# Berlin First Chairs Vibrato...Help!



## tomhartmanmusic (Apr 19, 2018)

Just got this today, and am having trouble figuring out if they actually expect us to use this much vibrato on things....I read the manual briefly where it says "some" patches will display a choice of vibrato styles, but I can't find it. Everything I'm playing sounds like a film from the 1940s. 

Thanks for any help here...

TH


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## SimonCharlesHanna (Apr 19, 2018)

I'm not in-front of my system right now, but I don't recall ever thinking that personally - not sure what you're expecting from FC string players.

There's not many patches so I doubt you're missing anything. Only thing I could suggest is not riding the mod wheel as high.


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## tomhartmanmusic (Apr 19, 2018)

SimonCharlesHanna said:


> I'm not in-front of my system right now, but I don't recall ever thinking that personally - not sure what you're expecting from string players.
> 
> There's not many patches so I doubt you're missing anything. Only thing I could suggest is not riding the mod wheel as high.



Thanks pretty familiar with doing live string sections....they don't play with THAT much vibrato unless asked. Not riding the mod wheel, this is out of the box. As far as missing something the manual clearly states there are patches that have different choices of vibrato....with a display to choose it.....have not been able to find.


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## jamwerks (Apr 19, 2018)

I don't think vibrato could be controllable on a solo instrument, you would hear double instruments. Unless the samples are processed then phase aligned, which does negativily affect the sound imo.


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## tomhartmanmusic (Apr 19, 2018)

jamwerks said:


> I don't think vibrato could be controllable on a solo instrument, you would hear double instruments. Unless the samples are processed then phase aligned, which does negativily affect the sound imo.



Certainly is controllable in CSS....and from the OT manual:

CC 3
This CC controls the vibrato mode (select patches only). You can assign this CC freely in the Controller Table. "
and
"
In Single Articulation Patches, you will find the Main Knob with its velocity layer display here, as well as Con Sordino, Auto Sustain, vibrato style and other important settings (depending on the instrument). "

And:
"
Vibrato Slider
Used by: All "Long" Single Articulations with multiple vibrato styles.
Assignable to: MIDI CCs
Default Value: CC3
Description: The assigned CC switches between the different vibrato styles available for the current articulation. "


I'm not seeing this vibrato slider yet...and have loaded long sustains and legatos...anyone know how to find this?


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## SimonCharlesHanna (Apr 19, 2018)

They are talking about ^^^ Those options (without, romantic, strong) which are unavailable (from memory) on the FC instruments.

All controllers & sliders are accessible by the 3x3 grid icon


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## SimonCharlesHanna (Apr 19, 2018)

VSL's solo strings may suit you if you're after something more neutral


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## tomhartmanmusic (Apr 19, 2018)

SimonCharlesHanna said:


> They are talking about ^^^ Those options (without, romantic, strong) which are unavailable (from memory) on the FC instruments.
> 
> All controllers & sliders are accessible by the 3x3 grid icon



Those quotes I listed were from the 1st Chairs manual, so that is strange. But thanks...!


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## SimonCharlesHanna (Apr 19, 2018)

tomhartmanmusic said:


> Those quotes I listed were from the 1st Chairs manual, so that is strange. But thanks...!


My guess is they do some copy-pasting which is a bit misleading isn't it!

Sorry for the crappy news!


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## tomhartmanmusic (Apr 19, 2018)

SimonCharlesHanna said:


> VSL's solo strings may suit you if you're after something more neutral



It's not so much neutral that I want, I want control over when and how much.... as with the CSS strings. There are many times when a passage needs to go from vibrato to none, and vice versa, especially in many of todays big musicals I've had to cover lately for clients. CSS has done a great job on it, I'm just a string fanatic and liked what I heard in many OT libraries so gave this one a shot..


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## SimonCharlesHanna (Apr 19, 2018)

tomhartmanmusic said:


> It's not so much neutral that I want, I want control over when and how much.... as with the CSS strings. There are many times when a passage needs to go from vibrato to none, and vice versa, especially in many of todays big musicals I've had to cover lately for clients. CSS has done a great job on it, I'm just a string fanatic and liked what I heard in many OT libraries so gave this one a shot..


Far more common in ensemble strings. Does CSSS do it too? I've never really heard a solo string library do crossfade-able vibrato convincingly (unless modeled)

You can set up VSL to do what ever you want (sus vib -> tremolo xfade, legato vib -> molto vib xfade etc). Makes them more flexible than any other library


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## tomhartmanmusic (Apr 19, 2018)

SimonCharlesHanna said:


> Far more common in ensemble strings. Does CSSS do it too? I've never really heard a solo string library do crossfade-able vibrato convincingly (unless modeled)
> 
> You can set up VSL to do what ever you want (sus vib -> tremolo xfade, legato vib -> molto vib xfade etc). Makes them more flexible than any other library



You're right, more common in ensemble strings typically. But yes, CSSS does do allow it so I got used to the feature.
I used to have VSL years back but not a big fan of the string sound which I always found harsh. Have not checked them out recently though. Thanks for the input.


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## Saxer (Apr 19, 2018)

CSSS allow a switch between non-vibrato and full vibrato. Nothing in between. And they have a more intens vib than Berlin FC.


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## tomhartmanmusic (Apr 19, 2018)

Saxer said:


> CSSS allow a switch between non-vibrato and full vibrato. Nothing in between. And they have a more intens vib than Berlin FC.



CSSS uses CC2 to smoothly fade between the two, I use it all the time.


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## Saxer (Apr 20, 2018)

tomhartmanmusic said:


> CSSS uses CC2 to smoothly fade between the two, I use it all the time.


Yepp, but it's vibrato on or off, not 'less' or 'more'. You can switch in the middle of the note which sounds very natural. Btw it's the same with SCS.
I don't understand why Berlin FC doesn't doesn't have the same vib layers as the main library. Especially when using is as FC.


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## jamwerks (Apr 20, 2018)

Seems to me that there are rare cases where you would want a solo instrument to play with no vibrato. And in those cases an ensemble sound might be better!


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