# Comparing meetings at GSA



## booboo (Mar 11, 2010)

I recently had a bizarre experience in my meeting with Cheryl and Maria - meeting lasted a long time and seemed to go well. 

However, when I called the following week to see if I can lock down representation from them, I got the blow off.

It's probably a blessing in disguise, since most guys just get lost in the roster there, but I was wondering if anyone else had any good GSA meeting stories...


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## Brian Ralston (Mar 12, 2010)

Are the films you are scoring studio level films making millions at the box office? 

Those are the only folks they are really interested in. Seriously. 

Does this really surprise you?

Most of the film composer agents are clearing their rosters to focus on only the big money makers any more. Why work 20 times as hard to get a smaller guy work on a small indie package deal when they can just answer the phone and get Giacchino any film he wants and pay for their entire year expenses with one deal at that level? There are only so many hours in the day and to take any time away from the clients that are actually bringing in significant money...they feel is a disservice to their established cliental. 

The best representation comes when they come after you in all honesty. It is one thing to keep yourself in their spotlight and stay in touch letting them know how you are doing. But it is a whole other thing to get them to represent you. That takes multi-million dollar studio films or primetime network TV shows to get their attention. When you get their attention being hired on a film like that...they will notice and happily take their percentage at that time. 

Agents don't establish careers. They just take 10-13% of already established ones.


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## bigdog (Mar 12, 2010)

Go get a good film/tv project and you can have any agent you want.


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## booboo (Mar 12, 2010)

Brian Ralston @ Fri Mar 12 said:


> Are the films you are scoring studio level films making millions at the box office?


Kinda sorta, but not really.


Brian Ralston @ Fri Mar 12 said:


> Those are the only folks they are really interested in. Seriously.
> Does this really surprise you?


Of course, not. But then why would they take the meeting in the first place??



Brian Ralston @ Fri Mar 12 said:


> Most of the film composer agents are clearing their rosters to focus on only the big money makers any more. Why work 20 times as hard to get a smaller guy work on a small indie package deal when they can just answer the phone and get Giacchino any film he wants and pay for their entire year expenses with one deal at that level? There are only so many hours in the day and to take any time away from the clients that are actually bringing in significant money...they feel is a disservice to their established cliental.


If I may, I actually disagree with this statement completely. Have you seen Jacobellis' Roster? Gaeta? Gerston? LOL - MACHADO?? These guys and more are taking on a TON of "little guys"...
GSA even has AN INSANE amount of clients that aren't even working or doing anything.

Look, Casinos rely on the 'whales' to come in and drop 6 figures in a visit, but the casino still puts slot machines at the door. Why? Every dollar counts. Every dollar. 
The 'whales' and Giaccino's get treated better, but that's to be expected...


Brian Ralston @ Fri Mar 12 said:


> Agents don't establish careers. They just take 10-13% of already established ones.


This is common knowledge, but not the point of my OP.


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## Brian Ralston (Mar 12, 2010)

booboo @ Fri Mar 12 said:


> Brian Ralston @ Fri Mar 12 said:
> 
> 
> > Those are the only folks they are really interested in. Seriously.
> ...



Hedging their bets. One day you may be making a lot and they would love to have a percentage of it...so they don't want to piss you off. I have met at GSA too, with Maria as a matter of fact. Directors I had worked with on their own called her and recommend to her that they should have me on their roster. I even had a producer I worked with who is a close friend of Maria Machado call her and recommend me. Maria was incredibly nice. The meeting went very well. I was presented to her by third parties she knew and respected. She was straight with me the first minute I walked in. Told me in her own words what I just shared with you before even knowing about my music and what all of my credits were at the time, other than the ones from the people that called her. We still keep in touch on occasion. But like I said...



booboo @ Fri Mar 12 said:


> If I may, I actually disagree with this statement completely. Have you seen Jacobellis' Roster? Gaeta? Gerston? LOL - MACHADO?? These guys and more are taking on a TON of "little guys"...
> GSA even has AN INSANE amount of clients that aren't even working or doing anything.


 Which is the reason they don't want to add to that list. There are a lot of guys who use to get work...and now don't. And some are let go. I was also at ICM for a while (before Brice) back when I had music on TV. After that gig ended, despite indie films becoming my focus instead of TV...they decided to end it. Needed to clear and focus on the ones with larger percentages coming in. Was told directly. That was fine with me at the time...because all the work I was getting, I was getting on my own connections. not from them. And my lawyer was doing the deal...not the agent. So giving up 10% to someone not doing anything for me was pointless at that point.



booboo @ Fri Mar 12 said:


> Look, Casinos rely on the 'whales' to come in and drop 6 figures in a visit, but the casino still puts slot machines at the door. Why? Every dollar counts. Every dollar.
> The 'whales' and Giaccino's get treated better, but that's to be expected...



I would submit to you that the analogy does not work because this is all about the business of relationships. Not hundreds of unmanned slot machines on the floor. But people (or one person) who spends precious time on the phone. Agents (especially one like Maria Machado) really care about their clients to the point where they get emotionally involved and feel bad when their clients aren't getting work. There are not enough minutes in the day to keep signing clients who are not generating steady streams of income on their own. Sure GSA has clients that have been signed due to politics. I am sure if one of the Newmans calls and asks, "will you sign this person for me," they will. But other than that type of a situation...your career has to be one that makes financial sense to them. And if they do have clients already on their roster who are not getting work...why would they add more to that who probably are not going to get work? It will just take precious minutes away from the ones they already have agreements with. You will know when they want you. It will be obvious and you won't go a week and get the blow off. Until then, I would focus on continuing to build your filmmaker relationships because that is where you are going to get the gigs anyway. And, let your lawyer focus on getting you the best contractual deals. 




booboo @ Fri Mar 12 said:


> Brian Ralston @ Fri Mar 12 said:
> 
> 
> > Agents don't establish careers. They just take 10-13% of already established ones.
> ...



Respectfully, if it is common knowledge, then you should already have known the answer to the question implied by your original post.


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## midphase (Mar 12, 2010)

BooBoo,

I'm just curious about what movie you worked on that got you the meeting with GSA? I'm just wondering if I should be trying to get a meeting as well (even though like you, I'll get the blow off afterwards...but what the hell right?)


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## booboo (Mar 12, 2010)

Brian Ralston @ Fri Mar 12 said:


> I have met at GSA too, with Maria as a matter of fact. Directors I had worked with on their own called her and recommend to her that they should have me on their roster. I even had a producer I worked with who is a close friend of Maria Machado call her and recommend me. Maria was incredibly nice. The meeting went very well. I was presented to her by third parties she knew and respected. She was straight with me the first minute I walked in. Told me in her own words what I just shared with you before even knowing about my music and what all of my credits were at the time, other than the ones from the people that called her. We still keep in touch on occasion. But like I said...



This is what I was looking for in my OP. A story or fun anecdote to share! Very cool, thanks!
As a side note - it's interesting that you like Maria - I can't stand her, which is why my meeting was with Cheryl. 

Any one else walk past the art gallery?


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## kid-surf (Mar 13, 2010)

Gaeta...

I met with him two years ago. We talked about how bleak it was out there. I had an epiphany in his office to write my first screenplay [only epiphany in my life]. Two years later I'm represented by the biggest agency on the planet. Now I'm meeting with people like DreamWorks, Warner Bros, Paramount, HBO, CBS, etc...

I really owe the guy a bottle of only the best wine...I may not have ever thought to try screenwriting had it not been for that meeting. And yet, he has no idea what that meeting meant to me or what I've accomplished in the two years since.

Otherwise, Brian's info is correct. I know this because my wife has been an agent for over ten years.

But, I will say that it's nuts how different the screenwriting world is compared to the composing world. It's the reason I split. I garnered Class-A representation and therefore Class-A meetings/opportunities with "NO" credits as a screenwriter, not one, and in less than two years. In the composing world that's unheard of. I can't tell you how strange it is driving onto these lots when just two years ago I was dealing with the lowest level of struggling directors - who btw - I've since surpassed. And now I'm told that I'll likely have a choice of who produces this thing at the end of all this. It sucks that composers' music is meaningless to these people...that it's entirely based on credits. It's a shame that it's not based on actual talent like in the screenwriting/directing world.

I'll say it again, it's time for composers to branch out into screenwriting, directing and producing etc. Then, down the road, you come back around to composing...on your own project. I'm convinced that, in this climate, it's the smartest long range approach. Things are changing fast, music is increasingly becoming an after thought. All the value is on the front end. I mean, if I'm the dude who crested the thing, I'm the guy who decides who the composer is. Pretty sneaky sis...

Isn't it interesting how just because I write some words onto a page, now important people at the highest levels want to meet me and be a part of this project. It's all about value, immediate value, tangible value. Words on a page put people to work. Music is an expense. I'm not suggesting one give up doing music, merely that it may be time to react to the current bleak climate by supplementing, by broadening one's horizons. Why wait for some director to come to you. BECOME the director, BECOME the show-runner/creator. I get it, it's a very long way around to doing music [not to mention, extremely difficult]. But so far it's working for me...and who the hell am I? In fact, I believe it's probably easier to get tv show or film made than to land a studio gig as a composer. And considering tv is where the money is...and considering a tv show is a steady gig. People here thought I was fucking nuts when I first set out to see if I could convert. In the grand scheme, I'm almost there. And whatever...if I fail I got closer than most.

If I were still composing I'd be begging a dude for a job who's way less talented than me or you. I got sick and tired of being that guy. I'm far happier now not having to deal with those people who I'm absolutely convinced are not talented. Now I get to deal with people who actually are very talented [you know, like you or me] with track records to prove it. Thus, my soul is at peace. Truly, I couldn't stand begging talentless people for work, and for almost free.

...Something to consider. Good luck my homies!


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## kid-surf (Mar 13, 2010)

Btw - two years ago, a decent boutique agency agreed to hip-pocket me [use your imagination] had this meeting the day before the Gaeta meeting. As I mentioned, my ultimate choice was to bail on composing.

The agent said this: "You will find your own gigs, we'll do the deal. There may be times where our bigger composers pass on a gig, which we'll put you up for...otherwise it's mostly on you".

That is so completely different than my representation now: As a screenwriter I have TWO agents who work in conjunction to get my work out there and set meetings...and all that political positioning that clients aren't privy to.

I don't mean to sound like a wet towel, nor be needlessly bleak aò¢>   ÈÉÏ¢>   ÈÉÐ¢>   ÈÉÑ¢>   ÈÉÒ¢>   ÈÉÓ¢>   ÈÉÔ¢>   ÈÉÕ¢>   ÈÉÖ¢>   ÈÉ×¢>   ÈÉØ¢>   ÈÉÙ¢>   ÈÉÚ¢>   ÈÉÛ¢>   ÈÉÜ¢>   ÈÉÝ¢>   ÈÉÞ¢>   ÈÉß¢>   ÈÉà¢>   ÈÉá¢>   ÈÉâ¢>   ÈÉã¢>   ÈÉä¢>   ÈÉå¢>   ÈÉæ¢>   ÈÉç¢>   ÈÉè¢>   ÈÉé¢>   ÈÉê¢>   ÈÉë¢>   ÈÉì¢>   ÈÉí¢>   ÈÉî¢>   ÈÉï¢>   ÈÉð¢>   ÈÉñ¢>   ÈÉò¢>   ÈÉó¢>   ÈÉô¢>   ÈÉõ¢>   ÈÉö¢>   ÈÉ÷¢>   ÈÉø¢>   ÈÉù¢>   ÈÉú¢>   ÈÉû¢>   ÈÉü¢>   ÈÉý¢>   ÈÉþ¢>   ÈÉÿ¢>   ÈÊ ¢>   ÈÊ¢@   ÈÊ¢@   ÈÊ¢@   ÈÊ¢@   ÈÊ¢@   ÈÊ¢@   ÈÊ¢@   ÈÊ


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## booboo (Mar 13, 2010)

kid-surf @ Sat Mar 13 said:


> Gaeta...
> if I'm the dude who crested the thing, I'm the guy who decides who the composer is. Pretty sneaky sis...



This is how Giacchino broke through, so it makes sense....

Though I'd rather get a pineapple in the arse sideways than be a showrunner.


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## booboo (Mar 13, 2010)

kid-surf @ Sat Mar 13 said:


> Btw - two years ago, a decent boutique agency agreed to hip-pocket me [use your imagination] had this meeting the day before the Gaeta meeting. As I mentioned, my ultimate choice was to bail on composing.
> 
> The agent said this: "You will find your own gigs, we'll do the deal. There may be times where our bigger composers pass on a gig, which we'll put you up for...otherwise it's mostly on you".



LOL. What are the chances this wasn't at FAM?



kid-surf @ Sat Mar 13 said:


> If Thomas J isn't a super star what chance do we all stand? Or is he..? I have no clue what he's up to these days. Hope he's doing well.


Nothing against the guy, but this sites regular practice of making Thomas the deified pinnacle of a composer is silly. I certainly don't measure my career on what TJ is doing! lol.


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## booboo (Mar 13, 2010)

midphase @ Fri Mar 12 said:


> BooBoo,
> 
> I'm just curious about what movie you worked on that got you the meeting with GSA? I'm just wondering if I should be trying to get a meeting as well (even though like you, I'll get the blow off afterwards...but what the hell right?)



I can't say what films I've done, obviously. However, GSA didn't call me, I called them when I left my previous agent. Agents LOVE poaching from one another.


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## Brobdingnagian (Mar 13, 2010)

Friends,

First off, I am actually pleased that there is FINALLY a real thread about "Working in the Industry"...

While to be fair, there have been some great & constructive discussions here about the business of composing, I do not believe a very specific thread like this has yet occurred. Funny that there are so many eyeball-ing this thread, yet so few responses. With humility, it is telling and perhaps serves as a barometer of sorts...

Booboo, I feel & have shared in your being puzzled. I want to elaborate, but I really need to get composing today. I hope you'll understand. More to follow.

Brian, thanks for sharing the anecdote. I appreciate your ramble about the other stuff which I am sure the un-initiated "looking thru the keyhole" will learn from and appreciate.

Kid, it has been interesting and exciting to watch your journey from afar, since the NS days. I am so pleased for you that you were able to harness and utilize & merge both your wife's position and your other channel of expression/creativity into a new direction. Certainly, this will pay off. While I have absolutely no interest in writing/producing (honestly, I would be rubbish) it is a great approach. For you, it seems to have been an organic one. I sincerely hope you knock it out of the park! Just let us know about your triumphs. Most of all - none of this means anything, if you hadn't recovered from your recent trauma. I am happy you are well and still amongst us.

Kid, I think the irony of your epiphany would be lost on Brice. In fact with things as dire as they are, he would probably ask you for 10%! (Yes he would settle for 5%, but he would still try and claim that he co-authored your 'new' direction)!

BooBoo, my money was on Anita's boutique, not FAM. But it is moot.

I want to get back on topic here without hijacking or steering Booboo's thread in another direction....I'll be back on my next break.....(I know, big deal/whoop the crowd groans)...


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## kid-surf (Mar 13, 2010)

Regular practice? I haven't heard the guy's name uttered in 2 years, nor do I believe him to be the pinnacle (nor a pineapple), and yet I'm still willing to guess that he's more talented than you...and younger...and cuter. That's the point. Nothing against you either.

Me? I'll take the showrunner gig over a pineapple in the ass. I'd pay someone to take pineapples in the ass on my behalf. My assistant's assistant would handle it out of my line of sight.


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## kid-surf (Mar 13, 2010)

Brobdingnagian-

Thanks man, all the way around! Wouldn't it be sad if the irony were lost on Brice...I like to hope (pretend?) that somebody in this business actually cares about people. But true...it's hard out there for a pimp.


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## choc0thrax (Mar 13, 2010)

kid-surf @ Sat Mar 13 said:


> Regular practice? I haven't heard the guy's name uttered in 2 years, nor do I believe him to be the pinnacle (nor a pineapple), and yet I'm still willing to guess that he's more talented than you...and younger...and cuter. That's the point. Nothing against you either.



People still talk about Thomas. He only does trailer music now, which is unfortunate.


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## midphase (Mar 13, 2010)

choc0....I think that's the point. He's talented, has a great reel, lives in LA and I'm sure he's met with all the top agencies in town and Zimmer himself. Yet AFAIK (and from his web site) he doesn't have representation.


This business does not necessarily reward talent...just perception of talent.


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## Brobdingnagian (Mar 13, 2010)

midphase @ Sat Mar 13 said:


> This business does not necessarily reward talent...just perception of talent.



And the perception of talent at a certain time. (What have you done 5 mins ago....)

Also, agencies have their own issues. FAM and SMA love the idea of poaching a client from each other. All of them love getting someone from GSA on their rosters as well. Etc.


But back on Booboo's track..... I was able to get a meeting with Cheryl a short while ago on a collaborators recommendation after a solid project we did. Maria joined us in the meeting as well.

I think Cheryl has a real gift. For over an hour, we really engaged in a fun, dynamic conversation. I come away from it with a real sense of interest, encouragement and optimism...even when discussing the smallest (or largest) things in life. Although she told me that she wasn't going to sign me that day (fair enough, no worries), a door was opened for the future (or not) - I am perfectly happy where I am now. Maria, IMHO does not have this. Being diplomatic, I found her awkwardly cordial - but distant and a bit of a third wheel. Let's leave it at that. 

Booboo, I am sure they discussed you after you left. Weighed the cost/benefit analysis of your career in that particular moment in time and made a decision based on that. Yes, you may be the second coming of composers (and I hope you are, as I am always inspired by a unique voice) - BUT as they decided not to sign you, I am pretty certain of one thing - you are NOT in Zimmer's camp or more specifically (maybe you are) BUT you are not yet in his top-rung. 

They seem to have a trickle down economics business model over there. - AND it works for them. Very clever. Congrats! With Capt. Zimmer at the top, then his minions. The money comes from the same source, but it is divied up in so many compellingly different ways......BUT, I digress as I am going off topic..........

This is actually a good thread.....thanks for starting it up, Booboo. Anyone else?


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## _taylor (Mar 13, 2010)

choc0thrax @ Sat Mar 13 said:


> which is unfortunate.




Making music for a living (prob a decent one at that), having live orchestras perform and record your works, working out of Remote Control, traveling, having a loyal fan base, co-producing a high profile string library.. a few of the unfortunate things he has to suffer though... 

Maybe one day I will be as unfortunate..


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## choc0thrax (Mar 13, 2010)

_taylor @ Sat Mar 13 said:


> choc0thrax @ Sat Mar 13 said:
> 
> 
> > which is unfortunate.
> ...



Unfortunate for us. I for one would like to hear him score a major film.


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## Brobdingnagian (Mar 13, 2010)

Taylor, Choco...please.

This is unhelpful, ridiculous and indicative of things. What on EARTH does this have to do with this thread? Take your love fest to another thread.....


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## _taylor (Mar 13, 2010)

Brobdingnagian @ Sat Mar 13 said:


> Taylor, Choco...please.
> 
> This is unhelpful, ridiculous and indicative of things. What on EARTH does this have to do with this thread? Take your love fest to another thread.....



Forgot - Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 ..


Sorry, It's Springtime - love is in the air


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## Brobdingnagian (Mar 13, 2010)

_taylor @ Sat Mar 13 said:


> Brobdingnagian @ Sat Mar 13 said:
> 
> 
> > Forgot - Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2 ..
> ...




Both marginalizing and ignoring me on the first quip... :roll: 

Displaying an adorable flippant bit of poetic wit in the second... :lol: 

Taylor - Charming. Adorable. C'mon, now.

Instead of reciprocating with a attack or smart-alec response, I'll simply ask, does anyone else have an anecdote they would like to share? Is anyone out there actually really working in the industry that has an agent-related tale?


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## choc0thrax (Mar 13, 2010)

_taylor @ Sat Mar 13 said:


> Brobdingnagian @ Sat Mar 13 said:
> 
> 
> > Taylor, Choco...please.
> ...



Speaking of MW2 I just went 28-2 on Quarry. Chopper gunner FTW.


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## booboo (Mar 15, 2010)

Brobding - 

Thanks for your post/story. And for trying to steer it back from the usual VI control decent. Oh well - lol.


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## booboo (Mar 15, 2010)

kid-surf @ Sat Mar 13 said:


> I'd pay someone to take pineapples in the ass on my behalf. My assistant's assistant would handle it out of my line of sight.



Until that show get's canceled after the 8th ep., then you're back to jamming them up your own ass! 
Seriously, though, good for you with the showrunning/screenwriting/directing/composing thing. It's very cool, just a different goal than mine.


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