# Modern Warfare Action Music



## Daniel James (Feb 12, 2011)

Hey Guys,

I Just finished off this track and would love to hear what you guys think. Its for a short action war flick, so somethings may sound underscore, or hit at odd times...but it all makes sense in context, which I sadly cant share just yet.

http://soundcloud.com/hybridtwo/operation-big-eye

EDIT: 

Video Part 1 (Bowed Acoustic Guitar Rhythms): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ehh6SYG94nw

Video Part 2 (General Track Overview): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOJ--muYLzw

Dan


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## Ryan Scully (Feb 12, 2011)

This is a remarkable piece Daniel - You certainly cover a lot of ground here and it all totally makes sense. If you hadn't noted it originally I would have thought that your sound design elements were definitely the stand out factors here...The guitar percussion at about 5:25 was intense. I also really dug your choice of harmony with the choirs towards the end..


Ryan =o


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## Daniel James (Feb 12, 2011)

Cheers Ryan, I am glad you enjoyed it, I agree there was plenty of bases to cover, I hope the track didnt get get too boring, that was my main worry.

Would you be interested in seeing any of the sound design stuff in a future vid perhaps?

Dan


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## JohnG (Feb 12, 2011)

Hi Daniel,

I love your sound design and the rhythmic stuff. It is propulsive, exciting, has plenty of variety, and is really the core of action music. In fact, I lean more toward these elements than harmonic / melodic stuff these days.

Without seeing the picture, it's hard to urge changes with any certainty regarding harmonic / melodic language, but a couple of thoughts come to mind.

1. Suggest you consider more dissonance in general. What I think I hear in general out there for action includes -- with a few notable exceptions -- very limited three-note-chord harmony. The ones that are like that tend to have a youth / adventure / cartoon / superhero element. Moreover, some of them benefit from the authority provided by a giant orchestra and virtually unlimited resources (people and gear) on the processing / mixing side.

2. Be careful using themes and melody in action scenes / films. They can harken back to the 90s or even 80s, which can reduce their effectiveness because people have "heard that" before.

What you have sounds really good, but I think you can take it to another level by listening to music from your favourite action scenes, mining it for harmonic ideas, additional percussion, and overall comparing the writing with what you have done so far.


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## BoulderBrow (Feb 12, 2011)

> The guitar percussion at about 5:25 was intense.



That was a guitar? Sounded great! Definately up for a vid


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## Daniel James (Feb 12, 2011)

JohnG @ Sat Feb 12 said:


> Hi Daniel,
> 
> I love your sound design and the rhythmic stuff. It is propulsive, exciting, has plenty of variety, and is really the core of action music. In fact, I lean more toward these elements than harmonic / melodic stuff these days.
> 
> ...



Cheers John, as you well know I greatly respect your opinion.

Haha about using melodic themes...I cant help it :D I just love me a huge theme. 

I am a bit unclear as to your point about dissonance, are you suggesting I am not using enough? and that I should listen to other action tracks to learn the way its done? also what were you saying about the limited three note chord harmony part (as you know I'm still learning as I go so any clarification here will be of great use to me)


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## Daniel James (Feb 12, 2011)

BoulderBrow @ Sat Feb 12 said:


> > The guitar percussion at about 5:25 was intense.
> 
> 
> 
> That was a guitar? Sounded great! Definately up for a vid



Yes...yes it was, an Acoustic guitar at that. I was sitting there thinking that I needed something with a really 'scratchy' sound....so I rosined the crap out of my bow and played my acoustic guitar string with plenty of force...instant scratch :D in fact ALOT of the scratchy delay parts of the track come from the guitar bow recordings I did.

Dan


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## Ryan Scully (Feb 12, 2011)

Daniel James @ Sat Feb 12 said:


> Would you be interested in seeing any of the sound design stuff in a future vid perhaps?




I always dig your vids Dan - I think I've seen most of them and I'm sure I would enjoy one centered around this topic.



Ryan


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## choc0thrax (Feb 12, 2011)

America, fuck yeah! 

Cool piece.


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## Daniel James (Feb 12, 2011)

Cheers choc0 :D 

So if I do a video....what would y'all like to see?

Dan


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## antoniopandrade (Feb 12, 2011)

Daniel James @ Sat Feb 12 said:


> Cheers choc0 :D
> 
> So if I do a video....what would y'all like to see?
> 
> Dan



*expletive deleted* YEAH!






P.S.: Awesome underscoring, I can totally see the action rising and falling to this.


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## Daniel James (Feb 12, 2011)

antoniopandrade @ Sat Feb 12 said:


> Daniel James @ Sat Feb 12 said:
> 
> 
> > Cheers choc0 :D
> ...



Cheers mate, I'll have to post the vid once It goes live so you can see how I tried to make the music flow with pictures :D

Dan


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## RiffWraith (Feb 12, 2011)

Cool piece, DJ! :D 



Daniel James @ Sat Feb 12 said:


> Would you be interested in seeing any of the sound design stuff in a future vid perhaps?



Not if you don't name stuff. :|


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## Daniel James (Feb 12, 2011)

RiffWraith @ Sat Feb 12 said:


> Cool piece, DJ! :D
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Funny enough, this track got so large by the end that I actually named stuff...I was wasting too much time writing on the wrong midi track xD

Dan


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## RiffWraith (Feb 12, 2011)

Daniel James @ Sun Feb 13 said:


> I actually named stuff



:shock: 



Daniel James @ Sun Feb 13 said:


> I was wasting too much time writing on the wrong midi track xD



Dude - I used to do the same thing! Until one day I got pissed (at who else - ME!) and I said THAT'S IT!!! No more trying to figure out what instrument I meant to have there from the night before....:lol:


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## Daniel James (Feb 13, 2011)

RiffWraith @ Sat Feb 12 said:


> Daniel James @ Sun Feb 13 said:
> 
> 
> > I actually named stuff
> ...



Yeah its a terrible habit thats for sure, when I get a machine capable of loading all my libraries in a template I'll go the route of having it all named from startup. This project may actually be my last in Ableton Live too, as I'm looking to get into Cubase 6 in the near future, perhaps the 64bit will help me some.


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## DynamicK (Feb 13, 2011)

Daniel James @ Sat Feb 12 said:


> Would you be interested in seeing any of the sound design stuff in a future vid perhaps?
> Dan


Definitely. Your vids are really informative.


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## Polarity (Feb 13, 2011)

Great track!! 
Sometimes remind me a bit Jablonsky's style in The Island.
Thanks for sharing, very inspiring.

A video wuld be very interesting. Yeah with tracks named this time LOL! :mrgreen:


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## Daniel James (Feb 13, 2011)

Polarity @ Sun Feb 13 said:


> Great track!!
> Sometimes remind me a bit Jablonsky's style in The Island.
> Thanks for sharing, very inspiring.
> 
> A video wuld be very interesting. Yeah with tracks named this time LOL! :mrgreen:



Hey, I am really happy that you found my work inspiring! 

Haha I shall try my hardest to make my videos seem more professional, perhaps I should write what I'm going to talk about before I hit record xD

Dan


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## Polarity (Feb 13, 2011)

just writing what instruments are you using on tracks is enough.
I tell this for you especially.
Man, I don't know how you can work like that.  

I become crazy when I have to guess what was used by friends/collaborators when they pass me some midi-project to work on. 

Ok, I spent a lot of time making my electronic/orchestral template in Cubase (hundred of tracks, divided/sorted in groups/folders), but now it's big time saver!!

Chosen orchestral instruments loaded in VEPRO instances are just there, ready to play on tracks with their name, no confusion.
I have actually just to update Omnisphere/Trillian (and some synths) tracks with name of what I use, but the rest is there.


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## Daniel James (Feb 13, 2011)

Polarity @ Sun Feb 13 said:


> just writing what instruments are you using on tracks is enough.
> I tell this for you especially.
> Man, I don't know how you can work like that.
> 
> ...



What kind of system would one need for a template of that size? I currently load instruments as I need them, I would love to just have everything ready to go.

Dan


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## Polarity (Feb 13, 2011)

I still work with an intel Q6600 and Cubase 4 32bit and have two Pulsar/Scope cards to mix all with external hardware.

I initially made my template on XP and 4 gb, so I had to do some sacrifice.
Like putting aside PLAY instances inside VEPRO and using Kontakt version for EW SO Gold (anyway percussive instruments sound identical to PLAY versions), 
and keeping a PLAY instance (or two) inside Cubase for those instruments I occasionally need the improved patches or also the close mic.

With the advent of Kontakt 4 and its new fast loading and compression functions I have a lot more memory now, and more patches pre-loaded.
I'm also using ALL the patches in purged mode: they load less memory, but when you play notes on tracks K4 loads just only those notes, very useful.

But since january I finally installed Windows7 64bit and using 8 gb of RAM,
so things are now easier and after installations and tests, I'm about to update my VEPRO orchestral templates with PLAY multis to substitute Kontakt 4 ones,
and expand the template with other sounds I had to give up to preload together my basic setup.
I will keep the old ones with K4 multis too, just in case, they are less memory hungry.

Also synths are now inside a dedicated VEPRO instance.
Inside Cubase template every plugin/library/instrument has its channels ready with default volumes, settings, effects, reverbs... also if they are not loaded inside VEPRO.

Just keep VEPRO interface plugin loaded inside Cubase and you still have all channels there in the mixer.
I think you can do the same also with your Ableton Live.
I also use a lot group channels for intrument genre and put there basic effects, reverbs, delay, so if I add something new I just have to link it to the group channel.

Anyway, you can create once all tracks in your host template, have them all ready to play, and so decide if load or not their sounds.
Then keep a couple (or more) of empty K4 instances inside your host just for those other sounds you didn't forecast and need for different projects.


PS: hope it's all clear, I'm not english language born, sorry.


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## Alex Temple (Feb 13, 2011)

Really solid work here. I don't use enough percussion and sound design toò     ô¥    
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## Daniel James (Feb 14, 2011)

Alex Temple @ Sun Feb 13 said:


> Really solid work here. I don't use enough percussion and sound design to make any more detailed comments on these aspects other than to say that they are very well done and really keep the tension going in a way that can be tricky on a cue of this length.
> 
> I hope that we do eventually get to see the visuals that go with this.



Thanks for your kind words :D The video is going through the sound and mixing stage at the moment, so I'd say I can post it sometime this week.

Dan


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## stevenson-again (Feb 14, 2011)

i have to agree with those commenting on the sound design aspects of this cue. it's fantastic. it's very strongly melodic too which i like. i think i know what john means about dissonance. interesting to read the comment and listen out for it. if it was written to picture who knows if that would be the right thing to do, but it would certainly give a bit more shape and interest if there were tenser moments.

really outstanding cue this. it's going to my VI forum folder so i can pick over it at my leisure and see if i can't learn some new tricks. i can't give no higher praise than that....


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## nickhmusic (Feb 14, 2011)

excellent work Dan - congrats - really enjoyed listening.

Re: the video ideas - I've found your videos to be very informative - but would love to see you dissect the piece (or a part of it) - perhaps look at a few of your choices in processing/writing etc. and take us through it?

Quick question - are you stage positioning at all with reverb - or just adding reverb to taste until it sounds good to you?

Thanks!

o-[][]-o


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## Daniel James (Feb 14, 2011)

stevenson-again @ Mon Feb 14 said:


> i have to agree with those commenting on the sound design aspects of this cue. it's fantastic. it's very strongly melodic too which i like. i think i know what john means about dissonance. interesting to read the comment and listen out for it. if it was written to picture who knows if that would be the right thing to do, but it would certainly give a bit more shape and interest if there were tenser moments.
> 
> really outstanding cue this. it's going to my VI forum folder so i can pick over it at my leisure and see if i can't learn some new tricks. i can't give no higher praise than that....



Wow thankyou for your compliment, I am really happy people are enjoying the sound design :D

Dan


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## Daniel James (Feb 14, 2011)

nickhmusic @ Mon Feb 14 said:


> excellent work Dan - congrats - really enjoyed listening.
> 
> Re: the video ideas - I've found your videos to be very informative - but would love to see you dissect the piece (or a part of it) - perhaps look at a few of your choices in processing/writing etc. and take us through it?
> 
> ...



I could do a disection video perhaps, could be interesting :D

For reverb, Its all about tweaking until it sounds good in a given situation. If you look on my Youtube channel I have a video about the reverb I use. http://www.youtube.com/user/dazexus

Dan


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## Daniel James (Feb 14, 2011)

Lloyd10 @ Mon Feb 14 said:


> Great work Dan, one thing that I also thought was good was the mastering of this
> cue.
> 
> Wondered what your weapon of choice was ?
> ...



Hey Lloyd, cheers for the kind words. My weapon of choice when it comes to mastering is TRacks3, I own some of the stand alone plugs too, but my main mastering plug is the main TRacks3 unit, on my master channel it normally goes EQ - Compression - 2ndEQ - Limiter...of course the settings totally depend on the track I am working on.

Dan


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## johan25 (Feb 14, 2011)

Great cue Daniel, looking forward to the video.

p.s. Thanks for your pm, you're a cool dude


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## Dracarys (Feb 14, 2011)

Great stuff Dan, did you master yourself?


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## Daniel James (Feb 14, 2011)

Casalena @ Mon Feb 14 said:


> Great stuff Dan, did you master yourself?



I did indeed...I sometimes think I should offload mixing and mastering to a fresher set of ears, although I think I'm doing ok.

Dan


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## Lloyd10 (Feb 14, 2011)

Cheers Dan thanks for the mastering info on this cue.

Bring on the vid!

Lloyd.


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## Ryan Scully (Feb 14, 2011)

Daniel James @ Mon Feb 14 said:


> Lloyd10 @ Mon Feb 14 said:
> 
> 
> > Hey Lloyd, cheers for the kind words. My weapon of choice when it comes to mastering is TRacks3, I own some of the stand alone plugs too, but my main mastering plug is the main TRacks3 unit, on my master channel it normally goes EQ - Compression - 2ndEQ - Limiter...of course the settings totally depend on the track I am working on.
> ...




Very interesting Dan - I own the original TRacks Mastering Suite and demo'd 3 about a year ago. I thought it definitely packed a huge punch for what was offered and felt that it was underrated as a whole... I had wondered how it would fare along with orchestral elements - You have obviously proved it's effectiveness in that category!

Ryan


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## Dracarys (Feb 14, 2011)

Yes that's always a good idea and usually the case if it's for a gig, but it sounds good.
Did you mix each individual stem from the session or did you master the wav as a whole by running it through a limiter, EQ, then compressor?


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## Patrick de Caumette (Feb 14, 2011)

Very cool, I dig it!


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## Daniel James (Feb 15, 2011)

Casalena @ Mon Feb 14 said:


> Yes that's always a good idea and usually the case if it's for a gig, but it sounds good.
> Did you mix each individual stem from the session or did you master the wav as a whole by running it through a limiter, EQ, then compressor?



I always mix the track as a whole, unless something needs its own extra bite...ie if I want the percussion to be a bit punchier I might compress that stem. Other than that, anything before the mastering stage is normally only reverb, slight EQ and level balance. And like I said earlier, for me the mastering order is EQ - Compression - EQ again - Limiter.

Dan


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## Daniel James (Feb 15, 2011)

Patrick de Caumette @ Mon Feb 14 said:


> Very cool, I dig it!



Thanks for taking the time to listen Patrick!

Just a note guys, I just received permission to make the videos, so I shall be getting onto them asap.

EDIT: Due to unexpected popularity I moved the link to soundcloud as my server bandwidth was taking a hit.

Dan


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## Dracarys (Feb 15, 2011)

Daniel James @ Tue Feb 15 said:


> Casalena @ Mon Feb 14 said:
> 
> 
> > Yes that's always a good idea and usually the case if it's for a gig, but it sounds good.
> ...




Cool, and my typo fault limiting is always before compression.


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## ricother (Feb 15, 2011)

Grrrrrreat work!!!
Impressive sound design.

o-[][]-o 


Love the "Zimmer style spic pattern" at 4:12, works really well.
The different atmospheres, the use of perc, the scratchy sounds, the tension... all amazing.

I'm eager to see the video :roll:


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## Daniel James (Feb 16, 2011)

Hey Guys,

I just uploaded Part 1 of my little, behind the score vids to youtube. This one covers the rhythmic bowed guitars.

Let me know if its to all over the place and/or pointless.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ehh6SYG94nw

Dan

p.s Should be in HD


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## Danny_Owen (Feb 16, 2011)

Great video Dan, I found it very insightful and coherent, definitely not all over the place!

Thanks for taking the time to do this


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## Daniel James (Feb 16, 2011)

Part 2 is online and is basically a general overview of the other elements of the track that are not bowed acoustic guitar.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOJ--muYLzw

Dan


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