# Can purchase Dorico 2 for $195 - worth it?



## Symfoniq

Dorico 2 is currently 30% off, and I'm also eligible for crossgrade pricing (I own Sibelius, but stopped upgrading after Avid layed off the UK team), bringing the total to $195. Is it worth it? Is Dorico the future? My primary DAW is Cubase, FWIW.


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## prodigalson

where is it 30% off?


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## Symfoniq

prodigalson said:


> where is it 30% off?



Steinberg Online Shop. Use coupon code "DORICO30". Expires January 29.


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## jamwerks

Yes Dorico is worth it. You'll never even want or feel the need to open Finale Sibelius ever again! And it's great to be able to assign identical key switches to similar functions in Dorico & Cubase.


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## Nathanael Iversen

I happily switched during the 1.x period of the program. It is quite good. The output is beautiful. There is a learning curve. Like Sibelius, it is designed to work on keyboard shortcuts. Learn them, and no, they are not identical to Sibelius. But the UI is so much better than Sibelius. It is clean and fast. Get NotePerformer3 working with it. It is a wonderful writing platform.


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## joebaggan

At that price Dorico 2 is worth it. Dorico 1 was a bit of a shambles so Dorico 2 is a good time to jump in.


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## ltmusic

I Would like to use Dorico with note performer 3. 
Is ti possible to record each instrument by live playing ? 

Thanks.


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## jamwerks

ltmusic said:


> I Would like to use Dorico with note performer 3.
> Is ti possible to record each instrument by live playing ?
> 
> Thanks.


Yes that's now possible (haven't used it though).


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## Paul T McGraw

Has Dorico added the ability to have multiple voices on the same staff? Crucial for choral and orchestral music.

Has Dorico added automatic reading and naming of chords? Very helpful for analysis.

Has Dorico added roman numeral analysis? A must for musicologists, and students of all ages.

Has Dorico added the ability to assign hairpins readable by NotePerformer to all staves at once?

Has Dorico added playable repeats with first and second endings, D.C. al fine, etc.?

Has Dorico added the ability to change instruments on a single staff? Useful for situations where Oboe 2 witches to English Horn, or Flute 2 switches to piccolo, etc.

I was very hopeful about Dorico when it was initially released. At the time it seemed like a product that was unfinished. The above list are some of the missing things that caused me to say no to Dorico. Perhaps the Dorico team has now added these and other features that a pro level notation program should have?


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## TimCox

Paul T McGraw said:


> Has Dorico added the ability to have multiple voices on the same staff? Crucial for choral and orchestral music.
> 
> Has Dorico added automatic reading and naming of chords? Very helpful for analysis.
> 
> Has Dorico added roman numeral analysis? A must for musicologists, and students of all ages.
> 
> Has Dorico added the ability to assign hairpins readable by NotePerformer to all staves at once?
> 
> Has Dorico added playable repeats with first and second endings, D.C. al fine, etc.?
> 
> Has Dorico added the ability to change instruments on a single staff? Useful for situations where Oboe 2 witches to English Horn, or Flute 2 switches to piccolo, etc.
> 
> I was very hopeful about Dorico when it was initially released. At the time it seemed like a product that was unfinished. The above list are some of the missing things that caused me to say no to Dorico. Perhaps the Dorico team has now added these and other features that a pro level notation program should have?


I can't answer all of these but I know when I was using my demo of Dorico 2 I could do multiple voices on one staff and in the setup if you assign multiple instruments to one player Dorico automatically switches instruments (including a player direction to do so). Even better is that you can see all the individual ones for writing if you switch to galley view (I think that's what it was called?) for easier writing. It saves having to input the switches yourself.


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## SimonCharlesHanna

So I just bought Dorico because of this thread! 

quick question:

re-input pitches - can you do this in Dorico?


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## lucor

SimonCharlesHanna said:


> re-input pitches - can you do this in Dorico?


Seems like it : https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=120293
I think I'll also finally take the plunge and switch to Dorico. Especially now that NotePerformer works almost as well as on Sibelius with 3.2.


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## C-Wave

Can anyone please post a screenshot of Dorico Pro price in ***USD*** with the Coupon applied?
Much obliged.
Thanks


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## Symfoniq

C-Wave said:


> Can anyone please post a screenshot of Dorico Pro price in ***USD*** with the Coupon applied?
> Much obliged.
> Thanks


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## SimonCharlesHanna

lucor said:


> Seems like it : https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=120293
> I think I'll also finally take the plunge and switch to Dorico. Especially now that NotePerformer works almost as well as on Sibelius with 3.2.


Thank you!!!

Very excited


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## jamwerks

Dorico 2.2 is very powerful. Their YouTube channel has some great learning tools plus of course the manual. On top of that, their forum is great for getting answers to those questions you just can't figure out yourself.


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## HeliaVox

Yup, I'm glad you posted this. I'm going to make the switch to Dorico.


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## SimonCharlesHanna

Been having a play with it coming from sibelius - it's really nice to work with. Definitely need to spend a bit of time setting up your own hot keys for certain tasks.

One downside for me was that there's no way to listen to the score verbatim unless you reset all your huamnised midi data in the PLAY section. In sibelius one can simply click a button to alternate between the two modes of playback.


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## C-Wave

About to purchase Dorico Elements (can’t afford Pro), but i have one question:
The trial of Elements doesn’t seem to be able to record *note duration* in free midi record mode. Can anyone say if this the same in Pro mode?
Thanks.

Edit: Anyone?
Edit 2: Yes, Elements has same Midi live recording like Pro. but while testing I found that there is a very small amount of vst instruments supported.


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## tonaliszt

I wish I could buy Dorico for $195!


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## ScoringFilm

I took the plunge as well; been holding out for a while, however at this price it's a no-brainer!


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## Anders Wall

Paul T McGraw said:


> The above list are some of the missing things that caused me to say no to Dorico. Perhaps the Dorico team has now added these and other features that a pro level notation program should have?


No.
https://download.steinberg.net/webcontent/products/dorico/Dorico_21_Detailed_Feature_List.pdf



jamwerks said:


> Dorico 2.2 is very powerful. Their YouTube channel has some great learning tools plus of course the manual. On top of that, their forum is great for getting answers to those questions you just can't figure out yourself.


Yes, do checkout the Youtube.
Most of my initial questions had a really simple answer and I got them all from the Dorico youtube feed.

Best,
Anders


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## ptram

Anders Wall said:


> No.
> https://download.steinberg.net/webcontent/products/dorico/Dorico_21_Detailed_Feature_List.pdf


However, Dorico 2.2 added a lot of things, in November 2018. This excellent review can be used to integrate the information given in the outdated document for 2.1 (Steinberg is often late with the documentation of Dorico).

https://www.scoringnotes.com/reviews/dorico-2-2/

Paolo


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## ptram

@Paul T McGraw, I'm not the biggest expert of Dorico yet, but I'll try to answer for what I know. As of Dorico 2.2:

- You can have multiple voices on the same staff.

- You can add chord names, and there is a chord track to play them back.

- Figured bass is not yet natively implemented, but there is a user-made workaround.
https://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=246&t=120821&start=100

- All dynamics, including hairpins, can be linked between staves, and can be read by NotePerformer.

- Repeats with first and second endings, D.C. al fine are there, and should be played back (not tried to see if it works).

- Dorico starts from che concept of Player, and not of Staff or Instrument. So, you can have a Player switching to a different Instrument on his own staff.

Paolo


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## JohnG

how's the switch from Finale? And does anyone know if you can import MusicXML files?

Finale is just a drag but I've been on it so long it's daunting to face a switch.

PS -- I never use Finale for playback except the basic piano sound to check pitches. Consequently, those improvements, while nifty, are not that interesting to me.


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## Anders Wall

JohnG said:


> how's the switch from Finale? And does anyone know if you can import MusicXML files?
> 
> Finale is just a drag but I've been on it so long it's daunting to face a switch.
> 
> PS -- I never use Finale for playback except the basic piano sound to check pitches. Consequently, those improvements, while nifty, are not that interesting to me.


MusicXML works like a charm.
Can’t say about finale.
Best,
/A


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## Anders Wall

ptram said:


> However, Dorico 2.2 added a lot of things, in November 2018. This excellent review can be used to integrate the information given in the outdated document for 2.1 (Steinberg is often late with the documentation of Dorico).
> 
> https://www.scoringnotes.com/reviews/dorico-2-2/
> 
> Paolo


Ah, there you go...
Thank you.
I think I’m still on 2.1.

Looks like update weekend 
/Anders


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## JohnG

I'm downloading it. Library is pretty large -- do you really need that (hoping "no")?


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## ptram

JohnG said:


> Library is pretty large -- do you really need that (hoping "no")?


I don't need it and deleted it. Shame you can't remove the many expression maps from the Play list.

I would suggest to get NotePerformer, if you don't already have it. There are also expression maps available for various libraries, to be imported as Cubase maps.

Paolo


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## JohnG

ptram said:


> NotePerformer



thanks Paolo; I don't use Cubase -- does that matter?

And does anyone know if you need the "Doric 2.2 Playback 1 -- HALion Sonic SE 3" file to make the program work? It's almost 3 GB.

Thank you everyone.


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## ptram

JohnG said:


> I don't use Cubase -- does that matter?


Sorry, I was a bit short in answering. Cubase expression maps are the only ones available from Steinberg at the moment. They can be imported, and then edited in Dorico. You need them to drive various sound libraries. You can find them by searching for 'Steinberg expression maps'.

NotePerformer is a separate sound library, not tied to Cubase. It works in a very interesting way with Dorico, and you can find some discussions about it in this same forum.

Paolo


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## Wallander

JohnG said:


> thanks Paolo; I don't use Cubase -- does that matter?
> 
> And does anyone know if you need the "Doric 2.2 Playback 1 -- HALion Sonic SE 3" file to make the program work? It's almost 3 GB.
> 
> Thank you everyone.


You don’t need to install the Halion library to use NotePerformer! And the same goes for the Sibelius Sounds library. 

NotePerformer only relies on its own, fully-integrated, sounds.


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## Rob

C-Wave said:


> ..........Yes, Elements has same Midi live recording like Pro. but while testing I found that there is a very small amount of vst instruments supported.


I found I had to “whitelist” the vstis in order to see them


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## Wolf68

I also updated from v1 to v2 now for a reduced Price. Hope I'll find somewhen the rest to work with it.


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## JohnG

Wallander said:


> You don’t need to install the Halion library to use NotePerformer! And the same goes for the Sibelius Sounds library.
> 
> NotePerformer only relies on its own, fully-integrated, sounds.



I'm not going to get NotePerformer. I mean Dorico 2.2 -- I just want to replace Finale.


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## Wallander

JohnG said:


> I'm not going to get NotePerformer. I mean Dorico 2.2 -- I just want to replace Finale.


Right! You can probably use Dorico without neither Halion or NP, if you’re fine with working without playback, or have your own solution to it.


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## HeliaVox

Whelp, just got it. Really looking forward to learning it!


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## joebaggan

JohnG said:


> I'm not going to get NotePerformer. I mean Dorico 2.2 -- I just want to replace Finale.



For quick mockups from notation software, NotePerformer is a great deal. You can use it with Sib, Finale, or Dorico to get a decent idea of what the score will sound like without all the fuss of dealing with CC's/automation etc.


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## jamwerks

@JohnG The move from Finale should go smoothly. Dorico is already so much more powerful than Finale that I don't see even how Finale will be able to stay in business. There's quite a bit to learn' but even after a couple a days you should be operational. Coming from Sibelius is probably a bit quicker.

IMO NotePerformer 3 is worth having, even just for last-thing listens to check for mistaken notes, tempi, etc.

FWIW, I just got through doing a project involving 40 cue's for large orchestra (about 63 minutes or music), that was done in a single Dorico file. Some players had 2 instruments. Dorico seems to know how to solve all the problems. I know we all have different ways of working, but personally I'd never commit to the score and parts being done without a few close listens to the playback.


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## JohnG

Wallander said:


> Right! You can probably use Dorico without neither Halion or NP, if you’re fine with working without playback, or have your own solution to it.



Before stuff gets approved I (nearly always) have to mock it all up in DP anyway. So it's already been checked. I rarely change the orchestration from the mockup, though sometimes I do. That's why I'm not interested in yet another library @joebaggan -- I already have a zillion.

I assume Dorico can at least play back some sounds if you connect the midi up, or it has built-in piano or something like that?

Either way it sounds great. Thanks @jamwerks and everyone.


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## SimonCharlesHanna

These are really helpful

Also imo you're a bit crazy not to get noteperformer - it's fantastic and good enough to export if you need a mockup imo.


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## Wallander

JohnG said:


> Before stuff gets approved I (nearly always) have to mock it all up in DP anyway. So it's already been checked. I rarely change the orchestration from the mockup, though sometimes I do. That's why I'm not interested in yet another library @joebaggan -- I already have a zillion.
> 
> I assume Dorico can at least play back some sounds if you connect the midi up, or it has built-in piano or something like that?
> 
> Either way it sounds great. Thanks @jamwerks and everyone.


I'm happy to stand corrected, but unlike Finale or Sibelius I don't think that Dorico -without Halion- has a built-in piano sound or General MIDI driver, no. That was my point, that without Halion, NP or another 3rd party sample library, there's no playback at all in Dorico but there's just a playback template named "Silence". So unless there's something I'm missing, NP is the closest you get to a General MIDI driver in Dorico, because NP is modelled on the same philosophy as GM. 

Just to be clear, I have absolutely no intention of trying to upsell you something you don't need, for monetary reasons. NP is a relatively cheap product, and the time I'm spending writing this post by all means outweigh the profit we would make if you actually purchased it.  

But for the record, just so that there's no confusion about what NP is about, I don't see NP as a direct competitor to your other libraries. Most if not all people on this forum who use NP also have a plethora of sample libraries which they use for professional production in a DAW. The reason why people still get NP is that we combine the ease-of-use of a plain General MIDI driver with a much-better-than-General-MIDI playback quality. 

Also, we're aiming to resolve the issues with playback, in general, in each specific notation software, by the means of operating system- and host-dependent features. To make a few Dorico-related examples, NP recognises the fact that it's running in Dorico, and uses operating-system features to significantly shorten the loading time going between different scores in Dorico. And on Mac, we hook into macOS to ensure that NotePerformer's mixer window stays on top of your Dorico project, despite the fact that plug-ins run in a separate process in Dorico and would normally disappear behind your project's main window when you click the Play button in Dorico, which many find very disturbing. These may be small things, but they add up to the user experience. 

So NotePerformer really isn't just another $129 budget sample library for notation programs, but we're trying to improve the user's experience of working with their particular notation software, in a way that makes our playback feel like a natural part of the notation software itself. And I think this plays a great role in explaining why our software has gained such a wide following.


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## Brentishere

Apparently, our friends at Steinberg are not allowing a crossgrade to Dorico on Finale if it was upgraded from Songwriter. Other restrictions may apply.

*Retracted*
Took 3 tries, but they finally authorized it.


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## jamwerks

I'll give my take on Note Performer 3. I know it can sound like a hassle to have to set up playback programs, but with Dorico & Note Performer (NP), you never really realize NP is open, or you never have to assign instruments or set any parameters, whatever instruments you add to your score (orchestral in any case), you just press playback and it just works.

In my case, I see it as an orchestration tool. The playback won't sound as good as our painlessly sculped mock-ups, but it gives me enough of the right kind of feed-back to be able to make wise orchestration decisions (provided you have your orchestration chops down). That and exposing any kind of error you've made, you'll hear it.

I used NP with Sibelius all the time, but had never tried it with Finale. With Dorico it seems to work seamlessly!


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## joebaggan

Wallander said:


> But for the record, just so that there's no confusion about what NP is about, I don't see NP as a direct competitor to your other libraries. Most if not all people on this forum who use NP also have a plethora of sample libraries which they use for professional production in a DAW. The reason why people still get NP is that we combine the ease-of-use of a plain General MIDI driver with a much-better-than-General-MIDI playback quality.
> .



Question for @Wallander - I know that Noteperformer's sounds are integrated into the software, but is there any plan to work with other higher end sample library vendors (e.g. Spitfire, Orchestral Tools etc.) so that your software can play back samples from those libraries (e.g. plugin/driver sort of thing)? As much as I like your "look ahead" technology and ability to drive playback from music notation, having this tech coupled so closely to the NP sounds gives it limited use for those who want higher quality sample playback.


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## Wallander

joebaggan said:


> Question for @Wallander - I know that Noteperformer's sounds are integrated into the software, but is there any plan to work with other higher end sample library vendors (e.g. Spitfire, Orchestral Tools etc.) so that your software can play back samples from those libraries (e.g. plugin/driver sort of thing)? As much as I like your "look ahead" technology and ability to drive playback from music notation, having this tech coupled so closely to the NP sounds gives it limited use for those who want higher quality sample playback.


I've pondered the idea, but it would be extremely hard to do, take many years, and even then it's hard to say how good the actual results would be. NotePerformer wouldn't be able to control notes on a note-by-note basis, but on a MIDI channel-by-channel basis only. It's also an issue that many of the fine-scale details would have to be left to the patch itself, such as legato transitions.

I never say never, but it's not something that's in the pipeline right now due to the uncertainness and complexity of it.


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## Maximvs

Hi Arne,

Any chance to see a WIWI update at some point in the near future?

Kind regards,

Max T.


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## dzilizzi

Now I am wondering if I should grab this, or wait until the Fall when I may be taking classes that would get me the educational crossgrade at $159.99. I got Finale last September, but I find it frustrating to work with. I'm sure it is me. It took forever to figure out how to get a normal SATB format for a class assignment. Well, better decide today sometime.


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## C-Wave

Rob said:


> I found I had to “whitelist” the vstis in order to see them


Thanks, that worked for me. I think one area that can take some improvements is the user interface here; having it tree-based grouped by vendor (similar to Cubase and other daw’s), instead of just one long list in a pull down menu.Nowi know this not a daw but the “play” tab sure makes this look like a daw.


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## Coincidental

Anyone know how many installations Dorico allows? Seems ideal, but if I can't have it installed on both home and studio laptops, that might be a bit of a problem...


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## C-Wave

Coincidental said:


> Anyone know how many installations Dorico allows? Seems ideal, but if I can't have it installed on both home and studio laptops, that might be a bit of a problem...


I believe you will have to take the dongle with you between your home and studio.


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## Wallander

Massimo said:


> Hi Arne,
> 
> Any chance to see a WIWI update at some point in the near future?
> 
> Kind regards,
> 
> Max T.


Hi Max!

I shouldn't hi-jack this thread anymore.  But to answer your question, there are no more _feature_ updates planned to the WIVI software, but it's a software that's reached its final form. It's likely that there will be at least one more update to maintain OS compatibility, but I'm not sure when that will be.


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## Saxer

Wallander said:


> But to answer your question, there are no more _feature_ updates planned to the WIVI software, but it's a software that's reached its final form. It's likely that there will be at least one more update to maintain OS compatibility, but I'm not sure when that will be.


Sometimes it's really relaxing to know something has reached it's final state. I still have WIVI in nearly daily use. If there wasn't no Noteperformer (and there isn't i.e. for Logic) I use WIVI for notation. Bassoons, Clarinets and Tuba are in my chamber setting and go into final production. If I use windcontroller there's nothing that playable like WIVI (all other sounds with "modeling" in the name have much more latency). The playability makes the winds more believable than all samples. And for every kind of additional brass and wind between samples it's great. Sometimes a bigger GUI was nice but I can live with that and I have tons of ready to go custom presets anyway. But keeping it on current and future OS would be great! It's not a forgotten software! Don't let it die


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## Saxer

Ok, back to Dorico/Noteperformer. 
Problem: After finishing an arrangement I changed the french horns from "Horn in F" to "Horn in F no key sig". The "no sig" is for "no key signature", so all accidentals are written per note. Most horn players prefer that.
But after changing the Horns Noteperformer stopped performing the horns. I can't get them to play again. Reloading or even changing to other instruments keeps the horn parts quiet. How can I get them to wake up again?


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## Wallander

Saxer said:


> Ok, back to Dorico/Noteperformer.
> Problem: After finishing an arrangement I changed the french horns from "Horn in F" to "Horn in F no key sig". The "no sig" is for "no key signature", so all accidentals are written per note. Most horn players prefer that.
> But after changing the Horns Noteperformer stopped performing the horns. I can't get them to play again. Reloading or even changing to other instruments keeps the horn parts quiet. How can I get them to wake up again?


Hmm, frankly I have no idea why that would be! If you email me the .dorico score (I'm sure you have an email address ) I'm happy to troubleshoot it.


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## Saxer

Great, thanks... sent mail!


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## Vardaro

Got it just in time! I had been hanging on until a graphic velocity control arrives: vital for piano mockups, where simultaneous notes can have different velocities, but I couldn't resist this offer (Finale crossgrade at €195)

I still use Sibelius 6 on my XP laptop (I'm far too old to learn their awful Ribbon), where I can sweep across the velocity markers on a selection of notes. But I shall then import to Dorico on my desktop for its DAW and engraving aspects.


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## Vardaro

Silly question; does music xml contain midi information (velocity, cc etc)?


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## Maximvs

Wallander said:


> Hi Max!
> 
> I shouldn't hi-jack this thread anymore.  But to answer your question, there are no more _feature_ updates planned to the WIVI software, but it's a software that's reached its final form. It's likely that there will be at least one more update to maintain OS compatibility, but I'm not sure when that will be.


Thanks Arne for the kind feedback about WIWI... Apologies for diverting from the Dorico thread subject.


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## Dewdman42

I bought Dorico this year and plan to ride the Dorico wave for however long it takes until its the monster notational that owns the market. That is where I think it will go. IMHO it still is being developed and while its quite capable, there are still features missing that many people are complaining about because those same features are already on other notational programs that have been worked on for decades. But the devs respond to questions and criticisms on the steinberg forum regularly and there is ample evidence that they are paying very close attention to what users want and need in Dorico.

However Dorico has some other compelling new paradigms that are new and unlike anything out there until now and I like it! The Dorico team definitely has a vision for something that is beyond what previous generations of notational programs are/were. 

I do think their priority at this time is with layout, typesetting and note entry concerns and probably as it should be, but I also feel that ultimately it will become the ultimate notational playback software, perhaps eventually making it possible to do completely mockups that rival what could be done in cubase.


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## Coincidental

C-Wave said:


> I believe you will have to take the dongle with you between your home and studio.


Thanks! Bit disappointing, but perhaps that's something there'll be some movement on in future - even two installations on the eLicenser would be a help.


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## C-Wave

Coincidental said:


> Thanks! Bit disappointing, but perhaps that's something there'll be some movement on in future - even two installations on the eLicenser would be a help.


Can't say for sure, but check if their software key (i.e. the license sits on the hard disk) is in *addition* or *instead* of the USB Key.


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## jamwerks

I don't think Dorico uses the Steinberg USB key dongle like Cubase does.


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## C-Wave

jamwerks said:


> I don't think Dorico uses the Steinberg USB key dongle like Cubase does.


It does. I am using the trial version now (I downloaded both Pro and Elements). Even the 30-day trial needs the trial key to be on a USB Dongle.


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## Dewdman42

Dorico provides one license and it’s in the dongle and you have to move the dongle in order to use it on another machine such as your laptop.

The dorico team is very aware about this frustration as it is completely understandable that a single user would want to work on several computers without having to shuffle the dongle around. Unfortunately Steinberg is very strict and stubborn in this point and it’s unlikely to change.


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## C-Wave

Dewdman42 said:


> Dorico provides one license and it’s in the dongle and you have to move the dongle in order to use it on another machine such as your laptop.
> 
> The dorico team is very aware about this frustration as it is completely understandable that a single user would want to work on several computers without having to shuffle the dongle around. Unfortunately Steinberg is very strict and stubborn in this point and it’s unlikely to change.


Pace-based dongle protection (non- Steinberg music software use this dongle except VSL)has two major advantages:
1. Two licenses out of the box
2. Licenses can be saved/transfered on the cloud.


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## C-Wave

Right now, judging by using Dorico 2.2.1 Pro (and Elements) my biggest grievance is vst instruments can freeze Dorico sometimes. Enough times (several in one day) to be unpractical using vst instruments; this includes the vst’s that are whitelisted by Steinberg (not user-designated white list). Windows 10 (latest update), AMD graphics, NVME SSD, 64 GB RAM.


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## Dewdman42

Which vst?


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## C-Wave

Dewdman42 said:


> Which vst?


any vst. the software just shows a blue circle, and it just doesn’t come back after 1 hour*. Worse (if nothing goes wrong) the switch from one vst to another takes 5 to 10 sec. loading time. i don’t know if this is because i am on a trial version.
* Edited. this is after two days of testing!


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## kitekrazy

Wallander said:


> You don’t need to install the Halion library to use NotePerformer! And the same goes for the Sibelius Sounds library.
> 
> NotePerformer only relies on its own, fully-integrated, sounds.



You can install on many machines as you want.


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## Rob

C-Wave said:


> Right now, judging by using Dorico 2.2.1 Pro (and Elements) my biggest grievance is vst instruments can freeze Dorico sometimes. Enough times (several in one day) to be unpractical using vst instruments; this includes the vst’s that are whitelisted by Steinberg (not user-designated white list). Windows 10 (latest update), AMD graphics, NVME SSD, 64 GB RAM.


 Must be system/machine related... I’m using it on Win7 and no crashes at all with Vstis in a week.


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## Wallander

C-Wave said:


> any vst. the software just shows a blue circle, and it just doesn’t come back after 1 hour*. Worse (if nothing goes wrong) the switch from one vst to another takes 5 to 10 sec. loading time. i don’t know if this is because i am on a trial version.
> * Edited. this is after two days of testing!


FWIW, all plug-ins in Dorico 2 runs in a separate process named "VstAudioEngine2".

So the audio engine and your VST plug-ins should be able to crash independently of Dorico, without crashing Dorico, or at least that's the idea.


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## joebaggan

C-Wave said:


> any vst. the software just shows a blue circle, and it just doesn’t come back after 1 hour*. Worse (if nothing goes wrong) the switch from one vst to another takes 5 to 10 sec. loading time. i don’t know if this is because i am on a trial version.
> * Edited. this is after two days of testing!



I have similar slowness/freezing issues when switching between vst's in Dorico. I also have a similar problem that Cubase has where I get audio engine related errors when trying to exit Dorico (maybe not surprising since I believe some parts of the Dorico audio engine were borrowed from Cubase).


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## C-Wave

joebaggan said:


> I have similar slowness/freezing issues when switching between vst's in Dorico. I also have a similar problem that Cubase has where I get audio engine related errors preventing me from exiting Dorico (maybe not surprising since I believe some parts of the Dorico audio engine was borrowed from Cubase).


Exactly! Like you i also figured that it is the audio engine hanging up, but IT IS dragging all of Dorico with it. On top of that the audio not always manages to come back if i force quit; Most of the times i gotta resart Windows. But guess what , here is weirdest thing, the same VST that had the audio engine to freeze next time it simply just starts up without a glitch, go figure.
Edit: Is your graphics card an AMD or NVidia? Windows or Mac?


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