# Piano Instruments and Controllers - Recommendations for Holiday Sales, 2022?



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 15, 2021)

I've been out of the virtual world for a while.

I spent the last couple of years dialing in my guitars and basses, not to mention restarting my design/engineering business.

Going through all my VIs, I found myself wanting to broaden my piano library.

I did some piano VI searches, overwhelming.

I created a pianobook account, looks interesting, again - a touch overwhelming.

I own Pianoteq Standard with
Steinway Model D
K2 grand piano
Petrof AP275 + P284
C. Bechstein DG

I am looking for 3 SAMPLED Piano instruments - this is mostly for composing jazz, fusion (all genres), classical, cinematic projects.

Kontakt Full.

These will not be used for performance.

1. Grand
2. Upright
3. Character

Suggestions?

Price: somewhat open, mid-price point-ish (whatever that means these days)

Apologies for the well beaten "What's the best piano VI?" post - sometimes a refresh can be fun.


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## slobajudge (Jul 15, 2021)

The list can be endless. I will ignore the price. Since you own Pianoteq, in short,
1. Grand - Any of VSL grand pianos or Garritan CFX. (overall sound and playability - the best)
2. Upright - VI Labs Modern U, VSL bosendorfer upright (the same as above)
3. Character - Embertone Walker Steinway, Pearl concert grand, IS Fazioli (In this category there are many, grands or uprights)


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## LamaRose (Jul 15, 2021)

Spitfire has a couple of character pianos from Abbey Roads in their Originals series.


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## sostenuto (Jul 15, 2021)

Audio Brewers.com _ Ambisonics says some about their sampling /audio skills, but libs are offered in just Stereo as well. 
Adding Pianoforte very shortly, even with long list of top-tier piano VI(s).


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## pcohen12 (Jul 15, 2021)

LamaRose said:


> Spitfire has a couple of character pianos from Abbey Roads in their Originals series.



Seconded.

Simple Sam’s Signature Grand may not have the craziest specs on paper, but it’s a rare case of being way more than the sum of its parts…maybe the best $50 I’ve ever spent, and I consistently find myself reaching for it over pricier options. It has a huge fan club here on VI-C.

Spitfire’s new Jangle Box Piano could fit in both your “upright” and “character” categories - without the tack layer engaged, it’s just a very nice upright.

Westwood’s ALT PIANO is a wonderful, supremely-playable character piano - you can even go from normal to felt and everything in between. Some inspiring sound design features with this, too.

Last but not least, if you have the most recent version of Pianoteq, be sure to check out the new felt presets that they recently added!


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 15, 2021)

pcohen12 said:


> Seconded.
> 
> Simple Sam’s Signature Grand may not have the craziest specs on paper, but it’s a rare case of being way more than the sum of its parts…maybe the best $50 I’ve ever spent, and I consistently find myself reaching for it over pricier options. It has a huge fan club here on VI-C.
> 
> ...



GREAT suggestions everyone.

but pcohen12, you hit it out of the park with those 3.
​just lovely.

i even like Simple Sam's Upright.

and the pricing is hard to argue with!

thank you SO Much everyone!


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## John R Wilson (Jul 15, 2021)

I'd recommend, VSL Synchron Bosendorfer 280VC. I've just got it having not purchased any sampled pianos for a long time now. I was not planning on buying anymore sampled pianos as I have enough and have never really been that satisfied with most of the sampled pianos I have, especially in consideration to playability. However, its quickly become my favourite sampled piano. It sounds so clean and clear and is extremely flexible with a very nice direct sound. It also probably has the best playability of all my sampled pianos.


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## doctoremmet (Jul 16, 2021)

1. SSSSG +1 or ArtVista Virtual Grand 3 
2. Sampletekk Rain piano (wait for 80% off sales)
3. Versillian Joachim’s Piano is fantastic

I also love 8Dio’s 1985 Passionate, Spitfire Originals Felt, Whole Sound’s 1954 Baldwin Parlor Grand, UVI Augmented Piano.


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## easyrider (Jul 16, 2021)

Spectrasonics - Keyscape - Models







www.spectrasonics.net


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## cfodeebiedaddy (Jul 16, 2021)

Lots of great suggestions here!

The only one I'd add is Cinesamples' Piano in Blue for your character category! If jazz is your thing, then between that and Simple Sam's Signature Grand (it has *great* jazz presets you can get lost in), you'll be in heaven.


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## CeDur (Jul 16, 2021)

1. Grand: Production Voices Production Grand 2, Soniccouture Hammersmith Pro, Ravenscroft 275 - all three rather clean sounding)
2. Upright: Addictive Keys Modern Upright - quite underrated Yamaha U3 sample; nice presets, sits well in the mix
3. Character: Embertone Walker Steinway +1, Simple Sam Signature Grand +1


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## wilifordmusic (Jul 16, 2021)

You might take a look/listen to Chocolate Audio's offerings. Nice variety of pianos and reasonable pricing.
Really like their drums as well.


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## doctoremmet (Jul 16, 2021)

cfodeebiedaddy said:


> The only one I'd add is Cinesamples' Piano in Blue for your character category!


Definitely a beauty! +1


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## John R Wilson (Jul 16, 2021)

CeDur said:


> 1. Grand: Production Voices Production Grand 2, Soniccouture Hammersmith Pro, Ravenscroft 275 - all three rather clean sounding)
> 2. Upright: Addictive Keys Modern Upright - quite underrated Yamaha U3 sample; nice presets, sits well in the mix
> 3. Character: Embertone Walker Steinway +1, Simple Sam Signature Grand +1


Production voices production grand 2 and ravenscroft are also a very nice, I'd also recommend these. These two alongside vsl 280VC are also some of my favourite piano libraries.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 16, 2021)

status:

so many great instruments

making a list

i grabbed Simple Sam’s Signature Grand - for the price, WOW!

what a difference from Pianoteq. Gorgeous.

what a great resource - i'll compile a list


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## alexen2916 (Jul 16, 2021)

This is a bit niche, but might be worth considering for a boutique sound singer-songwriter kinda sound









4Knob Upright: The Perfect Songwriter Piano


Tell your story with an amazing 80-year-old upright piano sampled by SampleTekk. 4Knob Upright is ideal for songwriter music, acoustic pop and blues.




new.steinberg.net


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## sostenuto (Jul 16, 2021)

FYI _ mentioned Audio Brewers Pianoforte - Stereo earlier @ $79. 
imho __ well worthwhile to checkout this very recent YT Vid. If it doesn't impress, then clearly cross off list. ✌🏻


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 16, 2021)

so many great collections - now to choose a few more.



*Piano Libraries*

Categories may overlap

Grand​
VSL
Bösendorfer Concert Grand 290 Imperial
Steinway & Sons D-274
Yamaha CFX
Bösendorfer 280VC
Blüthner 1895

Garritan
Yamaha CFX Concert Grand

Art Vista
Virtual Grand Piano 3

Production Voices
Production Grand 2
Concert Grand

Soniccouture
Hammersmith Pro

VI Labs
Ravenscroft 275

Upright​
VSL
Bösendorfer Grand Upright 130

VI Labs
Modern U

Spitfire Audio
Originals Jangle Box Piano

Westwood
Alt Piano

Sampltekk
Rain Piano MkII

XLN Audio
Modern Upright

Character​
Embertone
Walker 1955 Concert D

Impact Soundworks
Pearl Concert Grand

Imperfect Samples
Brasted Broken Upright
Braunschweig Upright
White Baby Grand
Walnut Concert Grand
Ebony Concert Grand

Versilian Studios
Joachim’s Piano

Cinesamples
Piano in Blue

Miscellaneous​
Chocolate Audio
O.D.D. Grand Piano
The 88 Series Pianos - Bundle V2
The 88 Series Pianos - Model 7 V2
The 88 Series Pianos - Model D V2
The 88 Series Pianos - Steinbach Upright V2
The 88 Series Pianos - Model 80 V2

Audio Brewers
Pianoforte
The Upright Complete
The Upright Prepared
The Upright Felt
The Upright Core

Spectrasonics
Keyscape

Steinberg
4Knob Upright


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## wilifordmusic (Jul 16, 2021)

Good luck narrowing your search down to a couple of contenders.

For each of my musical needs, I'll often open tabs for each of the libraries' web pages side by side and jump from one to the next and close tabs when I find anything that doesn't work for me at that moment.
Then I'll listen to the demos skipping back and forth until I end up with three choices.
Then I watch the walkthrough for each and listen to all the easily available musical demos.
Usually by then I have the knowledge available to make an informed decision.

Then I move on to the next tool I need.

Don't waste too much time second guessing yourself.

Use "The Force" Zoot. It will serve you well.


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## Captain Oveur (Jul 16, 2021)

If you have time to burn Gamma posted himself playing a number of popular options here: 

Might be more helpful in terms of direct comparison over officially approved demos.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 16, 2021)

Fascinating history with Piano in Blue



Cinesamples - Piano in Blue | Columbia Records' historic Steinway D Concert Grand piano


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## olsontex (Jul 16, 2021)

Sometimes you get a lot more than you pay for in the piano category, so I wouldn't write off some of the more modestly priced options. One caveat I'd like to make is pianos that sound the best as a solo instrument aren't always the ones that sound the best in busier mixes (and vice versa). Here are my current favorites:

Workhorse Grand: Ebertone - Walker 1955, Cinesamples - CinePiano
Workhorse Upright: VI Labs - Modern U
Specialty: Strix - Pripyat, SampleTekk - Rain Piano MkII
Pleasant Surprises: Botdog Samples - Botdog Piano, Fluffy - My Piano, Addictive Keys - Modern Upright

There's a specialty piano that came out a few years ago that's recently caught my interest. This is probably as good a thread as any to ask for opinions since the OP may benefit from the feedback too.

I've found myself gravitating towards the characteristics of prepared pianos this year. I've got a few pianos that get me in the neighborhood of what's in my head, but more often than not I've been blending multiple pianos to get the sound I'm after. Aside from taking a lot more effort to mix, it can quickly devolve into a sonic mess in a hurry. As I watch demos, Randy's Prepared Piano by Cinesamples is the one currently separating from the pack for me. Anyone have a strong opinion on this piano one way or the other?


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## CeDur (Jul 17, 2021)

olsontex said:


> Sometimes you get a lot more than you pay for in the piano category, so I wouldn't write off some of the more modestly priced options. (...)


+1
I've got both Cinesamples CinePiano (you can call it Piano in Blue successor) and Signature Grand. The latter is just 50$ and I much prefer it over 200$ CinePiano. SSSG is such a beautiful sound and joy to play at the same time (and it's not always the case, sometimes samples are great when you just listen to them but not so much in terms of 'playability' - my experience with Emberton Walker 1955).
I've also mentioned Production Grand 2: regarding value for money, you can get Compact version which runs in free Sforzando player. It has 1 mic perspective (but the best sounding one) from its big brother. I have both and I cannot hear any difference. And Compact is only 29$ now!



olsontex said:


> One caveat I'd like to make is pianos that sound the best as a solo instrument aren't always the ones that sound the best in busier mixes (and vice versa). (...)


+1
This is my experience as well. I tend to go to Addictive Keys when piano is surrounded with other instruments, but I wouldn't choose it for solo piece. Same goes for playing live gigs: Kurzweil's >20 years old 'triple strike' or Nord's <300MB piano is usually better choice than 200GB complex library.


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## Markrs (Jul 17, 2021)

If you decide to get Addictive Keys all 4 can be got for about $25 on KVR Sale forum and Knobcloud.com The reason they go so cheap is they are given away when you buy a Focusrite interface.

In the complete collection you get:

Studio Grand
Modern Upright
Mark One
Electric Grand

https://www.knobcloud.com/i/14943/xln-audio-addictive-keys-complete-collection (All 4 from Knobcloud for €25)
All 4 from KVR Buy/Sell Forum €18


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## olsontex (Jul 17, 2021)

CeDur said:


> I tend to go to Addictive Keys when piano is surrounded with other instruments, but I wouldn't choose it for solo piece.


Sounds like you and I have gravitated towards a lot of the same pianos and had very similar experiences with them. When I wrote my statement about solo vs. full mix I was specifically thinking about how well Addictive Keys tend to sit my mixes. It's one my older VIs and many dollars later I'm using it over other pianos for some applications. I guess I didn't want to "over-endorse it" but I should have pointed out why it's useful. It's slightly over-produced/polished, and that's not what I want in a solo or central instrument, but that same "flaw" is one of the main reasons it's easy to mix into the very crowded frequency band that pianos occupy.


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## Snoobydoobydoo (Jul 17, 2021)

Just bought Augmented Piano (with the current weekend deal), and love it. 
Thinking now of SSSG too, damn.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 17, 2021)

I sure came to the right place

If you do a google search for "Best Piano VSTs for 2021". you'll get the typical players

But here, I've never had so much fun digging through all these lesser known, amazing instruments

I bought SSSG without hesitation, which started me down a frugal path -
as a few of have mentioned, you don't have to break the bank to get amazing tools

With Pianoteq and yesterday's purchase,

Simple Sam Samples Signature Grand (SSSG) ($49.95),

I think I have my Grand section covered

_BUT_

Cinesamples Piano in Blue - just for the history ($99)
and
Production Voices Production Grand Compact - sound and sale price ($29)

are Grands that are hard to ignore

which leaves Upright and Character

leading contenders:

Spitfire Audio Jangle Box Piano ($29)
Westwood Instruments Alt Piano ($59)
Versilian Studios Joachim's Piano - 1890's Steinway B ($99)

Audio Brewers have a selection of uprights that are remarkable

The Upright Prepared (€49)
The Upright Core (€44)
The Upright Felt (€34)
or
The Upright Complete (€109)

the effects processing in the Audio Brewers instruments is stunning

as it stands,

CS Piano in Blue
PV PG Compact

SA Jangle Box
AB Upright Complete

$315.95 (approx) for 5 standout piano instruments

not bad



did I say 3?

it's that fanatical devotion to the pope thing


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## VSriHarsha (Jul 17, 2021)

Have you checked Mrs. Mills Piano? An Upright PianoAnd what about Sonuscore LoKi? It’s an upright.

I love this Sonuscore Piano. I am sure many already mentioned Sampletekk but are really good. Although I don’t have it, I love the tone of CinePiano. Just beautiful I can I can see it fit for Jazz.

I don’t know if it was mentioned but check Wavesfactory’s Tack Piano? I think it’s kinda character Piano. I saw it like weeks back I just don’t remember but I do remember its beautiful interface. If you also like free Pianos, there are plenty on Pianobook website. Piano samplibf truly topped.


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## khollister (Jul 17, 2021)

For grands, I vote for either the VSL Synchron grands (partial to Bosendorfer or Steinway) or Garritan CFX. Noire comes in second due to versatility (does a lot of character stuff too)

For character, I am very fond of the Fracture Sounds pianos. The Woodchester piano is particularly nice. Heavyocity Ascend has a lot of mangled piano variations as well that are well done. Piano Book has a lot of free character piano stuff too. And Noire.

Actually, except for the upright thing, you could do a lot worse than Noire for almost everything. The particle engine is fun to play with as well.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 17, 2021)

VSriHarsha said:


> Have you checked Mrs. Mills Piano?


That looks really nice in addition to Jangle (bought) - I will probably grab it.



khollister said:


> For grands, I vote for either the VSL Synchron grands (partial to Bosendorfer or Steinway) or Garritan CFX. Noire comes in second due to versatility (does a lot of character stuff too)
> 
> Actually, except for the upright thing, you could do a lot worse than Noire for almost everything. The particle engine is fun to play with as well.


Being an OLD school VSL fanboy, I'd love the Synchron Grands, but beyond my price point, especially for my use.

Now NOIRE looks interesting - yes, another grand, but...

For my upright thing, the quirkier the better, so Pianobook.com may be worth rabbit-holing.

THANKS!


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 17, 2021)

these two are lovely together


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## Mike Fox (Jul 17, 2021)

It doesn’t get any better than the Fazioli from Imperfect Samples, imo.

I have the Complete version, and it’s really hard to go back to anything else.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 17, 2021)

Mike Fox said:


> It doesn’t get any better than the Fazioli from Imperfect Samples, imo.
> 
> I have the Complete version, and it’s really hard to go back to anything else.



hmmm, I like the different price points.


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## sostenuto (Jul 17, 2021)

Mike Fox said:


> It doesn’t get any better than the Fazioli from Imperfect Samples, imo.
> 
> I have the Complete version, and it’s really hard to go back to anything else.


So many individual factors here _ not least of which is studio-based hdw /sfw. 
Ivory II Italian has been soooo close for long time. IS _ Ebony 'Basic' was worth adding, but Pro would have been better starting point _ imho. 
For comparable Pro Upgrade cost, tried Audio Brewers _ Pianoforte - Stereo. Early hours, but very pleased this far. Their YT vid by Rabih Rihana convinced to try. Fazioli F212 is surely fav these days.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 17, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> So many individual factors here _ not least of which is studio-based hdw /sfw.
> Ivory II Italian has been soooo close for long time. IS _ Ebony 'Basic' was worth adding, but Pro would have been better starting point _ imho.
> For comparable Pro Upgrade cost, tried Audio Brewers _ Pianoforte - Stereo. Early hours, but very pleased this far. Their YT vid by Rabih Rihana convinced to try. Fazioli F212 is surely fav these days.



I'm impressed with Audio Brewers.

Stereo Piano Forte with up to 24 layers... €79.00

Plus their Uprights - very nice.


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## CeDur (Jul 17, 2021)

Not to diss Pianoforte, but it has some issues. I've recently bough it and shared my experience here 





Baby/studio size piano library


Xperimenta Due is two pianos, a Yamaha C7 and a C3. They are wonderful. For a more modern and "clean" Steinway B I think Fluffy Audio's Scoring Piano is well worth a look. And then there's the VSL Blüthner and Bösendorfer Upright. I would like to finally try something from VSL. Blüthner...




vi-control.net


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## FlyingAndi (Jul 17, 2021)

For a Fazioli with history also checkout Wavesfactory Mercury 





Mercury | Fazioli grand piano library for Kontakt | Wavesfactory







www.wavesfactory.com





Disclaimer: I don't have this one but I've been on the verge of buying it a few times. I think it goes for sale for less than $100 from time to time. Sometimes it can be found in the "for sale" section.


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## Alchemedia (Jul 17, 2021)

Snoobydoobydoo said:


> Just bought Augmented Piano (with the current weekend deal), and love it.
> Thinking now of SSSG too, damn.


The straight AP Pleyel is very nice. Chopin's fav.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 17, 2021)

pcohen12 said:


> Last but not least, if you have the most recent version of Pianoteq, be sure to check out the new felt presets that they recently added!


just upgraded to 7.


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## John R Wilson (Jul 17, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> these two are lovely together


Production Voices is a brilliant library.


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## KEM (Jul 17, 2021)

Malmsjö


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## ptram (Jul 18, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Westwood Alt Piano
> Embertone Walker 1955 Concert D


Very nice list! But I wouldn't consider the first one of my selection as a simple generic upright (it is very much a character piano), nor the second a character piano (it is a legitimate piano that can be used everyday).

Paolo


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## cfodeebiedaddy (Jul 18, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> just upgraded to 7.


Zoot, are you eligible for academic discounts? If you are then VSL have a month (might be September) where there's a 40% education discount that brings their Bosendorfer upright to a price point more comparable with other VIs. That and the VILabs Modern U are brilliant uprights.

Re Piano in Blue, I think I got it for $50 on one of Cinesamples' regular sales!


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 18, 2021)

cfodeebiedaddy said:


> Zoot, are you eligible for academic discounts? If you are then VSL have a month (might be September) where there's a 40% education discount that brings their Bosendorfer upright to a price point more comparable with other VIs. That and the VILabs Modern U are brilliant uprights.
> 
> Re Piano in Blue, I think I got it for $50 on one of Cinesamples' regular sales!



My music tends academic, but I am not an official student.

I'll keep an eye out for Piano Blue sales.

Thanks!


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 18, 2021)

Purchase update:

recent purchases


Simple Sam Samples
Signature Grand
Vintage Upright
Toy Piano

Modartt
Pianoteq 7 Upgrade

Spitfire Audio
Originals Jangle Box Piano

Production Voices
Production Grand Compact C7


With very little time in with these instruments, I am really enjoying the Production Grand Compact with added 3rd party reverb (usually Relab).

Always a challenge to explain, but there is an immediacy to the tone and feel - closeness too. Probably due to only one mic position.

Fewer or no choices can be good sometimes.

I may pickup their Concert Grand Compact (Steinway D) - price makes it a classic no-brainer.

SSS Vintage Upright is fun.

Rethinking my grand/upright approach - 

perhaps a more STUDIO oriented grand than a concert hall model?


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## CeDur (Jul 18, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> With very little time in with these instruments, I am really enjoying the Production Grand Compact with added 3rd party reverb (usually Relab).
> 
> Always a challenge to explain, but there is an immediacy to the tone and feel - closeness too. Probably due to only one mic position.
> 
> ...


Although Production Grand 2 comes with nice convolution reverbs, recently I'm using it with Seventh Heaven reverb, also sounds really nice. I think Outside mic (included in Compact) is the best from 8 available. I mix it with others (I like to add some mono PZM mic to give it more center image and a bit more bite) but I could live with only one. I also bought Concert Grand LE and as much as I find it improved from coding/scripting perspective, I do not like its sound as much as C7. Also, there are so many Steinway D libraries, competition is hard


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 18, 2021)

CeDur said:


> Also, there are so many Steinway D libraries, competition is hard


thinking hard about Piano in Blue for this and the studio thing

plus that history - could be too niche though

recently recommended:

CinePiano - Scoring Stage Environment
Imperfect Samples Steinway Walnut Concert Grand
Keyscape Yamaha C7


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## Simeon (Jul 18, 2021)

@Zoot_Rollo , you have embarked on an incredible adventure 🤓
It seems you are making some great decisions along the way. Here is a vid I did for Piano In Blue. I am also very interested in the stories that these instruments contain, imagining the hands that have played the keys.



I also would recommend taking a look at the Hammers and Waves collection, as it covers a lot of ground.



I am also a Huge fan so the SSS Signature Grand as well.

Turn your sails into the wind and enjoy the trip, once you begin there is no turning back.

All the best!


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## Snoobydoobydoo (Jul 18, 2021)

Now where are the Harpsichords for the all different timbre…


Alchemedia said:


> The straight AP Pleyel is very nice. Chopin's fav.


Whats this Chopin everyone’s talking about, a french wine that makes your head spin? 

The preparations are nice too, inspired me to get attackier :€


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 18, 2021)

Simeon said:


> @Zoot_Rollo , you have embarked on an incredible adventure 🤓
> It seems you are making some great decisions along the way. Here is a vid I did for Piano In Blue. I am also very interested in the stories that these instruments contain, imagining the hands that have played the keys.
> 
> 
> ...



Hi Simeon,

So nice of you to join the ride.

I've watched a few of your videos over the last few days. They are super informative and very enjoyable.

Thank you for the Hammers and Waves mention - looks they are brand new. Love the technology.

I was reading through the H&W thread - I may be in a unique position in that I am not flush with piano libraries.

SO a collection just may fit the bill. I considered Keyscape, but thought that would be a copout, FOR ME. I am enjoying the journey too much.

However, H&W is a different kind of collection. I will definitely watch your walkthrough videos.



good stuff!


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## Consona (Jul 18, 2021)

Black Grand MkII - Steinway D Grand Piano







www.sampletekk.com









WG2 MkII - Studio Grand Piano


WG2 MkII




www.sampletekk.com









Rain Piano MkII







www.sampletekk.com


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## doctoremmet (Jul 18, 2021)

Wait. A cool piano thread WITH @Simeon but WITHOUT @newman and Craig Richards @CGR. Guess they’re on a holiday


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 18, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Wait. A cool piano thread WITH @Simeon but WITHOUT @newman and Craig Richards @CGR. Guess they’re on a holiday



I am not familiar with @newman or Craig Richards @CGR.

Apparently they have a rep - would be fun to hear from them.


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## VSriHarsha (Jul 18, 2021)

Have any mentioned Teletone’s Postcard Piano? Is it a Grand or what ? I don’t know but you might wanna check.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 18, 2021)

VSriHarsha said:


> Have any mentioned Teletone’s Postcard Piano? Is it a Grand or what ? I don’t know but you might wanna check.


very nice! thanks for sharing that.

reminds me of Sound Dust's offerings:


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

Jangle Box was a solid buy!





Nice job with the Originals!





**


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

Sampltekk has quite the collection of grands - crazy!






Grand Pianos


Grand Piano Meta




www.sampletekk.com





i've read the SSG and White are notable selections from Sampletekk.

I know this is hardly news to most of you - it's astounding how many amazing instruments are available these days compared to when I first started digging in not all that long ago.

thanks to everyone being so patient with my thread - i know there are plenty of piano discussions here, fantastic info!


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## doctoremmet (Jul 19, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Sampltekk has quite the collection of grands - crazy!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes, there’s quite a few piano afficionados on here. Sampletekk do regular 80% off sales, and once you own some of Per’s instruments he starts sending you emails for a 90% off sale. So at some point it becomes very tempting to get a bunch if his samples. The TVBO C7 is also a good one. (The Clavia Nord instruments also source some of their piano samples from Sampletekk).


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## doctoremmet (Jul 19, 2021)

Audioplugin Deals also have a Sampletekk bundle on sale from time to time, at very reasonable prices. A good “way in”, and after that get the rest of your fancy at a 90% off sale.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Audioplugin Deals also have a Sampletekk bundle on sale from time to time, at very reasonable prices. A good “way in”, and after that gean the rest of your fancy at a 90% off sale.



will be fun to wait for the sales.

Sampletekk, Light and Sound, and Piano and Blue are my latest targets.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

nice comparison page.






Piano Compare







www.sampletekk.com





what's a good Sampletekk starter?

i don't mind paying retail now and then - someone has to, yes?


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## VSriHarsha (Jul 19, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> very nice! thanks for sharing that.
> 
> reminds me of Sound Dust's offerings:



Thanks & never heard about Sound Dust’s Piano.


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 19, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> nice comparison page.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


WG Mk II springs to mind. @CGR @Simeon if you could have ONLY one, which one would you get?






WG2 MkII - Studio Grand Piano


WG2 MkII




www.sampletekk.com





But honestly… I’d never pay $199 for it! Wait for it to come down to $40. It’s BF before you know it. In the mean time resist the GAS and create music and compose with your OTHER pianos


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 19, 2021)

VSriHarsha said:


> Thanks & never heard about Sound Dust’s Piano.


Do yourself a favour and watch all of Pendle Poucher’s videos. His creative sampled instruments are FUN, and most excellent. Do not expect something “ordinary” though, that’s not his aim in life.


----------



## FlyingAndi (Jul 19, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> will be fun to wait for the sales.
> 
> Sampletekk, Light and Sound, and Piano and Blue are my latest targets.


Yes, it starts out fun, and then it becomes an addiction.
For sampletekk, see also this post (and the whole thread):





Sampletekk pianos recommendations during sale?


Hi I just saw an ad for sampletekk 80% sale. Are there pianos any good? I currently have the pianos from NI KU, and I just purchased Ascend during BF. I am looking for more upright and noticed they have a few, but I may purchase some grands too if they are so cheap. Im somewhat interested in the...




vi-control.net


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> In the mean time resist the GAS and create music and compose with your OTHER pianos





FlyingAndi said:


> Yes, it starts out fun, and then it becomes an addiction.


yes indeedy - i've been through it with string libraries and amp sims.

i am intimate with the gas pain.

so far, fairly frugal with pianos - i haven't sprung for a "BIG GUN" yet.

i'm enjoying finding lesser known, unique instruments that tend to be affordable.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Do yourself a favour and watch all of Pendle Poucher’s videos. His creative sampled instruments are FUN, and most excellent. Do not expect something “ordinary” though, that’s not his aim in life.



his overviews are excellent - i could have them on in the background while i work my day job.









Music Software | Gear4music


Music Software | Gear4music




www.timespace.com


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> resist the GAS and create music and compose with your OTHER pianos


Dude, what does this even mean?


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 19, 2021)

SupremeFist said:


> Dude, what does this even mean?


In Dutch we have a saying: de beste stuurlui staan aan wal (the best sailors are standing ashore)


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 19, 2021)

Anyone tried this one yet? From Steinberg, made by Sampletekk 








4Knob Upright: The Perfect Songwriter Piano


Tell your story with an amazing 80-year-old upright piano sampled by SampleTekk. 4Knob Upright is ideal for songwriter music, acoustic pop and blues.




new.steinberg.net


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 19, 2021)

SupremeFist said:


> Anyone tried this one yet? From Steinberg, made by Sampletekk
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I think @Simeon has. He also did the earlier Pop D.


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 19, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Rethinking my grand/upright approach -
> 
> perhaps a more STUDIO oriented grand than a concert hall model?


Xperimenta Due's Second Piano (a Yamaha C3) is my absolute favourite at this size.


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I think Simeon has. He also did the earlier Pop D.



Ah of course Simeon has! Look forward to watching. 🤘🏻


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

SupremeFist said:


> Xperimenta Due's Second Piano (a Yamaha C3) is my absolute favourite at this size.


eeegad, the list never ends!

C3 + C7 for the Xperrimenta - $99 too

looks really good on paper.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> In Dutch we have a saying: de beste stuurlui staan aan wal (the best sailors are standing ashore)


my family left the Vaderland in 1620.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> WG Mk II springs to mind. @CGR @Simeon if you could have ONLY one, which one would you get?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


thank you Doctor.


without fail - Simeon! THANKFULLY!





curious interface.

"For only $24.99 (normally $199), get the WG2 MkII Studio Grand Piano by SAMPLETEKK!"

i'll definitely wait.


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 19, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> curious interface


Absolutely. Never judge a Sampletekk book by its cover though! 

And yes: wait! The bundles will arrive soon enough.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Absolutely. Never judge a Sampletekk book by its cover though!
> 
> And yes: wait! The bundles will arrive soon enough.


definitely, appreciate the info!

i'm thinking Piano in Blue may be unavoidable 

still would like a couple of flagship studio/soundstage-ish/clean grands. Sampletekk on sale may be the thing!

for uprights, the VI Labs Modern U looks and sounds STELLAR, but may be overkill for my needs.

my taste for uprights leans toward the damaged and obscure.


----------



## FlyingAndi (Jul 19, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> yes indeedy - i've been through it with string libraries and amp sims


Ah, we don't talk too much about amp sims here. Maybe we should create an amp sim thread before this one goes off topic because I need to tell everybody how much I like KUASSA matchlock.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

FlyingAndi said:


> Ah, we don't talk too much about amp sims here. Maybe we should create an amp sim thread before this one goes off topic because I need to tell everybody how much I like KUASSA matchlock.


Amp what?

Matchlock is a fave!


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 19, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> my taste for uprights leans toward the damaged and obscure.


Sampletekk Rain Piano and Vertikal are some of my best, to be honest

Also, obscure? Check out the Pripyat Piano.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Sampletekk Rain Piano and Vertikal are some of my best, to be honest
> 
> Also, obscure? Check out the Pripyat Piano.




​
instant buy!

this thread is turning into "Let's see who can get Zoot to spend his money!"


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 19, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> this thread is turning into "Let's see who can get Zoot to spend his money!"


@ism You following this? I am waiting for you to share your favourite hashtag


----------



## Snoobydoobydoo (Jul 19, 2021)

Has SSSSG a noisier Tail on the samples than other libs?


----------



## CeDur (Jul 19, 2021)

What do you mean by noisier? Noise floor or rather some resonances?


----------



## Snoobydoobydoo (Jul 19, 2021)

Noise floor. Someone wrote about it somewhere.


----------



## CeDur (Jul 19, 2021)

I can check tomorrow, but I haven't noticed any, for example compared to Garritan CFX.


----------



## Snoobydoobydoo (Jul 19, 2021)

Thanks, always hard to judge w/o playing it or from Videos.
Oh and you have Cinepiano too, would be fine for me if the 4SG is comparable in terms of noise floor.


----------



## Jkist (Jul 19, 2021)

I picked up SSSSSSSSSSSG at $50 because of this thread. WOW. How has this skirted under my radar so long? This thing is beautiful, and oddly the playability is better than a lot of other "bigger name" libraries IMO. This thing just works!

As for the noise floor, yes, it can get a bit crazy with high voice counts at long sustains, similar to Keyscape, but its manageable. Absolutely worth every penny IMO.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

Pianos so far​
Strix Instruments
PRIPYAT Pianos ($29.00)

Simple Sam Samples
Vintage Upright ($29.95)
Vintage Toy Piano ($1.00)
Signature Grand ($49.95)

Modartt SAS
Pianoteq 7 Upgrade ($39.00)

Spitfire Audio
Origins Jangle Box Piano ($29.00)

Production Voices
Production Grand Compact ($29.00)

Total $206.90

Some grands, some uprights, some characters

Not bad


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 19, 2021)

I started this thread because of what I was seeing from google searches:

"What are the best piano VSTs for 2021"

Here are a few of the results (by title of page)

_Best Piano VST Plugins (Chosen by a Pro Composer) | 2021 Guide_

Keyscape
Garritan CFX
Vienna Imperial
Ravenscroft 275
Piantoteq 7
Ivory II
Addictive Keys Studio Grand
_Best Piano VST Plugins 2021 (Experts Choice)_

Keyscape
Vienna Imperial
Native Instruments Alicia Keys
XLN Audio Addictive Keys
Garritan CFX
Ivory II
Piantoteq 7
_8 Best Piano VST of 2021_

Garritan CFX
Omnisphere (!)
Garritan Instant Orchestra Piano Virtual Studio Technology
XLN Addictive Keys Studio Collection
Italian Grand Virtual Instrument
Ivory II Uprights
Ivory II Grands
Keyscape
Over and over, the same titles.

I'm not saying these are bad, I'm sure all are excellent (I own PTEQ7 and like it!)

but, they are safe, easy, not very adventurous answers. impartial, most claim. (?)

this thread has revealed some true gems that never make to any of these lists.

hats off to the VI Control community!


----------



## ism (Jul 20, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> @ism You following this? I am waiting for you to share your favourite hashtag


You mean this one?

#CurseYouAnyoneTryingToSellMeANewPianoBecauseWhyWouldYouThinkICouldPossiblyNeedYetAnotherPianoOoohThatLooksLikeAReallyNicePianoNowThatYouMentionIt


----------



## CeDur (Jul 20, 2021)

Snoobydoobydoo said:


> Thanks, always hard to judge w/o playing it or from Videos.
> Oh and you have Cinepiano too, would be fine for me if the 4SG is comparable in terms of noise floor.


If you want to hear it by yourself, send me some MIDI file and I'll render it through both Cinepiano and Signatrue Grand. If there is any noise, it's usually most audible when many keys are played simultanously with softer velocities. Another thing is, the more resonances, colourful piano character etc. the less noise you will hear, since it's masked. 

Also I'm wondering if people who wrote about Signature having huge noise levels had 'Player noise' turned off, since it simulates playing live (you hear breathing, body movement etc.). I really like this effect. SC Hammersmith also has the 'noise' knob which gives you some environemntal studio sounds, very pleasant experience.



Zoot_Rollo said:


> I started this thread because of what I was seeing from google searches:
> 
> "What are the best piano VSTs for 2021"


The main purpose of such websites and their rankings is mainly marketing. I've also learnt about many options after I registered here. Funny thing, but none of my top3 piano libraries is included in those rankings.


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 20, 2021)

ism said:


> You mean this one?
> 
> #CurseYouAnyoneTryingToSellMeANewPianoBecauseWhyWouldYouThinkICouldPossiblyNeedYetAnotherPianoOoohThatLooksLikeAReallyNicePianoNowThatYouMentionIt


That’s the one! I thought I had learned it by heart but somehow in my mind it was warped and came out as 

#CurseYouCreditcardDebtLimitsINeedMoreMoneyBecauseSimeonJustDroppedAnotherVideo


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

Digging through other VI-C piano threads, the Embertone Walker 1955 Concert D is mentioned frequently with high regard.

What a monster!

Piano in Blue is a D as well.

Which got me thinking about actual piano models.


Bechstein
C Series
D 282
C 234
B 212
M/P 192
L 167

B Series
B 228
B 208
B 190
B 175
B 160


Blüthner
Model 1
Model 2
Model 4
Model 6
Model 10
Model 11

Bösendorfer
290
280
280VC
225
214
200
185
170
155

Fazioli
F308
F278
F228
F212
F183
F156

Grotian
Concert Royal
Concert
Charis
Cabinet
Chambre
Studio 192/208

Sauter
Concert 275
Omega 220
Delta 185
Noblesse 160/185
Alpha 160
Queen Anne 160
Chippendale 160/185
Ambiente
Vivace

Shigery Kawai
SK-EX Concert Grand
SK-7 Semi-Concert Grand
SK-6 Orchestra Grand
SK-5 Chamber Grand
SK-3 Concservatory Grand
SK-2 Classic Salon Grand

Steinway & Sons
Model D
Model B
Model O
Model A
Model M
Model S

Steingraeber & Söhne
Concert Grand E-272
Semi-Concert Grand D-232
Chamber Concert Grand C-212
Salon Grand B-192
Salon Grand A-170

Yamaha
DCFEX3PRO
CFX
CF6
CF4


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

model choices from a couple of major players

VSL
Bösendorfer Concert Grand 290 Imperial
Steinway & Sons D-274
Yamaha CFX
Blüthner 1895

Pianoteq
Steinway Model D grand pianos
Steinway Model B grand piano
Ant. Petrof 275 and Petrof 284 Mistral grand pianos
C. Bechstein DG grand piano
Steingraeber E-272 grand piano
Grotrian Concert Royal grand piano
Blüthner Model 1 grand piano
K2 grand piano


The D and CFX seem to be popular VI instruments.


----------



## VSriHarsha (Jul 20, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Do yourself a favour and watch all of Pendle Poucher’s videos. His creative sampled instruments are FUN, and most excellent. Do not expect something “ordinary” though, that’s not his aim in life.


Alright Doc! I will.


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 20, 2021)

VSriHarsha said:


> Alright Doc! I will.


Cool mate! Curious to hear what you think!


----------



## Snoobydoobydoo (Jul 20, 2021)

CeDur said:


> If you want to hear it by yourself, send me some MIDI file and I'll render it through both Cinepiano and Signatrue Grand. If there is any noise, it's usually most audible when many keys are played simultanously with softer velocities. Another thing is, the more resonances, colourful piano character etc. the less noise you will hear, since it's masked.


Aye, when my nightmarish migraine is gone, i will make something. Danke.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

mentioned in an other thread:






!!!


----------



## sostenuto (Jul 20, 2021)

Marvelous, recent Thread seemingly plowed under and similar info now. 🤷🏻

https://vi-control.net/community/threads/any-recommendations-for-a-piano-vst.109776/page-12


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

good deal?


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> Marvelous, recent Thread seemingly plowed under and similar info now. 🤷🏻
> 
> https://vi-control.net/community/threads/any-recommendations-for-a-piano-vst.109776/page-12


i've been lurking...


----------



## CeDur (Jul 20, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> good deal?


Good if you like it (most people do). If not (like me, I'm not completely satisfied with it) you're basically left with it forever, since Cinesamples do not allow reselling their libraries. If it was possible, I would sell you mine for 50$. But, but.. if you already have Signature Grand, they are not very much different.


----------



## fiction (Jul 20, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> good deal?


I bought it this week. I must say that I'm enjoying it a lot, both the Cinepiano and Classical presets!


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

CeDur said:


> Good if you like it (most people do). If not (like me, I'm not completely satisfied with it) you're basically left with it forever, since Cinesamples do not allow reselling their libraries. If it was possible, I would sell you mine for 50$. But, but.. if you already have Signature Grand, they are not very much different.


I keep coming back to Simple Sam Grand and Upright.

Thanks for the info.


----------



## CeDur (Jul 20, 2021)

Snoobydoobydoo said:


> Aye, when my nightmarish migraine is gone, i will make something. Danke.


By no means any serious "playing", but short samples to showcase noise. Default patches for all of them, but all 'beautifications' like pedal noises etc. turned off. No reverb, it's just how 'wet' those particular pianos are. Starting from 0 to 22s I keep sustain fully pressed, then leave it.

CinePiano:
View attachment CinePiano.mp3


Signature Grand:
View attachment SignatureGrand.mp3


Garritan CFX Full:
View attachment GarritanCFXFull.mp3


Notice how CinePiano noise builds up to around ~11s and then slowly dissapears. In case of Signature Grand it kinda do not disappear until I depress pedal. In case of Garritan, there is a HUUUUGE some noise build up just after the attack, which disappears shortly after, no matter if sustain is pressed or not.

From practical perspecitve, with 'normal' playing, I find the noise 'troubling' only in case of Garritan.



Zoot_Rollo said:


> I keep coming back to Simple Sam Grand and Upright.
> 
> Thanks for the info.


If I were you and you haven't bought it yet, I would try Emberton Walker Concert D instead of CinePiano. It's only 99$ for 36 layer sampled piano, both pedal up and pedal down, separate release samples, proper soft pedal samples, great vintage Steinway sound. It's just sounds so, so beautiful. If you don't like it, you can re-sell it, but I doubt you will. By default there are some 'issues' with playability, at least some say so, but spending some time on velocity and dynamics settings is worth it.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

CeDur said:


> If I were you and you haven't bought it yet, I would try Emberton Walker Concert D instead of CinePiano. It's only 99$ for 36 layer sampled piano, both pedal up and pedal down, separate release samples, proper soft pedal samples, great vintage Steinway sound. It's just sounds so, so beautiful. If you don't like it, you can re-sell it, but I doubt you will. By default there are some 'issues' with playability, at least some say so, but spending some time on velocity and dynamics settings is worth it.


I was just looking at Walker

interesting, I was confused about the pricing - the $99 DOES have the 36 layer.

i think.

a little confusing about the mics - can you choose ONE MIC of your choice with the $99?







this and GIANT.

and i'll be done... right?

<taps mic>

RIGHT?


-


silly me, squirming over $50 - just go for it!

i spend that much on gerbil feed every day.


----------



## CeDur (Jul 20, 2021)

If you ask me, Giant, compared to other libraries we're talking about here, is, well.. Not as good  But each to their own, you might like it sound.
With Walker, for 99$ you get Main Mic, which is the most balanced one. You can buy additional mics afterwards. My favorite are Close (for more intimate stuff) and Hammer (when you have to cut through the mix).


----------



## sostenuto (Jul 20, 2021)

CeDur said:


> If you ask me, Giant, compared to other libraries we're talking about here, is, well.. Not as good  But each to their own, you might like it sound.
> With Walker, for 99$ you get Main Mic, which is the most balanced one. You can buy additional mics afterwards. My favorite are Close (for more intimate stuff) and Hammer (when you have to cut through the mix).


Post recently by @ CGR re layering two Mics .... I 'think' Hammer + Room, but _need_ to re-check. 
He was very pleased with the combo. So far, I have been as well.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> Post recently by @ CGR re layering two Mics .... I 'think' Hammer + Room, but _need_ to re-check.
> He was very pleased with the combo. So far, I have been as well.


i just read that as well.


----------



## CeDur (Jul 20, 2021)

Well, on my laptop I was never able to play Walker 1955 with 2 mics simultanously without cracks and pops with sample buffer low enough to have decent latency. I prefer to have set it to 36 layers but with all beautifications enabled (addaptive releases <3) and HQ pedal mode. Hammer + Room seems like a great combination, but I never bought Room mic (I was struggling with 240GB SSD then, and full EW takes 200GB).

Regarding CGR, no matter what he plays it sounds beautiful. Same thing with Simon with his reviews.
Last Christmas I uploaded a simple amateur cover where I used only Close mics from EW1955, I really like how the short intro sounds there. Don't bother with my agricultural playing and zero vocal editing capabilities after 0:20, but I think the intro was spot on:


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

CeDur said:


> Well, on my laptop I was never able to play Walker 1955 with 2 mics simultanously without cracks and pops with sample buffer low enough to have decent latency. I prefer to have set it to 36 layers but with all beautifications enabled (addaptive releases <3) and HQ pedal mode. Hammer + Room seems like a great combination, but I never bought Room mic (I was struggling with 240GB SSD then, and full EW takes 200GB).
> 
> Regarding CGR, no matter what he plays it sounds beautiful. Same thing with Simon with his reviews.
> Last Christmas I uploaded a simple amateur cover where I used only Close mics from EW1955, I really like how the short intro sounds there. Don't bother with my agricultural playing and zero vocal editing capabilities after 0:20, but I think the intro was spot on:



holy moly!

really nice playing.

just the first few notes from Walker blew me away.

it's got just enough "character" - not really character, but personality, i guess.

i bought a 4tb SSD just for times like this.

and CeDur, you have a lovely voice. 

-

about to pull the trigger on my flagship Grand.

what would be a comparable upright? Modern U looks amazing, but too pristine and grand-like for my upright taste.

THANK YOU FOR POSTING THAT!!!


----------



## CeDur (Jul 20, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> holy moly!
> 
> really nice playing.
> 
> ...


Thanks! But oh, It's my good friend singing, only my hands are there  I really like her voice (what's funny, usually my other female singer-friends don't), I went back to playing piano during lockdown and we recorded a few covers just for fun.

No advices from me regarding upright, I've already mentioned Addictive Keys Upright, but like it was already said, it's better suited for production/mixing than just playing solo.

I couldn't live with 4TB SSD, it would be too tempting to fill it with more libraries, I have to limit myself. Embertone Walker takes some space, but it's worth it and you won't regret it I believe.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

CeDur said:


> Thanks! But oh, It's my good friend singing, only my hands are there  I really like her voice (what's funny, usually my other female singer-friends don't), I went back to playing piano during lockdown and we recorded a few covers just for fun.
> 
> No advices from me regarding upright, I've already mentioned Addictive Keys Upright, but like it was already said, it's better suited for production/mixing than just playing solo.
> 
> I couldn't live with 4TB SSD, it would be too tempting to fill it with more libraries, I have to limit myself. Embertone Walker takes some space, but it's worth it and you won't regret it I believe.








patiently waiting.

thanks for all the great input! gonna sleep on it and decide.

the upright isn't that critical, plus, i'm enjoying what i've gotten since the thread started.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

this captures exactly what i felt when i listened to your recording

from epicomposer:

THE SOUND OF STEINWAY
If I had to summarize Embertone’s version of the 1955 Steinway D in one word, it would be ‘balanced’. The piano’s sound is very well-balanced both in itself as well as across the different tonal registers. By default, you get a classic grand piano sound that surely has character but at the same time brings enough clarity to serve as an all-round workhorse for many genres.

While the low notes are strong and powerful, they don’t drown the piano in a muddy cloud of bass when played loudly. In the lower dynamics, the low keys give you an intimately warm, woody sound. The higher register notes provide you with a pearly sheen and subtle bite depending on your playing style. The overall piano sound feels wonderfully natural and un-hyped, while at the same time providing just the right amount of modern tone to make it cut through a contemporary mix. In contrast to other, similar libraries on the market that either present a piano sound that’s too clinical/artificial or too vibey, Embertone successfully walks the rope between character and definition.


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 20, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> Post recently by @ CGR re layering two Mics .... I 'think' Hammer + Room, but _need_ to re-check.
> He was very pleased with the combo. So far, I have been as well.


Yes you want to buy the full package to see which mic combo works best for you. (I like Hammer & Wide.) The Walker is exquisite, no doubt, especially solo. (CinePiano, while less deeply sampled, is easier to dial in spatially and can work better in a mix.)


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

New Technology Recaptures Pianists of the Past


Decades of amazing musical performances are hidden behind the limits of audio technology at the time they were recorded. Now, a new technology re-performs and records classics by Glenn Gould, Alfred Cortot and Art Tatum.




www.npr.org


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 20, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> New Technology Recaptures Pianists of the Past
> 
> 
> Decades of amazing musical performances are hidden behind the limits of audio technology at the time they were recorded. Now, a new technology re-performs and records classics by Glenn Gould, Alfred Cortot and Art Tatum.
> ...


That's interesting. But the "new" version of the Gould sounds absolutely hilariously horrible? Why would anyone prefer to listen to that?


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

SupremeFist said:


> That's interesting. But the "new" version of the Gould sounds absolutely hilariously horrible? Why would anyone prefer to listen to that?


Supposedly, that's the process Embertone used to capture the Walker.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

Simeon's reactions and expressions say it all.





sometimes Simeon channels the Bob Ross of piano demos,

"happy little mic positions."

just lovely.


----------



## styledelk (Jul 20, 2021)

While I have a lot of these already, I hadn't heard the Simple Sam grand yet. Wow, that may be my new goto for just simply playing. As much as I love the Embertone Walker, it's like taking out a Star Destroyer every time I just want to fly around a little bit.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 20, 2021)

styledelk said:


> While I have a lot of these already, I hadn't heard the Simple Sam grand yet. Wow, that may be my new goto for just simply playing. As much as I love the Embertone Walker, it's like taking out a Star Destroyer every time I just want to fly around a little bit.


yes, that's the only thing holding me back.


----------



## styledelk (Jul 20, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> yes, that's the only thing holding me back.


It is absolutely beautiful. Made even more so if you have a pedal capable of half-pedaling.
But... it's a beast, the install of it can be a bit labored (especially if you bought it years ago, now), and in the full full full version, it's just a paralysis of choice.
Lovely, though.


----------



## sostenuto (Jul 20, 2021)

styledelk said:


> While I have a lot of these already, I hadn't heard the Simple Sam grand yet. Wow, that may be my new goto for just simply playing. As much as I love the Embertone Walker, it's like taking out a Star Destroyer every time I just want to fly around a little bit.


Hmmm .... Truly enamored when first added, but various Walker 1955 Concert D Mic combos pushed SS Grand back a bit. Clearly _ depends much on application, and remains on short list for new projects.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)

Today's flavors:

Garritan CFX
Piano in Blue
WG2 MkII - Studio Grand Piano
Rain Piano MkII

_Notes from the field:_

Pianoteq is dropping in my list - plays great, sounds odd now

Free Hammersmith sounds nice, but not getting consistent dynamics

Simple Sam is still enjoyable - Grand and Upright

Production Grand Compact - another enjoyable kit for practice, but now noticing some weird artifacts


----------



## Simeon (Jul 21, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> looking forward to the Sampltekk sales.
> From their Facebook page, sales seem to happen quite often


Keep your eye on Audio Plugin Deals Thursday, just sayin 😎


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 21, 2021)

Simeon said:


> Keep your eye on Audio Plugin Deals Thursday, just sayin 😎


@Zoot_Rollo See? Toldcha!


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)

Simeon said:


> Keep your eye on Audio Plugin Deals Thursday, just sayin 😎





doctoremmet said:


> @Zoot_Rollo See? Toldcha!


Thanks guys!!!

Yes you did Doctor E - made me look!

Double checked my Audio Plugin Deals account and I have $40 in rewards.

Whoo!

Sampletekk and Nord.

Had no idea.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)




----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)




----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 21, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


>



Ah. Valued VI member @Stephen Limbaugh - the man can PLAY!


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 21, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


>



Yep, if your budget can stretch to it that Synchron Imperial is absolutely wonderful. Definitely in my top 5 (and creeping up the more I learn to dial in the sound I want: the VSL pianos, at least the full libraries, are extremely flexible in this regard).


----------



## CeDur (Jul 21, 2021)

I'm going to buy VSL Bluthner once they move to iLok. Haven't tried any VSL piano in person, but judging by demos it usually sounds quite far/distant, more like simulating piano concerto from audience perspective than player - that's what I'm a bit afraid of.


----------



## Stephen Limbaugh (Jul 21, 2021)

CeDur said:


> I'm going to buy VSL Bluthner once they move to iLok. Haven't tried any VSL piano in person, but judging by demos it usually sounds quite far/distant, more like simulating piano concerto from audience perspective than player - that's what I'm a bit afraid of.


Check 3mins into that video. 🤙🏻


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 21, 2021)

CeDur said:


> I'm going to buy VSL Bluthner once they move to iLok. Haven't tried any VSL piano in person, but judging by demos it usually sounds quite far/distant, more like simulating piano concerto from audience perspective than player - that's what I'm a bit afraid of.


Almost all their official demos showcase that kind of sound, which I don't like at all either, but in fact you can get nice and close (especially with the mics in the full versions).


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)




----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)

*VSL Synchron Pianos*


Steinway & Sons D-274, Hamburg Model
Standard: €267
Full: €522

Bösendorfer Concert Grand 290 Imperial
Standard: €285
Full: €540

Bösendorfer 280VC
Standard: €285
Full: €445

Bösendorfer Upright
Standard: €165
Full: €290

Yamaha CFX
Standard: €255
Full: €490

Blüthner 1895
Standard: €195
Full: €345



*Garritan CFX - $159*


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)




----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 21, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> since we're sniffing corks...


Own and love Studio Grands, as part of my quest to hoard all Steinway B samples in existence.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Own and love Studio Grands, as part of my quest to hoard all Steinway B samples in existence.


----------



## Buz (Jul 21, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> *VSL Synchron Pianos*
> 
> 
> Steinway & Sons D-274, Hamburg Model
> ...


Yeah the price hurts, but I've found one full library keeps me occupied for literally months just learning how to make it sound good. You can mix it so many ways it ends up covering the ground of many different instruments (and it's probably coded better than those).


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Own and love Studio Grands, as part of my quest to hoard all Steinway B samples in existence.


very nice


----------



## sostenuto (Jul 21, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


>


Italian Grand longtime fav.

Kinda recall @ Stephen Limbaugh not liking Synthogy much ?? Never had chance to Reply to ask him re. specifics. 🤷🏻


----------



## Stephen Limbaugh (Jul 21, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> Italian Grand longtime fav.
> 
> Kinda recall @ Stephen Limbaugh not liking Synthogy much ?? 🤷🏻


Loved Ivory II back in 2012/13… but it was really difficult for me to add a space, width, and dimension to the sound. The Studio grands have a LOT of noise in them which requires a lot of automation of one of the knobs (cant remember which one).

My view is that better stuff has come out since then.


----------



## sostenuto (Jul 21, 2021)

Stephen Limbaugh said:


> Loved Ivory II back in 2012/13… but it was really difficult for me to add a space, width, and dimension to the sound. The Studio grands have a LOT of noise in them which requires a lot of automation of one of the knobs (cant remember which one).
> 
> My view is that better stuff has come out since then.


THX ! @ CGR has mentioned Synthogy 'tone' if memory serves. 
Personal interest .... Shirley Horn (RIP) fan here, Fazioli ~F212 gets me where I like with: Here's To Life, Where Do You Start, many more.
Audio Brewers - Pianoforte now preferred over Italian Grand.

Regards


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)

this seems to get a lot of love around here:


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)




----------



## Jkist (Jul 21, 2021)

I dont know if Experimenta ever fixed their weird sustain pedal issue. You hit a note, hit the sustain pedal, then let off and immediately hit the pedal again, and the notes you last played come back again. It was super annoying, if they've fixed it I need to update.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)

Jkist said:


> I dont know if Experimenta ever fixed their weird sustain pedal issue. You hit a note, hit the sustain pedal, then let off and immediately hit the pedal again, and the notes you last played come back again. It was super annoying, if they've fixed it I need to update.



from the XPERIMENTA website:
1.9: What's new​
We released a new, definitive version of XPERIMENTA Due. Improvements:

New Feature! Half-Pedaling support
New Feature! Sympathetic Resonance is generated by both samples and an Impulse Response.
Fix: no more latency, maximum playability
Fix: better CPU performances
Improvement: better automated de-noising of the first and second piano
Other little fixes and improvements


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 21, 2021)




----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)




----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

so it begins


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

I wasn't going to go big guns so soon, but

I did.

Browsing the classified, I stumbled onto a couple of resale items to hard to resist.

Which prompted the purchase of a 3rd

3 - the original impetus of this thread

I'm all about triptychs; 3 points make a plane; third time's a charm; three little pigs; three blind mice; Goldilocks and the three bears; Cinderella and her evil stepsisters; and Aladdin’s Genie, who grants not one, but three wishes. The three musketeers eventually inspired the three stooges and the three amigos; rock, paper, scissors; “three guys walk into a bar… .”

so

1. Steinway
2. Bösendorfer 
3. Yamaha

guess?

@CGR and @SupremeFist: you can't play


----------



## anderslink (Jul 22, 2021)

For a less characterful piano comparison try this: https://www.sweetwater.com/insync/virtual-piano-shootout-sound-samples/
Keyscape came out on top for me in multiple compositions.

For something more characterful the Keyscape C7 is definitely not it. I like Fracture Sounds midnight grand, olafur's felt, and cinesamples abbey roads upright challen (no longer sold, I don't like spitfire's version as much).

Piano in blue is too noisy. A felt piano is better and has a similar character at low velocities. I do like the tone OK but it's not as good as it once was.


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 22, 2021)

anderslink said:


> Piano in blue is too noisy.


That is very much a matter of taste. I like it best when using the taped samples and adding some of the hiss back.


----------



## Simeon (Jul 22, 2021)

And here is the


Zoot_Rollo said:


> thank you Doctor.
> 
> 
> without fail - Simeon! THANKFULLY!
> ...



And here we go ;^)









Elkatwin Retro Synth Sample Library by Xtant Audio - Audio Plugin Deals


The Elkatwin 61 is an Italian analogue synthesizer, considered a great string machine amongst enthusiasts and now available as an easy to use Kontakt 5 instrument.




bit.ly





WG MK II (White Grand II), TVBO, Black Grand MK II





*Some links provide a small incentive to provide support for the affiliate ;^)


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

Simeon said:


> And here is the
> 
> And here we go ;^)
> 
> ...



Whoa!

INSTANT BUY!

thanks @Simeon


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 22, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Whoa!
> 
> INSTANT BUY!
> 
> thanks @Simeon


Have fun. These three are all equally great.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

SupremeFist said:


> That is very much a matter of taste. I like it best when using the taped samples and adding some of the hiss back.



I tend to agree.

I just installed one of my new BIG GUNS, it is lovely, clean, responsive.

but there is something about the less perfect, "noisy", funky, low velocity count, etc. instruments that speaks to me.

i'll still grab PiB if it goes on sale.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Have fun. These three are all equally great.


funny how those were the 3 I have been keeping an eye on.

that and Rain Piano Mk II

thanks Doc!


----------



## CeDur (Jul 22, 2021)

Does anybody own Sampletekk Small Studio Grand? https://www.sampletekk.com/grand-pianos&product_id=262 

I have TVBO and WG2 bought separately, but I'm curious about that one.


----------



## doctoremmet (Jul 22, 2021)

CeDur said:


> Does anybody own Sampletekk Small Studio Grand? https://www.sampletekk.com/grand-pianos&product_id=262
> 
> I have TVBO and WG2 bought separately, but I'm curious about that one.


Have it. Sounds great too haha.


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 22, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> i'll still grab PiB if it goes on sale.


It's a must!


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

while i'm waiting for all my great new VIs,

_off topic tangent (my thread) HA!_


*what is everyone's 88 key controller of choice?*

i've gone through a few, most recently a StudioLogic SL88 Studio.

it was just OK, great build quality, but not for me.

I downsized to a 61 key controller, but with all these new instruments, I'd like to get another 88 key controller.

I've read here on VI-C, digital pianos tend to have better, more accurate piano action than MIDI controllers.

I like a lighter action, though, so something in-between perhaps?

I prefer USB, but my RME Babyface Pro has MIDI (looking at you Kawai).

Thoughts? 

I know @Simeon uses an SL88 Grand - so that is an option.


----------



## Jkist (Jul 22, 2021)

I recently picked up a Juno DS88. In my opinion, for a midrange controller thats not a top-end Kawai, your money is best spent here, or on a Korg D1.

The Juno has a killer keybed. I tried the A-88 Mk2 and found the action a tad too heavy, like the keys were pretty stiff. The Juno is just right. Add to this the fact it has assignable faders, buttons, pads, knobs, etc, as well as a massive amount of on-board sounds, functionality, interesting features, etc, and you have so much more than just a midi controller.


----------



## CeDur (Jul 22, 2021)

Both Kawai ES8 and Korg Grandstage (D1 has the same action) I owned had 'lighter' and faster keybeds than Roland FP10 I use as a MIDI controller currently, but I much prefer Roland: it's easier to control dynamics of a piano. If you are after 'lighter', look elswehere. Maybe something with Fatar TP100? Or take a look at Kurzweil SP6.


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 22, 2021)

CeDur said:


> Both Kawai ES8 and Korg Grandstage (D1 has the same action) I owned had 'lighter' and faster keybeds than Roland FP10 I use as a MIDI controller currently, but I much prefer Roland: it's easier to control dynamics of a piano. If you are after 'lighter', look elswehere. Maybe something with Fatar TP100? Or take a look at Kurzweil SP6.


I too use a Roland FP10, but if one is after "lighter" I think it's still hard to beat the NI S88, especially if you'll use the KK stuff, when those knobs become really nice. (I wrote a lot of piano stuff on a hired S88 when I was abroad for a time in 2018 and I managed to make it work...)


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

i can be convinced to move away from the lighter synth action.

so please, don't let that keep other recommendations from coming.

$1,500 max.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

FP30 replace the FP10?









Roland FP-30X Digital Piano with Speakers - Black


88-key Digital Piano with SuperNATURAL Modeling, PHA-4 Keyboard with Progressive Hammer Action and Escapement, Onboard FX, Speaker System, and Audio/MIDI via Bluetooth and USB - Black




www.sweetwater.com






this looks like a great affordable option.


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 22, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> FP30 replace the FP10?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Same action but the 30x supports continuous pedalling, while the 10 responds only to off-half-full.


----------



## sostenuto (Jul 22, 2021)

Early 'replacement' (vintage Roland KR-577) days here. 
Wondering if Simeon would choose SL88 today, given new options since ? 

Stu Harrison impresses with RD2000 on various YT vids, but only need MIDI Keyboard functionality. Do these Rolands (FP-30x, et al) have same keybed ??






stu harrison virtual piano reviews - Bing video







www.bing.com


----------



## Jkist (Jul 22, 2021)

Roland FP30x and FP60x share same keybed, PHA4. Roland Juno DS-88 has their "Ivory Feel-G" keybed. Roland FP90x has their flagship PHA50 keybed, supposedly the best one of them all. I've yet to play on one.


----------



## CeDur (Jul 22, 2021)

It's a bit tricky with Roland. OK, so FP10 is lower-tier and actually younger model than FP30. FP30X is FP30 successor (in X they finally included TRS line-outs). They all together with FP60, FP60X and RD88 share the same PHA4-Standard action, which is Ivory Feel-G successor (very similar construction). Do not mistake them with PHA4-Premium or Concert, which are completely different design, including longer keys/pivot point which makes it lighter, faster and better action. PHA50 is PHA4 Concert successor, and I find it really great (tried it on RD2000 and FP90/FP90X). PHA50 has also it's 'hybrid' (hahaha) variant, which can be found in Roland's upper-tier console digital pianos 

Tl:dr version: PHA50 is best Roland action currently available and don't mistake PHA4 Standard with Premium/Concert variants since they are completely different.


----------



## sostenuto (Jul 22, 2021)

CeDur said:


> It's a bit tricky with Roland. OK, so FP10 is lower-tier and actually younger model than FP30. FP30X is FP30 successor (in X they finally included TRS line-outs). They all together with FP60, FP60X and RD88 share the same PHA4-Standard action, which is Ivory Feel-G successor (very similar construction). Do not mistake them with PHA4-Premium or Concert, which are completely different design, including longer keys/pivot point which makes it lighter, faster and better action. PHA50 is PHA4 Concert successor, and I find it really great (tried it on RD2000 and FP90/FP90X). PHA50 has also it's 'hybrid' (hahaha) variant, which can be found in Roland's upper-tier console digital pianos
> 
> Tl:dr version: PHA50 is best Roland action currently available and don't mistake PHA4 Standard with Premium/Concert variants since they are completely different.


Sooo maybe RD2000 comes back into picture, despite having content needed when used away from studio ? Focus for future is keybed, keybed, keybed ....... 
Maybe existing KR-577 is still more useful than current "grass-is-greener' ..... especially since purchased new, never relocated, only played by _moi_.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

update:

ok, i went with this.

thanks everyone!

piano hardware and software complete

i'll never have to buy anything else ever again!!!

right?

hello?












Review: M-Audio Hammer 88 Pro


This 88-note controller boasts a beautifully playable keyboard and all the MIDI functions you can shake a stick at – is it the ultimate controller for studio and stage?




www.musictech.net


----------



## sostenuto (Jul 22, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> update:
> 
> ok, i went with this.
> 
> ...


Enjoy ! Hardly any relationship .... but still using M-Audio Axiom Pro61 daily in Home Studio. Never a hiccup with piece or part ! Will definitely check this out as happy, loyal kinda User ! 
Will watch for follow-up comments, especially re. keybed characteristics.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

GOODNESS GRACIOUS, the Sampletekk Black Grand MkII and the WG2 MkII especially, are absolutely SUPERB!

dare I say I enjoy them more than my first BIG GUN at this point.

some fiddling required, i'm sure.


----------



## FlyingAndi (Jul 22, 2021)

Maybe you should change the thread title now. It's probably better without a number.
And please keep us updated how you like Hammer 88pro. I'm also looking for a new controller.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

FlyingAndi said:


> Maybe you should change the thread title now. It's probably better without a number.
> And please keep us updated how you like Hammer 88pro. I'm also looking for a new controller.


good call - done!

The Hammer 88 Pro was definitely an impulse buy

I did some VI-C searches, then went to google - didn't realize it had just come out.

Supposedly nice action and on the lighter side. Great DAW integration and SLIDERS!


----------



## Dewdman42 (Jul 22, 2021)

The list of piano instruments is long and subjective. Can't advise, its a purely personal decision. Many good options.

My next weighted piano controller, with piano the main focus...will be a Kawai.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

Dewdman42 said:


> The list of piano instruments is long and subjective. Can't advise, its a purely personal decision. Many good options.
> 
> My next weighted piano controller, with piano the main focus...will be a Kawai.


Yes indeed!

The Kawai pianos get high marks from what I can tell - even the older models without USB.

When I started this thread, Pianoteq was my only Piano VI.

Little did I know.

Now I have several, with 3 Mystery Models.

Game is still open!

1. Yamaha
2. Steinway
3. Bösendorfer


----------



## alcorey (Jul 22, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Whoa!
> 
> INSTANT BUY!
> 
> thanks @Simeon


"80"  .rar files to Download!!!! Am I doing something wrong???????


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

alcorey said:


> "80"  .rar files to Download!!!! Am I doing something wrong???????


i thought the same thing.

it's tedious, but well worth the $60 - VERY NICE libraries!

no, you are not doing anything wrong.

if i would have gotten these yesterday, i probably wouldn't have bought the 3 BIG GUNS.


----------



## alcorey (Jul 22, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> i thought the same thing.
> 
> it's tedious, but well worth the $60 - VERY NICE libraries!
> 
> ...


BTW, I have the Hammer Pro 88. Had it for about 6 weeks now. I'm a guitarist but I can make my way around the keyboard. I saw a video where the owner complained about "sloppy keys" - too much wiggle.
Doesn't bother me - I also have a Kurzweil K2600XS and the keys are tighter there - but it's too big and monstrously heavy for my desktop situation.
I also notice sometimes (in the short amount of time I've actually had to use it) that I'll hit a key while playing a line and it will seem to cut off - not finish or sound out all the way? Not sure if it's me or the keyboard. Haven't seen anybody else complain about that yet so we'll see what more playing time shows.


----------



## Lee Blaske (Jul 22, 2021)

As far as controllers go, the Kawai VPC1 would be hard to top. It feels like the real thing.

I'm now using it as my main controller, after adding a set of Monogram controllers, and a MIDI Solutions box to add a controller pedal input. I also have a Korg Micro-Key on top of the VPC1 that gives me pitch bend and modulation, AND works fabulously to manage all of my key switching (I set it at the lowest transpose range, so all my key switches begin off the range of my 88 key keyboard). I finally have the setup I've been looking for for years.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 22, 2021)

alcorey said:


> BTW, I have the Hammer Pro 88. Had it for about 6 weeks now. I'm a guitarist but I can make my way around the keyboard. I saw a video where the owner complained about "sloppy keys" - too much wiggle.
> Doesn't bother me - I also have a Kurzweil K2600XS and the keys are tighter there - but it's too big and monstrously heavy for my desktop situation.
> I also notice sometimes (in the short amount of time I've actually had to use it) that I'll hit a key while playing a line and it will seem to cut off - not finish or sound out all the way? Not sure if it's me or the keyboard. Haven't seen anybody else complain about that yet so we'll see what more playing time shows.


I'm not expecting piano quality with the Hammer Pro - I just need a half-way decent 88 again for some projects I have coming up.

I can always upgrade later.

Possibly to something like Lee Blaske's set up:



Lee Blaske said:


> As far as controllers go, the Kawai VPC1 would be hard to top. It feels like the real thing.
> 
> I'm now using it as my main controller, after adding a set of Monogram controllers, and a MIDI Solutions box to add a controller pedal input. I also have a Korg Micro-Key on top of the VPC1 that gives me pitch bend and modulation, AND works fabulously to manage all of my key switching (I set it at the lowest transpose range, so all my key switches begin off the range of my 88 key keyboard). I finally have the setup I've been looking for for years.


The VPC1 looks like a serious piece of gear - congrats!


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 23, 2021)

new Sampletekk fan

next on my quest to Collect Them All !


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 23, 2021)

ok, the big reveal for #1 (since #s 2 & 3 haven't arrived yet).

Yamaha: Garritan CFX

Sweetwater had it for $40.95 less than the Garritan site.

An obvious choice - very popular.

Garritan CFX is growing on me day by day. 

Very nice to sit down to first thing in the morning.

Gorgeous with my new pedal.


----------



## SupremeFist (Jul 23, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> if i would have gotten these yesterday, i probably wouldn't have bought the 3 BIG GUNS.


Don't worry, you'll be glad you did.


----------



## Consona (Jul 23, 2021)

Elkatwin Retro Synth Sample Library by Xtant Audio - Audio Plugin Deals


The Elkatwin 61 is an Italian analogue synthesizer, considered a great string machine amongst enthusiasts and now available as an easy to use Kontakt 5 instrument.




audioplugin.deals


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 23, 2021)

Consona said:


> Elkatwin Retro Synth Sample Library by Xtant Audio - Audio Plugin Deals
> 
> 
> The Elkatwin 61 is an Italian analogue synthesizer, considered a great string machine amongst enthusiasts and now available as an easy to use Kontakt 5 instrument.
> ...


grabbed this yesterday, highly recommended!

@Simeon approved!


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 23, 2021)




----------



## FlyingAndi (Jul 23, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> new Sampletekk fan
> 
> next on my quest to Collect Them All !


Just make sure to check this post





Sampletekk pianos recommendations during sale?


Hi I just saw an ad for sampletekk 80% sale. Are there pianos any good? I currently have the pianos from NI KU, and I just purchased Ascend during BF. I am looking for more upright and noticed they have a few, but I may purchase some grands too if they are so cheap. Im somewhat interested in the...




vi-control.net





You don't need to have them all to have them all 

And I wouldn't recommend the Blue Grand. Of all the piano libs I have, it's the only one I don't really like, see





Sampletekk Piano Library Roundup


I know Sampletekk piano libraries have been around for quite a while but today was my first experience with them. I hope you enjoy my discovery of five of their piano libraries.




vi-control.net





But I love Rain Piano.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 23, 2021)

FlyingAndi said:


> Just make sure to check this post
> 
> 
> 
> ...


i was kidding.

but Rain Piano MkII is high on my list.

THANK YOU for the links!


----------



## newman (Jul 24, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Garritan CFX is growing on me day by day.


There are some good suggestions for tweaking the sound and performance at PianoWorld:






Garritan CFX hiss fix ?


Thanks to NewerPlayer, I believe he just came up with a preset that makes me not hear the hiss! I don't know what he did, but one of these presets he sent me to try yesterday really solved the problem for me. I guess it's because of the convolution reverb? I don't know... But a dry signal ...




forum.pianoworld.com


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 24, 2021)

newman said:


> There are some good suggestions for tweaking the sound and performance at PianoWorld:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


PianoWorld is a different planet.

Informative AND amusing.






The noise or hiss they are talking about (noticeable by some and not others) seems amplified with the built in reverb.

I typically use other reverbs with great results.

There are links to other threads in that PW discussion with DEEP analysis of the Garritan CFX.

I think if I spent too much time on PW, I never would have bought anything.

We are riding the bleeding edge - sampling, modeling, even traditional recording has its limitations and critics. blood will flow.

_Imperfections _

It's great PW contributors hold developers feet to the fire. Products will improve.

This thread has been immensely helpful with my journey back into piano after so many years.

I've learned so much.

Not just about virtual instruments, but about piano history, recording history and studios, famous piano personalities and their troubled and 'imperfect' personal lives.

The strive for perfection is good as long as it fosters progress and not paralysis.

I deal with that as an Industrial Designer in my day job. A lot of my workflow comes from YEARS in the industry - it's second nature now. There's a huge difference between a great designer and a great engineer. A great designer will work from intuition and the GUT - a great designer will allow the imperfections in and craft them into FEEL or the HUMAN element. A great engineer will filter those out (analysis, DFM, etc.). There are exceptions, of course. Those who ride both sides of the brain.

So

The fact the Garritan CFX may have some hiss or noise issues, actually appeals to me.

My 3 big guns may be less than pristine instruments - in contrast to other products on the market.

1. Garritan CFX
2. Embertone Walker (bought here through the classifieds - great deal thank you)
3. VSL Vienna Imperial - non-Synchron (bought here through the classifieds - great deal thank you)

All three have their issues and nay-sayers.

I could have easily gone full-tilt Synchron.

I read in an interview of a top producer (can't recall who) who said he would rather listen to a great song on cassette than a sterile, lifeless, PERFECT recording of a marketing product.

So

Cheers to all the noise and warts and scars in the VI community and the world.

<heavy, i know, i just had 4 shots of espresso>

and check out this video of Django and Stéphane - I could listen to this on a loop for days.

talk about imperfections used to create some of the most gorgeous music ever conceived and recorded. 

24 bit what?


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 24, 2021)

good way to end a thread!


----------



## newman (Jul 24, 2021)

Great points @Zoot_Rollo . 

I sense the PianoWorld members are generally focused on great live playability / sound to "replicate" the classical music practice on a real piano. Just a handful of piano VIs are "popular" at PW for that. For example: PianoTeq, Garritan CFX, ModernU, several VSL pianos, etc.

Maybe VI-Control Members are less focused on playability and ammenable to instruments with unique characteristics and quirks. The entire universe of piano VIs are worth considering depending on the project IMHO. 

By the way, PianoWorld has a fairly comprehensive database of most piano VIs showing approximately 200.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 25, 2021)

the Pianoteq comedy over at PW is priceless.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 25, 2021)

So

What is everyone's favorite Synchron piano?


----------



## Simeon (Jul 25, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> So
> 
> What is everyone's favorite Synchron piano?


Here are my top 3
280vc
Imperial
Steinway


----------



## Buz (Jul 25, 2021)

They're all so completely different it's better to save the anguish and just get the bundle :D


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 25, 2021)

Buz said:


> They're all so completely different it's better to save the anguish and just get the bundle :D


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 25, 2021)




----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 25, 2021)




----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 25, 2021)




----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 31, 2021)




----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 31, 2021)




----------



## musicsound (Jul 31, 2021)

Simeon said:


> Here are my top 3
> 280vc
> Imperial
> Steinway


Hi Simeon, 

I have seen a lot of your youtubes and I respect your judgement a lot. I have just asked VSL for a Demo version of their 280VC and their CFX since I am not sure which one I like most. At the moment I think the VSL CFX will be my preference. 
Since the CFX is not on your top3 list I am wondering if there is something specific at the CFX (playability, tuning, , etc…) which you do not like as much. Or is it just “the tone” of the Yamaha in general ?

Regards
Klaus


----------



## Simeon (Jul 31, 2021)

musicsound said:


> Hi Simeon,
> 
> I have seen a lot of your youtubes and I respect your judgement a lot. I have just asked VSL for a Demo version of their 280VC and their CFX since I am not sure which one I like most. At the moment I think the VSL CFX will be my preference.
> Since the CFX is not on your top3 list I am wondering if there is something specific at the CFX (playability, tuning, , etc…) which you do not like as much. Or is it just “the tone” of the Yamaha in general ?
> ...


I will have to go back and take a listen again, it might seem odd leaving it out since the CFX is obviously a monster of a piano. It also might have been a little redundant to include two Bosendorfer Pianos in the same list but there is no mistaking the immenseness of the Synchron Imperial, and then to have a totally different experience with the 280VC in the smaller Synchron Stage.

One of the issues is probably just a personal one based on the way the CFX is positioned on the Synchron Stage, which is all the way over to the right side, this puts your back to the entire orchestra. I have been in that situation before and it felt odd just looking off the stage with everyone else behind me, I actually had to set up a mirror so that I could see what was going on ;^) So I guess you can chalk it up to a little bit of performance PTSD.
So do not take the absence of the CFX to be an indictment of it in any way.

The CFX can also tend to be very bright as well but again some of this can be addressed with the mixer and EQ if it got to the point that it was too much.

You can check out some earlier videos I did for the CFX here:


And here, where you can hear it alongside some of the other Synchron pianos.


----------



## CeDur (Jul 31, 2021)

I'm starting to investigate VSL closely again since iLok migration is going to happen very soon (I'm at anti-dongle camp). I'm wondering how 280VC compares to Imperial. Also it's a shame that they don't allow to choose your own set of mics, since those which come with 'Standard' are not the ones I would personally use. I really like Embertone approach with Walker 1955.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 31, 2021)

and I was about to pull the trigger on IS Walnut.

thinking 280VC to scratch that Synchron itch.


----------



## sostenuto (Jul 31, 2021)

IS - Walnut Grand _ Complete version ..... currently @ $168. is sooo affordable (_by comparison_).

May go there soon, but now upgrading IS - Ebony Grand from Basic to Complete @ $103.
Also quite affordable. 👍🏻🤑


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 31, 2021)

SupremeFist said:


> Don't worry, you'll be glad you did.


you are correct, sir.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 31, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> IS - Walnut Grand _ Complete version ..... currently @ $168. is sooo affordable (_by comparison_).
> 
> May go there soon, but now upgrading IS - Ebony Grand from Basic to Complete @ $103.
> Also quite affordable. 👍🏻🤑


agreed.

plus VSL and turkey go together well.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 31, 2021)

Simeon said:


> I will have to go back and take a listen again, it might seem odd leaving it out since the CFX is obviously a monster of a piano. It also might have been a little redundant to include two Bosendorfer Pianos in the same list but there is no mistaking the immenseness of the Synchron Imperial, and then to have a totally different experience with the 280VC in the smaller Synchron Stage.
> 
> One of the issues is probably just a personal one based on the way the CFX is positioned on the Synchron Stage, which is all the way over to the right side, this puts your back to the entire orchestra. I have been in that situation before and it felt odd just looking off the stage with everyone else behind me, I actually had to set up a mirror so that I could see what was going on ;^) So I guess you can chalk it up to a little bit of performance PTSD.
> So do not take the absence of the CFX to be an indictment of it in any way.
> ...



love the Blüthner.

great demo as usual @Simeon - thank you.

after 2+ weeks of digging into the VI Piano world, the Synchron pianos are stunning and would be the icing.

<saves pennies>


----------



## Simeon (Jul 31, 2021)

CeDur said:


> Also it's a shame that they don't allow to choose your own set of mics, since those which come with 'Standard' are not the ones I would personally use. I really like Embertone approach with Walker 1955.


That is a very interesting idea.
The implementation could get rather tricky trying to figure the pricing for the various mic positions.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 31, 2021)

got a great deal from Best Service on the Synchron 280VC.

I am DONE!

thank you everyone!

I'll make a list of the damage, software AND hardware.


----------



## Robert_G (Jul 31, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> got a great deal from Best Service on the Synchron 280VC.
> 
> I am DONE!
> 
> ...


Excellent choice on the 280VC. I love how it sounds.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 31, 2021)

the final tally

Hardware

M-Audio Hammer 88 Pro Controller
AKG K-371 Headphones
Software

Embertone Walker 1955 Concert D
VSL Vienna Imperial
VSL Synchron 280VC
Garritan CFX
Sampletekk TVBO
Sampletekk The Black Grand MkII
Sampletekk WG2 MkII
Pianoteq Version 7 Upgrade
Production Voices Production Compact Grand
Simple Sams Samples Signature Grand
Simple Sams Samples Vintage Upright
Strix Instruments Pripyat Pianos
Spitfire Audio Orig!nals Jangle Box Piano
not a stinker in the lot

definitely better than the original google results

again, thank you everyone for joining in and sharing your thoughts and recommendations.


----------



## slobajudge (Jul 31, 2021)

Hmm, I am not sure if you already have all pianos from the list, but if not, my vote from that list goes to VSL (any you like), Garritan, Pianoteq and Emberton (less playability but sound is excellent). Rule out all others, this is waste of money and soon enough they will be collecting dust. I am talking from solo piano playing perspective. For using in the mix there is a tons of options that might work.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jul 31, 2021)

slobajudge said:


> Hmm, I am not sure if you already have all pianos from the list, but if not, my vote from that list goes to VSL (any you like), Garritan, Pianoteq and Emberton (less playability but sound is excellent). Rule out all others, this is waste of money and soon enough they will be collecting dust. I am talking from solo piano playing perspective. For using in the mix there is a tons of options that might work.


This is the list of my purchases over the last 2 weeks.

These are for upcoming recording projects - they will all find use.

The "dust collecting money wasters" were bought for ridiculously low prices compared to your "votes" and filled my OP request for "Character and Upright" piano styled libraries.

Plus it was a great learning experience to start slowly with "lesser" libraries than simply jumping into the heavy hitters.

I learned quite a bit since I started this thread - if I would have opted to just buy VSL and call it a day, where would have been the fun in that?


----------



## slobajudge (Jul 31, 2021)

I speak from my experience, but I agree, you must walk on VST path and learn alone. Enjoy !


----------



## CeDur (Jul 31, 2021)

A lot was written about piano VIs in this thread but I see you've also got K371 - such a great headphones, I simply love my pair!


----------



## cfodeebiedaddy (Aug 1, 2021)

I love that you ended up with that lot after starting with the plan to get three VIs.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 2, 2021)

See what happens when I say I am done...

Modern U
normal price 169 USD
discounted price 119 USD

Ravenscroft 275
normal price 199 USD
discounted price 139 USD

Joachim's Piano 50%


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 2, 2021)

VI Modern U and Ravenscroft 275 are lovely.

ok, this thread is going to bankrupt me.

back to the shadows.


----------



## FlyingAndi (Aug 2, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> this thread is going to bankrupt me


Seems it was easier to start this thread than to finish it.
And now the east west pianos are on sale at jrr





JRRshop.com | Manufacturers


Shop by Brands, Shop by Manufacturers




www.jrrshop.com




(use code "forum" on checkout).

And it won't be long until @doctoremmet chimes in to tell you about his favorite piano and the 8dio sale.


----------



## doctoremmet (Aug 2, 2021)

Hey. Just passing along to mention there is this 8Dio sale and their 1985 Passionate Piano is my favourite sample ever. Oh wait…


----------



## CeDur (Aug 3, 2021)

Good time to buy 8Dio, but I'm reading that it's far from flawless, especially playability-wise. Also it's not possible to later resell the licence, so even with prices 55% lower it's a bit of a risk.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 3, 2021)

Modern U and Ravenscroft 275 quickly became a favorite

Especially for practice

Ok - that's it!

Done






True Keys what?


----------



## doctoremmet (Aug 3, 2021)

CeDur said:


> Also it's not possible to later resell the licence


Correct. But this of course the case with almost all piano sample libraries, with the exception of VSL? 

I haven’t found many playability flaws in it, but I may be a very forgiving player - that’s true.


----------



## doctoremmet (Aug 3, 2021)

CeDur said:


> I'm reading that it's far from flawless, especially playability-wise


I’d like to read up on that hehe. Do you have the source(s)? Thanks!


----------



## sostenuto (Aug 3, 2021)

Recent posts here (VI-C), for one thing, but tough to recall Thread .... 🤷‍♂️ 
Was also considering, but passed __ mainly due to so many Piano VI just added.


----------



## CeDur (Aug 3, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I’d like to read up on that hehe. Do you have the source(s)? Thanks!


Not to look far:

https://vi-control.net/community/threads/8dio-1990-or-production-voices-2.68621/
https://vi-control.net/community/threads/8dios-1969-steinway-piano-is-it-worth-grabbing.62751/
It's very similar to what I've read regarding EWQL. Good for rendering due to brilliant sound, not so good for just playing.


doctoremmet said:


> Correct. But this of course the case with almost all piano sample libraries, with the exception of VSL?
> 
> I haven’t found many playability flaws in it, but I may be a very forgiving player - that’s true.


Oh, there are many that allow re-sell (usually after paying some fee). I always check it before I buy sample library (well, maybe not when it's a <50$ thing). I sold Ravenscroft 275 and Pianoteq for example. I can't sell Cinepiano which makes me angry every time I see it in my Kontakt libraries tab (not turning it off on purpose, to remind me to think twice before buying something blindly :D).


----------



## doctoremmet (Aug 3, 2021)

Thanks. Interesting to read Craig’s @CGR take on the 8Dio pianos in 2018 hehe. If he says so, better take the man VERY seriously. Although I also know, like me, he does like certain aspects of the 1985 Passionate 

To each their own of course!


----------



## CeDur (Aug 3, 2021)

I'm still considering buying 8dio piano to try it 😀 I know the feeling of reading some criticism towards things I like, not the most pleasant, but I think it's good to know possible product's flaws before spending money.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 3, 2021)

CeDur said:


> I can't sell Cinepiano which makes me angry every time I see it in my Kontakt libraries tab (not turning it off on purpose, to remind me to think twice before buying something blindly :D).


interesting - what's the story with Cinepiano, other than no resale?

almost jumped on that and Piano in Blue, hesitated long enough to make a few better choices it seems.


----------



## CeDur (Aug 3, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> interesting - what's the story with Cinepiano, other than no resale?
> 
> almost jumped on that and Piano in Blue, hesitated long enough to make a few better choices it seems.


Nothing 'wrong' with Cinepiano, I was just expecting more from a 200$ library. It's good for certain (cinematic? hahaha) style, but not for regular playing (in my opinion). Transition between the layers is not particulary smooth. Good for a 'character' piano, not the main everyday one. Signature Grand is arguably as good as Cinepiano, but IMO more playable and much cheaper.

Also I'm having some issues running it (some occasional cracks and pops), but I have completely no problem with other Kontakt libraries, even monsters like Embertone Walker. It doesn't seem to be CPU related, since even increasing buffer size to crazy high values does not help. Of course samples are running from SSD. I probably should re-install it.


----------



## CGR (Aug 3, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Thanks. Interesting to read Craig’s @CGR take on the 8Dio pianos in 2018 hehe. If he says so, better take the man VERY seriously. Although I also know, like me, he does like certain aspects of the 1985 Passionate
> 
> To each their own of course!


Just re-read what I wrote and I was probably a little harsh. The 8dio pianos still sit near the top in my opinion in producing an authentic acoustic piano tone - they leave the life and imperfections in their pianos which many developers "airbrush" out.

Playability is not up with the VSL pianos, but still quite good when I learn to "play into" them. +1 for the 8dio 1985 Passionate Piano (a Yamaha C5) - it's a real beauty once you set the velocity & EQ right. I used it solo on a number of tracks in my last album.


----------



## sostenuto (Aug 3, 2021)

CGR said:


> Just re-read what I wrote and I was probably a little harsh. The 8dio pianos still sit near the top in my opinion in producing an authentic acoustic piano tone - they leave the life and imperfections in their pianos which many developers "airbrush" out.
> 
> Playability is not up with the VSL pianos, but still quite good when I learn to "play into" them. +1 for the 8dio 1985 Passionate Piano (a Yamaha C5) - it's a real beauty once you set the velocity & EQ right. I used it solo on a number of tracks in my last album.


........ and ~$67. right now ! _When purchased; may pester for those cool settings._


----------



## CeDur (Aug 3, 2021)

I was tempted for 1985 Passionate Piano but decided to save money for VSL. It's hard to resist, so many sales right now 😬


----------



## sostenuto (Aug 3, 2021)

Right now, logged in and $66.60. with 8dio Code. UT, USA 
Already have Requiem Pro.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 4, 2021)

CGR said:


> Just re-read what I wrote and I was probably a little harsh. The 8dio pianos still sit near the top in my opinion in producing an authentic acoustic piano tone - they leave the life and imperfections in their pianos which many developers "airbrush" out.
> 
> Playability is not up with the VSL pianos, but still quite good when I learn to "play into" them. +1 for the 8dio 1985 Passionate Piano (a Yamaha C5) - it's a real beauty once you set the velocity & EQ right. I used it solo on a number of tracks in my last album.


is there a velocity settings area in the 1985?

the 1985 is surprisingly good!

nice addition.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 4, 2021)

Piano VST Plugins for PC/Mac DAWs | EastWest Sounds


Pianos VST plugin and largest and most detailed sampled piano project ever featuring top grand pianos Bechstein D-280, Steinway D, and Yamaha C7.




www.soundsonline.com


----------



## CeDur (Aug 4, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Piano VST Plugins for PC/Mac DAWs | EastWest Sounds
> 
> 
> Pianos VST plugin and largest and most detailed sampled piano project ever featuring top grand pianos Bechstein D-280, Steinway D, and Yamaha C7.
> ...


If you're planning to buy something 'EastWest', I think it's best to get Spaces II reverb (if you don't have it yet) and make your other freshly-acquired piano libraries sound even better  It's ~160$ now, so good price for that superb convo verb.


----------



## CGR (Aug 4, 2021)

CeDur said:


> If you're planning to buy something 'EastWest', I think it's best to get Spaces II reverb (if you don't have it yet) and make your other freshly-acquired piano libraries sound even better  It's ~160$ now, so good price for that superb convo verb.


Maybe a good time for me to upgrade from Spaces 1 . . .


----------



## CGR (Aug 4, 2021)

. . . on second thoughts . . .


----------



## CeDur (Aug 4, 2021)

Interesting whether it's a bug or.. maybe hidden message (sshh, Spaces I is better than II, don't upgrade) :D


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 4, 2021)

CeDur said:


> If you're planning to buy something 'EastWest', I think it's best to get Spaces II reverb (if you don't have it yet) and make your other freshly-acquired piano libraries sound even better  It's ~160$ now, so good price for that superb convo verb.


grabbed Spaces II a while ago during my reverb rampage.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 4, 2021)

funny, I had completely forgotten about Spaces II.

these 2 play very nicely together.


----------



## CeDur (Aug 4, 2021)

Share some sound demo!

My Spaces II trail recently ended and I'm left with Seventh Heaven for reverb (which is really nice), but I liked Spaces more for piano.


----------



## CGR (Aug 4, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> . . . reverb rampage.


Great name for a band


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 4, 2021)

CeDur said:


> Share some sound demo!
> 
> My Spaces II trail recently ended and I'm left with Seventh Heaven for reverb (which is really nice), but I liked Spaces more for piano.


Here is the 8Dio 1985 Passionate Piano with EW Spaces II reverb.

MIDI file snagged from a gearspace.com Piano Shootout thread


----------



## CGR (Aug 4, 2021)

Recent posts in this thread have prompted me to load up the old 8dio 1969 Steinway again (and hopefully distract me from the nagging urge to buy the 8dio 1990 Yamaha!).

I really like the "weight/heft" of the 8dio pianos. Here's a new version of a track I composed and produced for a music library about 3 years ago, featuring the 8dio 1969 Steinway:


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 4, 2021)

CGR said:


> Recent posts in this thread have prompted me to load up the old 8dio 1969 Steinway again (and hopefully distract me from the nagging urge to buy the 8dio 1990 Yamaha!).
> 
> I really like the "weight/heft" of the 8dio pianos. Here's a new version of a track I composed and produced for a music library about 3 years ago, featuring the 8dio 1969 Steinway:


----------



## CGR (Aug 4, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


>


Stop it, you tease you!!!


----------



## musicsound (Aug 5, 2021)

in terms of PLAYABILITY ... is there anything better than the VSL´s with their much (100 ?) velocity layers ?


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 5, 2021)

musicsound said:


> in terms of PLAYABILITY ... is there anything better than the VSL´s with their much (100 ?) velocity layers ?


Pianoteq


----------



## CeDur (Aug 5, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


>


Such a smart and lovely interface! I know that sound matters the most, but such an eye-candy kind of affects my mood and translates to more 'passionate' playing. Let's take Sampletekk libraries for example: great sampling, but GUI just puts me off. Embertone Walker before the update had animated GUI and it was really nice to see the movement.



musicsound said:


> in terms of PLAYABILITY ... is there anything better than the VSL´s with their much (100 ?) velocity layers ?





Zoot_Rollo said:


> Pianoteq


I can't compare Pianoteq to VSL (yet), but it's unbeatable playability-wise among libraries I've tried. Garritan CFX is a close second place at my ranking. 'Playability' is not a technical term, so to clarify what I think contributes to that factor:

Perceived latency - so the 'sample start' time, built into samples itself (not related to sample rate/buffer size/audio interface). It's easy to notice in sample libraries which have many mic positions: usually those more far away from piano have bigger latency, due to how sound travels in air (it's almost 3ms per 1m of distance)
Sample consistency and layer switching - so if piano has '16 layers', how they are distributed across velocities and keyboard range: if I press C3 with velocity = 60 and then G5 with the same velocity, do they respond like the real acoustic would? Also if I increase velocities gradually, do I experience 'abrupt', noticable timbre or loudness change or is it smooth?
Dynamic range - but I don't mean volume, rather timbre: was both ppp and fff sampled at the original piano?
Releases - as far as I know (I might be wrong) only Pianoteq takes advantage of variable note-off velocity. On a real piano the release sound is not only related to how long you've kept the key pressed, but also how quickly it was released.
Pedal behaviour, resonances - hard to catch with sampling, because number of combination on a real piano is near to infinite; it's a different thing when you press only C4 and when you add let's say C5; it's not a 'sum' of those 2 notes, real piano adds a lot of stuff. Then the sound is different with sustain pressed 100%, 90% etc. So all key combinations with different velocities, release times, multiplied by all possible pedal positions..
Only the modelling is able to simulate all those behaviour.


----------



## CeDur (Aug 5, 2021)

CGR said:


> Great name for a band


Agree! Listening to a lot of recent (last 15 years) pop recording, I have a feeling some bands should have called themselves 'Compression Rampage'  Not to diss all the modern music, I like some trends (like going back to 80s style).


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 6, 2021)

Ok

One more and that's it

Suggestions?


----------



## CeDur (Aug 6, 2021)

I will be a little bit 'phylosophical': why you need another one? You've probably got the best what's out there


----------



## FlyingAndi (Aug 6, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Ok
> 
> One more and that's it
> 
> Suggestions?


Simple Sam Vintage Toy piano.
It's surprisingly deep sampled for a toy piano and fun to play.


----------



## Buz (Aug 6, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Suggestions?


Check out Acoustic Samples if you didn't already. I love the Pleyel and also one of the shitty uprights they have.


----------



## SupremeFist (Aug 6, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Ok
> 
> One more and that's it
> 
> Suggestions?


Piano In Blue of course.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 6, 2021)

CeDur said:


> I will be a little bit 'phylosophical': why you need another one? You've probably got the best what's out there


Of course I don't need another

But I still have budget left over

If I don't use it, I lose it


Buz said:


> Check out Acoustic Samples if you didn't already. I love the Pleyel and also one of the shitty uprights they have.


hadn't checked into those, nice selection:


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 6, 2021)

SupremeFist said:


> Piano In Blue of course.


oh yes, I may have to miss it this go - perhaps at BF.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 6, 2021)

Product not found!



comes with UVI Sparkverb


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 7, 2021)




----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 10, 2021)

piano world sticky


----------



## sostenuto (Aug 10, 2021)

*$64.* while on Sale _ NOW !! 









Scoring Piano


Visit the post for more.




www.fluffyaudio.com


----------



## FlyingAndi (Aug 10, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> piano world sticky


Oh no! Remove it. This was my cheat sheet for the name that piano contest.😕


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 10, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> *$64.* while on Sale _ NOW !!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


oooh

"We have tried to take the softest dynamics particularly into account. Moreover, thanks to our _Dynamic Range Control_, it is very easy to achieve that “Thomas Newman” cinematic sound."

huge TM fan!

buy!


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 11, 2021)

i like the ORTF and Ribbon.

Nice sound from the two 8Dio pianos I grabbed during the recent 8Dio blowout.


----------



## styledelk (Aug 11, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> *$64.* while on Sale _ NOW !!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Reading the description on the page had me expecting their grandmother’s secret cookie recipe at the end. But this one sounds interesting just the same!


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 12, 2021)




----------



## SupremeFist (Aug 12, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


>


That's one you won't regret!


----------



## Simeon (Aug 12, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


>


Yep, got the email today and wondering what the cost would be to upgrade to the Full Piano Bundle since I have Piano In Blue and CinePiano, hmmmmm ;^)


----------



## wlinart (Aug 12, 2021)

Simeon said:


> Yep, got the email today and wondering what the cost would be to upgrade to the Full Piano Bundle since I have Piano In Blue and CinePiano, hmmmmm ;^)


Probably more than just buying Randy's prepared piano. Cinesamples don't allow upgrading to a bundle.


----------



## Simeon (Aug 12, 2021)

wlinart said:


> Probably more than just buying Randy's prepared piano. Cinesamples don't allow upgrading to a bundle.


Thanks,
I did see that Randy's Prepared was the only other piano in the bundle, before looking I thought there might be more included, like the Rhodes.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 12, 2021)

i think i'm done


----------



## CGR (Aug 13, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> i think i'm done


"Finally Monsieur – a wafer-thin mint" . . .


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 13, 2021)

any ideas on what piano Dudley is playing?


----------



## Simeon (Aug 13, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> any ideas on what piano Dudley is playing?



Looks like a Steinway. When you see the closeup of his hands you can faintly notice the logo.
What an amazing talent.


----------



## Markrs (Aug 13, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> any ideas on what piano Dudley is playing?



Dudley Moore is a true comedy legend, and a pretty damn good jazz pianist to boot!


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 13, 2021)

Simeon said:


> Looks like a Steinway. When you see the closeup of his hands you can faintly notice the logo.
> What an amazing talent.


I love the way he communicates with the other band members - so subtle and perfect.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 13, 2021)

can't resist this one


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## CGR (Aug 13, 2021)

. . . and this:


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## Lode_Runner (Aug 15, 2021)

Zoot, you could have bought a real piano.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 15, 2021)

Lode_Runner said:


> Zoot, you could have bought a real piano.


not unlike my tube-sniffing guitar buddies who joke about how I could have bought a real amp with the money I've spent on sims.

when I move to my farm - barn studio!


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 16, 2021)




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## doctoremmet (Aug 16, 2021)

Great pick. Here is a Tom Waits track. It does not have any piano. But it is a great track. By Tom Waits.


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## Fleer (Aug 16, 2021)




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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 16, 2021)

for under $60?

I dunno...

I already have: 
TVBO
WG2 MkII
Black Grand MkII


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## doctoremmet (Aug 16, 2021)

Ridiculous value really… Enjoy!


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## Fleer (Aug 16, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> for under $60?
> 
> I dunno...
> 
> ...


All mighty fine but don’t get 7CGMk2 as you’ve already got it in TVBO.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 16, 2021)

happy birthday Bill Evans


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## Flyo (Aug 16, 2021)

I have now the 3 bigs, Rain Piano is next… 

It is highly recommended Rain Piano?


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## Fleer (Aug 16, 2021)

Both Mk2 and the original (which comes closest to that Tom Waits feel).


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## Lode_Runner (Aug 17, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> for under $60?
> 
> I dunno...
> 
> ...


I hope you haven't pulled the trigger yet Zoot, unless that's a bundle - You already have 7CG MKII, It's the room mic in TVBO. This is why Sampletekk's naming bugs me, it's so easy for people to buy the same samples multiple times.

Re Tubed Keys and Tubed Wurli, I think there's better options for Rhodes and Wurli (Check out SonicCouture, Indiginus, E-Instruments, Gospel Musicians, Orange Tree Samples...)


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## Fleer (Aug 17, 2021)

But not at those prices


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## Markrs (Aug 17, 2021)

Lode_Runner said:


> Re Tubed Keys and Tubed Wurli, I think there's better options for Rhodes and Wurli (Check out SonicCouture, Indiginus, E-Instruments, Gospel Musicians, Orange Tree Samples...)


Probably true but with the 90% sale at Sampletekk at the moment, the Rhodes is only $8 and the Wurli is $5 which can't really be beaten for price


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 20, 2021)

Controller update

I bought an M-Audio Hammer 88 Pro to go with all these great piano libraries

I was able to use a 15% off coupon from Musicians Friend

Great value for a graded hammer action controller

However, after some time, the controller would slip into "Vegas Mode".

This is a demo state for retail floor models. 

M-Audio support could not tell me how to turn it off.

Since I absolutely loved the feel and features of the Hammer 88 Pro, I returned for an exchange.

Got the replacement yesterday - no problems.

MF was great about the exchange.

Couldn't be more pleased


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## CGR (Aug 20, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Controller update
> 
> I bought an M-Audio Hammer 88 Pro to go with all these great piano libraries
> 
> ...


Nice purchase - congratulations. Looking forward to hearing some music you make with it.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 20, 2021)

You can see I went all out with the studio furniture

2 Home Depot folding tables: $120

1 Office Depot swivel chair: $60

Total: $180


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## sostenuto (Aug 20, 2021)

CGR said:


> Nice purchase - congratulations. Looking forward to hearing some music you make with it.


Can you comment re 7CG 'orig' ? Have MkII, but a post seemed to note 7CG recording as salient ?


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 20, 2021)

The brains

Product design gigs - right

Music/Audio/Video - left











Multiple KVMs to get everyone playing nicely

Cable management what?


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## SupremeFist (Aug 20, 2021)

CGR said:


> Nice purchase - congratulations. Looking forward to hearing some music you make with it.


We're supposed to make music with this stuff?


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## ScrltPumpernickel (Aug 21, 2021)

Hello Zoot_Rollo,
I've been following this thread, as I'm too looking to expand my piano palette. Seeing as you acquired quite a formidable set of piano libraries (admittedly by my standards) and presuming, you had some time to play with them, my question to you is: 
Are there any positions in your current collection that you feel you could go without? (Maybe some libraries became redundant with later purchases or are no longer "up to standard" with the rest of them?)
Thank you.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 21, 2021)

ScrltPumpernickel said:


> Hello Zoot_Rollo,
> I've been following this thread, as I'm too looking to expand my piano palette. Seeing as you acquired quite a formidable set of piano libraries (admittedly by my standards) and presuming, you had some time to play with them, my question to you is:
> Are there any positions in your current collection that you feel you could go without? (Maybe some libraries became redundant with later purchases or are no longer "up to standard" with the rest of them?)
> Thank you.


Compiling


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## ScrltPumpernickel (Aug 21, 2021)

No hurry and thank you.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 21, 2021)

here's the final tally

*Embertone *
•Walker 1955 Concert D

*VSL *
•Vienna Imperial
•Synchron 280VC

*Garritan*
•Abbey Road CFX Concert Grand

*Sampletekk *
•TVBO
•The Black Grand MkII
•WG2 MkII
•Rain Piano MkII
•Vertikal Mk II
•SSG Small Studio Grand
•Tubed Keys MkI 73
•Tubed Wurli

*Modartt*
•Pianoteq Version 7 Upgrade
•Blüthner Model 1

*Production Voices*
•Production Compact Grand

*Simple Sams Samples*
•Signature Grand
•Vintage Upright

*Strix Instruments*
•Pripyat Pianos

*Spitfire Audio*
•Orig!nals Jangle Box Piano

*8Dio*
•1990 Studio Grand
•1985 Passionate Piano

*Fluffy Audio*
•Scoring Piano

*VI Labs*
•Modern U
•Ravenscroft 275

*Versilian Studios*
•Joachims Piano

*Cinesamples*
•Piano in Blue


I'm still wading through SSD devastation

Standouts at the moment

VSL (Vienna Imperial is my sweet spot - 280VC is a stunner)
Pianoteq (Blüthner and Petrof)
Garritan
VI Labs

the other, more "character" instruments will take some time to grasp

there are worse things in life, eh?

and I was originally only gonna get 3.


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## Marcus Millfield (Aug 21, 2021)

Not to add too much weight to your SSD devastation, but also check out Fracture Sounds Woodchester Piano and Midnight Grand character piano's.

Edit: oh, and don't forget Glacier Keys


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 21, 2021)




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## sostenuto (Aug 21, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


>



Following Stu Harrison /Merriam Music for some time. Quality talent and reference .


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 22, 2021)

Happy Birthday Claud Debussy


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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 24, 2021)




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## Zoot_Rollo (Aug 26, 2021)




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## sostenuto (Aug 26, 2021)

Hpy B'Day Cloud !! 🌨🌨 

Latest Beckstein /Beckstein Digital Grand @ ~$247. is now top of short list _ also breaking piggie ! 🤦‍♂️


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## Zoot_Rollo (Sep 10, 2021)




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## Trace (Sep 10, 2021)

pcohen12 said:


> Seconded.
> 
> Simple Sam’s Signature Grand may not have the craziest specs on paper, but it’s a rare case of being way more than the sum of its parts…maybe the best $50 I’ve ever spent, and I consistently find myself reaching for it over pricier options. It has a huge fan club here on VI-C.
> 
> ...


This one does not work for me for dynamic jazz. I know people love it, but if I could return it, I would.

VSL, unfortunately, has the only pianos that don't suffer from weird velocity issues when playing very dynamic jazz, IMHO.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Sep 10, 2021)

Trace said:


> This one does not work for me for dynamic jazz. I know people love it, but if I could return it, I would.


which one?


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## Zoot_Rollo (Sep 10, 2021)

https://feltinstruments.com/Lekko


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## Zoot_Rollo (Sep 11, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


>



this is a fun one!

instant buy at $19!!! sale still active!

plus, as @Simeon mentioned in his video, Botdog supports music education through their website!!!


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## Zoot_Rollo (Sep 11, 2021)




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## davinwv (Sep 11, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


>



Studiologic is supposed to show this product at SuperBooth next week.

I'm predicting it is an updated SL-series controller (because of those colored circles that match the SL zone colors), but with more Mixface-inspired physical controllers and possibly a few internal sounds, as well.

Gotta love the Italians 🇮🇹!


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## davinwv (Sep 13, 2021)

Numa X Piano (TP110):








Studiologic Numa X Piano 88 | Elklaver | Orkestergraven.dk


Numa X Piano 88 har den nye Fatar Hammer Action TP/110 med 3 kontakter og Aftertouch - Find det i Aarhus Største Musikforretning!




orkestergraven.dk





Numa X Piano GT (TP40(0)Wood):








Studiologic Numa X Piano GT | Elklaver | Orkestergraven.dk


Numa X Piano GT er flagskibsproduktet i den nye Numa X serie - find den i Aarhus Største Musikforretning!




orkestergraven.dk


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## Zoot_Rollo (Sep 24, 2021)

thanks @CGR


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## Justin L. Franks (Sep 25, 2021)

davinwv said:


> Numa X Piano (TP110):
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Why, oh why, does Studiologic not include standard pitch bend and mod wheels? Put in your funky joystick things if you want, but also put the normal wheels in as well. It's not like there isn't any space available on the top panel.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Sep 25, 2021)

Justin L. Franks said:


> Why, oh why, does Studiologic not include standard pitch bend and mod wheels? Put in your funky joystick things if you want, but also put the normal wheels in as well. It's not like there isn't any space available on the top panel.


that was one of the main gripes with the SL88 Studio I had before I got the Hammer 88 Pro.


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## mrfuzztone (Sep 25, 2021)

A couple more uprights:
e-instruments Session Keys Upright Pianos
Westwood Alt piano

I luckily bought the Cinesamples Abbey Road Classic Upright Pianos the week they were discontinued.
I have found combining the sounds of 2 pianos with PluginGuru Unify to be interesting.
Yesterday I tried Rain Piano + VI Labs Modern U with EW Spaces reverb
There are also a few VST synths and pipe organs to consider. Ha


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## bill5 (Sep 25, 2021)

Justin L. Franks said:


> Why, oh why, does Studiologic not include standard pitch bend and mod wheels?


Because they suck?  I will never get the love for the wheels, HATE them. That said, SL's implementation of the joystick here sucks bad...why, when most companies use a joystick, is it the size of a hamster dick?? Give me something I can easily grab, most of us are not Ant Man.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Oct 3, 2021)

Happy Birthday Steve Reich!

name that piano


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## georgewmusic (Oct 4, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> here's the final tally
> 
> *Embertone *
> •Walker 1955 Concert D
> ...


Not going to go through 17 pages worth, but are we ignoring Native Instruments in this discussion?

Feel like Noire deserves a mention. Lovely sounding library with lots of nice sound-design features.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Oct 4, 2021)

georgewmusic said:


> Not going to go through 17 pages worth, but are we ignoring Native Instruments in this discussion?
> 
> Feel like Noire deserves a mention. Lovely sounding library with lots of nice sound-design features.


Noire is on my BF list!

thanks for the reminder.

I had my sights on the Giant and the Gentleman as well.


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## georgewmusic (Oct 5, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Noire is on my BF list!
> 
> thanks for the reminder.
> 
> I had my sights on the Giant and the Gentleman as well.



Ahh good, thought I was going to have egg on my face for that suggestion.

Personally, I find the Gentleman to be a quite unremarkable library - there are probably better upright Pianos out there. The Giant is a cool sound and good for cinematic stuff but also not very useful in any other context as it's got this larger than life pseudo-chorusy vibe, at least to my ears.

I'd say the real standouts of the NI range are Noire and Alicias Keys. NI know it, that's why they don't give them away in the normal Komplete range.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Oct 14, 2021)

Death Piano - Production Voices


Death Piano is a Piano Sample Libraries that celebrates the obscure. Full of reverse samples, lo-fi synthesis shaped tones, morphed massacred sounds and more.




www.productionvoices.com


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## ag75 (Oct 14, 2021)

cfodeebiedaddy said:


> Lots of great suggestions here!
> 
> The only one I'd add is Cinesamples' Piano in Blue for your character category! If jazz is your thing, then between that and Simple Sam's Signature Grand (it has *great* jazz presets you can get lost in), you'll be in heaven.


Piano in blue all the way. It’s always the first piano I reach for. It goes on sale often as well.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Oct 14, 2021)

ag75 said:


> Piano in blue all the way. It’s always the first piano I reach for. It goes on sale often as well.


just updated.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Oct 17, 2021)

only on a Steinway?


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## CGR (Oct 17, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> only on a Steinway?



I saw the Finnish jazz pianist Iiro Rantala in concert a few years ago. The venue had 2 grand pianos on stage for him. A Steinway model C, and a Yamaha C7 for when he wanted to shove his hands under the bonnet!


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## Zoot_Rollo (Oct 18, 2021)

here's the link from the e-mail (which doesn't work):

https://www.productionvoices.com/product/300-grand-compact/

helpful, huh?


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## FlyingAndi (Oct 19, 2021)

300 grand?
That's the most expensive piano library ever!


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## bill5 (Oct 19, 2021)

* ba dum pssshhh * 

He'll be here all week folks!


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## Zoot_Rollo (Oct 21, 2021)

UVI Key Suite Bundle Edition - The Ultimate Keys Collection


A comprehensive selection of 94 acoustic, electric, and digital keyboard instruments with deep editing and effects




www.uvi.net


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## sostenuto (Oct 21, 2021)

Kinda smorgasbord ? 🤷🏻‍♂️


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## doctoremmet (Oct 21, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> UVI Key Suite Bundle Edition - The Ultimate Keys Collection
> 
> 
> A comprehensive selection of 94 acoustic, electric, and digital keyboard instruments with deep editing and effects
> ...


Just received a €50 voucher because I have Keysuite Electric. Pretty compelling offer…


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## Marcus Millfield (Oct 21, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Just received a €50 voucher because I have Keysuite Electric. Pretty compelling offer…


No! Why do these companies keep doing these things!

It certainly is a great offer. You get about everything you'd ever need in this bundle. Probably sounds great, knowing UVI.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Oct 23, 2021)

https://www.sound-dust.com/plasticghostpiano







https://www.pro-tools-expert.com/production-expert-1/5-piano-vis-that-sound-like-nothing-else?fbclid=IwAR3ELbkO4DwCbjdDUs4EHau693ajdHa6vgrIw54VnkUHqDMe1N10fKJ8mo0


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## Zoot_Rollo (Oct 23, 2021)

bracing for another round of pianos (BF!), I ran across this review of the Galaxy Vintage D piano VI by none other than,

Dave Stewart.

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/galaxy-vintage-d

no, not that Dave Stewart.

Dave Stewart from

Arzachel

1969 : _Arzachel_
Egg

1970 : _Egg_
1971 : _The Polite Force_
1974 : _The Civil Surface_ - Steve Hillage on guitar on "Wring Out the Ground (Loosely Now)".
Khan

1972 : _Space Shanty_
Hatfield and the North

1974 : _Hatfield and the North_ (Virgin)
1975 : _The Rotters' Club_ (Virgin)
1980 : _Afters_ (Virgin compilation, 1980)
National Health

1978 : _National Health_
1978 : _Of Queues and Cures_
1982 : _D.S. Al Coda_ (Memorial album to Alan Gowen)
Bill Bruford

1978 : _Feels Good to Me_
Bruford

1979 : _One of a Kind_
1980 : _Gradually Going Tornado_
1980 : _The Bruford Tapes_ (live album)
2006 : _Rock Goes To College_ (Broadcast 1979, DVD released 2006)


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## Zoot_Rollo (Nov 4, 2021)

300 Grand Compact - Production Voices


Sampled Performance Grand virtual piano. VST Piano sampled in a real piano performance hall for authentic piano performance.




www.productionvoices.com


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## Marcus Millfield (Nov 4, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> 300 Grand Compact - Production Voices
> 
> 
> Sampled Performance Grand virtual piano. VST Piano sampled in a real piano performance hall for authentic piano performance.
> ...


I don't know about you, but the audio demos on their website are not to my taste and if the library sounds like that, I'll pass.


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## poly6 (Nov 4, 2021)

Marcus Millfield said:


> I don't know about you, but the audio demos on their website are not to my taste and if the library sounds like that, I'll pass.


Simeon did a pre-release review on his channel:


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## Marcus Millfield (Nov 4, 2021)

poly6 said:


> Simeon did a pre-release review on his channel:



Yeah, I saw that and is a far better ad for the library than the official demos.


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## jazzman7 (Nov 4, 2021)

If I was looking for another piano, this sounds awful good for the price. Simeon is excellent by the way!


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## Marcus Millfield (Nov 4, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> If I was looking for another piano, this sounds awful good for the price. Simeon is excellent by the way!


Yes he is. The only problem with the libraries that he praises is that you never get his playing or singing skills with them!


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## jazzman7 (Nov 4, 2021)

Marcus Millfield said:


> Yes he is. The only problem with the libraries that he praises is that you never get his playing or singing skills with them!


Haha! I knew there was some fine print somewhere!


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## Marcus Millfield (Nov 4, 2021)

liquidlino said:


> Vilabs pianos bundle is selling 70 percent off right now. I'd be buying if I hadn't just bought uvi keysuite bundle.


Go wash your mouth! There's no such thing as too many piano libraries!



BTW, Sound Yeti released Revelation scoring grand a few weeks ago and although the layering was a bit less usefully for me than I thought, the raw piano sound of the Steinway O is actually really lovely.

For those who missed it:


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## Zoot_Rollo (Nov 12, 2021)




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## olsontex (Nov 12, 2021)

I commented on this earlier in the main BF 2021 thread, but since this thread is piano specific I thought I'd add it here too. I'm talking about the Muletone Audio - Upright Piano for $14.99.

A vast majority of time you get what you pay for, but every now and then you get surprised by something you can immediately visualize using for a specific purpose... and it's dirt cheap. Among the many VI purchasing lessons I've learned the hard way is "tonally amazing" and "practical - will actually use it" don't always go hand-in-hand. The lesson was focus on "will actually use it" above any other consideration.

I perceive I'm in the small camp of people who prefer uprights over grands, so take that into account, but the Muletone Upright is the most pleasant surprise I've found so far during BF 2021. It's a niche piano but I believe it does two (almost diametrically opposed) things very well:
(1) bright piano to cut through the mix in Latin/Pop recordings (think "Freedom" by George Michael)
(2) smokey jazz (I know - it doesn't make sense considering it's designed primarily for Latin)

I'm not going to rehash my more detailed comments on the library here, as you can find them on page 25 of Tiger the Frogs...November 2021 Sales thread.

I was impressed with Muletone as a whole and ended up buying 6 other libraries, including their excellent Vibraphone and 5 Percussion libraries. The last time I found comparable quality in the price range of entry level products was Boulder Sounds, both of these companies are gems in my book.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Nov 15, 2021)

C-Series Piano Bundle by Sampletekk - Audio Plugin Deals


For just $31.60 (instead of $316), get the SampleTekk 4-in-1 Emotional Piano Bundle comprising Blue Grand, Vertikal, Rain Piano and Small Studio Grand!




audioplugin.deals


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## Zoot_Rollo (Nov 22, 2021)

BOUGHT!
















XPERIMENTA Due - XPERIMENTA Project


https://youtu.be/FrHFJTPvT8o Xperimenta Sounds · XPERIMENTA Due Pianos - Demo XPERIMENTA Due 1.9Premium Pianos BUY NOW PIANO WEEK SALE! -40% OFFWhen Flavio and the team decided to make this sample library, they had in mind to create something special, something unique, that could really keep the...




www.xperimentaproject.com


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## Flyo (Nov 22, 2021)

Someone test 300grand? How good it is? In parallel with CFX in Abbey?


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## SupremeFist (Nov 22, 2021)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> BOUGHT!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That's a silly price for one of my top 5 pianos (the Second, Yamaha C3).


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Nov 22, 2021)

Flyo said:


> Someone test 300grand? How good it is? In parallel with CFX in Abbey?


i've been practicing with it.

hardly a "test".

i usually cycle through my piano VIs - i haven't with 300, yet.

i like it very much. i will buy the upgrade when it comes out.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Dec 2, 2021)




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## Zoot_Rollo (May 31, 2022)

https://thebeatcommunity.com/2022/05/31/the-ravenscroft-275-by-vi-labs-is-now-half-price/?amp=1


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## Zoot_Rollo (Sep 6, 2022)




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## CeDur (Oct 2, 2022)

I regret selling Hammersmith Pro to be honest. It has this amazing "sparkle" in the top.


----------



## keepitsimple (Oct 2, 2022)

Once i VERY recently cracked the velocity response code of the Modern U, it has become a revelation to me in authenticity and response. Never thought i'll ever achieve this level of realism with a controller and VST library....but this one has done it.

It's like i'm reborn lol.

So i HIGHLY HIGHLY recommend it!


----------

