# Convolution Reverb



## José Herring (Jan 18, 2020)

About 15 years ago I moved away from Convo verbs in favor of Algo verbs. 

I've decided to give Algo verbs another shot so that I can run synths through a room to give them more life. 

My trusted Convo plugin is sadly only 32 bit (yes it's been that long). I've been trying Cubase's built in Convo plugin but it sounds unusually like crap. I can't figure out if it's the convo engine in Cubase or if it's just bad IR's.

I know Altiverb has the best rooms. I'm wondering if there are ways to get some good room IR's so that I can get Cubase's convo to sound good or should I just face facts and plop down some money on finally getting Altiverb going. Seems like overkill to me as all I really need is just a good IR of a scoring stage or medium hal--like Teldex IR's would be great, or even Synchron. 

Thx.


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## slobajudge (Jan 18, 2020)

Try free Samplicity Bricasti m7 IR. I think that web site is down, but this link is from web archive 





Samplicity's Bricasti M7 Impulse Response Library v1.1 - Samplicity


Samplicity has created a new and FREE Impulse Response Library, based on the immensely popular and highly acclaimed Bricasti M7 reverb unit.



web.archive.org


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## José Herring (Jan 18, 2020)

slobajudge said:


> Try free Samplicity Bricasti m7 IR. I think that web site is down, but this link is from web archive
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you. I specifically need a room though. 

I loved Peter's work back in the day and he was kind enough to use his personal IR's for a live choir piece that I did. He was the reason why I started using Convolution and IR's in the first place. I was sad to see that Samplicity is no more.


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## slobajudge (Jan 18, 2020)

I don`t know what happened, but seems to me that some people unauthorized use his work and selling through Best service, but dont know the details. There is some problem though


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## Guffy (Jan 18, 2020)

It's a shame. The one free L96 IR he provided really sparked my appetite for more. I wish we could still buy it. I guess i'll have to live with the alternative lex reverbs around.


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## José Herring (Jan 18, 2020)

Guffy said:


> It's a shame. The one free L96 IR he provided really sparked my appetite for more. I wish we could still buy it. I guess i'll have to live with the alternative lex reverbs around.


He did some TC Electronic IR's and I used those so much early on. I stopped using convo but those IR's are still in a special folder on my sample disk. I've replaced the disk 3 times and each time that folder stays with me. Really good work. Taught me a lot about convo's.


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## Rob (Jan 18, 2020)

My favorite convo is still waves Ir1 I even bought the 360 version... it has a great collection of spaces and the ability to treat direct/early/late reflections separately. Their impulses contain the original direct signal which can be handy for putting sounds into a room, just using it as an all wet insert. Something I miss as an example in ew Spaces...


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## Dietz (Jan 18, 2020)

If someone uses algorithmic reverbs already then there's little need for sampled IR-based versions of those, if you ask me ... especially the ones that rely heavily on modulation in their algorithms, like the proverbial Lexicons.


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## muk (Jan 18, 2020)

josejherring said:


> My trusted Convo plugin is sadly only 32 bit (yes it's been that long).



Hey I'm still using the old WizooVerb that has been discontinued ages ago.

SpacesII has been mentioned. A little known low-cost option is this one:









Nebulapresets presents DreTripleSeven Impulse responses - Gearspace.com


I had in mind to get these out a few years ago but life took over. https://henryolonga.onfastspring.com...ulse-responses I won't say much as there is enough info about these guys on the interweb . If you are in the know you will 'Get' what these are. I ha



www.gearslutz.com





Some nice IR's in that pack.


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## Will Blackburn (Jan 18, 2020)

Reverberate 2 is excellent and alot of bang for your buck.


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## wst3 (Jan 18, 2020)

muk said:


> Hey I'm still using the old WizooVerb that has been discontinued ages ago.


HOW???

I've tried to get a license key for it several times over the years, but never heard back from the guy who had volunteered to support it. Any clues? Might be a rear view mirror thing, but I still miss WizzoVerb!


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## muk (Jan 18, 2020)

Still have a years old copy activated, and running it with jbridge. Maybe you could try contacting Peter Gorges, now working at ujam? No ideas other than that unfortunately.


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## wst3 (Jan 18, 2020)

Thanks! I will contact Peter, and I won't tell him where I found his name<G>!


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## Allen Constantine (Jan 18, 2020)

Seventh Heaven Professional reverb plugin AAX, AU, VST - LiquidSonics


Seventh Heaven Professional is dedicated to the reproduction of the most sought after hardware reverberation tool of a generation - the Bricasti M7.




www.liquidsonics.com


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## dgburns (Jan 18, 2020)

I’ve actually had great success using Cubase’s convo verb. Actually it was on par with Altiverb ( I usually default to the Teldex room ) I’m using a med room and dialed in a rather useful setting. It’s very very good (imho of course)

I use convo in quad, which the cubase one can do, and I use a room to mimic a scoring stage, nothing more then that. I’ll add some algo ( right now Valhalla Room) for long tails. One up front and one out rear with slightly differing settings. 

I think the trick to convo (orchestra use) is to make sure you use a fairly quick decay and concentrate on using it to give you the room, but not the tail. I actually find the Teldex Altiverb is a little long, but it does not suffer from the uneven nodes that I hear from the Altiverb Paramount and Todd AO stages. The thing I tend to do is brighten the Altiverb settings by lowering the bass, as it can build up down there fast.

Algo won’t always get you there, and convo is a nice way to widen out libraries that are only stereo (sample modelling, Lass etc) Even some rooms with multi mics can benefit from a touch of convo, just alot less. 

Just thought I’d throw this out there


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## José Herring (Jan 18, 2020)

Thx for all the responses.

In general I am not looking to replace the algo verbs I use. I just need to run synths through a natural sounding room so that I can give them space similar to my orchestral samples. Also to give them that cool sounding air and distance as if I had run them out into a room and recorded the output.

I am willing to use REverence(Cubase) but as of now it just sounds too cloudy. I am not sure if it is the engine or the stock IR's. I didn't realize there was a Teldex IR. I guess I gave up by the time I got to the Japaense hall IR. Never made it to the T's in the list. 

Wizoo verb was hands down the best reverb I ever heard those that have it hold on to it. I wonder if Vienna's hybrid verb is similar. But so far I haven't heard anything that sounded as good as that thing. I wish I had gotten it.


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## I like music (Jan 18, 2020)

josejherring said:


> Thx for all the responses.
> 
> In general I am not looking to replace the algo verbs I use. I just need to run synths through a natural sounding room so that I can give them space similar to my orchestral samples. Also to give them that cool sounding air and distance as if I had run them out into a room and recorded the output.
> 
> ...



Did you mean to say a reverence? I thought reverberate was something else. Just checking I haven't missed a reverb on cubase! 

I feel like the Dutch Hall gives a nice space on reverence...


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## José Herring (Jan 18, 2020)

I like music said:


> Did you mean to say a reverence? I thought reverberate was something else. Just checking I haven't missed a reverb on cubase!
> 
> I feel like the Dutch Hall gives a nice space on reverence...


Yes I meant ReVerence.


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## muk (Jan 19, 2020)

josejherring said:


> Wizoo verb was hands down the best reverb I ever heard those that have it hold on to it. I wonder if Vienna's hybrid verb is similar. But so far I haven't heard anything that sounded as good as that thing. I wish I had gotten it.



The concept is the same, a convolution reverb with the possibility to use algorithmic reverb for the late reflections. I have both, and both are very good. Hybrid reverb has more control, but if I had to use only one it would be Wizoo. It has a certain IR that I love for orchestral tracks. Very transparent, non-colouring, and with great depth. I slightly prefer the algorithmic part on Wizoo as well.


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## Beat Kaufmann (Jan 19, 2020)

Hello 
The Quality of the Output of Convolution Reverbs depends on the IR we use.
Unfortunately many of the free IR libraries are not from rooms but from algo reverbs (and that is not what you are looking for) or the rooms aren't really usable.
In order to record good room IRs, a considerable amount of effort is required. That's why I understand that people want to earn some money for it.
So maybe a good convolution reverb is worth buying... ...and with it good room IRs.

I was talking about a big effort for good room IRs. If you use the sine sweep method to get to such an IR, the first things that can cause errors are the speakers, then the microphones used... If they are placed at an unfavorable position... such a recording of a real room can lead to a quite discolored IR in the end. 

I also think that some of the IRs of Cubase's REVerence actually sound a bit "too discolored" - especially some of the older IRs. So - and of course in general - this following method can help to make the colored IRs sound a bit more natural (No. 36). If the Convolution Reverb has no EQ or only a simple one, you can for example edit the IR itself with an EQ if it is available separately. With the help of pink noise, a matching EQ and an analyzer it is relatively easy to trim the IR a bit for more neutrality.

All the best
Beat


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## SergeD (Jan 19, 2020)

Beat Kaufmann said:


> many of the free IR libraries are not from rooms but from algo reverbs



It sounds nonsense to my ears! Well, I learned something today, thanks Beat.


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## storyteller (Jan 19, 2020)

josejherring said:


> Thank you. I specifically need a room though.
> 
> I loved Peter's work back in the day and he was kind enough to use his personal IR's for a live choir piece that I did. He was the reason why I started using Convolution and IR's in the first place. I was sad to see that Samplicity is no more.


Look in my signature for a link to my storyteller store site. I built out and made available presets for waves ir1 which uses the bricasti irs and another Hopkins IR pack. The IRs are included in the download with the presets. you can demo Waves IR1 to see if it is one you want to use. It has a great set of IRs included and usually hits a sale price of $29/$39.


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## robgb (Jan 20, 2020)

Melda Production MConvolution MB.


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## Royosho (Jan 20, 2020)

Convology XT is free with lots of IRs





Convology XT | Impulse Record







impulserecord.com





However something like East West Spaces is definitely worth the money, imo.


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## Gerhard Westphalen (Jan 20, 2020)

I've also never had success with the one in Cubase. I use rooms and the scoring stage in Altiverb all the time (don't think I've ever done a mix without them). I used Spaces a bit many years ago and remember it having some nice ones but I'm not sure if I'd still like them now that I've been using Altiverb.


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## Tanuj Tiku (Jan 20, 2020)

Gerhard Westphalen said:


> I've also never had success with the one in Cubase. I use rooms and the scoring stage in Altiverb all the time (don't think I've ever done a mix without them). I used Spaces a bit many years ago and remember it having some nice ones but I'm not sure if I'd still like them now that I've been using Altiverb.



Gerhard, what do you use convolution reverbs for usually? Is it mostly on dry sources or even as main reverbs or even long tails for that cinematic sound? 

I am getting good results recently with Seventh Heaven. But, I would be very interested to know why and when do you use convolution reverbs, specially on sources that are not that dry?


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## Gerhard Westphalen (Jan 21, 2020)

Tanuj Tiku said:


> Gerhard, what do you use convolution reverbs for usually? Is it mostly on dry sources or even as main reverbs or even long tails for that cinematic sound?
> 
> I am getting good results recently with Seventh Heaven. But, I would be very interested to know why and when do you use convolution reverbs, specially on sources that are not that dry?


Sometimes as my main reverb like with the Mechanics hall. The Seventh Heaven doesn't always sound natural like if I'm working with something more classical. 

On dry sources then I'll always use it for a room or scoring stage. I'll normally put it directly on the track so that the send to other reverbs already has that room in it. I'll occasionally use it on wetter sources if I just want to push them back a little like with woodwinds that sound a little too close.


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