# Need a new system - hackintosh the answer?



## bassmancai (Apr 19, 2015)

Hey all,

So I need to upgrade my system. I'm running a 2008 iMac (dual core, 16gb RAM, 128 GB SSD and 1TB external SSD) and it's just not up to the job whatsoever. I'm running Komplete 10 Ultimate but the crippling beauties is my Cinesamples libraries, which are beautiful but just make it impossible to create anything without dropouts and problems in LPX.

I'd LOVE to upgrade to a new mac...it'd future proof me (writing for trailers / sync) but I just can't afford it, whichever way I look at it. My budget at the moment is £1k, and I'm adamant that I want to stay with Logic, as it's what I've used for a long time and a lot of people I work with also use Logic, so it just doesn't make sense for me to 'start again' with PC software. However, I'm not alien to PC hardware, as I grew up with PCs before switching to mac a few years ago, but I'm definitely no expert. 

A producer I work with closely has a self-built hackintosh that whilst hasn't been problem free, is powerful and laughs at anything mildly intensive thrown at it. So I've been doing some very soft research...with a budget of £1k, I spotted this setup on eBay - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hackintosh-mac-pro-i7-4790K-4-4GHz-16GB-RAM-GTX-960-250GB-SSD-Yosemite-/261776545708?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item3cf31917ac

Something pre-built appeals to me as I wouldn't be confident of putting something together myself, yet I have a mackintosh specialist not far from me if I run into any problems. Is this a capable system in terms of running layered intensive orchestral samples? Are there any tech-knowledgable peeps that can advise on this particular system? One thing I am aware of is that this system will only take a max of 32gb RAM...is it possible to upgrade the motherboard at some point to use more RAM or do other conflicts then come into play?

Thanks in advance for anyone that can help!


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## Lawson. (Apr 19, 2015)

I would go for a slave PC. You can still use Logic, most (or all) of your samples will be on the PC, and it will fit in your budget. I'm not sure how advanced you are with this type of stuff, so feel free to ask as much as you want.


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## Jdiggity1 (Apr 19, 2015)

I am PC + Cubase based, but every so often I need to use Logic for whatever reason, so I built a hackintosh (dual-boot Mac and Windows 7). In short, it works. But it is not always headache free.
I personally wouldn't recommend it as a work computer or main workstation unless you enjoy 'tinkering' with system files and the like. For me, it was usable as a Logic system, but things could get messy when you have to update software or the OS.
HOWEVER, this is just my experience.

As for that system on eBay, you are paying a lot for a graphics card that you don't need.
'Upgrading' the motherboard to a model that handles 64GB RAM will require a different processor too, not to mention you will have to then re-do the whole installation process of Mac and choose the appropriate settings (kexts) for the motherboard you chose.

If you still want a hackintosh, then get a pre-built one, and use your current Mac Pro as a slave. If you are unfamiliar with master / slave setups, it is essentially using a second computer as an external RAM expansion. So your hackintosh w/32GB + a slave w/16GB will give you 48GB of memory to work with.
That is a very basic way of describing it. 

There is obviously room for much discussion on this topic, but I will leave it at that for now.


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## jaeroe (Apr 19, 2015)

I've built 3 hacks and had good experiences doing so. i currently have 2 in my main rig and they are very solid. huge bang for the buck and with sites like www.tonymacx86.com out there you can usually find someone who is doing what you want to do and has a successful build with all the kinks worked out and all the details to share. there is also a great community of very knowledgeable people willing to help out. i wouldn't suggest it for someone who hasn't built a PC before unless they are otherwise confident they are pretty good at isolating variables. but, just do your research and if you aren't doing something crazy weird you should be fine. if you stray from a known working build then you can run into issues that take some sussing out.

you can do a search on tonymac for the software (logic X) , hardware, os and processor you want to use. i'd also get an idea of what motherboard (i would only use Gigabyte or Asus - find builds with one of them) you want to use and include that in the search.

The video card is incredibly important for compatibility, so while a video card might seem like an unnecessary expense in a built, if it is working and it is $100-200 more I'd go with it. really stick to exactly what is known. if something is no longer available ask people on the site for advice about swapping things out that won't cause problems.

i currently have 2 hacks in service in my main rig (along with a 2008 octo core mac pro). both are quad i7 3.5 ghz machines with 32gb ram. i made each for $1000 USD (not including the SSDs i use for my sample libraries). the only issue i have with them at all is - 1 of them hangs at the log in window for a couple minutes thinking about something on initial boot up in the morning, just sort of sits and then is totally fine. otherwise - works fantastically. the 2nd machine (which has a pro tools hd native thunderbolt rig) simply has to be restarted after initial boot up in the morning for the thunderbolt to power up properly (not doing so will eventually cause a crash if you use thunderbolt). otherwise, all fine and they are work horses.

just to keep your life simple, don't use cheap video cables and be smart about isolating things if a problem does arise. you want to be able to isolate things - i once had an issue where i suspected my video card was bad, but it was actually a cheap cable. being a hack i suspected the built. build was fine. my hacks actually have a better track record for video card survival than the legions of macs i've owned over the years.

a 64GB build no matter what route you go (and a hack is after all just a PC with particular parts) a 64GB build is a little pricey.

i would simply recommend that someone who wants to run a hack in his/her rig should understand reasonably well how a hack is built and how it works. take the time to learn that (say reading a couple hours a night for a week) and i think a lot of people who use the technology we are used to using daily would be in decent shape. my first hack i researched 2-3 hours a night for a week, bought parts and had up and running in 1 day for installation. worked great. the first PC i built (in 2009) took me many weeks to get working properly - way more headache. tonymac really makes hacking way easier and safer.


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## bassmancai (Apr 20, 2015)

I really appreciate these replies guys. 

Lawson - not as advanced as I'd need to be, I suspect. I'm no BIOS expert and whilst I've got experience troubleshooting PC problems, I literally have no idea what the processes of fixing an error on a hack would be, software-wise. As I say, I have people around me who ARE clued-up on this stuff, so I figure if I run into a crippling problem they can help.

Jdiggity1 and Jaeroe - thanks for all the info both of you, very helpful. I'm running an iMac rather than a Mac Pro, and I'm not hugely up on the whole master / slave vibe either, but it sounds like it'd make sense to run a 32gb hack with my iMac as a slave. Is it viable to use the internal SSD on my (slave) iMac as a drive for the master machine? I get what you're saying about the gfx card on the ebay link I posted, but I don't necessarily mind paying that bit extra for the card if I know it's going to work, and considering that has Yosemite pre-installed it's very tempting to buy a pre-built machine which (looking at the recommended CustomMac Pro builds on TonyMac) are all compatible with each other. If I was to buy the components separately I'd be paying almost the same amount but with the added variable of set-up.

Any extra thoughts massively appreciated guys, very much a noob as you can see...


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## bassmancai (Apr 20, 2015)

Jaeroe, you're absolutely right in terms of wanting to have a hack which has as good compatibility with Logic Pro X as possible, and looking at the some forum threads over at tonymac people are running the recommended components in their most recent CustomMac Pro build notes...which match the components of that hack on eBay. Obviously I know I'd need to do my homework on a pre-biuld anyway, because the chances of it running perfectly are still 50/50 (maybe at best!) but would you say it'd be a decent machine to start with?


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## vicontrolu (Apr 20, 2015)

What is it that still makes you want to stay on MacOs nowadays? I am asking seriously, cause i have no troubles with win7 at all but maybe i am missing something here.


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## Jdiggity1 (Apr 20, 2015)

@vicontrolu: He uses Logic.


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## vicontrolu (Apr 20, 2015)

Oh..right


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## bassmancai (Apr 20, 2015)

Yeah vicontrolu...I'm a Logic guy and working with other musicians / producers who also use Logic means I want to stick to Mac OS!


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## jaeroe (Apr 20, 2015)

Bassmancai - I would ask the model of the motherboard and inquire about having them just load it up with 32GB RAM. the Z97 chipset tops out at 32GB RAM and only has 4 slots, so just go straight for (4x) 8 GB chips and avoid having to buy ram twice.

re master slave - you'd be getting Vienna Ensemble Pro to do that. You need the software plus an eLicense dongles per computer in use. and yes, i would do that hack and then look at putting an SSD in the iMac to run samples off of. there are videos on youtube and macsales.com for installing SSDs in all sorts of macs.

if you go with a known build on tonymac and stick to the letter your changes of success should be much higher than 50/50. if you have someone else do it who knows their stuff then it's all the better. the series motherboard is extremely popular for hacking. a lot is known about it, and that's what you want. using common components means the work that others have been done has been incorporated into the default install and the kinks ironed out.

re your iMac's SSD - are you asking if you can remove the SSD from your iMac and use it in your Hack? should be fine (assuming it's a SATA drive and you have the space on the Hack - which you should). if you're talking about using it in your iMac to stream samples while running your OS - you can. just from a recovery stand point, i'd partition them. if you have to re-install the OS for some reason it is much faster to just recover a smaller size volume, and usually sample drives don't go down as much as OS volumes.

if you're going to be streaming samples from the iMac i'd want to have the samples on an SSD in the iMac. it is an older machine - can use all the help it can get.

re learning about hacks and the general idea - tonymac has great articles that give you the lay of the land and keep it fairly straightforward. if you're not that technical, it's like anything else - you have to give it and yourself a chance to learning something new. (i used to know absolutely nothing about computers and eventually ended up teching for people for a few years.) http://www.tonymacx86.com/basics/104542 ... start.html


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## Saxer (Apr 20, 2015)

another possibility would be to add a slave pc. needs the investment of vienna ensemble pro AND a pc. but maybe easier.


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## JohnG (Apr 20, 2015)

agree -- slave PC is cheap and easy. So powerful for so little money now.


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## jaeroe (Apr 20, 2015)

the only thing with a pc slave in his case is you generally want your powerful computer to be the one hosting VEP server (running your DAW). you wouldn't fair as well with a newer PC as the slave and an older 2010 iMac as the master VEP server/DAW. Better to have the DAW on the new computer (hack, as it's Logic) and the iMac as a slave.

both a hack and a PC are PCs, they just run different OSs. so, if you're building a computer, just make it a hack and have Logic on there.


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## Øivind (Apr 20, 2015)

+1 for slave PC


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## bassmancai (Apr 21, 2015)

Again, thanks for all the replies guys. I've been in contact with the eBay seller and managed to get a build that'd have 32GB of RAM, so with that setup I think I'd be very happy. I'll get a licence for VEP and use my iMac as a slave and hopefully I should be good to go :D


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## jaeroe (Apr 21, 2015)

Congrats and enjoy!


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## Øivind (Apr 22, 2015)

Congrats 

Just a side note, it might be best to have the most powerful computer 
run as the slave. As the more you host on the slave, the less power you need 
on your master/daw/sequencer computer.

Also that way, you do not need to make the new computer a hack. Keep the
iMac as the master (16gb & Logic), and use the new one as a slave (32gb & VEPro).
Of course, this is just a suggestion


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## jaeroe (Apr 22, 2015)

oivind_rosvold @ Wed Apr 22 said:


> Congrats
> 
> Just a side note, it might be best to have the most powerful computer
> run as the slave. As the more you host on the slave, the less power you need
> ...



No - you want the master to be the most powerful, especially in a case where the other computer is a 5 year old iMac with SATA II. The master has to process all the incoming audio from the host (which is work) plus all you have going on in Logic. You'll be able to run plenty of VIs on the Hack as host - more than the iMac, whether the Hack/PC is master or slave.

Plenty of people run Hacks with great success. You've spent some good money - plan for the future - run the Hack as master.

you can always test by installing Windows on the Hack - just read up on doing so for your build. but, i've been there and done that. Master is the potential bottle neck. VSL also highly recommends the mastering being the more powerful.


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## Lawson. (Apr 22, 2015)

jaeroe @ Mon Apr 20 said:


> the only thing with a pc slave in his case is you generally want your powerful computer to be the one hosting VEP server (running your DAW). you wouldn't fair as well with a newer PC as the slave and an older 2010 iMac as the master VEP server/DAW.



As far as I know, you want the more powerful computer to be the slave. The slave is the one hosting the VEP server, not the master (running the DAW). All the master has to do is process ~3MB/s of incoming audio.


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## jaeroe (Apr 22, 2015)

Lawson. @ Wed Apr 22 said:


> jaeroe @ Mon Apr 20 said:
> 
> 
> > the only thing with a pc slave in his case is you generally want your powerful computer to be the one hosting VEP server (running your DAW). you wouldn't fair as well with a newer PC as the slave and an older 2010 iMac as the master VEP server/DAW.
> ...



and you're basing that on what?

ultimately VEP server gets hosted in your DAW and has to be processed through it. There has been much discussion here on secs for masters and slaves respectively. you can also ask VSL, who in the past have said to make sure your host/DAW is powerful enough - of the two, it should as powerful if not more. having a powerful slave that is a bottle necked by the DAW hosting VEP won't help you much.

a simple test is this:
load your template - open your DAW with VEP instantiated, but not connected to the servers. then make your VEP connections, making the connection for each instance one by one and watch the load on your DAW. you will see the load increase as you connect. the DAW isn't doing nothing - it has to process that audio coming through.


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## Saxer (Apr 23, 2015)

jaeroe @ 22.4.2015 said:


> a simple test is this:
> load your template - open your DAW with VEP instantiated, but not connected to the servers. then make your VEP connections, making the connection for each instance one by one and watch the load on your DAW. you will see the load increase as you connect. the DAW isn't doing nothing - it has to process that audio coming through.


if the VEP plugin on the DAW side would need as many power as the instrument plugin on the slave PC it would make no sense to use slave PC's at all. the VEP plugin doesn't need no CPU but it is definitely lower than a virtual instrument. some midi is going out and an audio stream comes back. and it is steady and doesn't rise when the orchestra tutti comes in. that's the reason you use slave PC's for the hard work. and yes, the slave should be the bulldog.


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## bassmancai (Apr 24, 2015)

Again, thanks for the comments, guys. For someone with no experience of master / slave computer setups, it's all very helpful. For the meantime, I'm going to try running the Hackintosh as a standalone, master machine. If and when I hit any bottleneck / RAM issues, I'll try running VEP with my iMac (which is actually a 2008 model, not even 2010). I'd be amazed if running an 08 iMac as a master machine would benefit me in this situation!


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## jaeroe (Apr 24, 2015)

Saxer @ Thu Apr 23 said:


> jaeroe @ 22.4.2015 said:
> 
> 
> > a simple test is this:
> ...



the amount of connections you make from VEP to your DAW and the latency you work at is what will put more stress on your DAW. it has to buffer per connection. if you don't do much routing between VEP and your DAW or with greater latency, it won't cause much stress on your DAW. but, that seems a waste of a way to work with VEP, to me. 

ultimately, you want to give the biggest workload to the the strongest computer. whoever said you can't run VEP locally on the same computer as the DAW? i've always had better luck with more demanding VIs and the DAW itself (with all of it's DSP) on the more powerful computer and the weaker computers as slaves, just making sure to put the most demanding VIs on the most powerful computer or spread reasonably well. if you want to be able to print stems and mix quickly (a reasonable amount of routing and DSP processing while programming), i've just found this to work much better. the computer that has my DAW is almost always the one under fire.


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## jaeroe (Apr 24, 2015)

bassmancai @ Fri Apr 24 said:


> Again, thanks for the comments, guys. For someone with no experience of master / slave computer setups, it's all very helpful. For the meantime, I'm going to try running the Hackintosh as a standalone, master machine. If and when I hit any bottleneck / RAM issues, I'll try running VEP with my iMac (which is actually a 2008 model, not even 2010). I'd be amazed if running an 08 iMac as a master machine would benefit me in this situation!



Just bare in mind that you can still benefit from using VEP, even with a one computer setup. It allows you to keep a template loaded in VEP in the backround so when you load up a new session in your DAW, it doesn't have to reload samples, etc. VEP is also often better at distributing the load better on your computer than many DAWs. It's a great program - well worth testing out. it also offer some great things with scaleable latency so you can reduce latency in your DAW while increasing in VEP (and letting VEP compensate) if you were doing some live tracking but needed to change programming on the fly, etc.


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## WorshipMaestro (Apr 25, 2015)

As one who has built them from scratch and uses Hacks, (I built one with the exact hardware of this eBay seller less the graphics card) I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the whole question of legality of selling pre-built Hacks. Psystar ring any bells? Apple has shown a history of bringing suit against and shutting down these clone makers, which means you are going to be stuck with an orphan with no support, no OS upgrading path, etc. Even if they manage to fly under the Apple radar, Hacks tend to be problematic when trying to upgrade the OS. You'll find yourself spending time trying to figure out why the computer won't boot after that OS update instead of making music. Just speaking from experience here...

Is it not suspicious that if you go to their website there is no mention of them selling Hacks? I'd be very leery of a transaction like this.

The upside is that when you get to that point you can always install Windows 7, 8, 10, etc. on this hardware and away you go.

Don't get me wrong, I've had great results with my Hacks. They are solid, high performance machines that are upgradeable. My main machine has even interfaced flawlessly with my Apollo Thunderbolt interface (both in Mac OSX and Windows 8.1) And I've spent volumes of time getting them to that place.


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## Øivind (Apr 25, 2015)

jaeroe @ Wed Apr 22 said:


> oivind_rosvold @ Wed Apr 22 said:
> 
> 
> > No - you want the master to be the most powerful, especially in a case where the other computer is a 5 year old iMac with SATA II. The master has to process all the incoming audio from the host (which is work) plus all you have going on in Logic. You'll be able to run plenty of VIs on the Hack as host - more than the iMac, whether the Hack/PC is master or slave.
> ...



The slave is the salve because it handles all the heavy lifting, if it didn't, there would be no reason to have a slave.

My slave is probably about 2x (4x was a total lie ^^) more powerful than my host, so when it is running 90% maxed out, my host/master should
by your definition probably not be able to run at all. What about those who have 5 slaves or 10?
There is cpu usage when using VEP over LAN for the host, sure, but not nearly as much as the slave handles.. unless i am very uninformed and
have a uncommon setup. Maybe 

Edit: i am not saying he shouldn't, just that it might be better overall for power, logistics and no need for the hack. 
Edit2: cleaned up my answer, more readable. ^^
Edit3: just call me edit man, came to think of it, Logic might handle VEP differently than Cubase/Sonar? not just 1 event for each instance but 1 for 
each channel? that might explain more cpu usage. I do not know much about how Logic works, so you might be right.

o-[][]-o


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## jaeroe (Apr 25, 2015)

oivind_rosvold @ Sat Apr 25 said:


> The slave is the salve because it handles all the heavy lifting, if it didn't, there would be no reason to have a slave.
> 
> My slave is probably about 2x (4x was a total lie ^^) more powerful than my host, so when it is running 90% maxed out, my host/master should
> by your definition probably not be able to run at all. What about those who have 5 slaves or 10?
> ...



a slave is a slave to share your workload. but, that doesn't mean it doesn't put any demands on the computer it is connected to at all. it doesn't duplicate it's workload again in the DAW, but the more connections you make to your DAW the more demanding it is, and there are definitely situations where things like scripting can place a heavier usage on the slave can show an increase in processing activity in your DAW.

Again I'll just say that you want your most powerful computer handling the most demanding tasks. For me, the processing going on in the DAW (not just VEP and all of it's connections, but reverbs, etc), plus whatever VEP set up (actual frames) i have hosted on the same master computer is more demanding than what goes to my slaves, thus using the more powerful computer as the host.

i'm not saying your DAW has a workload equal to whatever slave is connected to it, simply by virtue of being connected to it - i'm saying when you make multiple connections from VEP to your master can be demanding on your master, and when you add in the other processing of the DAW you don't want an under powered master. and yes - there are definitely situations where the bloated workload of a slave (scripting etc) ramps up the demand from VEP on the master as well. i agree that it is not about voice count - it's about the actual workload. i prefer to have the master more powerful, host VEP on the master as well as my slaves and everything works fine. 

if you want to say it isn't imperative that the master be the most powerful - sure. but, the master has to be plenty powerful. i don't think a 2008 iMac is going to be your friend as the master. i would use the Hack as the master and try using the iMac for whatever you can (or not).


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## jaeroe (Apr 25, 2015)

WorshipMaestro @ Sat Apr 25 said:


> As one who has built them from scratch and uses Hacks, (I built one with the exact hardware of this eBay seller less the graphics card) I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the whole question of legality of selling pre-built Hacks. Psystar ring any bells? Apple has shown a history of bringing suit against and shutting down these clone makers, which means you are going to be stuck with an orphan with no support, no OS upgrading path, etc. Even if they manage to fly under the Apple radar, Hacks tend to be problematic when trying to upgrade the OS. You'll find yourself spending time trying to figure out why the computer won't boot after that OS update instead of making music. Just speaking from experience here...
> 
> Is it not suspicious that if you go to their website there is no mention of them selling Hacks? I'd be very leery of a transaction like this.
> 
> ...



re the legality of it - yes, people aren't supposed to be selling the OS pre-installed. the cases to date of resulted in it being ok to do hacks if the user installs the OS. people can't legally sell the OS pre-installed.

as i usually stick with an OS for several years, i haven't had a problem with this. if you stick to pretty common parts, don't do anything crazy, and do your research, i've had good luck finding people that did successful upgrades i wanted to do before i tried it. you can also try it pretty easily by just getting a new drive to build a new boot volume from scratch.

and then you can always upgrade parts as needed to get more in line with successful builds out there when upgrading. at the end of the day, you are spending a lot less money than buying a new mac every 3-5 years and also your computer can be more catered towards your actual needs.


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## Lawson. (Apr 25, 2015)

jaeroe @ Wed Apr 22 said:


> Lawson. @ Wed Apr 22 said:
> 
> 
> > jaeroe @ Mon Apr 20 said:
> ...



I'm not sure how you're working, but I know that my main VEP server is hosted on my slave. I don't have any VEP servers hosted in my DAW; that isn't even how the software works. VEP servers and your DAW are completely independent of each other. My slave PC is 2x as powerful as my master and I've loaded it up completely, but my master doesn't even break into a sweat.

The DAW has to use CPU to process the audio coming in, but way less. It doesn't have to worry about streaming off of your drives, storing samples in RAM, or using CPU power to grab all the samples and play them back in real time. For heavy projects, yes, you need a powerful computer, but it doesn't need to be as powerful as your slave.


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## jaeroe (Apr 25, 2015)

Lawson. @ Sat Apr 25 said:


> I'm not sure how you're working, but I know that my main VEP server is hosted on my slave. I don't have any VEP servers hosted in my DAW; that isn't even how the software works. VEP servers and your DAW are completely independent of each other. My slave PC is 2x as powerful as my master and I've loaded it up completely, but my master doesn't even break into a sweat.
> 
> The DAW has to use CPU to process the audio coming in, but way less. It doesn't have to worry about streaming off of your drives, storing samples in RAM, or using CPU power to grab all the samples and play them back in real time. For heavy projects, yes, you need a powerful computer, but it doesn't need to be as powerful as your slave.



If that's where you find your resources needing to go, great. for me, my DAW is hit harder than anything else. VEP doesn't break much of a sweat for me, but the DAW sure does sometimes. so, i have my most powerful computer with the DAW and 1 of 3 VEP servers. the other two computers are fine as slaves.

I'm not saying have an insanely powerful computer as just your DAW. what works for me is having VEP on all 3 machines, and putting the DAW on the most powerful machine and distributing my VEP template accordingly.

(and incidentally, this is also the case on my 2nd rig which is 3 macs, so not a hack thing).

Try it out and see how it works for you - the Hack can be run as a Mac or a PC. (the only bummer about VEP is that you can't share your Vframe files between Mac and PC - VEP on PC uses VST format and on Mac it is AU).

i would recommend looking to the future - if i had a 7 year old iMac and a nice new computer far more powerful, i'd put everything on the new computer and see how i did.


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## bassmancai (Apr 26, 2015)

I'm certainly not in a position of knowledge to argue whether in an IDEAL situation, VEP works better on the master or slave. But bearing in mind how old my iMac is (though it runs really well - there's nowt on it but Logic and Komplete 10), I think it makes sense for me to use the Hack as a standalone until I run into any bottleneck issues, and then try using VEP. Ideally, I'd get a second Hack down the line to run as a more powerful slave than my iMac but one overdraft at a time eh


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## Nick Batzdorf (Apr 26, 2015)

It depends on what you're doing. If you're setting up a slave to run EW Hollywood, it makes sense to make it a tweaked Windows machine. But I wouldn't want to work on Windows, so I'd make it the slave. 

Another reason to make a Hackintosh the slave is that you can leave it at whatever OS you're runnimg until VE Pro requires an OS update - which isn't very often. 

There is no universal answer.

[Fixed typos. iPads are great, but they're not good for typing on. I make far few mistakes typing on my iPhone!]


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## José Herring (Apr 26, 2015)

I'm so sorry, I've not read any of the responses as I'm very busy but did see the topic and wanted to give my opinion.

Imo, there's no reason to build a hackintosh other than for the novelty of it. If you finesse the parts then you may be able to get the middle performance zone that Apple seems to have forgotten. But in truth it wouldn't be worth it. There are stable hackintosh systems but it takes a lot to get there and basing your entire studio on a hack is just foolish imo. There will come a time that a program or OS or a piece of gear you need won't be compatible or work weirdly with your hack at that point you'll have to rehack or abandon the system if you want to move forward.


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## bassmancai (Apr 26, 2015)

> Imo, there's no reason to build a hackintosh other than for the novelty of it. If you finesse the parts then you may be able to get the middle performance zone that Apple seems to have forgotten. But in truth it wouldn't be worth it. There are stable hackintosh systems but it takes a lot to get there and basing your entire studio on a hack is just foolish imo. There will come a time that a program or OS or a piece of gear you need won't be compatible or work weirdly with your hack at that point you'll have to rehack or abandon the system if you want to move forward.



Well definitely too late for THAT 

I'm definitely not getting one for the novelty, and I'm also not building it - it's pre-built to a good spec, and the way I see it is that as people manage to create stable systems with further hardware upgrades, I'll follow suit, knowing I have a powerful machine akin to a Mac Pro that I (at the moment at least) have no method of being able to afford. 

As one person says, if it gets to a stage where plugins and samples I want to use just don't work, I'll run it as a PC instead on a different DAW, or just sell it on.


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## jaeroe (Apr 26, 2015)

bassmancai @ Sun Apr 26 said:


> Well definitely too late for THAT
> 
> I'm definitely not getting one for the novelty, and I'm also not building it - it's pre-built to a good spec, and the way I see it is that as people manage to create stable systems with further hardware upgrades, I'll follow suit, knowing I have a powerful machine akin to a Mac Pro that I (at the moment at least) have no method of being able to afford.
> 
> As one person says, if it gets to a stage where plugins and samples I want to use just don't work, I'll run it as a PC instead on a different DAW, or just sell it on.



I wouldn't worry about it too much (as you say, you're already there!).

One thing I would do is look up that build on Tonymacx86 and see what versions of their software (boot loader, etc) were used with what settings , download all the info on those successful builds. That way, if anything does ever happen to the person that sold you the Hack, you can do any kind of service you need. Just do a search for the model of your motherboard, processor, OS and video card.

I did once have a build that I found disappear from their website - the first build I did (just the detailed info on how it was done). I wanted to go back and checkout some info on the build and could never find that specific build again. I ended up fine in the end, but it would have been nice to have had all of that info and software downloaded. All builds I've done after that I have kept all info and software and detailed notes on what i did, order, etc.


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## bassmancai (Apr 27, 2015)

> One thing I would do is look up that build on Tonymacx86 and see what versions of their software (boot loader, etc) were used with what settings , download all the info on those successful builds. That way, if anything does ever happen to the person that sold you the Hack, you can do any kind of service you need. Just do a search for the model of your motherboard, processor, OS and video card.



Yeah good idea, this is a good shout. I'm not averse to having to fix issues if I need to though I'll have to do a LOT of learning...but that's fine. Thanks again for your help in this thread mate, much appreciated!


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## jaeroe (Apr 27, 2015)

It's actually not as bad as one would think.... if you stay on the Yellow Brick Road.... You can find articles from Tonymac here:

http://www.tonymacx86.com/basics/104542 ... start.html

That gives you a nice overview of the general concepts. If you then mouse over the 'Guides' tab you can see links to all versions of the OS going back to 10.6. That will show you the process in more detail and what trickier spots are for each OS, etc.

You will feel a lot better about things if you at least understand the basic concepts.

Really, you just need to understand the basic concept of the hardware interfacing with the software - getting the OS to look at the hardware as if it were a Mac.

The two pieces of software to look at are MultiBeast and Chimera.


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## bassmancai (May 3, 2015)

Hey guys, wanted to post a quick update. Hackintosh was delivered on Friday, but only really managed to start getting everything installed last night. So far, this thing is amazing. I'm so happy that I've had it pre-built - apart from buying an extra 250gb SSD for more sample storage space. 

I've installed Komplete 10 Ultimate and all my Cinesamples libraries, my Apogee Duet 2, Komplete Kontrol keyboard and Logic Pro X of course, and it's running like a dream. No dropouts, no problems, it's running super smooth and quite honestly exactly how I'd expect a full blown Mac Pro to run. Quite exceptional. I'm fully prepared for niggles along the way but considering I've had zero so far, very happy!


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## Øivind (May 4, 2015)

Sweet


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## Prockamanisc (Jul 15, 2015)

I'm considering building a slave, but I'm really stuck on two issues- first is the splitting of my licenses amongst dongles. How would I do that? Let's say I want to use Altiverb on just a single track, but also on the full mix. Since I use Cubase, I can't put a plugin on a MIDI track, so I'd have to put it on the track in the VEP window (which is on the slave). How, then, would I create some reverb busses (on the master)? Also, if I'm using VSL, putting all of my licenses on the Slave Dongle would force me to use just the slave for VSL, right? Or else I could plug it into my master, which might already be at capacity for USB ports.

My second issue is really buried within the first one- that MIDI Tracks in Cubase are less modifiable than Instrument Tracks. I can't insert plugins like I'd want to. The only workaround is bussing it to another track and effecting that. It seems unnecessarily complicated, right?


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## Killiard (Jul 15, 2015)

Ah but it can be done. The Darris has a good video on YouTube for setting up. You can activate the outputs in the VST rack in Cubase for each VEP instance and then it creates an audio track in the mixer window. You then just hide all the midi faders in the mixer and you have an audio channel for each instrument.

Here's the video Chris did. Doesn't involve VEP but the theory is the same.


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## Killiard (Jul 15, 2015)

This is in effect bussing it I guess. But it's dead simple and I'm pretty sure it's the way everyone works. 

Sorry if I've misunderstood what you're asking about!


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## Prockamanisc (Jul 15, 2015)

It works!! Wow, thank you so much! This is a real game changer! I'm completely sold on the slave now.


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## Killiard (Jul 15, 2015)

No problem


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## Prockamanisc (Jul 15, 2015)

Here's a follow up question: if I have all of my samples on the slave, will the master be able to "see" those drives and read from them? Would I be able to access them from my master just like any external hard drive? One step further, what if I used one of the drives on the slave as my destination drive, the one where I save all of my projects and record audio straight onto? Is that possible?


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## Killiard (Jul 15, 2015)

Both my master and slave are macs so i can't say for a pc but all the drives on my slave can appear on my master like an external drive (basically they are as viewed from my master), since they are networked together by the Ethernet connection. 

Not sure if it's a good idea to have your project drive on the slave though. I'd guess most folk here would recommend you keep that on the master.


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## Prockamanisc (Jul 16, 2015)

The project drive is probably going to be the second drive in my Mac Mini, I was just using that as an example, really. Definitely not going to go on the slave!

Ok, so it can see and access the drives, and I'm guessing that if I had a storage drive on my Slave, could I drag files off of it onto my Master. Awesome.

Let's say I have my VSL samples on my Slave but I want to create just an instrument track on my Master. Can my Master stream directly from those drives? From what I've learned, ethernet isn't "that kind" of connection- am I wrong? If so, how does it compare to USB 3.0, etc?


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