# Beginner orchestral library recommendations



## Flymania117 (Mar 26, 2021)

Hi all!

So I've been looking around for some quality libraries to make orchestral music at a reasonable price and have only become more confused with the amount of options. I've been using a lot of free things like BBCSO Discover, Labs, and have actually bought Audio Imperia's Areia Lite with my student discount since it fit my budget at the time (loving that library!). While I can do most of my string stuff with Areia (since I don't really have the need/knowledge/skill to make use of an extended set of articulations), I'm finding that the remainder of the orchestra is really lackluster and I wind up making pretty much string-only music which can get boring.

I was looking at the VI Special Edition volume 1 from VSL which seemed like a tremendous deal, but I fear it's my inexperience not quite seeing the whole picture regarding that library, so I was reluctant to pull the trigger.

With all this in mind, I would love to hear your recommendations for entry-level full orchestra libraries up to 300€, maaaayybe 400€. I have a preference for Kontakt Player libraries since I don't own the full version, but other samplers are also welcome.

Thanks in advance!

EDIT: I forgot to mention that I'm interested in libraries with individual sections, and not so much the ensemble type of library. My specs are as follows:

- Ryzen 5 3600
- 32GB DDR4 3000Mhz dual channel ram
- 500GB m.2 NVME SSD and 2TB 7200RMP HDD

I use ASIO4ALL since my interface broke :/ but it works just fine


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## GGaca (Mar 26, 2021)

If You like Areia's sound I think You would like Audio Imperia's Nucleus. If you like BBCSO Discover maybe go for BBCSO Core. - It's up to You which lib's tone suits You better. Also check Albion One - many people recommend that library for a start. 

Have a look at this similar (i think) thread: https://vi-control.net/community/threads/orchestral-library-for-absolute-newbies.104896/


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## Flymania117 (Mar 26, 2021)

GGaca said:


> If You like Areia's sound I think You would like Audio Imperia's Nucleus. If you like BBCSO Discover maybe go for BBCSO Core. - It's up to You which lib's tone suits You better. Also check Albion One - many people recommend that library for a start.
> 
> Have a look at this similar (i think) thread: https://vi-control.net/community/threads/orchestral-library-for-absolute-newbies.104896/


Thanks! BBCSO Core is one of the top choices at this price point by what I can tell, but I don't know... The demos aren't all that enticing to my ears. Albion is more ensemble based, right? Not quite what I was looking for. I should have specified it in the post. Nucleus really seemed like a great option, and the demos sound great to my ears, though I was hoping maybe someone could share their personal experience with it and maybe other libraries before I go out and spend hundreds on something that might no be what I'm looking for.

Thanks again for your reply! The thread you mentioned had some great info.


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## Vebjörn (Mar 26, 2021)

What will you be using it for (film, mockups of instrumental pieces?) What style of music? Hard to recommend without knowing.


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## fourier (Mar 26, 2021)

Christian Henson put out this video a few days back.

 - 

I think it's a great way to show what you can do with the stuff that are free and available for aspiring composers.


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## Flymania117 (Mar 26, 2021)

Vebjörn said:


> What will you be using it for (film, mockups of instrumental pieces?) What style of music? Hard to recommend without knowing.


Mostly orchestral music for indie films and games. My composition style is heavily inspired by the likes of Halo (the game franchise), Lord of the rings, Hollow Knight, so on, so I'd say it's definitely in the contemporaneous style of orchestral music. It's nothing fancy, really.


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## Flymania117 (Mar 26, 2021)

fourier said:


> Christian Henson put out this video a few days back.
> 
> -
> 
> I think it's a great way to show what you can do with the stuff that are free and available for aspiring composers.



I definitely agree that free stuff can really go a long way, but I'm starting to reach a point where I feel I'd like to explore the orchestra more so than textural pads and effects (though I love that stuff). It feels like the next logical step for me to take as a growing musician/composer since I never really delved deep into writing for sections other than strings. Plus, I have some spare money to spend, so while I'm definitely not going to turn my back on free samples, I'd love to make an investment on something that can hopefully broaden my knowledge of the orchestra and expand my possibilities that much more. Thanks for the reply!


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## Laurin Lenschow (Mar 26, 2021)

I own a bunch of all-encompassing orchestral libraries (Metropolis Ark 1, 2 and 3, The Orchestra, Albion One, Majestica, Nucleus and Jaeger) and out of these I would definetely recommend Nucleus! If you have any questions about that library (and/or the other ones I listed) feel free to ask them 
If you want to find out more about Nucleus I recommend watching this video:


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## SupremeFist (Mar 26, 2021)

Flymania117 said:


> Mostly orchestral music for indie films and games. My composition style is heavily inspired by the likes of Halo (the game franchise), Lord of the rings, Hollow Knight, so on, so I'd say it's definitely in the contemporaneous style of orchestral music. It's nothing fancy, really.


I have BBCSO and love it but I think Nucleus might be a better bet for this kind of writing: it has a bit more of a modern/hyped sound from what I've seen in demos.


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## tritonely (Mar 26, 2021)

If I could begin again I would leave BBCSO Core, EWHO, EWSO, Majestica, Albion Neo etc behind and build up my collection of VSL Big Bang Orchestra's packs. They are computerfriendly and can do epic and soft/textural. After quite a time I still use them in every project and the dynamics amazes me. It might cost more than BBCSO, but it's nice you can pick and choose the packs you want. I recommend for a complete orchestra: Orion (woodwinds sections), Zodiac (strings, horns and trombones), Kopernikus (trumpet), Dorado (percussion). In sale price it will probably be around 500/600 euros for a high end orchestral library in one of the best players. The libraries wouldn't require the best computer in the world, even with many instances together. First I was a little bit in doubt to buy and recommend VSL, but with the announcement they quit the dongle, I'm now in regret I first went in on many other libraries.


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## Vebjörn (Mar 26, 2021)

Flymania117 said:


> Mostly orchestral music for indie films and games. My composition style is heavily inspired by the likes of Halo (the game franchise), Lord of the rings, Hollow Knight, so on, so I'd say it's definitely in the contemporaneous style of orchestral music. It's nothing fancy, really.


I am not sure if VSL special will really fit your needs, some instruments might. I think you will quickly realize there is no one library that fits all. I guess the question is, which library will be most useful to you for now. All I can do is show you someone demos I did using VSL special edition 1 + (synchronized edition), maybe that can inform you.

This one is with the solo strings: 



This one is with woodwinds, harp, and unpitched percussion (see description in soundcloud for the other libraries)


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## Brendon V (Mar 26, 2021)

I think for the type of music you want to write, Nucleus is your best bet especially since you like the sound from Areia. It's a good beginner library, very easy to get a nice sound from without being overly complex to manage. You will learn alot from it and enjoy using it and it will teach you to write well in individual sections. Like every library it has its strengths and weaknesses, at some point you will outgrow it and want to add to it or replace it in your template. But first and foremost it has a nice sound thats easy to get for a beginner, so you tend to find ways to work around the other limitations. I found I preferred the classic mix for most situations as the modern mix was a little to hyped for my taste but it comes down to the effect and music you are trying to create, hope that helps, its a big investment but you can't go wrong with it I think, good luck.


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## mybadmemory (Mar 26, 2021)

Out of your two main contenders nucleus and bbcso, I’d say this.

BBCSO clearly wins on value. It includes much more in terms instruments and articulations for the actual orchestra. It also wins in being able to produce a more classic or “realistic” sound if you will. It sounds real. Like an orchestra in a room. 

Nucleus wins if you want a more modern epic hyped sound, that sounds less like an actual orchestra and more like a produced orchestra. For that it’s great. Just bear in mind it’s very limited in terms of articulations compared to BBCSO.


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## Flymania117 (Mar 27, 2021)

Thank you all for the replies!



Laurin Lenschow said:


> I own a bunch of all-encompassing orchestral libraries (Metropolis Ark 1, 2 and 3, The Orchestra, Albion One, Majestica, Nucleus and Jaeger) and out of these I would definetely recommend Nucleus! If you have any questions about that library (and/or the other ones I listed) feel free to ask them
> If you want to find out more about Nucleus I recommend watching this video:


I see! What would you say makes Nucleus your recommendation above the others? I definitely had it under my radar but didn't want to move forward with a purchase without getting to know about some of the other options through someone with more experience  Thank you for the video recommendation!



SupremeFist said:


> I have BBCSO and love it but I think Nucleus might be a better bet for this kind of writing: it has a bit more of a modern/hyped sound from what I've seen in demos.


The demos did sound quite hyped, which also got me worried the library wouldn't fair very well in something more emotional or expressive. I was hoping to find something that can comfortably do "epic" as well as "emotional and expressive" without having to be the absolute best at both, as it's an unrealistic expectation based on the info being kindly provided here


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## Flymania117 (Mar 27, 2021)

tritonely said:


> If I could begin again I would leave BBCSO Core, EWHO, EWSO, Majestica, Albion Neo etc behind and build up my collection of VSL Big Bang Orchestra's packs. They are computerfriendly and can do epic and soft/textural. After quite a time I still use them in every project and the dynamics amazes me. It might cost more than BBCSO, but it's nice you can pick and choose the packs you want. I recommend for a complete orchestra: Orion (woodwinds sections), Zodiac (strings, horns and trombones), Kopernikus (trumpet), Dorado (percussion). In sale price it will probably be around 500/600 euros for a high end orchestral library in one of the best players. The libraries wouldn't require the best computer in the world, even with many instances together. First I was a little bit in doubt to buy and recommend VSL, but with the announcement they quit the dongle, I'm now in regret I first went in on many other libraries.


Thanks for the recommendation! I heard say VSL isn't quite as beginner friendly as other libraries since it's less about out-of-the-box sound and more about delving deep into the sounds to get the best out of them. Is this true or just a misconception? One thing is for sure - to my ears, VSL has an incredible sound to it, but I can only assume achieving something even remotely close to their demos or some works I've listen to by other composers must take a lot more of an investment in time than what fits my workflow. 500/600 is a bit beyond my budget at the moment.  



Vebjörn said:


> I am not sure if VSL special will really fit your needs, some instruments might. I think you will quickly realize there is no one library that fits all. I guess the question is, which library will be most useful to you for now. All I can do is show you someone demos I did using VSL special edition 1 + (synchronized edition), maybe that can inform you.


Thank you! These tracks sound great! Was this hard to achieve? I always liked how versatile VSL seemed but it's definitely a scary thing to see that gigantic library of instruments.



Brendon V said:


> I think for the type of music you want to write, Nucleus is your best bet especially since you like the sound from Areia. It's a good beginner library, very easy to get a nice sound from without being overly complex to manage. You will learn alot from it and enjoy using it and it will teach you to write well in individual sections. Like every library it has its strengths and weaknesses, at some point you will outgrow it and want to add to it or replace it in your template. But first and foremost it has a nice sound thats easy to get for a beginner, so you tend to find ways to work around the other limitations. I found I preferred the classic mix for most situations as the modern mix was a little to hyped for my taste but it comes down to the effect and music you are trying to create, hope that helps, its a big investment but you can't go wrong with it I think, good luck.


Thanks for the advice! I've been trying to find more works made with nucleus. Do you have any recommendations? While I like its sound and the articulation range seems appropriate for now, I'm concerned it will "wear out" quick, so to speak. Though maybe I shouldn't be thinking about this just yet 



mybadmemory said:


> Out of your two main contenders nucleus and bbcso, I’d say this.
> 
> BBCSO clearly wins on value. It includes much more in terms instruments and articulations for the actual orchestra. It also wins in being able to produce a more classic or “realistic” sound if you will. It sounds real. Like an orchestra in a room.
> 
> Nucleus wins if you want a more modern epic hyped sound, that sounds less like an actual orchestra and more like a produced orchestra. For that it’s great. Just bear in mind it’s very limited in terms of articulations compared to BBCSO.


Thank you! The only reason I'd say the value is harder to judge for me is because BBCSO Core is handled directly at 449€, while nucleus, after conversion, is at around 380€ with the current conversion rates. Maybe it's my untrained ear, and I'm not saying nucleus sounds more or less realistic, but from what I've heard of BBCSO - even in the official demos - it sounds a bit... stiff? You get the sound of the room which is fantastic, but something about it made it sound unnatural. Maybe I'm just imagining things  Is this an inherent _thing _of the library or can it be worked around (either with ease or with some difficulty) or am I just nuts?


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## Markrs (Mar 27, 2021)

I don't know how quickly you need the library, but I would always advise waiting for sales if you can. Spitfire Audio will do another sale at least 30% off, but they do occasionally do 40% off sales as well. Not so sure about when Areia do their sales.


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## mybadmemory (Mar 27, 2021)

Flymania117 said:


> Thank you! The only reason I'd say the value is harder to judge for me is because BBCSO Core is handled directly at 449€, while nucleus, after conversion, is at around 380€ with the current conversion rates. Maybe it's my untrained ear, and I'm not saying nucleus sounds more or less realistic, but from what I've heard of BBCSO - even in the official demos - it sounds a bit... stiff? You get the sound of the room which is fantastic, but something about it made it sound unnatural. Maybe I'm just imagining things  Is this an inherent _thing _of the library or can it be worked around (either with ease or with some difficulty) or am I just nuts?


On value: If you look closer at the number of istruments and articulations you get from the two BBCSO is *much* more complete. Just compare for example violins one in nucleus where you get 5 articulations, whearas in BBCSO you get 21. It’s the same all though. And at sales BBCSO can go for as low as 250 making the value even more insane.

On sound: I too thought BBCSO sounded stiff in the official demos and actually went for nucleus first, which I thought sounded more impressive. Personally I never got nucleus to work for me while actually playing and working with it though, but as soon as I got BBCSO under my own hands I was struck with how real it sounded and well it played.

Summary: I think I would only opt for nucleus if I really liked the modern processed hyped sound a lot more. But for me, who are into much more classical and romantic pieces, BBCSO wins every day of the week. Check out the two BBCSO demos in my signature if you’d like!


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## tritonely (Mar 27, 2021)

Flymania117 said:


> Thanks for the recommendation! I heard say VSL isn't quite as beginner friendly as other libraries since it's less about out-of-the-box sound and more about delving deep into the sounds to get the best out of them. Is this true or just a misconception? One thing is for sure - to my ears, VSL has an incredible sound to it, but I can only assume achieving something even remotely close to their demos or some works I've listen to by other composers must take a lot more of an investment in time than what fits my workflow. 500/600 is a bit beyond my budget at the moment.


I can definitely agree that the 'older' VSL libraries (like VSL Cube and VSL VI series) have very dry and not easy out of the box sound. I have the brass of the VI series and it unfortunately needs very much tweaking to have a nice sound and therefore they are collecting dust. But the new Big Bang Orchestra recordings are in my opinion as easy as BBCSO Core and Nucleus. Maybe even easier because you can choose between various presets like room sound, close sound, surrounds sound and processed (compressed) sound. In my projects I only use a little bit of reverb for the BBO libraries to glue them together, nothing else. Other than the great sound, the Synchron player has very nice way of visualising which articulation under which key switch are (and you can edit the key switches) Also you can disable the articulation to save RAM if you think you won't need them, but with 32GB you are fine. 

To add to my previous post: why I recommend VSL BBO more than BBCSO Core and Nucleus is because they are in my opinion great for beginners with a easy out of the box sound, but they can grow with you in your carreer with many options in the synchron player and with many other packs that can add to your orchestral collections, even choirs. With those packs stated in my previous post you will get the basis of the orchestraIn any level of your career they still sound top level. With BBCSO Core and Nucleus I have much more a feeling there is a limit and at a level you will want more and leave those behind.


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## tritonely (Mar 27, 2021)

Flymania117 said:


> Thanks for the recommendation! I heard say VSL isn't quite as beginner friendly as other libraries since it's less about out-of-the-box sound and more about delving deep into the sounds to get the best out of them. Is this true or just a misconception? One thing is for sure - to my ears, VSL has an incredible sound to it, but I can only assume achieving something even remotely close to their demos or some works I've listen to by other composers must take a lot more of an investment in time than what fits my workflow. 500/600 is a bit beyond my budget at the moment.


You can hear VSL BBO Zodiac strings and horns, and BBO Kopernikus trumpets in


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## SupremeFist (Mar 27, 2021)

Flymania117 said:


> . Maybe it's my untrained ear, and I'm not saying nucleus sounds more or less realistic, but from what I've heard of BBCSO - even in the official demos - it sounds a bit... stiff? You get the sound of the room which is fantastic, but something about it made it sound unnatural. Maybe I'm just imagining things  Is this an inherent _thing _of the library or can it be worked around (either with ease or with some difficulty) or am I just nuts?


I think BBCSO is the opposite of stiff! And while it won't get you to "trailer epic" it can still get pretty loud and bombastic if need be, while also being perfect for more romantic/expressive stuff. But don't get it if you don't like the sound.


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## Piotrek K. (Mar 27, 2021)

Flymania117 said:


> Thanks for the recommendation! I heard say VSL isn't quite as beginner friendly as other libraries since it's less about out-of-the-box sound and more about delving deep into the sounds to get the best out of them. Is this true or just a misconception? One thing is for sure - to my ears, VSL has an incredible sound to it, but I can only assume achieving something even remotely close to their demos or some works I've listen to by other composers must take a lot more of an investment in time than what fits my workflow.



VSL synchronized SE libraries are pretty straightforward and sounds great out of the box due to proper balancing, stage placement etc. They've got also one great advantage, that wet libraries do not have - you can hear every detail of what you do hence you can learn tons and tons about proper orchestration etc. Those libraries sounds as good as your music is written imo. So they are great learning tool for sure due to clarity of sound and certain "unforgiveness". But Special Edtions are currently overpriced imo, especially when we take into consideration how the market grows and how it is more and more about hobbyists (I'm looking at you BBC SO core).

One detail, currently you can actually demo VSL Special Editions for free (don't know for how long though), plus you can actually refund lirbary if you don't like it. So zero risk on your side.

And... never buy samples full price. Never


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## Vebjörn (Mar 27, 2021)

Flymania117 said:


> Thanks for the recommendation! I heard say VSL isn't quite as beginner friendly as other libraries since it's less about out-of-the-box sound and more about delving deep into the sounds to get the best out of them. Is this true or just a misconception? One thing is for sure - to my ears, VSL has an incredible sound to it, but I can only assume achieving something even remotely close to their demos or some works I've listen to by other composers must take a lot more of an investment in time than what fits my workflow. 500/600 is a bit beyond my budget at the moment.
> 
> 
> Thank you! These tracks sound great! Was this hard to achieve? I always liked how versatile VSL seemed but it's definitely a scary thing to see that gigantic library of instruments.
> ...


I used their expression maps in Cubase, which helped. I wouldn’t say it was hard to achieve because of the library. There is always a lot of tweaking to do with any library.


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## Laurin Lenschow (Mar 27, 2021)

Flymania117 said:


> I see! What would you say makes Nucleus your recommendation above the others? I definitely had it under my radar but didn't want to move forward with a purchase without getting to know about some of the other options through someone with more experience


If you want a single library that covers the entire orchestra and offers control over individual sections, MA 1-3, Albion One, Majestica and Jaeger are already ruled out, because they are either too specific, "incomplete" or they only consist of ensemble patches.

Nucleus and The Orchestra both are great libraries, but both in terms of tone and consistent quality I would go with Nucleus. Nucleus also comes with soloists, The Orchestra doesn't.


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## vinnie2k (Apr 3, 2021)

Kirk Hunter Virtuoso anyone?


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## from_theashes (Apr 4, 2021)

Definitely wait for sales! You likely can get BBCSO Core for 220€ On spring sale in may.

Another option on a budget might be East West Composer Cloud subscription ($29 per month) with their Hollywood Orchestra, if you don’t mind subscription based models.


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## bill5 (Apr 8, 2021)

Check Amadeus. Only $150 for a full orchestra with ALL the solos and various ensembles too. 

Also keep in mind VSL requires the hardware iLok dongle in case that's a thing.


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## secondtiersound (Apr 9, 2021)

Hello! I wanted to second Nucleus (AudioImperia is pretty good in general) and BBC, IF you are after orchestral music. Nucleus is more bombastic, and BBC is more versatile but requires more knowledge.

Also, the Eastwest composer cloud is not bad at all, you get the Hollywood orchestra, which is still really good despite its age. A fair warning though, that library is complex and confusing, but with some experience you can still create really good music. I happen to have a few youtube videos about it. (sorry for the unashamed plug, but if you need it... ) Anyway, the good thing about the subscription is that you can try a month, and stop it if it is not for you, and you have not lost a lot of money. Also, if you don't like subscriptions, the Diamond version of the library has a sale about twice a year, where it usually is around the budget you have and you get the most complete Orchestral Library out there.

I like Native Instruments Komplete, it gives you a lot, but it is not a good choice if you are after Orchestral Libraries.
But,
Right now, as I write this, Cinesamples have partnered with Native Instruments and they have a fantastic offer. I would buy that package (I think it is within your budget) and you would get all you need for Orchestration and then some. Otherwise Cinesamples has CineSymphony which is a complete library. It is good, but not outstanding.

OrchestraTools is the best out there (in my mind) but you pay for that as well... They do have the library Inspire, which is really good as a package, but a little spendy, and not as good as other libraries. These packaged libraries tend to skimp on the quality a bit.

Lastly,
Sure, some libraries are a bit better than other ones, but it really comes down to EXPERIENCE and KNOWLEDGE about the library. ALL libraries require tweaking and knowhow in order to sound good. So, my advice is actually to listen to demo songs by the company AND good reviews that show what you can create (NOT just what each patch sounds like individually) and then buy that library that you fancy. Stick with it, learn it in and out, master it. That is how you sound good. The search for the library that makes you sound good is search in vain. If you don't know the library, you won't sound good no matter the quality. And ALL libraries have problems, and no library can really do EVERYTHING well.

I hope that helped someone.
Cheers!


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