# Timpani in D.A.?



## novicecomposer (Feb 24, 2016)

My understanding is that Timpani is not a transposing instrument. So when studying scores I always wondered what it means, for example (Beethoven's symphony No. 9):






And his symphony No.1 has "Timpani C.G". When I write a modern score, can I just say "Timpani" or should I notate something like that? 

Another question: the percussion samples I have just say "Timpani", not "Timpani D.A." or "Timpani C.G.". How do I know what kind of timpani it is? 

On a related note, many woodwinds libraries don't say what kind flutes and clarinets they are. Can I just assume they are just popular ones such as C flutes and Bb clarinets? If not, how do I know what kind they are? Just by listening?


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## Pietro (Feb 24, 2016)

In the old days, the timpani had no pedals and had to be tuned before the performance. So they marked the tuning like in the examples above, so that the musicians could prepare the timps.

In modern scores, you don't use this marking, instead just place the tuning above the stave in the beginning of the score (or certain parts of it, where you want to change it). Like "FADF". Modern timpani have pedal mechanism to change tuning.

- Piotr


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## bryla (Feb 24, 2016)

novicecomposer said:


> My understanding is that Timpani is not a transposing instrument.


To reiterate Piotr: in old days the timpani was in fact a transposing instrument. It was bound by convention to only play tonic and dominant so only the notes C and G were written.

Today you can write the tuning, but timpanists are the only percussion players that only play one instrument (the others play both glock, cymbals, bass drum aso). They are specialists and will have a good knowledge on how and when to tune the drums before and during the music. 

If I have a sample library that says flute, clarinet I will assume it's the concert flute (actually in D but non-transposing) and the Bb clarinet, yes.


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## stigc56 (Mar 22, 2016)

Timpani is not transposing. If you have a written D your timpani tuned for this piece to a D, will sound ad a D. 
The notenames just told the player (yes I once played the old fashion timpani) to tune the timpanis accordingly.


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## bryla (Mar 22, 2016)

stigc56 said:


> Timpani is not transposing. If you have a written D your timpani tuned for this piece to a D, will sound ad a D.
> The notenames just told the player (yes I once played the old fashion timpani) to tune the timpanis accordingly.


If the notes on the paper were C and G and it sounded D and A, then it was in fact a transposing instrument.


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## stigc56 (Mar 23, 2016)

bryla said:


> If the notes on the paper were C and G and it sounded D and A, then it was in fact a transposing instrument.


But the notes on the paper is not C and G. The C and G refers to which timpani to use. So you will play the D on the C timpani tuned up to a D. And so on. Many years ago I played Schubert's March Militaire and the score was written for 4 timpanis tuned to give 4 different tones. After the 1.st movement I seem to remember that I had to tune one of the timpanis.


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## bryla (Mar 23, 2016)

earlier than Schubert:

http://vsl.co.at/en/Timpani/Notation

Never heard of C and G timpani. Usually they are referred to in size.


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## stigc56 (Mar 23, 2016)

okay!


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