# Spitfire Audio - Kepler Orchestra - Available NOW



## Spitfire Team (May 15, 2019)

*Kepler Orchestra Is Available Now

Learn more: https://www.spitfireaudio.com/shop/a-z/kepler-orchestra/

In Case You Missed It: Kepler Orchestra LIVE



Watch Paul's Walkthrough:



NEW - Christian's Contextual Video:


*​


----------



## Zero&One (May 15, 2019)

And I thought the the world revolved around me... hmmm


----------



## Alex Fraser (May 15, 2019)

_"A new library, designed to capture the sound of Deep Space. We aimed to record the extreme silence which occurs when there are no molecules to vibrate and generate sound."
_
That, or eDNA Earth 2.


----------



## whiskers (May 15, 2019)

Alex Fraser said:


> _"A new library, designed to capture the sound of Deep Space. We aimed to record the extreme silence which occurs when there are no molecules to vibrate and generate sound."
> _
> That, or eDNA Earth 2.


my first thought was an eDNA update or another swarm. but they just revamped eDNA Earth, like what, mid-late 2018? Maybe Christian's finally releasing the cartridge he mentioned awhile back?


----------



## rottoy (May 15, 2019)

whiskers said:


> Maybe Christian's finally releasing the cartridge he mentioned awhile back?


----------



## Denkii (May 15, 2019)

I'm thinking about output movement for some reason.


----------



## bbunker (May 15, 2019)

Kerb-o-dyne Strings?


----------



## Syneast (May 15, 2019)

I'm thinking Albion TWO, considering Loegria was just scrapped.


----------



## sostenuto (May 15, 2019)

CH has signed up for Bezos' Moon shot !


----------



## MisteR (May 15, 2019)

JGCT?


----------



## smallberries (May 15, 2019)

Alex Fraser said:


> _"A new library, designed to capture the sound of Deep Space. We aimed to record the extreme silence which occurs when there are no molecules to vibrate and generate sound."
> _
> That, or eDNA Earth 2.



And here I thought the sound of Deep Space was a DX7 with lots of reverb.
Though I'd prefer Ligeti tone clusters, if only the vocalists could find some air.


----------



## rottoy (May 15, 2019)

smallberries said:


> Though I'd prefer Ligeti tone clusters, if only the vocalists could find some air.


Plenty of Air in Lyndhurst Hall!


----------



## Bear Market (May 15, 2019)

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that this has something to do with Kepler (the astronomer).


----------



## The Darris (May 15, 2019)

Isn't this teaser just an example of what Orchestral Tools already did with Time Macro? The one thing that comes to mind is the Pendulum Swell patches.


----------



## Dr.Quest (May 15, 2019)

Whatever it is it sounds beautiful.


----------



## whiskers (May 15, 2019)

The Darris said:


> Isn't this teaser just an example of what Orchestral Tools already did with Time Macro? The one thing that comes to mind is the Pendulum Swell patches.


think you might be on to something there.


----------



## ccarreira (May 15, 2019)

London Contemporary Orchestra on the Moon.


----------



## ism (May 15, 2019)

ccarreira said:


> London Contemporary Orchestra on the Moon.



You had me at "London Contemporary Orchestra"


----------



## prodigalson (May 15, 2019)

The Darris said:


> Isn't this teaser just an example of what Orchestral Tools already did with Time Macro? The one thing that comes to mind is the Pendulum Swell patches.



Funny, because Time Macro always seemed to basically what Spitfire had already done with Orchestral Swarm and the Evo series.


----------



## The Darris (May 15, 2019)

prodigalson said:


> Funny, because Time Macro always seemed to basically what Spitfire had already done with Orchestral Swarm and the Evo series.


You know, despite there seeming like they are similar, they are quite different. I feel like TIME's only real argument to separate itself from SWARM and EVOs is that it is far more orchestral whereas Spitfire's offerings are far more experimental. Both sort of stand on their own in that right. My point is that based on what I'm hearing in that very short teaser, it's much closer to the approach that OT took with TIME. 

To be clear. I bought TIME. I've yet to use it in a project. Haha. I own nearly all the EVOs and Orchestral Swarm and usually end up throwing a patch or two from those libraries onto a project. Based on Spitfire's track record with experimental orchestral libraries, I'm hoping this one knocks it out of the park and offers something genuinely new and innovative the way the EVO series was.


----------



## theStyg (May 15, 2019)

"Christian Henson, here. And we recorded the entire orchestra... IN SPACE."


----------



## bbunker (May 15, 2019)

So since the distance between the two foci determines the eccentricity of the orbit, this has be something eccentric, eh?


----------



## emasters (May 15, 2019)

Syneast said:


> I'm thinking Albion TWO, considering Loegria was just scrapped.



Was wondering the same.....


----------



## dogdad (May 15, 2019)

theStyg said:


> "Christian Henson, here. And we recorded the entire orchestra... IN SPACE."


It would definitely be a dry library!


----------



## Random Guy (May 15, 2019)

Definitely Hans Zimmer Xylophone.


----------



## theStyg (May 15, 2019)

Random Guy said:


> Definitely Hans Zimmer Xylophone.


With Triangle expansion pack???


----------



## Saxer (May 16, 2019)

What will this be*e**eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee**ee*ee?


----------



## rotho (May 16, 2019)

I think this could be like the semi time rubs in EWC. I might as well face it it’s pretty inevitable I get it. I have almost all the other SF stuff esp the experimental types


----------



## ccarreira (May 16, 2019)

I'm curious if there is a new type of GUI.


----------



## Raphioli (May 16, 2019)

F1 and F2 probably mean Flute 1 and Flute 2 and not "force".
The blue dot is the mic. So they're moving the mic around Flute 1 and 2 while recording them and creating a new type of evo.

Reminds me of how Matrix shot that bullet time scene.



Spoiler



I'm obviously joking of course. And sorry I know, it was a boring joke...


----------



## ccarreira (May 16, 2019)

Raphioli said:


> F1 and F2 probably mean Flute 1 and Flute 2 and not "force".
> The blue dot is the mic. So they're moving the mic around Flute 1 and 2 while recording them and creating a new type of evo.
> 
> Reminds me of how Matrix shot that bullet time scene.
> ...



Orchestral vector synthesis? That would be nice


----------



## AdamKmusic (May 16, 2019)

Binaural / surround textures or evos?


----------



## mgpqa1 (May 16, 2019)

Maybe they’re getting into effects... some plugin to position audio in a 3d “space”


----------



## ism (May 16, 2019)

mgpqa1 said:


> Maybe they’re getting into effects... some plugin to position audio in a 3d “space”



I suppose some kind of surround mixing features added to the spitfire player is perfectly plausible. 

I'm still hoping that it somehow involves a new clarinet though. Always number one on my spitfire wish list.


----------



## AllanH (May 16, 2019)

I would be interesting if they offered a more dynamic "stage placement" as part of their product line, including depth and location in the stereo image.


----------



## ka00 (May 16, 2019)

I was sitting under an apple tree this morning, and then had a sudden insight about what this could all mean. But please feel free to check my math on this...


----------



## whiskers (May 16, 2019)

Law Two:



Sounds like another evo?


----------



## Vladimir Bulaev (May 16, 2019)




----------



## jbuhler (May 16, 2019)

whiskers said:


> Sounds like another evo?


I was thinking maybe something more like tempo-synced swells and waves (sustains and pulses), perhaps with an evo-like grid to score on the fly. But whatever it is, it sounds great.


----------



## whiskers (May 16, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> I was thinking maybe something more like tempo-synced swells and waves (sustains and pulses), perhaps with an evo-like grid to score on the fly. But whatever it is, it sounds great.


Yep, agree on that. IDK for how useful that would be though


----------



## jbuhler (May 16, 2019)

whiskers said:


> Yep, agree on that. IDK for how useful that would be though


I'm a sucker for these sorts of things. And I'm always looking for more tools to do better controlled swells.


----------



## MauroPantin (May 16, 2019)

Each of these first two videos are the two first Kepler laws of planetary motion. So there's gonna be a third.

1- All planets move about the Sun in elliptical orbits, having the Sun as one of the foci (F1).
2- A radius vector joining any planet to the Sun sweeps out equal areas in equal lengths of time.
3- The squares of the sidereal periods of the planets are directly proportional to the cubes of their mean distances from the Sun.

Since they are referrencing laws of planetary motion this probably has something to do with orbits, which are periodic. So... Sounds arranged in some form of periodic way? Rather than EVOs which are a straight line forward, these would be a circle? My guess anyway...


----------



## fiestared (May 16, 2019)

mgpqa1 said:


> Maybe they’re getting into effects... some plugin to position audio in a 3d “space”


----------



## Mornats (May 16, 2019)

My money is (probably literally) on eDNA: Keplar, a new expansion for eDNA Earth.


----------



## ism (May 16, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> I was thinking maybe something more like tempo-synced swells and waves (sustains and pulses), perhaps with an evo-like grid to score on the fly. But whatever it is, it sounds great.



Yes, something that takes the experience of the rhythmic Evo (evo 3?) and filters it through the success of the OACE waves (which turned out to more practical in their realization than you might have thought, doubtlessly having learned from previous evos) seems kind of an obvious next step now that you mention it.

I find Evo 3, kind of fun, but in practice much more niche than I would have thought. Whereas the waves are much more all purpose (seriously, there’s almost nowhere I wouldn’t use them, though maybe that’s just me). The ‘pendulum swings’ of time Macro while they make for a nice high concept demo, are also a little too, I don’t know, ‘high concept’ or some something, to be all that useful in practice.


----------



## D Halgren (May 16, 2019)

Orchestra through a Leslie?


----------



## StillLife (May 16, 2019)

I think it is something big, more than 'another' evo or an Edna cartridge. They have a special event on 23 may scheduled to unveil it. That's not for every library, I think? Only for the big ones (Tundra, Hans Zimmer Strings, if I recall correctly).


----------



## Zero&One (May 16, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> I was thinking maybe something more like tempo-synced swells and waves (sustains and pulses), perhaps with an evo-like grid to score on the fly. But whatever it is, it sounds great.



Yeah I agree, sounds lovely especially that second pass of Law Two.
I was even trying to mix the 2 videos and it sound great having them slightly off.


----------



## Geoff Grace (May 16, 2019)

I think that a Doppler effect option would go nicely with what we’ve seen so far. 

Best,

Geoff


----------



## JT (May 16, 2019)

You can already use Eric Whitacre for deep space.


----------



## whiskers (May 17, 2019)

Law Three

Really does have a time macro feel to it


----------



## Fry777 (May 17, 2019)

whiskers said:


> Law Three
> 
> Really does have a time macro feel to it




Interesting how the elliptic movement speed of the planets correspond to those swells... a hint to controllable swells as someone else was predicting before ?


----------



## whiskers (May 17, 2019)

Fry777 said:


> Interesting how the elliptic movement speed of the planets correspond to those swells... a hint to controllable swells as someone else was predicting before ?


Yeah, I think @jbuhler might be right on the money here...


----------



## smallberries (May 17, 2019)

Fry777 said:


> Interesting how the elliptic movement speed of the planets correspond to those swells... a hint to controllable swells as someone else was predicting before ?



I'm thinking this is more a demonstration of how humans will find sync between audio and visual, whether it's there or not...


----------



## whiskers (May 17, 2019)

smallberries said:


> I'm thinking this is more a demonstration of how humans will find sync between audio and visual, whether it's there or not...


Eh, see what you're saying but definitely seems intentional


----------



## Soundhound (May 17, 2019)

Law 3 is reminding me of the Waves Brauer Motion plugin. Maybe here with multiple source material, each moving at different speeds, something like that...


----------



## lucor (May 18, 2019)

Check your emails, just got a download link from Spitfire for some demo patches for the "Kepler Orchestra".


----------



## gussunkri (May 18, 2019)

Cool!!! I just received a demo of this library in the email. What a great idea from Spitfire!


----------



## Zero&One (May 18, 2019)

Yeah, sounds and looks promising.


----------



## Cinebient (May 18, 2019)

Just tested the 2 demos and it really is my cup of tea. Sounds wonderful, mystic, sinister and whatever (especially sound fantastic with my favorite reverb on top). 
So far so great but of course i hope the final instrument/GUI will offer a lot more editing like temp-synced swells and waves etc. Even better would be some physics or math algos (like the granular binaural tool Dust with the flow field) to add....man can dream.
However, if that is a sneak peak and it get some of the deeper editing for at least temp-synced stuff it is an instant buy here. 
Maybe i´m alone but i hoped it would not be a Kontakt instrument since i now prefer the GUI and workflow from HZ-Strings and EWC. 
Spitfire is always for a surprise. I like what it (could) be....


----------



## gussunkri (May 18, 2019)

I think the idea of a preview demo is a great initiative that I hope can become the norm.


----------



## Raphioli (May 18, 2019)

Thanks for the demo Spitfire!
Especially liked the Basses Doppler patch.
It reminds me of Sicario.


----------



## MisteR (May 18, 2019)

Very cool demo on the 50th Anniversary of the Apollo 10 mission.


----------



## Sarah De Carlo (May 18, 2019)

I just pulled down two chords and a simple melody to test the Kepler demo. It is not easy to express myself using only two patches, but my first impression is that it could be a valid product to combine with Phobos. However, I don't particularly like the fact that 'DYNAMICS' controls both the intensity of the sound and the effect, and I would prefer the two parameters to be detached and independent, instead of using the 'volume' as fader.
As it is, it is impossible for me to create a pianissimo with the 'warped' effect, because with the dynamics at a minimum the effect also disappears.

As for the 'bass doppler' preset, the sound descent is not calibrated with the track's tempo and I struggled to find the exact point where to set the midi to make the 'fall' match the beat of the next bar. If the intention is to create a subcategory of 'doppler' effects, I think a time stretching function would be useful.
Good work and I hope I have been helpful.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/ganymede-basses-doppler-spitfire-kepler-orchestra-demo-sarah-de-carlo-mp3.20106/][/AUDIOPLUS]


----------



## MauroPantin (May 18, 2019)

Nice of them to include a small demo. This should be the norm whenever possible.


----------



## tonaliszt (May 18, 2019)

The basses in the demo sound incredible. Looking forward to see how close or different the rest of the library is to that.


----------



## Wolf68 (May 19, 2019)

does anyone know what exactly the kepler orchestra is?


----------



## Zero&One (May 19, 2019)

Wolf68 said:


> does anyone know what exactly the kepler orchestra is?



Dave “keppy” Kepler started an orchestra in the 80s. Tired of Wham, A-Ha, Cindy Lauper and other dominating musical forces at the time, he set out to change music.
During recordings he badly injured himself doing the legendary 80s dance move “the worm”.

The recordings never finished.

Until now... Spitfire meticulously analysed the recordings and mastered them to the finest quality. This is Keppys legacy.


----------



## Mannix (May 19, 2019)

Wow, foreboding, sinister, interesting indeed, I want it. Spitfire might as well pick me up, turn me upside down and shake all of the money out of my pockets


----------



## sostenuto (May 19, 2019)

Will wait to see 'how excited' PT really is on Thurs, before leaping …..


----------



## Michel Simons (May 19, 2019)

sostenuto said:


> Will wait to see 'how excited' PT really is on Thurs, before leaping …..



My guess is that he will be very excited.


----------



## ccarreira (May 19, 2019)

Wolf68 said:


> does anyone know what exactly the kepler orchestra is?



A flying orchestra. Each musician sits on a drone that flies around the mics, in an elaborated choreography. That's why spitfire hired python programmers.


----------



## Soundhound (May 19, 2019)

This is probably just a demo format with limited controls. The actual library I'd think will have ample control over everything you mention and a great deal more (pan for individual elements would be lovely as well) and the gui will look quite different. 

Of course, I'm often wrong as many here will gladly attest. 






Sarah De Carlo said:


> I just pulled down two chords and a simple melody to test the Kepler demo. It is not easy to express myself using only two patches, but my first impression is that it could be a valid product to combine with Phobos. However, I don't particularly like the fact that 'DYNAMICS' controls both the intensity of the sound and the effect, and I would prefer the two parameters to be detached and independent, instead of using the 'volume' as fader.
> As it is, it is impossible for me to create a pianissimo with the 'warped' effect, because with the dynamics at a minimum the effect also disappears.
> 
> As for the 'bass doppler' preset, the sound descent is not calibrated with the track's tempo and I struggled to find the exact point where to set the midi to make the 'fall' match the beat of the next bar. If the intention is to create a subcategory of 'doppler' effects, I think a time stretching function would be useful.
> ...


----------



## WaveRider (May 19, 2019)

Named after astronomer Johannes Kepler. Sounds like it will have a space theme.


----------



## Sarah De Carlo (May 19, 2019)

Soundhound said:


> This is probably just a demo format with limited controls. The actual library I'd think will have ample control over everything you mention and a great deal more (pan for individual elements would be lovely as well) and the gui will look quite different.
> 
> Of course, I'm often wrong as many here will gladly attest.



Maybe... but probably it could be very useful to know for sure, before participating in the pre-order


----------



## Maiestic9 (May 19, 2019)

James H said:


> Dave “keppy” Kepler started an orchestra in the 80s. Tired of Wham, A-Ha, Cindy Lauper and other dominating musical forces at the time, he set out to change music.
> During recordings he badly injured himself doing the legendary 80s dance move “the worm”.
> 
> The recordings never finished.
> ...




Lol. Well played.


----------



## NYC Composer (May 20, 2019)

Very heavily in favor of demo previews. Kudos to Spitfire.


----------



## LinusW (May 20, 2019)

Found use for both demo patches yesterday.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/kepler-swords-mp3.20214/][/AUDIOPLUS]


----------



## redlester (May 21, 2019)

MisteR said:


> Very cool demo on the 50th Anniversary of the Apollo 10 mission.



I was in the Science Museum in London at the weekend, where the Apollo 10 capsule is on display. They had balloons up celebrating its 50th which I thought was very sweet.


----------



## Spitfire Team (May 23, 2019)

We are live on Youtube for the launch. Do come and join in.


----------



## CGR (May 23, 2019)

_*New Mix of previously posted track:*_
I've been checking out the Spitfire Audio Kepler Orchestra demo. Here's a new track of mine which includes both Warped Ganymede & Basses Doppler patches in a contemporary instrumental setting (comes in from the 01:30 mark onwards):


----------



## n9n9n9 (May 23, 2019)

so... I've got it. And I'm getting very annoying popping glitches on attack on most if not all the patches. No problems with other libraries, my disk and CPU are low. Not sure what it is, but it takes the joy out of things. Anyone else?


----------



## D Halgren (May 24, 2019)

n9n9n9 said:


> so... I've got it. And I'm getting very annoying popping glitches on attack on most if not all the patches. No problems with other libraries, my disk and CPU are low. Not sure what it is, but it takes the joy out of things. Anyone else?


I hear some clicks if I have the attack too fast. Does that do anything for you?


----------



## Satorious (May 24, 2019)

n9n9n9 said:


> so... I've got it. And I'm getting very annoying popping glitches on attack on most if not all the patches. No problems with other libraries, my disk and CPU are low. Not sure what it is, but it takes the joy out of things. Anyone else?


Does this improve if you change the value of your Kontakt buffer? I had a similar problems with eDNA and changing the buffer fixed the issue. Worth a try?


----------



## Cinebient (May 24, 2019)

Short test, i have also clicks. Mainly when i use 2 mics or more (while i can use a lot more in HZS and any other SF library). It seems also mainly happen with when all notes are released and i trigger new midi notes. The first notes get that annoying click.


----------



## sostenuto (May 24, 2019)

Hmmmmm …. Trust these issues getting to SFA Support, and possible Setting recommendations.
Will hold off for a bit as capable Users work through initial niggles.


----------



## Craig Sharmat (May 24, 2019)

n9n9n9 said:


> so... I've got it. And I'm getting very annoying popping glitches on attack on most if not all the patches. No problems with other libraries, my disk and CPU are low. Not sure what it is, but it takes the joy out of things. Anyone else?



It appears to be hungry but try using one mic position, that should help some.


----------



## emasters (May 24, 2019)

Satorious said:


> Does this improve if you change the value of your Kontakt buffer? I had a similar problems with eDNA and changing the buffer fixed the issue. Worth a try?



Similar situation here with the clicks - only library I have, that does this. Increasing the buffer size does help. Ironically, I also purchased Straylight - thinking it would bring my system to its knees... it does not. Yet Kepler consistently creates pops and clicks with my standard buffer size setting. Wonder why?


----------



## Cinebient (May 24, 2019)

Only thing which helps is when i increase the buffer to 1024 and use just one mic (but i anyway use mainly just the close mic and turn all FX off). Even then there are a few clicks here and there. 
But at the same time i can use several instruments within one Kontakt instance or also using several Kontakt instances. I hope KO can be a bit optimized. Seems like one core gets to much cpu load and spikes, not sure. I love the library so far and what it does.


----------



## paulthomson (May 25, 2019)

Hi all!

Glad you are enjoying Kepler! I’ll leave proper advice to the CX team but just anecdotally - it is pretty hungry due to a lot of time machine work going on - with the single core logic thing I’ve found record you sometimes get pops and then playback is fine - I’ve also increased buffer size on occasion, and when I’ve had a ton of them going I’ve frozen a couple of tracks to lessen the CPU load. Also turning off the UI quantise lessens CPU load. 

Really depends on your machine spec but the load is down to the time machine working on all groups - which is the core of keeping everything in time. 

I can’t wait to hear what kind of stuff people make - I’m sure there’s a million ways to use this that I haven’t even thought of!

Have a great weekend everyone,

Paul


----------



## Cinebient (May 25, 2019)

paulthomson said:


> Hi all!
> 
> Glad you are enjoying Kepler! I’ll leave proper advice to the CX team but just anecdotally - it is pretty hungry due to a lot of time machine work going on - with the single core logic thing I’ve found record you sometimes get pops and then playback is fine - I’ve also increased buffer size on occasion, and when I’ve had a ton of them going I’ve frozen a couple of tracks to lessen the CPU load. Also turning off the UI quantise lessens CPU load.
> 
> ...



That makes sense now. Thank´s for the info. I found my workaround already (like using one instance per mic if needed to spread the load across cores) and so it is fine so far.
Thank you also to bring your idea to life. Sometimes a CPU and/or RAM hit is worth to not look back. Also i guess things might get better and optimized in near future (and a more powerful machine will be used as well maybe soon too).
Good luck with your baby.


----------



## Geoff Grace (May 25, 2019)

Cinebient said:


> I hope KO can be a bit optimized.


"KO." Of course. People are going start referring to Kepler Orchestra as "KO" here. I guess it'll be especially appropriate if the library turns out to be a knockout.

Looking forward to hearing more...

Best,

Geoff


----------



## Cinebient (May 25, 2019)

I did it myself here, lol. I often get confused here with all the acronyms and i find it not great at all.
So i will write now only Kepler Orchestra in full words.
A shame indeed we are too lazy to take the few seconds.
I apologize and i hate it myself, not sure why i did it.
Maybe someone should write a legend for all these acronyms.


----------



## fiestared (May 25, 2019)

Cinebient said:


> I did it myself here, lol. I often get confused here with all the acronyms and i find it not great at all.
> So i will write now only Kepler Orchestra in full words.
> A shame indeed we are too lazy to take the few seconds.
> I apologize and i hate it myself, not sure why i did it.
> Maybe someone should write a legend for all these acronyms.


Totally agree, between "OT, SPA, SSS, SS, SSC, CSS, CSCSS, SSSSCCSSSCCCSS, I'm completely lost and give up to the post ! It's already done, don't remember the title...


----------



## jbuhler (May 25, 2019)

fiestared said:


> Totally agree, between "OT, SPA, SSS, SS, SSC, CSS, CSCSS, SSSSCCSSSCCCSS, I'm completely lost and give up to the post ! It's already done, don't remember the title...


But there is only one N.


----------



## John Claus (May 25, 2019)

Yes, Kepler has great potential!! The concepts are brilliant and take us beyond current limitations in ways that will, once the kinks are worked out, yet again allow for new ways of composing in the box and at a keyboard! Very exciting and thank you Spitfire! But, for now, the operation is somewhat limited, at least on my rig (Mac Pro 2009 upgraded to 12 core 3.33 with 64G RAM, OS 10.12.6, Pro Tools 12.7, and a 2T SSD sounds drive -- and I'm about to move up to Mojave and Pro Tools 19, which may help a little - I'm maxed at 64G RAM, though). Initially, using default settings after installation, I could barely play anything, even single notes sometimes, without hesitation on the attack of notes. As suggested above, if I only use one mic and put the buffer at 1024, I can play up to 5 notes at a time without problems (and that's with only one track running as a trial). If I try a 6, or larger, note cluster, the front ends of notes start cutting off again. This all means some cool creative work is possible, for sure, but I think we all look forward to being able to use more mic positions and notes simultaneously. Let's hope the CX team can come up with some creative solutions. Also, I'm wondering what the optimal hardware set-up is to achieve full, smooth operation of Kepler. Are there things I can be doing to improve performance? Thanks!


----------



## Dr.Quest (May 25, 2019)

This is probably the best sounding useful creative tool I've heard in quite awhile. I love it that you are not locked into preconfigured chord shapes ala Sonokinetic but can just play the instrument. Brilliant stuff!


----------



## midiman (May 25, 2019)

Really like the concept of the library. It seems to do the Minimalist style really well. 

For people who have this library, how is the dynamic range of it? In the walk-through and demos everything seems to start more around MP or MF. Does it do "At the edge of silence" dynamics and moods? I love the motion it seems to provide but I would like to hear softer dynamics - not just lower in volume, put actually played softer, so it can work well as a backdrop to other more melodic libraries. Would love to hear your thoughts.


----------



## Cinebient (May 26, 2019)

midiman said:


> Really like the concept of the library. It seems to do the Minimalist style really well.
> 
> For people who have this library, how is the dynamic range of it? In the walk-through and demos everything seems to start more around MP or MF. Does it do "At the edge of silence" dynamics and moods? I love the motion it seems to provide but I would like to hear softer dynamics - not just lower in volume, put actually played softer, so it can work well as a backdrop to other more melodic libraries. Would love to hear your thoughts.



When i go into the editing page (full Kontakt) i see just one dynamic layer (beware i just picked up a few random to look into) and it also sound indeed like it. So it mainly reduce just volume if you use the dynamic slider. Which is a bit strange because so it is just the same as the expression.
But not sure if i get that right i´m no expert for deep editing in Kontakt. But so far i see just one sample per note which goes from 1-127 velocity without different dynamic layers. It might depends on the presets/instrument, not sure yet. I mainly see mf here everywhere.
Please correct me someone if i got it wrong.


----------



## midiman (May 26, 2019)

Cinebient said:


> When i go into the editing page (full Kontakt) i see just one dynamic layer (beware i just picked up a few random to look into) and it also sound indeed like it. So it mainly reduce just volume if you use the dynamic slider. Which is a bit strange because so it is just the same as the expression.
> But not sure if i get that right i´m no expert for deep editing in Kontakt. But so far i see just one sample per note which goes from 1-127 velocity without different dynamic layers. It might depends on the presets/instrument, not sure yet. I mainly see mf here everywhere.
> Please correct me someone if i got it wrong.



@SpitfireSupport Can you shed some light on this? Is there more than one dynamic layer? Are there "At the edge of Silence" patches, where it was actually played very softly? What I hear in the demos sounds great but more directed at Mf type of material.


----------



## Soundhound (May 26, 2019)

Has anyone tried Kepler Orch in VEP? That often allows me to use CPU hungry instruments I otherwise would have to freeze.


----------



## n9n9n9 (May 26, 2019)

Still can't banish the pops and clicks. I'm not seeing terrible CPU or disk spikes when isolating the lib in a project only playing one note at a time. I've tried a variety of buffer sizes as Spitfire support didn't offer a suggestion. IT happens with the attack very high medium or low. A click instantly upon keydown but no other artifact. It feels strange as Ive never had this issue with any of the other SA libraries I use (I have more than half of their offering.)

Anyone else?


----------



## D Halgren (May 26, 2019)

n9n9n9 said:


> Still can't banish the pops and clicks. I'm not seeing terrible CPU or disk spikes when isolating the lib in a project only playing one note at a time. I've tried a variety of buffer sizes as Spitfire support didn't offer a suggestion. IT happens with the attack very high medium or low. A click instantly upon keydown but no other artifact. It feels strange as Ive never had this issue with any of the other SA libraries I use (I have more than half of their offering.)
> 
> Anyone else?


I'm checking on my system on Ableton and it's fine. Do you have multiprocessor support off by any chance? I have mine set to 8 cores, but I have a pretty beefy iMac Pro.


----------



## D Halgren (May 26, 2019)

D Halgren said:


> I'm checking on my system on Ableton and it's fine. Do you have multiprocessor support off by any chance? I have mine set to 8 cores, but I have a pretty beefy iMac Pro.


In kontakt, not Live, although I don't think there is an option to in Live anymore.


----------



## prodigalson (May 26, 2019)

Unfortunately, the issues with CPU load are unsurprising to me. Anything Spitfire has built that uses Time Machine has been hugely problematic for me (and, it seems, many others). Glass and Steel, Solo Strings Total Performance Patch etc etc. 

I’m running a pretty good system with a heavy template including total Berlin Series and many other heavy libraries and nothing gives me problems like Spitfires forays into libraries that rely heavily on time machine


----------



## givemenoughrope (May 26, 2019)

Curious, do the clicks happen more often the further away the sample is from its original BPM or just across the board, even just a TM patch sitting at 0% changed?

Also curious about the dynamic range.


----------



## thesteelydane (May 26, 2019)

Cinebient said:


> When i go into the editing page (full Kontakt) i see just one dynamic layer (beware i just picked up a few random to look into) and it also sound indeed like it. So it mainly reduce just volume if you use the dynamic slider. Which is a bit strange because so it is just the same as the expression.
> But not sure if i get that right i´m no expert for deep editing in Kontakt. But so far i see just one sample per note which goes from 1-127 velocity without different dynamic layers. It might depends on the presets/instrument, not sure yet. I mainly see mf here everywhere.
> Please correct me someone if i got it wrong.


I don’t have the library, but keep in mind that for long articulations it’s normal to have the entire sample of each dynamic layer covering the whole velocity range of 0-127, otherwise you can’t cross fade between them. You have to look at the groups to see how many dynamic layers there are.


----------



## fiestared (May 27, 2019)

No click here...


----------



## Craig Sharmat (May 27, 2019)

I think I can do better by messing with kontakt but working fairly well here now. One mic position, quantize off (quantize was actually getting in the way)
Wanted to also say beautiful library!
Besides all the intricate off timing stuff you can do, the phrasing breathes naturally when you wish to keep things a bit more traditional, the tone is also warm...really liking this. Kepler can go really deep and i'm looking forward to what I do next, what ever that is.


----------



## Alex Fraser (May 27, 2019)

Apologies if this has been mentioned before - but is the orchestra recorded "in situ" like other Spitfire libraries for instant mix gratification? Thanks - A


----------



## midiman (May 27, 2019)

Craig Sharmat said:


> I think I can do better by messing with kontakt but working fairly well here now. One mic position, quantize off (quantize was actually getting in the way)
> Wanted to also say beautiful library!
> Besides all the intricate off timing stuff you can do, the phrasing breathes naturally when you wish to keep things a bit more traditional, the tone is also warm...really liking this. Kepler can go really deep and i'm looking forward to what I do next, what ever that is.



@Craig Sharmat , Would love to know what you think of the dynamic range of it. On the demos it sounds like the library lives better at MF dynamics and above. I am interested to know if it does well very soft dynamics like PP and the like. Or as Spitfire likes to call it "At the edge of Silence". Thanks!


----------



## angeruroth (May 27, 2019)

If Keple's behavior is anything like the demos, I'd say it can work nicely at the edge of silence.
I just made an experiment, copying two instances of the demo and changing the sound samples, one with BDT strings and the other with Tundra super sul.
The result is better than I anticipated.
Here the track naked with just those two instruments:

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/kepler-engine-bdt-tundra-samples-mp3.20353/][/AUDIOPLUS]


----------



## Soundhound (May 27, 2019)

I was wondering about this Kontakt/Time Machine cpu hog issue and tried a few different TM/Kontakt hungry patches (some Afflatus TMpatches, SF Glass&Steel, that new Sample Logic Modern Animated Percussion) and I'm wondering if the people here experiencing the problems are in Logic? I am, and found that in Cubase (10) and Studio One (4.5) the cpu usage is way less with these kinds of patches. I hadn't used either of these DAWs in a while, but have been getting up to speed with them recently (dunno why, seemed like a good idea in case Apple decides to only sell $20k Macs from here on out).


----------



## fiestared (May 28, 2019)

Soundhound said:


> I was wondering about this Kontakt/Time Machine cpu hog issue and tried a few different TM/Kontakt hungry patches (some Afflatus TMpatches, SF Glass&Steel, that new Sample Logic Modern Animated Percussion) and I'm wondering if the people here experiencing the problems are in Logic? I am, and found that in Cubase (10) and Studio One (4.5) the cpu usage is way less with these kinds of patches. I hadn't used either of these DAWs in a while, but have been getting up to speed with them recently (dunno why, seemed like a good idea in case Apple decides to only sell $20k Macs from here on out).


I am in Logic and don't have "clicks" _for the moment_ , I must say I have an iMac Pro


----------



## Silentspace2000 (May 28, 2019)

FYI, Spitfire just advised me against getting Kepler Orchestra since I would have issues running it on my 2012 iMac with 32gb of RAM (maximum allowed). I suggested they provide some sort of information about this on their website page so buyers don't run into this after purchasing. I was hoping to squeeze more life out of my iMac, drat.


----------



## givemenoughrope (May 28, 2019)

Bummer. I was going to purchase soon but my machine is a 2012 MBP. So, even just using one mic position at a time will still choke it? Even if it’s choking on half a dozen voices it’s not a showstopper since I would probably print each voice like I do the evos.


----------



## Soundhound (May 28, 2019)

I have a 2012 iMac w/32 gig, (i7 3.46). I just downloaded the library and patches do choke, so I'm using it in VEP6 and that seems to be fine. It can get up to 80% spikes in the VEP instance, but so far seems ok. I'll try it in a track soon and report back to base.





Silentspace2000 said:


> FYI, Spitfire just advised me against getting Kepler Orchestra since I would have issues running it on my 2012 iMac with 32gb of RAM (maximum allowed). I suggested they provide some sort of information about this on their website page so buyers don't run into this after purchasing. I was hoping to squeeze more life out of my iMac, drat.


----------



## Silentspace2000 (May 28, 2019)

Soundhound said:


> I have a 2012 iMac w/32 gig, (i7 3.46). I just downloaded the library and patches do choke, so I'm using it in VEP6 and that seems to be fine. It can get up to 80% spikes in the VEP instance, but so far seems ok. I'll try it in a track soon and report back to base.


Good to know. I'll look forward to hearing your experience with it.


----------



## John Claus (May 28, 2019)

fiestared said:


> No click here...


What are the specs of the system you're running? I'm trying to figure out what I'd need to really make it work in full. I have an old but solidly upgraded Mac Pro w/ 12 core 3.33 Intel Xeon processing/64G RAM/OS Sierra 10.12.6 (but moving to Mojave soon)/Pro Tools 12.7 (but moving to 2019)/and a separate 2T SSD sounds drive. With Kepler's quantize feature off, only one mic on, and the Pro Tools buffer set at 1024, I can play 4 notes simultaneously smoothly, without any hesitation in the attack, but with 5 note clusters things start getting sketchy. With 6 or more, the front ends of all notes are clipped off and it's unuseable. I wish I could go to 128 GB of RAM -- maybe that would help -- but I can't. Also, at the direction of Spitfire tech support today, I did 2 things. 1) I turned on the memory buffer in Kontakt and made the size 18KB, and 2) I did a batch resave. These things didn't help, though. I'd really love to use Kepler to its fullest, and I assume that somewhere (at least in a system at Spitfire??) it's running smoothly. If so, what does it take? Thanks for any insight...


----------



## Alex Niedt (May 28, 2019)

Of the ~60 Spitfire libraries I own, this uses the most CPU, and I'm often getting clicks/zipper noises playing back a single instance with an i7 4930K. Playback is often missing the downbeats of the basic looping articulations, rendering the library pretty much useless in actual rhythmic work, for me. The lack of release samples means you have to either release early or adjust the release so it doesn't sound like you have a delay on the rhythmic patches when changing notes. The high strings sound really synthy, and the library's overall sound is thin, though it should fit into mixes well. There is a lot of beautiful material in Kepler, for sure, but it's currently such a hassle to use that I totally regret buying it.


----------



## John Claus (May 28, 2019)

Soundhound said:


> I have a 2012 iMac w/32 gig, (i7 3.46). I just downloaded the library and patches do choke, so I'm using it in VEP6 and that seems to be fine. It can get up to 80% spikes in the VEP instance, but so far seems ok. I'll try it in a track soon and report back to base.


I don't use VEP, so could you explain how you're using Kepler within it, please? And you say it's running fine that way? Thanks a lot!


----------



## Soundhound (May 28, 2019)

Vienna Ensemble Pro lets you run instruments separately from your DAW, piping midi and audio between the two. So the cpu hit is taken by VEP rather than the daw itself. I have noticed that in VEP I can definitely make it choke if I play enough notes together in Kepler, 5, 6 notes has done it a few times. I tried using just one mic position as some here mentioned but it didn't seem to make much difference. It seems like it would be workable in a track, but I haven't tried one yet and am smack in the middle of a couple of projects so may not get a chance to try for a little while. Hoping for next week...

For the record I'm on a pretty low powered system by today's standards, 2012 iMac i7 3.46hz, and working in Logic.




John Claus said:


> I don't use VEP, so could you explain how you're using Kepler within it, please? And you say it's running fine that way? Thanks a lot!


----------



## Soundhound (May 28, 2019)

Just tried again and this time I got as many as 10 notes or so in VEP before it choked, that's a pretty heavy chord cluster. And using one mic or the mix patch definitely does help reduce cpu load.

Was testing it using the Cello Sul Pont patch, with the default grid, everything on the first horizontal line (half notes?)


----------



## jtnyc (May 28, 2019)

Alex Niedt said:


> Of the ~60 Spitfire libraries I own, this uses the most CPU, and I'm often getting clicks/zipper noises playing back a single instance with an i7 4930K. Playback is often missing the downbeats of the basic looping articulations, rendering the library pretty much useless in actual rhythmic work, for me. The lack of release samples means you have to either release early or adjust the release so it doesn't sound like you have a delay on the rhythmic patches when changing notes. The high strings sound really synthy, and the library's overall sound is thin, though it should fit into mixes well. There is a lot of beautiful material in Kepler, for sure, but it's currently such a hassle to use that I totally regret buying it.



I was really interested in picking this up at the intro price, but this and other similar reports decidedly put me off it. Thanks for posting


----------



## John Claus (May 28, 2019)

Soundhound said:


> Just tried again and this time I got as many as 10 notes or so in VEP before it choked, that's a pretty heavy chord cluster. And using one mic, or the mix patch definitely does help reduce cpu load.
> 
> Was testing it using the Cello Sul Pont patch, with the default grid, everything on the first horizontal line (half notes?)



Thanks... this sounds promising. I'm also now discovering that even if I can perform and record a pattern of 4 note clusters without it choking, that doesn't guarantee playback will be smooth. Even with every other track made inactive and using no plugin effects, it sometimes stops in the middle of playback! Sooo, still not convinced it will be useable in any exciting/meaningful way, unless Spitfire's able to make changes or some major work around comes to light. I'll see what I can do to check out the VEP solution... Not being able to use this and the cool parts of Glass and Steel much is definitely disappointing... bleeding edge.


----------



## paulthomson (May 29, 2019)

Alex Niedt said:


> Of the ~60 Spitfire libraries I own, this uses the most CPU, and I'm often getting clicks/zipper noises playing back a single instance with an i7 4930K. Playback is often missing the downbeats of the basic looping articulations, rendering the library pretty much useless in actual rhythmic work, for me. The lack of release samples means you have to either release early or adjust the release so it doesn't sound like you have a delay on the rhythmic patches when changing notes. The high strings sound really synthy, and the library's overall sound is thin, though it should fit into mixes well. There is a lot of beautiful material in Kepler, for sure, but it's currently such a hassle to use that I totally regret buying it.



Hi Alex,

Have you turned off 'Quantise' on the UI?

All best,

Paul


----------



## Alex Niedt (May 29, 2019)

paulthomson said:


> Hi Alex,
> 
> Have you turned off 'Quantise' on the UI?
> 
> ...


Hi Paul, thanks for the reply! Turning off quantize seems to resolve the issue of downbeats not triggering. Unfortunately, now this exposes timing issues when changing notes with faster articulations. Attaching examples with note changes drawn to the grid in Cubase. In two examples, I changed notes often to exaggerate the issue. The "simpler" example demonstrates that it sounds great for an extended period while holding a note, but the issue is still clear halfway through, in particular. Is there some way to remedy this, short of manual editing? Apologies if I'm making some sort of ridiculous error. On the bright side, I tend to like the slower stuff. By the way, the Non-Pulsing Doppler TM patches are brilliant. 

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/kepler-celli-8th-mp3.20381/][/AUDIOPLUS]

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/kepler-celli-16th-mp3.20382/][/AUDIOPLUS]

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/kepler-celli-simpler-mp3.20383/][/AUDIOPLUS]


----------



## mouse (May 29, 2019)

Working OK here with 64GB RAM / Xeon E5v4 3gHz procesor. No clicks / pops


----------



## John Claus (May 29, 2019)

mouse said:


> Working OK here with 64GB RAM / Xeon E5v4 3gHz procesor. No clicks / pops


What DAW are you using? And what computer exactly? Those of us who thought we were using pretty substantial rigs but are having problems are trying to figure out why. I’m running a 12 core Intel Xeon 3.33 processor and a separate 2T SSD sounds drive, and even with one mic, one patch, quantize off, and a buffer of 1024, I have limitations on the number of notes I can play simultaneously and choppy performance. Thanks for any details...


----------



## mouse (May 29, 2019)

John Claus said:


> What DAW are you using? And what computer exactly? Those of us who thought we were using pretty substantial rigs but are having problems are trying to figure out why. I’m running a 12 core Intel Xeon 3.33 processor and a separate 2T SSD sounds drive, and even with one mic, one patch, quantize off, and a buffer of 1024, I have limitations on the number of notes I can play simultaneously and choppy performance. Thanks for any details...




Windows and Cubase 8.5


----------



## John Claus (May 29, 2019)

Soundhound said:


> Just tried again and this time I got as many as 10 notes or so in VEP before it choked, that's a pretty heavy chord cluster. And using one mic, or the mix patch definitely does help reduce cpu load.
> 
> Was testing it using the Cello Sul Pont patch, with the default grid, everything on the first horizontal line (half notes?)



Are you using Vienna Ensemble Pro or Vienna Instruments Pro? I’m assuming the former, but you used both terms, and their prices are substantially different... Thanks a lot...


----------



## blue5 (May 29, 2019)

Bought the library 2 days ago, I get clicks and pops all over the place with grids, in some cases even playing one note only, with quantise and all fx off. Running it in Kontakt 5 standalone mode, 2013 6core Mac Pro, 64Gb ram, 2TB NVMe SSD, did batch re-save as well. I don't even dare to put it in my main template. Hope @SpitfireSupport deals with it soon


----------



## John Claus (May 29, 2019)

mouse said:


> Windows and Cubase 8.5


I wonder if anyone is having success running Kepler on Pro Tools... ?


----------



## Soundhound (May 29, 2019)

John Claus said:


> Are you using Vienna Ensemble Pro or Vienna Instruments Pro? I’m assuming the former, but you used both terms, and their prices are substantially different... Thanks a lot...



Yes Vienna Ensemble Pro, fixed the post, sorry!


----------



## zimm83 (May 29, 2019)

blue5 said:


> Bought the library 2 days ago, I get clicks and pops all over the place with grids, in some cases even playing one note only, with quantise and all fx off. Running it in Kontakt 5 standalone mode, 2013 6core Mac Pro, 64Gb ram, 2TB NVMe SSD, did batch re-save as well. I don't even dare to put it in my main template. Hope @SpitfireSupport deals with it soon


Oh my god.....click and pops with a 6 core .....so not for me.......(i5 quad core..)
Don't understand.....it's a library where you want to stack different rythms, different tempos, everything synchronized (TM) and with different mics....
And we want quantize and effects.......
What do we need ? I9 ?


----------



## Spitfire Team (May 29, 2019)

*NEW - Check out Christian's Contextual Video

*​


----------



## Dr.Quest (May 29, 2019)

zimm83 said:


> Oh my god.....click and pops with a 6 core .....so not for me.......(i5 quad core..)
> Don't understand.....it's a library where you want to stack different rythms, different tempos, everything synchronized (TM) and with different mics....
> And we want quantize and effects.......
> What do we need ? I9 ?


i7 according to the specs.


----------



## blue5 (May 29, 2019)

zimm83 said:


> Oh my god.....click and pops with a 6 core .....so not for me.......(i5 quad core..)
> Don't understand.....it's a library where you want to stack different rythms, different tempos, everything synchronized (TM) and with different mics....
> And we want quantize and effects.......
> What do we need ? I9 ?



I'm sure it's a some sort of a bug...maybe wait till it's fixed.


----------



## Silentspace2000 (May 29, 2019)

zimm83 said:


> Oh my god.....click and pops with a 6 core .....so not for me.......(i5 quad core..)
> Don't understand.....it's a library where you want to stack different rythms, different tempos, everything synchronized (TM) and with different mics....
> And we want quantize and effects.......
> What do we need ? I9 ?


I for one am waiting until this is all sorted out. It seems that the issues seem to be popping up on a variety of systems which makes one think it might be something beyond the lack of processing power. I also went and checked pricing on a stoked new iMac...ouch.


----------



## jbuhler (May 29, 2019)

Just got it. Late 2015 4Ghz i7 iMac. In Kontakt stand-alone with three instances of Kepler running, quantize on, and four to five notes in the chord, I don't get pops or clicks. Occasional pops and clicks do start to show up with a fourth instance.


----------



## Soundhound (May 29, 2019)

I did a quick test, doing a rough simulation of the patches/parts CH used in his demo there. In Logic it can't handle it at all. Running the instruments in VEP, it almost can squeak by, almost. 

Keep in mind my old farty iMac (2012 i7 3.46 hz) gets a number of 12,000 on the geekbench mac score for multi core. Newer macs get 22k or so and shoot up from there, so should be able to handle it much better. Though as Christian says in the video it devours cpu cycles mercilessly so even on a new machine I imagine as you write with this library you need to print as soon as you've got a part you'll be working with for a while—and maybe print all Kepler grid instrument tracks once you get farther along. 

Puts a bit of a damper on freedom of experimentation I'd say, but seems workable. I've got something coming up in a couple weeks it might be good for and I'll see how that goes...


----------



## jtnyc (May 29, 2019)

Soundhound said:


> Though as Christian says in the video it devours cpu cycles mercilessly so even on a new machine I imagine as you write with this library you need to print as soon as you've got a part you'll be working with for a while—and maybe print all Kepler grid instrument tracks once you get farther along.
> 
> Puts a bit of a damper on freedom of experimentation I'd say, but seems workable.


That doesn't sound fun at all


----------



## Soundhound (May 29, 2019)

Less throwing paint at the wall for sure. I do write that way sometimes, but until i finally get a new mac, won’t be able to do it with Kepler. On a new powerful mac i’d think you could still do some action painting...

Some of the sounds are pretty terrific to my ears, so it could be a matter of whether you like the material enough to warrant the extra effort...



jtnyc said:


> That doesn't sound fun at all


----------



## Geoff Grace (May 29, 2019)

Just a decade ago, when 32-bit DAWs couldn't exceed the 4GB RAM threshold, freezing tracks was routine when composing for orchestra. In fact, people were excited to be able to freeze tracks when that feature became an option.

Sure, it would be nice if Kepler Orchestra didn't necessitate this (on some computers); but it's really a small inconvenience that anyone who's been involved in making music for more than a few years has probably had to face.

The bottom line is that pushing the technological envelope often means leaving older machines in the dust, or at least taxing them to their limits. I'm glad that Spitfire is sharing workarounds. I hope they will be as forthcoming as possible about which computers can and can't handle Kepler Orchestra as user reports continue to illuminate the issue.

Best,

Geoff


----------



## blue5 (May 30, 2019)

Ok, I did a bit of more testing, it seems that pops/hiccups are gone if running trough VEP, at least in my case. Even playing with multiple mics and quantise on, it performs well. I'll explain a bit more, hope it helps:

My setup is 2013 Mac Pro 6x 3,5ghz Intel Xeon E5, 64Gb Ram, 2TB NVMe SSD, MacOS Sierra, RME Babyface

- Kontakt 5 standalone, high strings grid, one mic, quantise off, FX off, gives me pops pretty much every time. What's strange is if I play 3 voices slow chord progression 16th grid in the lower range, it doesn't hiccup. Playing the same chord progression in the higher range it pops as soon I change the chord, making it not playable at all. Playing 4-5 voices is not playable. Even playing 1 voice in the high range pops (strange!). Setting higher buffer size in Kontakt helps a bit, but not completely. Changing disk preload size or multicore/single core setting in Kontakt doesn't help.

- Logic X gives the same problems like above. Recording some chord progressions makes no sense at all. If quantise is off and hiccups appear, it mess up the rhythm completely plus there is some sort of a strange latency.

- Cubase 10 performs a bit better than Logic I think, but the pops are still there.

- VEP6 with Cubase 10 - the problems are gone  I can play up to 8-10 voices, changing chords like a mad man, no hiccups at all. It's even possible to play 4 instances at once (strings, woods, brass high and low), all at 16th grid, playing even up to 10 voices (as much fingers I could get  and switching chords, it performs without hiccups. The CPU runs very high though with 10 voices.

I still didn't test it in my main VEP template due to a project working on, but I'm curious how it will perform in real time situation with other tracks.

IMHO it's a really strange issue, at least I never came up on something like that having around 40ish spitfire libraries. Performance legato patches in solo strings or chamber strings which are CPU hungry perform very well on my setup. And on the product page min. requirements for Kepler Orchestra is a Intel Core 2 Duo??


----------



## Cinebient (May 30, 2019)

On my macbook from 2013 (just the i7 2.0Ghz quadcore and 8GB ram) i have no problems to run 4-6 note chords while triggering 5-6 instances (means one Kontakt per instrument here) with one mic only and 1024 buffer with Logic.
But if i want to go down to just 512 and/or 2 mics i get a lot pops/clicks even with one instance.
I personally have no problem with it since i‘m also used to early bounce to audio and almost never do deeper midi edit (i prefer to play all things live into the sequencer anyway).


----------



## John Claus (Jun 1, 2019)

Buying Vienna Ensemble Pro just to run Kepler doubles the price... ugh!


----------



## John Claus (Jun 7, 2019)

After doing a lot more troubleshooting, some with the help of Spitfire support, I think I need to upgrade some old usb ports to faster buss speed. My wife's running a rig very similar to mine with a couple of significant differences, and she's running Kepler w/o problems (e.g., 8 simultaneous note clusters play fine). She mostly uses Digital Performer, but sometimes Pro Tools, and both run Kepler well. A key difference between her rig and mine is a fast throughput USB 3.0 port card. I just got one today and will put it in sometime next week, when I have time. At that point I'll also be updating to Pro Tools 19.5 and Mojave and that move will include a new and faster video card. A friend who's a member of the PT beta testing team, says PT 19.5 has more efficient and powerful CPU use. SO, I think/hope with these changes I should be able to run both Kepler and Glass and Steel without issues. My wife can run all the cool cinematic rhythm patches in Glass and Steel, too, without limitations. I'll report back once the dust settles...


----------



## kp warren (Mar 4, 2020)

Running Kepler on my late 2014 iMac 3.5 quad i5 with 32ram is pretty much complete fail with pops & glitches on note changes. Even simple parts. Not sure if it's Logic or the i5 chip. (Kepler seems to run ok on my 2019 16" MacBookPro) I think a warning about this would have been helpful before dropping $$ for such library. I have the same issue with Steel & Glass. Bounce in place will clean up the pops but not a fun way to work at all. I do hope Spitfire looks at this scripting as i don't feel a 2014 iMac is _that _old!


----------



## blue5 (Mar 5, 2020)

kp warren said:


> Running Kepler on my late 2014 iMac 3.5 quad i5 with 32ram is pretty much complete fail with pops & glitches on note changes. Even simple parts. Not sure if it's Logic or the i5 chip. (Kepler seems to run ok on my 2019 16" MacBookPro) I think a warning about this would have been helpful before dropping $$ for such library. I have the same issue with Steel & Glass. Bounce in place will clean up the pops but not a fun way to work at all. I do hope Spitfire looks at this scripting as i don't feel a 2014 iMac is _that _old!



Unfortunately that library prefers newer CPU's, which many users (including me) were not aware while purchasing the library and we did run into same problems, even on decent systems. Increasing buffer size in Kontakt to 1024 helps a bit, or running it trough VEP pops did disappeared. Hope that helps


----------

