# Cubase - Why better on Windows than Mac?



## garyhiebner (Apr 21, 2016)

Hi Guys,

I've just recently got Cubase. And I've seen it pop up a lot here that it runs better on Windows than Mac.

I'm a super Mac fanboy (still using Logic, but maybe I'll be swayed completely onto Cubase).

But how come does it run better under Windows than the Mac OS. Just wanted to know your guys experience with it on Mac, and what bugs and trouble you ran into.

I'd like to run it on my Mac, but if theirs more benefits for it on PC, then will move that way.


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## cristianmatei (Apr 21, 2016)

Hi, I use Cubase on my mac book pro about 4 years with no problems.


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## Daryl (Apr 21, 2016)

Part of it is historical and part of it is that cross platform audio apps nearly always run better on Windows. The things to focus on are not whether or not it runs better, but on how much better, and also whether the slightly worse performance on OSX matters to you. If the difference is so slight, it may not matter either way.


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## Mihkel Zilmer (Apr 21, 2016)

From my experience with C6 - C8.5 on both Mac and PC, it's not that there are any additional bugs or other issues with the Mac version - it just simply isn't as efficient. With identical settings in an identical project you'll probably need to increase your buffer size by a notch on OSX. As Daryl said - depends on whether this matters to you or not.


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## garyhiebner (Apr 21, 2016)

Thanks Guys, I'm gonna run it on my Mac and see how it goes. Seeing as I haven't run it on Windows before I won't have any expectations of which has better performance.


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## Ashermusic (Apr 21, 2016)

Over the years reps from Steinberg, VSL, and Native Instruments have told me that pretty much all cross platform music software can be coded more efficiently on Windows than OSX.

At the time Apple bought Emagic and acquired Logic Pro I was on the verge of buying a PC to run it while keeping my Mac for daily non-musical stuff. Now of course, I run Logic on my Mac and have a slave PC to do much of the heavy lifting.


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## Mishabou (Apr 21, 2016)

garyhiebner said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I've just recently got Cubase. And I've seen it pop up a lot here that it runs better on Windows than Mac.
> 
> ...



I run CB 8.5 on both Mac and PC without any problems. I don't notice any difference in performance or reliability on either platforms.


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## Mishabou (Apr 21, 2016)

Ashermusic said:


> Over the years reps from Steinberg, VSL, and Native Instruments have told me that pretty much all cross platform music software can be coded more efficiently on Windows than OSX.
> 
> At the time Apple bought Emagic and acquired Logic Pro I was on the verge of buying a PC to run it while keeping my Mac for daily non-musical stuff. Now of course, I run Logic on my Mac and have a slave PC to do much of the heavy lifting.



I wouldn't say that one platform is more efficient than the other. It really depends the experience a software company has with a specific OS. Historically, Steingberg, VSL and NI started out as mainly PC guys so i'm not surprised by their statement.

I used to beta for Logic and Pro Tools and have always found back in the days that they run better and definitely more reliable on Mac than PC.


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## Ashermusic (Apr 21, 2016)

Anhtu said:


> I wouldn't say that one platform is more efficient than the other. It really depends the experience a software company has with a specific OS. Historically, Steingberg, VSL and NI started out as mainly PC guys so i'm not surprised by their statement.
> 
> I used to beta for Logic and Pro Tools and have always found back in the days that they run better and definitely more reliable on Mac than PC.



Can't speak to ProTools, but I was an Emagic beta tester back in the day for years and it ran better on PC, but back then, top of the line PCs were considerably more powerful than their Mac equivalents, so that may have been a factor.


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## woodsdenis (Apr 21, 2016)

There was a thread on the KVR about this when 8 came out and the result was surprisingly that the the Mac version was marginally better. Now this of course depends on what the individual user uses as VSTI. Is Kontakt better on one platform, Play? etc, those are the things which will affect performance rather than the DAW I suspect.


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## RiffWraith (Apr 21, 2016)

garyhiebner said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> I've just recently got Cubase. And I've seen it pop up a lot here that it runs better on Windows than Mac.
> 
> ...



Without more details on what "it runs better on Windows" means, and what your computers are and contain, it's hard to say. It could be system specific. Video card, sound card, RAM, CPU, HDD, and so on are all factors here. If one is a desktop and the other a laptop, that could also be a factor. Background processes and tools can also have a bearing on performance. If both your Mac and PC are virtually identical, Cubase really should not run better on one OS over the other, save for maybe a bug here or there. But performance should be the same.

Cheers.


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## EvilDragon (Apr 21, 2016)

As far as I can tell, one of the performance difference factors is in the file system. NTFS and Windows seem to have some sort of optimizations at a very low level with regards to disk performance (specific commands? things not available on HFS+, as it seems) that really seem to work well for disk streaming.



RiffWraith said:


> If both your Mac and PC are virtually identical, Cubase really should not run better on one OS over the other, save for maybe a bug here or there. But performance should be the same.



And yet performance differences _do_ exist...


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## RiffWraith (Apr 21, 2016)

EvilDragon said:


> And yet performance differences _do_ exist...



You think because of the file system? That disk streaming is better in NTFS?


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## EvilDragon (Apr 21, 2016)

Well NI and Steiny confirm it to be the case, it's not a matter of me just thinking. And as I said, it's just one factor of performance - I wouldn't write that one off as unimportant.


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## IFM (Apr 21, 2016)

With 8 there is no difference any more as far as I can see. Pre 8 yes Windows was better.


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## colony nofi (Apr 21, 2016)

Oh there is most definitely still differences - especially with certain systems.
Sessions that only barely run under osx 10.5 on my trashcan mac pro run far smoother (and with lower buffer settings) when bootcamped to win10.
This is especially evident for larger sessions with more bussing.
I still run in osx, only because of some legacy stuff I have that is not on windows / and for interoperability with other composers I work with.


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## Mishabou (Apr 21, 2016)

colony nofi said:


> Oh there is most definitely still differences - especially with certain systems.
> Sessions that only barely run under osx 10.5 on my trashcan mac pro run far smoother (and with lower buffer settings) when bootcamped to win10.
> This is especially evident for larger sessions with more bussing.
> I still run in osx, only because of some legacy stuff I have that is not on windows / and for interoperability with other composers I work with.



My trashcan mac pro can run huge CB session with 1080p video in Prores via my AJA Kona 4K card all day long without a glitch. My sessions are all in 5.1, lots of busses and stems.

All these conflicting reports and experiences go to show you that performances and reliabilities depend on many factors (sound card, drivers, external peripherals, plug-ins...etc) other than simply OSX or Windows.


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## mgpqa1 (Apr 21, 2016)

I remember the following thread on the VSL forums a few years ago where one of the VSL developers said cross-platform software performs better on Windows compared to a Mac (Martin's post, 4th down from the top) and gave some technical reasons: https://www.vsl.co.at/community/pos...otcamp-Mac-outperform-OSX-with-VEP#post192295

I'm not sure how much of that still applies today (I'm not a software developer), but that thread is an interesting read/discussion.


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## EvilDragon (Apr 22, 2016)

Yes, those things still apply today.


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## IFM (Apr 22, 2016)

Well it seems if you really want to know do you own tests. For me CP8.5 is running beautifully on my MP. LPX doesn't do any better and in some particular situations worse. I'm totally a convert.


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## garyhiebner (Apr 22, 2016)

Awesome, well is seems like the consensus is that it runs fine on Mac. Good to know. My next experiment is to try and sync Cubase and Logic together. Don't think I can fully let go of Logic right away. And I've seen some info of how you can sync the two together with the IAC Bus. If successful, will post my experiments.


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## IFM (Apr 22, 2016)

garyhiebner said:


> Awesome, well is seems like the consensus is that it runs fine on Mac. Good to know. My next experiment is to try and sync Cubase and Logic together. Don't think I can fully let go of Logic right away. And I've seen some info of how you can sync the two together with the IAC Bus. If successful, will post my experiments.



I just did this. If you plan on using Drummer you might find it a bit wonky as it tries to alter the tempo.


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## garyhiebner (Apr 23, 2016)

Yeah, that's one of the exact reasons why I want to do it. Drummer is awesome and I love using it for drum fills ideas and then converting the drummer track to MIDI and using the fills where I want in the track. I did a couple of testing and noticed if Cubase is the master and Logic the slave, if you set up a loop, when it loops back it messes with the tempo. So it may be best not using looping selections. Might be counter intuitive. But I'm keen to getting two to work alongside each other nicely.


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## Ashermusic (Apr 23, 2016)

Logic always wants to be the master. It has been ever thus.


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## colony nofi (Apr 26, 2016)

Anhtu said:


> My trashcan mac pro can run huge CB session with 1080p video in Prores via my AJA Kona 4K card all day long without a glitch. My sessions are all in 5.1, lots of busses and stems.
> 
> All these conflicting reports and experiences go to show you that performances and reliabilities depend on many factors (sound card, drivers, external peripherals, plug-ins...etc) other than simply OSX or Windows.


Oh yes - there are definitely many factors. 
I can run very large sessions without a glitch as well - but once you get to seriously CPU intensive work, the differences between the way the software behaves under different OS's become more apparent. 
I start to see it using HEAVY cpu plugins like multiple (many) instances of 2C-audio verbs, or melda harmonic based plugins, or using high-quality (oversampling) modes on 30+ fabfilter plugins. 
I see it even more with the buffer setting I can use. Indeed, often the 6core trashcan mac pro here runs some sessions BETTER than the 12core. This has to do with the way cubase/nuendo + plugins work in regards to multi-threading. 
I'm running sessions sometimes with more than 64GB ram used as well - but at least the ram management / how many instances of kontakt doesn't seem to really effect things from windows to mac. 

I see the differences with all 3 different soundcards we use here. Metric Halo (via t/bolt to firewire convertor) - ONLY runs on mac (of course!). But the others - RME (both usb and PCIe thru thunderbolt) and AVB based MOTU boxes show the differences.

This doesn't mean the mac pro's are not perfectally able machines for big sessions. Its just that at the moment, windows is a little better when it comes to resource usage under many circumstances (sometimes very slightly, sometimes quite dramatically).


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## colony nofi (Apr 26, 2016)

Oh - and if you want to see Mac/PC differences in action, try an orchestral session with tempo ramps. (So, constantly speeding up / slowing down over a few bars - or even just a bar if its a big session!)


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