# Why should I buy U-He Zebra 2?



## DANIELE

Sorry if this question has been already posted, I wasn't able to find an answer. I'm thinking about buying zebra for a long time now and I found *this* thread that somewhat convinced me to think deeply about buying it. I'm interested in orchestral and OST composing in general and Zebra seems like a very used synthesizer in this area.

So in the end, why should I prefer Zebra over other synths in the market? I'm interested in organic pads, hits, fx, pluck, leads and so on, something that gives the impression of a living sound and not a well shaped sine wave (if you understand what I mean).
I like the Hans Zimmer style but I also like to try something else.

I already tried to look at some videos and tutorials but I still don't understand what should be the thing that let me pull the trigger of the buy button.

Thank you for your help.


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## veranad

Well, you can download the demo version and see if you like it.


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## greggybud

DANIELE said:


> I already tried to look at some videos and tutorials but I still don't understand what should be the thing that let me pull the trigger of the buy button.


For myself 2 years ago it was the price. It was a deal through NI iirc. 

With that said, I'm not a composer. I write strictly pop with some occasional orchestra/strings. Last year I upgraded to Dark Zebra. 

What do you consider the "other synths in the market?" That will give more perspective on your question.


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## DANIELE

veranad said:


> Well, you can download the demo version and see if you like it.


Correct answer, but...

The thing is I need time to learn a tool and understand if I really like it and I work all day full time, I don't know if I'm able to understand it before the actual discount ends.



greggybud said:


> For myself 2 years ago it was the price. It was a deal through NI iirc.
> 
> With that said, I'm not a composer. I write strictly pop with some occasional orchestra/strings. Last year I upgraded to Dark Zebra.
> 
> What do you consider the "other synths in the market?" That will give more perspective on your question.



Yeah sorry, I mean some synths like: Dune 3, Omnisphere, Massive X, Absynth and so on, the most used ones.

Does Zebra let you import samples for example? Does it include a granular synthesis module?

I know that Hans Zimmer use it a lot and this is the way I would use it, plus other things.


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## Marcube

DANIELE said:


> before the actual discount ends


Is there a discount on Zebra? Where might a chap find such a discount? 🧐


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## Maarten

Survey Participation







survey.sogosurvey.com





You have to participate in a survey for a 25% discount on a u-he product.


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## Wes Antczak

Marcube said:


> Is there a discount on Zebra? Where might a chap find such a discount? 🧐


u-he is currently running a survey at the end of which you get a coupon for 25% off.

I read somewhere that if you have Zebra 2, the upgrade to 3 will be $30; however if you also already own Zebra HZ, the upgrade will be free.


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## Marcube

Maarten said:


> Survey Participation
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> survey.sogosurvey.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> You have to participate in a survey for a 25% discount on a u-he product.


Cheers!


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## Pier

Obviously to buy my Zebra libraries!

I'm kidding 

In all seriousness, Zebra will allow to get into some of the best cinematic synth libraries out there from The Unfinished, Sonic Underworld, Luftrum, etc.


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## DANIELE

Pier said:


> cinematic synth libraries


Define this.

In the first place I want to buy Dark Zebra for study purposes, just to understand how to get some sounds out of Zebra, I'd like to make my own sounds.

Do I need the libraries (which I could also buy in the future) to use it as I want to or Zebra 2 itself is enough (at least in the first place)?


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## Pier

DANIELE said:


> In the first place I want to buy Dark Zebra for study purposes, just to understand how to get some sounds out of Zebra, I'd like to make my own sounds.


Dark Zebra will give you access to the presets used by Hans Zimmer and programmed by Howard for the Batman movies. This is good material for studying if that's your main interest. It also includes a modified version of Zebra called ZebraHZ with the Diva filters and some other modification.

Just in case it's not clear, you need Zebra 2 in order to be able to to buy Dark Zebra.



DANIELE said:


> Do I need the libraries (which I could also buy in the future) to use it as I want to or Zebra 2 itself is enough (at least in the first place)?


Zebra's factory library (not including Dark Zebra) is very diverse and for all sorts of genres. It's definitely a good resource for learning synthesis with Zebra, but it's not very cinematic IMO.

Check out The Unfinished's store for probably the best cinematic libraries for Zebra:






The Unfinished | Store







www.theunfinished.co.uk


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## DANIELE

Pier said:


> Dark Zebra will give you access to the presets used by Hans Zimmer and programmed by Howard for the Batman movies. This is good material for studying if that's your main interest. It also includes a modified version of Zebra called ZebraHZ with the Diva filters and some other modification.
> 
> Just in case it's not clear, you need Zebra 2 in order to be able to to buy Dark Zebra.
> 
> 
> Zebra's factory library (not including Dark Zebra) is very diverse and for all sorts of genres. It's definitely a good resource for learning synthesis with Zebra, but it's not very cinematic IMO.
> 
> Check out The Unfinished's store for probably the best cinematic libraries for Zebra:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Unfinished | Store
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.theunfinished.co.uk


Ok thank you, yeah I know that DZ needs Zebra 2 in order to work.

What I'm trying to understand is: am I able to create the presets in those libraries with Zebra 2 or they are using other sources and so on, not available in Zebra 2?

I mean, am I buying a bunch of presets or something else?

Thank you again.


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## Pier

DANIELE said:


> What I'm trying to understand is: am I able to create the presets in those libraries with Zebra 2 or they are using other sources and so on, not available in Zebra 2?


Maybe some of these presets will include custom wavetables, but other than that you will be able to recreate these presets yourself. Zebra is a pure synth, no samples like in Omnisphere.


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## ed buller

I've owned shit loads of synths. ZebraHZ is unsurpassed in soft synth land . There is nothing as good.

best

ed


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## DANIELE

Pier said:


> Maybe some of these presets will include custom wavetables, but other than that you will be able to recreate these presets yourself. Zebra is a pure synth, no samples like in Omnisphere.


Ok, thank you Pier, now it is more clear. Will I be able to import my own wavetables or create new ones in Zebra 2?

Basically when I'm buying libraries I'm buying other people work in building new presets, am I right?


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## Pier

DANIELE said:


> Ok, thank you Pier, now it is more clear. Will I be able to import my own wavetables or create new ones in Zebra 2?


You can create wavetables right inside Zebra. There are actually a couple of editors depending on how you want to approach it. Maybe not the most modern editors compared to more synths like Dune, Vital, Serum, but they do the job.

You can import wavetables too BUT Zebra uses a custom format so it's not as straightforward as in other synths where you can just drop a .wav. Years ago there used to be a software called Wav2Zebra or something like that, but I'm not sure it's available anymore.



DANIELE said:


> Basically when I'm buying libraries I'm buying other people work in building new presets, am I right?


Yes, exactly.


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## DANIELE

Thank you again. So am I buying an old synth? I played a bit with Dune and I like it, I want more from a synth like Zebra.

From the tutorials I'm looking to I see that not all the parameters are modulable and there are separate knobs to set the amount of modulation for the parameter you want to modulate. I'd like more a Massive style looking UI where you can modulate everything and you see the amount directly on the knob you are modulating and maybe even an indicator of the running modulation.

Am I understanding wrong what I see? Maybe you can do more with the matrix, what happens if I want to modulate a modulation for example?

Sorry if I keep asking but you look very skilled (and kind) and I'd like to understand certain things before buying.


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## Rctec

I have no financial interest in any of Urs’ stuff. I gave him the presets for DarkZebraHZ as a gift… so, what I say is my honest opinion:
it’s not a sampler…
but it is the best sounding synth engine. By that I mean that the sound is solid like a mini-Moog, present and committed. Great Code. We at RCP use it every day. Not bored yet and constantly finding new, creative ways to surprise (check out Howie’s “Blech” oscillator waveform…)
i love making my own sounds. “Dune” is an example of Zebra Love.
its not hard to learn. In fact, it’s stupidly simple and logical. And with U-He you’re dealing with one of the most ethical companies around!
hz


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## DANIELE

Rctec said:


> I have no financial interest in any of Urs’ stuff. I gave him the presets for DarkZebraHZ as a gift… so, what I say is my honest opinion:
> it’s not a sampler…
> but it is the best sounding synth engine. By that I mean that the sound is solid like a mini-Moog, present and committed. Great Code. We at RCP use it every day. Not bored yet and constantly finding new, creative ways to surprise (check out Howie’s “Blech” oscillator waveform…)
> i love making my own sounds. “Dune” is an example of Zebra Love.
> pits not hard to learn. In fact, it’s stupidly simple and logical. And with U-He you’re dealing with one of the most ethical companies around!
> hz


Thank you Hans for the insight and the advices.

The thing I might actually be interested in might be the "your own sound creation". This is what I'm really looking for lately and everytime I open a synth I load a sawtooth waveform, apply a cutoff on it, maybe some distortion, some glide and that's it. I feel stuck in this process and I'm really looking for a way to learn how to get more from a synth.

That said I want to start this new adventure with the right synth, a synth shaped on my composing needs.


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## Pier

DANIELE said:


> So am I buying an old synth?


Some parts are starting to show its age IMO, like the effects. This might not matter to you if you're going to add say an external reverb.

The UI is showing its age too in some ways. For example, there are almost no animations. OTOH the workflow itself is fantastic. You can quickly create and understand very complex patches.

The sound itself is still fantastic and has an organic and timeless classic quality to it. Oscillators and the filters are still top notch. Also AFAIK there's nothing in the market like its comb filter.



DANIELE said:


> I played a bit with Dune and I like it


Dune is a very different synth which I also love.

Honestly, just demo Zebra and try it out for a bit. Give it time to grow on you, don't be fooled by superficial impressions!



DANIELE said:


> I see that not all the parameters are modulable and there are separate knobs to set the amount of modulation for the parameter you want to modulate. I'd like more a Massive style looking UI where you can modulate everything and you see the amount directly on the knob you are modulating and maybe even an indicator of the running modulation.


Most parameters in Zebra can be modulated but you get almost zero visual feedback. You have to use your ears 



DANIELE said:


> what happens if I want to modulate a modulation for example?


There are a couple of ways of approaching this.

1) Some modules have modulation knobs, and you can modulate those knobs.

2) In the mod matrix, each modulator has a sidechain, so to speak. This means you can control the how much modulation with a second modulation.



DANIELE said:


> Sorry if I keep asking but you look very skilled (and kind) and I'd like to understand certain things before buying.


No worries! Ask away 

Not sure if I'm very skilled but at least I've been using Zebra for a long time now!


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## DANIELE

Pier said:


> Some parts are starting to show its age IMO, like the effects. This might not matter to you if you're going to add say an external reverb.
> 
> The UI is showing its age too in some ways. For example, there are almost no animations. OTOH the workflow itself is fantastic. You can quickly create and understand very complex patches.
> 
> The sound itself is still fantastic and has an organic and timeless classic quality to it. Oscillators and the filters are still top notch. Also AFAIK there's nothing in the market like its comb filter.
> 
> 
> Dune is a very different synth which I also love.
> 
> Honestly, just demo Zebra and try it out for a bit. Give it time to grow on you, don't be fooled by superficial impressions!
> 
> 
> Most parameters in Zebra can be modulated but you get almost zero visual feedback. You have to use your ears
> 
> 
> There are a couple of ways of approaching this.
> 
> 1) Some modules have modulation knobs, and you can modulate those knobs.
> 
> 2) In the mod matrix, each modulator has a sidechain, so to speak. This means you can control the how much modulation with a second modulation.
> 
> 
> No worries! Ask away
> 
> Not sure if I'm very skilled but at least I've been using Zebra for a long time now!


Some very useful informations here.

The visual feedback could help me visually but I always use my ears to understand the effect of a modulation. Another important thing for me, which you highlighted, is the workflow. In many synths you can feel lost because at a certain point you loose track of the path you are walking in to get the final result. In Dune (the synth, not the movie, I still have to see it) I like the matrix, it is very flexible and you can almost modulate everything. Dune also doesn't have animations so maybe I could feel good with Zebra.

For the effects no problem, I can easily use an external reverb. I use a virtual space so I can easily fit the synths tracks in it.

I'd really like to see some Zebra sound design tutorial too.


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## Pier

DANIELE said:


> I'd really like to see some Zebra sound design tutorial too.


There are tons of Zebra resources on Youtube, ADSR, etc.

For example:









Zebra Tutorials


Want to start creating emotive soundscapes and original sounds with u-he's Zebra 2? Discover the power of u-he Zebra and it's modular layout with hours of indepth, professional Zebra tutorials.




www.adsrsounds.com


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## shadowsoflight

Pier said:


> There are tons of Zebra resources on Youtube, ADSR, etc.
> 
> For example:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Zebra Tutorials
> 
> 
> Want to start creating emotive soundscapes and original sounds with u-he's Zebra 2? Discover the power of u-he Zebra and it's modular layout with hours of indepth, professional Zebra tutorials.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.adsrsounds.com


Thanks for the link! They have a huge amount of tutorials... I'll be working through some of these for sure 

@DANIELE to give you a perspective on the other side of things: I am a hobbyist with an unrelated full-time job and small children. I generally get an hour or two in a day to do anything music related. I'm not very good at sound design, and my skills as a composer are marginal. I took a chance on Dark Zebra last Christmas, and I am absolutely loving it.

It sits very well in the mix, the X/Y pads allow convenient tweakability, the browser makes it easy to find sounds, it is very stable, and it is an extremely versatile synth. @R. Naroth has used it (actually, Dark Zebra) to re-create tracks from the Dune soundtrack, with no added samples and minimal external effects. And obviously, it is used extensively and successfully in hybrid scoring. On the other hand, I see people making sounds for EDM, Trance, House, etc. I myself have been using nothing but drums and Zebra 2 Luftrum / Sonic Underworld soundsets to make satisfying Psychill and Synthwave tracks.

I have been having so much fun using soundsets, and have been using Zebra so much in my work this year, that my interest in sound design has been rekindled.

Plus, you get a cheap upgrade to Zebra 3 (or free if you go all-in with the Dark Zebra), so you'll have plenty of time to wrap your head around it.


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## DANIELE

Pier said:


> There are tons of Zebra resources on Youtube, ADSR, etc.
> 
> For example:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Zebra Tutorials
> 
> 
> Want to start creating emotive soundscapes and original sounds with u-he's Zebra 2? Discover the power of u-he Zebra and it's modular layout with hours of indepth, professional Zebra tutorials.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.adsrsounds.com



Thank you, I'll look at them for sure. Another question cames to my mind: is there a way to assign CC controls to the knobs (for example the vibrato knob)? Maybe within the matrix itself?

I think you can and this is a pretty obvious question but you never know.



shadowsoflight said:


> Thanks for the link! They have a huge amount of tutorials... I'll be working through some of these for sure
> 
> @DANIELE to give you a perspective on the other side of things: I am a hobbyist with an unrelated full-time job and small children. I generally get an hour or two in a day to do anything music related. I'm not very good at sound design, and my skills as a composer are marginal. I took a chance on Dark Zebra last Christmas, and I am absolutely loving it.
> 
> It sits very well in the mix, the X/Y pads allow convenient tweakability, the browser makes it easy to find sounds, it is very stable, and it is an extremely versatile synth. @R. Naroth has used it (actually, Dark Zebra) to re-create tracks from the Dune soundtrack, with no added samples and minimal external effects. And obviously, it is used extensively and successfully in hybrid scoring. On the other hand, I see people making sounds for EDM, Trance, House, etc. I myself have been using nothing but drums and Zebra 2 Luftrum / Sonic Underworld soundsets to make satisfying Psychill and Synthwave tracks.
> 
> I have been having so much fun using soundsets, and have been using Zebra so much in my work this year, that my interest in sound design has been rekindled.
> 
> Plus, you get a cheap upgrade to Zebra 3 (or free if you go all-in with the Dark Zebra), so you'll have plenty of time to wrap your head around it.



The R. Naroth work is exactly why my urge to buy Zebra has awakened again. If I can do such things with this synth then it is the synth I'm looking for.
I'm going tired to use pre-baked libraries (pretty good and useful libraries no doubt) with low booms, downers and all sort of FX. I want to decide how to control them, through velocity and CCs. I want to create them myself and Zebra 2 could be my way to go together with some granular synthesizer (I love granular synthesis, so powerful) if I would like to use some sample.

As I said to Hans in an older post I cannot access a real orchestra (even if I live in Florence, a city overflowing with art) and for that purpose I have to use libraries (and pretty good ones are coming out), but for all the rest I want to shape my own sounds.


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## DANIELE

liquidlino said:


> With Zebra, the common two things said about it, for cinematic use, seem to be:
> 1. For some reason it blends into an orchestra well.
> 2. It is practically unlimited in terms of synth sound design. It doesn't have sampling like Falcon, HALion. But it does synth extremely well.
> 
> On the other hand...
> 
> 1. It's pretty complex, not something I personally would recommend to someone new to synthesis (unless you just want to buy preset packs and use it that way - in which case there's some awesome preset packs available Tom Wolfe, @Pier etc)
> 
> 2. It's not free. There's tons of free synths available if you're new to synths, and they're all amazing. Vital, Surge, Odin, TAL, Zebrette etc etc etc. Wear them out before buying anything, and you'll know what you do and don't value in a synth.



I'm not new to synthesis, some year ago I did a pair of courses to study it and I'm an engineer that studied automation (so not new to waves theory even if I studied them in the electrical field).

I know what an oscillator is, what an LFO is etc...I'm not very deep in the synthesis realm but I'm pretty confident that I can win over Zebra. I'll need to do some deep tutorials to understand what every module does and how it affects the sound, I'll do some reverse engineering too, just to understand what I need to get the right sound etc...

Thank you for the precious informations. You are all very informative and useful to me.


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## Pier

DANIELE said:


> Thank you, I'll look at them for sure. Another question cames to my mind: is there a way to assign CC controls to the knobs (for example the vibrato knob)? Maybe within the matrix itself?


Sure, just MIDI learn the knob like in any other synth.


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## Pier

DANIELE said:


> I'm going tired to use pre-baked libraries (pretty good and useful libraries no doubt) with low booms, downers and all sort of FX. I want to decide how to control them, through velocity and CCs. I want to create them myself and Zebra 2 could be my way to go


I actually have a library for Zebra just of subwoofer sounds and effects LOL









Mercury - Deep Impact - Cinematic subwoofer presets for U-He Zebra 2







www.mercurysounddesign.com





Let me know if you get Zebra and I'll send you a discount code 

Edit:

You can download 5 free presets from that page. I think in those there is a boom you could check out.


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## Pier

liquidlino said:


> in which case there's some awesome preset packs available Tom Wolfe, @Pier etc


Thanks. I feel honored to be in the same sentence as Tom Wolfe


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## DANIELE

Pier said:


> I actually have a library for Zebra just of subwoofer sounds and effects LOL
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Mercury - Deep Impact - Cinematic subwoofer presets for U-He Zebra 2
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.mercurysounddesign.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Let me know if you get Zebra and I'll send you a discount code
> 
> Edit:
> 
> You can download 5 free presets from that page. I think in those there is a boom you could check out.


I'm listening to the demos, very interesting, you are very kind and I'll let you know when I buy Zebra 2. I may also ask you other questions about it once I start putting my hands on it.

I'm looking to the ADSR tutorials and they seems pretty interesting, I hope they explain deeply all the modules of Zebra 2 because I'm not able to find courses about it (very weird).


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## D Halgren

DANIELE said:


> I'm listening to the demos, very interesting, you are very kind and I'll let you know when I buy Zebra 2. I may also ask you other questions about it once I start putting my hands on it.
> 
> I'm looking to the ADSR tutorials and they seems pretty interesting, I hope they explain deeply all the modules of Zebra 2 because I'm not able to find courses about it (very weird).


https://www.groove3.com/tutorials/u-he-Zebra2-Explained

Best I've found.


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## Pappaus

One thing that isn’t mentioned is that Zebra and most of the U-HE synths are really easy on the CPU. Running Serum on my PC would start blowing me out with a few tracks of Serum. I can load up multiple tracks of Zebra and not even feel it. (Of course it all depends on the requirements of the selected patch).


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## DANIELE

D Halgren said:


> https://www.groove3.com/tutorials/u-he-Zebra2-Explained
> 
> Best I've found.


Thank you, I already found it but in the reviews someone mention that it is only a list of the features like a video manual and not an in deep tutorial.


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## Pier

Pappaus said:


> most of the U-HE synths are really easy on the CPU


Except Diva I guess


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## DANIELE

Pappaus said:


> One thing that isn’t mentioned is that Zebra and most of the U-HE synths are really easy on the CPU. Running Serum on my PC would start blowing me out with a few tracks of Serum. I can load up multiple tracks of Zebra and not even feel it. (Of course it all depends on the requirements of the selected patch).


I was just asking myself about the performances and I like what I'm reading here, even if I have a pretty good workstation.


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## ed buller

best

ed


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## DANIELE

ed buller said:


> best
> 
> ed



Thank you Ed, I'm already watching these mini tutorials, they are very useful. In the post above I was talking about a more structured course that guide you through modules and examples (maybe in context).


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## DANIELE

I have another question that comes to my mind, this is more about the creative process but I'd like to listen to your techniques applied to Zebra 2. If also Hans (@Rctec) could answer it would be very helpful.

When you are creating a sound from scratch how do you work? 


You think about the sound before starting using Zebra;
You have a general idea of what sound are you looking for and then you start using zebra and you let the experimentation drive yourself;
You listen to nature, city sounds, noises and all the sounds around you and you try to pick something interesting trying to reproduce it with Zebra;
You "steal" the sound from a track you like;
You start completely random and see what happens.
Thank you so much.


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## Pier

DANIELE said:


> When you are creating a sound from scratch how do you work?
> 
> 
> You think about the sound before starting using Zebra;
> You have a general idea of what sound are you looking for and then you start using zebra and you let the experimentation drive yourself;
> You listen to nature, city sounds, noises and all the sounds around you and you try to pick something interesting trying to reproduce it with Zebra;
> You "steal" the sound from a track you like;
> You start completely random and see what happens.
> Thank you so much.


All of the above.

For me there isn't a fixed path unless it's a sound I've replicated many times and know the steps by heart. Ideas are generally only the first step and not a destination.

Even when you perfectly know the Zebra modules, the interaction between those modules is probably much more important. It's a very creative process that requires lots of experimentation.


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## D Halgren

DANIELE said:


> Thank you, I already found it but in the reviews someone mention that it is only a list of the features like a video manual and not an in deep tutorial.


It tells you what everything does, it doesn't tell you how to use it. That is all I want out of tutorials.


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## DANIELE

Pier said:


> All of the above.
> 
> For me there isn't a fixed path unless it's a sound I've replicated many times and know the steps by heart. Ideas are generally only the first step and not a destination.
> 
> Even when you perfectly know the Zebra modules, the interaction between those modules is probably much more important. It's a very creative process that requires lots of experimentation.


Yeah true but maybe I should have said: what do you prefer between those five options, what is it the most used by you?

I already have a little experience in how to go from an idea to a final composition but using an orchestra and using a synth are two very different things. An orchestra you already know how it plays more or less, you can still do something different but you know all the instruments.
A synth on the other side is a matter of starting from nothing to something.


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## greggybud

DANIELE said:


> Yeah sorry, I mean some synths like: Dune 3, Omnisphere, Massive X, Absynth and so on, the most used ones.


I will only comment on Zebra/Dark Zebra vs. Massive X and Absynth.

I would suggest comparing Zebra to Massive X is apples to oranges. To me, the overall sound is just...different. Not better or worse, just different. And I think Massive X would appeal to EDM producers more. Zebra would appeal to composers, and to other users as a general excellent all-around synth. Zebra has been around for ages, while Massive, and Massive X are relatively newer.

NI Absynth is a different beast. Over the years I have loved it...but most of the time my love is using Absynth inside NI Kore which NI stupidly abandoned long ago. Morphing is a big thing for me, and working with Absynth along with other 3rd party VST's and some Reaktor synths was simply inspiring for many years. Again, this is probably how I used it inside Kore. IMO the sound of Absynth is closer to Zebra than Massive/X.

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but NI outsourced Absynth from the very beginning. And that developer no longer is supporting it moving on to other projects. Also, personally, I can't stand the Absynth GUI colors. Speaking of GUI's, the Kore GUI is very similar to Zebras. I like those colors. I don't care much for the more recent NI GUI's such as both Massives even with the different light/dark shades.

My perspective is you gain a lot of sonic ground by Zebra compared to Massive/X and Abysnth. But that may just be my perspective More importantly however, my trust in NI has greatly diminished since the abandonment of Kore 10 years ago, (plus several other NI products) plus the general direction NI has taken since that time. Some original NI employees such as NI founder Stephan Schmitt, the brains behind Reaktor and Kore, plus James Walker Hall behind Maschine have left NI. 

The entire business/marketing paradigm between NI and u-he is very different, and I strongly prefer u-hes.


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## shadowsoflight

DANIELE said:


> Yeah true but maybe I should have said: what do you prefer between those five options, what is it the most used by you?
> 
> I already have a little experience in how to go from an idea to a final composition but using an orchestra and using a synth are two very different things. An orchestra you already know how it plays more or less, you can still do something different but you know all the instruments.
> A synth on the other side is a matter of starting from nothing to something.



Something I've been thinking about for myself lately: how do I approach writing a piece? You might find that a similar approach for a synth patch works well. To draw some parallels:

"You think about the sound before starting using Zebra" - do you think about an arrangement before you start writing a track?

"You have a general idea of what sound are you looking for and then you start using zebra and you let the experimentation drive yourself" - do you find it better to start working on a piece with a big picture idea, mood or feeling?

"You listen to nature, city sounds, noises and all the sounds around you and you try to pick something interesting trying to reproduce it with Zebra" - do you write a track that's inspired by the world around you?

"You "steal" the sound from a track you like" - do you get inspired to write your own arrangements by listening to the works of others?

"You start completely random and see what happens" - do you like to open up your DAW and just play around with existing instruments until a song starts to form?

Personally, for example, I lean more towards option 3 when writing music, so maybe I should try the same for programming synth patches.

Just a thought! Workflows are very personal, but this might help you think about it differently.


----------



## Pier

DANIELE said:


> Yeah true but maybe I should have said: what do you prefer between those five options, what is it the most used by you?
> 
> I already have a little experience in how to go from an idea to a final composition but using an orchestra and using a synth are two very different things. An orchestra you already know how it plays more or less, you can still do something different but you know all the instruments.
> A synth on the other side is a matter of starting from nothing to something.


I don't have a preference... sometimes I have a non sonic concept in my mind (maybe from a book or a movie) and I experiment with Zebra until I find something that gets me into that space.

Sometimes I'm having a shower and think "hey? what would happen if I used an MSEG with the comb filter?" and so I try that. If I like the result it becomes another thing I can use when working on a new preset.

I guess you're looking for a method when asking these questions? IMHO that's the wrong mindset. Zebra is a vast terrain that needs to be explored. I might enjoy forests with rivers and you might prefer arid cold mountains. Just go out there and explore. Eventually you will find whatever it is you're looking for, even if you don't know what it is yet.


----------



## Trash Panda

Pier said:


> Except Diva I guess


Its nature is true to its name in that regard.


----------



## jackal

“Why should I buy U-He Zebra 2?”​
Superior sound quality !!


----------



## DANIELE

D Halgren said:


> It tells you what everything does, it doesn't tell you how to use it. That is all I want out of tutorials.


Ok but I was looking for a course, and I'd like to se what everything does and maybe how it sounds in a context.


----------



## DANIELE

shadowsoflight said:


> Something I've been thinking about for myself lately: how do I approach writing a piece? You might find that a similar approach for a synth patch works well. To draw some parallels:
> 
> "You think about the sound before starting using Zebra" - do you think about an arrangement before you start writing a track?
> 
> "You have a general idea of what sound are you looking for and then you start using zebra and you let the experimentation drive yourself" - do you find it better to start working on a piece with a big picture idea, mood or feeling?
> 
> "You listen to nature, city sounds, noises and all the sounds around you and you try to pick something interesting trying to reproduce it with Zebra" - do you write a track that's inspired by the world around you?
> 
> "You "steal" the sound from a track you like" - do you get inspired to write your own arrangements by listening to the works of others?
> 
> "You start completely random and see what happens" - do you like to open up your DAW and just play around with existing instruments until a song starts to form?
> 
> Personally, for example, I lean more towards option 3 when writing music, so maybe I should try the same for programming synth patches.
> 
> Just a thought! Workflows are very personal, but this might help you think about it differently.



The comparison could work but for the orchestra after many years I found a way (not really a method) to avoiding being stuck and not feeling constrained at the same time, with a synth it is another story. Well I guess it is all a matter of experience and trial and error.



Pier said:


> I guess you're looking for a method when asking these questions? IMHO that's the wrong mindset. Zebra is a vast terrain that needs to be explored. I might enjoy forests with rivers and you might prefer arid cold mountains. Just go out there and explore. Eventually you will find whatever it is you're looking for, even if you don't know what it is yet.


Not really a method, a way to fire the engine maybe. I don't want to enclose the creativity in a box but I also don't want to be too dispersive.

Maybe it is a problem affecting mostly people like me, they have a little time in the evening after a day of work and they would like to avoid loosing time. I understand it doesn't work like this, like it didn't all the past years I spent studying music. Luckily I don't start from zero so it is only a matter of time and growing.


----------



## D Halgren

DANIELE said:


> Ok but I was looking for a course, and I'd like to se what everything does and maybe how it sounds in a context.


I understand. To me it is what I needed, but it isn't really a make this sound, here's how type course. I did take a lot away from it and felt like I knew Zebra better after. Plus, I bought it, and it is a quick reference anytime I need a refresher.


----------



## DANIELE

D Halgren said:


> I understand. To me it is what I needed, but it isn't really a make this sound, here's how type course. I did take a lot away from it and felt like I knew Zebra better after. Plus, I bought it, and it is a quick reference anytime I need a refresher.


Well, I think that for 10$ I could pull the trigger.


----------



## R. Naroth

As others mentioned, Zebra is very light on CPU. I have projects with over 40 - 50 instances of Zebra HZ running simultaneously on an old 2010 Mac Pro. You also get Zebrify for free, which is great if you want to extend a certain track/another synth with extra filters/mods/delays/reverb.

Once you get a hang of it, Zebra really becomes a journey of discovery. Sometimes, I find myself lost in it, spending hours exploring possibilities.

Wish you all the best.


----------



## DANIELE

R. Naroth said:


> As others mentioned, Zebra is very light on CPU. I have projects with over 40 - 50 instances of Zebra HZ running simultaneously on an old 2010 Mac Pro. You also get Zebrify for free, which is great if you want to extend a certain track/another synth with extra filters/mods/delays/reverb.
> 
> Once you get a hang of it, Zebra really becomes a journey of discovery. Sometimes, I find myself lost in it, spending hours exploring possibilities.
> 
> Wish you all the best.


This is what I'm hoping. I'm looking at the various tutorials out there and I must say I'm liking the workflow, I still have to wait a few days before purchasing it but the most I look at the videos the most I want to put my hands on it.


----------



## Rctec

..this is the longest post I’ve read for someone to make up their mind. As someone else said above: “Superior Sound-quality“. What more do you need? But from the amount Of indecision you show, (and I don’t mean this as a criticism, just an observation), a synth like Zebra will drive you mad.
i start by having a clear picture in my head of what sound i want to achieve. I’m usually on a deadline, so I have to make decisions and know my way around something that can give me the results flawlessly. I suggest you get Zebra and only load 2 modules: an Oscillator and an ADSR. the oscillators are so flexible with their own huge amount of build-in Fx, you’ll spend a life-time just exploring those…
hz


----------



## StefanoM

Zebra is the only (or almost the only) synth I use. As Master Hans says, with just one oscillator, you can create many things. It is also true that it requires a particular sonic "imagination" and good sound design skills; this is why there are so many more "ready" " Hybrid/Synth Sample Libraries out there, starting not from a simple oscillator but from an already complex organic sound. But if you think you want to enter into the world of Sound Design and spend hours creating YOUR sounds. You must have Zebra (especially Hans's version, Hz). I think it's not for everyone. Because not all composers or those who make music develop to have a strong attitude towards sound design. Zebra indeed has many presets, but its real strength is creating the sound in your head from scratch. Because if you just use Presets, then there is a lot of other choices in the sample libraries as well. Which allows you to have ready-made sounds more easily editable. 

But if you are interested in advanced sound design it is a must to have.


----------



## DANIELE

Rctec said:


> ..this is the longest post I’ve read for someone to make up their mind. As someone else said above: “Superior Sound-quality“. What more do you need? But from the amount Of indecision you show, (and I don’t mean this as a criticism, just an observation), a synth like Zebra will drive you mad.
> i start by having a clear picture in my head of what sound i want to achieve. I’m usually on a deadline, so I have to make decisions and know my way around something that can give me the results flawlessly. I suggest you get Zebra and only load 2 modules: an Oscillator and an ADSR. the oscillators are so flexible with their own huge amount of build-in Fx, you’ll spend a life-time just exploring those…
> hz


No wait, the post is no more about my decision (even if the title is keep telling that), I already decided and I'll buy it in a few days, I have to wait my wallet (it must be refilled before being emptied).
I'm sorry, I'm still limited in english so maybe I wrote something wrong.

Now it is more how to get better about it, this is why I liked to have some kind of confrontation with you all. As I said I like what I'm seeing and I like what you users are telling me. I already decided from the first posts of this thread, it is just a matter of time now.
You answered to my post selecting the number 1 as a primary way of using Zebra, this is useful to me.

Thank you againg for your advice and for taking the time to answering me.


----------



## DANIELE

StefanoM said:


> Zebra is the only (or almost the only) synth I use. As Master Hans says, with just one oscillator, you can create many things. It is also true that it requires a particular sonic "imagination" and good sound design skills; this is why there are so many more "ready" " Hybrid/Synth Sample Libraries out there, starting not from a simple oscillator but from an already complex organic sound. But if you think you want to enter into the world of Sound Design and spend hours creating YOUR sounds. You must have Zebra (especially Hans's version, Hz). I think it's not for everyone. Because not all composers or those who make music develop to have a strong attitude towards sound design. Zebra indeed has many presets, but its real strength is creating the sound in your head from scratch. Because if you just use Presets, then there is a lot of other choices in the sample libraries as well. Which allows you to have ready-made sounds more easily editable.
> 
> But if you are interested in advanced sound design it is a must to have.


This is exactly what I want to do, I don't want to use presets. I will only in the first place because I need to study the synth but then I will do it myself. I already worked with some synths and I already followed the same path.
My questions here was more about why this synth is better for my purposes (and I had plenty of answers) and then about the workflow and also about general synthesis methods. Only because until now I only used few synths in my works and I never went deep in using them. Also because I felt a bit limited by the workflows and results I had until now. Based on what I see now I think that Zebra is the right choice for me and I'm interested about how you use it, let's call it "academic interest".


----------



## StefanoM

DANIELE said:


> This is exactly what I want to do, I don't want to use presets. I will only in the first place because I need to study the synth but then I will do it myself. I already worked with some synths and I already followed the same path.
> My questions here was more about why this synth is better for my purposes (and I had plenty of answers) and then about the workflow and also about general synthesis methods. Only because until now I only used few synths in my works and I never went deep in using them. Also because I felt a bit limited by the workflows and results I had until now. Based on what I see now I think that Zebra is the right choice for me and I'm interested about how you use it, let's call it "academic interest".



In my opinion, the power of Zebra is:

1) The Workflow ( at the first Look it seems complex...but then it becomes all-natural and clear)
2) The Sound Engine. With Zebra is possible to create an infinite type of sound.

It Has so many types of modules, resonators, flexible oscillators, a pretty nice FX section, that if you can manage all these things you can create anything. It's really different from a "traditional" Synth. Like Diva or also Vital. Vital is another pretty cool synth but is a little bit different from Zebra.

Anyway Vital and Zebra are my two preferred Synth to create sound.

The problem is that creating really "cool" and organic sound from scratch is not easy, and it requires a long time of studying, and time to spend on it.

This is Why for example I created also libraries like Elements also for my purpose and not only for commercial use.

Where creating organic sounds ( also from scratch ) it's faster, because I start from a Wave_Rom created before for this purpose. So I do not start from an oscillator each time, but from more structured ( and Hybrid ) sounds, which allows me to create complex new organic sounds very quickly, And when you have a deadline that's important (for example my new DuneScapes Free Presets for Elements inspired from the amazing Dune Sound Track)

But when I have time to spend to create absolutely new sound from scratch starting from an oscillator, I start from Zebra, to create new WaveRom that I can use after to create also new future libraries.

The Raw sample that then I can use to mix it with the acoustic instruments samples to create a new Hybrid Library, just for example.

So yes Zebra is a must to have


----------



## DANIELE

StefanoM said:


> In my opinion, the power of Zebra is:
> 
> 1) The Workflow ( at the first Look it seems complex...but then it becomes all-natural and clear)
> 2) The Sound Engine. With Zebra is possible to create an infinite type of sound.
> 
> It Has so many types of modules, resonators, flexible oscillators, a pretty nice FX section, that if you can manage all these things you can create anything. It's really different from a "traditional" Synth. Like Diva or also Vital. Vital is another pretty cool synth but is a little bit different from Zebra.
> 
> Anyway Vital and Zebra are my two preferred Synth to create sound.
> 
> The problem is that creating really "cool" and organic sound from scratch is not easy, and it requires a long time of studying, and time to spend on it.
> 
> This is Why for example I created also libraries like Elements also for my purpose and not only for commercial use.
> 
> Where creating organic sounds ( also from scratch ) it's faster, because I start from a Wave_Rom created before for this purpose. So I do not start from an oscillator each time, but from more structured ( and Hybrid ) sounds, which allows me to create complex new organic sounds very quickly, And when you have a deadline that's important.
> 
> But when I have time to spend to create absolutely new sound from scratch starting from an oscillator, I start from Zebra, to create new WaveRom that I can use after to create also new future libraries.
> 
> The Raw sample that then I can use to mix it with the acoustic instruments samples to create a new Hybrid Library, just for example.
> 
> So yes Zebra is a must to have


Here's another interesting aspect, creating new wavetables. Pier told me it is not so simple to import new wavetables in Zebra.

May I ask you to give me more details about a wave_rom created for this purpose? I mean, what you should do to create a source sound that brings you to create organic sounds in the end. Zebra is not a sampler so we are talking about wavetables. I'm very curious about this process.

Obviously I don't want you to reveal your secret sauce in creating commercial products so tell me what you can if you can.


----------



## StefanoM

DANIELE said:


> Here's another interesting aspect, creating new wavetables. Pier told me it is not so simple to import new wavetables in Zebra.
> 
> May I ask you to give me more details about a wave_rom created for this purpose? I mean, what you should do to create a source sound that brings you to create organic sounds in the end. Zebra is not a sampler so we are talking about wavetables. I'm very curious about this process.
> 
> Obviously I don't want you to reveal your secret sauce in creating commercial products so tell me what you can if you can.



Indeed, Then I export the samples created with Zebra, and I use it with Kontakt to mix that samples crated with Zebra with other acoustic sources.


----------



## Pier

DANIELE said:


> Pier told me it is not so simple to import new wavetables in Zebra.


I told you you couldn't import .wav files, but there are plenty of Zebra format wavetables if you google a bit.






Zebra Family Presets







u-he.com





(scroll down to the oscillator presets)

I also told you you can create wavetables inside Zebra


----------



## Pier

Here's someone selling Zebra + ZebraHZ for $200

https://www.knobcloud.com/i/23144/u-he-u-he-zebra-and-zebrahz-retail-298-
Edit:

It's gone


----------



## DANIELE

Pier said:


> I told you you couldn't import .wav files, but there are plenty of Zebra format wavetables if you google a bit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Zebra Family Presets
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> u-he.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> (scroll down to the oscillator presets)
> 
> I also told you you can create wavetables inside Zebra


Sorry Pier I wrote the wrong thing, I meant wav files.


----------



## DANIELE

Pier said:


> Here's someone selling Zebra + ZebraHZ for $200
> 
> https://www.knobcloud.com/i/23144/u-he-u-he-zebra-and-zebrahz-retail-298-
> Edit:
> 
> It's gone


Acc...well with VATs I would have payed almost the same amount. The old offer you pointed me was even more expensive than buying from the u-he site in euros.

EDIT

Maybe there's someone lurking here, waiting in the shadows for you pointing good deals.


----------



## Pier

DANIELE said:


> Sorry Pier I wrote the wrong thing, I meant wav files.


No worries!


----------



## KEM

Because it’s really good, nothing else even needs to be said!!


----------



## Rctec

Dear Daniele, May I be so bold and say quite simply and succinctly:

RTFM!

….sometimes composers helping composers is as simple as that. 
Personally, I’ve never read the damn thing, but I know that the esteemed Howard Scarr has spilt his life’s blood in those pages, filling them with all you could ever want to ask, know, question, illuminate, discover - etc.,etc.


----------



## easyrider

Zebra 2 is an amazing VI! ❤️


----------



## Greeno

DANIELE said:


> Acc...well with VATs I would have payed almost the same amount. The old offer you pointed me was even more expensive than buying from the u-he site in euros.
> 
> EDIT
> 
> Maybe there's someone lurking here, waiting in the shadows for you pointing good deals.


Ciao Daniele

I appreciate that you want to ask the opinion of fellow composers so that you make a wise choice and spend your hard earned money securely etc but I think you're way overthinking this whole thing dude. I mean that in the kindest possible way of course! It's a damn good synth from one of the best companies, there's videos on line, info on U-he's website etc and a I think there's a demo version? 
Take the plunge !!


----------



## DANIELE

Greeno said:


> Ciao Daniele
> 
> I appreciate that you want to ask the opinion of fellow composers so that you make a wise choice and spend your hard earned money securely etc but I think you're way overthinking this whole thing dude. I mean that in the kindest possible way of course! It's a damn good synth from one of the best companies, there's videos on line, info on U-he's website etc and a I think there's a demo version?
> Take the plunge !!


Ciao Greeno,

as I said before it is no more a matter of buying it or not, I must wait for december (the 25% off is until 7th december) to buy it because of the expenses I had to bear this month, then I'll buy it for sure. In the meantime I'm looking to tutorials, videos about it, asking to other users, reading the manual and so on.

I was only using this thread (as many of you kindly answered to my initial question) to share some things that are coming to my mind. I don't want any shortcuts or other confirmations anymore. I think there is enough of them here.
So I can discover some developers of libraries from Zebra, some techniques, some good advices etc...

Since this thing is growing I'd like to clarify some points here (we all know that writing can be a bit limiting in some cases, especially not in your native language): it is 20 years now that I'm studying music in my free time (the time I had out of university, then work, wife and lately my father cancer etc...) I tried to do (and I did) many thing only by myself, I studied composers I like (Hans was one of the first but there are many other), I listened a lot, I looked for tutorials, advices all over the internet, I asked other musicians, I studied manuals, I tried demos, I bought a lot of tools and I played with them, I did research about hardware, audio engineering, I tried, I did it wrong and I tried again. I studied about all the fields regardin music (from the theory to the engineering) and I only touched the sourface, I have no degree in music and I needed a lot of feedbacks from many other people that listened to my music, this helped me to grow. In all this time I developed some very useful shortcuts and some methods to avoid feeling stuck. All this thank to other people that wrote what I read, that filmed what I watched at, that recorded what I listened to.
I starded when finding guides, lessons and so on was more difficult then now, so I needed a lot of time to reach some goals, time that would have been much shorter if I had been lucky enough to find someone to explain certain things to me.


I have pretty good ideas on how to work with new tools, but I know I still have to learn a lot and I love to share knowledge with you, this is was I was aiming lately here.

I hate to buy something that I will end not using, this is why I opened this thread in the first place. Now it is a different matter. I'm now in the process of gaining useful informations I will use later.

That said I thank you so much for your advice as I did with the other ones that used their time to answer me. I appreciate a lot and I hope you understand what I meant here.


----------



## DANIELE

Rctec said:


> Dear Daniele, May I be so bold and say quite simply and succinctly:
> 
> RTFM!
> 
> ….sometimes composers helping composers is as simple as that.
> Personally, I’ve never read the damn thing, but I know that the esteemed Howard Scarr has spilt his life’s blood in those pages, filling them with all you could ever want to ask, know, question, illuminate, discover - etc.,etc.



I won't waste his blood then (I'm already looking at it).


----------



## Evans

Speaking of Zebra, The Unfinished is doing their BF sale. Lots of presets for grab at 40% off.



Anyone have any favorites? I'm new to Zebra and it's always nice to start off with a wide variety of presets while learning a new app.


----------



## Greeno

DANIELE said:


> Ciao Greeno,
> 
> as I said before it is no more a matter of buying it or not, I must wait for december (the 25% off is until 7th december) to buy it because of the expenses I had to bear this month, then I'll buy it for sure. In the meantime I'm looking to tutorials, videos about it, asking to other users, reading the manual and so on.
> 
> I was only using this thread (as many of you kindly answered to my initial question) to share some things that are coming to my mind. I don't want any shortcuts or other confirmations anymore. I think there is enough of them here.
> So I can discover some developers of libraries from Zebra, some techniques, some good advices etc...
> 
> Since this thing is growing I'd like to clarify some points here (we all know that writing can be a bit limiting in some cases, especially not in your native language): it is 20 years now that I'm studying music in my free time (the time I had out of university, then work, wife and lately my father cancer etc...) I tried to do (and I did) many thing only by myself, I studied composers I like (Hans was one of the first but there are many other), I listened a lot, I looked for tutorials, advices all over the internet, I asked other musicians, I studied manuals, I tried demos, I bought a lot of tools and I played with them, I did research about hardware, audio engineering, I tried, I did it wrong and I tried again. I studied about all the fields regardin music (from the theory to the engineering) and I only touched the sourface, I have no degree in music and I needed a lot of feedbacks from many other people that listened to my music, this helped me to grow. In all this time I developed some very useful shortcuts and some methods to avoid feeling stuck. All this thank to other people that wrote what I read, that filmed what I watched at, that recorded what I listened to.
> I starded when finding guides, lessons and so on was more difficult then now, so I needed a lot of time to reach some goals, time that would have been much shorter if I had been lucky enough to find someone to explain certain things to me.
> 
> 
> I have pretty good ideas on how to work with new tools, but I know I still have to learn a lot and I love to share knowledge with you, this is was I was aiming lately here.
> 
> I hate to buy something that I will end not using, this is why I opened this thread in the first place. Now it is a different matter. I'm now in the process of gaining useful informations I will use later.
> 
> That said I thank you so much for your advice as I did with the other ones that used their time to answer me. I appreciate a lot and I hope you understand what I meant here.


Sei molto benvenuto di fare domande qua Daniele, stavo scherzando un po prima!..guarda, il suo inglese e fantastico e apprezzato che scrivi in una altra lingua! Scrivi molto bene, sembra molto meglio del mio Italiano! 
Fidami, sono sicuro che piacerei Dark Zebra. Molto bello e facile usarla, la suona e 'grasso' anche diverso, molto utile per tanti situazione con una qualita raro..e leggero su CPU.

all the best with your purchases and compositions mate, love from Bristol to Firenze (I have a friend from Regello and have visited Fir a few times) hope to be there one day in the future.


----------



## DANIELE

Greeno said:


> Sei molto benvenuto di fare domande qua Daniele, stavo scherzando un po prima!..guarda, il suo inglese e fantastico e apprezzato che scrivi in una altra lingua! Scrivi molto bene, sembra molto meglio del mio Italiano!
> Fidami, sono sicuro che piacerei Dark Zebra. Molto bello e facile usarla, la suona e 'grasso' anche diverso, molto utile per tanti situazione con una qualita raro..e leggero su CPU.
> 
> all the best with your purchases and compositions mate, love from Bristol to Firenze (I have a friend from Regello and have visited Fir a few times) hope to be there one day in the future.


Thank you again Greeno, I appreciate so much and I appreciate your italian too. Firenze is here waiting for your return. 

Be sure I'll have some other questions once I'll put my hands on Zebra. I'm very happy I opened this thread, one of the best I've ever written in.


----------



## DANIELE

Evans said:


> Speaking of Zebra, The Unfinished is doing their BF sale. Lots of presets for grab at 40% off.
> 
> 
> 
> Anyone have any favorites? I'm new to Zebra and it's always nice to start off with a wide variety of presets while learning a new app.



Poor wallet.


----------



## DANIELE

Uhm...I was just to buy it but another question rise from the shadows...just kidding, I did it, I bought it!! Finally! Now I'll start to experiment with it.


----------



## DANIELE

First question A.B. (After Buying): why the Dark Zebra is another VST and not a bunch of presets for the main one? Except for the UI they seems the same synth (but I only had time to take a quick look at them).


----------



## doctoremmet

DANIELE said:


> First question A.B. (After Buying): why the Dark Zebra is another VST and not a bunch of presets for the main one? Except for the UI they seems the same synth (but I only had time to do a quick look at them).


But they aren’t. Hans had Urs make some additions and adjustments, specifically for the movie.


----------



## DANIELE

doctoremmet said:


> But they aren’t. Hans had Urs make some additions and adjustments, specifically for the movie.


Ah ok, so it is like having two synths and make a sound with DZ it is a different matter than doing it with Z2, am I right?


----------



## doctoremmet

DANIELE said:


> Ah ok, so it is like having two synths and make a sound with DZ it is a different matter than doing it with Z2, am I right?


Correct.


----------



## doctoremmet




----------



## Maarten

DANIELE said:


> Ah ok, so it is like having two synths and make a sound with DZ it is a different matter than doing it with Z2, am I right?


Didn't you read about Dark Zebra, before you bought it?
It's just more (control-)options and filters, modules, but *the basic workflow* is the same as the normal Zebra.

Copy and pasted from the manual:

ZebraHZ
ZebraHZ is Hans Zimmer’s custom version of Zebra2. Many of the following extensions are required by The Dark Zebra:
• 8 extra filters (4 x highpass and 4 x lowpass) based on Diva models
• 4 comb filter modules instead of 2
• 8 MSEGs instead of 4
• 24 modulation matrix slots instead of 12
• X/Y pads also appear as regular modulation sources
• 4 polyphonic compressors, one for each lane of the main grid
• 3 PolymoogTM-style resonators with additional full-range band
Note: For even more powerful physical modelling capabilities, version 2.9 has twice as many comb filters as version 2.8, and three Resonators instead of just one.


----------



## Bee_Abney

DANIELE said:


> Ah ok, so it is like having two synths and make a sound with DZ it is a different matter than doing it with Z2, am I right?


Dark Zebra contains all the elements of Zebra 2 plus some additions.
• 8 extra filters (4 x highpass and 4 x lowpass) based on Diva models
• 4 comb filter modules instead of 2
• 8 MSEGs instead of 4
• 24 modulation matrix slots instead of 12
• X/Y pads also appear as regular modulation sources
• 4 polyphonic compressors, one for each lane of the main grid
• 3 PolymoogTM-style resonators with additional full-range band
Note: For even more powerful physical modelling capabilities, version 2.9 has twice as many comb filters as version 2.8, and three Resonators instead of just one.



https://uhedownloads-heckmannaudiogmb.netdna-ssl.com/manuals/soundsets/zebra2/The-Dark-Zebra-user-guide.pdf


----------



## DANIELE

Thank you all for all the answers. Yesterday I only had the time to install Zebra, turn on the Daw, activate it and look at the ui, that's all.

I bought it without reading because of the free Zebra 3 thing and mostly for studying purposes but I'm happy to discover that it is a bigger version of Zebra 2.

Among many other things I spent my time looking at the course about Zebra 2, reading the manual, look at some tutorials etc...

Then I also found a very rare bug in other libraries an it tooks me sometime. Now I'm at work and I'll look at Zebra again this evening I hope.


----------



## Tusker

DANIELE said:


> I have another question that comes to my mind, this is more about the creative process but I'd like to listen to your techniques applied to Zebra 2. If also Hans (@Rctec) could answer it would be very helpful.
> 
> When you are creating a sound from scratch how do you work?


Daniele, I am a mere hobbyist but I'll try to answer your question as directly as I can. I've worked with synths for a few decades but only recently decided to get into the VI world. It's amazing!! Your questions are very pertinent not only to Zebra but to any sound source which requires design. It's not just a technical question but as you alluded, a question of the human imagination. Like others I use all of your approaches but it depends on the context. Please see my comments below ...



DANIELE said:


> You think about the sound before starting using Zebra;


Usually, this is usually a very workmanlike sound which has to perform a specific task. It's easy to define. Perhaps it has to keep time, like a hi-hat, or enlarge the low or high frequencies like a sub bass or high bells. It does not require a lot of imagination or skill, so it's easier to start with an existing patch and tweak it to whatever degree of exoticism your music requires.



DANIELE said:


> You have a general idea of what sound are you looking for and then you start using zebra and you let the experimentation drive yourself;


You always experiment. Sometimes even the above-mentioned workmanlike sound may turn out differently than expected causing someone to re-think their arrangement. I should say that I am limited in my knowledge of certain Zebra techniques (like the comb filters, or the modulation mixer), which forces me to make a different kind of space for Zebra than I had originally conceived. Zebra can create a sound to fit nearly any mix. It just may not be the best tool for every job.



DANIELE said:


> You listen to nature, city sounds, noises and all the sounds around you and you try to pick something interesting trying to reproduce it with Zebra;


This is a very interesting way of a) developing synthesis skills or b) preparing a sound-world but (to me) begins in a different category from using Zebra in an actual piece. I tend to do the sound-world-building before the writing and arranging. (One of Han's tips!) One can make a rough analogy to a fiction writer who is writing a fantasy novel. You first do the world building, then you write a story which embodies that world, but you might change the world because your characters might nudge you into a slightly different understanding than you initially conceived? Same with sound design.

The U-He guys have excellent examples of the some of the basics (thumps, rumbles, wind, etc.) and you can explore from there. Generally, sound is shaped by envelopes and lfos. Those environmental sounds you refer to will usually require a knowledge of Zebra's MSEG envelopes. Also some of these sounds may involve using Zebra along with other tools.



DANIELE said:


> You "steal" the sound from a track you like;


My favorite. So easy to do. There are many excellent commercial sound banks which cover the important styles. So I would start there for these sounds. Also Howard and others have created a lot of these in the factory presets.



DANIELE said:


> You start completely random and see what happens.


I love this category, but in an interesting contradiction, this category doesn't exist. You are always taking your imagination to the synthesizer. Sometimes I make sound with my mouth or body, to understand the shape and feeling of it before trying to discover it's counterpart in the synth. And sure, sometimes I start with much much less. Just a vague notion of experimenting.

But that is also a notion. It is not possible to start without any intention. The "init" patch is the most powerful patch. It's the biggest doorway. Everything appears possible but we approach it with our own taste and intention. The most exciting intention to me, is when Zebra (the synth) tells me something about who I am, and what I like. That is a journey of self discovery through sound, right? Zebra is the mirror. Zebra can make sounds, but it is up to us to make meaning from those sounds.

Hoping this helps you. All the best,

Jerry


----------



## DANIELE

Thank you for the answer Jerry, I loved to read it. I also do a mixture of the "techniques" I listed but I think the real difference lies between the n.1 and the others.

I'm an hobbyst too and from my experience we don't create anything from scratch. Everything we do is inspired by something, even something subconscious that in some way influence our choices and our feelings.

The really incredible thing I found out is that everything could inspire you but you have to shape and train your brain about how to translate what you feel in some sound.


----------



## DANIELE

I managed to build my first sub low pulse, I love the workflow even if I already found something I'd like to see improved but I still have a lot to learn before looking at this.

I also found *this* precious surce of material to study, very very interesting.


----------



## Bee_Abney

DANIELE said:


> I managed to build my first sub low pulse, I love the workflow even if I already found something I'd like to see improved but I still have a lot to learn before looking at this.
> 
> I also found *this* precious surce of material to study, very very interesting.


Groovy.


----------



## KEM

There’s also a new version of ZebraHZ that was developed for Dune, all I know is that it has extra resonators but that’s it, I don’t think there’s any other info on it unless I’m just forgetting


----------



## shadowsoflight

KEM said:


> There’s also a new version of ZebraHZ that was developed for Dune, all I know is that it has extra resonators but that’s it, I don’t think there’s any other info on it unless I’m just forgetting



From the website:

ZebraHZ history
ZebraHZ 2.9.2 (revision 10374)

ZebraHZ 2.9.2 offers NKS support and we increased the number of Comb filter modules from 2 to 4 and Resonators from 1 to 3.

Edit: I assume this version reflects the changes required for Dune, but could be mistaken.


----------



## KEM

shadowsoflight said:


> From the website:
> 
> ZebraHZ history
> ZebraHZ 2.9.2 (revision 10374)
> 
> ZebraHZ 2.9.2 offers NKS support and we increased the number of Comb filter modules from 2 to 4 and Resonators from 1 to 3.
> 
> Edit: I assume this version reflects the changes required for Dune, but could be mistaken.



I actually don’t think the Dune version is available yet!!


----------



## shadowsoflight

KEM said:


> I actually don’t think the Dune version is available yet!!



My bad - this is an example where I am quite happy to have been wrong 😆


----------



## KEM

shadowsoflight said:


> My bad - this is an example where I am quite happy to have been wrong 😆



Hans did say they’d do a Dune soundset after the second movie…


----------



## Tusker

I am grateful for this thread because it directed my attention back to Zebra HZ. What a fantastic synth!! I would like more resonator bands myself, so I have been using a reaktor filterbank in the effects chain of my DAW in conjunction with a Zebra front-end. That’s a bit kludgy. Hopefully, future versions of Zebra will enable us to do it all inside this marvelous synth.


----------



## DANIELE

Tusker said:


> I am grateful for this thread because it directed my attention back to Zebra HZ. What a fantastic synth!! I would like more resonator bands myself, so I have been using a reaktor filterbank in the effects chain of my DAW in conjunction with a Zebra front-end. That’s a bit kludgy. Hopefully, future versions of Zebra will enable us to do it all inside this marvelous synth.


A very useful thread indeed. About the resonator, could I use them to get a formant (using it like a bunch of band pass filters on the right frequencies)? I'm studying a little bit of advanced synthesis in my free time but I have to understand many things.
A resonator is a sort of multi-filter (four filters in parallel) if I understand correctly, but how to use it is another thing.


----------



## DANIELE

KEM said:


> Hans did say they’d do a Dune soundset after the second movie…


About this I'm looking at the @R. Naroth Dune pack. He did a really good job, now this is the level I want to reach.


----------



## KEM

DANIELE said:


> About this I'm looking at the @R. Naroth Dune pack. He did a really good job, now this is the level I want to reach.



He did an incredible job!! More than I could ever do, already thinking about hiring him when I’m doing blockbusters


----------



## DANIELE

KEM said:


> He did an incredible job!! More than I could ever do, already thinking about hiring him when I’m doing blockbusters


I love how he replaced the cellos and the voices with pure synthesis, I'm studying that patches. He was also very kind to share them with us.


----------



## Bee_Abney

KEM said:


> He did an incredible job!! More than I could ever do, already thinking about hiring him when I’m doing blockbusters


I neither laughed nor smirked. Any cackling was entirely coincidental. 

Bonne chance!


----------



## Tusker

DANIELE said:


> About the resonator, could I use them to get a formant (using it like a bunch of band pass filters on the right frequencies)?


Yes indeed! Here is Elhardt's demonstration of the Polymoog resonator section, which the Zebra HZ resonator is based on ...




People look for at least 3 bands to get usable vocal formants. Simulating a violin or other acoustic instrument accurately may take more. But you could also use a resonator to fine tune an imagined instrument's personality. I have used other resonators but the Zebra/Polymoog approach is new to me. One could also repurpose a graphic eq from your daw of course but it's helpful to have your tools in the same toolbox.


----------



## Pier

DANIELE said:


> A resonator is a sort of multi-filter (four filters in parallel) if I understand correctly, but how to use it is another thing.


Each band is a bandpass filter with some feedback. The idea of resonators is to simulate acoustic environments (eg: the body of a guitar) where certain frequencies keep ringing due to the physical properties of the space, material, etc.

There was a small thread discussing this:






Can we talk about resonators and their uses? Especially the Zebra HZ resonator.


Have you ever had a tool which you know is super cool, but you still don't know how to use it? I feel that way with the resonator in Zebra HZ. I guess, I understand that it's four filter bands which you can customize and modulate. I guess that you could use it to dial in precise bass...




vi-control.net


----------



## KEM

DANIELE said:


> I love how he replaced the cellos and the voices with pure synthesis, I'm studying that patches. He was also very kind to share them with us.





Bee_Abney said:


> I neither laughed nor smirked. Any cackling was entirely coincidental.
> 
> Bonne chance!



I don’t know about you guys but I think @R. Naroth and I could do some great work together!! I just hope he doesn’t take it personal when I add +12db of hard clipping to his sounds


----------



## Pier

KEM said:


> I just hope he doesn’t take it personal when I add +12db of hard clipping to his sounds


----------



## KEM

Pier said:


>



Oh and that’s AFTER I run them through 3 instances of OTT


----------



## Pier

KEM said:


> Oh and that’s AFTER I run them through 3 instances of OTT


If you like that kind of thing you should take a look at Vital.

It has a multiband compressor/expander built-in, pretty much copied from the one in Ableton.


----------



## KEM

Pier said:


> If you like that kind of thing you should take a look at Vital.
> 
> It has a multiband compressor/expander built-in, pretty much copied from the one in Ableton.



I have the free version downloaded I just haven’t used it yet, I’ve only heard great things though so I will for sure!! Right now I just use the OTT plugin, and Slate just released their own version which has even more features


----------



## DANIELE

Tusker said:


> Yes indeed! Here is Elhardt's demonstration of the Polymoog resonator section, which the Zebra HZ resonator is based on ...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> People look for at least 3 bands to get usable vocal formants. Simulating a violin or other acoustic instrument accurately may take more. But you could also use a resonator to fine tune an imagined instrument's personality. I have used other resonators but the Zebra/Polymoog approach is new to me. One could also repurpose a graphic eq from your daw of course but it's helpful to have your tools in the same toolbox.





Pier said:


> Each band is a bandpass filter with some feedback. The idea of resonators is to simulate acoustic environments (eg: the body of a guitar) where certain frequencies keep ringing due to the physical properties of the space, material, etc.
> 
> There was a small thread discussing this:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can we talk about resonators and their uses? Especially the Zebra HZ resonator.
> 
> 
> Have you ever had a tool which you know is super cool, but you still don't know how to use it? I feel that way with the resonator in Zebra HZ. I guess, I understand that it's four filter bands which you can customize and modulate. I guess that you could use it to dial in precise bass...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vi-control.net



Thank you both, I will look at them, I was looking about how to replicate formants since I'd like to replicate a cello (without looking at R.Naroth preset for now) and maybe some brass. The only thing I'd like is to see frequencies in the F bars instead of percents, it would be more intuitive to set specific central frequencies for the band pass filters.


----------



## Pier

DANIELE said:


> Thank you both, I will look at them, I was looking about how to replicate formants since I'd like to replicate a cello (without looking at R.Naroth preset for now) and maybe some brass. The only thing I'd like is to see frequencies in the F bars instead of percents, it would be more intuitive to set specific central frequencies for the band pass filters.


If you're into replicating acoustic instruments with Zebra you should take a look at the Zebra Orchestra:






Corin Neff - The Zebra Orchestra


Buy The Zebra Orchestra here




esgalachoir.wixsite.com





And this trumpet modeling:






Physical Modelling Trumpet in Zebra2


Hey guys, here's a trumpet patch I've been working on. Hope you enjoy it! I would love some feedback! P.S. I took some inspiration from the Eugene Latsko trombone-patch, mostly on the reverb. Shout-out to him for making that great sounding patch!




vi-control.net


----------



## kgdrum

@Pier 
+1 
Corin Neff’s Zebra Orchestra is astounding! 
I haven’t purchased this masterpiece yet but one of these days I certainly will.






Corin Neff - The Zebra Orchestra


Buy The Zebra Orchestra here




esgalachoir.wixsite.com


----------



## R. Naroth

KEM said:


> I don’t know about you guys but I think @R. Naroth and I could do some great work together!! I just hope he doesn’t take it personal when I add +12db of hard clipping to his sounds


Thanks @KEM and @DANIELE for your kind words, really glad the patches are helpful. I am new to sound synthesis in general, so please do take the ideas in my patches with a grain of salt. It is all a lot of late nights of endless tweaks and a good amount of luck. Apart from the ZebraHZ sound set, the best ones to study are those by Howard Scarr and @TheUnfinished (at least those are the one's I own).

@KEM Would love to hear what they sound like after your OTT magic has been applied.

Daniele, To duplicate real instruments, having a reference audio really helps to nail down the exact resonance and modulations.


----------



## KEM

R. Naroth said:


> Thanks @KEM and @DANIELE for your kind words, really glad the patches are helpful. I am new to sound synthesis in general, so please do take the ideas in my patches with a grain of salt. It is all a lot of late nights of endless tweaks and a good amount of luck. Apart from the ZebraHZ sound set, the best ones to study are those by Howard Scarr and @TheUnfinished (at least those are the one's I own).
> 
> @KEM Would love to hear what they sound like after your OTT magic has been applied.
> 
> Daniele, To duplicate real instruments, having a reference audio really helps to nail down the exact resonance and modulations.



I’ll get on that later today!! I’ll do some of my classic KEM processing and post the before and after


----------



## DANIELE

Pier said:


> If you're into replicating acoustic instruments with Zebra you should take a look at the Zebra Orchestra:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Corin Neff - The Zebra Orchestra
> 
> 
> Buy The Zebra Orchestra here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> esgalachoir.wixsite.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And this trumpet modeling:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Physical Modelling Trumpet in Zebra2
> 
> 
> Hey guys, here's a trumpet patch I've been working on. Hope you enjoy it! I would love some feedback! P.S. I took some inspiration from the Eugene Latsko trombone-patch, mostly on the reverb. Shout-out to him for making that great sounding patch!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vi-control.net





R. Naroth said:


> Thanks @KEM and @DANIELE for your kind words, really glad the patches are helpful. I am new to sound synthesis in general, so please do take the ideas in my patches with a grain of salt. It is all a lot of late nights of endless tweaks and a good amount of luck. Apart from the ZebraHZ sound set, the best ones to study are those by Howard Scarr and @TheUnfinished (at least those are the one's I own).
> 
> @KEM Would love to hear what they sound like after your OTT magic has been applied.
> 
> Daniele, To duplicate real instruments, having a reference audio really helps to nail down the exact resonance and modulations.



I don't want to replicate exactly the instruments in the first place but I'd like to try to just to learn how can I create organic pads (similar to strings) and maybe some short notes to give more power to the orchestra. Then maybe, once I have some experience with Zebra, I can try to replicate real instruments.

Your advices are really precious and that Zebra Orchestra is amazing. Can I use it with Dark Zebra too? I'm playing with it actually.

@R. Naroth if you are new to sound synthesis I'm Santa Claus (Oh oh oh ooh!!). Actually I'm doing some interesting things but pretty far from what you have done there.


----------



## Pier

DANIELE said:


> Your advices are really precious and that Zebra Orchestra is amazing. Can I use it with Dark Zebra too? I'm playing with it actually.


You can open the presets from regular Zebra into ZebraHZ but it will complain the presets were created in a different version.


----------



## KEM

Pier said:


> You can open the presets from regular Zebra into ZebraHZ but it will complain the presets were created in a different version.



AND WHOS FAULT IS THAT PIER?!?!


----------



## DANIELE

I have a question for everyone that can answer me.

How do you choose the sound generator when you are looking for building a certain patch. For example, what OSC should I use if I want to build a vocal sort of synth? And what if I want to build a string sound?


----------



## DANIELE

Pier said:


> You can open the presets from regular Zebra into ZebraHZ but it will complain the presets were created in a different version.


I tried now but it didn't tell me anything.


----------



## KEM

DANIELE said:


> I have a question for everyone that can answer me.
> 
> How do you choose the sound generator when you are looking for building a certain patch. For example, what OSC should I use if I want to build a vocal sort of synth? And what if I want to build a string sound?



Honestly you can do a lot with just basic saw waves, looking through the ZebraHZ presets you’ll see almost all of them have a saw as the starting point, you can experiment all you want but the saw can do more than you might think!


----------



## Pier

KEM said:


> AND WHOS FAULT IS THAT PIER?!?!


PBKAC 😂


----------



## Bee_Abney

Pier said:


> You can open the presets from regular Zebra into ZebraHZ but it will complain the presets were created in a different version.


I have actually never used the regular Zebra. Am I missing out on anything? It's just, you know, the other one is _dark_!! (So GOTH!)


----------



## Pier

DANIELE said:


> what OSC should I use if I want to build a vocal sort of synth? And what if I want to build a string sound?


For a vocal thing I'd try maybe looking for a wavetable and then using the format filter. Look at the HS Zebra preset in the Bassics folder, or the HS Urs Zebra Speak in the root folder.

For strings probably a combination of saw waves, filters, and maybe the comb filter. I'm not really into replicating acoustic instruments myself, but I have a couple of presets that remind me of strings. If you want realistic results look into the Zebra orchestra or what @R. Naroth did for the Dune thing.


----------



## Pier

Bee_Abney said:


> I have actually never used the regular Zebra. Am I missing out on anything? It's just, you know, the other one is _dark_!! (So GOTH!)


My libraries are for regular Zebra just because I assume that's what most people have.

Also, I was really disappointed when I got ZebraHZ and the Diva filters were in mono. Makes sense of course, but I wish there was an option to enable stereo without having to use a mix module to divide the signal, add 2 VCFs, etc.


----------



## KEM

Pier said:


> My libraries are for regular Zebra just because I assume that's what most people have.
> 
> Also, I was really disappointed when I got ZebraHZ and the Diva filters were in mono. Makes sense of course, but I wish there was an option to enable stereo without having to use a mix module to divide the signal, add 2 VCFs, etc.



The original Zebra is just an inferior version of HZ, no reason to use it honestly. And I’m sure Hans had some reason for wanting them in mono


----------



## Pier

KEM said:


> And I’m sure Hans had some reason for wanting them in mono


The Diva filters are originally in mono because they are based on analog filters that themselves are in mono.



KEM said:


> The original Zebra is just an inferior version of HZ, no reason to use it honestly.


For myself I'd just use ZebraHZ, but not everyone that has Zebra has ZebraHZ.


----------



## Mikro93

KEM said:


> The original Zebra is just an inferior version of HZ, no reason to use it honestly.


I mean, I'm sure there must be some sort of value in a $200 soft synth, right?

This is me, debating whether to get Zebra with the little money I have left this year, it's so frustrating to read that


----------



## Bee_Abney

Pier said:


> The Diva filters are originally in mono because they are based on analog filters that themselves are in mono.
> 
> 
> For myself I'd just use ZebraHZ, but not everyone that has Zebra has ZebraHZ.


I agree, for commercial purposes, you want to at least have a Zebra2 only version; and given what you were doing it made sense to stick with that only.


----------



## Bee_Abney

Mikro93 said:


> I mean, I'm sure there must be some sort of value in a $200 soft synth, right?
> 
> This is me, debating whether to get Zebra with the little money I have left this year, it's so frustrating to read that


Keep an eye on license transfers and wait until you see a price that suits you and get both Zebra2 and ZebraHZ together for about the same money. That's what I did, anyway. It's not very sporting for poor old U-he, but my two U-he synths were both second hand.


----------



## Living Fossil

Mikro93 said:


> This is me, debating whether to get Zebra with the little money I have left this year, it's so frustrating to read that


It's a pointless statement, don't overthink it.
Zebra 2 is amazing, and lots of presets of Zebra HZ could be fully replicated in Zebra.
(in fact, when i first looked at ZebraHZ and also some Dark Zebra versions of soundsets from the Unfinished it was quite interesting to see how many presets don't use e.g. the Diva filters or the other extra features of it)
But of course, Zebra HZ is a great update. You can still add it later.


----------



## Pier

Mikro93 said:


> I mean, I'm sure there must be some sort of value in a $200 soft synth, right?
> 
> This is me, debating whether to get Zebra with the little money I have left this year, it's so frustrating to read that


Zebra 2 is amazing on its own.

If you're not convinced just listen to what pros do with it (The Unfinished, Sonic Underworld, etc).


----------



## KEM

Mikro93 said:


> I mean, I'm sure there must be some sort of value in a $200 soft synth, right?
> 
> This is me, debating whether to get Zebra with the little money I have left this year, it's so frustrating to read that



Of course you should still get it, it’s still a great synth, what I mean by it being inferior to ZebraHZ is that ZebraHZ only has more features, it has everything the regular Zebra has and more, so therefore it is superior to the original, but the original is still great


----------



## Mikro93

Bee_Abney said:


> It's not very sporting for poor old U-he


Basically, this my main concern, to be fair  As a future developper myself, I'm trying to find the balance between supporting another developper (by taking advantage of the survey coupon), or waiting until I can get a second hand license for cheapr, but no money to u-he.

Thanks everyone for your input, by the way! This thread has been a pleasure to read


----------



## Mikro93

liquidlino said:


> You shouldn't look at other developers like U-He as competition to denegrate or try to make their revenues lower etc.


Just to make it clear: I'd rather support the developper if I can, I don't mean to denigrate them, it's quite the opposite 

It's that money is tight at the moment, and my choice is between supporting the developpers, or save a tiny bit of money (by buying second hand) that I could need for myself.

Also, I doubt I would ever work in the same field as Urs or other players you've mentionned, but we never know


----------



## R. Naroth

@Mikro93 One more value add is the Zebrify effects plugin that comes free with Zebra. 

It is very easy to set up in a DAW that sends MIDI info to its effects plugins.. I believe Cubase does it. It is a pain to set it up in Logic pro.

See the picture below.. Everything is available. You can take any audio input and then apply Zebra's wonderful VCFs, make it gritty with Fold module, create great stereo separation using XMFs, apply a bit of organic evolving noise, compress it, eq it, apply distortion and add the delay/rev modules... You could even send it into its unique Comb modules and see what surprises await you.. It is a powerful sound design tool.

Also Zebra licensing is very friendly. It is licensed to a user and not a machine or an ilok/dongle. They trust you to do the right thing.


----------



## Bee_Abney

R. Naroth said:


> @Mikro93 One more value add is the Zebrify effects plugin that comes free with Zebra.
> 
> It is very easy to set up in a DAW that sends MIDI info to its effects plugins.. I believe Cubase does it. It is a pain to set it up in Logic pro.
> 
> See the picture below.. Everything is available. You can take any audio input and then apply Zebra's wonderful VCFs, make it gritty with Fold module, create great stereo separation using XMFs, apply a bit of organic evolving noise, compress it, eq it, apply distortion and add the delay/rev modules... You could even send it into its unique Comb modules and see what surprises await you.. It is a powerful sound design tool.
> 
> Also Zebra licensing is very friendly. It is licensed to a user and not a machine or an ilok/dongle. They trust you to do the right thing.


It works easily without any setting up in Studio One too.


----------



## Pier

Mikro93 said:


> Just to make it clear: I'd rather support the developper if I can, I don't mean to denigrate them, it's quite the opposite
> 
> It's that money is tight at the moment, and my choice is between supporting the developpers, or save a tiny bit of money (by buying second hand) that I could need for myself.
> 
> Also, I doubt I would ever work in the same field as Urs or other players you've mentionned, but we never know


Urs and U-He are perfectly OK with license transfers.

I'd bet this actually helps get more sales. Personally I have a hard time investing in a developer that doesn't allow transfers, or makes it expensive and complicated.


----------



## Pier

liquidlino said:


> Anyone can do it, it's just a case of devotion and application of time and effort. Serum was developed by one guy on his own, having never coded a synth before. He seems to pretty much run the company single handed as well, replying to support queries himself! (Duda).


Urs from U-He was on his own for years.

BTW Duda did most of the work for Serum but did use help from other people. In an interview he told the story of how Serum came into existence, and if I remember correctly he outsourced the filters.

I think it was this interview, but I'm not certain:


----------



## proxima

R. Naroth said:


> @Mikro93 One more value add is the Zebrify effects plugin that comes free with Zebra.
> 
> It is very easy to set up in a DAW that sends MIDI info to its effects plugins.. I believe Cubase does it. It is a pain to set it up in Logic pro.
> 
> See the picture below.. Everything is available. You can take any audio input and then apply Zebra's wonderful VCFs, make it gritty with Fold module, create great stereo separation using XMFs, apply a bit of organic evolving noise, compress it, eq it, apply distortion and add the delay/rev modules... You could even send it into its unique Comb modules and see what surprises await you.. It is a powerful sound design tool.
> 
> Also Zebra licensing is very friendly. It is licensed to a user and not a machine or an ilok/dongle. They trust you to do the right thing.


Zebrify does seem underappreciated, and the presets are a lot of fun.

As for using it in Logic with midi events, I was curious if there was a best way. This thread details two ways. Side chaining (the second method) is a little awkward, but it's not too much of a pain.


----------



## Living Fossil

liquidlino said:


> If you listen to the timbre of real life instruments, they have a mix of harmonics that are in and out of series with the root note. Often the difference between a "soft" sound and a "hard" sound, say a string being played pp vs fff is that more harmonics are being added, both in and out of series, and the relative volumes of each harmonic changes.


That's wrong information.
"harmonics" in acoustics always means whole-number multiples of the root frequency.
In a saw all are present, with descending volume (partial 1 = root note, p2 = octave, p3= perfect twelfth, p4 = doubleoctave etc.)
In a square, you have only even numbered partials (1, 3, 5, 7)

Most additive synths (Zebra too) rely on the harmonic series (i.e. whole number multiples)

Inharmonic or anharmonic spectrums can be found in bells etc. 
that's the reason why fm synthesis can handle them so well. 
Also, Frequency shifters can turn harmonic spectrums into non-harmonic ones.
Ringmodulation can add inharmonic spectral content.

But loud instruments just have lots of harmonic content.
A funny thing is that often people who pretend to be fond of "pure tuning" call the distorted electric guitar "unharmonic". It's funny, because distortion creates harmonic overtones _en masse_. 

(you could have a look at wikipedia regarding these topics, usually they can provide you with the basic infos: *








Overtone - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org




*


----------



## Living Fossil

liquidlino said:


> Not sure why you chose to disagree with me and say it was wrong info... and then go on to say all the same stuff. Glad we agree.


you say: "they are *out of series*. 

Which is wrong. 
They are just higher numbered *inside *of the series. 

(I hope this makes it clear)


----------



## Pier

Living Fossil said:


> That's wrong information.
> "harmonics" in acoustics always means whole-number multiples of the root frequency.
> In a saw all are present, with descending volume (partial 1 = root note, p2 = octave, p3= perfect twelfth, p4 = doubleoctave etc.)
> In a square, you have only even numbered partials (1, 3, 5, 7)
> 
> Most additive synths (Zebra too) rely on the harmonic series (i.e. whole number multiples)
> 
> Inharmonic or anharmonic spectrums can be found in bells etc.
> that's the reason why fm synthesis can handle them so well.
> Also, Frequency shifters can turn harmonic spectrums into non-harmonic ones.
> Ringmodulation can add inharmonic spectral content.
> 
> But loud instruments just have lots of harmonic content.
> A funny thing is that often people who pretend to be fond of "pure tuning" call the distorted electric guitar "unharmonic". It's funny, because distortion creates harmonic overtones _en masse_.
> 
> (you could have a look at wikipedia regarding these topics, usually they can provide you with the basic infos: *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Overtone - Wikipedia
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> en.wikipedia.org
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *


I confused harmonics with overtones for years!


----------



## Living Fossil

Pier said:


> I confused harmonics with overtones for years!


Well, basically it's just that harmonic/partial 2 equals overtone 1.
It's much easier to work with partials, since it makes correlations easier to see.

e.g. partials 3-6-12-24 from a root note C are: g-g-g-g
partials 5-10-20 are: e-e-e
partial 15 equals partial 3 from partial 2 or partial 2 from partial 3 (which would be b)


----------



## DANIELE

liquidlino said:


> Daniele if you haven't read it, I highly highly recommend the Sound on Sound series of synthesis fundamentals that teaches all this in digestable weekly tutorials, it's free to download or see online at: https://www.soundonsound.com/series/synth-secrets
> 
> In terms of what I said above, the tutorial about synthesising a Timpani is very interesting, as it covers how the harmonics and changes to the harmonics volumes over time is analysed in a spectral analyser.


Thank you, I already posted the same link a few posts above. I already found that guide, so great and so much informations.


----------



## DANIELE

Is there any table/guide with a list of basic formant to reproduce the resonance of various instruments?

I tried to follow the SOS guide about formant synthesis to reproduce a vocal "ee" but I still didn't managed to get it. I used a resonator in band pass filter mode trying to get the first 3 central frequencies adviced on that guide but it doesn't sound like an "ee". Should I use VCFs?

Should I use spectromorph mode to directly draw in the frequencies of a specific body? About this I'd like to have values on the axis in the wave editor.

I'm having a lot of fun with Zebra anyway, I already managed to build some interesting sounds, let's say "easy-medium difficult" ones. I'm not a fan of arpeggiators because I love to build the single hits to write them in the midi editor as I like. I'd like also to have more than two noise generators.


----------



## Mikro93

Okay everyone, you won, for this time.






(by the way, @R. Naroth you're responsible for the purchase of DZ, thank you very much)

Now back to music making.


----------



## Bee_Abney

Mikro93 said:


> Okay everyone, you won, for this time.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now back to music making.


Load up a sequenced preset, play E A E A B E. Job done. On to the next piece.


----------



## Mikro93

Bee_Abney said:


> Load up a sequenced preset, play E A E A B E. Job done. On to the next piece.


----------



## Bee_Abney

Mikro93 said:


>



It always works!

Plus, I'm honoured and grateful to be included in the name of your composition (don't forget to pursue any copyright infringements on YouTube with maximum rigour).


----------



## D Halgren

DANIELE said:


> Is there any table/guide with a list of basic formant to reproduce the resonance of various instruments?
> 
> I tried to follow the SOS guide about formant synthesis to reproduce a vocal "ee" but I still didn't managed to get it. I used a resonator in band pass filter mode trying to get the first 3 central frequencies adviced on that guide but it doesn't sound like an "ee". Should I use VCFs?
> 
> Should I use spectromorph mode to directly draw in the frequencies of a specific body? About this I'd like to have values on the axis in the wave editor.
> 
> I'm having a lot of fun with Zebra anyway, I already managed to build some interesting sounds, let's say "easy-medium difficult" ones. I'm not a fan of arpeggiators because I love to build the single hits to write them in the midi editor as I like. I'd like also to have more than two noise generators.


http://www.synthesizer-cookbook.com/id13.html


----------



## Bee_Abney

D Halgren said:


> http://www.synthesizer-cookbook.com/id13.html


Brilliant!


----------



## DANIELE

D Halgren said:


> http://www.synthesizer-cookbook.com/id13.html


Great, is there a way to buy it as an eBook?


----------



## Pier

DANIELE said:


> I'd like also to have more than two noise generators.


You could use a single noise source and split it. Either use the mix module, or right click on modules to use the input from a different lane.

I'm on mobile, but let me know if it's not clear and I'll send a patch.


----------



## D Halgren

DANIELE said:


> Great, is there a way to buy it as an eBook?


Doesn't look like it, but maybe if you look around on the web 🤷‍♂️


----------



## DANIELE

Pier said:


> You could use a single noise source and split it. Either use the mix module, or right click on modules to use the input from a different lane.
> 
> I'm on mobile, but let me know if it's not clear and I'll send a patch.


I'm into the routing process but if I want to split the source I still can only work on one source if I want to edit it, another thing is if I want to input the source in two different filters for example. You are talking about the second thing, am I right?


----------



## Pier

DANIELE said:


> You are talking about the second thing, am I right?


Yes. A single source, processed in different ways.

Another trick you could use to get a source with complex overtones (almost getting into noise territory) would be to use oscillator effects. See the "Blech" oscillator thread for an example:






Howie’s “Blech” oscillator waveform


In a recent post, HZ mentioned Howie’s “Blech” oscillator waveform. I am unable to find a patch or an oscillator preset within Zebra or Zebra HZ. Does anyone know what is this in reference to?




vi-control.net


----------



## DANIELE

Pier said:


> Yes. A single source, processed in different ways.
> 
> Another trick you could use to get a source with complex overtones (almost getting into noise territory) would be to use oscillator effects. See the "Blech" oscillator thread for an example:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Howie’s “Blech” oscillator waveform
> 
> 
> In a recent post, HZ mentioned Howie’s “Blech” oscillator waveform. I am unable to find a patch or an oscillator preset within Zebra or Zebra HZ. Does anyone know what is this in reference to?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vi-control.net


Ok, I'll try. Already downloaded the blech osc too.


----------



## Mikro93

I played with Zebra for three hours. It's a beast.

I'm at page 41 out of 113. Very gratifying


----------



## DANIELE

Mikro93 said:


> I played with Zebra for three hours. It's a beast.
> 
> I'm at page 41 out of 113. Very gratifying


Of the manual?

I'm reading it too but I need to study some synthesis aspects to understand all the things it explains.


----------



## Mikro93

DANIELE said:


> Of the manual


Yes!



DANIELE said:


> I'm reading it too but I need to study some synthesis aspects to understand all the things it explains.


Same here. The part about OSC FX is particularly gnarly. I recommend an oscilloscope


----------



## DANIELE

Mikro93 said:


> Same here. The part about OSC FX is particularly gnarly. I recommend an oscilloscope


I was referring exactly to that part. Some kind of telepathy is taking place here.


----------



## KEM

You guys read manuals…?


----------



## DANIELE

KEM said:


> You guys read manuals…?


I usually read the manuals of complex and deep things (music libraries or VSTs about this specific argument). Ideally I would not read a Spitfire manual but I would read SM Strings manual, because the second one is very deep and it requires to know the sectrets to use it a its maximum potential.

PLUS Hans told me RTFM and told me about Howard's blood!! So I cannot avoid reading it!!


----------



## doctoremmet

KEM said:


> You guys read manuals…?


You mean you haven’t downloaded Howard Scarr’s Bazille Cookbook yet and religiously tried to fathom the wisdom displayed therein?


----------



## Mikro93

@KEM I usually don't, but I feel like we got a good incentive to do so... :D



Rctec said:


> Dear Daniele, May I be so bold and say quite simply and succinctly:
> 
> RTFM!
> 
> ….sometimes composers helping composers is as simple as that.
> Personally, I’ve never read the damn thing, but I know that the esteemed Howard Scarr has spilt his life’s blood in those pages, filling them with all you could ever want to ask, know, question, illuminate, discover - etc.,etc.


----------



## KEM

DANIELE said:


> I usually read the manuals of complex and deep things (music libraries or VSTs about this specific argument). Ideally I would not read a Spitfire manual but I would read SM Strings manual, because the second one is very deep and it requires to know the sectrets to use it a its maximum potential.
> 
> PLUS Hans told me RTFM and told me about Howard blood!! So I cannot avoid reading it!!





doctoremmet said:


> You mean you haven’t downloaded Howard Scarr’s Bazille Cookbook yet and religiously tried to fathom the wisdom displayes therein?





Mikro93 said:


> @KEM I usually don't, but I feel like we got a good incentive to do so... :D



Alright alright you got me, I’ll read it


----------



## doctoremmet

Atta boy.


----------



## KEM

doctoremmet said:


> Atta boy.



Downloading it right now, also I didn’t know The Netherlands is as small as it is, I live in a state no one cares about and I just recently discovered it’s almost 5 times as big as The Netherlands


----------



## doctoremmet

KEM said:


> Downloading it right now, also I didn’t know The Netherlands is as small as it is, I live in a state no one cares about and I just recently discovered it’s almost 5 times as big as The Netherlands


Really tiny country. Lots of it beneath sea level, and gained land. We have a bright future ahead of us haha. Fun fact: my math and science teacher used to be in a band (Weekend At Waikiki). They recorded two albums in the 1980s and toured those. Their producer was one of the few (if not the only one) Dutch people who owned a Fairlight. But wait… that guitarist who also could play drums on those band posters in science class looks kind of familiar… who could he be?


----------



## KEM

doctoremmet said:


> Really tiny country. Lots of it beneath sea level, and gained land. We have a bright future ahead of us haha. Fun fact: my math and science teacher used to be in a band (Weekend At Waikiki). They recorded two albums in the 1980s and toured those. Their producer was one of the few (if not the only one) Dutch people who owned a Fairlight. But wait… that guitarist who also could play drums on those band posters in science class looks kind of familiar… who could he be?



Probably someone before my time, but my parents might know who lol


----------



## doctoremmet

On the left: my science teacher mister Klaas Pen. He taught me math, science, brought his little DX21 and DX100 synths to school to create cool waveforms on the oscilloscope in an excellent attempt to describe interference. And I also ran into him when I went to the seminal 1988 Groningen concert of Ramones.

But who is that mystery guitarist?


----------



## doctoremmet

Dude, you should put this in your resume. Hobbies: “huge Weekend at Waikiki fan”

Thank me later


----------



## KEM

doctoremmet said:


> On the left: my science teacher mister Klaas Pen. He taught me math, science, brought his little DX21 and DX100 synths to school to create cool waveforms on the oscilloscope in an excellent attempt to describe interference. And I also ran into him when I went to the seminal 1988 Groningen concert of Ramones.
> 
> But who is that mystery guitarist?



Is that… Junkie?!


----------



## doctoremmet




----------



## KEM

Junkie just oozes cool, dudes in his 50s rocking Gucci sneakers and Palm Angels jackets, that’s gonna be me one day as well


----------



## Bee_Abney

doctoremmet said:


>



Needs more guitars.


----------



## Bee_Abney

KEM said:


> Junkie just oozes cool, dudes in his 50s rocking Gucci sneakers and Palm Angels jackets, that’s gonna be me one day as well


I don't know what those things are, but I doubt my fortunes are going to change that much in the next couple of years! Good luck with that. 

(Bespoke is the only way to go.)


----------



## doctoremmet

Bee_Abney said:


> Needs more guitars.


This is just one of those “hey wanna play in our bi-annual reunion gig? I hear Tom’s in the neighbourhood too- and all ex-members turn up” kinda moments.


----------



## doctoremmet

But I think it is really cool he shows up and has fun with the guys of his very first band. I don’t know mister Holkenborg but I have the feeling he is one of the nicest guys in the industry.


----------



## doctoremmet

And he used to work with mister Zimmer who happens to use Zebra. Annnnnd we’re on topic.


----------



## KEM

doctoremmet said:


> But I think it is really cool he shows up and has fun with the guys of his very first band. I don’t know mister Holkenborg but I have the feeling he is one of the nicest guys in the industry.



He probably grew up right down the street from you!! I mean considering the size of The Netherlands it might be plausible


----------



## KEM

doctoremmet said:


> And he used to work with mister Zimmer who happens to use Zebra. Annnnnd we’re on topic.



Junkie also uses Zebra


----------



## doctoremmet

KEM said:


> He probably grew up right down the street from you!! I mean considering the size of The Netherlands it might be plausible


Says every Dutch person about every other Dutch person. If you drive 80mph you’ll need three hours to drive from where I live (Groningen “way” up north) to the southern border. Enter Belgium haha. One hour in you will drive past Zwolle, which is close to where Tom grew up.


----------



## Bee_Abney

KEM said:


> He probably grew up right down the street from you!! I mean considering the size of The Netherlands it might be plausible


I can't speak for the Netherlands, but in Europe generally a small physical distance can mean a completely different world.


----------



## KEM

Bee_Abney said:


> I can't speak for the Netherlands, but in Europe generally a small physical distance can mean a completely different world.



Sure sounds like it!! So much amazing history and cultures, would love to go all over Europe some day (Scandinavia is at the top of the list)

I live in the murder capital of the entire US, so it’s best to stay inside all day and mess around with Zebra lol


----------



## Bee_Abney

KEM said:


> Sure sounds like it!! So much amazing history and cultures, would love to go all over Europe some day (Scandinavia is at the top of the list)
> 
> I live in the murder capital of the entire US, so it’s best to stay inside all day and mess around with Zebra lol


Are there many murders connected to noise complaints? I hope you have a good pair of headphones!


----------



## KEM

Bee_Abney said:


> Are there many murders connected to noise complaints? I hope you have a good pair of headphones!



The only noise complaints I get are from my parents right above me when I’m blasting music in the basement at 2am


----------



## Pier

doctoremmet said:


> On the left: my science teacher mister Klaas Pen. He taught me math, science, brought his little DX21 and DX100 synths to school to create cool waveforms on the oscilloscope in an excellent attempt to describe interference. And I also ran into him when I went to the seminal 1988 Groningen concert of Ramones.
> 
> But who is that mystery guitarist?


Woah what a story!!!

Man now you should be able to get that intern position to Kenneth 😂


----------



## Pier

Bee_Abney said:


> I can't speak for the Netherlands, but in Europe generally a small physical distance can mean a completely different world.


Exactly.

I'm from Spain but living in Mexico. Here distances are huge. You can drive for 12 hours and still be in the same country. It's crazy.


----------



## Bee_Abney

liquidlino said:


> Try here in Australia. Can drive 24 hours and still be in the same state, let alone country. Or Sydney where you can drive for infinity and just about get to the next suburb.


Oh, well, measured in time, in London you could be 'driving' several days just to pull out of the car park.


----------



## Bee_Abney

liquidlino said:


> Well I'm London born and bred. Whilst the traffic is heavier in London, it flows more freely. In Sydney they've decided that traffic lights every 100m is a great idea, even on major arterial roads. So you spend most journey time stationary at lights.


Well, I'll take your word for it on the flow in London. I've only been in a car as a visitor, so I might have missed the flow. But Sydney sounds like a nightmare.


----------



## KEM

Is Batman Begins Zebra? I know The Dark Knight and Rises are but I’ve never really been able to find out much info on the creation of Batman Begins music


----------



## Bee_Abney

KEM said:


> Is Batman Begins Zebra? I know The Dark Knight and Rises are but I’ve never really been able to find out much info on the creation of Batman Begins music


Don't some of the Dark Zebra presets feature in Batman Begins?


----------



## Mikro93

Bee_Abney said:


> Don't some of the Dark Zebra presets feature in Batman Begins?


Batman Begins came out in 2005. Zebra came out in 2003, Zebra 2 in 2006. So, no :D


----------



## Bee_Abney

Mikro93 said:


> Batman Begins came out in 2005. Zebra came out in 2003, Zebra 2 in 2006. So, no :D


Sorry about that!

Gosh, Zebra2 has only been out five minutes and people are already waiting for the sequel!


----------



## Mikro93

Bee_Abney said:


> Sorry about that!
> 
> Gosh, Zebra2 has only been out five minutes and people are already waiting for the sequel!


I know, right? Imagine if people were pushing Apple to speed up their process and release a new iPhone every 15 years? Geez, peeps, calm down


----------



## KEM

Mikro93 said:


> Batman Begins came out in 2005. Zebra came out in 2003, Zebra 2 in 2006. So, no :D



Yeah this is exactly why I’m curious about it, Batman Begins started development in 2003 so Zebra would’ve been brand new whenever Hans started working on the film, I know before Zebra he was mainly using Virus but that time period is a bit gray concerning that transition (as far as I know at least), but given the consistent sonic landscape across the trilogy it’d make since that he was also using Zebra and continued on with 2 for TDK and Rises, hopefully someone has an answer or maybe he can answer that as well


----------



## doctoremmet

Happy to report I caved and bought Dark Zebra. I will likely be more absent from the forum from now on. See you next year.


----------



## Mikro93

doctoremmet said:


> Happy to report I caved and bought Dark Zebra. I will likely be more absent from the forum from now on. See you next year.


HA! The little shoulder demon did his job!

I finished reading the manual yesterday for Zebra and started making music this morning, I wish you the same fun I'm having!


----------



## doctoremmet

Did your shoulder demon have a little guitar strapped on, annoyingly playing metal riffs in drop D?


----------



## Mikro93

doctoremmet said:


> Did your shoulder demon have a little guitar strapped on, annoyingly playing metal riffs in drop D?


I mean, are there other kinds of shoulder demons?


----------



## doctoremmet

Mikro93 said:


> I mean, are there other kinds of shoulder demons?


So there is like an entire army of Kenneth demons out there?


----------



## gussunkri

KEM said:


> Yeah this is exactly why I’m curious about it, Batman Begins started development in 2003 so Zebra would’ve been brand new whenever Hans started working on the film, I know before Zebra he was mainly using Virus but that time period is a bit gray concerning that transition (as far as I know at least), but given the consistent sonic landscape across the trilogy it’d make since that he was also using Zebra and continued on with 2 for TDK and Rises, hopefully someone has an answer or maybe he can answer that as well


As I recall, there are presets in DZ named to suggest that they are Zebra recreations of Virus sounds. Isn’t there a preset called something like “Batman begins virus”? I would guess that Howie was given the task to recreate Virus sounds on Zebra for consistency reasons. I also believe Howie made many of the Virus presets before joining U-He.


----------



## doctoremmet

gussunkri said:


> As I recall, there are presets in DZ named to suggest that they are Zebra recreations of Virus sounds. Isn’t there a preset called something like “Batman begins virus”? I would guess that Howie was given the task to recreate Virus sounds on Zebra for consistency reasons. I also believe Howie made many of the Virus presets before joining U-He.


----------



## Bee_Abney

doctoremmet said:


> Happy to report I caved and bought Dark Zebra. I will likely be more absent from the forum from now on. See you next year.


You poor, poor fool. You've done something wonderful and now we all have to pay.


----------



## KEM

gussunkri said:


> As I recall, there are presets in DZ named to suggest that they are Zebra recreations of Virus sounds. Isn’t there a preset called something like “Batman begins virus”? I would guess that Howie was given the task to recreate Virus sounds on Zebra for consistency reasons. I also believe Howie made many of the Virus presets before joining U-He.



Now that you mention it there are presets that have Virus in the title and I’m an idiot for not understanding why that was until right now…

Also Howie didn’t start working for Hans until right before The Dark Knight, so that makes sense that he would’ve been tasked with going back to some of those Virus sounds and recreating them in Zebra for us in TDK and onwards, didn’t know he worked on the original Virus presets though!!


----------



## kgdrum

doctoremmet said:


> Happy to report I caved and bought Dark Zebra. I will likely be more absent from the forum from now on. See you next year.




Wow! Next your going to tell us you caved and finally went for the big O & yes @Bee I’m talking synths. 
Congratulations Doc 👍


----------



## Mikro93

kgdrum said:


> Wow! Next your going to tell us you caved and finally went for the big O & yes @Bee I’m talking synths.


This one?


----------



## KEM

doctoremmet said:


> Happy to report I caved and bought Dark Zebra. I will likely be more absent from the forum from now on. See you next year.


----------



## kgdrum

@Mikro93 
No but that looks pretty damn cool.


----------



## Bee_Abney

kgdrum said:


> Wow! Next your going to tell us you caved and finally went for the big O & yes @Bee I’m talking synths.
> Congratulations Doc 👍


I find myself strangely interested in the prospect of sea-faring nuns playing with


----------



## Bee_Abney

modular synths.


----------



## kgdrum

O 🚿


----------



## KEM

@doctoremmet don’t forget you’re legally obligated to send me any cool patches you make


----------



## doctoremmet

KEM said:


> @doctoremmet don’t forget you’re legally obligated to send me any cool patches you make


I had just started a new journey with Halion 6 (you know, my prior new new thing, already a week in my possession) and its glorious resynthesis wavetable function. And I have an unfinished cool (?) soundset for MSoundFactory in the works too. Mostly I decided to program stuff for those platforms because there are free “player” versions of the synths available, so once I do decide to actually share something for once *) everyone can use the patches, and it won’t require actually owning the synth.

Should I unexpectedly create a Zebra patch that isn’t half bad however I will definitely share it. No problem at all.

*) _not that I am selfish, but rather I am crippled by insecurity, perfectionism and imposter syndrome most of the time, resulting in me starting *new* fun little projects instead of finishing *old* ones. It’s a problem. That’s why I am getting sick and tired of myself announcing things I may do, because most of the time I just don’t. Anyway…_


----------



## KEM

doctoremmet said:


> I had just started a new journey with Halion 6 (you know, my prior new new thing, already a week in my possession) and its glorious resynthesis wavetable function. And I have an unfinished cool (?) soundset for MSoundFactory in the works too. Mostly I decided to program stuff for those platforms because there are free “player” versions of the synths available, so once I do decide to actually share something for once *) everyone can use the patches, and it won’t require actually owning the synth.
> 
> Should I unexpectedly create a Zebra patch that isn’t half bad however I will definitely share it. No problem at all.
> 
> *) _not that I am selfish, but rather I am crippled by insecurity, perfectionism and imposter syndrome most of the time, resulting in me starting *new* fun little projects instead of finishing *old* ones. It’s a problem. That’s why I am getting sick and tired of myself announcing things I may do, because most of the time I just don’t. Anyway…_



The more you learn the more you realize you still don’t know and how far you have to go, which can destroy your confidence in something you may be very skilled at already, when I was first joined this forum I was 20 years old and didn’t know anything and I was so confident in what I was doing, as they say ignorance is bliss, but once I saw how much I had to learn and started down that journey I slowly lost a lot of confidence and started to fear posting my music here as I didn’t think it was good enough. It’s only been within the last year or so that I slowly started to gain that confidence back and realized that if I never show anyone my music I’ll never get real feedback on it and my progress will be a slower as a result, and there’s a lot of people here with tons of knowledge that have given me great advice and have really looked out for me and want to see me succeed. Old habits die hard but there comes a point where you just have to realize we’re all gonna die one day and it really doesn’t matter anyways, so post those patches, Doc!!


----------



## doctoremmet

KEM said:


> The more you learn the more you realize you still don’t know and how far you have to go, which can destroy your confidence in something you may be very skilled at already, when I was first joined this forum I was 20 years old and didn’t know anything and I was so confident in what I was doing, as they say ignorance is bliss, but once I saw how much I had to learn and started down that journey I slowly lost a lot of confidence and started to fear posting my music here as I didn’t think it was good enough. It’s only been within the last year or so that I slowly started to gain that confidence back and realized that if I never show anyone my music I’ll never get real feedback on it and my progress will be a slower as a result, and there’s a lot of people here with tons of knowledge that have given me great advice and have really looked out for me and want to see me succeed. Old habits die hard but there comes a point where you just have to realize we’re all gonna die one day and it really doesn’t matter anyways, so post those patches, Doc!!


You are absolutely right Kenneth, no doubt about it. In my case I used to be a pretty confident person, especially when it comes to my impeccable taste in music and synth programming skills  … composing not so much … but I can always hide behind my “I am merely a hobbyist” deflector shield and still have fun sharing my little noodles.

So my real issue is a rather new one. Because of some health issues I have had to severely restrict my working hours (my body does that for me really haha). And that in turn has set in motion a series of negative thoughts (“so what good am I still, now that I can do far less useful stuff than I used to be able to”) - basically an effing depression - that has made me a quitter. I start things and then after a while I (literally) get tired and I have to pause for a while. And then that pause pisses me off to the extent that my depressed mind says “okay f’-that, I’m done”. Which sane people would call: self sabotage or rather a ‘self fulfilling prophecy’ I guess.

Anyway… the good news is: this forum, hosted by mister @Mike Greene -thanks Mike- has kept me sane for the past two years, and especially all the friendly and talented (and funny!) people on here. It has tremendously helped me to cope with a lot of BS, and I feel much better now than before. Great therapy guys and gals! Thanks for that, I truly appreciate it. So, next week I turn 50 and I am really trying to make my next year more productive and I will try and have more confidence to finish stuff and share it here. Especially synth patches hehe.

TL;DR You guys rock! Thanks for the free therapy and the friendship. I really appreciate it.


----------



## Bee_Abney

doctoremmet said:


> You are absolutely right Kenneth, no doubt about it. In my case I used to be a pretty confident person, especially when it comes to my impeccable taste in music and synth programming skills  … composing not so much … but I can always hide behind my “I am merely a hobbyist” deflector shield and still have fun sharing my little noodles.
> 
> So my real issue is a rather new one. Because of some health issues I have had to severely restrict my working hours (my body does that for me really haha). And that in turn has set in motion a series of negative thoughts (“so what good am I still, now that I can do far less useful stuff than I used to be able to”) - basically an effing depression - that has made me a quitter. I start things and then after a while I (literally) get tired and I have to pause for a while. And then that pause pisses me off to the extent that my depressed mind says “okay f’-that, I’m done”. Which sane people would call: self sabotage or rather a ‘self fulfilling prophecy’ I guess.
> 
> Anyway… the good news is: this forum, hosted by mister @Mike Greene -thanks Mike- has kept me sane for the past two years, and especially all the friendly and talented (and funny!) people on here. It has tremendously helped me to cope with a lot of BS, and I feel much better now than before. Great therapy guys and gals! Thanks for that, I truly appreciate it. So, next week I turn 50 and I am really trying to make my next year more productive and I will try and have more confidence to finish stuff and share it here. Especially synth patches hehe.
> 
> TL;DR You guys rock! Thanks for the free therapy and the friendship. I really appreciate it.


I’m not sure it did keep you sane... But be the kind of mad, bad, destroyer of sonic horizons that you want to be. You’re making music all the time you are making music for any part of the time. The part may get slighter; but the whole maintains it’s crunchy goodness.

Sorry, I started thinking about food by the end there.


----------



## doctoremmet

Thanks Bee. Indeed. ‘Sane’. But I tell you one thing though, you are one of my favourite therapists on here!


----------



## Bee_Abney

doctoremmet said:


> Thanks Bee. Indeed. ‘Sane’. But I tell you one thing though, you are one of my favourite therapists on here!


Well, I was assessed for institutionalisation; but they let me stay out in the wild...


----------



## doctoremmet

Bee_Abney said:


> Well, I was assessed for institutionalisation; but they let me stay out in the wild...


I am happy they did. And honestly… during some of my darkest hours I have sometimes wished they would actually come and pick me up. No joke.


----------



## KEM

doctoremmet said:


> You are absolutely right Kenneth, no doubt about it. In my case I used to be a pretty confident person, especially when it comes to my impeccable taste in music and synth programming skills  … composing not so much … but I can always hide behind my “I am merely a hobbyist” deflector shield and still have fun sharing my little noodles.
> 
> So my real issue is a rather new one. Because of some health issues I have had to severely restrict my working hours (my body does that for me really haha). And that in turn has set in motion a series of negative thoughts (“so what good am I still, now that I can do far less useful stuff than I used to be able to”) - basically an effing depression - that has made me a quitter. I start things and then after a while I (literally) get tired and I have to pause for a while. And then that pause pisses me off to the extent that my depressed mind says “okay f’-that, I’m done”. Which sane people would call: self sabotage or rather a ‘self fulfilling prophecy’ I guess.
> 
> Anyway… the good news is: this forum, hosted by mister @Mike Greene -thanks Mike- has kept me sane for the past two years, and especially all the friendly and talented (and funny!) people on here. It has tremendously helped me to cope with a lot of BS, and I feel much better now than before. Great therapy guys and gals! Thanks for that, I truly appreciate it. So, next week I turn 50 and I am really trying to make my next year more productive and I will try and have more confidence to finish stuff and share it here. Especially synth patches hehe.
> 
> TL;DR You guys rock! Thanks for the free therapy and the friendship. I really appreciate it.



50 sounds like it’ll be filled with lots of ZebraHZ and what could be better than that?! And while I *personally* don’t yet understand the concept of getting old and the body not working like it used to I know you can always push through it with the right mentality!! There’s always time for a break, but there’s NEVER time for giving up!!


----------



## Bee_Abney

doctoremmet said:


> I am happy they did. And honestly… during some of my darkest hours I have sometimes wished they would actually come and pick me up. No joke.


Same here.


----------



## Bee_Abney

KEM said:


> 50 sounds like it’ll be filled with lots of ZebraHZ and what could be better than that?! And while I *personally* don’t yet understand the concept of getting old and the body not working like it used to I know you can always push through it with the right mentality!! There’s always time for a break, but there’s NEVER time for giving up!!


I prefer the Tom Waits approach. ‘So, I look like hell. What can I do with that?’ For me, with increasing trouble using my hands, that means learning to make a one finger synth patch.


----------



## KEM

liquidlino said:


> Sorry to hear you're going through health / mental health issues. I think our own fear of failure is our worst enemy when it comes to creative pursuits, or even non-creative. There's an interesting psychology at play for many. See if this rings true at all for you... Growing up, everything seemed easy. Hardly had to try at school to do well/ok. Picking up new skills and ideas rapidly was easy. And yet... any time anything got difficult or challenging and required actually persevering to get any better at it, gave up and moved onto the next thing. This becomes a life long habit, where everytime something looks to be that bit too difficult to be good at quickly, move on to the next thing. Work, play, sport, music, everything. And because getting to the level of mediocrity is easy, and never breaking through the barrier of really sticking with something and keeping at it, no matter how little progress seems to be being made, everything seems unsatisfying, nothing provides any sense of achievement. I know all this too well, because that's exactly me. And it's exactly what I'm trying not to do with music this time around. I won't let my inner demons push me to give up and move to the next hobby again. I may not be the next Thom Yorke, but dammit, I can be something surely, and this time I will keep at it, put the hours in, put the months in, put the years in, that I really should have done 30 years ago. That's where I'm at.



Sounds a lot like my ADHD lol


----------



## KEM

Bee_Abney said:


> I prefer the Tom Waits approach. ‘So, I look like hell. What can I do with that?’ For me, with increasing trouble using my hands, that means learning to make a one finger synth patch.



And Zebra is great for those “hold one note bassline” patches!!


----------



## Bee_Abney

liquidlino said:


> Sorry to hear you're going through health / mental health issues. I think our own fear of failure is our worst enemy when it comes to creative pursuits, or even non-creative. There's an interesting psychology at play for many. See if this rings true at all for you... Growing up, everything seemed easy. Hardly had to try at school to do well/ok. Picking up new skills and ideas rapidly was easy. And yet... any time anything got difficult or challenging and required actually persevering to get any better at it, gave up and moved onto the next thing. This becomes a life long habit, where everytime something looks to be that bit too difficult to be good at quickly, move on to the next thing. Work, play, sport, music, everything. And because getting to the level of mediocrity is easy, and never breaking through the barrier of really sticking with something and keeping at it, no matter how little progress seems to be being made, everything seems unsatisfying, nothing provides any sense of achievement. I know all this too well, because that's exactly me. And it's exactly what I'm trying not to do with music this time around. I won't let my inner demons push me to give up and move to the next hobby again. I may not be the next Thom Yorke, but dammit, I can be something surely, and this time I will keep at it, put the hours in, put the months in, put the years in, that I really should have done 30 years ago. That's where I'm at.


I have seen some remarkably gifted individuals fail to progress for years for those sorts of reasons. It’s only too late when you are dead. So, avoid being dead and knuckle down.


----------



## Bee_Abney

liquidlino said:


> Nothing puts me off a patch faster than if it has a melodic arp or sequence. I can't stand the thought of using someone elses ideas in my track - presets are fine, but melodic sequences... might as well start using four bar loop samples from splice and just bung a track together.


I believe the idea is to program my own.


----------



## doctoremmet

liquidlino said:


> Weird. I had a long chat with a friend at the weekend, because I'm beginning to suspect that I've had ADD or ADHD my entire life and never realised. His son has been diagnosed with it, and has prescription of amphetamines, and his concentration levels have shot up. Half considering going to the doctors about it.


Same here pal. I strongly suspect I’m ADD too.


----------



## doctoremmet

My depression used to be all black. But now I experience longer stretches of hope and white. Much like…

a *ZEBRA!*


----------



## doctoremmet

liquidlino said:


> Yeh but are they white with black stripes, or black with white stripes?


Depends on the day. Increasingly the first option!


----------



## Bee_Abney




----------



## kgdrum

Bee_Abney said:


> I prefer the Tom Waits approach. ‘So, I look like hell. What can I do with that?’ For me, with increasing trouble using my hands, that means learning to make a one finger synth patch.




Either that or a good 🚿


----------



## kgdrum

We all have up and down times that’s what makes the good times so exhilarating! Creativity and health can certainly affect each other from my experience harnessing in light or dark moments can be equally fruitful & often fighting through the dark moments can bring the most rewarding results!
Hang in there and deal with your circumstances as best you can. 👍


----------



## Bee_Abney

kgdrum said:


> Either that or a good 🚿


Always a really, really good shower. It's a social occasion.


----------



## kgdrum

Using an extremely gifted musician as an example,can you imagine what Trent Reznor’s music would sound like if he didn’t have personal demons,struggles,dark moments or doubts?


----------



## Bee_Abney

kgdrum said:


> Using an extremely gifted musician as an example,can you imagine what Trent Reznor’s music would sound like if he didn’t have personal demons,struggles,dark moments or doubts?


Tuneful?


----------



## kgdrum

From my perspective his music is quite tuneful already.


----------



## Mikro93

kgdrum said:


> Using an extremely gifted musician as an example,can you imagine what Trent Reznor’s music would sound like if he didn’t have personal demons,struggles,dark moments or doubts?


I get what you mean (and I love Trent Reznor and his music) 

I am always wary of using the concept of the tormented artist, to present mental health issues as "a blessing in disguise", which tends to romanticize mental illness. It is a recurring thing happening often in today's society 

That being said, I am just mentionning it, and I'd be interested in knowing the opinions of those who are directly concerned. Maybe not in this thread, though?


----------



## Bee_Abney

kgdrum said:


> From my perspective his music is quite tuneful already.


You're not wrong. I like that cover of a Johnny Cash song he did. That's some grade A time travelling.


----------



## kgdrum

Mikro93 said:


> I get what you mean (and I love Trent Reznor and his music)
> 
> I am always wary of using the concept of the tormented artist, to present mental health issues as "a blessing in disguise", which tends to romanticize mental illness. It is a reocurring thing happening often in today's society
> 
> That being said, I am just mentionning it, and I'd be interested in knowing the opinions of those who are directly concerned. Maybe not in this thread, though?



If it’s merely a prop and not genuine I agree but the best art imo comes from truthful expression,good or bad.


----------



## kgdrum

Bee_Abney said:


> You're not wrong. I like that cover of a Johnny Cash song he did. That's some grade A time travelling.


 Are you joking or are you confused by too many recent shower romps?


----------



## doctoremmet

God, Zebra is *good*.


----------



## Bee_Abney

kgdrum said:


> Are you joking or are you confused by too many recent shower romps?


----------



## kgdrum

doctoremmet said:


> God, Zebra is *good*.


 

Omnisphere = next…………..


----------



## Mikro93

doctoremmet said:


> God, Zebra is *good*.


I know, right?

I made a bass patch this morning, and thought to myself "Yep, this is a 200€ bass patch, thank you very much".


----------



## grabauf

I guess I need a Zebra, too! ...and a Diva.


----------



## doctoremmet

kgdrum said:


> Omnisphere = next…………..


----------



## Bee_Abney

kgdrum said:


> Omnisphere = next………….


Okay, do we know of any physical modelling patches in Omnisphere...


----------



## kgdrum

grabauf said:


> I guess I need a Zebra, too! ...and a Diva.


 

Please don’t overlook Bazille it’s absolutely one of the best ,vastly underrated and often overlooked.


----------



## Bee_Abney

doctoremmet said:


> kgdrum said:
> 
> 
> 
> Please don’t overlook Bazille it’s absolutely one of the best ,vastly underrated and often overlooked.
Click to expand...

Gimme.


----------



## kgdrum

Bee_Abney said:


> Okay, do we know of any physical modelling patches in Omnisphere...




No I was suggesting to the man I refer to as DoctorXsample8dioanythingMelda&FMorsubtractiveFlintPopeChrisHeinArturiaKaroryferWaverunnerUVIEmptyVesselCherryRemmit who buys virtually everything on the planet but still doesn’t have Omnisphere! I am suggesting that the big O is next.
He’s such a fuc*in slacker!


----------



## Bee_Abney

Bazille sounds like love on toast.


----------



## Bee_Abney

kgdrum said:


> No I was suggesting to the man I refer to as DoctorXsample8dioanythingMelda&FMorsubtractiveFlintPopeChrisHeinArturiaKaroryferWaverunnerUVIEmptyVesselCherryRemmit who buys virtually everything on the planet but still doesn’t have Omnisphere! I am suggesting that the big O is next.
> He’s such a fuc*in slacker!


Yes, quite right. I was just looking for a persuasive angle.


----------



## kgdrum

Bee_Abney said:


> Bazille sounds like love on toast.




“Love on toast” what a marketing sloagan……….

unfortunately the toast might get soggy and fall apart as your cavorting in the 🚿 with the sisters


----------



## Bee_Abney

kgdrum said:


> “Love on toast” what a marketing sloagan……….
> 
> unfortunately the toast might get soggy and fall apart as your cavorting in the 🚿 with the sisters


I'm not going to make any jokes about eating in the shower. Everyone can do that for themselves.


----------



## kgdrum

doctoremmet said:


>




No new taxes today there’s always tomorrow,you will cave.


----------



## Trash Panda

Bee_Abney said:


> You're not wrong. I like that cover of a Johnny Cash song he did. That's some grade A time travelling.


----------



## kgdrum

Bee_Abney said:


> I'm not going to make any jokes about eating in the shower. Everyone can do that for themselves.




Bee please this might be viewed by minors or generally well adjusted people. 😱


----------



## Double Helix

doctoremmet said:


> God, Zebra is *good*.


Money Line at 1:30


----------



## Pier

kgdrum said:


> “Love on toast” what a marketing sloagan……….


Yeah that'd work great 😂


----------



## doctoremmet

Double Helix said:


> Money Line at 1:30


----------



## Pier

doctoremmet said:


>



That is a great line for sampling and adding to a track!


----------



## doctoremmet

Pier said:


> That is a great line for sampling and adding to a track!


That bit -without the French- is also in this excellent UNKLE track….


----------



## Pier

doctoremmet said:


> That bit -without the French- is also in this excellent UNKLE track….


Ahhhh yess I remember now!!!!

I knew that was familiar!!!


----------



## doctoremmet

Pier said:


> Ahhhh yess I remember now!!!!
> 
> I knew that was familiar!!!


Another DJ favourite of mine. I bet you used to play it too back in the day?


----------



## Pier

doctoremmet said:


> Another DJ favourite of mine. I bet you used to play it too back in the day?


Yep, I was all over Psyence Fiction!

I was also a huge fan of DJ Shadow's first album Endtroducing. It was actually one of the inspirations that got me into making music with trackers back in the late 90s.

If you haven't seen it, I'd recommend the Scratch documentary from back then. The scenes with DJ Shadow in that basement still give me the chills.


----------



## doctoremmet

Pier said:


> I was also a huge fan of DJ Shadow's first album Endtroducing. It was actually one of the inspirations that got me into making music with trackers back in the late 90s.


Oh hell yes.


----------



## Mikro93

Pier said:


> I was also a huge fan of DJ Shadow's first album Endtroducing. It was actually one of the inspirations that got me into making music with trackers back in the late 90s.





doctoremmet said:


> Oh hell yes.



Get a room, you two 

You know, a room filled with synthesizers and obscure electronic albums.


----------



## sostenuto

Zebra2 / Hz _ no Diva _ ah Hive 2 _ oops Bazille, ..........

Why always ending up staying with Omni 2 ! Luv the comfy, samo-samo UI.

BTW _ use, enjoy Repro-1-5.

💤💤 ... but there's always Zebra 3 !


----------



## Bee_Abney

sostenuto said:


> Zebra2 / Hz _ no Diva _ ah Hive 2 _ oops Bazille, ..........
> 
> Why always ending up staying with Omni 2 ! Luv the comfy, samo-samo UI.
> 
> BTW _ use, enjoy Repro-1-5.
> 
> 💤💤 ... but there's always Zebra 3 !


You'll come around.


----------



## doctoremmet

Mikro93 said:


> and obscure electronic albums


----------



## Mikro93

doctoremmet said:


>



p e r f e c t i o n


----------



## Mikro93

Well, I'm having quite a nice time here, trying to wrap my head around the combs, FMOs, modulations, effects, bit of everything.

And this patch uses a bit of everything, and was actually a breeze to put together and play. It was guided by many surprises, though.

I'm in my happy place right now.


----------



## Bee_Abney

Mikro93 said:


> Well, I'm having quite a nice time here, trying to wrap my head around the combs, FMOs, modulations, effects, bit of everything.
> 
> And this patch uses a bit of everything, and was actually a breeze to put together and play. It was guided by many surprises, though.
> 
> I'm in my happy place right now.


I like that very much!


----------



## Bee_Abney

doctoremmet said:


>



Four WAV files, one for each of Coppola's phrases. I did some tidying up of the files, including removing room reverb; but the basic character remains the same.


----------



## doctoremmet

Great! This will be put somewhere. I *really* feel like making a dub track right now.


----------



## Bee_Abney

doctoremmet said:


> Great! This will be put somewhere. I *really* feel like making a dub track right now.


It's a bit out of place here, but here is a little Falcon patch with these audio clips.


----------



## DANIELE

Since I'm playing a bit with the spectroblend mode and I'm trying to draw the spectrum of some acoustic instrument wouldn't be useful to have a frequency chart like an EQ where you can draw in a precise way the spectrum you want. By precise I mean better drawing tools, axis marked with precise values and some kind of replication of the spectrum based on the pitch (this is the difficult one).

You should draw the spectrum on a specific pitch, then there should be some kind of algorithm (maybe based on some parameters given by the user) that replicate the spectrum on all the other pitches in the "right" way.
A very very very very advanced version of the key follow thing.

I know it is not an easy task because there are infite ways of doing this but it could be a great addition for Zebra 3 maybe.

About the spectroblend I know you have 128 bypolar columns distributed in a linear fashion over six octaves but it would be very useful having a grid, a snap to grid and axis values, I'd like to know what frequencies I'm manipulating and what amplitude I'm giving to them.

I didn't looked at the upper value screen when I work on it, are the values visualized there?


----------



## Pier

DANIELE said:


> Since I'm playing a bit with the spectroblend mode and I'm trying to draw the spectrum of some acoustic instrument wouldn't be useful to have a frequency chart like an EQ where you can draw in a precise way the spectrum you want. By precise I mean better drawing tools, axis marked with precise values and some kind of replication of the spectrum based on the pitch (this is the difficult one).
> 
> You should draw the spectrum on a specific pitch, then there should be some kind of algorithm (maybe based on some parameters given by the user) that replicate the spectrum on all the other pitches in the "right" way.
> A very very very very advanced version of the key follow thing.
> 
> I know it is not an easy task because there are infite ways of doing this but it could be a great addition for Zebra 3 maybe.
> 
> About the spectroblend I know you have 128 bypolar columns distributed in a linear fashion over six octaves but it would be very useful having a grid, a snap to grid and axis values, I'd like to know what frequencies I'm manipulating and what amplitude I'm giving to them.
> 
> I didn't looked at the upper value screen when I work on it, are the values visualized there?


The additive spectroblend gives you control over the harmonics relative to the root note you're playing. But yeah, an indication of which harmonic or partial you're editing would be great. Maybe it can be done using a text editor? Zebra oscillator presets can be saved on a text file after all, and it's probably human readable.

Maybe you will get better results by trying to import a custom wavetable?

Sorry to be a party pooper, but I don't think Zebra has the best tools for exactly replicating acoustic instruments.

See this example on synthesizing a timpani on MSoundFactory for example. Around 4:00 you can see how he imports a sample and the harmonics are analyzed and applied to some kind of additive generator.




Would be great if there was a tool that did the same but exported a Zebra oscillator preset instead.


----------



## shadowsoflight

Pier said:


> Would be great if there was a tool that did the same but exported a Zebra oscillator preset instead.



Hmm, that sounds like a fun and doable challenge for Python.

*Looks at idea list*

Erm, maybe in 2025. 😅


----------



## Pier

shadowsoflight said:


> Hmm, that sounds like a fun and doable challenge for Python.
> 
> *Looks at idea list*
> 
> Erm, maybe in 2025. 😅


My thoughts as well but with JUCE instead 😂


----------



## DANIELE

Pier said:


> The additive spectroblend gives you control over the harmonics relative to the root note you're playing. But yeah, an indication of which harmonic or partial you're editing would be great. Maybe it can be done using a text editor? Zebra oscillator presets can be saved on a text file after all, and it's probably human readable.
> 
> Maybe you will get better results by trying to import a custom wavetable?
> 
> Sorry to be a party pooper, but I don't think Zebra has the best tools for exactly replicating acoustic instruments.
> 
> See this example on synthesizing a timpani on MSoundFactory for example. Around 4:00 you can see how he imports a sample and the harmonics are analyzed and applied to some kind of additive generator.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Would be great if there was a tool that did the same but exported a Zebra oscillator preset instead.



Sooooooooooooooo, dear Pier, are you trying to empty my wallet?!?

I didn't know this piece of software, omg!! And it is even on sale at 50% now.

Wonderfull tool to have.

Anyway I'm not trying to reproduce real instrument with Zebra, you can work this with some subtractive synthesis by using some standard oscillators alone or in combination.

What I'm aiming for is more about starting with drawing something not completely random. I mean, if I want to start to build a sound that remember a string instrument I could use the spectrum as a base a starting from there.

Maybe I would like to build some airy vocal-like pad, I could start with a spectrum of a female airy voice and working on it. I don't want to replace the real instrument.

And now I'm going to buy MSoundfactory.


----------



## Trash Panda

@DANIELE have you checked out the Zebra Orchestra yet? Might give you some starting points to get the creative juices flowing.






Corin Neff - The Zebra Orchestra


Buy The Zebra Orchestra here




esgalachoir.wixsite.com


----------



## shadowsoflight

Pier said:


> My thoughts as well but with JUCE instead 😂


Oh no! Why did you have to bring this up... My idea list can't handle it 😂


----------



## DANIELE

Trash Panda said:


> @DANIELE have you checked out the Zebra Orchestra yet? Might give you some starting points to get the creative juices flowing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Corin Neff - The Zebra Orchestra
> 
> 
> Buy The Zebra Orchestra here
> 
> 
> 
> 
> esgalachoir.wixsite.com


Yes I did, it is already in my presets and I'm studying it, a lot of work behind those presets. I wrote that just because I was looking at one of those presets and the ocillators have some custom shapes done with the spectroblend. I was just asking myself why the author choosed to draw exactly them and what process he used.

You guys are making me a poor guy (and I wasn't rich...).


----------



## Pier

DANIELE said:


> Sooooooooooooooo, dear Pier, are you trying to empty my wallet?!?
> 
> I didn't know this piece of software, omg!! And it is even on sale at 50% now.
> 
> Wonderfull tool to have.
> 
> Anyway I'm not trying to reproduce real instrument with Zebra, you can work this with some subtractive synthesis by using some standard oscillators alone or in combination.
> 
> What I'm aiming for is more about starting with drawing something not completely random. I mean, if I want to start to build a sound that remember a string instrument I could use the spectrum as a base a starting from there.
> 
> Maybe I would like to build some airy vocal-like pad, I could start with a spectrum of a female airy voice and working on it. I don't want to replace the real instrument.
> 
> And now I'm going to buy MSoundfactory.


Sorry for your wallet 😂

In all seriousness, it was really not my intention to make you buy this, just trying to make a point.

Regarding your ideas (string sound or vocal pad) have you considered using samples instead? Maybe using Omnisphere which includes a huge library of samples to work with, or Falcon. I'm not sure what you want to achieve, but I think you could get more convincing sounds that way, instead of synthesizing from scratch.


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## Pier

shadowsoflight said:


> Oh no! Why did you have to bring this up... My idea list can't handle it 😂


Yeah I really want to start playing with DSP and JUCE. But that's a very deep rabbit hole that would require a lot of time which I do not have. Maybe in a couple of years...


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## DANIELE

Pier said:


> Sorry for your wallet 😂
> 
> In all seriousness, it was really not my intention to make you buy this, just trying to make a point.
> 
> Regarding your ideas (string sound or vocal pad) have you considered using samples instead? Maybe using Omnisphere which includes a huge library of samples to work with, or Falcon. I'm not sure what you want to achieve, but I think you could get more convincing sounds that way, instead of synthesizing from scratch.


Too late, you make me know that and now I'm addicted.

To answer your statement I bought Zebra, I like it and I want to take the most out of it. I know I'm not fully clear, I'll try to explain, I want to learn the process of building a sound from scratch. I love to do it, I'm doing some reverse engineering but when I face custom oscillator I'd like to know why they are built like that.

I studied a bit of sythesis basics where the author take some real instruments, analyze their spectrum and try to reproduce it with basic oscillators, based on the harmonic content of every waveform he uses. That is crystal clear for me, I need to uderstand if I can do a sort of parallelism between a real spectrum and a tool like spectroblend. I love to create sound from scratch, the sample word is another great world but I have to approach one at time in my spare time. I already played a bit with some granular synthesizer by sampling my voice and some other little things, and I also love that but I must remember I also have to write some music and "so much tools" = "I don't know what to use".


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## grabauf

Why is it always so hard to make decisions? Diva or Zebra? 
Both are offered for 100€ atm. But I guess, they're gone before I decided which one to get.  
Any advice?


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## Bee_Abney

grabauf said:


> Why is it always so hard to make decisions? Diva or Zebra?
> Both are offered for 100€ atm. But I guess, they're gone before I decided which one to get.
> Any advice?


Go with your heart not your head. And if your heart doesn't have a clue, get Zebra. I think it has a greater range of hybrid applications.

Or toss a coin, they are both very good; but they are rather different.

Zebra excels are detailed textures and sounds that can be modulated in complex ways. It is a great support instrument that can also serve as the only instrument - leads, basses, it is good at everything.

Diva has retro charm and some heft to its sound. It is great for the sounds an old analog subtractive hardware synth would be used for. It does pads well, textures fairly well, and excels at leads and basses. It's core sound is its selling point, rather than variety and subtlety. But it can be nuanced.

I find I have CPU issues with Diva more than Zebra, but they are both powerful synths that take a fair amount of processing power.

Obviously, you could get neither; but if you can, do consider getting both eventually. If that seems appealing, buy now whichever one you fancy playing right now. Get the other one later.


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## Pier

grabauf said:


> Why is it always so hard to make decisions? Diva or Zebra?
> Both are offered for 100€ atm. But I guess, they're gone before I decided which one to get.
> Any advice?


Zebra is way more powerful and flexible. ZebraHZ includes all Diva filters plus other features (and you'll get Zebra 3 for free when it comes out).

Diva sounds amazing of course, but it is quite rigid. No MSEGs, few effects, very basic routing, etc, but if you want to emulate classic synths it's a better option than Zebra.


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## Pier

BTW @grabauf where do you see Zebra and Diva for €100?

Is there some sale I've missed?


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## Bee_Abney

Pier said:


> BTW @grabauf where do you see Zebra and Diva for €100?
> 
> Is there some sale I've missed?


Knobcloud, I believe, had those prices recently, if they aren't sold already.


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## grabauf

Bee_Abney said:


> Knobcloud, I believe, had those prices recently, if they aren't sold already.


Yes. Knobcloud. That's why I still hesitate, as I'm cautious at those prices. Would prefer to buy at an official sale price. Unfortunately I missed the NI deal last year.


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## grabauf

Ok. Problem solved. Both offers are gone now.


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## Bee_Abney

grabauf said:


> Ok. Problem solved. Both offers are gone now.


You needn't be so wary of Knobcloud. Just use PayPal goods and services and your purchase is protected. Check the feedback for the seller. Avoid a purchase if all of that fails.

And those were rather low prices, but you will see the U-he synths on there again long before you see another U-he (really, NI) sale as good.

There are online shops that might offer sale prices, but not with very large reductions.

But for now, unless you have some other synth I think is cool, you are dead to me.

I said good day, sir!


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## grabauf

Good day and thanks for your advice.
Playing with my other synths for now.


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## Pier

grabauf said:


> Ok. Problem solved. Both offers are gone now.


I've seen Diva on KnobCloud as low as $90 but it goes super fast!


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## grabauf

Pier said:


> I've seen Diva on KnobCloud as low as $90 but it goes super fast!


It looks like this time I was fast enough.


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## Bee_Abney

grabauf said:


> It looks like this time I was fast enough.



Are you a Diva now?


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## grabauf

Bee_Abney said:


> Are you a Diva now?


Still waiting for the license to transform into a Diva.


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## Bee_Abney

grabauf said:


> Still waiting for the license to transform into a Diva.


But when it comes, you'll be fab-u-lous, darling!

And you might throw your phone at your assistant. Oh yes, you'll be needing an assistant now.


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## grabauf

And an hour later the license arrived. 
Job offer for my assistant is about to be published.


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## Whywhy

"Why should I buy Zebra?"
Because it's awesome, simple like that!
Based on my own experience:
I bought Zebra seven years ago, but at this time, I focused on others instruments. Recently, I decided to focus on it, the goal was to release a tiny sound set of 50 percussive elements. Finally, I fall into the Zebra's abyssal possibility and come with more than 140 sounds. Here a teaser: 

Conclusion: Zebra is essential in my tonal arsenal and it's one of my favorite instruments now.


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## Bee_Abney

Whywhy said:


> "Why should I buy Zebra?"
> Because it's awesome, simple like that!
> Based on my own experience:
> I bought Zebra seven years ago, but at this time, I focused on others instruments. Recently, I decided to focus on it, the goal was to release a tiny sound set of 50 percussive elements. Finally, I fall into the Zebra's abyssal possibility and come with more than 140 sounds. Here a teaser:
> 
> Conclusion: Zebra is essential in my tonal arsenal and it's one of my favorite instruments now.



Wow! I have been duly teased!


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## grabauf

Whywhy said:


> "Why should I buy Zebra?"
> Because it's awesome, simple like that!
> Based on my own experience:
> I bought Zebra seven years ago, but at this time, I focused on others instruments. Recently, I decided to focus on it, the goal was to release a tiny sound set of 50 percussive elements. Finally, I fall into the Zebra's abyssal possibility and come with more than 140 sounds. Here a teaser:
> 
> Conclusion: Zebra is essential in my tonal arsenal and it's one of my favorite instruments now.



Impressive!


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## jcrosby

Whywhy said:


> "Why should I buy Zebra?"
> Because it's awesome, simple like that!
> Based on my own experience:
> I bought Zebra seven years ago, but at this time, I focused on others instruments. Recently, I decided to focus on it, the goal was to release a tiny sound set of 50 percussive elements. Finally, I fall into the Zebra's abyssal possibility and come with more than 140 sounds. Here a teaser:
> 
> Conclusion: Zebra is essential in my tonal arsenal and it's one of my favorite instruments now.



This isn't all Zebra is it? If so color me impressed (!), If not is it possible to clarify which sounds in the teaser are something else?


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## Whywhy

All are coming from Zebra Momentum. I will post some walkthroughs the next week.


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## jcrosby

Whywhy said:


> All are coming from Zebra Momentum. I will post some walkthroughs the next week.


Impressive for sure.... Cheers!


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## KEM

Whywhy said:


> All are coming from Zebra Momentum. I will post some walkthroughs the next week.



Dude this sounds incredible, I’ll buy this right away!!


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## Pier

Whywhy said:


> "Why should I buy Zebra?"
> Because it's awesome, simple like that!
> Based on my own experience:
> I bought Zebra seven years ago, but at this time, I focused on others instruments. Recently, I decided to focus on it, the goal was to release a tiny sound set of 50 percussive elements. Finally, I fall into the Zebra's abyssal possibility and come with more than 140 sounds. Here a teaser:
> 
> Conclusion: Zebra is essential in my tonal arsenal and it's one of my favorite instruments now.



Wow this is very impressive.


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## SupremeFist

Whywhy said:


> "Why should I buy Zebra?"
> Because it's awesome, simple like that!
> Based on my own experience:
> I bought Zebra seven years ago, but at this time, I focused on others instruments. Recently, I decided to focus on it, the goal was to release a tiny sound set of 50 percussive elements. Finally, I fall into the Zebra's abyssal possibility and come with more than 140 sounds. Here a teaser:
> 
> Conclusion: Zebra is essential in my tonal arsenal and it's one of my favorite instruments now.



This sounds outrageously good! When can haz it plz?


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## Whywhy

SupremeFist said:


> This sounds outrageously good! When can haz it plz?


Thanks, I will release it the 2 or 3 Feb. 
I'm actually finishing the walkthroughs.


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## KEM

Whywhy said:


> Thanks, I will release it the 2 or 3 Feb.
> I'm actually finishing the walkthroughs.



Buying it immediately


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## Snoobydoobydoo

The thing with Zebra is that you compare other synths functions always with Zebra, almost counting something in Zebras. 
One mans life is one and a quarter Zebras i found out.


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## Bee_Abney

Snoobydoobydoo said:


> The thing with Zebra is that you compare other synths functions always with Zebra, almost counting something in Zebras.
> One mans life is one and a quarter Zebras i found out.


You're mad. No-one's life is worth more than a single Zebra.


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## Snoobydoobydoo

Bee_Abney said:


> You're mad. No-one's life is worth more than a single Zebra.


Even when you are situated as a monochromatic bipolar lifeform of high priced irrational paradoxes, those even fancier stylized predators will chew on your nutrient bones without asking for your permission, therefore rendering yourself just in the top10 of natures gifts to talk about at student partys, but not on the first place to create more valuable mathematics for the food chains kings when you come late to those partys, sorry.


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## D Halgren

Whywhy said:


> Thanks, I will release it the 2 or 3 Feb.
> I'm actually finishing the walkthroughs.


Can I buy it yet 😉


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## Bee_Abney

Snoobydoobydoo said:


> Even when you are situated as a monochromatic bipolar lifeform of high priced irrational paradoxes, those even fancier stylized predators will chew on your nutrient bones without asking for your permission, therefore rendering yourself just in the top10 of natures gifts to talk about at student partys, but not on the first place to create more valuable mathematics for the food chains kings when you come late to those partys, sorry.


The party was over before the first human got there. But otherwise, I cheerfully concur.


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## Snoobydoobydoo

Bee_Abney said:


> The party was over before the first human got there. But otherwise, I cheerfully concur.


Seems you came late too. All humans left pretty early after waiting for a Zebra 3 announcement for some time (time can be measured in Zebras too they proclaimed back then, but didnt finish that idea and nodoby knows why).


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## Whywhy

Zebra Momentum is out !


https://vi-control.net/community/threads/zebra-momentum-by-yuli-yolo.120900/


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## Bee_Abney

Whywhy said:


> Zebra Momentum is out !
> 
> 
> https://vi-control.net/community/threads/zebra-momentum-by-yuli-yolo.120900/



It's what money was invented for! Just this moment!


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## doctoremmet




----------



## Bee_Abney

doctoremmet said:


>



It's such a shame. One brilliant performance, but those ape people just got typecast and couldn't get roles after that. I heard one was an insurance seller, another worked for Walmart. The one who tried work as a stripper didn't last.


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## doctoremmet

Hold on. Didn’t one of those blokes launch an acting career fighting Godzilla?


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## Bee_Abney

doctoremmet said:


> Hold on. Didn’t one of those blokes launch an acting career fighting Godzilla?


Different generation! But they had to use a lot of effects to make him look like a gorilla. Still, it’s a living.


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## Whywhy

Some walkthroughs for Zebra Momentum:



Best
Nico aka Yuli Yolo


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## Pier

Whywhy said:


> Some walkthroughs for Zebra Momentum:
> 
> 
> 
> Best
> Nico aka Yuli Yolo



There's some really awesome stuff in those videos!


----------

