# Account Takeover! Seriously?



## Geomir (Jul 17, 2020)

Didn't really know where to post it. Maybe it's not a newbie question, maybe it is. Anyway, I see some times people selling full accounts, using the term "account takeover". All the following examples are copied-pasted from this Forum:

"FS: Sonible - Account Takeover"
"FS: Garritan CFX Lite concert grand (account takeover)"
"Unfortunately VI Labs doesn’t allow individual license transfers, it has to be an account takeover"
"Just to be clear, transfers are not allowed hence why an account takeover is the only option"
"You can always do an account takeover though"
"FS: IK Multimedia account takeover"
So I was wondering:

1) Is it legal and perfectly fine to do it?
2) Is it legal but unethical to do it?
3) Is it illegal for some companies and legal for some other companies?
4) Is it illegal for all the companies?


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## el-bo (Jul 17, 2020)

I'm sure that most companies would prefer an entire account to be sold at the same time, to the same user, as it would be a lot less hassle. And there are definitely companies who will charge only once for that transaction, regardless of the amount of separate titles (FXPansion, as just one example). However, that's a different situation to that which seems to be becoming more and more common in member sales announcements (On KVR, for example). In these cases, people are just trying to avoid the fee payment. 

Unless specifically allowed by a company, it is dodgy AF!

Some will claim that it is against the law (At least. in Europe), to forbid license transfers, though I'm not sure what this law states about paid transfer. Either way, the seller has no interest in anything other than trying to maximise their own profit.


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## KarlHeinz (Jul 17, 2020)

I think it is really "case-by-case" which from 1-4 applies.

I myself ran into trouble with Melda while I naively did that and Melda after approving just denies to takeover the instrument into my regular account. I think that was cause they really have extremly high transfer fees which is ridiculous if for example you bought it in a sale and want to resale.

In some other cases it was not problem, but there are lots of possible pitfalls. For example with some accounts you cant change email adress of account, or name or whatever.

Learnt from that to directly ask the develloper if its possible and o.k. for him in any case.


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## Geomir (Jul 17, 2020)

So do you need to ask every time the company if they approve? I mean, I have noticed (just an example) that Native Instruments allow you to change your First name / Last name / email / password / billing address of your account. So literally they allow you to be "someone else"!

I mean, if you do it and gift (or sell) your account to your brother (just another simple example) will they care to know about it? Do they need to approve something that they allow you to do it anyway?


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## KarlHeinz (Jul 17, 2020)

It is just my experience that it seems so complex and differentely handled from each develloper (for example as far as I know in the AGB from W......., as an example, resale is forbidden and that includes of course account takeover but found more then one sale "account takeover approved by W.....").

And how often do you make account takeovers ? As Native Instruments has no transfer fee and transfer is very easy for that example account takeover would make no real sense (or to say it in another way: during the transfer they will transfer your new products directly into your Native Access account  ).

I can only say I dont wanted to do anybody any harm with the account takeover and then when they denied I kind of feel like I have tried to pirate that software or whatever, that just makes me cautious.


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## EgM (Jul 17, 2020)

It all comes down to the EULA agreed upon. While an account takeover would grant another user access to the software, legally the license would be void if the EULA only covers the original owner.


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## Reid Rosefelt (Jul 17, 2020)

I don't know the facts, but I've always assumed it was generally dodgy: somebody trying to get around the spirit of a company's rules on license transfer, or trying to not pay their fees. 

Perhaps there's nothing wrong with license transfer, but I've never considered taking anybody up on that deal.


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## KarlHeinz (Jul 17, 2020)

If it is that clear then I wonder why devellopers in some cases agree to account takeover ? I agree in general and think I wont do this again after my Melda experience but I really dont think its "criminal" in general. If the develloper agrees, where is the problem ? If not and someone does it nevertheless I agree, that stand for some kind of illegal, at least un-ethic intention.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Jul 17, 2020)

KarlHeinz said:


> If it is that clear then I wonder why devellopers in some cases agree to account takeover ?



Which developers?


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## KarlHeinz (Jul 17, 2020)

For example I have seen some Waveform sales where it was stated "account takeover approved by waveform". I think these are no general but "in case" decisions, thats what I meant.


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## Polkasound (Jul 17, 2020)

Developers can certainly choose to approve and assist account takeovers. Even developers who don't allow license transfers may make exceptions now and then, for example, in the event one of their customers dies and wills their DAW to a friend or family member.


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## ShidoStrife (Jul 18, 2020)

Developers that agree to account transfer are those who would allow license transfer for free but don't have/can't be bothered to create the license transfer system.

Developers who don't allow license transfer or allow it with fees won't agree to account transfer.


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