# Overtime



## ProfoundSilence (Jul 27, 2021)

Anyone else out there working silly overtime? 

I'm on my second 176 hour paycheck in a row right now... 

(11 16 hour shifts and 3 days off) 

I'd like to grumble with my fellow suffer-ers. 

Unfortunately staffing is so abyssmally low that I don't think my situation will change for a while so I'll probably work myself to the bone with all you can take overtime


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## Markrs (Jul 27, 2021)

ProfoundSilence said:


> 11 16 hour shifts and 3 days off


That is insane hours! Make sure you look after yourself, and watch out for any signs that working that many hours is effecting your mental health.


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## ProfoundSilence (Jul 27, 2021)

Markrs said:


> That is insane hours! Make sure you look after yourself, and watch out for any signs that working that many hours is effecting your mental health.


That'll be hard given my job already taxes that enough LOL.


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## ProfoundSilence (Aug 1, 2021)

That's from July 1st through July 31st


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## Markrs (Aug 1, 2021)

That's crazy stuff!


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## ProfoundSilence (Aug 1, 2021)

Markrs said:


> That's crazy stuff!


About to be debt free though

Might save up for some ridiculous thread ripper action XD


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## Martin S (Aug 1, 2021)

Yes, be sure to look after yourself. I’ve been working between 50-60 hours a week, every week for the past 2 years (without overtime pay - not part of my contract) and sure enough; 2 months ago I suffered from coronary thrombosis (heart attack) out of the blue, and was rushed to specialist cardiologists by helicopter, who saved my life twice on the operating table. I’m 48, generally living a healthy life (except the long hours) and not overweight..

I’m certain these long periods of long working weeks was the culprit here, so yeah… You gotta look after yourself


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## ProfoundSilence (Aug 1, 2021)

Martin S said:


> Yes, be sure to look after yourself. I’ve been working between 50-60 hours a week, every week for the past 2 years (without overtime pay - not part of my contract) and sure enough; 2 months ago I suffered from coronary thrombosis (heart attack) out of the blue, and was rushed to specialist cardiologists by helicopter, who saved my life twice on the operating table. I’m 48, generally living a healthy life (except the long hours) and not overweight..
> 
> I’m certain these long periods of long working weeks was the culprit here, so yeah… You gotta look after yourself


Unfortunately I spent the last decade just doing two jobs or one job 60 to 70 hours a week.


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## Markrs (Aug 1, 2021)

Martin S said:


> Yes, be sure to look after yourself. I’ve been working between 50-60 hours a week, every week for the past 2 years (without overtime pay - not part of my contract) and sure enough; 2 months ago I suffered from coronary thrombosis (heart attack) out of the blue, and was rushed to specialist cardiologists by helicopter, who saved my life twice on the operating table. I’m 48, generally living a healthy life (except the long hours) and not overweight..
> 
> I’m certain these long periods of long working weeks was the culprit here, so yeah… You gotta look after yourself


I'm glad you have recovered. It sounds very scary what happened to you and a lesson about the risk of overwork


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## Markrs (Aug 1, 2021)

ProfoundSilence said:


> Unfortunately I spent the last decade just doing two jobs or one job 60 to 70 hours a week.


That's not good. Try and reduce your hours if you can. It's great you get paid for overtime but don't risk your health.


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## Martin S (Aug 1, 2021)

Markrs said:


> I'm glad you have recovered. It sounds very scary what happened to you and a lesson about the risk of overwork


Thanks Mark, much appreciated

In fact it all happened so fast I didn’t have time to get really scared. Which is good, I think - no traumatic experience lodged in memory, etc. But it gives time to some afterthought indeed..Luckily, 
my heart was back to 100% efficiency already the next day after surgery and no complications either, so I’m good. My employer is great and I’ve been on sick leave for 2 months now w/full pay, and will start working again soon, but only 1 day a week for the next 2 months with full pay, too. On top of that my insurance also paid me a hefty tax-free amount ’for critical illness’, which made me go a bit shop-a-holic on the recent StaffPad sale, haha..

But yes, one helluva wake-up call and some lifestyle changes (for the better), too


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## thebeesknees22 (Aug 1, 2021)

ah yes, the wonderful world of working in entertainment. My full time job is in vfx so I'm all too familiar with heavy OT as well. I'm on month .... four.. of 60-80hr weeks. Almost done with this one though, but the next will ramp up soon enough. I think I average 8-10 months of the year working OT. Anywhere from 50-85hrs a week. On a rare occasion I've hit 99+.

This year and possibly next will be especially rough since there aren't enough experienced artists for the amount of work going on. 

I'm on year 15 of doing this. ..Yay! .....yay!!!


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## Markrs (Aug 1, 2021)

thebeesknees22 said:


> ah yes, the wonderful world of working in entertainment. My full time job is in vfx so I'm all too familiar with heavy OT as well. I'm on month .... four.. of 60-80hr weeks. Almost done with this one though, but the next will ramp up soon enough. I think I average 8-10 months of the year working OT. Anywhere from 50-85hrs a week. On a rare occasion I've hit 99+.
> 
> This year and possibly next will be especially rough since there aren't enough experienced artists for the amount of work going on.
> 
> I'm on year 15 of doing this. ..Yay! .....yay!!!


I genuinely don't know it is possible to do that, and not break, let along still have life outside of work


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## thebeesknees22 (Aug 1, 2021)

In my 20's it was easier. We were just young and stupid and the industry as a whole is/was younger back then. So it was work hard/play hard. Then on the weekends go party till close, and go right back to work 9am the next day................ yeah..saturdays were usually rough ha. 

It's tough to do it now that I'm almost 40 though. I go on periods where I'm downing 4-6 coffees a day to power through which...is not good. 

Back in the day I would take 4-6 weeks off between hard shows. But it's been a long time since I've been able to do that since the industry has been so busy over the last few years. (plus the skyrocketing cost of living and needing to save up for a huge down payment means long periods off aren't really as doable) 

After a while you just get used to it, and you basically become ok with not having a family or the idea of settling down. I've come to terms with it all, and I'm just trying to save as much as possible for an early semi-retirement if I can. ie) buy some house in the middle of nowhere mortgage free, and either work remote or go adventure around for jobs for 6 months out of the year if Covid ever becomes manageable. (I could have done that by now if I hadn't blown so much money in my younger days going out on the weekends lol)

But yeah... it does break some people. We used to have a running joke about people burning out and leaving the industry after 5 years. (it was kinda true for many)


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## Martin S (Aug 1, 2021)

thebeesknees22 said:


> ah yes, the wonderful world of working in entertainment. My full time job is in vfx so I'm all too familiar with heavy OT as well. I'm on month .... four.. of 60-80hr weeks. Almost done with this one though, but the next will ramp up soon enough. I think I average 8-10 months of the year working OT. Anywhere from 50-85hrs a week. On a rare occasion I've hit 99+.
> 
> This year and possibly next will be especially rough since there aren't enough experienced artists for the amount of work going on.
> 
> I'm on year 15 of doing this. ..Yay! .....yay!!!


Holy crap, that’s just..crazy!! 

As Mark says, you can’t have much - if any - life beyond work? As in perpetual work/sleep/work/sleep. Wow, you gotta tell your employer, that if you don’t get some reduced hours you’re going to burn out (or worse). You’re gambling with your health for work. Ask yourself if it’s really worth it…phew


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## Markrs (Aug 1, 2021)

thebeesknees22 said:


> In my 20's it was easier. We were just young and stupid and the industry as a whole is/was younger back then. So it was work hard/play hard. Then on the weekends go party till close, and go right back to work 9am the next day................ yeah..saturdays were usually rough ha.
> 
> It's tough to do it now that I'm almost 40 though. I go on periods where I'm downing 4-6 coffees a day to power through which...is not good.
> 
> ...


I hope you get some time off soon!


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## Martin S (Aug 1, 2021)

thebeesknees22 said:


> In my 20's it was easier. We were just young and stupid and the industry as a whole is/was younger back then. So it was work hard/play hard. Then on the weekends go party till close, and go right back to work 9am the next day................ yeah..saturdays were usually rough ha.
> 
> It's tough to do it now that I'm almost 40 though. I go on periods where I'm downing 4-6 coffees a day to power through which...is not good.
> 
> ...


yeah, retiring early would be a great option. Get yourself a ‘Tiny House on wheels’ and be your own boss


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## MartinH. (Aug 1, 2021)

ProfoundSilence said:


> Unfortunately I spent the last decade just doing two jobs or one job 60 to 70 hours a week.


I don't know your situation but I am seriously worried about your health!


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## Martin S (Aug 1, 2021)

I always used to say that my spare time was priceless. Now, I actually really mean it.


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## thebeesknees22 (Aug 1, 2021)

Martin S said:


> Holy crap, that’s just..crazy!!
> 
> As Mark says, you can’t have much - if any - life beyond work? As in perpetual work/sleep/work/sleep. Wow, you gotta tell your employer, that if you don’t get some reduced hours you’re going to burn out (or worse). You’re gambling with your health for work. Ask yourself if it’s really worth it…phew


yeah the VFX life is definitely not a normal life. Your coworkers become your family, you end up making bad decisions like dating your coworkers. lool (don't do that! ... I keep telling myself that, but well... when you're not around anyone else...it happens ha)

It's not so easy to just tell our employers "I'm not doing OT". They're at the mercy of the clients. The clients change edits up to the last minute, and you still have to meet that deadline. Then the deadline comes and they decide to extend...and extend... rinse repeat. Plus if you tell your employer you're not doing OT then they'll let you go after and soon you'll find yourself in a spot where no one will hire you. VFX is a small industry, and word travels fast. 

For the OT to reduce, we would have to have some drastic changes, and the VFX studios don't seem to have the power to do that with the clients.

That being said, the pay is quite good when you hit senior artist levels. Although though with the skyrocketing housing markets it's not quite enough to actually buy a house in the cities we have to live in to work, but I digress. 

Healthwise i've always been in tiptop shape unti covid hit. It's been a year and 1/2 since I've been able to hit the gym and it's starting to show....... but soon...soon I'll be back at it.

TL:DR: we're at the mercy of clients, and deadlines. It's not gonna change anytime soon.


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## Martin S (Aug 1, 2021)

thebeesknees22 said:


> yeah the VFX life is definitely not a normal life. Your coworkers become your family, you end up making bad decisions like dating your coworkers. lool (don't do that! ... I keep telling myself that, but well... when you're not around anyone else...it happens ha)
> 
> It's not so easy to just tell our employers "I'm not doing OT". They're at the mercy of the clients. The clients change edits up to the last minute, and you still have to meet that deadline. Then the deadline comes and they decide to extend...and extend... rinse repeat. Plus if you tell your employer you're not doing OT then they'll let you go after and soon you'll find yourself in a spot where no one will hire you. VFX is a small industry, and word travels fast.
> 
> ...


Yeah, I hear ya..It’s a vicious cycle, especially knowing there isn’t much you or your employer can do about it. And getting the boot isn’t really an attractive option, either..

You’re right about the housing prices. It’s insane and it seems it’s going on everywhere. Just the last year a house here in Denmark has gone up considerably, especially in the larger cities. I’ve come to terms with never owning my own house. It’s just way too expensive. And Denmark is already one of the most expensive countries to live in. Once in a while I dream of having a Tiny House on wheels built (much, much cheaper - and some are actually very, very nice), but Danish legislation isn’t accommodating in any way in this regard, so unfortunately it stays a dream. At least for now..

Oh yeah, dating coworkers is a minefield..I’d rather stick a needle in my eye  Although, there was a recent study - Canadian, I think - claiming that most couples today, met each other at work/study/etc..so never say never


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## thebeesknees22 (Aug 1, 2021)

Martin S said:


> Yeah, I hear ya..It’s a vicious cycle, especially knowing there isn’t much you or your employer can do about it. And getting the boot isn’t really an attractive option, either..
> 
> You’re right about the housing prices. It’s insane and it seems it’s going on everywhere. Just the last year a house here in Denmark has gone up considerably, especially in the larger cities. I’ve come to terms with never owning my own house. It’s just way too expensive. And Denmark is already one of the most expensive countries to live in. Once in a while I dream of having a Tiny House on wheels built (much, much cheaper - and some are actually very, very nice), but Danish legislation isn’t accommodating in any way in this regard, so unfortunately it stays a dream. At least for now..
> 
> Oh yeah, dating coworkers is a minefield..I’d rather stick a needle in my eye  Although, there was a recent study - Canadian, I think - claiming that most couples today, met each other at work/study/etc..so never say never


Never!! haha


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## patrick76 (Aug 1, 2021)

ProfoundSilence said:


> Anyone else out there working silly overtime?
> 
> I'm on my second 176 hour paycheck in a row right now...
> 
> ...


F- that. They tried to force us to do a ton of hours this quarter, but I just wouldn’t do it. I work too much as it is. They could decide to get rid of me, which they might do at some point, but for the near future they need my certifications.

Be careful and take care of yourself.


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## ProfoundSilence (Aug 1, 2021)

Ahh Dating coworkers 

Oddly my best friend at work as been absolutely miserable because she was talking to a guy we work with, which I *think* got her to dislike me or something?

She was a pain to deal with and then she stopped talking to me, just before talking to me and I found out she's not talking to him. 

Moral of the story: I'm not dumb enough to date co workers, but I still got punished with a few weeks of really akward shifts. 

Also worth noting, if you work with someone everyday and they are compatible it's basically unavoidable. Its easy to say when I'm with someone I'm happy with - but I'm positive my best friend would be the first mistake I would try to make if I was single tomorrow, and that's even given the fact that she has both my deal breakers


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## Trash Panda (Aug 1, 2021)

When I first started at my last job, we began in the end of Q3, so the only influence on our Q1 bonus payout (~$10k after taxes) was this insane audit of every property in our portfolios.

It required putting in 12 hour days for about 28 straight days in December to pull it off, but I was able to pay off all my debt with that bonus, so it was worth it.

Last year, after the wifey went back to teaching in the fall, I was putting in 12+ hours a day and weekend time because I was also trying to watch our 6 month old son while working from home full time, with increased responsibilities from a promotion and a bigger portfolio from downsizing due to COVID earlier in the year. I made it about six weeks or so before little man got shipped off to daycare and my stress levels went back to a tolerable amount. Never again.


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## rgames (Aug 1, 2021)

Working hours are an indicator but the real question is how many of those hours do you spend in a stressed state? Those are the hours that weigh on you and lead to health problems. If you only work 40 hours a week but they're all stressed hours then that's bad. If you're working 60 hours a week with 20 stressed hours then that's probably OK.

I've managed to keep my stressed hours pretty low by staying ahead of deliverables: I don't procrastinate (at least not on work-related deliverables, my honey-dos are another story...). Some people don't have that luxury, of course, but many who do still suffer from terrible time management. That leads to a lot of unnecessary stress and much longer hours than necessary.

A common problem that I've seen across industries is that people get lost in one element of the deliverable, trying to perfect it, and forget about the others until the first one or few are perfect. It's almost always better to flesh out *something* like a completed deliverable early in the alloted time, no matter how rough, and improve from there.

For example, let's say you have to deliver 10 cues in two weeks. Rather than working through each until you're happy with each one, it's better to write *something* for all 10 in the first week, even if you're not happy with many of them, then go back and tweak in the second week. That approach puts you in a more relaxed mindset because you don't have the blank-page problem in the second week. And you don't have a looming deadline in the first week. So the psychology of the situation reduces your stress level (for most people, I'll agree it's not one-size-fits-all).

rgames


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## ProfoundSilence (Aug 2, 2021)

Dunno what stress is, I'm a 911 operator/dispatcher


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## Markrs (Aug 2, 2021)

ProfoundSilence said:


> Dunno what stress is, I'm a 911 operator/dispatcher


I imagine most of us are grateful there are people like yourself to take the call when we phone the emergency services


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## Martin S (Aug 2, 2021)

Markrs said:


> I imagine most of us are grateful there are people like yourself to take the call when we phone the emergency services


I’m certainly one of them. Wouldn’t have been around if it wasn’t for the 112-operater dispatching a helicopter for me within 1 minute of calling. So a heartfelt Thank You to those of you who work in these jobs


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## MartinH. (Aug 2, 2021)

I just read a good quote under a youtube video: "If you don't take a break, the break takes itself." 
I've certainly seen many examples of that, from heart attacks to burnout and depression.


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## ProfoundSilence (Aug 2, 2021)

MartinH. said:


> I just read a good quote under a youtube video: "If you don't take a break, the break takes itself."
> I've certainly seen many examples of that, from heart attacks to burnout and depression.


Well I had to severely cut my caffeine back to about 200 mg daily, and about 4 liters of water a day. this has made me muuuuch less sketched out about my body. 

Everyone is moving to Florida but they aren't sending their 911 operators.. plus we were behind because of covid preventing us from training anyone for almost a year. 

Plus those of us who didn't get covid were working wild hours covering everyone who was out for weeks after positive results, so it caused a bunch of burnout and people quiting.


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## Gene Pool (Aug 2, 2021)

ProfoundSilence said:


> Dunno what stress is, I'm a 911 operator/dispatcher


I would really appreciate it if your colleagues would stop making sport of me and laughing in the background every time I get my penis accidentally stuck in the pool pump suction outlet. And when the firemen arrive they're no better.


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## ProfoundSilence (Aug 2, 2021)

Gene Pool said:


> I would really appreciate it if your colleagues would stop making sport of me and laughing in the background every time I get my penis accidentally stuck in the pool pump suction outlet. And when the firemen arrive they're no better.


I've had some odd calls. Someone did shoot themselves in the dangle a few nights ago.


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## Geoff Grace (Aug 2, 2021)

ProfoundSilence said:


> Anyone else out there working silly overtime?
> 
> I'm on my second 176 hour paycheck in a row right now...
> 
> ...


So sorry to hear that, *ProfoundSilence*. Thank you for all you do to help people in need.

The past version of me was a fellow sufferer, albeit in a different career. Back in my thirties, when I worked in the record industry, I went long hours with little sleep.

On my steady gig, I typically showed up at noon and worked until the sun came up the next day. Then, I'd go home and try to nap for 3-4 hours, while the birds outside chirped, and start the process over again. I worked six days a week. On Sundays, I'd sleep for about 12 hours and spend time with my wife.

That went on for years, with a month or two of time off every now and then. During those periods, I'd take other work. On a deadline for one of those gigs, I worked 36 hours straight without a break, eating meals while I worked.

The cliché is that the record industry is dominated by young people because of their youthful, good looks; but the less well-known reason is that they're the ones who can tolerate the lifestyle.

I'm glad I survived to tell the tale, but I'd never do it again. I'm too old, and I wouldn't even recommend it for those who are young. It does take a toll, some of which is masked by the adrenaline that comes from keeping those hours. I hope you're able to minimize the wear and tear you're enduring.

Take care,

Geoff


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## ProfoundSilence (Aug 13, 2021)

well the overtime train hit the e-breaks. 

came down with symptoms after i was on an exposure list - got tested and sure enough, got rona.

Don't worry about me, im like 1.5/10 sick - but I've been working 80+ hours a week, sleeping 4 hours a night, and aggressively fasting (one 1100-1300 cal meal at the end of the day) and hitting the gym for hours on my day off. 

I'd say it's odd because I never get sick, but given that I've been running my body into the ground emotionally and physically combined with sitting next to a person who had covid was probably poor timing. 

Ohh well, there will still be overtime when I get back.


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## Markrs (Aug 13, 2021)

ProfoundSilence said:


> Don't worry about me, im like 1.5/10 sick - but I've been working 80+ hours a week, sleeping 4 hours a night, and aggressively fasting (one 1100-1300 cal meal at the end of the day) and hitting the gym for hours on my day off.


That sounds like a lot of strain to put on your body and your mind all at once. Hopefully you continue to have only minor symptoms of Covid and can rest up.


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## MartinH. (Aug 13, 2021)

ProfoundSilence said:


> well the overtime train hit the e-breaks.
> 
> came down with symptoms after i was on an exposure list - got tested and sure enough, got rona.
> 
> ...


Get well soon!


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## JohnG (Aug 13, 2021)

Every job I've ever had that was good has been horribly over the line on overtime. The expression "good" in this context means either -- very highly paid or something I really want to do.

Every working composer I know works almost unbearable hours. Me too, when I'm on a job. I don't know any other way to get it all done in a satisfying way.


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