# Question about replacing Macbook Pro with iMac



## erikradbo (Jul 27, 2017)

Hi,

I've been running my setup on a MacBook Pro late 2013 with the following specs:

2,3 GHz Quad-Core Intel Core i7
16 GB 1600 MHz DDR3L SDRAM
512 GB PCIe-based flash drive (SSD)
External HD, not SSD, for some of the samples
I'm running Logic using mostly HO, Albions, CSS and VI's from Komplete, plugins mostly used are Spaces, Ozone, Neutron and Waves.

This setup has served me very well, but now it's time to upgrade, mainly to push the performance (having both CPU and memory shortages issues) but also to get a better screen (in order to improve my posture, in order to get less neck pain, in order to sleep better, in order to have better relationships, in order to make better music, and so on and so on).

My plan is to get a new iMac from the new line released this summer. I won't be in the business for iMac Pro given it's hefty price even though the specs look tempting.

This is the setup I'm considering:

iMac 27 inch Retina 5K
4,2 GhZ quad-core Intel i7
8 Gb built in RAM
Additionally 32 Gb RAM: Kingston HyperX Impact SO-DIMM DDR4 PC19200/2400MHz CL14 2x16GB (HX424S14IBK2/32)
2 TB Fusion Drive
External SSD HD 1-2 TB
Questions:

Would using Fusion Drive rather than SSD slow down the system much compared to my current laptop configuration? I.e. is it worth going for the 512 GB SSD even though I won't load many samples from there?
The SSD question is to balance vs the cost of adding more RAM to reach 48 or 64. Which upgrade would make the most sense?
Any recommendations for a good 1-2 TB (probably need 2) external SSD drive for samples?
It seems like most people choose the Apple Protection Plan. In my experience those extra insurances are rarely worth it. What's so good with APP?
And finally: would you choose another setup completely for the money? I used Cubase for 17 years, but have gotten used to Logic the last 7 years, so I'll stick with a mac setup, but maybe there are better routes to go.
Best,
Erik


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## Jeremy Spencer (Jul 27, 2017)

Just an idea....but what about investing in VEPro and a PC slave? I have the same MacBook, and utilize a slave, running fairly large templates (including Hollywood Strings, Brass, etc). You could have a nice one built for about 1/3 of the iMac cost, including SSD's and 64GB Ram. You can also connect additional displays to that MacBook, I have two coming out of mine. You MacBook still has plenty of life left in it! If I upgrade in the next couple of years, it will hopefully be to the new Mac Pro if it ever materializes.

Fusion drive? Not a fan, but that's just me. Only a very small portion of it is SSD.


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## synthpunk (Jul 27, 2017)

VEP Slave is a good idea but the retina screens on the Imacs are just beautiful. I could see how you fallen in love with that feature.

For SSD's I would look at Crucial or Samsung. I have also had good luck with two of these.
https://www.smithbuy.com/micron-1tb-2-5-sata-solid-state-drive-mtfddak1t0mbf-1an1zabyy.html

If you think you may need more storage down the line take a look at the Blackmagic Multidock.

I would pull the fusion drive out if it is still possible. Check with OWC on a SSD replacement.

If you can get 32G of RAM and a good size SSD to start you should be very happy with that rig.

If the ram is user replaceable in that model buy The Crucial equivalent on Amazon and save lots of money over Apples prices.

Get the extended AppleCare it may save you a lot of money one day. Pretty sure you can get up to 4 years now.

I use Logic & Ableton. I always take HZ's advice to heart, "use what you know". I'd rather chew off my own arm than learn another Daw.


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## erikradbo (Jul 28, 2017)

Wolfie2112 said:


> Just an idea....but what about investing in VEPro and a PC slave?





synthpunk said:


> VEP Slave is a good idea but the retina screens on the Imacs are just beautiful. I could see how you fallen in love with that feature.



Thanks. Many seems to be happy with VEpro, but I've never used it myself. If I don't have to I'd go for the simplicity of one computer rather than the two computers and extra screen setup.



synthpunk said:


> If you can get 32G of RAM and a good size SSD to start you should be very happy with that rig.
> 
> If the ram is user replaceable in that model buy The Crucial equivalent on Amazon and save lots of money over Apples prices.



Yes, the idea is to go with 8Gb built in and then another 3rd party RAM to end up with 40 GB. Might also go for the 256 Gb SSD which would be enough if all recordings and samples end up on an external SSD.

Reading some more, the trickiest part seem to be the processor. Given that Logic has a reasonably good multi core support, the benchmark,
https://browser.geekbench.com/mac-benchmarks)says (https://browser.geekbench.com/mac-benchmarks) ,says the following:

- iMac mid 2017 Intel Core i7-7700K @ 4.2 GHz (4 cores): 18938
- Same but with Intel Core i5-7600K @ 3.8 GHz (4 cores): 15058
- Same but with Intel Core i5-7600 @ 3.5 GHz (4 cores): 14772
- My Macbook Pro late 2013 Intel Core i7-4850HQ @ 2.3 GHz (4 cores): 12799

So the big jump in performance would be to pick the i7 4,2 GHz. However, lots of people seem to have issues with the fan noise as is stated in this thread http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=392075 among others.

The performance increase from 3,5 to 3,8 seems minimal and not worth the money. So perhaps the best bet is to go for the i5 3,5 Ghz, but it's quite a small step from my current processor, but what about the fan noise with the i7, but what about the performance...ah, decisions decisions.


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## rhye (Jul 28, 2017)

Funny enough, I'm in your exact same situation, wanting the 4,2 GhZ and also coming from a late 2013 MacBook Pro.
I have heard that going for the Radeon 575 instead of 580 will help the heat issue.


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## erikradbo (Jul 28, 2017)

rhye said:


> Funny enough, I'm in your exact same situation, wanting the 4,2 GhZ and also coming from a late 2013 MacBook Pro.
> I have heard that going for the Radeon 575 instead of 580 will help the heat issue.



Really?! Do you have any more info on this?


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## jonathanwright (Jul 28, 2017)

I can't quite remember the details now, but when I did a similar thing a few years ago I was told to avoid Fusion drives for VI/audio work. I'm not sure if the situation has changed since.

In the end I went for the mid-sized SSD, which had been rock solid and very fast.


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## erikradbo (Jul 28, 2017)

rhye said:


> Funny enough, I'm in your exact same situation, wanting the 4,2 GhZ and also coming from a late 2013 MacBook Pro.
> I have heard that going for the Radeon 575 instead of 580 will help the heat issue.



Did some more reading, and the 575 will will help only slightly, the CPU seems to be the main issue.

But someone else did this overview:
i5-7500: Guaranteed to be silent. Has the base GPU (570).
i5-7600: Pretty much guaranteed to be silent. Has a faster GPU (575).
i5-7600K: Probably will be silent, but not absolutely guaranteed. Has the fastest (and hottest) GPU (580).
i7-7700K: Will not be silent under heavy CPU load, regardless of how much the GPU (580) is working.


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## Kent (Jul 28, 2017)

I'm pretty sure the 8GB of RAM will be 4 x 2GB? I can't remember though. The late 2015 27" iMacs can hold up to 64 GB RAM (4 x 16GB), so if RAM upgrading is important to you I'd look there. 

Also, I do think you should avoid the Fusion Drive and go ahead and get the SSD.


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## erikradbo (Jul 28, 2017)

kmaster said:


> I'm pretty sure the 8GB of RAM will be 4 x 2GB? I can't remember though. The late 2015 27" iMacs can hold up to 64 GB RAM (4 x 16GB), so if RAM upgrading is important to you I'd look there.
> 
> Also, I do think you should avoid the Fusion Drive and go ahead and get the SSD.



The RAM is 2x4 GB, so two slots left to insert 2x16 GB (or 4x16 to reach 64 GB also in the 2017 model).

SSD seems to be the only way. 

If anyone else is considering this, I found this thread to be very informative, and ongoing, for iMacs for music production: https://www.gearslutz.com/board/music-computers/1161216-need-buy-new-imac-suggestions-2.html


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## rhye (Jul 28, 2017)

erikradbo said:


> Did some more reading, and the 575 will will help only slightly, the CPU seems to be the main issue.
> 
> But someone else did this overview:
> i5-7500: Guaranteed to be silent. Has the base GPU (570).
> ...


I think it has to do with the amount of energy the 580 requires compared to the 575. Also you probably won't need much of the GPU for normal music production.
I do want to get the i7-7700 but I saw this
I wonder how much of the heat comes from the GPU compared to CPU in iMacs...


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## erikradbo (Jul 28, 2017)

rhye said:


> I think it has to do with the amount of energy the 580 requires compared to the 575. Also you probably won't need much of the GPU for normal music production.
> I do want to get the i7-7700 but I saw this
> I wonder how much of the heat comes from the GPU compared to CPU in iMacs...



Multiple threads in different forums are discussing this if you make a google search. Consensus seem to be that the GPU has only limited impact and it's the CPU that is causing the issue.


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## jcrosby (Jul 28, 2017)

erikradbo said:


> 8 Gb built in RAM
> Additionally 32 Gb RAM: Kingston HyperX Impact SO-DIMM DDR4 PC19200/2400MHz CL14 2x16GB (HX424S14IBK2/32)


Don't skimp on RAM or assume any combination will just work. Mac's don't typically play nice when you mix and match vendors and speeds. Although some combinations can work others cause instability or inability to boot. If you're going to buy the Kingston memory I'd ditch the Apple memory and use only that... (Mixing speeds also stresses the CPU and from what I understand can shorten your CPU's lifespan if it's a volatile combination.) Stick to matched pairs with RAM... Personally I stick with Crucial or OWC as they have a long history of Apple spec'd RAM... Had both over they years, never a hiccup..
https://forums.macrumors.com/thread...-launched-today.2048694/page-21#post-24835036

Mismatched Memory
If money's an issue start with a matched 32 GB pair and grab another matching pair a few months later...


I'd also vote for utilizing your Macbook with VEP... You could use it as a master or slave, depends on how you set it up and if you plan on running a lot of CPU heavy plugins in the session... I have a Mac Pro master with a 2012 Mac Mini server slave. It's a solid combo, I found I preferred running my main machine as the master since I run Omnisphere and some pretty heavy CPU stuff at mixdown... Either way I'd give it a shot and see what combo works bets for you...


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## SillyMidOn (Jul 28, 2017)

erikradbo said:


> Yes, the idea is to go with 8Gb built in and then another 3rd party RAM to end up with 40 GB.


Unless things have changed in recent times, you won't be able to keep the installed 8Gb or RAM and add RAM from another manufacturer and/or different capacity to it - it's best to install the same RAM from the same manufacturer, and stick with the same size pairs, otherwise you will run into problems with applications, and/or the computer won't recognise some of the RAM chips.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Jul 28, 2017)

SillyMidOn said:


> Unless things have changed in recent times, you won't be able to keep the installed 8Gb or RAM and add RAM from another manufacturer and/or different capacity to it - it's best to install the same RAM from the same manufacturer, and stick with the same size pairs, otherwise you will run into problems with applications, and/or the computer won't recognise some of the RAM chips.



I'm glad you mentioned this, I wondered about it myself. So let's say I bought a new iMac with 8GB Ram. Would I need to buy completely new Ram (non Apple of course) if I wanted upgrade to 64GB?


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## José Skertchly (Jul 28, 2017)

With that money, I would buy a 12-cores MacPro 5.1, with 128gig RAM from OWC and make it a monster. 

I personally use the following setup:

1.- MacPro 4.1 (8 cores) 16 virtual cores.
2.- 256gig SSD for the OS
3.- 4 terabyte SATA HD for my projects
4.- Two 1 terabyte SATA HD's in RAID 0 for samples streaming
5.- 64 gig RAM


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## SillyMidOn (Jul 29, 2017)

Wolfie2112 said:


> I'm glad you mentioned this, I wondered about it myself. So let's say I bought a new iMac with 8GB Ram. Would I need to buy completely new Ram (non Apple of course) if I wanted upgrade to 64GB?


Well, in theory you should be able to add RAM of a different size and different manufacturer to the existing RAM, the one condition always stated is that it needs to be installed in pairs, and in the correct order (the manual for your iMac will tell which order that is). In practice I have found that using RAM from different manufacturers can cause problems, and also using pairs of different seizes, (so say 2 chips of 8gb, and two of 16gb size). So your best bet is to take out the RAM that shipped with your iMac and buy the maximum RAM you can afford from the same manufacturer. The current iMacs require:

_8GB (two 4GB) of 2400MHz DDR4 memory; four SO-DIMM slots, user accessible

Configurable to 16GB, 32GB or 64GB_

... and here ar the kits that MrMemory offers (there are other manufacturers):

https://www.mrmemory.co.uk/memory-ram-upgrades/apple/imac/retina-5k-27-inch-mid-2017-4.2ghz-core-i7

Of course 4 x 16gb chips gets very expensive, which gives you 64gb, but if you buy less now but fill up all your slots, and then in a year realise you need more, you have to chuck out the RAM you bought and buy new RAM all over again. Also if you just fill up two slots now with 16gb each, and leave the other two slots empty to fill up later, be aware that people like MrMemory or Crucial do change their suppliers, so you may end up buying RAM that is from a different manufacturer 2 years later, even if you buy it from the same online shop - potential for problems!

Hope that helps!


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## Michael Antrum (Jul 29, 2017)

Wolfie2112 said:


> I'm glad you mentioned this, I wondered about it myself. So let's say I bought a new iMac with 8GB Ram. Would I need to buy completely new Ram (non Apple of course) if I wanted upgrade to 64GB?


 
Yes, you would, but only because you would need to remove the 2 x 4gb modules so you can put in bigger ones.


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## synthpunk (Jul 29, 2017)

Yes I think us Mac users have always been stuck with useless Factory Ram after we upgrade  some vendors like OWC used to take it in on trade in I don't think they do anymore. I would recommend Crucial Ram from Amazon and nothing else. It's unfortunate timing-wise as RAM prices have climbed since a lot of factories are retooled for increased SSD production.



SillyMidOn said:


> Unless things have changed in recent times, you won't be able to keep the installed 8Gb or RAM and add RAM from another manufacturer and/or different capacity to it - it's best to install the same RAM from the same manufacturer, and stick with the same size pairs, otherwise you will run into problems with applications, and/or the computer won't recognise some of the RAM chips.


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## synthpunk (Jul 29, 2017)

I used to have two slaves and a vep pro setup as well but have since switched to a single 2013 Mac Pro 6 core with Ssd's, 64G ram and I have not come close torunning out of steam for anything as of yet.

Be weary as mentioned by everyone else of mixing Ram.

Sorry to see that there is a fan issue in the new iMacs but I still would remain strong and always recommending you go with the strongest processor possible.

Have you thought about upgrading the Processor/CPU and your 4 core Mac Pro to an 8, 10, or 12 core? Of course you would lose the great iMac retina screen. It does seem like apple marketing has us by the balls these days.




erikradbo said:


> Thanks. Many seems to be happy with VEpro, but I've never used it myself. If I don't have to I'd go for the simplicity of one computer rather than the two computers and extra screen setup.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## erikradbo (Jul 29, 2017)

SillyMidOn said:


> Unless things have changed in recent times, you won't be able to keep the installed 8Gb or RAM and add RAM from another manufacturer and/or different capacity to it - it's best to install the same RAM from the same manufacturer, and stick with the same size pairs, otherwise you will run into problems with applications, and/or the computer won't recognise some of the RAM chips.



Ok, so ordering with 8 Gb and remivoving it before adding the 2x16 GB, got it.



José Skertchly said:


> With that money, I would buy a 12-cores MacPro 5.1, with 128gig RAM from OWC and make it a monster.





synthpunk said:


> Have you thought about upgrading the Processor/CPU and your 4 core Mac Pro to an 8, 10, or 12 core? Of course you would lose the great iMac retina screen. It does seem like apple marketing has us by the balls these days.



I have a Macbook Pro atm, not a Mac Pro, so updating is not possible. And getting the Mac Pro would render a lot of extra costs in getting a monitor, keyboard, trackpad etc...without getting that gorgeous 5K display which will add some happiness to the production hours.



synthpunk said:


> Sorry to see that there is a fan issue in the new iMacs but I still would remain strong and always recommending you go with the strongest processor possible.



A guy in this thread https://www.gearslutz.com/board/music-computers/1161216-need-buy-new-imac-suggestions-2.html seems to have tried imacs with all the new processors (3.4, 3.5, 3.8 and 4.2 Ghz, he must have a friend at the apple store or something) and ended up with the 3.8 GHz since it could handle _almost_ everything and that the fan noise from the 4.2 just was too loud and also how the temperatures, despite the fan activity, of the CPU in that one was troubling. I'll wait a couple of days to see how he's doing, but will prob go with the i5 3,5 or 3,8.


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## jcrosby (Jul 30, 2017)

SillyMidOn said:


> Well, in theory you should be able to add RAM of a different size and different manufacturer to the existing RAM, the one condition always stated is that it needs to be installed in pairs, and in the correct order (the manual for your iMac will tell which order that is). In practice I have found that using RAM from different manufacturers can cause problems, and also using pairs of different seizes, (so say 2 chips of 8gb, and two of 16gb size).....



Different sizes not an issue if they're the same _model_...
So if you use "identical" RAM... (i.e same HyperX model, less memory per chip) you're fine... Mixing and matching latency is what you want to avoid.
And mixing and matching vendors is more unpredictable, as reporting of accuracy differs from vendor to vendor...

Basically... Apple builds their machines to a rigid specification.
Aftermarket PC part manufacturers aren't held to one per se, and different vendors report numbers ranging from accurate to "theoretical"...
As a result you can piece together a PC cheap, but no guarantees all of your parts play nicely together...
Aftermarket PC parts are also not generally manufactured with the intent of meeting Apple's specs...
With drives it's is rarely an issue... With RAM though you're dealing with something in constant negotiation with the CPU and it becomes a big issue that can cripple your system...

(Also latency's the problem, not clock speed. Just in case anyone has them confused...) If you think of it in terms of jitter issues using multiple audio interfaces it puts it in a context that we can all relate to...


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## JPQ (Jul 30, 2017)

erikradbo said:


> Did some more reading, and the 575 will will help only slightly, the CPU seems to be the main issue.
> 
> But someone else did this overview:
> i5-7500: Guaranteed to be silent. Has the base GPU (570).
> ...



Good know. if i go imac route someday. Saddly sounds so hard put such amount computer when only music (also camera raw file processing is slow but in this thing i can wait) uses needs faster computer and more memory. when even modern libs are pricey i mean my kind hobby musician.


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## JPQ (Jul 30, 2017)

good know even more sounds bad this later one is used 21.5" imacs.:( i dont have room and money for 27models.


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## erikradbo (Jul 31, 2017)

I just ordered the iMac i7 4,2GHz with the 575 graphic card and 512 GB SSD. With such easy return policies I'd be bummed not going for the highest config if the fan noise actually won't bother me.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Jul 31, 2017)

Good choice! That's one thing that's cool about buying a new Mac...the return policy. You can put it to the test for two weeks and return it for a full refund if you don't want it.


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## synthpunk (Jul 31, 2017)

Let us know how you make out Erik.


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## Joe Hartnett (Aug 3, 2017)

Has anyone here used a USB-C to Thunderbolt 2 converter with the Black Magic Multidock 2?


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## erikradbo (Aug 7, 2017)

synthpunk said:


> Let us know how you make out Erik.


Getting it today, will let you know how it goes. Will initially try it with only the 8 Gb bundled RAM.



jcrosby said:


> Different sizes not an issue if they're the same _model_...
> So if you use "identical" RAM... (i.e same HyperX model, less memory per chip) you're fine... Mixing and matching latency is what you want to avoid.
> And mixing and matching vendors is more unpredictable, as reporting of accuracy differs from vendor to vendor...



Most people actually seem to be able to mix RAM bundled and 3rd party as long as they're same speed. Although most people seem to buy slightly faster RAM as an upgrade (lower CL), and then the bundled memory slows it down.


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## erikradbo (Aug 10, 2017)

So, I got this baby tuesday and have installed and run first sessions on it. Here are my impressions:

- First and foremost: I've ordered with 8 GB RAM, and I get stuck almost immediately. Loading up a couple of VI's (like 4 instances of CSS, Spaces and neutron on the bus and some bohemian violin) and when recording I get system overload, which actually might be from the CPU, not sure there. But Logic freezes up and has to work hard to get back given the 8GB RAM.

- Screen is beautiful

- Haven't heard the fan yet, it hasn't once increased from 1200 rpm. That was my biggest concern, and it hasn't been a problem at all. Note that I'm sitting at home so it's not in a perfectly quiet studio.

- Magic trackpad feels so much less snappy than on my mbp.

- Geekbench score single/multi: 5505 / 18241. To compare with 4098 / 14260 on my mbp 2013.


In total my impression is a bit lukewarm. This is probably due to the low RAM, but I'm in between if I should order RAM to try it out or send it back and keep using my mbp, perhaps buy a bigger display. It's still a beautiful computer, but not sure this upgrade is worth the price.


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## babylonwaves (Aug 10, 2017)

erikradbo said:


> - Magic trackpad feels so much less snappy than on my mbp.


that might be down to bluetooth. if you have the new one, leave it connected to your mac so it doesn't use bluetooth.


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## synthpunk (Aug 10, 2017)

Or try the trackpad preferences adjustments. If you leave it connected all the time you may not condition the battery correctly.

Also I recomend downloading Better Touch Tool which allows even more customisation.



babylonwaves said:


> that might be down to bluetooth. if you have the new one, leave it connected to your mac so it doesn't use bluetooth.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Aug 10, 2017)

Honestly, you aren't going to gain a ton, except for the bigger screen and the ability to upgrade the Ram. That's why I had mentioned considering a PC slave to run along side your MacBook along with one or two large displays. If you upgrade the Ram in the iMac, you're still out that $$ even if you return the iMac (and Ram is stupid expensive these days). But if the Ram upgrade works for your needs, then you no doubt have a nice mac. Another thing you could try is going to a local computer shop to buy the Ram, they may give you a full refund for it if you return it within a certain period (there's a shop in my area that has this policy).


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## rhye (Aug 10, 2017)

8 gigs of ram is wayyyy too little for modern music production. If you are using virtual instruments, you'll eat that in a heartbeat and the computer will become completely unresponsive. 
Remember that it's always way cheaper to upgrade the ram yourself intead of paying apple. 
The reason why I am going to move away from my 2013 macbook pro is because 16 gigs of ram is limiting my work too much. I ordered the same iMac myself yesterday (also ordered 64gb ram on amazon) and I am glad that you are not having issues with the fan since that is my biggest concern.


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## erikradbo (Aug 10, 2017)

Yes, I'm very aware of the limitation, the extra RAM (32 GB for now) is already ordered and that was the original plan. The challenge is - as Wolfie points out - that I have to make up my mind and decide to keep the computer (the RAM that is) before trying it's full capacity.

The fan is deadly quiet. What I forgot to comment on is the keyboard: It really sucks. I've read lots of comments about it, and they are true. Little piece of cheap plastic.


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## rhye (Aug 10, 2017)

I guess it depends on your needs. One of my concerns with the macbook is that it's getting way too hot when I have large projects and it becomes way slower when I use an external display.


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## erikradbo (Aug 10, 2017)

Good to know with the display, was one of my options. Prob will keep this one, should be good for at least 5 years...I hope.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Aug 10, 2017)

rhye said:


> I guess it depends on your needs. One of my concerns with the macbook is that it's getting way too hot when I have large projects and it becomes way slower when I use an external display.



The display should not slow things down, I have two displays on mine and there's no affect (not HD though, just regular LED's). One thing you could try is setting your graphics to say in performance mode all the time (if you haven't tried that already).

Also, if you don't have one, I highly recommend investing in a cooling pad for the MacBook. It's doesn't fix the heating issue, but definitely helps with distributing air underneath the MacBook.


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## rhye (Aug 10, 2017)

I did notice an effect in performance (I am using a 4k display tho) and I've sure to be using the gpu. 
In order to help with the heat, I have been using the macbook with the lid open (to help with ventilation) and a small magnet to trick it to think it's closed.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Aug 10, 2017)

Joe Hartnett said:


> Has anyone here used a USB-C to Thunderbolt 2 converter with the Black Magic Multidock 2?



I haven't used it, but they're just using USB-C as the connector for everything now. Of course, that means you don't know what's there - Thunderbolt, power, USB, MiniDisplayPort...

Oy.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Aug 10, 2017)

erikradbo, Fusion drives are from when SSDs were much more expensive. You probably know that they have a small SSD and a regular drive, along with some kind of algorithm to decide when to move stuff you want all the time to the SSD.

That's not as good as real SSDs for your startup drive, and you don't want that for streaming samples at all.

If you don't want to pay to have everything on SSD, my suggestion is to get an external spinning drive and put the stuff you don't use often on that. That's actually what I do.


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## synthpunk (Aug 10, 2017)

If it is large enough you can partition backup partitions for Carbon Copy Cloner and Time machine as well.

But yeah as long as that Fusion Drive is user-replaceable to some extent definitely exchange it for at least a 256gb boot drive SSD. Keep your boot drive as clean as possible to avoid any possible bottlenecks.



Nick Batzdorf said:


> erikradbo, Fusion drives are from when SSDs were much more expensive. You probably know that they have a small SSD and a regular drive, along with some kind of algorithm to decide when to move stuff you want all the time to the SSD.
> 
> That's not as good as real SSDs for your startup drive, and you don't want that for streaming samples at all.
> 
> If you don't want to pay to have everything on SSD, my suggestion is to get an external spinning drive and put the stuff you don't use often on that. That's actually what I do.


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## Cowtothesky (Aug 10, 2017)

The new iMac's with 18 cores look amazing, but won't be out until December. I will probably bite the bullet and get either one of these or the standard iMac's with the new processors and graphics. 

https://www.apple.com/imac-pro/


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## Nick Batzdorf (Aug 10, 2017)

Computers are getting really expensive. They last a lot longer - computer years are now five years instead of 20 - but still.


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## robgb (Aug 13, 2017)

erikradbo said:


> Yes, the idea is to go with 8Gb built in and then another 3rd party RAM to end up with 40 GB.


I don't know about the new iMacs, but in my 2013, when I upped the RAM from 8gb, I had to remove the RAM currently in there to do the upgrade. The highest it will go is 32gb.


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## Kent (Aug 13, 2017)

robgb said:


> I don't know about the new iMacs, but in my 2013, when I upped the RAM from 8gb, I had to remove the RAM currently in there to do the upgrade. The highest it will go is 32gb.


Starting from the late-2015 27-inch models, the iMac can support up to 64.


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## erikradbo (Sep 22, 2017)

erikradbo said:


> So, I got this baby tuesday and have installed and run first sessions on it. Here are my impressions:
> 
> - First and foremost: I've ordered with 8 GB RAM, and I get stuck almost immediately. Loading up a couple of VI's (like 4 instances of CSS, Spaces and neutron on the bus and some bohemian violin) and when recording I get system overload, which actually might be from the CPU, not sure there. But Logic freezes up and has to work hard to get back given the 8GB RAM.
> 
> ...



Here's an update one month later. I bought the Crucial DDR4 SO-DIMM 2400Mhz 32GB MAC to get a total of 40 Gb. Since they had the same speed (17) I figured I could use them side by side. However, I was quite disappointed with the overall performance, with lots of spinning balls. I was seriously considering it faulty, but thought I might just as well try to remove those 8 Gb of original RAM, and after that it has worked as a charm. And still no issues with fan noise. Happy and glorious!


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## rhye (Sep 22, 2017)

Similar experience here. I bought a Corsair vengeance 64gb that ended up being defective and caused all sorts of problems. I returned it and bought the Crucial 64gb and it has been really stable. 
No issues with fan noise either, very rarely do I hear it in music production and it only lasts a few seconds. I am super happy with the computer!


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## Jonik (Oct 17, 2017)

So after this time, how’s the fan noise with the i7 and 575? I’m after one myself and wonder whether the noise is an i7 580 issue rather than just the i7. 

Would love an update if you could!





erikradbo said:


> I just ordered the iMac i7 4,2GHz with the 575 graphic card and 512 GB SSD. With such easy return policies I'd be bummed not going for the highest config if the fan noise actually won't bother me.


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## rhye (Oct 17, 2017)

I do hear the fan when working cpu intense projects, but I don't think it's such a big deal.


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## micrologus (Oct 17, 2017)

rhye said:


> I do hear the fan when working cpu intense projects, but I don't think it's such a big deal.



Same here, for example when I edit videos in iMovie. Normally my new iMac is absolutely silent.


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## erikradbo (Oct 17, 2017)

Jonik said:


> So after this time, how’s the fan noise with the i7 and 575? I’m after one myself and wonder whether the noise is an i7 580 issue rather than just the i7.
> 
> Would love an update if you could!



Haven't been disturbed by the fan once, it's possible it's there but never loud enough to disturb the music (or be noticed when recording).


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## Jonik (Oct 17, 2017)

That’s great to hear - micrologus and rhye, do you both have the i7 and 575 too?

I’ve got a MacBook Pro that almost hovers when the fans start so I’m not *hugely* bothered, but if there’s an option to keep the power and not have a fighter jet noise then that’s got to be worth the slightly worse GPU surely? Especially for audio apps!


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## rhye (Oct 17, 2017)

Yes, I have the 2017 iMac, 4.2 i7 and 575... I have to say that I do hear it quite often in music production when I am using many heavy Kontakt instruments (like that darn OT's Capsule), but the actual sound of the fan is not that disturbing, to me at least. 
My old 2013 MacBook Pro was way noisier anyway. I don't think I would really payed much attention had I not seen so much discussion about it online...


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## micrologus (Oct 18, 2017)

I have the 2017 iMac i7 580 with 40 GB Ram.


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## InLight-Tone (Oct 18, 2017)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> Computers are getting really expensive. They last a lot longer - computer years are now five years instead of 20 - but still.


Well PC's are dirt cheap, and you have a million options instead of a few, one reason I never bit the Apple...


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## Nick Batzdorf (Oct 19, 2017)

InLight-Tone said:


> Well PC's are dirt cheap, and you have a million options instead of a few, one reason I never bit the Apple.



The problem is that they're not Macs.


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## InLight-Tone (Oct 19, 2017)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> The problem is that they're not Macs.


I know I know, I almost went over, and Logic looks good to me. I even installed Mac on VMWare to test it all out. Can't afford the transition though, we'll see...


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## rossominerale (Jan 8, 2018)

erikradbo said:


> Here's an update one month later. I bought the Crucial DDR4 SO-DIMM 2400Mhz 32GB MAC to get a total of 40 Gb. Since they had the same speed (17) I figured I could use them side by side. However, I was quite disappointed with the overall performance, with lots of spinning balls. I was seriously considering it faulty, but thought I might just as well try to remove those 8 Gb of original RAM, and after that it has worked as a charm. And still no issues with fan noise. Happy and glorious!



My old 2011 i7 mabcook pro 13" 16gb with SSD has a faulty sata cable and I am considering what to do. I have ordered a new sata cable and I will put some electric tape around it (apparently it helps). Although a new laptop could sound like a reasonable investment in my situation, I am thinking instead of getting the top 27" iMac (but with i7, 512 ssd and custom ram). Perhaps I can use the old macbook pro 13" as a slave machine (if I can fix it).

As I am in a similar situation described in this post, rather than opening a new thread I thought to add a reply to this one. 

I work in an home studio, with very basic acoustic treatment. I would prefer to stay with Apple as I use Logic y partner who has a macbook air and I guess i could not do that switching to Cubase (and to PC).

For the people how have been using the imac i7 27" for a few months, how you find the fan noise?

Considering that my laptop could die anytime, should I invest in a macbook pro 15" instead? I do live performances as well, but not so many at the moment.

Thanks


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## mat1 (Jan 9, 2018)

rossominerale said:


> For the people how have been using the imac i7 27" for a few months, how you find the fan noise?
> 
> Thanks



I bought a top spec 2015 5k iMac and a top spec 2015 15" Mbp for less than a singe new Macbook Pro with equivalent specs. 1tb SSD is each with almost 2years Applecare. 

The fan on the iMac has been fine so far (fingers crossed). The 2015 Macbook pro however is offensively noisy with an external attached.


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## TheKRock (Jan 9, 2018)

rossominerale said:


> My old 2011 i7 mabcook pro 13" 16gb with SSD has a faulty sata cable and I am considering what to do. I have ordered a new sata cable and I will put some electric tape around it (apparently it helps). Although a new laptop could sound like a reasonable investment in my situation, I am thinking instead of getting the top 27" iMac (but with i7, 512 ssd and custom ram). Perhaps I can use the old macbook pro 13" as a slave machine (if I can fix it).
> 
> As I am in a similar situation described in this post, rather than opening a new thread I thought to add a reply to this one.
> 
> ...


Ive been a year in with my iMac i7 5k and even on super long sessions I have yet noticed any fan noise or if there was any it wasn't significant enough for me to notice.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Jan 9, 2018)

Yeah, I think a lot of heat and therefore fan noise was due to spinning hard drives.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Jan 9, 2018)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> Yeah, I think a lot of heat and therefore fan noise was due to spinning hard drives.



My 2013 Macbook Pro has a flash drive, and the fan is really annoying when it kicks in. I have it on a cooling mat which helps a bit, but man, it gets hot.


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## robgb (Jan 9, 2018)

My external hard drives are the only thing that make any noise in my setup. My iMac is virtually silent.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Jan 9, 2018)

Wolfie2112 said:


> My 2013 Macbook Pro has a flash drive, and the fan is really annoying when it kicks in. I have it on a cooling mat which helps a bit, but man, it gets hot.



Yeah, recent MacBook Pros aren't the best machines Apple has ever made. Anything that requires a cooling mat... that's ridiculous.

Now, the MacBook Air is another story. Great machine - but it's not for studio use.


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## rossominerale (Jan 9, 2018)

Thanks all for the answers! If I can fix the macbook pro and have it running for at least 6 months, I hope I can then get an imac 27" i7 and eventually a macbook air for the situations on the go (live, mainly supercollider and ableton launching field recordings).


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