# This is where it gets real - switching to Reaper!



## dtonthept (Nov 16, 2015)

Hey folks, 

Given there have been very active threads on our disappointment with Pro Tools, Apple, and more, as purveyors of critical tools in our studios, I thought I would make a bit of an open report on what I'm up to this week - which is my first week attempting to use Reaper for real in the studio on sessions. 

I'll be doing some programming, production, and mixing, and maybe a bit of recording. 

I've posted a lot, and joined threads where I've been investigating Cubase, then switched focus to Reaper, but these were all times when I was messing around in downtime, rather than "money on the table, rubber on the road" sessions. So this will be a real shift in focus. 

I'm hoping both to act as an informative guinea pig to others considering the move, and to drum up support from other Reaper users during this critical time, so many of you have already been so helpful. 

First up, I've actually booked a Skype one on one with Jon from Reaperblog to have a final brush up on stuff before I go nuts. 

I gotta run now to get on with some work in preparation for my Skype session, but will check up on this thread and provide updates periodically. 

Cheers, 

D


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## Marius Masalar (Nov 16, 2015)

Will be interesting to read your experiences! I'm a big fan of Reaper, even if I don't use it as a daily driver. Glad it exists.


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## Darthmorphling (Nov 16, 2015)

Good luck!

I have been a happy Reaper user for a while now, but am slowly migrating to Cubase. Not sure if I'm going to switch for good yet.


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## d.healey (Nov 16, 2015)

Darthmorphling said:


> I have been a happy Reaper user for a while now, but am slowly migrating to Cubase. Not sure if I'm going to switch for good yet.


I went the other way


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## Darthmorphling (Nov 16, 2015)

d.healey said:


> I went the other way



There are a lot of Cubase users going to Reaper. I simply got a great deal on Cubase 8 and have always wanted to try it out. I am so used to how Reaper utilizes the mouse, that editing in Cubase is problematic for me. Expression maps are really sweet though, and the script that emulates that in Reaper is not quite the same.

I haven't abandoned Reaper yet and will probably always use it for recording my guitar compositions.


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## MA-Simon (Nov 16, 2015)

I am an avid Cubase user. But I recently went from Cubase Studio 5 (which was really clean, sorted & functional) to 8 (which... has a hideous big, cluttered UI). ...I am about to roll back really. 8 is such a step back for me. It looks like something done by apple fanatics. Graphics > Functionality. I want my projects clean & tidy. Cubase 8 offers nothing like that. Thats 600€ down the drain.


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## dtonthept (Nov 16, 2015)

Cool - just so everyone knows too, I'm not so much a massive orchestral template kind of person, I mostly make records instead of soundtracks. But I've found the work flows that composers use, as most folks discuss on here, to be really eye opening. That led me to really see the limits I was up against in Pro Tools, and started a year long consideration on whether there was a better option elsewhere. 

Being that I do so much heavy duty audio recording and editing, I really found every other daw than tools to be a terrible compromise. But I felt like there were severe technical and work flow limitations that were holding me back in Pro Tools. 

I was fully ready to commit to Cubase (having decided against Logic because it is chained to the Apple platform, and I feel uncomfortable with Apple's direction, despite being a life long user) when someone on here made an offhand comment that I should check out Reaper. 

I'm totally blown away by its audio capabilities, it makes Pro Tools look crippled. 

Mixer and routing functionality is built on such a different paradigm it's quite amazing, so open and flexible. 

The midi feels like it might be right in my sweet spot. I can totally see how for the expression mapping crew it might feel limited. But the implementation and fluidity of virtual, physical instruments both, plus how they fit into the broader work flow is really impressive. 

Then there's stuff like how lean and small the application itself is. Many of the things that were really exciting about Cubase to me, namely resource efficiency and macro customizability, have very much had their boxes ticked in Reaper. 

It's interesting, Reaper seemed to be perceived as a more entry level, or simpler, tool, compared to established DAWs. But to me (now, having actually checked it out) it feels like a nimble startup, playing by completely different rules of its own making, operating completely free of decades of habits, and free of accountability to a conservative board of directors and hungry shareholders. 

I'm really excited. 

More soon, 

D


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## Lannister (Nov 16, 2015)

REAPER 5.1 just released today, with a sizable changelog. Next up should be the notation view/editor.

Oh, and someone posted a script to the forums today that enables Retrospective Record in REAPER.

Good stuff.


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## chimuelo (Nov 16, 2015)

I love Reaper also.
Fastest tracking workflow with so many great tools.
But only basic MIDI.
Cubase as much as I hate the dongle upgrade jive is still MIDI City.

But Reaper with Bidule as a VST Sub Host for Kontakt can playback and reload so much faster.
But with these NVMe devices it seems like every sample amp is fast.

Wait until you create your own theme with variations and screensets.
You'll see that it's great having such large uncluttered views customized exactly the way you want.


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## Guffy (Nov 16, 2015)

I started out using Reaper, but moved on to Studio One after a while. 
Studio One is still my main DAW, but i do have Reaper installed. There is some neat functions in there.


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## kitekrazy (Nov 16, 2015)

d.healey said:


> I went the other way



Tell us why.


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## d.healey (Nov 16, 2015)

kitekrazy said:


> Tell us why.


Long time Cubase user - started with Cubase VST sometime in the early 2000s - wanted to use expression maps when they came in (think that was Cubase 5) and found a major problem with them not processing commands in a certain order (this was a bug which didn't bother most people but was a pain for me because I was trying to link Cubase up with Sibelius and make use of expression maps) so I went looking for a new sequencer and found Reaper. And now my main focus is on sample library development Reaper is a must have tool, there is no other program that can do the stuff Reaper can in terms of sample editing and the ability to create custom scripts for it helps greatly.

I also like the Reaper philosophy - regular updates and you only have to pay when a new version comes out, and it's insanely cheap, good feedback from the developers on the forum, lots of help on the forum too from other users, lean and efficient programming (I've only had Reaper crash a few times, Cubase 5 would crash a lot with big projects), incredibly small download, I think it's almost at 10mb now for the 64bit version, and the install size is under 100mb including all the effects and processors that come with it - speaking of which, some of the effects are very very good, they all have a generic boring interface but what they do is what's important, ReaTune for example is my go to tuner it does an awesome job, and keeps samples in phase too (I recently found out)!

The only thing missing for me is notation - which is coming soon, and the Reaper devs tend to deliver on their promises. 

I could preach about the virtues of Reaper for another few pages... but I won't


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## kitekrazy (Nov 16, 2015)

Great post. I've come across some who dropped other DAWs because upgrades come with a lot of bloat which means a higher price and no reduction for just wanting the audio engine. I'm thinking of learning how to make SWS extensions. What put Reaper on the map was DAW benchmarks.


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## dtonthept (Nov 16, 2015)

Okay so very interesting to see everyone's thoughts so far. Really feels like Reaper might be at a bit of a tipping point with the features and maturity is has now. 

Anyways, first update is that my Skype run through with Jon from Reaper blog was amazing. He's super chill and very knowledgeable, has a pro tools background so it's easy to talk about habits and what to keep and where to open up thinking. 

So many good things, but I was really blown away by the render options. Cubase was doing great things on this front too, but Reaper can do this in so many different ways. Track freezing has some real genius capabilities - for example you can freeze your track up to a certain point in the fx chain, but still be able to tweak the plugs after that point. For final stages of production and mix this is just so huge. 

We talked a lot about editing techniques and possibilities. What he showed me of different ways even just to split an item (region) was very thought provoking, I can see that I need to put in some hard yards in the trenches to get my basic editing up to speed, while staying open minded enough to go beyond my existing paradigms. 

The whole philosophy behind only having one track type is really interesting too. I had been worried it would create a lot more work by having more button clicks just to get a virtual instrument track up and running, but this is taken care of by some handy actions, which speed up that side of it immensely. But he showed me a couple of examples of why you might want midi and audio on the same track, which I won't be able to fully explain in a nuanced way here. But the possibility is really cool. 

Also - recording track output??? This is a crazy concept that initially scared me and is now getting quite inspiring. 

Okay too much to list here. I've had to jump back into pro tools for the rest of the day to print mixes and stems and otherwise TCB, but will be back in Reaper land again soon. 

Very exciting.


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## tack (Nov 16, 2015)

dtonthept said:


> Anyways, first update is that my Skype run through with Jon from Reaper blog was amazing.


Thanks for sharing your initial experiences. Really interesting to hear what you discover as you go through this process.


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## dtonthept (Nov 16, 2015)

Oh just one more bit of background, I've been fiddling around with Reaper since early September, just on my laptop, watching tutorials, that kind of stuff. Haven't made any significant music in it yet, but I have a pretty decent broad overview. Looks like really getting to grips with the fine grained details is where Reaper would step things up. 

I'm still wrapping up stem and mix prints at the moment so... More soon!!!


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## dtonthept (Nov 17, 2015)

Okay, wrapping up all that stemming, and seting up my studio for the next wave of work. Gonna try to get Touch OSC working with Reaper, at this stage to see if it's easy to assign toggle buttons for actions rather than trying to remember a million and one new keyboard shortcuts just yet.

Fired up Reaper and it let me know 5.1 just got released. Check out this update log:

REAPER 5.1: Sir Hound
.
Media Explorer

support metadata in databases (ID3 tags, RIFF LIST-INFO, BWF descriptions)
search improvements
improve playback/preview behavior in various configurations
improve support for .LNK files, hidden/system folders on Windows
allow configuration of column order and visibility
improve UTF-8 support on Windows . .
increase shortcut list customization
use a better layout when small width set
JSFX

improve mouse behavior with touch screens or multiple mouse buttons pressed
add new 8-channel MIDI-controlled synchronized audio looper, Super8
add export_buffer_to_project()
improve parameter text editing behavior (enter to commit)
support __memtop() builtin function to query script memory size
support options: maxmem=xyz up to about 32 million items
Stretch markers

support for linear rate transitions between markers
adjust media item length automatically when editing stretch markers
fix quality issues with 0ms stretch marker fade
add action to manually edit stretch rates
add mouse modifier context for marker rate, various rate-envelope-like behaviors
add mouse modifier context for stretch marker double click
Actions window

use logical description sorting
allow executing single visible action without first selecting
enable enter in filter window to run action on Windows
allow configuration of closing after run for doubleclick/enter, for docked and undocked states
prevent truncated custom action names in the editor .
Freeze

automatically remove silent media from disk
fix silence detection (which was inadvertently disabled in 4.16)
improve render region detection for complex routing .
better handle unfreezing duplicated frozen items .
VST

improve VST3 sysex handling
prevent reset/delay on playback with Vienna Ensemble Pro VST2 [iid=5532]
add option to not send notes-off or pitch-reset messages on stop/reset
improve VST3 UI threading issues
Actions

add apply track FX to items as new take (multichannel)
add toggles for ripple per-track and all tracks
FX browser

allow inserting single visible FX without first selecting
fix recent filter list when clear filter on close set
allow switching from filter to list via enter, arrow keys
Glue

add preference to loop glued items .
improve glued item filename generation, make item labels consistent with files
OSX

improve drawing quality on on 10.10+
fix action support for F17-F19, NumPad enter
workaround various 10.11 issues
ReaScript

improve gfx mouse behavior with touch screens or multiple mouse buttons pressed
support __memtop() builtin function in EEL to query script memory size
use deterministic command ID string when adding scripts as actions
Search

do not treat back-tick as a quoting character, handle unterminated quotes
support ^foo, foo$, and "foo" for matching start/end/words
Windows

use current locale for date formatting
support drag and drop of file URLs
Audio/midi devices

improve device error notification window, preferences to disable
Batch converter

support writing markers/regions
Cues

support cues/regions for reversed takes, section takes
Cursors

added arrange_stretchmarker and arrange_stretchmarker_rate
Directory cleanup

improve support for very long filenames and UTF-8
Editing

fix replace media item source via drag and drop .
Explode multichannel audio

handle start offsets, stretch markers, and looping items correctly
Keyboard

support F12-F24 keys
Localization

fix various localization issues, make new template LangPack available
Media item properties

do not reset take start offset when enabling section with specified position
MP3

display ID3 tags in source properties
Parameter modulation

add option for free-running LFO (does not reset on seek/loop)
Performance

improve project/undo state loading performance
Project bay

use logical sorting
ReaVerb

fix prompt for test tone when deconvolving on OSX .
Render

when rendering selected media items with tails, prevent rendering the start of the following media item
Virtual keyboard

improve behavior when switching channels, octaves while notes are being played
WAVE

display RIFF LIST-INFO metadata in source properties
API

add GetTakeStretchMarkerSlope, SetTakeStretchMarkerSlope
fix TrackFX_SetPreset() return value
support spaces in section names for SetProjExtState()


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## Lannister (Nov 17, 2015)

That version is just out the door and they've already posted the first 5.11 pre-release,

v5.11pre1 - November 17 2015
+ Cues: allow encode of literal =START/=END into files using \=START and \=END
+ FX browser: fixed video processor/ReWire default preset issues
+ Glue: better support take FX on multichannel tracks
+ Glue: generate audio when a MIDI item has take FX that can produce audio
+ ReaProxy: support embedding projects within projects
+ Render item as new take: improve take FX support (multichannel, MIDI-to-audio)
+ Render/Windows: fix $user and $computer wilcards with international characters
+ Render: allow control of full-project render region with markers named =START and =END
+ Render: options to include tails when rendering time selection, regions, etc
+ Render: use stereo/multichannel stem rendering when encountering take FX on mono items
+ VST3: make compliant plug-ins adapt their channel count to the track channel count
# Render: fixed certain instances where audio device would not be reopened following render
# Updated to libpng 1.6.19


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## chimuelo (Nov 17, 2015)

Most fun is keeping your template loaded.
New projects can load combinations of MIDI and audio leaving your template.
Great MIDI plug ins and ReaRoute are great companions with Scope and UAD DSP and Bidule as a VST for Kontakt Instrument Banks. Basically becomes a massive ROMper only superior audio with articulation.
I tried Kronos Motiff Kurzweil and I just can't get by w/o VSL PLAY and Kontakt.


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## chimuelo (Nov 17, 2015)

You really need to checkout SWS as well as ReaMenus.
SWS is the finest 3rd party add on I know of for any app in Native.
With DSP apps.....that's their strength.


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## d.healey (Nov 17, 2015)

I use Reaper with Touch OSC, I use Bome's MIDI translator to turn MIDI messages into keyboard shortcuts in Reaper (and other programs).


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## dtonthept (Nov 17, 2015)

D. Heavy, that is very cool. Do you do bidirectional toggling or just one way messages? 

I'm currently going through the sws extension zoom options and binding a bunch of those to the Actions iPad app temporarily, just to save time from having to figure out touch OSC, which I'm looking forward to setting up in a more considered manner once I have refined my flow a bit. 

Also made buttons for all the different windows. 

Taking the approach that I'll make a lot of labelled buttons so that I can remember what the possibilities are - so MANY possibilities in Reaper!

Agreeing with Chim too - sws stuff very impressive indeed. 

Amazing to see that new update already out the door, I'm especially happy to see the render tails action in there. Previously you had to enter a millisecond value? 

Anyone here using all the wildcards and semi programming stuff for render Queues etc? I'll be fascinated to dig into that once the basics are in place.


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## chimuelo (Nov 17, 2015)

Bome's is awesome. Surprised someone here actually knows its value.
I have a Bome Box coming my way as soon as the WiFi workaround is complete.

Can't stand anything WiFi on the gig unless you are right next to it.
These WiFi mixers are prone to congestions. Especially since so many people send quick videos to YouTube during gigs or just snapshotting, texting, etc.

Works fine close by but our dream of the snakeless FOH went to hell during a gig.
Bomes MIDI Translator is great. Really want to make projects with it, then dump to the box.

Reaper FWIW is also Lighting Directors favorite app for automating long throw faders and Dimmer box wattage.
Showed me the fader moving glitch free the entire throw length.
Logic on a MacBook jittered like a whore in Church.


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## slidemasterx (Nov 17, 2015)

I've used reaper since version 3. I really like it but I still find it hard to change the CC#1 values. Why don't they make it linear and not block like?


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## Lannister (Nov 17, 2015)

slidemasterx said:


> I've used reaper since version 3. I really like it but I still find it hard to change the CC#1 values. Why don't they make it linear and not block like?



A tip I picked up that EvilDragon posted on the REAPER forums was to increase the value "Events per quarter note when drawing CC lanes" from the default 32 to 128.

It's in preferences under Editing Behavior --> MIDI Editor.

Also toggling the option, "Allow selecting a single CC event with a mouse click" means when drawing CC you won't click and drag just one CC block.


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## dtonthept (Nov 17, 2015)

Hey folks, 

Okay, I finally got to start making some music. Chopping audio, a couple of kontakts, machine, and battery only at this stage. Felt good and fluid, nice and tight, able to run at 128 buffer no probs, in PT I would normally already have to be in 256 at this stage. 

I haven't gone too deep yet, but it feels slick and solid and good. Still fumbling a bit with navigation and editing but I'm sure it'll speed up very quickly indeed. 

Starting to get a feel for the right blend of docked windows in different circumstances too, again very early but I really strongly intuit there will be a right way for me to flow which will emerge. I feel a bit more like I'm wobbling on a pair of ice skates rather than banging into walls. Hope that metaphor makes sense! 

Oh, it was impressive that Reaper automatically offered to make individual mapped outputs from maschine the second I loaded it up. I'm a bit out of practise with both so didn't go there just yet, but it's cool to feel there is that kind of capability under the hood waiting to be accessed.


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## dtonthept (Nov 17, 2015)

On that cc control point, I'm sure I saw a video or post which would allow you to have that kind of behaviour but still with the blocks - in other words you would click and drag and the line of blocks would follow you to wherever you released the mouse, rather than just remaining static once you had drawn over them. It was some kind of modifier, I believe... Sorry I can't be more precise!


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## Lannister (Nov 17, 2015)

dtonthept said:


> On that cc control point, I'm sure I saw a video or post which would allow you to have that kind of behaviour but still with the blocks - in other words you would click and drag and the line of blocks would follow you to wherever you released the mouse, rather than just remaining static once you had drawn over them. It was some kind of modifier, I believe... Sorry I can't be more precise!



I think that might be "CC selection follows note selection", another toggle option.


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## EvilDragon (Nov 17, 2015)

No, he's talking about linear edit MIDI CCs modifier. 

Too bad it's just for editing, it doesn't draw lines - that would've been even better.


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## Jason_D (Nov 17, 2015)

Lannister said:


> A tip I picked up that EvilDragon posted on the REAPER forums was to increase the value "Events per quarter note when drawing CC lanes" from the default 32 to 128.
> 
> It's in preferences under Editing Behavior --> MIDI Editor.
> 
> Also toggling the option, "Allow selecting a single CC event with a mouse click" means when drawing CC you won't click and drag just one CC block.



That's genius, thanks for the tip.


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## d.healey (Nov 18, 2015)

dtonthept said:


> Do you do bidirectional toggling or just one way messages?


Just one way


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## dtonthept (Nov 18, 2015)

d.healey said:


> Just one way



Any chance you might share a screen grab of your touch OSC layouts?

I've already outgrown Actions for iPad


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## dtonthept (Nov 18, 2015)

Oh!

I also wanted to mention that I was delighted that my eucon mc mix unit seems to be working great with Reaper, same deal with my maschine studio unit too.


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## Lannister (Nov 18, 2015)

EvilDragon said:


> No, he's talking about linear edit MIDI CCs modifier.
> 
> Too bad it's just for editing, it doesn't draw lines - that would've been even better.


 
Ah, ok 

I really like the way you can draw CC's in Studio One's MIDI Editor. I wish REAPER had an option for that.


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## Darthmorphling (Nov 18, 2015)

dtonthept said:


> Oh, it was impressive that Reaper automatically offered to make individual mapped outputs from maschine the second I loaded it up. I'm a bit out of practise with both so didn't go there just yet, but it's cool to feel there is that kind of capability under the hood waiting to be accessed.



In case you weren't aware, if you right click in the fx window of any vsti track, it gives you the option to build 16 tracks of midi, to the track, with all of the correct mappings.


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## dtonthept (Nov 18, 2015)

Darthmorphling! No I wasn't aware of that at all! Thank you so much! 

I remember someone saying once that there's a one button method to fire up Kontakt with audio and midi routing all taken care of automatically, is this it? Or is there another way which does audio and midi and routings etc? 

Oh and Lannister, I totally agree, lines for CCs with draggable curves etc would really be great.


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## dtonthept (Nov 18, 2015)

Here's that vid with the smooth cc tip


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## EvilDragon (Nov 18, 2015)

dtonthept said:


> I remember someone saying once that there's a one button method to fire up Kontakt with audio and midi routing all taken care of automatically, is this it? Or is there another way which does audio and midi and routings etc?



Track template. (They can have more than one track in them - so you can have your whole Kontakt instance folder plus routing plus MIDI tracks all in one template. Easy stuff.)


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## Darthmorphling (Nov 18, 2015)

Like EvilDragon said, track templates are the way to go. There is no default one button method, but simply create the vsti track, and choose yes for the audio. Then add the midi tracks. From there I usually hide the audio tracks in the TCP and the midi tracks in the mixer. Then you highlight all of the tracks you want to save, right click, and choose save as track template. Now you can simply add that to any project. It retains the routing for all of those tracks, as well their visibility in the TCP and mixer. I believe there are even actions/macros that can load the template in one go.


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## d.healey (Nov 18, 2015)

dtonthept said:


> Any chance you might share a screen grab of your touch OSC layouts?


This is my touchosc template, needs a bit of reorganising but I'm too busy at the mo. This template is designed for sample editing in Reaper.


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## dtonthept (Nov 18, 2015)

So cool....


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## dtonthept (Nov 18, 2015)

d.healey said:


> This is my touchosc template, needs a bit of reorganising but I'm too busy at the mo. This template is designed for sample editing in Reaper.


Wow that's great to see! Thank you! Nice to see that you can do different sizes etc, I can see how you could make something really ergonomic with a decent time investment, but it's great to see that you can just get straight in there and get busy too  

Actions for iPad doesn't go beyond a 4x5 grid of identically sized buttons, it's already rather limiting. 

It might not happen straight away, but I'd love to be able to set up bidirectional OSC for toggle buttons, that would be pretty useful in the long run.


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## dtonthept (Nov 18, 2015)

Okay, had more peripheral tasks today, but I'm now bearing down on scoring a 30" tvc. Lots of beats and synths for this one. 

Loving the way you can layer up sounds on one track. I do a lot of chopping up drum breaks, so it means I can keep the tails of hits and still have the next attacks all in a nice convenient spot for mixing and arrangement. 

Video also loaded in no problem, I'm running everything in Reaper, no external sync. 

More soon, 

D


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## dtonthept (Nov 19, 2015)

Bit of a rough few hours here trying to get multi channel Kontakt stuff happening. 

I think I shot myself in the foot by trying to have the main Kontakt track as the enclosing folder, then I messed myself up with input monitoring modes, but long story short is I believe I've found my way. 

Reaper has a really fresh way of doing routing which I know I'll really like when I get used to it. But, not the most productive evening in terms of tangible musical output!


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## Hannes_F (Nov 19, 2015)

dtonthept said:


> I think I shot myself in the foot by trying to have the main Kontakt track as the enclosing folder



It can work. However from a certain point of complexity it might be better to explicitly send the midi to the folder track in the I/O configuration window instead of relying on the automatic (master) routing feature. Same for audio if you have multitracks.


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## D.Salzenberg (Nov 19, 2015)

Love Reaper, but as mentioned, I really would love to draw cc lines with draggable curves!
Does anyone know if this may be forthcoming at some stage?


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## EvilDragon (Nov 19, 2015)

Only the devs know, and they don't share their plans with the public, really.


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## D.Salzenberg (Nov 19, 2015)

Thats fair enough. Reaper is still the best DAW I've ever used and I'm still very happy that I switched from Cubase.


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## Vin (Nov 19, 2015)

MA-Simon said:


> I am an avid Cubase user. But I recently went from Cubase Studio 5 (which was really clean, sorted & functional) to 8 (which... has a hideous big, cluttered UI). ...I am about to roll back really. 8 is such a step back for me. It looks like something done by apple fanatics. Graphics > Functionality. I want my projects clean & tidy. Cubase 8 offers nothing like that. Thats 600€ down the drain.



+1, that's why I'm still on 6.5 - the best version I've worked with since SX3.


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## samphony (Nov 19, 2015)

dtonthept said:


> Okay, had more peripheral tasks today, but I'm now bearing down on scoring a 30" tvc. Lots of beats and synths for this one.
> 
> Loving the way you can layer up sounds on one track. I do a lot of chopping up drum breaks, so it means I can keep the tails of hits and still have the next attacks all in a nice convenient spot for mixing and arrangement.
> 
> ...


If you look at the current pre release you might get hooked by Reaproxy. Awesome stuff!


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## dtonthept (Nov 20, 2015)

Hey all, 

Quick update.. I've had a couple of urgent mixes drop into my lap this week which has put me on a major time crunch, so I've been back in Pro Tools to mix. I'll say unfortunately, it's just the time crunch means the buffer I had built for myself to poke around and learn as I work has been eradicated. 

I have still done some more work in Reaper - last night I set up custom labelling for the 56 analogue inputs and outputs I'm running in my studio, and I'm really enjoying how easy on the eye and brain it is both setting this stuff up, and also using them on tracks in both the arrange view and mixer. 

I'm starting to feel much more at home with Reaper approach to inputs, outputs, and routing. This is pretty cool as I'm beginning to feel instinctively the benefits here and the potential increase in productivity as a result. 

Really grasping and digging the fact that you can pull up the routing window for a track and it will show you EVERYTHING to do with it - having the receives is amazing. For non Reapers, showing receives effectively means that it gives you a mini mixer of all tracks being sent to the track you are focusing on, so you can control everything from there, as well as from the source. Very cool indeed, this will save a LOT of time in the future. 

I then got a bit lost with the grouping setup. It seemed so simple, all the ribbons were showing up on tracks, but it didn't seem to be working right. I'd keep opening up the group channel window (as opposed to the grouping matrix) to check everything was ticked accordingly, then would flip between different groups to check on their status. 

Then my light bulb went off - I'm used to Pro Tools where you have a grouping window that has a global setting for each group, then tracks can either be part of that group, or not. When you switch between the different group settings in PT, you can modify the entire group. 

In Reaper, when you call up that window, it is specific to that exact track. If you want to apply the settings to a whole bunch of tracks, select them all, open the window, boom done. I had incorrectly set this up to start with, and made everything in my group masters, and not slaves as well. So none of the tracks would respond to the others when I tweaked them. Once I got the correct settings for all tracks being both master and slave I got the behaviour I was looking for. 

And immediately, I could see how much more powerful Reaper grouping is in this case. In PT it's such a pain in the ass to add a new track to an existing group. Here in Reaper it's so quick and easy. 

Then of course, we get into more complex situations where tracks can easily be related in various ways to a number of different groups, then the whole cool stuff about master and slave relationships, very very cool. 

The one thing I am really missing (or just haven't figured out yet) is having parameters linked automatically between the same plugins on different tracks. 

I also need to learn about track groups as relates to edit and item groups. 

So, some very encouraging progress, but still lots of work to do.


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## dtonthept (Nov 20, 2015)

Oh, it's worth saying that I'm typing this post while running off a bunch of audio stems from a drum replacement plugins. It's a stereo plug, with a bunch of different sample layer inserts. What I tend to do is pick a handful of samples I like, then print them all to audio so I can control them individually later in the mix. Often as a mix progresses one sample will take over from another as the one which works in context. 

Some of them have room mics as well as close mics, so I easily wind up printing between four and eight passes per drum, muting and panning different samples accordingly, some mono, some not... It's very time consuming. 

I'm really hoping I can access integrate the functionality in Reaper for this task in the future. I nearly spat my coffee all over the monitor in amazement when I saw this from Reaper blog about rendering multichannel plugins outputs. The fact that you can have multichannel within an individual track with a stereo output is amaaaaazing..... I've gotta spend the time to make sure I can make this work, but here's a single button click leading to a bit of drag n drop (explode multichannel to individual tracks) which could have a profound impact on my process. 

Okay back to it...


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## dtonthept (Nov 24, 2015)

Hi all, 

Latest update.. After the last minute schedule shake up last week I was hustling to meet some deadlines. Had a much needed day off on Monday and a travel day today to start a session, which is a non reaper scenario with a band. 

However, interesting progress nonetheless. I've started building a few (and I mean just a few) track templates, and have also spent time on airplanes poking around further in Reaper. I installed the ReaMenu set which is really interesting - well worth checking out if you are learning like me. 

https://mikestopcontinues.com/project/reaper-reamenus/

It's a custom menu set which brings way more actions into menus, so in the appropriate context it's a very good way to learn what possibilities you have available. No doubt you'd want to assign the useful ones to actions, but one of the biggest challenges we have when we learn reaper is that we simply have no idea of how deep we could go with it. So this is a great way to increase that sensitivity. 

I need to find a good way to sync settings between laptop and desktop too. I've heard rumours of some people running it from Dropbox, I really need to look into that. I've also ordered a new logitech mx master mouse, as reaper seems to really come alive with a heavy duty mouse and a lot of modifiers. 

On the subject of laptop and desktop interchangeability, I'm thinking that rather than purely learn a bunch of key commands, I'm going to try to get actions linked with lemur and or touchosc on tablets, which I could then take with me if I need to go mobile. Which I will a lot in the foreseeable future. I really miss having the full numpad on my Macbook when I'm travelling - so until I can switch to PC I'm thinking about pushing the capabilities of the combo of mouse and touchscreen as far as possible. 

I need to do some programming on my laptop over the coming week, so hopefully I'll be able to keep moving things forward, even if it's not as quickly as I had originally hoped.

Oh, on the subject of switching to PC, I've been v excited about this from a hardware point of view for a while, but having spent a chunk of the day looking at the peripherals used by the Master Race of PC Gamers, (know your meme, if you don't already) I gotta say I'm really looking forward to this aspect of PC life. And maybe I could set up one of those crazy mice to do all kinds of crazy stuff with Reaper... We'll see!

Oh, other cool reaper bits for today - the reaper midi plug in seems cool, I had a first play with it today. And I saw a couple of tutorials online that are starting to whet my appetite for the stark GUIs of the stock reaper plugs. 

More soon, 

D


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## Stevie (Nov 25, 2017)

So, after 2 years, how is your Reaper journey continuing?


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## dtonthept (Nov 28, 2017)

It didn't stick at all!


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## Stevie (Nov 28, 2017)

That doesn't sound very positive


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## devonmyles (Nov 28, 2017)

dtonthept said:


> It didn't stick at all!



Priceless.....
Ah man, funny post.


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## LFO (Nov 29, 2017)

dtonthept said:


> It didn't stick at all!


So what happened? I was reading your experience with Reaper and was interested. I've considered moving to Reaper from Cubase, but haven't done so because I am a heavy MIDI user. I still have it running on my DAW and play with it from time to time, (version 4, not 5) and am interested to hear how things ended for you, if you don't mind sharing.


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## InLight-Tone (Nov 29, 2017)

Same thing happened to me. Sold Cubase first (idiot) and went to Reaper for the scripting features. It's decent and impressive in many respects but didn't gel with me. It felt like there was TOO MUCH customization and had me wanting a more cohesive framework. It reminded me of my time in Linux, very cool programming but lot's of things just didn't work without re-compiling drivers, adding custom code etc. 

I couldn't get used to the weird zooming with the mouse and not being able to select items by left click dragging like every other program drove me nuts and that was not a "feature" you could change. 

Also, the lack of a midi delay, only audio was a major bummer as I use that in Cubase constantly to tighten up timing between tracks.

I re-bought Cubase and am a happy camper...


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## givemenoughrope (Nov 29, 2017)

I'm thinking about try Reaper just to be able to run 16 inputs in an instance (or several) of SPAT, mix/balance, render the audio and then throw it back into Cubase. Anyone else do this? Bad idea?


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## eboats (Nov 29, 2017)

I get that Reaper is good for audio but for me, Cubase is king for Midi. If you're doing a lot of detailed Midi editing/mockups (with orchestral VI's etc), Cubase just has so many bases covered with all of the Midi Functions, Expression Maps, Logical Editor, Note Expression, automation, randomize etc. So many ways to manipulate Midi at the microscopic level. Are there pro orchestral composers who are using Reaper for all of that?


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## Synetos (Nov 29, 2017)

I bought Reaper months ago and thought I could adapt. I wanted it to work for me because I was frustrated with Cubase being so buggy. Nope! I just can't tolerate it visually. It makes me want to gouge my eyes out after about 10 minutes. Looks like crap to me on my 4k monitors. 

Maybe I have just been on Cubase too long (~10 years)? Perhaps if I "had" to learn it and get use to it, I would. But, I don't...so it will sit around collecting free electrons. 

I am sure I'll open it up on occasion and then remember why I gave up on it real quickly. I don't doubt it is powerful and lean, but it is just not something I want to stare at all day.


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## Rapollo (Nov 29, 2017)

Synetos said:


> I bought Reaper months ago and thought I could adapt. I wanted it to work for me because I was frustrated with Cubase being so buggy. Nope! I just can't tolerate it visually. It makes me want to gouge my eyes out after about 10 minutes. Looks like crap to me on my 4k monitors.
> 
> Maybe I have just been on Cubase too long (~10 years)? Perhaps if I "had" to learn it and get use to it, I would. But, I don't...so it will sit around collecting free electrons.
> 
> I am sure I'll open it up on occasion and then remember why I gave up on it real quickly. I don't doubt it is powerful and lean, but it is just not something I want to stare at all day.



Thats very interesting... Such incredible variety in opinions.

As having at least a couple of years banked in my DAWs: Reaper, FL and Studio One and I've just recently got hold of to Cubase - Cubase looks genuinely the most dated by far to me on my PC. Reaper and FL are wonderful visually on my setup whereas Cubase's lack of any sort of self contained aliasing on text or the GUI. There is no one definite answer in the world of varied tech.


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## Sekkle (Nov 29, 2017)

I had an opposite experience. After being a long time Cubase/Ableton/Protools/Fairlight user I decided to give Reaper a go. I spent about 4 days customising it so it looks nice and all the mouse and keyboard modifiers and shortcuts are the same as Cubase. No issues there, in fact I can now zoom track height with the mouse scroll wheel which Cubase can't.
It's running perfectly and can do everything the other DAWs can do plus more, especially for scoring to picture, sound design (as in sfx for film), and sample based electronic tracks.
Now with the new AATranslator it'll be easy to convert Reaper projects to Ptools or Cubase/Nuendo or AAF for delivery.
I won't be going back!


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## DynamicK (Nov 30, 2017)

Sekkleman said:


> especially for scoring to picture, sound design (as in sfx for film), and sample based electronic tracks.I won't be going back!


Does it have support for Timecode Offsets and Display? Looked in the manual and don't see it


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## EvilDragon (Nov 30, 2017)

You mean different frame rates? Reaper supports these:






You can also generate SMPTE timecode source (MTC or LTC) in 23.976ND, 24, 25, 29.97DF, 29.97ND and 30 FPS.




InLight-Tone said:


> I couldn't get used to the weird zooming with the mouse and not being able to select items by left click dragging like every other program drove me nuts and that was not a "feature" you could change.



But you can change both of these. First one is reassigning mousewheel in Action list to do scrolling instead of zooming however you want. Second one is done by changing mouse modifiers.

As for MIDI negative delay, looks like one of the users did it as a JS FX: https://forum.cockos.com/showpost.php?p=1252977&postcount=6

I tested it. It is working.


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## sazema (Nov 30, 2017)

Synetos said:


> I bought Reaper months ago and thought I could adapt. I wanted it to work for me because I was frustrated with Cubase being so buggy. Nope! I just can't tolerate it visually. It makes me want to gouge my eyes out after about 10 minutes. Looks like crap to me on my 4k monitors.
> 
> Maybe I have just been on Cubase too long (~10 years)? Perhaps if I "had" to learn it and get use to it, I would. But, I don't...so it will sit around collecting free electrons.
> 
> I am sure I'll open it up on occasion and then remember why I gave up on it real quickly. I don't doubt it is powerful and lean, but it is just not something I want to stare at all day.



Main problem with R is because it costs 60$ 

If you look at this:







You can ask yourself why this costs up to 4.000$ and it looks like "crap" even at 2017.
Because is more focused to workflow and final product (mastering) than to look and sight.
Imagine, R costs about 2000$ and all producers are using it across the world. Any member here would be obsessed with R then  It's a matter of fashion and trend.
Man, Schiller (for example) still using Logic 9 and Stylus RMX, some other artists are still on Cubase 6 or Sound Forge 4. But you know...still, they're making good music and they're providing to us great gigs...


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## eboats (Nov 30, 2017)

I see a lot of Reaper fanboys on this site. I have it, and no doubt it's a good tool for the money as far as audio goes. But for Midi, am not seeing how it competes with Cubase (a gazillion midi functions, logical editor, expression maps, note expression, randomization/humanization, automation). Also, Cubase has probably the best Notation package of any DAW, and some composers even prefer it to dedicated notation products. Are any pro level composers using Reaper for these purposes when doing orchestral mockup work?


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## lucor (Nov 30, 2017)

eboats said:


> Are any pro level composers using Reaper for these purposes when doing orchestral mockup work?


Wilbert Roget just scored the latest Call of Duty using Reaper, as an example. But overall there aren't many, no.


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## Tyll (Nov 30, 2017)

eboats said:


> But for Midi, am not seeing how it competes with Cubase (a gazillion midi functions, logical editor, expression maps, note expression, randomization/humanization, automation).



It's fiddly at times to set up, but due to the very dedicated user base and the very open to script platform there are so many good scripts that make Reaper a very capable DAW for MIDI editing:
E.g. these tools create, select, warp compress, expand, curve, CCs,
this or this or this expression management scripts,
and hundreds more and more and more...

I don't think that anyone has to switch from/to Cubase to/from Reaper unless they want very, very specific features. People tend to discuss the choice of DAWs (and VSTs/libraries too!) as if that's what defines success when in fact they are just tools to use. I stand by the point that any good artisan can work with the cheapest tools and still get very good results. Reaper and Cubase both are far from being cheap tools so the choice is even less of a factor.


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## sazema (Nov 30, 2017)

lucor said:


> Wilbert Roget just scored the latest Call of Duty using Reaper, as an example. But overall there aren't many, no.



I saw many of them uses Sonar and Logic, and some of them Live, but top notch story is that one of them is using FL Studio but version 11. So what to do now?
Oh my, some stories just never ends.
Don't understand people here really.
First, some guy have Cubase but because it's buggy he wants to switch to Reaper !?? So, you payed 600-700$ and you will now throw that in dust, and just like that you will switch to Reaper, but Reaper is bad on 4K monitor. Why is Cubase buggy, how then PROs is using Cubase if is buggy? Never heard something about Cubase is buggy, it's software like any other available and as I know latest version is very stable.
Hm...


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## Stevie (Nov 30, 2017)

eboats said:


> I see a lot of Reaper fanboys on this site. I have it, and no doubt it's a good tool for the money as far as audio goes. But for Midi, am not seeing how it competes with Cubase (a gazillion midi functions, logical editor, expression maps, note expression, randomization/humanization, automation). Also, Cubase has probably the best Notation package of any DAW, and some composers even prefer it to dedicated notation products. Are any pro level composers using Reaper for these purposes when doing orchestral mockup work?



Actually Reaper features all these functions that you mention and even more, since Reaper has a scripting API.
So, only your imagination is the limit. As Tyll already mentioned, there are tons of scripts out there, which surpass the
possibilities of Cubase. But Reaper is of course not for everyone. And concerning the notation... I never heard anyone praising Cubase for its scoring capabilities, especially people switching from Logic were very disappointed.

EDIT: concerning expression maps: http://reaticulate.com/
This just came out some days ago. Having abandonned expression maps in Cubase (it hasn't been updated since version 6, you can't sort your maps alphabetically, in consequence it absolutely gets messy when having more than 50 expression maps), I must say, that Jason created a brilliant solution. I ike the approach way more than Cubase' solution.

Btw, Tyll also posted great links, just saw them now. If you are interessted in Reaper, definitely check those out.


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## sazema (Nov 30, 2017)

Stevie said:


> Actually Reaper features all these functions that you mention and even more, since Reaper has a scripting API.
> So, only your imagination is the limit. As Tyll already mentioned, there are tons of scripts out there, which surpass the
> possibilities of Cubase. But Reaper is of course not for everyone. And concerning the notation... I never heard anyone praising Cubase for its scoring capabilities, especially people switching from Logic were very disappointed.
> 
> ...



Max Richter is a one PRO composer right?

Lets jump in into his studio



Every day Max has a deep thoughts about switching from Logic to Cubase or Sonar or Reaper or ...

Wow, Logic again and version 9 ... (how dare you Max)


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## DynamicK (Nov 30, 2017)

EvilDragon said:


> You mean different frame rates? Reaper supports these:
> You can also generate SMPTE timecode source (MTC or LTC) in 23.976ND, 24, 25, 29.97DF, 29.97ND and 30 FPS.


 Thanks EvilDragon. I managed to find it in the Project Setup area, Project start time.


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## Sekkle (Nov 30, 2017)

eboats said:


> I see a lot of Reaper fanboys on this site. I have it, and no doubt it's a good tool for the money as far as audio goes. But for Midi, am not seeing how it competes with Cubase (a gazillion midi functions, logical editor, expression maps, note expression, randomization/humanization, automation). Also, Cubase has probably the best Notation package of any DAW, and some composers even prefer it to dedicated notation products. Are any pro level composers using Reaper for these purposes when doing orchestral mockup work?



I don't do in-depth orchestral mockups and use midi in a pretty standard way. I think probably Reaper is nicely suited to the particular way I work (which isn't typical) and has managed to solve the many frustrations I had with Cubase when scoring to picture, specifically with handling multiple tempo based cues in a master project and manipulating audio musically. All the other things I like about it like Folders for fast drag/drop bussing/grouping, drag drop send routing, clip FX, scalable tracks into multichannel after the fact are just nice bonuses I've discovered and have saved me a huge amount of time on recent projects.

Horses for courses as they say!


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## Chris Richter (Dec 1, 2017)

Does Reaper have Cubase like folders? I worked with v.4 some time and Reaper folders drove me crazy. I want tracks in a folder to be completely invisible, not just narrowed to small view.


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## Stevie (Dec 1, 2017)

Yes, Reaper has folders. The visibility of tracks inside a folder depends on a theme. I use a theme, where you can completely hide the tracks inside. It's called: Janne2016 II.


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## Chris Richter (Dec 1, 2017)

Stevie said:


> Yes, Reaper has folders. The visibility of tracks inside a folder depends on a theme. I use a theme, where you can completely hide the tracks inside. It's called: Janne2016 II.


Mhhh, then it has to be a setting in the preferences I guess...


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## Stevie (Dec 1, 2017)

https://forums.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=1440445


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## Chris Richter (Dec 1, 2017)

Thanks a lot guys!


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## Synetos (Dec 1, 2017)

sazema said:


> I saw many of them uses Sonar and Logic, and some of them Live, but top notch story is that one of them is using FL Studio but version 11. So what to do now?
> Oh my, some stories just never ends.
> Don't understand people here really.
> First, some guy have Cubase but because it's buggy he wants to switch to Reaper !?? So, you payed 600-700$ and you will now throw that in dust, and just like that you will switch to Reaper, but Reaper is bad on 4K monitor. Why is Cubase buggy, how then PROs is using Cubase if is buggy? Never heard something about Cubase is buggy, it's software like any other available and as I know latest version is very stable.
> Hm...



I assume your directing that at me...and I am trying to decipher your point. Cubase 9 was buggy when it came out...at least on my rig. So were versions 4, 5, 6, 7, 8. If you spent any time using them, you dealt with lockups, crashes, CPU spikes, etc. In fairness, Reaper has crashed on me too. It choked on Vienna Ensemble Pro 6.

$600-700? Heck no...I have owned two full license of of Cubase for about 10 years. Paid all the updates, etc. You can do the math. Much more than $600-700 bucks. I have a lot invested in Cubase, and many other software packages. I bought Waves Mercury when it wasnt being given away. Yes, even $2000 is giving it away compared to what I paid for it.

It was never about the price for Reaper. Price isnt a motivator for me. I paid a small fortune for Waves back in the day, but I would stop using it if I liked Slate Audio Everything bundle better. Same with Reaper vs Cubase. 

I explored Reaper because I was frustrated with not being able to get my system stable at the time. It ended up being more about NVidia video drivers and other hardware/software not playing well with Cubase at the time, but Cubase isn't innocent. I have a 10core CPU, that I cant make use of with hyper-threading...blah blah blah

So yes! I turned to Reaper to see if I could make it work for me. I just couldn't like it. Reaper looks like crap to my eyes on my 4K. I cant read a lot of it. My eyes are not so good. Since all I have are 4k monitors, it needs to be visually appealing. I didnt buy 4K monitors to scale them up 200% so i can see my DAW.

Personally, I am not interested in fiddling with a DAW it to make it look pretty. Out of the box, Reaper needs to be a bit more attractive to those who appreciate the GUI as much as the power under the hood. Of all the DAW options, Reaper is by far the least appealing, visually, to me. 

In fairness, I looked at other alternatives too, Logic, DP, Studio One, etc. I came back to Cubase (mostly out of familiarity) so I can just get on with making music. After all, what DAW I use...or why I use it...ought to be my choice, right? Well...I have chosen. I am back using Cubase Pro and upgraded to 9.5 on my copies.


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## sazema (Dec 1, 2017)

Synetos said:


> In fairness, I looked at other alternatives too, Logic, DP, Studio One, etc. I came back to Cubase (mostly out of familiarity) so I can just get on with making music. After all, what DAW I use...or why I use it...ought to be my choice, right? Well...I have chosen. I am back using Cubase Pro and upgraded to 9.5 on my copies.



That's great!


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## Sami (Dec 1, 2017)

Cubase is the perfect example of a technically perfect software which I hate to use. Like a german car, I can‘t complain about it, but I just don’t LOVE it. It does not inspire me the way Logic does. But MAN does Logic make you sweat with the articulations and the other nonsense sometimes. Like a vintage british bike.


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## dtonthept (Dec 1, 2017)

I feel like I want to make a brief post in defense of Reaper despite not sticking with it - I love so much about it but given my very regular and intense deadlines I just didn't quite have the available energy and headspace to get myself to the other side of the setup and customisation curve. It really is a brilliant platform and I still yearn for it in many ways, however between the setup and the lack of "native" controller support I've floated back to Pro Tools with 2 x HDX cards, alongside Pro Tools Control on an iPad, Pro Tools Dock, and the S3 controller. The hands on capabilities with these guys is truly astounding, and the Eucon software required to run them allows you to build macros and make custom buttons - always the glaring omission with Pro Tools in the past. Also, a LOT of my work is more in the production and mixing of records rather than scoring for film, so this all works better in that world. There's a brilliant blog called Admiral Bumblebee where he spends a month working on effectively every different DAW in the world, and his Reaper journey is very illuminating indeed.


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## LFO (Dec 4, 2017)

dtonthept said:


> I love so much about it but given my very regular and intense deadlines I just didn't quite have the available energy and headspace to get myself to the other side of the setup and customisation curve.


Exactly my thought. I really like Reaper, but to get the MIDI features I have in Cubase I have to a) discover (and that takes more time than one would think) b) install and learn scripts to get like functionality. Besides that, I found that the myriad of customization could really be painful. First, (again) you have to learn sooo much and then if you make a change to one setting it might trigger changes in other places that you have no idea will be effected. This causes more head scratching than I care for.
Reaper is great and I can see why it is great for many people, but for me it requires too much headspace (to use your term) that I could spend on music related topics.


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## DynamicK (Dec 5, 2017)

Switching DAWs is always a painful process, especially if you've been using it for years. At least nowadays there is a plethora of Tutorials and Forums to help in the process. As a long time user of DAWs, first with *Sonar*, then *Cubase* and now in the process of switching again, as I'm not giving any more of my money to Steinberg for updates I don't need, without addressing long term issues. What I'm liking so far about Reaper, *IS *the customization. If there's a feature I need, looks like someone has kindly written a script to do it. I think that *Reaper* is very close to Cubase in terms of Midi implementation, in fact the closest. I'm also demoing *Studio One* at the moment, but that is way behind Reaper in Midi and Video features. However at least they are listening companies, unlike Steinberg, now becoming stupidly expensive @£450. BTW I'm talking *Windows DAWs* here.


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