# Replacing CC controller data in Cubase as a performance



## kabinboy (Oct 5, 2015)

Hi,

Has anyone found an elegant way to "replay" and therefore replace mod and volume data without getting the "jagged" comb-like effect that happens when you overwrite cc data as a performance?

Sure, I can use the pencil tool like anyone, but I'm just wondering if others have a found a way to do it as a performance without creating a jumpy mess.

What happens to me is that the cc data only writes (replaces) when the mod or volume faders are sending — that is when they're actually moving. So you get a very jumpy line since it only replaces your previous pass in the little instances where your finger is moving.

Currently I solve this problem by keeping my finger moving ever so slightly throughout the mod / volume wheel performance. 

Thanks for your tips!


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## FriFlo (Oct 6, 2015)

No, I have no other way of doing it, than you already mentioned (pencil tool). I respond, though, as I find this to be one of those neglected topics that DAWs don't really improve upon since the 90ies! There is automation and there is old school midi CC. Sample libraries get usually controlled via old school midi CC, but there are so many limitations to that:
- having to know all CC numbers for every f#**ing library when editing in the key editor
- problems with "overdubbing CCs", as you mentioned 
- no feedback for controllers like motor faders, rotary encoders and led labels 
With today's technology you could so easily build very effective controllers, that giv you hand on access to every available control of an instrument, including keys witches with labels (so that you actually see on your controller, which articulation you choose instead of hitting keys until you find what you looking for ...). You can even do this with tablet apps (like Lemur) for just a few bugs, but still have an enormous depth of user customization. But as long as DAW developers won't think this through till the end, the best you can get is something like 8 (only?) quick controls in cubase, controlled by a motor fader box. You will get the labels this way, you will get feedback on your controllers, but you loose all the advantages of controlling notes and CC data in the key editor with all the dedicated editing tools ... It's about time for somebody to do this properly!


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## FriFlo (Oct 6, 2015)

What I would really like to see, is someone like steinberg doing something interesting and deep based upon their expression maps and the dusted device control panels! Something deep, like an improved "logic environment" (or rather max Msp), but customizable for every instrument and midi track. The idea is, each track has the ability to receive and send midi data (maybe OSC also ...) and each track can be programmed to be aware of what instrument it is controlling! The result is, you actually open the key editor and see something meaning full:
- articulations, if you like key switching, all labeled
- instead of 128 CCs, all the available parameters of an instrument all labeled
- midi feedback to an external controller, like a touchscreen or a dedicated hardware controller
- automation-like takeover of already recorded parameter data (touch-enabled motor faders)
...
It wouldn't be that hard to develop something like that! But it actually requires the user to dig deep, learn stuff and kind of program in a very basic way. But the reward would be a working environment, where you don't have to think around several corners and could actually make music! You could just play stuff in without looking at the PC monitor, but later, if you decide to edit the data, you would find the same parameters in your editor, as they were on your external controller.
To me, this would be the most significant thing to be done, but it seems, most people wouldn't even understand what it is for. Instead, they prefer to add new features, that most people understand by a simple headline, like "20 incredible new synth plugins - true analog emulation!!" ...
The same with sample library developers: everybody is baking his own cake, neglecting what workflow actually will work in those DAWs out there.
Well, I don't give up on this topic and keep mentioning, what we are all missing, although it wouldn't be that hard to do ...


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## Gerhard Westphalen (Oct 6, 2015)

I just use commands on my touchscreen to delete the various CC's. I just set up the presets in the midi logical editor. I believe you can also select only a region in a midi clip to delete. The only other way I see is to use a touch sensitive controller and have the CC's as automation but IMO that really doesn't work well and limits your editing capabilities.


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## IoannisGutevas (Oct 6, 2015)

Yeah you can setup some presets on logical editor and have them delete a portion or all midi cc's of a midi clip. But it amazes me how much innovation is going on this DAW and they cant still find a good way deal with midi cc and automation. In every other DAW its so easy and so well done, especially on ableton (damn i wish i had spend my years learning ableton instead of cubase).

We are in 2015, most things are done through either automation or midi cc's and if i want to edit either on cubase i need a digitizer tablet to play with the pen tool or zoom in the automation track and waste time on resizing tracks ruining my composing flow.. 

Lets hope once more that in the upcoming update the someone who works for this company will realize that midi cc's and automation are on medieval times on this DAW. 

Its a pity really, cause if they fix the midi cc's / automation interaction and editing it would be hands down the best DAW you can work on.


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## kabinboy (Oct 6, 2015)

Great comments, thank you all! I like the idea of buttons to quickly delete cc's from a clip. 

It also occurs to me to write a Pure Data patch dedicated to a particular fader, that once moved would continue sending volume (or mod) data -- even when flat -- until the overdub is complete. Of course if I can do this, so can Steinberg


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## snapeye (Dec 12, 2016)

Old thread, not sure if you got this, but in Cubase go to *File *> *Preferences *> *Record *> *MIDI *and set *Replace Recording in Editors* to *Controller*. Then set your MIDI Record to Replace and you can re-record just the controller lane CC, without getting the comb tooth pattern.


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## TomaeusD (Apr 18, 2020)

snapeye said:


> Old thread, not sure if you got this, but in Cubase go to *File *> *Preferences *> *Record *> *MIDI *and set *Replace Recording in Editors* to *Controller*. Then set your MIDI Record to Replace and you can re-record just the controller lane CC, without getting the comb tooth pattern.


Unfortunately this changes nothing for me.


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## resonate (Apr 19, 2020)

TomaeusD said:


> Unfortunately this changes nothing for me.


It works , as long as you're recording with midi piano roll window open.


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## TomaeusD (Apr 19, 2020)

resonate said:


> It works , as long as you're recording with midi piano roll window open.


I saw someone else say that on another forum and tried it yesterday to no avail. I should have tried restarting Cubase because after seeing your comment I tried one more time and it works. 😅 Now if only we could do multiple tracks at a time.


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## Hywel (Apr 19, 2020)

TomaeusD said:


> I saw someone else say that on another forum and tried it yesterday to no avail. I should have tried restarting Cubase because after seeing your comment I tried one more time and it works. 😅 Now if only we could do multiple tracks at a time.


Have you pressed the button at the top L side of the Editor window to allow recording within the Editor? You will have to set the preference to just record controller data as well as suggested above.


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## TomaeusD (Apr 19, 2020)

Hywel said:


> Have you pressed the button at the top L side of the Editor window to allow recording within the Editor? You will have to set the preference to just record controller data as well as suggested above.



It's working now for at least one track at a time. I didn't do anything different, I think it just required a restart. Before it would either replace midi notes or the midi cc was still merging and not replacing exclusively.

And here's the weird thing, now that I am actively paying attention to the record button in the key editor as you mentioned (I never tried clicking it to get it working this morning before you posted), now the exclusive midi cc replace won't work unless it's enabled there, too. These are all good things to know, and I'm glad Steinberg at least has this option.


EDIT: By the way, thank you both @resonate and @Hywel for responding so promptly to this old thread that I unwittingly necro'd.


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## igbk (Aug 24, 2020)

Using 'replace' mode doesn't seem like a solution to me, because that will replace all the midi notes you have previously recorded. It's a pretty niche' scenario to have a bunch of cc data with no midi notes, most of the time people want to rerecord the midi cc while leaving the midi notes intact.


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