# Stupid indies



## impressions (Mar 30, 2011)

/rant
it's been about 2 years since i'm in the market for short movies, and there isn't a month that goes by when a young director or producer wants a "big" score like hans zimmer for a silly 8-10 minute film, i mean come on... the whole point of being an indie is to create something fresh that's NEVER been done before-not relying on the success of the giants and trying to copy it so it would "succeed" also. and it won't obviously, since the producer who comes up with this "innovative" idea has the experience of a freshman. don't people know that uniqueness is what stands out? why replicate, clone, is that the only way you can learn to be better? 
and he calls on everyone in the team to be like him, creating another generation of wannabes.


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## lux (Mar 30, 2011)

well its a conseguence of virtual instruments. If you could hire Jack Nicholson for your ten minutes short, despite you are an "indie" director, wouldnt you just love that?

Well, its the same with music, they can have a similar sounding asset to the big budgeted movies at a fraction of the cost, and probably the attraction is too strong.

I have to say that here in Italy we have a complete opposite trend. There is pratically an handful of directors (say 3-4) which admit using orchestral sounds. All the rest reply on songs and minimal/experimental scores. Which i find a bit annoying as well personally.


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## JonFairhurst (Mar 30, 2011)

Both in films and music, we balance new and unique with old and predictable. If it's all new, it's disorienting. If it's all old, it's just a bad, boring copy. So, to use music that sounds familiar in film isn't necessarily a bad thing - assuming the film has other unique aspects.


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## José Herring (Mar 30, 2011)

impressions @ Wed Mar 30 said:


> /rant
> it's been about 2 years since i'm in the market for short movies, and there isn't a month that goes by when a young director or producer wants a "big" score like hans zimmer for a silly 8-10 minute film, i mean come on... the whole point of being an indie is to create something fresh that's NEVER been done before-not relying on the success of the giants and trying to copy it so it would "succeed" also. and it won't obviously, since the producer who comes up with this "innovative" idea has the experience of a freshman. don't people know that uniqueness is what stands out? why replicate, clone, is that the only way you can learn to be better?
> and he calls on everyone in the team to be like him, creating another generation of wannabes.



In the olden days of indie film (circa mid '90ies) we use to find creative ways to create scores on low budgets. Now, they want big stuff. No bones about it. The amount of films that require that "indie" score are precious few imo. It's a reality now. Everybody has access to a computer and a bunch of their favorite scores from recent blockbusters.


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## Danny_Owen (Mar 31, 2011)

If it is indeed a short 10-minute film and you have quite a lot of time you could always submit 2 ideas for a short section of score- that which he thinks he wants, and that which you think would be perfect for the picture. Some directors won't know that they'd prefer something original until they've heard it, simply because they can't envision anything musical that hasn't been done before. Try it... it might just work.

I took a bit of a risk on my latest project and went for something completely different and conceptual. It was a non-paid studenty type of thing so I thought 'what the hell, I'll give it a try' even though I knew he there was a chance he might hate it. When I submitted the first minute and a half to see if he thought I was on the right track his exact words were 'Fuck me.. I dont even need 2 listen 2 it twice. Thats the right track, sir. I like'.

Sometimes its worth the gamble (especially if it's low/non paid, you might as well experiment if you have a good idea).


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## impressions (Mar 31, 2011)

danny, that's my moto as well, the problem is the pitches are without any info about the film until you give them the right temp track-then you'd have to remake it and tell them that.

so its a waste of time. and besides i can't do something i don't strongly believe in it and do it well(do an amazing hans zimmer and then something experimental minimalistic for example).
the best pitch for films is to post some part of the film, tell the story, or show a scene which is best and explain what's the musical approach and let the composers do their best.
that way you can see if the composer also knows to work with the picture, knows how to add the sub-text, what kind of vibe we get, performance etc..

to the other posters, i disagree, each film, like each person, has its own unique voice, fingerprints, character, and depth, to copy paste, or even clone in a different way, is still just that-and that's the amount of depth the music will have. those producers want "fast and best result " not to design something that has a meaning in their film, even those cheesy hollywood films has a sense of meaning even if it's stupid and totally cliche. and besides what blockbuster would an 8 minute film would be? its a ridiculous notion. you can't even get in focus with an 8 minute film, it takes probably 15 minute to get in the vibe of the film, sometimes even half an hour. so the music should be much more to the point(hence minimalistic or experimental is more effective).


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## Danny_Owen (Mar 31, 2011)

Wow, that's ridiculous, no wonder you're frustrated! I haven't yet had to pitch for a project without them already having some kind of footage to show me, or at least a script. Pitching to script isn't too bad, though I always tell the director that ideas may change on seeing the footage, and that we'd discuss the music more in depth as soon as they have something visual to show me. Trying to throw temp tracks at them without being able to see the movie or know anything about it is a shoddy way to get composers to pitch... 

I have to agree with you on the fact that short indie films usually warrant something different and interesting. From all the festivals and screenings I've been to, by far the ones that have struck the entire audience the most have been the ones with original soundtracks inspired by the premise of the film. Too often you see work that is clearly imitating the hollywood scene, and 1) it's never as good as hollywood 2) there's nothing to grip the audience because they've heard it all before and 3) the type of music that they've gone for doesn't work 100% because it's simply not a hollywood movie.

I can understand your frustration- not all directors are so naive fortunately, it's just a challenge to find those that really understand the value of being different from everyone else.


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## noiseboyuk (Apr 1, 2011)

The irony is that these days a Hans Zimmer type score is probably easier to pull off than something smaller...


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## JJP (Apr 1, 2011)

noiseboyuk @ Fri Apr 01 said:


> The irony is that these days a Hans Zimmer type score is probably easier to pull off than something smaller...


Insightful! o-[][]-o


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