# Quit antidepressants - music seems less exciting



## metalchord (Jan 13, 2020)

Hello guys
I did post a similar post here couple years back, but wanted to hear your insight again

In the last 10 years Iv'e been on couple of SSRI & SNRI, all was good beside the side effects I didn't like, usually fatigue and some weird dreams, and it also helped with my IBS.
In the last year they seems to be less effective to me (still get depressed sometimes ) and I seemed to be *more *anxious and the side effects bugged me more,so I decided to quit.
I want to add that also In the last couple years I turned pro and I'm making money with my music.

Now that I'm 3 months "clean" There seems to be more positive issues, I'm less anxious and more relaxed but and this is a big but I'm less excited with making music.
In terms of sound and music (mines and others) everything seems to sound "ok"not mindblowing or amazing like I felt when I was on the pill. I feel like I'm not admiring good sounds like I used to be, for example in the past I used to buy a sample library and get really excited with the sounds, instant inspiration made me takes sounds and build a pallet of sounds and eventually creating a tune.
Now everything sound compressed and harsh, to an extent, I still enjoy music but not excited like I used to be, when I listen to my tracks now they seems very bright and digital (as well as other's music)
From the reading I did it seems to be some sort of depression because the excitement seems to have gotten worse (a little) with other aspects like socializing and approaching music companies to get a deal, right before I quit I was excited with getting a new client and sent emails and believe in myself more, now I really don't want to send emails.. it's like I'm ok without music

Now.. I'm still functioning well and I can create music even if it less enjoyable, but I'm worried that the excitement isn't going to be back..
any of you can relate to my story? any tips?

I'm also trying to eat healthy and exercise and it seems to help..


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## Tim_Wells (Jan 14, 2020)

I wouldn't worry too much about it. Your excitement about music will probably come back. It's not unusual to go through different phases in life. Especially right after getting off anti-depressants and other meds. So be good to yourself and don't beat yourself up. 

I got totally away from music for several years because my day job got so demanding. It was challenging to get back into it. My musical chops had fallen off and there was(is) so much to learn about all the technology. It was frustrating and not terribly enjoyable for the 6-months to a year. But now I'm really enjoying it and excited. I kind of had to "fake it till I made it".

To me it sounds like your growing and headed in the right direction. Keep doing that and things are bound to work out great.


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## SupremeFist (Jan 14, 2020)

To me it sounds like you are experiencing some anhedonia, the inability to derive pleasure from normally pleasurable experiences, which may be a sign of returning depression. Maybe see your doctor and talk about alternative medication options? Take care.


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## Greg (Jan 14, 2020)

I feel ya, I struggle with depression as well and know what you mean about losing interest in things that used to put you over the moon. Sounds like your brain needs time to recalibrate to being off the medicine and needs to learn to create its own dopamine again. The number one thing that helped me turn the corner and feel excellent again was snowboarding. Exercise is amazing for creating endorphins but it has to be fully engaging and short periods of intense stress to really get the benefits from what I've read & experienced. 

Did you have a blood panel done recently? Vitamin D deficiency is very common especially this time of year. Also is the IBS under control? I had digestion issues as well that seemed directly tied to my mood. Inflammation of the gi tract can make it difficult to absorb the nutrients you need. CBD & Turmeric might be worth a try?

Sounds like your depression is mostly physiological which is a lot easier to deal with than when it stems from being unhappy with your life or in terribly difficult situations. Hope you're right as rain soon and feel free to PM me if you feel like chatting more.


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## metalchord (Jan 14, 2020)

Hi guys
Appreciate the help!
@*SupremeFist *, I think you are right , when I saw my doctor last week he did give me a different medication to try which operate on Dopamine which treats Anhedonia.
I didn't take it yet but I now think maybe I should..

@Greg I did try all of the activities and methods you stated , it helped but not solve the core issue, I will gladly chat with you, thanks!

Best regards


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## SupremeFist (Jan 14, 2020)

metalchord said:


> Hi guys
> Appreciate the help!
> @*SupremeFist *, I think you are right , when I saw my doctor last week he did give me a different medication to try which operate on Dopamine which treats Anhedonia.
> I didn't take it yet but I now think maybe I should..
> ...


Hey, at least you did a positive thing seeing your doctor. Sometimes the advice to take enough exercise etc just doesn't get a person far enough. It's important to recognise that there should be absolutely no shame involved if it turns out you need certain medication to live your best life, just as there's no shame in needing pills for heart or liver problems etc. Good luck!


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## MartinH. (Jan 15, 2020)

metalchord said:


> In terms of sound and music (mines and others) everything seems to sound "ok"not mindblowing or amazing like I felt when I was on the pill. I feel like I'm not admiring good sounds like I used to be, for example in the past I used to buy a sample library and get really excited with the sounds, instant inspiration made me takes sounds and build a pallet of sounds and eventually creating a tune.
> Now everything sound compressed and harsh, to an extent, I still enjoy music but not excited like I used to be, when I listen to my tracks now they seems very bright and digital (as well as other's music)


There are a couple of things that can cause this, so you need to watch out for a correlation vs causation fallacy when making your conclusions.

I've heard someone say "When you start to learn mixing, all pro mixes sound amazing and all yours sound like garbage. You can tell that you are getting better at mixing, when the mixes of the pros will gradually start to sound like garbage as well. At no point, will you think your own mixes sound amazing, but others will start to tell you that they do, as you get better".
Probably not a good blanket generalization, but for _some _people it will likely be true. 

Then you're getting _paid _now for your work. There's almost nothing as effective in killing intrinsic motivation to do something, as applying extrinsic motivation aka payment. If someone can work fulltime as a composer and not lose their passion for music, imho they are really fucking lucky. I know I wouldn't be so lucky, and that's why I'm quite happy to keep this as a hobby.

And last but not least, there's some correlation between getting older and getting so _jaded _that it becomes harder and harder to find things that blow your mind. I think the process is being accellerated through the unhealthy environment that we live in. Social media, youtube, flashy ads everywhere, constant streams of novelty at your fingertips, all media being hyper-condensed for the decreasing attention spans... 
I have heard many people make similar comments about their satisfaction with things they used to love, and there seems to be a definite downward trend in that kind of enjoyment as people get older, and I haven't seen any indication of there being a clear way to stop or reverse the effect.
Do note however, that treatable and temporary forms of depression can sound very very similar on paper, and imho you're best off to stay the course and attempt those classical treatments like medications and/or therapy.

You can also take a critical look at all your vices and think about what kinds of substances or behaviours you might be addicted to and how that might negatively affect your dopamine system. E.g. I'm definitely addicted to forums and mindless internet browsing and I'm trying to cut down on that. I don't think I'll be posting here as much as I used to in the future, or at least that's the plan.
If you want to implement changes, I'd do them one at a time, but really commit to making permanent change and be ready to get back in the saddle if you slip up. Learning to be good at getting back up is 10 times more important than never slipping up when it comes to changing habbits imho.

Also you could try meditation. It's pretty much guarantueed to have very positive long-term effects on you, even if it should not turn out to fix the issue that made you open this thread. I should get back on track with that too. I 100% believe it's worth it, but it's not easy to stay consistent.




metalchord said:


> when I saw my doctor last week he did give me a different medication to try which operate on Dopamine which treats Anhedonia.


Which one is it? Please report back in 2 to 3 months and let us know if it helped. I'm sure that a fair few composers struggle more with the dopamine related side of depression, and there aren't a lot of drugs that apply to this.


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## metalchord (Jan 15, 2020)

MartinH. said:


> There are a couple of things that can cause this, so you need to watch out for a correlation vs causation fallacy when making your conclusions.
> 
> I've heard someone say "When you start to learn mixing, all pro mixes sound amazing and all yours sound like garbage. You can tell that you are getting better at mixing, when the mixes of the pros will gradually start to sound like garbage as well. At no point, will you think your own mixes sound amazing, but others will start to tell you that they do, as you get better".
> Probably not a good blanket generalization, but for _some _people it will likely be true.
> ...



The medication called "wellbutrin" I will report back in a few weeks since it's starting to make a difference in 2-4 weeks.
I really get all your points and experienced them while I was on SNRI's Pro Music did sound bad to my ears sometimes (and I can tell when someone made a bad mix) and I get what you said about learning to mix, the difference now is that I get no excitement from music for couple weeks now, sure I can enjoy a good tune but it's not in the same level that I'm used to.
The "Anhedonia" (like SupremeFist posted here) it's with other areas of my life so I guess no meditation and exercise can cure it although it's sure helping!
I'm now working against contract (for a major music library) so I can work because I "know what to do that sound good" for me it's like job as a waiter or in construction; I can do it, I can get creative but there is no spark whats so ever.


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## John Longley (Jan 15, 2020)

A few things:
1. Although some people have well known challenge getting off SSRIs, be careful attributing too much to a med change. I live my life on meds (I'm bipolar) and although they're a key factor for me, their impact is more subtle than I used to think-- it's just that protection is needed for people like me. It's easy to start overthinking meds, they're a savior or they're killing us.... Usually it's in the middle, like most things.
2. I've made great, mediocre and terrible music while manic, depressed, "normal" on 1350mg/lithium, unmedicated and every other mood state. The major factors seem to simply be....very fleeting and requiring focus and lots of luck. It's work and big creative lulls happen with all moods and meds.
3. When I have been ill, or overly sedated (in retrospect) I have still made some good stuff, but often my ability to know is ruined and I have deleted a lot when not able to see it. Later I might hear a rough bounce and realize what I have done. In my 20s I did this a LOT. In my late 30s and 40s I know not to trust my assesment without some rest and perspective so I save the crap until I can really decide.
4. I'm not a doctor or your dad, but I hope you are followed post titration off your meds as it's a delicate time even if it's the right choice for you and your fam. 

Hang in there, keep making healthy choices and let the music come when it wants.


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## givemenoughrope (Jan 15, 2020)

Maybe listen to some different or more exciting music. I know that sounds sarcastic and snarky or looks so on the page but it’s possible that what felt like 70mph just feels like 30. Every couple years I need a jolt myself. What have you been listening to?


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## metalchord (Jan 16, 2020)

@John Longley
I get you, It's weird, I tried taking the new medicine the doctor gave me yesterday, and even if it's suppose to work after couple of weeks I started feeling better after couple of hours.
Like the safety net you suggested,
I don't know if this is placebo, but I can swear there was something that made me feel better.
I'm sure putting more weight on me being on medication but also I guess this is something I need.
Today I feel like I felt before I took it, So I'll just have to wait and see.
Maybe I do have genetic shortage in Dopamine..

About your 3rd point (and I agree with your 1,2 completely) Iv'e notice it's more difficult for me to assess if my music is good or not, like all my confidence from previous albums I created was disappearing,so I got scared and I get feedback from a colleague.

@givemenoughrope I don't think it's genre related it's like being emotional bluntness.


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## John Longley (Jan 16, 2020)

metalchord said:


> @John Longley
> I get you, It's weird, I tried taking the new medicine the doctor gave me yesterday, and even if it's suppose to work after couple of weeks I started feeling better after couple of hours.
> Like the safety net you suggested,
> I don't know if this is placebo, but I can swear there was something that made me feel better.
> ...


I just try to remember even the most even tempered of us never has objectivity all the time. All we can do is make the best choices we can at the time, rely on those we trust and educate ourselves on the objective data. We can defeat our own best interests so easily and you sometimes don't notice until later. I don't know what med you're on, but while most drugs you would likely take need 3-6 weeks to really work, it can be sooner. Some of the options, like Atypicals, work immediately on some level-- so whether it's placebo or not doesn't matter, just stay on it if you've chosen to try it for a period (commit to a certain length and then talk to the doctor again). Setting ourselves up for success is all we can do and it's ok to have creatively dry spells. Sometimes you just need a break, hopefully you have a dependable and trustworthy person you can touch in with for some perspective day to day. Just try not to devalue what you create when your mood is flat or very low, until you have the perspective to evaluate it. If I had to only value things when my mood is an 11/10, I'd have almost nothing to show  sometimes powerful stuff comes from all states.


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## metalchord (Jan 21, 2020)

John Longley said:


> I just try to remember even the most even tempered of us never has objectivity all the time. All we can do is make the best choices we can at the time, rely on those we trust and educate ourselves on the objective data. We can defeat our own best interests so easily and you sometimes don't notice until later. I don't know what med you're on, but while most drugs you would likely take need 3-6 weeks to really work, it can be sooner. Some of the options, like Atypicals, work immediately on some level-- so whether it's placebo or not doesn't matter, just stay on it if you've chosen to try it for a period (commit to a certain length and then talk to the doctor again). Setting ourselves up for success is all we can do and it's ok to have creatively dry spells. Sometimes you just need a break, hopefully you have a dependable and trustworthy person you can touch in with for some perspective day to day. Just try not to devalue what you create when your mood is flat or very low, until you have the perspective to evaluate it. If I had to only value things when my mood is an 11/10, I'd have almost nothing to show  sometimes powerful stuff comes from all states.



Hi mate
Wanted to thank you, your words really make more sense to me now, I thought that being on anti depressants really was the holy grail for me ( because of the meds I created amazing music) but now I can tell it's allot more then that, the meds can help but it's not an essence. Like I said in previous post, started to take "wellbutrin" about a week ago my mood fluctuate, but I noticed that I can force myself into creativity and create cool stuff even being on a "sad" note.
Still I don't think it's working yet and I'll give it more time.


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## John Longley (Jan 21, 2020)

metalchord said:


> Hi mate
> Wanted to thank you, your words really make more sense to me now, I thought that being on anti depressants really was the holy grail for me ( because of the meds I created amazing music) but now I can tell it's allot more then that, the meds can help but it's not an essence. Like I said in previous post, started to take "wellbutrin" about a week ago my mood fluctuate, but I noticed that I can force myself into creativity and create cool stuff even being on a "sad" note.
> Still I don't think it's working yet and I'll give it more time.


It's a long slow battle and I'm really happy I could help in any way. We don't always get to feel happy, but we can always do what we can in the moment to make the best of it, even if it's throwing yourself in the shower . Good luck and feel free to follow up anytime. Happy to hear your music is happening!


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## JEPA (Jan 21, 2020)

I am musician full time. And the most depressing time in my life I left music for a long time. I found back to music when I found solutions to OTHER aspects of my life that didn't have any relationship to music, e.g. partner, family, children, stability, perspective on projects, etc. My advice based on my experience is to also look at other aspects of your life that need attention. If you take care of the whole, your house, your plants, your pet and the relationship to family and important persons in your life, music will come from alone to you again, because there will be place again for it. My experience was that I needed to resolve my "problems" prior to get back to music.

Best of best,
Jorge


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## InLight-Tone (Jan 21, 2020)

Dwelling the majority of one's LIFETIME indoors is a recipe for depression. WE are physical, biological organisms. Even pursuing something as ennobling as music/sound, will not take away the BIOLOGICAL imperitive that WE are not whole without being daily participating in the sources of LIFE, i.e., Sun/Light, Air, Water & Earth. Meds were invented to enable one to adapt to the unnatural, but WE adapt at a price, and the side effects are SEVERE. Better to strike a balance between honoring the flesh and the art. The suffering artist is a cliche not worth pursuing...


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## John Longley (Jan 21, 2020)

InLight-Tone said:


> Dwelling the majority of one's LIFETIME indoors is a recipe for depression. WE are physical, biological organisms. Even pursuing something as ennobling as music/sound, will not take away the BIOLOGICAL imperitive that WE are not whole without being daily participating in the sources of LIFE, i.e., Sun/Light, Air, Water & Earth. Meds were invented to enable one to adapt to the unnatural, but WE adapt at a price, and the side effects are SEVERE. Better to strike a balance between honoring the flesh and the art. The suffering artist is a cliche not worth pursuing...



Medication is a serious decision. I've had most complications you can have aside from renal failure or death. I need to be on meds, and I can assure you that if we all lived outside drinking from open ponds of crystal water and eating organic jungle fruit, while running free in the wilds-- there would still be very very sick people who need meds. They are not for everybody, and they can be over used and YES, they can harm you- but this advice doesn't work broadly and at worst it's destructive. Part of the reason nobody talks about their mental health sincerely is the onslaught of "eat better, organic, no meds, have you gone for a walk" wisdom that is dumped into the convo.

Healthy habits of all kinds are happy, but when somebody wants to talk about meds and music-- lets not be patronizing, and just allow ourselves to talk about meds and music.

I'm not the OP so I'll go easy


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## jmauz (Jan 21, 2020)

If it's available in your area, please research TMS (Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation) to treat your depression. 

I've suffered from depression all my life, tried many different medications, and NOTHING has come close to the efficacy of TMS, and NO SIDE EFFECTS. It's simply been life-changing. 

Good luck my friend, keep your head up. I'm rootin' for you.


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## InLight-Tone (Jan 21, 2020)

John Longley said:


> Part of the reason nobody talks about their mental health sincerely is the onslaught of "eat better, organic, no meds, have you gone for a walk" wisdom that is dumped into the convo.


Agree to disagree. IMO, OUR biological needs to stay mentally SANE are far beyond what most can conceive let alone achieve in OUR modern financial comes first prison system...
Thats why we have succesful rock stars offing themselves with EVERY financial opportunity. HAPPINESS does NOT lie in making money and accumulating FAME....


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## John Longley (Jan 21, 2020)

jmauz said:


> If it's available in your area, please research TMS (Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation) to treat your depression.
> 
> I've suffered from depression all my life, tried many different medications, and NOTHING has come close to the efficacy of TMS, and NO SIDE EFFECTS. It's simply been life-changing.
> 
> Good luck my friend, keep your head up. I'm rootin' for you.


It does have moderate efficacy for some people. Not as good as ECT or ketamine or mushrooms, but good and pretty safe. Sadly expensive still for many.


InLight-Tone said:


> Agree to disagree. IMO, OUR biological needs to stay mentally SANE are far beyond what most can conceive let alone achieve in OUR modern financial comes first prison system...
> Thats why we have succesful rock stars offing themselves with EVERY financial opportunity. HAPPINESS does NOT lie in making money and accumulating FAME....


Far out. Some of my schizophrenic and bipolar (like me) pals will come visit and we can roam the woods together under a full moon. We'll cast our meds into the sea and you can care for us with clean living. As for fame, well I guess I can give that up...if I have to. Can I keep the riches?


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## NYC Composer (Jan 21, 2020)

i think one thing that has helped me a great deal is taking a hard daily walk in Central Park. Up hills, down hills, about five miles a day, which takes me approximately an hour and fifteen minutes. It builds endorphins, gets me some sunlight, some fresh air-and I’ve become a bit of a bird watcher There are hawks and ducks, Canada geese and cardinals, etc etc. A daily walk takes me out of myself for a little while. I’ve been at it for about 6 years and it’s made me a little lighter in spirit.

You may find yourself a little nervous on Wellbutrin. Nothing to worry about, really. Good luck to you.


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## metalchord (Jan 22, 2020)

NYC Composer said:


> i think one thing that has helped me a great deal is taking a hard daily walk in Central Park. Up hills, down hills, about five miles a day, which takes me approximately an hour and fifteen minutes. It builds endorphins, gets me some sunlight, some fresh air-and I’ve become a bit of a bird watcher There are hawks and ducks, Canada geese and cardinals, etc etc. A daily walk takes me out of myself for a little while. I’ve been at it for about 6 years and it’s made me a little lighter in spirit.
> 
> You may find yourself a little nervous on Wellbutrin. Nothing to worry about, really. Good luck to you.


Hi NYC
I actually do feel more anxious in the last couple of days (8 days on welbutrin) do you mean not worried about it because it goes away after a certain period? do you have good experience with it?
about high intensity walks, I try to do at least 3 timea week and it helps allot...
Thanks



JEPA said:


> I am musician full time. And the most depressing time in my life I left music for a long time. I found back to music when I found solutions to OTHER aspects of my life that didn't have any relationship to music, e.g. partner, family, children, stability, perspective on projects, etc. My advice based on my experience is to also look at other aspects of your life that need attention. If you take care of the whole, your house, your plants, your pet and the relationship to family and important persons in your life, music will come from alone to you again, because there will be place again for it. My experience was that I needed to resolve my "problems" prior to get back to music.
> 
> Best of best,
> Jorge


I think this is part of the problem, I try to figure it out, so do you say once you worked on yournon music related issues your passion to music return?

thanks for the input


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## NYC Composer (Jan 22, 2020)

Metal,

It’s just sort of an up drug. I’ve not taken it, but friends and family have, pretty successfully. It’s just a little jittery. If it gets uncomfortable, talk to your MD about dosing.


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## JEPA (Jan 22, 2020)

metalchord said:


> you say once you worked on yournon music related issues your passion to music return?


So is it, I've worked on them and the result is a better and happier life, including music, my expression art.


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## JEPA (Jan 22, 2020)

metalchord said:


> you say once you worked on yournon music related issues your passion to music return?


So is it, I've worked on them and the result is a better and happier life, including music, my expression art.


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## creativeforge (Jan 24, 2020)

I've been off SSRI for 4 years, and I've experienced a deep sense of loss toward the 12 years I've used them. Short-term memory problems, sizzling creativity gone, dexterity reduced, etc. So it is a very personal, case by case. I'm readjusting to my life and giving time to the Muse to come back on her own terms. Step by step.



givemenoughrope said:


> Maybe listen to some different or more exciting music. I know that sounds sarcastic and snarky or looks so on the page but it’s possible that what felt like 70mph just feels like 30. Every couple years I need a jolt myself. What have you been listening to?



I personally go back to the music I listened to in the '70s and a few other periods. I listen to whole albums, and it really boosts my mood. Many bands have stopped recording and touring for many years, until they rejoined to carry on, usually with new additions.

Basically, I'm going where the sound used to excite me when I was a lad. And I explore other genres of music (lately the Armenian duduk). Discovering how these sounds make me respond inside has been awesome.

I've been off SSRIs since 2016 when I separated. Looking back, I had lost 12 years of creativity on those meds. If music springs from a personal need, if it fills a unique function on our life, it's always going to be there. The creativity aspect has to be helped I think. In my case, anyways. And pressing through with being focused to carry a project to completion. That's the challenge in my case: persistent motivation.

Now I only use meds for ADHD, and it works better. I can't mix certain meds anymore. If Wellbutrin helps you, take note and clear the fog around this. Meds don't take away from our talent. If they keep us from harm or destitution, it's a big plus! 

All the best, as you see there are many creatives who are faced with that reality.

Cheers,

Andre


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## metalchord (Jan 25, 2020)

creativeforge said:


> I've been off SSRI for 4 years, and I've experienced a deep sense of loss toward the 12 years I've used them. Short-term memory problems, sizzling creativity gone, dexterity reduced, etc. So it is a very personal, case by case. I'm readjusting to my life and giving time to the Muse to come back on her own terms. Step by step.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thank you for sharing you stroy,
Iv'e actually had increased dextirity, amazing creativity while on meds, but had allot of not so good things like :Increased OCD (I now actually communicate much better) fatigue, vivid dreams etc..
About the type of music I don't think it's the case, every genre sounds dull , sure, sometimes it sound ok but I don't find myself carving sounds like I used to be, I have no interest in taking my mixes to the "next level" like I used to be.
One more side effect Iv'e noticed while I was on meds, I didn't left my comfort zone, everything was good, so why change..

I stopped taking Wellbutrin, it only gave migraines , and not elevated my mood. maybe there are more meds like I used to take (SNRI)
I will try to take more time (without meds) maybe my brain needs more time to adjust (it's only been 3 months since discontinue the med) , I'm also having decreased motivation in other areas of my life..
Anyway will see how it goes

Thanks!


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## MartinH. (Jan 25, 2020)

There was a really good 2-part article on creativity and flow for composers on a blog, but nowadays you can only read the web-archived version of it: 



Modern Film Composer » The Science of Hacking Creativity and Motivation: Part 1





Modern Film Composer » The Science of Hacking Creativity and Motivation: Part 2


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## robgb (Jan 25, 2020)

I know they are of benefit to some, but I will not take anti-depression or anti-anxiety medication. I made the mistake of requesting from a general practitioner something that would "take the edge off" when I was feeling anxious about my health. I was given Lexipro and it fucked me up so badly—leading to full bore panic attacks and crippling anxiety, followed by severe insomnia and "brain sparks"—that I was ready to throw myself under a bus. I stopped taking it and it has taken me four years to feel normal again. I was told by a shrink that there are other medications I could take that won't have the same side effects, but I'm unwilling to take the chance. I have decided that the best way to get over any anxiety I have is to learn to deal with it without medication. This decision has served me well and I'm 99% back to my normal self.

Again, I know such medications work for some, but not for me.


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## jon wayne (Jan 25, 2020)

robgb said:


> I know they are of benefit to some, but I will not take anti-depression or anti-anxiety medication. I made the mistake of requesting from a general practitioner something that would "take the edge off" when I was feeling anxious about my health. I was given Lexipro and it fucked me up so badly—leading to full bore panic attacks and crippling anxiety, followed by severe insomnia and "brain sparks"—that I was ready to throw myself under a bus. I stopped taking it and it has taken me four years to feel normal again. I was told by a shrink that there are other medications I could take that won't have the same side effects, but I'm unwilling to take the chance. I have decided that the best way to get over any anxiety I have is to learn to deal with it without medication. This decision has served me well and I'm 99% back to my normal self.
> 
> Again, I know such medications work for some, but not for me.


It is strange about Lexipro. It made me suicidal. Then I switched to it’s original drug, Celexa and it was a miracle drug for me. The trade off for me was that my creativity suffered. It didn’t stop, it just wasn’t like before. Because of the level of depression and anxiety I had suffered through for almost 2 years, I am not comfortable just walking away from meds, but I miss the creativity. I have gotten out of the composer’s hamster wheel, but of course, I would love to write amazing music again.


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## robgb (Jan 25, 2020)

jon wayne said:


> It is strange about Lexipro. It made me suicidal. Then I switched to it’s original drug, Celexa and it was a miracle drug for me.


My shrink said that Lexipro should not be given to males.


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## jon wayne (Jan 25, 2020)

robgb said:


> My shrink said that Lexipro should not be given to males.


But I told him I identified as a woman!


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## jon wayne (Jan 25, 2020)

That was a joke.


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## creativeforge (Jan 25, 2020)

robgb said:


> I know they are of benefit to some, but I will not take anti-depression or anti-anxiety medication. I made the mistake of requesting from a general practitioner something that would "take the edge off" when I was feeling anxious about my health. I was given Lexipro and it fucked me up so badly—leading to full bore panic attacks and crippling anxiety, followed by severe insomnia and "brain sparks"—that I was ready to throw myself under a bus. I stopped taking it and it has taken me four years to feel normal again. I was told by a shrink that there are other medications I could take that won't have the same side effects, but I'm unwilling to take the chance. I have decided that the best way to get over any anxiety I have is to learn to deal with it without medication. This decision has served me well and I'm 99% back to my normal self.
> 
> Again, I know such medications work for some, but not for me.



Wow... Lexapro did the same for me. I had been off meds for 3 years, and my doc prescribed Vyvanse plus Lexapro. I spent 3 days reliving nearly the same reactions than two overdoses of coke 25 years ago. It freaked me out big time. I finally stopped that. I decided I wouldn't take antidepressants, only Adderall for ADHD. 

One of the thing I find is that - living with the edge brought about by my condition is kind of part of my creativity. Creativity seems to have been a go-to tool early on in life to help me deal with heavy inner dynamics triggered by a heavy environment. Does that make sense? Creativity as a tool for survival and inner recalibration. 

Cheers,

Andre


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## metalchord (Mar 14, 2020)

Hello Guys!
I thought I will share some update about my situation since I got so many good advice from you.
So since November I quit antidepressants, I struggled with depression and anxiety after two months which was a result from withdrawals syndrome! I quit the drug way to fast and thought my depression is back! after trying 2 new pills for one week each time situation was worsened, I quit everything altogether, it was rough month but now in the last week and a half I feel very good, almost no depression or anxiety , I also practiced CBT mainly from the book Feeling Good by David D. Burns , I also took some of your advice about intense workouts, walking, nutrition, all helped!

Like I said I'm now feeling good without any medication, I got some motivation back and started listening and creating music again, one thing still remains which is minor compared to all the benefits I got but it still bothers me, is the ability to be appreciate sound and massive excitement I had from creating music.

Now, music still sound more analytical to my ears, it is not as bad as it was 2 months ago, which everything sounded compressed and digital in a disgusting way, I now can enjoy music again , but it still bit harsh to my ears, if I'm writing a cue I still don't get the WOW factor from creating an insane beat which get me in the mood for creating and developing from hours.

I definitely dont want to take SSRI's again for that reason, since there is no real problem beside slightly decrease in motivation and enjoyment from sound.
I hope what I'm saying make since, and hope it will improve in time, but do you think maybe ADHD medication could "fix" that? maybe my brain is still rebooting from 8 years on antidepressants?
What was it that the SSRI's did which made me feel more exited about music?
I'm more connected to myself and my emotions now, I communicate better and this is a good thing.
Thanks again for your wonderful support!

@creativeforge
@Tim_Wells
@SupremeFist
@Greg
@InLight-Tone
@John Longley


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## creativeforge (Mar 14, 2020)

metalchord said:


> I hope what I'm saying make since, and hope it will improve in time, but do you think maybe ADHD medication could "fix" that? maybe my brain is still rebooting from 8 years on antidepressants?
> What was it that the SSRI's did which made me feel more exited about music?



Many people with ADHD have found ways to do life without meds. You obviously have found a path for yourself that works!  I think if you continue your practices and strengthen your outlook on life via CBT, I'm not your doctor but I think you'll be fine. You seem to make good use of practices and methods, and that is a strength.

In light of this, two sources came to mind as far as inspiration to further continue your amazing journey to creativity and well-being:

*1- Oblique strategies (Brian Eno)*








Oblique Strategies: Brian Eno’s Prompts for Overcoming Creative Block, Inspired by John Cage


“If a thing can be said, it can be said simply.”




www.brainpickings.org





*2- The Artist's Way (Julia Cameron)*







A book that I found quite inspiring, with daily task you can do in order to unplug the well of creativity inside of you.




metalchord said:


> I'm more connected to myself and my emotions now, I communicate better and this is a good thing.
> Thanks again for your wonderful support!



Well, believe me, that's more than a lot of people can say about themselves... 

Cheers,

Andre


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## gsilbers (Mar 14, 2020)

metalchord said:


> Hello guys
> I did post a similar post here couple years back, but wanted to hear your insight again
> 
> In the last 10 years Iv'e been on couple of SSRI & SNRI, all was good beside the side effects I didn't like, usually fatigue and some weird dreams, and it also helped with my IBS.
> ...




im sure everyone has a specific story. but ill share mine. maybe itll help. 
my parents used anti depressants a lot. my father was constantly changing due to tolerance and each time each change was like a heart attack. they where immigrants from argentina. and over there seems like half the population is psiciatrists. so they took antidepressants and also valium/etc. 
during my teen years and later they sent me to a psicatrist and of course as rebel teen i got the antidepressants. but im not from argentina and all my friends in Venezuela just saw that as wierd. why not just drink your problems away. everyone has issues. so culturally i saw things differently. now there is a stereo type in Venezuela that argentinians are depressed as fuck. but back then i didntk now. 
but for them history and familiarity said antidepressants are ok. now of course i realzies they just had a lot of issues to deal with and just went for antidepressants. 
anyways, i later stopped using them and it was wierd. it felt like i was feeling again. antidepressants helps by not getting too sad or too happy. so afterwards it was of course difficult. and anxiety of course was a huge thing. but i managed. having friends and a goal helps. 

anyways, i still felt the anxiety and could not sleep. so i tried the pharmacy sleep aid and that left me dizzy the next morning. so i tried melatonin. and it kinda worked. i also tried kava kava and it was nice. but kava is not nie to the liver so stopped. i once enter a NYC supplement store back in 2003 and one russian dude working there asked me what i wanted and i just said kava kava and he said witht he obvious thick russian accent " kava bad for liver" here take this. and he gave me L-Theanine. 
remember that back then there was no "googling" so i just tried it. and it worked. i was able to relax and with the melatonin go to sleep. 

but one thing that was important and took forever to figure out. these supplements that kind of relax you and are over the counter, the idea is that you dont use them like you do heavy antidepressants and xanax.. the idea is to lower your tolerance using friends, psicologists, life changes, to lower your level of anxiety to where these supplements work wonders. and no stigma. 
just google L-theanine and caffeine and youll see its one of the main thing programmers in san fransisco do to enhance work and get stuff done. 

for music appreciation i would say weed. but for me, i have to get drunk in order to get high becuase the anxiety of weed is too much. (no matter what "strain") i overthink way too much. and socially is a disaster. 
but once every 2-4 weeks or so i do get some rum, beer and weed and just take the day off mentally and just try to enjoy making and listening to music in the studio. no pressure etc. once music or sound design is a day job, then the fun gets lost easily. but again, if weed is not for you then dont do it. 

now im trying other things. im doing kratom. which affects the opiod receptors. and there are other things like Kanna, Tryptophan, Rhodiola, macuna dopa and a few others which are natural anti anxiety. 
the one big warning is to not take these if you are taking SSRI or other antidepressants. 
kratom is cool. white kratom does have some caffeine like effects and also relaxes. im trying to get energized w/o coffee so thats why i went for it. so far so good. there are some warnings so better read up on it. 
but to me the best is L-Theanine. and taking low doses helps not feel anxious but also dont feel groggy . there is no side effects or risk of addiction. helps with sleep or can take with caffeine to feel more productive (high caffeine w no jitters) 

so anyways, the big take away is that im very paranoid with psiciatrist specially in the USA where they treat antidepresants like candy and they need recurring appintment$. im sure some are good and some poeple defenitly need it. but in general i feel the system is rigged to get more drugs, hence the whole opiods epidemic. btw In venezuela we have to do social cummunity service for last year of school to graduate and i did mine in a mental asylum... now.. THATS having mental problems. 
but in general i think its better going to an experienced (older) psicologist who talks to you.. not only listens. and seeing his recommendations w/o the bias of having to rx. 
and whatch out for "life coaches". 

and the other thing is that if you feel like external help is needed there are natural supplements that are mild and working towards getting to that mild level requires some life changes and help from psicolgist to manage any issues. 

And what also help is having a stable job. a normal 9-5 job non music related. 
And the worse thing... you might just be getting old  why do you think record companies market so much music to teens? 

Also, maybe try listening to more music. if you have amazon prime, then get amazon music app and just try to listen to more music. 

i do sometimes feel the same. so hope this helps. and id like to read what others say.


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## metalchord (Mar 15, 2020)

gsilbers said:


> im sure everyone has a specific story. but ill share mine. maybe itll help.
> my parents used anti depressants a lot. my father was constantly changing due to tolerance and each time each change was like a heart attack. they where immigrants from argentina. and over there seems like half the population is psiciatrists. so they took antidepressants and also valium/etc.
> during my teen years and later they sent me to a psicatrist and of course as rebel teen i got the antidepressants. but im not from argentina and all my friends in Venezuela just saw that as wierd. why not just drink your problems away. everyone has issues. so culturally i saw things differently. now there is a stereo type in Venezuela that argentinians are depressed as fuck. but back then i didntk now.
> but for them history and familiarity said antidepressants are ok. now of course i realzies they just had a lot of issues to deal with and just went for antidepressants.
> ...


Hi 
Awesome! I will check the "L-Theanine" thing, I wanted to order it but because of the COVID thing I dont know.. maybe I should wait. I feel I'm slightly Anhedonic , I can work and everything but want more excitement from things, right now unfortunately I cant afford therapy , so I'm using books and workshops. The chemical imbalance thing still remains a big mystery to me , maybe I'm ok and never needed SSRI's in the first place, since they elevate my mood but made feel worse in other ways (emotional blunting, apathy, more anxiety! (I didn't noticed it until I was titter off the drug) so right now hoping my receptors improves in time with top nutrition and all...


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