# Don't you think sending to library music will minimize the freelance market for you?



## impressions (Jul 7, 2011)

hey,

just a thought, since most pieces there drown in their own sea of desperation to be heard, why send them at all?
since alot of production companies use it, wouldn't be more wise of us freelance composers to save some market for ourselves instead of sending pieces for cheap prices and getting a really bad royalty from them, if any at all?

it's like we're the ones ruining the market for ourselves. if there weren't any music libraries, the production companies would have to look for freelance composers-and pay according to what *we* set for them.

i think that loop is very self destructive and it should be stopped.


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## lux (Jul 7, 2011)

i think music libraries are almost dead. 

Every single composer, which has the hook with the production, actually puts together a "library" which names "john Doe's Music library". Basically is a curriculum note to get the job and its done raising stuff all around and promising unexisting TV royalties to composers. Royalties that will never happen, as most, if not all of the music will be taken by the composer itself. So basically if you put your tracks there youre just helping a composer to get his own gig.


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## IvanP (Jul 7, 2011)

Luca, could you expand further your point?

You mean that the deal is, now the release our own library, do the marketing ourselves and collect royalties? 

What about the client know-how? (marketing, etc) which is the part the Library Editors are meant to do? That's quite some time spent that the composer is not focusing on his library. 

But, in general, I agree with impressions...we seem to have buried ourselves with this market. 

In Spain we say..."bread for today, hunger for tomorrow".


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## lux (Jul 7, 2011)

What i meant is that probably not sending stuff to libraries is a good idea even beyond the scope of keeping space for freelance work.

I believe its the library scheme that its not working anymore. 

Tracks are too many. Computers pratically agmented exponentially the number of avalable tracks due to home recordings, virtual orchestras and the like. There is simply too much stuff and nobody will be able to search among hundreds thousands titles to find a background for 30sec promo.

One possible scenario is that libreries will become just consultants. That custom stuff will be the thing (actually most libs are getting in house composers). And that sooner or later we will be back to the old times.

My impression is that its no more time for catalogues.


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## midphase (Jul 7, 2011)

I agree with the sentiments. IMHO there are a handful (or maybe a couple of dozen tops) of libraries who have enough business relationships with post houses that can still manage to make it work. Sometimes they have niche corners of the market, sometimes the person who runs the library used to work at one of the networks....either way they have some specific factors that allow them (and the composers they represent) to do ok...and in some cases much better than ok. Those are the libraries which generally pay up front fees to the composers, they have well written comprehensive contracts, and a good accounting firm who manages all the payments and makes sure all the composers are paid. 

IMHO (and based on my observation of the market), these companies are few and far between, and up and coming outfits have little chance of being able to survive for the long term. The market is overcrowded with those libraries who amount to nothing more than disorganized collections of "stuff" for the most part.

I think many of these lesser players will fizzle out in the next few years, and the ones who remain will be tougher and tougher to get into. Ultimately there will always be a market for library music, it's unlikely that regional TV ads and the corporate world will go back to original music for their needs....and reality shows ingest so much music that they have to rely heavily on stock music (or the non-stop flow of singers and bands who send them stuff). 

I also (entering controversy) don't think that all composers are cut for original scoring. I know several composers who create beautiful compositions for libraries, but if you put them in front of a video clip and ask them to score it, they get totally lost.


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## impressions (Jul 7, 2011)

midphase @ Thu Jul 07 said:


> I also (entering controversy) don't think that all composers are cut for original scoring. I know several composers who create beautiful compositions for libraries, but if you put them in front of a video clip and ask them to score it, they get totally lost.



oh yeah, i second that. the spotting in composing and what to put on each spot is alot more related to knowing film and dramatizations work rather than be a great composer who deals with the various emotions of music.

although, i doubt there are composers who feed themselves just by library work, so that skill is a must if you want to finish the month.


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## lux (Jul 7, 2011)

midphase @ Thu Jul 07 said:


> I also (entering controversy) don't think that all composers are cut for original scoring. I know several composers who create beautiful compositions for libraries, but if you put them in front of a video clip and ask them to score it, they get totally lost.



no controversy, its a matter of fact.


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## gsilbers (Jul 7, 2011)

excuse my ignorance but what movies, scirpted tv shows or programs get scored using library music that its not a reality show, promo, cheap documentary (like the show "how its made" where a guy describes how a tennis raquet is made) or "live event"?

i dont think ive heard "library music" in other context that is not what i wrote above. 
but maybe its my small media world or i just wasnt aware.


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## impressions (Jul 7, 2011)

CSI, NYPD, commercials


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## TheUnfinished (Jul 8, 2011)

I've seen quite a few drama tv shows using library music - sometimes I only notice because I know the library music composer personally.

I've even seen library music used to augment the existing soundtrack to a programme, where the programme is employing a composer.


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## vlado hudec (Jul 8, 2011)

gsilbers @ Fri Jul 08 said:


> excuse my ignorance but what movies, scirpted tv shows or programs get scored using library music that its not a reality show, promo, cheap documentary (like the show "how its made" where a guy describes how a tennis raquet is made) or "live event"?
> 
> i dont think ive heard "library music" in other context that is not what i wrote above.
> but maybe its my small media world or i just wasnt aware.



I know several commercials (national and worldwide campaigns), where library music was used and music bugdet was $20k +


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## gsilbers (Jul 8, 2011)

impressions @ Thu Jul 07 said:


> CSI, NYPD, commercials




hmmm...

so how does it work?

how have this guy

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0443867/

who does the original music but still need library music?


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## gsilbers (Jul 8, 2011)

TheUnfinished @ Fri Jul 08 said:


> I've seen quite a few drama tv shows using library music - sometimes I only notice because I know the library music composer personally.
> 
> I've even seen library music used to augment the existing soundtrack to a programme, where the programme is employing a composer.



so the producers hire a guy for original music but need library music for some cues as well?


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## gsilbers (Jul 8, 2011)

vlado hudec @ Fri Jul 08 said:


> gsilbers @ Fri Jul 08 said:
> 
> 
> > excuse my ignorance but what movies, scirpted tv shows or programs get scored using library music that its not a reality show, promo, cheap documentary (like the show "how its made" where a guy describes how a tennis raquet is made) or "live event"?
> ...




seems that music supervisor or producer got a bunch of money for themselves.
did that commercial make a difference on the product in your country?
if its memorable then they should buy the copyright to make that specific music a staple for that product.


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## vlado hudec (Jul 9, 2011)

gsilbers @ Sat Jul 09 said:


> so the producers hire a guy for original music but need library music for some cues as well?



It happens in my opinion, I saw a requests for some music cues for film addressed to library music company.

for instance, there is a scene in disco bar and director needs some disco music there, so he licence some track from library music company.


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## vlado hudec (Jul 9, 2011)

gsilbers @ Sat Jul 09 said:


> seems that music supervisor or producer got a bunch of money for themselves.
> did that commercial make a difference on the product in your country?
> if its memorable then they should buy the copyright to make that specific music a staple for that product.



for national and worldwide commercials campaings $20k is quite common, but you receive usually 50% and 50% goes for library music company.

I mean commercials in US territory, not my country.


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## Daryl (Jul 10, 2011)

impressions @ Thu Jul 07 said:


> hey,
> 
> just a thought, since most pieces there drown in their own sea of desperation to be heard, why send them at all?
> since alot of production companies use it, wouldn't be more wise of us freelance composers to save some market for ourselves instead of sending pieces for cheap prices and getting a really bad royalty from them, if any at all?


It depends on the library.



impressions @ Thu Jul 07 said:


> it's like we're the ones ruining the market for ourselves. if there weren't any music libraries, the production companies would have to look for freelance composers-and pay according to what *we* set for them.


Not going to happen. Even if it did, what makes you think that you would have any say in the fee that gets paid? You refuse to accept what's on offer, and some kid in their bedroom with Garageband will agree, so you've achieved nothing.




impressions @ Thu Jul 07 said:


> i think that loop is very self destructive and it should be stopped.


Why do you think that you're more entitled to work than a composer who works for a library company? It's not your work. It's just work. It would be more sensible to say that composers who use orchestral samples should be stopped because they are decimating the music profession for performers. Oh wait, you've already done that. :shock: 

D


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## Daryl (Jul 10, 2011)

midphase @ Thu Jul 07 said:


> I also (entering controversy) don't think that all composers are cut for original scoring. I know several composers who create beautiful compositions for libraries, but if you put them in front of a video clip and ask them to score it, they get totally lost.


True.

There are also composers who work in TV who can't write library music.
There are also composers who work in TV who can't write to picture.
There are also composers who work in TV who can't compose without reaching for other people's compositions in the form of loops and synth presets.
There are composers in library who can't write music. However, they earn nothing.....!

These days writing for library is not something that you can just dip in and out of and expect to make a living. I suspect that many people who whine about library music are just crying over the fact that they don't have enough work. However, there is nothing to say that their idea of work is any more legitimate than someone else's. I primarily write library music these days because:

1) I can set my own deadlines
2) I can set my own budget
3) I can work 9-6 on weekdays and have weekends off.
4) I can go on holiday whenever I like.

Most Film and TV composers I know are very jealous of my work pattern. I'm quite happy with it. :lol: 

D


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