# Sometimes I really hate Windows



## AlexRuger (Aug 27, 2020)

My key commands are uniform across all DAWs to be as close to Pro Tools as possible. Therefore, my zoom tracks in/out vertically key command in Cubase on Windows is control+alt+[up or down arrow]. This has worked fine for literally ever until today. Now, Cubase will not accept that key combination as valid. Trying to delete the key command and re-setting it just results in a blank field unless I press literally any other key combination. A key combination that includes all of those keys, such as control+alt+shift+[up or down arrow], which I have set to zoom in/out vertically the selected track only, works just fine. The keys work fine by themselves or in any combination other than control+alt+[one of the arrow keys].

I tried restarting. Deleted Cubase preferences. Tried a different keyboard. Tested the same key command combo in Cubase on my Mac with the same keyboard (it worked just fine). I tried setting something to the same key combo in Reaper. Same deal. So it's not just Cubase. Etc etc etc. 

After an entire afternoon wasted, I've narrowed it down to Windows itself simply deciding that those keys pressed together is not a valid entry, and I have zero idea how to fix that. Deleting the device in Device Manager didn't work. What else can someone possibly do?

I'm tearing my hair out trying to fix something that, in all likelihood, will require a Windows re-installation to work. Something that should have never broken in the first place.

I really like the power of PC's, and I'm able and willing to deal with just about any problem Windows can throw at me -- I've seen and dealt with it all. Besides, shit like this hardly ever happens. It's truly a once in a blue moon occurrence. 

But fuck me, today I just want to work.

/rant


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## labornvain (Aug 27, 2020)

You should try running a system restore. It's quite possible that something got corrupted or whatever in Windows and just system restore will bring it back.

The shortcut to get to system restore is to open a search prompt from the taskbar and type rstui. Should get you there quick.

System restore operations can wipe a lot of changes that you've made to your computer since the last time a restore point was created. It may not be worth it to you but you should run one anyway since it's completely reversible just for Diagnostic purposes.

There's a button you can click where it will tell you everything that is going to be wiped from running the restore.

Again, if it's been a really long time since a restore point was set, it may make too many changes to your computer for you to live with. But it's worth a shot and it might help you to figure out what's going on with your system.

If system restore does fix the problem, but it also deletes a bunch of changes you made to your computer that you can't live without or don't want to have to redo, your next step would be to check and see if any Windows updates have been installed recently and try to revert for uninstall those.


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## AlexRuger (Aug 27, 2020)

I just got this computer completely up and running and haven't yet made a restore point. Was planning on doing that literally this week but was making sure the system was solid before doing so.



labornvain said:


> It's quite possible that something got corrupted or whatever in Windows and just system restore will bring it back.



This right fucking here is the problem. The whole "something got corrupted" just isn't really a thing with properly-built OS's. Never in my life have I had a Unix-based OS "corrupt something." It's the standard Windows rickety foundation showing through once again.

Windows is fine for VEP machines but honestly something this basic fucking up is making me rethink my entire view on using a PC as a master. I think I'm over it.


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## MartinH. (Aug 27, 2020)

Sounds like this problem to me: 

https://discuss.atom.io/t/windows-10-add-selection-keyboard-shortcuts-ctrl-alt-arrows-not-working/29597/3


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## AlexRuger (Aug 27, 2020)

MartinH. said:


> Sounds like this problem to me:
> 
> https://discuss.atom.io/t/windows-10-add-selection-keyboard-shortcuts-ctrl-alt-arrows-not-working/29597/3


Already looked into it. Not it. Besides, I use an Nvidia card, which doesn't allow key commands for GPU feature control.

By all means keep throwing ideas at me but there's a 99.9999% chance I've already tried it.


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## vitocorleone123 (Aug 27, 2020)

Doesn’t help you here, but I once had a Mac (it’s been a decade since this happened) have the area where it stores passwords get corrupted. The only solution was to reinstall the OS.
That was back when I worked somewhere with an IT department so they took care of it.

it may happen more with Windows, but you also get a lot more freedom of choice with Windows. Trade offs. Again, a whole lotta useless babbling for you right now.

good luck!


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## YaniDee (Aug 27, 2020)

Shift +G does the same thing ( zoom tracks in/out vertically )..it's frustrating when these things happen, but if it stops you from working, an alternate solution may be the best move..


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## brek (Aug 27, 2020)

I've been having all sorts of buggy keyboard problems on a new PC. I guess it's time to uninstall Powertoys and go back to using Corsair's software to remap my keyboard.


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## labornvain (Aug 27, 2020)

AlexRuger said:


> I just got this computer completely up and running and haven't yet made a restore point. Was planning on doing that literally this week but was making sure the system was solid before doing so.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Well, to be fair to Windows, I can't remember a time when I've had a system file become corrupted. I also didn't realize this was a new-build, so that makes me doubt very seriously that it is in fact a corruption problem. Files can get corrupted, and this is true for Macs as much as PCs, as a result of traumatic events, like a sudden power outage or something.

I should also add that I've never in my life using PCs or Macs experienced the problem that you're experiencing now. But again, it's a new-build so quirky things can happen, mostly as a result of installing a bunch of new drivers and or installing new applications.

Also note that I said "corrupted or whatever".

That whatever was kind of important. Like maybe you installed an application or there's a background process running that is hijacked those keys for its own purposes.

One thing you may try is to disable background processes, at least the ones you don't need, and see if that gives you your functionality back.

Lastly, rereading your post, it occurs to me that you may not be aware that system restore points are created automatically. You mentioned not having had a chance to create one yet. I rarely ever create them, they create themselves. I'm sure you've already checked, but just in case, if you haven't, do so. There might be one sitting there waiting for you that you did not create.


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## chillbot (Aug 27, 2020)

labornvain said:


> Lastly, rereading your post, it occurs to me that you may not be aware that system restore points ar automatically. You mentioned not having had a chance to create one yet. I rarely ever create them, they create themselves. I'm sure you've already checked, but just in case, if you haven't, do so. There might be one sitting there waiting for you that you did not create.


I see that you're trying to be helpful, but 99.9999% he's already tried that.


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## AlexRuger (Aug 28, 2020)

chillbot said:


> I see that you're trying to be helpful, but 99.9999% he's already tried that.


Hilarious.



labornvain said:


> Lastly, rereading your post, it occurs to me that you may not be aware that system restore points are created automatically. You mentioned not having had a chance to create one yet. I rarely ever create them, they create themselves. I'm sure you've already checked, but just in case, if you haven't, do so. There might be one sitting there waiting for you that you did not create.



To chillbot's point -- yeah, already tried that  The ones it automatically made were too far early in my setup process. The only points I really like to go back to are ones I create manually, as I actually know what my system was like when I made it. The automatic ones are kind of useless IMO.



labornvain said:


> Well, to be fair to Windows, I can't remember a time when I've had a system file become corrupted. I also didn't realize this was a new-build, so that makes me doubt very seriously that it is in fact a corruption problem. Files can get corrupted, and this is true for Macs as much as PCs, as a result of traumatic events, like a sudden power outage or something.
> 
> I should also add that I've never in my life using PCs or Macs experienced the problem that you're experiencing now. But again, it's a new-build so quirky things can happen, mostly as a result of installing a bunch of new drivers and or installing new applications.



Same, but I've been using the system for about a month since building it, off and on (since I still have some projects I'd rather just keep on my old Mac Pro). I've continued to get small things in place here and there (mostly just organizing and re-organizing my samples, as opposed to installing stuff), but all in all it's been solid and relatively unchanging for a month. 

I was JXL's tech and Elfman's tech before that, and get tech calls from composers here in LA at least a couple times a month. I've built more PC's than I can count and have pretty much seen it all and tend to think that I know Windows like the back of my hand. But I've never run into something like this. So far all my troubleshooting is turning up nothing.



brek said:


> I've been having all sorts of buggy keyboard problems on a new PC. I guess it's time to uninstall Powertoys and go back to using Corsair's software to remap my keyboard.



Thing is, I'm not using anything like that. I actually tried Powertoys for its more advanced window snapping features and didn't love it. I liked having TaskBarX centering my taskbar icons a la a dock, but I uninstalled that too.


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## Uiroo (Aug 28, 2020)

Did you create a key command preset that had the right shortcut in it?
If not, do key command presets, Cubase likes to occasionally delete all custom shortcuts.

edit: i just realised, if windows doesn't accept the combination, that solution wouldn't help


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## Rasoul Morteza (Aug 28, 2020)

Hi,

1. What's your keyboard? Do you have an onboard Intel GPU?
2. Have you reinstalled your keyboard drivers?
3. Have you tried a clean boot?
4. Have you tried a SFC scan?
5. Have you tried disabling screen rotation in GPE?
6. Try turning off your machine, unplug the power cord and press the power button for 10 seconds, meanwhile perform ancient zulu chants.
8. Have you tried fixing the issue with a sledgehammer?

Cheers


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## marclawsonmusic (Aug 28, 2020)

Hi Alex,

I wonder if another program has hijacked that shortcut for something else. Some graphic card drivers install 'helper apps' that use keyboard shortcuts... it might be worth checking?

This article might be helpful:









How can I disable Ctrl+Shift+Arrow from causing my screen to flip?


Windows 7 Home Premium, Catalyst Control Center. Without any apparent reason, after booting my PC, I got this little balloon "HD 4600 Drivers updated". I did not install any new cards or drivers or




superuser.com





Hope you get it fixed soon!

EDIT: Saw you tried this already. Damn. Bummer. :-(


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## wickedw (Aug 28, 2020)

I'd start with killing (non-critical) processes running in the background. Try the combination after each process you kill. If your processor has a graphic chip and you're using a graphics card, then I would start by killing that driver first.


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## RonOrchComp (Aug 28, 2020)

AlexRuger said:


> The whole "something got corrupted" just isn't really a thing with properly-built OS's.



The idea that Windows is not a properly-built OS, is about as ridiculous as it gets.



AlexRuger said:


> I just got this computer completely up and running and haven't yet made a restore point.



And you were who's tech? You tech'd for some of the biggest names in Hollywood, and you don't know that the* first* thing you do when you get a computer completely up and running, is set a restore point AND image the OS? I am not trying to rag on you here, but that makes no sense.

Have you accessed *Control Panel\Ease of Access\Ease of Access Center\Make the keyboard easier to use *and investigated everything there?

Have you tried uninstalling the kbd from *kbd prop*, and then letting Windows find it again?


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## Jdiggity1 (Aug 28, 2020)

I'm trying to break my key commands so that I can help resolve the issue, but so far i haven't been able to reproduce the problem.

I even did what most sane techs would never dare do..... installed the latest windows updates.
(all seems fine)


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## Technostica (Aug 28, 2020)

Have you tried turning it off and on again?
Maurice Moss


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## Ivan M. (Aug 28, 2020)

Did you maybe change your keyboard? I remember having issues in a game because the keyboard didn't support certain keys pressed simultaneously. Also, sometimes the order in which you press them matters.


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## AlexRuger (Aug 28, 2020)

RonOrchComp said:


> And you were who's tech? You tech'd for some of the biggest names in Hollywood, and you don't know that the* first* thing you do when you get a computer completely up and running, is set a restore point AND image the OS? I am not trying to rag on you here, but that makes no sense.



Yeah, I can tell you’re trying real hard. 

I’ve already addressed this. I was in the process of putting it through its paces before finalizing the setup and making images/restore points/bootable OS clones/etc. It’s just bad timing. Was literally the next thing on my to-do list. 

Considering that you’re being pretty rude, and multiple people are replying asking me if I’ve done things I’ve specifically said I’ve tried, I’d say we can shut this thread down.


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## Damarus (Aug 28, 2020)

Just in case you are still looking Alex... You may have come across this but worth a shot. Just thinking of not so obvious areas to look.





settings > search 'typing settings' > advanced keyboard settings > Input language hot keys
--
Another suggestion -
Filter keys, like sticky keys?


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## AlexRuger (Aug 28, 2020)

Thanks for the suggestion, already checked the former (no dice) and sticky keys/etc I had already disabled.


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## Synetos (Aug 28, 2020)

Maybe there is something in the Key Commands.XML file that is hosed?

You could edit the file and see if you have corruption in an entry, etc. Or copy it from another working system.

%AppData%\Roaming\Steinberg\Cubase 10.5_64\Key Commands.xml

You could look at the Character Map and see if there is something wrong in that?

Just a thought.

Did you build OS with Windows 10 2004? 
That is a buggy build. I got BSOD and have to rebuild my entire rig over the last couple days. Many hrs of work. If you have to rebuild OS again, roll back to 1909 and stay there for a while. That is what I did.


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## Jdiggity1 (Aug 28, 2020)

As Alex has mentioned, Reaper doesn't receive the command either. So it's something "above" the daw or active program.
Reminds me of when I installed a screen capture utility that ran in the background, it had its own key commands that overruled any other application I was using.
Obviously impossible to troubleshoot properly over the forum (and I'm not sure Alex even asked us to), but the symptoms certainly sound like a utility in the taskbar (or invisible) such as remote desktop or capture software that is overruling the DAW.


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## AlexRuger (Aug 28, 2020)

Jdiggity1 said:


> Obviously impossible to troubleshoot properly over the forum (and I'm not sure Alex even asked us to)


Thank you for pointing that out -- I was really just venting, not explicate asking for help. Obviously I appreciate the (non-snarky) suggestions, but really I was just blowing off steam.

And yes @Synetos I'm on Build 2004. It's been completely stable otherwise.


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## SergeD (Aug 28, 2020)

You could try to remap your shortcut specifically for Cubase with Autohotkey. Maybe it could confirm if, as marclawsonmus suggested, something hijacks combination keys for it's own purpose (Dell does it with function keys like F1).


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## RonOrchComp (Aug 29, 2020)

That's too bad my post was deleted. I made a good point.

And thanks, AR for not quoting the part of my post where I offered up assistance. If you don't want it, fine.


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## edhamilton (Sep 1, 2020)

Once upon a time - this forum, and the northern most one where it all started - was filled with the kindest, most helpful people.


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## PaulieDC (Sep 2, 2020)

Alex, I just checked my Key Command list which I haven't altered (Cubase 10.5 Pro on Win 10 pro latest blah blah blah), and it has just CTRL + [Up or Down Arrow] for zooming tracks in or out vertically, no ALT key. It worked for me. Adding ALT actually gave me nothing as a response. Not sure if this has been mentioned or if it's helpful, BUT, I didn't know about that key command before and I'll now be using it. So thanks!


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## PaulieDC (Sep 2, 2020)

Also never hurts to right-click the Start button open a Command Prompt as Admin (or Powershell as Admin if that's your option) and run *sfc /scannow*. That will fix some Windows system file issues, even if it finishes and said it can't. Takes about 6-7 minutes to run. There are plenty of other admin commands but I stick with that as normal maintenance, simple and effective. No issues at all with 2004 update so far.


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## MartinH. (Sep 2, 2020)

SergeD said:


> You could try to remap your shortcut specifically for Cubase with Autohotkey. Maybe it could confirm if, as marclawsonmus suggested, something hijacks combination keys for it's own purpose (Dell does it with function keys like F1).



Slightly offtopic, but autohotkey is amazing! Well worth learning for every Windows user imho. I'm using it for example in combination with curl to upload files from the explorer to my webspace via ftp and copy the http links of the files into the clipboard. All with one keyboard shortcut.


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