# Comparing Synchron Strings Pro to other flagship libraries



## Akarin (Oct 29, 2020)

Hey all. You all love a strings library comparison, right? So, let's see how VSL Synchron Strings Pro compares to other flagship libraries (SSS, CSS, Areia & Afflatus) and share your thoughts!



00:00 Introduction
01:04 Libraries compared
01:36 Overview
02:14 Legato flautando
02:48 Comparison process
03:45 Block chords - VSL Synchron Strings Pro
04:23 Block chords - Spitfire Symphonic Strings
05:04 Block chords - Audio Imperia Areia
05:44 Block chords - Cinematic Studio Strings
06:24 Block chords - Strezov Sampling Afflatus
07:24 Legato theme - VSL Synchron Strings Pro
07:47 Legato theme - Spitfire Symphonic Strings
08:26 Legato theme - Audio Imperia Areia
09:03 Legato theme - Cinematic Studio Strings
09:41 Legato theme - Strezov Sampling Afflatus
10:19 Agility test - VSL Synchron Strings Pro
10:46 Agility test - Spitfire Symphonic Strings
11:06 Agility test - Audio Imperia Areia
11:27 Agility test - Cinematic Studio Strings
11:48 Agility test - Strezov Sampling Afflatus
12:18 Short articulations - VSL Synchron Strings Pro
12:48 Short articulations - Spitfire Symphonic Strings
13:13 Short articulations - Audio Imperia Areia
13:37 Short articulations - Cinematic Studio Strings
14:03 Short articulations - Strezov Sampling Afflatus
14:30 Conclusion


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## Nemoy (Oct 29, 2020)

Thank you, Nico. Really enjoy watching this and your series of comparison videos.


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## Akarin (Oct 29, 2020)

Nemoy said:


> Thank you, Nico. Really enjoy watching this and your series of comparison videos.



Thanks! Although, I think that I'm done for a while with comparison videos. I'll get back to posting some tips and tricks.


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## muziksculp (Oct 29, 2020)

@Akarin ,

Thanks for the comparison video. 

VSL Synchron Strings Pro (full) is my favorite Strings library at this time, and I have many to choose from. imho. it is the best sounding Large Section Strings library VSL has ever developed, and the best one I have used so far. 

It's my go to Strings Library now. 

Well Done VSL


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## Akarin (Oct 29, 2020)

muziksculp said:


> @Akarin ,
> 
> Thanks for the comparison video.
> 
> ...



Truth be told, I've never been a big fan of the VSL sound (except for Appassionata) as I find it too clinical, even dead sometimes. But these Synchron Strings Pro are different. It feels like a new direction in their product line and I know I'll be using them (I have 63 strings libraries...). Now, if this COVID crap could just go away and they could release a Synchron Woodwinds Pro, I'd be very happy.


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## muziksculp (Oct 29, 2020)

Akarin said:


> Truth be told, I've never been a big fan of the VSL sound (except for Appassionata) as I find it too clinical, even dead sometimes. But these Synchron Strings Pro are different. It feels like a new direction in their product line and I know I'll be using them (I have 63 strings libraries...). Now, if this COVID crap could just go away and they could release a Synchron Woodwinds Pro, I'd be very happy.




I'm looking forward to see them release more Synchron Libraries (Not Synchronized). using the same know how/techniques they used in Synchron Strings Pro. They surely did something right this time around. 

i.e. Chamber Strings Pro, Solo Strings Pro, Woodwinds Pro, Brass Pro, Sordino Strings Pro, Appassionata Strings. All new recordings in Synchron Stage. 

Yes, the COVID situation is not helping. The sooner it goes away, the better we will all be.


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## JonS (Oct 29, 2020)

Akarin said:


> Hey all. You all love a strings library comparison, right? So, let's see how VSL Synchron Strings Pro compares to other flagship libraries (SSS, CSS, Areia & Afflatus) and share your thoughts!
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Areia does not sound good to me at all in any articulation, so I don't know what your HAL9000 is talking about. Synchron Strings Pro sounds good, probably the best of all of these overall. CSS did not sound great in this test. Afflatus sounded good, almost the best on block chords and legato but does not sound good on short notes at all. SSS sounds the most beautiful but is a little muddy for block chords and not great on short articulations. VSL Synchron Strings I is better than all of these IMHO. Good test!!


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## hannawald5 (Oct 30, 2020)

Many thanks for the video. From the video I have SSS, CSS and Synchron and this video convinced me that those are enough (for now at least). I liked Afflatus long notes (legato and block) but I have found that layering Spitfire Symphonic with Synchron Pro works very well there if I want the lush sound along with more definition as well.

I did not like Areia at all compared to the others except for - which you noted as well - the runs. But I do own Jaeger and for those hybrid type of situations the strings there are excellent. I can only assume that Areia with its additions would be an upgrade to it. But Jaeger is good enough for me.

From originally not going to buy Synchron Pro at all but thinking that if I don't like it I have 14 days to evaluate it to now it being one of my favourite strings for most situations. So well done with the 14 days return, I suppose. Otherwise I wouldn't have bought it.


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## tf-drone (Oct 30, 2020)

Hello Nico,

thanks very much for the video! The VSL would be my favourite, follwowed by CSS and SASS. Pitily YT provides only 128k audio, but it is enough for an impression. VSl has the clearest and most balanced tone IMHO.


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## Kevinside (Oct 30, 2020)

areia sounds totally strange in this whole test. the legato of sss sounds so "not connected"...I love the shorts and runs of syspro. css does a good job in all disciplines except the runs. areia sounds awful...
Aflatus sounds good, except the shorts...Its interesting, that syspro sounds very bright in comparsion to sss,css,aflatus...


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## Markrs (Oct 30, 2020)

Most of them sounded okay for the block chords, though I thought SSpro was the best. SSpro sounded great for the runs, Areia sounded very synth like to me, which is what I felt about that sound in general, the rest were okayish. On the shorts I felt only SSpro was good, SASS and CSS were terrible, Afflatus okay, Areia again was agile but very synthetic.

For me the easy winner was SSpro. Note that with different sample midi maybe the results would be different but I felt it tested common usage of the libraries. I really didn't like CSS, SASS and Areia and Afflatus is too expensive. 

Even though I really liked SSpro I'm not ready to commit to VSL libraries as they are not cheap in the long run. I will stick with EWHO for now and see what EWHO Opus brings


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## pmountford (Oct 30, 2020)

Thanks for this. I took Nico's advice and purchased. Although to be fair, because I'm cheep, I waited until Best Service's Halloween promotion to get another £20 off...


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## AndyP (Oct 30, 2020)

For slow legatos Areia is unfortunately almost hard to use. The transition from legato to sustain still has that clearly audible drop in the loudness which makes it start to wobble. Too bad, that's actually the only thing that bothers me about Areia.


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## Oliver (Oct 30, 2020)

which proves, that VSL is ahead of the game!
I enjoy this library!


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## ysnyvz (Oct 30, 2020)

While having many other strings libraries, I have been going back and forth with Synchron Strings Pro to decide since its release. Listened all demos and videos. At first I couldn't believe it. Because:
- It doesn't sound like pads at legato passages like most other libraries (some people think it's cinematic, I disagree)
- Natural sound (woody and bright instead of creamy like spitfire libraries)
- Agile enough to play runs, trills and ornaments (some libraries can only walk, some can run a little bit, seems like this one can do parkours)
- Roomy but not too wet
- Consistent and wide variaty of articulations
- I don't like silent stage libraries of VSL but this one looks very different

I couldn't resist anymore, so I bought standard version before the end of intro price. It's my first VSL library. Downloading now. I hope it will be my last symphonic strings purchase.
Your video was helpful. Thanks.


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## Akarin (Oct 30, 2020)

JonS said:


> SSS sounds the most beautiful but is a little muddy for block chords and not great on short articulations.



SSS indeed has this huge sound but sacrifices definition. That's why I usually layer it with SCS or SsS. But that's not a single lib anymore, so more work 



hannawald5 said:


> I have found that layering Spitfire Symphonic with Synchron Pro works very well there if I want the lush sound along with more definition as well.



Ha! This is exactly what I'm testing out at the moment. So far, I like the result.



tf-drone said:


> VSl has the clearest and most balanced tone IMHO.



Out of the box, it is the best sounding lib in the test, yes. Now, with a bit of work, I think that SSS still has the edge.



Kevinside said:


> Its interesting, that syspro sounds very bright in comparsion to sss,css,aflatus...



Actually, it's a little bit too bright for my taste but nothing that a dip at around 3kHz can't fix 



Markrs said:


> I will stick with EWHO for now and see what EWHO Opus brings



I really, really wonder what Opus will bring to the table. My hunch is that it will use the same samples, repackaged inside a better player.



pmountford said:


> Thanks for this. I took Nico's advice and purchased. Although to be fair, because I'm cheep, I waited until Best Service's Halloween promotion to get another £20 off...



20 quids is 20 quids! Didn't know that you could stack the intro pricing with BestService discount!



AndyP said:


> For slow legatos Areia is unfortunately almost hard to use. The transition from legato to sustain still has that clearly audible drop in the loudness which makes it start to wobble. Too bad, that's actually the only thing that bothers me about Areia.



Same. I know that some people are not so sensitive about it (like others don't hear phasing) but I clearly hear this wobbling. Layering it with another lib (to keep the definition and the tone) usually takes care of that.



Oliver said:


> which proves, that VSL is ahead of the game!
> I enjoy this library!



I really like the direction taken by this new Synchron line. Yet, I've also read quite a lot of comments of people absolutely hating the tone. It works for me, will use it


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## youngpokie (Oct 30, 2020)

Markrs said:


> I will stick with EWHO for now and see what EWHO Opus brings



I am so curious how EWQLHO might stack up against this line up (read an opinion that it still sounds better than BBCSO + big update coming soon)....

@Akarin?

many thanks


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## Eric G (Oct 30, 2020)

Akarin said:


> in their product line and I know I'll be using them (I have 63 strings libraries...)


63 string libraries. Really!?? That's it. This is disqualifying as far as I am concerned.


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## Akarin (Oct 30, 2020)

youngpokie said:


> I am so curious how EWQLHO might stack up against this line up (read an opinion that it still sounds better than BBCSO + big update coming soon)....
> 
> @Akarin?
> 
> many thanks



I can't really say if it sounds better. It's subjective. I've heard awesome pieces both with EWHO and BBCSO.




gst98 said:


> Synchron Pro sound great here. Really love the spiccatos it has, and its become my go to for extended articulations. I still don't think the longs can be beaten on Hollywood Strings. They sound close in tone to SSS (although drier) but they are brighter and clearer in the mix



I'm definitely not a fan of the EWHO basses. Brittle and harsh.


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## szczaw (Oct 30, 2020)

Nice. VSL is what I like best. I think libs with softer, more classical sound would be better fit for comparisons with VSL. Spitfire chamber strings, Berlin strings, BBC is what comes to mind.


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## Akarin (Oct 30, 2020)

szczaw said:


> Nice. VSL is what I like best. I think libs with softer, more classical sound would be better fit for comparisons with VSL. Spitfire chamber strings, Berlin strings, BBC is what comes to mind.



I don't think it would make much sense to compare a library with 4 first violins to one that has 14


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## szczaw (Oct 30, 2020)

Akarin said:


> I don't think it would make much sense to compare a library with 4 first violins to one that has 14



It's not the size that matters


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## hazza (Oct 30, 2020)

Thanks so much OP for doing this, super helpful.

I have one burning question, if anyone can help: which of these libraries offer control over vibrato? This why I love SCS, but I'm in the market for a bigger section library. Have played with a friend's Afflatus, sounds great but no vib control.


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## Beans (Oct 30, 2020)

hazza said:


> I have one burning question, if anyone can help: which of these libraries offer control over vibrato?



Synchron Strings Pro offers crossfading between techniques into vibrato, along with two intensities of vibrato (that can fade into one another). You could, for example, crossfade from no vibrato, to regular vibrato, to molto vibrato using a single CC.


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## hazza (Oct 30, 2020)

Beans said:


> Synchron Strings Pro offers crossfading between techniques into vibrato, along with two intensities of vibrato (that can fade into one another). You could, for example, crossfade from no vibrato, to regular vibrato, to molto vibrato using a single CC.


Thanks, yes as an Appassionata owner I was fully expecting SSP to cover this, which makes it highly appealing. But wondering about alternative options too?


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## lettucehat (Oct 30, 2020)

So this new Synchron Strings Pro is really that much cheaper than the existing Synchron Strings I? Comparing the two it seems like the newer one has just as much if not more content, plus sounds better?


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Oct 30, 2020)

Anyone considering VSL should at least be aware of their dongle policy.


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## artomatic (Oct 30, 2020)

Surprisingly, Afflatus sounded great to me.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Oct 30, 2020)

@Akarin How did you find Synchron Strings' dynamic range given it has fewer dynamic layers than the other libraries you compared it against? I'm still not entirely clear what VSL's goal was with this library given it seems similar to SS1 in some ways, more in a couple of ways, but then has less dynamic layers / RRs.


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## pinki (Oct 30, 2020)

hbjdk said:


> Anyone considering VSL should at least be aware of their dongle policy.



For me on balance their demo and resale policy offset the dongle policy, but maybe that’s for another thread?


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## Beans (Oct 30, 2020)

pinki said:


> For me on balance their demo and resale policy offset the dongle policy, but maybe that’s for another thread?



Agreed on the offset.

I don't get why people keep bringing up the dongle in what seems like every VSL post. I think the lack of downloadable demos, returns, and reselling is all bad practice by other developers, but I don't interrupt every Spitfire or Orchestral Tools thread to mention the ones they don't offer.

Furthermore, why the desire to warn people about something that appears multiple times in the VSL checkout process? It pops up *immediately* once you add something to cart. It's not hidden in the slightest. I would expect that other retailers also clearly call it out.


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## SlHarder (Oct 30, 2020)

Beans said:


> don't get why people keep bringing up the dongle


"To dongle or not to dongle, that is the question."

I agree with you. I've tried VSL 30 day demos, then purchased or not, and once used their withdrawal policy to upgrade to a pro product. I'm very satisfied with all the VSL products I own. I cannot say the same for a few other libraries which I had to buy without a try.


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## muziksculp (Oct 30, 2020)

Regarding VSL products needing a dongle, well Yes, they do, and many users here that use Cubase as their DAW use the same dongle, it's the Steinberg e-licenser dongle, so if you already use Cubase, you don't need another dongle.


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## heisenberg (Oct 30, 2020)

Nico, your video comparison is the bomb. Man that was good! 

But really the voice, was that your assistant, Bob?!! haha. I was splitting my sides during the whole presentation.

Some of the comparisons were surprising and it seemed the better overall some of the libraries were that those ones when they were off, were REALLY off.

Most informative and funny thing I have seen in a while. Most thankful!!


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## José Herring (Oct 30, 2020)

youngpokie said:


> I am so curious how EWQLHO might stack up against this line up (read an opinion that it still sounds better than BBCSO + big update coming soon)....
> 
> @Akarin?
> 
> many thanks


They work well together. I like both libraries A LOT. My only complaint about BBCSO is that boy is it British sounding. Kind of subdued in a way, but makes for a great balanced orchestra.

EWHO is vibrant. Bright sounding actually. A LOT dryer and way move expressivo style sampling. Way more articulations but you have to work really hard at it. Way harder than with BBCSO for the same music but EWHO is capable of doing a whole lot more.

HOOPUS imo will bring the full promise of EWHO to fruition. The library was way ahead of its time and I honestly think they poured their heart and soul into the library and made it as best as it could be done at the time. HOOPUS will also bring a lot of new samples as well. 

But, as it stands now EWHO after 10 years as is, is still a top contender and every shootout I've heard hasn't disabused me of that idea.


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## Yogevs (Oct 31, 2020)

Complaints complaints - I know...

BUT - I wish when comparing to Areia you would have used the Classic mix instead of the Modern (which sounds a lot more synthy to my ears).


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## Virtuoso (Oct 31, 2020)

Beans said:


> Furthermore, why the desire to warn people about something that appears multiple times in the VSL checkout process? It pops up *immediately* once you add something to cart. It's not hidden in the slightest. I would expect that other retailers also clearly call it out.


He mentions the dongle 'policy', so I expect he's talking not about the _requirement_ for a dongle, but what VSL's policy is if your dongle is _stolen, lost or damaged_.

In the first two cases, you will need to rebuy your licences - VSL offers a 50% discount. This is what scares most people. VSL will defend this on the basis that it should be covered by your insurance.

If the dongle is damaged and out of warranty (2 years I think, which covers free replacements for the licences and dongle), it must be returned to VSL so that they can verify the damage. They will replace your licences at a cost of 20 Euros each.



VSL Support said:


> if a key get's lost, everybody who finds this key has unrestricted acces to the licenses. Free replacement licenses would harm our company, we simply can't afford such a solution. We believe, taking care of the key is nothing but self-responsibility.



I really don't buy this argument. Anyone who burgles my house is unlikely to be targeting my licences of orchestral plugins and won't even know what the little blue USB stick does, or how many thousands of dollars' investment it represents, so it's not plausible that VSL would be 'losing a sale' if they simply replaced the stolen licences. Plus, you are able to buy the 'Vienna Protection Plan' for 70 Euros, which doesn't solve VSL's concern about their business being harmed by rogue stolen eLicensers out in the wild. (NB if you actually need to _use_ the Protection Plan, guess what..? Yes, you have to buy another!)

If they had put as much thought and care into the copy protection as they did the software and instruments, they would allow affected customers to simply disable stolen/lost licences remotely themselves, taking all of the burden off their support department. Yes, you may need to be online occasionally, but FFS, this is 2020!

On a more positive note, I did hear a while ago that Steinberg were, in the longer term, planning a move away from eLicenser, so I imagine/hope that VSL would follow suit if it happens.


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## Nuno (Oct 31, 2020)

I am using the same dongle for 7 years already. Should i replace it with a new one to avoid a disaster?


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## Virtuoso (Oct 31, 2020)

Nuno said:


> I am using the same dongle for 7 years already. Should i replace it with a new one to avoid a disaster?


If you buy a new eLicenser every 2 years and move your VSL licences onto it, you are covered against damage, but you would need another plan (like the VPP) for loss or theft.


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## Michael Antrum (Oct 31, 2020)

Welcome to the 75th Quarterly Vi-Control VSL Dongle controversy extravaganza !

This event, which is held approximately every three months or so, gives everyone the opportunity of copying and pasting their best comments from previous events into a completely new thread.

This time round, some of the highlights will include:

1) How VSL’s policy has contributed to climate change....
2) Dongles are evil
3) If only they would.....
4) I shouldn’t have to buy insurance...
5) Is it Steinberg‘s fault or not ?
6) I’m never, ever, ever, going to buy anything from VSL because.....

and new, for the first time, our new category....

7) Burn them !

Don’t forget to get you pop-corn order in !


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## pinki (Oct 31, 2020)

Nuno said:


> I am using the same dongle for 7 years already. Should i replace it with a new one to avoid a disaster?



Yes, it’s a good idea to swop it out every few years.


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## pinki (Oct 31, 2020)

Michael Antrum said:


> Welcome to the 75th Quarterly Vi-Control VSL Dongle controversy extravaganza !
> 
> This event, which is held approximately every three months or so, gives everyone the opportunity of copying and pasting their best comments from previous events into a completely new thread.
> 
> ...


😂😂😂😂😂😂

I purchased SSP and I am, for the first time, delighted with a string library.


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## Jimmy Hellfire (Oct 31, 2020)

I wish people would stop derailing every VSL thread with their dongle bullshit paranoia. Perhaps Mike should introduce that as a forum rule. I'm sure something can be done for "Spitifre marketing mooh" as well.


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## ptram (Oct 31, 2020)

Virtuoso said:


> VSL will defend this on the basis that it should be covered by your insurance.



Not personally happy of the dongle, its abysmal management software, the additional costs involved - but they solved the impossible mission to find an insurance covering the plastic key with their own insurance. Not particularly expensive, if you invested a lot in their libraries.

The protection plan also covers damaged keys, so there is no need to repurchase it every two years.

Paolo


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## ptram (Oct 31, 2020)

Michael Antrum said:


> 1) How VSL’s policy has contributed to climate change....



Burglars don't know what to do with a plastic key on which they can't write stolen hits, so the key is trashed away in the water, and fishes will die!

Paolo


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## Virtuoso (Oct 31, 2020)

Jimmy Hellfire said:


> I wish people would stop derailing every VSL thread with their dongle bullshit paranoia.


Well, if we are 'comparing Synchron Pro to other flagship libraries', only one of those requires a paranoia-inducing bullshit dongle! 

Back on topic, Synchron Strings Pro is easily my favorite of the far-too-many that I own for sound character/quality, playability and lack of irritating bugs/quirks. And the player is far ahead of the competition. Looking forward to seeing how the Synchron range develops.


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## Nuno (Oct 31, 2020)

Ok, you conviced me to buy a new dongle. Thank you!

On topic. I love Synchron Strings Pro . I was reluctant to buy it after listenning to some bad examples on youtube but i am glad i made this purchase, the best i made in years.
From the video posted, it really shines above others, its not perfect but balanced compared to others. 
I still like very much the tone of SSS, the room gives it that cinematic quaility that we love in Spitfire. I didn t like Areia, too bright and processed. CSS too dark to my taste. Afflatus didnt like because, to my ears it sounds less defined, vintage, and narrow stereo width.


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## Arbee (Oct 31, 2020)

On a blind test I'd have picked Strezov Afflatus as the clear overall winner in this contest, for sound and for definition.


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## Jimmy Hellfire (Oct 31, 2020)

Virtuoso said:


> Well, if we are 'comparing Synchron Pro to other flagship libraries', only one of those requires a paranoia-inducing bullshit dongle!



At least I contributed to the topic instead of ... oh wait.


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Oct 31, 2020)

On topic: 

Can someone post an example of SSP where the higher notes have been tamed a bit with EQ?

I like the sound of the library, just not the high register of the violins. It’s very bright IMO.


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## pinki (Oct 31, 2020)

That brightness I prefer to have available and tame myself as opposed to CSS which is the opposite end of the spectrum.


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## Noeticus (Oct 31, 2020)

Thanks for your huge efforts here Akarin. 

Does anyone here know if the issues I heard about years ago regarding problems with the VSL "Synchron Strings 1" library were ever fixed?

Or is the "Synchron Strings 1" library roughly the same now as when it first came out?


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## Casiquire (Oct 31, 2020)

I love your videos. One thing that really stood out to me is the weird bump Areia has after every note. Is that normal? Is something going on there? The shorts sounded good to me though.




ALTM said:


> So this new Synchron Strings Pro is really that much cheaper than the existing Synchron Strings I? Comparing the two it seems like the newer one has just as much if not more content, plus sounds better?


Synchron Strings 1 has so many more dynamic layers in the longs, and...I think that's really about all that the users is both libraries miss from SS1. SSP really does seem to be a good deal. On the SS1 site, under "Sample Content", there's a button to compare articulations directly.


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## ptram (Oct 31, 2020)

Noeticus said:


> Does anyone here know if the issues I heard about years ago regarding problems with the VSL "Synchron Strings 1" library were ever fixed?



Someone correct me, if I’m wrong, but I seem to understand that SS1's legato was considered too weak. VSL then released new legato patches with different types of legato, fixing the initial issues.

In SSP, legato sounds more evident (so much to be too much for some), therefore being the opposite of SS1.

Paolo


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## ALittleNightMusic (Oct 31, 2020)

Casiquire said:


> I love your videos. One thing that really stood out to me is the weird bump Areia has after every note. Is that normal? Is something going on there?



Yes that is how Nucleus is too. AI introduced a knob to help reduce it but it is still present in both libraries. I personally find their legatos quite poor and sound synthy (which is a useful tone in certain contexts).


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## Akarin (Oct 31, 2020)

hazza said:


> Thanks so much OP for doing this, super helpful.
> 
> I have one burning question, if anyone can help: which of these libraries offer control over vibrato? This why I love SCS, but I'm in the market for a bigger section library. Have played with a friend's Afflatus, sounds great but no vib control.



SSP does. And so do Areia and CSS. SSS is on/off and Afflatus has none.




ALittleNightMusic said:


> @Akarin How did you find Synchron Strings' dynamic range given it has fewer dynamic layers than the other libraries you compared it against? I'm still not entirely clear what VSL's goal was with this library given it seems similar to SS1 in some ways, more in a couple of ways, but then has less dynamic layers / RRs.



I'm never too bothered with tech specs and numbers. I just can tell if I like the sound of something or not. I've heard libs with tons of layers sounding like shit and some with only one feeling as smooth as a baby seal (Performance Samples, for example). So far, I really like the dynamic range. 




heisenberg said:


> Nico, your video comparison is the bomb. Man that was good!
> 
> But really the voice, was that your assistant, Bob?!! haha. I was splitting my sides during the whole presentation.
> 
> ...



Thanks! Yeah... Bob is quite something. I was a bit reluctant to use it after I made it, but it seems that people are warming to it. I'm currently working on an update.



Virtuoso said:


> Well, if we are 'comparing Synchron Pro to other flagship libraries', only one of those requires a paranoia-inducing bullshit dongle!
> 
> Back on topic, Synchron Strings Pro is easily my favorite of the far-too-many that I own for sound character/quality, playability and lack of irritating bugs/quirks. And the player is far ahead of the competition. Looking forward to seeing how the Synchron range develops.



I didn't mention the player in the video but yes, as a player (not as a sampler), it's way better than Kontakt and can't even be compared with the other attempts at proprietary players. These Austrians know how to code!




Noeticus said:


> Thanks for your huge efforts here Akarin.
> 
> Does anyone here know if the issues I heard about years ago regarding problems with the VSL "Synchron Strings 1" library were ever fixed?
> 
> Or is the "Synchron Strings 1" library roughly the same now as when it first came out?



You're welcome. I enjoy doing these comparisons. I don't know about the problems of SS1 as I don't have them and was not a VSL customer when they were released.


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## Hendrixon (Oct 31, 2020)

First of all, thanks AGAIN for another great video 

But Its a problem to make decisions with comparison videos like this one...
Here it seems that SSP sound easily the best, but for example I know SSS and the mics mix used here makes it too woofy, way too much room. a better mix won't make it sound miles different, but it will be better, and a tiny touch of eq will make it super beautiful.

Same goes for CSS, I know that lib inside out, what every mic of every instrument does.
I can eq CSS - on per mic - to get any sound I want, or to mimic the sound of almost any other library. this of course can be done to any library (though not always), but what can't be done is make any other library's legato behave and sound like CSS's legato.

So what does it tell me that I thought SSP sounded the best here? very confusing...

Anyway regardless I thought it sounded good, and this video got me thinking about SSP, which compared to AR1 seems like a steal

But thanks to the "dongle police", they managed to scare me straight!
Theft? loss? damage? insurance? international mail back and forth? new key every two years?!

Sorry, with my ADD I have enough headache to remember where I left my car keys last night (or was it this morning, after the coffee? which I think was about to ran out so I think I walked to the door, to go get some from the store, and that's where I found my best guitar pick that I lost just yesterday, right there on the floor, so I jumped to my music room to put it there, and that's when I saw my Les Paul that I left last night in the middle of replacing strings because I was tired, so I quickly finished doing that... but then on tuning I broke the high E... and I didn't have a spare!!!... well this was more urgent then extra coffee so I had to shave because I can't go out like this, right?... but I hate my shaver so finally I went online to order a new one... and that's when I saw the email from work, which I now had to answer... but wait, I was planning to go somewhere... so emmm.... WHERE ARE MY DAMN KEYS?!
and then the phone rang, its my brother, asks me "hey bro so when do you need your car back?")


So, does SSP sounds good? ehhh not good enough


----------



## SlHarder (Oct 31, 2020)

Akarin said:


> Bob is quite something. I was a bit reluctant to use it after I made it, but it seems that people are warming to it. I'm currently working on an update.


Maybe Bob^2 can do a comparison of all the different N libraries?


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## Raphioli (Oct 31, 2020)

I understand the frustration with their dongle policy.
I'm personally ok with dongles themselves, but am frustrated with policies though.
Hence the only VSL product I own is VEPro. (luckily, haven't damaged or lost a key yet)

But with that said, SSPro does sound good. I especially like how the cello sounds.
I also like the clarity of what their library includes (number of dynamic layers included, etc).
And I also like how they differentiate the Standard and Extended library.
Unlike some of their previous products, you still get a full set of articulations with the Standard edition which is really great, just less mics, which is personally a huge plus. (some of their older libraries had articulations exclusive to their Extended libraries)


----------



## Sovereign (Nov 1, 2020)

Noeticus said:


> But Its a problem to make decisions with comparison videos like this one...
> Here it seems that SSP sound easily the best, but for example I know SSS and the mics mix used here makes it too woofy, way too much room. a better mix won't make it sound miles different, but it will be better, and a tiny touch of eq will make it super beautiful.
> 
> Same goes for CSS, I know that lib inside out, what every mic of every instrument does.
> I can eq CSS - on per mic - to get any sound I want, or to mimic the sound of almost any other library. this of course can be done to any library (though not always), but what can't be done is make any other library's legato behave and sound like CSS's legato.


Couldn't agree more. I personally returned Synchron Strings Pro after the two-week trial, despite only costing me less than 120 bucks. Not saying it's bad. It’s certainly better than the original (updated) Synchron Strings 1 and serviceable. But the regular legatos are still only so-so, the reduced velocity layers (to me) are noticeable, and I just don’t like the overall sound. No amount of EQ-ing I tried gave that rounded, lush cinematic sound. This might be less an issue for those who desire a more classical sound. 

Comparisons like these can be quite deceptive. In the video I can see Akarin used the regular CSS legato for the runs. But it's not recommended to use the regular legato articulation for runs at all, the marcato legato articulation is meant for fast runs. It’s even right there in the manual, page 6. So I’m not sure Akarin is being fair when he says he’s done everything to compensate for specifics and adjusted the editing as best as he could, especially since he has an admitted dislike on his part for CSS.

In the end the proof is in the pudding, and these are not the best examples to make a decision on, especially since any sort of real reference is absent. Pick a few bars from well-known compositions (be they classical or film music) instead and see how close one can get to the original. And that's where SSP failed me immediately. I can get far easier and way better sounding results with CSS.


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## Kevinside (Nov 1, 2020)

but we all think AI Areia is... This library sounds so synthetic...shorts longs and legato...
and what is this volume curiosity in the Areia examples... is this failed programming...
it sounds really awkward...
But this is my opinion...what do you think...

And at last SASS fails in the legato line... again false programming?...


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## Sovereign (Nov 1, 2020)

Kevinside said:


> but we all think AI Areia is... This library sounds so synthetic...shorts longs and legato...
> and what is this volume curiosity in the Areia examples... is this failed programming...
> it sounds really awkward...
> But this is my opinion...what do you think...


Jaeger and Areia have some issues, it's not perfect. The legato bump is due to intervals that were played too fast. AI should IMO record new intervals, let the players play slower transitions to get that smooth sound. There are also some programming issues, and their new engine runs inefficiently compared to the one used in the old V1.2 Jaeger. I don't like the modern mix, perhaps that's your issue with it sounding synthetic? I also don't like the examples Akarin used here personally. Perhaps check out my Spiderman mockup which is exclusively Jaeger strings and brass, AI strings can sound quite good when played/programmed properly.


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## Hendrixon (Nov 1, 2020)

To my ears all AI strings have the same legato, its like they have a recording process and script they developed since they started making sample libraries, and all they do over the years is copy/paste.

The problem is that their legato is not good, which ruins their efforts to get good samples recordings.
I was shocked/disappointed when Areia came out...


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## Akarin (Nov 1, 2020)

Sovereign said:


> In the video I can see Akarin used the regular CSS legato for the runs. But it's not recommended to use the regular legato articulation for runs at all, the marcato legato articulation is meant for fast runs. It’s even right there in the manual, page 6.



Thanks for pointing this out. I've corrected it for the sake of transparency:


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## Sovereign (Nov 1, 2020)

Hendrixon said:


> To my ears all AI strings have the same legato, its like they have a recording process and script they developed since they started making sample libraries, and all they do over the years is copy/paste.
> 
> The problem is that their legato is not good, which ruins their efforts to get good samples recordings.
> I was shocked/disappointed when Areia came out...


Yeah, that disappointed me too. They did alter the scripts though with Areia, but the legato got in fact worse (especially noticeable on the violins). There's now also a strange volume dip after playing an interval, not just the 'bump' that was there before in Jaeger.


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## Paul Jelfs (Nov 1, 2020)

Sorry to kinda hijack the thread, but Akarin - you have VSL Synchron Pro yes? Can you tell me a bit more about how the poly legato is implemented in the Tutti patch - Is there a Voice limit, does it stand up on its own, how does it work with all the various types of legato etc ? 

There is very little about this feature online I can find, and that would be a main interest to me, to get realistic 5 part strings down with one patch - If the tutti poly legato is any good


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## Akarin (Nov 1, 2020)

Paul Jelfs said:


> Sorry to kinda hijack the thread, but Akarin - you have VSL Synchron Pro yes? Can you tell me a bit more about how the poly legato is implemented in the Tutti patch - Is there a Voice limit, does it stand up on its own, how does it work with all the various types of legato etc ?
> 
> There is very little about this feature online I can find, and that would be a main interest to me, to get realistic 5 part strings down with one patch - If the tutti poly legato is any good



This video definitely shows the power of the polylegato more than I could:


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## Paul Jelfs (Nov 1, 2020)

Akarin said:


> This video definitely shows the power of the polylegato more than I could:



Yes! That is the only video I could find - and i was like - Wow ! Surely this is too good to be true. 

Is he really only using 1 Patch ? 

I notice they only really demo the Poly Legato (Longs) at really Soft / Low CC values - This might be just because the piece is written that way, or is because they are strongest at this point. 

But I presume from your high regard for the library you think the Tutti /Combo Patches are really good ?


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## Akarin (Nov 1, 2020)

Paul Jelfs said:


> Yes! That is the only video I could find - and i was like - Wow ! Surely this is too good to be true.
> 
> Is he really only using 1 Patch ?
> 
> ...



As far as poly legato goes, only two libraries really impress me: Synchron Strings Pro and Venice Modern Strings. Who knows what Century Strings 2.0 will bring in that regard.


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## Hendrixon (Nov 1, 2020)

Nico thanks again for doing all this.
Much appreciated

Btw how do you find Venice Modern Strings?
It sound seems to me kinda between CSS and SCS, but have no idea how it performs and behaves.
I just remember someone here wrote that he had issues and fluffy promised to fix this "when they will have time" (or something along that line).

Does it have a used place in your template or does it collect binary dust?


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## Ashermusic (Nov 1, 2020)

Hendrixon said:


> Nico thanks again for doing all this.
> Much appreciated
> 
> Btw how do you find Venice Modern Strings?
> ...



Thank you for reminding me, I tend to forget about Venice Modern Strings, which I reviewed very positively.


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## Timothy Schmidt (Nov 1, 2020)

Kevinside said:


> This library sounds so synthetic...shorts longs and legato...
> and what is this volume curiosity in the Areia examples... is this failed programming...
> it sounds really awkward...
> But this is my opinion...what do you think...





Sovereign said:


> AI strings can sound quite good when played/programmed properly.



Here's a bunch of string pieces on which I recently tested the sound and flexibility of Areia (BBCSO Core added in background for extra depth). I fit the samples to the music (as opposed to writing music to the samples) and found Areia quite passable for concert/"classical" use - and this was the modern mix. See Ursa Major for my main legato test.




There is indeed a bump in the violin legato samples, but it really only shows in exposed sections. Sustains work better for more drawn out passages anyway. I would also note that Nico did not have the sample start set at 250ms, which improves not just the legato bumps but the natural quality of all articulations, including the shorts.

- Timothy


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## Akarin (Nov 1, 2020)

Hendrixon said:


> Nico thanks again for doing all this.
> Much appreciated
> 
> Btw how do you find Venice Modern Strings?
> ...



I'm a huge fan of VMS. Yes, it sits perfectly between CSS and SCS but my major issue is that the basses don't go to C and it makes doubling a cello line difficult. Paolo mentionned that they'd add the missing notes in a future update. In the meantime, I often use them to double vlns I + II on SSS or CSS.



Timothy Schmidt said:


> Here's a bunch of string pieces on which I recently tested the sound and flexibility of Areia (BBCSO Core added in background for extra depth). I fit the samples to the music (as opposed to writing music to the samples) and found Areia quite passable for concert/"classical" use - and this was the modern mix.



Was this before or after the latest update?


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## Timothy Schmidt (Nov 1, 2020)

Akarin said:


> Was this before or after the latest update?


This was before, just installed the latest update a few days ago. So far, my observations of 1.0 still seem to hold true for 1.1. Sounds basically the same to me, which I guess is a bit disappointing as I was hoping their smoothness knob would decrease the violin legato bump more than it does.


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## Akarin (Nov 1, 2020)

Timothy Schmidt said:


> This was before, just installed the latest update a few days ago. So far, my observations of 1.0 still seem to hold true for 1.1. Sounds basically the same to me, which I guess is a bit disappointing as I was hoping their smoothness knob would decrease the violin legato bump more than it does.



And did you notice a volume drop at the beginning of a note since the update? It now gives me a wobbly sound and I wonder if I should reinstall the lib.


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## Kevinside (Nov 1, 2020)

this makes it so strange in your example. The volume drop... Is this normal?


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## Akarin (Nov 1, 2020)

Kevinside said:


> this makes it so strange in your example. The volume drop... Is this normal?



That's the thing... I have this each time I try to use Areia since the last update. Wondering if it's only me.


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## jaketanner (Nov 1, 2020)

Akarin said:


> SSP does. And so do Areia and CSS. SSS is on/off and Afflatus has none.


If not mistaken CSS is just on/off...the control part is in the dynamics...lower dynamics offer less vibrato than at higher dynamics...seems to be the case with many. But control? no...it's just on/off.


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Nov 1, 2020)

jaketanner said:


> If not mistaken CSS is just on/off...the control part is in the dynamics...lower dynamics offer less vibrato than at higher dynamics...seems to be the case with many. But control? no...it's just on/off.


I don't have CSS, but I found this a while back:



Nabeel Ansari
01/18/2017 at 9:44 PM
The vibrato is easily controllable on CC2. Put it slightly above 0 (say, 15-25), and the vibrato will be subdued under the nonvib sample. You shouldn’t go completely nonvib otherwise it no longer plays legato transitions.



Source:








Nabeel Ansari shares his Comparison of Cinematic Strings 2 vs Cinematic Studio Strings - Sample Library Review


Earlier this week I was checking out the demos of Cinematic Studio Strings (CSS). The new library sells from Cinematic Studios (for $399) makers of the popular Cinematic Strings 2 (CS2) library. The legato sounded smooth and the demos showed a lot of character. I especially liked how the...




www.samplelibraryreview.com


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## jaketanner (Nov 1, 2020)

hbjdk said:


> I don't have CSS, but I found this a while back:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


CS2 is totally different...CSS doesn't have an adjustment, I'm pretty certain that CC2 is just on or off...so not sure it qualifies as controllable. The only way to control the amount of vibrato in CSS is through the dynamics...


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## Timothy Schmidt (Nov 1, 2020)

Akarin said:


> And did you notice a volume drop at the beginning of a note since the update? It now gives me a wobbly sound and I wonder if I should reinstall the lib.



I tried sequencing the first half of your legato example on the violins: first all legato, then all Cubase legato (MIDI placed end to end but with no overlap), and then a mixture of both. Sample start at -250ms, dynamic range at 90%, everything else default. Does it sound better on my machine than yours? Either way, the wobbly transitions have always been there, and they are pretty much the only weakness I have found in Nucleus, too. I worked around them in 1.0 by layering sustains and using the transitions sparingly (especially in slower passages), and it sounds like I will continue to have to do so in 1.1. Not ideal, but it's not representative of the entire library, as the other sections sound a lot better. I think Sovereign is right that the only remedy at this point to record the intervals again to better match the smoother sustains.


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Nov 1, 2020)

jaketanner said:


> CS2 is totally different...CSS doesn't have an adjustment, I'm pretty certain that CC2 is just on or off...so not sure it qualifies as controllable. The only way to control the amount of vibrato in CSS is through the dynamics...


Ah ok, too bad.


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## Sovereign (Nov 1, 2020)

jaketanner said:


> CS2 is totally different...CSS doesn't have an adjustment, I'm pretty certain that CC2 is just on or off...so not sure it qualifies as controllable. The only way to control the amount of vibrato in CSS is through the dynamics...


No. You can control the amount of vibrato through cc.


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## jaketanner (Nov 1, 2020)

Sovereign said:


> No. You can control the amount of vibrato through cc.


in CSS? Are you absolutely sure? One of the biggest complaints is too much vibrato, if it were controllable no one would be complaining...it's just on or off...I will need to check again...because that would make it a lot easier to incorporate.


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## Sovereign (Nov 1, 2020)

jaketanner said:


> in CSS? Are you absolutely sure? One of the biggest complaints is too much vibrato, if it were controllable no one would be complaining...it's just on or off...I will need to check again...because that would make it a lot easier to incorporate.


100% but with a slight caveat, the first pulse of vibrato after playing an interval seems less affected. But it still sounds fine imo. Set the vibrato between 70 and 80 and give it a try.


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## jaketanner (Nov 1, 2020)

Sovereign said:


> 100% but with a slight caveat, the first pulse of vibrato after playing an interval seems less affected. But it still sounds fine imo. Set the vibrato between 70 and 80 and give it a try.


I will try it, but I am pretty sure what you are hearing is simply the Xfade into vibrato and non...and NOT different amounts of vibrato (at the same dynamic of course)....different dynamics alone will yield a different amount of vibrato...but if you set it to full dynamics, and adjust the CC2...I think it really is just a Fade between vib and non rather than what Spitfire does where it's abprupt. However...I will certainly check this later on.


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## AndyP (Nov 3, 2020)

Now that the Nashville Scorings Strings have been published I have listened to this comparison again. And I think I will jump on the Synchron Strings Pro Bus after all.

The clarity, variability, and sound of the SSP are very convincing and I like it more.
Also the possibilities and the great handling of the Synchron Player.

Actually I hadn't planned any other library except HOOPUS, but I think I won't be able to resist.

Thanks Akarin, this comparison was very helpful, albeit with a little delay!

There is still time until November 22nd.


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## Akarin (Nov 3, 2020)

AndyP said:


> Now that the Nashville Scorings Strings have been published I have listened to this comparison again. And I think I will jump on the Synchron Strings Pro Bus after all.
> 
> The clarity, variability, and sound of the SSP are very convincing and I like it more.
> Also the possibilities and the great handling of the Synchron Player.
> ...



Jump on it now! The intro price is ending today!


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## AndyP (Nov 3, 2020)

Akarin said:


> Jump on it now! The intro price is ending today!


Oh, on the Bestservice page it says that the intro prices are valid until November 22 !?!?!?!?!!?!


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## AndyP (Nov 3, 2020)

And on the VSL site the 3rd of November.


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## Manuel Stumpf (Nov 3, 2020)

AndyP said:


> Oh, on the Bestservice page it says that the intro prices are valid until November 22 !?!?!?!?!!?!


The other VSL sales on bestservice all ended 2nd November.
22nd November might either be a typo or a communication deviation between VSL and bestservice.

Right now it is still intro price both at VSL and bestservice.
Might change in the morning when both companies start working.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Nov 3, 2020)

AndyP said:


> Now that the Nashville Scorings Strings have been published I have listened to this comparison again. And I think I will jump on the Synchron Strings Pro Bus after all.
> 
> The clarity, variability, and sound of the SSP are very convincing and I like it more.
> Also the possibilities and the great handling of the Synchron Player.
> ...



I agree here! I listened to Synchron String Pro demos multiple times comparing with Nashville Scoring Strings and Performance Samples Vista and in both cases, very glad I went with SSPro. I think the tone is just fantastic - and way more articulations than either of those new entries.


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## Martin Tichy (Nov 3, 2020)

Tomorrow we're extending the introductory pricing of Synchron Strings Pro to November 22. 
Cheers, Martin/VSL


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## JeeTee (Nov 4, 2020)

These Synchron Strings do sound very good. Which got me thinking - how WOULD EW Hollywood Strings handle this (it's one the string libs I own)?
Well, after quite a lot more work than I expected, I now know.

Thought I'd share the results in case there was interest!


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## muziksculp (Nov 4, 2020)

JeeTee said:


> These Synchron Strings do sound very good.



Yes, indeed they sound wonderful. I find the EWHS, lacking in the acoustics dept. but they do sound pretty good for their age, they can be further improved with some creative use of Reverb. Also excited about the upcoming release of Hoopus. 

The *Synchron Stage* has a beautiful sound. This is one of the reasons I wish to see more VSL Synchron Libraries released (not Synchron-ized) to complete the Synchron Orchestra. 

I think VSL's know how at this time shows clearly in Synchron Strings Pro, if they stick to the same formula for the rest of the orchestral sections, they will have an amazing Synchron Orchestral Library. 

Can't wait until they release the next big Synchron Library, I wonder what it's going to be ? More Strings ? or Synchron Woodwinds Pro, or Synch. Brass Pro ?


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## Akarin (Nov 4, 2020)

JeeTee said:


> These Synchron Strings do sound very good. Which got me thinking - how WOULD EW Hollywood Strings handle this (it's one the string libs I own)?
> Well, after quite a lot more work than I expected, I now know.
> 
> Thought I'd share the results in case there was interest!



Thanks for doing this!

Did you get the MIDI from composingtips?


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## muziksculp (Nov 4, 2020)

Personally, I think the whole Synchron-ized Libraries VSL has released, and is possibly still releasing, is a waste of time. Others might differ about this. So, this is purely my opinion. 

I wish they just focus on the real thing... The Synchron Orchestra ! 

They have a Gem, the Synchron Stage, why fake anything with this Synchronize process, I don't really get it. Hopefully they will just move forward with the serious work, and continue developing an amazing Orchestral Library recorded in their Synchron Stage.


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## Akarin (Nov 4, 2020)

muziksculp said:


> Personally, I think the whole Synchron-ized Libraries VSL has released, and is possibly still releasing, is a waste of time. Others might differ about this. So, this is purely my opinion.
> 
> I wish they just focus on the real thing... The Synchron Orchestra !
> 
> They have a Gem, the Synchron Stage, why fake anything with this Synchronize process, I don't really get it. Hopefully they will just move forward with the serious work, and continue developing an amazing Orchestral Library recorded in their Synchron Stage.



I too would love to see the rest of the orchestra there. The chamber strings, the ww, brass, etc 😊


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## Mike Fox (Nov 4, 2020)

They all sound like shit. I prefer the strings from Garageband. Can't believe they weren't included in this.


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## Akarin (Nov 5, 2020)

Mike Fox said:


> They all sound like shit. I prefer the strings from Garageband. Can't believe they weren't included in this.



I knew that I should have used the ones from Garritan or Amadeus, to have a realistic sound :-/


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## JeeTee (Nov 5, 2020)

Akarin said:


> Thanks for doing this!
> 
> Did you get the MIDI from composingtips?



No. At the time it wasn't available - I ended up doing it by ear. Did you use the exact same midi file for all your examples? That's to say, is the controller data identical for all the libraries?


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## Noeticus (Nov 5, 2020)

VSL is the best of the best!


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## Akarin (Nov 5, 2020)

JeeTee said:


> No. At the time it wasn't available - I ended up doing it by ear. Did you use the exact same midi file for all your examples? That's to say, is the controller data identical for all the libraries?



Nope, the CCs and velocities as well as the legato transition overlaps have been updated for each library. Your comparison prompted me to post a new video on the EWHO as its tone is still so very good after all these years!



Noeticus said:


> VSL is the best of the best!



That's an opinion... ...but I have to say that these Synchron Strings Pro are growing more and more on me. I love them.


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## Mike Fox (Nov 5, 2020)

Akarin said:


> I knew that I should have used the ones from Garritan or Amadeus, to have a realistic sound :-/


YES!!!


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## hayvel (Nov 5, 2020)

muziksculp said:


> Personally, I think the whole Synchron-ized Libraries VSL has released, and is possibly still releasing, is a waste of time. Others might differ about this. So, this is purely my opinion.
> 
> I wish they just focus on the real thing... The Synchron Orchestra !
> 
> They have a Gem, the Synchron Stage, why fake anything with this Synchronize process, I don't really get it. Hopefully they will just move forward with the serious work, and continue developing an amazing Orchestral Library recorded in their Synchron Stage.



Sorry to disagree here. I think the fact that they bring some of their existing (and still highly regarded) VI libraries over to the new format and have them seamlessly integrate with the new synchron line is genius. They have the material and technology (MIR) already, I think they saw an opportunity here to increase their offerings for the new eco system greatly and bridge the inevitable gaps, with a reasonable effort. And I personally embrace the fact that I can mix the older with the latest releases seamlessly, with no extra work. It is all prepared and ready to go together out of the box. 

Of course, the time invested here may delay the new synchron line, but in the end we get many more flavours of orchestral instruments for the new platform. And former VI customers benefit from the fact that some of their used and paid for instruments are kept alive and fresh in the synchronized format (for a small crossgrade fee)


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## Mike Fox (Nov 5, 2020)

First off, great video! I have all of these strings except for Synchron, so here are my real findings...

BLOCK CHORDS

1. Synchron Strings - probably my favorite of the bunch. They were nice and full, and the tonality was probably perfect to these ears. Not too bright, not too dark. Just right!

2. SSS - These strings can be a bit dark and not very detailed. I also hated how they handled the transitions. I almost threw up in my mouth.

3. Areia - Others have already said it, but using the Classic mix probably would have been a better choice for showcasing these strings in isolation. These are definitely modern sounding strings and are some of the best I've found to cut through heavy mixes.

4. CSS - Dark, muddy tone. I normally can't stand the tone of the strings (though some people have done amazing things with them!). I felt like the low end prevented the high end from shining through in this example.

5. Afflatus - No complaints here. Nice and balanced.

LEGATO

1. Synchron Strings - same as above
2. SSS - same as above
3. Areia - same as above
4. CSS - same as above, but is stellar for handling legato lines (obviously).
5. Afflatus -same as above

RUNS

1. Synchron Strings - Probably my least favorite. Even though they didn't have an issue with timing, they sounded a bit synthetic to me.

2. SSS - they fumbled big time, and just couldn't keep up.

3. Areia- have zero issue with keeping on time, but again, sound harsh in isolation.

4. CSS - Sound like these just weren't meant for this sort of thing.

5. Afflatus - Also had some trouble staying on time.

SHORTS

1. Synchron - Not a fan of these at all. They sound somewhat robotic to me. Zero grit and too perfect gives them a synthetic vibe. Not my cup of tea. Maybe some humanizing on them would resolve the issue? (do they offer any other spiccatos in this library that have more grit?)

2. SSS - Out of the box, the spiccatos are not tight enough. Spitfire knew this, which is why they created the Time Machine patches. (I get this is an "out of the box" comparison, but i would have loved to see SSS handle this with the Time Machine patch.)

3. Areia - Probably the tightest spiccatos in the biz. I probably sound like a broken record by now, but these really do sound best in a heavy mix. Would loved to have seen the Classic mix.

4. CSS - Handled the passage just fine. I wish i liked the tone more of CSS, because the shorts are really good in this library.

5. Afflatus - The standard spiccato patches in this library aren't amongst my favorite. I actually would have loved to see you use the Roofchase Strings patch instead, or even the Psychatto Strings (which obviously aren't symphonic sized, but sound aggressive as fu$!).

Overall, pretty good comparison. I don't think there's a "King of Strings" library in existence. Each one does something better than the next. And some do things other ones don't.

I guess that's why a lot of us have more strings libs than we know what to do with!


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## Mike Fox (Nov 5, 2020)

Watching Don Bodins review right now on Synchron. Not really sure how to feel about these strings. There does seem to be this "too perfect" tone going on that really takes away the human element, almost as if there's like a this plastic sheen over them. Not sure how to describe it.

But i do love the eq and stage! Mic placement is really good on these. 

Hm....


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## Beans (Nov 5, 2020)

Regarding SySP's shorts: in some tooling around I did when I first picked them up, the (non-FF) shorts were where I had to put in the most careful selection of mics and EQ (all the longs are gorgeous no matter what).

I cannot recall what settings were used, and I won't have time today to jump back in... Nov-Dec is the heaviest time at my place of work (I can "multi-task" on calls, but not enough to open Cubase on my tower next to me!). I did, however, have a good experience using SySP's spiccato on top of Hollywood Strings, and alternatively with Jaeger's spiccato patches.

I preferred using SySP as the higher volume of the pairings, rather than the inverse. It kept some of the "brevity" that the VSL shorts have, while covering up some of the hall that I _usually_ like with Synchron, but didn't completely get along with for these shorts. It needed some warmth, in my opinion.


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## muziksculp (Nov 5, 2020)

hayvel said:


> Sorry to disagree here. I think the fact that they bring some of their existing (and still highly regarded) VI libraries over to the new format and have them seamlessly integrate with the new synchron line is genius. They have the material and technology (MIR) already, I think they saw an opportunity here to increase their offerings for the new eco system greatly and bridge the inevitable gaps, with a reasonable effort. And I personally embrace the fact that I can mix the older with the latest releases seamlessly, with no extra work. It is all prepared and ready to go together out of the box.
> 
> Of course, the time invested here may delay the new synchron line, but in the end we get many more flavours of orchestral instruments for the new platform. And former VI customers benefit from the fact that some of their used and paid for instruments are kept alive and fresh in the synchronized format (for a small crossgrade fee)



You have some good points, but.... I just wish they did all this Synchronization work after they released the real thing... Synchron Orchestra !


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Nov 5, 2020)

IMO the new Nashville Scoring Strings sounds infinitely better than Synchron Strings Pro.  No, they both sound good


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## ALittleNightMusic (Nov 5, 2020)

hbjdk said:


> IMO the new Nashville Scoring Strings sounds infinitely better than Synchron Strings Pro.



Not if you need staccatos... 

I personally completely disagree. But all subjective. Some people like Areia...


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## muziksculp (Nov 5, 2020)

hbjdk said:


> IMO the new Nashville Scoring Strings sounds infinitely better than Synchron Strings Pro.



Surprising opinion, I haven't checked Nashville Scoring Strings, But... I'm curious.. what makes you come to that conclusion ? Did you buy NSS, and test it out ? Did you check VSL Synchron Strings Pro carefully ? 

NSS is missing so many articulations, and doesn't even have key-switches, also less mics. But, I will check it out.


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## ptram (Nov 5, 2020)

I've downloaded your midi file from your web site, and adapted it to the old VSL VI Orchestral Strings, processed with MIR PRO through the Synchron Stage Wide room.

I've also added a version in the Wiener Konzerthaus' Grosser Saal. And also, a version with Appassionata Strings in the Synchron Stage Wide room.

Finally, I've added the Spiccato passage with no surround reverb and an overall drier, in-your-face mix.

Paolo


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## Mike Fox (Nov 5, 2020)

hbjdk said:


> IMO the new Nashville Scoring Strings sounds infinitely better than Synchron Strings Pro.


At face value, i think i also prefer the tone of NSS over Synchron. They're definitely more raw and aggressive, and sounds more like performances, rather than static samples.

I don't have real world experience with either though, so it's tough to say how they really compare.


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Nov 5, 2020)

muziksculp said:


> Surprising opinion, I haven't checked Nashville Scoring Strings, But... I'm curious.. what makes you come to that conclusion ? Did you buy NSS, and test it out ? Did you check VSL Synchron Strings Pro carefully ?
> 
> NSS is missing so many articulations, and doesn't even have key-switches, also less mics. But, I will check it out.


I watched Sample Library Review and Nico's review.
As for NSS, check this besides what's on Ollie's homepage:


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Nov 5, 2020)

muziksculp said:


> NSS is missing so many articulations, and doesn't even have key-switches, also less mics. But, I will check it out.


Is NSS missing any of the basic articulations apart from Staccato (which is a rather big omission IMO!, but still)?

Looking at CSS, that's the only articulation I can see NSS is missing anyway.

Edit:
Ah, Staccatissimo too.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Nov 5, 2020)

hbjdk said:


> Is NSS missing any of the basic articulations apart from Staccato (which is a rather big omission IMO!, but still)?
> 
> Looking at CSS, that's the only articulation I can see NSS is missing anyway.
> 
> ...



Portamento, measured trems, Bartok pizzicato, sforzando - and that's just comparing to CSS. Once you compare to something even deeper like Synchron Strings Pro or SSS or something, it's not even close. Not to mention NSS is the only one of these that didn't record a second violin section (the transposition trick is a lame excuse for not recording the players).

I played around with SSPro along side that 1 hour walkthrough of NSS and not only did I much prefer SSPro, but I generally preferred all the other libraries he compared NSS to.


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Nov 5, 2020)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Portamento, harmonics, trills, measured trems, Bartok pizzicato, sforzando - and that's just comparing to CSS. Once you compare to something even deeper like Synchron Strings Pro or SSS or something, it's not even close. Not to mention NSS is the only one of these that didn't record a second violin section (the transposition trick is a lame excuse for not recording the players).
> 
> I played around with SSPro along side that 1 hour walkthrough of NSS and not only did I much prefer SSPro, but I generally preferred all the other libraries he compared NSS to.


NSS has both harmonics and trills according to the list of articulations here.

But yeah, it's a good thing you like SSPro. Horses for courses.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Nov 5, 2020)

hbjdk said:


> NSS has both harmonics and trills according to the list of articulations here.
> 
> But yeah, it's a good thing you like SSPro. Horses for courses.



Good catch - updated my post. Either way, if you need extra articulations, then of course, NSS won't suffice - but they have announced an expansion pack that will come (TBD when) so maybe they will add some more articulations then.


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## AndyP (Nov 5, 2020)

Now they are mine.


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Nov 5, 2020)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Good catch - updated my post. Either way, if you need extra articulations, then of course, NSS won't suffice - but they have announced an expansion pack that will come (TBD when) so maybe they will add some more articulations then.


That's true, I forgot. Thanks for the reminder. Would be nice with an expansion pack, we'll see how it turns out. Announcing something and actually delivering on it are two different things sometimes *cough* *CineStrings Pro, Play Pro*


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## Secret Soundworks (Nov 5, 2020)

Short test of Synchron Strings Pro (longs and shorts), raw sound out of the box, not the best programming on my part, but hopefully can help as a reference for the general sound. 

There's a lot of articulations and variations (soft, normal attacks / releases, bold spiccatos, agile spiccatos, different vibratos etc. ), so if you make use of all of those then I think it should be able to handle most passages pretty well.


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## hazza (Nov 6, 2020)

Quick question about VSL return policy. I went with advice given here and purchased both SSP and SS1, with a view to cancelling one if I feel I don't need it. If I authorise everything on my elicenser will this allow VSL to revoke one of the licenses if I choose? Or do I need to avoid activation and run in some kind of demo mode?


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## Beans (Nov 6, 2020)

Yep, just authorize both.


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## Akarin (Nov 6, 2020)

Mike Fox said:


> Overall, pretty good comparison. I don't think there's a "King of Strings" library in existence. Each one does something better than the next. And some do things other ones don't.
> 
> I guess that's why a lot of us have more strings libs than we know what to do with!



I think that in my whole strings collection, Synchron Strings Pro is the most versatile one. There's very little that it can do. As a main library, this is totally suitable.

But yeah... one can't have enough strings libraries!



hbjdk said:


> IMO the new Nashville Scoring Strings sounds infinitely better than Synchron Strings Pro.



I find NSS good in the demos but not stellar. Now, for $350 in 2020 for a lib with no staccato, no 2nd violins, no KS patches... ...I don't even want to look into it any further.


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## Mike Fox (Nov 6, 2020)

Akarin said:


> I find NSS good in the demos but not stellar. Now, for $350 in 2020 for a lib with no staccato, no 2nd violins, no KS patches... ...I don't even want to look into it any further.


For me, it doesn't matter how many articulations a library has (to a large extent anyways), because if the tone doesn't do anything for me? It's an easy pass.

But if I love the tone, and the library has 90% of the articulations I normally use, then I'm usually sold.

If you can find a string library that has both, then that's a real find, and it sounds like Synchron is doing just that for you.


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## Mike Fox (Nov 6, 2020)

@Akarin Btw, can Synchron get super gritty like the Psychatto Strings from Afflatus?


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## AndyP (Nov 6, 2020)

Akarin said:


> I think that in my whole strings collection, Synchron Strings Pro is the most versatile one. There's very little that it can do. As a main library, this is totally suitable.
> 
> But yeah... one can't have enough strings libraries!


I agree with you. I have SysP since today and am building a new template. Together with Musca, Lyra and Regulus I have almost no wishes left (except an upgrade to the full FX version).
Oh, maybe a SySP chamber version!


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## Ashermusic (Nov 6, 2020)

Mike Fox said:


> For me, it doesn't matter how many articulations a library has (to a large extent anyways), because if the tone doesn't do anything for me? It's an easy pass.



Mike Fox, my brotha from another motha , that is exactly me! If I really like the tone, almost all flaws are forgiven. If I don’t, almost all other virtues don’t matter.


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## muziksculp (Nov 6, 2020)

AndyP said:


> I agree with you. I have SysP since today and am building a new template. Together with Musca, Lyra and Regulus I have almost no wishes left (except an upgrade to the full FX version).
> Oh, maybe a SySP chamber version!



Hi @AndyP ,

I have Synchron Stirngs Pro (full), but I haven't bothered getting any of the VSL BBOrch. Libraries, what do i.e. Musca, Lyra, add to Synch. Strings Pro ? 

I know Regulus is their FX version. I might get the Synchron Strings FX 1, but not in an urgent need for them right now. 

Thanks.


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## AndyP (Nov 6, 2020)

muziksculp said:


> Hi @AndyP ,
> 
> I have Synchron Stirngs Pro (full), but I haven't bothered getting any of the VSL BBOrch. Libraries, what do i.e. Musca, Lyra, add to Synch. Strings Pro ?
> 
> ...


Lyra and Musca are primarily ensemble versions. Lyra High Strings, Musca Low Strings. In Musca there are divided and overlay versions of the high and low strings.
I find them very handy and they harmonize perfectly with the SysP, although I assume that they were created from the same samples, like the 5 new BBO String Versions.
I guess these can also be rebuilt with the SysPro.


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## Ben (Nov 6, 2020)

AndyP said:


> although I assume that they were created from the same samples, like the 5 new BBO String Versions.


Nope, they were recorded as ensembles - same room, same seating. Therefore they blend/layer perfectly. -> Completely different recordings/samples.


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## Ben (Nov 6, 2020)

AndyP said:


> I guess these can also be rebuilt with the SysPro.


Yes, to a certain point. But you can't recreate the magic that is happening in Lyra and Musca. Therefore this library is really useful on its own or to layer with the other Synchron Strings.


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## muziksculp (Nov 6, 2020)

Ben said:


> But you can't recreate the magic that is happening in Lyra and Musca.



@Ben,

How useful do you think it is to have Lyra, and Musca if I alredy have Synchr. Strings Pro (Full) ? 

If you can elaborate a bit on the benefits.

Also looking forward to the next VSL major Synchron Library release. I wonder what it's going to be. 

Thanks.


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## Akarin (Nov 6, 2020)

Mike Fox said:


> @Akarin Btw, can Synchron get super gritty like the Psychatto Strings from Afflatus?



No. Only Afflatus can. That's its unique selling point for me.


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## AndyP (Nov 6, 2020)

Ben said:


> Yes, to a certain point. But you can't recreate the magic that is happening in Lyra and Musca. Therefore this library is really useful on its own or to layer with the other Synchron Strings.





Ben said:


> Yes, to a certain point. But you can't recreate the magic that is happening in Lyra and Musca. Therefore this library is really useful on its own or to layer with the other Synchron Strings.


I think they actually harmonize perfectly. The overlay and divided patches are great indeed!


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## Ben (Nov 6, 2020)

muziksculp said:


> How useful do you think it is to have Lyra, and Musca if I alredy have Synchr. Strings Pro (Full) ?
> If you can elaborate a bit on the benefits.


It depends on the music you write as well as your workflow.
I would not use Lyra and Musca if composition is the main thing you care about.
But Lyra and Musca are perfect for instant big, nice and warm timbre, to be used on final products.
You can use it as the main string library or to layer with others (for example Synchron Strings Pro).

I have worked on a mock-up after the release of the Brass installments and included the beta of the woodwind BBOs, where I used Lyra and Musca to cover the string sections. And it worked perfectly even on parts where the strings do not play in octaves in the original. But due to the amount of work since then I was not able to finish the walkthrough yet... (I'll send you a PM  )



muziksculp said:


> Also looking forward to the next VSL major Synchron Library release. I wonder what it's going to be.


Can't talk about it until release 
But there is a lot already recorded and being worked on by our editors, as well as plans are made for the next libraries.
The great amount of positive feedback we got for the Synchron Strings Pro makes us really happy - and we are working hard on new libraries that will fit perfectly with these awesome strings!


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## muziksculp (Nov 6, 2020)

Hi @Ben ,

Thank You Very Much for the helpful feedback.

I will think about adding Musca and Lyra, although I really don't need them urgently, but.. I think for Speedy-Workflow they might be handy, especially for creating mockups in a shorter amount of time, than if one used a detailed library like Synchron Strings Pro. The results will be different as well.

Looking forward to see what VSL will delight us with next as far as the Synchron Orchestra is concerned.

I hope VSL uses the techniques they implemented in making Synchron Strings Pro in their future library development efforts. They surely have the correct formula/Technique now, they just need to move forward, releasing more wonderful sounding Synchron Libraries.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Nov 6, 2020)

Ben said:


> Can't talk about it until release
> But there is a lot already recorded and being worked on by our editors



Guess that means it won't be released this year... 

Finally made some custom patches in Synchron Player and articulation maps in Logic (thank God Logic has multiple output support for articulations given how many options Synchron Strings Pro has!). Despite how deep this is, once you get it setup the way you like, it is a joy to play and program as well.

How are folks using legato agile? @Ben any recommendations? Should we switch into it in the middle of a legato line or do you prefer to start the line with that patch?


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## Ben (Nov 6, 2020)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> @Ben any recommendations? Should we switch into it in the middle of a legato line or do you prefer to start the line with that patch?


My only recommendation - do whatever sounds good to you and whatever the piece requires.
Somethimes I specifically keyswitch between the legatos, somtimes I simply use the auto-speed feature.


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## ysnyvz (Nov 7, 2020)

Mike Fox said:


> @Akarin Btw, can Synchron get super gritty like the Psychatto Strings from Afflatus?


Yes, it can.


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## Akarin (Nov 7, 2020)

ysnyvz said:


> Yes, it can.




Very impressive! But not close to what Afflatus can do with Psychatto strings.


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## Mike Fox (Nov 7, 2020)

ysnyvz said:


> Yes, it can.



Eh, not quite the same level of aggression or grit.

Sounds good though!


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## ysnyvz (Nov 7, 2020)

Mike Fox said:


> Eh, not quite the same level of aggression or grit.
> 
> Sounds good though!


Yeah, maybe not the exact same sound. But I wanted to show it can get aggressive. Also that's just out of box sound. I can make it even more gritty with a little processing and layering ponticello shorts.


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## Mike Fox (Nov 7, 2020)

ysnyvz said:


> I can make it even more gritty with a little processing and layering ponticello shorts.


Would love to hear that!


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Nov 7, 2020)

hbjdk said:


> IMO the new Nashville Scoring Strings sounds infinitely better than Synchron Strings Pro.


I just bought NSS yesterday and I'm absolutely loving it! However, being so happy with this new library of mine, it has occurred to me that my post above (the one quoted) was very unkind and frankly somewhat rude  

To be thrilled about a new library-purchase like you guys no doubt are with your Synchron Strings Pro and then have someone come into this thread and write a negative comment like that.

I apologize! And I am happy for you guys that you are happy with SSP


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## ysnyvz (Nov 7, 2020)

Mike Fox said:


> Would love to hear that!


Here you go. At this point we're entering Ark 1 territory, watch your steps.


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## Mike Fox (Nov 7, 2020)

ysnyvz said:


> Here you go. At this point we're entering Ark 1 territory, watch your steps.



This sounds waaay better than Ark 1! Excellent job!


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## ysnyvz (Nov 7, 2020)

Mike Fox said:


> This sounds waaay better than Ark 1! Excellent job!


Thanks, mate. My point is the library is quite flexible and consistent. You can edit almost everything and even create your own patches. 
Btw I'm not trying to promote it as it's my first vsl library. Just tried to help.


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## Mike Fox (Nov 7, 2020)

ysnyvz said:


> Thanks, mate. My point is the library is quite flexible and consistent. You can edit almost everything and even create your own patches.
> Btw I'm not trying to promote it as it's my first vsl library. Just tried to help.


Yeah, it seems really flexible in that sense! Thanks for taking the time to do that.


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## ptram (Nov 9, 2020)

Why everybody can listen to @ysnyvz 's example, and I can't? Now you have made me very curious!

Paolo


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## Beans (Nov 9, 2020)

ptram said:


> Why everybody can listen to @ysnyvz 's example, and I can't? Now you have made me very curious!
> 
> Paolo



It was there, but now is not.


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## ysnyvz (Nov 9, 2020)

ptram said:


> Why everybody can listen to @ysnyvz 's example, and I can't? Now you have made me very curious!
> 
> Paolo


Sorry, I deleted them from soundcloud after we ended discussing.


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## markit (Nov 10, 2020)

ptram said:


> Why everybody can listen to @ysnyvz 's example, and I can't? Now you have made me very curious!
> 
> Paolo



@ysnyvz Now I am very curious too! haha


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## ysnyvz (Nov 10, 2020)

markit said:


> @ysnyvz Now I am very curious too! haha


My point is the library is quite versatile. It can do both soft and aggressive. Although it's a symphonic strings library, it's not limited to cinematic/romantic sound. I'm using it in all kind of music including ethnic. Even in hiphop, you can hear a little snippet here (you need to excuse quality of souncloud):


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## ptram (Nov 10, 2020)

ysnyvz said:


> Although it's a symphonic strings library, it's not limited to cinematic/romantic sound.



Thank you for the example. Actually, I think SSP is not a cinematic/romantic library. It is smaller than a regular symphony orchestra, and this makes it agile as a chamber ensemble, but with a beefier sound.

I find it to be, from the demos and examples, more a modern orchestra than a classical one. A reduced and nervous set for apocalyptic times. Capable of whispering in the dark, siffling in the ice, roaring in the fire, crackling in the dry land.

More than a nostalgic library, I would call it a futuristic one. The viennese Fritz Lang would be happy. Bernie Herrmann, too.

Paolo


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## AndyP (Nov 10, 2020)

ptram said:


> Thank you for the example. Actually, I think SSP is not a cinematic/romantic library. It is smaller than a regular symphony orchestra, and this makes it agile as a chamber ensemble, but with a beefier sound.


I thought the same thing today. And I find that absolutely positive. Layered with the Appassionata strings it gives a nice symphonic sound with lots of contour.


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## ysnyvz (Nov 10, 2020)

ptram said:


> Thank you for the example. Actually, I think SSP is not a cinematic/romantic library. It is smaller than a regular symphony orchestra, and this makes it agile as a chamber ensemble, but with a beefier sound.
> 
> I find it to be, from the demos and examples, more a modern orchestra than a classical one. A reduced and nervous set for apocalyptic times. Capable of whispering in the dark, siffling in the ice, roaring in the fire, crackling in the dry land.
> 
> ...


Yes, but it's performed by 46 players. I think that's pretty big especially in the sample library market. Since the topic is comparing to other libraries, that's what I wanted to show. I have many other libraries but this one is unique for me. Because I don't have to think like "Let me try to see if this library can fit to this track" I think the room and recording/mixing techniques VSL use made the real difference for me. Now I want more like this and their libraries are not cheap


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## José Herring (Nov 11, 2020)

Nuno said:


> I am using the same dongle for 7 years already. Should i replace it with a new one to avoid a disaster?


Yes.  I just rebuilt my main daw and didn't realize that I had two elicensers one I'm sure I put there when I built my retired DAW and I think it came from the DAW before that one because it had a gigastudio 3 license on it. It was even taped together which brings the grand total of 2 elicencers that I was using that were held together with scotch tape. I've replaced them both now. They were about to turn to dust.


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## Bman70 (Nov 19, 2020)

ysnyvz said:


> Sorry, I deleted them from soundcloud after we ended discussing.



That really kind of breaks the thread. If the reason for deleting was you don't want them in your Soundcloud library, it's possible to keep the piece Private and share a link. That way only people visiting the link will see it and not anyone coming to view your tracks list.


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## alchemist (Nov 22, 2020)

For anyone still interested, finished downloading and exploring the library, quickly put a riff together to see if an 'aggressive' sound could be achieved as I remember there was a question here about it that stuck with me when I was deciding to buy SSP. Only a little Seventh Heaven reverb applied to the mix. Overall pretty happy with the purchase! So much more to discover in the collection, have to hit the sack now, 4am jeez, time really doesn't exist when exploring a new library lol


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## stfciu (Nov 23, 2020)

Can Synchron Strings Pro go into emotional side as well? Just few hours away from the intro price and can't make up my mind between this and CSS. I know it is bit late but maybe someone will chime in.


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## Ben (Nov 23, 2020)

@stfciu Yes it can imo. You can also heavily change the tone by creating your mixer preset.
If you get these strings feel free to PM me - I'll send you a custom preset changing the tone to a more dark and cinematic one.


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## alchemist (Nov 23, 2020)

stfciu said:


> Can Synchron Strings Pro go into emotional side as well? Just few hours away from the intro price and can't make up my mind between this and CSS. I know it is bit late but maybe someone will chime in.


I think CSS has the upper hand over every other library when it comes to legato. SSP is still expressive, but there's just a little extra detail in the CSS transitions that make it a bit more musical than everything else. I think it would be a better comparison if VSL had done slower legato variations, and maybe bow change legato as well.

Here's a quick example I played on Vln 1, first SSP then CSS, normal vibrato/molto vibrato xfade patch for SSP. Do note that CSS is layered with CSSS close mics in my template. I find CSS is more expressive, but the tone of SSP is gorgeous. I own both so clearly I think both are great lol


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## Sovereign (Nov 23, 2020)

stfciu said:


> Can Synchron Strings Pro go into emotional side as well? Just few hours away from the intro price and can't make up my mind between this and CSS. I know it is bit late but maybe someone will chime in.


I own both of these, still have to find the library beating CSS at emotional legato. Let me add to Alchemist's example with something I just did live on the keyboard using divisimate and CSS. Only took a couple of seconds.


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## Bman70 (Nov 23, 2020)

alchemist said:


> I think CSS has the upper hand over every other library when it comes to legato. SSP is still expressive, but there's just a little extra detail in the CSS transitions that make it a bit more musical than everything else. I think it would be a better comparison if VSL had done slower legato variations, and maybe bow change legato as well.
> 
> Here's a quick example I played on Vln 1, first SSP then CSS, normal vibrato/molto vibrato xfade patch for SSP. Do note that CSS is layered with CSSS close mics in my template. I find CSS is more expressive, but the tone of SSP is gorgeous. I own both so clearly I think both are great lol



I actually liked the first version better, although the legato could be a tad smoother. But the second one sounded too quavery for my taste, like it couldn't decide whether to vibrato or not.


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## Bman70 (Nov 24, 2020)

Timothy Schmidt said:


> I tried sequencing the first half of your legato example on the violins: first all legato, then all Cubase legato (MIDI placed end to end but with no overlap), and then a mixture of both. Sample start at -250ms, dynamic range at 90%, everything else default. Does it sound better on my machine than yours? Either way, the wobbly transitions have always been there, and they are pretty much the only weakness I have found in Nucleus, too. I worked around them in 1.0 by layering sustains and using the transitions sparingly (especially in slower passages), and it sounds like I will continue to have to do so in 1.1. Not ideal, but it's not representative of the entire library, as the other sections sound a lot better. I think Sovereign is right that the only remedy at this point to record the intervals again to better match the smoother sustains.



Do you hear the wobbly or bumpy legato / transitions in this example? I'm just trying to make sure before I buy Areia. I recorded the same passage as your demo, then added some. I honestly can't hear anything distractingly wobbly. Maybe the legato is not like portamento-style smooth; it may sound a little more like a "sustain" patch than a slurred legato. Or maybe it's not supposed to be slurred. But this is the Single Legato Articulation for 16 Violins.


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## Timothy Schmidt (Nov 24, 2020)

Bman70 said:


> Do you hear the wobbly or bumpy legato / transitions in this example? I'm just trying to make sure before I buy Areia. I recorded the same passage as your demo, then added some. I honestly can't hear anything distractingly wobbly. Maybe the legato is not like portamento-style smooth; it may sound a little more like a "sustain" patch than a slurred legato. Or maybe it's not supposed to be slurred. But this is the Single Legato Articulation for 16 Violins.


Your sample start is far less than -250ms, right? I'm hearing where the wobble _would _occur if you were to set it to -250ms, but whatever setting you have it at is definitely passable.

Also, I think the "noticeable" wobble is confined primarily to the mid-range of the violins patch - the lowest notes and higher register are a bit better. Of course, most violin writing is in that middle register, so that doesn't lessen the concern.

I got Areia because of all the extra articulations it offered over Nucleus, knowing full well the source material for overlapping material was the same and would likely have the same wobble issue. So it's really just an expansion to Nucleus strings, no better or worse in the content it shares.

- Timothy Schmidt


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## Bman70 (Nov 24, 2020)

Timothy Schmidt said:


> Your sample start is far less than -250ms, right? I'm hearing where the wobble _would _occur if you were to set it to -250ms, but whatever setting you have it at is definitely passable.
> 
> Also, I think the "noticeable" wobble is confined primarily to the mid-range of the violins patch - the lowest notes and higher register are a bit better. Of course, most violin writing is in that middle register, so that doesn't lessen the concern.
> 
> ...




No I recorded MIDI using it at -10ms, so I wouldn't have delay. Then I moved the sample start all the way to -250ms before bouncing. I was hoping maybe you were using a shorter sample start which was causing the wobble... because maybe the smooth transition is in those first milliseconds? Not sure but I'm glad it sounds more passable.

I also wasn't using the Performance Patches, but the Legato violins from Single articulations folder. I'm pretty sure those are the same samples as in the Multi folder, but you just can't use keyswitches to move between them.


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## Bman70 (Nov 24, 2020)

@Timothy Schmidt I did mess with the Expression, bringing that down from the max to something like 3/4 or less... and also bringing the vibrato down about a 3rd turn. Dynamics knob was about 85% or so. I didn't move the mod wheel while playing.

Edit: I forgot to check what I had the Legato Smoothness knob at. I'm pretty sure it was high, around 80-90% since I maxed it then backed it off some.


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## marco berco (Dec 19, 2020)

hbjdk said:


> Anyone considering VSL should at least be aware of their dongle policy.


Sure, but if you take the 2 years e-licencer insurance you are covered for any loss, theft or breakage and that's ok for me as I can change computer at will without boring myself with authorizations and so on... I know some here hate the dongle policy but personnaly I like it a lot for the ease of use, that fit my needs perfectly. I already own a second Vienna key in case of issues...


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## Casiquire (Dec 19, 2020)

Trust me. Anyone considering VSL in these forums is already aware because every thread about them gets derailed. We can give it a rest.


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## ptram (Jan 2, 2021)

I've tried to adapt one of the demos of the new OT BSS to VSL SSP (Standard edition). The score is not a one-to-one match (not even one-to-point-five, probably), but it should give an approximate idea of how different they sound on the (more or less) same piece.

VSL SSP on Melodic Legato

[Earlier, more ascetic version: VSL SSP on Melodic Legato (old)]

The original demo is in the page dedicated to BSS in OT's web site:

OT BSS Melodic Legato

Paolo

PS: Apologies if this is considered breaking OT's copyright. I just tried to transcribe it for educational purposes. If this is against the rules or the law, I'll immediately remove it.


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## Casiquire (Jan 2, 2021)

ptram said:


> I've tried to adapt one of the demos of the new OT BSS to VSL SSP. The score is not a one-to-one match (not even one-to-point-five, probably), but it should give an approximate idea of how different they sound on the (more or less) same piece.
> 
> http://www.studio-magazine.com/music/test/vsl-sy/Melodic-Legato-VSL_SSP.mp3 (VSL SSP on Melodic Legato)
> 
> ...


Thanks so much for this! It's kind of eye opening, I actually prefer the BSS version quite a bit


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## Beans (Jan 2, 2021)

ptram said:


> I've tried to adapt one of the demos of the new OT BSS to VSL SSP. The score is not a one-to-one match (not even one-to-point-five, probably), but it should give an approximate idea of how different they sound on the (more or less) same piece.



While this is more effort than I have (or will) put into such a comparison, I think a few points could be considered:

The two libraries are for different purposes, in my opinion. SSP would be more comparable to BS, not BSS.


I think a different mic mix could be used here for SSP. It doesn't sound as wide or breathing as it could.


The dynamics on SSP sound a bit flat, like they're riding near the top too often. I think with SSP you've often got to crank up Synchron Player's master volume and ride both that mod wheel and expression to experience the proper range. It doesn't have the "press a single note and hear it go bonkers" expression that some libraries have.


While I appreciate the effort in the community-at-large's examples like this, it's misleading to compare A) a polished demo that a major developer is happy to put on their site for a major release to B) a partial mimic that didn't have the intense scrutiny that the official demo did.
Is stuff like this fun? Sure! I really enjoy listening to these. Are they useful for making purchasing decisions? No.

Note that I have SSP, BS, and BSS and feel they each have their own viable uses, even though BSS is far from a complete state at this point, in my opinion. Still, take my opinion as just an opinion. I'm terrible at string writing and have hired a mentor to improve here, so I've got little room to criticize. I do, however, feel I have a good grasp on the scope and limitations of each library. But I mean you no harm, honest.


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## ptram (Jan 2, 2021)

Beans said:


> Is stuff like this fun? Sure! I really enjoy listening to these. Are they useful for making purchasing decisions? No.


This is never stressed enough - this kind of exercise is just for fun, to learn something, to "see what happens if I do this". Speaking of learning something, thank you for the hints on how to improve it!

Paolo


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## jbuhler (Jan 2, 2021)

ptram said:


> This is never stressed enough - this kind of exercise is just for fun, to learn something, to "see what happens if I do this". Speaking of learning something, thank you for the hints on how to improve it!
> 
> Paolo


They are fun, and when doing them yourself, they can be exceedingly useful in learning a library. I find them helpful when others post them too, not so much as a straight comparison of libraries but in terms of what they can reveal about expressive domains of different libraries.


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## maestro2be (Jan 2, 2021)

ptram said:


> I've tried to adapt one of the demos of the new OT BSS to VSL SSP. The score is not a one-to-one match (not even one-to-point-five, probably), but it should give an approximate idea of how different they sound on the (more or less) same piece.
> 
> http://www.studio-magazine.com/music/test/vsl-sy/Melodic-Legato-VSL_SSP.mp3 (VSL SSP on Melodic Legato)
> 
> ...


The OT demo is smoother, softer, more lush sounding and less aggressive. It also feels like a larger stereo width and height. I definitely preferred its sound to the SSP sound here. If I were OT I wouldn't be bothered by it at all since it sounds so much more lush and would probably increase their sales.


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## muziksculp (Jan 2, 2021)

Sovereign said:


> I own both of these, still have to find the library beating CSS at emotional legato. Let me add to Alchemist's example with something I just did live on the keyboard using divisimate and CSS. Only took a couple of seconds.


Hi @Sovereign ,

Your demo Sounds wonderful.

I have divisimate, and have been experimenting with it a bit lately, with mixed results.

Which Divisimate Mode do you tend to use, or find most convincing when playing chord progressions : (Fill Voices, Top Down, Bottom Up) ?

I'm also guessing you enabled the melodic (mel) region of the keyboard in Divisimate to trigger the vlns for the melodic phrase.

Thanks,
Muziksculp


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## ptram (Jan 2, 2021)

maestro2be said:


> The OT demo is smoother, softer, more lush sounding and less aggressive.


It's a larger strings ensemble, so naturally sounding smoother. However, in this case it's mostly due to my mixing choices. I've just added a smoother, lusher version of my SSP version. Still, very different versions (and the OT has for sure benefitted from much deeper programming and much better mastering).



maestro2be said:


> If I were OT I wouldn't be bothered by it at all since it sounds so much more lush and would probably increase their sales.


I have to ask them a free library!

Paolo


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## ptram (Jan 3, 2021)

Digging deeper in the host of articulations in SSP, I think it is possible to make these strings sound smooth. It's easy to make them sound aggressive, since they can be very fast.

Further fine-tuning my demo knockoff, I focused on the attacks and release samples, sounding different than just changing the attack/release times via MIDI controls.

Also, I could see how effective it is xfading between the different degrees of vibrato. The transition is very smooth, and probably credible enough even if not a recorded transition.

Paolo


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## BasariStudios (Jan 24, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> @Akarin ,
> 
> Thanks for the comparison video.
> 
> ...


Too late to the Party but Synchron Strings Pro is probably the BEST Library 
i have ever used, seen or heard. The same night i purchased it like 3 months
ago that same night became my main Strings Library...it was just...love at 
first sight...in the first 30 seconds of turning it on...everything was just there.


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## BasariStudios (Jan 24, 2021)

youngpokie said:


> I am so curious how EWQLHO might stack up against this line up (read an opinion that it still sounds better than BBCSO + big update coming soon)....
> 
> @Akarin?
> 
> many thanks


HO Sounds ok but nowhere near as useful and as fast as SSP.


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