# Predator - Template



## AlexanderSchiborr (Nov 24, 2016)

Hej Guys,

Probably some (or even some more) of you know the old Predator Theme. I did a mockup and transribed a few bars in order to build up a new template where I tried a bit to reference the newman scoring stage stuff. I used the ideas in the theme to build up the mockup as it helps me not only to learn some odd meter stuff from Silvestri (which he in this case probably was influenced by Goldsmith work for First Blood), but also to see how the template behaves with such sound. My goal was a bit to creat a kind lively sound, bit of that smokey room sound, however..
Any ideas on the sound? What do you think? I welcome some input...thanks. and before I forget: Get to theeee Chopppppaaa..


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## jononotbono (Nov 25, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> Probably some (or even some more) of you know the old Predator Theme.



Never heard of Silvestri myself.


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## bbunker (Nov 25, 2016)

Yeah, he wrote a few good tunes.


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Nov 25, 2016)

jononotbono said:


> Never heard of Silvestri myself.





bbunker said:


> Yeah, he wrote a few good tunes.




Oh well guys, thats ok, but that has nothing to do here with the topic I have asked for either if you @jononotbono know silvestri (it is a pity you don´t), nor you @bbunker find that he wrote quite some good tunes (yes I agree )
So if you have a need to comment it would be meaningful, quite even respectful to me to relate to my topic and I appreciate any feedback to topic, otherwise I welcome you to have a discussion with silvestri and co in another thread, and I am pretty sure I will join and let you both guys know why his tunes were pretty good, so we 3 can have a great silvestri discussion there :D! And you know what guys: I think Silvestri not even did some cool tunes, I think he is a pretty cool down to earth guy , even after having written one of the most iconic themes in film history. thanks! :D
PS: 
I'm sure in 1985 plutonium is in every corner drug store, but in 1955, its a little hard to come by!


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## Kony (Nov 25, 2016)

Hi Alexander - sounds very, very good! Not sure if I'm imagining it but sounds like there is a pop at 1.20 - replayed several times but can't be 100% sure.... I really like the overall sound very much. Would it be ok to ask what reverb you are using please?

Before I forget .... "Come on, kill me, I'm here, kill me!!!"


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Nov 25, 2016)

Kony said:


> Hi Alexander - sounds very, very good! Not sure if I'm imagining it but sounds like there is a pop at 1.20 - replayed several times but can't be 100% sure.... I really like the overall sound very much. Would it be ok to ask what reverb you are using please?
> 
> Before I forget .... "Come on, kill me, I'm here, kill me!!!"



Hi Kony,

For the Reverb I used only one instance on the Masterchannel of QL Spaces, Burbank Scoring stage Large TS FR 2.1 (-15.7 dB, 30 ms predelay). plus another instance on the Brass Group Channel of QL Spaces (ACME Storage B TS FR .8s) with a good amount of predelay (120 ms) to fake distance and trail. I also notched out slightly the mids of the French Horns and added a Solo French Horn on top of the line to get more definition and variation in timbre and dynamic.

Edit:Not Sure though with the click / pop..Actually I don´t hear it.
For the rest of the Instruments including brass I only used the micing faders to place them into the room as I think that this is the most natural way of getting real room information.


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## Kony (Nov 25, 2016)

Thanks for the information Alexander, much appreciated!


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## Satorious (Nov 26, 2016)

Nice work Alexander! There seems to be a weird quirk around 0:47?

I'm always up for more takes on Predator as it's a fantastic score (and easily my favourite by Alan Silvestri). If you want to hear someone else's take, I thought this was a rather nice play on the original themes with some new material:



(main themes come just before the half way mark). Be amazing if Shane Black can entice Silvestri back for the new film or at least keeps the main themes - this is one of franchise strengths in my opinion.


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## jononotbono (Nov 26, 2016)

My comment was just a bit of humour. For goodness sake.


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## Baron Greuner (Nov 26, 2016)

Is that Alan Silvestri who lives in Carmel?


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Nov 26, 2016)

jononotbono said:


> My comment was just a bit of humour. For goodness sake.



Yeah, that was funny, thanks :D But still any idea on mockup or did you just passed by for the joking :D



Baron Greuner said:


> Is that Alan Silvestri who lives in Carmel?



What is a Carmel?..Yes the City


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## jononotbono (Nov 26, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> Yeah, that was funny, thanks :D But still any idea to the mockup did you just passed by for the joking :D
> 
> 
> 
> What is a Carmel?..Yes the City



I look forward to hearing this but I'm waiting to hear it when back at my Lab on my Adam speakers. Currently away from home. I'm not sure what my opinion will mean though as I'm just a beginner and you're probably best having people that are more experienced etc.


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## tack (Nov 26, 2016)

Pretty believable sense of a room there, Alexander. What libraries and processing did you use in your new template?


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Nov 26, 2016)

Satorious said:


> Nice work Alexander! There seems to be a weird quirk around 0:47?
> 
> I'm always up for more takes on Predator as it's a fantastic score (and easily my favourite by Alan Silvestri). If you want to hear someone else's take, I thought this was a rather nice play on the original themes with some new material:
> 
> ...




Cool Track, but it is yours?I like that impression, though soundwise I felt that some stuff is a bit very much left panned or in general the stereo panorama seems to me very much left. Have to listen to that on my studio speakers tomorrow though.
I like the score also a lot, because it has a lot of stuff what I call "not so conventional", it used a lot interesting rhytms, meters and sounds. I am big silvestri Fan by myself.

Any idea idea what oyu mean the weird quirck at 47 seconds? Soundwise or is it a harmonic thing?

Thanks for chiming in.


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Nov 26, 2016)

tack said:


> Pretty believable sense of a room there, Alexander. What libraries and processing did you use in your new template?



Is it ok, when I look into the template by tomorrow, tack? I am pretty tired from the work I had to do today I won´t turn on my machine. So to give you a bit more of a detailed answer, I need to load my template and look into the stuff. But I will do, promise.


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## tack (Nov 26, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> Is it ok, when I look into the template by tomorrow, tack?


Unacceptable. Do it now.



Sleep well!


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## Satorious (Nov 26, 2016)

Hi Alexander, no I didn't write the other track - I just put it here for a bit of fun. I really really like the space/balance in your track. I think the 0:47 might be a small transcriptional quirk (I've heard the original so many times - it feels like there is a short note missing or accelerated slightly too fast). Might just be my ears...


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## Baron Greuner (Nov 26, 2016)

Alexander, my wife recognised it almost immediately, so it must be good.


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## jononotbono (Nov 26, 2016)

Just got home. It's excellent! Got me right in the mood...


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## thov72 (Nov 26, 2016)

Jono you don´t have to be ashamed of showing your big muscles, even if they are bigger than Arnold´s. Don´t hide em under that Santa Clause costume!!


Alexander: Sounds errr...pretty good. I wish I could do that.

......If it bleeds, we can kill it....


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## jononotbono (Nov 26, 2016)

Who said it's a Costume?


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Nov 27, 2016)

tack said:


> Pretty believable sense of a room there, Alexander. What libraries and processing did you use in your new template?



Hi Tack,

Here we go:


Brass:

Trumpets: Trumpet Patch Adventure Brass (Mixed Mic= Close + Room) for the Sustaining Notes at beginning and so on.
No Eq,
Horns: Horns Patch Adventure Brass (Room Mic), layered with a Leg Slur Solo Horn of HWB (Main Mic + Hamburg Brass Reverb)
- for the Melodic Motif
Adventure Brass EQ Settings: +3dB at 134 for more body, Cut at 763 Hz for more distance.
HWB Horns Solo Patch: +3dB at 227 Hz for more Body, Cut at 711 Hz for more distance.
Both are playing unison. Reason for layering with Solo..to add more life and definition.

Trombones: Trombones Patch Adventure Brass (mixed Mic = Close and Room) - for the Low Stabson E1 unison
no EQ
Tuba: Tuba Patch Adventure Brass (mixed mic again) - for the Low Stabs playing in octaves Split from E0 and E1
+ Brass Ensemble Short Notes Patch from Symphobia (Stage Mic only) doubling Tuba / Trombones
no EQ

All the instruments are routed in a group Channel "Brass", there is an instance of QL Spaces, ACME Storage B TS FR 0.8s,
Wet Signal -13.9 dB, 120 Ms to Glue the sections and add a tad of trail, just for that, not for more reverb.

So practically I tried to create depth for brass just by moving micing faders and a little corr. eq.

STRINGS:

Fullstrings: CSS Fullstrings Spiccato Articulation, Mixed Micings, doubling Tuba and Trombonbes on the Low E0 and E1
No EQ

Violas: CSS Violas Spiccato Articulation, Mixed Micings, adding a bit more definition and upper Bite to the Stabs on the E2,
why E2? E1 is out of range, e3 sounds too thin and exceeds the octave construct too much to the upper registers which is unfortunate
PLUS it would interfer the melodic statement on the horns.
No EQ

Violins: Vlns 1ST Legato: CSS, Main (0.0 dB) + Rooms Micings (-11.9 dB), doubled with soaring Strings legato Violins to add
defintion and a bit of brilliance to the legato line in the mid parts.
EQ: CSS VLNS 1: Lowshelf until 743 Hz, to work again for the proximity effect to fake distance PLus to lower the rebowing floor
noise build up
EQ2: Soaring Strings very similiar to CSS VLns 1 but lowshelf until 731 Hz, and a tad of scoop at 5.7 kHZ to make it a bit more softer

2nd Violins: CCS, Main and Room Micings, same settings like Vlns 1, doubling the VLns1 lines
EQ: Low Shelf until 381 HZ for the same reasons.

CELLOS: CSS Legato Cellos, Mixed Micings, no EQ

Doublebass: CSS Marcato Legato Articulation, Mixed Micings, no corrective EQ

The instruments are routed to a Strings channel, but on the Strings Channel I didn´t add anything else like Reverb, because
I feel that they allready sit in the mix with the right distance, so I created the Space and room just with moving and using micings a
and a bit corrective EQ, The Group channel is just for practical reasons
to be able to solo and mute them with one button.

PIANO:

1. Cinematic Studio Piano, All Micings activated (spot:-15.3 dB, close -23.9 dB, -15.7 Main, room: +6.0 dB),
EQ: Slight Low Shelf until 253 Hz for the same reasons as mentioned above

2. Imperfect Samples Steinway Walnut Grand, Stacc Patch to layer CSP and to add defintion and aggression.

SNARES:

Cinesamples Concert Snare from old Cinesares: Mixed Micing, everything at 50%
Cinesamples Military Snares from Old Cinesnares: Mixed Micing: Close 63%, Mid 11%, Far 50%

EQ on both: Parametric at 121 Hz to add Fullness, Notch at 311 to reduce boxiness, Notch at 960 Hz to fake even more distance.

Solo Fill Snare: Eastwest Hollywood PRC Diamond, 6in x 14 in Brass Calfhead Ludwig Snare: All micings activated: Close and main very less db, Mid Micing a bit more
Surround Micing the most to create distance again, No EQ

Shakers, Hollywood Percussion Diamon: Same settings like for the Ludwig Snare Micings, No EQ

Bassdrum: Old Spitfire Albion (2012) Bassdrum Patch, Close (full) and Tree Micings (at 70 Percent), NO EQ
Bassdrum 2: Hollywood Perc.Diamond, 40 in Ludwig Bass Drum, All Micings on, same settings like the L. Snare
Both No EQ
Timpani: Hollywood PRC Diamond, Settings like Bassdrum 2, No EQ


CYMBALS:
Hollywood Percussion Diamond:
1. 22 in Zildjian K Crash, All micings on, slight different settings: A bit close and Main, mostly Mid and Surround.
2. 12 in - 22 in Combo Crash: All micings on, same settings like 1).
oN both baked in Reverb in play: New Hollywood Hall 4.0

Percussions are routed directly a group Channel. The Group Channel has no effects.

All Group Channels are routed to a master bus:

there I did just a bit corrective EQ: A slight Notch at 304 Hz to reduce the Rumble and to get more clarity. 1.3 Khz Notch
to reduce the amount to radio kind of "sound" informations.
A boost at 12 Khz to add brilliance and Air.
A boost at 65 Hz to add just a bit of nice lowend "Bass". + 1,7 dB
Corrective EQ with slight Highcut at 20 Khz to remove the very hizz unnatural Sampled hizzes..

After the corrective EQ I added one instance of QL Spaces Burbank Scoring Stage, 2.1 (-15,7 db wet, 30 ms Delay) to glue the Strings, Brass and PRC together, not to create more reverb and to get a bit of that dark IR from the Burbank Stage.

Then a Slate Tape Machine to add a bit Tape Saturation, and a Standard Protection Limiter.

That´s it. I hope I didn´t forgot anything.

So what is the conclusion about that here..well, you can add depth and distance mostly by using the available micings and corrective EQ and the additional IR Reverb to glue the sections. My philosophy is very strict related to the idea that real room information is the most realistic one you can get by using micings and that software reveration should be used very carefully in addition.
Everything is btw performed more or less accurate, but that´s another point what I think is important to realism: Just to perform everything to create performance imperfections. Don´t program parts as long it is not absolute necessary e.g. are not able to play parts. Even then I would say that play it at a slower pace and speed it up later.


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## tack (Nov 27, 2016)

Thanks for that very detailed overview of your template, Alexander. I agree with your philosophy about the realism of actually record rooms, but then of course you end up battling with room noise build-up (which you've taken some care to manage) and reduced playability. Always tradeoffs to juggle. I also tend to prefer algorithmic reverbs for that bit of extra glue but Spaces is definitely working for you here.

Thanks!


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Nov 27, 2016)

tack said:


> Thanks for that very detailed overview of your template, Alexander. I agree with your philosophy about the realism of actually record rooms, but then of course you end up battling with room noise build-up (which you've taken some care to manage) and reduced playability. Always tradeoffs to juggle. I also tend to prefer algorithmic reverbs for that bit of extra glue but Spaces is definitely working for you here.
> 
> Thanks!



Greetings, 
Yes definitely, depends on the developer and even sometimes on the patch you use and how you write. Problems occur often when you layer a solo instrument for doing chords in brass at a very low dynamic. The instrument is quite and the air is proportional louder and can add up extreme by creating a 4 part chord.


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## zacnelson (Nov 28, 2016)

Great work as always Alexander, I really like the use of the piano in this piece


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Nov 28, 2016)

zacnelson said:


> Great work as always Alexander, I really like the use of the piano in this piece



Thanks a lot my friend, much appreciated.

We hear us later. 

Best,
Alex


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## patrick76 (Dec 7, 2016)

Nice work on the mock up and thanks for the detailed notes on your work, this is always interesting to see. And, since you are a Silvestri fan, did you see FilmMusicMedia's recent interview with him? He talks a bit about Predator there. Here is the link


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Dec 7, 2016)

patrick76 said:


> Nice work on the mock up and thanks for the detailed notes on your work, this is always interesting to see. And, since you are a Silvestri fan, did you see FilmMusicMedia's recent interview with him? He talks a bit about Predator there. Here is the link




Hi Patrick, 

Always a pleasure to help the community here and provide some information. 
And thank you for the link to the interview. Yes I know it and saw it already a couple of times. Always a pleasure for me to hear him talking about all his projects and work.


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## Kony (Dec 7, 2016)

I'm also very grateful to you, Alexander, for the detailed notes on your template - it was very interesting to hear the piece and then get the breakdown on the template. Thank you!


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