# Hans Zimmer's Low End



## Parsifal666 (Dec 7, 2015)

I'm a big fan of Zimmer, and super curious to know how he gets that powerful low end (perhaps best evidenced on Dark Knight and Man of Steel). It's boomy yet powerful in a punchy way. Besides the amazing engineering he's done, I'm curious if I might get somewhere in that vicinity using the Wave Lo Air (or if perhaps he's used something similar)?

Any help would be hugely appreciated.


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## Vin (Dec 7, 2015)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPNWAG7rzzA (This guy) gets it for him.


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## marclawsonmusic (Dec 7, 2015)

Orchestration


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## Parsifal666 (Dec 7, 2015)

Vin said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UPNWAG7rzzA (This guy) gets it for him.



GREAT link, thank you!


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## tokatila (Dec 7, 2015)

Lining up transients, saturation, playing big drums in soft dynamics (and then cranking them up) and great use of Dynamic EQ / compression to move shit away from each other.

Would be my guess, based on what I have read.


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## Parsifal666 (Dec 7, 2015)

tokatila said:


> Lining up transients, saturation, playing big drums in soft dynamics (and then cranking them up) and great use of Dynamic EQ / compression to move shit away from each other.
> 
> Would be my guess, based on what I have read.



It's super low and devatastingly punchy. Heavy metal duuuuuuude!


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## Studio E (Dec 7, 2015)

I just wanted to say, thank you for not titling the thread "Hans Zimmer's Bottom End".


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## Parsifal666 (Dec 7, 2015)

Studio E said:


> I just wanted to say, thank you for not titling the thread "Hans Zimmer's Bottom End".



(dying!)


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## Kejero (Dec 7, 2015)

Probably a little EQ-ing too. I can imagine there's a lot of cutting going on in Hans' low end.

Also, very few people have rooms (and gear) that are acoustically optimized to accurately monitor low frequencies. I know my room is rubbish so when it comes to how my low end will translate in a theatre, it's a huge guessing game. Obviously the pros have their music eventually mastered in mini-theatres for this reason, but I'm sure Hans' "living room" (which I'm sure is an accurate description for his studio) handles those bass and sub frequencies pretty gracefully, and that definitely helps.


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## bbyrne (Dec 7, 2015)

Alan Meyerson and hundreds of tracks ! - mixwiththemasters dot com


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## Rctec (Dec 7, 2015)

Are you talking about my big bottom?!? 
Well, I don't use a sub in my room, so the lows have to translate to my little quested speakers. We mix on those as well, but Alan has now gotten some PMC's that are just a bit louder without blowing up for the mix. Steve Lipson uses anything that's lying around - he doesn't care and can get used to any speakers.
But this guy helps a lot:


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## Allen Constantine (Dec 7, 2015)

Rctec said:


> Are you talking about my big bottom?!?
> Well, I don't use a sub in my room, so the lows have to translate to my little quested speakers. We mix on those as well, but Alan has now gotten some PMC's that are just a bit louder without blowing up for the mix. Steve Lipson uses anything that's lying around - he doesn't care and can get used to any speakers.
> But this guy helps a lot:



Insane


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## Rctec (Dec 7, 2015)

AllenConstantine said:


> Insane


I use these Quested's. That's not a subwoofer at the bottom, it just wimple yes the frequency range.
And a lot of compression and EQ, but mostly "tailoring" the orchestration to work...


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## Allen Constantine (Dec 7, 2015)

Rctec said:


> I use these Quested's. That's not a subwoofer at the bottom, it just wimple yes the frequency range.
> And a lot of compression and EQ, but mostly "tailoring" the orchestration to work...



WOW... 4 of them ?


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## RiffWraith (Dec 7, 2015)

_Hans Zimmer's Low End_



Rctec said:


> A lot of compression and EQ, but mostly "tailoring" the orchestration to work...



It is absolutely not possible to emphasize that enough.


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## Walid F. (Dec 7, 2015)

Rctec said:


> ... but mostly "tailoring" the orchestration to work...



This is like... the best thing anyone can ever say about "how to get that fat sound".

A well-orchestrated composition sells a mix way better than a great mix with a badly orchestrated composition.

W.


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## kunst91 (Dec 7, 2015)

Don't forget squats!


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## Rctec (Dec 7, 2015)

Rctec said:


> I use these Quested's. That's not a subwoofer at the bottom, it just wimple yes the frequency range.
> And a lot of compression and EQ, but mostly "tailoring" the orchestration to work...


I can not believe "spellcheck"! "Wimple yes"? I think I meant to say "completes" the frequency range...


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## prodigalson (Dec 7, 2015)

God, my frequency range gets wimple yes'd all the time. so annoying..


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## guydoingmusic (Dec 7, 2015)

Rctec said:


> I can not believe "spellcheck"! "Wimple yes"? I think I meant to say "completes" the frequency range...


Fluffing Auto Collect!! It's a piece of shirt!!


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## Jdiggity1 (Dec 7, 2015)

I like the Nektar P6 photobombing in the background


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## givemenoughrope (Dec 7, 2015)

Wimple yes confused me.

Do you recommend anything else for bass besides something with wood on it? Minitaur, Dave Smith stuff, Bass Station 2, software?


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## Rctec (Dec 7, 2015)

givemenoughrope said:


> Wimple yes confused me.
> 
> Do you recommend anything else for bass besides something with wood on it? Minitaur, Dave Smith stuff, Bass Station 2, software?


Anything Ken Macbeth does, Studio Electronics, the AJH modules for Eurorack... Those are all very solid - and current - favorites in the bass department. And, of course U-He "Diva". Urs destroyed my favorite Mini Moog to model those Oscilators and filters...


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## Rctec (Dec 7, 2015)

Rctec said:


> Anything Ken Macbeth does, Studio Electronics do very good and affordable systems in their "Boomstars", the AJH modules for Eurorack... Those are all very solid - and current - favorites in the bass department. And, of course U-He "Diva". Urs destroyed my favorite Mini Moog to model those Oscilators and filters...
> Oh, and if you want to get really bad - Moon Modular!
> We build it into a steel frame, which is a bit overkill. But only a little bit...


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## givemenoughrope (Dec 7, 2015)

Wow... :0 

So when you are building a subby bass patch, how much of it starts with just a sine wave or a triangle/saw with the filter mostly closed? Is that a typical starting place ...or is there a starting place? (Question directed to anyone really..)

I'm having some luck with the BS2 (trying to stick to portable synths that save patches) since it does with sine waves but I still end up layering with software.


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## Parsifal666 (Dec 11, 2015)

Rctec said:


> Anything Ken Macbeth does, Studio Electronics, the AJH modules for Eurorack... Those are all very solid - and current - favorites in the bass department. And, of course U-He "Diva". Urs destroyed my favorite Mini Moog to model those Oscilators and filters...



Your collaboration with U-he has just been terrific, I fall in love with the Zebra HZ every time I open it! The percussion patches are simply incredible. All I can do is thank both you and Howard.


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## chimuelo (Dec 13, 2015)

If you want an incredibly Fat way to get that discrete audio punch without having to start building a Eurorack or MOTM wall, Studio Electronics SE-1 or SE-1X are over 20 years old and kids are just starting to discover them.
Used ones go for 600.
What makes them so fat and punchy is the 3 Oscillators.
Not just because it's the fullest detune method, but each Oscillator can output all waveforms simultaneously. So a 3 Oscillator preset can have 9 waveforms.

I sent my SE-1 back to be upgraded to the 1X. These guys added some extras for free like Distortion.
Had a guy recap something for extra snap on my EG for puncher BPF zaps and that Sub sound kids use where BPF and HPF cuts make their subs rattle the spare tires in their trunks.


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## Rodney Money (Dec 13, 2015)

You can tell I don't know ANYTHING about this stuff. I would've said, "I don't know, he adds tuba, cimbasso, bass trombone, low reeds, celli, and double basses?" Lol. I am enjoying this thread, guys, a lot of great information. Now I would've died if he said something on the lines of this, "Ok, in honesty, I take a bass flute and crank it up to 11 in the mix."


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## rottoy (Dec 13, 2015)

Rodney Money said:


> You can tell I don't know ANYTHING about this stuff. I would've said, "I don't know, he adds tuba, cimbasso, bass trombone, low reeds, celli, and double basses?" Lol. I am enjoying this thread, guys, a lot of great information. Now I would've died if he said something on the lines of this, "Ok, in honesty, I take a bass flute and crank it up to 11 in the mix."


And now we need to urge Hans & the Spitfire guys to sample an epic bass flute library.
You know, the famous Inception bass flute BRAAMS.


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## rottoy (Dec 13, 2015)

With 8x RR on the key noises.


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## rottoy (Dec 13, 2015)

Of course, there would be an expansion if you want to utilize the brown note for your work.
*399£ plus VAT.*


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## Rodney Money (Dec 13, 2015)

rottoy said:


> Of course, there would be an expansion if you want to utilize the brown note for your work.
> *399£ plus VAT.*


Crap, it's not included?


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## rottoy (Dec 13, 2015)

Rodney Money said:


> Crap, it's not included?


It's a scatological fact, my friend.


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## chimuelo (Dec 13, 2015)

A fine ass example of Reeds and Oscillator punch is Butterfly from Bernie Hancocks Thrust album.

Bass Clarinet by Dr.Bennie Maupin.
3 Oscillator punch by Herbie Hancock and Alan Pearlmans ARP 2600.
Just checking out the Roland Solina Strings is a lesson.
Not to mention incredibly well developed solos.


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## Parsifal666 (Dec 13, 2015)

rottoy said:


> And now we need to urge Hans & the Spitfire guys to sample an epic bass flute library.
> You know, the famous Inception bass flute BRAAMS.



You know, I'm hoping you meant that seriously, because I'd buy that. And the brass, strings...everything.


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## rottoy (Dec 13, 2015)

Parsifal666 said:


> You know, I'm hoping you meant that seriously, because I'd buy that. And the brass, strings...everything.


My fondness for the bass flute is what caught my eye in this thread. So yeah, a pinch of hope and truth to it.


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## Rodney Money (Dec 13, 2015)

Oh my goodness, what did I start? Good thing I didn't say Han's Bottom End would make a great name for a track." Oh no, I just did.


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## Parsifal666 (Dec 13, 2015)

Rodney Money said:


> Oh my goodness, what did I start? Good thing I didn't say Han's Bottom End would make a great name for a track." Oh no, I just did.



Even better...a Death Metal band name.


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## Parsifal666 (Dec 13, 2015)

rottoy said:


> My fondness for the bass flute is what caught my eye in this thread. So yeah, a pinch of hope and truth to it.



I'd be all over that. And no, I don't mean his bottom end! Words like "Zimmer", "U-he", and "Spitfire" always seem to make fascinating combinations in the plugin world.


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## wbacer (Dec 13, 2015)

I need to show the pic of Hans Moon Modular to my wife and maybe she's stop complaining about my wimple little studio.


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## givemenoughrope (Dec 13, 2015)

chimuelo said:


> A fine ass example of Reeds and Oscillator punch is Butterfly from Bernie Hancocks Thrust album.
> 
> Bass Clarinet by Dr.Bennie Maupin.
> 3 Oscillator punch by Herbie Hancock and Alan Pearlmans ARP 2600.
> ...



That lead at 6:13...!!!


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## chimuelo (Dec 13, 2015)

givemenoughrope said:


> That lead at 6:13...!!!



Indeed. 
My favorite euphoric moment was always @ 4:02.
The bi directional portamento with those Oscillators and Filters sizzling followed by those Solina strings.
But your ears caught that Reed with high harmonic content blended with synths @ 6:13.
You must be using IEMs or nearfields.
Phablets lack testecular fortitude.


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## givemenoughrope (Dec 13, 2015)

chimuelo said:


> Indeed.
> My favorite euphoric moment was always @ 4:02.
> The bi directional portamento with those Oscillators and Filters sizzling followed by those Solina strings.
> But your ears caught that Reed with high harmonic content blended with synths @ 6:13.
> ...


iPhone. But I'll check it on the monitors later.
A friend of mine was raving about Sextant as his Raymond Scott album. Always loved BM's bass clarinet/tenor.


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## Kejero (Dec 14, 2015)

rottoy said:


> And now we need to urge Hans & the Spitfire guys to sample an epic bass flute library.
> You know, the famous Inception bass flute BRAAMS.



8dio recently released the lite version of their super secret 8W library, and their low woodwinds actually contain some braams  

(Around 4m20)


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## AfterInfinity (Dec 14, 2015)

He mentions in that Pensado's Place that he saves his sub low end so that when there is something down there its special. I personally took this to heart and I've seen real improvement in the low end of my mixes.


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## kunst91 (Dec 14, 2015)

Rodney Money said:


> Crap, it's not included?



I see what you did there...


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## kunst91 (Dec 14, 2015)

rottoy said:


> My fondness for the bass flute is what caught my eye in this thread. So yeah, a pinch of hope and truth to it.



Spitfire's bass flute is like buttaaah


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## evilantal (Dec 18, 2015)

I hope Hans will be bringing his Low End out on tour.
I'd love to see it perform live


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## Parsifal666 (Dec 18, 2015)

kunst91 said:


> Spitfire's bass flute is like buttaaah



Note the "BUTT".....very pertinent to this topic


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## kunst91 (Dec 18, 2015)

Parsifal666 said:


> Note the "BUTT".....very pertinent to this topic



Glad someone noticed


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## musophrenic (Dec 18, 2015)

rottoy said:


> With 8x RR on the key noises.




Peter Sheridan is a bloody legend man. He teaches at my University (or former University now, lol), and his humility is proportional to his exceptional talent. He's ALL about that bass ... AND treble (he's equally phenomenal on any and all flutes). He played on a number of Jerry Goldsmith scores (including the Star Trek films).

If y'all need some brilliant live flute in any register, let me put you in touch with him 

Sorry for the OT, hehe. I just got pretty excited because Peter is an excellent human being.


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## Rodney Money (Dec 18, 2015)

musophrenic said:


> Peter Sheridan is a bloody legend man. He teaches at my University (or former University now, lol), and his humility is proportional to his exceptional talent. He's ALL about that bass ... AND treble (he's equally phenomenal on any and all flutes). He played on a number of Jerry Goldsmith scores (including the Star Trek films).
> 
> If y'all need some brilliant live flute in any register, let me put you in touch with him
> 
> Sorry for the OT, hehe. I just got pretty excited because Peter is an excellent human being.


That sounds truly awesome, and my hope is that one day I may be an excellent human being as well.


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