# Primer on VE Pro in Logic Pro X



## John Zuker (Nov 10, 2015)

Hi,

Long time Logic user here. I use VE (free version) for VSL instruments inside Logic with no issues. What is the advantage of using VE Pro within Logic for creating large templates with Kontakt, Play, VSL etc., vs. just using normal tracks in Logic. It has to do with efficient cpu use, processor threads, etc?? I know this has been discussed at length here, but this is new to me and I'm new to this forum.

Can somebody point me to a post/website/video etc explaining the advantages and also the how to's? (This is for use within one computer not using a slave for samples at the moment).

Thanks,

John Z


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## Peter Schwartz (Nov 10, 2015)

Dis-(but hopefully helpful)-claimer: the video I'm going to recommend is one I've authored for macprovideo called Designing Templates. It's totally Logic-specific, and I cover both single-computer and master/slave systems. Please have a gander at the macprovideo website and do a search for my name and you'll find it. Cheers!


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## John Zuker (Nov 10, 2015)

Peter Schwartz said:


> Dis-(but hopefully helpful)-claimer: the video I'm going to recommend is one I've authored for macprovideo called Designing Templates. It's totally Logic-specific, and I cover both single-computer and master/slave systems. Please have a gander at the macprovideo website and do a search for my name and you'll find it. Cheers!



Cool, thanks!


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## EastWest Lurker (Nov 10, 2015)

And if you want help setting up customized complimentary templates in VE Pro and Logic Pro, I am available for hire.


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## John Zuker (Nov 10, 2015)

EastWest Lurker said:


> And if you want help setting up customized complimentary templates in VE Pro and Logic Pro, I am available for hire.



Thanks!


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## John Zuker (Nov 10, 2015)

Peter Schwartz said:


> Dis-(but hopefully helpful)-claimer: the video I'm going to recommend is one I've authored for macprovideo called Designing Templates. It's totally Logic-specific, and I cover both single-computer and master/slave systems. Please have a gander at the macprovideo website and do a search for my name and you'll find it. Cheers!




Just saw the preview, Peter. Your video(s) appear to be what I'm looking for, and they seem pretty comprehensive. Do you explain _why_ one may want to do this in VE Pro vs. just opening up the libraries directly in Logic? The advantages, etc?


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## Peter Schwartz (Nov 10, 2015)

Hi John, yes, I definitely explain the whys and wherefores.


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## John Zuker (Nov 10, 2015)

Peter Schwartz said:


> Hi John, yes, I definitely explain the whys and wherefores.



Great, thanks!


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## Peter Schwartz (Nov 10, 2015)

You're welcome! I use incendiary imagery to explain said whys and wherefores. Fireballs. You'll see.


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## synthpunk (Nov 10, 2015)

Tobias Escher offers a free PDF on VE Pro setup, although some may not agree if it's the perfect way to setup VE Pro.

http://www.orchestraltemplates.com/tutorial.html


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## EastWest Lurker (Nov 10, 2015)

aesthete said:


> Tobias Escher offers a free PDF on VE Pro setup, although some may not agree if it's the perfect way to setup VE Pro.
> 
> http://www.orchestraltemplates.com/tutorial.html



I will go further than that. It is IMHO the wrong way for working it with Logic Pro.


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## kunst91 (Nov 10, 2015)

EastWest Lurker said:


> I will go further than that. It is IMHO the wrong way for working it with Logic Pro.



I agree. Have not yet had my (overdue) session with Jay yet, but I have implemented my templates along his general guidelines, and things are going great so far.


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## resound (Nov 10, 2015)

When setting up a template in Logic Pro X using VEPro and multi-timbral instruments, is there any difference between creating multitimbral tracks in Logic or connecting a multi-instrument in the Environment window to an instrument track? Is there any difference or benefit to working one way or the other?


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## mc_deli (Nov 11, 2015)

John Zuker said:


> What is the advantage of using VE Pro within Logic for creating large templates with Kontakt, Play, VSL etc., vs. just using normal tracks in Logic. (This is for use within one computer not using a slave for samples at the moment).



PSA from my extensive reading on this and setting up my own modest template. Advantages of VEPro server with Logic:

- On one machine, spreads CPU load over multiple cores (some Logic users are slowed by Logic's single core overload "feature" where the workaround is to have an always-record-enabled audio track...)
- Faster loading time, switching between Logic projects - if your main libraries are preserved and decoupled in VE Pro then you don't have to wait for them to reload. Very handy if working on many cues or copying between projects. Only load once per day!
- Better more efficient RAM handling - claimed, would need someone more qualified than me to explain.
- Easy to switch from one machine to a slave-based system without re-creating your whole template.
- 32/64 bit plug ins/VIs can be used in VEPro even running 64 bit Logic
- Some might also point to doing basic mix balancing/positioning in VEPro as a bonus so you don't have that clutter in Logic



resound said:


> When setting up a template in Logic Pro X using VEPro and multi-timbral instruments, is there any difference between creating multitimbral tracks in Logic or connecting a multi-instrument in the Environment window to an instrument track? Is there any difference or benefit to working one way or the other?



You can make this as simple or as complicated as you want. The big advantage of not using the environment for me is er... not using the environment!

Overall, what you will find from the dispersed threads on this is:
- VSL's multiport template should be approached with extreme caution
- Logic articulation switching solutions, like SkiSwitcher, provide environment tools (macros) as well as midi scripter plug ins, so you can do cunning articulation mapping and switching. SkiSwitcher comes with a template song with an env. macro. It is logical then to start with that and check before doing more environment fiddling (if you have got to )
- With Logic, more VEPro instances has been cited as being better than fewer (and is not a problem)
- You don't have to use the environment to use VEpro - you can set up e.g. multitimbral key switching Kontakt instruments without the environment

Then, how many instances?
How big is your template... how long is a piece of string... how do you want to switch articulations?
- If your orchestra is Albino One you could have one VEPro instance with one Kontakt multi, six slots, and do keyswitch articulations - and you would get some of the benefits outlined above - but maybe not worth the cost of VEPro.
- If you have 19 string libraries you can have 100 VEPro instances and load each with a different articulation to maximise your layering speed - plus of course all other VEPro benefits like loading time
- I like keyswitch articulation switching in the automation lane so I have one instance of VEpro for each major library/section, each with one instance of Kontakt with up to 16 slots e.g. 1x VEpro for Berlin WW inc. a Kontakt multi with all instruments, with the main articulations set up in capsule, one summing stack in Logic for Berlin WW, with a multitimbral track for each Berlin WW inst. and drawing keyswitch artics into the automation lane (via a scripter plug in).


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## kunst91 (Nov 11, 2015)

This could change, but I never use multi-timbal instruments in Logic. It has always felt more clunky to me, and I also like not having to deal with separate midi and audio tracks.


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## mc_deli (Nov 11, 2015)

kunst91 said:


> I also like not having to deal with separate midi and audio tracks.


What do you mean?


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## kunst91 (Nov 11, 2015)

mc_deli said:


> What do you mean?



Well with a multitimbral instrument you have midi tracks where the notes are sequenced and aux tracks where the audio is processed--where you would use plugins, sends, automation, etc.

By just using monotimbral instrument tracks this eliminates the need for the aux returns, allowing one to handle everything on a single track.

Haven't used multitimbral in Logic in a long time, so things may have changed, but this is my basic understanding


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## mc_deli (Nov 11, 2015)

kunst91 said:


> I also like not having to deal with separate midi and AUX tracks.


Ah! Fixed that for you 

Yes, it is very confusing for me that multitimbral midi tracks are handled as auxes by Logic. Though of course we then get in to the two different ways to create multitimbral tracks in Logic:

- the "mixer +" method (this is where you create a single software instrument, add a Kontakt multi out, then use the plus button in the mixer to create the midi tracks, then use create track to add these to the main window... which creates multi timbral midi tracks as aux tracks, has individual mutes and volume control but does not have region based automation that will work with automation lane articulation switching)
... and then...
- the "create from the menu multitimbral xX" method (which creates midi tracks, where only the first track's mute/vol controls all the others... which you can kinda get around by add an on/off switch (that Logic doesn't save in the track header when I re-open a project:( ))


...I would always choose the mixer + method as they have independent volume/mute but have to choose the create xX method for automation lane switching.
...The worst part is that all those auxes totally spoils the mixer view and navigation there


(I know this has been covered before, but I thought it might help to spell it out... it would have helped me 6 months ago )
(And please forgive if I have missed something important)

EDIT: The fact that there are two ways to do this and neither is logical or really is fit for purpose should be a source of great embarrassment for the Logic team!


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## kunst91 (Nov 11, 2015)

mc_deli said:


> Ah! Fixed that for you
> 
> Yes, it is very confusing for me that multitimbral midi tracks are handled as auxes by Logic. Though of course we then get in to the two different ways to create multitimbral tracks in Logic:
> 
> ...



Sorry, wrote that on the train! 
For the mixer + method can you add plugins to the midi track, or would all of that still be handled in the aux?

Absolutely agree on your last point. Pretty attached to logic at this point, but things like that really bother me. Granted, Logic is attempting to move towards monotimbral instruments as the "future" (pretty sure I read about that in one of Jay's articles), but the clumsiness of multitimbral workflow in Logic remains irritating.


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## mc_deli (Nov 11, 2015)

kunst91 said:


> Sorry, wrote that on the train!
> For the mixer + method can you add plugins to the midi track, or would all of that still be handled in the aux?



With the mixer+ method, the midi track is an aux (at least Logic treats it as an aux). Yes you can add audio plug ins to each multitimbral midid/aux track with the mixer+ method. (Drives me nuts this stuff!)


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## EastWest Lurker (Nov 11, 2015)

With Logic Pro X and VE Pro 5, you don't need Event Inputs. You don't need a multiport layer. You don't even need auxes unless you need to discretely automate different articulations with cc7, which AFAIR, a violinist does not do 

Tou need a single v-0frame connected to a single VE Pro srver instance in Logic Pro and if you use the SKiSwitcher 2 or AG Toolkit Pro or Arts Conductor you can do it from a single tracvk. If not, then several tracks assigned to diffrent MIDI channels all flowing through the same channel strip.

Simple, elegant, efficient, no need to make it more complicated UNLESS you _want_ to. I do not and I do not recommend it.

BTW, I fear I have offended OT Tobias, which is not my intention. He is a fine fellow, Orchestral Tools is a fine developer, and he is just showing people the path that VSL has recommended. BUT IMHO it muddies the waters unnecessarily.


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## jacobthestupendous (Nov 11, 2015)

mc_deli said:


> (I know this has been covered before, but I thought it might help to spell it out... it would have helped me 6 months ago )
> (And please forgive if I have missed something important)
> 
> EDIT: The fact that there are two ways to do this and neither is logical or really is fit for purpose should be a source of great embarrassment for the Logic team!


Wow! Thanks for this. At least I now know that my limited and frustrating experimentation with multitimbral instruments in Logic was by design; I had just assumed that I was doing something wrong and put it in the category of Things I Still Need to Learn Someday.


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## mc_deli (Nov 11, 2015)

EastWest Lurker said:


> Simple, elegant, efficient, no need to make it more complicated



Jay, when you enable the on/off buttons in the track header dialogue, do these stay in your template?

(Every time I open a project the on/off buttons are no longer there and I have to configure them again)


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## EastWest Lurker (Nov 11, 2015)

mc_deli said:


> Jay, when you enable the on/off buttons in the track header dialogue, do these stay in your template?
> 
> (Every time I open a project the on/off buttons are no longer there and I have to configure them again)



They do if I lock the screenset.


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## mc_deli (Nov 11, 2015)

EastWest Lurker said:


> They do if I lock the screenset.


Aha! Bingo, thanks.


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## resound (Nov 11, 2015)

EastWest Lurker said:


> With Logic Pro X and VE Pro 5, you don't need Event Inputs. You don't need a multiport layer. You don't even need auxes unless you need to discretely automate different articulations with cc7, which AFAIR, a violinist does not do
> 
> Tou need a single v-0frame connected to a single VE Pro srver instance in Logic Pro and if you use the SKiSwitcher 2 or AG Toolkit Pro or Arts Conductor you can do it from a single tracvk. If not, then several tracks assigned to diffrent MIDI channels all flowing through the same channel strip.
> 
> ...



Let's say you are not using SkiSwitcher, but you are using the large template method with one track for each articulation assign to a different MIDI channel. I am wondering about the difference between using multi-timbral tracks versus connecting a multi-instrument in the environment window to an instrument and then assigning tracks in the main window to the appropriate MIDI channels on the multi-instrument. The only difference I have noticed is that using the multi-instrument/environment window method gives you a track in the mix window for each articulation while the multi-timbral track method requires you to use the + to add aux tracks if you have your plugin set to multi-output. Is there any other difference or benefit to working one way or the other?


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## John Zuker (Nov 11, 2015)

mc_deli said:


> PSA from my extensive reading on this and setting up my own modest template. Advantages of VEPro server with Logic:
> 
> - On one machine, spreads CPU load over multiple cores (some Logic users are slowed by Logic's single core overload "feature" where the workaround is to have an always-record-enabled audio track...)
> - Faster loading time, switching between Logic projects - if your main libraries are preserved and decoupled in VE Pro then you don't have to wait for them to reload. Very handy if working on many cues or copying between projects. Only load once per day!
> ...



Thanks for that info, that explains a lot. I'm assuming that VE Pro would *not* be able to load any Logic instruments (like EXS24 in particular, which handles a fair amount of orchestral duties in my templates)?


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## Peter Schwartz (Nov 11, 2015)

@ JohnZuker, EXS is native to Logic and can't be loaded into VEPro. But EXS is _so_ efficient CPU-wise that you wouldn't need VEPro to host EXS anyway.

I waaaaaaaay prefer to use tons of VEPro Instances and work with one-track-per-instrument -- to the extent that this is possible and practical. I look at it this way... You can spend your life packing a multi-timbral plugin with a ton of sounds and then deal with all the signal routing malarky, or, you can create individual VEPro Instances and have a 1:1 relationship between the sound you're playing and the track you're recording the MIDI on.

I have to stress "possible and practical" tho, as I do in the tutorial (and I'm not here to hawk it, just saying...) From a practical standpoint, here's a hypothetical... Would it make sense to create 3 VEPro Instances for 3 cymbal patches from the same library? Prolly not. Here's a case where it makes sense to pack all 3 patches into a single VEPro Instance, set the sounds to different MIDI Channels, and call it a day. And if you ever _really _needed to break those sounds out to separate outputs to EQ or 'verb them differently, deal with it on a case-by-case basis. Chances are that you don't need to devote that much tweakage to cymbals. Other sounds, however, might be a different story, like...

What about piccolo and flute from the same library? For me that's two separate VEPro Instances, one sound per. I want individual control over the level and EQ and verb on those two. And -- most importantly -- I want to control those aspects of things directly from the track I'm recording the MIDI parts on. No CC#11 on different MIDI channels to control volume. Life's too short! Volume adjustment = instrument channel fader. Boom, done.

There's a lot of serious misinformation floating around about how many VEPro Instances you _should_ have in a metaframe. Yes, it's true, the Vienna boyz advise that you create as few Instances as possible and pack 'em full o' stuff. Well, here's a case where that advice -- even from the developer -- doesn't really pan out in the real world. Not only _can_ you run a ton of Instances running one sound per plugin, but very often the CPU hit ends up being _less_ doing it that way than running multi-timbral setups of those sounds.

Objection to this approach often comes in the form of "but... but... but... then you'd have a LOT of Instances!" And I'm like, "so?" What's practical or even enjoyable about packing Instances and multi's full o' stuff and then doing all the signal routing that goes along with it? It's almost as though this is an exercise that some people feel they must go through. But the real deal is that it's not a requirement at ALL.

But all that must be tempered with "the possible"... If you were to create a ton of individual VEPro Instances, one-sound-per, you'd quickly run out of available instruments in Logic! (There's a cap of 254 instrument channels). And right there is the only real reason why the tons of Instances approach won't work.

So it really comes down to balancing the practical and the possible when setting all of this stuff up.


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## John Zuker (Nov 11, 2015)

Peter Schwartz said:


> @ JohnZuker, EXS is native to Logic and can't be loaded into VEPro. But EXS is _so_ efficient CPU-wise that you wouldn't need VEPro to host EXS anyway.



Yes, and I'm mostly using EXS for my old, smaller sized, converted Giga and Roland samples (yes, I still use some old Roland patches). I was thinking about it organizationally, i.e. having my orchestral palette all in one, separate platform. I'm doing a lot of rock band with orchestra cues for my current gig, and I really like the idea having the "orchestra" locked and loaded while I change cues/projects etc. That, and the improved cpu efficiency, make implementing this a no brainer. But yes, I don't have to wait long for those EXS instances to load.

Plan on downloading your video today, btw!


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## Peter Schwartz (Nov 11, 2015)

Cheers!


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## jacobthestupendous (Nov 11, 2015)

Plus, setting up multiple instances would handily avoid the trouble that comes with some of the newer Kontakt libraries that automatically assign midi CC's and quickly fill up the available 511 channels per instance.


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## John Zuker (Nov 11, 2015)

Peter Schwartz said:


> Cheers!



Just completed your course, Peter. Excellent work! Feel like I've had my head in the sand for a while. Learned a lot! Even in the earlier tutorials, I learned stuff about Logic I never knew, and I've been a user for a long time.

Thanks!


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## OT_Tobias (Nov 12, 2015)

Just chiming in real quick (I wrote the tutorial linked to earlier) because I made some changes to its wording.
Like Jay I do NOT suggest using either Event Input or the Multiport Layer in Logic, because as Jay rightly said it is not the best option for Logic. My tutorial back in the days basically followed the VSL manual because users felt it was not very clearly written.
I take this thread an an incentive to rewrite the tutorial in the coming days to make all this more clear.
I'm more of a Cubase guy anyway and have not worked in Logic since 2012  So if you want to switch to Cubase, give me a ring^^

By the way:
In my experience there is a fundamental difference between Logic and Cubase users. Most Logic users I know who want templates want 1 track per instrument with keyswitching. Their templates are 160-250 tracks.
Most Cubase users (these are the ones I primarily serve) want one track per articulation and want TONS of libraries. 3000-4000 are the rule there rather than the exception.
I have found that Cubase (and Studio One and others) are simply better suited to this kind of template. Logic is AWESOME (especially with SkiSwitcher) for the people preferring one track per instrument.
So in real life I think the two worlds do not overlap greatly and there actually is little to no need for the Multiport layer. Most Logic users simply do not want so huge templates that they would need multiple ports per instance.


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## John Zuker (Nov 12, 2015)

OT_Tobias said:


> I'm more of a Cubase guy anyway and have not worked in Logic since 2012  So if you want to switch to Cubase, give me a ring^^




For me, learning a new DAW after 20+ years being a Logic guy? I don't know, something about old dogs and new tricks.


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## OT_Tobias (Nov 12, 2015)

John Zuker said:


> For me, learning a new DAW after 20+ years being a Logic guy? I don't know, something about old dogs and new tricks.



haha - you would be surprised at the number of old dogs who jump ship.
But yes, it is a daunting task and I am very glad I did it relatively early. I don't know if I could switch again now...


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## stonzthro (Nov 12, 2015)

WARNING: Brief Hi-jacking ahead 


OT_Tobias said:


> By the way:
> In my experience there is a fundamental difference between Logic and Cubase users. Most Logic users I know who want templates want 1 track per instrument with keyswitching. Their templates are 160-250 tracks.
> Most Cubase users (these are the ones I primarily serve) want one track per articulation and want TONS of libraries. 3000-4000 are the rule there rather than the exception.
> I have found that Cubase (and Studio One and others) are simply better suited to this kind of template. Logic is AWESOME (especially with SkiSwitcher) for the people preferring one track per instrument.
> So in real life I think the two worlds do not overlap greatly and there actually is little to no need for the Multiport layer. Most Logic users simply do not want so huge templates that they would need multiple ports per instance.



This is the source of my frustration with Logic - I have a 1200 track template and while it does (pretty much) work, it is clunky and not always reliable. I've toyed with switching to Cubase 8 but have been hesitant since I already know Logic so well...


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## OT_Tobias (Nov 12, 2015)

stonzthro said:


> WARNING: Brief Hi-jacking ahead
> 
> 
> This is the source of my frustration with Logic - I have a 1200 track template and while it does (pretty much) work, it is clunky and not always reliable. I've toyed with switching to Cubase 8 but have been hesitant since I already know Logic so well...



I know the feeling. I was in the exact same situation three years ago. You know what I did  Back then the situation was even worse because Logic had no folders. Not wanting to derail the thread here, feel free to PM me and we can continue this discussion without spamming here


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## resound (Nov 12, 2015)

Peter Schwartz said:


> I have to stress "possible and practical" tho, as I do in the tutorial (and I'm not here to hawk it, just saying...) From a practical standpoint, here's a hypothetical... Would it make sense to create 3 VEPro Instances for 3 cymbal patches from the same library? Prolly not. Here's a case where it makes sense to pack all 3 patches into a single VEPro Instance, set the sounds to different MIDI Channels, and call it a day. And if you ever _really _needed to break those sounds out to separate outputs to EQ or 'verb them differently, deal with it on a case-by-case basis. Chances are that you don't need to devote that much tweakage to cymbals. Other sounds, however, might be a different story, like...



I checked out both of your tutorials on orchestral templates as well as the one on creating mockups. Very well done and extremely helpful! Thanks for taking the time to put those together. I'm all about efficient workflow, so seeing your process broken down step by step helped me tighten up some things in my workflow


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## Peter Schwartz (Nov 12, 2015)

Thank you John and resound! I'm very glad to learn that you got some mileage out of them. And Tobias, I got a lot out of your tutorial as well when you first published it. Nice to e-meet you here.


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## mc_deli (Nov 12, 2015)

stonzthro said:


> This is the source of my frustration with Logic - I have a 1200 track template and while it does (pretty much) work, it is clunky and not always reliable.


I get clunky and not always reliable from the GUI lagging, auxes rerouting themselves, icons disappearing, patches not reloading, patches not importing... and that is only with @100 tracks. What happens when you have 1000?


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## stonzthro (Nov 12, 2015)

mc_deli said:


> I get clunky and not always reliable from the GUI lagging, auxes rerouting themselves, icons disappearing, patches not reloading, patches not importing... and that is only with @100 tracks. What happens when you have 1000?


Whew - I thought I was the only one having the mysterious aux-rerouting issue!


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## mc_deli (Nov 12, 2015)

stonzthro said:


> Whew - I thought I was the only one having the mysterious aux-rerouting issue!


Oh yeah. I have come back to projects to find all my auxes routed to bus 1. Crazy. I put that and other aux-related stuff on the LPH bugs forum but I don't think the (very knowledgeable) mods there are heavy VI users... (and surely it is the midi tracks as auxes thing that causes buggy stuff... and the newness of track stacks...)...


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## samphony (Nov 12, 2015)

I had the rerouting issues too sometimes.


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## kunst91 (Nov 12, 2015)

stonzthro said:


> Whew - I thought I was the only one having the mysterious aux-rerouting issue!



Me too!


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## vewilya (Nov 13, 2015)

stonzthro said:


> WARNING: Brief Hi-jacking ahead
> 
> 
> This is the source of my frustration with Logic - I have a 1200 track template and while it does (pretty much) work, it is clunky and not always reliable. I've toyed with switching to Cubase 8 but have been hesitant since I already know Logic so well...


Hello Stonzthro

How do you setup your 1200 tracks? VePro and Midi Tracks? Multitimbral or the Jay Asher Setup? 
Thanks for letting me now. Trying to get my head around string up a large orchestral template in Logic with an 2011 4-core 3,4 ghz iMac (32GB of Ram) and a PC Slave (4-core i7 3.6 ghz and 32 gb of Ram). But it's driving me nuts. 
Greetings Urs


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## stonzthro (Nov 13, 2015)

VE-Pro hosts almost everything. I put instruments groups in the same Kontakt. Several months back Jay was kind enough to share his PLAY VEP instances and I used those as a basis for the EW Orchestra stuff. With libraries like Symphobia and Albion the keyswitching can get way out of hand, so I put all that information in the notes. Everything is bussed to stem channels for tracking. That's where the aux assignments in Logic seem to go nuts - sometimes they reassign themselves to the wrong bus, or just to the stereo outs. Logic does not seem to be geared toward this kind of template setup - hence my eyeing Cubase...


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## vewilya (Nov 13, 2015)

stonzthro said:


> VE-Pro hosts almost everything. I put instruments groups in the same Kontakt. Several months back Jay was kind enough to share his PLAY VEP instances and I used those as a basis for the EW Orchestra stuff. With libraries like Symphobia and Albion the keyswitching can get way out of hand, so I put all that information in the notes. Everything is bussed to stem channels for tracking. That's where the aux assignments in Logic seem to go nuts - sometimes they reassign themselves to the wrong bus, or just to the stereo outs. Logic does not seem to be geared toward this kind of template setup - hence my eyeing Cubase...


Thanks. You're right about Logic not being developed for these large setups. But for composing it feels just very good. But yeah, all eyes on Cubase at the moment. But we'll see what El Capitan could bring us audio-wise. We might regret changing DAW...

Greetings 
U


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