# Do you use multiband compression?



## rgames (Dec 17, 2010)

I've used the Waves C4 on a number of things but I've seen discussions (gearslutz) that say multiband compression is almost never used. You know - "real men don't use multiband compression" sort of crap.

However, the multiband compressor seems like a really handy tool. It is for me, anyway. For example, when an orchestral track gets loud and borders on distortion, it's often only in one or two frequency bands (e.g. WW rips that lead into perc hits - lots of mid-highs on the hit). I use it for cases like that because I want some compression to reduce the level at that freq at point in the track but I don't want to reduce the level at that freq over the entire track.

So, sure, I could automate an EQ and achieve the same sort of thing. But why not just use the plug-in and have it do the work for me?

I also think it's handy on individual tracks on the mix - sometimes an instrument is peaking in the highs or lows but OK everywhere else. Sure, regular compression will fix it, but why not just alter the frequencies that are causing the problem? That's basically waht a de-esser does, right?

Just curious what you guys do...

rgames

Crap - just realized how lame my life is - Friday night and I'm researching multiband compressors...


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## Mike Greene (Dec 17, 2010)

I use the Waves LinMultiband compressor when I do my mastering. That and the L2 limiter. As far as real men not using them goes, I could be wrong, but I think multiband compressors are pretty standard in mastering engineers arsenals.

I'd be a little hesitant to use one on an individual track, but if an instrument was particularly problematic with peaks and it's not just a matter of EQ, I wouldn't be afraid to use one.


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## bigdog (Dec 17, 2010)

I use the C4 on everything I do - on the 2 buss. Dunno - sounds good to me


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## veetguitar (Dec 17, 2010)

Vienna suite multiband compressor here. 
I guess not everybody can master all aspects of a music production. 
Jay bacal uses the "impress your client" preset from Vienna suite and gets a great sound.


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## chimuelo (Dec 18, 2010)

Just in case you ever want to use AES/EBU hardware the TC Electronic C400XL is excellant. I just bought one to replace my aged Analog DBX-166 and Quad Gate.
Now I can send the triggered sounds and acoustic kicks in and out of the DAW's digitally live and even Sidechain them through the XLR /AES/EBU connectors simultaneously.
I especially like the transparency or colorizing options too.
It doesn't care about what OS or if its 32bit / 64bit either.
275 USD makes it a no brainer.
A nifty mix knob for parallel compression is the icing on the cake.

http://www.allprosound.com/catalog/prod ... C400XL.htm


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## germancomponist (Dec 18, 2010)

chimuelo @ Sat Dec 18 said:


> Just in case you ever want to use AES/EBU hardware the TC Electronic C400XL is excellant. I just bought one to replace my aged Analog DBX-166 and Quad Gate.
> Now I can send the triggered sounds and acoustic kicks in and out of the DAW's digitally live and even Sidechain them through the XLR /AES/EBU connectors simultaneously.
> I especially like the transparency or colorizing options too.
> It doesn't care about what OS or if its 32bit / 64bit either.
> ...



Can you use it also as an audio interface?


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 18, 2010)

I tend to follow Seinfeld's advice too often - 'figure what will kill you and then back it off JUST A LITTLE' :oops: 

MB for me is good but can suck the life/dynamics out of an orchestral mock up if I am not careful.

I also use the Vienna Suite one but back down the low/mid and high sliders a bit as they tend to be brought out too much in the final. Just my $0.02


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## Ashermusic (Dec 18, 2010)

I use the UAD Precision Multiband on certain mixes and it helps when it helps, does not when it does not.


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## Dietz (Dec 18, 2010)

Hi Richard,



rgames @ Sat Dec 18 said:


> [...]
> However, the multiband compressor seems like a really handy tool. It is for me, anyway. For example, when an orchestral track gets loud and borders on distortion, it's often only in one or two frequency bands (e.g. WW rips that lead into perc hits - lots of mid-highs on the hit). I use it for cases like that because I want some compression to reduce the level at that freq at point in the track but I don't want to reduce the level at that freq over the entire track.



You're absolutely right.




rgames @ Sat Dec 18 said:


> So, sure, I could automate an EQ and achieve the same sort of thing. But why not just use the plug-in and have it do the work for me?



... because that's only for people who have nothing to do on a Friday night. :mrgreen: 



rgames @ Sat Dec 18 said:


> I also think it's handy on individual tracks on the mix - sometimes an instrument is peaking in the highs or lows but OK everywhere else. Sure, regular compression will fix it, but why not just alter the frequencies that are causing the problem? That's basically waht a de-esser does, right?
> 
> Just curious what you guys do...



Multiband dynamics are most likely the most powerful tools amongst all audio processors - not only for compression and limiting. I use them on single tracks, sometimes even for single events in a track, but also on sub-groups and the master output.

I use splitband gates or expanders for simple denoising, or to get rid of signal bleed (on toms, for example). Splitband (or multiband) compressors are the perfect choice for deessing, but also to get rid of pops on vocal tracks without killing the low frequency range, or to tame sharp transients on signals that actually need lots of HF to cut through a mix. I use dynamic EQs to get rid of the shrillness of vocals or an instrument without actually cutting the offending frequency range, as it would be missing in those parts where the presence is needed. Proper dynamic processing of the upper frequency range even gives you the chance to push a signal to the back of a virtual room, as soon as you reduce the acoustic cues for "closeness", like fret noises, bowing noises, breath etc.

Multiband dynamics can be used both for enhancing dynamics as well as for a maximum density and loudness. Depending on the settings and possibilities, they can give a signal increased "vividness" or - quite contrary to that - overall "evenness". Especially on vocals in pop- and rock-tracks, they are able to enhance the perceived emotionality (for my ears).

The biggest problem for many people is to keep track of two acoustic "dimensions" at the same time: Timbre and volume. This may be the reason why some guys tend to badmouth multiband processors. 

The crucial part of a multiband processor is the quality of the crossover filters. They will introduce either phase errors, or pre-echoes in case of phase-linear designs. It is important to train your ears to discover those artifacts, because only then you will be able to choose the most effective tool for the task at hand.

BTW - the line between multiband dynamics (like Waves C1/C4/C6/LinMB, Vienna Suite Multiband, t.c. electronic MD3/MD5 etc.) and dynamic EQs (Sonalksis DQ1, Voxengo Gliss EQ, t.c. electronic Dynamic EQ, Brainworx DynEQ etc.) is blurry. On certain occasions they are able to do similar things. For me, it is always a good idea to identify the possibly problematic acoustic aspect first ("... is it about timbre or rather about volume?") and to use the "typical" processor then (dynamic EQ for timbre, multiband dynamic for volume). 

HTH,


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## rgames (Dec 18, 2010)

Dietz @ Sat Dec 18 said:


> For me, it is always a good idea to identify the possibly problematic acoustic aspect first ("... is it about timbre or rather about volume?") and to use the "typical" processor then (dynamic EQ for timbre, multiband dynamic for volume).


Interesting approach - I'll have to give that a shot. I have, indeed, used MB compression (not dynamic EQ) to try to fix timbre problems and not always been happy with the results.

Any thoughts on using something like the L3 multimaximizer vs. MB compression on the output bus? I downloaded the demo and am going to see what I can do with it...

Thanks,

rgames


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## wst3 (Dec 18, 2010)

another vote for using multi-band dynamics processors and dynamic equalizers here.

Once upon a time they were essential to breath a little life into samples, now not so much.

And of course they are an essential part of any mastering rig.

For mixdown I almost always have one on the master buss, usually as the first processor, but I don't always use it. I find it more useful for pop material, and especially stuff with lots of recorded tracks. It can also be a real time saver with projects that use 'too many' sample libraries, but again mostly in the pop music category - and I'd include trailer type music in that category.

Perhaps I need to spend more time working with them, but I just haven't found them useful for orchestral type projects, which for me are almost entirely sample based.

Specifics - mostly I use C4, but I have been using the Cakewalk multi-band stuff a lot lately, just to figure out what it can do. I've also been known to throw an EQ in front of a compressor, or in the sidechain, to get the same effect.


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## Dietz (Dec 18, 2010)

rgames @ Sat Dec 18 said:


> [...]Any thoughts on using something like the L3 multimaximizer vs. MB compression on the output bus? I downloaded the demo and am going to see what I can do with it...
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> rgames


I use the L3-Multimaximizer or the Vienna Suite Multiband as the final stage for my mixes whenever I don't have access to a t.c. MD3/MD5 (which would be my first choice).

You should fool around with the example presets that come with it. Personally, I tend to start with the "Cosy and warm"-setting (... what a name  ...) and adapt it to my needs.


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## tripit (Dec 22, 2010)

Mulitband (and side chain compression) are great. You can focus the squeeze, leave the top alone etc, depending on what you need. The only people I've ever found that pooed them were people that didn't really understand how to use them. 

I use the MD3 on my master bus all the time. It's about the smoothest and least digital sounding MB plug I've ever tried for using on score related stuff. The only other thing I might consider right now is a high end analog compressor like the Shadow Hills MC, A Design Nail or the Drawmer 1960. But, I haven't had a chance to really try them on my score stuff yet.


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## Lunatique (Jan 1, 2011)

The problem I find with multiband compression is that it treats the whole track the same way, whereas often, you want certain parts to have certain accents--such as a particularly boomy bass drum in just that one spot to highlight the drama. If you set the low frequency band to allow that bass hit to come through, then you also relax the bass compression on the entire track. 

What I tend to do is to only use multiband on busses where I know I want a more homogenized response on a particular instrument, and I try to keep it off of the mastering bus because it takes away too much control from me. If I do put it on the mastering bus, I'll then have to make sure any kind of accents I don't want the multiband to regulate would be routed away from the master bus so they can do their own thing.


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