# Vochlea Dubler



## Deelanee Orchestra (Mar 13, 2019)

I've been searching for alternative midi control that involves articulations such as breath control and was very intrigued by this chap's work but his process is a mystery:

Then, I thought: why not use both pitch and wind... and this appeared:
https://www.vochlea.co.uk/

I find this even more interesting, but it's at the funding stage right now.

What I would really like to find out is if you could configure the software to trigger articulations and pitch at the same time.

Any thought?


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## stixman (Mar 13, 2019)

They said they are going to do a demo using orchestral libraries soon....I am on the list to get it.


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## Deelanee Orchestra (Mar 13, 2019)

stixman said:


> They said they are going to do a demo using orchestral libraries soon....I am on the list to get it.


How do I get on that list? Have you backed the project?


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## stixman (Mar 13, 2019)

Yes...get yourself on the kickstarter asap


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## Deelanee Orchestra (Mar 13, 2019)

I just did, but it's the first time ever that I do that. I was a little nervous as I don't have a lot of money to invest in music technology and badly need an upgrade from my 25 key midi controller. If this all goes according to plan, I won't be needing another midi controller with this! I asked about expressions and they promptly answered: 
"Yes they can be triggered by Dubler.

Other than pitch information, we allow MIDI notes for triggers (which can be mapped).
We also output MIDI CC with vowel control (which can be mapped) - so if you were singing with an "ahhhhh" timbre, and then kept the same pitch but your voiced evolved into an "eeee" timbre, it would fire off the CC which you could map."


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## stixman (Mar 13, 2019)

Good thing is you have 33 days if you change your mind...I’m 189...I see it’s at 484.now


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## stixman (Mar 14, 2019)

I’m not interested in the beat side.... only how it will control vi’s...it should be a lot clearer.


from Vochlea Music!

Just wanted to let you know that we'll be going live on Kickstarter on Friday, March 22 at 2pm GMT.

We'll be covering how Dubler performs with orchestral instruments + opening the floor to AMA questions. Submit yours here:

https://emails.kickstarter.com/mpss/c/CAE/6TYCAA/t.2pw/xWXOdJ2EQjuZvDPIBM6NVw/h1/s2D-2Fibldui-2F8pv7b4oPaeekjx7mW8fxeKqAwK4EfXeugq9ZAxxsrctpr5ScDyzM7wL44n3ehpkJpLph-2FaaqF57THdrWZ2Y1TH-2FE5bebw8WUg-2FlhfFgMh35jfKpaP1-2BYFyDbUs2IBYO8w-2FdDVfFDvyqsZCV-2FE6M9Nd3Cd0E07TfOgWdghIRqYoDSvuLV7pK3Ck9HmrgC6HEJ9dKaZLExd4i9qtqG1LZ-2FEAy2XZ1Mk9vE-3D (https://live.kickstarter.com/vochlea-music/live/how-dubler-performs-with-orchestral-instruments-ama…)


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## minimidi (Mar 14, 2019)

Having extensively, repeatedly and unsuccessfully experimented with a microphone to control expression, I can tell you that in my opinion it will never work as well as a breath controller (which I own and use very successfully). 

The problem is that voice produces a modulated AC microphone signal, with no DC component (i.e. it has zero mean). The expression signal needs a DC component. Therefore the voice signal needs to be demodulated. It is a mathematical fact that such demodulation will introduce a phase shift (delay). 

A breath controller instead produces a direct signal, which does not need to be demodulated. This can change very fast (limited only by how fast you can blow and the speed of sound in the pipe), with no phase shift/delays. The difference is enormous.


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## Deelanee Orchestra (Mar 14, 2019)

minimidi said:


> Having extensively, repeatedly and unsuccessfully experimented with a microphone to control expression, I can tell you that in my opinion it will never work as well as a breath controller (which I own and use very successfully).
> 
> The problem is that voice produces a modulated AC microphone signal, with no DC component (i.e. it has zero mean). The expression signal needs a DC component. Therefore the voice signal needs to be demodulated. It is a mathematical fact that such demodulation will introduce a phase shift (delay).
> 
> A breath controller instead produces a direct signal, which does not need to be demodulated. This can change very fast (limited only by how fast you can blow and the speed of sound in the pipe), with no phase shift/delays. The difference is enormous.



Very interesting points, although I'd have to do some research to understand this well.
I suppose this is what happens when I use Reatune in Reaper: there are always shifts in pitch and even if I use many instances, it creates unwanted artefacts when converting to midi. 
From the Vochlea Dubler FAQ:
"There are a few reasons we include the microphone in the kit. Latency is one consideration - the audio interface that is built into our mic is low latency - which is essential for real-time use. There are lots of audio interfaces available with low latency though— so it’s not just about that. "

My hope is that this "audio interface" will not only deal with latency but with pitch shifting as well, or that the software is intelligent enough to clear out the signal.


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## Deelanee Orchestra (Mar 25, 2019)

stixman said:


> I’m not interested in the beat side.... only how it will control vi’s...it should be a lot clearer.
> 
> 
> from Vochlea Music!
> ...


I wasn't able to make it live but watched the replay yesterday. I don't think it was a very good demo of orchestral instruments. They don't seem to be musicians per se and I was surprised they didn't know what SWAM is. 
Quite possible this has more use than they make it look like, but I think they are marketing it as a tool for non-musicians. 
Still, I am interested enough in the technology and the beat making bit to stay in the game, but I do hope that it'll be more versatile than this.


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## stixman (Mar 27, 2019)

I agree...I was also surprised by their lack of knowledge regarding Swam technology etc....I will hold on till last minute to see if more convincing demos appear.



Elaine Gallant said:


> I wasn't able to make it live but watched the replay yesterday. I don't think it was a very good demo of orchestral instruments. They don't seem to be musicians per se and I was surprised they didn't know what SWAM is.
> Quite possible this has more use than they make it look like, but I think they are marketing it as a tool for non-musicians.
> Still, I am interested enough in the technology and the beat making bit to stay in the game, but I do hope that it'll be more versatile than this.


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## Deelanee Orchestra (Mar 28, 2019)

I just cancelled my pledge because I am in dire need of a professional midi controller (my Arturia Minilab doesn't cut it it anymore). I will follow the development of their product and technology in the future, but at this point, it feels it is more of a fun gadget than a product for composers.


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