# Do you sometimes get psyched out when listening to great music?



## MikeH (May 25, 2013)

Something interesting has been happening lately whenever I listen to music that I find fantastic and challenging-- it bums me out! I know that I have my own voice and a well-developed skill-set, but sometimes when I'm listening to a John Williams action piece while studying his sketches I just want to throw my tools out the window and take an extended vacation. 

I found this recent quote by Williams when asked if he spends time listening to the music of others:

_Not really. If for example, I listen to Haydn or Brahms, I become very discouraged because I'll never be able to write something as good as these great masters. _


Do you ever experience the 'ugh I'll never be as good as so-and-so' blues?


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## joshua (May 25, 2013)

Don't say you could never be as good as someone until you spend 10,000 hours of deliberate practice. https://www.google.com/search?q=10000+h ... +hour+rule


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## Resoded (May 25, 2013)

A few years ago I played guitar in a local band. We worked hard but never really got famous, and in times like that yeah, I felt discouraged by other peoples skill. Constantly chasing my own tail to improve. Then one day we got to meet our biggest fan. Just some guy who thought our music was the very best in the world, and he was very excited just to talk to us. Whenever I'm in doubt I try to remind myself of these people and how subjective music taste is.


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## Guy Bacos (May 25, 2013)

Interesting question.

When I listen to Porgy and Bess, for example, I say to myself, I write shit compared to that. So yes, it is discouraging, but at the same it's just as inspiring, which is the most important thing for a composer.


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## DocMidi657 (May 25, 2013)

Check out the book Effotless Mastery by Kenny Werner. He talks about this very topic under the chapter "fear based listening"

Dave


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## Iostream (May 25, 2013)

To be honest, I never worry to much about it. I love music, whenever I am not working on my own music, I listen to the music of others. There are a lot of people I know are making much better music than I am, but it doesn't bother me because I love to listen to it, and I love to spend time working on my own music as well.


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## TGV (May 26, 2013)

MikeH @ Sat May 25 said:


> Do you ever experience the 'ugh I'll never be as good as so-and-so' blues?


I'm just a simple amateur, and in contrast to JW, I do listen to great music. It can entertain, it can cheer me up, it can provide emotional comfort, or it can just be beauty itself. I highly admire the skills of many composers, and am totally baffled by some (Bach, how is it possible that one man could write all that?), and I realize I'll never be able to get anywhere remotely near that: I've got a better chance of becoming the a billionaire overnight. Well, bad luck for me, but slowly my music gets a bit better, and I occasionally surprise myself. I'm not one for quixotic feel good nonsense like "it's not about the goal, it's about the journey", but that's just completely worth the effort.


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## ghostnote (May 26, 2013)

bwaah... constantly...

everytime I listen to TJ's stuff (and that's almost everyday). Whenever I listen to Buckethead I want to throw my guitar in the corner and never even look at it again... 
http://youtu.be/qFoBbNHvOME?t=5m42s or this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f4RnFy1H7l0 (insane, hmm?)

I had a conversation with a guitarist ten years ago which I'll never forget. I said to him (young and naive as I was): It's hard to compose a good rock riff because Slash has done them all. He said: That's exactly what Slash said about Jimmy Page.  Never heard that quote before.

In the end there's no superiority. There's just you doing the best you can and the more you enjoy it and stay yourself, the more it might get really good - in its own way.


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## Christof (May 26, 2013)

Everytime I listen to Bach I loose my mind.


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## jcs88 (May 26, 2013)

Definitely. Not even listening to the 'masters', more than half the guys on this forum run circles around my ability as a composer and over the technicalities of sample software as well. I'm slowly getting to the point where there are guys 2/3 years younger than me that are so much better.

With such a crowded industry I do have a lot of self doubt.


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## Studio E (May 26, 2013)

I feel that way when I listen to almost any of the big film composers. The one's that most make me feel like a dunce are Danny Elfman, Thomas Newman, James Newton Howard, John Williams, Hans Zimmer. It's really an endless list. But that's just because we love their music so much (at least for me) that I fantasize about a world where that would have been me writing those things......but it's not that world. I think it's great to study them and learn from the things they wrote, but then stop worrying and just get on with what YOU want to do. Get inspired by something and just make it happen and see what comes out the other side. If you are truly inspired and truly love what it is you are writing, there is probably an audience out there that loves it as much as you love the work of your heroes.

I just finished my first short film that was an actual story-line film vs educational or commercial and the such. It was a HUGE boost in my writing because it had emotional content. That's what I need is visuals that inspire a mood or a feeling. Once that is there, I know that I have my own voice to lend. Now it's just a matter of using the established devices of others enough to drag along the audience with my personal flavor. I've already gotten enough feedback from my peers to know that I'm not total crap, lol, and my ego isn't so blown-up that I think I can rest now. I just finally have enough confidence to know that I can write music that will hit people the same way that the music of my heroes hit me. The better I get, the more people will probably like it. If not, screw it, I have a day job, lol.


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## dcoscina (May 26, 2013)

I get inspired actually. Listening to Stravinsky or Prokofief or Mahler or John Williams gives me that extra oomph to pursue my musical endeavours.


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## EastWest Lurker (May 26, 2013)

I made my piece with that a lot of years ago.


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## C.Bledsoejr (May 26, 2013)

Funny topic because I think all musicians at some stage in their career go through this. I've been playing guitar and bass for 15 years and my friends tell me I'm good but for some reason I hear some of my favorite bass players for example, and I'm thinking "Damn, I've been playing how long and I still don't know how to slap like that?!" But then once you get out of the blues period you go into inspiration mode, practice mode, whatever, and you become better


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## Lex (May 26, 2013)

I don't. First of all, how could I get inspired by music that I find mediocre or not much more accomplished then my own? Second, if I am better at what I do just a bit then I was yesterday, then there's no reason to be depressed. If anything I get depressed by encountering more and more stuff that I could do better with my left foot. 

Very grateful for being able to listen, enjoy and study works of Zimmer, Williams, Davis, Giacchino, Sakamoto and many other composers that not only touch my heart but also do things with their craft that I would never think of, sometimes even things that I can't even understand at the moment. I find that inspiring, challenging and exciting.

alex


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## Dan Mott (May 26, 2013)

I think good music is inspiring. When I hear a great song, I appreciate it much more because it's quite rare these days. I spend quite a while online, looking for new music.


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## TheUnfinished (May 27, 2013)

I love listening to music as much as I enjoy writing it, so I'd be very annoyed if I wasn't constantly able to listen to new and old music that is fantastic and inspirational.

Not for a minute do I think I'm a great composer. I enjoy what I do, I think I'm capable and there are things I want to do with my music that are specific personal goals. No amount of music by other people is going to change that. I am hugely grateful for all the wonderful music that is out there, because it makes my life a better place, not a worse one.

I don't see music as a competition I guess.


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## bryla (May 27, 2013)

C.Bledsoejr @ Sun May 26 said:


> But then once you get out of the blues period you go into inspiration mode, practice mode, whatever, and you become better


Exactly! The inspiration and practice mode is rewarding and productive. According to Stephen Covey way can actively choose if we want to be in our sphere of interest or sphere of influence. As Jay, I have made my peace with this by choosing not to enter the blues mode at all (not refering to the genre of course!). Be excited about the music and not the person, and you'll see that you too can find the great music.


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## Waywyn (May 27, 2013)

to quote Bob Marley:

"some people feel the rain, others just get wet!"


If you get psyched out and want to throw everything away it is because you want to! Convert it to something positive by e.g. try to analyze it. If you grabbed just 3% of no matter what information on a track like this, it is better than 1%!


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## jgarciaserra (May 27, 2013)

This latest months I've been re-studying classical period and mainly Mozart. The more I listen and study more "little" I feel myself. : :oops: 

I will introduce a phenomen I suffer. When I listen music I can't stop to listen rythms, notes and compositional processes. Its very disturbing when I just want to relax listening to music. 
Lately when I'm trying to get sleep I catch myself reviewing full scores and I can't sleep until I finish all the score.
Am I mad??? ~o) (o) 

Sorry again for my English. I'm working to improve it.


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## Dean (May 27, 2013)

Lex @ Sun May 26 said:


> If anything I get depressed by encountering more and more stuff that I could do better with my left foot.
> 
> alex



I feel this way too,its very discouraging,(to paraphrase John Powell,'theres no excuse for sounding crap anymore'.),but when I hear something original or amazing it just makes me raise the bar. D


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## Stephen Rees (May 27, 2013)

Don't worry about being a second rate (insert your most admired composer here).

Just realise your potential as a first rate (insert your own name here).


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## JJP (May 27, 2013)

Mike Post once said, "Bach wrote everything. We can't do anything original because he already wrote it all. So now that that's out of the way, let's go make some music!"


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## wst3 (May 27, 2013)

Some times I get a little distressed, but mostly I become inspired, driven even, to do better.

I know two guys who seem to be able to translate anything that they can imagine in their heads to their respective instruments (guitar and piano). I used to think that might be a bit disappointing, but both confirmed that it only let them imagine even wilder things.

So it is possible, at least for some, to reach that point... that keeps me trying.


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## nikolas (May 27, 2013)

MikeH @ Sat May 25 said:


> Do you ever experience the 'ugh I'll never be as good as so-and-so' blues?


Used to but not anymore...

When I was living in Athens and prior to leaving for London and my postgraduate studies in composition (remember it's a time that Greece wasn't still into the Internet...), all I knew was the REALLY GREAT composers (Bartok, Shostakovich, Ligeti, boulez, Stokhausen, etc)... So I was really upset that I would never be a composer!

Then I move to London and found tons of composers making a living by composing, and teaching, and having their works performed by small ensembles (a "random" string quartet, which still was excellent but wasn't the Juilliard Quartet!), or solo performers, etc... And thought to myself: Here we are! I *CAN* a successful composer! I don't have to be as huge as Messiaen. I can be a regular guy, composing and having fun, living my life!

- Problem semi-solved.

This is not to say that I do not dream a huge career (in contemporary classical music, btw), or that I'm not chasing my dream, but I figured that I've got time, that I've got kids, a family, friends and need to keep myself alive physically and mentally rather than working insane hours (which goes to an older thread I did. One project gone, the other almost gone and left with one... so it worked out fine after a couple of weeks)...


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## Ciaran Birch (May 27, 2013)

wst3 @ Mon May 27 said:


> Some times I get a little distressed, but mostly I become inspired, driven even, to do better.



Definitely agree with this, my iPhone is full to the brim with soundtrack albums, trailer company albums (just got James Dooley's "Untold" trailer album last week).

Every time I hear them I'm in awe of how they created their own sound, but you do then get inspired to improve and learn as much as you can to get to the level of these guys. The genre I am passionate about is the dark, sinister style that Michael Suby and Joel Richard write in, but they have such a unique sound, it is a little intimidating when I listen to their work. But I've realised everyone starts from the bottom, nobody is born with this sound that just appears one day out of the blue. They have worked and worked on bringing a piece of their personality out through their music. I think having the patience to realise it took these guys years to hone their own sound is a big part of staying sane.


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