# Qs about submitting to libraries



## schrodinger1612 (Mar 16, 2021)

I’m about to begin my library music venture and have a few Qs.

1. I’m looking to submit non-exclusive music. When submitting the same track to Audiojungle and Pond5, do I _have_ to use separate titles for each? In which case, would I be required to register both titles separately to my PRO to distinguish the two, in addition to any other libraries I submit it to?

2. When uploading a track to AJ - I'm being asked who my 'publisher' is. I don’t have one - I’m signed up as a writer as PRS requires me to be an already established publisher with 15 works in order to register as one. As I’m looking to get the ball rolling ASAP, can I register my works as writer on my PRO and still earn money via performance royalties on AJ, Pond5 etc.?


----------



## schrodinger1612 (Mar 16, 2021)

Anybody?


----------



## jneebz (Mar 16, 2021)

I think you’ll find faster answers directly from AJ and Pond5 support.


----------



## Jeremy Spencer (Mar 17, 2021)

Yes, you can use the same song titles. It all gets tracked back to where they're registered with you PRO. Not sure about your PRO, but with mine I have the option to list the publisher (which is me).

Don't expect much to happen right away, it will take at least a year to get the ball rolling. Those sites are overly saturated at this point.


----------



## Krayh (Mar 17, 2021)

My advice is take a job at mcdonalds you will make waaaaayyy more money than starting from scratch with aj and pond5.


----------



## schrodinger1612 (Mar 17, 2021)

Krayh said:


> My advice is take a job at mcdonalds you will make waaaaayyy more money than starting from scratch with aj and pond5.


You're an idiot. Not only have you ignored the initial query, but you've attempted to discourage me before I've even started. I'm sure every successful library composer was told that at some point....just give up. There's a lot of that going around, probably from established composers who don't want the extra competition. Anyway I wouldn't just be submitting to those two libraries...


----------



## Krayh (Mar 17, 2021)

Lol ok kid, find out the hard way...


----------



## schrodinger1612 (Mar 17, 2021)

Just because you don't have what it takes it doesn't mean others should be discouraged from even trying.


----------



## Jeremy Spencer (Mar 17, 2021)

Don't be discouraged, but it is definitely a tough road if you're going to try and license on those types of sites. If you have 200+ high quality tracks, that are very commercially viable, then you have better odds. I highly recommend submitting to exclusive libraries, you'll have much better placements/opportunities. But whichever route you choose, it still takes a couple of years to start seeing any substantial returns.


----------



## Allen Constantine (Mar 17, 2021)

schrodinger1612 said:


> You're an idiot. Not only have you ignored the initial query, but you've attempted to discourage me before I've even started. I'm sure every successful library composer was told that at some point....just give up. There's a lot of that going around, probably from established composers who don't want the extra competition. Anyway I wouldn't just be submitting to those two libraries...


Okay okay, calm down!

First of all, it's your decision if you want to start out with library music and from my point of view, it's a good catch to be on the market signed to as many companies as you can, but... the point isn't to offend @Krayh or any other member around here... 

This was a bad move. I mean c'mon, seriously... calling him an "idiot" just because he expressed his own opinion?

I won't get any further with this. 

Stay safe and calm yourself!


----------



## companyofquail (Mar 17, 2021)

That escalated quickly.


----------



## schrodinger1612 (Mar 17, 2021)

Sorry guys, and especially to @Krayh for over reacting....

I've had a bad day/week... :/


----------



## reborn579 (Mar 17, 2021)

schrodinger1612 said:


> 1. I’m looking to submit non-exclusive music. When submitting the same track to Audiojungle and Pond5, do I _have_ to use separate titles for each? In which case, would I be required to register both titles separately to my PRO to distinguish the two, in addition to any other libraries I submit it to?


you don't have to use separate titles for AJ or P5 (pond 5). you only have to register them once with your PRO.

the bigger problem here, though, is that if you go for both libraries you'll get some pretty bad deals. last time i looked into it, the non-exclusive cut for AJ was 45% and P5 35%. that is very low, especially the P5 one. i just went for the exclusive deal on AJ. i feel their website and requirements for submissions are a bit better. and they seem to be the go-to library.

indeed - this market is very over saturated. but it's still a good idea to go for it. most of the songs on AJ are very low quality (my opinion), so if you can make something that is a 8-9/10 i think there's a good chance to sell it. AJ does have some (i would say) unfair business practices like charging taxes from your cut not theirs - and other stuff, so keep that in mind. but they're the biggest shark in the water, so what are you gonna do?

i feel krayh was off topic with his unhelpful remark, but you should have just brushed his comment aside. always good to be more diplomatic 

good luck!


----------



## rgames (Mar 17, 2021)

Regarding PRO registration, you got the answers above but I’ll add that P5 has generated 0$ in PRO royalties for me after several years with them. I don’t think they’re in that market. I briefly had some tracks with AJ but don’t really have any experience with them. However, given that AJ used to refuse tracks with PRO registration I suspect they’re the same.

In fact, I’d think hard about *not* registering the tracks you put on P5 and AJ because I suspect it’s a mark against you on those sites. People licensing from those sites are more likely to look for tracks that *do not* have a PRO registration. So by registering your tracks you might actually be limiting your revenues.

I think sites like Epidemic are vastly better for that kind of music and they require that you *not* be registered with a PRO.

Just something to think about.

rgames


----------



## reborn579 (Mar 17, 2021)

rgames said:


> In fact, I’d think hard about *not* registering the tracks you put on P5 and AJ because I suspect it’s a mark against you on those sites. People licensing from those sites are more likely to look for tracks that *do not* have a PRO registration. So by registering your tracks you might actually be limiting your revenues.


i do the same. i am registered with a PRO, but i only register the music from my official albums, not the AJ stuff (which isn't really - let's say - that artistic, but more utilitarian; most library music is, i feel). 

you might have some potential losses, but from what i gather AJ caters more to smaller clients. i wouldn't see a movie studio using a song from AJ, even in a trailer, really. at least, that's what i think - correct me if i'm wrong.

however, i don't agree with the way epidemic music (or other sites like jamendo etc) do things. explicitly not allowing PRO musicians to join in is just really creating a bad culture for composers. most PROs will let you write songs and not register them with them, so there shouldn't really be an issue there. 
i think this has been talked about endlessly on this forum - and for good reason.


----------



## Rachel (Mar 22, 2021)

This is a very interesting thread and I read the answers carefully as I have the same questions. I uploaded a few songs on Pond5 but I am a bit discouraged by everyone saying that the market is going saturated. 
I thought Pond 5 would be a good deal for me, because it is not so easy to reach exclusive libraries.


----------



## schrodinger1612 (Mar 22, 2021)

Rachel said:


> This is a very interesting thread and I read the answers carefully as I have the same questions. I uploaded a few songs on Pond5 but I am a bit discouraged by everyone saying that the market is going saturated.
> I thought Pond 5 would be a good deal for me, because it is not so easy to reach exclusive libraries.


After chatting to certain forumites via PM I decided to pursue the exclusive route.


----------



## Jeremy Spencer (Mar 22, 2021)

Rachel said:


> This is a very interesting thread and I read the answers carefully as I have the same questions. I uploaded a few songs on Pond5 but I am a bit discouraged by everyone saying that the market is going saturated.
> I thought Pond 5 would be a good deal for me, because it is not so easy to reach exclusive libraries.


I think there's close to a million tracks on Pond5 now. Literally, everyone and their dog can upload tracks if they're approved (which is pretty easy). Nothing wrong with having a profile there, but don't expect anything more than a few dollars every year with only a handful of tracks. If you have hundreds of high quality, commercially viable tracks, you definitely have better odds.


----------



## Kony (Mar 22, 2021)

Epidemic only accept music from artists based in the US and Sweden due to legal limitations - not sure what those legal limitations would be.


----------



## SamC (Mar 26, 2021)

Kony said:


> Epidemic only accept music from artists based in the US and Sweden due to legal limitations - not sure what those legal limitations would be.


Royalties are enshrined by law as a human right in parts of the world like the UK, and some PRO’s don’t like their members handing ownership over to libraries like Epidemic who deny composers that right. So, it makes sense for Epidemic to just avoid legal and rights issues down the road.


----------

