# SAURON - The DAW All Media Composers Must Learn???



## christianhenson

Latest Vlog, all about how I use both Logic and Pro Tools in sync throughout my workflow:


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## catibi79

Welcome back Christian!  Good decision.


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## Garry

Welcome back Christian! You have been thoroughly missed, and while I follow your channel religiously, it's great to be able to chat/discuss on here, which is more difficult in other forums. That ice choir is amazing, not just because of its beautiful sound, but because of what it represents: your ingenious ideas (who thinks of recording a Scottish loch!) made freely available for the purpose of stimulating the community. Sooooo good to have you back!


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## artomatic

Yay! Glad to have you back, CH!


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## Saxer

Very nice!


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## AdamKmusic

Hello there


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## KallumS

Glad to see you posting here again


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## N.Caffrey

Glad to see you're back Christian!


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## axb312

Welcome back!


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## Daniel James

Welcome back mate 

-DJ


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## Mornats

Good to have you and Paul back and welcome to Loren


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## funnybear

Welcome back!


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## OleJoergensen

You guys are very generous and inspiring, thank you


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## Loïc D

Very good news.
Welcome back to you & Paul !


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## CT

Definitely glad to see this!


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## Silence-is-Golden

Good you chose to return. Everyone, developer, composer, visitor or otherwise should have a good experience here.
Were all humans first of all !


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## rlundv

Glad to see this! Welcome back


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## KallumS

Silence-is-Golden said:


> Were all humans first of all !



Speak for yourself, I'm a pile of orchestral libraries in a trench-coat.


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## Primary Target

Fantastic news, welcome back CH.


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## tav.one

Happy to see you here again


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## Geoff Grace

A hearty welcome back to both of you! You were missed.

Best,

Geoff


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## gussunkri

Welcome back, and thank you for the fantastic youtube channel!


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## Alex Fraser

Good news for a dreary Friday morning. Dev/composer duel role on a forum must be a difficult line to straddle.


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## MartinH.

Good to have you back! Looking forward to trying the ice choir.


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## Killiard

Yay, welcome back! Just downloading the "Ice Choir" now, thanks.


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## Land of Missing Parts

Musicians helping musicians.


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## TGV

I don't know what happened, and I don't want to know, I'm just happy that one of the most knowledgeable, skilled and experienced people in this sector (re)joined.


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## Jazzy_Joe

Good ole Mike!


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## tack

Welcome back Christian.

I bet that conversation between the three of you would have been very interesting indeed to a fly on the wall.


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## Hannes_F

Respect! This is classy.


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## D Halgren

Good you're back and thanks for the samples. Now I can explore my new genre, Lochstep!


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## thesteelydane

Welcome back. We missed you!


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## christianhenson

Thanks to you all, looking forward to posting some stuff up over the next few days.


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## Akarin

Thanks Christian. It's because of people like you, with your truckload of experience, that people like me keep coming back here.


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## kgdrum

I'm glad to see you back here Christian!
btw it was really nice meeting you & chatting when you had the Spitfire event in NYC a few months ago.


*On a side note as a fellow Parliament Funkadelic fan did you ever find and listen to the Bill Laswell produced cd:
*Funkcronomicon ?*




Best regards
Kenny


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## Mike Greene

This is great! The forum is a better place with Christian and Paul on it

By the way, I edited the first post, since I assume Christian meant Mike _Greene_, rather than Mike _Verta_.


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## whiskers

Yay!

Your content is both inspiring and enlightening/educational, especially to noobs like myself. Glad to have you here (again)!


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## jamwerks

Welcome back chaps!


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## DavidY

It's good to see you back on here, Christian. 

I regularly watch your excellent videos, but the way YouTube's comment system works mean there are now 200 individual sets of comments to look at, with no doubt more to come. 

Someone may make some really interesting comment today on video 182 (whichever one that is) but I'll probably never read it if it's a video I've already watched.

I find a linear forum thread such as this one is a rather easier way to keep track of comments than trying to keep up with everything on Youtube.


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## jneebz

Great news!!!


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## Nmargiotta

Christian! Happy to have you back. You were missed


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## LamaRose

Great to have you both _on board _again. Really appreciate and enjoy your respective youtube vids. Next time a skirmish breaks out, ask yourself: WWCD... What Would Caravaggio Do?


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## Anders Wall

Welcome back! Good to have you here 
Best,
Anders


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## JT

VI-Control just got a bit brighter today. Welcome back!


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## Britpack50

Lovely. Nice one Christian/Paul/Loren. Spitfire is an inspiration.


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## stonzthro

Yay! 
Love both of your video channels - thank you for giving back in so much of your time and thoughtfulness!


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## Garry

Hey Christian, I'm not sure if this is the right place to ask this question (or if it would be considered to break your 'vial of snake oil' rule for this thread?), but perhaps you can redirect me elsewhere if it does...

Anyway, I have a suggestion for a future vlog topic that, whilst it _could_ be answered/demoed using SF products, equally conceivably with any other library, since the library itself isn't the immediate focus (similar to your 'writing for strings' video, for example), which is why I thought the question might satisfy the new 'no snake oil vials' requirement.

So, I've just been playing about with the presets in eDNA Earth, which I really like, but a moment ago it really opened up huge possibilities once I slapped Logic's standard Step FX on it. I was browsing through the Earth presets, looking for something with a glitchy rhythm, and then realized I could just use the external sequencer in Logic. I appreciate others may be thinking, 'yes, of course you can', but for me (and perhaps others?), it immediately transformed the library into new realms of possibilities. Also, I appreciate there is a gate sequencer within Earth itself, but this doesn't have the same impact at all as the step sequencer (unless I'm using it wrong?) - certainly the step sequencer achieved immediately the effect I was after. So, my vlog topic suggestion for you was: what other plugins do you use in your compositions, that can transform and give new life to the sounds we may already have in our libraries, and how do you use them to best effect? Would others find this useful for Christian to cover?

Thanks for considering... off to tickle eDNA again! She loves it!


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## Michael Antrum




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## HeliaVox

YAAAAAAAAASSSSSSSSSSSSSSS


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## blougui

Sure it's more than good to have you back : a nice chap with loadsa of humor, a workholic who more than knows its craft, and a professional who is keen on sharing a good chunk of the said knowledge and who is haring it in an articulate yet never snobish way.
(Remember you always have the "ignore" button if you so wish. The community is not bounded by the naysayers ! )
Cheers,
Erik from the other side of the Channel


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## Ned Bouhalassa

All’s well that ends well, then! Our little community is richer with you in it.


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## JF

Welcome back!


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## christianhenson

Thanks again for all your kind words...

So I'm going on a weird journey which is kind of the opposite of what this forum is about, but I'm investigating making music out of the box, something I haven't done since 1992. In this film I practise a work in progress modular patch with my new non-computer based recording system, and, to be candid I found the experience utterly terrifying...Like, wanted to throw the whole thing in the bin "why put yourself through this stress"?



Next week I hope to finish the patch and to try and mix it properly... but out of the box.

Do any of you ever record anything without a DAW? Tape? Dictaphone? Weird Tascam Thingy? Radar?

Why do you do it?

C.


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## Ryan

Welcome back!


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## Michael Antrum

Christian really needs to upgrade his phone system....


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## Mornats

christianhenson said:


> Do any of you ever record anything without a DAW? Tape? Dictaphone? Weird Tascam Thingy? Radar?


Not quite the same thing but I started this whole VST craziness as a way of helping me with my bass playing (that's my primary instrument) but I record that into my DAW. I also had the idea of buying a hardware synth (Behringer Neutron for the silly low price and good sound) but my experience with VSTs has left me as a post-recording tweaker. It's so easy to go back and tweak midi or re-record a part that being unable to do so feels a little unsettling.

I do have a Tascam Portastudio in the repair shop at the moment. Maybe I should go ahead and record a few tracks on tape to get over my fear.

It's all weird as some of my favourite music comes from recordings that are quite rough and ready and haven't been cleaned up and have that luscious raw quality about them. I think I do just need to hit record on a tape, think f--- it and play.


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## kgdrum

Maybe it's just me being an old f*ck but I got so much more music *completed *before I used A DAW.
The complexity usually has me tweaking ,experimenting & trashing way more than ever actually finishing anything.
The immediacy and simplicity of actually having to capture a moment forced me to produce warts and all.
I hope one day I get comfortable enough with my Daw(DP) midi and the complexity of the DAW environment to finish things more to my satisfaction.


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## Geoff Grace

christianhenson said:


> Do any of you ever record anything without a DAW? Tape? Dictaphone? Weird Tascam Thingy? Radar?
> 
> Why do you do it?.


As a baby boomer, I grew up using some of that gear. I took a modular synthesis class in college; but back then it was simply called a synthesis class, as modular was the main form of synthesis at the time. It was difficult, in part because—as a piano player—I had no prior experience with music technology, other than using a mic, amplifier, and tape deck. I'd go through the effort of wiring things up on the ARP and sometimes get no sound at all. Then, I'd have to trace my signal path until I found my error. Ultimately however, it was a rewarding experience, because it was the first time I ever crafted my own timbres.

When I bought my first synth a few years later to use in a club band, I had a much better idea of how to sculpt a tone—which was a good thing as I had to do it quickly in between songs, because there was no was to save patches back then.

My hat's off to *Christian* and others who learn modular synthesis now, when there are far easier ways to craft sounds. I wouldn't put myself through it again, but I'm glad I learned how to do it way back when.

These days, I greatly appreciate modern conveniences—like having tens (or perhaps hundreds?) of thousands of patches at my disposal and total recall in my DAW sessions. I still look forward with excitement to new advancements in music technology, and I'm happy to work in-the-box as much as possible. The lone exception I can think of is that I still enjoy playing a real piano.

Best,

Geoff


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## Alex Fraser

christianhenson said:


>



Enjoyed my second listen of that track, Christian. I appreciate the "out the box" craft that went into the track too. The complexity boggles my mind.

Also, if you decide to deep sample that piano of yours and release it as Spitfire product, I'll happily throw my sweaty debit card in your direction.
Best - A


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## ironbut

Great to see Paul and Christian back!!!
I've been a fan of the Modular M*****-whatever all along but I haven't really been tempted to "draw my CC in anger" until watching Sandy's Qu-Bit Scanned demo.
Cools stuff!


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## christianhenson

I’m trying to figure out why piano samples made with 12 samples sound better than piano samples made with 88 and I think I have it figured... that’s for next week but this week download my latest piano prototype for free to see what you think:

Here’s how I did it: 

... and this is where the download lives: https://www.pianobook.co.uk/news/2019/2/15/mvp-prototype


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## Loïc D

christianhenson said:


> Do any of you ever record anything without a DAW? Tape? Dictaphone? Weird Tascam Thingy? Radar?


Yup, still got a perfectly working Tascam Portastudio 4 tracks tape recorder.
Ah, the thrill to hit record without editing and wild bouncing...


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## ironbut

One of my hobbies is fooling around with reel to reel tape. I have a collection of pre-recorded tapes that I listen to.
From time to time I record tracks into one of my machines for either tape compression or mangling.
One machine, a Technics RS1500 is modified with wide band 1/2 track heads with an all tube output amp.
The other is an Ampex ATR700 with a variety of headstacks. One is a worn out mono/full track head that makes some great sounds when overdriven.
Between the 2, I can have some Frippertronics/Stockhausen/delay fun but it does take a lot of effort and I haven't done it in a long time.


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## Paul Grymaud

Yeah ! It feels good to be Bach


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## christianhenson

I've also had a lightbulb moment regarding tuning samples down, and why they sound better when you do... 



Someone said that I probably wouldn't experience this effect if the sample is recorded at a higher SR say 96k are they right? I suspect not somehow but don't know why, maybe I'll try it this week to see.

and finally I talk about legal crap:



Have you got any horrors to share?


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## rottoy

christianhenson said:


> I've also had a lightbulb moment regarding tuning samples down, and why they sound better when you do...
> 
> 
> 
> Someone said that I probably wouldn't experience this effect if the sample is recorded at a higher SR say 96k are they right? I suspect not somehow but don't know why, maybe I'll try it this week to see.
> 
> and finally I talk about legal crap:
> 
> 
> 
> Have you got any horrors to share?



What happens if IP freely?


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## christianhenson

New Labs freebie!:



https://www.spitfireaudio.com/labs/

That was a happy day making those samples.

C. x


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## paulthomson

Hi all! I'm a total neophyte when it comes to YT compared with Christian! But I'm going to start popping things up here as I complete them - hope some of them will be of interest to some of you. In the meantime here are a few of my faves so far:


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## Bear Market

paulthomson said:


> Hi all! I'm a total neophyte when it comes to YT compared with Christian! But I'm going to start popping things up here as I complete them - hope some of them will be of interest to some of you. In the meantime here are a few of my faves so far



Hi Paul, 

For what it's worth, your YT videos have been of tremendous value for a composing neophyte like myself! I'm very grateful for the content you are putting out. 

And thanks for teaching me a new word!

All the best!


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## paulthomson

Bear Market said:


> Hi Paul,
> 
> For what it's worth, your YT videos have been of tremendous value for a composing neophyte like myself! I'm very grateful for the content you are putting out.
> 
> And thanks for teaching me a new word!
> 
> All the best!



Thanks Bear and glad they are coming in useful! Maybe we should have a new word of the week..


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## paulthomson

Tongue slightly in cheek - but a few tips in there as well ...


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## boxheadboy50

paulthomson said:


> Tongue slightly in cheek - but a few tips in there as well ...



I know I said this in the comments on YouTube, but for those of you even *considering* picking up Spitfire Studio Woodwinds, you should watch this.
In my opinion this video demonstrates the sound of the library even better than the _official walkthrough_, and it sounds pretty damn good.

Not to mention the whole "how not to use samples" thing which I'm pretty sure was Paul's point in the first place, I guess


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## christianhenson

Loren has done a cracking *newsletter* to celebrate Modular Piano coming out.

Its features a fascinating film with artist Eskmo:


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## christianhenson

For me as a musician pads are like soup, whilst a Heinz tomato will always warm you up, a home made broth will be the one that makes you cry:



What are your fave time stretching apps/plugs/algos? Ok so lots of links to cool stuff down below:

Fore more info on Pianobook go here: https://www.pianobook.co.uk/
That Mandolin sound: https://www.spitfireaudio.com/shop/a-z/mandolin-swarm/
That Marimba: https://www.spitfireaudio.com/shop/a-z/marimba-swarm/
That free "MVP" Piano: https://www.pianobook.co.uk/news/2019/2/15/mvp-prototype
That Olafur Arnalds sample: https://www.spitfireaudio.com/shop/a-z/olafur-arnalds-composer-toolkit/
That free "Triple Felt Piano": https://www.pianobook.co.uk/triplefelt

...and the three mediocre Piano Pads I made today: http://bit.ly/2ThhzAe


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## LinusW

I used my own tools to make two piano pads out of the same sources: https://bit.ly/2HkFNT2
EXS24 (Logic) and NNXT (Reason) formats for now. Easy to map in any other sampler, just set root key, enable loops on all samples and adjust softer attack/release.


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## christianhenson

Here's some cautionary advice about IP:


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## rottoy

christianhenson said:


> For me as a musician pads are like soup, whilst a Heinz tomato will always warm you up, a home made broth will be the one that makes you cry:



I'm fairly certain that I've developed a Pavlovian response to all the food analogies in your vlogs, 
because I always put them on when I'm eating something.


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## LinusW

@christianhenson I'm interested in your comment on paying musicians for sampling right. What's your opinion on studio musicians playing for small rate+royalties or higher rate but no royalties? How much higher is the rate for sampling rights?


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## christianhenson

The rate for sampling is about 3 x scale. I also like to pay soloists doing sample sessions with me a "specialist" rate which is an uplift even further north of that.


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## ironbut

That last newsletter was fantastic! I thought the stuff on Eskmo and Drum and Lace were very inspiring and worth digging deeper into their online assets.
Please thank Loren.


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## redlester

Regarding future "Labs Events" and the like, I realise it will be very awkward regarding staff etc. but if at all possible could any of these be at weekends rather than on midweek evenings, which effectively makes it impractical to attend for anyone who works full time and is based outside of the London area? Or just come and set up a satellite office in Nottingham!


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## christianhenson

Its a very good point and one I will raise with our events co-ordinator... The last time we did an event on a Sunday we had some A-level students as well which was nice.

Here's the latest featuring the talents of Louis, Homay, Oliver and Sandy:


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## paulthomson

Latest from me - everyone knows about using saturation on drums. What about on instrument tracks? Any point considering it?


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## CT

Good timing, Paul. I was just starting to play around with this idea. Thanks!


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## christianhenson

To understand the difficulties that face film makers in making moving pictures helps to "right size" us as media composers so it was a pleasure to have a peak into the craft of being a sound recordist here:


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## christianhenson

I was looking through my old EXS samples 'tother day and realised I've made a sample library for pretty much every job I've done over the last 20 years, here's a quick tour with an insight into how many of the Spitfire libraries evolved:

oh.... and have you heard of "Chopping" on a cello?


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## thesteelydane

Fantastic as always, and very inspiring for an aspiring samplist! I'm actually working on a chopping viola lib, been doing it (and other rhythmic techniques) for years! If you want to see what can be done on a violin check out Casey Driessen, who have taken chopping further than anyone else. And Rushad Eggleston is king of the cello chop!


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## Rodney Money

christianhenson said:


> oh.... and have you heard of "Chopping" on a cello?


I work in Mount Airy, NC aka Mayberry. We all know about chopping around here. Very cool technique!


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## christianhenson

Thanks for the heads up re. choppers.


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## paulthomson

I’m building a studio! Check out the first instalment here. Spoiler alert for ep2 - I’ve changed the patchbay layout already lol!


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## ironbut

Go big or go home!
Fantastic Paul. 
And what a pleasure to be a fly on the wall as you share your thoughts and these wonderful time lapse videos of the actual construction. 
Being a huge fan of tape, I'm glad to see that a Studer will find a home there too.


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## Mike Greene

Wow, that studio looks like it's going to really nice, and I really like your idea of making it a single _"everybody in the same room"_ concept. I'm half-tempted to knock out some walls and do something similar here.

One funny thing as I was watching the video - I'll bet anyone from L.A. watched that and thought, _"They're sure not in Los Angeles where we have to worry about earthquakes!"_ Out here, we have to put tons of steel in the footings, tie the footings to the walls with more steel, then have loads of steel rebar up the walls, and then have all the ceiling joists bolted to the steel in the walls. Oh, to live in a place where earthquakes aren't an issue.


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## paulthomson

Thanks ironbut! The time lapse took some commitment to keep going!

Cheers Mike - I love the sound having space to breathe - one of my many past studios had a small vocal booth and you could never really get a great sound in there.. and yes - the most I have to worry about is being hit by a low flying pheasant...


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## christianhenson

This is very much warts n' all:


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## PaulieDC

christianhenson said:


> This is very much warts n' all:



You asked what we do to take care of ourselves. I knew I needed to get out of that chair every so often and MOVE, but that’s a problem, exercise is not gonna happen, right? Then the answer came, for the price of a good string library...actually can’t wait to get up and move everyday, and I’m definitely feeling better. Problem solved. In orange of course.


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## dzilizzi

christianhenson said:


> This is very much warts n' all:



Okay, that tired me out just watching it. But these are very good points. 

I find a standing desk or at least one that will switch from standing to sitting is good to get me off my butt. It is hard to stand still for long.


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## Geoff Grace

@christianhenson, I realize this video reflects a particularly bad week, and I've seen enough of your videos to realize that your life is often more manageable; but man, you look like a guy who could _really_ use a vacation, or at the very least a few days of solid rest!

Thanks, as always, for your experienced advice. I will certainly consider how I may implement it.

If I may, I'd like to offer some advice in return. You are far from being an "abject failure." If part of you feels that way, I recommend doing more than just siloing the social media. Spend some time considering why this feeling is there. I find meditation helps, but only you can discover what works best for you. I'm a firm believer that each of us has intrinsic value. Certainly, that includes you.

As you wisely recommended, don't be afraid to ask for help if you need it. You are cared for.

Best,

Geoff


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## CT

Christian, from everything I know, you seem to be an absolutely delightful and genuine person, to say nothing of your musical and business achievements. The latter is almost solely responsible for me being able to bring my own music to life in a satisfying, rich way.

I'm definitely in the "you're not an abject failure" camp.


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## erica-grace

paulthomson said:


> I’m building a studio! Check out the first instalment here. Spoiler alert for ep2 - I’ve changed the patchbay layout already lol!




Hey - what happened to the other place?


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## christianhenson

We still have it, LCO 1 was recorded there and most of our tutorials and video features (Ones To Watch). We've converted my room into a live room and it works better than it ever did as a writing room.

My my its interesting to see my first attempts at vlogging, I hope I've come along a little bit from then? Mind you judging by my efforts on my last vlog maybe not so much.


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## Ryan

I've been watching that old Spitfire Audio studio build video so many times over the years. I brought the video series up again last week to check out how you built the floating floor and the walls. I'm about to build a small studio/room at home my self.. All done in 4-5 months. 
Also the video showing the patchbay in PT video is very informative. 

Best
Kai-Anders Ryan


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## WhiteNoiz

christianhenson said:


> This is very much warts n' all:




Very true and important stuff to be reminded of; and very relatable. Thanks for re-iterating it a few times. I've been trying to force myself to go out a bit more and do some light work-out at least for a few mins a day (+ staying better hydrated and avoiding just flat-out ignoring bodily things) and actually doing stuff that leads to something instead of just wasting time. Not just relating to music per se, but spending a lot of time in front of the screen overall (and burning my ears on top). Trying to keep at it (not always successful ).

I feel I'm more productive during the period of 3/4-7 am but it's really not a good time... It probably has to do with it being a "dead" period, so it's just you and your mind so you can focus better, but then again it feels very unhealthy (it being a dead time also means there's nothing really keeping you in check or you're avoiding it). I tend to go in cycles but morning just feels right. Or better for maintaining a routine at least. I recently heard somewhere that one of the first things psychiatrists check is your sleeping schedule (don't quote me on that, I don't remember where, lol). Don't know if it's true or not but it seems logical. I guess it has to do with how "normal" and orderly your life is.

That thing you say about feeling like a failure is probably not a subconscious sign that you're doing what you're doing [very] wrong but that you aren't doing what you should be doing (doing something else entirely). And again that's not really entirely related to music but managing your life and your time. And where you give your attention and balancing/figuring out things, and then doing them properly or optimising the workflow or what have you.

And yes, social media may be important these days (I occasionally go on YouTube binges; big distraction though not entirely pointless) but the way I try to think about it is you need to do stuff to have stuff to show and share.

Btw, I edited out my own version of the video (audio), as some parts were a bit difficult to listen to and focus on:
https://mega.nz/#!wY5mgKpB!HSf_6Ny5MwjtRdpaLwtjUIMWIKPQvwjrD9PWvzwW2kI

It's hopefully easier for someone else too and helpful. Hope you don't mind.

On another note, I use saturation like there's no tomorrow. A lot of stuff still seems very elusive to me but I keep trying... That's life, I guess.


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## erica-grace

Glad to hear the other place is still there.

Paul: when is part 2 coming?


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## christianhenson

Whats your favourite distortion, in or out of the box?


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## Mornats

I'm a bass player and my favourite distortion pedal is the DarkGlass vintage microtubes. They do a vst version of it too although I've not got that.

I've not watched the distortion vid yet, I tend to watch your videos when I'm doing the ironing and I have a massive pile to do this weekend so I'll have a grand old catch up with your channel.


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## Parsifal666

Ohmicide bay-beeee! Just can't stand the gui though.


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## MartinH.

christianhenson said:


> This is very much warts n' all:




Great video, please take care of yourself Christian! And in my book, you're a winner by so many metrics! 
I can relate to how you feel though.




christianhenson said:


> Whats your favourite distortion, in or out of the box?


I like the iconic swedish deathmetal sound that the Boss HM2 shaped, but I never actually use it. Digitally I sometimes use the exciter in Neutron Elements if that counts...


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## christianhenson

Thanks, both I'll have to check out..... did I mention how much this vlog is costing me BTW... all these great gear tips!


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## MOMA

Important video on a serious matter. To take some time off, even when it´s chaos, is a good one. But I would recommend to spend it in some live music environment – may it be the local pub or the opera house. That kind of input can easily be forgotten in our time of rat races. I myself do pop down to Stockholm Philharmonics every Wednesday night and spend some 12 pounds on the cheapest seat, just to drown myself in the real stuff. Inspiring – everytime!

Take care Christian!

MOMA, Stockholm


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## KMA

christianhenson said:


> Whats your favourite distortion, in or out of the box?



You're already using my two faves - Decapitator and Saturn.

SoundToys Radiator is nice too, as are SugarBytes Wow2 and my ancient and beloved OhmBoyz. The last two are a filter and delay respectively, but they have lovely distortion capabilities.


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## MOMA

KMA said:


> You're already using my two faves - Decapitator and Saturn.
> 
> SoundToys Radiator is nice too, as are SugarBytes Wow2 and my ancient and beloved OhmBoyz. The last two are a filter and delay respectively, but they have lovely distortion capabilities.



What is your favourite tweeting on the Saturn? Just trying to find the right sound, and it´s tough! Any advice is genuinely welcomed! 

MOMA


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## givemenoughrope

I have three Ampro film projector PAs from the 40s. Huge coke bottle tubes. Like a caveman ZZtop sound. I think about it 17 times a day.


----------



## MisteR

Ohmicide.


----------



## KMA

MOMA said:


> What is your favourite tweeting on the Saturn? Just trying to find the right sound, and it´s tough! Any advice is genuinely welcomed!
> 
> MOMA



I don't have a particular favourite setting or preset on Saturn. I just try and think about exactly what I want to hear, and then try to learn how to do it. For distortion "styles", I love Warm Tube, Old Tape, Rectify and Smudge (which is kind of a different beast), but they all sound great.

The Modulation section can really take this thing in new directions. Presets are handy here, but that's only because I haven't dug into how to properly use the Modulation section.

What I really love about Saturn is that it's multiband, and I've found it amazingly useful to drive the lows or the highs independently (for example), while leaving the rest untouched.


----------



## MOMA

KMA said:


> I don't have a particular favourite setting or preset on Saturn. I just try and think about exactly what I want to hear, and then try to learn how to do it. For distortion "styles", I love Warm Tube, Old Tape, Rectify and Smudge (which is kind of a different beast), but they all sound great.
> 
> The Modulation section can really take this thing in new directions. Presets are handy here, but that's only because I haven't dug into how to properly use the Modulation section.
> 
> What I really love about Saturn is that it's multiband, and I've found it amazingly useful to drive the lows or the highs independently (for example), while leaving the rest untouched.




Thanks! I´ll have another go in the weekend. The lows and the highs are interesting!

Take care

MOMA


----------



## christianhenson

ITS PIANO DAY TIME TO HEAD OVER TO PIANOBOOK TO SEE OUR HOST OF AMAZING COMMUNITY CREATED PIANOS!!!!!

https://www.pianobook.co.uk/

...and what do YOU think is the best way to mic a piano?


----------



## LinusW

christianhenson said:


> Whats your favourite distortion, in or out of the box?


D16 Devastor, kiloHearts Faturator and Phase Distortion, Softube Saturation Knob, McDSP FutzBox...


----------



## christianhenson

I have another go at making up science as I go along...


----------



## christianhenson

Is this a must-have first analogue synth or an overpriced Moog Taurus?


----------



## Anders Wall

christianhenson said:


> ...and what do YOU think is the best way to mic a piano?
> [/MEDIA]



For uprights.
This.
Ribbons at the sides and a Townsend L22 in stereo in the middle.






Best,
Anders


----------



## MOMA

christianhenson said:


> Is this a must-have first analogue synth or an overpriced Moog Taurus?



Yes! Its the back of that beautiful machine that really gets you going! To open up these amazing filters and just go bananas with just about any sound you like - thats entertainment! 

Thanks as always for a compact show of upmost quality!
MOMA


----------



## christianhenson

Are you allowed to put porn here Anders?


----------



## Anders Wall

christianhenson said:


> Are you allowed to put porn here Anders?


...reading the fine print...
Hmmmm...
Yes...
No.
:O
Hmmmm?!?
...
As long it’s gear..?


/Anders


----------



## dzilizzi

I don't know. Some people find naked mics very seductive.....


----------



## paulthomson

Next stage of the studio build - and a peek inside at the end!


----------



## ironbut

Fantastic!
Bummer about that snow. I bet the roofers couldn't believe it (considering how few rows of slate that were left)!
Still, an enormous amount of work so far (how kind of you to contribute to the local economy).
Can't wait to see what's next!


----------



## paulthomson

Thanks Ironbut!

Yes it was a bit annoying, snow gets in everywhere - such a small gap at the top as well!!

Next ep I’ll show the technical drawings and mock-up of the interior. We will see how that translates to reality over the next few weeks!!

Some interesting questions about electrics as well and lighting.


----------



## christianhenson

...and from one building site to another... an insight into how we start building a Spitfire product, something we hope is going to be very very special:


----------



## ism

christianhenson said:


> ...and from one building site to another... an insight into how we start building a Spitfire product, something we hope is going to be very very special:





Amazing sounds.

I don;t know whats harder to believe - that sample library companies have got me to spend so much money on pianos to date, or that it it’s all but inevitable that I’ll be spending even more in the future.

Can wait for the this library/ libraries to come out.


----------



## jbuhler

ism said:


> Amazing sounds.
> 
> I don;t know whats harder to believe - that sample library companies have got me to spend so much money on pianos to date, or that it it’s all but inevitable that I’ll be spending even more in the future.
> 
> Can wait for the this library/ libraries to come out.


My favorite part of the video is when Christian and Jake were talking about how they don't like to use a lot microphones in a session. Because one thing I very much associate with Spitfire is limited mic positions (though it is true that their recent libraries have often featured fewer mic positions in the basic product).


----------



## ism

In fairness, they seem to have managed to restrict themselves to - what 17, 18? mics in this case? I lost count. That's almost restrained (by some people's standards).

They do sound great though.


----------



## jbuhler

ism said:


> In fairness, they seem to have managed to restrict themselves to - what 17, 18? mics in this case? I lost count. That's almost restrained (by some people's standards).
> 
> They do sound great though.


I agree that they sound great and the examples they played showed how different the mics all sound. I certainly don't begrudge them their mics. I just found the minimalist statement quite amusing...


----------



## erica-grace

paulthomson said:


> Next stage of the studio build - and a peek inside at the end!



Very nice! 

How high are the ceilings? They look sort of low - I thought high ceilings are better for acoustics?


----------



## christianhenson

Yeah, I reckon this library is gonna be annoyingly big (if you want it to be)... There's some shit we did off-cam though which is next level.... never got to the chamois!


----------



## Geoff Grace

I always enjoy watching *Christian*'s product recommendations (admittedly, in part, because he often recommends products I already own  ). Here's his latest video on the subject:



I'd like to second his recommendations of the AKG 414 mic and Dynaudio BM15A monitors. They've served me admirably for years.

Best,

Geoff


----------



## LinusW

@christianhenson Replaced pitch bend with expression yet?


----------



## christianhenson

aw gawd, I'll try that, I'm current using Logics MIDI modifier plugin which is a tasty under the hood thing I didn't know about.

Here's the latest a very interesting talk with Rick with some quite troubling stuff about modern media:


----------



## christianhenson

Roll up roll up, competition time... can you make beauty from a rusty gate?


----------



## paulthomson

After constantly advising that a decent budget mic should be an early purchase I put my money where my mouth is and put a bunch of great mics on test. All these are sub 1k for a pair.


----------



## christianhenson

...and a touch on cyberbullying whilst managing to troll this forum somewhat!


----------



## Geoff Grace

Long before the advent of the Internet, I likened the process of fame to skeet shooting: first, you're flung to great heights; and then people take aim and shoot you down.

Congrats, *Christian*, on this first shot across the bow. Your YouTube channel has arrived. I'm glad you were unscathed. May it always be so. 

(And may the trolls go back to living under bridges, as they did before the Internet.)

Best,

Geoff


----------



## chrisr

Enjoyed the film Christian, thanks. Out of interest just had a quick look at Mel's own youtube videos. Couldn't help but click on one of the songs there titled "Fuckability" (great song title couldn't resist!) by Maria Doyle Kennedy and thought it was a really cracking song actually, anyway...

Interestingly enough in the comments to that video/song, there's just one item which reads:


"Pinned by mel obrien
mel obrien5 days ago (edited)
Had to delete a couple of moronic comments by TROLLS. Paolo Rossi, a coward who hides behind a pseudonym."

Oh the irony!!! - posted just a day or two before Mel's comment to you Christian. I recon if you study prehistoric cave paintings closely enough you'll probably find some pretty dry put-downs in there somewhere.


----------



## christianhenson

Easily the most informative (for a total ignorant like me) interview I've ever conducted...


----------



## Jeremy Gillam

christianhenson said:


> ...and a touch on cyberbullying whilst managing to troll this forum somewhat!



I added this comment on YouTube but wanted to post here too... 

To add to your Paco de Lucía/Concierto de Aranjuez example — Joaquín Rodrigo, that piece's composer, was blind from the age of three and wrote out his compositions in braille. So in a sense he too didn't "read music" in the purely classical sense.


----------



## Geoff Grace

Congratulations, @christianhenson, on your YouTube channel's milestone! As a former marching band drummer, it occurs to me that you may be able to mount your camera to your body—as we did our drums—to avoid aggravating your "really nasty bout of tendonitis" in your left arm.



Here's to your continued success!

Best,

Geoff


----------



## christianhenson

Thanks Geoff... I'm exploring options, just a lighter camera is the answer but sound is always an issue with those.


----------



## Alex Fraser

christianhenson said:


> Thanks Geoff... I'm exploring options, just a lighter camera is the answer but sound is always an issue with those.


I’d be more than happy to take a hit on the sound if it saves your arm, Christian.
I think I speak for most of us.


----------



## christianhenson

Something that changed PT and my lioves:


----------



## christianhenson

I cracked this little nut...


----------



## christianhenson

This is a very sound point, I am procrastinating today so I'll download each library and investigate, maybe a tasty page with a comparison chart also would be nice?


----------



## christianhenson

Here's the latest, a deep dive into the murky world of online royalties:


----------



## jbuhler

“Video unavailable.”


----------



## christianhenson

Its working for me?

May not have fully processed on the server in your area.


----------



## jbuhler

christianhenson said:


> Its working for me?
> 
> May not have fully processed on the server in your area.


Possibly. If it's one of yours it's also not yet visible on your channel here, so you might also check that you didn't accidentally set it to private.


----------



## christianhenson

You're absolutely right.... fixed! thanks J!


----------



## christianhenson

But can you?


----------



## paulthomson

Latest news from the building site! Plus detailed internal plans and 3D mockups..


----------



## ironbut

Another amazing video Paul! Thanks again.
I've been in on a few similar pours covering radiant floors (one was 6k sq/ft over a 4k sq/ft basement) and it always looks kind of scary.
It's good to see that your patience is holding fast. Custom projects walk a fine line schedule wise but it sounds like you're in good hands.
Can't wait to see what's next!


----------



## paulthomson

Thanks Ironbut! Yes its kind of weird how it all settles out to a perfectly smooth flat surface! 

Initial estimates were they'd be finished by Feb - its going to have been about 12 months in total. Will be worth the wait though!


----------



## Alex Fraser

paulthomson said:


> Thanks Ironbut! Yes its kind of weird how it all settles out to a perfectly smooth flat surface!
> 
> Initial estimates were they'd be finished by Feb - its going to have been about 12 months in total. Will be worth the wait though!


I'll second that appreciation. I'm enjoying these build videos immensely. Also, like you say, that beautiful large space is crying out for a grand piano.


----------



## christianhenson

A brief insite into how we go about "milling" sounds at Spitfire:


----------



## mouse

christianhenson said:


> A brief insite into how we go about "milling" sounds at Spitfire:




Does this mean spitfire is now creating some synth based products?


----------



## christianhenson

I've been skirting around this question:


----------



## christianhenson

Two guilty admissions, I never learned to drive and I never learned Kontakt, in this video I fix one of those:


----------



## Divico

christianhenson said:


> Two guilty admissions, I never learned to drive and I never learned Kontakt, in this video I fix one of those:



Beautiful work. Made me jump to kontakt and try it myself. One thing I dont get is, why Kontakts GUI is so small and ugly. Feels like windows 98.


----------



## christianhenson

That is a question for Native Instruments, although I suspect with it being 20 years old (at least) and with hundreds of thousands of users, thousands of developers even the slightest tweak meets with incredible degrees of scrutiny and debate.


----------



## puremusic

Not to divert the thread but how big Kontakt is can depend on your DAW too. In Cubase 10, Kontakt gets resized bigger sized depending on your Windows scaling settings. In Studio One, it's minisized no matter what you set it to, and so far Studio 4.5's HI DPI mode doesn't work properly with it to upsize it -- at least for me. Other setups and other DAWs your mileage may vary.


----------



## christianhenson

As many of you have just or are just about to graduate here are my 10 strategies to improve your chances of success, what would be _your_ 10 strategies?


----------



## CT

As someone who would have graduated an unsettling number of years ago, but never did, I wish you had this channel back then.


----------



## mscp

christianhenson said:


> As many of you have just or are just about to graduate here are my 10 strategies to improve your chances of success, what would be _your_ 10 strategies?




Outstanding wealth of advices Christian.


----------



## JohnG

Christian manages to deliver more usable information in less time than anyone else I know. Plus he's funny.


----------



## ManBitesSound

great videos, thanks


----------



## MrHStudio

JohnG said:


> Christian manages to deliver more usable information in less time than anyone else I know. Plus he's funny.


I agree however it’s becoming a bit of a dog channel and no I dont like cats either


----------



## JohnG

MrHStudio said:


> I agree however it’s becoming a bit of a dog channel and no I dont like cats either



Reptiles?


----------



## MrHStudio

JohnG said:


> Reptiles?


Not so averse as long as they pay their invoices on time


----------



## MarcusD

Spoiling us with great content. Thanks guys


----------



## christianhenson

Here's a real treat a piano recorded in air studios FREEEEEE!


----------



## Alex Fraser

christianhenson said:


> Here's a real treat a piano recorded in air studios FREEEEEE!


_<hyperventilates>_


----------



## bvaughn0402

@christianhenson any chance that amazing Twitch video could be uploaded somewhere?

It was amazing and I never got a chance to finish watching it.


----------



## christianhenson

I think Twitch just deletes them after a couple of weeks, it was more of an experiment.... looking into updating system to make more in future... I think just youtube maybe the way to go.


----------



## Garry

+1 on seeing more videos like that. Also, when that guy sent you a bass line that you incorporated, and then a guitar riff, I think you invented the internet jam right there! Would love to see you make this a thing.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

christianhenson said:


> I think Twitch just deletes them after a couple of weeks, it was more of an experiment.... looking into updating system to make more in future... I think just youtube maybe the way to go.


Saving them locally to upload to YouTube or elsewhere is a good idea. You can also keep Twitch from auto-deleting your past videos if you remember to save it as a Highlight after finishing the broadcast.


----------



## christianhenson

Here's us making some instruments from weather:


----------



## LinusW

Rusty Gates 2.0? Everybody, make patches out of it!


----------



## CT

I have a handful of EXS24 instruments that I've made over the last few years using methods similar to this. This inspired me to make another one.

My source audio (wind, birds, etc.) is mostly extracted from old iPhone videos. It's not the greatest quality to start with, but I'm glad I at least have those to draw from. It's been a funny way of coping with homesickness until I get back to New York.

I love these weirdly lovely instruments that no one else has, and the fact that they're made from the sounds of my home.


----------



## KallumS

christianhenson said:


> Here's us making some instruments from weather:




A fellow pluviophile?


----------



## Michel Simons

KallumS said:


> A fellow pluviophile?



No need to call people names.


----------



## christianhenson

I know!, VI-C back to its old ways (googles pluviophile)...

Here's a bunch of nutters, gonna DL their suite and see what I can come up with, whilst the monster plugin may be fun I reckon that analysis tool trigger thing could be an amazing way of programming rhythms?


----------



## ism

Now I really want a library of rain, recorded in AIR.


----------



## mouse

christianhenson said:


> I know!, VI-C back to its old ways (googles pluviophile)...
> 
> Here's a bunch of nutters, gonna DL their suite and see what I can come up with, whilst the monster plugin may be fun I reckon that analysis tool trigger thing could be an amazing way of programming rhythms?




How do you think you might program rhythms with it?


----------



## KallumS

christianhenson said:


> I know!, VI-C back to its old ways (googles pluviophile)...




Nothing nefarious, dear Christian. A pluviophile is simply someone who takes comfort in the sound of rain


----------



## christianhenson

We get a bit deeper with our piano sampling!


----------



## paulthomson

Part 4 of the studio build!


----------



## ironbut

Love the beams and stone wall!
I built some wall panels/sound treatment that I covered with fabric and it was surprisingly forgiving. I just made sure to "black out" the supporting wooden frames with some black landscaping fabric so no matter what the lighting was like, you won't see the outlines of the frames (also painted the outside edges of the frames a color close to the insulation they are filled with (6 inches of Roxul).


----------



## christianhenson

HAPPY MAKE MUSIC DAY!!!


----------



## rhizomusicosmos

christianhenson said:


> HAPPY MAKE MUSIC DAY!!!


Thanks, Christian. Your posts are always inspirational. How was Shibuya?


----------



## christianhenson

I finally go and commit career suicide:


----------



## ProfoundSilence

life of a hack hahaha

it's why I didn't have an interest in it. But your message is important for young composers - so they don't bankrupt themselves to only realize that they hate the one thing they need to do the job.


----------



## christianhenson

What would yours be?


----------



## Fredeke

A few years ago, I had this:





but now my studio isn't portable anymore - the van died on me after years of service.


----------



## givemenoughrope

I just started using my wife’s old MBA. Couldn’t get C10 to run on Mojave so I loaded up Logic with the idea that I’ll sketch and export midi a tempo map and markers. I’m using Ultrabeat, Sculpture, whatever the worst piano or rhodes sound it comes with, Zebra, Diva in sketch mode, Reaktor, Kontakt (aiming to load 16bit LASS) and VCV rack. I use a KMI Qunexus. My kid smacks it, throws it and barfs on it and it still works fine. Sketching w meh sounds (or great sounds to be printed later) is fun. No interface. Sometimes earbuds, mostly the laptop speakers.


----------



## Soundhound

Christian do you tend to just write on headphones when you're traveling? I notice there are no speakers in your travel kit. Planes/trains/automobiles for sure, but how about hotel rooms etc? I'm starting to do that more and more I find...


----------



## Garlu

christianhenson said:


> What would yours be?



Very nice one, Christian! 

Finalising details on my portable rig:
- Mac mini 64gb ram, 6 core, 2tb ssd (+14tb ssd external)
- NUC i7 32gb ram, 4 core, 5tb ssd (internal). Waiting on a BIOS update to install 64gb. There is an intel model that already accepts it, mine is a gigabyte.
- iPad Pro 13 (thinking on getting a slim usbc 15 4k one for extra monitor).
- bluetooth foldable full size typing keyboard (with numeric pad) + mouse
- Roli Songwriter kit
- Apogee one + Sony wh-1000mk3 (or Audio Technica’s ATM 50’s, it depends).
- Macbook pro i7, 4 core, 16gb for office work. (Not always, as needed, the ipad often does the job too).
- Sometimes I carry with me a korg nanokontrol too. (Faders on touch block part of the roli moves in “steps” because of the “holed” texture, which is a bit annoying...)

It does need external power, although I am trying to figure out a way to have one of the portable TSA approved powerbanks. 

Not as portable as yours, and more heavy for sure, but, I can carry all that on my hand luggage and travel overseas with my full rig, which is what I need. I might take a few ideas from your setup, thanks for sharing!!!


----------



## dzilizzi

Garlu said:


> Very nice one, Christian!
> 
> Finalising details on my portable rig:
> - Mac mini 64gb ram, 6 core, 2tb ssd (+14tb ssd external)
> - NUC i7 32gb ram, 4 core, 5tb ssd (internal). Waiting on a BIOS update to install 64gb. There is an intel model that already accepts it, mine is a gigabyte.
> - iPad Pro 13 (thinking on getting a slim usbc 15 4k one for extra monitor).
> - bluetooth foldable full size typing keyboard (with numeric pad) + mouse
> - Roli Songwriter kit
> - Apogee one + Sony wh-1000mk3 (or Audio Technica’s ATM 50’s, it depends).
> - Macbook pro i7, 4 core, 16gb for office work. (Not always, as needed, the ipad often does the job too).
> - Sometimes I carry with me a korg nanokontrol too. (Faders on touch block part of the roli moves in “steps” because of the “holed” texture, which is a bit annoying...)
> 
> It does need external power, although I am trying to figure out a way to have one of the portable TSA approved powerbanks.
> 
> Not as portable as yours, and more heavy for sure, but, I can carry all that on my hand luggage and travel overseas with my full rig, which is what I need. I might take a few ideas from your setup, thanks for sharing!!!


Are you using the iPad as a monitor for your Mac mini or did I miss something. Because that sounds interesting.


----------



## Garlu

dzilizzi said:


> Are you using the iPad as a monitor for your Mac mini or did I miss something. Because that sounds interesting.


Yes, using Duet. Great option! 
There is another alternative called Luna. 
It seems like the new Catalina OS has that feature built in, so, no need of 3rd party apps for such function! 

Hope it helps!


----------



## dzilizzi

Garlu said:


> Yes, using Duet. Great option!
> There is another alternative called Luna.
> It seems like the new Catalina OS has that feature built in, so, no need of 3rd party apps for such function!
> 
> Hope it helps!


Thank you! That is great. I always thought a mac mini would make a great portable option (for use in a hotel room - I drive a lot when I travel) but couldn't figure out the monitor aspect.


----------



## christianhenson

Did I make up the Roxy Music thing (so definitely did) or can you find piano and pads that go back further?


----------



## christianhenson

How we made LABS:


----------



## dzilizzi

Love the Labs. And didn't even mind that I paid £3 for each of them the first time around. It all went to a good cause.


----------



## paulthomson

The latest - just a quick one - from the studio build. 

Next week is tech install so that will be chunky!


----------



## ironbut

Looks fantastic Paul!
I love the blue/gray look and the "real" plaster is so much nicer than textured drywall mud. 
Exciting days ahead!


----------



## jononotbono

christianhenson said:


> How we made LABS:




Such an amazing achievement and such an amazing thing to do! Thank you!


----------



## christianhenson

A fascinating insight into a fascinating limited edition bit of tech:


----------



## christianhenson

...what do you think are the most important facets, attributes or indeed qualifications to becoming a media composer?


----------



## christianhenson

Next up, a catch up with Pianobook:


----------



## christianhenson

I think I'm In Love....


----------



## christianhenson

Do you have a favoured hardware sequencer?


----------



## stixman

For me it's the mighty Cirklon


----------



## christianhenson

Do you have any thoughts on creating the perfect showreel?


----------



## rottoy

No showreel musings, but here's a response.


----------



## paulthomson

Latest from the studio build!


----------



## ironbut

Looks absolutely awesome Paul!
I love all the details you're filming too!
Can almost smell the wood (nice that my brain ignores the solder fumes).


----------



## OleJoergensen

It looks lovely! 
I look forward to see some videos of you working there 
Thank you for sharing!


----------



## christianhenson

Do you think this spells a bad chapter?


----------



## Fredeke

christianhenson said:


> Do you think this spells a bad chapter?



At least twice, I composed a song only to realize later that it was an already existing song, that I happened to love but never learnt to play... until I "composed" it.

This being said, here's another brilliant (and fun) video about the Perry/Flame debacle:
(it also hints that our industry might be being gamed)


[EDIT: Rick Beato did a good one on that subject too.]


----------



## rhizomusicosmos

The intellectual dishonesty of hired-gun expert witnesses in court cases is a real problem. Heavily biased by their fat pay cheques, they will make the most ridiculous claims couched in specialist terminology that is aimed at both impressing and bemusing non-specialist juries.

Forget academic rigour, blind them with science!


----------



## christianhenson

Don't go here unless you're a staggering nerd:


----------



## Geoff Grace

Good reference, *Christian*! I've bookmarked it for the next time I redo my orchestral template.

Thanks for posting this. 

Best,

Geoff


----------



## christianhenson

Chance to win Spitfire big!!!


----------



## christianhenson

As er get closer to the big day I have a right old faff in my studio:


----------



## christianhenson

I'm starting to get a weeeee bit nervous!


----------



## christianhenson

ALL NEW PIANOBOOK COMPETITION?


----------



## christianhenson

What do you prefer?


----------



## christianhenson

Here's my take on the big day!


----------



## AndyP

christianhenson said:


> Here's my take on the big day!



So the beer you drink after the show already shows good taste. It´s Becks, if I see it right.


----------



## Garry

christianhenson said:


> I'm starting to get a weeeee bit nervous!



When you watch this video back now, it seems such an obvious plant to have the sketch of the orchestral arrangement on the desk - I mean, it was on there, in plain sight for about 10 minutes, and I totally missed it! I know someone on here spotted it, but I completely missed it first time around! Genius clue placement! The guys at Spitfire must have a ball thinking about how to leave these little breadcrumbs, leading up to a release!

In fact, do you guys also leave a few deliberately misleading clues, so as to not make your real clues too obvious? The walking to and fro in front of the white board, with what I think was fairly generic text, in retrospect seemed targeted to throw us off the scent just a bit, or am I just paranoid??!!


----------



## christianhenson

Yes... we like to throw a McGuffin in there from time to time


----------



## ptram

christianhenson said:


> McGuffin


And now that I think at it, I’m sure Hitchcock was thinking to a beer when creating this word.

Paolo


----------



## Zero&One

Loved the whole build up personally. I know it's not everyone's cup of tea, but I found it fun. Even if we did suss it out... by pure luck :D


----------



## Garry

christianhenson said:


> Yes... we like to throw a McGuffin in there from time to time


So have there been any obvious clues that we all missed?


----------



## Zero&One

Garry said:


> So have there been any obvious clues that we all missed?



9:09


----------



## christianhenson

No but Jake Jackson is up today to start next instalment of creating the mahoosive templates so keep subsrcibed "ding that bell" if you want more BBC sneakers!

Here's a very odd video:


----------



## Garry

Hi Christian,

Given all of the well-deserved and universally positive praise of Andy Blaney on the BBCSO thread in response to his most recent demo (but actually in response to seemingly every demo he does!), I started to Google him, and found there's surprisingly little to be found, for someone of such obvious and outstanding talent. There's even an Andy Blaney appreciation thread on VI-C here, from 4 years ago, but again, surprisingly little follow up of this elusive genius!

Any chance of a future crib or composer focus - perhaps this would be a good topic as part of the revamp of the Journal you mentioned that you and Paul will be taking over?

Or here's an idea - how about Andy does a walkthrough of his demo, as part of the promo for BBCSO?

*What does the VI-C community think - would this be of interest, if Christian could persuade Andy to do it?? 'Like' if you agree, so that we can count up the votes. *


----------



## christianhenson

I always say Andy Blaney is like Top Gear's Stig of composers.


----------



## Garry

He could do the walkthrough with a motorbike helmet on then?


----------



## Mornats

Garry said:


> He could do the walkthrough with a motorbike helmet on then?



Some say...


----------



## Garry

...Some say, he’s actually the mastermind behind the anti-Brexit protests, and has written a peace anthem, which he plans to release on Oct 31st, that will bring Boris to his knees in repentance and shame. All we know is... they call him the Blaney!


----------



## bvaughn0402

Christian,

Is the thought really that you guys might be sharing actual MIDI files and/or templates with BBC? That would be something of incredible value to me (i.e., hope it is "free" but I would even pay for it).

By the way, any chance you can do another live stream of beginning to end composing like you did several months ago, but save it somewhere? I think that live stream bit the dust because of the platform it was on.

(By the way, I would subscribe/pay to watch you do this on a monthly basis ...)


----------



## christianhenson

Sure, we've all sorts of evidence that long form tutorials and sharing is the way to go.... and yes all sorts of MIDI files being shared.


----------



## Mornats

Something that would interest me would be a tutorial or some tips on how to progress from writing with an ensemble library like Albion One to a library with instrument sections (Studio Strings, SSO etc.). I'd love to jump up to Studio Orchestra but fear that I would just end up playing the sections in an ensemble anyway...


----------



## Garry

christianhenson said:


> Sure, we've all sorts of evidence that long form tutorials and sharing is the way to go.... and yes all sorts of MIDI files being shared.


I feel like it's really important for Spitfire to deliver on this specific aspect of the library. It's hard to say exactly how good the library is until there are more details, (walkthrough, list of articulations, in action videos, etc). But a general feeling on the other thread that's emerging, that I think gathers momentum the longer the wait for more information and the initial excitement of the release begins to dissipate, is 'do I need this, given that I already have x number of string libraries, y woods, z brass & percussion'?). 

I have to admit, in the interim since the announcement, despite huge initial enthusiasm, I've also found myself going through my libraries, and similarly questioning my need for it.

However, the KEY differentiator, as I see it, is the extent to which this becomes a platform for collaboration, education and information sharing, and not just 'yet another library'. If there is any company that I would want to deliver on that, and have confidence of them doing so, it would be Spitfire - for now, I continue to wait with burgeoning anticipation... (but we need feeding soon!!!).


----------



## Garry

The new template was exactly along the lines I was hoping to hear... Thank you, and can't wait to hear more...


----------



## Alex Fraser

Hey Christian - template looks immense, thanks for sharing.
Popped a comment on YT but probably worth adding here re Logic's articulation maps. They're amazing but perhaps a bit of an undertaking. They'd go great with the template. If you want to get the community involved in making them, happy to play a part as I'm sure others will too.
A


----------



## christianhenson

The template births:


----------



## axb312

christianhenson said:


> The template births:



Were there any sounds from the BBC SO in the video? Did a quick scan, couldn't find any... Surprising that we're talking about templates before a walk through..


----------



## Tilt & Flow

axb312 said:


> Were there any sounds from the BBC SO in the video? Did a quick scan, couldn't find any... Surprising that we're talking about templates before a walk through..


I get the impression that it isn’t finished yet. I don’t think we’ll see a walkthrough until close to release.


----------



## christianhenson

Thanks Tilt & Flow, yes you're correct and in addition to that there is something uniques about the approvals process on BBCSO, see here:


----------



## jononotbono

I would love to see a cribs video or a video of Andy Blaney. But only if he is wearing a motor cycle helmet.


----------



## JohnG

jononotbono said:


> I would love to see a cribs video or a video of Andy Blaney. But only if he is wearing a motor cycle helmet.



Andy Blaney ALWAYS wears a motorcycle helmet. Sure, it's tough to sleep like that, but he's ready...always ready....


----------



## redlester

Sorry for a dumb question but this is bugging me.

I'm using Christian & Jake's template skeleton which I'm customising for the Spitfire Symphonic libraries, partly as a learning curve as I've never used templates before.

I notice that if I open a project based on their original file using New From Template, in the Logic title bar above the Control Bar it says: "Untitled - CH JJ Template 1.8 Stripped - Tracks".

I've saved mine as a Template called "Spitfire Symphonic Orchestra", but when I open a new project from it via the New From Template command it still says at the top: "Untitled - CH JJ Template 1.8 Stripped - Tracks". Even though it does incorporate all the changes I've made.

If I use the File>Open command instead of New From Template, it then says "Spitfire Symphonic Orchestra - CH JJ Template 1.8 Stripped - Tracks".

Am all for Christian and Jake's hard work being recognised, but why when I've renamed it does it still mention the original file name? I must be misunderstanding something about how Logic saves or uses templates?

EDIT: OK, sussed this now. The answer is the Project Alternatives function.


----------



## chillbot

What does the winner of the hike get?


----------



## Mornats

chillbot said:


> What does the winner of the hike get?



To the top.


----------



## D Halgren

chillbot said:


> What does the winner of the hike get?


3 extra dynamic layers


----------



## CT

And a custom built desk with complete N-integration (Ntegration™) and Round Robin.


----------



## Geoff Grace

chillbot said:


> What does the winner of the hike get?


The gift list is announced during the last minute of this song:



Best,

Geoff


----------



## christianhenson

Can you make good samples with a crappy mic?


----------



## Kent

christianhenson said:


> Can you make good samples with a crappy mic?



reminds me of these real gems:


----------



## Loïc D

Hmmm not sure, but I sure can make crappy samples with good mic. I’ve got proofs of it.


----------



## christianhenson

So you have the crumhorn too?


----------



## Kuusniemi

I personally think that the best recorder/microphone is the one you have available at all times. I've recorded excellent stuff with expensive mics and I've recorded excellent stuff with a phone. What really matters is what you plan to do with the samples afterwards.


----------



## GNP

LowweeK said:


> Hmmm not sure, but I sure can make crappy samples with good mic. I’ve got proofs of it.



Hahaha nicely played


----------



## christianhenson

RAM Competition Results!


----------



## CT

I've got what you'd call a "traditional" musical background (traditional in its content if not necessarily the way I actually went about it) and the snobbery that you've talked about so often is something that I've seen too much of.

I'd prefer not to count how many times people have seemed to place more weight on what I lack as far as conservatory/university credentials, etc., than on what I actually *do* know and am capable of. Thankfully, this is something that seems to be fading, rapidly. What you and Spitfire do towards that is absolutely not to be undervalued.

Also excited to hear you want to expand the NYC node. Definitely keeping my eye on that....


----------



## Jeremy Gillam

christianhenson said:


> RAM Competition Results!



I'm sure many here, myself included, can relate to the obsessiveness that comes with making recorded music. When music is going well it's frankly hard to find anything that can beat the high I get from it. But it's not always going well, and were humans, not just musicians. Thanks for the reminder to keep things in perspective.

Here's an interesting article about an elite MLB pitcher who sleeps 10 hours a night: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/09/sports/baseball/justin-verlander-all-star-sleep.html


----------



## christianhenson

Some sneaky peeks:


----------



## I like music

Wait, the _whole_ thing loaded up is that size in terms of RAM? So my 32gb laptop could (at least from a RAM perspective) load up the whole orchestra?!? Or have I fundamentally misunderstood something? I'm assuming mic positions will add to that, but if I just went with whatever standard mics are in there...?

Don't tempt me.


----------



## christianhenson

Yes.... that is exactly what I'm saying!


----------



## jononotbono

That Piano sounds amazing!


----------



## Jeremy Spencer

christianhenson said:


> Some sneaky peeks:




I have a good name for it....*Heart Strings*. I can't wait to get my hands on this, absolutely beautiful sounding.


----------



## christianhenson

I went on a bit of a piano adventure...


----------



## CT

Damn. What a place that is! Only been to Colorado once but absolutely loved it.


----------



## christianhenson

An amazing day:


----------



## Daniel James

christianhenson said:


> An amazing day:




Incredible turnout!. Serious props for arranging this mate and bringing all those people together! Really creating a sense if community in what is an otherwise a very lonely industry 

-DJ


----------



## jononotbono

christianhenson said:


> An amazing day:




"Every day we record or sample is a month of post production! And we recorded for 80 days". That's truly amazing. That's 6 and a half years working on the BBCSO! 

This video is great! Thanks for doing this! One day I'd love to go to one of these!


----------



## CT

I already commented on the video, and so risk repeating myself, but I wanted to say here how great a thing this was for you to organize, and to share with the rest of us. Maybe it's just what the kids call FOMO, or maybe something deeper, but it's had a real effect on me.

I've been too isolated and too static for way too long. This has lit a fire under my ass to finally kick things into gear, to really get involved in "the community," to get myself out there any way I can. I've been coasting along trying to make the music thing happen for years. Time to actually make it happen.


----------



## DGravel

Christian, each time I watch your videos, I am thinking how great it would be to have you as a neighbour. We would definitely share a couple of beers (or tea!).


----------



## erica-grace

jononotbono said:


> "Every day we record or sample is a month of post production! And we recorded for 80 days". That's truly amazing. That's 6 and a half years working on the BBCSO!



How much material gets recorded in a 6-hr day? Let's say two hours. So, you edit and process and do all of the other stuff required to release a product.... it takes 160 hours to process 2 hours or recorded material? Sorry, that does not sound right.


----------



## paulthomson

erica-grace said:


> How much material gets recorded in a 6-hr day? Let's say two hours. So, you edit and process and do all of the other stuff required to release a product.... it takes 160 hours to process 2 hours or recorded material? Sorry, that does not sound right.



Incorrect I’m afraid. We usually get about 35-40 minutes of final material per hour of session time. Our session day is either 3 x 3h or 4 x 2h so either 8 or 9 hours of recording time per day.


----------



## erica-grace

So, instead of two hours per day, you are getting about 5 1/2 hours per day? Ok, thanks for that.

So 5 1/2 hours (give and take) of material takes 160 hours to process? Which means to process, it takes literally around 30 hours for every one hour? that still doesn't sound right.


----------



## chrisr

erica-grace said:


> Which means to process, it takes literally around 30 hours for every one hour? that still doesn't sound right.



How long does it take you for your own orchestral sample libraries Erica?


----------



## ism

erica-grace said:


> So, instead of two hours per day, you are getting about 5 1/2 hours per day? Ok, thanks for that.
> 
> So 5 1/2 hours (give and take) of material takes 160 hours to process? Which means to process, it takes literally around 30 hours for every one hour? that still doesn't sound right.




so, back of the envelope, take 1h at, say, 10s per sample = 360 samples x 80 mics = 28800 audio files.

Then if you have legato sample there's probably a huge amount of delicate alignments and whatever else ... say 24 legato samples per note, which each need to be aligned and faded smoothly into other notes ....

Anyway, 30 hour then gives you about a budget of about 5 minutes per sample - and I really doubt its even possible to cut and align samples that quickly, so I'm probably way off in the average length of samples. 



I used to make extremely low budged radio documentaries. When I started I though it would maybe take three or four hours of work to produce an hour of audio. Turned out 30:1 was far closer to the ration of effort to output that it actually required. So not sure that I'd expect sample libraries would be any easier.

So not saying I know what it takes to make a top flight sample library. But just saying that 1:30 sounds entirely reasonable. Hyperproductive even.


----------



## paulthomson

I think this might help guide your understanding Erica-Grace! (cue'd up at the relevant moment..)


----------



## Jdiggity1

Couple of good looking roosters spotted in there


----------



## Greg

So much fun, everyone was so open and eager to chat. Would do it again in a heartbeat. Thx Christian


----------



## NoamL

Yep, tons of fun, thanks again for organizing it Christian. Best of success with your LA office and with Spitfire's wider educational initiative.


----------



## BlackDorito

When is the Bay Area event?


----------



## erica-grace

chrisr said:


> How long does it take you for your own orchestral sample libraries Erica?



Well, not THAT long!


----------



## erica-grace

ism said:


> so, back of the envelope, take 1h at, say, 10s per sample = 360 samples x 80 mics = 28800 audio files.
> 
> Then if you have legato sample there's probably a huge amount of delicate alignments and whatever else ... say 24 legato samples per note, which each need to be aligned and faded smoothly into other notes ....
> 
> Anyway, 30 hour then gives you about a budget of about 5 minutes per sample - and I really doubt its even possible to cut and align samples that quickly, so I'm probably way off in the average length of samples.
> 
> 
> 
> I used to make extremely low budged radio documentaries. When I started I though it would maybe take three or four hours of work to produce an hour of audio. Turned out 30:1 was far closer to the ration of effort to output that it actually required. So not sure that I'd expect sample libraries would be any easier.
> 
> So not saying I know what it takes to make a top flight sample library. But just saying that 1:30 sounds entirely reasonable. Hyperproductive even.



Thanks. Sorry, but that doesn't add up. Look, I know these things take time, and have alot of energy and effort put into them. And i appreciate what the developers do for the rest of us - have you ever edited and built a library of shorts? You have the original recording in your DAW, you chop the samples (making sure you choose the proper start and end point), you don't process them (remember, SFA said some time back the don't process their samples) you export each individual sample, and you build your Kontakt patch. A few hours of recorded material can be done in one day, if you know what you are doing. Don't believe me? Try it some time. Then there is some scripting (the bulk of which is already done), and some other stuff to do, but that's it - it's not as involved as many seem to think it is. Legatos will take considerably longer, of course, and that will add to the overall average. But it really takes 160 hours to process 51/2 hours of material? Can't be.


----------



## ProfoundSilence

erica-grace said:


> Well, not THAT long!




I think they mean editing samples, not orchestral PROGRAMMING. I'm not sure you've ever attempted to make a sample library(most of us haven't) but you could create an exercise for yourself to understand the time it takes pretty quickly by just trying to re-create a simple spiccato patch.

find something with say 6x RR per note. Play in (not step sequence) 6 notes in a row per dynamic range, on every white key from the bottom of the instrument's range all the way to the top. Make a track per microphone available - then individually cut each sample at the appropriate start point and fade out, organize your tracks, render them out into a folder - then create a kontakt instrument - and create your groups and zones for each note using your samples.

if you can reacreate a 6 round robin per dynamic layer(with atleast 3 dynamic layers) celli instrument with 3 mics all appropriately crossfaded and grouped so mics can be disabled and routed - in under 30 hours, I'll be impressed. And it'd had better be perfectly edited or it'll end up like that thread complaining about ark 1 shorts lol

for some perspective - a library like SCS is 72697 samples.If each sample only took a total of 1 minute worth of editing/exporting/adding to the instrument in it's entire lifespan - thats 1,211 hours, or 151 work days. (30 weeks of 40 hr work weeks)


----------



## ProfoundSilence

erica-grace said:


> Thanks. Sorry, but that doesn't add up. Look, I know these things take time, and have alot of energy and effort put into them. And i appreciate what the developers do for the rest of us - have you ever edited and built a library of shorts? You have the original recording in your DAW, you chop the samples (making sure you choose the proper start and end point), you don't process them (remember, SFA said some time back the don't process their samples) you export each individual sample, and you build your Kontakt patch. A few hours of recorded material can be done in one day, if you know what you are doing. Don't believe me? Try it some time. Then there is some scripting (the bulk of which is already done), and some other stuff to do, but that's it - it's not as involved as many seem to think it is. Legatos will take considerably longer, of course, and that will add to the overall average. But it really takes 160 hours to process 51/2 hours of material? Can't be.





do you have a staccato patch you've programmed?


----------



## ism

erica-grace said:


> Thanks. Sorry, but that doesn't add up. Look, I know these things take time, and have alot of energy and effort put into them. And i appreciate what the developers do for the rest of us - have you ever edited and built a library of shorts? You have the original recording in your DAW, you chop the samples (making sure you choose the proper start and end point), you don't process them (remember, SFA said some time back the don't process their samples) you export each individual sample, and you build your Kontakt patch. A few hours of recorded material can be done in one day, if you know what you are doing. Don't believe me? Try it some time. Then there is some scripting (the bulk of which is already done), and some other stuff to do, but that's it - it's not as involved as many seem to think it is. Legatos will take considerably longer, of course, and that will add to the overall average. But it really takes 160 hours to process 51/2 hours of material? Can't be.




You quite right I've never made a sound library - although technical I once worked on a project involving electron holography, which was, if you squint a bit, basically kind of the same as working with sound waves, only smaller, in a bunch more dimensions, spherical, and (being quantum mechanical) partially of imaginary. Still, basically the same math.


The broader point though is that my experience as a scientist and engineer across the board is that when a new hire gives you an effort estimate, you triple it. Then you add lots of additional contingency for things to be even more complex that first thought. And even then you take the new effort estimate with a very large pinch of salt.

And my instinct as a scientist and engineer is that sample libraries must be really hard to do well. Otherwise really, really good ones wouldn't be so rare.

But again, this is all just my intuitive back of the envelope estimations. So maybe you're right.


----------



## Saxer

160 hours for 5 1/2 hours of recorded material isn‘t even 30 times listening through. Don‘t forget the process of deciding which samples will make it into the instrument, sort out the trash and talking, fine tune the levels and the pitches in the instrument and set the best dynamic crossfades.


----------



## I like music

Saxer said:


> 160 hours for 5 1/2 hours of recorded material isn‘t even 30 times listening through. Don‘t forget the process of deciding which samples will make it into the instrument, sort out the trash and talking, fine tune the levels and the pitches in the instrument and set the best dynamic crossfades.



Glad I'm buying the stuff, and not selling it. Sounds more stressful than being a drug mule!


----------



## dzilizzi

And you have a new instrument that granted, has been used on a bunch of freebies, a very fancy set of strings, and a choir, and program it to work on a full orchestra with all the extra mics and dynamics. 

I've never built a sample library, but it seems like a lot of work.


----------



## paulthomson

It is hard work. Extremely complex plus a huge amount of artistic input and tweaking, weeks and weeks of tweaking, playing, refining. 

I don’t really have anything else to say to Erica, seems so willfully contrarian that maybe she’s just trolling me!

Wouldn’t be the first time lol..

Anyhoo, suffice to say we’ve got a team of 70 and it’s 2 years since we did our first recording for BBC. And another year of planning before that. 

Luckily we’ve got a ton of really intelligent and musical people all working together with passion to make stuff that we are proud of. And we’re living in a halcyon age with the technology we have at hand - I sometimes sit back and just allow my mind to be boggled... I used to program orch music on an MPC60 with an Akai S1100! 

I remember the old days of sample libs - I once spent over a grand on a violins library that sounded like someone trying to saw through a steel cable 😂

Thems were the days!!


----------



## ism

Well now I want a library of tuned saws sawing through steel cables. Sounds like it could be quite beautiful actually. Especially if it could be recorded in AIR.


----------



## dzilizzi

ism said:


> Well now I want a library of tuned saws sawing through steel cables. Sounds like it could be quite beautiful actually. Especially if it could be recorded in AIR.


Like this? Sounds like a Theremin.


----------



## I like music

It has taken me 4 years just to "balance" a template (yes, it means I can justify not writing any music this way). I imagine the project-management on developing a sample library music be utterly ridiculous and mindbogglingly complex.

I can very well believe it takes years to make these, with teams working around the clock. I can also imagine that "fixing" mistakes, bad samples, transitions etc must be a huge and difficult undertaking. Which is why I sometimes don't post things like "this library sounds like dogshit." If I don't like it, I would like to try to give positive critique to the developer so that they can bring better products to the market.

Seen too many threads where people are merely saying "wow, sounds crap" with nothing more to add. We should try to help the people who are selling us virtual instruments.


----------



## ProfoundSilence

same, these people are literally artists like ourselves creating art for us to use. 

if only the best birds sang the forest would he a very quiet place.


----------



## christianhenson

PT put up another vid..... looking shweeeeeeeet!


----------



## Zero&One

That fridge is awesome. Great video. 
Paul should do ASMR, he's such a relaxed dude.


----------



## jamwerks

Beautiful work space!


----------



## Pablocrespo

christianhenson said:


> PT put up another vid..... looking shweeeeeeeet!




Christian, I have noticed that you and Paul are favoring studio designs that have the desk facing the long wall, where I have read (as the acoustician that designed mine also said) that it’s better to face the short wall. 

Do you have an insight about this? Do you find the acoustics are better this way, or it is better ergonomically for you?

Also. I have been meaning to ask how is your shed constructed, are they SIP panels? Or brick and mortar as Paul’s new studio?


----------



## Zedcars

Beautiful studio Paul. I've really enjoyed your studio build videos.

I am very interested in how the environment can shape the music one creates. I sometimes wonder whether a small darkly lit studio would affect noticeably different compositional output compared to a spacious and bright studio. I believe your surroundings can very much have an influence and was wondering if anyone else agrees. Or is it complete hogwash?

(Future Vlog idea Christian?)


----------



## paulthomson

Thanks all! 

Pablo - it’s a weird one.. I’ve read that somewhere also but I’ve literally only been in one control room that was square even, every single other one has been wider than it is deep. My acoustician Chris Walls designed the room with a ton of carefully organized absorption behind and above the desk, and the fantastic thing is the room gets a little bit more live as you walk towards the front where the piano and drums are. I was in there yesterday fixing stuff (had a Manley Valve blow) and playing music and it just sounds awesome at the desk. 

Zedcars- I’m totally sure this has an effect. Somewhere you feel comfortable and inspired - with all the stuff you use to hand - makes a massive difference. I’ve always enjoyed setting up bedrooms, old garages, whatever I had available - as ergonomically as possible - so that I could enjoy working as smoothly as possible. I’ve never had a nice view like this before so it’s really great to have managed to get this room together! If you’re interested in seeing some of my old rooms you can here::


----------



## CT

Zedcars said:


> Beautiful studio Paul. I've really enjoyed your studio build videos.
> 
> I am very interested in how the environment can shape the music one creates. I sometimes wonder whether a small darkly lit studio would affect noticeably different compositional output compared to a spacious and bright studio. I believe your surroundings can very much have an influence and was wondering if anyone else agrees. Or is it complete hogwash?
> 
> (Future Vlog idea Christian?)



I think environment definitely does play a role in a person's music. I have a really particular vision for what my dream studio space would be.


----------



## ism

On the other hand, Falkner is said to have written has masterpiece (I think it might have been "As I Lay Dying") from a wheelbarrow .


----------



## CT

So if he wrote it at a desk instead of in a wheelbarrow, it would have been "As I Sit Comfortably."

I'll see myself out.


----------



## thesteelydane

erica-grace said:


> Thanks. Sorry, but that doesn't add up. Look, I know these things take time, and have alot of energy and effort put into them. And i appreciate what the developers do for the rest of us - have you ever edited and built a library of shorts? You have the original recording in your DAW, you chop the samples (making sure you choose the proper start and end point), you don't process them (remember, SFA said some time back the don't process their samples) you export each individual sample, and you build your Kontakt patch. A few hours of recorded material can be done in one day, if you know what you are doing. Don't believe me? Try it some time. Then there is some scripting (the bulk of which is already done), and some other stuff to do, but that's it - it's not as involved as many seem to think it is. Legatos will take considerably longer, of course, and that will add to the overall average. But it really takes 160 hours to process 51/2 hours of material? Can't be.



Trust me, I wish it was that easy, but it simply isn't. If you want to make a quality library, R&D, listening to, RX'ing, balancing, mixing, chopping, naming, setting loop points, mapping etc is a MASSIVE amount of work. By the time you get to the end, you will have listened to every sample many times over, and probably gone a bit mad. You will have questionable samples, there will be noises you have to something about, lots of little things that can have an unexpected effect on the quality of the finished product will come up. If you make a single mistake (and you almost certainly will) you have to backtrack several steps and start over again. My little string library Bunker Strings took me over 6 months of daily effort, and that's a small library compared to most string libraries. Granted the way it was sampled was slightly mad, and only added to the workload, but still....Sure, I've built small libraries of various ethnic guitar shorts for personal use in a couple of days, but if you want to make something of a quality that you can charge money for, it becomes an entirely different animal!


----------



## DGravel

Thanks Paul for sharing. Very interesting story. I've changed my studio setup several times. I haven't find the perfect ergonomic solution yet. What is the best solution to be properly sitting while playing on the piano keyboard OR the computer keyboard. So far, only one of both is positioned correctly. If I put the piano keyboard on a drawer mechanism, the height it requires makes the computer keyboard to high or the sitting position too low. Anyone found a good solution?


----------



## Pablocrespo

DGravel said:


> Thanks Paul for sharing. Very interesting story. I've changed my studio setup several times. I haven't find the perfect ergonomic solution yet. What is the best solution to be properly sitting while playing on the piano keyboard OR the computer keyboard. So far, only one of both is positioned correctly. If I put the piano keyboard on a drawer mechanism, the height it requires makes the computer keyboard to high or the sitting position too low. Anyone found a good solution?



Haven’t found this one yet. I think is more elusive tan perfect legato in samples or getting a job in RC. 

Jokes aside. For me, The solution would be a shallower music keyboard, shallower than Fatars, I am talking 7-8 cm. I have taken out the keybed of a yamaha p35 but it is still 11cm tall. 

Thanks for the response about the studio Paul!


----------



## christianhenson

...and whilst PT is creating a firm foundation for future composition, I'm galavanting round the place with 50 lb of kit!


----------



## Mornats

Bottom left of the preview image above... does that say 1 x CRAP machine?


----------



## christianhenson

CPAP!!! The thing that keeps me alive at night..... watch the effing film!


----------



## Mornats

Whups! I was thinking it was maybe a companion to your F*** box!


----------



## christianhenson

Ha ha ha ha!


----------



## DGravel

When I go on a photography trip, I am always thinking I'm totally bonkers travelling with 50 pounds of underwater camera gear! This level of insanity requires a great dose of passion for the art!! Great video as always Christian!


----------



## Geoff Grace

ism said:


> On the other hand, Falkner is said to have written has masterpiece (I think it might have been "As I Lay Dying") from a wheelbarrow .


No wonder he wrote a chapter that was just a sentence long. ("My mother is a fish.")

_"There! Done for the day. Now I can get out of that infernal contraption!"_

Best,

Geoff


----------



## Alex Fraser

christianhenson said:


> CPAP!!! The thing that keeps me alive at night..... watch the effing film!


Always fun taking those through airport security..


DGravel said:


> Thanks Paul for sharing. Very interesting story. I've changed my studio setup several times. I haven't find the perfect ergonomic solution yet. What is the best solution to be properly sitting while playing on the piano keyboard OR the computer keyboard. So far, only one of both is positioned correctly. If I put the piano keyboard on a drawer mechanism, the height it requires makes the computer keyboard to high or the sitting position too low. Anyone found a good solution?


I know the struggle. I've tried every which way possible - you gotta stretch whichever way you work it. Currently have 88 keys under the desk but it strikes me as slightly absurd considering I spend most of my writing time playing single notes/mod wheel, blocking chords and wrestling with Logic.

If you find the answer, please tell!


----------



## christianhenson

Time for a celebration:


----------



## yellowtone

christianhenson said:


> Time for a celebration:



clearly, no reason to spend money on piano sample libraries any longer... the amplified music box at ~6:30 is ridiculously cool... downloading as I type.


----------



## christianhenson

Thanks man... I'm gonna give you a reason to buy another piano library in a few months, trust me.


----------



## yellowtone

christianhenson said:


> Thanks man... I'm gonna give you a reason to buy another piano library in a few months, trust me.


Hahaha!! No doubts here... 🤪


----------



## ism

christianhenson said:


> Thanks man... I'm gonna give you a reason to buy another piano library in a few months, trust me.



My credit card and I thank you for the heads up.


----------



## Zedcars

EDIT: Ignore me...got it working! Apologies.


It could easily be my fault, but I'm unable to open the Broadwood piano EXS file in Logic. This is what happens when I try:






When I try to load it from the EXS sampler, the EXS file is greyed out (not selectable). Not sure what the issue is. I'm using Logic X 10.4.7, and macOS 10.14.6. Has anyone else reported this?

Thanks for starting this amazing resource. I'll try some other pianos now.


----------



## christianhenson

Possibly try re-downloading, may be a corrupt unzip?


----------



## Zedcars

christianhenson said:


> Possibly try re-downloading, may be a corrupt unzip?


Thanks Christian. As I feared - it was my ineptitude. Sorted it.


----------



## ARC Samples

yellowtone said:


> clearly, no reason to spend money on piano sample libraries any longer... the amplified music box at ~6:30 is ridiculously cool... downloading as I type.



Thanks for the Sonva Upright mention! I've spent my afternoon today redesigning the 9000ft Piano in Kontakt 5.


----------



## christianhenson

AMAZING THANK YOU!!!

NOW...

If you thought Paul's studio was a bit spesh, wait 'til you see this!


----------



## yellowtone

christianhenson said:


> AMAZING THANK YOU!!!
> 
> NOW...
> 
> If you thought Paul's studio was a bit spesh, wait 'til you see this!



Christian, I didnt know which of your many suits was your strongest: composer, orchestrator, sample library creator, vlogger, businessman, and the list goes on... until today. Truly, you are an amazing educator and a massive asset in keeping the history of music current with all your efforts. As a musician and optimist for future developments, I cannot thank you enough for sharing your journeys and learning with all of us. Amazing to see what you’ve done with your successes, sharing more and more. Please keep at it sir.


----------



## CT

Nathan's Cribs video made me ridiculously jealous! I would *not* mind a studio built around an organ.

It's very satisfying to hear how much of an investment he has in the roots of film music, and in its current state, too.


----------



## christianhenson

Will sounds become another 45º revenue stream for artists?


----------



## meradium

Just wanted to stop by to thank you for coming up with this Pianobook series. It made me sample my parent's piano and to my own surprise is sounds actually quite nice.

But boy, the amount of work necessary to sample, edit, re-sample, and edit again, de-noising, turning it into a Kontakt instrument, figuring out the scripting engine, and finishing the whole thing of is just crazy 

In the end I realized I completely forgot to record some pedal-up samples as well. Now, that silence is quite disturbing so I will have to go and record that as well.

I hope your team built a nice dev-ui / workflow for your in-house sampler that is much easier to use and automates some of the stuff that you have to go through when doing this inside Kontakt. There is clearly room for improvement in that Kontakt dev-department.


----------



## christianhenson

Paul Thomson, a Behringer, Really?


----------



## christianhenson




----------



## christianhenson

Help very much appreciated!!!


----------



## christianhenson

Anyone in NYC on the 20th of NOVEMBER???


----------



## CT

Finally! I'll be there!


----------



## Rick McGuire

I'll be there too!


----------



## styledelk

Definitely going to make this one work if I'm not traveling.


----------



## christianhenson

Well, can you?


----------



## christianhenson

Two new videos!


----------



## Patrick.K

Hi all,
Does anyone know where I could buy the conductor orchestral score that Paul has on his desk, I like this big one format.
Thank you for your answers
Patrick from France
ps: sorry for my bad English.


----------



## Zedcars

Patrick9152 said:


> Hi all,
> Does anyone know where I could buy the conductor orchestral score that Paul has on his desk, I like this big one format.
> Thank you for your answers
> Patrick from France
> ps: sorry for my bad English.


I found a PDF on Scribd. Then just take the file to a print shop and ask them to bind it for you (or do it at home):



I guess there might be a published printed version somewhere?


----------



## Patrick.K

I guess there might be a published printed version somewhere?
[/QUOTE]

Thank you very much Zedcars, for your answer.
I had already seen this score on Scribd, but I would like to know if it can be found on the market in the same large format (Orchestral conductor) that is more readable and more convenient than A4 format.
The ideal would be to ask the question to Paul Thomson ? 
If anyone has any information, I would be happy
Many thaks
Patrick


----------



## Zedcars

Patrick9152 said:


> Thank you very much Zedcars, for your answer.
> I had already seen this score on Scribd, but I would like to know if it can be found on the market in the same large format (Orchestral conductor) that is more readable and more convenient than A4 format.
> The ideal would be to ask the question to Paul Thomson ?
> If anyone has any information, I would be happy
> Many thaks
> Patrick


@paulthomson Can you advise please?


----------



## christianhenson

This is so exciting, I can't wait to get stuck in! (oh and a video that will satisfy those of you who have missed the dogs!).


----------



## brek

Patrick9152 said:


> I guess there might be a published printed version somewhere?
> 
> 
> Thank you very much Zedcars, for your answer.
> I had already seen this score on Scribd, but I would like to know if it can be found on the market in the same large format (Orchestral conductor) that is more readable and more convenient than A4 format.
> The ideal would be to ask the question to Paul Thomson ?
> If anyone has any information, I would be happy
> Many thaks
> Patrick




He mentioned it in the video:

It's part of the materials you got from the Steven Scott Smalley Orchestration workshop. I just looked it up and seems it is online only now - so the materials would only be available in PDF form.

Anyway, it's not a full conductor score for Basic Instinct, but a collection of assorted cues from many different films (Indiana Jones, Judge Dredd, Batman, Robocop, Starship Troopers, the NFL theme). It's quite a valuable hodge podge of materials across the two books you get.


----------



## ironbut

Fantastic CH!
Some fantastic suggestions in the comments of your video.
This should be something special.


----------



## christianhenson

BBCSO LOGIC TEMPLATE IS LIVE!!!


----------



## Saxer

Great stuff! Real fun to try a new library with one click and have a full template.


----------



## synkrotron

You know when you have pissed off Christian because he pins your comment...


----------



## christianhenson

Amazing Cubase template (click through to download) from the very talented and generous Alex Watson:


----------



## christianhenson

Very honoured to work with this talent:


----------



## christianhenson

Warts n' all (and sorry for calling this place grumpy)


----------



## CT

Grumpy? God, the nerve... myopic, hypocritical, petty, fickle, echo-chambery, cliquey, simultaneously pretentious and low-brow, yes, I'll grant you. But grumpy?!


----------



## Fry777

In the video you can see some sort of project calendar... are those upcoming releases ?


----------



## CT

Those look like LABS titles.


----------



## christianhenson

Whoops... Auntie is already out it’s BBC!


----------



## Fry777

CDT = Cadbury's Drama Toolkit confirmed

@christianhenson Is the HZ strings pickup near the top of this calendar by any chance?


----------



## AdamKmusic

Something CO in December, a new LCO library?


----------



## Mornats

About halfway up the screenshot: "...tions" can only be subscrip.... (I'll get my coat...)


----------



## robgb

christianhenson said:


> Amazing Cubase template (click through to download) from the very talented and generous Alex Watson:


I don't suppose you're planning a template for Reaper? If I had the library, I'd set one up for everyone, but...


----------



## synkrotron

robgb said:


> I don't suppose you're planning a template for Reaper?



I asked on the YouTube video. Bottom line is, it is up to us, the REAPER users to create a template. As it has been, I suppose, for Cubase.


----------



## Mornats

I think that's fair enough. If I remember Christian's reply to you (which was a nicely written reply I recall) he wants someone who lives and breathes Reaper to do real justice to a good template. He and the team just don't have that experience with it to do so.


----------



## synkrotron

Mornats said:


> which was a nicely written reply I recall



Yes, indeed it was


----------



## tav.one

Mornats said:


> About halfway up the screenshot: "...tions" can only be subscrip.... (I'll get my coat...)


"Evolutions"


----------



## Mornats

tav.one said:


> "Evolutions"



Spoilsport


----------



## christianhenson

OK, I've been working on the concept for this tutorial for 2 years... so its with equal nerves and excitement that I give you guys it first:



Download session files here: https://www.spitfireaudio.com/thepage/


----------



## CGR

Mornats said:


> About halfway up the screenshot: "...tions" can only be subscrip.... (I'll get my coat...)





tav.one said:


> "Evolutions"



" . . . Rations"


----------



## micrologus

This tutorial is really amazing, thank you Christian for sharing it!  I can see on my computer how it works, try to change the parameters and see what changes... great!
- Matteo


----------



## christianhenson

THATS THE IDEA!!! Thanks so much!


----------



## Living Fossil

christianhenson said:


> OK, I've been working on the concept for this tutorial for 2 years... so its with equal nerves and excitement that I give you guys it first:



The real take-away from this video is the fact that a piece which is a great composition for piano turns into _quite a cheesy piece of music_ when "transformed" into an orchestral piece.
I guess this is in part what Adorno meant by saying "taste in art consists [...] in not using tempting means". (the original is in German, so this is not an exact translation)
In fact, it's a crucial part in composition to know which sounds bring out the qualities of a piece and which destroy them.
In the case of the Gnossiens the extreme reduction of the used material is wonderful music when played on the piano (as intended). An orchestration like this just highlights what is left out (deliberately) in the composition. A positive quality turns into a supposed deficit.

Instead of misleading aspiring musicians by suggesting them that "everybody can write for orchestra" (which of course is terribly disrespectful against people who really learnt their craft for years and decades) it would probably more interesting to show, why certain pieces are great, when played with a solo piano, why other pieces are great when played by a string quartet, and why the music of Richard Strauss (he comes in my mind when we speak about people who "can" [could] orchestrate) really shines when played by a huge orchestra.

But i guess this is our Zeitgeist.
In the next episode you could do a tutorial "everybody can instantly be a surgeon" and show how to peel a cooked egg.
Followed by an episode "rocket science is f*cking easy" where you show how to tinker a paper plane.
Rounded up by the episode "everybody is a potential gourmet chef" where you not only open and heat a can of chilli con carne but also give it a personal touch by adding a spoonful of creme fraiche.

No offense, but please don't be part in the dumbing down of society.
It's great that you offer tutorials to beginners, but please choose titles that maintain the respect for a complex profession (which orchestration is) that's not learnt by doing some bricolage with a sample library.

(Edit: i've changed the term in _italics_ to avoid the impression that this post might be intended to be offensive)


----------



## Uiroo

Living Fossil said:


> The real take-away from this video is the fact that a piece which is a great composition for piano turns into cheesy garbage when "transformed" into an orchestral piece.
> I guess this is in part what Adorno meant by saying "taste in art consists [...] in not using tempting means". (the original is in German, so this is not an exact translation)
> In fact, it's a crucial part in composition to know which sounds bring out the qualities of a piece and which destroy them.
> In the case of the Gnossiens the extreme reduction of the used material is wonderful music when played on the piano (as intended). An orchestration like this just highlights what is left out (deliberately) in the composition. A positive quality turns into a supposed deficit.
> 
> Instead of misleading aspiring musicians by suggesting them that "everybody can write for orchestra" (which of course is terribly disrespectful against people who really learnt their craft for years and decades) it would probably more interesting to show, why certain pieces are great, when played with a solo piano, why other pieces are great when played by a string quartet, and why the music of Richard Strauss (he comes in my mind when we speak about people who "can" [could] orchestrate) really shines when played by a huge orchestra.
> 
> But i guess this is our Zeitgeist.
> In the next episode you could do a tutorial "everybody can instantly be a surgeon" and show how to peel a cooked egg.
> Followed by an episode "rocket science is f*cking easy" where you show how to tinker a paper plane.
> Rounded up by the episode "everybody is a potential gourmet chef" where you not only open and heat a can of chilli con carne but also give it a personal touch by adding a spoonful of creme fraiche.
> 
> No offense, but please don't be part in the dumbing down of society.
> It's great that you offer tutorials to beginners, but please choose titles that maintain the respect for a complex profession (which orchestration is) that's not learnt by doing some bricolage with a sample library.


I think this is what Christian means when he refers to "snobbish music elite" (not an actual quote). 
You wrote quite a few things, but for me it was already over when you referred to Christian's interpretation as cheesy garbage. 

That's just not how one should communicate, especially not if one's concerned with the "dumbing down of society".


----------



## ism

Living Fossil said:


> i've changed the term in _italics_ to avoid the impression that this post might be intended to be offensive



Yeah, good luck with that.


----------



## Living Fossil

Uiroo said:


> You wrote quite a few things, but for me it was already over when you referred to Christian's interpretation as cheesy garbage.
> 
> That's just not how one should communicate, especially not if one's concerned with the "dumbing down of society".



Sure, it's easier to be offended by a certain phrase than actually try to understand what someone wrote. Honestly, i didn't meant to be offensive by using the term "cheesy garbage", it was an honest impression. But since it hinders you from reading, i will change the term to "quite a cheesy piece of music". Is that ok for you, or still offensive?

And by the way: Historically, our time is maybe the most sensible one when it comes to being offended. instead of discussing topics, discussions are terminated at the moment where the first person is offended. That's the opposite of what the "Aufklaerung" stood for. It's not a good thing.


----------



## funnybear

Can anyone write orchestral music?: 100% YES

Will the result be any good?: in 99.99999% of cases NO

I am all for empowering more people to experiment with orchestral music and leading them away from purely doing 4/4 beat writing (which can be great too obviously) and eventually discovering counterpoint et all.

But I would always want to augment these “yes you can” statements with an immediate “... and then go and put in 10,000 hours of study and practice to truly create stuff that will stand the test of time”.


----------



## synkrotron

The stink of elitism is strong here lately


----------



## rottoy

Living Fossil said:


> No offense, but please don't be part in the dumbing down of society.
> It's great that you offer tutorials to beginners, but please choose titles that maintain the respect for a complex profession (which orchestration is) that's not learnt by doing some bricolage with a sample library.
> 
> (Edit: i've changed the term in _italics_ to avoid the impression that this post might be intended to be offensive)


Yeah, VI Control isn't a grumpy place at all.


----------



## Living Fossil

synkrotron said:


> The stink of elitism is strong here lately



Please be so kind and explain why it is "elitist" to state the opinion that a specific piano piece might not be suited to be performed with an orchestra?
Would it also be elitist to state that e.g. a specific Metallica song might not work when performed on a recorder?

In this concrete case, it's even more absurd to call it "elitist" to critisize the statement.
Eric Satie was maybe one of the most anti-elitist composers who ever lived. 
He once turned down a commission because he thought the offered money was too much.
His concept of "music d'ameublement" is the sheer opposite of elitist pump and circumstances.
It's reduction.
That is what creates - among others - the magic of his piano music.
It is what it is, it doesn't want to be more.

And the fact that certain music shines with a specific instrumentation is not elitist at all.
It's quite a basic rule.


----------



## Bansi

Living Fossil said:


> The real take-away from this video is the fact that a piece which is a great composition for piano turns into _quite a cheesy piece of music_ when "transformed" into an orchestral piece.
> I guess this is in part what Adorno meant by saying "taste in art consists [...] in not using tempting means". (the original is in German, so this is not an exact translation)
> In fact, it's a crucial part in composition to know which sounds bring out the qualities of a piece and which destroy them.
> In the case of the Gnossiens the extreme reduction of the used material is wonderful music when played on the piano (as intended). An orchestration like this just highlights what is left out (deliberately) in the composition. A positive quality turns into a supposed deficit.
> 
> Instead of misleading aspiring musicians by suggesting them that "everybody can write for orchestra" (which of course is terribly disrespectful against people who really learnt their craft for years and decades) it would probably more interesting to show, why certain pieces are great, when played with a solo piano, why other pieces are great when played by a string quartet, and why the music of Richard Strauss (he comes in my mind when we speak about people who "can" [could] orchestrate) really shines when played by a huge orchestra.
> 
> But i guess this is our Zeitgeist.
> In the next episode you could do a tutorial "everybody can instantly be a surgeon" and show how to peel a cooked egg.
> Followed by an episode "rocket science is f*cking easy" where you show how to tinker a paper plane.
> Rounded up by the episode "everybody is a potential gourmet chef" where you not only open and heat a can of chilli con carne but also give it a personal touch by adding a spoonful of creme fraiche.
> 
> No offense, but please don't be part in the dumbing down of society.
> It's great that you offer tutorials to beginners, but please choose titles that maintain the respect for a complex profession (which orchestration is) that's not learnt by doing some bricolage with a sample library.
> 
> (Edit: i've changed the term in _italics_ to avoid the impression that this post might be intended to be offensive)


If you want people to understand your point of view maybe you should phrase your criticism in a nicer fashion.What if someone told your post is garbage? Most likely that would stop any further serious consideration about a legitimate topic.If Christian would have tried to orchestrate a nocturne by Chopin I would feel like you feel but in this case I think C. really added something new and worthwhile listening to, adding a new flavor to the composition.Something was lost, the beautiful intimacy and fragility of the piece, but maybe something new was added worth considering.Or maybe Eric was really lazy the day he wrote the piece  Peace


----------



## Zedcars

Living Fossil said:


> The real take-away from this video is the fact that a piece which is a great composition for piano turns into _quite a cheesy piece of music_ when "transformed" into an orchestral piece.
> I guess this is in part what Adorno meant by saying "taste in art consists [...] in not using tempting means". (the original is in German, so this is not an exact translation)
> In fact, it's a crucial part in composition to know which sounds bring out the qualities of a piece and which destroy them.
> In the case of the Gnossiens the extreme reduction of the used material is wonderful music when played on the piano (as intended). An orchestration like this just highlights what is left out (deliberately) in the composition. A positive quality turns into a supposed deficit.
> 
> Instead of misleading aspiring musicians by suggesting them that "everybody can write for orchestra" (which of course is terribly disrespectful against people who really learnt their craft for years and decades) it would probably more interesting to show, why certain pieces are great, when played with a solo piano, why other pieces are great when played by a string quartet, and why the music of Richard Strauss (he comes in my mind when we speak about people who "can" [could] orchestrate) really shines when played by a huge orchestra.
> 
> But i guess this is our Zeitgeist.
> In the next episode you could do a tutorial "everybody can instantly be a surgeon" and show how to peel a cooked egg.
> Followed by an episode "rocket science is f*cking easy" where you show how to tinker a paper plane.
> Rounded up by the episode "everybody is a potential gourmet chef" where you not only open and heat a can of chilli con carne but also give it a personal touch by adding a spoonful of creme fraiche.
> 
> No offense, but please don't be part in the dumbing down of society.
> It's great that you offer tutorials to beginners, but please choose titles that maintain the respect for a complex profession (which orchestration is) that's not learnt by doing some bricolage with a sample library.
> 
> (Edit: i've changed the term in _italics_ to avoid the impression that this post might be intended to be offensive)


The way you wrote this is not respectful. I think you need to work on your communication skills and give an honest opinion without the unnecessary acidic elitism.


----------



## rottoy

If we don't get off the lawn quickly with our DAW bikes, old Mr. Conservatoire is going to advance from the porch brandishing sharps and flats!


----------



## Living Fossil

Bansi said:


> If you want people to understand your point of view maybe you should phrase your criticism in a nicer fashion.What if someone told your post is garbage? Most likely that would stop any further serious consideration about a legitimate topic.If Christian would have tried to orchestrate a nocturne by Chopin I would feel like you feel but in this case I think C. really added something new and worthwhile listening to, adding a new flavor to the composition.Something was lost, the beautiful intimacy and fragility of the piece, but maybe something new was added worth considering.Or maybe Eric was really lazy the day he wrote the piece  Peace



I wrote it in the post above yours, so in the case you missed my argument why i didn't think this piece is suited:

_In this concrete case, it's even more absurd to call it "elitist" to critisize the statement.
Eric Satie was maybe one of the most anti-elitist composers who ever lived. 
He once turned down a commission because he thought the offered money was too much.
His concept of "music d'ameublement" is the sheer opposite of elitist pump and circumstances.
It's reduction.
That is what creates - among others - the magic of his piano music.
It is what it is, it doesn't want to be more._

@Zedcars & all the other ones: As stated, i think the term i used is accurate. However, i wonder why nobody thinks that it is blatantly disrespectful towards those who take their craft seriously to create the impression that orchestration is just kind of simple bricolage?


----------



## jbuhler

As if orchestrations of this kind, done by very well known composers, don't have a very long history. A good deal of the traditional pedagogy of orchestration also involves doing these kinds of orchestrations.


----------



## Living Fossil

jbuhler said:


> As if orchestrations of this kind, done by very well known composers, don't have a very long history. A good deal of the traditional pedagogy of orchestration also involves doing these kinds of orchestrations.



Sure, i know, i went through it. It's maybe a reason why i'm allergic to the abuse of musical intentions.
However, there are more suited pieces and less suited ones.
And i guess i stated my view why i think this specific piece is specifically-specially-unsuited for an orchestral treatment. 
Peace!


----------



## muk

Can we try to look at it from a different angle? Each time the elitism-argument comes up the discussion is basically over. And that's a pity in this case, because I think there are a lot of interesting points that can be duscussed regarding Mr. Henson's orchestration. Hopefully that is possible without unnecessary vitriol.

In my opinion the orchestration is very good. Mr. Henson clearly is a great orchestrator. However, I also think that his orchestration does not work well for this piece. Here is why I think that: as @Living Fossil wrote, Satie's 'Gnossiennes' are very sparse, almost minimalist pieces of music. This is especially noteworthy in the context they were written in. Richard Wagner's music was everywhere at the time. It was a huge craze. It was so influential that there was no way around it for composers. The 'Gnossiennes' are a very bold statement, as they almost painfully clearly distance themselves from anything Wagnerian. Where Wagner's music is huge, expansive, sensual, and inherently orchestral. These 'Gnossiennes' are the exact opposite. They are almost minimalistic, introvert, very experimental. It's no coincidence that these are short piano pieces. In essence they go against anything Wagner's music stands for. In that context the 'Gnossiennes' are a strong statement, and the instrumentation (piano solo instead of a large orchestra) is an important part of that.

Mr. Henson's orchestration is based on film music style orchestration. That orchestration style has many Wagnerian traits. In fact, Wagner is one of the composers that heavily influenced film music composers in the 20th century. I guess you can see the point I am trying to make here. The orchestration - which in itself is wonderfully done and really excellent - is, in my opinion, the entirely wrong choice for this particular piece of music. The large orchestra, the techniques used to orchestrate, the 'filmic' display of emotion (I guess that's what @Living Fossil called 'cheesy'), all go against the very soul of this piece - which is a statement against Wagnerian largesse. To use these Wagnerian principles to orchestrate it, is, again in my personal opinion, a mistake, and does not work for the 'Gnossiennes'.

That being said, I think that this orchestration is very instructive, and a lot can be learned from it. For, even if you might not like it on this particular musical material, there is other music where it's exactly what is needed. And well crafted, imaginative, and creative as it is there is a lot that can be learned and gained from studying it.


----------



## Zero&One

I was going to write exactly what @muk posted... although my version had less knowledge, finesse, talent, experience, poetry, and general coolness. So I refrained.


----------



## CT

synkrotron said:


> The stink of elitism is strong here lately



There are a few people championing it.

I think it's worth saying that elitism, snobbery, whatever you want to call it, is almost never about a person's actual perspective, but about how they communicate it.

In any case, I don't get the impression that Christian is saying that his video will allow anyone to orchestrate like Debussy or Takemitsu in an instant. Instead, it's offering a look into something which might be foreign to many, demystifying it a little, and possibly giving them incentive to then pursue mastering it. That's in keeping with Spitfire's recent emphasis on education, etc., and I think it's great.


----------



## Loïc D

Maybe we should consider this piece for what it is, a sheer _exercice de style_ explaining that a good way to orchestration is to start from minimalistic pieces. For fun.

I watched the video and by no way Christian Hanson states that his reorchestration sheds a new light on a somewhat too simplistic piece of music.

So yes, it’s fun to reintepret classics and I’d bet someone can create a pretty interesting cover of Metallica on a recorder.

Now I’m just sitting here waiting for Christian’s take on Vivaldi’s Four Season winter on the next LABS hurdy gurdy...


----------



## jbuhler

muk said:


> Can we try to look at it from a different angle? Each time the elitism-argument comes up the discussion is basically over. And that's a pity in this case, because I think there are a lot of interesting points that can be duscussed regarding Mr. Henson's orchestration. Hopefully that is possible without unnecessary vitriol.
> 
> In my opinion the orchestration is very good. Mr. Henson clearly is a great orchestrator. However, I also think that his orchestration does not work well for this piece. Here is why I think that: as @Living Fossil wrote, Satie's 'Gnossiennes' are very sparse, almost minimalist pieces of music. This is especially noteworthy in the context they were written in. Richard Wagner's music was everywhere at the time. It was a huge craze. It was so influential that there was no way around it for composers. The 'Gnossiennes' are a very bold statement, as they almost painfully clearly distance themselves from anything Wagnerian. Where Wagner's music is huge, expansive, sensual, and inherently orchestral. These 'Gnossiennes' are the exact opposite. They are almost minimalistic, introvert, very experimental. It's no coincidence that these are short piano pieces. In essence they go against anything Wagner's music stands for. In that context the 'Gnossiennes' are a strong statement, and the instrumentation (piano solo instead of a large orchestra) is an important part of that.
> 
> Mr. Henson's orchestration is based on film music style orchestration. That orchestration style has many Wagnerian traits. In fact, Wagner is one of the composers that heavily influenced film music composers in the 20th century. I guess you can see the point I am trying to make here. The orchestration - which in itself is wonderfully done and really excellent - is, in my opinion, the entirely wrong choice for this particular piece of music. The large orchestra, the techniques used to orchestrate, the 'filmic' display of emotion (I guess that's what @Living Fossil called 'cheesy'), all go against the very soul of this piece - which is a statement against Wagnerian largesse. To use these Wagnerian principles to orchestrate it, is, again in my personal opinion, a mistake, and does not work for the 'Gnossiennes'.
> 
> That being said, I think that this orchestration is very instructive, and a lot can be learned from it. For, even if you might not like it on this particular musical material, there is other music where it's exactly what is needed. And well crafted, imaginative, and creative as it is there is a lot that can be learned and gained from studying it.


It's a lesson in orchestration. Christian did not intend, as far as I know, the orchestration to be anything more than an exercise. I don't find the piece unsuitable for orchestration in the least bit. And, though Christian didn't take this approach on it, the large orchestra might have been just the palette to express an oppositional sparseness, a medium where you would really be able to hear that sparseness. 

Then, too, you think that short evocative piano pieces were unusual when Satie was writing this? Really?


----------



## Manuel Stumpf

This video tries to encourage people trying to orchestrate/compose/dip their toes into music or whatever.
Where the hell is the problem?
If you don't like the video, make a better one before you complain.


----------



## Levon

christianhenson said:


> OK, I've been working on the concept for this tutorial for 2 years... so its with equal nerves and excitement that I give you guys it first:
> 
> 
> 
> Download session files here: https://www.spitfireaudio.com/thepage/



Great tutorial Christian! As a hobbyist I find these type of tutorials very inspirational, motivating and insightful. I’m at the beginning of my production and orchestration journey and this is exactly the type of tutorial that will be invaluable to me as a starting point. I had been thinking about purchasing SSO but the whole potential sharing aspect of BBCSO sounds like it will be a better fit for my needs. Hopefully I’ll make it along to one of your future Edinburgh walks.


----------



## Mucusman

I actually was introduced -- and fell in love with this Satie piece -- in an _orchestrated _form. It was performed by the Orchestra of the Royal Opera House, as the music to the ballet Monotones I. I have the ballet set on Blu-Ray, and I was totally taken by the music and the lovely orchestration (I shortly thereafter learned that it was originally just a piano work). 

While I cannot find that exact recording anywhere online to link to, this version is similar, written by the same orchestrator (or at least one of the two):



I applaud what Christian and team are doing. Putting oneself out there with one's own interpretation of an existing work takes courage. I didn't watch the entirety of Christian's video, but I don't see how this cannot be of help to anyone wanting to try orchestrating existing (or one's own!) piano pieces. Is everyone super talented in this arena? No. But there's joy and a certain nobility in the growing, the stretching, the learning, and the engagement with the music, with the art.


----------



## Living Fossil

muk said:


> The large orchestra, the techniques used to orchestrate, the 'filmic' display of emotion (I guess that's what @Living Fossil called 'cheesy'), all go against the very soul of this piece



Thanks, @muk , nice to see that it's possible indeed to discuss topics.
Your guess about what made me think the rendering is cheesy is quite accurate, however i'll try to add some additional impressions.
As @jbuhler has mentioned, it's quite a conventional exercise to orchestrate piano pieces. However, usually the aim is to enforce the intended characteristics of the piece.
This one is quite limited in its range and also in its dynamic range.
A melodic statement that works when played softly turns (in my opinion) into cheesy when you shout it. So, the loud brassy part for me really turns that simple child-like melody into something slightly vulgar.
Second thing: The piano is a pluck instrument. Once a note is played, there is no real way to inforce it or add a conscious vibrato etc.
One thing about the melodic language of the Gnossiennes is that once you've heard the piece, it will go on in your head - it becomes a silent musique d'ameublement - that at a certain point you imagine to sing with your voice in your head. So, all the emotional potential that these simple, catchy tunes have, remain implicit as long as the music is played. (I'm not sure if it's comprehensive what i wrote).
So, the expression takes place rather in your head than in reality. With woodwinds playing vibrato, this magic is gone. It gets the emotion that Satie was so obsessed with to omit.
Third thing: one reason why it is good to maintain the intended range and dynamics is the fact that normally, a deviation of the intended ranges would have a consequence in the music.
When you turn a soft melody loud, you would maybe echo it by other instruments. Or you would add a counterpoint etc.

But, as a final statement in this thread where i obviously stepped on many toes: As initially stated, i really didn't wanted to be offensive, but was somehow offended myself by two aspects:
1) I think the specific choice of the piece is disrespectful against Eric Satie, since it turns his vision of a humble music upside down into an elitist and somehow snobbish orchestral Pump & Circumstances piece.
2) Maybe that's hard to understand for people who aren't affected by this, but for me (and many colleagues) the situation in composing for film and media gets harder and harder.
On one side, budgets for music are rapidly going down. Usually (it's probably different if you work in Hollywood or for the BBC) the budgets don't provide orchestral recordings etc. etc.
On the other side, there is an increase of ignorance towards the profession of a composer and music itself. It's not unusual to find people, working in the film industry, who can't tell apart the profession of a DJ and the profession of a composer. And it's quite usual, that a harmonic language that isn't tonal is perceived as "sounddesign". (like that wonderful piece of sounddesign called "Atmospheres" in Kubrick's Space Oddity).
Making statements as "everybody is an orchestrator" in such an environment is vicious.

And finally, as i've written in my first post [most people probably didn't read it so far] of course i think it's great that ChH is offering tutorials!
Peace!


----------



## jbuhler

Living Fossil said:


> Thanks, @muk , nice to see that it's possible indeed to discuss topics.
> Your guess about what made me think the rendering is cheesy is quite accurate, however i'll try to add some additional impressions.
> As @jbuhler has mentioned, it's quite a conventional exercise to orchestrate piano pieces. However, usually the aim is to enforce the intended characteristics of the piece.
> This one is quite limited in its range and also in its dynamic range.
> A melodic statement that works when played softly turns (in my opinion) into cheesy when you shout it. So, the loud brassy part for me really turns that simple child-like melody into something slightly vulgar.
> Second thing: The piano is a pluck instrument. Once a note is played, there is no real way to inforce it or add a conscious vibrato etc.
> One thing about the melodic language of the Gnossiennes is that once you've heard the piece, it will go on in your head - it becomes a silent musique d'ameublement - that at a certain point you imagine to sing with your voice in your head. So, all the emotional potential that these simple, catchy tunes have, remain implicit as long as the music is played. (I'm not sure if it's comprehensive what i wrote).
> So, the expression takes place rather in your head than in reality. With woodwinds playing vibrato, this magic is gone. It gets the emotion that Satie was so obsessed with to omit.
> Third thing: one reason why it is good to maintain the intended range and dynamics is the fact that normally, a deviation of the intended ranges would have a consequence in the music.
> When you turn a soft melody loud, you would maybe echo it by other instruments. Or you would add a counterpoint etc.
> 
> But, as a final statement in this thread where i obviously stepped on many toes: As initially stated, i really didn't wanted to be offensive, but was somehow offended myself by two aspects:
> 1) I think the specific choice of the piece is disrespectful against Eric Satie, since it turns his vision of a humble music upside down into an elitist and somehow snobbish orchestral Pump & Circumstances piece.
> 2) Maybe that's hard to understand for people who aren't affected by this, but for me (and many colleagues) the situation in composing for film and media gets harder and harder.
> On one side, budgets for music are rapidly going down. Usually (it's probably different if you work in Hollywood or for the BBC) the budgets don't provide orchestral recordings etc. etc.
> On the other side, there is an increase of ignorance towards the profession of a composer and music itself. It's not unusual to find people, working in the film industry, who can't tell apart the profession of a DJ and the profession of a composer. And it's quite usual, that a harmonic language that isn't tonal is perceived as "sounddesign". (like that wonderful piece of sounddesign called "Atmospheres" in Kubrick's Space Oddity).
> 
> And finally, as i've written in my first post [most people probably didn't read it so far] of course i think it's great that ChH is offering tutorials!
> Peace!


The thing is, Christian's approach wasn't even bricolage you accused it of being. He very clearly stated his intention for the orchestration—eroticism—and then pursued a strategy to realize it. It may not be your cup of tea (I don't think it sounds cheesy or overdressed so much as intensely sensuous albeit somewhat more directly expressed than I would have preferred for this piece) but whether it suits your particular artistic sensibilities is not really the point for an orchestration exercise like this. It's the execution of the intention and in Christian's case the way he expresses what he is trying to draw out of the piece as he orchestrates it. Then too these little Satie pieces are frequently orchestrated. Debussy did two of the Gymnopedies, Poulenc did the third Gnossienne. You might not like what Christian did with it, and that's fine, but it's simply not the artistic violation you present it as.


----------



## Zedcars

Here’s a beautiful viola and harp arrangement. There are so many interpretations; none of which are the ‘right’ one, but many of them have artistic merit if they are expressive and speak to you musically and emotionally:


----------



## christianhenson

INSANE...... who is that Viola player!!!!!????


----------



## Zedcars

christianhenson said:


> INSANE...... who is that Viola player!!!!!????


Grigory Tsyganov. He also did the transcription. Such subtle and delicate playing. It's amazing how he somehow manages to sound like a flute at the beginning and uses his viola in very creative ways.


----------



## Living Fossil

@jbuhler : Thanks for mentioning the Debussy and Poulenc arrangements.
I am so free and post links to the youtube videos below for those who are interested.
Both, Debussy's and Poulenc's versions, reinforce what i've meant: they try to maintain the characteristics of the piece. 
What is interesting, is that the melodies in the woodwind in fact lose their magic.
It's interesting because that's not the case in the video that @Zedcars posted:
Here you have a viola player who perfectly catches the spirit of the tune. He keeps it completely intimate, introverted. It's an intimacy that keeps the unspoken unspoken but in the same time tells you there is something unspoken...


----------



## jbuhler

Living Fossil said:


> @jbuhler : Thanks for mentioning the Debussy and Poulenc arrangements.
> I am so free and post links to the youtube videos below for those who are interested.
> Both, Debussy's and Poulenc's versions, reinforce what i've meant: they try to maintain the characteristics of the piece.
> What is interesting, is that the melodies in the woodwind in fact lose their magic.
> It's interesting because that's not the case in the video that @Zedcars posted:
> Here you have a viola player who perfectly catches the spirit of the tune. He keeps it completely intimate, introverted. It's an intimacy that keeps the unspoken unspoken but in the same time tells you there is something unspoken...



I disagree. They are all variants. They are all drawing something out of the piece, imprinting upon it something more than a difference in performance. But the main thing is that orchestrations of this sort once upon a time were a perfectly ordinary part of the work composers did (which is why the Debussy and Poulenc orchestrations exist). And it's an exercise that is still central to the training of composers so it's really unclear why you are complaining about Christian doing it as an exercise for instruction. For an hour's time, a person who sits down with this video will learn quite a lot about orchestration—what's possible with the instruments to some extent but even more so how you think about deploying instruments, how you rework lines, etc. to realize an intention—and quite a lot about midi programming as well. Whether you are fully convinced by the orchestration at the end is really beside the point since Christian isn't offering it up as a track to buy or putting the orchestration in front of an orchestra to play at a concert.


----------



## Living Fossil

jbuhler said:


> I disagree.



@jbuhler : I've perfectly understood that you disagree. And it's perfectly fine to disagree. You mentioned your arguments, I've mentioned mine. At a certain point there is no sense in continuing to discuss why somebody likes something and the other one thinks it's of poor taste. 
Let's agree to disagree. 
As a tourist in this thread i'm guilty of having derailed the thread, so i will cease to repeat my arguments.


----------



## synkrotron

The way I understood Christian's Orchestration of a piano piece he is familiar with is, it was an exercise, nothing more.


----------



## ism

muk said:


> Mr. Henson's orchestration is based on film music style orchestration. That orchestration style has many Wagnerian traits. In fact, Wagner is one of the composers that heavily influenced film music composers in the 20th century. I guess you can see the point I am trying to make here. The orchestration - which in itself is wonderfully done and really excellent - is, in my opinion, the entirely wrong choice for this particular piece of music. The large orchestra, the techniques used to orchestrate, the 'filmic' display of emotion (I guess that's what @Living Fossil called 'cheesy'), all go against the very soul of this piece - which is a statement against Wagnerian largesse. To use these Wagnerian principles to orchestrate it, is, again in my personal opinion, a mistake, and does not work for the 'Gnossiennes'.



This is fine. But if the original piece was composed with a minimalism born of an anxiety of the Wagnerian influence, it also flows into other influences - including the "how can we write lush and beautiful music upon the millions of corpses of the Great War" that informs later modernism.

But this modernist influence becomes just as dominating an anxiety as the original Wagnerian anxiety.

Its of course fine if this filmic version of Satie isn't to you taste.

But the current neo-classical and filmic rebellion against the anxiety of the modernist rebellion against the anxiety of the Wagnerian high romantic influence is surely just as valid as the original rebellion against the anxiety of the Wagnerian was at the time.

I find this orchestration quite beautiful in its simplicity. It does lose the sense of lonely spareness of the original, and I can see someone who loves the original lamenting that loss (as surely as I have been known to lament certain unfortunate Beatles covers). But has its own kind of minimalism. And I don't feel it falls into Wagnerian excess.


----------



## NoamL

Hey everyone.

In the spirit of what @christianhenson is doing for the composer community, here is one of my favorite pieces for strings, the Elgar *Strings Serenade*, 2nd Movement. I made a mockup of it ages ago, and just dug out the original MIDI.

I think the piece would suit BBCSO admirably, especially the beautiful true-sampled _con sordino_ in BBCSO. It's public domain so you can use the mockup in your portfolio, you'll learn from one of the greatest string orchestrators ever, and plus, Elgar was a Brit! :emoji_tea:🇬🇧

It's a bit of a big project to chew on, but there is so much to learn from how Elgar uses the strings sensitively & masterfully.

The MIDI is attached below, which is a 1:1 copy of the sheet music.

Here is a video with the sheet music (because the MIDI won't tell you when the players are doing divisi, pizzicato, or con sord.) and a very nice, nuanced performance. I suggest including the leaders as well if you go for it!



*Have fun!*


----------



## CT

NoamL said:


> Hey everyone.
> 
> In the spirit of what @christianhenson is doing for the composer community, here is one of my favorite pieces for strings, the Elgar *Strings Serenade*, 2nd Movement. I made a mockup of it ages ago, and just dug out the original MIDI.
> 
> I think the piece would suit BBCSO admirably, especially the beautiful true-sampled _con sordino_ in BBCSO. It's public domain so you can use the mockup in your portfolio, you'll learn from one of the greatest string orchestrators ever, and plus, Elgar was a Brit! :emoji_tea:🇬🇧
> 
> The MIDI is attached below, which is a 1:1 copy of the sheet music.
> 
> Here is a video with the sheet music (because the MIDI won't tell you when the players are doing divisi, pizzicato, or con sord.) and a very nice, nuanced performance. I suggest including the leaders as well if you go for it!
> 
> 
> 
> *Have fun!*




This is great, Noam. I'm going to add this to my BBCSO "to-do" list now that I'm up and running.


----------



## redlester

Living Fossil said:


> Thanks, @muk , nice to see that it's possible indeed to discuss topics.
> Your guess about what made me think the rendering is cheesy is quite accurate, however i'll try to add some additional impressions.
> As @jbuhler has mentioned, it's quite a conventional exercise to orchestrate piano pieces. However, usually the aim is to enforce the intended characteristics of the piece.
> This one is quite limited in its range and also in its dynamic range.
> A melodic statement that works when played softly turns (in my opinion) into cheesy when you shout it. So, the loud brassy part for me really turns that simple child-like melody into something slightly vulgar.
> Second thing: The piano is a pluck instrument. Once a note is played, there is no real way to inforce it or add a conscious vibrato etc.
> One thing about the melodic language of the Gnossiennes is that once you've heard the piece, it will go on in your head - it becomes a silent musique d'ameublement - that at a certain point you imagine to sing with your voice in your head. So, all the emotional potential that these simple, catchy tunes have, remain implicit as long as the music is played. (I'm not sure if it's comprehensive what i wrote).
> So, the expression takes place rather in your head than in reality. With woodwinds playing vibrato, this magic is gone. It gets the emotion that Satie was so obsessed with to omit.
> Third thing: one reason why it is good to maintain the intended range and dynamics is the fact that normally, a deviation of the intended ranges would have a consequence in the music.
> When you turn a soft melody loud, you would maybe echo it by other instruments. Or you would add a counterpoint etc.
> 
> But, as a final statement in this thread where i obviously stepped on many toes: As initially stated, i really didn't wanted to be offensive, but was somehow offended myself by two aspects:
> 1) I think the specific choice of the piece is disrespectful against Eric Satie, since it turns his vision of a humble music upside down into an elitist and somehow snobbish orchestral Pump & Circumstances piece.
> 2) Maybe that's hard to understand for people who aren't affected by this, but for me (and many colleagues) the situation in composing for film and media gets harder and harder.
> On one side, budgets for music are rapidly going down. Usually (it's probably different if you work in Hollywood or for the BBC) the budgets don't provide orchestral recordings etc. etc.
> On the other side, there is an increase of ignorance towards the profession of a composer and music itself. It's not unusual to find people, working in the film industry, who can't tell apart the profession of a DJ and the profession of a composer. And it's quite usual, that a harmonic language that isn't tonal is perceived as "sounddesign". (like that wonderful piece of sounddesign called "Atmospheres" in Kubrick's Space Oddity).
> Making statements as "everybody is an orchestrator" in such an environment is vicious.
> 
> And finally, as i've written in my first post [most people probably didn't read it so far] of course i think it's great that ChH is offering tutorials!
> Peace!



I'd hate to think what your opinion is on Wendy Carlos and Tomita!


----------



## Living Fossil

redlester said:


> I'd hate to think what your opinion is on Wendy Carlos and Tomita!



This statement gives me the impression that you haven't really understood much of what i meant...
I'm actually a great admirer of Wendy Carlos' work. Don't know Tomita enough to have an opinion.
however, if you want to explain me how you come to the assumption that i would not like Wendy, please drop me a PM.
There's no need to derail this thread any further.


----------



## jononotbono

NoamL said:


> Hey everyone.
> 
> In the spirit of what @christianhenson is doing for the composer community, here is one of my favorite pieces for strings, the Elgar *Strings Serenade*, 2nd Movement. I made a mockup of it ages ago, and just dug out the original MIDI.
> 
> I think the piece would suit BBCSO admirably, especially the beautiful true-sampled _con sordino_ in BBCSO. It's public domain so you can use the mockup in your portfolio, you'll learn from one of the greatest string orchestrators ever, and plus, Elgar was a Brit! :emoji_tea:🇬🇧
> 
> It's a bit of a big project to chew on, but there is so much to learn from how Elgar uses the strings sensitively & masterfully.
> 
> The MIDI is attached below, which is a 1:1 copy of the sheet music.
> 
> Here is a video with the sheet music (because the MIDI won't tell you when the players are doing divisi, pizzicato, or con sord.) and a very nice, nuanced performance. I suggest including the leaders as well if you go for it!
> 
> 
> 
> *Have fun!*




This is a fine gift. Thank you. 

And thanks Christian for a wicked video!


----------



## gussunkri

This is amazing Christian! Thanks for sharing. I will learn a lot from this! This is exactly the kind of stuff I was hoping for when I bought the BBCSO.


----------



## christianhenson

Just downloading Cubase now to port it onto that, can I use Cubase without the dingle thingy???


----------



## johanholmstrom

christianhenson said:


> Just downloading Cubase now to port it onto that, can I use Cubase without the dingle thingy???


Requires dongle I’m afraid...


----------



## Loïc D

christianhenson said:


> Just downloading Cubase now to port it onto that, can I use Cubase without the dingle thingy???


AFAIK, nope...


----------



## gussunkri

christianhenson said:


> Just downloading Cubase now to port it onto that, can I use Cubase without the dingle thingy???


Reaper on the other hand requires no dingle dongles and is great. Can’t we all agree to use that as our universal starting point. It is cheap and super stable!  Ok, I guess us Reaper folk are a minority.


----------



## Uiroo

gussunkri said:


> Reaper on the other hand requires no dingle dongles and is great. Can’t we all agree to use that as our universal starting point. It is cheap and super stable!  Ok, I guess us Reaper folk are a minority.


Well, if you'd throw in low-cost as an argument for universal starting point, it should really be cakewalk, because it's totally free (and I read it's supposed to be decent), right?

Other than that, Cubase and Logic seem to be the big two DAW's, I think they ARE the universal starting points because they are the industry standard. 

I mean, you can learn a different DAW because it's cheaper, but if you want to be an assistant some day, you really want to be an expert at industry standard software. So i'm not really sure if you should start with Cakewalk, except for when you really don't have the money for Cubase or Logic at all.


----------



## gussunkri

Uiroo said:


> Well, if you'd throw in low-cost as an argument for universal starting point, it should really be cakewalk, because it's totally free (and I read it's supposed to be decent), right?
> 
> Other than that, Cubase and Logic seem to be the big two DAW's, I think they ARE the universal starting points because they are the industry standard.
> 
> I mean, you can learn a different DAW because it's cheaper, but if you want to be an assistant some day, you really want to be an expert at industry standard software. So i'm not really sure if you should start with Cakewalk, except for when you really don't have the money for Cubase or Logic at all.


My strategy is to get the industry to adapt to me and my Reaper use, rather than me adapting to the industry. Wish me luck!


----------



## synkrotron

miket said:


> In any case, I don't get the impression that Christian is saying that his video will allow anyone to orchestrate like Debussy or Takemitsu in an instant. Instead, it's offering a look into something which might be foreign to many, demystifying it a little, and possibly giving them incentive to then pursue mastering it. That's in keeping with Spitfire's recent emphasis on education, etc., and I think it's great.



Hi Mike,

Having read your post again, I was wondering if you thought my (rather un-cool comment) about "elitism" was somehow targeted at Christian, which it wasn't.

cheers

andy


----------



## Uiroo

gussunkri said:


> My strategy is to get the industry to adapt to me and my Reaper use, rather than me adapting to the industry. Wish me luck!


Good Luck! :D


----------



## CT

synkrotron said:


> Hi Mike,
> 
> Having read your post again, I was wondering if you thought my (rather un-cool comment) about "elitism" was somehow targeted at Christian, which it wasn't.
> 
> cheers
> 
> andy



No, not at all!


----------



## Mornats

Logic is proprietary to the Mac so it's not universal... Just saying 

So it's great to see others helping out with other templates and kudos to Christian and Spitfire for supporting that.


----------



## synkrotron

miket said:


> No, not at all!



Thank goodness 

At the end of the day, though, I shouldn't have chipped in with that comment.


----------



## Zedcars

christianhenson said:


> Just downloading Cubase now to port it onto that, can I use Cubase without the dingle thingy???


If you have an eLicenser dongle from VSL, or any company listed below, then that will also work as it’s the same thing. Yes, it is a huge pain in the posterior. Incidentally, if I remember correctly, didn’t eMagic also have a dongle before Apple came along? Seems they use their own hardware as a giant dongle these days...

Companies who use, or have used, the Steinberg USB eLicenser:


Algorithmix
Arturia
Axis Plugins
Eiosis
Iosono
Real Sound Lab
reFX
Vengeance Sound
Vienna Symphonic Library
VirSyn Software Synthesizer
Waldorf
XILS-lab


----------



## christianhenson

That is nuts, it makes it an absolute no-no for going on the road with... Someone at the HQ is kindly doing a cubase version as we speak.


----------



## JazzDude

so HZ or Junkie XL composes "on the road"? 
I "lol"ed hard on yr comment Christian. 
I use e-licenser dongles for more than 10 years and i own 3 of em. Never had any problems.


----------



## Mishabou

christianhenson said:


> Just downloading Cubase now to port it onto that, can I use Cubase without the dingle thingy???



Are you using VEP pro with your studio set up ? or only one machine with enable/disable tracks in LPX ?


----------



## christianhenson

one machine.... gonna try and break it this week.


----------



## christianhenson

So this is a moment for me. I run down a version in Logic, export to MIDI then import into Cubase, whack on a bit of verb and hey presto we have an almost carbon copy in a totally different DAW!!! took minutes to do courtesy of the genius Luke at Spitfire HQ: https://we.tl/t-uAmqxBx56L


----------



## dzilizzi

christianhenson said:


> That is nuts, it makes it an absolute no-no for going on the road with... Someone at the HQ is kindly doing a cubase version as we speak.


I have an elicenser, an ilok, a waves thing, and a codemeter all on a small hub. I don't even bother bringing my setup when I fly. But I drive for most of my travel. I like your setup better.


----------



## slohcine

christianhenson said:


> That is nuts, it makes it an absolute no-no for going on the road with... Someone at the HQ is kindly doing a cubase version as we speak.


Steinberg also offers a software eLicenser. Sorry if already posted.


----------



## Zedcars

slohcine said:


> Steinberg also offers a software eLicenser. Sorry if already posted.


I don’t know which version he was downloading, but I should clarify only the license for Cubase Elements, AI and LE can be stored on the Soft-eLicenser, not the Pro or Artist versions which require the USB-eLicenser.


----------



## IFM

Wow I absolutely love the sound and so far rock solid in LPX on a Mac Pro 6,1 with 64GB or RAM. That template @christianhenson built is a monster...not sure how I may use it or at all as I have a lot of other plugins I need for my compositions. However I will certainly learn from it and import some if it.


----------



## angeruroth

Today I woke up too early, and too sleepy, so I decided to convert the Cubase version to BDT to boot my brain.
There are instruments and articulations missing in BDT, so I went a bit creative, and then replaced the piano with the 9000ft piano and the perc with GM instruments, so if you have BDT you also have everything needed to play it.

There are small changes here and there to accommodate some notes to the new instruments, but only when there was no better option. Also some things like reverb and EQ here and there, but just small things 

Thanks @christianhenson for the video and the project!


----------



## MartinH.

christianhenson said:


> That is nuts, it makes it an absolute no-no for going on the road with... Someone at the HQ is kindly doing a cubase version as we speak.



Just wanted to say that your dislike for DRM dongles warms my heart and gives me hope for the future of Spitfire audio to remain customer-friendly and bright. Thumbs up!


----------



## gussunkri

angeruroth said:


> Today I woke up too early, and too sleepy, so I decided to convert the Cubase version to BDT to boot my brain.
> There are instruments and articulations missing in BDT, so I went a bit creative, and then replaced the piano with the 9000ft piano and the perc with GM instruments, so if you have BDT you also have everything needed to play it.
> 
> There are small changes here and there to accommodate some notes to the new instruments, but only when there was no better option. Also some things like reverb and EQ here and there, but just small things
> 
> Thanks @christianhenson for the video and the project!



Thanks! That was quite nice actually!

I began a version of this with Spitfire Studio Orchestra (augmented with BHCT) based off of Christian's midi but it probably needs more Midi-massage before it is worth sharing.


----------



## NoamL

The "Church Steinway" in the latest vlog is nice!

Also shoutout to the "Sneaky Piano" by @William Palmer . I've been using it on a score recently and every cue gets approved... so I guess prepared piano is "in" again  

Edit: Oh my goodness. That "ODDSemble" is an INSTANT download.


----------



## prodigalson

Just wanted to point out that if anyone’s looking for a deeply sampled grand piano that almost perfectly blends with BBCSO, I’ve been really pleased with Garritan CFX. I replaced the soft piano in the Satie piece with it and just added the same reverb and it sounds very convincingly like it’s in the same room.


----------



## christianhenson

OK, I'm sure a much welcome diversion away from le topic du jour:


----------



## Alex Fraser

christianhenson said:


> OK, I'm sure a much welcome diversion away from le topic du jour:


----------



## christianhenson

Love this!


----------



## arvfur

Her is the Gnossiennes MIDI file done with Steinberg Iconica:


----------



## christianhenson

Interesting!


----------



## Saxer

I can even make crap out of drums!


----------



## porrasm

gussunkri said:


> Reaper on the other hand requires no dingle dongles and is great. Can’t we all agree to use that as our universal starting point. It is cheap and super stable!  Ok, I guess us Reaper folk are a minority.


Same with FL Studio users :(


----------



## christianhenson

I'd like to get my Satie into it..... can you not see how you get on with the MIDI file? As I said it was mixed totally using expression only so should translate direct in provided you pull the correct instruments / articulations in?


----------



## jononotbono

christianhenson said:


> I'd like to get my Satie into it..... can you not see how you get on with the MIDI file? As I said it was mixed totally using expression only so should translate direct in provided you pull the correct instruments / articulations in?



What is a Satie? It feels like I’ve missed out on something massive here! Do tell!


----------



## synkrotron

jononotbono said:


> What is a Satie? It feels like I’ve missed out on something massive here! Do tell!



It is a person.

Google is your friend...


----------



## Alex Fraser

jononotbono said:


> What is a Satie? It feels like I’ve missed out on something massive here! Do tell!


Spitfire Air Tenor Imperial Euphonium. Did you not get the email?


----------



## jononotbono

synkrotron said:


> It is a person.
> 
> Google is your friend...



Is it?


----------



## gussunkri

jononotbono said:


> Is it?


We hope so.


----------



## Alex Fraser

As it provides _access to every distraction known to mankind_, Google is definitely *not* my friend when it comes to being a productive composer.


----------



## synkrotron

jononotbono said:


> Is it?



I suppose it is debatable... I use it a lot anyway.

Perhaps I should have said "a search engine of your choice is your friend."


----------



## dzilizzi

Google is my IT guy.... Not sure about friend, since I think he talks about me behind my back to advertisers.....


----------



## christianhenson

A trip down memory lane:


----------



## Mornats

Nice Bass Collection bass in the background of Paul's video there. SB330 maybe? I've had a few BC basses over the years. They're fantastic!


----------



## Zedcars

synkrotron said:


> Google is your friend...


I beg to differ.


----------



## Zedcars

synkrotron said:


> I suppose it is debatable... I use it a lot anyway.
> 
> Perhaps I should have said "a search engine of your choice is your friend."


I prefer Alta Vista myself.


----------



## Simon Ravn

Cellos (sustained) of BBC sound quite nice here! Violins sound clearly out of tune in BBC though, as can be heard in several demos. Sounds like a worn out VHS tape playing in the lower registers. Let's hope that is fixable.


----------



## Pixelpoet1985

Simon Ravn said:


> Cellos (sustained) of BBC sound quite nice here! Violins sound clearly out of tune in BBC though, as can be heard in several demos. Sounds like a worn out VHS tape playing in the lower registers. Let's hope that is fixable.



Thanks, so I'm not the only one thinking about this... It's okay that they are a bit out of tune, but it's very obvious.


----------



## christianhenson

Sandy and I brush off the mine dust from our tough few weeks being part of the team launching BBCSO and get out fingernails dirty again with a bit of modular madness:


----------



## christianhenson

IMPORTANTY ANOUNCEMENTIES


----------



## rottoy

Two cells split and turned into true legato. 
Then VI Control came around to scat on the whole congregation.


----------



## Mornats

Confirmed. New library is Spitfire Cellular Shagging Evolutions.


----------



## VSTBuzz

Mornats said:


> Confirmed. New library is Spitfire Cellular Shagging Evolutions.


----------



## christianhenson

XXX GEAR PORN DON'T VIEW ON PUBLIC TRANSPORT:


----------



## christianhenson

Are sounds the future?


----------



## christianhenson

An INCREDIBLE new resource for us all... I hope you like, this is the Spitfire team at their best, nothing to do with Paul, nothing to do with me, just an absolute love for this mad job we have all decided to undertake..... please enjoy:





__





Composer Magazine — Spitfire Audio


Composer Magazine is a platform for inspiration showcasing emerging artists and interviews with top composers writing the latest Hollywood blockbuster film scores.




composer.spitfireaudio.com


----------



## CT

Jeez, you folks are on a tear lately....


----------



## christianhenson

Company of super geeks having a heck of a time!


----------



## Fever Phoenix

christianhenson said:


> Company of super geeks having a heck of a time!



A company that has introduced me to VI-composing and has me using the very first Albion still in my everyday template.

Thank you, guys.


----------



## christianhenson

An AMAZING video from Paul, and I get to the bottom of this composer magazine:


----------



## NoamL

Wow. really nice sound. Sure that mockup could be improved in some aspects but just like every other BBCSO mockup it's so impressive how the sound just glues together with Paul having to do any mic balancing.


----------



## christianhenson

Missed the NYC walk? Don't worry, walk with us on my vlog:


----------



## paulthomson

Who wants my Mac Pro?


----------



## christianhenson

How to succeed and survive writing AAA Games Music:


----------



## christianhenson

An offering for Black Friday from Pianobook, is it going to be crap?


----------



## christianhenson

Missed yesterday? Enjoy a sense of it here:


----------



## redlester

I forgot to ask Christian while we were there, just how many Mac Pro’s are in that top floor room where the libraries are created, and will you be replacing them with the new model when available?


----------



## christianhenson

We're not in any hurry!


----------



## LinusW

Good to hear I'm not the only one battling open heart surgery.


----------



## MarcHedenberg

christianhenson said:


> We're not in any hurry!



Christian, really enjoyed the Spitfire Audio Day, so thank you for that (the masterclass should have been 30 minutes longer, though!).


----------



## christianhenson

Thanks Marc, and thanks for the feedback!


----------



## christianhenson

Do you guys think you can forge a career without being a tech head???


----------



## christianhenson

After a brief hiatus due to some family illness I'm back with a new feature to accompany this vide:



I've made a playlist so you can hear what on earth I'm prattling on about here:



Let me know if this is a welcome feature.


----------



## christianhenson

Here's my take:


----------



## chillbot

Bravo, cheese, dogs, sold.


----------



## Fever Phoenix

christianhenson said:


> Here's my take:




Dear Christian,

I agree with so much you say here and your statement(s) are very encouraging. However, if it comes to publishment and distribution, many times the production company that produces a film or a show has ties or in my cases is owned by a bigger company and by accepting the job you have to publish through them or you don't work. So, to a degree some shares will go to the publisher. In Germany, Switzerland and Austria this seems to be pretty much the case with the major players.

I am saying, sometimes, we cannot keep all the rights. Copyright is obviously mine and I will get paid for that, but distribution is their field and therefore they get their share.

Is it the norm to get the full 100% of royalties in the UK? Or is it a matter of negotiation everytime?

Thank you for your thoughts,

Raoul

edit: oh and thank you all so much for Epic Woodwinds and Brass! Just landed in my inbox?! Lovely surprise for legacy owners


----------



## chrisr

Fever Phoenix said:


> Is it the norm to get the full 100% of royalties in the UK? Or is it a matter of negotiation everytime?



Regarding percentages, the UK and USA describe the same thing in different ways. In the UK we'd say that the writer's share is generally 50% of the total performance royalties. Composers who join PRS cannot ask for any less than that amount, but can receive up to the full 100% (and mechanicals if you've got the leverage, and the right agent who is savvy enough to swing such a deal)

In the USA, ASCAP and BMI describe that_ same thing_ not as 50% of the performance royalties, but 100% of the "writers share" of the performance royalties, the other 50% of total performance royalties being described as 100% "Publishers Share". So a cue sheet has, as it were, 200% total performance royalties! It's language that reinforces the idea that composers should only take a maximum of half of the total performance royalties, which is a bit of linguistic deception if you ask me.

So, it's normal to get at least half of all performance royalties, in whatever way you might wish to describe that. Everything is always up for negotiation, but with virtually all the bigger production companies the person you'll be negotiating with will have their hands tied from above as to what they are allowed to offer. The UK composer who famously got mechanicals on a massive worldwide hit show got it because they/their agent gambled financially on the shows success and the production companies involved clearly wanted to spread their risk.

My own experience so far has been that the split is 50/50 and described by them as "non negotiable" and that's been alright with me. I mean, it is negotiable, but essentially they're saying take it or leave it.


----------



## chrisr

christianhenson said:


> Let me know if this is a welcome feature.



Yes, very much so, thanks.


----------



## Fever Phoenix

chrisr said:


> Regarding percentages, the UK and USA describe the same thing in different ways. In the UK we'd say that the writer's share is generally 50% of the total performance royalties. Composers who join PRS cannot ask for any less than that amount, but can receive up to the full 100% (and mechanicals if you've got the leverage, and the right agent who is savvy enough to swing such a deal)
> 
> In the USA, ASCAP and BMI describe that_ same thing_ not as 50% of the performance royalties, but 100% of the "writers share" of the performance royalties, the other 50% of total performance royalties being described as 100% "Publishers Share". So a cue sheet has, as it were, 200% total performance royalties! It's language that reinforces the idea that composers should only take a maximum of half of the total performance royalties, which is a bit of linguistic deception if you ask me.
> 
> So, it's normal to get at least half of all performance royalties, in whatever way you might wish to describe that. Everything is always up for negotiation, but with virtually all the bigger production companies the person you'll be negotiating with will have their hands tied from above as to what they are allowed to offer. The UK composer who famously got mechanicals on a massive worldwide hit show got it because they/their agent gambled financially on the shows success and the production companies involved clearly wanted to spread their risk.
> 
> My own experience so far has been that the split is 50/50 and described by them as "non negotiable" and that's been alright with me. I mean, it is negotiable, but essentially they're saying take it or leave it.


Thank you for that insight.

So, in the end practices are similar all over. English is not my first language, so when it comes to a legal debate my vocabulary might be limited as I am not an expert in that in my mother tongue .

Many changes and grey zones, especially with the ever growing digital aspects of our work and our world

In Germany, the general formula(s) are 50/50 for cinema, 66.5/33.5 for TV, meaning publisher takes a third.


----------



## redlester

christianhenson said:


> Let me know if this is a welcome feature.



It's a very welcome feature, but can we have it in Apple Music as well as Spotify?


----------



## christianhenson

Fever Phoenix said:


> Dear Christian,
> 
> I agree with so much you say here and your statement(s) are very encouraging. However, if it comes to publishment and distribution, many times the production company that produces a film or a show has ties or in my cases is owned by a bigger company and by accepting the job you have to publish through them or you don't work. So, to a degree some shares will go to the publisher. In Germany, Switzerland and Austria this seems to be pretty much the case with the major players.
> 
> I am saying, sometimes, we cannot keep all the rights. Copyright is obviously mine and I will get paid for that, but distribution is their field and therefore they get their share.
> 
> Is it the norm to get the full 100% of royalties in the UK? Or is it a matter of negotiation everytime?
> 
> Thank you for your thoughts,
> 
> Raoul
> 
> edit: oh and thank you all so much for Epic Woodwinds and Brass! Just landed in my inbox?! Lovely surprise for legacy owners




Yes, I too have been coerced to give up my "publisher's" rights many times, and by coerced I mean "if you don't accept this you don't get the job". What is fucking particularly heinous about this is that it is a FLAGRANT breaking of EU law. What I would give to invest a few million in taking all of these cunts to court for illegal restriction of trade. Which is WHAT IT IS!!!!


----------



## christianhenson

love the way VI-C automatically provided me with some asterisks!


----------



## KallumS

christianhenson said:


> love the way VI-C automatically provided me with some asterisks!



I think that's a new feature.


----------



## Technostica

redlester said:


> It's a very welcome feature, but can we have it in Apple Music as well as Spotify?


There's a free version of Spotify but not for Apple Music which makes Spotify preferable in some scenarios.  
I'd rather support an independent service not tied to a massive company which have profits from other sources; this also includes Google, Amazon etc.
Independents are more likely to offer a service that is equal across platforms unlike some of the corporate behemoths which can slant things in their favour.


----------



## redlester

Technostica said:


> There's a free version of Spotify but not for Apple Music which makes Spotify preferable in some scenarios.
> I'd rather support an independent service not tied to a massive company which have profits from other sources; this also includes Google, Amazon etc.
> Independents are more likely to offer a service that is equal across platforms unlike some of the corporate behemoths which can slant things in their favour.



Yeah, I get all that. but I use Apple Music, not Spotify.

By the way I was actually joking (hence the wink after my post). It took me 3/4 mins to recreate Christian’s playlist in Apple Music.


----------



## Technostica

redlester said:


> Yeah, I get all that. but I use Apple Music, not Spotify.



Sure and some use Google, Amazon etc so using the largest provider that offers a free tier is good.


----------



## chrisr

christianhenson said:


> What I would give to invest a few million in taking all of these c**** to court for illegal restriction of trade. Which is WHAT IT IS!!!!



If you genuinely thought that was a goer I would contribute ££ towards it, as I'm sure would most PRS associate/full writer members, though I expect it's been looked at before and discounted? I guess the PRS itself wouldn't be of much assistance in that sort of action, wearing multiple hats as it does.


----------



## Fever Phoenix

christianhenson said:


> Yes, I too have been coerced to give up my "publisher's" rights many times, and by coerced I mean "if you don't accept this you don't get the job". What is fucking particularly heinous about this is that it is a FLAGRANT breaking of EU law. What I would give to invest a few million in taking all of these c**** to court for illegal restriction of trade. Which is WHAT IT IS!!!!



Basically wording my exact situation and position. Well, still better than the streaming world, I guess.


----------



## vladsartini

christianhenson said:


> Yes, I too have been coerced to give up my "publisher's" rights many times, and by coerced I mean "if you don't accept this you don't get the job". What is fucking particularly heinous about this is that it is a FLAGRANT breaking of EU law. What I would give to invest a few million in taking all of these c**** to court for illegal restriction of trade. Which is WHAT IT IS!!!!




Chris this is extremely clarifying and mortifying. But it can actually be noticed, the times that this happened by just looking at your spotify profile and on each álbum you can see who the publisher is.

Now, is it possible you could get some of the big heads of the business to give their two cents or just teach everyone that how you can get to hold on to them?
Because it doesn't seem like the likes of Hans Zimmer are actually holding on to their publishing rights, and I even remembre(auto correct) that himself wanted Warner(I believe) to publish his "X-Periments" álbum as na extension.


----------



## Michael Antrum

I am a hobbyist, with absolutely no intention of trying to make a career in this industry. If my son/daughter wanted to try and make a living in this field, I would, with regret, discourage them. 

The reason for this is what is happening to composers is quite similar to what has happened in the VFX industry. Remember the company Rhythm & Hues - they won an oscar on 24th February 2013 for the best Visual FX. However, they had filed for chapter 11 bankruptcy just two weeks earlier.

Ridiculous workloads, stupidly long hours and tight deadlines, where above and beyond seems to be the minimum standard, and the financial rewards constantly under pressure.

What is clear that the small guy always gets squeezed, except perhaps for those lucky (and extremely hardworking) few who manage to rise to the top.

I have nothing but the greatest respect for those who try to make their way in this business - but I wouldn't want to join them - I'd have to be a pretty damn successful composer to provide for my wife and children to the same standard we have now.

And I suspect that it would portably suck the joy out of making music for me too......


----------



## Fever Phoenix

Michael Antrum said:


> If my son/daughter wanted to try and make a living in this field, I would, with regret, discourage them



My son will have my support to chase his dreams, as long as he puts in the work and does not expect the world to hand out rewards for nothing.

I my case, the hard work, long breath and persistance paid off. I don't think it is fair to label one rather big field as unsafe. The world is changing rapidly, the work world with it. Going self employed was the best thing I ever did. But of course there are many ways and paths and no one road to success to rule them all and of course we want the best for our children.


----------



## christianhenson

The money is there, it requires hard work, passion and an understanding that you need to be an entrepreneur. Being open minded and educated about the challenges ahead is a considerable part of the battle. So make your son aware of this but don't advise against his career choice (unless that is to be a dancer or actor).


----------



## South Thames

> Because it doesn't seem like the likes of Hans Zimmer are actually holding on to their publishing rights, and I even remembre(auto correct) that himself wanted Warner(I believe) to publish his "X-Periments" álbum as na extension.



If you have access to the PRS database, you can check the ownership of cues and, as you say, it's perfectly clear that Hanz Zimmer and John Williams etc are not getting any of the publisher's share.

@christianhenson -- Given that the titans of the industry are apparently not getting that share (and indeed have never gotten it far as I can see) I'm not sure what the precedent for encouraging media composers to ask for it, or to feel cheated out of it, is. I can see if a fledgling production company doesn't have much upfront money to offer a composer they might use a percentage of publishing to sweeten the pill, but in the mainstream of the industry, the 50/50 composer/publisher split seems to be de rigueur and has been for a long time, no?


----------



## christianhenson

Yes, absolutely. But Discovery is taking the writers share away, that is the crux of my video and is totally illegal in the EU. Major studios ALWAYS take the publishers half as they require total control of copyright, but traditionally they compensate well for this. With smaller film companies it is negotiable, as with TV. In European law it is illegal for composers to be coerced into giving away their publisher's rights by TV companies but this law is largely ignored. In my video I talked about Two Pints Of Lager & A Packet Of Crisps where I was "offered" publishing. This I took hastily (they compensated me to the tune of £1,000) without thinking about the long term impact which cost me £100,000 over 10 years roughly. imagine if I made that mistake maybe 3 times a year what the impact would be over 10 years? This as a means of illustrating to people how trying to keep and fighting for your rights is an incredibly important thing to do.

When synchronising pre-recorded music you pay twice for "two sides" these are usually given favoured nation status, which means the same basically. So you want to put Radiohead on your film you'll be quoted say $100,000 a side, which means it'll cost you $200,000 of which half goes to the record company half goes to the publisher (of which members of Radiohead will receive earnings depending on the writer / publisher split and their individual split of the writers share).

So it is very important that us commissioned composers also see this very distinct separation of rights. If a film company wants to create a piece of copyright that they own then they need to compensate you fully for coming up with some notes and recording them and all the things that go in between this is usually referred to "the fee" they will then cover all other costs, orchestration, musicians, studios etc etc. If they don't want to administer these costs then you're often offered what is known as a package deal the encompasses your "fee" and all costs FOR THE MASTER RECORDINGS. 

HOWEVER, If they want to own the notes as well as the master recordings of them (of which you should retain a minimum of 50% writer's share) then there should be compensation for that also (this is referred to as "the buyout fee") to provide them with the legal quid pro quo that they need in order to prove ownership of publishing.

This is why I am always very careful when recording sample sessions in preparation for a new production to undertake these early in the process and show a clear paper trail of my company being invoiced direct, and listed on the MU forms as the "production company" not via my agent with no involvement of whom I'm being commissioned by so as to retain copyright ownership of those samples for future productions.

In summary

1. keep you publisher's share if you can (and publish yourself or through a service like Kobalt)
2. try and negotiate a better split than 50/50 if your commissioner insists that they control publishing and you feel is NOT compensating you appropriately
3. if you're being coerced into giving away your publisher's share make sure you're compensated well to mitigate against future losses (Imagine how much Thomas Newman's score for American Beauty was worth to a publisher for example, however it could be argued that the publisher in question was very effective in seeking additional usages beyond the score for a very small scale film).
3. NEVER GIVE AWAY ANY OF YOUR WRITERS SHARE if no one else is writing your music.

Its important to note that whilst it may appear that often a-list composers don't have control over their publishing rights you probably find plenty of examples where they are controlled by a publishing company that they have set up, or indeed have a stake in. But where it is clear that its a straight buyout (as you have found) you can believe me that negotiation will always have been thorough and payment appropriate as a totally separate aspect to the fee charged for making the master recordings.


----------



## South Thames

@christianhenson

Thanks! That all makes good sense, but:



> In my video I talked about Two Pints Of Lager & A Packet Of Crisps where I was "offered" publishing. This I took hastily (they compensated me to the tune of £1,000) without thinking about the long term impact which cost me £100,000 over 10 years roughly.



I have to say, this story confused me. In your video, you describe it as an 'advance' - implying that you should have got some agreed percentage after the advance was recouped. But as I understand, what they really did was pay you £1,000 to buy out any claim you had on the publisher's share, in addition to your upfront fee and your composer's share of the PRO income. 

And I think what you're saying in your post is that a monetary 'buyout' of the publisher's share should always be a factor when agreeing compensation, if a share of the publishing for the composer is not possible. But how to put a value on that, since it's essentially speculative? 

(Coincidentally, it reminds me of reading that in the mid-seventies, Frederick Forsyth took up his publisher's offer to 'buy out' Day Of The Jackal for £75,000 (a lot of money then), since he thought it had had its day as a bestseller. He took the money and forfeited any further royalty income. Decades later it was still selling.)


----------



## christianhenson

The word “advance” is a standard term for payment for publishing as it is offered in “advance” of future earnings that you and the publisher will make. You have non recoupable advances where a publisher simply speculates that they will make their investment back and some (as they did here) and recoupable advances which tend to be much bigger gambles for the publisher (ie they pay more up front but get their cash back first) but this extra risk gives the publisher a vested interest in secondary exploitation of their newly acquired catalogue which the artist likes (alongside a massive up front payment). General publishing deals where all your publishing needs to be published by a single entity (never do it until you’re worth gazillions) tend to be recoupable where single assignments (ie X publisher publishes your score for Two Pints...) tend not to be.

the point I made badly is that 1,000 quid, essentially beer money is never worth giving up 50% of a right away for, some basic research would reveal that I was likely to get £600 back in the first year alone just from the extra 50% of income, add to that repeats in y2/3 and you’re done... but this series ran for 10+ seasons so multiply those multiple TX’s and repeats over multiple years and you get a net loss of 100k over ten years for a small injection of 1k in y1 to help cash flow.

It goes back to what I said at the very beginning of the video, if you don’t value your music no one will do it on your behalf so be bloody careful about giving up rights if you have a choice and if you don’t make sure you bloody get compensated for it. It isn’t speculative it is what you feel you are worth!


----------



## mverta

You know what I was thinking, though? Take the money out of it and we might get actual musicians again.


----------



## Saxer

mverta said:


> You know what I was thinking, though? Take the money out of it and we might get actual musicians again.


If there is a universal basic income guarantee for everyone there will be better musicians and better music. But as long as nobody can afford to make music very few will be actual musicians any more.


----------



## flim flam

Saxer said:


> If there is a universal basic income guarantee for everyone there will be better musicians and better music.



"Free stuff" is a great idea until you realise that there is no such thing as free stuff. There is only coercion (forced redistribution of property) masquerading as "free stuff". UBI (or any other socialist policy) just means forcing a redistribution of property from the MOST productive in society to the LEAST productive.

Not only is this immoral, it actually does not help the poor or the aspirational. The hidden costs of 'free stuff' (both financial as well as social) always outweigh the supposed benefits (except for the tiny minority who profit from the coercion and the social dysfunction at everyone else's expense).

Socialised sectors (such as socialised education or infrastructure or transport) are always the MOST dysfunctional, corrupt, stagnant, bloated, wasteful, demoralised and backward sectors in any society because they are always filled up with parasites .. er.... parasitising off the 'free stuff' and enjoying their job security (shielded from the free market where people have to actually demonstrate their value on a daily basis in order to keep their job or keep their business profitable).

What drives any industry, sector and the economy as a whole is INNOVATION (new business start ups AND the failure of unproductive or outdated businesses). And most business startups operate at a loss - often for years - to begin with. Musicians and composers certainly fit category.

But UBI means most start ups cannot get off the ground because they cannot hire employees (or be hired themselves) on the cheap during this critical stage.

For example ...... suppose you were around when Spitfire first started out (funding their first libs out of their own pockets) and therefore operating at a loss. You have musician or programming skills and you see the potential in these guys. You think they are going to be massive in a few years. You like their ballsy attitude to business and to sampling. You want to offer your services and get on board from the start, even if that means accepting little (or even no) pay to begin with.

Such an arrangement would be like being an informal partner/ employee. Instead of investing money, you offer to invest your labour and your skills for low wages or even for 'free'. But in return they will consider hiring you properly as soon as the business gets off the ground and they start making proper money. That shows them you have commitment to their new business, trust in them as future employers and you got balls too! So they would likely hire you on that basis. 

It is a classic WIN - WIN scenario. They get cheap/ free labour when the need it the most. You get your leg in the door based on your attitude and skills, perhaps with no formal qualifications or a proper CV. You both help to build up each other's career aspirations.

But under UBI this kind of arrangement would be illegal, and that would not benefit you or Spitfire. Or the industry of sampling, or the economy as a whole.


----------



## South Thames

> But under UBI this kind of arrangement would be illegal



Why would it be illegal?


----------



## mverta

A guaranteed something for nothing. Interesting idea. Nature's had about four and a half billion years to field test that one. I wonder what her verdict is?

Now, don't get me wrong. I'm a big advocate for guaranteed income. You all just relax and not worry about a thing. Just get nice and comfy. That's where all the best architecture, art, music, philosophy, science, comes from - lives of ease and comfort, without all the stress of being alive. Hell, I'll throw some money at that right now. It'll be like job security.


----------



## christianhenson

Do All Roads Lead To Pro-Tools?


----------



## NoamL

@christianhenson interesting insights in this one. I know two folks who ONLY use Pro Tools specifically because it makes everything "easier to deliver." It always seems to end up being a little more complicated than just sending a final Pro Tools session though doesn't it?

They also use Pro Tools for SCORING which just seems a bit off to me.

One of the things Logic does brilliantly is you can set bar 5 to any SMPTE you want, thus "shoving" the unused portion of the movie into the invisible space to the left of your computer  I have a collaborator who uses Pro Tools and it doesn't appear possible to shove the movie before session start. You can rename any point in the session to bar 1, but... when they export a MIDI it looks like 500 bars of nothing and then the music starts, because of course that's what the actual Pro Tools session is.

What you've said about using Pro Tools as a bird's eye view of the entire score is very cool though, especially as cuts change.


----------



## tmhuud

I have no real choice. Everything I deliver is finalized in PT. If they need changes, I would prefer to make those changes myself. The only way to do that is if I output in PT. I feel better about making changes to MY music vs having someone else do it. That and of course I love the PT environ when it comes to audio and surround.


----------



## christianhenson

NoamL said:


> @christianhenson interesting insights in this one. I know two folks who ONLY use Pro Tools specifically because it makes everything "easier to deliver." It always seems to end up being a little more complicated than just sending a final Pro Tools session though doesn't it?
> 
> They also use Pro Tools for SCORING which just seems a bit off to me.
> 
> One of the things Logic does brilliantly is you can set bar 5 to any SMPTE you want, thus "shoving" the unused portion of the movie into the invisible space to the left of your computer  I have a collaborator who uses Pro Tools and it doesn't appear possible to shove the movie before session start. You can rename any point in the session to bar 1, but... when they export a MIDI it looks like 500 bars of nothing and then the music starts, because of course that's what the actual Pro Tools session is.
> 
> What you've said about using Pro Tools as a bird's eye view of the entire score is very cool though, especially as cuts change.



Pro tools uses Time Code as its heart beat so the movie will always sync to the timecode and you can place bar 1 or 5 wherever you want on that timeline. Its a slightly different way of thinking> I guess the bigger question is can protools handle minus bars and the answer is yes.... it wasn't always so though.

...and yes to corroborate tmhuud everything gets put into Pro Tools eventually at dubbing stage so you can just send the stems and sums but you have to trust that the engineer (or rather their assistant) understands how these are put together and that they spot them in correctly. Remember they're under pressure too. I had an ethnic flute stem slip out by a 16th note on a major movie that went to broadcast with an end cue that sounded like demolition derby. I think its also important to deliver yourself on ProTools so that alternative versions of cues are muted to imply your preference etc etc.


----------



## Anders Wall

NoamL said:


> @christianhenson interesting insights in this one. I know two folks who ONLY use Pro Tools specifically because it makes everything "easier to deliver." It always seems to end up being a little more complicated than just sending a final Pro Tools session though doesn't it?
> 
> They also use Pro Tools for SCORING which just seems a bit off to me.
> ...


Yes, and if all is OK with @christianhenson I'd like to show the Logic/PT in my class.
I'll send you a proper request.

RE: ProTools
It works just fine. Not that it's easier to deliver, it's always a struggle 
But I do send my "Save copy as...include Audio" file/folder to Post and that always works.
It's more the content that's a struggle :O

Anyhow, I compose on paper, use Dorico for notation and ProTools for the rest.
Never send my PT midi outside the Avid environment, hate those 500 bars of nothingness.
I've got a copy of Logic that I never use.
On the HDX/Ultimate route so there's little to none latency and the thing never (and that's true) never crashes on me.
VI's are hosted outside PT.

Best,
Anders


----------



## christianhenson

Anders you're free to use these however you wish

Best

C.


----------



## Geoff Grace

christianhenson said:


> Do All Roads Lead To Pro-Tools?



*Christian*, I really enjoyed your vlog's unexpected shift in reality after "let's head back to the shed to check this out" provided by your score accompanying your dogs scurrying down the hill. I was watching a vlog, but suddenly it was a film. I laughed with delight!

The tutorial that followed was very useful, as always; but that descent to the shed scene was one of the best bits in any vlog I've seen. It was slightly akin to the alien scene in _Life of Brian_ in how unexpected it was. You called it "rubbish," but I thought it was a gem. I wish more content was created that way.

Bravo!

Best,

Geoff


----------



## christianhenson

Stop it purple! my thread will get chucked into the canal that is “political threads” again.


----------



## purple

christianhenson said:


> Stop it purple! my thread will get chucked into the canal that is “political threads” again.


Oh, I thought we were already there. I'll remove it.


----------



## christianhenson

Some real treats here:


----------



## christianhenson

Had such a lovely time on the latest composer walk, as always learned so much about different angles carving a career in music, and on THIS walk we were joined by two special guests:


----------



## thesteelydane

Thanks for having me, Christian and everyone else on the walk - an honour and a privilege to meet you all!

I filmed a tiny little vlog/thank-you-note on my way back to Hanoi (sorry for the poor production quality, it was shot and edited entirely on my phone):



Forgot to say the obligatory like, subscribe and ding-the-bell, but I'd obviously love it if you did!


----------



## gamma-ut

flim flam said:


> ...
> Not only is this immoral, it actually does not help the poor or the aspirational. The hidden costs of 'free stuff' (both financial as well as social) always outweigh the supposed benefits (except for the tiny minority who profit from the coercion and the social dysfunction at everyone else's expense).
> ...



_Ayn Rand has joined the chat_


----------



## christianhenson

What are your best purchases?


----------



## ag75

christianhenson said:


> What are your best purchases?



Maschine mikro, so much fun! And HZ strings. Absolutely love that sound.


----------



## MSutherlandComp

christianhenson said:


> What are your best purchases?



... I've been waiting for the opportunity to bring this up! My best purchase of 2019 was - bar none - this bad boy right here. (Shure MV88, for those too lazy to click the link)

I first discovered it when it was mentioned in a Ryuichi Sakamoto interview that he used it for most of the foley et cetera when making his album, Async (check it out if you can).

Growing your own samples is all well and good, but I find that when the moment arises that I hear a really inspiring sound when out and about, I don't usually have the Zoom on me (too bulky for being out on a stroll). With this, I simply have it in my pocket at all times, and plug it into my iPhone.

The sound is amazing for the size and price, and is especially amenable if you are an iZotope RX user. It comes with a great app from Shure that lets you adjust the stereo width, polar pattern, gain, et cetera (even do some light EQing).

I use it every day. Cannot recommend it enough!


----------



## Zedcars

There’s been some criticism about this library, but I genuinely think the BBCSO is my best purchase of 2019 because it has enabled me to compose much quicker and with more satisfying results due to the cohesion and plug ‘n’ play nature of this library.

A piece of music I started many years ago that has been languishing on my hard drive has now had new life breathed into it by the BBCSO. Previously, I was using VSL Symphonic Cube but it just seems quite lifeless in comparison.

So thank you very much for creating such a wonderful library. All the best for 2020.


----------



## vitocorleone123

Now that 2019 is almost over (not all of these are new in 2019, of couse, just new to me)....

1) Valhalla Delay
2) Arturia Keystep
3) Kush Omega TWK tied with Novatron
4) Zero-G Ethera series
5) Audio Imperia Nucleus

I reserve the right to edit this as I remember wtf I bought this year!


----------



## Geoff Grace

This seems a good time to thank you, *Christian*, for your product reviews of Palette Gear and Elgato Stream Deck in 2018. They've been very helpful in my setup in 2019. Stream Deck is X-Keys Pro on steroids!

Thanks as well for Spitfire's many beautiful products. Looking forward to using them in 2020.

Best,

Geoff


----------



## tokatila




----------



## Geoff Grace

@christianhenson, my most sincere condolences on the loss of your father:



I think I speak for many here when I say that our thoughts are with you during this difficult time.

Best,

Geoff


----------



## christianhenson

Many thanks Geoff.

C. x


----------



## CGR

So sorry to hear of your loss Christian.

Craig Richards


----------



## SymphonicSamples

My condolences to you Christian. When my father passed away about 3 years ago, he also for me was the one whom most shared the gift of music as I grew up. After his passing I slowly stopped composing and then completely stop writing music for the last 2 odd years now. I have watched a number of your youtube videos over time and always found your enthusiasm and passion infectious. And after watching this most recent video your words, "Follow your bliss and be yourself" is a wonderful thought and a good time to as 2020 begins. Cheers for the inspiration !!


----------



## Allen Constantine

Sorry to hear about your loss, Christian! 
My sincere condolences!


----------



## Loïc D

Very sorry for your loss, Christian.

I wish you & Spitfire team a great year 2020.


----------



## joed

My sincere condolences.


----------



## christianhenson

SymphonicSamples said:


> My condolences to you Christian. When my father passed away about 3 years ago, he also for me was the one whom most shared the gift of music as I grew up. After his passing I slowly stopped composing and then completely stop writing music for the last 2 odd years now. I have watched a number of your youtube videos over time and always found your enthusiasm and passion infectious. And after watching this most recent video your words, "Follow your bliss and be yourself" is a wonderful thought and a good time to as 2020 begins. Cheers for the inspiration !!



One thing I know for certain is my Dad would want us to keep the laughter and music going, do what makes you happy and there are some friendly people out there to support your every step. Whilst not wanting to divert people away from here the pianobook forum is a very supportive and loving community!

https://piano.community/


----------



## Ashermusic

christianhenson said:


> Many thanks Geoff.
> 
> C. x



Sorry for the loss of your father, Christian. My dad is 96 and although he is doing amazingly well, I know that day cannot be too far off for me.


----------



## Dr.Quest

This is why I so love Spitfire Audio... this wonderful human excitement and passion about all they do. The sharing that Christian does for the community and the treasure trove of ideas that keep the excitement alive. Here's to a splendid New Year for you and all the world!


----------



## christianhenson

The all-year highlight of pianobook is given its first honours list:


----------



## christianhenson

Hope I don't give too much away here:


----------



## brenneisen

beautiful location


----------



## Primary Target

What an incredible location and a new Albion to look forward to. 2020 off to a great start.


----------



## dzilizzi

I'm feeling very cold right now..... :emoji_snowman:

So a new Tundra? On the edge of a frozen night?


----------



## Mornats

Albion VI: Spin (based on the video evidence!). Glad you all got back safely and can't wait to see and hear the result.


----------



## rottoy

Albion VI: Anda


----------



## Anders Wall

rottoy said:


> Albion VI: Anda


s

/A


----------



## rottoy

Anders Wall said:


> s
> 
> /A


Hmm?


----------



## gussunkri

rottoy said:


> Hmm?


Maybe he suggested that an “s” be added to “anda” forming the Swedish word “andas” = “breathe “.


----------



## rottoy

gussunkri said:


> Maybe he suggested that an “s” be added to “anda” forming the Swedish word “andas” = “breathe “.


I considered that possibility, but felt it more prudent to ask.


----------



## Anders Wall

rottoy said:


> I considered that possibility, but felt it more prudent to ask.


No I was more in the sanda or dansa kind of vibe. Not ansad, that would be rude.
Ta,
/A


----------



## rottoy

Anders Wall said:


> Not ansad, that would be rude.
> Ta,
> /A


You have to admit, Spitfire does keep things neat and tidy.


----------



## christianhenson

Some insights into the creation of Spitfire videos:


----------



## christianhenson

... and we're having A LOT of fun working on a future free LABS library!!!


----------



## christianhenson

I spout some crap about apple air pods in this one:



and admit it in this one:


----------



## ironbut

Great stuff Christian!
Regarding your question about the length of the tape loops,..
I asked a guy who makes replacement tapes for the Rolands what the difference was between his 1 and 4 meter versions of replacement tapes;

*New message from: grssystems (1,995

)*
*

The primary difference is in the life of the tape. When using a 4 meter long tape loop versus a 1 meter long loop, the life of the 4 meter long tape loop is at least 4 times longer. This is simply because the the surface area of the 4 meter loop of tape is 4 times as much as the 1 meter long loops.

When the tape head passes over the tape's oxide coating, some oxide wears off. The 4 meter long tape is 4 times longer than the 1 meter loops, so the tape head only affects the same spot on the tape, 4 times less often than on the shorter 1 meter long tape.

So the oxide wears off 4 times less often and the benefit being a much longer lasting tape loop that sounds better much for a much longer time. 4+ times longer!

Other than this benefit, the 1 & 4 meter long GRS X-TRA tape loops are exactly the same in all other performance specs & features.

Thanks for asking!

Regards,

James Davis, MSEE
Analog Tape Systems Engineer / Technician*


----------



## christianhenson

Ooooooh thanks for this!!!

Here's some good news.


----------



## christianhenson

MY FIRST YOUTUBE PREMIERE! A truly amazing chat with a truly amazing person. I'll be watching live so join me!


----------



## CT

Always love to hear what Eric has to say, musically or otherwise. Looking forward to it!


----------



## christianhenson

Its a real cracker this one, being in a room of just composers brings about a truly candid and at times spiritual take on what we do and why we make life so difficult for ourselves!!!


----------



## christianhenson

Taking lessons learned from Spitfire and applying them to composition...


----------



## Mikro93

It is now close to the end of the day here in France, and the aspiring media composer that I am was lacking energy this evening. It was time to brew a nice cuppa, sit down in front of the computer in a comfortable chair, and listen to Christian rambling about that sweet dream of mine.

I'm going to miss the UK in Europe, not only because of personal interests (my girlfriend is British), but also because it marks the end of an era. I've always had an issue with change, even when the change is positive, like a new career. The change is scary, it is unknown, even if the outcome is possibly amazing. And this is one of the reasons why I enjoy your videos so much: they shed just a bit of light on that dark, scary, unknown future that might, someday, be mine/ours.

Thank you, Christian


----------



## ptram

Mikro93 said:


> I'm going to miss the UK in Europe, not only because of personal interests (my girlfriend is British), but also because it marks the end of an era.


And you have not seen everything, yet! Just think when Scotland will secede, and the Englishman Paul will have to ask permission to the government to talk with the Scotchman Christian, and all the exchange on reverbs and articulations will be supervised by the controllers in Bruxelles!

Paolo


----------



## ptram

I don't know it political discussions are admitted in this area of the forum. Only, I would answer to Christian's request of making our ‘British cousins' feel we are near to them, by saying that you might have lost the EU club's membership, but nobody will be able to wipe out your European citizenship. It's just a matter of history and culture, common development, personal and political relationship. And, obviously, of geography (Europe is a continent kept united by its internal seas). We on the continent will continue to use English as our lingua franca. Despite the EU institutions already listing it as the language of Ireland.

Paolo


----------



## Mornats

Speaking as a Brit who didn't want to leave, thank you for your kind words


----------



## PaulBrimstone

Mornats said:


> Speaking as a Brit who didn't want to leave, thank you for your kind words


Likewise.


----------



## christianhenson

Modular Drums... always shite?


----------



## Loïc D

Indeed it's sad to see Europe without our fellow british cousins.
Feels like when the funniest guy is leaving the party.


----------



## christianhenson

Here's a couple of real treats for you:

COMPOSER magazine keeps its production values and content sky high:



...and CRIBS IS BACK!!!


----------



## Alex Fraser

Love cribs. One of the best things about them is that they show working composers happily ignoring the Internet’s Perceived Wisdom (™) on studio setup, gear, acoustics etc.


----------



## C.R. Rivera

In the Ciani, she mentions her first album in 1982 but she actually had "_Voices of Packaged Souls_" in 1970. Is that not a real album?


----------



## ironbut

The Ciani film was wonderful! 
I have great admiration for the members of the San Francisco Tape Music Center. 
Here's a short bit on one of it's founders, Pauline Oliveros.


----------



## christianhenson

You have to check these out:


----------



## christianhenson

Am I getting there or is this just a total car crash?


----------



## christianhenson

How I use small bands mixed in with large samples to create epic realism:



...and if you missed out on the London composers walk:


----------



## barteredbride

@christianhenson you mention in the London Walk, that Spitfire pay royalties to 600 musicians twice a year, which equates to approx 25% of Spitfire´s total turnover!  

Is that the musicians that played on the sample libraries? i.e. a cello player on Tundra?

However it is, hats off to you guys!


----------



## christianhenson

barteredbride said:


> @christianhenson you mention in the London Walk, that Spitfire pay royalties to 600 musicians twice a year, which equates to approx 25% of Spitfire´s total turnover!
> 
> Is that the musicians that played on the sample libraries? i.e. a cello player on Tundra?
> 
> However it is, hats off to you guys!



yes.


----------



## christianhenson

Having problems with tuning during an overdub or vocal session? Tom may have the answer:


----------



## christianhenson

VI-C Can be a testy place, here's something extraordinary I hope some of you take part in:


----------



## Zedcars

christianhenson said:


> VI-C Can be a testy place, here's something extraordinary I hope some of you take part in:



This is really exciting. Definitely going to give this a go.


----------



## CT

Ah, now this is a neat idea. I've had a "two pianos" itch for a while now that I haven't been able to figure out how to scratch. I'm there!


----------



## Michel Simons

An interesting and fun idea. I lack the talent and creativity to make a decent contribution, but I am looking forward to the end result.

I still might download one of the download packs and try to do something on my own.


----------



## christianhenson

Great news, a good op to bring this community together maybe? I'd love other devs to take part! Seeing as its not a spitfire thing per se?


----------



## redlester

Six of the most imaginative win something special, which can’t be talked about? Oooh... new product alert?


----------



## redlester

Michel Simons said:


> An interesting and fun idea. I lack the talent and creativity to make a decent contribution, but I am looking forward to the end result.
> 
> I still might download one of the download packs and try to do something on my own.



Me too. This is very inspiring.


----------



## christianhenson

Michel Simons said:


> An interesting and fun idea. I lack the talent and creativity to make a decent contribution, but I am looking forward to the end result.
> 
> I still might download one of the download packs and try to do something on my own.



Michael!!!!

this is systems music hence no talent or creativity required to gain entry! Lock up your DAW to my plops (that didn’t come out right) and lay down a hi hat or another pulsing note... some thumping bass notes to match the MIDI provided... anything!


----------



## Zedcars

redlester said:


> Six of the most imaginative win something special, which can’t be talked about? Oooh... new product alert?





Spoiler



The gold-plated Spitfire Audio engraved Kazoo will finally be mine


----------



## christianhenson

Rumbled again... Well Spitfire haven't released something in.... what is it? 5 minutes now?


----------



## paulthomson

While you are all working on your systems collabs!! -->

Here I'm having a quick look at a novel way to add rhythmic movement to a slow long strings paddy thing - with short notes - but not how you'd expect...

Hope you find something interesting in it!!

Cheers,

Paul


----------



## tav.one

christianhenson said:


> VI-C Can be a testy place, here's something extraordinary I hope some of you take part in:



Can something with vocals (not words) be recorded, or just instruments?


----------



## gussunkri

tav.one said:


> Can something with vocals (not words) be recorded, or just instruments?


Steve Reich (and 18 musicians) says yes.


----------



## christianhenson

Paul has come up with some crackers this week:





This is what I love about the internet.... 6 people who have never met:


----------



## ptram

The handwritten score in the systems piece materials will for sure mean that integration with Dorico is still not ready!

Paolo


----------



## christianhenson

A rare glimpse of a TV scoring session with downloadable score here: https://we.tl/t-8eJGJ8kZSO to follow as this blistering 2 hours unfold:


----------



## christianhenson

Things are getting going on pianobookpianoday2020



Only a few days left to submit!!!


----------



## Zedcars

christianhenson said:


> Things are getting going on pianobookpianoday2020
> 
> 
> 
> Only a few days left to submit!!!



Hi Christian. I think my entry will be right down to the wire on the Friday. What time will the last submissions be allowed? 11:59pm GMT?

Thanks for organising this crazy collab!


----------



## christianhenson

I'm sure we'll scoop up the stragglers on Saturday!


----------



## christianhenson

Working from home (10 Survival Tips):


----------



## Pablocrespo

Great and honest tips Christian, we have to take care of ourselves and others in this time (Day one of mandatory quarantine countrywide here).

It is ok for me to say that I didn´t have to look at the comments to know which mitchell and webb sketch you were refering to?


----------



## christianhenson

Well, what do YOU think it is:


----------



## rhizomusicosmos

To paraphrase Walter Benjamin: "Ostinato in the Age of Mechanical Reproduction" . . .


----------



## nidhi478

System music will be music with sound continua which develops bit by bit, regularly over extensive stretches of time (Sutherland 1994, 172). Truly, the American minimalist Steve Reich, La Monte Young, and Philip Glass are viewed as the key advocates of this compositional approach.[citation needed] Works by this gathering of authors are frequently described by highlights, for example, balance or redundancy. 

Various English trial arrangers have additionally evolved frameworks based on music especially Michael Parsons, Howard Skempton, John White, and Michael Nyman (Sutherland 1994, 183). 

In the domain of PC music, "System music" alludes to fractal-based, PC helped synthesis, and specifically iterated work frameworks music, in which a capacity "is applied over and again, each time taking as contention its incentive at the past application"


----------



## Richard Wilkinson

Got mine done saturday early evening (bit sidetracked by, you know, the thing) but hoping it'll get scooped up. Fascinated to see and hear this come together - it's even more relevant and needed now.


----------



## christianhenson

What doesd it sound like when you get 381 strangers to play music with nothing more than a BPM a key and a set of chords?


----------



## Richard Wilkinson

christianhenson said:


> What doesd it sound like when you get 381 strangers to play music with nothing more than a BPM a key and a set of chords?



That piano stem sounded great on its own. Good start! I hope there’s been a final straggler hooverup to pick up my entry and some others - I saw a couple of wind/brass entries and it would be lovely to hear them amidst everything else. Also please do a vid with Jake on your approach to the mix, I’m sure loads of us will love to hear about that.

great work so far!


----------



## christianhenson

Here's a couple more vids.... 'said I'd keep the coming!


----------



## rhizomusicosmos

Wow, really coming together! I thought the pianos en-masse sounded like something from a mid-70s Mike Oldfield album, but nothing wrong with that! Thanks for your hard work on this Christian and Jake, it's really inspiring.


----------



## christianhenson

Catch the premiere later!



and the AFTERSHOW:


----------



## rudi

A.M.A.Z.I.N.G


----------



## Zedcars

Such a privilege to have been a small part of this. Really enjoyed the whole experience. Thanks for the effort everyone has put in! Magnificent job Jake did on the mixing too!


----------



## ism

Incredible.

And the mix really is a work of art in its own right. Wow.


----------



## Wunderhorn

Love this project. I wonder if the official track can be obtained somewhere in good quality?
I also wish for this to become an album as a longer immersive musical journey.


----------



## CT

Ended up being unable to contribute, but great to follow nonetheless!


----------



## gussunkri

This was amazing! I didn't expect it to end up sounding so good. I thought it would be more of a fun little project, but it actually ended up sounding like something I would enjoy listening to many times. Well done to everyone involved, and in particular Christian and Jake.


----------



## Alex Fraser

Utterly, utterly magnificent. Watched (and listened) with a huge grin on my face. Congrats Christian and to all those involved!


----------



## christianhenson

Thanks all, here's the final version of the track:


----------



## Alex Fraser

Anyone here spot themselves in the video? And when?


----------



## redlester

Alex Fraser said:


> Anyone here spot themselves in the video? And when?



Only on the credits! But then, my contribution was minimalist to say the least


----------



## Harry

This whole project has been amazing to follow. Final track is superb - an unbelievable piece of work. I feel like jacking this whole thing in now, CH is just an incredible talent.


----------



## Zedcars

Alex Fraser said:


> Anyone here spot themselves in the video? And when?


Um, can't say I've checked really  . But a rough guess at about 10:41, 10:59, 11:01, 13:10, and 14:01 middle right; 14:06 and 14:20 one up from bottom right; and 12:37 if you freeze frame in the 'mad' section. 

One of the clips even has an old photo of me and my dear late granddad back in '77.

What about you?


----------



## Wunderhorn

christianhenson said:


> Thanks all, here's the final version of the track:




Thank you. What an inspiration! - Is this available somewhere in a lossless format?


----------



## proxima

I enjoy the piece, and I really enjoyed the contributions coming at a time of so many people quarantining/isolating. 

And while I think the hired strings add a nice touch musically...I think they subtract from the spirit of the exercise. But that's just my worthless $0.02. Nice job!


----------



## Fever Phoenix

Alex Fraser said:


> Anyone here spot themselves in the video? And when?


I am the guy clapping during the intro at 0.35 and you can see and hear me sing at 12.25, the two windows bottom middle and right  and then in the end for the big rinse


----------



## MisteR

Great.


----------



## Zedcars

I bring you...

The 'Music By 300 Strangers Drum & Bass Remix' (spent all day on this baby!)...

Enjoy...


----------



## redlester

Am intrigued about the idea of doing an album. Is the thinking this would be re-mixes of this same piece, or further additional pieces created using the same methodology?


----------



## Alex Fraser

Zedcars said:


> (spent all day on this baby!)


Worth it.



redlester said:


> Am intrigued about the idea of doing an album. Is the thinking this would be re-mixes of this same piece, or further additional pieces created using the same methodology?


I think CH was referring to pooling from the same source material already recorded.


----------



## christianhenson

NEXT!


----------



## christianhenson

Feeling anxious?


----------



## redlester

christianhenson said:


> Feeling anxious?



My body clock, at 60 years old, is now adjusted to getting up far earlier than when I was younger. But it's still about two hours later than yours Christian!

For me, it's about 9pm when my creative juices start to flow!

Once a night owl, always one. All the best stuff used to be on BBC2 after 11pm...


----------



## christianhenson

You ever had to deal with 381+ tracks?


----------



## christianhenson

ONE YEAR ON..... AND 227 SAMPLE INSTRUMENTS FREE!!!!!!!!


----------



## redlester

Pianobook is such an awesome treasure trove I can barely keep up with it. When I visit the site I feel like the Dutch guy in the Grolsch adverts.... "schtop...schlow down... "

Only joking, it's just the most wonderful resource and constant inspiration. And I expect will create a whole new generation of samplists. Thank you for this.


----------



## christianhenson

Good with a cuppa:


----------



## christianhenson

Some great insights here:


----------



## christianhenson

First in a series...


----------



## rhizomusicosmos

"Thrumming", "swarms", it's all _weft _to me. See Michel Chion's Guide to Sound Objects:

78. WEFT (T)
1) A type of excentric sound of prolonged duration, created by superimposing prolonged sounds, “sheaves”, “fusions of slowly evolving sounds” (450) which are heard as groups, macro-objects, slowly developing, scarcely differentiated structures. The weft is denoted by the symbol T. 

2) In addition to the usual so-called “mixed” wefts T, in which the variations of details are quite complex and unpredictable, there are also specific examples of redundant wefts of scarcely variable mass, notated Tn (“harmonic” weft based on tonic sounds) or Tx (“complex” weft of complex sounds). 

3) Wefts are not encountered solely in natural phenomena and musique concrète, but also very commonly in traditional symphonic music. 

a) Originality of the weft. 
The weft belongs to the type of prolonged sound that could be analysed as an amalgamation of different intermingled constituent objects, but which present to the ear as macro-objects bound together by the sensation of a “causal unity”. As a macro-object with mobile parts, but whose general profile is fairly continuous and fixed, the weft takes its place in the TARTYP in the column of homogeneous sounds “where it extends the category in the direction of originality”. (457) 

b) The weft in the typology of varying objects.
The complementary typology of variations begins by considering the possibility of new distinctions between “fluctuating” wefts Tz, developing wefts Ty and “modulating” wefts (i.e. developing by stages) Tx, but ultimately it classifies the general type weft T with objects varying slowly in a progressive and continuous manner (variation of the “progress” type, see 30).


----------



## christianhenson

After a year of procrastination I volt-face on my album project:


----------



## christianhenson

Paul is doing something mental:



...and David Hilowitz joins me for the latest NFTW


----------



## christianhenson

Is Spitfire losing its way?


----------



## christianhenson

This could make for an interesting topic of convo here?

Are LESS samples better than MORE???


----------



## Mike Greene

I like that you compare the sample library creation process with diarrhea. 

I'm becoming more and more convinced that fewer samples are often, if not usually, better than more samples. Although ... trying to _sell_ a library which admits to fewer samples is another story.

I was showing RealiDrums at NAMM one year and can't even count how many times I was asked, _"How many round robins for each drum? How many velocity layers?"_ I'd answer, _"Round robins aren't the point with this set."_ Then I'd play some sounds and say, _"That, that sound, is the point."_

They'd invariably answer, _"Sure, but how many round robins?"

Great_ sunrise BTW.


----------



## novaburst

I think there are some that use alot of samples but i dont think they want the listener to feel there is a ton of samples being used, in thier music or mockup.

this may sound a little strange for instance a very quite piece, may have a ton of samples used to make that part, but they are going for a sculp or searching for a sound to creat that feel or vibe

so tons of samples may be used in any musical creation but you or the listener would not feel there is a ton of samples being used if that makes sense


----------



## Zero&One

@Mike Greene That's interesting to hear thanks.
Us humans do like our buzzwords. Companies can be their own worst enemies when they coin them sadly.

My friend wanted a TV. I suggested countless (including mine that he loved) and he always asked:
"How many NITs does it have?"
He didn't even really know what it is, but a *cough* forum told him the more the better dude.
Eventually he bought a NIT loaded TV for an _extra_ £900. He's never mentioned his NITs since! Or even the TV for that matter!!


----------



## angeruroth

Hmm, interesting indeed. Thanks!

I recently got stuck sampling my guitar and, being this the first time I try to do it right, I gave it a lot of thinking, trying a lot of different things with the gear available... and came to the conclusion that less notes were somehow a better approach for 3 reasons:
1. The whole post processing time would be huge, and I'm just sampling a guitar! I can't even guess what would take to sample a whole orchestra or something like that and turn it into a cohesive VI.
2. Some notes sound almost better when transposed than the actual notes. I'm not sure why. Maybe there are some subtle quirks that just turn me on.
3. I ran out of HD space 

But I do think the RRs are as important for short notes as subtle variations are for long notes.
I thought I could settle for 3 RRs, but every time I play the same note it's a bit different, and knowing the instrument it just sounds weird, so I've tried 4, 5... 10... And it's a nightmare! So now I'm thinking 5 could be enough, but... argh, it's so hard to set the limit...


----------



## MartinH.

Zero&One said:


> @Mike Greene That's interesting to hear thanks.
> Us humans do like our buzzwords. Companies can be their own worst enemies when they coin them sadly.
> 
> My friend wanted a TV. I suggested countless (including mine that he loved) and he always asked:
> "How many NITs does it have?"
> He didn't even really know what it is, but a *cough* forum told him the more the better dude.
> Eventually he bought a NIT loaded TV for an _extra_ £900. He's never mentioned his NITs since! Or even the TV for that matter!!



Never heard that term, but it seems to just mean brightness, right? Would be the cherry on top if your friend never puts it on max brightness and says "that would be way too bright, it hurts my eyes".


----------



## Technostica

Zero&One said:


> @Mike Greene
> 
> My friend wanted a TV. I suggested countless (including mine that he loved) and he always asked:
> "How many NITs does it have?"
> He didn't even really know what it is, but a *cough* forum told him the more the better dude.
> Eventually he bought a NIT loaded TV for an _extra_ £900. He's never mentioned his NITs since! Or even the TV for that matter!!


I think your friend required a visit from the nit nurse.


----------



## charlieclouser

For drums, there are never enough round-robins and velocity splits, and the pain and suffering of editing and culling the wonky hits will (should / must) be epic and never-ending.

But for weird textures, ambient drone-scapes, and textural stuff my favorite number of samples is:

One.

Most of my favorite and most-used textural stuff (and even some strings and string-like sounds) are nothing more than one single sample mapped across all 88 keys. Sometimes I'll go so far as to use two, with the mod wheel crossfading between them - but that's rare.

It might be because I came up in the era of crude samplers with tiny memory and rudimentary mapping capabilities (Fairlight IIx, Mirage, Emax, etc.) but that's still my favorite way to work.


----------



## CT

A great thing about some of the weird textural EXS instruments I've made for myself with the "one sample" approach is that you get all kinds of different flavors depending on where you play because of the pitch-stretching, all from that single sample. Some are like totally different sounds in the low, mid, and high ranges.


----------



## christianhenson

This week's Nerding-For-The-Weekend has just dropped (along with loads of amazing new samples)


----------



## José Herring

charlieclouser said:


> But for weird textures, ambient drone-scapes, and textural stuff my favorite number of samples is:
> 
> One.
> 
> Most of my favorite and most-used textural stuff (and even some strings and string-like sounds) are nothing more than one single sample mapped across all 88 keys. Sometimes I'll go so far as to use two, with the mod wheel crossfading between them - but that's rare.
> 
> It might be because I came up in the era of crude samplers with tiny memory and rudimentary mapping capabilities (Fairlight IIx, Mirage, Emax, etc.) but that's still my favorite way to work.



I just recently rediscovered this. I took one of those EW string FX patches and ran it through Grain in Reason. Played all sorts of mayhem with it. Sounded nothing like the original.

Then I sampled a synth and used NNXT. Stretched the sample across the entire keyboard and man did it sound cool. It was so cool that I'm thinking of getting a Roland S550 or Akai 950 just to capture that sound again. Use a hardware sampler to get all that 12bit grainyness. The old beast had clever ways of overcoming their limitations that have kind of gotten lost.


----------



## christianhenson

A BIG WEEK:



Oh and if you don't want the waffle I start talking about THE week here:


----------



## christianhenson

OK JOIN US LATER (I'll be on live chat for both of these premieres) 19.00BST


----------



## Ashermusic

That's' 11:00 AM PDT, right?


----------



## IFM

charlieclouser said:


> For drums, there are never enough round-robins and velocity splits, and the pain and suffering of editing and culling the wonky hits will (should / must) be epic and never-ending.
> 
> But for weird textures, ambient drone-scapes, and textural stuff my favorite number of samples is:
> 
> One.
> 
> Most of my favorite and most-used textural stuff (and even some strings and string-like sounds) are nothing more than one single sample mapped across all 88 keys. Sometimes I'll go so far as to use two, with the mod wheel crossfading between them - but that's rare.
> 
> It might be because I came up in the era of crude samplers with tiny memory and rudimentary mapping capabilities (Fairlight IIx, Mirage, Emax, etc.) but that's still my favorite way to work.


I had an Akai S612 so I know what you mean. Then later a Mirage and EPS...still have an EPSM.


----------



## christianhenson

This week someone who is no stranger to this community Charles Clouser and my good pal and amazing composer Anna Phoebe joined me for a con-joined two-parter special!!


----------



## redlester

Christian - are you doing a video explaining the changes to the BBC templates? The practical differences between the "full routing" and "simple stereo" versions, and when it's appropriate to use each? I daresay a seasoned pro would know this, but many of us are dabbling in stuff we are quite new to.


----------



## christianhenson

My initial thoughts on the death of EXS24


----------



## nolotrippen

christianhenson said:


> This could make for an interesting topic of convo here?
> 
> Are LESS samples better than MORE???



"fewer" not "less" but nice vid


----------



## Ashermusic

christianhenson said:


> My initial thoughts on the death of EXS24




OK Mr. ChristIan Henson, yes I’m talking to you! I am calling you out! All this EXS24 love but WHERE are the Spitfire libraries for it? Nonexistent!

BBCO for the new Logic sampler. I am not asking, I am DEMANDING. Don’t profess your love, demonstrate it.

Seriously, loved the video, hugely entertaining.


----------



## BassClef

Great idea Jay... a Spitfire pack of 300 presets for this newly evolved sampler, with an introductory price of $9.95!


----------



## Ashermusic

BassClef said:


> Great idea Jay... a Spitfire pack of 300 presets for this newly evolved sampler, with an introductory price of $9.95!



If they sell BBCO for Sampler for $499, I am in. Otherwise, when I get Discovery I am using Autosampler


----------



## CT

Ashermusic said:


> If they sell BBCO for Sampler for $499, I am in. Otherwise, when I get Discovery I am using Autosampler



Is that only usable in MainStage?


----------



## Ashermusic

miket said:


> Is that only usable in MainStage?



Now it is also in Logic Pro X 10.5.


----------



## CT

Gah. I can't update on my current iMac, and was thinking about making the dreaded switch to PC anyway, but that's a very tempting feature. Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!


----------



## Ashermusic

miket said:


> Gah. I can't update on my current iMac, and was thinking about making the dreaded switch to PC anyway, but that's a very tempting feature. Just when I thought I was out, they pull me back in!


----------



## dgburns

Ashermusic said:


> OK Mr. ChristIan Henson, yes I’m talking to you! I am calling you out! All this EXS24 love but WHERE are the Spitfire libraries for it? Nonexistent!
> 
> BBCO for the new Logic sampler. I am not asking, I am DEMANDING. Don’t profess your love, demonstrate it.
> 
> Seriously, loved the video, hugely entertaining.



But I think the problem is copy protection, no ?


----------



## Ashermusic

dgburns said:


> But I think the problem is copy protection, no ?



Yes, probably. But there are still some developers who have continued to develop for the platform so maybe there’s a way?


----------



## Saxer

I already ran tons of orchestral samples through Autosampler (which is available for years in Mainstage). EXS (or now "Sampler") is so fast and easy to use and needs less than no CPU. i.e. I have a "best of" of percussion samples from orchestral to epic of all my libraries and don't have to load Kontakt for it and search through tons of discs and folders.


----------



## redlester

There are loads of Pianobook Instruments for EXS24 and the price is zero!


----------



## christianhenson

Gary gives us some great insights from the other side of the industry:



...and I ponder, is it all change from here:


----------



## Ásta Jónsdóttir

Hello Christian,

Thank you for everything that you do sir!

I am not sure how many share my opinion but I wanted to say that I much prefer Spitfire Audio's own dedicated user interface to any other. I do believe that your streamlined approach is best for getting work done. You cannot please everyone but so far, the Spitfire interface is my favorite.

Does Spitfire Audio have their own proprietary software for building sample libraries internally at the company, initially before they get ported to Kontakt and other samplers?


----------



## doctoremmet

Ásta Jónsdóttir said:


> I much prefer Spitfire Audio's own dedicated user interface to any other


This! In fact I like them so much I hope that Spitfire will port some of their stuff over to the new proprietary interface.


----------



## Ásta Jónsdóttir

doctoremmet said:


> This! In fact I like them so much I hope that Spitfire will port some of their stuff over to the new proprietary interface.


I could not agree more Dr. Emmet


----------



## CT

Hey @christianhenson , I'd like to draw your attention to an "Organbook" of sorts.









Home - Piotr Grabowski – Virtual Pipe Organ Sample Sets







piotrgrabowski.pl





This guy has been sampling pipe organs (some quite substantial ones too) around Europe for a while now, and all but a few of them are available for free. When I say sampling pipe organs, I mean immaculately, pristinely, and gorgeously sampling pipe organs. It's incredible stuff and unspeakably generous.

The main caveat is that these are not EXS (Dave?) or Kontakt instruments. They require either the rather pricey Hauptwerk, or, more palatably, the open source version of that software, Grand Orgue. Neither is especially ergonomic to a DAW workflow, but given the amount of passion and skill that obviously goes into these instruments, I thought they would be worth bringing to the attention of a community like Pianobook, for those who might be interested in the piano's extravagant grandfather.


----------



## anjwilson

miket said:


> Hey @christianhenson , I'd like to draw your attention to an "Organbook" of sorts.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Home - Piotr Grabowski – Virtual Pipe Organ Sample Sets
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> piotrgrabowski.pl
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This guy has been sampling pipe organs (some quite substantial ones too) around Europe for a while now, and all but a few of them are available for free. When I say sampling pipe organs, I mean immaculately, pristinely, and gorgeously sampling pipe organs. It's incredible stuff and unspeakably generous.
> 
> The main caveat is that these are not EXS (Dave?) or Kontakt instruments. They require either the rather pricey Hauptwerk, or, more palatably, the open source version of that software, Grand Orgue. Neither is especially ergonomic to a DAW workflow, but given the amount of passion and skill that obviously goes into these instruments, I thought they would be worth bringing to the attention of a community like Pianobook, for those who might be interested in the piano's extravagant grandfather.


Agreed. More people need to know about and support Grabowski's work. His sampled organs truly are immaculate, and it's unbelievable that he offers even up to 44-stop organs for free. I practice on them for my weekend organ gigs all the time, and it's glorious.


----------



## christianhenson

Insights from Rupert Gregson-Williams


----------



## Juan Carlos

Awesome work, wonderful organs


----------



## Juan Carlos

Awesome work, wonderful organs


----------



## christianhenson

Can SPITFIRE Answer Difficult Questions???


----------



## Levon

christianhenson said:


> Can SPITFIRE Answer Difficult Questions???



You should have called it "The Pub" instead!  Very enjoyable. Hope you do more of these in the future. Bought some new toys afterwards... the JH Pro Select bundle was just too good to say no


----------



## paulthomson

Levon said:


> You should have called it "The Pub" instead!  Very enjoyable. Hope you do more of these in the future. Bought some new toys afterwards... the JH Pro Select bundle was just too good to say no


Glad you enjoyed it!
I think it’s really valuable to consider the difficult questions as well as the fun ones. It’s essential to have your positions and views challenged. That is the way of growth. Sending you guys lots of love at this time of profound challenge and change. I’m so grateful for music.


----------



## doctoremmet

paulthomson said:


> I’m so grateful for music.


This ^! Me too. Thanks for the inspiration Paul. I just bought Solo Strings. Those Virtuoso patches are incredible! <3


----------



## christianhenson

paulthomson said:


> Glad you enjoyed it!
> I think it’s really valuable to consider the difficult questions as well as the fun ones. It’s essential to have your positions and views challenged. That is the way of growth. Sending you guys lots of love at this time of profound challenge and change. I’m so grateful for music.



Many thanks.

C.


----------



## MarcHedenberg

Ásta Jónsdóttir said:


> Hello Christian,
> 
> Thank you for everything that you do sir!
> 
> I am not sure how many share my opinion but I wanted to say that I much prefer Spitfire Audio's own dedicated user interface to any other. I do believe that your streamlined approach is best for getting work done. You cannot please everyone but so far, the Spitfire interface is my favorite.
> 
> Does Spitfire Audio have their own proprietary software for building sample libraries internally at the company, initially before they get ported to Kontakt and other samplers?



Burn the heretic!!

But yes, I agree actually. By their own admission, it's an engine in its infancy but I find it very conducive to quick writing.


----------



## StillLife

paulthomson said:


> Glad you enjoyed it!
> I think it’s really valuable to consider the difficult questions as well as the fun ones. It’s essential to have your positions and views challenged. That is the way of growth. Sending you guys lots of love at this time of profound challenge and change. I’m so grateful for music.


Yes! Learn and listen, listen and learn, read - question - repeat.
Thanks for the clip - very nice. And some tips for my newly acquired Studio Woodwinds!


----------



## Mornats

StillLife said:


> Yes! Learn and listen, listen and learn, read - question - repeat.
> Thanks for the clip - very nice. And some tips for my newly acquired Studio Woodwinds!


I feel bad for asking as this is totally lazy but do you remember how far into the video those tips were? I've yet to watch it all yet (but I will) and I'd love to hear the tips. Ta!


----------



## StillLife

Around 45-50 minutes, Oliver talks about Woodwinds and how to use them in your music, interesting as I am fairly new to WW. The tips are not only for the Studio WW, but more in general, but it sparked my interest.


----------



## Mornats

StillLife said:


> Around 45-50 minutes, Oliver talks about Woodwinds and how to use them in your music, interesting as I am fairly new to WW. The tips are not only for the Studio WW, but more in general, but it sparked my interest.


Thanks, I'll check it out now


----------



## Primary Target

Mornats said:


> I feel bad for asking as this is totally lazy but do you remember how far into the video those tips were? I've yet to watch it all yet (but I will) and I'd love to hear the tips. Ta!



The top pinned comment on the video has a list of the questions and time codes, handy if you don't have time to view the whole thing in one go


----------



## Mornats

Primary Target said:


> The top pinned comment on the video has a list of the questions and time codes, handy if you don't have time to view the whole thing in one go


That's brilliant, thanks for letting me know!


----------



## korgscrew2000

Would have liked to ask if they plan to do ala carte like OT seem to be doing. Most of the Albions I have I only use a few bits of them. They have done it with the solo string patches, but it would be nice to buy an articulation from any other library.


----------



## christianhenson

Rick BEATO vs Spinal Tap


----------



## doctoremmet

christianhenson said:


> Rick BEATO vs Spinal Tap



Love Rick! Will watch. His Sting video on Fortress... today was excellent. Thx Christian


----------



## MarcHedenberg

christianhenson said:


> Rick BEATO vs Spinal Tap





You got Rick Beato! My favourite music theory teacher.


----------



## christianhenson

My deep dive for you EXS die hards:


----------



## Saxer

I will never call it Dave.

It‘s still the EXS. In German it is pronounced „Eh Iggs Ass“.


----------



## Rory

Saxer said:


> I will never call it Dave.



He's reversing the thought (deliberate hubris?), but surely that's a playful reference to _2001: A Space Odyssey_


----------



## christianhenson

Its actually an "Only Fools & Horses" ref.


----------



## Saxer

christianhenson said:


> Its actually an "Only Fools & Horses" ref.


Just read about in Wiki... never heard of it before here. 

I think the reason for the renaming from EXS to Sampler is the same as the renaming from Sable to Chamber Strings: you don't have to know it to recognize what it is. It's a bit like the reverse switch from calling your mom and dad by their first name when you're grown up. But who of the musicians really want to grow up?


----------



## Ashermusic

I think it was renamed Sampler to e consistent with Quick Sampler and Auto Sampler.


----------



## christianhenson

Saxer said:


> Just read about in Wiki... never heard of it before here.
> 
> I think the reason for the renaming from EXS to Sampler is the same as the renaming from Sable to Chamber Strings: you don't have to know it to recognize what it is. It's a bit like the reverse switch from calling your mom and dad by their first name when you're grown up. But who of the musicians really want to grow up?



I always preferred Sable.... although when you Google'd it you got a furry rodent so the reference to fine Sable brushes was double obfuscated!


----------



## charlieclouser

I kind of like Apple renaming EXS to just Sampler. Probably copyrighted the name and will sue anyone who speaks that word into oblivion. I'm surprised they haven't come out with a model called "Computer" and done the same.


----------



## Alex Fraser

Sampler (Dave), Drum Machine Designer and Quick Sampler are the Holy Trinity. I love the way they all work together.


----------



## Loïc D

I kinda stayed away from sampling for years because I found the process unclear and tiresome, both on EXS24 and Kontakt. And I didn’t want to put too much time & energy in this, having other priorities in music & life.

New LPX sampler range is a game changer for me : this is clear, straightforward, the automap is a bless.

I think I’ll restart an old project : sampling my good old Yammy SY35 homemade patches and share them 

So whatever the name you give to it (mine’s named Christian), it’s great tool !


----------



## A3D2

christianhenson said:


> My deep dive for you EXS die hards:



@christianhenson You can actually rename the 'Sampler' in Logic X, I wrote about it in this thread: https://vi-control.net/community/th...ler-multi-sample-any-major-differences.93464/ You can rename it Dave if you want, I just changed its name right back to EXS24


----------



## Michel Simons

LowweeK said:


> I think I’ll restart an old project : sampling my good old Yammy SY35 homemade patches and share them



Ah, the SY35. Those were the days.


----------



## Loïc D

Michel Simons said:


> Ah, the SY35. Those were the days.


Yeah ! This was the only synth I could afford as a teenager...
I still have it, working fine save some buttons are hard to trigger.
I did unmount & clean keybed ; it’s like new. I always liked this keybed.


----------



## ag75

Does sampler still convert other sample types such as AKAI?


----------



## Kent

**
New Logic SAMPLER - Deep Dave For You EXS Die Hards.*


----------



## christianhenson

I show off how I actually use the new mega BBCSO templates:


----------



## prodigalson

Is anyone else have serious latency issues with these templates (specifically the logic one?). On a buffer of 256 with no plugins enabled I get latency as bad as if my buffer was 1024. I suspect it has something to do with the routing on the 'mix' channel as when I go into low latency mode the latency disappears and the specific sends on the mix channel get disabled? 

Its not the end of the world to just track in low latency mode but in order to monitor I have to set the Mix output to my main Stereo Out and doing this gives me all kinds of level issues. For some reason, recording something at one level seems to always playback significantly louder. Its a nightmare. 

Thoughts on any of this?


----------



## Paul Jelfs

christianhenson said:


> I show off how I actually use the new mega BBCSO templates:



Good stuff Christian. Any word on when the Extended Legatos will be added to some of the Instruments ? I believe it is similar to Performance Legato on Kontakt. - last i checked some instruments like solo Trumpet and Clarinet were missing them. 

It just makes writing a line so much easier, even if it is really just having a staccato type sample overlaid, and sounds more convincing without switching arts.


----------



## gordinho

christianhenson said:


> I show off how I actually use the new mega BBCSO templates:



I haven't seen all of your videos, but what do you use the sirin for? I love the minitaur for bass and I'm curious as to why you chose that synth to sit on your desk


----------



## christianhenson

Here's a load of fun about sampling:







...and an interview with Nitin Sawhney that I'm really proud of:


----------



## David Kudell

Thanks Christian! This is the best explanation of how to make your own samples I’ve seen. You’ve inspired me to try making something of my own!


----------



## christianhenson

Glutton for punishment:


----------



## NDRU

christianhenson said:


> Glutton for punishment:




Thank you for sharing Christian. About time.. Take care my brother!


----------



## Loïc D

christianhenson said:


> Glutton for punishment:




Christian, take care and get some sleep and spend time with your family (on Fortnite?)

This is more important than online competition.


----------



## mybadmemory

It’s really hard for me to understand where the frustration comes from. A competition is nothing other than a jury responding subjectively to what they are confronted with. Agree with them or not. They are human beings and human beings many times do not know what they want until they are shown it. Human beings are vague. Human beings are emotional, irrational, and change their minds. They are allowed to! And opinion is always subjective.

It’s as if people somehow expect competitions or jury’s to not be human, but some kind of computerized AI’s that base their decisions purely on objective criteria and facts rather than on human emotion. And are then chocked and appalled when they realize they’re not. 

It’s always the same in all creative competitions, be it in this format, American Idol, or whatever. People are like “BUT I DON’T AGREE!!!” and I’m like “Well you don’t have to agree! Start your own competition and YOU get to be the judge!” :D


----------



## StillLife

mybadmemory said:


> It’s really hard for me to understand where the frustration comes from. A competition is nothing other than a jury responding subjectively to what they are confronted with. Agree with them or not. They are human beings and human beings many times do not know what they want until they are shown it. Human beings are vague. Human beings are emotional, irrational, and change their minds. They are allowed to! And opinion is always subjective.
> 
> It’s as if people somehow expect competitions or jury’s to not be human, but some kind of computerized AI’s that base their decisions purely on objective criteria and facts rather than on human emotion. And are then chocked and appalled when they realize they’re not.
> 
> It’s always the same in all creative competitions, be it in this format, American Idol, or whatever. People are like “BUT I DON’T AGREE!!!” and I’m like “Well you don’t have to agree! Start your own competition and YOU get to be the judge!” :D


Exactly! Agree wholeheartedly!


----------



## Mornats

mybadmemory said:


> It’s really hard for me to understand where the frustration comes from. A competition is nothing other than a jury responding subjectively to what they are confronted with. Agree with them or not. They are human beings and human beings many times do not know what they want until they are shown it. Human beings are vague. Human beings are emotional, irrational, and change their minds. They are allowed to! And opinion is always subjective.
> 
> It’s as if people somehow expect competitions or jury’s to not be human, but some kind of computerized AI’s that base their decisions purely on objective criteria and facts rather than on human emotion. And are then chocked and appalled when they realize they’re not.
> 
> It’s always the same in all creative competitions, be it in this format, American Idol, or whatever. People are like “BUT I DON’T AGREE!!!” and I’m like “Well you don’t have to agree! Start your own competition and YOU get to be the judge!” :D



Yes, this.


----------



## chocobitz825

christianhenson said:


> Glutton for punishment:




i dont understand the hate. even if people hate the 8-bit parts...for that one "failure" (that i actually enjoyed), people are ignoring everywhere else where it succeeds as a composition. Genre changing was a theme of the scene, so any change in tone works. The motif was constant and modulated very well. Tension was well built and there was a great build to the finale. Even using the reference track it used the brass and other standout parts of the referene material well. It wins in more places than it fails. If i had any criticism its mostly with the mixing done on the 8bit parts...


----------



## asherpope

chocobitz825 said:


> i dont understand the hate. even if people hate the 8-bit parts...for that one "failure" (that i actually enjoyed), people are ignoring everywhere else where it succeeds as a composition. Genre changing was a theme of the scene, so any change in tone works. The motif was constant and modulated very well. Tension was well built and there was a great build to the finale. Even using the reference track it used the brass and other standout parts of the referene material well. It wins in more places than it fails. If i had any criticism its mostly with the mixing done on the 8bit parts...


Agreed. Many of the entries I watched in the lead up didn't follow the on screen action at all - plenty of hybrid loops, ostinatos and synth pads throughout though. The winning entry actually drove the narrative of the scene and made it a lot more entertaining than it should have been (those are some clunky and slow cars)


----------



## chocobitz825

Giudan said:


> I had more posts with good points in them. But they got deleted because Spitfire is too scared to deal with their mistake.



i am legitimately curious about where people think that score failed. I actually preferred it more than the real score from the show. In the show prior to that scene they used black and white filters to give a noir feel...i think with the same visual manipulation the 8 bit would have fit more...but I cant get the hero motif and the danger motifs out of my head..really strong work.


----------



## chocobitz825

Giudan said:


> I don't mind the composition. But I do mind the poor reaction Spitfire and their crew had to the public. I mean... In a worldwide competition with people from multiple cultural backgrounds, the winner ends up being an American industry veteran with JJ Abrams in his CV who wrote a chip tune. And then this dude sits on top of an actual mountain and talks down to people. It's such a boomer moment.



But then don’t we have to critique the criticism as well? An industry veteran? How many people have credits to their names? It’s not like it was marketed as an amateur only contest. And to call it just a chip tune ignores why it had chip tune in it and ignores the fact that the usage of that element is small in comparison to the entire composition.

I honestly understand some hurt feelings, but I don’t think they’re wrong for not babying people here. Making a good composition doesn’t mean people made standout compositions. I honestly would have preferred David’s composition to the one in the actual show. And maybe this is a problem I personally have with the industry a lot of people keep pushing consistency over creativity. A fine piece is not an original and memorable piece. David’s was memorable.


----------



## kgdrum

I agree with @chocobitz825 
I only listened to the finalists and I really preferred David’s work.
The others sounded cliched & generic.
David showed originality,he took the score in a different direction than a typical soundtrack and it really was imo a creative left turn that I didn’t expect.
For me the music had energy an an unexpected edge that for me worked.
I am surprised at the level of vitriol and pathetic behavior people are hurling at David Kudell and Spitfire.
This was a competition,congratulations should be going to David and a BIG Thank You to Spitfire and all of the judges.
How will these “Composers” react if they get a real project rejected and someone else gets the job or audition for a band and don’t get the gig?
This was a competition a contest, besides winning the competition hopefully this helped the participants improve their film scoring chops & was also fun on some level.

AGAIN CONGRATULATIONS to David Kudell!
Thank You to Spitfire,The Westworld Team and the judges.
Cheers!


----------



## ironbut

I wish I could do something to help Christian and others involved to ignore all those haters who must have been raised by wolves, but I believe it's the same sensitivity that makes them outstanding creators that keeps them from being as thick skinned as some.
So,..
Hurrah to the guys and gals who made all this possible!
It was harder than I thought it would be but man, did I learn a lot!


----------



## Kirk1701

kgdrum said:


> I agree with @chocobitz825
> I only listened to the finalists and I really preferred David’s work.
> The others sounded cliched & generic.



If we're experiencing Caleb's "trip," then I think cliché is important. That entire chase scene is pieced together from what he knows of chase scenes, if I've understood it correctly. 

What David did well was exaggerate those clichés. If I were to venture a hindsight opinion, I suspect that's what grabbed the judges' attention. 

I've been enjoying the wrap-up discussions, as there's always tips and tricks to be shared. 

In the end, my opinion of other entries isn't worth the paper it's printed on. I feel like if I praise the winner and judges too much, it's sycophantic. If I complain the contest wasn't fair, I'm a sore loser. 

Best to just stick to facts.


----------



## Bruhelius

I think the negative backlash witnessed in the last days presents an opportunity (to attempt) to educate the masses about what it means to be a community.
This is a village-sized population of creators who (seem to) share the same passion. Creating inspiring musical stories, textures and designing sound. We need to try and stand together more as a team.

Quote from my earlier post:

I used to have a Croatian friend who still lives on a small island to this day... his mantra was one word. I keep coming back to it after decades. It's this: "ENJOY". 
Sounds like something out of an advert? Maybe. But this is the philosophy of a winner on this planet. Someone who can enjoy anything. If you couldn't enjoy the announcement of the winners, and enjoy what that is bringing to your life, then probably you are living your life for the wrong reasons. Don't just produce music. Enjoy music and the process it entails with your peers. If you perceive a moment to be "bad" you can always find a way to enjoy what new things this bad moment can bring to your life...there are over 11000 of us. Now enjoy that. Enjoy the few years you have left to live. Enjoy your make-believe composer hut on a lake. Enjoy bringing music to the foot of someone's death bed. Enjoy how it connects people. Enjoy that you were not chosen as a so-called winner this time. Enjoy what good things may come to David Kudell. And enjoy your personal growth as a human with limited time left.


----------



## kgdrum

@Bruhelius 

Good point Enjoyment!

That’s why I really liked David’s entry.
It showed he enjoyed what he was doing,it had a sense of fun,adventure and showed he has a sense of humor.
For me these elements transformed the typical action movie scene from something I’d never enjoy or watch into something I found both interesting and entertaining.


----------



## Michel Simons

I am enjoying my breakfast.


----------



## Van

I genuinely hope they do this kind of competition again. Otherwise it's ‘this is why we can’t have nice things.'


----------



## dzilizzi

Van said:


> I genuinely hope they do this kind of competition again. Otherwise it's ‘this is why we can’t have nice things.'


You all have to quit breaking your toys!


----------



## Studiodraven

Thanks for this, Christian. As an aspiring composer it helped clue me in to some stuff I hadn't considered (in a good way).


----------



## MartinH.

Van said:


> I genuinely hope they do this kind of competition again. Otherwise it's ‘this is why we can’t have nice things.'



Or make the next contest have a rule "no complaining about the winner or you're banned from all following contests" x].


----------



## Loïc D

MartinH. said:


> Or make the next contest have a rule "no complaining about the winner or you're banned from all following contests" x].



Or solve any conflict about standing out by running the “most boring soundtrack” contest.
(in this case, I _may_ have a chance)


----------



## Mornats

Am I the only person who liked the idea of the winning composition? After watching Christian's video above and reading some comments I thought, hmm what if I'd heard that track whilst watching the show? I'd probably have laughed, thought it was brilliant and brave and talked about it at work the following day. Some people wouldn't have liked it of course but honestly, I hate boring so I'd rather have this than boring.


----------



## NoOneKnowsAnything

christianhenson said:


> ...and an interview with Nitin Sawhney that I'm really proud of:
> 
> 
> 
> Glutton for punishment:



I’m not exactly sure why people are so upset about this. Only one person was gonna win whether 11,000 entered or 100. Plus, whether one agrees or not with the judges, there is but one winner so the vast amount of entries simply don’t get to win or get feedback, such is life. David’s cue made me laugh and smile so why not anoint him King 👑 du Jour regardless if it was appropriate or not for that scene!!! Just about everyone but one ☝ was gonna lose so does it really matter why you (one) didn’t win? For me personally, I already own just about all of Spitfire’s wonderful libraries so winning would not have helped me 🍾. I’ve entered so many competitions in my lifetime, it’s always best to assume you are gonna lose then you can always be pleasantly surprised. Even when I’ve won or made the finals of a competition it has never once led to advancing my career in any way. So be mindful of that too.


----------



## NoOneKnowsAnything

christianhenson said:


> ...and an interview with Nitin Sawhney that I'm really proud of:
> 
> 
> 
> Glutton for punishment:



CH, just wanna add. I adore you and I think your comments in the video above are 100% spot on. In particular, it is essential for composers, as well as people in general, to simply find their own unique voice and simply express themselves regardless if they get the gig or not. Of course we each have our own influences, that goes without saying. I am not suggesting that David was the only composer to express his unique voice. Clearly David’s cue stood out as not sounding like anyone else if I were guessing since I did not listen to 11,000 entries!!!! But, I do want to say that everything CH said above in his video is correct and I do agree with Christian!! Hugs 🤗 I would have assumed maybe 200 people would have entered this contest. 11,000?!!!!!! Are you friggin’ joking?!!!!!!! 11,000 entries is absolutely mad and preposterously more successful as a contest than I bet anyone dreamed!!!!!!! Congrats, Spitfire and David!!!


----------



## ism

Kirk1701 said:


> I'm not sure it's fair to classify the non-winning entries as "boring."
> 
> There's also an amount of ball-washing the winner and Spitfire that skeeves me out. There's being appreciative and conciliatory, but some guys are really burying their noses.


Or ... this community you’ve just joined might be one where people genuinely do appreciate each other from time to time. 

Crazy thought to be having on the internet, I know.


----------



## Mornats

Kirk1701 said:


> I'm not sure it's fair to classify the non-winning entries as "boring."
> 
> There's also an amount of ball-washing the winner and Spitfire that skeeves me out. There's being appreciative and conciliatory, but some guys are really burying their noses.



I wasn't intending to classify the non-winners as boring. I actually edited out a line from my post that said I didn't consider them boring but took it out for conciseness. I mean, some were, as you'd expect in a field of 11,000 but in general, not. 

I was more trying to make the point that something interesting won. Something that was a nice idea. If the winning entry had sounded like a run-of-the-mill car chase scene I'd have been disappointed I think.


----------



## Michel Simons

NoOneKnowsAnything said:


> In most businesses the most successful are not the most talented nor the most intelligent nor the most hardworking nor persistent nor confident nor determined nor the most passionate nor the most charismatic, but they definitely are the most lucky 🍀



You see, that's my problem. I don't have any talent, I am dumb as bleep, lazy as hell, don't even know the meaning of the word 'persistent', lack any determination, I am as passionate as a corpse and have a matching charisma (so far, so good), but luck is my missing ingredient. But I hope that it will be heavily discounted next BF.

I am not into "media composing", so I am probably the last person to say anything meaningful about any of the entries, but David's entry put a smile on my face and we all need that every now and then.


----------



## Van

David Kudell gambled but with 11,000 participants, he had almost nothing to lose and everything to gain. He heard something with the genre switching that made sense to him (and many others it seems) that could have just as easily been laughed off. (Myself, if I’d had the time, I was thinking something Bach fugue-ian that led into something else, but it wasn’t to be.) He didn’t play it safe, he went big and swung for the fences. Considering it was E L E V E N - T H O U S A N D entries, we ALL should have been thinking that way. I’ve heard @christianhenson talking about this VERY idea in other vlogs where he espoused doing what you have to do to stand out from the fray. Seriously, with the little direction from the ‘brief’, and the expected number of people to enter this thing, what did any of us have to lose? More than that, his stuff was very good BEYOND the mocked chiptune material. I can’t get his themes out of my head! (I can barely remember what I did much less anyone else.) But he blended the suspenseful style everyone else used AND his creative 8-bit stuff and did so in a way that caught attention yet also MADE the genre-change which would have been missed were it not for the music, as it was in my own score. 

Congrats David! You rocked this thing and deserve the accolades.


----------



## NoOneKnowsAnything

mybadmemory said:


> It’s really hard for me to understand where the frustration comes from. A competition is nothing other than a jury responding subjectively to what they are confronted with. Agree with them or not. They are human beings and human beings many times do not know what they want until they are shown it. Human beings are vague. Human beings are emotional, irrational, and change their minds. They are allowed to! And opinion is always subjective.
> 
> It’s as if people somehow expect competitions or jury’s to not be human, but some kind of computerized AI’s that base their decisions purely on objective criteria and facts rather than on human emotion. And are then chocked and appalled when they realize they’re not.
> 
> It’s always the same in all creative competitions, be it in this format, American Idol, or whatever. People are like “BUT I DON’T AGREE!!!” and I’m like “Well you don’t have to agree! Start your own competition and YOU get to be the judge!” :D


Realize too that the notion of being objective does not even exist, it’s a fantasy. A human is incapable of ever being anything but subjective applying their own tastes, whims, mood swings and biases at all times. No one can ever perceive, think, process or communicate objectively, that’s technically impossible. So when people say IMHO, that’s all it ever is, our own biased opinion.


----------



## NoOneKnowsAnything

Van said:


> David Kudell gambled but with 11,000 participants, he had almost nothing to lose and everything to gain. He heard something with the genre switching that made sense to him (and many others it seems) that could have just as easily been laughed off. (Myself, if I’d had the time, I was thinking something Bach fugue-ian that led into something else, but it wasn’t to be.) He didn’t play it safe, he went big and swung for the fences. Considering it was E L E V E N - T H O U S A N D entries, we ALL should have been thinking that way. I’ve heard @christianhenson talking about this VERY idea in other vlogs where he espoused doing what you have to do to stand out from the fray. Seriously, with the little direction from the ‘brief’, and the expected number of people to enter this thing, what did any of us have to lose? More than that, his stuff was very good BEYOND the mocked chiptune material. I can’t get his themes out of my head! (I can barely remember what I did much less anyone else.) But he blended the suspenseful style everyone else used AND his creative 8-bit stuff and did so in a way that caught attention yet also MADE the genre-change which would have been missed were it not for the music, as it was in my own score.
> 
> Congrats David! You rocked this thing and deserve the accolades.


I say don’t try to stand out, just be your natural self, whatever that is. Express your signature voice, don’t try to be clever, don’t try to stand out, just express your heart.


----------



## chocobitz825

NoOneKnowsAnything said:


> I say don’t try to stand out, just be your natural self, whatever that is. Express your signature voice, don’t try to be clever, don’t try to stand out, just express your heart.



True art for the sake of art should be this way. Simply as it comes from the heart with no consideration of how it is received.

Art that strives to evolve should challenge the boundaries of what's comfortable. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Art that wants to be safe, non-offensive, or easily sold to a mass audience, should try and stay in its lane. Because being unique doesn't often pay the bills for most creators.


----------



## christianhenson

Its been a while so I thought I'd make this one a premiere, swing by if you're around at 17.00 BST and wanna say hello:


----------



## Studiodraven

christianhenson said:


> Its been a while so I thought I'd make this one a premiere, swing by if you're around at 17.00 BST and wanna say hello:



Oh cool. Also I have modular envy.


----------



## Zedcars

christianhenson said:


> Its been a while so I thought I'd make this one a premiere, swing by if you're around at 17.00 BST and wanna say hello:



It’s funny hearing you talk about cassette tapes and 4-track machines as if they are completely alien to your audience. I, like you, grew up with these and it was my first experience of recording anything remotely serious. Then I thought, bloody hell, the reason you are explaining what they are is because most of your audience are, what’s the phrase, gen-z-ers and millennials? That makes me feel very very old indeed. Thanks for that Christian!! 

I think this is one of your best videos. It makes me want to dig my old Vestax out.

I think a lot of people would love a Spitfire library based on subtle tape variations. Any plans...oh yeah, you can’t talk about future products...

Cheers,
Darren.


----------



## Bear Market

Loved the new video! AAA production!

Have Spitfire re-amp your synths and sample them in Lyndhurst hall already! I would buy that library in an instant.


----------



## jononotbono

It’s an amazing video. You must be so good at video editing to do stuff like that!


----------



## dgburns

great stuff


----------



## élitiparti




----------



## Anders Wall

Still can't get over the alleged rumor that Christian was drinking warm budw.. (can't for my life write it) for the premiere.
We should start a fundraiser and get him some proper drinks and a fridge.
Geezzz.
...
Nice video and, damn, that euro-rack is looking like stuff dreams are made of.
You should do a walkthrough, no really I'd watch that, explaining the modules.

Best,
Anders


----------



## christianhenson

Would love your thoughts on this "monolith" system:


----------



## davidson

christianhenson said:


> Its been a while so I thought I'd make this one a premiere, swing by if you're around at 17.00 BST and wanna say hello:




I might be missing something but why does this video have a slate and ash tag on youtube?


----------



## AdamKmusic

davidson said:


> I might be missing something but why does this video have a slate and ash tag on youtube?


The monsoon module in the video is sold by S+A


----------



## davidson

AdamKmusic said:


> The monsoon module in the video is sold by S+A



Ah yeah, so it is, thanks. Oh well, let me get back into the youtube rabbit hole of looking for slate and ash content.


----------



## christianhenson

if you've not been keeping up here's a couple of new ones:


----------



## Markrs

christianhenson said:


> if you've not been keeping up here's a couple of new ones:



These are excellent videos Christian, really high quality.

I find it strange that I watched your youtube videos before I even knew what a DAW was or had heard of Spitfire Audio (the first time I heard about Spitfire Audio was unsurprisingly on one of your videos about focusing on that rather than composition, if I recall correctly. I then had to google Spitfire Audio)! The fact I am happily spending money and learning to compose with samples is in part down to you. For which I thank you, though my wallet does not :D


----------



## easyrider

christianhenson said:


>




Kudos to you mate, Top quality stuff and very educational...Leant a lot thanks for sharing...


----------



## gussunkri

Christian Henson is better than me at many many things, but I now believe that I am a better violinist than him (though not by much).

So Christian, out of all the flautandos you have, which are your go to? I am guessing you are still going to SCS first.


----------



## samuel.beliveau

christianhenson said:


>




Came for the flautando, stayed for the amazing explanation of different string techniques  .


----------



## JonS

christianhenson said:


> if you've not been keeping up here's a couple of new ones:



As always, Christian, what a joy it is to watch your videos!!


----------



## christianhenson

gussunkri said:


> Christian Henson is better than me at many many things, but I now believe that I am a better violinist than him (though not by much).
> 
> So Christian, out of all the flautandos you have, which are your go to? I am guessing you are still going to SCS first.



Yeah, I hang out with the SCS Flautando, but in all honesty I think the Intimate Strings one may have the edge now its been all cleaned up and stuff.

HOWEVER.... I've also made some pretty effing nice flautando ensemble multis out of Solo Strings!


----------



## Mornats

christianhenson said:


> HOWEVER.... I've also made some pretty effing nice flautando ensemble multis out of Solo Strings!


Oh I 've just tried that, that's such a lovely delicate sound although... it seems to be missing a viola! (I had the three violins, cello and bass.)


----------



## christianhenson

no the new solo strings!


----------



## Locks

Really enjoying the new format Christian. I've found the last few videos fascinating!


----------



## EvgenyEmelyanov

Lovely videos, Christian. Thanks!


----------



## Mornats

christianhenson said:


> no the new solo strings!



Oh, I mean the new ones (https://www.spitfireaudio.com/shop/a-z/spitfire-solo-strings/) - no flautando patch for the viola, but a nice mini violin ensemble via the 1st desk, progressive and virtuoso violins.


----------



## SupremeFist

I just bought these and they are lovely. Now please just release the strings from Neo separately and I will buy that too.


----------



## Simeon

I really should have watched this video, before doing my livestream on Intimate Stings. It possibly worked out for the best however as it gave me a new appreciation for the instrument.😎
All of your videos are top-notch. I especially enjoyed watching as the instrumentalist demonstrates these amazing techniques with such style; world-class. It helps to internalize how we approach these instruments and brings us to the reality of how truly expressive they really are.
Thanks for being a source of inspiration and challenge to us all.
All the best,
Simeon


----------



## SupremeFist

Simeon said:


> I watched the latest video after doing the livestream on Intimate Stings; I really should have watched it before. 😎
> All of your videos are top-notch. I especially enjoyed watching as the instrumentalist demonstrates these amazing techniques with such style; world-class. It helps to internalize how we approach these instruments and brings us to the reality of how truly expressive they really are.
> Thanks for being a source of inspiration and challenge to us all.
> All the best,
> Simeon


Seconded! I am occasionally sarcastic about Spitfire on here but that's because I really love certain things of theirs, and Christian is awesome in all the ways.


----------



## JonS

christianhenson said:


> no the new solo strings!


Christian, were you saying earlier in this thread that if one already owned Albion Neo there was no reason to get the latest Original Intimate Strings from Loegria II?


----------



## christianhenson

I think there would be a degree of duplication yes, although it doesn't share any common recordings. The reason I would give to having both is to have a common sketch tool on both lap top system drive and main rig.


----------



## JonS

christianhenson said:


> I think there would be a degree of duplication yes, although it doesn't share any common recordings. The reason I would give to having both is to have a common sketch tool on both lap top system drive and main rig.


Thank you always, Christian 🍾. I will get it 🎈


----------



## Geoff Grace

Is This The Best @christianhenson Video EVER? 

Certainly, it was among the best by my reckoning; and I've watched at least a few dozen by now.

The highlights for me were your back story on the birth of the Spitfire flautando samples and the violinist and cellist segments. I found it helpful not only to see their techniques in action but also to hear their explanations about how they play. The four dimensions of vibrato was a great example.

Best,

Geoff


----------



## christianhenson

Very kind, thanks.... The more I make these little mini histories the more I fall in love with the business of making sound. There's an unexpected romance about the whole thing which seems to only really appear when the loupe of time is cast across it.

I guess something I'll never replace or beat is having personally played the soft piano.... there's about a million users now, playing me, playing a piano 12 years ago, but with compositions being written today. It is not like time has frozen like you get in a photo or film, but that moment in time keeps being played, again and again in an infinite number of different patterns and permutations, with one guarantee, when you hit D4 pedal up you'll hear my nail strike the key.


----------



## davetbass

Geoff Grace said:


> Is This The Best @christianhenson Video EVER?
> 
> Certainly, it was among the best by my reckoning; and I've watched at least a few dozen by now.
> 
> The highlights for me were your back story on the birth of the Spitfire flautando samples and the violinist and cellist segments. I found it helpful not only to see their techniques in action but also to hear their explanations about how they play. The four dimensions of vibrato was a great example.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Geoff



I also really appreciated the string players demonstrations and clear explanations. 

I hope they do more of those covering other instruments (except the triangle)


----------



## christianhenson

...and the piccolo.


----------



## Mikro93

I had taken some time away from composing these days, and this is such a nice way to get back into it.

I would love some similar ressources for other instruments indeed! If needed, I play the triangle and available for interviews, I can give tips to composers.


----------



## Markus Kohlprath

christianhenson said:


> ...and the piccolo.


Maybe you can get a piccolo player playing flautando...


----------



## Mornats

Markus Kohlprath said:


> Maybe you can get a piccolo player playing flautando...



Fluteando.


----------



## Scalms

christianhenson said:


> Very kind, thanks.... The more I make these little mini histories the more I fall in love with the business of making sound. There's an unexpected romance about the whole thing which seems to only really appear when the loupe of time is cast across it.
> 
> I guess something I'll never replace or beat is having personally played the soft piano.... there's about a million users now, playing me, playing a piano 12 years ago, but with compositions being written today. It is not like time has frozen like you get in a photo or film, but that moment in time keeps being played, again and again in an infinite number of different patterns and permutations, with one guarantee, when you hit D4 pedal up you'll hear my nail strike the key.


Can you please re-record those notes, remove the fingernail sound and provide an update?!  It's popping up on all my songs and people are going to start to wonder why my fingernail hits that exact same note everytime...


----------



## christianhenson

...and how we made some (FREE) samples out of it.


----------



## angeruroth

I am s peach less. It sounded so good... and then the nails... and the saw... and the hammer...


----------



## dzilizzi

christianhenson said:


> ...and how we made some (FREE) samples out of it.



There's a part of me that is horrified you would drop a piano like that. Poor piano. All that it gave to everyone and that is the end. But then, if you were going to put it in a skip, I guess that was a better way to go.

And? Thank you for sharing such a lovely piano with us. I love the sound of old pianos.


----------



## TGV

Is your new site going to be pianobroke.co.uk?


----------



## Stringtree

I heard a demo today that odd parts of me responded to: back of my neck, tops of my arms.

Off to download. And thank you!

*upon reflection edit*

Umm, yeah, this feels really weird. I know it's dead. But it's here, and I can play it. Hasn't it suffered enough? Enough to not have to be punished with my awful music?

But what I play is reverent. It's like walking through an abandoned house or school. It's been sitting there quietly turning to dust, and it gets to speak again. Carefully thinking about what it will say as I reach out my hand and hope it can still do so. Sound. Surprisingly sweet. Aged. Strained.

It's a very odd feeling, having witnessed what happened to it, not naming any names. It suffered a very un-Christian demise.

I guess the instrument and its history affect the way it is approached. 2020. You go. You're hardly finished with us, aren't you?


----------



## Kirk1701

Stringtree said:


> I heard a demo today that odd parts of me responded to: back of my neck, tops of my arms.
> 
> Off to download. And thank you!
> 
> *upon reflection edit*
> 
> Umm, yeah, this feels really weird. I know it's dead. But it's here, and I can play it. Hasn't it suffered enough? Enough to not have to be punished with my awful music?
> 
> But what I play is reverent. It's like walking through an abandoned house or school. It's been sitting there quietly turning to dust, and it gets to speak again. Carefully thinking about what it will say as I reach out my hand and hope it can still do so. Sound. Surprisingly sweet. Aged. Strained.
> 
> It's a very odd feeling, having witnessed what happened to it, not naming any names. It suffered a very un-Christian demise.
> 
> I guess the instrument and its history affect the way it is approached. 2020. You go. You're hardly finished with us, aren't you?



Un-Christian?! Jesus Himself was literally thrown out of His home synagogue by people who had known Him as an infant and done business with his father Joseph. They dragged Him to the edge of a cliff and tried to push Him over it. 

I won't say dropping a piano from a crane is a Christian act, but I think you mean to say it is unmerciful. 

(I don't mean to offend, but language matters to me.)


----------



## kgdrum

Kirk1701 said:


> Un-Christian?! Jesus Himself was literally thrown out of His home synagogue by people who had known Him as an infant and done business with his father Joseph. They dragged Him to the edge of a cliff and tried to push Him over it.
> 
> I won't say dropping a piano from a crane is a Christian act, but I think you mean to say it is unmerciful.
> 
> (I don't mean to offend, but language matters to me.)




i can’t speak for @Stringtree but he might have been having a bit of a play on words as the OP and founder of Pianobook and Spitfire‘s first name is: Christian and he’s a pianist.


fwiw Some people here actually have a sense of humor which in these times is sorely needed.

😂


----------



## Geomir

Would you try that with a pipe organ?


----------



## Stringtree

Thanks, @kgdrum, but I really plucked an easy apple from the tree by noting that the Christian name of the fellow who savaged that piano was Christian, and his actions were indeed unmerciful, Hens, un-Christian. 

No offense taken, and certainly none meant. But as jokes go, I sometimes do better.


----------



## Stringtree

Geomir said:


> Would you try that with a pipe organ?








Probably not, but I would download one. And I did!


----------



## Kirk1701

kgdrum said:


> i can’t speak for @Stringtree but he might have been having a bit of a play on words as the OP and founder of Pianobook and Spitfire‘s first name is: Christian and he’s a pianist.
> 
> 
> fwiw Some people here actually have a sense of humor which in these times is sorely needed.
> 
> 😂



My reply was meant in jest. It's my failure to allow a joke to stand. I have a sense of humour; this was a rare miss.


----------



## kgdrum

Kirk1701 said:


> My reply was meant in jest. It's my failure to allow a joke to stand. I have a sense of humour; this was a rare miss.




Please don’t go into standup comedy 😱


----------



## dzilizzi

I also owned the Destroyed Six pianos. Christian wasn't the first to wreck pianos for art. 

I'm not much of a synth person, but I love unusual sounds from natural sources like broken instruments. I'm actually curious what @christianhenson going to do with that violin he's got there in his studio. I recently picked up a cheap violin from the thrift store. I also don't play but was thinking about what sounds I could make with it. My first horrible attempt at making a Kontakt library, I'm thinking. it may end up on pianobook if it is any good.


----------



## Mikro93

dzilizzi said:


> My first horrible attempt at making a Kontakt library, I'm thinking. it may end up on pianobook if it is any good.


Do it! Do it! Do it!

And for @christianhenson : your video was one of my favourites. Informative, entertaining, wholesome, with a touch of something deeper, like the emotional impact of seeing a piano being smashed on the ground yet knowing it will live on digitally forever. I was moved (in fact, I'm getting emotional) by this little je-ne-sais-quoi that I can find very often in your videos, an empowering yet calm feeling that music is where it's at. Thank you, Sir!


----------



## christianhenson

95% of all media composers were formerly composer’s assistants. Here are 12 golden rules in becoming an assistant based on my own terrible mistakes. You composers don’t get off though I’ve also included 5 golden rules for composers with assistants and one of them is “don’t kill your assistant”. Anything I’ve left out? Leave in the comments below!


----------



## rnieto

christianhenson said:


> 95% of all media composers were formerly composer’s assistants. Here are 12 golden rules in becoming an assistant based on my own terrible mistakes. You composers don’t get off though I’ve also included 5 golden rules for composers with assistants and one of them is “don’t kill your assistant”. Anything I’ve left out? Leave in the comments below!



Fantastic stuff. I wish I could have watched this 20 years ago, but even now it's a great refresher.


----------



## NoamL

@christianhenson interesting as always Christian.

While watching your list I came up with 10 rules too. Some overlap with yours.

1. Under promise, over deliver. Take less attention from the composer than the results you are delivering.

2. Ego & 'tude are pointless. You are not in charge. Do not get wedded to your work. If you are given notes/revisions, adopt the mindset of "great, that will make it better." Similarly, rejection is just something that happens. Taking rejection well is good practice for being a composer....

3. Be disciplined about naming files correctly and having a good file system, it will absolutely FUCK you up if you don't.

4. Develop zen. It doesn't help anyone for you to add stress to a crunchtime situation. Your boss has a job 10x more stressful than yours.

5. Sleep and food are non-negotiable.

6. Do grunt work happily, but think about what can make the composer's life easier. Don't stick your oar in unless you really, really can improve a process or workflow, and only volunteer your "idea" when you've actually prepared to deliver it on the spot.

7. Respect the chain of command. If anyone higher than composer is in the room, you must absolutely shut up unless spoken to.

8. Learn & establish the boundaries with your composer about whether they want to hear your opinion on anything musical. I have worked with one composer who simply did not want my opinion on anything, and another who frequently bounced ideas off me.

9. Being a bad communicator & misinterpreting instructions makes you a bad assistant. Learn the composer's communication style and adapt. They're not going to change who they are.

10. The harder you are to replace the better you'll be paid - and appreciated.


----------



## RonOrchComp

So, I have a question. 

Say you are a composer's assistant, and your boss writes something that sounds like something else. Not similiar, as in you can hear the influence, but dead on. As in law suit dead on.

Do you say something, or do you keep your mouth shut?


----------



## rnieto

RonOrchComp said:


> So, I have a question.
> 
> Say you are a composer's assistant, and your boss writes something that sounds like something else. Not similiar, as in you can hear the influence, but dead on. As in law suit dead on.
> 
> Do you say something, or do you keep your mouth shut?


Ethically, you should say something, even if it gets you fired. 

I know I couldn't sleep at night with the knowledge that I could have prevented a catastrophic situation and didn't do anything about it. If my boss doesn't appreciate my candor and fires me, my conscience is clean and I can move forward.


----------



## chillbot

RonOrchComp said:


> So, I have a question.
> 
> Say you are a composer's assistant, and your boss writes something that sounds like something else. Not similiar, as in you can hear the influence, but dead on. As in law suit dead on.
> 
> Do you say something, or do you keep your mouth shut?


Jesus that's a no-brainer. Why is this a question?


----------



## RonOrchComp

chillbot said:


> Jesus that's a no-brainer. Why is this a question?



Umm, because I don't know the answer? 

What kind of response is that?


----------



## chillbot

RonOrchComp said:


> What kind of response is that?


It's a terrible response. Sorry thought it was implied.

If you are working for someone who would not want you to tell them when they either intentionally or unintentionally ripped someone else off to the point of, in your words, "lawsuit dead on", then you should be looking for someone else to work for.


----------



## Living Fossil

RonOrchComp said:


> So, I have a question.
> 
> Say you are a composer's assistant, and your boss writes something that sounds like something else. Not similiar, as in you can hear the influence, but dead on. As in law suit dead on.
> 
> Do you say something, or do you keep your mouth shut?



It's rather about how you tell it.
Play the file where you think the idea derives from, and ask if he (or she) thinks there is a too obvious similarity. But avoid being overly clever and to lecture him/her about details ("you could change that interval").
Leave it up to him/her to decide.


----------



## RonOrchComp

Thanks.

BTW - I am not an asst for a composer. I have never been so I don't know what that world is like. I don't know what those relationships are like, and how much freedom the asst has to speak up, even when done respectfully.

It's just something I thought of, and was curious about.


----------



## christianhenson

RonOrchComp said:


> Umm, because I don't know the answer?
> 
> What kind of response is that?




If it's something big then I would do this, approach the music supervisor (if its big then it will have one) and say "can I speak to you in total confidence" I would get their absolute reassurance that I could speak to them in this manner and then preface "the reason I'm speaking to you about this is because I'm a junior and don't know what to do, nor indeed if there is anything to worry about, but I'm fearful that my boss, who is massively stressed and I don't want to bother, may have just re-written Angie by The Rolling Stones as the main theme for Endgame 3".

If its something small, I wouldn't even think about it.


----------



## christianhenson

NoamL said:


> @christianhenson interesting as always Christian.
> 
> While watching your list I came up with 10 rules too. Some overlap with yours.
> 
> 1. Under promise, over deliver. Take less attention from the composer than the results you are delivering.
> 
> 2. Ego & 'tude are pointless. You are not in charge. Do not get wedded to your work. If you are given notes/revisions, adopt the mindset of "great, that will make it better." Similarly, rejection is just something that happens. Taking rejection well is good practice for being a composer....
> 
> 3. Be disciplined about naming files correctly and having a good file system, it will absolutely FUCK you up if you don't.
> 
> 4. Develop zen. It doesn't help anyone for you to add stress to a crunchtime situation. Your boss has a job 10x more stressful than yours.
> 
> 5. Sleep and food are non-negotiable.
> 
> 6. Do grunt work happily, but think about what can make the composer's life easier. Don't stick your oar in unless you really, really can improve a process or workflow, and only volunteer your "idea" when you've actually prepared to deliver it on the spot.
> 
> 7. Respect the chain of command. If anyone higher than composer is in the room, you must absolutely shut up unless spoken to.
> 
> 8. Learn & establish the boundaries with your composer about whether they want to hear your opinion on anything musical. I have worked with one composer who simply did not want my opinion on anything, and another who frequently bounced ideas off me.
> 
> 9. Being a bad communicator & misinterpreting instructions makes you a bad assistant. Learn the composer's communication style and adapt. They're not going to change who they are.
> 
> 10. The harder you are to replace the better you'll be paid - and appreciated.




OK to copy this into the comments under the YouTube vid, I'll link to you! But brilliant addendum!


----------



## NoamL

Sure thing @christianhenson ! Like yourself I learned some of those rules the hard way....


----------



## christianhenson

Have any of you seen some of the big threads that are building under my film on you tube:



Comments like "this is barbarism" and "it needs to stop" someone even say its like modern day "slavery".

Have I missed something here? Is this a pernicious barbaric world I describe something I've become normalised to or indeed am I not trying to simply say, make some tea until you have better things to do with your time and keep your opinions to yourself because when you're running a symphonic scoring session having the world and his wife pile in with his or her opinions would cost tens of thousands of pounds?

Do you find what I describe onerous? Would love to know what @Rctec thinks about these responses?

I always think of internships and assisting as a way of being paid to learn and gain insanely rarefied experience.


----------



## Tice

Internship as a general concept is tainted by bad practices. It doesn't mean your particular iteration of it is wrong, but it makes people wary, perhaps even a little paranoid at times. But not without any reason. Bad things do happen with internships, and the concept could sure use a good PR agent!


----------



## Nils Neumann

I want to highlight @christianhenson response on youtube to the question "Should assistants who write cues or small parts of cues get a tiny percentage of the royalties?"

"If the melody or chord sequence or distinctive rhythm part existed before you start working on it no, if it didn't then yes. If you are the originator of the purely composition material then yes, if you're just reconfiguring to picture no. If you've been asked to put it into a minor key, transpose the melody from the violin to the cellos no, if you've been ask to write a hero theme that is using the same sounds as the rest of the show then yes. It's a minefield but for me you know when you've written something in your heart. Its the difference between having a child of your own and looking after someone's that you care for deeply. A great example of where you're like to actually write something is when a composer asks you to copy the temp. Quick tip, don't copy it too much or else neither of you will get the royalties."



I found this to be very insightful! Feels like the correct and ethical way to deal with this kind of situation.


----------



## Markrs

christianhenson said:


> Have any of you seen some of the big threads that are building under my film on you tube:
> 
> 
> 
> Comments like "this is barbarism" and "it needs to stop" someone even say its like modern day "slavery".
> 
> Have I missed something here? Is this a pernicious barbaric world I describe something I've become normalised to or indeed am I not trying to simply say, make some tea until you have better things to do with your time and keep your opinions to yourself because when you're running a symphonic scoring session having the world and his wife pile in with his or her opinions would cost tens of thousands of pounds?
> 
> Do you find what I describe onerous? Would love to know what @Rctec thinks about these responses?
> 
> I always think of internships and assisting as a way of being paid to learn and gain insanely rarefied experience.



Your video is similar to me working in the office world. If you are junior and in a team of experienced people I would always say it is better to listen than believe you have all the answers, though I am would always encourage contribution, but be aware you might not have all the context and experience. Same when you are in a meeting with your bosses and an exec, I would normally let my bosses lead. Not sure on the tea making, I am always happy to make teas and coffees as it is a way to bond and socialise but I also think it is healthy if everyone makes the tea  Plus I like making the tea as it encourages me to get up away from the screen, can really help with the thinking / problem solving process.

Though I would add I learn a lot from those that work for me, they often have fresh ideas, that help get me out of my box like thinking.


----------



## Markrs

I won't lie though after watching the video I didn't much fancy being a composing assistant. Partly as it felt less collaborative than I like when working.


----------



## FinGael

christianhenson said:


> Have any of you seen some of the big threads that are building under my film on you tube:
> 
> 
> 
> Comments like "this is barbarism" and "it needs to stop" someone even say its like modern day "slavery".
> 
> Have I missed something here? Is this a pernicious barbaric world I describe something I've become normalised to or indeed am I not trying to simply say, make some tea until you have better things to do with your time and keep your opinions to yourself because when you're running a symphonic scoring session having the world and his wife pile in with his or her opinions would cost tens of thousands of pounds?
> 
> Do you find what I describe onerous? Would love to know what @Rctec thinks about these responses?
> 
> I always think of internships and assisting as a way of being paid to learn and gain insanely rarefied experience.




I think the main challenge may revolve around he fact that there are sunglasses of different colour handed to different generations.

This new "everything and everyone is equal" younger generation may see things described here as oppression, and an idea of being an apprentice with less rights can be a bit more difficult for them to swallow. _I'm not saying that there are no good things in breaking the old ways to do and think and forwarding the idea of equal rights._

The more experienced and older ones may know by experience that everyone having equal rights in such situations would probably be something comparable to unleashing the evil genie from the bottle. How many of you could think of a major movie project with thirty, fifty, hundred or more directors?

Oh yes, I am generalizing.

Anyways, an interesting situation.


----------



## christianhenson

Thanks @FinGael I had my suspicion that this was a possible reason. It is interesting because the main interested party in the comments section is a professor of my age, but almost immediately went into "cancel" mode with all sorts of veiled threats and mention of russian hacking bots and Orchestral Tools and 8DIO and stuff. Total non-sequiter (can't spell) from what was being discussed in this video.

It has certainly been the most surprising so far, I've done far more controversial ones in my own mind, the one about Westworld I (half) expected that backlash, but this one I saw as a bit of a "difficult" window into the world of the natural order of things.


----------



## Kent

FinGael said:


> I think the main challenge may revolve around he fact that there are sunglasses of different colour handed to different generations.
> 
> This new "everything and everyone is equal" younger generation may see things described here as oppression, and an idea of being an apprentice with less rights can be a bit more difficult for them to swallow. _I'm not saying that there are no good things in breaking the old ways to do and think and forwarding the idea of equal rights._
> 
> The more experienced and older ones may know by experience that everyone having equal rights in such situations would probably be something comparable to unleashing the evil genie from the bottle. How many of you could think of a major movie project with thirty, fifty, hundred or more directors?
> 
> Oh yes, I am generalizing.
> 
> Anyways, an interesting situation.


Respectfully, I believe you are establishing something of a false dichotomy here. As I read these comments, the given concerns are not about the hierarchies of responsibilities and purviews on a project—which exist for a clear reason and ought to—but rather the manner in which people are treated or considered.


----------



## FinGael

kmaster said:


> Respectfully, I believe you are establishing something of a false dichotomy here. As I read these comments, the given concerns are not about the hierarchies of responsibilities and purviews on a project—which exist for a clear reason and ought to—but rather the manner in which people are treated or considered.



Thank you @kmaster. It is certainly possible. I am sorry if that is what happened.

I have watched Christian's video and read the answers in this thread, but have not yet read the comments in Youtube.


----------



## Brasart

Hey Christian, as a young composer (25) who's been passionately following your channel for a few years now - and also having no interest in becoming a composer's assistant -, I can tell you it didn't feel weird, "old school", or displaced in any way.

It certainly feels like being a composer assistant is the best - or at least, the quickest - way to gain skills, contacts and experience.
I think everything is fine as long as composers and assistants (but especially composers) understand that labor laws exist, and that you shouldn't push off your deadlines, as in overworking, onto young people that might have nor the choice, will, composure, or fear of losing their job to say no to their boss.

As long as it's not a race to "whoever is left standing after excruciating work hours is the one who deserve the assistant job", it's all good.

And also keep making great and educational content, love your videos, you're the best!


----------



## christianhenson

I totally agree, and think I cover this in the final part of the film.... its about being in the trenches together, we're there to look after one another.


----------



## rnieto

christianhenson said:


> Thanks @FinGael I had my suspicion that this was a possible reason. It is interesting because the main interested party in the comments section is a professor of my age, but almost immediately went into "cancel" mode with all sorts of veiled threats and mention of russian hacking bots and Orchestral Tools and 8DIO and stuff. Total non-sequiter (can't spell) from what was being discussed in this video.
> 
> It has certainly been the most surprising so far, I've done far more controversial ones in my own mind, the one about Westworld I (half) expected that backlash, but this one I saw as a bit of a "difficult" window into the world of the natural order of things.



I'll argue that there's a much stronger sense of entitlement nowadays, and that has made the tea boy/runner/assistant position harder to sustain for most composers and recording engineers. Too many people only care about their end goal of being a well-known composer, and not about the invaluable learning of going through the journey, as you mentioned in your video. They want a hard timeline for when they will be making the big bucks and be in the industry's spotlight, and want to get there quick.

I'm very biased, though—I learned by cleaning the basement at a sound design studio in Santa Monica, carrying buckets of flood water out of a North Hollywood recording studio, putting in 14 hours a day of work for $60 a week as an assistant, and being a _very quiet_ fly on the wall when the big dogs were talking. And I wouldn't change any of it, because that taught me how to do what I do. If I hadn't been at the studio with the recording engineer/composer/sound designer at 11 pm on a Friday night, there's a piece of invaluable information that I wouldn't have now.


----------



## Markrs

rnieto said:


> I'll argue that there's a much stronger sense of entitlement nowadays, and that has made the tea boy/runner/assistant position harder to sustain for most composers and recording engineers. Too many people only care about their end goal of being a well-known composer, and not about the invaluable learning of going through the journey, as you mentioned in your video. They want a hard timeline for when they will be making the big bucks and be in the industry's spotlight, and want to get there quick.
> 
> I'm very biased, though—I learned by cleaning the basement at a sound design studio in Santa Monica, carrying buckets of flood water out of a North Hollywood recording studio, putting in 14 hours a day of work for $60 a week as an assistant, and being a _very quiet_ fly on the wall when the big dogs were talking. And I wouldn't change any of it, because that taught me how to do what I do. If I hadn't been at the studio with the recording engineer/composer/sound designer at 11 pm on a Friday night, there's a piece of invaluable information that I wouldn't have now.


On a separate issue I don't like low salaries assistant jobs (thankfully in UK we have minimum wage, though in places like London it is too low to cover expenses), or no pay internship as it restricts access to those that have another source or income, which reduces access to those on lower income.


----------



## Kent

rnieto said:


> I'll argue that there's a much stronger sense of entitlement nowadays, and that has made the tea boy/runner/assistant position harder to sustain for most composers and recording engineers. Too many people only care about their end goal of being a well-known composer, and not about the invaluable learning of going through the journey, as you mentioned in your video. They want a hard timeline for when they will be making the big bucks and be in the industry's spotlight, and want to get there quick.




There are undoubtedly some people like this—I have met a few, as I'm sure most of us have—but respectfully, you are painting a picture of a straw man. 

I would argue that the career plan for _most_ assistants/prospective assistants is this: to be able to make a healthy living in the media music industry, and to be treated humanely while doing so.

As part of the research we undertook last year for the first edition of _Assisting the Composer_, we set up an anonymous survey for composers assistants working for composers based in LA/Southern California (which was our scope at the time). We got a lot of really valuable feedback; for example,







Or this:






Or this:






This does not read like a bunch of entitled brats (to me, at least), but rather, on the whole, earnest young people who are eager to improve themselves and figure out where they fit in the grand scheme of things.



rnieto said:


> I'm very biased, though—I learned by cleaning the basement at a sound design studio in Santa Monica, carrying buckets of flood water out of a North Hollywood recording studio, putting in 14 hours a day of work for $60 a week as an assistant, and being a _very quiet_ fly on the wall when the big dogs were talking. And I wouldn't change any of it, because that taught me how to do what I do. If I hadn't been at the studio with the recording engineer/composer/sound designer at 11 pm on a Friday night, there's a piece of invaluable information that I wouldn't have now.


Which may have been fine for you, but honestly, nobody lives in LA on $240/month. Something heavily subsidized your experiences. It seems you took advantage of the opportunities presented to you in the way you wanted to, and that is great! But that you were able to attempt that at all says more about your external support system than you intrinsically. Most people do not have such support structures.


----------



## Brasart

Great post and valuable insight, also agree with everything you said, and thanks for the link!


----------



## rnieto

Markrs said:


> On a separate issue I don't like low salaries assistant jobs (thankfully in UK we have minimum wage, though in places like London it is too low to cover expenses), or no pay internship as it restricts access to those that have another source or income, which reduces access to those on lower income.



I agree that it's a tough situation to be in. When I was an assistant and was paid what amounted to bus fare money, I had to pay for rent and food, and had no additional income. My wife and I had a few harrowing financial moments around that time.

However, it's about optics again. I paid a crazy amount of money when I went to sound engineering school, and I didn't learn one percent there of what I learned by being an assistant. People tend to forget that assisting a seasoned professional in their workplace is a privilege, not a right, and at the very least it's like going to the best school on the planet for free.

In the end, like with most things in life, it comes down to how badly we want something. Being a creative, self-employed professional is not a 9 to 5 job and there are no financial guarantees of having a steady salary, so I can't see how training to be one should be any different. Just my opinion.


----------



## Markrs

rnieto said:


> I agree that it's a tough situation to be in. When I was an assistant and was paid what amounted to bus fare money, I had to pay for rent and food, and had no additional income. My wife and I had a few harrowing financial moments around that time.
> 
> However, it's about optics again. I paid a crazy amount of money when I went to sound engineering school, and I didn't learn one percent there of what I learned by being an assistant. People tend to forget that assisting a seasoned professional in their workplace is a privilege, not a right, and at the very least it's like going to the best school on the planet for free.
> 
> In the end, like with most things in life, it comes down to how badly we want something. Being a creative, self-employed professional is not a 9 to 5 job and there are no financial guarantees of having a steady salary, so I can't see how training to be one should be any different. Just my opinion.


I agree that on the job experience and learning can often being more useful that a degree, but with a degree in the UK you can get loans and also you normally only need to do 35 hours or less a week, so you can then supplement with a part-time job. With an assistant job you wouldn't get a loan and I doubt you would have the time for any other job.

As a rule I don't like industries that require you to have money to do the job.


----------



## rnieto

kmaster said:


> There are undoubtedly some people like this—I have met a few, as I'm sure most of us have—but respectfully, you are painting a picture of a straw man.



I've been in the sound and music industry for over 30 years and have seen how it has evolved, so I may have some information you don't. Just saying.



kmaster said:


> I would argue that the career plan for _most_ assistants/prospective assistants is this: to be able to make a healthy living in the media music industry, and to be treated humanely while doing so.



And I agree with you. But reality comes at people fast. It's a tough and competitive field, and they don't teach how tough it is at school. If a healthy living is working 9 to 5 and being paid enough to be able to afford a mortgage, a car and kids, you probably already know that most assistants will not have that. Hell, most composers won't have that.



kmaster said:


> This does not read like a bunch of entitled brats (to me, at least), but rather, on the whole, earnest young people who are eager to improve themselves and figure out where they fit in the grand scheme of things.



You used the word 'brats', not me. Entitlement takes many shapes and forms and degrees. And it's one thing to fill out a survey and another one completely is being in the trenches in the thick of it. Hindsight is 20/20.



kmaster said:


> Which may have been fine for you, but honestly, nobody lives in LA on $240/month. Something heavily subsidized your experiences. It seems you took advantage of the opportunities presented to you in the way you wanted to, and that is great! But that you were able to attempt that at all says more about your external support system than you intrinsically. Most people do not have such support structures.



Not so. Picture moving to a country where you barely speak the language, have no family or friends and all you have are some savings that are running out pretty fast. That doesn't sound like a "support structure" to me. I just wanted to get in the industry badly enough that, if I had to take a night shift flipping burgers at a shitty all-night diner, I would have done it so I could keep going at my dream. All I'm saying is that I don't see that drive and determination that much now.


----------



## MGdepp

There is the term of the so-called "bullshit jobs" established by bestselling author David Graeber. By definition, all of them have in common that the person working these is not getting the feeling to do anything substantial, anything valuable to society, anything meaningful, etc. Mostly, those are well-paying jobs in order to compensate the worker for the empty feeling they get.

I guess, in this context, it is rather not well-payed most of the time, as the payment is the assistants hope to finally become a little lord one day. It is the ancient master-apprentice-relationship. It is not restricted to the arts - I have observed the same thing in craftsmanship very often. The only tragedy is, in the arts the degree of exploitation is huge while the chances of actual reward for the pain is lowest ...

To you kids out there - there actually is another way: Learn your craft well, go study and work with other beginners! That is also not a guarantee to "break into the business" (neither is being an assistant). But you may learn more by it and if you need money, there is always the option to make tea for someone busy while being payed!


----------



## Kent

rnieto said:


> I've been in the sound and music industry for over 30 years and have seen how it has evolved, so I may have some information you don't. Just saying.


You have two decades on me, and I'm sure you know things I do not. That has almost nothing to do with the fact that the statement I was responding to...


rnieto said:


> I'll argue that there's a much stronger sense of entitlement nowadays, and that has made the tea boy/runner/assistant position harder to sustain for most composers and recording engineers. Too many people only care about their end goal of being a well-known composer, and not about the invaluable learning of going through the journey, as you mentioned in your video. They want a hard timeline for when they will be making the big bucks and be in the industry's spotlight, and want to get there quick.


... is a straw man, or at best a sweeping generalization. "Kids these days" is not a firm foundation on which to build a position—or have I misunderstood you here? I don't mean to commit a straw man myself, either 



rnieto said:


> And I agree with you. But reality comes at people fast. It's a tough and competitive field, and they don't teach how tough it is at school. If a healthy living is working 9 to 5 and being paid enough to be able to afford a mortgage, a car and kids, you probably already know that most assistants will not have that. Hell, most composers won't have that.


Fair enough, and having some grandiose notions disabused is all part of the post-academic experience. It's part of growing up and becoming a functioning member of western adult society, in other words. I completely agree that schools do not spend nearly enough time on this aspect of the career/industry as they ought to.
But yes, this is part of a bigger issue (some might call it political) but the fact that to some it is a "radical idea" that one should be able to support oneself on a single minimum wage job...just shows how western/American capitalism has brainwashed the population. Should not a high-skill job in a high-expense city provide somewhat over that amount? My music editor friend tells me that the base _assistant_ music editor rate on a multimillion-dollar production is *$45/hour*. You'll be lucky to make half that on the same project as a composer's assistant. It's not like these productions are starved for money, it's that composers have been squeezed and are passing the squeeze downward. It's not fair to either person.


rnieto said:


> You used the word 'brats', not me. Entitlement takes many shapes and forms and degrees. And it's one thing to fill out a survey and another one completely is being in the trenches in the thick of it. Hindsight is 20/20.


Yes, I perhaps extrapolated connotation a bit too much. My apologies. The point stands though. Can/should people act better in the heat of the moment? Sure—composers _and_ assistants alike. I see this as a moot point. People are people. Humans are humans. We are all as likely to mess up or act as we wish we had not as the next one. The survey (which, to be fair, was filled out by self-selecting individuals, which already shows some bias toward eagerness) shows what it shows. In fact, here are some anonymous composers' answers:










Again, self-selecting bias aside, these are not the answers of megalomaniacs, evil people, or incompetents. By and large they're just working professionals who want/need the help of other professionals. (Here's the thought behind "I'm not your superior, just your boss; I was just here before you; etc.") The work needs to get done and they need someone to help accomplish that. Most adults don't have a fully-developed prefrontal cortex (the "executive decision-making" center of the brain—strategy, impulse control, and logical empathy vis-a-vis _sonder_) until 25. 25!! I would wager that most "self-centered" assistants are fresh out of undergrad, and/or went to grad school early, so though they might know Giant Steps or stereo mic techniques or how to decode a MIDI byte they literally do not have the cognitive capacity to even attempt to be fully-professional until halfway through their third (!) decade....and if you look at the data here, "work ethic" and "communication" top composers' chief concerns re: their current/former assistants. Correlation does not imply causation, but these are certainly incredibly correlated.

All this to say: empathy should be extended both ways in any human equation.



rnieto said:


> Not so. Picture moving to a country where you barely speak the language, have no family or friends and all you have are some savings that are running out pretty fast. That doesn't sound like a "support structure" to me. I just wanted to get in the industry badly enough that, if I had to take a night shift flipping burgers at a shitty all-night diner, I would have done it so I could keep going at my dream. All I'm saying is that I don't see that drive and determination that much now.


That certainly takes a lot of grit and determination, and I do not mean to downplay your role in it. But being able to even think about moving internationally for work, and having savings _at all_, is more privilege than many have, as much hard work and exploitation of you that that subsequently entailed. Trial-by-fire is a great way to learn many things...but there is a difference between running the gauntlet and exploitation. If you were okay with your own exploitation, that's your call, but I don't think it's fair to expect that of others.

And please know I say all this in full respect—I don't know you, but even if I did I would not want even a fundamental disagreement to become a personal attack. I for one am thankful for your insights; diversity of experience is one of the best things about this forum.


----------



## rnieto

kmaster said:


> And please know I say all this in full respect—I don't know you, but even if I did I would not want even a fundamental disagreement to become a personal attack. I for one am thankful for your insights; diversity of experience is one of the best things about this forum.



I do appreciate this. I agree with your points of view in general, even if our different backgrounds and experiences make it hard to see eye to eye in some of the specifics. On those, I'm happy to agree to disagree, and I recognize your positions as well-meaning and constructive.

Cheers man!


----------



## NoamL

christianhenson said:


> Is this a pernicious barbaric world I describe, something I've become normalised to?



No and yes, @christianhenson .

*NO -* I wager many of your viewers are not CA's and they're getting a reality check. Just because it's artistic work doesn't mean there's no hierarchy. The composer is an artist but also an entrepreneur, team leader, and department head. The CA needs to be disciplined & reliable, understand that mentoring is a bonus to the work getting done, and understand the composer _does not need_ "another artist" giving ideas. (unless THEY initiate a collaborative relationship with you and then there's an appropriate time). Knowing your role & taking instruction is not self-abasement. Seems like your viewers need to re-think what a composer's studio is, it's not Willy Wonka's factory. Your metaphors of "being in the trenches together" and "at the coalface" are more accurate!

*YES* - The discussion of ☕ 🍩 kind of was a landmine because it "stands for" such a fraught, wider issue. As long as I'm doing work that uses my abilities, there's NO objection to making coffee on the side, vacuuming the studio or whatever. The problem is the stories everyone's heard about "assistants" who end up fetching the dry cleaning and doing groceries while doing no technical work. It's understandable composers can't entrust work to a CA unless he/she can deliver, & onboarding a CA to the unique details of the process can be time consuming. If composers set clear expectations when hiring, & schedule onboarding smartly, it benefits themselves long term. There is no reason for an "I went through the _tea-boy-until-they-give-you-real-tasks_ routine so _you_ should too" culture. It underrates the availability of well-trained, knowledgeable people; also I believe it narrows the diversity of people who eventually become successful composers. I think a culture of clear expectations serves composers & CAs better and fits well with all the other points you made.

In short I reckon your video was full of good wisdom, just some people might have got their wires crossed when they connected your comments about hierarchy/respect with coffee & donuts.


----------



## Mike Greene

NoamL said:


> The discussion of ☕ 🍩 kind of was a landmine because it "stands for" such a fraught, wider issue. As long as I'm doing work that uses my abilities, there's NO objection to making coffee on the side, vacuuming the studio or whatever. The problem is the stories everyone's heard about "assistants" who end up fetching the dry cleaning and doing groceries while doing no technical work.


Sure, but how do we know that's not part of the Miyagi School of Composing? Imagine the big day finally arrives when the assistant is given a chance to mix a track. But ... it's too muddy! The wise composer knowingly nods and says, _"Make the coffee!_" The Assistant reflexively, without even realizing what his hands are doing, applies his non-mud coffee making skills and instantly, the track sounds crisp and clean!


----------



## NoamL

Mike Greene said:


> Sure, but how do we know that's not part of the Miyagi School of Composing? Imagine the big day finally arrives when the assistant is given a chance to mix a track. But ... it's too muddy! The wise composer knowingly nods and says, _"Make the coffee!_" The Assistant reflexively, without even realizing what his hands are doing, applies his non-mud coffee making skills and instantly, the track sounds crisp and clean!



Of course the true power will only come when you master the mute button... Tracks on, tracks off.


----------



## asherpope

Sweep the mids


----------



## badhaircut

Mike Greene said:


> Sure, but how do we know that's not part of the Miyagi School of Composing? Imagine the big day finally arrives when the assistant is given a chance to mix a track. But ... it's too muddy! The wise composer knowingly nods and says, _"Make the coffee!_" The Assistant reflexively, without even realizing what his hands are doing, applies his non-mud coffee making skills and instantly, the track sounds crisp and clean!


LOL, this is perfect!!


----------



## Billy Palmer

I enjoyed the video.
I also had mini heart attacks whenever Christian described something that I learnt on the job as an assistant NEVER TO DO! What a minefield.

I basically agree with all of kmaster's comments.
I was an assistant/intern for the first time last year. I thoroughly enjoyed the time I spent with the composer and I came away much stronger.

I went in with the expectation of an apprenticeship. The reality was more of being a freelancer who needed to be reliable and available for sprints. Being a HOD/composer is unpredictable and assisting is just as unstable. This was the main expectation gap I encountered.

I'd be interested to see a part 2 discussing best practices/problem solving.
For example,
-What communication issues have you solved.
-Do you hire an assistant per hour, or per project and why?


----------



## christianhenson

These comments are fascinating. One thing I did do is treat it as a given that you pay your assistants well. I know of composers who pay assistants but also offer full board and lodge. Internships are not great in some
Studios but they’re always a living wage and often part of a students 4 year diploma or degree.

Gordon Ramsey always likes to point out that even though he gets a bit shouty all of his crew moved with him when he went from exec to chef proprietor at his first restaurant.

I think that can be proof in the pudding. Many composers have assistants who have been with them for many years. I can say that I have had three assistants in the last 12 years (since setting up Spitfire) Sam Bohn was with me for 4 years and is now winning all sorts of awards and is very much in demand Stanley Gabriel is now insanely senior in Spitfire (head of product) Seb Truman is forging a path having set up a studio whilst continuing to work free lance at spitfire and Oliver Patrice Weder is head of composition at Spitfire and released his first album and sample library last year.

and

we’re all still talking.

I remember my Dad saying to me that he abused someone only once in his career as an actor. A prop hand fucked up and my Dad made some hollow threat for him not to fuck up again. That prop hand turned out to be Cameron Mackintosh.


----------



## MOMA

Billy Palmer said:


> I'd be interested to see a part 2 discussing best practices/problem solving.
> For example,
> -What communication issues have you solved.
> -Do you hire an assistant per hour, or per project and why?



This a valid point, the market is rapidly changing and we all suffer from tighter budgets, time schedules and an ever growing competition. So the opportunity to form a good partnership between the composer and the assistant long term is getting harder by the day.
The video from Christian is a reminder of the world as it may be in some studios, but as we are rapidly moving into the future, the perspective is changing for many of us, and especially for those looking for a chance to be a composer assistant.

MOMA


----------



## Tice

People sticking with you, sadly, is not the proof you're looking for. At risk of sounding like fear-mongering:
People can have a scary amount of 'loyalty' to an abusive situation/person. For career situations this can often be fueled by the fear that "There'll never be another opportunity like working with this successful person, no matter how bad it gets here". To make this absolutely clear: I'm not saying you're being abusive. I honestly have no idea, but you sound like one of the most sincere people out there who genuinely cares about the wellbeing of others. I'm only saying that people sticking with you isn't the proof you need that you're doing things right. In the case of the example you mentioned, Ramsey, if his show is anything to go by, he's abusive as all hell. This might not translate into everyone leaving him and it may even result in some of his underlings becoming very successful, but that doesn't mean it's harmless.
And a show like Junior Masterchef shows that he can do perfectly well without the abusive behavior. He doesn't actually need it. Now if he were to not be abusive, what would happen to his underlings then? That'd be the better comparison to make.


----------



## Kent

Apropos of nothing, there is always a relevant XKCD.

This is my favorite one to refer to in any discussion about 'working in the industry':









Survivorship Bias







xkcd.com


----------



## Kent

Billy Palmer said:


> I basically agree with all of kmaster's comments.


Thanks Billy!




Billy Palmer said:


> I'd be interested to see a part 2 discussing best practices/problem solving.
> For example,
> -What communication issues have you solved.
> -Do you hire an assistant per hour, or per project and why?


I second the request for a part 2 (of _n_, perhaps), @christianhenson! This is a deep topic.


----------



## NoamL

Head chef in the kitchen is another good metaphor for how it does work / is supposed to work. Nobody ever sends their "compliments to the chef*s*"!


----------



## easyrider

christianhenson said:


> I’ve no ambition to be a tech reviewer but like doing these as I they help me to properly learn a new piece of kit and do a deep dive on products I think this community has an interest in.




Geek  

Celebrate thy Geekdom !


----------



## JonS

christianhenson said:


> I’ve no ambition to be a tech reviewer but like doing these as I they help me to properly learn a new piece of kit and do a deep dive on products I think this community has an interest in.



very cool, Christian


----------



## Tice

I'm always glad to see another Modular Monday video come up!


----------



## thesteelydane

christianhenson said:


> I’ve no ambition to be a tech reviewer but like doing these as I they help me to properly learn a new piece of kit and do a deep dive on products I think this community has an interest in.




Man, I would love to run my dry Off-World Dan Bau samples through this!!! Great video, Christian!


----------



## christianhenson

We hope to do something INSANE for XMAS:


----------



## JonS

christianhenson said:


> We hope to do something INSANE for XMAS:



You are always up to goodness, Christian !!


----------



## Markrs

christianhenson said:


> We hope to do something INSANE for XMAS:



Love what you guys are all doing with pianobook, the quality of the free libraries is great, but the community is even more amazing. The passion to create all these libraries but to also make it as easy as possible for any one to do it and to create a free sampler as well. Great work all round!


----------



## christianhenson

A massively proud moment for Pianobook.... 



...he made this!!!


----------



## Markrs

christianhenson said:


> A massively proud moment for Pianobook....
> 
> 
> 
> ...he made this!!!



So amazing, what I can I say that has not already been said about both Labs and Pianobook. They are both such amazing gifts, there is so much love in the community and the creation of these libraries that you can almost hear it in the sounds. Spitfire Audio is a wonderful thing @christianhenson but for me these 2 things will are the true gifts you have given the community and I think will live on long in the music created with them!


----------



## christianhenson

Thanks so much, it is words like this that make it so worth, we don't often state our intention with these "side hussles" having them fed-back exactly as intended is a great lift, so a thank you for taking the time to write this.


----------



## Mornats

Arctic Swells sounds amazing. It's a pleasure to play. Thanks Jon and Spitfire!


----------



## Dirtgrain

Wow, I played some chords with it, and it gave me goosebumps. I want to go cuddle in bed with my memories now--so wistful. Many thanks.


----------



## Alex C

Is it exactly the same as the original Kontakt version?


----------



## Mikro93

Alex C said:


> Is it exactly the same as the original Kontakt version?



I believe this is a completely new product made by Jon Meyer, so nothing to do with the old Kontakt instruments that were discontinued in 2018


----------



## Alex C

Mikro93 said:


> I believe this is a completely new product made by Jon Meyer, so nothing to do with the old Kontakt instruments that were discontinued in 2018



The original free Jon Meyer instruments are all available on his website. He never charged anything for it and they were never discontinued. I believe 'Artic Swells' is a repackaging of his 'Flute + Violin' instrument for Kontakt.


----------



## Mikro93

Alex C said:


> The original free Jon Meyer instruments are all available on his website. He never charged anything for it and they were never discontinued. I believe 'Artic Swells' is a repackaging of his 'Flute + Violin' instrument for Kontakt.


Oh, I see! I had no idea he had his own instruments on his website, sorry


----------



## Mikro93

Seems to be the case


----------



## pbobcat

People sometimes moan about the high price of Spitfire libraries but they give SO much back, for me it's worthwhile. Artic Swells is gorgeous!


----------



## Yogevs

To be honest, I would have loved to see this (or a maybe a more "advanced" form of this) come to Originals as well.
Could be so cool to see Spirfire help some of the Pianobook people earn some cash from their samples.


----------



## christianhenson

Ear plugs in for this one:


----------



## rhizomusicosmos

@christianhenson, are you going for that David Hykes vibe?


----------



## Simeon

christianhenson said:


> Ear plugs in for this one:




This is the type of thing that really sets Spitfire apart; not only the inherent curiosity but the abundant generous spirit that gives back and inspires all of us.

Thanks for challenging us to step into new territories, and providing the tools and guidance along the way!


----------



## christianhenson

In this video I discuss the single most important piece of advice I could offer for any aspiring, ascending or struggling media composer. With 10 top tips of how to achieve it alongside ten musical examples. If there was one piece of advice you could give, what would it be? And do you recognise the music, let me know in the comments down below 10-1 what shows these tracks are from.


----------



## Ashermusic

christianhenson said:


> In this video I discuss the single most important piece of advice I could offer for any aspiring, ascending or struggling media composer. With 10 top tips of how to achieve it alongside ten musical examples. If there was one piece of advice you could give, what would it be? And do you recognise the music, let me know in the comments down below 10-1 what shows these tracks are from.





Bravo, Christian, well done and agreed. I have had a moderately successful career in music but never _solely_ as a composer because while I am really good at doing reasonable imitations of others, I don't think that until the last few years with my pop songs, I ever really found my own voice.

BTW, I too use an RE-20, what is that mount you are using for it?


----------



## christianhenson

Ashermusic said:


> Bravo, Christian, well done and agreed. I have had a moderately successful career in music but never _solely_ as a composer because while I am really good at doing reasonable imitations of others, I don't think that until the last few years with my pop songs, I ever really found my own voice.
> 
> BTW, I too use an RE-20, what is that mount you are using for it?




Hey there, its just a standard RE20 shockmount?









Electro-Voice 309A Shockmount | Reverb


Reverb is a marketplace bringing together a wide-spanning community to buy, sell, and discuss all things music gear.




reverb.com





and this pop shield









RoXdon HPF-2 Metal Pop Filter for Electrovoice RE20, RE27 & RE320 Microphones 635189486514 | eBay


High-frequency details pass through to be captured in full while blocking the invasive blasts.



www.ebay.co.uk


----------



## Ashermusic

christianhenson said:


> Hey there, its just a standard RE20 shockmount?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Electro-Voice 309A Shockmount | Reverb
> 
> 
> Reverb is a marketplace bringing together a wide-spanning community to buy, sell, and discuss all things music gear.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> reverb.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> and this pop shield
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> RoXdon HPF-2 Metal Pop Filter for Electrovoice RE20, RE27 & RE320 Microphones 635189486514 | eBay
> 
> 
> High-frequency details pass through to be captured in full while blocking the invasive blasts.
> 
> 
> 
> www.ebay.co.uk



Thanks Christian. I am using the clip that came with it right on the boom stand and it doesn’t stay put well enough.


----------



## JonS

christianhenson said:


> In this video I discuss the single most important piece of advice I could offer for any aspiring, ascending or struggling media composer. With 10 top tips of how to achieve it alongside ten musical examples. If there was one piece of advice you could give, what would it be? And do you recognise the music, let me know in the comments down below 10-1 what shows these tracks are from.



I agree that "daring to be different" is a good approach, or one could say finding your unique voice as a composer, but I still know that being lucky is the most significant factor in success. Thus, I finally disagree with some of what you said as being lucky in life in all things is the most important factor in succeeding in any pursuit regardless how much you don't agree with me and I could give you endless examples why this is true. Many who succeed misplace their egos for their success and it's just not true, it's luck. Speak to any billionaire or the most successful people and they all will tell you that luck played the most significant role. You are confusing your ego for luck. Still love ya!!


----------



## christianhenson

With all due respect, I A B S O L U T E L Y couldn't disagree with you more.

Luck IS a factor as I said in my film.

But it is not an absolute.

I gave Ben Wallfisch his first job in film music, the minute I met him I knew he was going to be massive.

I used to drink with Dan Pemberton in shit pubs in Soho, the minute I met him I knew he was going to be massive.

What being insanely ambitious, hard working, talented, geographically well positioned and well connected is the ability to shorten the odds of luck falling in your favour.

What being insanely conscientious, productive and intelligent affords you is the ability to capitalise on fortuitous events, meetings, circumstance when they fall.

Lessening the odds so that fortune favours you is the first step.

Ensuring that when fortune favours you that you capitalise on it is the second.

And leading yourself to be able to deploy your skills so you can capitalise on those two key steps is fundamental. Ergo, you have to work your tits off.

I'm not talking about billionaires, I'm talking about composers, and I'm not aware that feeding back the thousands of conversations I've had with composers is an ego-thing, it is quite simply the consensus as I see it.

Sorry to respond passionately but I think your assertion is a very dangerous one when we're talking about people giving their all to be successful and how that can impact on mental health. We have a responsibility _not _ to say things that have no evidence behind them and can be damaging to people who are working their socks off to gain success.

Respectfully.

CH.

**EDIT** I think the key difference here is comparing business-men/women to craftspeople. The paradigm is TOTALLY different. Why can I say this? Because I am a successful businessman and can safely say a series of fortuitous events (actually the unfortunate events were as important as the fortunate ones) are totally central to the success of an enterprise that neither my co-founder I set out to achieve. My craft as a film composer? Graft.


----------



## ism

Stephen Limbaugh said:


> Pardon the small aside...
> 
> 
> 
> Publicly perhaps. Lots of what billionaires will say/write publicly is to cultivate a public imagine designed to keep the pitchforks at bay and secure wealth for their posterity.
> 
> Privately however, the 3 billionaires I have met, and the dozen $100m+ net worth folks, all of them believe it was their own intelligence and grit.


And there’s psychological research to back that up.


----------



## JonS

Stephen Limbaugh said:


> Pardon the small aside...
> 
> 
> 
> Publicly perhaps. Lots of what billionaires will say/write publicly is to cultivate a public imagine designed to keep the pitchforks at bay and secure wealth for their posterity.
> 
> Privately however, the 3 billionaires I have met, and the dozen $100m+ net worth folks, all of them believe it was their own intelligence and grit.


Well, then they are not very aware or evolved people as the billionaires and most successful producers that I've met in person have all said luck plays the most significant role. The billionaires I've known are not good people, most of them are terribly narcissistic and if you are not as wealthy as they are they don't respect you at all. None of these ultra wealthy people believe the laws apply to them and are tremendous tax cheats. And, their marriages are total train wrecks. So how really successful are any of these billionaires when the most important thing in one's life, your marriage, is a disaster?! I don't consider these people to be successful at life. It's hard to find truly caring people who are extraordinarily wealthy. I'm not saying they don't exist, but they are very rare individuals. Almost all of the ultra wealthy people I've met or gotten to know are pretty horrible types and not honorable. 

Talk to the biggest film and theater producers and they will also tell you that luck plays the most important factor when determining the success of a production. Mark Cuban has said numerous times if he lost all his money he doubts he would ever become a billionaire again as it requires enormous luck. The most successful films, shows, songs and books are not necessarily the best or the most well-written. I am not saying that talented people never succeed, tons of talented people succeed. However, there are plenty of hacks who have been extremely lucky to experience tremendous success too. Cameron Mackintosh and Andrew Lloyd Webber are both very talented, successful and wealthy yet they have mostly failures but no one focuses on the failures. If they were so bright, they would always or almost always succeed, and that is just not how life unfolds. 

Finding the love of your life is so much about luck, no one can summon this to appear in your life. Not being killed by a drunk driver, and not getting terminal cancer as a child or adult, and not being murdered or paralyzed by a random car jacking, car crash or plane crash are all events requiring pure luck along with so many other things that can go wrong in one's life causing your hopes and dreams to vanish. I've witnessed the nicest people in perfect health have their lives ended by total random tragedy where had they simply been lucky they would all still be alive. Human life is very fragile. So much can go wrong ending the success one is pursuing or the success one has built over a lifetime. 

Some of the greatest painters and writers only succeeded decades after they died. For those who experience happiness and success, appreciate it as much as you can as life can be terribly tragic very quickly. I've experienced way too much of life to know that luck plays the most important role in everything. It's good to make a plan, pursue one's hopes and dreams, and do everything in one's power to achieve them, but at some point one has to realize that something else is at play in this realm. None of us are Gods. We all need something not in our control to greatly help us get the things we want. For those who don't yet understand what I am talking about, I pray you all live very long happy lives filled with so much love, luck, success and good health that you never have to learn the hard way what I've experienced in my lifetime and can all transcend one day with the egotistical belief that luck had nothing to do with your blessed life.


----------



## JonS

Stephen Limbaugh said:


> lol... you should tell that to Mark Cuban or whoever it is you know in the “, , , club.”


I no longer associate with any of those people. They are way too narcissistic for me so I threw them out of my life a long time ago. Successful people to me are those who embrace humility, kindness, compassion, spiritual evolvement and balance, not the greedy power-hungry infantile manipulative narcissist type which dominate the most financially powerful in this world. Even the ones who say luck plays the most important role in their success are still not nice people most of the time.


----------



## JonS

christianhenson said:


> With all due respect, I A B S O L U T E L Y couldn't disagree with you more.
> 
> Luck IS a factor as I said in my film.
> 
> But it is not an absolute.
> 
> I gave Ben Wallfisch his first job in film music, the minute I met him I knew he was going to be massive.
> 
> I used to drink with Dan Pemberton in shit pubs in Soho, the minute I met him I knew he was going to be massive.
> 
> What being insanely ambitious, hard working, talented, geographically well positioned and well connected is the ability to shorten the odds of luck falling in your favour.
> 
> What being insanely conscientious, productive and intelligent affords you is the ability to capitalise on fortuitous events, meetings, circumstance when they fall.
> 
> Lessening the odds so that fortune favours you is the first step.
> 
> Ensuring that when fortune favours you that you capitalise on it is the second.
> 
> And leading yourself to be able to deploy your skills so you can capitalise on those two key steps is fundamental. Ergo, you have to work your tits off.
> 
> I'm not talking about billionaires, I'm talking about composers, and I'm not aware that feeding back the thousands of conversations I've had with composers is an ego-thing, it is quite simply the consensus as I see it.
> 
> Sorry to respond passionately but I think your assertion is a very dangerous one when we're talking about people giving their all to be successful and how that can impact on mental health. We have a responsibility _not _ to say things that have no evidence behind them and can be damaging to people who are working their socks off to gain success.
> 
> Respectfully.
> 
> CH.
> 
> **EDIT** I think the key difference here is comparing business-men/women to craftspeople. The paradigm is TOTALLY different. Why can I say this? Because I am a successful businessman and can safely say a series of fortuitous events (actually the unfortunate events were as important as the fortunate ones) are totally central to the success of an enterprise that neither my co-founder I set out to achieve. My craft as a film composer? Graft.


I rarely disagree with anything you say, Christian. However.... I am not just talking about billionaires and their financial success. James Horner built his entire successful career as a composer only to see it vanish along with his life in one unlucky moment of a plane crash 💥 A similar terrible fate that followed Kobe Bryant, Sam Kinison, Stevie Ray Vaughan, Buddy Holly, Richie Valens, Roberto Clemente, and others let alone the countless list of others who die well before their time from some horrific illness (Lou Gehrig, Bruce Lee) or unlucky tragic event out of their control.

Mozart died at the young age of 35, Schubert at 31, Bizet at 36, Chopin at 39, Gershwin at 38, Johann Johannsson at 48, Pergolesi at 26, Adam Schlesinger at 52, and let’s not forget Alexandre Levy, Amy Winehouse, Robert Johnson, Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin, Jim Morrison, Kurt Cobain, Brian Jones, Duane Allman, Randy Rhoads, Ronnie Van Zant, Sid Vicious, John Lennon, Keith Moon, John Bonham, and many more. So in the same way one needs to get lucky 🍀 to succeed, one also needs tremendous luck to not have a tragic event take it all away from you in a blink of an eye.

There’s also a long list of top composers who succeeded in film and pop music but failed horribly on Broadway as they did not get lucky on the Great White Way ie. John Barry, Adam Schlesinger, Paul Simon, Sting, Bryan Adams, Phil Collins, ELO, and many more. One of the biggest flops ever in Broadway history was Pipe Dream by the legendary Rodgers & Hammerstein, though they aren’t alone as Alan Menken’s Leap of Faith bombed too as well as Marvin Hamlisch’s Smile and Jean Seberg, Alan Jay Lerner & Leonard Bernstein’s 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, Stephen Schwartz’s Rags, Stephen Sondheim’s Merrily We Roll Along, Duncan Sheik’s American Psycho, Charles Strouse’s A Broadway Musical, Jim Steinman’s Dance of the Vampires, etc. Life in general, especially in the entertainment business requires incredible amounts of luck.

Spitfire may be the most successful sample library developer ever and it’s clear that Christian has gotten to know an enormous amount of super successful composers in the industry. I think when one is so successful and surrounded by the most successful colleagues it’s easy to believe how much all of one’s brilliance and hard work had everything to do with making such a success unfold. Unfortunately, there’s a world of people out there just as talented that are not making it and most likely never will.

How unlucky so many genius black artists have been only to have their music ripped off by legendary rock bands who took over the world years later. Listen to Otis Rush and you will hear the entire signature sounds of The Rolling Stones, Cream, The Allman Brothers, The Grateful Dead well before those bands ever existed. Otis is not the only unlucky black artist that list is very long of super talented artists who did not have the luck to succeed while other artists thrived.

I always deeply appreciate your passion, experience and beliefs and almost always agree with everything you say, except about this one specific point. You can’t find a super successful Broadway producer who does not believe luck plays the most important factor in why a show succeeds or fails regardless which A-list superstars are enlisted to craft that production. I’ve spoken with almost all of them and they will all tell you privately the same thing regarding the preeminent importance of luck. If a composer’s first show is a failure he won’t get a second chance in theatre and his career is over in that arena. 80% of all musicals fail and all the A-list composers, directors, writers, actors and producers can’t change those odds no matter how talented they are and how hard they work. 60% of all movies fail for the same reasons just as 90% of all record label artists lose money for the record company. Talent and hard work cannot change these daunting realities.

Life requires tremendous luck regardless how passionate, ambitious, persistent, hard-working, determined, talented, educated, intelligent, charismatic, good-intentioned, well-connected, and earnest one is. Melville did not succeed in his lifetime neither did Van Gogh, and they are not alone as genius talent not recognized while they lived. And, though there are many very talented people who do succeed, many others succeed that are not necessarily genius or that talented be it directors, producers, writers, composers, etc. I know you believe cream rises to the top, but there’s an endless list of failed movies, albums, songs, tv shows, books, plays, musicals and other works created by the top of the A-list of writers, directors and composers that begs to differ. I’ve seen fabulous movies and shows that were total failures at the box office while there are huge smash hits that IMHO I thought were dreadful.

I think it’s important for any composer that wants to enter this industry be prepared to face how difficult it is to achieve success as a media composer. It’s not impossible, but given how few will make it, it will be nearly impossible to attain success. For instance, if only 1000 out of 1 million composers will succeed in this industry then that means 999,000 composers cannot make a steady living in this business let alone any money at all. Those odds are so stark that breaking through and becoming one of those 1000 composers is not just highly unlikely to happen but nearly impossible to overcome. I strongly suggest that a composer only pursues this career if they cannot fathom any other possible career path because of how difficult it can be to make a living in this business.

Yes, I know you think luck plays some kind of a factor in a composer’s success so I realize you are not stating that luck is completely irrelevant, but I think luck plays a substantially more significant role in attaining major success than you do, that’s all. FYI I adore Spitfire’s libraries (own just about all of them), love watching your YouTube channel, and love your music! Always wishing you and the people you care about continued good luck 🍀 in all things🙏

Your friend ☮

*I am a little bit older than you, but a long long time ago in a galaxy far far away I used to believe cream rises to the top just like you, and that even though one had to be a little lucky in life to gain success, talent, skill, drive, integrity, determination, charisma, persistence and innovation were all way more important than just dumb luck. I learned the hard way over and over again that this is sadly not true, the world is not a meritocracy either. It’s unfortunate that it’s always better to be lucky than smart. Chuck Norris used to say luck is 98% hard work, that’s true in martial arts 🥋 and becoming a world class musician, that’s not true in becoming an A-list composer. I’ve met some unbelievably talented composers, some highly trained with PhD in composition from the top music schools on the planet and others with no formal music training, and the only thing they have in common is they will most likely not become successful film and tv composers unless a substantial amount of luck engulfs their careers. Sadly, justice does not conquer all and a consistent dose of positivity cannot simply manifest these kinds of pursuits to happen no matter how hard one tries in every imaginable way to succeed. All a person can do is try their best in life and let the universe do the rest.


----------



## JonS

Stephen Limbaugh said:


> lol... you should tell that to Mark Cuban or whoever it is you know in the “, , , club.”


Unlike being a composer, I think being an accomplished pianist or musician is way more about dedication, determination, practice and hard work and much less about luck, so there are certain career paths where the only way one is gonna get there is rolling up your sleeves and doing the work to gain mastery. No one becomes a brain surgeon because they primarily lucked into it.


----------



## Troels Folmann

If it sounds good ... it is good (aka ear over intellect).


----------



## christianhenson

Is this the coolest effects pedal ever?


----------



## christianhenson

WIN EVERYTHING SPITFIRE IS GOING TO RELEASE IN 2021!!!


----------



## dcomdico

Paleontologist Stephen Jay Gould called human existence the result of "survival of the luckiest." That success in merely human endeavors should come down to contingency should then come as no surprise. Why you might not agree: survivorship bias.


----------



## christianhenson

dcomdico said:


> Paleontologist Stephen Jay Gould called human existence the result of "survival of the luckiest." That success in merely human endeavors should come down to contingency should then come as no surprise. Why you might not agree: survivorship bias.



As a backgammon player (one of the most ancient games in the world) I see it more to do with increasing your odds, switching from offensive to defensive, adjusting your position within the hierarchy so that whatever dice are rolled you are able to adjust your tactic to overcome your opponent.

I am of the view that successful people, and by that I mean people who become successful and stay successful, usually have had their fair share of bad luck as well as good. The most learned of us after all, tend to have had the most lessons.

I think we judge success as a single hierarchy. Where you sit at any given time. For me I would judge it on a whole portfolio of context and achievement.

Steve Jobs could be considered hugely successful, but when bearing in mind that he wasn't born into famine in sub-Saharan brush land AND was a pretty shit Dad to his eldest daughter tends to temper my opinion of him somewhat. I imagine someone further back in his lineage may have suffered more so that he could go to Stanford and ignore the responsibility of being a father.


----------



## dcomdico

The ancient world thought mostly in terms of fate and fickle fortune and those that tried to rig that system paid a heavy price. So tread lightly  And look around you - BLM reminds us of the contingency of being born white, male, cis etc., the world is suffering from the contingency of COVID, and the fate of impending climate change promises to smite us for our hubris, despite all of our hard work and achievement. But it is folly to disagree with Henson about success (I say this without irony), even though, logically his argument is extremely weak. Again, each example provided, Jobs or the people who stay successful, has already filtered out the vast majority who have followed the same path, performed the same actions but failed. But at least this observation makes for a wonderful paradox.


----------



## Peros

but can't we also attribute to luck the way we are born?
Our talent, dedication to hard work, intelligence, looks, the family we are born in (the kind of parents we have) and numerous other things that in addition to many other factors, also makes every one of us the people we are??


----------



## SupremeFist

Peros said:


> but can't we also attribute to luck the way we are born?
> Our talent, dedication to hard work, intelligence, looks, the family we are born in (the kind of parents we have) and numerous other things that in addition to many other factors, also makes every one of us the people we are??


Absolutely: this is why modern philosophical ethics has "moral luck" as a hot topic.


----------



## JonS

christianhenson said:


> As a backgammon player (one of the most ancient games in the world) I see it more to do with increasing your odds, switching from offensive to defensive, adjusting your position within the hierarchy so that whatever dice are rolled you are able to adjust your tactic to overcome your opponent.
> 
> I am of the view that successful people, and by that I mean people who become successful and stay successful, usually have had their fair share of bad luck as well as good. The most learned of us after all, tend to have had the most lessons.
> 
> I think we judge success as a single hierarchy. Where you sit at any given time. For me I would judge it on a whole portfolio of context and achievement.
> 
> Steve Jobs could be considered hugely successful, but when bearing in mind that he wasn't born into famine in sub-Saharan brush land AND was a pretty shit Dad to his eldest daughter tends to temper my opinion of him somewhat. I imagine someone further back in his lineage may have suffered more so that he could go to Stanford and ignore the responsibility of being a father.


I love backgammon too, Christian!! I know quite a bit about metaphysics, and once one understands the implications of the timing of their birth through mathematics & charts it becomes much easier to ascertain why certain people have a huge predisposition to succeed in ways others never will ie. Bill Gates, Michael Dell, The Rolling Stones, etc.... Being born with or having partners with several Golden linkages (Jupiter-Pluto, Venus-Pluto, Jupiter-Chiron, Venus-Chiron, Pluto-Chiron) are one of the more powerful indicators of the potential for success, fame, wealth and power. No one to my knowledge can control when they were born after the fact, so this essential event becomes the most dramatic echo of our future destined outcomes.

Of course, I agree that each individual should do as much as they can to prepare for and foster the success they may experience throughout their lifetime be it planned or not, but wither one succeeds at a high level or not has much more to do with energies out of our control than in them IMHO. Deciding to go to kitchen to retrieve an apple 🍎 from the fridge is a plan almost anyone can succeed at 100% of the time. However, planning to become the next Bill Gates, Elon Musk, Albert Einstein, Napoleon, Andrew Lloyd Webber, Pablo Picasso, Mick Jagger, or Hans Zimmer are not even remotely as easy to achieve no matter how hard one tries. The whole world of 7.8 billion people would love to be rich, yet only 2,825 individuals have achieved billionaire status owning more wealth than 60% of the world’s population combined. The richest 26 individuals alone have more wealth than 4 billion people combined. It is typical for successful people to believe that their cunning, wisdom, talent and hard work was the prime factor in determining their own success, but that is their lower mind and ego embracing a notion that does not account for God’s grace and how fragile human life is. So much tragedy can derail anyone from success in a second.

As John Lennon stated, “Life is what happens to you while you’re busy making other plans.” Danny Elfman initially never wanted to go into music let alone become a film composer and never believed the studio would accept his original score for Pee-wee’s Big Adventure, yet that is precisely what happened. We should all try to do our best in life and attempt to pursue our passions and dreams, but certain opportunities will unfold for some that will never unfold for others because control is ultimately an illusion IMHO. Hang a toilet on the wall in 1914 and Dadaism decrees you a genius as the carnage of World War I collapsed the culture of rationality that existed since Enlightenmet. Who in their right mind would ever think a toilet 🚽 was high Art 🖼? Alexander Graham Bell and Nikola Tesla were equally genius inventors, yet when Westinghouse refused to acknowledge their royalty agreement with Tesla only Bell became a household name throughout the world and financially successful while Tesla spent his life penniless, in debt and eventually homeless. After what I’ve learned through studying metaphysics, I truly wonder if Free Will even exists or perhaps it’s a mere illusion as well. I would assume this is a hard concept for most to wrap their head around as it used to be for me too. Even though I am expecting you will disagree with me, I think you are a wonderful person 💫


----------



## D Halgren

christianhenson said:


> As a backgammon player (one of the most ancient games in the world) I see it more to do with increasing your odds, switching from offensive to defensive, adjusting your position within the hierarchy so that whatever dice are rolled you are able to adjust your tactic to overcome your opponent.
> 
> I am of the view that successful people, and by that I mean people who become successful and stay successful, usually have had their fair share of bad luck as well as good. The most learned of us after all, tend to have had the most lessons.
> 
> I think we judge success as a single hierarchy. Where you sit at any given time. For me I would judge it on a whole portfolio of context and achievement.
> 
> Steve Jobs could be considered hugely successful, but when bearing in mind that he wasn't born into famine in sub-Saharan brush land AND was a pretty shit Dad to his eldest daughter tends to temper my opinion of him somewhat. I imagine someone further back in his lineage may have suffered more so that he could go to Stanford and ignore the responsibility of being a father.


Jobs went to Reed, not Stanford. Just saying...


----------



## easyrider

JonS said:


> It is typical for successful people to believe that their cunning, wisdom, talent and hard work was the prime factor in determining their own success, but that is their lower mind and ego embracing a notion that does not account for God’s grace and how fragile human life is. So much tragedy can derail anyone from success in a second.



In 2007 a flood wiped me out completely. I lost my home, my studio, everything. I went to work that morning in a state of order...and came home to chaos... The house was condemned by the insurance company. I was homeless. 

I knocked the house down and rebuilt another house in situ 20 feet higher and with flood defences. That took 8 years of hard work and pain and ups and downs....

13 years on...I have no mortgage, I have just quit my job after 15 years teaching TV and Film production to 16-19 year olds due to the UK government crushing the education system with nonsense bureaucracy, Bloat and a pure toxic working environment. This caused me nothing but stress and anxiety.

From the 18th December I will be jobless... That 2007 flood that was beyond my control was the best thing that happened to me. It made me wakeup and realise what meaning was. Success is not money, or fame or adulation...These are all illusion. Success is internal. Its meaning from within. Its getting a text from your 19 year old daughter telling you she loves you. Its building a pond for 3 years by hand to save and protect your mental health. Success is to love and to be loved.

New challenges await me...I'll need to find another job at some point...But 2007 taught me that the only way to true meaning is ,Like Camus puts it. "Is to embrace the absurd".


----------



## christianhenson

Great story. I certainly wouldn't be where I was today had it not been for my brain exploding when I was 25 and nearly killing me. I always maintain that whilst it was horrid for my family, it was the best thing that ever happened to me.


----------



## easyrider

christianhenson said:


> Great story. I certainly wouldn't be where I was today had it not been for my brain exploding when I was 25 and nearly killing me. I always maintain that whilst it was horrid for my family, it was the best thing that ever happened to me.




@christianhenson I'm free for a job at spitfire if you need me....Available from the 18th December.


----------



## Technostica

Unless you really know what the true nature of reality is, then all talk about luck is speculation. 
So if you choose to believe that success is down to luck, you are choosing a negative idealogy that you can't prove. 
So depending on the nature of reality, you may actually be creating a life that is 'unlucky', based purely on your belief system, even though luck is not absolute. 
So be very careful what you believe.


----------



## christianhenson

The world's biggest choir and a binaural piano FREE from pianobook:


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## rnieto

@christianhenson This is fantastic stuff! Thank you so much, Christian!


----------



## creativeforge

christianhenson said:


> The world's biggest choir and a binaural piano FREE from pianobook:




Hi Christian, I'm just discovering this choir, wowzers! What a fascinating project, Christian, wow. And what could be more humanly vulnerable and expressing both our desire for connection (calling out) and our sense of isolation (dependence) than the human voice? A true beauty this whole project and the results! Really moved.

Peace to you and yours,

Andre


----------



## bigrichpea

christianhenson said:


> The world's biggest choir and a binaural piano FREE from pianobook:




That is amazing, I love the sense of community in the whole Pianobook
project. Thank you.


----------



## creativeforge

christianhenson said:


> The world's biggest choir and a binaural piano FREE from pianobook:




Gorgeous piano... Looking forward to try it with the studio headphones.


----------



## nolotrippen

Thank you thank you thank you


----------



## sostenuto

Family Piano enhanced and now '_ported _?' to PluginGuru UNIFY. Yesterday (Dec 26) YT Livestream covered this and is now saved on YT.


----------



## christianhenson

sostenuto said:


> Family Piano enhanced and now '_ported _?' to PluginGuru UNIFY. Yesterday (Dec 26) YT Livestream covered this and is now saved on YT.


where can I find this?


----------



## Markrs

christianhenson said:


> where can I find this?


Hi Christian,

Here is the link the the Unify Pianobook patches:








Unified - Pianobook Select.guru


Shared with Dropbox




www.dropbox.com





I have linked to the video where is shows what is included in the patch library as it is both Family Piano and Winter Voices


----------



## christianhenson

oooh thanks!


----------



## Mikro93

Okay, we need to talk.

I downloaded the free Family Grand and Winter Voices. This is so amazing.

So, this is one track, stacking the Grand detuned down an octave, and the Evo Fast patch of Winter Voices, with some granular goodness and saturation - nothing fancy, nothing expensive, but going full perineum! 

Happy holidays everyone


----------



## thesteelydane

easyrider said:


> In 2007 a flood wiped me out completely. I lost my home, my studio, everything. I went to work that morning in a state of order...and came home to chaos... The house was condemned by the insurance company. I was homeless.
> 
> I knocked the house down and rebuilt another house in situ 20 feet higher and with flood defences. That took 8 years of hard work and pain and ups and downs....
> 
> 13 years on...I have no mortgage, I have just quit my job after 15 years teaching TV and Film production to 16-19 year olds due to the UK government crushing the education system with nonsense bureaucracy, Bloat and a pure toxic working environment. This caused me nothing but stress and anxiety.
> 
> From the 18th December I will be jobless... That 2007 flood that was beyond my control was the best thing that happened to me. It made me wakeup and realise what meaning was. Success is not money, or fame or adulation...These are all illusion. Success is internal. Its meaning from within. Its getting a text from your 19 year old daughter telling you she loves you. Its building a pond for 3 years by hand to save and protect your mental health. Success is to love and to be loved.
> 
> New challenges await me...I'll need to find another job at some point...But 2007 taught me that the only way to true meaning is ,Like Camus puts it. "Is to embrace the absurd".



Glad to hear you rebuild your life and found true meaning. I experienced something similar, but on a much, much smaller scale.

I was working as an orchestral musician in Sweden, fresh out of conservatory, and eager to do well. I was working an opera orchestra job and doing auditions all the time, so some days I was playing violin close to 10 hours a day - a few years in and I had constant and severe shoulder pain, but kept playing, out of fear of losing my contract and the social stigma of being "one of those" who complained about the pain that almost all classical musicians live with. Needles to say, that was the dumbest thing I have ever done. When finally the pain was so severe I couldn't even lift my instrument up to play without tears, it was too late. It took almost a year to get a proper diagnosis (chronic bursitis and biceps tendonitis, due to a massive shoulder blade dysfunction). In that year I tried to return to work many times, which just made it worse and worse. When I finally got the proper diagnosis, I realised I would probably never play again.

In the end it took 18 months of intense daily physio therapy, and I suffered a massive depression along the way. I couldn't even stand to listen to music for almost a year, because it reminded of the one thing I wanted to do, but couldn't. Despite numerous testaments from expert that even office desk work would cause chronic damage to my shoulder, the government insisted I wasn't eligible for any sickness cover, and I damn near became homeless. The only reason I didn't was a sympathetic social worker, who understood and kept putting my case file at the bottom of the pile.

In the end though, it was the best thing that ever happened to me, because it set me free as a musician. When I was finally able to return to playing I now longer felt the pressure of having to be successful. I returned and rebuild because I wanted to, not because I was driven by my previous mad ambitions. That eventually led me to discovering that I loved playing viola more than violin, I switched and had a good career as an orchestral viola freelancer for many years. Then one day I realised I wasn't creatively satisfied by that, moved to Vietnam and now I write music and make sample libraries. That would never have happened without my injury, I was so blinded by my ambition I missed all the peripheral opportunities - there's a French expression I think - "idé fix"? Sometimes I miss playing orchestra, but I'm much happier now exploring my own creative instincts and experimenting with sampling, synths and new kinds of music, than if I had stayed in an orchestra job for the rest of my life - and I have experienced cultures and parts of the world I would probably never have seen otherwise.


----------



## Mikro93

thesteelydane said:


> there's a French expression I think - "idé fix"?


Idée fixe 

Good to know that all of that lead to Bunker Strings :D

Be well, friend


----------



## christianhenson

Do you know of any LPG plugins?


----------



## Mikro93

I'll watch after my day of work, but I was excited to know that you had an LPG on the way!

Generate and Pendulate synth plugins by Eventide/Newfangled have LPGs, it gives them a very different dynamic feel than other synth plugins I own. Pendulate is free, do look it up, you might enjoy the sound of it, not only because of the LPG, it has an interesting oscillator and waveshaper!


----------



## allen-garvey

christianhenson said:


> Do you know of any LPG plugins?



Reason can do it but it is a bit overkill if you are using it just for that. You can use a pulveriser and connect the CV out from the envelope follower to the CV in of a filter cutoff. 

I don't own it but I think Native Instrument's driver can do it, since you can have the envelope follower modulate the filter frequency.


----------



## LinusW

There is a Doepfer LPG for Softube Modular, but I will do it in Reason.


----------



## gussunkri

There is a LPG in Reaktor’s blocks.

I am loving my Malekko Borg in my Eurorack.


----------



## Mikro93

Okay, I watched the video!

In my situation, I would use one of Max4Live's Envelope Follower, and map it to a filter and a volume knob. But of course, you'd need Ableton Live and M4L for that. 

I wonder whether Logic has this kind of envelope follower plugin, that you could map to anything you want?


----------



## christianhenson

OK, so a VCR in a stompbox, do we really need this???


----------



## mscp

christianhenson said:


> OK, so a VCR in a stompbox, do we really need this???




For as long as there are musicians who can take advantage of it - why not?


----------



## christianhenson

Last week I made a video for Spitfire audio that demonstrated how I would go about pitching for a job in a way that broke with tradition got noticed and hopefully would be successful. But some of you asked “but where do you find the opportunity to pitch?”. The answer is both simple AND difficult for some to swallow, because…. Well, check out the video. We’re in a golden age of creation, be a part of it by anyway possible.


----------



## JonS

christianhenson said:


> Last week I made a video for Spitfire audio that demonstrated how I would go about pitching for a job in a way that broke with tradition got noticed and hopefully would be successful. But some of you asked “but where do you find the opportunity to pitch?”. The answer is both simple AND difficult for some to swallow, because…. Well, check out the video. We’re in a golden age of creation, be a part of it by anyway possible.



I totally concur with you, Christian!! Another wonderful video!! It is very important that a composer develops their chops as well as every controllable aspect of their career as best they can so if and when that opportunity arises one is as prepared for success as possible!! Well said!! Getting an agent is not easy as one either needs a large body of work before an agent will get interested in repping you or a major credit with an A-list producer or director who wants to work with that composer again.


----------



## christianhenson

JonS said:


> I totally concur with you, Christian!! Another wonderful video!! It is very important that a composer develops their chops as well as every controllable aspect of their career as best they can so if and when that opportunity arises one is as prepared for success as possible!! Well said!! Getting an agent is not easy as one either needs a large body of work before an agent will get interested in repping you or a major credit with an A-list producer or director who wants to work with that composer again.


Thanks JonS, I think it is also important not to get an agent TOO EARLY, you will have nothing to negotiate with, our industry is littered with shite deals made at the beginnings of careers. But possibly more important why hand of the controls of your career without setting a course for yourself. I have seen people get an agent then sit around on their arse for a year waiting for the phone to ring, and when they finally get off their arses and get a job using their own tenacity are suddenly incredibly hacked off that their agent is taking 20% and a 50% publisher's share of their authorship!

I literally gave away 50% of my publishing to the BBC for a TV show at the beginning of my career when I was desperate for the £1000 quid they were offering. I calculate that 1k lost me well over 100,000 pounds over a 10 year period!


----------



## christianhenson

Is this the ultimate orchestral expression controller???


----------



## Markrs

christianhenson said:


> Is this the ultimate orchestral expression controller???



Bit to rich for my blood being a hobbiest but looked very nice!


----------



## David Kudell

christianhenson said:


> Is this the ultimate orchestral expression controller???



Impeccable timing on this video, my friend, thank you! I've been shopping for a CC fader controller to upgrade from my tiny Korg NanoKontrol. Monogram looks interesting! So does that Nuance. I see my composing heroes using the JL Cooper FaderMaster Pro...like you say, something you use every day is important to get right!


----------



## sostenuto

Markrs said:


> Bit to rich for my blood being a hobbiest but looked very nice!


_*Monogram*ming_ dress shirts is upper limit these days. But there's always _ 
https://www.amazon.com/Mackie-Controller-2x2-KNOB-Passive/dp/B01NCUZ32O/ref=sr_1_5?dchild=1&keywords=Faderport+16&qid=1613591901&sr=8-5 (Mackie Big Knob Series)​


----------



## easyrider

Faderport 16 in midi mode....100mm faders in midi mode 🤓

In Daw mode full Daw Control 🤓


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## SupremeFist

Do people who use swish fader boxen find that they just get it right first time compared to using something like the Nanokontrol? Because I have the latter and am still forever drawing in new cc curves to replace the bad ones I recorded.


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## Alex Fraser

NI touch strips coupled with finger sleeves for consistent movement and low friction. Makes faders seem clunky and something from the last century. Honestly.


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## Loïc D

SL Mixface is a really great product I’d recommend. Plenty of useful features.

Minor gripes :
- Fader caps are odd but can be replaced easily with v curved ones
- Faders are a bit hard to move but it comes with a rubber mat


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## bvaughn0402

Well ... I finally caved in and bought the Mongram.


----------



## proxima

christianhenson said:


> Is this the ultimate orchestral expression controller???



It's ironic that you didn't make the big spinning wheel map to...the big spinning wheel in the Spitfire plugin.


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## dzilizzi

proxima said:


> It's ironic that you didn't make the big spinning wheel map to...the big spinning wheel in the Spitfire plugin.


I was thinking the same thing. 

But then I realized the big spinning wheel controls something that is easier to control with a real slider.


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## bvaughn0402

Yes ... possible to control all 3 with 3 fingers!


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## Markrs

I know Christian would normally post his videos on here anyway (though I notice this was a Spitfire one, rather than one from his personal channel) but this weeks it one of his best. I found his guide to orchestrating with midi and sample libraries incredibly useful and insightful. Learned more from those 22 minutes than from some courses!


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## christianhenson

Thanks Markrs!

PT has also done a great one on his channel:


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## christianhenson

...and some filth:


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## cqd

The very excited t shirt is a nice touch..


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## christianhenson

I have a go at a "phatt" beat with the Blue Devils whilst also introducing the best thing I've ever put drums through ever:


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## Geoff Grace

The Overstayer Modular Channel 8755DS sounds great. I enjoyed your drum processing tips as well. Thanks for the video, *Christian*!

My preferred method of achieving parallel processing in software is to use Blue Cat's PatchWork. It's a plugins patchbay that allows you to create up to eight parallel chains that can be activated independently. It has the added benefit of hosting VST and AU plugins in Pro Tools.




Another great plugin for beefing up drums is Goodhertz Vulf Compressor. Here's a short demo:




Thanks for reminding me about Spitfire's Blue Devils Drumline library. I've been meaning to give it a try. Perhaps I'll pick that up this month. At $29, it's an easy choice.

Best,

Geoff


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## Alex Fraser

Great tips, CH. Thanks for sharing as always.

I've created somewhere north of 1000 beats(!) and here's some things I do:

One of the best limiters I use is actually *Logic's "Bit Crusher" plugin.* Turn off all the "downgrade" options until you're getting a clean signal. Next, match the "clip level" to wherever your signal is peaking. Now, drag the "clip level" lower and watch the magic happen. It's surprising how much peak signal you can remove without audio artefacts. More headroom is always better. I use this plugin to get the peaks of the kick and snare to match each other if I'm in a hurry.

If you have a kick and bass line occupying the same frequency band, yet both are hitting at the same time, *Logic's "Sample Delay" *often works. Use this to move the bass line later by a few ms to avoid the "peak" of the kick. I like to ramp up the effect too far until I can hear a clear gap between the two parts, then slowly wind it back the other way until the gap is no longer there. This trick works more effectively if you're using a kick with a fast decay. 

Finally, a quick way to get more punch on your kick is via *Logic's enveloper plugin*. Ramp up the attack gain for more punch. The tradeoff here is more peak signal - but see tip one. 😉

I'm sure there's more, but I've got another beat to mix..


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## Pier

Alex Fraser said:


> Great tips, CH. Thanks for sharing as always.
> 
> I've created somewhere north of 1000 beats(!) and here's some things I do:
> 
> One of the best limiters I use is actually *Logic's "Bit Crusher" plugin.* Turn off all the "downgrade" options until you're getting a clean signal. Next, match the "clip level" to wherever your signal is peaking. Now, drag the "clip level" lower and watch the magic happen. It's surprising how much peak signal you can remove without audio artefacts. More headroom is always better. I use this plugin to get the peaks of the kick and snare to match each other if I'm in a hurry.
> 
> If you have a kick and bass line occupying the same frequency band, yet both are hitting at the same time, *Logic's "Sample Delay" *often works. Use this to move the bass line later by a few ms to avoid the "peak" of the kick. I like to ramp up the effect too far until I can hear a clear gap between the two parts, then slowly wind it back the other way until the gap is no longer there. This trick works more effectively if you're using a kick with a fast decay.
> 
> Finally, a quick way to get more punch on your kick is via *Logic's enveloper plugin*. Ramp up the attack gain for more punch. The tradeoff here is more peak signal - but see tip one. 😉
> 
> I'm sure there's more, but I've got another beat to mix..


Yeah clipping is standard practice in mastering to control short transients and gain a couple of dbs.

Here’s a long video talking about this:


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## christianhenson

One of the Pianobook contributors has converted 100 instruments into the ALL FREE multi platform DECENT SAMPLER:


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## christianhenson

A Pro Score Using 100% FREE SAMPLES???

Andrew Huang pimped his 3 x producers 3 x XXX format to involve some film composers and I made my score totally out of LABS and Pianobook samples.... did I get away with it?



and check out how the other composers did it here:

https://youtu.be/EPlN_ev6Qk4


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## Nimrod7

That was great Christian, super inspiring!


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## Loïc D

Christian, your entry is by far the best of the 4.

But you lost me in the end. As much as I appreciated the process AND the approach, I think the final product is not as good as the separate tracks. 
The search for that loudness / trailer sound killed all the subtle magic you were putting in the making.

See what happens when you commit yourself with the "Ableton geeks gang".
And you had your hair cut when you should have had your hair dyed. What a disgrace... 

I've really tried to follow Huang's channel but got tired by the shameless self-promotion and that super-loud super-lifeless sound that every "ooooh myyyy God" überkool producer seem to rave about.

As much as I love a lot the stuff you write, you lost me on this one, because of the final mix mostly.

That said your "Zeitgeist" remark on the 4th producer entry (which I called "arpeggiator trepenation") tells everything and had me laughing a lot. Thanks for this


----------



## Daniel James

christianhenson said:


> A Pro Score Using 100% FREE SAMPLES???
> 
> Andrew Huang pimped his 3 x producers 3 x XXX format to involve some film composers and I made my score totally out of LABS and Pianobook samples.... did I get away with it?
> 
> 
> 
> and check out how the other composers did it here:
> 
> https://youtu.be/EPlN_ev6Qk4



You nailed it. Great job on that one Christian.

-DJ


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## christianhenson

I've been hammering away at this for nearly 14 years now, trying to get the ULTIMATE intimate piano sound. By using my trusty Schimmel, celeste pedal down 2 X M19s a KU100 and a duvet (high tog) , have a nailed it and could it be the best piano sound I've made since my LABS Soft Piano?


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## Markrs

christianhenson said:


> I've been hammering away at this for nearly 14 years now, trying to get the ULTIMATE intimate piano sound. By using my trusty Schimmel, celeste pedal down 2 X M19s a KU100 and a duvet (high tog) , have a nailed it and could it be the best piano sound I've made since my LABS Soft Piano?



Great video @christianhenson. Hard to believer that there are now 500 libraries on Pianobook, such a massive achievement and the quality still blows me away!


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## Stringtree

Super!

Great!

A lot of gold here. Techniques, future plans, and sweet sounds. Happy Birthday, for sure. Chills all over.


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## TomislavEP

Finally, I'm about to try out the newest piano libraries from PB. I'm particularly intrigued by "Claustrophobic Piano", especially in comparison to the beloved LABS Soft Piano. There is just something about it that never ceases to inspire me. I'm hoping to contribute a few new pieces to PB in due time that would feature these new instruments.

P.S. Thanks to CH for featuring one of my tracks in the latest PB video!


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## christianhenson

...and in my second video of today's pianoday I ask the quesion???


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## christianhenson

???


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## christianhenson

Yes?


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## christianhenson

Not worth it?


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## christianhenson

VI-C, gotta love it. I think its worth noting that I didn't buy a piano for 15k. I paid very skilled people to transport it to a studio, record it at a studio, make it into samples I shared with you for free. Transport it to Aberdeen, get it on top of a crane and with a pro camera crew film it being dropped. I then paid for it to be disposed of. From that I have generated content to promote pianobook, content for pianobook (I use this footage every week for pianodrops). I have created two hours of tutorials on how to re-score this footage, shared different cuts of these footage for people to score, upload and use in show reels and then have re-edited this footage and placed it on my channel promoting a student's work, which I have again offered up for use by anyone who wants to practise scoring to picture and use in show reels promos etc etc.

So for me absolutely worth it.


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## christianhenson

No offence taken, just want to clarify my position as you'd made yours clear.


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## pfmusic

Sorry


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## Markrs

christianhenson said:


> VI-C, gotta love it. I think its worth noting that I didn't buy a piano for 15k. I paid very skilled people to transport it to a studio, record it at a studio, make it into samples I shared with you for free. Transport it to Aberdeen, get it on top of a crane and with a pro camera crew film it being dropped. I then paid for it to be disposed of. From that I have generated content to promote pianobook, content for pianobook (I use this footage every week for pianodrops). I have created two hours of tutorials on how to re-score this footage, shared different cuts of these footage for people to score, upload and use in show reels and then have re-edited this footage and placed it on my channel promoting a student's work, which I have again offered up for use by anyone who wants to practise scoring to picture and use in show reels promos etc etc.
> 
> So for me absolutely worth it.


This is why we ❤️ what you do Christian. Your videos are always a must-watch, but everything you do for pianobook is just amazing!


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## SupremeFist

christianhenson said:


> VI-C, gotta love it. I think its worth noting that I didn't buy a piano for 15k. I paid very skilled people to transport it to a studio, record it at a studio, make it into samples I shared with you for free. Transport it to Aberdeen, get it on top of a crane and with a pro camera crew film it being dropped. I then paid for it to be disposed of. From that I have generated content to promote pianobook, content for pianobook (I use this footage every week for pianodrops). I have created two hours of tutorials on how to re-score this footage, shared different cuts of these footage for people to score, upload and use in show reels and then have re-edited this footage and placed it on my channel promoting a student's work, which I have again offered up for use by anyone who wants to practise scoring to picture and use in show reels promos etc etc.
> 
> So for me absolutely worth it.


Cool. Destroying a musical instrument is not funny though.


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## Markrs

SupremeFist said:


> Cool. Destroying a musical instrument is not funny though.


I understand that, but if I'm honest old pianos are "recycled" (i.e. scrapped) all the time, just not done in this way and on film


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## Stringtree

Hilarious and brilliant. It's like Tom Scott hung out with the Hydraulic Press Channel guy and blew the fecker up, with a Werner Herzog movie soundtrack in the background. It's sad, sure, but I remember hearing the first samples from this. I was so close to tears, and now it's available to all of us. 

Not only a great video, but good art, and a fine afterlife for something that could have ended up on the devilstrip to be chucked away and forgotten. 

Hey, you're not forgotten. I gotcha.


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## SupremeFist

Markrs said:


> I understand that, but if I'm honest old pianos are "recycled" (i.e. scrapped) all the time, just not done in this way and on film


Sorry, it actually makes me sick. He could have donated that piano to a school, or a homeless shelter, or a psychiatric hospital, and who knows whose life it might have touched and changed in future decades. 

Instead he spent thousands of pounds destroying it for YouTube clicks.


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## Markrs

SupremeFist said:


> Sorry, it actually makes me sick. He could have donated that piano to a school, or a homeless shelter, or a psychiatric hospital, and who knows whose life it might have touched and changed in future decades.
> 
> Instead he spent thousands of pounds destroying it for YouTube clicks.


In the UK you often can't give old pianos away (I know a friend, who has been trying to give away an upright piano for some time), due to the cost of maintenance. Further once an upright has gone (I have been reliably told most don't last more than 100 years, which is still good going by today's standards), it is really beyond economical repair.


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## icecoolpool

Just caught the Andrew Haung composition video. FANTASTIC! Very inspiring in more ways than one (I love the automated tremolo trick - great effect!). Look forward to catching your new videos later. Thanks so much, I really appreciate the huge amount of effort you put in and I know thousands of people appreciate the work you do.


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## SupremeFist

Markrs said:


> In the UK you often can't give old pianos away (I know a friend, who has been trying to give away an upright piano for some time), due to the cost of maintenance. Further once an upright has gone (I have been reliably told most don't last more than 100 years, which is still good going by today's standards), it is really beyond economical repair.


The question is rather is to what extent the instrument could have been lovingly restored at a more "economical" price than spending thousands to have it destroyed on film.


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## PaulieDC

SupremeFist said:


> Sorry, it actually makes me sick. He could have donated that piano to a school, or a homeless shelter, or a psychiatric hospital, and who knows whose life it might have touched and changed in future decades.
> 
> Instead he spent thousands of pounds destroying it for YouTube clicks.


That does sound good on paper, but in reality, giving away a piano is rather hard. I've been handed the task to find a home for a half-dozen pianos in the last few years and you've be surprised how all the places you mentioned DON'T want real pianos, especially spinets, let alone the upright that Christian tested gravity with. You can barely get a church to take one now. Mainly for the upkeep and tuning, and you need to consider the finacial burden the ward or school would have making that Henson upright get and stay in tune, not to mention hammers that would need heating up to straighten out, etc etc. Why bother when you can get a Yamaha P125 and a stand and never worry about it?

I grew up in the 60s and 70s where mostly every house had the family spinet. Families today are different and that scenario is very rare now. Plus, let's be honest. Spinets sound horrid, and that upright is pretty much beyond reasonable restoration. Either of them need to get retired at some point.

It's one piano, the event is over, not worth getting sick over. HOWEVER, I do appreciate your integrity for the respect musical instruments deserve. Had that been a reasonably nice piano or even worse a GRAND, yeah, we'd probably be justified with fussing at Christian, lol.

Anyone remember the Art of Noise video from the early 80's? There's a google task for the day.


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## christianhenson

the piano was headed for the tip watch the vid chaps!!! I had an old pleyel at my house was absolutely knackered (but nothing as bad as the gimp) the cost of restoration would have been 30k and with that would have brought the piano back to a resale value of £300.... three hundred!!! Not a great investment and the restorers who would have “lovingly” undertaken the work said “not fucking worth it mate the piano’s dead”. 

my point above is the 15k I spent actually went into the pockets of people. And in so doing it also created educational content for A LOT of people (from what I can see about 100,000 people have watched this content in its various forms).

so the piano didn’t end up on a tip it went towards doing something more special than that. IMHO.


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## Gingerbread

SupremeFist said:


> Cool. Destroying a musical instrument is not funny though.


*eyeroll*

The piano doesn't have feelings.


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## angeruroth

Someone decides to share an idea, and that idea, instead of being forgotten like so many great ideas, attracts others with similar visions and grows, and evolves, and then more ideas pour into the whole, and the whole becomes even bigger, and expands, and opens new, maybe unexpected, possibilities for everyone, and then... ...the future looks bright!
Yeah, I love the butterfly effect :emoji_butterfly: (and pianobook)
Cheers!


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## easyrider

SupremeFist said:


> The question is rather is to what extent the instrument could have been lovingly restored at a more "economical" price than spending thousands to have it destroyed on film.


Its was CH piano. He can do what he likes with it. It was sampled , then given away for free.

Every instrument as a value to repair ratio.

Would you spend £300 on a neck reset for an old acoustic guitar if said guitar was going to worth less than your outlay?

Any top end luthier would advise the client not to have the work done. In fact I follow a guy on YouTube and he refused to repair instruments beyond economical repair as it doesn't sit right with him.

Instruments have a lifespan. If the local charity really wanted a piano. A wanted ad would deem very successful as you cant give them away these days.

If watching a piano being destroyed then recycled makes you angry then pour this energy into something more meaningful...Like Famine, war, equality, global warning, corruption of power etc...

Nothing lasts we are all transient so dont waste your time getting upset about meaningless things.

Accept Entropy and do a few altruistic acts throughout your week. This will help


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## PaulieDC

christianhenson said:


> the cost of restoration would have been 30k and with that would have brought the piano back to a resale value of £300....


I honestly was thinking those ranges when I saw it in the vid. It served people well for 120 years, it wasn't as if you plucked a CFX off the assembly line and launched it into the stratosphere with a punkin chucker (look THAT one up, we're weird in the States, lol!).


----------



## Lo28

christianhenson said:


> I've been hammering away at this for nearly 14 years now, trying to get the ULTIMATE intimate piano sound. By using my trusty Schimmel, celeste pedal down 2 X M19s a KU100 and a duvet (high tog) , have a nailed it and could it be the best piano sound I've made since my LABS Soft Piano?



The Claustrophobic Piano is absolutely wonderful. It really is the piano equivalent of a warm blanket. Thanks Christian Henson for this marvelous gift on Piano Day!


----------



## jbuhler

christianhenson said:


> the piano was headed for the tip watch the vid chaps!!! I had an old pleyel at my house was absolutely knackered (but nothing as bad as the gimp) the cost of restoration would have been 30k and with that would have brought the piano back to a resale value of £300.... three hundred!!! Not a great investment and the restorers who would have “lovingly” undertaken the work said “not fucking worth it mate the piano’s dead”.
> 
> my point above is the 15k I spent actually went into the pockets of people. And in so doing it also created educational content for A LOT of people (from what I can see about 100,000 people have watched this content in its various forms).
> 
> so the piano didn’t end up on a tip it went towards doing something more special than that. IMHO.


I mean, yes, but one reason the film is compelling is because we are both intensely curious while also recognizing the action is morally suspect. And you get at that in the re-edit where you ask the composer to cast the the destroyers as baddies. The film asks us to invest in the dignity of the instrument and to question the decision to drop it to satisfy the narcissistic urge of our curiosity. 

That’s not to say I disapprove of the film or destroying the Gimp thus for the film. Indeed I think the new version of the film is extremely moving in its way. And it allowed the Gimp to end its life with real dignity, but in a sense only because the film raises the question of how does one properly lay a piano to rest. The sacrificial act of dropping the piano is not a general answer of course, nor is sampling it in this condition, which feels more like creating a death mask. It’s a difficult issue, with few good answers.


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## LamaRose

SupremeFist said:


> Cool. Destroying a musical instrument is not funny though.


Pete Townshend and Laurel & Hardy say, "Hello!" Honestly, he could have at least offered Jackass the op to stand underneath and see who jumps first.

From my POV, I witness suffrage, of all types, on an almost daily occurrence... to me, that piano died a good death... each of us should be so lucky.


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## Dirtgrain

Markrs said:


> In the UK you often can't give old pianos away (I know a friend, who has been trying to give away an upright piano for some time), due to the cost of maintenance. Further once an upright has gone (I have been reliably told most don't last more than 100 years, which is still good going by today's standards), it is really beyond economical repair.


Same here in the US.


----------



## SupremeFist

christianhenson said:


> the piano was headed for the tip watch the vid chaps!!! I had an old pleyel at my house was absolutely knackered (but nothing as bad as the gimp) the cost of restoration would have been 30k and with that would have brought the piano back to a resale value of £300.... three hundred!!! Not a great investment and the restorers who would have “lovingly” undertaken the work said “not fucking worth it mate the piano’s dead”.
> 
> my point above is the 15k I spent actually went into the pockets of people. And in so doing it also created educational content for A LOT of people (from what I can see about 100,000 people have watched this content in its various forms).
> 
> so the piano didn’t end up on a tip it went towards doing something more special than that. IMHO.


OK I overreacted. Apologies! ✌🏻


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## ScarletJerry

I LOVE the sound of the Claustrophobic Piano. Kudos to Christian and team! My only wish is that there was a way to control the mechanical noise level. I now that would be nearly impossible due to the location of the microphones, but just a wish on my part.

Scarlet Jerry


----------



## christianhenson

You can reduce the RT and Pedal noises?


----------



## ScarletJerry

christianhenson said:


> You can reduce the RT and Pedal noises?


Wow! How did I miss that? Thanks Christian. I knew that you can reduce the pedal noise, but I was focused on using the key control to adjust the volume of the sound relative to the fixed mechanical noise. OK - this is now my favorite piano. It has a simply beautiful tone.

Scarlet Jerry


----------



## AudioLoco

christianhenson said:


> ...and in my second video of today's pianoday I ask the quesion???



That's a proper Henson Top Gear episode for sample-heads!  



The new piano is superb indeed! Thanks....
I have too a small upright Schimmel in my studio and it is such a warm and inspiring little instrument....


----------



## christianhenson

Why does TV timecode start at 10:00:00:00 ???


----------



## Markrs

christianhenson said:


> Why does TV timecode start at 10:00:00:00 ???



Fascinating Christian, I knew nothing of any of this, so was great to have a bit more understanding of the process of working with timecodes.


----------



## Hoopyfrood

Just wanted to say I'm a big admirer. Not only do you make engaging videos, I think it's awesome that your bread and butter is making (great quality) VIs, but you give away libraries for free with Labs and run Pianobook with its trove of goodies.


----------



## rnieto

Regarding NTSC standards, the frame count in North America is indeed 30 frames per second, but the actual speed is 29.97 fps for standard definition TV and 23.976 fps for high definition TV.

And because NTSC is such a convoluted system, we also deal with Drop Frame timecode, which means that we drop 2 frames from the frame count in every minute of footage (except every 10th minute!), to make it all compatible with the broadcast systems at the TV networks, so that a 52 minute show (60 minutes minus 8 minutes of commercials) is actually 52 minutes of timecode.

So much fun.


----------



## Anders Wall

christianhenson said:


> Why does TV timecode start at 10:00:00:00 ???



I’ve always been told that it’s so that the robots (at the broadcasting houses) would avoid airing the wrong tape.
Or at least not an unedit tape/reel.
Re 50/60 or 25/30
It is because of the different electrical systems around the globe. Ours (Europe) are tuned to 50hz vs the 60hz other continents use. This divided by two equals 25 and 30.
I don’t have the proper lingo to try to explain how and why but it all dates back to when the Tv’s had a black and white picture and not all of us had one. The electronics in the tv wasn’t fast enough to paint the picture so clever persons came up with the idea to interlace two pictures giving us a non flickering picture without doubling the data rate.

I’m more than happy to be proven wrong.
Let’s go internet!



Best,
/Anders


----------



## christianhenson

An inside peak into the incredibly inspiring world of Hainbach:


----------



## Markrs

christianhenson said:


> An inside peak into the incredibly inspiring world of Hainbach:



Great interview Christian, I wouldn't necessarily say I am into all the test equipment stuff but I always enjoy Hainbach's videos.


----------



## christianhenson

Whilst I threw some dollar at this I think the basic advice offered up by Ben from Yellow Technology would certainly have stopped me throwing money down the drain in the past! Some really useful insights!


----------



## christianhenson

The most beautiful synth of all time ever?


----------



## Dirtgrain

Ha, you have me laughing right at the start: Dave. But holy smokes the size and scope of that one.


----------



## artomatic

I find this thread to be fascinating, over and over again.
Keep 'em coming, Christian!
And much oblige for sharing your talent.


----------



## redlester

Totally realise that if this were a real job I would have been kicked off the project for taking about a month longer than required, but finally finished my 4k final version of the Piano drop project!

This has been immensely educational to work on (learned so much about sync to timecode etc.), as well as tremendous fun, and I cannot give enough thanks to Christian for making this material available.


----------



## Toecutter

redlester said:


> Totally realise that if this were a real job I would have been kicked off the project for taking about a month longer than required, but finally finished my 4k final version of the Piano drop project!
> 
> This has been immensely educational to work on (learned so much about sync to timecode etc.), as well as tremendous fun, and I cannot give enough thanks to Christian for making this material available.



This was fun! I wasn't even aware there was a contest. Was it on Christian's channel?


----------



## redlester

Toecutter said:


> This was fun! I wasn't even aware there was a contest. Was it on Christian's channel?


It wasn't a contest, no, it was a a tutoring session in two parts for Edinburgh College students given by Christian but made available to all via his channel.


----------



## christianhenson

Latest Vlog, all about how I use both Logic and Pro Tools in sync throughout my workflow:


----------

