# Vi-Control's Collaborative Learning Project 5a and 5b: From sketch to Orchestration



## Darthmorphling (Jul 5, 2013)

Submissions:

Sasje
5a
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F99850897&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/sasha-sandbox/jazzy

kmlandre
5a
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F100574698&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/vi-controlcollablearnproj/mr-blink-in-the-drink-v2

5b
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F102715949&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/vi-controlcollablearnproj/mr-blink-in-the-drink-full-v3

darthmorphling 
5a
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F101222742&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/darthmorphling/sketch

5b
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F103623069&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/darthmorphling/moderni-heroici-compositorem-3

David Chappelle
5a
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F100605316&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/davidchappell-2/nebula

5b
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F103733113&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/davidchappell-2/nebula-drum-bass-remix

Frankly-h
5a
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F102306543&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/franklyh/vista

Wanmingyan
5a
https://soundcloud.com/wanmingyan/once-again-orchestral-sketch

It has been suggested that we split this project into two separate sections.

Project 5a:

Compose a piece of music using only two patches. The idea is to focus more on the sketching/composing process than the actual orchestration. I don't want to limit what patches you use, but you should limit the parts to reflect what the players are actually capable of doing live. No writing complex counterpoint with a solo cello. Remember this is about creating a coherent idea that seems to gel as a complete piece.

Project 5b:

Take the sketch you created for Project 5a and go full bore with whatever type of orchestration you would like. Also, do not feel like you need to be locked to the sketch. If you get inspired to change it please do. The focus for this was to worry less about getting the idea down and focusing on making it as close to perfect as you can. Think of this as a final draft of an essay. Polish, edit, and add if needed.

Unless any one objects, we should have a three week deadline to complete both pieces. So that makes July 28th for 5b. Ideally 5a should be completed by the halfway point, but if you are one of those last minute type of people please don't feel pressured.

I would like some suggestions for future projects as well. Please list in this thread any ideas you would like and I will update them in the 2nd post of the thread for easy choosing later.

One last thing: If you know of any other composers, please direct them here. I would love to have more people we can learn from.

The last 4 projects can be found at the links below.

Project 4: Writing to an image

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=3714484

Project 3: Wind Ensemble/Expanding a motif

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=3704358

Project 2: Scoring a Trailer

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=31328

Project 1: Expanding a motif

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=30766&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0[/quote]


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 5, 2013)

Future ideas:

I will take suggestions for future ideas and place them here.


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 5, 2013)

Composer Robin Hoffman addresses this idea in his Daily Film Scoring Bits.

http://www.robin-hoffmann.com/dfsb/daily-film-scoring-bits/

Look for the July 5th post.


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## Sasje (Jul 5, 2013)

For project 5a: I wrote a small Jazz improvisation piece. :D I was a bit tired of orchestral stuff. haha... I never did a Jazz piece, it's my first. o 

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F99850897&secret_url=false[/flash]

Used instruments: Contra-bass, Piano, Drums. I used two patches, but I just had to add the brush drums to it... It was actually pretty tough to write convincing brush drums, learned quite a bit from doing it.


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## Ron Snijders (Jul 5, 2013)

Sounds like a fun piece, Sasje  It really makes me curious as to what you're planning on doing with it when it's time to make it bigger.
One small point that I noticed is that in the e-f-g-a-g piano line, the volume drops a little, which (to me, at least) makes it sound a bit uncertain, like a player who is improvising but not really feeling it. Could be that I'm completely missing the point, but that's how it sounds to me.

Also: just wondering, are you from the Netherlands as well? Your name seems Duch :mrgreen:


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## Sasje (Jul 5, 2013)

Ron Snijders @ Fri Jul 05 said:


> Sounds like a fun piece, Sasje  It really makes me curious as to what you're planning on doing with it when it's time to make it bigger.
> One small point that I noticed is that in the e-f-g-a-g piano line, the volume drops a little, which (to me, at least) makes it sound a bit uncertain, like a player who is improvising but not really feeling it. Could be that I'm completely missing the point, but that's how it sounds to me.
> 
> Also: just wondering, are you from the Netherlands as well? Your name seems Duch :mrgreen:



Yes indeed, sounds a bit hesitant, maybe it was. Just playing around without giving it much though where to go next. Just improvising a bit, with no clear path... :D 

Yep, live in the Netherlands as well.


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 6, 2013)

Sasje @ Fri Jul 05 said:


> For project 5a: I wrote a small Jazz improvisation piece. :D I was a bit tired of orchestral stuff. haha... anyway I always write too much dark music, I need to lighten up a bit... I never did a Jazz piece, it's my first. o
> 
> [flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F99850897&secret_url=false[/flash]
> 
> Used instruments: Contra-bass, Piano, Drums. I used two patches, but I just had to add the brush drums to it... It was actually pretty tough to write convincing brush drums, learned quite a bit from doing it.



Very cool! It will be interesting to hear how you orchestrate this into a much larger piece.

Oh, and welcome back!


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## Sasje (Jul 6, 2013)

Thanks Darth! 

Finally some time to join again.  Oh yes, will be fun to complete it. I probably will be using a trumpet somewhere, I think I can sneak in a Cello or Clarinet. Not sure yet. I think I will replace the Piano with a wind instrument or brass and then use simple Piano keys beneath it.


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## Ron Snijders (Jul 6, 2013)

Ha, cool to see more Dutch composers here  And jazzy clarinets are lovely :D

Still thinking about what to do here. I think I'll make it harder on myself by not using a piano. Inspired by http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZnzjzjYkK0 (Dvorak's Humoresque) I think I'll do a cello + violin piece. Now for some inspiration :D


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## kmlandre (Jul 11, 2013)

Hi All-

I'm new here, so please excuse any missteps I might make.

Here's my submission for the first part: harpsichord and marimba. I'm afraid I'll have to keep my bits short as I only have time to pound these out during spare moments of the day.

https://soundcloud.com/vi-controlcollablearnproj/mr-blink-in-the-drink-v2

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F100574698&secret_url=false[/flash]

I won't say too much about it as so I'm curious to see how this all works and to get people's uninfluenced feedback...

Thanks much!

PS - Ahoy Darthmorphling - how did you do the cool embed of SoundCloud in your post? I didn't see a markup option for it...

PPS - Libraries are just Notion 4's native ones. 

Kurt M. Landre'
http://www.soundcloud.com/kmlandre


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 11, 2013)

@kmlandre

Here is the link that will get you started on embedding your Soundcloud tracks.

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24777.

I won't comment too much on your piece until I can listen to it on something other than my iPads speaker. On first listen it sounds quite good. I'm amazed at the talent the people doing these projects posess.


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## kmlandre (Jul 11, 2013)

@Darthmorphling

Thanks and thanks!

Got it figured out, as one can hopefully see above...

Kurt M. Landre'
http://www.soundcloud.com/kmlandre


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 15, 2013)

Updated the first post with the first of the submissions. Would have done it sooner, but have been busy with day trips.

Here's mine:
[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F101222742&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/darthmorphling/sketch

Used Kontakt's Grand Piano
SpitfireAudio's Sable.
Composed in Reaper.

This was a tough piece. I have four projects in this Project's folder. Once I got the basic 7/8 time piano line it was very easy to come up with variations.

I didn't get too deep in CC editing, but I did try and make it uniform and sound good. I did treat this as what it was intended to be, a rough draft/sketch.

I'm actually quite proud of this one.


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## David Chappell (Jul 18, 2013)

Here's my submission for 5a

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F100605316&secret_url=false[/flash]

Used Ql Pianos Gold (Steinway D). I tried adding another instrument but it didn't sound quite right so I kept it as a solo piano track.


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 18, 2013)

@David

Very beautiful piece. I kept hearing strings underneath. I know they are not there, but nonetheless I pictured them in my mind.


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## kmlandre (Jul 19, 2013)

Hi All-

Here's a partial orchestration of the sketch so far:

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F101780400&secret_url=false[/flash]
And here's the original:

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F100574698&secret_url=false[/flash]
Obviously, there's still a number of gaps that need filling in over and around the original, and couple of rough transitions. That and there's some eq and leveling issues.

I'm enjoying hearing everyone's work very much - looking forward to the fleshed-out versions immensely...

Kurt M. Landre'
http://www.soundcloud.com/kmlandre


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## Sasje (Jul 20, 2013)

Nice ideas so far.  

I don't think I will make the date set for the project. I'm really sick right now and need hospitalization. So I'm out for a few weeks. :(


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 20, 2013)

@Sasje

I'm really sorry to hear. I hope it's not to serious and you will be out soon.


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## wanmingyan (Jul 23, 2013)

Here's my sketch! Decided to start from Project number 5 instead as i missed out on a few...Posted this tune on soundcloud quite some time ago but then lost the account as i forgotten the email and password...=_=...so i decided to use it purely for this project!!  Do check it out! My orchestration is weak though...very weak.

https://soundcloud.com/wanmingyan/once-again-piano-sketch


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## wanmingyan (Jul 23, 2013)

Here's something i tried to churn out in 20 minutes...sorry about my poor orchestration beforehand...(warning before listening to my track)...

https://soundcloud.com/wanmingyan/once-again-orchestral-sketch


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## Frankly-h (Jul 23, 2013)

https://soundcloud.com/franklyh/vista
Here is mine. I hope I'm not too late.


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 23, 2013)

@Frankly-h

That is a very nice piece! I look forward to the fully orchestrated version.

@wanmingyan
 
Is the orchestral sketch for 5a? It's a very nice piece, I just want to post it as the right project.


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## wanmingyan (Jul 23, 2013)

Thanks Darthmorphling! It was my sketch! 

Hey all, i started a series of compositions called the "project' series, its like a project to show my improvement over time and get feedback (bad or good) from everyone! Please help me by giving me constructive feedback by commenting on my soundcloud! Really serious when i ask for feedback! I really wanna improve!~ :D 

-WMY


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 25, 2013)

@wanmingyan

I apologize for not getting your submission on the first post yet. I haven't really been near my computer lately and doing the embedding on my phone doesn't work. I'll get it posted later this evening.

I will listen to your soundcloud as well. I started this whole thing with the idea that we need practice, time, and a deadline to improve. It seems to be working, but familial duties seem to take a lot of time :D 

Don


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## wanmingyan (Jul 25, 2013)

Thanks alot for your helping people like me in the first place! 

-WMY


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 26, 2013)

@wanmingyan

I wasn't able to embed yours as I think you may have a setting checked somewhere on the track to not allow the Wordpress code to show. I did put it in the first post though. I few posts up I put a link that explains how to embed Soundcloud tracks, if you could embed it in a post then I can embed it in the first post.

Don


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## wanmingyan (Jul 26, 2013)

Sure, i would do something about it!

Cheers,
-WMY


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## kmlandre (Jul 26, 2013)

Hi All-

I've enjoyed listening to everyone's pieces and thought I'd post my comments:

*@Sasje* 

nice feel and the brush work is really convincing.
perhaps vary the direction of that final punctuating note on the bass in each of the phrases, sometimes heading to the upper octave, sometimes to the lower
I hear some nice lazy string swells behind it after the piano comes in
PS - Hope your health improves quickly and we can see you back here soon!

*@darthmorphling *

love that piano ostinato figure when it comes in
gets a little muddy when it passes to the lowest register
mid-low register version later on much more effective, especially with the mid-high range bell figure in contrast - maybe bring that in earlier?

*@David Chappelle *

beautiful, fragile piece - contrasting densities work very well
accelerando very effective at raising the level of poignancy
little blurry in the accelerando section
ending callback to the opening theme a little long for my taste - maybe skip the first set and just use the second set of the 3 or 4 chords and let it fade out there

*@Frankly-h *

Immediately had a great Shenandoah/American Folk melody feel to it
Though unexpected, enjoyed the turn to the mildly jazzy second half
Seems like great soundtrack for a pastoral scene, a la "A River Runs Through It" (this is a high compliment - one of my favorite movies of all time!  )

*@Wanmingyan *

Wonderfully light touch with a "childlike" feel - I can see it in a "Toy Story" style animation
The string pizz is effective, though perhaps a few occasional high pitched contrapuntal notes might help grab attention
For the full orchestration, it might sound pretty neat to pass that main melody back and forth between various wind instruments- start with clarinet, move to a high bassoon, the flute/piccolo, etc.

Thanks,

Kurt M. Landre'
http://www.soundcloud.com/kmlandre


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## kmlandre (Jul 26, 2013)

Hi Again-

Here's my final candidate for the 5b portion of the assignment:

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F102715949&secret_url=false[/flash]

Thanks,

Kurt M. Landre'
http://www.soundcloud.com/kmlandre


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 29, 2013)

Here is my final piece:

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F103070031&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/darthmorphling/moderni-heroici-compositorem

I have to say that after the last project, where I am still not happy with my piece, I am ecstatic about this one. The one area I am still struggling with is percussion. Not sure it completely fits, but without it there is something missing.

You will notice that I kind of abandoned the melodies from sketch. Melodies are an area where I am still trying to become more proficient in. Most of the ostinati and rythmic elements are still there. I have to say that writing in 7/8 time is creative, but it adds to the complexity, especially in writing percussion parts.

I want to thank all of the people who have joined my in this learning project as it really forced me to step up my game. All of the participants have set the bar rather high! 

Libraries used:

Spitfire Audio's Albion 1 and Sable
HybridTwo's ProjectAlpha
U-he's Zebralette
Composed and mixed in Reaper 4.

I tried to incorporate some of what I learned in Scoring Stages: Bruckner. Still have a ways to go, but I learned a lot from it. I spent about 5 hours mixing it this evening, but mixing is an area I still need to work on. Please be critical as it really has made me much better than the first piece I wrote.

Don


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 29, 2013)

kmlandre @ Fri Jul 26 said:


> Hi Again-
> 
> Here's my final candidate for the 5b portion of the assignment:
> 
> [flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F102715949&secret_url=false[/flash]



I like what you have done with the piece. I will critique it tomorrow since my train of thought is fried after finishing my piece.

Don


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 29, 2013)

@kmlandre

Well done! I really admire your ability to jump around to different instruments fluidly. It creates a lot of variation and interest in the piece. I think your orchestration is spot on. What libraries are you using? There is something synthy sounding in them. Unfortunately, or forutnately, that is the only thing I can even critique as it is really good!

Don


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## kmlandre (Jul 29, 2013)

@Darthmorphling

-EDIT- Just realized I never answered one of your questions - everything is from the Notion4 built in libraries. They're really decent, but not astounding. There's a few bits here and there on them that can sound clunky -/EDIT-

Thanks very much! After listening again, I think you're absolutely right. There's probably three factors causing the "synthy" quality:

1) I notated this piece directly (I use "Notion" - http://www.notionmusic.com) and didn't take time to randomize the velocity and on/off playback of the notes, so the performance is pretty rigid. With Notion, I find that overlapping the note on/off a bit really seems to help the illusion of legato (though not perfectly). Notion is supposed to do it automatically and it does to some degree - just not enough for my liking.

2) The recording style of all the instruments is close-miked and I'm still trying to figure out how to EQ them in a more realistic manner. Above and beyond reverb, I'd like to roll off the appropriate frequencies so that they sound more distant and correctly placed proximity wise. The fact that I didn't do that and combined with the native reverb in Notion - of which I'm really not all that fond - makes everything sound a bit artificial. I haven't found a cheap and suitable reverb replacement yet and I haven't stumbled upon the magic EQ formula yet - I'll have to keep poking at it.

3) I try to control all my levels with dynamic markings and leave the fader where it sits. I personally think that helps things sound more "orchestral", wherein a louder sound from an instrument equates with a harder played instrument. However, I frequently "fail to nail it" and I think there's several spots in this piece where things jump out too much or are buried too much.

But I have to say, this was an awesome exercise for me. The closest I've ever come to working from a sketch is whistling or singing into my phone and then starting orchestration immediately. This really forced me to work out the melodic direction and structure of the cue in advance instead of relying on the color of the orchestration - not something I usually do. In some ways it made things harder, it other ways it made it SO much easier. I'm sure I'll be using this approach again.

I hope to find a bit of time today to sit back and listen to your final orchestration, but I keep getting interrupted by work stuff. Stupid job! Why do they have to pay me to do stuff?!?  I can say this though - your piece very happily reminds me of Mike Oldfield's "Tubular Bells" and a lot of his other soundtrack stuff. I've always loved that approach to building an ambiance and I think it can be very effective...

Looking forward to hearing more from everyone!

Kurt M. Landre'
http://www.SoundCloud.com/kmlandre


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## kmlandre (Jul 29, 2013)

We could look at this for the next project:

"Midifan/Kong Audio 2013 Computer Game Music Contest"

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/vie...days=0&postorder=asc&highlight=chinee+contest

Might be fun...

Kurt M. Landre'
http://www.SoundCloud.com/kmlandre


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## Darthmorphling (Jul 31, 2013)

Here is my updated piece. I really worked at balancing the mix. The brass levels have been raised and that seemed to have worked out some of the bass problems I had. I also added some more percussion. I might have overdone the levels, but they sound huge!

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F103452188&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/darthmorphling/m ... ositorem-2

Also, what happened to everyone? Sasje is the only that has a valid excuse for not finishing 0oD 

I finally feel like I am starting to grasp this whole composing thing and I have everyone here to thank for it. 

Let's keep this going. Now finish dammit :evil: :twisted: :D :mrgreen: 

I also want to give a huge thanks to Jose J. Herring. He started a Facebook group and has really helped me with fine tuning my pieces. Message him on Facebook and he said he will add you all. There's not a lot of action going on, but I feel it could become a great resource. 

Don


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## David Chappell (Aug 1, 2013)

I am still participating actively in these, just my orchestration for this one is a fair way out of my comfort zone so progress is painfully slow :( but, regardless, I refuse to cop out !


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## Darthmorphling (Aug 1, 2013)

@David

Don't feel pressured, take the time you need. I wanted these projects to be fun, and educational. The deadline is more of a suggested target. I just got a bit worried when we went from 6 to 2 submissions. 

I think we need to come up with a rubric for our critiques. Something that makes us focus on each of the different areas.

One of the things I think we are missing is someone who does this professionally to critique us and is willing to help out. That's a hard sell as composers are very busy. I have a cousin who just graduated with a degree in music technology from UC Davis. I asked him to take a look at this piece, but he is in the middle of an internship and is quite busy. Im waiting to hear back from him but he may just forget.

Someone mentioned in another project that they didn't feel like they could critique as they were still learning themselves and I feel that way too. I am a teacher, not music, and to really critique something requires an understanding of the fundamentals. I'm not talking just theory, but an understanding of how things work on an intuitive level. However, one of the ways I run my classroom is to get the kids to feel comfortable with discussing the mistakes they make. We also do a lot of discussions where the kids try and figure out how to fix mistakes. It really forces them to think the material through. After the first month, they get upset when they can't share the mistake they made.

The only area I struggle to teach is writing. I recognize good writing, but nailing down why a piece of writing is bad is hard. I'm not talking about grammar and structure, but things like voicing, descriptive language etc... Kind of reminiscent of composing eh?

I am at the stage in my composing where I see that I am making mistakes but I need someone to help me identify how to fix them. I have learned a lot from this group, and will continue to learn from you all, but joining that Facebook group has really made my mistakes a lot more clear. I'm going to be uploading a third version of this piece, the final one, and it is far and away the best sounding piece I have done. I'm not talking orchestration, but the balance of the sounds. That's not to say it couldn't be improved, because it can. Just that I can take the things to be improved upon and apply them to the next piece. 

That was a lot longer than I meant to write :D


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## David Chappell (Aug 2, 2013)

Here's my submission for the second part:

[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F103733113&secret_url=false[/flash]

Been trying to learn a bit about synth programming and I wanted to try something a bit different. Can't say I'm all that happy with how it turned out but I think there was only so much little tweaking I could do before I just had to go with what I had.


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## Darthmorphling (Aug 2, 2013)

David Chappell @ Fri Aug 02 said:


> Here's my submission for the second part:
> 
> [flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F103733113&secret_url=false[/flash]
> 
> Been trying to learn a bit about synth programming and I wanted to try something a bit different. Can't say I'm all that happy with how it turned out but I think there was only so much little tweaking I could do before I just had to go with what I had.



Just updated the first post with your piece. I really like the sound of the synth. I have actually started getting into the synth side of things as well. Just purchased Zebra2 last night and plan on spending the next few days figuring it out.

While listening to it, it reminded me of the sound of the first Transformers score. The way you have mixed the piano and synth together blends very well. I do miss the intricate piano line you have towards the end of the the sketch. I'm envious of people that can play the piano that well though :mrgreen: 

Around 2:05 there is another sound that comes in and I'm not quite sure what it is. I'm assuming it's a synth, but I feel like it should come up more in the mix. It's very hard to hear. The only other thing I can think of is maybe vary the wobble, it gets a little repetitive. I am no synth expert, and depending on which synth you are using, you might modulate the LFO with another modulation source. If you are even using an LFO to modulate the wobble that is.

Nice piece!

Don


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## Darthmorphling (Aug 2, 2013)

We have three suggestions for the next project:

Sasje's: Write a piece for music you normally do not feel comfortabe writing for.

kmlandre's:

"Midifan/Kong Audio 2013 Computer Game Music Contest" 

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=32 819&start=0&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=chi nee+contest 

Mine: Writing a heavily synth based piece.

I would like to do the game contest, but would like to do that for Project 7. It will still give us time. Also, since it so far out, we can still start planning for it now. I am finding that working on one piece at a time, while keeping me focused, actually narrows my vision a bit.

That leaves Sasje's and mine. I don't feel comfortable with synth based music so either one we choose will work for me as I'll do synths for either. If I had my choice, I would like to focus on synths this time, while still using orchestral instruments, as well. From listening to all of our work it seems like synths are a shared area where we don't feel comfortable. Of course Sasje is the exception since she's actually writing her own synth :D

One thing we could do if we choose the synth route, is to share any patches we may have created along the way. This way we can help each other to figure out synthesis along the way of writing our piece.

Let me know, as I want this to be a collaboration.

I'll start the next project thread tonight.

Don


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## Darthmorphling (Aug 2, 2013)

Here is my last attempt at remixing this.


[flash width=450 height=110 loop=false]http://player.soundcloud.com/player.swf?url=http%3A%2F%2Fapi.soundcloud.com%2Ftracks%2F103623069&secret_url=false[/flash]
https://soundcloud.com/darthmorphling/moderni-heroici-compositorem-3

Let me know if you all think it's better or worse.

Don


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## kmlandre (Aug 5, 2013)

@Darthmorphling

I think the mix is a ton better on this. The section where the ostinato drops out and the suspended brass take over is more subtle and yet somehow more dramatic at the same time.

The fade in at the start is really good, and the ping-pong delayed synth thingy sounds like you did some thinning on it. I think that works well and adds to the ambiance of the track.

I personally would back off a bit that first hit as things are fading in. Unless it's actually attached to a visual element that's meant to startle, it just pops out too much.

Also, there's a few sections where I'd tighten up the quantizing on the performance, but that's probably a matter of personal taste. I tend to like things a bit square and rigid 'cos I listened to way too much 80's electronic music... 

Well done!

@David Chappelle 

Really interesting take on your original! It's so different from your sketch. I feel like both pieces could co-exist in a soundtrack as a sort of thematic development, the first part where the hero experiences that plot forming tragedy, the second where the hero finally goes off to confront "The Enemy".

I'd still like to hear that original version with some sort of orchestral backing - there's just so many possibilities in it for a super, gut wrenching dramatic build and callback. It so very wistful.

Like Darthmorphling, well done!

Kurt M. Landre'
http://www.SoundCloud.com/kmlandre


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## kmlandre (Aug 5, 2013)

Darthmorphling @ Fri Aug 02 said:


> We have three suggestions for the next project:
> 
> Sasje's: Write a piece for music you normally do not feel comfortabe writing for.
> 
> ...



That works for me! I have yet to write a true synth/orchestral hybrid piece, so this would be a good exercise.

Only trouble- I don't have much in the way of synth VSTs that sound decent since I tend to focus on orchestrating acoustic instruments. Any freebie suggestions?

Kurt M. Landre'
http://www.SoundCloud.com/kmlandre


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## Darthmorphling (Aug 5, 2013)

There are quite a few free ones out there.

by U-he
Tyrell N6
ZebraCM (comes with Computer Music Magazine)
Zebralette free with the zebra2 demo (single oscillator, but very powerful)
zebra2 demo works for awhile before outputting random notes. Can save and load presets. I wouldn't use it in any commercial works, and to be honest I never put it in any pieces, just used it to learn. Will do so now that I have bought it!
Podolski
Triple Cheese

Others

Crystal (very powerful, but complex)
Oatmeal (tons of presets to get started with)
Synth1 (another with lots of presets)
Dune CM (Another that comes with Computer Music Magazine)

Those are the only ones that I have had experience with.


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## kmlandre (Aug 5, 2013)

Darthmorphling @ Mon Aug 05 said:


> There are quite a few free ones out there.
> 
> ...(snipped)...



Thanks for the tip! I went and downloaded a number of those...

I have a few old copies of CM sitting around, so I'll have to go and check out what I might have there.

It's funny, because I have half-a-dozen hardware synths sitting around my house that I haven't powered on in years and years. I used to use them on everything, but now...

Kurt M. Landre'
http://www.SoundCloud.com/kmlandre


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## David Chappell (Aug 5, 2013)

I can personally vouch for sylenth1 which has a demo at http://www.lennardigital.com/modules/downloads/

It plays a watermark every minute, so I doubt you could use it in a project, but it doesn't have much restriction on functionality so in terms of learning the workflow of synthesis I think it's great.


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## kmlandre (Aug 5, 2013)

David Chappell @ Mon Aug 05 said:


> I can personally vouch for sylenth1 which has a demo at http://www.lennardigital.com/modules/downloads/
> 
> It plays a watermark every minute, so I doubt you could use it in a project, but it doesn't have much restriction on functionality so in terms of learning the workflow of synthesis I think it's great.



It looks pretty neat! I suppose I could pipe bits of it to disk in between watermarkings and dump the files into SFZ or something...

Also, I found this, though I don't know if anybody has any familiarity with it (like I said, I'm pretty far out of it when it comes to synth stuff these days):

NI Reaktor 5
http://www.native-instruments.com/en/products/komplete/synths-samplers/reaktor-5-player/

It's got some tasty bits in it...

Kurt M. Landre'
http://www.SoundCloud.com/kmlandre


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## GrimeBrett (Aug 6, 2013)

Great job, folks. Excellent work. I really enjoyed listening to your pieces. :D 
I am also a beginning composer, and I think participating in a group like this would be very beneficial. How does someone "join" a group like this? Does it ever start over at Project 1? Anyway, I guess I would appreciate more information. 
Keep up the good work! 

Brett


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## Darthmorphling (Aug 6, 2013)

@GrimeBrett

All you need to do is keep an eye out for the new thread getting started. I was supposed to start it last Friday, but have gotten distracted with my newly purchased Zebra2. I think I will start the next thread now so it should be up when you read this

Feel free to start doing any of the projects. I only put the deadline up to give us a bit of focus, but have fun going through each one at your leisure.

And welcome!

Don


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## Darthmorphling (Aug 6, 2013)

I just noticed this has been made into a sticky. Awesome!


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## GrimeBrett (Aug 6, 2013)

Thanks, Don. I'd love to be involved. Although finding time to do the projects will be a bit more difficult once I start teaching again. :( 
I will keep my eyes open for the new thread. 

Brett


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## Darthmorphling (Aug 6, 2013)

GrimeBrett @ Tue Aug 06 said:


> Thanks, Don. I'd love to be involved. Although finding time to do the projects will be a bit more difficult once I start teaching again.  :(
> I will keep my eyes open for the new thread.
> 
> Brett



Got the keys to my classroom today and my kids helped me set up my desks. I feel your pain o-[][]-o What grade do you teach? I teach 5th.

What I have found since starting these is that if there is a deadline, you will write something. I even have 5 kids of my own so no excuses :mrgreen: 

Don


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## Darthmorphling (Aug 6, 2013)

New Project has been posted.

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=3720989


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