# Logic Pro X: Bouncing outputs with speaker correction



## Raindog (Nov 9, 2017)

Dear Logic affinados,
I have changed from Cubase to Logic a while ago as I much prefer Logic´s workflow. There is one Thing though I don´t like in Logic which is the output and monitor management.
To come to my problem: I have 2 stereo output channels (as my audio interface has 2 stereo outputs). I can bounce these outputs when I have finished the mixing state. I like Logic´s bouncing concept as I can bounce to different output formats (such as mp3 for emailing the mix to a friend or bouncing to aiff for further treatment of my singer who lives abroad) at the same time. The problem is that I have applied eithere a speaker or headphone correction plugin to both output channels and as I´m getting old I sometimes forget to deactivate them before bouncing :-( 

Is there a way to have an aux stereo channel that I use to mix the project, then route the aux-channel to 2 output channels with different corrections (one for the loudspeakers, one for the headphone) at the same time and then bounce the aux channel instead of the output channel (as the aux channel has all the mixing plugins but not the Speaker correction)? In Cubase it was easy as monitor channels and output channels could be treated independently.

Sorry if my description sounds a bit complicated but maybe you understand my Problem despite my poor description
Thanks for your help
Raindog


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## mc_deli (Nov 9, 2017)

Audio Hijack is a good utility for this. It can host plug ins, lots of routing options, really easy to place between Logic and interface. 

I use it to host Sonarworks after Logic's output. I switch between monitor/headphone correction in the Sonarworks plug in becuase both are from the same interface output. But you can use Audio Hijack to run two parallel plugins to separate interface outputs in your case.


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## Raindog (Nov 9, 2017)

Sounds like a good idea (that´s exactly what I need to do, as I´m using Sonarworks as well). I´ll give it a try
Thanks very much
Raindog


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## jcrosby (Nov 9, 2017)

Have you tried systemwide? The previous version wasn't great, but the new release is much more CPU efficient and it let you apply your SW reference curve with accidentally exporting through it.


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## Raindog (Nov 9, 2017)

Good idea. I could use Systemwide but there would be only one stereo output available (which I could use for the monitors). I would prefer to have two output pairs one for the monitor (+correction) and one for the headphones (+ correction). I think it could work with hijack pro (I have just upgraded my old version) but I can´t make it work.

Dear mc_deli: Can you post how you have routed the outputs? I have uploaded a screenshot of my setting. Thanks for your help.
Best regards
Raindog


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## mc_deli (Nov 9, 2017)

Click to open each Focusrite block in Hijack and you should be able to select which individual physical outputs.

At least with my Babyface I get a window pop up with a dropdown of available outs. I can change from default to eg 1+2 for mains and 3+4 for headphones. Of course it depends what outputs you have and are using with the Focusrite. Is that what you mean?


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## Raindog (Nov 9, 2017)

Hi mc-deli,
thanks for you trying to help me out. I defined "Instant on Sound Effects" as my Logic output (set within preferences). I can choose my available inputs 1-8 within the Focusrite blocks. Then I route these inputs to the respective outputs within my Focusrite software. I can´t see a mistake here. Any other suggestions?
Thanks very much for your help. Highly appreciated.
Raindog


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## mc_deli (Nov 9, 2017)

What is "Instant on sound effects"?
What's not working?

(I used the "system audio" at the start of the chain and not the Logic app module)
(There is a big button at the bottom left of the Hijack window that is the "on" button - in addition to each module's on/off slider)


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## Raindog (Nov 9, 2017)

mc_deli said:


> What is "Instant on sound effects"?
> What's not working?
> 
> (I used the "system audio" at the start of the chain and not the Logic app module)
> (There is a big button at the bottom left of the Hijack window that is the "on" button - in addition to each module's on/off slider)



Hi Mc,
you´re a genius. I switched to system output within Logic and left the Logic app as a sound source within audio hijack.
Now I start Hijack and activate the session. Voila, Logic does automatically start and everything is fine. I only have one master bus left with all the mastering effects applied and don´t have to worry about the bouncing as the monitor and headphone correction are both done outside Logic. And in contrast to using systemwide, there is no significant delay of the output. You saved my day (together with audio hijack)
Best regards
Raindog


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## jcrosby (Nov 10, 2017)

I had no idea you could do this with Audio Hjack. I might just hijack this idea


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## jamwerks (Nov 10, 2017)

After thinking about it for a while, was wondering why you would want to bounce audio with a correction of your own room?


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## Raindog (Nov 10, 2017)

jamwerks said:


> After thinking about it for a while, was wondering why you would want to bounce audio with a correction of your own room?



Actually this is exactly what I want to avoid  and this thread is all about because when you forget to deactivate the correction during the bouncing process your resulting file will be useless. That´s why I looked for a way to do the correction OUTSIDE Logic. Using Hijack just does this job.
Regards
Raindog


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## Raindog (Nov 10, 2017)

jcrosby said:


> I had no idea you could do this with Audio Hjack. I might just hijack this idea



Audio Hijack is pretty straight forward. I had an old copy, so I could upgrade for 25 $. You can download a trial version and see if it does the job for you. The nice thing is, that when configured correctly, you open Audio Hijack and it automaticely opens Logic for you. Pretty easy. Additionally, you can use the programm to record or redirect every source of audio produced within your computer.
regards
Raindog


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## mc_deli (Nov 10, 2017)

Raindog said:


> Hi Mc, you´re a genius.



The cheque's in the post. And you can call me Deli


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## Raindog (Nov 10, 2017)

Being based in Germany I´ll pay in beers  . It was a pleasure Mr. Deli. You can call me dog 
Regards
Raindog


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## jamwerks (Nov 10, 2017)

Wouldn't it be possible to use a few busses, with the audio correction on the last one, and then bounce the output of the previous buss?


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## mc_deli (Nov 10, 2017)

jamwerks said:


> Wouldn't it be possible to use a few busses, with the audio correction on the last one, and then bounce the output of the previous buss?


Yes. Though I am such an eegit I got constantly confused about whether I had SW on or off when it was in Logic. With SW in AHijack I don't get confused, I can quickly bounce whole project and, maybe the thing I like most is that AHijack is a separate window with a big on-off button. Horses for courses though with this. Systemwide also valid. Other software and solutions are available


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## jamwerks (Nov 10, 2017)

If you can bounce the buss immediately upstream of the one where the audio correction is, then you shouldn't need to disenable anything.


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## Raindog (Nov 10, 2017)

jamwerks said:


> If you can bounce the buss immediately upstream of the one where the audio correction is, then you shouldn't need to disenable anything.


You can, but this is not very convenient in Logic. The major output channels in Logic are designed for bouncing and provide many choices about format and destination etc. You´re right that it can be done using busses but the externalisation of speaker and/or headphone correction is far more elegant and saves some aux busses hence making the mixer much less clustered. Cost me 25 $ but 2 days without food should be enough to compensate the expense 
Regards
Raindog


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## Raindog (Nov 14, 2017)

And as a nice "side effect" you can also configure Kontakt standalone or any other standalone VI to run through AudioHijack using your Speaker compensation (or any other effect plugin) without any latency (whereas "systemwide" still adds some latency (about 60 ms to the output making it impossible to use for live playing). AudioHijack is amazing for musicians.
Best regards
Raindog


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## babylonwaves (Nov 17, 2017)

how much latency does AudioHijack add?


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## Raindog (Nov 17, 2017)

babylonwaves said:


> how much latency does AudioHijack add?


None, at least nothing noticeable (I haven´t measured it though). No problems when when playing Vi live (depending on the host´s buffer size)
Best regards
Raindog


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## babylonwaves (Nov 18, 2017)

Raindog said:


> None, at least nothing noticeable (I haven´t measured it though). No problems when when playing Vi live (depending on the host´s buffer size)
> Best regards
> Raindog


here's the answer from the developer:

"Thanks for following up with us. Ultimately, the latency added when capturing audio from Audio Hijack depends on your session setup, your audio devices' sample rate, and the preference setting in Audio Hijack for latency. In general, though, a basic session running at 44.1 kHz should be about 25ms, and at 96 kHz about 15ms."

a mit more than none i guess ...


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## Raindog (Nov 18, 2017)

babylonwaves said:


> here's the answer from the developer:
> 
> "Thanks for following up with us. Ultimately, the latency added when capturing audio from Audio Hijack depends on your session setup, your audio devices' sample rate, and the preference setting in Audio Hijack for latency. In general, though, a basic session running at 44.1 kHz should be about 25ms, and at 96 kHz about 15ms."
> 
> a mit more than none i guess ...



As I said, I didn´t measure it. But 25 ms sounds definitely too much as 25 ms are quite noticeable when you play VI live. I believe I would have noticed such a latency. In general latencies above 10 ms interfere severely with live playing (at least for me). I have a very fast audio interface though (Focusrite Clarett Pre with a lightning connection). It may be different with a USB interface.

BUT........you can download a trial and test yourself. As I said, it works very well for me even when recording VI live. 

Best regards
Raindog


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## babylonwaves (Nov 18, 2017)

Raindog said:


> As I said, I didn´t measure it. But 25 ms sounds definitely too much as 25 ms are quite noticeable when you play VI live. I believe I would have noticed such a latency. In general latencies above 10 ms interfere severely with live playing (at least for me). I have a very fast audio interface though (Focusrite Clarett Pre with a lightning connection). It may be different with a USB interface.
> 
> BUT........you can download a trial and test yourself. As I said, it works very well for me even when recording VI live.
> 
> ...



hey, i just wanted to share the answer from Rogue Amoeba for those how're interested. i don't question that you hear a latency of 25ms  - i was a bit surprised myself.


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## mc_deli (Nov 19, 2017)

...that's why I like Audio Hijack's big red off button. I have it so I can always see it in the corner of my second screen. It never disappears, which is what happens always happens to plug in windows - because of the way show/hide plug ins works, especially as you can't "lock" Logic's mixer (whinge) and have e.g. buses/output channels as easily viewable as I could in Logic 9 (double whinge), of course if I was better with screen sets... but you get the idea... simple brain - big red button


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## Raindog (Nov 28, 2017)

babylonwaves said:


> hey, i just wanted to share the answer from Rogue Amoeba for those how're interested. i don't question that you hear a latency of 25ms  - i was a bit surprised myself.



I definitely have to correct myself. As you said it DOES add latency (though I would guess it´s less than 25ms). I was mislead as I have a thunderbolt Interface which has much less latency by itsself than my previous interface. So together with this low interface latency, it´s still tolerable. But when I deactivate Audio Hijack using the "red button" like mc_deli suggested I have definitely less latency while playing live. It´s still playable in contrast to using "systemwide" which adds some 60 ms. So altogether: When you want very low latency because you´re playing VI live, deactivate Audio hijack and use your standard interface output without correction. When mixing where latency doesn´t play a role, reactivate audio hijack (which is easy) and you have the Speaker correction as it should be without having it inside the bounce pathway.

Sorry for not having the facts correct before.

regards
Raindog


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## mc_deli (Nov 28, 2017)

Raindog said:


> I definitely have to correct myself. As you said it DOES add latency (though I would guess it´s less than 25ms). I was mislead as I have a thunderbolt Interface which has much less latency by itsself than my previous interface. So together with this low interface latency, it´s still tolerable. But when I deactivate Audio Hijack using the "red button" like mc_deli suggested I have definitely less latency while playing live. It´s still playable in contrast to using "systemwide" which adds some 60 ms. So altogether: When you want very low latency because you´re playing VI live, deactivate Audio hijack and use your standard interface output without correction. When mixing where latency doesn´t play a role, reactivate audio hijack (which is easy) and you have the Speaker correction as it should be without having it inside the bounce pathway.
> 
> Sorry for not having the facts correct before.
> 
> ...


Are you using the new Ref4? If I understand correctly SW are claiming no latency now for the updated Systemwide (?). I just got the Ref4 Studio upgrade so I am eager to check it out. But I think my Logic/RME combo means that Systemwide will mean 60ms latency as previously (and discussed here https://sonarworks.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/community/posts/115002911665-Latency-Issue)


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## Raindog (Nov 28, 2017)

I also upgraded from SW 3 to SW 4. The plugin (SW 4)has no (or close to none) latency but systemwide still has the 60 ms latency (systemwide was included in my studio upgrade, I hadn´t used it before). So maybe it is different for systemwide (still with latency) and the AU/VST plugins (without latency). Or maybe I did something wrong when installing the upgrade.
Best regards
Raindog


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## mc_deli (Dec 1, 2017)

Raindog said:


> I also upgraded from SW 3 to SW 4. The plugin (SW 4)has no (or close to none) latency but systemwide still has the 60 ms latency (systemwide was included in my studio upgrade, I hadn´t used it before). So maybe it is different for systemwide (still with latency) and the AU/VST plugins (without latency). Or maybe I did something wrong when installing the upgrade.
> Best regards
> Raindog


I think that is correct, hence the comments in that link I posted.
I presume the linear phase (max quality) setting still has some latency?


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