# Another Orchestral Template Post



## Simon Passmore (Sep 2, 2021)

Hi all,

I've recently bought an iMac and upgraded to 128GB RAM in preparation for my first ever composition work for a new TV show.

I'm just getting round to setting up an orchestral template, and there are so many tutorials out there I can't work out what's best.

I'll be using:
CSW
Hollywoodwinds
Cinebrass (Complete)
Composer Cloud for perc & choir
CSP & Labs Soft Piano
Cineharps
CSS
Cinestrings Runs

I have a good idea of how to group the instruments, but I have two questions. I'm still getting used to transferring from manuscript paper to DAWs and still very new to the tech side of things, so sorry if the questions are stupid or hilarious:

1) Should I use folder stacks or summing stacks?
It seems like everyone uses summing stacks, but is there still the option to edit reverb/eq/balance of individual instruments within that stack?

2) I have one instance of Kontakt/Play for each track (if that's the right term - I just create a new track and select Kontakt - New Instrument), is that a good way to do it? My midi keyboard is very basic and doesn't have many buttons and I have lots of RAM to spare.

3) Are there any very clear and basic guides on busses/routing, or how to use reverb? I have the cheaper version of 7th heaven and just not quite sure how much of the instrument to "send" to the reverb, and how to use wet/dry etc


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## Argy Ottas (Sep 2, 2021)

Hi!
If your DAW of choice is Cubase, then this guy will definitely help you a lot!
I am posting a playlist from his YT channel dedicated to orchestral templates.


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## Simon Passmore (Sep 2, 2021)

Argy Ottas said:


> Hi!
> If your DAW of choice is Cubase, then this guy will definitely help you a lot!
> I am posting a playlist from his YT channel dedicated to orchestral templates.



I'm on Logic, but that template makes me feel a bit ill - so many libraries!! And so many bad ones too! Seems like a huge waste of memory. I bet his music is absolutely amazing, is there somewhere you can listen? Really curious to see what it sounds like


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## tc9000 (Sep 2, 2021)

I recommend Anne-Kathrin Dern's youtube channel:



https://www.youtube.com/c/AnneKathrinDernComposer/videos



I have learned (am still learning) from her Template, Sample Libraries, and LOTR Mockup series.

Edit: AKD on reverb:


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## Kent (Sep 2, 2021)

Simon Passmore said:


> I'm on Logic, but that template makes me feel a bit ill - so many libraries!! And so many bad ones too! Seems like a huge waste of memory. I bet his music is absolutely amazing, is there somewhere you can listen? Really curious to see what it sounds like


I used to build Logic templates for composers in LA. PM me if you want a brief call (no charge!) sometime in the next few days.


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## Justin L. Franks (Sep 4, 2021)

Simon Passmore said:


> 1) Should I use folder stacks or summing stacks?
> It seems like everyone uses summing stacks, but is there still the option to edit reverb/eq/balance of individual instruments within that stack?
> 
> 2) I have one instance of Kontakt/Play for each track (if that's the right term - I just create a new track and select Kontakt - New Instrument), is that a good way to do it? My midi keyboard is very basic and doesn't have many buttons and I have lots of RAM to spare.
> ...


1. Yes, you still can control each individual instrument in a summing stack.

2. Yes, that is fine.

3. Routing is personal preference. I've attached two "blank" partial templates for Logic (empty Kontakt instances, and just a couple of instruments/tracks per stack) with different routing strategies.

The first is the simpler one. There are track stacks for strings, brass, wind, and percussion. Each track stack has a reverb bus for the entire stack. There are two tracks per instrument, one for legato, and one for everything else. Routing is as follows (one example per stack):

Violins -> Strings Stack (bus 10), with a send to bus 15 for reverb -> Full Mix (bus 250) -> Stereo Out
Horns -> Brass Stack (bus 20), with a send to bus 25 for reverb) -> Full Mix (bus 250) -> Stereo Out
Oboes -> Woods Stack (bus 30), with a send to bus 35 for reverb) -> Full Mix (bus 250) -> Stereo Out
Timpani -> Perc Stack (bus 40), with a send to bus 45 for reverb) -> Full Mix (bus 250) -> Stereo Out


The second is a bit more complex. Each stack has three separate busses (longs, shorts, and FX). Each of those busses has its own reverb send, so you can have different amounts of reverb for each type of articulation. There are four tracks per instrument (legato, longs, shorts, and FX). Routing is as follows (one example per stack):

Violins Longs -> Strings Longs (bus 11), with a send to bus 15 for reverb -> Strings Stack (bus 10) -> Full Mix (bus 250) -> Stereo Out
Horns Longs -> Brass Longs (bus 21), with a send to bus 25 for reverb -> Brass Stack (bus 20) -> Full Mix (bus 250) -> Stereo Out
Flutes Shorts -> Woods Shorts (bus 32), with a send to bus 35 for reverb -> Woods Stack (bus 30) -> Full Mix (bus 250) -> Stereo Out
Cymbals -> Perc Metals (bus 43), with a send to bus 45 for reverb -> Perc Stack (bus 40) -> Full Mix (bus 250) -> Stereo Out

The "skips" in bus numbering for each is for clarity. Each stack gets its own set of 10 busses (10-19 for strings, 20-29 for brass, etc.). Bus "x0" (10 for strings, 30 for woods, etc.) is always the full stack. Bus "x15" (25 for brass, 45 for percussion, etc.) is always the reverb bus used inside that stack.

And in the second template, bus "x1" (11 for strings, 21 for brass, etc.) is always the long articulations for that stack. Bus "x2" is always the shorts, and bus "x3" is always the FX / other articulations. Percussion is the only outlier, with bus 41 for tuned perc, bus 42 for untuned, and bus 43 for metals.

So if you want to add another track stack, such as for choirs, synths, or whatever else, you can just select the last track stack and duplicate it, then adjust the routing to match the others (bus 50 for the whole stack, bus 51 for the longs, etc.). The "Full Mix" bus is set all the way to 250 to leave lots of room for additional stacks while retaining the same routing structure for each.

For the reverb, I just used the Chroma reverb included with Logic. The wet/dry mix is set to 100%, and you control the level of reverb by adjusting the send level (under the full stack in the 1st template, and under the longs/shorts/FX busses in the 2nd template).


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## Simon Passmore (Sep 5, 2021)

Justin L. Franks said:


> 1. Yes, you still can control each individual instrument in a summing stack.
> 
> 2. Yes, that is fine.
> 
> ...


Wow - that's really above and beyond, thank you so much. This will come in incredibly useful, I'm very very grateful indeed


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## cedricm (Sep 22, 2021)

Justin L. Franks said:


> 1. Yes, you still can control each individual instrument in a summing stack.
> 
> 2. Yes, that is fine.
> 
> ...


Hey Justin,

Trying to understand - I have neither a Mac or Logic - to what do you route Legato tracks?


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## Justin L. Franks (Sep 22, 2021)

cedricm said:


> Hey Justin,
> 
> Trying to understand - I have neither a Mac or Logic - to what do you route Legato tracks?


I route legatos to the same bus as all the other longs. While you certainly require a separate track (or MIDI channel) for legatos due to the notes having to overlap, in the end, they are still just another type of long articulation, so I don't see the need to create a separate bus exclusively for legatos.

Some may argue that legato tracks, which tend to be soaring melodies, need a touch more reverb or other processing to help it stand out, so they need their own bus separate from other long articulations. This is completely valid, and just another example why routing strategies are mostly personal preference.


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