# Mid-tier CPU Mainly for Orchestral Libs (VSL DS, 8DIO)



## Vladinemir (May 13, 2022)

I'm not buying right now, but it's useful to plan ahead.
I Would Use​
S-ized VSL Dimension Strings I have an option to use Synchron Stage convolution reverb. Could mid-tier CPUs below utilize full potential of this library? I don't have MIR, but my guess is that it loads CPU similarly. Even though it can be used for sections to reduce the load, I'm not sure if this works well with DS. Also, don't know if they plan to release Synchron DS.
I don't necessarily plan to use DS in this way. It's more like a reference. Realistic scenario would be small orchestra like 3 violins, 2 violas, 2 or 1 cellos, 1 bass plus some other instruments like harpsichord, flutes etc. On top of that some libs by other devs like choir, organ and synths, for example Syntronik or Anlog Lab.
8DIO Kontakt libs - Century String and Brass (and maybe Woodwinds one day :D ).
Kontak Play series for atmospheric sounds. These can hit CPU pretty hard.
CPUs​5700X/5800X
10700(K)
12600K with DDR4
I know that Zen4 and Intel 13th gen are coming out soon, but mentioned chips could become good deal then. If those don't suffice, maybe to wait price drop of 12700(K). DDR5 might be more available by then too.


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## Zanshin (May 13, 2022)

I’ve found using sections in MIR for DS is fine. Syz DS obviously has the Synchron IRs (per player) by default, but it’s easy to turn it off (stock mixer preset).

I highly doubt we will ever see a Synchron DS, the mic per player just doesn’t make sense. DS is fantastic achievement as it stands.

Once you invest into MIR there’s a ton of sweet libraries to use in it, including the VI libraries many of which you can purchase the individual instruments a la carte.

Another option (instead or in addition to) to consider is VSL VI Chamber Strings (not Synchron-ized version!!!!). Very beautiful small sections but you’ll need/want MIR to make the most of it.

EDIT: I think I didn’t get that you were asking about CPUs not libraries lol. I’d guess any of those would work. I’m still rocking a 9900K and it’s good to go.


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## Jrides (May 13, 2022)

Any of those should work. I decided against the 12700K with DDR4. DAWBench reesults show a pretty significant dip in performance. However given your situation… I don’t even think you would notice the difference.


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## Vladinemir (May 14, 2022)

Zanshin said:


> Syz DS obviously has the Synchron IRs (per player) by default, but it’s easy to turn it off (stock mixer preset).


Yes, I can get away by turning them off(and leave them internally, in Guy Michelmore's words, dry as Sahara Desert ) but let's say we use them per player as a sort of benchmark.


Zanshin said:


> I highly doubt we will ever see a Synchron DS


This is what I think too.


Zanshin said:


> there’s a ton of sweet libraries to use in it, including the VI libraries many of which you can purchase the individual instruments a la carte.


Already have some of those. Maybe I could use s-ized conv. reverb wiht VSL and baked in reverb for example with Emperium. Not sure how synths would sound through MIR. I read that for pads it is not recommended, but maybe for basses and arps.


Zanshin said:


> VSL VI Chamber Strings (not Synchron-ized version!!!!)


I probably won't be able to think about those anytime soon. If one has MIR, they make sense.


Zanshin said:


> I’m still rocking a 9900K and it’s good to go.


Can it run all DS sections with IRs turned on comfortably?


Jrides said:


> Any of those should work.


That's good news. Now the question is 6 vs 8 cores. According to this video, single core is still more important, so 12600K has the advantage:

On the other hand, it was mentioned here that E cores don't do much for audio so more P cores only might be better option (or maybe non K version if found much cheaper).
Also I watched local review of 12400f vs 11700K, although for gaming. The reviewer had much smoother experience with 11700k even though 12400f is brilliant for the price. I wonder if average low fps tell something about audio performance too.


Jrides said:


> I decided against the 12700K with DDR4.


Too expensive for me at the moment so I would have to wait anyway and DDR5 might be a better option by then. Well, the other mentioned CPUs are not cheap either.


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## Zanshin (May 14, 2022)

Vladinemir said:


> Can it run all DS sections with IRs turned on comfortably?


Here's a screen grab, 5 sections all playing using Divisimate, all legato, stock presets with IR per player. No audio overload at all. Doing what you outlined above would be easy peasy. It's obviously going to be more efficient to run MIR per section though.






Here's what a typical MIR session looks like for me:






This makes my machine start to sweat if I play everything at once tutti. It is 43 MIR instances.


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## Vladinemir (May 14, 2022)

Thanks for your time and detailed answers. That was very useful. It looks much better than I though. I plan to add other details about mentioned chips and compatible components as a reminder later.


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## Pictus (May 14, 2022)

This may help 





DAWbench 2021 Suite - Intel 12th Gen Results.


DAWbench Suite - AMD 7000 and 13th Gen Intel results https://gearspace.com/board/showpost.php?p=16229111&postcount=934 The new CPUs are factory overclocked, by tweaking we can reduce the max wattage and use air cooler. Intel Core i9-13900K vs. AMD Ryzen 9 7950X at 125W and 65W...




vi-control.net




For KONTACK DDR4 vs DDR5 makes is a big difference.
The 5800X is better than the 12600K with DDR*4*, but the 12600K
has the advantage of built-in GPU.


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## Vladinemir (May 22, 2022)

Intel​Integrated GPU would be handy, but it looks like the prices of discrete ones are going down finally. 12th gen probably makes more sense with DDR5. Jay (JayzTwoCents) said he had many problems with 12900k so far (uses DDR5) but he's not sure if the memory caused it. He also mentioned that 13th gen might be more stable.

AMD​I would probably pick 5700X over 5800X because it's a bit colder and more efficient. Not for current prices though.
RAM​Also, I wonder if 4 layer PCB could be a problem with 4 sticks of DDR4, 64 GB in total. Buildzoid mentioned it in this video:

He is talking about overclocking, but XMP profiles are technically overclocking too.
On the other hand, he said some 4 layer boards overclock better than some with 6.
I could buy 32 GB first and 32 more later. Not sure what would be better to start with - 2x16 GB or 1x32 GB. Potential board could be MSI B550-A Pro or MSI MPG B550 GAMING PLUS.
Storage​Does it make more sense to put libraries on NVMe or OS? My guess is that Dimension Strings would benefit more from it than OS. IIRC, I read some systems had problem booting from an m.2 drive.


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## Pictus (May 23, 2022)

Vladinemir said:


> Intel​Integrated GPU would be handy, but it looks like the prices of discrete ones are going down finally. 12th gen probably makes more sense with DDR5. Jay (JayzTwoCents) said he had many problems with 12900k so far (uses DDR5) but he's not sure if the memory caused it. He also mentioned that 13th gen might be more stable.



*Moving *the PC and problems?
This is a mechanical problem, his CPU is probably deformed + bad contact.
The Intel 12th Gen is initially flat, but can deform and become concave.














Cooling issues with Intel’s Alder Lake - Problems with the LGA-1700 socket and a possible workaround | igor'sLAB


Badly fitting coolers, too low performance with actually good waterblocks and bent CPUs – meanwhile not only the feedback of the readers is piling up, but also very similar reports from the board…




www.igorslab.de












Alder Lake’s cooling problem straightened out by 5 degrees! - Simple ILM-Mod for Intel’s LGA-1700 socket | Practice | igor'sLAB


Intel's Alder Lake CPUs run hot, very hot. A few weeks ago, Igor had already identified the bending of the CPU and motherboard due to the LGA1700 socket as a potential cause for this. Today I'




www.igorslab.de










Vladinemir said:


> AMD​I would probably pick 5700X over 5800X because it's a bit colder and more efficient. Not for current prices though.


Use a big cooler and no problem.




Vladinemir said:


> RAM​Also, I wonder if 4 layer PCB could be a problem with 4 sticks of DDR4, 64 GB in total. Buildzoid mentioned it in this video:
> 
> He is talking about overclocking, but XMP profiles are technically overclocking too.
> On the other hand, he said some 4 layer boards overclock better than some with 6.
> I could buy 32 GB first and 32 more later. Not sure what would be better to start with - 2x16 GB or 1x32 GB. Potential board could be MSI B550-A Pro or MSI MPG B550 GAMING PLUS.



The MSI MPG B550 GAMING PLUS is a 6 layer PCB.


https://www.overclock.net/threads/vrm-on-the-new-am4-motherboards.1624051/



I would go for 2x32 3600MHz.





2 or 4 sticks. High or low voltage. Timing ? Ram questions.


Hey everyone… let me begin by saying… The type of music I generally work with does not require 32GB ram. That being said, I am building a new system with 64GB RAM. I don’t collect libraries so no massive template or anything like that. 5950x with X570 chipset. The computer will be in a closet...



vi-control.net







Vladinemir said:


> Storage​Does it make more sense to put libraries on NVMe or OS? My gues is that Dimension Strings would benefit more from it than OS. IIRC, I read some systems had problem booting from an m.2 drive.


TLC NVMe SSDs(GEN3 or GEN4) are very fast, you can place everything into a single drive
and there will be no performance loss for audio workflow.
For backup reasons like creating a system image with Macrium Reflect, it is better
a separate drive for the OS or create a smaller partition for the OS in the big drive.

BTW, you may also like





Anyone with Aorus Elite X570/Ryzen 3900x?


Hey guys, I'm curious if anyone has an Aorus Elite x570 with a Ryzen 3900x for music production?! Any specific BIOS settings I should disable or enable? Global C-states? PBO? AMD Cool&Quiet? I've been experiencing some ticks/pops recently although I have a RME Fireface UFX II set at 256...




vi-control.net


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## Vladinemir (May 23, 2022)

Thank you @Pictus for lot of information and having patience to read all this. Didn't know about deforming although Jay did mention something about rushing production to meet the demand. So visiting a tinsmith for CPU repairs could become a thing now 


Pictus said:


> The MSI MPG B550 GAMING PLUS is a 6 layer PCB.


That's even better then. I heard it's 4 layers here:

Also, MSI has in your face approach with things like that, for example:





MSI MAG B550 TOMAHAWK AMD AM4 DDR4 CF M.2 USB 3.2 Gen 2 HDMI ATX Gaming Motherboard


Powered by AMD Ryzen AM4 processors, the MSI MAG B550 TOMAHAWK inspired by the military armor design, tuned for better performance by Core boost, DDR4 Boost, Lightning M.2 with M.2 Shied




www.msi.com






Pictus said:


> Use a big cooler and no problem.


It will probably depend how much cheaper cooler I will be able to get away with using 5700x vs 5800x. For example, local price for Noctua NH-D15 is about $140. AK620 is not available yet. Dark Rock Pro 4 is about $110. I know PBO doesn't mind better cooler but I'm not sure what would be the sweet spot.


Pictus said:


> BTW, you may also like
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I thought it's more suited for 5900X and something like B550 AORUS ELITE V2 would be a match.
Do Gigabyte boards behave after updating BIOS and when using XMP? I remember they had problems with OC and dual BIOS before.


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## Pictus (May 23, 2022)

Vladinemir said:


> Thank you @Pictus for lot of information and having patience to read all this. Didn't know about deforming although Jay did mention something about rushing production to meet the demand. So visiting a tinsmith for CPU repairs could become a thing now



You are welcome.


Vladinemir said:


> That's even better then. I heard it's 4 layers here:
> 
> Also, MSI has in your face approach with things like that, for example:
> 
> ...



Best ask the support if it is 4 or 6.
I checked the Tomahawk site link and they mention 6 layer, but not for the
GAMING PLUS, so it is probably 4 layers, not a concern for 2 RAM sticks.



Vladinemir said:


> It will probably depend how much cheaper cooler I will be able to get away with using 5700x vs 5800x. For example, local price for Noctua NH-D15 is about $140. AK620 is not available yet. Dark Rock Pro 4 is about $110. I know PBO doesn't mind better cooler but I'm not sure what would be the sweet spot.




The Thermalright Frost Commander 140(FC140) is interesting and not much
expensive, I have one and lapped the foot/plate to make it more flat.
By limiting the max RPM it can be more silent.
From https://www.overclock.net/threads/thermalright-frost-commander-140.1777788/page-19#post-28972586
"It is very good. Speaking in pure performance terms, it outpaces the NH-D15. Sound wise, I would give the win to the NH-D15, but barely. The stock fans on the FC140 are sort of meh and nothing special compared to the NF-A15s (in terms of heatsink application). The TL-D14X is basically an airflow fan and due to materials used, produces audible harmonic resonance if put against any restriction (but it's still a good and quiet fan for the air it pushes). The TL-C12PRO is an outright average fan and very loud at top speeds. The heatsink , either because of geometry or because it's simply too dense, also gives off a slight harmonic resonance noise that can either be outright annoying (stock TL-D14X) or barely noticeable (swap the stock TL-D14X for another fan like a TY-143). If you go by pure dba readings and perceived sound levels, the NH-D15 is a bit better, but in my testing the fans spin up considerably more frequently as the heatsink itself struggles with temperature spikes while the FC140 is able to deal with said spikes much better.

It's a win some lose some type deal, but given the the FC140 is practically half the price of the NH-D15 one may be willing to overlook the loses entirely. Personally I love this thing, and after swapping the stock TL-D14X with my old TY-143 (and throwing out the TL-C12PRO since it produces more noise than it does any cooling improvement) I have no complaints."





Vladinemir said:


> I thought it's more suited for 5900X and something like B550 AORUS ELITE V2 would be a match.
> Do Gigabyte boards behave after updating BIOS and when using XMP? I remember they had problems with OC and dual BIOS before.


I don't know how the situation is today, but MSI generally had better BIOS than Gigabyte.
I posted the link not because of the Gigabyte mobo, but for the other links there...


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## Vladinemir (Jun 13, 2022)

Update - 5700G was suggested to me recently because I have only ATI HD 4770 which may not work in W10 and the situation with GPUs is still not great. In this forum they were happy with the iGPU driver. Also, @Pictus mentioned 5700G on gearspace too.
Is 2x32 GB 3600 still recommened over 4 sticks (or even more so)? Would it be a drawback for an APU if I went with single stick of 32 GB and added more later? It was also suggested to buy 2x16 GB and add that much later which I guess might cause problems with 4 layer mobo.
Also, it was mentioned in this L1 video that the max speed for 5700G is 3200. Not sure why. HW Unboxed tested it with much higher speeds. Also, Wendel said that with 128 GB the max speed is 2933.


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## Pictus (Jun 13, 2022)

Go for 2x32 3600Mhz, you can buy 1 RAM stick now and later buy another, but
you *MUST* buy the same brand/model!
With only 1 RAM stick you will have less performance.
The memory controller in the 5700G is better than the non G versions, 3600Mhz should work ok.
One example of AMD with 128Gb 3600Mhz


https://pcpartpicker.com/b/CYFG3C


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## Vokes (Jul 17, 2022)

Hi guys!
I found a really good deal on a i5 9400f processor, do you guys think it will be a good processor to use for music production? To this day I was working on a ryzen 3500u laptop processor, it worked ok, but bigger projects needed freezing tracks etc..


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## MarcMahler89 (Jul 17, 2022)

Vokes said:


> Hi guys!
> I found a really good deal on a i5 9400f processor, do you guys think it will be a good processor to use for music production? To this day I was working on a ryzen 3500u laptop processor, it worked ok, but bigger projects needed freezing tracks etc..


No, it wont be a major upgrade. If youre on a comparable budget to the 9400f listing price, get a Ryzen 5600 instead for a minor surcharge and get a significant improvement instead. If your budget can handle a few more bucks, id recommend a 5800x for ~300, which might last you much longer.

But if youre not desperate, id actually recommend waiting until the end of this year until AMD releases its new CPUs - which will in turn lower the prices of its previous generation, usually by quite a lot.


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## Vokes (Jul 17, 2022)

MarcMahler89 said:


> No, it wont be a major upgrade. If youre on a comparable budget to the 9400f listing price, get a Ryzen 5600 instead for a minor surcharge and get a significant improvement instead. If your budget can handle a few more bucks, id recommend a 5800x for ~300, which might last you much longer.
> 
> But if youre not desperate, id actually recommend waiting until the end of this year until AMD releases its new CPUs - which will in turn lower the prices of its previous generation, usually by quite a lot.


The thing is the 9400f will cost me 250 dollars with GTX 1050 graphics, 16gb ram and 1tb hdd.
While the one I asked for Ryzen 5600x is 550 dollars, same ram memory, 500 ssd and WITHOUT graphics card.
I can stretch 300 more $, but will the Ryzen 5600x be 300% better than i5 9400f or more like 20-30%?


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## Vladinemir (Jul 20, 2022)

MarcMahler89 said:


> But if youre not desperate, id actually recommend waiting until the end of this year until AMD releases its new CPUs - which will in turn lower the prices of its previous generation, usually by quite a lot.


I was thinking about that too, but then there is this:








Intel Announces CPU Price Hikes, Hopes to Spur Near-Term Purchases


Intel wants to reduce its current oversupply




www.tomshardware.com




I wonder if AMD will follow up although my guess is we will see Zen 4 in early 2023 so prices of Zen 3 CPUs might drop by then. Gut feeling - prices will increase this fall and then drop slightly bellow current ones in Q1 2023.


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## Pictus (Jul 21, 2022)

Intel Core i5-13600K 14 Core Raptor Lake ES CPU Tested, 40% Faster Than Core i5-12600K & Beats The Ryzen 9 5950X In Cinebench


The latest benchmarks of Intel's mainstream Core i5-13600K 14-Core Raptor Lake Desktop CPU have leaked out and it's a beast.




wccftech.com


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## Technostica (Jul 21, 2022)

Vladinemir said:


> I wonder if AMD will follow up although my guess is we will see Zen 4 in early 2023 so prices of Zen 3 CPUs might drop by then. Gut feeling - prices will increase this fall and then drop slightly bellow current ones in Q1 2023.


Zen 4 has formally been given a timeline by AMD.
I believe it is due to be actually released in September.
I think they will repeat what they did with version 3 and just release the highest tier chips at first and at high prices.
So not much downward pressure on the current cheapest chips, unless Intel force their hand.
Not much further for those to fall really.


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## Ben (Jul 21, 2022)

I think all of the CPUs mentioned by OP should work fine.

Regarding Dimension Series and MIR:
It's recommended to insert each player as separat player icon so MIR can do it's magic. You will get the best results this way.
If you want to use a section player icon instead, make sure to pre-pan the players with a power panner in the stereo field.


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## Vladinemir (Jul 22, 2022)

Thanks. Is standard MIR replaced completely with 3D now or do you plan to offer it as well maybe as value option later?


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## Ben (Jul 22, 2022)

Vladinemir said:


> Thanks. Is standard MIR replaced completely with 3D now or do you plan to offer it as well maybe as value option later?


It's completely replaced. The old MIR Pro will not get any updates from now on.


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## Vladinemir (Aug 22, 2022)

I got 5700G. I'm not sure if something is wrong, but the meter in Synchron Player shows constant
peaks even when idle.




I set PBO to auto for the time being. OC Genie in BIOS was pretty aggressive with voltage, although it jumps a little bit above 1.4 V occasionally with the current settings.
With Curve Optimizer CPU didn't fail even with all cores set to -30 when running Cinebench. I also tried low power workload by restarting a couple of times to trigger Automatic Repair described here:

Sometimes the PC shut down after restarting (the fans stopped for a second) and then immediatelly turned on. This also happened sometimes when I changed PBO type, like from Auto to Advanced or Genie, so I'm not sure if it was low power workload stability fail or something else is wrong or maybe this is just normal. Restarting constantly doesn't sound like it's good for the computer so I didn't want to proceed before asking here.


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## Pictus (Aug 22, 2022)

Vladinemir said:


> I got 5700G. I'm not sure if something is wrong, but the meter in Synchron Player shows constant
> peaks even when idle.



The peaks is something Windows is doing in the background...
You can check with:

https://www.resplendence.com/latencymon
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/downloads/process-explorer



> I set PBO to auto for the time being. OC Genie in BIOS was pretty aggressive with voltage, although it jumps a little bit above 1.4 V occasionally with the current settings.
> With Curve Optimizer CPU didn't fail even with all cores set to -30 when running Cinebench. I also tried low power workload by restarting a couple of times to trigger Automatic Repair described here:
> 
> Sometimes the PC shut down after restarting (the fans stopped for a second) and then immediatelly turned on. This also happened sometimes when I changed PBO type, like from Auto to Advanced or Genie, so I'm not sure if it was low power workload stability fail or something else is wrong or maybe this is just normal. Restarting constantly doesn't sound like it's good for the computer so I didn't want to proceed before asking here.




The restarts means something is wrong. 
Clear the CMOS and do not do any tweak or overclock, else if
you really know what you are doing and why.

You can use https://www.ocbase.com/ to test system/memory stability.

Check this to understand the Curve Optimizer

IF you do the Curve Optimize, better set the "Minimum processor state" to 15% or more, but not zero.






If you want to go deep into OC, but he OC too much, not good for production machines. ☠️


*Nowadays I only use the Curve Optimizer, but with Precision Boost Overdrive Scalar = 1X
to keep the CPU cool and quiet, plus some RAM OC to 3733MHz.*

My recommendations:

Make sure the motherboard BIOS is updated and use the latest chipset driver
https://www.techpowerup.com/download/amd-ryzen-chipset-drivers/
The GPU driver
https://www.amd.com/en/support/apu/...series-desktop-processors-radeon-graphics/amd
You have the option to only install the driver




You may want to use DDU to uninstall the current GPU driver
https://www.guru3d.com/files-details/display-driver-uninstaller-download.html

Some BIOS tweaks I do here:

VDDCR SOC Voltage Override [1.1]
CLDO VDDP Voltage [0.900]
Global C-state Control [Disabled] (can try with enabled)
SB Clock Spread Spectrum [Disabled]
ASUS Performance Enhancement [Disabled]
Performance Bias [None]
VDDCR CPU Switching Frequency [350] (If the default is higher, keep the default)
VDDCR CPU Power Phase Control [Extreme]
VDDCR SOC Switching Frequency [350] (If the default is higher, keep the default)
VDDCR SOC Power Phase Control [Extreme]
ErP Ready [Enable(S5)]
Energy Star Ready [Disabled]
Download & Install ARMOURY CRATE app [Disabled]
ECO Mode [Disable]
Power Supply Idle Control [Typical Current Idle]

Some Windows 10/11 Tweaks:
*But before change anything you must create a Restore Point NOW! *
https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/4571-create-system-restore-point-windows-10-a.html

Unofficial Windows Audio Workstation build and tweak guide 
https://devblogs.microsoft.com/wind...dio-workstation-build-and-tweak-guide-part-1/

Set the Power Plan like this




Use the Windows power plan settings explorer utility to to unselect "Processor idle demote/promote threshold"
https://forums.guru3d.com/threads/windows-power-plan-settings-explorer-utility.416058/



New options will appear and set the Threshold to 100%.




To save energy can try with Balanced(recommended) instead of Ultimate, but do the tweaks.

Disable Windows Hibernate
https://www.tenforums.com/tutorials/2859-enable-disable-hibernate-windows-10-a.html

Disable Widgets
https://www.elevenforum.com/t/enable-or-disable-widgets-feature-in-windows-11.1196/
But I prefer to uninstall
https://www.thewindowsclub.com/how-to-uninstall-or-reinstall-widgets-in-windows-11

Disable Core Isolation and Memory Integrity in Windows 11/10
https://www.thewindowsclub.com/core-isolation-and-memory-integrity-in-windows-10

---

Some interesting stuff you may like or not:

https://www.w10privacy.de/english-home/
https://www.oo-software.com/en/shutup10
https://www.oo-software.com/en/ooappbuster
https://www.sordum.org/9470/windows-update-blocker-v1-7/
https://www.sordum.org/9480/defender-control-v2-1/
https://www.binisoft.org/wfc
https://doublecmd.sourceforge.io/
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/downloads/autoruns
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/sysinternals/downloads/process-explorer


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## Vladinemir (Aug 24, 2022)

Thanks @Pictus for more than detailed post.


Pictus said:


> The peaks is something Windows is doing in the background...


I checked with latency monitor and it says everything is fine even with those spikes. Maybe the Windows is doing its telemetry thing  


Pictus said:


> The restarts means something is wrong.


Maybe I didn't explain clearly. PC doesn't restart by itself. When I change some major settings in BIOS and then save, computer restarts normally but sometimes it shuts down for a sec during this process and then turns on immediately and continues without me needing to turn it on again (or it just looks to me like turning off cause the fans stop for a moment). Is this still bad?
I mentioned repeated restarting as a method for testing low power workload by pushing the button manually before Windows loads a couple of times to trigger Automatic Repair as described in reddit article. Is that safe for the PC? Do you know some other methods for testing this?


Pictus said:


> You can use https://www.ocbase.com/ to test system/memory stability.


I tested RAM before I installed Windows or put the components in the case, one stick at a time for 6+ hours each with memtest with no errors.


Pictus said:


> If you want to go deep into OC, but he OC too much, not good for production machines. ☠️


I don't want to go deep in OC, just lower the voltages with Curve Optimizer. I would keep the limits predefined by the CPU, not even those by mobo and set Curve Optimizer values per core. I wouldn't touch other options if this is enough for what I want. Even when all cores were set to -30, PC didn't crash in Cinebench. That increased performance and lowered the voltage and the temps too. Low power workload stability is still the question, -30 can't be right for long tern use.


Pictus said:


> Make sure the motherboard BIOS is updated and use the latest chipset driver


The latest chipset driver is installed but I hesitate to mess with the BIOS updates. Heard many horror stories, mainly by Jay on YT.


Pictus said:


> To save energy can try with Balanced(recommended) instead of Ultimate, but do the tweaks.


I prefer Balanced over Ultimate because this is low power oriented kind of a build.


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## Pictus (Aug 24, 2022)

Vladinemir said:


> Thanks @Pictus for more than detailed post.


You are welcome.



Vladinemir said:


> I checked with latency monitor and it says everything is fine even with those spikes. Maybe the Windows is doing its telemetry thing
> 
> Maybe I didn't explain clearly. PC doesn't restart by itself. When I change some major settings in BIOS and then save, computer restarts normally but sometimes it shuts down for a sec during this process and then turns on immediately and continues without me needing to turn it on again (or it just looks to me like turning off cause the fans stop for a moment). Is this still bad?


No.



Vladinemir said:


> I mentioned repeated restarting as a method for testing low power workload by pushing the button manually before Windows loads a couple of times to trigger Automatic Repair as described in reddit article. Is that safe for the PC?


I do not like this test, will not break the hardware, but may end messing the Windows...



Vladinemir said:


> Do you know some other methods for testing this?



Hummm...
In Photoshop, load some photo, duplicate the layer some times, apply some different
effect in each layer and keep enabling/disabling the layers to see if it crashes...
With Photoshop loaded allow the system to sleep and see if crashes when waking up
or working with Photoshop again, but bad drivers may create problems too.



Vladinemir said:


> I tested RAM before I installed Windows or put the components in the case, one stick at a time for 6+ hours each with memtest with no errors.


OK, but memtest is "meh", does not always get the subtle errors.
y-chruncher test #14 is one of the most strong and does not need 6 hours.
6 hours you are testing for temperature stability, see the post





New DAW Build for mainly Spitfire BBCSO Pro and VEPro - Player settings


Hi Folks. Just completed a new build MSI Z690 DDR4 PRO A Intel 12th Gen I7 12700k 128GB Teamgroup T-Create expert DDR4 3600mhz OS/Apps - Samsung 980 Pro PCI Gen 4 1tb BBCSO Pro/HWO - Samsung 970 EVO Plus 2tb Interface - having issues with Apollo Twin X TB3 with the MSI TB4 Card but borrowed a...




vi-control.net







Vladinemir said:


> I don't want to go deep in OC, just lower the voltages with Curve Optimizer. I would keep the limits predefined by the CPU, not even those by mobo and set Curve Optimizer values per core. I wouldn't touch other options if this is enough for what I want. Even when all cores were set to -30, PC didn't crash in Cinebench. That increased performance and lowered the voltage and the temps too. Low power workload stability is still the question, -30 can't be right for long tern use.
> 
> The latest chipset driver is installed but I hesitate to mess with the BIOS updates. Heard many horror stories, mainly by Jay on YT.
> 
> I prefer Balanced over Ultimate because this is low power oriented kind of a build.


If the motherboard has BIOS flashback or dual BIOS, no need to worry.


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## Vladinemir (Aug 25, 2022)

Thanks @Pictus . VI community should buy you a birthday gift. Do you have buy me a coffee or something similar? Or maybe you develop some plugins?


Pictus said:


> In Photoshop


I guess Gimp works too.


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## Pictus (Aug 25, 2022)

Vladinemir said:


> Thanks @Pictus .



I am glad to help.


> VI community should buy you a birthday gift. Do you have buy me a coffee or something similar? Or maybe you develop some plugins?




I do not code anything. 



> I guess Gimp works too.


Anything that can create layers.


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## OHjorth (Aug 25, 2022)

I have the 5800X and I can run projects with over 80 MIDI-tracks plus FX without a single glitch. Not sure how many of those tracks that run at the same time but full string, brass, choir, percussion and synths at the same time is no problem whatsoever. 
It runs a bit hot yes, but I have a big Noctua-cooler to take care of that. 5900X is a better choice and I don’t know how it matches current CPUs


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## Vladinemir (Aug 26, 2022)

OHjorth said:


> I have the 5800X


Did you play with PBO and Curve Optimizer? Do you use VSL?


OHjorth said:


> I have a big Noctua-cooler


Mine is Deepcool AK620. I guess it's sufficient for 5700G.


OHjorth said:


> 5900X is a better


There are themes here with posts about 13600K being better than 5900X although I'm curious about the price, especially for the mobos.
I was thinking about 5700X vs 12600K. Intel looked like clear winner but motherboards with number of connectors that I needed were much more expensive. Ended up with 5700G which price dropped much more than 5700X's.
My guess is that builds with 13600K will be significantly pricier, so 5900X might still make sense. Well, that will probably be the case even more so with Zen 4.


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