# Dorico update



## ed buller (Jun 28, 2017)

*Dorico 1.1 update released with chord symbols and much more*


by *Daniel at Steinberg* » Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:05 am 

We are pleased to announce the immediate availability of the Dorico 1.1 update, the most significant update yet to our new scoring application, and a significant milestone in the growing maturity of the product. This update is at least as large as all of the previous three updates for Dorico combined, and adds many long-awaited features:

• This release introduces sophisticated support for chord symbols. While chord symbols are added by playing a MIDI keyboard or typing on the computer, Dorico automatically writes chord symbols in any of six pre-set conventions, and lets users tweak the appearance using dozens of options. Dorico is also the only professional scorewriter to support polychords.
• Piano pedaling with comprehensive support for advanced techniques — including partial pedaling, changing the pedal level over time and more; 
• New repeat ending lines for 1st and 2nd time bars, perfectly positioned;
• Unique intelligent note spelling for MIDI step input, which automatically avoids common enharmonic errors during input;
• Expanded editing operations, allowing users to move dynamics, slurs, hairpins, octave lines and other notations easily with the mouse, intelligently snapping them to ideal positions;
• New selection features, allowing users to quickly select items of a certain kind for further editing;
• Comprehensive features for precise editing of rhythmic spacing, designed in consultation with experienced professional engravers;
• Expanded import and export features, allowing users to import music from other projects and MusicXML files into a current project, and export sections of a project in Dorico, MIDI, MusicXML and audio formats.

This is only scratching the surface of the new features in this update. You can read more about the new features, and watch quick tutorial videos, on the Making Notes blog, read complete documentation of the changes and improvements in the Dorico Version History, and download the update here.


e


----------



## Saxer (Jun 28, 2017)

Wow!


----------



## agarner32 (Jun 28, 2017)

Double wow! I may have to revisit Dorico now that it has chord symbols.


----------



## ed buller (Jun 28, 2017)

an amazing bit of software...they really are thinking of everything. The idea that midi data can be manipulated just for playback where it won't affect the printed the score is so cool.




e


----------



## dtcomposer (Jun 28, 2017)

It's getting better and better. The intelligent spelling thing was really cool, and seems good enough to not annoy me most of the time. Still waiting for proper CC lane editing in "Play" mode. Once it gets that I will be ready to start diving in while the rest is added. Really was hoping for that in this update even in a basic form. It looks like maybe you can set up some basic stuff with the expression maps, but I want to be able to edit that info easily like in a DAW. 

Still, the Dorico team is delivering so far, and I have great faith that this program is going to be amazing when fully mature. I don't regret purchasing early to support them.


----------



## mverta (Jun 28, 2017)

Looking forward to somewhere around Dorico 2.0.


----------



## ed buller (Jun 28, 2017)

dtcomposer said:


> Still, the Dorico team is delivering so far, and I have great faith that this program is going to be amazing when fully mature. I don't regret purchasing early to support them.




exactly 

e


----------



## mikeh-375 (Jun 28, 2017)

Watching this too and will probably get it, so long as the note spelling malarkee changes the f natural in f sharp major, to an e sharp....
I hope they will incorporate digitiser pen and touch functionality too.....


----------



## jamwerks (Jun 28, 2017)

I use Finale & Sibelius alongside Cubase, and had envisioned the switch to Dorico about 6 months back. But after spending a full day understanding Dorico, I was really disappointed with some of the dev directions taken. In a nut-shell, what I could do in Finale in 2 clicks was necessitating 6 or 7 clicks in Dorico. Seems they had really thought about everything (in a good way), but almost totally neglected speed issues. Looking at these videos, it does seem better. May be time to go back and take a hard look!


----------



## Nathanael Iversen (Jun 28, 2017)

Sibelius 8.5 and Win10 are not happy together at my studio. I have been messing with Dorico a bit and it is just as fast for basic stuff. I need to dive into the VST stuff and see about getting my Cubase expression maps into it. Give it real instruments and still have the ability to move stuff on a grid? Pretty cool. It will take a bit to meet to the full functionality of Sibelius, but it is a refreshing change. I will not miss Sibelius at all. It has not been stable since moving to Win10 for my main DAW 18 months ago, but everything else works fine.


----------



## Saxer (Jun 29, 2017)

Doesn't Dorico have the possibility for realtime midi recording (playing to a click and record like in a DAW)?
I couldn't find any information about that. I can't imagine that it isn't possible...?


----------



## Vik (Jun 29, 2017)

Saxer said:


> Doesn't Dorico have the possibility for realtime midi recording (playing to a click and record like in a DAW)?
> I couldn't find any information about that. I can't imagine that it isn't possible...?


No, there are some crucial functions that are still missing. Nevertheless, having watched the new videos about yesterday's version, this is a big step forward - there are lots of nice details in 1.1.


----------



## Saxer (Jun 29, 2017)

Thanks... yepp, that's a function I really miss. Probably I have to get used to step input... which I never did using Logic for notation up to now. But the Dorico update is great and sooner or later that's the way to go!


----------



## Franklin (Jul 7, 2017)

Hi everyone,

Hope you guys don't mind if I jump on the Dorico bandwagon 
I'm new to this forum and have read very useful information on music notation software and other topics. Bumped into this forum after a google search and glad I did. Interested in composing, arranging, music notation and also working with virtual instruments. My current DAW is Cubase Artist 9.

Regarding Dorico which I own and have put up for sale, my disappointment grew after the last 1.1 update. Chords were implemented, but rhythm remarks were left out completely. I waited a couple of months to finish a Bigband arrangement, but currently exploring Finale 25 which seems to have all the features I am looking for. Concerning Sibelius; I don't like the annual fee, but other than that it could be ok too. Dorico has a long way to go and it felt like I payed to be a beta-tester given the tons of questions in the Dorico forum at Steinberg.

And while we're at it, which notation software (Sibelius or Finale 25) in your experience has the most potential and regular updates to keep up with todays music notation needs?

Thanks in advance.

Franklin


----------



## HaidenDvim (Jul 7, 2017)

Franklin said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> Hope you guys don't mind if I jump on the Dorico bandwagon
> I'm new to this forum and have read very useful information on music notation software and other topics. Bumped into this forum after a google search and glad I did. Interested in composing, arranging, music notation and also working with virtual instruments. My current DAW is Cubase Artist 9.
> ...




Sibelius and Finale are great products, but they have been around forever. That being said, Dorico is already miles ahead of Sibelius and Finale. Also, since you are new, you should know that the team that is creating Dorico, created Sibelius in the first place up till the point that Avid bought them and almost ran it into the ground. The direction Dorico is going, Sibelius and Finale are and will never be able to go because of their legacy engine. In order to even compete with what Dorico will be able to do in 2.0 or later updates, would require a completely new software and engine, which would be starting over. The Dorico team has already done that. 

Just because it is missing things still does not mean it will not be there soon. Those of us who have purchased Dorico and those who are thinking of it, should keep in mind, that it is a work in progress and we understand the direction they are going. When Dorico is complete, based on everything they have stated and already delivered on, will make Dorico the most complete Notation/DAW'in-one option for composers ever created. We will see in up-coming releases cc-lanes for drawing in expressions, which no notation program has. Now dont get me wrong, I know you can assign like cc in other notation programs, but it is not a cc-lane, and as everyone here agree's is a static and not a human representation of true expression. This is why a DAW is mandatory for realistic mock-ups.

Dorico is promising to bridge this gap and is already more then half-way complete on these features being put into place. I have already seen video and screenshots of the cc-lanes and in the 1.1 release, we now can edit midi data separate from printed note input, for a realistic performance. And if you are selling Dorico and giving up on it because "rhythm remarks were left out completely", I am sorry to say, that I feel you do not see the huge picture of what Dorico will become.

My 2-cents.


----------



## noxtenebrae17 (Jul 7, 2017)

HaidenDvim said:


> That being said, Dorico is already miles ahead of Sibelius and Finale.



This is a bit misleading. Dorico has the potential to be miles ahead of Sibelius and Finale. And its user interface, engine, and workflow are definitely more modern. But Finale and Sibelius can still do way more than Dorico can in their current state and will likely be able to for another 1-2 years. Dorico is catching up quickly but still has a ways to go. And there are many quirks to Dorico's workflow and UI that simply don't make as much sense.

I own both Finale and Dorico (and used to teach in Sibelius). I have used Finale for 15 years and can pretty much do anything on it. Even if some of those things take absolutely forever and I have crashes here and there.

Dorico, on the other hand, is a fantastic little program with a lot of potential. And I would love to switch to it full time. Unfortunately, when working with larger groups (like symphony orchestra scores), the features just aren't there. I just finished notating a string orchestra piece in Dorico that turned out great. But I'm switching over to larger groups and I don't think I can work in them effectively and produce the music that my performers need to be the most effective. Thus Finale gets pulled out again.

Franklin, if you need a full-featured notation program right now, get Finale or Sibelius (both have their quirks, but both can create marvelous, professional scores). If you can sputter along creating scores that are missing a few things that will undoubtedly be there after a few updates, keep Dorico in your library.

jamwerks, I agree there are a few things that take more steps in Dorico than they do in Finale or Sibelius (for example you still can't enter dynamics into multiple staves in one click. You have to copy them, which is a pain). But there is a lot less editing when you're done which makes up for that time. And the overall visual appearance of Dorico looks great to my eyes.


----------



## Luke W (Jul 7, 2017)

HaidenDvim said:


> Sibelius and Finale are great products, but they have been around forever. That being said, Dorico is already miles ahead of Sibelius and Finale. ... And if you are selling Dorico and giving up on it because "rhythm remarks were left out completely", I am sorry to say, that I feel you do not see the huge picture of what Dorico will become.



Dorico development is on a great trajectory for integrating DAW and notation software - but it is not "miles ahead" of Finale or Sibelius in terms of usability. After talking with Daniel Spreadbury at the Nashville Dorico demonstration, I believe they may very well get there someday. But right now, as a professional engraver, I couldn't remotely consider moving to Dorico. Daniel asked me to email him a list of features Dorico would have to have before I could switch - but the list was so long, I didn't even send the email for fear of sounding mean.

That being said, I do like the engine they've built. But a nice engine cannot make up for incomplete notation capabilities. But if you don't need to create publisher-ready scores and want to see where they take the DAW integration, it might be fun to go along for the ride on these early versions, learning the program as it develops.

But for those of us who have to get work done, Dorico is miles behind.


----------



## noxtenebrae17 (Jul 7, 2017)

dtcomposer said:


> Still, the Dorico team is delivering so far, and I have great faith that this program is going to be amazing when fully mature. I don't regret purchasing early to support them.



Agreed 100%. They need that early support to make the program flourish later on. I can tell the team really is working hard and their updates are so jam-packed they make Finale & Sibelius's updates look paltry in comparison.


----------



## Luke W (Jul 7, 2017)

noxtenebrae17 said:


> ... their updates are so jam-packed they make Finale & Sibelius's updates look paltry in comparison.



Totally agree on this point. I'm hoping that Dorico's work will light a fire under the Finale team. I fear Finale is less attentive to the pro-engraver market these days. Lots of issues that haven't been addressed in years of updates. Some aggressive competition would be a welcome factor to the playing field.


----------



## Franklin (Jul 7, 2017)

HaidenDvim,

I agree that Dorico has the potential to become the standard in music notation some day. I bought it because I also see that they're walking a different path, but for the sake of my arrangement being finished, I had to look for other notation software.
I mentioned only one feature I'm missing, but also after the latest update there are a total of 13 features I miss that would make my score complete. These features seem to be present in Finale. I know that the list of features from Dorico users goes on and on and to implement a great deal of them takes time, a lot of time. When things are in place I certainly think Dorico will be my choice, but for now Finale will do.

B.T.W., I like the lively discussion on this forum. Thanks for the contributions in reaction to my post.


----------



## koolkeys (Jul 7, 2017)

Luke W said:


> Totally agree on this point. I'm hoping that Dorico's work will light a fire under the Finale team. I fear Finale is less attentive to the pro-engraver market these days. Lots of issues that haven't been addressed in years of updates. Some aggressive competition would be a welcome factor to the playing field.


As a long-time Finale user (I think I bought in 1998/1999 for the first time), and as somebody who has followed the Dorico development closely, I also hope it causes Finale to improve greatly. I feel like the Finale team has been quite complacent, which is unfortunate. It's like they think adding more underwhelming Garritan sounds is enough for an update. It was nice to see 64-bit finally, but that alone isn't enough. Finale is uber powerful, so maybe there isn't a lot they can do to it without rebuilding the user experience, and they don't have the manpower to do that. So we get little tiny features with each update. Hard to say.

So I am really hoping Dorico screams forward. They have already been moving at a good pace, and there are some things it does that are just awesome. And as a Cubase Pro 9 user, it's very intriguing to see what kind of integrations might come. So a switch to Dorico is definitely possible for me, and I'm already using it for messing around more with each update. So the near future is going to be quite interesting for sure. 

Dorico is really the first competition for Finale and Sibelius in years. Notion is good, but not on the same level yet, and not really marketed very well or developed very quickly. Sibelius got stale, which made Finale get stale. And the notation market has just been boring lately......until Dorico came along. 

Brent


----------



## jamwerks (Jul 7, 2017)

noxtenebrae17 said:


> jamwerks, I agree there are a few things that take more steps in Dorico than they do in Finale or Sibelius (for example you still can't enter dynamics into multiple staves in one click. You have to copy them, which is a pain). But there is a lot less editing when you're done which makes up for that time. And the overall visual appearance of Dorico looks great to my eyes.


Yeah I think you're right that once all the data entry is done, Dorico seems to be much faster for the rest. But I was totally disappointed to see how (for example) slow it was to get articulations and especially text (pp, arco, poco sul pont., etc.) in! Finale clearly is twice as fast as Sibelius for this, and what did Dorico do? They copied the Sibelius way! WT Flying F ???

And in all their video's they seemed so proud that you could do everything from a portable, but at the expense of having twice as many keys to press. They say to be creating a tool for the pro's, but seemed to have catered to the hacks!

And I didn't see any way to be able to program macros with a 3rd party program to speed things up. I was SO psyched for this program, and SO disappointed (6 months ago). Maybe time to take another look...


----------



## camelot (Jul 24, 2017)

I am using Cubase in my studio where the e-Licencer can sit warm and save. But I want Dorico for composing ideas on the road. Does it need a USB-dongle? I could not find it mentioned on the Steinberg page under "resources". So my hopes are high it doesn't. 
Right now, I use a mixture of Muse, which sounds ugly even with additional sound packages and Reaper, which does not offer an efficient workflow when working with a pen on the MS Surface, which I prefere to do on the road. 
I will definitely check out the demo version. Thanks to the Steinberg team for offering a demo.


----------



## Vik (Jul 24, 2017)

Cubase needs dongle, Dorico doesn't, but IIRR once you have authorised it on your dongle (if you choose that), there's no way back. So if you buy it and authorise it, make sure you get it right from the start.


----------



## Saxer (Jul 24, 2017)

You can use it without a dongle (using software protection). But without a dongle you can use it on one computer only.


----------



## Vik (Jul 24, 2017)

But I guess - if you need to use Dorico on two computers at some point, that you can transfer the authorisation to the dongle?


----------



## camelot (Jul 24, 2017)

Thanks for the answers. So, it is e-licensing on the machine then.



Vik said:


> but IIRR once you have authorised it on your dongle


What does IIRR means? 
I assume it doesn't mean _Iranian Islamic Republic Railways_ or _International Institute of Rural Reconstruction_.


----------



## Vik (Jul 24, 2017)

IIRR means "if I remember right".


----------



## camelot (Jul 24, 2017)

Ok, got it. Sorry, I am not a native speaker.


----------



## Rob Elliott (Aug 7, 2017)

Hey guys. How is Dorico for getting midi or xml from Cubase 8.5 (in a quantitized state) and then cranking out parts for piano and a string quartet? (is it workable - I don't want to spend the time mousing in all the notes again if possible.)


----------



## Saxer (Aug 7, 2017)

I exported some XML test files from Logic to Dorico which worked very well.


----------



## Rob Elliott (Aug 7, 2017)

Great news Saxer. Anyone do the same on Cubase 8.5. I'd like to stay in Cubase during writing phase and then when all approved export to Dorico (XML or midi) to get more of a 'pro' score for live musicians to play/record. Will I be happy with Dorico with this intent? Enormous time to achieve this?


----------



## Luke W (Aug 7, 2017)

I attended a seminar here in Nashville the other night. This was my second Dorico seminar but my first since they've added chords. I must say, while the program still isn't ready for professional engraving, the chord system puts Finale's long-outdated chord tool to shame. I'm confident that the Dorico team is building a better mousetrap, and looking forward to the day it will fully meet my needs.


----------



## Rob Elliott (Aug 9, 2017)

Sorry for the newbie question but when I export MusicXML from Cubase to Dorico on a PIANO part - it reads out in Dorico well BUT all the stems coming from notes on the lower bass clef are 'connected' to the notes on the upper treble clef. All those stems look right in Cubase's score for the piano?? This cue is for piano and strg quartet and the string parts are PERFECTLY imported into Dorico (looks fabulous btw). Nice piece of software - if I can just get this piano part to look right.


----------



## Piano Pete (Aug 9, 2017)

Rob Elliott said:


> Sorry for the newbie question but when I export MusicXML from Cubase to Dorico on a PIANO part - it reads out in Dorico well BUT all the stems coming from notes on the lower bass clef are 'connected' to the notes on the upper treble clef. All those stems look right in Cubase's score for the piano?? This cue is for piano and strg quartet and the string parts are PERFECTLY imported into Dorico (looks fabulous btw). Nice piece of software - if I can just get this piano part to look right.



I use Finale, but I typically split the grand staff to avoid that sort of thing. Maybe you could try exporting the Treble and Bass cleffs separately and combine them in dorico? My guess is that it is associating everything in the piano roll with the upper staff, hence the awkward stems.


----------



## jamwerks (Aug 9, 2017)

Luke W said:


> I attended a seminar here in Nashville the other night...


Tell us more!


----------



## ptram (Aug 9, 2017)

While I'm happy we can now also choose Dorico, I still was hoping this new competitor could hurry Avid to rewrite Sibelius' user interface, remove all those childish icons, devote more room to the score, and (at least on the Mac) give it back a Mac appearance.

This doesn't seem to be happening, so the development of Dorico is becoming more and more interesting.

Paolo


----------



## Rob Elliott (Aug 9, 2017)

Ok guys - I found a solution on exporting out of Cubase to Dorico for piano. In the options don't set it to 'split' but rather 'polyphonic'. Stems will behave nicely then in Dorico. Hope this helps.


----------



## Luke W (Aug 9, 2017)

jamwerks said:


> Tell us more!



I don't know that we saw anything you can't find in their videos on their youtube channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCIOwP19omIVDSUq2rTGgHKw

But watching it work as the rep ran through features - man, I love the way the program understands music. Example: after adding notes to a measure in multiple voices (unlimited multiple voices, by the way), the section ended up with a voice below the staff with ledger lines and low beams hanging down. When the rep added lyrics, Dorico automatically recognized that those low notes were in the way and placed the lyrics exactly where they needed to be to avoid colliding with those beams. The same thing happens with dynamic markings, slurs, etc. It sees the problem and moves things to avoid collisions. Years of my life have been spent moving things around to avoid collisions in Finale. Dorico assumes you don't want collisions and understands how musical elements should be spaced. It's a beautiful thing to behold.

Now if they can just flesh out the program fully with all the necessary features, I'll be truly excited.


----------



## Rob Elliott (Aug 9, 2017)

I can support this - first track is pno+strg quartet+voice (with lyrics) - putting in lyrics right now - pure magic how things just sort out. Glad I bought it.


----------

