# Afraid of composing?



## Casda123 (May 24, 2021)

Hi everyone. I would like to know if I'm alone with this problem. 

When I sit down to compose, I will often procrastinate, do something else like cleaning my room, going on youtube, etc. I feel like I'm "afraid" of the empty project. I don't know where to begin, so I avoid trying to make sure I don't "fail". Then I end up having so little projects, close to none because of that. 

Any way to "cure" this? Am I alone?...


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## easyrider (May 24, 2021)

Casda123 said:


> Hi everyone. I would like to know if I'm alone with this problem.
> 
> When I sit down to compose, I will often procrastinate, do something else like cleaning my room, going on youtube, etc. I feel like I'm "afraid" of the empty project. I don't know where to begin, so I avoid trying to make sure I don't "fail". Then I end up having so little projects, close to none because of that.
> 
> Any way to "cure" this? Am I alone?...


Just do it!


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## jazzman7 (May 24, 2021)

It's an easy feeling to have crop up. As Churchill liked to say, KBO. Keep Buggering On!


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## Double Helix (May 24, 2021)

*You are not alone, @Casda123, but being "afraid" of doing *anything* is a human condition--we'd rather disassociate from the task at hand (where there is a chance of failing to meet our own expectations) than "just do it"



* I remember reading an interview with actor Jeff Bridges--this was decades ago--who said that sometimes he would jog on the beach at Malibu at sunset. He was alone, literally no one in sight, so he would try to close his eyes as he ran. But he'd imagine that an iron bar had manifested right in front of his face--he'd snap his eyes back open, only to see nothing (but "amethyst distance" iirc). He tried repeatedly, but the iron bar would continue to block his path.
Of course there was nothing there. It was (obviously) his imagination.
We all have our own iron bar, @Casda123; even Jeff Bridges. Even Double Helix. Our barriers are self imposed.
Courage!
Onward!


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## proxima (May 24, 2021)

You're not alone. 

I envy those new composers who get into a state of flow and have an insatiable appetite, spending countless hours composing. I don't know how common that is, but it sure isn't/wasn't me. 

Instead, it's much easier to get into a trap of "I need to learn X", or "I need to buy Y". Or being disappointed by what you write, because you know it doesn't sound as good as the music you hear and want to sound like. At some point, for hobbyists at least, it starts to feel like "is this even the right hobby for me?" 

I hope people fill this thread with helpful tips; know that many, maybe even most of them won't work for you. But hopefully a few will. With that said, here's my list:

1. Force yourself to spend X minutes composing. Set aside your phone. Maybe even change your location away from where you usually watch things. Don't get greedy here and set X too high. Start small, 15, 30 minutes. 

2. Try to spend more of your non-composing free time immersed in something that will aid composing. Practice your instrument (or learn one if you have none!). Learn theory applicable to the genre you want.

3. Carefully listen to music you want to sound like. Take detailed notes, like when instruments come in, what they're doing. Later, you can try using those notes as a template for writing something that follows the style, but changes the substance entirely.

4. Mock up small sections of music you like. It'll be harder than you think. Start small, even a few bars. 

4b. Bonus points for doing it without the score. Then you're transcribing and mocking up. For orchestral work, I find this really hard and prefer to start with the score of music that's out of copyright.

5. Commit yourself to submit to some sort of contest. Don't expect to do well, just commit to submitting. Deadlilnes focus the mind.

6. Buy the _right_ courses. General courses will teach you lots of theory and give you general tools (or specific knowledge of specific tools), but they won't inspire most people to actually write. Instead, have a look at courses like Thinkspace Education's How to Write Music or Orchestration Recipes. 

7. Don't be too hard on yourself. Assuming that you're in this as a hobby, know that there are lots of ways you can spend your time on it that aren't directly composing, but are fun. Maybe you'll find that designing synth patches is more fun, or recording sounds and mangling them into something new.


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## Casda123 (May 24, 2021)

Thank you all for you replies, I really appreciate it. 

@proxima I will try these, Thank you very much!


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## Mark Stothard (May 24, 2021)

Some excellent points from proxima.

One thing I do, is import a track I like and want to sound/compose similar to. Work out the tempo, then the chords, then the structure. I find just by doing this, I get a lot of inspiration to create something new.

p.s. Disconnect your computer from the internet, it’s too easy to get distracted when online.


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## Barrel Maker (May 24, 2021)

You're not alone. I used to do the same thing, but my form of procrastination was studying. I thought "you can't be a composer until you've read (fill in the blank author's book) or studied (fill in the blank composer's score)." It wasn't until I realized that the only thing worse than a composer who writes bad music, is a composer who writes no music that I felt comfortable. Deadlines helped too  

I think many of us fell in love with music simply because of its beauty and the joy that creating it provides. Try to focus more on that and less on any self-imposed pressure. Sometimes having fun and enjoying the process require a conscientious effort.


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## reborn579 (May 24, 2021)

even hans zimmer feels this way, as he said in many interviews. i think procrastinating is part of the creative process. for me, most of my creative moments happen while i'm away from the studio.
if you can't find a theme or a melody line or a place to start, just start with anything really. even a few basic notes and chords will give you a base to work on.


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## bill5 (May 24, 2021)

Casda123 said:


> Hi everyone. I would like to know if I'm alone with this problem.
> 
> When I sit down to compose, I will often procrastinate, do something else like cleaning my room, going on youtube, etc. I feel like I'm "afraid" of the empty project. I don't know where to begin, so I avoid trying to make sure I don't "fail". Then I end up having so little projects, close to none because of that.
> 
> Any way to "cure" this? Am I alone?...


Of course not...

As for courses of action, that I think depends first and foremost on whether this is a hobby/something you're doing mostly if not entirely for yourself, or something you're trying to make money out of. If the former, then I respectfully disagree with trying to force it. I've found that almost all of my ideas and the bulk of my overall material came to me out of nowhere when I wasn't "trying to write," which IMO is diametrically opposed to the creative process. This isn't like building a model plane or planting a tree, with clearly defined steps that if everyone does will end up with the same result. It's art. Generally speaking, IMO it can't be forced. It will appear when it damn well feels like it.  Plus forcing myself to write I found...sucks. This is supposed to be something I enjoy, not a chore.

I'm not saying you can't or shouldn't work at it. I think it's extremely rare for an entire song to just pop outta nowhere and no "work" is required (it's happened to me a few times, lucky me, but I question if it will ever happen again). Just that the heart or gist of it, at least for me, is that unexplainable stream of consciousness thing...but once I had something, I did have to work at it. That was OK though, because the main work was there, it just needed fine tuning or another stanza or whatever, so I did not feel overwhelmed; I had something to work with vs a blank sheet of paper. 

This also can vary according to genre. I wouldn't approach composing symphonies the same way that I'd approach writing a pop song. etc


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## timprebble (May 24, 2021)

It's worth noting, you can use procrastination to get other things done. For example I don't really enjoy doing my accounting, and I also don't enjoy cleaning the bathroom. So when it's time to do my taxes I also tend to end up with a sparkling clean bathroom because I give myself a deadline to do the accounts and if I am going to procrastinate on them then the only other option I allow myself is to go do the cleaning instead. This idea is partly borrowed from a quote: 

_"There is a state of mind that means being open to anything and trying to be extremely vulnerable to things. I try to know nothing, to be simple, curious and open. And I try not to be clever. That's the state of mind. And you can't always get into that. If you are feeling frazzled or preoccupied you won't make it. So I don't try. If I know I'm feeling like that, I'll scrub the floor instead"_
Laurie Anderson

Having said that, often my best work comes from working & action. Trying something & failing often leads to a better direction, or a direction I could not see until I tried the first one. Sometimes deliberately doing the wrong thing can make the right thing far clearer eg if you don't feel confident making the brilliant music that you dream of, make some really bad generic crud, and while no one will ever hear that crud, I bet you will find something in the process of making it that will lead you in an interesting direction, because the contrast is so clear.

For film projects, I think it was Randy Thom who said that experimenting costs the least early in the schedule. That is the best time to try every angle, try things on a whim without worrying about the outcome... Focusing too much on the end result before you even have the start, can lead to paralysis...


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## toddkreuz (May 24, 2021)

i write in my head all day long. I only turn on the computer when i have something i feel
is worth messing with. Which is not often lately.


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## David Kudell (May 24, 2021)

What helped me in the past is I set a goal to write 30 seconds of music every day. This allowed me to try a new idea, play with a new style, try a new instrument, and it's not a daunting task...it's only 30 seconds. You don't have to make it perfect either, it's just a sketch and exercises your composing muscles. 

When you're done with your 30 sec sketch that day, export it and add it to a playlist on your phone. Soon you'll start to have a little collection of sketches which will give you a sense of accomplishment. You'll be amazed at how much you learn. Then it will be much easier to work on a longer track, since you're basically just making a longer sketch.


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## toddkreuz (May 24, 2021)

David Kudell said:


> What helped me in the past is I set a goal to write 30 seconds of music every day. This allowed me to try a new idea, play with a new style, try a new instrument, and it's not a daunting task...it's only 30 seconds. You don't have to make it perfect either, it's just a sketch and exercises your composing muscles.
> 
> When you're done with your 30 sec sketch that day, export it and add it to a playlist on your phone. Soon you'll start to have a little collection of sketches which will give you a sense of accomplishment. You'll be amazed at how much you learn. Then it will be much easier to work on a longer track, since you're basically just making a longer sketch.


Excellent tip!


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## Alex Fraser (May 25, 2021)

To the OP - I don't think you're alone with this problem at all. Read between the lines across the forum, and you'll see that many people are procrastinating and avoiding writing music in one way or another. Finding "problems" where there are none, endlessly "tweaking the template." We all do it.

I mean, come on - I'm supposed to be writing some music *right now* yet here I am pontificating away in yet another thread.


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## gamma-ut (May 25, 2021)

Casda123 said:


> Hi everyone. I would like to know if I'm alone with this problem.
> 
> When I sit down to compose, I will often procrastinate, do something else like cleaning my room, going on youtube, etc. I feel like I'm "afraid" of the empty project. I don't know where to begin, so I avoid trying to make sure I don't "fail". Then I end up having so little projects, close to none because of that.
> 
> Any way to "cure" this? Am I alone?...


Yes, it happens in all forms of art.

There are two main remedies (with some refinements for the first one):

1) Treat things as "practice" and "exercises" to avoid the feeling you're creating something precious. If it isn't really working, you can edit it later.

1a) Use arbitrary restrictions to come up with things that are short and use some more arbitrary restrictions to develop themes etc. But be prepared to ditch the restrictions if you find them getting in the way. You may get blocked at certain points - make a note (see below) of what you think needs to happen even if it's "some magic needs to happen here" and move on past the blocking point.

2) For blank-page syndrome specifically: keep notes. Every time you have an idea for something, anything while you're doing something else, note it down (or record it - humming etc, maybe just outline a feeling). Instead of a blank page, you now have starting points. Pick one.


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## chrisr (May 25, 2021)

Get a gig. When you are working to someone else's deadline believe me the juices flow.


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## newbreednet (May 25, 2021)

Perfection, and striving only for this, is a great cause of procrastination; it's easier to do nothing and not face the pain of failing to achieve greatness.

Aim instead to make the most terrible music imaginable. Truly awful. Something that would offend your mother.


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## easyrider (May 25, 2021)

David Kudell said:


> What helped me in the past is I set a goal to write 30 seconds of music every day. This allowed me to try a new idea, play with a new style, try a new instrument, and it's not a daunting task...it's only 30 seconds. You don't have to make it perfect either, it's just a sketch and exercises your composing muscles.
> 
> When you're done with your 30 sec sketch that day, export it and add it to a playlist on your phone. Soon you'll start to have a little collection of sketches which will give you a sense of accomplishment. You'll be amazed at how much you learn. Then it will be much easier to work on a longer track, since you're basically just making a longer sketch.


I taketh your tip with aplomb. 😎


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## Laurin Lenschow (May 25, 2021)

Casda123 said:


> When I sit down to compose, I will often procrastinate, do something else like cleaning my room, going on youtube, etc. I avoid trying to make sure I don't "fail".


I find this very interesting because I am struggeling with the exact same problem in a different field of creativity. I have never had an issue with procrastination when it came to composing, but I do experience this when I am working on my novel. The interesting thing is that I am (at least according to my own perception of my work) not particularly great in any of these fields (yet), so this does not correlate to how skilled you actually are. 
The only difference between writing stories and writing music is that I am more serious about my stories than I am about my compositions. I aim to become a professional writer (I'm 19) and what I am working on is hopefully going to be my debut novel. But even when I force myself to work on it I outline and outline and outline, avoiding the process of actually writing something "readable".
Writing music on the other hand always was nothing but a "fun hobby" to me and I have never seriously considered it becoming more than that. I guess that's why I feel more comfortable with making mistakes when I am composing than when I am writing stories.


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## youngpokie (May 25, 2021)

Casda123 said:


> When I sit down to compose, I will often procrastinate, do something else like cleaning my room, going on youtube, etc. I feel like I'm "afraid" of the empty project. I don't know where to begin, so I avoid trying to make sure I don't "fail". Then I end up having so little projects, close to none because of that.


Look at the words you're using: "empty project", "where to begin", "avoid trying", "don't fail". I think "where to begin" is the most critical bottleneck, because you likely just sit around waiting for inspiration to strike. And there's a lot of good advice here about facilitating inspiration/flow.

My suggestion is to focus on something else - create a routine that you can follow anytime and in any state of mind, with or without inspiration. Set a goal of composing: (a) a total of 16 bars of music, built up from 4 bar segments and (b) ending on a tonic chord.

- Thinking in bars will make you see your melody as segments which can repeat up to 3 times with or without variation. And 16 bars can vary a lot in duration depending on tempo
- Thinking in final tonic chord will prompt you to follow some chord progression with an ending. It will sound "completed" and you'll avoid meaningless wandering from chord to chord.

The most primitive example of this workflow:

1. Create a snippet of a melody. The first melodic segment that comes to mind, it really doesn't matter what it is. Put it into a 4 bar MIDI part
2. Copy this MIDI part 3 times and then insert an empty 4 bar segment in second to last spot. You'll have a total of 16 bars. Find the tonic chord for your melody and put it at end of the 16 bars.
3. Now you have a melodic segment that repeats identically 3 times. Make some variations in these repetitions, such as note length or interval. And fill up the chords that sound OK throughout the sequence. That's it. All that's left is a contrasting melodic segment + chords in MIDI part #3.

The only goal is to finish the 16 bar sequence in every session. You can dedicate the next session to refining this one or to a brand new 16 bar sequence.

If you internalize this routine, I promise you the following will happen:
- you will become faster, more confident and try more daring kinds of melodic/harmonic variations
- your overall 16 bars will sound better and more interesting
- you will start imagining melodic/harmonic variations and that's the moment when inspiration comes


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## el-bo (May 25, 2021)

jazzman7 said:


> As Churchill liked to say, KBO. Keep Buggering On!


Given the etymology of that word, along with the reputation of the old British public-schooling system, I'd suggest perhaps not advising people to "Keep Buggering" anything


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## Montisquirrel (May 25, 2021)




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## Mike Fox (May 25, 2021)

Accept that you fail, time and time again. Also accept that failure is necessary for growth and success. You can’t have one without the other.

Also, it might help to not think of it as composing, but to rather think of it as just a way to have fun.

Some of my favorite guitar riffs I’ve written came about when i was just noodling and enjoying the instrument, and not having the preconceived notion that i “need to write something”. That kind of self pressure and expectation never works for me.


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## cmillar (May 25, 2021)

Know what you're going through....many times over!

But, I find the best 'proscrastination-killer' is an actual deadline, as posted by 'chrisr'.

It's the same as when setting up a rehearsal with fellow musicians. A looming rehearsal or performance date makes everything else totally unimportant! 

Of, go visit your local art gallery and try to get inspired by something you see that makes you want to get back home and try to put your thoughts into musical form.

Hey...maybe you need to try a different blend of coffee? LOL


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## GNP (May 25, 2021)

Play a note. Followed by another. Rearrange, edit, the notes to your liking. Repeat.

Before you know it, your canvas will be filled up!


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## bill5 (May 25, 2021)

newbreednet said:


> Perfection, and striving only for this, is a great cause of procrastination; it's easier to do nothing and not face the pain of failing to achieve greatness.


Agree.




> Aim instead to make the most terrible music imaginable. Truly awful. Something that would offend your mother.


Disagree. Emphatically.  It's great to keep expectations reasonable, but why on Earth would you try to make something that you don't want to make?


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## PedroPH (May 25, 2021)

Maybe you shouldn't wait until you are sitting in front of your computer to start composing. Compose in your head whenever you can: in the shower, while exercising, while waiting in line at the supermarket, etc. Try to make it something active, i.e. not just coming up with a melody. Try to develop it in your mind. If you're afraid of forgetting it, record it in your phone by whistling or humming. Then listen to it some other day, and try to develop it. Then, when you sit in front of your computer, you will always have something to do. At the very least, you have a melody or some idea to sequence.


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## newbreednet (May 25, 2021)

bill5 said:


> Agree.
> 
> 
> 
> Disagree. Emphatically.  It's great to keep expectations reasonable, but why on Earth would you try to make something that you don't want to make?


Before I had a DAW, I would record my songwriting demos with a guitar and a vocal onto cassettes. I called them "sick tapes", and they were basically me just pressing record and then vomiting (not literally) out whatever came to me. Often it was very weird and/or just a channelling of whatever emotion I was needing to express at the time. My point (perhaps poorly worded, and intended to be humourous) was that sometimes making something "awful" gets the wheels greased and the gears into action, eventually leading to something better being produced.

edit: I know this thread is about composing not songwriting but I wondered if the same principles would apply


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## newbreednet (May 25, 2021)

PedroPH said:


> Maybe you shouldn't wait until you are sitting in front of your computer to start composing. Compose in your head whenever you can: in the shower, while exercising, while waiting in line at the supermarket, etc. Try to make it something active, i.e. not just coming up with a melody. Try to develop it in your mind. If you're afraid of forgetting it, record it in your phone by whistling or humming. Then listen to it some other day, and try to develop it. Then, when you sit in front of your computer, you will always have something to do. At the very least, you have a melody or some idea to sequence.


this too. I read "The Complete Idiot's Guide to Songwriting" by Joel Hirschhorn when I was a younger pup, and one thing he said was to make songwriting a HABIT. And it's true. With repeated practice, one can end up hearing internal music in the most unexpected environments. Then it's voice memos app to the rescue!


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## el-bo (May 25, 2021)

newbreednet said:


> I wondered if the same principles would apply


I imagine the same thing applies to any creative art. For a writer, an empty page me seem just as foreboding. Perhaps more so, given that a writer doesn't have a ton of different instruments from which inspiration can be drawn.


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## newbreednet (May 25, 2021)

bill5 said:


> why on Earth would you try to make something that you don't want to make?


another thing I remember reading someone say was "I never get writers' block - there are just some times when I'm writing bad music".

Again, this alludes to what I was getting at. I think a lot of the things I've written I didn't "want" to write. Often I would listen back and be quite ashamed of them. But as the years go by I look back on some silly songs and treasure them, because they were all part of the process.


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## Alex Fraser (May 25, 2021)

As someone else already suggested, a deadline definitely helps.

But really, it all boils down to just *starting* and putting one note after the other. Personally, I’ve always found that if I start thinking about *how* I’m going to approach writing, all I do is end up refining and questioning the *how* itself. 

It that makes any sense, whatsoever.


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## newbreednet (May 25, 2021)

Casda123 said:


> Hi everyone. I would like to know if I'm alone with this problem.
> 
> When I sit down to compose, I will often procrastinate, do something else like cleaning my room, going on youtube, etc. I feel like I'm "afraid" of the empty project. I don't know where to begin, so I avoid trying to make sure I don't "fail". Then I end up having so little projects, close to none because of that.
> 
> Any way to "cure" this? Am I alone?...


do you have what we could call a "base" instrument? something you are comfortable with. for example, piano or guitar. Starting out by sitting in front of a fully-loaded orchestral template with all the empty track regions could be scary. But sitting with a familiar instrument and getting something down as an idea might help to get things going. Afterwards, you can then orchestrate around the initial idea.


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## NeonMediaKJT (May 25, 2021)

Every single time. Even when I'm feeling inspired. It comes eventually...


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## LamaRose (May 25, 2021)

David Kudell said:


> What helped me in the past is I set a goal to write 30 seconds of music every day. This allowed me to try a new idea, play with a new style, try a new instrument, and it's not a daunting task...it's only 30 seconds. You don't have to make it perfect either, it's just a sketch and exercises your composing muscles.


I'm a master of the 30 seconds, slave to the finished product.

To the OP, crank some music/tunes that get your juices moving... the stuff that got you into this "mess" in the first place. Don't worry about writing anything, just allow the dream and passion to be born again.


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## GtrString (May 25, 2021)

It’s thE most problem for creatives of all kind, getting started. Someone said that you just put yourself there and wait.. untill the blood drips from your forehead!

I’ve found a way having several projects going at any one time, so I can use another project as procrastination. That way I get a little bit done every day, at least.


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## David Kudell (May 25, 2021)

Bears mentioning I’ve talked to at least one composer who has worked on some big shows and they find it more difficult to write unless they have picture to score to. I think it’s a lot harder with a blank slate than having something to write to.


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## Farkle (May 25, 2021)

Casda123 said:


> Hi everyone. I would like to know if I'm alone with this problem.
> 
> When I sit down to compose, I will often procrastinate, do something else like cleaning my room, going on youtube, etc. I feel like I'm "afraid" of the empty project. I don't know where to begin, so I avoid trying to make sure I don't "fail". Then I end up having so little projects, close to none because of that.
> 
> Any way to "cure" this? Am I alone?...


I talk exactly about this on this Farkle Friday... Generating a 2 Bar Idea. Check it out, might help...


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## Johnny (May 25, 2021)

Write one little motif, once a day- every day! (This will beat your fears!) The only fear is sitting down and investing 100's of hours into a composition only to be disappointed with your ability, and feeling that you are a failure as a result of your lack of talent- fear is ego. Nothing more...) I write a two part piano motif once a day- melody and chords. Stuff it on a hard drive somewhere in the darkest corner of your desktop! That way if you ever do take on gigs and are afraid to you will get writer's block and have nothing to compose? You can sift through 365 motifs from the last year of not writing a full piece of music! Next: write anything once in a while when you are inspired, (more than just piano motifs) if you don't finish it?! Put it down for a long while. I have written songs 8 years ago where I dived back into the session, (After 8 years) finished them, only to be 1000% happier than I was when I gave up on the idea years prior  Sometimes some ideas just need to cook for a long while, and when inspiration finally comes back? You'd be surprised in the level of quality and fresh input that will come back to those original ideas, after you give them some time and some rest : ) Just my thoughts, this works me and my work flow. Also take on projects when you don't really want to! (Seems counterintuitive right?) Nothing will inspire you/me/composers to write better, faster and with fluid channeling of new ideas, further raising your personal growth, than deadlines! Deadlines force you into a creative state where sometimes that little fear of failure with a deadline is all you really need to do the best work that you've ever done in your entire life!! (I can almost guarantee!) Time pending and expectations of your abilities are a construct of course- within reason and realistic limitations in what you feel that you can physically output. I'm not saying you cannot raise your own bar and surprise yourself, but I wouldn't expect you to write a 60 minute Williams suite if you have only ever written 8bit, retro indie game scores using Famitracker. But you will write and push yourself to your fullest potential if there is a mild consequence forcing you to exceed your limits  So if you can, set a deadline, hopefully it is towards a paying gig! And you'll break that block of creativity and if not? That's ok too! I often tell myself: I'd rather go to bed at night with my head on my pillow, feeling like a failure, and that I can always do better next time, but at least I tried my best! Than going to bed feeling the personal emptiness of not having tried at all  Hope this helps  Best of luck!


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## borisb2 (May 25, 2021)

Farkle said:


> I talk exactly about this on this Farkle Friday... Generating a 2 Bar Idea. Check it out, might help...


Awesome Video!

.. quoting your video (at 1h:07) " thats moving more into how to develop an idea ..." .. I would be interested if you did that Farkle friday as well?


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## Farkle (May 26, 2021)

borisb2 said:


> Awesome Video!
> 
> .. quoting your video (at 1h:07) " thats moving more into how to develop an idea ..." .. I would be interested if you did that Farkle friday as well?


Ask and ye shall receive!!


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## borisb2 (May 26, 2021)

Farkle said:


> Ask and ye shall receive!!



this is really good stuff Mike! .. especially the first one (on identifying and building themes) goes already in the first 27 minutes WAY beyond what Verta is communicating in his 4 hour ranting-session


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## Nate Johnson (May 27, 2021)

I struggled with this for years. What finally snapped me out of it were two things: composing to deadline and writing what I _wanted_ to write. It's soooo easy to think the music you're _trying_ to write is actually the music you _want_ to write. Lots of external (and perceived) societal expectations can subconsciously direct us away from our actual passion. 

I was 'stuck' writing short loops. You can find every YouTuber under the sun with a video suggesting tips and tricks to get out of the 'habit' - this is of course implying that it's a _bad_ thing to only write short loops! One day I decided to say 'fuck it' and embrace my 'shortcoming.' I focused on layering and duplicating my loops to play longer. I experimented with what really gets me excited, timbre and texture, instead of the notes and rhythms themselves. I had a few 'eureka' moments, experimenting this way, and was all of a sudden cranking out tracks. Concurrently, I stumbled across and joined an internet group with a similar mindset that also released group albums, thus creating some simple deadlines to adhere to; some actual responsibility to others to finish musical ideas. 

I've spent over a year with these notions, and I've found I now have the ability to more easily switch gears into writing other styles of music I enjoy, and like most people on this planet musical or not, can easily enjoy and understand (surprise - no matter how important I think purely experimental music is, not many people outside of other musicians truly give a shit.) Currently working on an album full of notes and rhythms organized in a somewhat 'traditional' way - and loving every second of it!

P.S. - oh yeah, and having a kid kinda forces you to look at your 'free' time a little differently - I disciplined myself to wake up a 4am (before everyone else) every.single.day. to have the quiet I need to focus on composing. About 2 hours later everyone's up; play time is over - THERE'S a deadline for ya right there!


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## Daniel James (May 27, 2021)

Casda123 said:


> Hi everyone. I would like to know if I'm alone with this problem.
> 
> When I sit down to compose, I will often procrastinate, do something else like cleaning my room, going on youtube, etc. I feel like I'm "afraid" of the empty project. I don't know where to begin, so I avoid trying to make sure I don't "fail". Then I end up having so little projects, close to none because of that.
> 
> Any way to "cure" this? Am I alone?...


You have two parts of your brain. Creative and Technical. It sounds like you are trying to lean onto the creative before you are ready. Try just putting something. Anything. A bunch of chords, some loops. Then sit back and be really judgemental. Ok this sounds shit, or this doesn't work. WHY?

In the process of figuring out a why your creative brain will wake up like the lazy bastard it is and will be like 'hol up, I got an idea on how to make that better'. Then once you start answering a bunch of whys you can invite the flow state, where your mind gets hooked on answering all these little puzzles.

But yeah if it seems intimidating, just allow yourself to be as shit as you need to be, so that you can then begin to correct yourself. 

It works for me, but I feel your pain mate. Blank pages suck.

-DJ


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## Arbee (May 27, 2021)

Daniel James said:


> In the process of figuring out a why your creative brain will wake up like the lazy bastard it is and will be like 'hol up, I got an idea on how to make that better'. Then once you start answering a bunch of whys you can invite the flow state, where your mind gets hooked on answering all these little puzzles.
> 
> But yeah if it seems intimidating, just allow yourself to be as shit as you need to be, so that you can then begin to correct yourself.
> 
> ...


This is such a gem of wisdom imho, create a puzzle quickly with one part of your brain, then engage the analyst to pull it apart and solve it. I always had the feeling that Beethoven's fifth is a perfect example of this process the way the opening motif unpacks and develops.


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## jbuhler (May 28, 2021)

when I‘m stuck like this, I take out a new library or one I haven’t used in awhile and open it in a standalone app (I.e, not the DAW) and I just start noodling around in spirit of exploration. inevitably I’ll stumble onto something interesting.

Sometimes I use something like a Sonokinetic library or The Orchestra as a cue starter. Multies in the Symphobia series also work well for this. You could use something like @PhilipJohnston’s Orchestration Recipes similarly. When all else fails you can use the old trick of beginning composition lessons and construct yourself a little set of pitches and then work at shaping those into a varied set of short melodies or motifs.

also a real looming deadline always seems to stimulate the creativity.


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## Megreen (Jun 3, 2021)

If you need encouragement from random people on the internet to do something,
then you shouldn't be doing it.

The basis for everything is that a person has an interest and has that inner drive to do
something and some internet encouragement brigade can't help you with that,
it's a waste of time.


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## youngpokie (Jun 3, 2021)

Megreen said:


> If you need encouragement from random people on the internet to do something,
> then you shouldn't be doing it.
> 
> The basis for everything is that a person has an interest and has that inner drive to do
> ...


The OP wasn't asking for encouragement. And probably not for the patronizing judgmental comments like yours either...


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## AkashicBird (Jun 3, 2021)

I don't try to compose. I just load a preset or take an instrument and play random stuff until something interesting comes up. 
After I've recorded a bunch of random ideas, I select the nice parts and start building around it with other instruments.
Don't burden yourself with the task of composing. Just play with and instrument or mood in mind and assemble the pieces after a freetyle session.


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## Jackdnp121 (Jun 3, 2021)

enjoy the process , accept who you are and Have fun . all the best


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## Megreen (Jun 4, 2021)

youngpokie said:


> The OP wasn't asking for encouragement.


Yeah......



youngpokie said:


> And probably not for the patronizing judgmental comments like yours either...


ok....


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## mscp (Jun 4, 2021)

Casda123 said:


> Hi everyone. I would like to know if I'm alone with this problem.
> 
> When I sit down to compose, I will often procrastinate, do something else like cleaning my room, going on youtube, etc. I feel like I'm "afraid" of the empty project. I don't know where to begin, so I avoid trying to make sure I don't "fail". Then I end up having so little projects, close to none because of that.
> 
> Any way to "cure" this? Am I alone?...


Trying to make sure you don't fail is already failing, because you're not even trying.

Write snippets. Then see what you like. Turn those into bigger things...until...ta-da!


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## Smikes77 (Jun 4, 2021)

Casda123 said:


> Hi everyone. I would like to know if I'm alone with this problem.
> 
> When I sit down to compose, I will often procrastinate, do something else like cleaning my room, going on youtube, etc. I feel like I'm "afraid" of the empty project. I don't know where to begin, so I avoid trying to make sure I don't "fail". Then I end up having so little projects, close to none because of that.
> 
> Any way to "cure" this? Am I alone?...


I'll paraphrase what Larry David once said when asked about another Curb Your Enthusiasm Season. He would respond with "I don`t know, ask me next year". He said that he finds writing so hard and so daunting that he would rather do anything else in order to put it off. And he's at the *top *of the tree. 

No you aren`t alone.


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## borisb2 (Jun 4, 2021)

But why is that exactly? Why do we (incl myself) try to procastinate the hell out of our time (please don’t make me write something), and when the piece is done we do think (hopefully mostly at least) ”that was a rather nice experience, I did enjoy writing that piece” .. why can’t we be more efficient with our time in the the first place - and write twice the amount of music? Or more ...


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## gamma-ut (Jun 4, 2021)

Phil81 said:


> Trying to make sure you don't fail is already failing, because you're not even trying.


That makes absolutely no sense unless you’re working with a different definition of “trying” to most of the population.


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## Smikes77 (Jun 5, 2021)

borisb2 said:


> But why is that exactly? Why do we (incl myself) try to procastinate the hell out of our time (please don’t make me write something), and when the piece is done we do think (hopefully mostly at least) ”that was a rather nice experience, I did enjoy writing that piece” .. why can’t we be more efficient with our time in the the first place - and write twice the amount of music? Or more ...


That’s true. But I wonder if we thought about the difference between a good chef and a good musician. You see them on TV, ‘mmm, that smells great, look at the colour on that, mmm, tastes delicious’. I rarely hear a musician say ‘wow, did you see how I got from A minor to F minor, it was brilliant, and did you hear how well that was articulated? Paradise for the ears’.
Most of our stuff ends up on the cutting room floor.


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## HotCoffee (Jun 5, 2021)

Ah, perfectionism. The bane of my (and many others) existence. There are some great advice in this thread already, but here are some that I try to follow:

*Do your best to throw out perfectionism*
Perfectionism is the perfect assassin of creativity. It's also really hard to get rid of, but you have no option here. It must go, one way or the other. If you are lacking own ideas, pick a (non complex) composition that you really like and try to mock it up. This will ease up your initial creative burden and might spark up some own ideas. If nothing else, at least you did something productive, which helps boost confidence. As @Mike Fox put it: `Accept that you fail, time and time again. Also accept that failure is necessary for growth and success. You can’t have one without the other.` There is a reason that this notion is in virtually every book about personal growth.

*Limit your toolset*
Until you master the ability to throttle your perfectionism, limit yourself to your very favorite libraries. If you're anything like me, too many options will only stand in your way and raise too many questions.

*Create a simple writing template*
This could be only a piano, or at most 5-6 tracks of bare essentials. The template should be ready to go, that is, reverbs, mic positions etc should already be set up. You don't want to focus on technical stuff when you are trying to write.

*Invest in education rather than new libraries*
A common trap is thinking that buying new libraries will further your composition skills or somehow automagically dish out solid productions. While it might be true that new libraries can be inspirational, too many options, as suggested above, will likely only stand in your way, and now you have even more libraries to learn.


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## mybadmemory (Jun 5, 2021)

I think in any creative area, art, music, writing, there will be people that like the actual creation, and there will be people that like the idea of the creation, or the idea of themselves as creators, more than the actual creation itself.

Those that truly love the actual creation don’t tend to worry as much about tools or setup, but rather just do it with whatever they have lying around, since they don’t have much preconceived notion on what the creation “should be like”. 

The other group tend to obsess over reading up on anatomy, perfecting their template, the typewriter that Hemingway used, and so on. The tools and setup is equally as, or even more, important than the creation itself. 

Obviously both are perfectly adequate things to do with your time, so no judgement. I also believe both roads can lead to accomplishment and success, it’s just two different ways of getting drawn in.


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## HotCoffee (Jun 5, 2021)

mybadmemory said:


> I think in any creative area, art, music, writing, there will be people that like the actual creation, and there will be people that like the idea of the creation, or the idea of themselves as creators, more than the actual creation itself.
> 
> Those that truly love the actual creation don’t tend to worry as much about tools or setup, but rather just do it with whatever they have lying around, since they don’t have much preconceived notion on what the creation “should be like”.
> 
> ...


I completely agree in general. I myself clearly fall into the latter category at this point, since for some reason I'm stuck trying to figure out how to do things "by the book". I just recently realized that I have to more or less start from scratch and work from the other end, that is, focus on creativity, and the technicals and best practices will likely come automatically over time.


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## mscp (Jun 5, 2021)

gamma-ut said:


> That makes absolutely no sense unless you’re working with a different definition of “trying” to most of the population.


Your command of the English language is terrific, though your post needs to be proofread too. You don't omit the pronoun "you" in an imperative sentence because you assume others are too thick to understand what the subject is, do you? lol.

Analyse the overall context before shitposting. It works 2 out of 3 times.


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## gamma-ut (Jun 5, 2021)

Phil81 said:


> Analyse the overall context before shitposting. It works 2 out of 3 times.


That is excellent advice that you might wish to consider.


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## mscp (Jun 5, 2021)

gamma-ut said:


> That is excellent advice that you might wish to consider.


I didn't attack the OP. I provided him with a thought - unlike you, who wasted someone's time with a personal jab (shit post). Your lack of comprehension skills is not my fault. I will stop replying just so you know. If you have an issue with me personally, PM.


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## gamma-ut (Jun 5, 2021)

"Trying to make sure you don't fail is already failing, because you're not even trying."

...to me looks a lot like a personal jab to the OP. I don't think they meant to imply they had got absolutely nowhere but that they face the not uncommon issue of feeling that they aren't going to do something good enough and so find it hard to get started. I can accept maybe there's some ambiguity there and you actually meant "not trying is the real failure" or some such but it really came across as you making a grand assumption of what the OP hadn't done.

Also, maybe you should stop taking things personally.


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## Markrs (Jun 5, 2021)

gamma-ut said:


> Also, maybe you should stop taking things personally.


I find most times people disagree on here it is normally just a misunderstanding. After all, text can be a very limited format for communication.

I also think the OP's question about fear of composing is an important one, one that I often suffer from. It is the same fear with most creative things including drawing and writing.


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## gamma-ut (Jun 5, 2021)

Markrs said:


> I also think the OP's question about fear of composing is an important one, one that I often suffer from. It is the same fear with most creative things including drawing and writing.


I entirely agree. Whether it's as imposter syndrome or various other symptoms. There are quite a few handy tips in this thread now - the ones I suggested tend to focus on tricking the brain into being productive by poking the problem-solving bits but there are numerous ways to get there.

The other one is decision paralysis. Is this any good? Does this work? Would something else work better? That's where artificial restrictions and Oblique Strategies can often work wonders. Or simply developing the theme, classical stylee: which is good practice either way.


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## el-bo (Jun 5, 2021)

Markrs said:


> I find most times people disagree on here it is normally just a misunderstanding.


Yup! The op has a fear of composting, yet people are squabbling about music-making and grammar


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## gamma-ut (Jun 5, 2021)

el-bo said:


> Yup! The op has a fear of composting, yet people are squabbling about music-making and grammar


Give your garden that little extra with some ex-composers...


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## Hadrondrift (Jun 5, 2021)

Markrs said:


> the same fear with most creative things


I think so too. That's why I believe that the tips that come from other areas of creativity are also applicable to the case of composing.

Here are some examples, funnily enough extracted from a book called "The Basics of Essay Writing":

Practice: don't just read about it.
Everyone finds excuses not to be creative.
Do something rather than nothing.
Less than perfect can be good enough.
<Composing/Writing> just a few <notes/words> can get you started.
Concentrate only on what is strictly relevant to your current idea/project.
Don't waste your time surfing the Internet; use it wisely.
...
For me (hobbyist), my biggest problem is that I don't finish things. Often I have a new idea that doesn't fit the current project, then I start a new project with that idea. Often I don't go back to older unfinished projects for weeks, if ever....

I think probably every creative person has problems getting things done from time to time. It is helpful to admit them honestly and not to think of them as personal individual weaknesses.


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## gamma-ut (Jun 5, 2021)

Hadrondrift said:


> For me (hobbyist), my biggest problem is that I don't finish things. Often I have a new idea that doesn't fit the current project, then I start a new project with that idea. Often I don't go back to older unfinished projects for weeks, if ever....


This may seem a bit weird but what can help is making notes while working on a project - what you don't like about it, maybe why you did X or Y, but basic mix notes-type stuff is just fine and maybe a note of things like chord progressions and motifs.

One really tricky thing in all art is artistic distance. Often you're just too close to the project to make any worthwhile decisions because you've done it all in a burst of activity. But if it's been sitting on a disk drive for weeks or months, you can approach it as if it's not yours and so set about thinking of ways to reinvigorate it, or if you find you like it, top and tail it relatively quickly - which is where the notes come in as you've probably already worked out some of the gaps but need to remember how the sections go together. Or it might be genuinely terrible and you just kill it with fire.


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## mscp (Jun 5, 2021)

Hadrondrift said:


> I think so too. That's why I believe that the tips that come from other areas of creativity are also applicable to the case of composing.
> 
> Here are some examples, funnily enough extracted from a book called "The Basics of Essay Writing":
> 
> Practice: don't just read about it.



Pretty much.



Hadrondrift said:


> Everyone finds excuses not to be creative.



Exactly.



Hadrondrift said:


> Do something rather than nothing.



That was my only point.




Hadrondrift said:


> Less than perfect can be good enough.



Precisely.


Another bit to consider is: write snippets in a specific key and save those recordings somewhere.


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## youngpokie (Jun 5, 2021)

I think the reason we don't finish is because we don't know "what's next". 

That happens when we compose bar by bar, in an open-ended way. We try to either guess what's next or to fake it, but mostly we just wander about aimlessly. We don't how long the melody should be or how many segments it should have. We collect hundreds of unfinished snippets, create filing systems for them, etc. A good name for this compositional method should be "pissing in the dark". And it was my default approach, too, for a long time. 

To simplify an earlier point, a genuine breakthrough for me was composing "iteratively" instead of open-endedly. By locking myself into fixed 8 or 16 bar segment and using any snippet, or any germ of an idea to kick-start the process, I fill these bars with whatever seems vaguely OK and then my focus shifts to refining, connecting, improving and enriching, both melody and harmony. Instead of "what's next" I think of "what's best". At some point, the sense of structure becomes ingrained and I think that's when creativity really flourishes, within that structure.


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## Arbee (Jun 7, 2021)

I wasn't sure whether to add to this thread or start a similar one, but here goes.

The point of fear (and then procrastination) for me is not at the start. I'm very comfortable doodling on paper, on the piano or guitar, or looking for inspiration in the DAW. It's when I actually get an idea that I really like that I freeze in creative terror and feel the urgent need to check email or sort the sock draw, as if I've just picked up a red hot potato. I suspect it's the fear of turning a potential gem into crushed glass by the time I've pummeled it into submission, so I'm too scared to touch it. I appreciate the need to give the subconscious time to develop a plan for it, but there are limits (i.e. excuses to wait a little longer)!

The irony is that I can always make a deadline, but I would have a much better experience and potentially a better outcome if I could work through it at a steady pace instead of waiting until the urgency overcomes the fear. Does anyone else share this handicap and/or have any tips apart from the obvious "just push through it".


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## Tomboy69 (Jun 18, 2021)

David Kudell said:


> What helped me in the past is I set a goal to write 30 seconds of music every day. This allowed me to try a new idea, play with a new style, try a new instrument, and it's not a daunting task...it's only 30 seconds. You don't have to make it perfect either, it's just a sketch and exercises your composing muscles.
> 
> When you're done with your 30 sec sketch that day, export it and add it to a playlist on your phone. Soon you'll start to have a little collection of sketches which will give you a sense of accomplishment. You'll be amazed at how much you learn. Then it will be much easier to work on a longer track, since you're basically just making a longer sketch.


That's a good idea that I think I will be using moving forward. Thanks.


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