# Symphobia demos online!



## IvanP (Mar 12, 2008)

wow...listening as we speak...strings have been recorded 

http://www.projectsam.com/Home

And thks for doing a string section demo  these are playable instruments, right?

Timbre of the violins are really good, the attack may need a bit of work but it sounds really, really good....

Are the string dinamics pre-recorded or programmed?

Anyway, nice work, Maarten!


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## Christian Marcussen (Mar 12, 2008)

> SYMPHOBIA® is all the good stuff missing in other orchestral libraries. Featuring all-new orchestral recordings of strings, brass and woodwinds, SYMPHOBIA® gives you out-of-the-box, big, playable symphonic ensembles and cinematic effects. The library delivers extremely fast results and endless inspiration with the deadline-driven, modern day composer in mind. *Full string ensemble in numerous articulations, tutti orchestra sustains, staccatos and rips, aggressive violin section glissandi, horrific brass clusters and woodwind textures.* These are just a few examples of what SYMPHOBIA® has to offer.



Listen to the demo by Troels and you will hear a lot of the orchestra playing non-fx. 

So now we know what Sam strings will sound like


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## IvanP (Mar 12, 2008)

Christian Marcussen @ Wed Mar 12 said:


> So now we know what Sam strings will sound like



Then the next step should be a full Sam strings library!


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## Niah (Mar 12, 2008)

This library sounds like lots of fun.


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## lux (Mar 12, 2008)

i've only read this thread....please..tell me there is a sustain strings section sampled by the projectsams...please...


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## Frederick Russ (Mar 12, 2008)

Luca - there seems to be well recorded expressivo string samples that appear to have been programmed to respond to expression cc. Demos sound nice so far.


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## dannthr (Mar 12, 2008)

Sounds like Ensemble and FX patches like what they've already done with their WW orchestrators...

Meh.


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## Ed (Mar 12, 2008)

I AM BUYING THIS

*hopes it isnt too expensive..*

EDIT: SAM Harp? Oooh interesting.


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## Ed (Mar 12, 2008)

dannthr @ Wed Mar 12 said:


> Sounds like Ensemble and FX patches like what they've already done with their WW orchestrators...
> 
> Meh.



And thats not usefull? Theres much more than just FX I see. Those staccs and sustains are awsome. How can you listen to those demos and think, its just a bunch of fx?


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## Ned Bouhalassa (Mar 12, 2008)

Can't wait to get this. Great work by Troels!!! =o =o =o


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## Rob Elliott (Mar 12, 2008)

Nice demos (way to go Troels). The last one (farewell) shows the 'strings' exposed. With my current libraries anytime I use a minor second harmony with the violins up relatively high it gets 'thin' and 'phasey' - this pulls that off a lot better. Be interesting to track this library's progress to release.

Rob


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## nomogo (Mar 12, 2008)

I wonder if this includes the material from the exclusives?? 

Also any ideas on price yet?


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## Trev Parks (Mar 12, 2008)

Lovely sound and great demos. Is it so rich sounding straight out-of-the-box?.


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## dannthr (Mar 12, 2008)

Ed @ Wed Mar 12 said:


> dannthr @ Wed Mar 12 said:
> 
> 
> > Sounds like Ensemble and FX patches like what they've already done with their WW orchestrators...
> ...



I said "Ensemble and FX"

I'm not a fan of Ensemble/Tutti patches, that's all. There's more flexibility in separated patches for me and copy and pasting MIDI data across the sections is no big thing if I want tutti.

This, to me, feels like a product oriented toward music supervisors, not composers. It's all about: Get that movie feel fast and effortless. That's great. But I want to compose music.


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## Ed (Mar 12, 2008)

dannthr @ Wed Mar 12 said:


> Ed @ Wed Mar 12 said:
> 
> 
> > dannthr @ Wed Mar 12 said:
> ...



And yet look at those demos. Products like Symphonic Adventures or Scoring Tools is geared towards music supervisors. 

How can a music supervisor, not a composer, know how to use staccato and sustain patches? They know how to take fx and put them down, maybe. Thats it. Thats where the similarity ends.


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## Stephen Baysted (Mar 12, 2008)

Very impressive demos; sounds like a great addition and supplement to VSL and a god send to those of us who do adverts and need some quick fixes.


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## jc5 (Mar 12, 2008)

The sound is very good, though I'd be curious to see just what the articulations are and how the instruments are handled... I'm left a bit in doubt as to how much full on composition will be doable with this set... but if priced modestly, it would be worth having for those quick projects or spots where the recorded effects fit in.


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## Fernando Warez (Mar 12, 2008)

IvanP @ Wed Mar 12 said:


> Christian Marcussen @ Wed Mar 12 said:
> 
> 
> > So now we know what Sam strings will sound like
> ...



I hope so!


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## muziksculp (Mar 12, 2008)

Yes, .... A Project Sam Full Strings Library ! 

It's about time this becomes a reality... One of my requests for quite a while ... Project SAM full Strings library .. Please.

Any idea if "Symphobia" is related to the earlier announced "Movie Box" ? 

i.e. is "Symphobia" a part of "Movie Box" ?

So far "Symphobia" demos sound great, especially when you consider the number of tracks used, this can be quite a big time saver ! but there is a bit of a sacrifice in the strings detail, I agree, especially the attack portion of the strings, a bit more byte, and clarity would be nice to hear in these sections, maybe some more demos will demonstrate that this is possible ? 

A Project Sam (Full Strings library) is my #1 Wish list. Hopefully this will happen in the near future.

o/~ 

Cheers.


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## Niah (Mar 12, 2008)

muziksculp @ Wed Mar 12 said:


> Yes, .... A Project Sam Full Strings Library !
> 
> It's about time this becomes a reality... One of my requests for quite a while ... Project SAM full Strings library .. Please.
> 
> ...




Moviebox is now called symphobia....so it's the same.


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## Daniel James (Mar 12, 2008)

> Any idea if "Symphobia" is related to the earlier announced "Movie Box" ?



Im pretty sure they re-named The Movie Box to Symphobia.

Sounds amazing.

EDIT: Ha beat me to it :D

DaZ


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## David A (Mar 12, 2008)

First of all Maarten-excellent!

Id like to know how extensive the strings are in this library as the package seems to be an all-for-one one-for-all solution that may not address the need for a extensively sampled string library-Im hoping Id be able to use this in the same manner as EW/VSL, etc-rather than a 'given number of articulations' which although great for the sound quality, will become rather limiting.

Very impressive however. When IS this thing out? I may re-think my investments...

Dave.


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## Daniel James (Mar 12, 2008)

Its coming out July 2008. (there is more info in the pdf on the site)

DaZ


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## David A (Mar 12, 2008)

Hmm....so the subsequent release of a strings library will likely take place a significant while later.....Im hoping sooner.....OR that this product has an extremely flexible array of string samples to the point at which it basically is a string library+fx library+brass...

Dave.


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## handz (Mar 12, 2008)

Sounds yummy!


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## Hannesdm (Mar 12, 2008)

Lovely demos! Also the time given these demos have been created!

The logo of Symphobia is great too!

But I fear this thing won't be cheap, looking at the price of their exclusives.. :?


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## mducharme (Mar 12, 2008)

Unfortunately it's K2 only.. not multiformat like their other stuff :( I would have probably bought it if I could have used it in Giga.. disappointing


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## nomogo (Mar 12, 2008)

mducharme @ Wed Mar 12 said:


> Unfortunately it's K2 only.. not multiformat like their other stuff :( I would have probably bought it if I could have used it in Giga.. disappointing



Wow, thats a bummer. Pretty sure Maarten is a Giga guy, odd.

Still like to know if this covers stuff from the exclusives, or if its all different-


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## Niah (Mar 12, 2008)

ETM Dude @ Wed Mar 12 said:


> mducharme @ Wed Mar 12 said:
> 
> 
> > Unfortunately it's K2 only.. not multiformat like their other stuff :( I would have probably bought it if I could have used it in Giga.. disappointing
> ...



It's going to be released in a K2 player, so you will be able to use it even if you don't have kontakt.


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## zvenx (Mar 12, 2008)

this thing has my name written all over it, if it is reasonably priced.
rsp


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## germancomponist (Mar 12, 2008)

dannthr @ Wed Mar 12 said:


> I'm not a fan of Ensemble/Tutti patches, that's all. There's more flexibility in separated patches for me and copy and pasting MIDI data across the sections is no big thing if I want tutti.
> 
> This, to me, feels like a product oriented toward music supervisors, not composers. It's all about: Get that movie feel fast and effortless. That's great. But I want to compose music.



On their website they say: "The library delivers extremely fast results and endless inspiration with the deadline-driven, modern day composer in mind."

*Oops, what is in their opinion a deadline-driven, modern composer? Is a modern composer someone who for reasons of time only cook with ready meals?* :mrgreen: 

_....remids me to the days when True-Strike came out and we have heared it on the most TV-movietracks then for a long time... . _ o


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## mathis (Mar 13, 2008)

germancomponist @ Thu Mar 13 said:


> _....remids me to the days when True-Strike came out and we have heared it on the most TV-movietracks then for a long time... . _ o



This inevitably will come with this library. I already hear countless "Tatort"s sounding the same...


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## Waywyn (Mar 13, 2008)

Drop dead beautiful sound! This will be a no brainer for sure!


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## Craig Sharmat (Mar 13, 2008)

there are a lot of advantages to this kind of library. It will rarely sound synthy as it is ensemble playing. Also to create these kind of ensembles with traditional libraries there is a a buildup of noise unless the smaller sections were made without noise reduction (which often sterilizes samples). not sure how deep the arts are, and certain fx will get used over and over but for ensemble playing i think the realism will be unprecedented because of the approach. Of course fx can be hidden well in tracks if you are crafty so this should be very useful.


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## Jack Weaver (Mar 13, 2008)

Perhaps this library will dovetail nicely with Melodyne's DNA.


.


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## jorgen (Mar 13, 2008)

yes an articulation list would be interesting. 

And GIGA format please.


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## synthetic (Mar 13, 2008)

Sounds fabulous. Another winner to be sure. 

And another vote for a Giga version.


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## Ed (Mar 13, 2008)

synthetic @ Thu Mar 13 said:


> And another vote for a Giga version.



Yea me too. :? Would be nice if it used the special filters.


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## mducharme (Mar 13, 2008)

According to Maarten they are using Kontakt scripting in it.. not sure if what the scripts do is something that Giga iMIDI can do. :?:


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## nomogo (Mar 13, 2008)

Maybe they are waiting for GS4?


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## Ed (Mar 13, 2008)

mducharme @ Thu Mar 13 said:


> According to Maarten they are using Kontakt scripting in it.. not sure if what the scripts do is something that Giga iMIDI can do. :?:



It probably can, but they are put off cos its Giga most likely. It would have to be pretty captain insano for Giga not to be able to do it. And as far as I know Gigas filters are supa dupa cool.


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## Aaron Sapp (Mar 13, 2008)

+1 for GIGA.


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## mducharme (Mar 13, 2008)

Aaron Sapp @ Thu Mar 13 said:


> +1 for GIGA.



Hopefully ProjectSAM is listening to all these "+1 for GIGA"s.


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## Frederick Russ (Mar 13, 2008)

I look forward to working with the K2 scripting personally. The fact that I'm on 3 Macs has nothing to do with that decision  

Seriously though, SIPS & TKT are mighty fine options for some choice scripting and deep programming.


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## choc0thrax (Mar 13, 2008)

YAYAYAY STRINGS. Wonder what the price is.


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## Peter Emanuel Roos (Mar 13, 2008)

+1 GIGA

and I wonder if the strings are new recordings or if the lib contains lego-like building blocks created using the PP lib...


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## Evan Gamble (Mar 14, 2008)

Peter Roos @ Fri Mar 14 said:


> +1 GIGA
> 
> and I wonder if the strings are new recordings or if the lib contains lego-like building blocks created using the PP lib...



That would be against NDA so no. Has to be new.


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## Hannesdm (Mar 14, 2008)

Also on their site, they say: _"Featuring *all-new orchestral recordings *of strings, brass and woodwinds..."_


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## Mark Belbin (Mar 14, 2008)

I gotta chuck in another +1 Giga here. Though by now it should be implied. :D 

Belbin


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## Craig Sharmat (Mar 14, 2008)

Peter Roos @ Thu Mar 13 said:


> +1 GIGA
> 
> and I wonder if the strings are new recordings or if the lib contains lego-like building blocks created using the PP lib...



Highly unlikely for a number of reasons.
First Maarten is a standup guy and would not use recordings he is legally bound not to use.
2nd, I am sure Project Sam is into developing their own sound and would not want to use recordings from a unrelated space or recording technique.


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## Ed (Mar 14, 2008)

Mark Belbin @ Fri Mar 14 said:


> I gotta chuck in another +1 Giga here. Though by now it should be implied. :D
> 
> Belbin



Whoa Mark, do like Giga or something? :D


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## Mark Belbin (Mar 14, 2008)

Ed @ Fri Mar 14 said:


> Whoa Mark, do like Giga or something? :D



Where on earth did you hear that? Who is spreading this horrible misinformation!?

On a serious note, Congrats to the SAM team on what looks and sounds like a super cool release!

-B


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## Leandro Gardini (Mar 14, 2008)

No three mic position :shock: ???

The demos sound wonderful!!!


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## Fernando Warez (Mar 14, 2008)

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## choc0thrax (Mar 14, 2008)

I'm guessing nobody has heard of what the price might be?


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## Christian Marcussen (Mar 14, 2008)

My guess: €/$ 399


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## Niah (Mar 14, 2008)

Christian Marcussen @ Fri Mar 14 said:


> My guess: €/$ 399



don't give them any ideas chris

my guess: 100 euros !! :mrgreen:


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## Ed (Mar 14, 2008)

Christian Marcussen @ Fri Mar 14 said:


> My guess: €/$ 399



Hopefully less though


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## _taylor (Mar 14, 2008)

Demos sound great!

=o


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## midphase (Mar 14, 2008)

"Another giga vote... and honestly using this type of library (from what I currently think it is) in a locked player doesn't seem very convenient.. "

Actually although K3 Player is somewhat limited in editing (although still quite comprehensive), you can easily access all of the parameters and individual samples with the full Kontakt 3 which by now many of us have.

Also, if it was released on GS, it would probably have been released as a GVI instrument which would suffer from the same restrictions and have the added bonus of not being Mac compatible.

I think that if such strong past GS supporters as the SAM team has decided to fully embrace the Kontakt engine....that should tell you something!


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## midphase (Mar 14, 2008)

I'm still not sure what this library really is and what it does include. If it's a comprehensive orchestral phrases library and sectional sustains and staccatos, then $399 sounds like wishful thinking to me!

Anyone had a chance to attend the presentation at MusikMesse? I think we need some hands-on reports!


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## Jack Weaver (Mar 14, 2008)

Yeah...where's Batzdorf anyway?

I wonder if German beer has anything to do with his disappearance? Apparently he's fallen down on the job!

.


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## synthetic (Mar 14, 2008)

If you'd like Batsdorf's take on Symphobia, you'll probably have to buy the next copy of Virtual Instruments magazine. 

And GVI will be bi-platform in a month.


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## Jack Weaver (Mar 14, 2008)

You're too late.

I'm already a subscriber.

Looking forward to GVI Mac. I've been waiting on Plectrum for a long time. 


.


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## germancomponist (Mar 14, 2008)

Today I was at Musikmesse and listend to their demonstration.

The sound is very great, the progrumming of this library is more like the Roland XV5080- or older EMU-Sampler-Patches. Reminds me also to the big string patches from EWQLSO and Sonivoxmi string and brass downloadable gvi instruments.

But, as I said, the sound is very great!  

Gunther


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## Niah (Mar 14, 2008)

germancomponist @ Fri Mar 14 said:


> Today I was at Musikmesse and listend to their demonstration.
> 
> The sound is very great, the progrumming of this library is more like the Roland XV5080- or older EMU-Sampler-Patches. Reminds me also to the big string patches from EWQLSO and Sonivoxmi string and brass downloadable gvi instruments.
> 
> ...



price? 

size of the library?

pc requirements?

what articulations are available for each ensemble?

are there mic positions?

:mrgreen:


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## midphase (Mar 14, 2008)

"And GVI will be bi-platform in a month. "

Did I mention wishful thinking? We'll see, but as a general point I try not to jump right into the 1.0 versions for my professional setup. If the first release is anything like PLAY, it might be a year or more before GVI is actually useable on the Mac.

We'll see!


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## midphase (Mar 14, 2008)

"the progrumming of this library is more like the Roland XV5080- or older EMU-Sampler-Patches."

What does that mean?


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## Niah (Mar 14, 2008)

midphase @ Fri Mar 14 said:


> "the progrumming of this library is more like the Roland XV5080- or older EMU-Sampler-Patches."
> 
> What does that mean?




hahaha I don't know either, but that doesn't sound too good


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## germancomponist (Mar 14, 2008)

Oops,

I mean the downloadable sonivox dvi instruments like this one: http://www.sonivoxmi.com/ProductDetail.asp?Item=SymphonicBrassV2

So today they said ist`s only for Kontakt 2

About programming: it is more layering with different instruments, like we did it at our old EMU days or in the Roland XV. 

This means not that layering is bad, I always do this in my sequencer too. Fast "ready to go" patches with a very grat sound!


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## janila (Mar 15, 2008)

Christian Marcussen @ Fri Mar 14 said:


> My guess: €/$ 399


Haven't you seen the current exchange rates? Dollar is funny money these days.  Those figures would be more like 399 € / 599 $ but that's too much for a string pad and couple of orchestral effects. Either the product has to offer a lot more than it seems at this point or it has to be cheaper. Or I just won't buy it. >8o


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## Christian Marcussen (Mar 15, 2008)

hehe right. The exchange rates are crazy 

But my guess is that it will be in the same price range as True Strike.


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## Daryl (Mar 15, 2008)

Christian Marcussen @ Sat Mar 15 said:


> hehe right. The exchange rates are crazy
> 
> But my guess is that it will be in the same price range as True Strike.


You guys really love to speculate. :lol: 

For some people it will always be too expensive, but if you need it, you will pay whatever it costs, and if you won't pay, you don't really need it.

D


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## Hannesdm (Mar 20, 2008)

Just watched a video about Maarten's presentation of Symphobia at the Messe on Chris Hein's website (Thanks Hein!)

This baby is looking sweet! Great add-on to 'normal' orchestral libraries.

Maarten said the library will be between 10 and 20GB. 
So I quess the price will be comparable with the True Strike series. (True Strike 1 is 17GB and True Strike 2 is 14GB)


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## Ed (Mar 20, 2008)

Hannesdm @ Thu Mar 20 said:


> Just watched a video about Maarten's presentation of Symphobia at the Messe on Chris Hein's website (Thanks Hein!)



link link!

EDIT: never mind I found it  And thankfully he was sensible not to use the stupid QT7 format. Maarten doesnt sound like I expected him to sound.


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## Hannesdm (Mar 20, 2008)

Go to http://www.chrishein.net/index.htm and go to the Musikmesse videos.

(Or see the thread: http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=9043 :wink: )

EDIT: You found it by yourself. Good job!  

And Maarten sounds like... well, a Dutch guy speaking english. :lol:


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## synthetic (Mar 20, 2008)

http://www.chrishein.net/musikmesse08/musikmesse08_seiten/musikmesse08_videos.htm (http://www.chrishein.net/musikmesse08/m ... videos.htm)


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## Chris Hein (Mar 20, 2008)

Its here:
http://www.chrishein.net

click on "video"

Symphobia is exactly what is missing in all the orchestral libraries I own.
Can't wait to get it.

BTW, here is a project I did last year for the European Space Agency ESA
using mostly SAM Horns and True Strike:
http://www.wizardserver.de/forum/ESA_An ... _Large.mov
http://www.wizardserver.de/forum/SpaceS ... _Large.mov

Chris Hein


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## Rob Elliott (Mar 20, 2008)

Nice Maarten. When you first started telling us about this 'ensemble' library I was honestly just thinking it would be ONLY used one of two ways

1. Quick sketches for client review of themes - general feel.
2. if 'samples' wasn't final product (score for live players)


The brass ensemble sounds like it could be used for a final product (that good of a sound.) Obviously this video can't give us the 'detail' we would like but it is promising.


Be sure to show us how you handle 'legato' - couldn't really tell on the horns/bones patch you demo'd (thinking the kind of legato sound out of VSL's epic horns).


You mentioned July? Have you considered a partial release with updates - got a project I could use the FX on in April. :D 


Really like your concept of 'filling in the gaps' of what is available now.


Best wishes on this.


Rob


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## Fernando Warez (Mar 20, 2008)

Looks like it's going to sound great. 

Unfortunately, I'm mostly interested in a good traditional strings library.


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## Justus (Mar 20, 2008)

Maarten, I love this Symphobia video!!
Great human sound! Seems to be a nice toy as well 

Best regards,
Justus


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## Reegs (Mar 20, 2008)

too cool!

choc0's straight on: What a sketchpad!

I want it! I want it!!



(stupid exchange rate...)


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## _taylor (Mar 20, 2008)

want !


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## Markus S (Mar 21, 2008)

I am pretty impressed by the video, I want this library rather today than tomorrow, but I have doubts about the musical approach of the whole thing. Orchstration is not just about doubling everything in every possible sense. When I play all the woodwinds, I know everything is doubled in any way, this certainly sounds fat, but I don't like the idea of giving the control of all this away. So many of the musical subtilities come from the many shades of the variation of the doublings. But I imagine the use very well for trailersque music, it will certainly gain us a lot of time : Just play some chords, and the super huge orchstration is ready.


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## Fernando Warez (Mar 25, 2008)

Do any of you know what he means by ensemble exactly? Those this means they've recorded violins and violas at the same time? So you cant just play the violins?


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## musicpete (Mar 25, 2008)

It looked exactely like that on the video. You seem to have ONE patch that goes over the whole range of your keyboard. The various sections of the string ensemble overlap at "logical" positions. Same with Woodwinds and Brass. Seems like a usable sketchpad solution.

I'm looking forward to hear the musical language in trailers/filmmusic even more reduced, now that we don't have to orchestrate any more to get brilliant sound. 

I want this too!

p.s.: Anyone else noticed how the live demo sounded far better than the DVZ strings disaster?


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## IvanP (Mar 25, 2008)

I didn't imagine the Ethno World video guy had such a sense of humour


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## choc0thrax (Mar 25, 2008)

I totally forgot about DVZ, did that get scrapped?


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## Nick Batzdorf (Mar 25, 2008)

Audio Impressions were there in a hotel room. I got a demo of the system just before leaving, so I didn't stop in there, but the strings are pretty much ready. It's very playable, and I heard some hard attack stuff that wasn't there last time I saw the system.

Unfortunately I'm not familiar with Chris' monitoring set-up, so I can't really say what it sounds like, but I can say that I didn't hear anything bad. Chris played some stuff that would have needed about two tweaks to be ready to go.

In any case, the concept is that you play it in and hand it to a copyist without worrying about perfecting the programming.

As to Maarten's new library, I'd buy it just for the hits. They're great. Markus, you have to look at this as an fx library to use with other stuff, not as orchestra soup. Of course you need individual lines for orchestration.


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## Waywyn (Mar 26, 2008)

Nick Batzdorf @ Wed Mar 26 said:


> Audio Impressions were there in a hotel room. I got a demo of the system just before leaving, so I didn't stop in there, but the strings are pretty much ready. It's very playable, and I heard some hard attack stuff that wasn't there last time I saw the system.
> 
> Unfortunately I'm not familiar with Chris' monitoring set-up, so I can't really say what it sounds like, but I can say that I didn't hear anything bad. Chris played some stuff that would have needed about two tweaks to be ready to go.
> 
> ...



Hey Nick,

thanks for the info on AI, but I am just asking myself why they care sooo much about the sound when the main concept is just to have played stuff "sheet ready" quickly ... I mean the Edirol orchestra would do it soundlike if it would have the articulations. Who cares if the samples are 192KHz when it's all about quick playing and hand out the stuff to the copyist.


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## musicpete (Mar 26, 2008)

Good point!


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## Craig Sharmat (Mar 26, 2008)

well you can't get the real time articulations and expression with edirol you can with AI. Also hopefully the sound quality is a huge improvement over Edirol. The goal is to play something that a director can hear and approve so you can go onto the copy stage. whether there is an advantage to someone who is a poor keyboard player like myself I can't say, but to a good KB player I can see it speeding up his/her work flow.

seems like this should be on another thread.


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## Ed (Mar 26, 2008)

Craig Sharmat @ Wed Mar 26 said:


> well you can't get the real time articulations and expression with edirol you can with AI. Also hopefully the sound quality is a huge improvement over Edirol. The goal is to play something that a director can hear and approve so you can go onto the copy stage. whether there is an advantage to someone who is a poor keyboard player like myself I can't say, but to a good KB player I can see it speeding up his/her work flow.
> 
> seems like this should be on another thread.



I think Alex' point is that if you're going to have 192k you'd expect it to actually sound good, except libs at 44k sound better. Something doesnt make sence somewhere.


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## Craig Sharmat (Mar 26, 2008)

i think the 192 thing was a dream, not practical.


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## Waywyn (Mar 26, 2008)

arg, I am sorry to Hijack another thread again, especially one of Maarten's 

I totally understand the points of being quick and be able to throw something out real quick and I am not saying that Edirol could do this articulationwise NOW.

I am just saying that the Edirol could do it soundwise. So add some decent programming to it, make all the articulations with good synthesis, get a cool divisi system done, add some nice reverb and you are set.

No need for "23 PCs and a 4mio Dollar setup" only to show a producer how it's going to sound. Just one honest question: Did someone ever had a producer saying: "Man, you know, there are actually 28 strings playing at this one spot. This is too thick and it's not going to work." ... ??? 

Then you do the same with AI and he goes: "Brilliant! Now the divisi is exactly as it has to be."

I recently finished lots of tracks as previews for a company. The soundtrack was recorded with real orchestra a few weeks later .... but the main issues the producer had during the process was stuff like:

- Trumpets sound a bit stiff on a few parts, but well, I know you are using samples. It going to kick azz with the real stuff.

- High strings sound a bit sharp, but okay, will sound cool with real strings

...

Now, to come back to topic and leaving the DVZ stuff aside and just talking soundwise. As from the demos I can hear that Symphobia will be absolutely smashing. Not only that it has FX and stuff, but the string sound is just way overcool!


----------



## Ed (Mar 26, 2008)

Waywyn @ Wed Mar 26 said:


> I recently finished lots of tracks as previews for a company. The soundtrack was recorded with real orchestra a few weeks later .... but the main issues the producer had during the process was stuff like:
> 
> - Trumpets sound a bit stiff on a few parts, but well, I know you are using samples. It going to kick azz with the real stuff.
> 
> - High strings sound a bit sharp, but okay, will sound cool with real strings



The irony is, if you did it with Audio Impressions they would more likely complain about the strings.


----------



## choc0thrax (Mar 26, 2008)

If you used AI, instead of saying the high strings sound sharp he'd be like "yeah uhh hmmm you're fired" haha.


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Mar 26, 2008)

Choc, I'm sorry, but you really need to think about other human beings before you post. One day you're going to contribute something useful to the world, and I hope you don't have to endure some kid tossing off years of your hard work with a snide comment. These guys may have had some failures on the way, but they've poured heart, soul, and lots of money into an unbelievably ambitious project. You haven't seen their system from anywhere closer than 2000 miles away, and you haven't heard it for a year. I think they deserve more credit than that whether or not the product lives up to its potential. It's not like they've been selling crap and taking peoples' money all along, they've been working hard on their system. Let's give them a chance.

Alex, of course I didn't mean to say that *all* they care about is quick and dirty mock-ups, just that it's part of the concept. Obviously they've set the bar a lot higher than that or they'd have been on the market ages ago. That system has a lot of interesting ideas, starting with the concept of building up string sections in 2-desk increments, with a slider to program in the amount of imprecision as you move back in the section. You don't care about that - or automatic divisi for that matter - if all you want is a Sound Canvas!


----------



## choc0thrax (Mar 26, 2008)

Nick Batzdorf @ Wed Mar 26 said:


> One day you're going to contribute something useful to the world



Highly doubt that.


----------



## Ed (Mar 26, 2008)

Well Nick, if they have improved the system and sounds after a year then thats great, but right now all we have are a few crappy poor quality live demos and a fancy website with big talk and a gigantic price point. Its kind of annoying they could be so out of touch they think it sounds good and wasted all that money they could have spent making really good samples. The only reason people are defending the soundseems to be because its not Gary and its not marketed to newbies like GPO. If Gary did the same thing people wouldnt bat an eye lid here to say what everyone really thinks about it, ie, it sounds bad.


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Mar 26, 2008)

Oh, I wasn't talking to you, Ed, I was responding to Choc's comment.

But I actually think with Gary it's the opposite! If you read Northernsounds - which I haven't done for a very long time - you'll see that he's considered a sampling rock star.


----------



## Daryl (Mar 26, 2008)

Nick, rather than hijack this thread, is there any news that you could impart about AI on another thread? Whilst I wouldn't want to dis anyone's years of hard work, there is so much unproven stuff in their claims that an update might be appreciated.

D


----------



## Frederick Russ (Mar 26, 2008)

Craig Sharmat @ Wed Mar 26 said:


> i think the 192 thing was a dream, not practical.



Probably. Personally I've wondered if 192k is less forgiving than 44k in terms of shrilly metallic sharpness tendencies in samples of high strings. My sense of it however is that the recording - any raw recording - is actually capturing perfectly the sound of the room - regardless of bandwidth. If the room + mics + positioning + signal chain + engineering talent isn't gelling together at 100%, the increased bandwidth really won't matter other than capturing what is already there - warts and all. (The flip side is that if it does gel, it will matter - eventually).


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Mar 26, 2008)

Daryl, please see my earlier post in this for the update, minimal as it is. I got to see a demo and fondle the system briefly at Chris' studio three weeks ago.

192? I personally would rather have four times the performance out of my computers.

But I'm going to start a new thread about 192, because there are some misconceptions and this is supposed to be a thread about Maarten's new library.


----------



## KingIdiot (Mar 27, 2008)

thumbs up guys!

it'll be really usefull for alot of types of projects. Though, at some point there will be need for symphobia pt 2 when all the sounds have been used on every project known to man 

great work tho, so far! Sounds like a winner, and something that will move tons of units! Remind me to have you guys buy lunch when I see you!


----------



## germancomponist (Apr 5, 2008)

Waywyn @ Thu Mar 27 said:


> Imagine a very very big car company which announces a new generation of cars ... and then you see a presentation video while a guy with a cam sitting inside the car filming out the front window



LOL :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


----------



## johncarter (Apr 19, 2008)

The demos sound great , nice dutch product again 8) 

One of the demos sound exactly like king arthur or chevaliers de sangreal from hans zimmer.


At the same time, I can't help thinking that this kind of library will lower the musical level of film and TV scores and make the competition between composers even stronger. 

It will be like Stylus RMX or atmosphere, everybody knows how to use stylus RMX, it's really easy to use and you can make a decent music ( although unoriginal ) in 15 minutes.

Why advertising studios would hire a composer if they can do it with a few loops of RMX and some pads from symphobia ? They would do it themselves.

Hard times for composers my friends, hard times :D


----------



## Daryl (Apr 19, 2008)

johncarter @ Sat Apr 19 said:


> At the same time, I can't help thinking that this kind of library will lower the musical level of film and TV scores and make the competition between composers even stronger.
> 
> It will be like Stylus RMX or atmosphere, everybody knows how to use stylus RMX, it's really easy to use and you can make a decent music ( although unoriginal ) in 15 minutes.
> 
> ...


Well, in the "old" days, if you couldn't read music then you weren't a composer. Things have moved on with all these sample libraries, so I don't see this as being any different. Already most ad agencies can't tell good music from bad, so this product might even enhance the standard of music making. It will just all sound very similar, that's all. :lol: 

D


----------



## germancomponist (Apr 19, 2008)

johncarter @ Sat Apr 19 said:


> At the same time, I can't help thinking that this kind of library will lower the musical level of film and TV scores and make the competition between composers even stronger.
> 
> It will be like Stylus RMX or atmosphere, everybody knows how to use stylus RMX, it's really easy to use and you can make a decent music ( although unoriginal ) in 15 minutes.
> 
> ...



Smile, on their website they are telling that this will be a good library for the "*modern composer*". Ha, now I know what a modern composer is! :mrgreen:


----------



## Niah (Apr 19, 2008)

johncarter @ Sat Apr 19 said:


> Niah you're right about many things. RMX and atmosphere are wonderful tool.
> 
> My point was , with these tools you can easily make something that sounds PRO without really knowing something about music ( I'm not talking about self-taught composers here, because i am a self taugh composer and I have difficulties to read music )
> 
> ...




Hi John, ok now I understand were you were coming from with this.

It is certainly a vaild point, however I still believe that if you are a creative individual that does good music will always make better music with these tools than people who are not. In my view the better tools you have the better music you will make.

Symphonia sounds great out of the box but in the hands of a crafty composer who can create great music and is a skillful mixer and sound engineer will sound 10 times better than the competition. 


If producers and directors can't distinguish good music from bad it's not really these tools fault but the industry. And the fact is that most producers and directors will never choose music that it's better than their production.

but that's just my 2 cents anyway


----------



## billval3 (Apr 19, 2008)

Niah @ Sat Apr 19 said:


> Other orchestal libraries like VSL and SI have full ensemble patches and I don't see anyone complaining about. Except in these libraries the ensemble patches are just a much of patches but together.



I'm glad you mentioned that, Niah, because I was actually wondering what makes this product different than the ensemble patches in other libraries. Can someone explain, in further detail, what the differences are? Or do we still not know exactly what will be included?

I consider myself to be a beginning composer/orchestrator. What I like about this product (from what I've gathered so far) is not that it will help me make a better finished product. Rather, I'm gathering it will allow me to create a better mock-up without having to learn as much about using samples. That way I can spend more of my time learning more about working with real instruments.


----------



## Niah (Apr 19, 2008)

billval3 @ Sat Apr 19 said:


> Niah @ Sat Apr 19 said:
> 
> 
> > Other orchestal libraries like VSL and SI have full ensemble patches and I don't see anyone complaining about. Except in these libraries the ensemble patches are just a much of patches but together.
> ...



What makes the difference is how they were created.

On other libraries they have recorded individual sections of the orchestra like violins, violas, etc, and then have made ensemble patches by sticking these patches together, (nothing you couldn't it yourself btw). The reason stated for the creatin of these patches by the developers has been that they are useful mostly for sketching. Now the thing is that these patches don't sound quite like a full string ensemble playing.

On the other hand for this symphonia project sam has recorded a full string ensemble playing as well as brass, woods...the difference is in the sound mostly it actually has more depth and is more lively than previous efforts in my opinion.

Mind you that I'm just judging this through their demos and the musikmesse presentation.


----------



## FireGS (Apr 20, 2008)

SYMPHO*B*IA


----------



## musicpete (May 17, 2008)

So, does anyone know when this baby will be finished? 

Right now I am working on a quick mockup and the awful sounds of Sibelius 4 make me sick.... :( Symphobia is my hope for half-decent demos...


----------



## Niah (May 17, 2008)

musicpete @ Sat May 17 said:


> So, does anyone know when this baby will be finished?
> 
> Right now I am working on a quick mockup and the awful sounds of Sibelius 4 make me sick.... :( Symphobia is my hope for half-decent demos...



Hi musicpete,

Well in their press release they say it's July 2008.


----------



## musicpete (May 17, 2008)

Thank you! I must have overlooked that piece of information....


----------



## billval3 (May 25, 2008)

Do you need to own your own software sampler to use ProjectSAM's products or do they come with their own?


----------



## nomogo (May 25, 2008)

billval3 @ Sun May 25 said:


> Do you need to own your own software sampler to use ProjectSAM's products or do they come with their own?



Yes, most of their samples are for Gigastudio, Kontakt, or EXS24 (which comes with Logic). You must own one of these three platforms to use their samples.


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## Ed (May 25, 2008)

FireGS @ Sun Apr 20 said:


> SYMPHO*B*IA


----------



## choc0thrax (May 25, 2008)

I'm hoping there's going to be some more Symphobia info soon. Maybe an estimated price?? July isn't that far away. Symphobia and Omnisphere are coming to rescue me from a boring couple years of nothing interesting being released.


----------



## Niah (May 26, 2008)

choc0thrax @ Sun May 25 said:


> I'm hoping there's going to be some more Symphobia info soon. Maybe an estimated price?? July isn't that far away. Symphobia and Omnisphere are coming to rescue me from a boring couple years of nothing interesting being released.



Word!

Can't even remember the last time I saw something and said to myself....I need that !


----------



## choc0thrax (Jul 2, 2008)

Wellll it's Julyyyyyyyyyyyy. I think it's a good time to give us more info on Symphobia!!!!! East West is extending their upgrade sale thing for another 2 weeks, would be good to give us more info before they take everyone's money.


----------



## midphase (Jul 2, 2008)

bump!

Come on Maarten...at least give us a date for the announcement!


----------



## musicpete (Jul 2, 2008)

Be patient! Didn't you read my post? You have to wait until the 31st for the announcement.


----------



## choc0thrax (Jul 3, 2008)

Well looking through my English/developer dictionary I see that very soon translates to 'not very soon'.


----------



## Chaim (Jul 4, 2008)

This is what my dictionary says:


soon |soōn|
adverb
1 in or after a short time : 

• early 

2 used to indicate one's preference in a particular matter
o=<


----------



## janila (Jul 8, 2008)

Does anyone know if the Project SAM downloadable woodwind libraries are included in Symphobia?


----------



## nomogo (Jul 8, 2008)

janila @ Tue Jul 08 said:


> Does anyone know if the Project SAM downloadable woodwind libraries are included in Symphobia?



I've been asking this for a while and haven't gotten a response... can anyone from SAM answer this?

Thanks (o)


----------



## Vision (Jul 8, 2008)

For my sake I hope not. If so, I just blew about $450 bucks. :|


----------



## tmhuud (Jul 8, 2008)

I really doubt very much that it would be included in symphobia.


----------



## Aer Gui Ta (Jul 9, 2008)

I understand that Project Sam intended to incorporated some of the woodwind recordings in Symphobia, however they intended to "use/program" them in a "different way".


----------



## musicpete (Jul 10, 2008)

Sounds interesting!

I really hope there will be plenty of String and Brass clusters programmed in the same brilliant way as in the already released Woodwind effects. I used those in a score I did last month and was able to pull off some great stuff. This was completely impossible before. Let's see if they can repeat the same thing for string and brass sections.


----------



## Ed (Jul 10, 2008)

Well Im sure some at least of whats in the woodwind libraries are in Symphobia, unless they did new recordings for just that.


----------



## sevaels (Jul 10, 2008)

I'm stoked for this thing......come on guys get a move on!


o-[][]-o


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## musicpete (Jul 11, 2008)

Ed @ 10.7.2008 said:


> Well Im sure some at least of whats in the woodwind libraries are in Symphobia, unless they did new recordings for just that.



In that case I would greatly appreciate an upgrade path for owners of the Woodwinds libraries. I'd hate having to pay twice for the same samples.


----------



## Rob Elliott (Jul 11, 2008)

musicpete @ Fri Jul 11 said:


> Ed @ 10.7.2008 said:
> 
> 
> > Well Im sure some at least of whats in the woodwind libraries are in Symphobia, unless they did new recordings for just that.
> ...





Peter - totally agree. I think Maarten and crew's track record has been fair on such things. I would expect us Woodwind owners will be happy with the upgrade path.


Rob


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## musicpete (Jul 11, 2008)

You are absolutely right. I certainly don't expect do be Steinberged by Maarten. Even the mere thought is ridiculous....


----------



## Aer Gui Ta (Jul 11, 2008)

There has been an indication that they will have an offer for Woodwind Exclusive licensees.


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## Jack Weaver (Jul 11, 2008)

Dear Mr. Air Guitar, 

Hmm.... so sensitively stated with a sprinkling of ultimate insider assurance.


----------



## janila (Jul 11, 2008)

My left tentacle is sensing that getting the downloadable libraries might not be the best idea right now. (o)


----------



## choc0thrax (Jul 11, 2008)

Hmmm wonder where those new demos are. Supposedly all their current demos took between 1-4 hours to make, you'd think they could churn out a few of those a day. ~o)


----------



## janila (Jul 11, 2008)

That's a very good point Choco. I might have to skip sleeping to be able listen to all those demos when they release them all at once.


----------



## Jack Weaver (Jul 11, 2008)

janila,

I wouldn't let Jesse Jackson get anywhere near that left tentacle of yours.


----------



## Rob Elliott (Jul 11, 2008)

Jack Weaver @ Fri Jul 11 said:


> janila,
> 
> I wouldn't let Jesse Jackson get anywhere near that left tentacle of yours.




ROFL - Jack :wink:


----------



## ProjectSAM (Jul 14, 2008)

Hi people,

We have a bunch of new demos ready but we're releasing everything in one go.

Our website is currently being prepared to hold all release info (and the new demos)... we're almost there.

All the best,
Maarten


----------



## Elfen (Jul 14, 2008)

Great, can't wait for the demos and the price tag :mrgreen:


----------



## RiffWraith (Jul 15, 2008)

Hal @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> as u r preparing the site would be great if u make the Demos available for download like the other symphobia demos,i would like to download listen on the studio monitors,and keep a copy on my HD
> i dont like that TS and sam exclusivs demos r only for streaming online
> 
> i beleive with all the people waiting now Project SAM site will be down for a week after the release !!



When you "stream" - you are actually listening to the files from your HD. Therefore, the term stream is incorrect - there is no such thing in reality. The files are in you Temp Int Files folder until you navigate away fron the site.

Cheers.


----------



## JustinW (Jul 15, 2008)

> ... we're almost there.



Nice! Hope its weeks rather than months





RiffWraith @ Tue Jul 15 said:


> When you "stream" - you are actually listening to the files from your HD. Therefore, the term stream is incorrect - there is no such thing in reality. The files are in you Temp Int Files folder until you navigate away fron the site.



Such a relevant post. ~o)


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## Hal (Jul 15, 2008)

LOL no actually RiffWraith was writing that,commenting on me asking project sam to make the Demos available for dowload,and not making an online stream thx RiffWraith  but i still want the downloads 8)


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## RiffWraith (Jul 15, 2008)

JustinW @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> RiffWraith @ Tue Jul 15 said:
> 
> 
> > When you "stream" - you are actually listening to the files from your HD. Therefore, the term stream is incorrect - there is no such thing in reality. The files are in you Temp Int Files folder until you navigate away fron the site.
> ...



Yup - 25 allright.


----------



## Ed (Jul 15, 2008)

RiffWraith @ Tue Jul 15 said:


> Hal @ Wed Jul 16 said:
> 
> 
> > as u r preparing the site would be great if u make the Demos available for download like the other symphobia demos,i would like to download listen on the studio monitors,and keep a copy on my HD
> ...



What about streaming radio?


----------



## RiffWraith (Jul 15, 2008)

Eh, except radio. :lol: 

I guess it would have been better if I specified that that applies to files being obtained from another server, and not live broadcasts. DOH!


----------



## janila (Jul 16, 2008)

The new demos are up.

Rather nice I'd say. 

edit:

"We are currently updating our site" 8)


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## janila (Jul 16, 2008)

Nah, false alarm. Just the demos and Harp. No info about Symphobia. (o) My right tentacle hurts from clicking the refresh button. BTW can I reroute the refresh function to another key in case the F5 button breaks?


----------



## dogforester (Jul 16, 2008)

Could be a new price structure, Their brass package has seen and increase to 39,999.00 euros. >8o 

http://www.projectsam.com/Products/Orchestral-Brass/


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## choc0thrax (Jul 16, 2008)

Wish they had a version for like $999.00 with just the brass and strings. Very smart putting up a POTC demo, all those Zimmer clones parents have the cash to buy this lib. Did Gabriel Shadid get a free copy of Symphobia for that Cursed Treasure demo?


----------



## nomogo (Jul 16, 2008)

dogforester @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> Could be a new price structure, Their brass package has seen and increase to 39,999.00 euros. >8o
> 
> http://www.projectsam.com/Products/Orchestral-Brass/




They must have switched to Yen.... (o)


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## Cinesamples (Jul 16, 2008)

Maarten, 

Congrats, Symphobia looks great! I was wondering how extensive the RR is especially in the strings and brass?

Looking forward to using it!

MP


----------



## dogforester (Jul 16, 2008)

Well whatever price it ends up, It does sound great and I do want it.


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## synthetic (Jul 16, 2008)

I found all of the info up there. Click on the links at the top of the description for the other pages of info, PDF of included samples and presets, and much more info. Click on the demo player at the top right corner to hear the new demos. It's just not obvious because they got clever with their flash programming. Intro pricing is on their homepage. 

It sounds very nice. At first I also thought it was overpriced, but the demos sound very BIG. Not sure if I could get that big of a sound using SI or VSL, maybe with better mixing. If I was scoring a TV show this would be a no-brainer. Quick, someone hire me to score a TV show and give me the excuse to buy it.


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## Peter Alexander (Jul 16, 2008)

39,999 Euros is over $50,000US based on the current exchange rate. 

I hope this is a typo.


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jul 16, 2008)

I wish there were more velocity layers for stuff like the brass and strings. Sounds good, but all things considered in think I'll pass this time around.... perhaps... I don't know. I was hoping these section strings and brass would be more substantial. But I guess for trailer music and similar it should suffice.


----------



## Jack Weaver (Jul 16, 2008)

OK, it's out (well, shortly anyway). Congrats. 

I ordered it. It's everything it was advertized to be and it's not all the things it says it wouldn't be. (huh?)

Let's give Maarten and crew about a week of down time. Then let's start demanding they give us a real string library. One with all the wonderful ambiance that their brass have - but with better programming. Maybe they can be the first ones to solve the ambiance/legato issue. 

Keep up the good work guys!


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## RiffWraith (Jul 16, 2008)

choc0thrax @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> Wish they had a version for like $999.00 with just the brass and strings. Very smart putting up a POTC demo, all those Zimmer clones parents have the cash to buy this lib. Did Gabriel Shadid get a free copy of Symphobia for that Cursed Treasure demo?



Ha ha - if that doesn't sound like a POTC reject, I don't know what does! :lol:


----------



## janila (Jul 16, 2008)

choc0thrax @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> Did Gabriel Shadid get a free copy of Symphobia for that Cursed Treasure demo?


That piece is propably something like fifteen notes with Symphobia. I'll promice twice that for a free copy!


----------



## Colin O'Malley (Jul 16, 2008)

Get you some Shadid:

http://www.epicscore.com/


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## midphase (Jul 16, 2008)

Pricing is a bit steep, but not as out of touch as some "other" developers.

Knowing the quality that these guys put into their stuff, I would think this is probably worth more than other similarly-priced collections.

I think what Symphobia essentially is, is a version of a custom library that we've seen some of the members around here go and make, except available to the masses.

As far as the Hans Zimmer comparison...I think it's not just a coincidence that Symphobia, like Hans himself and his famed LSO custom library, uses a similar type of "ensemble" approach.

I'll probably pick this one up as soon as my next crappy-paying-art-film project gets underway!


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## synthetic (Jul 16, 2008)

Price is 899 Euro / 1349 US dollars

Easy to miss being on the HOMEPAGE and all. Sheesh.


----------



## musicpete (Jul 16, 2008)

Seeing the price tag gave me a good laugh... This library obviously is aimed at the big players in the business.

I wish them the best of luck with it. They deserve the success.


----------



## Pzy-Clone (Jul 16, 2008)

nah the price isnt that high...people seem to forget what we had to pay for even just a mediocre hardware sampler or workstation back in tha days. You dont get nothin for nothing, you know.

BUT, im wondering more about why the logo for Symphobia looks like a symphonic extreme metal band lol. 

Well, good that they cha-cha-changed the name from MOVIE BOX. That was a dreadful name.


----------



## Hal (Jul 16, 2008)

want the truth?
its better that way,less of the sales of that thing is better.
i mean i was expecting 750 $ but now after they added a preoder option 1350 and 150 discount for the complete woods owners then 1200 $ i would ve payed 1000 without complaining now am paying 200 more and trying not to complain.
its fair.u know whats not fair,selling somthing like this at 350 $ then u will stop using it after 2 months because everybody on eath ve got it from amators to pro and u hear it in everything 10 times a day from cinematic trailers and tv series passing by adds and web sites,i dont wana see this library dying in a couple of month.i see this to be clever from project Sam instead of targeting the mass they r tageting some quality composers a smaller number and getting enough money from them,however i beleive 1000 was fair.


----------



## dogforester (Jul 16, 2008)

> Price is 899 Euro / 1349 US dollars
> 
> Easy to miss being on the HOMEPAGE and all. Sheesh.



I knew the price when I posted, Just thought It might be a typo like the brass package is at the moment. Mind you a high price tag might stop it from being used by everyone every three seconds or something.


----------



## RiffWraith (Jul 16, 2008)

dogforester @ Thu Jul 17 said:


> ..a high price tag might stop it from being used by everyone every three seconds or something.



This is true - as less people buy it. But is that the idea PSam has? "We don't want our libs to get boring quickly!" or are they trying to sell as many units as possible?


----------



## synthetic (Jul 16, 2008)

They're probably out a lot of capital from hiring and recording an orchestra and then editing them for a year.


----------



## RiffWraith (Jul 16, 2008)

Hal @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> LOL no actually RiffWraith was writing that,commenting on me asking project sam to make the Demos available for dowload,and not making an online stream thx RiffWraith  but i still want the downloads 8)



HERE:

http://www.projectsam.com/files/press/symphobia_newmusicdemos.zip (http://www.projectsam.com/files/press/s ... cdemos.zip)


----------



## Niah (Jul 16, 2008)

Guys, 899 euros seems to me like a very fair price for what you get in terms of content and features.

If some of you have to pay 1349 dollars for this library that's a currency issue, it has nothing to do with Project Sam.


----------



## Pzy-Clone (Jul 16, 2008)

synthetic @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> They're probably out a lot of capital from hiring and recording an orchestra and then editing them for a year.



But its true, the price of a product has to be set accord to its development costs, in order for the product to actualy be profitable for the developer.

Everyone would like lowpriced products,. but a big underataking in terms of development costs also has to have a price tag that makes it worthwhile for the manufacturer to produce it in the first place.

So if they price an expensive production too low, they risk not getting their investments covered, even tho more people might buy it.
So with something like ths, they are counting on a fair number of semi-pro to pro people bying it regardless of a few hundred dollars give or take, so i would asume its safer for them or anyone to get some revenue back with a higher pricetag, since the segment they are selling it to are probably willing to pay whatver they charge for it.

They probably took the costs, and divided them towards a expected minimum of sales, and hence the price tag.

So they are pobably not xpecting to sell this by the bucketloads, or else the price would have been set lower i think.


----------



## dogforester (Jul 16, 2008)

Just to be clear I don't think it's an unfair price. I wonder what the production cost is ?


----------



## Hal (Jul 16, 2008)

RiffWraith @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> Hal @ Wed Jul 16 said:
> 
> 
> > LOL no actually RiffWraith was writing that,commenting on me asking project sam to make the Demos available for dowload,and not making an online stream thx RiffWraith  but i still want the downloads 8)
> ...



thx x 1350 times riffWriath o-[][]-o i really apreciate this


----------



## Ed (Jul 16, 2008)

Does it come with a harp? Herman told he their harp library was cool and I wonder if this is going to come with one or if it will be an extra.

This will be so awsome. It will be so much easier to make things sound awesome. I can then always orchestrate it properly later if I have to, and also... I have to actually leave instruments out of scores at the moment because my system cant handle it and I cant be dealing with bouncing if I can help it. This will make things so much faster my god. My fu**ing god, seriously... a wave of extacy is flooding over me right now I swear to god, and I may have just had had a few drinks but damn, fu**k me I want this. 

Now I just need one thing. 

Money... I feel you close, stretch out and you will find me in the dark abyss... I am calling.


----------



## dogforester (Jul 16, 2008)

Ed @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> Does it come with a harp? Herman told he thgeir harp library was cool and I wonder if this is going to come with one or if it will be an extra.



No, It is downloadable though as part of the Sam exclusives.

here is a link......

http://www.projectsam.com/Products/Direct-Download/


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## Ed (Jul 16, 2008)

dogforester @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> No, It is downloadable though as part of the Sam exclusives.



I WANT IT NOW AS WELL

I dont suppose they demo makers can do some soft stuff as well? Or is that the softest it can sound?


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## midphase (Jul 16, 2008)

"..a high price tag might stop it from being used by everyone every three seconds or something.

This is true - as less people buy it. But is that the idea PSam has? "We don't want our libs to get boring quickly!" or are they trying to sell as many units as possible?"


You're joking right? This thing will end up on BitTorrent faster than you can say Symphobia.

As much as I hate the liability that a USB dongle comes with....I really am beginning to think that this is the only way that pro composers can separate themselves from the masses and I do wish that Project SAM had adopted a USB dongle solution for this.

The K2 player has been [k] for a while, so I don't think this library will be off limits to anyone who wants it but can't afford it.

So how about it guys? I vote for USB Dongles for the new pro stuff!


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## RiffWraith (Jul 16, 2008)

midphase @ Thu Jul 17 said:


> "..a high price tag might stop it from being used by everyone every three seconds or something.
> 
> This is true - as less people buy it. But is that the idea PSam has? "We don't want our libs to get boring quickly!" or are they trying to sell as many units as possible?"
> 
> ...



NO! No dongles for libs. I am one of the most anti-piracy people you will meet, but enough with the dongles.

And don't be so sure that Symphobia will suffer the fate you think it will. Do you think there are TS bittorrents? No there aren't. Do a search - you won't come up with one. How do I know? Because someone on another forum had the audacity to PM me, and because I have PSAM Brass listed in my profile, he wanted to know if I had a bittorrent for TS becuase he was unable to find one himself. I ignored him, but was actually curious enough as to how he was unable to find what he was looking for to do a search for myself. I searched "project sam true strike" +bittorrent and other variables. No d/l-able torrents came up. Which. AFAIAC, is a good thing.

Cheers.


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## Rob Elliott (Jul 16, 2008)

Hey traveling and in a airport right now but was there an 'upgrade path' for those of us who just bought into the WW Fx and orch libraries?


Rob


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## Ed (Jul 16, 2008)

RiffWraith @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> NO! No dongles for libs. I am one of the most anti-piracy people you will meet, but enough with the dongles.
> 
> And don't be so sure that Symphobia will suffer the fate you think it will. Do you think there are TS bittorrents? No there aren't. Do a search - you won't come up with one. How do I know? Because someone on another forum had the audacity to PM me, and because I have PSAM Brass listed in my profile, he wanted to know if I had a bittorrent for TS becuase he was unable to find one himself. I ignored him, but was actually curious enough as to how he was unable to find what he was looking for to do a search for myself. I searched "project sam true strike" +bittorrent and other variables. No d/l-able torrents came up. Which. AFAIAC, is a good thing.
> 
> Cheers.





Ah but Riff, you must not be looking in the right place. If they have them for actual protected products like QLSO, Stylus or Atmosphere then Im sure they have them for True Strike which has no protection at all as far as I can see. Now someone may not have actually put a torrent up, thats bescide the point. 

I think the main thing is not that loads of people will have it becasue it can be downloaded, its loads of people will have it because its cheap. As it isnt, many people wont buy it that might normally. As its so large, many people wont bother downloading it even if there are torrents of it. Many many people have GPO, not because its easily cracked and found probably very easily on file sharing sites, but because its cheap (and marketed as uber amazing) 

EDIT: Personally I would rather have a dongle than an annoying copy protection system that requires me to do tons of things in order to register. .. like Native Instruments . I want to put in the dvds, install it, run it. Thats it. If a dongle means I can do that then hand me the USB hub catalogue. 

Ed


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## Rob Elliott (Jul 16, 2008)

Planes delayed :( - had time to find it. probably fair.


Woodwind user discount
SYMPHOBIA includes woodwind recordings that are also available in our SAM Exclusives downloadable series, specifically SAM Woodwind Effects & SAM Woodwind Orchestrator.

If you already own a license for SAM Woodwind Effects or SAM Woodwind Orchestrator and purchase SYMPHOBIA, you will get the following discounts:

Woodwind Effects users: € 50 / $75 discount
Woodwind Orchestrator users: € 50 / $75 discount
Users who have both: € 100 / $150 discount

If you correctly registered your SAM Exclusive Woodwind purchases on our website, your discount will be automatically applied when purchasing SYMPHOBIA.


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## Hal (Jul 16, 2008)

there should be some kind of protection i dont think the Kontakt 2 is all what it is,i dont know,but i beleive they know what they r doing i hope they r its an 1500 $ library this is not some 150 $ dolo instrument CD,i hope for them it wont end up where u think,i hope for me too am ordering this week !!


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## Vision (Jul 16, 2008)

Rob Elliott @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> Planes delayed :( - had time to find it. probably fair.
> 
> 
> Woodwind user discount
> ...




Rob, I bought the woodwinds about 3 weeks ago. I just pre-ordered Symphobia, and my total came to $1199.00 usd including tax. This was with the pre-order discount as well of course. 

After listening to the demos, I'm sure this will be my source lib. I'm a little concerned about the lack of trumpets, and trumpet effects in the demos though. Any thoughts on this? 

At any rate, great Job Maarten/Proj SAM. I would venture to say this could very well be the best BANG for the buck lib out. Time to invest in an octo-core.


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## billval3 (Jul 17, 2008)

midphase @ Wed Jul 16 said:


> As much as I hate the liability that a USB dongle comes with....I really am beginning to think that this is the only way that pro composers can separate themselves from the masses and I do wish that Project SAM had adopted a USB dongle solution for this.



So you're saying the only advantage a "pro composer" has is how much they spend on software? :?


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## MacQ (Jul 17, 2008)

Hmm ...

This product is interesting, but sort of isn't at the same time. The "pre-orchestrated" aspect of it is both a plus and a minus for me. I mean, they're absolutely right in that the layering sounds much better when it's recorded that way, but this whole "baked-in" element makes me wonder about how well these kinds of mock-ups are going to transfer to real players. Also, how does something like this integrate with a broad orchestral template? Do you play the horns+strings Symphobia ensemble patch for certain passages, and then change back to your horns/strings individual patches for the rest? I mean, there are absolutely "go-to" orchestration layerings that composers have used through the ages, but I see this requiring a lot of "oh, right, that woodwinds patch has BOTH oboe and flute on it, blah blah" happening. It sort of reminds me of what Thomas_J once said ... how he likes a separate MIDI channel for ALL of his articulations (500+ MIDI channels). This (Symphobia's approach) is even "worse" than keyswitches ... it's compressing your layerings into single tracks. And when I'm writing horizontal lines, I don't want the violas showing up while I write my violins, you know?

I don't know if what I'm saying is resonating with anyone, but it seems that in an effort to "streamline" the orchestration process, it's actually made it more difficult in terms of the flexibility of the results. Sure it sounds great ... and probably it'll work for some people in achieving _that sound_, but this kind of approach has me wondering about usefulness, long-term, beyond the quick-and-dirty sketches. I love the "orchestral effects" aspect, and it'd be worth picking up this library for those kinds of things. But those alone aren't worth the kind of money they're asking, in my opinion. Maybe this really is as it was intended ... a way of sketching out high quality mock-ups with some tried-and-true orchestrations.

I'm waffling, surely. Would anyone care to comment or convince me I'm crazy?

~Stu


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## midphase (Jul 17, 2008)

" I might be naive here, but I think most new KontaktPlayer libraries are UNcrackable."

And you'd be wrong.


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## Vision (Jul 17, 2008)

Stu, I don't think the intention with this library was to be an end all lib. For me it'll be a great compliment to my other libraries. That's the whole point of Symphobia I believe. 

Honestly, in my experience no one cares how you put it together as long as it sounds good.


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## Ed (Jul 17, 2008)

MacQ @ Thu Jul 17 said:


> And when I'm writing horizontal lines, I don't want the violas showing up while I write my violins, you know?



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## MacQ (Jul 17, 2008)

Ed @ Thu Jul 17 said:


> Think about those agressive brass staccatos or think about the lovelly little woodwind staccs I hear in the demos. You can easily reorchestrate that out for live players if you want, but this way its easier and gets you the sound you want. Its not meant to be a replacement to VSL or EW, its meant to compliment them and fill in the gaps. The demos however show you can do a helleva lot with JUST Symphobia on its own.



Okay, you make a valid point there. I think I understand how it works, and certainly as an adjunct to one of the more comprehensive libraries, it'll be a great asset.

Funnily enough, I anticipate a range of "what IR/EQ settings can I use to make my VSL sound like Symphobia" threads. Haha. But hey, I love the character of the demos they've done (especially the "Farewell" demo which has the most lovely string sound), so that's not a bad thing.

I think I'll take a wait-and-see approach with it. I'm sure the early adopters will be more than eager to post their impressions.

~Stu


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## Hal (Jul 17, 2008)

midphase @ Thu Jul 17 said:


> "
> 
> I welcome any sort of exclusivity to software in the form of uber-tight copy protection.
> 
> ...



Totaly agree 

i would say,a very high price requires a very high protection without making the client suffer from a 20 step authorisation/authentication
may be a smaller price requires an average protection (i always wonderd does protection costs the sample house a lot of money ? )
symphobia is a high price so i hope Kontakt player 2 is enough

who really cares if this thing will be (k) after two years but at least i dont wana hear of this happening after 2 months

i think Project sam cares fo its money more then we care,i still beleive they know what they r doing


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## OLB (Jul 25, 2008)

Does anyone know if you can install Symphobia on different slaves? Or is it locked for one system...?

The demos sound amazing....!


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## tgfoo (Jul 25, 2008)

Well, since it comes with the K2 player, it should allow you two simultaneous installs.


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