# Jaeger or Metropolis Ark 1 ?



## Mars (Apr 7, 2018)

I'm tempted by both libraries, and can't decide myself... 

They're in same price range, serving almost the same purpose. 
They both sound fantastic but Jaeger seems more "complete" to me, with legatos on brass, hybrid tools, and the ability to also write quieter music (at least it seems, in the tech demos). 

The big asset of Metropolis would be its choirs, but Jaeger has a great solo vocal...

Help :-D


----------



## damcry (Apr 7, 2018)

Depends on your need ... (no woodwinds in Jaeger)


----------



## Lionel Schmitt (Apr 7, 2018)

damcry said:


> Depends on your need ... (no woodwinds in Jaeger)


Well, and only very low register woodwinds in Ark.


----------



## Niklas (Apr 7, 2018)

Yea, it really depends on your needs.
If you wanna do quieter music aswell, don’t go for Ark I, unless you’re planning to also buy Ark II

I also think Ark I has a more wet, old school epic music sound, while Jaeger is more focused, dry and modern, aimed for real hybrid stuff.

But its a hard one, I often tend to combine them.
If you don’t feel you must have woodwinds, I propably would have bought Jaeger (as you said, it is more complete, I haven’t bought a more consistent and relevant library) and the Oceania choir, which is on sale now


----------



## aelwyn (Apr 7, 2018)

Wow, that is a tough one. I've already got all three Arks (which I love), but I'd like to pick up Jaeger soon. If I didn't have any of them, I'd definitely have a tough time deciding where to start. If your own needs don't dictate which is the better fit for you right off the bat, maybe flip a coin? :D

(I'm only half joking.)


----------



## dcoscina (Apr 7, 2018)

Jaeger is ironically a very natural sounding library even though it was intended for trailer music. There are also lots of sounds that are very well suited to that genre of course but I have been using the string legatos (only vlns and vc at this time) along with the vocal Hangar quite a lot. Ark I is a library I use a ton of because of its sheer massive sound but recognize that it's mf to fff dynamic range, rather than Jaeger's pp-ff range. 

It's a real toss up because each library has its strengths.


----------



## AlexanderSchiborr (Apr 7, 2018)

I think MA1 is really the stuff where you want to go through the ceiling. If you don´t care too much about writing quiter parts then I can recommend it a lot. But (though I don´t have it) I like Jaeger too, but for other reasons.


----------



## ChrisSiuMusic (Apr 7, 2018)

I have the MA's and not Jaeger, but Metropolis can do everything I need when it comes to epic music. The choirs they come with are wonderful as well!


----------



## Erick - BVA (Apr 7, 2018)

dcoscina said:


> Jaeger is ironically a very natural sounding library even though it was intended for trailer music. There are also lots of sounds that are very well suited to that genre of course but I have been using the string legatos (only vlns and vc at this time) along with the vocal Hangar quite a lot. Ark I is a library I use a ton of because of its sheer massive sound but recognize that it's mf to fff dynamic range, rather than Jaeger's pp-ff range.
> 
> It's a real toss up because each library has its strengths.



I think organic and natural can be a very good thing in trailer music because it can help the music be more emotional, which is more enthralling and attractive. Music that is too electronic and synthetic can sometimes feel detached and robotic (even if on the foreground it seems "intense!!!!"). I may be kind of a subconsious effect, but I think it matters.


----------



## Niklas (Apr 7, 2018)

Sibelius19 said:


> I think organic and natural can be a very good thing in trailer music because it can help the music be more emotional, which is more enthralling and attractive. Music that is too electronic and synthetic can sometimes feel detached and robotic (even if on the foreground it seems "intense!!!!"). I may be kind of a subconsious effect, but I think it matters.


Indeed. And the beautiful legato in Jaeger really adds to that.
Also, IMO, a common misconception about the hybrid side of epic music is that bigger is better.
Ark I is huuuge and rather wet, which is perfect for orchestral epic music. In hybrid, you’ll need focus and clarity to compete with all the synths and fx, which you’ll lose with a too big and messy setting. That’s why, IMO, libs like Jaeger suits well for hybrid.


----------



## Sopranos (Apr 7, 2018)

Seems obvious but have you watched Daniel James videos on both (if he has them)? Typically very in-depth and I'm guessing you would come out with a decision made after watching.


----------



## chris massa (Apr 7, 2018)

I had the same decision to make and after watching Daniel James reviews, I purchased Jaeger. I can make wet sounds with efx and having Albion One and some other libraries the woodwinds will be covered for now. The solo voice is great in Jaeger and now I will hunt up a choir if I need to. Jaeger seemed like a tad more bang for my buck.


----------



## kavinsky (Apr 7, 2018)

I'd suggest Jaeger. Ark1 while being great, is very niche and OT has a particular taste in sound/performance that's definitely not for everyone. Listen to as much demos and you can and decide which one speaks to you


----------



## dcoscina (Apr 8, 2018)

I think this is a hard decision btw. I have both (actually all 3 Arks to be specific) and I dunno if I could choose if faced with only getting one of them. I've pretty much replaced my legato strings with Jaeger vlns and celli because they work so nicely and because they have a reasonably dryer sound, I can apply things like SPACES on them to conform to a different room setting.


----------



## Erick - BVA (Apr 8, 2018)

dcoscina said:


> I think this is a hard decision btw. I have both (actually all 3 Arks to be specific) and I dunno if I could choose if faced with only getting one of them. I've pretty much replaced my legato strings with Jaeger vlns and celli because they work so nicely and because they have a reasonably dryer sound, I can apply things like SPACES on them to conform to a different room setting.


I was really looking to get ARK 2 one of these days, but everyone's positive comments on JAEGER has me wondering if I should get that instead. So Jaeger is for hybrid orchestral trailers and soundtracks, but is also capable of the more "intimate" music? If I just wanted something more intimate and quiet, should I just go with ARK 2? I love Albion 5, but I'd also love something a little less peculiar (which I assume ARK 2 is a little more traditional compared to Albion 5).
I know it would be much pricier, but what if it were a choice between ARK 1 and 2 together, or JAEGER?
Basically....does JAEGER and all of the variety of things it does -is it enough to justify the price? Or is it a jack of all trades and a master of none? If there are better tools at each individual thing Jaeger does, then I may spend more in the long run, but I'd rather get better quality over convenience.


----------



## dcoscina (Apr 8, 2018)

Sibelius19 said:


> I was really looking to get ARK 2 one of these days, but everyone's positive comments on JAEGER has me wondering if I should get that instead. So Jaeger is for hybrid orchestral trailers and soundtracks, but is also capable of the more "intimate" music? If I just wanted something more intimate and quiet, should I just go with ARK 2? I love Albion 5, but I'd also love something a little less peculiar (which I assume ARK 2 is a little more traditional compared to Albion 5).
> I know it would be much pricier, but what if it were a choice between ARK 1 and 2 together, or JAEGER?
> Basically....does JAEGER and all of the variety of things it does -is it enough to justify the price? Or is it a jack of all trades and a master of none? If there are better tools at each individual thing Jaeger does, then I may spend more in the long run, but I'd rather get better quality over convenience.


Ark II is good and I love the alto flute solo legato along with some of the softer choir patches. I admittedly don't use it very much compared to Ark I and III however. 

Jaeger has a very different sound. As I mentioned earlier, it's actually capable of tackling different genres and its only real limitation is the lack of woodwinds. Strange it also lacks timpani samples in the percussion section. Aside from that, it's a terrific library and has exceeded my expectations personally.


----------



## FriFlo (Apr 8, 2018)

Sopranos said:


> Seems obvious but have you watched Daniel James videos on both (if he has them)? Typically very in-depth and I'm guessing you would come out with a decision made after watching.


No, those are not in depth reviews, those are "unboxings" ...


----------



## Sopranos (Apr 9, 2018)

FriFlo said:


> No, those are not in depth reviews, those are "unboxings" ...


I never called them "reviews"  lol. Whatever they are, they're in-depth.


----------



## Erick - BVA (Apr 9, 2018)

Sopranos said:


> I never called them "reviews"  lol. Whatever they are, they're in-depth.


I would call them comprehensive "sound tests." Whatever you call them, they are useful, regardless of what SF or HZ say.


----------



## fretti (Apr 9, 2018)

If you haven't check them, I think the articulation lists might help to see what library satisfies your needs more than the other (MA1 only low and high strings, therefor very big sounding as they are octaved; Jaeger all individual Sections etc.). 
http://www.orchestraltools.com/resources/documents/Metropolis_Ark_1.pdf (as it is more hidden I think)
Jaeger is obviously on the main page of the library at Audio Imperia so I guess you at least saw that one already.

As I only own Ark1 so far I can only judge that one personally, but it is a very usefull tool to just take out of the box and instantly make your project sound bigger, darker, more epic etc. depending on what you need right now. But yeah the quiet (and also very high) stuff is not that big represented...


----------



## Sosimple88 (Apr 9, 2018)

Ark 1 is a must. I don't have Jaeger, and it looks pretty cool too.


----------



## Mike Fox (Apr 9, 2018)

All I can say is that there is nothing like the choirs in Ark 1. They're the best on the market, imho.

Regardless, I would buy whichever library sounds best to you.


----------



## Sosimple88 (Apr 11, 2018)

Mike Fox said:


> All I can say is that there is nothing like the choirs in Ark 1. They're the best on the market, imho.
> 
> Regardless, I would buy whichever library sounds best to you.


You're right, the Ark 1 choir is really something.


----------



## Michael Antrum (Apr 11, 2018)

Sosimple88 said:


> You're right, the Ark 1 choir is really something.



When I want to freak the wife out a bit I play a bit of “The Omen” with the Ark I choir. It doesn’t take long for a ‘cease and desist’ order to be issued, often with various threats attached.

She really doesn’t like that film......


----------



## Daniel James (Apr 11, 2018)

FriFlo said:


> No, those are not in depth reviews, those are "unboxings" ...



I get that you are being facetious for...lulz I guess?

But those are overviews, an in depth look a the libraries with prepared examples. HZS was a First Look which is close to an unboxing as you mentioned, crack open the library and see whats there. I was planning initially to do an overview for HZS....but yeah, fuck that.

JAEGER is good if you want to have a solid set of bread and butter sounds with which to layer ontop of. ARK1 is a great library if you focus on big sounding music, but you can't really take it quiet with any ease.

-DJ


----------



## FriFlo (Apr 11, 2018)

Daniel James said:


> I get that you are being facetious for...lulz I guess?
> -DJ


Yeah, that's me, I guess! 
Thanks! But I am quite set with sample libraries - especially strings. My GAS is so bad, I even bought Synchron strings (don't start another fight, guys! I am just not taking everything serious in this forum any more ...). If I combine all string libraries I got, the number of "virtual players" is even higher than HZS. Next, I will purchase a string orchestra at my disposal for 24/7! 
Regarding this HZS thing ... let it go, Daniel!


Daniel James said:


> ...but yeah, fuck that.


And watch your language, son!


----------



## Mars (Apr 11, 2018)

Thanks for your answers guys !!
Choice is hard to make, but I want to try to write hybrid and trailer music for a while and I think Jaeger is the only "all-in-one" package for that (great value for money, at least it seems). 
I've got woodwinds on the side if needed, and Storm Choir 1 will be enough for now in terms of choirs... 

And when I'll be bored by hybrid music I still could use it for layering my other libraries


----------



## KEM (Apr 12, 2018)

I was gonna mention the lack of Woodwinds, but if you’ve got a library to cover that already I’d suggest Jaeger, I don’t have either, but from listening to both it just sounds stronger to me, but you can’t go wrong with either one.


----------



## Parsifal666 (Apr 26, 2018)

I just bought Ark 1 the other day...I don't know much about Jaeger, but if you want an all in one Epic library, you've found it. I'm working toward adding other libraries to it (naturally the high winds, xylophones, etc. that are part of my style). The problem is that Ark sounds so great as a standalone one tends to not WANT to mess with it. It's great in and of itself. In that sense it's like Iceni (which is also excellent btw), however those two library's each feature that pronounced room sound. 

Ark 1, however...you can do more with it than Iceni, and I'm not just saying because of the choirs. In fact, had I known about Ark before I bought Iceni and Albion One I would never have bought them (and good riddance to the latter, great legato woodwinds nonwithstanding).


----------



## sostenuto (Apr 26, 2018)

What Woodwinds can work well with _Jaeger _?
I currently have NI_Symphony Essentials, NI_FactLib-VSL WW, Albion One, BO_Inspire ….
I am at '_non-*pro*'_ level …  (per today's landslide SF discussion) … perhaps I have some good choices already ?


----------



## dcoscina (Apr 27, 2018)

sostenuto said:


> What Woodwinds can work well with _Jaeger _?
> I currently have NI_Symphony Essentials, NI_FactLib-VSL WW, Albion One, BO_Inspire ….
> I am at '_non-*pro*'_ level …  (per today's landslide SF discussion) … perhaps I have some good choices already ?


I think what you have is fine for Jaeger. The orchestra was recorded in a modest sized hall so it doesn't sound too drowned out in reverb which makes it a good match for several other libraries (and third party reverbs). 

I don't know if they specifically put a time line on the woodwinds addition to Jaeger but I do recall someone from Audio Imperia making mention of adding that down the line.


----------



## sostenuto (Apr 27, 2018)

dcoscina said:


> I think what you have is fine for Jaeger. The orchestra was recorded in a modest sized hall so it doesn't sound too drowned out in reverb which makes it a good match for several other libraries (and third party reverbs).
> 
> I don't know if they specifically put a time line on the woodwinds addition to Jaeger but I do recall someone from Audio Imperia making mention of adding that down the line.



Good to hear ! The 'modest sized' Hall was not known and is positive for current needs/interests. The WW shortcoming is so obvious, Audio Imperia must surely have that high on their to-do list. 

Thanks and regards


----------



## Brian Nowak (Apr 28, 2018)

Metropolis Ark 1 or Audio Imperia Jaeger?

Yes, is the only real answer that can be given here. It's not like one or the other is going to be a terrible experience for you. 

It just comes down to preferences and what you want out of the user experience. To my ear (I don't personally own Jaeger) Jaeger has a slick, modern, neutral sound, with an edge on flexibility of use as it covers more dynamic range and has separated strings. The strings do sound nice. But also, to my ear, Jaeger risks sounding kind of generic, or characterless, in certain cases. Not BAD, but just kind of middle-of-the-road for orchestral sounds. When I hear it, I think "well that sounds nice" but it doesn't really wow me. Again, that's just a personal reaction and people will disagree.

Ark 1, while more flexible than it's often given credit for, has a definite character to it. Big, in-your-face sound right out of the gates. And that's for better or worse. Some people heavily criticize all the Arks for having _too much _character, and I can see why they might feel that way. It really depends on whether you like the character or not. I personally do, as I have them all and don't necessarily feel like I NEED more epic stuff when it comes to orchestra. Every time I use the Arks it brings a stupid smile to my face. 

You can see how personal this whole matter becomes. But again, it's not a life-or-death decision. If I had ended up with Jaeger I'm sure I would have written a lot of music with it and been totally happy. And lots of people are doing just that.

One thing of note, though - both Jaeger and Ark 1 are a touch on the light side of great percussion representation. Ark 3 makes up for the lack in percussion detail for Ark 1 (plus a whole lot more), and Audio Imperia's answer to Jaeger's lack of percussion has been to re-record Decimator Drums in the same hall as Jaeger for a re-release. So either way, expect to need more stuff if you truly want to get the job done.


----------



## MarcusD (Apr 28, 2018)

I share your pain, brother. Also can't decide between Ark 3 or Jaeger...


----------



## Brian Nowak (Apr 28, 2018)

MarcusD said:


> I share your pain, brother. Also can't decide between Ark 3 or Jaeger...



Do you have Ark 1?


----------



## MarcusD (Apr 28, 2018)

Brian Nowak said:


> Do you have Ark 1?



Unfortunatly no. I'm torn between the huge character of Ark 3, and Jaegers clean sound / amazing legato patches. I can see myself using both.


----------



## Brian Nowak (Apr 28, 2018)

MarcusD said:


> Unfortunatly no. I'm torn between the huge character of Ark 3, and Jaegers clean sound / amazing legato patches. I can see myself using both.



While Ark 3 is a very big sounding library, it is an odd place to start with the Arks, in my opinion. It's not that you can't make cool music with it. You certainly can. But there are no true longs or legatos in the whole library, and the library is very much more geared toward massive hits, rhythmic pulses, swells, dynamic motion, etc. Ark 3 pairs beautifully with Ark 1, however. Each one compliments the other quite nicely.

If you aren't interested in Ark 1, then between Ark 3 and Jaeger I'd go Jaeger without hesitation. You'll just get a lot more use out of it - I guarantee it.


----------



## MarcusD (Apr 29, 2018)

Brian Nowak said:


> While Ark 3 is a very big sounding library, it is an odd place to start with the Arks, in my opinion. It's not that you can't make cool music with it. You certainly can. But there are no true longs or legatos in the whole library, and the library is very much more geared toward massive hits, rhythmic pulses, swells, dynamic motion, etc. Ark 3 pairs beautifully with Ark 1, however. Each one compliments the other quite nicely.
> 
> If you aren't interested in Ark 1, then between Ark 3 and Jaeger I'd go Jaeger without hesitation. You'll just get a lot more use out of it - I guarantee it.



For individual orchestral sections I'm pretty much covered with 8DIO, Cinesamples and ton of different percussion libs. I'm after something that will serve as the main backbone to my template, that'll blend well. I think you're quite right in your recommendation, Jaeger does have the edge in that respect.


----------



## Brian Nowak (Apr 29, 2018)

MarcusD said:


> For individual orchestral sections I'm pretty much covered with 8DIO, Cinesamples and ton of different percussion libs. I'm after something that will serve as the main backbone to my template, that'll blend well. I think you're quite right in your recommendation, Jaeger does have the edge in that respect.



Yep. Ark 1 is the "backbone" though it is geared toward friggin butt-screaming loud. 

Ark 3 would be a great addition to what you already have, mind you. But it's just a little more specific in its use. 

Ark 3 percussion is pretty damn amazing though. I picked it up at the intro sale and added on a loyalty coupon. For the price I paid the percussion alone was worth the price of admission.


----------



## Parsifal666 (Apr 29, 2018)

Brian Nowak said:


> Yep. Ark 1 is the "backbone" though it is geared toward friggin butt-screaming loud.
> 
> Ark 3 would be a great addition to what you already have, mind you. But it's just a little more specific in its use.
> 
> Ark 3 percussion is pretty damn amazing though. I picked it up at the intro sale and added on a loyalty coupon. For the price I paid the percussion alone was worth the price of admission.



The choirs are the blow-you-away part of Ark 1 imo (and I've been an EWSCP sycophant for ages). If you plan on writing beyond-Omen music Ark might be PRECISELY what you need. The brass is terrific, strings really good, band okay (I like the drum kit). The percussion can be good, but I have so many great percussion libraries.

For its high points, was it worth 700 US to me? Unreservedly yes, and this has got me hot for the OT WWs and Strings as well. The highs in Ark 1 are stellar imo.

I'd say: just get Ark 1 (especially if you're having any kind of writer's block), as it's total Epic inspiration.


----------



## Parsifal666 (Apr 29, 2018)

mikeybabes said:


> When I want to freak the wife out a bit I play a bit of “The Omen” with the Ark I choir. It doesn’t take long for a ‘cease and desist’ order to be issued, often with various threats attached.
> 
> She really doesn’t like that film......



But we're talking about god in the form of elite Jerry Goldsmith composition. That score changed the game in horror. Like it or not, the truth is immutable.


----------



## Brian Nowak (Apr 29, 2018)

@Parsifal666 Ark 2 choir is also amazing but in a very different way. 

I have Ark-itis.


----------



## Parsifal666 (Apr 29, 2018)

Brian Nowak said:


> @Parsifal666 Ark 2 choir is also amazing but in a very different way.
> 
> I have Ark-itis.



I'm curious about both 2 and 3. But as you can probably guess, Brian, having just purchased 1 I have a LOT of fun and composing ahead of me 

Thanks though, will definitely check out 2.


----------



## Michael Antrum (Apr 29, 2018)

Parsifal666 said:


> But we're talking about god in the form of elite Jerry Goldsmith composition. That score changed the game in horror. Like it or not, the truth is immutable.



It one of the few films (along with the sequel) that got to me as a horror film. The other was the Exorcist. The really creeped me out - but I was young at the time.


----------



## Brian Nowak (Apr 29, 2018)

I had sold a bunch of modular gear so my money was burning a hole right through my wallet.

I think I lasted 72 hours before I had 2, and another 72 before I had 3.

Yikes.


----------



## Parsifal666 (Apr 29, 2018)

Brian Nowak said:


> I had sold a bunch of modular gear so my money was burning a hole right through my wallet.
> 
> I think I lasted 72 hours before I had 2, and another 72 before I had 3.
> 
> Yikes.



BEEN there lol! I think I'm getting better at spacing things out though, last sample library I bought before this was Spitfire BHOT (and that is one library that kept me inspired for MONTHS).

You should have seen me with synths...I had TONS, total buying spree of like the top 15 in the Music Radar survey a few years ago. Plus, when got hooked on Evo 2 I bought all of them (and only regretted 1).


----------



## Parsifal666 (Apr 29, 2018)

For everyone interested in Ark 1, don't listen to my dumb ass, @Ashermusic knows what the hell he's talking about:

https://ask.audio/articles/review-orchestral-tools-metropolis-ark-1


----------



## midi-et-quart (Apr 29, 2018)

IMO you should get MA1 if you already have some basic orchestral libraries containing your bread and butter (longs, shorts, legatos, staccatos etc...).

This library will spice your whole production up as the sample do contain an inherent force to them which you can't fake with distortion or other effects.

Take Jaeger if you don't have your bread and butter yet... and want to get some cool solo vocals by Merethe Solvedt. But this is just a bonus IMO, you shouldn't base your opinion on that.


----------



## sostenuto (Apr 29, 2018)

For same usd ….. much more confident with Ark1 choice until Jaeger Woodwinds added, and many more reviews and critiques. Ark 1 is getting some age, but has also stood the test of time, and voluminous evaluations ….. 

While not uncomfortable with Audio Imperia, equal pricing is very tough to accept, given OT /ARK credentials and impact of Euro pricing for USA customers.


----------



## Asterixobelix (Feb 11, 2020)

As a owner if MA1, I will disagree with the most.
People here confuse epic with big sections or loudness.

Here is an explanation...
Are TSFH tracks epic? - Yes.
Will you create it with MA1? - No way.

Thomas and Nick use fast spiccatos, much detailed, thin sounding instruments that sound huge together, but still those details are there.
MA1 will not let you have details, nor you will write fast runs with this library, it can just create lazy, sustained epic tracks, and you can use some percussion to compensate lack of spiccato runs.

Strings - Jaeger owned MA1.
Brass - Jaeger can go huge like MA1, but MA1 can't go detailed and soft like Jaeger.
Choir/Vocal - Solo wins Jaeger, Choir wins MA1.
Percussion - Jaeger has detailed percussion, MA1 has so called epic hits, that are deep impacts actually, and some other percussion, but Jaeger definitely wins here.

If I knew what I know now, I would buy Jaeger and Talos instead MA1, and to repeat myself, Jaeger is dry and detailed, can go almost as big as MA1, just reverb it, and MA1 advantage is in hall sound (reverb can't get this) and good choirs.

Whoever will disagree, do not bring me high strings unison patch spiccato run, but let me hear your ark cellos on 180BPM with fast run, without it glitching.
Good luck with that 8va low strings patch.

It is huge miss for this library, exactly that low strings 8va patch, if it was unison, and a bit shorter and a bit less harsh...wishes...


----------



## ProfoundSilence (Feb 11, 2020)

this is a weird necro my friend. let it stay dead lol


----------



## Crowe (Aug 19, 2020)

Never


----------

