# Sessions Strings Pro 2



## Zoot_Rollo (May 16, 2018)




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## Batrawi (May 16, 2018)

What can innovative ideas, good scripting/programing and good GUI do with unrealistic samples


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## Tekkera (May 16, 2018)

Batrawi said:


> What can innovative ideas, good scripting/programing and good GUI do with unrealistic samples


sounds like native instruments in a nutshell most of the time


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## sostenuto (May 16, 2018)

I am trying to learn to listen better for these issues. Surely NI choice of musicians, halls, mics, tech individuals is not lacking in serious ways ? Where do they fall down so badly ?
Are there some specific instruments, sections, articulations, etc., to compare with popular SF versions for example.

BTW … my senior ears may be a major barrier here, with notable fall-off above ~4-5 KHz.  
Even so. I still prefer to listen closely for these shortcomings.


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## Tekkera (May 16, 2018)

sostenuto said:


> I am trying to learn to listen better for these issues. Surely NI choice of musicians, halls, mics, tech individuals is not lacking in serious ways ? Where do they fall down so badly ?
> Are there some specific instruments, sections, articulations, etc., to compare with popular SF versions for example.
> 
> BTW … my senior ears may be a major barrier here, with notable fall-off above ~4-5 KHz.
> Even so. I still prefer to listen closely for these shortcomings.


It sounds very robotic and flat, no emotion and sounds very inexpressive. Knowing NI, the legato is probably bowed, and also it has that gross "super responsive legato" sound. Great for fast passages, bad for everything else. Compared to something like CSS where it has the least responsive legato, but gives the attack time the legato needs to sound good with samples. Generally, the slower the legato, the more expressive and emotive it sounds.

The articulations here don't flow well at all and it just sounds gross. Really the only thing they have going for them here is the sliding articulation which their session stuff all has. Their session horns sampling technique is not doing these strings justice.

Just have a listen at this timestamp. Honestly I would say just pick up chamber strings and ignore this marketing based money grab NI library.



Edit: Had a quick listen to the demos. It resembles a worse version of LASS to me, minus the shorts which have a nicer slow attack which are the only seemingly the redeeming factor. My opinion still stands, chamber strings trashes it.


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## fretti (May 16, 2018)

Tekkera said:


> It sounds very robotic and flat, no emotion and sounds very inexpressive


So actually good for Pop music?!


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## sostenuto (May 16, 2018)

Tekkera said:


> It sounds very robotic and flat, no emotion and sounds very inexpressive. ...*** .... Generally, the slower the legato, the more expressive and emotive it sounds. ............
> The articulations here don't flow well at all and it just sounds gross. Really the only thing they have going for them here is the sliding articulation which their session stuff all has. Their session horns sampling technique is not doing these strings justice.
> 
> Just have a listen at this timestamp. Honestly I would say just pick up chamber strings and ignore this marketing based money grab NI library.
> ...



Your comments are truly appreciated. They help me focus where I have not done so. 
Your LASS reference made me smile as I have had several messages with Audiobro re. their current product(s) and content in my NI K11U ..... 

As pianist, I will always struggle with orchestral nuances (even 'not-so-nuanced'). 
I also struggle with sorting these same factors .... when going from DAW with powered monitors and headphones, to other DAW with 'decent' stereo amp and passive speakers. 

Thanks for helping the learning.


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## Batrawi (May 16, 2018)

sostenuto said:


> Where do they fall down so badly ?


one word.."staticness"
This is what I hear with every note/articulation being played by this product..this could be due to trimming off notes attack/notes release/limited dynamic range etc...which could actually all be intended by NI for what the product is aimed for...."pop production" mainly.

From another side, pop not being my favourite style and my taste being heavily influenced by orchestral music, this makes me repel the product even more. But that's just me.

Other pop composers have found good use of the product from what I've read here and there...So I respect the product afterall in terms of how it still fulfils the needs of other fellow composers


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## Batrawi (May 16, 2018)

Tekkera said:


> Compared to something like CSS where it has the least responsive legato, but gives the attack time the legato needs to sound good with samples.


Amen, Amen, Amen... but it's actually unfair to put CSS in comparison with any other major library when it comes to these slow expressive legatos. CSS has truly set a new standard in this regard.


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## sostenuto (May 16, 2018)

Batrawi said:


> one word.."staticness"
> This is what I hear with every note/articulation being played by this product..this could be due to trimming off notes attack/notes release/limited dynamic range etc...which could actually all be intended by NI for what the product is aimed for...."pop production" mainly.
> 
> From another side, pop not being my favourite style and my taste being heavily influenced by orchestral music, this makes me repel the product even more. But that's just me.
> ...



Got it. 
NI product emphasis is obvious, and you immediately react to these specifics, which I miss given recent move into orch/cine/hybrid/….
This help is key in setting my expectations when adding new Libraries. Just a few hours left on SF_Wishlist promo and I am still adding 'fundamentals' for now.
CSS comments have been noted as well.
THX and regards


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## Tekkera (May 16, 2018)

fretti said:


> So actually good for Pop music?!


Actually, the pop I occasionally hear on the radio sounds quite expressive... It might just be a coincidence though that the only pop I've happen to have heard had such soaring emotive lines.


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## fretti (May 16, 2018)

Tekkera said:


> Actually, the pop I occasionally hear on the radio sounds quite expressive... It might just be a coincidence though that the only pop I've happen to have heard had such soaring emotive lines.


There are lots of great string parts in pop. It was more a joke in the direction of pop often being stamped as simple, 4-chords songs with no complexity.
Though the production quality and layering in some of these songs gets to surprise me from time to time (in a good way)


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## procreative (May 16, 2018)

I think its quite obvious that NI have a focus on the Hip Hop/Dance/R&B markets. Most of their energy is on the Maschine/Traktor end.

You just have to look at the expansions for Maschine or the "Producers" they like to feature on their site to see this.

I reckon to this market these probably sound great. I mean take a look at the "Construction Kits" people like Producer Loops and Loopmasters sell in the "Cinematic" and "Orchestral" genres – serious cack loops obviously sampled off low end GPO libraries with bad midi editing.

I mean the use of a Coldplay ripoff as one of the demo tracks demonstrates what some think great strings sound like. Even the original version of Viva La Vida sounded like a bad rompler strings patch from the early 90s (I should know I had them).


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## Sears Poncho (May 16, 2018)

SSP is actually made by e-Instruments. I have their pianos and love them, they aren't offered by NI. There is a certain "ideology" with the e-Instruments libraries, they share a lot of characteristics.

I love SSP, but I can understand if/why some people don't like them. They don't have much character or emotion, the grand pianos don't either (The upright has a ton though). They are as clean and dry as it gets. But the shorts are great, and the violas are excellent.


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## Straight2Vinyl (May 17, 2018)

I was hopeful when I saw the ad at the top of Explorer, then I watched the videos and thought "Not bad."
It looked worthwhile, until I checked out the manual and all the rhythm and pattern generator options are only for the ensemble patches, not the individual instruments. 
I honestly don't get this kind of shit. Also, why the hell don't most libraries come with full divisi programming? LASS came up with that so many years ago that it should be expected every time. I'll likely pick up the NI String Ensemble crossgrade during the summer sale in a month, but I was hoping to find something useful with a smaller section size for music I make, which is r & b, hip-hop and other pop genres. I don't like the robotic stuff in the mix though. It works fine sin small doses on up tempo tracks, but if you want a more acoustic sounding track it simply doesn't hold up. 

I'll keep an eye out for surprising reviews and also to see if there's a workaround to the lack of options in the single instrument patches. Most likely it would just involve muting instruments in the mixer, but perhaps that would affect the patterns. 

This just seems like a missed opportunity. Only 36 gigs of samples and the same number of articulations, limited section patch options.... Get your act together Native Instruments and E Instruments.


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## hag01 (Jun 8, 2018)

Actually, judging by the demos, it sounds like strings patches from a good keyboard, or a Yamaha\Roland Hardware sound module, no?

Could be nice for someone who look for that particular sound.
Many classical pop\rock songs used those old sounds...


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## lucianogiacomozzi (Jun 8, 2018)

Wow, they are... Not my cup of tea at all... They just sound robotic and synthy to my ears.


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## Sears Poncho (Jun 8, 2018)

hag01 said:


> Actually, judging by the demos, it sounds like strings patches from a good keyboard, or a Yamaha\Roland Hardware sound module, no?


IMO, no. SSP 1 has excellent shorts. It can't do legato/singing lines at all, but it's good at what it does. It's an odd duck compared to what's out there. It was recorded very dry and very clean, with a minimum of vibrato. It's a sound that most people aren't used to.

It's a good example of "size matters".  It's what a small, dry string section sounds like in a non-hall. People are used to these 60 piece, rich string sections in big movies. 11 string players playing non-vibrato in my living room sounds like SSP, I've done it. For something like baroque with small sections, players are digging in and playing differently, and the gigs are usually in a boomy cathedral. If they were playing footballs in a dry space, it sounds like SSP.


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## Sears Poncho (Jun 8, 2018)

Here's a little clip of SSP (original recipe) doing what it was made to do: Rock out. It has one real violinist (me) overdubbed, obviously that's going to change things a lot, But for articulate, dry, aggressive rock (which is my thing), it's a Godsend for me. Check it out.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/odndemossp-mp3.13880/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## hag01 (Jun 8, 2018)

Sears Poncho, thank you very much!!!
Actually metal is my thing too(among other things).
And I really wanted SSP2 to be good for that stuff, because if so, I will buy it in the next sale.
Unfortunately I didn't found any demo that proofs that SSP could work for that genre, until now.

If you have more demos of SSP in that context I would be glad to hear.
And if you have some SSP demos in context of a bit more epic kind of metal(Nightwish, Dimmu Borgir, for example) I would be twice as glad to hear, because SSP is a small\mid size sections, and therefore I'm afraid it won't work for epic metal, however I understand it can be tweaked to sound bigger, but I don't know how well it works without a demo.


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## vintagevibe (Jun 8, 2018)

When the line between personal preference and objective fact is ignored and libraries are compared as if it’s contest to see which one has the biggest symphonic D%#!, there’s little to be learned. Best advice is to download the demo.


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## hag01 (Jun 8, 2018)

vintagevibe said:


> When the line between personal preference and objective fact is ignored and libraries are compared as if it’s contest to see which one has the biggest symphonic D%#!, there’s little to be learned. Best advice is to download the demo.


Is there a demo\trial version to download?!
Where?
I'm eager to try it, I'm so pissed off there is no trial version!


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## Sears Poncho (Jun 8, 2018)

hag01 said:


> If you have more demos of SSP in that context I would be glad to hear.


Keep in mind that I'm cheating with using overdubbed real violin. I am a cheater.  But I think one could get excellent results by mixing SSP with something like LASS first chair, and SSP2 seems much more advanced than 1. Regardless, it can do some great tricks on its own if the genre is right. It can't do melodies, but the articulate stuff is right on the money.

Here's another one. These are demos for a live show in October, we'll have live strings and these pre-recorded strings on Pro Tools if we can't get the real ones loud enough.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/demo-mp3.13882/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## hag01 (Jun 8, 2018)

What happen if you layer all 4 sections of SSP(44 players)?
Supposed to sound good?


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## Sears Poncho (Jun 8, 2018)

hag01 said:


> What happen if you layer all 4 sections of SSP(44 players)?
> Supposed to sound good?


 I think they are the same samples mixed differently. It doesn't sound like 44 players, it just sounds wider or thicker. I don't know how it works in SSP2 but one shouldn't expect a big section sound.
Ironically, a small section works best for rock. They just have to be mic'ed up the wazoo or in the right spot in the mix. Harder than it seeems. But big sections become lugubrious, it's not the right sound. Live is always a problem, sound guys don't like pushing up the strings and telling drummers to play softer will encourage them to play louder.


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## hag01 (Jun 8, 2018)

Sears Poncho said:


> I think they are the same samples mixed differently. It doesn't sound like 44 players, it just sounds wider or thicker. I don't know how it works in SSP2 but one shouldn't expect a big section sound.
> Ironically, a small section works best for rock. They just have to be mic'ed up the wazoo or in the right spot in the mix. Harder than it seeems. But big sections become lugubrious, it's not the right sound. Live is always a problem, sound guys don't like pushing up the strings and telling drummers to play softer will encourage them to play louder.


Yeah I noticed that even in the most epic symphonic metal songs, where in studio recordings they sometimes even use full orchestra, when they play live however, they settle with some thinner strings patch played on a keyboard.
Here is a good example:
Studio(real orchestra):

Live(keyboard only):


I assume this is for the reasons you mentioned.

Edit: Only the intro, I think later they use backing track.


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## Sears Poncho (Jun 8, 2018)

Budget is always a concern of course. Could be that couldn't sync to it so they went with something more rompler-esque at the beginning. But it's easier to deal with the smaller sound in the mix. Big sections take up a lot of sonic territory.
For me as a pro string player, everything I do is based on "budget", even if I am doing my own stuff in my studio. My whole concept of sound is focused around small sections. And even that is tough live since bands balk at paying strings. TSO hires 7 (plus their electric violinist) and they sell out arena shows. That's why I gravitate to the sound of SSP since it's what I am used to when I play live gigs with bands.


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## Leslie Sanford (Aug 3, 2018)

I own the original Session Strings Pro, and I'm considering upgrading.

I'm curious if they've added any new articulations. I've looked through the manual, and I haven't found an articulations list. The closest I've seen is the drop down list in one of their videos. It looks like they may have removed the individual down/up bow articulations? In rare situations, I need those articulations.

I'm not sure this upgrade is right for me. I never use the animator in the original Session Strings Pro, so everything in their demo video with phrase presets doesn't appeal to me. Additionally, all the stuff about mixing doesn't either. I always use SSP as raw as possible and do my own mixing/reverb outside the plugin.

What would attract me are new articulations (that I need) plus additional velocity layers, etc.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 3, 2018)

Tekkera said:


> My opinion still stands, chamber strings trashes it.



VSL Chamber Strings?

cool.


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## sostenuto (Aug 3, 2018)

Likely solid choice @ $423. Intro. SS Pro2 Upgrade @ $149. 
Best fit here continues to be L&S Chamber Strings @ current $149.

Frustrated not to have string instrument background to understand subtleties better. 
Guessing newer SF_ Solo Strings may hit ~ $280. by Blk Fri … and seems like C Henson made some positive 'Chamber' comments on video …. 

*'What's in your wallet?'*


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 3, 2018)

sostenuto said:


> Best fit here continues to be L&S Chamber Strings @ current $149.
> 
> Frustrated not to have string instrument background to understand subtleties better.
> Guessing newer SF_ Solo Strings may hit ~ $280. by Blk Fri … and seems like C Henson made some positive 'Chamber' comments on video ….



L&S still taunts me.

CH Ensemble makes me squirm.

VSL SE V.3 gives me pause.

I am still SF Free. 

an SF Chamber sale could change that.


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## sostenuto (Aug 3, 2018)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> L&S still taunts me.
> 
> CH Ensemble makes me squirm.
> 
> ...


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CH Ensemble gets beyond me 'technically' _ not truly comprehending hows & whys _ but in my case, total 'Strings' commitment comes first.

'I am still VSL Free' 

Have SF: (3) Albions, Orch Swarm, Glass and Steel, EDNA 01, LABS .... Was soooo comfortable moving ahead with SF_Orchestral, and recent directions causing some queasy reactions. 

All the best with your decisions! Gonna procrastinate and lurk a bit more.


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## brenneisen (Aug 3, 2018)




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## dflood (Jun 8, 2019)

I see it's been quite a while since anyone had anything to say about this. I just got it in the bucketful of stuff included with the 50% off upgrade sale of Komplete Control Ultimate, Collectors Edition, and I must say, I'm impressed. It was not on my radar at all as anything I cared about in the upgrade. Now, I'm not an orchestral audiophile and I sometimes drink boxed wine, so consider the source, but it sounds great to me, and the new interface is a big step up from Session Strings 1. Would I use it for a classical symphony piece? Probably not. Would I use it for backing tracks and film underscoring? Definitely.


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## Diablo IV (Jun 8, 2019)

Tekkera said:


> It sounds very robotic and flat, no emotion and sounds very inexpressive. Knowing NI, the legato is probably bowed, and also it has that gross "super responsive legato" sound. Great for fast passages, bad for everything else. Compared to something like CSS where it has the least responsive legato, but gives the attack time the legato needs to sound good with samples. Generally, the slower the legato, the more expressive and emotive it sounds.
> 
> The articulations here don't flow well at all and it just sounds gross. Really the only thing they have going for them here is the sliding articulation which their session stuff all has. Their session horns sampling technique is not doing these strings justice.
> 
> ...




Sounds out of tune to me (ending "long" notes")


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## Guy Rowland (Jun 8, 2019)

Just got this in K12U and very pleasantly surprised. Don’t even think about it for orchestral use, this is for pop and especially disco. Disco! It has articulations that no orchestral library has, there’s a big clue - fast and slow slides and scoops. The legato and portamento works seamlessly. Scripting is superb. Tonally it’s unfussy, straight, small sizes.

For its intended purpose, I think it will work very well. Going straight into the template - won’t use it for much, but when I do there won’t be anything else to touch it.


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## gum (Jun 8, 2019)

12UCE possibilities.
The tool chooses a person.


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## Parsifal666 (Jun 9, 2019)

Far from a terrible library, it came in handy on my old Rock opera album. It can come in handy for Pop imo.


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## MoSound (Nov 16, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


>





Zoot_Rollo said:


>



I'm sorry, I'm so disappointed, Session Strings Pro ii sound terrible. Over & over I've tried to use them and they just sound like a cross between a Kazoo and a wax comb. Thin, unrealistic and hard to manage... Unuseable for me. Has anyone here compared them to the Spitfire Chamber Strings?


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## MoSound (Nov 16, 2021)

lucianogiacomozzi said:


> Wow, they are... Not my cup of tea at all... They just sound robotic and synthy to my
> 
> 
> lucianogiacomozzi said:
> ...


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## mohsohsenshi (Nov 16, 2021)

MoSound said:


> I'm sorry, I'm so disappointed, Session Strings Pro ii sound terrible. Over & over I've tried to use them and they just sound like a cross between a Kazoo and a wax comb. Thin, unrealistic and hard to manage... Unuseable for me. Has anyone here compared them to the Spitfire Chamber Strings?




I don't think it's that bad. Maybe give a try to change some articulations in a musical phrase, adjust the CC curves to emulate real players' nuance and expression, shut down the built in reverb and add a better plugin with it.

Yes, not everyone is as good as Cory did in the video. But he shows a possibility to make this library sound nice IMO.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Nov 16, 2021)

MoSound said:


> I'm sorry, I'm so disappointed, Session Strings Pro ii sound terrible. Over & over I've tried to use them and they just sound like a cross between a Kazoo and a wax comb. Thin, unrealistic and hard to manage... Unuseable for me. Has anyone here compared them to the Spitfire Chamber Strings?


I never bought them

That was 3-1/2 years ago


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## MoSound (Nov 16, 2021)

mohsohsenshi said:


> I don't think it's that bad. Maybe give a try to change some articulations in a musical phrase, adjust the CC curves to emulate real players' nuance and expression, shut down the built in reverb and add a better plugin with it.
> 
> Yes, not everyone is as good as Cory did in the video. But he shows a possibility to make this library sound nice IMO.



Thanks for the advice! I'll give the cc curves a try..


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## Sebastián collao (Nov 16, 2021)

I considered it an unnecessary library considering so many others on the market, until I had to emulate glissandos at the end of the phrases, being a dry library, it was really easy for me to mix it with other libraries.


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