# Doom Eternal(and doom 2016)



## ProfoundSilence (Mar 29, 2020)

these fvckn S L A P

I dont know how this existed for 4 years without me hearing it. 

makes me want to dig out my genesis with the 32x and go ham

discuss.


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## Consona (Mar 30, 2020)

Generic metal with some distorted synths and sounddesign pads. Dunno why people rave about it so much. It nicely complements the atmosphere though, so, mission accomplished I guess.


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## Mornats (Mar 30, 2020)

If you like the soundtrack you should check out Mick Gordon's talk from 2017 where he talks about it's creation.


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## Montisquirrel (Mar 30, 2020)

Consona said:


> Generic metal with some distorted synths and sounddesign pads. Dunno why people rave about it so much. It nicely complements the atmosphere though, so, mission accomplished I guess.



It fits perfect into the game. And the game is close to perfect, too. It is a great example how game and music work together. I played Doom 2016 with a huge smile on my face, and the music was one of the reasons.


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## Consona (Mar 30, 2020)

Good.


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## ProfoundSilence (Mar 30, 2020)

Consona said:


> Generic metal with some distorted synths and sounddesign pads. Dunno why people rave about it so much. It nicely complements the atmosphere though, so, mission accomplished I guess.


I think it sounds like metal from the future, and its simple enough to be mixed in a way that's super aggressive but clear


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## MartinH. (Mar 30, 2020)

It's not generic metal with some added synths, it's uniquely processed synths with some added metal riffs (and choir etc.). The whole original premise was "no guitars". I don't think anyone listening to metal would call it generic metal. What is "generic" in metal even supposed to mean, given that there are so many tightly defined subgenres?

To me the soundtrack was some of the most inspiring music of recent years because imho it broke the mold a fair bit and you can feel the passion that was put into it. It has motivated more action towards making music on my side, than many other things. I even bought an 8-string guitar. And I have a reaper project called "the doom array" where I'm experimenting with insane signal chains to process sine-waves and guitar- or bass-DI tracks. I bought a bass too, but that was mostly for another project. 


Here's a more recent video by Mick Gordon:




If anyone is working on similar stuff, lets hear it in this thread! Doesn't matter if it's just a single riff, a processed synth sample, a short snippit or a whole song.


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## Consona (Mar 30, 2020)

ProfoundSilence said:


> I think it sounds like metal from the future, and its simple enough to be mixed in a way that's super aggressive but clear


I actually think the sound is not that aggressive, compared to some metal albums I know.



MartinH. said:


> What is "generic" in metal even supposed to mean, given that there are so many tightly defined subgenres?


Run-of-the-mill riffs.


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## Mornats (Mar 30, 2020)

MartinH. said:


> And I have a reaper project called "the doom array" where I'm experimenting with insane signal chains to process sine-waves and guitar



Me too, I paused the 2017 video on the section where Mick showed his Doom Array setup and tried to put it together in Reaper. I'm too scared to turn off feedback protection so I'm sure some of it isn't working as it should but it's been fun doing it.




MartinH. said:


> If anyone is working on similar stuff, lets hear it in this thread! Doesn't matter if it's just a single riff, a processed synth sample, a short snippit or a whole song.



I'll try and dig out some of the clips I did with my Doom Array later


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## ProfoundSilence (Mar 30, 2020)

Consona said:


> I actually think the sound is not that aggressive, compared to some metal albums I know.
> 
> 
> Run-of-the-mill riffs.


it's pretty damn aggressive for VGM, and it's not that it sounds like metal, it sounds like metal from the future. Like basic Djent fuzed effortlessly with something like destroid/drumstep/brostep. 

It's a mixture of 9 string, bass DI, riffs recorded on guitar at 2x and then time stretched, and raw sine. 

he pulled back a bit because when it was too frantic it was too distracting, and originally the Devs didn't want him to make something that sounded "metal" even though it certainly sounds like that was thrown at the window and embraced. 

coincidently I didn't know anything about the new doom releases OR the sound track until the line above was provided on another thread


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## davidson (Mar 30, 2020)

I agree with @Consona to an extent. The first track, rip and tear, is basically a straight slipknot rip without the vocals. Maybe as a metalhead myself I'm constantly looking for similarities, but if metal isn't your usual thing it might sound new and exciting. 

That aside, the soundtracks extremely well done and I like it.


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## Zero&One (Mar 30, 2020)

BFG Division... enough said.


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## ProfoundSilence (Mar 30, 2020)

davidson said:


> I agree with @Consona to an extent. The first track, rip and tear, is basically a straight slipknot rip without the vocals. Maybe as a metalhead myself I'm constantly looking for similarities, but if metal isn't your usual thing it might sound new and exciting.
> 
> That aside, the soundtracks extremely well done and I like it.


I was listening to amputated genitals and enslaved well everyone else in high school was wearing girl jeans and spin kicking at shows.

The last time I was in a band, we inspired somebody to bring a folded metal chair into the pit, maybe you didn't mean that to sound elitist but I certainly got that vibe from it.

Considering there are videos of me playing traditional blast Beats and double bass over 250 beats per minute from a decade ago your comment seems pretty unfounded.

I never had a slipknot phase, but by the time I was seven I was jamming to Judas Priest and names my iguana Ozzy... by the time I was twelve I was listening to Morbid Angel, deicide, and Cannibal Corpse.


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## Consona (Mar 30, 2020)

@ProfoundSilence Seems like the composer had a lot of fun making all those sounds and stuff, yea, but that's that as far as I'm concerned.

@davidson I don't care as much the riffs being similar to something else, they are just not exciting per se.

But that applies for the majority of stuff. I find like 95% of metal rather boring and frankly quite daft, yet there is some metal stuff that's fricking great. The old-school composers have the advantage that when their ideas are generic, they at least can do funny, interesting and noteworthy things with them. Like that Steiner's King Kong we are talking about in the other thread. There are no Williams-y super melodies or anything, but the compositions themselves are just sooo good.


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## ProfoundSilence (Mar 30, 2020)

Consona said:


> @ProfoundSilence Seems like the composer had a lot of fun making all those sounds and stuff, yea, but that's that as far as I'm concerned.
> 
> @davidson I don't care as much the riffs being similar to something else, they are just not exciting per se.
> 
> But that applies for the majority of stuff. I find like 95% of metal rather boring and frankly quite daft, yet there is some metal stuff that's fricking great. The old-school composers have the advantage that when their ideas are generic, they at least can do funny, interesting and noteworthy things with them. Like that Steiner's King Kong we are talking about in the other thread. There are no Williams-y super melodies or anything, but the compositions themselves are just sooo good.



film music is "technically" boring most of the time, yet often times is effective at doing what music is actually suppose to do, which is make you feel a certain way. Your focus on the pitches doesn't make any sense given the context, he actually talks about his entire perspective on the project was about turning his processing into the instrument, and throwing insanely simple raw sine wave motifs into it. 

Sound design was his instrument, and even though you could get like 80% of the way there with much less work, he put all of his effort into making the textures sound interesting with the limitation of something that is simple and repetitive so that it isn't distracting. There is no "story to tell" -it's not synced to events, He's not writing an album, he's creating the best soundscape for a game - and getting paid by the people making the game to do that(and that only)

this *is* soundtrack discussion, hopefully you'll be able to judge this through the lense of what it actually does, if it does what it does well, and if it does it exceptionally.


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## ProfoundSilence (Mar 30, 2020)

judge it based on that, if the changes in music match the changes in level/danger/ect.


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## Consona (Mar 30, 2020)

ProfoundSilence said:


> film music is "technically" boring most of the time, yet often times is effective at doing what music is actually suppose to do, which is make you feel a certain way. Your focus on the pitches doesn't make any sense given the context, he actually talks about his entire perspective on the project was about turning his processing into the instrument, and throwing insanely simple raw sine wave motifs into it.
> 
> Sound design was his instrument, and even though you could get like 80% of the way there with much less work, he put all of his effort into making the textures sound interesting with the limitation of something that is simple and repetitive so that it isn't distracting. There is no "story to tell" -it's not synced to events, He's not writing an album, he's creating the best soundscape for a game - and getting paid by the people making the game to do that(and that only)
> 
> this *is* soundtrack discussion, hopefully you'll be able to judge this through the lense of what it actually does, if it does what it does well, and if it does it exceptionally.


I get your point. Which still won't change the fact I find the music boring. I think you can get that.

Plus I flipping hate the new "so that it isn't distracting" notion. First off all you can have interestingly composed music that is not distracting. Second off, it's just utter bullshit. Wasn't it Nolan who said to HZ he does not want the music to be very prominent so it doesn't distract the viewer? WTF, Chris? First off, sorry to disappoint but HZ's music was so loud that I think your plan did not work at all. Second off, WTF Chris? Like Williams' awesome pieces in Star Wars, Harry Potter or Jurassic Park diminished the viewers perception of the story or what?!

But I get it, you mow demons down left and right so you can't insert Mozart there as a soundtrack. Fine. But that doesn't mean you have to make it frustratingly monotonous and dull.
Like that video you've posted. Bleh.

I think if you'd make an Doom music contest here on the forum, you'd get the same or way better pieces no problem.


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## Zero&One (Mar 30, 2020)

Consona said:


> I think if you'd make an Doom music contest here on the forum, you'd get the same or way better pieces no problem.




I think isolation is getting to you


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## ProfoundSilence (Mar 30, 2020)

Consona said:


> I get your point. Which still won't change the fact I find the music boring. I think you can get that.
> 
> Plus I flipping hate the new "so that it isn't distracting" notion. First off all you can have interestingly composed music that is not distracting. Second off, it's just utter bullshit. Wasn't it Nolan who said to HZ he does not want the music to be very prominent so it doesn't distract the viewer? WTF, Chris? First off, sorry to disappoint but HZ's music was so loud that I think your plan did not work at all. Second off, WTF Chris? Like Williams' awesome pieces in Star Wars, Harry Potter or Jurassic Park diminished the viewers perception of the story or what?!
> 
> ...



hmmm, maybe they should be submitting their work for Bethesda, and maybe a kind soul will let them know that their purchase that they made twice was a poor choice and should just post threads here for the next opening. 

fwiw, many of those classic film scores made the films, because the acting and dialog was pretty cringe. Nowadays we have better actors(or graphics and sound effects). I think the sonic character fits the atmosphere pretty spot on, and based on the reaction from the last 2 games, the music actually looks to be a massive driving factor in it's reception, as many user reviews mention the music and sound effects specifically. I can't think of the last FPS review where I saw people go out of their way to mention the music, side from really niche flavors like some of the farcry games.


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## davidson (Mar 30, 2020)

ProfoundSilence said:


> I was listening to amputated genitals and enslaved well everyone else in high school was wearing girl jeans and spin kicking at shows.
> 
> The last time I was in a band, we inspired somebody to bring a folded metal chair into the pit, maybe you didn't mean that to sound elitist but I certainly got that vibe from it.
> 
> ...



Yeah, I didn't mean it to come across as "I'M MORE METAL THAN YOU, RAWWRR' at all, so sorry if it did, and it wasn't aimed at any person in particular.

Like I say, I think it's an awesome soundtrack and does the job perfectly.


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## Consona (Mar 30, 2020)

ProfoundSilence said:


> hmmm, maybe they should be submitting their work for Bethesda, and maybe a kind soul will let them know that their purchase that they made twice was a poor choice and should just post threads here for the next opening.
> 
> fwiw, many of those classic film scores made the films, because the acting and dialog was pretty cringe. Nowadays we have better actors(or graphics and sound effects). I think the sonic character fits the atmosphere pretty spot on, and based on the reaction from the last 2 games, the music actually looks to be a massive driving factor in it's reception, as many user reviews mention the music and sound effects specifically. I can't think of the last FPS review where I saw people go out of their way to mention the music, side from really niche flavors like some of the farcry games.


Well, people these days are used to dumbed-down music. Especially the producers it seems, they even demand it in their products, ffs!  We're back in the circle of "MI Fallout is the best action music ever because it has huge braaaaaaaaams and cool synths and it's epiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiic". These praising reviews mean s#!t to me... Yea, I won't bother anybody with my rants again.  Enjoy the soundtrack.


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## J-M (Mar 30, 2020)

ProfoundSilence said:


> these fvckn S L A P
> 
> I dont know how this existed for 4 years without me hearing it.
> 
> ...



Correction: Everything that Mick Gordon ( a.k.a. the God of Distortion and Weird Pedals) does fvckn 
S L A P S.


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## Mornats (Mar 30, 2020)

Here's one of my home-grown Doom Array experiments. There's a drum beat and what I believe is Alicia's Keys playing a single note 4 times in a row. The piano is going through the Doom Array.


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## Uiroo (Mar 30, 2020)

"*You can be the ripest*, *juiciest peach* in the world, and there's still going to be somebody who hates *peaches*. "




I love the sounddesign in the intro in both here. I dig the metal stuff, but I'm not that much into that anymore. I think it fits the game perfectly (although the gameplay looks a bit dull to be honest, but it's probably cool if you play it yourself )

edit: I mean Doom Eternal, Doom 2016 seemed better


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## KEM (Mar 30, 2020)

As someone who grew up only listening to metal their entire life and still only listens to metal I can tell you this is not generic in any regard, no metal band is doing stuff like this. There’s a reason these soundtracks are drooled over in the metal communities, they’re absolutely phenomenal and they deserve such praise, Mick Gordon managed to do something that almost no one else is doing nowadays, which is to make metal fresh and exciting.


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## x-dfo (Mar 30, 2020)

It's motif metal, the lastest game is a bit of a letdown compared to 2016 but it has its moments. I really am not a fan of the opening screen theme tho, it's like a bad take on Korn run through a bad limiter.


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## J-M (Mar 31, 2020)

KEM said:


> As someone who grew up only listening to metal their entire life and still only listens to metal I can tell you this is not generic in any regard, no metal band is doing stuff like this. There’s a reason these soundtracks are drooled over in the metal communities, they’re absolutely phenomenal and they deserve such praise, Mick Gordon managed to do something that almost no one else is doing nowadays, which is to make metal fresh and exciting.



Exactly.


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## Henu (Mar 31, 2020)

KEM said:


> no metal band is doing stuff like this



And the fact some people referring this as "Slipknot" or whatever mainstream metal band they may have heard about tells more about _them_ than Mick Gordon's magnificent score.

Yours, "another metalhead-78"


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## Uiroo (Mar 31, 2020)

I mean, if you're not into a specific genre, stuff tends to sound the same to you. 
Like 10 years ago, I bought a Paramore album because I thought I should listen to some PopRock, but everything sounded the same to me, really dull.
One year later and I LOVED that album, every single song has its own thing. Great album.


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## Consona (May 11, 2020)

KEM said:


> As someone who grew up only listening to metal their entire life and still only listens to metal I can tell you this is not generic in any regard, no metal band is doing stuff like this. There’s a reason these soundtracks are drooled over in the metal communities, they’re absolutely phenomenal and they deserve such praise, Mick Gordon managed to do something that almost no one else is doing nowadays, which is to make metal fresh and exciting.


Could you explain to me why it's so good and revolutionary? I just can't hear it.



Uiroo said:


> I mean, if you're not into a specific genre, stuff tends to sound the same to you.


Well, I've been listening to various kinds of metal for over 2 decades now and from that comparison, I don't hear anything special or exciting here.

The Kovenant made their In Times Before the Light heavy electro-industrial-metal remix 18 years ago. Limbonic Art released their brutal electro/atmospheric metal stuff over 20 years ago. Or how about DB's Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia or Mayhem's Grand Declaration of War? Again 20 years ago. Every one of these albums was way more innovative and progressive, for metal, than what I hear in the Doom soundtrack. Plus all those albums had super catchy riffs and not just some generic palm-muting. Or Arcturus' avant-garde metal with a lot of various samples and electronic stuff in it that went far beyond the metal genre?!

How could I, knowing all that, be blown away by some plain repetitive low guitar chugging with some over-saturated electronic stuff? How can metal community think this is something so fresh and unspeakably phenomenal?* Stuff like this, way better than this, exists in metal more than 20 years ago.
(And do people still remember something like Pink Floyd, they used various loony sample techniques more than 50 years ago.)


*Well, I vividly remember all those "my speed metal is faster than your speed metal and your symphonic black metal is not as symphonic and dark as my symphonic black metal and this band is not black/thrash/kinda heavy metal, it's melodic/death/gothic metal!!!" debates. Such a deep and wide musical knowledge as in metal communities is really hard to find. Wouldn't be surprised adding a noisy synth pad would create a whole new genre in there.





Or maybe I'm wrong and the metal community is a very sophisticated crowd now and the Doom soundtrack is so out-there revolutionary that I can't even get it.


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## brenneisen (May 11, 2020)

Consona said:


> How can metal community think this is something so fresh and unspeakably phenomenal



because "metal community" now is all bois and gals under 25yo

mix meshuggah+synths+textured noise and they go "omg, so innovative!"


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## x-dfo (May 11, 2020)

also to note: bethesda responded to Gordon's VERY public complaints about the limiting of his music in the mix. They said he underdelivered/was late and they had to stretch what they received to fill the needs of the game.


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## MartinH. (May 11, 2020)

Consona said:


> Could you explain to me why it's so good and revolutionary? I just can't hear it.



I'd say "it goes brrrRRRZZZzzztt in a way that nothing else does".



Consona said:


> Stuff like this, way better than this, exists in metal more than 20 years ago.



I don't think the innovation here is in what the guitars are doing and I'd agree that on that front we're not really hearing anything new. Also not conceptually in the broadest sense, metal and synths have been combined before. But all those examples that you gave don't even come close (for me personally) to scratching the same itch that the Doom Soundtrack satisfies. I wouldn't even put them in the same subgenre. If I had been trying to make your argument, I'd have named Sonic Mayhem, Celldweller, maybe Frank Klepacki. Or forget about the guitars entirely and check out Noisia's soundtrack for DMC: 



I have been looking forever for a certain vibe of "energetic darkness" in music that the Doom OST satisfies so well. Before that I was seeking it in things like the ones mentioned above or Neurofunk like this: 




When that Dimmu Borgir album that you mentioned came out I quite liked the song "Puritania" because it hit the right tone for me at least in some parts. So there I at least see where you're coming from with seeing the similarities.



Consona said:


> over-saturated electronic stuff?



I guess if you can't appreciate the sounddesign aspect of it, then there's nothing for you to like here. Which is fine of course!

Just out of curiosity, how hard do you think making neurofunk is (without using loops), and have you ever tried making similar music?


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## asherpope (May 11, 2020)

Consona said:


> Could you explain to me why it's so good and revolutionary? I just can't hear it.
> 
> 
> Well, I've been listening to various kinds of metal for over 2 decades now and from that comparison, I don't hear anything special or exciting here.
> ...


Maybe you're looking at it the wrong way - as a metal fan it might not sound that innovative or fresh to you, but for game music it sounds pretty damn innovative/risky to me (I say this an ignorant non gamer so what do I know really).




> KEM said:
> 
> 
> no metal band is doing stuff like this


And the fact some people referring this as "Slipknot" or whatever mainstream metal band they may have heard about tells more about _them_ than Mick Gordon's magnificent score.

Yours, "another metalhead-78"

Also...a lot of the Doom riffs do sound quite a bit like Slipknot. And Rammstein. And a lot of the industrial sound design sounds like NIN. That's ok - it's fine to be influenced by mainstream stuff


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## Andrew Aversa (May 11, 2020)

I love these soundtracks. As someone who listens to a LOT of metal, they're extremely innovative and fresh. It's not just "synths and guitars". HOW you use, mix, and process the guitars matters. This isn't SM57 + 5150 + Serum here. His sound design choices, EQ, compression, and tones are all super innovative and fit the games like a glove.

If you don't believe production matters, then a lot of music is going to sound samey to you. I think there is a world of difference - beyond the composition and performance - between say... Slayer, Dragonforce, Meshuggah, and In Flames. Totally different production sensibilities and you can instantly tell you're listening to a different band each time.


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## KEM (May 11, 2020)

asherpope said:


> Maybe you're looking at it the wrong way - as a metal fan it might not sound that innovative or fresh to you, but for game music it sounds pretty damn innovative/risky to me (I say this an ignorant non gamer so what do I know really).
> 
> 
> 
> ...



The riffs definitely feel like Slipknot, just on an 8 string, but the use of synths within that context is why I think it’s very new and refreshing, if people want to hate that’s fine, but to say there’s tons of other stuff out there like this, I don’t get it...


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## asherpope (May 11, 2020)

KEM said:


> The riffs definitely feel like Slipknot, just on an 8 string, but the use of synths within that context is why I think it’s very new and refreshing, if people want to hate that’s fine, but to say there’s tons of other stuff out there like this, I don’t get it...


Yeah I'm not knocking it at all, I love the soundtrack and think Mick Gordon is a genius


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## KEM (May 11, 2020)

asherpope said:


> Yeah I'm not knocking it at all, I love the soundtrack and think Mick Gordon is a genius



Totally! Sucks he won’t be doing them anymore.


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## x-dfo (May 11, 2020)

KEM said:


> The riffs definitely feel like Slipknot, just on an 8 string, but the use of synths within that context is why I think it’s very new and refreshing, if people want to hate that’s fine, but to say there’s tons of other stuff out there like this, I don’t get it...


I think it's a generational difference. As someone who was a big gamer around quake/quake 2 and early consoles, pseudo industrial was really common, just before the rise of big beat being everywhere.


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## Andrew Aversa (May 11, 2020)

Even the pure-synth tracks are REALLY cool. The sound design throughout this one is pure ear candy. Plus the processed vocals and the tonality that keeps shifting and wavering all over the place. Sounds morph into one another seamlessly and you can just feel this sense of dread building up. 

Now keep in mind, in-game, you're not hearing this for 7 minutes straight with no breaks. It's in the context of exploring an area with growing and building tension, voiceover, SFX, and punctuated with ultra-intense combat. So, keep that in mind if you've never heard it.


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## Nicholas (May 12, 2020)

As a fan of 2016 Doom, I have to say: Imo, Doom Eternal was a bit of a letdown and so was the music. I don't know what went on between Gordon and Bethesda, but I don't feel the music hits the head quite like in Doom 2016. There's just too much synth-quirkyness going on between combat, and I feel like the music in combat is kinda dull compared to Doom 2016. I think the Doom 2016 OST was a masterpiece, the Doom Eternal OST feels a bit like the 'trying too hard' 2nd album. Just like the game itself.


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## Uiroo (May 12, 2020)

x-dfo said:


> also to note: bethesda responded to Gordon's VERY public complaints about the limiting of his music in the mix. They said he underdelivered/was late and they had to stretch what they received to fill the needs of the game.


Well, given how Bethesda has acted the last couple of years, I'd go with Gordon. 
Plus, I don't realise how underdelivering would necessarily lead to limiting the hell out of it.


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## MartinH. (May 12, 2020)

Uiroo said:


> Well, given how Bethesda has acted the last couple of years, I'd go with Gordon.
> Plus, I don't realise how underdelivering would necessarily lead to limiting the hell out of it.



That was just about everyone's reaction, but you should read the full open letter written by ID (not bethesda) to get a better picture and decide for yourself:


Spoiler










zircon_st said:


> I think there is a world of difference - beyond the composition and performance - between say... Slayer, Dragonforce, Meshuggah, and In Flames. Totally different production sensibilities and you can instantly tell you're listening to a different band each time.


This is so true. When I check out new albums on youtube I usually listen to half a dozen 1 second bits from random timestamps and already have a strong opinion on whether I'll like it or not. I quite enjoy that about metal. Makes it easy to check out a bigger number of new releases without a massive time investment.


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## SvenE (May 12, 2020)

x-dfo said:


> I think it's a generational difference. As someone who was a big gamer around quake/quake 2 and early consoles, pseudo industrial was really common, just before the rise of big beat being everywhere.


mmhhh.... Personally, I wouldn't call Nine Inch Nails (technically Trent Reznor) soundtrack for Quake pseudo industrial. For me it was a big step up from the original doom soundtrack


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## Uiroo (May 12, 2020)

MartinH. said:


> That was just about everyone's reaction, but you should read the full open letter written by ID (not bethesda) to get a better picture and decide for yourself:


Ahh that's interesting, thanks for posting that!


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## x-dfo (May 12, 2020)

SvenE said:


> mmhhh.... Personally, I wouldn't call Nine Inch Nails (technically Trent Reznor) soundtrack for Quake pseudo industrial. For me it was a big step up from the original doom soundtrack



Yeah pretty sure this is industrial! 
*Quake Theme*


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## Eldhrimnir (May 12, 2020)

Consona said:


> Could you explain to me why it's so good and revolutionary? I just can't hear it.
> 
> 
> Well, I've been listening to various kinds of metal for over 2 decades now and from that comparison, I don't hear anything special or exciting here.
> ...



I kind of understand where you're coming from with this reasoning. I understand the parallels you're drawing to The Kovenant, Mayhem and Dimmu Borgir (I even own For All Tid on red vinyl). I've been listening to metal my whole adult life, and have been recording, writing and producing it (among other things) for the past 15 years. So I've heard it all; the production trends, performance trends, gearslutting trends, urban myths and production technique legends. Today however, almost nothing sparks my interest. If I ever listen to metal at all these days, it's 99% older albums. Obviously partly for nostalgic reasons, but mainly for the lack of innovation and the generic and uninspired writing, production and mixing. (I would dare suggest that the time around 'Puritanical...' was the beginning of the end of terms of interesting and unique metal productions). Some of the very few metal albums that I have really enjoyed in the past few years are 'Wilderun - Veil of Imagination', 'Mgla - Exercises in Futility'....and...*gasp*...Mick Gordon's Doom soundtrack.
It's not that the riffs and chuggs have never been made before, it's not that the aggressiveness is something new, it's not that the sounds in isolation are something jaw-dropping. But. Put together, Mick Gordon really created something unique, interesting, refined, and gut-punchingly refreshing.
The meticulousness of the production is what makes it stand out. Sure, DB and The Kovenant had something cooking 20 years ago, but Mick's surgical precision and clinical, mechanical craftsmanship in the Doom soundtrack is something very new (to my ears). The perfect and seamless synergy between electronic and "acoustic" is incredible (and it superbly fits the mood of the game). Those albums you mentioned belong to a different era. Sure, the concepts and embryos were there, but they were gritty and unrefined. Sloppy even, by Doom standards. And of course, made for a completely different purpose than a video game soundtrack. 
Just my 2 cents.


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## MichaelVakili (May 12, 2020)

It suits the game good, I am not really overhyped about it and also the whole controversy surrounding him not meeting deadlines and all the fans bashing the lead designer for finishing what Gordon couldn't do /12 tracks ffs/ just to meet his multiple extended deadlines really dropped my respect for him.


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## Henu (May 12, 2020)

Eldhrimnir said:


> I even own For All Tid on red vinyl



Except for it's a filthy re-issue from 2000 which makes you obviously a poser.


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## Eldhrimnir (May 12, 2020)

Henu said:


> Except for it's a filthy re-issue from 2000 which makes you obviously a poser.



Busted!!


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## MartinH. (May 16, 2020)




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## MauroPantin (May 16, 2020)

Last week I went through a bit of a DOOM OST loop on YouTube, with a recent Mick Gordon recorded live stream and his GDC talk for Doom 2016 where he discusses the Doom Array. Pretty neat. I ended up coding my very own Doom compressor in Reaper using JSFX, which I am experimenting with.


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## MartinH. (May 16, 2020)

MauroPantin said:


> I ended up coding my very own Doom compressor in Reaper using JSFX, which I am experimenting with.



That's awesome! Would be cool to hear it in action.


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## MauroPantin (May 16, 2020)

MartinH. said:


> That's awesome! Would be cool to hear it in action.



Actually, I might as well post the code here for the Reaper guys. It is basically snippets of code I found online that I mashed up together to get it working, so it's not really mine anyway. In Reaper, in the "Add FX to" where you select your plugins to add them to a track, click FX -> Create new JS FX and paste this code:



```
desc:Doom Compressor v0.1
//tags: Doom Compressor

in_pin:left input
in_pin:right input
out_pin:left output
out_pin:right output

@init
gain = seekgain = 1;
c_ampdB = 8.65617025;

@slider
treshdB = min(-200,-.1);
tresh = exp(treshdB/c_ampdB);

treshdB == -.1 ? (gain = seekgain = 1; );

look = floor(max( min( 1000/1000000*srate , 500000) , 1));
attack = exp( -treshdB/max( 30/1000000*srate , 0) / c_ampdB  ) ;
hold = 1000/1000*srate;
under_tresh = 0;
release = exp( -treshdB/max( 1000/1000*srate , 0) / c_ampdB ) ;

limit = exp(-0.1/c_ampdB);

mode_make_up = 1;

volume = limit / (mode_make_up ? tresh : 1);

seekgain = 1;

@sample
detect = max(abs(spl0),abs(spl1));

bufPos[0] = spl0;
bufPos[look] = spl1;
(bufPos += 1) >= look ? bufPos = 0 ;
spl0 = bufPos[0];
spl1 = bufPos[look];

detect = max(max(abs(spl0),abs(spl1)),detect);

detect > tresh ? (
    under_tresh = 0;
    hold ? seekgain = min( tresh/detect ,seekgain ) : seekgain = tresh/detect;
):(
    (under_tresh+=1)>hold ? (seekgain = 1; );
);

gain > seekgain ? gain=max(gain/attack,seekgain):gain=min(gain*release,seekgain);

spl0 *= gain * volume;
spl1 *= gain * volume;

max(abs(spl0),abs(spl1)) > limit ? gain = seekgain;

spl0 = max(min(spl0,limit),-limit);
spl1 = max(min(spl1,limit),-limit);
```

As far as the features, this is basically an extreme limiter with a -200dB threshold, fast attack (30ms as per what I could gather from his GDC and stream info), very slow release, and a -0.1dB output ceiling. Anything you put through it will go out at -0.1dB. 

Also, no GUI and no dials, it is not optionally multiband like the one he has, so there are no options and it's not pretty. Those two things are next on my list for when I have some downtime.

Use with caution and watch out for your ears and speakers! I almost went deaf a couple of times whlie coding this stuff.


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## MartinH. (May 17, 2020)

MauroPantin said:


> Actually, I might as well post the code here for the Reaper guys. It is basically snippets of code I found online that I mashed up together to get it working, so it's not really mine anyway. In Reaper, in the "Add FX to" where you select your plugins to add them to a track, click FX -> Create new JS FX and paste this code:


Thanks so much for sharing the code and the guide how to use it! I haven't messed much with JS FX scripting yet. I only tried writing a midi plugin once, but gave up because of conceptual flaws that I hadn't fully throught through.



MauroPantin said:


> As far as the features, this is basically an extreme limiter with a -200dB threshold, fast attack (30ms as per what I could gather from his GDC and stream info), very slow release, and a -0.1dB output ceiling. Anything you put through it will go out at -0.1dB.


That explanation was very helpful for making sense of the code!



MauroPantin said:


> Use with caution and watch out for your ears and speakers! I almost went deaf a couple of times whlie coding this stuff.


I appreciate the warning! When I first started the plugin, I got a fairly loud sine-wave before even hitting play. Probably some fake-analog noise of one of my plugins that got compressed to hell. 

I use this setting in Reaper to protect my ears: 






I highly highly recommend that to everyone, no matter if you're working on such experimental plugins or not.



MauroPantin said:


> Also, no GUI and no dials, it is not optionally multiband like the one he has, so there are no options and it's not pretty. Those two things are next on my list for when I have some downtime.



I randomly opened one of the JS FX plugins that come with reaper and the "Master Limiter" looks kind of similar. Did you use that as a base? 

Does your plugin code in the version you've pasted here give you an extreme compression? For me it barely changed the sound, and I have a suspicion why. You have some code in the @slider part, but you took the actual sliders out. I don't think it reliably calls that code now. When I move the "@sample" line up to just below the "@slider" line, it sounds how I'd expect it to sound. Very fun to play around with, thank you for sharing! 

Last night I had played around a little with ozone 8 multiband compressor and maximizer on extreme settings and based on that I'd say working it into a multiband setup somehow might be worth it. It doesn't necessarily need to happen on code level, you can just use the 3 band splitter and joiner JS effects and route the 3 resulting channel pairs through 3 instances of your doom compressor. Might need to pull the gain down though, because they add up far beyond 0db otherwise. 

I'm attaching an example of a short synth part with and without the 3-band doom compressor setup. Quite a difference ^^. I need to put a -100 db noisegate before the compressor or else the sinewave creeps in again.


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## MauroPantin (May 17, 2020)

MartinH. said:


> I appreciate the warning! When I first started the plugin, I got a fairly loud sine-wave before even hitting play. Probably some fake-analog noise of one of my plugins that got compressed to hell.
> 
> I use this setting in Reaper to protect my ears:
> 
> ...



Oh, man! This is awesome, thank you for the tip, I did not know this existed! After the first close call, I just went to the headphones and left them on the table as I moved stuff around, and I heard a couple of loud noises when testing, but this would have been much better!



MartinH. said:


> I randomly opened one of the JS FX plugins that come with reaper and the "Master Limiter" looks kind of similar. Did you use that as a base?
> 
> Does your plugin code in the version you've pasted here give you an extreme compression? For me it barely changed the sound, and I have a suspicion why. You have some code in the @slider part, but you took the actual sliders out. I don't think it reliably calls that code now. When I move the "@sample" line up to just below the "@slider" line, it sounds how I'd expect it to sound. Very fun to play around with, thank you for sharing!



I opened up Reaper and see what you mean, it's very similar. The code is a mashup of about 2 or 3 plugins I found on github that I shamelessly ripped off. One might have been that one, I went through about 30 different code pages looking for ways to do it. Since I did not know how to use JSFX (I think maybe I still don't) I copied and pasted stuff, and moved it around until it worked. 

And you guessed it right, some of the code had sliders and a few other variables (like makeup gain, a dB meter and stuff like that) that I just took out completely. I wanted to make it as simple as possible for both keeping in the spirit of the original Doom comp and also for my own sanity because I am not at a level where I can keep up with a lot of code. 

I am also seeing in the Reaper JSFXs code that these have comments all over them, which on second thought would have been a good idea to include in this one as well, a month from now if I sit down to try and make a GUI I won't know what the hell anything does.

I corrected mine and now it's much more like I originally expected it to work, so thanks for the fix, as well! I was hearing compression before, but I have a limiter in my output bus that I never took out just in case after those close calls and it might have been doing the work instead. With the auto-mute in place, I can take it out without worrying. I'm glad I shared it!



MartinH. said:


> Last night I had played around a little with ozone 8 multiband compressor and maximizer on extreme settings and based on that I'd say working it into a multiband setup somehow might be worth it. It doesn't necessarily need to happen on code level, you can just use the 3 band splitter and joiner JS effects and route the 3 resulting channel pairs through 3 instances of your doom compressor. Might need to pull the gain down though, because they add up far beyond 0db otherwise.
> 
> I'm attaching an example of a short synth part with and without the 3-band doom compressor setup. Quite a difference ^^. I need to put a -100 db noisegate before the compressor or else the sinewave creeps in again.



Multiband seems worth it. I wonder how difficult it would be to implement in code... I also think that splitting it the way you mentioned might have some advantages in terms of manually balancing the tone using the mixer faders and the mix knob in the plugin to get something similar to parallel comp. I imagine one could probably do that with automation, of course, but it seems way out of my league in terms of programming.


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## Matt Damon (May 18, 2020)

Consona said:


> Generic metal with some distorted synths and sounddesign pads. Dunno why people rave about it so much. It nicely complements the atmosphere though, so, mission accomplished I guess.



Hard agree.

I've been (or maybe I should say I was) a huge metal fan for decades and honestly, this is basically just the same, binary-code riff bullshit with half-time drums less the death metal screams and with some cinematic sound-design going into the production and wobble synths which fell out of popularity around 2015 when Dubstep died.

Absolutely nothing about this boring-soundtrack is "innovative". This stuff was dated by 2010, folks. Tons of bands have been doing this kind of stuff since the 90s.









Run those down-tuned guitars through that plugin that combines it with a chainsaw (like Mick does), use electronic drums instead of real ones, add some dubstep synths and typical "cinematic" impacts and stuff and you've got the DOOM soundtracks.

Compositionally and such, it's just generic downtuned metal. Like, it's basically "cinematic meshuggah".

I think this garbage was called "Djent"


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## visiblenoise (May 18, 2020)

As a metalhead myself, I think it's a flawed premise to look at the Doom soundtracks with respect to metal at all. My appreciation of the soundtracks comes precisely from the fact that the riffs are not always trying to be super "metal", and neither is the production - it's just aggression and menace. If the riffs resembled anything like Iron Maiden or Emperor or Cannibal Corpse, it would have taken me out of the experience, because for some reason, I find metal to be a very grounded sound, inappropriate for cinematic experiences. Much like most typical guitar/bass/drums band setups.



Matt Damon said:


> Like, it's basically "cinematic meshuggah".


"Cinematic meshuggah" is an awesome concept. The Doom soundtracks are closer to Meshuggah than any of the djent progeny that came after Meshuggah, which is huuuge distinction to me.


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## MauroPantin (May 18, 2020)

Of course it's not a reinvention of the wheel. It's clear what the influences are. But it gets praise because nobody combined those elements before in a palatable mainstream way, while at the same time managing to hit a brief with so much accuracy. It's a remarkable job. Metal is often times a caricature of itself, these soundtracks are a breath of fresh air.


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