# Which one would you choose : Cinesample Cinestrings Core, or OT Berlin Strings ?



## muziksculp (Oct 18, 2014)

Hi,

Which one would you pick if you had to choose one of these two strings libraries, from both a sonic, flexibility, and playability perspective : 

Cimesamples *Cinestrings Core* http://cinesamples.com/product/cinestrings-core

OR

Orchestral Tools *Berlin Strings* : http://www.orchestraltools.com/libraries/berlin_strings.php

I'm also wondering if there will be a Cinesamples _CineStrings Pro_ version in the near future ? Any clues if this will be released in the near future ? 

Any additional feedback as to why you would pick one over the other would be interesting, and very helpful. 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


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## Echoes in the Attic (Oct 18, 2014)

I really can't suggest one over the other soundwise but I do own Cinestrings and I can at least say that I do really like the scripting and I think the poly legato is excellent, especially after the 1.1 update. There are capabilities there that aren't in any other string library.

They have stated that Cinestrings Pro will be along. When, who knows but they will have the solo strings and I would assume more articulations for the ensembles.

I think you will find people preferring either one (I'm a Cinesamples fan personally), but one thing that might be worth considering is whether you have any other libraries by other company, as they would fit in the same room.


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## muziksculp (Oct 19, 2014)

Hi Echoes in the Attic,

Thanks for the feedback. 

Any additional feedback, or opinions as far as how these two Strings Libraries differ as far as character, flexibility, playability, or any other factor that one might consider when choosing one over the other, besides the pricing. 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


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## muziksculp (Nov 3, 2014)

Interesting ... 587 views and only one reply ? :roll: 

Any additional feedback, opinions would be helpful. 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


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## Revenant (Nov 3, 2014)

I'm not a maven by a long shot, but anyway, my frank answer would be: neither. Go for Cinematic Strings 2/Spitfire Albion and/or Mural/LASS instead.

If, however, you are hell-bent on choosing just between those two, I'd probably recommend Berlin Strings, that is assuming the updates have mixed most of the scripting errors (like missing RRs on Cel Spic), which I think they have. 

Reason? While they are both fairly demanding (especially RAM-wise) on the system, I find the sound of Berlin Strings much more appealing and authentic. From what I gather, legatos and sustains are supposed to be the forte of Cinestrings, yet I find BS strings warmer and more pleasant-sounding. If you don't mind tweaking the sound a lot, I suppose you could make Cinestrings sound great, but then again, if you could make CS sound great, I'd be pretty sure you'd make LASS sound nothing short of amazing.

As for shorts, neither library impressed me, but with the fixed programming issues, I still think BS would win in my book. Cinestrings have recently got an update with some nice features, but it's nothing substantial enough to change my view on it in comparison with BS.

And a final face-off to top it all: I'd say that LASS beats BS in pretty much every conceivable aspect (perhaps with the exception of out-of-the-box playability). And Cinestrings? That's not even in the same league.

But naturally, that's just my opinion, and, of course, providing that budget is not an issue, because otherwise, it may not be nearly as clear, given that Cinestrings is now priced at five hundred bucks, while BS or LASS, as the case may be, is double that price IIRC.


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## Carles (Nov 3, 2014)

muziksculp @ Tue Nov 04 said:


> Interesting ... 587 views and only one reply ? :roll:
> 
> Any additional feedback, opinions would be helpful.
> 
> ...



Perhaps 587 views from people like me, having no any of both and also interested in reading opinions 

I think these are the two only string libraries I don't have, and trust me I'd like to have my hands on these but running out of budget until I'll make any money with music and it can take quite long for that :-(

Anyway, I think a more appropriate comparison as per pricing would be CineStrings Core+Pro vs Berlin Strings?

I personally love thick ambients (Mural the most, but also Cinematic Strings2) and Sony sounds pretty thick to me too, but also seems proven the agility of Berlin Strings...
Possibly the main usage for the library that one might have in mind can make a difference in their decision.
It would be a hard decision for me.


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## constaneum (Nov 3, 2014)

Hmmm....Tone wise, I thought it's hard to compare Cinesamples' Cinestrings and OT's Berlin Strings. If i'm not mistaken, both are on different scale in terms of number of strings players right? In fact, i'll compare CineStrings with Cinematic Strings 2. 

I'm quite interested in Cinematic Strings 2 but all the demos sound pretty wet. For owners of Cinematic Strings 2, would like to hear more about it. Is is possible to make it sounds dry? Not sure how dry is the Close mic samples. What's the pro and cons of Cinematic Strings 2? Thanks


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## Mahlon (Nov 3, 2014)

My experience with Berlin Strings is that it's a building block library. All the necessary elements are there to get you where you want to go, but it's not necessarily easy to do. That said, that's exactly the kind of library I like. The ease-of-use may not be perfect (I think users are calling that "programming"), but it's certainly more than acceptable, and it is an extremely nimble library capable of pretty much anything you throw at it -- the most realistic sound outside of Hollywood Strings, to me (more on the longs than the shorts). But I supplement the shorts with HS. Can't go wrong. BST can sound small, and it can sound large, too. Orchestral Tools has done a library for themselves, which translates into us, at least to my way of thinking.

Mahlon


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## kurtvanzo (Nov 4, 2014)

After owning CinesStrings and Cinematic Strings 2 for a while CS2 has become my go to strings. Cinestrings has a great tone, but more bow noise and has many mic mixes including dry and a nice stage/mix sounds. Even the harmonic patches are beautiful for sustain. Cinematic Strings 2 does fast runs better with more fast articulations and a great Arco and Marcato sustain sounds all key switchable, multiple mics including a decently dry close mic on each section- plus a full patch that works great. You can even unload articulations your not using to save ram. CS2 is also cleaner sounding (less bow noise) than Cinestrings. At $399 CS2 is probably the most usable and least expensive orchestral string sections your going to find.


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 17, 2014)

@constaneum I just saw this. No, it's not possible to use Cinematic Strings 2.1 as a very dry library. There are mono spot mics (called close in this version) but they aren't as strong a sound as you'll find in the closer mikings of some other libraries.

Cinematic Strings 2.1 is a great library when you want the sound of a big hall baked in and like to work quickly and easily. The trade-off (and I think it's a fair one) is that it's not good for most other things.

Out of all the libraries recorded with legato interval samples Cinematic Strings 2.1, Berlin Strings and the Spitfire BML series are the libraries recorded in the wettest locations. So none of them will ever "eliminate" the ambience - but the close mics in Berlin Strings and BML Mural sound much closer and more detailed than those in Cinematic Strings 2.1.

If you want a sound from a multi-mic library that caters to the close mics a little more, I would say Hollywood Strings, CineStrings and the 8Dio Adagio/Agitato series are better options. Each of them has a different distinctive sound from the others, and I find they are all desirable in a different context.

For single mic position dry libraries, the best I've tried so far is VSL Dimension Strings. I haven't had a chance to audition LASS. Dimension Strings (which I'm currently reviewing) has some of the tightest staccato samples of any string library I've ever encountered and has a very dry sound.

I hope that helps at least a little - even if it's been a couple weeks since your question.


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## dhlkid (Nov 17, 2014)

If choose between Cinestrings & Berlin Strings, I will go for Berlin Strings


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## muziksculp (Nov 17, 2014)

dhlkid @ Mon Nov 17 said:


> If choose between Cinestrings & Berlin Strings, I will go for Berlin Strings



Thanks for the direct feedback.


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## Tatu (Nov 17, 2014)

dhlkid @ Mon Nov 17 said:


> If choose between Cinestrings & Berlin Strings, I will go for Berlin Strings



And if I'd have to choose between Cinestrings & Berlin Strings, I'd go for Spitfire's Mural and Cinematic Strings 2 (I wouldn't change any current library for CS2's staccatissimos).


That's what you get when asking these questions. :D 
But it's great to have lots of great choices, isn't it?


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## Vovique (Nov 17, 2014)

kurtvanzo @ Wed Nov 05 said:


> At $399 CS2 is probably the most usable and least expensive orchestral string sections your going to find.



I just checked the site and noticed CS2 will be on sale during the Black Week for a mere $319.


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 17, 2014)

@muziksculp If you really want to know the differences between the two libraries, I'd suggest reading the reviews I wrote of each at http://www.soundbytesmag.net

I talked a bit about the recording space and miking a few posts above, but the truth is that it's difficult to make any sort of suggestions without knowing more about the specifics of your priorities.

You can coax more up-front detail out of CineStrings CORE, the legatos are good executing accents within a line, it has more dynamic layers in its legatos and sustains and it's easier to place in other environments - it's also quicker to learn and makes more extensive use of keyswitching, etc. However, it covers much fewer articulations, has more difficulty rendering rapid legato lines and if you want a more reverberant space, you may prefer Teldex to the Streissand Scoring Stage at Sony. The ensembles are roughly twice as large as in Berlin Strings - which is either a strength of liability depending on your preferences. It's really impossible to make a reccomendation without understanding your needs and preferences in that area better.

Conversely, Berlin Strings has a warmer out-of-the-box sound, more articulations, more legato types (including a runs mode), sordino modeling (though neither library has real sordino samples), more short articulation types, etc. Note that certain articulations (like harmonics) are reserved for the expansions in the Berlin Strings series while they are included in CineStrings CORE - but overall Berlin Strings offers more articulations.

These are two of the most interest string libraries I've reviewed and they are very different. What are your priorities in a library? The criteria you specified were very general.


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## Vin (Nov 17, 2014)

Tatu @ 17/11/2014 said:


> dhlkid @ Mon Nov 17 said:
> 
> 
> > If choose between Cinestrings & Berlin Strings, I will go for Berlin Strings
> ...



My thoughts exactly :D


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 17, 2014)

Here's what I'd reccomend each for.

Cinematic Strings 2.1: For making broad stroke renderings very quickly using the bread and butter articulations. You get a big sound out of a relatively small ensemble (only a little bigger than BST) but you can't make it too intimate or coax too much detail. The staccatissimos are definitely nice, but if you're used to Hollywood Strings already, then that may not be a selling point.

Berlin Strings: More articulations, better for runs and trills than the others, most flexible legatos in terms of use (and most legato transition types). Smallest ensembles, warm sound. This is a great one if having a variety of colors is important and the detail of a small but you place a premium on a warm out-of-box sound. Also, while CS2.1 has staccatissimo and staccato for all sections, BST has the most different short bowed articulations. For example, for the first violins there is staccato, spiccato, spiccatissimo and a hard martele (off the top of my head - I may have missed one).

CineStrings CORE: If you want the driest and most flexible sound out of the three, the most dynamic layers in your legato and the best vibrato crossfading and the largest ensembles, then this is a good choice. It's quick to learn and use, certainly a bit quicker than BST but not quite as quick as CS2.1.

CS2.1 and CSC make it quick to re-assign MIDI CCs or velocity mapping with menus while BST makes it easy to switch between modwheel control and velocity with a click. BST also displays the current dynamic layers.

Does that help?


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## G.R. Baumann (Nov 17, 2014)

Some excellent advice here!

Not knowing what you might already have in the strings department makes it difficult to suggest one over the other for me.What I can say though, it makes sense to add complementary libraries.

What I mean by that is that I would look for ensemble strings vs. more detailed versions. Say Albion 1 vs Berlin Strings just for example. 

What that allows for is a more intelligent and successful layering at the end.

They all have strength and weaknesses, combining them allows for more realism and emotion, the latter of course needs treatment such as EQ, choice of Reverb etc.


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## muziksculp (Nov 17, 2014)

Per Lichtman @ Mon Nov 17 said:


> Here's what I'd reccomend each for.
> 
> Cinematic Strings 2.1: For making broad stroke renderings very quickly using the bread and butter articulations. You get a big sound out of a relatively small ensemble (only a little bigger than BST) but you can't make it too intimate or coax too much detail. The staccatissimos are definitely nice, but if you're used to Hollywood Strings already, then that may not be a selling point.
> 
> ...



Hi Per Lichtman,

Yes, this is very helpful indeed, Thanks.

From the libraries you described, I have Cinematic Strings 2.1 , but non of the others. and Yes, CS 2.1 is a great sounding library, I wish there was a sequel to it, with more articulations. i.e. (CS3), but so far I have no clue if this will ever happen. 

Reading your review on Berlin Strings, plus a few other reviews, in addition to listening to the audio demos at the OT Website, and a few on Youtube, I really like Berlin Strings. They have a warm-dark timbre, yet can get bright and lively depending on velocity values when needed. The adaptive Legato is a big plus, especially for real time performance. I also like the way the attacks of the legatos can be more pronounced via velocity, and sound quite realistic, without sounding too harsh, or fake. 

I have not been able to fully evaluate the shorter articulations, since there seems to be more emphasis on the legato in the demos. but from the little I heard, the shorts sound very good to my ear. 

From a purely personal taste perspective, I prefer the sound/timbre of OT-BS to CinesString Core. 

When it comes to strings, I feel that timbre is a very important quality, the number of articulations is another important factor, but if the library does not offer the sonic quality I can enjoy, or relate to, then it just does not make a difference as to how many articulations, and additional bells and whistles it offers. 

I also feel that experimenting with layering some of the various articulations in Berlin Strings can yield some very nice string textures. since they are warm, and the string sections are relatively small, it would be easy to make convincing layers that sound fuller, and add more character, and color to it. 

Another plus for OT Berlin Strings, it the fact that it will have more expansions in the future, and I really like the fact that they are very transparent with regards to their development road map, and status of each of their future/upcoming products in terms of where it is in the development.. i.e. conceptual phase, recording phase. This makes me feel comfortable when investing into their products, including their other Orchestral Sections. 

I think I will go ahead with buying Berlin Strings in the near future. 

Meanwhile, any additional feedback is always helpful. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 17, 2014)

@Muziksculp If you like the sound of Berlin Strings better then I would definitely go with your plan. Both of them are great libraries but you seem to have a clear sense of what you need and from everything you say, BST sounds like it should provide for you.

PM me if you either want me to send links to some short demos (I don't have dedicated ones at the moment, so they would private ones from cues in progress) or have any additional questions you'd like to chat about in person. I'm in Pasadena and easily bribed to gab over the right meal. 

But in the meantime, my only additional feedback is that it seems like you've made a sound choice.


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## muziksculp (Nov 17, 2014)

Per Lichtman @ Mon Nov 17 said:


> @Muziksculp If you like the sound of Berlin Strings better then I would definitely go with your plan.Both of them are great libraries but you seem to have a clear sense of what you need and from everything you say, BST sounds like ti should provide for you.
> 
> PM me if you either want me to send links to some short demos (I don't have dedicated ones at the moment, so they would private ones from cues in progress) or have any additional questions you'd like to chat about in person. I'm in Pasadena and easily bribed to gab over thr right meal.
> 
> But in the meantime, my only additional feedback is that it seems like you've made a sound choice.



Hi Per Lichtman,

Thanks for all the great feedback. 

I have a large selection of Strings Libraries, I can't seem to have enough of these.  

As you know, they are all slightly different, each offering something unique in terms of sonic character, functionality, playability, size, acoustics, articulations, playability,...etc. 

imho. *OT-Berlin Strings * is a great complement to many of the existing strings libraries from developers such as (Spitfire, VSL Strings, 8dio, LASS, Cinematic Strings, CineStrings, ...etc.). So, I'm sure it will be a very useful tool to have, and even expand via currently available expansions, and the future expansions OT will offer. 

I think the limited amount of Short Articulations I heard in audio demos is good enough to make me buy it. Thanks for offering links via PM of some of your work/s in progress. That's very nice of you. but I don't think there is a need for that, I'm already convinced that Berlin Strings is a very good choice for me. 


Thanks Again, and All The Best,
Muziksculp


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## Kony (Dec 6, 2019)

Iswhatitis said:


> 100% choose Berlin Strings!! CineStrings is the biggest weakness to the Cinesamples libraries. CinePerc, CinePiano and CineHarp are all excellent. CineWinds and CineBrass are very usable but CineStrings violins do not sound good at all. Berlin Series is the best of all libraries with spitfire coming in a close second.


Seeing as this thread's five years old, I'd think it's safe to assume the OP has made up his mind by now - and has probably even bought all available string libraries in the universe.


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