# Help! Connecting two Macs (one of them as a slave)



## AliciaMusic (May 25, 2020)

Hello,

I’m new here, and happy to have entered this community 

I have a big problem related to workflow. Seriously, I might take my new super MacBook Pro and throw it away, but I won’t… First I want to see if there’s something I could do to fix my problem.

First of all, I’m a full time film composer. I use Logic Pro for midi programming and I work with plenty of huge orchestral sample libraries that I load inside Kontakt - I create one main Kontakt track and I can load up to 16 instruments for each track that I create using auxiliaries - . Sometimes I can have around 70 instruments loaded or more… I work with orchestral templates, so I need to use plenty of instruments.

I’ve always worked with an iMac from 2011, but around 2017 it started giving me problems; it constantly freezed while I was working and it just kept interrupting my workflow, so I decided to get a new machine. I got a MacBook Pro laptop from 2017, 3,1 GHz Intel Core i7 and 16 GB of RAM, but it also gives me the same problems. It constantly freezes while I work, the CPU goes crazy; it doesn’t matter if I change the buffer size or whatever I do. Many times I have to restart the laptop by pressing the start button, it’s terrible. 

I have my sample libraries inside a SSD-M2 external hardrive that I connect via USB-C, I don’t keep my libraries inside the laptop.

I’m not a very techie person, so I know there must be something else I can do to keep this from happening. I’m very frustrated, because I thought that getting this “powerful” machine would prevent this problem, but it doesn’t.

Also mention that I bought a laptop instead of a desktop computer because I travel a lot, so I thought it would be convenient, and given that this laptop is supposed to be a good one, by using an external hardrive I didn’t think I would have such problems.

I’m familiar with Vienna Ensemble Pro and slave computers, but I don’t know very much about it.

So, after this, I wanted to ask some questions. I’m considering going with the possibility of using a slave computer to work, and load my instruments with instances of Vienna Ensemble Pro. It’s something I’m considering to apply for ASAP, since the situation is unsustainable with me with plenty of deadlines.

Maybe my questions are dumb, but as I said I’m not a very techie person… Here they go: I have two computers, the iMac and the MacBook Pro. Could I use one of them as a slave computer of the other? Would this be a possible setup? Having two computers at the moment, I wouldn’t want to spend money on a new PC now.

My MacBook Pro doesn’t have an Ethernet port; I guess I would have to get an adaptor for this, but I also don’t know if there would be another way to connect both.

What would be then a good setup with these two computers?

Any response will be a breath of fresh air. I feel like I threw away my money by getting the MacBookPro 

Thank you very much in advance!


----------



## EgM (May 27, 2020)

Hi there,

If you work with templates of preloaded instruments, you will definitely need more than 16Gb of ram for 70 instruments. I have 64Gb at the moment and it's very easy to max it... 

Probably not something you want to hear but working with a laptop is the last thing I'd wanna work with since I do orchestra music as well. 

If the iMac still works decently and has at least 16Gb you could invest in Vienna Ensemble Pro and connect both to a gigabit ethernet switch (You'll need that USB-C to Ethernet adapter for the macbook) but even at 16Gb + 16Gb it'll still be easy to max cpu or ram on both :/


----------



## musicalweather (May 27, 2020)

I use a MacBook Pro with 16 GB memory as the center of my studio. I use DP. I have a few libraries on that machine -- ones that require midi drag and drop. But most of my libraries, and I have _a lot_, reside on two external PCs which are connected to the Mac via VE Pro. This works very well. Everything runs smoothly and the MacBook Pro has no problem handling the incoming midi and audio, all connected via ethernet.

One thing I could advise is that you use VE Pro even for your MacBook Pro (even if you're not connecting any other machines to it). This will help offload some of the burden on Logic and may make running instruments a little smoother. It did make a difference for me when I first did that. DP was crashing all the time because of too many plugin instruments, and letting VE Pro take over that helped considerably. VE Pro is now cheaper to get in to -- you can pay for a single machine license.

But EgM is right, 16GB + 16 GB is still not a huge amount of memory to handle big templates. I have 32 GB on one PC and 128 GB on the other. 


So, IMO, getting the MacBook Pro was not a waste. But you may need to upgrade your slave machine.


----------



## WandaS (May 29, 2020)

Using USB-C when you could be using Thunderbolt makes little sense to me when you stream huge orchestra Libraries. My External NVMe drive streams at 2500 megs p/s 2x the speed of USB-C gen2.
And yes you should have a lot more RAM. That might help you choking problem. 
Also you might be asking a quad core CPU to do far more than it can handle.
At least a 2018 Mac Mini 6 core i7.


----------



## Jeremy Spencer (Jun 2, 2020)

I also use a MB Pro....2013 i7 16GB. Before you start adding the slave setup, consider modifying your templates. I used a slave for years; but honestly, I got sick of it. I now take a different approach, and that’s by loading up _only _what I’m going to use for a given project. My bigger projects are around 50 tracks, but I try to keep them under 40. The only big resource hogs I have are Hollywood Strings/Brass Gold. And connecting your SSD’s to USB-C is plenty fast, mine are connected to USB-3.

Before you shell out for VEPro (which is still a great tool), try this, you have a nice laptop.

Also, what are you using for an audio interface? This is also a critical component.


----------



## AliciaMusic (Jun 3, 2020)

Hello! Thank you all for your responses. 

I'm using a Focusrite Scarlett 2i4 as my audio interface.

It's a good idea to use just what you need for a specific project. I normally do that, but sometimes when I need to compose for orchestra in an "epic" style with many different colors, I like to have a big pallet of sounds. That's impossible with my workflow right now.

So, I bought VEP7 and set up a template in Logic yesterday (I already had the Vienna Key). It seemed to work perfectly fast... Until I created the strings instance. My MacBook Pro kept crashing all the time... awful. I was loading Kontakt inside the instance, and loading Cinematic Studio Strings plus Cinematic Strings into it (these two libraries always seem to give me trouble, especially CSS). Has anyone had this issue loading Kontakt inside VEP instances?

So I also got an ethernet adaptor for my MBP to connect it with my Imac and use this one as master, and I have a gigabit ethernet cable.

- Will it be enough by connecting them with just the cable, or is it indispensable to connect both to an ethernet hub? How do you do this? (one cable for each computer connected to the hub, etc.)? And what kind of hub would I need - do you know an specific model I could buy-?

- Do you know any manuals or tutorials out there to configure two Macs for a master-slave setup? (There's a lot on configuring Mac-PC, but not so much on connecting Mac to Mac for midi purposes)

- Maybe this is a dumb question, but do I need to have VEP installed on both master and slave? I guess it's just on the slave, but just in case... 

In any case, I'm going to take my MBP to the shop since it's still in guarantee and got an insurance for it. Hopefully I'll have it changed. But right now I have a couple of important deadlines, so I still need it to work...

Thanks sooo much again!


----------



## Jeremy Spencer (Jun 3, 2020)

You can just use an Ethernet cable connected directly to each Mac, no hub needed. You’ll need to manually set your IP addresses.....

MAC Master:

IP Adress: 10.0.5.2
Subnet 255.255.255.0

Leave the other fields blank.

Slave:

IP Adress: 10.0.5.3
Subnet 255.255.255.0

Leave the other fields blank.

Also, you’ll need to start VEPro 64bit Server on each Mac before opening your DAW.

When using VEPro, I only load one instrument per instance when using it in just the MacBook. I just find it easier to set up this way. There are a lot of videos on YouTube that show different methods for setting up and routing.


----------



## Mavros (Apr 18, 2021)

I see that AliciaMusic uses a 2011 iMac and and recent MBP. Do I assume correctly that these machines are running different MacOS versions and also different versions of Logic? Personally I have a MBP running Big Sur with Logic version 10.6.1 and an iMac 2011 running High Sierra with Logic 10.4.8. Is it possible to use these with the MBP as master and iMac as slave?


----------



## Jeremy Spencer (Apr 18, 2021)

Mavros said:


> I see that AliciaMusic uses a 2011 iMac and and recent MBP. Do I assume correctly that these machines are running different MacOS versions and also different versions of Logic? Personally I have a MBP running Big Sur with Logic version 10.6.1 and an iMac 2011 running High Sierra with Logic 10.4.8. Is it possible to use these with the MBP as master and iMac as slave?


If you wanted a slave for hosting VI’s, you could with VEPro, but the versions of VEPro would need to be the same.


----------



## eakwarren (Apr 18, 2021)

*This thread *or *this thread* or *this thread* or *this thread* or *this thread* may be helpful. Searching the forum for *Logic CPU spike* returns 9 pages of results. It’s a pretty common issue, which can be addressed in various ways.


----------



## Dave Connor (Apr 18, 2021)

Don’t forget to assign the number of threads VE Pro will use (in its Preferences.) Leave at least one for your DAW. In Kontakt‘s preferences make sure “multi threading“ is on so it handles that rather than VE Pro. That’s one way a lot of people are setup including myself and it works well.

Edit: Just read that Logic doesn’t like multithreading in Kontakt turned on. That’s probably if you’re hosting Kontakt within Logic as opposed to outside of it in VE Pro. Not sure. The point is that some of these tweaks can make a big difference and often times one or two can make a huge difference in problems that are stopping the show.


----------



## gzapper (Apr 18, 2021)

AliciaMusic said:


> Hello! Thank you all for your responses.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


- No ethernet hub or switch is needed. Just an ethernet cable and a usb-c to ethernet dongle for your macbook

- mac to mac is easier, but make sure you set your slave (we need a new word for that term) to have a static IP address and give it access in system preferences/sharing.

- VEP lives on the 'slave', the master just needs the plugins.


----------



## Kent (Apr 19, 2021)

Dave Connor said:


> Edit: Just read that Logic doesn’t like multithreading in Kontakt turned on. That’s probably if you’re hosting Kontakt within Logic as opposed to outside of it in VE Pro. Not sure. The point is that some of these tweaks can make a big difference and often times one or two can make a huge difference in problems that are stopping the show.


I'm not sure either, but there's an easy fix:

VST Kontakt in VEP
AU Kontakt in Logic

separate settings for each, and ne'er the twain shall meet


----------



## Mavros (Apr 24, 2021)

Just a quick feedback I have all running now VEP Pro on iMac with High Sierra as server (gzapper this is better than slave) and Logic 10.6 on MBP with Big Sur as client (better than master). VEP Pro with 7 instances with min. and max. 16 channels (orchestra instrument sections and long and short articulations for strings and woodwinds). Next would be adding one additional to have long and short for Brass (10 instruments). I didn't touch any default settings of VEP. kmaster, the Midi channels in VEP all use the AU version of the plugin (in my case the standalone BBCSO library which does not use Kontakt).

If you need a different bussing for an instrument you unfortunately need a new instance I found out. All multitimbral channel in Logic get the same bussing even if the do not have the same Midi port.


----------



## ZailSi (May 10, 2021)

Jeremy Spencer said:


> You can just use an Ethernet cable connected directly to each Mac, no hub needed. You’ll need to manually set your IP addresses.....
> 
> MAC Master:
> 
> ...



Jeremy Spencer, I have been using this same set up with my 2 MacPro. No hub, just connected directly with an Ethernet cable and set up both machines like you said.

Now I am going to add another MacPro (2 slaves and 1 master) my question is, do I need a switch to connect all 3 machines? Can I connect them via Ethernet using both ports on the Macs? I am not using them for anything else, no internet or other networks, so both Ethernet ports on all three machines are available.

I have zero knowledge in computer networking, so I am a bit lost.

If I do need a switch, any Gigabit switch will do?

Will any of these work?:

Linksys LGS108
Netgear GS105GE / GS308
TP-Link TL-SG108 / LS108G
D-Link DGS-108

I believe since I am only going to use this network with VEPro7 (no internet) an unmanaged switch is good enough. Correct me if I am wrong!

Many thanks!​


----------



## Jeremy Spencer (May 10, 2021)

ZailSi said:


> Jeremy Spencer, I have been using this same set up with my 2 MacPro. No hub, just connected directly with an Ethernet cable and set up both machines like you said.
> 
> Now I am going to add another MacPro (2 slaves and 1 master) my question is, do I need a switch to connect all 3 machines? Can I connect them via Ethernet using both ports on the Macs? I am not using them for anything else, no internet or other networks, so I both Ethernet ports on all three machines are available.
> 
> ...


Hi! I honestly can’t answer your question, as I’ve only ever used a single slave (connected like yours). I recommend pinging @Ben from VSL, he’s a guru with this stuff.


----------



## Ben (May 10, 2021)

It should also work without a switch, but you might need to set up different subnets in order to get everything working. I've never tried such a setup myself and subnet setup is not so easily explained in a few lines...
The easiest solution imo is to get a switch. Any gigabit switch should work - but you should manually set the IP addresses of each system.


----------



## Mavros (May 11, 2021)

you can use one of your old routers mentioned to connect master and both servers with LAN cables. Configure a small LAN subnet manually. I use subnet mask 255.255.255.0 with master MBP 10.0.0.10 and 10.0.0.20 and 10.0.0.30 for the server IP addresses. The servers both need a VEP key. The master only needs one if you also want to connect instruments on your MBP using VEP (so 3 VEP servers) rather than plug them in directly into Logic. I experimented with this mainly to configure and test the VEP templates for the servers on my MBP while underway. You can just copy the finished VEP files with all instances to your servers and connect to them without modifications. When you push the VEP plugin in Logic in a track with upto 16 output channels, you will see your two servers with all instances you have loaded using the VEP files.

With Macs all machines in the VEP LANnet can keep their WAN connection at the same time.


----------



## ZailSi (May 11, 2021)

Jeremy Spencer said:


> Hi! I honestly can’t answer your question, as I’ve only ever used a single slave (connected like yours). I recommend pinging @Ben from VSL, he’s a guru with this stuff.





Ben said:


> It should also work without a switch, but you might need to set up different subnets in order to get everything working. I've never tried such a setup myself and subnet setup is not so easily explained in a few lines...
> The easiest solution imo is to get a switch. Any gigabit switch should work - but you should manually set the IP addresses of each system.





Mavros said:


> you can use one of your old routers mentioned to connect master and both servers with LAN cables. Configure a small LAN subnet manually. I use subnet mask 255.255.255.0 with master MBP 10.0.0.10 and 10.0.0.20 and 10.0.0.30 for the server IP addresses. The servers both need a VEP key. The master only needs one if you also want to connect instruments on your MBP using VEP (so 3 VEP servers) rather than plug them in directly into Logic. I experimented with this mainly to configure and test the VEP templates for the servers on my MBP while underway. You can just copy the finished VEP files with all instances to your servers and connect to them without modifications. When you push the VEP plugin in Logic in a track with upto 16 output channels, you will see your two servers with all instances you have loaded using the VEP files.
> 
> With Macs all machines in the VEP LANnet can keep their WAN connection at the same time.


Many thanks guys!


----------



## ZailSi (May 26, 2021)

If it may help anyone, I got the TP-Link LS108G switch and connected all 3 MacPro to it with 3 Cat6 cable. VEPro runs smooth on the 2 slaves and was very easy and hassle free to do. I manually set up the Subnet of the new machine so it matched those of the other two machines and the IP Adress as shown next:

Settings:

MAC Master:

IP Adress: 10.0.5.2
Subnet 255.255.255.0

Leave the other fields blank.

Slave 1:

IP Adress: 10.0.5.3
Subnet 255.255.255.0

Leave the other fields blank.

Slave 3:

IP Adress: 10.0.5.4
Subnet 255.255.255.0

Leave the other fields blank.

VEPro is AMAZING!


----------

