# Can you run samples into your computer from an external SSD?



## Steve Martin (Feb 29, 2016)

Hi to the Forum,

I'm going to be buying a SSD to run my Hollywood Orchestral Strings from. I can open up my computer and replace the drive with the SSD. Is it also possible to add an external SSD that will run other sample libraries from, that will be just as efficient a performance as the drives that are attached internally inside the computer tower?

Thanks if anyone has had experience with this.

best,

Steve.


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## higgs (Feb 29, 2016)

In my experience so far, it's pretty pricey to get into anything external that functions as speedily as an internal SSD. A Thunderbolt 2 SSD RAID 0 setup is about the fastest I've run across - this is assuming you have Thunderbolt ports in the first place. The best performance I've seen in an external USB3 SSD was in the neighborhood of 300-350 MB/s read and write.

For many comps I've been working on lately, I use a RAID 0 array with 4 7200rpm drives. It's not lightning fast, but it gets the job done with a reasonable investment. I'm getting about 450-550MB/s via TB2...

My Apple stock SSD drive performs at roughly 750 MB/s read and 550-600 MB/s write.

Hope this is somewhat helpful, I'm not sure if I read your question correctly or not.


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## Steve Martin (Feb 29, 2016)

Hi Higgs,
Thank you for your reply and advice. Much appreciated!

thanks and best,

Steve


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## phil_wc (Feb 29, 2016)

If you want to buy USB3 enclosure, carefully look the product that said it use *UASP* technology. It made for SSD.


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## Steve Martin (Feb 29, 2016)

Hi Phil,

I'll look this up. Sounds great! Thanks for your help and advice here.

best,

Steve


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## jeffc (Feb 29, 2016)

I run my samples from a 1TB SSD drive in an external USB3 enclosure and it works great. So, I don't know if you necessarily need all that crazy stuff. An SSD is and SSD as far as I know, and the bottleneck is still the drive, not USB vs Thunderbolt, etc.


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## Steve Martin (Feb 29, 2016)

Hi Jeffc,

thanks for that info. I'm just heading off and maybe dropping in on my computer shop to talk prices etc for the SSD, so thank you to you and all of the rest of you who have helped me here. Much appreciated! 

best,

Steve


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## Steve Martin (Mar 7, 2016)

Hi all,

have been around to the computer shop. They have some 500 gigs plus ssd's, but also recommended [even though they cost a bit more] a 1 terrabyte drive. I could stick my Hollywood strings libraries plus my others on there as well.
Is that an ok thing to do? 

thanks for any answers out there. 

Steve


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## phil_wc (Mar 9, 2016)

SSD price is actually drop pretty fast. So if you need it, buy it. If you need for later, just wait when you really need.


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## Steve Martin (Mar 10, 2016)

Thanks Phil, good point you've made here - I don't actually need it right now, but maybe waiting a little while as they are dropping is a good idea. Thanks for your input here. Much appreciated.

best,

Steve


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## passsacaglia (Mar 12, 2016)

Hi guys I am also interested in this subject.
What kind of models/types of SSD are we talking about? USB harddrive 3.0 like the Samsung T1, is that listed as an SSD or just a 3.0 HDD?
I was looking for the Samsung T1 or the Hitachi/HGST Touro S or a Samsung EVO, I know that the T1 is ultra fast for an external, the EWQL stuff comes with an Touro S usb 3.0 7200 rpm, is that enough to have your samples on and your computer supports usb 3.0?

A thunderbolt drive is indeed ultra fast but costs a little too...


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## Astronaut FX (Mar 12, 2016)

https://www.blackmagicdesign.com/products/blackmagicmultidock


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## JohnG (Mar 12, 2016)

jeffc said:


> the bottleneck is still the drive, not USB vs Thunderbolt



That is arguably an oversimplification. It _may_ not matter, but it _can_ matter a great deal, depending on what kind of USB you have. There's also PCIe mounted SSDs that are incredibly fast if your computer can accommodate one.


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## JohnG (Mar 12, 2016)

Steve Martin said:


> They have some 500 gigs plus ssd's, but also recommended [even though they cost a bit more] a 1 terrabyte drive. I could stick my Hollywood strings libraries plus my others on there as well.



Personally I like to use many small drives instead of one large one, although the reason for that practice harkens back to the olden days of regular hard drives. Nevertheless, I still do it.


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## neblix (Mar 12, 2016)

It's not as simple as a bottleneck; internal SSD's aren't designed for the kind of file transferring model and OS communication that an external bus uses. It can lead to problems.

I use a Samsung T1 external SSD for all of my sample libraries. Works very well, and very portable when I need to switch to my laptop.


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## JohnG (Mar 12, 2016)

neblix -- what are you trying to say?


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## Astronaut FX (Mar 12, 2016)

Depending on who you spoke to, he or she may have not fully understood how you were intending to use the SSD. Streaming sample libraries is a pretty specific activity, and outside of those who visit here, most folks probably don't know much about it. Most of the "normal" non-sample streaming musicians are buying SSD drives to use as their hard drives. So I suspect even computer shop employees may be somewhat ignorant to how you intend to use the device.

If you're wanting to use an SSD to store and stream your samples exclusively, and not use it as your main hard drive, then (and someone can correct me if I'm wrong here) then the difference as to where it's mounted isn't the critical determining factor as to it's speed.

Using an SSD drive versus a non-SSD drive is already going to give you increased speed. Secondly, the connection choice will impact the speed (thunderbolt faster than USB3; USB3 faster than USB2). In other words, not all connection methods work at equal speeds.

Long story short, I think it might be an overgeneralization to state that internal is always going to be faster than external. It's going to depend partially on the communication bus type used. From my own experience, for a while, I was using non-SSD drives (external) with a USB connection, and I sometimes had issues with sample streaming. Once I switched to the BlackMagic, using SSD drives (external) with a thunderbolt connection, I no longer have the same kinds of issues. So going internal (which wasn't an option for me) wasn't a necessary component of the solution for me.

All of that being said, full disclosure, I may not fully have my head around what is and isn't available on the market, and what is best/fastest, etc. If you take anything from my rambling, it's that your first assumption when getting advice from the computer shops, be sure they fully understand exactly how you plan to use it before you rely too heavily upon their advice.

Good luck!


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## JohnG (Mar 12, 2016)

back to Steve Martin -- what kind of computer is it? Laptop or desktop? If it's a laptop does it have a thunderbolt connection? If it's a desktop is there room for a PCIe card or simply extra SATA drives? And if there are places to plug in SATA do you know if it's the latest standard or is it an older motherboard?


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## Steve Martin (Mar 12, 2016)

Tone Deaf said:


> Depending on who you spoke to, he or she may have not fully understood how you were intending to use the SSD. Streaming sample libraries is a pretty specific activity, and outside of those who visit here, most folks probably don't know much about it. Most of the "normal" non-sample streaming musicians are buying SSD drives to use as their hard drives. So I suspect even computer shop employees may be somewhat ignorant to how you intend to use the device.
> 
> If you're wanting to use an SSD to store and stream your samples exclusively, and not use it as your main hard drive, then (and someone can correct me if I'm wrong here) then the difference as to where it's mounted isn't the critical determining factor as to it's speed.
> 
> ...


Hi there TD, 

thanks for your reply. I actually deleted my post that you replied to, as I thought it may confuse people, but you replied before I deleted it, but your answer is great! I wish I had not deleted the post you replied to. Thanks for that info. I'm just in the middle of doing mandatory online courses for my job, so once finished I'll get back to you with some questions. Thanks again for your help here, Steve


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## Steve Martin (Mar 12, 2016)

JohnG said:


> back to Steve Martin -- what kind of computer is it? Laptop or desktop? If it's a laptop does it have a thunderbolt connection? If it's a desktop is there room for a PCIe card or simply extra SATA drives? And if there are places to plug in SATA do you know if it's the latest standard or is it an older motherboard?


Hi John, I'll get the info about the build of the pc, and post it. I hope that will be helpful. Thanks also for your post and help here. 

best,


Steve


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## JohnG (Mar 12, 2016)

sounds sensible


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## Steve Martin (Mar 13, 2016)

Hi there John,

here are the specifics of the computer from the company that built it for me. This was 2010, so it is getting to be an "old" computer, but it still works very well.

Hope this is helpful. Thanks for any input you have here. Much appreciated

thanks and best,


Steve 

Product ID: Corei7
Product Name: CORE i7 XTREME GAMING
Quantity: 1

> > > Case : NZXT ZERO 2 Black Case with card reader
> > > Power Supply : Zalman/Antec/Ikonik 850w SLI PSU
> > > Motherboard : Gigabyte GA-X58A-UD3R SATA3 USB3 Motherboard
> > > LCD Monitor : No Monitor
> > > Processor (CPU) : Intel i7-930 Core i7 CPU, Quad Core 2.80 GHz,4.8 GT/sec
> > > CPU Cooler : Standard Intel Fan & Heatsink
> > > Graphics Card : nVidia GeForce GTS 250 1Gig
> > > Sound Card : Integrated 7.1 High Definition Audio
> > > DVD/CD Burner : LG/SAMSUNG 22 Speed SATA DUAL LAYER
> > > Hard Disk Drive : 500Gig HDD plus 1 Terrabyte SATA2 HDD (+$139.00)
> > > RAM (memory) : OCZ/Corsair 12GB 1600MHz (64Bit OS Only) (+$359.00)
> > > Operating System : WINDOWS 7 HOME PREMIUM 64 Bit (+$139.00)
> > > Keyboard & Mouse : No Keyboard & Mouse
> > > Wireless LAN Card : No Wireless LAN


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## JohnG (Mar 13, 2016)

If I had that computer, I would -- probably get a new computer so I could have 64 GB of RAM and a faster processor. But if I were going to stay with your computer, I'd buy more RAM. Your Motherboard can hold 24 GB according to Gigabyte's website.

For storage, I'd get an extra one (or more) Samsung 850 EVO Solid State Drives and simply plug them into the SATA ports on your motherboard, and use those for streaming.

You are constrained in the amount of RAM you have from doing a really huge project of course, but if you use light patches in strings, or if you're mostly wanting to write pop / contemporary style you can still have a great time.


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## passsacaglia (Mar 13, 2016)

ps. Just checked some reviews etc. Anyone using the G-technology G-drive? Seems super fast and nice price for the piece and it's also Firewire and eSATA. Up to 700mbps in speed. Like 149 bucks for 1-2 TBs.


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## rgames (Mar 13, 2016)

Has anyone compared voice counts on internal vs. external drives? I looked at it while back and internal drives far outperformed the externals (using the same interface - SATA II/III). I don't know if that's still true. My guess is that it is still true because you're adding an interface to another interface.

However, I have seen some indication that sequential read speed is not that important any more. Voice count is what we really care about (maybe load time, too) but nobody measures that. Of the commonly measured performance metrics I think IOPS matters more to us than sequential read speeds.

rgames


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## Steve Martin (Mar 13, 2016)

Hi John,

thanks so much for your input here. Yes, it is an old computer - can't afford a new one at the moment though, so your idea of adding more RAM is something I definitely need to do. Also, the sata drives will be good. I'll definitely be adding some more RAM and a sata drive or 2. I get the impression that a one terabyte drive to put HS on and my other on may not be a good idea, but it is better to have two drives that are smaller, rather than one large drive. That's what I appear to be inferred from what I've read on your post.

thanks again for your advice John,

best,

Steve


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## Yogi108 (Mar 13, 2016)

I've been using this http://www.caldigit.com/store.asp#T4, as an external drive for all my sample libraries. Technically I have the older T3 version with 3 2TB HDD drives (Total of 6 TB RAID drive)... It's has two Thunderbolt 2 ports. I use it with VE Pro.... I have a late 2013 2.6 GHZ MacBook Pro with 16 Gigs of RAM. I bought my MacBook with an internal 1 TB SSD drive, but with the external drive, I'm able to keep the internal solid state drive at about 50% full, which makes for a very smooth running machine.

The apple guys that specialize in Logic swear by this system for music production with Logic. I also moved all samples and other music content from Logic into the external drive. I guess the theory is this aids the internal drive to focus on the writing of MIDI and audio recording, which the external drive focuses on reading all samples and VI instruments. 

It works for what I do just fine. I haven't really had a problem with it, and it seems with the latest El Capitan, things are smoother than before... 

Caldigit does offer the external drives to be SSD, but the price goes WAY up. The only catch is they claim ONLY the SSD drives they sell will work with the main unit. I bought my 6TB unit for $750, and I could at any point upgrade to SSD's... Only catch is... a 1 TB SSD Drive costs $800... I'd only be able to get 3 TB with SSD... and that's $2,400 for the upgrade... I've already been using my $750 investment for the 6 TB HDD drives for almost 2 years... I'm thinking I'll be able to continue this for at least another year or two, and hopefully by that time invest in a SSD Blackmagic setup or other technology that will be cheaper and maybe even faster... 

Rod


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## JohnG (Mar 13, 2016)

Steve Martin said:


> I get the impression that a one terabyte drive to put HS on and my other on may not be a good idea, but it is better to have two drives that are smaller, rather than one large drive. That's what I appear to be inferred from what I've read on your post.




Hi Steve -- I do use multiple drives, but I would not spread any one library over more than one drive. Otherwise updating the libraries is a pain in the neck. So, at the risk of redundancy -- put HS on one single drive, an SSD, and then use another (or maybe more than one other) SSD for your other libraries. I don't spread a library among multiple drives unless it's a RAID, in which case the computer "sees" one drive anyway.

Honestly, with your computer you are going to be somewhat constrained in how far you can push Hollywood strings. To improve the performance from HS you could invest in a higher performance Solid State Drive. It's called a PCIe SSD, which is an SSD that mounts on a PCIe slot inside your computer, instead of attaching via a SATA port. Even so, you are probably going to be using more of the "light" patches rather than the most formidable ones. Mind you, they still sound very good, so it's still going to be nice, but if you want to have HS in its full glory it will take your "next" computer, not this one.

Have fun and good luck.


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## Steve Martin (Mar 14, 2016)

JohnG said:


> Hi Steve -- I do use multiple drives, but I would not spread any one library over more than one drive. Otherwise updating the libraries is a pain in the neck. So, at the risk of redundancy -- put HS on one single drive, an SSD, and then use another (or maybe more than one other) SSD for your other libraries. I don't spread a library among multiple drives unless it's a RAID, in which case the computer "sees" one drive anyway.
> 
> Honestly, with your computer you are going to be somewhat constrained in how far you can push Hollywood strings. To improve the performance from HS you could invest in a higher performance Solid State Drive. It's called a PCIe SSD, which is an SSD that mounts on a PCIe slot inside your computer, instead of attaching via a SATA port. Even so, you are probably going to be using more of the "light" patches rather than the most formidable ones. Mind you, they still sound very good, so it's still going to be nice, but if you want to have HS in its full glory it will take your "next" computer, not this one.
> 
> Have fun and good luck.


Hi John,
yes, I see what you're saying here. Ultimately, I do need a new pc, maybe it will be Tax Return time that I'll afford it!
I'll talk to my computer shop people about the PCIeSSD you mentioned. That sounds good to me. Thanks for your help here. Makes great sense. Steve


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## neblix (Mar 14, 2016)

JohnG said:


> neblix -- what are you trying to say?


http://goughlui.com/2013/02/26/am-i-crazy-an-ssd-in-a-usb-3-0-enclosure/\

Don't pay attention to the experiment, it's for speed, not for reliability. Read the intro and conclusion.


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## JohnG (Mar 14, 2016)

That article is three years old, neblix, and it is almost indescribable the improvement in SSDs (and the price drop) since it was written.

I am not saying an outlier opinion couldn't be right -- of course it could! Especially when it comes to technology. And USB 3 is very fast.

However, I wouldn't recommend to anyone to _prefer_ an external solution, today, over an internal one, based on such old information.


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## Gary Williamson (Mar 30, 2016)

I have my Albion, NI, 8Dio libraries on an external Samsung T1, the price has dropped about 50% on them since I bought mine.


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## kurtvanzo (Mar 30, 2016)

I've got 2 1TB Crucial SSDs in portable USB 3 enclosures for streaming samples and its working fine with a Mac mini quad core (2.7GHz). But it also depends on the music you do and how dense it gets (large orchestral? Rock band? Both at the same time?). If you really need a lot of polyphony (larger epic cues, lots of layers), then you may need to look into something faster, but I've got HO and all my other East West samples on one drive and haven't had an issue. The speed increase of the SSDs alone helped immensely, also for me adding VE Pro helped my system cope better- with play and kontakt- well worth the $200 software download and no other hardware. All the best.


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