# Anthology II: Adagio general discussion



## jaketanner (May 23, 2019)

Hi all,

I think creating a common overall thread on the entire new Anthology II line, is better than having 4 different threads on the same library. Maybe the admins can find a way to merge them into this?

I'll start with what I see so far: I like it a lot...now having the viola to add to the violin, it's starting to sound really thick, and more like a complete idea. 

A trick I just tried...since Legato I (Agitato) and Legato II (Adagio) are TWO completely different samples taken from two different recordings, I thought it'd be cool to layer all 4 in one Kontakt instance...I lowered the Legato I on both by around -13dBs more, because I really don't like the portamento to stick out too much, but layered with everyone, it sounds really full...

...Violin Legato I
...Violin Legato II
...Viola legato I
...Viola Legato II


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## ReelToLogic (May 23, 2019)

Just downloaded the Violas. It's free for Anthology owners, but my email said that the offer is only good for 48 hours, so if you own Anthology don't wait too long to get the update! 

I haven't played with the Violas yet, but I like the update to the Violins. My hat's-off to 8Dio for listening to users who had criticisms of Anthology, making the effort to create an update and providing it to their Anthology customers for only $8.


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## gamma-ut (May 23, 2019)

The code that’s mailed only works for 48 hours, but the mail also says Anthology owners just need to contact support after that time’s up to get a new one.


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## jgarciaserra (May 24, 2019)

I payed around 1100$ for Adagio. A great sounding library but "unusable" for me. Neither cohesion nor continuity throughout the series. I love the tone and the concept but every time I tried to use it ... it was a failure. Therefore, it is great to get a package programmed as a unic product. But I feel cheated when a "fixed" from the original product its priced (20$ coupon) at half the actual price. In my opinion , it's not fair.
Only an opinion from an user that tried to "love" the product.
Cheers


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## Dominik Raab (May 24, 2019)

jgarciaserra said:


> But I feel cheated when a "fixed" from the original product its priced (20$ coupon) at half the actual price. In my opinion , it's not fair.



Just in case you haven't seen that yet: the price you pay for the violins is the price for the whole package, as an upgrader. I paid $8 for the violins and will now get the violas, celli and basses for free. Troels explained it's about server costs - and honestly, I understand the upgrade price difference between Anthology owners and those who've never bought Anthology.

To be fair, I never had Adagio and picked up Anthology for cheap during their Christmas sale, so maybe I don't even deserve the cheap upgrade, heh.


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## ism (May 24, 2019)

jgarciaserra said:


> I payed around 1100$ for Adagio. A great sounding library but "unusable" for me. Neither cohesion nor continuity throughout the series. I love the tone and the concept but every time I tried to use it ... it was a failure. Therefore, it is great to get a package programmed as a unic product. But I feel cheated when a "fixed" from the original product its priced (20$ coupon) at half the actual price. In my opinion , it's not fair.
> Only an opinion from an user that tried to "love" the product.
> Cheers



Where it might be valuable to you is that the Legato II and all the sordinos (which are among the best realized in the series) are from Agitato and were never in adagio - all much more useable than the origional Adagio. So there really is quite a lot of new and quite quality content for someone who never picked up Agitato or Anthology.

In fact, calling this new library the new "Adagio" has a certain irony, as most of the actual Adagio content has been thrown away.


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## Land of Missing Parts (May 24, 2019)

Can some confirm if I understand this correctly-- 

This new Adagio cocktail thing is soley content from old Adagio, Agitato Grandiose, and Agitato Sordino, right? And a couple processed fx patches. 

And it is "remastered", which I read as a fuzzy suggestion that they maybe tweaked the panning problems, but the panning is still all over the place like Heisenberg particles?


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## jgarciaserra (May 24, 2019)

ism said:


> Where it might be valuable to you is that the Legato II and all the sordinos (which are among the best realized in the series) are from Agitato and were never in adagio - all much more useable than the origional Adagio. So there really is quite a lot of new and quite quality content for someone who never picked up Agitato or Anthology.
> 
> In fact, calling this new library the new "Adagio" has a certain irony, as most of the actual Adagio content has been thrown away.



Thats true.


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## jtnyc (May 24, 2019)

Land of Missing Parts said:


> Can some confirm if I understand this correctly--
> 
> This new Adagio cocktail thing is soley content from old Adagio, Agitato Grandiose, and Agitato Sordino, right? And a couple processed fx patches.
> 
> And it is "remastered", which I read as a fuzzy suggestion that they maybe tweaked the panning problems, but the panning is still all over the place like Heisenberg particles?


Yes, content from those 3.
The ambience patches are from Agagio.
Yes, fuzzy suggestion, no real info on that.

The video they released “explaining” it all didn’t really clear these questions up. It felt more of an indulgence than a clear explanation to me. If they would just release a list of the articulations used and where they came from and what they used to be called and what there called now, that would make things perfectly clear for everyone. Dead simple.


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## ism (May 24, 2019)

Land of Missing Parts said:


> Can some confirm if I understand this correctly--
> 
> This new Adagio cocktail thing is soley content from old Adagio, Agitato Grandiose, and Agitato Sordino, right? And a couple processed fx patches.
> 
> And it is "remastered", which I read as a fuzzy suggestion that they maybe tweaked the panning problems, but the panning is still all over the place like Heisenberg particles?




Support, if you believe 8dio support, told me that the "polishing" of the Anthology samples for the new Adagio involves "tuning" and "processing of the raw samples".

That said, in my A/B testing thus far, once you strip down the effects and default panning and such, I have not yet been able to discern any audible difference from Anthology whatever. But other reports a significant difference, so maybe its just me.


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## jaketanner (May 24, 2019)

ism said:


> In fact, calling this new library the new "Adagio" has a certain irony, as most of the actual Adagio content has been thrown away.



I agree...it should have been Anthology II.. I mentioned that to their support team. For those of us who have their other libraries, the naming of 8Dio Adagio is going to get messy...should have been plainly Anthology II.


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## jaketanner (May 24, 2019)

ism said:


> Support, if you believe 8dio support, told me that the "polishing" of the Anthology samples for the new Adagio involves "tuning" and "processing of the raw samples".
> 
> That said, in my A/B testing thus far, once you strip down the effects and default panning and such, I have not yet been able to discern any audible difference from Anthology whatever. But other reports a significant difference, so maybe its just me.



I find this very surprising. I hated Anthology because of what they did to the samples from Adagio and Agitato...This is better.


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## chocobitz825 (May 24, 2019)

I can’t help but chuckle at the seemingly hours spent analyzing an $8~$28 upgrade.


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## Jeremy Spencer (May 24, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> I can’t help but chuckle at the seemingly hours spent analyzing an $8~$28 upgrade.



Yeah, I know, guilty as charged  I just don’t want to blow $80 CDN only to discover its basically the same old Violas and Violins.


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## Consona (May 24, 2019)

Dominik Raab said:


> Just in case you haven't seen that yet: the price you pay for the violins is the price for the whole package, as an upgrader. I paid $8 for the violins and will now get the violas, celli and basses for free. Troels explained it's about server costs - and honestly, I understand the upgrade price difference between Anthology owners and those who've never bought Anthology.


Really? I got an email saying upgrading violins is $28, then got another email that upgrading violas is $28... Or does this work only for the $8 upgrade or do I miss some lines in the mails or like what?


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## jtnyc (May 25, 2019)

Consona said:


> Really? I got an email saying upgrading violins is $28, then got another email that upgrading violas is $28... Or does this work only for the $8 upgrade or do I miss some lines in the mails or like what?


I believe the $8 upgrade is for Anthology owners


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## ReelToLogic (May 25, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> I believe the $8 upgrade is for Anthology owners


That's correct. I received multiple emails. One saying I could upgrade for $28 (because I own Adagio Violas) and another saying I could upgrade for $8 (because I own Anthology).


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## paulmatthew (May 25, 2019)

It was $8 to upgrade for Anthology owners only to the new Adagio Violins. I think it's $28 if you owned Adagio Violas to get the new Adagio Violas. The new Adagio Violas were free to Anthology owners for 48 hours. Confusing I know , but I've got it now. I heard the new cellos and basses were going to be free to Anthology owners as well??


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## Manuel Stumpf (May 25, 2019)

paulmatthew said:


> The new Adagio Violas were free to Anthology owners for 48 hours. Confusing I know , but I've got it now. I heard the new cellos and basses were going to be free to Anthology owners as well??


I think the free upgrade of the Violas for Anthology owners is valid after the 48 hours too. Only the automatically generated discount codes will not work afterwards so that you have to contact their support.


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## Consona (May 25, 2019)

So it's $112 for all 4 sections when only owning Adagio series...


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## sostenuto (May 25, 2019)

8DIO site Chat has been most helpful with these type of inquiries. 
If a _single_ $8. payment gets all new Adagio Updates (for Anthology owners), it's hard to believe you would need to pay more than a _single_ $28.  
Good luck !


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## 667 (May 25, 2019)

No, I chatted on this already, they told me to take the $1100 or whatever it cost to buy Adagio on release and shove it. In slightly more polite terms, but basically that's it.

I have not given 8Dio money in a number of years and the way they handled Adagio is the primary reason for this.


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## ism (May 25, 2019)

667 said:


> No, I chatted on this already, they told me to take the $1100 or whatever it cost to buy Adagio on release and shove it. In slightly more polite terms, but basically that's it.
> 
> I have not given 8Dio money in a number of years and the way they handled Adagio is the primary reason for this.




In fairness, most of the actual content of the new Adagio is actually from Agitato, and was never in the original Adagio. 

Agitato, on a sufficiently good sale, is still worth having, and is, for the most part, much more convincingly executed than the original Adagio. Which, if you own the original Adagio, would get you a free upgrade to Anthology, and therefore the $8 upgrade to the new Adagio.

So even if the original Adagio now disappears, its possible that you might be able to keep an eye out for an especially good sale an Agitato. 

Just a thought.


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## sostenuto (May 25, 2019)

667 said:


> No, I chatted on this already, they told me to take the $1100 or whatever it cost to buy Adagio on release and shove it. In slightly more polite terms, but basically that's it.
> I have not given 8Dio money in a number of years and the way they handled Adagio is the primary reason for this.



Just when I start to warm up to 8DIO, another post like this sours the taste … 
Their marketing strategy is baffling. 

(edit)* @ ism* posted prior, and his Anthology point may be key for you …. hopefully.


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## pderbidge (May 25, 2019)

667 said:


> No, I chatted on this already, they told me to take the $1100 or whatever it cost to buy Adagio on release and shove it. In slightly more polite terms, but basically that's it.
> 
> I have not given 8Dio money in a number of years and the way they handled Adagio is the primary reason for this.



You're obviously not sharing the whole conversation here. For the most part their policy on this has been as straight forward as it can be and does make some sense. I understand it can be a little confusing, which I will layout below but it's not rocket science. So far, this is what I know for sure:

If you own Anthology - $8- One time fee and the rest is free. $8 covers the server cost.

If you own all the Adagio's but no Anthology- It will be a $28 upgrade fee. This may or may not be a one time update fee and still needs to be clarified with support

If you own some of the Adagios, for example- I own Adagio Violas- $28 upgrade fee to "Adagio Violas – A Part Of The Anthology Series" and so on.

If you don't own any of the Anthology or Adagios- $48 intro price.

Other than the confusion of whether or not it is a one time $28 fee for owners of all the Adagio's I think it's pretty straight forward.


Just a brief explanation as to why I think they called this Adagio instead of an Anthology update.
1- I think the Adagio name has a better reputation than Anthology- given some of the complaints about Anthology not sounding as good. So in essence it's a marketing move.
2- Anthology contains both samples from Adagio and Agitato. Agitato was essentially Adagio 2.0 as new samples recorded in the same church in order to blend tonally with Legacy Adagio so since Agitato and Adagio were recorded in the same space and the fact that Agitato was internally dubbed as Adagio 2.0 on top of the fact that Anthology didn't have as good of a reputation as the original Adagio, I think that they felt going back to the name Adagio is more representative of the library's intent than the name Anthology. Nevertheless, this new library is more representative of what they did with Anthology (being that Anthology was Adagio and Agitato combined) then it is of the original Adagio who's content was massive but unruly and did not contain Agitato (Adagio 2.0) samples. Once this sale is done there will only be Adagio and no more legacy Adagio or Anthology, thus clearing up the confusion for future buyers.

My only complaint is that I still wish they would include a legacy folder in this new update that contained all the arcs and unruly patches from Legacy Adagio. I don't see how anyone can complain about that. If people really didn't like those patches they can always delete them from their hard drive to free up space or just ignore the Legacy folder. Please 8Dio consider doing this


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## ism (May 25, 2019)

pderbidge said:


> Agitato was essentially Adagio 2.0 as new samples recorded in the same church in order to blend tonally with Legacy Adagio so since Agitato and Adagio were recorded in the same space and the fact that Agitato was internally dubbed as Adagio 2.0 on top of the fact that Anthology didn't have as good of a reputation as the original Adagio, I think that they felt going back to the name Adagio is more representative of the library's intent than the name Anthology.




This is what 8dio is saying now, but it is not at all the way that Adagio has ever been marketed. In fact the names - Adagio vs Agitato - reflex that different intents of the libraries.

This whole "Agitato was always meant to be Adagio 2.0" is at best marketing happy talk, and at worst completely changing the story (again) on what the respective libraries are or were or were supposed to have been or are supposed to be now in order to sell more of the current product. 

Lots to love in the work 8dio has done in creating these libraries. But some of the confusion around this is clearly not merely accidental.


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## pderbidge (May 25, 2019)

ism said:


> This is what 8dio is saying now, but it is not at all the way that Adagio has ever been marketed. In fact the names - Adagio vs Agitato - reflex that different intents of the libraries.
> 
> This whole "Agitato was always meant to be Adagio 2.0" is at best marketing happy talk, and at worst completely changing the story (again) on what the respective libraries are or were or were supposed to have been or are supposed to be now in order to sell more of the current product.
> 
> Lots to love in the work 8dio has done in creating these libraries. But some of the confusion around this is clearly not merely accidental.



It is always what I understood but that's only going back about 6 years when I got into all of this stuff. From what I've always known about Agitato is that it was recorded in the same church as Adagio in order to get the same sound as Adagio for blending purposes. To your point, however, I don't think they ever dubbed it Adagio 2.0 to the public until more recently so I think it's fair to critique them for not being more clear on that. I just thought it was always understood that it was designed to be a companion to Adagio since it was recorded in the same space.


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## ism (May 25, 2019)

pderbidge said:


> It is always what I understood but that's only going back about 6 years when I got into all of this stuff. From what I've always known about Agitato is that it was recorded in the same church as Adagio in order to get the same sound as Adagio for blending purposes. To your point, however, I don't think they ever dubbed it Adagio 2.0 to the public until more recently so I suppose it's fair to critique them for not being more clear on that. I just thought it was always understood that it was designed to be a companion to Adagio since it was recorded in the same space.



That basic point, is that if they always been public dubbed Agitato as Adagio 2.0, then there would have been no need to keep selling Adagio. Instead, they actively sold Agitato - and quite reasonably - as further content, going into new territory for stronger types of lines. 


To start now implying that Agitato is just Adagio done right is nonsense. Although it is true that so little of the Adagio legato remains in Anthology/the new Adagio that I suppose you could argue that this is an admission that Adagio is rubbish and should just be thrown away and replaced with Agitato.

(Adagio isn't rubbish, of course, I'm just trying to follow the twist and turns of whatever kind of 'logic' there is to this marketing).

Maybe there's a certain amount of innocent confusion in complexity of the marketing. But they'd do better in just being honest and clear, maybe at the cost of have a few fewer customers in the short term, but without generating such a well of distrust and animosity.

I'm very, very hesitant to invest in Century strings, despite the really very excellent demos, because I just do not trust 8dio marketing.


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## pderbidge (May 25, 2019)

ism said:


> To start now implying that Agitato is just Adagio done right is nonsense.



I can't disagree with you here. I don't necessarily think it was intentional though, just the nature of Marketing departments trying to make their libraries enticing.



ism said:


> I'm very, very hesitant to invest in Century strings, despite the really very excellent demos, because I just do not trust 8dio marketing.



I don't trust anyone's Marketing. I worked in a Marketing firm for many many years and can't tell you how many times I publicly and openly disagreed with practices I thought were misleading. The problem is that a lot of these marketing people truly and honestly don't think what they are doing is misleading, they think they are just highlighting the positive. The point is, I hear ya.


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## jaketanner (May 25, 2019)

ReelToLogic said:


> That's correct. I received multiple emails. One saying I could upgrade for $28 (because I own Adagio Violas) and another saying I could upgrade for $8 (because I own Anthology).



If you upgrade for $8, it's a ONE time payment..the rest are free. Not sure if it works for people who pay more.


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## jaketanner (May 25, 2019)

I'm also going to chime in here. 

So...let's forget that Anthology even exists for a moment, because for all intents and purposes, it's only a name given to a repurposed Adagio/Agitato. So Adagio came first from what I remember, and then they recorded all BRAND NEW samples for Agitato, and worked the library with what they've learned from previous libraries. Then...enter Anthology, which simply puts the older libraries into the new GUI...because the older libraries like Adagio, Agitato and Adagietto, had playability issues for the newer Kontakt 5 engine. This was confirmed by the actual programmer of the libraries, and he also thought that they should have been discontinued long ago...BUT, they truly have a wonderful sound that I've yet to find in another library...Not in terms of playability or scripting, but in pure tone it's great! Now, what they ended up doing, is messing with the sound of the samples so much to fit the new GUI into Anthology, that they lost all appeal...at least for me, I've yet to use it.

Now enter yet another incarnation: Adagio 2.0...which is misleading because it includes samples from both Adagio and Agitato, which is what they called "Anthology" already...so this IS Anthology II...despite what they want to call it, this is truly what it should be based off what the upgrade actually is...they restored some of the beauty of the original sound, but not 100% as nice as the originals...but as I've said in other posts, not a bad thing, as I believe they will blend better into a large score. Aside from the sound, they have apparently picked only the best of the best samples from the two libraries, and created this new library. In order to do this, they omitted some samples they thought were nonessential (objective)...Maybe THIS is what Anthology should have been from the start? So I believe this is why Anthology owners are only paying $8 because they got ripped...LOL

Now about the money: I personally can't remember ever paying full price for any of these libraries. I got into the Adagio/Agitato/Adagietto library when on major sale. Couldn't have been more than a 2-3 hundred for all three for me, and as a result, I was eligible for an "upgrade" to Anthology 1...never used it, like I said the sound was terrible, but the GUI and idea worked far better with Kontakt 5 than the other libraries did. So for someone like me, who hasn't paid much into this whole slew of libraries, this latest version is very welcomed, and reasonable at $8 for sure...so far I love it!!

What is messed up in this whole scenario, is the people who purchased any of these libraries at FULL price. They should have definitely gotten this update free...because it's obviously not an issue with how much someone paid for their libraries, it's just whoever owns Anthology, even if had for free, get's this discount, and THIS is the part that is unfair...so I am sorry for everyone who falls into this category, and your remorse is totally justified. 

Now..last thing: the owners of Adagio only OR the owners of Agitato only, will get additional samples that either has had...so it's well worth the small price to get additional samples that sound great.

Hope this clears things up, or maybe I've confused you all even more.. LOL But either way, the bottom line is, that this new update is worth it...and I have already moved all older samples into a B.U. drive, and completely deleted Anthology altogether.


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## ism (May 25, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> In order to do this, they omitted some samples they thought were nonessential (objective)...



I have to strongly disagree with you here. There's a lots of great content in the original Adagio that is gone. Legato II in the new Adagio/Anthology is a pale echo of the original Adagio. True, it was often uneven and frustrating, but I'd rather have the Adagio content polished rather than thrown away and replace with Agitato content. 

The upgrade from Adagio is a good deal - if you don't have Agitato 

As a though experiment - imagine what the value proposition would be if it didn't have the sordino or Legato I. Would this be a great Adagio 'update' with only the Adagio content?


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## jaketanner (May 25, 2019)

ism said:


> I have to strongly disagree with you here. There's a lots of great content in the original Adagio that is gone



I'm agreeing with you here, that's why I said "objective"...meaning I didn't really agree. Sorry if that came across as the opposite. 


ism said:


> imagine what the value proposition would be if it didn't have the sordino or Legato I. Would this be a great Adagio 'update' with only the Adagio content?



I agree here also, the sardine strings sound great, and a much valued addition.


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## pderbidge (May 25, 2019)

I think the value prop here is this newer interface. If the face lift is better for workflow then for those who did not get along with the inconsistent and somewhat messy layout of the original Adagio series, but found the "sound" of Anthology to be too strained from the original Adagio/Agitato series then this new interface will be welcomed. I'm on both sides. I'll miss a lot of the Legacy Adagio content and would prefer to have it back (i'm repeating myself here, I know) but some of the workflow features of this new Adagio will be useful as well. Like I said before, a legacy folder with the stuff from Adagio that they couldn't fit into this new workflow would satisfy both camps.


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## jaketanner (May 25, 2019)

pderbidge said:


> a legacy folder with the stuff from Adagio that they couldn't fit into this new workflow would satisfy both camps.



You mean a folder that will load into the new GUI? Otherwise, you can still access the old content as you always did, and supplement that way..But kinda defeats the purpose.. LOL


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## sostenuto (May 25, 2019)

Aarrgghh ….. Decades with top-tier technology firm, and millions invested in R&D annually. 
Marketing has staggering potential to dilute amazing creative efforts with a few poorly chosen words and policies.
Now retired and enjoying equally amazing artistic 'r&d' …. No clue how much Mr. Troels F is involved with marketing, but hope he is distant and not shooting himself (_and his creative talents_) in the foot.


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## pderbidge (May 25, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> What is messed up in this whole scenario, is the people who purchased any of these libraries at FULL price. They should have definitely gotten this update free



8Dio is not the only guilty one here. I have a few of my own examples and here is just one example:

I bought LASS Lite years ago and decided a month later that I wanted to upgrade to LASS 2. So not only did I end up paying $1k for LASS2 but I paid a $50 upgrade fee (only a month later). I also wanted to get LASS LS, however the crossgrade fee for me on a normal sale is $199 and when on a special sale it's $178, as it is currently. Now this is where it bugs me. Anyone can currently buy a bundle price of LASS 2 + LASS LS for $696 and yet here I am, having paid $1k just for LASS is still required to pay $178 to add LASS LS. Prices go down, I get it. I don't begrudge paying $1K where as it now sells for less but as a crossgrade to complete my LASS bundle having to pay almost $200 just doesn't make me feel like a valued and loyal customer. I can see maybe $50 or something like that but $178. No thank you. This is what brought me to 8Dio in the first place. I was able to get Their recorded sordinos on sale for around $50 and ever since I have been slowly building up to more of their strings. I still love LASS and it isn't leaving my template anytime soon though.

The point is, there are stories like this for every developer- East West, Spitfire Etc... I just look at my options and go with what works best for me and I don't necessarily have an allegiance to any of the developers since they don't really have an allegiance to me. It's that simple.


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## pderbidge (May 25, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> You mean a folder that will load into the new GUI? Otherwise, you can still access the old content as you always did, and supplement that way..But kinda defeats the purpose.. LOL


Not with the new gui. Just an Extras folder with the old gui would be fine. Unfortunately I can't access the old content when it comes to the Violins because I never owned the original version of those. I only know what I'm missing because I own the old Violas and Basses. Going forward, all this great content will be lost forever to new users. That, to me, is a shame.


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## jaketanner (May 25, 2019)

pderbidge said:


> Not with the new gui. Just an Extras folder with the old gui would be fine. Unfortunately I can't access the old content when it comes to the Violins because I never owned the original version of those. I only know what I'm missing because I own the old Violas and Basses. Going forward, all this great content will be lost forever to new users. That, to me, is a shame.



Got you...but isn't moving to the new GUI the main reason for doing this in the first place? I think that would undermine their new "upgrade" to include the old interface in a folder.. But I agree it's too bad the content is no longer available. I mean, why not right? Not like it's costing them any to sell it, at least I don't think it would..lol


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## chocobitz825 (May 25, 2019)

So this is the problem...assume they throw that extra content in, and now you get just as many people saying they don’t want old unprocessed old format sample. How do you satisfy everyone? Knowing that the old system was clunky...and considering that few developers do multi Keyswitch legato anymore...what’s the point? If they could make an expansion that turns those arcs and extra legatos into a smart legato, I might even buy those (don’t mean to encourage more product).

I’m a studio one user, and recently they put put new updates that added features a lot of people would appreciate, but in the process they also cut out some functions and options I really used to like. It’s a reminder to me that not all updates are additive. Sometimes it’s also about cutting out things that might be less popular or outdated. It’s a risk in every update these days. 

At the end of the day, I can’t fault 8Dio for retiring certain parts of older libraries and I’d think if people had really wanted those older articulations, they would have bought them during the years they were available.


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## T-LeffoH (May 25, 2019)

paulmatthew said:


> The new Adagio Violas were free to Anthology owners for 48 hours. Confusing I know , but I've got it now. I heard the new cellos and basses were going to be free to Anthology owners as well??



As far as I understand the communication from 8Dio, the upgrades for Anthology users are free even after 48 hours. Per the email:

"*This coupon will expire in 48 hours. *

This coupon is unique to you - *do not share this code.*

If you wish to receive the update after the 48 hours is up, please get in touch with support for your free upgrade."​I'm speculating they may have had just one internal script/process setup to spit out emails and time-dependent discount codes to users based on what products they currently owned, figuring most would hastily redeem.

With Anthology owners being the only exception to the discount cost timeframe, probably figured they could respond to those who missed the window via individual requests later...or maybe benefit from their not reading the fine print and purchasing anyway.


----------



## Morning Coffee (May 25, 2019)

T-LeffoH said:


> As far as I understand the communication from 8Dio, the upgrades for Anthology users are free even after 48 hours. Per the email:
> 
> "*This coupon will expire in 48 hours. *
> 
> ...



I think they probably use the 48 hours time frame on personal codes because some people might share their code to others. As they are a business, I think that is fair enough.


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## teclark7 (May 25, 2019)

Hoping someone can help me with a couple of queries.

I have the agitato grandiose ensembles (violins, viola and cello), the agitato sordino ensemble/ sections, adagietto and adagio viola. (I don’t have the agitato legato arpeggio nor do i have Anthology). 

I have two questions I am hoping someone can answer:

1. I can get the new adagio viola for $28 but not sure what I would be getting. I understand I have both legatos in agitato and old adagio. Is it just a better user interface?

2. What am I getting by buying the new adagio violin and cello for $48 at intro price given that I have agitato for both of them and some nice patches in the agitato sordino as well as in adagietto? I am aware of a few bad (noisy) notes that presumably may have been fixed but I am not sure whether $48 each is worth it for a few fixes and a new UI.


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## 667 (May 25, 2019)

pderbidge said:


> You're obviously not sharing the whole conversation here.


Man there's no mystery about it: 8Dio chat support told me I have to pay 4 times to upgrade all 4 volumes (violin/viola/cello/bass).

I think for people who have been waiting a long time for bug fixes, people who spent $1000+ and supported your company and allowed you to build the business you now have, they deserve better than a $20 coupon.

But reading between the lines, if this is really 99% Agitato with some Adagio thrown in, I'm not even interested at $8. I want the original promise of Adagio delivered. Guess we'll never see it.


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## pderbidge (May 26, 2019)

667 said:


> Man there's no mystery about it: 8Dio chat support told me I have to pay 4 times to upgrade all 4 volumes (violin/viola/cello/bass).
> 
> I think for people who have been waiting a long time for bug fixes, people who spent $1000+ and supported your company and allowed you to build the business you now have, they deserve better than a $20 coupon.
> 
> But reading between the lines, if this is really 99% Agitato with some Adagio thrown in, I'm not even interested at $8. I want the original promise of Adagio delivered. Guess we'll never see it.


Sorry, I misunderstood. I think this answers the mystery question though. If you own all the adagios it's still not a one time fee of $28 like it is for Anthology owners who get a one time $8 fee. That's too bad. I agree it should be better than that. It's like I posted earlier though that 8Dio is not alone in making these poor decisions and I understand why you wouldn't be interested. If the interface doesn't entice you then the content certainly won't since you have a lot more content in the original Adagio.


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## 667 (May 26, 2019)

Maybe my perspective on it is just warped due to frustration with how Adagio was released/supported for what was a pretty expensive library at the time (on par with LASS or EW HS).

At $48 I'm sure it's a great deal for anyone looking sampled strings.


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## chocobitz825 (May 26, 2019)

ism said:


> To start now implying that Agitato is just Adagio done right is nonsense. Although it is true that so little of the Adagio legato remains in Anthology/the new Adagio that I suppose you could argue that this is an admission that Adagio is rubbish and should just be thrown away and replaced with Agitato.



Didn't the video explain that Anthology was essentially the "best of" collection of Adagio and Agitato?

I mean I know many of us hear are confused, but I cant help but feel its because of false expectations. People read Adagio and think its an upgrade directly to adagio, but all of these are listed as "A Part of the Anthology Series"....meaning Anthology is the core of this product, not Adagio or Agitato. It makes sense that this is Anthology improved. It also makes sense that this is Anthology, broken up instead of one large collection.

I think maybe we have to look at this as two parts. One its an update to Anthology...and at the same time, they also happened to retire Adagio. Two separate actions somewhat unrelated to each other. I mean..Adagio is old...eventually it needed to be put down.

I dont know. I have criticisms with 8DIO, but their marketing language has been the least of my concerns. I've always had a problem with seeing coupons come hours or days after products are announced.


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## ism (May 26, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> Didn't the video explain that Anthology was essentially the "best of" collection of Adagio and Agitato?



The video stated - for marketing purposes - that this is a ‘best of’. In does not attempt explain the sense in which it can be considered a best of.

Of course, you can interpret this as a literal truth: if you take Adagio and Agitato and throw away most of Adagio, then I guess you can interpret this, in a very literal, technical sense, as a “best of”

But while the execution of Agitato is clearly better than Adagio, I personally prefer the kind of emotional lines the the full Adagio is capable of over the very different kinds of lines Agitato excellent at.

But does anyone here consider the rather lacklustre Legato II of Anthology/ Adagio 2.0 as in any meaningful sense the "best of" Adagio? 

The tuneing is definitely better, and the playability is better - but only in the sense that most of the expressiveness has been removed, so there not much left to actually play.

But even Adagietto (notwithstanding the tuning) is much superior to legato II. 

So the marketing video can laude this a ‘best of’ all it wants, but it doesn’t change the fact that most of what I consider as the best in Adagio (and even adagietto) has simply been expunged.

Nothing wrong with selling Adagio 2.0 as a “Adagio-mostly-expunged” cut down version of course. But it doesn’t mean we need to accept marketing-happy-talk euphemisms like ‘update’ and ‘best of’ uncritically.

Of course, if your don’t like Adagio, and are happy to replace it with Agitato legatos instead, the ‘best of’ make makes sense. Just that this isn’t where i’m coming from.


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## chocobitz825 (May 26, 2019)

ism said:


> The video stated - for marketing purposes - that this is a ‘best of’. In does not attempt explain the sense in which it can be considered a best of.
> 
> Of course, you can interpret this as a literal truth: if you take Adagio and Agitato and throw away most of Adagio, then I guess you can interpret this, in a very literal, technical sense, as a “best of”
> 
> ...



I get that. Everyone has their tastes for what works and what doesnt, but Anthology was the "best of" from what they had made with Adagio and Agitato. Whether we agree if its the best or not, is preference, but not a failure of marketing. "Best of" is not a promise, its an opinion. They feel from a technical standpoint, its the best of what they had. How they decided that, i dont know, but no matter which way they made this library, someone would step up and say "I disagree! this could be better to fit my personal preferences!". So again, I entirely understand your preference, but I cant agree that this is somehow misleading marketing. 

They already stated that this library doesnt replace adagio, but should be considered as something separate. I've considered legato 2 to be a fast legato compared to the more expressive legato I. in my workflow thats totally fine because I dont have to do anything to get a workable fast legato. I dont need to adjust velocities or CC to get it, I just keyswitch to II, and go. This is better to me than having an instance of Adagio open, and an instance of Agitato open and trying to work the two libraries at the same time. Does it sound better than the older library? thats irreverent to me personally because if I wanted to use the sound of the older library, I'll use the older library. 

What I cant get is this idea that somehow 8DIO marketing has screwed over people who would prefer Adagio. If you preferred adagio, use adagio and dont upgrade. Or if you upgrade, use both as necessary. If the argument is, now people can no longer buy the "superior" adagio, then I'd have to say, why should 8DIO go out of its way to appeal to people who didn't buy a product that came out in 2012? Especially after they'd had numerous flash sales. If people didn't buy it over the last 7 years, why wait for them to buy it now? This upgrade is optional and the quality of its benefits are subjective. If it doesnt fit your expectations, I understand. I just dont know how they could ever cater marketing to guarantee that everyone is going to get EXACTLY what they want.


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## Dominik Raab (May 26, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> If people didn't buy it over the last 7 years, why wait for them to buy it now?



I'm not disagreeing with you on your whole post at all, but this section seems weird to me. There are people who're just getting started and would maybe like to buy the original Adagio. There are hobbyist with a certain budget, and maybe they considered but haven't taken the plunge yet, telling themselves: "This year around Christmas, I'm definitely getting Adagio!" Not everyone was in the market for sample libraries for as long as Adagio has existed, not everyone had the means to buy it.

I'm not saying this is a major faux-pas or that 8dio are doing the wrong thing here. Still, the "It was available long enough, your fault if you didn't pick it up" argument (hyperbole; you didn't say it like that) doesn't really fly with me.


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## ism (May 26, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> I get that. Everyone has their tastes for what works and what doesnt, but Anthology was the "best of" from what they had made with Adagio and Agitato. Whether we agree if its the best or not, is preference, but not a failure of marketing. "Best of" is not a promise, its an opinion. They feel from a technical standpoint, its the best of what they had. How they decided that, i dont know, but no matter which way they made this library, someone would step up and say "I disagree! this could be better to fit my personal preferences!". So again, I entirely understand your preference, but I cant agree that this is somehow misleading marketing.
> 
> They already stated that this library doesnt replace adagio, but should be considered as something separate. I've considered legato 2 to be a fast legato compared to the more expressive legato I. in my workflow thats totally fine because I dont have to do anything to get a workable fast legato. I dont need to adjust velocities or CC to get it, I just keyswitch to II, and go. This is better to me than having an instance of Adagio open, and an instance of Agitato open and trying to work the two libraries at the same time. Does it sound better than the older library? thats irreverent to me personally because if I wanted to use the sound of the older library, I'll use the older library.
> 
> What I cant get is this idea that somehow 8DIO marketing has screwed over people who would prefer Adagio. If you preferred adagio, use adagio and dont upgrade. Or if you upgrade, use both as necessary. If the argument is, now people can no longer buy the "superior" adagio, then I'd have to say, why should 8DIO go out of its way to appeal to people who didn't buy a product that came out in 2012? Especially after they'd had numerous flash sales. If people didn't buy it over the last 7 years, why wait for them to buy it now? This upgrade is optional and the quality of its benefits are subjective. If it doesnt fit your expectations, I understand. I just dont know how they could ever cater marketing to guarantee that everyone is going to get EXACTLY what they want.



I appreciate the insight into your workflow, and why you appreciate this.

And its great that the literal truth ('update', 'best of') the marketing happens to coincide with the way you use the library..

But the workflow you describe is that opposite of mine. Adagio has always been the library I like for slower lines, and some of the slow legatos are very beautiful and comprise what of which I most value about Adagio - especially in the violas, which tuning issues aside, can be quite gorgeous in Adagio in a way that is now completely lost in Adagio 2.0.


So reducing Adagio to the single Legato II for use as a fast legato (not even keeping the legatos of Adagietto) ... well, again, its great that this constitutes the 'best of' Adagio in your workflow. But it's the exact opposite of mine, and the opposite of how 8dio has always marketed Adagio. And even contradicts the implied meaning of the word 'Adagio'

And while I take your point of the subjectivity of 'best of', but I'd suggest that with the observation that the workflow that you describe is the exception rather that the rule.

Anyway, I think we've both made our points adequately. Glad you're enjoying Adagio 2.0.


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## chocobitz825 (May 26, 2019)

Dominik Raab said:


> I'm not disagreeing with you on your whole post at all, but this section seems weird to me. There are people who're just getting started and would maybe like to buy the original Adagio. There are hobbyist with a certain budget, and maybe they considered but haven't taken the plunge yet, telling themselves: "This year around Christmas, I'm definitely getting Adagio!" Not everyone was in the market for sample libraries for as long as Adagio has existed, not everyone had the means to buy it.
> 
> I'm not saying this is a major faux-pas or that 8dio are doing the wrong thing here. Still, the "It was available long enough, your fault if you didn't pick it up" argument (hyperbole; you didn't say it like that) doesn't really fly with me.



I totally acknowledge the possibility that people maybe just didn't know until now, or maybe they were waiting for the next sale. I only got Adagio last year, and on sale for some of them. I actually only bought Adagio Violins because it was the last thing I didn't have, it hadn't gone on sale, and I figured I should just complete the set, because "who knows?"

I dont get the necessity or even incentive for the developer to wait for people who only buy on sale. I get that the costs are high, and some people just are waiting for that right opportunity, but thats not a guaranteed condition. If you get it on sale, you're lucky! If you had to buy it full price, thats the way it goes. If while you were waiting for the next sale, the product is discontinued, thats an unfortunate result of the gamble taken. There are many libraries I missed out on that were discontinued before I ever got a shot at them, but thats not a failure of the developer. Its just bad timing. I dont think 8DIO would have done themselves any favors by keeping such an outdated and cumbersome (from current perspective) library in their product line. If its the one thing you bought, and the first thing you bought from 8DIO, how much faith would you have in their brand, if you compared their old Adagio interface to CSS? or any other brand that uses smarter legato? They could potentially turn off just as many new customers by keeping outdated stuff up. for example, the only reason I even stay with East West is because of the composer cloud, but their engine is so old and obnoxious that they're often the last library I ever want to pull up and I'm constantly considering ending my subscription.



ism said:


> I appreciate the insight into your workflow, and why you appreciate this.
> 
> And its great that the literal truth ('update', 'best of') the marketing happens to coincide with the way you use the library..
> 
> ...



Really this whole thing reminds me of Orchestral Tools Woodwinds Revive.

https://vi-control.net/community/threads/confused-with-ot-woodwinds-revive.66749/
When I picked up OT Woodwinds, I ended up with a main collection 3.0 and a Legacy 2.2 version in the package. I guess they rerecorded some instruments with more mics, but not all, so they just threw everything in. So now, as a new user coming into this i have BWW Revive: 90 GB compressed, and BWW Legacy: 67 GB compressed on my drive, and I rarely go into the legacy folder because the mic setups are different and I havent really needed it, but eliminating that 67GBs of data is complicated because the samples appear to be grouped all in together. I accept that. For whatever reason, they felt it was necessary to keep both versions, and make the woodwinds set more expensive for new adopters. I dont agree with it, it doesn't work for my workflow, and I'd like 67 GBs back, but it is how the product is, so I just have to accept it. I don't feel like OT is a lesser company for doing what they did, its just how they approached a similar issue. We agree to disagree on workflows and what's important, and I'm sure we're not the only ones.

OT's marketing around this library:
_Berlin Woodwinds is the industry standard when it comes to sampled woodwind collections.
The product that started our journey at the Teldex Scoring Stage in 2012, now received a huge update called Berlin Woodwinds Revive.
Most instruments have been newly recorded and, best of all, the whole original Berlin Woodwinds from 2012 with additional tweaks is included. This gives you as a composer double the number of instruments for ultimate flexibility and possibilities for doubling.
The purchase of Berlin Woodwinds consists of two separate collections that are available together as one big collection: Berlin Woodwinds Revive, containing all-new instruments, as well as Berlin Woodwinds Legacy, featuring the classic Berlin Woodwinds Instruments from 2012._


(My personal note:
"_This gives you as a composer double the number of instruments for ultimate flexibility and possibilities for doubling." _
Not really sure how this works with two versions of completely different mic positions, but thats marketing)


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## ism (May 26, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> Really this whole thing reminds me of Orchestral Tools Woodwinds Revive.



I think we'll simply have to agree that we perceive the dynamics of marketing semiotics very differently.

All the best.


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## chocobitz825 (May 26, 2019)

ism said:


> I think we'll simply have to agree that we perceive the dynamics of marketing semiotics very differently.
> 
> All the best.


fair enough. good day.


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## Reid Rosefelt (May 26, 2019)

Back in December 2017, @Cory Pelizzari made this video, which compares Anthology to Adagio, before the release of Century. And his recommendation at the time was to just get the original Adagio Violas and Adagio Cellos plus Agitato Grandiose Violins.



Based on this video I purchased the violas when they went on sale and was waiting for a good sale on the cellos (now $118) I'm probably going to upgrade the violas for $28 and am thinking about getting the new cellos for $48.

What are your thoughts? How have things changed since then? Do you agree with Cory? Are the new Agitato Violins better than the Agitato Grandiose Violins Cory recommended, which are still available for $44? I also have the Agitato Sordino Strings, which I really like. Are they duplicated in this new series?

@Cory Pelizzari do you care to chime in?


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## chocobitz825 (May 26, 2019)

TigerTheFrog said:


> Back in December 2017, @Cory Pelizzari made this video, which compares Anthology to Adagio, before the release of Century. And his recommendation at the time was to just get the original Adagio Violas and Adagio Cellos plus Agitato Grandiose Violins.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




His video is why I skipped on the violins initially. I just bought them down the line to complete the set. At least in my mind these new ones sound better and are more functional but that’s subjective. I would be interested to see what Cory has to say.


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## Land of Missing Parts (May 26, 2019)

TigerTheFrog said:


> Based on this video I purchased the violas when they went on sale and was waiting for a good sale on the cellos (now $118) I'm probably going to upgrade the violas for $28 and am thinking about getting the new cellos for $48.
> 
> What are your thoughts?


I'm in the same boat, as I have old Adagio Violas from the flash sale. And I got the Sordinos from a flash sale last year. As best as I can tell, here's what's going on in plain English.

New Adagio is:
-1 legato patch from old Adagio (which had a mess of different ones)
-1 legato patch from Agitato Grandiose (EDIT: With 3 legato types, velocity switches them)
-Sordinos from Agitato Sordino
-The most useful of the other articulations, namely shorts and a subset of dynamic bowings/arcs
-Newer interface which, unlike Anthology, doesn't take forever to load
-"Remastered" which is a fuzzy suggestion that they improved tuning and panning issues. Opinions from users on whether there is anything substantively different seem to vary. I'm not expecting much. (EDIT: Tuning fixes yes, minimal or no panning fixes).

Of those, I'm only interested in the 1 Agitato Grandiose legato. I don't care about the interface (I've modded my own Adagio multis, made my own articulation sets, and don't really even need to open Kontakt to use it. They load easy too.)

So to me it's a question of paying $28 for 1 legato and tuning fixes. And since this is a solo instrument, a divisi/chamber size, and a full section size, all in one, it's actually 3 legatos. (EDIT: Each with 3 types, velocity switches them)


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## Dominik Raab (May 26, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> I dont think 8DIO would have done themselves any favors by keeping such an outdated and cumbersome (from current perspective) library in their product line. If its the one thing you bought, and the first thing you bought from 8DIO, how much faith would you have in their brand, if you compared their old Adagio interface to CSS?



Fair point! Actually, one of the first 8DIO libraries I had was Anthology, and I wasn't thrilled (panning issues). Funny how those things work out... :D



> the only reason I even stay with East West is because of the composer cloud, but their engine is so old and obnoxious that they're often the last library I ever want to pull up and I'm constantly considering ending my subscription.



I think I'm your exact opposite. 80% of my template, at least, is East West stuff, and I prefer PLAY over Kontakt (mainly because I learnt how to use VSTs on PLAY, so maybe it's just what I'm used to). I've only recently started to explore other options, mainly complementing my EW stuff instead of replacing it.


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## ism (May 26, 2019)

Land of Missing Parts said:


> -1 legato from old Adagio (which had a mess of different ones)
> -1 legato from Agitato Grandiose



Possibly helpful:

- The origional Adagio has many legato patches, each with only a single type of legato. (Though there were some cumbersome multis that I was unable to even install that attempted to combine them)

- Agitato only ever had 1 legato patch - but with 3 type of legato triggered by velocity. (Which was a significant improvement in playability over the Adagio approach)


- Adagietto combined 3 Adagio legatos into a single legato patch, mirroring the playability of Agitato, only it expunges all the expressive arks of the original legato.

- Anthology/Adagio 2.0 Legato I, is virtually identical to Agitatio legato with the expressive arcs expunged.

- Anthology/Adagio 2.0 legato II has a single legato patch, but apparently with only a single type of legato. So it fixes some of the tuning issues (though not the panning), but otherwise expunges not only the expressive arcs of Adagio, but also the multiple legato type of Adagietto.


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## Dominik Raab (May 26, 2019)

ism said:


> So it fixes some of the tuning issues (though not the panning), but otherwise it not only expunges not only the expressive arcs of Adagio, but also the multiple legato type of Adagietto.



As someone who only owns Anthology and the new Adagio, the insane number of legato styles is the only thing I really wish I had. Mainly in it for the feathered spics and the wonderful sordinos.


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## Land of Missing Parts (May 26, 2019)

ism said:


> Possibly helpful


Very helpful, thanks. I edited my post to update the info.

I also second @pderbidge 's suggestion that 8dio just make all of the old legacy stuff available in a separate folder, maybe just call it something like "bonus: legacy patches"


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## chocobitz825 (May 26, 2019)

Dominik Raab said:


> Fair point! Actually, one of the first 8DIO libraries I had was Anthology, and I wasn't thrilled (panning issues). Funny how those things work out... :D
> 
> 
> 
> I think I'm your exact opposite. 80% of my template, at least, is East West stuff, and I prefer PLAY over Kontakt (mainly because I learnt how to use VSTs on PLAY, so maybe it's just what I'm used to). I've only recently started to explore other options, mainly complementing my EW stuff instead of replacing it.



That’s always the hard thing about moving to a new system. It can sometimes feel like they’ve ruined your entire workflow for the sake of new product or some marketing talk about revolutionizing the industry. Honestly though. I started on EW back in 06’ or so and it was a game changer for me. Nowadays there are so many more intuitive options. I wish PLAY would catch up. I always liked east west sound, but if you use something like CSS, you’ll see how much faster things can be. Whether that’s a better workflow result depends on the user, but I’d say EW’s major flaw is not innovating on PLAY. Having their own engine should have given them the chance to make something better than what goes on in the confines of kontakt.


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## Cory Pelizzari (May 26, 2019)

TigerTheFrog said:


> Back in December 2017, @Cory Pelizzari made this video, which compares Anthology to Adagio, before the release of Century. And his recommendation at the time was to just get the original Adagio Violas and Adagio Cellos plus Agitato Grandiose Violins.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



If the panning issues haven't been fixed then I don't really see the update as any more than an attempt to grab some more cash for an older release. Mind you I have a rather cynical mind - considering these libraries are Kontakt full based I see no reason to keep charging for "updates" or "remasters"... But that's just me...


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## Land of Missing Parts (May 26, 2019)

Cory Pelizzari said:


> If the panning issues haven't been fixed then I don't really see the update as any more than an attempt to grab some more cash for an older release. Mind you I have a rather cynical mind - considering these libraries are Kontakt full based I see no reason to keep charging for "updates" or "remasters"... But that's just me...


ism did mention tuning fixes. But yeah, that's some weak tea if you've already got Adagio and the Agitatos. 

However, if you're missing any of those, it'll partially fill them in for you.


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## michael c (May 26, 2019)

Bought the Violas update for $28.00. Wasn't worth even for $28.00 IMO. Though they did fix the 'staccato' short patch where the 4th sample was always twice as loud as the other samples in the patch which made it unusable. Of course they promised a fix that never came when I 1st bought that library. I've bought other libraries for a staccato viola patch since buying the original 8Dio viola. I do think the Violas are the best sounding of the Adagio original library. Just too many silly panning issues and odd samples in the original library. I've been burned by 8Dio too many times and not sure why I still buy their super cheap 'new' versions of old libraries.


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## Jeremy Spencer (May 26, 2019)

pderbidge said:


> If you own all the adagios it's still not a one time fee of $28 like it is for Anthology owners who get a one time $8 fee.



Yep. And by the time I buy all four sections, I'll be paying around $160 CDN. Already owning he original Adagio bundle, I'd rather pay a bit more and get something else. The upgrade fees are a joke, really.


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## Dominik Raab (May 26, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> I always liked east west sound, but if you use something like CSS, you’ll see how much faster things can be.



I'm probably just biased, but I still prefer EW's one-patch-for-one-articulation approach. Sure, it's slower, but having to remember all sorts of keyswitches just isn't my thing. If I really put the effort in to learn all the shortcuts, I'd probably be able to get used to it, but I just refuse. :D


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## chocobitz825 (May 26, 2019)

Dominik Raab said:


> I'm probably just biased, but I still prefer EW's one-patch-for-one-articulation approach. Sure, it's slower, but having to remember all sorts of keyswitches just isn't my thing. If I really put the effort in to learn all the shortcuts, I'd probably be able to get used to it, but I just refuse. :D



No right or wrong answer just different workflows yeah? It took awhile to get used to key switches but as more libraries went that way and I started blending libraries, it became far less complicated with Keyswitches. Honestly the best ones are the ones that have such smart engines they can just pick the right articulation based on velocity and speed. I welcome progress toward smarter libraries.


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## T-LeffoH (May 26, 2019)

Dominik Raab said:


> I'm probably just biased, but I still prefer EW's one-patch-for-one-articulation approach. Sure, it's slower, but having to remember all sorts of keyswitches just isn't my thing. If I really put the effort in to learn all the shortcuts, I'd probably be able to get used to it, but I just refuse. :D



I don't necessarily think because a library provides a keyswitch patch, it mandates keyswitching to be part of the workflow in using the library. You're free to parse out articulations over multiple tracks in your project files as you wish.

It's already what I do with Anthology anyway and other libraries like Musical Sampling Trailer Strings/Brass.


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## T-LeffoH (May 27, 2019)

Dominik Raab said:


> EW's one-patch-for-one-articulation approach



An additional thought - many of EW libraries have keyswitch patches. Albeit I don't use them because they don't really add anything, they are there.

Also in a lot of conversations I've had with other composers over the years about their workflow, I've never really heard consistent, objective responses to the WHY question behind choices in workflows.

If I were a nerd _<cough>_, I would reference early workflow methodologies that stemmed from Toyota's early 20th century operations in textile manufacturing. They developed business processes, in use to this day, which focused around improving efficiency in work execution.

The goal with work in all fields should always be in implementing solutions that make the work occur more efficiently - which doesn't mean it has to be less enjoyable. With music technology there are _objective_ and _subjective_ workflow ideas. To me, things begin to become _subjective_ when they introduce abnormal amounts of time in the workflow.


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## jaketanner (May 27, 2019)

T-LeffoH said:


> The goal with work in all fields should always be in implementing solutions that make the work occur more efficiently



There is a fine line between efficiency, and inspirational workflow. Playability and creativity should trump efficiency. If using KS allows me to feel the performance better then I’ll do that. If it’s a another way I’ll do that also. That’s why it’s important to have options from the developers, as everyone’s creative workflow is different. If it’s not intuitive, it’s going to be hard to perform.


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## robgb (May 27, 2019)

michael c said:


> Though they did fix the 'staccato' short patch where the 4th sample was always twice as loud as the other samples in the patch which made it unusable.


I know it's ultimately the developer's responsibly to fix their libraries, but proactive users can also fix small errors like this themselves. The beauty of owning full Kontakt is the ability to make changes in an instrument file.


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## Cory Pelizzari (May 27, 2019)

robgb said:


> I know it's ultimately the developer's responsibly to fix their libraries, but proactive users can also fix small errors like this themselves. The beauty of owning full Kontakt is the ability to make changes in an instrument file.


And oh boy, do I like to do that. It's like a sub-hobby for me.


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## T-LeffoH (May 27, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> There is a fine line between efficiency, and inspirational workflow. Playability and creativity should trump efficiency. If using KS allows me to feel the performance better then I’ll do that. If it’s a another way I’ll do that also. That’s why it’s important to have options from the developers, as everyone’s creative workflow is different. If it’s not intuitive, it’s going to be hard to perform.



I mostly agree, except for the fact that both playability and creativity are variable words relative to objective impact on any individual's workflow requirements.

If using KS makes your workflow more efficient...use it.

If using KS doesn't make your workflow more efficient...don't use it.

Efficiency is also dependent on what you're doing and why you're doing it one way versus another.

e.g. If your end product is never going to be a sample-based piece of music, later live-recorded, and you're using KS to aid you in expediting the writing process...by all means use KS.

In general I'm positive creative individuals/businesses don't regularly consider their own efficiency, or measure it, because inefficiency is a naturally widespread problem in most businesses and they pay millions/billions annually to identify those inefficiencies.


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## jaketanner (May 27, 2019)

T-LeffoH said:


> I mostly agree, except for the fact that both playability and creativity are variable words relative to objective impact on any individual's workflow requirements.



I agree here that it would be hard to be creative, if there is no efficiency in the workflow. Last thing we need is the technical side to get in the way.

I think for myself, I try and start out to be as efficient as possible, but then things start to change and little b little, I'm back to having to make things efficient again.. LOL. Part of grow I think for any business as you mentioned.


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## T-LeffoH (May 27, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> I agree here that it would be hard to be creative, if there is no efficiency in the workflow. Last thing we need is the technical side to get in the way.
> 
> I think for myself, I try and start out to be as efficient as possible, but then things start to change and little b little, I'm back to having to make things efficient again.. LOL. Part of grow I think for any business as you mentioned.



I similarly agree with you, I'm the same way with how I work. My underlying point was just that it's very situationally dependent. For me, regardless of the tech details I actually prefer to work with hard, fast deadlines versus loose timeframes because it reduces creative second-guessing w/ the end goal being just getting the work done by XX:YY:ZZ time.

I've also done a little bit of freelance workflow/improvement consulting for larger production music publishing orgs over the past few years and had great conversations w/ some of their leadership about where improvements might be possible across the board industry-wide. I was inspired by those interactions but also disheartened at the same time as the separate businesses involved in our industry are so operationally independent compared to other businesses in the world it creates this weird lack of accountability in making sure efficiency and accountability exists.

With any/every industry from first note conceived by the composer to the time it gets to somebody's ear, I think there's a lot that can be improved upon to benefit any/all people & businesses involved.


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## robgb (May 27, 2019)

Cory Pelizzari said:


> And oh boy, do I like to do that. It's like a sub-hobby for me.


Yeah. I love the things you did with SF Studio Strings.


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## Jeremy Spencer (May 27, 2019)

robgb said:


> Yeah. I love the things you did with SF Studio Strings.



Another reason for me to bite the bullet and upgrade to Kontakt 6


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## robgb (May 27, 2019)

Wolfie2112 said:


> Another reason for me to bite the bullet and upgrade to Kontakt 6


You can use the Kontakt 6 Player. That's what I do. I use 5.8.1 for everything else, but Cory's NKIs work great in Player.


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## Jeremy Spencer (May 27, 2019)

robgb said:


> You can use the Kontakt 6 Player. That's what I do. I use 5.8.1 for everything else, but Cory's NKIs work great in Player.



Nice! I didn't realize that.


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## airwavemusic (May 28, 2019)

I miss the original dynamic bowing’s in the solo section. Why did they get rid of so many great articulations? All of this to have key switches? Will buy upgrade nevertheless because it’s a great sounding and unique collection imo but I’ll keep my original files


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## Dominik Raab (May 30, 2019)

Cellos are out! Has anyone received their upgrade code yet?


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## Manuel Stumpf (May 30, 2019)

Dominik Raab said:


> Cellos are out! Has anyone received their upgrade code yet?


Support just said, codes will be sent by email in an hour.


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## jaketanner (May 30, 2019)

I got mine.


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## muziksculp (May 30, 2019)

As an Anthology Strings owner, I just purchased their Adagio Violins 2.0 for $8.0 which covers the cost for the remaining sections, looking forward to receive my download code for the Adagio Cellos 2.0, and Violas 2.0 .

I wonder when 8Dio will have their *2.0 versions* of their *Century Strings, and Century Brass* ? It has been quite a while since they mentioned the Century 2.0 versions are being worked on.


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## dzilizzi (May 30, 2019)

Got my free Cello upgrade. I missed the violas and had to ask for a new code. So thought I'd better grab it quick.


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## jaketanner (May 30, 2019)

Just played around with the cello ensemble patch. Legato 1 and 2 only...no other articulation yet. Did not like them...LOL Legato 2 has some tuning issues, and legato 1 seemed to have velocity issues. I was a bit discouraged to continue, but I will tonight. Anyone else care to chime in?

Compared to the violin and viola, the cello so far, seems not as good from my initial play-through. Hope others have different opinions.


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## Jeremy Spencer (May 30, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Just played around with the cello ensemble patch. Legato 1 and 2 only...no other articulation yet. Did not like them...LOL Legato 2 has some tuning issues, and legato 1 seemed to have velocity issues. I was a bit discouraged to continue, but I will tonight. Anyone else care to chime in?
> 
> Compared to the violin and viola, the cello so far, seems not as good from my initial play-through. Hope others have different opinions.



This is not good news, the "old" Adagio Cellos have the exact same issues. I still haven't heard any compelling reasons to upgrade to any of the new libraries. For Antholgy owners its a no-brainer, but I don't feel like shelling out $28 for each section if it's the same old issues.....that will be like $160 CDN.


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## jaketanner (May 30, 2019)

Wolfie2112 said:


> This is not good news, the "old" Adagio Cellos have the exact same issues. I still haven't heard any compelling reasons to upgrade to any of the new libraries. For Antholgy owners its a no-brainer, but I don't feel like shelling out $28 for each section if it's the same old issues.....that will be like $160 CDN.



I hear you completely. The only reason to upgrade is for the new GUI and smoother operation within Kontakt 5. I have Anthology, so $8 for the entire upgrade is a no-brainer. It's still better than old Adagio simply because it runs smoothly, and non of the issues I had with the old interface are present. I need to see the other patches and articulations. Might need to wait until later tonight though...but hoping to hear from others who have played longer with it.

My fear is that it's less than a week from the violas, and while the upgrades are good, I'd rather wait a little longer than for them to rush this release.


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## jtnyc (May 30, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Just played around with the cello ensemble patch. Legato 1 and 2 only...no other articulation yet. Did not like them...LOL Legato 2 has some tuning issues, and legato 1 seemed to have velocity issues. I was a bit discouraged to continue, but I will tonight. Anyone else care to chime in?
> 
> Compared to the violin and viola, the cello so far, seems not as good from my initial play-through. Hope others have different opinions.


Do you own the original Adagio Cellos? These, like the Violins and Violas are essentially the same as the old ones as stated many times. Yes they left out some stuff and there is the Anthology UI, but for all volumes so far there is no hugely noticeable improvements. Just some tailoring of the releases and maybe some other minor things that I can't hear. As also stated, these new versions do sound better than they did in Anthology, but if you only own the original Adagio and you don't want the Agitato content (which I happen to quite like), and your not fussed about the new UI, I see no reason to pay for the upgrade.


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## jtnyc (May 30, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> My fear is that it's less than a week from the violas, and while the upgrades are good, I'd rather wait a little longer than for them to rush this release.


I don't think they are rushing. I think this was as far as they were willing to go regardless, or as far as they could go with the existing material. As an owner of all of it, Adagio, Agitato and Anthology, I'm happy with this easier to manage UI. The articulations that I care most about are all there except the different arcs, which I am keeping in quickload right along side the new stuff. What is a drag is having 3 sets of the same samples on my drive. I'll probably keep the old Adagio samples (need them for the arcs and who knows what else later on), lose Anthology altogether and of coarse keep the new version.


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## jaketanner (May 30, 2019)

jtnyc said:


> Do you own the original Adagio Cellos? These, like the Violins and Violas are essentially the same as the old ones as stated many times. Yes they left out some stuff and there is the Anthology UI, but for all volumes so far there is no hugely noticeable improvements. Just some tailoring of the releases and maybe some other minor things that I can't hear. As also stated, these new versions do sound better than they did in Anthology, but if you only own the original Adagio and you don't want the Agitato content (which I happen to quite like), and your not fussed about the new UI, I see no reason to pay for the upgrade.



I have them ALL...All versions. The old interfaces were not stable in my system and with kontakt 5...Anthology was unusable because of the sound...at least now it's better. I'd have to do more testing to see if overall the cello is good. From the ensemble legatos, I wonder.


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## jtnyc (May 30, 2019)

Wolfie2112 said:


> This is not good news, the "old" Adagio Cellos have the exact same issues. I still haven't heard any compelling reasons to upgrade to any of the new libraries. For Antholgy owners its a no-brainer, but I don't feel like shelling out $28 for each section if it's the same old issues.....that will be like $160 CDN.


As I just said in my response to Jake, If you only own the original Adagio and you don't want the Agitato content (which I happen to quite like), and your not fussed about the new UI, I see no reason to pay for the upgrade.


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## pderbidge (May 30, 2019)

airwavemusic said:


> I miss the original dynamic bowing’s in the solo section. Why did they get rid of so many great articulations? All of this to have key switches? Will buy upgrade nevertheless because it’s a great sounding and unique collection imo but I’ll keep my original files


8Dio is just not making any sense to me right now. As they release these "new" libs they are discontinuing the original Adagio and yet most of this is really just an update to Anthology, which is still selling on their site. The original Adagios have so much content that these do not include so why not just discontinue Anthology- call this new one Anthology 2 and keep the old Adagio for the unique content that it had to offer, or get those Arcs back into this new library. I still maintain that no one would complain (at least not very much) to include a Legacy folder for those patches that might be too difficult to fit into this new interface.


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## jaketanner (May 31, 2019)

pderbidge said:


> why not just discontinue Anthology



I agree here...Anthology 1 is awful. I renamed these new Adagio libraries Anthology II in my files. They are in no way an updated Adagio 2...it's Anthology II.


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## ScarletJerry (Jun 1, 2019)

I’m on the fence about buying the Cellos. I have Adagio Violas, so I spent $28 to upgrade them. I also have the Grandiose Sordinos library and the Agitado Grandiose Violins (but no the Adagio Violins, new or old). I have other strings libraries (Cinematic Strings 2.1 and Soaring Strings) so that’s why I didn’t purchase the Adagio Violins. Part of me feels like the Cellos could add something new to my template, and also give me two Adagio sections that I could complement with other Bass and Violin strings libraries. I also own the original Tina Gio acoustic Cello. Basically. This library would give me a ‘less emotional’ solo cello, as well as the divisi section, the arc articulations, and the Agitado Grandiose Cello Legato.

What would you do?

ScarletJerry


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## Dominik Raab (Jun 1, 2019)

ScarletJerry said:


> This library would give me a ‘less emotional’ solo cello, as well as the divisi section, the arc articulations, and the Agitado Grandiose Cello Legato.



The divisis and everything you mentioned are certainly great, but don't forget the sordinos (my main reason for buying Anthology back in December and upgrading now), and the short notes aren't too bad, either. I like layering the two spiccato options in Anthology/Adagio with other libraries to give them more of an edge.


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## jaketanner (Jun 2, 2019)

ScarletJerry said:


> What would you do?



The one reason to upgrade them all, is the have a consistent sound as a string library. Mixing and matching libraries is okay, but not the same as using all the instruments recorded in the same space. 

Second, the GUI is better and more stable with Kontakt 5. 

Think of the solo patches as first chairs, not as exposed solo libraries. Tina Guo is way over the top and is not an all around cello library. Comparing the two is like apples to oranges. Totally different uses.


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## Stanoli (Jun 2, 2019)

I would really like it if they also could provide the new GUI for Adagietto.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Jun 2, 2019)

ScarletJerry said:


> I’m on the fence about buying the Cellos. I have Adagio Violas, so I spent $28 to upgrade them. I also have the Grandiose Sordinos library and the Agitado Grandiose Violins (but no the Adagio Violins, new or old). I have other strings libraries (Cinematic Strings 2.1 and Soaring Strings) so that’s why I didn’t purchase the Adagio Violins. Part of me feels like the Cellos could add something new to my template, and also give me two Adagio sections that I could complement with other Bass and Violin strings libraries. I also own the original Tina Gio acoustic Cello. Basically. This library would give me a ‘less emotional’ solo cello, as well as the divisi section, the arc articulations, and the Agitado Grandiose Cello Legato.
> 
> What would you do?
> 
> ScarletJerry



How do you like the Adagio viola upgrade? Worth it?


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## ism (Jun 2, 2019)

ScarletJerry said:


> I also own the original Tina Gio acoustic Cello. Basically. This library would give me a ‘less emotional’ solo cello



I would not buy this for the solo cello. 

Although you are of course correct that it can accurately be described as 'less emotional' than the Tina Guo. And I guess it can add a bit of definition to a line using it as a first chair.

But there's a reason there's virtual no demo of it available.


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## EgM (Jun 2, 2019)

ism said:


> I would not buy this for the solo cello.
> 
> Although you are of course correct that it can accurately be described as 'less emotional' than the Tina Guo. And I guess it can add a bit of definition to a line using it as a first chair.
> 
> But there's a reason there's virtual no demo of it available.




There's a playthrough from 8Dio using all the Cello patches including solo here:


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## ism (Jun 2, 2019)

EgM said:


> There's a playthrough from 8Dio using all the Cello patches including solo here:



Yes, I saw that, we have a few seconds of the solo cello sounding. but I’d take it with a large grain of salt.

Notice for instance, how there’s no dynamics used at all in those few seconds.


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## EgM (Jun 2, 2019)

ism said:


> Yes, I saw that, we have a few seconds of the solo cello sounding. but I’d take it with a large grain of salt.



I have it, it plays exactly like the video is doing. I find it is a nice spot in between Virharmonic and Tina Guo, it can play faster than both and still has a nice character.


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## ism (Jun 2, 2019)

EgM said:


> I have it, it plays exactly like the video is doing. I find it is a nice spot in between Virharmonic and Tina Guo, it can play faster than both and still has a nice character.



I find it unusable. But then, I consider the dynamics the sin quo non of a solo cello - I would never play a line like in the demo that’s all at ff (with volume change of cc13 only controlling the dynamics). So I guess i’d believe there’s a certain type of lines that it’s ok for. Perhaps I just don’t happen to write such lines.

Anyway, you’re the first person i’ve heard say anything, positive or negative about the solo cello, so that’s a good data point to add. But the demos are so spare (and my experience so bad) that I’d simply warn about weighing it very heavily in a purchasing decision.


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## jon wayne (Jun 2, 2019)

muziksculp said:


> As an Anthology Strings owner, I just purchased their Adagio Violins 2.0 for $8.0 which covers the cost for the remaining sections, looking forward to receive my download code for the Adagio Cellos 2.0, and Violas 2.0 .
> 
> I wonder when 8Dio will have their *2.0 versions* of their *Century Strings, and Century Brass* ? It has been quite a while since they mentioned the Century 2.0 versions are being worked on.


Did you get yours?


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## ScarletJerry (Jun 2, 2019)

Wolfie2112 said:


> How do you like the Adagio viola upgrade? Worth it?



I think that it’s worth it for the $28 upgrade price. If I only had this version, and not the original Adagio, I would be disappointed. The number of the dynamic bowings in the original Adagio violas are really nice, and I like the ability to try different legato styles in the solo viola, instead of only one legato in the new version. The interface, of course, is a nice improvement.

Scarlet Jerry


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## ScarletJerry (Jun 2, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> The one reason to upgrade them all, is the have a consistent sound as a string library. Mixing and matching libraries is okay, but not the same as using all the instruments recorded in the same space.
> 
> Second, the GUI is better and more stable with Kontakt 5.
> 
> Think of the solo patches as first chairs, not as exposed solo libraries. Tina Guo is way over the top and is not an all around cello library. Comparing the two is like apples to oranges. Totally different uses.



Thanks for your reply about the solo cello. I like your analogy about using the cello as a first chair rather than an exposed cello.

Scarlet Jerry


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## chocobitz825 (Jun 2, 2019)

ScarletJerry said:


> Thanks for your reply about the solo cello. I like your analogy about using the cello as a first chair rather than an exposed cello.
> 
> Scarlet Jerry



I think the problem is in how we view the concept of “solo”. It’s literally just a single cello but it plays like a First chair more than a more expressive solo library like virharmonnic, or Tina Guo. I’d say most developers not specifically aimed at making solo instruments that can play more expressive lead lines suffer from the same. Even as good as spitfire gets, they’re never exactly as characteristically unique as the virharmonic, Tina or Joshua bell violin. 8dios solo instruments are useful if it fits your writing style, but I’d never use them completely on their own.


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## ScarletJerry (Jun 2, 2019)

On a related note (no pun intended), I probably will purchase the new Cellos but not the Violins or the basses. As a hobbyist, I already mentioned in a previous post that I own CS2 and Soaring strings, as well as the 8Dio Sordinos and the Agitado Grandiose violin legato. I will miss out on the divisi legato, as well as the shorts. I have Joshua Bell, so the solo violin does not appeal to me, and if I need to get the expressive solo sound like the Schindler violin, I can just use the free violin from Perfomance Samples.

-Scarlet Jerry


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## muziksculp (Jun 2, 2019)

jon wayne said:


> Did you get yours?



I got them emailed to me after I requested them from their Support Chat. They are very responsive, and emailed them to me within a few minutes, but I have not had the time to install any of the new Adagio 2 libraries yet.


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## jaketanner (Jun 3, 2019)

Stanoli said:


> I would really like it if they also could provide the new GUI for Adagietto.



Doubt that would happen.


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## jaketanner (Jun 3, 2019)

Has anyone tried the solo viola in this new update? There seems to be quite a volume jump when going from low C to G in legato mode. Can anyone confirm this to be sure it's not just me? Thanks


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## jaketanner (Jun 3, 2019)

Also, to confirm...at least on my testing: The solo instruments can barely be used for any exposed writing...they are clearly only meant to be used as first chairs within a composition, and not to replace, or take the place of an actual solo library.


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## Dominik Raab (Jun 3, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Also, to confirm...at least on my testing: The solo instruments can barely be used for any exposed writing...they are clearly only meant to be used as first chairs within a composition, and not to replace, or take the place of an actual solo library.



That's my impression, too.


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## Montisquirrel (Jun 5, 2019)

I'm very happy about this update, but there is one thing really bothering me right now. Maybe I'm doing something wrong:

When I play legato and than keyswitch to a short articulation and after some notes back to the legato, it triggers the same note which I played in the first legato part in the end. I repeat, because I'm not sure if you understand my words: The last note/sample in the first legato melody will be played again for a very short amount of time, when I switch to shorts and than back to legato.

I hope it is not normal and I am doing something wrong

Edit: Violins, Violas and Cellos, they all behave this way


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## Manuel Stumpf (Jun 5, 2019)

Montisquirrel said:


> I'm very happy about this update, but there is one thing really bothering me right now. Maybe I'm doing something wrong:
> 
> When I play legato and than keyswitch to a short articulation and after some notes back to the legato, it triggers the same note which I played in the first legato part in the end. I repeat, because I'm not sure if you understand my words: The last note/sample in the first legato melody will be played again for a very short amount of time, when I switch to shorts and than back to legato.
> 
> ...



If you hold the note while switching to the short articulation, after coming back to the legato, it will make a legato transition from the last legato note (from before playing the shorts) to the next note you play legato (after coming back from the shorts).

-> You can release the legato note quickly before switching to the short articulation, then this will not happen. And the next note played legato will be seen as pick up note, that does not have a legato transition at the beginning.

Edit: Anthology behaves the same.


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## Montisquirrel (Jun 5, 2019)

Manuel Stumpf said:


> If you hold the note while switching to the short articulation, after coming back to the legato, it will make a legato transition from the last legato note (from before playing the shorts) to the next note you play legato (after coming back from the shorts).
> 
> -> You can release the legato note quickly before switching to the short articulation, then this will not happen. And the next note played legato will be seen as pick up note, that does not have a legato transition at the beginning.
> 
> Edit: Anthology behaves the same.



Thank you. Yes, that works. But it would be much more convinient, if the engine "forgets" about the last legato note after keyswitching.


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## EgM (Jun 6, 2019)

new Adagio Basses are out.

https://8dio.com/instrument/adagio-basses/


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## Lukas Vokrinek (Jun 8, 2019)

Hmm, I only own the Adagietto and the Sordinos, so I wonder how useful these would be... In addition I own Cinematic Strings, Hollywood Strings, and Emotional Cello and Violin...
I am mostly worried about the inconsistencies in panning and other minor issues that's been there pretty much with every 8DIO product, so I am being careful.
That currently means 48$ each, or 192 for all, but I am not really sure I need them.
Hopefully we'll get a couple more impressions, I believe the Violin promo ends mid June.


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## chocobitz825 (Jun 8, 2019)

Lukas Vokrinek said:


> Hmm, I only own the Adagietto and the Sordinos, so I wonder how useful these would be... In addition I own Cinematic Strings, Hollywood Strings, and Emotional Cello and Violin...
> I am mostly worried about the inconsistencies in panning and other minor issues that's been there pretty much with every 8DIO product, so I am being careful.
> That currently means 48$ each, or 192 for all, but I am not really sure I need them.
> Hopefully we'll get a couple more impressions, I believe the Violin promo ends mid June.



If you have concerns about panning, just avoid it. Every person that has said they had this as a concern, continues to say that its a problem for almost every release from 8dio. It’s not bothered me, so I dont find this an issue, but I wouldn’t expect this to be a satisfactory update if that was a concern you had.


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## Gerbil (Jun 8, 2019)

The panning issues really don't bother me with Adagio-Anthology as, together, they make a beautifully rich, organic sound. It's also very playable and the revised interface means everything now loads really quickly.


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## Lukas Vokrinek (Jun 8, 2019)

I'll keep that in mind, thanks! So, you'd say at ~200$ they are good value then?


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## jaketanner (Jun 8, 2019)

Lukas Vokrinek said:


> Hmm, I only own the Adagietto and the Sordinos, so I wonder how useful these would be... In addition I own Cinematic Strings, Hollywood Strings, and Emotional Cello and Violin...
> I am mostly worried about the inconsistencies in panning and other minor issues that's been there pretty much with every 8DIO product, so I am being careful.
> That currently means 48$ each, or 192 for all, but I am not really sure I need them.
> Hopefully we'll get a couple more impressions, I believe the Violin promo ends mid June.



So the panning bothered me also at first. But after you have completed a score with it, they seem nice a full. However, with this new version, you have different mic positions that each have their own pan knob. So you can place them where ever you want, and still sound great...not so much with older versions. Also keep in mind that, most modern film scores do not follow traditional seating, so having this option is nice.

Whether you actually need the library is up to you, but for me, no one else has this particular sound.


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## Gerbil (Jun 8, 2019)

I think that's a really generous price for what you get.

It might be worth pointing out that I stayed clear of 8dio for years. A fair number of bad reviews and evident issues with programming in the early days put me off buying from them. Then they started having these $28 dollar sales last year so I bought the alto flute on a whim and my jaw almost hit the floor it sounded so lovely. Up there with Spitfire's. So I added more instruments and each time I was struck by just how lovely the performances of the samples sounded. Sure, there was some uneveness between articulations but that goes for almost every developer I've bought a library from.

What really impresses with this release of Adagio and the Century Brass Ensembles I bought the other night, is how effective these libraries are at helping sculpt a really effective musical phrase. It's not just pulling around CC1/11; there a variety of options to start and end phrases that can make them musically compelling. That's worth a lot to me.


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## Lukas Vokrinek (Jun 8, 2019)

I appreciate all the input guys! I'll probably wait this one out for now, as great as they're. Surely, they'll be on sale again, eventually. Suppose I feel a bit sour towards 8DIO for all the past bad rep so I'll take a break buying off them for a bit. Been having a blast with Cinematic Strings lately, so I'd probably save up for CSS / CSSS instead. Thanks for all the help though!


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## jon wayne (Jun 8, 2019)

Sorta dumb question. I have Anthology and the Adagio updates. If I trash Anthology, what will I be missing?


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## jtnyc (Jun 8, 2019)

jon wayne said:


> Sorta dumb question. I have Anthology and the Adagio updates. If I trash Anthology, what will I be missing?


I believe nothing except the all sections ensemble patch.


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## Drjay (Jun 9, 2019)

Hi all,


being new to this forum, I‘d first like to thank you all for the interesting and massive amount of posts regarding orchestral libraries. 
Since I‘m a noob when it comes to orchestral composition, I‘m a little bit confused of what to buy as a first „real“ string/orchestral library. I currently own the Orchestra and the Komplete 12 Ultimate (not CE) libraries.
Given the current sale price of approx. 200$ for all 4 Adagio libraries, I am tempted to pull the trigger, especially since I like the sound of these libraries and from what I have heard, there are lots of articulations to play with. On the other hand I read a lot about various programming issues in these libraries and I wonder if it would be worth saving the money and waiting for the next sale of CSS or EWHO Diamond. With the later I would also get the additional orchestral sections besides the strings. When it comes to the sound of the libraries, I tend to the „classical side“ and less to epic hollywood stuff.

I‘m aware of the fact, that there a a lots of similar posts in this forum, but most of them refer to the old Adagio libraries and do not take into account the current sale price. I’m also interested in your opinion how the Adagio libraries match with the aforementioned other libraries.

Thanks for your help


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## MarcelM (Jun 9, 2019)

Drjay said:


> Hi all,
> 
> 
> being new to this forum, I‘d first like to thank you all for the interesting and massive amount of posts regarding orchestral libraries.
> ...



if you are starting out, get east west composer cloud. then if you get along with it and play buy HO diamond. you cant buy anything like it for the money it costs.


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## robgb (Jun 9, 2019)

Lukas Vokrinek said:


> I am mostly worried about the inconsistencies in panning and other minor issues that's been there pretty much with every 8DIO product, so I am being careful.





chocobitz825 said:


> If you have concerns about panning, just avoid it. Every person that has said they had this as a concern, continues to say that its a problem for almost every release from 8dio.



If you have concerns about panning there are two ways to address this. If you have a width control on each track in your DAW, you can narrow the width of the instrument and pan it into position. Alternately, you can use a free plugin like Panagement from Auburn Sounds. If you want a permanent solution, you can hit the wrench/spanner on the instrument in Kontakt, go down to the INSERT EFFECTS tab and add a STEREO MODELER. The modeler will allow you to narrow the width of the instrument and pan it to any position you like. Be sure to SAVE this with a NEW INSTRUMENT NAME so that you don't overwrite the original instrument (in case something goes wrong).

While it would be nice if the developers took care of some of these issues themselves, the beauty of owning Kontakt is that we can go in a correct these minor deficiencies and not have to wait for them to fix it.


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## chocobitz825 (Jun 9, 2019)

robgb said:


> If you have concerns about panning there are two ways to address this. If you have a width control on each track in your DAW, you can narrow the width of the instrument and pan it into position. Alternately, you can use a free plugin like Panagement from Auburn Sounds. If you want a permanent solution, you can hit the wrench/spanner on the instrument in Kontakt, go down to the INSERT EFFECTS tab and add a STEREO MODELER. The modeler will allow you to narrow the width of the instrument and pan it to any position you like. Be sure to SAVE this with a NEW INSTRUMENT NAME so that you don't overwrite the original instrument (in case something goes wrong).
> 
> While it would be nice if the developers took care of some of these issues themselves, the beauty of owning Kontakt is that we can go in a correct these minor deficiencies and not have to wait for them to fix it.



THIS seems to be the most persistent complaint about Anthology. That adagio had issues and this is exactly what 8DIO did with Anthology resulting in it being too thin. Now It's wide again, but still bothers some people with the panning.


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## ism (Jun 9, 2019)

robgb said:


> If you have concerns about panning there are two ways to address this. If you have a width control on each track in your DAW, you can narrow the width of the instrument and pan it into position. Alternately, you can use a free plugin like Panagement from Auburn Sounds. If you want a permanent solution, you can hit the wrench/spanner on the instrument in Kontakt, go down to the INSERT EFFECTS tab and add a STEREO MODELER. The modeler will allow you to narrow the width of the instrument and pan it to any position you like. Be sure to SAVE this with a NEW INSTRUMENT NAME so that you don't overwrite the original instrument (in case something goes wrong).
> 
> While it would be nice if the developers took care of some of these issues themselves, the beauty of owning Kontakt is that we can go in a correct these minor deficiencies and not have to wait for them to fix it.




Thanks - this is helpful. Especially for libraries like the Claire clarinet where the stereo image is so wildly all over the place the place that I almost feel I need to duck to avoid the clarinet that seems to be madly flying around the room.


My (very imprecise) sense is almost that some of legato samples - or something - are recorded seemingly facing in different directions. So it's not just wonkiness in the stereo image, its something that at worst, can fundamentally break the illusion of the different sample fusing together to form an illusion of a single fluid line.

That said, I'd call this tips more of workaround than a solution, in that you loose the stereo image naturally recorded. In the best recorded libraries I have (spitfire solo strings, light and sound chamber strings for instance) there's something about the sense of presence and dimension that is very precisely the antidote to the sterility that always drive me crazy with, for instance, vsl.

So these workarounds are helpful. But they do come at a cost.

In a busy hybrid mix it probably doesn't matter so much. But when I'm trying to write something more contrapuntal (in which case spatialization really can make a diffence in maintaining the perceptual independence of the lines), and in a less thonkingly-epic styles, this is when the panning issues really take a serious toll.


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## zimm83 (Jun 9, 2019)

Hy ..can someone tell me how the portamento is triggered..in adagio cellos.......by lower velocity or by higher velocity... Thanks .


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## Montisquirrel (Jun 9, 2019)

zimm83 said:


> Hy ..can someone tell me how the portamento is triggered..in adagio cellos.......by lower velocity or by higher velocity... Thanks .



Should be lower velocity, but only with the Legato 1 patch, if I remember correct


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## zimm83 (Jun 9, 2019)

Montisquirrel said:


> Should be lower velocity, but only with the Legato 1 patch, if I remember correct


Ah ok...Thanks very much. Would have loved...higher velocities....More playable.


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## jaketanner (Jun 10, 2019)

jon wayne said:


> Sorta dumb question. I have Anthology and the Adagio updates. If I trash Anthology, what will I be missing?



I trashed mine. Kept the original libraries off on another drive, but just replaced Anthology, with a new folder called: Anthology II...with all the new "adagio" samples.


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## robgb (Jun 10, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> That adagio had issues and this is exactly what 8DIO did with Anthology resulting in it being too thin.


Yep. You have to find a balance that works for you. And the stereo spread problem isn't a problem exclusive to 8Dio. I suspect developers like that wide stereo spread because it sounds so gorgeous out of the box. But here's the thing. I recently downloaded the stems of a full orchestral recording. The stems were all mono. No stereo spread at all. And on their own they sounded thin. But within the full mix, with EQ and reverb, they sounded fantastic.


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## ScarletJerry (Jun 14, 2019)

Since the sale is ending soon, I need to make a decision. I have the new Adagio Violas. I only want to buy one more instrument. Would you recommend the new Adagio Violins or Cellos? I should mention that I have the Adagio Agitado Violins (just the full section, not the divis). I also own CS2, a Soaring Strings, and Adagio Sordinos. My initial thought is to get the cellos, because I have the Agitado violins and that would give me a full section of Hollywood style strings.

Scarlet Jerry


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## chocobitz825 (Jun 14, 2019)

ScarletJerry said:


> Since the sale is ending soon, I need to make a decision. I have the new Adagio Violas. I only want to buy one more instrument. Would you recommend the new Adagio Violins or Cellos? I should mention that I have the Adagio Agitado Violins (just the full section, not the divis). I also own CS2, a Soaring Strings, and Adagio Sordinos. My initial thought is to get the cellos, because I have the Agitado violins and that would give me a full section of Hollywood style strings.
> 
> Scarlet Jerry




Probably the cellos. The violins were never the best part of the original set anyway.


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## Manuel Stumpf (Jun 14, 2019)

ScarletJerry said:


> Since the sale is ending soon, I need to make a decision. I have the new Adagio Violas. I only want to buy one more instrument. Would you recommend the new Adagio Violins or Cellos? I should mention that I have the Adagio Agitado Violins (just the full section, not the divis). I also own CS2, a Soaring Strings, and Adagio Sordinos. My initial thought is to get the cellos, because I have the Agitado violins and that would give me a full section of Hollywood style strings.
> 
> Scarlet Jerry


In that case I would get the Celli. You have the legato for the violins in your Agitato Violins already.


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## ism (Jun 14, 2019)

ScarletJerry said:


> Since the sale is ending soon, I need to make a decision. I have the new Adagio Violas. I only want to buy one more instrument. Would you recommend the new Adagio Violins or Cellos? I should mention that I have the Adagio Agitado Violins (just the full section, not the divis). I also own CS2, a Soaring Strings, and Adagio Sordinos. My initial thought is to get the cellos, because I have the Agitado violins and that would give me a full section of Hollywood style strings.
> 
> Scarlet Jerry




Note that
- virtually all of the Adagio legatos are expunged from the new anthology anyway

- Agitato cellos are still available for $44 (and it’s entirely possible that they’ll be on sale at some point, given that this is 8dio).

- all the Agitato sordios are still available for $88 - and I would’t exactly be shocked to see them on a good sale soon either.

I’d argue that unless your after the longs/ shorts then these Agitato libraries (on a suitable sale) are better value than the ‘new Adagio’.

Also:

- a 40% off sale of the ‘new adagio’ is highly likely again, probably by the end of the summer.


So its worth keeping in mind that 8dio is likely to continue aggressively marketing the Agitato libraries, and so the urgency of this sale should be considered in the context of the (also manufactured) urgency of likely future sales.


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## Reid Rosefelt (Jun 14, 2019)

ScarletJerry said:


> Since the sale is ending soon, I need to make a decision. I have the new Adagio Violas. I only want to buy one more instrument. Would you recommend the new Adagio Violins or Cellos? I should mention that I have the Adagio Agitado Violins (just the full section, not the divis). I also own CS2, a Soaring Strings, and Adagio Sordinos. My initial thought is to get the cellos, because I have the Agitado violins and that would give me a full section of Hollywood style strings.
> 
> Scarlet Jerry


Scarlet Jerry, I'm the same as you. I bought the Violas on sale and was waiting for the Adagio Cellos to go on sale. I am a loyal @Cory Pelizzari fan.

I like Adagio Violas a lot and I like many of my 8Dio libraries. I respect the company and look forward to getting more great libraries from them. But the way they have rolled out these Adagio/Agitato/Anthology/Adagio II libraries is beyond unacceptable. You shouldn't need to study for hours to figure out what these new Adagios are (ie not Adagios). They should have included a legacy folder. Getting all those arcs and stuff was one of the reasons I like the Violas and wanted to buy the old Adagio Cellos.

And... will there be another permutation of these libraries in the future? Agita Strings? Tell me that isn't possible. Tell me that isn't likely. Or all of the new Adagios will come out for $88 plus a free choir? 

So I'm doing the only thing that makes any sense to me, which is to not buy any of these new Adagios. If I ever feel the need to add to my strings collection, I can get Spitfire Studio Strings for very little in the next Wish List. Fluffy Audio may have a sale on Venice Modern Strings someday. Even if I don't need Venice Strings I feel really good every time I buy anything from the beautiful Fluffy people.


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## ScarletJerry (Jun 15, 2019)

I always get great advice from this Board. It sounds like the consensus is to buy the nothing or purchase the Adagio Agitado Cellos, and not the new Adagio. That will complete my set, and it has more kinds of legato than the update - and it’s four dollars cheaper. Thanks for the advice everyone!

Scarlet Jerry


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## ptram (Apr 26, 2021)

So, in the end, is Anthology (now at version 1.3) the same as Adagio 2.0? I compared the number of samples and the articulations, and it seems to be exactly the same.

Paolo


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## evilantal (Apr 26, 2021)

ptram said:


> So, in the end, is Anthology (now at version 1.3) the same as Adagio 2.0? I compared the number of samples and the articulations, and it seems to be exactly the same.
> 
> Paolo


It is. Anthology 1.3 could be considered the bundled up Adagio 2.0


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## T-LeffoH (Apr 26, 2021)

ptram said:


> So, in the end, is Anthology (now at version 1.3) the same as Adagio 2.0? I compared the number of samples and the articulations, and it seems to be exactly the same.
> 
> Paolo


Mostly similar, as somebody pointed out to me a while back, 8dio changed the value range of the velocity which triggers portamento on the legato patches when porting over from Adagio/Agitato to Anthology.

I think it went from anything below 40 to anything below 20.


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## jaketanner (Apr 26, 2021)

ptram said:


> So, in the end, is Anthology (now at version 1.3) the same as Adagio 2.0? I compared the number of samples and the articulations, and it seems to be exactly the same.
> 
> Paolo


Anthology takes the best from Adagio/Adagietto and bundled into the Anthology...more streamlined, but at an expense of sound quality. Adagio sounds better...Anthology plays better. Give and take.


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## ism (Apr 26, 2021)

jaketanner said:


> Anthology takes the best from Adagio/Adagietto and bundled into the Anthology...more streamlined, but at an expense of sound quality. Adagio sounds better...Anthology plays better. Give and take.


(Legacy) Adagio also has vastly more expressiveness that has been ruthlessly slashed and burned in crushing it into Anthology.


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## jaketanner (Apr 26, 2021)

ism said:


> (Legacy) Adagio also has vastly more expressiveness that has been ruthlessly slashed and burned in crushing it into Anthology.


exactly.


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## muziksculp (Apr 26, 2021)

ism said:


> (Legacy) Adagio also has vastly more expressiveness that has been ruthlessly slashed and burned in crushing it into Anthology.


How was Legacy Adagio degraded into Anthology ? They reduced the number of dynamic layers, or .... ?

If they picked the best from Adagio, would that be the same as the legacy Adagio, but maybe less of the patches were ported to Anthology ?


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## Casiquire (Apr 26, 2021)

ism said:


> (Legacy) Adagio also has vastly more expressiveness that has been ruthlessly slashed and burned in crushing it into Anthology.


That's true but i find the Legacy near unusable. For a library with so many legatos, the legato management is really not where it needs to be. So it winds up just being for those arcs, which are of very limited practicality.


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## Casiquire (Apr 26, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> How was Legacy Adagio degraded into Anthology ? They reduced the number of dynamic layers, or .... ?
> 
> If they picked the best from Adagio, would that be the same as the legacy Adagio, but maybe less of the patches were ported to Anthology ?


To my ears, samples and transitions were cleaned up a little and the stereo image was narrowed significantly, and then it was panned to standard orchestral seating (version Adagio which was recorded centered). Maybe they did even more than that. That's just all that I can easily tell just from using the instruments


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## ism (Apr 26, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> How was Legacy Adagio degraded into Anthology ? They reduced the number of dynamic layers, or .... ?
> 
> If they picked the best from Adagio, would that be the same as the legacy Adagio, but maybe less of the patches were ported to Anthology ?



They removed the arc expression from the legato entirely, which was supposedly the big selling point. And jettisoned more than half of the legatos. No question that Anthology is a lot easier to play, a lot more CSS-like in terms of consistency, plonkabilty etc,, and that the original Adagio was messy and awkward. 

But this came at the cost of jettisoning the bulk of Adagio's unique expressiveness. As well as great cost to the sound, although anthology 2.0 undid some of the damage.


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## jaketanner (Apr 26, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> How was Legacy Adagio degraded into Anthology ? They reduced the number of dynamic layers, or .... ?
> 
> If they picked the best from Adagio, would that be the same as the legacy Adagio, but maybe less of the patches were ported to Anthology ?


The picked the best legatos, best shorts, reduced redundant patches...basically streamlined them...but as all others have mentioned, at a cost. Not the Adagio was fantastic to begin with, but the sound was really nice...if 8DIO were able to implement their latest techniques into those original samples...maybe if would be great. But I think they possibly redid Adagio into Anthology to make extra cash without re-recording anything. it's basically a reworked library.

Also, the Adagio library and GUI didn't work with the latest OS/computer systems...so they really didn't have much of a choice but to refresh it.


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## muziksculp (Apr 26, 2021)

A bit puzzled here, I wonder why they messed up with the sound of the samples of Adagio, if they sounded great ? to make them sound worse ?


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## Casiquire (Apr 26, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> A bit puzzled here, I wonder why they messed up with the sound of the samples of Adagio, if they sounded great ? to make them sound worse ?


To make them usable. I can barely use the legacy legatos


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## jaketanner (Apr 26, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> A bit puzzled here, I wonder why they messed up with the sound of the samples of Adagio, if they sounded great ? to make them sound worse ?


no choice it they were to be more playable I guess...not sure exactly. They also messed with the pan, which I think ruined them further...rather than leave them center position.


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## muziksculp (Apr 26, 2021)

OK. Thanks for the feedback. 

Anyways, I think Anthology still sounds wonderful.


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## muziksculp (Apr 26, 2021)

OH, do you think Century Strings 2.0 sounds much better than Anthology ?

To my ears, Anthology has a much warmer sound than Century Strings 2, which I find sounds a bit harsh for my taste.


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## ism (Apr 26, 2021)

Remember, when we're talking about Anthology and Adagio, we're largely talking about Legato II.

Legato I, and the sordinos are from Agitato. 

I don't think when people talk about how great Anthology is they're talking primarily about legato II.


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## ism (Apr 26, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> OH, do you think Century Strings 2.0 sounds much better than Anthology ?


It's a much more mature library - even by the time they get to the violas Adagio is improving a lot. And it's a very different sound - room, sections, expression. 

So it's not about bashing Century or Anthology ... just that there exists in Adagio the kernel of something very special that was never give time to mature before the vision was abandoned, and the expressiveness crushed into Anthology.


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## robgb (Apr 26, 2021)

ism said:


> (Legacy) Adagio also has vastly more expressiveness that has been ruthlessly slashed and burned in crushing it into Anthology.


Absolutely not true. I have both and Anthology is superior in terms of sound and playability. What Adagio has, however, are more articulations like loure, detache, and many different legatos. Some sound great, others not so much. Regardless, if you buy Anthology, you'll get Adagio Legacy for $8, so it's a win-win.


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## ScarletJerry (Apr 26, 2021)

I would like to hear a comparison with both libraries playing the same exact lines. I have both and I may do that, only because this topic has been discussed ad nauseam . I always thought that the original Adagio was special because it offered much more content, legato choices, etc. but the sound in the latest Anthology was actually cleaner and better balanced, making it the better choice for general composing and arranging. I could be wrong.

Scarlet Jerry


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## ism (Apr 26, 2021)

robgb said:


> Absolutely not true.



Absolutely true. But of course, ymmv.


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## robgb (Apr 26, 2021)

ism said:


> Absolutely true. But of course, ymmv.


Or you could just be wrong.


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## robgb (Apr 26, 2021)

ScarletJerry said:


> I would like to hear a comparison with both libraries playing the same exact lines. I have both and I may do that, only because this topic has been discussed ad nauseam . I always thought that the original Adagio was special because it offered much more content, legato choices, etc. but the sound in the latest Anthology was actually cleaner and better balanced, making it the better choice for general composing and arranging. I could be wrong.
> 
> Scarlet Jerry


Exactly.


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## EgM (Apr 26, 2021)

You’re both wrong! 😂. Agitato is better!


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## ism (Apr 26, 2021)

robgb said:


> Or you could just be wrong.


Always a possibility, of course. But you’re sure you’re comparing Adagio to Anthology legato II?


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## sostenuto (Apr 26, 2021)

Watching and learning guys. Cool to have this sorted ... no matter.


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## ism (Apr 26, 2021)

This post from a while ago makes a direct shares a direct Adagio vs Anthology (1.0) comparison. 





__





Anyone Else Think 8dio Adagio Violas Kick Ass?


Also that was way too complicated figuring out how to get the gif to embed.




vi-control.net






For all its flaws, I much prefer Adagio on a number of levels.


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## robgb (Apr 26, 2021)

ism said:


> This post from a while ago makes a direct shares a direct Adagio vs Anthology (1.0) comparison.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's Anthology 1.0. The latest version is what I'm referring to. It's excellent from top to bottom. Adagio has many flaws. But again, having both is a win.


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## ism (Apr 26, 2021)

robgb said:


> That's Anthology 1.0. The latest version is what I'm referring to. It's excellent from top to bottom. Adagio has many flaws. But again, having both is a win.


True, Anthology 2 improves the tone, somewhat, but not the expressiveness of, specifically, Legato II, which simply doesn’t have the arcs.


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## sostenuto (Apr 26, 2021)

ism said:


> True, Anthology 2 improves the tone, somewhat, but not the expressiveness of, specifically, Legato II, which simply doesn’t have the arcs.


My Acct shows Anthology Strings ... but small type in details show 1.3 and Downloads are available. Is this Anthology 2 /II ?


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## VSriHarsha (Apr 26, 2021)

Anthology 2 released?


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## VSriHarsha (Apr 26, 2021)

Well, if you own Anthology old version, is it possible to get the update for free?


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## VSriHarsha (Apr 26, 2021)

robgb said:


> Adagio has many flaws. But again, having both is a win.


The new Adagio or the legacy?


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## VSriHarsha (Apr 26, 2021)

ScarletJerry said:


> I would like to hear a comparison with both libraries playing the same exact lines. I have both and I may do that, only because this topic has been discussed ad nauseam . I always thought that the original Adagio was special because it offered much more content, legato choices, etc. but the sound in the latest Anthology was actually cleaner and better balanced, making it the better choice for general composing and arranging. I could be wrong.
> 
> Scarlet Jerry


I think the new Adagios offer the same set of legatos or not?


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## robgb (Apr 26, 2021)

VSriHarsha said:


> The new Adagio or the legacy?


Legacy. The new Adagio and Anthology are exactly the same thing, except Anthology has a full ensemble patch.


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## robgb (Apr 26, 2021)

VSriHarsha said:


> Well, if you own Anthology old version, is it possible to get the update for free?


I don't know if they've officially called it an update. But the individual Adagio sections have been updated, and you can have them added to your account for an $8 downloading fee.


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## muziksculp (Apr 27, 2021)

In terms of Timbre, Legato, playability, Dynamics, expressiveness, ...etc. Which one do you prefer :

Anthology Strings or Century Strings 2 ?


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## ism (Apr 27, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> My Acct shows Anthology Strings ... but small type in details show 1.3 and Downloads are available. Is this Anthology II ?


Good question - probably, but safest to ask support in the chat.


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## sostenuto (Apr 27, 2021)

ism said:


> Good question - probably, but safest to ask support in the chat.


Did so and Anthology 1.3 is latest .... downloading now from Acct.


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## pipedr (Apr 27, 2021)

I started with VSL Orchestral Strings and Chamber Strings, but retired those when I got the original Adagio I several years ago. The music I have been working on calls for romantic string lines playing melodies, and I found Adagio I well suited for this. However, it takes quite a bit of programming effort to switch between all the articulations and legato style and arcs to build a line. If you just let it play with one articulation, you will not be satisfied, especially compared to other modern string libraries.

I upgraded to Anthology and found it overall to be more reliable in terms of Legato I or Legato II being able to handle a variety of string lines. I like to use Anthology for supporting string lines, but if I have a melody line or something I really want to be expressive, I will still go back to Adagio I. I feel that the wealth of articulation choices, and the samples themselves are more expressive (I suspect that they had to compress the samples to get the note to note transitions smoother, but I could be wrong).

When Adagio II was available, I paid the $8 or whatever to upgrade. Through chat, I surmise that Adagio II and Anthology are identical, except that Adagio II is broken into individual sections, so you don't have to load up all sections in each instance. That works better for my workflow, so I never use Anthology anymore, but others may not find that to be a benefit. As far as I can tell, the original Adagio I is no longer available (so although getting Anthology now for $88 seems like an awesome deal and much cheaper than what I paid for the original sample sets, I'm glad that I have the original Adagio I).

When Century Strings went on sale, I bought the main string library (still don't have the sordino set). I wish that they had fleshed out the original concept of Adagio I with multiple legato styles, but I like Century quite a lot. It has a more reliable legato than either Anthology/Adagio II or Adagio I. And although it does not have multiple legatos to choose from, I find that the arcs and sustain articulations together with the main legato give me enough choices of notes to get some nice expressive lines. The softer velocity levels are also quite lovely, especially in the violas (which I think 8dio has always done very well). The small section sizes also allow the expressiveness of the performances to come through (this may also be why some seem to prefer Violins 2 to Violins 1, and I tend to use Violins 2 more often even for lead lines).

One thing I don't like about Century is the room. IMHO, there is an unpleasant hollow/metallic sound to the room, and you can't get away from it even with the close mics. this might be one reason why I like to layer Century with Adagio (and also you get a smaller with a larger section).

I hope the 8dio folks revisit the Adagio I concept. I think they would be great at creating a new library with multiple legato styles. I don't mean just slurred or portamento. I mean different playing styles for different lines, like an Emotional Violin, but in a string section. Or, if they could just expand Century this way (Century Strings+, Special Legatos?).


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## ptram (Apr 27, 2021)

robgb said:


> if you buy Anthology, you'll get Adagio Legacy for $8


From the offer letter, I would believe one gets the current, "freshly updated" Adagio, and not the Legacy.



https://8dio.com/2019/05/20/adagio-anthology-owners/



Paolo


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## muziksculp (Apr 27, 2021)

pipedr said:


> One thing I don't like about Century is the room. IMHO, there is an unpleasant hollow/metallic sound to the room, and you can't get away from it even with the close mics.


Yup. This is one things I dislike about Century Strings.


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## Sarah Mancuso (Apr 27, 2021)

ptram said:


> From the offer letter, I would believe one gets the current, "freshly updated" Adagio, and not the Legacy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It's not advertised, but you _can_ get the legacy Adagio when crossgrading if you specifically ask their support chat for it.


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## muziksculp (Apr 27, 2021)

pipedr said:


> I hope the 8dio folks revisit the Adagio I concept. I think they would be great at creating a new library with multiple legato styles. I don't mean just slurred or portamento. I mean different playing styles for different lines, like an Emotional Violin, but in a string section. Or, if they could just expand Century this way (Century Strings+, Special Legatos?).


That would be fantastic. I hope they do it, but in a warmer, lush sounding hall, not the one they used for Century Strings.


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## ptram (Apr 27, 2021)

pipedr said:


> Through chat, I surmise that Adagio II and Anthology are identical, except that Adagio II is broken into individual sections, so you don't have to load up all sections in each instance.


In the current version (1.3), Anthology also has separate sections. Or, if you like, even separate articulations.

Paolo


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## doctoremmet (Apr 27, 2021)

If you want the older Adagio for $8, specifically ask support for v1.6. They will then issue a voucher with which you have to buy the current Adagio Violins. This will add all current individual Adagios and all v1.6 versions to your account.


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## Sarah Mancuso (Apr 27, 2021)

A revisit of the Adagio concept would be great. 8Dio was onto something really magical with it.

I've been working on my own project, "Adachi", to rebuild Adagio and Agitato into a single library that includes all of that juicy legato content. It makes all the different legato types accessible, and incorporates the "true legato with arcs" concept that was left out of Anthology. The ensemble violins have a total of 13(!) different legato types, all of which can be used together and switched on a per-note basis. It's still very much a work in progress, but here are two test pieces I did using it a while back: 
View attachment adachi_7f.mp3

View attachment adachi-5d.mp3


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## robgb (Apr 27, 2021)

ptram said:


> From the offer letter, I would believe one gets the current, "freshly updated" Adagio, and not the Legacy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You get legacy. You just have to ask for it. I bought this library a few weeks ago, went to the 8dio chat and asked for legacy to be added to my account.


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## Casiquire (Apr 27, 2021)

Sarah Mancuso said:


> It's not advertised, but you _can_ get the legacy Adagio when crossgrading if you specifically ask their support chat for it.


Correct you can indeed get both!


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## muziksculp (Apr 27, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> If you want the older Adagio for $8, specifically ask support for v1.6. They will then issue a voucher with which you have to buy the current Adagio Violins. This will add all current individual Adagios and all v1.6 versions to your account.


I have ver 1.5 of their Adagio Legacy Library, they sound very good.


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## lettucehat (Apr 27, 2021)

Sarah Mancuso said:


> A revisit of the Adagio concept would be great. 8Dio was onto something really magical with it.
> 
> I've been working on my own project, "Adachi", to rebuild Adagio and Agitato into a single library that includes all of that juicy legato content. It makes all the different legato types accessible, and incorporates the "true legato with arcs" concept that was left out of Anthology. The ensemble violins have a total of 13(!) different legato types, all of which can be used together and switched on a per-note basis. It's still very much a work in progress, but here are two test pieces I did using it a while back:
> View attachment adachi_7f.mp3
> ...


Wow, this is great. So are you building kontakt multis or is it something more complicated that I can't think of at the moment?


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## robgb (Apr 27, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> Did so and Anthology 1.3 is latest .... downloading now from Acct.


But aren't they calling the individual sections Adagio Version 2.0? Color me confused.


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## robgb (Apr 27, 2021)

By the way, I also changed the Adagio Legacy GUI. Can't stand the outdated look. Fortunately all the resource files are unencrypted, so it was possible to desaturate all the gold to silver and change the background completely. Shouldn't matter, I know, but I have a design background and it kills me to look at those old Adagio designs.


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## Sarah Mancuso (Apr 27, 2021)

lettucehat said:


> Wow, this is great. So are you building kontakt multis or is it something more complicated that I can't think of at the moment?


Thanks! I'm using the Adagio and Agitato samples, but scripting an entirely new engine to power them. It's been a massive undertaking. In addition to the coding, I've been setting up custom crossfade parameters for every possible combination of legato type and arc type, trying to get them as smooth as possible, etc.

When I bought Adagio last summer, I thought "this is fantastic but I wish it was more flexible," and a few months later I could no longer resist the temptation and started learning Kontakt scripting...


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## lettucehat (Apr 27, 2021)

Sarah Mancuso said:


> Thanks! I'm using the Adagio and Agitato samples, but scripting an entirely new engine to power them. It's been a massive undertaking. In addition to the coding, I've been setting up custom crossfade parameters for every possible combination of legato type and arc type, trying to get them as smooth as possible, etc.
> 
> When I bought Adagio last summer, I thought "this is fantastic but I wish it was more flexible," and a few months later I could no longer resist the temptation and started learning Kontakt scripting...


Incredible. When it's all said and done 8dio should get you a gift (or hire you)!


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## muziksculp (Apr 27, 2021)

I thought posting this older video here might be helpful to get Cory's perspective on these libraries.


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## VSriHarsha (Apr 27, 2021)

Sarah Mancuso said:


> A revisit of the Adagio concept would be great. 8Dio was onto something really magical with it.
> 
> I've been working on my own project, "Adachi", to rebuild Adagio and Agitato into a single library that includes all of that juicy legato content. It makes all the different legato types accessible, and incorporates the "true legato with arcs" concept that was left out of Anthology. The ensemble violins have a total of 13(!) different legato types, all of which can be used together and switched on a per-note basis. It's still very much a work in progress, but here are two test pieces I did using it a while back:
> View attachment adachi_7f.mp3
> ...


You mean you’re actually making new patches outta these libraries right? That’s nice. I heard the files attached & they sound beautiful. Now, when you create these patches, do you save in a separate folder & name whatever you want or save in the same original 8dio download folder?


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## VSriHarsha (Apr 27, 2021)

The Legacy libraries come with the Mancini settings or something right? I mean it’s a little confusing these or the Agitato Grandiose libraries.
But the legacy libraries have like various kinds of legatos. The new libraries have the same kinda legatos as the legacy libraries?


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## lettucehat (Apr 27, 2021)

VSriHarsha said:


> The Legacy libraries come with the Mancini settings or something right? I mean it’s a little confusing these or the Agitato Grandiose libraries.
> But the legacy libraries have like various kinds of legatos. The new libraries have the same kinda legatos as the legacy libraries?


The Mancini stuff is actually what Agitato contributed. Adagio had all kinds of legatos named after movies mostly, but the Agitato legatos are all more molto vibrato, highly emotional, etc. The violins have literal "Mancini" 1 and 2 settings but the rest of it is still in that ballpark.


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## Sarah Mancuso (Apr 28, 2021)

VSriHarsha said:


> You mean you’re actually making new patches outta these libraries right? That’s nice. I heard the files attached & they sound beautiful. Now, when you create these patches, do you save in a separate folder & name whatever you want or save in the same original 8dio download folder?


Thanks for the kind words. Yes, what I'm building is completely new patches using the _Adagitatothology_ samples.

The save location doesn't make much of a difference, as Kontakt can be pointed to where the samples are.


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## Ian Dorsch (Apr 28, 2021)

Sarah Mancuso said:


> Thanks! I'm using the Adagio and Agitato samples, but scripting an entirely new engine to power them. It's been a massive undertaking. In addition to the coding, I've been setting up custom crossfade parameters for every possible combination of legato type and arc type, trying to get them as smooth as possible, etc.
> 
> When I bought Adagio last summer, I thought "this is fantastic but I wish it was more flexible," and a few months later I could no longer resist the temptation and started learning Kontakt scripting...


That's truly impressive.


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## Obi-Wan Spaghetti (Apr 28, 2021)

So the Legacy libraries is v. 1.1? 1.5? Which is it?


Sarah Mancuso said:


> Thanks for the kind words. Yes, what I'm building is completely new patches using the _Adagitatothology_ samples.
> 
> The save location doesn't make much of a difference, as Kontakt can be pointed to where the samples are.


I'd be amazing if you could share this with us once you're done. Always hated the GUI and kind of gave up on them because of that.


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## ScarletJerry (Apr 28, 2021)

The legacy Adagio libraries are version 1.6. There is also the Agitato series, and the latest Anthology is 1.3, which contains updated versions of these libraries. Others can correct me if I'm wrong. @Sarah Mancuso is clearly the expert on this topic.

Scarlet Jerry


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## VSriHarsha (Apr 28, 2021)

lettucehat said:


> The Mancini stuff is actually what Agitato contributed. Adagio had all kinds of legatos named after movies mostly, but the Agitato legatos are all more molto vibrato, highly emotional, etc. The violins have literal "Mancini" 1 and 2 settings but the rest of it is still in that ballpark.


Ok ! I didn’t know that. Wow! Settings named after movies I think I gotta check.


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## VSriHarsha (Apr 28, 2021)

Sarah Mancuso said:


> Thanks for the kind words. Yes, what I'm building is completely new patches using the _Adagitatothology_ samples.
> 
> The save location doesn't make much of a difference, as Kontakt can be pointed to where the samples are.


You’re welcome @Sarah Mancuso !
Wow! Agitatothology! Will you let 8Dio know about this?
I mean will you send them your work?


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## Drjay (May 29, 2021)

Even after reading the whole thread, I am still confused with regards to the content of all these libraries. I have got Anthology and all Adagio 1.6. Is there additional content in Agitato Violins/Cello/Viola worth buying (esp. given the current 50% discount)?


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## doctoremmet (May 29, 2021)

Drjay said:


> Is there additional content in Agitato Violins/Cello/Viola worth buying (esp. given the current 50% discount)?


Hardly. You’re good. Give the old FOMO a rest. Only thing maybe worth getting are these:


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## lettucehat (May 29, 2021)

Not to reintroduce FOMO, but there is a variety of dynamics and attacks in the Agitatos, that give you much more expressive control. And at least get the Violins for that and the full Mancini legatos!


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## Drjay (May 29, 2021)

lettucehat said:


> Not to reintroduce FOMO, but there is a variety of dynamics and attacks in the Agitatos, that give you much more expressive control. And at least get the Violins for that and the full Mancini legatos!


Thanks. Lucky me, after watching the demo video I am not that convinced


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