# Really fast repeating notes



## erica-grace (Jan 26, 2019)

Hi

I am trying to find out if this is possible with samples, or if we just are not there yet.

So, I took Mike Verta's "The Race" as a good example. It's about 1:26 sec in, where the 1st and second violins are playing a fast arpeggiated line.



I just took the first two bars - no need to keep going.

Here are three exs with CSS. First, legato, then stac, then measured trems.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/race-leg-mp3.18107/][/AUDIOPLUS]

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/race-stac-mp3.18109/][/AUDIOPLUS]

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/race-mtrem-mp3.18108/][/AUDIOPLUS]


Those all sound pretty bad. Now, this is in no way a knock on the library. It's just that I dont think any library can do this effectively, with individual samples. Or am I wrong?

---


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## BenG (Jan 26, 2019)

This type of quick/nimble legato is imho not possible with samples. (At least convincigly) 

For this stuff, I usually just use a spiccato/staccatissimo patch to get the overall feel I'm looking for. If the piece is going to be recorded live, I'll notate it as originally intended. (With slurs)


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## shireen (Jan 26, 2019)

I think VSL orcherstal strings can do a pretty good job at it. this is a combination of the legato fast patch with the performance repetition spiccatos. very far from the real thing but much close than CSS from what I can hear!

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/vsl-mp3.18110/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## aaronventure (Jan 26, 2019)

Here's a quick take on it. Berlin's Spiccato Blurred (attack 85%) + Spiccato Exposed (attack 50%) + Spiccato (attack 70%).

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/therace-runs-mp3.18112/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## Sopranos (Jan 26, 2019)

aaronventure said:


> Here's a quick take on it. Berlin's Spiccato Blurred (attack 85%) + Spiccato Exposed (attack 50%) + Spiccato (attack 70%).
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/therace-runs-mp3.18112/][/AUDIOPLUS]


This one sounds really good.


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## NoamL (Jan 26, 2019)

It sounds good but it doesn't sound like what Mike wrote. That's on-the-bow staccatos instead of slurred groups of 4 16ths.

CSS can do this just fine. Use Marcato without Spiccato overlay and make sure all notes overlap EXCEPT between slurs.


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## erica-grace (Jan 26, 2019)

shireen said:


> I think VSL orcherstal strings can do a pretty good job at it. this is a combination of the legato fast patch with the performance repetition spiccatos. very far from the real thing but much close than CSS from what I can hear!
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/vsl-mp3.18110/][/AUDIOPLUS]



Not bad, but not quite. Thanks!


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## erica-grace (Jan 26, 2019)

aaronventure said:


> Here's a quick take on it. Berlin's Spiccato Blurred (attack 85%) + Spiccato Exposed (attack 50%) + Spiccato (attack 70%).
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/therace-runs-mp3.18112/][/AUDIOPLUS]



Yikes!!!

Thanks!


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## NoamL (Jan 26, 2019)

Whoops, here's a better version:

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/cssfastslurs-mp3.18114/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## erica-grace (Jan 26, 2019)

NoamL said:


> It sounds good but it doesn't sound like what Mike wrote. That's on-the-bow staccatos instead of slurred groups of 4 16ths.
> 
> CSS can do this just fine. Use Marcato without Spiccato overlay and make sure all notes overlap EXCEPT between slurs.



I didnt think to try marc - I mean, why would marc work? 

Will check that out later. Thanks!


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## erica-grace (Jan 26, 2019)

NoamL said:


> Whoops, here's a better version:
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/cssfastslurs-mp3.18114/][/AUDIOPLUS]



Sounds the same, just lower in volume?


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## NoamL (Jan 26, 2019)

CSS + CSSS + CSB....

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/cinematic-studio-series-the-race-mp3.18117/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## NoamL (Jan 26, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> I mean, why would marc work?



CSS Marcato is secretly just "fast legato"


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Jan 27, 2019)

Thats not easy to replicate..I tried to make a "version" as well with berlin Strings.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/59xrqnfal9aimi4/The_Race_Ostinato.mp3?dl=0


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## Erik (Jan 27, 2019)

Herewith VSL Synchron Violins 1

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/vertarace-sys-mp3.18119/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## Sears Poncho (Jan 27, 2019)

Session Strings Pro 2 and LASS FC

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/ttthm-mp3.18120/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## Sovereign (Jan 27, 2019)

Here's a quick try with Soaring Strings.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/soaring_1-mp3.18122/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## erica-grace (Jan 27, 2019)

Sovereign said:


> Here's a quick try with Soaring Strings.



Sounds ok - too bad you put the horns in there :/


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## erica-grace (Jan 27, 2019)

NoamL said:


> CSS Marcato is secretly just "fast legato"



Ha. Maybe - but when hearing the string in Mike's piece, you wouldn't think that marcato is the way to go.


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## Sovereign (Jan 27, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> Sounds ok - too bad you put the horns in there :/


Well, they hide any flaws.  But here's one with the violins playing solo. nothing layered on top, just the legato patch. Accents are done with slight cc modulation. That said, in terms of (fast) ostinatos that is really one area where most libraries are still lacking IMO.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/soaring_solo-mp3.18123/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## erica-grace (Jan 27, 2019)

Thanks everyone! 

So I guess this really is not doable with samples. You can get the point across, but not convincingly, as Ben pointed out.

We need more phrase libraries.


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## bryla (Jan 27, 2019)

Isn't this something Orchestral String Runs should excel at? I would be curious if someone with OSR can try.


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Jan 27, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> Thanks everyone!
> 
> So I guess this really is not doable with samples. You can get the point across, but not convincingly, as Ben pointed out.
> 
> We need more phrase libraries.



I think its a matter of programming and knowing how to layer and alter patches from default settings. Sure you get not 100 percent there, but you can create a descent version of it. Your examples can be improved a lot by using different techniques.


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## erica-grace (Jan 27, 2019)

bryla said:


> Isn't this something Orchestral String Runs should excel at? I would be curious if someone with OSR can try.



Oh - good idea. I dont have that. Anyone who does, give it a try?


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## Sovereign (Jan 27, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> Thanks everyone!
> 
> So I guess this really is not doable with samples. You can get the point across, but not convincingly, as Ben pointed out.
> 
> We need more phrase libraries.


Not necessarily phrase libraries, but dedicated performance patches I think would be a big step forward.


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## robgb (Jan 27, 2019)

Thought I'd give it a try with the new Amadeus Library:

1. Amadeus Violins Marcato(w/transient shaper)+Amadeus Violins Spiccato(w/Sordino EQ)
2. Amadeus Violins Marcato(w/transient shaper)+Amadeus Violins Spiccato(w/Sordino EQ)+Audio Modeling Solo Violin (w/Strad IR)

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/am-strings-test-mp3.18128/][/AUDIOPLUS]

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/am-strings-test-audio-modeling-mp3.18129/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## Consona (Jan 27, 2019)

Cinematic Studio 2. (With some secret sauce.* )

*I just put a TKT round robin script there to make in more organic (dunno if it's working but I left it enabled ), plus some noise reduction and a little bit of reverb and eq.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/cs2-arpeggio-03-01-mp3.18133/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## Living Fossil (Jan 27, 2019)

Interesting comparisons.
In my opinion, the (old) VSL orchestral strings (as posted by @shireen ) still are the most convincing ones on this task. The other ones either sound very mechanical or deal in a not so nice way with strange tails.


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## robgb (Jan 27, 2019)

Living Fossil said:


> Interesting comparisons.
> In my opinion, the (old) VSL orchestral strings (as posted by @shireen ) still are the most convincing ones on this task. The other ones either sound very mechanical or deal in a not so nice way with strange tails.


I agree. But I do think the Amadeus strings do a pretty damn good job at a tiny fraction of the price. Ironically, I tried the 8Dio Agitato Legato Arps that were allegedly designed for this purpose and they couldn't handle it (or I was using them wrong).


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## Przemek K. (Jan 27, 2019)

Here is a version I did with my custom multi with HS Diamond (Vintage + Close mic)

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/race-hs-diamond-mp3.18135/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## tack (Jan 27, 2019)

Consona said:


> Cinematic Studio 2. (With some secret sauce.* )


Best one so far IMO. Talk about a sample torture test.


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## robgb (Jan 27, 2019)

tack said:


> Best one so far IMO. Talk about a sample torture test.


I love CS2's abilities to handle it. Unfortunately, it sounds a million miles away out of the box.


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## MartinH. (Jan 27, 2019)

I wanna try too:

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/spiccatos-mp3.18139/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## erica-grace (Jan 27, 2019)

MartinH. said:


> I wanna try too:


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## erica-grace (Jan 27, 2019)

Przemek K. said:


> Here is a version I did with my custom multi with HS Diamond (Vintage + Close mic)



Not bad, but it's not slurred enough.


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## erica-grace (Jan 27, 2019)

robgb said:


> Thought I'd give it a try with the new Amadeus Library:



Yikes!!!!


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## Consona (Jan 27, 2019)

tack said:


> Best one so far IMO. Talk about a sample torture test.




Yea, that arpeggio sound from Race is flowing, you can't replicate that with spiccati or staccati alone. Fortunately CS2 has the live mode which transforms short notes into more blurred sound that matches the Race snippet way better than only using legato or short notes, IMO.


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## MartinH. (Jan 27, 2019)

erica-grace said:


>



That bad?


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## Consona (Jan 27, 2019)

MartinH. said:


> That bad?


It sounds nice but nothing like the Race violins.  Listen to that part again. Even CS2 live mode has way stronger attack, I should remake my demo.


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## MartinH. (Jan 27, 2019)

Consona said:


> Listen to that part again. Even CS2 live mode has way stronger attack, I should remake my demo.





Consona said:


> Yea, that arpeggio sound from Race is flowing, you can't replicate that with spiccati or staccati alone.


I think I know what you mean, thanks!


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## Przemek K. (Jan 27, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> Not bad, but it's not slurred enough.



I did reduce the slur so that it doesn't disturb the pronounced notes, so a more slurred version is definitely doable. I guess it depends on what you want to do within such a line, because
always slurred will also sound not convincing. Finding the sweetspot is sometimes a matter of taste or a personal choice. I did listen again to the youtube video and there the repetition line is not slurred or at least not so much at the beginning.
The VSL version also comes close to the original and CSS also sound quite good actually.

Maybe a dedicated patch specifically tailored to cover such lines would be great to have at some point, till than, we will have to be creative with our libraries, and that is sometimes challenging.


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## Sovereign (Jan 27, 2019)

Przemek K. said:


> Here is a version I did with my custom multi with HS Diamond (Vintage + Close mic)
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/race-hs-diamond-mp3.18135/][/AUDIOPLUS]


Which specific HS articulation did you use here?


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## MartinH. (Jan 27, 2019)

Consona said:


> Yea, that arpeggio sound from Race is flowing, you can't replicate that with spiccati or staccati alone. Fortunately CS2 has the live mode which transforms short notes into more blurred sound that matches the Race snippet way better than only using legato or short notes, IMO.



Is this closer?

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/spiccatos2-mp3.18140/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## Przemek K. (Jan 27, 2019)

Sovereign said:


> Which specific HS articulation did you use here?



I created a multi consisting of tight staccatissimo patch and the perf repetition run patch. I also loaded a spiccato patch and exchanged 2 notes to give a bit of more diversity within this line.


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## shawnsingh (Jan 27, 2019)

The original is actually fingered slurs with slightly accented bow change on each quarter note. Maybe that helps people trying to get authentic results? All legato or all spiccato only probably won't cut it, even layering them won't, it probably requires tweaking one articulation on each quarter beat with some agile legato on the other 16ths

I'm not able to be at my computer for a while so won't have a chance to try these possibilities myself. Cheers!


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## robgb (Jan 27, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> Yikes!!!!


To each their own, I guess. I like it.


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## Consona (Jan 27, 2019)

MartinH. said:


> Is this closer?
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/spiccatos2-mp3.18140/][/AUDIOPLUS]


Maybe closer but still so far from it. Don't ask me, listen to the original recording. Or use some youtube converter, download it, put it into your daw so you can compare it while recreating it.


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## WhiteNoiz (Jan 27, 2019)

https://instaud.io/private/f5bf182c66691fa443b608c195072c8bee7f3f2f


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## boxheadboy50 (Jan 28, 2019)

shawnsingh said:


> The original is actually fingered slurs with slightly accented bow change on each quarter note. [...]


You mean half note


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## Architekton (Jan 28, 2019)

This is what happens when people dont know how to program libraries...and when they fail, they instantly write it sounds bad. Learn first, than talk.


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## brenneisen (Jan 28, 2019)

Architekton said:


> This is what happens when people dont know how to program libraries



Sometimes IT IS about the samples, you'd need fast legato transitions and round-robins to sound good doing that line. Not every library has them.

(waiting for your well-programmed entry)


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## erica-grace (Jan 28, 2019)

Architekton said:


> This is what happens when people dont know how to program libraries...and when they fail, they instantly write it sounds bad. Learn first, than talk.



And who was that directed at?


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## BenG (Jan 29, 2019)

The only library I've heard come close to this type of quick, agile legato is Embertone's Friedlander Violin. I know it's not an ensemble/section, but still very impressive nonetheless and a definite step in the right direction...


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## Consona (Jan 29, 2019)

Well, CS2 handles playable runs no problem.


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## BenG (Jan 29, 2019)

Consona said:


> Well, CS2 handles playable runs no problem.




I wouldn't necessarily call this a run and think CS2 would be too 'blurry'. In Mike's piece, the legato figures are really flowing and clearly defined.


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## Karl Feuerstake (Jan 29, 2019)

The bassist at 1:57 makes me smile


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## NoamL (Jan 29, 2019)

This is the weirdest VI-C thread in a long while. 

Slurs and spiccatos are.... not the same thing... at all....


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## Consona (Jan 29, 2019)

BenG said:


> I wouldn't necessarily call this a run and think CS2 would be too 'blurry'. In Mike's piece, the legato figures are really flowing and clearly defined.


Just for the record, you can control the level of blur in CS2. I posted it because your example was nothing like the Race example either, but a kinda general take on faster passages, so something similar to that CS2 video.


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## fixxer49 (Jan 29, 2019)

this type of phrase is possible, but it's a bitch to get it right. *Joshua Bell Violin* can definitely do this type of phrase + *Berlin Strings expansion* (the one with the measured trills) and some other types of tweaking of velocity and note lengths in libraries such as SCS, CSS etc... but you can't just throw up a single patch and hope for the best.
i recently struggled with a similar articulation, a classical pastiche:
https://vi-control.net/community/threads/csss-scs-tears.78200/

(yes, it's much slower than your example, but the concept works for higher tempos)


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## BenG (Jan 29, 2019)

Consona said:


> Just for the record, you can control the level of blur in CS2. I posted it because your example was nothing like the Race example either, but a kinda general take on faster passages, so something similar to that CS2 video.



Ah, was not aware this was controllable! Very cool and will check it out


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## jbuhler (Jan 29, 2019)

fixxer49 said:


> this type of phrase is possible, but it's a bitch to get it right. *Joshua Bell Violin* can definitely do this type of phrase + *Berlin Strings expansion* (the one with the measured trills) and some other types of tweaking of velocity and note lengths in libraries such as SCS, CSS etc...


I tried this in SCS and couldn't get it in the ballpark at this tempo. (I can get a decent spiccato version of it, but not the slurred phrasing.) I would like to hear someone do it and show the programming.


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## erica-grace (Jan 29, 2019)

NoamL said:


> This is the weirdest VI-C thread in a long while.
> 
> Slurs and spiccatos are.... not the same thing... at all....



Ha!


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## boxheadboy50 (Jan 29, 2019)

NoamL said:


> This is the weirdest VI-C thread in a long while.
> 
> Slurs and spiccatos are.... not the same thing... at all....



That was awesome.

Noam, the ones you posted are the most accurate I've heard here (both in actual technique and realism).


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## fixxer49 (Jan 29, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> I tried this in SCS and couldn't get it in the ballpark at this tempo. (I can get a decent spiccato version of it, but not the slurred phrasing.) I would like to hear someone do it and show the programming.


@jbuhler You just have to mix it up with a few different libs. Joshua Bell is great. You can use him as a first chair for each of the two desks. The Berlin FX expansion has measured trills with a big selection of intervals. (The only problem is they only trill UPWARDS.)

SCS is a shit-show – but you can get results by using various short patches (unfortunately it’s a painstaking process to identify which ones, switching midphrase, and adjusting velocities and note lengths.)

@NoamL did the best version by far on this thread. he's got a mix of different things going on.


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## jbuhler (Jan 29, 2019)

fixxer49 said:


> @jbuhler You just have to mix it up with a few different libs. Joshua Bell is great. You can use him as a first chair for each of the two desks. The Berlin FX expansion has measured trills with a big selection of intervals. (The only problem is they only trill UPWARDS.)
> 
> SCS is a shit-show – but you can get results by using various short patches (unfortunately it’s a painstaking process to identify which ones, switching midphrase, and adjusting velocities and note lengths.)
> 
> @NoamL did the best version by far on this thread. he's got a mix of different things going on.


Yes, I agree that @NoamL produced the best one. I was just wondering about SCS in particular, since, I have it, and, yes, my experience was that it was indeed a shitshow on this passage; messing around with various short articulations, whether individually, layered, or mixed, and at different velocities, didn't really help. I did not try adjusting the lengths with the TM patches however.


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## Land of Missing Parts (Jan 29, 2019)

This is from a mock up of The Race I did last summer. It's CSS, marcato legato with overlay.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/the-race-fast-strings-mp3.18182/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## fixxer49 (Jan 29, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> Yes, I agree that @NoamL produced the best one. I was just wondering about SCS in particular, since, I have it, and, yes, my experience was that it was indeed a shitshow on this passage; messing around with various short articulations, whether individually, layered, or mixed, and at different velocities, didn't really help. I did not try adjusting the lengths with the TM patches however.



for SCS: I meant adjusting note lengths of the *sustain patches*, actually (sometimes), even in very fast passages, to simulate legato/slurring. 
I am also superstitious about layering patches from the same library. it's irrational, i know.


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## NoamL (Jan 29, 2019)

Actually I thought @Sovereign 's example with Soaring Strings was the best. Don't own SS yet but I may well get it on the next sale!


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## jbuhler (Jan 29, 2019)

NoamL said:


> Actually I thought @Sovereign 's example with Soaring Strings was the best. Don't own SS yet but I may well get it on the next sale!


I really liked yours and now I'm feeling like I need to get CSS just for passages like these, because all my string libraries failed this test pretty spectacularly.


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## boxheadboy50 (Jan 29, 2019)

NoamL said:


> Actually I thought @Sovereign 's example with Soaring Strings was the best. Don't own SS yet but I may well get it on the next sale!


On re-listening, and cranking the volume, I really like both yours and @Sovereign's best for different reasons.
Sovereign's smoothness between the fingered slurs is super super nice.
Noam, I like the sound of the bowing (because I don't think it's meant to be accented, just the sound of the direction change) on yours.


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## JohnBMears (Jan 29, 2019)

Przemek K. said:


> Here is a version I did with my custom multi with HS Diamond (Vintage + Close mic)
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/race-hs-diamond-mp3.18135/][/AUDIOPLUS]



What would you say the ratio of Close to Vintage Mic was? I love HWS and still am struggling to find the best method to mix microphones.

Great example!


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## JohnBMears (Jan 29, 2019)

Also would a library like Action Strings or Emotive Strings have the appropriate ‘chunks’ to piece together a phrase like this?


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## AlexanderSchiborr (Jan 29, 2019)

Well, as that thread got a bit longer, I wrapped all examples up in one file, normalized them in volume to the original live version and what I did also is that each example has original live version attached before: So live version --> sampled version by member xy, then live version followed by the next member xz so on. I thought to do that _because when a/B directly with normalized volume to the original you can compare it better. _

https://www.dropbox.com/s/dnw3teofagi4oi0/Race_ostianto.wav?dl=0


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## jbuhler (Jan 29, 2019)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> Well, as that thread got a bit longer, I wrapped all examples up in one file, normalized them in volume to the original live version and what I did also is that each example has original live version attached before: So live version --> sampled version by member xy, then live version followed by the next member xz so on. I thought to do that _because when a/B directly with normalized volume to the original you can compare it better. _
> 
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/dnw3teofagi4oi0/Race_ostianto.wav?dl=0


You didn't happen to produce a key, did you?


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## Sovereign (Jan 30, 2019)

JohnBMears said:


> Also would a library like Action Strings or Emotive Strings have the appropriate ‘chunks’ to piece together a phrase like this?


Don't know about Emotive Strings, but Action Strings has really limited building blocks. The pre-recorded phrases, some of which are melodic and some single pitch, are limited in dynamics too. So no, that would not work.


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## Sovereign (Jan 30, 2019)

NoamL said:


> Actually I thought @Sovereign 's example with Soaring Strings was the best. Don't own SS yet but I may well get it on the next sale!


Surprised you don't have it yet.


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## Lassi Tani (Jan 30, 2019)

NoamL said:


> Actually I thought @Sovereign 's example with Soaring Strings was the best.



I agree, but your example was really good too 

I had to try with Soaring Strings too. Of all my string libraries Soaring Strings performed the best I think. Quite a surprise, and shows how good scripting it has. This is just one patch and CC1.

When listening to the original, I noticed that the players don't exactly play the same length for the notes. E.g. the first one is usually a little bit accented, but also longer, and the last 3 notes of the 4 note figures are quieter and shorter. That emphasizes the accent more. I'm not sure if this is true, since I'm not a string player.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/mike-verta-the-race-fast-violins-mp3.18191/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## Przemek K. (Jan 30, 2019)

JohnBMears said:


> What would you say the ratio of Close to Vintage Mic was? I love HWS and still am struggling to find the best method to mix microphones.
> 
> Great example!



There is no ratio, I'd say. It's more like I just mixed in the close mic to the vintage mic till it sounded right to my ears. The original version is less dry than HS, but HS could be mixed in this way to get even more close to the original version. Check your pm, I've sent you some pictures showing settings of my multi.


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## Przemek K. (Jan 30, 2019)

JohnBMears said:


> Also would a library like Action Strings or Emotive Strings have the appropriate ‘chunks’ to piece together a phrase like this?



Probably yes, but I think you would need to create a custom patch from scratch and make it playable to get the best results.


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## JeeTee (Jan 30, 2019)

For what it's worth, here's another Hollywood Strings version -

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/gtraceruns-mp3.18197/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## erica-grace (Jan 30, 2019)

Land of Missing Parts said:


> This is from a mock up of The Race I did last summer. It's CSS, marcato legato with overlay.



That's not slurred.


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## erica-grace (Jan 30, 2019)

sekkosiki said:


> I had to try with Soaring Strings too.



That's not slurred.


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## erica-grace (Jan 30, 2019)

JeeTee said:


> For what it's worth, here's another Hollywood Strings version -



That's pretty good. A bit mechanical, but it's samples after all.


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## Lassi Tani (Jan 30, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> That's not slurred.



Well, as slurred as it can be with Soaring Strings legato patch. 

Does it sound too separated?


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## Land of Missing Parts (Jan 30, 2019)

JeeTee said:


> For what it's worth, here's another Hollywood Strings version -
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/gtraceruns-mp3.18197/][/AUDIOPLUS]


Nice. What patch/settings did you use to get that?

What an informative thread.


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## JeeTee (Jan 30, 2019)

Land of Missing Parts said:


> Nice. What patch/settings did you use to get that?
> 
> What an informative thread.



Its mostly a Legato Slur patch with additional accents from Staccato On Bow and Staccatissimo.
I then added some Rep Runs Script and finally some Trills at low level (for the opening).


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## brenneisen (Jan 30, 2019)

JeeTee said:


> I then added some Rep Runs Script



what's that?


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## Przemek K. (Jan 30, 2019)

brenneisen said:


> what's that?



its a seperate runs patch within HS.


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## Rob (Jan 30, 2019)

I bet Noteperformer could pull this off pretty well


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## boxheadboy50 (Jan 30, 2019)

NoamL said:


> [...]instead of slurred groups of 4 16ths.


Just to be clear for those of us giving this is a shot with our libraries, it's a slurred group of *8* 16ths (watch the vid, you can see her bow changes).


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## Olfirf (Jan 30, 2019)

I like challenges like that! Although everyone with decent ears should be able to hear that NOTHING can really replace a real recording ... but that does not only go for fast lines like this. Everything you play with samples sounds like plastic compared to the real thing. You only need to listen closely enough.
Anyhay, here is my go with Berlin Strings to come close.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/violin-legato-mv-mp3.18203/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## Lassi Tani (Jan 30, 2019)

boxheadboy50 said:


> Just to be clear for those of us giving this is a shot with our libraries, it's a slurred group of *8* 16ths (watch the vid, you can see her bow changes).



In the score, it's 4 16ths.


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## boxheadboy50 (Jan 30, 2019)

sekkosiki said:


> In the score, it's 4 16ths.


I'll be damned! I wonder if Mike changed it at the session or if the violins just played it that way?


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## JohnBMears (Jan 30, 2019)

At that tempo I guess they knew they could manage 8 on a bow.


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## dzilizzi (Jan 30, 2019)

So is the violinist playing it incorrectly?


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## NoamL (Jan 30, 2019)

It's a subtle thing but I think bowing every quarter would be a tiny amount too much emphasis while every half note is just right.

String players do a lot of things without checking with the composer.


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## dzilizzi (Jan 30, 2019)

NoamL said:


> It's a subtle thing but I think bowing every quarter would be a tiny amount too much emphasis while every half note is just right.
> 
> String players do a lot of things without checking with the composer.


I kind of figure the conductor didn't mind the sound.


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## Wallander (Feb 5, 2019)

Rob said:


> I bet Noteperformer could pull this off pretty well


For reference!

https://noteperformer.com/MV%20Race%20Test%20-%20NotePerformer.mp3

Good enough for notation proofing.


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## jaketanner (Feb 5, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> Hi
> 
> I am trying to find out if this is possible with samples, or if we just are not there yet.
> 
> ...





Hi..Quick question. I've taken a few of Mike's classes...and I think I remember him saying that the RACE, went from mockup, to final...So what did Mike do for that part of the mockup? Or was that not covered? Curious, because I've been thinking about taking this class, but I would like to see it from it's inception to finale.


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## boxheadboy50 (Feb 5, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Hi..Quick question. I've taken a few of Mike's classes...and I think I remember him saying that the RACE, went from mockup, to final...So what did Mike do for that part of the mockup? Or was that not covered? Curious, because I've been thinking about taking this class, but I would like to see it from it's inception to finale.


Have you taken "Putting it all Together"? I haven't yet, but Mike himself told me that it goes through the entire piece bar-by-bar, with score. So maybe he'll talk about the mockup as well?

Edit: Sorry, that must be the "this class" you were talking about! Anyway, I would buy that class regardless


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## jaketanner (Feb 5, 2019)

boxheadboy50 said:


> Have you taken "Putting it all Together"? I haven't yet, but Mike himself told me that it goes through the entire piece bar-by-bar, with score. So maybe he'll talk about the mockup as well?
> 
> Edit: Sorry, that must be the "this class" you were talking about! Anyway, I would buy that class regardless



The Race comes from "Putting It All Together" masterclass...it says in the description that it goes through the Vi mockup. Maybe there is a clue there about what he used..or maybe he just got close, knowing that it's going to get replaced anyway. I mean, I think that's the goal anyway, is to get the "idea" across.


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## jaketanner (Feb 5, 2019)

If anyone has this library, I think it would work...Just tried playing it live in standalone with 8Dio's Agitato violas divisi. Patch used is Stong Detache. Seems to be nimble enough to make that work for a mockup for sure.


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## erica-grace (Feb 5, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Hi..Quick question. I've taken a few of Mike's classes...and I think I remember him saying that the RACE, went from mockup, to final...So what did Mike do for that part of the mockup?



Probably doesnt matter. Only he can truly speak to this, but I mean, did he sit there and try to get it realistic as possible? Probably not - he probably didnt worry about it too much, as he knew it would be played live.


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