# Blackpond Tale (with Symphobia 2 and stuff)



## RiffWraith (Oct 4, 2010)

Soundcloud said:


> *Oops, looks like we can't find that page!*


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## Pietro (Oct 4, 2010)

Thanks Jeff, I'm trying to figure out what's going on.

- Piotr


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## RiffWraith (Oct 4, 2010)

Looks like it wasn't uploaded. According to SCloud, you have one track, and one track only: "Desert Run".

Twy again, dis time use totaw consentwashun!


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## Pietro (Oct 4, 2010)

Yeah, Soundcloud is somewhat lazy today . I had to delete and reupload it.

Should work now. And in case it doesn't:

http://www.piotrmusial.com/piotrmusial_-_blackpond_tale.mp3 (www.piotrmusial.com/piotrmusial_-_blackpond_tale.mp3)

Cheers,
- Piotr


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## RiffWraith (Oct 4, 2010)

Very nice - I like the mood and ambiance. Could have built up the ending a bit more, but that's just me.

Good work!


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## dcoscina (Oct 4, 2010)

I love this Pietro. Nice Williams chordal mvmt. How much of this is S2 and how much is other stuff?


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## IvanP (Oct 4, 2010)

Great piece, Piotr! Nice textures and harmonies, I like it 

I would love to listen to the Symphobia 2 rendering alone, but that's just my symphobia curiosity...so only if it doesn't bother you too much


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## dcoscina (Oct 4, 2010)

108 views and only 7 comments? I don't get it. This is a very musical piece with a lot going on harmonically. I know this is just going to stir up a hornet's nest but does anything other than MV-RC power anthems receive more than a few scarce comments? I think Alex Temple is the only non-MV style that gets a lot of feedback and it's more praise than anything else. 

I think it's not respectful to the author of whatever piece to listen to it and not comment. If Pietro only received 10 views, than this wouldn't bug me as much but over 100 views and 7 comments. C'mon guys....


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## stevenson-again (Oct 4, 2010)

dcoscina has shamed into making a comment.

i listen here all the time but i don't always comment.....

i also really like this. it feels like old school williams-ey hermanny, colourful and interesting. it's great stuff. i do think it is a bit dry here and there though - but actually maybe that's the vibe too - those early quite dry recordings. but i think some subtle hall in the background could really tie everything together.

it's very operatic. i keep thinking about some polish bloke going on about murdering his missus....


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## Guy Bacos (Oct 4, 2010)

Well 100 views isn't that much... but David is right, I really enjoyed this piece, it grabs you early on right to the end, very effective!


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## Pietro (Oct 5, 2010)

Wow, thanks to everyone for all the positive response! 

At first, I was trying to compose this piece with Symphobia 2 only. Then I had these different ideas, and couldn't restrain myself, so there's a lot of other products, mostly ProjectSam anyway - Truestrike, Symphobia 1, but also a little of LASS to "glue" the strings, Hollywoodwinds and Vienna flute (legato flute in S2 has a strange vibrato imo).

Anyway, for those interested, here's S2 only (with everything else muted):
http://www.piotrmusial.com/piotrmusial_-_blackpond_tale_s2 (www.piotrmusial.com/piotrmusial_-_blackpond_tale_s2) only.mp3

I think it would be easy to make a ProjecSam version only. If PS guys wanted it as a demo, I'd love to do it .

Thanks for listening,
- Piotr


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## Hannes_F (Oct 5, 2010)

Hi Piotr,

impressive, and interesting orchestration. I would love to hear the S2 version too but you please would have to write it without spaces, like

http://www.piotrmusial.com/piotrmusial_blackpond_tale_s2_only.mp3 (www.piotrmusial.com/piotrmusial_blackpo ... 2_only.mp3)

Thanks
Hannes


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## Dr.Quest (Oct 5, 2010)

http://www.piotrmusial.com/piotrmusial_-_blackpond_tale_s2%20only.mp3

This seems to work.
Very nice writing, btw.
J


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## nikolas (Oct 5, 2010)

I think that this is great. Your harmonic language works very well and so does your melodic lines and the more "extra-tonal" phrases you use.

I'm also quite impressed with the audio result.

In all a great piece of music.

EDIT: But yes, the coda was rather suddent... :-/


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## Rob (Oct 6, 2010)

great job, Piotr!


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## noiseboyuk (Oct 6, 2010)

Yes, sounds great. Really like the trumpets btw - are these the Trumpet Octaves at 1.30? And a bonus question - how about the lovely little stabby bits at 1.15?


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## Pietro (Oct 6, 2010)

Thanks for listening and your comments .

Yeah, this piece could develop a little further, but I had to close it. I could continue forever, but then I probably wouldn't finish it. 

For example, one of my pieces, I started composing for fun, and to learn something new is already over 12 minutes (8 minutes of a closed allegro part). I started it last year, and cannot finish it since then . I still would like to, but it keeps growing and growing, and I feel it's only a half of what it eventually should be.

Those trumpets are indeed Trumpet Octaves from S2. I like them too, though I'd love if they were legato. All effects are from S2 too, those trumpets around 1:12 are somewhere in the rythmic textures category.

- Piotr


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## dcoscina (Oct 6, 2010)

I do hope that PS expands on S2 in the future. They have been very good about adding content and programs to Symphobia 1 so I'm pretty sure they will continue to develop this. I'm also glad to have bought this. 

I do have regrets about buying a similarly priced library recently since I don't find I use it that much but I don't want to start naming names.....


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## jlb (Oct 6, 2010)

Great stuff  bit too dry maybe in places, agree with Rohan

jlb


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## noiseboyuk (Oct 6, 2010)

Thanks Piotr - interesting about those rhythmic textures. Forgive yet another s2 question - is that section quite large and versatile, or is a few nice odds and ends (or something in between)? Moments like that really help sell the illusion of reality.


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## Hannes_F (Oct 6, 2010)

Very good, Pietro.
One could say it's a shame ProjectSAM does not do full 'normal' orchestra libraries beyond Brass because they have the sound down and if they nailed the legato thing with today's Kontakt this would be it. 

For example the basses in the Sym2 version sound better to me than what you layered on it, it is just not legato.


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## Pietro (Oct 7, 2010)

Yeah, I agree, that ProjectSam should do full orchestral libraries. But I guess, that some of the magic of their products lies in the very fact of recording ensembles instead of individual sections and instruments.

@noiseboy: There is plenty of new effects in S2. Perhaps, the rythmic textures is not a very vast category though. I may be mistaken, but I feel like it's around 12 effects in 6 pitch variants.

Thanks for listening again,
- Piotr


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## mverta (Oct 7, 2010)

@dcoscina -

As of this writing, he has 2.5% of the people viewing his thread responding. 

My thread has 14,600+ views and only 187 replies, which is approx. 1%.


The way I see it, twice as many people are motivated to say something about his piece than in 10 months of my own. And for me, apathy is worse than negativity. So all in all, I have to face the fact that 99% of the people listening to my music don't give a crap enough to say...anything. Now you know why I keep practicing  True, a lot of viewers are guests without posting privileges. But they also aren't motivated enough to sign up to say something. Again, telling.

I think it's a nice piece, and as far as I'm concerned, is garnering a good amount of attention 



_Mike


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## jsaras (Oct 7, 2010)

mverta @ Thu Oct 07 said:


> @dcoscina -
> As of this writing, he has 2.5% of the people viewing his thread responding.
> My thread has 14,600+ views and only 187 replies, which is approx. 1%.



I hate to state the obvious, but this forum is one of the biggest bitch-fests I've come across on the web...unless you ARE Stravinsky and TJ produced the mockup for you yesterday using the new "North Hollywood" Brass library (OMG, listen to the legato chromatic runs and 15 microphone positions!) and StormDrum 4.0 (more "Hollywood" than ever before). 

If you happen to use the older sample libraries (like the VSL Cube), then it just sucks and don't waste my time with your dated crap.

That pretty much sums up most of what I read around here ;-|


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## Guy Bacos (Oct 7, 2010)

I thought it would be more appropriate and interesting to continue this discussion on a new thread, (and leave this one to Pietro's music).


http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtop ... 820#239820


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## JBacal (Oct 7, 2010)

Nice serious mood with a lot of weight.

Best,
Jay


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## dcoscina (Oct 7, 2010)

jsaras @ Thu Oct 07 said:


> mverta @ Thu Oct 07 said:
> 
> 
> > @dcoscina -
> ...



I sort of eluded to this on the offshoot thread of this. 

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## StrangeCat (Oct 7, 2010)

Cool film piece style.

But...every single line and phrase is being held back by less expression, you have to feel it like a conductor, add a little more cress to each note that is sustained long, pull the phrases and add more dynamics, make it come alive in a mix. (has nothing to do with the samples)

Add more tempo variation on phrases make the orchestra pull up and down swoop up and down, pp-f-ff.

It has some really great moments I like those winds. The bass in the beginning just isn't moving well enough, expression again. I love those winds from symphobia2 those are fantastic.

Would be nice if there was high flute part with trill then some harp glisses and a cymble cress up to some louder dynamics, then back down to the softer parts, just more dynamic motion through the orchestra. Over all the composition is very good.

Maybe you are changing it a bit to much with out repeats. That first motif get's kind of lost with the different answering phrases that change harmony through out.

over all lots of great moments.
Great Job! 

just passing through and I thought I would give a listen.


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## dcoscina (Oct 7, 2010)

I think it's harder to affect subtle tempo changes in a DAW as opposed to notation software. I find that I concentrate on phrasing and development of the line more in Sibelius or Notion than when I'm playing lines in realtime to a clicking metronome. Perhaps I'm not alone on this but I think Pietro's piece still breaths and feels very organic.


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## StrangeCat (Oct 7, 2010)

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## dcoscina (Oct 7, 2010)

The most recent fully developed piece I did on Logic 9 does have a small ritardando at the conclusion to give the piece that extra weight. I sort of agree about adding small tempo changes afterwards but I'm also intrigued about altering tempi in realtime using a slider or controller...I'll have to check that out. 

As for Sibelius, I NEVER play in realtime. I plot notes like the old fashioned way of composing. 

Sorry Pietro, didn't mean to hi-jack your thread.
For what it's worth, I think you've upped the ante for terrific sounding Symphobia demos. I'm striving to give my Symphobia 2 pieces that same fluidity.


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## StrangeCat (Oct 7, 2010)

I have to get back to work here and finish this track .

Here is an awesome example of orchestra temp variation.

Piece starts with low strings, (tempo same) the strings start to rise in steps with the bass and now brass is added as harmony(tempo starts to change little) 

now the strings are going up even more and the notes have become faster and winds are added with brass harmony(now the tempo is really going faster at this part)

From here the conductor has raised up his hands(the whole orchestra)

Now the orchestra lets off and the strings and winds and brass settle down a bit and the tempo goes back to the it's normal tempo. 

and now the conductor is he bringing his hands down slowly(everyone slow down, softer, slower)

Feel the emotion of that? Notes and phrases determine the tempo variations, the subtle cress through out the piece the feeling of each player adding his her own passion to a part. Everyone wants to be part of it and give there all.

that is the same with any style of music be it electronic or whatever. Mixes are like an ocean, the rising waves crescendo and decrescendo through out the piece, fluxuating the tempo with each phrase and moment of the music.


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## dannthr (Oct 7, 2010)

Very enjoyable, Piotr!


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## Pietro (Oct 7, 2010)

Thanks StrangeCat for you input.

I understand and use the idea (I've been playing in orchestras for more than 10 years now). You probably would be really surprised if you saw the expression, modwheel and tempo curves for this piece. There's a lot of movement in these areas. Tempo changes continuously sometimes for every note. But yeah, there's always place for improvement, I agree. It's a delicate matter not to overdo it though.

Anyway, to defend some of the decisions I made in this piece - I love dynamic and tempo movement or expression in music. I really do. And sometimes when I hear some music it irritates me, that it's so... flat, or lacks of expression. But sometimes, I like it. It almost drives me nuts, but I like that it does. It's difficult to explain.

And so for example, the very beginning in this piece is almost relentless, persistent.

I feel that there's a lot of tension in this sort of movement. It's a specific kind of tension - you would like the melody lines to be more this or that, yet it persists, and to me, the result is a strange feeling of insecurity. It's unsettling. You would like it to be more friendly, but the music decides for itself.

I don't know how to explain, but perhaps you'll get the idea. Sometimes I listen to music, and I so don't like it, that I like, that I don't. I guess it's one of the ideas of expressionism in music.

Thanks for your valuable comment, I appreciate it.

- Piotr


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## synergy543 (Oct 7, 2010)

Piotr, I enjoyed listening to your piece very much as it was refreshingly different with some colorful orchestration.

Greg


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## Hal (Oct 7, 2010)

i loved it somthing different from what we usually hear around here..was too short


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## careyford (Oct 8, 2010)

@Mike Verta - you'd get more responses if you'd leave more to criticize (i.e. quality).

Richard


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## mverta (Oct 14, 2010)

Why, yes, that's a nice thought, isn't it? 


_Mike


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## Hannes_F (Oct 14, 2010)

careyford @ Fri Oct 08 said:


> @Mike Verta - you'd get more responses if you'd leave more to criticize (i.e. quality).



Definetely.


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## George Caplan (Oct 14, 2010)

this is good and sounds like old hollywood especially the way the strings and horns sound in unison and its unsettling because it doesnt resolve. be good in a film like cat people.


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## tumeninote (Oct 14, 2010)

Hi Piotr,

I love this! I also heard your work previously on your website and is fantatic. Do you mind sharing some of your musical influences/composers? Parts of it reminded me of Shostakovich. Thanks for sharing this piece.


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## Pietro (Oct 16, 2010)

Thanks George, Brian.

I never really studies scores but I played in an orchestra and I have a good ear (and unfortunately - musical memory ). I absorb, what I like, even if I hear it only once, so it is possible, that there's a little of Ravel, Prokofiev, Shostakovich and John Williams influence.

There's a lot to like in each one of them.

- Piotr


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