# What sections of the orchestra do you find yourself using the least (for film / TV music) ?



## Ray (Dec 24, 2019)

Asking in order to know what's best to leave out for later because of budget issues. Merry Christmas!

LE: I'm only missing brass and choir, so I think I made the right choice. I purchased strings, woodwinds, percussion, harp and piano.


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## dcoscina (Dec 24, 2019)

So many sample based composers neglect woodwinds. As Conrad Pope once said, strings and brass largely balance themselves . Woodwinds do not.


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## chillbot (Dec 24, 2019)

Woodwinds are for nerds.


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## Land of Missing Parts (Dec 24, 2019)

dcoscina said:


> So many sample based composers neglect woodwinds. As Conrad Pope once said, strings and brass largely balance themselves . Woodwinds do not.


I like the sentiment, but I'm not exactly sure how he meant it. Is he saying that strings and brass are more uniform color-wise? Or maybe he's saying that if you distribute strings/brass evenly throughout their range with equal dynamics on a staff, they will be more balanced volume-wise?


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## nolotrippen (Dec 24, 2019)

Ray said:


> Asking in order to know what's best to leave out for later because of budget issues. Merry Christmas!


I think the kazoo is overused, as well as the slide whistle. Seriously, all of the sections of an orchestra are there for time-proven reasons. In the 60s and 70s (pre-synth and sampler), most action TV shows relied on brass and woodwinds for the most part as you could get the most color bang-for-the buck. Strings were brought in for the occasional romantic scene.


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## dcoscina (Dec 24, 2019)

Land of Missing Parts said:


> I like the sentiment, but I'm not exactly sure how he meant it. Is he saying that strings and brass are more uniform color-wise? Or maybe he's saying that if you distribute strings/brass evenly throughout their range with equal dynamics on a staff, they will be more balanced volume-wise?


He was saying from the standpoint of samples mock ups that there isn’t as much of a difference when orchestrating for strings. Or for brass because they balance themselves out in a real life situation. Winds don’t and need to be carefully arranged for live group.


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## KEM (Dec 25, 2019)

Woodwinds, same as most of us young composers.


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## Zero&One (Dec 25, 2019)

Woodwinds, so I add them even more now to learn them. Since doing this every track is 100% better.
I'm now a woodwind nerd noob. So I'd say leave none out, not helping you I know... but it'll help you long term though.


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## Jimmy Hellfire (Dec 25, 2019)

I sometimes omit brass, because my style sometimes doesn't need that kind of power.

Woodwinds are always there. 

But, to speak to the topic more constructively: it's not feasible to not own all traditional sections of an orchestra. Save money elsewhere.


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## Ray (Dec 26, 2019)

Jimmy Hellfire said:


> I sometimes omit brass, because my style sometimes doesn't need that kind of power.


I did just that  Although I should be able to buy the brass in 2 months or so. Thanks!


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## JohnG (Dec 26, 2019)

I write mostly for media (tv, games, movies). Woodwinds typically "poke out" under dialogue. If you are mixing for media and you have a woodwind solo, be sure to listen to your mix very carefully at a very low volume, especially if it's a scene that has dialogue or voice-over. Even a flute can sometimes tread too heavily over speech, but it's especially true of the double reeds: cor Anglais (English Horn), bassoon and oboe.

And never use shawms.


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## I like music (Dec 26, 2019)

Would you mind us asking what the budget is? I would say that it is far more important to have all the sections (even if of slightly lesser quality) than to have higher quality samples, but missing a whole section!


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## Rob Elliott (Dec 26, 2019)

JohnG said:


> I write mostly for media (tv, games, movies). Woodwinds typically "poke out" under dialogue. If you are mixing for media and you have a woodwind solo, be sure to listen to your mix very carefully at a very low volume, especially if it's a scene that has dialogue or voice-over. Even a flute can sometimes tread too heavily over speech, but it's especially true of the double reeds: cor Anglais (English Horn), bassoon and oboe.
> 
> And never use shawms.



I agree with this. Also for me the clarinet is the orchestra's 'human voice' so judicious use under heavy dialog is recommended.


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## Ray (Dec 26, 2019)

I like music said:


> Would you mind us asking what the budget is? I would say that it is far more important to have all the sections (even if of slightly lesser quality) than to have higher quality samples, but missing a whole section!


1200 euro max.


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## Ray (Dec 26, 2019)

JohnG said:


> I write mostly for media (tv, games, movies). Woodwinds typically "poke out" under dialogue. If you are mixing for media and you have a woodwind solo, be sure to listen to your mix very carefully at a very low volume, especially if it's a scene that has dialogue or voice-over. Even a flute can sometimes tread too heavily over speech, but it's especially true of the double reeds: cor Anglais (English Horn), bassoon and oboe.
> 
> And never use shawms.


Good advice! Thanks!


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## JJP (Dec 26, 2019)

JohnG said:


> And never use shawms.



Laughed out loud at this! Thanks, @JohnG


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## I like music (Dec 26, 2019)

Ray said:


> 1200 euro max.



With that budget, I feel you should be able to get all the sections, and without compromising a great deal on quality. I'm sure others will chime in.


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## chillbot (Dec 26, 2019)

JohnG said:


> And never use shawms.





JJP said:


> Laughed out loud at this! Thanks, @JohnG





chillbot said:


> Woodwinds are for nerds.


I am resting my case, thanks.


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