# Covid Ear



## Alchemedia (Apr 7, 2022)

COVID-19 can infect the ears — causing a chronic condition some call "Covid ear"​








How COVID-19 can infect your ears


Scientists now understand why some COVID-19 patients report balance and hearing issues, a condition being called "Covid ear"




www.salon.com


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## Jeremy Morgan (Apr 7, 2022)

Alchemedia said:


> COVID-19 can infect the ears — causing a chronic condition some call "Covid ear"​
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I fear we are going to be finding out for many years what covid actually does under the hood for all the reported symptoms in getting it and those that remain post. There is one I saw like this where they found it hides in fat cells.


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## Michel Simons (Apr 7, 2022)

Fat cells? Damn, I have a lot of those....


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## Jeremy Morgan (Apr 7, 2022)

Michel Simons said:


> Fat cells? Damn, I have a lot of those....


https://www.asbmb.org/asbmb-today/science/012222/covid-fat-cells-diabetes

More stuff on it here too


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## Tatiana Gordeeva (Apr 7, 2022)

COVID-19 and hearing loss: What we know


Can COVID-19 cause hearing loss? Learn about what experts have found so far on the relationship between the coronavirus and hearing problems.




www.healthyhearing.com


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## parapentep70 (Apr 7, 2022)

I myself developped tinnitus after having CoVid. It was strange to me because I never had before. I am exposed to moderate (not brutal by any standard) audio levels for 2 hours a week (rehearsals or gigs). But due to moving out for a new job I stop any rehearsal or any exposure to high accoustic pressure back in late 2019. 1 year later I had CoVid. Then I developped tinnitus. recently (14 months after) I resumed playing with my band, this did not change anything.

So I developped the tinnitus just in the middle of a 2.5 year period when I never exposed to high sound pressure (beyond watching TV or mixing at home). And it was at the same time I got CoVid.

I know it was not related to stress. I was concerned that the tinnitus could be just the result of hearing loss. So I checked my ears with my studio equipment (I mentioned in this forum). It turns out that I have 2 narrow "deaf spots" at 2 different frequencies, 1 per ear. When I first noticed, I could not believe it (I can hear 4500Hz with my right ear if I increase the level by 17dB respect to neighbour frequencies!!!!), but just rotating the headphones... the problem was me, not the cans. I could hear perfectly the same 4.5kHz my left ear. My hearing above 10K is slightly above average for my age / gender.

I documented the procedure and the results, being very concerned about the possible evolution of this sudden hearing loss. I recently checked again (this was the goal). No change at all. Only these 2 "deaf spots".

I can easily ignore the tinnitus, and I accept this small hearing loss. It appeared suddenly and then I have not seen any change for at least 10 or 12 months (when I was fully aware).

Being SO specific and SO narrow band I tend to think it is a neurological damage in the inner ear.

Of course I went to the Web to check for more cases like mine. The only information I found was about hearing loss DURING CoVid caused by some medication. Not my case (it was mild, I did not take anything). Then I was simply tired of looking for confirmation on the Internet, life is short.

And now this is the first time I see medical information about hearing losses due to CoVid, but I suspect I am not alone. Many people had neurological problems related to smell / taste.

I also had another symptom after CoVid (some abnormal heart condition), but apparently I fully recovered from it. This one is well-known and documented.


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## Pier (Apr 7, 2022)

parapentep70 said:


> I myself developped tinnitus after having CoVid. It was strange to me because I never had before. I am exposed to moderate (not brutal by any standard) audio levels for 2 hours a week (rehearsals or gigs). But due to moving out for a new job I stop any rehearsal or any exposure to high accoustic pressure back in late 2019. 1 year later I had CoVid. Then I developped tinnitus. recently (14 months after) I resumed playing with my band, this did not change anything.
> 
> So I developped the tinnitus just in the middle of a 2.5 year period when I never exposed to high sound pressure (beyond watching TV or mixing at home). And it was at the same time I got CoVid.
> 
> ...


Both my wife and I developed tinnitus maybe 2-3 weeks after our second shot.

I don't have any proof, but I'm convinced it was either the vaccine or that we got asymptomatic Covid. It's super weird we got it both quite suddenly and in the same period.

Hers was much worse than mine. I barely hear it most of the time, but hers even woke her up in the middle of the night. She did some acupuncture sessions and barely hears it now.


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## parapentep70 (Apr 7, 2022)

Pier said:


> Both my wife and I developed tinnitus maybe 2-3 weeks after our second shot.
> 
> I don't have any proof, but I'm convinced it was either the vaccine or that we got asymptomatic Covid. It's super weird we got it both quite suddenly and in the same period.
> 
> Hers was much worse than mine. I barely hear it most of the time, but hers even woke her up in the middle of the night. She did some acupuncture sessions and barely hears it now.


Interesting. First time someone tells me a case like mine first hand. And today also first time I see papers publishing that "possibly this is caused by CoVid, not by medication or stress".


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## Pier (Apr 7, 2022)

parapentep70 said:


> Interesting. First time someone tells me a case like mine first hand. And today also first time I see papers publishing that "possibly this is caused by CoVid, not by medication or stress".


Honestly, I really don't have any scientific proof, it's just my conspiracy theory.

But even in 2021 there was some talk about this from reputable sources:









Evidence supports Covid hearing loss link, say scientists


Hearing loss and other auditory problems are associated with Covid-19 according to a systematic review of research evidence led by University of Manchester and NIHR Manchester Biomedical Research Centre (BRC) scientists.Professor Kevin Munro and PhD researcher Ibrahim Almufarrij found 56...




www.manchester.ac.uk













Coronavirus vaccines and tinnitus


We know that people with tinnitus have concerns about the impact of the vaccines and of Covid-19 on their condition, so we've put together some information to help.




www.tinnitus.org.uk


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## Robert_G (Apr 7, 2022)

Pier said:


> Both my wife and I developed tinnitus maybe 2-3 weeks after our second shot.
> 
> I don't have any proof, *but I'm convinced it was either the vaccine* or that we got asymptomatic Covid.


The truth is that the Covid-19 vaccines are still in the experimental stage. Mainstream media will not OPENLY tell you that. Many people believe that because they are legal and released to the public, that they are fully approved. That is NOT the case. A simple inquiry to the CDC(which is mainstream), FDA, or any query to mainstream pharmaceutical information will prove that. Unfortunately, the vaccine companies and government have used very CAREFUL WORDING in hopes to make the public naïve to that fact.

That is the main reason I'm not vaxxed for Covid....and I have ALL my other vaccines. I chose not to get this one because it's still experimental and we still don't know all the long-term or side effects from it. I refuse to be a guinea pig.

Hope you and your wife get better soon.


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## jbuhler (Apr 7, 2022)

Robert_G said:


> The truth is that the Covid-19 vaccines are still in the experimental stage. Mainstream media will not OPENLY tell you that. Many people believe that because they are legal and released to the public, that they are fully approved. That is NOT the case. A simple inquiry to the CDC(which is mainstream), FDA, or any query to mainstream pharmaceutical information will prove that. Unfortunately, the vaccine companies and government have used very CAREFUL WORDING in hopes to make the public naïve to that fact.
> 
> That is the main reason I'm not vaxxed for Covid....and I have ALL my other vaccines. I chose not to get this one because it's still experimental and we still don't know all the long-term or side effects from it. I refuse to be a guinea pig.
> 
> Hope you and your wife get better soon.


I hope you don’t get covid or pass it along to anyone you are fond of (the downside of not getting vaxed is that you are much more likely to get it, get a more virulent case, and pass it along).


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## robgb (Apr 7, 2022)

Robert_G said:


> The truth is that the Covid-19 vaccines are still in the experimental stage.


This is NOT the truth. At all. The Covid vaccines are based on decades of science. Quit spreading false information.


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## robgb (Apr 7, 2022)

Fact Check: No, the COVID-19 vaccines are not experimental


Social media posts have falsely claimed the COVID-19 vaccines currently being distributed in the U.S. are "experimental."




www.kwqc.com


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## parapentep70 (Apr 7, 2022)

Pier said:


> Honestly, I really don't have any scientific proof, it's just my conspiracy theory.
> 
> But even in 2021 there was some talk about this from reputable sources:
> 
> ...


Thanks for the links. I got CoVid in Jan 2021, I noticed the hearing / tinnitus some weeks later (and I did not link initially with CoVid). Then I tried to find some material, but at the time I found material proving that anything could be potentially related to CoVid (at most some reasonable scientific doubts). So I stop trying to find any information on the Internet. I did my 1st home audiometry later, in June.
In general I try to avoid using the Internet to find support for my own biases when data are not conclusive.
From my acquintances with mild symptoms, some 15% had smell / taste problems (equally disturbing), but none told me about hearing loss.


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## Pier (Apr 7, 2022)

Robert_G said:


> The truth is that the Covid-19 vaccines are still in the experimental stage. Mainstream media will not OPENLY tell you that. Many people believe that because they are legal and released to the public, that they are fully approved. That is NOT the case. A simple inquiry to the CDC(which is mainstream), FDA, or any query to mainstream pharmaceutical information will prove that. Unfortunately, the vaccine companies and government have used very CAREFUL WORDING in hopes to make the public naïve to that fact.
> 
> That is the main reason I'm not vaxxed for Covid....and I have ALL my other vaccines. I chose not to get this one because it's still experimental and we still don't know all the long-term or side effects from it. I refuse to be a guinea pig.
> 
> Hope you and your wife get better soon.


Thanks for your wishes but it's not true the vaccines are in an experimental stage. The bureaucracy was accelerated but not the science. All vaccines and drugs can have side effects.

Even if I was 100% sure the mild tinnitus was caused by the COVID vaccine, I would do it again.


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## Alchemedia (Apr 7, 2022)

Pier said:


> Thanks for your wishes but it's not true the vaccines are in an experimental stage. The bureaucracy was accelerated but not the science. All vaccines and drugs can have side effects.
> 
> Even if I was 100% sure the mild tinnitus was caused by the COVID vaccine, I would do it again.


I'm in the same boat Pier and getting my 2nd booster tomorrow regardless.


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## sostenuto (Apr 7, 2022)

robgb said:


> This is NOT the truth. At all. The Covid vaccines are based on decades of science. Quit spreading false information.


Agree !! Also recall internet news article, just few weeks back, showing scans of multiple brain anomalies in post-Covid patients.
Much more to be studied and learned _ yet quite pleased to have received all (3) Moderna vaccines and soon to add #4 booster.


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## Roger Newton (Apr 8, 2022)

Robert_G said:


> The truth is that the Covid-19 vaccines are still in the experimental stage.


All vaccines are in the experimental stage(s) constantly. It's an ongoing project because even when you think a virus has been around for years and it's dna is written in tablets of stone, like say Polio, there are usually subtle changes that need addressing.

Flu jabs are the most obvious ones.


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## Guffy (Apr 8, 2022)

Hmm, my tinnitus first started in late feb 2020 (just around when covid was becoming a big deal).
I had a cold around that time but i never got checked for covid, as it was very mild and testing stations wasnt a thing here yet.
I never thought covid could do that. I know i was also monitoring too loud around this time, so thats most likely the cause. Interesting to think about tho.
I had covid a few months ago, but my tinnitus didnt change. I did have some strange sudden balance issues in my hearing after that (what felt like pressure and minus a few dB on one ear, and it was seemingly random which ear it would happen to). Im very anxious regarding anything happening to my ears, so whenever i experience stuff like that i always freak out a little and my mind seems to exaggerate it even further 😅


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## tcollins (Apr 8, 2022)

Pier said:


> Both my wife and I developed tinnitus maybe 2-3 weeks after our second shot.
> 
> I don't have any proof, but I'm convinced it was either the vaccine or that we got asymptomatic Covid. It's super weird we got it both quite suddenly and in the same period.
> 
> Hers was much worse than mine. I barely hear it most of the time, but hers even woke her up in the middle of the night. She did some acupuncture sessions and barely hears it now.


Although I've had tinnitus for almost 20 years, it became much worse within hours of getting the J&J vaccine in August 2021. When I went to an audiologist, she told me that she had other patients that reported a similar experience. I did report this as a side effect. It may have lessened a bit since then (or I'm just adapting to it), but it is still much worse than before.

Edit: Almost everyone I know has been jabbed, and as far as I know none of them has experienced this. However, I do believe that it is important to report something (to VAERS) that could possibly be a side effect, so that proper research can be done.


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## Tatiana Gordeeva (Apr 8, 2022)

Not disputing anyone's experience here, there's also seem to be a strong correlation between tinnitus and stress level in studies like this one:








Tinnitus Among Patients With Anxiety Disorder: A Nationwide Longitudinal Study


ObjectivesThe association between tinnitus and anxiety disorder remains debated. We used a retrospective cohort study to investigate the relationship between anxiety disorder and tinnitus, aiming to decipher possible risk factors for tinnitus in patients with anxiety disorder.MethodData on a...




www.frontiersin.org




where people suffering from stress and/or anxiety were 3-4 times susceptible to tinnitus!!

And God knows how many reasons we have had in recent years to be stressed... COVID, economy, wars,...did I mention economy?


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## robgb (Apr 10, 2022)

tcollins said:


> Although I've had tinnitus for almost 20 years, it soared to a new level within hours of getting the J&J vaccine in August 2021. When I went to an audiologist, she told me that they were "seeing a lot of this". An acupuncturist told me the same thing. I did report this as a side effect. It may have lessened a bit since then (or I'm just adapting to it), but it is still much worse than before.


Anecdotal, not scientific. I've had tinnitus for 40 years and it didn't get any worse after getting jabbed three times. The only side effect was being mildly fatigued for a day or so. Which, of course, is also anecdotal. Means nothing for that very reason.


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## robgb (Apr 10, 2022)

Tatiana Gordeeva said:


> Not disputing anyone's experience here, there's also seem to be a strong correlation between tinnitus and stress level in studies like this one:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


The one time I went in for treatment of my tinnitus, the doctor suggested anxiety meds. I declined.


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## tcollins (Apr 10, 2022)

robgb said:


> Anecdotal, not scientific. I've had tinnitus for 40 years and it didn't get any worse after getting jabbed three times. The only side effect was being mildly fatigued for a day or so. Which, of course, is also anecdotal. Means nothing for that very reason.


Yes, I understand, although we may never know unless people report possible side effects and studies are done. I'm not in any way anti-vax, I was just responding to a post by someone (actually 2 people including his wife) who had a similar experience.

I edited my earlier post a bit just to try to avoid misunderstanding.


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## parapentep70 (Apr 11, 2022)

Tatiana Gordeeva said:


> Not disputing anyone's experience here, there's also seem to be a strong correlation between tinnitus and stress level in studies like this one:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I mentioned before: Not in my case by any means. I had to immigrate to a different country, without the family, travelling every weekend, keep 2 homes (really expensive), quit my rock band... But with the lockdown I could return home (initially for 2 or 3 weeks), do remote work (as usual in the last 5 years), completed a key project and got credit to be allowed to continue remote work "in a semi-permanent basis". Back to normal cosy life, no need to spend in the apartment abroad, flights, cabs... It is when I started dedicating more time to music (as a hobby).

I got CoVid 1 year after in a situation of unusually low stress. And not depressed at all!

Now things are a bit more hectic, but I cope well with pressure. I can easily ignore the tinnitus (never really bad), but I did lose some hearing and fortunately it is not going worse.

Of course this does not prove it was CoVid. It could be any other infection (I suspected a minor teeth infection, but hearing loss is in both ears) or just aging... but it appeared suddenly and fortunately does not look any worse with time. Even now that I resumed playing with my band.


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## robgb (Apr 15, 2022)

tcollins said:


> Yes, I understand, although we may never know unless people report possible side effects and studies are done. I'm not in any way anti-vax, I was just responding to a post by someone (actually 2 people including his wife) who had a similar experience.
> 
> I edited my earlier post a bit just to try to avoid misunderstanding.


Of course. Understood. Some people are bound to have side effects taking any type of medication or vaccine. But there are so many factors that affect the severity of tinnitus that it's nearly impossible to determine if the vaccine is the cause. Your perception of the severity of your tinnitus can worsen simply by THINKING about it (or remembering you suffer from it). Which is why anxiety medicines are often prescribed to treat it.


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## CATDAD (Apr 15, 2022)

All I know is going through this thread certainly enhanced my own tinnitus!

...Actually it's probably more because of my seasonal allergies. Congestion has a big impact on the ol' ear-tubes no matter what it's from!


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## Alchemedia (May 12, 2022)

robgb said:


> The one time I went in for treatment of my tinnitus, the doctor suggested anxiety meds. I declined.


Valium helps. YMMV


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## ptram (May 12, 2022)

Pier said:


> Both my wife and I developed tinnitus maybe 2-3 weeks after our second shot.


I had the same experience, but all started about ten days after the first shot. However, I've had Covid before, and this was considered by the doctor at the acceptance as sort of a 'first shot', unfortunately not recognized by the law.

A few days after the second shot I had to go to the hospital, because all I could hear was a strong white noise on all the frequencies. It was like living in a world with no reference points. Even driving my car was a troubling experience, until the problem mitigate by itself along the way.

The audiologist I consulted didn't give me any hope this problem can be solved with some medicine or therapy. The only solution seems to be a deep psychological work on myself, to accept this ugly traveling companion.

To those who are living this same situation: the psychological work seems to be effective. The rumble and whine can go to the background, and even disappear from the horizon of perception. Hearing is not actually damaged, and knowing this greatly attenuates that sense of despair that may get you during the first months.

At least in my case, the hypersensitivity to low-level noises (fan vibrations, water running, munching…) is limited to short bundles of time. I know next summer will be a difficult time, but I also know that it will end at the end of August. So, I can resist. And so I hope the others suffering for the same disease.

Paolo


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## ptram (May 12, 2022)

Alchemedia said:


> Valium helps. YMMV


I don't know if this is milder or not, by melatonine is also effective in helping you sleep. It seems it has no serious negative consequences. I suspect it can create addiction, due to the positive effects, but it seems it is easy to resist.

Paolo


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## ptram (May 12, 2022)

robgb said:


> Anecdotal, not scientific.


No, it's scientific. On a limited time-span and a limited number of reported cases, but a phenomenon kept under observation by the scientific community.









SARS-CoV-2 vaccine-associated-tinnitus: A review


The global vaccination drive against severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus-2 is being pursued at a historic pace. Unexpected adverse effects have been reported following vaccination, including thrombotic thrombocytopenia, myocarditis, amongst ...




www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov





All I can say on myself is that I never had tinnitus before, didn't suffer of vaccine anxiety, and two coincidences are nearing a proof in my peasant's wisdom.

Paolo


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## robgb (May 12, 2022)

ptram said:


> No, it's scientific. On a limited time-span and a limited number of reported cases, but a phenomenon kept under observation by the scientific community.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


This a review that scrutinizes the available literature and is not scientific proof of anything. And from the review itself:

"Secondly, all the patients evaluated reported substantial past medical history and carried a high risk of immune dysregulation; therefore, the role of genetic predisposition and underlying conditions requires special surveillance..."

Finally, tinnitus can be caused by any number of things. It can be permanent (as in my case) or it can be temporary (as in my wife's case when she experienced it awhile back), but there's no scientific proof that the vaccine caused it. And until there is, all the stories here are merely anecdotal.

I personally had never had tinnitus until I suddenly had it thirty years ago. The cause is most likely the fact that I'm a musician (as all of us here are) and did not protect my ears properly when listening and performing. I'm guessing THAT, more than the vaccine, is this reason anyone on this forum experiences tinnitus. And there's a lot more scientific proof of such a correlation.


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## Pier (May 12, 2022)

robgb said:


> there's no scientific proof that the vaccine caused it. And until there is, all the stories here are merely anecdotal.


That's true but OTOH it would be extremely difficult to determine that someone got tinnitus from a vaccine (or anything really) with 100% certainty.

Personally I would have never even considered I got it from the vaccine if it wasn't because both my wife and I got constant tinnitus within days of each other. I mean it could be a massive coincidence but I think it's fair to assume it's because something we both did.

Other than getting the second COVID shot we went to see Dune at the theater. It was quite loud but other than that we're not exposed to loud sounds regularly. We don't even live in a city.


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## tcollins (May 12, 2022)

ptram said:


> I had the same experience, but all started about ten days after the first shot. However, I've had Covid before, and this was considered by the doctor at the acceptance as sort of a 'first shot', unfortunately not recognized by the law.
> 
> A few days after the second shot I had to go to the hospital, because all I could hear was a strong white noise on all the frequencies. It was like living in a world with no reference points. Even driving my car was a troubling experience, until the problem mitigate by itself along the way.
> 
> ...


So sorry to hear that you're going through this as well. It is life-changing. There are still days I cannot work, even though like you I have adapted to an extent. Also like you, I had already had Covid. A doctor had pressured my wife (who also had recovered from Covid) under threat of not allowing surgery she needed to get the shot, so I got the shot at the same time to support her.

We are composers here at VI-Control. Unless we're at Beethoven levels of skills, we need to be able to hear. Knowing the risks in anything that could affect our hearing is important.

To be fair, tinnitus can be caused by the disease itself, so we're taking a risk either way.

FWIW, using the term "anecdotal" is not helpful. Reporting side effects is the first step in studying them.


And thank-you Mike for not removing our comments on this subject.

-TC


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## robgb (May 12, 2022)

Pier said:


> Other than getting the second COVID shot we went to see Dune at the theater.


See, this seems the more likely culprit. I have had experiences where an especially loud theater/movie experience caused my tinnitus to worsen to almost unbearable levels for days after. Now, as a matter of course, I wear special frequency cutting earbuds when I go to the movies. But again, merely anecdotal.


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## Pier (May 12, 2022)

robgb said:


> See, this seems the more likely culprit. I have had experiences where an especially loud theater/movie experience caused my tinnitus to worsen to almost unbearable levels for days after.


Yeah but that was like 7 months ago. Also, movies aren't constantly blasting sound at you like in a concert or a club.

I mean, of course I don't know for certain, and will probably never know. Thankfully my tinnitus is quite low. I don't hear it unless I'm wearing ear plugs or headphones. My wife was much worse but she got better after doing some acupuncture sessions.


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## robgb (May 12, 2022)

Pier said:


> Also, movies aren't constantly blasting sound at you like in a concert or a club.


Tinnitus can be caused by a single incident.


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## MartinH. (May 12, 2022)

ptram said:


> I don't know if this is milder or not, by melatonine is also effective in helping you sleep.


Melatonine is waaaaaay milder than Valium. Can't really compare them I think.



robgb said:


> I have had experiences where an especially loud theater/movie experience caused my tinnitus to worsen to almost unbearable levels for days after.


But that was noticable immidiately after the loud noise event, correct? For me it always was like that when my tinitus permanently worsened from loud noise. It was the worst immidiately after the loud noise and then slowly got better to the (now raised) baseline. What others here are reporting related to the covid vaccine sounds very different. I'd take it seriously, but I'm also taking Covid very seriously and will keep getting those vaccine refreshers as long as needed.


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## ptram (May 12, 2022)

MartinH. said:


> Melatonine is waaaaaay milder than Valium. Can't really compare them I think.


I must say that I’m not actually taking pure melatonine, but a mix of substances, among which gingko biloba, vitamins and something called Q-ter. The prescription is called Acuval Audio, and it's what the audiologist and my doctor prescribed as a long term therapy.

I'm sure it's not in the same category as Valium, and since I try not to get drugs, I’m happy it works despite being with no consequences. I don't think it is doing much for my tinnitus, but it's great to fall asleep for a few hours.

Paolo


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