# Cleany Clean Clean Master Bus



## Nate Johnson (Jan 27, 2021)

A while back, I made a thread about colorful plugins to run on the master bus. I ended up with a ton of great sounding options that suit my tastes. Now I'd like to explore the other side, the clean stuff. Less character, more precision. In this case, let's say I'm mixing straight classical - using BBCSO specifically at the moment, but see myself working with some real acoustic instruments for this project as well. 

I'd like nice and clean:

EQ
Compressor
Limiter

I don't need verb or any other effects atm.

What jumps out at me first, is the Fab Filter stuff. 

What else should I look at?


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## doctoremmet (Jan 27, 2021)

Sonible


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## doctoremmet (Jan 27, 2021)

Also: Melda Production. I am again tempted by their MXXX deal for 50% off. Their effects are just deep and sound good.

Transparent for sure. But I guess Fabfilter would be the number one contender here...


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## AudioLoco (Jan 27, 2021)

Best clean compressor money can buy is Unisum, hands down. 
It has been created for mastering but can be used on anything. It is slightly complicated to use as it has a lot of parameters, but the presets help with a starting point (it is the only compressor where I would even contemplate using presets)

Surgical EQs: I would say Fabfilter ProQ3 is my favourite for workflow. DMG Equlibruim sounds amazing and I know many like Crave.

Limiter: Nothing beats Fabfilter ProL. Other good options are DMG Limitless and the never ceasing to be great L3 Multimaximizer from Waves, still a classic.


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## Heizenhaus (Jan 27, 2021)

The Tokyo Dawn Labs plugins come to my mind. SlickEQ, Kotelnikov and Limiter No. 6 can all work perfectly clean, but offer saturation or coloring to a degree.

Another thing would be elysia museq and elysia alpha compressor over at Plugin Alliance. Though you might want to wait for them to be on sale, if you don't want to spend the regular price.


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## Nate Johnson (Jan 27, 2021)

Any of you guys and gals screwing around with AI type workflow - i.e. Izotope (Ozone/Nectar/Tonal Balance) or what @doctoremmet suggested: Sonible (Smart EQ and Smart Comp)


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## doctoremmet (Jan 27, 2021)

I have. IMPORTANT disclaimer: I am a hobbyist and a horrible mixer.

That said: I like the Sonible plugins for their clean / clear results and good UIs. They do what they have to, and the AI sometimes helps to get you in a good starting position. As long as you don’t expect miracles or “mix this track for me, will ya” results, it can really be helpful. But again, I am merely a hobbyist piano player who likes to mess around with this stuff.


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## AudioLoco (Jan 27, 2021)

Of the "smart stuff" I only have and use Sooth(2). It's a great timesaver when harshness needs to be tamed.
Can't comment on the rest of the AI, or self analizing stuff out there.... But I know Gulfoss is the most popular and beloved.


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## Nate Johnson (Jan 27, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I have. IMPORTANT disclaimer: I am a hobbyist and a horrible mixer.
> 
> That said: I like the Sonible plugins for their clean / clear results and good UIs. They do what they have to, and the AI sometimes helps to get you in a good starting position. As long as you don’t expect miracles or “mix this track for me, will ya” results, it can really be helpful. But again, I am merely a hobbyist piano player who likes to mess around with this stuff.


Fair enough. One of my ongoing projects is handling the audio production of my wife’s podcast. Whereas I’ve been doing it long enough to improvise around all of the inconsistencies that come with tracking and mixing dialogue (two hosts) I’m always going to be looking for tools to simplify that workflow.


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## Nate Johnson (Jan 27, 2021)

I just realized that A: I own the Elements versions of Neutron/Ozone/Nectar that I never though to authorize on my new computer and B: theres a really nice upgrade offer (advanced versions) on my Izotope account ($199) right now. Loading up elements to mess around now.

I’ve been using RX Elements for noise reduction for like ever - I love it. So simple and effective.


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## doctoremmet (Jan 27, 2021)

The Izotope stuff is excellent. I know a guy who does editing for a podcast who uses nothing but their plugins.


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## Collywobbles (Jan 27, 2021)

For (budget friendly) clean master bus processing you can also check out some of the old Waves stuff like LinMB, LinEQ and L2.


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## method1 (Jan 27, 2021)

This freebie has been making some waves, its really good.. 



fircomp - Jon V Audio


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## Jeremy Spencer (Jan 27, 2021)

Nate Johnson said:


> EQ
> Compressor
> Limiter


Fab Filter. Cleanest I’ve ever used.


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## vitocorleone123 (Jan 27, 2021)

My standard now for the mixbus is

Slick EQ M
Gullfoss
Kotelnikov GE
Pro-L2 (set as transparent as possible)

I try not to add more than that. I’ll add a Pro-Q3 if needed.


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## merty (Jan 27, 2021)

try weiss too


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## patrick76 (Jan 27, 2021)

Clean is kind of George Massenburg’s thing, so maybe check out his stuff.


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## cloudbuster (Jan 27, 2021)

Got some of the stuff that has been mentioned above (no Fabfilter or Sonible though) but when I need it as transparent as it gets I'm still grabbing Ozone (and Neutron). More often than not though I do like a bit of color here and there and pick something different - huge fan of the SSL and EMI sound (SSL, PA, Waves) and don't hesitate to place mixing tools on the master bus.
As to the AI features I sometimes play around with them and in many situations they deliver interesting results and sometimes starting points; at the end of the day though those plugins don't know sh.t about my ideosyncrasies, maybe that comes with the next upgrade 😜


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## Gerhard Westphalen (Jan 27, 2021)

Fabfilter, and Ozone. Higher end would be the Weiss and DMG but those are probably unnecessary for the average composer.


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## Trash Panda (Jan 27, 2021)

Nate Johnson said:


> Any of you guys and gals screwing around with AI type workflow - i.e. Izotope (Ozone/Nectar/Tonal Balance) or what @doctoremmet suggested: Sonible (Smart EQ and Smart Comp)


Use and love Izotope Neutron, Ozone, Insight and Tonal Balance Control all the time. The AI assistant gives a good starting point, but I always tweak to taste. I really like getting a sound that I’m happy with quickly.

Been trying to make myself use the Sonible stuff more, but Izotope is the comfort zone.


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## Gert Keunen (Jan 28, 2021)

Gerhard Westphalen said:


> Fabfilter, and Ozone. Higher end would be the Weiss and DMG but those are probably unnecessary for the average compose
> 
> 
> Nate Johnson said:
> ...


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## vitocorleone123 (Jan 28, 2021)

I have ozone and neutron and never use them except as a “second set of ears and eyes”. I strongly prefer using other tools like the ones I mentioned. I could easily part with izotope products (excluding the exponential reverbs).


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## Nate Johnson (Jan 28, 2021)

vitocorleone123 said:


> I have ozone and neutron and never use them except as a “second set of ears and eyes”. I strongly prefer using other tools like the ones I mentioned. I could easily part with izotope products (excluding the exponential reverbs).


Interesting. Can you explain your typical workflow using those tools as a ‘second set of ears and eyes’? Are you bypassing your preferred chain and just looking at the neutron/ozone analyzers to check your work? Or engaging the AI to see how it compares to your manual work? Or what?


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## vitocorleone123 (Jan 28, 2021)

Nate Johnson said:


> Interesting. Can you explain your typical workflow using those tools as a ‘second set of ears and eyes’? Are you bypassing your preferred chain and just looking at the neutron/ozone analyzers to check your work? Or engaging the AI to see how it compares to your manual work? Or what?


Both! Yes, I do check at least once to see what the software thinks I should do very early on, and then again after I make changes to see if it brought it closer AND I like how it sounds after doing so. I also use Tonal Balance control in conjunction with Mastering the Mix Reference 2 throughout the process. 

It's no different than what iZotope, I believe, recommends doing. Only they, of course, want you to use their software to make the changes, too.


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## Gert Keunen (Jan 28, 2021)

vitocorleone123 said:


> Both! Yes, I do check at least once to see what the software thinks I should do very early on, and then again after I make changes to see if it brought it closer AND I like how it sounds after doing so. I also use Tonal Balance control in conjunction with Mastering the Mix Reference 2 throughout the process.
> 
> It's no different than what iZotope, I believe, recommends doing. Only they, of course, want you to use their software to make the changes, too.


The same for me.
In mixing (in Cubase): I work with Softube hardware and software (with channel strips from SSL and Weiss), but I check with iZotope Nektar afterwards (1) to see if I'm missing something or (2) to add a little bit of extra comp/EQ.
In mastering (in Wavelab): first everything with Softube/SSL/Weiss and second with iZotope Ozone (also for maximizing). And with Tonal Balance control all the time open for reference. 
This way I both have the physical 'turning knobs' and the AI, my ears and a second pair.


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## Nate Johnson (Jan 28, 2021)

Very cool concepts, guys. I like the idea of taking advantage of both worlds.


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## Stringtree (Jan 28, 2021)

I want the bx_console Focusrite SC. Heft, air, curves. Plus, it's like, famous.

Hey, it's free. Try it for fourteen days. I just want fourteen days to really play with this and not let the clock run out. Comp, EQ, om-nom-nom... 









Brainworx bx_console Focusrite SC


Officially approved Focusrite TMT Studio plugin of the beautiful console designed for Beatles producer, Sir George Martin




www.plugin-alliance.com





Will it be $29 doll hairs someday? I really hope so.


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## doctoremmet (Jan 28, 2021)

Stringtree said:


> Will it be $29 doll hairs someday? I really hope so.


Absolutely will.


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## ThomasL (Jan 29, 2021)

Most DAW stock plugins are pretty "colorless" if that's what you're after.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Jan 29, 2021)

ThomasL said:


> Most DAW stock plugins are pretty "colorless" if that's what you're after.


I did some testing, and this is not the case with Logic. This especially true of the EQ and compressors.


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## ThomasL (Jan 29, 2021)

Been a few years since I opened Logic but from what I recall the stock EQ and compressor were very clean. Not talking about the later stuff which tries to mimic "old" hardware.

But if that's true then I'll take your word for it.


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## Nate Johnson (Feb 11, 2021)

Well, I picked up the Tonal Balance bundle from Izotope, to experiment with that workflow. I haven't made it very far, just throwing Neutron on the mix bus and Ozone on the master. 

Screwing around with the 'assistants' has been interesting. With the podcast episode I just finished editing, I got to where I needed to go crazy quick. Just made a couple of tweaks after the analysis. Like that's too quick. I mean it hits my usual target metrics and it sounds fine, so I _guess _it must be fine. 

All in all, it's as much overwhelming to look at as it is mesmerizing. One plug in is essentially doing the work of 4-5 all in one GUI. Lots of moving meters. Lots to wrap my head around all at once. I think I definitely need to spend some time with the manuals and find someone's YT tutorials.


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## vitocorleone123 (Feb 15, 2021)

Nate Johnson said:


> Well, I picked up the Tonal Balance bundle from Izotope, to experiment with that workflow. I haven't made it very far, just throwing Neutron on the mix bus and Ozone on the master.
> 
> Screwing around with the 'assistants' has been interesting. With the podcast episode I just finished editing, I got to where I needed to go crazy quick. Just made a couple of tweaks after the analysis. Like that's too quick. I mean it hits my usual target metrics and it sounds fine, so I _guess _it must be fine.
> 
> All in all, it's as much overwhelming to look at as it is mesmerizing. One plug in is essentially doing the work of 4-5 all in one GUI. Lots of moving meters. Lots to wrap my head around all at once. I think I definitely need to spend some time with the manuals and find someone's YT tutorials.


I also still highly recommend a second opinion, if you will, with either Reference 2 or Metric AB. To compare with other tracks.


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## Nate Johnson (Feb 15, 2021)

vitocorleone123 said:


> I also still highly recommend a second opinion, if you will, with either Reference 2 or Metric AB. To compare with other tracks.


So for the past few days, I slapped the Izotope stuff all over my orchestral mix I’m working on. Not digging it as much for this task. The AI stuff was less helpful. I might try using Neutron and Ozone ‘manually’ (I don’t know why I haven’t yet) and see how that goes.

Strongly considering adding the Fab Filter Eq, Compressors and Limiter to my collection.


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## vitocorleone123 (Feb 15, 2021)

Nate Johnson said:


> So for the past few days, I slapped the Izotope stuff all over my orchestral mix I’m working on. Not digging it as much for this task. The AI stuff was less helpful. I might try using Neutron and Ozone ‘manually’ (I don’t know why I haven’t yet) and see how that goes.
> 
> Strongly considering adding the Fab Filter Eq, Compressors and Limiter to my collection.


I’d say that Ozone is pretty much as good as Fabfilter now. More and more I read supposed professional mixers (online so I can’t tell) are finding alternatives to Fabfilter. I find proq3 super easy to use, but I’ve had it awhile and would probably shop around. For example, some people claim Crave is a better sounding EQ, or that you can get better results with an analog style EQ like BigFrEQ or many others. Others swear by MAAT EQs.

I have 5 Fabfilter plugins and regularly use 2 (q3 and L2). I don’t use mb or c2. I want to use saturn2 but... I think I shouldn’t have bought it when I keep using bluecats destructor instead.


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## antret (Feb 15, 2021)

I tried Izotope Neutron for awhile, but just couldn't along with it.... it was probably me and the way I work....I do use the tonal balance thing all the time though! For whatever reason, I found that the Tokyo Dawn, Sonimus and Hornet stuff was more forgiving of my ham-fistedness on the controls (bigger sweet spot?).  Haven't used Fabfilter or a few others mentioned above, so keep that in mind.....


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## pondinthestream (Feb 15, 2021)

I use Blue Cat Dynamics. Clean and with a good interface


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## DimensionsTomorrow (Feb 16, 2021)

Total amateur so take it with a grain of salt, but I never bonded with Neutron but love Ozone. I have the latest versions of both, but will probably just stick with Ozone going forward. I think Ozone is pretty great. I basically get my mix as good as I can in Logic and then open up the stereo mix in Ozone for basic mastering.

Again, I’m a total amateur, but there is a definite learning curve with Ozone. You can easily end up with a much worse sounding track if you aren’t careful, so for me it was just a matter of a lot of trial & error and YouTube tutorials. Now I can’t imagine not having it.


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