# NY Compression on Strings?



## pixel (Jan 15, 2016)

Hi. Im working on mix now and I'm testing parallel compression on Cinematic Strings 2. I found that it helps to make them sound dense, especially basses and celli. 
I'm curious does this method is popular or it is known as absolutely bad practice. 
What you think about it?

It's not to kill all velocity/expression work done in arrangement stage but I I found that CS especially on low register have quite huge dynamic changes in sustain notes, which is kind problematic in dense arrangement parts. 
Not forgot to mention that I have used really fast release, like on attached picture


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## chrysshawk (Jan 17, 2016)

Don't see why one would do this. If sustained strings have a dynamic range, they do it because that's the point.


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## pixel (Jan 17, 2016)

But in arrangement with drums like bass drums and low toms, basses with 4-5dB random change in volume make mix in bass frequency range a disaster. Maybe that's why it's popular technique to use synthesizers to create low end.


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## dgburns (Jan 17, 2016)

Best to try,but go lightly cause too much compression will bring up the background noise,room,bow noise and stuff that you don't really want to showcase.
I'd ride the cc11 first to get that volume in line.then I'd print audio and ride the volume till I got where I wanted,with touch trim so you could go over the problem areas and refine to your hearts content.
I'd also bring the overall mix level down so the strings were present enough against the other instr.


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## ghostnote (Jan 17, 2016)

I'm not sure and please correct me when I'm wrong, but I think I read somewhere that Jeremy Soule is compressing his lower strings.


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## pixel (Jan 17, 2016)

dgburns said:


> Best to try,but go lightly cause too much compression will bring up the background noise,room,bow noise and stuff that you don't really want to showcase.
> I'd ride the cc11 first to get that volume in line.then I'd print audio and ride the volume till I got where I wanted,with touch trim so you could go over the problem areas and refine to your hearts content.
> I'd also bring the overall mix level down so the strings were present enough against the other instr.



Yes but i mean changes in volume level during single note which is not possible to control while midi editing especially with RR. I found that CineStrings are much better to control without need to crazy volume automation. Maybe it's just Cinematic Strings.
After all I changed compression to more gentle on my basses now.


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## EC2 (Jan 17, 2016)

Especially if you have a chunky ostinato rhythm going on that you want to solidify, then parallel compression is the way to go. Esp. some trailer mixers treat those like they would treat heavy palm mutes.


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## dgburns (Jan 17, 2016)

pixel said:


> Yes but i mean changes in volume level during single note which is not possible to control while midi editing especially with RR. I found that CineStrings are much better to control without need to crazy volume automation. Maybe it's just Cinematic Strings.
> After all I changed compression to more gentle on my basses now.



just a thought,but flatten out your velocities,and all else fails,use distortion.(yup read that right)


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## germancomponist (Jan 17, 2016)

pixel said:


> Yes but i mean changes in volume level during single note which is not possible to control while midi editing especially with RR. I found that CineStrings are much better to control without need to crazy volume automation. Maybe it's just Cinematic Strings.
> After all I changed compression to more gentle on my basses now.


Have you tried to handle this in the mapping editor in Kontakt Sampler? This I do always first when it comes to such a situation ... .


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## pixel (Jan 17, 2016)

Im not sure did I explained myself in right way. I try again. 
So, here is one single note of bass from CS2. Like you can see, amplitude vary from -10 to -18dB so it's difference around 8-10dB. It's a lot, especially on low notes, to deal with. It's not about orchestration, expression, velocity or any other CC. It's how these samples are recorded. 
Finally I got good results with Vari-Mu model in MJUC but I'm still curious about other parallel techniques on strings. Seems that it's not popular


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## germancomponist (Jan 17, 2016)

Huh, this looks not very good. As I said, with Melodyne now you can handle such things very well, but it costs money, sure. And the 30 days Trial could only help within the next 30 days ... . 
Can you post the audio of this note on the picture?
Another solution I would do is to insert a compressor into the bass track.


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## pixel (Jan 17, 2016)

I'm curious about new Melodyne


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## Hannes_F (Jan 18, 2016)

That is a nice lively note. The changes in volume might come from some bassists changing the bowing direction in-between.


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## germancomponist (Jan 18, 2016)

I think there is nothing wrong with this note, still alive.


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## Hannes_F (Jan 18, 2016)

pixel said:


> Im not sure did I explained myself in right way. I try again.
> So, here is one single note of bass from CS2. Like you can see, amplitude vary from -10 to -18dB so it's difference around 8-10dB. It's a lot, especially on low notes, to deal with. It's not about orchestration, expression, velocity or any other CC. It's how these samples are recorded.



I see regular repetitions coming from the looping of the samples, and within each period there are bow changes. If that bothers you especially in the basses then chances are that this could have been avoided in the recording session on request. It may be a bit much for some purposes and if that gets into the way then why not reduce the ebb and flow with mild compression at that point. I personally catch boomy notes with individual volume automation but that is easier with bounced stems.


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## pixel (Jan 18, 2016)

And this is what I have talk about  Compression but parallel mode in this example. I was curious do people use parallel technique on orchestra instruments. No more no less


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## neblix (Jan 21, 2016)

Parallel compression is for retaining clean signal transient detail to balance with squashed, harmonically distorted signals.

If you want to squash the strings to remove the dynamic range in the bowing, there's absolutely no purpose in parallel compression; because you'd be bringing back what you're expressively trying to remove.

Parallel compression is useful in drums because drum compression squashes transients. But then you bring the transients back in parallel to balance with the squashed drums, so you still have squashed, harmonically satisfying hits that still have their impact because of their transients.

I'd simply use a very slowly acting compressor; you don't want to be hearing weirdly timed gain and attenuation.

You can also use the plug-in Peak Rider instead, and match the volume of the strings to a constant amplitude signal (like a sine wave). That will do the job *much better* than any compression or manual editing methods.


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## EC2 (Jan 21, 2016)

Many pro mixers like Andrew Scheps use parallel compression exclusively on every track that needs compression. And yes, it is also used on orchestral instruments.


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## pixel (Jan 22, 2016)

neblix said:


> Parallel compression is for retaining clean signal transient detail to balance with squashed, harmonically distorted signals.



Yes it's the one of possibility but it's not rule. I'm not limiting myself to just few basic techniques. Experimentation is in my nature


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## neblix (Jan 22, 2016)

I wasn't giving general rules-based advice, I was talking about the very specific string bass note you posted and what parallel compression would do for you in that instance. The point was not that you're misappropriating NY compression (because I'm not really interested), the point is that I'm saying NY compression wouldn't solve the specific problem you're trying to solve (which is equalizing the string sustain over time).

Yes, NY compression is used everywhere, creatively or not, by professionals, yes... but that attests to if it's a cool, useful technique that gives good results when applied to many use cases. But I'm saying for this specific use case (sustained string note), it barely does anything for you and perhaps even is counter-productive.

There are, of course, other places and articulations in the orchestra where NY compression is useful or creative.

I apologize if it seemed like I was trying to limit the usage of NY compression earlier.


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## pixel (Jan 22, 2016)

Ah Ok now I get it  Yes actually for that purpose (bass note) I did normal compression with gentle vari-mu emulation


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