# How do you deal with stress / health with multiple deadlines?



## passenger57 (Mar 11, 2013)

Hi, I was wondering how everyone hear deals with their deadline stress? 

I always make my deadlines, but with year after year of continuous deadlines and people constantly making demands, notes, stems, etc... my body seems to jump ship at some point even though mentally I can handle it. But physically, things start to happen...
This usually manifests itself as dizzy spells, fevers, rapid heart beat, easily getting sick. Then I goto the doctor and it's unusually something I caught because my immune system was low. Other than that I'm fine. After a while I'm back in business only to have this happen months later when things get crazy in the schedule. 

Whatever energy I have left over I prefer to spend with my family going out to a restaurant, the zoo or something that doesn't take too much time. 
I try to take a walk in the morning, but other than that I'm sitting in my chair all day. I'm thinking of making a 'standing studio' desk so at least I'm on my feet.

I'm starting to wonder if I should just pass on gigs from time to time but there is always that nagging fear they won't call me back.

Anyway - just some random thoughts with a guy and a 102 temperature typing on VI Forum :oops:


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## Guy Bacos (Mar 11, 2013)

I use to work, work and work. I changed that last year. I now play tennis 2 to 4 times a week and train at the gym 2 days a week, cardio and muscle work out. I have a lot more energy than before and it reduced my stressed. It was an investment I decided to do to be able to enjoy doing music for a long time and feel better in my body. I think it's one of the best moves I've ever done. But it demands discipline, however, I enjoy every moment of it.


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## JJP (Mar 11, 2013)

You're right, you do need to get out and be active a few times a week. You need to have time for your family, you need to have time to do things other than music. This is a very serious issue that has been discussed on this board before. The deadlines and all-nighters do catch up with you if you're not careful. I have colleagues who have nearly lost their lives over this. Most people don't know that even Oliver Nelson died in his early 40s at his desk while pulling an all-nighter. (One of the people with whom I work was his pall bearer.) He had become known as the guy to call when it last minute and nobody else could get it done in time. It killed him.

Having a life and maintaining your health are critical for being able to continue doing your job. I personally take the attitude that I am happy to bust my tail, burn the midnight oil, and push through make a deadline, and deliver a great product, but somebody's gonna pay for it -- and pay a lot. If someone comes to me and says "this project needs to be done in a week" when I know it should really take two weeks, they're probably gonna pay about double what it would normally cost. If they find somebody who's willing to do it cheaper, fine. I plan on being in this game for many years and enjoying my old age. I'm not going to let anyone take that away from me by expecting me to burn myself out early. I've seen it happen to too many others.

That's part of why I push very hard to do my orchestration and music prep work union. If I'm forced to work nights or Sundays, they are going to pay overtime and Sunday rates. If I decide to work on Sunday myself, that's one thing, but if a project forces me to work after hours, they should pay. A union contract makes all that very clear.

I once worked for a company run by a Harvard business grad. The company was growing rapidly and they were nearing the point where they would have more work than they could handle. I asked him, "What are you going to do if you have more clients than resources?" He shrugged and said, "We raise our prices and it's no longer a problem." He was right. The cheap clients would disappear and leave room for the ones who paid well.

If you have a completely full plate and are putting in too much time to make a living, you're not charging enough. As another businessperson once told me, "If at least one client isn't complaining about your fees, you're not charging enough." That's so true. There will always be one person who thinks you're too expensive. The rest will know you're worth it.

No gig is worth your health or your family just so some other person can make a bit more money. Don't be afraid to say no to a gig. You'll probably find that in the long run it wasn't worth it anyway. o-[][]-o


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## Musicologo (Mar 11, 2013)

Do you work for a living or do you live to work? Does your work equate your identity?

I believe we're much much more than our work. Music should be something you do because you like and you're motivated to do it.

The money you make is to assure you a good living quality otherwise there is no point in working at all. If your daily routine doesn't assure you that living quality then something is clearly wrong. Better have less money but more life quality and health.

So, if you think you're working too much just ease out. Change your routines and make a lighter pace. It just seems you're overdoing and stressing out of it.

In the end this world is only worthwhile if you have a good time while you're here. So think about your priorities and what really makes sense to you and makes you feel good. And do that stuff in a balanced way.

If you're working that hard and you NEED all that money and you can't ease out, then it's another story and a more complex dilemma - that would be a struggle for pure survival.


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## passenger57 (Mar 11, 2013)

Thank you for the feedback. Very sobering and sad about Oliver Nelson. 

I've been on a constant work stretch for over seven years. Before that, 10+ years of constant struggling, being broke all the time, in dept having to borrow money from my family. Now I'm out of dept, making real money, scoring gigs are pouring in, getting bigger, more high profile. Even A list stuff even pecking at my door. I always strive to do great work, improve my skills, give 100% - but now I feel like I'm on a train that can't stop but I'm afraid to get off. I'm greatly fearful of how it was before when I was poor which is why I very rarely turn anything down - I'm always playing the game, making connections, meeting people. Its a total rat race. 

I guess whenever I talk to younger composers starting out, I always stress that they keep in shape. Wish I could take that advice. I'm just starting to wear out and I don't know what else to do. I have no other skills or desire to do anything else with my life. Maybe it's a 'be careful what you wish for' sort of thing. 

Anyway, thanks for allowing me to express such personal feelings here - I know were all in the same boat. Feels good to connect a little


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## kdm (Mar 11, 2013)

May not be an issue for everyone, but cutting out all caffeine (and most sugar too) in addition to exercising regularly, eating healthy can be a night and day change for anyone drinking a lot of coffee, tea, or sodas to keep going on late nights.

But if you do consume a decent amount, be warned, quitting can be rough. Caffeine can do a number on your system, especially when under stress. 
 
It is good that you are as busy as you are - congrats on reaping some rewards for the years of hard work! Enjoy this part of the journey as much or more than you plan for the next. Enjoy family and friends. No amount of work can replace them. At a point, you might have to pass on a gig here or there, picking the ones you know are going to propel your career, improve your craft, and be the most profitable to maintain minimal financial stress.


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## Brobdingnagian (Mar 11, 2013)

Agreed on Oliver Nelson. I hadn't realized he passed away so young AND that he was also out here doing a lot of TV work, aside from all of the landmark Jazz work.

You are not alone, my friend. We work so hard to get the ball rolling uphill and as it begins to move downhill a bit more rapidly than anticipated, one is thrilled by success, but it does take its toll... 

Life/work balance is easy to discuss, but difficult to implement, especially when juggling several projects..all year long...for several years. Your moving train metaphor and especially the part about being afraid to get off, is very on pont. I'd be a hypocrite if I said I couldn't relate. 

I just turned down a project this week - VERY hard for me to do. Money was more than fair, situation was good. I simply cannot take on more work at this time AND manage to spend any time with my family. My children, whilst still quite young, are growing up so quickly...as I toil day and night. The accolades are fun, reaching so many people is humbling, the money is great and my wife and I love each other dearly. I will take JJP's Harvard Business colleague's words to heart and tell my agents to start raising my fees a bit more...perhaps it will free things up a little more...

Keeping fit is paramount. So I am trying to do brisk walks, play a fair bit of tennis, sit in the sun for 10mins a day and stay healthy. Diet is also a HUGE factor. Constantly drinking vegetable juices and eating well here, despite my penchant for wonderful restaurants.

Hang in there, Passenger 57 and forever forward.

-B


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## Guy Rowland (Mar 12, 2013)

What a good and sobering thread. My own workload expands and contracts over the year - I have mad seasons and quiet seasons. But I never want the mad to take over and even there I try to protect one day a week even if it means negotiating a delay on project where that might be viable.

I'd definitely take these illnesses as a serious warning, Passenger.

Lots of good comments here. One more idea to consider if the good gigs are rolling in - get an assistant / collaborator.


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## presetfreund (Mar 12, 2013)

passenger57 @ Tue Mar 12 said:


> I'm thinking of making a 'standing studio' desk so at least I'm on my feet.



Years ago I had a carpenter manufacture a well-working standing studio desk solution, costs about 50 €. Not too beautiful looking I admit, however I was finally able to change a seating studio workstation into a standing studio workstation & vice versa within 40 seconds (if u like pm me for photos of it).

Ergonomics in the context of working always has been extremely crucial for me. Some times I walk up and down in my studio like the tiger in the cage while listening to what I have written during the previous feverish hour, or look out of the window, or practice some triumphant gestures of success and the like
:D

Reg. the other issue, your life plan, no advice from me, apart from:
Try to do everything you do because you love doing it. And not because you fear the consequences if you don´t do it.

Maybe easier said than done.


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## Waywyn (Mar 12, 2013)

passenger57 @ Tue Mar 12 said:


> Hi, I was wondering how everyone hear deals with their deadline stress?
> 
> I always make my deadlines, but with year after year of continuous deadlines and people constantly making demands, notes, stems, etc... my body seems to jump ship at some point even though mentally I can handle it. But physically, things start to happen...
> This usually manifests itself as dizzy spells, fevers, rapid heart beat, easily getting sick. Then I goto the doctor and it's unusually something I caught because my immune system was low. Other than that I'm fine. After a while I'm back in business only to have this happen months later when things get crazy in the schedule.
> ...




Here are just a few personal thoughts which helped me to reduce stress bigtime:

- do Yoga Nidra!
It is basically exercises to help your body to realize what it is to become calm. This 24 min exercise basically lets you sweep in between a nap and being awake ... but in kind of a constant rhythm. After that you feel very relaxed, calm and peaceful within and bringing back some energy. Make sure to read about it since it can really help to change some situations (not even life)

- get a standing working desk!
I did this a few weeks ago. I don't want to use this post for shameless self promo, but you find my article about this topic on my website. Yes, it sounds dramatic again, but this definitely changed my entire life. Being a few weeks into it I not just got rid of all my issues and pains (not that I had intense ones, but more of the annoying kind) I also feel more focused and more "being present".

- are your deadlines really deadlines?
This sounds completely weird, but think about this for a moment. You talk to a producer and he says: That thing HAS to be done next week.
Your inner stress deadline signal turns on: Next week, next week, it has to be done!
Of course this doesn't work on any job, but I would make sure if the deadline is really a hardcore deadline deadline deadline :lol: or just some point the producer wants to have it!
Maybe ask (depending about how good you know your client) if he wants the full track/full project or maybe a tasty 1 min preview to give you some feedback. I mean, if it is about a 3-4 min track, you just reduced your deadline from working on 3-4 mins to 1 day.

- talk to your clients:
What helped me a lot, especially when I had like 3-4 deadlines clashing into each other was calling each client one by one, simply asking, if there would be a chance to deliver the track a day later or if the deadline is still actual or if anything has changed. I think a lot of us, incl. me, simply accepted the clients deadline and even started to defend this deadline when it came to private things: "But don't you understand, this HAS to be done".
Then one day I simply started to call 2 clients of those 4 projects and within 30 mins my whole schedule completely cleared. One client told me that the project has been delayed for a week, the other one said, that one minute preview is okay and the other one (you maybe already delivered 2 mins of a track) tells you that they are still caring about feedback, but one of the guys went on vacation for 2 weeks.
I am just making up some numbers, here!
Again, of course there are hardcore and intense deadlines, but most of the time we eat let people feed us, no matter how hot the meal is. We do not ask if we could take a minute to let it cool down for a bit ... we rather prefer to moan about our burnt mouths later 

- the more stress, the more do something else
I can't remember this full phrase, but it was something like: If you have stress, do meditate for an hour, if you got more stress, meditate even two! 
Okay, so this is not only about meditating but it should get obvious. In times you feel like stress is ramming down your house, just take a walk or do something else and not music. It helps you to reboot and in the end maybe get things done much faster.

- why worry?
This helped me most of everything, but it is actually the hardest one. Still is, not was, since I am still developing it, but there is this little meme going round the internet: http://www.curiositiesbydickens.com/wp-content/uploads/why-worry.jpg (http://www.curiositiesbydickens.com/wp- ... -worry.jpg)

If you really understand it, things become much easier. On this one you could explain and write books of 10000 pages long, but once you really start doing it (and I am not talking of ignoring problems or swallowing them away) life seems a lot easier! 

- money does not make you happy, it just calms you down
This is another important one. Money is obviously important in our society, but many many people think that money makes you happy, because of all the things you can buy and the comfort you could achieve, BUT the thing is, happiness comes from the inside. You could be a billionaire, you could still be unhappy, but if you are (or become) a happy person totally depends on you and not the money. I am not assuming you do this, but again, these are just some thoughts.
Let me say I have been in some pretty deep shit financially throughout my whole life and everytime a high bill came in, I went like crazy ... but over time I realized that this little piece of paper doesn't make me mad. It was myself ... and even if the situation was Defcon 5, it was way easier to handle it when being calm and focused instead of OMG OMG OMG! :D


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## Justus (Mar 12, 2013)

Thank you, Passenger57, for starting this thread and the others for giving valuable pieces of advice.
In fact I am in the exact same situation right now and it feels good to know that I am not alone.

Recently I came across this little story that fits quite well into this thread (really worth reading):

http://www.sunnyskyz.com/feel-good-stor ... olf-balls/


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## Jimbo 88 (Mar 12, 2013)

Yes I suffer from many of the same issues. I started playing baseball and softball a couple times a week and that helped. As soon as winter comes and the baseball season is over all the problems start showing up. I will go thru a spell where I feel like I have a flu coming on. 

I purchased a tread mill, a couple of other work out devices and put them in front of a big screen TV. My wife and i now work out regularly while watching TV. It had been years since i watched any show besides sporting events. Sounds silly, but that helped. Helped me see what was going on in the rest of the world and disconnect from work for a bit.

I have found that keeping my body on schedule is the key. Eat, sleep, exercise, work all in proper moderation. Working too late or all-nighters are counter productive.

From what i've seen from friends, good health is far from guaranteed after 45 years old. The sooner you start being healthy, the better.


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## Brian Ralston (Mar 12, 2013)

Waywyn @ Tue Mar 12 said:


> - do Yoga Nidra!
> It is basically exercises to help your body to realize what it is to become calm. This 24 min exercise basically lets you sweep in between a nap and being awake ... but in kind of a constant rhythm. After that you feel very relaxed, calm and peaceful within and bringing back some energy. Make sure to read about it since it can really help to change some situations (not even life)



Good recommendation Alex! 

There is a free Yoga Nidra audio guide on iTunes U that comes out of UCLA for anyone that is interested. 

https://itunes.apple.com/itunes-u/deep-relaxation-guided-meditation/id434139276?mt=10


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## Patrick de Caumette (Mar 12, 2013)

Thanks for sharing Passenger57!

I am in the same boat too. When jobs are super imposed for a bit too long, the negative effects are creeping up. Hard to detach from the job. I am not so pleasant to be around at that point. 
Unfortunately, i am not as fast as i'd like to be, mostly when doing orchestral mockups, and i have to put in more time to make sure that the level of production is up to my standards. So, no time left for anything else.
Forget spending time with family, aside from picking up kids from school, rehearsals...etc

Diet, exercise, help, but we just aren't meant to be spending that many hours a week doing our job, period.
Having immigrated to the US, i can't help reminding myself of the difference in life style between Europe and here (granted, film composers in Europe are subjected to the same insane schedule)
I believe the merit of working non stop is over rated.
When life is finally over and we look back, what do we have to show for?
Great music, possibly, but what else?

We all know we have no leverage against the practices of the film industry, but it is a shame.
Money is the ruler, and therefore we have to submit to its authoritarian demands: less and less time to do our jobs, while someone up the food chain is sitting pretty behind a desk, cashing in on all of the hard labor.

Shit hits the fan when aging creeps in...
By then, i hope that i'll have secured some retirement money.
Until then, working my butt off it is...


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## maest (Mar 12, 2013)

I know this is a bit personal here, and most of you don't know me - but I have lurked for many years (until recently have never really posted anything, because of my previous position - I let my boss do the posting)

I spent 4 great years working for the biggest film composer (who shall rename nameless) meeting many impossible deadlines. I really enjoyed my time there, really liked my boss and co-workers, and the stress was not the issue (however my body was messed up, and I was developing a "short-fuse" because of one issue). 

Since I left the gig to come work for Cinesamples, I have actually have had a harder time adjusting to a "less-stress" life. I know my wife is happier she gets to see me, my body is in much better shape, but my spirit is a little rocked, to be honest. But I am adjusting... 

There is something so gratifying about completing something impossible, even if it took you 130+ hours that week to do it. 

When I was in the thick of it, it was always looking for the completion, and feeding off the stress energy. I don't think it ever really hit me as stress on an emotional or spiritual side. I fed off of it. 

My advise, if you are the type of person who feeds off of stress and performs best under stress - come up with a routine in the morning to start your day off. For me its a bit of meditation while I drink my coffee and read something inspiring, like proverbs or some great quotes. Cleaning my work space - so I have some organization, getting a good stretch in. Then making a checklist of what needs to be accomplished that day, making sure everything gets checked off... EVEN if things get in the way, it still gets checked off. 

The key to any stressful workload is organization. You can see it all in front of you, you can prioritize, and then make decisions on what is realistic to do that day, and whether or not you will see your family/friends/etc at all that week.

On the physical side - know your limitations, do not hurt yourself. Stretch every hour, take a "mind" break and walk around the block. Take a lunch break outside. Let your body relax while you process the tasks at hand.

Hope this helps,

Sam Estes


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## mwarsell (Mar 12, 2013)

How do you get multiple deadlines?


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## IvanP (Mar 12, 2013)

Best thread ever! :D 

Thank you for all your input...it is relieving to find out that we're all on similar boats and love reading all the alternatives and advices. 

What a great forum this is


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## Guy Bacos (Mar 12, 2013)

Other than exercising and yoga, the first thing to do might be to get a physical by your doctor. Get blood tests regularly, this is very important. One thing most people don't have enough is vitamin D, the best way to get it is through direct sun, 15 min a day (depending on your skin colour). Vitamin D triggers a hormone that acts on your entire body and low vitamin D can cause depression. I know I've often gone days and weeks with hardly any sun too busy with my work. It depends also where you live. Being conscious of this now, I try to get my vitamin D.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6D9aANoN0-Y


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## germancomponist (Mar 12, 2013)

Guy Bacos @ Tue Mar 12 said:


> Other than exercising and yoga, the first thing to do might be to get a physical by your doctor. Get blood tests regularly, this is very important. One thing most people don't have enough is vitamin D, the best way to get it is through direct sun, 15 min a day (depending on your skin colour). Vitamin D triggers a hormone that acts on your entire body and low vitamin D can cause depression. I know I've often gone days and weeks with hardly any sun too busy with my work. It depends also where you live. Being conscious of this now, I try to get my vitamin D.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6D9aANoN0-Y



+1

I take one tablet every week, "Vitamin D", which holds for one week. Many informations you can find here: http://lpi.oregonstate.edu/infocenter/vitamins/vitaminD/

The next very important thing is the light in your studio. Is the light bright enough?
It is very unhealthy and stressful work in the long run, if the lighting is not optimal.


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## AndrewS (Mar 12, 2013)

maest @ Tue Mar 12 said:


> On the physical side - know your limitations, do not hurt yourself. Stretch every hour, take a "mind" break and walk around the block. Take a lunch break outside. Let your body relax while you process the tasks at hand.
> 
> Hope this helps,
> 
> Sam Estes



Drinking heavily helps too!


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## maest (Mar 12, 2013)

@AndrewS - that's what Wednesday's are for 

-Sam


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## rgames (Mar 12, 2013)

There are two types of overworking:

1. Overwork due to long periods of inspiration
2. Overwork due to long periods of forced activity

Both are, in general, bad, but #2 is especially bad. Some people are constantly inspired and are able to work ridiculous hours with no apparent side effects. However, they don't feel like they're working. For those people, the work is not a struggle (most of the time). Others, however, use self-discipline to make up for the lack of inspiration.

Of course, nobody is at either extreme - people fall into a continuum over these two extremes. However, the father you are to #2, the more likely you are to suffer from health problems. Still possible towards #1, but much less common.

More to the point - does working long hours equate to better work products? Specific to the art and craft of composition: look through the entire opus of some of history's great composers and estimate the total number of minutes of music they produced in their lifetimes. Now estimate the number of days they worked as a composer to get an average of minutes per day.

Then ask yourself why composers keep pulling all-nighters. Sure, lots of the music is abandoned, but even accounting for that fact it's pretty obvious that (most of) the greats weren't working sixteen-hour days for weeks on end.

Producing lots of music doesn't necessarily equate to producing good music. There are plenty of composers who left this world with a lot of minutes of music under their belts and nobody listening to it. Is such an end result worth all the stress? The answer, of course, is entirely personal, but it is a question worth asking.

The question is especially relevant for anyone who has children. Most of the time a parent's greatest hope for leaving a significant mark on history is in his children. Let's face it, by the time you have kids, you probably know if you're going to leave your mark as a composer. If not, and composing is ravaging your health and keeping you from those children, who benefits from that approach?

rgames


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## jeffc (Mar 12, 2013)

This is a really interesting question, Passenger 57, one that I've struggled with as well. As we all know, composing kind of takes over thought 24/7, so it's not as easy as saying to work less hours. Diet and exercise are great recommendations, but I still find that when you're in the thick of it on more than one gig, even that stuff doesn't help because you just can't focus on it to enjoy the benefit. Yoga when you've got a ton of cues due the next day to me just doesn't work, cause I'm so stressed out while doing it, that I don't really get the benefits.

I also share your worry about turning down work, because, I'm sure we've all had the years of trying to get steady work, and when the phone rings, you really don't want to let anything go for fear that it might stop ringing again.

My realization, after years of being on the constant working treadmill, burning through a marriage, not being 'there' for some kid stuff, was to really enjoy the days off. After doing a series for 10 years (which I'm sure will never happen again, knock on wood), in looking back, was I wish I enjoyed the summers and time off more. And I've made that a major change in my life now, and I feel it has made life better. If there's no spotting session for a few days, now I'll really try to get out and do no music stuff on those few free days. Drive to Mammoth or Bear to ski, go bike, just live life and feel like a human. I can't tell you how many days I wasted sitting in the studio, when I really didn't have to be there those days. So, in a business where we have so little control over anything, now I try to be in control of life on those days I can and enjoy them to the fullest. That, I feel, recharges the batteries enough for the following day and keeps me from going insane.

Who knows? I have a friend who's a pretty big kind of A-list composer who was able to say 'no' to work all the time, and it kind of helped his stock go up, and surely helped his health and well-being. The more he said 'no', the more people wanted him. But I've never been able to apply that philosophy to my career, cause I'm always scared that saying 'no' will be the last time someone asks. 

Crazy business! Stay healthy....

Jeff


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## presetfreund (Mar 13, 2013)

maest @ Tue Mar 12 said:


> There is something so gratifying about completing something impossible, even if it took you 130+ hours that week to do it.





maest @ Tue Mar 12 said:


> For me its a bit of meditation while I drink my coffee and read something inspiring, like proverbs or some great quotes. Cleaning my work space - so I have some organization, getting a good stretch in. Then making a checklist of what needs to be accomplished that day, making sure
> everything gets checked off... EVEN if things get in the way, it still gets checked off.
> 
> On the physical side - know your limitations, do not hurt yourself. Stretch every hour, take a "mind" break and walk around the block. Take a lunch break outside. Let your body relax while you process the tasks at hand.




Do you do all this within that 18hs34ms (oh, I forgot: "+" !) day schedule, seven days a week? Or does it sum up to 22(+) working hours per day?


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## IvanP (Mar 13, 2013)

About saying no....

I had an emotional talk, a few years ago, with one of today's major film music composers. 

I was asking him how he coped with family, life, etc. and he answered that he learned to say no and to leave that fear behind. 

He had an illness because of which he needed to disappear for some time and, after that, he wanted to spend more time with his family. 

During a holiday, he received a call for a movie featuring an important cast...he said no, thank you and went on holiday with his family. 

A little while after he was back he received a call for a blockbuster movie and a once in lifetime chance to score that kind of picture. If he had accepted the other one, he wouldn't have been able to score it, nor replenish his energies with his family. 

That attitude was a game changer for me and I also discovered that there's no shame in saying no. People will still call you.

On the other side, I'm still waiting for this big blockbuster call hahahaha :mrgreen:


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## mark812 (Mar 13, 2013)

For me, 3 things: Yoga (daily), meditation (at least 5 minutes per day) and jogging at least 3 times a week. 

Yoga is really a life saver, it can improve your health so much. It did wonders for my back and stress. There are many free youtube lessons for beginners, these are my favorites, awesome stuff:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2B-_aQ5vS9E&list=SP68C4F42A875FF6B0 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2B-_aQ5v ... 2A875FF6B0)


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## Patrick de Caumette (Mar 13, 2013)

Sorry to state the obvious, but getting collaborators to handle some of the load for you is also to consider.
There is plenty of young talent eager to work, and if it is the right fit for a specific project, things become suddenly more managable, without being financially too taxing...


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## passenger57 (Mar 13, 2013)

Thank you all for such wonderful, thoughtful responses and insights. 
After taking in everyones suggestions, I've decided to pass on the next gig and take some time off, spend time with my family. Who knows, perhaps my stock will go up a little was suggested.  
To put things in perspective, I am married, in my early 40s with two small children. I don't have the energy I had 20 years ago but I'm creatively as strong as ever. I just need to pace myself a little. An orchestrator friend not much older than me with kids the same age almost died from a heart attack, and that really was a wake up call for me. 
I remember reading an article that had an interview with a hospice nurse. She was asked what people regretted most in their final days.. top of the list was 'I worked too hard, never spent time with my family'
Who knew being a composer could be such a hazardous profession. Kinda makes you wonder how guys like Bach could write a cantata a week with 50 kids running around. Maybe people were made of tougher stuff back then. :lol: 
Be well friends, and thank you!


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## JAM (Mar 13, 2013)

Thank you very much Ivan for sharing your story with us - I found it very inspirational. Learning to let go of fear is one of the most difficult things for us all. 

The problem is that most of us are not free to work exactly as we want to. At some point in the distant past, somebody somewhere felt it was okay to suggest an unreasonable deadline and perhaps because no resistance took place that sends out a signal for it to be tried again - to the point where it is now normal.

I also think Patrick sometimes the obvious needs stating and getting collaborators is one of the major keys. As we all know many composers work just that way - they want to get their idea from their mind onto the speakers as quickly as possible thus delegating the programming and endless tweaking to their assistants. This makes absolute sense to me as it keeps you fresh and alive and not bogged down in all the minute programming details. 

The other thing, is to eat organic healthy as often as possible. Our bodies and mind have been and still are, our loyal companions on this journey - so let's treat them with respect and health.


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## Patrick de Caumette (Mar 13, 2013)

Enjoy a well deserved break Passenger!
=o


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## Peter Alexander (Mar 13, 2013)

Quick! Raise your hand if you're a Type A or a first born!

Yeah, me too!

So, I've worked in three sectors related to music and creativity: the advertising agency business, publishing, and music production.

It's all the same in terms of bodily impact because of deadline demands. I've pulled nearly as many all nighters in the ad agency business as I have in music, and with big clients, not little ones. 

If your body is jumping is jumping ship, it's sending you a message you need to respond to _now_. A piano teacher once said to me that he learned the hard way that he had to be an athlete of his instrument. 

I think many of us could carry that to the next level and say that we have to be athlete's of our careers. Stress and meeting wild deadlines is its own addiction. And has a tough competitor, I thrill at beating people. 

But I don't thrill at dying before my time. So I've pulled way back.

And it's been hard pulling back. Achieve, achieve achieve! I'm not doing it cuz I'm resting.

The one day this verse from Genesis started banging on my head. "By the seventh day God had *finished* the work he had been doing; so on the seventh day he *rested* from all his work." 

And the American translation of the Hebrew shabath translated rested is -> *STOPPED!*

OK, so I'm learning to rest and bringing Caroline with me!

There's always stuff to do. But I learned that if God could plan the week to stop, so could I.

Still working on it. But getting there.


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## Arbee (Mar 14, 2013)

Peter Alexander @ Thu Mar 14 said:


> Quick! Raise your hand if you're a Type A or a first born!


Yep, guilty as charged - birth order analysis is a fascinating topic which I also observe with great clarity in my children.

Now in my third career (arguably quite successful in each one) with 15 years of full time music in the middle, and an achievement junkie. I remember in my twenties, early in my music career, working 50 hours straight simply because the phone wouldn't stop ringing. And, like all self employed people (not just those in music) I worried that my moment in the sun would disappear the minute I said no just once.

I haven't posted here because, although I've been blessed so far with robust health, a supportive wife and incredible loving children, I'm not a great example. Even though I work for a company these days and in my fifties I'm still guilty of "just seeing if I can over achieve one more time". It's nuts, and I have mellowed a little, but the adrenalin rush is an addictive curse. I do however these days make time for exercise, for sailing and for my wife and kids, and for holidays every now and then.

I have no idea if this is really my defence system, but I find I reach a certain point of stress and then suddenly a sense of humour grips me and I see how ridiculous it all is.

I think this post has been one of the most helpful and supportive I've seen on this forum, and about the really important stuff - your health, a balanced life and ultimate happiness.

.


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## Brobdingnagian (Mar 14, 2013)

Arbee @ Thu Mar 14 said:


> I think this post has been one of the most helpful and supportive I've seen on this forum, and about the really important stuff - your health, a balanced life and ultimate happiness.



Agreed. Well said. Some great posts here.


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## nikolas (Mar 14, 2013)

Since August my life has become very very complicated and difficult to cope with:

1. My publishing house is going very well, gather lots of attention, etc...

2. My composing is going great, quite a few gigs, etc.

*3. My wife is working full time abroad, some 1000+ miles from home (in Azerbaijan). I'm here in Athens with both my kids.*

All this combined with the lovely atmosphere of Greece and the brilliant economy we have! 

This is killing me. Lack of sleep, stress and some health issues are starting to appear.

I need vacation! Summer 2012 was NOT a vacation, since my wife left. XMas sucked big time, because there were deadlines to meet. I seriously hope to sit back this summer, without the kids at home for at least a month and sleep, go out to the movies, have tons of sex (with my wife, duh!), etc... 

I'm not sure I can handle a second year like this... And it's been only 7 months now that she's away...

________________

Further consequences of the above is the lack of excersize (simply no time to cycle around as I used to), lack of normal dinner (I adore take away), quite a bit of alcohol (beer, nothing else, but it's enough), and staying up late, while waking up extremely early. some of you are on facebook, so I bet you've seen some of my posts around 05:30 in the morning or so... brrr...

Promise to stop this when my wife gets back and finds a full time job in Greece (and Athens, please). Otherwise I'm fucked big time... :(


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## Greg (Mar 15, 2013)

You have to trick your body and remind it that if it doesn't behave while writing music, the alternative is to go work in a coal mine. :o 

But seriously, I just remind myself of all the shittier jobs in the world and how privileged we are to be doing this as a career. Then POOF instantly feel better and motivated 

Oh and a cure for the nights of no sleep, in the famous words of Dave Grohl:

FRESH POTS

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fhdCslFcKFU


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## George Caplan (Mar 16, 2013)

i tried to keep out of this but ive seen stress and the consequences that would kill most people. but that stress is caused by this particular work environment daily hour upon hour and the weekends for some are the worst. you cant get away from it if youre that way inclined. 

the two biggest causes of stress ive seen are money and people.


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## mwarsell (Mar 17, 2013)

Yoga helps a lot. On youtube, search for "neck yoga" and take the first one that comes up. It's a 1h relatively easy series that you can do at home. The video has great commentary by the yogi Michael Riel.

I've done this since December and it has made me feel much better and relaxed.


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## wonshu (Sep 9, 2013)

Today I was reading an interview with Gavin Bryars and started to look for his music. I then stumbled across and listened to the 25 minute long "The Sinking Of The Titanic".

It's fantastic for calming things down. A bit on the sad side, but for me this morning, it was an excellent tool for clearing my mind and starting the day.

Highly recommended.

Best,
Hans


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## Hannes_F (Sep 10, 2013)

Speaking as a player - my violin professor once told me "if you don't sleep enough it will be bad for your tone". I had been caught guilty (pulling all-nighters because of a double study).

Since then I've learned that much comes from staying really relaxed, even in the middle of the heat. Maybe this is a live performer thing but it also includes beginning early with preparations (often guilty here as well but getting better). 

I've come to this conclusion for me: If I am somebody that needs the axe in the back for being highly effective then cosmical equity will deliver the pressure - reliably. To the same extent that I learn to work pro-actively which means early, voluntarily and concentrated then the unhealthy part of the pressure goes away.


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## germancomponist (Sep 10, 2013)

What I have found out in the last month's is that it is best for me to work only on one project at a time. 

One after another.


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## nikolas (Sep 10, 2013)

As far as I'm concerned there's two types of stress for me: The first one is caused by real life problems, or business problems that can be handled somehow (tight deadlines, clients asking too much of me, etc). The other kind is one that is impossible to solve on your own (For example my wife is away since last August, to work full time abroad. That's a clear cause of stress, but impossible to solve, unless she comes back. The Syria war for a Syrian, etc). 

In both cases there's a way to resolve your stress: By dealing with what's causing it. If you can handle it, then all the better. But if you can't, you need to work on coping mechanisms: substitutes (don't tell my wife that! hahahaha! (only kidding), alternatives, etc.

However, there's a third kind of stress that's caused internally and usually is connected with our selves, our own psychology, etc... Which is much tougher to resolve, cause there's nothing tangible to work with. It's our habits, our life style, our bed routine... whatever... For this we have the psychologists (and boy do they help!)

All the above from a composer/publisher and not a trained in psychology, or something similar, right?


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## TimJohnson (Sep 10, 2013)

Drink copious amounts of coffee, eat nothing but hobnobs and block out daylight. The last one is important because it will only depress you further.

... ok that's what I used to do. Now I try to only have one coffee a day and water for the rest, eat a lot more fruit than what I used to, go for walks/runs/gym - dependent on time, but never go the full day without getting out at least for 15 minutes.
Take regular breaks - I found I had to be very strict and set my alarm for every hour and a half, grab a 10 minute break - force yourself to do it. When you sit back down you really do feel more refreshed. Gives the eyes a rest too.


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## Tanuj Tiku (Sep 10, 2013)

This is indeed a very interesting thread. I have started to feel that this is becoming a problem for me now too.

The phone is indeed always ringing. There is enourmous pressure a lot of the time.

Last year was really hectic and I kind of got lost in the stress for a bit. It affected the quality of my work as well on a project. 

When you over do it, its like you have just survived a major ordeal sometimes. It takes a while to come out of it. And if you have gigs lined up one after the other, then it could be bad news.

I have learnt recently to not take too much stress when it comes to deadlines and big movie projects. They are just like any other project in terms of the number of hours at hand and the general work scenario.

I am working on my 11th movie in less than a year as additional composer at the moment. I also scored an entire feature film on my own.

Two of these films have been one of the biggest hits this year in India - one is actually the 4th of all time. Another one is releasing in November, which looks likely to set new records.

Earlier, I used to feel intimidated by such figures and it used to trigger a little bit of a panic situation. 

But, I just narrowed my vision down to the work. Just the music. And that helped me.

In between the movies, I get many calls for jingles, songs etc.

I have taken some of them on because they were friends and needed help and some of them were big individual gigs. 

But, I have started not taking deadlines too seriously now. At a professional level, yes of course. But I try to figure out from a realistic production schedule point of view - the real deadline of things. Production houses are calling non-stop and they always need everything as soon as possible. Its a bit of a rude environment sometimes.

But I learnt to say no and to ask people to wait if they wanted something good. I am ok to make a little less money if it means, it buys me time.

But I agree, it is highly underestimated - the power and importance of saying no. 

At one point, I was already booked for 6-7 months ahead of time. And planning dates becomes a problem sometimes. Schedules can overlap. Because I freelance, I work with a lot of different composers and production houses. 

I also just produced a score and that was a very hectic thing to do because I did not have enough staff to pull it off and the main composer was not really doing anything. I basically had ghost written about 70% of the score, went to record live strings, did the basic notation, the file preparation - everything.

So that took a major toll on me. But I had anticipated a bit of this, so I hired another composer to help me with some of the scenes. Still, it was not enough at the end of the day.

So each job is a learning. Regarding, rest - I agree that is very important. Sleeping over some problems is better than being in a dark space which I often go into. 

Sometimes though in the rush, you forget to sleep and some really nice stuff comes out as well.

But I guess, we have to learn to balance things. I had not seen my family for 10 months even though they live in a city just 4 hours away by train. But that is what this work can do to us sometimes.

It is an addiction. I have an ear infection going on at the moment and I am not able to do any music. That sucks! I dont know what to do with myself. I mean, I did go out, I saw a few movies, did some thinking for my next project but I really miss writing music.

Plus, I had to take off from my current gig for a few days because its quite bad. So, even getting sick sometimes has to be factored in your schedule.

If you are not going to be healthy - then its going to be worse if you get sick at the last minute.

Too bad!

Its mainly an organisation problem and also an inspiration/mood problem.

That is why I am working hard to set up my personal studio and get things organised. As of now, I have to relocate to other studios all the time and many clients want to come over but I have just converted my bedroom and that doesnt work really well.

So I guess, in the end a lot of things have to be factored in.

Good to hear about this from so many people. Very interesting read!


Tanuj.


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## AC986 (Sep 10, 2013)

Try to avoid coffee or any drinks that have an over abundance of caffeine. Like coca cola.

Questions you should answer truthfully are things such as what is your weight and is it normal for age and height and so on?

Do you sleep well through the night? Are you lethargic a lot of the time? Do you have trouble concentrating for more than a short period? Are you allergic to certain foods?


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## jackson (Sep 13, 2013)

Hi passenger57,


Sometimes I got stuck while working. If I'm doing some work continuously after some time I get irritated that why I stuck. I always take break of 5 minutes after every 2 hours. Every day I go for morning walk and did some Yoga and Exercise. 

Life should have some Fun and Rock. That's why I go for party/event, concerts or club once a month. But I didn't touch alcohol. Sometimes I listened music to go a way from stress and to be a fresh. I like swimming, dancing and cooking. 

I heard you can leave stress by doing your favorite things. If you love yourself, your family and others, then only you will like your living. /\~O


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## Peter Alexander (Sep 20, 2013)

@Tanuj - I went to your site and listened to about half your cues on Soundcloud. Sir, you do excellent work. I'm surprised VSL doesn't have some of your things posted.

Thanks for making it available for us to hear.


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## Tanuj Tiku (Sep 20, 2013)

Thanks Peter! Glad you enjoyed some of my music. 

VSL has some excellent demos from Guy Bacos, J Bacal and others. Then there is Daryl (they really should put some of his stuff!) and many more.

I would make perhaps very down their list if they ever considered putting anything I have ever done on their website.

In any case great thread with some excellent suggestions.


Tanuj.


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## Ryan (Sep 29, 2013)

Don't do as I did, thought I could be Beethoven, Mozart and Hans Zimmer by just work, working work, studying and compose, compose compose compose. Always trying to be the BEST!!.

I have a *known* heart issue. But it has never, EVER been dangerous. Until this happens:

I have a family (two kids (twins, 2 years) and a wife). I was studying film music-composition and had a daytime job at the same time as I scored for TV, commercials and all the other things that comes by. Just to make sure I've reached my goal at the end of the day: To really have this job as a living (composing). Stress? hell YEAH!

One day after the kids had fallen to sleep. I then sat down with my wife and her parents to chat a bit before I started to work again. Suddenly I syncopated/fainted, my heart beat got a high tempo and a was brought by ambulance to the hospital. 

At that stage I was asking my self: Damn, 27 years... Pacemaker? I need to get back home and compose the final scenes. 

Day two: Hospital
This is the stage where it all "hits" my face (wife, kids, house, apartment). I've since then taken the evenings and nights off my working/composing schedule. I also try to take some time out in the woods/training. Just to get a fresh head/start. I've also followed a advice I got from Alexandre Desplat, I quote: "I often take a 5-15 minute nap If a can't compose/make anything good. Just to clear my head."

I use a lot more time with family and especially my kids. I found out that I even work/compose better, and that I'm more precise with structure etc now then before. 

It's the stress-part of this type of job I love. But again, it's the most fearing thing at the same time. You could say I have a love-hate relationship with it.

Tip: get a ECG before you get into this type of job 
nhaa, just kidding! 

Best
Ryan


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## Peter Alexander (Sep 29, 2013)

Taking an EKG might be a good idea. My wife experienced something similar. While working on her Masters in Film Composition at Bournemouth, the instructor ran the course like you were working at RC.

She put so much into it, including sleepless days, that she came out of it with a heart murmur. Even today, she has to pace herself otherwise it comes back.


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## John Rodd (Oct 2, 2013)

Hi all

Good thread

so me? I have always eaten well (healthy) and exercised - but it wasn't enough......

So recently I took up boxing. 

Seriously. 

I love it, and I am now in much better shape than before. 

Great stress reliever too!!!

>8o 

Best to all,

John


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## Creston (Oct 3, 2013)

Careful John, 

I've spent years here and there doing martial arts etc and a strike to the side of the ear with boxing gloves or semi contact gloves on can damage your hearing. Had it happen to me years ago and couldn't hear for a couple of days.


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## Farkle (Oct 3, 2013)

John Rodd @ Wed Oct 02 said:


> Hi all
> 
> Good thread
> 
> ...



Right on, John! For years I trained in Boxing and MMA, for the same reason. Great fitness, major stress relief. It's hard to think about "how should I develop that cue at home", when a dude is throwing hooks at your ribs. 

I can't state this enough. Getting exercise regularly, is such an important part of being a creative. Allowing your body to have healthy chemicals/endorphins flow through it at LEAST 3 times a week (ideally, 4-5) has been shown to increase sleep quality, reduce stress.

And, from an Eastern standpoint, being able to "center yourself" in an exercise (boxing, Martial Arts) creates a skill set that transfers to the creative process.

In the video game community, one of the top exercise programs that startup and independent studios are engaged in (myself and the Play Eternal guys included) is Crossfit. It's intense, it's short and tight, and it allows you to get out of the studio, get good exercise, shed some stress, and "forget" about your work for an hour.

John, next GDC, maybe a little exhibition match?? :twisted: 

Mike


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## choc0thrax (Oct 18, 2013)

http://www.ted.com/talks/kelly_mcgonigal_how_to_make_stress_your_friend.html (http://www.ted.com/talks/kelly_mcgoniga ... riend.html)

I thought this was a pretty interesting video. Perhaps it could add years to your life if you really apply the ideas in it.


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## toomanynotes (Nov 17, 2013)

I remember watching a documentary about Bernard Hermann and his daughter/wife mentioned that Benny liked to get up early and would be done composing for film by 9am everyday so he could enjoy the rest of the day for other life's activities like walking the dog in the park, reading a book. 

I think there's alot to be said of that..perhaps a bad example. hehe!


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## Ed (Nov 17, 2013)

toomanynotes @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> I remember watching a documentary about Bernard Hermann and his daughter/wife mentioned that Benny liked to get up early and would be done composing for film by 9am everyday so he could enjoy the rest of the day for other life's activities like walking the dog in the park, reading a book.
> 
> I think there's alot to be said of that..perhaps a bad example. hehe!



Be done composing by 9am?? Just how early did he get up??


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## Stephen Rees (Nov 17, 2013)

Probably 8.45am, reeling of the Scene D'Amour by 8.50am, sandwich until 8.55am, then a Twilight Zone episode before calling it a day at 9.00am.


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## Brobdingnagian (Nov 17, 2013)

Ed @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> toomanynotes @ Sun Nov 17 said:
> 
> 
> > I remember watching a documentary about Bernard Hermann and his daughter/wife mentioned that Benny liked to get up early and would be done composing for film by 9am everyday so he could enjoy the rest of the day for other life's activities like walking the dog in the park, reading a book.
> ...



Nevermind that - you have to remember that his pencils never crashed nor did they have IP address issues or software update conflicts (he simply saved conflict for his meetings

SORRY. Just had to......


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## germancomponist (Nov 17, 2013)

http://www.ted.com/talks/kelly_mcgonigal_how_to_make_stress_your_friend.html (http://www.ted.com/talks/kelly_mcgoniga ... riend.html)


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## choc0thrax (Nov 17, 2013)

germancomponist @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> http://www.ted.com/talks/kelly_mcgonigal_how_to_make_stress_your_friend.html



Great find! Oh wait, I already posted that link. I forgive you though because you're adorable.


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## germancomponist (Nov 17, 2013)

choc0thrax @ Mon Nov 18 said:


> germancomponist @ Sun Nov 17 said:
> 
> 
> > http://www.ted.com/talks/kelly_mcgonigal_how_to_make_stress_your_friend.html
> ...



Smile, I like this lady, very sexy, if you ask me... .


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## toomanynotes (Nov 18, 2013)

Stephen Rees @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> Probably 8.45am, reeling of the Scene D'Amour by 8.50am, sandwich until 8.55am, then a Twilight Zone episode before calling it a day at 9.00am.



ya not far off me ole china!

:lol:


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## jonathanwright (Nov 21, 2013)

Great thread.

Music wise, I'm in that middle ground, where I'm not quite starting out, and I'm not quite getting enough regular work to turn stuff down easily.

As a result, when I do get a chance to take a couple of days to recharge when a project ends, I end up stressing for most of it until I get the next job, then I start stressing about the job!



Seriously though, my better (understanding) half is also self employed and has a very stressed job.

We have a deal where four times a year we HAVE to go on a break for a week (somewhere sunny). It's fixed. Planning in advance means I can tell clients that I'll be away for a few days on specific dates at the start of a project.

So far, the clients haven't been remotely bothered and I haven't lost any work because of it.

It's quite noticeable that often I really, really don't want to go on the break, but a couple of days into it I realise how stressed I actually was.

Plus these days being forcibly removed from computers/smartphones is becoming more and more necessary before we all go insane.


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## Stephen Rees (Nov 21, 2013)

jonathanwright @ Thu Nov 21 said:


> Great thread.
> 
> Music wise, I'm in that middle ground, where I'm not quite starting out, and I'm not quite getting enough regular work to turn stuff down easily.
> 
> ...



Your post struck an immediate chord with me. We are much the same here (my wife is also a composer)


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## SamGarnerStudios (Nov 21, 2013)

Just drink Death Wish coffee, you're problems will go away.


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## Ciaran Birch (Nov 21, 2013)

SamGarnerStudios @ Thu Nov 21 said:


> Just drink Death Wish coffee, you're problems will go away.



I would totally love that Sam!! Huge fan of strong coffee. :D


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## germancomponist (Nov 21, 2013)

I have found a new and also very old way to relax: I spend my time for programming new sounds with synths. 

This is very great for relaxing... ! At least for me.


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## jonathanwright (Nov 22, 2013)

Stephen Rees @ Thu Nov 21 said:


> Your post struck an immediate chord with me. We are much the same here (my wife is also a composer)



Gosh, two for the price of one! Has to be done though doesn't it?


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## Hannes_F (Nov 22, 2013)

jonathanwright @ Thu Nov 21 said:


> We have a deal where four times a year we HAVE to go on a break for a week (somewhere sunny). It's fixed. Planning in advance means I can tell clients that I'll be away for a few days on specific dates at the start of a project.
> 
> So far, the clients haven't been remotely bothered and I haven't lost any work because of it.
> 
> ...



Yesss. Except that we are going twice a year for two weeks.

In earlier years I was spending lots of holiday time either in internet cafés or on the laptop for having contact with clients. But it is silly. Holiday effect has become so much better since my wife forced me to let that go (she is the wiser one of us both).


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## jonathanparham (Jul 11, 2017)

JJP said:


> Most people don't know that even Oliver Nelson died in his early 40s at his desk while pulling an all-nighter. (One of the people with whom I work was his pall bearer.


Sorry to dredge up an old post. Thought I heard a jazz teacher say suicide?


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## JJP (Jul 11, 2017)

jonathanparham said:


> Sorry to dredge up an old post. Thought I heard a jazz teacher say suicide?



The people I know who worked with him said it was a heart attack while working late at night. He was doing a good amount of work in Hollywood at the time.


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## SimonCharlesHanna (Jul 12, 2017)

I wish I could stress about all the work I received.


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## jonathanparham (Jul 12, 2017)

JJP said:


> The people I know who worked with him said it was a heart attack while working late at night. He was doing a good amount of work in Hollywood at the time.


hmmm interesting. thanks for the info


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## Mike Fox (Aug 9, 2017)

Karoshi quickly comes to mind.


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## chillbot (Aug 9, 2017)

Wonder how the OP is doing all these years later. (BTW sick brag, bro.)


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## Desire Inspires (Aug 12, 2017)

passenger57 said:


> Thank you for the feedback. Very sobering and sad about Oliver Nelson.
> 
> I've been on a constant work stretch for over seven years. Before that, 10+ years of constant struggling, being broke all the time, in dept having to borrow money from my family. Now I'm out of dept, making real money, scoring gigs are pouring in, getting bigger, more high profile. Even A list stuff even pecking at my door. I always strive to do great work, improve my skills, give 100% - but now I feel like I'm on a train that can't stop but I'm afraid to get off. I'm greatly fearful of how it was before when I was poor which is why I very rarely turn anything down - I'm always playing the game, making connections, meeting people. Its a total rat race.
> 
> ...



This may sound harsh but here it is: Stop complaining!

People would kill to be in your position. Yeah, things get stressful and hectic. But that is a part of life. Just take whatever hard times come and think about the good things you get out of this career. 

Remember, people would kill to be in your position. Don't get weak, because others are waiting to take your spot. One wrong move and you are finished. Fight, fight, fight, and fight some more!


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