.
GOP electees would have allowed these benefits or they would have faced millions of people out of coverage who actually have paid into the system for decades or they wouldn't be eligable. 
Lets pray that these extensions will be revamped too. After 6 months if a person takes a job and it doesn't turn out to be full time/permanent, they risk losing their eligability if more than 1200 USD is made..................This is what drives me nuts about the law makers.
This little rule is never thought about and its one size fits all approach forces the unemployed to now become unemployable.
Re training is the name of the game, and thoses on the benefits should be required to at least go through such programs just in case, like in the constructiuon industry, those jobs will not return.
They are based on growth, so re train in another area, which also will help out for these old hard workers when they no longer can shovel mud in the sun for 10 hours.

The leverage games still continue, but IMHO the damage has already been done.
Businesses are not hiring after last weeks numbers, and politcal correctness has paralyzed our leaders.
While they sweat out who has " won " or " lost " Americans are suffering.
Our leaders in the Pentagon should take lessons on how to attack your enemies by watching these clowns in Congress and the Senate.
If they would attack our " supposed enemies " like they do each other, we would be have N. Korea begging us not to pave over their pathetic regime.


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## midphase (Dec 9, 2010)

More disgusting behavior from the GOP:

http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/12/09/ ... tml?hpt=T1

I don't get it...how do these guys get away with doing crap like this, and then accuse the other party of being anti-American?


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## Andrew Aversa (Dec 9, 2010)

The problem isn't lobbying, per se. The problem is money influencing elections. Every voice in this country should count equally, if we truly have a representative Democracy. Polls have shown that the vast majority of the country supports ENDING tax cuts for the rich, yet half our representatives support extending them. This is a failure of representative Democracy, by definition.


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## P.T. (Dec 9, 2010)

Outsourcing:

Maybe we could outsource the government.

We could bypass the current one and hire a better one overseas.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Dec 9, 2010)

Better yet, ship the Republicans and Blue Dog Democrats overseas. They could use them in the Ivory Coast, and then we'd have a reasonable government here.


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## P.T. (Dec 9, 2010)

Nick Batzdorf @ Thu Dec 09 said:


> Better yet, ship the Republicans and Blue Dog Democrats overseas. They could use them in the Ivory Coast, and then we'd have a reasonable government here.



Well, I still think that you are delusional about the democrats, but getting rid of some of the politicians is a start at least.


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## snowleopard (Dec 10, 2010)

zircon_st @ Thu Dec 09 said:


> The problem isn't lobbying, per se. .


Well, unfortunately lobbying has been so completely absorbed by money, by definition it has become a huge part of the problem. Money buys lobbyists, which gains access to politicians. Access for those with money to afford it. It's really that simple. There's no way you, I, or anyone on here is going to possibly be able to compete with the lobby efforts done by a company like Monsanto, Goldman Sachs, Exxon, etc. 

Agree with your statement on taxes for the wealthy.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Dec 11, 2010)

P.T., you're sort of right - I am delusional about them. But of the two, the Democratic Party is the one that looks forward and wants to invest in things that will improve our peoples' lives. The Republicans simply say no, for whatever reason they come up with.

That's a ridiculous oversimplification - but only of the Democrats, not the Republicans!


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## Animus (Dec 11, 2010)

Nick Batzdorf @ Fri Dec 10 said:


> Better yet, ship the Republicans and Blue Dog Democrats overseas. They could use them in the Ivory Coast, and then we'd have a reasonable government here.



You mean like the reasonable government that controls California and has business leaving the state in droves? :D


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## midphase (Dec 12, 2010)

It's a myth that companies are leaving California any more rapidly than they are leaving most other states. Companies as a whole are expanding, merging, and simply looking for the best deals they can find (many times overseas).


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## Nick Batzdorf (Dec 12, 2010)

And this is the person who accuses me of being a demagogue who just says stuff without backing it up.


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## chimuelo (Dec 13, 2010)

Its not a myth. Governor Davis and Sacramento legislators crippled small business to keep big energy and public Unions happy.

You can thank Pelosi, Feinstein, Boxer and Schwarzeneggar for bringing in Federal tax dollars for growth, and business back to CA via tax credits.
Nevada had a serious tilt-up construction boom for warehousing. Reno was basically Silicon Valleys warehouseing. Microsoft, Silicontrax and many businesses left during the insane taxing era during Governor Davis' term. 

CA will grow faster in 2011 than the rest of the nation and should actually lead in Global trade and high technology sectors.
Sacramento legislators need to be leveraged into any decisions and nobody knows that game better than Brown does.
So CA will lead the way in 2011.
If Brown has his way, and taxes stay at current rates, he can expect to see job growth which will spur demand.
I am counting on it.
50% of the people that come here to Las Vegas are from California. I can always tell if its going to be a good week by going to the roof of the Venetian on a friday night. If you can see a steady stream of lights for 50 miles west, you'll be having a great time.
Nobody likes those stiff machines in the " Indian " casinos anyways. What a bunch of crooks. They make the California Lottery scam look legit.


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## Animus (Dec 14, 2010)

chimuelo @ Mon Dec 13 said:


> Its not a myth. Governor Davis and Sacramento legislators crippled small business to keep big energy and public Unions happy.
> 
> You can thank Pelosi, Feinstein, Boxer and Schwarzeneggar for bringing in Federal tax dollars for growth, and business back to CA via tax credits.
> Nevada had a serious tilt-up construction boom for warehousing. Reno was basically Silicon Valleys warehouseing. Microsoft, Silicontrax and many businesses left during the insane taxing era during Governor Davis' term.
> ...



Yup.


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## Animus (Dec 14, 2010)

Nick Batzdorf @ Sun Dec 12 said:


> And this is the person who accuses me of being a demagogue who just says stuff without backing it up.



http://thebusinessrelocationcoach.blogspot.com/

193 companies have left Cali in just 2010 alone, 4 times more than 2009 even.




And to make my links more liberal friendly since I know how liberals like their news from "trusted" sites here is a MSNBC article talking about the same.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40533464/ns ... county_ca/





Contrast California with Texas (which is booming) for example, in the light of their disparate fiscal policies and the differences are clear.


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## P.T. (Dec 14, 2010)

Not only are they leaving California (and that has been going on since at least the 90's) they also leave San Francisco and relocate in the surrounding suburbs in order to escape the taxes and regulations imposed on them by the city.


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## midphase (Dec 15, 2010)

Ok, so the House today repealed Don't Ask Don't Tell.

What I would like to know from fellow conservatives around here is what does it say when the Republican Party pretty much voted against it right among party lines?

I think both what makes them such a force to be reckoned with, and scary at the same time, is their willingness to march in lockstep even when there are issues that one would assume centrist Republicans would be for. DADT has been obviously overdue for a repeal for a number of years, the majority of the country seems to feel that it's time for it to go (just like a majority of the country is opposed to tax cuts for the above $250k earners), yet 100% of Republicans vote against the repeal!!! What gives? Seriously!


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## JonFairhurst (Dec 15, 2010)

I've been reading Taylor Branch's books on civil rights recently. The reach of the segregationists was like a cancer from top to bottom. It included politicians, the courts, police, business leaders, schools, hospitals, bus stations, lunch counters, and bathrooms. You also had an underground organization in the KKK, mobs on the street, and individuals who would harass people with words, beatings, sniper shots, and bombs. In Birmingham an Eagle Scout shot and killed a black man on a bike without provocation. 

DADT isn't the same as slavery and segregation, but the common thread is that there are those in power who will rally together to keep the powerless down. Ethics (compassion, fairness, respect) gets turned on its head, passions rise, and organizations are co-opted through "purity" campaigns.

The party line vote doesn't surprise me at all. Frankly, I'm surprised that it hasn't been more vicious. Human nature can turn really ugly over purity and power.


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## snowleopard (Dec 15, 2010)

That is part of the problem. Probably 75% of the country would like to see rapid progress from compromise, and for the government to try new things, even fairly radical things. But when you have 90% of elected officials paranoid about upsetting the base, and prominent party leaders who are connected to money, they won't do it. As an example, some 41 of the GOP senators have signed a pledge that they won't vote to raise taxes, no matter what, period. They call this principle, and get praised by the likes of Grover Norquist and such every chance they get. But having such a stance means that there is no flex room at all. Even if you were to get a great majority of other things the country desperately needs, and you believe in, if there is a tax on there, you MUST vote against it. The Dems are held hostage in similar ways. 

As to jobs leaving states. I noticed my home state of Oregon is one of the states where they are moving to. We're supposedly a very liberal state. Wonder how that works? Well, we have low taxes due to no sales tax, a lot of specific tax incentives, and our state is completely broke as such. With that, we have many schools closing, and some of the œ  Õ   À0j  Õ   ÀMq  Õ   ÀMè  Õ   Á$+  Õ   Á$w  Õ   Á?™  Õ   Á?é  Õ   ÁE†  Õ   ÁE£  Õ   ÁGÄ  Õ   ÁGå  Õ   ÁSm  Õ   ÁS|  Õ   ÁU*  Õ   ÁU;  Õ   Á„R  Õ   Á…/  Õ   Á‰Õ  Õ   ÁŠ  Õ   Â]k  Õ   Â^3  Õ   Âlm  Õ   Âl   Õ   Âq  Õ   Âq)  Õ   Â²‰  Õ   Â²•  Õ   Âñ  Õ   ÂñÑ  Õ   Âõ«  Õ   Âõô  Õ   Â÷:  Õ   Â÷û  Õ   Ã]•  Õ   Ã]ï  Õ   Ã”ð  Õ   Ã•T  Õ   Ã¥4  Õ   Ã¦  Õ   Ã·  Õ   Ã·‡  Õ   ÃîŽ  Õ   Ãïÿ  Õ   Äf  Õ   Ä ×  Õ   Ä!  Õ   Ä!M  Õ   Ä'  Õ   Ä'`  Õ   Ä[email protected]  Õ   ÄN  Õ   ÄXß  Õ   ÄYC  Õ   ÄÎ-  Õ   ÄÎÏ  Õ   Äîo  Õ   ÄïŒ  Õ   Å=Î  Õ   Å=Û  Õ   Å=é


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