# Samples for Trumpet Fanfares?



## Rodney Money (Feb 4, 2016)

For the past two days I was working on this small fanfare that comes in the 3rd movement of my trumpet concerto. This gave me the opportunity to work on my fanfare, multiple tonguing rendering also. What samples have you used for trumpet fanfares? And if you would like to render this short phrase to show me your example, I would be truly grateful, my friends. Note: notice it's for Bb trumpet, so in the DAW it would be in c minor.





Sound: https://app.box.com/s/0tabk3fb69eolmr74fp8ewf9lfmiqwsx


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 4, 2016)

Hollywood Brass (2 Trumpets Stacc and 1 Trumpet Stacc with reduced Release times). Also Repitition Trumpet Patches from HWB.


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## tomaslobosk (Feb 4, 2016)

Hi Rodney , well I mostly use Hollywood Brass (3 Trumpets patches are amazing for fanfares)... I'll try to do you a demo today.


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## Hanu_H (Feb 4, 2016)

Cinebrass has great shorts for trumpets.

-Hannes


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## Zhao Shen (Feb 4, 2016)

Hanu_H said:


> Cinebrass has great shorts for trumpets.
> 
> -Hannes


Yep. I've heard a lot of people criticize Cinebrass for being too "simple" or "shallow" but it really is quite amazing.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 4, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> Hollywood Brass (2 Trumpets Stacc and 1 Trumpet Stacc with reduced Release times). Also Repitition Trumpet Patches from HWB.


Nice! Sounds like math. Thank you for sharing.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 4, 2016)

tomaslobosk said:


> Hi Rodney , well I mostly use Hollywood Brass (3 Trumpets patches are amazing for fanfares)... I'll try to do you a demo today.


What's up, my brother! That would be truly awesome if you would do that not only for me but for others to hear as well.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 4, 2016)

Zhao Shen said:


> Yep. I've heard a lot of people criticize Cinebrass for being too "simple" or "shallow" but it really is quite amazing.


I guess by "shallow" they meant not deeply sampled such as more articulations and effects?


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## Rodney Money (Feb 4, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> Hollywood Brass (2 Trumpets Stacc and 1 Trumpet Stacc with reduced Release times). Also Repitition Trumpet Patches from HWB.


Nice hat, by the way!


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 4, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> Nice! Sounds like math. Thank you for sharing.



If you need more math, let me know.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 4, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> If you need more math, let me know.


Let's hear a rendering, if you like and have the time!


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## Lawson. (Feb 4, 2016)

Sample Modeling is quite good at this type of thing. Also, BML Trumpets have double, triple, and quad tongues. They sound fantastic, however there is no round robin (unless you turn on borrowing) so it can sound a bit of the same if you use them repeatedly.


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 4, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> Let's hear a rendering, if you like and have the time!


Actually I am pretty busy working for clients but I will keep that in mind. In general I would say: A lot goes into programming and knowing how to twist a library to your own needs. Surerly some guys here chimed in saying this library and that library is good for that. I guess for sure everyone is more or less right. I don´t know if you are familiar with those libraries mentioned here? (like HWB / Cinebrass and SM Stuff). Problem I often see with that fanfare things is not the roundrobins but the releases of the samples which at least in my opinion you have to shorten down a lot to avoid that the samples cloud together. Another point is to find the right patches. Just a thing: In hollywood someone sais here that he uses 3 trumpet patches. While I have nothing against that I often see that this patch is overpowering the sound ecspecially when you want to write voicings / chordal fanfares. Better use then 2 trumpet or even 1 trumpet because you have more detail and better control over the chordal stack.

Anyways hope it helps


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## Rodney Money (Feb 4, 2016)

Lawson. said:


> Sample Modeling is quite good at this type of thing. Also, BML Trumpets have double, triple, and quad tongues. They sound fantastic, however there is no round robin (unless you turn on borrowing) so it can sound a bit of the same if you use them repeatedly.


I heard that Sample Modeling can truly produce spectacular fanfare results, very cool. In the BML series, are the multiple tongue articulations tempo sync?


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## P.N. (Feb 4, 2016)

Vienna has a nice fanfare trumpet ensemble.
http://vsl.co.at/en/Special_Brass/Fanfare_trumpets


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## Rodney Money (Feb 4, 2016)

P.N. said:


> Vienna has a nice fanfare trumpet ensemble.
> http://vsl.co.at/en/Special_Brass/Fanfare_trumpets


Just look at those rotary valved trumpets! Thank you my friend for the suggestion.


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## Neifion (Feb 4, 2016)

Also, the BML series brass has a new feature called the "fanfare creator". Might be something to look into.


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## Ryan (Feb 5, 2016)

I would use SM Brass doubled with Spitfire Audio. Found that to work pretty well!


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## Kaufmanmoon (Feb 5, 2016)

Not sure if this is right, but have you seen this library?
It's mentioned above but thought worth linking you to it.
I must admit Sample Modelling seems to be the best bet.
http://www.spitfireaudio.com/shop/a-z/bml-trumpet-phalanx/


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## babylonwaves (Feb 5, 2016)

Trumpet Phalanx is fantastic. I can really recommend the whole Phalanx series when you're looking for the _big_ sound. Double that with the rest of BML brass and you're looking at 8 players.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 5, 2016)

Ryan said:


> I would use SM Brass doubled with Spitfire Audio. Found that to work pretty well!


That even sounds like it would be awesome.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 5, 2016)

Kaufmanmoon said:


> Not sure if this is right, but have you seen this library?
> It's mentioned above but thought worth linking you to it.
> I must admit Sample Modelling seems to be the best bet.
> http://www.spitfireaudio.com/shop/a-z/bml-trumpet-phalanx/


Oh yes! Pure awesomeness! I wish someone would take my little example and rendering it with either Spitfire or Sample Modeling... or both!


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## Ryan (Feb 5, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> That even sounds like it would be awesome.


Indeed!
Check my Youtube


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## Erik (Feb 5, 2016)

Hi Rodney,

I made some versions of your (enjoyable) piece with SampleModeling Trumpets (3 tr), VSL Dimension Brass (4), VSL Fanfare (6), VSL trumpets a3, Hollywood Brass (3), Chapman Trumpets (a3) and the old goodie Advanced Orchestra Trumpet section. I hope that I have performed your piece according to your taste, but anyway it gives a nice overview of these brass products. Please note that I had to _push up_ the dynamics because of your _*ff*_ in the score.
Reverb: QL Spaces, one of the Brass Halls

Here we go:
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI-VSL_DB.mp3 (VSL DB)
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI-VSL_Fanfare.mp3 (VSL Fanfare)
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI-VSL_Fanfare+DB.mp3 (VSL DB &amp; Fanfare)
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI-VSL_TR3.mp3 (VSL trumpets a 3)
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI-VSL_all.mp3 (VSL all)
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI-Chapman.mp3 (Chapman trumpets a3) (Embertone)
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI-Chapman+SM.mp3 (Chapman a3 &amp; SM)
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI-SM.mp3 (SM)
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI-SM+VSL_Fanfare+DB.mp3 (VSL all &amp; SM)
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI_HB.mp3 (HB)
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI-SM+HB.mp3 (HB &amp; SM)
Advanced Orchestra
http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI-AO+SM.mp3 (Advanced Orchestra &amp; SM)


I hope that this comparison is useful! There is also a http://www.erikotte.nl/temp/FanfareVI.zip (zip file with all tracks in it), so you could load them in your own DAW for further insight. At your service Rodney!

[EDIT: now in the right key signature: C-minor]
[EDIT2: added VSL trumpets a 3 - Chapman (Embertone) - Advanced Orchestra]


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## Rodney Money (Feb 5, 2016)

Ryan said:


> Indeed!
> Check my Youtube



Beautiful work, Ryan. Rock on with your beast self! What's some of the chord progressions you used for that piece? And I loved the bass drop.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 5, 2016)

Erik said:


> Hi Rodney,
> 
> I made some versions of your (enjoyable) piece with SampleModeling Trumpets (3 tr), VSL Dimension Brass (4), VSL Fanfare (6) and Hollywood Brass (3). I hope that I have performed your piece according to your taste, but anyway it gives a nice overview of these brass products. Please note that I had to _push up_ the dynamics because of your _*ff*_ in the score.
> Reverb: QL Spaces, one of the Brass Halls
> ...


Who is the man? Erik is the freaking man! Thank you so much, brother. You are truly awesome. You are the definition of musicians helping musicians and deserve 1000's of likes for your epic post. Thank you for finding my little fanfare enjoyable and being at my service also! You performed it perfectly. I have Spaces also. Did you use a default setting or messed with it some? Thank you for pushing it up to ff. Yes, this big push comes right after the pretty hymn leading to the climax of the third movement. This is an awesome overview of the brass products. If someone would like to do Cinesamples, Native Instruments Symphony Series, or Spitfire, it would almost be complete! Here's some things I noticed:

VSL DB: has that classic concert/ orchestral sound.
VSL Fanfare: more bolder, and if they really did use rotary-valved trumpets you can definitely hear it in the smoothness of the legatos!
VSL DB and Fanfare: sound is bigger like a happy Greek family.
SM: Here's where it gets interesting, I teach private lessons, and I noticed with one particular trumpet player when he points his bell directly towards me you can hear the articulation as if it is coming directly from his bell like a trumpet player pointing directly at the audience. The affect is a very up close sharp attack with a bright sound. I wonder if this is how they recorded SM?
VSL and SM big orchestral concert sound with crisper, brighter articulations.
HB: I can start to hear the Hollywood, epic almost John Williams.
HB and SM: tone of HB with the detail of SM!

Thank you again, my friend, great job!

"Oh, one more thing I noticed, I had the score written for Trumpet in Bb and forgot to transpose it back down (c minor,) but it was refreshing hearing it in a different key that you performed it in, d minor! Very cool."


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 5, 2016)

Thanks a lot for the comparisons. Very interesting to see where the similarities are but also the differences. Overall I prefer the last 2 examples. (and that is not because I have them in my palette


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## marclawsonmusic (Feb 5, 2016)

Not your piece, Rodney... and not exactly fanfare, but here is some fast multi-tonguing with Cinebrass... I've included some other instruments as well (also Cinebrass) so you can hear how they blend.

Trumpets only
Tpts + Hns
Tpts + Tbns
Full Ensemble


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## Rodney Money (Feb 5, 2016)

marclawsonmusic said:


> Not your piece, Rodney... and not exactly fanfare, but here is some fast multi-tonguing with Cinebrass... I've included some other instruments as well (also Cinebrass) so you can hear how they blend.
> 
> Trumpets only
> Tpts + Hns
> ...


Awesome demo, my friend! Very cool and hot. Thank you for taking the time to do this also. What reverb did you use and any eq?


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## marclawsonmusic (Feb 5, 2016)

Thank you, Rodney. I used Spaces for reverb - So. Cal Orchestral Hall. 

EQ is the 'JW Bright' preset in Cinebrass. The only other EQ I applied was some high-pass and low-pass on the reverb channel (before the signal hits the reverb).

I also did some tweaking of the release tails (off) and also dialed up the sample start as far as it would go so the attacks were as clean as possible.
Marc


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## Rodney Money (Feb 5, 2016)

marclawsonmusic said:


> Thank you, Rodney. I used Spaces for reverb - So. Cal Orchestral Hall.
> 
> EQ is the 'JW Bright' preset in Cinebrass. The only other EQ I applied was some high-pass and low-pass on the reverb channel (before the signal hits the reverb).
> 
> ...


Awesome advice. Stupid question... how do you make just a reverb channel alone but then send it to an instrument to affect it in Cubase? I hope I am saying that correctly.


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 5, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> Awesome advice. Stupid question... how do you make just a reverb channel alone but then send it to an instrument to affect it in Cubase? I hope I am saying that correctly.


you can set up a channeltrack then insert the reverb, and then you can send the signal from your dry miditrack (via send optio) to the reverbchannel.


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## marclawsonmusic (Feb 5, 2016)

Yes, but it's the other way around - you create an 'aux' or 'FX' track (not sure what it's called in Cubase - I'm a Logic guy), and then 'send' some signal from your instrument track to that aux/FX track. Then, you can mix the two levels to achieve a balance that is nice to your ear.


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 5, 2016)

marclawsonmusic said:


> Yes, but it's the other way around - you create an 'aux' or 'FX' track (not sure what it's called in Cubase - I'm a Logic guy), and then 'send' some signal from your instrument track to that aux/FX track. Then, you can mix the two levels to achieve a balance that is nice to your ear.


Well in Cubase it is via send to the FX Channel. Not mandatory to do it everytime like that. Advantage is that you have control over the wet signal.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 5, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> Well in Cubase it is via send to the FX Channel. Not mandatory to do it everytime like that. Advantage is that you have control over wet signal.


Cool, Ok so I set up an instrument channel, then a FX for the reverb, now how to I physically send it? What's the magic button? LOL.


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 5, 2016)

I just googled and found that video:



PS: In the manual on page 169 there is also explained how to set up send effects.

ftp://ftp.steinberg.net/Download/Cubase_4/Docs_English/Operation_Manual.pdf

( older pdf but the general thing is the same)

My teacher told me: Don´t do things for other what they can do by themselves 

But I hope it helps.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 5, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> My teacher told me: Don´t do things for other what they can do by themselves
> 
> But I hope it helps.


You have to realize though, you are talking to an idiot, lol... me.


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 5, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> You have to realize though, you are talking to an idiot, lol... me.


Ah come one, Rodney. I have faced unpleasant comedy in my life with some real dumbutts. And you don´t belong to them I am pretty sure. But yes thats an excuse not to look that up by yourself. hahah. Anyways hope it helps.


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## Erik (Feb 6, 2016)

Rodney, 
Thank you so much for your positive feedback!
It was a nice_ job _to do for me. I hope that there will be more contributions with other libraries based on your piece. How could I have forgotten to transpose the score a whole tone down, typically for a guitarist maybe? 


If anybody needs the midi file, just send me a PM. 

Also the Marc's Cinebrass example (& ??) is instructive!


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## marclawsonmusic (Feb 6, 2016)

Erik said:


> Also the Marc's Cinebrass example (& ??) is instructive!



Hi Erik, yes it was just Cinebrass Core using the 'Split Patches' (8th notes). A terrific sounding library for sure.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 6, 2016)

Erik said:


> Rodney,
> Thank you so much for your positive feedback!
> It was a nice_ job _to do for me. I hope that there will be more contributions with other libraries based on your piece. How could I have forgotten to transpose the score a whole tone down, typically for a guitarist maybe?
> 
> ...


Erik, you are truly awesome, my friend. NOW SOMEONE WHO IS PASSIONATE ABOUT SPITFIRE DO ONE!!!! Erik, feel free to link the midi file on this thread, but only if you like and in the right key, lol, jk. Thank you again, my friend, and I can not wait to check out your other thread concerning room placement software.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 6, 2016)

marclawsonmusic said:


> Hi Erik, yes it was just Cinebrass Core using the 'Split Patches' (8th notes). A terrific sounding library for sure.


It's nice that Cinesamples is getting some love.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 6, 2016)

So we have these examples now: VSL, SM, CineBrass, Hollywood Brass. Now we need a Spitfire and maybe a demo from Metropolis Ark 1.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 6, 2016)

Erik said:


> Rodney,
> Thank you so much for your positive feedback!
> It was a nice_ job _to do for me. I hope that there will be more contributions with other libraries based on your piece. How could I have forgotten to transpose the score a whole tone down, typically for a guitarist maybe?
> 
> ...


Not to force you to do more work, but how much work would it to be to transpose them down to C minor?


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## Lawson. (Feb 6, 2016)

I'll try to do a demo with BML Trumpets and Metropolis Ark sometime soon, but I have a ton of stuff on my schedule. No promises!

Also, I can't remember if the BML multi tongues are tempo synced. I'll test it when I get a chance.


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## Erik (Feb 7, 2016)

Rodney,
I have uploaded the new files. See my first post somewhere here.
Same links, new versions.

For those who want to make their own version http://erikotte.nl/blog/VIfanfare_Cminor.mid (herewith the midi file in C-minor).


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 7, 2016)

I have done a short test with Hollywood Brass. With more time I could of course tweak the stuff to let sound it better


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## Erik (Feb 7, 2016)

I have added some more libraries, see my first post.

@Alexander: nice and brassy! Did you use the rips for the upbeats? I guess the different tempo choice is yours?


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 7, 2016)

Erik said:


> I have added some more libraries, see my first post.
> 
> @Alexander: nice and brassy! Did you use the rips for the upbeats? I guess the different tempo choice is yours?



Yes, I altered slightly the tempo - if you like I can sent you back the template project from cubase? I use 6.5, so you can see what I did there.

But yes I use also a rip patch there.

Add: I mean everybody is welcome to have the project file. I can upload it later on DB if you like. I think you can get better results by spending more time into tweaking the length of the notes, velocities and curves (sometimes it is a bit jumpy).

As effects I only add on the insert one instance of QL Spaces (Hollywood Scoring Stage ss, 2.4 seconds) and I notched out a bit of the harsh frequencies of the trumpets in the upper mids (which I never liked in HWB), also I lowcutted a bit the lows to get a nice proximity effect.


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## Rob (Feb 7, 2016)

or, if you have wivi, that's also an option... 

www.robertosoggetti.com/3trumpets-wivi.mp3


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## marclawsonmusic (Feb 7, 2016)

Rob said:


> or, if you have wivi, that's also an option...
> 
> www.robertosoggetti.com/3trumpets-wivi.mp3



Sounds great, Rob.


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## Rob (Feb 7, 2016)

marclawsonmusic said:


> Sounds great, Rob.


Thanks, wivi can be surprisingly good, but it needs some tweaking...


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 7, 2016)

marclawsonmusic said:


> Sounds great, Rob.



I like the shorts there though and the homogenous sound though at least for my ear it is here and there synthy sounding, also the repetition sequences are a way too polished at least for me. But overall a acceptable result I have to say.


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## Erik (Feb 7, 2016)

Rob said:


> or, if you have wivi, that's also an option...
> 
> www.robertosoggetti.com/3trumpets-wivi.mp3


Well done Again Rob! WIVI is at its best in the brass imo, but indeed there is always lots of tweaking. Thanks for sharing!


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## Rob (Feb 7, 2016)

Thank you Erik!


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## storyteller (Feb 7, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> For the past two days I was working on this small fanfare that comes in the 3rd movement of my trumpet concerto. This gave me the opportunity to work on my fanfare, multiple tonguing rendering also. What samples have you used for trumpet fanfares? And if you would like to render this short phrase to show me your example, I would be truly grateful, my friends. Note: notice it's for Bb trumpet, so in the DAW it would be in c minor.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I thought I'd add *NI Symphony Series Brass* to the mix since it was requested and hasn't been posted yet. I did not have much time so all I did was use Erik's midi file as-is (thanks Erik ), but it should at least be representative of the tone. I included several different variations. For the Ensemble Trumpet examples, you will find the Staccato F patch, Staccato muted patch, and a mix between the two. You will find the same examples for the Solo Trumpet. I also blended all four into one combined mix. I did not take the time to change the mic positions or add sustains, so it is just the standard Mix mic position on one patch each. No reverb, eq, or effects were added. Again, nothing was changed from the midi file. Hope this helps with some perspective.

http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_Ensemble_Staccato_F.mp3 (NI SSB - Ensemble Staccato Forte)
http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_Ensemble_Staccato_Mute.mp3 (NI SSB - Ensemble Staccato Muted)
http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_Ensemble_Combined.mp3 (NI SSB - Ensemble Staccato Forte &amp; Muted Blended)
http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_Solo_Staccato_F.mp3 (NI SSB - Solo Staccato Forte)
http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_Solo_Staccato_Mute.mp3 (NI SSB - Solo Staccato Muted)
http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_Solo_Combined.mp3 (NI SSB - Solo Staccato Forte &amp; Muted Blended)
http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_All_Combined.mp3 (NI SSB - Even Blend of Ensemble &amp; Solo Tracks)

EDIT: Also, added a zip file to download all files at once http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_Trumpet_Fanfare_Demos.zip (here.)


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## prodigalson (Feb 7, 2016)

storyteller said:


> I thought I'd add *NI Symphony Series Brass* to the mix since it was requested and hasn't been posted yet. I did not have much time so all I did was use Erik's midi file as-is (thanks Erik ), but it should at least be representative of the tone. I included several different variations. For the Ensemble Trumpet examples, you will find the Staccato F patch, Staccato muted patch, and a mix between the two. You will find the same examples for the Solo Trumpet. I also blended all four into one combined mix. I did not take the time to change the mic positions or add sustains, so it is just the standard Mix mic position on one patch each. No reverb, eq, or effects were added. Again, nothing was changed from the midi file. Hope this helps with some perspective.
> 
> http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_Ensemble_Staccato_F.mp3 (NI SSB - Ensemble Staccato Forte)
> http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_Ensemble_Staccato_Mute.mp3 (NI SSB - Ensemble Staccato Muted)
> ...



NO reverb was added??? jesus, where did they record this thing?


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## HiEnergy (Feb 7, 2016)

I've also given this one a try... my rendition of the fanfare uses a mix of the Komplete 9 "Factory" solo trumpet and the three trumpets from Xtant Model Brass.

It's here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/nqlzyu4l2b1y6ul/fanfare mix.wav?dl=0

I've done some slight adjustments to the midi data (note lengths, velocities) and added some expression and keyswitches.

Still lots of room for improvement...


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## SpeakPianissimoAndCarry.. (Feb 7, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> For the past two days I was working on this small fanfare that comes in the 3rd movement of my trumpet concerto. This gave me the opportunity to work on my fanfare, multiple tonguing rendering also. What samples have you used for trumpet fanfares? And if you would like to render this short phrase to show me your example, I would be truly grateful, my friends. Note: notice it's for Bb trumpet, so in the DAW it would be in c minor.



A little late to this post but my go to fanfare trumpets is still Vienna Symphonic Fanfare Trumpets. Demos on the left: https://vsl.co.at/en/Special_Brass/Fanfare_trumpets I am liking Bravura though as another go to possibility though. The jury is still out.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 7, 2016)

Lawson. said:


> I'll try to do a demo with BML Trumpets and Metropolis Ark sometime soon, but I have a ton of stuff on my schedule. No promises!
> 
> Also, I can't remember if the BML multi tongues are tempo synced. I'll test it when I get a chance.


Yeah man, do it. Represent the big dogs, lol. Become the Awesome Lawson once again.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 7, 2016)

Erik said:


> Hi Rodney,
> 
> I made some versions of your (enjoyable) piece with SampleModeling Trumpets (3 tr), VSL Dimension Brass (4), VSL Fanfare (6), VSL trumpets a3, Hollywood Brass (3), Chapman Trumpets (a3) and the old goodie Advanced Orchestra Trumpet section. I hope that I have performed your piece according to your taste, but anyway it gives a nice overview of these brass products. Please note that I had to _push up_ the dynamics because of your _*ff*_ in the score.
> Reverb: QL Spaces, one of the Brass Halls
> ...


Yes, loving the new stuff, man. Way to go, and thank you for all your hard work and passion for this forum.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 7, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> I have done a short test with Hollywood Brass. With more time I could of course tweak the stuff to let sound it better



Yes! It's like the trumpets said, "Yeah man, we got this." Then played it with both attitude and fortitude.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 7, 2016)

Rob said:


> or, if you have wivi, that's also an option...
> 
> www.robertosoggetti.com/3trumpets-wivi.mp3


Clear as a bell! Thank you so much for representing wifi!


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## Rodney Money (Feb 7, 2016)

storyteller said:


> I thought I'd add *NI Symphony Series Brass* to the mix since it was requested and hasn't been posted yet. I did not have much time so all I did was use Erik's midi file as-is (thanks Erik ), but it should at least be representative of the tone. I included several different variations. For the Ensemble Trumpet examples, you will find the Staccato F patch, Staccato muted patch, and a mix between the two. You will find the same examples for the Solo Trumpet. I also blended all four into one combined mix. I did not take the time to change the mic positions or add sustains, so it is just the standard Mix mic position on one patch each. No reverb, eq, or effects were added. Again, nothing was changed from the midi file. Hope this helps with some perspective.
> 
> http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_Ensemble_Staccato_F.mp3 (NI SSB - Ensemble Staccato Forte)
> http://phoetry.co/publicshare/NI_SSB_Ensemble_Staccato_Mute.mp3 (NI SSB - Ensemble Staccato Muted)
> ...


Loved these examples dude, and so happy that you chose to do the mutes also. Many people mix them in with the open sounds for more bite in sample renderings even though you would never do that in real life so thank you once again for your contribution. NI SSB is bright, tight, and just blistering their way towards that larger than life sound. I loved the solo and ensemble blend also. It was large but refine detail.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 7, 2016)

prodigalson said:


> NO reverb was added??? jesus, where did they record this thing?


Some church for Jesus, lol.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 7, 2016)

HiEnergy said:


> I've also given this one a try... my rendition of the fanfare uses a mix of the Komplete 9 "Factory" solo trumpet and the three trumpets from Xtant Model Brass.
> 
> It's here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/nqlzyu4l2b1y6ul/fanfare mix.wav?dl=0
> 
> ...


Your adjustments were very musical, my friend. Way to represent NI and the new Xtant Model Brass! The articulations were spot on.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 7, 2016)

SpeakPianissimoAndCarry.. said:


> A little late to this post but my go to fanfare trumpets is still Vienna Symphonic Fanfare Trumpets. Demos on the left: https://vsl.co.at/en/Special_Brass/Fanfare_trumpets I am liking Bravura though as another go to possibility though. The jury is still out.


You are never too late to join the party, and to bring something to the table. Let's complete this task and include Bravura so the jury can make their decision! This is VI, let the libraies speak for themselves, lol.


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## Paul T McGraw (Feb 7, 2016)

Rob said:


> or, if you have wivi, that's also an option...
> 
> www.robertosoggetti.com/3trumpets-wivi.mp3



That was WIVI? It sounded great. What did you do to it?


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## HiEnergy (Feb 7, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> Your adjustments were very musical, my friend. Way to represent NI and the new Xtant Model Brass! The articulations were spot on.


Thanks for your appreciation!


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## Rob (Feb 8, 2016)

Paul T McGraw said:


> That was WIVI? It sounded great. What did you do to it?



hi Paul, these three trumpets are wivi patches I have customized... plus, I've sent the hall channel to an external reverb (tsar) and EQed the early reflections channel.


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## Paul T McGraw (Feb 8, 2016)

Rob said:


> hi Paul, these three trumpets are wivi patches I have customized... plus, I've sent the hall channel to an external reverb (tsar) and EQed the early reflections channel.



You did an awesome job. I have WIVI but never heard it sound that good. Of course, I don't have the skill or knowledge to customize, nor the mixing skills you obviously have demonstrated.

Despite my lack of ability, and results nowhere near as good as yours, I found the WIVI woodwinds and brass very attractive when I bought them several years ago. The one big problem, no legato. Did you find a solution?


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## Rob (Feb 8, 2016)

Paul T McGraw said:


> You did an awesome job. I have WIVI but never heard it sound that good. Of course, I don't have the skill or knowledge to customize, nor the mixing skills you obviously have demonstrated.
> 
> Despite my lack of ability, and results nowhere near as good as yours, I found the WIVI woodwinds and brass very attractive when I bought them several years ago. The one big problem, no legato. Did you find a solution?



patience and tweaking  if you work on the "legato" and "transition speed" parameters much can be done... but there are so many parameters to check... what I always do is turn off the "smart release", raise the legato, at the same time lowering the impact of the cc on it, also slow the transitions a bit (but it depends, sometimes I need to speed them up), find a suitable amplitude envelope, work on the vibrato tab and from there go experimenting. It needs time and a certain passion for editing...


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## babylonwaves (Feb 8, 2016)

Here's my admittedly rough and dirty try with SF Trumpet Phalanx (Legato + Fanfare Builder). Six Trumps.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet%20Phalanx%20A6%20BBW.mp3 (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet Phalanx A6 BBW.mp3)


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## Rodney Money (Feb 8, 2016)

Rob said:


> patience and tweaking  if you work on the "legato" and "transition speed" parameters much can be done... but there are so many parameters to check... what I always do is turn off the "smart release", raise the legato, at the same time lowering the impact of the cc on it, also slow the transitions a bit (but it depends, sometimes I need to speed them up), find a suitable amplitude envelope, work on the vibrato tab and from there go experimenting. It needs time and a certain passion for editing...


Amen brother, it just goes to show sometimes its not what you have but how you skillfully use it!


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## jason.d (Feb 8, 2016)

Wow very nice demos you guys! So far the Hollywood brass sound is doing it for me. I'm surprised how washy the phalanx trumpets are, although the tonguing of the phalanx trumpets sounds the most realistic out of all of them.

babylonwaves, do you mind if I ask which mics you used for your demo?


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## babylonwaves (Feb 8, 2016)

jason.d said:


> Wow very nice demos you guys! So far the Hollywood brass sound is doing it for me. I'm surprised how washy the phalanx trumpets are, although the tonguing of the phalanx trumpets sounds the most realistic out of all of them.
> 
> babylonwaves, do you mind if I ask which mics you used for your demo?



I've used a Jake Jackson stereo mix, here's a dryer version with a blend of Close, Tree and Ambient mics. Depending on what size you have in mind, the JJ "Broad" mix can be a little bit to indirect. I'm sure the transitions can be tweaked much better but I don't have much time right now.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet%20Phalanx%20A6%20Closer%20BBW.mp3 (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet Phalanx A6 Closer BBW.mp3)


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## jason.d (Feb 8, 2016)

babylonwaves said:


> I've used a Jake Jackson stereo mix, here's a dryer version with a blend of Close, Tree and Ambient mics. Depending on what size you have in mind, the JJ "Broad" mix can be a little bit to indirect. I'm sure the transitions can be tweaked much better but I don't have much time right now.
> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet%20Phalanx%20A6%20Closer%20BBW.mp3 (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet Phalanx A6 Closer BBW.mp3)



oh wow, very nice of you to make another demo! I like that one a lot actually!


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 8, 2016)

babylonwaves said:


> I've used a Jake Jackson stereo mix, here's a dryer version with a blend of Close, Tree and Ambient mics. Depending on what size you have in mind, the JJ "Broad" mix can be a little bit to indirect. I'm sure the transitions can be tweaked much better but I don't have much time right now.
> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet%20Phalanx%20A6%20Closer%20BBW.mp3 (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet Phalanx A6 Closer BBW.mp3)



But I assume you didn´t put much time in anything regarding programming here right? Sounds at least for my ear that there is nothing really done to let those samples sound a bit more expressive and lively.


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## tack (Feb 8, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> But I assume you didn´t put much time in anything regarding programming here right?


Didn't he just say that in the part you quoted?


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## Rodney Money (Feb 8, 2016)

jason.d said:


> Wow very nice demos you guys! So far the Hollywood brass sound is doing it for me. I'm surprised how washy the phalanx trumpets are, although the tonguing of the phalanx trumpets sounds the most realistic out of all of them.
> 
> babylonwaves, do you mind if I ask which mics you used for your demo?


They have been truly awesome, haven't they? And I thank everyone for participating and the ones who are still going to contribute. Hollywood brass does have some fortitude behind it, doesn't it? I love that everyone is liking different ones also. It tell a lot about people's different styles even while using the same musical passage. Very cool.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 8, 2016)

babylonwaves said:


> Here's my admittedly rough and dirty try with SF Trumpet Phalanx (Legato + Fanfare Builder). Six Trumps.
> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet%20Phalanx%20A6%20BBW.mp3 (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet Phalanx A6 BBW.mp3)


Yes! And here's the big guns belting it out in Air studios. Thank you, my friend for taking the time to do this and render the lesser ambient one also! I can definitely hear the "TA KA TA."


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 8, 2016)

tack said:


> Didn't he just say that in the part you quoted?


I am not sure what he means by a "rough and dirty" try. So I was interested if he just copied the content from the midi, loaded a patch and rendered it down to mp3. Because it sounds (a bit) like that. I would be more interested in a more shaped example. Ecspecially because I think that the phalanx can truely sound so much better. What I want to say is: Nobody should spent hours here to make that short demo though I appreciate at least a bit editing so that it gives a good impression. Shouldn´t it? :D


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## Rodney Money (Feb 8, 2016)

I tell you what though, this is becoming the "What Brass Samples Have the Best Shorts Thread?" With all of the different libraries now represented, if future people on the forum had similar inquiries, people could simply point them here. We need to hear Bravura now. Represent!


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## NoamL (Feb 8, 2016)

Man, _most_ of these libraries are NOT sounding good to my ear... this high and exposed trumpet phrase is certainly appropriate for testing libraries under a pitiless spotlight! I can imagine that this a very tiring and unforgiving part of the Tpt range for players to sample!

But also, with so much tonguing to handle, it's easy for these demos to start revealing their unreality... when you don't hear the "dakata dakata"... know what I mean? I'm not a trumpet player.

Cinebrass Core sounded nice although we didn't get an exact comparison yet. SF Phalanx sounded good on the shorts but wasn't very aggressive. WIVI was surprisingly good, SM was ok but a bit robotic, and then all the rest were worse off I think.

Here's two more

*Jasper Blunk Fortissimo Trumpets

HW Brass Gold Tpts a3 with sweat, tears, triplet-faking, and QL Spaces*

edit: here's *HWB totally dry*

Not really a fair comparison I know, because most of these are "out of the box" demos. But I wanted to see how far I could push HWB.

Jasper Blunk on the other hand always sounds very nice OOTB.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 8, 2016)

NoamL said:


> Man, _most_ of these libraries are NOT sounding good to my ear... this high and exposed trumpet phrase is certainly appropriate for testing libraries under a pitiless spotlight! I can imagine that this a very tiring and unforgiving part of the Tpt range for players to sample!
> 
> But also, with so much tonguing to handle, it's easy for these demos to start revealing their unreality... when you don't hear the "dakata dakata"... know what I mean? I'm not a trumpet player.
> 
> ...


Freaking awesome! The Jasper Blunk came here with a ripping, bright attitude that blistered its way through the fanfare, and the HW mixed with the tears and sweat was simply pure music! Thank you so much for doing this, my friend and keeping people in check, lol.


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Feb 8, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> Freaking awesome! The Jasper Blunk came here with a ripping, bright attitude that blistered its way through the fanfare, and the HW mixed with the tears and sweat was simply pure music! Thank you so much for doing this, my friend and keeping people in check, lol.




Btw Rodney: Can you please complete the thread with a live performance from you so that we can move on by realizing (even before) that live players are still needed and welcome. Thanks


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## Rodney Money (Feb 8, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> Btw Rodney: Can you please complete the thread with a live performance from you so that we can move on by realizing (even before) that live players are still needed and welcome. Thanks


Man, I wish, but I don't even have a mic.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 9, 2016)

But there is another thread now called "Beautiful Brass" where there is a live example. http://vi-control.net/community/thr...-brass-lets-have-some-fun.51652/#post-3936743


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## babylonwaves (Feb 11, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> But I assume you didn´t put much time in anything regarding programming here right? Sounds at least for my ear that there is nothing really done to let those samples sound a bit more expressive and lively.


you assume right. as stated, i didn't have time (why would I mention this otherwise?). i've updated the following link now. I've only posted something so Rodney can get an impression on how the Fanfare Builder sound. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet%20Phalanx%20A6%20Closer%20BBW.mp3 (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet Phalanx A6 Closer BBW.mp3)


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## Rodney Money (Feb 11, 2016)

babylonwaves said:


> you assume right. as stated, i didn't have time (why would I mention this otherwise?). i've updated the following link now. I've only posted something so Rodney can get an impression on how the Fanfare Builder sound. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet%20Phalanx%20A6%20Closer%20BBW.mp3 (https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/11713963/Trumpet Phalanx A6 Closer BBW.mp3)


Thank you, my friend, for doing this. I am amazed how similar Cinesamples and Spitfire sound in the tone of the instruments but where they differ in both articulation (the start of the note) and the release. In Cinesamples they simply restart the ta or tu articulation of the 8th note and it sounds as though you can hear the ta ka ta and tu tu ku in the multiple tongue of Spitfire. Thank you, my friend, for your wonderful example.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 11, 2016)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> Btw Rodney: Can you please complete the thread with a live performance from you so that we can move on by realizing (even before) that live players are still needed and welcome. Thanks


Here's a live performance not of this piece but it does show a lot of triple tonguing! It's some excepts from a piece called Pilot Mountain. There are 6 trumpets at the beginning, and if anyone is wondering about the low brass, you hear 2 tubas and 2 bass trombones. No need for cimbasso or contrabass trombone here, lol.


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## Lawson. (Feb 13, 2016)

1 Trumpet Solo
2 Trumpet a2
3 Trumpet Solo + a2
4 Trumpet a2 w/ multi-tongue (apparently the multi-tongues aren't tempo synced btw)

I'll try to get MA1 up soon.

Also, Trumpet a2 was being buggy with the release on the tenutos, which caused that slight overlap effect. 

[Note: I have received free products from Spitfire Audio]


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## iaink (Feb 14, 2016)

Here are the sample modeling trumpets all the way at the back of the Großer Saal:


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## rainierjmartin (Feb 14, 2016)

iaink said:


> Here are the sample modeling trumpets all the way at the back of the Großer Saal:



Wow! How did you get SM Brass to sound like that?


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## Musica42 (Feb 14, 2016)

Tried a little different approach and built a section out of solo patches from various libraries. Here they are in turn and then together:

http://www.mediafire.com/listen/05dtg1k6dow1nbi/Trumpet_Fanfare_v3.mp3

1. Cinebrass
2. Spitfire Trumpet Corps
3. Project SAM Orch Brass Classic

Only processing is running through Altiverb Teldex.


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## dpasdernick (Feb 14, 2016)

P.N. said:


> Vienna has a nice fanfare trumpet ensemble.
> http://vsl.co.at/en/Special_Brass/Fanfare_trumpets


+1 on Vienna... the player is also a work of art


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## Rodney Money (Feb 15, 2016)

Lawson. said:


> 1 Trumpet Solo
> 2 Trumpet a2
> 3 Trumpet Solo + a2
> 4 Trumpet a2 w/ multi-tongue (apparently the multi-tongues aren't tempo synced btw)
> ...



This is a wonderful example of Spitfire, my friend, and thank you for doing this. I don't know why they wouldn't make the multiple tongues tempo synced though. For my pieces, it would almost make it completely useless, because it sounds as though they are not in tempo trying to rush too much. This was a great representative of Spitfire, and you should recieve free products from them!


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## Rodney Money (Feb 15, 2016)

iaink said:


> Here are the sample modeling trumpets all the way at the back of the Großer Saal:



Curse you Iain Kelso, curse you to heck! Lol. Just when I thought I was not going to buy Sample Modeling you post this awesome, realistic example. So now you have to share. How in the world did you get it to sound like this? I always hear 2 different sounds of Sample Modeling, no offense to anyone, but the ultra bright jazzy sound that doesn't have the correct tone for classical style renderings, then ones like this that actually sound like I'm performing. Did you eq it to sound darker, warmer or simply placing it the hall did the work for you? Plus concerning your reverb, what program is the hall in? Basically, tell us everything, lol.


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## iaink (Feb 15, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> Curse you Iain Kelso, curse you to heck! Lol. Just when I thought I was not going to buy Sample Modeling you post this awesome, realistic example. So now you have to share. How in the world did you get it to sound like this? I always hear 2 different sounds of Sample Modeling, no offense to anyone, but the ultra bright jazzy sound that doesn't have the correct tone for classical style renderings, then ones like this that actually sound like I'm performing. Did you eq it to sound darker, warmer or simply placing it the hall did the work for you? Plus concerning your reverb, what program is the hall in? Basically, tell us everything, lol.



Thanks Rodney, your threads have been very helpful. These experiments have made me realize my reverb/3d set-up of preference was not the best I could do.

I have some EQ in this example but not much. This is the 3 SM trumpets and the flügelhorn sitting at the back of the MIR Pro Großer Saal. The main microphone is in the 7th row to add more distance. Each of the 4 trumpet performances is programmed slightly differently.

Cheers


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## Rodney Money (Feb 16, 2016)

iaink said:


> Thanks Rodney, your threads have been very helpful. These experiments have made me realize my reverb/3d set-up of preference was not the best I could do.
> 
> I have some EQ in this example but not much. This is the 3 SM trumpets and the flügelhorn sitting at the back of the MIR Pro Großer Saal. The main microphone is in the 7th row to add more distance. Each of the 4 trumpet performances is programmed slightly differently.
> 
> Cheers


Thank you for the additional information. Is it possible to hear the same rendering without flugelhorn, then totally dry? Sorry for asking too much, but this is extremely interesting for me as I will be considering purchasing in the spring time.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 16, 2016)

Musica42 said:


> Tried a little different approach and built a section out of solo patches from various libraries. Here they are in turn and then together:
> 
> http://www.mediafire.com/listen/05dtg1k6dow1nbi/Trumpet_Fanfare_v3.mp3
> 
> ...


Oh, project SAM is finally represented! This is a clear, great example of the differences between the tone of these three different libraries. Just wondering how did you get Cinebrass sounding so bright? Did you raise the eq or is it simply the reverb? Also, how hard was it to balance the legato with the shorts? I've heard that Cinesamples can be tricky in that regard. Cinebrass sounded like a section while Spitefire sounded a little less in numbers and SAM even more divided for a classic, clearer sound. I loved the demo of all of them complimenting each other. My ears were telling me SAM upfront, Cinebrass for fullness and Spitfire blending inbetween.


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## iaink (Feb 16, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> Thank you for the additional information. Is it possible to hear the same rendering without flugelhorn, then totally dry? Sorry for asking too much, but this is extremely interesting for me as I will be considering purchasing in the spring time.



I can do that and will post later. In the meantime, these SM brass tests might be of interest:

MIR Pro & B2:



Reverbs noted in the video:


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## Rodney Money (Feb 16, 2016)

iaink said:


> I can do that and will post later. In the meantime, these SM brass tests might be of interest:
> 
> MIR Pro & B2:
> 
> ...



Love these examples! Thank you so very much for posting the links, and I look forward to the other examples also. I find it will benefit us all.


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## Musica42 (Feb 16, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> Oh, project SAM is finally represented! This is a clear, great example of the differences between the tone of these three different libraries. Just wondering how did you get Cinebrass sounding so bright? Did you raise the eq or is it simply the reverb? Also, how hard was it to balance the legato with the shorts? I've heard that Cinesamples can be tricky in that regard. Cinebrass sounded like a section while Spitefire sounded a little less in numbers and SAM even more divided for a classic, clearer sound. I loved the demo of all of them complimenting each other. My ears were telling me SAM upfront, Cinebrass for fullness and Spitfire blending inbetween.



Appreciate the comments!

I didn't do any EQing so you're hearing whatever resulted from the reverb. Honestly didn't have that much trouble working with the Cinebrass solo trumpet. The legato's definitely had a delay but it was simple enough to compensate for in the piano roll and volume and tone was very even across articulations. So no complaints there. Pretty much the same for Spitfire and ProjectSAM. The only complaint I would lodge is the Spitfire solo trumpet legato articulation doesn't seem to get any louder than a mf so it was useless for this particular passage.

I did try this with ensemble patches a couple times but differences in response and tone between the shorts and legatos were beyond frustrating to work around so I finally gave up with that route. So I can definitely corroborate there.

I was really pleased with the final composite as well, so thanks for the compliment.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 16, 2016)

Musica42 said:


> Appreciate the comments!
> 
> I didn't do any EQing so you're hearing whatever resulted from the reverb. Honestly didn't have that much trouble working with the Cinebrass solo trumpet. The legato's definitely had a delay but it was simple enough to compensate for in the piano roll and volume and tone was very even across articulations. So no complaints there. Pretty much the same for Spitfire and ProjectSAM. The only complaint I would lodge is the Spitfire solo trumpet legato articulation doesn't seem to get any louder than a mf so it was useless for this particular passage.
> 
> ...


Well, I feel like an idiot right now. For some reason my ears were telling me Cinebrass and Spitfire where ensemble patches, must be the reverb, but now I hear and understand why CineBrass Pro trumpet solo sounded bright.


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