# What is the cheapest iPad that can be used for StaffPad in 2021?



## CatOrchestra (Sep 28, 2021)

The best of the best is the safest bet. But what was the cheapest iPad that you tried that you found to be functional for the iPad (For writing a 12 player/instrument piece, and with the basic sounds.)? 

I have been thinking of getting an iPad for my commute. Been thinking of getting the new iPad Mini or the new standard iPad.


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## Pseudonym (Oct 1, 2021)

The new iPad Pro 12.9" is great in terms of space, and ability to see quite a bit of the score at one time, but it's beastly heavy!


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## rnb_2 (Oct 1, 2021)

I have not used Staffpad, but am familiar with several iPad models.

The new iPad mini is fantastic - performance is about equal to the 2018 iPad Pro (but with a better GPU), it works with the Apple Pencil 2 (easier to hold and charge than the original model), and is obviously the best for portability. The screen will probably be cramped for Staffpad, but rotating to landscape might be a partial solution (depending on how exactly Staffpad handles the smaller screen).

The base iPad has a much bigger screen and saves you a few hundred dollars, but only works with the original Apple Pencil, and has a 2-year-old processor. Still, you get a lot for your money, and part of me still prefers the older design for the simplicity and weight savings of the Smart Cover (I never cared about protecting the back of my iPads) vs the mini/Air/Pro, which all require full wrap-around covers with metal in the back (to attach via the iPad's internal magnets).


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## CatOrchestra (Oct 2, 2021)

Pseudonym said:


> The new iPad Pro 12.9" is great in terms of space, and ability to see quite a bit of the score at one time, but it's beastly heavy!


The Pros are lovely for sure! But, how do the older generations (from the past 1-4 years) hold up?

Maybe I should get them 2nd hand? Do all of these older models hold up well with staffpad?

12.9-inch (4th generation, March 2020, with Apple A12Z bionic, 6GB RAM)
12.9-inch (3rd generation, 2018, November, with Apple A12X bionic 4GB RAM)
12.9-inch (2nd generation, 2017, June with Apple A10X Fusion, 4GB RAM)



rnb_2 said:


> I have not used Staffpad, but am familiar with several iPad models.
> 
> The new iPad mini is fantastic - performance is about equal to the 2018 iPad Pro (but with a better GPU), it works with the Apple Pencil 2 (easier to hold and charge than the original model), and is obviously the best for portability. The screen will probably be cramped for Staffpad, but rotating to landscape might be a partial solution (depending on how exactly Staffpad handles the smaller screen).
> 
> The base iPad has a much bigger screen and saves you a few hundred dollars, but only works with the original Apple Pencil, and has a 2-year-old processor. Still, you get a lot for your money, and part of me still prefers the older design for the simplicity and weight savings of the Smart Cover (I never cared about protecting the back of my iPads) vs the mini/Air/Pro, which all require full wrap-around covers with metal in the back (to attach via the iPad's internal magnets).



That is a nice introduction of the state of iPads, thank you! I have not really kept up with iPads. A bit of a luxury thing for me. I have been considering getting the iPad 9th gen. Is it correct to assume that the *Apple A12X Bionic *processor with 4gbs ram is still much faster than the A13 processor with 3gbs ram that you find in the 9th gen iPad?


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## rnb_2 (Oct 2, 2021)

CatOrchestra said:


> The Pros are lovely for sure! But, how do the older generations (from the past 1-4 years) hold up?
> 
> Maybe I should get them 2nd hand? Do all of these older models hold up well with staffpad?
> 
> ...


Yes - the A12X is still 40%+ faster than the A13 in multi-core and Metal (GPU), though the A13 is about 15% faster in single-core. The A12X has four performance cores vs two in the A13, but the A15 in the new mini is very close to the A12X/A12Z in multi-core and is faster in Metal by about 25%.

If you can find a deal on the current iPad Air, it’s also a good option - not quite as fast as the new mini, but faster in single-core and Metal than the A12X/Z, and not much slower in multi-core.


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## CatOrchestra (Oct 2, 2021)

rnb_2 said:


> Yes - the A12X is still 40%+ faster than the A13 in multi-core and Metal (GPU), though the A13 is about 15% faster in single-core. The A12X has four performance cores vs two in the A13, but the A15 in the new mini is very close to the A12X/A12Z in multi-core and is faster in Metal by about 25%.
> 
> If you can find a deal on the current iPad Air, it’s also a good option - not quite as fast as the new mini, but faster in single-core and Metal than the A12X/Z, and not much slower in multi-core.


Thank you so much! Will keep an eye for 2nd hand deals iPad Pros with either A12X/A12Z or the current Air. 

Do you know of any good sites that aggregate these scores? 

Though it is outside my budget, is it correct that the M1 provides a much greater leap than previous CPU upgrades?


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## rnb_2 (Oct 2, 2021)

Yes, the M1 is in a class by itself, since it’s the newest processor with four performance cores. The go-to site for benchmarks is Geekbench - the iOS charts are here.


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## CatOrchestra (Oct 2, 2021)

Thank you! It feels like for each generation on that chart, the improvements are steady rather predictable improvements, but M1 provides with a giant leap.

Another bench-marking app/aggregator I found was


iOS Ranking - AnTuTu Benchmark - Know Your Phone Better


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## rnb_2 (Oct 2, 2021)

Because of the X-variant cadence (they don't usually happen in consecutive processor versions), the gains are usually dramatic between generations of iPad Pro. The M1 (which could also have been called the A14X) is over 50% faster than the A12X/Z, which was over twice as fast as the A10X, which was twice as fast as the A9X in the original iPad Pro. This is due to two factors: two processor generations of performance gains between X variants, combined with one or more of the following: more cores, faster clock speeds, and/or process shrinks (which increase the number of transistors while reducing heat and power usage). The M1 combined two of the three - faster clock (3.2GHz vs 2.5GHz for A12X/Z) and a process shrink from 7nm to 5nm.

In any case, it's amazing to see what the constant drumbeat of consistent, incremental improvements leads to: the M1 iPad Pro is six times faster in multi-core than the first iPad Pro from 2015, almost three times faster in single-core, and over five times in GPU Compute.


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## CatOrchestra (Oct 2, 2021)

That is cool to hear! What happened between the releases of A12X and A12Z? It seems that on the benchmarks that these processors nearly get the same results on Geekbench.


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## rnb_2 (Oct 2, 2021)

CatOrchestra said:


> That is cool to hear! What happened between the releases of A12X and A12Z? It seems that on the benchmarks that these processors nearly get the same results on Geekbench.


The A12X had 7 GPU cores - it was an 8-core GPU design, but if one of the cores failed to pass final testing, they could still use it, and if they all passed, they'd just deactivate one. By the time the A12Z came out, TSMC had gotten yields up to the point where they could activate the 8th GPU core, so that's the only difference in the benchmarks. The Z variant probably only exists because they wanted to get the LIDAR module into a product before they put it in the iPhone 12 Pro last fall (so that developers could start programming for it), and they didn't want to rev the hardware for just the camera/LIDAR module, so they activated that 8th GPU core and gave it a new name.


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## Voider (Oct 2, 2021)

I've thought of getting Staffpad in the future as well, is there any particular reason to limit oneself to apple devices? From their website it looks like they offer it for windows too, wouldn't a tablet that can run windows do the job for way fewer money?


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## rnb_2 (Oct 2, 2021)

Voider said:


> I've thought of getting Staffpad in the future as well, is there any particular reason to limit oneself to apple devices? From their website it looks like they offer it for windows too, wouldn't a tablet that can run windows do the job for way fewer money?


Staffpad will work on any recent iPad, so that goes down to the $329 base iPad (plus the $99 Pencil). They do recommend the current iPad Pro, but they also recommend the Surface Pro line on the Windows side, so pricing at the higher end is pretty similar (a Surface Pro i5/8GB/128GB and 12.9" iPad Pro M1/8GB/128GB both start at $1099). I'm not sure if there are Windows 2-in-1s or tablets at the $329 level that support an active pen (required by Staffpad), or if there is anything competitive with the iPad mini or iPad Air around those price points.

An iPad is the lightest option that I'm aware of (the Surface Pro starts at around 2lbs, where the 12.9" iPad Pro is 1.5, and the 11" is 1lb), and the M1 should outperform any Intel processor that will fit in a Surface Pro.

There may be other considerations in both directions. I imagine anyone who is already comfortable with Windows won't have a problem with using something like a Surface Pro for Staffpad, whereas anybody on a Mac would probably gravitate to the iPad option. My gut feeling is that you can get in the door for a bit less with a lower-end iPad and have a decent experience, but as the price point goes up, Windows becomes a comparable option if you're comfortable going that way, especially if you're in a position to make something like a Surface Pro your main computer.


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## CatOrchestra (Oct 3, 2021)

rnb_2 said:


> The A12X had 7 GPU cores - it was an 8-core GPU design, but if one of the cores failed to pass final testing, they could still use it, and if they all passed, they'd just deactivate one. By the time the A12Z came out, TSMC had gotten yields up to the point where they could activate the 8th GPU core, so that's the only difference in the benchmarks. The Z variant probably only exists because they wanted to get the LIDAR module into a product before they put it in the iPhone 12 Pro last fall (so that developers could start programming for it), and they didn't want to rev the hardware for just the camera/LIDAR module, so they activated that 8th GPU core and gave it a new name.


I see, that is interesting. Thank you for the explanations in the thread : ), I find them to be very helpful.


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## el-bo (Oct 3, 2021)

I've never used Staffpad. However, one thing to consider, if you're also looking to do art or use the iPad to take notes, is that although iPencil2 is a marked improvement over the first iteration, there is still quite noticeable lag without a 120hz refresh-rate screen.


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## CatOrchestra (Oct 3, 2021)

el-bo said:


> I've never used Staffpad. However, one thing to consider, if you're also looking to do art or use the iPad to take notes, is that although iPencil2 is a marked improvement over the first iteration, there is still quite noticeable lag without a 120hz refresh-rate screen.


I see! I thought that the previous gen iPad pros were hailed as wonderful for drawing. Luckily most of my uses would not be pen related.


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## el-bo (Oct 3, 2021)

CatOrchestra said:


> I thought that the previous gen iPad pros were hailed as wonderful for drawing.


They are/were. But things just kept getting better, it seems. If you'd never tried the iP2 @120hx, you'd be fine. But it took all of about 10 seconds of in-store comparison for me to decide that I'd never be happy with even iP2 on an iPad Air.

My use case would be different, though i.e Heavy note-taking. I also have never owned any of the pencil iterations or the iPads that are compatible with them, so I can't say whether the more detectable lag is something that is too noticeable once used to it.

I'd recommend going to an AppleStore and trying out the different options


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## CatOrchestra (Oct 3, 2021)

el-bo said:


> They are/were. But things just kept getting better, it seems. If you'd never tried the iP2 @120hx, you'd be fine. But it took all of about 10 seconds of in-store comparison for me to decide that I'd never be happy with even iP2 on an iPad Air.
> 
> My use case would be different, though i.e Heavy note-taking. I also have never owned any of the pencil iterations or the iPads that are compatible with them, so I can't say whether the more detectable lag is something that is too noticeable once used to it.
> 
> I'd recommend going to an AppleStore and trying out the different options


Sounds like something I should not do  with the bliss from ignorance being the best for me. But honestly, I had a look at the iPad Pro but did not feel much of a difference for me. 

I only use classical pen and paper for my note-taking.


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## CatOrchestra (Oct 3, 2021)

A good review about the input pen lag (not much lag), and the iPad 9 in general, and about the "limited" ram.


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## el-bo (Oct 5, 2021)

CatOrchestra said:


> A good review about the input pen lag (not much lag), and the iPad 9 in general, and about the "limited" ram.



Whether the lag is acceptable (Yes, it's definitely noticeable) will be for each user to decide.

Lag-free writing is something that's been hardwired into me (I'm sure for most others, also) for almost as long as I've been alive. For my needs, I'd rather take a hit on other features, power, storage etc. to get as close to a lag-free writing experience as possible. Perhaps by the time I can afford one I'll be able to get a cheap, second-hand 'pro' model.

I'd still recommend you try the different options, in store


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## CatOrchestra (Oct 6, 2021)

Fair enough : ), will have a 2nd look to see if I notice a difference now.


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## dcoscina (Oct 6, 2021)

At least the iPad Air 4 if you want to write anything reasonably big. Don’t try it on a mini- not enough screen real estate. And the base model would not be good for larger orchestral works. 

I started with an Air3 and found I needed more horsepower so I went up to the 2020 Pro 11” last year. Haven’t looked back. Pieces that would have issues in the Air 3 run beautifully on the pro. It just depends how much time you want to spend using Staffpad. I use it for all my concert works now so I need something with power to handle large works and the expansion libraries. You might not…


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## CatOrchestra (Oct 9, 2021)

dcoscina said:


> At least the iPad Air 4 if you want to write anything reasonably big. Don’t try it on a mini- not enough screen real estate. And the base model would not be good for larger orchestral works.
> 
> I started with an Air3 and found I needed more horsepower so I went up to the 2020 Pro 11” last year. Haven’t looked back. Pieces that would have issues in the Air 3 run beautifully on the pro. It just depends how much time you want to spend using Staffpad. I use it for all my concert works now so I need something with power to handle large works and the expansion libraries. You might not…


Thank you!

I would be just using small assembles and stock libraries.

A review about drawing with the iPad 9th gen


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