# PC, Thunderbolt and UA Apollo



## jononotbono (Feb 19, 2019)

So I’m considering moving back to PC and wondering about Thunderbolt. Is Thunderbolt 3 working well with PC? I want to use a Universal Audio Apollo Interface and that uses TB so I’m wondering what are good choices of CPU and Motherboards (that have TB). I’ve been considering the Intel 9900X but I’m only just starting to do some research so it’s not set in stone. I’m not very up with TB and PCs so thought I’d ask here for any advice on what to look for. This build is going to be the Master PC and will need TB3. Unlike any slaves I build after this.

Thanks for any advice

Jono


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## manuhz (Feb 19, 2019)

Yes, it works pretty well, but for me was not as easy as plug and play. Mobo and tb expansion card are from same manufacturer, in my case Asus. Had some troubles initially to driving in, especially with the extreme fuzzy bios configuration. I would take care about the components you’re considering and check out first for compatibility. There are such a list on the UAD website. Hope it helps!


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## Fab (Feb 19, 2019)

I remember it being a pain in the bum researching a good motherboard with thunderbolt, though it was a few years ago with T2. 

I think keep researching all the thunderbolt motherboards that fit your build needs and pick a few that either have easily available expansion cards, better still is to find one that is already ready to go / thunderbolt built into the board.


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## iMovieShout (Feb 19, 2019)

We had this issue. We wanted to upgrade from our various DACs to Apollo, but then found that our 2 workstations had the dual-CPU Asus MB that isn't compatible with a TB card. That was unfortunate luck for us. 
In the end after alot of research and procrastination, we swapped out the Asus MBs for SuperMicro dual-CPU MB and compatible TB. Then tested with a new Apollo x8 to be sure they worked fine. The CPUs are Intel Xeon E5-2696 v3 with 128GB DDR4 RAM. This provides for 72 threads but unfortunately Windows 10 only currently supports 64 threads max, so we use Process Lasso Pro to maximise the available 64 threads and ensure Cubase or Nuendo are running at maximum performance. Requires a bit of tweaking to get it working, but after 3 months it seems fine.


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## chimuelo (Feb 19, 2019)

Curious which SuperMicro you swapped for.
I love their boards. I still use a P4SCT+II from over a decade ago.
Had to buy a NOS/NIB Prescott CPU 3 years ago.
It’s my only GSIF PC left.


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## manuhz (Feb 19, 2019)

jpb007.uk said:


> We had this issue. We wanted to upgrade from our various DACs to Apollo, but then found that our 2 workstations had the dual-CPU Asus MB that isn't compatible with a TB card. That was unfortunate luck for us.
> In the end after alot of research and procrastination, we swapped out the Asus MBs for SuperMicro dual-CPU MB and compatible TB. Then tested with a new Apollo x8 to be sure they worked fine. The CPUs are Intel Xeon E5-2696 v3 with 128GB DDR4 RAM. This provides for 72 threads but unfortunately Windows 10 only currently supports 64 threads max, so we use Process Lasso Pro to maximise the available 64 threads and ensure Cubase or Nuendo are running at maximum performance. Requires a bit of tweaking to get it working, but after 3 months it seems fine.



Curious abot the Lasso Pro tool you’ve mentioned. Makes sense on W10 PCs? I mean the non server version...


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## SomeKindaThing (Feb 19, 2019)

I'm using the Apollo Thunderbolt with an adapter connected to a USB-C port of an Asus Prime X299 Deluxe II. No problems inside of Cubase, but it's not great for driving system audio. A fair amount of clicks and pops, even with the suggested optimization by UA.


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## iMovieShout (Feb 20, 2019)

chimuelo said:


> Curious which SuperMicro you swapped for.
> I love their boards. I still use a P4SCT+II from over a decade ago.
> Had to buy a NOS/NIB Prescott CPU 3 years ago.
> It’s my only GSIF PC left.



*Supermicro Intel Xeon E5 Dual Socket 2011 R3 X10DAi EATX *
*Purchased from scan.co.uk: https://www.scan.co.uk/products/sup...3-x2-ddr4-sata-iii-6gb-s-pcie-30-gb-lan-e-atx*


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## BGvanRens (Feb 20, 2019)

Used the Apollo (original silverface) on Firewire (with official tested PCIe FW exp card on mobo). At some point it was disconnecting itself most of the time (even if Windows recognized it and shown it in device manager). For this reason I am resisting a bit to recommend UA interfaces on Windows. I did run a 10 meter FW signal extender on it though. But if that was the issue then Windows couldn't see it either. According to the uadforum I am not alone on having 'Device not found' errors. On Mac OS it was running great on TB, have to give them credit here.

I just feel (also by judging from their forum) that their Windows drivers are not that great and stable. TB or not. The fact that at some point they shipped unsigned drivers out that caused a major rant tells me that they are not serious about Windows either. Insisting that users should disable a security setting in the BIOS till they figure it out. Instead of pulling back the update and offer a rollback.


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## JamieLang (Feb 22, 2019)

UA is not a Windows focused company. Haven't been a for a long time.


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## CoffeeLover (Feb 22, 2019)

was painless proscess on my side
easy install 
motherboard gigabyte
pcie card from gigabyte and adapter both ordered on amazon
i had no problems.


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## Pudge (Feb 27, 2019)

MSI are a good board maker and use the best components. Although its hard finding a board without gimmicks (RGB).

One of their boards comes with TB3 card and PCIE based M.2 port (Looks like a GPU) holds up to 3 M.2 slots on the card.

X299 board Sups 128gb RAM.

https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/MEG-X299-CREATION/Specification


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## fraz (Mar 3, 2019)

Hello jononotbono,

I've looked into this as it's not easy to start with where to look.

On Intel socket LGA 2066 HEDT - I believe these are the best choices available.

Gigabyte X299 Designare - 3 x PCIe-x16 thru CPU lanes - & - 2 x PCI-e thru chipset (24 lanes PCH_chipset - plus thunderbolt 3 thru back panel.

Gigabyte have other boards on X299 with thunderbolt header on board but would need a Gigabyte TH3 Alpine Ridge card

Asus, X299 Sage - 7 x PCI-e x16 slots - will need an Asus thunderbolt 3 card - If you plan Pro Tools HDX cards & or PCI-e SSD this is a workstation class board that will excel.

Asus WS X299 Pro - like the WS above but less slots and cut down but cheaper and very well made indeed.

Asus X299 Deluxe II - not many slots - does have th3 built into board and improved VRM's heat sinks

AsRock X299 OC Formula - limited to 64 GB RAM - 5 X PCI-e slots x16 + 1 x X4 slot ---- very good board. Needs AsRock TH3 card.

AsRock X299 Taichi XE - VRM's on this are great - needs an AsRock TH3 card

>>>> On Z390 platform - MSI X390 Carbon Pro Gaming - thunderbolt header on board and my Asus TH3 card works with this and an 9900 K processor

Asus Z390-A ---has th3 header on -

Have a look at these and I'm sure you'll find your favorite board / thunderbolt combo


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## jononotbono (Mar 3, 2019)

fraz said:


> Hello jononotbono,
> 
> I've looked into this as it's not easy to start with where to look.
> 
> ...



Thank you so much. I’ve been going round in circles so much so i was even thinking about getting a Mac Pro 6,1 again. I’ll check all of these out as I really would love a faster computer than a 6,1


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## Gabriel S. (Mar 12, 2019)

@jononotbono I'm in the process of building a new system too...You can't imagine the amount of hours that I'm expending just checking all the possible options  

At the end, I think one of the bests is Gigabyte Z390 Designare + i9-9900k. The Designare MB has built-in Thunderbolt 3 and many users, both windows and mac (hackintosh), are working with it using interfaces from UAD like the apollo. Regarding osx, it has a golden build and it seems to work pretty well in Os mojave.

This solution works better than the ASUS or Gigabyte Thunderbolt PCi cards. It supports TB Hot swap, for example.

Also, the Designare has good OC capabilities. Easy to set the i9-9900k on 4.8-5 Ghz. It's not cheap but also not the most expensive one. Overall, it seems a good investment based on what I've found so far. Ah, and it can handle 128Gb RAM


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## Pablocrespo (Mar 13, 2019)

Be careful with the designare because it doesn´t support tb1 and tb2 is a bit hit and miss. you can check in the gigabyte forums. I settled for a aorus pro wifi and the alpine range card to be sure with my tb1 motu


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## Gabriel S. (Mar 13, 2019)

Pablocrespo said:


> Be careful with the designare because it doesn´t support tb1 and tb2 is a bit hit and miss. you can check in the gigabyte forums. I settled for a aorus pro wifi and the alpine range card to be sure with my tb1 motu



Really? I have to check that. Thanks! But in tonymacx86 there is a bunch of people using it with their UAD units. Search in google for: z390 designare 9700k thunderbolt 3, and check the first result

You only need a TB2 to TB3 adapter (extra cost). With the Alpine Range you don't need anything else for TB1 or TB2?


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## jononotbono (Mar 13, 2019)

Gabriel S. said:


> @jononotbono I'm in the process of building a new system too...You can't imagine the amount of hours that I'm expending just checking all the possible options
> 
> At the end, I think one of the bests is Gigabyte Z390 Designare + i9-9900k. The Designare MB has built-in Thunderbolt 3 and many users, both windows and mac (hackintosh), are working with it using interfaces from UAD like the apollo. Regarding osx, it has a golden build and it seems to work pretty well in Os mojave.
> 
> ...



Thanks! Curious what you think of the Asus WS Sage /10gb mobo? It looks to me like a very good board. I’ll have to do some more reading regarding the Designare. 

Basically I’m looking for a board that will give me a Grammy with every note I write... or perhaps I’ll just settle for something that makes Cubase and UA run in perfect harmony! Haha


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## Gabriel S. (Mar 13, 2019)

jononotbono said:


> Thanks! Curious what you think of the Asus WS Sage /10gb mobo? It looks to me like a very good board. I’ll have to do some more reading regarding the Designare.
> 
> Basically I’m looking for a board that will give me a Grammy with every note I write... or perhaps I’ll just settle for something that makes Cubase and UA run in perfect harmony! Haha



Forget about the Grammy, it's too heavy and you can hurt your feet if it falls. Safety first 

I am checking that board, but it's for X processors (7900x, 9800x, etc) based on what I know. So far, it seems that the 9900k outperforms the X series (on a similar price range) and even the 7900x (which costs 2 times the 9900k...) in DAW applications and VI. Check what TechReport published about the 9900k.

Also 9900x doesn't seem (Geekbench) to give better benchmarks results than the 9900k with OC. And again the same, it's way more expensive...

IMHO the 9900k is definitely the best option out there for the money. Of course there are better ones but then we are talking about more than 2000 € per 1 CPU, like the 9980XE. And at the end, you are expending 4 times more money for just having 2 times the performance of the 9900k OC. So, I would rather build two 9900k systems, to be honest.

OUPS, I forgot that we were discussing about Thunderrrrrroooooolt  . I am checking what @Pablocrespo said.


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## Pablocrespo (Mar 13, 2019)

I think tb2 could be hassle free, maybe tb1 is only affected.
you should check this thread, a lot of people posting about it, ones with success stories and others with problems: 

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/mus...r-studio-pc-quot-thread-255.html#post13862870

last month or so we started talking about the designare.


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## Gabriel S. (Mar 13, 2019)

Pablocrespo said:


> I think tb2 could be hassle free, maybe tb1 is only affected.
> you should check this thread, a lot of people posting about it, ones with success stories and others with problems:
> 
> https://www.gearslutz.com/board/mus...r-studio-pc-quot-thread-255.html#post13862870
> ...



Yeah that's one of the sources of the info that I have to make my decision. I read many pages there.

In my case I don't care about T1. I don't have any thunderbolt device at the moment and if I buy something is going to be TB2 or TB3 probably. I'll manage.

I think at the end I'm going with the Aorus Pro as you suggested, and adding a Thunderbolt card later. Reason: I don't have a TB device so I prefer to save some money now, and also wait to see if it really works well or not before doing the extra investment.


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## Pablocrespo (Mar 13, 2019)

Yes, and you can choose alpine ridge or titan ridge with that board I think. I have it here in the box waiting for the 9900k


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## fraz (Mar 16, 2019)

This maybe wrong but I thought thunderbolt was backward compatible.

I have UAD Apollo 8 which has thunderbolt 2 connector -which is mini-display port connector.

Also I've got thunderbolt 2 cards (mini-display port connector)_and thunderbolt 3 cards_usb_c_connector

There is an Apple adapter which I've got which will convert th2 > th3 or vice versa__with contingency for mini-display port__&_usb_type_c

>>>possible ??? - one of the thunderbolt software driver releases (eg_version_17.xxx.xxx)_may not support_thunderbolt 1 devices ???? - usually there is a read me in the release for the different versions of thunderbolt software__

I've got versions __15.xxx.xxx & 16.xxx.xxx & 17.xxx.xxx

Sometimes some experiment is needed >>> I post these for consideration and general helpfulness!


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## fraz (Mar 16, 2019)

The older relative of the Z390 Designare which was made for the i7 7700K (4 core)

https://www.gigabyte.com/Motherboard/GA-Z170X-Gaming-7-rev-10#ov


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