# Komplete Kontrol - how to 'write' CC midi information into DAW



## Rob Elliott (Dec 24, 2016)

Sorry for what might be a numbnut question. I control various parameters on these NKS libraries (via the knobs) but when I am playing/recording in a midi part and controlling one of the knobs - it is NOT recording the midi CC information????

Can someone help (I looked into the KK manual and online search - nothing comes up of 'how-to')


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## procreative (Dec 24, 2016)

Okay firstly the knobs in KK mode write in automation (in Kontakt this is the tab Auto/Host Automation).

If you want to write CC data here is my tip:

1. Firstly locate the Controller Editor in the Native Instruments folder and open. 

2. Here you can edit all the mappings you want to any of the controllers including the Mod Wheel and Pitch Bend Strip. Any can be labelled and these will display on the scribble strips on the keyboard.

3. You can add many mappings as you can create extra pages to skip to using the arrows on the keyboard.

4. Once done, when you are in your DAW and want to write CC data on a KK instance, press Shift/Instance to force it into Midi mode and you will see the keyboard change to display all your custom CC mappings.

5. Any non KK tracks eg Kontakt only, will use Midi Mode as standard, your DAW should auto focus if you set it up right to start with see here for DAW setup: 

Logic Pro X
https://support.native-instruments....Setting-Up-Apple-Logic-X-for-KOMPLETE-KONTROL

Cubase
https://support.native-instruments....-Steinberg-Cubase-Nuendo-for-KOMPLETE-KONTROL

Only thing I cannot understand is why they did not provide either buttons or make the pots clickable like on a Mackie Control. Hope that helps and happy Christmas!


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## JohannesR (Dec 24, 2016)

I had the exact same problem, but it's a while ago - let me see if I remember this correctly.

You are using the Komplete Kontrol plugin right, as opposed to a Kontakt instance? I think the NI controller doesn't write CC data when in plugin mode, but automation data. Try to write enable automation in your DAW, and I think your knob movements will get recorded.

I do not use the Komplete Kontrol plugin, and I think it was for that exact reason.

Edit: Didn't see the post above. A much more thorough explanation


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## procreative (Dec 24, 2016)

JohannesR said:


> I had the exact same problem, but it's a while ago - let me see if I remember this correctly.
> 
> You are using the Komplete Kontrol plugin right, as opposed to a Kontakt instance? I think the NI controller doesn't write CC data when in plugin mode, but automation data. Try to write enable automation in your DAW, and I think your knob movements will get recorded.
> 
> I do not use the Komplete Kontrol plugin, and I think it was for that exact reason.



It does if you switch to midi mode.


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## JohannesR (Dec 24, 2016)

procreative said:


> It does if you switch to midi mode.


Yes, I know, my NI controller is constantly in midi mode. I don't use the Komplete Kontrol plugin.


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 24, 2016)

Ok thanks but was hoping that the 'assigned knobs/parameters' of the various NKS 3rd party library got written in the pno roll. :( Doesn't this kinda negate using the S88 / Komplete Kontrol software as a 'controller' - if you have to move to a std midi controller version of the S88? for sure it is a workable solution though. btw - enabling a midi track inside of Cubase does NOT write the automation (from any of the knobs) - :(


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## JohannesR (Dec 24, 2016)

Rob Elliott said:


> Ok thanks but was hoping that the 'assigned knobs/parameters' of the various NKS 3rd party library got written in the pno roll. :( Doesn't this kinda negate using the S88 / Komplete Kontrol software as a 'controller' - it you have to move to a std midi controller? for sure it is a workable solution though. btw - enabling a midi track inside of Cubase does NOT write the automation (from any of the knobs) - :(


Create an instrument track with the NI plugin and write enable automation "W", and it should get recorded?


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 24, 2016)

JohannesR said:


> Create an instrument track with the NI plugin and write enable automation "W", and it should get recorded?


Yea - that's where (for me) this will be a disconnect. I run all libraries OUTSIDE of Cubase in VEPRO (main puter and slaves). :( I may only have the option of 'run the S88 as a midi controller' if I want to write CC information - which in the context of my day is 95% of the time.


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## JohannesR (Dec 24, 2016)

Rob Elliott said:


> Yea - that's where (for me) this will be a disconnect. I run all libraries OUTSIDE of Cubase in VEPRO (main puter and slaves). :( I may only have the option of 'run the S88 as a midi controller' if I want to write CC information - which in the context of my day is 95% of the time.


Gotcha! Then shift+instance (if I remember correctly), and the controller is in midi mode, acting like a plain midi controller.


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 25, 2016)

Yea - while the keyboard is fantastic (feel) - the KK element is largely not very useful for folks on huge orch templates across a network of slaves. :(


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## procreative (Dec 25, 2016)

Rob Elliott said:


> Yea - while the keyboard is fantastic (feel) - the KK element is largely not very useful for folks on huge orch templates across a network of slaves. :(



But remember there are a lot of controls in instruments that are not set up as regular CC.

Also Light Guide is only available via KK, switching back and forth is no big deal though?

Personally wouldn't be too hung up on CC vs automation data and you can always stick to CC for the ones you are likely to want to use on other tracks or the main ones like CC1, CC11, etc.


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 25, 2016)

Yea for sure switching back and forth is a snap, BUT almost every midi track I lay down has 3-5 CC's being 'played' in by me (not always the same time - ) The KK 'reminds' me of where KS's are, play ranges, etc. - all of which is nice but the 'controllability and midi CC writing' of 3 slaves full of orch instruments is key (for me). Hopefully someday VSL and NI will resolve their software differences and this 'tool' will be fully realized for my sort of working application. I am not holding my breath as the DJ market that this is really made for is far larger than 'orchestral mock-ups' segment (over the network / slave farm). And I don't see those two companies working together. For now, I have a great 'keyboard' controller, some Cubase transport controls, some lightguide feedback (only on Main puter). Grateful for at least those things.


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## kurtvanzo (Dec 25, 2016)

Perhaps this article on KK and Cubase will help. It's important to be setup to record automation and midi, but it should record knobs to automation and notes/CCs to midi track. Also helps to use shortcuts to enable/overwrite automation while punching in. All this should work with a midi track routed to KK in a VEPro instance (though I'm not sure about the slave).
https://www.native-instruments.com/...ion-in-cubase-using-s-series-keyboard.274153/


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 26, 2016)

Hey kurtvanzo - I was so hoping that at least I could get 'automation' to record performance parameters (given the vid tutorial you linked). I am sure this setup works when KK is set up DIRECTLY as an instrument track in Cubase - BUT it DOESN'T with KK INSIDE of VEPRO (master puter). :( This wouldn't be so frustrating if I couldn't see the 'potential' of being able to control AND record these KK knobs (to preferably midi - but heck I would even take Cubase automation.)

Of course this would ONLY be on the Daw puter - but that would be better than nothing and I could migrate all NKS libraries over to that puter. Any other possible solutions running KK inside of VEPRO and recording midi/automation?


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 26, 2016)

Well - I have settled on a 'compromise within a compromise'. I feel that the S-series and Komplete Kontrol is really just made for entry level folks and probably D.J.'s, etc.. NI did not have 'working folks' in mind when then came up with it. If you use VEPRO - this is not a workable solution.

Having said that and trying to feel a little like I didn't just throw away $900 for the S88 (Fatar keybed is nice I'll give them that) - here's what I have ended up with for some 'partial use of KK'

1. Forget the slaves - KK doesn't work in VEPRO (VSL and NI will likely get that figured out the 'second Tuesday of next week.) :(

2. On Main puter (S88 is hooked to) - can get lightguide to work in VEPRO (shift+instance). Since midi record from the KK knobs is NOT possible with KK inside of VEPRO - using my Alias 8 midi controller to send out and record that (as I have to date). So in the end I get the visual feedback of the lightguide. Nice but worth the $900 - prolly not.

Hopefully this summary will inform others considering the S88. Significant limitations with unlikely changes in the near future - if ever from NI and VSL.


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## kurtvanzo (Dec 26, 2016)

I've been looking into this since my last post. Trouble is the knobs are sent out as automation data, and that can be tricky, but I have found ways to change it into midi CC data, then you would need to midi learn the knobs you want to control (in Kontakt- if the dev allows it in the interface). This page discusses how to convert the automation into midi data (in Cubase). You would still need to record it as auto data, then convert to Midi CC, then midi learn the knob, but the upside is it should then work with VE Pro, even on a slave. The downside is the knob resolution would only be 128 steps (which is probably why it's not a midi CC) but I don't think I would mind.
https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?p=162983

Still looking into a way to realtime convert (still checking with Biome) so that this can be set-up and recorded live without the post-convertion. I do believe NI could someday provide an option aloneside non-midi mode that would allow knobs to output midi CC's like other midi controllers. Wouldn't be a big deal and would solve the VE pro issue (but you would still need to midi learn knobs, and may not help with non-Kontakt synths... Good grief  )

Edit: Found another Steinberg post explaining how to move automation data to a midi track using region tool + alt.


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 26, 2016)

Thanks kurtvanzo. Another issue just discovered. Set up a track (KK inside VEPRO -master only). Hit shift+instance - to 'raise' the lights. All fine. Set up second track as above - different midi channel of course - hit shift+instance. GO BACK to first track and shift+instance - will not raise up that first midi track's Lightbridge (stays on second one. Close everything, restart and you can get to that first midi track's lightguide. In other words, in Cubase going from one midi track to the next - you cannot call up that new midi track's lightguide. Of course not workable solution. Bummer. :(


EDIT: delete that 'second midi KK track inside of VEPRO' and the FIRST lightguide comes instantly ON. It's like KK lightguide in VEPRO gets confused and locks on the latest instrument's lightguide??


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## Mornats (Dec 26, 2016)

Having to map midi CC to the knobs the get them to record kinda defeats the whole purpose of NKS in my opinion. Olympus Elements choir has the swell function mapped to one of the knobs and what's the point of that if it doesn't record the swell as you play? I'm away from my workstation for a few days but I'll try to get Reaper to record automation to see if this helps but it's rather disappointing that it doesn't just do this out of the box.


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 26, 2016)

Mornats said:


> Having to map midi CC to the knobs the get them to record kinda defeats the whole purpose of NKS in my opinion. Olympus Elements choir has the swell function mapped to one of the knobs and what's the point of that if it doesn't record the swell as you play? I'm away from my workstation for a few days but I'll try to get Reaper to record automation to see if this helps but it's rather disappointing that it doesn't just do this out of the box.


Given all these 'workarounds' and the latest discovery about the lightguide not even being properly 'raised' from track to track.....

This whole KK thingy is like having a shiny new 'transporter' (from the Star Trek world) right in front of you but a small note hanging off it saying "'transporter out of order' please use the bike leaning by the nearby tree to transport to your final destination." I'll eventually get there with the bike but how frustrating that the 'potential' - for KK in VEPRO cannot be used.


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## kurtvanzo (Dec 26, 2016)

Rob Elliott said:


> Thanks kurtvanzo. Another issue just discovered. Set up a track (KK inside VEPRO -master only). Hit shift+instance - to 'raise' the lights. All fine. Set up second track as above - different midi channel of course - hit shift+instance. GO BACK to first track and shift+instance - will not raise up that first midi track's Lightbridge (stays on second one. Close everything, restart and you can get to that first midi track's lightguide. In other words, in Cubase going from one midi track to the next - you cannot call up that new midi track's lightguide. Of course not workable solution. Bummer. :(
> 
> 
> EDIT: delete that 'second midi KK track inside of VEPRO' and the FIRST lightguide comes instantly ON. It's like KK lightguide in VEPRO gets confused and locks on the latest instrument's lightguide??



I was just looking into this earlier Rob. When using the keyboard to change lightguide it's kind of a pain if you're DAW doesn't lock with komplete kontrol (logic and a few others do, so that when you select the record track the light guide follows). If not it raises a screen on the computer, and your expected to scroll though all the open instances with the scroll wheel next to browse button then hit enter to select the instance you want (all my VE Pro instances were in one group, then DAW instances, then standalone). It works but it's too many steps.

Luckily I found if you click on the small keyboard icon on the top of each Kontrol instance, the keyboard will switch to that instance, even in VE Pro (I'm on the most recent version). Much quicker than the keyboard select/enter process, just as you're tweaking Kontakt (or whatever you have inside Komplete) hit that keyboard icon above. Eventually Kontakt may communicate directly with the Keyboard, but it may be 6.1 or later. Considering all of our issues are software based, you may get more use out of your purchase yet. Merry Christmas and I hope this helps. -Kurt


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 26, 2016)

kurtvanzo said:


> I was just looking into this earlier Rob. When using the keyboard to change lightguide it's kind of a pain if you're DAW doesn't lock with komplete kontrol (logic and a few others do, so that when you select the record track the light guide follows). If not it raises a screen on the computer, and your expected to scroll though all the open instances with the scroll wheel next to browse button then hit enter to select the instance you want (all my VE Pro instances were in one group, then DAW instances, then standalone). It works but it's too many steps.
> 
> Luckily I found if you click on the small keyboard icon on the top of each Kontrol instance, the keyboard will switch to that instance, even in VE Pro (I'm on the most recent version). Much quicker than the keyboard select/enter process, just as you're tweaking Kontakt (or whatever you have inside Komplete) hit that keyboard icon above. Eventually Kontakt may communicate directly with the Keyboard, but it may be 6.1 or later. Considering all of our issues are software based, you may get more use out of your purchase yet. Merry Christmas and I hope this helps. -Kurt


Thanks Kurt for the tip. That does in fact work to 'raise' the track/lightguide (funny that the 'shift+instance' doesn't do the same thing) - but small 'step' to take to at least get this functionality.

In all its glory - KK could be as important to us Orch mock up folks as VEPRO was/is. If I could 'write' midi with the KK knobs AND use KK on slaves (in VEPRO) I would be one happy camper. Can almost 'taste' it. Thanks again Kurt and Merry Christmas to you.


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## procreative (Dec 26, 2016)

Rob Elliott said:


> Set up a track (KK inside VEPRO -master only). Hit shift+instance - to 'raise' the lights. All fine. Set up second track as above - different midi channel of course - hit shift+instance. GO BACK to first track and shift+instance - will not raise up that first midi track's Lightbridge (stays on second one. Close everything, restart and you can get to that first midi track's lightguide. In other words, in Cubase going from one midi track to the next - you cannot call up that new midi track's lightguide.



This is exactly what I said would happen. After many hours trying different permutations, I came to the realisation it just would not work. As I said I think the only way it could work was if loading KK inside a VEP instance on the master computer worked because I think KK has to be between the DAW and keyboard and doing it the other way around is not how the wrapper works.

My compromise is to load KK directly in the DAW and only use it for instruments that really benefit from the Lightguide and not ones that require a lot of CC data. So I use it for phrase libraries like Capriccio and Sotto and other instruments such as Percussion where the keys are mapped in small groups as it helps when they are colour coded.

I agree its a missed opportunity and knowing what I do now I probably would have not got it. Especially as I dont record keyswitches preferring to use a 3rd party solution to switch articulations which makes use of a mini keyboard dedicated to the task.

And I also agree its daft that the NKS mapped controls use automation instead of CC. Midi Mode is your friend for CC input and its pretty easy to switch back and forth. FYI KK does auto update its Lightguide when it switches between KK instances and Kontakt or other plugin tracks providing you have it properly setup for your DAW.

I think the key is that VEP would need to transmit midi feedback to properly function with KK. Probably the only way it might work on a locally hosted VEP server is using something like the IAC bus to communicate with the DAW.


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## kurtvanzo (Dec 26, 2016)

procreative said:


> This is exactly what I said would happen. After many hours trying different permutations, I came to the realisation it just would not work. As I said I think the only way it could work was if loading KK inside a VEP instance on the master computer worked because I think KK has to be between the DAW and keyboard and doing it the other way around is not how the wrapper works.
> 
> My compromise is to load KK directly in the DAW and only use it for instruments that really benefit from the Lightguide and not ones that require a lot of CC data. So I use it for phrase libraries like Capriccio and Sotto and other instruments such as Percussion where the keys are mapped in small groups as it helps when they are colour coded.



I agree it may not work on a slave, but KK inside VE Pro does work properly on the host machine. Only certain DAW's will work directly with the Keyboard (I assume yours does as using KK directly inside the DAW, which gives you a great interconnection and turns the instance button off). But those that don't (Cubase, Pro Tools, etc) works the same as VE Pro, selecting instance button on the keyboard opens a window on the computer, you use the scroll knob next to instance button to find instance and hit the enter button to switch to it. All this just to select which open instance of kk you want the keyboard to display.

A much simplier solution is to select the keyboard icon at the top of the KK instance your using in VE Pro, which switches the keyboard to that instance. Just checked it in VE Pro 6 to Pro Tools, all works properly. But recording the knobs (because it uses automation) is still an issue. The KK instance needs to be on an instrument track for automation to be recorded and played back properly. Midi tracks (at least in Pro Tools) don't record automation, only midi. Hopefully they will correct this issue soon by adding an option to output CC's when operating KK knobs.


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 26, 2016)

Here's hoping for 'output cc's when operating knobs'!!!!!!


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## procreative (Dec 27, 2016)

kurtvanzo said:


> I agree it may not work on a slave, but KK inside VE Pro does work properly on the host machine. Only certain DAW's will work directly with the Keyboard (I assume yours does as using KK directly inside the DAW, which gives you a great interconnection and turns the instance button off). But those that don't (Cubase, Pro Tools, etc) works the same as VE Pro, selecting instance button on the keyboard opens a window on the computer, you use the scroll knob next to instance button to find instance and hit the enter button to switch to it. All this just to select which open instance of kk you want the keyboard to display.
> 
> A much simplier solution is to select the keyboard icon at the top of the KK instance your using in VE Pro, which switches the keyboard to that instance. Just checked it in VE Pro 6 to Pro Tools, all works properly. But recording the knobs (because it uses automation) is still an issue. The KK instance needs to be on an instrument track for automation to be recorded and played back properly. Midi tracks (at least in Pro Tools) don't record automation, only midi. Hopefully they will correct this issue soon by adding an option to output CC's when operating KK knobs.



Sorry I meant to say if loading the VEP server plugin inside KK with Kontakt loaded in the VEP server project.

If it were done this way around then KK would always reside on the same computer as the keyboard. However I tried this and it did not communicate. Probably because having VEP between KK and Kontakt broke the feedback.


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 27, 2016)

Working my first day with KK inside of VEP (in Cubase 8.5). VERY pleased the workflow improvement on that Main puter (S88 hooked to)....BUT sad that I *can't* have the same improvement on slave farm (3 puters) on the network (VEP). When they somehow get this sorted out -- for me, anyways, -- biggest workflow improvement since VEP came out. Would be a game changer on how I would work.


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## kurtvanzo (Dec 27, 2016)

procreative said:


> Sorry I meant to say if loading the VEP server plugin inside KK with Kontakt loaded in the VEP server project.
> 
> If it were done this way around then KK would always reside on the same computer as the keyboard. However I tried this and it did not communicate. Probably because having VEP between KK and Kontakt broke the feedback.



Wow, you are proactively creative. I never would have thought of putting KK in my DAW then trying to open a VEP server inside that (which is hosting all kontakt instances) - Interesting creative solution, but I suppose it wouldn't know which instance you wanted to control. For me it's setting up vepro first which hosts many kk instances which have kontakt (or others). Which means changing out most of my templete to kk, but I can see the day coming when Kontakt may talk to the keyboard directly (perhaps Kontakt 6?).


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## procreative (Dec 28, 2016)

kurtvanzo said:


> Wow, you are proactively creative. I never would have thought of putting KK in my DAW then trying to open a VEP server inside that (which is hosting all kontakt instances) - Interesting creative solution, but I suppose it wouldn't know which instance you wanted to control. For me it's setting up vepro first which hosts many kk instances which have kontakt (or others). Which means changing out most of my templete to kk, but I can see the day coming when Kontakt may talk to the keyboard directly (perhaps Kontakt 6?).



Ha!

Well that was the theory, that VEP would host Kontakt versions of NKS libraries and you would add KK instances in your DAW for each and connect them via a VEP plugin inserted inside each KK instance. It worked in so far as connecting them up. But it did not communicate.

At least for me in Logic on a Mac, I can get your method to work for one instance of KK, but as soon as I add more VEP projects with KK in them, they do not update the keyboard. Even clicking the keyboard icon.

And even though I have 2 monitors accessing the KK instance is a pain. Auto raise in VEP has been a bit funky for me since the last update. So it means hiding Logic and finding the instance (which is kind of irrelevant as it does not work for me when a project has multiple KK instances).


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## procreative (Dec 28, 2016)

So I went back and did a bit of a test:

I created a blank Logic project and added a few instances of VEP server. In each VEP project I added a KK instance, then I connected them up in Logic.

So normally in Logic when you switch tracks with KK inside Logic, the keyboard updates to each instrument (otherwise known as Track Focus).

However although all VEP connected KK tracks play correctly when selected, there is no Track Focus.

As mentioned previously the workaround is to either click the keyboard symbol on the VEP project relating to that track or press the Instance button on the keyboard. Both bring VEP to the front on monitor.

Now for those with multiple monitors and spare screen estate this might not be a problem. I have 2 monitors, but use both for my DAW choosing to display the Arrange window in one and various editor windows in the other.

This means that when VEP comes to the front, I then have to manually switch back to the DAW after switching Instance in the KK popup window. Not workable in a large project and tedious.

So does anyone know a way to switch back to Logic Pro on a Mac using a shortcut or using the KK keyboard? Or a way to retain Track Focus inside the DAW?


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## kurtvanzo (Dec 28, 2016)

procreative said:


> At least for me in Logic on a Mac, I can get your method to work for one instance of KK, but as soon as I add more VEP projects with KK in them, they do not update the keyboard. Even clicking the keyboard icon.



Strange. I wonder if this is an AU issue, as this works fine for me using AAX VEP, and I'm pretty sure the VST VEP works also when you hit the keyboard icon on kk.

I have to admit, I wish Track focus worked in Pro Tools or Cubase, but I suppose it will take the DAW developer to fix that (or perhaps a VE Pro update?)

As far as switching between app windows, can't you just use the standard command+tab to switch to VEP and command+~ to go back? Works here to uncover VEP then put it behind again.

Or you could set up a custom shortcut:
http://superuser.com/questions/2992...rtcut-to-switch-between-windows-of-the-same-a


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 28, 2016)

kurtvanzo said:


> Strange. I wonder if this is an AU issue, as this works fine for me using AAX VEP, and I'm pretty sure the VST VEP works also when you hit the keyboard icon.
> 
> I have to admit, I wish Track focus worked in Pro Tools or Cubase, but I suppose it will take the DAW developer to fix that (or perhaps a VE Pro update?)




Do you guys see VSL even being motivated to 'assist' their competitor's software functionality (with a VEPro update)? I hope am not just being to jaded in thinking they are both working on, as we speak, to 'copy' each other's strengths to offer their customer base the WHOLE solution. I hope not. I hope both focus on their strengths (VSL = VEP and Kontakt = KK).


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## kurtvanzo (Dec 28, 2016)

Rob Elliott said:


> Do you guys see VSL even being motivated to 'assist' their competitor's software functionality (with a VEPro update)? I hope am not just being to jaded in thinking they are both working on, as we speak, to 'copy' each other's strengths to offer their customer base the WHOLE solution. I hope not. I hope both focus on their strengths (VSL = VEP and Kontakt = KK).



Yes, yes you are.  But seriously, After seeing compatibility issues with earlier versions of VEP and how quickly they fixed/updated the software, along with how great their customer service is, I kind of expect to see VEP improve in all ways that it can. The improvements in 6 are great, and the idea that it could raise kk instances, or even talk to komplete keyboards directly someday (as kontakt could someday) is not unthinkable.

NI wants people to buy the keyboards, so they may allow it to talk to more apps (releasing comm standards) so that it becomes more useful outside of kk software (which they don't make money on anyway), VSL wants more people to buy VEP and Vienna libraries, so having them work on the keyboard (and communicate with them) is an advantage as well. Same reason so many libraries are updating to nks compatibility. It's a hassle for the developer but they are betting it will be another reason to buy over something else. And for some that own the keyboard (like me) it sure is if it's integrated well.

i think VSL realizes it would be difficult to dominate an area where Kontakt is so common, and even more diffficult to get into making hardware. If they are smart both companies will see that having open controller standards (especially for KK) will become more imparitive as more VI's hit the market. Between samplers, synths, and modeled instruments, it's already in need of some midi type controller standards. Hopefully by then KK knobs will have an option to output CC's as well.


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## procreative (Dec 29, 2016)

Personally I dont see it happening. NI make hardware tied to their software, they added functionality to integrate any plugin or VI, but no way to integrate the Lightguide or other functions.

Hosting KK inside VEP locally is a workaround, but for it to work properly it would have to be the other way round. I tried that again last night and it has no Lightguide and all the controls display "Parameter 0001", "Parameter 0002" etc instead.

VSL currently do not seem interested in making it work and unless they were to collaborate with NI cannot see this changing. VEP is too niche a product and really only interests composers using sophisticated setups with CPU heavy plugins. KK seems mainly aimed at rap/dance producers like Maschine.

Hope I am wrong, but NI has a history of products that never quite fulfil their potential... Kore?

PS I think my memory was skewed over KK not working in VEP, I think it has more to do with if there are KK instances in the DAW as well as in VEP. 

But for me losing Track Focus is too big a price to put them into VEP, as I cannot find a quick way to switch back and forth.


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 29, 2016)

Well - I hope kurtvanzo is ultimately right and procreative is likewise wrong.  Even if these boys do decide to play marbles together - It likely won't happen next weds.  But here's hoping and a wishin' for a solution.


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## procreative (Dec 29, 2016)

Rob Elliott said:


> Well - I hope kurtvanzo is ultimately right and procreative is likewise wrong.  Even if these boys do decide to play marbles together - It likely won't happen next weds.  But here's hoping and a wishin' for a solution.



How do you make it work switching back and forth between VEP and Cubase? Do you have a spare monitor just for VEP?


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## Mornats (Jan 1, 2017)

I managed to work out how to write automation from the Komplete Kontrol knobs in Reaper. See the screenshot below. In your trim window, arm the parameter you want - in this case the swell on Olympus Elements, then set the automation mode to write or latch and with the Komplete Kontrol instance open, just play your track and move your parameter knob and it will record it. Actually, since typing this I've just found out that you can simply set the automation mode to latch and move any knob and it'll add the trim envelope and start recording it. Just set the automation mode back to read/trim when you're done recording the automation (or you can change the automation preferences to do this automatically).


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## Mornats (Apr 2, 2017)

Update on my thread above. For some reason this isn't working for me at all now. Every time I turn the knob on the keyboard the value shown in the automation envelope in Reaper flickers up and down by a few digits but it doesn't record the automation anymore. I even used the same project shown above that I used to test this with so I know it worked before. Any ideas?


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## Mornats (Apr 14, 2018)

Oh wow, I just googled this problem again today and noticed that I'd put the answer to the problem above into my previous post. You have to have the Komplete Kontrol instance open in Reaper for the automation to record.


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