# Cubase 10.5 vs Studio One 4



## BlueStacc (Jan 29, 2020)

Hey guys!

Coming from FL Studio I now want to switch my DAW to something more capable for the orchestral genre. Yep, I'm "that guy" using FL Studio composing film music.. for years.. 

I already downloaded and started two "free 30 day trials". 1 for Studio One and 1 for Cubase. Having tried both out, I'm still very uncertain of what to go for in the end.

Studio One: Seems to be laid out very nicely and has a lot of functions. Mousewheel-Scrolling through your tracks seems to be a nightmare with such low speed in larger arrangements though. S1 runs smoother than Cubase on my system, don't know why.

Cubase: Expression Mapping and other additional MIDI features, great chord features S1 doesn't have yet (insert chords, drop notes, etc.). The marketing department seems to be focusing on film composers, which is a plus in a way, as it suggests that future features will focus on "composers" (could be "just marketing", I know).

Do you guys have suggestions and things to mind before making a decision?
Thank you so much!


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## easyrider (Jan 29, 2020)

Both are great, I have both...recently bought cubase though as it handles midi better when using Kontakt..

You can run multiple instruments in one instance of Kontakt and just route them to midi channels...

these MidI tracks appear in the mixer...this doesn’t happen in s1 and the process can still be achieved but in a way that’s not as slick...


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## stigc56 (Jan 29, 2020)

The midi editor in Cubase is second to none! Are you on PC or Mac?
Cubase is huge! It is really a deep DAW, a lot's of small adjustments and adaptions is needed. Has a lot of really nice features, Control Room,VST Expression maps, the best metronome system, but also heavy to work with.


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## BlueStacc (Jan 29, 2020)

stigc56 said:


> The midi editor in Cubase is second to none! Are you on PC or Mac?
> Cubase is huge! It is really a deep DAW, a lot's of small adjustments and adaptions is needed. Has a lot of really nice features, Control Room,VST Expression maps, the best metronome system, but also heavy to work with.


Thanks for the response!
I really enjoy the Cubase metronome as well.

I work on a PC.


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## Dewdman42 (Jan 29, 2020)

StudioOne might have a bright future in 5-10 years, and its quite good in a lot of cool ways, but it is nowhere near as deep as Cubase. Especially for Orch stuff, if that's what you want to get into, then I would stick with Cubase. I am watching StudioOne and we'll see what the future holds for it, but for now, despite some really cool workflow things, and support for AU, Cubase just has a lot more depth and particularly in the area of Expression Maps which you are going to want to use for Orch work.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Jan 29, 2020)

I also have both and prefer Cubase in general these days. S1 has good fundamental workflow but it needs refinement in other areas - for example, the colors palette, the lack of articulation maps, the performance, etc. Excited to see what S1 5.0 will bring but their focus recently has been more on beat makers and pattern-based music.


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## EgM (Jan 29, 2020)

I also use both on a mix of Windows 10 primarily and MacOS second. I mainly use Studio One because of its kickass preset system which I use with VEP (Vienna Ensemble Pro) It's not as developed as Cubase in the MIDI department but I don't miss anything from Cubase, I mainly play all my takes on a midi keyboard and edit as needed which it does properly.

What I hate about Cubase is its weird UI, it's awkward, clunky, windows everywhere, terrible mixer, scroll wheels seem to be set at 300% speed and there is nothing smooth. It does perform especially well though.

I decided to switch to SO because I value workflow above features even if it means a little cost of performance. I will always update Cubase to the last version as well because I need it for importing MIDI material.


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## EgM (Jan 29, 2020)

This is what I meant by kickass preset system.

Once I decide on an instrument, I just drag it from my personal presets from right to left and that's that. No need for 500 tracks preloaded if you can wait ~5 seconds — You need to drink that coffee at some point anyway 

 

The window on the top right is Vienna Ensemble Pro (an Instrument / VI server to host your instruments), you don't need this to use this workflow. I just prefer it because if I go over the capacity of my main machine, I can offload instruments to my secondary mac.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Jan 29, 2020)

EgM said:


> This is what I meant by kickass preset system.
> 
> Once I decide on an instrument, I just drag it from my personal presets from right to left and that's that. No need for 500 tracks preloaded if you can wait ~5 seconds — You need to drink that coffee at some point anyway
> 
> ...




How do you deal with changing articulations?


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## tabulius (Jan 29, 2020)

I'm switching between Cubase and S1 constantly. However, within a few months, I've been using Studio One more, because some of the workflow things just work for me so well, that when using Cubase I really miss those. Cubase is the king if you love HUGE 600-1000+ track projects, but I found the modular way to build the template in Studio One, so performance is not an issue. I don't use expression maps personally, so I don't care about those.

Here are some of the thing I like in S1: Transform instrument tracks to audio and back, I like the mixer GUI better, drag and drop everything, quickly select tracks and they are grouped, the midi editor looks clean with tabs, channel pre-gain, my legacy Faderport works(!), instrument preset system is great, 0.5 and smaller upgrades usually give some really useful new features (for free), bus channels have a console emulations called "Mix FX" with crosstalk, I can actually open the fx plugin when clicking the sends.

I miss these Cubase features the most (hopefully S1 updates will give some of these): Tracks for video files, Variaudio when working with tuning, adding fx offline workflow, giving random values of velocity and timing to midi notes, the tracks view is a bit cleaner to my eyes, able pitch bend up and down, able to change the pitch "tape-mode" where files slow down or are faster depending the values, Cubase interface stays snappier even with big projects, CPU handling is still a little better.


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## Robert Kooijman (Jan 30, 2020)

Use both, but mostly S1. Much better workflow & more pleasant GUI. Lots of very smart features, also in the MIDI department.

And S1 is snappier here then Cubase as well (even after ordering & using a new dongle).

I'm honestly amazed by the lack of progress in Cubase, especially regarding its non-intuitive GUI and inconsistent, intrusive window borders. Things really went IMO downhill after the badly integrated, infamous Media-bay got introduced. 

Variaudio is nice, but having Melodyne ARA-integrated in S1 isn't too bad either.

Am STILL waiting for decent articulation management though. Using the drum editor in S1 works pretty well as a workaround, and is easy to set-up, but it's about time Presonus implements this long overdue and much requested feature.


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## Robert Kooijman (Jan 30, 2020)

tabulius said:


> I miss these Cubase features the most (hopefully S1 updates will give some of these): ...giving random values of velocity and timing to midi notes...



You can do this and more in S1 4.6 using the pattern editor. And switching editors is very convenient in S1


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## EgM (Jan 30, 2020)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> How do you deal with changing articulations?



With MIDI channels.


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## KallumS (Jan 30, 2020)

Have you seen Alex Moukala's YouTube videos? He uses FL Studio for composing and can switch articulations like Cubase.

E.g


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## ALittleNightMusic (Jan 30, 2020)

I’d be curious to know how folks are using the drum editor for articulation management- sounds cool! Is there a tutorial? Can you change MIDI channels per note on the same track?


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## AEF (Jan 30, 2020)

Im a 15+ year Logic user but finding myself really into S1. I dont enjoy keyswitches anyway and particularly never enjoyed using articulation sets in logic. If you compose in the DAW, I dont see how they are any more useful than folder tracks with arts on separate midi tracks. but to each his own...

Never could get on with Cubase. Its brilliant though, and its really all about trying them out (they both offer free extended trial periods) and seeing which one clicks for you.


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## rrichard63 (Jan 30, 2020)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> I’d be curious to know how folks are using the drum editor for articulation management- sounds cool! Is there a tutorial? Can you change MIDI channels per note on the same track?


I would also like to learn about this.


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## dzilizzi (Jan 30, 2020)

Coming from pretty much any other DAW, Studio One is easy to use and just makes sense. It always takes me twice as much time to get anything going in Cubase. I do have both. Cubase has unusual nomeclature, partially because they invented VST and use the term for things you may not associate with VST. But then, Studio One calls MIDI something else too. It's just that I don't have to use the manual to make Studio One work, so I don't have to figure out what they call it in order to look it up. 

That said, I do more pop/rock and am only starting to do a bit of orchestral stuff. If you are going to be learning a new system for orchestral, I would go with Cubase for all the extras it can provide for the film track/orchestral genre. Plus it does have a lot of extra midi functions. Unless you don't do huge track counts. And then you might as well stay with FL if it works for you. The other plus about Cubase is there are a lot of users here who can help if you have issues.


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## jbuhler (Jan 30, 2020)

I used to use S1 as frequently if not more so than Logic. But I’ve shifted toward Logic since it got articulation sets and some other things. I’ve had trouble with S1 as track counts increased and I started writing longer pieces. Using S1 efficiently requires setting up a lot of macros and it can be confusing. Its manual is not good (lots of undocumented features but no way to learn about them aside from running into someone who knows about one) and the user base is much smaller so it can be hard to learn about undocumented features and macros.


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## NYC Composer (Jan 30, 2020)

EgM said:


> What I hate about Cubase is its weird UI, it's awkward, clunky, windows everywhere, terrible mixer, scroll wheels seem to be set at 300% speed and there is nothing smooth.


You’re singing my song. I’ve been with Cubase a long time and a lot of it is great, but the crazy UI can drive me up a wall. As I struggle for screen space with a million open windows, I usually “minimize all” and just open the project window again leaving everything else hidden.


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## dcoscina (Jan 30, 2020)

I have Studio One Professional, Logic and Cubase..and DP...and Ableton...you get the point. I spend most of my time between Logic X and Cubase 10.5 but I'm loving the expression maps in Cubase. And the general workflow for orchestral writing (for me) is better than Logic. Copy-paste at original is so speedy. Yeah Logic has that too but I like the arranger page of Cubase and the tools better.


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## DS_Joost (Jan 31, 2020)

Cubase UI used to be really ugly. Lots of disparate elements. Since version 10.5 however, they fixed a lot of it and now I believe it to be the easiest and the prettiest to look at. Funny how just a couple changes can do that.


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## NYC Composer (Jan 31, 2020)

10.5 crashed constantly on my iMac. I had to downgrade to 10.


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## Robert Kooijman (Jan 31, 2020)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> I’d be curious to know how folks are using the drum editor for articulation management- sounds cool! Is there a tutorial? Can you change MIDI channels per note on the same track?





rrichard63 said:


> I would also like to learn about this.


There's a thread about it, made a small video showing articulation switching using the MIDI editor.
Articulation switching in Studio One


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## barteredbride (Jan 31, 2020)

EgM said:


> What I hate about Cubase is its weird UI, it's awkward, clunky, windows everywhere, *terrible mixer*, scroll wheels seem to be set at 300% speed and there is nothing smooth.



Why is the mixer terrible in Cubase?

It seems fine to me! But I´ve only ever used Cubase and Ableton Live, so what is good about other DAWs mixers that make Cubase so terrible?

I´m curious, as obviously I could learn Pro Tools or some other DAW to do mixing and mastering.


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## DS_Joost (Jan 31, 2020)

barteredbride said:


> Why is the mixer terrible in Cubase?
> 
> It seems fine to me! But I´ve only ever used Cubase and Ableton Live, so what is good about other DAWs mixers that make Cubase so terrible?
> 
> I´m curious, as obviously I could learn Pro Tools or some other DAW to do mixing and mastering.



Nothing. The mixer is one of the best parts of Cubase actually.


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## EgM (Jan 31, 2020)

barteredbride said:


> Why is the mixer terrible in Cubase?
> 
> It seems fine to me! But I´ve only ever used Cubase and Ableton Live, so what is good about other DAWs mixers that make Cubase so terrible?
> 
> I´m curious, as obviously I could learn Pro Tools or some other DAW to do mixing and mastering.



Personal opinion of course, but I hate that it lacks track volume on the track list, only in the inspector:






The bottom mixer misuses screen estate, you can't see the inserts, sends, outputs without changing view to full screen, way too big. I'm on 2560x1440 resolution:






I just prefer my mixers, track arrange volumes to be like this and not waste screen space. Also, seeing my inserts, sends and routing in the lower pane is important to me since I use 3 screens, one main for the DAW, the left for Vienna Ensemble Pro, the right for everything else:


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## ChazC (Jan 31, 2020)

IMO the mixer is terrible in Cubase. Mainly from an aesthetics perspective but the main thing that drives me nuts in functionality is lack of track ordering.

If you come from an analogue desk (old school!) background it looks terrible - about the only thing Pro Tools still has going for it is how the mixer looks. If Steinberg would at least sort out the overall colour options it’d at least be a bit more customisable than what we have now. Fader cap colours are great to have but not much consolation when the rest of it looks as it does. At least there’s the option for full channel colours now I guess, but then they get rid of all the knob cap colours in the strip FX! One step forward, 2 steps back.

(I’d still never go back to Pro Tools though regardless!)


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## Ozan Colakoglu (Feb 2, 2020)

Robert Kooijman said:


> Use both, but mostly S1. Much better workflow & more pleasant GUI. Lots of very smart features, also in the MIDI department.
> 
> And S1 is snappier here then Cubase as well (even after ordering & using a new dongle).
> 
> ...





tabulius said:


> I'm switching between Cubase and S1 constantly. However, within a few months, I've been using Studio One more, because some of the workflow things just work for me so well, that when using Cubase I really miss those. Cubase is the king if you love HUGE 600-1000+ track projects, but I found the modular way to build the template in Studio One, so performance is not an issue. I don't use expression maps personally, so I don't care about those.
> 
> Here are some of the thing I like in S1: Transform instrument tracks to audio and back, I like the mixer GUI better, drag and drop everything, quickly select tracks and they are grouped, the midi editor looks clean with tabs, channel pre-gain, my legacy Faderport works(!), instrument preset system is great, 0.5 and smaller upgrades usually give some really useful new features (for free), bus channels have a console emulations called "Mix FX" with crosstalk, I can actually open the fx plugin when clicking the sends.
> 
> I miss these Cubase features the most (hopefully S1 updates will give some of these): Tracks for video files, Variaudio when working with tuning, adding fx offline workflow, giving random values of velocity and timing to midi notes, the tracks view is a bit cleaner to my eyes, able pitch bend up and down, able to change the pitch "tape-mode" where files slow down or are faster depending the values, Cubase interface stays snappier even with big projects, CPU handling is still a little better.





tabulius said:


> I'm switching between Cubase and S1 constantly. However, within a few months, I've been using Studio One more, because some of the workflow things just work for me so well, that when using Cubase I really miss those. Cubase is the king if you love HUGE 600-1000+ track projects, but I found the modular way to build the template in Studio One, so performance is not an issue. I don't use expression maps personally, so I don't care about those.
> 
> Here are some of the thing I like in S1: Transform instrument tracks to audio and back, I like the mixer GUI better, drag and drop everything, quickly select tracks and they are grouped, the midi editor looks clean with tabs, channel pre-gain, my legacy Faderport works(!), instrument preset system is great, 0.5 and smaller upgrades usually give some really useful new features (for free), bus channels have a console emulations called "Mix FX" with crosstalk, I can actually open the fx plugin when clicking the sends.
> 
> I miss these Cubase features the most (hopefully S1 updates will give some of these): Tracks for video files, Variaudio when working with tuning, adding fx offline workflow, giving random values of velocity and timing to midi notes, the tracks view is a bit cleaner to my eyes, able pitch bend up and down, able to change the pitch "tape-mode" where files slow down or are faster depending the values, Cubase interface stays snappier even with big projects, CPU handling is still a little better.





Robert Kooijman said:


> You can do this and more in S1 4.6 using the pattern editor. And switching editors is very convenient in S1


There is also a humanize function for velocity and timing with right click on the midi region


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## BlueStacc (Feb 5, 2020)

Thank you for all your input!
I made my decision: Cubase


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## Sean J (Feb 14, 2020)

Studio One

A Steinberg dev manager and the guy who created vst3 left to make Studio One. It's clear up front that both DAWs are very similar, except S1 focuses on user voted features. I find S1 to be far more reliable, intuitive workflow, and plugins that make sense. They don't just have a better convolver than REVerence... but a utility to make your own IR's. Many DAWs have this feature. Cubase is last here.

In 10.5, Steinberg sold track import and video export as major improvements. S1 added these a year prior. Audio batch processing and conversion in S1. A better tempo track editor. Actually useful plugin cpu monitoring. The scratch pad to sketch sequences and decide later if they go into the final song. The list goes on and on. As for maps, in recent months it climbed to the top feature request. It was requested 4 years ago, but other features were at the top during most of that time... features which PreSonus heard and added. v5 will likely come out in the coming months. I look forward to it.

Steinberg does have great things. They will add great things in the future. I just like Studio One 10,000x more.


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## Sean J (Feb 14, 2020)

BlueStacc said:


> Thank you for all your input!
> I made my decision: Cubase



Sorry, I did read the thread but somehow overlooked that you had decided. Best of luck!


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## kitekrazy (Feb 15, 2020)

I like S1's licensing. Up to 5 machines and activate and deactivate when needed.


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