# Favorite MIDI CC controllers?



## Virtual Virgin (Mar 26, 2019)

What are your favorite hardware tools for tweaking the VI's?

Queneo?
E Touche?
iPad?
ICON?


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## jazzmaster12345 (Mar 26, 2019)

I've been using Palette gear. It's not perfect but it's cool. It takes up a very small foot print, not that expensive compared to those JL Cooper midi controllers, and basically gets the job done. Plus, you can expand it as you go. I've actually replaced the plastic part that comes on their faders with the normal mixing board plastic part. I think that helps a bit.


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## Guy Rowland (Mar 26, 2019)

Favourite midi CC controllers? I like 3, 19 and 55.

Oh sorry, didn't read the OP properly.


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## MatFluor (Mar 26, 2019)

Got the nakedboard faderbox some time ago and still love it. Before I had my self-made one (which was also good xD)


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## Michael Antrum (Mar 26, 2019)

I’ve got a old Behringer BCF2000 I’ve had for years (since new) and it’s been terrific. Never let me down.

I’ve also got the palette gear for when I travel and it’s perfect with my laptop.


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## Virtual Virgin (Mar 26, 2019)

Michael Antrum said:


> I’ve got a old Behringer BCF2000 I’ve had for years (since new) and it’s been terrific. Never let me down.
> 
> I’ve also got the palette gear for when I travel and it’s perfect with my laptop.



How do the motorized faders feel when controlling VI parameters?


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## Virtual Virgin (Mar 26, 2019)

MatFluor said:


> Got the nakedboard faderbox some time ago and still love it. Before I had my self-made one (which was also good xD)


Looks straightforward and minimal. Will it stay put when using the sliders? It looks light.


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## PaulieDC (Mar 26, 2019)

I second the Palette Gear notion. It's my next hardware purchase. My M-Audio CODE 61 has 9 cheap short sliders but I want to get used to a separate unit so if and when I swap out my keyboard, nothing changes on the CC Slider side. I like the idea of the JLCooper Fadermaster, but at that price, I do want more than sliders. For instance, I prefer a big know if I'm automating Reverb or even room mikes in my patch. So when I watched Christian Henson's Orchestrating video and saw how he get's on with Palette Gear and that it's modular, I was sold. I might change things up and modular is obviously the WTG.
he decision to get going is to decide which of the two starting sets to begin with, $199 or $299. You have to start with one or the other, because it has the USB interface chunk you need. If you really only want mostly sliders, then this https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1184430-REG/palette_pal005_startr_kit_1_core_1_dial_2.html ($199 Starter Set) is ideal, just keep adding the https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1184428-REG/palette_pal012_high_sensitivity_slider_add_on.html (slider module(s)) you need. But for $100 more you actually get two more knobs and a 2nd slider with the https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1184431-REG/palette_pal006_xprt_kit_1_core_3_dials_2.html ($299 Expert Set). That's basically a free module and at that point, you probably only need additional sliders as you see fit. Even with 2 additional sliders it's still HALF the price of the JLCooper. And you can move them around until you find that perfect layout. OK, I pretty much convinced my self that the Expert Set is the way to go for me, lol!

Here's a section of video where Christian shows his Palette setup and briefly talks about it and uses it.

On top of all that, these units are actually designed for Adobe Premiere and Photoshop, both of which I have used regularly for a decade so I get a double bonus there. They were smart enough to add MIDI CC control to make then work for VI. Pretty cool concept.

Anyway, hope that helps.


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## Michael Antrum (Mar 26, 2019)

I bought the palette gear over Black Friday dna got an extra Fader for free with the starter set.

I can’t really comment on the feel of the BCF2000 as I’ve had it for years and I’m so used to it. To me it’s absolutely fine. The motors are disengaged and it feels much as any other fader of medium quality.


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## antonyb (Mar 26, 2019)

I picked up a great condition Peavey PC1600X on eBay a year back and really love that thing... old school MIDI only, no usb but 16 faders+buttons, presets, everything I need for less than palette gear.

I gotta admit I discovered it through the Spitifre Audio, I think Christian H or Paul T. had one and was intrigued. After some research, the thing got my needs.

The faders are smooth


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## colony nofi (Mar 27, 2019)

I'm another voter for palette gear. I have 2 of their faders among a few other modules... and its awesome to be able to just take the faders (and controller) with me when I'm on the road. However, I have noticed I'm getting strange data points (a few random zero's come thru) when moving the fader sometimes. I've yet to look into it deeply, as in the last 12 months I've been using a korg nano kontrol studio when on the road, and in the studio I've finally got the first 4 faders of a avid artist mix working as 4 x midi CC faders (just not motorized) while the other 4 remain motorized audio faders. Now thats an awesome solution - but expensive, considering you're not using the motorized feature for the midi CC's.

B.


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## MatFluor (Mar 27, 2019)

Virtual Virgin said:


> Looks straightforward and minimal. Will it stay put when using the sliders? It looks light.



Yes, it has 4 rubber feet underneath, stays put (of course depending on the surface  )


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## Virtual Virgin (Apr 2, 2019)

Michael Antrum said:


> I bought the palette gear over Black Friday dna got an extra Fader for free with the starter set.
> 
> I can’t really comment on the feel of the BCF2000 as I’ve had it for years and I’m so used to it. To me it’s absolutely fine. The motors are disengaged and it feels much as any other fader of medium quality.



So the motorized faders do not work on VIs? I guess they would go apezonks playing back automation.


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## Saxer (Apr 2, 2019)

My favorite controller is CC1


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## ltmusic (Apr 3, 2019)

antonyb said:


> I picked up a great condition Peavey PC1600X on eBay a year back and really love that thing... old school MIDI only, no usb but 16 faders+buttons, presets, everything I need for less than palette gear.
> 
> I gotta admit I discovered it through the Spitifre Audio, I think Christian H or Paul T. had one and was intrigued. After some research, the thing got my needs.
> 
> The faders are smooth



Your are on Windows? its easy to assign the faders to cc controls via midi learn? 
Thanks


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## dbazile (Apr 10, 2019)

Hi everyone, per your continued request, I present the following. I hope this helps you guys out!

As part of the latest firmware in the Presonus Universal Control version 3 release, we added TWO new features into the FaderPort 8 and 16. We’ve added a dedicated operation mode for Ableton Live and a dedicated MIDI CC operation mode so that the all buttons, knobs, and faders can transmit CC MIDI messages. These can be mapped to any MIDI software or plugin but are already pre mapped to useful MIDI CC assignments like Modulation, Expression, Pan, Portamento, etc. 

Please see the latest version of the FaderPort 8 and FaderPort 16 manual for the default assignments. 

https://pae-web.presonusmusic.com/d...aderPort-16-8_OwnersManual_EN_V3_25032019.pdf

To update to the latest firmware, please download the latest version of Universal Control from the application via the "File" >> "Check for Updates" menu. Once installed and your device is connected, you will be prompted to update your FaderPort 8 or FaderPort 16.


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## Guffy (Apr 10, 2019)

One out of my holy trinity


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## DerGeist (Apr 10, 2019)

I like my Touche a lot. The sensitivity is great, the software is excellent, and it really helps bring a lot of instruments to life by allowing you to morph smoothly between changes to up to four parameters. It also lets you do things like play filters like bongos etc.

I do use it for orchestral work as well as it allows you to control dynamics and vibrato together in real time. It does take some practice.

One issue I have with it is that it sends up to four CCs (up, down, left, right). I have not had much luck using it as a standard x/y controller since most VSTs seem to use only one CC per axis. Thrill is a good example, x/y control is two CCs. I'm sure there is a way to address this but I'm not quite sure how.


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## Jeremy Gillam (Apr 10, 2019)

CC1, CC11


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## stixman (Apr 10, 2019)

Korg KP3 works great with Thrill.


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## robgb (Apr 10, 2019)




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## ltmusic (Apr 10, 2019)

Guffy said:


> One out of my holy trinity


Can you comment on Peavey 1600 ?
How do you program midi cc ? by midi learn ?
I just found one in a good condition but I am wondering if its worth today...

Thanks


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## DerGeist (Apr 10, 2019)

robgb said:


>


I wish. I have an Ipad, I have lemur, I have a wifi network, I have an iRig IOS to midi connector, I have a semi functioning brain, I have access to instructions on the internet. I am completely unable to get lemur working.


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## robgb (Apr 10, 2019)

DerGeist said:


> I wish. I have an Ipad, I have lemur, I have a wifi network, I have an iRig IOS to midi connector, I have a semi functioning brain, I have access to instructions on the internet. I am completely unable to get lemur working.


I use TouchOSC combined with OSCulator. TouchOSC is used only to design the interface and setup the buttons, etc. I then us OSCulator to assign them. OSCulator simplifies the process immensely.


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## DerGeist (Apr 10, 2019)

robgb said:


> I use TouchOSC combined with OSCulator. TouchOSC us used only to design the interface and setup the buttons, etc. I then us OSCulator to assign them. OSCulator simplifies the process immensely.


I will check it out and then add it to my list of failed attempts to get an iPAD working with my DAW


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## antonyb (Apr 10, 2019)

ltmusic said:


> Can you comment on Peavey 1600 ?
> How do you program midi cc ? by midi learn ?
> I just found one in a good condition but I am wondering if its worth today...
> 
> Thanks


Not midi learn but good old menu and value select... the manual is online check it out
I’ve had one (1600X) for 2 years, configured a general patch with all midi cc i need and it’s been rock solid... pure midi though


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## ltmusic (Apr 11, 2019)

antonyb said:


> Not midi learn but good old menu and value select... the manual is online check it out
> I’ve had one (1600X) for 2 years, configured a general patch with all midi cc i need and it’s been rock solid... pure midi though



I found it for 150 euros. i have to dicide thought..
What do you use now ? 

Thanks!


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## antonyb (Apr 11, 2019)

Still using it, it is my main controller when it comes to faders.
Make sure the power supply is the correct one.


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## Alex Fraser (Apr 11, 2019)

I use the legendary Korg Nano Kontrol. Also, a wee bit of Midi Designer on the iPad. And the mod wheel.


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## Dewdman42 (Apr 11, 2019)

How does everyone feel about a touchpad instead of 100mm CC faders? These days its hard and expensive to get good CC faders, on the other hand, a touchpad can easily have an X/Y controller would could be handy too....amoung other things... nothing tactile though....


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## Alex Fraser (Apr 12, 2019)

Dewdman42 said:


> How does everyone feel about a touchpad instead of 100mm CC faders? These days its hard and expensive to get good CC faders, on the other hand, a touchpad can easily have an X/Y controller would could be handy too....amoung other things... nothing tactile though....


I think in ideal circumstances, a tablet can be even more accurate than 100mm faders. Most apps for example, allow you to alter the rate of input depending on your off-axis position to the controller. Hard to explain without a video!

The main issue (for me) with tablets is that the screen resistance changes with climate, finger oil etc. Sometimes, my fingers can glide over the screen effortlessly (and I swear never to touch real faders again.) Other times, there’s enough resistance to actually push the iPad across the desk.

Because of this, the iPad is a secondary option in my setup.


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## ltmusic (Apr 12, 2019)

antonyb said:


> Still using it, it is my main controller when it comes to faders.
> Make sure the power supply is the correct one.




Ok. Many thanks!!!


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## AdamKmusic (Apr 12, 2019)

Kenton Control Freak studio edition, managed to find one on Facebook for £50!


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## Robert Kooijman (Apr 12, 2019)

Just build an eight-fader CC controller using a Teensy LC.
This was my first experience using an Arduino based controller, and I was so happy yesterday evening when it finally started working 

Decided to build one myself, mainly because it's fun, to keep the size compact so it fits beside my keyboards, decent quality of the faders, and of course to get hands-on with the Teensy 

The case is made entirely of standard aluminium profile, in a way that there's no need for cutting / sawing tracks for the faders.

These little Teensy devices offer potentially much more then controlling just 8 faders, so perhaps there will be a follow up project someday...


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## Alex Fraser (Apr 12, 2019)

Robert Kooijman said:


> Just build an eight-fader CC controller using a Teensy LC.
> This was my first experience using an Arduino based controller, and I was so happy yesterday evening when it finally started working
> 
> Decided to build one myself, mainly because it's fun, to keep the size compact so it fits beside my keyboards, decent quality of the faders, and of course to get hands-on with the Teensy
> ...


I make no apologies for de-railing the thread to ask about your double key stack! What do you use it for? It's amazing.


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## stonzthro (Apr 12, 2019)

There's a fond place in my heart for the ol' Emulators - and 4 of them still - awesome!


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## Robert Kooijman (Apr 12, 2019)

Alex Fraser said:


> I make no apologies for de-railing the thread to ask about your double key stack! What do you use it for? It's amazing.



Thank you Alex. I have the bad habit of removing keyboards from their casing 
The challenge was to have easy access to both MIDI-keys, controllers, computer keyboard, mice etc. all at the same time.

The upper keyboard has a weighted piano hammer-action (Fatar SL880), the lower one more a synth feel (Fatar TMK88). You don't see the difference from above, but "under the hood" they are quite different mechanically.

These two keyboards also make it easier to play and hear immediately what works well together. Great for e.g. laying out orchestral (divisi) tracks using various instruments purely "by ear". I've always been a particular fan of strings, and spend a lot of time and effort just trying to get a certain sound. Still learning of course...


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## Robert Kooijman (Apr 12, 2019)

stonzthro said:


> There's a fond place in my heart for the ol' Emulators - and 4 of them still - awesome!



Haha, yes they are still hooked up  But rather then going trough the trouble of loading samples from disk over SCSI, they can be used as a semi-analog additive synth by using their internal ROM (sine, square) wave-forms.

One can assign MIDI CCs to various parameters and get really out of this world sounds by combining the many voices and analog outs of these Emulators...


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## Alex Fraser (Apr 12, 2019)

Robert Kooijman said:


> Thank you Alex. I have the bad habit of removing keyboards from their casing
> The challenge was to have easy access to both MIDI-keys, controllers, computer keyboard, mice etc. all at the same time.
> 
> The upper keyboard has a weighted piano hammer-action (Fatar SL880), the lower one more a synth feel (Fatar TMK88). You don't see the difference from above, but "under the hood" they are quite different mechanically.
> ...


(Looks at single Keystation bitterly...)


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## Polarity (Apr 13, 2019)

Years ago I tried touch on ipad but not felt right for me...
so I went down the hardware path making a custom controller based on two nanoKontrol2 units and designing the overlay panel with Omnisphere, Diva, Saurus and some Orchestral Libraries keyswitches in mind.
You can see the result in the photo.
Happy with that and thinking now about expanding it with a third unit or making a "brother" with a third and fourth unit to use in parallel.


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## SoNowWhat? (Apr 13, 2019)

Damn. Feeling some serious rig envy right now.


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## chris massa (Apr 13, 2019)

I was think about moving to an NI Jam. Had an older Fadermaster that died. Using a Korg nano at the moment.


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## anp27 (Apr 13, 2019)

Polarity said:


> Happy with that and thinking now about expanding it with a third unit or making a "brother" with a third and fourth unit to use in parallel.


Please update us when you've expanded it, this is fantastic!


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## DerGeist (Apr 13, 2019)

I did it! Getting this going was not fun.


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## jonathanparham (Apr 13, 2019)

DerGeist said:


> I like my Touche a lot. The sensitivity is great, the software is excellent, and it really helps bring a lot of instruments to life by allowing you to morph smoothly between changes to up to four parameters. It also lets you do things like play filters like bongos etc.
> 
> I do use it for orchestral work as well as it allows you to control dynamics and vibrato together in real time. It does take some practice.
> 
> One issue I have with it is that it sends up to four CCs (up, down, left, right). I have not had much luck using it as a standard x/y controller since most VSTs seem to use only one CC per axis. Thrill is a good example, x/y control is two CCs. I'm sure there is a way to address this but I'm not quite sure how.


is it easy to control articulations for say Cinematic Studio strings or Spitfire Chamber Strings? Can you 'play in' what you want?


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## danbo (Apr 14, 2019)

I have the Touche, Maschine Jam and JL Cooper Fadermaster Pro. From this I found that whatever the device is designed for is what it's really best suited for. 

The Touche is weird, wish I hadn't gotten it. It can CC but wasn't really designed this way. I'm busy setting up other things but will try to get it to be a master tempo control or something. There has to be some situation it really fits into. 

The Maschine Jam has a great CC mode, but it has too many buttons, kind of a shame to be using it for only a fraction of what it has. Ultimately I decided to use it for it's intended use which is a sequencer. Coming up to speed on that but it offers some interesting compositional tools. 

The FaderMaster has worked out great, I really like it. Just does one thing and does it really well, 8 faders are more than enough.


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## DerGeist (Apr 14, 2019)

danbo said:


> I have the Touche, Maschine Jam and JL Cooper Fadermaster Pro. From this I found that whatever the device is designed for is what it's really best suited for.
> 
> The Touche is weird, wish I hadn't gotten it. It can CC but wasn't really designed this way. I'm busy setting up other things but will try to get it to be a master tempo control or something. There has to be some situation it really fits into.
> 
> ...


What issues are you having. Mine has been great for CC with one or two exceptions where it behaved strangely (mostly xy grids) or defaulted to backwards (up is down). Otherwise no issues.


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## danbo (Apr 14, 2019)

Don't know which you're talking about, maybe the Touche. I don't remember, it's freaked out before, spitting out CC's until I unplugged. The interface is confusing, instead of keeping it simple they have all these stupid names I have to re-remember ... OK UVI Workstation is one, an app I haven't figured out yet. Lie is another I think, maybe that's the plugin, I forget where it's at. Then configuring it is different than I would have expected in terms of the philosophy of how it spits out CC's.

OFF TOPIC
I like software to be straightforward (maybe because I'm a software engineer by day). I work to make things simpler - all of our customers want things easier and clearer, why make it opaque? Take sample libraries, when I was first shopping I found Spitfire, went to their site and my first question was "What the hell is Albion?" I couldn't figure out what it was in a minute and so they forever lost my sale. I then went to EastWest who had the "Hollywood Strings" - BOOM. Instantly you know what it is, where it comes from and what it flavor it might have. 

ON TOPIC
The guys that did this overthought it and I don't want to spend that much energy figuring out their ideas. I'll get to it eventually and find some use for it.


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## Jdiggity1 (Apr 15, 2019)

Guffy said:


> One out of my holy trinity


You sicken me


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