# The official CineStrings thread [Now Available! Intro pricing ends Tuesday]



## Cinesamples

Hey Vi-controllers!







We're proud to officially announce CineStrings! CineStrings is our orchestral strings library, recorded at the MGM Scoring Stage at Sony Pictures Studios. Stay tuned to this VI thread in the coming days and weeks ahead to be a part of the production. We will offer sneak peaks at many of the features. We're going to need your involvement and feedback as we push to the finish line!

We're jumping into the lion's den here so help us out by keeping discussion positive and constructive.  Every comment will be read and considered. We've come to realize that if we can make VI Controllers happy, then chances are we've got something good... 

UPDATE: WE ARE LIVE!!!

VIDEOS:
*Walkthrough:*


*Trailer:*


*Hairpin Creator:*


*Bow Attack Overlay:*


*Demos:*
_String Theory_ - Alex Temple
[mp3]http://images.cinesamples.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/cinestrings_string_theory_at.mp3[/mp3]

_Mid-Winter Warmth_ - Sebastien Najand 
[mp3]http://images.cinesamples.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/cinestrings_midwinter_warmth_sn.mp3[/mp3]

_Medal of Saving Brothers_ - Michael Barry

[mp3]http://images.cinesamples.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/cinestrings_mdl_of_saving_bros_MB.mp3 [/mp3]

_Set Flangers to Stun_ - Sebastien Najand
[mp3]http://images.cinesamples.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/cinestrings_setflangerstostun_sn.mp3[/mp3]


Manual:
https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/CineStringsManual

MP


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## valexnerfarious

Can you tell us the sizes of each section?


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## RasmusFors

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

I actually don't have the need for a new string library, but if it blends well with the other cinewinds/brass/perc products, I will definitely buy it


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## 667

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Can you tell us anything new or unique you're doing with this release? Is there anything new in the scripting, articulations, etc. that we haven't seen or heard in other current-gen libs?


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## studioj

cool! My wish is that it will be sonically = or superior to HWS... that library is unmatched in sonics, vibe, and expressiveness but its difficult to work with compared to my kontakt libraries... I feel like the money I spent on getting a system to handle it properly was well spent but would love to have everything in something as flexible as kontakt and with the usual awesome CS scripting! vibrato control a must... large dynamic range a big one too. love how the HWS dyn mod goes to 0 / no volume. 

These are big picture things... will think longer on the specifics. looking forward!


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## mark812

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*



667 @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> Can you tell us anything new or unique you're doing with this release? Is there anything new in the scripting, articulations, etc. that we haven't seen or heard in other current-gen libs?



+1


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## Enyak

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

My secret fear is that CineStrings will be 1) very expensive AND 2) very good!

My only wish is that for the demos to be posted to be entirely old-fashioned symphonic without any synthy hybrid elements.

Can't wait for more info.


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## Cinesamples

Overall you'll find we'll be using a similar layout and programming to CineBrass. Particularly the "Articulation" patches.

The focus overall is to have a library that is extremely simple to use, yet very powerful if you wanted to dig deeper.


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## jaredcowing

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*



667 @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> Can you tell us anything new or unique you're doing with this release? Is there anything new in the scripting, articulations, etc. that we haven't seen or heard in other current-gen libs?



+1, and also curious about numbers in the string sections.

Also, are solo instruments on the radar or is this focused on sections?


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## MA-Simon

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

I hope you do more unusual articulations. I recently purchase Symphonic Sphere but didn't realise how limited the patch ranges are. It is a grat library, but I expected it to be different somehow.


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## mark812

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Are there going to be solo instruments and divisi sections à la LASS?


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## Per Lichtman

Looking forward to hearing how this shapes up. Here are the usual suspects. 

- Divisi samples are always appreciated (whether as true smaller sections are even the "super close-mics divided into two patches" on a larger section like HS)

- Please make sure to offer consistent control options for all patches: if you offer it for one type of articulation, make sure you do it for another. So the if it's CC1 for vibrato, CC11 for expression for some, then make sure you can do it for all (don't suddenly make CC1 one do something different for staccatos, just leave it empty).

- Apparently some people like using velocity to control the dynamic level for sustains. It's worth giving that option as well.

- Legatos are extremely important - a lot of people like the way HS does it but I would also look closely at how Embertone did it in Friedlander Violin. I especially love being able to use sustain pedal to keep the notes sustaining until I hit the next note instead of having to hit it manually (and being able to re-bow the note in the alternate direction by just keeping the sustain pedal selected).

- I am of course looking forward to hearing how the strings sound on the MGM Scoring Stage at Sony Pictures Studio - no suggestions, just wanted to mention that. 

- In terms of patch organization, consistency between sections whenever possible (both in terms of what's available and naming) is greatly appreciated. 

- Sordinos: Real sordinos on as many articulations as possible, please (take pretty much anything from the wish list that you can). 

- In terms of articulations, here is my "wish-list", for all sections: there's a lot on it, so feel free to ask which are most important.

Short
- Very important to include Au Talon versions of most of these, whether as the top dynamic layer or as extra articulation.
- A minimum of x4 for each is important: the ability to repeat the same note in the same direction without repeating samples is very helpful.
- If you sample marcato, make sure to clearly differentiate it from martele. Certain other libraries drive me crazy in this area.
- Being able to load all short articulations at once and keyswitch between them makes life much easier.

Staccato
Spiccato
Martele
Pizzicato
Snap Pizzicato
Artificial Harmonics
Natural Harmonics
Sul Tasto/Flautando
Sul Ponticello
Col Legno Battuto
Col Legno Tratto



Long
- Both slur and bow change legatos for legato patches.
- The "automatic bow-change at end of a sustain instead of looping" that Embertone Friedlander Violin uses would be great. This obviously requires sampling at least 2 variations for each articulation (which is very important).
- At least some patches or legato patches that progressively introduce vibrato would be great.
- Once again, Au Talon samples are very important, either as a top dynamic layer or a separate path option for a given articulation.

Non-Vibrato Sustain Straight
Non-Vibrato Espressivo
Non-Vibrato Legato Emotionale
Non-Vibrato Presto Legato
Poco-Vibrato Sustain Straight
Poco-Vibrato Espressivo
Poco-Vibrato Legato Emotionale
Poco-Vibrato Presto Legato
Molto-Vibrato Sustain Straight
Molto-Vibrato Espressivo
Molto-Vibrato Legato Emotionale
Molto-Vibrato Presto Legato
Sul Ponticello Sustain (from ppp to Au Talon FFF)
Sul Ponticello Legato (from ppp to Au Talon FFF)
Portamento Legato
Flautando/Sul Tasto Sustain
Flautando/Sul Tasto Legato

FX
Artificial Harmonics
Natural Harmonics
Col Legno Tratto Sustain
Trill (HT and WT at least)
Tremolo
Sul Ponticello Tremolo (from ppp to Au Talon FFF)


I would say out of everything, the most important things are getting extensive sampling using sordinos and flautandos (including legatos and shorts for both) and good Au Talon samples, all for every section, would be the single most important aspect. I can't tell you how much I wish I could use these more often in my sampled orchestrations like I do in my writing for real performers.  Sul ponticello Au Talon is almost as important.


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## EastWest Lurker

Best of luck with it, Mike and Mike. I am sure it will be a worthy addition to what is available.


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## Per Lichtman

Also, as long as the list above is, I'm betting I forgot something. But hopefully it hammered home a few key points. 

Harmonics, flautando, sordino, au talon and sul ponticello are often overlooked. They are essential - completely essential - colors to varied orchestration for strings.


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## Daniel James

Powerful shorts with hard attacks will be awesome  

I'd love to see some random craziness like a string equivalent of the 12 horn patch....maybe tons of double bass players or cello players....then again I maybe thinking out loud.

oh oh oh and pppp dynamics! by default pppp has a fuckton of room tone...but at Sony thats kind of a good thing  ( my best example of super soft strings https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3unFw0fYrY )

Can't wait to hear more details.

-DJ


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## Per Lichtman

Daniel James @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> Powerful shorts with hard attacks will be awesome
> 
> I'd love to see some random craziness like a string equivalent of the 12 horn patch....maybe tons of double bass players or cello players....then again I maybe thinking out loud.
> 
> oh oh oh and pppp dynamics! by default pppp has a fuckton of room tone...but at Sony thats kind of a good thing  ( my best example of super soft strings https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3unFw0fYrY )
> 
> Can't wait to hear more details.
> 
> -DJ



The random craziness isn't as important to me but definitely +1 to all the rest of that, which you could probably guess from the rest of my posts.


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## Per Lichtman

Oh and if you have time for extra effects - being able to do the sort of HT bend you often hear in the brass (like in the first demo for Iceni) would be great.


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## Daniel James

Per Lichtman @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> Daniel James @ Mon Aug 26 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Powerful shorts with hard attacks will be awesome
> 
> I'd love to see some random craziness like a string equivalent of the 12 horn patch....maybe tons of double bass players or cello players....then again I maybe thinking out loud.
> 
> oh oh oh and pppp dynamics! by default pppp has a fuckton of room tone...but at Sony thats kind of a good thing  ( my best example of super soft strings https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U3unFw0fYrY )
> 
> Can't wait to hear more details.
> 
> -DJ
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The random craziness isn't as important to me but definitely +1 to all the rest of that, which you could probably guess from the rest of my posts.
Click to expand...


Haha yeah the random craziness would def be afterthought stuff. But just planting the seed there encase they find themselves with free time.

Also now I think about it, how about some sort of string FX system where you can manipulate how it sounds over time? maybe somesort of layered system where you can bring in different elements like clusters, bends...general creepyness in real time, so that the FX can sound unique (I can't count how many times I have heard canned string FX in scores haha)

-DJ


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## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

I'm stoked! But at the same time I'm trying not to expect more than what the Cinesamples team is capable of delivering (an insane articulation list is going to come with an equally insane price tag, recording at Sony can't be cheap!). I think you guys may be a bit late in asking for stuff to be recorded, I'm thinking the "deep into production" might mean they have already recorded it.


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## jaredcowing

Daniel James @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> Also now I think about it, how about some sort of string FX system where you can manipulate how it sounds over time? maybe somesort of layered system where you can bring in different elements like clusters, bends...general creepyness in real time, so that the FX can sound unique (I can't count how many times I have heard canned string FX in scores haha)
> 
> -DJ



Something like this would be great for any instrument family, but for strings in particular it'd be spectacular.


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## noxtenebrae17

Congrats on the announcement guys! Highly looking forward to seeing what you come up with.

That said, something that has somehow gone overlooked in most every string library on the market is fast, bowed (detaché) transitions. This isn't "legato" (aka smooth lines) but for the purposes of sampling it uses "legato sampling." Too often the solution for this is using shorts to create these separated lines but they sound extremely stiff. This is because the string sections are so large that each player plays with slightly different timing than his/her comrades. Most noticeable in faster passages, this is a sorely needed area of strings. (and not just loud dynamics please!)

The best (and possibly most extreme example) of what I'm on about is the opening to Tchaikovasky 4's 4th Movement. Here's a quick youtube: http://youtu.be/mctpTyIBt_I

Here you see the bows constantly alternating between up and down bows. This is something that really needs to be sampled. Please consider adding it to the list!

Best of luck with the recordings. And keep up the good work.

Cheers.


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## Per Lichtman

noxtenebrae17 @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> Congrats on the announcement guys! Highly looking forward to seeing what you come up with.
> 
> That said, something that has somehow gone overlooked in most every string library on the market is fast, bowed (detaché) transitions. This isn't "legato" (aka smooth lines) but for the purposes of sampling it uses "legato sampling." Too often the solution for this is using shorts to create these separated lines but they sound extremely stiff. This is because the string sections are so large that each player plays with slightly different timing than his/her comrades. Most noticeable in faster passages, this is a sorely needed area of strings. (and not just loud dynamics please!)
> 
> The best (and possibly most extreme example) of what I'm on about is the opening to Tchaikovasky 4's 4th Movement. Here's a quick youtube: http://youtu.be/mctpTyIBt_I
> 
> Here you see the bows constantly alternating between up and down bows. This is something that really needs to be sampled. Please consider adding it to the list!
> 
> Best of luck with the recordings. And keep up the good work.
> 
> Cheers.



+1


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## Per Lichtman

@midi_controller Maybe, but we can't really ask any earlier than such things are revealed. Also, there's always pick-up sessions (though they might be expensive).

I'm not saying that it's practical to do all this in an inexpensive library. I'm just saying that among the things that I miss in most of my libraries are more extensive sordino (true not emulated), flautando, au talon, ponticello and harmonics. In fact, I feel like I need to go grab my violin to play some right now just talking about them.


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## Cinesamples

Great feeback. So here is some info:
We are approaching this library just like the others, in the sense that there will be a CORE and a PRO library. This first release is the CORE version. The goal with CORE is to have a library that allows us to create about 80% of the things that strings can do, a solid foundation. An extremely fast and easy-to-use library that allows us all to write realistic and well-produced mockups very quickly. A library that "just works". 

Two key features are the Articulation patches, allowing quick switching between various lengths of shorts (Spiccato, Staccato, Marcato), and the detailed legato sampling at multiple velocities. Tremolos, Pizz, Bartok Pizz, Sul Pont, Trills, Harmonics and all that good stuff will also be in CORE, but more on that later.

As if this writing, the shorts are done and we have some rudimentary patches complete. I'll start with examples of those and we can start the discussion. 

MP


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## Per Lichtman

@MP Looking forward to it. 

I also finally remember what one of the things I forgot was: open strings.

Anyway, sounds like you already have lots of the articulations I mentioned in CORE. Kudos!

I'm hoping that sordino strings, flautando and au talon can be included in PRO if they can't make it into CORE.


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## Darryl Jackson

Very exciting news! Scratch what I said earlier. In the end, what I'm most interested in is convincing legato, during both slow and fast sections.


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## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Really looking forward to this. Will all articulations in CORE be available inside each patch via keyswitch, like CineBrass? I'd love to get the complete string section into my template in only 4 tracks.


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## synapse21

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

This being one of the more-competitive areas in orchestral sampling lately, I definitely feel that divisi sections will be quite important to break a large section down into smaller ones as a live orchestra can do; similar to LASS (but with the great Sony scoring stage sound).

No doubt you will add to this living library with great updates post-release as well, as Spitfire continues to do, so I for one don't worry too much about what comes out with the _initial _release. 

- Rodney


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## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

I'm always excited when a new strings library is announced :lol: 

How many Mic-Positions would CineStrings offer ? 

imho. 3 or 4 mic positions does the trick most of the time. so no need to go overboard on the mic-positions i.e. (5, 6, 7, ..and more can be an overkill, and consumes a lot of sample memory). 

Would love to hear some demos once you have some ready. 

All The Best, and Good Luck with CineStrings ! 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


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## Blakus

Having flexible legato is pretty important. Something that is flexible enough to handle both fast and slower passages.


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## Per Lichtman

@Blakus +1

Also, looking forward to hearing it in Blakus Cello.


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## midi_controller

CineSamples @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> As if this writing, the shorts are done and we have some rudimentary patches complete. I'll start with examples of those and we can start the discussion.
> 
> MP



Cool beans! 

My requests:
Con sordino is a 100% must have. Even if it is a completely different set (Sordino Core / Pro), we need it!

But more than anything, I just want clarity, tone and performance to be the #1 priority. You don't need a super extensive list of articulations to sell me, as long as it BREATHES. This is something that 8dio really understood when they made Adagio and it shows (but the programming, setup, and smaller church left some things to be desired). Not just in the dynamic bowings either, it was all over that library (listen to the well-defined vibrato on the sustains, for example). No stagnant samples please! Be sure give some extra attention to the violas, they are so beautiful and so many string libraries leave them kinda flat.

Something else that is important to me is if you record something for one section, please record it for the rest. One thing I never understood about Hollywood Strings was having harmonics and flautando for the 2nd violins and nothing else. Why would you do that? It makes no sense! If you choose to record things like dynamic bowings (which you probably won't but just in case), please keep these consistent across the different sections as well.

If you do divisi recordings (again, this could be a separate Core / Pro set I'm sure), please replicate what is in your full ensemble articulation list. I'd hate to only have access to spiccatos with the full ensemble when I need them for divisi as well.

You have such a fantastic opportunity here, I'm really interested to see how this turns out! I'm sure I'll think of more later. :D


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## Per Lichtman

@midi_controller Glad to hear other people are thinking these things, too (even though I also asked for a ton of articulations


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## Cinesamples

The CORE library will have each of the sections: Violin I, Violin II, Viola, Cello, Bass. 
Now, right off the bat I'll say: We did NOT do divisi for this CORE library. Sorry divisi lovers. There are libraries out there that do this quite well already, and we chose to focus our efforts on our other features.

Okay, shorts demo coming up...


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## Jem7

Divisi and sordino divisi.


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## Jordan Gagne

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

It's great to have these crazy-in-depth libraries with 20 keyswitches and 7 CCs and all that, but part of the reason that Cinebrass is such a fantastic library is that it is so easy to use, AND it sounds great. I hope you guys take the same approach to CineStrings.


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## Cinesamples

Thanks Jordan. Yes, this is the plan. We'll have those patches that contain many articulations all in one, but then we'll also have individual old-school split-out patches of all the individual articulations. I know some particular A-list composers who still prefer things this way. 

MP


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## Tino Danielzik

Personally I really hope that this string library is able to create a convincing Silvestri kind of sound, including string runs.


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## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Envelope controls (ADSR) always come in handy for speedy tweaking to taste in some cases. It would be nice to see ADSR Env. controls integrated into the main GUI.


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## Peter Alexander

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

1. Once you release CineStrings, you will now be the third company to have a complete library of strings, woods, brass, and percussion. Spitfire will be the fourth.

Therefore, the strings must be impeccable as they will be the springboard for buying an ez-2-mix complete orchestra from you. 

2. The bowing that is most used in real life playing is also the bowing that is the most neglected - detache. Going back to the original Miroslav strings, a .5, .7, and .9 in length by seconds is needed. The .9 is about the length in Mozart's _A Little Night Music_.

3. The ultimate test of a string lib is a sectional sound in multipart harmony. Since you have most of JW's scores, see _Across the Stars_ and _Hymn to the Fallen_. Another is Walton's _Princes In the Tower_ from the movie _Richard III_.

4. Not offering divisi in the Pro is a mistake. You have all of these libraries recorded in one room (Sony) and anything else that's divisi is NOT recorded in that one room. 

5. Don't. Rush.


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## Justin Miller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Sorry I haven't read all the replies earlier in this post, but will there be any solo instruments in the pro version?


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## Cinesamples

@Justin the CORE library's focus will be on the string sections as a group. However we did experiment with a First Stand Solo 'Spot' mic. We still have to test if this is a viable option. I'll be sure to offer audio examples of this and we can all decide if we should include it in CORE.


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## synapse21

[quote="Now, right off the bat I'll say: We did NOT do divisi for this CORE library. Sorry divisi lovers. There are libraries out there that do this quite well already, and we chose to focus our efforts on our other features.[/quote]

Cool - didn't expect that to be in the CORE set at all. 

Are there plans for this to be a 2-set library (CORE + PRO), or 4 like CinePerc?

- Rodney


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## Tino Danielzik

Oh, and VIBRATO for the Violins, there is never enough vibrato in string libraries, and of course controllable vibrato via midi controller, please.


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## jamwerks

Congrats on the release. With Sable & Adagio doing smaller sections and lots of detailed articulations, your timing seems right for a large section library. Maybe a more modern day HS. Not sure if I'd even bother with divisi.

I'm sure it's going to sound great !


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## Per Lichtman

@jamwerks I'm definitely intrigued by the library as well.

But I have to question calling something a "modern day HS" when it's still a current generation library in every sense of the word.


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## studioj

CineSamples @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> The CORE library will have each of the sections: Violin I, Violin II, Viola, Cello, Bass.
> Now, right off the bat I'll say: We did NOT do divisi for this CORE library. Sorry divisi lovers. There are libraries out there that do this quite well already, and we chose to focus our efforts on our other features.
> 
> Okay, shorts demo coming up...



I'm glad to hear that you're not spending time on this. Its a cool feature to have in LASS but I'd much prefer something I can work with FAST and sounds AMAZING. The key to the success of this library in my eyes/ears will be the SOUND and the flexibility in bowing techniques. looking forward to hearing the shorts demo! short short shorts would be welcome . with much flexibility in dynamics and length.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ou9AabR6_1w


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## Justin Miller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Alright, I think you're right in only recording it close as that's all that's really needed for solo strings. I agree with Tino that most of the libraries out there don't have enough vibrato, like they are catering to the studio/hybrid orchestra sound as opposed to a more dramatic string sound like you would hear in a symphony or more orchestra-based film score. An example of what I'm talking about would be like the string sound in Christopher Lennertz's Medal of Honor: European Assault Dogs of War (I realize it's sordino, but the amount of vibrato here is lacking in just about every library).


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## studioj

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*



Justin Miller @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> I agree with Tino that most of the libraries out there don't have enough vibrato, like they are catering to the studio/hybrid orchestra sound as opposed to a more dramatic string sound like you would hear in a symphony or more orchestra-based film score.



i tend to think there is too much vibrato in most string libraries ... for the film score sound anyway... and I would think that is what CS will cater to. Adagio's use has been limited to me because of this (but still great for some things)... HWS has the most useful application of vibrato control for me.


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## Cinesamples

As far as vibrato, there are three types that will be crossfaded via CC. Non Vibrato, Vibrato, and Expressive Vibrato.
Our note to the players for the Expressive Vibrato was to really exaggerate the vibrato.

For those interested, there are 5 velocities of Sustains, each having 3 vibrato types. 15 sustains per pitch.

(That's a great score by Lennertz.)


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## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Good news guys - looking forward to this! 

The most important thing to me, behind many dyn layers (already mentioned) is marcs of different lengths. Shorter, almost like stac but not quite, medium, and a longer one that's about 1.5 sec long. This, in conjuntion with the leg/sus. will make it much easier to mimic real players, and in the end be more realistic.

Cheers.


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## MA-Simon

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Another question:

Could you make the pro version non dependent on the core library? (As in using samples from core?) Because I already have a lot of string libraries so I would want to pick up the extended library first?


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## jamwerks

What you guys could do that others have (almost) neglected, would be control over the attack of the long notes.


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## 5Lives

For laypeople like myself, it'd be great to know from your perspective how these are different from the other "big" string libraries out there today - LASS, Hollywood Strings, Spitfire, etc.

Thank you!


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## R.Cato

I love the concept behind Hollywoodwinds, so I really hope there will be some pre recorded runs, measured trems and kind of common fx phrases or orchestrations in it. In some situations nothing beats the real deal. Especially talking about a realistic tuning between the players.


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## BenG

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Wow! Definitely looking forward for this. 

As others have mentioned, the most important thing for me will be the sound. Any and everything else is secondary. But while we are on the subject....

-A legato that can do fast and slow
-Controllable Vibrato (or atleast some options)
-Con Sordino
-"All in one" patches with either key or velocity switching 
-Small Ensembles (Pro)
-Solos (Pro or even another extension)

I would love to finally have smaller ensembles and solos recorded in a hall versus dry. 

Anyway, congrats on the new library guys!


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## jleckie

5Lives @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> For laypeople like myself, it'd be great to know from your perspective how these are different from the other "big" string libraries out there today - LASS, Hollywood Strings, Spitfire, etc.
> 
> Thank you!



It will mean that now it will be even MORE difficult to choose a main string library. Or it will mean , if your like most here, that you will be very broke as you'll just HAVe to have it all.


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## Cinesamples

5Lives @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> For laypeople like myself, it'd be great to know from your perspective how these are different from the other "big" string libraries out there today - LASS, Hollywood Strings, Spitfire, etc.
> 
> Thank you!



I would ask around to others here how CineBrass compares to any of the other Brass libraries out there... the comparisons should be similar with Strings.


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## mark812

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

I would consider doing smaller ensembles and solo strings for Pro since Core seems to be pretty much all-around. I'd also put "crazy" stuff in Pro (like Sul Ponticello Tremolo, Col Legno Tratto etc.).

Playable runs patch would be great as well.


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## midi_controller

5Lives @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> For laypeople like myself, it'd be great to know from your perspective how these are different from the other "big" string libraries out there today - LASS, Hollywood Strings, Spitfire, etc.
> 
> Thank you!



It's going to be the sound primarily.

But I'm telling you guys, don't ask for divisi in Pro, unless you want it to cost a fortune and delay the whole project. Recording at Sony with top musicians costs a TON of money. Ask for a separate product! CineStrings Divisi! This has MUCH more of a chance of getting made since Mike has already said there will not be divisi in CineStrings.

So I'm wondering, would round robin détaché notes work? Just need to figure out how to make the section attack slightly off from each other and with much less of an edge to the note. I think it could be done. Hell, you could probably chop up some of those lourés that Adagio has into round robin shorts. I think it can be done, I really do.


----------



## Guy Rowland

R.Cato @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> I love the concept behind Hollywoodwinds, so I really hope there will be some pre recorded runs, measured trems and kind of common fx phrases or orchestrations in it. In some situations nothing beats the real deal. Especially talking about a realistic tuning between the players.



FWIW, that would be my vote too for Pro  

(well, not so much full melodic phrases... but the runs, gestures and basically everything that sounds hopeless with conventional samples that HWW did so well for winds.... would be great if the some of the fx could be playable / transformable in some way to avoid the stock-effect problem).

All the best with the release folks!


----------



## The Darris

CineSamples @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> Two key features are the Articulation patches, allowing quick switching between various lengths of shorts (Spiccato, Staccato, Marcato), and the detailed legato sampling at multiple velocities. Tremolos, Pizz, Bartok Pizz, Sul Pont, Trills, Harmonics and all that good stuff will also be in CORE, but more on that later.



It would be cool to have a way to blend in effects for instance: Holding a sustained Arco sound and via CC fader, we transition into a tremolo or something to that effect. Having the functionality to customize something like that would be sweet.


----------



## ryanstrong

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

The 'rocking back and forth' sound on a legato patch...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpTaACZxoc4


----------



## Saxer

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

fast legatos and a convincing performance of phrases with mixed articulations (short short loooongshort shortshortloooong) is what i'm missing most in string libraries. especially short upbeats on epic legato phrases and short last notes unter a tie always sound whashy like a keyboard-midi-pad.
would be beautiful to have legato speed following the tempo of the player, but having a controller for attack speed of legatos will also do it.

i'm missing fast legato in cinebrass too. but it's much more important in strings.


----------



## 5Lives

From Cinesamples perspective - given the multitude of string libraries today (LASS, EW, Spitfire, etc.), what do you feel your library will bring to us that is unique or different?

Love your other libraries btw! Very easy to use and sound great.


----------



## Malo

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Looking forward to this library! :D 

I would really like to have the option to set up legato/sus patches something like this:

Low velocity: legato on same string/portamenta/"old school" slide transitions
Mid velocity: normal attack according to dynamic layer (mod wheel)
Hi velocity: marcato
Top velocity: sfz

I like having recorded marcato longs, instead of joining a short marcato or a staccato to a long note. Although, if programmed really well I probably couldn't hear the difference.

Thanks!


----------



## Casiquire

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Not many libraries find sul tasto important enough to really do much with, but it would be nice to see someone do it right. Sul tasto and sul pont can be played legato as well, but nobody seems to record them that way.

Though truth be told CS libraries seem to be geared toward getting up and running quickly so to that aim some kind of short note "Auto-Rhythm"-like script and a very good polyphonic legato script would be beneficial.

Oh and Per Lichtman has a pretty extensive and comprehensive list that I highly agree with. Listen to what he says!


----------



## schroerob

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Keep it simple and very usable as you always did  And please take your time, don't rush  Looking forward to an "easy to use" straight forward string lib with most basic articulations.


----------



## Frankly-h

Cinesamples products usually have polyphonic legato, so I don't think divisi writing is really a big issue.


----------



## Tatu

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

How about ensemble chords (low/mid) with legato transitions, maybe just three voices (db, celli, vla)? 

That'd be sick and require a ton of recording and careful writing for consistency, but us peasants would praise you for doing that! 8)


----------



## Scrianinoff

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*



Tatu @ Tue 27 Aug said:


> How about ensemble chords (low/mid) with legato transitions, maybe just three voices (db, celli, vla)?)


I see they've listened to you and found it a great idea, because they took the DeLorean and went back in time to produce CineOrch for you. Now, that's customer service! 

Legato might not be in yet, but with a bit of overlap who'd hear the difference on chord transitions.


----------



## Tatu

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*



Scrianinoff @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> Tatu @ Tue 27 Aug said:
> 
> 
> 
> How about ensemble chords (low/mid) with legato transitions, maybe just three voices (db, celli, vla)?)
> 
> 
> 
> I see they've listened to you and found it a great idea, because they took the DeLorean and went back in time to produce CineOrch for you. Now, that's customer service!
> 
> Legato might not be in yet, but with a bit of overlap who'd hear the difference on chord transitions.
Click to expand...


Yep. Well, that'd be mostly an interesting experiment, since it's not really an overkill to do those with individual lines.

What I'd really like is an intuitive glissando like the one on LASS. Combine that (go further!) with the Sony sound and BOOM! You've got your selves some classic JW tools.


----------



## mikebarry

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

The basses are very manly - chuck norris approved.


----------



## handz

CineSamples @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> Thanks Jordan. Yes, this is the plan. We'll have those patches that contain many articulations all in one, but then we'll also have individual old-school split-out patches of all the individual articulations. I know some particular A-list composers who still prefer things this way.
> 
> MP



Great news that this is comming. And great news it will also contain split patches. Im not A composer but still prefer it, loading huge patches and then unload most of the arcs is pain in the a...

What would be best, would be some interface that would allow you load different arcs onto one patch and then assign them their own KS or velocity switches. I love using velocity articulation switching in CB, but brass overal have not so many articullations so it is not problem to load, with strings, this is always bit annoying for me. 

There was a good point about Hollywoodwinds - would be great to have some patches like this that would work together.


----------



## hector

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

So a question I think that no one to ask yet.

Is this going to be a Kontakt library? Or will this be Mach 5, or will this be both?


----------



## Hanu_H

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

As a user of CineBrass I have few suggestions. Please don't focus on divisi, please don't make any string fx in the CORE. Only make a good sounding main patches with the same kind of functions as CineBrass. Keep it simple and make sure it has real dynamics on all the samples so you can only use CC1 to make dynamic changes. I use CineBrass as my main brass library and I almost never use the effects or the recorded chords. They are just too limiting and I think there's better libraries for effects around. I think the main reason why CineBrass is so usable is the simplicity and the fact that main patches cover the 90% of what you need and it doesn't take long to make them sound great. I already have LASS for intimate and divisi writing so don't try to compete with that, it will be too expensive and not ideal for you approach.

-Hannes


----------



## Enyak

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

I have questions regarding legato intervals.

Are there different legato samples for the different dynamics? I think the only Strings library that may actually do this is HS.

Also, are there different legato speeds available? (not just by modyfying sample offset)

Ideally I'd want to get at least those two playstyles covered:
- emotional ppp-legato (slow)
- stirring ff-legato (fast)


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

I'm sure if you do Cinestrings like Cinebrass you'll have a winner. The Cinesamples polyphonic legato is great.

The one thing that I think is important and very intuitive with strings is to have velocity control the attack, both for new notes and legato transitions. So for a new note it's how hard or soft the attack is and for a legato transition it's the speed of the transition (glissando to a faster legato), which is essentially the attack as well but of a connected note.

It just feels so natural to hit a string hard and get sharp attack or fast transition and to hit it softly and have a softer attack or slower transition. I think this would be important to have in Cinestrings. I know velocity will be used for note length of the shorts, but when the mod wheel is held down, hopefully velocity will be attack/transition for the longs.

Oh and something that I'd also like to see in Cinebrass and Cinewinds: option for neighboring zone round robin (Ie. using the sample samples but having round robin for the longs). Yes please.


----------



## R.Cato

Would be cool if you can split the package up into little bit more than core and pro. Liked how you've done it with cineperc. 

Core: all essential articulations, similar to Cinematic Strings 2, but done with the cinesample approach as already pointed out in other posts and please don't forget to include real spiccatos.

Pro: the more advanced stuff like flautando, more trills, sordino, mess trems....

FX/Essemble: Essembles like strings in octaves, runs, fx.... similar to Hollywoodwinds.

Solo: Sampled Solo Violin, Viola, Cello and Double Bass.

No need to have every edition available at once. Take yourself the time you need to deliver a truely outstanding product.

cheers,

Robin


----------



## jamwerks

I imagine that each developer has to do something that other products haven't done.

LASS has limited sordino stuff and HS (and now LASS 2.5) do a simulated sordino. Adagio has some muted stuff in Vol. I, but apparently more more will be in Vol. II, but that might be far off. So doing Legatol, 3-4 shorts, pizz, trem & trills (the basics) con sordino might get you some more customers (like me).

It's probably a little late for a want list, as recording is probably long finished. If not, you guys might consider doing a patch like the "trills orchestrator" in OT's Symphonic Spheres. With everything from minor 2nd to perfect 5th.


----------



## peksi

very exiting news indeed! you guys have some tough competition out there...

what about portamentos? slower ones would be good for emotional stuff.


----------



## mark812

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

For slower stuff...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... lNghc#t=59


----------



## playz123

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*



mikebarry @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> The basses are very manly - chuck norris approved.



Funny you should mention that because the basses are one of the first things I thought about when I saw 'new library' mentioned. So may of us focus on the hi strings when considering a wish list..as well we should. But on the hand, I feel there is a slight weakness in the basses in a couple of the other libraries currently available, especially in the sustains, so am looking forward to hearing what you folks provide.

Although a brief reference to mics was made by others earlier, I also complement you on the micing setup in CineBrass, and hope the same sort of arrangement will be found in the Strings library. It's great to be able to choose a Mix setting sometimes and also have individual positions available as well, especially when the mix settings have been created by highly esteemed professionals.


----------



## Assa

R.Cato @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> Would be cool if you can split the package up into little bit more than core and pro. Liked how you've done it with cineperc.
> 
> Core: all essential articulations, similar to Cinematic Strings 2, but done with the cinesample approach as already pointed out in other posts and please don't forget to include real spiccatos.
> 
> Pro: the more advanced stuff like flautando, more trills, sordino, mess trems....
> 
> FX/Essemble: Essembles like strings in octaves, runs, fx.... similar to Hollywoodwinds.
> 
> Solo: Sampled Solo Violin, Viola, Cello and Double Bass.
> 
> No need to have every edition available at once. Take yourself the time you need to deliver a truely outstanding product.
> 
> cheers,
> 
> Robin




+1

Always wished developers would split their products into smaller packages. I often thought it would be nice to have for example only the short notes from library xy, but don't think that I would also nead the legato and trems stuff etc., cause I (and maybe some other useres here too) probably feel like they pay for a lot of stuff they won't use. Or already own the whole basic stuff in an equal quality.


----------



## SpaceOrch

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Wow, just after I spent weeks agonizing on which string library to buy and was about to pull the trigger and buy LASS lite. But I'm sure CineStrings will go great with my CineWinds and CineBrass libraries! With the different vibrato layers it sounds like it could be able to do the lighter softer strings like LASS Bat Man as well as really emotional string passages like Adagio Strings, which sounds really cool. I especially like the idea of the first chair spot mic, it could add that extra oomph of emotion.

I just hope it has solid dependable legato transitions like LASS, including speed controlled portamento or glissando. Also, some kind of script for repeated ostinatos like Ostinatum or ART would be awesome. I guess I might have to hold off on buying a good real string library until this comes out!


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Hi Guys, 

We have finished some rudimentary 'shorts' patches. Here is a quick demo to show you what we have at this beginning stage:

[mp3]https://cinesamples.box.com/shared/static/8vuef361teig7vqihkkr.mp3[/mp3]

Direct Link: https://cinesamples.box.com/shared/stat ... qihkkr.mp3

MP


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*

Grand slam, guys! I think I pooped my pants a little hearing those celli. Godspeed on getting this done. Our credit cards are burning our pockets.


----------



## Per Lichtman

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*



CineSamples @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> We have finished some rudimentary 'shorts' patches. Here is a quick demo to show you what we have at this beginning stage:
> 
> [mp3]https://cinesamples.box.com/shared/static/8vuef361teig7vqihkkr.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> Direct Link: https://cinesamples.box.com/shared/stat ... qihkkr.mp3
> 
> MP



I like how flowing the sound is. The samples definitely have a bit of an identity and feel to them. I especially like the effect of going from the shorter notes to the long one - it really feels like the phrase flows from one into another.

Sounds like you are doing a good job of keeping things cohesive so far and I'm looking forward to hearing more.


----------



## Per Lichtman

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*



Enyak @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> I have questions regarding legato intervals.
> 
> Are there different legato samples for the different dynamics? I think the only Strings library that may actually do this is HS.
> 
> Also, are there different legato speeds available? (not just by modyfying sample offset)
> 
> Ideally I'd want to get at least those two playstyles covered:
> - emotional ppp-legato (slow)
> - stirring ff-legato (fast)



I would definitely like to see that as well.

As a minor point, HS is definitely not the only one with different legato samples for different dynamics: for starters, VSL offered "p" and "f" legato programs around a decade ago and they've made it much easier to use them together since then.


----------



## Mike Connelly

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Great demo, it would be nice to hear some stacked combinations of those as well, like V1/V2 octaves, violins/celli, celli/basses etc.

I agree with the earlier comment of same articulations for all instruments unless there's good reason not to.

For legato transitions, I still love the ones in LASS the best - instead of just legato/port there's a nice long gliss as well, with speed control. Having a wide range of speeds available, with control, and with timings fairly consistent between notes and sections would be killer (one of the other recent string libraries is really inconsistent on portamentos, some sound great but some are fast to the point where it's hard to tell if the ports are playing or just legatos on certain intervals).

Personally I like interval trills up to a fourth if not a fifth. A custom patch set up to play chords and scripted to automatically have the various sections trill between the appropriate notes would be fantastic (I'd love to see Sable add that one too).

And I always want to see falls, both short/fast and long versions. And for violins through celli (not chromatically sampled and minimal round robin and dynamics would be fine).

Continued updates to Cinebrass, Cinewinds, and your other libraries (still looking forward to a refresh of HWW) definitely are an incentive for buying new libraries.

And if you could just go back in time and announce this library before Sable went on sale...


----------



## Enyak

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Great demo, killer sound. The different lengths seem very musical and as commented above it also has an (very likable) identity of its own.


----------



## tmm

I'm a huge fan of CB-Pro and it's playability, so anything like that for strings is going to be on my to-buy list. I can't wait!

I'm curious to see what will be offered in CS-Pro. Will it be a CB-Pro approach, with solo versions of the ensemble instruments from CB-Core? Or the CW-Pro approach, with entirely different and less common instruments within the same grouping (meaning, other stringed instruments... erhu, kemençe, electric violin, zhonghu, etc)?


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Hi Mike,

The first Audio Demo of the Shorts you posted sounds wonderful. 

o/~ 

One more Strings Library I will be buying :D 

I'm also interested in _CineBrass_ Library, so I will be reviewing that one while you work on the Strings. 


Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Daniel James

Yesssssss crunchy attack! Sounding great guys. Love the idea of the Cinebrass style multi articulation patches. Any idea if they will be velocity or keyswitch toggles yet?

If its keyswitch can we have velocity as velocity so that we can have fast passages with accents 

-DJ


----------



## StevenOBrien

Very warm sounding! I particularly like how the basses sound, they're very clear and not at all muddy.

I know you're getting a lot of requests, but if there's one thing I could request that you consider paying attention to; 

One thing that annoys about most string libraries is how their legato patches work. Far too often, I find myself having to slur an entire phrase so that it's all played without changing the (theoretical) bowing direction, just so it will sound convincing. If I was writing for a real string orchestra, I would certainly not do this. I want to divide up the phrase into multiple bowings, but whenever I try to do this with sampled strings, it just never sounds good (at least not without a significant amount of programming). I guess I'm essentially asking for a legato patch which contains both legato transitions and "detache transitions" for unslurred notes which occur very shortly after a previous note.

Similarly, I would really love to be able to write faster slurred notes in a passage which also contains slower slurred notes without having the legato transitions crap out on me.

Essentially, my challenge to you is to write a legato patch where the violin parts in this can be played convincingly without much effort:

http://librarymusicsource.com/images/ph ... e_id=20279

If you can do that, I will immediately replace my current string library with CineStrings :D.

Best of luck with the scripting! I look forward to hearing more.


----------



## Per Lichtman

@StevenOBrien I know what you mean about the slurs - that's part of the reason I've ended up using bow change legato patches so much.

Is the detache articulation you are thinking of here similar to or different from the bow change legatos in products Hollywood Strings and Embertone Friedlander Violin?

Either way, sampling fast legatos is something we need more of in libraries.


----------



## Jonathan Howe

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

_Really_ like the sound of these demos! I'm excited for the rest!


----------



## Cinesamples

We sampled 4 dynamics of Legatos for CineStrings. It took forever. 

More on legatos later...

Thanks for all the good feedback.

MP


----------



## StevenOBrien

Per Lichtman @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> @StevenOBrien I know what you mean about the slurs - that's part of the reason I've ended up using bow change legato patches so much.
> 
> Is the detache articulation you are thinking of here similar to or different from the bow change legatos in products Hollywood Strings and Embertone Friedlander Violin?
> 
> Either way, sampling fast legatos is something we need more of in libraries.



Exactly! I only have HS Gold, but I listened to a few demos of Platinum's bow change patches and they seem to be along the lines of what I'm asking for.

So if you were playing in a phrase, and you hit the next note while still holding down the previous note (i.e. slurring it), it would play a slur legato transition, but if there was a small space between the notes, it would play a bow change legato transition (or an immediate attack at least, rather than the slower attacks you usually seem to get with string libraries).


----------



## Steve Martin

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Hi Mike,

The shorts sound really great! I'm really looking forward to hearing more.

Thanks so much for posting the demo.

best,

Steve :D


----------



## midi_controller

CineSamples @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> We sampled 4 dynamics of Legatos for CineStrings. It took forever.
> 
> More on legatos later...
> 
> Thanks for all the good feedback.
> 
> MP



Wow, that is just... holy crap guys. I'm really, really rooting for this, can this finally be the library that gets me away from HS? I sure hope so!

Really love the sound of those shorts, but I kinda knew I would. It's all going to come down to the longs, and the fact that you sampled 4 dynamics of transitions?!? That is fantastic. I'm kind of afraid to see the price tag now...


----------



## Ryan Scully

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Beautiful sound Mike!! Love the definition on those spiccatos - plus am totally stoked that they will be layed out the same way as the CineBrass/CineWinds short articulations!



Ryan :D


----------



## Enyak

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

4 dynamics of legatos? I'd say you guys are off to a great start - can't wait to hear them.


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Sounds great guys! 



Mike Connelly @ Wed Aug 28 said:


> Great demo, it would be nice to hear some stacked combinations of those as well, like V1/V2 octaves, violins/celli, celli/basses etc.



Then go ahead and try it. I combined the shorts here, added a bit of verb, and it sounds awesome.

Cheers.


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

here's some stacking

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http://api.soundcloud.com/tracks/107559542&secret_url=false[/flash]


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Gabriel Oliveira @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> here's some stacking
> 
> [flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http://api.soundcloud.com/tracks/107559542&secret_url=false[/flash]



Hi,

Which library are you using here ?


----------



## StevenOBrien

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



muziksculp @ Wed Aug 28 said:


> Gabriel Oliveira @ Tue Aug 27 said:
> 
> 
> 
> here's some stacking
> 
> [flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http://api.soundcloud.com/tracks/107559542&secret_url=false[/flash]
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Which library are you using here ?
Click to expand...


I assume it's the CineStrings demos stacked on top of each other.


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



muziksculp @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> Gabriel Oliveira @ Tue Aug 27 said:
> 
> 
> 
> here's some stacking
> 
> [flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http://api.soundcloud.com/tracks/107559542&secret_url=false[/flash]
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Which library are you using here ?
Click to expand...


CineStrings like StevenOBrien assumed o/~


----------



## Daniel James

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



muziksculp @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> Gabriel Oliveira @ Tue Aug 27 said:
> 
> 
> 
> here's some stacking
> 
> [flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http://api.soundcloud.com/tracks/107559542&secret_url=false[/flash]
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Which library are you using here ?
Click to expand...


Hahaha best comment so far 

-DJ


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Daniel James @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> muziksculp @ Tue Aug 27 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Gabriel Oliveira @ Tue Aug 27 said:
> 
> 
> 
> here's some stacking
> 
> [flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http://api.soundcloud.com/tracks/107559542&secret_url=false[/flash]
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Which library are you using here ?
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Hahaha best comment so far
> 
> -DJ
Click to expand...


+1


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Haha... I wasn't aware that Gabriel was with CineSamples, development, or maybe a beta-tester. Funny, but I thought he was using another Strings Library to make some kind of comparison to what CineStrings will sound like when they post some more audio demos :lol:


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I am sure he did the same thing I did: chop up the mp3.


----------



## MA-Simon

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Sounds really nice though!


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



muziksculp @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> Haha... I wasn't aware that Gabriel was with CineSamples, development, or maybe a beta-tester. Funny, but I thought he was using another Strings Library to make some kind of comparison to what CineStrings will sound like when they post some more audio demos :lol:



Let the Universe hear you! If I were part of Cinesamples team I would be proudly using "Cinesamples" under my username 8) 

I just choped Mike's examples.


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Gabriel Oliveira @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> muziksculp @ Tue Aug 27 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Haha... I wasn't aware that Gabriel was with CineSamples, development, or maybe a beta-tester. Funny, but I thought he was using another Strings Library to make some kind of comparison to what CineStrings will sound like when they post some more audio demos :lol:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let the Universe hear you! If I were part of Cinesamples team I would be proudly using "Cinesamples" under my username 8)
> 
> I just choped Mike's examples.
Click to expand...


LOL ... Slick move You had me fooled :mrgreen:


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Forgot to ask, is there any reverb on that demo?

Also, how many recorded dynamics are we looking at for the short notes?


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*



CineSamples @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> We have finished some rudimentary 'shorts' patches. Here is a quick demo to show you what we have at this beginning stage:



Sound great! You've got me interested. I love Adagio, but there's no substitute in recording the instruments in place as you've done here.


----------



## IFM

Sounds great so far! I am looking forward to this one.


----------



## Jem7

I would like to hear how each mic sounds like on next demo.
Also how many players for each section?


----------



## muk

That shorts sound very good. Just the right amount of bow for my taste - enough for them to have a bite, but not so much that it'd sound overly harsh. Really nice demo.


----------



## Cinesamples

Player numbers:

Violin I 16
Violin II 12
Viola 10
Cello 10
Bass 7


----------



## Saxer

CineSamples @ 28.8.2013 said:


> Player numbers:
> 
> Violin I 16
> Violin II 12
> Viola 10
> Cello 10
> Bass 7


lovely!


----------



## Vision

CineSamples @ Tue Aug 27 said:


> We sampled 4 dynamics of Legatos for CineStrings. It took forever.
> 
> More on legatos later...
> 
> Thanks for all the good feedback.
> 
> MP



Don't know if this has been mentioned, but a bow change legato style similar to embertone's violin would be nice. Alternating between regular and bow change legato styles on the fly would be really cool.


----------



## Per Lichtman

@Vision A couple of us mentioned it earlier, but the more people that mention it the better for sure!


----------



## Cinesamples

Vision @ Wed Aug 28 said:


> CineSamples @ Tue Aug 27 said:
> 
> 
> 
> We sampled 4 dynamics of Legatos for CineStrings. It took forever.
> 
> More on legatos later...
> 
> Thanks for all the good feedback.
> 
> MP
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Don't know if this has been mentioned, but a bow change legato style similar to embertone's violin would be nice. Alternating between regular and bow change legato styles on the fly would be really cool.
Click to expand...


Read and noted.


----------



## olajideparis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I'd like bow change legato too but as CS is now in POST-PRODUCTION its a safe bet that whatever is going to be in the library has already been recorded. So let's all just sit back and wait.


----------



## Patrick_Gill

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Hey Guys,

Brilliant news about the dev of CineStrings! Simply can NOT wait! 

I'd honestly love to see a good variety of string fx patches which are always quite minimalist in most libraries (Perhaps for PRO) eg, Clusters, Sul Pont, Pendereki style plucks, Harmonic bends, glissando swells, Herrmann psycho-esc rips and slides etc etc. All of that chaotic and obscure stuff! 

Also, I'd really LOVE to know if you're considering 'playable runs' patches. I know HS has them and there is a runs specific library available but again it's an articulation that seems to be left out of most string libraries (likely because of demand or trends) etc. But it would be fantastic to have these for fast and flexible slurred passages which help to bridge long and short notes - especially coming out of the Sony Stage together with the engineering of Dennis Sands! (Silvestri Fan) .

Looking forward to it guys!! Good luck.

Patrick.


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



olajideparis @ Wed Aug 28 said:


> I'd like bow change legato too but as CS is now in POST-PRODUCTION its a safe bet that whatever is going to be in the library has already been recorded. So let's all just sit back and wait.



Correct. As far as the foundational stuff, for the CineStrings CORE library, this is in the can. However, we are doing a series of CineStrings PRO sessions later, so keep ideas coming for that.

Like the Brass, Winds, and Perc, this is a living library that we'll continually update with new free samples.

Thanks everyone,
MP


----------



## 667

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



CineSamples @ Thu Aug 29 said:


> Like the Brass, Winds, and Perc, this is a living library that we'll continually update with new free samples.


I've always appreciated the dedication to keeping the libraries updated. CineSamples is one of a few "top tier" devs who can be counted on in this regard. There have been some nice upgrades to both CW and CB Core and Pro (I have all four).

I don't have CinePerc (I'm overweight perc libraries by significant margin!) and I have most of the current gen strings libs so am not likely to become a CineStrings 1.0 customer either. BUT if history is any guide you guys will probably put something in the 1.5 version of CineStrings PRO that I just HAVE to have and I'll end up picking it up then.


----------



## Per Lichtman

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Patrick_Gill @ Thu Aug 29 said:


> But it would be fantastic to have these for fast and flexible slurred passages which help to bridge long and short notes - especially coming out of the Sony Stage together with the engineering of Dennis Sands! (Silvestri Fan) .



The Silverstri scores were really good and I resonated with several of them quite thoroughly (as I did with the Danny Elfman "Good Will Hunting" score) but for me the most impressive thing about Dennis Sand's previous work has been combining the diverse work with other composers with a portfolio of 15 or more Thomas Newman scores. Those scores inspired me greatly as a composer as both a composer and an engineer.

I think that the later Newman scores also really benefitted from the recurring work by both Dennis Sands and the music editing with Bill Bernstein. There is such a confident sense of cohesion and effortless in the final result that I think many of us strive toward.

Which (to bring things back to the product again) makes me quite confident in Sands' ability to engineer a compelling and emotional string sound in a sample library - as he is one of only a handful of engineers that has been able to do so in recordings. We are lucky as composers that with so few engineers at that level, several have chosen to work in engineering sample libraries, and I think the sampling world is going to be richer for having a "Sands Sound" string collection soon.

Here's hoping the final product lives up to the potential introduced so far.


----------



## muk

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



CineSamples @ Thu Aug 29 said:


> Correct. As far as the foundational stuff, for the CineStrings CORE library, this is in the can. However, we are doing a series of CineStrings PRO sessions later, so keep ideas coming for that.
> 
> Like the Brass, Winds, and Perc, this is a living library that we'll continually update with new free samples.
> 
> Thanks everyone,
> MP



Thanks for that! That sort of consumer care and dedication is not to be taken for granted. I'm impressed.


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Hi,

Price of CineStrings, and CineStrings Pro ? Any info. at this time ? 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



muziksculp @ Thu Aug 29 said:


> Hi,
> 
> Price of CineStrings, and CineStrings Pro ? Any info. at this time ?
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp



Too hard to tell at this point. But I will say this has been our most expensive library to produce, hence the reason we saved it for last.


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



CineSamples @ Thu Aug 29 said:


> muziksculp @ Thu Aug 29 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Price of CineStrings, and CineStrings Pro ? Any info. at this time ?
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Too hard to tell at this point. But I will say this has been our most expensive library to produce, hence the reason we saved it for last.
Click to expand...


Which means it will cost more than any of your current sample libraries  

Anyways... I'm really excited, and happy that you finally ventured into making CineStrings. and look forward to buy both basic, and pro versions once they are available.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## drymcore_music

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Some thoughts on string libraries from someone owning a lot of them:

- the Basses should be sampled all the way up. Nearly all other libraries stop recording legatos (or even sustains) around the middle c for our deep resonatong friends. There are beautiful passages in the classical literature where the basses play up the g (even above the violas and / or 2nd violins).

- I´m always asking myself if i´m the only one who writes melodies including bigger intervals than an octave. As far as i know all legato patches only did record transitions up to an octave up and down. At least the ninth should be added to this palette, octave plus third would be perfect.

- It´s great to add the "dead" sound of empty strings sometimes. It would be great if these would be added as an option (in a seperate patch or via keyswitch)

- Double stops are completely underestimated. They offer a slightly bigger sound than divisi, especially if the same note is bowed on two strings at the same time (a lot of microtonal dissonance going on, making the sound broader)

- What would music be without "SUL G"-performances in the violins?

- On the Note legato is something which is not available anywhere (spitdfire once announced it for sable, maybe it´s coming in Vol. 3b...) . Simply sustain a note but play a rhythmic accent by changing the direction of the bow - something real string players do all the time - is simply impossible with strings (without using seperate detache or marcato patches to simulate a bowing sound, that is).

- It´s sad that only the LASS do have a real glissandos. "Slow" and "Very slow" glissandos with speed control would be awesome.

- Some pre-recorded crescendi were great, short, medium and long - all of them ending in an unbelievable harsh fff (normally this can´t be with sus patches via modwheel)

- Once i dreamed about a string patch where i could manipulate the position of the bow between sul pont and sul tasto...


I might have forgotten something...i´m not expecting you to do all this. I just wanted to write down what´s missing and what would make me buy this library - even if i decided to stop buying string stuff (after sable i was weak one time and bought the Friedlander and might buy the following solo stuff from ember, but i still believe i can be strong - unless a company does a lot of stuff which is still missing in my pallette... 8) )


----------



## Per Lichtman

@dyncore_music See, those were some of the things I forgot to mention in my earlier list. It's funny, you talk about them, you think about them and then you sit down to write about them and "poof" they aren't on your mind at all anymore. So thanks. 

Personally I don't feel any to be able to control the position from sul pont to sul tasto during a note - I just need to be able to change it at the start and end of each note.

When I play the violin (poorly) in real life, I use (to take a different one of your suggestions) double-stops almost every day. But I almost never move the bow position gradually from sul ponticello to sul tasto or arco normale. It's pretty much always a jump to one of the three discrete positions.

The exception is when I'm doing some very weird stuff on the strings - like playing fx by going col legno tratto on an open string from sul ponticello practically up to the neck. I think stuff like that is pretty specialized though, and better suited to a dedicated library than bringing up the price of the current one.

Most of the other things you mentioned, though, would be really great.


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

double stops? 

Tim Davies said that section players rarely use it... better expend some time (and money) with more useful artics.

http://www.timusic.net/notation/double-trouble/


----------



## Per Lichtman

@Gabriel Oliveira No, it's true that double-stops are rarely used in larger ensembles - but they can be quite effective if done simply.

For instance, using an open G D combination, play au talon FFF for an accent has a great deal of weight and force and is generally difficult to screw up (especially if used early in a piece so that the strings are still close their original tuning).

But the more common uses for double stops are of course when the ensemble is just too small to divide sufficiently, or in solo string work.

So for the pro library I would love (at the very least) if they could at least sample the double stops for all the open strings.


----------



## midi_controller

Gabriel Oliveira @ Thu Aug 29 said:


> double stops?
> 
> Tim Davies said that section players rarely use it... better expend some time (and money) with more useful artics.
> 
> http://www.timusic.net/notation/double-trouble/



I've seen John Williams employ it fairly often. Just sayin'. But why stop at double stops? Triple stops! Quadruple stops! I want them all! Mostly triple stops; After I heard John William's use of them for the first few bars of the End Titles for Born on the 4th of July, I was hooked.

Anyhow, I'll second the request for effects. As many as you can do! Glissandi galore and weird shifty bowing junk! I love me some effects.

If you are thinking of doing crescendos, please do crescendo to diminuendo instead, and have a script that will play back a release sample at the proper volume if the note is released earlier. Would be WAY more useful I think.

Please try to keep everything subtle though. There has been quite a few times when I've gone through some sample library effects (especially the longer ones) and thought 'Well, that has about one use'. I want effects that will become part of my music, not take it over. Except nasty screechy atonal high strings stuff; If you do those, make my ears bleed! :D

Some things I'd like that I don't have: The different short playing techniques completely muted. As in, the left hand covering all the strings at the top of the neck, over the fingerboard. No actual notes, just percussive effects on the different strings. Is there a term for that? I think spiccato, staccato, and bartok pizzicato would be particularly good, both very loud and very soft, with as many round robins as possible. Would be really great for stabs or wicked rhythmic stuff. Also, taps and scrapes and knocks of all kinds. Other oddness like the instruments played with a guitar/bass pick or something. Go wild!

More than anything though, I really want soft, slightly randomized attack short notes that I can use to make a rocking back and fourth line like we were talking about earlier. Or something. We really need to cover this area, it's so basic and yet so hard to do with samples currently.


----------



## snattack

Gabriel Oliveira @ Thu Aug 29 said:


> double stops?
> 
> Tim Davies said that section players rarely use it... better expend some time (and money) with more useful artics.
> 
> http://www.timusic.net/notation/double-trouble/



This text is pure bollux. Double stops are used all the time and very useful. You just have to think an extra time or two before using them so that it's playable. Divisi on the other hand gives a very specific timbre when used in a real orchestra, I recently re-orchestrated a video game soundtrack with divisi all over the place into playable double stops, worked fine in concert.

Nevertheless, a section double stop sounds closer to just adding the extra note in the sequencer with less vibrato, so it shouldn't be a priority imo.


----------



## Casiquire

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



drymcore_music @ Thu 29 Aug said:


> - On the Note legato is something which is not available anywhere (spitdfire once announced it for sable, maybe it´s coming in Vol. 3b...) . Simply sustain a note but play a rhythmic accent by changing the direction of the bow - something real string players do all the time - is simply impossible with strings (without using seperate detache or marcato patches to simulate a bowing sound, that is).



I'm pretty sure all VSL libraries include this.

Otherwise if they can combine your list and Per Lichtman's list I'm pretty sure they'd have the perfect library. I don't think anybody's even sampled legato sul pont/tasto, so seeing those with legato with the ability to crossfade from normal playing into them would be quite unusual. 

As for double-stops not being used often, the point of sample libraries is for them to be "your orchestra" and you should be able to make them do whatever you want.

What do you mean by "the dead sound of empty strings"? Do you just mean open strings?


----------



## drymcore_music

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

@Casiquire:

Ah, sorry.
I´m not a native english speaker...in german we say "empty string", but it means "open string" - i once knew that but forgot...

So you are right, i meant the open string without any chance for vibrato.


The (old) VSL strings had pre recorded bow changes on one note which jumped to the next bow change when a key was hit (otherwise the sample was simply played as a oneshot).

Might be a workaround but a on the note bow change for current (or next) gen should be implemented into the legato patch so lines without audio editing could be played.

I don´t know about the new dimension strings: do they offer something like this?


----------



## Simon Ravn

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Sounds very promising guys! Very detailed and clear sound. Only thing that worries me a bit is the noise buildup that is already pretty noticable playing just one section here. So no matter how raw and untouched I like samples, I hope you'll do some noise reduction on these.


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Simon Ravn @ Fri Aug 30 said:


> Sounds very promising guys! Very detailed and clear sound. Only thing that worries me a bit is the noise buildup that is already pretty noticable playing just one section here. So no matter how raw and untouched I like samples, I hope you'll do some noise reduction on these.



I know the guys did this on CinePerc (and probably the others too) - they recently released some de-noised samples for vibes and bass drum, and did an excellent job on them. Those vibes REALLY needed it!


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

snattack @ Fri Aug 30 said:


> This text is pure bollux...



"bollux" is a strong word to use for Tim's field experience...

http://www.timusic.net/bio/


----------



## Simon Ravn

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Guy Rowland @ Fri Aug 30 said:


> Simon Ravn @ Fri Aug 30 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds very promising guys! Very detailed and clear sound. Only thing that worries me a bit is the noise buildup that is already pretty noticable playing just one section here. So no matter how raw and untouched I like samples, I hope you'll do some noise reduction on these.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know the guys did this on CinePerc (and probably the others too) - they recently released some de-noised samples for vibes and bass drum, and did an excellent job on them. Those vibes REALLY needed it!
Click to expand...


Some of the bass drums are unusable because of noise and electrical curcuit noise.... I didn't see any fixes for that?


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Simon Ravn @ Fri Aug 30 said:


> Guy Rowland @ Fri Aug 30 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Simon Ravn @ Fri Aug 30 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sounds very promising guys! Very detailed and clear sound. Only thing that worries me a bit is the noise buildup that is already pretty noticable playing just one section here. So no matter how raw and untouched I like samples, I hope you'll do some noise reduction on these.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I know the guys did this on CinePerc (and probably the others too) - they recently released some de-noised samples for vibes and bass drum, and did an excellent job on them. Those vibes REALLY needed it!
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Some of the bass drums are unusable because of noise and electrical curcuit noise.... I didn't see any fixes for that?
Click to expand...


http://dist.cinesamples.com/cinepercupdate/


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Simon Ravn @ Fri Aug 30 said:


> Sounds very promising guys! Very detailed and clear sound. Only thing that worries me a bit is the noise buildup that is already pretty noticable playing just one section here. So no matter how raw and untouched I like samples, I hope you'll do some noise reduction on these.



You got it Simon. Only minimal noise reduction has been done so far. We'll take out a lot more, however it is a careful balance between noise reduction and altering the tone of the actual sound.


----------



## DDK

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I have most of the string libraries
And what I am wanting to hear from a new strings
Is how well it is recorded
I feel that this is often overlooked when everyone is concerned with articulations
It is how the sections sound together 
I want to be able to get a lush sound that is still focused without having to pile on 
The reverb
I think for me it would be somewhere between the fat sound of cinematic strings 
And the definition of Hollywood strings 
So it is the overall recoding character that will make me pull the trigger on another string
Library


----------



## Per Lichtman

@eclipse What are your thoughts on the recorded sound of the demo so far?


----------



## dhlkid

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I also have most of the strings libraries and narrow down to several when doing my production. 

I do wanna hear how far u can go, hope u can produce the sound, articulation and details other cannot.


----------



## Casiquire

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



drymcore_music @ Fri 30 Aug said:


> @Casiquire:
> The (old) VSL strings had pre recorded bow changes on one note which jumped to the next bow change when a key was hit (otherwise the sample was simply played as a oneshot).
> 
> Might be a workaround but a on the note bow change for current (or next) gen should be implemented into the legato patch so lines without audio editing could be played.



I'm pretty sure all VSL already has this. Every library of theirs I've ever used does.

Anyway though it does seem to be an often overlooked articulation despite the fact that it seems like everybody wants it. So Cinestrings guys...glad it's on your radar.

As for open strings, I wonder how Cinestrings can incorporate them while keeping some ease-of-use. For most situations, people using a library for its simplicity can just play a note without vibrato and at a slightly higher dynamic to simulate the open string sound.

How far will Cinestrings go with harmonics? I use them all the time but it's difficult because so many libraries have them as an afterthought


----------



## Patrick_Gill

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Hey Guys,

Are you going to be recording a Harp (perhaps with CineStrings) as part of the Cinesamples Orch library collection ? I know you have CineHarp which sounds good but it would be nice to have one with the same treatment you've given the orchestral libraries. Perhaps even a session artist Harp later on like you did for Randy's Celeste ? Just a suggestion 

Patrick.


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

One problem with LASS (imo) is the small choice of shorts. Adagio has more shorts, as do the V1's and Celli in Sable (4!).

For your upcoming "Pro" sessions, you might consider doing another short note, even shorter than what you have already, off-the-string, light at pp, and kind-of "ricochet" sounding at "forte". At very fast tempi, your current offering may work less well.

Time-stretching via the Kontakt TM may be interesting also.


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Hi,

It would be nice to have no bugs, or issues once CineStrings is released. 

So, please run _extensive tests_ before releasing it. 

It makes a huge difference when a new library is released, and works perfectly, without glitches, sample edit issues, scripting, or other overlooked detail that requires a fix after a user downloads the library. 

Oh... and this bit of advice applies to all sample developers  

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## EastWest Lurker

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



muziksculp @ Sat Aug 31 said:


> Hi,
> 
> It would be nice to have no bugs, or issues once CineStrings is released.
> 
> So, please run _extensive tests_ before releasing it.
> 
> It makes a huge difference when a new library is released, and works perfectly, without glitches, sample edit issues, scripting, or other overlooked detail that requires a fix after a user downloads the library.
> 
> Oh... and this bit of advice applies to all sample developers
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp



They can test _forever_ and that will not happen with _any_ library of this scope

If they do however, I will take my hat off to them..


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



EastWest Lurker @ Sat Aug 31 said:


> muziksculp @ Sat Aug 31 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hi,
> 
> It would be nice to have no bugs, or issues once CineStrings is released.
> 
> So, please run _extensive tests_ before releasing it.
> 
> It makes a huge difference when a new library is released, and works perfectly, without glitches, sample edit issues, scripting, or other overlooked detail that requires a fix after a user downloads the library.
> 
> Oh... and this bit of advice applies to all sample developers
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp
> 
> 
> 
> 
> They can test _forever_ and that will not happen with _any_ library of this scope
> 
> If they do however, I will take my hat off to them..
Click to expand...


HAha.. This advice applies to EW Libraries, and PLAY as well :lol:


----------



## williemyers

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

a thought - - for one and all....

the discussion of what the "sound" of this new string library should be brings up, I believe, a most important point that I've never seen discussed here (on VI-Control). 

Quite simply, from what *perspective* should strings - - or any other insturments, for that matter - - be sampled?
That is, there are two positions on the concert hall that are critical listening points; the perspective of the player who's performing the passage and the perspective of the audience member who's hearing that performance. 

So one can stand immediately adjacent to the concertimeister and ask them to perform a passage. There will be a (probably) beautiful sound.

Now, one can walk out in to the middle of the house (as an audience member) and ask that same concertmeister to play the same passage. There will a an equally beautiful, but fundamentally different sound.

So the questions arises, should samples be taken for a "performer's perspective"? Or for a "from the audience" sound?

Yes, of course, most libraries offers differing mic positions to attempt to deal with the differences, but multiple mic positions really still don't give the difference in timbre that one gets from the two positions mentioned above.

And, because both equally important, that leaves the potential library developer with the question; which perspective do I attempt to obtain with the library that I'm creating?

So, at the end of the day, I'm not sure that there's a "correct" answer. Both perspectives are equally valid. And lib. developers can choose either/or in creating their libraries. 

I just wish (sometimes) they'd be a little more up front about which approach they've taken so that the composer (purchaser) can make a more informed purchasing decision?


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



williemyers @ Sun Sep 01 said:


> So the questions arises, should samples be taken for a "performer's perspective"? Or for a "from the audience" sound?



Neither. They should take neither possibility into consideration; they should be made to sound just like film score soundtracks - or as close as possible. At least the libs that are targeted to composers who do film, tv and game scores, such as the CS series.

Cheers.


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



RiffWraith @ Sat Aug 31 said:


> Neither. They should take neither possibility into consideration; they should be made to sound just like film score soundtracks - or as close as possible. At least the libs that are targeted to composers who do film, tv and game scores, such as the CS series.
> 
> Cheers.



Exactly. Film scores aren't usually recorded trying to replicate how it would sound played back in a concert setting. Honestly, if someone is looking for the concert hall kind of a sound, I'd point them to something like VSL, so that they can mess with it however they want, and even set up the orchestra in different ways.

With composers who specialize in media, quite a bit of the time our mock-ups are the end result, which is why it's so important to get that extra bit of realism that a library recorded at, for example, the Sony scoring stage can offer. It might not be as in depth as some of the other offerings, but if it has the right sound to it, it can make all the difference in the world.

This is why it's such an exciting time, developers like Cinesamples and Spitfire are recording at the stages where most film scores are recorded at, and even getting the right engineers to get the sound even closer.


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Thanks for the replies guys.
Yes, the goal with CineBrass, CineWinds, CinePerc and Cinestrings, are simply to have a full orchestral set that sounds like the great soundtracks that Dennis Sands recorded and mixed.

He has a specific Mic Array that he's used for many years, which I think has contributed greatly to the "Hollywood" sound that we're all accustomed to. We all grew up with this sound (at least I know I did).

If you all missed it, here's a quick interview we did and may help answer some of the deep engineering questions. (Most is over my head):



MP


----------



## Enyak

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Very enticing interview! I can't wait to hear that Silvestri ppp-Strings sound.


----------



## Jem7

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I've done a little test about how that CineStrings shorts compared to LASS shorts. In my demo, same parts played by LASS so you can compare them both. I didn't tried to make it sounds like CineStrings. Just want to try and see how LASS and CineStrings compare. Also did stacking too.

http://soundcloud.com/ugurdariveren/lass-shorts/s-XM8DO

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F108464100%3Fsecret_token%3Ds-XM8DO&secret_url=true[/flash]


----------



## Ellywu2

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I am sure I am not alone when I say the following about Cinestrings:

Shut up and take my money.


----------



## Farkle

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Jem7 @ Mon Sep 02 said:


> I've done a little test about how that CineStrings shorts compared to LASS shorts. In my demo, same parts played by LASS so you can compare them both. I didn't tried to make it sounds like CineStrings. Just want to try and see how LASS and CineStrings compare. Also did stacking too.
> 
> http://soundcloud.com/ugurdariveren/lass-shorts/s-XM8DO
> 
> [flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F108464100%3Fsecret_token%3Ds-XM8DO&secret_url=true[/flash]



First, thank you for the comparison! As a LASS user, that was a great chance for me to hear how they match up against each other.

May I ask you a question about your LASS shorts that you recorded on your Soundcloud? You did a great job of having the long note at the end of each phrase sound out clearly, with a strong attack, rather than a "swelly legato" sound. I'm having trouble with my LASS template getting that type of sound. The sound where the string plays with a strong, clear attack, but it's a legato tone. 

How did you get that sound in LASS (the C# at the end of the second phrase) to speak with such a clear bow attack, and have a clean sustain, without a swell into it?

Not to hijack the thread, if you want, we can start a new thread on this. Thank you for any advice you can provide!

Mike


----------



## ZORZES

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Be released indeed a very important Strings library from Cines Samples. Called Cine Strings. Hopefully contain samples will represent the Hollywood philosophy in unisono Strings melody line ... For examples: 2 or 3 octaves range combination from Violins + Violas + Celli. Jhonn Williams uses this structure orchestration an many others film composers. With this we manage to have a more true resonance harmonics from the same recording room. In contrast to the use thrice a convolution of the sound of the room for each individual patch. A example of a well-known theme of the movie Captain Iook in music Jhonn Williams. Can someone give me some information about it; or an answer; It is very important in order to start from now on campaign financing to purchase the product Cine Strings.Parakalo see a quote from Captain Hook Strings Orchestration! Sorry for my moderate English.
Best Regards![/img]


----------



## Jem7

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Farkle @ 2/9/2013 said:


> Jem7 @ Mon Sep 02 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I've done a little test about how that CineStrings shorts compared to LASS shorts. In my demo, same parts played by LASS so you can compare them both. I didn't tried to make it sounds like CineStrings. Just want to try and see how LASS and CineStrings compare. Also did stacking too.
> 
> http://soundcloud.com/ugurdariveren/lass-shorts/s-XM8DO
> 
> [flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F108464100%3Fsecret_token%3Ds-XM8DO&secret_url=true[/flash]
> 
> 
> 
> 
> First, thank you for the comparison! As a LASS user, that was a great chance for me to hear how they match up against each other.
> 
> May I ask you a question about your LASS shorts that you recorded on your Soundcloud? You did a great job of having the long note at the end of each phrase sound out clearly, with a strong attack, rather than a "swelly legato" sound. I'm having trouble with my LASS template getting that type of sound. The sound where the string plays with a strong, clear attack, but it's a legato tone.
> 
> How did you get that sound in LASS (the C# at the end of the second phrase) to speak with such a clear bow attack, and have a clean sustain, without a swell into it?
> 
> Not to hijack the thread, if you want, we can start a new thread on this. Thank you for any advice you can provide!
> 
> Mike
Click to expand...


Yeah sure. The answer is very easy  It's just staccato + legato patches together.


----------



## Farkle

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Hah! Well, there you go! Thank you, the answer makes total sense. Looks like I'm adding a keyswitch to my template with layered stacc and Leg! 

Mike


----------



## SymphonicSamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

A quick thanks to CineSamples for taking the time to do the interview and post it . Love stuff like that . Music is a never ending learning curve . Something tells me there's going to be some magic in this library .


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

isn't time for more demos? o/~


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Gabriel Oliveira @ Thu Sep 05 said:


> isn't time for more demos? o/~



Silly question.

Of course it is!!!!! :mrgreen: 

I have a feature req. *Use Neighboring Zones* for the shorts (stac, spic, or whatever they wind up being). Extremely useful in the SF libs; I would love to see CS do the same.

Cheers.


----------



## Cinesamples

you got it, we're finishing up an all-new polyphonic legato engine. Will demo this next.


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



RiffWraith @ Wed Sep 04 said:


> Gabriel Oliveira @ Thu Sep 05 said:
> 
> 
> 
> isn't time for more demos? o/~
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Silly question.
> 
> Of course it is!!!!! :mrgreen:
> 
> I have a feature req. *Use Neighboring Zones* for the shorts (stac, spic, or whatever they wind up being). Extremely useful in the SF libs; I would love to see CS do the same.
> 
> Cheers.
Click to expand...


Why just shorts? shorts already have RR anyways usually. I'd love to see neighboring zones for the longs, which I've already requested for the Brass and winds. The longs just have the one note, no RR so if you play quickly with legato or longs, it's obvious. Neighboring zones for longs would help this.


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Echoes in the Attic @ Thu Sep 05 said:


> Why just shorts?



Never said it had to be_ just _for the shorts. Not sure you can implement that properly for legato patches, but maybe. If so, I'd be all for that as well.

Cheers.


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



Echoes in the Attic @ Wed Sep 04 said:


> Why just shorts? shorts already have RR anyways usually. I'd love to see neighboring zones for the longs, which I've already requested for the Brass and winds. The longs just have the one note, no RR so if you play quickly with legato or longs, it's obvious. Neighboring zones for longs would help this.



No, it wouldn't. You can try it yourself with an older Kontakt library, it sounds BAD. With shorts it's a little less obvious so you can get away with it a bit, and even with legato transitions, although that is pushing it. But longs just sound really artificial this way.

@RiffWraith: Why would you need a "neighboring zone" script for patches that already have 4-8x RR?


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



midi_controller @ Thu Sep 05 said:


> @RiffWraith: Why would you need a "neighboring zone" script for patches that already have 4-8x RR?



*More *RRs :D The more the merrier. Seriously. If you have a one-note line that goes on forever, the ear gets tired of hearing the same notes - even if a random script is used. A "neighboring zone" script helps in this regard. Albion I is RRx4, and this script is very useful there.

Cheers.


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

But that is what measured tremolo is for! Well, I guess Albion probably doesn't have that, but most of recent string libraries do.


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



midi_controller @ Wed Sep 04 said:


> Echoes in the Attic @ Wed Sep 04 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Why just shorts? shorts already have RR anyways usually. I'd love to see neighboring zones for the longs, which I've already requested for the Brass and winds. The longs just have the one note, no RR so if you play quickly with legato or longs, it's obvious. Neighboring zones for longs would help this.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> No, it wouldn't. You can try it yourself with an older Kontakt library, it sounds BAD. With shorts it's a little less obvious so you can get away with it a bit, and even with legato transitions, although that is pushing it. But longs just sound really artificial this way.
Click to expand...

Try it myself with something older like say, ummm, Spitfire Albion? where neighbouring zone round robin on longs is incredibly useful? Yes I have, and it's incredibly useful. Obviously something you want all the time but works very well especially with chord patterns. I will say though that it would be much better with randomization of the neighbouring zones. It can be bad when you hear obvious 1234-1234-1234 tone differences.



midi_controller @ Wed Sep 04 said:


> @RiffWraith: Why would you need a "neighboring zone" script for patches that already have 4-8x RR?



Ok, we get that you don't like neighbouring zone round robin. But you do understand we're talking about an option here right? So you wouldn't be forced to use it. Why would you want to discourage what others would find useful when you don't need to use it?

I really hope Cinesamples adds neighbouring zone RR to CineBrass (longs and shorts!)


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I never said I didn't like it. Hell, when the method was first introduced I used it on every short note patch I had (worked wonders in the original EWQLSO). I just remember that when I tried it on longs, the RRs would sound completely out of place, and instead of making it sound more realistic, it just sounded more artificial. If it works for you, then awesome. I'm only thinking that CineStrings will already have RR on the longs (down bow / up bow), since every other recent library I have does (except Adagio). I didn't think it would be necessary. 

I fully support having neighboring zones on legato transitions though, I know how expensive it is to record actual alternate transitions, so it just makes sense. The question about using it on the shorts that already have RRs was just that, a question. I was only curious, since I haven't felt the need to do that technique on short notes in a very long time. 

Back on topic: Hey Cinesamples! Did you get RRs on your sustains? :D


----------



## Casiquire

Have to agree with midi_controller here, neighboring-note never quite sounds natural to me while I'm playing. Maybe it works in an overall mix but while playing in-the-moment it just doesn't do it for me. Though I'm all about options, so carry on Cinesamples!


----------



## stikygum

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Maybe I'm coming in on this late, but do we have an idea of when this might be released. I'm wondering if it's going to be something like next month or later this winter.


----------



## Piano & Strings

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I want this! I am a proud cinebrass pro user and I love having the Sony tone I most desire with the self-configuring flexibility to change around the patches. Here are my important points:

For me, Kontakt Player is a must, even if paying a little extra for the option is needed (as some other libs have done before). I LOVE the Kontakt Engine, but as an orchestral vi hound, I've never felt compelled to buy Komplete. I'm really hoping Cinewinds and CinePerc will end up with a KT Player option eventually too.

Whatever the cost of recording the library, I don't think I'd ever pay over $500 for any orchestral section library. I think splitting up the content over more releases would be a better idea, to stagger the financial damage lol.

The room tone in the shorts examples sounded uber tasty to my ears.

Keep up the ear candy gents!


----------



## Enyak

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Dear CineTeam,

if you don't mind ask me asking, are there any news on the status on con sordino in CineStrings CORE yet? I actually expect that to be in CineStrings PRO right now.

I certainly want the sordinos to be treated with the same amount of detail (dynamics) as the non-muted strings, but don't necessarily need all arts (1/8, 1/4, 1/2 lengths, sustains, legatos, tremolo - YES! But I can live without trills, pizz, bartok, FX, etc)


----------



## Steve Steele

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I've been away and I'm just now getting in on this discussion, so I want to talk about PRO.

Having and loving the CineBrass CORE and PRO workflow and realizing CineStrings is intended as a film scoring library, this is what I'd like to see...

*1)* Articulations - Ricochet bowing, saltando bouncing bow, and/or flying spiccatos, etc.. If nothing else these could be mixed or layered with the the included spiccatos and staccato to get a more varied and realistic performance. Anything that improves humanistic playing, that goes beyond relying on round robins of the same articulation. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C6SzFRqWu7M

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4soFJ_izGIE

+1 on the many legato suggestions concerning bow changing (Embertone Friedlander Violin), and controlling legato length, etc.. 4 layers of legato. Nice. Hopefully the legato will be as good or better than the LPG of LASS. That's the current gold standard, IMO.

Double stops would be nice. Sordino I assuming will be there.

*2)* As in CineOrch and CineBrass PRO - Solo True Legato Pro instruments. Ensemble Hi and Low Chords. (I like divisi, and I'm sure you guys will have something). Any other useful combinations. Not sure about fx. LASS did well with their aleatoric patches. FX patches, can take or leave them.

*3)* Whatever LASS didn't do that we all want done. Whatever that might be.

In summery: FC players done up. Extra articulations. Ensemble chords w/ legato and divisi groups. I think CB Pro is a good model for CS Pro. 

Btw, The initial samples sound great! I know CS CORE and PRO are gonna be a home run!


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Here's the update on our progress. The interface is compete, and we have all the microphones done as well as the legato. Now onto testing.


----------



## BenG

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Looks great guys!


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Looks very nice ! 

Thanks for the update.


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Wow, you guys are moving quick on this! Very cool. Any chance we can get another little teaser? :D


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



midi_controller @ Sat Sep 14 said:


> Wow, you guys are moving quick on this! Very cool. Any chance we can get another little teaser? :D




Yes, another teaser, por favor. Doesn't matter for me; my mind was made up on this long ago, but I do want to hear more. NOW :mrgreen:


----------



## Steve Steele

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I want to hear "Best Legato" please!


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Best Legato is just a mixing preset that most likely has less phasing than the other presets. I think, I could be wrong, maybe there is more to it.

I'd love to hear a legato demo, but I would totally understand if they are not ready yet. 

Do we have an articulations list for Core yet? Also, will Core be released first, then Pro following sometime later?


----------



## Steve Steele

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



midi_controller @ Fri Sep 13 said:


> Best Legato is just a mixing preset that most likely has less phasing than the other presets. I think, I could be wrong, maybe there is more to it.



That's what I was wondering. Is it a particular mic and settings preset? Or is it a different sample set (like a LASS LPG)? Since I don't know, I was just throwing it out there. Interesting though.


----------



## MrCambiata

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



nightwatch @ Fri Sep 13 said:


> I want to hear "Best Legato" please!



me too!


----------



## Sid Francis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

the presets on the left are MIC presets ...Nevertheless helpfull


----------



## Piano & Strings

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

When this is complete, I hope you guys will consider a single octave demo of the 1st Vins for every articulation, so we can try customizing the patches and really test the legato patches to see how they integrate in our setups. When you're already more than happy with your string libs (the offerings currently are great) it's going to take this kind of marketing (spitfire did this I think I recall with their strings) to seduce us away from what we know and love. 

On paper, sony scoring stage with that resource friendly full mic position is VERY tempting, but without a full octave demo of the vins, I know I for one would not be able to risk the cash. Oh, as previously mentioned, making it kontakt player. I'd like to see legato, spics, stacs and marcs on core. 

For pro I'd like to see other articulations like pizz, fx flautando etc, able to be made mod or keyswitchable on fewer midi trqcks. I'd also like solo strings on pro, with legato, and basic articulations (like to be able to switch between spic, stac and marc with modwheel, plus velocity dynamics. Such a long list of expectations, l9rd knows how you'll compromise and please us all! Love the KT skin... yet more instrument seduction!

And finally, two more suggestions, again similar to Hollywood strings: For legato patches, please track down two score recordings made in sony scoring stage, one with sordino strings and one with hybrid muted and non muted string sections. Please then use ozone to eq match these and give us two eq fx buttons in the interface that can be clicked on or off: 'sordino' and 'hybrid'. This will be worth it's weight in gold an as we have access to such a vast repertoire from film music at sony, you should be able to get quite specific finding exact string numbers on record and perhaps eq each section independantly to average the difference. Good luck and may the Maestro be with you!


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

If you are happy with what you already have, why would you need this library? I'm just wondering.

I've got plenty of string libraries and none of them have gotten close enough to the sound that I want for me to be happy (usually having to do with the room size it seems). That is why I'm so interested in this library. Well, that and the fact that it's in Kontakt.

I think pizzicato should be in Core though. It's one of the most used articulations for strings. Tremolo too now that I think about it. If they have both of those then Core alone will be in direct competition with another popular string library, and Pro will just be the icing on the cake.

I'd also much rather have real sordino recordings or more articulations for full strings than solo strings in this library, unless they have already been recorded. A sordino switch like in Hollywood strings would be fine as a temporary measure, but it would be such a shame to not have the real thing, even if it means another package that we would have to pay for. Con sord is everywhere in film scores, and in some, they almost never take the mutes off. It's a must have!


----------



## Steve Steele

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



> Marc Filmer @ Sat Sep 14 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Please then use ozone to eq match..
Click to expand...


Did I read your request correctly? You want them to use Ozone to EQ match their samples to get Sordino strings? No, please don't. Using RX for noise reduction is one thing. Using Ozone EQ matching.. no way. Quality would suffer. They would have to record real sordino strings, and the user could apply EQ matching if they wanted a particular sound.


----------



## Steve Steele

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



midi_controller @ Sat Sep 14 said:


> If you are happy with what you already have, why would you need this library? I'm just wondering.
> 
> I've got plenty of string libraries and none of them have gotten close enough to the sound that I want for me to be happy (usually having to do with the room size it seems). That is why I'm so interested in this library. Well, that and the fact that it's in Kontakt.
> 
> I think pizzicato should be in Core though. It's one of the most used articulations for strings. Tremolo too now that I think about it. If they have both of those then Core alone will be in direct competition with another popular string library, and Pro will just be the icing on the cake.
> 
> I'd also much rather have real sordino recordings or more articulations for full strings than solo strings in this library, unless they have already been recorded. A sordino switch like in Hollywood strings would be fine as a temporary measure, but it would be such a shame to not have the real thing, even if it means another package that we would have to pay for. Con sord is everywhere in film scores, and in some, they almost never take the mutes off. It's a must have!



Hey, two questions. Are you saying you don't want solo strings in CineStrings at all, or just in the Core release? I'm kinda hoping they do CineStrings like CineBrass which had solo patches in both. In Core they could release one chair and in Pro, another chair (doesn't have to be specified as first or second). I don't know how they plan on spitting up articulations between Core and Pro, if they are. It would be kinda weird to release a only few articulations in Core and wait and put the rest in Pro. But if they did, a possibility would be, Arco, Staccato, Pizzicato, Trills and Tremolo in Core. Then maybe Marcato, Harmonics, Sordino, and extra content like Glissando, Aleatoric or fx type articulations, Ricochet bowings, and any others they decide, along with a more highly developed solo string Pro type instrument like in CB.

They can't leave too many important articulations out of Core. That might make Core look uncompetitive.

I still think there's a hole in the market for great and modern solo strings. I use LASS FC, which is great but even AudioBro admitted that FC was just meant to be a complement to the ensembles, and not a full on solo string library (it's still very good though). Spitfire has there's now which seem great, but I'd have to commit to their way of doing things. I don't have Hollywood Strings (although the articulation list is superb) because I don't want my string library to run on the Play engine until I get a second computer (unless Play 4 is much better than 3, I just don't have the CPU). And Adagio wash't for me. So that leaves CineSamples as my current hope. They're the best company left to do it and I hope they do. (I have some VSL stuff, but not their strings)

What are you using for solo strings?


----------



## Piano & Strings

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I am indeed currently happy with my string libs, but if I can be equally happy, take up less RAM space, get the sony sound and some cool extra features... well one can always be happier! The use of Ozone was for the purpose of gaining eq settings that would be applied via a button, or seperate eq package with presets (maybe a bundled freebie). You'd be amazed how close to Lass LS the sordino button in HS comes, of course in my limited opinion.  I'm going to duck out of this thread, as it's true, being happy with my current string libraries means it would be unfair of me to try and shape it for those of you who really need it. Feeling like I still crave it... must... resist.

I would almost like a separate solo strings product from cinesamples however. I currently do not use solo strings, but would like to.

I love hybrid strings... would love a library fully recorded half muted... one day... Mike Patti? Lol


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



nightwatch @ Sat Sep 14 said:


> Hey, two questions. Are you saying you don't want solo strings in CineStrings at all, or just in the Core release? I'm kinda hoping they do CineStrings like CineBrass which had solo patches in both.



In this product, I'd prefer there not be any solo strings, mainly because I'm thinking long term. It's the same with sordino and divisi. As a separate product, there is much better chance of them being more complete, with more articulations dedicated to them. If we get them now, it might only be a couple patches. 

Besides, this is the first time (with the exception of private libraries) that a string library has been recorded on one of the stages where thousands of film scores are recorded. I want this library to be as in depth and complete as possible. The Cinesamples team can always come back and do a Solo String library; Hell, it would even cost quite a bit less to record! An expansion on ensemble strings down the road might not sell as well though, and cost much more to make.

If not completely different products, it would be cool to see the line up like this:

CineStrings Core (Main articulations)
CineStrings Pro (More articulations and effects)
CineStrings Sordino
CineStrings Divisi
CineStrings Solo

That can be done over a longer period of time, and give more breathing room for each part, instead of trying to fit in one or two patches in core or pro.

In any case, we still don't know what Cinesamples is planning so it will be interesting to see the route they take!


----------



## hector

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



midi_controller @ Sun Sep 15 said:


> As a separate product, there is much better chance of them being more complete, with more articulations dedicated to them. If we get them now, it might only be a couple patches.


I agree I too prefer them a separate addon library to be more detailed and in depth! I like your ideas for how to have it to be split, good chance for details.
 
Though with your post I point out this is not the first as there are already some commercial strings library that are recorded on famous film hall/stage but I will not mention here for respect but can be found on the forums.


----------



## Steve Steele

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



midi_controller @ Sun Sep 15 said:


> nightwatch @ Sat Sep 14 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hey, two questions. Are you saying you don't want solo strings in CineStrings at all, or just in the Core release? I'm kinda hoping they do CineStrings like CineBrass which had solo patches in both.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In this product, I'd prefer there not be any solo strings, mainly because I'm thinking long term. It's the same with sordino and divisi. As a separate product, there is much better chance of them being more complete, with more articulations dedicated to them. If we get them now, it might only be a couple patches.
> 
> Besides, this is the first time (with the exception of private libraries) that a string library has been recorded on one of the stages where thousands of film scores are recorded. I want this library to be as in depth and complete as possible. The Cinesamples team can always come back and do a Solo String library; Hell, it would even cost quite a bit less to record! An expansion on ensemble strings down the road might not sell as well though, and cost much more to make.
> 
> If not completely different products, it would be cool to see the line up like this:
> 
> CineStrings Core (Main articulations)
> CineStrings Pro (More articulations and effects)
> CineStrings Sordino
> CineStrings Divisi
> CineStrings Solo
> 
> That can be done over a longer period of time, and give more breathing room for each part, instead of trying to fit in one or two patches in core or pro.
> 
> In any case, we still don't know what Cinesamples is planning so it will be interesting to see the route they take!
Click to expand...


Yeah, good point. After I posted my question, I thought about how much work it would take to produce a solo string library that would be more than trivial. Solo strings are a bit harder to do than solo brass (if done up right). And the recordings I've heard so far are so good, I'd rather they do the best ensemble library possible first. So, yeah, a separate CineStrings Solo could be a good idea. Like you said, we have no idea what they're doing.

However, personally, I'd like to see Sordino and Divisi strings in one or both of the libraries. I think those are vital to the genre they're selling to. I use divisi patches a lot now. But that's me.


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



hector @ Sun Sep 15 said:


> Though with your post I point out this is not the first as there are already some commercial strings library that are recorded on famous film hall/stage but I will not mention here for respect but can be found on the forums.



Not like this one. The ones you are talking about are only small sections or ones that combine sections in patches. I have the former and am not a huge fan of the latter, I just find it too limiting.

@nightwatch: I wouldn't be terribly surprised if I learned that the bulk of Pro will be Sordino, considering it would fit with the way they did CineBrass. I just hope that if that is the case, we still get lots of extra articulations as well, like Bartok Pizz, Flautando, Measured Tremolo; all the stuff that wouldn't really be "bread and butter" articulations.


----------



## Steve Steele

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



midi_controller @ Sun Sep 15 said:


> hector @ Sun Sep 15 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Though with your post I point out this is not the first as there are already some commercial strings library that are recorded on famous film hall/stage but I will not mention here for respect but can be found on the forums.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @nightwatch: I wouldn't be terribly surprised if I learned that the bulk of Pro will be Sordino, considering it would fit with the way they did CineBrass. I just hope that if that is the case, we still get lots of extra articulations as well, like Bartok Pizz, Flautando, Measured Tremolo; all the stuff that wouldn't really be "bread and butter" articulations.
Click to expand...


Agreed. That's basically what I'm thinking too.


----------



## artinro

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

How's that testing going gents? :wink: 

Can't wait to hear another demo...


----------



## Sid Francis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

If not completely different products, it would be cool to see the line up like this:

CineStrings Core (Main articulations)
CineStrings Pro (More articulations and effects)
CineStrings Sordino
CineStrings Divisi
CineStrings Solo

A very good concept in my eyes...


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

CineSamples @ Wed Sep 25 said:


> Here are three examples of Hollywoodwinds + our new string runs mixed together:
> 
> *Bb Major Up/Down*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/7agxazpqynhpt8fmkxqb.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> *E Minor Up/Down*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/6rcrkq5qd52lzrgm4hum.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> *Gb Major Up*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/n1iwaklu0ckb6jn710dr.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> MP


----------



## BenG

Gabriel Oliveira @ Mon Sep 30 said:


> CineSamples @ Wed Sep 25 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here are three examples of Hollywoodwinds + our new string runs mixed together:
> 
> *Bb Major Up/Down*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/7agxazpqynhpt8fmkxqb.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> *E Minor Up/Down*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/6rcrkq5qd52lzrgm4hum.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> *Gb Major Up*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/n1iwaklu0ckb6jn710dr.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> MP
Click to expand...


Awesome!!!!!!!


----------



## kfirpr

Gabriel Oliveira @ Mon Sep 30 said:


> CineSamples @ Wed Sep 25 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here are three examples of Hollywoodwinds + our new string runs mixed together:
> 
> *Bb Major Up/Down*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/7agxazpqynhpt8fmkxqb.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> *E Minor Up/Down*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/6rcrkq5qd52lzrgm4hum.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> *Gb Major Up*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/n1iwaklu0ckb6jn710dr.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> MP
Click to expand...


It does sound spectacular, however I assume it is pre recorded runs right?


----------



## Guy Rowland

kfirpr @ Mon Sep 30 said:


> It does sound spectacular, however I assume it is pre recorded runs right?



Yes - HWW certainly is I'm sure HWS is in the same mould. One thing that set HWW apart all those years ago when it was released was that it used a form of timestretch that was MUCH better than Kontakt's own... I never knew how they did it, a form of slicing I guess. And it had such a good range of different runs rips and scales that, along with convincing tempo syncing, you were pretty well covered. I'd guess (?) HWS will use TMPro in K5, which works great.


----------



## lucianogiacomozzi

Guy Rowland @ Mon 30 Sep said:


> kfirpr @ Mon Sep 30 said:
> 
> 
> 
> It does sound spectacular, however I assume it is pre recorded runs right?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes - HWW certainly is I'm sure HWS is in the same mould. One thing that set HWW apart all those years ago when it was released was that it used a form of timestretch that was MUCH better than Kontakt's own... I never knew how they did it, a form of slicing I guess. And it had such a good range of different runs rips and scales that, along with convincing tempo syncing, you were pretty well covered. I'd guess (?) HWS will use TMPro in K5, which works great.
Click to expand...


I am looking forward to seeing how they update HWW to K5 and utilise it for both libraries. Obviously they can't use the name HWS though haha.


----------



## midi_controller

Gabriel Oliveira @ Mon Sep 30 said:


> CineSamples @ Wed Sep 25 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Here are three examples of Hollywoodwinds + our new string runs mixed together:
> 
> *Bb Major Up/Down*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/7agxazpqynhpt8fmkxqb.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> *E Minor Up/Down*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/6rcrkq5qd52lzrgm4hum.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> *Gb Major Up*
> [mp3]https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/n1iwaklu0ckb6jn710dr.mp3[/mp3]
> 
> MP
Click to expand...


Just so everyone knows, these runs are _not_ going to be included in CineStrings Core. Mike said that they were for a comparable product to Hollywoodwinds.

Looking forward to hearing more about Core though!


----------



## artinro

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Just noticed on the Cinesamples FB page that CineStrings Core was to be sent in to NI for encoding last Friday. Great news! 

I hope we'll be getting Mike's walkthrough video soon. Really looking forward to hearing the legatos! Any news Mikes?

Cheers and best of luck with finishing things up.


----------



## Enyak

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Looks like a end-of-November release is likely. Can't wait to hear more.


----------



## DDK

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I would like to see grace notes
I find it very use full 
Thanks


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

More audio demos while we wait would be super cool and exciting


----------



## Cinesamples

That's correct, CineStrings CORE is now in the hands of NI for encoding. This can take 2-6 weeks. We always plan for the worst (6 weeks), but if we get if back before then we'll try to release a bit early.


----------



## quantum7

Really looking forward to eventually seeing the walk-through videos.


----------



## muziksculp

CineSamples @ Mon Oct 14 said:


> That's correct, CineStrings CORE is now in the hands of NI for encoding. This can take 2-6 weeks. We always plan for the worst (6 weeks), but if we get if back before then we'll try to release a bit early.



Two weeks would be sweet  

Thanks for the feedback. Looking forward to use CineStrings o/~ 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## feck

CineSamples @ Mon Oct 14 said:


> That's correct, CineStrings CORE is now in the hands of NI for encoding. This can take 2-6 weeks. We always plan for the worst (6 weeks), but if we get if back before then we'll try to release a bit early.


Awesome...if you are so inclined to do a pre-order for any sort of an incentive, count me in!


----------



## 667

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

According to Daniel James' twitter he's doing a walkthru video of it as well...


----------



## paulmatthew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

I'm thinking of jumping in full bore and picking up the Cinewinds bundle , and Cinestrings when it comes out . Then I will have all Cinebrass, all Cinewinds , Cineperc Core and Cinestrings. Essentially a full Orchestra in one room :D 

Anyone else thinking of going for a full Cinesamples setup too as soon as the strings are released?


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



paulmatthew @ Mon Oct 14 said:


> I'm thinking of jumping in full bore and picking up the Cinewinds bundle , and Cinestrings when it comes out . Then I will have all Cinebrass, all Cinewinds , Cineperc Core and Cinestrings. Essentially a full Orchestra in one room :D
> 
> Anyone else thinking of going for a full Cinesamples setup too as soon as the strings are released?



Did CineSamples mention that they will be releasing new Brass & Woods recorded in the Sony hall, to match the upcoming CineStrings ? My plan is to wait for their Sony Hall versions of Brass & Woods. 

Any feedback on this ? 

Thnx


----------



## artinro

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



muziksculp @ Mon Oct 14 said:


> Did CineSamples mention that they will be releasing new Brass & Woods recorded in the Sony hall, to match the upcoming CineStrings ? My plan is to wait for their Sony Hall versions of Brass & Woods.
> 
> Any feedback on this ?
> 
> Thnx



CineBrass and CineWinds are recorded in the same space (Sony) as CineStrings (and CinePerc) so they should all match well.


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*



artinro @ Mon Oct 14 said:


> muziksculp @ Mon Oct 14 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Did CineSamples mention that they will be releasing new Brass & Woods recorded in the Sony hall, to match the upcoming CineStrings ? My plan is to wait for their Sony Hall versions of Brass & Woods.
> 
> Any feedback on this ?
> 
> Thnx
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CineBrass and CineWinds are recorded in the same space (Sony) as CineStrings (and CinePerc) so they should all match well.
Click to expand...


Yes, you are correct. I was under the (wrong) impression that they were not recorded at Sony Scoring Stage. But they are. 

Thanks for the feedback,
Muziksculp


----------



## benmrx

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Shorts Demo Added]*

Excited about this release! I love the GUI Cinesamples has come up with in regards to their whole 'Cine' range. Can't wait for the walk-thru videos.


----------



## Jem7

Yeah where is walkthrough videos? Gimme!


----------



## Cinesamples

Okay, we have official word from Native Instruments that CineStrings CORE is now done with Kontakt Player encoding. This is great news. Now we just need to complete the webpage and upload to our server.

Some have asked and here is a PDF showing the instruments and articulations of CineStrings CORE: https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared/static/2kppwas9k748skjbakfy.pdf (https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/shared ... jbakfy.pdf)

Everything is at 5 dynamic levels with up to 8RR. The legato transition charts were sampled at 4 velocities (that took forever). We also have Full-Ensemble patches, not listed.

"Enough already, Patti, show us the walkthrough videos"
... okay okay! Coming up...

MP


----------



## feck

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Awesome!


----------



## artinro

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Wow, NI worked quickly on this one. Can't wait to hear Mike's walkthrough.


----------



## BenG

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Hey Mike!

I'm really looking for to adding CineStrings to my template! 

I was wondering about the articulation list however; Will there be multiple types of legato such as portamento, glissando, bow change, etc., included? Or would that be something in the PRO expansion?


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Audio Demos would be very nice to hear o/~


----------



## korgscrew

Ben, I think those would be with cinestrings pro. 

To be fair, the core version looks great. Everything you need!

Price will be interesting!


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Also curious about pricing. The other 3 sections were very reasonable, in my opinion. Hoping this is in the same ballpark.


----------



## korgscrew

$399 for cinebrass core is a good competitive price point. 

With the sale on, even better! I doubt the sale will still be on when cinestrings comes out though!


----------



## Jem7

CineSamples @ 21/10/2013 said:


> "Enough already, Patti, show us the walkthrough videos"
> ... okay okay! Coming up...
> 
> MP



Absolutely! :lol:


----------



## Simon Ravn

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

I am seriously excited about this library! Wow....

HOWEVER, I see that sordinos are not in you "core" library, which is perfectly fine, but I really, REALLY hope that you will do proper, multi-velocity recorded legato sordinos - it just haven't been done properly yet and sordino playing can be used for so many things in the orchestral repertoire. Personally, I wish you would treat sordino playing almost as extensively as the regular recordings, i.e. record legato with vibrato (and even better, if you could do both with and without, but I think vibrato is most important for anything beyond p dynamics), staccatos, spiccatos, tremolos and trills. Add to that some great clusters and I think it could become an awesome (additional) library.

Apart from that, I can't wait to try this one out!


----------



## Enyak

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

"First Chair" mics? Very cool!


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

most excited about the first chairs allowing us to create 'size and detail' as required. Please walk through that and 'show' examples of.....

:wink:


----------



## BenG

korgscrew @ Tue Oct 22 said:


> Ben, I think those would be with cinestrings pro.
> 
> To be fair, the core version looks great. Everything you need!
> 
> Price will be interesting!



Ah, I see. I hope PRO is in the not to distant future as well


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



Simon Ravn @ Tue Oct 22 said:


> I am seriously excited about this library! Wow....
> 
> HOWEVER, I see that sordinos are not in you "core" library, which is perfectly fine, but I really, REALLY hope that you will do proper, multi-velocity recorded legato sordinos - it just haven't been done properly yet and sordino playing can be used for so many things in the orchestral repertoire.



Totally agree, but I'll bet that is what is going to make up the bulk of CineStrings Pro. Con sord is everywhere in film scores, so it would be kind of strange for the Mikes to skip over it.

The consistency in articulations between sections is very impressive, as are those 5 dynamics on _everything_ (totally didn't expect that one). I can't wait to see the walkthrough!

Looks like this one is going to put our computers through their paces for sure, so I'm wondering if they will also include some patches that are lighter on polyphony for those with older systems or laptops.


----------



## paulmatthew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Have there been any official announcements yet as to the release date and price of Cinestrings Core now that encoding is complete?


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

using Cinebrass EXTENSIVELY today on a cue. Man that ROOM!!!!!!!! Really looking forward to hearing how strings sound at Sony (of course we all love how they sound on 'scores' - just hoping it 'translate' to samples.) Me thinks it will - just based on the Brass (I don't have the wds -- yet). Pretty pleased with BWW and VSL.


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Thanks Rob!!!

I cannot wait to get this library into all of your hands. We are writing demos and testing the library over here, and when you bring in our percussion, winds, brass - WOW! (and I am trying to be unbiased as possible here) It sounds like I at the podium, in the room at MGM/Sony. We are so happy with how this is coming out. 

Stay tuned for videos and demos shortly... just making sure everything is working with the encoding and patches!

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## paulmatthew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



maest @ Wed Oct 23 said:


> Thanks Rob!!!
> 
> I cannot wait to get this library into all of your hands. We are writing demos and testing the library over here, and when you bring in our percussion, winds, brass - WOW! (and I am trying to be unbiased as possible here) It sounds like I at the podium, in the room at MGM/Sony. We are so happy with how this is coming out.
> 
> Stay tuned for videos and demos shortly... just making sure everything is working with the encoding and patches!
> 
> Best,
> 
> Sam Estes
> Manager, Cinesamples



This is exactly why I picked up the Woodwinds during the sale . So I can have all my Cine - Brass, Winds , Perc, and now Strings together in the same room. :D


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

I have a new score where BOTH the temp tracks were recorded on that STAGE. Man, I don't need ANOTHER wds library. I'll probably start with the strings and see how BWW plays with them.


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Will there be an introductory, limited time discount ?


----------



## Darryl Jackson

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Another vote for more info on pricing!  I'm very likely sold either way though- both Cinebrass Core and CinePerc Core/Pro turned out to be exactly what I was looking for.


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



Darryl Jackson @ Thu Oct 24 said:


> Another vote for more info on pricing!  I'm very likely sold either way though- both Cinebrass Core and CinePerc Core/Pro turned out to be exactly what I was looking for.



If past performance is anything to go by, CS only announce prices at launch.

I'm keen to find out about the HollyWoodWinds style string stuff - wonder if that is in Pro or if its a self-contained product?


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Sounds good guys. that's cool that you have the full multi-dynamic solos in Core as well, as opposed to CineBrass Core where the solos are cut down versions. 5 dynamics is pretty impressive indeed.

By the way, has Cinestrings put the Cinewinds and Cinebrass updates on hold? So we can expect those to be the focus after Cinestrings is out?


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



Guy Rowland @ Thu Oct 24 said:


> I'm keen to find out about the HollyWoodWinds style string stuff - wonder if that is in Pro or if its a self-contained product?



I'm hoping it will be in another product, more products hopefully means more content.

@Echos in the Attic: There actually isn't any solos in Core at all, just a first chair / spot mic. Also, Cinebrass 1.5 just came out a few months ago.


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



Echoes in the Attic @ Thu Oct 24 said:


> By the way, has Cinestrings put the Cinewinds and Cinebrass updates on hold? So we can expect those to be the focus after Cinestrings is out?



Hey Echoes: CineWinds Update is coming out prior to CineStrings release. Expect this very shortly. New patches and new instruments, quite a hefty free update. I just finished the walkthrough of this, just working on getting the website stuff sorted.

MP


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



midi_controller @ Thu Oct 24 said:


> Guy Rowland @ Thu Oct 24 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm keen to find out about the HollyWoodWinds style string stuff - wonder if that is in Pro or if its a self-contained product?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm hoping it will be in another product, more products hopefully means more content.
> 
> @Echos in the Attic: There actually isn't any solos in Core at all, just a first chair / spot mic. Also, Cinebrass 1.5 just came out a few months ago.
Click to expand...


Sorry, first chair is what I meant. I thought it could be used like a solo to do individual passages over the rest. Is this not the intent? Too much bleed from the rest of the Orchestra you think?

As for Cinebrass, I was talking about the update to 1.5 that has been mentioned. They mentioned months ago they were going to be putting out a sort of hotfix to modify a few things, but I think it turned out to be a bigger update. So I was curious how that was going.


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



CineSamples @ Thu Oct 24 said:


> Echoes in the Attic @ Thu Oct 24 said:
> 
> 
> 
> By the way, has Cinestrings put the Cinewinds and Cinebrass updates on hold? So we can expect those to be the focus after Cinestrings is out?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hey Echoes: CineWinds Update is coming out prior to CineStrings release. Expect this very shortly. New patches and new instruments, quite a hefty free update. I just finished the walkthrough of this, just working on getting the website stuff sorted.
> 
> MP
Click to expand...


Cool! I thought maybe all hands would be on deck for Cinestrings. Great to see you guys are multi-tasking! 

Looking forward to the walkthrough. Love your walkthroughs.


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

@Echoes,

Unfortunately the brass 1.5.1 is a bigger ordeal. It has to do with the script. We re-wrote ALL of our scripts for Cinestrings to accommodate some of the suggestions you guys had (control over the the overlay samples, control over the modwheel volume depth, etc) They are MASSIVE changes - look forward to hearing what you guys think of how these work now. On the surface it will feel like the same "cine" line, but there is much more under the hood now... (MORE TO COME ON THAT WHEN WE RELEASE)

We tried to sneak some of the code into the Winds update (since we didn't need to re-encode it was easier), but the original code, really won't allow for some of these changes - and then we have to also re-encode brass with NI again - so we are planning a bigger update on Brass at the moment, if we can interface it, we will try. We hear you all and I desperately want to address it to make the Brass even better!

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## Guy Rowland

Loving that news Sam, thanks - really appreciate the many extra miles you've all gone over CineBrass!


----------



## Rob Elliott

Guy Rowland @ Fri Oct 25 said:


> Loving that news Sam, thanks - really appreciate the many extra miles you've all gone over CineBrass!


+1


----------



## olajideparis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Would be great if you could sneak in some new demos too or at least a walkthrough of the new features of Cinewinds. I'm looking to pull the trigger on a winds library soon but wasn't too impressed by the first iteration so if there are significant improvements that have been made I would definitely want to hear/see them in action. Really looking forward to seeing what you guys came up with.


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



maest @ Fri Oct 25 said:


> @Echoes,
> 
> Unfortunately the brass 1.5.1 is a bigger ordeal. It has to do with the script. We re-wrote ALL of our scripts for Cinestrings to accommodate some of the suggestions you guys had (control over the the overlay samples, control over the modwheel volume depth, etc) They are MASSIVE changes - look forward to hearing what you guys think of how these work now. On the surface it will feel like the same "cine" line, but there is much more under the hood now... (MORE TO COME ON THAT WHEN WE RELEASE)
> 
> We tried to sneak some of the code into the Winds update (since we didn't need to re-encode it was easier), but the original code, really won't allow for some of these changes - and then we have to also re-encode brass with NI again - so we are planning a bigger update on Brass at the moment, if we can interface it, we will try. We hear you all and I desperately want to address it to make the Brass even better!
> 
> Best,
> 
> Sam Estes
> Manager, Cinesamples



As usual, great to hear that you guys are constantly improving and re-inventing and always listening to customers. Looking forward to Cinewinds update for sure.


----------



## JE Martinsen

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



maest @ Fri Oct 25 said:


> We tried to sneak some of the code into the Winds update (since we didn't need to re-encode it was easier), but the original code, really won't allow for some of these changes - and then we have to also re-encode brass with NI again - so we are planning a bigger update on Brass at the moment, if we can interface it, we will try. We hear you all and I desperately want to address it to make the Brass even better!



This is one of the things that are driving me towards investing in my first Cinesamples libraries. Some companies may release a product that is in need of and /or would gain from significant updates and improvements further down the line. But the urge to work on new exciting products may in some cases bump those updates and improvements a few notches down on the to-do list.

You have rightfully earned a great reputation for your customer service and your will and ability to update and constantly improve upon the products in your catalogue. Another update in the works for CineBrass? Well, I'm getting this library asap. The brass I have is bone dry and more "classical" sounding (which I also like) and although you can put some great IR's on it, the sound of CineBrass just blows me away.

If I may ask a couple of questions.. After the fall sale, will CineBrass (CORE) go up to $399? Did they cost $499 at any time? I may not remember correctly but I thought I'd seen reduced prices for CineBrass etc for quite some time? Perhaps I get the impression because you so often have sales.

Also, do you have any plans of putting together a CORE bundle with CineWinds/CineBrass/CineStrings/CinePerc?

Yeah, and will there be an intro price for CineStrings? :lol: 

All the best,


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Talking about CineBrass, and CineBrass Pro. They have a bundle Discount for both these libraries at $ 598.50 The Sale ends Oct. 31st. 

I'm still trying to make up my mind if I should get the CineBrass bundle by Oct. 31. 

I'm guessing they sound very different from VSL Brass, EW Hollywood Brass, and other Brass libraries, since they were recorded in the Sony Stage, and have a unique sonic character due to the ambience of the Sony Stage. and possibly the scripting features make it a great library to have. 

I might look into getting the CineWinds bundle in the future. How popular are they compared to VSL-Woodwinds ? or Berlin Woodwinds ? ..etc. ?

Oh.. and it would be wonderful if CineStrings have a limited time Introductory Price to help ease the financial strain on my Credit Card. :lol: 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



muziksculp @ Fri Oct 25 said:


> Oh.. and it would be wonderful if CineStrings have a limited time Introductory Price to help ease the financial strain on my Credit Card. :lol:



Agreed! Does anyone know if they did this for the other Cine libraries?

Since I've been looking at replacing almost my whole sampled orchestra to stuff that runs in Kontakt, I've just been really, really impressed with Cinesamples customer service and commitment to fixing _and_ improving their libraries. Just waiting on the walkthrough before I make the jump at this point.

Also, something to keep in mind, my little bit of Googling shows that Cinesamples usually has a pretty awesome Black Friday sale, if you can wait for it.


----------



## BenG

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



muziksculp @ Fri Oct 25 said:


> Talking about CineBrass, and CineBrass Pro. They have a bundle Discount for both these libraries at $ 598.50 The Sale ends Oct. 31st.
> 
> I'm still trying to make up my mind if I should get the CineBrass bundle by Oct. 31.



I was just asking myself the same question yesterday until I finally pulled the trigger. I now have Core and Pro and I have been testing them out with my template. They sound amazing!!!! 

I am currently working on a game that very "Starwars-ey" and the brass bundle shines perfectly! The 1.5 update really helped and I'm reading there might be more updates the road Very satisfied. 

Looking forward to CineStrings!


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



BenG @ Fri Oct 25 said:


> muziksculp @ Fri Oct 25 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Talking about CineBrass, and CineBrass Pro. They have a bundle Discount for both these libraries at $ 598.50 The Sale ends Oct. 31st.
> 
> I'm still trying to make up my mind if I should get the CineBrass bundle by Oct. 31.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was just asking myself the same question yesterday until I finally pulled the trigger. I now have Core and Pro and I have been testing them out with my template. They sound amazing!!!!
> 
> I am currently working on a game that very "Starwars-ey" and the brass bundle shines perfectly! The 1.5 update really helped and I'm reading there might be more updates the road Very satisfied.
> 
> Looking forward to CineStrings!
Click to expand...


Hi BenG,

Congratulations on your CineBrass bundle purchase. I'm glad you are very happy with them, and as you say .. They sound amazing ! Which is kind of pushing me to pull the trigger on the Brass bundle before Oct. 31st. 

Do you also have CineWinds ? 

I'm curious to know how they compare to other Woodwind libraries ? 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## paulmatthew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Check these topics for info regarding Cinewinds and other Woodwinds:

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=33735&highlight=cinewinds

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=33156&highlight=cinewinds

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=29936&highlight=cinewinds


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



paulmatthew @ Fri Oct 25 said:


> Check these topics for info regarding Cinewinds and other Woodwinds:
> 
> http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=33735&highlight=cinewinds
> 
> http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=33156&highlight=cinewinds
> 
> http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=29936&highlight=cinewinds



Hi paulmatthew,

Thanks for the links. I will check them out.


----------



## rottoy

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

What's the estimated release date, would you think?
Will this skyrocket out of the VERY reasonable
price range of the rest of the Cine series?


I've been planning to purchase a bread and butter strings
library for a while now, and this seem to shape up to be
THE strings library. :D 

I'm psyched, you guys rock! =o


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Knowing the price of CineString would help me plan my purchase of the CineBrass Bundle, before the end of the discount special, which ends Oct. 31st. 

I'm guessing the price should have been determined by now. 

Hopefully we will know the Price before Oct. 31st. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## TSU

I think that price will be from $400 to $600. It is hard to imagine that core version can be priced lower or higher than that.


----------



## paulmatthew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

I'm guessing in the neighborhood of $349 - $449 . I figure the bundle of Cinestrings would run about $700-$900 max . I'm sure they will beat the total price of Sable , LASS , and Adagio strings. Cinesamples is good about keeping their libraries in that" just right zone " where it's just enough for one to be able to afford at least Core or Pro at some point.


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

I am calling it. $999 for core, $1099 for Pro.


----------



## paulmatthew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



RiffWraith @ Mon Oct 28 said:


> I am calling it. $999 for core, $1099 for Pro.



Buy Core for $999 , get Pro for $1


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



RiffWraith @ Mon Oct 28 said:


> I am calling it. $999 for core, $1099 for Pro.



Quiet you! Stop putting bad ideas in their heads!

I doubt it will be that much, considering that it just wouldn't be a competitive price at all. $400 is also way too low, the amount of material this library has is much higher than CineBrass Core, and also took quite a bit more money to record. We'll see soon enough!

I'm guessing the release date might be around mid-November since the CineWinds update will come out first. I just hope we get a walkthrough video soon, that shorts teaser got me really curious to hear how the rest of the library sounds.


----------



## artinro

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



midi_controller @ Mon Oct 28 said:


> I'm guessing the release date might be around mid-November since the CineWinds update will come out first. I just hope we get a walkthrough video soon, that shorts teaser got me really curious to hear how the rest of the library sounds.



Looks like the CineWinds update is already out (just checked the page). Now...onto that CineStrings walkthrough...Mike? :wink:


----------



## paulmatthew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Thanks for the heads up on that , been waiting on these. Jumped on the downloads already. o=?


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Considering there are already so many great ones on the market (CS2, LASS, HS, etc) I'm hoping the price is competitively low enough to justify picking up yet another string library. Seriously hoping each volume is in the same range as the other Cine products ($400). Don't know why they'd suddenly bump one up dramatically.


----------



## Casey Edwards

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



Maestro77 @ Mon Oct 28 said:


> Don't know why they'd suddenly bump one up dramatically.



Can't say that they will or won't, but when you have roughly 4x the players on the clock don't be surprised if the price is slightly higher than previous releases. Then again, maybe CS is the kind of company that has enough overhead pricing to where they can keep prices decently around the same average. Only time will tell.


----------



## Cinesamples

CineWinds Update is now behind us! Phew... if you haven't picked it up, please do, this is quite a hefty update. Free oboe 2 and contrabass clarinet additional patches for owners.

http://cinesamples.com/cinewinds-update/


----------



## Cinesamples

All hands on strings stuff now. Barreling towards release...


----------



## rottoy

CineSamples @ Tue Oct 29 said:


> All hands on strings stuff now. Barreling towards release...


*sweats* B-b-ut.. The pricing....
I have to know!

The suspense is killing me.


----------



## dcoscina

Gentlemen. Not sure why there's anxiety about pricing. Mike & Mike have been pretty consistent with their price points thus far. I don't see that changing dramatically for CineStrings. It will be what it will be.


----------



## Guy Rowland

dcoscina @ Tue Oct 29 said:


> Gentlemen. Not sure why there's anxiety about pricing. Mike & Mike have been pretty consistent with their price points thus far. I don't see that changing dramatically for CineStrings. It will be what it will be.



+1. And as I said in an earlier post, the CS policy seems to be to price only on release, making the endless calls for advance info even more perplexing.


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

hey! Shorts Release Layer will be on CB updates too?


----------



## artinro

CineSamples @ Mon Oct 21 said:


> "Enough already, Patti, show us the walkthrough videos"
> ... okay okay! Coming up...
> 
> MP



How 'bout it Mike? Dying to hear what you good folks have cooked up o/~


----------



## Sid Francis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

If it´s already in the encoding process I hope for more than a shorts demo. Its quite easy to make good shorts in my opinion but the real challenge are the legato longs. And since they are ready.... 8)


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Hopefully it will be released next week, with some cool, and in-depth walkthroughs, and a healthy doze of audio demos. And... Pricing info. too. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Here's a bump. Really hungry for more info and the release. Just built a new template and reserved a front row seat for these guys. Give us a few crumbs, Mikes!


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Another bump


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*

Walkthrough of the Hairpin Creator tool in CineStrings CORE:


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

Sounds great!


----------



## feck

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



CineSamples @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> Walkthrough of the Hairpin Creator tool in CineStrings CORE:


Sounds killer - what a great feature!


----------



## tmm

Oh my.... and it's all in Kontakt, so you can assign those parameters and change your swell characteristics in real time through CC. I can see that being pretty phenomenal.


----------



## Daniel James

I will be doing an overview video for CineStrings very soon  here is the little track I wrote to dissect  NOTE: NOT AN OFFICIAL DEMO DAMMIT 

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F119200944&secret_url=false[/flash][

https://soundcloud.com/hybridtwo/gloria ... rings-core 

-DJ


----------



## Guy Rowland

That's a fine sound there, CS and DJ...


----------



## Graham Keitch

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

Go easy on the percussion Daniel! It's a bit OTT! :oops: 

The hairpin creator looks very useful. Finale HP has had a similar but less flexible feature for years - but good to see it implemented in a Kontakt library


Graham o-[][]-o


----------



## mac4d

Daniel James @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> I will be doing an overview video for CineStrings very soon  here is the little demo I wrote to dissect
> 
> [flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F119200944&secret_url=false[/flash][
> 
> https://soundcloud.com/hybridtwo/gloria ... rings-core
> 
> -DJ


Cool, but how about a naked cinestrings core version. 8)


----------



## reddognoyz

what Daniel write over the top?? never!! Daniel's middle name is restraint! ( so not) great and powerful track. It reminds me of JW's score for Lincoln. : )


----------



## ed buller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

Gorgeous Sound......

e


----------



## germancomponist

I am not so impressed yet, but maybe later after listening to more pure samples?


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

@ CineSamples ,

Thanks for the new feature video. Very nice to have this type of control. 

Looking forward to the official release of CineStrings, Pricing, and more Audio/Video demos. 

@ Daniel James,

Very enjoyable Epic style demo using CineStrings ! (Thanks) 

The Strings are hard to hear, since they are a bit overshadowed by the Brass, and Perc.

Maybe another audio demo that exposes CineStrings would be more helpful for evaluation. I look forward to enjoy your CineStrings Walkthrough Videos. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

Very nice. Great to see the patch list, too. Really glad you're including full ensemble patches. No complaints from me, other than the fact that I can't buy it yet.


----------



## Daniel James

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



muziksculp @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> @ CineSamples ,
> 
> Thanks for the new feature video. Very nice to have this type of control.
> 
> Looking forward to the official release of CineStrings, Pricing, and more Audio/Video demos.
> 
> @ Daniel James,
> 
> Very enjoyable Epic style demo using CineStrings ! (Thanks)
> 
> The Strings are hard to hear, since they are a bit overshadowed by the Brass, and Perc.
> 
> Maybe another audio demo that exposes CineStrings would be more helpful for evaluation. I look forward to enjoy your CineStrings Walkthrough Videos.
> 
> Cheers,
> Muziksculp



Haha thats half the point. I always structure my demo cues to give me plenty to talk about. So the intro is all about the legato in an exposed setting. Then I show how the lib sounds when part of a larger section. Then at the end how well it does soft when completely naked.

Very few people will write string only pieces so I try to show libs in as many different situations as the track allows for. 

-DJ


----------



## reddognoyz

reddognoyz @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> what Daniel write over the top?? never!! Daniel's middle name is restraint! ( so not) great and powerful track. It reminds me of JW's score for Lincoln. : )



I read this after I posted it, and realized it could be misconstrued. I hope the context was taken correctly. 

great and powerful track! yes it is...

The "so not" being in reference to DJ's complete and utter lack of restraint in making his awesome epic tracks.


----------



## korgscrew

germancomponist @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> I am not so impressed yet, but maybe later after listening to more pure samples?



+1

I'd really like to hear these as a standard section. 

Daniels demo is great and all, but it's covered with brass and percussion and is compressed. something a little lighter would be nice. Maybe something like a traditional Williams style piece, something that uses the strings to their full potential, and not for some ostinatos and supporting lines. 

I've been burned before by dressed demos. No names...


----------



## mark812

korgscrew @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> Daniels demo is great and all, but it's covered with brass and percussion and is compressed. something a little lighter would be nice. Maybe something like a traditional Williams style piece, something that uses the strings to their full potential, and not for some ostinatos and supporting lines.



Or maybe something like this: http://grooveshark.com/#!/s/Tangiers/3VNdNk?src=5

:D


----------



## Daniel James

korgscrew @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> germancomponist @ Sat Nov 09 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am not so impressed yet, but maybe later after listening to more pure samples?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +1
> 
> I'd really like to hear these as a standard section.
> 
> Daniels demo is great and all, but it's covered with brass and percussion and is compressed. something a little lighter would be nice. Maybe something like a traditional Williams style piece, something that uses the strings to their full potential, and not for some ostinatos and supporting lines.
> 
> I've been burned before by dressed demos. No names...
Click to expand...


Again just for the record I deliberately do this with my demo cues. Most people who use a string library will most likely at some point cover it in brass percussion and compress it. Thats why I include sections like that, to show how the library sounds in context of a track....That is also why I have softer front and end sections where it is all about the strings by themselves 

I am sure you will hear some JW style stuff with them at some point, I just do what I do 

Oh and my demo isn't an official demo btw, this is just for the purpose of my overview video! I hope Mike does one, I love his tracks!

-DJ


----------



## korgscrew

Haha, things don't come across well over typing 

I was hinting that there doesn't seen to be many softer demos of late. I wasn't pointing any fingers. That's your bag, which is fine. Cine samples should give me a copy so can do something like this... :wink: :wink: 

http://youtu.be/AFmkjBqkloA


----------



## mac4d

Daniel James @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> korgscrew @ Fri Nov 08 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> germancomponist @ Sat Nov 09 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am not so impressed yet, but maybe later after listening to more pure samples?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +1
> 
> I'd really like to hear these as a standard section.
> 
> Daniels demo is great and all, but it's covered with brass and percussion and is compressed. something a little lighter would be nice. Maybe something like a traditional Williams style piece, something that uses the strings to their full potential, and not for some ostinatos and supporting lines.
> 
> I've been burned before by dressed demos. No names...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again just for the record I deliberately do this with my demo cues. Most people who use a string library will most likely at some point cover it in brass percussion and compress it. Thats why I include sections like that, to show how the library sounds in context of a track....That is also why I have softer front and end sections where it is all about the strings by themselves
> 
> I am sure you will hear some JW style stuff with them at some point, I just do what I do
> 
> Oh and my demo isn't an official demo btw, this is just for the purpose of my overview video! I hope Mike does one, I love his tracks!
> 
> -DJ
Click to expand...

Doesn't remotely explain why you can't put up a naked version too. Are they really that bad naked?


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

Daniel hasn't had nearly enough time or experience with the library to be held solely responsible for everyone's critical first impression of CineStrings. Be patient, folks. I'm sure there'll be plenty of fine demos to wow us very soon.


----------



## midi_controller

korgscrew @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> Daniels demo is great and all, but it's covered with brass and percussion and is compressed. something a little lighter would be nice. Maybe something like a traditional Williams style piece, something that uses the strings to their full potential, and not for some ostinatos and supporting lines.



Maybe something like this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcOXOY_jCqM (John Williams - Born on the Fourth of July - The Early Days, Massapequa)

That is the kind of thing I'm looking for in a strings demo. Lush strings that have character and expression, enough to stand on their own. When drown under brass and percussion, you can get away with a whole hell of a lot, pieces like this one are much less forgiving. No offense to Daniel though, you do what you do and I have no problem with that, it's just that I can picture string libraries I already have doing something similar without too much trouble.


----------



## Daniel James

mac4d @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> Daniel James @ Fri Nov 08 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> korgscrew @ Fri Nov 08 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> germancomponist @ Sat Nov 09 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am not so impressed yet, but maybe later after listening to more pure samples?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +1
> 
> I'd really like to hear these as a standard section.
> 
> Daniels demo is great and all, but it's covered with brass and percussion and is compressed. something a little lighter would be nice. Maybe something like a traditional Williams style piece, something that uses the strings to their full potential, and not for some ostinatos and supporting lines.
> 
> I've been burned before by dressed demos. No names...
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Again just for the record I deliberately do this with my demo cues. Most people who use a string library will most likely at some point cover it in brass percussion and compress it. Thats why I include sections like that, to show how the library sounds in context of a track....That is also why I have softer front and end sections where it is all about the strings by themselves
> 
> I am sure you will hear some JW style stuff with them at some point, I just do what I do
> 
> Oh and my demo isn't an official demo btw, this is just for the purpose of my overview video! I hope Mike does one, I love his tracks!
> 
> -DJ
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> Doesn't remotely explain why you can't put up a naked version too. Are they really that bad naked?
Click to expand...


The naked version will be in my overview video  The library sounds great! It handles the epic stuff so easily, the shorts are nice and snappy!

-DJ


----------



## quantum7

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



CineSamples @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> Walkthrough of the Hairpin Creator tool in CineStrings CORE:




EDIT: *OK, at first I listened from my living room entertainment system....which is good quality, but then I went upstairs to my home studio and fired up my trusty Focal twins and got online to take a 2nd listen. I don't hear what I originally thought was a bit of top-end noise. My bad! Sounds great and i really LOVE the hairpin tool.  Oh boy, I may have to decide if I do need another string lib. * 

Big Cinesamples fan- I own Cinebrass & Cineperc and am VERY happy with those libs. That said, though, is it me, or do the strings in this video sound a bit noisy? Hopefully it's just the video. Look forward to the eventual walk-through video.


----------



## Jordan Gagne

germancomponist @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> I am not so impressed yet, but maybe later after listening to more pure samples?



Yeah, glad I'm not the only one. It's happening more and more often where I'm reading a commercial announcements thread and everyone is posting about how great it sounds, meanwhile I'm sitting here wondering if I'm the only one that doesn't think it sounds that great? I get that it's a small community and a fairly public forum, and some of us have our real names easily visible (like yours truly), so everyone is a little bit wary of openly criticizing developers or libraries at the risk of coming across in a negative light.

It's still probably too early to tell but my ears hear these strings as kind of synthy. The hairpin creator is a brilliant idea but the transitions seem, well, not so natural (I realize it's not a legato patch but even so). I'll reserve judgement as the shorts do sound good, but in the 2013/2014 landscape where there's Sable, LASS, CS2, and Adagio all with some great string sounds, the standard for strings is just so high.


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

Sorry, but I think these strings sound great. 

Sean - where are you hearing noise? Admittedly, I didn't have the volume up that much, but I don't hear anything...

In terms of the transitions - guys, we have all gotten spoiled, and I think many of us expect too much. Well, you just can't expect the transitions of a string lib to sound like the real thing when someone (even one of the devs) is sitting there playing block chords. In fact, you can't expect the transitions of a string lib to sound like the real thing,_ period_. Ain't gonna happen, regardless of how well played, recorded and programmed the lib is. Samples are samples and real is real. Two different animals. Doesn't mean that samples cant get close.... but with what CS has done in the past, with what EW is doing, with what SF is doing... I think people at this point, _actually expect it to sound like the real thing_. That's expecting too much.

midi_controller - That is the kind of thing you are looking for in a strings demo? _Not going to happen. _ Those strings are real, played by some of the best players on the planet. No sample lib - regardless of the players - is going to sound like that.

Daniel - I liked your demo. Save for the (I am assuming unwanted  ) low end distortion on those big hits. I would love to hear a naked demo of that (str only). Looking forward to your vid. 

Cheers.


----------



## artinro

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



RiffWraith @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> Sorry, but I think these strings sound great.
> 
> Sean - where are you hearing noise? Admittedly, I didn't have the volume up that much, but I don't hear anything...
> 
> In terms of the transitions - guys, we have all gotten spoiled, and I think many of us expect too much. Well, you just can't expect the transitions of a string lib to sound like the real thing when someone (even one of the devs) is sitting there playing block chords. In fact, you can't expect the transitions of a string lib to sound like the real thing,_ period_. Ain't gonna happen, regardless of how well played, recorded and programmed the lib is. Samples are samples and real is real. Two different animals. Doesn't mean that samples cant get close.... but with what CS has done in the past, with what EW is doing, with what SF is doing... I think people at this point, _actually expect it to sound like the real thing_. That's expecting too much.
> 
> midi_controller - That is the kind of thing you are looking for in a strings demo? _Not going to happen. _ Those strings are real, played by some of the best players on the planet. No sample lib - regardless of the players - is going to sound like that.
> 
> Daniel - I liked your demo. Save for the (I am assuming unwanted  ) low end distortion on those big hits. I would love to hear a naked demo of that (str only). Looking forward to your vid.
> 
> Cheers.



+1 

And, regarding transitions, I don't think the patch Mike was playing in that video is even meant to have them. To me, that patch just looks like a full ensemble patch with sustains and no "true legato" like the individual sections. 

Looking forward to the full walk through videos. Hopefully they'll be up within a day or so...


----------



## paulmatthew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

The hairpin feature is a great scripting idea and can't wait to how it sounds in the other patches. The patch featured in the demo was long sustains only . Looking forward to Mike's full patch walk through and Daniel's full Cinestrings Core overview.


----------



## Jordan Gagne

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



RiffWraith @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> In terms of the transitions - guys, we have all gotten spoiled, and I think many of us expect too much. Well, you just can't expect the transitions of a string lib to sound like the real thing when someone (even one of the devs) is sitting there playing block chords. In fact, you can't expect the transitions of a string lib to sound like the real thing,_ period_. Ain't gonna happen, regardless of how well played, recorded and programmed the lib is. Samples are samples and real is real. Two different animals. Doesn't mean that samples cant get close.... but with what CS has done in the past, with what EW is doing, with what SF is doing... I think people at this point, _actually expect it to sound like the real thing_. That's expecting too much.



I don't think anybody expects it to make a 40 piece string section obselete, but I don't think it's unreasonable to, given the abundance of string libraries and quality of the options out there, expect a sound as good or better as any library to date. The pricing will be similar (yes, Cinesamples divides things up so the sections of the libraries are cheaper, but altogether Cinestrings will most likely be comparable to LASS, CS2, Sable, etc, in price). But if it doesn't sound as good as those, then what's the point in buying it unless it's considerably less expensive?

But anyway, we're getting way ahead of ourselves. I'm not saying Cinestrings is inferior, I was mainly just taking exception to your argument :lol: . It's still early.


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



RiffWraith @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> midi_controller - That is the kind of thing you are looking for in a strings demo? _Not going to happen. _ Those strings are real, played by some of the best players on the planet. No sample lib - regardless of the players - is going to sound like that.



Well I meant I wanted a demo to be more in that vein but I'm going to wholeheartedly disagree with you that a sample library can't get close to that. It's never going to sound as good as live players, but there are certain things we can start to expect at this point in the game. Space, sound, balance and expressiveness should be on top of the list for anyone attempting to make a sample library of strings.

The thing about that piece is that it's pretty simple. There isn't anything that would be hard for almost any competent players to do. I don't think it's a stretch to expect a sample library to be able to do an approximation of it, and as a matter of fact, the very first thing I do with any new string library is try to mock up this very piece. It seems like the more expressive the samples, the better they do with it.

Another good example of something a modern string library should be able to do is the https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqtPVEuAbzM (beginning of the second movement of Beethoven's 7th). Again, nothing too complicated here, but the samples need to have a natural expressive quality and room to breathe or it will sound like mush.

No offense Riff, but I think you are aiming way too low if you think this kind of thing is impossible to realize with samples. There are things that they won't ever be able to do as well as live players, and live players will always be able to bring more life and character compared to samples, but if we can't write beautiful flowing melodies and harmonies with a sampled string library, something is wrong with it.

Now in regards to the video, I also thought it sounded a bit "padlike", but I think I might know why. First, I think the dynamic curve is a bit off. When it was set to pp to mf, the arc was so subtle you could almost miss it. Having a more dramatic curve might help a bit. Also, there seemed to be very little vibrato as well, but I think that might have been because Mike didn't have the vibrato CC turned up very high. It might also be possible that when he turned on the "link crescendo and vibrato" option, that the vibrato only goes up as high as the crescendo, which means that theoretically it's only going to go to the standard vibrato at the mf range, instead of the expressive vibrato range that it hits when the dynamic is set a bit higher. From listening to sampled cres-dim, it seems like players tend to get expressive a lot earlier, and that might give the sections a bit more identity and prevent it from sounding as homogenous.

I'm not giving up yet, I really want to hear the detailed walkthrough, and I hope it is _very_ detailed. I want to hear melodic lines played at multiple dynamic layers, using all three different vibratos so I can really get a handle on what this sucker can do. And even though my purchase will mainly hinge on whether or not it can do flowing melodic lines convincingly, I'd really like to hear the other articulations as multiple dynamics as well, and how well they work together (like marcatos at pp going into sustains, that kind of thing).

Fingers crossed!


----------



## Harcourt

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

Thanks for the video demo Mike. I was wondering if you are considering preparing VST Expression Maps to go along with your new library?
The hairpin feature looks very promising, and it would be great to be able to integrate it into these maps. I'm assuming it will be possible to control hairpin parameters via some kind of MIDI automation, keyswitches/cc combinations - or whatever. 

Looking forward to the release!

Tom


----------



## Arbee

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

Am I missing something? a track played with two hands blocking chords is never, ever going to show a strings library at its best. And I don't think this was the purpose of the video. Perhaps we need a little more patience to hear this in the context of separate voice leading lines before passing judgement? Just saying....

.


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



Arbee @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> Am I missing something? a track played with two hands blocking chords is never, ever going to show a strings library at its best. And I don't think this was the purpose of the video. Perhaps we need a little more patience to hear this in the context of separate voice leading lines before passing judgement? Just saying....
> 
> .



A big +1. While this thankfully hasn't (yet) plumbed the depths of the inexplicable rudeness and false representation which accompanied their free CinePerc patch (and imo to date still the most risible performance from VI mod in the forum's history and no I'm still not over it) I get to wonder why the harsh negativity towards this fine developer in a commercial announcements thread? CS are consistently open, friendly and responsive to customer requests.

All we have so far is a clever new feature demo based on a single sustain ensemble - and thus to be compared only with other sustain ensemble patches with are all either pre-baked or, yes, "pad-like" - and a terrific huge-epic-all-guns-blazing-daniel-james-style track, with a detailed walkthrough to come. Comments along the lines of "is it really so terrible that you can't give us a naked version" are, imo, pathetic, ignorant and breathtakingly rude. Come on people, VI-C should be better than this.

[STOMPS OFF TO CORNER OF ROOM MUMBLING INCOHERENTLY WITH CARTOON BLACK CLOUD OVER HEAD, KICKING SOME KIDS TOYS ON THE WAY. CLOUDS SUDDENLY PART]

Looking forward to the walkthroughs, chaps. Really liking that bite I hear in the low shorts in the DJ track. I'm awash with string libs so its not really been on my radar, but...


----------



## mac4d

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



Guy Rowland @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> Comments along the lines of "is it really so terrible that you can't give us a naked version" are, imo, pathetic, ignorant and breathtakingly rude.


It's none of those things. What I wrote that was similar to this was a veiled attempt to try to get DJ to release a naked version. It didn't work, but was worth a try, to me. You've taken it way too seriously. DJ didn't.


----------



## korgscrew

I don't think any of the naked comments are meant as being rude or pathetic. I haven't seen the word terrible at all I think! What we are wanting are some naked demos for when the demos are released. Nothing has been announced regarding cost, demos or likewise. I was simply saying I would like some audio examples of the softer side, as I've got countless libraries that can do "epic". 

If I'm doing g a bombastic track, will these strings of the task when I take it back to a minimum for a break in the que?

I'm sure we will see/hear in good time


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



mac4d @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> Guy Rowland @ Sat Nov 09 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Comments along the lines of "is it really so terrible that you can't give us a naked version" are, imo, pathetic, ignorant and breathtakingly rude.
> 
> 
> 
> It's none of those things. What I wrote that was similar to this was a veiled attempt to try to get DJ to release a naked version. It didn't work, but was worth a try, to me. You've taken it way too seriously. DJ didn't.
Click to expand...


Well fair dos - it did read really "off" to me, in a sea of negative posts (and there is some ugly history here which I might be overly sensitive to). Anyway, onwards to more productive thoughts!


----------



## germancomponist

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

To avoid any misunderstanding: With no word I said that this library is sounding bad. 

I can't wait to listen to more stuff. o/~


----------



## tmm

Maybe it's a hope more than an expectation, but I certainly _hope_ they'll sound pretty close to the real thing. Otherwise, what's the point of further and further developing this technology?


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

@midicontroller

Those are two nice examples of string writing (and what a beautiful rendition of Beethoven!). I also would want to hear this kind of thing on a demo.

While this hairpin feature may be nice for some, I'm a little surprised that they did their first video with that. Hope that's not the strongest selling feature. Those aren't recorded swells like Adagio did so well (but rather crossfaded). That's something you can draw in in automation much quicker (since each case is different). Plus you can then use legato transitions which will sound much better.

I like what I hear so far, I just hope they've brought something new to the table, that neither Adagio, nor HS can't do. That would actually be easy: concentrate on the attacks.

With brass and woodwinds, the variety of different attack type is very limited, more or less related to accents. But with strings there are many different ways to begin the sound (from on the string, off the string, and with various degrees of pressure and various speeds of the bow).

Should be relatively easy to record say 6 different attacks (that then crossfade into sus'es) and add then say 2-3 release types (abrupt and not).

If you take the time to do that with a string library, then we could do a presentable version of JW & Ludwig with samples!

I would also hope for:
-3 kinds of legato transitions (slur, bow change, & portando/gliss) like SF & HS has done.
- Some feathery & some "digging-in" types of shorts at various durations.
- Trills m2-M2 that, like Sable, that can either start slower or jump-right-in
- Tremolo m3, M3, P4, fast and slow, both up and down, and both norm & con sordino.

I know we couldn't have all that in just the basic core library. It's probably very expensive to produce these strings, being some many players, and high wages for everyone involved. But if they do it right, and do it extensively, I'd imagine that almost everybody will be buying.


----------



## Hannes_F

Jordan Gagne @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> germancomponist @ Fri Nov 08 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I am not so impressed yet, but maybe later after listening to more pure samples?
> 
> 
> 
> It's still probably too early to tell but my ears hear these strings as kind of synthy.
Click to expand...


It would certainly be good to have the option to get the strings 'au natural'. It is much easier to add saturation to a sound than to un-fuzz it.

Problem is of course that developers are in the need to provide a product that delivers the mighty-sweep-off-your-feet sound right out of the box. So ...


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



midi_controller @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> ...but I'm going to wholeheartedly disagree with you that a sample library can't get close to that.



Please try reading my entire post next time, thank you.


----------



## JE Martinsen

About the Hairpin Creator, I can't say that I've seen something very similar to this before. But would you see this as an essential feature to ease the workflow? I'm asking as a newbie to orchestral composition here.. When I saw the video I was thinking that one may do this just as well with an expression pedal or just by using the good old pen tool, drawing in the curves. I'm also puzzled that this is the first video, showcasing this feature and not so much the sound of the library itself.

I'm really excited about CineStrings, so like all of you I'm waiting patiently to hear more demos of the library in detail.

o-[][]-o


----------



## Daniel James

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



RiffWraith @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> Daniel - I liked your demo. Save for the (I am assuming unwanted  ) low end distortion on those big hits. I would love to hear a naked demo of that (str only). Looking forward to your vid.
> 
> Cheers.



I'm blaming Soundcloud compression. Its like a really really shitty version of a tape distortion from a cassette player in the 90s. Soundcloud just can't handle me 

-DJ


----------



## germancomponist

JE Martinsen @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> About the Hairpin Creator, I can't say that I've seen something very similar to this before. But would you see this as an essential feature to ease the workflow? I'm asking as a newbie to orchestral composition here.. When I saw the video I was thinking that one may do this just as well with an expression pedal or just by using the good old pen tool, drawing in the curves. I'm also puzzled that this is the first video, showcasing this feature and not so much the sound of the library itself.
> 
> I'm really excited about CineStrings, so like all of you I'm waiting patiently to hear more demos of the library in detail.
> 
> o-[][]-o



I think this is a very cool idea what they did, especially that you can sync it to your sequencer tempo. Sure, you will edit later here and there, but the idea is very cool.


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



Daniel James @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> Soundcloud just can't handle me ;



Ha! :D


----------



## korgscrew

Hannes_F @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> Problem is of course that developers are in the need to provide a product that delivers the mighty-sweep-off-your-feet sound right out of the box. So ...



Something that sable doesn't do. Which is the point! :D


----------



## twtech

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

when the hairpin creator within kontakt is activated, will it generate and "send out" the actual cc data to the host sequencer? for example so that the orchestrator can also see the ups and downs of the hairpins in a track as cc values? or for later tweaking/editing the automatically created hairpins if needed? 
thanks! t


----------



## Stiltzkin

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



twtech @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> when the hairpin creator within kontakt is activated, will it generate and "send out" the actual cc data to the host sequencer? for example so that the orchestrator can also see the ups and downs of the hairpins in a track as cc values? or for later tweaking/editing the automatically created hairpins if needed?
> thanks! t



Looking at the video it doesn't seem to be changing it in kontakt, so I imagine it probably doesn't at the moment.

That said, I'm not usually a big fan of the sound you guys are after with cinesamples stuff, I have brass and the piano only though so I can't say much, but the utility of the hairpin creator is honestly buying me over, if only for an inspirational tool to use to get things started.


----------



## Aquatone

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

I like the "hairpin" creator. Along with it's described usage, I see it as a way to create "expressive" patches like the Sonic Implants Strings useful espressivo patch. Or, use the script sfz with the attack dynamic on cc1. I can see the feature implemented into a soundset for Sibelius…that would be great. Plus, it can be turned off and one can use cc drawing or an expression pedal. Great options for the imagination to explore.

I learned some other things watching the video and hearing the Daniel James piece. The hairpin script shows me the dynamic transition in the Full Patch is smooth. The sound of the strings have a "latitude or altitude" and width I have been looking for without sounding like there are a hundreds of strings or a huge ambience. I like the balance between attack and sustain. The Contrabass range woke up my sub speaker without overpowering the Violin range. The _*pp*_ dynamic is clean sounding. And, the Full Sustains patch is .65GB which isn't too huge. I assume it's the Dennis Sands mix since, that what the Cine libraries use as a default. So, I'm liking what I'm seeing and hearing.


----------



## HardyP

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



CineSamples @ 2013-11-08 said:


> Walkthrough of the Hairpin Creator tool in CineStrings CORE


Hello CS,
thanks for that interesting feature!! I don´t own any of your libs (yet?), but like to make a suggestion:
I think it would be great to change between 'loop' and 'no loop' with the sustain pedal: down - looped, so great swelling legato lines, up - get a climax/decresc on this chords.

If it´s not clear, feel free to ask


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



twtech @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> when the hairpin creator within kontakt is activated, will it generate and "send out" the actual cc data to the host sequencer? for example so that the orchestrator can also see the ups and downs of the hairpins in a track as cc values? or for later tweaking/editing the automatically created hairpins if needed?
> thanks! t



That's a great idea - hope its technically possible. So you could have a default that works for certain kinds of writing, but then just tweak the bits you need to later, rather than switching off the hairpin and starting from scratch.


----------



## playz123

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

In some circumstances I can see the Hairpin Creator saving me a lot of time and effort, so definitely welcome this new feature. And yes, it would be great if the controller data could be recorded and then edited if or as required. As for sound quality of a new library based on a Soundcloud or YouTube file...well I'm not even going to justify that with a comment.  The true test is when the library is on one's own computer, but to do that normally requires an investment...unless of course you are Guy Rowland who has recently discovered a new approach to obtain free software from a developer!  (LOL, just kidding, Guy!)


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

Regrading SoundCloud and the degraded audio quality due to compression. 

I think using AAC on Youtube is supposed to be very good (I have not tried it). 

So, that's another option for sample developers to use to demonstrate the quality of their products. It surely sounds better than mp3/Youtube, and SounCloud. I also think Vimeo offers a better audio quality due to better compression encoding used on their video's audio. I think Spectrasonics uses Vimeo to demonstrate their products ... (for a good reason)  

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## germancomponist

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



muziksculp @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> Regrading SoundCloud and the degraded audio quality due to compression.
> 
> I think using AAC on Youtube is supposed to be very good (I have not tried it).
> 
> So, that's another option for sample developers to use to demonstrate the quality of their products. It surely sounds better than mp3/Youtube, and SounCloud. I also think Vimeo offers a better audio quality due to better compression encoding used on their video's audio. I think Spectrasonics uses Vimeo to demonstrate their products ... (for a good reason)
> 
> Cheers,
> Muziksculp



And there is "box.net" with no compression, and you can upload wav files, too. 

Ok, it looks not so sexy, maybe, but what is more important?


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



twtech @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> when the hairpin creator within kontakt is activated, will it generate and "send out" the actual cc data to the host sequencer? for example so that the orchestrator can also see the ups and downs of the hairpins in a track as cc values? or for later tweaking/editing the automatically created hairpins if needed?
> thanks! t



this and a midi send to another track... not ideal, but can work.


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

@ germancomponist.

Yes, that's right, and _Dropbox_ is another option.


----------



## Ed

Sounds great, I don't hear any noise! I really think the feature in the video is really simple but useful! Would be nice to see the feature in other libraries as well. I like simple but good ideas


----------



## The Darris

*Re: The official CineStrings thread! [Encoding Complete]*



HardyP @ Sat Nov 09 said:


> CineSamples @ 2013-11-08 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Walkthrough of the Hairpin Creator tool in CineStrings CORE
> 
> 
> 
> Hello CS,
> thanks for that interesting feature!! I don´t own any of your libs (yet?), but like to make a suggestion:
> I think it would be great to change between 'loop' and 'no loop' with the sustain pedal: down - looped, so great swelling legato lines, up - get a climax/decresc on this chords.
> 
> If it´s not clear, feel free to ask
Click to expand...


If I may? CS products make use of the sustain pedal for a few different types of articulations, sustained and legato (artics patches). I think what would be beneficial is being able to toggle it on and off via CC or another means of midi controlling. Maybe a nice feature to add in an update but nevertheless, an awesome script feature that sits under the hood. I am looking forward to the official patch walkthrough and demos.


----------



## quantum7

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



RiffWraith @ Fri Nov 08 said:


> Sorry, but I think these strings sound great.
> 
> Sean - where are you hearing noise? Admittedly, I didn't have the volume up that much, but I don't hear anything...
> 
> 
> Cheers.



OK, at first I listened from my living room entertainment system....which is good quality, but then I went upstairs to my home studio and fired up my trusty Focal twins and got online to take a 2nd listen. I don't hear what I originally thought was a bit of top-end noise. My bad! Sounds great and i really LOVE the hairpin tool.  Oh boy, I may have to decide if I do need another string lib.


----------



## germancomponist

Ed @ Sun Nov 10 said:


> Sounds great, I don't hear any noise! I really think the feature in the video is really simple but useful! Would be nice to see the feature in other libraries as well. I like simple but good ideas



+1

The more I think about it, the more I like it. A very cool Idea!


----------



## jcs88

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

I'm crap at CC and so that hairpin feature has me pretty much sold. As if I need another string lib...


----------



## mac4d

What's the earliest version of Kontakt 5 that can be used for CineStrings?


----------



## Cinesamples

CineStrings CORE is encoded for use with the latest version of Kontakt 5.3

If you are on a mac, the system requirements for Kontakt 5.3 is OSX Lion 10.7 or later.

*EDIT: We now have a solution to support Snow Leopard users.*


----------



## Aquatone

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



> CineStrings CORE is encoded for use with the latest version of Kontakt 5.3
> 
> If you are on a mac, the system requirements for Kontakt 5.3 is OSX Lion 10.7 or later.



Swell. Well, I guess if I want to buy, I have to decide if I want to update my very well running 10.6.8 K5/Logic system. Would have been nice to have a little more heads up. If there is possibly a Kontakt 4 version, I'm in on day one. I can handle a new library in the middle of a project but updating several key pieces of software won't happen until down time.


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



Aquatone @ Sun Nov 10 said:


> CineStrings CORE is encoded for use with the latest version of Kontakt 5.3
> 
> If you are on a mac, the system requirements for Kontakt 5.3 is OSX Lion 10.7 or later.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Swell. Well, I guess if I want to buy, I have to decide if I want to update my very well running 10.6.8 K5/Logic system. Would have been nice to have a little more heads up. If there is possibly a Kontakt 4 version, I'm in on day one. I can handle a new library in the middle of a project but updating several key pieces of software won't happen until down time.
Click to expand...


Totally understand. We're working on solutions...
All Kontakt developers were caught off guard on this one too...

*EDIT: We now have a solution to support Snow Leopard users.*


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*

Here is the official full walkthrough for CineStrings CORE. Thanks everyone, we're getting there. Releasing this month.


01:36 Violins I Articulations
06:28 Violins I True Legato
13:12 Violins I Pizzicato and Col Legno
14:28 Violins I Harmonics
14:54 Violins II Patches
18:55 Violas Patches
22:02 Bow Attack Overlay
24:02 Cellos Patches
29:05 Multi-Microphone Walkthrough
33:19 Bass Patches
35:55 Full Ensemble Patches
42:14 Multis


----------



## Jem7

Just watched sounds great! 
I was gonna say legato patches can be more dynamic because it didn't sound too dynamic to me then you said it can be adjusted in the library which makes me feel better about this. Because I'm tired to write CC11 to make libraries sound dynamic along with CC1. It takes too much time.


----------



## Enyak

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Listening now. The spiccato shorts sound just great.

Update: Yup, that sound is working for me. Legatos sound reasonably nice too and the ppp-Timbre is very evocative. Got a sell here.


----------



## germancomponist

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

I have breakfast and am watching the video. 

I like what I see and hear.


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Home run guys!

I love HS, and wasn't thinking I'd want or need your strings, but I'm sold.

- Kudos for not leaving out arts here and there like so many devs do.
- The bow control overlays sound pretty good, could have heard more.
- Shorts sound great, good choices of length and how they are shaped.
- Very well thought out controls
- First chair mic's a great addition
- Legato rep sounds great.

The main point for me is that these things seem to breath, probably due to the bigger space, much better than HS. More 3D.

Here's to hoping that you do lots of add-on's to Core. Here is a wishlist:
- Runs builder
- Trills orchestrator up to P4 (up and down, slow & fast).
- Con sord pack, complete arts (minus Bartok pizz, no FF layers necessary)
- Solo strings pack

Your ensemble sizes aren't huge, so I wouldn't do divisi section personally. Plus there are other libraries for that kind of writing imo.

Looking forward to these! o-[][]-o


----------



## korgscrew

Whats the room tone button?


----------



## Mihkel Zilmer

korgscrew @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> Whats the room tone button?



I assume it's just a recording of the noise present when nobody's playing. Perhaps taken from their room tone freebie? 

http://cinesamples.com/2012/05/cinesamples-room-tone-sony-scoring-stage/


----------



## Vovique

In my second post on this amazing forum I would like to thank CineSamples for such an amazing product! I had other string library on my Christams wish list, but have now changed my mind.


----------



## kfirpr

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

I think that this library sounds incredible from what I can hear. good thing I didn't bought the "other" one.
I wish that you will include faster legato and random runs patche that will work only on fast stuff (not pre recorded)


----------



## korgscrew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Great! Thanks!

Ive been after somthing like this for a while!

One from Air would be nice


----------



## MA-Simon

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

I wanna marry those dry mic! o/~


----------



## synapse21

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Has there been a release date announced?


----------



## Aquatone

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Hairpin Creator Walkthrough Added]*



> Totally understand. We're working on solutions...
> All Kontakt developers were caught off guard on this one too...



No trouble, just reality on all sides. I figured NI would make all developers and users go 5.3 and all "Mavericky".


----------



## dcoscina

Sounds like the strings are in between LASS and Cinematic Strings. You can hear the bowing better but it's not so astringent as they can be in a dry setting. I like the shorts and the whole way of alternating between spicc/stacc/marc on the fly. I've gotten quite used to this methodology in my other CS libraries so this will be welcome. 

My only question is whether the legatos respond well to quick passages. Personally, not many libraries are able to manage this with reverb tails which is why I think dry samples sometimes are better. I'm hoping these legatos do as I love write some fast passages with leg strings.


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Great sound and lots of clever features! Well done.


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Any chance you guys will do the full ensemble patch for the brass as well?


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



Echoes in the Attic @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> Any chance you guys will do the full ensemble patch for the brass as well?




+1


----------



## ed buller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Sounds great mike....will this be for the full kontakt 5 or will it run on the player like cinebrass ?

E


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

dcoscina @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> My only question is whether the legatos respond well to quick passages. Personally, not many libraries are able to manage this with reverb tails which is why I think dry samples sometimes are better. I'm hoping these legatos do as I love write some fast passages with leg strings.



+2

demo 2 octave runs and arpeggios (back and forth) please


----------



## BenG

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Really nice sound, can't wait for some beautiful demos!

Some observations...

-Vibrato control is perfect
-Celli sound nice and thick (Nice sounding full ensemble patch as well)
-First Chair mics are super cool and useful, lots of sound options.
-Love the hairpin tool, will save me tons of time
_Nice legato transitions, to my ears.

Overall, everything sounds great! Looking forward to the release


----------



## Cinesamples

Here's an index since this walkthrough is a bit longer than our others:

01:36 Violins I Articulations
06:28 Violins I True Legato
13:12 Violins I Pizzicato and Col Legno
14:28 Violins I Harmonics
14:54 Violins II Patches
18:55 Violas Patches
22:02 Bow Attack Overlay
24:02 Cellos Patches
29:05 Multi-Microphone Walkthrough
33:19 Bass Patches
35:55 Full Ensemble Patches
42:14 Multis


----------



## Tino Danielzik

You guys should rename this library into SilvestriStrings, what a great big sound!!! Awesome!


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Hey korgscrew:

That is a button that adds room-tone from the SONY scoring stage. It's a way to add back a bit of the tone that we ended up removing in the de-noising process. 

Once turned on, the room tone plays when you are playing passages. Then once you stop, it slowly diminishes out.

MP


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



synapse21 @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> Has there been a release date announced?



Releasing this month.


----------



## playz123

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Very impressive articulations, wonderful multis, and it definitely does not sound like the competition either, which is exactly the way it should be. At first I was leery of 'yet another string library', but now I understand that it's not that at all. I can see it being very useful, especially when combined with other CS libraries recorded in the same location. It obvious as well that a lot of time, thought and care went into producing it. Looking forward to the release.


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Watching this walk-through I'm very impressed with the design of these patches. Really like how you've included so many features and articulations in a small number of CC's. Must have taken a ton of thought and very nicely achieved.


----------



## Sid Francis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

You guys really surprised me...wow.
After the for me not so convincing hairpin video (because of the very much over-the-top sounding full sustain patch) I did not expect much, but: wow! How meaty and 3D everything sounds, as if you could touch the players. Great.

As always there are some points that you left out in the (great) video, and I would like to know, whether you did it intentionally or unintentionally.. :D 8) 

You showed the different vibratos of the violins. WONDERFUL sound. This is the first time I would plan to use CC2 for controlling dynamic vibrato "flows" because the players are really playing TOGETHER, something that I missed in all my other string libraries.
I was excited to hear this for the violas and the celli too but...you just not showed it.. 8) Would you be so kind to make a short demo for those too? Audio will do naturally. I would LOVE this kind of vibrato for the lower strings too.

Further you didn´t want to mess with the legato controls. But there ARE these controls... :D Don´t get me wrong, I think the legato is okay as it is, but...just "okay". For me I would try to make it slower to make it sound more lyrical. But will the sound still be "coherent"? Another member would like to hear it quicker for fast passages... so perhaps you might want to show also, what the legato control can do and what it can´t do. As long as there is a position that works I would not expect wonders from the more extreme settings but it would be nice to know how far you can go.
Different from what I expected I think I got a definite contender for my personal christmas pre-present...  
Congrat s to a great product.


----------



## jamwerks

Hi, planing an SSD for this. Do you have the size of Core already?


----------



## quantum7

+1 for a video on the legato controls.

+1 on the size of Core & Pro as I am also going all SSD soon.


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Would love to know what the plan is for portamento and glissando. Are those features included in Core? If not I'm interested to find out exactly how we'll be expected to add those important little details from Pro to the music we write with Core. Seems like it would be difficult to accurately sprinkle those in using an alternate, second patch.


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

If this is core - what would be an example of 'Pro'? Fast legato, playable runs, smaller sections, etc. The only reason i ask is it might influence my decision to get on board now. Thanks for any info provided.


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

(this is Sam Estes here)

We will be listing the full specs shortly, but let me share a few tech-y things here - 

Library is Kontakt version 5.3, we are going to do a version 5.2 as well, but you will need to purchase the 5.3 then email our support for links to the 5.2, there will be some patches that we cannot use in 5.2 (full string ensemble multi-mics primarily), this is also kontakt player, so if you only have Kontakt 4, you can download the free player for 5 and be okay. Lion and Mountain-Lion are the recommended OS (for mac) OR Win 7/8 for PC.

Size of the library is under 50gb, so a single 64gb free SSD is perfectly good to run the library (and recommended, of course having 128, 256, 512 also good!) - to load ALL the patches we are recommending at least 10-12gb FREE RAM (for the FULL mix mic position) 

LEGATOS:
The legatos are "natural" legatos. We carefully planned out when to trigger specific types of legatos when we recorded. There are not "gliss" or "protamento" to change to, sorry. We opted to do more dynamic layers instead. You can hear in the walk-though the slight variances we did to the legatos to get them to perform what the players would play "80%" of the time. Say when they were fff there would be a slight bow-change when playing minor 2nds, but just a fingered change when playing pp. The result is really, nice, natural, and "don't have to think about it" vibe, and there are no over-the-top schmaltz to the legatos either. There is also a LOT going on under the hood that will allow for fast-playing passages too! I think the result is something very, very natural and life-like sounding, instead of having to program in even more changes. 

BOW ATTACK:
We will be explaining the bow-attack controller more indepth in future videos. This is a very, very expressive way of changing easily the sound of both legatos and regular sustains - and easily triggered by playing above v111 and using cc9 to change from "disabled" through to Sforzando (BTW the Sforzando patch is part of the "split" patches we are also releasing, if you want it on it's own).

HAIRPIN:
I like setting the start and end dynamic controls to velocity and the "middle" to CC. That way I can record/recall the exact dynamic range I want to go to and from. Also assigning cc's to the duration controls helps too!

BACK END CONTROLS:
For you "wrench-heads" we will also be including some manual addendums including volume-dynamic control over the mod-wheel, velocity. Legato controls, split points, etc - again don't recommend getting into these without "SAVING" your patches!

ALSO:

Reserve: CC1 (dynamics), CC2(Vibrato / Trem-Sul / Trill HS-WS) CC7 (Trim Volume), CC9 (Bow Attack), CC11 (Expression Volume) for the controls of this library. The rest of the CC settings are up to you to assign and control. 

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## germancomponist

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

_I wonder how people could live with their libs in the past when there was no legato at all... . _

What I wanted to say is: I like the sound of this new library and all the tricky functions! 

Well done, CS!


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Thanks for the details Sam. I'll be picking this up for sure but I must say I'm disappointed about the lack of port and gliss. I remember reading on this forum that these would be included. That's one of the best features of LASS, in my opinion, so I suppose I'll still need to reserve a few tracks in the template for those. Still a great sounding product that I'm really looking forward to.


----------



## Simon Ravn

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Having only listened on a set of iPhone earplugs, this sounds like a must have addition to my strings arsenal! Congrats, this must have been a huge undertaking! 

Only major criticism I have is the same I have with brass, that dynamics have been compressed, so playing pp isn't the true recorded dynamics, and going up to ff just isn't wide enough. So you HAVE to use CC11 alongside to get proper dynamics, which I think is a pity since it requires extra work that isn't really neccessary. But I guess you wanted this to match the dynamic mapping of the brass, sort of. Unless of course this is something that my iPhone headset or the YouTube upload does, in which case I apologize for that criticism.

Oh and for the first time in a commercial library, violas seem to have the right timbre, sans a little more vibrato perhaps. Cellos seem to have too little vibrato too, but of course I don't know if you played with full vibrato in the demo and how controllable it is.

No matter what, I will get this one!

Oh, and please do sordino legatos with at least 3 dynamic layers, trills and tremolos for Violins 1 + 2 + Violas + Cellos for the Pro addition! (+ staccatos for the violins+violas) 8)

EDIT: Despite my few criticisms, this sounds generally terrific and very thorough! Wow, must have been quite an undertaking to do.


----------



## quantum7

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



germancomponist @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> _I wonder how people could live with their libs in the past when there was no legato at all... . _



It was tough back then, living in Medieval times .....before The Legato Renaissance. Gives me the chills thinking about the horror. >8o



CineSamples @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> There are not "gliss" or "protamento" to change to, sorry.



I must admit that I find this a little disappointing also. :cry: Although, I kind of understand the reasoning behind it.....and since Mr. Hannes_F (A.K.A. violinist extraordinaire) is not bothered by it, I feel better now.


----------



## Hannes_F

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



CineSamples @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> LEGATOS:
> The legatos are "natural" legatos. We carefully planned out when to trigger specific types of legatos when we recorded. There are not "gliss" or "protamento" to change to, sorry. We opted to do more dynamic layers instead.



Thank you. The voice of reason.


----------



## germancomponist

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



Hannes_F @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> CineSamples @ Mon Nov 11 said:
> 
> 
> 
> LEGATOS:
> The legatos are "natural" legatos. We carefully planned out when to trigger specific types of legatos when we recorded. There are not "gliss" or "protamento" to change to, sorry. We opted to do more dynamic layers instead.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thank you. The voice of reason.
Click to expand...


+100!


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Really impressive. I'm the world's fiercest ambient legato critic as you guys know (!) - these sound very, very smooth indeed.



Rob Elliott @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> If this is core - what would be an example of 'Pro'? Fast legato, playable runs, smaller sections, etc. The only reason i ask is it might influence my decision to get on board now. Thanks for any info provided.



+1 to these questions, and if there are ports planned for Pro. Congrats again.


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



CineSamples @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> There are not "gliss" or "protamento" to change to, sorry. We opted to do more dynamic layers instead.



It would be nice to have the gliss and port, but would rather have more dyn layers. Good choice!


----------



## Craig Sharmat

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

It sounds great and the poly legato is a terrific feature.


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

@Simon Ravn

Coming from my background of programming samples for the "big music studio" here in town, using CC11 (or cc7) really helps in getting the soft dynamics above the mix. BUT if you set cc1=0 and then have volume=10% at the same time, well - it's pointless when you are mixing a large score, since the ppp layer won't sound at all without serious compression/amplification. It's always easier to make something softer than louder in sample land. 

While I encourage everyone to write with CC11 (or cc7) and CC1, there are those who want a "natural" approach to the dynamics, which is great too! As I stated, there are backend controls that allow you to adjust the "DYNAMIC" range of the Mod wheel, to have no dynamics to 100% dynamic control. We have set it to a modest 80% now which gives some movement without drastically changing the volume from ppp to fff.. 

It is a VERY easy tweak to do and we will show you exactly how to do it!

AS for the "PRO" comment, AFTER we release this library - we will be gathering comments from the community as to what they'd like to see in PRO and we will do what we can to get them in! (and yes, con sordino is on that list!)

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples.


----------



## Simon Ravn

Hi Sam.

That sounds great with the dynamics controls - I think I missed that while watching (I am still watching actually), so I guess this will do it for me to set it to 100% - thanks for including this feature


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



maest @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> AS for the "PRO" comment, AFTER we release this library - we will be gathering comments from the community as to what they'd like to see in PRO and we will do what we can to get them in! (and yes, con sordino is on that list!)



IMHO, the boxed version of Pro should come with a piece of the Sony Stage. I am just sayin'...


----------



## artinro

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



RiffWraith @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> It would be nice to have the gliss and port, but would rather have more dyn layers. Good choice!



+1. So glad they opted to really focus on one type of "legato" and do it in considerable depth. 

Sounds great, guys!


----------



## Cinesamples

As far as PRO, nothing truly has been planned yet. We have some general ideas, but those ideas will be really informed by you guys after you get a chance to start working with CORE. Mutes are certainly on that list, portamento and glissando possibly if you really REALLY think you need it. 

One of the things we do when planning libraries, is we surround ourselves and listen to people much smarter than us! (which does include some of you)

One of the busiest conductors in the Hollywood studio scene advised us on what he saw missing from existing libraries, and things he considered unnecessary. We learned that studio string players in LA these days actively avoid such technique in their playing. However, depending on the styles of music you're doing, you may indeed want that syrupy sweet port/gliss. I will tell you, from the perspective of the Hollywood Scoring musician (which is the sound we're going for in general), this is a very infrequent technique on the stages these days. It's probably a stylistic thing, related to the music that is being created today. We went back and forth on this.. but decided to focus the time and resources on multiple dynamics of legato transitions. If you guys really want it in PRO we will, of course, put it on the list of suggestions. 

Thoughts?

MP


----------



## Hannes_F

Guys, before you start to miss glissando and portamento . . . listen to the 'true legato' parts of the walkthrough video again. There are plenty of small portamenti . . . but in the way how they come naturally. More would be too much in most cases.

In the very rare cases you really want it rather mix a solo violin patch with a glissando into it instead of a section. But this should perhaps be one time in one cue.



cinesamples said:


> We learned that studio string players in LA these days actively avoid such technique in their playing



Yes.


----------



## jamwerks

@sam

If you have the right to make IR's of Sony, that could help us place our other libraries in that space.

As to the bow control overlays, did you try also not overlaying the shorts, but rather butting the sus right up to the end of the short? Would that make a realistic attack? That might be hit or miss on different samples, but if you had a sus start offset control (vis-a-vis the short attack), that might work.

Just thinking out load here...

EDIT: As for the portamenti, I think you made a good choice in leaving them out. Most of your buyers already own HS, Adagio &/or Sable, that all have plenty of that sliddy stuff.


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

@jamwerks

The IR - no, cannot do that. Solution: Buy the "Cine" line  - 

Seriously though - I wish for myself I had an IR of the stage for the "other" libraries as well, we have to respect our Sony relationship. We do however encourage using our sister company - "Hollywood Scoring" for hiring out to record at Sony if you really "WANT" that sound - can even do ra-amping if you'd like - 

As for the bow-attack, it is not just a simple overlay. There is a LOT of script stuff that had to be done for it to feel natural and work. Our new script guy, Patrick O'Neil is super awesome and we are very, very lucky to have him on our team now. You guys really should see how long this script is, it's pretty incredible. 

-Sam


----------



## artinro

Hannes_F @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> Guys, before you start to miss glissando and portamento . . . listen to the 'true legato' parts of the walkthrough video again. There are plenty of small portamenti . . . but in the way how they come naturally. More would be too much in most cases.
> 
> In the very rare cases you really want it rather mix a solo violin patch with a glissando into it instead of a section. But this should perhaps be one time in one cue.
> 
> 
> 
> cinesamples said:
> 
> 
> 
> We learned that studio string players in LA these days actively avoid such technique in their playing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes.
Click to expand...


Totally agree with you on this, Hannes.


----------



## Cinesamples

Hannes_F @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> Guys, before you start to miss glissando and portamento . . . listen to the 'true legato' parts of the walkthrough video again. There are plenty of small portamenti . . . but in the way how they come naturally. More would be too much in most cases.
> 
> In the very rare cases you really want it rather mix a solo violin patch with a glissando into it instead of a section. But this should perhaps be one time in one cue.
> 
> 
> 
> cinesamples said:
> 
> 
> 
> We learned that studio string players in LA these days actively avoid such technique in their playing
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes.
Click to expand...


Thanks Hannes. 
And by the way, everyone should hire live musicians once-in-a-while!! Even if it is just a solo violin to layer in.


----------



## Guy Rowland

CineSamples @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> As far as PRO, nothing truly has been planned yet. We have some general ideas, but those ideas will be really informed by you guys after you get a chance to start working with CORE. Mutes are certainly on that list, portamento and glissando possibly if you really REALLY think you need it.
> 
> One of the things we do when planning libraries, is we surround ourselves and listen to people much smarter than us! (which does include some of you)
> 
> One of the busiest conductors in the Hollywood studio scene advised us on what he saw missing from existing libraries, and things he considered unnecessary. We learned that studio string players in LA these days actively avoid such technique in their playing. However, depending on the styles of music you're doing, you may indeed want that syrupy sweet port/gliss. I will tell you, from the perspective of the Hollywood Scoring musician (which is the sound we're going for in general), this is a very infrequent technique on the stages these days. It's probably a stylistic thing, related to the music that is being created today. We went back and forth on this.. but decided to focus the time and resources on multiple dynamics of legato transitions. If you guys really want it in PRO we will, of course, put it on the list of suggestions.
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> MP



Heavens, what a dangerously inviting post.

I think the multi-dynamic basic offering was very smart for Core, and the results of this (and the new scripts) sound like the best legato yet from that stage. Will this scripting be ploughed back into Brass / Winds incidentally?

Port - yup, I'd love it in Pro. Though it's not as common in more recent stuff, some of my favourite Hollywood scores used it unashamed. And of course it's glorious for evoking the old romantic era stuff. So I'd argue it's definitely Hollywood - perhaps not Hollywood 2013 though.

I believe you already have runs / fx covered in The Other Upcoming Strings Product (TM).... In general, grace notes (theme from Tin Tin - would so love scoops up and down on the pitch bend of an uber-artics patch) and very fast bowed repetitions perhaps.

[Slight digression For me, in general, I think one of the biggest under-served areas would be big band / jazzy artics (a la The Incredibles, for example). This goes mainly for brass, of course - would kill for that Sony sound and players to have a few jazzy turns. Literally kill. I'd do 20 years for it, if I could take my laptop with me and CineBigBandBrass]


----------



## rpaillot

CineSamples @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> As far as PRO, nothing truly has been planned yet. We have some general ideas, but those ideas will be really informed by you guys after you get a chance to start working with CORE. Mutes are certainly on that list, portamento and glissando possibly if you really REALLY think you need it.
> 
> One of the things we do when planning libraries, is we surround ourselves and listen to people much smarter than us! (which does include some of you)
> 
> One of the busiest conductors in the Hollywood studio scene advised us on what he saw missing from existing libraries, and things he considered unnecessary. We learned that studio string players in LA these days actively avoid such technique in their playing. However, depending on the styles of music you're doing, you may indeed want that syrupy sweet port/gliss. I will tell you, from the perspective of the Hollywood Scoring musician (which is the sound we're going for in general), this is a very infrequent technique on the stages these days. It's probably a stylistic thing, related to the music that is being created today. We went back and forth on this.. but decided to focus the time and resources on multiple dynamics of legato transitions. If you guys really want it in PRO we will, of course, put it on the list of suggestions.
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> MP



IMO, we need port / gliss. I hear ton of these in hollywood comedy scores  ( and I mean, recent comedy scores )


----------



## Hannes_F

Idea: Rename the 'True Legato' patch into 'Legato + Gliss/Port'. Marketing-problem solved.


----------



## FriFlo

IMO the problem is, there are so many kinds of quite different glissandi/portamenti that what I got in libraries like VSL or Lass almost never seems to be quite fitting. to slow, to fast, not the right vibe to it ...
I guess we all just have to live with the fact, that some things are never gonna be expressable with samples. Take the music at the end credits of each Dexter episode: Good example for a glissando, you won't find any library to come close to this. I think it was harmonics glissando or some kind of extreme flautando. Hannes? Could you enlighten us?
Over all, I like this library! Probably more than all the other Cine Libs. Just don't know, if I will buy it. Man, I have sooooo many string libraries by now ...
The legato sounds pretty good to me, though ...


----------



## germancomponist

FriFlo @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> ... Take the music at the end credits of each Dexter episode: Good example for a glissando, you won't find any library to come close to this. I think it was harmonics glissando or some kind of extreme flautando.



You mean this gliss where the flute is playing the same as the violin, but one octave higher?


----------



## Vision

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



Rob Elliott @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> If this is core - what would be an example of 'Pro'? Fast legato, playable runs, smaller sections, etc. The only reason i ask is it might influence my decision to get on board now. Thanks for any info provided.



Fast legato/Playable runs, or even time stretched runs for Pro would put this library over the top. Sordino strings is a given(?) 

As it stands though.. Phenomenal library. Excellent scripting, and programming. Great job guys.


----------



## Polarity

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Wow! 
I love how it sounds and the performance flexibility of the patches.
My compliments.
Loved the Cellos tone and the ostinatos you played with it.
The Violas are very good too.

Great idea for the FULL Ensemble patches to give the chance of changing the extension of the single sections! 

Definitely a library that goes in my wishlist...
I have to see if and when I can afford it together the two CineBrass bundles (others in wishlist), that I don't own yet, but love very much how they can sound so "John Williams" or "Star Trek themes" like.

Just two questions:

1) is there any chance you will do a sort of rhythm tool arpeggiator for short articulations like in LASS? (I have LASS Lite only and used it a lot that tool).

2) memory question. Usually Kontakt doesn't load in memory twice the same samples.
So, if I load both Sustain Legato and Articulations patches for Violins I (for example) will my Windows7 use 0.52 and 0.84 Gb of memory or 0.52 and just the 0.32 Gb of different samples of the added articulations in the latter patch?

Thanks in advance.
And keep going your amazing work!


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



Polarity @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> Just two questions:
> 
> 1) is there any chance you will do a sort of rhythm tool arpeggiator for short articulations like in LASS? (I have LASS Lite only and used it a lot that tool).
> 
> *No current plan to do this.*
> 
> 2) memory question. Usually Kontakt doesn't load in memory twice the same samples.
> So, if I load both Sustain Legato and Articulations patches for Violins I (for example) will my Windows7 use 0.52 and 0.84 Gb of memory or 0.52 and just the 0.32 Gb of different samples of the added articulations in the latter patch?
> 
> *The second. Kontakt will not double-up loading of samples if they are loaded already.
> 
> *
> Thanks in advance.
> And keep going your amazing work!
> 
> *Thanks!*


----------



## Patrick_Gill

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

I know you guys have Sordino/Mutes covered for PRO so that's cool. I'd already mentioned this but I'd really LOVE to see playable run patches in there! I wish more string libraries would include these, especially if you're going for that classic hollywood sound . 

Solo strings, Sul Pont and a good variety of string FX would be brilliant too! 

Congrats on the CORE patch video guys. Sounds incredible.

Patrick.,


----------



## Hannes_F

FriFlo @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> Dexter episode . . . I think it was harmonics glissando or some kind of extreme flautando. Hannes?



FriFlo, had to look this up on Youtube - not my kind of entertainment. Regarding the music I could be wrong but for me the Dexter end credits melody sounds like a solo violin plus solo violin harmonics, both parallely glissed. If I should emulate that with samples I'd use (resp. probably program) the pitch-wheel instead of a ready sample.

This nicely shows the point: Glissando is an _effect _that needs to be adjusted every time to the situation. And a recorded glissando is a one trick pony. If you want a variety of different glissandi, say 5 variations, then this would make 5 * 24 = 120 variations _per note_, and that through all sections. Or do you prefer this care being given to the natural little transitions that you can use every day, in virtually every cue that uses strings, because they really glue together the lines?

Yes other libraries have legato samples too but from library to library they are really done different.

I find myself sounding like a Cinesamples sales rep., however it is just that finally somebody understood how valuable the little transitions are in contrast to the big and flashy ones.


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



Patrick_Gill @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> Solo strings, Sul Pont and a good variety of string FX would be brilliant too!



watch the video, Patrick... Sul Ponticello is there


----------



## feck

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Looks like Christmas will come in November this year....can't wait to grab these! Using the modwheel to adjust the shorts overlaid on the sustains is a killer idea.


----------



## Blakus

I think you made the right decision with the legato. It definitely got my attention! You can really tell that you thought about how varied intervals and dynamics are played differently - it sounds really natural and great. Glad you decided to go for more dynamics instead of port/gliss too.


----------



## ryanstrong

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Library sounds amazing! Great work Cinesamples. It's a must have.

My PRO Wish List:

*01 Solo*
Not soaring solos but soft natural sounding solos - this is a niche waiting to be filled IMO

*02 Divis*
Either half-sections or small chamber-size sections - another lib may have this but not in SONY!

*03 Sordino*
A given.

*04 Port / Gliss*
I actually love port/gliss, I use it à la Jonny Greenwood style.

*05 Controlled Aleatoric Longs*
I like the idea of being able to control chaos. Another lib has this and works well but again wouldn't mind having this from Hollywood players in SONY.


----------



## woodsdenis

Hannes_F @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> FriFlo @ Tue Nov 12 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dexter episode . . . I think it was harmonics glissando or some kind of extreme flautando. Hannes?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> FriFlo, had to look this up on Youtube - not my kind of entertainment. Regarding the music I could be wrong but for me the Dexter end credits melody sounds like a solo violin plus solo violin harmonics, both parallely glissed. If I should emulate that with samples I'd use (resp. probably program) the pitch-wheel instead of a ready sample.
Click to expand...


Given the nature of the program I always thought the high part was a bowed saw !!!!!


----------



## Dmitry Noskov

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

First, congrats! I think this is the Must Have library anyway, I really liked what I hear, so can't wait.

Second, to talk about PRO, I think you're really should focus on divisi sections and soloists. Believe me, it's never enough!! 
About portamento & gliss also, time after time there's a tasks to write 50's or 60's kind of music and there's no way to do it without these stuffs. ))
Soloists got to be very expressive, with huge dynamic range and techiques.
To tell the truth there's not a single solo strings library on the market that even get close to the real players. I know, we should hire them and I'd love to, but sometimes we're very short in time, first of all.
Anyway, thanks for keep doing such a great libs!

Dmitry


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



Sid Francis @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> You showed the different vibratos of the violins. WONDERFUL sound. This is the first time I would plan to use CC2 for controlling dynamic vibrato "flows" because the players are really playing TOGETHER, something that I missed in all my other string libraries.
> I was excited to hear this for the violas and the celli too but...you just not showed it.. 8) Would you be so kind to make a short demo for those too? Audio will do naturally. I would LOVE this kind of vibrato for the lower strings too.



I'll second this request, just some nice, slow phrases with the violas and celli so we can hear the vibrato more distinctly. I'm right on the edge, just need a tiny push. :D

The sound is pretty fantastic, can't wait to hear more!


----------



## MacQ

Wow guys, these sound amazing. Seriously, what an achievement! Very impressed!


----------



## germancomponist

woodsdenis @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> Hannes_F @ Tue Nov 12 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> FriFlo @ Tue Nov 12 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dexter episode . . . I think it was harmonics glissando or some kind of extreme flautando. Hannes?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> FriFlo, had to look this up on Youtube - not my kind of entertainment. Regarding the music I could be wrong but for me the Dexter end credits melody sounds like a solo violin plus solo violin harmonics, both parallely glissed. If I should emulate that with samples I'd use (resp. probably program) the pitch-wheel instead of a ready sample.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Given the nature of the program I always thought the high part was a bowed saw !!!!!
Click to expand...


This is interesting. Yesterday on my little net-book it sounded like a flute is playing there.... . 

What I found this morning: "Known for eccentric scoring techniques, Licht has treated the Dexter audience to sounds of tethered duct tape, playing wine glasses, and scraping surgical tools through his score for the series... "

Link: http://www.danlicht.com/video_dexter_concerto.php

Very cool!


----------



## Arbee

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

These sound very natural and uncoloured to my ears in comparison with many competitors. The multiple mics alone might just tip me over the line, and the close mics based on this video anyway sound delicious (in other words, perhaps we have here both great sounding samples AND a great room). Couldn't agree more on the port/gliss issue versus a more subtle "lazy legato" (for want of a better term). Hmm.... o/~ 


.


----------



## Hannes_F

woodsdenis @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> FriFlo @ Tue Nov 12 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Dexter episode . . . I think it was harmonics glissando or some kind of extreme flautando. Hannes?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Given the nature of the program I always thought the high part was a bowed saw !!!!!
Click to expand...


Yes that is it. Probably with an octaver mixed into it. Certainly doable with a synth too or a theremin or a violin sample and the pitch-wheel, and Gunther probably can program it in Kontakt using the sample of a dog bark (but hopefully in another thread then). 

So . . . back to topic - no real need to blow ten-thousands on recording such a speciality throughout a complete strings orchestra.


----------



## Daryl

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

I haven't managed to watch the whole walkthrough yet, but I think that the sound is very good. Whilst I wasn't really convinced with either the Brass (soloists) or Woodwinds sound, the studio seems to suit String samples very well.

I also agree that the choice of not recording Portamento is a good one. The trouble with Portamento is that unless you are a String player, it is very difficult to know what sort should be used, or when it should be used. I remember when LASS first came out there were heaps of dreadful demos that seemed to feature Portamento, just because the library could do it, so I think that it was a good call not to prioritise it with the initial release of this product. Obviously I don't have any knowledge as to whether or not the method chosen is going to work for all scenarios, but I didn't hear anything that sounded too amiss in the video.

One thing that I did notice from the walkthrough was that a fair number of the transitions were too loud. I think that once the product is released it would be good to go through them, so that they are all equal volume. It's not good having a load of time saving features, if every transition has to be edited with a CC in order to sound right. There were also a few problems with ensemble. The demonstration of the legato sample started with a C and each time it was played I winced, as it was not a good start note. If there is no alternative recording, it might be necessary to do a few extra notes when the Pro section of the library is being recorded.

Personally my only wish for a String library is to be able to do bow changes within legato phrases (not just on repeated notes). So far all the libraries fail dismally on this one, yet it is an integral part of String playing. As I haven't yet got to the end of the video I don't know whether or not this is included, so I'll keep quiet about it for now.

Good luck with the release.

D


----------



## Dan Mott

Brilliant sound and I even have HS and also fussy about string sound.

Christmas is close so...... 


PS - Looking forward to that dog bark thread with Gunther .


----------



## Theseus

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



Daryl @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> Personally my only wish for a String library is to be able to do bow changes within legato phrases (not just on repeated notes). So far all the libraries fail dismally on this one, yet it is an integral part of String playing.
> 
> D



^^^
This. Pretty please.
I also find the transitions way too loud most of the times. But I'm sure it can be fixed through options. Same with the speed, as it clearly doesn't sound natural anymore when Mike plays fast passages on the violins for exemple (kudos though for not trying to hide that with only slow lyrical melodies a la Adagio). I'm sure the speed knob in the options can precisely address that. I just hope it does in a convincing manner. 

The sound is really excellent, beautiful presence. Through all this years of strings libraries released one after another, this is the only time if feel I can finally safely complement LASS in a useful way (just my opinion, based on the way I use it). The 5 dynamic layers for sustains is just brilliant.


----------



## Jem7

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



maest @ 11/11/2013 said:


> @Simon Ravn
> 
> Coming from my background of programming samples for the "big music studio" here in town, using CC11 (or cc7) really helps in getting the soft dynamics above the mix. BUT if you set cc1=0 and then have volume=10% at the same time, well - it's pointless when you are mixing a large score, since the ppp layer won't sound at all without serious compression/amplification. It's always easier to make something softer than louder in sample land.
> 
> While I encourage everyone to write with CC11 (or cc7) and CC1, there are those who want a "natural" approach to the dynamics, which is great too! As I stated, there are backend controls that allow you to adjust the "DYNAMIC" range of the Mod wheel, to have no dynamics to 100% dynamic control. We have set it to a modest 80% now which gives some movement without drastically changing the volume from ppp to fff..
> 
> It is a VERY easy tweak to do and we will show you exactly how to do it!
> 
> AS for the "PRO" comment, AFTER we release this library - we will be gathering comments from the community as to what they'd like to see in PRO and we will do what we can to get them in! (and yes, con sordino is on that list!)
> 
> Best,
> 
> Sam Estes
> Manager, Cinesamples.



I hope maybe you guys want to put that dynamic range tweaker on CineBrass sometime.
It's good to hear that. With PRO I would like to have recorded all articulations again with the mutes not just the legato. Port/Gliss can be good feature too. Most JW scores still have them. 
Maybe all in one patches for CORE update for who wants everything in one patch but that leads another problems too.(Need individual articulation volume tweaking within articulations)


----------



## Enyak

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Personally, not a fan of Port / Gliss 99% of the time. I just want smooth bow change and fingered legato. (Having the choice of both like in HS and Sable would be ideal, but I get the sense you approached this musically so it's already close to ideal as far as samples go.)

Very happy about the 4 sampled dynamics for legatos.

As far as Sordinos go - I am mostly in the "treat equally" camp. I would likely be willing to pay the same price again for a thorough CineStrings Sordino.

I could absolutely see CS being a very modular product line, for example: 
- CineStrings CORE
- CineStrings Sordino + Misc
- CineStrings Divisi I
- CineStrings Divisi II

Whereas I would like to see the Divisi libs to really be divided into the different physical individual players, so that when I use V1-1 and V1-2 as divisi they are both in their correct seatings positions and sound differently.

Making the Divisi libs would be a huge undertaking obviously (especially if made a 3-way split), but boy would it be sweet to have access to.


----------



## ModalRealist

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Viz. Pro: I wouldn't mind seeing "True Detache" in a string library. Straight sustains and/or shorts never produce that smooth "flowing but not legato" effect, even though this is usually the default manner of playing in the absence of any other articulation markings. The ideal case is plugging in a detache line with 16th, 8th, quarter and half notes mixed together and getting that "flowing but not legato" sound.


----------



## germancomponist

Hannes_F @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> Yes that is it. Probably with an octaver mixed into it. Certainly doable with a synth too or a theremin or a violin sample and the pitch-wheel, and Gunther probably can program it in Kontakt using the sample of a dog bark (but hopefully in another thread then).



Hm, why not, a cool idea!


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



ModalRealist @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> Viz. Pro: I wouldn't mind seeing "True Detache" in a string library. Straight sustains and/or shorts never produce that smooth "flowing but not legato" effect, even though this is usually the default manner of playing in the absence of any other articulation markings. The ideal case is plugging in a detache line with 16th, 8th, quarter and half notes mixed together and getting that "flowing but not legato" sound.



This is exactly what our bow attack feature does. I'll be putting together a walkthrough to show that in more detail.

It is a way to simulate long-tone passages where the bow changes on each note. It also allows you to have a full phrase that is true legato, then you can indicate where the full section changes bow. Because a long true-legato phrase is technically one super long bow without changing direction. Bow attack will allow you to 'change' bow direction at any point within a phrase. It works remarkably well... standby for the video...

MP


----------



## germancomponist

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



CineSamples @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> This is exactly what our bow attack feature does. I'll be putting together a walkthrough to show that in more detail.
> 
> It is a way to simulate long-tone passages where the bow changes on each note. It also allows you to have a full phrase that is true legato, then you can indicate where the full section changes bow. Because a long true-legato phrase is technically one super long bow without changing direction. Bow attack will allow you to 'change' bow direction at any point within a phrase. It works remarkably well... standby for the video...
> 
> MP



WOW!


----------



## quantum7

REALLY want to see that video.


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

What's with all these good manners? Nobody has even asked the price yet. I sure won't be the first one to do it... o[])


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Bow Attack Overlay Walkthrough!


----------



## Cinesamples

You beat me to it Gabriel


----------



## playz123

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Re. the bow attack overlay:

I can hear it! I can hear it!  Yes, definitely a "new level of realism". I like!


----------



## woodsdenis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

OK I hope I don't start a war here, it is certainly not my intention. I am aware of the silliness that happened the last time.

I certainly here noise on the samples especially in the higher registers, anyone else ?

Caveat,

1. I do not own any other "hi end string libs" so I am not comparing it to anything, or know what is expected.
2. Obviously its youtube and naked, but I am watching/listening in HD
3. I am not for a minute suggesting that there should be a completely noiseless set.
4. This lib would certainly be on my radar as I am a big fan of Cinesamples.

Maybe its the nature of the beast and inherent in Lass/HS etc 

Just a question not a criticism as I don't have this lib or any other hi end string library in front of me.


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Is it just me, or do Mike's hands in these vids look like they belong to the demon child from hell? >8o


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



woodsdenis @ Wed Nov 13 said:


> I certainly here noise on the samples especially in the higher registers, anyone else)



I am not inside your head, so I cant be 100% sure of what you hear, but it's probably the same thing I am hearing. That's the noise of the bow on the strings. It should be there. You will probably be able to get rid of much of this if you don't use the full mix nor close mics.

Same thing happened to Doug and Nick when they did the original EWQLSO. At first, they were like, "what's that weird noise". There is a thread about this on the SO forum from many years ago. I know - I started it. I didn't know what that noise was either.

In any event, I hear the bow noise here, the same as in EWQLSO. It should be there.

Cheers.

--edit--

Here's the thread:

http://www.soundsonline-forums.com/arch ... -3075.html

Check Doug's first post.


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Bow Change Overlay is excellent! Great little detail, looking forward to using that.


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

CineSamples @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> You beat me to it Gabriel



hehe, that's how you see how much eager I'm about it! :D


----------



## Tatu

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

The Violas sound great, not too nasal. Finally.


----------



## woodsdenis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



RiffWraith @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> woodsdenis @ Wed Nov 13 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I certainly here noise on the samples especially in the higher registers, anyone else)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I am not inside your head, so I cant be 100% sure of what you hear, but it's probably the same thing I am hearing. That's the noise of the bow on the strings. It should be there. You will probably be able to get rid of much of this if you don't use the full mix nor close mics.
> 
> Same thing happened to Doug and Nick when they did the original EWQLSO. At first, they were like, "what's that weird noise". There is a thread about this on the SO forum from many years ago. I know - I started it. I didn't know what that noise was either.
> 
> In any event, I hear the bow noise here, the same as in EWQLSO. It should be there.
> 
> Cheers.
> 
> --edit--
> 
> Here's the thread:
> 
> http://www.soundsonline-forums.com/arch ... -3075.html
> 
> Check Doug's first post.
Click to expand...


Tx Jeff, its not hiss but a lower pitched "wind" sound as you described. TBH never noticed it when a room was playing a piece of music, a straight sample is different and more exposed on a single note I suppose.


----------



## paulmatthew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



Tatu @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> The Violas sound great, not too nasal. Finally.



+ 1 Tatu

I was thinking the same thing when I first heard the patch walk through. I thought it was just me. A lot of libraries have a viola that , especially in higher registers , sounds too dry and hurts my ears. I've always liked the sound of violas , just not in sample libraries until now. 
I'm also keen on hearing more of the Bass too . I think it is sometimes the most overlooked of the 4 main orchestral string instruments . I really like this hairpin feature as I mentioned before and the bow attack overlay seems to make nice subtle differences in playing.


----------



## playz123

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



woodsdenis @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> Tx Jeff, its not hiss but a lower pitched "wind" sound as you described. TBH never noticed it when a room was playing a piece of music, a straight sample is different and more exposed on a single note I suppose.



Absolutely. With every string library I have, if you expose some notes on their own, you are going to hear some sort of 'noise', usually generated by the bow etc. But, magically, as soon as the instrument is mixed with other sections or instruments the 'noise' seems to disappear. If one was standing right beside a person playing a violin, one would hear similar sounds, the same sounds a violinist hears. I haven't heard anything here yet that gives me cause for concern, but then again I'm familiar with all the other string libraries.


----------



## Darryl Jackson

Very much looking forward to it! Hoping a release this month means sooner rather than on Nov 28th (but I'm sure that's wishful thinking!). Selfish motive of course: I'm about to get started on a project and based on what I've heard I'd already love to have CineStrings replace my current library for it.

I'm especially excited about the detache bowing solution, as that was what disappointed me the most about certain libraries in the past (alongside the Viola tone).


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



woodsdenis @ Wed Nov 13 said:


> Tx Jeff, its not hiss but a lower pitched "wind" sound as you described.



Right. Do you hear it here?:

http://www.jeffreyhayat.com/vbowsample.mp3

Make sure you have your vol. up a good deal.


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Hi Mike/CineSamples,

CineStrings sounds amazing ! I'm ready to buy. 

Questions : Does the Bow-Attack Overlay feature work in non-legato patches ? 

Just wondering if it is possible to use it in non-legato patches to add more color to the attacks of the various articulations ? 

I look forward to enjoy playing with CineStrings as soon as you release it. 

Oh.. hope the price will sound amazing too :lol: 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## woodsdenis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



RiffWraith @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> woodsdenis @ Wed Nov 13 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tx Jeff, its not hiss but a lower pitched "wind" sound as you described.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Right. Do you hear it here?:
> 
> http://www.jeffreyhayat.com/vbowsample.mp3
> 
> Make sure you have your vol. up a good deal.
Click to expand...


Exactly, you learn something new every day.


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



muziksculp @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> Questions : Does the Bow-Attack Overlay feature work in non-legato patches ?
> 
> Just wondering if it is possible to use it in non-legato patches to add more color to the attacks of the various articulations ?



+1 to bow-attack overlay on trills and tremolos, please


----------



## Damon

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

The Strings sound wonderful Sam Estes! I really love the richness. The harmonics are super nice as well. Congrats to you guys for putting out an awesome library, I bet you guys are ready for the loony bin after all of that sample editing! Sheeeesh! lol


----------



## EwigWanderer

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

I really would like to know about the pro version also. What kind of articulations there might be?


----------



## paulmatthew

CineSamples @ Mon Nov 11 said:


> As far as PRO, nothing truly has been planned yet. We have some general ideas, but those ideas will be really informed by you guys after you get a chance to start working with CORE. Mutes are certainly on that list, portamento and glissando possibly if you really REALLY think you need it.
> 
> One of the things we do when planning libraries, is we surround ourselves and listen to people much smarter than us! (which does include some of you)
> 
> One of the busiest conductors in the Hollywood studio scene advised us on what he saw missing from existing libraries, and things he considered unnecessary. We learned that studio string players in LA these days actively avoid such technique in their playing. However, depending on the styles of music you're doing, you may indeed want that syrupy sweet port/gliss. I will tell you, from the perspective of the Hollywood Scoring musician (which is the sound we're going for in general), this is a very infrequent technique on the stages these days. It's probably a stylistic thing, related to the music that is being created today. We went back and forth on this.. but decided to focus the time and resources on multiple dynamics of legato transitions. If you guys really want it in PRO we will, of course, put it on the list of suggestions.
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> MP



@ EwigWanderer This was posted a few pages back regarding Cinestrings Pro . Cinesamples is open to ideas.


----------



## korgscrew

I'm not sure I agree with mike on those points. I've heard gliss and port on loads of today's movie scores! 

I tend to turn them off, but they are great for those emotional high strings. Elfman uses them a lot, just as an example.


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Also want to note here - that the "dynamic" of the overlay changes with what ever you have your "long" dynamic set to. So if you are using Mod Wheel, and set it to 70, you will get a mf sustain/legato and mf bowattack. 

Second thing to note:
There is backend controls to set where the "velocity" trigger split point is at, as well as the volume of the overlay, default is 111.

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## EwigWanderer

paulmatthew @ 12th November 2013 said:


> @ EwigWanderer This was posted a few pages back regarding Cinestrings Pro . Cinesamples is open to ideas.



Oh, I didn't see it. Must look harder next time. Thanks Paul


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



muziksculp @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> Hi Mike/CineSamples,
> 
> CineStrings sounds amazing ! I'm ready to buy.
> 
> Questions : Does the Bow-Attack Overlay feature work in non-legato patches ?
> 
> Just wondering if it is possible to use it in non-legato patches to add more color to the attacks of the various articulations ?
> 
> I look forward to enjoy playing with CineStrings as soon as you release it.
> 
> Oh.. hope the price will sound amazing too :lol:
> 
> Cheers,
> Muziksculp



Hi Muziksculp. I'm not sure I understand your question. By non-legato patches do you mean patches where the legato is turned off? Or do you mean non-legato patches in other libraries?

Bow Attack Overlay works whenever there is a sustain involved. So you can perform a line, and leave slight gaps to avoid an legato transition.

I think I understand?

M


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Mike - for sure I'll pick this up. Just the 'shorts' will make my workflow MUCH faster. Listened again on GREAT speakers - love Sony. I'll be in line to get this in divisi and solo in THAT room. :wink:


----------



## midi_controller

I'm kind of surprised that there are so many people that seem to want Portamento / Glissando. No matter how you look at it, it's not something that you would want to use except in special circumstances, and the cost of recording it would very likely mean than something else will suffer (less legato dynamics for Con Sordino, or far fewer articulations for example).

If you look at it that way, it just doesn't seem to be something that is needed that badly. It's nice to have, but I'd much rather have more time dedicated to other material than spend so much on something that I wouldn't use very often. It's just too time consuming and costly.

An alternative would be something like recording the sections sliding up, for example, a fifth, with the base note truncated so it's primarily just the slide / end note. Not perfect, but it would leave much more room for other samples, and you can still have that sound available if you need it.

I really dig that bow change overlay, fantastic idea guys! Question about the unison legato (11:50 in the walkthrough). Does that only work once, or can you trigger it multiple times in a row? Just wondering if we can get that https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RpTaACZxoc4 (Philip Glass - The Hours) kind of thing going.


----------



## artinro

midi_controller @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> I'm kind of surprised that there are so many people that seem to want Portamento / Glissando. No matter how you look at it, it's not something that you would want to use except in special circumstances, and the cost of recording it would very likely mean than something else will suffer (less legato dynamics for Con Sordino, or far fewer articulations for example).
> 
> If you look at it that way, it just doesn't seem to be something that is needed that badly. It's nice to have, but I'd much rather have more time dedicated to other material than spend so much on something that I wouldn't use very often. It's just too time consuming and costly.



I completely agree with this. I'd much rather the focus remain on deeply sampling "bread and butter" articulations, as was done here with CS-Core.


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



CineSamples @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> muziksculp @ Tue Nov 12 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Mike/CineSamples,
> 
> CineStrings sounds amazing ! I'm ready to buy.
> 
> Questions : Does the Bow-Attack Overlay feature work in non-legato patches ?
> 
> Just wondering if it is possible to use it in non-legato patches to add more color to the attacks of the various articulations ?
> 
> I look forward to enjoy playing with CineStrings as soon as you release it.
> 
> Oh.. hope the price will sound amazing too :lol:
> 
> Cheers,
> Muziksculp
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Muziksculp. I'm not sure I understand your question. By non-legato patches do you mean patches where the legato is turned off? Or do you mean non-legato patches in other libraries?
> 
> Bow Attack Overlay works whenever there is a sustain involved. So you can perform a line, and leave slight gaps to avoid an legato transition.
> 
> I think I understand?
> 
> M
Click to expand...


Hi Mike,

Maybe my question was not very clear, but yes, I meant if it possible to use the Bow-Attack Overlay (BAO), when the legato function is not enabled. 

So, basically I was wondering if I could still use the BAO when the Legato function is OFF. 

Please correct me, just in case this is not the way the Legato function and BAO work. 

I'm guessing that Legato is a function that can be enabled/disabled by the user. (correct ?) 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## Cinesamples

Muziksculp. Yes it works if legato is off. And you can indeed turn off legato. You can also assign legato "on/off" to a cc controller.


----------



## Diffusor

Sounds great guys! What's that fader controller you are using in the walk-through?


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

Diffusor @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> Sounds great guys! What's that fader controller you are using in the walk-through?



Peavey PC1600X


----------



## muziksculp

CineSamples @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> Muziksculp. Yes it works if legato is off. And you can indeed turn off legato. You can also assign legato "on/off" to a cc controller.



Perfect ! 

Thanks for the feedback.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Harcourt

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Though I think sordino is very important to include in CS Pro, I would love to see a very comprehensive and inclusive library of portamento, glissando and trill string patches. Maybe as a expansion set outside of the pro release. I personally love the sound of 50's and 60's string arrangements in which these articulations were very popular - there is something very creamy and heart felt about the sound.....I'm thinking now in particular of some of Les Baxters's string flourishes of his "Exotica" period.

For instance how would one replicate the trilling (with a glissando I think) sound with a current sample library of the strings playing here? - (between 1:28 and 1:47) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-zxzG7eHQI

That's something I'd love to be able to pull off with a sample library, and I think CS are probably up to the task!


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

@ CS guys

Still thinking about the "bow attack" feature, which already seems great as is. If I've got it straight, it's "on" buy reaching a certain velocity level (111 in the video), then with a CC you decide which attack note you want.

It seemingly might be interesting also to be able to control separately the level (velocity) of the attack note. Did you guys try that?

Thinking then about Pro, you might then consider expanding on the possible attack notes. Something like starting off the string with a fast bow, giving kind of a harsh pronounced attack, where you really hear the bow grab the strings, could be interesting. Also another kind of flautando on-the-string, gradually leaning into it, could be cool.


----------



## Saxer

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



Harcourt @ 13.11.2013 said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-zxzG7eHQI


haha, i love that sound!


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



Harcourt @ Tue Nov 12 said:


> Though I think sordino is very important to include in CS Pro, I would love to see a very comprehensive and inclusive library of portamento, glissando and trill string patches. Maybe as a expansion set outside of the pro release. I personally love the sound of 50's and 60's string arrangements in which these articulations were very popular - there is something very creamy and heart felt about the sound.....I'm thinking now in particular of some of Les Baxters's string flourishes of his "Exotica" period.
> 
> For instance how would one replicate the trilling (with a glissando I think) sound with a current sample library of the strings playing here? - (between 1:28 and 1:47) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c-zxzG7eHQI
> 
> That's something I'd love to be able to pull off with a sample library, and I think CS are probably up to the task!



This should be possible with CineStrings CORE. We have half-step and whole-step trills in all five sections. To replicate your example, I would layer a number of things together, namely the trills with some marcato shorts on each note. All at a really lite CC#1 value. Certainly possible, and just requires some creative midi programming.

Nice piece.

M


----------



## jamwerks

Didn't you guys just also just introduce a release feature for the short notes in the Woodwinds update? Didn't hear that mentioned in the strings. Will that be in the 1.0, or maybe in a planned update?


----------



## Cinesamples

jamwerks @ Wed Nov 13 said:


> Didn't you guys just also just introduce a release feature for the short notes in the Woodwinds update? Didn't hear that mentioned in the strings. Will that be in the 1.0, or maybe in a planned update?



Yes. That feature is also in CineStrings CORE.


----------



## jamwerks

CineSamples @ Wed Nov 13 said:


> Yes. That feature is also in CineStrings CORE.


Cool!


----------



## germancomponist

So, how much? 

I want it, I want it.... . o-[][]-o


----------



## Dan Mott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

I am impressed how simple this looks to use. It seems much simpler than HS. Plus, HS I feel has been abandoned. There has been so many requests for tweaks, but there hasn't been an update in years and there has been no word from anyone if the library is still being worked on.


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Man, those harmonics sure sound beautiful. It all sounds great.


----------



## paulmatthew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Full details page up on the Cinesamples site now , but alas , no pricing yet.It must be close!!

http://cinesamples.com/products/cinestrings/


----------



## james7275

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

good job, Cinesamples - I like what i'm seeing and hearing in your library. the fact that I can load up 4 patches and have all the articulations at my fingertips is very enticing. but i'm pretty content with my current string library, so it's going to have to be a pretty awesome intro price for me to want to jump ship.

I would like to hear more of the legatos playing some faster stuff. are there going to be more exposed demos or is that it?

also, do I need a ssd or will a regular 7200 drive do?

Thanks.


----------



## Ryan

Definitely it sounds good, but I just jumped on the Spitfire wagon (BML). Have to wait a while before I get this. But it really does sound good. i like the intuitive control you get with this.

Best of luck! 

Ryan


----------



## The Darris

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



james7275 @ Wed Nov 13 said:


> good job, Cinesamples - I like what i'm seeing and hearing in your library. the fact that I can load up 4 patches and have all the articulations at my fingertips is very enticing. but i'm pretty content with my current string library, so it's going to have to be a pretty awesome intro price for me to want to jump ship.
> 
> I would like to hear more of the legatos playing some faster stuff. are there going to be more exposed demos or is that it?
> 
> also, do I need a ssd or will a regular 7200 drive do?
> 
> Thanks.



You shouldn't 'need' an SSD to run this library, however it is highly recommended given the shear size of the library. Really the biggest issue you will have with that 7200 HDD will be load times but when you do a batch re-save of the library's location, load times shouldn't be an issue. I've only had problems with the libraries that don't show up in the instrument library pane (ie; ones that need the full version of kontakt to run.) Piano In Blue comes to mind. When I open it for the first time in the morning, it takes at least 5 minutes to load, K5 sometimes crashes in the process.

As far as their intro price, they have been good at keeping that under wraps but given the size of this library compared to their other CineSeries, I would estimate at least 400-500 (300 would be pretty generous). Hell 4-500 would be too. Anyway, I am betting Alex Temple has already pumped out an awesome demo showing off a lot of this library's capabilities and will be showing up soon.


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



The Darris @ Thu Nov 14 said:


> Piano In Blue comes to mind. When I open it for the first time in the morning, it takes at least 5 minutes to load, K5 sometimes crashes in the process.


Seems you might have a problem. Maybe a batch resave would help. I have PIB on a normal 7200 drive, and it loads in just 10-20 seconds.

Cinestrings is sounding great (from the video). As someone said earlier, that room seems particularly beautiful for strings. Hopefully they can swing it to be able to continue with several add-ons.


----------



## Polarity

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



paulmatthew @ Thu 14 Nov said:


> Full details page up on the Cinesamples site now , but alas , no pricing yet.It must be close!!
> 
> http://cinesamples.com/products/cinestrings/



yep, and on the Store page is called CineSrass Core :mrgreen: 
oopss

My question of the day: is CineStrings initially going to be sold alone only, 
or will be included also in some bundle together CineBrass and/or CineWinds?
Thanks


----------



## kfirpr

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



> yep, and on the Store page is called CineSrass Core :mrgreen:
> oopss




LOL you made me laugh


----------



## Harcourt

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



kfirpr @ Thu Nov 14 said:


> yep, and on the Store page is called CineSrass Core :mrgreen:
> oopss
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> LOL you made me laugh
Click to expand...


And its true!


----------



## Harcourt

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



CineSamples @ Thu Nov 14 said:


> This should be possible with CineStrings CORE. We have half-step and whole-step trills in all five sections. To replicate your example, I would layer a number of things together, namely the trills with some marcato shorts on each note. All at a really lite CC#1 value. Certainly possible, and just requires some creative midi programming.
> 
> Nice piece.
> 
> M


Thanks for the reply Mike. Replicating that sound seems like a daunting task. Not being a string player I'm really at a disadvantage - and without the written score, its going to be a difficult exercise. But I'll give it a try. There seems to be some sliding of notes going on in the background, but I can't quite pin it down.


----------



## jaeroe

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

really looking forward to this - excellent stuff! 

re desires for pro - good options for doing proper divisi writing would be a top one for me (and i'm guessing a lot of people). and by that i mean most of the patches you have listed - legatos, the shorts, trills, plus sords. you guys know the type of things being recorded at Sony today...

re port/gliss - for standard fare, i agree that it is not such a hugely needed feature (on the few occasions when i have used it for standard fare stuff, filmmakers ask for it to go away)... LASS does it pretty well, so i'd say if you do it, it should cover some different ground. what i do really use their gliss functions for is avant garde stuff. so, if you offered more controls like longer/more flexible control of gliss time, or could some how use CC to control pitch and have it really float around (think glide on a synth), especially on the divisi patches, this would be outstanding for doing microtonal and more extended technique string stuff - clustered textures, etc. i leave it up to you how you'd control that, but this i would fine hugely useful. the greater the number of accurately divided strings, the better (which i know, makes things tougher for recording and programming....but, it would be awesome and helpful, nonetheless). control over vibrato and dynamics with this is key, as well.

until now - i've just been inserting pitch control on LASS divisi patches on a cc fader. one has to be careful about masking the pitch stretch, but i'm willing to bet you guys could come up with a very cool approach to this. i think there is a much greater need for this today than the golden age of HW sound, at least for those of us working in film today. (and i've never once used gliss/port on a mockup for a record/string arrangement)


----------



## Marius Masalar

"I don't need another string library."
— Me, pre walkthrough video

"Mhmm."
— You Guys

"I need another string library!"
— Me, post walkthrough video

"Mhmm."
— You Guys

("I hate you all."
— My wallet)

Lessons learned here...walkthrough videos sell libraries, putting strings onto the Sony stage is like putting strawberries into chocolate, and there's always room for a fresh approach to a familiar instrument sampling area, especially when it's designed with clever programming features that seem to bring something genuinely new to the table in terms of usability.

I haven't had this kind of "next gen" feeling about strings since Cinematic Strings 2 came out.

Keep the info coming—will likely pick this up as funds permit!


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

Mathazzar @ Thu Nov 14 said:


> "I don't need another string library."
> — Me, pre walkthrough video
> 
> "Mhmm."
> — You Guys
> 
> "I need another string library!"
> — Me, post walkthrough video
> 
> "Mhmm."
> — You Guys
> 
> ("I hate you all."
> — My wallet)
> 
> Lessons learned here...walkthrough videos sell libraries, putting strings onto the Sony stage is like putting strawberries into chocolate, and there's always room for a fresh approach to a familiar instrument sampling area, especially when it's designed with clever programming features that seem to bring something genuinely new to the table in terms of usability.
> 
> I haven't had this kind of "next gen" feeling about strings since Cinematic Strings 2 came out.
> 
> Keep the info coming—will likely pick this up as funds permit!



I definitely had no intentions of getting another string library. With LASS and the Albion series, that's enough for me. But damn it, Cinesamples just have that sounds where they seem to get the clarity and the bigness and the great room sound all at once and also it's just too easy to get to grips with the patches. They just instantly make sense are a breeze to get going with. I love LASS but it's a bit of a complex beast at times. The Cinesamples appraoch to different articulations is very intuitive and I'm used to it from the Brass, Winds are Perc. 

I fear I may be in a losing battle trying to resist this. However Cinesamples pricing strategies actually encourage waiting because they don't tend to offer an initial sale for early adopters, but often have sales later on, whereas Spitfire for example do an introductory price, so you end up diving in more often at the start to save that money. So we'll see, i might wait... unless Cineamples break the trend and offer an introductory sale that is.


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Hi,

Still no CineStrings Price info. 

I wonder if it's all ready to go, except price. or if CineSamples is tweaking it, or adding more features before the official release ? 

Hope it's out very soon.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Cinesamples

RELEASE INFO: CineStrings CORE will be available for purchase and download on Tuesday, November 26th at an introductory price of $429.

Introductory pricing will last one week and then return to $499. Thanks everyone! 

http://cinesamples.com/products/cinestrings/


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

SOLD! Calendaring..


----------



## james7275

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Very generous intro price. It's about what I was expecting.

Now I need to go back and wtch the walkthrough video again to see if I need it.


----------



## feck

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

Awesome, I'm in. HZ percussion and CineStrings on the same day - looks like I will need to take the following few days off to have some fun with both... :D


----------



## germancomponist

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



feck @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> Awesome, I'm in. HZ percussion and CineStrings on the same day - looks like I will need to take the following few days off to have some fun with both... :D



+1

Same here!


----------



## Rob Elliott

CineSamples @ Thu Nov 14 said:


> RELEASE INFO: CineStrings CORE will be available for purchase and download on Tuesday, November 26th at an introductory price of $429.
> 
> Introductory pricing will last one week and then return to $499. Thanks everyone!
> 
> http://cinesamples.com/products/cinestrings/




Extremely fair. Sold.


----------



## Astronaut FX

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



james7275 @ Thu Nov 14 said:


> Very generous intro price. It's about what I was expecting.
> 
> Now I need to go back and wtch the walkthrough video again to see if I need it.




I was half hoping it would be more, so that I wouldn't be able to justify it. :lol: 
At that price, need flies right out of the window.


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

$499? Damn! That means my $999 projection was a wee off... :lol:

$429/$499 is a great deal.

Cheers.


----------



## Dan Mott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

SOLD


----------



## Assa

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*

It really is a reasonable price, I expected it much higher. But I think it would be more tempting for me if it would cost double its price but would also include divisi. The sound is IMO the best I have heard from a string library.


----------



## jaredcowing

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced]*

Well this might be pushing it, but does the SCL discount stack ontop of the introductory pricing? 

Very tempted- the library sounds great!


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

please! Do bigger trills (m3, M3, P4, #4, P5) on PRO... at least for violin 1, violin 2 and viola

Only SS can do that stuff and mixing libraries is wonky...


[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F120194365&secret_url=false[/flash]


----------



## quantum7

Great price!!! Considering that the Adagio's are $1300 combined and the Sable's are $1500 combined, I think that Cinestrings is a steal for $429 and will sell a whole lot of copies I'm betting. Another library for my list.....which NEVER is going to end it seems. It's time I get a job. :lol:


----------



## muziksculp

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced]*

@ CineSamples,

Hi, and Thanks for developing such a wonderful sounding Strings Library, the intro price is great, and so is the regular price. Given the quality this library offers. I'm sure the Pro-version of CineStrings will be another must buy. 

I will be clicking the CineStrings Buy button on Nov. 26th. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## midi_controller

Day one purchase for me, no question. I was anticipating a much higher price, so this is just a total no brainer. A few days later you'll be getting a lot more of my money if you have a sale on Black Friday. I'll be broke by the end of it but so, so happy. :D


----------



## marcotronic

Damn... Looks like I'm in for another strings library... What a beautiful sound.

Marco


----------



## mac4d

Definitely has a great sound. 

Can CineStrings CORE do fast runs (ala CS2 or HS)?


----------



## Apina

Sold!

A must buy.


----------



## jamwerks

Great price! Get ready for some slammed servers...


----------



## Dan Mott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced]*

I'd really like to hear more of the basses. I feel they were very quickly run through in the videos.

Cinesamples. Do you think you could show off the basses a little bit more in solo?


----------



## Jem7

Great news! Now we need audio demos to see how strings sounds in a mix with other instruments.


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



feck @ Thu Nov 14 said:


> Awesome, I'm in. HZ percussion and CineStrings on the same day - looks like I will need to take the following few days off to have some fun with both... :D



And will need a new hard drive on that day too!


----------



## Cinesamples

Here is the first official audio demo of CineStrings CORE. Composed by Alexander Temple of Hollywood Scoring

https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/efzf88jifr775elcidvs (https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/ ... 775elcidvs)


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

CineSamples @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> Here is the first official audio demo of CineStrings CORE. Composed by Alexander Temple of Hollywood Scoring
> 
> https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/efzf88jifr775elcidvs (https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/ ... 775elcidvs)



You beat me to it Mike! 8)


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Good call leading off with the 'shorts' in this demo- all arts sound great, room is lively - but those shorts. :D Finally something to work with that will not take a million hours to program. Congrats.


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced]*

Nice piece, and great sounding strings. I'm surprised at how non-reverbrant it can be. Sounded like little or no surround mic's there (does multi-mic mean "everything up?"). Anyway, lots of great sounding detail there, 3D, and controllable ambience, perfect!


----------



## Cinesamples

Hi Jamwerk. This is using all the mics: SPOT, CLOSE, ROOM, SURROUND

It favors the ROOM mostly with a touch of the others.

We're making a screengrab of the mix settings for you right now...


----------



## germancomponist

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Rob Elliott @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> Good call leading off with the 'shorts' in this demo- all arts sound great, room is lively - but those shorts. :D Finally something to work with that will not take a million hours to program. Congrats.



+100

And I hate it when I have to tweak samples for hours. I have stopped composing a piece sometimes because of that reason... .


----------



## Gerd Kaeding

CineSamples @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> Hi Jamwerk. This is using all the mics: SPOT, CLOSE, ROOM, SURROUND
> 
> It favors the ROOM mostly with a touch of the others.
> 
> We're making a screengrab of the mix settings for you right now...



First of all congratulations to this new library ! Must have been a huge undertaking.
Lots of nice things you've implemented in there ... wonderful.

And also a big "thank you" to Alex Temple for providing this first demo !


I have a question concerning the demo :

Is this an "out-of-the-box" Mix , just dealing with the various Mics to shape the sound ?
Or are there any other third party effects involved ( EQ / add Ambience Rev / Compr / Limit ) . 
Thanks in advance for any infos on this .


Best wishes

Gerd


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

dressed version please


----------



## germancomponist

CineSamples @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> Here is the first official audio demo of CineStrings CORE. Composed by Alexander Temple of Hollywood Scoring
> 
> https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/efzf88jifr775elcidvs (https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/ ... 775elcidvs)



As a side note: Congratulations that you have Box-Net selected to demonstrate the demos!!!

I like it very much to listen to demos in a best quality.


----------



## Jem7

Seems like you guys heard me! It sounds great and very beautiful! 
It could be programmed a bit better but still shows what the library can do!

Yeah please dressed version too.


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Here are the general mix settings for AT's demo:


----------



## Cinesamples

Thanks guys, When you guys say "dressed" what do you mean? Add reverb and EQ?
Or add other libraries to the piece?


----------



## Jem7

CineSamples @ 15/11/2013 said:


> Thanks guys, When you guys say "dressed" what do you mean? Add reverb and EQ?
> Or add other libraries to the piece?



I'm meaning both 
Like hearing final mix of a piece. Of course with other instruments added.


----------



## germancomponist

I fear that in the near future we will hear the string trills very often. At least in trailer music productions.  (Good meant!)


----------



## Cinesamples

Sure, now that we have Brass, Winds, Percussion and Strings, we have the full orchestra now. Working on some demos showcasing all these libraries together shortly.

The "CineSymphony" is almost complete.


----------



## Kivsters

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

It would be really great to hear a Back to the Future cue mockup with just the CineSamples libraries!


----------



## Sid Francis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

I love the 3D-sound it has through the various mic options. And, yes: I also love the shorts.

On the other hand: Andrew Kerestes from LASS once mentioned that they sold a big part of their sordino lib because of the great response to the piece "She was a fair lass" which is a very soft and romantic piece. Since I am NO trailer composer and not involved in "in -your-face" music: can this library also do "soft and heart-melting"? I presume that it is more made for the "slam" side of music because of the beefy general tone but I would love to see myself being wrong. Looking forward to some quieter demos...


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Sid Francis @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> I love the 3D-sound it has through the various mic options. And, yes: I also love the shorts.
> 
> On the other hand: Andrew Kerestes from LASS once mentioned that they sold a big part of their sordino lib because of the great response to the piece "She was a fair lass" which is a very soft and romantic piece. Since I am NO trailer composer and not involved in "in -your-face" music: can this library also do "soft and heart-melting"? I presume that it is more made for the "slam" side of music because of the beefy general tone but I would love to see myself being wrong. Looking forward to some quieter demos...



+1 - that would be a bonus for me - perhaps something in the the vein of JNH's 'I am Legend'. If it could do that 'delicately' with xfade levels (and not volume) - I'd feel I ripped *you* off for the asking price. :wink:


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Sid Francis @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> ...
> On the other hand: Andrew Kerestes from LASS once mentioned that they sold a big part of their sordino lib because of the great response to the piece "She was a fair lass" which is a very soft and romantic piece. ...



"She was a fair lass" didn't use sordino.


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



CineSamples @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> Here are the general mix settings for AT's demo:


Hey, nice to see the settings. That sounds very intimate and detailed. Very excited to know that that's possible and sounds that good. And then to get a sound I'd use more often, maybe just bring down the close and bring in more (all) surround.

The nice thing is that it seems you can get an intimate detailed sound, yet there remains the "air" around everything (not boxy if that makes any sense). o-[][]-o


----------



## Polarity

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Very good demo and thanks for the Wav file quality.

Good to know how you mixed the different mics,
I wonder how the same piece sounds with the full mix only mic.


----------



## quantum7

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Kivsters @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> It would be really great to hear a Back to the Future cue mockup with just the CineSamples libraries!



That would be cool! If they give me an advance copy of Cinestrings I'll do it!!! :mrgreen:


----------



## dedersen

CineSamples @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> Thanks guys, When you guys say "dressed" what do you mean? Add reverb and EQ?
> Or add other libraries to the piece?


Does this mean that Alex's demo is "raw" in the sense that no additional reverb and EQ has been added? If so, that is one damn impressive and very cohesive sound out of the box!


----------



## christianb

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

any possibility of hearing the same cue with the 'full mix' mics only?
thanks if you can.




christianb


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

For your reference, here are each of the individual microphone positions isolated in AT's demo. These are straight out of Kontakt with no reverb:

Full Mix: https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/xaqlpoxldsguidsykx58
Spot: https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/bhzqn5r6tg6n85hprvqb
Close: https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/gplpizlkw2ufofw3395g
Room: https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/m2l33dtds6t6gy6ibl34
Surround: https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/xn1m9zcutfk8umudl2oi

Here is the Multi-Mic mix that we posted earlier:
https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/efzf88jifr775elcidvs (https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/ ... 775elcidvs)

And the mixing settings used in the Multi-mic demo:





MP


----------



## AC986

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Sid Francis @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> I love the 3D-sound it has through the various mic options. And, yes: I also love the shorts.
> 
> On the other hand: Andrew Kerestes from LASS once mentioned that they sold a big part of their sordino lib because of the great response to the piece "She was a fair lass" which is a very soft and romantic piece. Since I am NO trailer composer and not involved in "in -your-face" music: can this library also do "soft and heart-melting"? I presume that it is more made for the "slam" side of music because of the beefy general tone but I would love to see myself being wrong. Looking forward to some quieter demos...



Sid it's definitely got a 'big' sound. A good sound too but I want something smaller. I would get this for the sound alone if I was in the market for a big sound.


----------



## germancomponist

What a SOUND!!!


----------



## Cinesamples

We have a quieter more "sustain" audio demo coming up next...


----------



## paulmatthew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



adriancook @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> Sid it's definitely got a 'big' sound. A good sound too but I want something smaller. I would get this for the sound alone if I was in the market for a big sound.



Same here. I am getting Cinestrings Core , but I would like something smaller too . I hope Cinesamples will consider doing the divisi sections for the Pro version . Recording 4-8 piece string sections would be awesome . Any extra articulations for Core and Pro could then be recorded and brought into an AUX version. :wink:


----------



## jamwerks

Thanks for all those bounces. Top notch on many accounts.

The spot mic's could almost go as a solo strings library! I've been doubling HS with Sable for this "detail" effect. Cool.

Amazing how little room info in those close mic's I wouldn't even have thought that possible in a big room like that. Excellent

Love those mains, and the surrounds really give it the 3D to my ears. Totally excited about these strings!!

EDIT: I sense a major drop in energy between 28"-48". That jumped out to my ears as needing a low level ostinato (the Violin II's playing legato 16ths, alla Mozart), to keep that energy there. :mrgreen:


----------



## germancomponist

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



paulmatthew @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> adriancook @ Fri Nov 15 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sid it's definitely got a 'big' sound. A good sound too but I want something smaller. I would get this for the sound alone if I was in the market for a big sound.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Same here. I am getting Cinestrings Core , but I would like something smaller too . I hope Cinesamples will consider doing the divisi sections for the Pro version . Recording 4-8 piece string sections would be awesome . Any extra articulations for Core and Pro could then be recorded and brought into an AUX version. :wink:
Click to expand...


Guys, hold on! 

Stay now satisfied with what you get with core!


----------



## Cinesamples

jamwerks @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> The spot mic's could almost go as a solo strings library!



Yes, that was the plan with this. But in reality the purpose isn't to say that you can 'simulate the sound of soloists'... but rather have a 'soloist sound' that you can use to layer into a full section - to obtain further realism and presence. That's the thought behind it anyway. 

M


----------



## Rob Elliott

CineSamples @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> jamwerks @ Fri Nov 15 said:
> 
> 
> 
> The spot mic's could almost go as a solo strings library!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, that was the plan with this. But in reality the purpose isn't to say that you can 'simulate the sound of soloists'... but rather have a 'soloist sound' that you can use to layer into a full section - to obtain further realism and presence. That's the thought behind it anyway.
> 
> M
Click to expand...



Brilliant - you just saved me a LOT of time. I used a 'solo strings' library dbl (detail/realism) on 90%+ of my string writing/programming. Many thanks.


----------



## korgscrew

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



feck @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> Awesome, I'm in. HZ percussion and CineStrings on the same day - looks like I will need to take the following few days off to have some fun with both... :D



Errrmm, yeah...about that.

Whats your internet connection speed? 160gig for HZ percussion, plus 50 gig for cine strings. If you have an average connection, id say you need book those days for the week after! :mrgreen:


----------



## Jordan Gagne

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Wasn't convinced by the sound of the mic mix in the demo (especially low strings), but I have to say, those spot mics do sound great. Could be very useful for doubling for detail.


----------



## Jem7

I have a question about performing accents on shorts. Since I like the idea of modwheel controlling dynamics on shorts too, which way will be better to performing accents between 16th note repetitions? Using "KS Vel Dynamic Map"? If so, can you guys could make change mapping by some sort of automation?


----------



## feck

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Full Official Patch Walkthrough Added]*



korgscrew @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> feck @ Fri Nov 15 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Awesome, I'm in. HZ percussion and CineStrings on the same day - looks like I will need to take the following few days off to have some fun with both... :D
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Errrmm, yeah...about that.
> 
> Whats your internet connection speed? 160gig for HZ percussion, plus 50 gig for cine strings. If you have an average connection, id say you need book those days for the week after! :mrgreen:
Click to expand...

Haha - 100 megs down - shouldn't take too long. :D 
I assume the 150GB will be all the different mic setups for HZ - I could be wrong, but if that's the case, I don't do surround so the downloads I will need will most likely be around the 80GB range for those. But if it's more, I certainly won't complain!


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Thanks for posting all those mic positions, very interesting. Overall this doesn't sound as live to me as CineBrass for some reason - I guess the strings don't excite the room to the same extent. It sounds quite a bit more controllable - a terrific sound.

What's the rough balance used in the Dennis Sands mix, out of interest? It's more present than the multi-mic (I notice the built in reverb was off for the full mix pass).


----------



## Dan Mott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

That close mic sound is pretty nice!


----------



## MacQ

Honestly just the room mics plus some reverb would do it for me in 90% of situations. It's really sounding so good!! And I don't gush (usually).


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

To me it sounds like the spot mic could definitely be used for solo passages. Sounds like it really has just the first chair. I'm curious to hear how the non-vibrato to vibrato sounds with that.


----------



## NYC Composer

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

I will make two predictions here.

First, I will buy this library because in general, it sounds fantastic and the price is perfectly reasonable.

Second, people will complain about the fast legato. I won't, because I already know what I'm buying, but I'm pretty sure it won't make me happy.

If/when you start complaining about the fast legato on this thread, please +1 me. 
If you love it, upbraid me with "see????!!"


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



NYC Composer @ Sat Nov 16 said:


> I will make two predictions here.
> 
> First, I will buy this library because in general, it sounds fantastic and the price is perfectly reasonable.
> 
> Second, people will complain about the fast legato. I won't, because I already know what I'm buying, but I'm pretty sure it won't make me happy.
> 
> If/when you start complaining about the fast legato on this thread, please +1 me.
> If you love it, upbraid me with "see????!!"



Ha ha! I have sorta similar feelings, but with at least 50% more optimism. I definitely hear a difference here in terms of overall baked-in ambience compared to CineBrass in particular - it seems considerably dryer overall (to my ears, anyway). And baked in ambience is the single biggest cause of legato issues by far. I was impressed with the parts Mike played in his walkthrough - while the fastest stuff may not have been 100% convincing in terms of sounding like real strings playing quickly, it crucially lacked some of the horrible artefacts you often get with ambient legato patches. I think it's gonna perfectly playable, while there might be some scope for some dedicated future patches for really quick writing, like another recent string library has provided.

So I guess there's a case for a fast / runs legato option in Pro. I know back in the early days of CineBrass, CS talked about bonus patches for owners of both libraries, perhaps there's a case for reviving this idea in this case (cos it would need to make use of Core's sustain samples). The dream ticket would be to create an UberLegato patch, which has scripting to tell the speed of playing and choose a fast or regular legato patch on the fly. Add those controversial ports on low key velocity and that would be CineHeaven for me.


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



NYC Composer @ Sat Nov 16 said:


> people will complain about the fast legato. I won't, because I already know what I'm buying, but I'm pretty sure it won't make me happy.
> 
> If/when you start complaining about the fast legato on this thread, please +1 me.
> If you love it, upbraid me with "see????!!"



You just may be wrong about the legato (I'm hoping so anyway, as you are too I imagine).  

On the Walkthrough video, Mike didn't go into the new legato controls, saying he liked at the mid position. But those are speed, and transition volume controls (iinm), which are present also on the recent CWW 1.1 update. I haven't spent that much time playing them yet they seem to me very useful and musical sounding.

Imo, if an instrument is not in the foreground, and doing some fast ostinato work, speed at 100% and volume at 0-10% sounds great.


----------



## Graham Keitch

CineSamples @ Fri Nov 15 said:


> We have a quieter more "sustain" audio demo coming up next...



Yep, that's what I am going to need to hear too. I'd like to hear a few bars of contrapuntal writing please that demonstrates each of the voices in the string orchestra working in harmony so that one can assess their tonal qualities.

I'm sure this will be an excellent library and I'm pleased with the realistic pricing.

Graham


----------



## ed buller

Hey Mike

lovely library..sweet price too. Quick question, 

Dynamics: is 4 the highest number ? I notice on the shorts , staccato goes from pp to fff wouldn't that be more ?

also in the walkthrough when you get to the col legno's you grab your first fader and the dynamic get's way softer yet in the articulations list on the website it seems that those patches only have one dynamic ?


e


----------



## Guy Rowland

ed buller @ Sat Nov 16 said:


> Hey Mike
> 
> lovely library..sweet price too. Quick question,
> 
> Dynamics: is 4 the highest number ? I notice on the shorts , staccato goes from pp to fff wouldn't that be more ?
> 
> also in the walkthrough when you get to the col legno's you grab your first fader and the dynamic get's way softer yet in the articulations list on the website it seems that those patches only have one dynamic ?
> 
> 
> e



In the video @7m Mike says it is 5 dynamic layers for sustain and 4 for the transition samples in the legato patch. Not sure about the shorts.


----------



## ed buller

yeah but on the website there is an articulations list with RR count and Dynamics available.Seemingly from PP to FFF. Which would suggest 7 layers at the most. 

No dynamics noted for Col Legno or Bartok pizz

E


----------



## Guy Rowland

ed buller @ Sat Nov 16 said:


> yeah but on the website there is an articulations list with RR count and Dynamics available.Seemingly from PP to FFF. Which would suggest 7 layers at the most.
> 
> No dynamics noted for Col Legno or Bartok pizz
> 
> E



I'm sure the chaps will clarify when the west coast awakes. I don't necessarily take it to mean that there is a layer for every gradation, but I can at least answer your original question which was 



ed buller @ Sat Nov 16 said:


> Dynamics: is 4 the highest number ?



With a "no", as there are at least 5 in the sustain patches.


----------



## ed buller

got you...thanks

e


----------



## midi_controller

If you dig through the thread, they said everything was done at 5 dynamics (4 for the legato transitions). I'll add "where applicable" since there are certain techniques they sampled that obviously won't have all 5, like bartok pizzicato.


----------



## handz

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Great sound and price! 

But, I will need to ehar some lyrical, lush,romantic piece before buying - this is something I still miss in string libs. Epic yet lyrical lush sweeping sound.

o/~


----------



## Cinesamples

5 dynamics for all sustains and shorts. 
1 dynamic for Bartok pizz and col legno (only one in reality). We put a very light filter on col legno to give just a subtle control over dyn. 

MP


----------



## ed buller

sweet ...is that 5 for ALL the shorts ?

e


----------



## SF_Guy

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

I have CineBrass Core (and Pro) and have been debating whether to go all in with a Cinesamples orch template or stay with my hyrbrid template with Spitifre, BWW, etc... 

And I've got to say I think CineStrings just sold me. The ease of use and quality of sound are really hard to beat. So many of my gigs are project based, so if I'm faster I earn more $$$. I hate spending time futzing around with libraries. I just don't have that kind of time.

My requests would be to:

1.) Make the Cinestrings Pro library an expansion of the same sized ensemble - practical patches = playable runs, etc...
2.) Release a completely separate Divisi string library (in Sony of course) - Core and Pro editions. Record the players in the correct Divisi positions.
3.) Make an expansion to CineWinds = ensemble patches and a runs builder. Frankly like BWW. Hollywoodwinds is great (and I own it), but it's not in Sony.
4.) Create Sordino versions of both string libraries.

Thanks for creating such fantastic tools!


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



SF_Guy @ Sat Nov 16 said:


> 3.) Make an expansion to CineWinds = ensemble patches and a runs builder. Frankly like BWW. Hollywoodwinds is great (and I own it), but it's not in Sony.



+1000. I still feel the CineSymphony is a bit incomplete for this reason. I believe there are a lot of us who prefer to write by instrument (e.g., one track for flutes, another for oboes, etc). I have HWW and Cinewinds Core & Pro and I still can't accomplish this very standard way of writing. Right now I'm layering the 2 different flute patches, for example, through one MIDI channel to try to fake a full section. Of course it's actually only 2 soloists and each instrument has a slightly different range, which doesn't allow this approach to work. It all requires a lot of tweaking and still isn't to my liking. HWW has nice runs but, as stated above, sound different than the rest of the winds because it's an older library recorded in a different location.

I don't want to drop $600 on BWW. I'd much rather stick with the Sony sound to complete my template, since all other sections will be Cine. I would gladly pay a little extra for this "expansion" volume featuring sections and especially for a runs builder, all recorded at Sony. Pretty please!


----------



## Cinesamples

ed buller @ Sat Nov 16 said:


> sweet ...is that 5 for ALL the shorts ?
> 
> e



Most have 5 layers of dynamics for shorts. Some of the longer 'shorts' are 3-4. 

Most have 5 layers of dynamics each for sustain non vib, sustain vib, sustain exp vib. 

2 dynamics for tremolo, sul pont, half step trills, whole step trills, harmonics

We will create a comprehensive list of exactly what was sampled. Going off my poor memory here.


----------



## Cinesamples

I also didn't mention, but in addition to the shorts of three lengths there is sfortzando. That is used primarily for the bow attack feature.


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Maestro77 @ Sat Nov 16 said:


> SF_Guy @ Sat Nov 16 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 3.) Make an expansion to CineWinds = ensemble patches and a runs builder. Frankly like BWW. Hollywoodwinds is great (and I own it), but it's not in Sony.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +1000. I still feel the CineSymphony is a bit incomplete for this reason. I believe there are a lot of us who prefer to write by instrument (e.g., one track for flutes, another for oboes, etc). I have HWW and Cinewinds Core & Pro and I still can't accomplish this very standard way of writing. Right now I'm layering the 2 different flute patches, for example, through one MIDI channel to try to fake a full section. Of course it's actually only 2 soloists and each instrument has a slightly different range, which doesn't allow this approach to work. It all requires a lot of tweaking and still isn't to my liking. HWW has nice runs but, as stated above, sound different than the rest of the winds because it's an older library recorded in a different location.
> 
> I don't want to drop $600 on BWW. I'd much rather stick with the Sony sound to complete my template, since all other sections will be Cine. I would gladly pay a little extra for this "expansion" volume featuring sections and especially for a runs builder, all recorded at Sony. Pretty please!
Click to expand...


We are going to re-amp Hollywoodwinds into the MGM Scoring Stage very soon. Also note that we also sampled string runs in the same patterns as HWW. They will blend nicely with the re-amped WW runs.


----------



## Ed

I havent commented yet but Im very impressed by these walkthroughs.... 

If I didnt have so many string libs right now I'd definitely get it. I don't know if its just a clever ruse but it seems very consistent and a really natural smooth sound. Some of the best strings I've heard, from what I've heard.

Has anyone mentioned that "hairpin" creator is like a faked version of the "dynamic bowings" of Adagio? I quite like that idea, seems most libraries could take advantage of a similar system.


----------



## germancomponist

I have listened today in my studio and am so very much impressed by the sound of this strings!


----------



## The Darris

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



CineSamples @ Sat Nov 16 said:


> We are going to re-amp Hollywoodwinds into the MGM Scoring Stage very soon. Also note that we also sampled string runs in the same patterns as HWW. They will blend nicely with the re-amped WW runs.



+1 on this. 

I am incredibly excited that HWW will be getting a face lift in Sony as well as having the string runs to complement it. As soon as you all get ready to release one big library, you tease the idea of some other awesome content. Keep up the great work!!


----------



## olajideparis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



SF_Guy @ Sat Nov 16 said:


> I have CineBrass Core (and Pro) and have been debating whether to go all in with a Cinesamples orch template or stay with my hyrbrid template with Spitifre, BWW, etc...
> 
> And I've got to say I think CineStrings just sold me. The ease of use and quality of sound are really hard to beat. So many of my gigs are project based, so if I'm faster I earn more $$$. I hate spending time futzing around with libraries. I just don't have that kind of time.
> 
> My requests would be to:
> 
> 1.) Make the Cinestrings Pro library an expansion of the same sized ensemble - practical patches = playable runs, etc...
> 2.) Release a completely separate Divisi string library (in Sony of course) - Core and Pro editions. Record the players in the correct Divisi positions.
> 3.) Make an expansion to CineWinds = ensemble patches and a runs builder. Frankly like BWW. Hollywoodwinds is great (and I own it), but it's not in Sony.
> 4.) Create Sordino versions of both string libraries.
> 
> Thanks for creating such fantastic tools!



All very good suggestions. Again guys don't be afraid to charge us whatever you need to to make this library profitable. You have a good opportunity here to create the BEST string library made and you are on the right track. 

As for HWW and CW its great that it is getting a facelift and I'm looking forward to it. As much as I like the idea of playable runs for strings, it's 2013 and with libraries like BWW and CS2 out there that can achieve runs so well for winds and strings respectively I think it is really important that you give users the ability to "roll their own" as it were in addition to providing them with some useable pre-fabricate runs.

Despite my partialness to BWW for its completeness and flexibility I still really WANT to get CW+CWP because I already have your brass and will most certainly be picking up your percussion and strings as well. That said I am watching closely to see what you are going to do to put your winds on the level of your brass. And try not to think of it as doing a Cinesamples version of BWW. Just look at what you did with cinebrass core + pro. With those two libraries you are able to achieve nearly any style of detailed brass writing that can be imagined. So I think ultimately what we are waiting for is you to give us a wind section that can facilitate the kind of detailed writing that is possible with cinebrass core+ pro. When its all said and done what I would REALLY love is a wind library that would give me the flexibility to create the kind of patterns and runs that are included in HWW manually. I hope that helps you better understand what I and possibly other users are looking for.

Sorry to go on about winds again as I realize this is the strings thread but since it'd been mentioned by a couple of people I thought I'd just chime in and give my two cents. 

I'll take some time to think more about what I'd like to see in HS pro over the next couple of weeks and post it here. In the meantime, keep up the good work!

Best,
OP


----------



## olajideparis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread!*



Peter Alexander @ Mon Aug 26 said:


> 1. Once you release CineStrings, you will now be the third company to have a complete library of strings, woods, brass, and percussion. Spitfire will be the fourth.
> 
> Therefore, the strings must be impeccable as they will be the springboard for buying an ez-2-mix complete orchestra from you.
> 
> 2. The bowing that is most used in real life playing is also the bowing that is the most neglected - detache. Going back to the original Miroslav strings, a .5, .7, and .9 in length by seconds is needed. The .9 is about the length in Mozart's _A Little Night Music_.
> 
> 3. The ultimate test of a string lib is a sectional sound in multipart harmony. Since you have most of JW's scores, see _Across the Stars_ and _Hymn to the Fallen_. Another is Walton's _Princes In the Tower_ from the movie _Richard III_.
> 
> 4. Not offering divisi in the Pro is a mistake. You have all of these libraries recorded in one room (Sony) and anything else that's divisi is NOT recorded in that one room.
> 
> 5. Don't. Rush.



Sorry guys needed to bump this. 1000% agreed!


----------



## Dan Mott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Divisi is a must. Something new to the table.

also. Smooth dyanmic crossfading through out the whole library. Too many string libs have all these sudden bumps in dynamics which makes working with the library tedious.

I'd be very happy with that.


----------



## Harcourt

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

A few requests for the Pro or Expansion edition in cases where these can't be recreated with scripting in Core: Sul Ponticello, Ricochet/Jeté, Martele, Flautando, Collé, Détaché, Louré, Sautillé and Portato (with sour cream). o/~


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Dan Mott @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> Divisi is a must.



But is it?

Divisi, of all things, requires a lot of careful thought - even when merely requesting it as a feature. "I want detache, non-trem sul pont and divisi" - that was really easy for me to type those three requests as if all have equal weight.

To do it properly, divisi is a huge deal, with a huge implication for both resources and cost. It's essentially saying "Hey, Core looks great. Now just do exactly the same thing 3 or 4 more times, will you?" Which equates to more or less 3 or 4 times the production cost and time required. But since we're going to do it, we really need to go for it with all articulations, including real (not faked) sordino. So let's ramp that up to 6-8 times the cost. So I make that, with an introductory discount, $3,432.

Now, maybe this is justified. In practice, I'm sure you could do it for less - fewer musicians in total, you could probably production-line the process a little. Maybe it would be $2,500 with that discount. But that assumes that the sales projections would be simlar to Core in order to recoup the costs - I'd be highly doubtful about that. I don't know if the business model would be sustainable - perhaps at $5k plus?

See, it opens a huge can of very expensive worms. Now, I love divisi - I've been evangelical about auto-divisi for years, and the realism that brings. But can we expect that in every library? Personally I think not. Personally I'd rather a similarly priced expansion to Core that focuses on other things - playable runs, fast legato, port, grace notes, measured trems, maybe a few other artics. I'm slightly ambivalent about Sordino for similar reasons - it doubles the cost,, and selfishly I have some great sordinos already. Might be nice to have a fake sordino button in 1.1 though, if the effect were convincing enough with tonal impulse responses.


----------



## Dan Mott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Guy Rowland @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> Dan Mott @ Sun Nov 17 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Divisi is a must.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> But is it?
> 
> Divisi, of all things, requires a lot of careful thought - even when merely requesting it as a feature. "I want detache, non-trem sul pont and divisi" - that was really easy for me to type those three requests as if all have equal weight.
> 
> To do it properly, divisi is a huge deal, with a huge implication for both resources and cost. It's essentially saying "Hey, Core looks great. Now just do exactly the same thing 3 or 4 more times, will you?" Which equates to more or less 3 or 4 times the production cost and time required. But since we're going to do it, we really need to go for it with all articulations, including real (not faked) sordino. So let's ramp that up to 6-8 times the cost. So I make that, with an introductory discount, $3,432.
> 
> Now, maybe this is justified. In practice, I'm sure you could do it for less - fewer musicians in total, you could probably production-line the process a little. Maybe it would be $2,500 with that discount. But that assumes that the sales projections would be simlar to Core in order to recoup the costs - I'd be highly doubtful about that. I don't know if the business model would be sustainable - perhaps at $5k plus?
> 
> See, it opens a huge can of very expensive worms. Now, I love divisi - I've been evangelical about auto-divisi for years, and the realism that brings. But can we expect that in every library? Personally I think not. Personally I'd rather a similarly priced expansion to Core that focuses on other things - playable runs, fast legato, grace notes, measured trems, maybe a few other artics. I'm slightly ambivalent about Sordino for similar reasons - it doubles the cost,, and selfishly I have some great sordinos already. Might be nice to have a fake sordino button in 1.1 though, if the effect were convincing enough with tonal impulse responses.
Click to expand...



I agree with you mostly. However, I love divisi and many times I've found my self wanting to use it, but properly you know. I'd love it if perhaps this could be a completely different library. Or somehow, just split up the amount of players from the original recording sessions like in HS, but not in MONO, which was a big mistake from EW.


Yeah, I'd love to have some sordino samples. Fast legato, even portamento for the expansion. Portamento can be very expressive if used well, so I don't know why many people around here don't care for it so much.

However. Imagine divisi recorded the same way in Sony, as well as chamber strings. Ahh, would be sweet.


----------



## midi_controller

@Guy: I think the problem is you are thinking of divisi in the way that LASS did it, which wouldn't be what CineStrings would need. We already have the full ensemble, why would we need to try and replicate it with 3 divisi ensembles? I think half sections would be the best route, since I see that far more often than splitting the sections into 3 parts, and we would only need one recording of it. I have an idea of how it could work but I'm waiting until after Core comes out before throwing my ideas out there, I'm sure the Cinesamples guys have their hands full right now!

But these are the things you should all start thinking about before making suggestions for Pro. Think about what you really need, and think about how much that articulation will cost Cinesamples in terms of time and money (which are not infinite), and that by asking for one thing you might lose something else.

@Dan Mott: It's not that I don't care for portamento, it's that the time and resources that would be required to sample it would very likely mean that something else that I would use much more often might not be sampled as thoroughly or may not even be sampled at all. It's a pick your battles kind of thing and portamento just consumed too much for something that is typically used so sparingly.


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Haven't of course yet been able to compare side by side HS with the upcoming Cinestrings (what will be the correct abreviation by the way, CS is already taken?), but yesterday I listened carefully to my HS template, and I think CineS will be a be step forward. Being able to work with 3 mic positions would help HS, but Play doesn't seem to handle it.

Lots of sonic options seem possible with CineS, and if it seems economically viable for them, I'm sure they'll do several volumes (Sordino, Pro, etc.).


----------



## Guy Rowland

midi_controller @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> @Guy: I think the problem is you are thinking of divisi in the way that LASS did it, which wouldn't be what CineStrings would need. We already have the full ensemble, why would we need to try and replicate it with 3 divisi ensembles? I think half sections would be the best route, since I see that far more often than splitting the sections into 3 parts, and we would only need one recording of it. I have an idea of how it could work but I'm waiting until after Core comes out before throwing my ideas out there, I'm sure the Cinesamples guys have their hands full right now!



I only know of 1 library that tried anything that way, and I think it's fair to say it wasn't viewed as a success. Interested to hear any new ideas / approach though.

But you've hit on the real problem - we already have the full sections (unlike LASS, whose full sections are made up of divisi). Maybe its my lack of imagination, but I still can't think of a way to do a successful shortcut, keeping that great tone in the great space but breaking down the section sizes. Also I do think 3 divisi (+FC?) is definitely more useful than 2.

In general, I completely agree about picking your battles. Portamento is very divisive - I think it mostly depends on the kind of writing you do as to whether you perceive a need for it, and we're all different there.


----------



## Harcourt

midi_controller @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> It's a pick your battles kind of thing and portamento just consumed too much for something that is typically used so sparingly.


.....probably is used so sparingly because its typically not given much of a priority when developing sample libraries. Maybe if it were better and more comprehensively sampled, it would have wider appeal. Maybe its just no longer a fashionable sound as it was in previous decades. I mostly love the sound, depending on how its used. And I guess its just an aesthetic consideration. 

I think there's a gap in the market waiting to be filled. I would happily pay my $s for a decent gliss/porta library.


----------



## Polarity

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

I agree with Guy Rowland about Divisi matter.

Personally I don't care much about them... infact I have LASS Lite and not the FULL vesion.
I believe you should do a PRO with all other important things and, IF so many people and YOU really want, do a separate (PRO2 maybe) pack for Divisi...
beacause also I believe it will be double if not four time the effort, time and costs for realizing it.

Nice idea about an emulated Sordino, with a button and an impulse! 
If is it possible to do for a close to real effect.
Better than nothing sometimes.

Great to hear about a HWW re-amp with Sony hall sound..
I use it a lot for Winds sections... and going to buy CB, CBP after CineS, that would sure raise my interest for it too.


----------



## midi_controller

3 part divisi might be nice to have, but again it's not used anywhere near as much as 2 part, and 2 part is easier to set up as well. Since each desk will split the part, all you really need to do is set up the section as if it was full sized, and just seat one musician per desk instead of two. It will also sound more natural when you play the 2 parts since the musicians would be so close to each other anyway.

3 part is much trickier for this kind of library, both in it's setup and the way it would sound when played back in 3 parts with one recording, which might not sound as natural. Even LASS wasn't really 3 part (it was sampled 1/4, 1/4, 1/2). Again, I'm just going for what I see being used the most, which is 2 part by a mile.

The only library I know of that did something similar would be Adagio, and I think it's safe to say it was a pretty successful library, and that part of it worked really well.

Ugh, I just realized we still have 9 days before release. The anticipation is killing me! :D


----------



## jcs88

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Loved the demo, and the intro pricing. Guess I'll have another string library to play with. I love the speed features of the library.


----------



## Guy Rowland

midi_controller @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> 3 part divisi might be nice to have, but again it's not used anywhere near as much as 2 part, and 2 part is easier to set up as well. Since each desk will split the part, all you really need to do is set up the section as if it was full sized, and just seat one musician per desk instead of two. It will also sound more natural when you play the 2 parts since the musicians would be so close to each other anyway.
> 
> 3 part is much trickier for this kind of library, both in it's setup and the way it would sound when played back in 3 parts with one recording, which might not sound as natural. Even LASS wasn't really 3 part (it was sampled 1/4, 1/4, 1/2). Again, I'm just going for what I see being used the most, which is 2 part by a mile.
> 
> The only library I know of that did something similar would be Adagio, and I think it's safe to say it was a pretty successful library, and that part of it worked really well



Hadn't realised about the latter library. Well, it all goes to show its a thorny area - if it was gonna be divisi, I'd definitely want 3 part with an auto arranger. To please everyone, it would cost megabucks. To please some, it would be cheaper, but cheap enough for what would be a reduced market?

Tricky.

So I guess how this all works is through the debate here, the CS guys will best evaluate the most asked for features vs production cost etc. Will be very interesting to see how it turns out, also how the companion to HWW works (and if that has the same branding etc).


----------



## ed buller

i'd like some divisi. I agree two part is much more useful. Also you wouldn't need as many articulations maybe. Same with Sordino. You aren't really going to need all those shorts. Not that bothered about portamento . It's a nice effect certainly but it can sound very overused. 

i'd really like to see more articulations with the standard setup TBH. What's in core for the price is great though .maybe some ultra shorts and different trems. measured would be very useful.


the other thing that would be great is some sort of tool in the kontakt player for this library that let you change the duration of the sample. This an enormous plus for VSL as with strings especially you might find playing back a bit of midi you just can't find the right articulation. with a little fiddling its quickly solved . I really like the Cinesamples note length philosophy but it's obvious Achilles heel is its tempo dependant . It would be great if they wrote some magic that let us shorten or lengthen the sample a bit in playback .......tears of joy round my house there would be...tears of joy !!

just my 2 cents

e


----------



## Cinesamples

ed buller @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> i'd like some divisi. I agree two part is much more useful. Also you wouldn't need as many articulations maybe. Same with Sordino. You aren't really going to need all those shorts. Not that bothered about portamento . It's a nice effect certainly but it can sound very overused.
> 
> i'd really like to see more articulations with the standard setup TBH. What's in core for the price is great though .maybe some ultra shorts and different trems. measured would be very useful.
> 
> 
> the other thing that would be great is some sort of tool in the kontakt player for this library that let you change the duration of the sample. This an enormous plus for VSL as with strings especially you might find playing back a bit of midi you just can't find the right articulation. with a little fiddling its quickly solved . I really like the Cinesamples note length philosophy but it's obvious Achilles heel is its tempo dependant . It would be great if they wrote some magic that let us shorten or lengthen the sample a bit in playback .......tears of joy round my house there would be...tears of joy !!
> 
> just my 2 cents
> 
> e



You can indeed control the lengths of the shorts. Just lift the note earlier and it pulls in a release sample. Possible now in CineBrass and CineWinds now too.


----------



## ed buller

yes but the sample is mealy cut short......not shortened . In the VSL it acts like a time stretch i guess. Very cool feature.

e


----------



## jamwerks

The VSL time stretching is amazing. If Kontakt one day gave the same feature (already a couple of years old), that would make all our Kontakt libraries more versatile and musical.

The new Cinesamples feature seems not to just "cut short" the sample, but rather cut it short and add a release. Not sure how that works, but if it brings on the release earlier (essentially reducing the "hold" part of the sample), that might get very close to the results VIP gets. I look forward to learning more about this feature.


----------



## KingIdiot

jamwerks @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> The VSL time stretching is amazing. If Kontakt one day gave the same feature (already a couple of years old), that would make all our Kontakt libraries more versatile and musical.
> 
> The new Cinesamples feature seems not to just "cut short" the sample, but rather cut it short and add a release. Not sure how that works, but if it brings on the release earlier (essentially reducing the "hold" part of the sample), that might get very close to the results VIP gets. I look forward to learning more about this feature.



Kontakt 5's time stretch is pretty good, Really it's up to the developers to implement and it can be resource hoggy, but also it's not used because it has the possibility of adding phasing artifacts in the relationship between multiple mic options. Almost all Time stretching will do this, which is why developers who do multiple mic variations tend not to, or only offer this (and some tuning options) across one mic.

There are ways around it offline, it's just a matter of development ideals.

I've got a offline process that creates time stretch across multiple mics that is phase coherent/minimal phase shift that I used in some libraries. Using actual time manipulation algos, not splice/edit/xfade. So it's possible. But in a case like cinestrings, it would add multiple samples multiplied by mic choices, which might just be considered sample bloat by some.

The whole play and release trigger thing works really well when done/planned correctly, especially with scripted releases, it plays nice. All of which I'm sure the crazy dudes at cinesamples did. They look to be awesome with scripts! And they seem to have gotten some real consistency in the samples, from the walkthrough. Which is key to making that process work.

in all honesty K5's TMpro has not so obvious artifacts with large mic distances, but the minute you have something that has only a few feet, or duplicate mics between mic choices, and things can get a little blurry sounding depending on mixing and matching mics.

the other key is making sure the time adjustment is consistent, but that's super duper easy.

anyway, just clarifying that Kontakt has the feature, and it's pretty damn good in K5. Sucks toes in K4 though, which I guess some people might be into. But comparing VSL which is one stereo sample, against something like this which has a million (or HZ which by my inflation has a billion) doesn't take into account some of the concerns the process brings into play.

there are also other issues of course, that make for different reasons on why to use/not use time stretching, like the room reflection changes, etc. blah blah blah TMI


----------



## Cinesamples

ed buller @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> yes but the sample is mealy cut short......not shortened . In the VSL it acts like a time stretch i guess. Very cool feature.
> 
> e



If one were to time stretch the sample, that would time stretch the release too, creating the illusion of a much smaller room. Not the ideal solution.


----------



## KingIdiot

CineSamples @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> ed buller @ Sun Nov 17 said:
> 
> 
> 
> yes but the sample is mealy cut short......not shortened . In the VSL it acts like a time stretch i guess. Very cool feature.
> 
> e
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If one were to time stretch the sample, that would time stretch the release too, creating the illusion of a much smaller room. Not the ideal solution.
Click to expand...


not if you do it with compensation techniques. There's lots of ways around that.

you wont be able to change the effect it has on fast early reflections from the attacks though, especially on short notes, but releases are easy to get around


----------



## benmrx

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

First off: The library sounds GREAT!! It's pretty much exactly what I was hoping it would be.

BIG +1 for a 2 part Divisi option in Pro _or_ further expansion. Obviously everyone has their own checklist, but for me the Div option could be _really_ stripped down. 

1. Sus with an optional scripted Legato (3 dyn layers)
2. Spic (2-4 RR)
3. Trem (2 dyn layers)

Maybe even do a Div Core and Div Pro library?


----------



## germancomponist

KingIdiot @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> CineSamples @ Sun Nov 17 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ed buller @ Sun Nov 17 said:
> 
> 
> 
> yes but the sample is mealy cut short......not shortened . In the VSL it acts like a time stretch i guess. Very cool feature.
> 
> e
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If one were to time stretch the sample, that would time stretch the release too, creating the illusion of a much smaller room. Not the ideal solution.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> not if you do it right. There's lots of ways around that.
Click to expand...


Believe me, I am a master in doing this.  There are ways to get good results, but not best results. It also takes a lot of time. I did many many experiments with this.... .

But hey, here it is sunday evening and I thought we could have the pleasure to listen to another demo?


----------



## KingIdiot

germancomponist @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> KingIdiot @ Sun Nov 17 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CineSamples @ Sun Nov 17 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ed buller @ Sun Nov 17 said:
> 
> 
> 
> yes but the sample is mealy cut short......not shortened . In the VSL it acts like a time stretch i guess. Very cool feature.
> 
> e
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If one were to time stretch the sample, that would time stretch the release too, creating the illusion of a much smaller room. Not the ideal solution.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> not if you do it right. There's lots of ways around that.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> Believe me, I am a master in doing this.  There are ways to get good results, but not best results. It also takes a lot of time. I did many many experiments with this.... .
Click to expand...


Trust man, so have I. And I still do all the time. Offline you can do some incredible things these days. That I wish more people would do and I wish I could do to existing libs for everyone. But I don't want to detract from Cinesamples release on a discussion about Time Manipulation of audio. Just wanted to clarify.

More demos, and good luck guys!


----------



## germancomponist

KingIdiot @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> Trust man, so have I. And I still do all the time. Offline you can do some incredible things these days. That I wish more people would do and I wish I could do to existing libs for everyone. But I don't want to detract from Cinesamples release on a discussion about Time Manipulation of audio. Just wanted to clarify.
> 
> More demos, and good luck guys!



+1

A long time ago I did it with EWQLSO Platinum and ended up with, for example: Staccato, short staccato, very short staccato, fast runs, very fast runs e.t.c. ... . 

But, nothing beats real recordings!


----------



## Cinesamples

Very interesting. Would like to hear what you guys did and how you achieved it. And namely any procedures for applying equally over multiple mic positions.


----------



## Cinesamples

More demos coming this week. Trying to take a day off today.


----------



## germancomponist

CineSamples @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> Very interesting. Would like to hear what you guys did and how you achieved it. And namely any procedures for applying equally over multiple mic positions.



Ha ha... . 

The reason why I said you can get good results, but not best results! o-[][]-o o/~


----------



## KingIdiot

CineSamples @ Sun Nov 17 said:


> Very interesting. Would like to hear what you guys did and how you achieved it. And namely any procedures for applying equally over multiple mic positions.



sent you a PM. I've come up with a process that works across multiple mics, have used it already in commercial libs. Should translate to your stuff, can only really tell with testing and refining.


----------



## ed buller

hm

this sounds fab. I can understand the phase problems could be enormous but it really would add a lot of value to these libraries if there was some control over the sample length . But mike makes a good point, it really would sound naff if the room sample was effected too. The VSL stuff is bone dry so not a problem but an obvious feature of the cinesamples stuff is the ambience. Though if they are separate release samples there should be a way round it. 

e


----------



## Polarity

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

hmm perhaps is a stupid question, but I wonder if with CineStrings, CineBrass and so on it is possible to route every single mic position to different Kontakt outputs.
I guess not, right?


----------



## Jem7

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Polarity @ 18/11/2013 said:


> hmm perhaps is a stupid question, but I wonder if with CineStrings, CineBrass and so on it is possible to route every single mic position to different Kontakt outputs.
> I guess not, right?



It is possible.


----------



## Cinesamples

Here is another quick audio demo, demonstrating some of the more delicate aspects of CineStrings CORE.
Composed by Sebastien Najand of Hollywood Scoring:

Multi-Mic MIX: https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/4an70fo842wutfomvs6v

Here are the splits:

FULL MIX DRY https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/wxtctnhm4nju1qtkz2va
SPOT https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/9gq4y4qomduo0is4w5eu
CLOSE https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/phr1kaqyhi8fy0f0xc9y
ROOM https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/70kuxrz0b90nv9apgld4
SURROUND https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/p23l9gdv19nee1uo7bp5


MP


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

The link to the Multi-Mic MIX is private.

--edit-- not anymore...


----------



## jamwerks

Sounds great !

Love those PP samples in the first part.

Edit: Forgot to mention, even in the soft passages, absolutely no preamp noise !!


----------



## Guy Rowland

These sound terrific. Definitely more dry to my ears than CB - listen to that sudden silence @1.14 on the full mix dry, then cf with the Multi Mic Mix. That's kinda what I'm talking about, I think there's more of a need for artificial tail here, which is good news for ambient legato moaners like me. It's still clearly in a great space, but it sounds under control. The final mix with reverb sounds great. 

(and is that the bow change legato at 1'05? Sounds fantastic).


----------



## reddognoyz

WOW. I mentioned this before, but I think that room is in love with the lower register instruments. Such a nice bloom in the cellos and bass. Listen to the spot mics and see how much glory that room is adding.....


----------



## germancomponist

NICE!


----------



## Sid Francis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

The strings really love the Sony stage most. wow.


----------



## tmm

Ha, yep, that sounds like the Sony stage. Great tone!


----------



## ed buller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

glorious sound. Bottom end is wonderful

good job

e


----------



## Cinesamples

Here's where we'll be putting the audio demos as we create them: https://soundcloud.com/cinesamples/sets ... core-demos


----------



## germancomponist

@CS, have you read my pm?


----------



## Saxer

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

beautiful sound and composition! warm and emotional but very detailed. no "midi-pad"-feeling at all!


----------



## tmm

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Saxer @ Mon Nov 18 said:


> no "midi-pad"-feeling at all!



+1 yes, exactly! and it takes a lot for sustaining strings not to sound paddy to me.


----------



## marcotronic

The demos sound so gorgeous. Probably the best CineSamples library ever.

Marco


----------



## james7275

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

I have to agree with Guy on this one. It's amazing how dry the samples sound considering such a large space. I think I liked the raw sound better than the one with reverb. And i'm really digging the intimate and defined sound of the spot mics.


----------



## germancomponist

+1

Listen to the most scores.  

I for myself never liked it if there is too much reverb used. As an effect, ok, but not the whole track.


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

How about accepting preorders? And if it's ready a few days before, you could (secretly) get us(!) downloading, so as to free up your servers for the launch!


----------



## Inceptic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Fantastic demos. Does anyone know what the price will be after the introductory offer?


----------



## Cinesamples

Price is $429 for the first week. Then $499 thereafter.


----------



## midi_controller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Inceptic @ Tue Nov 19 said:


> Fantastic demos. Does anyone know what the price will be after the introductory offer?



$499. Even at that price this sounds like a steal. I've spent nearly that much on single sections before.


----------



## Simon Ravn

Really amazing sound at an amazing price! I'll join the "sold" choir


----------



## reddognoyz

"talk about mudflaps Cinestring's got 'em"

-Nigel


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

I didn't see it mentioned in the walk through, but I assume that cinestrings has the same double and triple hit shorts by key switch like the brass and winds have, right?


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



Echoes in the Attic @ Tue Nov 19 said:


> I didn't see it mentioned in the walk through, but I assume that cinestrings has the same double and triple hit shorts by key switch like the brass and winds have, right?



Good question!


----------



## Cinesamples

Double tongue, and triple tongue is not currently available in CineStrings CORE. Perhaps in an update.

We'd definitely have to call it something different though.  Any ideas?


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

CineSamples @ Wed Nov 20 said:


> Double tongue, and triple tongue is not currently available in CineStrings CORE. Perhaps in an update.
> 
> We'd definitely have to call it something different though.  Any ideas?



Double/Triple Stroke? Measured Tremolo Keyswitch?


----------



## duanran007

CineSamples @ Tue Nov 19 said:


> Double tongue, and triple tongue is not currently available in CineStrings CORE. Perhaps in an update.
> 
> We'd definitely have to call it something different though.  Any ideas?



Double arm? Triple arm？ o


----------



## pkm

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

double/triple bow?


----------



## mikebarry

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Here is a demo showing the transparent nature of the strings, and how they sit well with the brass of the same name.

*Medal of Saving Brothers *
https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/59unp5atseqkttw7wgh4


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Measured tremolo a definite must for the soon(!) upcoming Pro


----------



## jamwerks

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



mikebarry @ Wed Nov 20 said:


> Here is a demo showing the transparent nature of the strings, and how they sit well with the brass of the same name.


Nice piece Mike! Care to share you mic usage settings? WW, Brass & Perc sounded like room & surround to me.


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



pkm @ Wed Nov 20 said:


> double/triple bow?



+1. I was going to say this too.

I'm surprised you guys didn't include this. You seem to have thought of everything else though!


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



mikebarry @ Wed Nov 20 said:


> Here is a demo showing the transparent nature of the strings, and how they sit well with the brass of the same name.
> 
> *Medal of Saving Brothers *
> https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/59unp5atseqkttw7wgh4



Very nice!


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*

Here is a great demo by Sebastien using only Cinesamples libraries:

*"SET FLANGERS TO STUN!"*
https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/nmoujlh2arvdvf7zui81


----------



## Vision

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Release Information Announced + Audio Demo]*



CineSamples @ Wed Nov 20 said:


> Here is a great demo by Sebastien using only Cinesamples libraries:
> 
> *"SET FLANGERS TO STUN!"*
> https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/s/nmoujlh2arvdvf7zui81



Very cool composition.. really impressive mix too. Would be nice to know how resources are being used.. How many tracks, how much memory used, mics.. etc.

Truly sounds like a complete orchestral library. Congrats Cinesamples team.


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Two more Demos Added + Release Info]*

The three demos to date:

https://soundcloud.com/cinesamples/sets ... core-demos


----------



## germancomponist

Like...


----------



## Guy Rowland

Me too. What a wonderful age we live in to have tools like these


----------



## ed buller

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Two more Demos Added + Release Info]*

Double bow and triple bow would be wonderful. Is it possible mike? It really is effective in the brass .

E


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Two more Demos Added + Release Info]*



ed buller @ Thu Nov 21 said:


> Double bow and triple bow would be wonderful. Is it possible mike? It really is effective in the brass .
> 
> E



Yeah, could be super useful in fast passages, a quick and dirty way to get measured trems. Or....

Maybe something for a future update down the line, but how about a little pattern generator for figures, locked to host tempo, so the user plays on the downbeat and the pattern fills in. Potentially useful for runs and arpeggios across the range? Say 3 definable presets on f#, g#, a#?


----------



## Simon Ravn

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Two more Demos Added + Release Info]*

Very impressive, guys! I can't wait to get my hands on this. Shorts sound great, col legnos and pizz too. And the sustains seem very nice too - the only fear is that there might not be enough vibrato in them, esp. the top registers, but I'll have to layer som Spitfire chamber strings on top for the time being - until you do smaller sections with tons of emotional vibrato at least 8) 

But wow, very cool sound.

Regarding the "tripple/double tongueing" - personally I don't see the need and they will be pretty unflexible. I'd rather have some measured tremolos at various BPM's... Say 100, 130 and 160 BPM with time stretch capabilities...


----------



## AC986

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Two more Demos Added + Release Info]*

The latest (or last demo in the queue) really shows off the bottom end. This library seemingly has a sound all its own based on demos thus far. It's a really good sound. Well done men! :D

Some higher register, sweeping lyrical material would be a welcome listen, that incorporates 1st and 2nd violins weaving some magical harmonies and counterpoint if at all possible. :idea:


----------



## Steve Martin

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Two more Demos Added + Release Info]*

Hi to Cinesamples,

Congratulations to to you on your new string library.

All the demo's have been very impressive.

I'm quite wowed by the sound of this. The latest demo with all of the other Cinesample libraries used together sounds just great! 

Congrats to Sebastien for a very impressive demo here, and also to the other composers who have created wonderful music on the other demo's also.


all the best,

Steve :D


----------



## ed buller

give this a go !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EB3IokHelRk

e


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Two more Demos Added + Release Info]*

DON'T sample measured tremolos, please! We can fake it well with shorts. 

Use CineStrings PRO budget to sample things that are impossible to fake:


Important:

- Half section divisi (all CORE articulations)
- Sordinos (at least legato/sustains+vibrato controller and shorts)
- 3m/3M/P4/#4/P5 trills *


Not so important (and best suited for CineStrings AUX)

- Sul ponticello trills: m2/M2/m3/M3/P4/#4/P5 (spooky as hell >8o ) **
- Sul ponticello sustains *
- Tremolo harmonics *


* don't do basses
** don't do cellos and basses


----------



## MacQ

How fast can she go, Cap'n? I'm thinking fast runs (Horner's "Khan" score), or lots of John Powell's stuff that is so fast, like the Celli doing that fast 1/16T figure at the end of the "Bathroom Titles" cue from X-Men 3 ... the kind of "intensity for free" writing you can get with a real section scrambling to play that fast!! Attention to that kind of speed (or close simulation using scripted trickery) would be great. And if not core, it's my request for Pro. So much of the great action-music canon is built around these kinds of runs, and it's less of a gimmick than other potential choices, in my opinion. 

I'd also love the extended trills ... those are awesome.


----------



## Jordan Gagne

Why do people like trills so much?

... 8)

Just a personal preference I suppose, but they're definitely not high on my priority list in terms of string libraries. In any case, I'm sure whatever you guys end up doing on Pro will be very interesting.


----------



## renegade

MacQ @ Thu 21 Nov said:


> ...I'm thinking fast runs (Horner's "Khan" score), or lots of John Powell's stuff that is so fast, like the Celli doing that fast 1/16T figure at the end of the "Bathroom Titles" cue from X-Men 3 ...



+1


Great demos so far! Looking forward to hearing more


----------



## Casey Edwards

Jordan Gagne @ Thu Nov 21 said:


> Why do people like trills so much?



Open a Respighi, Stravinsky, or John Williams score and you'll see/hear why. It's a color used in TONS of film scores and only one company offers this to a P5 and I can't believe it took that long. I'd been begging for it before OT put it on the market, but unfortunately it was paired with a bunch of other stuff I have no need for. Another reason I enjoy modular set releases for sample shopping.


----------



## feck

Jordan Gagne @ Thu Nov 21 said:


> Why do people like trills so much?
> 
> ... 8)
> 
> Just a personal preference I suppose, but they're definitely not high on my priority list in terms of string libraries. In any case, I'm sure whatever you guys end up doing on Pro will be very interesting.



My thoughts exactly - not high on mine at all either.


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

Jordan Gagne @ Thu Nov 21 said:


> Why do people like trills so much?
> 
> ... 8)
> 
> Just a personal preference I suppose, but they're definitely not high on my priority list in terms of string libraries. In any case, I'm sure whatever you guys end up doing on Pro will be very interesting.



I could divide the violas and give F and Ab,A to each half. But using F-Ab and F-A trills added much more movement and, sometimes, this is preferable over a static sustained chord.

Just came up with something to demonstrate this effect:

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F121241968&secret_url=false[/flash]


----------



## Hannes_F

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Two more Demos Added + Release Info]*

Hey Cinesamples, I'm seriously interested in this library but could you give us a demo with a nice melody please? Thanks.


----------



## Cinesamples

Hannes, for that people will need to hire you!!


----------



## Hannes_F

Haha. No seriously, I'm using samples too for my own hybrid mixes and would appreciate to use these legato transitions in your product. They are yummy. Also you have the vibrato control, so it should work quite good for melodies and I'm genuinely interested in hearing some thematic lines in the mf - f range.


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Two more Demos Added + Release Info]*

I don't understand. The demos so far don't have nice melodies? I think they do.


----------



## Hannes_F

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Two more Demos Added + Release Info]*

@Echoes in the Attic, I see where you are coming from, however while searching through the demos this was my result: 

Set Flangers to stun:
https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/nmoujlh2arvdvf7zui81 (https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/ ... vdvf7zui81)
stings mostly shorts, celli melody under horns at 1:30? some strings doubling brass at 1:50?

Medal of saving brothers:
https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/nmoujlh2arvdvf7zui81 (https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/ ... vdvf7zui81)
Melodies in solo trumpet, winds, horns
thematic material in strings only in the pp-p range at 0:20 and 1:40

Sebastian Najand:
https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/4an70fo842wutfomvs6v (https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/ ... wutfomvs6v)
melodic material in strings throughout however mostly in the pp-p range
It blooms to mf one time from 0:59 on, however all quite restrained

Alex Temple:
https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/efzf88jifr775elcidvs (https://hollywoodscoring.app.box.com/s/ ... 775elcidvs)
Short strings at beginning. Melodic material at 0:36 has great tone, however not much use of the vibrato feature and is still quite restrained (which suits the music there of course). Short theme in lower range at 0:55, however not over the mp range.

Did I miss something?

I was however very impressed by what Mike showed in the walkthrough video at 6:30 and 9:05. 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgRpTKuYS0E 

Please forget for this thread that I am a strings player, additionally I am using samples as everybody else and contemplate about plucking down USD 429 next week. So I'd love to hear a tasteful riding of cc01 and cc02 throughout the sections before I buy, that would be nice.


----------



## Cinesamples

3 Days until release!


----------



## Rob Elliott

CineSamples @ Sat Nov 23 said:


> 3 Days until release!




Taking preorders to 'get in line' on the servers? I bet they stress beyond capacity - given what is shown on the walk-thrus and heard on the demos.


----------



## Richard Bowling

Rob Elliott @ Sat Nov 23 said:


> CineSamples @ Sat Nov 23 said:
> 
> 
> 
> 3 Days until release!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Taking preorders to 'get in line' on the servers? I bet they stress beyond capacity - given what is shown on the walk-thrus and heard on the demos.
Click to expand...



+1


----------



## Guy Rowland

CS folks - talk us through the servers, and our best strategy... Wait a few days?


----------



## Cinesamples

We use Amazon S3 servers. It is a scalable solution. It's the same servers that Netflix uses. 

There is no difference in download speed if one person is downloading, or several million people (which is of course what we're expecting 

MP


----------



## Richard Bowling

CineSamples @ Sat Nov 23 said:


> We use Amazon S3 servers. It is a scalable solution. It's the same servers that Netflix uses.
> 
> There is no difference in download speed if one person is downloading, or several million people (which is of course what we're expecting
> 
> MP



Well then... What are we waiting for?! 8)


----------



## Guy Rowland

CineSamples @ Sat Nov 23 said:


> We use Amazon S3 servers. It is a scalable solution. It's the same servers that Netflix uses.
> 
> There is no difference in download speed if one person is downloading, or several million people (which is of course what we're expecting
> 
> MP



Glorious. Ta!


----------



## quantum7

CineSamples @ Sat Nov 23 said:


> There is no difference in download speed if one person is downloading, or *several million people* (which is of course what we're expecting



Errrr.....can I buy some stock in Cinesamples.....before Monday??? :lol:


----------



## lucor

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases in 2 days!]*

At what time will we be able to purchase/download the library on Tuesday?
Would be great to download through the night


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow]*

MANUAL!!! 

https://images.cinesamples.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/CineStrings_CORE_Manual.pdf (https://images.cinesamples.com.s3.amazo ... Manual.pdf)

Enjoy,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## AC986

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow]*

Ha. I just noticed this won't run on Snow Leopard. :shock:


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow]*

@adriancook

We will have a 5.2 version that we will release on request. Just submit a support ticket and we can send it to you. 

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow]*



maest @ Mon Nov 25 said:


> MANUAL!!!
> 
> https://images.cinesamples.com.s3.amazonaws.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/CineStrings_CORE_Manual.pdf (https://images.cinesamples.com.s3.amazo ... Manual.pdf)
> 
> Enjoy,
> 
> Sam Estes
> Manager, Cinesamples



Hi Sam - 100:1 it's nothing to worry about, but I get this message on Chrome when I click the link:



> You attempted to reach images.cinesamples.com.s3.amazonaws.com, but instead you actually reached a server identifying itself as *.s3.amazonaws.com. This may be caused by a misconfiguration on the server or by something more serious. An attacker on your network could be trying to get you to visit a fake (and potentially harmful) version of images.cinesamples.com.s3.amazonaws.com.
> You should not proceed, especially if you have never seen this warning before for this site.



Wanna read, but I'm a scaredy cat so I'll be good and hold fire for the mo!


----------



## Maestro77

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow] - Manual Added!*

I also got a security warning in Firefox but clicked through anyway with no problems.


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow] - Manual Added!*

It's just a security warning that you are grabbing it from Amazon's S3 server... it's not a problem.

If you are cautious about it try this link instead:

https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/CineStringsManual

Best,

Sam


----------



## Inceptic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow] - Manual Added!*

So the library is 50gb; does anyone know how big the compressed download is? Or how many download links we'll be getting?


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow] - Manual Added!*



maest @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> It's just a security warning that you are grabbing it from Amazon's S3 server... it's not a problem.
> 
> If you are cautious about it try this link instead:
> 
> https://hollywoodscoring.box.com/CineStringsManual



I'm in! Thanks Sam - loads of interesting info in there, great to have longs / shorts dynamics controls in the back end.

Inceptic - usually with Kontakt ncw libraries, the download size is pretty much the same as the installed size, since the libraries are compressed already.


----------



## Astronaut FX

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow] - Manual Added!*

Purchased...links received...am I first???


----------



## Dan Mott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow] - Manual Added!*



Tone Deaf @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> Purchased...links received...am I first???




Hahah. You must have been sitting there, refreshing all day :D

Thanks for letting me know. Tempting.


----------



## EastWest Lurker

Congrats to Mike and Mike on what I am sure is another very good sounding library.


----------



## Astronaut FX

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow] - Manual Added!*



Dan Mott @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> Tone Deaf @ Tue Nov 26 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Purchased...links received...am I first???
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hahah. You must have been sitting there, refreshing all day :D
> 
> Thanks for letting me know. Tempting.
Click to expand...


Nah...just dumb luck really. Even if I was first, my internet is so horrendously slow, I doubt I'll be hearing it anytime soon.


----------



## Dan Mott

BOUGHT!


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



CineStrings CORE is now available!
http://cinesamples.com/products/cinestrings


----------



## Jordan Gagne

Anxious to hear some vi-control user demos with this library. As someone who thought the spot/close mics sounded great but wasn't convinced by the full sound (judging by the response here I guess I'm the only one?), I'm anxious to see whether some different mic mixes will be more to my taste.


----------



## midi_controller

Quick question, can I buy it now and download it later? I said I would purchase on day one but I'm not going to have the time to download and start playing with it until around the beginning of December (which SUCKS). Let me know, I've got my credit card at the ready!


----------



## Cinesamples

Looking forward to hearing VI-control member demos as well. Will post the best ones on FB / Twitter.


----------



## Cinesamples

midi_controller @ Mon Nov 25 said:


> Quick question, can I buy it now and download it later? I said I would purchase on day one but I'm not going to have the time to download and start playing with it until around the beginning of December (which SUCKS). Let me know, I've got my credit card at the ready!



Yes, you do have 7 days to download. But, just drop us a line if you need more time...


----------



## RiffWraith

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow] - Manual Added!*



Tone Deaf @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> Purchased...links received...am I first???



Nope. Second.


----------



## Cinesamples

Just a reminder that the introductory price of $429 will only last for one week. Then it goes back up to $499.


----------



## Saxer

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Doooooowwwwnnnllllooooaaaadiiiing.....

This will take a while

From dusk till DAW


----------



## JE Martinsen

Is there a chance for a few more demos during this week? I think the demos you've posted are really great, but I'd love to hear some romantic lines with a strong and passionate vibrato.. o/~ 

Maybe that's what you already posted and I really don't have a clue what I want.. :mrgreen: To my inexperienced ears CineStrings sounds like it is all about that lovely Hollywood sound, maybe the best library you can get for this distinct cinematic sound. And I just feel that I'd really like to hear a demo showcasing that romantic side of it.

Here's what I'm often listening to in front of the fireplace, with a good Cognac and a cigar.. (giggle) I just love the sound of these strings..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2t_pg2cpps4

And then there's that special sound of the violins on the Basic Instinct theme, by Jerry Goldsmith. These strings sound so fragile and sweet I just can't believe mye ears. How do they do that? And is it possible with CineStrings? It actually reminds me a little about Grieg's compositions, perhaps because of that velvet smooth sound. The strings sound like they are warm and comfortable waves on the beach.. Of course, you cannot listen to that piece without getting seduced by the flute ensemble.. What a joy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xreXeugQjdw


----------



## feck

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Bought and downloaded...installing now. Psyched to have some fun with these!


----------



## Simon Ravn

No chance you could include a Kontakt 5.2 version automatically in the download, so we don't have to wait for support tickets to be responded to etc.? I will probably move the library to a 5.3-equipped slave, but I always try out on my Mac first (which is running Snow Leopard).


----------



## Markus S

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Did I miss the demos somewhere? (not talking about presentation videos)


----------



## JimVMusic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Congrats Mikes! I think the "bow attack feature" is a really great development. I haven't tried this yet, but from what I can tell, this looks to solve the challenge of having some control over the attack of the Instrument. The "hairpin tool" looks cool too. Add to this Dennis Sands' great recording techniques, the sound of Sony, the flexibility of the controls, the consistency of sound/interface with WW's, Brass, and Perc. Topped off with a VERY reasonable price! I think this a really great purchase IMHO.


----------



## Guy Rowland

Downloading - it's gonna be a long one though, servers seem pretty slow. I estimate 6-8 hours on a 120mb connection (I recently downloaded a 40gb library in under 1).

Markus - there's 4 official demos near the top of the product page on the right hand side - http://cinesamples.com/products/cinestrings/


----------



## Enyak

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

€377 for 50 gigs of Silvestri-Strings. Not a bad offer!


----------



## feck

Guy Rowland @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> Downloading - it's gonna be a long one though, servers seem pretty slow. I estimate 6-8 hours on a 120mb connection (I recently downloaded a 40gb library in under 1).
> 
> Markus - there's 4 official demos near the top of the product page on the right hand side - http://cinesamples.com/products/cinestrings/


Hmm, I downloaded the whole thing in an hour on a 105MB connection.


----------



## Guy Rowland

feck @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> Hmm, I downloaded the whole thing in an hour on a 105MB connection.



Huh - must be a UK / US thing. Darnit.


----------



## Dan Mott

feck @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> Guy Rowland @ Tue Nov 26 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Downloading - it's gonna be a long one though, servers seem pretty slow. I estimate 6-8 hours on a 120mb connection (I recently downloaded a 40gb library in under 1).
> 
> Markus - there's 4 official demos near the top of the product page on the right hand side - http://cinesamples.com/products/cinestrings/
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm, I downloaded the whole thing in an hour on a 105MB connection.
Click to expand...



An hour? Far out, that's quick as all hell. Mine is still going and it's been 2 and half hours now.


----------



## Anthony N.Putson

Some of the demo's sound terrific! I have Cinebrass so would be great to go alongside. My strings are currently occupied by LASS, wondering if (in hindsight) i should of held out for this? CS sounds really warm straight out of the box.


----------



## feck

Guy Rowland @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> feck @ Tue Nov 26 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Hmm, I downloaded the whole thing in an hour on a 105MB connection.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Huh - must be a UK / US thing. Darnit.
Click to expand...

Yeah, the servers can vary pretty wildly. I feel like I'm 10 years old on Christmas Eve....I get to wake up tomorrow and play with this and HZ Percussion. I'll be damned if these aren't AWESOME times we live in these days! o-[][]-o


----------



## Guy Rowland

feck @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> I'll be damned if these aren't AWESOME times we live in these days! o-[][]-o



I so agree - how blase we can be about these miracles.


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

edited.


----------



## Symfoniq

The demo link for Michael Barry's "Medal of Saving Brothers" actually links to "Set Flangers to Stun."


----------



## Symfoniq

Guy Rowland @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> feck @ Tue Nov 26 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'll be damned if these aren't AWESOME times we live in these days! o-[][]-o
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I so agree - how blase we can be about these miracles.
Click to expand...


I was saying basically the same thing to my wife the other day. I almost feel guilty sometimes for taking it for granted.

Along those lines, I read something yesterday that said in 1985, RAM was $880 per megabyte. I just put 32,768 megabytes of RAM in my music computer. You do the math. :shock:


----------



## Harcourt

JE Martinsen @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> .....And then there's that special sound of the violins on the Basic Instinct theme, by Jerry Goldsmith. These strings sound so fragile and sweet I just can't believe mye ears. How do they do that? And is it possible with CineStrings? It actually reminds me a little about Grieg's compositions, perhaps because of that velvet smooth sound. The strings sound like they are warm and comfortable waves on the beach.. Of course, you cannot listen to that piece without getting secuced by the flute ensemble.. What a joy.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xreXeugQjdw


.....yes, thats the type of texture I'd like to be able to recreate, (talent required of course).....Another example of strings that "sound like they are warm and comfortable waves on the beach" is this piece by "Mr. Exotica" himself - Les Baxter:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ReAYC0lUBY

If someone can do a mockup with any string library recreating this sound...let me know!


----------



## Harcourt

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

To Mike & Mike from Cinesamples: (I couldn't find a contact email which was not a support ticket on your site). 

I just noticed a small text error in your download manual for CineStrings on page 7....."What is True Legato? True legato means that we sampled all of the intervalic leaps
throughout the ranges, both upwards and downwards, for each *brass section.*".....I'm sure you mean "*string section*."


----------



## reddognoyz

I just took a look at the manual. It seems they've really expanded the tweakability of cinestrings, building on the recent cinesamples libraries template. I may have to miss the discount, I'm in deep on a series, but this is gonna get bought. I would love to see these tweakes translated to Cinewinds and brass where apropriate. I would love to have 2 cineflutes for instance, a fast one and a lush one.


----------



## Jeff Tymoschuk

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



Harcourt @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> I just noticed a small text error in your download manual for CineStrings on page 7....."What is True Legato? True legato means that we sampled all of the intervalic leaps
> throughout the ranges, both upwards and downwards, for each *brass section.*".....I'm sure you mean "*string section*."




Ahh, you've gotta expect a bug or two on a 1.0 release, this one's not so bad!


----------



## Sid Francis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Congrats to that release... I just watched the interview video which leads me to the same question I had at the beginning of this thread:

At 2.25 in the interview video there is again such a GORGEOUS vibrato in the strings that I miss in all the libs at the moment. Since I heard this vibrato also in the first demo video and asked about it. Couldn´t you just give us an audio example of the vibrati in the various sections? A nice vibrato in the longs (and controlable, wooow) is my absolute and final purchase argument


----------



## TGV

Check the walk through. You can hear the legato (sorry, True Legato) Violins I here for yourself: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... YS0E#t=383 (wait until at least 9:20).


----------



## JE Martinsen

Harcourt @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> JE Martinsen @ Tue Nov 26 said:
> 
> 
> 
> .....And then there's that special sound of the violins on the Basic Instinct theme, by Jerry Goldsmith. These strings sound so fragile and sweet I just can't believe mye ears. How do they do that? And is it possible with CineStrings? It actually reminds me a little about Grieg's compositions, perhaps because of that velvet smooth sound. The strings sound like they are warm and comfortable waves on the beach.. Of course, you cannot listen to that piece without getting secuced by the flute ensemble.. What a joy.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xreXeugQjdw
> 
> 
> 
> .....yes, thats the type of texture I'd like to be able to recreate, (talent required of course).....Another example of strings that "sound like they are warm and comfortable waves on the beach" is this piece by "Mr. Exotica" himself - Les Baxter:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ReAYC0lUBY
> 
> If someone can do a mockup with any string library recreating this sound...let me know!
Click to expand...


Tahiti A Summer Night At Sea is an exquisite example, sir! These strings really do have "the waves" in 'em! Surely someone with a good deal of experience and expertise would be able to come up with something like that? What I would really like to do myself is to have a go at it. Even with my virtually non-existent experience of composing and arranging for strings.. Failing is just another valuable lesson and the next logical step in a quest to fail less with time.. :mrgreen: 

So again, I'd really like to hear some of CineStrings' more romantic sides. Perhaps with a vintage twist? Another member here requested the same thing, some demo pieces showing CineStrings' ability to "carry" a melody line and really make it sing.


----------



## JE Martinsen

Sid Francis @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> Couldn´t you just give us an audio example of the vibrati in the various sections? A nice vibrato in the longs (and controlable, wooow) is my absolute and final purchase argument



+1


----------



## Harcourt

:D


JE Martinsen @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> Sid Francis @ Tue Nov 26 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Couldn´t you just give us an audio example of the vibrati in the various sections? A nice vibrato in the longs (and controlable, wooow) is my absolute and final purchase argument
> 
> 
> 
> 
> +1
Click to expand...

+1 :D


----------



## Cinesamples

Sure... will work on something. Give us a bit.. slightly swamped over here.. 

Or better yet, maybe there is someone out there who purchased who can offer a non-biased demo. I always find those to be more helpful? 

Standby...


----------



## Harcourt

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ReAYC0lUBY



JE Martinsen @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> Tahiti A Summer Night At Sea is an exquisite example, sir! These strings really do have "the waves" in 'em! Surely someone with a good deal of experience and expertise would be able to come up with something like that? What I would really like to do myself is to have a go at it.


....A good exercise indeed. But if you can find the score to that or of any other of Les Baxter's works, please let me know. It would make things much easier if we had something written down to work with.


----------



## Saxer

Harcourt @ 26.11.2013 said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ReAYC0lUBY
> 
> 
> 
> JE Martinsen @ Wed Nov 27 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tahiti A Summer Night At Sea is an exquisite example, sir! These strings really do have "the waves" in 'em! Surely someone with a good deal of experience and expertise would be able to come up with something like that? What I would really like to do myself is to have a go at it.
> 
> 
> 
> ....A good exercise indeed. But if you can find the score to that or of any other of Les Baxter's works, please let me know. It would make things much easier if we had something written down to work with.
Click to expand...

http://web.cfa.arizona.edu/lesbaxter/collection/scores/list.html (http://web.cfa.arizona.edu/lesbaxter/co ... /list.html)


----------



## feck

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

5 minutes with the full ensemble legato patch and I was grinning ear to ear. AMAZING sounds guys! Looking forward to digging into it this weekend. o-[][]-o


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

I have 20 MB/sec speeds (normally) and can only get 400-600k/sec with this dl. Anyone else having these issues (using 'download it all' in firefox). :(


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

@Rob Elliot 

These are hosted through an Amazon S3 server - they are entirely dependent on general internet traffic - it took me 6 hours to download on my 20mbit Time Warner when I tested at my house using Download them All through Firefox. I ranged from 200kb/sec to 1.9mb/sec - and that was on a Sunday Morning.

Wish we could have the cloud based sampler.... wait - that may be a bad idea if ISPs are this slow... 

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## woodsdenis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



feck @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> 5 minutes with the full ensemble legato patch and I was grinning ear to ear. AMAZING sounds guys! Looking forward to digging into it this weekend. o-[][]-o



Yes you could waste hours on that one, lovely sound.

Overall from an hours tinkering couldn't be happier with it , well done all involved.


----------



## Dan Mott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

I have a problem with my license code.


In my email I was sent, there is no license code. At the bottom of the email is just says 'License Code' but there is no code there?


----------



## Guy Rowland

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



Dan Mott @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> I have a problem with my license code.
> 
> 
> In my email I was sent, there is no license code. At the bottom of the email is just says 'License Code' but there is no code there?



If I were you, just check your email on another browser / client if you are able , then get in touch with CS support right away, I'm sure they'll sort you out.

Just to update on my posts yesterday, whole library took about 4 hours in the end - not too shabby!


----------



## Harcourt

Saxer @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> Harcourt @ 26.11.2013 said:
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ReAYC0lUBY
> 
> 
> 
> JE Martinsen @ Wed Nov 27 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Tahiti A Summer Night At Sea is an exquisite example, sir! These strings really do have "the waves" in 'em! Surely someone with a good deal of experience and expertise would be able to come up with something like that? What I would really like to do myself is to have a go at it.
> 
> 
> 
> ....A good exercise indeed. But if you can find the score to that or of any other of Les Baxter's works, please let me know. It would make things much easier if we had something written down to work with.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> http://web.cfa.arizona.edu/lesbaxter/collection/scores/list.html (http://web.cfa.arizona.edu/lesbaxter/co ... /list.html)
Click to expand...

Thanks for the link Saxer. Yes I've been to that site before. I could be wrong, but it seems that they are sketches only, and not really all that indicative of his exotica period either, except for Ancient Galleon, which unfortunately doesn't really feature strings that much nor his characteristic string style - better than nothing I guess.


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Wonderful library - all that I expected and hoped for. Just one little issue. Has anyone seen 'dropouts' using CC2 (vibrato control) on the true legato patches? I am running on speedy SSD's in VEPRO - 2 buffers (1026 samples). Given that - shouldn't have any streaming issues. This happens if I use the Dennis Sands mix or my own set of mics???


My work-around is that I NEVER bring CC2 down to '0' -- if I do I get the 'drop-outs'.


Thanks for any help anyone who has experience the same.


----------



## Saxer

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

in the walkthrough video was said, there would be a possibility to adjust legato dynamic and level (silence when mod-wheel is on '0'). how can that be done?


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Hi Guys,

This is really not meant to sound pandering, just pointing you to some great tips in the manual... In general this is a pretty expansive library with a LOT going on in scripts and what not - the manual really is a great resource.

@Saxer

In the manual on page 18, it explains in detail what to do to achieve this. Just backup your patch, go into the "wrench" click script then the tab that says Articulation Control 1.0 and move the Mod Long to 100. Then when Modwheel is at 0, your volume will be at 0. That's IT!

@Rob

In the Manual on page 15, it explains what is happening with the vibrato and legatos. If you read page 19-20 it will explain the "HQ" mode. Basically we were trying to be resource friendly out of the box and we have a really intelligent way of killing non-vibrato/vibrato/espressivo voices, however there were some slight issues if you move the vibrato controller during a legato (since there is some very complex crossfading between sample sets), Kontakt can get a little confused at times as to when to bring back in the voice - we added the HQ mode for those with powerful computers who can handle 100's of voices playing on 2 notes... I would read page 15 if you do not want to use the HQ mode, and you should not have any drop-outs.

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## Rob Elliott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



maest @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> This is really not meant to sound pandering, just pointing you to some great tips in the manual... In general this is a pretty expansive library with a LOT going on in scripts and what not - the manual really is a great resource.
> 
> @Saxer
> 
> In the manual on page 18, it explains in detail what to do to achieve this. Just backup your patch, go into the "wrench" click script then the tab that says Articulation Control 1.0 and move the Mod Long to 100. Then when Modwheel is at 0, your volume will be at 0. That's IT!
> 
> @Rob
> 
> In the Manual on page 15, it explains what is happening with the vibrato and legatos. If you read page 19-20 it will explain the "HQ" mode. Basically we were trying to be resource friendly out of the box and we have a really intelligent way of killing non-vibrato/vibrato/espressivo voices, however there were some slight issues if you move the vibrato controller during a legato (since there is some very complex crossfading between sample sets), Kontakt can get a little confused at times as to when to bring back in the voice - we added the HQ mode for those with powerful computers who can handle 100's of voices playing on 2 notes... I would read page 15 if you do not want to use the HQ mode, and you should not have any drop-outs.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Sam Estes
> Manager, Cinesamples




Are you serious - I have to read the manual???? I want my money back. o 


Seriously - many thanks Sam. You guys out did yourselves on this one.


----------



## paaltio

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Great job guys. The sound is great (and doesn't require loading multiple mics to achieve it -- everyone should be doing full mix samples in their libraries!), and the samples are impeccably edited and the mapping customization should be industry standard. Awesome work.

If you do fast legatos well in Pro, I think I'll be all CS from there on out.


----------



## Saxer

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



maest @ 27.11.2013 said:


> @Saxer
> 
> In the manual on page 18, it explains in detail what to do to achieve this. Just backup your patch, go into the "wrench" click script then the tab that says Articulation Control 1.0 and move the Mod Long to 100. Then when Modwheel is at 0, your volume will be at 0. That's IT!


great! thanks a lot!


----------



## lucor

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Loving the library so far!

Two things I noticed though:
- Is it me, or is the Volume of the legatos in the Articulation Patches very low in comparison with the other articulations? Normally not that big of an issue for me, as I load the True Legato Patch as well anyway, but unfortunatley the True Legato Patches seem to lack the Bow Attack Overlay feature?
- The polyphonic legato seems to be pretty glitchy for me. Sometimes I can't get it to work at all and it acts like Monophonic is active (yes, I'm hitting the 2 notes simultaneously) and sometimes note get stuck and keep on ringing for 2-3 seconds.

Anyone else noticing this or is it just me?


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

@ Lucor

The True Legato, by default, is in MONO mode. You can switch to POLY Mode if you'd like and it will work fine (in the settings page). The True Legato patch was designed to be a "Split" patch of sorts, the bow-attack overlay was not included in there, since it was meant to be a lighter load on the ram if you just needed a "legato" patch instead of EVERYTHING 

There is a legato volume knob just below that if you want the Legato's to stick out a bit more. 

If you are getting an occasional stuck note, you may want to lower the legato retrigger knob at the bottom of the page. See manual page: 15-16 for more info.

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## lucor

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Hey Sam, thanks for your reply.



maest @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> The True Legato, by default, is in MONO mode. You can switch to POLY Mode if you'd like and it will work fine (in the settings page)


Yeah, I made sure I'm really in POLY Mode, but I'm still getting these glitches occasionally (both in the True Legato Patch as well as the Articulations Patch).



maest @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> There is a legato volume knob just below that if you want the Legato's to stick out a bit more.


No, I meant the overall volume is rather low, compared with everything else.
Shorts, tremolo and trills are all in balance but the sustains are about 6-9db quieter for me. 
Is that intentional? Maybe I'm just retarded. :mrgreen: 



maest @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> If you are getting an occasional stuck note, you may want to lower the legato retrigger knob at the bottom of the page. See manual page: 15-16 for more info.


I'm gonna try that, thank you. 

Cheers,
Lucas


----------



## germancomponist

I have not yet clicked the buy button because I got a nasty letter from my tax office yesterday, .... and not because this Berlin... working on a library ..... . 

As soon as I'm over my finances in the clear I'll buy CineStrings!


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

@ Lucas,

The non-vibs are a slightly lower volume (more percieved - a timbre shift really) than the shorts and trems at high velocities. In order to get the non-vibrato to blend with the vibrato and espressivo, we had to bring them down just a tad - so they may be a bit quieter. Try moving CC2 to 127 and trying the balances then.

Also one other tip for the triggering - the timing is pretty precise on triggering up to 3 notes at a time, a "flam" of more than 50ms, it will not pick up. If we increased it any more than 50ms the library felt way too laggy, but just to re-iterate from MP's video - you basically tell the script how many voices you are using upon first trigger - so if you only play one note at first, the script thinks you only want a mono line, if you play 2 then it knows to go into double-voice counterpoint. It's really hard to tell a script to read into the "intent" of what is to be played on the fly - this was one of many solutions that we tried that seemed to work the best. Otherwise just double up the track in Kontakt and write in the polyphony as needed, no more ram is really needed and the load on the CPU is minimal (other than the extra voices, which you would be using anyway).

I understand this may take a bit of getting used to playing, but once it is under the fingers, we find it works really well!

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## quantum7

germancomponist @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> I have not yet clicked the buy button because I got a nasty letter from my tax office yesterday



Yikes! >8o I'd rather have a barium enema than a nasty letter from the tax cronies. I hope everything works out for you.


----------



## lucor

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

@Sam

Thanks, it was the vibrato. When it's at espressivo everything is balanced out.
I loaded in a second articulations patch with just the sustains now to have a bit more control and it works very good o-[][]-o .
And it's very possible that my sloppy piano skills are the reason for the glitches :mrgreen: . I'll pay more attention, to see if it helps.

Thanks for your help, absolutely loving the sound of the library.  

L


----------



## bennyoschmann

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Fantastic library! Really loving the sound, guys! Just did a quick test mockup of various score moments from Silvestri's "Back to the Future":
https://www.dropbox.com/s/62eeznz7oj9k1v7/bttf_cinestrings.mp3

Featuring Cinestrings, Cinebrass & Cineperc


----------



## Polarity

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



bennyoschmann @ Wed 27 Nov said:


> Fantastic library! Really loving the sound, guys! Just did a quick test mockup of various score moments from Silvestri's "Back to the Future":
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/62eeznz7oj9k1v7/bttf_cinestrings.mp3
> 
> Featuring Cinestrings, Cinebrass & Cineperc



very good indeed!
love how it all sounds...
are you really sure you didn't handle to us the original recording?  
:mrgreen:


----------



## Polarity

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

....


----------



## feck

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Yes, this library really does sound fantastic. After only an hour of so playing with it, I imagine it will most likely be my go-to string library based on sound and ease of use. I know this is hot off the presses, but is there any ETA for the PRO/EXP packs?


----------



## Cinesamples

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



bennyoschmann @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> Fantastic library! Really loving the sound, guys! Just did a quick test mockup of various score moments from Silvestri's "Back to the Future":
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/62eeznz7oj9k1v7/bttf_cinestrings.mp3
> 
> Featuring Cinestrings, Cinebrass & Cineperc



That is just lovely!! Nice work. 
Are you based in LA by any chance?


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



bennyoschmann @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> Fantastic library! Really loving the sound, guys! Just did a quick test mockup of various score moments from Silvestri's "Back to the Future":
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/62eeznz7oj9k1v7/bttf_cinestrings.mp3
> 
> Featuring Cinestrings, Cinebrass & Cineperc



Cinewinds too no?


----------



## woodsdenis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



bennyoschmann @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> Fantastic library! Really loving the sound, guys! Just did a quick test mockup of various score moments from Silvestri's "Back to the Future":
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/62eeznz7oj9k1v7/bttf_cinestrings.mp3
> 
> Featuring Cinestrings, Cinebrass & Cineperc



Wowser if that doesn't sell the lib nothing will !!!!!


----------



## Gerd Kaeding

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



bennyoschmann @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> Fantastic library! Really loving the sound, guys! Just did a quick test mockup of various score moments from Silvestri's "Back to the Future":
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/62eeznz7oj9k1v7/bttf_cinestrings.mp3
> 
> Featuring Cinestrings, Cinebrass & Cineperc


That sounds very good . Well done , Benny !!! Well done , Cinesamples !!!


----------



## woodsdenis

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

For CineSamples.

Is there any chance of Lite patches for the Full Ensembles ? They are the only ones so far that I need to up the buffer size for. Lite Patches to write for and then load the full ones for rendering ?


----------



## Dan Mott

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



Guy Rowland @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> Dan Mott @ Wed Nov 27 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have a problem with my license code.
> 
> 
> In my email I was sent, there is no license code. At the bottom of the email is just says 'License Code' but there is no code there?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If I were you, just check your email on another browser / client if you are able , then get in touch with CS support right away, I'm sure they'll sort you out.
> 
> Just to update on my posts yesterday, whole library took about 4 hours in the end - not too shabby!
Click to expand...



Yeah I got it sorted.

It took me about 4 hours aswell. Not bad really. You must have a similar speed to mine it seems.


----------



## Gerd Kaeding

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Releases Tomorrow]*



maest @ Mon Nov 25 said:


> We will have a 5.2 version that we will release on request. Just submit a support ticket and we can send it to you.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Sam Estes
> Manager, Cinesamples



Hi Sam ,
I have to / want to stick with OS X 10.6.8 for the moment , so I can not install K5.3 .

If you send out a K5.2 version , this would be just the .nki files , not the complete sample content , right ?

Thanks for any info on this 

Best
Gerd


----------



## maest

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

@Gerd,

You are correct, just k5.2 patches - no samples or anything like that. Just send a note to customer support and they will get you sorted. Please note we did our best to re-create the 5.3 patches (minus some scripting things) in the K5.2 patches, only thing really different from the two versions are the missing Full Ensemble "multi-mics" (the Full Mixes are there) and the single splits. There may be a few legatos that need some smoothing and other minor volume tweaks and script finessing. The splits we may be able to do in a bit (Next Week), but the multi-mics are impossible with the structure of 5.2 - It's to lengthy to explain why the Multi-mic ensembles won't work in the older versions. 

It was a LOT of work to try to re-constitute these 5.2 versions of the patches. We started working on converting them back once we heard about the Snow Leopard issue with 5.3.

Needless to say - 5.3 is the "approved version" for these patches, but 5.2 comes very, very close. 

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## Gerd Kaeding

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



maest @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> @Gerd,
> 
> You are correct, just k5.2 patches - no samples or anything like that. Just send a note to customer support and they will get you sorted. Please note we did our best to re-create the 5.3 patches (minus some scripting things) in the K5.2 patches, only thing really different from the two versions are the missing Full Ensemble "multi-mics" (the Full Mixes are there) and the single splits. There may be a few legatos that need some smoothing and other minor volume tweaks and script finessing. The splits we may be able to do in a bit (Next Week), but the multi-mics are impossible with the structure of 5.2 - It's to lengthy to explain why the Multi-mic ensembles won't work in the older versions.
> 
> It was a LOT of work to try to re-constitute these 5.2 versions of the patches. We started working on converting them back once we heard about the Snow Leopard issue with 5.3.
> 
> Needless to say - 5.3 is the "approved version" for these patches, but 5.2 comes very, very close.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Sam Estes
> Manager, Cinesamples



Sam ,
thanks for all the info and explanations . Much appreciated .
Let me thank you ... with my creditcard ... =o 

Best
Gerd


----------



## bennyoschmann

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Thanks a lot guys! I will do another mockup for the shorts with some action bits from BTTF 

*@Polarity:* Thanks man! Haha, just compare the original to the mockup. We're still far away from the real thing 

*@Echoes in the Attic:* Woodwinds are BWW & 8Dioboe.

*@Cinesamples:* Many thanks and keep up doing great libraries! Unfortunately I'm based in Germany.


----------



## NFSBuff

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

Hearing the pizzicato in the walk-through video did it for me. I have no idea why I latched onto that particular part, out of everything, but I did. And I pulled the trigger. So very glad I did.

I'm just getting into this whole arena of sequencing, mostly just for fun, as I'm normally a live brass player. So, having grabbed CineStrings and CineBrass, here's the first thing I've ever sequenced in my life.

>>GoldenEye-Ball<<

There's probably a 1000 things I did wrong, but you know what? I had fun! The CineSample guys speak truth when they say it's the worlds most composer friendly library.

*Edit: accidentally a word


----------



## Polarity

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*

just pulled the trigger, I'm one of the CineStrings club now!

the downloading is quite slow: it's just a little over 510 kb/sec, while my download rate could reach over 1 mb/sec...
well, I'll keep patience and the pc turned on for days I think..
or maybe it's just the traffic of these hours.

just charged to pay 13 euros more than what the rate exchange of today was predicted (also by paypal)...
did it happen to others among you?


----------



## Steve_B

My first VI forum post, hope I clicked the right 'post' button. Anyway, hi to you all. I usually just read the topics, but decided to go all high tech and join in.

I bought CineStrings a few days ago. So far, really liking it. Nice and easy to use.

Today was my first day at playing around with the library. I did a quick arrangement of the theme from The Pacific (tv series), to test out the legatos. Here's the track on YouTube, give you an idea of how I'm using the sounds so far...
http://youtu.be/QNJ3ABiZZdg

~ Steve


----------



## mojamusic

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



bennyoschmann @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> Fantastic library! Really loving the sound, guys! Just did a quick test mockup of various score moments from Silvestri's "Back to the Future":
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/62eeznz7oj9k1v7/bttf_cinestrings.mp3
> 
> Featuring Cinestrings, Cinebrass & Cineperc



Wonderful! o-[][]-o


----------



## handz

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



bennyoschmann @ Wed Nov 27 said:


> Fantastic library! Really loving the sound, guys! Just did a quick test mockup of various score moments from Silvestri's "Back to the Future":
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/62eeznz7oj9k1v7/bttf_cinestrings.mp3
> 
> Featuring Cinestrings, Cinebrass & Cineperc



oh man, this sounds great! Please moreee I want more of such great, classic pieces with slow lush strings. Im really tempted to buy the lib now!


----------



## Steve Steele

To CineSamples -

Any plans to take advantage of Kontakt's sequencing abilities to create a rhythmic pattern sequencer like LASS does with their Auto Arranger or Spitfire does with there Ostimatum? Session String Pro also uses this feature and I think it works well for action sequences when using staccato strings. I especially like the way SSP does theirs in that it switches between two phrases so the repeating pattern doesn't sound so obvious. SSP also has the best interface, IMO, making the animator fun and easy to use. LASS did a good job too.

It may not be for everyone, and maybe not the Cinesamples way, but it does speed up the creation of demos, is fun to work with and might be great in CineStrings.

Thanks


----------



## star.keys

Although I like the sound of this library, I hear a slight valley followed by steep rise in volume in between legato note transitions (in almost all demos I have heard). This sounds a bit disturbing to my ears. Is it just me? Other than that, I mean if there is a way to fix this, my cash is waiting... Any opinions please?


----------



## pkm

star.keys @ Thu Nov 28 said:


> Although I like the sound of this library, I hear a slight valley followed by steep rise in volume in between legato note transitions (in almost all demos I have heard). This sounds a bit disturbing to my ears. Is it just me? Other than that, I mean if there is a way to fix this, my cash is waiting... Any opinions please?



At softer dynamics, I've noticed the same thing while playing around with it, but it does even out dramatically as you get louder.


----------



## bennyoschmann

As promised here is another short montage from the score:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/n0tsnrlos2kx6vk/bttf_cinestrings_2.mp3

This time some scherzo & light action moments. Strings are all from Cinestrings, except for the runs... Hope to replace them soon with the announced Cinesamples String runs library  The mockup also features Cinebrass (Core & Pro), Cinewinds (Pro) Cineperc (Core).

*@mojamusic & handz:* Thanks guys! Really appreciated


----------



## mark812

bennyoschmann @ Fri Nov 29 said:


> As promised here is another short montage from the score:
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/n0tsnrlos2kx6vk/bttf_cinestrings_2.mp3
> 
> This time some scherzo & light action moments. Strings are all from Cinestrings, except for the runs... Hope to replace them soon with the announced Cinesamples String runs library  The mockup also features Cinebrass (Core & Pro), Cinewinds (Pro) Cineperc (Core).
> 
> *@mojamusic & handz:* Thanks guys! Really appreciated



>8o 

Would kill for a walkthrough. Care to share info on eq and reverb? Those trumpets especially sound amazing and I've been struggling to get a satisfying, not boomy sound from them.

Stunning work.


----------



## benmrx

bennyoschmann @ Fri Nov 29 said:


> As promised here is another short montage from the score:
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/n0tsnrlos2kx6vk/bttf_cinestrings_2.mp3
> 
> This time some scherzo & light action moments. Strings are all from Cinestrings, except for the runs... Hope to replace them soon with the announced Cinesamples String runs library  The mockup also features Cinebrass (Core & Pro), Cinewinds (Pro) Cineperc (Core).
> 
> *@mojamusic & handz:* Thanks guys! Really appreciated



Wow! Really nice work here! Though I must say IMO it's selling Cinebrass the most..., which isn't a bad thing!! That said the strings do sound quite nice. All in all, this is my favorite demo using Cinestrings so far.

I'm curious though what library you're using for the string runs (assuming this is the same template as before).


----------



## quantum7

I'm guessing the runs are from Orchestral String runs?


----------



## Peter Alexander

Harcourt @ Tue Nov 26 said:


> JE Martinsen @ Tue Nov 26 said:
> 
> 
> 
> .....And then there's that special sound of the violins on the Basic Instinct theme, by Jerry Goldsmith. These strings sound so fragile and sweet I just can't believe mye ears. How do they do that? And is it possible with CineStrings? It actually reminds me a little about Grieg's compositions, perhaps because of that velvet smooth sound. The strings sound like they are warm and comfortable waves on the beach.. Of course, you cannot listen to that piece without getting secuced by the flute ensemble.. What a joy.
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xreXeugQjdw
> 
> 
> 
> .....yes, thats the type of texture I'd like to be able to recreate, (talent required of course).....Another example of strings that "sound like they are warm and comfortable waves on the beach" is this piece by "Mr. Exotica" himself - Les Baxter:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5ReAYC0lUBY
> 
> If someone can do a mockup with any string library recreating this sound...let me know!
Click to expand...


This sound is achieved with divisi writing. The three libs with the potential for this are Dimension Strings, HS Diamond, and LASS.

Maybe Spitfire Mural plus Sable on release. Maybe Berlin Strings plus LASS Cs, or Berlin Strings plus Dimension Strings.


----------



## midi_controller

The thing that sticks out to me the most on both those tracks is that they are both played con sordino.

Cinesamples hasn't recorded Pro yet, so if you want con sord, divisi, divisi con sord, or even better, all three, let your voice be heard!

@Peter: You won't be able to get that sound with HS. The "divisi" mics are more just spot mics, and don't really sound that great, especially in exposed lines like this. Plus, the con sord is simulated so it's not going to have that "air" to it, if you know what I mean. I'm also not seeing con sord on Dimention Strings, so I don't think those would work either.


----------



## Harcourt

Probably both tracks could be emulated reasonably well without using con sordino as long as the libraries are well represented in the lower dynamic range. Definitely small string sections (divisi) required though. 

The Les Baxter piece has the strings slipping and sliding all over the place like a banana on a bed of jelly. To replicate that sound authentically, I think what's required is a library extensively dedicated to portamento and glissando. I haven't heard a library (or demo) that can come close...yet.


----------



## Peter Alexander

midi_controller @ Fri Nov 29 said:


> The thing that sticks out to me the most on both those tracks is that they are both played con sordino.
> 
> Cinesamples hasn't recorded Pro yet, so if you want con sord, divisi, divisi con sord, or even better, all three, let your voice be heard!
> 
> @Peter: You won't be able to get that sound with HS. The "divisi" mics are more just spot mics, and don't really sound that great, especially in exposed lines like this. Plus, the con sord is simulated so it's not going to have that "air" to it, if you know what I mean. I'm also not seeing con sord on Dimention Strings, so I don't think those would work either.



I'm speaking about the chord voicings and how they could be achieved.


----------



## Polarity

Finished the download yesterday late night (I just waited the last file before going to sleep), now I'm extracting the files, then I will go for installation...

I believe that, after some experimental playing to listen how it behaves, what I will do is not new tracks but just replace the other strings libraries in my unfinished cinematic album.
I'll do the same when I'll have also CineBrass, CineWinds and HZP 01.
So finally I can fix those things that still didn't convince me in some tracks too.


----------



## bennyoschmann

mark812 said:


> bennyoschmann @ Fri Nov 29 said:
> 
> 
> 
> As promised here is another short montage from the score:
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/n0tsnrlos2kx6vk/bttf_cinestrings_2.mp3
> 
> This time some scherzo & light action moments. Strings are all from Cinestrings, except for the runs... Hope to replace them soon with the announced Cinesamples String runs library  The mockup also features Cinebrass (Core & Pro), Cinewinds (Pro) Cineperc (Core).
> 
> *@mojamusic & handz:* Thanks guys! Really appreciated
> 
> 
> 
> 
> >8o
> 
> Would kill for a walkthrough. Care to share info on eq and reverb? Those trumpets especially sound amazing and I've been struggling to get a satisfying, not boomy sound from them.
> 
> Stunning work.
Click to expand...


Thanks man! Didn't EQed anything here. Concerning reverb, I use Virtual Sound Stage for panning & the ERs. For the tail I use Altiverb's ToddAO and a tad of EW Spaces' Burbank Scoring Stage.

For the trumpets, try layering the "Trumpets Ensemble" from CB Core with the "Trumpets Ensemble Muted" patches from CB Pro. Lower the volume of the muted patches and there will be a certain point, when they melt together and you don't hear the muted Trumpets as muted anymore. You will just recognize some extra brightness.
Btw. you can do the same with the horns to give them some extra brightness. It's a little more difficult here, because the timbre of the "normal" and stopped horns are so different.



benmrx said:


> Wow! Really nice work here! Though I must say IMO it's selling Cinebrass the most..., which isn't a bad thing!! That said the strings do sound quite nice. All in all, this is my favorite demo using Cinestrings so far.
> 
> I'm curious though what library you're using for the string runs (assuming this is the same template as before).



Thanks a lot! The string runs are the pre-recorded, chromatic runs from EW Hollywood Strings (Gold).


----------



## Polarity

*Re: The official CineStrings thread [Now Available!]*



lucor @ Wed 27 Nov said:


> Loving the library so far!
> 
> Two things I noticed though:
> - Is it me, or is the Volume of the legatos in the Articulation Patches very low in comparison with the other articulations? Normally not that big of an issue for me, as I load the True Legato Patch as well anyway, but unfortunatley the True Legato Patches seem to lack the Bow Attack Overlay feature?
> - The polyphonic legato seems to be pretty glitchy for me. Sometimes I can't get it to work at all and it acts like Monophonic is active (yes, I'm hitting the 2 notes simultaneously) and sometimes note get stuck and keep on ringing for 2-3 seconds.
> 
> Anyone else noticing this or is it just me?



No you aren't alone.
in addition to the problems with polyphonic legato - I get often notes that don't start, notes that stuck and play longer alone even after I released the other notes... -
I noticed other "bugs" here and there.

I heard glitches and holes in the sound when using Hairpin Creator and moving the Mod wheel for dynamics (if you play in vibrato it's much more evident).
All these glitches don't happen (with hairpin deactivated) if you do manually with CC11 Expression wheel what Hairpin does automatically. 
(I found this in the Full Ensemble Articulations - Full Mix patch for example.)

On some short articulations when note is released, I heard noises like the player hit something around him.

Sorry if I'm a voice out of the choir.
I love the sound... but I can't say I'm enjoying how some articulations are behaving under my hands at the moment.
Please tell me that CineBrass and CineWinds don't have all these kind of problems and behaviour! :cry:


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## Craig Sharmat

Polarity,

This is not unusual for new libraries, usually we hope for perfect when a lib comes out but rarely does that happen, same with software. This is why support is so important and track record of updates when considering your purchases. CSamples, Spitfire, Audio Bro, VSL and many others have been very proactive with updates. Hopefully this will continue and with future products coming they probably will. It was not that long ago when EW would announce a product, take money and ship it buggy a year later, times are way better now.


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## germancomponist

Craig Sharmat @ Sat Nov 30 said:


> ... It was not that long ago when EW would announce a product, take money and ship it buggy a year later, times are way better now.



Huh.... .


----------



## braindeaf

@Polarity


> in addition to the problems with polyphonic legato - I get often notes that don't start, notes that stuck and play longer alone even after I released the other notes... -
> I noticed other "bugs" here and there.



Did you check out the manual in regards to using the polyphonic legato? There are a couple things to remember:

1. Start your polyphonic line by playing the number of voices of polyphony that you want (i.e. if you want two-voice polyphony, you must play two notes at the same time to START the line). If you only play one note, then you are in monophonic mode until you release all notes, and if you try to play with polyphony it will not work properly since it thinks you're in one-voice mode.

2. only 3 voices are supported. Playing more than 3 notes at a time won't work.

When keeping those in mind, it works quite well. If none of that helps, attach a midi file of a sequence giving you the problems and I'll check it out.



> I heard glitches and holes in the sound when using Hairpin Creator and moving the Mod wheel for dynamics


Don't move the modwheel while using the Hairpin Creator. The Hairpin Creator uses fancy controller automation.


----------



## feck

Yes, I have noticed the polyphonic legato issues as well. With heavy scripting like that, I am not surprised it has some kinks. Like all sample sets this large, there are things that will take some time to perfect. I would much rather have that be the case than to have to wait another 6 months to have the product, especially since it's usually pretty easy to work around the common issues in new sample sets. Overall I love this sample set, and am already using it in my productions. I am sure they will continue to improve and update it over time as well. Great work guys!


----------



## pkm

braindeaf @ Sat Nov 30 said:


> Don't move the modwheel while using the Hairpin Creator. The Hairpin Creator uses fancy controller automation.



Yeah, as I understand it, if you select CC as a value in the hairpin dynamics, you have to set the mod wheel before the note on of a swell, which makes sense because it needs to know how fast to swell before it starts. Seems a little unintuitive, but probably unavoidable.


----------



## Cinesamples

pkm @ Sat Nov 30 said:


> braindeaf @ Sat Nov 30 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Don't move the modwheel while using the Hairpin Creator. The Hairpin Creator uses fancy controller automation.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yeah, as I understand it, if you select CC as a value in the hairpin dynamics, you have to set the mod wheel before the note on of a swell, which makes sense because it needs to know how fast to swell before it starts. Seems a little unintuitive, but probably unavoidable.
Click to expand...


+1 to both of these. The hairpin creator automates CC data. So if you're riding your own manual CC at the same time as the hairpin creator you will, of course, get unusual effects. 

If you wish to have the peak of your hairpin be a CC value, be sure to set it prior to performing the note.

The hairpin creator is designed to not require any CC controller stuff at all. If you wish to control CC on your own, we advise that you turn off hairpin creator.

Hope that clarifies some questions! 

MP


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## Cinesamples

feck @ Sat Nov 30 said:


> Yes, I have noticed the polyphonic legato issues as well. With heavy scripting like that, I am not surprised it has some kinks. Like all sample sets this large, there are things that will take some time to perfect. I would much rather have that be the case than to have to wait another 6 months to have the product, especially since it's usually pretty easy to work around the common issues in new sample sets. Overall I love this sample set, and am already using it in my productions. I am sure they will continue to improve and update it over time as well. Great work guys!



Here's my layman's understanding of the complex world of Polyphonic legato, and I'll also have someone smarter than I to answer for you too:

Creating polyphonic legato for any sample developer is a unique mathematical/statistical challenge. We have to program it based on basic standards and musical patterns that are most common when we are are performing the patch. Triads and basic inner-voice movement are not usually a concern, and the script performs well in all these cases. However, when voicing and inner line movement becomes too complex, the script does its best to analyze our musical intensions. Sometimes it gets it right, sometimes not.

Here's a suggestion, from a composer / midi programming standpoint:

These strings perform polyphonic chordal writing of 3 or more voices remarkably well with legato turned OFF. This ON/OFF switch can also be automated with CC.

Until we find a way to write a script that analyze's a composer's mind just microseconds prior to performing notes, we'll have to keep tweaking this way of scripting Polyphonic legato. 

Does this make sense?

Overall though, I'm glad there has been such a positive response to our library... and on VI-Control no less. 

Best, 
MP


----------



## feck

CineSamples @ Sat Nov 30 said:


> Creating polyphonic legato for any sample developer is a unique mathematical/statistical challenge. We have to program it based on basic standards and musical patterns that are most common when we are are performing the patch. Triads and basic inner-voice movement are not usually a concern, and the script performs well in all these cases. However, when voicing and inner line movement becomes too complex, the script does its best to analyze our musical intensions. Sometimes it gets it right, sometimes not.
> 
> 
> Best,
> MP



Yeah, that's pretty much what I figured - it is a very complex idea to script that. So, that being said, I don't expect it to work PERFECTLY all the time. I can't even imagine the amount of variables that go into that kind of coding. I think it's a fantastic idea, and is implemented very well in CS1.0. o-[][]-o


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## Polarity

Thanks for the quick responses.

about Polyphonic Legato: well, I believe it is a complex thing - if I got it right it's a new feature in a string library - but what I found strange is that it was giving the same problem on the same notes of the repetitive passage.
well actually I was playing a two chord melody that in past I created with a synth stringpad sound, so I was quick at playing it.

So I wonder, can't be an issue of Kontakt 5.3 itself?
it's the first time I use it... I updated Kontakt today just for CineStrings.
I'm a bit conservative with updates and, even if I'm on Windows, having read about rant by users of Mac OS made me stay on 5.2 till now.

about the Hairpin Creator: well, I guessed it is automating CC11, ie Expression controller... not CC1, ie Modulation controller.
that's why I found it strange.
Maybe I didn't described well what I encountered.
Moving together Mod Wheel (assigned to articulation dynamics) and Expression Wheel (yes, my master keyboard has three wheels and four sliders, all assignable to what I want) I have no artifact or issue with sound.
It's moving the Mod/Dynamics wheel with Hairpin Creator ON that creates glitches in sound.
theoretically they should control their own CC data each one in both situations.
At least it's what I thought...
so are you saying is it not so?

again: can't be a Kontakt 5.3 issue only?

Anyway I will found workarounds for both problems...
maybe using more than one patch of the same for legato parts if needed
and going manually with expression automation... no big deal.
during song compositions I work in a different way, today it was just "fun" playing mode to explore the new library.

thanks again for the responses.
and I'm looking for to mix CS with CB and CW soon.
actually I just read the Facebook post about the problem with CB Core serial numbers...
and I'm gonna get all the bundle of four packs...
I will need to aks a serial code for CB Core then.

all the best.


----------



## maest

@Polarity

The Hairpin Creator is actually using the internal modulator that controls the "timbre dynamics" (which externally is ONLY cc1) - I don't think it is cc11 - I will have to check the script on Monday.

DO NOT move cc1 while the Hairpin creator is active (meaning you have a note held down). You will confuse the automation happening within Kontakt and will get glitches. If you set the "dynamic" in that pull down menu to CC, then you can set the dynamic on the fly, but again you have to set it before ANY note is pressed down. A little tip: When set in Loop mode there is a 1 beat / 300ms (i think) transition from the last dynamic to the first. if you are jumping from FF to P there may be some glitches as well...

5.3 is a great move for Windows (FYI) we had so many crashes in 5.2 in building that were fixed in 5.3 (part of the reason why we had to move over to 5.2). You are in good hands in windows 7 and kontakt 5.3. 

Poly legato does take a bit to get used to on how it works. We are always trying to look at better ways to implement this. For now, read the manual - you will notice that B-1 (the lowest "b" on the 88 keyboard) while held down, disables legato mode. It is a non-latching keyswitch - which means once you let off the note and re-trigger a new sequence of notes, you are back in legato mode...

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

braindeaf @ Sat Nov 30 said:


> 2. only 3 voices are supported. Playing more than 3 notes at a time won't work.



Really? 3 note max? That's weird Cinebrass and Cinewinds you just play what you want and it seems to figure out the legato amazingly.

@Cinesamples - What was wrong with the way the Cinebrass and Cinewinds poly legato worked? Just curious why it was changed for Cinestrings. I was hoping that it would be like the others and just work for any polyphony.


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## Polarity

maest @ Sun 01 Dec said:


> @Polarity
> 
> The Hairpin Creator is actually using the internal modulator that controls the "timbre dynamics" (which externally is ONLY cc1) - I don't think it is cc11 - I will have to check the script on Monday.
> ........
> ........
> Best,
> Sam Estes
> Manager, Cinesamples



Ok, if it so, forget what I said! :mrgreen: 
Thanks also for all the other infos.
I will practice with legato and get a deeper look at the manual.

All the best.
Andrea


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## uselessmind

maest @ Sat Nov 30 said:


> DO NOT move cc1 while the Hairpin creator is active (meaning you have a note held down). You will confuse the automation happening within Kontakt and will get glitches. If you set the "dynamic" in that pull down menu to CC, then you can set the dynamic on the fly, but again you have to set it before ANY note is pressed down.



So that means if i want to use the hairpin creator, but also change its dynamics on the fly i can only do it for passages with big enough gaps right?

If that is the case its still a good feature, but it would be so much better if one could change the dynamics easily for legato passages.

I haven't tried it yet but i assume the off/on switch can be linked to a midi cc ?


----------



## Simon Ravn

Sorry but I can't find the "dynamics" setting anywhere? It was mentioned earlier that you could tweak the dynamics so you don't need to work so much with CC11 as well as CC1 but I can't see it.


----------



## Gabriel Oliveira

why Anze didn't post this here?

https://soundcloud.com/anzetheeye/cines ... patch-test


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## uselessmind

Simon Ravn @ Mon Dec 02 said:


> Sorry but I can't find the "dynamics" setting anywhere? It was mentioned earlier that you could tweak the dynamics so you don't need to work so much with CC11 as well as CC1 but I can't see it.



Its on the Settings page. Under hairpin creator you have knobs for start, hold and end.
Below them you can set the dynamics.


----------



## Guy Rowland

uselessmind @ Mon Dec 02 said:


> Simon Ravn @ Mon Dec 02 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Sorry but I can't find the "dynamics" setting anywhere? It was mentioned earlier that you could tweak the dynamics so you don't need to work so much with CC11 as well as CC1 but I can't see it.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its on the Settings page. Under hairpin creator you have knobs for start, hold and end.
> Below them you can set the dynamics.
Click to expand...


No, I think Simon means the overall dynamic shape. That's under the wrench - 2nd tab along you have mod long and mod short. My early fumblings found setting the dynamics any higher gave a pronounced steppy thing going on when riding CC1 though.


----------



## uselessmind

Guy Rowland @ Mon Dec 02 said:


> No, I think Simon means the overall dynamic shape. That's under the wrench - 2nd tab along you have mod long and mod short. My early fumblings found setting the dynamics any higher gave a pronounced steppy thing going on when riding CC1 though.



Yea, makes sense he wouldn't miss something so obvious.


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## Craig Sharmat

What time does intro pricing end?


----------



## Cinesamples

Please refer to our Facebook page for any further information. 

http://www.facebook.com/cinesamples


----------



## Craig Sharmat

NT


----------



## Enyak

As far as I can see the CineSamples Facebook page is constantly being updated, so the info right now is that the sale has been extended until wednesday.

I can appreciate having a central place for that kind of information, so I think the reply was perfectly helpful IMO.


----------



## skyforestblaze

On top of that you can't expect these devs to constantly check a forum to answer questions about their products. I think it's normal to always check the official website and/or Facebook page first, for up to date info. Saves a lot of forum clutter in the process.


----------



## Craig Sharmat

I had already checked both website and FB page for clarification and they took the time to respond here and still did not give the info. I also asked on their fb page but my question appears to have been erased for whatever reason (It is not clear if this is part of the sale since it happened first).

Considering I have bought numerous libraries and written a demo for one of their products I would hope for a better response.


----------



## Polarity

Craig Sharmat @ Tue 03 Dec said:


> I had already checked both website and FB page for clarification and they took the time to respond here and still did not give the info. I also asked on their fb page but my question appears to have been erased for whatever reason (It is not clear if this is part of the sale since it happened first).
> 
> Considering I have bought numerous libraries and written a demo for one of their products I would hope for a better response.



sorry, but why post a question on their facebook profile when actually there is already their "answer" on the same page... and as top post indeed? :roll: 
I'd understand (without offense) if they would delete a post like that: it's redundant.


----------



## Polarity

Please, I didn't find any information about this info in CineStrings manual:
are the samples 24bit and 48kHz ?!?
or are they 44.1 ?

I believe I read somewhere in past that CineSamples libraries are given us as 48kHz?
Am I right or perhaps I'm justing mixing up things with HZPercussion library?


----------



## wlotz

hi guys,

I thought that I'd ask a question here since it's the official Cinestrings thread. I might be the first person to complain about something regarding this product but hey, there always need to be the first one :lol: 

I have a very annoying problem with this library and it just doesn't let me enjoy playing with it. Basically, it sounds like it wasn't 'cleaned' (which is not possible, I know) - I'm talking about the sound that comes out of my system, not that the guys at Cinesamples didn't do the job properly. Almost every note I hit, especially short articulations introduce a lot of dirts, clicks, really weird buildups (no, it's not the great sound of the Sony hall, it's something different that just sounds wrong) and generally noises that I haven't heard in any other libraries I use, something I can't get rid of using EQ. It's obvious that this is not a synth, these are real life recordings recorded by real musicians and I want it to sound this way but I still think that what I hear is just too much, sounds more like a bug or a problem with my system (Logic X, Kontakt 5.3) and that's what I'm trying to find out.

I really like the sound, use Cinebrass as my main brass library so it would make it easier for me to mix them together etc. but it just doesn't work for me at the moment.

Anyone experiencing similar problems? 

Thanks,
W


----------



## Jem7

wlotz @ 3/12/2013 said:


> hi guys,
> 
> I thought that I'd ask a question here since it's the official Cinestrings thread. I might be the first person to complain about something regarding this product but hey, there always need to be the first one :lol:
> 
> I have a very annoying problem with this library and it just doesn't let me enjoy playing with it. Basically, it sounds like it wasn't 'cleaned' (which is not possible, I know) - I'm talking about the sound that comes out of my system, not that the guys at Cinesamples didn't do the job properly. Almost every note I hit, especially short articulations introduce a lot of dirts, clicks, really weird buildups (no, it's not the great sound of the Sony hall, it's something different that just sounds wrong) and generally noises that I haven't heard in any other libraries I use, something I can't get rid of using EQ. It's obvious that this is not a synth, these are real life recordings recorded by real musicians and I want it to sound this way but I still think that what I hear is just too much, sounds more like a bug or a problem with my system (Logic X, Kontakt 5.3) and that's what I'm trying to find out.
> 
> I really like the sound, use Cinebrass as my main brass library so it would make it easier for me to mix them together etc. but it just doesn't work for me at the moment.
> 
> Anyone experiencing similar problems?
> 
> Thanks,
> W



Can you post some audio clips I'm wondering what kind of noises you hearing?


----------



## feck

I have definitely heard some sub-lows on certain notes and some clicks in others. The subs are easy enough to high-pass, but I assume (ala Spitfire) that as time goes on they will have the time to go over the samples more closely to eliminate the clicks/noises. I can absolutely (and already am) still use it in my productions in the meantime though. I kind of expect this sort of thing with huge sets these days so I don't really get bothered by it.


----------



## Enyak

I've had major problems with the Legato Multi where there's a low and very pronounced hall rumble coming from the cello even in medium dynamics. I don't think I've heard that when using the single instrument patches - yet. I got the impression it's a problem with the multi patch though.


----------



## woodsdenis

wlotz @ Tue Dec 03 said:


> hi guys,
> 
> I thought that I'd ask a question here since it's the official Cinestrings thread. I might be the first person to complain about something regarding this product but hey, there always need to be the first one :lol:
> 
> I have a very annoying problem with this library and it just doesn't let me enjoy playing with it. Basically, it sounds like it wasn't 'cleaned' (which is not possible, I know) - I'm talking about the sound that comes out of my system, not that the guys at Cinesamples didn't do the job properly. Almost every note I hit, especially short articulations introduce a lot of dirts, clicks, really weird buildups (no, it's not the great sound of the Sony hall, it's something different that just sounds wrong) and generally noises that I haven't heard in any other libraries I use, something I can't get rid of using EQ. It's obvious that this is not a synth, these are real life recordings recorded by real musicians and I want it to sound this way but I still think that what I hear is just too much, sounds more like a bug or a problem with my system (Logic X, Kontakt 5.3) and that's what I'm trying to find out.
> 
> I really like the sound, use Cinebrass as my main brass library so it would make it easier for me to mix them together etc. but it just doesn't work for me at the moment.
> 
> Anyone experiencing similar problems?
> 
> Thanks,
> W



Difficult to know exactly what you mean without hearing it but I have gotten clicks on certain patches, it doesn't seem like an overload issue BUT increasing the buffer size to 1024 cures it, so it must be related to performance.

also for CINESAMPLES 

Lite patches for the ensembles would help in this issue. Bearing in mind Kontakt can only use 1 core in a DAW and I have 3.33 Mac some optimization would be great.

Still love the lib though o/~


----------



## uselessmind

Polarity @ Tue Dec 03 said:


> Please, I didn't find any information about this info in CineStrings manual:
> are the samples 24bit and 48kHz ?!?


Yes, they are.


----------



## wlotz

thanks a lot guys, your replies helped me to narrow the problematic area  I've noticed that it's much worse with the Articulations patches than with the split ones. Some of the problems still occur but it's something that can definitely be described as the hall sound/noise and I'm pretty sure that it's going to be updated soon knowing how good with this things Cinesamples are.

The second thing I've noticed is that it's mainly about spiccato and sometimes marcato patches, staccato sounds perfect for example, every single instrument:

Spiccato and Marcato Violin I, Violin II and Viola

Viola Spiccato - particularly bad

Finally, I have another problem with the split patches sustains this time. Does the legato work here as well? When I activate it (either mono or poly) it gives me something like this:

Legato - Split Patch Sustain (no legato)

The reason I'm asking all those questions is not because I'm spending days trying to find bugs :twisted: I really like the sound of this library, use Cinebrass for most of the brass parts and am planing to buy other sections so would be great to have it working as smooth as possible. And btw - do the CineGuys set their libraries/sections so they're ready to go together straight out of the box volume-wise or it needs some tweaking?

cheers,
W


----------



## Per Lichtman

@wlotz I would like to listen to the files, but so far all the DropBox links give me a 403 error.


----------



## wlotz

Ups, my fault, I've shared priv links :mrgreen: I've updated the links above but just in case:

Spiccato and Marcato Violin I, Violin II and Viola

Viola Spiccato - particularly bad

Legato - Split Patch Sustain (no legato)

Thanks,
W


----------



## Per Lichtman

@wlotz Great, those links worked.

Yeah, the legato issue sounds exactly like you described. There's not much chance this will make a difference, but for the heck of it, did you try purging samples and seeing if the results changed at all?

Also, when you using the splits, is there anything else loaded in the Kontakt instance at that point, or is that the only one? With some other libraries, I've sometimes found they behave unpredictably unless they have a Kontakt instance dedicated to just the patch I'm playing (though thankfully not often).


----------



## wlotz

Thanks Per.



> but for the heck of it, did you try purging samples and seeing if the results changed at all?


yep, no difference unfortunately



> Also, when you using the splits, is there anything else loaded in the Kontakt instance at that point, or is that the only one?


I'm using only one patch per Kontakt instance.

What do you think about shorts?

Thanks,
W


----------



## Craig Sharmat

I'm ok with the shorts, they sound pretty punchy.


----------



## Polarity

wlotz @ Tue 03 Dec said:


> What do you think about shorts?
> 
> Thanks,
> W



yes, I heard the dirt/noise. the release sample maybe?
can't check it at the moment.


----------



## Polarity

uselessmind @ Tue 03 Dec said:


> Polarity @ Tue Dec 03 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Please, I didn't find any information about this info in CineStrings manual:
> are the samples 24bit and 48kHz ?!?
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, they are.
Click to expand...


very good.
thank you!


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

Took the plunge and mostly so far so far good. Although I do find the poly legato less reliable than Cinebrass and Cinewinds. I get stuck notes sometimes and also notes cutting out when they shouldn't.

Again, out of curiosity, why develop a new script for poly legato when the Cinebrass and Cinewinds worked so well and didn't restrict polyphony to 3 notes? I would love to have their legato in Cinestrings.

Cheers


----------



## maest

@ Echoes,

There are a lot of reasons, a few too many to list.

We are trying to push Kontakt Scripting as far as it can go. Yes, there are some things that work better in CineWinds and Brass, we know that - but there is a lot more that I needed this script to do with getting the transitions work better - that it was worth the re-write. 

There is so much going on under the hood here, and trust me - it is much better than when we plugged in the old script to strings - that's one of the primary reasons why we scrapped the old script. FYI - we have re-worked this poly legato script now at least 3 times, each time it is getting better, but there are a few bugs that get introduced each time. 

I know it doesn't seem obvious, but it works much better than when we plugged it into the old script, I had so many stuck notes in the old one, it was unusable. 

Best,

Sam Estes
Manager, Cinesamples


----------



## Echoes in the Attic

Thanks Sam. That is very strange that you'd get struck notes with the same script but different samples. I can't say understand how the samples matter for the script and performance but I'll just have to trust you. I do find though that CineBrass always plays chord when I mean to whereas Cinestrings seems more picky and I end up playing just one note, I guess because I didn't play them close enough together. I wish there was a bit more give there or even a setting as to the initial chord detection as LASS does. Might be an idea for an update.


----------

