# Do you think Apple will announce new M2 based Macs during the upcoming WWDC22 Event June 6-10 ?



## muziksculp (May 20, 2022)

Hi,

There is a lot of internet buzz going on about Apple announcing new M2 based Macs, during the upcoming June 6-10 WWDC22 Event.

What are your expectations ? 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


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## rnb_2 (May 20, 2022)

I don't think so - a "pre-announcement" of the Mac Pro, shipping later in the year, seems the most likely (mirroring 2019). WWDC isn't really a consumer event, and is also primarily a software event, so the announcement of new consumer hardware isn't the best fit. With the lead times on most Macs right now, it also doesn't seem like the best time to announce mass-market hardware and strain the supply chain even more.

That said, this is all just a feeling based on not many notable recent leaks, so anything is still possible.


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## AlphaCen (May 20, 2022)

All I really want to see is which direction they will go with AS Mac Pro. M2 will come eventually anyway.


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## gsilbers (May 20, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> I don't think so - a "pre-announcement" of the Mac Pro, shipping later in the year, seems the most likely (mirroring 2019). WWDC isn't really a consumer event, and is also primarily a software event, so the announcement of new consumer hardware isn't the best fit. With the lead times on most Macs right now, it also doesn't seem like the best time to announce mass-market hardware and strain the supply chain even more.
> 
> That said, this is all just a feeling based on not many notable recent leaks, so anything is still possible.



I agree. I think the focus will also be services which it hink makes almost double what macs make in revenue. 
ios16 for sure. 

AWith that said, some rumores mentioned a lot of macs in the pipeline so maybe not the mac pro but maybe a refresh on some models like the iMac so its as fast as the new macbooks. or most likley the macbook air with m2 so that way it can start getting peoples hopes up for the next gen of AS.

And yeah, those supply chain issue sure are creating havoc as well as the stock market. AS a CEO tim might say lets wait for it to have more stock impact or to catch up... or since the mac pro is made i the usa, it would help ease the issue happening in china. 

But one thing is for certain.. damn software upgrades grrrr :-/


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## Pier (May 20, 2022)

The rumor is Apple still needs to release the final M1 chip which will probably be for the Mac Pro. The JADE 4C Die in the chart below which basically will be 2 x M1 Ultra. This chart was released by John Siracusa when the M1 was released IIRC. So far it has been very accurate.

I don't think they will announce it after the M2 to be honest.


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## Cdnalsi (May 20, 2022)

I don't see it happening. WWDC is usually all about software, so I'm expecting announcements of iOS 16, MacOS 13?, and whatever else they're planning on that front.


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## rnb_2 (May 20, 2022)

Pier said:


> The rumor is Apple still needs to release the final M1 chip which will probably be for the Mac Pro. The JADE 4C Die in the chart below which basically will be 2 x M1 Ultra. This chart was released by John Siracusa when the M1 was released IIRC. So far it has been very accurate.
> 
> I don't think they will announce it after the M2 to be honest.


Apple said that the Ultra (Jade 2C-Die) was the "last M1", so it remains to be seen what they do to set the Mac Pro apart.


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## Pier (May 20, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> Apple said that the Ultra (Jade 2C-Die) was the "last M1", so it remains to be seen what they do to set the Mac Pro apart.


Oh you're right. I had completely forgotten about that!


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## rnb_2 (May 20, 2022)

Pier said:


> Oh you're right. I had completely forgotten about that!


Of course, there's nothing stopping them from pairing two Ultras somehow in a way that lets them get around that.


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## wayne_rowley (May 20, 2022)

No, too many issues affecting supply and manufacture at the moment. Probably announce the new Mac Pro. Earliest we’ll see M2 based Macs will be October I suspect, perhaps even 2023.


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## KEM (May 20, 2022)

Wasn’t the Pro Display XDR and Mac Pro announced at 2019s WWDC? I could see them at least announcing the refreshed Mac Pro, they’re working on the new Pro Display XDR right now as well but the announcement for that will probably be delayed due to the supply chain shortage for displays

As far as M2 goes, it will only be a refresh of the base model, it’ll still be weaker than the M1 Pro/Max/Ultra, so I honestly wouldn’t even worry about it. But now that I think about it, they might not announce a Mac Pro cause it will use the quad M1 chip that’s been rumored but since the Ultra is the last of the M1 lineup it would completely go against their word as well as make their product cycle very confusing if they announced another M1 chip or announced a quad M2 before even announcing the other models, so who knows…


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## AlphaCen (May 21, 2022)

M2 might offer better single core performance, so I am looking forward to it. As for Mac Pro, they’ve pre-announced 2019 model at WWDC, so I’m cautiously optimistic…

Ultra was supposed to be the last chip from M1 family, so AS Mac Pro might be something different altogether , if they want to keep RAM and GPU upgradeable (unlikely, but one can dream).


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## holywilly (May 21, 2022)

Fingers crossed for user serviceable ram upgrade. That’s all I’m hoping for the upcoming Mac Pro.


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## davidson (May 21, 2022)

If the price was right and it had user accessible drive slots, I could be tempted by a new mac pro...


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## KEM (May 21, 2022)

holywilly said:


> Fingers crossed for user serviceable ram upgrade. That’s all I’m hoping for the upcoming Mac Pro.



That’s the issue, ram is built directly into the Apple Silicon processors so currently that isn’t an option. But I’d imagine it’ll be possible to have more ram on the motherboard that is activated when the AS ram gets maxed out but it would just be a bit slower, I’m not an engineer so I have no idea if that’s technically possible but it makes sense from a power perspective


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## T-LeffoH (May 21, 2022)

Unless Apple is going to slash their margins for users on upgrade costs, I don't see how they'll offer a 1.5 TB RAM upgrade for new M2 Mac Pro without a huge purchase price.

I'm about due for an upgrade to a machine that will last another 10+ years but don't see myself investing in a Mac Pro where there are costly limitations on RAM & storage upgrades.

I'd be better off replacing my current VE Pro PC and had been considering getting a Mac Studio as a main. 🤷‍♂️


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## muziksculp (May 21, 2022)

Hi,

Thanks for all the speculations, predictions, and feedback on this topic. 

And just to mix things up a bit, what are the expectations from Intel, and AMD as far their response to the Apple Silicon Processor line ? Could they come up with faster, more energy efficient chips in the near future, meaning this year ? or is Mac ahead of both Intel, and AMD for now, and the near future ? 

I'm just entertaining the idea of moving back to a well spec'd Mac Pro that will use their next generation AS chip. I have been using PC for the past 10 years, so this will be a drastic switch for me, especially if Intel and AMD are still behind Apple by Q4 of this year.


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## T-LeffoH (May 21, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> Thanks for all the speculations, predictions, and feedback on this topic.
> 
> ...


At the end of the day, I’m not sure how much Intel or AMD are worried about energy efficiency of their chips as a strategic response to Apple, as their business model being component manufacturers is different than Apple’s. They have their chips in so many different places as is.

They certainly have an agreement to continue to work together & support current-gen products but the discontinuation of Intel chips in portable Macs didn’t seem to cause much of a fuss.

Who knows, maybe Apple will use this timing as an opportunity to make M2 Mac Pro models with near 6-figure max upgrade costs. It would be a way of ensuring pro models are limited to use more by professionals with huge budgets. 🤷‍♂️


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## Cdnalsi (May 22, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> And just to mix things up a bit, what are the expectations from Intel, and AMD as far their response to the Apple Silicon Processor line ? *Could they come up with faster, more energy efficient chips in the near future, meaning this year ? or is Mac ahead of both Intel, and AMD for now, and the near future ?*


My understanding of the scene is that Apple is quite a lot more ahead in the game compared to Intel and AMD, and not just by a few quarters, or a few years even. 

They've pretty much revolutionised performance to energy efficiency chips to a degree that I don't see the other two catching up in the near future (or at all really if Apple keeps pushing the envelope with new Ms every couple of years or so).

Anecdotally my upgrade from an i9 6core Intel chip (2018 MBP) to the M1 Pro 10core felt like going 10 years into the future, from the actual incredible performance to how the fans don't ever seem to need to spin up, even with a huge template running, to the battery life maxing out iStat Menus at 20 hour reported. I've been doing my work on laptops since 2006 and this new MBP is giving me even more than desktop performance, and then it's unreal how it tops it off by being able to close the lid and slide it in my backpack and continue my work on the other side of the world the next day.


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## cedricm (May 22, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> There is a lot of internet buzz going on about Apple announcing new M2 based Macs, during the upcoming June 6-10 WWDC22 Event.
> 
> ...


It will. 
My guess is that the M2 will be produced in TSMC's 3 or 4 nm, for which Apple has secured a one-year or morr exclusivity, copy the formula that served Intel very well for decades, before being managed by accountants and losing its 1 generation or more advance in manufacturing process.


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## T-LeffoH (May 22, 2022)

Cdnalsi said:


> Anecdotally my upgrade from an i9 6core Intel chip (2018 MBP) to the M1 Pro 10core felt like going 10 years into the future


The chip performance benchmarks have made me consider upgrading to the Mac Studio M1 ultra, as they’ll keep that compatible with OS upgrades for a long time. It seems to be benchmarking ahead of many existing Mac Pro models.


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## Vik (May 23, 2022)

The M2 probably have some major improvement over the M1, and we may see that when M2 Pro/Mac/Ultra are released, their benefits are important for the kind of work VI users and video editors do. 

It's probably wise to wait and check out what they'll announce and _when the release will happen_ before investing in something M1 based now.


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## vitocorleone123 (May 23, 2022)

Cdnalsi said:


> My understanding of the scene is that Apple is quite a lot more ahead in the game compared to Intel and AMD, and not just by a few quarters, or a few years even.
> 
> They've pretty much revolutionised performance to energy efficiency chips to a degree that I don't see the other two catching up in the near future (or at all really if Apple keeps pushing the envelope with new Ms every couple of years or so).
> 
> Anecdotally my upgrade from an i9 6core Intel chip (2018 MBP) to the M1 Pro 10core felt like going 10 years into the future, from the actual incredible performance to how the fans don't ever seem to need to spin up, even with a huge template running, to the battery life maxing out iStat Menus at 20 hour reported. I've been doing my work on laptops since 2006 and this new MBP is giving me even more than desktop performance, and then it's unreal how it tops it off by being able to close the lid and slide it in my backpack and continue my work on the other side of the world the next day.


Apple definitely rules when it comes to performance per watt. Intel and AMD are focused on performance (and they are faster and will continue to be faster unless Apple shifts strategy). I don’t see Apple holding the top performance slots in the next few years anymore than I see Intel/AMD holding the top efficiency slots.

For me this just means-
For a laptop: Mac.
For a desktop: Intel or AMD


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## Pier (May 23, 2022)

vitocorleone123 said:


> Apple definitely rules when it comes to performance per watt. Intel and AMD are focused on performance (and they are faster and will continue to be faster unless Apple shifts strategy). I don’t see Apple holding the top performance slots in the next few years anymore than I see Intel/AMD holding the top efficiency slots.
> 
> For me this just means-
> For a laptop: Mac.
> For a desktop: Intel or AMD


Yeah I think Apple will lead perf per watt for at least a couple of years. Honestly I don't see the point in buying a Windows laptop these days unless someone is deeply dependent of the Windows ecosystem (eg: gaming).

For desktop, Apple must know it needs to do something. I would be surprised if it didn't have have an ace up its sleeve. We'll see what happens at WWDC.


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## rnb_2 (Jun 5, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> I don't think so - a "pre-announcement" of the Mac Pro, shipping later in the year, seems the most likely (mirroring 2019). WWDC isn't really a consumer event, and is also primarily a software event, so the announcement of new consumer hardware isn't the best fit. With the lead times on most Macs right now, it also doesn't seem like the best time to announce mass-market hardware and strain the supply chain even more.
> 
> That said, this is all just a feeling based on not many notable recent leaks, so anything is still possible.


As we get close to the event, it now seems very likely that we will see M2 machines announced at WWDC - the MacBook Air, one or two variations of the Mac mini, and possibly a revision of the 13" MacBook Pro. Still unknown whether these will be accompanied by the Mac Pro.


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## Pier (Jun 5, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> As we get close to the event, it now seems very likely that we will see M2 machines announced at WWDC - the MacBook Air, one or two variations of the Mac mini, and possibly a revision of the 13" MacBook Pro. Still unknown whether these will be accompanied by the Mac Pro.


Maybe Apple needed something special for the Mac Pro and that's why they waited until the M2.

Or maybe there will never be another modular tower Mac 😂

I wonder how much of an improvement over the M1 the M2 will be.


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## rnb_2 (Jun 5, 2022)

Pier said:


> Maybe Apple needed something special for the Mac Pro and that's why they waited until the M2.
> 
> Or maybe there will never be another modular tower Mac 😂
> 
> I wonder how much of an improvement over the M1 the M2 will be.


We're 12-14 hours from finding out...


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## Pier (Jun 5, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> We're 12-14 hours from finding out...


Who knows. Maybe not.

I've been disappointed too many times by Apple events that I'd rather not expect anything.


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## muziksculp (Jun 5, 2022)

Looking forward to the Apple event tomorrow.


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## AndrewS (Jun 6, 2022)

Apple's taken down the Apple Store ahead of the stream today, which they generally do before announcing new hardware. Doesn't happen every time, but happens enough that there's probably a non-zero chance they're announcing something new, potentially with the ability to buy immediately.


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## Pier (Jun 6, 2022)




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## gsilbers (Jun 6, 2022)

not sure if anyone else saw but a new mac mini m2 info was leaked. And also a mac mini tower. whatevr that is. 

Kinda sucks knowing this far ahead about m2 of you are thinking about the mac studio with m1. 

Yes, it will take maybe until next year for the studio to get update to m2, but still, if you are planning on keeping the ultra for 5-10 years this is not very reassuring. 

Unless it turns into a car lease sort of scenario where every 2-3 years you just get the new mac studio and keep paying $100-200 a month. Have external audio drive and just do mac migrator tool and everything works after an hour transfer. 
And i would still wodnt be comfy with that.


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## Pier (Jun 6, 2022)

gsilbers said:


> Yes, it will take maybe until next year for the studio to get update to m2, but still, if you are planning on keeping the ultra for 5-10 years this is not very reassuring.


Why though?

Of course every year there will be new things.

And there are still people using the trash cans which are quite underwhelming in terms of performance compared to the Mac Studio.


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## gsilbers (Jun 6, 2022)

Pier said:


> Why though?
> 
> Of course every year there will be new things.
> 
> And there are still people using the trash cans which are quite underwhelming in terms of performance compared to the Mac Studio.


its the not knowing i guess. If i know there will be a new mac pro, ill be waiting for it just in case. 

iphone we know its a new one every sept. but macs still dont have that yet. Many of us still have the mac pro from 10 years ago and for $5-6k we'd want something that lasts another 10 as being one of the best. 

but i know the ulta studio will still be more than great.


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## NuNativs (Jun 6, 2022)

M2 with 24GB memory max, ouch...


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## NoamL (Jun 6, 2022)

so if M1 started as 16GB max, M1Pro was 32, M1Max was 64 and M1Ultra was 128...

...then the M2Ultra might eventually support 192GB?

It doesn't seem like a huge advancement. Meanwhile CPU on the M1Max is working great for all my audio tasks.


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## Composer 2021 (Jun 6, 2022)

24 GB is certainly an improvement over 16 GB. Could make for a decent mobile rig.


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## AndyP (Jun 6, 2022)

gsilbers said:


> not sure if anyone else saw but a new mac mini m2 info was leaked. And also a mac mini tower. whatevr that is.
> 
> Kinda sucks knowing this far ahead about m2 of you are thinking about the mac studio with m1.
> 
> ...


24 is better than 16 and better than 8. But for 8 GB Ram 230 € more - from 16 to 24, is hefty. 
The next Mac Book with 32 GB will then already cost 2.700 €. 
The M2 is supposed to be as fast as an MBPro 14 inch M1 Pro 8 cores.

A MacBook Air with 24 GB Ram, 512 GB memory costs as much as a MacStudio Max1 with 32 GB Ram. 

Apple is once again not making it easy for people.

Where did you see the info on the new Mac Minis? This then becomes even more confusing for those interested in a MacStudio (as long as more than 24 GB Ram is offered).


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## gsilbers (Jun 6, 2022)

AndyP said:


> 24 is better than 16 and better than 8. But for 8 GB Ram 230 € more - from 16 to 24, is hefty.
> The next Mac Book with 32 GB will then already cost 2.700 €.
> The M2 is supposed to be as fast as an MBPro 14 inch M1 Pro 8 cores.
> 
> ...


some reseller posted it two days ago. you can google. its just the specs used for the product but nothing else. 

Maybe they mssed up or maybe apple will add it a ltitle later. macs are not really apples main selling point anymore so imo, if they take too much time in another event they just push it straight to the store.


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## gsilbers (Jun 6, 2022)

NoamL said:


> so if M1 started as 16GB max, M1Pro was 32, M1Max was 64 and M1Ultra was 128...
> 
> ...then the M2Ultra might eventually support 192GB?
> 
> It doesn't seem like a huge advancement. Meanwhile CPU on the M1Max is working great for all my audio tasks.



just trying to imaging the price on that 192gb ram lol.
well, those mac pro users would not be so happy though.

I dont think that many folks use that much ram so even though it might have it, the price would probably be exponentially higher as such low amount of units would be sold and economy of scale woudnt be on its side.


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## Antonio Zarza (Jun 6, 2022)

So 48Gb for M2 Pro and 96Gb M2 Max, which in most cases could be enough. 192Gb is also pretty amazing but as @gsilbers says, for the Mac Pro people is not going to be good enough. I’m wondering how Apple is going to deal with Mac Pro users, we’ll see but is a bit uncertain.


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## gsilbers (Jun 6, 2022)

Antonio Zarza said:


> So 48Gb for M2 Pro and 96Gb M2 Max, which in most cases could be enough. 192Gb is also pretty amazing but as @gsilbers says, for the Mac Pro people is not going to be good enough. I’m wondering how Apple is going to deal with Mac Pro users, we’ll see but is a bit uncertain.



Im sure they have a plan though. And I think the mac studio ultra is part of it. But having said that there might be a new mac pro, and now releasing an m2 for their "first" new M series we are starting to see a pattern of first its macbook air to test the waters, then do the mini and then better MacBooks and later mac studio. 

Apple knows we studio guys are the most vocal while givnig the least profit to apple. 

So my guess its to make the new mac pro prohibitive expensive while making the mac studio very desirable at a price akin to what windows users are used to for similar performance and upgrade timelines. 3-6 years. 

But i find it intresting that not many pro composers are not too open about that mac studio and dont want to see a trashcan scenario again. And want to get that magic 5,1 mac pro they experienced a while back.. myself included. 
but i admit seeing the bench marks and seeing 128gb of ram i dont think id neeed a new mac for many years to come.


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## AndyP (Jun 6, 2022)

Somehow I find it incomprehensible that RAM upgrades on the M1 and M1 pro are twice as expensive as on the M1 Max (in terms of RAM per money). 
Technically, there should be no reason for this.


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## gsilbers (Jun 6, 2022)

oh except that the new m2 cpu is 18% faster than the m1. :/

darn it.


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## gsilbers (Jun 6, 2022)

AndyP said:


> Somehow I find it incomprehensible that RAM upgrades on the M1 and M1 pro are twice as expensive as on the M1 Max (in terms of RAM per money).
> Technically, there should be no reason for this.


on the laptops?


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## AndyP (Jun 6, 2022)

gsilbers said:


> on the laptops?


Desktop and Laptops.


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## Pier (Jun 6, 2022)

A bit disappointed with the M2 stuff announced today.

According to Apple it's a 20% CPU increase and a 30% GPU increase. It's ok but I feel it doesn't really justify a 20% price increase. I think Apple has put the Air into MBP territory and essentially killed the "great value laptop for everyone" reputation the Air had for the past 10 years.

Also no desktop machines announced...


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## AndyP (Jun 6, 2022)

The MBPro M2 is actually cheaper than the new Air M2 with the same features.


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## rnb_2 (Jun 6, 2022)

gsilbers said:


> some reseller posted it two days ago. you can google. its just the specs used for the product but nothing else.
> 
> Maybe they mssed up or maybe apple will add it a ltitle later. macs are not really apples main selling point anymore so imo, if they take too much time in another event they just push it straight to the store.


That was the B&H "leak", which turned out to be rumored products on inactive pages, with no actual inside information. It seemed weird when I saw it, since resellers don't usually get advance heads-up on new products to keep a lid on leaks just like this.


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## Antonio Zarza (Jun 6, 2022)

Pier said:


> A bit disappointed with the M2 stuff announced today.
> 
> According to Apple it's a 20% CPU increase and a 30% GPU increase. It's ok but I feel it doesn't really justify a 20% price increase. I think Apple has put the Air into MBP territory and essentially killed the "great value laptop for everyone" reputation the Air had for the past 10 years.
> 
> Also no desktop machines announced...


Amen. They just don’t want to lower the price for the M1 Air so instead they start at higher price for the new one. The M1 could cost 799$ and the M2 999$ starting point, but I also still see in some stores MacBook Airs with intel chip at 850€ which is insane knowing that these chips are not gonna to have software updates very soon…

We can’t expect also M2 Pro and Max this fall right?


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## Pier (Jun 6, 2022)

gsilbers said:


> but i admit seeing the bench marks and seeing 128gb of ram i dont think id neeed a new mac for many years to come.


For audio work, I feel like the CPU and RAM requirements have been increasing much slower than with other types of work.

In video, the resolution has been quadrupling every couple of years. From 1080p to 4K, to 8K, and now 16K cameras. All with RAW workflows. In gaming and 3D work the hardware gets left behind in a matter of years too.



AndyP said:


> The MBPro M2 is actually cheaper than the new Air M2 with the same features.


Is it?

Here in Mexico the base M2 Air costs $1,500 and the base M2 MBP costs $1,600 USD. Both are 8GB of RAM and 256GB of SSD.


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## rnb_2 (Jun 6, 2022)

AndyP said:


> The MBPro M2 is actually cheaper than the new Air M2 with the same features.


I think they're actually effectively the same price, at least in the US. You can get the Air with the binned 8GPU core chip for $100 less, which accounts for the price difference on the base Air vs the base 13" MacBook Pro.

Not going to lie - the Air in Midnight is gorgeous. However, configured with 24GB of RAM and 2TB of storage, it's $2500, just $800 less than my M1 Pro 14" 32GB/2TB. That does seem a bit on the high side by comparison.


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## gsilbers (Jun 6, 2022)

Pier said:


> A bit disappointed with the M2 stuff announced today.
> 
> According to Apple it's a 20% CPU increase and a 30% GPU increase. It's ok but I feel it doesn't really justify a 20% price increase. I think Apple has put the Air into MBP territory and essentially killed the "great value laptop for everyone" reputation the Air had for the past 10 years.
> 
> Also no desktop machines announced...



Maybe the m1 was their introduction to a new product. Like how new sample library give an intro discount  

Once it was confirmed it was a hit performance wise, the swith now can happen. Of course they can also say inflation... the times etc. 

well, now those m1 might come down in price which are still very good imo.


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## Pier (Jun 6, 2022)

gsilbers said:


> Maybe the m1 was their introduction to a new product. Like how new sample library give an intro discount
> 
> Once it was confirmed it was a hit performance wise, the swith now can happen. Of course they can also say inflation... the times etc.
> 
> well, now those m1 might come down in price which are still very good imo.


I wonder what will happen with the M3.

Will Apple keep current prices for the M3 base machines and lower the M2 prices?

Or will Apple keep the M2 prices and increase the M3 prices another 20%?


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## ptram (Jun 6, 2022)

gsilbers said:


> dont want to see a trashcan scenario again.


My 6,1 Trashcan can be expanded to 128 GB with standard RAM modules, and the internal drive can be replaced with any NVMe module you like. Not all that bad scenario, it seems to me.

Paolo


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## rnb_2 (Jun 6, 2022)

AndyP said:


> Somehow I find it incomprehensible that RAM upgrades on the M1 and M1 pro are twice as expensive as on the M1 Max (in terms of RAM per money).
> Technically, there should be no reason for this.


I don't think this is right. It's $200 to go from 8GB to 16GB on M1/M2. It's $400 to go from 16GB to 32GB on M1 Pro, and $800 to go from 32GB to 64GB on M1 Max. If you figure a price of $200 for the base 8GB, each 16GB increment is $400.


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## Nimrod7 (Jun 6, 2022)

Those prices are insane.
I brought my Intel MacBook Air 2020, 16GB, 512 Storage, €1421.
Same specs for the M2, costs now €2109!

The display is another league, but on the other hand they were paying Intel large sums of money while now they manufacture their SOCs themselves.

The Air was a great entry level machine for students and people that needs portability. Not anymore.


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## davidson (Jun 6, 2022)

Nimrod7 said:


> Those prices are insane.
> I brought my Intel MacBook Air 2020, 16GB, 512 Storage, €1421.
> Same specs for the M2, costs now €2109!
> 
> ...


But the M2 air is what, something crazy like 5x more powerful than the intel, way better screen, way better drive, way faster ram...the list goes on.


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## vitocorleone123 (Jun 6, 2022)

If it's any comfort, I saw an Intel-based, rather large gaming laptop with top end everything announced for something like $6000. I speculate it would get 30 - 60 min of battery life running at full tilt.....

https://arstechnica.com/gadgets/202...s-up-to-6000-comes-with-intel-hx-series-cpus/

Pick yer poison. There's always trade-offs that differ per person. That crazy Intel-based laptop will be faster than the Apple ones at a lot of tasks. But that battery life! For a laptop, I'd still stick with Apple for now.

(not trying to bash or trash anyone or anything - I use both OS every day... just wanted to help with perspective on what great mobile solutions Apple does offer, for a price)


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## gsilbers (Jun 6, 2022)

ptram said:


> My 6,1 Trashcan can be expanded to 128 GB with standard RAM modules, and the internal drive can be replaced with any NVMe module you like. Not all that bad scenario, it seems to me.
> 
> Paolo


Yeah it’s good. But in general it wasn’t regarded as a good Mac Pro and many profesionals really poopooed it at the time. And seen as a failed Apple product


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## AndyP (Jun 6, 2022)

Apple Store Germany:
Mac Studio / Mac Book Max +32





Mac Book Air / Pro M2 +16


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## Nimrod7 (Jun 6, 2022)

davidson said:


> But the M2 air is what, something crazy like 5x more powerful than the intel, way better screen, way better drive, way faster ram...the list goes on.


yes it’s more powerful, in the past generations of intel were also more powerful, but the prices were stable more or less. That’s a 47% price increase.

The cost of manufacturing the components is also significantly lower than paying Intel. They have R&D costs now, and not sure how that balances out.


----------



## rnb_2 (Jun 6, 2022)

Nimrod7 said:


> Those prices are insane.
> I brought my Intel MacBook Air 2020, 16GB, 512 Storage, €1421.
> Same specs for the M2, costs now €2109!
> 
> ...


Prices are up on everything these days, though, and I'm sure the development costs for the M2 in the age of Covid were higher than M1 before Covid. One thing Apple will never do is give away margin, so if the actual bill of materials comes in a little over $100 more than the M1 Air, Apple will always raise the price by $200 to avoid losing profit margin.


----------



## gsilbers (Jun 6, 2022)

Nimrod7 said:


> Those prices are insane.
> I brought my Intel MacBook Air 2020, 16GB, 512 Storage, €1421.
> Same specs for the M2, costs now €2109!
> 
> ...




Apple still sells the m1 version so maybe that the plan going forward.

Like they have the previous iPhone versions being sold along side the new ones.


----------



## gsilbers (Jun 6, 2022)

Nimrod7 said:


> yes it’s more powerful, in the past generations of intel were also more powerful, but the prices were stable more or less. That’s a 47% price increase.
> 
> The cost of manufacturing the components is also significantly lower than paying Intel. They have R&D costs now, and not sure how that balances out.



I think it’s the other way around;

People got used to paying those prices so they are getting more money for the same product.
Which was the main intention all along.

Plus intel dropped the ball w the heat/fan noise.


----------



## rnb_2 (Jun 6, 2022)

AndyP said:


> Apple Store Germany:
> Mac Studio / Mac Book Max +32
> 
> 
> ...


*Edit - this paragraph is incorrect, as explained in post #98 *_This isn't true on the laptop side, only the desktop. There is no base laptop config with the Max - they all start as M1 Pro, with Max as an upgrade. As soon as you select a Max CPU on the laptop, it adds the extra cost for the CPU + $400 to upgrade the RAM from 16 to 32GB. You can then upgrade to 64GB for another $800. It is interesting that the RAM price is so low on the Studio, though._

Edit: the only explanation I have for the cheap RAM upgrade on the Max/Ultra is that the base price on the 32GB Max and 64GB Ultra is effectively subsidizing the RAM cost (so the base configs are effectively priced a bit high).


----------



## Pier (Jun 6, 2022)

davidson said:


> But the M2 air is what, something crazy like 5x more powerful than the intel, way better screen, way better drive, way faster ram...the list goes on.


Yes but I think the main point @Nimrod7 is making is that the Air is in another category now.

It's not a popular device anymore (as in a device for the people). For all intents and purposes it has become a thin MBP.

The M1 Air fills that niche for now, but for how long?


----------



## rnb_2 (Jun 6, 2022)

Pier said:


> Yes but I think the main point @Nimrod7 is making is that the Air is in another category now.
> 
> It's not a popular device anymore (as in a device for the people). For all intents and purposes it has become a thin MBP.
> 
> The M1 Air fills that niche for now, but for how long?


I think they'll keep that M1 Air around to hold down the $999 price until they can put something else there - they know that's a price point that they really need to hit.


----------



## FireGS (Jun 6, 2022)

Soooo from what I'm gathering, right now is a rather poor time to be buying a laptop for pleasure...


----------



## Pier (Jun 6, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> I think they'll keep that M1 Air around to hold down the $999 price until they can put something else there - they know that's a price point that they really need to hit.


What do you think will happen with the M2 Mini?


----------



## rnb_2 (Jun 6, 2022)

Pier said:


> What do you think will happen with the M2 Mini?


Interesting question. On the one hand, there's no screen to improve and add cost, so it may depend on exactly how much R&D they put into a new enclosure (assuming they do that). Also, they probably sell 10 MacBook Airs for every Mac mini (if not more), so the Air is probably bearing the brunt of paying off the M2 development. The mini did get a price cut from Intel to M1, so they do have that to claw back if they want to, but maybe they won't? Or they can continue with the Tim Cook doctrine, and keep the old one around to hold down the bottom price point.


----------



## dunamisstudio (Jun 6, 2022)




----------



## Nachivnik (Jun 6, 2022)

FireGS said:


> Soooo from what I'm gathering, right now is a rather poor time to be buying a laptop for pleasure...


Seems as good a time as any. What concern are you feeling? At first blush, none of it feels particularly "must have." Perhaps the lineup feels too confusing? Nonetheless, you can still buy an M1 MacBook Air, you can pay more and buy an M2 MacBook Air, get a 24GB RAM 13" MacBook Pro if you like the Touch Bar, or a 14" MacBook Pro if you don't. Lots of choices.


----------



## FireGS (Jun 6, 2022)

Nachivnik said:


> Seems as good a time as any. What concern are you feeling?


Prices/inflation, mainly


----------



## NoamL (Jun 6, 2022)

Seems like the calculus doesn't really change from this announcement. Right now the Studio is an excellent DAW + host. Eventually.. in like a year?.... the Mac Pro will drop.... with the M2 chip?.... and with 3-5x across the board stats vs the Mac Studio M1Ultra and then it's just "do you want 3x the computer."


----------



## Saxer (Jun 6, 2022)

With the StudioMac available I don't really see the need to get a ProMac. At least for music related tasks it's a great machine. If you don't need more than 128GB RAM I don't think it's worth to pay for a MacPro just to host a few SSDs inside.

I don't have a StudioMac yet but I'll order one in the following weeks.


----------



## muziksculp (Jun 6, 2022)

Hi,

I'm going to wait for the next generation Mac Book Pro laptops, with the more powerful M2 processor options to be out, most likely during 2023.

Meanwhile, I decided to invest into replacing my 9 year old Studio computers. PCs (not Macs). I will be commissioning a custom PC developer to build two i9 Intel PCs. with the latest, and fastest processors, 128 GB of RAM in each PC, and water-cooled system, no fans, if that's feasible. I hate the noise fans make. 

I also wonder when Intel will be able to compete with the Apple Silicon M1/M2/...etc Micro Processors Apple is producing ? They surely know they can't just be sitting idle, given the current situation. Especially the energy efficient Silicon Processors. Which is one of the biggest issues Intel has at this time with their high-energy, and heat generating processors. Also battery life, which is a big thing for laptops.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## ennbr (Jun 6, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> water-cooled system, no fans, if that's feasible. I hate the noise fans make


you still need fans in a water cooled system to cool the radiator


----------



## muziksculp (Jun 6, 2022)

ennbr said:


> you still need fans in a water cooled system to cool the radiator


But less noisy, I'm guessing.


----------



## ennbr (Jun 6, 2022)

they use 3 very large fans running very slow to cool the radiator so very quite


----------



## muziksculp (Jun 6, 2022)

ennbr said:


> they use 3 very large fans running very slow to cool the radiator so very quite


Thanks for the feedback.  

That's what matters to me. To have Super Quiet PCs. My current machine is super noisy, I got used to the hum the fans make, but when I turn it OFF, I finally can enjoy silence, which is impossible to experience if my Master PC is running. Unless I use headphones, which I hate using when composing, or mixing.


----------



## wayne_rowley (Jun 6, 2022)

ennbr said:


> they use 3 very large fans running very slow to cool the radiator so very quite


Don’t forget the noise of the pump and the gurgle of fluid if you have any air in the system! I also don’t think you want to run an i9 without any additional case fans.


----------



## Eulenauge66 (Jun 7, 2022)

I always wonder what you guys want with even more power, PC or Mac. I am running a MacStudio M1 Max, and a PC Slave via VEP. Full orchestral templates, hundreds of tracks, and I am mixing and mastering inside the project. My machines are still completely bored by that. So, are you planning world domination or what?


----------



## ptram (Jun 7, 2022)

gsilbers said:


> Yeah it’s good. But in general it wasn’t regarded as a good Mac Pro and many profesionals really poopooed it at the time. And seen as a failed Apple product


And nine years later we are here discussing of marginally more powerful computers, with non-expandable limited memory and storage, questionable design, possibly noisier, and drooling for them! 

Paolo


----------



## ridgero (Jun 7, 2022)

The progress from the M2 is great, but the MacBook Air M2 is very expensive.


----------



## Alex Fraser (Jun 7, 2022)

An M2 Mac Mini with 24gb of ram would be a lovely sweet spot for those of us who don't regularly use multi-mic orchestral setups. 

Any thoughts on if/when that might happen? Assuming it would be very low hanging fruit from a technical perspective and more down to supply and marketing..


----------



## wayne_rowley (Jun 7, 2022)

Alex Fraser said:


> An M2 Mac Mini with 24gb of ram would be a lovely sweet spot for those of us who don't regularly use multi-mic orchestral setups.
> 
> Any thoughts on if/when that might happen? Assuming it would be very low hanging fruit from a technical perspective and more down to supply and marketing..


October at the earliest I would say. 

Frankly, I'd really want a Mini with an M2 'Pro' that maybe could go to 32Gb or 48GB of RAM.


----------



## Alex Fraser (Jun 7, 2022)

wayne_rowley said:


> October at the earliest I would say.
> 
> Frankly, I'd really want a Mini with an M2 'Pro' that maybe could go to 32Gb or 48GB of RAM.


Yeah, that would be a great choice. I guess it depends on how near Apple want to "nudge up" to the Studio spec.

That's what's interesting to me now - these new CPU's are so flexible (iPad Pro, fan-less in the Air, cooled in the 'Pro) that the choice and machine availability is as much down to Apple's chosen market position as it is technical considerations. At least that's how it appears.


----------



## SharpDal (Jun 7, 2022)

Eulenauge66 said:


> So, are you planning world domination or what?


Yes, and my cat agrees. I guess we have to still wait for the new Mac Pro. Don't have the bucks yet, but I'm very anxious to know what technical aces Apple has in its sleeves. Interesting times...


----------



## easyrider (Jun 7, 2022)

WWDC 2022: Apple announces new M2 Macbook Air and macOS Ventura, introducing high-end features at an entry-level price


Apple has announced the development of its new M2 architecture at this year's WWDC, which features on the new MacBook Pro and MacBook Air.




musictech.com


----------



## easyrider (Jun 7, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> I'm going to wait for the next generation Mac Book Pro laptops, with the more powerful M2 processor options to be out, most likely during 2023.
> 
> ...


AM5 is coming from AMD…why are you even contemplating Intel?


I’ve been building custom PCs for decades and it’s amazes me the Intel bias in this forum….


----------



## Manaberry (Jun 7, 2022)

$200 to add 8GB of RAM. Hope it's all made of gold.


----------



## Antonio Zarza (Jun 7, 2022)

Its DDR5 RAM, maybe is for that reason while in M1 is DDR4, Am I right?


----------



## Manaberry (Jun 7, 2022)

It's LPDDR5 yes. But the price changes with the density of the die. 8GB die is usually the cheapest.


----------



## muziksculp (Jun 7, 2022)

easyrider said:


> AM5 is coming from AMD…why are you even contemplating Intel?
> 
> 
> I’ve been building custom PCs for decades and it’s amazes me the Intel bias in this forum….


I don't build them, I have them custom made for me by a company. They prefer Intel. I asked them about AMD, but they prefer using Intel for Audio Workstations.


----------



## AndyP (Jun 7, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> This isn't true on the laptop side, only the desktop. There is no base laptop config with the Max - they all start as M1 Pro, with Max as an upgrade. As soon as you select a Max CPU on the laptop, it adds the extra cost for the CPU + $400 to upgrade the RAM from 16 to 32GB. You can then upgrade to 64GB for another $800. It is interesting that the RAM price is so low on the Studio, though.
> 
> Edit: the only explanation I have for the cheap RAM upgrade on the Max/Ultra is that the base price on the 32GB Max and 64GB Ultra is effectively subsidizing the RAM cost (so the base configs are effectively priced a bit high).


There is a third option to order a 16" MacBook Pro Max! Seems to be new.

M2 8 to 24 costs 400$. +16
M1 Pro 16 to 32 costs 400$. +16
M1 Max from 32 to 64 costs $400. +32 (speaking for the M1 Max base models)

That is, in relation twice the price. Maybe you mean the same, since one can only upgrade the MAX to 64GB. Still, the upgrade on the Max is half the price.
It may be for design reasons, but I still find the prices for RAM in the entry-level models much too high. I think $400 for 32 GB for the Studio is more appropriate.


----------



## easyrider (Jun 7, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> I don't build them, I have them custom made for me by a company. They prefer Intel. I asked them about AMD, but they prefer using Intel for Audio Workstations.


🤭


----------



## rnb_2 (Jun 7, 2022)

AndyP said:


> There is a third option to order a 16" MacBook Pro Max! Seems to be new.
> 
> M2 8 to 24 costs 400$. +16
> M1 Pro 16 to 32 costs 400$. +16
> ...


You're right - I fooled myself by looking at the base M1 Pro MacBook and it shows the 64GB upgrade as $800, but that's when you're at the base 16GB of the Pro. As soon as you select the M1 Max, the 32 to 64GB upgrade drops to $400. However, it appears this isn't new - I checked the remaining Intel Mac mini pricing, and it's $200 to go from 8 to 16GB, $400 to go from 16 to 32GB, and another $400 to go from 32 to 64GB - the same pattern as on the M1 Max/Ultra, where the big RAM upgrade is ½ the price of the lower upgrades.

I know that Apple used to be famously expensive for all RAM upgrades, and they adjusted prices down at some point, but maybe they adjusted more at the top end (lower sales volume) than the bottom?


----------



## egroys (Jun 7, 2022)

Antonio Zarza said:


> Its DDR5 RAM, maybe is for that reason while in M1 is DDR4, Am I right?


I am curious about this as well and how that affects loading large, orchestral multi-mic, whole enchilada templates...


----------



## egroys (Jun 7, 2022)

Eulenauge66 said:


> I always wonder what you guys want with even more power, PC or Mac. I am running a MacStudio M1 Max, and a PC Slave via VEP. Full orchestral templates, hundreds of tracks, and I am mixing and mastering inside the project. My machines are still completely bored by that. So, are you planning world domination or what?


This is EXACTLY what I have been wondering about! Do you have 128gb of ram and what's your experience with 'unified' memory in terms of VEP usage? Are you doing a lot of multi-mic and legatos?

Thanks in advance!


----------



## Composer 2021 (Jun 8, 2022)

Alex Fraser said:


> An M2 Mac Mini with 24gb of ram would be a lovely sweet spot for those of us who don't regularly use multi-mic orchestral setups.


I tend to use single mic setups while editing a project and then do the mic mixing for each track individually at the end. Do you think 24 GB is really enough for an orchestral setup?


----------



## Alex Fraser (Jun 8, 2022)

Composer 2021 said:


> I tend to use single mic setups while editing a project and then do the mic mixing for each track individually at the end. Do you think 24 GB is really enough for an orchestral setup?


Single mic? Sure, I'd think so. Multi-mic? Probably into "how long is a piece of string" territory..


----------



## Eulenauge66 (Jun 13, 2022)

egroys said:


> This is EXACTLY what I have been wondering about! Do you have 128gb of ram and what's your experience with 'unified' memory in terms of VEP usage? Are you doing a lot of multi-mic and legatos?
> 
> Thanks in advance!


My Mac Studio has 32GB RAM, my PC Slave (i9 9900k) 128GB RAM. I have no clue about „unified memory“, haha.

My VEP Template loads in general all mic positions (90% of my libraries is Orchestral Tools). What do you mean with legatos? All available articulations loaded, including every possible Legato variation.

So, almost everything runs from my PC. Except synths and some libraries like Keyscape. That’s why I ordered a Mac Studio with only 32GB. 

I’m confident this will stay being my Setup for many years to come. I’m beyond the point considering hardware since a long time. Trying to focus on the creative side only.

Still, it’s fun reading this forum.


----------



## muziksculp (Jun 13, 2022)

Hi,

I will be ordering a Mac Book Air (M2) next month, with 24 GB RAM, and 1 TB SSD.

Mostly for daily general use, some video, and graphics work, and possible use for music production when I need to during traveling, but this is the least important for me when using a laptop, most of my music production is done on custom built Rackmount Desktop PCs in my Studio.

I even thought of getting the M1 based Mac Book Pro, with more RAM, and SSD, for music production, but I know it won't be something I need, or will use for music production. So, this was not an option for me.

I think the new M2 Mac Book Pro 13" that's going to be available next month is a fantastic laptops for my needs, and the price is not too bad given it's an Apple Laptop. I'm not sure how long I will have to wait for it to ship after ordering it next month, my guess at least 8 weeks of waiting time. Which is the only bummer about it.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## rnb_2 (Jun 13, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> I will be ordering a Mac Book Air (M2) next month, with 24 GB RAM, and 1 TB SSD.
> 
> ...


You're getting the Air, not the 13" M2 MacBook Pro, right? Nobody should buy the 13" MacBook Pro - it's an old laptop with a new processor, and the only laptop that still has the Touch Bar. The MacBook Air will be a better option for almost everyone.

Whichever way you go, I don't think you'll be looking at huge lead times at release - one of the reasons the M2 laptops won't be available until (an undefined date) next month is that they're trying to build up inventory so there won't be huge wait times, at least for the first run of orders.


----------



## egroys (Jun 13, 2022)

Eulenauge66 said:


> My Mac Studio has 32GB RAM, my PC Slave (i9 9900k) 128GB RAM. I have no clue about „unified memory“, haha.
> 
> My VEP Template loads in general all mic positions (90% of my libraries is Orchestral Tools). What do you mean with legatos? All available articulations loaded, including every possible Legato variation.
> 
> ...


Copy that. Okay, I was asking because I was hoping to hear the same news but with VEP running only on one system. Thank you, though!


----------



## muziksculp (Jun 13, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> You're getting the Air, not the 13" M2 MacBook Pro, right?


Yes, the Mac Book Air M2, not the M2 Mac Book Pro.


----------



## Pier (Jun 13, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> You're getting the Air, not the 13" M2 MacBook Pro, right? Nobody should buy the 13" MacBook Pro - it's an old laptop with a new processor, and the only laptop that still has the Touch Bar. The MacBook Air will be a better option for almost everyone.
> 
> Whichever way you go, I don't think you'll be looking at huge lead times at release - one of the reasons the M2 laptops won't be available until (an undefined date) next month is that they're trying to build up inventory so there won't be huge wait times, at least for the first run of orders.


Why do you think Apple is still using the 13 inch? To get rid of touch bar parts?


----------



## rnb_2 (Jun 13, 2022)

Pier said:


> Why do you think Apple is still using the 13 inch? To get rid of touch bar parts?


I think it's a combination of having the chassis and Touch Bar in inventory, and having a "MacBook Pro" under the $1999 starting price of the 14". There are rumors of an upcoming 15" consumer laptop - either a bigger MacBook Air, or just a MacBook - that might take the place of the 13" Pro, but if that doesn't happen soon, I wish they'd put some effort into modernizing it. Get rid of the Touch Bar (since it's obviously not part of Apple's future), go with a full-size function key row and new TouchID, MagSafe - basically make a 13" version of the 14", but without the high-end processors and screen.

As it stands, it's not even holding down a specific spot in the pricing chart - the M2 Air is only cheaper because you can get it with the binned processor with 8GPU cores. Once you upgrade to the 10-core GPU, the new Air and 13" Pro are the same price. If they're not going to modernize it, I hope it disappears soon, as it just causes confusion now.


----------



## Pier (Jun 27, 2022)

I was watching this video comparing the M1 vs M2 13'' MBP.

The M2 version has a significantly slower SSD, and actually gets hotter even when the fans ramp up more quickly.

In a Logic benchmark the M2 performs worse than the M1. Not sure why, maybe it's because of the SSD.




Honestly I'm a bit disappointed with the M2. From the data I've seen, it seems it's essentially an overclocked M1. The perf improvements seem to come from the fact that it consumes more watts, runs hotter, runs at higher clock speeds, and has more GPU cores. I was expecting more efficiency, not less.


----------



## rnb_2 (Jun 27, 2022)

Pier said:


> I was watching this video comparing the M1 vs M2 13'' MBP.
> 
> The M2 version has a significantly slower SSD, and actually gets hotter even when the fans ramp up more quickly.
> 
> ...



The SSD is slower not because Apple "cheaped out", but because they were able to source a single 256GB SSD module, where for the M1 they had to go with 2x128GB (either due to cost or availability in 2020). Any higher config will likely see the same performance as the M1's SSD - this same performance shortfall has been seen for several years on the lowest-end configs, for exactly the same reason. I would hold off on M2 disappointment until higher-end configs are benchmarked. *EDIT: *Price no doubt played a role in the SSD choices between M1 and M2, but I don't think Apple is off-base in considering the single-module performance on the M2 base model to be fine for its market; 1400MB/s is not "slow", no matter what anyone says, and the issue goes away as soon as you upgrade the storage.

Max is generally pretty decent, but there is a bit of Youtube silliness going on here, mostly around throwing workloads at an 8GB/256GB config that aren't realistic. Yes, the M1 handles some of them better, but I suspect it's because being starved of RAM causes it to use the SSD for swap, and the SSD performance in the base model is slower on the M2. I suspect that at 16GB/512GB (or higher), the M2 will show better performance across the board than the M1. I also suspect that some of their testing suite is not tuned properly for the M2, as they showed it consuming more power for certain benchmarks, but having more battery left afterward.

It is interesting to see that the M2 will theoretically spike to almost 3.5GHz - I don't believe that the M1 ever goes higher than 3.2 - but that they couldn't actually get it to go higher than 3.3GHz in testing. Also, I think they swapped the Blender scores, as the graphic showed the M2 being slower than the M1.

None of what the video shows really surprises me, as reading AnandTech's review of the A15 compared to the A14 (which the M2 and M1 are based off of) laid out the performance/efficiency tradeoffs in the designs. Since they're on similar processes (only ~5% gain via process, according to TSMC), any large gains are going to come from optimizations, and there are areas where A15 is significantly faster than A14, but others where the performance gain is marginal. The GPU is likely the source of the significant heat increase on M2, as AnandTech noted that the A15 (particularly with the 5-core GPU) showed significant thermal throttling, but was also much faster than the A14 GPU.

Realistically, though, this is a review of a computer that almost no consumer should be buying. Max asking for dual fans and other design changes misses the point of this computer: to use up parts that Apple has in inventory while holding a starting price point below $2k for the MacBook "Pro" (largely due to corporate and institutional buyers who won't buy MacBook Air for employees). Due to the hot GPU, there may be more performance gains on the M2 MacBook Pro vs Air than the M1 MacBook Pro vs Air (which were almost nonexistent), but we won't know that until the Air gets released.


----------



## Pier (Jun 27, 2022)

All fair points Rick.



rnb_2 said:


> Realistically, though, this is a review of a computer that almost no consumer should be buying. Max asking for dual fans and other design changes misses the point of this computer: to use up parts that Apple has in inventory while holding a starting price point below $2k for the MacBook "Pro"


I agree, although I think the main point I got from of the video is that most users would be better with the M1 version. Obviously assuming they are in the category that would be looking at this machine.

When watching the video I actually assumed you could still buy the 13'' M1 but just checked Apple's website and it's not available anymore. I guess it's still available through other retailers though (Costco, BH, etc).

Do you know of any good video comparing the Air M1 vs M2?


----------



## rnb_2 (Jun 27, 2022)

Pier said:


> All fair points Rick.
> 
> 
> I agree, although I think the main point I got from of the video is that most users would be better with the M1 version. Obviously assuming they are in the category that would be looking at this machine.
> ...


We won't see anything on the M2 Air for (probably) another few weeks, but I expect we'll see a similar SSD performance issue on the base config for the same reason we see it on the M2 MacBook Pro.

Based on this video, I think the only conclusion I'd come to is that, for some specific workflows, the M1 (via other retailers or Apple's refurb store) would still be a good choice if you're restricted to the base config, as the slower SSD will offset much of the potential performance gain from the SOC. Once you spec more RAM and/or storage, I don't expect that to be the case.


----------



## Nimrod7 (Jun 27, 2022)

Pier said:


> is that most users would be better with the M1 version.


I guess non musicians will benefit the most from the M2. The GPU is a nice bump as well as the ProRes, and ProRes RAW encoder / decoder.


----------



## rnb_2 (Jun 27, 2022)

Nimrod7 said:


> I guess non musicians will benefit the most from the M2. The GPU is a nice bump as well as the ProRes, and ProRes RAW encoder / decoder.


I think the higher RAM limit will benefit some musicians, and once you add that RAM and a bit more storage, the Logic benchmark will be better on M2 than M1.


----------



## muziksculp (Jul 8, 2022)

Hi,

OK, I finally went ahead, and ordered a Mac Book Air M2, Midnight Color.

24 GB RAM, 2 TB SSD. , 8-Core CPU , 10- Core GPU. Expected delivery Aug. 1st - Aug. 8th.

This will be my first Apple Laptop ever. I used to have a Cheese greater Mac Pro over a decade ago, but have been using PCs for the past decade, including my current 9 year old Lenovo Yoga 2 laptop with broken screen that still works.

So, it would be interesting to see how I get along with this new very slim, light weight, and yet quite powerful beauty from Apple.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## muziksculp (Jul 29, 2022)

Finally !

My Mac Book Air M2, 24 GB RAM, 2TB SSD, Midnight Color Arrived today 😎👍

It will be my personal laptop, not too much for music production, some video/picture/graphics, but who knows I might eventually install some music related stuff on it in the future. Love the lightweight, clean, and thin design this laptop is, compared to my 9 year old Lenovo Yoga, which will soon need to be retired. I haven't used a Mac OS computer for a decade, so my Mac OS skills of the past are beginning to kick back after a long absence.






Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Cdnalsi (Jul 29, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Finally !
> 
> My Mac Book Air M2, 24 GB RAM, 2TB SSD, Midnight Color Arrived today 😎👍
> 
> ...


Congrats, that colour looks fire!

I predict that you give Logic a go, and just for shits and giggles try some big templates with lots of VIs, you'll might just be completely baffled and amazed about how much it can handle; even if you max out your RAM, just keep going 

This was my experience when I upgraded from a rather "beefy" 2018 i9 Macbook Pro to the M1 Pro. It's all rather magic, they've really knocked it out of the park with these laptops.

The trick is to keep it all native and not deal with the Rosetta 2 Intel translation layer at all.


----------



## Jack Weaver (Jul 29, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> My Mac Book Air M2, 24 GB RAM, 2TB SSD, Midnight Color Arrived today 😎👍


That's exactly what I'm considering to replace my 2010 MacBook Pro that's huffing and puffing to the finish line. I hadn't considered that color but it looks killer.

_If we run into each other in an airport somewhere I hope we don't walk off with each other's computer._

.


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## muziksculp (Jul 29, 2022)

Cdnalsi said:


> Congrats, that colour looks fire!
> 
> I predict that you give Logic a go, and just for shits and giggles try some big templates with lots of VIs, you'll might just be completely baffled and amazed about how much it can handle; even if you max out your RAM, just keep going
> 
> ...


Thanks. 

I don't use Logic Pro X, I use Studio One Pro 5 on PC. So, I might install S1Pro 5 on this baby in the future to see how it behaves. S1Pro 5 I think is already Apple Silicon Compatible. So, it should run smoothly, and be super efficient, provided I stick to using Apple Silicon Supported plugins.


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## Cdnalsi (Jul 29, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I don't use Logic Pro X, I use Studio One Pro 5 on PC. So, I might install S1Pro 5 on this baby in the future to see how it behaves. S1Pro 5 I think is already Apple Silicon Compatible. So, it should run smoothly, and be super efficient, provided I stick to using Apple Silicon Supported plugins.


Yeah it looks like the 5.4 update added native Apple Silicon support. Great!

Do let us know your thoughts if you ever end up trying it out


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## rnb_2 (Jul 29, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Finally !
> 
> My Mac Book Air M2, 24 GB RAM, 2TB SSD, Midnight Color Arrived today 😎👍
> 
> ...


Congratulations - it's a beauty! If I hadn't bought a 14" M1 Pro MBP in March, that's exactly the config I would have just purchased myself. Is there a blue light involved in that photo? I was under the impression that it wouldn't look *that* blue, more like a very dark gray that has a bluish tint in certain light.

In any case, enjoy it!


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## muziksculp (Jul 29, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> Congratulations - it's a beauty! If I hadn't bought a 14" M1 Pro MBP in March, that's exactly the config I would have just purchased myself. Is there a blue light involved in that photo? I was under the impression that it wouldn't look *that* blue, more like a very dark gray that has a bluish tint in certain light.
> 
> In any case, enjoy it!


Yes, I have some blue ambient LED lights on but far from it, I'm not sure they are what's making it look more blue than it really is in the pic. I will take another photo without the blue LED lights on, to see how it shows up. Maybe post it here so you get a better idea of how it looks without any color lights.


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## muziksculp (Jul 29, 2022)

@rnb_2 ,

I took another pic without any blue lights, and it still looks quite blue in the pic. but looking directly at it it appears much darker, not sure why. It seems the iPhone lens is causing this. Actually it looks much darker blue, kind of a charcoal-blue, less blueish like the pic, when I'm looking at it.


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## muziksculp (Jul 29, 2022)

@rnb_2 ,

OK, the blueish color of the pic was caused by the reflection from my studio window of the blue sky. Not the LED lights. I turned the laptop around a bit, so it won't reflect the light from the window, and here is how it looks, taken via my iPhone. As you can see, much more like a dark grey, with a hint of dark blue. I think the back cover has a unique reflective finish, that can make it appear a bit different color wise depending on what it is reflecting.


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## PeterN (Aug 30, 2022)

I have a target to buy the 14" M2 Pro MBP in December. Assuming it is out. So, Im checking that's around a 100 days more or less. And, wondering is there is a global conflict, or complete market crash, before that, which will devastate this plan.

We should be able to make it 100 days still? My guts tell me I must get it before around February 2023, after that its all sliding into "red light" (the twilight zone).


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## rnb_2 (Aug 30, 2022)

PeterN said:


> I have a target to buy the 14" M2 Pro MBP in December. Assuming it is out. So, Im checking that's around a 100 days more or less. And, wondering is there is a global conflict, or complete market crash, before that, which will devastate this plan.
> 
> We should be able to make it 100 days still? My guts tell me I must get it before around February 2023, after that its all sliding into "red light" (the twilight zone).


If you're that concerned about the state of things 100 days out, just buy an M1 Pro/Max MBP now - the M1 Pro/Max is already faster than *all but* the 16+ core iMac/Mac Pros.

(Quick edit to add "all but" - the M1 Pro/Max is faster than the 12/14-core Xeons)


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## rnb_2 (Aug 30, 2022)

Quick post to point to the edit I made to the above post - I originally left out a couple of key words.


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## Nachivnik (Aug 30, 2022)

PeterN said:


> I have a target to buy the 14" M2 Pro MBP in December. Assuming it is out. So, Im checking that's around a 100 days more or less. And, wondering is there is a global conflict, or complete market crash, before that, which will devastate this plan.
> 
> We should be able to make it 100 days still? My guts tell me I must get it before around February 2023, after that its all sliding into "red light" (the twilight zone).


If the likely 11% per core CPU increase of an M2 Pro over an M1 Pro chip is crucial to you, then you better wait. Otherwise, Luke Miani has a video out today talking about discounts on M1 based MacBook Pros.

Disaster planning - I don't think fear of supply chain disruptions should drive computer purchase planning.


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## PeterN (Aug 31, 2022)

Anticipating that upcoming 14" M2 Pro MBP will not only have slightly better CPU, but overall improved features. Maybe keyboard, sound, storage options. Whatever.

This makes the situation a gamble. Who wants the M1, when you can see M2 under the rainbow and in the horizon? But will the world crash before you reach the rainbow? Its a gamble, thinking last night, the coin is tossed for M2. I got two combs, each with 60 fine teeth - and like we did in military - pulling one tooth off each day. Its a gamble.


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## Vik (Aug 31, 2022)

PeterN said:


> Anticipating that upcoming 14" M2 Pro MBP will not only have slightly better CPU, but overall improved features. Maybe keyboard, sound, storage options. Whatever.











M2 MacBook Pro (2023) 14 and 16-inch rumors: Everything you need to know


What can we expect from the new 14-inch and 16-inch MacBook Pro in 2023?




www.imore.com












Supply constraints could delay M2 Pro, M2 Max MacBook Pro launches


You might have to wait longer to get a 2022 14-inch or 16-inch MacBook Pro.




www.imore.com





"As noted, we’ve been told to expect that not much beyond the processor is going to change with these new MacBooks. In June, Mark Gurman stated that the new MacBook Pros “won't be radically new products beyond offering the speedier chips.”"


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## PeterN (Sep 2, 2022)

What if EUR goes in free fall, isn't Apple stuff based on USD. Say, if EUR loses 25% to USD, will these toys be 25% more in cost?

Most likely, right?

And the Battle Royale hasn't even started yet. What is the panel suggesting? Is it too risky to wait for M2?


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## Nachivnik (Sep 3, 2022)

It sounds like you want an M2-based MacBook Pro. You should wait and get what you want. Global factors would paralyze us from getting up in the morning if we let them.


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## PeterN (Sep 3, 2022)

Nachivnik said:


> It sounds like you want an M2-based MacBook Pro. You should wait and get what you want. Global factors would paralyze us from getting up in the morning if we let them.


Global factors means you need to plan in advance. Now theres a lot to plan strategically, while masses are following (lead by) their masses media. Better be ahead of their mass reactions.


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## PeterN (Sep 6, 2022)

Apple event tomorrow. Imagine if they would surprise us with new MacBooks, so we Europeans could sigh of relief?


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## Mike Stone (Sep 6, 2022)

Here in Norway, we've had several large price hikes across the entire Apple product line the last 7-8 years. Back in 2010-15, Apple products were actually fairly reasonably priced. Now, not so much. If they make another big price hike, Apple is going to start noticing less sales IMO. The Western economy isn't that great either (we're probably looking at stagflasion).

If I only could break away from Logic Pro X, and use Cubase and PCs instead...


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## Tronam (Sep 6, 2022)

PeterN said:


> I have a target to buy the 14" M2 Pro MBP in December. Assuming it is out. So, Im checking that's around a 100 days more or less. And, wondering is there is a global conflict, or complete market crash, before that, which will devastate this plan.
> 
> We should be able to make it 100 days still? My guts tell me I must get it before around February 2023, after that its all sliding into "red light" (the twilight zone).


We won’t likely see 14/16” updates until next Spring or Summer. They’re typically on an 18 month refresh cycle, like the iPad Pros. The Macs due for a refresh this year are the Mac Mini and Mac Pro. Also, M2 is a relatively minor silicon update owing much of its performance improvements to a clock speed increase meaning they run hotter as well. It’s still 5nm like M1, so I’d almost rather wait until a new MacBook Pro features TSMC’s 3nm die shrink which will run cooler and with better battery efficiency.


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## rnb_2 (Sep 6, 2022)

PeterN said:


> Apple event tomorrow. Imagine if they would surprise us with new MacBooks, so we Europeans could sigh of relief?


No chance of Macs at tomorrow's event - it will be iPhone, Watch, and (probably) AirPods Pro. There will be an October (or early November) event for iPads (M2 Pros, updated base iPad), as well as probably some Macs. While it does feel early for the M2 14"/16", they're still possible for this year, since the M1 versions were delayed for several months due to supply issues last year. If we go ~18 months from when they were supposed to be announced (WWDC '21), this fall would work - having the Pro/Max versions ship ~6 months after the base chip feels more like what Apple was hoping for, but they had to wait almost a year on the M1 cycle.


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## rnb_2 (Sep 6, 2022)

Tronam said:


> We won’t likely see 14/16” updates until next Spring or Summer. They’re typically on an 18 month refresh cycle, like the iPad Pros. The Macs due for a refresh this year are the Mac Mini and Mac Pro. Also, M2 is a relatively minor silicon update owing much of its performance improvements to a clock speed increase meaning they run hotter as well. It’s still 5nm like M1, so I’d almost rather wait until a new MacBook Pro features TSMC’s 3nm die shrink which will run cooler and with better battery efficiency.


Leaving out the timing (I think we may very well see the M2 Pro/Max MBPs this year), I largely agree with this. While the benchmarks used were silly - YouTubers were throwing ridiculous workloads at the M2 Macs this summer to get them to heat up as much as possible - the M2s are fundamentally hotter chips than the M1, due to both a clock increase (3.2GHz to 3.5) and an increase in the number of already-hotter GPU cores.

Even with throttling to cool things down, the M2 is substantially faster than the M1, but I do like that I've only ever heard the fans on my M1 Pro MBP once, testing a DVD-rip to "AI-assisted" 1080p upscale (it wasn't worth it). I don't think my needs will increase over the coming few years - I honestly never think about how long anything takes on my M1 Pro - so, if things continue on the current path, I will probably be able to "downgrade" to an M3 or M4 MacBook Air down the line and get better performance in a lighter, cheaper package than what I have now. Whether I'll actually do that remains to be seen, but the biggest draws to the MacBook Pro over the Air - the much better screen, extra Thunderbolt Port, HDMI and SDHC - might not be worth the extra cost for me. My M1 Pro is almost always in clamshell mode, attached to all of my external storage, USB and Thunderbolt hubs, and display via a single Thunderbolt cable, so for my most common usage, an Air would be a drop-in replacement. I went with 32GB of RAM in my M1 Pro, and that could very well be available a couple more revisions down the line on the base chip.


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## PeterN (Sep 6, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> Leaving out the timing (I think we may very well see the M2 Pro/Max MBPs this year), I largely agree with this. While the benchmarks used were silly - YouTubers were throwing ridiculous workloads at the M2 Macs this summer to get them to heat up as much as possible - the M2s are fundamentally hotter chips than the M1, due to both a clock increase (3.2GHz to 3.5) and an increase in the number of already-hotter GPU cores.
> 
> Even with throttling to cool things down, the M2 is substantially faster than the M1, but I do like that I've only ever heard the fans on my M1 Pro MBP once, testing a DVD-rip to "AI-assisted" 1080p upscale (it wasn't worth it). I don't think my needs will increase over the coming few years - I honestly never think about how long anything takes on my M1 Pro - so, if things continue on the current path, I will probably be able to "downgrade" to an M3 or M4 MacBook Air down the line and get better performance in a lighter, cheaper package than what I have now. Whether I'll actually do that remains to be seen, but the biggest draws to the MacBook Pro over the Air - the much better screen, extra Thunderbolt Port, HDMI and SDHC - might not be worth the extra cost for me. My M1 Pro is almost always in clamshell mode, attached to all of my external storage, USB and Thunderbolt hubs, and display via a single Thunderbolt cable, so for my most common usage, an Air would be a drop-in replacement. I went with 32GB of RAM in my M1 Pro, and that could very well be available a couple more revisions down the line on the base chip.


Can you tell Sir, is there any point opting for the MBP Max for someone only into music? This is for the graphic crowd, aint it?


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## Mike Stone (Sep 6, 2022)

PeterN said:


> Can you tell Sir, is there any point opting for the MBP Max for someone only into music? This is for the graphic crowd, aint it?


Not really, except for more RAM (64gb over 32gb), and higher RAM bandwidth (however I don't know if that will affect DAW performance in any way). The CPU single thread performance is the same.


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## rnb_2 (Sep 6, 2022)

Mike Stone said:


> Not really, except for more RAM (64gb over 32gb), and higher RAM bandwidth (however I don't know if that will affect DAW performance in any way). The CPU single thread performance is the same.


This is correct - the only reason to go for the Max is for the 64GB RAM ceiling. The higher memory bandwidth only comes into play for tasks that saturate both the CPU and GPU cores, so you won't see a benefit for music.


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## Vik (Sep 6, 2022)

I wonder why the MBP prices are massively reduced right now:








Price drops: save up to $550 on 14-inch & 16-inch MacBook Pros | AppleInsider


September is an exciting time for Apple fans with the release of the iPhone 14, and B&H Photo is pulling out all the stops by slashing 14-inch and 16-inch MacBook Pros by up to $550 to cover the Mac side of the ecoystem. Grab the cheapest prices on record on numerous M1 Pro and M1 Max models.




appleinsider.com


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## mat1 (Sep 6, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> Leaving out the timing (I think we may very well see the M2 Pro/Max MBPs this year), I largely agree with this. While the benchmarks used were silly - YouTubers were throwing ridiculous workloads at the M2 Macs this summer to get them to heat up as much as possible - the M2s are fundamentally hotter chips than the M1, due to both a clock increase (3.2GHz to 3.5) and an increase in the number of already-hotter GPU cores.
> 
> Even with throttling to cool things down, the M2 is substantially faster than the M1, but I do like that I've only ever heard the fans on my M1 Pro MBP once, testing a DVD-rip to "AI-assisted" 1080p upscale (it wasn't worth it). I don't think my needs will increase over the coming few years - I honestly never think about how long anything takes on my M1 Pro - so, if things continue on the current path, I will probably be able to "downgrade" to an M3 or M4 MacBook Air down the line and get better performance in a lighter, cheaper package than what I have now. Whether I'll actually do that remains to be seen, but the biggest draws to the MacBook Pro over the Air - the much better screen, extra Thunderbolt Port, HDMI and SDHC - might not be worth the extra cost for me. My M1 Pro is almost always in clamshell mode, attached to all of my external storage, USB and Thunderbolt hubs, and display via a single Thunderbolt cable, so for my most common usage, an Air would be a drop-in replacement. I went with 32GB of RAM in my M1 Pro, and that could very well be available a couple more revisions down the line on the base chip.



I had a 14 M1 Pro, M1 Air and the M2 Air last week for testing.

I was fully planning on keeping the 14 but ended up ordering a maxed out M2 Air to replace my M1 Air. The form factor really is incredible. If you can make an Air work for you one day its a great overall experience.


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## mat1 (Sep 6, 2022)

Vik said:


> I wonder why the MBP prices are massively reduced right now:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


it's almost as though they think an update is coming soon..


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## rnb_2 (Sep 6, 2022)

mat1 said:


> it's almost as though they think an update is coming soon..


It could certainly be this, but retailers don't have much advance notice of new Apple products (or they'd leak like crazy, and do leak when order pages go up the night before an event, even briefly), so I don't think anyone actually knows what's coming. I think it's more likely that production has finally caught up with demand (custom configs from Apple appear to have about a 2-week delivery time, much better than just a few weeks ago) and retailers are starting to discount to convince people to buy from them instead of Apple or other competitors. When supplies were really tight, some retailers couldn't even take orders for some configs, and if they could take the order, they wouldn't be able to tell you when to expect it. Apple could at least estimate a delivery date for most orders from them, even if it was 8 weeks out.


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## PeterN (Sep 6, 2022)

mat1 said:


> I had a 14 M1 Pro, M1 Air and the M2 Air last week for testing.
> 
> I was fully planning on keeping the 14 but ended up ordering a maxed out M2 Air to replace my M1 Air. The form factor really is incredible. If you can make an Air work for you one day its a great overall experience.


Do you find a significant difference in the Air M2 and Air M1? Is there any M2 Air heating issue in music production?

I was disappointed with the M1 Air when I got it, but after gradually upgrading all plugins to Apple Silicon support, systems etc, its really good. But I want something even better before the dark ages start. So that it can keep going for years. Also backup stuff.


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## Tronam (Sep 7, 2022)

rnb_2 said:


> No chance of Macs at tomorrow's event - it will be iPhone, Watch, and (probably) AirPods Pro. There will be an October (or early November) event for iPads (M2 Pros, updated base iPad), as well as probably some Macs. While it does feel early for the M2 14"/16", they're still possible for this year, since the M1 versions were delayed for several months due to supply issues last year. If we go ~18 months from when they were supposed to be announced (WWDC '21), this fall would work - having the Pro/Max versions ship ~6 months after the base chip feels more like what Apple was hoping for, but they had to wait almost a year on the M1 cycle.


It's certainly been a strange couple of years, so anything is possible, but in general their release cycle clock doesn't begin until the actual products ship. Even Tim Cook specifically refers to the start of the Apple Silicon transition as when the M1 MBA first released, not the earlier WWDC announcement. One of the other reasons this Fall feels too early to me though is precisely due to those chip shortages. Up until about 3 months ago they were still heavily supply constrained with ship times of some configurations continuing to be delayed 1-2 months. Manufacturing has to retool and start production several months ahead of release and it just seems odd to restart production on a refresh right as the current generation finally starts catching up with demand. With TSMC only just now beginning their 3nm production process, those chips won't likely be quite ready for this Fall lending more credence to the idea of a Spring refresh to me. I could be wrong of course. It's fun to speculate.


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## mat1 (Sep 7, 2022)

PeterN said:


> Do you find a significant difference in the Air M2 and Air M1? Is there any M2 Air heating issue in music production?
> 
> I was disappointed with the M1 Air when I got it, but after gradually upgrading all plugins to Apple Silicon support, systems etc, its really good. But I want something even better before the dark ages start. So that it can keep going for years. Also backup stuff.



I benchmarked it in my DAW and it's about 10% more powerful so not massive. It lines up pretty well with the cinebench scores as expected. The 14 is significantly more powerful but it's also significantly bigger. I realised pretty quickly I will always want an Air around but my budget allows for a desktop or 16 down the line if I need more power or screen real estate. Will let you know about heat but it was fine while I used it.

Magsafe is quite a big deal for me as I use a thunderbolt interface. Previously I would have no free ports once I plugged the power in so that limited it's usefulness without an expensive (at the time) hub.


You can kind of hedge your bets by getting a discounted machine just before the Oct/Nov event but that'll massively depend on whether you need a custom spec machine or not and whether those deals even exist where you live. There could easily be a 30% difference in price between the best stock M1 Pr deals vs new M2 Pro pricing if there is a small rise. That's only relevant if the machine you want is a stock model though.

If you want a custom machine it'll probably be a case of you "get what you pay for" and the performance will roughly line up with what you spend like the M2 Air.


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## PeterN (Sep 7, 2022)

Watched parts of the event. 

A sherpa running in Himalayas with an Apple Watch. Only Silicon Valley can come up with that. 

No MBP! We need it in October!


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## rnb_2 (Sep 7, 2022)

Tronam said:


> It's certainly been a strange couple of years, so anything is possible, but in general their release cycle clock doesn't begin until the actual products ship. Even Tim Cook specifically refers to the start of the Apple Silicon transition as when the M1 MBA first released, not the earlier WWDC announcement. One of the other reasons this Fall feels too early to me though is precisely due to those chip shortages. Up until about 3 months ago they were still heavily supply constrained with ship times of some configurations continuing to be delayed 1-2 months. Manufacturing has to retool and start production several months ahead of release and it just seems odd to restart production on a refresh right as the current generation finally starts catching up with demand. With TSMC only just now beginning their 3nm production process, those chips won't likely be quite ready for this Fall lending more credence to the idea of a Spring refresh to me. I could be wrong of course. It's fun to speculate.


I'm still not convinced that 3nm is going to happen on M2 (A16 just went to 4nm), but Ming-Chi Kuo says that Apple has cut production orders for the M2 14"/16" a bit ahead of expected introduction in early 2023, so you could very well be right. I still think that Apple would like to be closer to 6 months between base processor and the first higher-end variant, but maybe that settles at ~9 months?


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## mat1 (Sep 7, 2022)

PeterN said:


> Watched parts of the event.
> 
> A sherpa running in Himalayas with an Apple Watch. Only Silicon Valley can come up with that.
> 
> No MBP! We need it in October!



Big euro price hikes :O . Not looking great for M2.

Luckily I got a song placed in the keynote. That should just about cover the price hike once I get my cut.


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## Altauria (Sep 7, 2022)

mat1 said:


> Luckily I got a song placed in the keynote.


Congrats!!


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## PeterN (Sep 8, 2022)

mat1 said:


> Big euro price hikes :O . Not looking great for M2.
> 
> Luckily I got a song placed in the keynote.


Theres always the hope that USD will crash. 

China sent a drone to Kinmen last week. Im buying the M1 immediately when a pack of robot dogs, are sent flying to Taipei Liberty Square. Bet it was Silicon Valley that paid Pelosis flight ticket across Pacific 2 weeks ago.


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## PeterN (Sep 17, 2022)

Price of lithium spinning out of control. Will probably be added in price, so we are *too late already*. Lets hope for MBP PRO M2 in October event. 2023 is too late. There's, of course, always the possibility to pick up an M1 before the mass formatted masses.


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## Tronam (Sep 18, 2022)

PeterN said:


> Price of lithium spinning out of control. Will probably be added in price, so we are *too late already*. Lets hope for MBP PRO M2 in October event. 2023 is too late. There's, of course, always the possibility to pick up an M1 before the mass formatted masses.


Considering how far in advance all of these product launches get planned out, here's hoping they already have locked in component pricing with their supplier contracts to ensure they're not suddenly surprised by massive spikes like this.


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## PeterN (Sep 18, 2022)

Tronam said:


> Considering how far in advance all of these product launches get planned out, here's hoping they already have locked in component pricing with their supplier contracts to ensure they're not suddenly surprised by massive spikes like this.


What has been confirmed via the grapewine is that power banks go up in prices soon. Time to pick up one xtra. Not need a clairvoyant to see this coming.


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## PeterN (Sep 27, 2022)

*Situational report:

EUR* falling closer to 0.95 and *lithium* keeps spiking straight up again. *Taiwan situation:* currently stable. *Supply chain:* not critical.* WW3 chances: *moderate. *Pandemic: *stable. *Inflation:* rising


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## HCMarkus (Sep 27, 2022)

New 14-Inch and 16-Inch MacBook Pros Reportedly Launching Later This Year


Apple plans to release new MacBook Pro models in the fourth quarter of 2022, according to supply chain publication DigiTimes. The report does not...




www.macrumors.com


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## Mike Stone (Sep 27, 2022)

European currencies continue to weaken, while the US dollar remains strong. Those Mac computers are going to get awfully expensive here in Europe, if this trend continues. 

I'm holding out for a 3nm Mac Studio, but I dread how expensive these machines are going to get in another 2-3 years.


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## PeterN (Dec 26, 2022)

*December Update*


Yesterday, we can read Apple about to start mass production of 3nm chips at TSCM (Taiwan)






Todays news say China possibly planning Taiwan attack.







----

Will we get the MacBook Pro M2 before apocalypse begins, it is still an open question. But it looks like we are making it over the 2023 threshold.


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