# Anyone working in the industry? Watch this!



## midphase (Dec 11, 2008)

This is a must watch for anyone who calls themselves (or aspires to call themselves) a professional.

http://www.8164.org/pay-the-designer/

I think there's nobody as eloquent as Harlan to voice what many of us think...which is that we're fucking ourselves up!


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## Ethos (Dec 11, 2008)

Perfect.


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## Przemek K. (Dec 12, 2008)

Whoa, absolutely right he is about it. >8o


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## dkristian (Dec 12, 2008)

Harlan Ellison! Thanks for this.


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## Mihkel Zilmer (Dec 12, 2008)

I couldn't agree more.

I've lost a couple of jobs just because I was extremely forward about getting paid.
Being a young composer and working on semi-professional projects with modest
budgets I don't expect to get paid a fortune for my work and will settle for a reasonable salary. 
However I am providing a service and my time and skills 
aren't free to hire. A free preview of my material and methods is obviously more
than reasonable (even though I've been paid to do a couple of demo tracks
focusing on a specific style).

After mentioning getting paid some people never got back to me. They went and found
people who'd jump at the opportunity without ever questioning whether they 
should be paid or not. 

I've invested a lot of money in my education and tons of gear and software to provide a quality service. 
It's only fair I should be getting something back. Once when talking to a young director I brought this up and said:
"The only way I'm doing this for free is if you're willing to settle for a quick 
recording of me improvising on the piano. And I'm only offering this because I'm 
not a completely selfish and greedy person who is willing to help you out, but only to a certain point."
It's only natural to think of
self-preservation before anything else. And I'd very much like to pay my rent on time,
eat well, wear decent clothes and still have some money left over to invest in
furthering my career. 

All that said, there are always exceptions. But there'd better be a damn good reason!


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## schatzus (Dec 12, 2008)

I have seen this before but it is always worth seeing again. What he describes is so true and so prevalent. His emotions are something I am sure we all feel, he just actually articulates it well.
(Besides, he reminds me of Ray Liotta in "Goodfellas", F*&% You! Pay me!")


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## erockrazor (Dec 12, 2008)

Watching this was very surprising for me. Not because of his argument but because his argument is with Warner Brothers. I think it is understandable for a indie filmmaker with little to no budget to ask for a piece for free but I would never assume at that level of work, you'd still be getting asked to give it away. Warner Brothers may as well be wearing an eyepatch with a tin can because that's not how a company with that much clout should act.


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## RiffWraith (Dec 12, 2008)

_They wouldn't go for 5 seconds without getting paid, and they'll bitch about how much they are paid and want more._

Yup.


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## Niah (Dec 12, 2008)

Now I know how to answer to the people that want my services for free, i'll just send them this video...maybe this will get through their thick heads :twisted:


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## poseur (Dec 12, 2008)

beautiful.
horrifying.
the truth can be very, very ugly,
but
i hope that the truth doesn't make me
feel any uglier than i already do.
d


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## TheoKrueger (Dec 13, 2008)

Mihkel @ Sat Dec 13 said:


> However I am providing a service and my time and skills
> aren't free to hire.



Yeah man! Not to mention all the time and years away from humanity that it actually TOOK to develop the compositional/mixing/hearing/understanding skills. Its not like musical charisma grows in summertime... it must be tended to and cultivated every day to stay fresh and charming. Plus gear, plus experience.... they pay for the whole for the past experience as well.


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