# Brahms Lied orchestration



## muk (Jun 14, 2016)

Hello everybody

Recently I had the idea that 'Oh Tod' out of the 'Vier ernste Gesänge' op. 121 by Johannes Brahms could be a gorgeous piece for orchestra as well. So I orchestrated this Lied, and I am thinking of adding one or two more Lieder by Brahms that deal with the topic of death.
I didn't orchestrate it on commission, or with the outlook of an immediate performance. So here is a mockup instead:

https://app.box.com/s/ntch2kacdx9sqtcl0em0e2twmvp2uegd

Your thoughts and comments would be welcome.


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## muk (Jun 15, 2016)

It's a bit different from what you usually hear here on VIC I guess. Still, I'd appreciate any thoughts and comments.


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## Silence-is-Golden (Jun 15, 2016)

Hello Muk,

I think it sounds fantastic!
I have listened to it in my car and will listen again later on the monitors at home, but it sounds very pleasent to my ears.

Allthough not many pieces from Brahms speak to me, this one does. and I think that your orchestration has made this an very appealing piece of music.
It comes across as a very classic approach but the whole piece sounds good together so real nicely done.

Strings especially sound beautiful in tone and dynamics, Dimension Strings?.

It may also depend on what your preferences are, but if you would use more woodwind - strings alterations, or a Ravell-ian or Debussy-ian like orchestration, who knows what you might find in terms of flavours.

All in all, I aplaude your effort and if you orchestrate more pieces I would gladly listen again, or purchase them if you would sell it through bandcamp or so.
If after some time you have a collection of these pieces you can still decide to see if an orchestra or concert hall manager is interested to include this in a production.
Brahms is an attraction for many people.

Btw: did you do it by notation or playing?


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## airflamesred (Jun 15, 2016)

muk said:


> It's a bit different from what you usually hear here on VIC I guess. Still, I'd appreciate any thoughts and comments.


No news is good news, as they say!, very enjoyable.


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## lucky909091 (Jun 15, 2016)

muk, this orchestration is really a big thing. 
You developed the initial notes of Brahms to an orchestral piece and this is not easy.
In my opinion a well-done work as an orchestrator.
Bravo.


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## muk (Jun 15, 2016)

Hello Silence-is-Golden. Thank you very much for your elaborate feedback. I agree that my orchestration is on the classical track. While I made sure that each instrument has something meaningful to play, it's indeed a nice suggestion that a Ravellian or Debussian approach can be very colorful if done well. Your suggestion of selling such tracks through bandcamp is interesting as well. I haven't thought about that, but will now.
The strings are Dimension Strings indeed (well spotted!), with just a tad of Berlin Strings First Chairs on top of it. I orchestrated by notation.

Thank you airflamesred, I'm glad you like it.

Thank you very much lucky909091. These are very nice compliments, so thanks a lot.


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## OleJoergensen (Jun 15, 2016)

Imenjoyed it, its lovely! Thank you for sharing.


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## muk (Jun 16, 2016)

Thank you Ole.


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## Takabuntu (Jun 16, 2016)

Hello Muk,

Wow, what a fantastic mockup. I'm listening to it on repeat. You're very talented and skilled!!! There's so much classical music to be enjoyed. I also certainly hope you keep making more of these mockups.

All the best,

Erik


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## synergy543 (Jun 16, 2016)

You did a really excellent job of orchestrating this. Not and easy one, and nicely executed. Great performance as well.


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## muk (Jun 17, 2016)

Thank you so much Erik and synergy! This really gives me energy to tackle one or two more Lieder by Brahms.


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## muk (Jun 20, 2016)

Ok, so I found two more Brahms songs that I think could work in orchestrated form. I'll keep you posted.


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## Silence-is-Golden (Jun 20, 2016)

muk said:


> Ok, so I found two more Brahms songs that I think could work in orchestrated form. I'll keep you posted.


Well, you have a "fan" here waiting for your new work!

Seriously, I am looking forward to it, and as stated before I will purchase for sure (normal price ok?) if you offer it as a complete mini CD or so. Really nice orchestration and good flavours in the first piece.


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## jonnybutter (Jun 20, 2016)

Very nice work!


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## muk (Jun 21, 2016)

Thanks a lot Silence, that is very kind of you. I'll do some research about bandcamp and think about whether it's worth it to put it on there. 

Thank you Jonny.


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## muk (Jun 22, 2016)

Thanks all who listened and gave feedback. Just as a short update: here is a new short piece by Brahms that I orchestrated. It probably won't make it into the final collection for several reasons (the original setting is for womens choir, so it's not actually a song; and it doesn't fit the collection I have in mind that well musically). But I'd still love some feedback on anything that comes to mind. Orchestration obviously, but also the mockup and mix.

Brahms, 'Und wenn du über den Kirchhof gehst' op. 44 Nr. 10:

https://app.box.com/s/y66d6h3n24fc7l5pjmhr20csyiqfue97


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## Silence-is-Golden (Jun 23, 2016)

Hi Muk,

Very nice. I realy begin to like your orchestration work very much.

So far I also did not listen to the original compositions to let it be what it is, otherwise its easy to compare and it may take the life out of listening afresh.

Mock up: I listened to it yesterday late and now again. I realy enjoy the overal sound, especially the woodwinds, only this time I miss something in the strings and I can't put my finger on it.
Like its a bit too 'perfect' or so.
Did you also use the FC again?

Nevertheless, I don't know what other pieces you have in your pocket but who knows it still fits?


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## muk (Jun 23, 2016)

A keen ear you have, Silence. This times it is indeed Dimension Strings only, without FC. I'll do a version with FC layered tonight. And maybe I can increase the humanizing settings in my DS template a bit more. Thank you for the hint.


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## muk (Jun 23, 2016)

Here's the version with Berlin Strings First Chairs layered. It definitely adds something to the sound of the strings:

https://app.box.com/s/j1doevbrpk38ema48hfvrvj8qeqt60wr


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## Silence-is-Golden (Jun 24, 2016)

Hi Muk,

Improved indeed (not that I am the official approval or so, but for my taste)

I am just listening again to your first Brahms song. And experiencing again that it is really very nicely done. 

Since I am not working with notation software/approach I do not know how much work it is to work it out like this, but is is excellent work from my ears.
I think also because the usage of the various instruments of the orchestra seems to blend so well in your effort that it is a beautiful piece as is.

I currently listen to a few specific less known Max Bruch pieces that seem to have a similar signature like this one you orchestrated. Enjoyable stuff.


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## muk (Jun 25, 2016)

Thank you Silence, very kind of you. I feel more at home with the notation approach, especially when working with a traditional orchestral setup or when the music is complicated. I probably couldn't write a fugue or even a canon in a DAW, but on paper it's much easier for me. And for traditional orchestration I like to see all instruments on a page to have an overview what each instrument is doing. Working directly in a DAW is the more improvisational approach. That works well on modern genres for me, and can help getting out of the comfort zone.
Any particular tips for Max Bruch? I know his well-known pieces (violin concertos, viola romance) but not much else.


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## BigImpactSound (Jun 26, 2016)

Really great mockup, great sound and excellent orchestration decisions.


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## Silence-is-Golden (Jun 27, 2016)

muk said:


> Any particular tips for Max Bruch? I know his well-known pieces (violin conc


Hi Muk,
I discovered some of his less known works a few months ago:
- Swedish Dances opus 63
Mainly no II, VI, VII, and XIV
I found similar flavours in your Brahms orchestrations.

Also his Serenade for Strings (opus posthumus) are interesting.
No II , and III .

Enjoy the music!


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## Vik (Jul 29, 2016)

muk said:


> Hello everybody
> 
> Recently I had the idea that 'Oh Tod' out of the 'Vier ernste Gesänge' op. 121 by Johannes Brahms could be a gorgeous piece for orchestra as well. So I orchestrated this Lied, and I am thinking of adding one or two more Lieder by Brahms that deal with the topic of death.
> I didn't orchestrate it on commission, or with the outlook of an immediate performance. So here is a mockup instead:
> ...


I enjoyed your version more than the original. Brahms, watch out.


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## muk (Jul 29, 2016)

Wow, thank you very much Vik!


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