# Vi-Control's Collaborative Learning Project 10: Adventure Theme



## Darthmorphling (Jan 17, 2014)

*Submissions:*

*GrimeBrett*
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F131406362&secret_url=false[/flash] 
https://soundcloud.com/grimebrett/adventure-theme

*cAudio*
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F132051473&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/caudio-1/the-birch-2nd-ver

*ModalRealist*
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F132502475&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/modalrealist/vi- ... venture-v1

*mscottweber*
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F132591060&secret_url=false[/flash] 
https://soundcloud.com/michaelwebermusi ... urney-home

*David Chappell*
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F133445179&secret_url=false[/flash]

*constaneum*
*Two Submissions*



Project 9 had the largest number of submissions out of any of these projects. Let's try and beat that number.

This time we will be composing an adventure theme. It is up to you to decide what that means. Fantasy, sci-fi, fedora wearing PhD,... 

No other real requirements for this one, other than to make it fun. Also convince another composer to submit a piece as well.

Deadline will be February 2nd.

Don


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## GrimeBrett (Jan 25, 2014)

OK. I guess I'll go first. We've had some pretty nasty weather here in Ohio, and the many school delays and cancellations have allowed me time to finish early. :D 

I look forward to hearing your critiques. My main focus with this track was to get Piano in Blue and KFL percussion to mix well with Albion. I'm a complete noob when it comes to EQ and reverbs, so let me know if you have any suggestions. 

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F131406362&secret_url=false[/flash] 

https://soundcloud.com/grimebrett/adventure-theme

Libraries used:
Spitfire Albion I Redux
Cinesamples Piano in Blue
NI Kontakt Factory Library Percussion
Composed in Cubase 7

I can't wait to hear the other submissions!

Brett


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## Darthmorphling (Jan 26, 2014)

I've only listened to this on my phones speakers so won't comment on anything sound wise, but it has a very Copland feel to it.

I wasn't sure about it at first, but then I envisioned a cattle drive scene in an older western movie and it was perfect.

Will do a more thorough critique once I listen to it with real speakers.

Nice writing!


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## Darthmorphling (Jan 27, 2014)

After listening to it on better speakers, it still has that old western/Copland feel. You have a lot of stuff going on and the orchestration seems solid.

My only critique would be that the strings playing the melody seem a bit buried underneath the mix.

Nice work!


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## cAudio (Jan 28, 2014)

Hi,
here's my submission. I found it really hard to make a adventure theme, so this is what I ended up with..
I've listened to your piece Grimebrett, it sounds great! I will post some comments soon.

Cheers

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F131888479&secret_url=false[/flash]

https://soundcloud.com/caudio-1/the-birch

Libraries:

Spitfire Albion Redux
Spitfire solostrings
NI Kontakt factory library (percussion, marimba, glockenspiel, harp)
NI Giant
Pocket Blakus Cello

Composed in Logic X


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## mscottweber (Jan 28, 2014)

I'm still pretty new to orchestral composing/sequencing, and adventure music especially is a sound I have not had much luck with. I think I might force myself to submit something


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## mscottweber (Jan 29, 2014)

*GrimeBrett:*
Great piece! It does indeed have that Copeland/Americana thing going on which is perfect for adventure music. The brass sounds great in the intro, and I like the strings melody a lot. Also, the change in chords and texture when the B section comes in is really beautiful!
A couple minor things I noticed:
First, there is this awkward volume jump in the sustained note of the strings melody. Albion 1 is my main orchestral library as well, so I am very familiar with that particular hiccup in the Hi Strings Legato; its the bane of my existence sometimes!
Second, I'm not completely sold on the piano sound. Later on in the piece, as more instruments pile up, it does a nice job of sitting back and not taking up too much space. However, when it first enters at around 0:23 as a counter-melody to the strings it is barely audible at all. I don't know if another piano VI would work better or not, it may just come down to raising the piano's volume for that particular spot by just a little bit.
All in all, though, a very well written and well sequenced/mixed track. NICE job of blending KFL percussion with Albion. That is no small feat... 

*cAudio:*
Very cool track! A bit on the mellow side, but I can still picture it as an adventure theme. I love how the woodwinds apear to have the melody right at the start, but then the strings take it over around 0:17 and expand upon it. Its very subtle and does a nice job of blurring the distinction between Intro and A Section (I'm not sure if that's how you wrote it and intended it to sound, but thats what it sounds like to me and I like it!  ). Over all, its a great mix; everything has its own place and nothing seems to be fighting with anything else sonically. That being said, some of the percussion... OK, mainly the glockenspiel, sound far too _forward_ in the soundstage for a _real_ orchestral recording. But I've never been one to get up in arms about that kind of stuff. This ISN'T a real orchestral recording. And it sounds good!
My two gripes with the track: First, I feel like the ending happens quite abruptly. Maybe if the A Section (which is down to a lighter instrumentation with solo cello melody) were to repeat again and go back to a more full sound FIRST, then go to the big ending? I dunno, just a thought.
Second, there is something weird going on with the suspended cymbal rolls. When the rolls reach their climax it sounds like they are getting cut off or something, its a bit jarring. Maybe some of the samples weren't loading right when you rendered it?

A GREAT first two submission, hope to hear some more!


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## cAudio (Jan 29, 2014)

Grimebrett:

As I mentioned earlier, I think this is a great track! I like the phrasing of the strings melody a lot. There is also a lot going on underneath the melody without things getting in the way of each other. I’m impressed with the rhythmic precision in the strings. Thats something I find hard to do with Albion. The piece overall has a great rhytmic drive to it. Beside it being a great track I think it’s mixed well and has a nice sound, and I love the ending! Good work!

Chris


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## cAudio (Jan 29, 2014)

@mscottweber:

Thank you very much for listening and for your comments! Actually everything you pointed out was things I had noticed myself not being right. Regarding the percussion, I find it difficult to get a good sound out of the Kontakt Library percussion. 
I have made a new version where I've used the cymbals and cymbal rolls from Albion instead. I have also extended the last A-section and brought the glockenspiel a bit down.
Thanks again for the feedback! Looking forward to hear yours and everybody else's tracks!

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F132051473&secret_url=false[/flash]

https://soundcloud.com/caudio-1/the-birch-2nd-ver


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## Darthmorphling (Jan 29, 2014)

@cAudio

The piece doesn't sound like a traditional adventure theme, but it does have an adventure feel to it. More like a kid's movie where the group sets out on their adventure.

I really think the second version fixed the problems inherent in the first. It is very well written. If I had to find a critique it would be the solo cello part. It sounds good on its own, but it seems a bit out of place in the piece. That being said, if this was to a picture, Then the cello part would be a good change if something sad happened during the adventure.


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## cAudio (Jan 30, 2014)

Darthmorphling @ Wed Jan 29 said:


> @cAudio
> 
> The piece doesn't sound like a traditional adventure theme, but it does have an adventure feel to it. More like a kid's movie where the group sets out on their adventure.
> 
> I really think the second version fixed the problems inherent in the first. It is very well written. If I had to find a critique it would be the solo cello part. It sounds good on its own, but it seems a bit out of place in the piece. That being said, if this was to a picture, Then the cello part would be a good change if something sad happened during the adventure.



Thanks for the feedback Darthmorphling! 
I agree its not a typical adventure theme :D 
I also tend to reach for the cello as a solo instrument because I think it sounds okay, but I see what you mean about it being out of place in this context.


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## ModalRealist (Feb 1, 2014)

Here's my submission. I actually wrote this tune when I was still at school. Found the dodgy score last week and thought it would make a good subject for reworking in this CLP.

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F132502475&secret_url=false[/flash]

Non-flash link: https://soundcloud.com/modalrealist/vi- ... venture-v1

Libraries used: Hollywood Strings Gold, Hollywood Brass Gold, Hollywood Orchestral Woodwinds Gold, QL Spaces, with timpani from Spitfire Percussion.

I shall post feedback as soon as I have had some sleep. This thing kept me up all night! Suffice to say everyone else is sounding rather good, as per usual.


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## mscottweber (Feb 1, 2014)

Here's my submission, "A Hero's Journey Home"

I anxiously await your feedback!

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F132591060&secret_url=false[/flash] 

https://soundcloud.com/michaelwebermusi ... urney-home

Spitfire's Albion 1 Redux
Embertone's Jubal Flute
Kontakt Factory Library
XLN's Addictive Grand Piano
Cocko's Reaper


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## ModalRealist (Feb 2, 2014)

Okay, so critiques for those who have posted so far!

@GrimeBrett: I really liked the gently driving brass that permeates this piece. I felt it was the star of this mockup, and very effective qua the adventure brief. I also liked the woodwind section 35) very much - very convincing sound and well written. I was less convinced by its brass counterpart (1:05-1:30). The transition back into the main theme at 1:30 onwards was very good. The dramatic break at ~1:57 was cool, although I wanted it a) to have a slightly better defined entrance, although the entrance could do with having slightly more attack perhaps, and b) the final note with the underlying cymbal didn't feel like a sufficient resolution to the piece. I thought the Piano in Blue was mixed just fine. The percussion wasn't poorly mixed with Albion, but it left me a bit cold, out of all the sound in there (especially that last cymbal). Finally, the melodic strings during the main theme sections had a few issues (volume bump, etc. as mscottweber noted). Actually, more than the programming, I think they just sound a little "thin" next to that brass. Nevertheless, a great piece that hit the brief absolutely dead-centre.

@cAudio: I listened to your second version. Enjoyed it very much. A "lighter" adventure to be sure, but no less scintillating for it. I really liked the inclusion of the Blakus Pocket Cello here, though with a caveat. Namely, that the cello does not by any means "sit" in the mix as if it were sat there amidst the Albion sections, or even on the soloist podium. Rather, it comes "across the bows" of the mix. However I find the effect of this here to be very satisfying. It sounds more like an instrument that has been playing in another part of the soundtrack, and which thereby carries some symbolism or association with it, that suddenly erupts - gently! - into this more driving piece. So, I think as mixed it works wonderfully, but not in terms of being "in the same room" as Albion.

@mscottweber: I absolutely loved the Jubal Flute. Goodness me it's beautiful! And here it has such a wonderful melody. Absolutely delightful. And at ~0:57... that little surprise... mmm, loved it. The rest of the piece works rather well, but never quite returns to the glorious heights of that flute. However, it seemed rather well-executed to my ears. My only major complaint is the finale, where the percussion remains at a static dynamic while the strings faded out. While there is nothing wrong with that per se, I felt the drums were so static volume-wise that it rather gave the game away, so to speak. Either the drums need a diminuendo, or the strings need to maintain a little more volume (at the moment they effectively fade out entirely). As a final note, I should add that I really did like the introduction (everything up to the flute). While being relatively "laid back" and more "underscore" in a way, it was still very musical and compelling to listen to.

So yes, in conclusion: very nice work from all. Makes mine look horrifically slapdash by all accounts. Looking forward to seeing more entries hopefully! Will leave feedback for them too, of course.

Cheers,

Alex


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## Darthmorphling (Feb 3, 2014)

@mscottweber and ModalRealist

I have listened to your pieces a couple of times now, but want to give a couple more listens before commenting on them. Like what I am hearing though.

I am behind schedule on this one but will get a submission in.


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## mscottweber (Feb 6, 2014)

@Modalrealist

Thanks for the kind words! I picked up Embertone's Jubal Flute a while back on a whim, and this is the first time I've really gotten to put it to good use. Its a wonderful instrument! And I completely agree about the pseudo-fadeout at the ending. I'll play around with it a bit and see whether it works better fading the drums as well, or keeping everything full volume till the end hit.

I'll write a review for your piece soon. I've listened to it a couple of times, but I haven't gotten a chance to really sit down and analyze it. It definitely has some cool stuff going on in it, though!


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## mscottweber (Feb 6, 2014)

@Darthmorphling I just realized that your avatar has the Reaper symbol on his chest.

Awesome! 

I look forward to your track!


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## Darthmorphling (Feb 6, 2014)

Yes I am a Reaper fanboy. Everyonce in a while I contemplate switching to Cubase, but then I realize that as of now, Reaper does everything I need it to do, and it does so quite well.

I look forward to hearing my piece as well :mrgreen: 

It seems like life is getting in the way though.

Here is my latest setback that seems to be fixed, but not sure yet. Still have to install all of of my software again.

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=36690


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## Darthmorphling (Feb 6, 2014)

All submissions have been put in the first post. I apologize for the lateness with everything going on with this project, but life has a way of doing that to a person at times.


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## David Chappell (Feb 6, 2014)

Here's my submission for this one:

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F133445179&secret_url=false[/flash]

please excuse the lateness, between uni finals and the first track I was going to submit simply not working... delay ensued 

I'll get back with feedbacks soon :D


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## ModalRealist (Feb 8, 2014)

@DavidChappell: Haha! Lovely, lovely piece; one can hear Alan Menken's shadow here, I think! The composition and the mockup are really great to my ears, and a lot of fun to listen to. There are just a few minor points. 

Firstly, the final section of the piece, from 02:00 onwards, while having a well-programmed violin melody and horns, suffers from its accompaniment. The chords underneath feel rather flat and lifeless. I think this could be partly the actual orchestration here, or it might be the programming. Assuming you want to keep the chords as-is, then perhaps have them programmed at a slightly lower, more recessed dynamic, with a greater swell. But since they go on for a while, be careful with the swells: avoid the swells being too similar, since this too can often be a giveaway, to my ears (unless it is clearly an intentioned effect).

Secondly, the solo winds earlier in the piece feel like they might need just slightly more breathing time! Specifically, the soloist at 00:40 onwards feels like he has unnaturally large lungs. For example: from 01:01 to 01:20 it sounds a little like he takes no breath. A potential solution: in the five-note phrases of melody, consider breaking the line just ever so, ever so briefly at the end of the fifth note (the long one). Not every time necessarily, but at least sometimes. At the moment, it rather seems like the guy at 00:40 onwards never stops for breath at all! It still sounds beautiful, because the programming is sublime, but it rather spoils an otherwise wonderful illusion. At least, it does for me - but as a sometime wind player I might be over sensitive? I do think it'd be very hard to achieve the sound as it currently exists in the mockup.

But, overall, just wonderful music. Please, please let us know what libraries you used here! I would love to know!

Cheers!


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## David Chappell (Feb 10, 2014)

righto, i've had a few days to listen to everyone's submissions so i'll give my feedbacks now.

@GrimeBrett
Nice track! I love the main melody, it reminds me of the sort of music they have in disney parks. very nice and energetic! I also love the chord progressions used, being major but still using chords from the minor is a favourite of mine, and perfect for adventure tracks. I'm not entirely sold on the strings - what (if anything) were you doing to get them to sit in the mix? It sounds to me like there was a pretty big boost in the highs, but in any case it sound a bit too airy. I love the little slow bit at 0:35, and it leads brilliantly back into the main melody. The brass sounds really good at around 1:05. I’m not entirely convinced on the ending, but maybe that’s just due to my particular dislike for dissonance. Overall though, great track. Definitely gave the sense of adventure.

@cAudio
I love the melody in this. I also really like the background accompaniment. There’s a lot going on but it’s not distractingly so and gives a really nice texture for the melody to sit on. The slower part at 0:50 is really good, the strings sound excellent. I didn’t expect the solo cello. I’m not sure if that’s a good or bad thing, but I did think it was a little random to bring in the solo cello for such a short phrase and then go back to the strings for the end part. I think a bit of solo wind, maybe clarinet w/ horn countermelody would have fitted better, but that’s just me. You do seem to be a fan of the solo cello so I can see why you went for it! 

@ModalRealist
A very good melody here, great sound from the cellos too. I like the background texture at 0:25 ish, plenty going on but at the same time not detracting from the melody. The dynamic swells on the horns at about 0:55 seem a bit extreme; I didn’t expect them to go quite so loud. I’m not very fond of having both the same melody in parallel between the violins and basses/celli, I feel as if a countermelody in the bass part would have suited better and allowed for more interesting chords progression. The trumpets shorts sound a little too loud and abrupt to my ears. The ending makes for a very good build up – and at this higher overall dynamic level the trumpet shorts don’t seem quite as harsh. I would have preferred a big, tutti, ff chord to end with, but, overall a very good piece!

@mscotweber
I second ModalRealist, the Jubal Flute sound magnificent here. I must pick it up sometime! Great track in general, with solid composition and mock-up all round. I love the change of mood at 0:36, it’s a great background accompaniment and the Jubal Flute is just the cherry on the top. Gorgeous melody it gets, too. The strings following this sound good, but I think if they were doubled with something they would sound more defined. I like the change at 1:20, good use of percussion and a good adventureish rhythm, if you can call it that. I like the ritardando at 1:53, however I think the part proceeding should have just gone straight to the brass chords as the part with just low strings and timpni don’t really serve any purpose in the overall structure. I love the big brass, almost fanfare-like ending. Great work!


Aaand finally, in response to ModalRealist’s critique:
Thank you very much for your comment  Both are valid issues that I have been working on lately. The accompaniment likely sounds dull as I didn’t consider the importance of having individually defined lines for the strings/ low brass. As is they’re just block whole notes playing a single voice in a stacked, unmoving chord. Something I need to work on. I did add a subtle break to the winds at the end of each long note. I think it was about a 1/8th note in length, so not very long, and I think in the process of adding reverb it was blurred to the point that it’s indistinguishable as a pause.

As to the libraries used: Cinematic Strings 2, Cinebrass Core, Cinewinds Pro, and EWQLSO Gold for the harp, piccolo and percussion.


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## constaneum (Feb 12, 2014)

Here's my entrance. Basically a past work which i did for fun in a personal album for X'mas. 

"Snowboarding Lesson"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6e_O2h8pxg

Libraries used are EWQLSO Gold, Real Guitar 3 & Goliath


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## constaneum (Feb 12, 2014)

Yikes !! DIdn't realise the deadline for submission. >.<


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## mscottweber (Feb 12, 2014)

OK, here the rest of my comments 

*ModalRealist*
I love the horn that comes in around :24, and the stacatto oboe (?) playing at :30 sounds really nice with it. In general, _everything_ sounds really nice; melodically the piece is very interesting, and it does a lot of subtle things harmonically and structurally that are really great. But something about the track seems a bit stagnant to me. I think its mostly due to the instrument performances. The melody lines always sound nice and musical, but a lot of the accompanying instrument parts sound very rigid and un-human, most noticably in the strings. Im certainly no master with orchestration and I've only been mocking up orchestral music on the computer for under a year, but (if you didn't already do it this way) maybe try to actually play in each part instead of importing the midi data. I bet it might help the parts to flow a bit better. 
Its a really nice track, though, and it does an excellent job of capturing the adventure spirit!

*David Chappell*
A really beautiful track, both compositionally and production-wise! 
I do agree with Modal Realist's point about the winds needing a bit more breathing room durring their solo lines in the beginning. Its certainly only a minor qualm, and then only if you ever plan on having the piece performed live. As a finished product it does not sound weird or stand out at all (maybe just to musicians/wind players :D ). I enjoyed the fact that the piece never really got too big. Even in its big ending it still felt a bit constrained, which is nice; I know, personally, when I write a piece of music I am alwasy compelled to get to the extremes in either direction, and sometimes that is too much dynamic change for one piece of music.

*constaneum*
Certainly a different direction than the other compositions. Its cool to hear something with a bit more of a pop influence to it. I love the fact that it has a nice strong intro! I think my favorite spot in the track, though, is right at 1:10 where the orchestration thins out a bit; the strings/piano playing that repeated line in the higher register leaves a lot of room for the actively moving bass line to shine through. If I was to have any complaint about this piece, it would just be that all of the insturments sound a bit too "synthy", but I think thats a compositional/artistic choice and not the result of poor quality samples with poor programming. In fact the track wouldn't work as well, IMO, with more "realistic" sounding orchestral instruments. SOOO maybe disregard that last statement...
All in all, its a well-done track. I'm not convinced that it would fit in an adventure scene :? but its a great piece all the same!


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## constaneum (Feb 12, 2014)

LOL !! Guess different people have different approach. I was trying something different from the "typical adventure" tune. It's a little adventure for a kiddo who's taking up his first snowboarding experience.

Anyway, here's another of my past works for more adventurous piece which is a fan tribute music to Final Fantasy Tactics game. Music style wise, I'm trying to mimic Hitoshi Sakimoto. 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eo5e8ymWJwI


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## Darthmorphling (Feb 14, 2014)

@ModalRealist

Yours is the most traditional adventurish sounding to my ears. I am listening to it and it seems like it would fit into "How to Train Your Dragon". It doesn't have the orchestration that Powell uses, but the feel of the piece, in several places, kept making me think of movie. 

From about :33 to :48 I feel that the horn line needs a bit more movement. Even just adding a slight counter melody underneath it would help. I really like the piece and how you kept revisiting different motifs throughout.

@constaneum

The seems perfectly suited for a xmas movie. I actually picture kids running through town as everyone is getting ready for the holidays. And yes they pass by some kids snowboarding.

The only thing that stands out for me is the chord progression at around :21. It sounds a bit like "La Bamba". It is a very common progression so there is nothing wrong with using it, but I was thinking it and one of my students said the same thing. It works in the piece very well, just wanted to point that out.

@mscottweber
Your piece sounds like it belongs in a movie set in a kingdom. Not sure if I can explain why, but that’s what popped in my head while listening to it. The flute gives a sort of a small village vibe. Maybe the village is outside of the castle.
Lots of good motifs throughout and the orchestration seems solid. The sustained brass note that comes in around 1:22 seems off to me. Like it may be out of key by only a few semitones.

@David Chappell

Your work just gets better and better with each piece. The piece seems to have more of grand epic feel, not trailer epic, but old school epic. There are several different sections that I think could be fleshed out into seperate pieces.

The flutes sound good to my ears, but I'm not a wind player so they might have to be adjusted for live players. As a guitar player I can pick out sampled guitar quite easily so I understand what the others are saying.

@Everyone

I have my work cut out for me as all of the pieces are really great! I have report cards finished, my computer seems to be working fine. Still not sure what caused my machine not to boot. Eveyone seems to be getting healthy at home again. I started fleshing out some ideas last night so this weekend I will get a piece done.


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