# Progress of My Trumpet Concerto



## Rodney Money (Dec 21, 2015)

Is anyone working on a classical piece for public performance, and are you using software to help you compose besides notation software? I've been commissioned to compose a trumpet concerto that needs to be completed in January. I've completed the first two movements and now working on the third. (EDIT: 3rd finished 2/18.) The first two movements did not call for any accompaniment whatsoever working as a single voice crying out their anguish.

I started thinking about the third movement and collecting my pallet of sound. I was debating on finally adding the piano in the third, until I came to my real issue, the piano just simply bores me right now at this point in my life. I want to come up with something totally different, so I will create a track with the sounds of rain, city ambience, chimes, Tibetan singing bowls, "voices," and fireplace to accompany the soloist creating the mood and atmosphere while all of this is performed in darkness. At the end of this movement, I will have the performer play while moving to the back fading and fading until all is silent. When all is said and done, I picture this trumpet concerto more than just a performance but borderline live cinematic or simply dramatic.
Here is accompaniment track for movement III:

UPDATE 2/18/2016: Score for Movements I, II, and III. https://app.box.com/s/8kq2tx1oqzrsow6eos55bxylbcb6dgzw which includes better recognizable differences between the F's and F#'s in the 1st movement, and you might notice a particular little fanfare in there!


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## sleepy hollow (Dec 21, 2015)

Sounds like it's gonna be one helluva third movement. Will we get to hear a recording of this?
I'd like to know how well the fireplace will accompany the soloist. Might be quite a rad sound!


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## Rodney Money (Dec 21, 2015)

sleepy hollow said:


> Sounds like it's gonna be one helluva third movement. Will we get to hear a recording of this?
> I'd like to know how well the fireplace will accompany the soloist. Might be quite a rad sound!


Oh yes, once the trumpet player performs it, I will share the performance. It might be May though, because I believe he is using it for his recital. The first movement is for flugelhorn alone and would make a great exercise for anyone who wants to practice rendering. I simply don't have the time needing to concentrate solely on the score. The track will be there to create the mood much like a score to picture where the trumpet player will be the actor. Concerning the fireplace, in the words of Daniel James, I was amazed how much the fireplace added "balls" to the rain and thunder. It was like adding tuba mixed with Cimbasso to tenor trombones.


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## Rodney Money (Dec 21, 2015)

Here's the score for the first two movements if anyone is interested in seeing the score. https://app.box.com/s/cj6jv8ylj23xhmc0w3z66nrbmzjucai1


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## Morodiene (Dec 24, 2015)

So would the performer be performing "live" with the fireplace etc.? Does this person know that he'd have to arrange to have these performers on his recital? Or are you thinking he would play along with a track? 

Tracks are tricky when it comes to classical performing, and they can really limit one's ability to be expressive unless it is tailored to just how the performer would do it. But even then, that doesn't allow for much spontaneity.


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## Rodney Money (Dec 24, 2015)

Morodiene said:


> So would the performer be performing "live" with the fireplace etc.? Does this person know that he'd have to arrange to have these performers on his recital? Or are you thinking he would play along with a track?
> 
> Tracks are tricky when it comes to classical performing, and they can really limit one's ability to be expressive unless it is tailored to just how the performer would do it. But even then, that doesn't allow for much spontaneity.


Awesome, someone else actually replied. Thank you so much for your questions. Yes the soloist would perform with the track, but don't think of the track like accompaniment, but think more like an "evolving" set on a stage to set the mood for a live actor. Concerning the performer, in his words, "I'm really up for anything." While preparing for my own performances this holiday season, I used some of my own composition students as a control group to see if this was going to work. I performed about half of the movement, and they said it sound as though the track worked very well, and as though I was "playing with it." I was surprised how expressive I could be, I simply waited for some of the low bells as cues. It's going to be really interesting, and I'm actually looking forward to getting past the holidays now to get back to work (I purposely left my computer at work, so I would spend time with my family and not obsessed with composing.) I actually wanted to write the track to set the mood, give the soloist time to rest, break the norm, and for the soloist to be very expressive.


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## Morodiene (Dec 25, 2015)

Sounds like it could actually work, then! Of course, depending on how the music is written, it could be very free for the performer to play with. Will you be making a video of the performance? I'd love to see how it turns out!


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## Rodney Money (Dec 25, 2015)

Morodiene said:


> Sounds like it could actually work, then! Of course, depending on how the music is written, it could be very free for the performer to play with. Will you be making a video of the performance? I'd love to see how it turns out!


I am hoping that the performer will find that they can be quite expressive while playing with the track. I will let y'all know more starting in January when I record the track and do some experiments while playing with it. I live in North Carolina, and I was commissioned by a performer who lives across the country so I hope the performance will be recorded. I know it will be though because he sent me a recording of his last recital, but it would be nice to see a video also. He is always posting videos on Facebook.


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## Jaap (Dec 26, 2015)

You might want to look into Max/DSP from Cycling 74 where you can build patches that can be controlled in real-time with controllers and might give you maybe a bit more flexibility and might come closer to the evolving set as you mentioned it instead of a static track.
In the past (more then 10 years ago and when it was still from Opcode) I used to work with this a lot to create electronic/acoustic performances and you can do some nifty stuff with it.
Edit: and here a link to check it out: https://cycling74.com/


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## Alohabob (Jan 3, 2016)

I love the concept and can't wait to hear it.


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## mpalenik (Jan 5, 2016)

Watch out so that the John Cage estate doesn't sue you for the second movement.


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## Rodney Money (Jan 5, 2016)

mpalenik said:


> Watch out so that the John Cage estate doesn't sue you for the second movement.


I'll be fine, we "technically" had the same teacher me being a 4th generation Shoenbergian student.


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## Rodney Money (Jan 5, 2016)

Jaap said:


> You might want to look into Max/DSP from Cycling 74 where you can build patches that can be controlled in real-time with controllers and might give you maybe a bit more flexibility and might come closer to the evolving set as you mentioned it instead of a static track.
> In the past (more then 10 years ago and when it was still from Opcode) I used to work with this a lot to create electronic/acoustic performances and you can do some nifty stuff with it.
> Edit: and here a link to check it out: https://cycling74.com/


Thank you so much for the link, my friend. I will check it out.


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## mducharme (Jan 15, 2016)

Is there a reason in your score for the first few movements that you have that semitone neighbor motive as F-F# rather than F-Gb? To me it would make the notation a bit clearer to respell F# as Gb.


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## Rodney Money (Jan 15, 2016)

mducharme said:


> Is there a reason in your score for the first few movements that you have that semitone neighbor motive as F-F# rather than F-Gb? To me it would make the notation a bit clearer to respell F# as Gb.


Because it's set theory, it's moving up, and it's not based on a key.


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## mducharme (Jan 16, 2016)

Sorry if my question seemed a little pedantic. I was just asking because I have composed many atonal pieces with set theory, and was always taught in such cases to spell the note based upon what the note moves to (in your case, the F# normally returns back to F), and to err on the side of spelling intervals in the simplest way possible (i.e. a major second not a diminished third, a minor second not an augmented unison) unless it was justified to do otherwise. That principle is also echoed by Elaine Gould on page 85 of _Behind Bars_, regarding note spellings in atonal music. The idea being to make it easier for the performer. I don't know however if there is some particular reason on a trumpet that F# is easier to read than Gb, or if somehow you want the idea of an F# to have the performer play it microtonally sharper than if it were a Gb. I was simply surprised to see your spelling - I expect my prof. would mark me wrong if I ever wrote an F# instead of Gb in your context. Perhaps there is a different system or train of thought regarding atonal accidentals than I am familiar with?


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## dcoscina (Jan 16, 2016)

I think it also depends on what instruments you are writing for. String players are better with sharps. Some brass family are more flats for accidentals.


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## chillbot (Jan 16, 2016)

F# has more balls.


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## Rodney Money (Jan 16, 2016)

mducharme said:


> Sorry if my question seemed a little pedantic. I was just asking because I have composed many atonal pieces with set theory, and was always taught in such cases to spell the note based upon what the note moves to (in your case, the F# normally returns back to F), and to err on the side of spelling intervals in the simplest way possible (i.e. a major second not a diminished third, a minor second not an augmented unison) unless it was justified to do otherwise. That principle is also echoed by Elaine Gould on page 85 of _Behind Bars_, regarding note spellings in atonal music. The idea being to make it easier for the performer. I don't know however if there is some particular reason on a trumpet that F# is easier to read than Gb, or if somehow you want the idea of an F# to have the performer play it microtonally sharper than if it were a Gb. I was simply surprised to see your spelling - I expect my prof. would mark me wrong if I ever wrote an F# instead of Gb in your context. Perhaps there is a different system or train of thought regarding atonal accidentals than I am familiar with?


I will go ahead and tell you this, I am weird, and I am one of those people who believe F# and Gb are not the same notes. F# is closer to F than Gb, and in this particular piece the F# sharp would be played flatter to sound like a true minor 2nd. So the set is based on perfect 4ths and moving one note down and up from the first 2 notes of the set with: C and F, C# and F#, C going down is B, and I wanted to go the opposite with F going up to F#. Now the F# also makes more since in relation to the B, because it is again a perfect 4th.


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## mducharme (Jan 16, 2016)

Ahh so it was for the microtonal reason. OK, that makes sense.


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## Rodney Money (Jan 16, 2016)

mducharme said:


> Ahh so it was for the microtonal reason. OK, that makes sense.


Yeah man, there is always some inside, deep, theory weird reason why I do things. Plus perfect 4ths and tritones with perfect 4th relationships with: C and F, C sharp and F sharp, F sharp and B, and the tritone relationships of C and F sharp, F and B


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## mducharme (Jan 16, 2016)

I actually thought on first glance that your set was [016], the famous "Viennese trichord":

After F-F# [01] and C-C# [01] you have F-F#-B [016] and overlapping with that, you have B-F-C [016]


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## Rodney Money (Jan 16, 2016)

mducharme said:


> I actually thought on first glance that your set was [016], the famous "Viennese trichord":
> 
> After F-F# [01] and C-C# [01] you have F-F#-B [016] and overlapping with that, you have B-F-C [016]


Lol, probably subconsciously.


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## Rodney Money (Jan 17, 2016)

I will tell you this, my friend, sometimes it's nice just to talk about music theory, because it's the only thing that I do not, somewhat, look like a complete idiot, lol.


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## Rodney Money (Jan 17, 2016)

sleepy hollow said:


> Sounds like it's gonna be one helluva third movement. Will we get to hear a recording of this?
> I'd like to know how well the fireplace will accompany the soloist. Might be quite a rad sound!


Did you get a chance to check out the track for movement 3? It doesn't include the trumpet part in it yet because I am working on the score this week.


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## Rodney Money (Jan 17, 2016)

Morodiene said:


> Sounds like it could actually work, then! Of course, depending on how the music is written, it could be very free for the performer to play with. Will you be making a video of the performance? I'd love to see how it turns out!


Just a quick update, I sent the track to the trumpet player, and he is extremely excited. In his words, "The singing bowls and themes sound so spirtual, I just hope I can do it justice." I felt the same that I just hope my writing skills can give his playing skills justice.


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## Rodney Money (Jan 30, 2016)




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## Rodney Money (Feb 3, 2016)

A quick update on the trumpet concerto. I was worried that this multiple tongue passage in the 3rd movement might be troublesome so I emailed my client, and he said, "I think I can handle this! " That was a big sigh of relief since I worked for two days on that short little fanfare. Here's the sound: https://app.box.com/s/0tabk3fb69eolmr74fp8ewf9lfmiqwsx


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## Paul T McGraw (Feb 3, 2016)

Very exciting!


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## Jerome Vonhogen (Feb 3, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> I'll be fine, we "technically" had the same teacher me being a 4th generation Shoenbergian student.


 

That's actually very cool, Rodney!

- Jerome Vonhögen


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## Rodney Money (Feb 3, 2016)

Paul T McGraw said:


> Very exciting!


I hope so, my friend. This part will be the big push after a melody of remembrance.


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## Jerome Vonhogen (Feb 3, 2016)

Rodney Money said:


> (...) while all of this is performed in darkness. At the end of this movement, I will have the performer play while moving to the back fading and fading until all is silent. When all is said and done, I picture this trumpet concerto more than just a performance but borderline live cinematic or simply dramatic.


 

Speaking of 'drama', I hope you realize that your trumpet player is going to sue the hell out of you if he falls down while walking around playing your conceto in total darkness!


- Jerome Vonhögen


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## Rodney Money (Feb 3, 2016)

Jerome Vonhogen said:


> Speaking of 'drama', I hope you realize that your trumpet player is going to sue the hell out of you if he falls down while walking around playing your conceto in total darkness!
> 
> 
> - Jerome Vonhögen


If it was a violin or flute I would definitely worry, but a trumpet player would see it as missing a note, lol.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 18, 2016)

UPDATE 2/18/2016: Score for Movements I, II, and III. https://app.box.com/s/8kq2tx1oqzrsow6eos55bxylbcb6dgzw which includes better recognizable differences between the F's and F#'s in the 1st movement.


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## Rodney Money (Feb 18, 2016)




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## Rodney Money (Feb 18, 2016)

Had issues making the last photo look correct on the forum, but at least you can see it here and it looks fine in the pdf score: https://app.box.com/s/8kq2tx1oqzrsow6eos55bxylbcb6dgzw


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## Rodney Money (Feb 18, 2016)

dcoscina said:


> I think it also depends on what instruments you are writing for. String players are better with sharps. Some brass family are more flats for accidentals.


You cannot always go by that, for example I know a lot of us brass players who prefer to play in F# rather than Gb. That old theory came from beginning wind and brass players in the band world, because that's what keys they learned first.


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