# HW Question: Vostok / Syntrx



## Savepoint (Aug 3, 2021)

Hi everyone! This is my first post here (I come in peace). I stumbled on this wonderful forum while reading a way-back recommendation made by @charlieclouser on a Gearspace thread and was *delighted* to discover a production forum on Al Gore’s fabled internet which doesn’t seem to be filled with bile, synthfommercial fanboy-ism, and bizarre tribal fury (at least none that I’ve seen, yet).

Anyway, to my question… I’ve been looking for a (premium) self-contained, um “dangerous”, semi-modular 3-osc (or more), musical insanity/sfx synth that can kind of do a lot of unexpected cool things that go sonically/organically beyond what I mangle in Kontakt & without me needing to buy twenty other things to find that wide variety of murderous-to-ethereal textures I want at my fingertips, and I’ve narrowed it down to the Erica Synths SYNTRX and the Analog Solutions Vostok 2020…

Does anyone here have any experience with either? Specifically the Vostok 2020, as there are *maybe* 3 or 4 demos online I can find on it, none of which are very useful to determine anything beyond “sound rad”…

From what I can tell there seems to be overlap/similarities between these two, tech & feature wise, but because of the lack of demos for the Vostok compared to the abundance of demos on the Syntrx it’s hard to figure out which might be right for me. If the Vostok 2020 is essentially a more secret weapon/“dangerous”/versatile version of the Syntrx then, why not, I’m all in. Anyone?

Ok, that was my question! Thank you! 🎉


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## doctoremmet (Aug 3, 2021)

Boldfish100 said:


> delighted* to see a production forum on Al Gore’s fabled internet which doesn’t seem to be filled with bile, synthfommercial fanboy-ism, and bizarre tribal fury (at least none that I’ve seen, yet).


Hahaha. This is true but I have never seen it phrased THIS funny! ❤️


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## doctoremmet (Aug 3, 2021)

Now, as far as hardware synths go… I have been completely out of the loop since a decade or two. Maybe synthheads like @Nimrod7 or @Pier can shed their light on it? True to the name of the forum, I have to say we mainly discuss softsynths on here…


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## Savepoint (Aug 3, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> True to the name of the forum, I have to say we mainly discuss softsynths on here…


Thank you! Makes sense — I work in a hybrid environment and have seen quite a bit of informed conversations here on HW, so I figured this would be a better place to ask than Gearspace 😂. Hope I haven’t engaged in first-time-poster sacrilege on VI-C… 🙏😬.


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## doctoremmet (Aug 3, 2021)

Sacrilege? No way. Any synthhead is very very welcome here. We regularly discuss hardware. But since I’m OLD I typically think about my DX7 and Waldorf modules and stuff like that.


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## Savepoint (Aug 3, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Any synthhead is very very welcome here. We regularly discuss hardware.


And thank you again!


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## doctoremmet (Aug 3, 2021)

Even synth haters are… tolerated. Yep. Coolest place on the internet


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## Nimrod7 (Aug 3, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Maybe synthheads like @Nimrod7 or @Pier can shed their light on it?


I wish... 

I am very embarrassed to say that I have hundreds of soft-synths.
I am even more embarrassed to say that I have not one hardware synth!

A friend of mine is into modulars, tried to assimilate me, but at the end he felt guilt, because he knows I am into sample libraries and the impact they have financially to a person...


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## doctoremmet (Aug 3, 2021)

I decided to get into Cherry Audio Voltage Modular, to satisfy the “eurocrack” GAS.


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## doctoremmet (Aug 3, 2021)

Of course, the orchestral samples still managed to bankrupt me, so I ended up living under my Swindon railway bridge anyway.


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## Savepoint (Aug 3, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I decided to get into Cherry Audio Voltage Modular, to satisfy the “eurocrack” GAS.


How do you like it? Cherry Audio is killer — I love the buzz and personality of the VA they have on their stuff. The MG-1 emu is awesome. Sounds legitimately electric.


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## doctoremmet (Aug 3, 2021)

Boldfish100 said:


> How do you like it? Cherry Audio is killer — I love the buzz and personality of the VA they have on their stuff. The MG-1 emu is awesome. Sounds legitimately electric.


It is great fun and sounds awesome. All their stuff does by the way.

Here’s me mangling some orchestral samples that are part of Karoryfer Samples’ excellent Vengeful Violin library:



But the normal synth modules are equally great. The MRB modules, the PSP modules, the Vult stuff. Really great.


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## Savepoint (Aug 3, 2021)

Nimrod7 said:


> A friend of mine is into modulars, tried to assimilate me, but at the end he felt guilt, because he knows I am into sample libraries and the impact they have financially to a person...


Haha — very wise to stay away from those patch cables then. That’s mostly why I’m interested in a Vostok or Syntrx, for the all-in-one sonic/creative opportunities parallel to modular synth’ing, but on a single monster box with wide tonal range etc. I’ve sold a ton of HW to finance a semi simplified “best of” (for me) flagshippy toolset, where I (hopefully) won’t be looking past what’s in front of me for whatever specific thing I need to make. My Waldorf Quantum covers all my HW granular, sampling, VA, wavetable needs… My Prophet 6 covers all my basic VCO Poly synth’ing… Etc etc… Trying to keep as little GAS as possible in my life these days by having only exactly the best of what I’m into, and also making sure any purchase I make has as little overlap into what I currently have as possible. The “best” of this, the “best” of that.


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## Savepoint (Aug 3, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Here’s me mangling some orchestral samples that are part of Karoryfer Samples’ excellent Vengeful Violin library:





doctoremmet said:


> It is great fun and sounds awesome. All their stuff does by the way.
> 
> Here’s me mangling some orchestral samples that are part of Karoryfer Samples’ excellent Vengeful Violin library:
> 
> ...



That’s awesome! I love how they’ve collab’d and incorporated great brand modules in their sandbox. I’ve felt a lot of plugs in the last few years have either gone the way of highly pro utility or highly suspicious/superfluous, and Cherry and Softube keep knocking it out of the park on quality, variety, usefulness. Haven’t jumped too far into Cherry Modular yet but I definitely will this year.


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## doctoremmet (Aug 3, 2021)

The developer community is great, really approachable. Mark Barton (MRB) in particular. He and Cherry collaborated on the ARP 2500 modules, and those are fantastic. So are his own modules. Zeroscillator. Great for true “thru-zero” FM.


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## charlieclouser (Aug 3, 2021)

I haven't played Vostok, but I've owned a bunch of Analogue Solutions modules for Eurorack.

I have played Syntrx, and I own a bunch of Erica modules for Eurorack.

Syntrx is pretty darn cool and sounds great. But I have a big Eurorack so I don't need a standalone unit, and in the past I've played a few original Synthi AKS units and passed on them every time, even back when they were around $4k. The original Synthi does do "On The Run" very well, and plenty of BBC Radiophonic Workshop / Dr. Who sounds, but if you don't like atonal ring mod bleeps you may get bored fast. The Syntrx is not a 1:1 clone so it probably has more versatility, but it definitely caters to those who lust after a Synthi but have never touched one and never will due to the current $20k asking price. At half the price of the Vostok, the Syntax is very tempting - and save+recall of the matrix routings is WAY better than the manual pin board on the Vostok.

One thing I'm not sure about is whether the matrix on the Syntrx or the pin board on the Vostok are buffered or not. A big part of the unpredictable weirdness of the original Synthi came from the fact that the pin matrix was NOT buffered from the factory, so if you had a routing of a source going to oscillator pitch and then added another pin to that column, that oscillator would go out of tune and need to be readjusted. Although there are mods and kits to add buffering to original Synthi units to resolve this issue, some graybeards would call that sacrilege as the original behavior was weird and charming (I'd call it annoying, but whatever). I would imagine that in this day and age, the Vostok and Syntrx DO have buffered matrices, but I have not verified this.

In general Erica Synths is absolutely killing it right now, and you get more bang for your buck because they're made in Latvia - if they were made in the US or UK you'd pay a lot more for what you get. The Erica Fusion tube VCO is one of the best purchases I've made in the last 20 years - so I got a second one. The Erica Fusion tube mixer also sounds great for something as boring as a 6x2 mixer. And then of course there's the Fusion Plasma Drive module which sounds like having the skin on your face removed with 40-grit sandpaper. I tried every single Erica module in depth and went home with Fusion VCO x2, Fusion mixer, Fusion Plasma Drive x2, and a Black Hole DSP v2. So in general I give top marks to Erica stuff.

Analogue Solutions on the other hand, make very high quality stuff but the feature set and innovation level is maybe not quite as cutting-edge as other stuff out there - they're kind of old school. The Vostok might indeed sound good, but on paper it's "meh". And their stuff comes at a premium UK-made price. The Eurorack modules I have of theirs are all in the "to be sold or launched from a trebuchet" pile, but they're all from 10-15 years ago. However I admit to a bit of lust for their Collossus. Even though the feature set is not anything special, and the cosmetics are not a 1:1 match for the EMS Synthi 100, it is an interesting package and lots of it.

That said, a buddy got the Impulse Command and loves it. Even though it's fairly basic the feature set is well-targeted to a particular niche and it's built very well and sounds great for what it does do.

And just to distract from the main topic I'll wave the flag again for the ASM Hyrdasynth keyboard. For $1,300 you get a very up-to-the-minute sound, polyphony, very good build quality and UI, and the poly-aftertouch keyboard is an absolute game changer and worth triple the asking price. Everyone should have one.


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## Pier (Aug 4, 2021)

Nimrod7 said:


> I wish...
> 
> I am very embarrassed to say that I have hundreds of soft-synths.
> I am even more embarrassed to say that I have not one hardware synth!
> ...


Same.

I'm 100% digital now and have been for years.


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## Pier (Aug 4, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> It is great fun and sounds awesome. All their stuff does by the way.
> 
> Here’s me mangling some orchestral samples that are part of Karoryfer Samples’ excellent Vengeful Violin library:
> 
> ...



Woah that is good.

What is going on there? It sounds like all is coming from the audio tracks?


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## doctoremmet (Aug 4, 2021)

Pier said:


> What is going on there? It sounds like all is coming from the audio tracks?


I rendered out a pretty generative track from VM to audio. So what you hear is VM rendered to audio in Ableton, but no post processing at all. Just some copy / pasting in the audio tracks by the looks of it. By the time I wanted to screengrab the audio of the actual VM patch, my CPU sort of died haha, so I used this workaround.

I had two LFOs triggering two instances of a sampler module containing 8 samples I took from Karoryfer Vengeful Violin. The cool thing (for sounddesigners) is that @DSmolken includes those WAVs with every instrument. The randomly triggered samples then flow through some PSP Verbs and Delay lines by the looks of it.

I went on to sample some of the more interesting bits of this patch and have used that as a basis for some synth patches in Equator 2 IIRC


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## doctoremmet (Aug 4, 2021)

charlieclouser said:


> And just to distract from the main topic I'll wave the flag again for the ASM Hyrdasynth keyboard. For $1,300 you get a very up-to-the-minute sound, polyphony, very good build quality and UI, and the poly-aftertouch keyboard is an absolute game changer and worth triple the asking price. Everyone should have one.


Paging @jbuhler - maybe this is “the one” for you? Thanks Charlie, great post!


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## j_kranz (Aug 4, 2021)

Another vote for anything Erica Synths, but like Charlie mentioned, personally I think you get better bang for your buck with their eurorack modules. I can also attest, as a huge Erica fanboy, that their modules are absolutely killer, and amazingly well assembled... it's a small detail but they're the one manufacturer I have that even every nut on the panel is even aligned symmetricaly (you can see in my little video):


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## mscp (Aug 4, 2021)

I wholeheartedly agree with @charlieclouser. I don't have the Analogue Solutions one, so I can't really A/B compare them. Sorry.


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## Savepoint (Aug 4, 2021)

charlieclouser said:


> I haven't played Vostok, but I've owned a bunch of Analogue Solutions modules for Eurorack…


Thank you Charlie — this is beyond helpful. Makes perfect sense RE the reason for the doubled price of AS vs Erica, and the general recommendation of Erica is super useful in narrowing it down from my end. I’m mid-project on building a new workspace and I’m at about 35k left on my budget. 

And to your side note: I actually (sadly) sold my Hydrasynth, my Juno 106, and my SEM Pro (and like 20 other things) to buy a (not sadly!) Waldorf Quantum and a Prophet 6 with lots of money leftover, plus money previously set aside for everything else on the checklist.

I did absolutely love the Hydrasynth. I had it for a year and it was really hard to let go of — one of the most quick, fun, and intuitive workflows to accomplish super complex stuff. But ultimately I wanted a Quantum more for my purposes, and WOWZERS it has not disappointed me. I’m inside of it every day, doing everything I could ever want or dream of doing. On the wavetable/modmatrix front, it takes me a beat longer than the HS to get to where I need to go, but I really don’t mind the extra clicking and routing. Plus, I have all the other stuff there at my disposal, a lifetime of synth’ing in one beautiful synth. Legitimately the best purchase I’ve ever made. I miss the Hydrasynth a lot, but the Quantum just takes me there for everything I want in the digital realm, and takes me there gorgeously.

Per the Syntrx, lol all the talk about Erica Fuse VCO etc, makes me wonder if I oughta instead just kick 5k into a modular cabinet and just make my own thing. I’m pre-noob status on modular, but I have a few friends who could point me in the right direction. I kind of cringe these days at investing in anything that is a version-of-something-for-people-who-can’t-afford-the-real-thing, as I’d just rather save up for the real thing. 20k might be a lot for a synth, but it’s also a lower-ish cost for a car, both of which I feel are equally serious/worthy investments, so I’m happy to drop 20k on something that will be there with me for decades. But then again, Erica Synths isn’t Behringer… I’ll have to ponder a while RE: Syntrx vs going up to 5k-ish for a modular lunchbox situation. An existential question more than anything, lolol.

Beyond that I’m gunning for a Model D Reissue by next month. The current price of 7-9k kinda kicks me in the n*ts, but I know I’ll be happier in the long run than getting a midimini or an SE clone for half the price (as good as I know they are — I’ve played with a friend’s MM before but it’s just not the same… for me). I just want the real thing. Obviously feels weird to drop like 8k on something people get Behringer clones for at 300 bucks, but I’ve hit a point where I philosophically only want the “best” and most authentic tools regardless of price. Saving up for stuff aka the lost art 😂.

Thanks again Charlie!


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## Savepoint (Aug 4, 2021)

j_kranz said:


> Another vote for anything Erica Synths, but like Charlie mentioned, personally I think you get better bang for your buck with their eurorack modules. I can also attest, as a huge Erica fanboy, that their modules are absolutely killer, and amazingly well assembled... it's a small detail but they're the one manufacturer I have that even every nut on the panel is even aligned symmetricaly (you can see in my little video):



Oh boy. TFW you’re gonna really walk into the modular abyss. Thank you J.


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## doctoremmet (Aug 4, 2021)

Savepoint said:


> abyss


Someone say ABYSS?






The Dawesome Thread - ABYSS and NOVUM discussion. New synth KULT released December 22, 22!


So, Tracktion are running an extended 4th of July sale, and I happened to notice they released yet another new synth - after recently giving us their FM monster f.’em. It is called ABYSS and has been developed by a “new kid on the block”, Dawesome (Peter V.) This one’s interesting. A very nice...




vi-control.net


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## Savepoint (Aug 4, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Someone say ABYSS?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Omg haha — looks rad! Thank you Doctor. I do love me some arty-but-minimal-ish intuitive/expressionistic GUI (obv mainly if it sounds killer and unique). I’ll grab up the demo later today. 🕺🏻


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## doctoremmet (Aug 4, 2021)

Savepoint said:


> Omg haha — looks rad! Thank you Doctor. I do love me some arty-but-minimal-ish intuitive/expressionistic GUI (obv mainly if it sounds killer and unique). I’ll grab up the demo later today. 🕺🏻


Have you listened to Tatiana Gordeeva’s two latest tracks? Especially the most recent one, scored to a glass octopus video is really cool. Nifty little synth, great for organic sounding pads with a “church organ through a phaser” kinda vibe (which to be clear is a good thing where I come from) 






My Glass Octopus, has now reached 36000+ views on YT


Update (22.05.24): My Glass Octopus has now surpassed the 36000 views mark on YouTube!! Unbelievable!! :dancedance: Fresh catch of the day! (21.08.20): My Glass Octopus has finally made its way officially on the Schmidt Ocean Institute (@SchmidtOcean) multiple social media platforms with...




vi-control.net


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## Savepoint (Aug 4, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Have you listened to Tatiana Gordeeva’s two latest tracks? Especially the most recent one, scored to a glass octopus video is really cool. Nifty little synth, great for organic sounding pads with a “church organ through a phaser” kinda vibe (which to be clear is a good thing where I come from)
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just listened on headphones — it sounds awesome, and classy af. Was not familiar with Tatiana. Beautiful piece. Going to listen to more of her work. 

Always hard to tell how much I’ll love a synth until I go hands on myself even if I’ve heard it used in something I click with — that said I’ll definitely demo later. I suspect I have this covered on some other softs but the GUI looks super inspiring and fun, and that counts for a lot.


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## charlieclouser (Aug 4, 2021)

Savepoint said:


> Thank you Charlie — this is beyond helpful. Makes perfect sense RE the reason for the doubled price of AS vs Erica, and the general recommendation of Erica is super useful in narrowing it down from my end. I’m mid-project on building a new workspace and I’m at about 35k left on my budget.
> 
> And to your side note: I actually (sadly) sold my Hydrasynth, my Juno 106, and my SEM Pro (and like 20 other things) to buy a (not sadly!) Waldorf Quantum and a Prophet 6 with lots of money leftover, plus money previously set aside for everything else on the checklist.
> 
> ...


Ah, well, sold the Hydrasynth for a Quantum - now that's something I can understand. I don't have a Hydrasynth (yet) but I do have a Quantum and I reckon it's the ultimate flagship of all synths. I did not recommend it because it can be daunting and it is not cheap. But it is the best. Although the Hydrasynth is very quick and does a small subset of very modern, mildly gritty cinematic tones very well. And that poly-AT is... wow.

As to going EuroCRACK, well, asking me about that would be like asking an alcoholic if we should have just one more drink... But I have a legitimate excuse - I learned synths on an Arp 2500 in college before MIDI was invented, so at this point I've been turning the filter knob for 40 years (and hoping something different will happen THIS time).

The range, sonics, and versatility of today's Eurorack scene is astounding and awesome, although in general it can be a time (and money) suck, so there is a lot to be said for a closed-ended system. A good compromise is pre-configured modular systems, of which the MakeNoise Shared System is probably the best. Very little fat on those bones. Their Tape+Microsound system is also cool but more for dealing with sounds coming from outside the system. The Erica Fusion system is far less flexible and has some "meh" modules, and their Black system is well-integrated and complete but not thrilling. Their Techno System is amazing if you like pumping out bangers live, but it's built to a purpose, and that purpose is not scoring! So MakeNoise Shared System it is then.

There are also hybrid semi-modular systems and synths that can give you expandability and connectivity of EuroCrack without totally going down the wormhole on day one:

• Moog Mother32 + DFAM + Subharmonicon = A three-synth rig that has that Moog sound, mounts in Eurorack cases if desired, and talks to other Eurorack stuff. Very popular and very innovative, but still it's three various takes on the plain jane east-coast Osc > Filter architecture. Some limitations, like only 8-step sequencers, etc. but most of those limitations can be overcome by sticking them in a Eurorack sled like the Behringer Eurorack-Go case and adding some Euro goodies alongside.

• Moog Matriarch = Another super-popular semi-modular Moog synth that also sounds great and is not as limiting as it appears at first. And you've got a nice keyboard with MIDI and CV connectivity, so it can talk to other Moog stuff and the Euro scene so if you decide to expand....

• Behringer's own synths and Euro modules = These things are cheaper than a sandwich, but the build quality reflects this. Although the sonics are good, they don't really offer anything very modern except for their recently announced Mutable rip-off module, Brains. The rest of their line is 1979-vintage features, albeit with that new-car smell but notorious Behringer build quality. Even though I learned on an Arp 2500 I have zero desire to get the Behringer Arp tribute modules. They're boring. But cheap enough to experiment with and then drag them behind your car or give them to your neice.

• MakeNoise Strega, O-Coast, O-Control = These are great but a bit inscrutable. Self-contained worlds of sound, yes; cheap-ish, yes - but the front panels are labelled with hieroglyphics that will leave you scratching your head if you set them aside for a month and then come back to them. Although they don't mount in Eurorack enclosures (ARRGGHHH!) they will interface perfectly with Euro gear. Worth a look for sure.

• Buchla Easel and Easel Command = Oof. Not a huge fan. I've only ever heard a few people make actual music with them, as opposed to bug farts and arhythmic marbles-in-a-pan sounds - like Allessandro Cortini and a French guy named Lyonel Bauchet. But they're into Buchla for big bucks, so.... At one point a few NAMM shows ago I was in the Buchla booth playing with a system, and it was the first time in a long time when I was standing in front of a synth and going, "None of this makes sense, what the FUCK is going on?!??". So Ezra Buchla saw me in distress and came over to help. He patched, tweaked, and fiddled, then HE got confused - and then we realized that the speakers were connected to a different system off to the side that was bubbling away on auto-pilot. We did get going after that, but it was a lesson on how inscrutable Buchla stuff can be unless it's your only religion and you do it on the daily. Here's the most useful noises I've heard from Buchla in a while (the beginning, Jam #1 only):



But just get a Sensel Morph with the Thunder overlay and the Arturia simulation of the Easel and try that out first. Might get you what they're doing in that video, and a lot cheaper. And polyphonic. And all the convenience of a plugin.

If you do go Euro, be prepared to never be finished. Set up your Reverb.com account now because you'll be selling a lot of modules as time goes by. I have found some absolute gems that make sounds that just don't or can't exist outside of that world, but there can be a tendency, even with a ton of modules, to just patch them in the normal order and get 100 variations on Osc > Filter sounds. The MakeNoise shared system and other outsider stuff discourages this, or at least encourages unconventional routing / thinking / sounds. That said, I often AM looking for more sonic variation within an "ordinary" signal path, instead of some Dr. Who noises, so that's why I have so many different oscillators and filters. And the distortions.... oh my. So many good ones. But Euro is, in essence, monophonic so it ain't gonna take you places that the Quantum will. And even though there's a ton of "granular" modules in Euro they're basically PaulStretch or a $49 plugin in a box - and again, they can't touch what the Quantum can do. For me, Euro is all about weird oscillators, unique filters, step sequencers, CV gesture recorders, and lots of flavors of distortion. But mostly CV recorders.

I did recently get some modules from Error Instruments in Amsterdam, and some from Bizarre Jezabel in Russia, and they are absolutely mental. Not versatile, but unique and weird and pretty cheap. Delays based on chips from a karaoke machine, poorly-designed tube overdrives, stuff like that.

I'll save you a spot at the bottom of the rabbit hole.


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## Savepoint (Aug 4, 2021)

charlieclouser said:


> Ah, well, sold the Hydrasynth for a Quantum - now that's something I can understand. I don't have a Hydrasynth (yet) but I do have a Quantum and I reckon it's the ultimate flagship of all synths. I did not recommend it because it can be daunting and it is not cheap. But it is the best. Although the Hydrasynth is very quick and does a small subset of very modern, mildly gritty cinematic tones very well. And that poly-AT is... wow.
> 
> As to going EuroCRACK, well, asking me about that would be like asking an alcoholic if we should have just one more drink... But I have a legitimate excuse - I learned synths on an Arp 2500 in college before MIDI was invented, so at this point I've been turning the filter knob for 40 years (and hoping something different will happen THIS time).
> 
> ...



Currently on Trip Advisor for a one-way ticket to Rabbit Hole.

And yeah, this is all for film score and sound design.

The Make Noise Shared System does feel like a solid entry-point for me. I’ve vaguely looked into it before, the Black & Gold. A few of my friends have said to me I’d love Maths. I can see getting the MNSS and then swapping out something for another Osc and thus tripping further down the Rabbit Hole. The ES Fusion VCO 2 does indeed beckon for my face to be melted off by it. 

Among the synths I sold was a Subharmonicon, Behringer Neutron, B Pro 1, Behringer M20 clone, etc… had them on a rack and they were all cool for a time. Ultimately it all felt like having too many little synths competing for attention and ultimately inspired very little. The Subharmonicon was fun and interesting to patch out of. I’m just in a place where I need to be fully intimidated by what’s in front of me. 

I was actually very interested in the *Matriarch* for a while as a way to talk myself out of dropping 8k on a Model D Reissue (still haven’t done just yet). Clearly there’s infinitely more versatility at play with a Matriarch, but I worry I’d be missing those singularly raw sun-ripping harmonics of the Mini to nail those world-ending cues and doom inducing soundscapes. Can the Matriarch get close to that? If so, hell, it would be a cool way to integrate with a base modular system like MNSS and go from there.

I mean, I may just be thinking too yesteryear on the Model D, and for all I know I could achieve “that” thing with Matriarch + modular system. 

Also, hilarious RE: Buchla and your experience with Ezra B. I’ve heard from pals that the Eisel Command is a no-go.


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## Savepoint (Aug 4, 2021)

charlieclouser said:


> I do have a Quantum


A quickie Quantum yes/no question you probably/definitely know the answer to that Google leads me nowhere on (well, not nowhere, just bad/possibly outdated explanations): Maybe I’m doing it wrong, but can I *actually* use my SD card as a direct ext HD for adding samples to a patch, or am I limited to importing them to the 2gb-ish on-board storage? If so that’s fine, I’ll just be more organized/economical.

I’ve tried, but it’s just always giving me the option to import from both SD and USB flash.

Since it works with my MPC — I use all my samples directly from my SD card hooked in — I would assume it would work with the Quantum, unless there’s further tech at play here that makes it impossible. 

Thanks a ton, Charlie!


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## charlieclouser (Aug 4, 2021)

Savepoint said:


> A quickie Quantum yes/no question you probably/definitely know the answer to that Google leads me nowhere on (well, not nowhere, just bad/possibly outdated explanations): Maybe I’m doing it wrong, but can I *actually* use my SD card as a direct ext HD for adding samples to a patch, or am I limited to importing them to the 2gb-ish on-board storage? If so that’s fine, I’ll just be more organized/economical.


I think the SD card situation may have changed at Quantum OS v2.0, or else it didn't but almost made it in. I know that Rolf is aware of our desire to do that, but I can't remember if it made it into v2.0 or whether we have to wait. I'm still on an older Quantum OS so I can't say. Slow on the uptake, I know...

On the other stuff it sounds like you know what's up. The Behringer clones are great value for money but as you know, they're just 1979 all over again. There's no need to have a half-dozen simple synths unless you're doing an Ultravox cover band. Might be worth getting a Behringer D just to see. People say it nails the sound even if the knobs do wiggle.

The Matriarch vs Model D is a tough call. I've only played a Matriarch for a minute, purely out of curiosity, and it was nice but.... I do have a Model D reissue and it is perfect. I've owned four original Model D's over the years, and each was a little bit broken in a different way. I don't think I ever paid more than $600 for one, and I think I sold each for exactly what I paid. The last one left the building in the early 2000's. I was just sick of dealing with them, and when Kevin Lightner died (he was THE Moog repair guy in LA) I was out.

The reissue D wasn't something I "needed" but I felt a karmic debt to Moog in general re: using Theremins on stage with NIN, getting a custom black Voyager (low serial number, and signed) long before they came in black, having Bob over to my house to film part of the Moog documentary, etc. So when the D reissue was announced I paid full pop. $3,600 I think it was. And there's a reason it's a classic. It's not just the three-oscillator girth (which is no joke), it's the range of the controls. Every knob is in the sweet spot 90% of the time. If you look in the audio dictionary next to the word "synthesizer" they'd have a picture of a Model D. And the build quality... oh my. It's actually weird to play a D that doesn't have yellowed, uneven keys and scratchy knobs. The reissue is built to last a lifetime. My only gripe is the external power brick. I need to pick up a few spares just in case.

On the 8th (or 9th?) SAW movie I needed a bog-simple synth sound for the very first thing you hear, when the production company logos are flying across the screen. I needed just a slow filter sweep on a low D. So I broke out a few dozen soft synths, and the winner was Serum. Since I hadn't yet begun to panic over the looming deadline, I decided to have a big ol' synth shootout, figuring if a hardware synth can't do better than Serum it's getting loaded on the trebuchet. I tried the following: TTSH 2600 clone, Nord Lead 1, Super Jupiter, Prophet VS, Xpander, MS-20 reissue kit, Quantum, Pro2.... and the reissue Model D. (The Euro rig was in the closet because we were fighting.)

I'll give you three guesses who won, and two of them don't count. None of them had the girth even of Serum, let alone the D. The Arp clone's envelopes wouldn't go long enough (needed to be about 8sec rise and 6 sec fall) and trying to do a filter sweep on those sliders is impossible compared to a knob, the MS-20 sounded pinched, etc. etc. etc. Only the Quantum came close because it had three oscillators. But really it was no competition. The D killed it for that sound, and it only took about 30 seconds to dial it in.

What wound up in the movie is the D, four mono passes spread out into quad, with Serum in stereo in the front L+R about 6db down. Now, granted, it was a bog-simple sound that just needed to "sound good" and it wasn't doing anything fancy. But with the D, even a basic sound can still sound good.

And that's why it's a classic.


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## Savepoint (Aug 4, 2021)

charlieclouser said:


> I think the SD card situation may have changed at Quantum OS v2.0, or else it didn't but almost made it in. I know that Rolf is aware of our desire to do that, but I can't remember if it made it into v2.0 or whether we have to wait. I'm still on an older Quantum OS so I can't say. Slow on the uptake, I know...
> 
> On the other stuff it sounds like you know what's up. The Behringer clones are great value for money but as you know, they're just 1979 all over again. There's no need to have a half-dozen simple synths unless you're doing an Ultravox cover band. Might be worth getting a Behringer D just to see. People say it nails the sound even if the knobs do wiggle.
> 
> ...


It is actually crazy how much power Serum packs. Steve Duda really snapped with it’s perfection… Its popularity and legacy speaks for itself, and I’m not at all surprised to read your above anecdote. It makes total sense RE: the results of your shootout. I recently tried Vital, and it’s definitely great (huge props to the guy who made it, being a one man team, he’s obviously a genius on a path to great things) but Serum just has an undeniable sonic wallop to it that’s hard to compare among softs. Serum along with Omni are both true staples of VSTland at this point, tried and tested unf*ckwithable virtual monsters. Similar to your astutely summarized “if you look up synthesizer in a dictionary”… the same is probably true for Serum if you look up softsynth in a dictionary… Pretty f’ing cool that you ended up blending two dictionary-bound synths together in a single opening cue.

As per the Model D vs Matriarch… I had a feeling. What you’re saying will echo in my wallet’s memory for some time to come as well 😂. Well worth it though. I was too considering a Moog Voyager XL, but another friend insisted there’s no substitute for Model D with a Voyager.

So… The Reissue it is, and once it’s home I’ll salute you, Maestro Clouser, with an inaugural filter sweep.

Thanks again Charlie for your *extremely* generous tips and insight. You’re a champ, and a real live legend. 💥💥💥💥


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## EvilDragon (Aug 4, 2021)

charlieclouser said:


> albeit with that new-car smell but notorious Behringer build quality



Ha don't know about all the rest of their Euro stuff, but I do have Neutron which is Eurorackable and it has very good build quality. Also got their MonoPoly and that thing is really solidly well built, too. Would gig with it.


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## Living Fossil (Aug 5, 2021)

EvilDragon said:


> Ha don't know about all the rest of their Euro stuff, but I do have Neutron which is Eurorackable and it has very good build quality. Also got their MonoPoly and that thing is really solidly well built, too. Would gig with it.


I'm really interested in their upcoming 2600 reissue. The demos sound extremely promising.


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## EvilDragon (Aug 6, 2021)

I have Behringer's 2600. It sounds spectacular!


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## Living Fossil (Aug 6, 2021)

EvilDragon said:


> I have Behringer's 2600. It sounds spectacular!


So it's released yet? I recently checked some dealers and they all had the "available in 5-7 weeks" notion.
But nice to hear that you like it.


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## EvilDragon (Aug 6, 2021)

2600 was released a year or so ago IIRC, it's in such high demand Behringer cannot supply enough of them!


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## Living Fossil (Aug 6, 2021)

EvilDragon said:


> 2600 was released a year or so ago IIRC, it's in such high demand Behringer cannot supply enough of them!


thanks for clarifying. I'm living behind a rock since the pandemic started.


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