# S+A CYCLES - 10/10 Music Tech review



## slateandash (Nov 2, 2019)

ENDLESS.ABSTRACT.LOOPS

CYCLES is an endless exploration of loops and sound sources in a powerful new loop manipulation and granular synthesis environment.

OUT NOW







The LOOPS engine is an audio looper, splicer and synthesiser. Audio is manipulated using an interactive visual timeline that slices the loops into rhythmic segments and re-collages them to create new and irregular formations. Playback parameters facilitate detailed loop manipulation whilst parameter modulation and slice randomisation can create further rhythmic evolution.


The GRAINS engine operates at the micro level, deconstructing the loops into tiny fragments and then rebuilding them into diffuse and amorphous clouds of texture. Grains of variable size, shape, pitch, volume, pan and direction interact to create a multitude of generative soundscapes and gestural movements, with physically simulated modulation introducing natural repetition by animating parameters in cyclical patterns.


PRESETS





STATES




SAMPLE IMPORT




OVERVIEW






On sale at the intro price of £229 (full price £279)


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## jneebz (Nov 2, 2019)

OH YES PLEASE.


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## midiman (Nov 2, 2019)

Can't wait!


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## AdamKmusic (Nov 2, 2019)

Would be perfect for an album I’m working on based on that teaser! So gimme now!!


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## givemenoughrope (Nov 2, 2019)

tell us more


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## slateandash (Nov 3, 2019)

givemenoughrope said:


> tell us more



will do soon


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## colony nofi (Nov 3, 2019)

Breath is being held.


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## Felt Instruments (Nov 4, 2019)

Can't wait! Auras is a beautiful library and I'm super excited for the new release!


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## EvgenyEmelyanov (Nov 4, 2019)

Can't wait for your new sound toy guys!


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## slateandash (Nov 7, 2019)

A little live take playing around with a deconstructed loop in the new instrument.


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## Audio Ollie (Nov 7, 2019)

Love your stuff. I could look at that beautiful UI all day.


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## D Halgren (Nov 7, 2019)

slateandash said:


> A little live take playing around with a deconstructed loop in the new instrument.



Sounds like Annihilation


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## slateandash (Nov 7, 2019)




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## Salohcin894 (Nov 7, 2019)

slateandash said:


>




Absolutely stunning!! C'mon, give us a tease of the release date, hungry to get my hands on this.


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## colony nofi (Nov 7, 2019)

I'd love to be using this yesterday....


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## Rob Elliott (Nov 7, 2019)

Call me interested.


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## lp59burst (Nov 7, 2019)

I might be interested if you had someplace other than Facebook / Instagram for your demo(s)...

"_Cannot load Facebook SDK. Disable any adblocker or tracking protection and try again._"

Now why would I want to do that..?


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## slateandash (Nov 8, 2019)

lp59burst said:


> I might be interested if you had someplace other than Facebook / Instagram for your demo(s)...
> 
> "_Cannot load Facebook SDK. Disable any adblocker or tracking protection and try again._"
> 
> Now why would I want to do that..?


Yep, there will be a proper launch with full demos, walkthroughs etc. This is just a bit of behind the scenes pre-release stuff


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## ironbut (Nov 11, 2019)

You're killing us!


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## Mannix (Nov 12, 2019)

Based on my experience with Auras, I want this, period.

Assume its MPE ready for Rise no?


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## slateandash (Nov 15, 2019)




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## Rob Elliott (Nov 15, 2019)

Ok - sat down longer than 20 seconds and listen to most of one of the videos of auras. Really sounds good. Will that product be a black Friday sale? If so, 'when'?


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## TomaeusD (Nov 15, 2019)

Getting some "Feral" vibes.


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## D Halgren (Nov 17, 2019)

You guys need some swag. I want a 

+A
S

hat.


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## N.Caffrey (Nov 17, 2019)

AURAS is so good. All the electronics of album I'm working on are from it. So I'm very interested in this now!


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## IvanP (Nov 18, 2019)

Rob Elliott said:


> Ok - sat down longer than 20 seconds and listen to most of one of the videos of auras. Really sounds good. Will that product be a black Friday sale? If so, 'when'?




+1


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## slateandash (Nov 18, 2019)

Rob Elliott said:


> Ok - sat down longer than 20 seconds and listen to most of one of the videos of auras. Really sounds good. Will that product be a black Friday sale? If so, 'when'?





IvanP said:


> +1


Hey guys,

We don't plan on doing any sales in the foreseeable future. We do offer an educational discount and there will also be a bundle deal for AURAS + CYCLES when it's released. 

Hope that helps!


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## stixman (Nov 18, 2019)

Auras sounds really impressive, i wonder how well it would play paired with a Continuumini?


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## slateandash (Nov 18, 2019)

stixman said:


> Auras sounds really impressive, i wonder how well it would play paired with a Continuumini?


We have a number of users who control AURAS with a Continuum. Here’s a video Sascha Knorr made improvising with a single patch.


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## Fry777 (Nov 18, 2019)

slateandash said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> We don't plan on doing any sales in the foreseeable future. We do offer an educational discount and there will also be a bundle deal for AURAS + CYCLES when it's released.
> 
> Hope that helps!



How big would the EDU discount be ? I couldn't find the information on your website


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## slateandash (Nov 18, 2019)

Fry777 said:


> How big would the EDU discount be ? I couldn't find the information on your website


The edu discount is 25%. Email [email protected] if you want to get in touch with your details.


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## Salohcin894 (Nov 18, 2019)

Will the bundle pricing beat out buying them with the education discount? (Or would they miraculously stack?)


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## Craig Sharmat (Nov 19, 2019)

What is the pad like thing to the right of the KB and will an apple pad work in its place?


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## Katzenjammer (Nov 19, 2019)

Craig Sharmat said:


> What is the pad like thing to the right of the KB and will an apple pad work in its place?



It's a ROLI Blocks https://roli.com/products/blocks


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## slateandash (Nov 19, 2019)




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## AdamKmusic (Nov 19, 2019)

Sounds so dark & scary! Love it!!

Need to pick up a Seaboard too!


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## IvanP (Nov 19, 2019)

Salohcin894 said:


> Will the bundle pricing beat out buying them with the education discount? (Or would they miraculously stack?)



Wondering this too


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## slateandash (Nov 19, 2019)

Salohcin894 said:


> Will the bundle pricing beat out buying them with the education discount? (Or would they miraculously stack?)





IvanP said:


> Wondering this too



The bundle price will be 20% off of the total cost of AURAS + CYCLES. The Educational discount is 25% but it won't be 'on top' of the bundle discount.


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## D Halgren (Nov 19, 2019)

slateandash said:


> The bundle price will be 20% off of the total cost of AURAS + CYCLES. The Educational discount is 25% but it won't be 'on top' of the bundle discount.


Could you show the math on that :dodgy:

Just kidding! 

Besides, who doesn't already have Auras?


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## slateandash (Nov 20, 2019)

Mannix said:


> Based on my experience with Auras, I want this, period.
> 
> Assume its MPE ready for Rise no?



Missed this.

Actually no CYCLES is not MPE compatible unfortunately.

We almost broke Kontakt doing what we’ve done, so multiplying it all by ten would lead to everyone’s computers exploding and we don’t have the legal team in place to deal with that.

Joking aside, it’s quite a different concept to AURAS and whilst there would be some benefits to using MPE they’re way more minimal than when it’s used with AURAS. And it would genuinely lead to major performance issues to the point where it would be pretty unusable in a lot of ways.


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## slateandash (Nov 22, 2019)




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## D Halgren (Nov 22, 2019)

slateandash said:


>



Can't wait to get my hands on this! Did you guys dump your Facebook? It's been out of commission for a couple of days. I just look over there for updates occasionally. I'm not Facebook user. Cheers!


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## slateandash (Nov 22, 2019)

D Halgren said:


> Can't wait to get my hands on this! Did you guys dump your Facebook? It's been out of commission for a couple of days. I just look over there for updates occasionally. I'm not Facebook user. Cheers!


We updated the page address. Its now https://www.facebook.com/slateandash/


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## D Halgren (Nov 22, 2019)

slateandash said:


> We updated the page address. Its now https://www.facebook.com/slateandash/


Ah, your website link is still broken for me, but maybe it's a cache thing.


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## D Halgren (Nov 22, 2019)

@slateandash Does the Kontakt 6.2 update change anything for adding your own samples to Cycles? Just curious.


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## thebob (Dec 1, 2019)

compatible with kontakt 5 ? (please say yes)


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## slateandash (Dec 3, 2019)

thebob said:


> compatible with kontakt 5 ? (please say yes)


It’s Kontakt 6 but Player compatible so no need to own K6


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## AdamKmusic (Dec 3, 2019)

I’ve got the money sat waiting in my PayPal, eager to transfer it into your bank account!


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## slateandash (Dec 3, 2019)

D Halgren said:


> @slateandash Does the Kontakt 6.2 update change anything for adding your own samples to Cycles? Just curious.



Unfortunately not. Too much going on under the hood to just drop a sample into it


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## AdamKmusic (Dec 4, 2019)

Can we expect any release news from this week?


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## thebob (Dec 4, 2019)

slateandash said:


> It’s Kontakt 6 but Player compatible so no need to own K6



thanx. don't want to upgrade, if I buy somehing (very limited budget), it's your stuff.. but then I would be limited to what extent ? only 20 minutes working in a row is that it with player ? and is it possible the have kontakt player 6 along full kontakt 5 ?


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## D Halgren (Dec 4, 2019)

thebob said:


> thanx. don't want to upgrade, if I buy somehing (very limited budget), it's your stuff.. but then I would be limited to what extent ? only 20 minutes working in a row is that it with player ? and is it possible the have kontakt player 6 along full kontakt 5 ?


If it's a Kontakt player library then you can just use it without full Kontakt, and it will show up in the library area of Kontakt. You can have full Kontakt 5 and Kontakt Player 6 together, no problem.


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## thebob (Dec 4, 2019)

D Halgren said:


> If it's a Kontakt player library then you can just use it without full Kontakt, and it will show up in the library area of Kontakt. You can have full Kontakt 5 and Kontakt Player 6 together, no problem.



thanks a lot, great news ! 

If I understood well on NI site, no limitation unless you used some specific functions of Kontakt. 
I guess it doesn't mean functions the S+A library would use right ?


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## D Halgren (Dec 4, 2019)

thebob said:


> thanks a lot, great news !
> 
> If I understood well on NI site, no limitation unless you used some specific functions of Kontakt.
> I guess it doesn't mean functions the S+A library would use right ?


You just lose some under the hood editing ability. Everything that Slate+Ash intends should work.


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## thebob (Dec 4, 2019)

Thanks so much ! can't wait to know more about the new S+A tool ! hopefully in my price range (as a xmas present)


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## slateandash (Dec 4, 2019)

AdamKmusic said:


> Can we expect any release news from this week?



You know that thing when you move house and you think you've moved everything but actually there's all the little bits of random tat and loose ends you need to tie up and it takes about as long to move that final 2% as it did to move the other.

Yeah, that.

Its really really close, and will be with NI in the next few days. Then it depends a little on how long it takes for encoding. 



thebob said:


> thanks a lot, great news !
> 
> If I understood well on NI site, no limitation unless you used some specific functions of Kontakt.
> I guess it doesn't mean functions the S+A library would use right ?



As @D Halgren says, there should be no limitations on your use of CYCLES, you just get restricted from using under the hood stuff in the Player version of Kontakt.


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## AdamKmusic (Dec 4, 2019)

slateandash said:


> You know that thing when you move house and you think you've moved everything but actually there's all the little bits of random tat and loose ends you need to tie up and it takes about as long to move that final 2% as it did to move the other.
> 
> Yeah, that.
> 
> ...



No worries it’ll sure be worth the wait 😁


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## thebob (Dec 4, 2019)

slateandash said:


> You know that thing when you move house and you think you've moved everything but actually there's all the little bits of random tat and loose ends you need to tie up and it takes about as long to move that final 2% as it did to move the other.
> 
> Yeah, that.




ahah, well, it happened that I've JUST been there




slateandash said:


> As @D Halgren says, there should be no limitations on your use of CYCLES, you just get restricted from using under the hood stuff in the Player version of Kontakt.



Great ! you make great looking hoods, no need for me to go under it


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## avocado89 (Dec 10, 2019)

Any updates on this?


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## AdamKmusic (Dec 14, 2019)

Hopefully something this week? 🤞


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## slateandash (Dec 16, 2019)

avocado89 said:


> Any updates on this?





AdamKmusic said:


> Hopefully something this week? 🤞


Apologies on lack of updates, we have been head down finishing everything up. We've not done an NKS/Kontakt Player compatible library before and there have been a few more things to get done than we imagined, hence the delay. 

Everything pretty much done from our side, so should be very soon hopefully!

*slightly hesitant to give an exact date as not sure on times from NI side of things, sorry!


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## givemenoughrope (Dec 29, 2019)

Release this kraken


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## avocado89 (Dec 30, 2019)

At the risk of being pushy - any updates on a release date for this? I think it has been exactly 2 weeks since we had the last update from S + A.

Super excited for this as I purchased AURAS right out of the gate, and it was one of the best kontakt library purchases I have ever made - no lie.

As much as I like more traditional sample libraries, my weakness is for beautiful and unique libraries that push the envelope, and actually bring something new to the table and don't just say they are unique! We need less pad libraries and more libraries like the ones S + A make!


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## Salohcin894 (Jan 2, 2020)

avocado89 said:


> At the risk of being pushy - any updates on a release date for this? I think it has been exactly 2 weeks since we had the last update from S + A.



Even a "Hey, we're still waiting on Native Instruments" would be nice. Can't wait for this one!


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## wetalkofdreams (Jan 8, 2020)

They've been leaving cryptic clues on their facebook this week, so maybe it's super soon?

On another note, I can't believe i've been checking their website daily for 2 months now, I feel so stalkery


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## Salohcin894 (Jan 10, 2020)

Just got an email that it's out! Was able to purchase and will hopefully be downloading soon!


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## slateandash (Jan 10, 2020)

OUT NOW!!!










CYCLES → SLATE + ASH







slateandash.com









The LOOPS engine is an audio looper, splicer and synthesiser. Audio is manipulated using an interactive visual timeline that slices the loops into rhythmic segments and re-collages them to create new and irregular formations. Playback parameters facilitate detailed loop manipulation whilst parameter modulation and slice randomisation can create further rhythmic evolution.





The GRAINS engine operates at the micro level, deconstructing the loops into tiny fragments and then rebuilding them into diffuse and amorphous clouds of texture. Grains of variable size, shape, pitch, volume, pan and direction interact to create a multitude of generative soundscapes and gestural movements, with physically simulated modulation introducing natural repetition by animating parameters in cyclical patterns.




On sale at the intro price of £229 (full price £279)


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## ironbut (Jan 10, 2020)

Very cool!

The 16N looks interesting. 








16N → SLATE + ASH


SOLD OUT UNTIL JANUARY 2023 Hand built by Gareth Luke Custom 16n Faderbank used to control electronic musical instruments and devices. Each smooth as silk Alps 60mm fader can send MIDI data through USB or 3.5mm stereo jack, CV (0-5V) through sixteen dedicated jacks, or I2C data through TRS jack...




slateandash.com




What are the overall dimensions?


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## Glassactor (Jan 10, 2020)

This was an instant buy for me. I love Auras and have been looking forward to Cycles based on the demos... wondering though, will there be any way to get under the hood and add our own loops or samples to be processed by the Cycles engine?


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## avocado89 (Jan 10, 2020)

How does this library download? I am just hesitant to purchase if they are using a downloader manager like pulse or what not, I have had such bad experience with them, losing serial numbers, not being able to update, etc. Will hold off until I hear from other users who have bought it and downloaded with no issue.


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## Glassactor (Jan 10, 2020)

I bought, downloaded and installed with no issue. Currently playing with it and it's great. Highly recommend. My earlier question about whether or not we would be able to load our own samples is almost a moot point, as the range of modulation and fx you can apply to the provided sources is so vast that you could make a bunch of very different music with the same patch. Still, I'd like to know if we can load our own sounds... maybe I'll just have to dig into that on my own though.


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## pulsedownloader (Jan 10, 2020)

avocado89 said:


> How does this library download? I am just hesitant to purchase if they are using a downloader manager like pulse or what not, I have had such bad experience with them, losing serial numbers, not being able to update, etc. Will hold off until I hear from other users who have bought it and downloaded with no issue.



Hi there sorry to hear you had issues in the past with Pulse. I'm not sure why you might have lost serial numbers or not been able to update but if you have any issues at all please just get in touch at [email protected] and we'll sort you out right away


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## brett (Jan 10, 2020)

Is there a discount for owners of Auras? I can't seem to spot one...


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## AdamKmusic (Jan 10, 2020)

Seems a hell of a lot of content! I just had to fork out for a new motherboard & CPU so will probably have to put getting this on the back burner for a little while though


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## Dr.Quest (Jan 11, 2020)

The audio demos sound great! What a cool sounding new instrument. I'll need to save up for this one for sure!


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## TomaeusD (Jan 11, 2020)

brett said:


> Is there a discount for owners of Auras? I can't seem to spot one...


I'd imagine there has to be... the bundle saves you £100 and owners of Auras don't have that option (the intro offer saves you £50).

I like what I hear, but if there's no discount for Auras owners I'll need to wait.

Edit: Never mind my logic. If you save £50 on both Auras and Cycles with the bundle it makes more sense that the intro price accounts for it.


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## NickDorito (Jan 11, 2020)

When does the intro price offer end?


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## slateandash (Jan 11, 2020)

Glassactor said:


> I bought, downloaded and installed with no issue. Currently playing with it and it's great. Highly recommend. My earlier question about whether or not we would be able to load our own samples is almost a moot point, as the range of modulation and fx you can apply to the provided sources is so vast that you could make a bunch of very different music with the same patch. Still, I'd like to know if we can load our own sounds... maybe I'll just have to dig into that on my own though.



Re sample import. 

We won’t be able to do a gui sample import feature as the under the hood stuff is to complex for it to work.

There is a hacky way of doing it that won’t work perfectly with the gui interactive elements in the loop ending (but all the audio elements/processing and granular will be fine). 

We’ll need to set up a couple of things in an update for that to work though.


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## slateandash (Jan 11, 2020)

NickDorito said:


> When does the intro price offer end?



17 Feb


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## TomaeusD (Jan 11, 2020)

slateandash said:


> 17 Feb


This will make a lovely Valentine's Day present to myself.


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## brett (Jan 11, 2020)

brett said:


> Is there a discount for owners of Auras? I can't seem to spot one...


 
@slateandash ?


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## slateandash (Jan 11, 2020)

TomaeusD said:


> This will make a lovely Valentine's Day present to myself.



We’re all for self love. ❤️


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## slateandash (Jan 11, 2020)

brett said:


> @slateandash ?



Hi Brett, there isn’t a discount beyond the intro offer for owners of Auras.


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## TomaeusD (Jan 11, 2020)

slateandash said:


> We’re all for self love. ❤


It's just my attempt to practice self-control. Nice work on the new instrument.


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## schmeete (Jan 11, 2020)

I find all your visuals, whether it be the interface or any part of your com, to be as artistic and uniquely beautiful as your meticulously orchestrated sounds.

I have though the same question as I had during my purchase of Auras back in 2018, how do you handle VAT? Your checkout process indicates nothing for those of us requiring proper EU invoicing. Is your pricing inc. or ex VAT? And should it be properly inclusive VAT, how do you handle ex VAT purchases for those of us EU companies with a valid VAT iD?

Thank you for any insight. 
Peter


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## slateandash (Jan 13, 2020)




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## slateandash (Jan 14, 2020)

It's coming...


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## thebob (Jan 14, 2020)

ooooowww this changes everything for me.
Is Kontakt player still enough for this trick ?


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## slateandash (Jan 14, 2020)

thebob said:


> ooooowww this changes everything for me.
> Is Kontakt player still enough for this trick ?


Yep!


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## Glassactor (Jan 14, 2020)

yeah this makes it a different device imo. Incredible sample mangler.


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## Pontus Rufelt (Jan 14, 2020)

slateandash said:


> It's coming...




Thats awesome! Any ETA on this?


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## schmeete (Jan 14, 2020)

schmeete said:


> I have though the same question as I had during my purchase of Auras back in 2018, how do you handle VAT? Your checkout process indicates nothing for those of us requiring proper EU invoicing. Is your pricing inc. or ex VAT? And should it be properly inclusive VAT, how do you handle ex VAT purchases for those of us EU companies with a valid VAT iD?
> Thank you for any insight.
> Peter


Guys could anyone at Skate and Ash give me a quick info on this?
Thanks for your time. New functionality looks incredible!
Best 
Peter


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## D Halgren (Jan 14, 2020)

slateandash said:


> It's coming...



Is that for all functions, or is it limited in some way?


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## AdamKmusic (Jan 14, 2020)

Sheeet! Its payday tomorrow....


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## colony nofi (Jan 14, 2020)

schmeete said:


> Guys could anyone at Skate and Ash give me a quick info on this?
> Thanks for your time. New functionality looks incredible!
> Best
> Peter


I think everyone just ends up paying the same. I bought from Australia yesterday and VAT wasn’t removed and GST wasn’t added.


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## slateandash (Jan 14, 2020)

schmeete said:


> Guys could anyone at Skate and Ash give me a quick info on this?
> Thanks for your time. New functionality looks incredible!
> Best
> Peter





colony nofi said:


> I think everyone just ends up paying the same. I bought from Australia yesterday and VAT wasn’t removed and GST wasn’t added.



Yes, there is currently no VAT applied to the product.


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## slateandash (Jan 14, 2020)

D Halgren said:


> Is that for all functions, or is it limited in some way?


Pretty much all functions, apart from being able to change the speed of the slices in the loop engine.


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## slateandash (Jan 14, 2020)




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## colony nofi (Jan 14, 2020)

slateandash said:


> It's coming...



This is absolutely fantastic. I was just thinking how amazing a plugin with the functionality of cycles would be (as a VST) - and how many uses both in music and sound design I could find for it! 
And then I see this... which, although a different workflow, is going to be able to open up a TONNE of creative options - right now!
Now, if I owned a company making VST plugins, I know what I'd be looking at making... 

Thankyou S+A for this.


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## slateandash (Jan 14, 2020)

colony nofi said:


> This is absolutely fantastic. I was just thinking how amazing a plugin with the functionality of cycles would be (as a VST) - and how many uses both in music and sound design I could find for it!
> And then I see this... which, although a different workflow, is going to be able to open up a TONNE of creative options - right now!
> Now, if I owned a company making VST plugins, I know what I'd be looking at making...
> 
> Thankyou S+A for this.



Without wanting to blow our own trumpet, it’s bloody brilliant! 😂


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## Brian2112 (Jan 14, 2020)

How will we be notified when the update containing the importing of our own samples becomes available?
Thank you! This library is a dream come true!


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## schmeete (Jan 14, 2020)

slateandash said:


> Pretty much all functions, apart from being able to change the speed of the slices in the loop engine.


Great thanks for the info. Getting this NOW!!


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## slateandash (Jan 14, 2020)

Brian2112 said:


> How will we be notified when the update containing the importing of our own samples becomes available?
> Thank you! This library is a dream come true!



We will send an email out sometime today. Any new purchases from this morning will already have the feature included.


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## schmeete (Jan 14, 2020)

colony nofi said:


> This is absolutely fantastic. I was just thinking how amazing a plugin with the functionality of cycles would be (as a VST) - and how many uses both in music and sound design I could find for it!
> And then I see this... which, although a different workflow, is going to be able to open up a TONNE of creative options - right now!
> Now, if I owned a company making VST plugins, I know what I'd be looking at making...
> 
> Thankyou S+A for this.


What he said 👆🏻... downloading...


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## schmeete (Jan 14, 2020)

slateandash said:


> We will send an email out sometime today. Any new purchases from this morning will already have the feature included.


You guys sleep at all ...!?


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## slateandash (Jan 14, 2020)

schmeete said:


> You guys sleep at all ...!?


Not at the moment 🥱


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## schmeete (Jan 15, 2020)

slateandash said:


> Not at the moment 🥱


Didn’t think so...🙄
Been playing around all morning. Sounds incredible! What a fantastic tool for the future as well apart from the cutting edge S+A sound instrument it already is. 🙏🏻


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## slateandash (Jan 15, 2020)

schmeete said:


> Didn’t think so...🙄
> Been playing around all morning. Sounds incredible! What a fantastic tool for the future as well apart from the cutting edge S+A sound instrument it already is. 🙏🏻


Thank you!


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## slateandash (Jan 15, 2020)

slateandash said:


> Thank you!



Sample import coming, email out tomorrow with download instructions.


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## colony nofi (Jan 15, 2020)

I'm going to say it. Most interesting, inspiring, new, forward thinking release of the last couple of years for me. Congrats guys.


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## schmeete (Jan 15, 2020)

slateandash said:


> Sample import coming, email out tomorrow with download instructions.



OK now GO TO BED guys!!!🤘🏻


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## schmeete (Jan 15, 2020)

colony nofi said:


> I'm going to say it. Most interesting, inspiring, new, forward thinking release of the last couple of years for me. Congrats guys.


Couldn’t agree more, now I’m not sleeping as well anymore🤦🏻‍


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## slateandash (Jan 16, 2020)

schmeete said:


> Couldn’t agree more, now I’m not sleeping as well anymore🤦🏻‍



Thank you! Almost at the point we can rest. 🥱


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## slateandash (Jan 16, 2020)




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## schmeete (Jan 16, 2020)

slateandash said:


> Thank you! Almost at the point we can rest. 🥱


Ok get some rest guys.🙏🏻 Maybe next week try a batch re-save and let me know what you get on your end with V 1.1. Hardly mission critical...


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## AdamKmusic (Jan 16, 2020)

Gave in & purchased! Going straight into a project I’m working on!


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## pulsedownloader (Jan 16, 2020)

If anyone has any issues with the download, update or Pulse at all please just drop us an email at [email protected] and we'll help you out right away.


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## Anders Wall (Jan 16, 2020)

AdamKmusic said:


> Gave in & purchased! Going straight into a project I’m working on!


Same here, took me 10min to play a little with the library and another five get a que approved :O
@slateandash a million thumbs up.
So inspiring and I'm only on the first patch 
Abstractions - a keeper
Series will air in a few months, will update with link.

Best,
Anders


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## slateandash (Jan 16, 2020)

Anders Wall said:


> Same here, took me 10min to play a little with the library and another five get a que approved :O
> @slateandash a million thumbs up.
> So inspiring and I'm only on the first patch
> Abstractions - a keeper
> ...



Awesome!

Now go forth and spread the gospel of Slate + Ash 🧙‍♂️


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## Pontus Rufelt (Jan 16, 2020)

@slateandash I am only able to get the user samples patch to load as “demo” in the player version of Kontakt 6. Any help would be greatly appreciated.


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## Damarus (Jan 16, 2020)

@slateandash saw the walkthroughs last night - seriously blown away on the amount of detail and configurations available. Looking forward to diving into this!


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## Brian2112 (Jan 16, 2020)

Man, this thing is just amazing! Granular synthesis in itself is nearly limitless but this library takes it even further. A truly grand achievement. The interface is very intuitive but sometimes I am forgetting some “hidden” options. A nice PDF manual would be really nice.


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## Pontus Rufelt (Jan 16, 2020)

Can any other owners confirm that you seem to need the full version of Kontakt 6 to use the user import functionality?


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## Damarus (Jan 16, 2020)

Pontus Rufelt said:


> Can any other owners confirm that you seem to need the full version of Kontakt 6 to use the user import functionality?



So i noticed right away you have to use the instrument "#user sources" to be able to drag and drop


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## slateandash (Jan 16, 2020)

Pontus Rufelt said:


> Can any other owners confirm that you seem to need the full version of Kontakt 6 to use the user import functionality?


Yes apologies Rufus, you’ll need to use the full version of Kontakt to use the user patch properly until NI Kontakt team are back from NAMM to encode the player version.


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## Pontus Rufelt (Jan 16, 2020)

slateandash said:


> Yes apologies Rufus, you’ll need to use the full version of Kontakt to use the user patch properly until NI Kontakt team are back from NAMM to encode the player version.



Ah, gotcha! Thank you for the response! Really loving the library, very intuitive and fun to use.


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## slateandash (Jan 17, 2020)

Pontus Rufelt said:


> Ah, gotcha! Thank you for the response! Really loving the library, very intuitive and fun to use.



Hi Pontus, 

We think we have a solution for the issue. Get in touch on [email protected] if you want some help


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## Mannix (Jan 17, 2020)

full k5 or k6 for drag and drop?


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## slateandash (Jan 17, 2020)

Mannix said:


> full k5 or k6 for drag and drop?


It works in full k6 but, if you get in touch on [email protected] we can give you an update to try that should get it to work on player.


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## Welldone (Jan 17, 2020)

slateandash said:


> It works in full k6 but, if you get in touch on [email protected] we can give you an update to try that should get it to work on player.



As the possibility to import my own samples is crucial for my decision to buy Cycles, I‘d like to ask: Will I be able to use the import function in Kontakt Player after an update has been encoded by NI? Is there a risk that it won‘t work and that I‘ll be left with the instrument as it is now?

Thanks for a clarification.


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## slateandash (Jan 17, 2020)

Welldone said:


> As the possibility to import my own samples is crucial for my decision to buy Cycles, I‘d like to ask: Will I be able to use the import function in Kontakt Player after an update has been encoded by NI? Is there a risk that it won‘t work and that I‘ll be left with the instrument as it is now?
> 
> Thanks for a clarification.



Hey, drag + drop samples is a native feature to Kontakt (and Kontakt Player), so no there shouldn't be any issues once encoded.


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## AdamKmusic (Jan 17, 2020)

Absolutely blown away by the sounds in this library & so many patches to choose from!


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## Welldone (Jan 17, 2020)

slateandash said:


> Hey, drag + drop samples is a native feature to Kontakt (and Kontakt Player), so no there shouldn't be any issues once encoded.


Great! Thanks for the quick reply.


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## Mannix (Jan 18, 2020)

this is amazing, probably the most innovative, inspiring thing I have used and I have everything..


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## ok_tan (Jan 18, 2020)

Mannix said:


> this is amazing, probably the most innovative, inspiring thing I have used and I have everything..


this. great library and engines.


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## stevedeath (Jan 19, 2020)

Not sure how I missed this release, love Auras!

started a thread on sample talk asking for new sound design tools, and was wondering how this compares to Straylight? Anyone got both?


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## jneebz (Jan 19, 2020)

Wow, this is just so inspiring. A little nervous about the CPU hit in a bigger project, but I’ll make it work! Thanks @slateandash for an amazing library!


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## midiman (Jan 19, 2020)

stevedeath said:


> Not sure how I missed this release, love Auras!
> 
> started a thread on sample talk asking for new sound design tools, and was wondering how this compares to Straylight? Anyone got both?


I would say they are a bit different sonically. But what the developers at Slate and Ash are doing is in my opinion much much superior. They at the very edge of innovation in terms of both tech and sound. And what they do is very artistic also, not just innovative for the sake of it. I have not bought straylight, but I will be buying Cycles for sure. The level of integrity of Slate and Ash is hard to match. I really love the Auras lib they released before. And Cycles looks to be as innovative as Auras was, but yet in a new direction, quite apart from Auras. I can't wait to try Cycles.


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## AdamKmusic (Jan 19, 2020)

I’ve got both Cycles & Straylight. They’re both quite different in terms of their sound me, Cycles is more electronic/modular based whilst there are some organic bowed sounds whereas Straylight is a bit more industrial with scrapes etc. So their functions are nearly the same just different sounding


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## slateandash (Jan 20, 2020)

midiman said:


> I would say they are a bit different sonically. But what the developers at Slate and Ash are doing is in my opinion much much superior. They at the very edge of innovation in terms of both tech and sound. And what they do is very artistic also, not just innovative for the sake of it. I have not bought straylight, but I will be buying Cycles for sure. The level of integrity of Slate and Ash is hard to match. I really love the Auras lib they released before. And Cycles looks to be as innovative as Auras was, but yet in a new direction, quite apart from Auras. I can't wait to try Cycles.


Thank you for the kind words!


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## Banquet (Jan 20, 2020)

I've just bought Cycles (and the Auras bundle) and have been playing with it tonight for the first time. I'm not sure if there's a manual but I loaded some of the presets and changed a few settings without really knowing what I was doing and they sounded great! The interface is very cool and it seems like you can tweak lots of things with very musical results.

I have a Moog Grandmother hooked up to a Chase Bliss Mood Pedal. When I watched the demo videos for Cycles it reminded me very much of the type of sound Chase Bliss are doing, which I really love.

So I recorded a 4 bar random arp pattern from the Moog, through the Mood pedal and loaded that into Cycles. That actually helped me figure out some of the controls because I knew how the loop should sound so I could better tell how the controls were altering it. And wow, really wow... I've loaded my own loops and samples into granular engines before with mixed results... very often ending up quite disappointing, but the loops I've tried tonight sound AMAZING through cycles. So organic and beautiful , I could jut tweak these sounds forever and not get bored. And very inspiring sounds for me. I can't wait to go through the rest of the presets but particularly to push more samples and loops from my hardware into this brilliant engine! Much respect to the devs... I'm thrilled!


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## Mannix (Jan 20, 2020)

jneebz said:


> Wow, this is just so inspiring. A little nervous about the CPU hit in a bigger project, but I’ll make it work! Thanks @slateandash for an amazing library!


let me know how you will reduce the CPU hit thanks in advance


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## jneebz (Jan 21, 2020)

Mannix said:


> let me know how you will reduce the CPU hit thanks in advance


I think I’m kinda stuck....running a quad-core i5 3.2GHz and this library is bringing it to its knees quite often. I can’t play a triad in some patches without hitting 80-90% CPU. And that’s in Kontakt stand-alone mode. I kinda wish the system requirements would just say it requires a minimum i7. All that being said, the library really is a gem and I figure I’ll be updating my studio computer at the end of the year so I will enjoy it more then


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## BezO (Jan 21, 2020)

I wasn't looking for anything like this, but if it's similar to Straylight, it sounds interesting. But man, I can't get most of the videos to play, here or on the S&A site. I'll try from a different computer tonight.


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## Greg (Jan 21, 2020)

Challenges your cpu for sure but a small price to pay for the amazing sounds. Not a big deal since most of the sounds are drones and loops that don't need to be played in real time necessarily.


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## paperhouse (Jan 21, 2020)

@slateandash This thing is insane! One question: I can't seem to find a way to see exactly what parameters the XY grids are controlling. Am I missing something, or is there a list somewhere? What is actually being affected by Window, Density, Cluster, Stretch, and Grains?


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## slateandash (Jan 22, 2020)

Banquet said:


> I've just bought Cycles (and the Auras bundle) and have been playing with it tonight for the first time. I'm not sure if there's a manual but I loaded some of the presets and changed a few settings without really knowing what I was doing and they sounded great! The interface is very cool and it seems like you can tweak lots of things with very musical results.
> 
> I have a Moog Grandmother hooked up to a Chase Bliss Mood Pedal. When I watched the demo videos for Cycles it reminded me very much of the type of sound Chase Bliss are doing, which I really love.
> 
> So I recorded a 4 bar random arp pattern from the Moog, through the Mood pedal and loaded that into Cycles. That actually helped me figure out some of the controls because I knew how the loop should sound so I could better tell how the controls were altering it. And wow, really wow... I've loaded my own loops and samples into granular engines before with mixed results... very often ending up quite disappointing, but the loops I've tried tonight sound AMAZING through cycles. So organic and beautiful , I could jut tweak these sounds forever and not get bored. And very inspiring sounds for me. I can't wait to go through the rest of the presets but particularly to push more samples and loops from my hardware into this brilliant engine! Much respect to the devs... I'm thrilled!


Also try using the states once you’ve out your loop in. Just hover the L or G and click on the + that appears. Click on any of the states and it will our cycles into a bunch of predesigned settings that tend to work well with most loops/sources.


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## N.Caffrey (Jan 22, 2020)

Banquet said:


> I've just bought Cycles (and the Auras bundle) and have been playing with it tonight for the first time. I'm not sure if there's a manual but I loaded some of the presets and changed a few settings without really knowing what I was doing and they sounded great! The interface is very cool and it seems like you can tweak lots of things with very musical results.
> 
> I have a Moog Grandmother hooked up to a Chase Bliss Mood Pedal. When I watched the demo videos for Cycles it reminded me very much of the type of sound Chase Bliss are doing, which I really love.
> 
> So I recorded a 4 bar random arp pattern from the Moog, through the Mood pedal and loaded that into Cycles. That actually helped me figure out some of the controls because I knew how the loop should sound so I could better tell how the controls were altering it. And wow, really wow... I've loaded my own loops and samples into granular engines before with mixed results... very often ending up quite disappointing, but the loops I've tried tonight sound AMAZING through cycles. So organic and beautiful , I could jut tweak these sounds forever and not get bored. And very inspiring sounds for me. I can't wait to go through the rest of the presets but particularly to push more samples and loops from my hardware into this brilliant engine! Much respect to the devs... I'm thrilled!


Could you post some audio examples if you don't mind? I'm really curious now!


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## slateandash (Jan 22, 2020)

paperhouse said:


> @slateandash This thing is insane! One question: I can't seem to find a way to see exactly what parameters the XY grids are controlling. Am I missing something, or is there a list somewhere? What is actually being affected by Window, Density, Cluster, Stretch, and Grains?



currently you can only see by looking at what is modulating in the main grains window once you set the cursor off on a path.

we will get round to a manual which will detail this stuff. With Cycles being so deep, it’s a bit of a job in itself!


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## slateandash (Jan 22, 2020)

CYCLES FUN MODE


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## Banquet (Jan 22, 2020)

slateandash said:


> Also try using the states once you’ve out your loop in. Just hover the L or G and click on the + that appears. Click on any of the states and it will our cycles into a bunch of predesigned settings that tend to work well with most loops/sources.


Thanks, I was trying the different states last night - very useful!


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## Banquet (Jan 22, 2020)

N.Caffrey said:


> Could you post some audio examples if you don't mind? I'm really curious now!


I might see if I can record a video as it would help to see what is happening with the interface and how that is changing the sound. I haven't done that before though, so it might take a couple of days to set up.


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## N.Caffrey (Jan 22, 2020)

Banquet said:


> I might see if I can record a video as it would help to see what is happening with the interface and how that is changing the sound. I haven't done that before though, so it might take a couple of days to set up.


Thanks!


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## ziggi (Jan 23, 2020)

Pulled a trigger on this one, definitely inspiring and unique instrument, although this is not instant gratification one. Some patches work right away but mostly you'd like to mold it and tweak it. Your work will be rewarded though. It has really original loops and samples to play with. But mind that it is on the LoFi, tape noise, warm side of sonic spectrum. I think it'll nicely complement Zebra, Omni and more FM/Wavetable style of synths. And, yes, it's quite CPU heavy. I'm on 3.2Ghz i7 with 32GB

@slateandash Great job guys! Could you let us know when you'll have an update for user samples import for Kontak6 Player? Can't wait to try it. Right now it's impossible on the Player. Thanks a lot!


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## paperhouse (Jan 24, 2020)

slateandash said:


> currently you can only see by looking at what is modulating in the main grains window once you set the cursor off on a path.
> 
> we will get round to a manual which will detail this stuff. With Cycles being so deep, it’s a bit of a job in itself!



@slateandash I can imagine! Looking forward to the manual. In the meantime, I believe I've stumbled upon a small bug in the XY section. The first time I click "A" in Structure (without dragging to B) _something_ changes, even though nothing changes onscreen. The pitch jumps up an octave or two (maybe other stuff happens as well--not entirely sure!). I can "undo" it by clicking "Tun" on the main Grains page (which shows the value to be 0, no dragging required) and then I'm able to repeat the behavior by clicking "A" again. And I know it's not simply a matter of it switching to Structure B without updating visually because when I do drag to B afterwards, the sound changes further. Happy to provide a screen capture if that's helpful, and I'm on Kontakt 6.2.1 in Logic on Mojave. Regardless, thank you for this insane instrument; it's such an inspiring and creative tool. Can't wait to use it on everything I do from now on!


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## DanPhaseMusic (Jan 24, 2020)

I'm looking to get this but how do you get the bundle price ? I can't see it on the site...

Cheers


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## DanPhaseMusic (Jan 24, 2020)

Sorry just found it


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## slateandash (Jan 25, 2020)

paperhouse said:


> @slateandash I can imagine! Looking forward to the manual. In the meantime, I believe I've stumbled upon a small bug in the XY section. The first time I click "A" in Structure (without dragging to B) _something_ changes, even though nothing changes onscreen. The pitch jumps up an octave or two (maybe other stuff happens as well--not entirely sure!). I can "undo" it by clicking "Tun" on the main Grains page (which shows the value to be 0, no dragging required) and then I'm able to repeat the behavior by clicking "A" again. And I know it's not simply a matter of it switching to Structure B without updating visually because when I do drag to B afterwards, the sound changes further. Happy to provide a screen capture if that's helpful, and I'm on Kontakt 6.2.1 in Logic on Mojave. Regardless, thank you for this insane instrument; it's such an inspiring and creative tool. Can't wait to use it on everything I do from now on!


thanks, we'll look into that!


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## Banquet (Jan 25, 2020)

N.Caffrey said:


> Could you post some audio examples if you don't mind? I'm really curious now!


Here's a video. Sorry, it's a bit long and rambling, but there's so much to cover and I still missed bits but it gives an idea how Cycles handles some loops I imported. Hope it helps a bit!


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## N.Caffrey (Jan 25, 2020)

Banquet said:


> Here's a video. Sorry, it's a bit long and rambling, but there's so much to cover and I still missed bits but it gives an idea how Cycles handles some loops I imported. Hope it helps a bit!



Wow thank you for this! I’ll watch it tomorrow, much appreciated!


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## slateandash (Jan 25, 2020)

Banquet said:


> Here's a video. Sorry, it's a bit long and rambling, but there's so much to cover and I still missed bits but it gives an idea how Cycles handles some loops I imported. Hope it helps a bit!



Bravo 👏


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## Banquet (Jan 27, 2020)

I've had a couple of email notifications of questions about the video, but when I visit the forum, the posts don't seem to exist. One question was - where in the video is the original sample. To answer that, if you go to 9:18 in the video, you can hear the original sample/loop. In the last 10 minutes or so I go through a few others as well.

When it comes to importing samples, you can just drag and drop and as long as the audio is 4 bars long and recorded between 75 and 140 bpm, it will be tempo synced.

Edit, I thought it might be helpful to do a video index in the description. You can use this to skip about the video if there's a certain function you're interested in.


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## Harry (Jan 27, 2020)

Great video, thanks Banquet. One thing you said in the video, about importing own samples, was that they should be was it, 70-140bpm and 4 bars long to sync up inside Cycles? Where did you find that information, is there a manual? What if they are just one shots, random .WAV files, will those work?


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## Banquet (Jan 27, 2020)

Harry said:


> Great video, thanks Banquet. One thing you said in the video, about importing own samples, was that they should be was it, 70-140bpm and 4 bars long to sync up inside Cycles? Where did you find that information, is there a manual? What if they are just one shots, random .WAV files, will those work?



I think if you want the audio to be tempo synced it has to be 75 - 140bpm and 4 bars long, but I'm pretty sure you can import anything you want if you don't need the tempo sync. I've been importing .wavs generated from Cubase. You can then save in Kontakt and it saves the audio with the .nki

Edit: I supposed you couldn't have longer than 4 bars as it would go outside the scope of the UI. I'll try importing a one-shot tonight and let you know how it deals with it.


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## Harry (Jan 27, 2020)

Banquet said:


> I think if you want the audio to be tempo synced it has to be 75 - 140bpm and 4 bars long, but I'm pretty sure you can import anything you want if you don't need the tempo sync. I've been importing .wavs generated from Cubase. You can then save in Kontakt and it saves the audio with the .nki
> 
> Edit: I supposed you couldn't have longer than 4 bars as it would go outside the scope of the UI. *I'll try importing a one-shot tonight and let you know how it deals with it.*


Great - thanks.
I'm using Cubase too - so your process was, for example when using SCS, record a 4 bar phrase, export that track as audio, and import that audio into Cylces. And then you can save each "User Preset" as an .nki.

Kept coming to my mind when watching your vidoe, doing all those many tweaks - to the existing Loops (and I presume you can do something simialr to the existing Presets too?) - can you save those tweaked Loops/Presets as new files --- or would it be, you edit a Loop, then you want to save it, it saves as a Preset? Or, is it not savable?

Edit : actually now I think that you didn't actually edit any of the EXISTING Loops, but just your own imported Loops.


----------



## Welldone (Jan 27, 2020)

Banquet said:


> Here's a video. Sorry, it's a bit long and rambling, but there's so much to cover and I still missed bits but it gives an idea how Cycles handles some loops I imported. Hope it helps a bit!



Thank you very much for your video. Showing the initial loop unmangled made it much clearer for me what Cycles actually can do. I found the official videos quite unclear in this regard.

I‘m not sure about a fundamental point: Can you apply the loop and the grains engine at the same time to a loop - or do you have to choose just one?


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## AdamKmusic (Jan 27, 2020)

Am I right in thinking the importing of sounds was only for K6 full version currently?


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## slateandash (Jan 27, 2020)

AdamKmusic said:


> Am I right in thinking the importing of sounds was only for K6 full version currently?



It works in kontakt player also. Did you get the update email? 

If not email, [email protected] and someone can help you out.

S


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## slateandash (Jan 27, 2020)

Welldone said:


> *Thank you very much for your video. Showing the initial loop unmangled made it much clearer for me what Cycles actually can do. I found the official videos quite unclear in this regard.*
> 
> I‘m not sure about a fundamental point: Can you apply the loop and the grains engine at the same time to a loop - or do you have to choose just one?



We will be putting out some more specific tip + tricks/techniques type videos in the coming weeks which will help with this. Very grateful to @Banquet for putting this out in the meantime however, very useful for people to understand some of the many possibilities


----------



## Welldone (Jan 27, 2020)

slateandash said:


> We will be putting out some more specific tip + tricks/techniques type videos in the coming weeks which will help with this. Very grateful to @Banquet for putting this out in the meantime however, very useful for people to understand some of the many possibilities


Great. Meanwhile, I allow myself to ask once more: Can the loop and the grains engine be applied together to a loop?


----------



## slateandash (Jan 27, 2020)

Welldone said:


> Great. Meanwhile, I allow myself to ask once more: Can the loop and the grains engine be applied together to a loop?


You can't apply them simultaneously, if thats what you mean? You can switch back and forth between the two engines on the same loop keeping your settings, but you can't hear both things at the same time or feed one into the other.

Hope that helps?


----------



## Welldone (Jan 27, 2020)

slateandash said:


> You can't apply them simultaneously, if thats what you mean? You can switch back and forth between the two engines on the same loop keeping your settings, but you can't hear both things at the same time or feed one into the other.
> 
> Hope that helps


Yes, that‘s what I meant. Thanks for the quick reply. Is it out of question that a simultaneous use would be possible in the future?


----------



## slateandash (Jan 27, 2020)

Welldone said:


> Yes, that‘s what I meant. Thanks for the quick reply. Is it out of question that a simultaneous use would be possible in the future?


I can't really see it as being possible unfortunately. What sort of ways were you thinking of using it?


----------



## Welldone (Jan 27, 2020)

slateandash said:


> I can't really see it as being possible unfortunately. What sort of ways were you thinking of using it?


Something like playing a loop only partially and in reverse, while applying some granular alterations, for example.


----------



## slateandash (Jan 27, 2020)

Welldone said:


> Something like playing a loop only partially and in reverse, while applying some granular alterations, for example.


One of our favourite things with cycles is that you can program it in the grains engine to essentially play back the loop like the original loop and then pull it apart in subtle (or dramatic) ways. 

This is achieved by certain density and envelope settings and then modulating the grain position using a ramp up waveform over four bars. You could then cycle through the loop backwards by using a ramp down waveform, and put the grains in full reverse if you want it to sound 'reversey'. Of course combining this with other wave shapes like bouncing ball, or adding subtle randomisation to grain position etc creates some other cool weird alternative versions of the loop. You can also assign the position to modwheel which lets you slide through the sample in a gestural way, freezing the sound of whatever position you leave it in. Its super cool! 

There are 'states' that allow you to achieve these effects with whatever source material you are using in just a couple of clicks. 

This is some of the stuff we will share in our techniques videos.


----------



## Welldone (Jan 27, 2020)

slateandash said:


> One of our favourite things with cycles is that you can program it in the grains engine to essentially play back the loop like the original loop and then pull it apart in subtle (or dramatic) ways.
> 
> This is achieved by certain density and envelope settings and then modulating the grain position using a ramp up waveform over four bars. You could then cycle through the loop backwards by using a ramp down waveform, and put the grains in full reverse if you want it to sound 'reversey'. Of course combining this with other wave shapes like bouncing ball, or adding subtle randomisation to grain position etc creates some other cool weird alternative versions of the loop. You can also assign the position to modwheel which lets you slide through the sample in a gestural way, freezing the sound of whatever position you leave it in. Its super cool!
> 
> ...


Thanks a lot for this helpful explanation! It‘s only slowly dawning on me how powerful Cycles is. I‘m really looking forward to your videos. Or should I just buy it and try for myself? 😉


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## slateandash (Jan 27, 2020)

Welldone said:


> Thanks a lot for this helpful explanation! It‘s only slowly dawning on me how powerful Cycles is. I‘m really looking forward to your videos. Or should I just buy it and try for myself? 😉



Yeah, we gave it the ENDLESS.ABSTRACT.LOOPS strapline for a reason


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## Banquet (Jan 27, 2020)

Harry said:


> Great - thanks.
> I'm using Cubase too - so your process was, for example when using SCS, record a 4 bar phrase, export that track as audio, and import that audio into Cylces. And then you can save each "User Preset" as an .nki.
> 
> Kept coming to my mind when watching your vidoe, doing all those many tweaks - to the existing Loops (and I presume you can do something simialr to the existing Presets too?) - can you save those tweaked Loops/Presets as new files --- or would it be, you edit a Loop, then you want to save it, it saves as a Preset? Or, is it not savable?
> ...



In Cubase I set up a 2nd stereo out (doesn't have to be connected) and routed my VSTs to that, so after recording my 4 bars, it went straight to audio. However I found Cubase was adding half a bar of silence to that audio file. It didn't show in Cubase unless I grabbed the edge of the audio track and pulled it left - then I could see the extra half bar of silence... I never realised Cubase did that! So to get around that I 'rendered in place' the 4 bars of audio and then used that audio file to drag into Cycles. It's more straightforward than it sounds and I think I'm keeping this setup in Cubase saved used Cycles import, so I can go into that whenever I want to import. Then save the preset and reload into whatever tracks I want.

When dragging the audio file, Cycles brings up a message to say the audio needs to be between 75 and 140bpm and 4 bars long to be tempo synced. There is no manual for Cycles yet, but all the functions seem to have pop up text which does a great job of explaining how it works.

I just tried dragging 1 bars of audio in and it seems to have multiplied it by 4 to make it 4 bars... so it just repeats 4 times. So it seems you can import shorter clips if you want to.


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## Banquet (Jan 27, 2020)

slateandash said:


> One of our favourite things with cycles is that you can program it in the grains engine to essentially play back the loop like the original loop and then pull it apart in subtle (or dramatic) ways.
> 
> This is achieved by certain density and envelope settings and then modulating the grain position using a ramp up waveform over four bars. You could then cycle through the loop backwards by using a ramp down waveform, and put the grains in full reverse if you want it to sound 'reversey'. Of course combining this with other wave shapes like bouncing ball, or adding subtle randomisation to grain position etc creates some other cool weird alternative versions of the loop. You can also assign the position to modwheel which lets you slide through the sample in a gestural way, freezing the sound of whatever position you leave it in. Its super cool!
> 
> ...



Hadn't thought of trying that - sounds very cool


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## Harry (Jan 27, 2020)

Banquet said:


> I 'rendered in place' the 4 bars of audio and then used that audio file to drag into Cycles. It's more straightforward than it sounds and I think I'm keeping this setup in Cubase saved used Cycles import, so I can go into that whenever I want to import. Then save the preset and reload into whatever tracks I want.


So you can drag an audio file directly form inside a Cubase project? Or did you mean you need to go to the File Explorer and drag the actual file itself?
I'm not totally getting your Cubase workflow - you mean you have a Cubase file called "Cycles" and when you get a sound you like, you save as a Track Preset, which you can them import into another Cubase project? This doesn't sound so convenient as saving it within Cycles ..?


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## Banquet (Jan 28, 2020)

Harry said:


> So you can drag an audio file directly form inside a Cubase project? Or did you mean you need to go to the File Explorer and drag the actual file itself?
> I'm not totally getting your Cubase workflow - you mean you have a Cubase file called "Cycles" and when you get a sound you like, you save as a Track Preset, which you can them import into another Cubase project? This doesn't sound so convenient as saving it within Cycles ..?


 , 

You have to go to file explorer to drag and drop. Don't worry too much about my workflow - it's just someone I've setup with the routing how I want it to get the audio files without having to export the track. 

All you have to do is drag and drop an audio file into Cycles and from there you can save any presets you make that you like. It's no more complicated than that.


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## slateandash (Jan 28, 2020)

'Shadow Encounter' is an otherworldy piece made entirely of sounds from our AURAS and CYCLES instruments.


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## slateandash (Feb 1, 2020)




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## Welldone (Feb 1, 2020)

slateandash said:


>



Could you please elaborate what excatly Cycles is doing to the samples? If the track is made only out of the initial samples that‘s quite impressive.


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## AdamKmusic (Feb 2, 2020)

slateandash said:


> It works in kontakt player also. Did you get the update email?
> 
> If not email, [email protected] and someone can help you out.
> 
> S



Ah somehow I missed your reply, doesn't look like I got any update email so will pop you guys an email!

Cheers


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## AdamKmusic (Feb 4, 2020)

slateandash said:


> It works in kontakt player also. Did you get the update email?
> 
> If not email, [email protected] and someone can help you out.
> 
> S



Looks like I had downloaded the latest version when I bought the library, got a reply from one of your support guys. But whenever I load the user sources patch I get a demo timeout screen (see below). Have replied to the tech support guy though


EDIT - redownloaded again (must've been another update since the version I originally downloaded) & now the user sources patch works in kontakt player, time to experiment!


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## slateandash (Feb 7, 2020)

'Granular Loop Reconstruction' is the first in a series of videos exploring different approaches to using Cycles to create and shape sounds.


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## AdamKmusic (Feb 9, 2020)

A little track I wrote using mainly Cycles, non cycles elements are the piano / bass & some guitar buried in there


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## midiman (Feb 10, 2020)

@slateandash Is it possible to play harmony with Cycles? Or that depends upon the loop that is being used? are there some presets that would allow me to lay down a chord structure or is it mainly devoted to creating textures? Are there some presets that would allow for creating chords?


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## wildsheep (Feb 11, 2020)

Hey guys, I just bought Cycles for a new film project and am loving the sounds. But, it crushes my Mac Pro 4,1 8 core. I've been looking to update my system anyways.

Is anyone using this on a Mac Pro 6,1 (trashcan) 12 core? How's the performance? I've been debating between that and the iMac i9 8 core.


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## Welldone (Feb 14, 2020)

slateandash said:


> 'Granular Loop Reconstruction' is the first in a series of videos exploring different approaches to using Cycles to create and shape sounds.




@slate + ash: Thanks for this Video! It's really helpful to me to see what Cycles can do that my other granular Tools can't. 

Frankly said, I was hoping that some more of These walkthrough videoes would be published before the end of the intro Price period. It seems also a bit strange to me that some of the questions in this thread (mine about the flute video and another one about polyphonic playing) are not yet answered. 

Another question: When does the intro price end? Your site says 2/21, this thread states 2/17?


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## slateandash (Feb 14, 2020)

Welldone said:


> @slate + ash: Thanks for this Video! It's really helpful to me to see what Cycles can do that my other granular Tools can't.
> 
> Frankly said, I was hoping that some more of These walkthrough videoes would be published before the end of the intro Price period. It seems also a bit strange to me that some of the questions in this thread (mine about the flute video and another one about polyphonic playing) are not yet answered.
> 
> Another question: When does the intro price end? Your site says 2/21, this thread states 2/17?




Perfect timing that we have another video out today then!



And yes, we have extended the intro period until the end of next week, have adjusted the thread title now.

Re the flute video, I think pretty much everything is made using Cycles apart from the beat and bassline. Not sure exactly what the process was as it was done by a user, not us.


Please bear in mind we are a very small team of three (with one away at the moment) working on an update for cycles, tech support, educational content and marketing, alongside our own personal commissions/projects. VI-C is only one of our channels to keep up to date on alongside numerous comments, requests and questions on facebook, instagram, twitter and a few other forums.

We try to keep up to date on everything but things can get missed!

P.S There will be more educational videos soon...



midiman said:


> @slateandash Is it possible to play harmony with Cycles? Or that depends upon the loop that is being used? are there some presets that would allow me to lay down a chord structure or is it mainly devoted to creating textures? Are there some presets that would allow for creating chords?



Yes, there are poly modes you can use with both the loops and grains engines. It depends on the source material and how you are using it as to how suitable it will be to perform polyphonically, but there are lots of nice presets that can be used playing multiple notes.


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## Welldone (Feb 14, 2020)

Thanks a lot for your helpful reply! I appreciate it.


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## Niah2 (Feb 15, 2020)

Can you also load your own samples into the engine is AURAS or is it just a feature that comes with CYCLES?

Thank you


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## slateandash (Feb 16, 2020)

Niah2 said:


> Can you also load your own samples into the engine is AURAS or is it just a feature that comes with CYCLES?
> 
> Thank you


Just cycles as the moment.


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## isu89 (Feb 18, 2020)

Two questions, is there an evaluation/demo available? Is it possible to re-sell my license in the future (or is there any transfer fees or other obstacles); thanks. Looks very interesting but with a higher price it would be helpful to know the answers to these questions


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## barteredbride (Feb 18, 2020)

slateandash said:


> Just cycles _*at the moment*_.



Is this in the pipeline ? 

Or just a figure of speech?


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## slateandash (Feb 20, 2020)

A quick demonstration sampling AURAS into CYCLES Grains engine.







barteredbride said:


> Is this in the pipeline ?
> 
> Or just a figure of speech?


Not directly in the pipeline, but is something we would like to do later in the year...


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## isu89 (Feb 20, 2020)

Just purchased, 20 sec spoken word sample import made me sound like Ken Nordine's Word Jazz


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## duanran007 (Feb 20, 2020)

slateandash said:


> A quick demonstration sampling AURAS into CYCLES Grains engine.



I love every second of this video, just inspiring!
One thing I noticed is the GUI is a little different when import the user sample. Is this from incoming update?


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## Richard Wilkinson (Feb 21, 2020)

Can it do swing/triplets? I've already bought it and it's so, so bloody cool. But triplets & swing would be a really welcome addition, unless it's there already and I haven't found it yet...


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## schmeete (Feb 22, 2020)

slateandash said:


> A quick demonstration sampling AURAS into CYCLES Grains engine.



It's gotta be one of the most inspiring audio sandboxes ever created, and I really mean EVER...
And the interface is half of it, the simplicity that enables such mind boggling deep editing. 🤘


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## slateandash (Feb 24, 2020)

duanran007 said:


> I love every second of this video, just inspiring!
> One thing I noticed is the GUI is a little different when import the user sample. Is this from incoming update?


Yes, it will be in a future update!


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## thebob (Feb 24, 2020)

I waited the very last minute cause you guys like to release exquisite libraries just when I quit or change job with way less incomes..

sadly, all I got with kontakt player when I want to load a patch is "This instrument belongs to a library that is currently not installed", although I installed it in native access and all... mac 10.11, latest kontakt player..
anyone got that ?
bouh :(


edit : found in the FAQ someùthing about it... kontakt can't be uptdated with OS 10.11 is that really it ? I have player 6.04 and I cant' go to 6.2 ?? wonderful, thank you NI, always serving your clients with respect :emoji_angry:


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## motomotomoto (Mar 19, 2020)

slateandash said:


> Yes, it will be in a future update!



After a few hours of playing with this thing I desperately need a detailed walkthrough / tutorial. Does one exist? 

I'm having trouble figuring out how to get cycles that are in a predictable key so I can layer it in with other instruments. Seems like the way I am working it I can't figure out what key the end cycle is in, or perhaps the key is changing over time or non-tonal. Maybe I am missing something basic here.


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## slateandash (Apr 3, 2020)

First review in and its a 10/10 from Music Tech magazine.






Review: Slate + Ash Cycles


The world’s leading media brand at the intersection of music and technology.




www.musictech.net


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## fiction (Apr 27, 2020)

I'm having a hard time with this sampler and can't really figure it out. 

To be honest, It's one of my favourite purchases ever in software and I've been using it a lot in every project. Anything I record from my analog synths or microphones ends up in Cycles and I always get something useful out of it. 

Usually, I bounce stuff and work with the audio once I have something useful going. However, I've been working on some projects that I want/need to keep the various Cycles instances running to modulate all the useful parameters that it has, specially sequencer pattern changing and envelopes/filter. Plus, it's useful to keep the plugin running to take advantage of polyphony and midi sequencing different notes. 

The problem I'm having is the huge tax on my CPU comparing to other plugins/kontakt instruments. I have a 12-Core Xenon W and it's struggling to keep up with various Cycles instances. Anyone in a similar situation? It seems worse when I'm in user sample mode which is basically what I use it for.


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## N.Caffrey (May 22, 2020)

Is it ever going to be on sale or discounted for Auras owner?


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## AdamKmusic (Jun 9, 2020)

Downloaded the update, liking the new sounds in the loops but struggling to tell which are the new presets in some of the sections where there’s quite a lot of presets! Do you have a list of the new content @slateandash ? I saw you posted that the update was out on FB but the post seems to have been removed, was the update released too early?


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## N.Caffrey (Jun 9, 2020)

Update: I got it and love it! My MacBook is struggling so much though, crazy heavy library


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## Monkberry (Jun 12, 2020)

Somebody clear my schedule for the next two months. This thing is a rabbit hole that's hard to climb back out of. The possibilities are endless. Brilliant, just brilliant!! CPU does take a hit. I'm just playing with one Kontakt instrument on an i-9900K / Gigabyte Aorus Master MB with Samsung Evo 860 SSDs & 64GB GSkill Trident memory and CPU is between 25%-40%. Hopefully they can get that a little better optimized with an update but it's an amazing instrument at this point.


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## kev (Jul 21, 2020)

I have a linnstrument coming my way which was the push I needed to get the auras and cycles bundle. I haven't even gotten past the presets in cycles and I have to agree with everyone that this is one of the most amazing and inspirational libraries I've ever purchased. I was a little worried about the cpu hit but it runs just fine on my new 13" i7 macbook pro, about 6-10% per instance. I'm prepared to have my mind blown when I finally get around to importing my own samples, which was the main motivation to get cycles.

One thing that I wish I could do (maybe I can?) is to pitch individual slices, which would open up some creative possibilities in arp or one shot mode.

Bottom line is that all of the praise is not hyperbole. Go and get cycles!!! 

Oh and as amazing as cycles is, I am now even more excited about the new library on the horizon. It will be an instant buy for me based on the teasers posted. Hopefully there will be a discount for auras and cycles owners


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## AdamKmusic (Jul 25, 2020)

I never realised until now but on Cubase if you click quick controls it gives you the options for reverb / delay etc


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## davidson (Aug 5, 2020)

Someone else in the thread asked but wasn't answered - how are you guys going about getting things to sit in key? Say I import a pad sample in F#, how do you set the root?


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## D Halgren (Aug 5, 2020)

davidson said:


> Someone else in the thread asked but wasn't answered - how are you guys going about getting things to sit in key? Say I import a pad sample in F#, how do you set the root?


I'm not in the studio right now, and going from memory, but I believe the root defaults to C2, maybe C1, and then you can change the tuning from there. So, it might be better to import in C if possible, or understand where you are at transposition wise if you bring in a different note/key.


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## davidson (Aug 5, 2020)

D Halgren said:


> I'm not in the studio right now, and going from memory, but I believe the root defaults to C2, maybe C1, and then you can change the tuning from there. So, it might be better to import in C if possible, or understand where you are at transposition wise if you bring in a different note/key.



Cheers, so the tune slider is there for (more or less) this exact reason?


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## D Halgren (Aug 5, 2020)

davidson said:


> Cheers, so the tune slider is there for (more or less) this exact reason?


Yes, I believe so, and for more experimental reasons.


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## D Halgren (Aug 5, 2020)

Just got my 'upgrade' to the Kontakt library version of Auras. Is it just me, or does it sound even better, and is more responsive? Optimisations?


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## D Halgren (Aug 5, 2020)

ka00 said:


> I'm trying to upgrade Auras and am running into a Native Access issue. NA doesn't like the folder I'm pointing it to when locating the library. However, it's named exactly what the library is called (S+A - AURAS v1.0), so I don't know what's wrong. Hmm...


It's v1.1, I had to redownload.


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## AdamKmusic (Aug 6, 2020)

ka00 said:


> I'm trying to upgrade Auras and am running into a Native Access issue. NA doesn't like the folder I'm pointing it to when locating the library. However, it's named exactly what the library is called (S+A - AURAS v1.0), so I don't know what's wrong. Hmm...


Same for me so I just downloaded it, looks like it was updated anyway


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## morphido (Aug 10, 2020)

Latest updates improves CPU performance?


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## rmak (Nov 30, 2020)

Looks like cycles is pretty cpu intensive. I have 2016 MacBook Pro 2.7GHz quad core i7 with 16gb ram. Will I be able to handle this plugin, maybe if I bounce in place every time I come up with something.


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## N.Caffrey (Nov 30, 2020)

rmak said:


> Looks like cycles is pretty cpu intensive. I have 2016 MacBook Pro 2.7GHz quad core i7 with 16gb ram. Will I be able to handle this plugin, maybe if I bounce in place every time I come up with something.



I have a 2013 retina macbook pro, and don't really have problems with many libraries, but this one, more than 3 patches and I can't work with it anymore, I have to freeze or bounce. I've heard of people with really powerful computers struggling too. So be prepared.


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## Rob Elliott (Nov 30, 2020)

I haven't noticed any BF sales on this one. Sound right?


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## rmak (Nov 30, 2020)

Rob Elliott said:


> I haven't noticed any BF sales on this one. Sound right?


 No sales =(


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## rmak (Nov 30, 2020)

N.Caffrey said:


> I have a 2013 retina macbook pro, and don't really have problems with many libraries, but this one, more than 3 patches and I can't work with it anymore, I have to freeze or bounce. I've heard of people with really powerful computers struggling too. So be prepared.



That's helpful. I would be fine running 1 or 2 instances of it to get musical ideas going. It seems really helpful for inspiration, to get something like a loop or texture going.


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## jneebz (Nov 30, 2020)

Definitely a CPU hog. By far, the biggest hog I own, and is very limiting on my 2015 3.3GHz quad-core i5. Upgrading my computer when the new Apple Silicon iMacs come out hopefully next year...so I'm sure that will help.


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## Rob Elliott (Nov 30, 2020)

rmak said:


> No sales =(


It is what it is. I'll hold off for now - until a project 'screams' for it. I have had good fortune with this approach to buying as when that time comes around (project demanded purchase) - there are often eventually 'me-too's' that give me options of which would serve the project best.


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## Jack Weaver (Nov 30, 2020)

jneebz said:


> Definitely a CPU hog. By far, the biggest hog I own, and is very limiting on my 2015 3.3GHz quad-core i5. Upgrading my computer when the new Apple Silicon iMacs come out hopefully next year...so I'm sure that will help.



Same issue here within Logic on a 2019 Mac Pro 16-Core/Catalina/192 GB RAM/m.2 SSD's - often with only one instance. Typically I put it in VEP7 and I have much fewer issues there. 

But c'mon developer guys, you need to address this situation. There must be something you can do to fix this.

I love the product but end up often avoiding using it.

.



Edit - I seldom post complaints about products. With this one, it's because I really, really want to be able to use it more.


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## rmak (Nov 30, 2020)

it looks usable. This guy is using a 2013 iMac I think -  If you change buffer size, maybe it'll run fine unless... you are loading it halfway through a project when you have many tracks open.


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## rmak (Nov 30, 2020)

Rob Elliott said:


> It is what it is. I'll hold off for now - until a project 'screams' for it. I have had good fortune with this approach to buying as when that time comes around (project demanded purchase) - there are often eventually 'me-too's' that give me options of which would serve the project best.


I think they did have a sale on Cycles earlier, but it didn't look like a significant sale. I don't know historically if the company does big sales, like on their Aura for instance. Maybe others in the forum can speak to this.


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## jneebz (Nov 30, 2020)

Jack Weaver said:


> Same issue here within Logic on a 2019 Mac Pro 16-Core/Catalina/192 GB RAM/m.2 SSD's - often with only one instance.


Wow. OK that definitely looks like some code streamlining could be done? Geesh...yeah it's one of my all-time best-sounding plugs but often skip it due to the fear of it trashing my project. Bummer...


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## AdamKmusic (Nov 30, 2020)

Yeah they don't typically do sales, I think they only recently went on sale as Auras became a Kontakt library instrument.

I think at the moment though, probably ending today, all profits were going to charity (might've only been Friday actually)


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## rmak (Nov 30, 2020)

I spent a good amount of $ this BF, and I am tempted by S+A cycles. I think cycles will facilitate the use and help me take advantage of the plugins I purchased =).. Decisions Decisions.


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## rmak (Dec 1, 2020)

I bought cycles... wish me luck!


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## Guido Pannekoek (Jun 17, 2022)

I just got Cycles, finally, and it is fantastic to play with. You load 3 random presets in Kontakt and see what comes out. I wonder what can be made with it if you dive deep into it.


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