# The End of Music: There’s plenty of music already, so why bother making more?



## gsilbers (Nov 25, 2009)

http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/20 ... lobal-home


We seem to be on the edge of a paradigm shift. Orchestras are struggling to stay alive, rock has been relegated to the underground, jazz has stopped evolving and become a dead art, the music industry itself has been subsumed by corporate culture and composers are at their wit’s end trying to find something that’s hip but still appeals to an audience mired in a 19th-century sensibility.



For more than half a century we’ve seen incredible advances in sound technology but very little if any advance in the quality of music. In this case the paradigm shift may not be a shift but a dead stop. Is it that people just don’t want to hear anything new? Or is it that composers and musicians have simply swallowed the pomo line that nothing else new can be done, which ironically is really just the “old, old story.”

Certainly music itself is not dead. We’ll continue to hear something approximating it blaring in shopping malls, fast food stops, clothing stores and wherever else it will mesmerize the consumer into excitedly pulling out their credit card or debit card or whatever might be coming.

There’s no question that in music, like politics, the bigger the audience gets the more the “message” has to be watered down. Muzak’s been around for a long time now but maybe people just can’t tell the difference anymore. Maybe even the composers and songwriters can’t tell the difference either. Especially when it’s paying for a beach house in Malibu and a condo in New York.

Of course, we could all just listen to all of our old albums, CD’s and mp3’s. In fact, nowadays that’s where the industry makes most of its money. We could also just watch old movies and old TV shows. There are a lot of them now. Why bother making any new ones? Why bother doing anything new at all? Why bother having any change or progress at all as long as we’ve got “growth”? I’m just wondering if this is in fact the new paradigm. I’m just wondering if in fact the new music is just the old music again. And, if that in fact it would actually just be the end of music.


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## gsilbers (Nov 25, 2009)

I dunno man, maybe it's me but there is seldom a time o day that I m not listening to mx somewy or another.
Radio, tv, while working , etc


Main reason I got into film score from electronic music was that 
there was soo much new going on.
It's orchestral and electronic together. That's huge IMO . So much more depht and variations.


One thing I and maybe we all can agree is that the music business it's changing dramaticlly

not only piracy but mug more important is that kids nowadays spend their leasure time listenig to music while on other things like video games , 
Web clips, tv, DVDs movies etc

so it's a big chunk of time/money it takes from music being the center focus. 
Do u see kids listening to only music like we did back 10-20 years ago? 
There is new music and great music being made 
but the focus shifted just like it did when recorded media became available for consumers.
So in the future I see less recording Megastar artists and more outlets for music. 
We just need to figure out how not to bE robbed in this wild wild west that it's the Internet and new media


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## germancomponist (Nov 25, 2009)

There is so many good music arround the web. The problem is to find it. The youg people always need or look to the hype. What is in and out? The companies tell them always that all is in what they are selling... . 

And so many covers are out, only because the companies have bought the rights years ago and want to earn money again with this and that old song.

One day money will kill all art. o-[][]-o


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## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 25, 2009)

I was thinking about posting that here. Glad you did.

I don't know if you saw my comment on NY X, but it was more about the commentary than the article. The guy is right, but not too many people got the irony in the article. It's the music business being in the toilet that's causing the problem, not any lack of human creativity.


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## germancomponist (Nov 25, 2009)

Nick Batzdorf @ Wed Nov 25 said:


> I was thinking about posting that here. Glad you did.
> 
> I don't know if you saw my comment on NY X, but it was more about the commentary than the article. The guy is right, but not too many people got the irony in the article. It's the music business being in the toilet that's causing the problem, not any lack of human creativity.



I did not read the article.

Sorry to say that, because I do not know a better system, but our "money" system is the reason, yes, no? How poor, all is reduced to a "money price". :-(


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## Waywyn (Nov 25, 2009)

It's generally sad to see that people think that e.g. "Iris" of the GooGoo Dolls is worse or unintellectual than a specific piece of an old master ...

Music evolves as everything else evolved ... and to be honest, people who think that music has stopped evolving only because it got e.g. easier to grip or understand ... I think that those people didn't understand music.

Basically this whole "music is dead thing" is the same like those "80ies with long hairs, stretch pants and lots of hairspray" guy, simply got stuck in the in that time ... but time goes on.

Besides that we have just one human life, which is - in optimal situation - approx. 60-80 years long. Music "only" exists now for like thousands and thousands of years. Music didn't start when Beethoven started to compose. I started when the first neanderthal hit a drum with a bone.

See it as a sine wave. We are just from the top a bit down ... and people go "oh no, it goes down, we are doomed" ... but after this down, there is a low point and it goes up again ... and if we check the whole thing it repeats endlessly.

Generally it is the same with everything.
People learn to master the fire, start to build simple things, invent the wheel, technologically advance, even more advance technological, destroy themselves or get destroyed by the planet ... the whole thing starts again ...

Earth is 4 billion years old ... who know HOW often we all had this before?!?


Sorry for zooming out soo much, ... but to make it short, it is not the end of music, it is just "a state" at a certain time on a certain place.


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## germancomponist (Nov 25, 2009)

Alex, sure that it is not the end of music. But the way how music shines in these days, how this product "music" is sold, this is sadly. Do you think that one day this changes?

I say it again: The big money kills the art. Do we wet? :mrgreen: o-[][]-o


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## Pando (Nov 25, 2009)

>> There’s plenty of music already, so why bother making more?

Yea, especially considering the fact that nearly everybody is using the same damn 12 notes over and over and over again. Sheesh, after hundreds of years it must be getting old.

:D


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## dinerdog (Nov 25, 2009)

The Beatles - 1000 Years Later

"and what's truly amazing is that they wrote all of these songs with only the notes A through G, musical notation had not yet been expanded to V" (@1:00)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Z2vU8M6CYI


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## Waywyn (Nov 25, 2009)

germancomponist @ Wed Nov 25 said:


> Alex, sure that it is not the end of music. But the way how music shines in these days, how this product "music" is sold, this is sadly. Do you think that one day this changes?
> 
> I say it again: The big money kills the art. Do we wet? :mrgreen: o-[][]-o



Yes it will change again and it is fairly simple to see why.
I always tend to see the "whole big picture". i don't stay within one topic but also compare with others, no matter what ...
So I ask myself, music is dead? Is movies dead, cloth, aaand so on.
You can somehow relate this to each other, but each categorie is at another spot of that big sine wave ...

Let's say, movies are dead. The thing which really counts is stupid acting, lots of vfx, kaboom and happy ends ... will it change again? Yes for sure, people may be fed up with the concept and go in a new direction. Probably a big war or a huge catostrophy may take over and people are fed up with explosions, want to see deep emotional stuff ... movies which makes you think etc.

Relate that to everything else ...

Another example. If you check back computer development during the last 50 years, see how much faster it goes each year and look into the future. Scientists predicted that you will be able to buy a computer with the potential of a human brain (I am just talking synapse and calculatewise ) in 2030 for around 1 (ONE!!!!) buck.

Imagine how awesome (and of course creepy) it may be to visit a concert of a composer having a 1000 Terabyte library connected to his brain and giving a concert in 48:1 surround sound which will leave your mouth open for days. Sick thoughts? Yes, for sure, .. but hey, if you would have tell someone 500 years ago that there will be little machines which soak in air and clean your rooms ... they would have thought the same :D


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## rJames (Nov 25, 2009)

Are there little machines that will suck in air and clean my room? Will they make my bed?

Pretty soon you'll be telling me that there are little handheld machines that can tell you where the best restaurants within 100 miles are located. And then show you the menu.


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## mf (Nov 25, 2009)

The opinions in that article are completely ridiculous. Also, this guy is obviously a lunatic -

_Glenn Branca has composed 13 symphonies: six for electric guitars, three for harmonic series instruments, three for orchestra and one, No. 13, for 100 guitars. The first movement of No. 14 was premiered by The St. Louis Symphony in 2008. He is recording a new album, “The Ascension: The Sequel.”_


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## Unison (Nov 25, 2009)

To me the title of your post reminds me of the good old "Everything that can be invented has been invented"... 

I believe the answer to "why bother making more" lies within each one of us. And we all have to find out for ourselves what moves us to dare utter the sentence "I am a composer".. and to find out what stories in sound we want to tell the world. What postcards from the inner landscapes of our souls we desire to send the listener..

Think of all the richness of nature, and think of the abundance of variation on known themes, that still can make us go "wow".. like sunsets.. A so simple occurrence that has been repeated beyond belief, and still can move us, surprise us etc.

I am very positive when it comes to the future of invention in music.

=o 

:D


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## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 25, 2009)

The whole article is sarcastic. He doesn't believe for one minute that everything that has to be said in music has been said already, he's saying that the business is run as if that were the case.

And he's right. Until the '90s, R&D was a big part of at least the pop industry. For all their rapacious ways, record companies found and developed talent. Bands released second and third albums, and there was a healthy industry.

Today all anyone seems to talk about is growth, as he says. The music that gets promoted - which is what it takes - is rarely new. If it weren't that music is still being "consumed" at a high rate (but not paid for) I'd argue that the whole problem is that everyone is bored with the same old thing; instead I just think it's a significant factor.

I liked the article, even though I also see bright spots in the world.


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## mf (Nov 25, 2009)

I don't think the article is sarcastic but simply obtuse. 
I invite you to read the readers' comments. Many are VERY intelligent and insightful. Here is something that I especially liked:

"I don't think there is a paradigm shift occurring, I think something much more significant is afoot. The cages called genre are bursting and the shackles of style are being thrown down. I find amazing music whenever I take the time and effort to really search. To quote Dave Bowman; what's going to happen? Something wonderful! If this is the end of music, pop the cork!"


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## David Story (Nov 25, 2009)

The universe is made of music. It's eternally creative. 
Society is ephemeral, yet it must provide music. 
Composers are struggling to connect the short term goals of society(business) with the long term nature of the universe(art). The entertainment industry has difficulty with this. So we get music with little connection to the greater universe of music.

I feel it's a marketing issue, promoting the value of music.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 25, 2009)

Read it again please, mf. I think the irony is hard to miss. Do you really think he's saying that music is over?

And I agree with you, David, if not literally then the spirit of what you're saying.


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## germancomponist (Nov 25, 2009)

Waywyn @ Wed Nov 25 said:


> ...Another example. If you check back computer development during the last 50 years, see how much faster it goes each year and look into the future. Scientists predicted that you will be able to buy a computer with the potential of a human brain (I am just talking synapse and calculatewise ) in 2030 for around 1 (ONE!!!!) buck.
> 
> Imagine how awesome (and of course creepy) it may be to visit a concert of a composer having a 1000 Terabyte library connected to his brain and giving a concert in 48:1 surround sound which will leave your mouth open for days. Sick thoughts? Yes, for sure, .. but hey, if you would have tell someone 500 years ago that there will be little machines which soak in air and clean your rooms ... they would have thought the same :D



The problem is that in this future computers are doing all jobs arround the world and people have less and less to eat. With an empty stomach music does not sound good. :mrgreen:


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## david robinson (Nov 26, 2009)

germancomponist @ Wed Nov 25 said:


> Waywyn @ Wed Nov 25 said:
> 
> 
> > ...Another example. If you check back computer development during the last 50 years, see how much faster it goes each year and look into the future. Scientists predicted that you will be able to buy a computer with the potential of a human brain (I am just talking synapse and calculatewise ) in 2030 for around 1 (ONE!!!!) buck.
> ...



i'll have fries with that!!!!

David R.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 27, 2009)

See? Sarcasm in writing is often missed.

I know, because people sometimes get really pissed off when my dry sense of humor doesn't penetrate the right orifice.


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## mf (Nov 27, 2009)

I may be wrong, but I think you missed waywin's sarcasm, so, yes, sarcasm can be missed.
But sarcasm can also be implied where it was not intended, as I believe you do with this article. I'm sorry, I still fail to see any sarcasm there. Sarcasm means to state the opposite of the obvious. In that article there is no underlying opposite of what he's stating. He is really concerned about the issues he points to.

This is what he says:
"We seem to be on the edge of a paradigm shift. Orchestras are struggling to stay alive, rock has been relegated to the underground, jazz has stopped evolving and become a dead art, the music industry itself has been subsumed by corporate culture and composers are at their wit’s end trying to find something that’s hip but still appeals to an audience mired in a 19th-century sensibility."

Sarcasm should have sounded like this:
"We seem to be at a cultural peak. Orchestras are flourishing, rock is more popular than ever, jazz has evolved to become mainstream art, the music industry prospers and composers are making a great living."

My strong impression is that he plays straight.


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## poseur (Dec 7, 2009)

make the music you need to make, as often & persistently as you can,
and don't worry about it:
just proceed with your own vision, while still exerting _effort_ to hear more & more music
that was previously unknown to you, both "new" & "old".

i do, in fact, often find articles like these kinda funny.
not always "ha-ha" funny; sometimes inadvertently (& sadly) funny.

here's a good one, another oft-repeated & extended bon mot:
*"jazz has stopped evolving and become a dead art"*
nothing like a little bit of underexposed reductionism to make my day just a wee bit brighter.
ha!

dt


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## watikutju (Dec 7, 2009)

Every night, when I put down my guitar or shut down my DAW......it is the END of MUSIC....


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## Nick Batzdorf (Dec 7, 2009)

The difficulty is with the music *business*, poseur, not the artists!


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## poseur (Dec 12, 2009)

Nick Batzdorf @ Mon Dec 07 said:


> The difficulty is with the music *business*, poseur, not the artists!


not meaning at all to deny that current circumstances don't display their very own special problems, of course, but:
somehow:
_"same as it ever was"_, no?

aren't we simply responsible for forging ahead with our own work,
both within + against whatever the current "odds" are?
again:
i don't deny the problems, new & old.
it is, in some ways, a simple reduction for me:
i don't wanna leave this planet looking back at my efforts & body-of-works as having been half-hearted,
as having been consigned to a lack-of-integrity due to "bad timing", "bad breaks",
an unsupportive & unfair industry (whether wittingly or unwittingly supported by "the public"),
or a lack of patronage by the royalty of my days on earth, for whatever reasons.
?

dt


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## germancomponist (Dec 12, 2009)

Nick Batzdorf @ Mon Dec 07 said:


> The difficulty is with the music *business*, poseur, not the artists!



How true, how true. And the business is a result from our system. Money, money, and: Money!


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## Nick Batzdorf (Dec 12, 2009)

Yup - and illegal downloading has to do with money too.


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