# Embertone Releases: Walker 1955 Steinway 'D'



## Embertone

Happy Thursday VIC Friends!

When we embarked on this sampling journey about 12 million years ago, we thought sampling a piano would be "easy". What a relief that we don't have to worry about LEGATO for once!



We were so, so, wrong. Down the rabbit hole we went! ...capturing this unique and beautiful instrument in as much detail as possible. And nearly 150,000 samples later, we have our flagship piano: https://www.embertone.com/instruments/steinwayD.php (Walker 1955 Steinway 'D'). A massive, gorgeous 9-foot beauty. Here are some features:

- 36 velocities per note
- All Pedal combinations sampled
- 10,000 discrete and authentic adaptive release samples
- Dedicated set of real and highly addictive staccato samples
- 6 mic positions, available 'a la carte' for $15/each

*Default*
Mics: AKG C414 XLS, ORTF Stereo
Position: 2 ft off the side lip at the curve of the piano.
Qualities: Balanced piano/room tone with a beautiful twinkly high register and tamed low end. Vibrant and hearty with enough air space to breathe.

*Close*
Mics: Neumann U87, A/B Stereo (Omni)
Position: 6 in off the strings
Qualities: Extremely intimate and warm with very little room ambience. Rich with string reverberance while capturing all the subtle mechanical sounds.

*Hammer*
Mics: Superlux S241/U3, X/Y Stereo
Position: 1 ft above pointed directly at the hammers.
Qualities: Punchy and percussive dynamics, great for pop/rock music.

*Room*
Mics: Schoeps CMC 6, A/B Stereo (Cardioid)
Position: 6 ft away 8ft high, pointing towards the inside of the lid from the audience perspective.
Qualities: More room ambience and reverb coloration while allowing the piano to fully resonate into the room. Great for achieving a traditional/classical sound in a concert hall or recital setting.

*Wide Perspective*
Mics: Modified Oktava Mk012, A/B Stereo (Omni)
Position: 1 ft from the piano at the player’s perspective, spaced at the full width of the keyboard.
Qualities: An experimental mic pair capturing an ultra-wide stereo image with a unique and enveloping character.

*Binaural Perspective*
Mics: Stereo binaural dummy head (affectionately named Bruce)
Position: 2ft from the the keyboard at the player’s perspective.
Qualities: Realistic spatialization, especially when listened through headphones.

https://www.embertone.com/instruments/steinwayD.php (<script class="js-extraPhrases" type="application/json">
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<div class="bbImageWrapper js-lbImage" title="stacks-image-a83486b.png"
data-src="https://www.embertone.com/index_files/stacks-image-a83486b.png" data-lb-sidebar-href="" data-lb-caption-extra-html="" data-single-image="1">
<img src="https://www.embertone.com/index_files/stacks-image-a83486b.png"
data-url="https://www.embertone.com/index_files/stacks-image-a83486b.png"
class="bbImage"
data-zoom-target="1"
style=""
alt="stacks-image-a83486b.png"
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</div>)​1955 Steinway D offers great depth of user control as well. We know that some people do not need 36 velocities per note, whether it’s because of the style of music or RAM limitations, so our instrument allows for full sample sets and specific velocities to be disabled and purged from memory. We also offer a number of customized effects such as EQ, Compression, Dynamic + Velocity Control, and some custom mastering coloration should you chose to use it. This allows you ultimate control over your sound!

... and it's available with *early bird pricing* for a limited time. Learn more at our website and have a great day! 

<3

Alex and Jonathan


----------



## axb312

Out of the Blue...and it sounds nice! Also appreciate the a-la carte pricing...

Would like some demos of the different mic positions though...and some video demos please...


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## creativeforge

And here I was, doing so well with not coveting any new library!! 

Rach Prelude's Eb Major's last chord's sustain begs for more demos of that type. Long sustained chords allowing the soundboard's work to be revealed. Grateful for the pricing, too, and those added mics. 

Well done! Let us know when you have more demos (not of the classical type, although if this is your niche I understand).


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## Gerbil

Lovely sound. Purchased.


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## Old Timer

This looks crazy good. I cannot imagine how much work this involved. Well, I can. It's mind-boggling. I hope no-one has developed RSI at Embertone. 150,000 samples, 10,000 release samples, 36 velocities per note...! Jeepers creepers! Love Embertone!


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## SoNowWhat?

Nice one Embertone. Going to look very closely at this one. Interesting a la carte mic options.


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## Mystic

Fantastic sounding as usual! Will be watching for the walkthrough and mic demos.


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## rottoy

Purchased the LITE version. I'm loving this piano! Here's my first run with it.
Straight out of the box.


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## cadenzajon

Listening to the demos while perusing the product page on your site, I stumbled across this section. I must confess, Mr. Bell's versatility in helping you record your pedal combinations is quite amazing!!


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## sostenuto

Deciding on Lite vs Full for right now. Wondering if there will be Crossgrade after using Lite for some auditioning ?


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## Embertone

ka00 said:


> Am intrigued! Have a few questions:
> - How long is the early bird pricing period?
> - Which mics were used in each of the demo tracks?
> - Will there be more demo tracks and a walkthrough during the early bird period?



Thanks for these questions. Yes!

- The early bird period will be about 2 weeks.
- All demos so far use only the AKG/Main mic. I am working on another demo that will be rendered separately for all the mic positions so that everyone can hear the difference.
- We are editing the walkthrough video now... and more demos to come. Thanks!

-Alex


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## Embertone

sostenuto said:


> Deciding on Lite vs Full for right now. Wondering if there will be Crossgrade after using Lite for some auditioning ?



This hasn't been finalized yet... but we are very likely to offer a crossgrade. There may be a small fee because of what we pay NI in licensing, if anything. Thanks!

-Alex


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## Michel Simons

rottoy said:


> Purchased the LITE version. I'm loving this piano! Here's my first run with it.
> Straight out of the box.




Nice. It actually convinces me more to go for it (especially at that price) than the trailer and demos.


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## JEPA

nice one!


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## Vita Et Musica

I need another piano like I need another... oh... my... hello there, you sexy thing!


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## Embertone

There has been some confusion about mic positions — especially concerning how much disk space. I’ll clarify here and will be updating the website with better info!

- Mic positions are “a la carte” and available only for the full (not lite) product

- each mic position takes up roughly 30GB- about 24,000 samples per mic position

- we will update the site shortly with better audio demos to showcase and describe each mic position.

Thanks!


----------



## Vita Et Musica

Hmm. I bought the full version, but Connect only downloads the AKG_Sus_6 and part of AKG_Sus_5 before it just... goes away? It doesn't say anything about crashing, the app just disappears and downloading stops with it. This is with v3.2.4. Haven't seen that before. Is there a way to manually download? It's crashed 5 or 6 times in a row. This is on Win 10 pro 64bit.

Edit* In case anyone experiences anything similar, I changed a setting in Connect to just "Download" instead of "Download and Install" and things are downloading without incident. I've not had Connect try to Download and Install at the same time before. It used to download everything and then install, this was trying to unpack and install at the same time the download was still going.


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## Embertone

Vita Et Musica said:


> Hmm. I bought the full version, but Connect only downloads the AKG_Sus_6 and part of AKG_Sus_5 before it just... goes away? It doesn't say anything about crashing, the app just disappears and downloading stops with it. This is with v3.2.4. Haven't seen that before. Is there a way to manually download? It's crashed 5 or 6 times in a row. This is on Win 10 pro 64bit.



Not sure. I’ll check in with Stu about this. In the meantime please email us your request if you haven’t already 

support @ Embertone dot com


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## OleJoergensen

It sounds great. Very clear sound. I look forward to a walk thrue and more demoes.


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## richard kurek

Embertone said:


> Not sure. I’ll check in with Stu about this. In the meantime please email us your request if you haven’t already
> 
> support @ Embertone dot com


so far downloading full on mac os half way through no issue with 3.2.4


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## Embertone

Vita Et Musica said:


> Hmm. I bought the full version, but Connect only downloads the AKG_Sus_6 and part of AKG_Sus_5 before it just... goes away? It doesn't say anything about crashing, the app just disappears and downloading stops with it. This is with v3.2.4. Haven't seen that before. Is there a way to manually download? It's crashed 5 or 6 times in a row. This is on Win 10 pro 64bit.
> 
> Edit* In case anyone experiences anything similar, I changed a setting in Connect to just "Download" instead of "Download and Install" and things are downloading without incident. I've not had Connect try to Download and Install at the same time before. It used to download everything and then install, this was trying to unpack and install at the same time the download was still going.



FYI, I heard from Stu @ Continuata about this. This is what he had to say:

"... it's because of all the individual zips sometimes whilst it's extracting when it goes to get the new file it can crash the extracting. *Doing what he's done (downloading everything first) and then switching it back to download and extract and use shift Reset would work...*"

I highly suggest that you let CONNECT do the extraction for you. Much less headache that way. Thanks!!

-Alex


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## SoNowWhat?

Not seen it mentioned here specifically but, for those who don’t/won’t/haven’t updated to Kontakt 5.7 (Player or Full), there is a legacy version available on request. Legacy requires full kontakt v5.4.1 or later. This doesn’t affect me but, I’m pretty sure there are some out there that will want to know.

(This info is on the website but given most of us don’t even RTFM, I’m not sure we’d read to the bottom of the page).


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## Vita Et Musica

Embertone said:


> FYI, I heard from Stu @ Continuata about this. This is what he had to say:
> 
> "... it's because of all the individual zips sometimes whilst it's extracting when it goes to get the new file it can crash the extracting. *Doing what he's done (downloading everything first) and then switching it back to download and extract and use shift Reset would work...*"
> 
> I highly suggest that you let CONNECT do the extraction for you. Much less headache that way. Thanks!!
> 
> -Alex



That crashed it too for some reason. It's ok, I got them to download and extracting all in a go is simple with 7zip. Thanks for the help!


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## Fleer

Wow, this sounds absolutely amazing.
Following the Joshua Bell violin, another surefire hit for Embertone.


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## kimarnesen

Sounds really nice! After being disappointed after EVERY purchase of a piano library before, it would be awesome if there was a crossgrade offer so that we can try it with little risk with the light version, and upgrade if we like.


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## mobileavatar

Congrats on the release! The tone sounds lovely!!

I have some questions regarding sympathetic resonance: are both key and pedal resonance supported? And for pedal resonance, if a chord is hold and then the damper is depressed (100%), would there be a timbre change (like on a physical piano)? And is there a control of the resonance output?


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## ashtongleckman

Embertone said:


> Happy Thursday VIC Friends!
> 
> When we embarked on this sampling journey about 12 million years ago, we thought sampling a piano would be "easy". What a relief that we don't have to worry about LEGATO for once!
> 
> 
> 
> We were so, so, wrong. Down the rabbit hole we went! ...capturing this unique and beautiful instrument in as much detail as possible. And nearly 150,000 samples later, we have our flagship piano: https://www.embertone.com/instruments/steinwayD.php (Walker 1955 Steinway 'D'). A massive, gorgeous 9-foot beauty. Here are some features:
> 
> - 36 velocities per note
> - All Pedal combinations sampled
> - 10,000 discrete and authentic adaptive release samples
> - Dedicated set of real and highly addictive staccato samples
> - 6 mic positions, available 'a la carte' for $15/each
> 
> *Default*
> Mics: AKG C414 XLS, ORTF Stereo
> Position: 2 ft off the side lip at the curve of the piano.
> Qualities: Balanced piano/room tone with a beautiful twinkly high register and tamed low end. Vibrant and hearty with enough air space to breathe.
> 
> *Close*
> Mics: Neumann U87, A/B Stereo (Omni)
> Position: 6 in off the strings
> Qualities: Extremely intimate and warm with very little room ambience. Rich with string reverberance while capturing all the subtle mechanical sounds.
> 
> *Hammer*
> Mics: Superlux S241/U3, X/Y Stereo
> Position: 1 ft above pointed directly at the hammers.
> Qualities: Punchy and percussive dynamics, great for pop/rock music.
> 
> *Room*
> Mics: Schoeps CMC 6, A/B Stereo (Cardioid)
> Position: 6 ft away 8ft high, pointing towards the inside of the lid from the audience perspective.
> Qualities: More room ambience and reverb coloration while allowing the piano to fully resonate into the room. Great for achieving a traditional/classical sound in a concert hall or recital setting.
> 
> *Wide Perspective*
> Mics: Modified Oktava Mk012, A/B Stereo (Omni)
> Position: 1 ft from the piano at the player’s perspective, spaced at the full width of the keyboard.
> Qualities: An experimental mic pair capturing an ultra-wide stereo image with a unique and enveloping character.
> 
> *Binaural Perspective*
> Mics: Stereo binaural dummy head (affectionately named Bruce)
> Position: 2ft from the the keyboard at the player’s perspective.
> Qualities: Realistic spatialization, especially when listened through headphones.
> 
> https://www.embertone.com/instruments/steinwayD.php (<script class="js-extraPhrases" type="application/json">
> {
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> <div class="bbImageWrapper js-lbImage" title="stacks-image-a83486b.png"
> data-src="https://www.embertone.com/index_files/stacks-image-a83486b.png" data-lb-sidebar-href="" data-lb-caption-extra-html="" data-single-image="1">
> <img src="https://www.embertone.com/index_files/stacks-image-a83486b.png"
> data-url="https://www.embertone.com/index_files/stacks-image-a83486b.png"
> class="bbImage"
> data-zoom-target="1"
> style=""
> alt="stacks-image-a83486b.png"
> title=""
> width="" height="" />
> </div>)​1955 Steinway D offers great depth of user control as well. We know that some people do not need 36 velocities per note, whether it’s because of the style of music or RAM limitations, so our instrument allows for full sample sets and specific velocities to be disabled and purged from memory. We also offer a number of customized effects such as EQ, Compression, Dynamic + Velocity Control, and some custom mastering coloration should you chose to use it. This allows you ultimate control over your sound!
> 
> ... and it's available with *early bird pricing* for a limited time. Learn more at our website and have a great day!
> 
> <3
> 
> Alex and Jonathan




This honestly sounds incredible! Great job you guys.


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## ChrisSiuMusic

Congratulations on this release! The depth of sound really stands out to me.


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## SGordB

What! No half-pedalling?


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## Donny Grace

Embertone said:


> There has been some confusion about mic positions — especially concerning how much disk space. I’ll clarify here and will be updating the website with better info!
> 
> - Mic positions are “a la carte” and available only for the full (not lite) product
> 
> - each mic position takes up roughly 30GB- about 24,000 samples per mic position
> 
> - we will update the site shortly with better audio demos to showcase and describe each mic position.
> 
> Thanks!


Further clarification please. I'm only seeing mention here of “a la carte”, but the "1955 Steinway D + Full Mic Collection" purchase option listed on the website sounds like it includes *ALL* the mic positions. Is that indeed the case or am I interpreting incorrectly?


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## SoNowWhat?

dgrace said:


> Further clarification please. I'm only seeing mention here of “a la carte”, but the "1955 Steinway D + Full Mic Collection" purchase option listed on the website sounds like it includes *ALL* the mic positions. Is that indeed the case or am I interpreting incorrectly?


That’s how I understood it (obviously need Embertone to confirm). I read it as essentially three options:
1. Lite
2. Full - includes default mic position and to which other mic options can be added a la carte.
3. Pro Complete - which includes all mic positions.
I use the term Pro Complete to try and differentiate. This isn't used on the website. (Again need Embertone to confirm this).


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## Iskra

Yep, as far as I can understand, there are 3 versions of the piano. Lite, Full, then Full+all mics. If I understand correctly you can have 'Full' 1955 Steinway D (just the main mics) for 99$ (SRP) and then add the different mic positions at 15$ each, which make a total of 174$ if you buy them all separately, or you can buy everything at once for 175$ (1955 Steinway D+ Full Mic Collection).
It's very nice to have the mic positions a la carte, because i.e. if you don't need/want the binaural or wide position, or you don't have the HD space, you'll be saving 15$ from the total price. Plus, for a piano with this specs, 175$ SRP for the full version sounds pretty good to me. You can have 3 mics for 130$ SRP. Pretty good deal from Embertone (as usual).


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## Strezov

wow. wow. wow.


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## CGR

OK . . . bought the Lite version to 'test the waters'. Purchased, downloaded & installed no problems.

First impressions - this is a very warm and 'playable' sampled Steinway D. I'm impressed. To my ears tonally similar to Cinesamples' Piano in Blue (which I own & use) but with more clarity and maybe not as 'character' sounding. I'd say it has the best characteristics of Piano in Blue and the new Cinesamples Cinepiano (going by the demos I've heard - I don't own Cinepiano).

Steinway were really onto something with these 1950's era grand pianos. There is a real charm to the tone - a sweet bell-like tone in the treble and a warm/resonant mid & bass, which can also 'bite' when needed. I'd imagine these characteristics would be even more evident with the full version of the Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D.

Excellent job Embertone!


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## CGR

Just listening to some initial test recordings I made as I type this. Very authentic and convincing listening back through the Hi-Fi system in our house. The stereo imaging is excellent - the overtones mingle naturally, and at the default setting is not artificially wide. Really pleased with this.


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## willbedford

SGordB said:


> What! No half-pedalling?


There is re-pedalling though


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## rottoy

CGR said:


> OK . . . bought the Lite version to 'test the waters'. Purchased, downloaded & installed no problems.
> 
> First impressions - this is a very warm and 'playable' sampled Steinway D. I'm impressed. To my ears tonally similar to Cinesamples' Piano in Blue (which I own & use) but with more clarity and maybe not as 'character' sounding. I'd say it has the best characteristics of Piano in Blue and the new Cinesamples Cinepiano (going by the demos I've heard - I don't own Cinepiano).
> 
> Steinway were really onto something with these 1950's era grand pianos. There is a real charm to the tone - a sweet bell-like tone in the treble and a warm/resonant mid & bass, which can also 'bite' when needed. I'd imagine these characteristics would be even more evident with the full version of the Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D.
> 
> Excellent job Embertone!


It’s funny that you talk about Piano in Blue, because the reason I bought this was to get something with a similar character, but more deeply sampled. So now I can rest my lovely Piano in Blue on another hard drive for a while.


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## kimarnesen

CGR said:


> Just listening to some initial test recordings I made as I type this. Very authentic and convincing listening back through the Hi-Fi system in our house. The stereo imaging is excellent - the overtones mingle naturally, and at the default setting is not artificially wide. Really pleased with this.



Would love to hear your tests


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## Iskra

willbedford said:


> There is re-pedalling though


Not having half pedaling is a bit of a shame, for solo piano, classical or jazz, I think half pedaling is way more important than repedaling. I mean, having repedaling is great, but should have been second on the list of 'pedaling features'. 
Are we sure there is no halfpedaling? Haven't seen it on the website, so maybe is not confirmed...


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## markleake

Personally I find the demos are a bit hit and miss maybe. Not that they don't sound nice, but I find it hard to evaluate things like the bass notes, as they are doubled a lot by synth or other instruments, and some of the quirky playing makes it hard to judge. But when it is allowed to shine, this piano really does sound beautiful. And @rottoy's little experiment sounded great! Also it sounds a bit strange sometimes in the demos, I think just due to processing to sound like that for the track??

I have too many pianos and end up disappointed with them all, but this sounds like it does soft very well AND opens up nicely when you play it harder. I would love to hear the different mics.

And more demos please!


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## CGR

kimarnesen said:


> Would love to hear your tests


Sure - here's some very simple improvised playing I did within the first few minutes of launching it. I was listening for resonance, voicing and tuning, tone and stereo image. Sometimes overly complex playing can disguise these qualities with sampled pianos I've found. This is the Lite version, with the 12 layers selected, built-in reverb disabled, tone & dynamics switches on + a touch of EW Spaces on the master out. (the piano also sounds great dry, or with some of the built in verbs).

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-walker-1955-steinway-d-lite-spaces_03-mp3.13965/][/AUDIOPLUS]

[AUDIOPLUS=https://www.vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-walker-1955-steinway-d-lite-spaces_03-mp3.13965/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## markleake

CGR said:


> Sure - here's some very simple improvised playing I did within the first few minutes of launching it. I was listening for resonance, voicing and tuning, tone and stereo image. Sometimes overly complex playing can disguise these qualities with sampled pianos I've found. This is the Lite version, with the 12 layers selected, built-in reverb disabled, tone & dynamics switches on + a touch of EW Spaces on the master out. (the piano also sounds great dry, or with some of the built in verbs).
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-walker-1955-steinway-d-lite-spaces_03-mp3.13965/][/AUDIOPLUS]


Wow! CGR... that sounds really great to me! Thanks so much for posting this.

How does it feel like to play?


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## CGR

markleake said:


> Wow! CGR... that sounds really great to me! Thanks so much for posting this.
> 
> How does it feel like to play?


Very natural Mark. I'm using a Yamaha CP4 stage (88 key triple sensor hammer action) and the Embertone Steinway is very even and consistent, and a real joy to play. I grew up with acoustic pianos - have played, performed and recorded on many Steinway (and other brand) grand pianos, so feel I have a solid point of reference. I read that the piano Embertone sampled had an advanced player system fitted to it, so velocities were captured extremely accurately.

Glad my simple demo was of some help!


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## markleake

Good to hear that. I generally find VI pianos annoying to play personally. Not that I am a great player, but I can't get past how the natural roll off of each note just doesn't sustain like it does on real pianos. They feel dead in a way. How much of that effect do you get with this piano? If you say it feels very natural, are you saying it is sampled well enough at the various velocities for the first sustain part after the attack (where I find this issue start to set in with a lot of VI pianos) to start feeling real-ish enough compared to a real piano?

Certainly hearing it in the examples it sounds to have a lot more realistic character to it than some other VI pianos I have. I guess what I am asking is after playing it for a little while, do you feel frustrated about the sustains fading too fast and lack of resonance, or is that not too much of a problem from a player's perspective for this piano?


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## CGR

I've really only spent about 20 minutes with it so far, so I'm sure I'll have more to say, but my experience was similar to just walking up to a piano in a studio and playing, and instantly enjoying it. Very rich and warm, with plenty of sustain and body. Also, I didn't feel the need to delve into the interface and tweak settings like many sampled pianos I've bought. It just felt and sounded great. I quickly A/B'd it with Ivory 2.5 American Concert D (similar vintage - 50's era Steinway D) and although the 12 (Embertone) vs 20 (Ivory) velocities were apparent, I prefer the overall experience of the Embertone Steinway, and the top end is sweeter and more resonant & natural than Ivory ACD.

Keep in mind I'm comparing the Embertone Steinway Lite version at $39, to the much more expensive Ivory American D, which doesn't have the expandability of additional velocities (36) and range of Mic perspectives like the full version of the Embertone Steinway D.


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## Michel Simons

Well, 30 euros for the lite version almost feels like stealing it. I had the same problem with the download tool as already reported, but switching from download & install to just download and then unpacking it manually with WinRAR seems to have worked.


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## markleake

Cheers CGR, thanks so much for the info. Even if you've had little time with it, it is still valuable to hear this kind of first play experience. It does indeed sound like it could play as well as it sounds. 

And for such a small price to compare so well with the benchmark, at first glance at least... it certainly has me very interested.


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## CGR

markleake said:


> Cheers CGR, thanks so much for the info. Even if you've had little time with it, it is still valuable to hear this kind of first play experience. It does indeed sound like it could play as well as it sounds.
> 
> And for such a small price to compare so well with the benchmark, at first glance at least... it certainly has me very interested.


Here's another bit of playing - the very first thing I played with it. Nothing complicated, but hopefully it will give you an idea of the resonance and tone across the piano.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-walker-1955-steinway-d-lite-spaces_01-mp3.13966/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## markleake

Cheers, thanks again CGR. The more exposed stuff like this is very helpful.


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## SGordB

willbedford said:


> There is re-pedalling though


By popular demand, I'm sure!


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## HardyP

SoNowWhat? said:


> That’s how I understood it (obviously need Embertone to confirm). I read it as essentially three options:
> 1. Lite
> 2. Full - includes default mic position and to which other mic options can be added a la carte.
> 3. Pro Complete - which includes all mic positions.
> I use the term Pro Complete to try and differentiate. This isn't used on the website. (Again need Embertone to confirm this).



So in terms of @dgrace's question:
On their page, it says only "+Full Mic Collection". Means (in terms of your numbering scheme) this:




Which also maks sense, since 5 additional mic positions is 75$, what is nearly exactly the proce difference between 2. and 3.
It´s a bit confusing, but only the option 3. shows the early bird discount in the cart, the other ones need to the "Checkout" as it says in the head line...


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## bsntn99

I am also interested in trying out the Lite version during this sale period. But only if I can just pay the difference then to go up to the full or full/all mics while the sale is still on if I like the sound/playability. Have been burnt as well too many times with Kontakt piano libraries which always seem to fall short in some aspect.


----------



## LaurensGoedhart

This thing sounds very interesting! And here I am always telling myself I have enough piano VI's...
I have a possibly more 'advanced' question. For feature films I would probably want to use this piano in surround. So probably with the C414s or U87s as close mics and thus front signal, and the room mics for the back. How are mics selected in the library? Does each mic have a separate Kontakt patch? If so, is each mic patch programmed the same way that it will trigger the same (but different sounding) samples for each different mic, thus resulting in a perfect 'image'?


----------



## kimarnesen

bsntn99 said:


> I am also interested in trying out the Lite version during this sale period. But only if I can just pay the difference then to go up to the full or full/all mics while the sale is still on if I like the sound/playability. Have been burnt as well too many times with Kontakt piano libraries which always seem to fall short in some aspect.



Same here. It wouldn't make much sense to end up having the light + full version.


----------



## Vita Et Musica

Here's some fiddling with the full version, 36 layers, round robin, 414 default mics, no verb, no additional fx. Shows a bit of the dynamics, high and low stuff, wide open chords etc. It's a nice piano, very rich sounding. I love it on mp stuff, great soft low and high end, and thunderous clear lows when pushed. It's a very familiar Steiny sound, but done in a satisfying, intimate way (with the default mics anyway).

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-1955-steiny-quickshot-mp3.13974/][/AUDIOPLUS]


----------



## Donny Grace

M


HardyP said:


> So in terms of @dgrace's question:
> On their page, it says only "+Full Mic Collection". Means (in terms of your numbering scheme) this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which also makes sense, since 5 additional mic positions is 75$, what is nearly exactly the price difference between 2. and 3.
> It´s a bit confusing, but only the option 3. shows the early bird discount in the cart, the other ones need to the "Checkout" as it says in the head line...


Main reason I questioned it is that I'd like to purchase the *whole* thing and want to make sure I am getting that before I go to Checkout. The terminology is a little ambiguous. The "Lite" version is well defined. But there's not anything truly labeled as the "FULL VERSION". The only *Full" labeling is the "Full Mic Collection". So one could also interpret that the "FULL VERSION" would be owning *ALL* 6 mic positions, which was the way I first read it thinking maybe the "Additional Mic Positions" meant there are even more mic positions available besides the 6. So I just find the terminology a little ambiguous. Again, I would just like to know for a fact what to purchase to get the whole shooting match since there seems to be a savings by doing so. That seems to be what you're labeling as Option [3]. Just want to make sure.


----------



## bsntn99

Does anybody know if this is true 36 sustain layers? A lot of times developers will lump all the layers; pedal, no pedal, and release into one bucket to claim a higher layer count. So a 36 layer library may end up being only 12 layers for each group.


----------



## rottoy

bsntn99 said:


> Does anybody know if this is true 36 sustain layers? A lot of times developers will lump all the layers; pedal, no pedal, and release into one bucket to claim a higher layer count. So a 36 layer library may end up being only 12 layers for each group.


The lite version definitely have 12 dedicated layers for both pedal on and pedal off.
I'd assume the full version follows in a similar vein with their 36.


----------



## Donny Grace

bsntn99 said:


> Does anybody know if this is true 36 sustain layers? A lot of times developers will lump all the layers; pedal, no pedal, and release into one bucket to claim a higher layer count. So a 36 layer library may end up being only 12 layers for each group.


The panel controls for "VELOCITIES" along the "MODE" toggle for "normal" (which I would take to be sustained or long) and "staccato" suggests there are 36 for each, and I would presume that for each mic position. But clarification on this would also be good.


----------



## artinro

Forgive the possibly obvious question....are the staccato samples triggered automatically when appropriate, or must they be activated by keyswitch?


----------



## rottoy

artinro said:


> Forgive the possibly obvious question....are the staccato samples triggered automatically when appropriate, or must they be activated by keyswitch?


It's activated by a MIDI CC of your choice. (Default is CC#11)


----------



## artinro

rottoy said:


> It's activated by a MIDI CC of your choice. (Default is CC#11)



Thanks! Appreciate the quick response.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

dgrace said:


> M
> 
> Main reason I questioned it is that I'd like to purchase the *whole* thing and want to make sure I am getting that before I go to Checkout. The terminology is a little ambiguous. The "Lite" version is well defined. But there's not anything truly labeled as the "FULL VERSION". The only *Full" labeling is the "Full Mic Collection". So one could also interpret that the "FULL VERSION" would be owning *ALL* 6 mic positions, which was the way I first read it thinking maybe the "Additional Mic Positions" meant there are even more mic positions available besides the 6. So I just find the terminology a little ambiguous. Again, I would just like to know for a fact what to purchase to get the whole shooting match since there seems to be a savings by doing so. That seems to be what you're labeling as Option [3]. Just want to make sure.


Obviously need Embertone to clarify this for certainty but it seems to me that there is a default mic position (details in op) that comes with the $99 option, and another 5 mic options (details in op) that are available a la carte for $15 each. If you purchase the full mic collection $175 option then my understanding is you are getting everything (default mic + 5 a la carte options). Is that what you’re wondering or have I misunderstood?
@Vita Et Musica might confirm this as it appears their piece above (very elegant) uses the Full version so they may be able to comment. I’m leaning towards getting this so can confirm if I do but am out of studio right now.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

HardyP said:


> So in terms of @dgrace's question:
> On their page, it says only "+Full Mic Collection". Means (in terms of your numbering scheme) this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which also maks sense, since 5 additional mic positions is 75$, what is nearly exactly the proce difference between 2. and 3.
> It´s a bit confusing, but only the option 3. shows the early bird discount in the cart, the other ones need to the "Checkout" as it says in the head line...


Yes. That’s how I understood it.


----------



## JPQ

I dont found its prices?


----------



## Gerbil

The $175 option has all of the mics included.


----------



## rottoy

Had some fun today putting this piano in a jazz-ish context.
Be gentle with me.


----------



## axb312

rottoy said:


> It's activated by a MIDI CC of your choice. (Default is CC#11)



Ummm...isn't this a little strange? I mean...shouldn't the output be Staccato when you play Staccato? Or am I missing something?


----------



## tack

axb312 said:


> I mean...shouldn't the output be Staccato when you play Staccato?


It would need to know you intend to play staccato before you play it, so that it can start playing the staccato sample at the moment you trigger the note.

Perhaps mind reading will be available in a future update?


----------



## axb312

tack said:


> It would need to know you intend to play staccato before you play it, so that it can start playing the staccato sample at the moment you trigger the note.
> 
> Perhaps mind reading will be available in a future update?


It would need to be quick enough to interpret Midi data which tells it how long the note was held for and play back the right sample...If there are plans for mind reading though I wouldn't mind...

There's no separate Staccato articulation as far as I can see in the Pearl Concert Grand I have right now. I believe most Piano VI's allow you to change the length of release samples instead.


----------



## Michel Simons

I have been playing around with it for a bit (I bought the Lite version) and it sounds so much better than most pianos I have. Mind you, I am not a piano/keyboard player and I can only play simple stuff that even a brain dead monkey could play. Therefore I don't have a lot of fancy high-end piano libraries, so maybe I don't have the right material to compare it to. On the other hand, for the price of the Lite version, comparing it with high-end stuff might not be the right thing to do in the first place.

By the way, it could be me (see brain dead monkey comment above), but I don't seem to be able to switch between the 12 and 6 velocity layers options.


----------



## tack

axb312 said:


> It would need to be quick enough to interpret Midi data which tells it how long the note was held for and play back the right sample.


Which would mean waiting at least as long as the average staccato note duration before triggering the sample. That would introduce a latency of about, what, 50ms? That'd definitely be a no-go for live playing of the VI.

There could be an offline mode, I suppose, where it introduces a delay (relying on PDC to correct) to lookahead and trigger the appropriate sample. I'm not sure how useful that would be, seeing as the performance you hear while recording would be different from playback.

On balance I think I'd prefer the keyswitch.


----------



## axb312

tack said:


> Which would mean waiting at least as long as the average staccato note duration before triggering the sample. That would introduce a latency of about, what, 50ms? That'd definitely be a no-go for live playing of the VI.
> 
> There could be an offline mode, I suppose, where it introduces a delay (relying on PDC to correct) to lookahead and trigger the appropriate sample. I'm not sure how useful that would be, seeing as the performance you hear while recording would be different from playback.
> 
> On balance I think I'd prefer the keyswitch.



Perhaps yes...chalk it down to ignorance that I've never seen a separate Staccato articulation before and am just wondering why it's done this way here...


----------



## Embertone

Hey! I went through this thread and found all the unanswered questions... here goes:

(1) 
For all those asking about crossgrades, we don't yet have an option for that. When the early bird period ends (in about 2 weeks), we will have a system worked out. Thanks!

(2) 


LaurensGoedhart said:


> This thing sounds very interesting! And here I am always telling myself I have enough piano VI's...
> 
> I have a possibly more 'advanced' question. For feature films I would probably want to use this piano in surround. So probably with the C414s or U87s as close mics and thus front signal, and the room mics for the back. How are mics selected in the library? Does each mic have a separate Kontakt patch? If so, is each mic patch programmed the same way that it will trigger the same (but different sounding) samples for each different mic, thus resulting in a perfect 'image'?



GREAT question! This instrument was too huge for us to be able to put all the samples in a single NKI, so we came up with a workaround. When you buy any of the additional mic positions, you get a MULTI that can be loaded into Kontakt. Load any of your microphone positions into kontakt (make sure they are all set to the same MIDI channel). When you turn the MULTI on, changing one mic position/instruments' settings will change ALL the mic position/instruments' settings. That way you can combine microphones if you wish to.

Just make sure that you do not MUTE any of the NKI's, that will cause it to lose communication with the other mics.

(3)


artinro said:


> Forgive the possibly obvious question....are the staccato samples triggered automatically when appropriate, or must they be activated by keyswitch?
> Ummm...isn't this a little strange? I mean...shouldn't the output be Staccato when you play Staccato? Or am I missing something?



Good question! It's not strange at all IMO, here's how it works (put on your sampling nerd hats, everyone):

If you play very short notes, you here a pretty realistic version of staccato. We sampled a ton of releases based on velocity and LENGTH of note, so basically the piano is "listening" to your playing and waiting to see how long your notes are. It will decide on the proper release once you lift the key, based on how hard the note was played and the length you played it.

That means if you play a very short note and lift, you hear a pretty perfect, realistic release for that note! However, I have always loved REAL staccato sound, with no crossfades and no fanciness. There's something special about the way the piano mechanism interacts with the sound that just inspires me. So we included this deliberate set of staccatos (with 2X RR, 36 velocities) for that very purpose. If you choose this deliberate set, you can switch between articulations via the CC of your choosing.

(4) 


mobileavatar said:


> Congrats on the release! The tone sounds lovely!!
> I have some questions regarding sympathetic resonance: are both key and pedal resonance supported? And for pedal resonance, if a chord is hold and then the damper is depressed (100%), would there be a timbre change (like on a physical piano)? And is there a control of the resonance output?



By key resonance, do you mean, how the piano interacts when you lift the key?
By pedal resonance, do you mean, how the piano reacts when you depress the pedal?

If you hold a chord down and then the damper is depressed, there is no timbre change. We tried crossfading to from sans-pedal --> sus pedal samples upon sustain pedal depress, but that doesn't sound good. We'd consider doing an update eventually that adds internal pedal resonance, but our impression is that it would make very little difference.

One thing I like to do is to shut off the Sans Pedal samples... especially when I want a more cinematic sound. Then I always get more resonance, whether I have the pedal up or down . I know this is a cheat but it's fun!

(5)


creativeforge said:


> And here I was, doing so well with not coveting any new library!!
> Rach Prelude's Eb Major's last chord's sustain begs for more demos of that type. Long sustained chords allowing the soundboard's work to be revealed. Grateful for the pricing, too, and those added mics.
> Well done! Let us know when you have more demos (not of the classical type, although if this is your niche I understand).


I think some of the demos that users have posted have address this, BUT we have had multiple requests for some more exposed demos. We're working on it!

(6)


SoNowWhat? said:


> That’s how I understood it (obviously need Embertone to confirm). I read it as essentially three options:
> 1. Lite
> 2. Full - includes default mic position and to which other mic options can be added a la carte.
> 3. Pro Complete - which includes all mic positions.
> I use the term Pro Complete to try and differentiate. This isn't used on the website. (Again need Embertone to confirm this).



Yep, you have it right there. We decided not to call it "Pro", so it's simply the "normal" instrument and the "Lite" one.

(7)


Iskra said:


> Not having half pedaling is a bit of a shame, for solo piano, classical or jazz, I think half pedaling is way more important than repedaling. I mean, having repedaling is great, but should have been second on the list of 'pedaling features'.
> Are we sure there is no halfpedaling? Haven't seen it on the website, so maybe is not confirmed...



I can confirm, no half pedaling! We sampled: (1) Sans Pedal, (2) Sustain Pedal, (3) Sustain plus una corda, (4) Una Corda Pedal only. We didn't have the time or resources to record additional full articulations for half pedaling, and the library would have been completely out of control (and we wouldn't have released for another year most likely).

Is there a way to simulate half pedaling without recording a sample set for it?

(8)


keepitsimple said:


> Would be nice to hear how each mic sounds by itself. Still can't see a section on your website that has demos for each mic. Hopefully this is to be added soon.



We're working on it. Should be today or tomorrow.



kimarnesen said:


> Same here. It wouldn't make much sense to end up having the light + full version.



We're thinking about this. What we might do is give LITE users two upgrade options:

Option 1: Get the FULL version but keep your LITE license for discounted price X
Option 2: Get the FULL version and give up your LITE license for slightly less than discounted price X

(9)


dgrace said:


> M
> Main reason I questioned it is that I'd like to purchase the *whole* thing and want to make sure I am getting that before I go to Checkout. The terminology is a little ambiguous. The "Lite" version is well defined. But there's not anything truly labeled as the "FULL VERSION". The only *Full" labeling is the "Full Mic Collection". So one could also interpret that the "FULL VERSION" would be owning *ALL* 6 mic positions, which was the way I first read it thinking maybe the "Additional Mic Positions" meant there are even more mic positions available besides the 6. So I just find the terminology a little ambiguous. Again, I would just like to know for a fact what to purchase to get the whole shooting match since there seems to be a savings by doing so. That seems to be what you're labeling as Option [3]. Just want to make sure.



We decided not to give the "main" library a name other than "Walker 1955 Steinway D". So:

(a) "Walker 1955 Steinway D Lite" is the pared down version with less articulations and velocities
(b) "Walker 1955 Steinway D" is the main version.
(c) "Walker 1955 Steinway D + Full Mic collection" is the main version with all the mics.

Hope that helps!

(10)


bsntn99 said:


> Does anybody know if this is true 36 sustain layers? A lot of times developers will lump all the layers; pedal, no pedal, and release into one bucket to claim a higher layer count. So a 36 layer library may end up being only 12 layers for each group.



True 36 velocities, baby! No monkeying around, each articulation is 36 velocities 

Hope that helps. I'll pop in every now and then to answer questions. Thanks!!


----------



## kimarnesen

Thank you for all the good answers and for willing to offer some kind of crossgrade price. Usually, when someone has a lite version and really likes it they would be interested in an upgrade. So perhaps an upgrade offer makes more sense than a crossgrade since it’s like
VSL’s standard + extended versions, or Spitfire’s “pro” extensions with additional mics. You don’t end up with two libraries but with additional content.


----------



## jon wayne

I am loving a small investment in a great sounding Lite version. I would love to upgrade at a later date, but the little guy is pegging my CPU with using sustain pedal often. I am using a quad core I7 3.4 ghz with 24 gb of RAM. For those of you who purchased the Full with multi mic, are you getting major CPU spikes?


----------



## muziksculp

I don't see any video walkthroughs, will you be posting some soon ?


----------



## Embertone

jon wayne said:


> I am loving a small investment in a great sounding Lite version. I would love to upgrade at a later date, but the little guy is pegging my CPU with using sustain pedal often. I am using a quad core I7 3.4 ghz with 24 gb of RAM. For those of you who purchased the Full with multi mic, are you getting major CPU spikes?



I've been noticing a few users with this issue. Are you on Windows or Mac? If Windows, are you using ASIO? What are your audio buffer settings? Can you try in Kontakt Standalone to rule out DAW issues?


----------



## jon wayne

Mac, SSD, Logic, buffer was actually 256, changed to 512...much better!


----------



## creativeforge

Embertone said:


> Hey! I went through this thread and found all the unanswered questions... here goes:
> 
> (5)
> 
> I think some of the demos that users have posted have address this, BUT we have had multiple requests for some more exposed demos. We're working on it!
> 
> Hope that helps. I'll pop in every now and then to answer questions. Thanks!!



Thorough job of answering. Awesome! Thanks!


----------



## tack

Embertone said:


> We sampled a ton of releases based on velocity and LENGTH of note, so basically the piano is "listening" to your playing and waiting to see how long your notes are.


Crazy question: are the release samples based on _release_ velocity too? This is really left field esoteric subtlety (given that so few controllers send velocity with note-offs) and I think the only piano VI that takes release velocity into account is Pianoteq, but it'd be interesting to have a sample-based piano use this information in some way too.



Embertone said:


> Is there a way to simulate half pedaling without recording a sample set for it?


Might be able to do some trickery with just simple volume reduction on the sample to simulate a faster decay. This might end up being better than nothing, as partial pedaling is a common technique to blend notes.


----------



## Gerbil

I'd set the day aside to watch all the world cup games. This piano pretty much stole most of that time.

I really want to congratulate Embertone on this instrument. You picked a really lovely Steinway and have captured it's heart - and genuine una corda as well. The mic choices/engineering was spot on (note to lovers of pianos: you're going to want ALL of the mics - they each offer something special). It's wonderful to play (as good as the VSL CFX), I love the GUI and the choices you've made. This must indeed have driven you borderline nuts but I am so glad you did it. Oh..and applause for the staccato samples as well; they're going to be great for adding that extra bit to finished recordings.

There's something special I love about this library. I can't see how there wont be little things that might need tweaking with so many samples under the hood but whatever and wherever they are I kind of didn't care because I've had such a great day playing it.

Right...I think I've run out of superlatives.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

JPQ said:


> I dont found its prices?


If you’re on a mobile device click the shopping trolley. This will open a pop up with the prices and “add to cart” options for each.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

jon wayne said:


> Mac, SSD, Logic, buffer was actually 256, changed to 512...much better!


Was going to ask you which OS you were using. 
Embertone have all spike issues been for Mac or are other OSs affected too?


----------



## CT

Sigh. I certainly don't *need* another piano, and I hardly have cash to throw around, but....


----------



## mobileavatar

Embertone said:


> By key resonance, do you mean, how the piano interacts when you lift the key?
> By pedal resonance, do you mean, how the piano reacts when you depress the pedal?
> 
> If you hold a chord down and then the damper is depressed, there is no timbre change. We tried crossfading to from sans-pedal --> sus pedal samples upon sustain pedal depress, but that doesn't sound good. We'd consider doing an update eventually that adds internal pedal resonance, but our impression is that it would make very little difference.
> 
> One thing I like to do is to shut off the Sans Pedal samples... especially when I want a more cinematic sound. Then I always get more resonance, whether I have the pedal up or down . I know this is a cheat but it's fun!




Thanks for your reply! Sorry for the confusion, by resonance, I was referring to sympathetic resonance.
a) key resonance - if I press down a key silently (BTW, is "silent key" supported in the current version?), would the overtones of the depressed pitch (of the key) be triggered (proportionally in volume)?

b) pedal resonance - since each key with pedal is samples, could I assume the resonance of overtones is also captured in the sample? If that's the case, there should be a difference in timbre when pedal is added to an already-depressed key, i.e. (no pedal - no overtone vs. pedal = w/ overtones). Maybe I've misunderstood something (?)


----------



## good

miket said:


> Sigh. I certainly don't *need* another piano, and I hardly have cash to throw around, but....









..but..I..open..my..wallet..aga..in...


----------



## axb312

@Embertone - is there a noise buildup if you depress the sustain pedal continuously?


----------



## Vita Et Musica

jon wayne said:


> I am loving a small investment in a great sounding Lite version. I would love to upgrade at a later date, but the little guy is pegging my CPU with using sustain pedal often. I am using a quad core I7 3.4 ghz with 24 gb of RAM. For those of you who purchased the Full with multi mic, are you getting major CPU spikes?



I have a lesser CPU and only 16GB RAM and don't have any issues, but I typically keep my buffer at 512+. I Just assume that I'm going to hit the ceiling during pretty much any given session and have gotten used to the latency. Don't really feel it all that much TBH. That's on a 7200RPM HDD. Pretty basic setup.


----------



## Ylmir

Embertone said:


> "... it's because of all the individual zips sometimes whilst it's extracting when it goes to get the new file it can crash the extracting. *Doing what he's done (downloading everything first) and then switching it back to download and extract and use shift Reset would work...*"



In case this can help someone : I encountered this issue as well, but in my case, changing the options of Continuata to "Download only" didn't even fix it. I've been able to get Connect to work by switching the download method to "Single" though, as I was using the "Multi" mode and it now seems to be working fine.


----------



## Iskra

Embertone said:


> Is there a way to simulate half pedaling without recording a sample set for it?


Many thanks for the reply! Maybe it's possible to simulate half pedal by shortening the 'with pedal' samples to almost no sustaining part of the pedal and then using the release of the key off. Pressing a note half pedal gives the attack of the 'sans pedal' note and then a small bit of the sustaining part of the 'with pedal' sound. Maybe worth a try to experiment with a few samples and see if it works?


----------



## slobajudge

Iskra said:


> Many thanks for the reply! Maybe it's possible to simulate half pedal by shortening the 'with pedal' samples to almost no sustaining part of the pedal and then using the release of the key off. Pressing a note half pedal gives the attack of the 'sans pedal' note and then a small bit of the sustaining part of the 'with pedal' sound. Maybe worth a try to experiment with a few samples and see if it works?


I think that Production voices with their product Production grand in version 2 use some kind of script in NI Kontakt to simulate half pedal. Maybe its not a bad idea for Embertone to contact Production voices and use similar script.


----------



## Gerbil

I seem to recall the Garritan CFX adding half pedalling in an update which is very effective. Half pedalling on the 1955 would be a real treat.


----------



## CGR

I find it quite difficult & unnatural to half pedal with sampled pianos which support it (Pianoteq is different). On an acoustic piano it's an intuitive thing I can feel though the sustain pedal and keyboard action, but with a sampled piano it distracts me from my playing, so I tend not to get too concerned about it. Re-pedalling/catch-pedalling is more important to me on a sampled piano.


----------



## Gerbil

That's the next milestone: keyboards and pedals with feedback where you can feel the sound of the virtual piano. Something tells me it wont be cheap!


----------



## al_net77

Gerbil said:


> That's the next milestone: keyboards and pedals with feedback where you can feel the sound of the virtual piano. Something tells me it wont be cheap!



The Yamaha Avantgrand N3 does it on keys, it is called TRS


----------



## Gerbil

That's very impressive. I wonder if external audio could be routed through it to the same end - not that I could afford it, mind. It would be great if that sort of technology could be applied to sub-2k weighted keyboards. Sampling and modelling have made leaps and bounds but the controllers have some catching up to do.


----------



## Embertone

Happy Monday everyone!

I've prepared a basic mic comparison. I'm happy to go deeper with this if folks here would find it useful!

WEBSITE UPDATED: https://www.embertone.com/instruments/steinwayD.php

MIC COMPARISON HERE:


----------



## CGR

Fantastic video demo Alex - a succinct and detailed walkthrough. I'm sure the Walker 1955 Steinway D will be a great success for Embertone, and a superbly authentic and flexible instrument for many pianists/composers/musicians.


----------



## CGR

Nice playing too! Some really interesting ideas in your hands there.


----------



## Embertone

Thanks CGR! 

Fun fact: The "Flight of the Bumblebee" example above is sourced from a piano roll performance by the master himself: Rachmaninoff!!


----------



## CGR

Would that be a Zenph re-performance? I worked at a studio with a restored 1969 Hamburg Steinway D (stunning piano) which had been fitted with a Live Performance LX MIDI system, and heard an Art Tatum Zenph disc played back through the piano one evening. It was a spine-tingling experience as we stood around the piano, watching & listening in amazement.


----------



## teclark7

Alex

I can not see a button to add to cart / buy. Can you please direct me and others.


----------



## artinro

Embertone said:


> Thanks CGR!
> 
> Fun fact: The "Flight of the Bumblebee" example above is sourced from a piano roll performance by the master himself: Rachmaninoff!!



Alex, this sounds superb! Quick question: Is there an easy way (or planned addition to the interface) to mix mic positions, or do they each need to be separate kontakt instances adjusted individually?


----------



## mobileavatar

Thank you for the audio demos and excellent walk-thru!!

The close-mics esp. for the first piece is wetter than I anticipated. Is it because of the applied reverb?
For multi-mic settings, would there be presets that include different % of reverb dialled in for different mic positions, as reference to get a more realistic surround setup?


----------



## Embertone

teclark7 said:


> Alex
> 
> I can not see a button to add to cart / buy. Can you please direct me and others.



Hey Tec, this is a website formatting error . I've adjusted it, you can try reloading! However, if you're still not having luck, try changing the width of your browser. Sorry about that!

-Alex


----------



## Embertone

mobileavatar said:


> Thank you for the audio demos and excellent walk-thru!!
> 
> The close-mics esp. for the first piece is wetter than I anticipated. Is it because of the applied reverb?
> For multi-mic settings, would there be presets that include different % of reverb dialled in for different mic positions, as reference to get a more realistic surround setup?



There is a touch of reverb on that close mic. It is very close, and quite dry. 

We don't have specific reverb presets, I'd say it should be added to taste. Thanks!


----------



## emasters

Really great sounding piano library. Had a try yesterday and really enjoyed the sound and playability. Nice job Embertone!


----------



## teclark7

Embertone said:


> Hey Tec, this is a website formatting error . I've adjusted it, you can try reloading! However, if you're still not having luck, try changing the width of your browser. Sorry about that!
> 
> -Alex



Thanks working now.


----------



## Fleer

This is simply. A-MA-ZING. Embertone, you did it. You actually made it happen. I give in.


----------



## kimarnesen

Exciting! Will you consider offering mic mixes for specific colors and styles? That might save some CPU than 3 mics at once I guess.


----------



## Embertone

CGR said:


> Would that be a Zenph re-performance? I worked at a studio with a restored 1969 Hamburg Steinway D (stunning piano) which had been fitted with a Live Performance LX MIDI system, and heard an Art Tatum Zenph disc played back through the piano one evening. It was a spine-tingling experience as we stood around the piano, watching & listening in amazement.



Yep. This piano sits in the former Zenph studio!


----------



## Vita Et Musica

The unsung hero of this particular piano library is the una corda sample set. Extremely inspiring to play. Having a tough time switching una corda off at this point. Why can't every song just be "Stardust?"


----------



## Fleer

Already tested the main (AKG) mics. Those are the ones in the (base) full version and they sound just beautiful: close, but not too close, with that nice room sound to boot. The complete version has so many interesting mics, including close, wide and binaural. I’m really looking forward to testing the latter with headphones.


----------



## sostenuto

Fleer said:


> Already tested the main (AKG) mics. Those are the ones in the (base) full version and they sound just beautiful: close, but not too close, with that nice room sound to boot. The complete version has so many interesting mics, including close, wide and binaural. I’m really looking forward to testing the latter with headphones.



Soooo. Is it your early advice to start with Full version now and add mics 1-at-a-time, *or* take advantage of $149. Intro price for the whole enchilada ?? 

Cool, but just adds (2) Mics …..


----------



## Fleer

Well, you would get 5 more mics and 150 GB of extra samples ...


----------



## Embertone

Vita Et Musica said:


> The unsung hero of this particular piano library is the una corda sample set. Extremely inspiring to play. Having a tough time switching una corda off at this point. Why can't every song just be "Stardust?"



Agree. I'm in love with the Una Corda . Try making it cinematic by turning down the dynamics so that it's only a very slight upward slope (from left to right). Extra detail and beauty!!


----------



## mobileavatar

Embertone said:


> There is a touch of reverb on that close mic. It is very close, and quite dry.
> 
> We don't have specific reverb presets, I'd say it should be added to taste. Thanks!



Or maybe if there could be snapshots for multi-instrument included, at least we know how the multi-mic/surround setups are intended to be. Surely we could experiment from scratch, but your Embertone team would know the best the multi-mic setup, in terms of relative volume, pan, and stereo width.


----------



## rottoy

Vita Et Musica said:


> The unsung hero of this particular piano library is the una corda sample set. Extremely inspiring to play. Having a tough time switching una corda off at this point. Why can't every song just be "Stardust?"


After listening to the Una Corda samples in the walkthrough, it pains me that it's not featured in the Lite version.
I just don't have all the hard drive real estate for the Full version. Oh well, one can dream.


----------



## axb312

@Embertone ..

Can you guys kindly do some kind of add to cart thing so we can all the bits we want at once?

Right now, its add one item, see cart, close cart, add next item etc etc....


----------



## dougj7

Is the discount price still in effect? View Cart shows $39.00 for the Lite version.


----------



## HardyP

dougj7 said:


> Is the discount price still in effect? View Cart shows $39.00 for the Lite version.


Go to checkout - has allready been covered here:
https://vi-control.net/community/th...ker-1955-steinway-d.72492/page-3#post-4244448


----------



## dougj7

HardyP said:


> Go to checkout - has allready been covered here:
> https://vi-control.net/community/th...ker-1955-steinway-d.72492/page-3#post-4244448



Got it, Thanks


----------



## sostenuto

Fleer said:


> Well, you would get 5 more mics and 150 GB of extra samples ...



True, true …..

In the meantime, @ Cory Pelizzari released his fine video review and responded to resulting Forum inquires.
Wide and Binaural mics are mentioned, in addition to the Close mic. With promo prices, seems like only detail is a comfortable resting place for the 150 GB …..


----------



## Embertone

axb312 said:


> @Embertone ..
> 
> Can you guys kindly do some kind of add to cart thing so we can all the bits we want at once?
> 
> Right now, its add one item, see cart, close cart, add next item etc etc....



So sorry, that is incredibly annoying. I’ll work on that tonight!


----------



## Vita Et Musica

rottoy said:


> After listening to the Una Corda samples in the walkthrough, it pains me that it's not featured in the Lite version.
> I just don't have all the hard drive real estate for the Full version. Oh well, one can dream.



You're gonna have to make room. It's one of the best una corda piano libraries I've heard.


----------



## tack

Oh Continuata. How do I love thee? Let me count the ways.





Figure 1: A familiar sight.

This software abomination is the single biggest cause of my VI acquisition angst. I've no doubt Embertone Support will get me squared away, but I felt compelled to whine about it publicly out of a desperate wish for developers to stop using them.


----------



## Phryq

Wow. This is going to leave every other piano in the dust. The lite version is already better than other $200 piano options on the market. 

Embertone are Gods.

I just.... don't have money. Why didn't I win that competition!!!!


----------



## sostenuto

Phryq said:


> Wow. This is going to leave every other piano in the dust. The lite version is already better than other $200 piano options on the market. Embertone are Gods.
> I just.... don't have money. Why didn't I win that competition!!!!



Ha ha ha ha !!!!  I have money. I have money ! 

Sounds like Lite is dang cool !  …. sooo do I really need the whole enchilada ?


----------



## SoundChris

Full version with Mic - Collection --> Ordered!


----------



## sostenuto

Embertone has made 'interim' comment, BUT would seriously like to see 'no-cost' crossgrade to Full after auditioning Lite ( at least during this Intro phase ).


----------



## Fleer

Man, those extra mics are exquisite. Binaural for headphones. Check. Wide for special. Check. Room for concert. Check. Hammer for cinematic. Check. Close. Check. 
Just play those Close mics with the Default AKG ones. Sheer heaven.


----------



## jwusoccer

Anyone with the full library care to compare the binaural and close mics? I'm looking at picking up one more mic perspective for headphone play but I'm having a hard time deciding between the two.


----------



## jwusoccer

keepitsimple said:


> After listening to the close mics on different sources (youtube videos etc), i'm not too convinced with them yet because they sound to my taste in one video then i don't like them in another video. I went with the binaural for now (downloading it now).



I sort of thought the same but I've read that the original/close mic combo sounds good. Maybe they sound better together than the close mic on its own? Let me know how the binaural is when you get a chance to try it. I'll probably pick it up if it's any good since I don't have any other libraries with a binaural sample.


----------



## mobileavatar

The sound of this library is gorgeous. I am really impressed by the bottom end. It really goes beyond a piano VI.
What have been stopping me right now is in fact the lack of half-pedalling.

@Embertone, I would like to know if "half-pedalling" could be supported in a future upgrade?
I mainly use piano VI to mock-up classical contemporary music ala Messiaen, Takemitsu, etc. Half-pedalling is indispensable...


----------



## Michel Simons

tack said:


> Oh Continuata. How do I love thee? Let me count the ways.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Figure 1: A familiar sight.
> 
> This software abomination is the single biggest cause of my VI acquisition angst. I've no doubt Embertone Support will get me squared away, but I felt compelled to whine about it publicly out of a desperate wish for developers to stop using them.



I had the same problem and put it on download only in the settings page. After that you can either put it back on download&install and continue from there (it won't redownload the library, but just install it) or you can unpack it yourself (which is what I did since the other option also didn't work for me).


----------



## Embertone

mobileavatar said:


> The sound of this library is gorgeous. I am really impressed by the bottom end. It really goes beyond a piano VI.
> What have been stopping me right now is in fact the lack of half-pedalling.
> 
> @Embertone, I would like to know if "half-pedalling" could be supported in a future upgrade?
> I mainly use piano VI to mock-up classical contemporary music ala Messiaen, Takemitsu, etc. Half-pedalling is indispensable...



We will look into it. Thanks for the suggestion!


----------



## mobileavatar

Embertone said:


> We will look into it. Thanks for the suggestion!


Thanks for the prompt reply.

@Embertone, I'd also like to know the answers for my earlier question on the support regarding "sympathetic resonance" and "silent key". Are those supported in the current version?


----------



## Embertone

Neither of those currently offered. Both entirely possible (and practical) scripting updates that we are seriously considering. Thanks!


----------



## JPQ

SoNowWhat? said:


> If you’re on a mobile device click the shopping trolley. This will open a pop up with the prices and “add to cart” options for each.


I am mac computer and dont found it but look again. and i dont know if this lib for me. i need before this so much else. some things what i thinked are also embertone (their solo strings).


----------



## Embertone

JPQ said:


> I am mac computer and dont found it but look again. and i dont know if this lib for me. i need before this so much else. some things what i thinked are also embertone (their solo strings).



I understand. So much out there to buy! On our website, look for the orange button that says BUY. Thanks!

-Alex


----------



## axb312

Embertone said:


> I understand. So much out there to buy! On our website, look for the orange button that says BUY. Thanks!
> 
> -Alex



When will the early bird discount expire?


----------



## Embertone

axb312 said:


> When will the early bird discount expire?



It'll last at least through June. It's likely to disappear shortly into July. Thanks!!


----------



## SoNowWhat?

Embertone said:


> It'll last at least through June. It's likely to disappear shortly into July. Thanks!!


Thank you.


----------



## CGR

Embertone said:


> It'll last at least through June. It's likely to disappear shortly into July. Thanks!!


Hi Alex - a question comparing the Lite version to the Full version:
Do the 12 velocity layers in the Lite version span the full dynamic range sampled (but with less gradations in between softest and loudest) as the 36 velocity layered Full version?


----------



## star.keys

Wonderful sound. Excellent playability. I'm just a bit uncomfortable with the lack of stereo imaging in samples and the sound is a bit too much in the face at players position.


----------



## Napier Lopez

On CGR's comment above, I bought the Lite version and I feel like I'm struggling with dynamic range compared to my other favorite VSTs. This is my first Kontakt library so I don't know if I'm doing something wrong, but there seems to be less change in timbre than my other VSTs when going from piano to forte. 

Embertone's explainer video for the full version says the overall feel should remain the same with less velocity layers selected at around 7:40, but I don't know if that applies to the Lite version as well.

But it's sampled so darn well. If I can sort the dynamic range and Embertone adds sympathetic resonance, it could end up being my favorite VST. 

Looking forward to upcoming updates and I hope Embertone considers an upgrade path for those of us on the Lite. Despite the above reservations, I'm already tempted to upgrade to the full version!


----------



## Embertone

Napier Lopez said:


> On CGR's comment above, I bought the Lite version and I feel like I'm struggling with dynamic range compared to my other favorite VSTs. This is my first Kontakt library so I don't know if I'm doing something wrong, but there seems to be less change in timbre than my other VSTs when going from piano to forte.
> 
> Embertone's explainer video for the full version says the overall feel should remain the same with less velocity layers selected at around 7:40, but I don't know if that applies to the Lite version as well.
> 
> But it's sampled so darn well. If I can sort the dynamic range and Embertone adds sympathetic resonance, it could end up being my favorite VST.
> 
> Looking forward to upcoming updates and I hope Embertone considers an upgrade path for those of us on the Lite. Despite the above reservations, I'm already tempted to upgrade to the full version!



Something must be wrong... the lite instrument has just as wide a dynamic range as the full. Please go to the response page and make sure that dynamics curve is a wide and steep hill going lower left to upper right. Same as the volume!


----------



## slobajudge

This piano is so authentic and fantastic that it will be total catastrophe without half pedal here. Embertone please don`t do it to your baby


----------



## Vita Et Musica

Here's some main mic (414's) with close mics (87's) and each alone to compare. The close mics are... closer sounding, maybe fuller in the lows. When added to the mains it just makes it all sound more rich and satisfying. Feel like I'm becoming an Embertone salesman here. It's a friggin' good piano, don't know what else to say. Half pedaling be damned!

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-1955-steiny-main-close-mp3.14089/][/AUDIOPLUS]

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-1955-steiny-close87s-only-mp3.14090/][/AUDIOPLUS]

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-1955-steiny-main414s-only-mp3.14091/][/AUDIOPLUS]


----------



## CGR

Vita Et Musica said:


> Here's some main mic (414's) with close mics (87's) and each alone to compare. The close mics are... closer sounding, maybe fuller in the lows. When added to the mains it just makes it all sound more rich and satisfying. Feel like I'm becoming an Embertone salesman here. It's a friggin' good piano, don't know what else to say. Half pedaling be damned!
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-1955-steiny-main-close-mp3.14089/][/AUDIOPLUS]
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-1955-steiny-close87s-only-mp3.14090/][/AUDIOPLUS]
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-1955-steiny-main414s-only-mp3.14091/][/AUDIOPLUS]


Thanks for uploading these - very helpful. Really enjoyed the playing too - sounds like Eric Satie at the beginning. Great to hear the natural resonances and sustain ring out. Those close U87's sound very full indeed!

A minor observation using the Lite version here - I'm hearing that the middle range of the piano is tuned _every-so-slightly_ flat (I'm only talking a few 'cents' here) compared to a number of other sampled Steinway Ds which I've A/B'd it with. It's no issue at all in use, just an observation. The treble is pretty consistent tuning/pitch-wise with the others though. One thing this does is give the Embertone piano more of a stretched tuning, which in my opinion is a good thing.


----------



## Vita Et Musica

keepitsimple said:


> Sounds good! Is this with the sweetening tone switch on or off ?


Only thing changed was instrument volume up (equal gain on both) and reverb all the way down.


----------



## Jonas Hallstrom

I just bought the one mic version, and try to download it, but Continuata shuts down after downloading the first part.
Anyone else experienced that?


----------



## Michel Simons

Jonas Hallstrom said:


> I just bought the one mic version, and try to download it, but Continuata shuts down after downloading the first part.
> Anyone else experienced that?



I got an error message, but not a shutdown. I put it on download in the settings panel and then unpacked it manually after everything was downloaded.


----------



## Jonas Hallstrom

Thanks, will try that!


----------



## slobajudge

My experience is: Download only (no install) and wait till its finished all. After that manually extract. Avoid to manually extract or do anything with files when download is still working no matter if earlier files are finished.


----------



## sostenuto

keepitsimple said:


> So I bought the Binaural mics add-on. Played it on its own: Meh it's okay. Then i mixed it with the default mics and...boom, thunder.
> 
> I can tell already that it's going to be a lot of fun experimenting with different mic matching. I'm going for the close mics next.
> 
> Here's a little improv with the Binaural/default combo. 36 velocites, reverb turned off.
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-steinway-default-binaural-mp3.14107/][/AUDIOPLUS]



VERY COOL !  If you are willing to share …. what is your keyboard in this audio ?
Only delay here is all now or mics as ready ….. 

THX


----------



## sostenuto

keepitsimple said:


> I'm sorry i don't understand what you mean. Are you asking what keyboard controller am i using? And if the reverb is a 3rd party plugin or from the mics ?



Yes ... what keyboard controller was used to play in this audio ?


----------



## galactic orange

Along the keyboard controller lines (apologies for the slightly off topic), is anyone using a semi-weighted controller to play this instrument? (possibly blasphemy or utter foolishness, I guess) I was looking at getting the NI Komplete Kontrol S61 MK2 for the majority of VI use, but after hearing this piano something fully-weighted might be in order. Space (and money!) is an issue which is why I don't have both. I am not a skilled piano player, but I once played on a Yamaha P-120 which had a nice feel. I mostly use synths nowadays, but the Embertone 1955 might push me more in the piano direction.


----------



## teclark7

I had a lot of trouble downloading using Connect on Windows 10 DAW. Application kept crashing after a couple of files. I then tried on my gaming PC - same windows 10 version and no problem. It’s a temperamental application.

I dropped Embertone a note telling them. Maybe they can get Continuata to work on it but I notice on the Continuata website they have a beta release of their new replacement application, Conduct. I read into that that Connect is irremedially flaky.


----------



## dzilizzi

Bought this and am really regretting it. Not because it is a bad product. I really have no idea if it is a bad product, I cannot download it. The downloader/installer downloads the first file and then closes. I reopen it, it closes. I sent in a help ticket, they send me a manual download that is not working. Supposedly good until today, but I get an "expired" when I try to download. I've been traveling for work and thought maybe it was the crappy hotel connection. Nope. Still not working at home.

So I am trying the download only option. If this doesn't work, I am done. Very frustrated.


----------



## dzilizzi

It seems to be working on my Windows 7 computer in download only. Keeping my fingers crossed. Maybe it doesn't like Windows 10.


----------



## Floris

Just a recap for users having trouble downloading with Continuata:

-Run the program as Administrator (Windows)

In the settings tab:
-Put download/install mode to: Download only
-Connection mechanism seems to work best at single.

You can unzip the files you end up with and it should work beautifully!


----------



## Michel Simons

Floris said:


> Just a recap for users having trouble downloading with Continuata:
> 
> -Run the program as Administrator (Windows)
> 
> In the settings tab:
> -Put download/install mode to: Download only
> -Connection mechanism seems to work best at single.
> 
> You can unzip the files you end up with and it should work beautifully!



What Floris said. And maybe a pause and resume when it freezes.


----------



## Jonas Hallstrom

Is there a "mix window" for mixing the different microphones?


----------



## mobileavatar

@Embertone
Help needed! When I am down to the last file (53 MB) to download. Continuata suddenly requests for 49xxxxxxxxGB space. Please see the screenshot.


----------



## slobajudge

Do you read the posts before to Download only and not install with Continuata ? Try to manually extract with some of archiver if download its finished.


----------



## al_net77

mobileavatar said:


> @Embertone
> Help needed! When I am down to the last file (53 MB) to download. Continuata suddenly requests for 49xxxxxxxxGB space. Please see the screenshot.



Cool, a 32 bit overflow


----------



## mobileavatar

Sorry I missed that suggestion earlier. Right now there is one more file to be downloaded before I can extract manually. I think it's the default mic nki file.


----------



## slobajudge

Press ok, pause, try to go for settings - Download only - and resume that file. After that manually extract.I hope it will be working, if not close Continuata, start again.


----------



## mobileavatar

slobajudge said:


> Press ok, pause, try to go for settings - Download only - and resume that file. After that manually extract.I hope it will be working, if not close Continuata, start again.



Thanks again for the tip! Tried but no avail. Same "32 bit overflow" message pops up...
Maybe I should download "Conduct" beta app to try (?)


----------



## slobajudge

Do you try to restart PC and then start Continuata again - Download only ? If its only one file and the last, maybe to move all acrhive files to another folder and let that one to donwload to overcome that 32bit overflow ?


----------



## blougui

keepitsimple said:


> So I bought the Binaural mics add-on. Played it on its own: Meh it's okay. Then i mixed it with the default mics and...boom, thunder.
> 
> I can tell already that it's going to be a lot of fun experimenting with different mic matching. I'm going for the close mics next.
> 
> Here's a little improv with the Binaural/default combo. 36 velocites, reverb turned off.
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-steinway-default-binaural-mp3.14107/][/AUDIOPLUS]


I dunno if you keepitsimple but I find impressive piano chops at play here, more complex than not, at least in the virtuoso section  congrats !
Is it me or I feel like sometimes a lot of reverb is happening, or is it the effect of a sustain pedal pressed hard ?


----------



## mobileavatar

I am using Mac OS 10.13. Now I remember I read the earlier comment not to use "Download & Install", but I thought it's only for Windows.

Trying with "Conduct" right now.


----------



## slobajudge

In the end that one file have 2mb, nothing to worry about, contact Emberton to send you, or I will give you if they allow me


----------



## mobileavatar

slobajudge said:


> In the end that one file have 2mb, nothing to worry about, contact Emberton to send you, or I will give you if they allow me



Thanks again for your earlier help!! I finally did it with "Conduct". Yes, the missing file is only around 1MB within that 56MB zip. Hope Continuata will up their game soon enough, esp. in terms of the client side.


----------



## slobajudge

Glad that you make it, enjoy in piano


----------



## dzilizzi

The Windows 7 download crashed with a bunch of C++ errors, but the Windows 10 finally completed.  Now I have 33 files to unpack.  Actually, I can do it fairly easily with 7-zip.

And listening to @keepitsimple 's sample of the Binaural mics (sounds great), I'm kind of wishing I got the full version with all the mics. I figured at $15 each, I could grab them later if I liked how it sounded. And that I would never need the binaural mic. 

Thanks!


----------



## Napier Lopez

keepitsimple said:


> So I bought the Binaural mics add-on. Played it on its own: Meh it's okay. Then i mixed it with the default mics and...boom, thunder.
> 
> I can tell already that it's going to be a lot of fun experimenting with different mic matching. I'm going for the close mics next.
> 
> Here's a little improv with the Binaural/default combo. 36 velocites, reverb turned off.
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/embertone-steinway-default-binaural-mp3.14107/][/AUDIOPLUS]



This setup sounds fantastic. I'm a sucker for binaural recordings and tempted to buy the full version right now just because of it. Hope Embertone decides to allow those of us who bought the lite version to upgrade!

In other news, I think I finally got the dynamics somewhere I like. It took more tweaking than on any of my other VSTs, but yes, starting with a 45-degree line for both dynamic scaling and volume is a good starting point.


----------



## OleJoergensen

What is binaural recordings? A speciel setup of mics or speciel mics?


----------



## blougui

keepitsimple said:


> Thank you very much Blougui  Yes there is surprisingly a lot of room reverb with the sustain samples in the binaural mics. And what sucks is that you can't tame it, it seems present in the sustain samples. I wanted to contact Alex about it. Maybe i should.



Yes, may be you could. It'ld be interesting to have his answer on that matter.


----------



## rrichard63

OleJoergensen said:


> What is binaural recordings? A speciel setup of mics or speciel mics?


See this Wikipedia article. The most important point in this article is, "Binaural recording is intended for replay using headphones and will not translate properly over stereo speakers." So, great for game composers but less than great for most musicians and TV/movie composers.


----------



## Fleer

keepitsimple said:


> What i'm discovering with this library is that each mic has a different flavor (obviously) and therefore can hold its own in being used by itself in a musical context. I think the mic-matching feature and the included multi are more of a bonus, at least that's how i think the Embertone team intended it to be.
> 
> In other libraries with multi mic options, the different mics complete each other like a puzzle to make the big full experience. I don't think that's the case with this piano. I think each mic is an "big experience" by itself. Writing poems here lol.


Well said


----------



## Thorsten Meyer

*Walker 1955 Steinway D by Embertone Review*
By
Cory Pelizzari

Find the review here:
https://www.strongmocha.com/2018/06/22/walker-1955-steinway-d-by-embertone-review/


----------



## Virtuoso

Damn you all. 

I've been telling myself all week that I really don't need yet another piano library*. I even spent the evening playing through several of them and deciding that I _definitely_ don't need another...










...It's downloading now! (and at a remarkable 212Mb/s!) 






*I currently have all the Synthogy Ivory pianos, Vienna CFX, Garritan CFX, Ravenscroft 275, Spectrasonics Keyscape, all Pianoteq pianos, all Native Instruments pianos and last and most definitely least, Spitfire Hans Zimmer Piano.


----------



## slobajudge

Haha, I have them also, and you now what ? I delete them all (keep only Pianoteq) and play only this beast  There are so many great mics combinations, I love Room plus Close the most. This piano just explode with combinations.


----------



## slobajudge

keepitsimple said:


> So i tried the close mics just now, they have some thinness that i don't like. And when mixed with the default mics, they feel imposed and not necessary.
> 
> So far, nothing comes close to the binaural mics for me which *i highly recommend*. They're just clear and balanced on all registers yet have a warm attack where you can hear the felts but that attack never gets buttery, it remains pensive and precise.
> 
> Going for the Room mics next.


Ah, so fun if there is possibility to find what you are looking for. Fortunately this one have that option. I agree, close is thin but with combinations with room shines, at least for me. This is just beginning, will be probably change opinion about mics with time.


----------



## slobajudge

keepitsimple said:


> Are the room mics not as roomy as advertised thus have closeness to them (as stated in a Youtube video review)?


Room mics reminds me of old recordings from Horowitz. They are not so far. With close together there is more body still there is classical sound from it.


----------



## muziksculp

Hehe.. I'm still resisting the temptation to buy this Piano, If I change my mind, I think the Standard version will be enough for my needs.

Let's see how long I can resist adding this Grand.


----------



## slobajudge

In the meantime while you resist we`ll be playing this piano. You can run but you can`t hide


----------



## OleJoergensen

rrichard63 said:


> See this Wikipedia article. The most important point in this article is, "Binaural recording is intended for replay using headphones and will not translate properly over stereo speakers." So, great for game composers but less than great for most musicians and TV/movie composers.


Thank you for explaining.


----------



## JPQ

Embertone said:


> I understand. So much out there to buy! On our website, look for the orange button that says BUY. Thanks!
> 
> -Alex


Good. and i need orchestra base fixed. i looked your solo strings and trumpet and flutes maybe even. even i dont know when i can buy all what i want i try found solution where i can be happy.


----------



## rrichard63

OleJoergensen said:


> Thank you for explaining.


I left out one group of users: those who like to use headphones while listening to their own performances. They will believe they have died and gone to heaven.


----------



## StillLife

Purchased yesterday (with the binaural, close and hammer mics). Such beauty. Can't stop playing. Man...
Just tried out some of Spitfire's free Epic Piano Pads under the default Una Corda....
This has been one of my most satisfying library purchases, alongside The Canterbury Suitcase and Superior Drummer 3.


----------



## Funkybot

Has anyone gotten the multi-control to work with multiple microphone positions? I'm not sure if I'm doing something wrong, or my expectations about what it does are off, but it doesn't seem to work over here. I posted this over on a different forum and had no luck but I'm hoping with a more active, and Kontakt-experienced user-base here, someone can help.

Here's what I'm doing (experienced using Kontakt 5.7 and later 5.7.1):

1. Load the "Blank Multi NKM"
2. Make sure "Mulit Control On" is enabled
3. Load the Close instrument
4. Load the Hammer instrument
5. Make sure both instruments are receiving from Omni and setup my outputs

Result: I see a "Connected to Multi" message on the GUI of each instrument. So far so good. Now let's test it...

6. Set the Close instrument to "Stacatto" and play some notes

Result: The close instrument is "Stacatto" but the hammer instrument is still "normal." The settings aren't in sync visually and they're not in sync when it comes to the audio either (you can hear one stacatto piano with another normal). This is true of al settings. Change the number of layers on one, it's out of sync on the other. Remove the reverb on one, it's still at default on the other. Etc...

Any idea what I'm doing wrong? It's a truly gorgeous sounding library IMO and I bought the full version (and glad I did) but I'd like to understand how to use it properly (and whether it's user error or a bug). I do wish Embertone created a PDF manual that explained this and more, as that seems pretty standard for any kind of commercial library. No complaints about the sound or playability though!


----------



## Funkybot

keepitsimple said:


> There seem to be a bug in the multi that they provide. They're aware of it and it's on their list along other bug fixes/improvements.



Ok, that makes feel somewhat better, but it seems like it doesn't work at all, which is quite the bug. I'll await the update. Thanks!


----------



## Funkybot

keepitsimple said:


> It doesn't work here either. Just make your own combo for now and save it as a new custom multi. That's what i did.



I made some custom mutlis for the microphone positions I'd use the most regularly but it seems like it'd be very easy to run into phase issues with things not being entirely in sync (example round robins triggering different samples or adjusting the velocity curve on one instance and needing to make those exact adjustments on the other) so that approach doesn't seem like a satisfactory long-term workaround. If there's a better way to do things I'm all ears (mostly use Kontakt for playback so I'm not an expert). But as you pointed out, if the developer is aware and working on a fix, no need to beat a dead horse any further. Thanks again.


----------



## Funkybot

Since purchasing, I've been playing around with combining microphones, and I'm happy with the results. I really like the sound of the Close position, but the Close + Hammers setting seems like it would work great in dense mixes (rock, indie, maybe even blues) with more emphasis on the hammers if things are really busy and a super close sound is needed. Close + Room gives a nice sense of space based on how loud you want the room. In a piano-ballad type situation, that may be a good go-to set. Then there's Close + Main is just a very nice sounding combo to my ear and would probably work well in a variety of genres.

Depending on what I want to do mix-wise, I could see any of the above being used, though you're absolutely right in that Close and Main both sound very good by themselves. But so far, I feel like the Room and Wide positions benefit from the reinforcement of adding either Close or Main and blending (I'm not doing any classical, where either of those solo may be totally the right call). Binaural is probably something I'd only use if playing with headphones on.

From a CPU/RAM performance perspective, in a blank project at least, two positions seems to work fairly well here even at 64 sample buffer (RME Fireface). I'm running off an SSD though (6kb preload buffer in Kontakt). Haven't tried 3 positions at once yet (haven't found a need), and totally suspect that would be overkill (from both a CPU and "is this necessary" perspective).


----------



## joeyf

Hi everyone, about to purchase this wonderful piano, can anyone tell me please, I have been listening to various demos and video walkthroughs, is there any tuning problems in the top end of the keyboard, or is it my ears? I don't wish to disperse any negativity, because as i said this is an unbelievable piano, just wanting to hear from others if it's something that could interfere in using this for a recording.


----------



## ChrisSiuMusic

Hey folks, feel free to check out my review of this library! Definitely a strong contender for the only piano library you will ever need, especially for a classical sound. Enjoy!


----------



## jon wayne

joeyf said:


> Hi everyone, about to purchase this wonderful piano, can anyone tell me please, I have been listening to various demos and video walkthroughs, is there any tuning problems in the top end of the keyboard, or is it my ears? I don't wish to disperse any negativity, because as i said this is an unbelievable piano, just wanting to hear from others if it's something that could interfere in using this for a recording.


If they wanted perfection, they would have sampled something else. It gives it character!


----------



## CGR

jon wayne said:


> If they wanted perfection, they would have sampled something else. It gives it character!


I agree Jon – I like the tuning of this piano. It has a bit of 'movement' which sounds great to my ears. I mentioned in an earlier post that the middle octaves of the keyboard are _ever-so-slightly_ flat when I compare it to Ivory American D and CineSamples Piano in Blue, which gives it more of a 'stretched' tuning (the treble being a little sharper in relation to the mid/tenor region).


----------



## Virtuoso

I like that the damper pedal is velocity sensitive, but PLEASE add full continuous controller support for partial pedaling. It's such a part of my technique that I miss it hugely.

Anyone hearing a click on E1 (two octaves below middle C) at higher velocities? If you hammer the notes around it and then hammer the E there's something noticeably weird going on there. (This is on the main mics)


----------



## Virtuoso

Not yet - just trying to figure out whether it's a glitch at my end, a 'feature' of the piano or a sample error.


----------



## CGR

Just a thought about "out of tune" notes. I hear these more as notes with wider unison tunings, which if implemented well, give a sampled piano life. Much prefer that approach to an "airbrushed" version of a piano.


----------



## Embertone

Hey group,

A quick response, I’m on a short vacation with the family (and my wife had me agree not to use my phone, whoops).

The Multi- it must have broken at the very last phase of development, we are looking into it. It’s a helpful tool to combine the mics

Velocity/volume curves- in our first update, we will adjust so that by default everything is a simple 45 degree upwards line.

Half pedaling- something for a future update

Tuning- We spent an additional 2-3 weeks adjusting the tuning by ear in Kontakt, we were unhappy with the original job done. There are a few wide unisons up top which we can’t fix.

Manual- coming ASAP!

Clicking sound- this is the natural sound of the piano mechanism for a few notes at the very highest velocity. We may look into removing those samples.

Thanks!!

Alex


----------



## slobajudge

Embertone said:


> Hey group,
> 
> A quick response, I’m on a short vacation with the family (and my wife had me agree not to use my phone, whoops).
> 
> The Multi- it must have broken at the very last phase of development, we are looking into it. It’s a helpful tool to combine the mics
> 
> Velocity/volume curves- in our first update, we will adjust so that by default everything is a simple 45 degree upwards line.
> 
> Half pedaling- something for a future update
> 
> Tuning- We spent an additional 2-3 weeks adjusting the tuning by ear in Kontakt, we were unhappy with the original job done. There are a few wide unisons up top which we can’t fix.
> 
> Manual- coming ASAP!
> 
> Clicking sound- this is the natural sound of the piano mechanism for a few notes at the very highest velocity. We may look into removing those samples.
> 
> Thanks!!
> 
> Alex


I am looking forward for update. Just one question about half pedal, how far is that future update ? Thank you. Enjoy in your vacation. Well deserved. Piano is beautiful.


----------



## mobileavatar

slobajudge said:


> I am looking forward for update. Just one question about half pedal, how far is that future update ? Thank you. Enjoy in your vacation. Well deserved. Piano is beautiful.



+1. And hope "sympathetic resonance" and "silent key" are still in the road map.
Enjoy your vacation!


----------



## tack

mobileavatar said:


> And hope "sympathetic resonance" and "silent key" are still in the road map.


Is silent key a thing people actually use? I mean it's a cool gimmick but isn't it just a gimmick? Or do people actually use it in some musical context?


----------



## al_net77

tack said:


> Is silent key a thing people actually use? I mean it's a cool gimmick but isn't it just a gimmick? Or do people actually use it in some musical context?



It's useful for practice, a real piano does have silent key and trills practice needs it. If you are not looking to VST pianos for practice you can ignore it


----------



## tack

al_net77 said:


> It's useful for practice, a real piano does have silent key and trills practice needs it.


I'm having a failure of imagination on how it helps with trills practice. No doubt explains why I'm terrible at my trills. 



al_net77 said:


> If you are not looking to VST pianos for practice you can ignore it


For me the Walker is disqualified for practice due to its pedaling behavior (including the absence of what might be called half pedaling but is really adaptive decay rate based on sustain pedal level). I'm very happy to hear Embertone is interested on improving these behavioral aspects in the future.


----------



## al_net77

tack said:


> I'm having a failure of imagination on how it helps with trills practice. No doubt explains why I'm terrible at my trills.



First of all the need is only if you move from a virtual to a grand, as me (I have no access during the week to my grand). You can find very goods keyboards that simulate or replicate hammer action, so physical response is very near; but if the VST plays "always", also at lower velocity, you are not correctly exercising your fingers, because fase passages (as trills) are easier. So, when moving to a grand, you are simply not correcly trained.
I understand this can be problem for 1% of users, but I think these are the things that make a good VST a GREAT VST...




tack said:


> For me the Walker is disqualified for practice due to its pedaling behavior (including the absence of what might be called half pedaling but is really adaptive decay rate based on sustain pedal level). I'm very happy to hear Embertone is interested on improving these behavioral aspects in the future.



Yes, there are very few virtual pianos to practice with.


----------



## tack

al_net77 said:


> but if the VST plays "always", also at lower velocity, you are not correctly exercising your fingers, because fase passages (as trills) are easier.


You mean that you have a risk of striking the piano at near-zero velocity, which on an acoustic piano wouldn't be hard enough to sound the note, but during practice with a VI you inadvertently train yourself into underhitting the notes because they always sound?

I practice on a Kawai CA67 which has triple sensor and double escapement (which admittedly is more of a tactile thing that probably isn't too relavent here) but even so my trills tend to suffer from the opposite problem of overhitting (and consequently being clunky and slow). Probably due to years of practice on an older digital piano with only double sensor, which would encourage (necessitate) greater finger travel than you'd want for fluid trills.




al_net77 said:


> Yes, there are very few virtual pianos to practice with.


Yeah, it's impossible to beat Pianoteq in this category. But then Pianoteq doesn't sound as nice as the Walker (IMHO). It remains a decision of compromise between sound and feel.


----------



## Virtuoso

Embertone said:


> Clicking sound- this is the natural sound of the piano mechanism for a few notes at the very highest velocity. We may look into removing those samples.


This is what I'm hearing - it happens on E1 at velocities of 115 or above.


----------



## StillLife

It seems I can only open the default mics in Komplete Kontrol? I can always open the rest via the edit view, so it is not a big problem, but it would be nice if I could load up another mic (not to mix with default, just as another instrument) via my keyboard.


----------



## Ninth Lion

Been eyeing this one for a while. Which mics do you think would be best suited for lets say... reflective solo piano improvisation? Perhaps with a slight wandering or longing sort of sound.


----------



## lucky909091

Is it possible to put the data of the mic positions to different harddiscs?
I mean: "close mics" to HD c) and "binaural mics" to HD e) ?


----------



## slobajudge

Why not, move the mics and load instrument, when program alert missing samples you point them to different location. If you want to keep that way save new -patch only- in Kontakt, or you can copy full main program with some of the mics on one location and main program with the other on different location and load them independently. Second option is to move where ever you want and then batch resave, when program alert missing samples you point them to other location. But beware it will save like that and overwrite default nki. So make instrument backup.


----------



## lucky909091

Yeah. Thank you for your advice.


----------



## Emmanuel Rousseau

Just purchased the Lite version, hope to have it downloaded before the end of the week (tears, please !).

This is my first dedicated piano library and I hope it will be so good I'll never want to start a collection


----------



## Iskra

Tested the Walker 1955 for a couple of days, and I have to say it has a wonderful tone. Plus, I don't really know it's because the amount of dynamic layers, but the clarity of articulation (specially on p and pp) is great - something I find difficult in other virtual pianos. Great instrument and great playability (and hope it gets its deserved half pedaling function!) 
I made a pass on an old standard I played with the Walker 'standard' version -so just the AKG basic mics- in case someone is interested in this kind of musical setting. Full 36 layers used, the saturation switch activated, if I remember correctly and a bit of EQ and external reverb.


----------



## CGR

Iskra said:


> Tested the Walker 1955 for a couple of days, and I have to say it has a wonderful tone. Plus, I don't really know it's because the amount of dynamic layers, but the clarity of articulation (specially on p and pp) is great - something I find difficult in other virtual pianos. Great instrument and great playability (and hope it gets its deserved half pedaling function!)
> I made a pass on an old standard I played with the Walker 'standard' version -so just the AKG basic mics- in case someone is interested in this kind of musical setting. Full 36 layers used, the saturation switch activated, if I remember correctly and a bit of EQ and external reverb.



Santa Claus is Swingin' to town . . .


----------



## N.Caffrey

Iskra said:


> Tested the Walker 1955 for a couple of days, and I have to say it has a wonderful tone. Plus, I don't really know it's because the amount of dynamic layers, but the clarity of articulation (specially on p and pp) is great - something I find difficult in other virtual pianos. Great instrument and great playability (and hope it gets its deserved half pedaling function!)
> I made a pass on an old standard I played with the Walker 'standard' version -so just the AKG basic mics- in case someone is interested in this kind of musical setting. Full 36 layers used, the saturation switch activated, if I remember correctly and a bit of EQ and external reverb.



Love it!


----------



## Iskra

Thanks guys! On the first test-drive of the walker, the sound of this piano reminded me to the great records of Bill Charlap of the 2000s - which I love. Haven't actually compared, so maybe it's just my memories of that specific music, but anyway... Another good reason to like the Walker 

PS
Not that I'm comparing my playing on the track to Bill Charlap, of course, mine is light-years away behind of his.


----------



## slobajudge

Iskra said:


> Thanks guys! On the first test-drive of the walker, the sound of this piano reminded me to the great records of Bill Charlap of the 2000s - which I love. Haven't actually compared, so maybe it's just my memories of that specific music, but anyway... Another good reason to like the Walker
> 
> PS
> Not that I'm comparing my playing on the track to Bill Charlap, of course, mine is light-years away behind of his.


I enjoy in your playing, sounds like acoustic piano and I love it, really reminds me of old jazz and classical records.


----------



## Iskra

Yep, I forgot to mention my preference is the tone know turned off, sounds more natural to me (actually I don't think I understand what the tone knob do exactly, is it a kinda eq?)


----------



## Emmanuel Rousseau

The Lite version is 6,17Go on my hard drive. Is this normal ? Thought it was more like 12Go  Thanks !


----------



## CGR

whitewasteland said:


> The Lite version is 6,17Go on my hard drive. Is this normal ? Thought it was more like 12Go  Thanks !


If I remember correctly my installation was around 7GB. (there are *12 velocity layers* with the Lite version, which you may be confusing with the GB size).


----------



## rrichard63

whitewasteland said:


> The Lite version is 6,17Go on my hard drive. Is this normal ? Thought it was more like 12Go  Thanks !





CGR said:


> If I remember correctly my installation was around 7GB. (there are *12 velocity layers* with the Lite version, which you may be confusing with the GB size).


I think it's more likely that either (1) the library is 12 GB before compression into .NCW format, or (2) it takes 12 GB of disk space available for Continuata Connect to download and install it.


----------



## desert

When does early bird pricing run out


----------



## rrichard63

desert said:


> When does early bird pricing run out


Embertone said the discount would be available until "at least June 30". I will refrain from relaunching my usual tirade about this.


----------



## HBen

Bought, great sounding piano.


----------



## good

Is this piano suited for playing the classical music that have a lot of padalling and fast tempo?

I have heard many demos of calm music and jazz, and I liked them, but I wonder if they are suitable for classical music.


----------



## ChrisSiuMusic

good said:


> Is this piano suited for playing the classical music that have a lot of padalling and is fast tempo?
> 
> I have heard many demos of calm music and jazz, and I liked them, but I wonder if they are suitable for classical music.


I'd definitely use it for Classical music as well as jazz. It can definitely keep up, I've only had 1-2 pedal lag issues, but no big deal.


----------



## good

ChrisSiuMusic said:


> I'd definitely use it for Classical music as well as jazz. It can definitely keep up, I've only had 1-2 pedal lag issues, but no big deal.



Thank you for informing! I like their 1955 sound. I'll buy it before the end of the early bird period.


----------



## SGordB

good said:


> Is this piano suited for playing the classical music that have a lot of padalling and fast tempo?
> 
> I have heard many demos of calm music and jazz, and I liked them, but I wonder if they are suitable for classical music.



I suspect because it lacks half pedal support (word is they may provide that in an update), I, at least (and this guy: ), find it easy to get clipped notes that were meant to be sustained. I have to be much more aggressive with the pedal than I’m used to to stave that problem off. But then I find the difference between the pedal off and pedal on sample sets to be so black and white, the results are musically “jerky” rather than nuanced. That said, lot of happy users here, obviously, so I’m clearly atypical. Also, I’m using the Lite version. Plus I’m a self taught amateur, so possibly my technical limitations are to blame.


----------



## Iskra

good said:


> Is this piano suited for playing the classical music that have a lot of padalling and fast tempo?
> 
> I have heard many demos of calm music and jazz, and I liked them, but I wonder if they are suitable for classical music.


I'm a classically trained pianist and I would use the Walker for classical, tone is superb, and even now it will fit perfectly many classical pieces... But it really needs to have the half pedal functionality. For classical is a must -not only pieces with a fast tempo or lots of pedaling pieces, but all classical from 1810 onwards . Good thing Embertone said they will look into it for a future update.


----------



## OleJoergensen

I was not sure about what “half-pedaling” means. I search on youtube.
It is a good video and the pianist plays quite beautiful....


It must be quite a work, sampling several levels of half-pedaling, or is this attaind with a script?
Are there any vst pianos with half-pedaling?


----------



## al_net77

OleJoergensen said:


> It must be quite a work, sampling several levels of half-pedaling, or is this attaind with a script?
> Are there any vst pianos with half-pedaling?



Yes, a lot.


----------



## Iskra

OleJoergensen said:


> Are there any vst pianos with half-pedaling?


Many piano VST's have half-pedaling (but I don't want to be more specific as this is a commercial thread and I think is better to leave the possible discussion about other products to the sample talk forum)


----------



## OleJoergensen

Thank you.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

Does anyone know if the mic position pricing remains unchanged after intro pricing stops?
I note that on the sale page, there's no strike through on the extra mic prices. ie I'm expecting them to stay at $15 per set after the intro pricing ends. Wondering if I should get main library now and add mics later or just get the whole package now. Budget would prefer the earlier option but could do either.


----------



## Embertone

For those wishing for half pedal support, I have some questions:

(1) If you’re wishing for real-time support of half pedaling, you must have a pedal/keyboard combination that supports continuous control... (unless you’re using an expression pedal as your sustain pedal, which to me is a very unnatural solution in terms of feel). What kind of keyboard are you using? What kind of pedal? Most entry level sustain pedals seem to be simply on/off, as opposed to CC.

(2) Please post all your thoughts and ideas about half pedaling here! Which libraries successfully implement it? What do you think would need to happen for the instrument to feel better in performance?

(3) for those with sustains cutting off, try simply raising the voice limit from 100 to something higher. I set this on the low side to be safe, but if you’re experiencing notes cutting off (which means you’re playing a lot of notes!) WITHOUT disk or CPU issues, likely it’s because the instrument is reach that 100 voice ceiling.

And for clarity... the sale will end on Monday. Mic positions will remain at $15. Thanks all!

Alex


----------



## SoNowWhat?

Thank you for the clarification Alex.


----------



## jon wayne

Embertone said:


> For those wishing for half pedal support, I have some questions:
> 
> (1) If you’re wishing for real-time support of half pedaling, you must have a pedal/keyboard combination that supports continuous control... (unless you’re using an expression pedal as your sustain pedal, which to me is a very unnatural solution in terms of feel). What kind of keyboard are you using? What kind of pedal? Most entry level sustain pedals seem to be simply on/off, as opposed to CC.
> 
> (2) Please post all your thoughts and ideas about half pedaling here! Which libraries successfully implement it? What do you think would need to happen for the instrument to feel better in performance?
> 
> (3) for those with sustains cutting off, try simply raising the voice limit from 100 to something higher. I set this on the low side to be safe, but if you’re experiencing notes cutting off (which means you’re playing a lot of notes!) WITHOUT disk or CPU issues, likely it’s because the instrument is reach that 100 voice ceiling.
> 
> And for clarity... the sale will end on Monday. Mic positions will remain at $15. Thanks all!
> 
> Alex


Alex, what's the word on an upgrade path from Lite to Full?


----------



## SGordB

Embertone said:


> For those wishing for half pedal support, I have some questions:
> 
> (1) If you’re wishing for real-time support of half pedaling, you must have a pedal/keyboard combination that supports continuous control... (unless you’re using an expression pedal as your sustain pedal, which to me is a very unnatural solution in terms of feel). What kind of keyboard are you using? What kind of pedal? Most entry level sustain pedals seem to be simply on/off, as opposed to CC.
> 
> (2) Please post all your thoughts and ideas about half pedaling here! Which libraries successfully implement it? What do you think would need to happen for the instrument to feel better in performance?
> 
> (3) for those with sustains cutting off, try simply raising the voice limit from 100 to something higher. I set this on the low side to be safe, but if you’re experiencing notes cutting off (which means you’re playing a lot of notes!) WITHOUT disk or CPU issues, likely it’s because the instrument is reach that 100 voice ceiling.
> 
> And for clarity... the sale will end on Monday. Mic positions will remain at $15. Thanks all!
> 
> Alex



I use a Casio Privia 850. Its built-in sustain pedal sends a continuous signal. In terms of other piano VIs I have that do a good job, Pianoteq (of course), Garritan CFX (excellent) and, within Kontakt, while I don't use The Grandeur and its kin often, I haven't felt let down by whatever scripting they use to simulate it. 

Thanks for caring about this issue!


----------



## slobajudge

Embertone said:


> For those wishing for half pedal support, I have some questions:
> 
> (1) If you’re wishing for real-time support of half pedaling, you must have a pedal/keyboard combination that supports continuous control... (unless you’re using an expression pedal as your sustain pedal, which to me is a very unnatural solution in terms of feel). What kind of keyboard are you using? What kind of pedal? Most entry level sustain pedals seem to be simply on/off, as opposed to CC.
> 
> (2) Please post all your thoughts and ideas about half pedaling here! Which libraries successfully implement it? What do you think would need to happen for the instrument to feel better in performance?
> 
> (3) for those with sustains cutting off, try simply raising the voice limit from 100 to something higher. I set this on the low side to be safe, but if you’re experiencing notes cutting off (which means you’re playing a lot of notes!) WITHOUT disk or CPU issues, likely it’s because the instrument is reach that 100 voice ceiling.
> 
> And for clarity... the sale will end on Monday. Mic positions will remain at $15. Thanks all!
> 
> Alex


Lots of digital pianos even in low price range support half pedal so this is not an issue. As above stated Garritan CFX, VSL CFX, Pianoteq of course but this is modeling piano, Ivory and many more. All big players have it. Production voices also, some of them sample half pedal and some of them use scripts to emulate it. Whatever you choose make it good. I really wait for that. Piano is beautiful, playable and need this like a desert miss the rain (yeah, we can sing it  ). Thanks in advance.


----------



## tack

Embertone said:


> (1) If you’re wishing for real-time support of half pedaling, you must have a pedal/keyboard combination that supports continuous control... (unless you’re using an expression pedal as your sustain pedal, which to me is a very unnatural solution in terms of feel). What kind of keyboard are you using? What kind of pedal? Most entry level sustain pedals seem to be simply on/off, as opposed to CC.


I have two setups with continuous pedals:

Kawai CA67
Roland DP-10 connected to a Komplete Kontrol S88. On the S88, the sustain pedal port supports continuous pedals.
Previously I used a M-Audio controller which only supported discrete sustain pedals, however I connected the DP-10 to the expression port for sustain instead, remapping it to CC64, to get continuous pedaling on that controller




Embertone said:


> (2) Please post all your thoughts and ideas about half pedaling here! Which libraries successfully implement it? What do you think would need to happen for the instrument to feel better in performance?


Galaxy Vintage D is the one to model here IMO. I don't think it has half-pedal specific samples (at least based on the Kontakt group names it doesn't seem like it), but rather appears to emulate it by implementing a volume ramp of pedal-down sample in relation to the sustain pedal value.

So while CC64 value 127 (or perhaps within some range like 110-127) would just play the pedal-down sample as-is, values below that would gradually adjust the volume of pedal-down sample to simulate partial contact with the dampers on the strings. Partial contact would adjust the velocity of the decay (a volume ramp), and the more contact, the steeper the ramp. The player pedaling deeper would decrease the contact of the dampers, which would dynamically adjust the slope of the volume ramp (to make it less steep) -- and if fully repedalled to CC64 value 127, the ramp would be flat, and so the pedal-down sample would just continue to ring out from its current position without any further dynamic volume adjustments. Meanwhile, letting off the pedal would steepen the volume ramp, causing the voice to drop more quickly in volume.

Hopefully that makes sense? I can rephrase if not (with math to eliminate ambiguity ).

IMO this kind of pedal behaviour is perfectly good for classical music performances. This kind of responsiveness to pedal depth would allow better note blending: as it is now, you either have notes vanishing abruptly, or sustained notes are excessively blurred together. Being able to adjust the volume ramp of existing voices via pedal depth will enable more nuanced blending of notes.

Half pedal samples would be icing on the cake, but I feel much, much less important than just getting good pedaling behavior. For the Walker, given the sheer size of it (all those great velocity layers and mic positions) I'd have to think it's just more trouble than it's worth.

Meanwhile a few tweaks on the scripting side could really make the Walker the one to beat.




Embertone said:


> (3) for those with sustains cutting off, try simply raising the voice limit from 100 to something higher.


I shared this with you guys over email but I'll repeat it here as part of this conversation: in my case (author of the video @SGordB linked to above), the notes dropping out wasn't caused by hitting a voice ceiling but rather seems to be related to the fact that I triggered the note while the sustain pedal was in the midway position. It's quite possible it's related to some internal threshold that decides whether to trigger the pedal-down sample and instead triggered the pedal-up sample, which wasn't caught from repedalling.


----------



## Iskra

I'm using a yamaha or roland stage piano as controller. Usually I use a FC3 pedal, which allows half pedal. For serious playing I can't use an on/off pedal.
I mostly use all vilabs pianos, Ravenscroft have a great implementation of half pedal (not kontakt though).
IIRC, Galaxy pianos for kontakt have a nice half pedal function.
Edit: Tack beat me to the Galaxy half pedal and he explained it way better.


----------



## SGordB

Iskra said:


> I'm using a yamaha or roland stage piano as controller. Usually I use a FC3 pedal, which allows half pedal. For serious playing I can't use an on/off pedal.
> I mostly use all vilabs pianos, Ravenscroft have a great implementation of half pedal (not kontakt though).
> IIRC, Galaxy pianos for kontakt have a nice half pedal function.


Yeah, +1 on VI Labs. I play their TrueKeys series, and the half-pedal is smooth.


----------



## chasmanian

Embertone Alex,
Garritan CFX originally had no half pedaling, nor re-pedaling.
people asked for it. it took a while, but then:

Garritan Abbey Road Studios CFX Concert Grand Update for Windows.........
see this at PW:
http://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/2586624/1.html


----------



## SoNowWhat?

...and I'm all in.


----------



## Lode_Runner

SoNowWhat? said:


> ...and I'm all in.


Me too


----------



## SoNowWhat?

Lode_Runner said:


> Me too


----------



## desert

Can't tell if the mics included has that stereo effect (bass notes left / treble notes right)

Can anyone confirm?


----------



## desert

ok, I bought the full version :D Now the download will take weeks on an Aus internet :(


----------



## SGordB

desert said:


> Can't tell if the mics included has that stereo effect (bass notes left / treble notes right)
> 
> Can anyone confirm?


Yep. That's the default. Plus there's a switch to flip it, and you can adjust the spread.


----------



## Ashermusic

Embertone said:


> For those wishing for half pedal support, I have some questions:
> 
> (1) If you’re wishing for real-time support of half pedaling, you must have a pedal/keyboard combination that supports continuous control... (unless you’re using an expression pedal as your sustain pedal, which to me is a very unnatural solution in terms of feel). What kind of keyboard are you using? What kind of pedal? Most entry level sustain pedals seem to be simply on/off, as opposed to CC.
> 
> (2) Please post all your thoughts and ideas about half pedaling here! Which libraries successfully implement it? What do you think would need to happen for the instrument to feel better in performance?
> 
> (3) for those with sustains cutting off, try simply raising the voice limit from 100 to something higher. I set this on the low side to be safe, but if you’re experiencing notes cutting off (which means you’re playing a lot of notes!) WITHOUT disk or CPU issues, likely it’s because the instrument is reach that 100 voice ceiling.
> 
> And for clarity... the sale will end on Monday. Mic positions will remain at $15. Thanks all!
> 
> Alex



Yep, mine does.
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/de...-style-sustain-pedal-with-half-damper-control. A plus 1 for me on this wish.


----------



## HardyP

Embertone said:


> (1) If you’re wishing for real-time support of half pedaling, you must have a pedal/keyboard combination that supports continuous control... (unless you’re using an expression pedal as your sustain pedal, which to me is a very unnatural solution in terms of feel). What kind of keyboard are you using? What kind of pedal? Most entry level sustain pedals seem to be simply on/off, as opposed to CC.


I think every stage piano has it, at least 1 step in between (I think my FP5 maybe 2 steps). Rolands standard sustain pedal (see link in Jay´s post) can be switched between continuous and switched behaviour. I use their RPU-3*, which is continuous, too - and generally very recommended (3 pedals, superb feeling, rock stable, nearly no movement on stage,...)!


*PS: I only with that one discovered/have been able to track down some bad samples/programming in ew Pianos, which have been (silently, but finally!!) fixed some months ago after years of waiting...


----------



## Batrawi

Sorry if that has been answered somewhere here...but what mic position comes with the lite version?


----------



## jonnybutter

Just installed this library (the full version, not all the mic positions, but not the lite version). May I just say that this is a wonderful sounding and feeling piano? I think there are a couple rough edges to this instrument, but overall, it's really nice. A pleasure to play. Very balanced sounding.


----------



## Morning Coffee

Can anyone compare this Embertone piano with the Imperfect Samples grand pianos which came out years ago? There isn't a lot of videos, if any, reviewing Imperfect Samples pianos, but they sound the most natural to me, so I am wondering why that is. But Embertone is onto a winner here I think.


----------



## jonnybutter

Morning Coffee said:


> Can anyone compare this Embertone piano with the Imperfect Samples grand pianos which came out years ago? There isn't a lot of videos, if any, reviewing Imperfect Samples pianos, but they sound the most natural to me, so I am wondering why that is. But Embertone is onto a winner here I think.



I can't compare to Imperfect Samples piano, but I agree with above poster that this piano is reminiscent of Piano in Blue, except even better. The Walker has some slightly, well, imperfect-sounding samples, but it's not so many that it sounds out of tune or nasty (at least not yet! I just got it tonight). Having some weird piano noise stuff sprinkled in gives it realism to my ear.


----------



## Embertone

Hi all,

We're working on some bug fixes/feature additions THIS WEEK (as well as creating a full-featured manual). Will continue to update everyone here, and also:

*TODAY IS THE LAST DAY OF THE EARLY BIRD SALE!*

FYI 

-Alex


----------



## SGordB

Embertone said:


> Hi all,
> 
> We're working on some bug fixes/feature additions THIS WEEK (as well as creating a full-featured manual). Will continue to update everyone here, and also:
> 
> *TODAY IS THE LAST DAY OF THE EARLY BIRD SALE!*
> 
> FYI
> 
> -Alex


I'm still hoping for half pedal support, but whatever you do, for the love of God, fix "spacialization"! Oh, the humanity :-(


----------



## Embertone

What do you mean?


----------



## sostenuto

Embertone said:


> What do you mean?



Ha ! I'm probably passing on the Bruce anyway …..


----------



## rottoy

Bruce? What is going on?


----------



## sostenuto

From Mic description page:

_*Binaural Perspective*_
Mics: Stereo binaural dummy head (affectionately named *Bruce*)
Position: 2ft from the the keyboard at the player’s perspective.
Qualities: Realistic spatialization, especially when listened through headphones.

Already feeling _spatialized_ this morning ….


----------



## SGordB

Embertone said:


> What do you mean?



I was sure you guys had noticed the typo by now, at least in the Lite version:

Damn, can't seem to embed the screenshot. Here's a link: https://www.dropbox.com/s/052kmnbvt2zs30e/Screen Shot 2018-07-03 at 9.52.45 AM.png?dl=0


----------



## sostenuto

*@ SGordB* …. Good Catch !! …. but, they'll still get off the hook !! 

spacialization" definition | English definition dictionary | Reverso
'_spacialization_' definition, meaning, English dictionary, synonym, see also 'specialization',spacial',spallation',socialization', Reverso dictionary, English definition ...


----------



## jon wayne

SGordB said:


> I'm still hoping for half pedal support, but whatever you do, for the love of God, fix "spacialization"! Oh, the humanity :-(


Yeah, misspelling makes that piano sound awful. Replacing it with free piano that knows how to spell!!!!


----------



## slobajudge

Embertone said:


> Hi all,
> 
> We're working on some bug fixes/feature additions THIS WEEK (as well as creating a full-featured manual). Will continue to update everyone here
> 
> -Alex


Great news, looking forward to it.


----------



## Batrawi

Embertone said:


> TODAY IS THE LAST DAY OF THE EARLY BIRD SALE!



How come? I was trying to purchase today but the early bird discount didn't apply. 
I contacted your support team and "Nick Cameron" responded to me that it has unfortunately ended yesterday!
(Would you be able to help the poor guy here)


----------



## Embertone

When did you try it? The discount should work through 11:59PM, we extended the sale one more day because of an error on our side communicating with users.

Alex


----------



## Batrawi

I tried it early this day (@ around 7am cairo time) it didnt work back then. Nick just sent me another mail now informing that it's working now till end of today.

...purchased...lucky me


----------



## Batrawi

Now downloading.. and while really excited about the library overall, the thing I'm anxious about the most is that tiny space I'm pointing at below...I really have high hopes that scrolling the "sample start" knob all the way to the left, would mean hearing more of the "key down" noise (as opposed to hammer strike noise).

This may sound as a ridiculously unnecessary detail, but trust me it gives a magical *thickness* & *weight* to the sound specially when playing at low velocity. And Yes there will be a tiny delay in response for sure but it's definitely worth it IMO!

If not the case, then I hope Alex & embertone would consider this feature in a future update...I mean, they went crazy meticulous with the release notes already... so why not


----------



## desert

The sound/sample quality is amazing. I'm loving these deep low notes and dreamy high notes


----------



## slobajudge

desert said:


> The sound/sample quality is amazing. I'm loving these deep low notes and dreamy high notes


I have problem now with all other piano libraries, now they sound flat and empty compare to Embertone.


----------



## Ashermusic

slobajudge said:


> I have problem now with all other piano libraries, now they sound flat and empty compare to Embertone.



I just wrote a very positive review for AskAudio. Try combining the main and hammer mics, the sound is glorious.


----------



## slobajudge

Ashermusic said:


> I just wrote a very positive review for AskAudio. Try combining the main and hammer mics, the sound is glorious.


Yes, in the beginning I was mainly use room with close mics, but now I use only main with close or hammer mics as you said. Fantastic combination really. Room mics goes better with hammer mics than close for some classical distance feeling.


----------



## HardyP

Embertone said:


> We're working on some bug fixes/feature additions THIS WEEK (as well as creating a full-featured manual). Will continue to update everyone here,


Knock, knock....


----------



## desert

HardyP said:


> Knock, knock....


It’s been like a few days dude. Give them some time...


----------



## HardyP

desert said:


> It’s been like a few days dude. Give them some time...


Just wanna make shure they don‘t work on Sundays...


----------



## Batrawi

I'm in love with that piano...truely a piece of art!

However sorry for being naggy @Embertone but is there hope to see this feature implemented for extra meatiness to the sound?


----------



## Embertone

An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.

Thanks!!

Alex


----------



## good

Embertone said:


> An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.
> 
> Thanks!!
> 
> Alex



Oh, that's fantastic!
You've solved its only flaw I think. It is closest to perfection among piano virtual instruments that have recently come out.
Thank you for your hard work.


----------



## slobajudge

I was checking email everyday, excellent news, I am glad that you decide to bite more than just small changes. So glad. Can`t wait.


----------



## Funkybot

Embertone said:


> An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.
> 
> Thanks!!
> 
> Alex



Great news on the documentation and the update (honestly, why not release both together?). Will the update include a fix to the script that's supposed to link parameters when using multiple microphones? How does it ensure the same sample is being triggered at the same time across instances?


----------



## jneebz

Embertone said:


> An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.
> 
> Thanks!!
> 
> Alex


This is just ridiculously generous. Thanks @Embertone !


----------



## HBen

Embertone said:


> An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.
> 
> Thanks!!
> 
> Alex



Alex, we appreciate your efforts in making this product a better one. As a new customer to Embertone, how will we receive the updates? By email?


----------



## CGR

HBen said:


> Alex, we appreciate your efforts in making this product a better one. As a new customer to Embertone, how will we receive the updates? By email?


Given this is a 1955 Steinway, expect the update to arrive by Telegram


----------



## Fleer

Go, Embertone


----------



## jamwerks

WOW! Just picked up the lite version (great to be able to "try" that way). Totally awesome. Definitely the best piano vst I own. Will definitely move up to the full version!


----------



## SoNowWhat?

I've got all mic positions but so far have only had time to unpack and try close and main mics...







Damn, this is good. Sooooo tasty.


----------



## fuztec25

Just bought the lite version... Soon to be tested


----------



## erica-grace

These demos sound great.  Almost too bad I do not need another piano :(


----------



## Fleer

Oh but you do ...


----------



## fuztec25

Ok Just fired up my lite version... I'm not a good pianist or listener but... To my ears plays magic even the lite one!


----------



## ReelToLogic

Embertone said:


> An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.
> 
> Thanks!!
> 
> Alex



Just curious if there is any update on this. I'm thinking of purchasing but figure I'll wait until this update is out to simplify things.


----------



## HBen

What about the update for now? when will it be released?


----------



## slobajudge

14.07 Emberton said week or two. We are already at the end of week two so I suppose it will be soon, probably at the end of the month. Implementing half pedaling and testing fixed bugs took some time...


----------



## Ashermusic

Here is my review btw:
https://ask.audio/articles/review-embertone-walker-1955-steinway-d


----------



## SoundChris

Ashermusic said:


> Here is my review btw:
> https://ask.audio/articles/review-embertone-walker-1955-steinway-d



Totally d´accord. Wonderful piano. Even I already got almost any out there and with Pianos Platinum didn´t think I would need another piano anymore ... well ... this instrument totally convinced me. Dont know how you see it - for me the big pro of this library (next to the great sound, controls and all the other positive aspects you already mentioned) I was really surprised how realistic it feels when you play it live. Very nice. I hope it will fit well with the Josh Bell violin, too (and of course with a new solo cello that they hopefully will announce asap - stil hoping it will be a Yo Yo Ma Cello  ). Good review btw!


----------



## chapbot

Ashermusic said:


> Here is my review btw:
> https://ask.audio/articles/review-embertone-walker-1955-steinway-d


Thanks! I was wondering what you thought of it.


----------



## Allen Constantine

@Embertone Any news regarding that update?


----------



## SoNowWhat?

Its beautiful without the update. 
Sure half pedalling will be nice but I’m very happy so far. I can’t stop playing it.


----------



## slobajudge

SoNowWhat? said:


> Its beautiful without the update.
> Sure half pedalling will be nice but I’m very happy so far. I can’t stop playing it.


It will be more beautiful with half pedal.


----------



## EgM

Best piano ever, and super playable! I bought the lite version to test I guess, but sorry if this has been asked before: Can you upgrade from Lite to the 99$ version? (I totally didn't think I'd like it this much...  )


----------



## good

EgM said:


> Best piano ever, and super playable! I bought the lite version to test I guess, but sorry if this has been asked before: Can you upgrade from Lite to the 99$ version? (I totally didn't think I'd like it this much...  )



Yes, it is possible to upgrade to full version.


----------



## EgM

good said:


> Yes, it is possible to upgrade to full version.



Oh!! Excellent, do you know how to proceed on their page to do so?


----------



## good

EgM said:


> Oh!! Excellent, do you know how to proceed on their page to do so?



Embertone said that they'd proceed it if people who want to upgrade to full version contact them by email. : )


----------



## EgM

good said:


> Embertone said that they'd proceed it if people who want to upgrade to full version contact them by email. : )



Thanks!


----------



## slobajudge

Knock, knock, Embertone, alerts doesn`t working here properly, can you test it ?  I am just checking my impatiens for update.


----------



## paularthur

Curious, where was this recorded?


----------



## Fleer

There’s a great story about this special piano at Keyboard Mag: “Although all acoustic pianos are technically one-of-a-kind instruments, in the end Embertone’s _Walker 1955 Steinway D _virtual piano flagship owes its name and, indeed, its very existence to a truly one-of-a-kind 9’ Steinway Model D dating back to 1955. The instrument in question ultimately made its way to a beautiful rural private concert hall in Raleigh (in Embertone’s ‘native’ North Carolina), designed and owned by John Q. Walker, a brilliant software engineer who pioneered the concept of ‘re-performance’ with a company called Zenph, Inc. As the company’s founder, Walker worked with a team of specialists who, helped by Sony recording engineers, developed a way of analysing old recordings in order to create live re-performances — converting piano tracks into precise keystrokes and pedal motions for playback on computer-controlled grand pianos, in other words. This proprietary technology enabled them to capture and reproduce every nuance of performances by some of the greatest pianists in the world, including Glenn Gould, Oscar Peterson, and Rachmaninoff.”


----------



## Geoff Grace

Fleer said:


> There’s a great story about this special piano at Keyboard Mag: “Although all acoustic pianos are technically one-of-a-kind instruments, in the end Embertone’s _Walker 1955 Steinway D _virtual piano flagship owes its name and, indeed, its very existence to a truly one-of-a-kind 9’ Steinway Model D dating back to 1955. The instrument in question ultimately made its way to a beautiful rural private concert hall in Raleigh (in Embertone’s ‘native’ North Carolina), designed and owned by John Q. Walker, a brilliant software engineer who pioneered the concept of ‘re-performance’ with a company called Zenph, Inc. As the company’s founder, Walker worked with a team of specialists who, helped by Sony recording engineers, developed a way of analysing old recordings in order to create live re-performances — converting piano tracks into precise keystrokes and pedal motions for playback on computer-controlled grand pianos, in other words. This proprietary technology enabled them to capture and reproduce every nuance of performances by some of the greatest pianists in the world, including Glenn Gould, Oscar Peterson, and Rachmaninoff.”


Thanks, *Fleer*!

Article link:

Embertone Announces Walker 1955 Steinway D Virtual Piano

Best,

Geoff


----------



## mobileavatar

slobajudge said:


> Knock, knock, Embertone, alerts doesn`t working here properly, can you test it ?  I am just checking my impatiens for update.



Not sure why Embertone has time to organize the sale event, but no time to update us...


----------



## Embertone

I’m no longer getting notifications when this thread comes back to life...

Update is ASAP. The new half pedaling sounds and feels great. We’re testing to make sure it’s perfect. The Multi (for combining mics) is fixed, and we’re adding some interesting new sample content for the standard (non-lite) version of the instrument. Huzzah!

Talk soon,

Alex


----------



## CGR

Here's a little Jazz trio test I played with the Embertone 1955 Walker Steinway Lite (an excerpt from the tune 'Edge of Happiness' by the Tord Gustavsen Trio):



What a pleasure it is to work with this sampled piano!


----------



## SoNowWhat?

CGR said:


> Here's a little Jazz trio test I played with the Embertone 1955 Walker Steinway Lite (an excerpt from the tune 'Edge of Happiness' by the Tord Gustavsen Trio):
> 
> 
> 
> What a pleasure it is to work with this sampled piano!



Agreed. I’ve been having a little explore with it over the last day or two and I love it. Adding eq/channel strips give it even more options/timbres. Lovely.


----------



## Fleer

True. Immensely enjoyable.


----------



## OleJoergensen

Im having troubles with cliped tones with the sustain pedal. Is there any work around for this or does it require an update?
The sound of this piano is wonderful


----------



## slobajudge

OleJoergensen said:


> Im having troubles with cliped tones with the sustain pedal. Is there any work around for this or does it require an update?
> The sound of this piano is wonderful


Increase voices from default 100 to much more (mine is set on 256) and it will be ok. (settings above main Embertone window where is your output, midi ch., memory, voices, etc.)


----------



## OleJoergensen

slobajudge said:


> Increase voices from default 100 to much more (mine is set on 256) and it will be ok. (settings above main Embertone window where is your output, midi ch., memory, voices, etc.)


Great, I will try tomorrow.
Thank you


----------



## Allen Constantine

So, when is the update coming out?


----------



## Iskra

I'm actually waiting for the update with half-pedal to come out to get some other mic positions (I have the basic mics now)...


----------



## HardyP

AllenConstantine said:


> So, when is the update coming out?


It seems to me, that the more we ask, the longer it takes...: It was end of July here, then ASAP there -
so I hope it won´t be "next couple of months" now


----------



## slobajudge

HardyP said:


> It seems to me, that the more we ask, the longer it takes...: It was end of July here, then ASAP there -
> so I hope it won´t be "next couple of months" now


Despite I check everyday for update and I really need that piano at the moment for my project, I will forgive them if they make the most playable piano vst on the market at least as Garritan CFX. (p.s.<whisper>Embertone, please not couple of months  </whisper> )


----------



## keepitsimple

HardyP said:


> It seems to me, that the more we ask, the longer it takes


That's a good sign That means they're making sure every feature request is being attended for carefully until they're happy with the result. And believe me there are many requests...and each one is different.


----------



## HardyP

I meant it just in terms of questions "when will it come", w/o feature requests.
But nice twist ...

What additional "many requests" did we see since end of July?


----------



## slobajudge

HardyP said:


> I meant it just in terms of questions "when will it come", w/o feature requests.
> But nice twist ...
> 
> What additional "many requests" did we see since end of July?


Hmm, let me try to count some of them, let`s see, half pedal, fixing re-pedaling, when press sustain pedal after a while some notes disappeared , even velocity response from all notes, multi mics patch, attack delay issue...is there more  ?


----------



## keepitsimple

HardyP said:


> I meant it just in terms of questions "when will it come", w/o feature requests.
> But nice twist ...
> 
> What additional "many requests" did we see since end of July?


Wasn't twisting anything. Was trying to be optimistic that's all.


----------



## HardyP

keepitsimple said:


> Was trying to be optimistic that's all.


That´s a good habit ...


----------



## Francis Bourre

As unbelievable as this may be, sometimes developers deserve holidays.


----------



## keepitsimple

HardyP said:


> That´s a good habit ...


We all learn from you. We’re your students.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

ka00 said:


> Has anyone reported this noisiness on key E2? I've noticed it on the room and binaural mics, with una corda on. I have some midi velocity processing turned on, so my output velocity numbers might not match up exactly with the input velocity reported here.



Hmmm, just checked here but can't reproduce it. I wonder is this due to a particular setting? ie very specific. Can you go through a few more of your settings? I have una corda on and am using room and binaural mics to check. Can you tell me exactly what the velocity is (without the velocity processing)? How many Velocity layers are you using and I take it from this example that you have rr's on. 
Release samples? etc?
Or maybe somebody else can try to reproduce the artefact and might have more luck than me.


----------



## ka00

SoNowWhat? said:


> Hmmm, just checked here but can't reproduce it. I wonder is this due to a particular setting? ie very specific. Can you go through a few more of your settings? I have una corda on and am using room and binaural mics to check. Can you tell me exactly what the velocity is (without the velocity processing)? How many Velocity layers are you using and I take it from this example that you have rr's on.
> Release samples? etc?
> Or maybe somebody else can try to reproduce the artefact and might have more luck than me.



Thanks for checking. I've stripped away all processing except for additional gain.

I've identified that the noisy sample is on the Binaural mics, mapped to E2, between midi velocities 34-38 inclusive.

My settings are: all 36 velocity layers enabled, una corda ON, and round robin OFF.

In the previous video, I wasn't consistently hitting the right velocities, so the noise was intermittent, making it appear as if it was a noisy RR sample, but it isn't.

Here's another video without any processing (except gain):

I'll send Embertone an email. Could maybe be an easy fix.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

ka00 said:


> Thanks for checking. I've stripped away all processing except for additional gain.
> 
> I've identified that the noisy sample is on the Binaural mics, mapped to E2, between midi velocities 34-38 inclusive.
> 
> My settings are: all 36 velocity layers enabled, una corda ON, and round robin OFF.
> 
> In the previous video, I wasn't consistently hitting the right velocities, so the noise was intermittent, making it appear as if it was a noisy RR sample, but it isn't.
> 
> Here's another video without any processing (except gain):
> 
> 
> I'll send Embertone an email. Could maybe be an easy fix.



I can't reproduce it here. Bizarre.
I've tried everything I can think of. 
Played with and without sustain pedal. 
Do you have adaptive releases on or off?
I've tried with velocity at 34-38 as % (x/100) and as a direct midi value (x/127)
I've swept up and down with midi values around those levels and can't get it here. Really strange. It sounds like some unwanted sample recording, but I can't get it here.

Maybe we can get someone else to try.


----------



## OleJoergensen

I couldn’t reproduce it either...


----------



## Funkybot

Is it possible a file just got corrupted during download? I recently had a library that had some glitches and a second download of the content resolved the issue.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

ka00 said:


> Weird. I emailed Embertone support and it’s been forwarded to the developers. So, I’ll leave it in their hands. I wonder if I attempt to redownload the binaural samples if I’ll get anything different this time. Will try that later on.


Yeah, I was going to suggest that but what you’re showing doesn’t sound like something you’d expect from a dodgy download. Well, I wouldn’t think so anyway. I’m hoping somebody else can reproduce it so we can properly diagnose the problem.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

OleJoergensen said:


> I couldn’t reproduce it either...


Thank you for trying.


----------



## prodigalson

Really struggling with this. Getting tons of dropouts and pops and clicks. All notes will suddenly stop. On a Mac running logic. Samples are streaming from SSD, running i7 3.2ghz, 32GB RAM. Even when buffer is at 512 (with the resulting totally unusable latency) Tried upping max voices to 512 and still no luck. Totally unusable right now. Anyone have any thoughts?


----------



## SoNowWhat?

prodigalson said:


> Really struggling with this. Getting tons of dropouts and pops and clicks. All notes will suddenly stop. On a Mac running logic. Samples are streaming from SSD, running i7 3.2ghz, 32GB RAM. Even when buffer is at 512 (with the resulting totally unusable latency) Tried upping max voices to 512 and still no luck. Totally unusable right now. Anyone have any thoughts?


I had some issues with notes dropping when voices set at base of 100. Upped to 256 (following advice earlier in one of the Walker threads) and problem solved. Not had any issues since. I'm running a 3.5Ghz i7 with 32Gb ram and streaming from SSD. At the risk of suggesting something that is probably really stupid; even when streaming from SSD it takes a looooong time for samples to fully load here. Are you seeing the problem when patch is fully loaded? Sorry about asking this, just trying to eliminate possible causes.

Are you getting a CPU spike? or is it something else?

What sort of latency are you getting (in ms)?

I've had something similar happen with another library where it seems to cause me problems but everyone else appeared fine. Quite frustrating.


----------



## ka00

SoNowWhat? said:


> Yeah, I was going to suggest that but what you’re showing doesn’t sound like something you’d expect from a dodgy download. Well, I wouldn’t think so anyway. I’m hoping somebody else can reproduce it so we can properly diagnose the problem.



I was actually thinking, rather than the download being dodgy, that maybe it was quietly identified in the initial release and then quickly patched by Embertone.

I could be wrong, but I think the sample file in question is:
1955 Steinway - BRC Corda Dry 1.nkx
It has a date created/modified of 2018-06-22, 6:34 AM. Would the date on your file be newer perhaps?

I'm actually perfectly content to let Embertone troubleshoot this themselves, but in case you were curious...


----------



## SoNowWhat?

ka00 said:


> I was actually thinking, rather than the download being dodgy, that maybe it was quietly identified in the initial release and then quickly patched by Embertone.
> 
> I could be wrong, but I think the sample file in question is:
> 1955 Steinway - BRC Corda Dry 1.nkx
> It has a date created/modified of 2018-06-22, 6:34 AM. Would the date on your file be newer perhaps?
> 
> I'm actually perfectly content to let Embertone troubleshoot this themselves, but in case you were curious...


I'll take a look. 

Aaaaaaha! My sample file of that name has the following metadata. 25/7/2018, 12:17pm. 
You must have been an early adopter.

I hope that @Embertone are following the thread.


----------



## OleJoergensen

prodigalson said:


> Really struggling with this. Getting tons of dropouts and pops and clicks. All notes will suddenly stop. On a Mac running logic. Samples are streaming from SSD, running i7 3.2ghz, 32GB RAM. Even when buffer is at 512 (with the resulting totally unusable latency) Tried upping max voices to 512 and still no luck. Totally unusable right now. Anyone have any thoughts?


I am experiencing a similar problem but not that dramatic. 
I use 2 mics at 36 layer on a Mac pro 3.7 ghz 4 core, 64 GB ram, Audio buffer 256 in Logic. I believe it should be able to handle that. By suggestion of SoNowWhat, I raised the voices in Kontakt to 256 but it didn’t make any difference. Yesterday I tried to raise the buffer cize in Kontakt from 48 (I think ) to higher but it actually made it worse. Then I lowered the buffer size to 24 and it helped a grat deal but still some few pop and clicks.
I have noticed that the last of the 8 cpu threads in Logic cpu meter, have some serious jump. After reading an other tread about Logic and how it works with Kontakt (I didnt not understand al of it) https://vi-control.net/community/th...-core-cpu-spikes-in-logic.74425/#post-4272652, I actually think, that is the problem. I will soon try to use This great Piano-Kontakt with Ve- pro, I think and hope it will work better that way. 
I must say again, Embertone Steinway just sounds lovely .


----------



## OleJoergensen

I just tried to load Kontakt- Embertone Steinway in ve-pro but it just makes it worse :-/. I did try diffirent cpu thread settings in Ve-pro. I think the pop and clicks occurs with the sustain pedal but not al the time.
Maybe the comming update from Embertone will fix it.


----------



## slobajudge

OleJoergensen said:


> I just tried to load Kontakt- Embertone Steinway in ve-pro but it just makes it worse :-/. I did try diffirent cpu thread settings in Ve-pro. I think the pop and clicks occurs with the sustain pedal but not al the time.
> Maybe the comming update from Embertone will fix it.


I don`t know why you have that problems, on my old PC laptop (2012) i5 3210m Emberton working with no problems with one mic position, no pops, cracks etc. On my PC desktop i5 4690 working like a charm. There are only problems we already mention in Emberton itself.


----------



## Embertone

Hey gang,

I am monitoring this thread!! I would suggest those with performance issues reach out to us directly. Our tech support guru, Nick, is extremely detailed compiling everyone's issues, so we can probably identify what's going on pretty quickly.

Our half pedaling script-work is done! There is only one (extremely time consuming but) minor issue left, which you will notice (and probably chuckle about) when the update comes through.

Thanks and talk soon!

Alex


----------



## LamaRose

prodigalson said:


> Really struggling with this. Getting tons of dropouts and pops and clicks. All notes will suddenly stop. On a Mac running logic. Samples are streaming from SSD, running i7 3.2ghz, 32GB RAM. Even when buffer is at 512 (with the resulting totally unusable latency) Tried upping max voices to 512 and still no luck. Totally unusable right now. Anyone have any thoughts?



Increasing voices only puts more potential strain on your CPU - pops & clicking. Have you tested this in Kontakt standalone - outside of logic? Odds are it's a Logic issue of how it distributes CPU load during recording/real time playing.


----------



## slobajudge

Embertone said:


> Hey gang,
> There is only one (*extremely time consuming but*) minor issue left


----------



## Fleer

Embertone said:


> Hey gang,
> 
> I am monitoring this thread!! I would suggest those with performance issues reach out to us directly. Our tech support guru, Nick, is extremely detailed compiling everyone's issues, so we can probably identify what's going on pretty quickly.
> 
> Our half pedaling script-work is done! There is only one (extremely time consuming but) minor issue left, which you will notice (and probably chuckle about) when the update comes through.
> 
> Thanks and talk soon!
> 
> Alex


----------



## borealis75

Hi all,

I was wondering if someone tried the light version ? Is this worth it? I really like the sound but I really don't need to have the whole mic tweeking etc...

Greg


----------



## Maximus

Sorry if it was posted here before but I mean the part of demo starting at 29m54s relating "Lite" version:




Long story short: For 39USD, price the of "Waves - Grand Rhapsody" you get a really serious instrument. Incredible Price/Features ratio. 

For me, as the owner of over 20 piano VSTis, it is interesting only as a "Full" version. 

I'd like to see a clear description on how "Lite to Full" upgrade path works. Can I use it as kind of paid "demo" and if like it buy the full version without any loss of 39USD paid? Is it possible?


----------



## SoNowWhat?

borealis75 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I was wondering if someone tried the light version ? Is this worth it? I really like the sound but I really don't need to have the whole mic tweeking etc...
> 
> Greg


While of course this makes complete sense, I have only one thing to say: hammer+wide, hammer+wide, hammer+wide. 

But, the main mics are good too and you can always get extras later if you desire them (and for a pretty affordable price too).


----------



## SoNowWhat?

OK, so something really weird just happened. Opened DAW, opened Kontakt and no Walker (I have it at top of my libraries pane). Not touched any of the files.
Went to Native Access and for some reason it's saying not installed, so reinstalled and pointed to path.
Seemed to reinstall fine (though I don't think this was a complete reinstall).
Now, it shows in libraries pane in Kontakt but, there's an error "Library Content Not Found", so I try to point it to the folder but it says Walker 1955 Concert D.nicnt file is missing, I don't think this file was ever in the instrument? I can't see it anywhere and the actual nicnt files is labelled Walker 1955 Steinway D. I haven't deleted anything. Everything else seems fine. Anybody else had this happen? I can't point Kontakt to the missing .nicnt file as it doesn't exist (well, I'm pretty sure it doesn't).


----------



## slobajudge

Nicnt file exist in Embertone. Probably it was deleted accidentally. Do you have backup anywhere ?


----------



## SoNowWhat?

That's the thing. It doesn't exist in my backup either. Which is why I thought it didn't exist. It doesn't even exist in the RAR files I downloaded. The only nicnt file is called Walker 1955 Steinway D.
Can you tell me the path to that file?

Thank you for your help. I'll check back tomorrow as it's the middle of the night here and I need some sleep.


----------



## slobajudge

SoNowWhat? said:


> Can you tell me the path to that file?


Do you mean where its located in folder ?


----------



## SoNowWhat?

slobajudge said:


> Do you mean where its located in folder ?


Yes. The nicnt I can see (Walker 1955 Steinway D) is in the main folder, along with nkc and nkr files as well as the other folders (samples, instruments, snapshots, multis and documentation).


----------



## slobajudge

That`s correct. If you don`t have it you will probably need to download again. If there is another solution I will gladly help you.


----------



## dzilizzi

This is one of my complaints about Embertone - no user account where you can see what you should own and the ability to redownload products. Though they aren't the only ones. Other than that, they make great products.


----------



## galactic orange

They might be willing to send you the file. That would save you the trouble of redownloading everything just to get one small file. Other developers have been willing to do this back in the day when NI Service Center would commonly not recognize .nicnt files and instruments wouldn’t show up in Kontakt. I was under the inpression that those problems weren’t happening now that Native Access handles everything, but I could be mistaken.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

galactic orange said:


> They might be willing to send you the file. That would save you the trouble of redownloading everything just to get one small file. Other developers have been willing to do this back in the day when NI Service Center would commonly not recognize .nicnt files and instruments wouldn’t show up in Kontakt. I was under the inpression that those problems weren’t happening now that Native Access handles everything, but I could be mistaken.


Yeah it’s a strange one. I have all the zipped RAR files as backup and when I unzip the RAR where the nicnt file that I do have is located there’s no other nicnt file. 

So can I check, do other users have more than one nicnt file?

Thanks to everyone for trying to solve the mystery.


----------



## berndfri

Just had that happen to me, quickly received a reply from Embertone (on a Saturday!):
"Here's the issue - we recently had to change the name of the library to Walker 1955 Concert D for legal reasons, so that is giving our users problems - sorry for the inconvenience! 
try renaming "Walker 1955 Steinway D.nicnt" to "Walker 1955 Concert D.nicnt"

Worked for me!


----------



## Fleer

Good solution. Thanks, Embertone, well done.


----------



## tmhuud

For goodness sakes Sample Library companies, (and this is not specifically aimed at Embertone as there are several others), get with it and make accessible USER ACCOUNTS. You can buy a $250 SSD from Samsung and create a user account and see all of your serials and products there. Folks are spending thousands and thousands on sample libraries. [PS: I think the Embertone boys are the best- I really like the way they connect with the customers and I think a lot of love goes into each products and most importantly, that they sincerely CARE about the end user] 

Anyways, that’s my 2 cents from a sleep depraved chuckle head.


----------



## CCTM

Hi


berndfri said:


> Just had that happen to me, quickly received a reply from Embertone (on a Saturday!):
> "Here's the issue - we recently had to change the name of the library to Walker 1955 Concert D for legal reasons, so that is giving our users problems - sorry for the inconvenience!
> try renaming "Walker 1955 Steinway D.nicnt" to "Walker 1955 Concert D.nicnt"
> 
> Worked for me!



I've just seen this happen on 2 Macs: Walker visible in Library pane until you run Native Access. Relaunch Kontakt and Walker disappears.

The solution is as posted: rename the nict file, relocate the Walker sample directory in NA, then relaunch Kontakt.


CCT


----------



## Fleer

I guess all will be refreshed with the upcoming update.


----------



## slobajudge

Fleer said:


> I guess all will be refreshed with the upcoming update.


I only hope that the more we talk about the faster it will be


----------



## SoNowWhat?

Normal service resumed (after renaming file). Thank you to everyone who posted in here before I had a chance to contact @Embertone directly. Have had some very busy days which have kept me largely out of studio. 

What happened makes sense now. Couldn't understand how I had an nicnt file but it didn't match the name that Kontakt was looking for. Happy days.


----------



## OleJoergensen

I manage to make it work, ay least for now . Settings in Kontakt: 201 Voices, Instrument preload buffer size 24 kb

Here a little demo, a mix between Close, main and room mic + reverb and a bit stereo pan.



https://www.dropbox.com/s/a9tv1o804hys7sp/Nostalgia-%20Piano%204%3A9-2018.wav?dl=0 (https://www.dropbox.com/s/a9tv1o804hys7sp/Nostalgia- Piano 4:9-2018.wav?dl=0)


----------



## CGR

Just got the Embertone 1955 Walker Concert D (Lite version) going again after the re-naming issue. Hadn't played it for a few weeks and was reminded again how special this sampled piano is. I find myself just playing simple stuff and listening to the beautiful resonances:


----------



## SoNowWhat?

CGR said:


> Just got the Embertone 1955 Walker Concert D (Lite version) going again after the re-naming issue. Hadn't played it for a few weeks and was reminded again how special this sampled piano is. I find myself just playing simple stuff and listening to the beautiful resonances:



That’s exactly what I did last night. Literally played myself to sleep at my desk listening to those resonances.


----------



## bbrylow

Thanks for the solution. I just fixed mine but it was a very frustrating few weeks and to have not received an email is less that cool. Just glad it works. BTW - I re-downloaded the whole thing and the name is still wrong in my download so this fixed it.


----------



## OleJoergensen

berndfri said:


> Just had that happen to me, quickly received a reply from Embertone (on a Saturday!):
> "Here's the issue - we recently had to change the name of the library to Walker 1955 Concert D for legal reasons, so that is giving our users problems - sorry for the inconvenience!
> try renaming "Walker 1955 Steinway D.nicnt" to "Walker 1955 Concert D.nicnt"
> 
> Worked for me!


Thank you for sharing. I just experience the same after I had Native acces opened...
Renamed the nicht file and it worked again.


----------



## ptram

Just downloading it. I guess I'll be able to try it in a couple weeks, when finished downloading 

Is this piano the same used for these recordings?
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLrRdDOgKd0iVHqZuQqBpyWUtI0lBKY1Hq

Listening to Rachmaninoff playing (even if on a piano a little more modern than the ones it his times) is really an incredible experience.

Paolo


----------



## ljh25275

I bought and downloaded it over the weekend. My brief review:

Good:
The sound could not be lovelier. This piano excels for softer/simpler pieces. It's not my favorite for big loud pieces (Rachmaninoff, prelude in B Minor). Strangely, the Ravenscroft which I also own seems to suit that piece particularly well. But for anything more delicate, this instrument is just wonderful. I appreciate how much customization there is. While I would greatly prefer all of the mic positions to be available to load from the same instrument (VI Labs has this perfected) it's not too complex to set up. Lastly, while this might bother some people, I actually like the slightly imperfect nature of this instrument. There is something very beautiful about an older instrument that sounds slightly worn. It's not at all inappropriately out of tune or anything, but it doesn't sound perfectly pristine. It's really something special.

Bad:
The pedaling behavior is abominable, and I would regret my purchase if not for the promised update. Half pedaling is important, but I don't think people realize how absolutely essential is is for a particular technique. When lowering and raising the dampers (during a chord change, say) a real instrument will allow you to only partially lower the dampers, and still have a bit of resonance in the strings. This instrument just cuts off the notes entirely. It's unbearable, and sounds constantly like something is going wrong. the Ravenscroft (and other VI Labs pianos) have this absolutely perfected. It's the best pedal behavior I've ever seen in a virtual instrument. I am completely unable to play the Embertone Walker until they fix this, it's really quite bad. 

I hope the update is released soon. I bought this under the impression that it had already been fixed as they said in this thread it would be coming out in 'two weeks', and that was like two months ago. I hope they can update us as to the progress.


----------



## Fleer

I hope they take their time and make an already amazingly sounding piano also eminently playable. Then it will rule all (Steinway) competitors beyond comparison.


----------



## tack

ljh25275 said:


> The pedaling behavior is abominable, and I would regret my purchase if not for the promised update.


FWIW, the substandard pedaling behavior is relatively well treaded territory in this thread so this should have spared you of any potential regrets. Granted, this is a pretty large thread, but this kind of user feedback is so instrumental in making buying decisions that it's worth a few minutes wading through the pages.

I'm extremely excited for the update, because the Walker samples are an excellent foundation to build from. And I agree with @Fleer, I can wait however long it takes to get it right. I'm just grateful that Embertone is taking playability so seriously, rather than providing the world yet another brilliant sounding and unplayable piano VI.


----------



## slobajudge

ljh25275 said:


> This instrument just cuts off the notes entirely. It's unbearable, and sounds constantly like something is going wrong. I am completely unable to play the Embertone Walker until they fix this, it's really quite bad.


Little thing and first thing you must do (if you didn`t already) and its very important for the problem you mention is to increase max voices from default 100 to at least double to prevent program to cut notes when you playing. Also go to response tab and make linear volume and dynamic scaling. I dont remember any more, I think that volume scaling was at default above lower left corner. After that it will be much better.


----------



## emulator

OleJoergensen said:


> Thank you for sharing. I just experience the same after I had Native acces opened...
> Renamed the nicht file and it worked again.



Thank you very much for the hint.


----------



## tack

slobajudge said:


> Little thing and first thing you must do (if you didn`t already) and its very important for the problem you mention is to increase max voices from default 100 to at least double to prevent program to cut notes when you playing.


Although this may be the cause of some problems, the pedalling issues discussed earlier aren't related to voice counts. (The video in the post I linked to above demonstrates that.)


----------



## slobajudge

tack said:


> Although this may be the cause of some problems, the pedalling issues discussed earlier aren't related to voice counts. (The video in the post I linked to above demonstrates that.)


Yes, thats correct. But increasing voices is the first little fix for any new customer. Without that Embertone is not playable at all.


----------



## ptram

Embertone said:


> *Doing what he's done (downloading everything first) and then switching it back to download and extract and use shift Reset would work...*"
> I highly suggest that you let CONNECT do the extraction for you. Much less headache that way. Thanks!!


Alex, I'm not sure what to do. I've done this:

1) Set the preferences to Download only.
2) Let Connect download all the zip files.
3) Went to the Preferences again, and chosen Download and Install.
4) Clicked Shift-Reset. This deleted all the downloaded files from the list in Connect.
5) Relaunched Connect.
6) Clicked on Download. It told me that the product is already installed and asked if I wanted to download it again.

What should I do to let it consider the downloaded files, and install them?

Paolo


----------



## ptram

I received an answer via mail, and the answer was to manually reassemble everything.

There are 192 segments. At least on the Mac, I suggest to do a search on the .nkx files, so that you'll have all the sample files ready to be moved with a single action.

The piano is fantastic. However, there are some things I noticed, and that I hope can be fixed, that I reported here:

https://vi-control.net/community/threads/embertone-steinway-in-comparison.72674/page-2#post-4279586

Paolo


----------



## Fleer

Great review from SoundBytesMag: http://soundbytesmag.net/review-walker-1955-steinway-d-review-from-embertone/


----------



## Leo

Fleer said:


> Great review from SoundBytesMag: http://soundbytesmag.net/review-walker-1955-steinway-d-review-from-embertone/


Tanks, great review!


----------



## HBen

Any news about half-pedaling update?????


----------



## RandomComposer

Seems to be taking a while for something that only had 1 minor issue left a month ago


----------



## ljh25275

RandomComposer said:


> Seems to be taking a while for something that only had 1 minor issue left a month ago



I emailed to ask about it last week. They said they would have an ETA 'in a couple of weeks'. Really not a good answer, they've already provided multiple ETAs that have long passed. I understand that it's difficult and time consuming work, but you can't promise an update AND remain silent on the delay. You either need to wait to announce until it's ready, or agree to keep people apprised of the progress when the deadline passes.


----------



## slobajudge

ljh25275 said:


> I emailed to ask about it last week. They said they would have an ETA 'in a couple of weeks'. Really not a good answer, they've already provided multiple ETAs that have long passed. I understand that it's difficult and time consuming work, but you can't promise an update AND remain silent on the delay. You either need to wait to announce until it's ready, or agree to keep people apprised of the progress when the deadline passes.


That answer probably means end of October. Better to think this way. I am a little tired to check this forum every day waiting for update. I think they make this very serious. This is not surprise, for example people wait for Garritan almost two years for update. Of course they not working all the time that two years. Couple of months for Embertone seems reasonable. Now after said that from my half of reasonable mind, the other half is  transformed to  for silent operations, hehe


----------



## CGR

While we wait for the update (and Lite to Full upgrade option!) here's a track I made with the Lite version featured in a band setting:


----------



## Fleer

Sweet


----------



## Nahnou

CGR said:


> While we wait for the update (and Lite to Full upgrade option!) here's a track I made with the Lite version featured in a band setting:



Great track! I love it!!


----------



## rottoy

Today I put the piano into a cheesy business jingle I made.
Brightened the top end considerably with EQ, I think it works!

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/bujingle-mp3.15428/][/AUDIOPLUS]


----------



## CGR

Nahnou said:


> Great track! I love it!!


Cheers!


----------



## scherzo75

Hello, 
I love the Embertone 1955 Steinway sound. I'm about to buy a Kawai Novus 10 (digital piano that has an acoustic grand mecanism, including the dampers, controlled by the sustaining pedal), and would like to use it with quality samples. 
I'm considering buying the whole Embertone package, but I really need the partial pedalling function (also called half-pedalling or fractional pedalling), otherwise the sophisticated damper system of the Kawai would be reduced to a baby piano with on/off sustain.
On the one hand you can loose notes that should be sustained, as SGord clearly showed it very clearly  (no-go)
but the pedal is the base of classical piano as the video 

shows it.
I'm sure you'll finally manage to implement this, as Garritan managed it
thank you for the enormous work, you'll change the life of many pianists


----------



## HardyP

Yeah, it´s really strange, embertone was one of my favourite devs, because they had an outstanding reputation in terms of living products, communication, keeping promises (or at least proactively explaining that and why there´s a delay), and so on. I´m not talking about some days here, the first update (+ manual*) was said to come in July... 
Hope they can "come back to the roots" some day .

(*) BTW, even the link from the documentation folder to the manual does not work any longer... I understand, that they had licensing/naming issues, but at least a redirect should be possible I think...


----------



## ptram

I'm awaiting with great hope the half-pedal, repedallng and "reaction" fixes. The sound of this piano is fantastic, and it would be a shame if it is not finished.

At the same time, VSL has never added half-pedaling to their otherwise fantastic Vienna Imperial, so everything may happen...

Paolo


----------



## Funkybot

They mentioned recently that one small (I think that's the word they used) new feature was very time-consuming and holding up the release. Made me think at the time, "well, if it's small (which I read as 'low impact, high effort') then why bother?" At work, we call that scope-creep. The alternative could've been, release the fixes for linking of microphone positions and half-pedalling now and put whatever small new feature in later. I wonder, if in hindsight, they don't regret that.

Anyway, I'm sure they're still working on an update and it's just taking them much longer than anticipated. Especially if they're doing any sample-editing, which is tedious and insanely time-consuming. If someone's really concerned, you can always email them and ask for a more detailed status update since they no longer seem to be monitoring this thread.

For now, the software works. Understandable that owner's would want it to be even better, but it didn't get any worse since you bought it. I'm still quite happy with it. And remember: you never buy software based on promises about what it will do in the future. You're just asking to be disappointed if you do. So I wait patiently...


----------



## slobajudge

The software works but it has problems they need to fix. I hope that we all want full piano that is working as piano and not some half working instrument. There are too many defective vst pianos in the market. We already talk about problems earlier in this thread and its not just half pedal. At the moment piano is hard to control without problems in fast passages in classical music with small nuances in dynamic changes and very close to be unusable for full controlling sustain and repedaling. The truth is, if update fix problems Emberton will be among three best pianos on the market. For me number one. If they not, well we already saw that many times.


----------



## styledelk

So I went ahead and bought this a few weeks ago, and I run it through my Kawai CA95. Once I learned to play against the lack of half-pedaling, it got better, but it's definitely a sore spot.

That said: it responds pretty amazingly to the Kawai action, and piping it back through the soundboard on it produces a very natural sound. I feel like by default the high-end is a little too overpowering, but I haven't played a real piano in years, so maybe that's just how a Steinway feels.

Looking forward to the improvements.


----------



## jneebz

@Embertone rocks. Never doubted the commitment to their customers, and won’t start now...software development is just freaking unpredictable. Update will be fantastic, looking forward to it.


----------



## slobajudge

jneebz said:


> @Embertone rocks. Never doubted the commitment to their customers, and won’t start now...software development is just freaking unpredictable. Update will be fantastic, looking forward to it.


I hope it will, I really love and need that piano


----------



## chapbot

I have been amused at the constant bellyaching about half pedaling on these forums. Literally nobody cares about half pedaling except a few purists. I have taken piano lessons my entire life and was a piano proficiency in college. Never one time have I ever used half pedaling for any practice or recital. I have been recording and producing music for the past 20 years and never once have found any need for half peddling in any tracks I have produced. If you're wondering why Embertone is dragging their feet on implementing half pedaling this is probably the reason.

If you must have half pedaling may I suggest the new Concert Grand from Production Voices - I just got the Gold version and it is spectacular:

https://www.productionvoices.com/concert-grand-2/

I own the Embertone and it is also spectacular - these two are my main pianos and I would use them for different styles.


----------



## Leo

indeed this embertone piano sounds beautifully, but I'm broke. 
This year again I spend maybe 6.5-7.000 eur for this expensive little toys, 
and I almost believed that I had everything...
and then I hear this piano, damn


----------



## SGordB

chapbot said:


> I have been amused at the constant bellyaching about half pedaling on these forums. Literally nobody cares about half pedaling except a few purists. I have taken piano lessons my entire life and was a piano proficiency in college. Never one time have I ever used half pedaling for any practice or recital. I have been recording and producing music for the past 20 years and never once have found any need for half peddling in any tracks I have produced. If you're wondering why Embertone is dragging their feet on implementing half pedaling this is probably the reason.
> 
> If you must have half pedaling may I suggest the new Concert Grand from Production Voices - I just got the Gold version and it is spectacular:
> 
> https://www.productionvoices.com/concert-grand-2/
> 
> I own the Embertone and it is also spectacular - these two are my main pianos and I would use them for different styles.


It’s not about “purity” for me. It’s about functionality. The ability to feather in a touch of sustain rather than a bucketload is a fixture of my technique.


----------



## ptram

I don't want to judge teaching methods or playing styles, but I can't imagine a piano teacher asking to only completely press down or immediately fully release the pedal. "Too much pedal here!" was a common refrain I had to listen from my piano teachers, seen my propension to use too much of it...

Paolo


----------



## al_net77

Not only the sustain, but also the soft (una corda) pedal is commonly used NOT on/off by professionals. I'm speaking in acoustic pianos, honestly I don't know if any VST supports continuous pedalling on una corda (apart from Pianoteq).
I've recorded several MIDI performance of some concert players and both the pedals tracks were used as above.


----------



## jamwerks

chapbot said:


> I have been recording and producing music for the past 20 years and never once have found any need for half peddling in any tracks...


We've all been getting by without it for a long time with sampled pianos, but half pedaling is really an integral part of playing the instrument. We all do it all the time while playing (on real instruments), without having ever learned it.


----------



## Ninth Lion

jamwerks said:


> We all do it all the time while playing (on real instruments), without having ever learned it.


Whether we consciously realise it or not... 

Interesting way of looking at it.


----------



## ptram

Leo said:


> indeed this embertone piano sounds beautifully, but I'm broke.


It's probably the least expensive piano, if you only choose the base main mics. The additional mics are great to have, but you can get all you need even without them.

Paolo


----------



## Iskra

chapbot said:


> I have been amused at the constant bellyaching about half pedaling on these forums. Literally nobody cares about half pedaling except a few purists


If you define 'purists' as classical and jazz advanced players, then yes, we care about half pedaling. But we are not what I would call 'literally nobody', as you can clearly deduct from the posts of all the purists in this very thread. 

Half pedaling and repedaling is a feature that is present on almost every good digital piano from the past 15 years, and every manufacturer try to improve it on each new model. You never wondered why Yamaha or Kawai put that much effort in getting it right? You think that investment of money and time is to make 'literally nobody' happy?


----------



## Fleer

Embertone Walker definitely is the best sampled Steinway I have, among too many.


----------



## Per Lichtman

The half-pedaling and re-pedaling discussion here is a little more intense than I expected.

First of all, the people that are speaking for everyone (even just a sub-group like classical pianists) are overstating things. When I was in college my classmates included pianists of every level, from novices to one that won a Steinway at a national level competition and was a finalist for the Van Clieburn award. The variation in technique (and teaching styles) is far wider than some people are characterizing.

Not every piano player that aims to perform in a classical style uses partial pedaling and re-pedaling. For many of those that do it's an essential technique and playing without it feels limiting. Now we can make guesses about what the number of each type of performer is but on either side we are likely going to be dealing with confirmation bias.

Part of my time spent learning piano was dedicated towards more classical technique and part was not. But I cannot remember a week where even 50% of my time at any acoustic piano (whether it was a day at the Kawai, the Baldwin, the Steinway or August Förster) was spent doing half-pedaling. I struggle to think of a week where even 5% was spent that way, even in my most classically focused period.

So with my personal playing technique, the absence of partial pedaling is just normally not an issue. When and if Embertone updates the feature it will likely have no effect on my own recordings. At the same time, I completely respect the performers that do use the technique as an essential part of their performances - that's part of the reason why I make sure to mention the absence of partial pedaling in my SoundBytesMag.net review. If you're like me and don't use partial pedaling much (or at all) then the library already is one of the best on the market (and of course I go into what sort of preferences may or may not like it in the review. If the partial pedaling is a core part of your technique, do not buy the library yet - either wait for the update or pick another library.

If you already bought the library based on a promised update that accommodates a core aspect of your technique, I earnestly urge you to avoid doing that again. Ever since I got GigaStudio 96 (in 2001 or 2002, I think) buying a library because of a promised update has very, very rarely served me well even when dealing with developers that I really appreciated (and many of whom I still do). I have no insight to Embertone's process on this one so I am speaking generally, not specifically. Sometimes the updates come late and sometimes they never come, but (having worked as a consultant for developers before) I can tell you that it's rarely anything malicious. Often roadmaps are constructed based on the idea of using a particular implementation. Sometimes it gets really far into the process before a designer realizes that a different approach will be required.

Buy a product based on what it already does. Please. If it doesn't do what you need yet, then pass on it until it does or take your pick of the best the competition offers. Both you and the developer will be happier. Consider developer schedules to be their intentions, not a careful analysis of how long it will take but rather their own optimistic impression of how long it will take "if everything goes according to plan." Often things don't.

I've gotten angry at company's over products that took a really long time to materialize in the past - GigaStudio 4 being one of the biggest ones - but in the long run I found one big tool for happiness. The developer is usually honestly telling you the plan that they see - and in that much it is accurate - but they are not telling you what things will be. As long as I don't treat "what they see" as a statement of "what will be" I tend to really just have a much better time in my life, and make better gear purchasing decisions in terms of having what I need, when I need it in order to do the projects I want. When I needed particular functionality that GigaStudio 3 didn't have, I didn't just wait for GigaStudio 4 and complain - I started buying Kompakt and Kontakt Player libraries that provided as much of that functionality as I could find on the market. And when GigaStudio ultimately fell by the wayside, I went to Kontakt with a shorter learning curve from my time already working with the Kompakt and Kontakt Player libraries. I was definitely not happy that GigaStudio 4 didn't show up in the way I had expected (and said lots about that), but I had made lots of music along the way with better and better tools from other sources instead of (effectively) punishing myself because someone else's plans didn't go the way I wanted.

Whether you like or dislike a product is fine, as long as you can acknowledge that other people may have different preferences and needs. Would it be fair to ask that both those that do use partial pedaling and those that do not acknowledge the existence of performers on the other side of the spectrum and not attempt to minimize their experience?


----------



## SoNowWhat?

ptram said:


> It's probably the least expensive piano, if you only choose the base main mics. The additional mics are great to have, but you can get all you need even without them.
> 
> Paolo


And the other mics can be added if/when you want and when budget allows.


----------



## Per Lichtman

SoNowWhat? said:


> And the other mics can be added if/when you want and when budget allows.



Agreed, with just two caveats.

1) The base main mics are available in both the normal and Lite Package. The Lite version offers a lot of bang for your buck (at ca. 40% of the cost) but only the normal version can be upgraded.

2) From the normal package you can add the mics after the fact, but you don't get the same discount as if you bought them all at once. If you buy all the mics at once they discount the price of them by 33% compared to buying each of them a la carte after the fact.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

Per Lichtman said:


> Agreed, with just two caveats.
> 
> 1) The base main mics are available in both the normal and Lite Package. The Lite version offers a lot of bang for your buck (at ca. 40% of the cost) but only the normal version can be upgraded.
> 
> 2) From the normal package you can add the mics after the fact, but you don't get the same discount as if you bought them all at once. If you buy all the mics at once they discount the price of them by 33% compared to buying each of them a la carte after the fact.


Indeed. Good clarification. 
I jumped in for the full package at initial release and have not been sorry. It’s beautiful and I get so much joy playing it. That’s the bottom line for me.


----------



## Fleer

Exactly. If you buy a product you want, like the Embertone Walker, you can enjoy it for what it already is, and lust for what it can still become. Getting updates is one of the perks of buying software. I hope Embertone go about it slowly. Knowing their other libraries like that incredible Joshua Bell Violin, they always get it right. Works of art take time.


----------



## jneebz

Just got an email that said Walker Concert D Piano update v1.1 will be "Ready within days..."


----------



## OleJoergensen

Me too. It is great news!


----------



## lumcas

jneebz said:


> Just got an email that said Walker Concert D Piano update v1.1 will be "Ready within days..."



Any idea what does “ready within days” mean?


----------



## slobajudge

lumcas said:


> Any idea what does “ready within days” mean?


One week is already gone from that message, so I guess `within days` is now relative, and it can be anywhere from 1 to x/y days. With little more faith maybe it can be next week.


----------



## SGordB

lumcas said:


> Any idea what does “ready within days” mean?



... ready within days.*

*Days may not necessarily be Earth days. In some cases, days may be Mercury days or even Venus days. Google it.


----------



## lumcas

SGordB said:


> ... ready within days.*
> 
> *Days may not necessarily be Earth days. In some cases, days may be Mercury days or even Venus days. Google it.



No need to use google on this one. Many thanks for sharing a rough estimate with us


----------



## HardyP

lumcas said:


> Any idea what does “ready within days” mean?


Something similar to the „THIS WEEK“ from July 3rd


----------



## prodigalson

Something really strange happened with my install. It was working fine and then suddenly the sample location couldn't be found, when I point kontakt to where the samples are it couldn't find them and then I noticed it's was looking for "Walker *Concert* D" where my files all say "Walker *Steinway* D". 

Has this happened to anyone else? is there a workaround other than redownloading the library or waiting for update? I don't really feel like renaming all the files!


----------



## HardyP

prodigalson said:


> Has this happened to anyone else? is there a workaround other than redownloading the library or waiting for update?


Yep - rename the nicnt as posted here

Obviously they they faced some naming/licensing/legal/... issues


----------



## prodigalson

HardyP said:


> Yep - rename the nicnt as posted here
> 
> Obviously they they faced some naming/licensing/legal/... issues



ah great, thanks. very curious. guess they can't call it a Steinway without Steinway's say so!


----------



## Mystic

SGordB said:


> ... ready within days.*
> 
> *Days may not necessarily be Earth days. In some cases, days may be Mercury days or even Venus days. Google it.


I assumed it meant "days" like in Genesis when God was creating things. Not literal days but eons we can't begin to comprehend.


----------



## Lode_Runner

HardyP said:


> Yep - rename the nicnt as posted here
> 
> Obviously they they faced some naming/licensing/legal/... issues


Thank you. I had just noticed the library pane issue and was wondering what was going on. I missed the discussion early last month, so I'm grateful you linked back to it.

I wonder if any other companies have had to make a similar name change?


----------



## RandomComposer

To be fair, they didn't say a few days, they just said within days.
So it could be released in 365 days and the statement would still hold


----------



## latorreccint

Probably this has already been discussed but what about “losless compression” for reducing hd space? 

Ps: sry if bad english


----------



## Per Lichtman

latorreccint said:


> Probably this has already been discussed but what about “losless compression” for reducing hd space?
> 
> Ps: sry if bad english



Don’t worry about your English.  What was the question about lossless compression? Are you trying to find out whether they are using it? Or are you suggesting that they should use it?


----------



## Embertone

RandomComposer said:


> To be fair, they didn't say a few days, they just said within days.
> So it could be released in 365 days and the statement would still hold



Ha, sorry that I’ve missed this active thread. As stated earlier, the legal concerns we had, along with the unexpected complexity of the half pedaling update (mostly to do with very small issues that popped up after the update was “complete”), combined with my moving to a new house with my family, has caused the few months delay. It is so close now, I’m just trying to lock down consistency between all the mics, squash a few more sample issues, and we’ll be ready to go!

And... we do not work in Earth days, we work on a Mercurian calendar/schedule 

Sorry everyone and thanks!!

Alex


----------



## good

Embertone said:


> Ha, sorry that I’ve missed this active thread. As stated earlier, the legal concerns we had, along with the unexpected complexity of the half pedaling update (mostly to do with very small issues that popped up after the update was “complete”), combined with my moving to a new house with my family, has caused the few months delay. It is so close now, I’m just trying to lock down consistency between all the mics, squash a few more sample issues, and we’ll be ready to go!
> 
> And... we do not work in Earth days, we work on a Mercurian calendar/schedule
> 
> Sorry everyone and thanks!!
> 
> Alex



nice! I can wait 

Will the Lite version be updated?


----------



## HardyP

Embertone said:


> And... we do not work in Earth days, we work on a Mercurian calendar/schedule


Aaah, that explains it all...
Just out from curiosity in order to translate them into earthen ones - synodical or rotational days?! And does that also mean you will go to sleep for half a year after the update and postpone all the update work on ISS?!


----------



## latorreccint

Per Lichtman said:


> Don’t worry about your English.  What was the question about lossless compression? Are you trying to find out whether they are using it? Or are you suggesting that they should use it?



Both haha, trying to know if they are using it and, if not, asking if it's possible to use it for reducing hd space. Some computers, especially laptops, don't have the hd space for 150gb haha


----------



## jaketanner

lumcas said:


> Any idea what does “ready within days” mean?



I did not get any email, and I own Walker. I am having some issues with notes getting cut off while holding the sustain and transitioning from certain notes. Is it possible that I am using the whole polyphony of the library? I don't think so...is any one else having this issue?


----------



## ptram

jaketanner said:


> I am having some issues with notes getting cut off while holding the sustain and transitioning from certain notes ... is any one else having this issue?


I do. Waiting for the update, to see it these issues are solved.

Paolo


----------



## slobajudge

jaketanner said:


> I did not get any email, and I own Walker. I am having some issues with notes getting cut off while holding the sustain and transitioning from certain notes. Is it possible that I am using the whole polyphony of the library? I don't think so...is any one else having this issue?


Did you increase voices from default 100 ?


----------



## jaketanner

slobajudge said:


> Did you increase voices from default 100 ?



Where is that? I just looked and didn't see it in the tabs.


----------



## jaketanner

jaketanner said:


> Where is that? I just looked and didn't see it in the tabs.



Found it...For some reason it was defaulting to the camera icon instead of the info...I set it to 1000 voices..let's see if that works..LOL


----------



## slobajudge

jaketanner said:


> Found it...For some reason it was defaulting to the camera icon instead of the info...I set it to 1000 voices..let's see if that works..LOL


Thats it. It will be ok. Even 250 will do the job.


----------



## jaketanner

Had a note choking issue resolved by increasing the 100 note default voices...I had no idea, until it was brought to my attention. So I ask @Embertone ...why on earth, would you not default the voices to their max for a piano library that can easily use infinite voices, instead default it to 100? that's ridiculous to me, at the very least it should be 250 minimum...anyone else feel the same?


----------



## jaketanner

slobajudge said:


> Thats it. It will be ok. Even 250 will do the job.



Actually just mentioned that before I saw this..LOL


----------



## slobajudge

jaketanner said:


> Actually just mentioned that before I saw this..LOL


I am glad that everything is ok. Now we need update to full complete this excellent piano.


----------



## jaketanner

slobajudge said:


> I am glad that everything is ok. Now we need update to full complete this excellent piano.



Agreed. I love the sound. Just need some tweaks and we are good


----------



## Fleer

Congrats on moving to a new house, Alex, take your time on the update and make it perfect. Already sounds divine as it is.


----------



## CGR

Yeah, happy to wait till it's right. In the meantime, here's a little piece using the Lite version:


----------



## SoNowWhat?

Fleer said:


> Congrats on moving to a new house, Alex, take your time on the update and make it perfect. Already sounds divine as it is.


This^^^
(You've changed your avatar and now I feel like I'm responding to a new/different person).


----------



## Fleer

Yeah, dumped the Roland FA and got myself a Yamaha MODX8 with that shiny super knob


----------



## motomotomoto

Love the sound of the piano in the demos and looking for something that can handle a jazzy sound better than Una Chorda and Maverick which I already have. If I were to get the Full version and just a couple mic positions (I can't spare the HD space to get them all) which would cover the most ground?


----------



## Per Lichtman

motomotomoto said:


> Love the sound of the piano in the demos and looking for something that can handle a jazzy sound better than Una Chorda and Maverick which I already have. If I were to get the Full version and just a couple mic positions (I can't spare the HD space to get them all) which would cover the most ground?



I use the room or binaural mics the most and both are very different from Main. But you might want to listen to the demos of each position on their site - you should be able to tell what you like pretty easily.


----------



## motomotomoto

Per Lichtman said:


> I use the room or binaural mics the most and both are very different from Main. But you might want to listen to the demos of each position on their site - you should be able to tell what you like pretty easily.



To be honest I think I like the main mics most, but I am curious which other mics would give me the greatest range of styles if I were to purchase a couple...


----------



## jaketanner

motomotomoto said:


> To be honest I think I like the main mics most, but I am curious which other mics would give me the greatest range of styles if I were to purchase a couple...



I have binaural and room mics, of course the main as well...never used the main for anything, BUT...don't look at the sound as a single mic position, but more of a combination. With more mics, you have tons more sound options, and they ALL sound different...I personally love the binaural, with a bit of room, and slight main mics. Gives a nice full sound.


----------



## Per Lichtman

motomotomoto said:


> To be honest I think I like the main mics most, but I am curious which other mics would give me the greatest range of styles if I were to purchase a couple...



That’s essentially what I thought you meant.

Other than the room mic position, all the others can be mixed with each other. Room mic is the most different from the others - it’s the one best suited to use in an orchestral seating out of the group, by far.

Binaural gives you the most ambient tone out of the ones that can be mixed with Main/Full.

In other words, by being the most different from your favorite mic position, they give you the most additional stylistic options.

That doesn’t mean that they are the ones that necessarily make the most sense for you personally, though. Instead you could work to fill in with similar compatible colors.

Main/Close/Wide is one blend option.

Main/Hammer/Wide another alternative.

Or if you don’t want the extra width and just want as much control over the close tone as possible: Main/Hammer/Close.

It’s mainly a question of whether you really want to cater to drastically different styles (in which case my first two suggestions remain) or work with closely related styles. Adding close or hammer can definitely help you add some definition when mixing the piano up-front.

There’s no “wrong” choice, so you should be fine whatever you pick.


----------



## Per Lichtman

jaketanner said:


> I have binaural and room mics, of course the main as well...never used the main for anything, BUT...don't look at the sound as a single mic position, but more of a combination. With more mics, you have tons more sound options, and they ALL sound different...I personally love the binaural, with a bit of room, and slight main mics. Gives a nice full sound.



While my personal preference is to use binaural when mixing with other mic positions or room on its own (due to the difference in LR imaging), I completely agree with jaketanner about how most of the mics contribute the most when mixed. Also, it seems like both jaketanner and I like getting some of that more ambient miking in there when possible.


----------



## motomotomoto

Per Lichtman said:


> That’s essentially what I thought you meant.
> 
> Other than the room mic position, all the others can be mixed with each other. Room mic is the most different from the others - it’s the one best suited to use in an orchestral seating out of the group, by far.
> 
> Binaural gives you the most ambient tone out of the ones that can be mixed with Main/Full.
> 
> In other words, by being the most different from your favorite mic position, they give you the most additional stylistic options.
> 
> That doesn’t mean that they are the ones that necessarily make the most sense for you personally, though. Instead you could work to fill in with similar compatible colors.
> 
> Main/Close/Wide is one blend option.
> 
> Main/Hammer/Wide another alternative.
> 
> Or if you don’t want the extra width and just want as much control over the close tone as possible: Main/Hammer/Close.
> 
> It’s mainly a question of whether you really want to cater to drastically different styles (in which case my first two suggestions remain) or work with closely related styles. Adding close or hammer can definitely help you add some definition when mixing the piano up-front.
> 
> There’s no “wrong” choice, so you should be fine whatever you pick.



I have Una Chorda which I find quite nice for ambient type tones so I'm looking for a more Jazz sounding piano, something like Piano in Blue... Which mic's which would recommend picking up for that?


----------



## Per Lichtman

motomotomoto said:


> I have Una Chorda which I find quite nice for ambient type tones so I'm looking for a more Jazz sounding piano, something like Piano in Blue... Which mic's which would recommend picking up for that?



Close, hammer and wide are the most relevant ones. Close and hammer if you want the most control over exactly which up-front detail frequencies to bring out, or wide if you want the piano to sound a little bigger/wider without going ambient.

Again, there’s a mic comparison SoundCloud player on their product page at Embertone that’s helpful in terms of making the final decision.


----------



## motomotomoto

Per Lichtman said:


> Close, hammer and wide are the most relevant ones. Close and hammer if you want the most control over exactly which up-front detail frequencies to bring out, or wide if you want the piano to sound a little bigger/wider without going ambient.
> 
> Again, there’s a mic comparison SoundCloud player on their product page at Embertone that’s helpful in terms of making the final decision.



I appreciate the thoughts! I have listened to the demos, but it's hard for me to imagine them blending together, so thanks for the advice.


----------



## NeonMediaKJT

Hi,

I bought the Lite version on sale and have had lots of difficulties getting it to work. Initially, the Connect app kept crashing on install, so I had to manually unpack the zip files and structure them myself following a guide from Embertone Support. 
I kept getting missing file errors and so I was eventually sent manual download links. I replaced the files with the manually downloaded ones and now no longer get missing file errors. But now the samples don't play properly. I can only get a sound from it if I play with the sustain pedal on and in Staccato mode. Playing the normal notes only gives me sound at specific velocities.

Support have been giving me some troubleshooting tips, but none have worked. I know I'm not the only one with this issue because I've been talking to some others with similar issues on Facebook.

I thought it might be worth asking here, in case any of you guys experienced these issues?


----------



## Embertone

We're having lots of download issues right now, and Stu @continuata has identified some of the problem: we used ZIP files instead of RAR, and it is messing the process up on certain Windows Machines.

As for your current problem -- it sounds very, very strange. If the instrument loads, and your MIDI Controller is functioning properly, you should be getting different results. I'm assuming that you have a ticket going with us... can you PM me your ticket number? I'd like to take a look at this odd behavior. Thanks!

-Alex


----------



## NeonMediaKJT

Embertone said:


> We're having lots of download issues right now, and Stu @continuata has identified some of the problem: we used ZIP files instead of RAR, and it is messing the process up on certain Windows Machines.
> 
> As for your current problem -- it sounds very, very strange. If the instrument loads, and your MIDI Controller is functioning properly, you should be getting different results. I'm assuming that you have a ticket going with us... can you PM me your ticket number? I'd like to take a look at this odd behavior. Thanks!
> 
> -Alex


Hi Alex,

Basically, when I had these missing file errors, I was able to skip locating these files when Kontakt asked me to and was able to play some notes only at specific velocities. I have the same issue now after I've replaced the files with the manually downloaded ones, except now Kontakt doesn't tell me I have files missing. Does that make sense? According to Kontakt, I had 527 files missing.

I am currently emailing back and forth with a member of the support team. I'll PM you my ticket number. Thanks!


----------



## Embertone

OK, let's connect about it.


----------



## JeffvR

Does anyone have the same problem? 1 instance of the Walker 1955 loaded with 1 mic position. Crackles and pops when I play "too many" notes. W10 and C10, the real time performance goes through the roof with a buffer size of 256. I don't have issues with other libraries.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

JeffvR said:


> Does anyone have the same problem? 1 instance of the Walker 1955 loaded with 1 mic position. Crackles and pops when I play "too many" notes. W10 and C10, the real time performance goes through the roof with a buffer size of 256. I don't have issues with other libraries.


Have you tried upping the Max Voice count in Kontakt? To 250-ish.


----------



## JeffvR

SoNowWhat? said:


> Have you tried upping the Max Voice count in Kontakt? To 250-ish.


Yes, no difference.. Also changing the amount of velocity layers doesn't do anything. At 512 buffer it get's a little bit better but still not without issues. Embertone is directing me to some general page to optimize Kontakt, I know that stuff already. I can play full orchestras without issues but one piano is bringing my computer to it's knees.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

JeffvR said:


> Yes, no difference.. Also changing the amount of velocity layers doesn't do anything. At 512 buffer it get's a little bit better but still not without issues. Embertone is directing me to some general page to optimize Kontakt, I know that stuff already. I can play full orchestras without issues but one piano is bringing my computer to it's knees.


It is resource intensive with the full edition. But it’s something I’ll live with for the sound and sensation. I hope you find some solution. Please post back if you find anything.


----------



## ag75

berndfri said:


> Just had that happen to me, quickly received a reply from Embertone (on a Saturday!):
> "Here's the issue - we recently had to change the name of the library to Walker 1955 Concert D for legal reasons, so that is giving our users problems - sorry for the inconvenience!
> try renaming "Walker 1955 Steinway D.nicnt" to "Walker 1955 Concert D.nicnt"
> 
> Worked for me!


Thanks for this. I was having the same issue and this fixed it. Thanks for the tip!


----------



## ptram

I tried a piece started with the Walker, and not adapted from other samples. This is Close+Main+Room mics, with the Logic Multipressor (soft limiter) as the only added effect.


----------



## Gerbil

I remember listening to that piece on the Garritan CFX and being impressed by how the piano dips right down into pianissimo convincingly. I think it was one of the demos that led me to buy it.



I'd really like to hear it performed on the new VSL Steinway.


----------



## kgdrum

Hi 
I have a couple of questions about the Walker 1955 Lite install on a mac.

After the Connect install,I see 2 folders: 

_OSX
and
Walker 1955 Steinway concert D

should I create a Walker 1955 folder and put these both inside the folder?

Also should I rename 
Walker 1955 Steinway D.nicnt" to "Walker 1955 Concert D.nicnt in both the _OSX folder and the Walker !955 folder?

Thanks
KG


----------



## ptram

Gerbil said:


> impressed by how the piano dips right down into pianissimo convincingly


Thank you for helping me notice that my dynamics were a bit to high! I've expanded them, to have both a forte and a pianissimo.

Paolo


----------



## NeonMediaKJT

Hi,

Just wanted to note that if anybody happened to be experiencing the issue that I did. Try unpacking the zip files onto an SSD instead of a regular HDD. It ended up fixing my problem!


----------



## Mikk

Hi, i am a new member here! I have a question about the embertone walker key release noise: on my setup it is much much louder when the sustain pedal is down than without pedal. When playing soft chords (like chopin prelude op28 N4) the noise can be louder than the piano sound itself! The only workaround is to lower down the release sample volume which will impact the release sound without the pedal... And the piano will loose something great. I am the only one who has this issue? Maybe something wrong on my install?


----------



## Architekton

A lot of sampled pianos have that problem...noise on sustain and when you play more notes at the same time or complex chords, noise gets excessive. Hence why I ditched most piano libraries.


----------



## Mikk

But I don't understand why is there more mechanical release noise when using the sustain pedal.
There should be at least two different knobs for controlling the release noise with and without sustain pedal so we don't sacrifice dry release samples.


----------



## bsntn99

Mikk said:


> But I don't understand why is there more mechanical release noise when using the sustain pedal.
> There should be at least two different knobs for controlling the release noise with and without sustain pedal so we don't sacrifice dry release samples.


That's because of the programming. There is a release noise when you release the key and another when you release the sustain pedal. This is not consistent with the way a real piano behaves. The release knob does allow you to adjust both together but not independently. I just went in and turned down the volume on the release noise group so I only get one sound. Should be an easy fix for the developer.


----------



## Mikk

Do you mean that the release sample knob controls:
- mechanichal release noise without sustain
- mechanichal release noise with sustain
- strings release without sustain
- strings release with sustain pedal
And that these four components could have differents controls for allowing us to adjust them separately?

Is it possible to modify mechanichal release noise with sustain engaged directely in kontakt parameter or we need a developper patch?
Thanks!


----------



## bsntn99

There are only the sustain pedal, no pedal, releases samples, pedals, and key noises groups (staccato and una corda also, but not relevant here). So no separate string resonances in this library. The release volume knob controls both the release samples volume and key noises volume together. The key noises group is only active when you hold the sustain pedal and release the key giving you an extra key off noise, but not when you release a key without the sustain pedal. This is the inconsistent. Try repeating a note with the release volume turned all the way up and then go on and off the sustain pedal, you will hear the extra key off noise with the pedal, but not without.

After I set the release volume to where I want it, I go in to the edit mode (full Kontakt required) and turn down the volume of the key noises group. However, if I go back and touch the release volume knob, it resets. I saved a preset with this setup so I don't have to go in each time. By the way, looks like the webpage has been updated to show the half pedal and silent key functions added to the interface.


----------



## Mikk

bsntn99 said:


> There are only the sustain pedal, no pedal, releases samples, pedals, and key noises groups (staccato and una corda also, but not relevant here). So no separate string resonances in this library. The release volume knob controls both the release samples volume and key noises volume together. The key noises group is only active when you hold the sustain pedal and release the key giving you an extra key off noise, but not when you release a key without the sustain pedal. This is the inconsistent. Try repeating a note with the release volume turned all the way up and then go on and off the sustain pedal, you will hear the extra key off noise with the pedal, but not without.
> 
> After I set the release volume to where I want it, I go in to the edit mode (full Kontakt required) and turn down the volume of the key noises group. However, if I go back and touch the release volume knob, it resets. I saved a preset with this setup so I don't have to go in each time. By the way, looks like the webpage has been updated to show the half pedal and silent key functions added to the interface.



Thank you very much bsntn99. with your help I can lower or shut down down key noise!
And your right they have updated their webpage... It seems that the update is coming!


----------



## Lougheed

Any idea when the update will be released?


----------



## OleJoergensen

+1


----------



## ptram

No idea, but I hope they are taking all the needed time to make it 'right'. The piano and its sample are too good not to give them all they deserve.

Paolo


----------



## HardyP




----------



## HardyP

Lougheed said:


> Any idea when the update will be released?


Ok, sorry for the ROFL, now a little bit more precisely:
beginning of July 2018 "within a week", August 2018 "ASAP", end of Oct 2018; and so on ... so don´t count on it, especially during the Holiday Season!
So I am not yet ready to put in the sphere of BBB 2.0, but... at least I´ve got the pleasure to make some fun of the poor embertones


----------



## Lougheed

Well, the reason I was asking was that the changes are shown in the screenshots on their website, but yet . . . we are still waiting.


----------



## HardyP

That´s right, many guessing around here, and especially for the ones who know embertone since the early days (Intimate Strings LITE, VI-C exclusive Solo Viola, ...), this is NOT typically for them. So there´s just guessing, that something is going on behind the curtain.

Just hoping the best, and trusting that "it is ready when it´s ready".


----------



## Phryq

So I wonder; is there any way to keep the sustain pedal samples only (so only samples with the damper up) but without sooo much sustain? Maybe going under the hood that's possible?


----------



## slobajudge

Phryq said:


> So I wonder; is there any way to keep the sustain pedal samples only (so only samples with the damper up) but without sooo much sustain? Maybe going under the hood that's possible?


I think Emberton nailed it exactly there, with realistic sustain resonance and this is the reason why so many people here love it. And this is the reason why we need that update especially half pedal to control it similar to acoustic piano. I am too tired with sterile and clean samples in so many libraries that is so unrealistic.


----------



## jmvideo

I purchased it 48 hours ago and it's still downloading. Yes seriously. Anyone else have sloooowww download issues? Not sure if it's my connection or their servers. It's juuuuust chugging along. I hope to play it someday.

p.s. I purchased the full (all mics version) @ 200GB


----------



## good

jmvideo said:


> I purchased it 48 hours ago and it's still downloading. Yes seriously. Anyone else have sloooowww download issues? Not sure if it's my connection or their servers. It's juuuuust chugging along. I hope to play it someday.
> 
> p.s. I purchased the full (all mics version) @ 200MB.



haha I waited half a day to download it. You'd better forget for a moment


----------



## Phryq

slobajudge said:


> I think Emberton nailed it exactly there, with realistic sustain resonance and this is the reason why so many people here love it. And this is the reason why we need that update especially half pedal to control it similar to acoustic piano. I am too tired with sterile and clean samples in so many libraries that is so unrealistic.



Oh, just realized, there's a switch to turn off 'sans pedal'. Does this mean it'll give *only* samples with the damper-pedal down (even if you're not using the pedal?)

This is exactly what I've always wanted!!!

Embertone, do you like, read my posts, and put everything I want into your new instruments? Honest question, because it feels like that.

We really don't need half-pedaling; just use the pedal-down samples. All we really need is a way to automate the release, so we can get more or less, and that's basically what half-pedaling is. Keeping the resonance, well... so you'll get a bit more resonance that natural, but every time you're playing more than 1 note, there's resonance anyway, so I think extra resonance is just good. Other than that, half-pedaling is just for effects ('catching' a note of the pedal before it finishes decaying, or just barely touching the strings with the damper for a weird sound, so more of an effect articulation).


----------



## ptram

The samples in this library are soo good, and so detailed, that I wouldn't dislike an Extended set of samples, including real samples of half-pedal sounds. If I’m not wrong, half-pedaling is usually done with filtering and envelope editing. This would be, at least in one or two intermediate phases, the real thing.

Paolo


----------



## jaketanner

I love this piano and agree that it's fantastic...however, aside from the half-pedaling which is coming soon...You really need to get in there and tweak the settings a bit to your taste. For instance, the Volume Dynamics should be smooth all the way down left, to all the way up right...and adjust the middle slider to show nothing (no black bar), this makes the volume linear. Do the same for the Velocity Dynamics. This also allows you to tailor the response to your MIDI controller better. For a good weighted action, set them all to linear and full range. Then turn ON the Adaptive Release samples for a more natural release depending on your dynamics. Then set the Velocities to 36...and the COLOR of the TONE should be in it's OFF position. This defaults to on, which cuts out certain frequencies, but the true sample is with this switch OFF (just a preference for me). Then adjust the release volume so that you can hear slight mechanical noise (more so with the close mics, not the room or wide mics as this will be unnatural)...but for an intimate sound, raise this a bit to your liking. And I personally set the reverb to about the 9 O'Clock position.

The mics I have are the Main, Binaural and Room...this for me covers all the tones I would want. I made these adjustments and saved the patch so it loads this way every time.

Side note tip: If your controller has multiple pedal inputs, assign the second pedal to control the soft pedal...works great. I love playing with both pedals. My controller already has a soft pedal/input 2 to default to the soft pedal...love it.


----------



## Funkybot

I also found the pedal noise to be incredibly loud by default. So that's another one worth adjusting IMO.


----------



## jaketanner

Funkybot said:


> I also found the pedal noise to be incredibly loud by default. So that's another one worth adjusting IMO.



Agreed. Especially in close Mics. I do have it lowers also.


----------



## CGR

To owners of the full version: I'm hoping to upgrade from the lite version - what 2 additional mic sets (on top of the default mics) would you recommend for best flexibility?


----------



## slobajudge

CGR said:


> To owners of the full version: I'm hoping to upgrade from the lite version - what 2 additional mic sets (on top of the default mics) would you recommend for best flexibility?


Sometimes I play with room position only and I like it. Then after couple of weeks I enjoy so much in combination main plus close mics, after that in combination with hammer mics, then binaural, etc. Simply, get all. This is the only way to have peace in mind.


----------



## CGR

slobajudge said:


> Sometimes I play with room position only and I like it. Then after couple of weeks I enjoy so much in combination main plus close mics, after that in combination with hammer mics, then binaural, etc. Simply, get all. This is the only way to have peace in mind.


Ha! Thanks Slobajudge - I suspected that would be the case!


----------



## teclark7

I enjoy combining main with the close and room. Good for a rounded intimate tone for some piano ballads I am working on.

I’ve also got hammer mic but haven’t used it yet but suspect it might be good for combining for a sound that cuts through mix better.


----------



## CGR

teclark7 said:


> I enjoy combining main with the close and room. Good for a rounded intimate tone for some piano ballads I am working on.
> 
> I’ve also got hammer mic but haven’t used it yet but suspect it might be good for combining for a sound that cuts through mix better.


Interesting to hear that - that was the combo I was leaning towards.


----------



## teclark7

CGR said:


> Interesting to hear that - that was the combo I was leaning towards.



Do you want to send me a midi file and I do a couple of demos for you?


----------



## CGR

teclark7 said:


> Do you want to send me a midi file and I do a couple of demos for you?


Thanks for the offer - I'll PM you a short MIDI file tomorrow


----------



## jaketanner

CGR said:


> To owners of the full version: I'm hoping to upgrade from the lite version - what 2 additional mic sets (on top of the default mics) would you recommend for best flexibility?



Room and Binaural. Covers it all


----------



## CGR

jaketanner said:


> Room and Binaural. Covers it all


Thanks Jake - do you hear any issues using the Binaural mics when played back over monitors/speakers? I've heard conflicting reports about compatibility with playback other than headphones (I have made a number of binaural recordings myself of live music performances and rehearsals, and they sound surprisingly good, with a lot of depth, width & detail, played through monitors/speakers/car stereo).


----------



## jaketanner

CGR said:


> Thanks Jake - do you hear any issues using the Binaural mics when played back over monitors/speakers? I've heard conflicting reports about compatibility with playback other than headphones (I have made a number of binaural recordings myself of live music performances and rehearsals, and they sound surprisingly good, with a lot of depth, width & detail, played through monitors/speakers/car stereo).



I have not noticed anything that made me stop and think. When directly in front of the speakers, I prefer the intimate sound of the binaural. Feels a bit more like I’m behind the soundboard. At least for the initial playing, then I might switch the mic if I need to fit it in a composition but need a different perspective.


----------



## Phaedraz

If you want to upgrade from lite to full, send support an email and they will provide you a personal voucher code to use. I did this last week.


----------



## OleJoergensen

jaketanner said:


> I love this piano and agree that it's fantastic...however, aside from the half-pedaling which is coming soon...You really need to get in there and tweak the settings a bit to your taste. For instance, the Volume Dynamics should be smooth all the way down left, to all the way up right...and adjust the middle slider to show nothing (no black bar), this makes the volume linear. Do the same for the Velocity Dynamics. This also allows you to tailor the response to your MIDI controller better. For a good weighted action, set them all to linear and full range. Then turn ON the Adaptive Release samples for a more natural release depending on your dynamics. Then set the Velocities to 36...and the COLOR of the TONE should be in it's OFF position. This defaults to on, which cuts out certain frequencies, but the true sample is with this switch OFF (just a preference for me). Then adjust the release volume so that you can hear slight mechanical noise (more so with the close mics, not the room or wide mics as this will be unnatural)...but for an intimate sound, raise this a bit to your liking. And I personally set the reverb to about the 9 O'Clock position.
> 
> The mics I have are the Main, Binaural and Room...this for me covers all the tones I would want. I made these adjustments and saved the patch so it loads this way every time.
> 
> Side note tip: If your controller has multiple pedal inputs, assign the second pedal to control the soft pedal...works great. I love playing with both pedals. My controller already has a soft pedal/input 2 to default to the soft pedal...love it.


Thank you for this tip Jake, it makes the piano sound even better


----------



## SoNowWhat?

To throw another spanner in the works re which mics to choose, my favourite (so far) combo that I have saved as a multi is Hammer + Wide. It just works for me. It's always going to be a very personal decision though.

And as above yes @jaketanner and @Funkybot are correct, you should tweak this from the default settings to suit your playing style, controller and sound preference. There is so much you can do with this and I can't make it sound bad. My only criticism is the long load times (yes, I have it on SSD and this may be related to my specific set-up) but I will live with it in order to get the sound and experience of the instrument. It's special (IMHO). I'm actually not fussed at all about waiting for the update. Half pedalling would be nice but it will come when it's ready and even if it never arrived I could not be more happy with Walker 1955.


----------



## tleetabor

Hey folks, 

I'm a generally enthusiastically happy owner of the complete Embertone Walker library. It has definitely become my favorite grand piano library. Relative to other Steinways in my collection, I find it very good sounding out of the box, with lots of character that I find lacking in many libraries that I own, but not too much as found in one particular library I own.

That said, I find one annoying issue that I've not heard too much talk about.

That issue is a "click" on the low E2 at higher velocities. To my ear, it sounds real (not a sampling artifact). It also sounds mechanical, like some piece of the hammer mechanism is hitting something else. I notice it in every mic sample set (I have them all). It gradually comes in as velocity increases, and becomes very annoying (to my ear) at the higher quarter of velocity. It is present on other notes; mainly Eb2, D2, Db2, C2, to a much lesser degree. In fact, for me, a livable degree. But the E2 is too much.

The issue can be "hidden" by moving the rotary control of sample start time well to the clockwise, but I don't like that solution much as it de-emphasizes much of the wonderful attack characteristics for the rest of the keys.

Other than this one issue, I find the Embertone Walker absolutely incredible; my go-to piano without reservation. And even with this flaw, I will continue to use this in most of my work. The flaw as-is sounds natural; but it sounds like a maladjusted action that I would want to have fixed if I owned/used this physical piano.

So I'm wondering if 

other folks have noticed this E2 click and/or find it as annoying as I do, 
other folks have found any work arounds for this issue that doesn't compromise the rest of the keys, and 
if Embertone is aware of this issue and plans on addressing this in their long awaited update.


----------



## Ashermusic

tleetabor said:


> Hey folks,
> 
> 
> That issue is a "click" on the low E2 at higher velocities.



I don't hear that here, but I do have some high frequency hearing loss in one ear.


----------



## jaketanner

tleetabor said:


> Hey folks,
> 
> I'm a generally enthusiastically happy owner of the complete Embertone Walker library. It has definitely become my favorite grand piano library. Relative to other Steinways in my collection, I find it very good sounding out of the box, with lots of character that I find lacking in many libraries that I own, but not too much as found in one particular library I own.
> 
> That said, I find one annoying issue that I've not heard too much talk about.
> 
> That issue is a "click" on the low E2 at higher velocities. To my ear, it sounds real (not a sampling artifact). It also sounds mechanical, like some piece of the hammer mechanism is hitting something else. I notice it in every mic sample set (I have them all). It gradually comes in as velocity increases, and becomes very annoying (to my ear) at the higher quarter of velocity. It is present on other notes; mainly Eb2, D2, Db2, C2, to a much lesser degree. In fact, for me, a livable degree. But the E2 is too much.
> 
> The issue can be "hidden" by moving the rotary control of sample start time well to the clockwise, but I don't like that solution much as it de-emphasizes much of the wonderful attack characteristics for the rest of the keys.
> 
> Other than this one issue, I find the Embertone Walker absolutely incredible; my go-to piano without reservation. And even with this flaw, I will continue to use this in most of my work. The flaw as-is sounds natural; but it sounds like a maladjusted action that I would want to have fixed if I owned/used this physical piano.
> 
> So I'm wondering if
> 
> other folks have noticed this E2 click and/or find it as annoying as I do,
> other folks have found any work arounds for this issue that doesn't compromise the rest of the keys, and
> if Embertone is aware of this issue and plans on addressing this in their long awaited update.



Just tried that, and yes it's definitely there. Hope often do I hit that note? not too much to really notice, but maybe if it were a piece that had repetitive E2s, probably. But agreed, sounds like a defect in the piano note. I tried adjusting the sample start but for me, it's still there.


----------



## jaketanner

Ashermusic said:


> I don't hear that here, but I do have some high frequency hearing loss in one ear.



its more of a knocking than a click.


----------



## tleetabor

jaketanner said:


> its more of a knocking than a click.


Yep. I agree. The downside to subjective terms. To me, like I mentioned in my first post, it reminds me of a misaligned hammer causing some sort of undesired collision in the mechanism. And I would concur that "Knock" is probably a better description than "click".


----------



## jneebz

We’re still waiting on the update, yes?


----------



## ptram

tleetabor said:


> That issue is a "click" on the low E2 at higher velocities.


I don't know if it is the same note, but I could encounter this click a couple times when editing a piece. Then, with 36 velocity levels, editing dynamics made them disappear, and I'm not able to find them again.

If we meet them again, it would be better to note the pitch and velocity value, and let Embertone know. Maybe it is a fixable issue.

Paolo

EDIT: Maybe I could find three of them in an older, louder file I had archived. But one of them could also be pedal noise. Hard to say in the mix. I should analyze the sequence file.


----------



## tleetabor

ptram said:


> I don't know if it is the same note, but I could encounter this click a couple times when editing a piece. Then, with 36 velocity levels, editing dynamics made them disappear, and I'm not able to find them again.
> 
> If we meet them again, it would be better to note the pitch and velocity value, and let Embertone know. Maybe it is a fixable issue.
> 
> Paolo
> 
> EDIT: Maybe I could find three of them in an older, louder file I had archived. But one of them could also be pedal noise. Hard to say in the mix. I should analyze the sequence file.



These are similar, although not as noticeable as the ones I'm referring to. Mine are always on E2 at louder velocities, and always right at the start of the note. I'm not at home, but I'll try to record some examples this evening and post.


----------



## tleetabor

tleetabor said:


> These are similar, although not as noticeable as the ones I'm referring to. Mine are always on E2 at louder velocities, and always right at the start of the note. I'm not at home, but I'll try to record some examples this evening and post.



Okay, here's a simple test example. This is with the standard load of the Hammer mic set, but set to 36 velocity layers, full dynamics, and reverb off.

The first set of notes is 36 notes of E2 increasing velocity 92 to 127.

To my ear, the last 10 notes (i.e., velocities 108 to 127) of the E2 demonstrate the knock, with the last 5 (i.e., velocities 123 to 127) overly obnoxious.
The second set of notes is 36 notes of F2 increasing velocity 92 to 127.

This is just a control. I don't hear this knock at all on F2.
The final 16 notes are the following sequence repeated four times: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]

This is there just to contrast with knock and without knock based on velocity. No knock on F2; knock on E2 at 127, but not at 107.
While I used the Hammer Mic position, I find this knock to be consistent over all the Mic position sample sets.



By the way, ignore the link name, and at least one of my initial comments that keeps showing up regarding the note names. The notes are E2 and F2.


----------



## good

jneebz said:


> We’re still waiting on the update, yes?



I wish they just let me know the progress of the update.


----------



## slobajudge

good said:


> I wish they just let me know the progress of the update.


Every information about update we received from Embertone in the last seven months was false, so till we received update on email, we don`t know whats really going on no matter what they say. Sorry to all VI community, I think that patient at least for honesty from developer just left me.


----------



## jneebz

slobajudge said:


> Every information about update we received from Embertone in the last seven months was false, so till we received update on email, we don`t know whats really going on no matter what they say. Sorry to all VI community, I think that patient at least for honesty from developer just left me.


There is no dishonesty going on here. Just unforeseen circumstances that caused unexpected delays....which is commonplace in the world of software development. You’re right to be frustrated or disappointed, but to call the company dishonest is a step too far, IMO.


----------



## slobajudge

jneebz said:


> There is no dishonesty going on here. Just unforeseen circumstances that caused unexpected delays....which is commonplace in the world of software development. You’re right to be frustrated or disappointed, but to call the company dishonest is a step too far, IMO.


I love when someone interpreted something I did not say. Where do you read that I was said that Embertone is dishonest ? I expect honesty and thats it. Did I say something that isn`t truth ? My rare conversation with Embertone about update and beta update is something that you dont know nothing about.


----------



## Lougheed

jneebz said:


> We’re still waiting on the update, yes?



Yes, we are still waiting . . .


----------



## jneebz

slobajudge said:


> I think that patient at least for honesty from developer just left me


Sorry did I misinterpret this? Not trying to spark anything...this just sounds like you're questioning their honesty in this statement.


----------



## slobajudge

jneebz said:


> Sorry did I misinterpret this? Not trying to spark anything...this just sounds like you're questioning their honesty in this statement.


Just to end up this conversation. Did you read this in my previous post ? `My rare conversation with Embertone about update and beta update is something that you dont know nothing about`. Anyone here who take this piano from the moment its shows on the market, the same like me waiting for update and even make some jokes about their promises. No need to go further. I love that piano. I hope we can now talk about piano and some good things about it.


----------



## Mason

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but can you only use mic at a time with this one? What about having a couple of close and a room mic together? Not possible?


----------



## slobajudge

Mason said:


> Sorry if this is a stupid question, but can you only use mic at a time with this one? What about having a couple of close and a room mic together? Not possible?


You can use all mics at the same time if your PC can handle it. Load one by one in Kontakt and play them at the same time. I think combination of two mics are enough. In promised update Embertone will fix multi patch.


----------



## Mason

slobajudge said:


> You can use all mics at the same time if your PC can handle it. Load one by one in Kontakt and play them at the same time. I think combination of two mics are enough. In promised update Embertone will fix multi patch.



So it doesn't sound like two pianos playing together, or phasing issues?


----------



## slobajudge

Mason said:


> So it doesn't sound like two pianos playing together, or phasing issues?


No, it sounds beautiful. Very realistic and full of character.


----------



## jneebz

slobajudge said:


> Just to end up this conversation. Did you read this in my previous post ? `My rare conversation with Embertone about update and beta update is something that you dont know nothing about`. Anyone here who take this piano from the moment its shows on the market, the same like me waiting for update and even make some jokes about their promises. No need to go further. I love that piano. I hope we can now talk about piano and some good things about it.


----------



## HardyP

jneebz said:


> There is no dishonesty going on here. Just unforeseen circumstances that caused unexpected delays....


But true honesty and professionalism would speak out „ok guys, we failed again, and it’s because of... our new plans and actions are as following:....“ and so on.
In their early days, that’s exactly what they did, and one of the reasons I got in love with @Embertone.
So: let’s set the second half of 2018 aside, and let 2019 shine, Alex&Jonathan  !!


----------



## Funkybot

HardyP said:


> But true honesty and professionalism would speak out „ok guys, we failed again, and it’s because of... our new plans and actions are as following:....“ and so on.
> In their early days, that’s exactly what they did, and one of the reasons I got in love with @Embertone.
> So: let’s set the second half of 2018 aside, and let 2019 shine, Alex&Jonathan  !!



They had a holiday sale recently and did just that in the post in this very forum. They even offered to send anyone a beta version with half pedaling if it was needed before the official update was ready. I recall them saying the half pedaling was relatively easy but there were lots of little things that needed cleaning up that were more time intensive than expected. You can probably search for the thread and find it. You could also always shoot them an email.


----------



## lumcas

I don't mind the update isn't released yet, but the lack of communication is alarming. Just one short post every week would do it. Well yes, you can always shoot an email, but I'd expect a more official announcement e.g., that you have to rename your nki to make the library work again. I discovered this here by chance.

It's always hard to earn a customer's trust back.


----------



## slobajudge

Funkybot said:


> They had a holiday sale recently and did just that in the post in this very forum. They even offered to send anyone a beta version with half pedaling if it was needed before the official update was ready. I recall them saying the half pedaling was relatively easy but there were lots of little things that needed cleaning up that were more time intensive than expected. You can probably search for the thread and find it. You could also always shoot them an email.


Yeah, they promised that, I already ask for beta patch in November. They answer was very positive. Guess what. Nothing. I still try to keep my positive attitude about it.


----------



## Fleer

I’m looking at it this way.
Am I happy Embertone released Walker when they did? 
Oh yeah.
Would I have preferred them to postpone its release until they added half pedaling? 
Hell no.
So I’m happy, very happy ‘cause I can play this amazing instrument while they’re working on an update. Don’t mind if they do and don’t mind if they take their time.


----------



## HardyP

@Fleer and @Funkybot ,
You both have valid arguments, and I agree to a certain point - I bought it "as it was", and are happy with it, they had a great sale, and so on. I was just pointing out their shift/degradation in terms of communication and tight contact. And, as a side note, beside the undisputed quality of the product, we also buy from a company because of the trust you have in them in terms of ongoing development and their approach of "living instruments".
My last point - I think a forum like this is not necessary, if we only praise the developers no matter what they do. A certain push/pull from the market (in polite and fair manners, no question!) is always needed and of benefit for both sides.


----------



## Mystic

Plus, the half-pedaling thing was an addition they weren't really counting on which means they are likely working on it at the same time as the next library as they have several libraries lined up to develop probably stretching at least 2 years in advance so instead of focusing all energy into the new one with minimal bug fixing on previous, they now have to split efforts into adding in a new, difficult feature. That is going to take time.


----------



## Phryq

Is it possible to simple have the release decay triggered by CC?

Using the down-pedal only samples, wouldn't this sound perfectly real? Can't we do this by just going into the 'wrench' icon section? Full pedal is just an infinite release and half is just... longer release, no?


----------



## harmaes

Considering buying the Walker, is the update still in the works?


----------



## HardyP

harmaes said:


> is the update still in the works


Most probably, yes -
but that doesn´t mean hat it will be availlable in the foreseeable future ...
So if you like "as it is", buy it. If not - don´t buy it, it´s as simple as that...


----------



## Rogier Vogels

HardyP said:


> Most probably, yes -
> but that doesn´t mean hat it will be availlable in the foreseeable future ...
> So if you like "as it is", buy it. If not - don´t buy it, it´s as simple as that...



The problem is, you can never know how "it is" without buying it.

Harmaes, with the current issues, I will advice you absolutely _not_ to buy the Walker.
The problem is not only half-pedaling but also pedaling issues in general which makes the piano absolutely unusable, atleast for classical repertoire. I have other piano's without half pedaling with better pedaling behaviour.
However, I think the issue is a hit-and-miss one, as I can not believe that people are enthousiastic about this piano if they have the issues I am experiencing (and multiple other users with me).
Maybe it has to do something with the controller/piano one is using, the repertoire one is playing, if someone is playing 'live' or using it in mixes, I don't know.


----------



## Rogier Vogels

Maybe it is more clear with an example. I just recorded a small excerpt of a Nocturne of Chopin in which pedaling is quite essential. Garritan CFX versus Embertone Walker D. To even things out I disabled half-pedaling in the CFX. 

Links on Soundcloud: 
Garritan CFX
Embertone Walker D
Please beware, I have not set up the Embertone for the best musical output / dynamics etc. And also not my own best musical output but whatever, this is just a quick comparison for pedaling behaviour.  

There are obvious flaws in the Embertone where the pedal suddenly 'disappears' / does not catch properly.


----------



## SGordB

Rogier Vogels said:


> Maybe it is more clear with an example. I just recorded a small excerpt of a Nocturne of Chopin in which pedaling is quite essential. Garritan CFX versus Embertone Walker D. To even things out I disabled half-pedaling in the CFX.
> 
> Links on Soundcloud:
> Garritan CFX
> Embertone Walker D
> Please beware, I have not set up the Embertone for the best musical output / dynamics etc. And also not my own best musical output but whatever, this is just a quick comparison for pedaling behaviour.
> 
> There are obvious flaws in the Embertone where the pedal suddenly 'disappears' / does not catch properly.



I have the Walker and the CFX, and, like you, I love my half pedaling (and the CFX in general). I think the problem with the pedal not “catching” occurs because a piano VI has been set up to require a relatively high controller 64 value and/or deep pedal depression to toggle the sustain on. When I analyze the MIDI of my piano tracks with missed sustains, I can see this every time and easily remedy it by shifting the sustain controller curve data that came too late to the left so that the “on” value comes early enough for the VI. Not that that’s a workable solution, but it does suggest a programming solution. Interestingly, while the Walker is very unforgiving this way — especially, perhaps, for pianists who have been spoiled by the ability to trigger a touch of sustain with any amount of pedal, so no need to use your foot like a plunger every time you want to refresh the sustain — some other sampled pianos without half pedal can be much more tolerant of a light pedal touch (including, judging by your example, the CFX when it’s not in half pedal mode), presumably because they’re programmed to turn the sustain on with a lighter application of pedal.


----------



## SAM CA

Rogier Vogels said:


> ...
> ... the pedal suddenly 'disappears' / does not catch properly.



Yes! It has nothing to do with your controller or anything. As soon as the harmony gets thicker, notes -in particular low notes- get cut off or completely drop out. I reported the issue couple of months ago. 
The library itself sounds great and I love the interface. This is the only problem that I noticed.


----------



## SAM CA

SGordB said:


> ...When I analyze the MIDI of my piano tracks with missed sustains, I can see this every time and easily remedy it by shifting the sustain controller curve data that came too late to the left so that the “on” value comes early enough for the VI. ...



I can confirm this is not what's causing the cut off and drop outs. I did a number of tests. I even drew the sustain manually with pencil tool on problematic notes to make sure. Hopefully this will be addressed in the update as it's a great piano otherwise.


----------



## SGordB

SAM CA said:


> I can confirm this is not what's causing the cut off and drop outs. I did a number of tests. I even drew the sustain manually with pencil tool on problematic notes to make sure. Hopefully this will be addressed in the update as it's a great piano otherwise.



Then my bad. I thought I'd done that trick with Walker tracks, too, but it's been quite some time since I recorded anything with it.


----------



## jonnybutter

SGordB said:


> I have the Walker and the CFX, and, like you, I love my half pedaling (and the CFX in general)....



Another angle is, if you don't use a lot of sustain pedal, the problem on the Walker is less of a drawback. But it is one, for sure!


----------



## bsntn99

The reason for the abrupt cutoff is due to the programming. The sustain notes do not transition properly to the release samples with the note off signal. This library is a mess in terms of programming, partly because the dev created separate groups of six velocity layers to allow users to select the number of velocity layers they wanted to use. Normally you put all the velocity layers in a single map. Then, just create a lite version as a separate nki. Also, repedalling is poorly scripted and is hit and miss whether it catches or not and tends to unnaturally swell in. Some conditions have two key off sounds. People may like the overall sound of the library, but it needs a lot of improvement in terms of programming.


----------



## Funkybot

bsntn99 said:


> The reason for the abrupt cutoff is due to the programming. The sustain notes do not transition properly to the release samples with the note off signal. This library is a mess in terms of programming, partly because the dev created separate groups of six velocity layers to allow users to select the number of velocity layers they wanted to use. Normally you put all the velocity layers in a single map. Then, just create a lite version as a separate nki. Also, repedalling is poorly scripted and is hit and miss whether it catches or not and tends to unnaturally swell in. Some conditions have two key off sounds. People may like the overall sound of the library, but it needs a lot of improvement in terms of programming.



That very well may explain the delay.


----------



## tack

Rogier Vogels said:


> There are obvious flaws in the Embertone where the pedal suddenly 'disappears' / does not catch properly.


Your example is exactly my experience playing the Walker, and not even just with this type of classical music. I'm afraid I haven't touched it since my post 7 months ago for this reason. Eagerly anticipating the update when it's released in 2035.

On a more positive note, I'm struck by how much more I like the sound of the Walker compared to the CFX in your example.


----------



## jneebz

@Embertone - can you give us ANYTHING on this? Maybe just confirm you’re still working on an update?


----------



## Pablocrespo

Yes, an update about the update would be nice. I have problems with the sustain pedal, and I love the sound and the feel of this piano.


----------



## jaketanner

I'm going to jump in here too: @Embertone update please...I see the new interface on the tutorials..it's clearly already in production...why the hold up?


----------



## harmaes

jaketanner said:


> I'm going to jump in here too: @Embertone update please...I see the new interface on the tutorials..it's clearly already in production...why the hold up?



Embertone was last seen dec 3 2018...


----------



## jaketanner

harmaes said:


> Embertone was last seen dec 3 2018...



Not a good sign. What does it take to stop by and say a few words.


----------



## thomasjdev

Not that it helps any but checking out their twitter account they responded to someone on Jan 2


> Hey Mac,
> We’re sorry for the delay for the half pedaling update, but it will be coming soon! We appreciate your patience.


So at least a response this year, though coming soon doesn't give any idea of what their idea of soon is. 

I'm just starting out and picked up their library as I liked the sounds from the demos I watched and the price of the library seemed reasonable for what you get. It sounds funny but I'm thankful that I'm not experienced enough to have had this issue impact me, so in my case I only hope the release the update before it does.


----------



## slobajudge

thomasjdev said:


> Not that it helps any but checking out their twitter account they responded to someone on Jan 2
> 
> So at least a response this year, though coming soon doesn't give any idea of what their idea of soon is.
> 
> I'm just starting out and picked up their library as I liked the sounds from the demos I watched and the price of the library seemed reasonable for what you get. It sounds funny but I'm thankful that I'm not experienced enough to have had this issue impact me, so in my case I only hope the release the update before it does.


I hope that update doesn`t mean only half pedal patch. There is more to fix. We already discuss about it. I don`t know why is so hard to respond to users. What if product will need more updates after this one ? Whenever I go to VSL forum I see that VSL team respond on daily basis and from the moment they release VSL CFX and Steinway they update their product at least 20 times to fulfill all wishes from users. Yeah, I know that also cost three times more. Too bad I like the sound of Embertone more than VSL pianos. But Embertone must work hard to arrive at least close to their playability.


----------



## dflood

Not sure why the radio silence on this forum, but the lights do seem to be on at Embertone. I had a quick response to a mountain dulcimer support question just the other day. If they say they are working on it I assume that’s what’s happening.


----------



## slobajudge

dflood said:


> Not sure why the radio silence on this forum, but the lights do seem to be on at Embertone. I had a quick response to a mountain dulcimer support question just the other day. If they say they are working on it I assume that’s what’s happening.


Probably, our worries and doubts are related for their words from may 2018, all other is nothing but pure love for their piano


----------



## Phryq

Could we simply set cc64 to automate the release in order to get half-pedalling?

With only the sus samples, maybe it'd sound convincing?


----------



## Phryq

Also, I assume that the staccato samples are not for the Una Corda, right?

So if I'm playing Una Corda, and trigger some staccato, they'll be non Una Corda?

I definitely wouldn't expect una-corda staccato, just wondering.


----------



## Mystic

Keep in mind the piano isn't the only thing they are working on as well. I'm assuming they are already well into the recording and editing of the new cello which is likely taking a good amount of time as well. You can't just pause projects you have on the schedule which unfortunately means that this update is taking longer the more hitches they find with it.


----------



## Embertone

Hey all, Alex here.

We are very sorry for the radio silence. And for the delays. Rather than offer any lame excuses, I'll just assure you that updating the piano is a top priority for us. Things got messy is all I'll say .

We do now have beta patches available for any *current owners** wanting a sneak peak at the half pedaling feature. Thanks!

Alex


----------



## OleJoergensen

A reply... where are my symphonic concert cymbals......


----------



## Phryq

Can I request one of these Beta updates?!


----------



## wolfgangmeister

Embertone said:


> Hey all, Alex here.
> 
> We are very sorry for the radio silence. And for the delays. Rather than offer any lame excuses, I'll just assure you that updating the piano is a top priority for us. Things got messy is all I'll say .
> 
> We do now have beta patches available for any *current owners** wanting a sneak peak at the half pedaling feature. Thanks!
> 
> Alex



Alex,
As a *current owner*, I had also requested the 'sneak peak' half-pedaling feature beta patch some 75 days ago, via Embertone Support Ticket #7015 - New Purchase Invoice #0000107644: Looking for 1/2 pedaling / re-pedaling patch. I actually just sent a reply note to this same support ticket request last evening. How does one receive this patch?

Many Thanks, Jason


----------



## Phryq

I also wanted to ask about the stereo-spread (can't find this anywhere).

Is 100% spread simply Mic-A 100% left and Mic-B 100% right?

Or is there some algorithm going on? I prefer to start with mics hard-panned, but no 'stereo' processing. Is that 50% (default) spread?


----------



## eli0s

Embertone said:


> We do now have beta patches available for any *current owners** wanting a sneak peak at the half pedaling feature. Thanks!


Hello Alex,

New owner here, requesting this sneak peek at the half pedaling feature! How should I get by it, ask here or at Embertone's support?

Thank you for your support,

Elias


----------



## SAM CA

In case if anybody's interested in a first impression type of recording, here's one that I recorded a while ago. (Not the new Beta version). Once they iron out the issues, it should be considered one of the top piano libraries for sure.


----------



## Lougheed

Great recording! Thanks for sharing.

And yes I agree if they can get the issues sorted (note cut offs) and new features finished it will become the go-to piano for many, I'm sure.


----------



## NYC Composer

I thought it was something I was doing wrong.

I have the pedaling cutoff as well (Lite version), and I’m surprised we haven’t gotten Embertone feedback on it. I’m starting to wonder if it’s a knotty problem they have yet to figure out. Not good.


----------



## styledelk

SAM CA said:


> In case if anybody's interested in a first impression type of recording, here's one that I recorded a while ago. (Not the new Beta version). Once they iron out the issues, it should be considered one of the top piano libraries for sure.



Which keyboard controller is that?


----------



## SAM CA

styledelk said:


> Which keyboard controller is that?



It's a Korg Kronos 2. I like the keybed a lot. You can totally play advanced material on it.


----------



## jon wayne

SAM CA said:


> In case if anybody's interested in a first impression type of recording, here's one that I recorded a while ago. (Not the new Beta version). Once they iron out the issues, it should be considered one of the top piano libraries for sure.



I have been hesitant to upgrade to the full version because I’m not in love with the sound of lite. I saw this is the main mics. Should I be getting close to this sound with the lite?


----------



## SAM CA

jon wayne said:


> I have been hesitant to upgrade to the full version because I’m not in love with the sound of lite. I saw this is the main mics. Should I be getting close to this sound with the lite?



I've never tried the lite version so i'm not sure what the tonal difference between the two is. In this video I'm only using the default out of the box setting I think. I didn't record more videos with contrasting settings because of the drop outs. 

Minus pedal and drop out issues, I thought it was a very nice and convincing piano. It's a pretty versatile instrument for sure.


----------



## harmaes

I heard from Embertone support that the beta version can be requested via their support email address. Anyone tried it? (haven’t bought it yet)


----------



## wolfgangmeister

Yes it is true. I heard from both Alex Davis and Nick Cameron from Embertone Technical Support; they provided me a v1.1 BETA patch that is *definitely an improvement from my initial assessment* - I've been evaluating it for the past hour or so. Here was the direct message from their tech team:
"_Hello! You are receiving this message because you requested the BETA patch for the Walker 1955 Concert D. We apologize for the wait! We just shared two zip files with you... those are the instruments with the half pedaling feature completed! This version is almost a full 1.1 update. However, in the coming weeks the following features will be added: (1) a new sustain resonance sample set will be added! (2) a minor graphical glitch will be fixed (3) full NKS re-integration. New presets to match all the new features of the 1.1 update."_


----------



## SAM CA

That's great news! This is a very nice piano and totally deserves a solid update.


----------



## NYC Composer

Is the cutoff fixed?


----------



## wolfgangmeister

It's much better... When I use proportional pedaling, I can still get it to happen, but it happens much less frequently.


----------



## eli0s

I don't get any cutoffs with the new 1.1 beta instrument and I can already tell that there is a huge difference in expression with half pedaling! Half sustained notes leave so much more room for subtle details. Previously, the full sustained notes were too dominate in dense passages.

One thing that I can tell for sure is that the voice count and cpu usage skyrockets with this instrument!!! I hope that in the future some optimization will bring cpu - buffer size requirements down.


----------



## Mikk

For me even with the new beta update the piano is still unplayable.
I have a correct machine: I7 quad core 2016 macbook pro. 16 Gb or ram, fast SSD, thunderbolt UAD apollo twin sound card: I can't play without dropout with a buffer at 128. As soon as the voices go around the voice limit and I release the sustain pedal I get dropouts.
I have tried to lower the voice limit or to set it very high, batch resave. I have even tried to reinstall a fresh OS on an external SSD without success. The support answer is to set the buffer size aroud 512 or 758!!! 

How many perspective can you play at the same time with the classical preset? and what buffer size do you use? how many voices?


----------



## Pudge

Reading the thread title made me think of that old TV show, Walker Texas Ranger... 

Anyway, sounds nice


----------



## wolfgangmeister

Mikk said:


> For me even with the new beta update the piano is still unplayable.
> I have a correct machine: I7 quad core 2016 macbook pro. 16 Gb or ram, fast SSD, thunderbolt UAD apollo twin sound card: I can't play without dropout with a buffer at 128. As soon as the voices go around the voice limit and I release the sustain pedal I get dropouts.
> I have tried to lower the voice limit or to set it very high, batch resave. I have even tried to reinstall a fresh OS on an external SSD without success. The support answer is to set the buffer size aroud 512 or 758!!!
> 
> How many perspective can you play at the same time with the classical preset? and what buffer size do you use? how many voices?



I also have a Dell i7 quad core 2018 2-in-1 touchscreen laptop, with a very fast SSD. In order to avoid dropouts on a slower more melodic Liszt or Grieg lyrical piece, I've had to increase the buffer size to at least 256 (which is a noticeable latency to me) and use only one microphone set - Wide. I've also had to adapt my playing to hang onto notes with more exaggerated legato and pronounced on-to-off-to-on sustain pedaling to help clear the buffer. These are all things I do not have to do with Garritan CFX Full, VSL Steinway or PianoTeq 6.4 Std - operating with zero or no latency with a polyphony of 128 (or 256 on PT) and buffers of no more than 128. I can definitely hear the potential in the sound of the samples with the Embertone Walker 1955 Concert D - i.e. beautiful sampling; but the interface and details of operation have a way to go to match their aforementioned competitors.


----------



## ka00

Pudge said:


> Reading the thread title made me think of that old TV show, Walker Texas Ranger...
> 
> Anyway, sounds nice



The Chuck Norris Piano: when you strike the keys, the keys strike you back.


----------



## keepitsimple

I have to genuinely applaud everyone here for their commitment and patience with this piano in terms of waiting for a fix. I mean not even the wife in the new Netflix show ‘Dirty John” has the patience you guys have.

Me? I threw the towel a long time ago, it’s now in my trash stash aka ‘unused libraries SSD”. I did update to the beta version yesterday but it’s still in the trash stash and I have a feeling it will always be there.

We’ll see when the final update rolls but I’m not getting my hopes up.


----------



## CGR

keepitsimple said:


> I have to genuily applaud everyone here for their commitment and patience with this piano, knowing that it sounds good but it plays....NOT so good. Not even the wife in the new Netflix show ‘Dirty John” can have the patience you guys have in terms of waiting for a fix.
> 
> Me? I threw the towel a long time ago, it’s now in my trash stash aka ‘unused libraries SSD”. I did update to the beta version yesterday but it’s still in the trash stash, I’m not really getting my hopes up. We’ll see when the final update rolls....


Ha! I like your 'Dirty John' analogy, but I'm sorry to hear The Walker D still isn't working for you. I haven't tried the beta update as yet (I only have the Lite, and will sit it out until the final release update is out before considering upgrading to the full version).


----------



## slobajudge

keepitsimple said:


> I have to genuinely applaud everyone here for their commitment and patience with this piano in terms of waiting for a fix. I mean not even the wife in the new Netflix show ‘Dirty John” has the patience you guys have.
> 
> Me? I threw the towel a long time ago, it’s now in my trash stash aka ‘unused libraries SSD”. I did update to the beta version yesterday but it’s still in the trash stash and I have a feeling it will always be there.
> 
> We’ll see when the final update rolls but I’m not getting my hopes up.


I am halfway to the same direction, especially because my request for beta patch stays couple of months without results and I really hate to repeat myself and beg again. So my focus change towards VSL pianos. But as you said, we`ll see when the final update comes.


----------



## Pudge

ka00 said:


> The Chuck Norris Piano: when you strike the keys, the keys strike you back.



Dude, you're a genius. That cracked me up! Haha


----------



## keepitsimple

slobajudge said:


> I am halfway to the same direction, especially because my request for beta patch stays couple of months without results and I really hate to repeat myself and beg again. So my focus change towards VSL pianos. But as you said, we`ll see when the final update comes.


Good for you. Long time coming for you. You made the right choice!


----------



## rottoy

ka00 said:


> The Chuck Norris Piano: when you strike the keys, the keys strike you back.


What about the Han Solo Piano? 
It's generated quite the controversy due to the fact that nobody can agree on who strikes first, the piano or the player.


----------



## alexbaroni

Hi people.

I have two products from Embertone.

-Walker 1955 Steinway D
-Joshua Bell Violin

I noted that in Komplete Kontrol sofware, The Walker Piano is showed under Native Instruments Vendor and not in Embertone. The Joshua Violin is correct under the Embertone.

I didn´t check all the forum yet, but I appreciate to know if someone have had the same problem. I asked Embertone, but they don´t have an answer for me until now.

Thank you
Alex


----------



## jbuhler

alexbaroni said:


> Hi people.
> 
> I have two products from Embertone.
> 
> -Walker 1955 Steinway D
> -Joshua Bell Violin
> 
> I noted that in Komplete Kontrol sofware, The Walker Piano is showed under Native Instruments Vendor and not in Embertone. The Joshua Violin is correct under the Embertone.
> 
> I didn´t check all the forum yet, but I appreciate to know if someone have had the same problem. I asked Embertone, but they don´t have an answer for me until now.
> 
> Thank you
> Alex


I have this issue with one of my Metropolis Ark libraries, which also shows up under OT, after I reinstalled the KK software. Oddly, this library doesn't even exist on my drives and it persisted under NI even after I did a complete removal and reinstall of the KK software earlier today. Then there are the libraries that don't show up at all but should...


----------



## Lougheed

Indeed. At first I couldn't find the NKS controls for the Walker because I was looking . . . for Embertone. I was about to message tech support to inquire about this, and accidentally stumbled upon it. I wonder, though, how many have messaged tech support about this? Definitely should be fixed.


----------



## oshogg

So, when is the 1.1 version coming out? It has been a long wait...

Osho


----------



## OleJoergensen

+1 Very long...


----------



## Fleer

But it’ll be soooooo good.


----------



## thecomposer10

Still waiting... the pesky clicking sound on the low "E" at the highest velocity layer is destroying my MIDI demos.


----------



## WaveRider

Anyone having issues with notes cutting off abruptly when using a lot sustain pedal? Not sure if this is a bug or a loud proclamation saying 'no half pedaling!' Otherwise this a freakin' great piano.


----------



## Ashermusic

Yes, me too.


----------



## Nicktwo85

Yes, same. I've upped the voice count and still get consistent note cut-offs while employing the sustain pedal. It's quite jarring when you're "in the zone" so-to-speak.


----------



## alexbaroni

alexbaroni said:


> Hi people.
> 
> I have two products from Embertone.
> 
> -Walker 1955 Steinway D
> -Joshua Bell Violin
> 
> I noted that in Komplete Kontrol sofware, The Walker Piano is showed under Native Instruments Vendor and not in Embertone. The Joshua Violin is correct under the Embertone.
> 
> I didn´t check all the forum yet, but I appreciate to know if someone have had the same problem. I asked Embertone, but they don´t have an answer for me until now.
> 
> Thank you
> Alex



Someone else here to help me?


----------



## newman

20% offer on Embertone this week.

I will flag this post to moderators just in case it is in wrong place.


----------



## good

20% discount on this piano that has beautiful tone is a chance for those who planned to buy it.

I'm using beta version but still waiting for their update.


----------



## Illico

WaveRider said:


> Anyone having issues with notes cutting off abruptly when using a lot sustain pedal?


+1, Same here. Waiting for a fixing.


----------



## LittleCoral

Am I the only one hearing footsteps when I sustain E4 with the Binaural Mic + una corda activated, at low velocity?


----------



## LittleCoral

I called it E4 but it's the same  (could it be the reason why the download links they sent you changed nothing?)


----------



## evilantal

newman said:


> 20% offer on Embertone this week.
> 
> I will flag this post to moderators just in case it is in wrong place.



Anyone know if the discount will also work for an upgrade from Lite to full D?
Does "this week" mean until next Sunday?
Maybe @Embertone can chime in


----------



## DerGeist

LittleCoral said:


> Am I the only one hearing footsteps when I sustain E4 with the Binaural Mix + una corda activated, at low velocity?


I thought I was going crazy! I have taken of my headphones a number of times convinced someone had just walked into the room. I have heard this on the standard mike.


----------



## slobajudge

DerGeist said:


> I thought I was going crazy! I have taken of my headphones a number of times convinced someone had just walked into the room. I have heard this on the standard mike.


Because Embertone calculate days for update from Venus calendar and not Earth days (someone mention that before), seems reasonable that what you hear is Moonwalk  They must live in accordance to


----------



## OleJoergensen

Is it like half a year the update has been on its way.....?


----------



## DerGeist

slobajudge said:


> Because Embertone calculate days for update from Venus calendar and not Earth days (someone mention that before), seems reasonable that what you hear is Moonwalk  They must live in accordance to


I have solved the pedaling issue by being a terrible rock pianist. If you never take your foot off the pedal it works great. This is only a problem for people with good pedal technique


----------



## Phryq

Also, in the update, maybe you could include something that allows the Dynamic Pure Tuning to work? (It glitches with the current version). Hopefully that's an easy fix?


----------



## Pablocrespo

Any news about the official update?


----------



## OleJoergensen

Pablocrespo said:


> Any news about the official update?


+1


----------



## jneebz

Pablocrespo said:


> Any news about the official update?


+1 @Embertone any thoughts at this point?


----------



## Illico

Here an answer from support this month...


> There is an update we are making for the Walker that we are trying to release ASAP!


----------



## slobajudge

Illico said:


> Here an answer from support this month...There is an update we are making for the Walker that we are trying to release ASAP!





> Embertone Aug 8, 2018
> Update is ASAP.


No worries, its coming


----------



## bsntn99

A year of empty promises ... not a great way to instill confidence in potential customers. I know I won't be doing business with Embertone in the future.


----------



## NYC Composer

I have to admit to being pretty shocked and disappointed at the silence from Embertone. It seems antithetical to their initial customer care model.


----------



## newman

Certainly there is pent up demand for well-playing Steinway piano VIs.

If Embertone can get the Walker Steinway piano finalised, they would see a big bump in sales from those of us patiently waiting on the sidelines.


----------



## OleJoergensen

bsntn99 said:


> A year of empty promises ... not a great way to instill confidence in potential customers. I know I won't be doing business with Embertone in the future.


I have the same thought and I feel sad about it because I love the tone of Walker.....


----------



## EgM

Embertone is a small team, I know we're all impatient but give 'em a chance to fix things out. For all we know they probably had to re-record sections of the whole thing.


----------



## Grizzlymv

As EgM mention, they are a very small team I think, which will obviously won't have the same reaction time as bigger companies. Their service is above average and the quality of the products is top notch. To deliver such high quality, it takes time. My feeling is they are victim of their success. Keep faith, and you shouldn't be afraid of doing business with them. My humble 2 cents.


----------



## mojamusic

I just bought the piano, a moment ago and there is a notice stating that Embertone is having some legal issues with the name... that could also be a monkey wrench for a small company. Let's stand by them.


----------



## EgM

mojamusic said:


> I just bought the piano and there is a notice stating that Embertone is having some legal issues with the name... that could also be a monkey wrench for a small company. Let's stand by them.



They dealt with that, they only had to remove the mention of the word 'Steinway' and have changed it since then.


----------



## CGR

Grizzlymv said:


> As EgM mention, they are a very small team I think, which will obviously won't have the same reaction time as bigger companies. Their service is above average and the quality of the products is top notch. To deliver such high quality, it takes time. My feeling is they are victim of their success. Keep faith, and you shouldn't be afraid of doing business with them. My humble 2 cents.


Good points. Although communication to their customer base is important - if only to say that it's still a work in progress.


----------



## Fleer

Grizzlymv said:


> As EgM mention, they are a very small team I think, which will obviously won't have the same reaction time as bigger companies. Their service is above average and the quality of the products is top notch. To deliver such high quality, it takes time.My feeling is they are victim of their success.Keep faith, and you shouldn't be afraid of doing business with them.My humble 2 cents.


^^^ This.
And for such a very small team they make some of the best products available. Nothing beats their Joshua Bell Violin library and I’m sure the final version of their Walker Steinway will be just as incredible. Go, Embertone.


----------



## Mystic

You guys have a weird way of coming up with excuses to deflect issues these companies have; especially with customer service. I love Embertone but the reality is they should be on here communicating with us every once in a while to let us know what is going on rather than radio silence for months at a time. I find this very odd behavior for this company as they have always been very active with the community. It takes all of 10 minutes to log in and give us some sort of update as to what is going on. Many of us paid a lot of money for this library and are waiting for updates beyond the half-pedaling thing.

If they had issues that required the library to be re-recorded, that's fine but at least let your customers know so we're not hanging in the dark for a year. Saying they are a small company is such a BS excuse for radio silence if I've ever heard one.


----------



## thecomposer10

Mystic said:


> You guys have a weird way of coming up with excuses to deflect issues these companies have; especially with customer service. I love Embertone but the reality is they should be on here communicating with us every once in a while to let us know what is going on rather than radio silence for months at a time. I find this very odd behavior for this company as they have always been very active with the community. It takes all of 10 minutes to log in and give us some sort of update as to what is going on. Many of us paid a lot of money for this library and are waiting for updates beyond the half-pedaling thing.
> 
> If they had issues that required the library to be re-recorded, that's fine but at least let your customers know so we're not hanging in the dark for a year. Saying they are a small company is such a BS excuse for radio silence if I've ever heard one.



I have to agree. The cutoffs that come as a result of bad pedal scripting basically make this things unusable for classical style playing and recording, and since the sound is so good that this is a real travesty. I find myself using the HZP (!) for classical style cues and recordings because the programming is just so much better, even though at least in my opinion the sound is not. I’ve been eagerly awaiting an update to this but am disappointed by the lack of communication.


----------



## Pablocrespo

Yes, I know people are eager to defend the small companies, and I like to do that too, but some info on the status of the product would be nice, a beta was released, and then it went silent.

I would like to know if the problems will be adressed because is my best sounding piano, but I would start to move elsewhere.


----------



## mojamusic

I'm having issues with the install of the library so I can't test it, just yet but is it usable for any application as is, or do the issues render the library useless for now?


----------



## thecomposer10

mojamusic said:


> I'm having issues with the install of the library so I can't test it, just yet but is it usable for any application as is, or do the issues render the library useless for now?



It’s definitely usable, but you can’t play technically intricate things with it because notes consistently cut out if you pedal them even a millisecond off. I mainly use it for slower “classical” style cues where I can deal with the pedal issues by editing CC data piece by piece.


----------



## ryst

Mystic said:


> You guys have a weird way of coming up with excuses to deflect issues these companies have; especially with customer service. I love Embertone but the reality is they should be on here communicating with us every once in a while to let us know what is going on rather than radio silence for months at a time. I find this very odd behavior for this company as they have always been very active with the community. It takes all of 10 minutes to log in and give us some sort of update as to what is going on. Many of us paid a lot of money for this library and are waiting for updates beyond the half-pedaling thing.
> 
> If they had issues that required the library to be re-recorded, that's fine but at least let your customers know so we're not hanging in the dark for a year. Saying they are a small company is such a BS excuse for radio silence if I've ever heard one.



To play devil's advocate, this forum is not called "Embertone Customer Support Forum". It's a 3rd party forum where developers choose to or not to be active. So regardless of your expectations based on the past, it doesn't require them to continue to keep everyone up to date in this forum. 

I'm really curious how many people here who have complained of their silence have bothered to email their support email address that is located on their website?


----------



## EgM

ryst said:


> To play devil's advocate, this forum is not called "Embertone Customer Support Forum". It's a 3rd party forum where developers choose to or not to be active. So regardless of your expectations based on the past, it doesn't require them to continue to keep everyone up to date in this forum.
> 
> I'm really curious how many people here who have complained of their silence have bothered to email their support email address that is located on their website?



This. ^

I do a lot of my own sample libraries for my own use, but I wouldn't ever want to have to deal with support on this forum  Contact their official support.


----------



## mojamusic

They responded to me straightaway from their support email. I was having an install issue and Nick from support responded almost immediately.


----------



## NYC Composer

ryst said:


> To play devil's advocate, this forum is not called "Embertone Customer Support Forum". It's a 3rd party forum where developers choose to or not to be active. So regardless of your expectations based on the past, it doesn't require them to continue to keep everyone up to date in this forum.
> 
> I'm really curious how many people here who have complained of their silence have bothered to email their support email address that is located on their website?


I completely agree with you, so I did indeed email support yesterday.


----------



## Mystic

So I'm curious. How many of the people here have emailed them about this issue and actually gotten a response on it? Embertone has always been good with technical support and I can't fault them for that but they seem to be very hush hush about what they are doing with this particular library.

Again, I will say I'm not angry or upset with the company. More confused as to why they are being so quiet about what is going on and not communicating about it. I just find it a bit silly that so many people come up with the most god awful excuses to defend companies when things like this happen.


----------



## NYC Composer

Mystic said:


> So I'm curious. How many of the people here have emailed them about this issue and actually gotten a response on it? Embertone has always been good with technical support and I can't fault them for that but they seem to be very hush hush about what they are doing with this particular library.
> 
> Again, I will say I'm not angry or upset with the company. More confused as to why they are being so quiet about what is going on and not communicating about it. I just find it a bit silly that so many people come up with the most god awful excuses to defend companies when things like this happen.


I haven’t gotten a response yet, but it’s been a short time. I questioned them on their quietude.

I’m not angry or upset either-I’ve just loved their ethos as a company up to now, and I encouraged them to be a little more communicative. I’m interested in their response.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

OK, My 2 cents worth. It might not be perfect but it's my best piano VI and I love it as it is. I bought it expecting it to be as it is and was not disappointed. It does what it says on the tin. Then Embertone offered to try and add features for some who really wanted them. Props for that and perhaps the communication on this front could have been better as it's clearly taking a long time to get right. However, I'm happy with the VI as it is. If you're not I'm sorry to hear that and I'm sure Embertone would be too. But once again, I got exactly what I was expecting and I love it. I use it as it is and would be happy if they never released the updated features. That was never part of the deal when I bought it. I have many embertone instruments and they are among my favourites. I am not affiliated with Embertone in any way, just my opinion on the subject.


----------



## star.keys

I sincerely think that this thread deserves to be taken out of commercial announcements section. It is ridiculous to read complaints (for that a piano that cheap) every time I check here, thinking that there would be an update or something new being announced


----------



## jaketanner

EgM said:


> This. ^
> 
> I do a lot of my own sample libraries for my own use, but I wouldn't ever want to have to deal with support on this forum  Contact their official support.



Totally understand that this is not support, but if Embertone replied at any given time in this forum (which I think they did), then went dark, the least the can do is say something so that it doesn't look like they abandoned their customers. Not saying they need to address any support issues, but at least a few words saying something, and that they're working on the update and can't monitor this forum anymore. That would at least make people aware that THEY are aware.

As others have stated, it this piano wasn't so great sounding, no one would care about the update...but we all want to use this thing without any glitches...so I totally understand the people who paid, and can't use it how they'd like because it's taking them about a year to fix. I went through this with IkMultimedia before...had a product that was unusable because it kept crashing my DAW...took them over a year to update it.

I love this piano, and have tweaked the hell out of it from the default to where it sounds amazing and responds perfectly...just a few minor things to be perfection.


----------



## Phryq

Maybe someone handy with Kontakt can just develop a script that links CC to release-times.

How would that fall short of other half-pedaling scripts? Is that something we can already do within Kontakt?


----------



## NYC Composer

Damnit- didn’t realize this was in the Commercial Section.


----------



## Fleer

SoNowWhat? said:


> OK, My 2 cents worth. It might not be perfect but it's my best piano VI and I love it as it is. I bought it expecting it to be as it is and was not disappointed. It does what it says on the tin. Then Embertone offered to try and add features for some who really wanted them. Props for that and perhaps the communication on this front could have been better as it's clearly taking a long time to get right. However, I'm happy with the VI as it is. If you're not I'm sorry to hear that and I'm sure Embertone would be too. But once again, I got exactly what I was expecting and I love it. I use it as it is and would be happy if they never released the updated features. That was never part of the deal when I bought it. I have many embertone instruments and they are among my favourites. I am not affiliated with Embertone in any way, just my opinion on the subject.


Same thinking here. Love that piano. Got lots and this one’s definitely among the best sounding IMO.


----------



## jneebz

Can someone clarify the "re-naming" fix? I changed the .nicnt, .nkc, and .nkr and the Instrument file names. Now when Kontakt tries to open the library I get a load error because it's searching for the original .nicnt with "Steinway" in the name...TIA


----------



## EgM

Files should look like this:






Then reauthorize it with Native Access.


----------



## jneebz

EgM said:


> Files should look like this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Then reauthorize it with Native Access.


I re-installed with Native Access...is that what you mean? That didn't work unfortunately, if so....


----------



## EgM

jneebz said:


> I re-installed with Native Access...is that what you mean? That didn't work unfortunately, if so....



Just contact Embertone support, they'll have you up and running in no time.


----------



## Funkybot

I really hope Embertone is going to blow us away with this update whenever it does finally come out. The half-pedaling beta has been available to anyone who contacts support and requests it, but they're clearly working on a lot more than that. This update is approaching almost a year in the making. That said, I also hope that major performance optimizations are part of the hold-up. I've never seen an instrument that eats up voice count/CPU the way this thing does, and I'm far from a great piano player.

It's a wonderful instrument, but I think they should've done an official 1.02-type release for half-pedaling months ago, once it was ready [and just to get it out there], then saved whatever else they were working on for a 1.5 or 2.0 release.


----------



## HardyP

ryst said:


> this forum is not called "Embertone Customer Support Forum"


I fully agree, but if they´d had clear communication (as it was in former times!!) on that via regular email to their customers, people wouldn´t need to go here and search around and place their questions. For example the naming issue: It was changed w/o any notice, and the solution was given over here!
And after their email anouncement of October 18th about "1.1 Update - Ready within days now..." there was silence on the official channels beside occasional sales emails.

And this behavior belongs to "Commercial", because it helps people to decide: If you like the Walker as it is, then buy it (and I recommend it !). But - other than in former times - don´t _count_ on embertone to be a "living product approach company" any more; btw the first indications to that may have been the problems with the withdrawn Cello update, IMHO. 
I do not doubt the love they have for their products, I´m just stating that something (priorities, health, resources,...) has changed since they started with their undisputed groundbraking String Solo Series.


----------



## Genki

Would you guys recommend the LITE version of this piano? For cinematic use


----------



## mojamusic

Genki said:


> Would you guys recommend the LITE version of this piano? For cinematic use



yes


----------



## Fleer

mojamusic said:


> yes


+1


----------



## CGR

+2!


----------



## oshogg

Any word on when is the update coming up?


----------



## mojamusic

Mums the word


----------



## NYC Composer

For a very long time. I hope it’s not a health issue.


----------



## Billy Palmer

I'm curious how the Walker performs when playing in realtime without a generous buffer size?
I have a 15" 2015 macbook pro - I wonder if performing in realtime with all 36 layers would be too much of a cpu hog?


----------



## OleJoergensen

Live performens is a problem because of the sustain pedal- programing I think. It is the update we are waiting for. I hope it will come- the tone of Walker is just gorgeous!


----------



## JEPA

I've bought Walker and didn't knew about this bug...
at least could one mess with the script to find a solution?

on init
declare $new_id

end on
on controller

if ($CC_NUM = 64)
if (%CC[64] = 127)

$new_id := play_note(60,100,0,0)
else

note_off($new_id)
end if

end if end on
trigger a MIDI note by pressing the sustain pedal


----------



## Embertone

Hey all,

We're so sorry for the inexcusable delay. For questions about why we dropped off the world, please refer to a new thread we're making shortly. We've had our reasons for the slow down, personal and professional. One big problem that we're working to resolve is getting ourselves into too many projects... We're refocusing our efforts, and first on our list is to update the piano, JBell, and ISS.

As for the piano update, I'm excited to say that I just have to do final NKS testing on it. For those having performance issues, we've found several easy tweaks to improve things exponentially. The first suggestion is to up the voice count. Our default patches are set waaaay too low, so it causes dropouts rather quickly. The second suggestion is tweak the DFD settings to fit your machine. Those settings aren't always predictable, and we've found some users improved performance by experimenting with different and unexpected DFD settings. My understanding is that higher DFD settings will increase the RAM load and decrease CPU stress. Third, and perhaps most annoyingly, it's important to have just the right buffer setting. I've seen support tickets successfully resolved when users have raised and even lowered their audio buffer!

When we set out to sample this beautiful piano, we didn't expect that Kontakt would be unable to house all the samples within one NKI. We recorded too many darn samples!  That is part of the headache here: having 6 mic positions in 6 identical NKIs, each with a dozen or so NKS presets. We'll be looking out for that issue in the future so that it never happens again.

Anyway... If anyone has an urgent issue, our tech support line, [email protected], is checked and responded to multiple times a day. We've been lucky to have a dedicated specialist, Nick Cameron, on board to get back to everyone with solutions and ideas.



JEPA said:


> I've bought Walker and didn't knew about this bug...
> at least could one mess with the script to find a solution?



Is there something specific about the code you posted that you're needing us to look into?


----------



## JEPA

Embertone said:


> Is there something specific about the code you posted that you're needing us to look into?


hehe, no thank you, it was a pseudo joke. I've only copied the sustain pedal code from the Kontakt manual hoping there could be easy way to start a conversation about why it drops the sound on pedal on. It happens to me too on my machine Mac Pro 5.1 with over 90gb RAM (I don't know yet exactly, I'm writing from home). All I know is I am very satisfied with the sound, but had to let Walker aside on a track I had to deliver yesterday because of the drop outs.


----------



## lumcas

Embertone said:


> Hey all,
> 
> We're so sorry for the inexcusable delay. For questions about why we dropped off the world, please refer to a new thread we're making shortly. We've had our reasons for the slow down, personal and professional. One big problem that we're working to resolve is getting ourselves into too many projects... We're refocusing our efforts, and first on our list is to update the piano, JBell, and ISS............................



You probably don't realize how much it means to us that you occasionally drop a line or two in this thread . Thanks.


----------



## Fleer

Yes, please keep us posted.


----------



## JEPA

JEPA said:


> Mac Pro 5.1 with over 90gb RAM (I don't know yet exactly, I'm writing from home)


ups... I was hoping too much . Now in studio I see I have 48GB RAM...


----------



## lumcas

JEPA said:


> ups... I was hoping too much . Now in studio I see I have 48GB RAM...



Make your RAM great again.


----------



## JEPA

lumcas said:


> Make your RAM great again.


but with 48GB RAM Walker should walk fine... sniff!


----------



## Embertone

Hey gang... the update emails are going out tonight! If you have any issues or questions, send us a line:

[email protected]e.com

<3, Alex


----------



## Fleer

Right on, go Embertone!


----------



## Per Lichtman

Embertone said:


> Hey gang... the update emails are going out tonight! If you have any issues or questions, send us a line:
> 
> [email protected]
> 
> <3, Alex


Just wanted to confirm I got my update links e-mail.

Cheers!


----------



## NYC Composer

Hmmm...waiting.


----------



## slobajudge

Per Lichtman said:


> Just wanted to confirm I got my update links e-mail.
> 
> Cheers!


A... ? Send them back till tonight   ! Lucky you, now I must check every 30 seconds, no toilet and no food. Is there any samples in update ?


----------



## Virtuoso

Yes - 1.3GB of new samples.


----------



## keepitsimple

Updating now. Fingers crossed all my original culprits with the samples are solved.


----------



## CGR

Downloaded and updating now (Full version) - Kontakt is finding the files and reloading them, which is taking some time.


----------



## eli0s

I am batch resaving the instrument, it's trying to find 51152 files for some hours now, is this normal? 
Previously I had the patch loaded without any problems, it just took a couple of minutes to open.


----------



## Virtuoso

eli0s said:


> I am batch resaving the instrument, it's trying to find 51152 files for some hours now, is this normal?
> Previously I had the patch loaded without any problems, it just took a couple of minutes to open.


It might be due to the 'legacy' subfolder and the fact that the instrument was renamed from 'Steinway D' to 'Concert D' which seems to screw up the old links. I just deleted the legacy folder and batch resaved and all was fine.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

Excellent news. Waiting patiently for my linkydinks.


----------



## eli0s

Virtuoso said:


> It might be due to the 'legacy' subfolder and the fact that the instrument was renamed from 'Steinway D' to 'Concert D' which seems to screw up the old links. I just deleted the legacy folder and batch resaved and all was fine.


I had already renamed the directory to Walker 1955 Concert D, I believe since I got and used the beta patches with the early half pedaling features.
The weird thing is that the instrument 1.1 load normally without asking to find any files. It's when I try to batch resave that is missing all that files that I don't seem to have (BRC-steinway_cordadry_...\1955 Steinway - BRC Corda Dry 1.nkx>>>Samples\).
And this is just for the main mic patch. I haven't received the other microphone perspectives that I own yet.

-EDIT- Forgot to say that I deleted the legacy folder as you told me and I still have the problem


----------



## Virtuoso

Did you try deleting (or just temporarily moving out of the way) the 'legacy' subfolder in the Instruments 1.1 folder? That fixed it for me.


----------



## Embertone

Hey gang,

Continuata is crashing and causing me headaches, but I'm working through the system to make sure everyone gets contacted.

LITE users and individual mic owners have not yet been emailed -- once some bugs can be worked out that will happen, hopefully today.

If you're having issues with the instrument (like loading samples and connecting them), you're welcome to reach out to us [email protected]

Thanks!

-Alex


----------



## eli0s

Virtuoso said:


> Did you try deleting (or just temporarily moving out of the way) the 'legacy' subfolder in the Instruments 1.1 folder? That fixed it for me.


Yes, I did, I forgot to mention it in my previous post. I will contact Empertone's support directly! Thank you for helping!


----------



## EgM

Thanks @Embertone ! All installed and working, waiting for the close mics now


----------



## styledelk

*bites nails waiting for the email*


----------



## Funkybot

Another owner of the full version patiently waiting. Glad to see it's finally getting released! It's really a terrific sounding piano and the enhancements/fixes are very appreciated.


----------



## wolb1

I think they mentioned a while back they were going to include a single patch that could load all the mics and would have a proper mixer, did they do this in the update? Still waiting for my email...


----------



## lumcas

slobajudge said:


> A... ? Send them back till tonight   ! Lucky you, now I must check every 30 seconds, no toilet and no food. Is there any samples in update ?



I’ve been sitting on my throne since yesterday, just in case, still no luck. The lack of food is slightly disturbing, but I’ll make it somehow. When is tonight?


----------



## Embertone

wolb1 said:


> I think they mentioned a while back they were going to include a single patch that could load all the mics and would have a proper mixer, did they do this in the update? Still waiting for my email...



Unfortunately it's not possible - too many samples for Kontakt to handle it!


----------



## jaketanner

Embertone said:


> Unfortunately it's not possible - too many samples for Kontakt to handle it!


Just emailed support...it's a bit of a mess installing, and also what about my other mics?


----------



## EgM

jaketanner said:


> Just emailed support...it's a bit of a mess installing, and also what about my other mics?



_Edit: removed the screenshot to better represent who said the post..._

Alex of Embertone said: "LITE users and individual mic owners have not yet been emailed -- once some bugs can be worked out that will happen, hopefully today. "

I think they'll do those after the main mics have been sent to all users.


----------



## jaketanner

EgM said:


> View attachment 22875
> 
> 
> I think they'll do those after the main mics have been sent to all users.


Should not have even started this update then. Glad I didn't trash the old files...I can move them back. I appreciate the updates, but even with the name change, it's to like Embertone reached out and told it's users to make those changes...we had to find out the hard way.


----------



## Symfoniq

EgM said:


> View attachment 22875



I'm unable to fully download the update. Connect is crashing here, too (latest version).


----------



## Michel Simons

EgM said:


> _Edit: removed the screenshot to better represent who said the post..._
> 
> Alex of Embertone said: "LITE users and individual mic owners have not yet been emailed -- once some bugs can be worked out that will happen, hopefully today. "
> 
> I think they'll do those after the main mics have been sent to all users.



I am a lite user and I already had the e-mail this morning (some 12 hours ago). 
The only problem I had was that the installation instructions were a bit ambiguous about deleting the original Instruments folder.
Of course I deleted it and therefore had some problems with a current project that included the instrument.
I just reloaded the new instrument and made the tweaks I believed I had made previously. It worked as expected.


----------



## Embertone

jaketanner said:


> Should not have even started this update then. Glad I didn't trash the old files...I can move them back. I appreciate the updates, but even with the name change, it's to like Embertone reached out and told it's users to make those changes...we had to find out the hard way.



You're totally right. We did our very best to keep this update streamlined and simple -- but it's not as simple as it could be. Sorry about that! We are sending out individual mics now...


----------



## ReelToLogic

Embertone said:


> LITE users and individual mic owners have not yet been emailed -- once some bugs can be worked out that will happen, hopefully today.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> -Alex



FYI - I received the links for my Lite version early this morning, but still haven't received the links for my full version (all mics). That's just the opposite of the statement above.


----------



## Mucusman

ReelToLogic said:


> still haven't received the links for my full version (all mics)



Take comfort: you are not alone. I only have the full package but am awaiting my links.


----------



## Embertone

ReelToLogic said:


> FYI - I received the links for my Lite version early this morning, but still haven't received the links for my full version (all mics). That's just the opposite of the statement above.



When I attempted to email all LITE users, I crashed the entire Continuata system. So a few might have received that email. But we will be doing a batch re-send of all the LITE emails.

As for the FULL, my impression is that the Continuata system was able to successfully send those emails. If you haven't received one, please reach out right away and we will get you your codes.

Thanks!

-Alex


----------



## chapbot

LOL people, simply read the instructions to update. It. Is. Not. Hard. Did it within 30 seconds, new version loaded perfectly.


----------



## slobajudge

lumcas said:


> I’ve been sitting on my throne since yesterday, just in case, still no luck. The lack of food is slightly disturbing, but I’ll make it somehow. When is tonight?


Tonight is now  at least in this time zone. No email yet. I hope you already received your update.


----------



## styledelk

They only hard part about the instructions was what to do if you didn't need to rename the Walker folder, since that didn't instigate a need to refind the library.
[Although when I tried to do a batch resave after that, it still complained it couldn't find samples.]

But at least a few of the instruments worked fine for me.


----------



## prodigalson

It’s pretty frustrating that they sent out the “update” for just the main mic without any information that it would only update the main mic and not any other mics only to send another email with information on updating several mics at once. I just spent about 30mins downloading and updating only to now get another email saying I have to do it all over again to use my other mics. If I had known another email was coming I would have just waited and done it once


----------



## styledelk

So thank you @Embertone for the update! I look forward to getting to try it out tonight.


----------



## jonnybutter

Everything working great for me. Loads perfectly, sounds great, half pedaling works. Nice job!


----------



## eli0s

jonnybutter said:


> Everything working great for me. Loads perfectly, sounds great, half pedaling works. Nice job!


Have you tried batch resaving the patches? Did it work?


----------



## Symfoniq

The update guide appears to contain contradictory instructions.

Step 1 says to remove all directories except "Documentation" and "Samples".

Step 2 shows the directory "Instruments" still being present.

Which is correct?


----------



## EgM

Symfoniq said:


> The update guide appears to contain contradictory instructions.
> 
> Step 1 says to remove all directories except "Documentation" and "Samples".
> 
> Step 2 shows the directory "Instruments" still being present.
> 
> Which is correct?



You can leave the old "Instruments" folder there, I did so my old projects would at least load without complaining. Do remember to load new patches from the "Instrument 1.1" folder in the future though.


----------



## jonnybutter

eli0s said:


> Have you tried batch resaving the patches? Did it work?



I didn't try that yet.


----------



## slobajudge

I received update, testing, so far everything is working, I will run through the details tonight and see you in the morning. Thank you Embertone, great job.


----------



## Fleer

Got mine in too. Full user here. Thank you, Embertone, thank you indeed.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

I just received my email. I have Walker Full. Thank you Embertone. I probably won’t have time to look at it for a while.


----------



## CGR

Just installed my additional mic updates (Binaural & Hammer) and had a quick run through with the Hammer + Mains in a multi - all really solid at this point. Running it in the Kontakt 6 Player and no performance problems with the full 36 layers and all samples switched on (only disabled the Staccatos).
Great work Embertone - it's been well worth the wait!


----------



## sostenuto

Recently impressed with Tobias' _ OT reminder that their Contact /Support /Helpdesk page has tab named: _Folder Structures /how your installation should look_

Only Lite so far, but totally confused how new Update should look. To be safe, I renamed Instruments as (old Instruments); Snapshots as (old Snapshots). 
How can I be sure the Update is now properly installed ? What should new '_Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D Lite_' folder look like ( including subfolders and sizes ) ? 
Very interested in purchasing full product, but not before Lite Update is verified and tested.


----------



## conceptcar3

Got the update for the full. Incredible stuff! Loving it.


----------



## jneebz

sostenuto said:


> How can I be sure the Update is now properly installed ?


There's an image in the Installation Guide. However, I found the update installation to be confusing despite the Guide. I just made the folders look like the picture and then had to batch re-save everything. 

Everything seems to be working now, but the CPU usage is off the charts and the "Main Mics" patch releases voices REALLY slowly for some reason...no idea what that's about., maybe normal, but it kills my CPU. I'm hoping I can make some performance tweaks to make it usable.


----------



## Fleer

Continuata working like a charm here. Nicely checks if everything's there.


----------



## EgM

jneebz said:


> Everything seems to be working now, but the CPU usage is off the charts and the "Main Mics" patch releases voices REALLY slowly for some reason...no idea what that's about., maybe normal, but it kills my CPU. I'm hoping I can make some performance tweaks to make it usable.



Try this set at 'eco'


----------



## jneebz

Oh, cool, thanks! I’ll try that tomorrow...


----------



## sostenuto

jneebz said:


> There's an image in the Installation Guide. However, I found the update installation to be confusing despite the Guide. I just made the folders look like the picture and then had to batch re-save everything.
> 
> Everything seems to be working now, but the CPU usage is off the charts and the "Main Mics" patch releases voices REALLY slowly for some reason...no idea what that's about., maybe normal, but it kills my CPU. I'm hoping I can make some performance tweaks to make it usable.



THX. Re-read Installation Guide, and instructions remain confusing. 
_No big deal_ ...... but Guide states: 'Remove all Folders except Documentation and Samples'. This clearly means to remove _Instruments _Folder as well. New installation image shows both Instruments folder _AND_ Instruments v1.1. How can Instruments Folder remain after Update when only instruments v1.1 folder is in the Update ?? I assume this is an error and orginal Instruments folder should not appear ..... yes ???


----------



## EgM

sostenuto said:


> THX. Re-read Installation Guide, and instructions remain confusing.
> _No big deal_ ...... but Guide states: 'Remove all Folders except Documentation and Samples'. This clearly means to remove _Instruments _Folder as well. New installation image shows both Instruments folder _AND_ Instruments v1.1. How can Instruments Folder remain after Update when only instruments v1.1 folder is in the Update ?? I assume this is an error and orginal Instruments folder should not appear ..... yes ???



I think you shouldn't use the old 'Instruments' folders because it won't make use of the new samples that contain fixes, BUT you can leave them there so your old projects load as they were. Your call. If you were a new buyer, you'd have no use for that old Instruments folder.


----------



## sostenuto

EgM said:


> I think you shouldn't use the old 'Instruments' folders because it won't make use of the new samples that contain fixes, BUT you can leave them there so your old projects load as they were. Your call. If you were a new buyer, you'd have no use for that old Instruments folder.



Makes sense. Old projects are a factor for many. 
Appreciate your help, and Embertone indeed had the installation folder images as desired.


----------



## WaveRider

Uh... hmmmm. Never received an email about an update. When was it sent?


----------



## Embertone

Hey All!



prodigalson said:


> It’s pretty frustrating that they sent out the “update” for just the main mic without any information that it would only update the main mic and not any other mics only to send another email with information on updating several mics at once. I just spent about 30mins downloading and updating only to now get another email saying I have to do it all over again to use my other mics. If I had known another email was coming I would have just waited and done it once



Yep, that was frustrating for us too. We intended to send everything all at once... but our batch email broke the Continuata system for awhile, and I had to wait until Stu could make a better solution to get in touch with everyone. I take the blame -- and will learn from the mistake!



EgM said:


> You can leave the old "Instruments" folder there, I did so my old projects would at least load without complaining. Do remember to load new patches from the "Instrument 1.1" folder in the future though.



Keep in mind that if you leave the Instruments folder in there, Komplete Kontrol will see that folder as well, and cause some confusion. If you don't use Komplete Kontrol though, there's no harm in keeping that original Instruments folder in there.



Symfoniq said:


> The update guide appears to contain contradictory instructions.
> 
> Step 1 says to remove all directories except "Documentation" and "Samples".
> 
> Step 2 shows the directory "Instruments" still being present.
> 
> Which is correct?



We will be updating the image so that there is no "Instruments" folder on the right. THAT is how we hope users will organize, WITHOUT the Instruments folder.



WaveRider said:


> Uh... hmmmm. Never received an email about an update. When was it sent?



We sent batch emails out to everyone today. If you haven't received an email, hit us up [email protected].



jneebz said:


> There's an image in the Installation Guide. However, I found the update installation to be confusing despite the Guide. I just made the folders look like the picture and then had to batch re-save everything.



Sorry that the process was tough. We did our very best to make sense of it -- but the product is pretty complicated. For future products we will keep this challenge in mind!



jneebz said:


> Everything seems to be working now, but the CPU usage is off the charts and the "Main Mics" patch releases voices REALLY slowly for some reason...no idea what that's about., maybe normal, but it kills my CPU. I'm hoping I can make some performance tweaks to make it usable.



Please reach out -- [email protected]!

Thanks everyone!

-Alex


----------



## lumcas

slobajudge said:


> Tonight is now  at least in this time zone. No email yet. I hope you already received your update.



Got my links, will update later today. Huge amount of work had to go into this so thanks again Embertone!!!


----------



## Scamper

> Fixed an issue where a glitch occurred when simultaneously activating the sustain pedal and a note



This hopefully fixes my issues with having cpu overload and crackles while using the pedal. Great update overall, thanks.


----------



## Embertone

We've removed the confusing INSTRUMENTS/MULTIS folder from the installation instructions 

Behold:

*FULL*





Installation Instructions







www.embertone.com






*LITE*





Installation Instructions







www.embertone.com


----------



## ptram

I noticed that you can't paste a license in Continuata Connect, before it has finished downloading and installing the previous one. If you do so, you end with missing microphones.

So, download only a single license at once.

Paolo


----------



## prodigalson

Embertone said:


> Hey All!
> 
> 
> 
> Yep, that was frustrating for us too. We intended to send everything all at once... but our batch email broke the Continuata system for awhile, and I had to wait until Stu could make a better solution to get in touch with everyone. I take the blame -- and will learn from the mistake!
> 
> 
> 
> Keep in mind that if you leave the Instruments folder in there, Komplete Kontrol will see that folder as well, and cause some confusion. If you don't use Komplete Kontrol though, there's no harm in keeping that original Instruments folder in there.
> 
> 
> 
> We will be updating the image so that there is no "Instruments" folder on the right. THAT is how we hope users will organize, WITHOUT the Instruments folder.
> 
> 
> 
> We sent batch emails out to everyone today. If you haven't received an email, hit us up [email protected].
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry that the process was tough. We did our very best to make sense of it -- but the product is pretty complicated. For future products we will keep this challenge in mind!
> 
> 
> 
> Please reach out -- [email protected]!
> 
> Thanks everyone!
> 
> -Alex



Thanks. I will say after having updated both my mics the MULTI works as expected and this piano sounds as fantastic as ever.


----------



## emasters

Thanks to Embertone for the update - appreciate your time and effort with this. One thought that might help with getting the update installed. How about an image of what the finished directory/folder structure should look like? I got it installed and batch-repaved, so it works. But I suspect the way I did it doesn't match your intended outcome, which may make future updates more challenging. Just a thought....


----------



## prodigalson

emasters said:


> Thanks to Embertone for the update - appreciate your time and effort with this. One thought that might help with getting the update installed. How about an image of what the finished directory/folder structure should look like? I got it installed and batch-repaved, so it works. But I suspect the way I did it doesn't match your intended outcome, which may make future updates more challenging. Just a thought....



There is an image of the fully updated file structure in the installation instructions linked above


----------



## Embertone

emasters said:


> Thanks to Embertone for the update - appreciate your time and effort with this. One thought that might help with getting the update installed. How about an image of what the finished directory/folder structure should look like? I got it installed and batch-repaved, so it works. But I suspect the way I did it doesn't match your intended outcome, which may make future updates more challenging. Just a thought....



That's what the lower right picture is! "Ensure that your fully updated installation matches the folder on the right, pictured below"

Ah, @prodigalson, beat me to it 






Installation Instructions







www.embertone.com


----------



## ptram

I reorganized the Instruments folder, by moving the Legacy subfolder out or it. They are now called "Instruments v1.1" and "Instruments v1.0 Legacy". This make batch-resaving (as well as the Instruments folder) cleaner.

Paolo


----------



## emasters

prodigalson said:


> There is an image of the fully updated file structure in the installation instructions linked above



There sure is - thanks.


----------



## Embertone

A couple new demos -- I think this first one shows off the half pedaling quite well. (and I LOVE Schubert)... You get a lovely, blurry sound -- but not so much that all the tones compete with each other. Being able to partially dampen notes and chords really does allow one to phrase in a more subtle way



And some Beethoven! This shows off how versatile the adaptive releases are for this instrument...


----------



## ptram

I spent some time just readapting older sequences to the new Eco half-pedal mode. Not yet the resonance samples of the HQ/HQ+ mode, because I want to try things one at a time. No repedalling, no release samples yet.

Even with the basic set of features, the new half-pedal feature works great. Maybe even better than expected. It can add beauty to a piano piece, with that gradual transition between notes and chords that are the soul of the instrument. It works in the smoothest way. No jump between pedal levels.

If this is the 'economic' way, I can't yet imagine the full-featured way!

Thank you very much, @Embertone, for this great gift!

Paolo


----------



## chasmanian

requesting help, please?
I have Full, all mics.
Continuata download worked fine until last mic position download.
it said 100% for both. but no matter how long I waited, if I clicked to end, I would get a message saying it was still downloading.
I am thinking of deleting all 6 downloads and starting over and re-downloading the whole thing.
any thoughts anybody, please?


----------



## Embertone

chasmanian said:


> requesting help, please?
> I have Full, all mics.
> Continuata download worked fine until last mic position download.
> it said 100% for both. but no matter how long I waited, if I clicked to end, I would get a message saying it was still downloading.
> I am thinking of deleting all 6 downloads and starting over and re-downloading the whole thing.
> any thoughts anybody, please?



Typically you'll get a better response time if you email our tech support, BUT I'm right here, SO! I would first try to do a "reset". With CONNECT open, hold down shift, and hover the mouse over the download button. It becomes a RESET button. Now point to the same folder you were downloading to previously, and connect will try to make things right 

-Alex


----------



## slobajudge

chasmanian said:


> requesting help, please?
> I have Full, all mics.
> Continuata download worked fine until last mic position download.
> it said 100% for both. but no matter how long I waited, if I clicked to end, I would get a message saying it was still downloading.
> I am thinking of deleting all 6 downloads and starting over and re-downloading the whole thing.
> any thoughts anybody, please?


That message is normal. If it is 100 % then it is finished. For you to be sure, just run winrar and open archive before you close Continuata.


----------



## chasmanian

thank you very much Alex, and Slobajudge.
I already closed Connect.
what should I do?


----------



## chasmanian

should I try re-downloading only the last mic position (Wide Mics Update)?


----------



## slobajudge

If you didn`t already, then try again, but if you did, then open archive and update. There is a new installation instruction on the top of this page.


----------



## chasmanian

and Alex and Slobajudge, please tell me what I have to do with winrar?
I didn't see anything in the instructions about doing that?


----------



## Embertone

chasmanian said:


> and Alex and Slobajudge, please tell me what I have to do with winrar?
> I didn't see anything in the instructions about doing that?


reopen connect and try what I suggested a few posts above! If you use connect, you shouldn't need WinRAR. But if you want to do the unpacking yourself, an UnRAR tool can be used


----------



## slobajudge

Chasmanian, where do you download files from Continuata ? These are rar files, you can also open it with 7zip freeware and extract. Then follow instructions from Embertone. If you need to download again then do what Alex said. Hold shift and hover with mouse download button and it will change to reset button. Continuata will be open again new window where to save files.


----------



## chasmanian

thank you very much, Slobajudge and Alex.
I'll try it now.


----------



## chasmanian

I just did the Connect Reset. and it says 100% downloaded for both.
and then same as before. the Pause stays active. I click the x to close the window and get a a Connect message: Installation still in progress. Do you really want to exit.
well, I guess I will just exit.
Alex, thinking this is just a Connect bug, right?


----------



## chasmanian

Alex, my Update folder has 12 RAR files in it. 6 big, and 6 small files.
and there is none of the other folders. no Samples folder, no Instruments v1.1, no Multi folder, none of that.
would you please tell me step by step what I need to do?
I have 7 zip. I do not have winrar.


----------



## chasmanian

got it working. thank you again for all the help.


----------



## Fleer

Happy you got it solved, Chas. 
Continuata really works well.


----------



## SoNowWhat?

OK, I've got it installed, batch saved, opened up the main mic patch...

...

...I'm in heaven. Again. I seriously love the sound and response of this piano. Thank you Embertone. My only problem now is that I need a better keyboard to get the best out of this VI.
Not even tried my favourite combo yet of Hammer and Wide.


----------



## slobajudge

SoNowWhat? said:


> OK, I've got it installed, batch saved, opened up the main mic patch...
> 
> ...
> 
> ...I'm in heaven. Again. I seriously love the sound and response of this piano. Thank you Embertone. My only problem now is that I need a better keyboard to get the best out of this VI.
> Not even tried my favourite combo yet of Hammer and Wide.


Fantastic sound indeed, overall good combinations are main+close, room+hammer, wide+hammer, and binaural single.


----------



## CGR

A big thank you to the team at Embertone for seeing this through. I'm sure there were many times when it all felt overwhelming and you just wanted to walk away from it, but your persistence is truly appreciated, and you've created a top-tier sampled piano with a tone & character like no other. 

Now, make sure you celebrate this achievement, and consider how many pianists around the world now have the opportunity to play and record with a stunning vintage Steinway D from the comfort of their studio or home. Cheers!


----------



## TomislavEP

Many thanks to Embertone for this latest version of the Walker Piano and especially for updating the Lite version as well. Although I only have the latter for the time being, I find myself using and enjoying this particular Steinway library more and more, also in comparison with The Grandeur from Native Instruments, which until I've purchased Walker D Lite was my go-to Steinway piano instrument.


----------



## ptram

I've finally tried the adaptive release and HQ/HQ+ half-pedal. What to say? The sound problems I can find in my virtual piano pieces can no longer be charged to the piano sample.

For classical (and I guess jazz) solo piano, this is the definitive piano.

Paolo


----------



## ptram

slobajudge said:


> Fantastic sound indeed, overall good combinations are main+close, room+hammer, wide+hammer, and binaural single.


My preferred combinations:

- close+main for mixing with the orchestra
- close+main+room for solo piano
- hammer+close+main(+room) for jazz

Artificial reverb always turned off, since I rely on the beautiful halo coming from the room mics for this. I like to add a bit of smooth, neutral compression to blend the mics better and keep care of the huge dynamics range of this piano.

Paolo


----------



## OleJoergensen

Does it require a special sustain pedal to use half pedal?


----------



## slobajudge

OleJoergensen said:


> Does it require a special sustain pedal to use half pedal?


Maybe you already have it. Which piano do you have and model ?


----------



## CGR

OleJoergensen said:


> Does it require a special sustain pedal to use half pedal?


A 'continuous-sustain' pedal is required (transmits continuous sustain pedal position MIDI data, i.e. not just ON-OFF) which many high end digital & stage pianos have.


----------



## DerGeist

Works like a charm! No more sustain pedal cutting of notes.


----------



## sin(x)

I fell deeply in love with the sound of this piano as soon as I got it, but it never became my go-to library for playing because of an annoying performance issue that I ran into where sustaining more than 5-6 notes at small audio buffer sizes would result in a nasty click as soon as I released the sustain pedal. Of course I'm streaming from SSD and playing around with the preload buffer didn't seem to change anything, so I chalked it up to some scripting snafu and had high hopes the 1.1 update might address the issue. So when I had finished the update install this morning and the problem was still there, my heart sank a little.

But.

The new coat of paint inspired me to dig a little deeper into the instruments, and I actually found a way to solve the problem for me. And it's so simple that I feel pretty dumb for not doing this earlier: *Switch the source playback mode of all "rel" groups from DFD to Sampler.* Of course this will considerably increase memory consumption and load times, as it now pulls all the release samples into memory, but for me it actually all but fixes the problem. (There's still the occasional dropout at a buffer size of 64 samples when I sustain A LOT of notes, but it's gotten so much better to the point where it doesn't really bother me anymore).

So I thought I'd leave this here in case anyone else happens to be dealing with the same issue.

(Side rant: Cases like this is why I get unreasonably pissed when developers lock their users out of editing their Kontakt instruments because tRaDe sEcReTs; it hampers our ability to fix problems that might be specific to our setups and workflows ourselves. So kudos to Embertone for, on top of creating a dream piano library, not doing that.)


----------



## Jonas Hallstrom

Thanks Embertone for this great update! It sounds great and plays really well! I got two qeustions, are there any presets available, and is there a way to turn off the reverb, as it is now, I could only turn it off by dialing the mix down to zero. I guess I missed something.
Thanks again


----------



## Jerry Growl

So happy with the Walker now! 
I will allow it to gobble up my cpu and ram - this baby is now a real grand  (unlike anything else out there)

All previous errors, pedal problems, glitches that I personally came across are now gone  And the improvs I 've been recording in midi since January 2019 all sound way more balanced now. 

Thank you so much!


----------



## Jonas Hallstrom

One more question to Embertone. Each time I start my DAW and load Kontakt, I have to locate the Walker Concert D, again, and again. It doesnn't "remember" that I just did that. What am I doing wrong?


----------



## OleJoergensen

slobajudge said:


> Maybe you already have it. Which piano do you have and model ?


Thank you.
it is an old Roland HP237le.
I dont think it has. I can see in Logic, when I press the sustain pedal “ press 64 127, release 64 0”


----------



## OleJoergensen

CGR said:


> A 'continuous-sustain' pedal is required (transmits continuous sustain pedal position MIDI data, i.e. not just ON-OFF) which many high end digital & stage pianos have.


Thank you.
I will buy such pedal...


----------



## slobajudge

OleJoergensen said:


> Thank you.
> it is an old Roland HP237le.
> I dont think it has. I can see in Logic, when I press the sustain pedal “ press 64 127, release 64 0”


I can`t find, it is an old piano but before you buy continuous pedal, the best solution is to ask Roland does your piano support half pedaling. If not, then maybe you can consider buying some new one. Even the low price Roland models now support half pedaling.


----------



## jneebz

Jonas Hallstrom said:


> One more question to Embertone. Each time I start my DAW and load Kontakt, I have to locate the Walker Concert D, again, and again. It doesnn't "remember" that I just did that. What am I doing wrong?


Batch re-save?


----------



## EgM

OleJoergensen said:


> Thank you.
> I will buy such pedal...



Make sure your midi controller/keyboard supports continuous sustain, a lot of them only supports on or off even if your pedal is. My pedal is continuous but all my keyboard controllers don't support it :(


----------



## prodigalson

Leaning heavily on the close mics in a Main/Close mix with my Kawai VPC-1 is especially delicious. Such a gorgeous and characterful piano


----------



## OleJoergensen

EgM said:


> Make sure your midi controller/keyboard supports continuous sustain, a lot of them only supports on or off even if your pedal is. My pedal is continuous but all my keyboard controllers don't support it :(


Thank you for telling me that! I would just have bought a pedal :-/.
Well, my digital piano is 20 years old, so maybe it is time to buy a new one.


----------



## OleJoergensen

Thank you for the Walker update Embertone.
I think the piano sounds even better and it feels more tight- wonderful  

I have 2 questions, not meant as complaints.

- I want to play “live” 3 mics, 36 layers, no reverb but sometimes experience little cracks (cpu overload). 
Is it to much to demand from an Mac pro 2013 quad core, 3.7 Ghz 64 GB Ram, streaming from SSD?

- I have noticed after stopped playing the piano, streaming seems to continue from the SSD 5-10 sec
I can see the Led on my my Black magic multidock blinking and the cpu is slowing down also after 5-10 sec.
why? (This only happens after playing with sustain pedal).


----------



## sin(x)

Ole, see my post on the previous page – if your dropouts are happening when you release the sustain pedal, my method might work for you too.


----------



## Jerry Growl

OleJoergensen said:


> - I have noticed after stopped playing the piano, streaming seems to continue from the SSD 5-10 sec
> I can see the Led on my my Black magic multidock blinking and the cpu is slowing down also after 5-10 sec.
> why? (This only happens after playing with sustain pedal).



There's a lot going on under the hood. I think what you are seeing is a ring-out of the top end undampend (shortest) strings. Like a real grand piano the top range octave will constantly add sympathic resonance and ring out naturally and unhindered by sustain pedal or dampers.

I can clearly hear Embertone's Walker 1955 Concert D doing that top end string ring out, only fading out really slow and realisticly. I m not sure to what extend there is extra sympathic resonance added while playing other keys. The resonance of the top strings would already have been captured during per-note sampling.

Obviously the instance in Kontakt demands a huge amount of samples and cpu. I noticed it too - the amount of voices in Kontakt is hitting up to over 600 voices. Even after all keys are silent and sustain pedal is lifted the high undampend strings continue to ring out. And the amount of total voices in the Kontakt instance is only slowly diminishing as this happens.


----------



## OleJoergensen

Thank you fro explaining Jerry.


----------



## Jerry Growl

Just a very short fragment to demonstrate this upper strings ring-out after sustain pedal is lifted:


----------



## styledelk

Any recommendations on the best mic (or mics) to use when sending the output to a hybrid piano that has a soundboard? I would think the hammer mics, but it doesn't quite sound right.
(I have a Kawai CA95, and I re-route the outputs from the Walker to its inputs, which then resonate the soundboard and other onboard speakers).

It still sounds beautiful, but it's not quiiiiite real yet.


----------



## ptram

styledelk said:


> Any recommendations on the best mic (or mics) to use when sending the output to a hybrid piano that has a soundboard? I would think the hammer mics, but it doesn't quite sound right.


Both the hammer and close mics are placed inside the piano. They should both capture the sound at the soundboard.

Paolo


----------



## Embertone

OK, deep breath in. Here we go! Happy friday everyone! 



ptram said:


> I spent some time just readapting older sequences to the new Eco half-pedal mode. Not yet the resonance samples of the HQ/HQ+ mode, because I want to try things one at a time. No repedalling, no release samples yet.
> 
> Even with the basic set of features, the new half-pedal feature works great. Maybe even better than expected. It can add beauty to a piano piece, with that gradual transition between notes and chords that are the soul of the instrument. It works in the smoothest way. No jump between pedal levels.
> 
> If this is the 'economic' way, I can't yet imagine the full-featured way!
> 
> Thank you very much, @Embertone, for this great gift!
> 
> Paolo



Thank you Paolo, those words mean a lot! We hope you enjoy the instrument.



chasmanian said:


> got it working. thank you again for all the help.



Hey, sorry we weren't around to guide you through, but I'm glad you found your way. We're always available at the tech support line - [email protected] 



SoNowWhat? said:


> OK, I've got it installed, batch saved, opened up the main mic patch...
> 
> ...I'm in heaven. Again. I seriously love the sound and response of this piano. Thank you Embertone. My only problem now is that I need a better keyboard to get the best out of this VI.
> Not even tried my favourite combo yet of Hammer and Wide.



Thank you very much! This is my personal favorite piano at the moment as well... and though I am obviously biased, I just love the sound and versatility too 


CGR said:


> A big thank you to the team at Embertone for seeing this through. I'm sure there were many times when it all felt overwhelming and you just wanted to walk away from it, but your persistence is truly appreciated, and you've created a top-tier sampled piano with a tone & character like no other.
> 
> Now, make sure you celebrate this achievement, and consider how many pianists around the world now have the opportunity to play and record with a stunning vintage Steinway D from the comfort of their studio or home. Cheers!



Thanks much. I'm so glad the update is helping you 



sin(x) said:


> The new coat of paint inspired me to dig a little deeper into the instruments, and I actually found a way to solve the problem for me. And it's so simple that I feel pretty dumb for not doing this earlier: Switch the source playback mode of all "rel" groups from DFD to Sampler. Of course this will considerably increase memory consumption and load times, as it now pulls all the release samples into memory, but for me it actually all but fixes the problem. (There's still the occasional dropout at a buffer size of 64 samples when I sustain A LOT of notes, but it's gotten so much better to the point where it doesn't really bother me anymore).
> 
> So I thought I'd leave this here in case anyone else happens to be dealing with the same issue.
> 
> (Side rant: Cases like this is why I get unreasonably pissed when developers lock their users out of editing their Kontakt instruments because tRaDe sEcReTs; it hampers our ability to fix problems that might be specific to our setups and workflows ourselves. So kudos to Embertone for, on top of creating a dream piano library, not doing that.)



Very interesting. I will be testing this as well. If you're willing to, pleazse reach out to us via DM or email with your results and the difference in CPU and memory consumption on your machine? And, what kind of machine you have!



Jonas Hallstrom said:


> Thanks Embertone for this great update! It sounds great and plays really well! I got two qeustions, are there any presets available, and is there a way to turn off the reverb, as it is now, I could only turn it off by dialing the mix down to zero. I guess I missed something.



Heya - the reverb is effectively shut off at 0. No reverb, and the plugin under the hood should be OFF. 



Jonas Hallstrom said:


> One more question to Embertone. Each time I start my DAW and load Kontakt, I have to locate the Walker Concert D, again, and again. It doesnn't "remember" that I just did that. What am I doing wrong?



Hmmm. That's an interesting one. I would follow one of the other users advice, or alternatively, simply open these instruments outside of your DAW to save them there. This could be an old, familiar NI bug, which could be fixed with an xml file. Please send us an email if you continue to experience issue! [email protected]



styledelk said:


> Any recommendations on the best mic (or mics) to use when sending the output to a hybrid piano that has a soundboard? I would think the hammer mics, but it doesn't quite sound right.
> 
> (I have a Kawai CA95, and I re-route the outputs from the Walker to its inputs, which then resonate the soundboard and other onboard speakers).
> 
> It still sounds beautiful, but it's not quiiiiite real yet.



Ooo, interesting. Can you elaborate on your setup and what you're doing here? Very interesting 



OleJoergensen said:


> Thank you for the Walker update Embertone.
> I think the piano sounds even better and it feels more tight- wonderful
> I have 2 questions, not meant as complaints.
> - I want to play “live” 3 mics, 36 layers, no reverb but sometimes experience little cracks (cpu overload).
> Is it to much to demand from an Mac pro 2013 quad core, 3.7 Ghz 64 GB Ram, streaming from SSD?
> - I have noticed after stopped playing the piano, streaming seems to continue from the SSD 5-10 sec
> I can see the Led on my my Black magic multidock blinking and the cpu is slowing down also after 5-10 sec.
> 
> why? (This only happens after playing with sustain pedal).



Hmmm. I'd love to work on this with you. Please reach out to us [email protected], and mention to Nick that you're from VI-C and Alex wants to be involved in the case. We'll do what we can... those Mac Pros may be old, but they're still pretty darn capable machines!

Thanks all - be well!

-Alex


----------



## Embertone

And finally, I'd like to send anyone interested to our website to check out a new tool we made for people curious about the mic positions! In the "Mic Position" section, you can now easily A/B all the mics, as you would in a DAW (easier, actually!).






Walker 1955 Concert D







embertone.com





<3 Talk soon,

Alex


----------



## Scamper

Embertone said:


> And finally, I'd like to send anyone interested to our website to check out a new tool we made for people curious about the mic positions!



Nice, this should be a standard for mic comparisons. Much clearer to hear the differences.


----------



## Pianolando

Does anyone know if I can choose to install just the mic positions that I want to use even if I have the full version? Trying to save some space on the SSD and know that there’s a few mics that I won’t ever use.


----------



## Embertone

Pianolando said:


> Does anyone know if I can choose to install just the mic positions that I want to use even if I have the full version? Trying to save some space on the SSD and know that there’s a few mics that I won’t ever use.



Yeah, don't download what you don't need. HOWEVER - the crucial NICNT and NKR files are attached to the MAIN mic download. So if you don't want those AKG's, send us an email and we'll send you those two small files 

Thanks!

-Alex


----------



## OleJoergensen

Embertone said:


> And finally, I'd like to send anyone interested to our website to check out a new tool we made for people curious about the mic positions! In the "Mic Position" section, you can now easily A/B all the mics, as you would in a DAW (easier, actually!).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Walker 1955 Concert D
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> embertone.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> <3 Talk soon,
> 
> Alex


Brilliant with the mics demo.
The higher register, with the main mics, sounds woooonderful shining.


----------



## eli0s

Anyone having trouble with *batch resaving*, if you DON'T own all mic perspectives, delete the Full Multi.nkm and Full Multi (Legacy).nkm files.
Kontakt is looking for the files of the mic positions you don't own.

Thank you Alex Davis for your support!


----------



## Pianolando

Embertone said:


> Yeah, don't download what you don't need. HOWEVER - the crucial NICNT and NKR files are attached to the MAIN mic download. So if you don't want those AKG's, send us an email and we'll send you those two small files
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> -Alex



Thanks! The I definitely want those AKGs, so it’ll be easy to pick and choose! The ‘mic demo-player” is brilliant, something all of the other big sample library producers should be inspired by!


----------



## HardyP

Pianolando said:


> Thanks! The I definitely want those AKGs, so it’ll be easy to pick and choose! The ‘mic demo-player” is brilliant, something all of the other big sample library producers should be inspired by!


„AKG“ are the Main mics which are in every version, so nothing to do in that case...

BTW, Iam very happy, that these have been chosen, bcs after checking the new mic player it definitely seems to me, that they are the most versatile, balanced, generic ones! Thanks, @Embertone !


----------



## Satorious

This update is great, thanks so much for continuing to support and improve your products Embertone.


----------



## Phryq

Yeaaaahhh!!

So the pedal script adds a resonance to the non-pedal samples? Or x-fades between pedal and non-pedal samples?

Personally, I loooove resonance. I'd take the pedal down samples, add the resonance on *tops* of them, and then just use half-pedaling to stop the notes from sustaining too long.


----------



## NYC Composer

I have the 1.1 Lite update installed and it seems to have fixed the sustain pedal bug-yay!!

Now how about an upgrade special for long suffering Lite users?


----------



## DerGeist

Hmmm, after an extended playing sessions I seem to be having more issues after the update than I had before. Will contact Embertone but am curious if anyone else is seeing these issues.

Before the update I had all kinds of issues with drop outs due when using the sustain pedal. Because I ride the pedal like a horse I could manage.

After the update, my pedal switching problems are gone but I have new issues. If I'm riding the pedal, it will occasionally disengage itself on its own and I will have to release the pedal and re-engage it to sustain again. This happens fairly frequently. I'm also having issues where notes don't trigger the first time I hit they key. Intermittent but happens enough to make recording a full piece impossible.

Anyone else seeing this?


----------



## Embertone

DerGeist said:


> Hmmm, after an extended playing sessions I seem to be having more issues after the update than I had before. Will contact Embertone but am curious if anyone else is seeing these issues.
> 
> Before the update I had all kinds of issues with drop outs due when using the sustain pedal. Because I ride the pedal like a horse I could manage.
> 
> After the update, my pedal switching problems are gone but I have new issues. If I'm riding the pedal, it will occasionally disengage itself on its own and I will have to release the pedal and re-engage it to sustain again. This happens fairly frequently. I'm also having issues where notes don't trigger the first time I hit they key. Intermittent but happens enough to make recording a full piece impossible.
> 
> Anyone else seeing this?



Send over a message ([email protected]) with some MIDI - an NKI would help too so that we can know the exact settings you're using. Thanks!


----------



## DerGeist

Embertone said:


> Send over a message ([email protected]) with some MIDI - an NKI would help too so that we can know the exact settings you're using. Thanks!


Disregard. Turns issue the issue was the max voices setting in Kontakt. I set this higher prior to 1.1 because it seemed to help with pedaling. The voices were too high after the update and was causing weird Kontakt behaviours.

If anyone is having issues, just set your max voices lower (to the default) and everything works great.


----------



## slobajudge

Just to say that Embertone Walker is such a beautiful vintage piano, not without little quirks, but sound is so marvelous that I can`t imagine any other piano for classical lyrical pieces at the moment. I love this update but I hope that Embertone team will not stop to further improve this piano with new updates from time to time. Cheers to all  !


----------



## Ashermusic

slobajudge said:


> Just to say that Embertone Walker is such a beautiful vintage piano, not without little quirks, but sound is so marvelous that I can`t imagine any other piano for classical lyrical pieces at the moment. I love this update but I hope that Embertone team will not stop to further improve this piano with new updates from time to time. Cheers to all  !



Agreed, love it, and would welcome any improvements they see fit to make.


----------



## Phryq

I've been playing with the pedaling. On HQI... it's so amazing. What exactly are they doing? This is even better than Orange Tree.


----------



## David Kudell

Hi all, kind of debating between this and the new Ascend Modern Grand...both are Steinways. Any thoughts?


----------



## Pianolando

This is an amazing sounding library!

I have some performance issues though: have anyone worked out how to get logic/Kontakt to share the load over different cores? I have a 12 core machine but it looks like only one core is used and it gets spiked immediately, resulting in constant crackles. I have my Kontakt set to use all cores, but still it doesn’t...
Lowering the dynamic layers doesn’t help at all.

My new MacBook Pro usually handles anything with ease, it eats Diva for breakfast for instance, but I can’t get the Walker to work smoothly without raising the buffer to unusable latency. Anyone have a fix or any idea what to do?

EDIT: clarified that only one core is used.


----------



## Phryq

David Kudell said:


> Hi all, kind of debating between this and the new Ascend Modern Grand...both are Steinways. Any thoughts?



Get this!!!! Nothing compares. The half pedaling is soo good. Everything is perfect. Embertone are the gods of sampling.


----------



## mojamusic

After updating, the library switches to staccato without any prompting. when I manual change it, it changes back to staccato. Does anyone have this issues?


----------



## Phryq

I'm trying to get a good staccato-half-pedal sound.

I wonder if I could layer 2 instances, with pedal and dampers-up. Keep the damper-instance quiet, and compressed, with releases cranked. Something like that?


----------



## Buz

I grabbed this as a colourful backup option and I'm overjoyed with the tone. 

The one issue that stands out to me is release trails. At default release volume you lose the room sound abruptly even with the wider mic perspectives. It's there perfectly in the staccato samples, but on normal mode you have to increase release volume to recover it. This sounds great on highs but it doesn't scale correctly for the bass or longer sustains, so it's not an option. I feel like if this setting was scaled consistently the natural quality of the instrument would dramatically improve. 

This can be obscured somewhat by getting reverb elsewhere but it seems a shame not to have the natural space.


----------



## creativeforge

^ ...which would not make it ideal for ambient solo piano use, if I understand correctly the issue you're describing. Which would surprise me from Embertone, though. Natural reverb for acoustic instruments, if included, should be a hallmark of the sound itself. I'll be following the responses... an update is not always possible if the sampled instrument is not accessible anymore.


----------



## JEPA

creativeforge said:


> ^ ...which would not make it ideal for ambient solo piano use, if I understand correctly the issue you're describing. Which would surprise me from Embertone, though. Natural reverb for acoustic instruments, if included, should be a hallmark of the sound itself. I'll be following the responses... an update is not always possible if the sampled instrument is not accessible anymore.


:(


----------



## creativeforge

JEPA said:


> :(



DISCLAIMER: I'M NOT SPEAKING FOR EMBERTONE! when I mention updates re: instrument's availability. I'm following this conversation to see what they will respond. 

This library is highly rated here, Embertone rocks it. But maybe those who use it find that it sits very well in a mix with other instruments, but I'm curious about piano solo.

The number of "staccato" demos could indicate its niche. The Eleanor Rigby demo, however, offers a bit more space for the sound to trail off. Is it an added reverb, though...

*So I should ask: those who bought the library, what do you use it for most? How is it for ambient-like piano solo? (*It's a weakness of mine).


----------



## CGR

Buz said:


> . . . The one issue that stands out to me is release trails. At default release volume you lose the room sound abruptly even with the wider mic perspectives. It's there perfectly in the staccato samples, but on normal mode you have to increase release volume to recover it. This sounds great on highs but it doesn't scale correctly for the bass or longer sustains, so it's not an option. I feel like if this setting was scaled consistently the natural quality of the instrument would dramatically improve . . .


I maybe misinformed here, as I've only ever done some minor "under the hood" edits to Kontakt instruments, but I'd imagine creating an adjustable release sample volume scaling dial/slider from bass to treble would be a fairly easy feature to add? @EvilDragon may be able to advise?


----------



## styledelk

creativeforge said:


> DISCLAIMER: I'M NOT SPEAKING FOR EMBERTONE! when I mention updates re: instrument's availability. I'm following this conversation to see what they will respond.
> 
> This library is highly rated here, Embertone rocks it. But maybe those who use it find that it sits very well in a mix with other instruments, but I'm curious about piano solo.
> 
> The number of "staccato" demos could indicate its niche. The Eleanor Rigby demo, however, offers a bit more space for the sound to trail off. Is it an added reverb, though...
> 
> *So I should ask: those who bought the library, what do you use it for most? How is it for ambient-like piano solo? (*It's a weakness of mine).



I use it almost exclusively for solo piano work, both for classical performance and for composition. It is by far the most realistic and well suited piano I have [I pair it with a Kawai CA-95 and run the output back out the hybrid piano's soundboard.]


----------



## evilantal

I'm having an issue. If I play lots of notes with the pedal pressed down, when I release the pedal I hear a click. Not while playing the notes or sustaining them just when the pedal is released.

Is this a CPU issue maybe? Or something with all the release samples of the sustaining notes being triggered at once?


----------



## styledelk

evilantal said:


> I'm having an issue. If I play lots of notes with the pedal pressed down, when I release the pedal I hear a click. Not while playing the notes or sustaining them just when the pedal is released.
> 
> Is this a CPU issue maybe? Or something with all the release samples of the sustaining notes being triggered at once?



Try changing the eco pedal settings for the resonance. Up the voice count to something ridiculous. Or may just need to bring up your buffers. This is definitely a resource beast with the pedal. Before the big update this problem had made it almost unusable without being very careful.


----------



## Phryq

Here's something with the Embertone piano (and clarinet). Not a great example really; kinda weird and clumsy playing. Pedal is on HQ+. I loooove the pedal response sooo much. No piano compares to this.

I wish I could use Kontakt's pure tuning script with it; all the best instruments don't work with Kontakt's tuning scripts (because they already got their own scripting). I won't if it's impossible to make this workable?


----------



## JEPA

is the update v1.1. working properly?


----------



## Ashermusic

Yes. Bumping up the voice count to 1024 however made a big difference here.


----------



## feck

It sure would be awesome if they'd include an update with one master instrument that would allow for loading/blending various/all perspectives. Either way, this piano sounds GREAT.


----------



## SupremeFist

feck said:


> It sure would be awesome if they'd include an update with one master instrument that would allow for loading/blending various/all perspectives. Either way, this piano sounds GREAT.


iirc the developer has said this isn't possible because Kontakt is unable to address that many samples in a single nki.


----------



## feck

SupremeFist said:


> iirc the developer has said this isn't possible because Kontakt is unable to address that many samples in a single nki.


Gotcha. Makes sense I suppose, thanks.


----------



## Rtje

Just bought the walker, so instant 1.1 version for me. 

It's nothing short of fantastic, and beats everything i had before, including garritan cfx, ravenscroft, and synthogy's American D.

It's actually the first virtual piano that i find truly inspiring to play, like an acoustic piano, and that is something really special.

Thanks for this masterpiece, guys at Embertone!


----------



## SAM CA

I've yet to download and install the update. Will do it this week for sure. The pedal issue is fixed right?


----------



## Pablocrespo

Yes it´s my only "normal" piano since I bought it (I have a couple of muted and felt, etc)


----------



## Rtje

I have a question

Does anyone know, if I want to buy/build a new pc to run the walker very well, maybe even with 4 mic positions simultaneously... what is most important in a CPU, real good single core performance, or real good multi core performance? What should I look for?


----------



## slobajudge

I was testing Embertone piano through Chopin etude op10 no 3 part with lots of strongest psychedelic notes before the end and it was very tough for my desktop i5 4690 with 4 cores (cpu is 6 years old) ssd disk and 16gb ram. I start with two mics and optimal result without any crackles on part I was mention above was > One mic on 12 velocity levels, on tab details only sustain was on, eco half pedal, 400 voices with sample rate 44100 and 512 buffer size on Scarlett 2/2. Of course, I have no problem to play with two mics with better buffer size, more velocities but easier stuff with less notes. So, go with the best, strongest and latest CPU you can afford, lots of memory and even with that I doubt that you will be in position to play with 4 mics some hard stuff without crackles. Two is enough. This guy Simeon maybe can help you, he was testing Walker with much better PC (i9 9900K and 64gb ram) and he has some tips below in comments.


----------



## Simeon

I am going to try and do a video showing how you can use one of the multis to be able to adjust the different mic positions.
I also agree with some of the previous comments that increasing the voice limit really does help as it provides an extra amount of headroom for things to work a little better.


----------



## slobajudge

Simeon said:


> I am going to try and do a video showing how you can use one of the multis to be able to adjust the different mic positions.
> I also agree with some of the previous comments that increasing the voice limit really does help as it provides an extra amount of headroom for things to work a little better.


I agree but only if CPU is strong to handle it and then you can use lots of notes without cutting sound. In my test limiting voices on older CPU decreased crackles so everybody must find balance depends of PC and number of mics, voices, etc. I like your videos Simeon and especially piano reviews. I love your `child` enthusiasm and natural reaction to sound, it is very positive. I am impatient to see which piano is next  . Keep up the good work.


----------



## Simeon

Well, I just now pulled up a Multi with all of the mics except for the Binaural and increased each slot to 2000 voices. I was able to push it pretty hard but CPU maxed out at 100% when it hit 1100 voices
:emoji_astonished:
One of the workflows I recommend when dealing with an enormous instrument like this is to find a piano sound that gives you the feel you are looking for using a minimum amount of requirements. This allows you to capture a good performance, not worrying about things breaking down.
After you get a part you are happy with I would then load things up and "render" that to an audio track. You can also use the technique to give you the option to use all of the mic positions rendered to separate audio tracks, increase the velocity layers and other features as you wish without worrying about CPU.

I also mapped the different mics to faders on my nanoKONTROL to be able to mix things and it really opens things up.



slobajudge said:


> I like your videos Simeon and especially piano reviews. I love your `child` enthusiasm and natural reaction to sound, it is very positive. I am impatient to see which piano is next  . Keep up the good work.



Thanks so much, that means a lot!
I have been doing tons of piano libraries lately (check the channel as there might be a couple of new ones since your last visit). It is really is interesting to hear how each piano has its own personality. Also the different rooms and recording techniques are amazing.


----------



## gfd

I just installed a number of mic positions. I originally bought just the default position. Installation went OK. Now in Kontakt Player, I opened the default instance. I then opened a second mic and I was up to about 10 GB of memory and CPU load spiked. I have 32GB ram and a 6700HQ processor (XPS 9550). The processor is not a giant killer, but it has never been overwhelmed before. This was in the stand alone version of Kontakt.

I setup default and the second mic with 30 layers. I realize that an instrument such as the Walker is probably demanding, but I'm thinking I must be doing something wrong. Should the default only be used on its own? Should multiple mics only be setup using the additional positions?

Could somebody paint a setup scenario for 2 or more mic positions? You help will be appreciated.

Hope you are al staying safe,
Graham


----------



## newman

I have a Dell XPS 9550 also but not the i7 and not Walker. Intel's 2020 laptop CPUs are the same Skylake architecture so aren't much better or different for your purposes. A few tricks that might help. Reducing load on CPU + boosting CPU performance. Try them one at a time:

- Increase the buffer size for Walker

- Turn off all programs not necessary

- Turn off all wireless on Windows (incl bluetooth etc.)

- Turn off antivirus (search forums to see how to do this correctly)
EDIT - this is risky especially if your PC is connected to the internet. Please research carefully.

- Set Windows Power Options to "high performance"

- Download Dell Command | Power Manager set to "ultra performance"

- In BIOS disable c-states

- Download ThrottleStop free software. Enable SpeedShift and change EPP to 0. (This puts CPU at MAX performance & allows you to run turbo clocks a bit higher (+0.5MHz on my laptop) with c-states off)

- If thermals are high, say above 80*c, you can undervolt

You can run latency mon to see how DPC Latency shows up. If you have a lot of background processes on your computer that will cripple CPU.

Another test is to see look on main screen of ThrottleStop with all other programs off. Idle power consumption should be well below 1W. Else you have a lot of rubbish running in the background.


----------



## gfd

Thanks for the reply newman. I've done just about everything suggested other than use ThrottleStop. Background programs, turned of cosmetics in advanced options, disabled BT and wireless, setup custom power plan with all suggestions, etc. I just want to know if using multiple mic positions is just a matter of opening a second, third, etc instance in Kontakt. If so, then I'll just have to pare down the velocities, etc.


----------



## Ashermusic

This is the melody to a bossa nova song I wrote in 1969  I played this in Logic Pro X with the Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D (probably currently my favorite sampled piano library).

I only used one mic when I performed it, then added two more mic positions, and raised the audio buffer to 1024 and bounced it offline, which was the only way I could on my less than beastly late 2013 i7 Mac with 32 GB.


----------



## gfd

Bingo, 

Thanks Jay. Now I know what I'm dealing with.


----------



## Ashermusic

gfd said:


> Bingo,
> 
> Thanks Jay. Now I know what I'm dealing with.



You are welcome. Yes, it’s a resource demanding sucker, but sounds great, doesn’t it? Very inspiring to play, especially the Hammer mic, for me.


----------



## EgM

gfd said:


> I just installed a number of mic positions. I originally bought just the default position. Installation went OK. Now in Kontakt Player, I opened the default instance. I then opened a second mic and I was up to about 10 GB of memory and CPU load spiked. I have 32GB ram and a 6700HQ processor (XPS 9550). The processor is not a giant killer, but it has never been overwhelmed before. This was in the stand alone version of Kontakt.
> 
> I setup default and the second mic with 30 layers. I realize that an instrument such as the Walker is probably demanding, but I'm thinking I must be doing something wrong. Should the default only be used on its own? Should multiple mics only be setup using the additional positions?
> 
> Could somebody paint a setup scenario for 2 or more mic positions? You help will be appreciated.
> 
> Hope you are al staying safe,
> Graham



What I usually do is set the sus pedal mode to eco for the recording and mixing and then set it to HQ+ for the rendering on each mic position instance that is loaded. Also unload staccato/una corda if you're not using them.


----------



## CGR

Ashermusic said:


> This is the melody to a bossa nova song I wrote in 1969  I played this in Logic Pro X with the Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D (probably currently my favorite sampled piano library).
> 
> I only used one mic when I performed it, then added two more mic positions, and raised the audio buffer to 1024 and bounced it offline, which was the only way I could on my less than beastly late 2013 i7 Mac with 32 GB.



What was your mic mix Jay? It's a nice balance of hammer tone, body resonance & ambience.


----------



## Ashermusic

CGR said:


> What was your mic mix Jay? It's a nice balance of hammer tone, body resonance & ambience.



Hammer mic. I then added the close and main mics.


----------



## shapeshifter00

gfd said:


> Thanks for the reply newman. I've done just about everything suggested other than use ThrottleStop. Background programs, turned of cosmetics in advanced options, disabled BT and wireless, setup custom power plan with all suggestions, etc. I just want to know if using multiple mic positions is just a matter of opening a second, third, etc instance in Kontakt. If so, then I'll just have to pare down the velocities, etc.



Turning off antivirus should never be a recommendation unless the PC is offline only. However, another solution that works is to exclude folders with sample libraries. I use Win 10 and excluding these folder removed crackles and slow loading for some libraries in Kontakt.


----------



## HardyP

shapeshifter00 said:


> excluding these folder removed crackles and slow loading for some libraries in Kontakt.


I also suggest to start with that one, or (depending on your AV solution) deactivate similar options like "scan file on every access". On a more general approach: Go through all your AV options and think about, if this particular one would be @work if you are starting Kontakt, read a sample, write audio, and so on.


----------



## Edelsong

Installed the 1.1 update today. Wanted to make sure about one thing. Anyone know if this is just a typo in some of the instrument names after they've been loaded in Kontakt - some of the mic positions show a "1" beside the name and others show "1.1" (Hammer 1, Room 1.1, etc.)

In the Walker 1955 instruments list in the Libraries dropdown all mic pos's have xxxx 1.1.nki, so I'm guessing that's just a typo if it doesn't say 1.1 next to the header of the mic pos that's been loaded.

Looking to double-check to make sure I didn't miss something in the Connect dl/install process.

Thanks!


----------



## carbric76

Hello, I have carefully read this thread on this wonderful piano, I will have to save to buy it soon. I have a familiar professional classical musician who tells me that his favorite pianos for that style of music are The Ravencroft 275 (as a new piano) and the Emmbertone Walker Concert grand as an old piano. A question, after buying the basic package, which other do you recommend to mix it and produce a more classical and somewhat jazzy tone? thanks


----------



## Phryq

When I do half-pedaling with staccato samples, the pedal isn't releasing entirely and I'm getting ringing. Anyone else?


----------



## CGR

Phryq said:


> When I do half-pedaling with staccato samples, the pedal isn't releasing entirely and I'm getting ringing. Anyone else?


If you did that on an acoustic grand you'd also get ringing after staccato notes, given the damper felts are not fully muting the strings with the sustain pedal half way.


----------



## gfd

Greetings,

I hope this finds you all well in these difficult times. I use the Walker 1955. Amazing instrument. I just built a new machine 9900k, z390, 32GB ram. This instrument was one of the reasons, as it just ate up my laptop.

Anyway, I am populating the machine, getting it ready. I have just started using Studio One 4. Sample size set to 256, sample rate 44100, 24 bit. Windows has been modified to keep it lean, etc. 

So I open Studio One, open Kontakt and run the close microphone. I have a multi set up for that. 30 layers, most items active, except stacatto. I am playing away and after some extended use of the sustain pedal, the CPU usage increases quickly, peaks, and the audio completely breaks down. I do some glissandos with sustain down and CPU goes up like a rocket. This is in Studio One, not task manager.

I increase the sample size to 512 and the same thing occurs. I should point out that I am using a midi translator, fed by my midi keyboards, which in turn feeds multiple virtual MIDI ports.

I closed Studio One and opened up the piano in the Kontakt standalone player. Played a bit and everything seemed OK. I then did a bunch of glissandos with the sustain pedal down. CPU peaked at about 40%. No pops or dropouts.

So can anyone give me some idea why I am having this difficulty in Studio One? This piano is excellent, but a beast. Would appreciate any tips to use this thing in the DAW.

Thanks in advance,
Graham


----------



## slobajudge

Have you tried some another DAW ?


----------



## newman

Can you run that in 16 bit to reduce CPU processing? I see dropouts with some VIs when CPU use gets above say 40%, but I don't own the Embertone so can't comment.

You might try disabling c-states in the BIOS; your computer will run hot and use a lot of power so you need to monitor temps and maybe use this only when you use the Embertone.


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## gfd

Thanks sloba. I have migrated to Studio One from another DAW. After I get S1 configured and stable, I'll consider installing another DAW to test this out. 

Thanks newman. I stressed out the machine using Aida 64 with AVX instructions. Temps and voltage were good. The CPU cores don't get parked. I checked in a bunch of scenarios. I have a music power plan which runs the the CPU at 100%. I use offset voltage on the core, so that the machine runs a bit cooler, based on the power needs at a given time.

I am wondering if the Embertone is choking the virtual MIDI port. I will using a direct MIDI connection with the keyboard and see if that solves it.

If all else fails, maybe I'll record the piano parts using the standalone Kontakt and import into Studio One. That's not my preference.


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## gfd

Just a report. I changed the MIDI routing from the controller directly into Studio One, bypassing the virtual MIDI ports. The Walker is now playable, but it is still using a lot of resources. When I play glissandos with the sustain pedal down, the CPU is still almost saturated, but it is playable, although I still get some crackles when I come off the keyboard and pedal. I don't expect to play anything this way, but have to check for worst case.

I setup the Garritan CFX Grand and the CPU saturation barely budged above 8 percent. That's doing constant slides with the sustain pedal down.

Before anybody rips my head off for trolling a Walker thread; I want to say that I am looking for a solution here. The Walker 1955 is the most realistic, real, human VST piano I have ever played. I am a fan boy. I don't want to have to play one piano while I'm thinking about the Walker. But I can't have it overrun the host environment.

So is it something in the instrument? Is it the way that Kontakt player interacts with Studio One? Is there something I have configured incorrectly, either in S1 or the Kontakt player?

Any further guidance would be most appreciated.

Graham


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## Mucusman

Graham -- One of the last times I loaded up The Walker 1955 in Studio One (several weeks ago) I, too, had my CPU slain by the plug-in (Windows 10 machine). Pops, crackles, stutters... it was a mess. But I restarted Studio One and then minutes later, it was playing fine. Today, upon reading your post, I booted up Studio One (my only DAW) and loaded up Walker with the close mics, and everything played perfectly, no CPU spikes. I don't know if this (unpredictable) behavior is unique to Studio One, or not. So, while this isn't a lot of help or comfort, I share this to say that you aren't alone. I will say that due to problems playing it in the past, Walker isn't the first piano I reach for when writing/playing, but it does sound so great, and I'm glad it's in my arsenal.


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## Ran Zhou

In the details tab, have you tried to change the sustain pedal from HQ/HQ+ to eco? I met a similar situation a few days ago, tried the solution found in a post in the forum about crackles and pops of Walker 1955 D. And it indeed solved my problem. Good luck!


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## gfd

Thanks Mucusman and Ran,

I moved to Studio One because I prefer to use that DAW. I probably won't go back for a single instrument, no matter how amazing it could be. If I find I miss FL Studio or Reaper enough to go back, I will report on my results.

I will change the pedal to ECO. By the way, how many layers you guys using? By choosing 30, maybe I am getting what I deserve. Mind you, why have so many layers if you are going to kill a system?

I'll report back on my progress and solutions???? in case it will help others.

Graham


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## SupremeFist

gfd said:


> Thanks Mucusman and Ran,
> 
> I moved to Studio One because I prefer to use that DAW. I probably won't go back for a single instrument, no matter how amazing it could be. If I find I miss FL Studio or Reaper enough to go back, I will report on my results.
> 
> I will change the pedal to ECO. By the way, how many layers you guys using? By choosing 30, maybe I am getting what I deserve. Mind you, why have so many layers if you are going to kill a system?
> 
> I'll report back on my progress and solutions???? in case it will help others.
> 
> Graham


Pedal on eco for writing/playing then switch to HQ+ for bouncing is the way to go. I have no problems with 33 layers on a single mic this way, on a not very powerful laptop. (Though in Logic.)


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## gfd

Thanks Supreme


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## HardyP

I´m using the Walker with the highest quality setting possible (1 mic position) with an oldish i5 Sandy Bridge 2500k, 32GB RAM, SSD without problems... it IS demanding, but with your powerful hardware setup, it seems to me that you have a configuration/software issue. Maybe talk to Presonus, and tell them that it works fine with Kontakt in standallone?


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## gfd

Thanks Hardy,

I have gotten in touch with Embertone and will see what they have to say. If I don't get an answer there, I'll go to Presonus.


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## EgM

gfd said:


> Just a report. I changed the MIDI routing from the controller directly into Studio One, bypassing the virtual MIDI ports. The Walker is now playable, but it is still using a lot of resources. When I play glissandos with the sustain pedal down, the CPU is still almost saturated, but it is playable, although I still get some crackles when I come off the keyboard and pedal. I don't expect to play anything this way, but have to check for worst case.
> 
> I setup the Garritan CFX Grand and the CPU saturation barely budged above 8 percent. That's doing constant slides with the sustain pedal down.
> 
> Before anybody rips my head off for trolling a Walker thread; I want to say that I am looking for a solution here. The Walker 1955 is the most realistic, real, human VST piano I have ever played. I am a fan boy. I don't want to have to play one piano while I'm thinking about the Walker. But I can't have it overrun the host environment.
> 
> So is it something in the instrument? Is it the way that Kontakt player interacts with Studio One? Is there something I have configured incorrectly, either in S1 or the Kontakt player?
> 
> Any further guidance would be most appreciated.
> 
> Graham



Make sure you set Dropout Protection to minimum in Studio One, it causes more problems than it helps. And yes, sus pedal set to ECO is definitely the way to go for composing and HQ+ for mixdown.


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## gfd

Thanks EgM

Have changed sus to ECO


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## Philip Vasta

EgM said:


> Make sure you set Dropout Protection to minimum in Studio One, it causes more problems than it helps. And yes, sus pedal set to ECO is definitely the way to go for composing and HQ+ for mixdown.



That's interesting. I just discovered the feature in Studio One. How does it cause problems?


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## EgM

Philip Vasta said:


> That's interesting. I just discovered the feature in Studio One. How does it cause problems?



Just doesn't do anything to help, rather it messes up cpu performance. Same with Cubase's ASIO-Guard.


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## gfd

Hey EgM,

I didn't do anything with the dropout protection. Just set my sample size. Thanks for the warning though.


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## gfd

So here's where it's at. Qualification: this is in the standalone app.

There is a setting in instrument options called DFD (direct from disk). There is 32GB of memory available in my system. If you are memory limited, you may wish to give this a pass. I opened the instrument's options and selected DFD. The default setting resulted in about 1.6GB of memory being occupied by the library. I moved the slider all the way to the right. Once that was processed, the memory usage increased to ~ 6.6GB. Based on the excellent advice of others, the 1/2 pedalling setting was changed to ECO.

I sat on the sustain pedal and did several glissandos, up and down, with as many keys depressed as my short arms could manage. The CPU maxed out at about 20%. Setting the 1/2 pedal to HQ resulted in about 35% max and a bit of a glitch when I came off the keys/pedal.

Unlike Garritan, which allows you to allocate RAM to the instrument in the Aria player, there is no way of directly doing so in Kontakt player. That's the message you get in the player, when you hover over the memory use number. Using DFD is the workaround. 

There is a setting in Global options to override the instrument's preload buffer size (DFD). I would stay away from that, as it would act on all loaded instruments, and potentially wallop the RAM.

This is it for now. I'm going to try this out in Studio One, which was the genesis (I still think it ended after Peter Gabriel left) for the issue, and Reaper as a control. I'll let you guys know how I make out .


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## gfd

Ran the instrument in Studio One. With one exception, which I'll mention shortly, Walker preformed quite well, with DFD set to 240 and 1/2 pedal set to ECO. The memory usage is 6.62GB. Unless I do what I noted below, the CPU usage is moderate, at about 5 to 10%. 

Exception: if I sit on the sustain pedal and input notes without releasing, the CPU usage will slowly, but inexorably, increase. What I did was probably not going to happen in normal use. However, I do believe the library has an issue releasing samples when the sustain pedal is engaged.

I am in communication with Embertone about this. They have been quite helpful so far (I looked into DFD, based on their advice) amongst other things. I am going to run the library in Reaper to see if I get the same result. I'll let you guys know what happens.

If/when I get this sorted, I will advise Embertone and this forum. You guys have been great.

Thanks,
Graham


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## gfd

Greetings,

Just a final note. I contacted Embertone about the issue(s) with the sustain pedal. They replied that they are aware of it, and are going to address it in their next update.


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## VladK

Concert D supports silent key and damper resonance (depressing sustain pedal after the key is released generates sound to mimic felts that did not completely mute the string yet), but sympathetic resonance is not implemented (play a silent key, do not release it, and playing staccato afterwards causes the 'open' string to vibrate).
"Sustain-Damper Sympathetic Resonance" term is incorrect and misleading: damper resonance is different from sympathetic resonance.
Can somebody confirm this?


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## rojarvi

Howdy,

Breathing some new life to this thread as I recently bought Walker D and finally yesterday had some more time to test it. Few weeks back in my initial very short tests I found things are OK if I just have a single or max two mic positions running simultaenously, got some clicks but nothing serious. Was very much concentrated on how it sounds and played few seconds here and there and adjusted settings... Really enjoyed the generic sound and having multiple microphone positions to mix seemed like a great option to get some different character out of the instrument. So, had my expectations very high and was certain this is in my Top 3 pianos when I get to use it more extensively. Just so great sounding instrument.

But... Yesterday I finally had time to play more with it and started playing longer classical pieces. Had Hammer + Room loaded up with 18 layers (in Cubase) and started to play a classical piece with normal sustain pedal operation, you know, press and release in about every bar. And oh the horror when after a minute of playing things went totally ballistic. CPU meter was screaming at full 100% and could not hear anything but a buzzing sound. When I stopped playing the buzzing stopped and CPU meter slowly dropped back to low levels. 

Repeated the same few times and started to fiddle around with the settings to see if there's something I could do. Dropped layers to 12, made sure half-pedalling was at Eco mode, unloaded some sample options like Staccato I was not using etc. Still the same. Removed the Hammer mic and played with just one mic position - still the same. I noticed @gfd mentioned his test of "sitting on sustain pedal" making the CPU load build up until things go nuclear. In my test I would say that you don't even have to keep the sustan pedal pressed down for an extended period to get the same effect! I cannot even play a normal classical piece with a single mic position if I operate the sustain pedal in normal manner. CPU meter keeps creeping up and finally as it hits 100% it's game over.

In Kontakt you can find the setting of "CPU overload protection" where it starts to kill off voices when CPU load is high. Using that option things do improve but are still not perfect - and I'm not sure if this is the way a Kontakt instrument is supposed to work: building up CPU load to such levels that Kontakt decides to go into damage control mode and start chopping heads off. 

Is this something others besides me and @gfd have experienced? Anyone else have this even if you periodically release the sustain pedal? Is there any workaround for it? I didn't read through all this 40+ page thread and even if I had done it there must be comments based on older versions, which may not be valid anymore. I would think the computer I'm using is supposed to handle a single piano instrument, it's Core i7-6950x, 10 cores, running at 4.0 GHz in turbo, 64GB RAM, samples on SSD, RME Fireface 800 interface with no problems with other instruments. I also disabled Cubase multi-processing as it is really a broken feature causing nothing but trouble in live playing. 

Really frustrated as this is sound-wise a truly great instrument but if I cannot play a single piece with it without stopping every minute for things to cool down it's not much of use to me.


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## SupremeFist

Have you tried raising the max voice count to 512 and/or increasing buffer? If that doesn't help there may be Windows-specific settings to look at. (No problems when playing one mic at 33 velocities with heavy pedalling on my old system which was a lowly dual i5 Mac.)


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## rojarvi

Yeah, I tried with 2000 max voice count - no effect and Kontakt reports only like 100-200 voices running. It could be Windows-only thing but I've done pretty much all latency etc tunings available (C states, hyper-threading etc.). To me it seems like there is some kind of pedaling bug in Walker which keeps cumulating CPU load over time. 

Good point about Mac - I also have a i5 Mac Mini available to test this on if I go through the trouble of installing it there. Maybe worth a shot even if it wouldn't be possible to start using all the other stuff on that tiny Mac. Thanks!


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## CGR

rojarvi said:


> Yeah, I tried with 2000 max voice count - no effect and Kontakt reports only like 100-200 voices running. It could be Windows-only thing but I've done pretty much all latency etc tunings available (C states, hyper-threading etc.). To me it seems like there is some kind of pedaling bug in Walker which keeps cumulating CPU load over time.
> 
> Good point about Mac - I also have a i5 Mac Mini available to test this on if I go through the trouble of installing it there. Maybe worth a shot even if it wouldn't be possible to start using all the other stuff on that tiny Mac. Thanks!


Sorry to hear of your problems - that's very frustrating. From what I've read in various forums, it seems that the Walker D behaves better on Mac computers. I run the full 36 velocity patch with 2 mic sets (Hammer & Room) in Logic X Pro on an old 2009/2010 Mac Pro 2.8Ghz Quad core with 20GB ram without any problems or drop outs, and that is with dense playing & pedalling.


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## gfd

Not sure how to work around other than to use less damper pedal (good luck!). Embertone say they are working on it. We'll see. They don't seem to engage their customers on forums. I don't blame them. They get flamed a lot. I won't use the library again until it is fixed. Too bad...I love the sound of that piano.


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## OleJoergensen

2 years later....

I forgot about the advices given here and now reread part of this thread and tried what @sin(x) suggested, thank you!:
_Switch the source playback mode of all "rel" groups from DFD to Sampler(in Kontakt)_
and it works great.

I really like the sound of walker piano, such a nice tone.
Here an easy arrangement of "A child is born" made for my piano students.
Close (-11)+ hammer(-4)+ room (0) mics. Little compression and E.Q.


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## LostintheBardo

I've downloaded the full version just now (still downloading all the mic positions) and I've got that issue where it isn't showing in the kontakt library menu and I have to go through the file system and then it is in demo mode. The nicnt file is name correctly. Really hope I don't have to redownload everything to get around this...

From quickly jamming on it, I think I'm in love already.


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## SGordB

LostintheBardo said:


> I've downloaded the full version just now (still downloading all the mic positions) and I've got that issue where it isn't showing in the kontakt library menu and I have to go through the file system and then it is in demo mode. The nicnt file is name correctly. Really hope I don't have to redownload everything to get around this...
> 
> From quickly jamming on it, I think I'm in love already.


I _think_ all you need to do is "add a serial" for the Walker D inside Native Access and then use "add library" to point it to where you've already installed the lib.


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## LostintheBardo

SGordB said:


> I _think_ all you need to do is "add a serial" for the Walker D inside Native Access and then use "add library" to point it to where you've already installed the lib.


Thanks but that was the first thing I did and no luck.


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## LostintheBardo

Oh wow, suddenly it is showing! Not sure what changed...


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## dzilizzi

LostintheBardo said:


> Oh wow, suddenly it is showing! Not sure what changed...


There was something weird with the name of the piano in the first version, but I thought they fixed it.


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## Fleer

Still one of my absolute favs, this lovely Embertone grand. Would love to know what they’re working on nowadays.


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## adaagaard

Hi.

For the last few days, I've been trying to find a solution regarding CPU spikes when playing a few specific instruments in Kontakt (especially those which benefit from a sustain pedal...
I wanted to avoid the option of changing the sampler playback source from DFD to Sampler, as this will eat up my precious ram. To my surprise, it was changing the multithread option in Kontakt from off to 8 cores – both in standalone and in my DAW – which made it possible to play more than three notes with the sustain pedal engaged on two of my favorite pianos – the Walker 1955 and 1985 Passionate Grand. 
This solution seems to reduce the CPU usage quite drastically, especially in Logic, when playing the mentioned heavy CPU-hitters in the standalone application.

Earlier, I searched and read a lot about whether I should keep the "Multiprocessor support" option in Kontakt turned off when I instantiate the plug-in in Logic or if it would be more efficient CPU-wise to turn it on.
My impression is that the overall recommendation is to leave it off if you got "Processor Threads" set to automatic (or specified number of cores/threads) in the Logic preferences panel.

For me, and in terms of glitches, dropouts, and CPU spikes, the solution indicates that Logic and Kontakt will benefit from «sharing the load.» 
I have no idea if this will ease the CPU load for others affected by the same issue, but I thought it was worth posting on relevant threads/forums.

I've tested this on my iMac 2012 running OS 10.14.6 (Mojave), Logic 10.5.1, and Kontakt 6.7.1.


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## yabino974

Hi guys, just bought the full version, taking advantage of the BF sale.

Wasn't a script update or else due some time ago?


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## ChoPraTs

Hello everyone. Taking advantage of the Black Friday sales, I have also bought the complete version of the Embertone Walker 1955 Concert D. I am delighted with its sound, it is very nice and although I already have many other pianos (Synthogy Ivory II, American Concert D, Garritan CFX Concert Grand ) surely this will become one of my favorites.

However, I've found a few things that don't seem to work like I think they should. I have written an email to the Embertone support account, but I wanted to know if it happens to you too.

*1. Multi Control script seems to not work.*
I’ve tried to load several times all Kontakt Multis included with Walker 1955 Concert D, the Blank ones and the other two inside the "Instruments 1.1" folder, but it seems that the script "Multi Control" is not working, at least in my Kontakt 6 and Kontakt 7 versions. For me, there’s no difference if it’s ON or OFF, because no changes are sync with the other patches. Is this normal? Am I doing something wrong? What controls is supposed should be synced?

*2. Sostenuto pedal is not working as supposed in a real piano.*
The sostenuto pedal (middle pedal) seems to doesn’t work properly. As you know, on an acoustic grand piano, when pressing the sostenuto pedal it keeps the dampers of the sustained keys raised, so that those notes remain resonant while the rest of the keys continue with the dampers on the strings. The problem with the Walker 1955 Concert D is that, when using the sostenuto pedal, it works correctly only if you don’t want to press the same keys again. If so, then it produces a strange effect because although the sostenuto pedal is pressed and the keys still resonating, the second time that you press those same keys they will not be sustained, if you play them staccato, they will sound staccato and they shouldn’t sound that way because the sostenuto pedal is still pressed exactly for those notes. It’s not something that you’ll use everyday, but sometimes is necessary to press the same key several times without changing the pedal, maybe just to give to each press more energy or volume, but at this moment it’s not working as expected.

Have any of you run into these problems too?

Thanks in advance for the help!


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## Vik

Have you checked if the CC number of your pedal matches the CC number used in the Walker? @Embertone, maybe you can chime in?


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## ChoPraTs

Vik said:


> Have you checked if the CC number of your pedal matches the CC number used in the Walker? @Embertone, maybe you can chime in?


Yes, of course, CC 66.

The pedal itself works and even the Walker piano responds to it, but I think the way that it's implemented in this library is wrong, or at least not realistic.

In other libraries I own or I've tried (Garritan CFX Concert Grand, The Grandeur, Galaxy Vintage D, Ivory Pianos II, Ivory American Concert D) it works exactly as it works in a real acoustic grand piano: the sostenuto pedal works just the same as the sustain pedal but only for the pressed keys. In a real piano, if you sustain a note with the sostenuto pedal, it will remain sustained each time you press the same key as long as you don't release the pedal. But for some reason, in the Walker, the key is only sustained the first time you press it and when you press the sostenuto pedal. Once the pedal is pressed and sustaining that key as expected, if you press the key several times it will sound without sustain and I think that's not possible in a real piano.

In a real piano you can sustain a key with the sostenuto pedal and play other keys as staccatto if you want, but you can't play staccato those keys that you are keeping sustained with the sostenuto pedal. But in the Walker, for some reason I don't understand, you can sustain a key with the sostenuto pedal and play again the same key as staccato in the in the following presses, something that does not make sense to me. If the pedal simulates that the dampers of the key are raised, it does not make sense that the same key can sound sustained with the sostenuto pedal but also be playable as staccato at the same time.

Has no one else noticed this before? Or maybe is there something wrong with my installation?


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## Embertone

ChoPraTs said:


> Yes, of course, CC 66.
> 
> The pedal itself works and even the Walker piano responds to it, but I think the way that it's implemented in this library is wrong, or at least not realistic.
> 
> In other libraries I own or I've tried (Garritan CFX Concert Grand, The Grandeur, Galaxy Vintage D, Ivory Pianos II, Ivory American Concert D) it works exactly as it works in a real acoustic grand piano: the sostenuto pedal works just the same as the sustain pedal but only for the pressed keys. In a real piano, if you sustain a note with the sostenuto pedal, it will remain sustained each time you press the same key as long as you don't release the pedal. But for some reason, in the Walker, the key is only sustained the first time you press it and when you press the sostenuto pedal. Once the pedal is pressed and sustaining that key as expected, if you press the key several times it will sound without sustain and I think that's not possible in a real piano.
> 
> In a real piano you can sustain a key with the sostenuto pedal and play other keys as staccatto if you want, but you can't play staccato those keys that you are keeping sustained with the sostenuto pedal. But in the Walker, for some reason I don't understand, you can sustain a key with the sostenuto pedal and play again the same key as staccato in the in the following presses, something that does not make sense to me. If the pedal simulates that the dampers of the key are raised, it does not make sense that the same key can sound sustained with the sostenuto pedal but also be playable as staccato at the same time.
> 
> Has no one else noticed this before? Or maybe is there something wrong with my installation?


I have loaded the instrument, and tried what you've said... it seems like we need to add this to our list of tasks for an update. Although this sostenuto "glitch" is not something I come across often in piano playing, I can imagine one would need this to work better, especially for a highly coloristic/sensitive piano piece that needs more authentic behavior here.

[EDIT] The Multi Control script is really tricky to get right. Because we could put more than 100,000 samples into Kontakt at once, we were limited from being able to put the mic positions within one instance of Kontakt. This Multi Script was our best solution here, but it requires careful preparation to make it work properly. I'll load it up and refresh my memory ASAP. Thanks!


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## Embertone

yabino974 said:


> Hi guys, just bought the full version, taking advantage of the BF sale.
> 
> Wasn't a script update or else due some time ago?


There's a minor half pedaling fix that requires us to roll out an update - if that problem is irking you, please email me directly. Thanks! alex at embertone dot com


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## ChoPraTs

Embertone said:


> I have loaded the instrument, and tried what you've said... it seems like we need to add this to our list of tasks for an update. Although this sostenuto "glitch" is not something I come across often in piano playing, I can imagine one would need this to work better, especially for a highly coloristic/sensitive piano piece that needs more authentic behavior here.


Oh, I see! So, I hope it will be solved in a future update. It's not a priority, but I think it would be more useful if it works like a real piano, it will be more realistic.



Embertone said:


> [EDIT] The Multi Control script is really tricky to get right. Because we could put more than 100,000 samples into Kontakt at once, we were limited from being able to put the mic positions within one instance of Kontakt. This Multi Script was our best solution here, but it requires careful preparation to make it work properly. I'll load it up and refresh my memory ASAP. Thanks!


Ok! I will wait for some indications. I looked in the manual for information on how to use this script, but I couldn't find anything related to it. Thank you very much for the help!


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## Embertone

ChoPraTs said:


> Oh, I see! So, I hope it will be solved in a future update. It's not a priority, but I think it would be more useful if it works like a real piano, it will be more realistic.
> 
> 
> Ok! I will wait for some indications. I looked in the manual for information on how to use this script, but I couldn't find anything related to it. Thank you very much for the help!


I've done some testing - and so far I'm finding that Kontakt 6 broke the Multi... the last version of Kontakt that I personally have, that works with this Multi, is Kontakt 5.8.1...


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## ChoPraTs

Embertone said:


> I've done some testing - and so far I'm finding that Kontakt 6 broke the Multi... the last version of Kontakt that I personally have, that works with this Multi, is Kontakt 5.8.1...


Oh! I see! Then I think this will also need and update, hehe.

I hope you keep it in mind for future updates. Thank you in any case, the piano itself sounds very nice, I like it very much and despite these small issues I'm really enjoying it a lot.


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## Embertone

ChoPraTs said:


> Oh! I see! Then I think this will also need and update, hehe.
> 
> I hope you keep it in mind for future updates. Thank you in any case, the piano itself sounds very nice, I like it very much and despite these small issues I'm really enjoying it a lot.


I'm gonna run more tests to make sure, and reach out to our programmer once I'm more confident that it's officially broken in Kontakt 6... Thanks for helping here!
-A


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## Iondot

I just picked this up last week and it sounds beautiful! What a bargain!


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