# XPERIMENTA Due tech assistance thread



## fcangia

Here's Flavio from XPERIMENTA Project.
If you need assistance with XPERIMENTA Due, you can write here or to our e-mail [email protected]

Enjoy the pianos!


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## Laptoprabbit

fcangia said:


> Note for Due users:
> If you are using Kontakt 6, I _highly recommend_ to turn off the Knob next to the "Resonance" label. I've just found this little bug which emphasizes the re-pedaling in the newer version of Kontakt, probably due to a different response of the convolution plugin. I've fixed this by turning the knob off by default.


Thanks, this helped a lot


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## fcangia

A lot of Due users are asking about how to update to 1.9. First, let's see what's new:

*Why 1.9 and not 1.6?*
Because the improvements are a lot, and because I like more this number  joking, the next step from this release has to be Due 2...maybe in the future. I'm already working on a "side patch" to add to the software: a "felt-like" piano, using the same samples.

*New things in Due 1.9:*
- New! Half-Pedaling
- New! Soft Pedaling support
- New! Now you can purge the release samples from the RAM. This helps also to achieve better CPU performances.
- New! Two types of resonances; Impulse Response and Resonance Samples. NOTE: IR Response works better in Kontakt 5. The knob is switched off by default.
- Fix: less latency, faster response
- The feeling knob will not only adds a delay in the lower velocity, but it will also preserve the headroom of the sample, for a natural transient of the sound.
- Fix: better CPU performances
- Fix: Better noise control overall
- Fix: "Flutter" label
- Some ringing harmonics were smoothed (especially in the 3/4st octave of the First Piano)
- Other little fixes

I'm working to make the update as much easy as possible. I really would like to avoid the download of the samples (maybe just the first piano files). You will receive an e-mail as always, next week because I'm working on a new release and I really would like to give a little present to the 1.5 users...

Best,
Flavio.

@CGR


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## Stan Stewart

You asked in another thread if I was using the latest Due. I have 1.9 which seems to be the most recent. You talked about a slow computer. Mine is a 3.1 GHz 6-Core Intel Core i5 with 64GB RAM. I'm not thinking that's the issue.

Don't get me wrong, I think your piano sounds are promising. Overall, I'm more impressed with the 2nd piano.

I don't really have a support question, but just wanted to respond here since you asked me to.


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## Alex C

fcangia said:


> - New! Two types of resonances; Impulse Response and Resonance Samples. NOTE: IR Response works better in Kontakt 5. The knob is switched off by default.



This I don't understand, Flavio. How does this knob work and how (or when) does it switch between Impulse resonance or sampled resonance?


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## fcangia

Stan Stewart said:


> You asked in another thread if I was using the latest Due. I have 1.9 which seems to be the most recent. You talked about a slow computer. Mine is a 3.1 GHz 6-Core Intel Core i5 with 64GB RAM. I'm not thinking that's the issue.
> 
> Don't get me wrong, I think your piano sounds are promising. Overall, I'm more impressed with the 2nd piano.
> 
> I don't really have a support question, but just wanted to respond here since you asked me to.



Thanks  I'm here to help customers to get the best experience from our products!
I posted here because wanted to keep clean the thread. I hope the answer in the other thread was helpful.
If you are experiencing some glitches, try to turn off overtones and repedaling, use the light patch, and try to increase the buffer size.


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## fcangia

Alex C said:


> This I don't understand, Flavio. How does this knob work and how (or when) does it switch between Impulse resonance or sampled resonance?



The two types of resonance:
*Samples*: I've recorded the piano with the pedal down, so these samples are triggered when the sustain pedal is on.
*IR Reverb*: The sound goes through a convolution reverb, with a custom Impulse generated from the open strings of the piano, and controlled by the sustain pedal. It helps to achieve a warm and natural sound.

When the sustain pedal "goes down" (off), the Convolution reverb should "clean" the previous information, and this is not working in the same way in Kontakt 5 and 6. This is why in Kontakt 6 you can experience some sort of "repedaling" on faster movements of the pedal. I'm trying to fix this and I hope to find a solution because I think it is a great feature.

Meanwhile, you can switch off this function by moving the knob next to the "Resonance" label all the way left.


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## SupremeFist

Is it possible to keep the preattack of the sound (as it is in the current version of the C3) without having to add the feeling parameter if one doesn't want the delay?


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## Laptoprabbit

fcangia said:


> The two types of resonance:
> *Samples*: I've recorded the piano with the pedal down, so these samples are triggered when the sustain pedal is on.
> *IR Reverb*: The sound goes through a convolution reverb, with a custom Impulse generated from the open strings of the piano, and controlled by the sustain pedal. It helps to achieve a warm and natural sound.
> 
> When the sustain pedal "goes down" (off), the Convolution reverb should "clean" the previous information, and this is not working in the same way in Kontakt 5 and 6. This is why in Kontakt 6 you can experience some sort of "repedaling" on faster movements of the pedal. I'm trying to fix this and I hope to find a solution because I think it is a great feature.
> 
> Meanwhile, you can switch off this function by moving the knob next to the "Resonance" label all the way left.



When you fix this could you take a look at Preparato? I think the issue is there as well.


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## labornvain

Just had to chime in here to say that I had never heard of this company and so spent a while surfing through their website and I was really impressed. What a great collection of instruments and quite lovely demo music to go with him.

Well done mate. Cheers


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## Stan Stewart

fcangia said:


> Thanks  I'm here to help customers to get the best experience from our products!
> I posted here because wanted to keep clean the thread. I hope the answer in the other thread was helpful.
> If you are experiencing some glitches, try to turn off overtones and repedaling, use the light patch, and try to increase the buffer size.


I have a brand new, high powered system, so using the light patch is not on my to-do list. I’ll try the other tweaks you mention as time permits. Thanks!


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## doctoremmet

labornvain said:


> Just had to chime in here to say that I had never heard of this company and so spent a while surfing through their website and I was really impressed. What a great collection of instruments and quite lovely demo music to go with him.
> 
> Well done mate. Cheers


Their Due pianos are generally held in high regard around these parts!


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## Alex C

I hope this Kontakt 6 issue will soon be fixed.


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## Alex C

I wonder if it's possible to make a separate patch that has the sample start of all the notes truncated to an absolute minimum (in a non-destructive manner which Kontakt provides)? I understand that this is done for ultimate realism, but I'm so used to an immediate response that I often struggle to connect with the instrument. Maybe an idea for a future update?


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## Alex C

An error in the First Piano: press B7 at the lowest vel. and you will hear a B0.

Can't believe nobody heard this before, guys!


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## cnogradi

I just installed Due having taken advantage of the 50% sale this week. When I unpacked the RARs, 7Zip complained that there were extra chars at the end of the 1st RAR. Instruments seem to work fine so this is just an FYI.


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## fcangia

Alex C said:


> I wonder if it's possible to make a separate patch that has the sample start of all the notes truncated to an absolute minimum (in a non-destructive manner which Kontakt provides)? I understand that this is done for ultimate realism, but I'm so used to an immediate response that I often struggle to connect with the instrument. Maybe an idea for a future update?



It can be an idea! Maybe it can be integrated in the "Feeling" knob: when it goes in minus values, the software "cut" the start of the sample. Actually the average latency is about 3-4ms, which is not a lot, but I understand your need.


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## fcangia

Alex C said:


> An error in the First Piano: press B7 at the lowest vel. and you will hear a B0.
> 
> Can't believe nobody heard this before, guys!



Whaat? Probably is an error on the Disklavier system or of the MIDI communication when I was recording. I played it so much, worked on all the samples, and never found this "easter egg"...thank you, this is why customer feedbacks are so important!


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## fcangia

cnogradi said:


> I just installed Due having taken advantage of the 50% sale this week. When I unpacked the RARs, 7Zip complained that there were extra chars at the end of the 1st RAR. Instruments seem to work fine so this is just an FYI.


Thank you for the info! I've packed the files with WinRar, so it might be a slightly different encoding from 7-zip or something happened when downloading.


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## Scottyb

Is the 1.9 update out yet? Thanks!


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## fcangia

Sorry guys for the delay, I do everything on my own, and these days I've been really busy with the release of Kantele. I'm sending the update between today and tomorrow. Sadly you'll need to download everything again...the first piano was a bit noisy and I had to clean the samples. 
I promise that this is the last time  Next updates only .nki files.


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## Scottyb

Appreciate the response and can't say it enough, appreciate the work you've put into this as it has become one of my absolute favorite piano libraries!


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## Alex C

fcangia said:


> It can be an idea! Maybe it can be integrated in the "Feeling" knob: when it goes in minus values, the software "cut" the start of the sample. Actually the average latency is about 3-4ms, which is not a lot, but I understand your need.



That would be great! I already tried to make the samples start 5ms later (value 240) in the Kontakt wave editor but noticed I was actually cutting into some of the piano notes. The thing is, I can't play a fast run. The piano doesn't keep up with me, there is a noticeable delay which I can't explain. Of course, it's less of a problem when you play adagio. I haven't checked whether any Kontakt effects are being activated that could make things less 'immediate'.

Regarding the noise issue, I haven't noticed it, but that could be due to my headphones.

So it won't be possible to just replace the current nki files with the upcoming new ones?


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## doctoremmet

Scottyb said:


> Appreciate the response and can't say it enough, appreciate the work you've put into this as it has become one of my absolute favorite piano libraries!


+1. Awesome pianos! ❤


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## fcangia

Alex C said:


> That would be great! I already tried to make the samples start 5ms later (value 240) in the Kontakt wave editor but noticed I was actually cutting into some of the piano notes. The thing is, I can't play a fast run. The piano doesn't keep up with me, there is a noticeable delay which I can't explain. Of course, it's less of a problem when you play adagio. I haven't checked whether any Kontakt effects are being activated that could make things less 'immediate'.
> 
> Regarding the noise issue, I haven't noticed it, but that could be due to my headphones.
> 
> So it won't be possible to just replace the current nki files with the upcoming new ones?



Update sent for Full users!

Sadly you'll need to download everything again. I'm so sorry about that. But this will be the last time for sure. There's also a little gift inside the e-mail


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## Alex C

fcangia said:


> Update sent for Full users!



Haven't received an email yet.


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## Stan Stewart

fcangia said:


> Update sent for Full users!
> 
> Sadly you'll need to download everything again. I'm so sorry about that. But this will be the last time for sure. There's also a little gift inside the e-mail


Well, I'm excited to see that email. (Sadly, it hasn't arrived yet.) 
Thanks for your efforts. I fully understand what it's like to be a one-person-business.


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## Scottyb

No email here either. Just a heads up! Thx!


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## Alex C

I bought it via Plugin Mega Deals and maybe that's the problem?


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## fcangia

NOTE:
If you have bought it from AudioPlugInDeals, you have already the last version (1.9) of DUE.
The update is only for the previous customers 

If you have bought DUE FULL before the 9/09 and you still didn't receive the e-mail, then send an e-mail to [email protected]


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## SupremeFist

SupremeFist said:


> Is it possible to keep the preattack of the sound (as it is in the current version of the C3) without having to add the feeling parameter if one doesn't want the delay?


Interested to know the answer to this (I haven't received an update email either).


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## fcangia

SupremeFist said:


> Is it possible to keep the preattack of the sound (as it is in the current version of the C3) without having to add the feeling parameter if one doesn't want the delay?



It is physically impossible. A little graphic I made for you. Feeling moves the "sample start" backward.


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## Alex C

fcangia said:


> NOTE:
> If you have bought it from AudioPlugInDeals, you have already the last version (1.9) of DUE.
> The update is only for the previous customers
> 
> If you have bought DUE FULL before the 9/09 and you still didn't receive the e-mail, then send an e-mail to [email protected]



Ah, okay. Yes, that's the one I have. For some reason I thought you were talking about the fix for Kontakt 6.


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## fcangia

Alex C said:


> Ah, okay. Yes, that's the one I have. For some reason I thought you were talking about the fix for Kontakt 6.



Still working on it


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## SupremeFist

fcangia said:


> It is physically impossible. A little graphic I made for you. Feeling moves the "sample start" backward.


So there's no way to keep the preattack without adding the extra delay in the lower register?


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## decredis

@fcangia Hi, I'm still sometimes getting the unnaturally loud return of resonant sound when repedalling even with the resonance knob turned fully left.


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## fcangia

decredis said:


> @fcangia Hi, I'm still sometimes getting the unnaturally loud return of resonant sound when re-pedalling even with the resonance knob turned fully left.



Since I still didn't find a solution to get it working on Kontakt 6, and because I think it is nice to have just one parameter, I'm going to remove the IR feature :( or probably merge it into the resonance samples.

The KNOB triggers the Impulse Responce. The Resonance fader controls the volume of the samples.

Turn off the Knob; you need also to adjust the volume of the resonance fader, when it is more than 0db it might sound too loud.






If you still have trouble with repealing, try to decrease the amount of re-pedaling from this knob (sound menu)






I hope that you are enjoying the sound!


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## decredis

fcangia said:


> Since I still didn't find a solution to get it working on Kontakt 6, and because I think it is nice to have just one parameter, I'm going to remove the IR feature :( or probably merge it into the resonance samples.
> 
> The KNOB triggers the Impulse Responce. The Resonance fader controls the volume of the samples.
> 
> Turn off the Knob; you need also to adjust the volume of the resonance fader, when it is more than 0db it might sound too loud.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you still have trouble with repealing, try to decrease the amount of re-pedaling from this knob (sound menu)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope that you are enjoying the sound!


Cheers, I'll try those additional things! Yes it's a lovely sounding pair of pianos indeed.


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## decredis

fcangia said:


> Since I still didn't find a solution to get it working on Kontakt 6, and because I think it is nice to have just one parameter, I'm going to remove the IR feature :( or probably merge it into the resonance samples.
> 
> The KNOB triggers the Impulse Responce. The Resonance fader controls the volume of the samples.
> 
> Turn off the Knob; you need also to adjust the volume of the resonance fader, when it is more than 0db it might sound too loud.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If you still have trouble with repealing, try to decrease the amount of re-pedaling from this knob (sound menu)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope that you are enjoying the sound!


Hi, so making these changes does seem to help, but there remains an oddity: I am still getting unnatural reoccurring echoes of sounds when repedalling even with everything switched off or turned fully down as suggested, BUT only when playing it within my DAW Cubase (and also when playing it back within Cubase after recording)... when I export the audio mixdown, the resulting file is fine. 

I don't know whether this issue is within your concern, or is a Cubase or other issue, but I've never encountered anything similar before. Monitoring audio performance during the playback in Cubase, there is no spiking or overloading, so that's not the issue. Any thoughts would be appreciated.


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## decredis

Ok, @fcangia I don't know if this will help diagnose, but here is a simple test midi file (one loud chord, followed by a soft one, with pedal down for the first chord, lifted for the change and brought back down again),

then the file "due pedal export.mp3" which is the result of exporting the midi file from Cubase and this sounds how it should sound;

finally "due pedal direct in DAW.mp3" a recording made with my iphone recording my speakers playing back the exact same section played back live in Cubase. This last recording has the original chord reemerging during the second chord in a way that is unnatural.

Obviously it's good that the actual exported audio sounds right, but the occasional unnatural echoes during performance are quite off putting for improvisation.

For all of this, I had all the settings turned off or reduced to zero as recommended.


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## decredis

decredis said:


> Ok, @fcangia I don't know if this will help diagnose, but here is a simple test midi file (one loud chord, followed by a soft one, with pedal down for the first chord, lifted for the change and brought back down again),
> 
> then the file "due pedal export.mp3" which is the result of exporting the midi file from Cubase and this sounds how it should sound;
> 
> finally "due pedal direct in DAW.mp3" a recording made with my iphone recording my speakers playing back the exact same section played back live in Cubase. This last recording has the original chord reemerging during the second chord in a way that is unnatural.
> 
> Obviously it's good that the actual exported audio sounds right, but the occasional unnatural echoes during performance are quite off putting for improvisation.
> 
> For all of this, I had all the settings turned off or reduced to zero as recommended.


Further diagnostics... this problem occurs with most of the First Piano patches (for example the Classical one) even with all resonance and repedalling turned down and off, but not with the old First Piano 1.4 patch, and not with Kantele's Magic, even with resonance and repedalling on. And copying all of the knob and slider settings from patches that don't have the problem to patches that do have the problem... doesn't get rid of the problem in the patches that do have the problem.

EDIT: Of course, this means I can recreate all the patches that do have the problem by starting from one that doesn't have the problem (Kantele's Magic) and rebuilding them all from there. So this is no big problem for me, although I'm curious to know what the source of the problem is. As I said, it's a beautiful and flexible instrument. Cheers!


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## Toroaspu

Hi @fcangia , I like a lot Due library, unique sound.
I have version 1.9.31, and I am sorry can't enable the Player mic: when clicking on "PLAYER" nothing happens, or rising the volume of PLAYER mic, or trying to disable Close or Room mics... in the PDF could not find any related info...
Can you please help me?
Thanks


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## pcohen12

Hi Flavio (@fcangia) - I have a similar issue to @Toroaspu above, specifically with the "Due - Second Piano.nki" file. While I _am_ able to disable Close/Room, I'm not able to enable or change volume of the Player mic, either on the front page or in the "Mics" subpage. Here's a video of what I'm seeing on the front page: https://share.cleanshot.com/i961HB

The mics in the First Piano NKI file seem to work as expected.


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## SupremeFist

pcohen12 said:


> Hi Flavio (@fcangia) - I have a similar issue to @Toroaspu above, specifically with the "Due - Second Piano.nki" file. While I _am_ able to disable Close/Room, I'm not able to enable or change volume of the Player mic, either on the front page or in the "Mics" subpage. Here's a video of what I'm seeing on the front page: https://share.cleanshot.com/i961HB
> 
> The mics in the First Piano NKI file seem to work as expected.


Second Piano does not have a player mic, hence why it's greyed out.


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## pcohen12

SupremeFist said:


> Second Piano does not have a player mic, hence why it's greyed out.


Well that would explain it 😄 I didn't see this in the manual - do you mind sharing where you found this?


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## SupremeFist

pcohen12 said:


> Well that would explain it 😄 I didn't see this in the manual - do you mind sharing where you found this?


Dunno, it was somehow made clear when I bought it on release


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## poly6

pcohen12 said:


> Well that would explain it 😄 I didn't see this in the manual - do you mind sharing where you found this?


It’s in the product description:

Up to 3 Microphone positions: Close, Player (only C7), Room

Might not be obvious I guess….


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## Toroaspu

poly6 said:


> It’s in the product description:
> 
> Up to 3 Microphone positions: Close, Player (only C7), Room
> 
> Might not be obvious I guess….


Thanks a lot, sorry went completely lost this row...


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## pcohen12

poly6 said:


> It’s in the product description:
> 
> Up to 3 Microphone positions: Close, Player (only C7), Room
> 
> Might not be obvious I guess….


Yes, thank you - totally missed this as well.


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