# Tantacrul Dorico Video



## Laptoprabbit (Apr 24, 2020)

Tantacrul has done some interesting (and funny) videos about Sibelius and MuseScore and came out with the Dorico one today. Curious as to what you guys think.


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## bryla (Apr 24, 2020)

sooooo true!


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## tack (Apr 24, 2020)

This video is so good. I love Tantacrul's videos in general, but this one in particular is a steady stream of entertainment gold.


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## gyprock (Apr 24, 2020)

This video was superb, not only for its content but also the entertainment value. I'm a Dorico user and really like it. However I now realize that much of my workflow was picked up by watching tutorials or from the Dorico forum. If some of the design interface recommendations are implemented, Dorico will fly into the stratosphere and beyond. The foundational core of Dorico is unmatched for many of the things it can do today and for future growth. It should be given as much support as possible.

The thing is, some of the best, most used programs in the industry have the worst interfaces imaginable. A good example is Zbrush for 3D sculpting. It is the no.1 program for character design by far yet it has the most cryptic, horrible, horrible, horrible interface imaginable for a new user.

Another set of programs that make me want to vomit are Microsoft's Word and Excel, not because of any lack of functionality but because the engineers, programmers and designers try and tell me how I should think and interact with the program. I much preferred the versions of these programs I was using in 1987.

Interestingly, many GNU licenced programs such as MuseScore or Blender (3D design) are really stepping up their game in terms of interface design and can teach some of the industry stalwarts a thing or two.


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## Thundercat (Apr 24, 2020)

Laptoprabbit said:


> Tantacrul has done some interesting (and funny) videos about Sibelius and MuseScore and came out with the Dorico one today. Curious as to what you guys think.



Wow that really put things in perspective! And owning both, I feel exactly same as him! Now I understand why I've been SO CONFUSED when I try to use Dorico - I feel stupid most of the time actually - and I TEACH COMPUTERS FOR 30 YEARS!

I love the concept, but they have major usability problems that need looking at. It's like when you're composing music, and a melody pops out and you just revel in it and run with it and make something cool.

Then next time you think, "I'm going to structure this one really well" so you spend a bunch of time planning it out.

Result might be good, or just ok - well structured maybe, but lost it's soul. I feel that's what happened with the Dorico team. So much battery acid in that war room when they were designing it that they over designed it and lost the simplicity that made Sib so much fun to use!

EDIT - forgot to say, much of the issues could be easily remedied. The functionality is superb, and despite my rantings I've managed to produce some impressive looking scores without a lot of fiddling after the fact (but a lot of fiddling DURING the fact lol!). So some redesign, as he suggests, would be really all that's needed to make it the game changer it's meant to be...


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## Thundercat (Apr 24, 2020)

One more thing - now that I understand how to use the Dorico INSERT mode, I'm in love! It makes it really easy to insert notes, lengthen them or shorten them with keyboard strokes - this is what made me perk up a couple weeks ago when I learned this feature and started using it. All was forgiven then, but sins remain that still need absolving...lol


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## gyprock (Apr 24, 2020)

Thundercat said:


> One more thing - now that I understand how to use the Dorico INSERT mode, I'm in love! It makes it really easy to insert notes, lengthen them or shorten them with keyboard strokes - this is what made me perk up a couple weeks ago when I learned this feature and started using it. All was forgiven then, but sins remain that still need absolving...lol


I agree. I discovered this yesterday when I was trying to convert a harp arpeggio from 1/16 notes tied in a tuplet of 6 to 1/8 notes in the same tuplet. I tried everything while ripping out my hair... then I discovered the insert command and suddenly everything fell into place.


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## Thundercat (Apr 24, 2020)

gyprock said:


> I agree. I discovered this yesterday when I was trying to convert a harp arpeggio from 1/16 notes tied in a tuplet of 6 to 1/8 notes in the same tuplet. I tried everything while ripping out my hair... then I discovered the insert command and suddenly everything fell into place.


It really is genius! If they can iron out the usability kinks, Dorico will be unstoppable.


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## jmm (Apr 25, 2020)

At 36:40 ish: Demonstrates a thing in Sib. "In Dorico, I can't do this." 

Uh...

View attachment hmmmm.mp4


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## bryla (Apr 25, 2020)

Yeah I noticed that too. For someone who is obsessed with design of GUI I get that he's taking a first hand user experience but for him having used it for 8 months and don't know how to do this is quite strange.

Some other things like key commands, caret and popovers are also not mentioned. But I get that I know most of it through searching through the manual (many times!) and watching a lot of Discover Dorico's...


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## Thundercat (Apr 25, 2020)

bryla said:


> Yeah I noticed that too. For someone who is obsessed with design of GUI I get that he's taking a first hand user experience but for him having used it for 8 months and don't know how to do this is quite strange.
> 
> Some other things like key commands, caret and popovers are also not mentioned. But I get that I know most of it through searching through the manual (many times!) and watching a lot of Discover Dorico's...


It’s a terrifically deep program. But I find I have to crack the manual or google things constantly.

I had to do that with Sibelius too, but not nearly as often. There’s something to be said for making a program intuitive...


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## Saxer (Apr 26, 2020)

I feel less stupid after watching the video. I had the same starting awkwardness and had to ask very basic things again and again in the Dorico forum. And as I'm using the German version I must say that the translation of functions and musical terms is terrible. This doesn't make things easier when googling or asking in the forum for solutions or searching the manual. After two years and about 50 arrangements there is still a daily "what now?" block in the work flow. But it's getting better over time.


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## MrCambiata (Apr 26, 2020)

The video is spot on and informative. But for me, the advantages of Dorico are numerous. Moving notes around, filtering all kind of things in the score, from dynamics to pedal symbols and text, not having to adjust (almost) anything in the parts, swapping the order of voices... It just feels superior and I write really fast. I'm also confident that the shortcomings will be addressed in the future.


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## Franklin (Apr 26, 2020)

And if they take it a step further with seemless integration with Cubase (which could have been well on it's way if they did not spend too much time in over designing Dorico), they will regain my attention.
For now it's Sibelius Ultimate which - as has been mentioned in the video - is largely the legacy of the same Dorico design team.


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## ptram (Apr 26, 2020)

Saxer said:


> And as I'm using the German version I must say that the translation of functions and musical terms is terrible


I decided to go for the English version of the UI. Not my language, but I feel better.

Paolo


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## ptram (Apr 26, 2020)

Franklin said:


> And if they take it a step further with seemless integration with Cubase


As a Logic user, I hope they will continue to develop their own way, instead of going for Cubase's.

Paolo


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## Franklin (Apr 26, 2020)

ptram said:


> As a Logic user, I hope they will continue to develop their own way, instead of going for Cubase's.
> 
> Paolo



In the Cubase forum the have created a survey dedicated to the integration of Dorico and Cubase.
As a Logic user you must have noticed what the benefits are of this integration.
Both camps (Dorico and Cubase) look forward to an integration as the benefits are obvious.
That doesn't mean that Dorico cannot stand out as notation software.
I hope that Studio One will also consider this instead of the clumsy way of a failed bonding with Notion.


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## ptram (Apr 26, 2020)

Franklin said:


> As a Logic user you must have noticed what the benefits are of this integration.


If you mean the integration between the MIDI and score in Logic, I would say that this is the main reason I'm not convinced integration between Cubase and Dorico would be a good idea. Many users are happy with Logic's score abilities, and this is maybe the reason why it has remained so primitive for decades. Most would never use the benefits of the advanced features of a program made for advanced musical typography and management of performance materials.

When Avid integrated some parts of Sibelius in Pro Tools, many users were satisfied with what they received. I suspect that many Cubase users would be happy with the features of Dorico SE. Full integration with Dorico Pro would, in my view, make a lot of users unsatisfied by how obscure the score part has become, pretending a dramatic simplification.

Mind you – I would like easier file exchange between DAWs and notation programs. But I fear a monster aggregate of software that have to share concepts stranger to their core mission.

And then, I'm horrified by the time when we will have Dorico adopt Cubase's color scheme...

Paolo


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