# Video tutorials about mixing orchestral mockups?



## Consona (Oct 28, 2014)

Are there any good ones?

Seems like everyone with YT channel is making those composition walkthroughs, but I'd be really interested in some videos about mixing.

Like I'm trying to get close to sound of Baldur's Gate: Enhanced Edition soundtrack (http://youtu.be/Imca73o350k (The Black Pits - Main Theme Preview)), but I'm just tweaking eq and wet reverb knobs and nothing good comes out of my monitors. :lol:

I've read a lot of those _300Hz - muddiness, 3kHz - harshness_ kind of books, but I guess I need to see somebody putting the actual mix together or dissecting it. 

Any suggestions? Thank you!


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## Andrew Goodwin (Oct 28, 2014)

It's not orchestral mixing but this guy has a lot of good videos(111 to be exact): 

Dave Pensado, Into The Lair:
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLFC57D274A1E94943

He also has a short series about how to hear different frequencies and there are some dissecting a mix videos. Bound to learn some useful stuff that can apply to orchestral mixes


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## CDNmusic (Oct 28, 2014)

Very interested as well to watch some good mixing tutorials, practical use of reverbs (IRs, ERs, tails, etc), eq, positioning, etc, etc, etc.

Edit: Pretty good stuff in those tutorials Andrew, thanks for sharing.


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## Consona (Oct 28, 2014)

*@Andrew Goodwin*: Thank you for suggestion, I watch Pensado's channel regularly.  


For example these woodwinds at 0:04-0:15 - http://youtu.be/VsT4jZQMhjc (Dorn the Punisher - Sam Hulick - Baldur's Gate: Enhanced Edition)

I have Cinewinds Pro and QL Spaces, but I cannot recreate that type of sound whatsoever. Sounds like the body of instruments is somewhat cut by eq, I don't know... and I cannot figure out the dry/wet level of reverb either. Sitting by my PC whole day, tweaking knobs... :roll: :lol:


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## pavolbrezina (Oct 28, 2014)

I am searching for this kind of stuff for a long time, but without success. And I am not talking only about mixing mockups, but even standard classical recordings. It seems that nobody makes this tutorials... I do believe, that it is completely different approach than mixing pop music.


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## Andrew Goodwin (Oct 29, 2014)

@Consona I don't yet have a dedicated WW library, but it sounds like the instrument is very mid rangy, it doesn't have a lot of high end or low end. Honestly I would load the instrument, turn off any close mics, roll off some top end say at 5k and low end around 250hz and add a delay. Then tweak hope that helps a little, just my 2 cents


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## Consona (Oct 29, 2014)

Andrew Goodwin @ Wed Oct 29 said:


> @Consona I don't yet have a dedicated WW library, but it sounds like the instrument is very mid rangy, it doesn't have a lot of high end or low end. Honestly I would load the instrument, turn off any close mics, roll off some top end say at 5k and low end around 250hz and add a delay. Then tweak hope that helps a little, just my 2 cents


I've tried that but I cannot reproduce that softness kind of sound. Everytime some frequency just sticks out too much making the sound too much concrete. The example sounds like far in the room but not over-reverbed at the same time.

Here's another one http://youtu.be/tl0fLl_r1MI (Baldur's Gate: Enhanced Edition - Music Preview). It's maybe just particular eq and reverb usage, but I cannot figure that out. And I know Sam Hulick is using Berlin WW, CineBrass, Cinematic Strings and ValhallaRoom Reverb, which are standard libraries, nothing like Spitfire Bespoke, so it must be a mix thing.

Thank you for help, nevertheless.


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## Mike Marino (Oct 29, 2014)

I, too, have been looking for tutorials about mixing orchestral samples and have come up empty. The closest I've found is this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hp6bKIJ-chQ


- Mike


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## Consona (Oct 29, 2014)

Oh, and maybe I should have made separate threads for _Video tutorials_ and _How to get that Baldur's Gate: Enhanced Edition sound_, but it doesn't matter since both endeavours failed miserably. :lol:


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## tokatila (Oct 29, 2014)

Consona @ Wed Oct 29 said:


> _How to get that Baldur's Gate: Enhanced Edition sound_, :lol:



You need to be at least lvl 25 Bard to acquire that Lore.

To offer something helpful, you might try to mockup something you have access to (score) and then autoeq it.

Or you might want to try a program like TrainYourEars EQ (no affiliation, there must be more). You can take any sound/music file you want and test yourself and train your ears what different EQ cuts & boosts sound like. http://www.trainyourears.com/train-your ... q-edition/


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## Cinesamples (Oct 29, 2014)

We have some tutorials along those lines. More to come...


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## ryans (Oct 29, 2014)

I definitely recommend the Dave Pensado videos. Watch them all... may not be dedicated to 'orchestral' mixing but the principles are the same.

EDIT: You already have, sorry... missed that.

Ryan


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## Jetzer (Oct 29, 2014)

I sense a little gap in the market...


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## Consona (Oct 31, 2014)

As far as my research for BGEE sound goes, I listened to some Altiverb 7 examples and that reverb can make sound that is really close to what I'm searching for and QL Spaces really cannot do. So maybe it's not about mixing techniques but about equipment... and Altiverb is something really expensive. :/




CineSamples @ Wed Oct 29 said:


> More to come...


Great news than! Thank you.


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## pavolbrezina (Oct 31, 2014)

Consona @ Fri Oct 31 said:


> So maybe it's not about mixing techniques but about equipment... and Altiverb is something really expensive. :/



No, it is about mixing.


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## Consona (Oct 31, 2014)

pavolbrezina @ Fri Oct 31 said:


> No, it is about mixing.


I hope so, but I've tried like everything with eq and reverb and VSS 2 and compressor and saturation plugin and still was not able to match the particular quality of that sound. ( http://youtu.be/VsT4jZQMhjc 0:04-0:15 )


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## LTSF (Nov 4, 2014)

Does no one on this forum have the answer?


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## kurtvanzo (Nov 5, 2014)

As a mixer I'm often asked to match another sound and there can be several issues. The original tone of the strings can be so different that nothing you do is going to match, but Ozone 5 (a mastering plugin that runs about $150 on plugindiscount.com) can do an "eq match" where it will analise the source sound and apply an eq to match the sound on the destination sound (other plugins may have this too) helps when you have a source to match- but eq is normally a hit and miss thing- you need a parametric with adjustable Q (like fabfilter q or Protools stock eq) to lock in on the frequencies you like (or remove the ones you don't). Besides that, yes, on orchestral it's all about the reverb. I've tried many and only like a real Lexicon 480L (5k$$$) or Altiverb ($500) so to me it's an easy choice (try plugindiscount.com for best price) because it can do thousands of rooms that you can switch between and tweak. My favorite is the 20th century Fox scoring stage but my bet is I could find a reverb that matches your samples exactly. A tip when testing reverb is to try it on a solo instrument or voice with nothing else- does it sound like a real room or digital fuzziness? Most reverbs don't pass this test, and it's why Altiverb (and Lexicon before it) stand out as worth $500. Remind yourself you only use certain instruments on certain songs and pay 200-500 for them- but Reverb goes on almost everything and ties the orchestra together- placing them in the same room. It's worth the investment if you really want a high quality mix sound.


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## José Herring (Nov 5, 2014)

I did one about a year ago. It was my first Screencast so it's not perfect. And, if I had it to do over again, I'd change a few things. But, if it's useful to you you can watch it here. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vr3WMWU9TQQ


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## MDesigner (Nov 17, 2014)

Hey guys, I'm flattered someone thinks my mixes sound that good! 8) 

Simpler is always better! I don't use any fancy bells & whistles like VSS. I use two reverb instances maximum. In this case, I believe I used ValhallaRoom, though since then I've moved on to R2 by Exponential Audio which is fantastic. I feel like I'm getting better mixes with R2 (maybe), not to mention I've started narrowing stereo fields of solo instruments while panning them. Note: not folding them to mono, just narrowing them. Out of the box, many solo instrument samples are too wide and clutter up the mix. An example of a more recent mix of mine with the new reverb and stereo narrowing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oe9p7vf2qB8

Consona: There's no fancy EQ'ing going on in that section of the Baldur's Gate cue, really (which incidentally is "The Great Tree," not "Dorn the Punisher"). If those winds sound "dark" it's because they're mostly low winds. If I recall correctly, bassoon, bass clarinet, contrabassoon, etc.


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## Consona (Nov 18, 2014)

Thank you very much guys for responses.



pavolbrezina @ Fri Oct 31 said:


> No, it is about mixing.


So it seems you were right.  

*@kurtvanzo:* That reverb thing is tricky. I've heard some really nice mixes with ValhallaRoom which is 50$ reverb. IMHO, it's much more about mixing and orchestration skills than what exact reverb you use.

*@josejherring:* I've seen it already and still hoping you'll do some more.  

*@MDesigner:* Yea, I think your mixes sound that good.  I really like those orchestral ones from soundtracks to Baldur's Gate EE 1 and 2 or Conclave. I could not believe it's just ValhallaRoom when I was watching your Walkthrough video.  
It's interesting that "Fates Forever - Music Samples" mix sounds very differently from your BG and Conclave stuff although I'd bet you've used same libraries to make them all.
I hope one day you will make video about mixing your stuff for noobs like me to learn some more useful things. 
Once again thank you for response and clarification!


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## MDesigner (Nov 18, 2014)

Yes, you're right. BGEE's mix sounds a little "deeper" or darker. Fates Forever has a more up-front and brighter sound. I think that just comes down to mixing in less of a wet signal in the reverb (in Fates). Pretty much the same samples though.


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## tokatila (Nov 18, 2014)

MDesigner @ Tue Nov 18 said:


> Yes, you're right. BGEE's mix sounds a little "deeper" or darker. Fates Forever has a more up-front and brighter sound. I think that just comes down to mixing in less of a wet signal in the reverb (in Fates). Pretty much the same samples though.



Hey Mr, Sam. Nice trailer music for Fates Forever! I browsed through your YouTube channel and noticed that you have this sample library walk-through from the beginning of the 2013, and just wanted to know that have you changed your go-to orchestral samples since that for example for this trailer?


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## John Rodd (Nov 18, 2014)

MDesigner @ Mon Nov 17 said:


> .... *Simpler is always better!* I don't use any fancy bells & whistles like VSS. I use two reverb instances maximum......



Good advice!!! Less is more.

:D


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## José Herring (Nov 18, 2014)

Consona @ Tue Nov 18 said:


> Thank you very much guys for responses.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Oh sorry, I hadn't realized you'd seen it.

I do plan more. I just need a better way to do screen cast with zoom in and out.


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## Peter Alexander (Nov 26, 2014)

Yes - The Visual Orchestration Trilogy and specifically within that VO3 - Doing the BASIC Virtual Orchestral Mix

http://www.alexanderpublishing.com/Depa ... ation.aspx


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