# Sample libraries. Are we addicted?



## ChrisSiuMusic (Sep 30, 2021)

As composers, we're attracted to sample libraries like flies to a sweaty headband. But why is that the case? Is GAS a real thing? Let's discuss in today's video.


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## musicalweather (Sep 30, 2021)

It's not so hard to resist impulse buying since you can become aware of when you are skipping over the process of vetting a product (comparing it to similar products you already own, asking practical questions, reading reviews, etc.). What I find harder is when I'm doing all that vetting but an underlying rationalization is driving my thought process. That is, the want is more powerful than the need, but I've cloaked it in what I think is reasonable decision making. I can persuade myself that I need a sample library or plugin, but then after purchase it ends up sitting on the shelf. That's often when I experience regret. Then again, sometimes you just can't foresee the reasons you won't end up using a sample library or plugin.


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## Markrs (Sep 30, 2021)

Some great advice Chris. 

One of the biggest issues with getting more libraries is having the time to learn them which takes away time you could spend composing or learning composition/orchestration.

My issue with buying too many Sample Libraries is two fold. One, I love bargains and I often pick up a library because I think it is a "bargain", even though I might not use it. My other issue is that I don't have a set style I want to compose in. So I end up buying libraries that work for different styles.

Sometimes you also forget what you have, especially if you have libraries that came in a bundle like Komplete UCE or are contained in patches like with Omnisphere.


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## sostenuto (Sep 30, 2021)

I am a recovering Sample Library addict. I am a recovering Sample Library addict. I am a recovering Sample Library addict. I also have recurring GAS. I also have ... I also ... I .... 😨


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## dcoscina (Sep 30, 2021)

I find it exciting and just creatively fun to limit myself to a single library. When I review sample libraries that is my main criteria: can one write music using only that library? 

I will say I’ve been enjoying the libertarian of Dorico using NotePerformer these days, or else Staffpad, where I get to focus on all of the rudiments of music rather than the production end of the spectrum.


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## dcoscina (Sep 30, 2021)

Since using Studio One, on days where I’m not focussed on composing per se, I’ve been cataloguing existing library patches using the Presets feature which then helps bookmark sounds I will want to use in the future. I’ve re discovered my love of everything Spectrasonics with this methodology


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## Paul Jelfs (Sep 30, 2021)

I think we joke about it, but I DO think it can be an addiction like any other- Gambling etc. 
There have been times when I have spent only to regret it the next day, getting caught up in the hype. 

I am much better now at waiting and really thinking if it is needed, but people could get in to serious financial trouble if they are not careful.


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## danevaz (Sep 30, 2021)

Don't know if we're addicted, but there's definitely a lot of excessive "collecting" and "I got pluginX..." going on. As the previous poster noted, a good sale is often hard to pass up. GAS is real.

The best (temporary) cure for GAS is to find some of those underused plugins you have, get the manual out, and start hacking away. You'd be surprised at what you find out you can do with what you already have.

As to your question - "Do you really need it?" Well for me, the answer is most often no (but then again, that IK Multimedia 25 for 1 sale is really something...).


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## Stringtree (Sep 30, 2021)

For me it's like owning a very small café. Happily cooking, enjoying the aromas and the food.

Golly, if I buy this industrial smoker unit, I could serve pulled pork for a hundred people. And it's on sale! It will never be this low price again! No call whatsoever for pulled pork, much fewer than a dozen customers daily. But I'll need this industrial walk-in cooler to store all that.

But that's me. The gear should never stand in the way of my abilities! /sarcasm

Yeah, I'm a low-impulse-control control freak. This will undoubtedly end badly.


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## zwhita (Sep 30, 2021)

GAS/SAS is like falling in love. Can be very addictive. It floods the reward response of your brain and can actually imprint good memories if the experience that follows is also fulfilling.

I'm at a threshold now where I must be cautious and not anticipate sales or researching new libraries anymore, at the risk of getting more enjoyment out of that process than actually making music. The latter should always be present in your mind, guiding your inspiration and creativity to new places. 

New boundaries to explore with new libraries is something we all dream about, but perhaps such aspirations should be seen as a privilege to be earned.


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## kgdrum (Sep 30, 2021)

Especially here @VI-C the land of group-think impulse buying are you seriously asking a question or is this meant rhetorically? 😂


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## dcoscina (Sep 30, 2021)

I limited myself to using BBCSO last spring and wrote a couple Star Trek inspired cues which I really enjoyed and that were also very well received here. 

I recently received a review copy of another orchestra in a box which garnered some good buzz. While I like some of it, I have to say it doesn’t match BBCSO and just reinforces the whole “work with what you have” ideology. If, heaven forbid, I had to start over with sample library purchasing, I’d still choose BBCSO and Spectrasonics automatically. And of course Staffpad. Really, at the end of the day, they are enough for what I generally need out of a library. 

For big film score sound, that’s where i add Audio Imperia products because I really like them as well. And some OT.


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## dzilizzi (Sep 30, 2021)

Yes.


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## ummon (Sep 30, 2021)

I thought the ultimate reason is to get so inspired by a new library that you don't have to suffer anymore with your mediocre ideas. Suddenly you are composing this beautiful music with ease. No more sweat and tears. Everybody loves your music and you become rich and famous.


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## ChrisSiuMusic (Sep 30, 2021)

kgdrum said:


> Especially here @VI-C the land of group-think impulse buying are you seriously asking a question or is this meant rhetorically? 😂


How about BOTH


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## Markrs (Sep 30, 2021)

If I started over again.... 

Part of me things I should have stuck with piano and learning that, along with keyboard and choral style harmony. However, I would still have wanted to learn orchestration.

I think having StaffPad is excellent, not necessarily cheap if you get the extra libraries, but one you get them, you have all the basics you need.

I would still have got NI Komplete UCE as I got that for about $500 buying 2nd hand then upgrading, and it has so much I could need. The odd thing that is one of the first things I got, then ended up buying a lot extra.

I love BBC SO Pro, but for my abilities I could have stuck with Core for longer, but the upgrade price was very good.

I am happy I got EW Hollywood Orchestra and later the Opus version. Whilst another orchestra, they have a lot of articulations and the sound is drier than BBC SO, has Divisi, but is also able to be more film oriented.

That is still quite a bit of libraries, but is small compared to what I actually ended getting. My biggest "regret" is less sample libraries and more Mixing/Mastering plugins and FX. Too much was wasted on them.

The courses and books I have bought have been expensive too, costing over £1000, and I should have used some of them first before buying others, but in the long run I think they will offer better value than many of the sample libraries I own.


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## ummon (Sep 30, 2021)

dcoscina said:


> I limited myself to using BBCSO last spring and wrote a couple Star Trek inspired cues which I really enjoyed and that were also very well received here.


This is a brilliant idea - and it applies to many things. Although, it can be a pure hell when you are facing your limitations and lack of ideas while browsing through General Midi presets and trying to find an inspiration.


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## dzilizzi (Sep 30, 2021)

The thing is, the feeling you get from creativity is addictive. So anything that makes you feel more creative is going to be addictive. And? Some people are internally motivated while others need some external source to get their creative juices going. For most of us here, it will be VI libraries. Otherwise, why else be here?


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## b_elliott (Sep 30, 2021)

A tip for those hobbyists new to vi world lurking or wondering if you should pull the trigger and spend $$:

Tip 1: You can save yourself ten- or twenty-thousand $$ by deciding right now that you aren't trying to simulate or write orchestral music. A free library like BBC Discover could handle your needs for what you plan to do == smart savings.

Tip 2: Test for free your level of GAS. 
One could visit and download the free vcvrack modules to explore the eurorack-synth world on the cheap. Vcvrack is excellent open source material, lots of enthusiasts on board, plus its modules sound great.

As you explore vcvrack, notice if rather than sticking with the few fundamental modules, you have instead downloaded +500 or more free modules all of which require reading a manual + learning how to use. 

For $0 you'll know several things:
1. you collect waaaay more than you'll know how to use or have time to bother learning to use.

2. Translate that tonnage of free eurorack modules into $$. That represents the hit your wallet will take if you don't have the filters in place such as Chris describes in his video.

3. The upside: you'll learn about/play with eurorack synths. Maybe you'll decide on Cherry Audio (similar but not free) to better integrate with your DAW. Still reasonable, but you'll be much savvier as to your approach after the vcvrack test.

Cheers, Bill


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## easyrider (Sep 30, 2021)

Spitfire is like crack….😂


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## Macrawn (Sep 30, 2021)

I'm just glad I haven't gotten into too much analog gear. That is an even more expensive rabbit hole.


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## ChrisSiuMusic (Sep 30, 2021)

Macrawn said:


> I'm just glad I haven't gotten into too much analog gear. That is an even more expensive rabbit hole.


Same here XD


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## Bman70 (Sep 30, 2021)

dzilizzi said:


> The thing is, the feeling you get from creativity is addictive. So anything that makes you feel more creative is going to be addictive. And? Some people are internally motivated while others need some external source to get their creative juices going. For most of us here, it will be VI libraries. Otherwise, why else be here?


Hmm... it almost seems that libraries are moving further and further from making the user more creative, and instead serving us the creative visions of the developer. So many texture / arp / evolving pad sounds are really largely complete as is... Leaving us to just sit and press a key and smile, but with nothing significant to add. So, the more we seek the sense of creative satisfaction in these libraries that give us increasingly finished sounds, the less creatively satisfied we feel and the cycle requires more libraries to be stuffed in to fill the void. Lol. Just playing Dr. Phil's advocate.


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## Bman70 (Sep 30, 2021)

ka00 said:


> This thread was the final straw in getting me to buy this book called “Dopamine Nation”.
> 
> Read the first chapter and then decide for yourselves how familiar it seems.



Come on for $19 I could buy at least a few special sample deals.


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## dzilizzi (Sep 30, 2021)

Bman70 said:


> Hmm... it almost seems that libraries are moving further and further from making the user more creative, and instead serving us the creative visions of the developer. So many texture / arp / evolving pad sounds are really largely complete as is... Leaving us to just sit and press a key and smile, but with nothing significant to add. So, the more we seek the sense of creative satisfaction in these libraries that give us increasingly finished sounds, the less creatively satisfied we feel and the cycle requires more libraries to be stuffed in to fill the void. Lol. Just playing Dr. Phil's advocate.


Well, it does depend upon the libraries you buy.


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## Inventio (Sep 30, 2021)

dcoscina said:


> I find it exciting and just creatively fun to limit myself to a single library. When I review sample libraries that is my main criteria: can one write music using only that library?
> 
> I will say I’ve been enjoying the libertarian of Dorico using NotePerformer these days, or else Staffpad, where I get to focus on all of the rudiments of music rather than the production end of the spectrum.


I am experiencing the same. I am a fan of working in the DAW and enjoy all the aspects of music production... 

but Dorico + NotePerformer is giving me pure orchestration joy in this period. It puts me in a nice creative zone where I only focus on the challenges of composition.


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## dzilizzi (Sep 30, 2021)

dcoscina said:


> I find it exciting and just creatively fun to limit myself to a single library. When I review sample libraries that is my main criteria: can one write music using only that library?
> 
> I will say I’ve been enjoying the libertarian of Dorico using NotePerformer these days, or else Staffpad, where I get to focus on all of the rudiments of music rather than the production end of the spectrum.


I like to pick 5 libraries, preferably at least 2 I haven't used before and make a minute of music. When I say libraries, it is usually a section or a single instrument library. Though maybe I should take one of the Arks or Albions and do it that way as well. It gets me using libraries I forgot I had and makes me be creative. It's fun too.


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## hoxclab (Sep 30, 2021)

I only use a handful of third party plugins anymore rest is straight vst. I sold over $1300 worth of plugins this last month.


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## dzilizzi (Sep 30, 2021)

hoxclab said:


> I only use a handful of third party plugins anymore rest is straight vst. I sold over $1300 worth of plugins this last month.


Well, at least you can sell them.


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## Futchibon (Sep 30, 2021)

easyrider said:


> Spitfire is like crack….😂


So what does that make OT's Junkie XL?


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## el-bo (Sep 30, 2021)

easyrider said:


> Spitfire is like crack….😂


Having tried both, I'd disagree


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## el-bo (Sep 30, 2021)

b_elliott said:


> A tip for those hobbyists new to vi world lurking or wondering if you should pull the trigger and spend $$:
> 
> Tip 1: You can save yourself ten- or twenty-thousand $$ by deciding right now that you aren't trying to simulate or write orchestral music. A free library like BBC Discover could handle your needs for what you plan to do == smart savings.
> 
> ...


A great way to sniff out whether there is a hoarder lurking inside each of us


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## b_elliott (Oct 1, 2021)

Futchibon said:


> So what does that make OT's Junkie XL?


How 'bout Super $ize Me?


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## Jimmy Hellfire (Oct 1, 2021)

"Addiction" is a very strong word. Disregarding substance abuse, comparably few people are truly pathologically, clinically addicted. But, is VIC a meeting grounds for people with problematic and compulsive behavior (which in extreme cases can develop into a "true" addiciton)? Absolutely.


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## AndyP (Oct 1, 2021)

In the meantime I am so well equipped that new libraries have to be especially good to buy.
Some libraires I would probably not buy today, these are learnings that you make when you make impulsive purchases during sales.
Everything I need to work reasonably I have, which does not mean that there are some announcements that do not interest me.
What sounds good doesn't have to be easy to use, that's where I see the biggest shortcomings at the moment. Good results can be achieved with many libraries, the question is rather with what time expenditure and how annoyed one is at some point by bugs or awkward operation.

Good mixing skills currently interest me more than new libraries.


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## Soundbed (Oct 1, 2021)

VI-C has reawakened my addiction, (if that’s what it is) sure. 

I keep a spreadsheet with (lowest) prices for everything I “might want” and it totals them up.

The sum is a sobering reminder that I don’t *really* want/need much anymore. 

Everything gets a ranking of 1-3 and it becomes easier to sort out the “but I’ll be saving so much” impulse buys from tools that might actually provide a ROI.


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## AceAudioHQ (Oct 1, 2021)

I always buy stuff for a specific need and I’m starting to own all the libraries I need to make the music I want, but I’ve noticed many people who pretty much buy every library published and lots of people also seem to think all the new libraries are excellent, always the same people cheering in the threads how good a new release is even though it might be only mediocre. I don’t even know how they have money for everything, and I think some of the people don’t even make that much music, they just buy libraries 😆


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## Living Fossil (Oct 1, 2021)

ChrisSiuMusic said:


> As composers, we're attracted to sample libraries like flies to a sweaty headband. But why is that the case? Is GAS a real thing?


I'm not so sure about the comparison to flies; in my case it's maybe rather comparable to a volatile cat


Which means:

First, all in all emulating the orchestra in a DAW almost ever means: doing it instead of having real musicians performing the music. And that's a huge PITA in all those cases where there are no elements involved that would require the help of a computer (i.e. "normal orchestral" cues etc.)
It's somehow a miserable task to fine tune some stupid figurations etc. which would anyway sound much better when performed by a musician.
So, the main motivation in this kind of work to get at least a result that has the best ratio between spent effort and result.
However, working in the DAW also means that the project has a limited budget and therefore (realistically) a limited RoI. Which means: there has to be a relation between the two. And that's the reason while i'm not really interesting in learning permanently new libraries etc. If something works, i try to keep it. Also: I'm not interested in the last 5 percent of achievable realism if it requires an extreme amount of extra work.

Second, the fun when working in a DAW is much bigger when working on projects that in their very substance require a computer, be it because of the desired (hybrid) sound or the desired non-realism or whatever.
However, while there are libraries that offer such flavours (like the huge oversized ensembles à la 66 trombones or huge percussive ensembles etc.) I'm absolutely not interested in libraries that already have done the fun work. (Like granulised sounds, or sampled processed sounds etc.)
Synths, of course, are always fun to buy.

Third, since mangling sounds falls into the second category i really love to buy lots of effect plugins. There are some i use once in two years, but on that occasion i'm happy i have it. (like e.g. the Metric Halo reverb which has a "empty warehouse" preset that happens to be perfect for some occasions)
But also here, i try to keep a realistic balance to avoid loss of time.
(which can easily happen e.g. with lots of different amp simulations etc.)

TL;DR: I really enjoy working on projects in the DAW where the computer itself is the adequate instrument. Otherwise, working with good musicians is a much more satisfying thing...


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## hoxclab (Oct 1, 2021)

AceAudioHQ said:


> I always buy stuff for a specific need and I’m starting to own all the libraries I need to make the music I want, but I’ve noticed many people who pretty much buy every library published and lots of people also seem to think all the new libraries are excellent, always the same people cheering in the threads how good a new release is even though it might be only mediocre. I don’t even know how they have money for everything, and I think some of the people don’t even make that much music, they just buy libraries 😆


I think some people here with extra disposal cash have bought into the more samples you have the more quality your music but that isn't true at all. I'm going to show my age here a bit but does anyone remember Edirol Orchestral? You could make a masterpiece with that back in the day.


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## Denkii (Oct 1, 2021)

dzilizzi said:


> Yes.


Agreed


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## Denkii (Oct 1, 2021)

hoxclab said:


> I think some people here with extra disposal cash have bought into the more samples you have the more quality your music but that isn't true at all. I'm going to show my age here a bit but does anyone remember Edirol Orchestral? You could make a masterpiece with that back in the day.


Also agreed with everything you said including edirol. I loved that thing. I know that it is still used today by some folks and no one would know if you didn't tell anybody


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## Paulogic (Oct 2, 2021)

hmmm, libraries....

For some (and me sometimes) it is like this :


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## ControlCentral (Oct 2, 2021)

"Sample libraries. Are we addicted?​Yes. Thank you for coming to my TED Talk."


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## Learningtomix (Oct 2, 2021)

I have GAS. I find the best way for me to address this is to have a monthly budget for audio related shopping, and to try not to spend more than the budget allows. Larger purchases only ideally to be made by saving up front, or less ideally using the Paypal 'pay in 3' (months) service. Even so, BF sales will be a challenge!


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