# String arrangements like Five Leaves Left, possible for a noob?



## LA68 (Oct 31, 2021)

Hey guys

I'm not super educated when it comes to music, used to play the guitar and (with less success) the piano, which I unfortunately had to give up. I've started making music on the PC, and I'm having a pretty good time. Guitars, keys, bass. I know the instruments well enough and what I want / need them to sound like. Not that I'm always happy with my results, but I'm trying 

I used to do a lot of fingerpicking and through that I learned about Nick Drake. On his first album, Five Leaves Left, there are some string arrangements which I find absolutely gorgeous (like Way to Blue / River Man) and I'm wondering if it's possible to learn how to do similar things with sample libraries. Don't really know my way around string instruments very well, and I have no idea where to start with the million of sample libraries out there.

Can it be done? Is there any library you'd recommend to start with? Any other tips how to get started?


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## crossrootsdoc (Oct 31, 2021)

I listened to River Man just now. I think the beauty of the strings is in how they were ARRANGED IE the way the chords were voiced. I agree they are beautiful, but you'd be best served understanding how to do string voicing rather than finding a specific library. Just my two cents. Look up avideo on string voicing by Paul Thomson for starters. Guy Michelmore also has a few


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## AudioLoco (Nov 1, 2021)

Fantastic goal to set...
Those are one of my favorite strings arrangement in a song ever.

(https://vi-control.net/community/th...rchestral-accompaniment-that-you-know.115250/)

It can be more or less done (well still not 100% sounding like a real ensemble, but pretty close, close as it gets).

I would say pick up a couple of libraries and start trying for yourself, the more you do, the more you improve.

For that kind of sound I would recommend solo and smaller ensemble samples, not symphonic.

("Kirby had a different sensibility about what type of arrangements to write for Nick Drake’s songs. Instead of using a full orchestra, he wrote the arrangements for a string sextet, resulting in a more intimate sound. Given that the vocals and the sextet were recorded together, it is amazing how clearly you can hear each of the instruments and the quality of their tone.")

I would try:

-A good complete solo library - like Spitfire Solo Strings
-Good solo instruments; like Tina Guo I (for that Cello Song vibe) and JB Violin.

A bit bigger sound, but easier to dial, and still can be kind of intimate:
-The amazing Vista (on sale now) which sounds great but can only do legato lines.
-Spitfire Chamber Strings: Has all the articulations and sounds gorgeous (more expensive, might be discounted on BF)


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## LA68 (Nov 2, 2021)

crossrootsdoc said:


> I listened to River Man just now. I think the beauty of the strings is in how they were ARRANGED IE the way the chords were voiced. I agree they are beautiful, but you'd be best served understanding how to do string voicing rather than finding a specific library. Just my two cents. Look up avideo on string voicing by Paul Thomson for starters. Guy Michelmore also has a few


Thank you for your advice. I watched the Paul Thomson video and checked out Guy Michelmore's channel. Both great. I'll definitely invest some time in learning about this and see if I get anywhere.



AudioLoco said:


> I would say pick up a couple of libraries and start trying for yourself, the more you do, the more you improve.
> 
> For that kind of sound I would recommend solo and smaller ensemble samples, not symphonic.
> 
> ...


Again, thanks a lot for the advice. Cool to know someone else here appreciates Nick Drake.

The Spitfire solo library sounds sweet, but it's pretty much at the edge of what I can afford right now. Next year I'll have a better budget again, but until then 400, 500 EUR is already pushing it.

The "JB Violin" is the Joshua Bell Violin, right? That one sounds lovely as well. The Embertone Intimate strings bundle seems quite attractively priced even without a BF discount, is that any good (and any good for someone like me)?

Would those VSL starter editions be any good? I've read quite a bit about that company on here and it seems quite well regarded.


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## WhiteNoiz (Nov 3, 2021)

Maybe LASS FC 2 and/or LASS LS. Or the FC + Lite bundle.


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## Alchemedia (Nov 3, 2021)

LA68 said:


> Hey guys
> 
> I'm not super educated when it comes to music, used to play the guitar and (with less success) the piano, which I unfortunately had to give up. I've started making music on the PC, and I'm having a pretty good time. Guitars, keys, bass. I know the instruments well enough and what I want / need them to sound like. Not that I'm always happy with my results, but I'm trying
> 
> ...








Part 2: Nick Drake String Arrangements on ‘Five Leaves Left’ - String Section


The album ‘Five Leaves Left’ was started in late 1968 with Joe Boyd as producer (a man who had produced ‘Fairport Convention’ amongst other bands



stringsection.co.uk


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## Alchemedia (Nov 3, 2021)

AudioLoco said:


> I would try:
> 
> -A good complete solo library - like Spitfire Solo Strings
> -Good solo instruments; like Tina Guo I (for that Cello Song vibe) and JB Violin.


The Tina Guo bundle is currently on sale.


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## crossrootsdoc (Nov 3, 2021)

LA68 said:


> Thank you for your advice. I watched the Paul Thomson video and checked out Guy Michelmore's channel. Both great. I'll definitely invest some time in learning about this and see if I get anywhere.
> 
> 
> Again, thanks a lot for the advice. Cool to know someone else here appreciates Nick Drake.
> ...


if you are really on a budget check out Ben Osterhouse sospiro strings, they go on sale sometimes for $20 -$30 and are worth much more imho. There low price belies how awesome they are. All his libraries really, but specifically that one, for the purpose you intend.


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## mixedmoods (Nov 3, 2021)

Its so good to see Nick Drake and especially River Man being mentioned in this forum!
Because the string writing in this song and also the work of grandmasters like Arthur Verocai made me being interested in String Libraries and brought me here as well.
There is so much wonderful music in the Singer Songwriter, Folk and Soul music and beyond – and especially nowadays I hear many younger artists using string sounds in their music.

But back to River Man – I am not sure if a Solo Sting library alone will get you there. They might be good to used as additional layer – but listening to the strings in the song it seems to be a medium size ensemble. Maybe a quartet or small chamber ensemble – as the sound is more on the lush and warm side. There have been good recommendation already but let me add 3 more libraries to consider:

*VSL Elite Stings*
Maybe the best choice in terms of sound and flexibility if you ask me.
I love the sound and the amount of dynamic articulations (like swells, being used in River Man).
It might be over your budget but maybe you're lucky on BF?

*8-Dio Studio Quartet Series*
A well sampled, detailed quartet with a warm and imperfect sound and lots of usefull articulations for this type of music. Try their "Bundler" option to save money.

*Orchestral Tools LA-Sessions*
One of the best sounding studio string library I know. Not the most detailed one but in this case it could get you there.

Good luck!


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## LA68 (Nov 5, 2021)

crossrootsdoc said:


> if you are really on a budget check out Ben Osterhouse sospiro strings, they go on sale sometimes for $20 -$30 and are worth much more imho. There low price belies how awesome they are. All his libraries really, but specifically that one, for the purpose you intend.


Thanks, I saw these on one of Guy Michelmore's videos, but it seems like you Kontakt to be able to use them


mixedmoods said:


> Its so good to see Nick Drake and especially River Man being mentioned in this forum!
> Because the string writing in this song and also the work of grandmasters like Arthur Verocai made me being interested in String Libraries and brought me here as well.
> There is so much wonderful music in the Singer Songwriter, Folk and Soul music and beyond – and especially nowadays I hear many younger artists using string sounds in their music.
> 
> ...



Yep, strings can have such a beautiful sound, it's not hard to understand why 

Thank you for the suggestions, I'll listen to some demos later.



Alchemedia said:


> Part 2: Nick Drake String Arrangements on ‘Five Leaves Left’ - String Section
> 
> 
> The album ‘Five Leaves Left’ was started in late 1968 with Joe Boyd as producer (a man who had produced ‘Fairport Convention’ amongst other bands
> ...


That's awesome, thanks so much for the link.

I just got an email from Best Service announcing that the VSL Synchronized Special Editions are 50% off now. Quite attractive prices. Maybe there's still enough in them them for learning? (€dit: Found lists of the contents on the website, doesn't seem optimal for what I'm doing, but maybe I'm wrong)


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## LA68 (Nov 27, 2021)

Just to conclude this thread: Again thanks for all your help. I'll buy the Spitfire libraries and Kontakt next year, when the budget is better. I listened to more SF demos and really fell in love with the sound. Until then I'll take a deeper dive into music theory and into string arrangements.

Couldn't help burning some of my money though, like every black friday: I picked up Chris Hein Strings Compact for 85 €. That should keep me entertained in the meantime. I thought it sounded pretty good, certainly more so than the other cheap options like Garritan Personal Orchestra or the cheap one from Steinberg. Hope this wasn't a stupid decision, but yeah. Too late to think about it now


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## ThomCSounds (Dec 20, 2021)

Nick Drake is such a great reference, I love that album. I've composed stuff with the older solo strings by Spitfire. But trying to find the right sound is a never-ending quest, and like @crossrootsdoc said, the actual voicing / composition itself is very important. 

But there are libraries that are more playable than others and they all deliver a different sound. When it comes to solo strings, too much brightness and detail isn't always a good thing. I mean, it depends on what mics were used etc... 

Actually, maybe that Spitfire's new Abbey Road Two would be worth looking at?


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## rhizomusicosmos (Dec 20, 2021)

In a similar vein: string and orchestral arrangements on David Sylvian's _Secrets of the Beehive_. Especially the track Orpheus which has an arrangement by Brian Gascoigne.


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