# Spitfire Solo Strings: How I learned to stop worrying and love vibrato



## ism (Sep 15, 2018)

So the short version here, is that after a lot of experimenting, and via a "performance vibrato" script that I've developed, I think I've finally managed to get my head around the vibrato in Spitfire solo strings. And found a way to make it much more playable 'out-of-the-box'. Here's my first attempt at a piece that crafts vibrato phrasings using this script:




UPDATE: taking on board some on the suggestion below, this version improves the arcs:





It's (once again) more of a noodle than an actual composition, but I think that compared to those earlier legato noodlings that I posted, the phrasing and the dynamics and the overall performances are all vastly, vastly improved (and much more satisfying to perform).


But the interesting point here is that, thanks to the "performance vibrato" script, this piece is entirely performed using only the mod wheel (and occasional touches of the sustain pedal) - ie without even thinking about touching the cc21 vibrato slider.

So musically - well the obvious point is that using the vibrato makes a huge difference. Crafting a phrase with both the dynamic layers and the vibrato gives you an expressivity more than the sum of it parts - it really feels like a much, much more expressive instrument that when I was using dynamics alone.

Perhaps less obviously is that there's an expressive quality in the way I've worked to shape these lines that I really love, and that even instruments like the Joshua Bell or Virharmonic violins simply can't match. Of course these instruments can play smoother and faster lines than the Spitfire solo strings instruments, but neither gives you anywhere near the same ability to craft expressive details across both dynamics and vibrato. To be sure, Spitfire is rawer and messier, and definately not what I would use for a Mozart concerto. But for this particular type of expressivity and sonority - which I'm not quite sure what to call - I'm really starting to love these instruments.

On a more technical level, my initial evaluation of the "performance vibrato" script is that it really gives the instruments an "out-of-the-box playability" that you just don't get when you have to abandon the mod wheel and instead juggle a pair of cc sliders. Or at least, a playabilty that *I* just don't get when I have to mess about with an additional slider - your mileage may vary.

I can share more details about the script if anyone's interested, but the basic idea is this: it attempts to bake in a form of progressive vibrato as a kind of 'default phrasing', which it infers from the mod wheel alone. When you want to depart from this default progressive vibrato, you can use the sustain pedal. But note that I only use the pedal a handful of times in the above piece. So the hope is that, at least for a certain style of phrasing, most of the time you will only need to think about finessing a performance with the mod wheel, relieving you of the extra dimension of cognitive overhead that comes with putting vibrato on its own cc21 slider.


The upshot of all of this (and why I've spent so much time on it) is not just an improved 'out-of-the-box' playability. Its that I find it really helps when I attempt to compose not just at the level of notes and counterpoint, but at the level of nuances of phrasing and performance. I suppose I'm trying to get back to that sense I had when I used to write for acoustic guitar. Once I became skilled enough, at some point I realized that I wasn't just bashing out chords any more, but instead looking for sounds and textures, and nuances, and then finding chords and notes to build around them.


Which is ultimately the real sweet spot that sold me instantly on this library. (And which makes me more jealous of real string players than ever).



Curious to know what anyone else makes of this - especially any real string players ( @thesteelydane - any thoughts? ).

UPDATE 2: with a few more tweaks to the script, but mostly after developing a better sense of idiomatic arcs, this demo (discussed below) gets closer to what I think is a wonderfully lyrical sweet spot of this lib.


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## jbuhler (Sep 15, 2018)

ism said:


> I can share more details about the script if anyone's interested, but the basic idea is this: it attempts to bake in a form of progressive vibrato as a kind of 'default phrasing', which it infers from the mod wheel alone. When you want to depart from this default progressive vibrato, you can use the sustain pedal. But note that I only use the pedal a handful of times in the above piece. So the hope is that, at least for a certain style of phrasing, most of the time you will only need to think about finessing a performance with the mod wheel, relieving you of the extra dimension of cognitive overhead that comes with putting vibrato on its own cc21 slider.


I would definitely be interested in seeing what you did with the script insofar as you are willing to show it. I've struggled mightily with the vibrato in this library, which I otherwise quite like, and have had occasional success but nothing that is exactly predictable and it usually takes me several attempts to program it so that it comes in naturally (and I admit that it sometimes defeats me).


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## Bill the Lesser (Sep 15, 2018)

Congratulations ism! That's some subtle coding! I can sense the players watching each others' wrists. Very "real" feel to that piece.


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## prodigalson (Sep 15, 2018)

the expression seems very exaggerated in the demo but I assume from your description that is more to do with the mod wheel than the script?


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## ism (Sep 15, 2018)

jbuhler said:


> I would definitely be interested in seeing what you did with the script insofar as you are willing to show it. I've struggled mightily with the vibrato in this library, which I otherwise quite like, and have had occasional success but nothing that is exactly predictable and it usually takes me several attempts to program it so that it comes in naturally (and I admit that it sometimes defeats me).



Yes, I find the vibrato is the most difficult thing to work with in this library myself

Happy to share the script - I'll write up some documentation in the next day or so. Curious to see if it anyone else finds it as helpful as I do, or if its just me.


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## ism (Sep 15, 2018)

Bill the Lesser said:


> Congratulations ism! That's some subtle coding! I can sense the players watching each others' wrists. Very "real" feel to that piece.




Thanks! Hey do string players really do that or is it just an expression? Either way, it's a nice image, and it captures that sense of trying to get not just the notes to work together as a chord, but the phrasing and nuances. Obvious to actual musicians I'm sure, but kind of a new revelation to me in working with solo string samples.


And the best thing here is that there is no subtle coding involved at all - neither in the script itself (where the algorithm turns out to be remarkably simple) nor in the midi programming (of which there is none, its all performance, with maybe the occasional tweaking).

The need for subtly get shifted to the mod wheel, which does add some complexity in that it requires a bit more finesse to account for the vibrato. But it feels to me like a *musical* complexity - the complexity of a performance, whereas juggling another cc always feels like a *technical* complexity, closer to midi programming that musical performance.

(Which is maybe what you meant in there first place  )


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## ism (Sep 15, 2018)

prodigalson said:


> the expression seems very exaggerated in the demo but I assume from your description that is more to do with the mod wheel than the script?




There are a few places that could obviously stand some tweaking to reign them in a bit. I would just call them imperfections in the performance. (It's always easier to hear these after the fact that when I'm in the middle of it.)

But there's also the sense that, this being an exercise in understanding the interactions of the dynamics and the vibrato, I've perhaps found it useful to have the dynamic effects as visible as possible. So maybe that's what you mean.


But I guess the simple answer is that the script doesn't affect the dynamics at all (*) so any exaggeration is, one way or another, all down to my playing. 


(*) except, technically, I guess for a tweak to the relatively volumes of vib and non vib. It isn't always perfect, but I hear this more as a (not at all unpleasant) warblyness of, rather than an exaggeration of, the dynamics.


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## DynamicK (Sep 16, 2018)

Is your script for the new SF Solo Strings or the Legacy Solo Strings from a few years ago?


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## Nite Sun (Sep 16, 2018)

Very nice tone and an interesting piece!

Personally I find the constant shifts in dynamic a bit distracting and I think they detract from your goal of realism. I appreciate that you're trying to create movement and to avoid that pitfall of an unnaturally static sound, but it sounds a little random and unmusical. As string players we're taught to transcend the limitations of the bow - to create the illusion of long overarching phrases, albeit with subtle swerves and swells here and there. String instruments are a lot like the voice in this sense. You wouldn't want to keep swelling within each note you sing otherwise it'd sound a bit comical and seasick. In the opening solo violin passage you're quite often swelling two or three times per note. Another thing that sounds slightly odd is the frequent diminuendos you have right before a change of note. This can be nice occasionally, but it is a little unidiomatic to do it every note. More often string players do a little tiny smooth swell before changing notes/bows. Btw are you modulating C11 or C1 (or both?) It sounds to me as if you're modulating C11 too wildly which produces a slightly odd sound where the intensity/timbre of the note remains the same while you have these abrupt volume changes. The resultant effect is more like the position of the mic being moved than expression by means of bow speed and pressure. IMO CC11 should be used for broad/subtle/smooth/gradual dynamic shifts (if at all!) and CC1 should be used to simulate the bowing and more granular level of phrasing.

Hope that doesn't sound too critical!


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## ism (Sep 16, 2018)

Nite Sun said:


> Very nice tone and an interesting piece!
> 
> Personally I find the constant shifts in dynamic a bit distracting and I think they detract from your goal of realism. I appreciate that you're trying to create movement and to avoid that pitfall of an unnaturally static sound, but it sounds a little random and unmusical. As string players we're taught to transcend the limitations of the bow - to create the illusion of long overarching phrases, albeit with subtle swerves and swells here and there. String instruments are a lot like the voice in this sense. You wouldn't want to keep swelling within each note you sing otherwise it'd sound a bit comical and seasick. In the opening solo violin passage you're quite often swelling two or three times per note. Another thing that sounds slightly odd is the frequent diminuendos you have right before a change of note. This can be nice occasionally, but it is a little unidiomatic to do it every note. More often string players do a little tiny smooth swell before changing notes/bows. Btw are you modulating C11 or C1 (or both?) It sounds to me as if you're modulating C11 too wildly which produces a slightly odd sound where the intensity/timbre of the note remains the same while you have these abrupt volume changes. The resultant effect is more like the position of the mic being moved than expression by means of bow speed and pressure. IMO CC11 should be used for broad/subtle/smooth/gradual dynamic shifts and CC1 should be used to simulate the bowing and more granular level of phrasing.
> 
> Hope that doesn't sound too critical!




Thanks - that's really helpful! I'm going to take some time work through all of that before replying properly, but it's exactly the kind of critique I was hoping for.

Quick question though - accepting your critiques, do you think you think any of them apply specifically to the passage specifically between roughly 0:56 - 1:10 ?


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## ism (Sep 16, 2018)

DynamicK said:


> Is your script for the new SF Solo Strings or the Legacy Solo Strings from a few years ago?



It should work with both. But the old library was really designed only as the soaring melody over an orchestral section, it has only a single dynamic layers, and non-vib legato was, I understand, only added as an afterthought. So the script might helpful in avoiding the inconvenience of cc21, but you're obviously not going to get anything like performability of the new library.


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## LamaRose (Sep 16, 2018)

I really like the tone and progression you've achieved, but have to agree with @Nite Sun on how it's applied in your example. I'd like to hear what you/your script could do with something like this, which I believe better illustrates the capability of what you've created:


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## Nite Sun (Sep 16, 2018)

ism said:


> Thanks - that's really helpful! I'm going to take some time work through all of that before replying properly, but it's exactly the kind of critique I was hoping for.
> 
> Quick question though - accepting your critiques, do you think you think any of them apply specifically to the passage specifically between roughly 0:56 - 1:10 ?



0:56 - 1.03 sounds great! Then from 1.04 this unnatural lumpiness comes into play a bit again. Think of the bow as needing constant but smooth/gradual movement. Sudden changes in bow speed and pressure are reserved for things like fortepianos, subito pianos, sfz, accents, martele, not so much normal lyrical phrasing. Just my view as violin player, feel free to disagree


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## ism (Sep 18, 2018)

A quick update: I've been working on refining the dynamics (more on which soon), but in the process I've stumbled on enhancement to the script that I think improves the playability enough to merit its own post.

So here's a little demo that shows the improvement:




This is completely off the cuff, and a *very* crude noodling (even by my standards). It uses only the mod wheel, and the midi is completely unedited. There are a few glitches, most of which could easily be fixed in the midi (or by playing with a little more finesse) but the point was show how easily you can get this expressiveness, particularly across the dynamic layers, so I just left it raw. Notwithstanding a few glitches then, I think this is very playable, and very expressive.

The improvement hinges on the ability to shape phrases across use all three dynamic layers - its a little bit hard to describe the experience of playing (I really will share the script shortly), but whereas the first demo hinged on the lower two dynamic layers, this one crafts phrases across all three.


The only new thing the script is doing is reigning in the upper dynamics a bit through a simple 'midi compression' (the only twist being that it distinguishes between the lower and the upper 2 dynamic layers).


This relates to the exaggerated dynamics that people have noted on this thread. While most of the exaggerated dynamics turned out to be just a lack of subtlety in my playing, I eventually realized that at least some of the bumpiness was related the need to reach for the higher dynamic layer. So a 'dynamic layer-aware' compression was an easy fix.


(I'll share the script shortly - just one more tweak first ... )


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## thesteelydane (Sep 19, 2018)

It's a little over the top and very old-school wide - especially on the short notes. We practice for years to be able to vibrate even the short notes in a phrase, but in reality short notes always get far less vibrato or none at all. The very beginnings of notes shouldn't have any vibrato at all, if you want it to be realistic - especially after a position change. 

Other than that, it sounds very transparent for being scripted, well done!


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## marcocaricola (Sep 21, 2018)

hey everyone! @ism very interested in the scripting work you are carrying on with this - would be glad to try it out too! I've also found the vibrato to be the most painful part of programming with SSS... 

Could you explain the function of the sustain pedal a bit? does holding CC64 temporarily revert to the normal patch? I guess one solution could be to bypass the script when playing short notes, so to make those less vib?


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## ism (Dec 30, 2018)

Hi All,
Sorry this has taken so long. Just about to release this - but if anyone would like to play with a 'beta' version (if that's even a sensible term for such a simple script), feel free to PM me.

Note that it's currently just for logic (ksp version should be straight forward though once its nailed down in logic ).


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## ism (May 3, 2019)

Another silly little noodle - but this time using only two sustain patches - the Vl (1st desk) + a little bit of the Va at the end:




For all that this library can have sound terrible the first time you start plonking away, with a little care to not play like it's a piano, the sustain patches it turns out are actually capable of quite a bit of subtlety.

There's a few points that if I were developing this would certainly benefit from the legato. But the point is that when sketching, the performance vibrato script lets you avoid the cognitive overhead of cc21 changes- and even in something like this there are dozens of vib/non vib shifts - and focus on the musicality, which I think here is about the sweetness and dynamic texture, quite a lot of which hinges on the shape of the dynamic arcs - which in turn hinge on varying the vibrato idiomatically, which is an absolute necessity in this library.


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## kriskrause (May 3, 2019)

Hey, @ism, did you ever release your script? I picked this library up during the winter wishlist sale and would love to try it out!


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## ism (May 4, 2019)

kriskrause said:


> Hey, @ism, did you ever release your script? I picked this library up during the winter wishlist sale and would love to try it out!



pm'd you


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## Dex (May 4, 2019)

Is the script only for this library, or can it be applied to other libraries as well?


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## Fitz (May 4, 2019)

Is the vibrato a deal breaker on this library? I was thinking of picking it up on their sale


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## ism (May 4, 2019)

Dex said:


> Is the script only for this library, or can it be applied to other libraries as well?



The actual script is quite specific to this lib, in that it hardcodes the cc boundaries between dynamic layers and that sort of thing. 

It's possible that that the basic algorithm might be adapted in other contexts, but there are a number of factors that would another library would have to meet.


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## ism (May 4, 2019)

Fitz said:


> Is the vibrato a deal breaker on this library? I was thinking of picking it up on their sale



In what sense?


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## Fitz (May 4, 2019)

ism said:


> In what sense?


I see a lot of talk about too much vibrato etc. does it have s good sound / usable and is worth buying? I don’t have solo strings ATM


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## MatFluor (May 4, 2019)

@ism I would be very interested in the script as well - are you planning a public release or is it more a "ask and you shall receive" basis?


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## The Darris (May 5, 2019)

Concerning Spitfire's vibrato features in their libraries:

It's important to note that their vibrato "fader" doesn't really dial in vibrato the way you would for something like dynamics. It's basically an on/off switch with a quick fade between the non vib and vib samples near the 50% point of the fader. I've demonstrated this every time I've reviewed a Spitfire library. Vibrato crossfading is difficult and requires a very meticulous approach to recording those types of samples needing that functionality. Spitfire tried to make a vibrato dial in their original Solo Strings but it didn't work well. So, they took the path of least resistance by making their vibrato controls simply an on or off feature while making it appear to be a blending/gradually applied feature via a fader. 

I will give it to them though, the transition from the non vib to vib samples is quick and seamless so you don't get any wonky phasing. You just simply don't get a subtle vib sound to extreme vib like you'd expect when using a fader. 

Embertone's vibrato script in their solo string libraries is my favorite in terms of artificial vibrato. It is very expressive and realistic if you know how to use vibrato correctly. However, using scripts like that on extremely ambient samples like those recorded at Air can be problematic. The last thing you'd want is to put vibrato on the natural reverb of Air. Haha, or do you?


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## constaneum (May 5, 2019)

I think Spitfire released an update with the total performance patch. the vibrato seems controllable, not about the matter of ON/OFF.


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## jbuhler (May 5, 2019)

constaneum said:


> I think Spitfire released an update with the total performance patch. the vibrato seems controllable, not about the matter of ON/OFF.


The total performance patch uses the progressive vibrato long and time machine so vibrato works completely different on that patch. The vibrato is not fully controllable but it’s got more control than the on/off of the other legato patches.


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## constaneum (May 5, 2019)

But overall I think that library sounds great. Definitely one of the best sounding solo strings libraries out there


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## ism (May 6, 2019)

Fitz said:


> Is the vibrato a deal breaker on this library? I was thinking of picking it up on their sale



So to answer this ... here's another noodle on the cello, designed to better demonstrate some of the range of nuance the vibrato is capable:




Its just a noodle, controlled only with the mod wheel (and this script that infers vibrato from the path of the mod wheel).


A few points:


1. If you give it a listen or two and you'll hear that there quite a lot of variation in how the vibrato is used. And unlike some of my previous noodle, here I'm starting to get a sense that sometimes less is more, and holding back on the vibrato can give you more subtly, and more variation in the context of the overall arc. When you want the really wide, powerful vibrato, its there. Which is good for moments of particular intensity, or when you really need it to cut through a busy orchestral mix. But early criticism of the vibrato aside, it's entirely possible to hold back and get much more subtle effects.

2. On nearly every note the vibrato switches at least twice, often more. This is quite different from most of the demos where the vibrato is shaped manually with cc21, and these to be used to shape passages, more often rather than individual notes. (I have a whole rant on how much I hate cc21, but that's another story). So while someone sufficiently skilled (ie not me) could craft these kinds of phrasings using multiple fingers on cc1 and cc21, bloody hell that sounds like hard work.

Needless to say, if you plonked this is without attending to the vibrato at all, it would sound really terrible. But again, this poor plonkability is also what gives you such great performability.


3. Vibrato is intimately connected with the idiomatic crafting of the dynamics.

So this:



The Darris said:


> It's important to note that their vibrato "fader" doesn't really dial in vibrato the way you would for something like dynamics. It's basically an on/off switch



...is absolute true. But I'll add an important nuance in that you have three dynamic layers which, depending on the instrument, have different qualities in their vibrato as well as they timbre. So if you're in a crescendo, and you shift from non-vib to vib on the softest layer, and them proceed to higher layers, you can also craft your progressive legato more that the on/off implementation suggests. Again, if you listen carefully enough to the above, you might be able discern how I'm using the dynamics to get different vibrato effects.

And a further nuance - the softest layer of this library is so quiet by default that I feel you loose much of the benefit of both the beautiful timbres of the softest layers and the softer vibrato on these layers. So the script perform a 'midi compression', bringing up the volume of the lowest layer, and down the upper two. This makes it easier to craft your arcs across all three layers, and consequently it gives you get a more nuance in crafting your vibrato phrasings.


And finally:

4. Impressionistically: noodling in these phrases this *feels* like a performance. Not like midi programming (which is part of why I hate cc21). And not like a virtual performer controlled by a midi keyboard. It takes a bit of practice, since its of course very easy to play something unidiomatic - and I would still welcome any and all critique from actual string players. But unlike my initial experiments in messing about with cc21 (or ignoring vibrato altogether), it's really become a joy to play.


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## Fitz (May 6, 2019)

Just picked up the library. The vibrato is interesting, but it seems like with proper programming, you can really make it sound realistic. The mic positions sound great as well. 

I seem to like the Violin more than the cello on first listen


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## ism (May 7, 2019)

Fitz said:


> Just picked up the library. The vibrato is interesting, but it seems like with proper programming, you can really make it sound realistic. The mic positions sound great as well.
> 
> I seem to like the Violin more than the cello on first listen



The cello is arguably the least plonkable. But it really repays a bit of effort in crafting the arcs, once you get a sense of the sweet spot of the kind of arcs it really excels at.


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## Land of Missing Parts (May 7, 2019)

I love the tone of these instruments, so it sounds great when you hold out a note. 

But to my ear, the legatos or any other change in the longs sounds really weird and disjointed.


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## ism (May 7, 2019)

Land of Missing Parts said:


> I love the tone of these instruments, so it sounds great when you hold out a note.
> 
> But to my ear, the legatos or any other change in the longs sounds really weird and disjointed.



Do you mean specifically in the above cello example, or in general?


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## Land of Missing Parts (May 7, 2019)

ism said:


> Do you mean specifically in the above cello example, or in general?


From the examples I've heard on VI Control generally. Feel free to point me toward something specific, I'd be happy to be proven wrong.


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## ism (May 7, 2019)

Land of Missing Parts said:


> From the examples I've heard on VI Control generally. Feel free to point me toward something specific.



So I'd be interested in the extend to which you're feeling the same issues in the above noodle:



There's a number of things going on here in an attempt to work with the bumpiness you're talk about. (Both in some maths at work in the Logic script, but also in the way I've learned to craft the performance around the dynamics arcs and vibrato transitions.)

Compared especially to my early noodles (and many of the early demo on vi-c) I think this is really starting to show what kind of expressiveness the library is capable of.


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## Land of Missing Parts (May 7, 2019)

ism said:


> So I'd be interested in the extend to which you're feeling the same issues in the above noodle:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I still hear the rockiness clearly in that example too. Sorry, don't mean to hate on your jam ism. 

It's the library. I think it sounds like a series of exquisitely performed and recorded notes that don't really flow well from one to another.

I also think you rule for posting these examples, especially ones that are exposed like this, as it's a ton more helpful than written opinions and assertions, and I think that we all benefit from it.


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## ism (May 7, 2019)

Land of Missing Parts said:


> I still hear the rockiness clearly in that example too. Sorry, don't mean to hate on your jam ism.
> 
> It's the library. I think it sounds like a series of exquisitely performed and recorded notes that don't really flow well from one to another.
> 
> I also think you rule for posting these examples, especially ones that are exposed like this, as it's a ton more helpful than written opinions and assertions, and I think that we all benefit from it.



Thanks for the critique.

Further question - how does this bumpiness bother you? Now granted, if this was a cellist playing a baroque piece the bumpiness in this noodle would be all wrong and, in sample library parlance, would break the "acoustic 4th wall".

But for something that's more, say, Olafur Arnalds than Bach, where a certain roughness of nuance is intentionally and necessarily a part of the musicality of the line, would that make any different, not to you perception of existence of this bumpiness, but to whether it bothers you as a unwanted, 4th-wall-breaking "rockiness", vs an acceptable, perhaps even musical, roughness of nuance.

(Kind of an abstract question, but I find this all just endless fascinating).


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## Land of Missing Parts (May 7, 2019)

ism said:


> Further question - does this bumpiness bother you?


Mostly what's on my mind is that if I bought the library, I think I'd be frustrated trying to get it to do what I want, that's all.

On the other hand, this is music--there are no strict rules if the tune works, right? It's expressive and sounds good, and if it was situated in a mix I might not even notice.

Here's a video game tune that I adore, and that has some pretty atrocious sampled strings going on. It's all good.


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## chlady (May 7, 2019)

ism said:


> pm'd you


@ism, Hi ism I too would be interested in checking out this script if its available. I have this library and tried it a few times but hasn't been getting much use because of the vibrato issues so would like to pull it out again .


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## bryanmckay (May 7, 2019)

chlady said:


> @ism, Hi ism I too would be interested in checking out this script if its available. I have this library and tried it a few times but hasn't been getting much use because of the vibrato issues so would like to pull it out again .



As would I, if you’re open to sharing!


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## jtnyc (May 8, 2019)

Glad I came across this thread. I've been eyeing Solo Strings during the current wishlist sale. The shorts sound so nice in the walkthrough, especially the violins. The one thing that kept sticking out to me in a negative way was the vibrato. I just don't like the way it sounds, in the walkthrough at least. The performance patch is pretty impressive. Are there performance patches for viola and cello as well? The regular legatos didn't blow me away either. Am I wrong there. Are they good/great? At 40% off it seems like a great deal, but I'm still very hesitant.

Any additional thoughts/comments?

Thanks -


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## jbuhler (May 8, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> Glad I came across this thread. I've been eyeing Solo Strings during the current wishlist sale. The shorts sound so nice in the walkthrough, especially the violins. The one thing that kept sticking out to me in a negative way was the vibrato. I just don't like the way it sounds, in the walkthrough at least. The performance patch is pretty impressive. Is there performance patches for viola and cello as well? The regular legatos didn't blow me away either. Am I wrong there. Are they good/great? At 40% off it seems like a great deal, but I'm still very hesitant.
> 
> Any additional thoughts/comments?
> 
> Thanks -


The total performance patch only exists for the virtuoso violin. The cello has the samples to make one as well, but it has not yet been released and there is no announcement of it. The viola does not have the samples to make a total performance patch like the one in the virtuoso violin, though they could make a legato that used time machine to control the vibrato.

As with all solo strings, the library is optimized to do certain things well. Generally, I find it credible on the kinds of spot lyrical solos you'd expect a solo string player to take up in a larger ensemble piece. And the legato is structured accordingly. The transitions between dynamic layers are often bumpy but each dynamic layer itself is quite lovely. In any event the legato sometimes doesn't work well—but usually when it doesn't work well that's because something else is also not working well. Basically, you've passed over to something that the library is not optimized to handle. 

As you'd expect from the name, the virtuoso violin handles passage work adeptly. The virtuoso violin and first chair violin also sound nicely differentiated on lyrical passages so that gives you options. 

The vibrato is the hardest thing about the library initially and it will likely at first be a turn off, but @ism's script helps for playing in real time, and I've found you can pass back and forth across the trigger point on the CC21 pretty freely and get the vibrato to behave reasonably with relatively simple programming. Indeed I think this programming works far better than it has any right to. Also in context the transition is usually suitably masked by the accompaniment that I rarely have to program CC21 with real care—just hit the approximate point vibrato would start to be noticed. In practice, I find vibrato only to be a small nuisance on these instruments. 

These are really some of my favorite SF instruments, and I use them all the time. Of course, mileage may vary and all the usual caveats.


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## jtnyc (May 8, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> The total performance patch only exists for the virtuoso violin. The cello has the samples to make one as well, but it has not yet been released and there is no announcement of it. The viola does not have the samples to make a total performance patch like the one in the virtuoso violin, though they could make a legato that used time machine to control the vibrato.
> 
> As with all solo strings, the library is optimized to do certain things well. Generally, I find it credible on the kinds of spot lyrical solos you'd expect a solo string player to take up in a larger ensemble piece. And the legato is structured accordingly. The transitions between dynamic layers are often bumpy but each dynamic layer itself is quite lovely. In any event the legato sometimes doesn't work well—but usually when it doesn't work well that's because something else is also not working well. Basically, you've passed over to something that the library is not optimized to handle.
> 
> ...


Thanks J


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## constaneum (May 9, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> Glad I came across this thread. I've been eyeing Solo Strings during the current wishlist sale. The shorts sound so nice in the walkthrough, especially the violins. The one thing that kept sticking out to me in a negative way was the vibrato. I just don't like the way it sounds, in the walkthrough at least. The performance patch is pretty impressive. Are there performance patches for viola and cello as well? The regular legatos didn't blow me away either. Am I wrong there. Are they good/great? At 40% off it seems like a great deal, but I'm still very hesitant.
> 
> Any additional thoughts/comments?
> 
> Thanks -



I end up decided not to buy . Aha


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## jtnyc (May 9, 2019)

constaneum said:


> I end up decided not to buy . Aha


Haha - me too. Now I'm eyeing Emotional Violin crossgrade with and additional 25% off sale that's on at Best Service right now, it comes in around $123.


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## ism (May 11, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> Glad I came across this thread. I've been eyeing Solo Strings during the current wishlist sale. The shorts sound so nice in the walkthrough, especially the violins. The one thing that kept sticking out to me in a negative way was the vibrato. I just don't like the way it sounds, in the walkthrough at least. The performance patch is pretty impressive. Are there performance patches for viola and cello as well? The regular legatos didn't blow me away either. Am I wrong there. Are they good/great? At 40% off it seems like a great deal, but I'm still very hesitant.
> 
> Any additional thoughts/comments?
> 
> Thanks -



There's a series of sweet spots to this library that I would call "uncompromising sonority meets as much expressiveness as possible (without compromising the sonority)".

The above cello noodle is emblematic of this. Once you figure out how to craft the arcs (and wrangle the vibrato), there's a really lovely lyrical sweet spot - and one that absolutely hinges upon fine control over the dynamics layers and the vibrato.

For comparison, while the CSSS demos are beautiful in their own right (and reflect a sweet spot that that library was designed for) they fundamentally rely on baked in vibrato, and the dynamics are generally used at the phrase level, and not to craft arcs of individual notes in detail. So its worth contrasting the musicality of such phrases with the above noodle where the musicality is simply performed on different dimensions of dynamics and vibrato (and it's amazing to me that this can be done with only the mod wheel).

re-quoting for reference:




More impressionistically - when I play the cello with the close mics only, it almost feels like a different instrument, to the point that I feel I might compose different lines with only the close mic (+ an external reverb). There a "blooming" effect and a sense of presence or dimension ... or something, that you get from the tree, and I that I really feel when I'm playing on quite an emotional level when I'm trying to come up with a cello line. Probably this is heard most obviously in the little flourish-crescendos at the end of some notes. Partly this is the value of the multiple dynamic layers, a crunchiness that you need the close mic for, but there's also something about the sound - a kind of "blooming" I've heard it called - that you would never get without the tree mic, and that isn't simply a reverb tail. To emphasize this effect I've brought the tree down to ~40%, which gives you the blooming without the reverb tail becoming overwhelming, and instead added a lot of Valhalla cathedral reverb with the early reflections turned off (I might have use the ambient mic instead, but I don't really have the system resources).

My point here is that there's something amazing in the sound, that involves whatever it is that's going on with the mics, that plays directly into the expressiveness in the way it interacts with the ability to control the dynamic layers and vibrato in the overall crafting of phrases. I don't really understand all the technical dimensional of what's going on here, except that you have these sweet spots of unparalleled sound interacts with the expressiveness of the phrases.

Without a doubt, the expressive space is of SsS is much smaller that something like Chris Hein - which I would probably go for if I wanted to mock up, say, Mozart. CH is technically virtuosic in the way is uses techniques of phase alignment and such that deliver vast expressiveness, but which sometimes, necessarily, comes at great cost to the sound.


Another dimension is the range of textural sonorities, which I think constitute another sweet spot - so the harmonics, the harmonic terms, the flautandos and so on are all gorgeous.

This example is mostly of BDT, and I noodled in the solo strings before I had even begun to think about crafting the dynamics idiomatically, much less the vibrato, so good lord it sounds cringingly bad now, but I'll quote it again here to draw attention to specifically violin "whispers trems", which enter in the first phrase really fit seamlessly into the space of the other textural libraries like BDT, OACE etc.




The 1st chair Vl, especially on its lowest dynamic layer also fits into this space of really beautiful, textual work - which the original noodle that starts this thread hinges on. I'll quote it again here, partly because I've just realized that the OP still has my first attempt with has some terribly unidiomatic playing which I've since improved (but which could be improved more), and also to point out how well it plays with the textures of the Olafur Chamber evo.





There a roughness to the strings that make them more Olafur Arnalds than Bach. But also a textural delicacy, which is one of the things I love about the library across the board.


Then there's the depths of the virtuosic violin. One barely documented much less advertised hilight of which is the ricochet and arpeggio legatos. jbuhler has a better and more comprehensive example of them somewhere (can't seem to find it), but my quick attempt to mock up Part's Fratres, gives some sense of what's possible.



I'll add that I've been listening to Caroline Shaw's new record of string quartets "Orange" in the last couple of weeks. And she has these amazingly passages of fast arpeggios, which invariably makes me think about what all might be possible with the Virtuosic Vl.

There's also lots that the library can't do - probably not the best for strings quartets. Or for languorously smooth long args of the sort you get in Tina Guo or Bohemian cello. Or for anything overly baroque.


But its all about sweet spots. And this is far from an exhaustive list of its sweet spots.


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## ism (May 11, 2019)

Off topic, and its never good for morale to compare any sample library too closely to a quartet of professional musicians, but the new record of Caroline Shaw quartets performed by the Attacca quartet is really quite brilliant:

https://carolineshaw.com


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## thorwald (Feb 29, 2020)

ism said:


> This example is mostly of BDT, and I noodled in the solo strings before I had even begun to think about crafting the dynamics idiomatically, much less the vibrato, so good lord it sounds cringingly bad now, but I'll quote it again here to draw attention to specifically violin "whispers trems", which enter in the first phrase really fit seamlessly into the space of the other textural libraries like BDT, OACE etc.



Maybe it's just me not having the experience of hearing live string players, but I don't find this too bad. I would have used a slight diminuendo on the very last note, but otherwise I think even without vibrato changes, this is expressive.

I know this is hard to answer easily, but just for the sake of educating your peers , what would you have changed personally?
Also, would you mind sharing your script? I'd be happy to port it over to Reaper, if I end up purchasing the library.

I'm planning to get a solo library for emotional lines and possibly for quartet writing in the near future, so I am looking into my available options. This thread definitely helps immensely.


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## Boag1 (Mar 6, 2020)

ism said:


> pm'd you


I'm also really interested in your vibrato script but never used this forum before so not sure if my last private message for to you. Please could you send a link to your Spitfire Vibrato script. Cheers. Pete


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## dcomdico (Nov 26, 2020)

ism said:


> One barely documented much less advertised hilight of which is the ricochet and arpeggio legatos.



I just purchased this library in the Black Weekend bundle and was browsing for info about it. This is a great thread. Can you explain how you achieved this sound (ricochet and arpeggio legatos) in the mock up of Part's Fratres?


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## jbuhler (Nov 26, 2020)

dcomdico said:


> I just purchased this library in the Black Weekend bundle and was browsing for info about it. This is a great thread. Can you explain how you achieved this sound (ricochet and arpeggio legatos) in the mock up of Part's Fratres?


For ricochet just use the total performance patch and program the note very short. That should trigger ricochet. If you then arpeggiate a triple or quadruple stop and it get the tempo right they should trigger.


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## marcocaricola (May 26, 2021)

ism said:


> pm'd you


Hey @ism - I wonder if it'd be still ok to ask a copy of the script to give it a spin! Bought this library ages ago but lowkey abandoned it for its issues... Thanks!


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## Trevor Meier (Dec 26, 2021)

Found my way here via the Spitfire Christmas Sale discussion. I’d love to have a copy of this script to see what it could do for getting more utility out of this library for my needs. I quite like the sound you’ve been able to achieve.


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## ImJim (Aug 19, 2022)

Interested in the script too, as I'm heavily working with SsS to build very small chamber sections.


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## halfaplanck (Aug 19, 2022)

ImJim said:


> Interested in the script too, as I'm heavily working with SsS to build very small chamber sections.


+1


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## slomo (Aug 20, 2022)

ImJim said:


> Interested in the script too, as I'm heavily working with SsS to build very small chamber sections.


+1


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## cjthomas234 (Nov 30, 2022)

Hey @ism !

I recently stumbled across a forum topic where you were discussing a script that you created for the spitfire studio strings to have a performance legato patch. The demos you shared sounded incredible. Is there a way to get the script from you?

Thanks in advance!!

CJ


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