# EW Spaces II - Anyone upgrading?



## quantum7 (Jul 26, 2018)

http://www.soundsonline.com/spaces-...tter&utm_campaign=spaces-ii-gen-now-available

I used to use Spaces all the time, but over the years have gravitated to other choices such as Altiverb 7 and SeventhHeaven for my convolution reverb needs. Spaces II looks intriguing though, but for $149 (the upgrade price) I'm not quite sure it is worth it now. Opinions welcome.


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## rcris (Jul 26, 2018)

I upgraded today and it's definitely worth it. The improved UI and additions of a filter and decay control are very welcome indeed. And the new locations are excellent! And the pictures (finally!) representing the locations are very helpful.

I don't have altiverb so I can't tell you if it's better or not, but for the price, it's a very good upgrade.


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## Geocranium (Jul 26, 2018)

Do they have anything new in terms of orchestral hall reverbs? My favorite part of Spaces is the So. Cal hall from all the different perspectives.


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## damcry (Jul 26, 2018)

Not at this price. Will wait a sale...


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## The Darris (Jul 26, 2018)

I'm testing via the Cloud Sub and all I can say is that yes, it sounds great BUT the IR management is awful. They have a specific "Instrument Specific Tour" folder with multiple sub-folders. However, not all of the instrument specific IR's can be found here. You need to go fishing to find them within the Location specific folders. It would be great if each location that has instrument specific IR's had their own folder for them versus just sitting in the M-S/S-S Folders. 

I'd also like there to be some UI scaling. On 2K+ monitor, it's extremely tiny and the font is pretty small which makes it hard to read in many cases. 

On the bright side, besides sounding great, it performs a hell of a lot better than the original Spaces ever did for me. I had to stop using it because it caused crashes, hang ups, pops, etc. So far, I've not had problems with Spaces II. I'd just like to see some minor cosmetic/workflow changes to make it a lot more user friendly and easy to get the IR you want.


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## rcris (Jul 26, 2018)

The Darris said:


> I'm testing via the Cloud Sub and all I can say is that yes, it sounds great BUT the IR management is awful. They have a specific "Instrument Specific Tour" folder with multiple sub-folders. However, not all of the instrument specific IR's can be found here. You need to go fishing to find them within the Location specific folders. It would be great if each location that has instrument specific IR's had their own folder for them versus just sitting in the M-S/S-S Folders.
> 
> I'd also like there to be some UI scaling. On 2K+ monitor, it's extremely tiny and the font is pretty small which makes it hard to read in many cases.
> 
> On the bright side, besides sounding great, it performs a hell of a lot better than the original Spaces ever did for me. I had to stop using it because it caused crashes, hang ups, pops, etc. So far, I've not had problems with Spaces II. I'd just like to see some minor cosmetic/workflow changes to make it a lot more user friendly and easy to get the IR you want.



I agree. The folder's can be better organized.


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## milesito (Jul 26, 2018)

Should I save for altiverb or upgrade to spaces? WHat is a better product price
Aside? I have spaces now and it gets the job done...it just is limited in options. If I am willing to invest more which of the two is better? For orchestral film scoring...


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## Quantum Leap (Jul 26, 2018)

Spaces 2 crushes Altiverb for orchestral film work. Altiverb is amazing and broad ranging reverb software that often sounds like mush. So Cal Hall, Reynolds Hall, Davies Hall, Angels Cathedral, Grace Church, Hamburg Cathedral all sound better than anything in Altiverb. And they have a ton of instrument/ early reflections impulse options that Altiverb doesn’t have.​


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## TimCox (Jul 26, 2018)

I've almost bought Spaces so many times simply for Benaroya Hall being in there. Now that theres a 2...might be a must!


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## constaneum (Jul 26, 2018)

damcry said:


> Not at this price. Will wait a sale...



I think the current price is near 50%. I anticipate future sale would be the same price as the current intro price


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## quantum7 (Jul 26, 2018)

Quantum Leap said:


> Spaces 2 crushes Altiverb for orchestral film work. It’s Mclaren versus Hyundai. Altiverb is amazing and broad ranging reverb software that sounds like mush. So Cal Hall, Reynolds Hall, Davies Hall, Angels Cathedral, Grace Church, Hamburg Cathedral all sound better than anything in Altiverb. And they have a ton of instrument/ early reflections impulse options that Altiverb doesn’t have.



Spaces 2 "crushes" Altiverb? Bold statement, but it has me intrigued and I will now have to investigate further.


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## Jimmy Hellfire (Jul 26, 2018)

Spaces is great, but the upgrade is too expensive.


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## emasters (Jul 26, 2018)

TimCox said:


> I've almost bought Spaces so many times simply for Benaroya Hall being in there.



I also like the sound of Spaces Benaroya Hall impulses. Was working with it last night -- really creates a rich sounding Space (so to speak).


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## gpax (Jul 26, 2018)

The Darris said:


> I'd also like there to be some UI scaling. On 2K+ monitor, it's extremely tiny and the font is pretty small which makes it hard to read in many cases.


I have to also agree, Chris, from the perspective of being legally blind.

The v2 interface is very compelling, and modern in design, yet has a constrained approach I personally struggled with right away. Navigating small fonts is not a unique challenge to me and GUIs, but the trend toward scalable options is something I’ve come to expect (and rely on) in other plugins recently. Or, at the very least, an option to expand some things. I actually grabbed the corner when I first launched S2, thinking it would scale.

Apart from that, I’m pleased with the actual sound. The instrument specific IRs I’ve tested so far are very clean and transparent, and a nice addition over the original Spaces. I think these settings are actually useful gems that will become more apparently as others use them and discover. I’ve been in both the War Memorial and Davies hall, and love those additions in S2. Too much of a good thing, if I don’t use these judicially, lol.

G


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## Sid Francis (Jul 26, 2018)

Unfortunately that was also the first thing that I noticed when I started using it: "So small?" In the trailers it seems so gigantic and in reality it seems quite small. Additionally the knobs on my quite dark monitor (not to get blinded too much after hours of work) are "black on black surrounded by black". Obviously both is improvovable.
But the sound: gorgeous! And Sean: I had a NFR licence of Altiverb for one year...and NEVER used it, deleted it before it ran out because "Spaces crushes Altiverb"


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## keepitsimple (Jul 26, 2018)

Yes I was surprised by how small the GUI is and when I looked at the resize option I didn’t find one. 

Having said that, it sounds fantastic.

I was using it with the VSL CFX yesterday. What was meant to be a short couple minutes test with the Hamburg Cathedral iR ended up being a 30+ minutes jam. I just couldn’t stop playing.


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## N.Caffrey (Jul 27, 2018)

emasters said:


> I also like the sound of Spaces Benaroya Hall impulses. Was working with it last night -- really creates a rich sounding Space (so to speak).


Which one is this preset?


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## Brendon Williams (Jul 27, 2018)

N.Caffrey said:


> Which one is this preset?


It’s the Northwest Hall.


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## jcrosby (Jul 27, 2018)

1 license and no upgrade path = a firm no.

"Crushes Altiverb"?

Considering the films mixed/scored using Altiverb? (Let alone Altiverb's firm foothold as the post-production convolution reverb of choice?)
Sorry but that's purely opinion-based hype.
And considering this is by a representative of the product's developer? Suspiciously biased.


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## Akarin (Jul 27, 2018)

Am I the only one bothered by the lack of numerical values (in ms for pre-delay, in Hz for filters)? Using a knob without values is challenging. I know they said it will be added in a future update but as of now, it isn't in there.


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## constaneum (Jul 27, 2018)

US$149 was the original Spaces 1 price back then right ? so basically, we're paying the original price for Space 2, not even the intro price.


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## Francis Bourre (Jul 27, 2018)

Quantum Leap said:


> And they have a ton of instrument/ early reflections impulse options that Altiverb doesn’t have.


I'm curious, which options are you talking about?


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## constaneum (Jul 27, 2018)

anyway, i think i'll get the upgrade. =)


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## Francis Bourre (Jul 27, 2018)

Quantum Leap said:


> So Cal Hall, Reynolds Hall, Davies Hall, Angels Cathedral, Grace Church, Hamburg Cathedral all sound better than anything in Altiverb.


Another question, why don't you propose all the latest IRs for Spaces 1 as an extension? From outside, smells like a big repackaging to sell twice the full product.


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## Lode_Runner (Jul 27, 2018)

Quantum Leap said:


> Spaces 2 crushes Altiverb for orchestral film work. It’s Mclaren versus Hyundai. Altiverb is amazing and broad ranging reverb software that sounds like mush. So Cal Hall, Reynolds Hall, Davies Hall, Angels Cathedral, Grace Church, Hamburg Cathedral all sound better than anything in Altiverb. And they have a ton of instrument/ early reflections impulse options that Altiverb doesn’t have.


 Maybe they are, maybe they aren't, whatever the case this approach to marketing is a massive turn off for me.


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## N.Caffrey (Jul 27, 2018)

Brendon Williams said:


> It’s the Northwest Hall.


Thank you! Which one is the So. Cal then?


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## MarcelM (Jul 27, 2018)

Lode_Runner said:


> Maybe they are, maybe they aren't, whatever the case this approach to marketing is a massive turn off for me.



well if it is the truth its kinda ok. but i remember also statement like this regarding hollywood choirs, and it didnt crush the competition imho. not to mention the solo strings. so its always better if we get opinions from users or could try a demo.


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## fretti (Jul 27, 2018)

constaneum said:


> US$149 was the original Spaces 1 price back then right ? so basically, we're paying the original price for Space 2, not even the intro price.


I think it was 265$ or something like that (maybe even 300 at the start). But with the frequent 50% sales I think most People got it at ~150$, or even less from other retailers


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## Consona (Jul 27, 2018)

I own Spaces 1 and still use $50 Vahalla on all the orchestral stuff anyway so no upgrade here.


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## Sid Francis (Jul 27, 2018)

I have got only very little money to spend on new software since some time. CD sales are going down rapidly and as we say in Germany "I have to turn the cent twice". Interestingly I did not hesitate a minute when I got the Spaces upgrade offer. Got it at 7 GMT in the morning and bought it at 7.02 GMT  I did not ask myself "Is it worth it?" or "Do I get it a lot cheaper than a new customer would" nor "Will it be much cheaper in the future" ... Only thing I asked myself was "Can I afford it now?"  Qualitywise it is an absolute no brainer for me... but I agree, that reverb is very much dependant on taste. A guitar may be a blues singers dream and at the same time a celtic pickers nightmare. It is similar with reverbs... Sean: funny, Seventh heaven was also an instant purchase for me, great reverb too!


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## StatKsn (Jul 27, 2018)

Quantum Leap said:


> Spaces 2 crushes Altiverb for orchestral film work. It’s Mclaren versus Hyundai. Altiverb is amazing and broad ranging reverb software that sounds like mush. So Cal Hall, Reynolds Hall, Davies Hall, Angels Cathedral, Grace Church, Hamburg Cathedral all sound better than anything in Altiverb. And they have a ton of instrument/ early reflections impulse options that Altiverb doesn’t have.



Excuse me, but that could be a borderline FUD without an actual example. I have Altiverb and Spaces 1. SoCal Hall IRs are hella good, coming with a lot of reflective definition during the decay. Altiverb doesn't have that definition or technically significantly worse? Uhh, yes and no. Altiverb doesn't have the exact IR but they have a lot of different choices.

Here's an example. Either one is Spaces (SoCal Hall Strings TS FR) or Altiverb (Amsterdam Concertgebouw 8m cardioids). Which one sounds mush? 

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/altiverb_vs_spaces-mp3.14550/][/AUDIOPLUS]

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/altiverb_vs_spaces_2-mp3.14551/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## OleJoergensen (Jul 27, 2018)

StatKsn said:


> Excuse me, but that could be a borderline FUD without an actual example. I have Altiverb and Spaces 1. SoCal Hall IRs are hella good, coming with a lot of reflective definition during the decay. Altiverb doesn't have that definition or technically significantly worse? Uhh, yes and no. Altiverb doesn't have the exact IR but they have a lot of different choices.
> 
> Here's an example. Either one is Spaces (SoCal Hall Strings TS FR) or Altiverb (Amsterdam Concertgebouw 8m cardioids). Which one sounds mush?
> 
> ...


Thank you for this example .
I don’t know which is Spaces or Altiverb. I like the second best in both examples. The first reverb seems to color the sound a bit but also makes the sound bigger or lauder. The second reverb has a nice calm reverb tail.
Which is which?


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## StatKsn (Jul 27, 2018)

I auditioned both Altiverb's and Spaces' hall IRs one-by-one during making a test and, as for orchestral mockup use, I personally made up my mind whether Altiverb or Spaces is better. There is some difference! That is just personal opinion but I'll talk about that after disclosing which one is Altiverb/Spaces in the example.


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## will_m (Jul 27, 2018)

StatKsn said:


> Excuse me, but that could be a borderline FUD without an actual example. I have Altiverb and Spaces 1. SoCal Hall IRs are hella good, coming with a lot of reflective definition during the decay. Altiverb doesn't have that definition or technically significantly worse? Uhh, yes and no. Altiverb doesn't have the exact IR but they have a lot of different choices.
> 
> Here's an example. Either one is Spaces (SoCal Hall Strings TS FR) or Altiverb (Amsterdam Concertgebouw 8m cardioids). Which one sounds mush?
> 
> ...



Thanks for doing this, I prefer the first pass on each example but there does seem to be a level difference between them.

Also marketing like this is frankly embarrassing:



Quantum Leap said:


> Spaces 2 crushes Altiverb for orchestral film work. It’s Mclaren versus Hyundai. Altiverb is amazing and broad ranging reverb software that sounds like mush. So Cal Hall, Reynolds Hall, Davies Hall, Angels Cathedral, Grace Church, Hamburg Cathedral all sound better than anything in Altiverb. And they have a ton of instrument/ early reflections impulse options that Altiverb doesn’t have.



If you have something to back up those claims then I'm all ears, but seeing as there is no walk-through video or even audio examples its hard to take you seriously. The email I got reads like "here's our new update, all we have to show you is this teaser video but just buy the update for $150 (IN 48 HOURS) and I'm sure it'll be great".

Also yes, the update is too expensive.


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## Pablocrespo (Jul 27, 2018)

Yes. I was keen but I think the two days limit is a slap in the face to old customers. 

I will pass, maybe a sale, but they don’t do many sales involving upgrades (always on the hunt for new customers)


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## NoamL (Jul 27, 2018)

Hi @Quantum Leap 

I'm really liking the new TS impulses! I have two questions.

1. Is it the intended workflow to use the FR + RR impulses together? (on separate sends) For some reason, the FR impulses alone, seem a lot drier or lower level, than some of the FRs in Spaces 1.

2. How would you integrate Spaces 2 in a mix where you already have lots of stems? For example on one mix I have Spot, Close, Tree, Far, Wide stems for strings and winds.


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## NoamL (Jul 27, 2018)

StatKsn said:


> Excuse me, but that could be a borderline FUD without an actual example. I have Altiverb and Spaces 1. SoCal Hall IRs are hella good, coming with a lot of reflective definition during the decay. Altiverb doesn't have that definition or technically significantly worse? Uhh, yes and no. Altiverb doesn't have the exact IR but they have a lot of different choices.
> 
> Here's an example. Either one is Spaces (SoCal Hall Strings TS FR) or Altiverb (Amsterdam Concertgebouw 8m cardioids). Which one sounds mush?
> 
> ...



I slightly prefer the 1st example in each case. The 2nd example feels more like a recording played back in the space, while the 1st example feels more like the instruments are actually in the space. It's difficult to put my finger on exactly why it feels like that. Maybe just a placebo effect from presence/levels. In any case, the two examples sound close to me.


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## Mystic (Jul 27, 2018)

Pablocrespo said:


> Yes. I was keen but I think the two days limit is a slap in the face to old customers.
> 
> I will pass, maybe a sale, but they don’t do many sales involving upgrades (always on the hunt for new customers)


It really is but I expect nothing less from them. They've always been terrible with their customers despite how good a few of their products have been. I've been looking forward to Spaces 2 for a long time but remembering things like how they respond to people who buy their products and the terrible social presence (like in this thread) might just keep me from doing so.


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## Mike Fox (Jul 27, 2018)

damcry said:


> Not at this price. Will wait a sale...


Bingo


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## Ruffian Price (Jul 27, 2018)

Hall photos are great, but they should display source location for the source-specific impulses. If you're mixing dry and wet signals from multiple tracks, you still have to pan them by ear/meter comparison with wet output.


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## jtnyc (Jul 27, 2018)

Pablocrespo said:


> Yes. I was keen but I think the two days limit is a slap in the face to old customers.
> 
> I will pass, maybe a sale, but they don’t do many sales involving upgrades (always on the hunt for new customers)



I agree on the 2 day limit to upgrade. Fabfilter’s upgrade prices are permanent.


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## quantum7 (Jul 27, 2018)

Wow, I didn’t even realize about the “2 day” thing to upgrade. What a smug company EW is. Boy that felt good to say out loud.


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## StatKsn (Jul 27, 2018)

I do smell "at all costs" very hostile attitude for customers, competitors and even their previous collaborators from EW from the very beginning, in similar fashion to Uber of its glory days. I think it is a deep cultural problem. Like when they told us the absence of Nick Phoenix -Quantum Leap himself- doesn't matter because he is "not famous" as the HOW debacle unfolds.

However, their products are 50-60% off for 200 out of 365 days after a year, so you don't need to hurry if you are on the edge regarding this release. I also believe that Nick doesn't have a control over EW's sales policy or this 2-days upgrade without a demo thing.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Jul 27, 2018)

Mystic said:


> They've always been terrible with their customers despite how good a few of their products have been.



How so? Not being sarcastic, I am just curious, as I've been a heavy EW user since 2006 and the service I've received has always been top notch. I agree the pricing is sometimes whacky. I was totally anti-cloud until I dove in during a promotional sale a year ago. I am totally digging it, even though I already own a lot of their stuff. But even for libs like Hollywood Choirs, Voices of the Empire, Spaces II, and HW solo instruments, CC has paid for itself in spades when I add up the costs of buying them separately.


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## leonardo (Jul 27, 2018)

StatKsn said:


> Excuse me, but that could be a borderline FUD without an actual example. I have Altiverb and Spaces 1. SoCal Hall IRs are hella good, coming with a lot of reflective definition during the decay. Altiverb doesn't have that definition or technically significantly worse? Uhh, yes and no. Altiverb doesn't have the exact IR but they have a lot of different choices.
> 
> Here's an example. Either one is Spaces (SoCal Hall Strings TS FR) or Altiverb (Amsterdam Concertgebouw 8m cardioids). Which one sounds mush?
> 
> ...



Thank you very much for these examples! I would say that in each example the first take is Altiverb and the second is Spaces with So.Cal.Hall. To my ears the first takes in both comparisons are more colored and "muddier" whereas the second takes are definitely clearer. This is due to the fact that the So.Cal.Hall impulses have exceptionally clear ER's and the tail kicks in later and is quite long; that makes for clearer transients and more definition whereas the first impulse you have chosen sort of covers everything with a thick "sauce". But IMO the long, bright and sort of detached tail in the So.Cal.Hall impulses can also be a problem sometimes because the original signal seems quite upfront but there is a big tail buildup afterwards. This is why I find the addition of the decay parameter in Spaces 2 very helpful: this way I can shorten the length of the tail without having to reduce the overall early reflections and the intensity of the beginning of the reverb.

In any case: I own both Altiverb and Spaces and have used and compared them a lot in the past years (both on real recordings and on orchestral samples) and imo Altiverb doesn't have impulses that are as clear and rich as in Spaces. In Altiverb you can modify every aspect of the impulses: you can treat ER's differently from the tail, you can postpone ER's and tail independently, change their volume, even turn off ER or tail completely, lengthen or shorten the various portions etc... but all that comes at a sonic cost, it doesn't sound as natural as the impulses in Spaces do. So if you're just after the most natural and convincing space you want to put your production into - especially if it's a real recording - then imo Spaces offers better results. You just have to find an impulse that suits your recording. If however you need to have access to the most complete collection of spaces for post-production stuff then Altiverb is certainly unbeatable. That is my experience at least, of course other people may have different opinions.

And maybe I'm also wrong on the assertion that the first take is Altiverb and the second Spaces, who knows  but I'm quite sure to know So.Cal.Hall well enough in order to recognize it...


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## Fleer (Jul 27, 2018)

Wolfie2112 said:


> How so? Not being sarcastic, I am just curious, as I've been a heavy EW user since 2006 and the service I've received has always been top notch.


Same here, great support experience with EastWest, every time I needed them to step in they were very helpful.


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## quantum7 (Jul 27, 2018)

I would love it if someone could compare the awesome SeventhHeaven with Spaces 2. I have found that I often like SeventhHeaven better than Altiverb.


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## NoamL (Jul 27, 2018)

Ruffian Price said:


> Hall photos are great, but they should display source location for the source-specific impulses. If you're mixing dry and wet signals from multiple tracks, you still have to pan them by ear/meter comparison with wet output.



What I found slightly confusing is if you're using the reverb on sends, the returns for wet signals of the farther-back microphone positions are much too loud compared to closer microphone positions. Of course Spaces has to do this because when it's in send mode it has no control over the amount of dry return, the dry signal isn't even hitting the bus Spaces is on. But it would be helpful if each setting had a note saying "Hey, you should lower the dry (& corresponding send) by this much compared to the sends that are going to the front/strings impulses." Or if they had a table of such values listed in the manual.

A good way to generate these values for yourself is to have one simple instrument like a piano, and send it to all the different impulses of one stage and figure out the proper levels by ear.


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## NoamL (Jul 27, 2018)

as an example here are some values for the Sacred Heart Church impulses:

Solo -0
Strings -2.5
Brass -7.5
Percussion -11.5
Choir -15?

meaning an instrument that you're moving from the Solo to the Choir stage position needs to decrease its dry level (& post-fader send to the reverb bus) by 15 dBFS.


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## Mystic (Jul 27, 2018)

Wolfie2112 said:


> How so? Not being sarcastic, I am just curious, as I've been a heavy EW user since 2006 and the service I've received has always been top notch. I agree the pricing is sometimes whacky. I was totally anti-cloud until I dove in during a promotional sale a year ago. I am totally digging it, even though I already own a lot of their stuff. But even for libs like Hollywood Choirs, Voices of the Empire, Spaces II, and HW solo instruments, CC has paid for itself in spades when I add up the costs of buying them separately.


Multiple times over the years I've needed support and they have either outright ignored my emails or came off as extremely arrogant and self-righteous. I was willing to deal with it because they already had my money and at least had some decent products which have been a major part of my templates and at that point, I wasn't really willing to change it up. I was extremely nice/courteous, professional and detailed in every communication as well which is why I was so shocked at the response (and lack of responses) I would get back.

I'm not even bothered by the price. I'm of the opinion that quality should come with a price tag.


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## Scrianinoff (Jul 27, 2018)

Lode_Runner said:


> Maybe they are, maybe they aren't, whatever the case this approach to marketing is a massive turn off for me.


+1 

I respect Nick Phoenix a lot. His remark just after the release of Spaces (I), that he found Altiverb sounding "Lo-Fi" not so much. 

That Spaces sounds less 'mushy' than Altiverb on many IRs has a very simple explanation, that mostly anyone could find out themselves reading the accompanying information coming with Spaces. 

The keyword to look for is 'ceiling fired'. Yes people, that's right, the speakers were firing their chirps at the _ceiling_. 

Why? Well Spaces was, I think, first and foremost designed to complement the Hollywood series, which have strong baked in early reflections of the EW room in which they were recorded. Meaning there is no need for strong early reflections from the floor and walls of the reverb halls, therefore the speakers were pointed, aimed, fired, at the _ceiling_. The lack of strong early reflections in those IRs give the impression of less 'mush' compared to IRs with early reflection from walls and ceilings

That's one of the many things I take into account when choosing a reverb. As the English say, 'horses for courses'. 

Further, instead of bluntly trying to EQ out the mush in a strong-ER IR, you could simply cut the start of the IR, and you have less "early-ER" in the resulting IR, i.e. cut the first reflections of the floor and walls, when these first reflections are already set in stone in the samples themselves.


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## Scrianinoff (Jul 27, 2018)

The concertgebouw IR in Altiverb is very very close to the real thing. I know, because I have been there hundreds of times. It's a magnificent IR to use, but again, horses for courses, and nobody in his right mind would use it for everything. It was not ceiling fired. It has first reflections, and does not sound mushy at all to my ears. Using it with Hollywood Strings and Brass close mics I still do cut out a but of the first reflections. How you do that I leave as an exercise to the reader.

The coloration is also the natural coloration of the halls, it's nice to have, I am glad they did not normalise it out. What surprised me is that they don't have an 'easy' option to neutralise the coloration. It's easily done of course with a reverse EQ solution, but a button would have been nice. Maybe their design philosophy was to advocate the coloration and not make it all too easy to neutralise it.


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## StatKsn (Jul 27, 2018)

Great post, Scrianinoff. I agree that cutting the sample head is a simple and very efficient way to "de-mush" IRs if you want a custom convo. I noticed a few technical things when comparing Altiverb/QL Spaces (I'll post details later as I don't want to affect the test's neutrality). As much as I like the one better, the opinion poll is already showing a 50:50 split, meaning that "X crushes Y"/"X is better than anything from Y" can't be objectively true regardless of whatever technical differences. However it'd be definitely helpful to know what the difference is, so that you can pick what you actually want for your needs.


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## leonardo (Jul 27, 2018)

Scrianinoff said:


> Why? Well Spaces was, I think, first and foremost designed to complement the Hollywood series, which have strong baked in early reflections of the EW room in which they were recorded. Meaning there is no need for strong early reflections from the floor and walls of the reverb halls, therefore the speakers were pointed, aimed, fired, at the _ceiling_. The lack of strong early reflections in those IRs give the impression of less 'mush' compared to IRs with early reflection from walls and ceilings



That's a very good explanation, I totally forgot about this although I now remember that I had read about this when Spaces 1 came out. However the thing is that in most cases "dry" signals already contain some ER's, not only in samples but especially in real recordings that have been done in a studio or even a concert hall, so I think it's actually good that the ER's in Spaces aren't that pronounced...

Concerning the violin recording in example 2 I think that the first rendering (which I believe is Altiverb) is not realistic; you wouldn't perceive a live violin like this under real circumstances and I really hope that listening to a solo violin performance in the Concertgebouw hall doesn't sound like that; the rather high amount of overtones and high frequencies in the direct violin signal makes me think that the violin is quite near to the listener yet the amount of ER's and tail that cover the direct signal nearly completely contradict that impression quite heavily. Also the second rendering has too much reverb in order to be really plausible but as it is clearer and not that much covered it feels a bit better.


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## Geoff Grace (Jul 27, 2018)

StatKsn said:


> the opinion poll is already showing a 50:50 split, meaning that "X crushes Y"/"X is better than anything from Y" can't be objectively true regardless of whatever technical differences.


Yes. As far as I'm concerned, the bottom line is that you don't need to trash Altiverb to make Spaces look good.

Sometimes, I wish I could save people from themselves.

Best,

Geoff


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## Michael Antrum (Jul 28, 2018)

If I had gone away for a long weekend, and come back to find I'd missed the 48 hour upgrade discount window, I'd be pretty upset.

Well, despite being a bit annoyed about the 48 hour thing, I've upgraded one of my two Spaces licences and first impressions are that its rather jolly good. I'm still in the early days of playing with it, but so far I'm liking it a lot.

Spaces I was one of those bits of software that just seemed to work without having to arse around with it for hours - which is why it always was the first reverb I tended to reach for. There aren't very many bits of software like that, and so far Spaces 2 seems to be the same.

Yummy.

Anyway, back to the hot topic, which one crushes the other, East West Spaces II or Microsoft Excel. This question needs to be answered !!!!


----------



## constaneum (Jul 28, 2018)

The new concert halls sound awesome. Loving them.


----------



## Sid Francis (Jul 28, 2018)

"Anyway, back to the hot topic, which one crushes the other, East West Spaces II or Microsoft Excel. This question needs to be answered !!!!"

 Yes, this has to be clarified now!


----------



## Quantum Leap (Jul 28, 2018)

Fair enough. I shouldn’t say anything negative about Altiverb. It’s just my personal opinion. 

It’s always been my thinking that you shouldn’t have to do any tweaks to an impulse. Find the right one, set the level and that’s it. Spaces has the predelay already set correctly. If you really want to hear the quality of an impulse, listen to it 100% wet and 0% dry. Then you can truly hear the sound of the Hall and perhaps even more so, the sound of the recording equipment and speakers that generate the impulse. A hall usually has a few slightly problematic frequencies and anything less than ideal in the recording process and pulse amplification can really maginify this. There are a few impulses in the old spaces that don’t pass this test very well. We left them in because some people would be upset if we deleted them. I’ve tried this 100% wet test on some impulses not in spaces and was not impressed with the sound and frequency balance. 

The instrument specific impulses in the halls and churches in Spaces 2 sound different to one another because of the location on stage and the way the sound was fired. So some of them like the strings and French horn presets will have more early reflections, but that doesn’t mean we fired the sound straight up. Sound was fired to emulate how the section fires its sound in real life. Impulses at the back of the stage will have more early reflections just because of their location. But it’s true that some samples or VIs might already have a lot or room sound so the basic presets, the solo presets or the wind presets in Spaces 2 might work better. Those have the least early reflections.


----------



## Sid Francis (Jul 28, 2018)

Thank you for telling a bit about it. I already noticed that the "Solo" impulses are very widely usable and are very unobtrusive. And yes: for the strings you want something that makes them breathe a bit more....


----------



## Michael Antrum (Jul 28, 2018)

Quantum Leap said:


> Fair enough. I shouldn’t say anything negative about Altiverb. It’s just my personal opinion.



Please ignore my quip about excel - it's a very British thing that you take the mickey out of those you like.

I've had a bit more time with Spaces II now, and the more I play around with it, the more I like it. It's always a worry when you update something with a new version, whether it be a car, or a piece of software. 

Will the new version be as well received as the last one ?

Well, I don't think EastWest will need to worry about that.


----------



## StatKsn (Jul 28, 2018)

StatKsn said:


> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/altiverb_vs_spaces-mp3.14550/][/AUDIOPLUS]
> 
> [AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/altiverb_vs_spaces_2-mp3.14551/][/AUDIOPLUS]



In the example the first pass was Altiverb and the second pass was Spaces 1.

Let me keep it simple! I personally liked Spaces' SoCal Hall IRs better than Altiverb Hall IRs for the orchestral mockup purpose. If Spaces 2 adds more of the same, I can totally see that Spaces 2 would be considerably better than Altiverb for this particular use.

With Spaces SoCal IRs, there are instrument/placement-specific IRs and you can technically speaking choose the stereo width from tight (FR) and wide (RR) which can result in a more defined and focused sound even as many orchestral sections get stacked. Altiverb's Hall IRs generally do sound "mushy", having to do with the strong tail attack and a wide stereo field in some impulses. You can adjust the attack knob which, from what I experience, is good enough for de-mushing but it doesn't have stereo options as clear cut as Spaces (there are stereo-in/mono-in).

You can still mimick what makes SoCal IRs so good by a few tricks. Obviously, however, there is a sonic cost and it takes some engineer's work. Spaces is carefree experience as you don't really need to fiddle with knobs even if you don't absolutely know what you want (I often get into analysis paralysis when there are too many knobs...)

If you are producing a hybrid track, that might not make much difference - any IR that sounds good in the track is good enough - but Spaces' design philosophy I believe is superior to competitions when creating an orchestral mockup. Spaces (and its hall IRs) is about a knob-free experience as possible while providing a pre-engineered real IRs in an orchestral setting. Altiverb provides a lot of real hall IRs but it still has a philosophy of you be the engineer as Altiverb IRs are served in vanilla compared to Spaces.


----------



## Ashermusic (Jul 28, 2018)

I said it before when I worked for EW and now that I don't I still will. The day I swapped out my Altiverb 7 instances for Spaces my mixes immediately sounded less muddy without doing a single thing.

And I really don't care if someone doesn't like my saying that. It was my experience.


----------



## Scrianinoff (Jul 28, 2018)

I just tested some of the presets in Spaces II and I am glad it has the same general 'character' as Spaces I, which I used continuously through the years, next to other great reverb tools, SW and HW. It is a great reverb tool to have _and_ _use_. Nick Phoenix always had a great ear for quality and sound(!) judgement in selecting the gear and tools to acquire this high quality, and Spaces II confirms this again. Many thanks Nick!


----------



## dzilizzi (Jul 28, 2018)

mikeybabes said:


> Spaces I was one of those bits of software that just seemed to work without having to arse around with it for hours - which is why it always was the first reverb I tended to reach for. There aren't very many bits of software like that, and so far Spaces 2 seems to be the same.
> 
> Yummy.
> 
> Anyway, back to the hot topic, which one crushes the other, East West Spaces II or Microsoft Excel. This question needs to be answered !!!!


The filters in Excel are much easier to use and the coloring options are wonderful, but the sound is still not quite as good as Spaces 1 or 2.


----------



## quantum7 (Jul 28, 2018)

I spent an hour or so going from Spaces I to Altiverb 7 this afternoon and find they sound pretty much the same quality and clarity to me. I certainly hear nothing "clearer" in Spaces over Altiverb and I have a professional acoustically treated studio with Focal Twins. I guess my 49 year-old ears may not be perfect, but according to my last ear exam, the supposedly work great. Years ago I stopped using Spaces I for Altiverb 7.....which was sooo much nicer to use than Spaces. Spaces is a fantastic reverb though, so I'm certainly not going to say anything bad about its sound.


----------



## Daniel James (Jul 28, 2018)

I remember giving the Spaces one demo a while back but never jumped in. I have Altiverb 7 but something about this has my attention. Really curious to hear some comparisons of similar rooms from those of you who have both!

-DJ


----------



## artinro (Jul 28, 2018)

Would be great to get at least some audio demos or maybe a walkthrough video before the (short) update period expires.


----------



## MarcelM (Jul 28, 2018)

Daniel James said:


> I remember giving the Spaces one demo a while back but never jumped in. I have Altiverb 7 but something about this has my attention. Really curious to hear some comparisons of similar rooms from those of you who have both!
> 
> -DJ



get it and make a twitch stream for us. easy


----------



## StatKsn (Jul 28, 2018)

Most of hall IRs in Spaces 1 aren't orchestral section positioned like SoCal Hall IRs and there are colorful/mushy IRs in Spaces too. Colorful doesn't mean it's lo-fi but can be an issue when you have so many orchestral sections with a verb as the tail gets stacked. You'll normally have to engineer the verb yourself with a technique like cutting the tail IR attack, altering the stereo width, etc if you want a defined sound.


----------



## Lode_Runner (Jul 28, 2018)

dzilizzi said:


> The filters in Excel are much easier to use and the coloring options are wonderful, but the sound is still not quite as good as Spaces 1 or 2.


I use Excel for the Cells, but prefer Spaces for the Halls


----------



## Daniel James (Jul 28, 2018)

Heroix said:


> get it and make a twitch stream for us. easy



Haha god dammit, I suppose I could get back on the composer cloud for that!

-DJ


----------



## Shad0wLandsUK (Jul 28, 2018)

I took the dive and got it. I do have the Composer Cloud Plus, but that puts the plugin on the slave (where all my EW libraries are hosted), which is not where i use my Reverbs :/

But so far I have to say the sound is beautiful
At very quiet levels playing HWS through it, I am finding the detail very good!

I also got Abbey Road Chambers and Plates today, so perhaps its the reverb intoxication talking, but I am very happy


----------



## Grilled Cheese (Jul 29, 2018)

Spaces is the only EW product I use these days, and it gets a lot of use. It’s usually my go to reverb. Spaces 2 has been a worthwhile upgrade. The new impulses are varied, interesting, usable and great sounding. 

2 opportunities for improvement:

1. When you load a preset, Spaces switches back to the home screen. I wish it would stay on the presets page so that I can easily switch from one preset to another. Always found this irritating in Spaces 1 and hoped it would have changed.

2. There’s no reason for the GUI to be as small as it is. Text is cramped. I’m using a 32 inch 4K monitor and prefer plugins that are squint proof.

Other than that, all good stuff.


----------



## s_bettinzana (Jul 29, 2018)

Shad0wLandsUK said:


> I do have the Composer Cloud Plus, but that puts the plugin on the slave (where all my EW libraries are hosted), which is not where i use my Reverbs :/


Hello,
can you elaborate more on this detail? I could be interested in EW CC, but from your words I understand that the CC is a monolithic license and Spaces2 license is embedded in the CC one. Is this how it works?


----------



## lokotus (Jul 30, 2018)

quantum7 said:


> I would love it if someone could compare the awesome SeventhHeaven with Spaces 2. I have found that I often like SeventhHeaven better than Altiverb.


never heard that much detail in concert hall impulses. Superb acoustics and capturing techniques. 
Really like Spaces 2 Someone asked about a bricasti comparison: Spaces 2 can achieve a realism that I can not seem to be able to reproduce with a bricasti (7heaven impulses). 7heaven can achieve things that melt in a special way (realistic spaces are not always desired) and are much more intuitive to tweak than in spaces. 
No winner - sorry to disappoint


----------



## MarcelM (Jul 30, 2018)

are the new IRs better sounding than so cal hall or is it kinda same quality?

hmmm 149 is quite alot for just a few IRs imho, but iam happy that its a good product. i will upgrade sooner or later aswell, but not for 149


----------



## N.Caffrey (Jul 30, 2018)

can't believe there's not even a walkthrough yet! even by an user


----------



## desert (Jul 31, 2018)

N.Caffrey said:


> can't believe there's not even a walkthrough yet! even by an user


Yeah im waiting. Nothing on YouTube


----------



## Ashermusic (Jul 31, 2018)

If I do one, what do you guys want me to do?


----------



## axb312 (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> If I do one, what do you guys want me to do?



- Instrument specific impulses and how they affect the sound (vs. a generic/ all in one IR).
- User interface and ease of use.
- CPU usage.
- Bass response.
- What you would like to see improved.
- Sound examples - different instruments, whole orchestra, whole orchestra from various library developers. 

Thank you in advance!


----------



## Ashermusic (Jul 31, 2018)

axb312 said:


> - Instrument specific impulses and how they affect the sound (vs. a generic/ all in one IR).
> - User interface and ease of use.
> - CPU usage.
> - Bass response.
> ...



Wow, you don't want much for free


----------



## OleJoergensen (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> If I do one, what do you guys want me to do?


That is a great offer Jay, thank you.
If you have time, maybe show what you find interesting with Spaces 2,
Or an example of Spaces 2 vs Spaces 1.


----------



## quantum7 (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> If I do one, what do you guys want me to do?


 Yes please! Whatever you choose to show will be more than most of us know currently anyway.


----------



## artinro (Jul 31, 2018)

quantum7 said:


> Yes please! Whatever you choose to show will be more than most of us know currently anyway.



I find it bizarre that a week later there's still not a single audio example or walkthrough of any kind. How is one supposed to make an informed purchasing decision? Jay is a gentleman to offer to do EW's work for them.


----------



## muziksculp (Jul 31, 2018)

Hi,

I purchased *Spaces II* as an upgrade. So far I'm very happy with the quality of the impulses, and variety it offers. and the easy to use interface.

It is also CPU friendly, so having multiple instances shouldn't be problem for a decent DAW system. I'm using it in Studio One Pro 4 (PC). I'm very satisfied, I was using mostly Algorithmic Reverbs, but I'm starting to use Spaces 2 quite a bit now.

I highly recommend it.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Audio Birdi (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> If I do one, what do you guys want me to do?



It still baffles me that EW haven't even got an overview video on what's included in Spaces II or audio demos. They can't boast over having an amazing new product that beats the competition, without audio or video proof of what it sounds like to potential buyers / upgraders.

If possible, could you please do a comparison between So. Cal. Hall's instrument / section impulses vs Abraneval Hall's instrument / section impulses.

To see how SPACES II's new IR's compare to SPACES I's original section / instrument-based IR's.

Thank you in advance for doing a video for us Jay!


----------



## Geoff Grace (Jul 31, 2018)

@Ashermusic, I'd like to know what you think are the most compelling reasons to upgrade, along with a few video examples of these reasons. Thanks, *Jay*!

Best,

Geoff


----------



## Ashermusic (Jul 31, 2018)

OK here it is, down and dirty. 

Pros: More venues; more true stereo instrument specific presets; presets that cover a range like French horn- trumpets, French horn-trombones; more controls, which I did not get into in my video. Maybe if I do a part two.

Cons: Personally, I prefer the old GUI, bigger, and more obvious how you access the filters and you see the specific frequencies you are filtering, unless I have just not figured out how to see that in Spaces 2.

No noticeable CPU difference., maybe a teensy bit less with Spaces 2 actually.


----------



## quantum7 (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> OK here it is, down and dirty.
> 
> Pros: More venues; more true stereo instrument specific presets; presets that cover a range like French horn- trumpets, French horn-trombones; more controls, which I did not get into in my video. Maybe if I do a part two.
> 
> ...




Thanks for taking the time to do this. I look forward to watching it in a little while.


----------



## MarcelM (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> OK here it is, down and dirty.
> 
> Pros: More venues; more true stereo instrument specific presets; presets that cover a range like French horn- trumpets, French horn-trombones; more controls, which I did not get into in my video. Maybe if I do a part two.
> 
> ...




thx from me too. iam gonna watch it now


----------



## Geoff Grace (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> OK here it is, down and dirty.
> 
> Pros: More venues; more true stereo instrument specific presets; presets that cover a range like French horn- trumpets, French horn-trombones; more controls, which I did not get into in my video. Maybe if I do a part two.
> 
> ...



Just watched it. My quick takeaway from your video is that it's a worthy upgrade with a higher quantity of high-end sounds. I too prefer the size of the old interface, but I overall like the look of the new better.

I don't feel a rush to upgrade though, because I already have a wealth of great reverb plugins (including Spaces 1); but I'm confident I will upgrade eventually.

Thanks again for taking the time to do this, *Jay*!

Best,

Geoff


----------



## quantum7 (Jul 31, 2018)

I don't understand what possessed EW to make the Spaces II GUI smaller. I am so sick of having to put my "middle-aged man" glasses on for all these small GUI's. :(


----------



## SoNowWhat? (Jul 31, 2018)

Thank you Jay. 
FWIW, to my ears II sounds wider or maybe a more defined sense of depth and space. It sounds really good.
Will be on my list but I don't need it right now.


----------



## MPortmann (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> OK here it is, down and dirty.
> 
> Pros: More venues; more true stereo instrument specific presets; presets that cover a range like French horn- trumpets, French horn-trombones; more controls, which I did not get into in my video. Maybe if I do a part two.
> 
> ...




Thank you


----------



## CGR (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> OK here it is, down and dirty.
> 
> Pros: More venues; more true stereo instrument specific presets; presets that cover a range like French horn- trumpets, French horn-trombones; more controls, which I did not get into in my video. Maybe if I do a part two.
> 
> ...



Thank you Jay - very helpful.


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## artinro (Jul 31, 2018)

Jay, you're a gentleman. Thank you for putting this together. Very useful.


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## Ashermusic (Jul 31, 2018)

Glad you all found it helpful. I do think it is a worthy update.


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## dzilizzi (Jul 31, 2018)

Thanks Jay. That Abravanal Hall sounds really good. And I am listening on my phone.


----------



## Raphioli (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> OK here it is, down and dirty.
> 
> Pros: More venues; more true stereo instrument specific presets; presets that cover a range like French horn- trumpets, French horn-trombones; more controls, which I did not get into in my video. Maybe if I do a part two.
> 
> ...




Thanks Jay


----------



## SoNowWhat? (Jul 31, 2018)

dzilizzi said:


> Thanks Jay. That Abravanal Hall sounds really good. And I am listening on my phone.


I really liked the Davies Hall at the end. They all sounded good though.


----------



## constaneum (Jul 31, 2018)

basically all the new halls sound awesome


----------



## TheKRock (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> OK here it is, down and dirty.
> 
> Pros: More venues; more true stereo instrument specific presets; presets that cover a range like French horn- trumpets, French horn-trombones; more controls, which I did not get into in my video. Maybe if I do a part two.
> 
> ...



Thanks mate!!


----------



## gsilbers (Jul 31, 2018)

quantum7 said:


> http://www.soundsonline.com/spaces-...tter&utm_campaign=spaces-ii-gen-now-available
> 
> I used to use Spaces all the time, but over the years have gravitated to other choices such as Altiverb 7 and SeventhHeaven for my convolution reverb needs. Spaces II looks intriguing though, but for $149 (the upgrade price) I'm not quite sure it is worth it now. Opinions welcome.





6 pages of comments! i might be late for this party but convolution reverbs is all about the IRs. If they added all new IR and those account equal or similar amount of well recorded IR than the first version then the price would be actually very good. 

So the name spaces 2 is decieving but not in regard to the software part. There is a facelist and some new features but the real value is in those IR. Just imaging all of those composers who bought a $400+ altiverb plugin when it came out and only... and still use... that Todd AO IR. 
The point is that for software upgrades we tend to want a lot but for convolution i think thats not the case since the IR is the most important part of a convolution software. 

Also, its no secret this plugin will eventaully go down in price. really down in price.


----------



## Sid Francis (Jul 31, 2018)

Thank you Jay, that was very nice and generous to offer this. Spaces II seems to sound much more wet with the same settings, I noticed it in Abravanel Hall. But one could immediately hear what I meant with the sense of depth that this Hall gives to the strings. Just put down the wet signal about 3-4 db


----------



## hdsmile (Jul 31, 2018)

Thanks Jay, for sure it is a worthy update, the Spaces still the world's leading reverb specially for creating a true, classical orchestra sound.


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> OK here it is, down and dirty.
> 
> Pros: More venues; more true stereo instrument specific presets; presets that cover a range like French horn- trumpets, French horn-trombones; more controls, which I did not get into in my video. Maybe if I do a part two.
> 
> ...




Listening to the Fr Hn example, the second hall is much thicker, rounder, and less metallic at the tail (which may be what Mr. QL was saying about halls having problem freqs). No comparison - but of course they're different impulses.

Will listen to the rest at an opportune juncture window timeframe.


----------



## Giscard Rasquin (Jul 31, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> OK here it is, down and dirty.
> 
> Pros: More venues; more true stereo instrument specific presets; presets that cover a range like French horn- trumpets, French horn-trombones; more controls, which I did not get into in my video. Maybe if I do a part two.
> 
> ...




Thanks Jay! Much appreciated
Regarding the reverb mix, I can see you leave the dry signal at 100% within Spaces on a send bus. I thought FX on a send bus always should be 100% wet so was wondering why you do that!


----------



## OleJoergensen (Aug 1, 2018)

Thank you Jay for taking the time. I think they both sounds good . Im also curious about the dry signal on the bus being 100 %......?


----------



## zolhof (Aug 1, 2018)

Hey guys, just a heads up:







Until this moment, the "proceed to checkout" button does nothing, but we should expect a working trial soon. 

Kudos to EastWest for listening.


----------



## N.Caffrey (Aug 1, 2018)

zolhof said:


> Hey guys, just a heads up:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thank you for telling us, I'm downloading now!


----------



## zolhof (Aug 1, 2018)

N.Caffrey said:


> Thank you for telling us, I'm downloading now!



Awesome! It is now working for me too. 10-day trial, just like the original Spaces.


----------



## ChristianM (Aug 1, 2018)

Mr EastWest, can I have gratis upgrade ? 

Thanks for trial version, I test it here


----------



## desert (Aug 1, 2018)

N.Caffrey said:


> Thank you for telling us, I'm downloading now!


Downloaded. Installed. Activated... anddd Logic can't seem to find the plugin. wtf


----------



## Akarin (Aug 1, 2018)

desert said:


> Downloaded. Installed. Activated... anddd Logic can't seem to find the plugin. wtf



Did you reboot?


----------



## ChristianM (Aug 1, 2018)

the name is EW Space and not QL Space for this version


----------



## N.Caffrey (Aug 1, 2018)

desert said:


> Downloaded. Installed. Activated... anddd Logic can't seem to find the plugin. wtf


You need to close Logic and reopen it.

A question, how do you treat the dry and wet knob? In Spaces 1 I keep the dry one always on 0, while here starts at 100%. While regarding the wet knob, when you load a preset is never 100%, is that the best and preferred way or you guys put it 100% wet? I usually keep it where it is when I load the preset.


----------



## desert (Aug 1, 2018)

Akarin said:


> Did you reboot?


reboot the computer? no. I rebooted logic a few times.
I'll try rebooting computer


----------



## JohnG (Aug 1, 2018)

N.Caffrey said:


> A question, how do you treat the dry and wet knob? In Spaces 1 I keep the dry one always on 0, while here starts at 100%. While regarding the wet knob, when you load a preset is never 100%, is that the best and preferred way or you guys put it 100% wet? I usually keep it where it is when I load the preset.



I’m not sure I remember the details, maybe in Preferences? But there was a way in the original Spaces to set the default at 0% dry and 100% wet.


----------



## MarcelM (Aug 1, 2018)

proceed to checkout doesnt work for me sadly for the trial. does it for anyone else?

edit: weird. tried with firefox now and it worked. maybe it was bcos of chrome or the fact that i logged in before i put it into my cart.

whatever, will try it now


----------



## Giscard Rasquin (Aug 1, 2018)

JohnG said:


> I’m not sure I remember the details, maybe in Preferences? But there was a way in the original Spaces to set the default at 0% dry and 100% wet.



Yes, in preferences you can choose to have it as a send effect by default


----------



## Jeremy Spencer (Aug 1, 2018)

N.Caffrey said:


> You need to close Logic and reopen it.
> 
> A question, how do you treat the dry and wet knob? In Spaces 1 I keep the dry one always on 0, while here starts at 100%. While regarding the wet knob, when you load a preset is never 100%, is that the best and preferred way or you guys put it 100% wet? I usually keep it where it is when I load the preset.



I personally leave it where it is, if I go 100% it's way too wet for my liking.


----------



## N.Caffrey (Aug 1, 2018)

Wolfie2112 said:


> I personally leave it where it is, if I go 100% it's way too wet for my liking.


Same here


----------



## JohnG (Aug 1, 2018)

Well, I assumed you were talking about using it as a "send" effect. If it's an insert, that's another matter.


----------



## Ashermusic (Aug 1, 2018)

JohnG said:


> I’m not sure I remember the details, maybe in Preferences? But there was a way in the original Spaces to set the default at 0% dry and 100% wet.



That would be in Settings:


----------



## NoamL (Aug 1, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> OK here it is, down and dirty.
> 
> Pros: More venues; more true stereo instrument specific presets; presets that cover a range like French horn- trumpets, French horn-trombones; more controls, which I did not get into in my video. Maybe if I do a part two.
> 
> ...




Great review Jay & comparison with Spaces 1!



Nick Batzdorf said:


> Listening to the Fr Hn example, the second hall is much thicker, rounder, and less metallic at the tail (which may be what Mr. QL was saying about halls having problem freqs). No comparison - but of course they're different impulses.
> 
> Will listen to the rest at an opportune juncture window timeframe.



The Reynolds Hall sounds magnificent... I was playing around with the other more famous spaces and Jay's review made me go back and check it out. Guess there's a reason it loads as the standard preset!! IMO if you want to get that super spacious 2SFH sound, this is pretty close. So Cal Hall was great too but it always felt like a recognizable "actual space." Reynolds lends more of a "larger than life" feeling. Sort of like there's less walls?

Sacred Heart is really good too, there's a huge depth between the front of stage impulse and the choir in the back.



N.Caffrey said:


> A question, how do you treat the dry and wet knob? In Spaces 1 I keep the dry one always on 0, while here starts at 100%. While regarding the wet knob, when you load a preset is never 100%, is that the best and preferred way or you guys put it 100% wet? I usually keep it where it is when I load the preset.



I always put Spaces on a bus. Check "use as send" under preferences so it only outputs the proper wet level (which is not always 100%). Then send 0dB to the bus. For extra dry libraries I send +2 postfader, and lower the track fader -2, just so the sound is enveloped by the reverb a little more.



GuitarG said:


> Regarding the reverb mix, I can see you leave the dry signal at 100% within Spaces on a send bus. I thought FX on a send bus always should be 100% wet so was wondering why you do that!



Also the dry signal was hitting both buses at all times... even when one of the plugins was bypassed the dry signal still flowed thru its bus to stereo out 

Unless I misunderstand and there's a way to make it that a bus in Logic is inactive when all plugins on it are inactive? That would be really useful TBH!


----------



## JT (Aug 2, 2018)

Regarding the presets, it looks like it's comprised of mostly large spaces. Are there any small venues, like a jazz club? Something intimate.


----------



## good (Aug 2, 2018)

I'm thinking about buying Altiverb or Spaces II as a reverb for the *piano*.

Which one is better?


----------



## keepitsimple (Aug 2, 2018)

good said:


> I'm thinking about buying Altiverb or Spaces II as a reverb for the *piano*.
> 
> Which one is better?


I think spaces ii sounds stunning on piano. It made me reopen piano based daw sessions i haven't opened in years just so i can smack that Hamburg Cathedral IR on the piano track.

I also noticed that it doesn't color/warm/coat the sound like other reverbs tend to do (even to a slight degree), if anything, it actually makes the piano clearer and more vivid.


----------



## Michael Antrum (Aug 2, 2018)

My main piano sound is Ivory II American Concert D with Spaces on the Culver stage.

Beautiful. I haven’t tried Altiverb, as after I got Spaces, I never felt the need to look elsewhere.

Can’t recommend it enough for piano.


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## good (Aug 2, 2018)

keepitsimple said:


> I think spaces ii sounds stunning on piano. It made me reopen piano based daw sessions i haven't opened in years just so i can smack that Hamburg Cathedral IR on the piano track.
> 
> I also noticed that it doesn't color/warm/coat the sound like other reverbs tends to do (even to a slight degree), if anything, it actually tends to make the piano clearer and more vivid.





mikeybabes said:


> My main piano sound is Ivory II American Concert D with Spaces on the Culver stage.
> 
> Beautiful. I haven’t tried Altiverb, as after I got Spaces, I never felt the need to look elsewhere.
> 
> Can’t recommend it enough for piano.



Thanks for the replies!

I tried the trial version and it certainly gave me an uncoated natural reverb.
But it is so expensive to me. I'm waiting for its sale.


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## desert (Aug 3, 2018)

good said:


> Thanks for the replies!
> 
> I tried the trial version and it certainly gave me an uncoated natural reverb.
> But it is so expensive to me. I'm waiting for its sale.


It is on sale...


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## good (Aug 3, 2018)

desert said:


> It is on sale...


another sale...
I meant it is still expensive to me


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## desert (Aug 3, 2018)

good said:


> another sale...
> I think it is still expensive to me...


Ah you want the “we can’t sell this anymore sale”... yeah, you’re going to wait awhile


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## N.Caffrey (Aug 3, 2018)

I wonder why they decided not to record specific impulses for woodwinds.


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## Quantum Leap (Aug 3, 2018)

Thanks for all the comments. I think they finished the update to fix those few small issues. There are tons of woodwind reverbs in spaces 2. They are all in the stereo folders. Not in the true stereo folders. Because winds are center stage, you only need a stereo impulse. True stereo is for sounds or sections that spread across the entire stage.


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## N.Caffrey (Aug 3, 2018)

Quantum Leap said:


> Thanks for all the comments. I think they finished the update to fix those few small issues. There are tons of woodwind reverbs in spaces 2. They are all in the stereo folders. Not in the true stereo folders. Because winds are center stage, you only need a stereo impulse. True stereo is for sounds or sections that spread across the entire stage.



thank you for clarifying!


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## lpuser (Aug 3, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> Cons: Personally, I prefer the old GUI, bigger, and more obvious how you access the filters and you see the specific frequencies you are filtering, unless I have just not figured out how to see that in Spaces 2.



Thank you so much Jay, fantastic video! And yes, I prefer the old GUI too - and my first though was: Why make it so small ... hmmm..


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## MarcelM (Aug 3, 2018)

after playing with it for a while, what can i say? it really sounds bloody fantastic.
is it just my imagination or do even sound the old IRs from spaces one sound a little bit better in spaces 2? not sure if they have the same preset settings anyway, since i cant read anything which is very bad but will be fixed.

will i upgrade? honestly, not sure. i think 149 is a bit much for the upgrade and while it really sounds outstanding i have quite a few other reverb options, so i may wait for black friday or something to get it.


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## desert (Aug 3, 2018)

I bought it. It’s a great upgrade! I didn’t agree with the price but I’m definitely not regretting it. Well worth the investment


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## Sid Francis (Aug 3, 2018)

Thank you for the illumination, Nick. I never looked in the stereo folder because I thought of true stereo as being more elaborate and "better". Perhaps new gems to find, because I have not yet found a concert hall response for my loud lead woods, english horn and oboe.


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## quantum7 (Aug 6, 2018)

OK, I tested the demo for Spaces II...and sadly for my wallet, I like it. D'oh!  Does anyone know how much long the upgrade from Spaces I to II price will be available for?


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## Sid Francis (Aug 6, 2018)

na na na na naaaaa na.... oops...sorry Sean 

No, really congrats for the purchase. And as Nick said: don´t forget to look into the M-S folders. Lots of different sounding impulses in there too...


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## jonathanwright (Aug 7, 2018)

quantum7 said:


> OK, I tested the demo for Spaces II...and sadly for my wallet, I like it. D'oh!  Does anyone know how much long the upgrade from Spaces I to II price will be available for?



I had an email through today saying 'until August 31st'.


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## ChristianM (Aug 7, 2018)

I have tried Space 2 but, for me, it's too expensive for a little update


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## good (Aug 7, 2018)

I have Altiverb and have never used Spaces I.
Will be Spaces II worth $290 as a piano player? (not upgrade)

I know the upgrade price is expensive for most people, but as a first-time buyer, I'm wondering if $290 is reasonable or I should be satisfied with Altiverb.


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## keepitsimple (Aug 7, 2018)

good said:


> I have Altiverb and have never used Spaces I.
> Will be Spaces II worth $290 as a piano player? (not upgrade)
> 
> I know the upgrade price is expensive for most people, but as a first-time buyer, I'm wondering if $290 is reasonable or I should be satisfied with Altiverb.


I’m on Composer cloud so I can’t tell you if 290$ is reasonable or not, but i will say that spaces ii is the only thing I use on my piano now.


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## s_bettinzana (Aug 7, 2018)

keepitsimple said:


> I’m on Composer cloud so I can’t tell you if 290$ is reasonable or not, but i will say that spaces ii is the only thing I use on my piano now.


What are your preferred presets for the piano?


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## keepitsimple (Aug 7, 2018)

s_bettinzana said:


> What are your preferred presets for the piano?


Instrument specific---> Piano Large Venue-----> Hamburg Cathedral B TS RR 4.0 Piano, with the wet fader around 10:00. That's my most used so far.


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## jneebz (Aug 7, 2018)

good said:


> I have Altiverb and have never used Spaces I.
> Will be Spaces II worth $290 as a piano player? (not upgrade)
> 
> I know the upgrade price is expensive for most people, but as a first-time buyer, I'm wondering if $290 is reasonable or I should be satisfied with Altiverb.


Download the trial?


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## jneebz (Aug 7, 2018)

good said:


> I'm wondering if $290 is reasonable or I should be satisfied with Altiverb.


Personally, I wouldn't depend on the forum to confirm YOUR satisfaction.


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## Geoff Grace (Aug 7, 2018)

jneebz said:


> Personally, I wouldn't depend on the forum to confirm YOUR satisfaction.


Yes. Why not download the trial version and see for yourself? (Click on the "Buy Now" link and select "Trial Version" from the drop down menu.)

Best,

Geoff


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## good (Aug 7, 2018)

Geoff Grace said:


> Yes. Why not download the trial version and see for yourself? (Click on the "Buy Now" link and select "Trial Version" from the drop down menu.)
> 
> Best,
> 
> Geoff



Yes, I'll try the trial version.
I was just wondering if people who think upgrading is expensive think that the price of the first purchase, not the upgrade price, is also expensive.
Thank you for teaching me how to download!


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## muziksculp (Aug 7, 2018)

I'm happy to report that* EW-Spaces II* has become my Goto Convolution Reverb for Orchestral Work. 

It offers lots of Great Sounding Spaces, very clear, and three-dimensional. I'm really glad I purchased the upgrade from Spaces I. 

For those who are still debating about upgrading ... Just Do it, you will be


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## muziksculp (Aug 7, 2018)

I'm loving the acoustics of the *NY String Hall *EW-Spaces II for Orchestral Work :


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## OLB (Aug 8, 2018)

This quick demo of @Ashermusic sounds fantastic, thank you. I'm trying to download the demo but for some reason it doesn't give me the option to download the plugin. The demo period is activated on my iLok account and I have the latest eastwest installation center. Tried in OSX 10.11.6 and 10.13.6, also refreshed product list and signed out and in again. It should give me a download button right?

Anybody able to help me? Thanks!


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## quantum7 (Aug 8, 2018)

OLB said:


> This quick demo of @Ashermusic sounds fantastic, thank you. I'm trying to download the demo but for some reason it doesn't give me the option to download the plugin. The demo period is activated on my iLok account and I have the latest eastwest installation center. Tried in OSX 10.11.6 and 10.13.6, also refreshed product list and signed out and in again. It should give me a download button right?
> 
> Anybody able to help me? Thanks!



You need to download the EW installer software to install anything EW.


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## OLB (Aug 8, 2018)

quantum7 said:


> You need to download the EW installer software to install anything EW.



Thank you quantum7.

Can’t wait to try this reverb. Looking forward to hear some favourites of people.

EDIT: support quickly helped me, you have to install the Play software in order to download anything from the Installation Center.


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## Sid Francis (Aug 9, 2018)

I want to hint the fresh owners again at Abravanel Hall, S-S - Violins and Celli I exchanged my actual concert hall "San Francisco Hall" to this new impulse response in several string heavy tunes and the effect is still very very satisfying.


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## Silence-is-Golden (Aug 10, 2018)

Since the "old" spaces is now available for roughly $110 at JRR shop, does it also contain section specific IR's like mentioned in Spaces 2?
So f.e. strings, brass, woods, and percussion specific IR's are available in various settings / hall's in Spaces 1?


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## pmcrockett (Aug 10, 2018)

Silence-is-Golden said:


> Since the "old" spaces is now available for roughly $110 at JRR shop, does it also contain section specific IR's like mentioned in Spaces 2?
> So f.e. strings, brass, woods, and percussion specific IR's are available in various settings / hall's in Spaces 1?


Only the So Cal hall in Spaces I is like that.


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## Silence-is-Golden (Aug 10, 2018)

pmcrockett said:


> Only the So Cal hall in Spaces I is like that.


Thanks crockett

And that is one of the better and/or much used halls for orchestral works isn’t it?


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## pmcrockett (Aug 10, 2018)

Silence-is-Golden said:


> Thanks crockett
> 
> And that is one of the better and/or much used halls for orchestral works isn’t it?


The tail on So Cal decays a little quickly for my own taste, but people in general seem to agree that it's very good.


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## MaxOctane (Aug 10, 2018)

Qualitatively, how much better is this than stock IR reverb like Logic's Space Designer? For a non-professional who still enjoys awesome sound quality, is the difference noticeable?


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## JohnG (Aug 10, 2018)

MaxOctane said:


> Qualitatively, how much better is this than stock IR reverb like Logic's Space Designer? For a non-professional who still enjoys awesome sound quality, is the difference noticeable?



I think the importance of reverb cannot really be exaggerated, if you are trying to create a feeling of space and scale. So that's a roundabout way of saying that, whether you make a lot of money or not at music the main reason to pursue it is for the beauty and joy of it.

Therefore, money doesn't really matter. Scary concept!

Practically speaking though, why not download the demo and decide for yourself?


----------



## MaxOctane (Aug 10, 2018)

JohnG said:


> Practically speaking though, why not download the demo and decide for yourself?



Because I'm an idiot who forgot there was a demo, and forgot I installed it already.


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## JohnG (Aug 10, 2018)

MaxOctane said:


> Because I'm an idiot who forgot there was a demo, and forgot I installed it already.



lol


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## Silence-is-Golden (Aug 11, 2018)

and those who use the combo: CSS, LASS, L&S Chamber strings work well with Spaces? (especially the So Cal hall section IR's with the respective sections?)


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## jononotbono (Aug 11, 2018)

I reckon I’ll upgrade to it eventually but after getting Altiverb 7, I’m not really lusting for another convo Reverb at this point.


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## NoamL (Aug 11, 2018)

Silence-is-Golden said:


> and those who use the combo: CSS, LASS, L&S Chamber strings work well with Spaces? (especially the So Cal hall section IR's with the respective sections?)



So Cal Hall is a classic and definitely works. 

Out of all of the impulses, I think *St. Dominic's* is a real gem. Not all of the impulses are true stereo. But the sound is fantastic. It's dark, and dramatic and beautiful, but it doesn't sound "churchy," you know, like a big stone cave.

Big brass sounds INCREDIBLE in this church. I'll go out on a blasphemous limb and say I like this church better than AIR for brass. I was A/Bing against some reference tracks (mostly 2 Steps From Hell and Audiomachine) and I think St Dominic's will become my go to master verb for that kind of epic music, replacing the Bricasti emulation (for LogicX Space Designer) that I was using before. 

The similar sized church St. Patrick's also sounds good, but it is a bit more echo-y and cave-y in sound. Probably good for dark or emotional strings. 

The plugin doesn't contain hundreds of spaces, but the upside is that each space is actually pretty distinct and well-chosen. It's not just total verb length, but the geometry of the space, the harshness or mellowness of the walls, and the exact placement of the impulse response on stage... in the end I don't feel that there's too little to choose from.


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## dcoscina (Aug 11, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> Glad you all found it helpful. I do think it is a worthy update.


Sounds gorgeous to my ears.


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## Silence-is-Golden (Aug 12, 2018)

NoamL said:


> So Cal Hall is a classic and definitely works.
> 
> Out of all of the impulses, I think *St. Dominic's* is a real gem. Not all of the impulses are true stereo. But the sound is fantastic. It's dark, and dramatic and beautiful, but it doesn't sound "churchy," you know, like a big stone cave.
> 
> ...


Thanks for your post Noaml. Good to read your views on it.

Now I only need a conversation with my budget holder..........me.


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## LHall (Aug 16, 2018)

Is anyone having latency problems when using Spaces II as an insert? I put it on a drum and the latency is HUGE.


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## MarcusD (Aug 16, 2018)

Some of the impulses are really incredible. My favourites are from the Church folder. Most notably Angels Cathedral & St. Dominic's, (some one else mentioned it St. D's, it is beautiful!) literally spent about hour getting lost in reverb-land.


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## LHall (Aug 16, 2018)

The good folks at EW just confirmed the bug I reported above and are working on a fix. Great news!


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## constaneum (Aug 16, 2018)

LHall said:


> Is anyone having latency problems when using Spaces II as an insert? I put it on a drum and the latency is HUGE.



yup. I've noticed that as well....


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## quantum7 (Aug 16, 2018)

LHall said:


> Is anyone having latency problems when using Spaces II as an insert? I put it on a drum and the latency is HUGE.


I've learned over the years that some reverbs just stink as inserts. I always use sends even with a project with only one track.


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## Ashermusic (Aug 17, 2018)

Happens even if “use as a send effect by default” is unchecked?


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## Ashermusic (Aug 17, 2018)

Dead on with the click here.

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/latency-test-mp3.14934/][/AUDIOPLUS]


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## LHall (Aug 17, 2018)

Michael at EW confirmed the bug and they’re working on a fix


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## Ashermusic (Aug 17, 2018)

LHall said:


> Michael at EW confirmed the bug and they’re working on a fix



Then the bug is only with that setting checked because as you can hear in my example there is no playback latent with it unchecked.


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## emasters (Aug 17, 2018)

Posted by EW Admin on their own forum...

"If you are using Spaces as an insert effect please make sure that the check box in settings 
is unchecked (Use as a send effect by default) If it is set as a send return the dry control in Spaces will be at zero and the whole instrument and effect will be delayed by the amount of predelay"


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## Ashermusic (Aug 17, 2018)

So it isn’t a bug, just the way it works.

I rarely use a reverb as an insert, other than the occasional gated verb on a snare, so it’s a non-issue for me.


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## chocobitz825 (Aug 18, 2018)

i have both EW spaces II and altiverb 7. they're both great. i think altiverb has so many more room options that can come in handy, but when set to 100% mix it can sometimes sound mushy. this can be great when trying to make a lesser library, or under programmed sequence sound more realistic. I've found cutting back the mix and room size option in altiverb to as low as 40%~60% gives the same kind of clarity and warmth that Spaces II has by default. Spaces II default settings sound great with a very good balance of dry and wet for its rooms that make it great for strings, drums and guitars. given the price difference, spaces is a good buy compared to many other similar products.


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## keepitsimple (Aug 18, 2018)

Spaces ii is the only reverb I’ve used so far where I don’t have to touch the wet knob when I put it as insert. That’s how transparent it is. Yes I know most of the “Insert” presets are not 100% wet, but use another reverb side by side with the same wet settings and you’ll be forced to dial back the wet knob on that other reverb. Not the case with Spaces ii.


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## LHall (Aug 18, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> Then the bug is only with that setting checked because as you can hear in my example there is no playback latent with it unchecked.



I tried it both checked and unchecked. Also turned the pre-delay all the way down. The result was the same. Works fine as a send, but as an insert this is what happens for me. Glad not everyone is having the problem. I sent my Logic session to Michael so they could see exactly what I was doing and they confirmed a problem. That's all I know.


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## Ashermusic (Aug 18, 2018)

LHall said:


> I tried it both checked and unchecked. Also turned the pre-delay all the way down. The result was the same. Works fine as a send, but as an insert this is what happens for me. Glad not everyone is having the problem. I sent my Logic session to Michael so they could see exactly what I was doing and they confirmed a problem. That's all I know.



I guess I have either a magical rig or magical Logic installation


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## MarcelM (Aug 18, 2018)

Ashermusic said:


> I guess I have either a magical rig or magical Logic installation



sorry to disapoint, but i didnt have any problems when i tried the demo


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## LHall (Aug 18, 2018)

I'm so glad for everyone for whom it's working great. Perhaps I'm imagining it.


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## MarcelM (Aug 18, 2018)

LHall said:


> I'm so glad for everyone for whom it's working great. Perhaps I'm imagining it.



pretty sure you dont, and as you said EW noticed its a bug and will fix it.

things like this happen in the vst world. some people have problems with something while others have not.

in the end you will enjoy spaces 2


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## Geoff Grace (Aug 18, 2018)

Certainly, there are bugs that are active in some systems and not in others.

Best,

Geoff


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## NoamL (Aug 19, 2018)

Bumping to ask a question - does anyone have wisdom/advice on using these impulses with multiple stems?

I'm using Spaces to mix the first track in my new trailer template, and I have 7 stems for the strings:

Spot
Close
Tree
Hall
Far
Wide
Rear
So far I'm just sending everything to St Dominic String/Wind FR. But I wonder if it's a smarter idea to send the close stems to String FR and the others to String RR or even further back?

EDIT: also, the *Angels Cathedral* impulses are fantastic. They replaced Hamburg Cathedral in my workflow. Same general principle, just send a little bit to the Cathedral impulse.


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## procreative (Aug 19, 2018)

I am wondering if anyone has thoughts about using Stereo vs True Stereo presets?

In my example I am using Spaces on just the Room Mics of the Hollywood Series.

Will using a non True Stereo preset bugger the natural placement of the instrument? For example if an instrument is seated over to the right, will using a non True Stereo preset place an unnatural tail that moves it over?

Its just that there are more instrument family options available for Stereo than for True Stereo (which only seem to have one for an instrument family rather than breaking them down into groupings).


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## Quantum Leap (Aug 19, 2018)

Many of the instrument specific impulses are in the stereo folders, not in the true stereo folders. So if you are looking for a reverb for French horns, look in the stereo folder of each Hall. If you need a trumpet reverb, same thing. Both those impulses will be really nice sounding stereo reverbs specifically made for those instruments and their position on stage. If you listen carefully at 100% wet, you will notice a stereo impulse that was recorded with its source on the left side of the stage like violins, will appear in the left speaker before the right, so the right signal will be delayed slightly. This is because the source on stage is physically closer to the left mics in the Hall.

If you load the true stereo brass preset, you are essentially getting both of those stereo impulses setup together where the left input goes to the stereo French horn impulse and the right input goes to the stereo trumpet impulse. So what happens is the French horns being a stereo recording, will not only send to the French horn impulse, but will also input somewhat into the trumpet impulse and vice versa. This is just as in real life. So true stereo presets are a realistic and efficient way to get a general brass reverb, or strings etc.... but with some real spatial information that goes beyond algorithmic reverb. 

If you want to get really tweaky, using the correct instrument specific stereo reverb for each section in the orchestra will sound different than using the true stereo general presets. This is because the bleed factor is gone. A stereo reverb only has mono input. So when you send a stereo French horn sample to a stereo horn reverb, the stereo horn signal is summed to mono before it enters the processor. The impulse turns that mono signal back into a stereo signal based on the stereo recording in the Hall. True stereo does the same thing but it does it for both sides, essentially turning 2 summed mono recordings into a 4 channel output. Or 2 stereo signals on top of one another. 

True stereo is an interesting concept.


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## Consona (Aug 20, 2018)

I use Stereo + True stereo all the time (Not only with Spaces). Stereo travels with the instrument's panning, so it will make an instrument sound more wet but without sending the signal to the other side of the left/right spectrum, then the True does exactly that, it takes the instrument + Stereo signal and spread it over the stage.

When you listen to some Star Wars prequels music were there are percussion very left and right, you hear them being in the room but without the reverb being all over the stage, so it's more Stereo than True stereo reverb sound.


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## procreative (Aug 20, 2018)

I still dont think I totally get it!

If you have a Mic position that reflects the seating in the "hall" for example Cellos are over to the right a bit. If you send that to a Stereo preset, then all of the signal containing its spacial setting will get summed to mono before going into a Stereo reverb that has spacial positioning.

So is what comes out an approximation of what went in?

One has the depth of how far back the instrument was in the hall but not the left/right positioning and the other has no depth accounted for but the reverb processes the original stereo image as is?

I think I am a bit frustrated as I think I was hoping Spaces II had more Instrument Specific True Stereo presets...

Its the concept of trying to achieve "realism" vs the options available vs original seating placement.


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## jamwerks (Aug 20, 2018)

procreative said:


> I still dont think I totally get it!


Me either...


----------



## Noiseguild (Aug 20, 2018)

procreative said:


> I still dont think I totally get it!
> 
> If you have a Mic position that reflects the seating in the "hall" for example Cellos are over to the right a bit. If you send that to a Stereo preset, then all of the signal containing its spacial setting will get summed to mono before going into a Stereo reverb that has spacial positioning.



Yes, and the position on stage of your instrument is totally neglected in the reverb.
It's sort of a well kept secret that true stereo is vital for IR reverbs like Spaces and Altiverb. And it's a pity that Kontakt, for instance, doesn't allow for true stereo IR reverb.

In a good concert hall, like the concertgebouw here in Amsterdam for instance, the lateral (side) reflections are very strong and defining for the quality of the reverb. Imagine your instrument on the right side of the stage, the lateral early reflections from the right arrive much earlier than the ones from the left. You can clearly observe that in recordings. That is lost with normal stereo reverb.


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## Quantum Leap (Aug 21, 2018)

Most reverbs are stereo in name, but they actually sum the input into mono and create a new stereo signal from that mono signal. So if you have a stereo recording of celli and send it to a stereo reverb, you are losing a bunch of spatial information. However, you are still hearing all stereo info in the dry signal, so it’s not lost, but rather it’s lost in the wet signal. The wet signal creates a new stereo field generated by the algorithm or impulse. This sounds just fine or even fantastic when combined with the dry. 

But yes, the true stereo presets solve this problem. If you can call it a problem, because if you use separate stereo reverbs for various instruments, you are getting all kinds of spatial information from the various reverbs. 

FYI some of the top pop mixers prefer mono reverbs on various instruments, to keep the mix from getting unruly.


----------



## procreative (Aug 21, 2018)

Quantum Leap said:


> Most reverbs are stereo in name, but they actually sum the input into mono and create a new stereo signal from that mono signal. So if you have a stereo recording of celli and send it to a stereo reverb, you are losing a bunch of spatial information. However, you are still hearing all stereo info in the dry signal, so it’s not lost, but rather it’s lost in the wet signal. The wet signal creates a new stereo field generated by the algorithm or impulse. This sounds just fine or even fantastic when combined with the dry.
> 
> But yes, the true stereo presets solve this problem. If you can call it a problem, because if you use separate stereo reverbs for various instruments, you are getting all kinds of spatial information from the various reverbs.
> 
> FYI some of the top pop mixers prefer mono reverbs on various instruments, to keep the mix from getting unruly.



Where it gets tricky using the Instrument specific ones, is that assuming they are generating reflections based on a position in a space, that this is the same position as the library you apply it to. Not every developer seats players in the same way as there are so many schools of thought on this (if they bother at all like 8Dio).

I suppose it comes down to how much of this virtual room you are adding, but the point of something like Spaces is to place a sound in a "space". Otherwise I would just whack it through my Lexicon...


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## quantum7 (Aug 21, 2018)

OK, I did my first piece with Space II, my own rendition of "Cry Little Sister" from the 80's vampire movie, "The Lost Boys". I used the New York Cathedral and am happy how it came out.


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## SoNowWhat? (Aug 21, 2018)

quantum7 said:


> OK, I did my first piece with Space II, my own rendition of "Cry Little Sister" from the 80's vampire movie, "The Lost Boys". I used the New York Cathedral and am happy how it came out.



I love that song (and the movie at the time. It’s a while since I watched it).

I’m testing the demo of spaces at the moment and have to say I’m really liking it. Still getting to grips with everything though (I never had Spaces I). There’s something about the reverb where it seems to really envelope the sound, or surround it which helps to place an instrument in a space, rather than sound like something added on top. I’m conparing to my other preferred verb option and the difference is subtle but, very nice.


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## Quantum Leap (Aug 21, 2018)

The enveloping nature of spaces has to do with the way the sound was projected in the Hall. You will get more early reflections and more enveloping in many of the instrument specific presets. If you want less of that, use the basic, solo, or wind presets.


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## zeng (Aug 22, 2018)

I started using Spaces II with Composer Cloud. It is great. I have been using Spaces for years and Spaces II brings new locations and UI. Anyone using Composer Cloud?


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## SoNowWhat? (Aug 22, 2018)

Apologies in advance (I was sure this was covered but now can't see it) when does the intro pricing end? (not crossgrade from I).


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## quantum7 (Sep 23, 2018)

Until I started using Spaces II, I've only used convolution reverb for acoustic instruments, but decided to use Spaces II for a 100% synthesizer piece I just completed. Edvard Grieg's "In The Hall Of The Mountain King" was the perfect opportunity to use Spaces II Carlsbad Caverns IR. All the reverb on this piece is that single IR. I think it fit the piece very well.


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## Quantum Leap (Sep 24, 2018)

Loved it.


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## quantum7 (Sep 24, 2018)

Quantum Leap said:


> Loved it.



Thanks!


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## muziksculp (Sep 24, 2018)

@quantum7 ,

You did a very good job producing "In The Hall Of The Mountain King" with the OB-6, which is one of my favorite synths these days, and Spaces II has become my go to Reverb for Orchestral/Acoustic productions, and after listening to this piece of music, I have to give it a try with my Synths  , Spaces II has so much to offers, I only tried a few of the presets, and have been very impressed with the quality of the IR quality. I have been using the NY Strings Hall of Spaces II quite a bit, it sounds great on any Orch. material I throw at it. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


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## quantum7 (Sep 24, 2018)

muziksculp said:


> @quantum7 ,
> 
> You did a very good job producing "In The Hall Of The Mountain King" with the OB-6, which is one of my favorite synths these days, and Spaces II has become my go to Reverb for Orchestral/Acoustic productions, and after listening to this piece of music, I have to give it a try with my Synths  , Spaces II has so much to offers, I only tried a few of the presets, and have been very impressed with the quality of the IR quality. I have been using the NY Strings Hall of Spaces II quite a bit, it sounds great on any Orch. material I throw at it.
> 
> ...



Thanks! Yeah, I'm actually going to keep trying Spaces II with future synth projects and see what happens. Spaces II is definitely turning out to be my go-to reverb.


----------



## pcarrilho (Sep 25, 2018)

For orchestral stuff, i just use spaces II (don't use Altibverb anymore for orchestral music... must prefer Spaces II).


----------



## Sami (Sep 25, 2018)

Bought MIR Pro, never looked back


----------



## good (Sep 25, 2018)

I have two questions!

1) Would Spaces be better suited to *piano* sounds than the 112db's Redline Reverb or Slate Digital's Verb Suite Classic (or Pro-R, Altiverb, etc)?

2) Is it reasonable to buy Spaces I first and then upgrade to Spaces II as a piano player?

Because I have used the Trial version long time ago, I can no longer try it..


----------



## Francis Bourre (Sep 26, 2018)

good said:


> I have two questions!
> 
> 1) Would Spaces be better suited to *piano* sounds than the 112db's Redline Reverb or Slate Digital's Verb Suite Classic (or Pro-R, Altiverb, etc)?
> 
> ...



For intimate pianos, I really like ew studios presets (front in true stereo). I like to make it a bit drier than the original settings.
For bright stereo image, the new Reynolds hall is fantastic (you can't miss it, this is the welcome preset).

1/ I guess it's very subjective. Got some presets on Altiverb I like a lot, but the 2 mentioned above are my goto for pianos. I stopped my slate subscription because I didn't use it at all, I got better choices. And I never tried 112db's thingy.

2/ Try before buying is the most reasonable thing you can do. Don't forget these things are fully subjective. It's like piano sound, there's no best one most of the time, there's just the one you like the most for making your music.


----------



## good (Sep 26, 2018)

Francis Bourre said:


> For intimate pianos, I really like ew studios presets (front in true stereo). I like to make it a bit drier than the original settings.
> For bright stereo image, the new Reynolds hall is fantastic (you can't miss it, this is the welcome preset).
> 
> 1/ I guess it's very subjective. Got some presets on Altiverb I like a lot, but the 2 mentioned above are my goto for pianos. I stopped my slate subscription because I didn't use it at all, I got better choices. And I never tried 112db's thingy.
> ...




OK, thank you  I'll buy Spaces I first although it doesn't have Reynolds Hall preset, and then if I like it, I'll upgrade to II.
Thank you for replying.


----------



## Michael Antrum (Sep 27, 2018)

For many years my goto piano was Ivory II American Concert D , with the reverb replaced by Spaces (v 1).

It's now Ivory II American Concert D , with the reverb replaced by Spaces (v 2).

But there is still a lot to love about v 1, and if you can pick it up cheaply it's still a terrific reverb.


----------



## Przemek K. (Sep 27, 2018)

mikeybabes said:


> For many years my goto piano was Ivory II American Concert D , with the reverb replaced by Spaces (v 1).
> 
> It's now Ivory II American Concert D , with the reverb replaced by Spaces (v 2).
> 
> But there is still a lot to love about v 1, and if you can pick it up cheaply it's still a terrific reverb.



So is there besides the new impulses and presets and features a difference in sound between Spaces 1 and 2?


----------



## Sid Francis (Sep 27, 2018)

no, both are gorgeous


----------



## Mike Fox (Oct 3, 2018)

quantum7 said:


> OK, I did my first piece with Space II, my own rendition of "Cry Little Sister" from the 80's vampire movie, "The Lost Boys". I used the New York Cathedral and am happy how it came out.



Sounds great! Love the vocals.


----------



## Mike Fox (Oct 3, 2018)

I got to test drive Spaces ll yesterday. The Reynolds Hall had me sold as soon as I loaded up a Soaring Strings patch. Pure magic.


----------



## muziksculp (Oct 3, 2018)

Mike Fox said:


> I got to test drive Spaces ll yesterday. The Reynolds Hall had me sold as soon as I loaded up a Soaring Strings patch. Pure magic.



Cool, will have to give this a try.

Loving Spaces II.


----------



## quantum7 (Oct 3, 2018)

Mike Fox said:


> Sounds great! Love the vocals.



Thanks!


----------



## Anders Wall (Nov 5, 2018)

Heads up!
November sale offers this plug-in for roughly $135.
Check with your usual dealers.
Best,
/Anders


----------



## Breaker (Nov 5, 2018)

Seems to be around 150$ now on many retailers, which is excactly the same as the upgrade price. 

I guess only EW offers the upgrade. Nice that loyalty is rewarded.


----------



## SoNowWhat? (Nov 5, 2018)

Breaker said:


> Seems to be around 150$ now on many retailers, which is excactly the same as the upgrade price.
> 
> I guess only EW offers the upgrade. Nice that loyalty is rewarded.


Check in cart pricing at JRR and Audiodeluxe. Maybe Best Service too but I haven’t checked there yet. Seems like a good deal.


----------



## ChristianM (Nov 5, 2018)

Yes, but no deal for upgrade… grrrr


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## Audio Birdi (Nov 5, 2018)

everyplugin.com have the cheapest prices for EW normally  I

It's odd that EW themselves haven't discounted Spaces II as much as the 3rd party sellers.


----------



## Henu (Nov 5, 2018)

SoNowWhat? said:


> Best Service



€ 159 currently. 

I'm still wondering do I actually _need_ this. I got a ton of impulses and know how to use them, and I recently bought myself the whole Lexicon PCM bundle which takes care of my artificial reverbs. I'd love to get my hands on the Sony Scoring Stage somehow, but AFAIK, this doesn't have it. Right?


----------



## zolhof (Nov 5, 2018)

Henu said:


> € 159 currently.
> 
> I'm still wondering do I actually _need_ this. I got a ton of impulses and know how to use them, and I recently bought myself the whole Lexicon PCM bundle which takes care of my artificial reverbs. I'd love to get my hands on the Sony Scoring Stage somehow, but AFAIK, this doesn't have it. Right?



There's actually a preset called "Culver Scoring Stage" under the LA Scoring Stages folder. It's been speculated to be the MGM Stage.

Also, Burbank = Eastwood? Hollywood = Newman? Just a bunch of wild guesses.


----------



## Audio Birdi (Nov 5, 2018)

zolhof said:


> There's actually a preset called "Culver Scoring Stage" under the LA Scoring Stages folder. It's been speculated to be the MGM Stage.
> 
> Also, Burbank = Eastwood? Hollywood = Newman? Just a bunch of wild guesses.


It would be interesting to find out which scoring stage is what for sure!


----------



## Breaker (Nov 5, 2018)

SoNowWhat? said:


> Check in cart pricing at JRR and Audiodeluxe. Maybe Best Service too but I haven’t checked there yet. Seems like a good deal.



Maybe I didn’t explain properly but I already own Spaces and the regular upgrade price from Spaces to Spaces II is 149$.
So for me this is not so good deal.


----------



## SoNowWhat? (Nov 5, 2018)

Breaker said:


> Maybe I didn’t explain properly but I already own Spaces and the regular upgrade price from Spaces to Spaces II is 149$.
> So for me this is not so good deal.


Sure. I was posting as much for anyone else reading so they would know that the price is actually slightly lower than the $149 quoted. Sorry that the upgrade has no discount. Very odd.


----------



## Henu (Nov 5, 2018)

zolhof said:


> There's actually a preset called "Culver Scoring Stage" under the LA Scoring Stages folder. It's been speculated to be the MGM Stage.



Oh no you just didn't. >.<


----------



## Mike Fox (Nov 5, 2018)

I love Spaces II. The ability to adjust the decay is what I was always wanting from Spaces. Unfortunately, EastWest has never made much sense when it comes to their upgrade prices, so I won't be buying it until it's cheaper.


----------



## zolhof (Nov 5, 2018)

I asked EW support about the November 60% sale for Spaces 1 owners and here's their response:

_"For the Spaces 1 to Spaces 2 upgrade, the cost is $149 if you are interested. We currently have a November 60% sale, but that excludes sale prices, Spaces II, Voices of Soul, and Composer Cloud."_

Keep in mind that you can buy a full Spaces 2 license for $134 here. So much for loyalty, huh?


----------



## Breaker (Nov 5, 2018)

zolhof said:


> I asked EW support about the November 60% sale for Spaces 1 owners and here's their response:
> 
> _"For the Spaces 1 to Spaces 2 upgrade, the cost is $149 if you are interested. We currently have a November 60% sale, but that excludes sale prices, Spaces II, Voices of Soul, and Composer Cloud."_
> 
> Keep in mind that you can buy a full Spaces 2 license for $134 here. So much for loyalty, huh?



To put it nicely, that's just BS. Per Eastwest website, the regular price for Spaces II is 399$ even though it has been on sale (299$) through the whole lifespan of the product so far (199$/149$ for the upgrade). Now they are selling it for less than 149$ through vendors.

Nice way to piss off the owners of Spaces I as well as the people who bought Spaces II for the "Intro price" just 3 months ago.


----------



## ChristianM (Nov 5, 2018)

I expect a sale to provide the update _Spaces 1 to Spaces 2_ for ~$80 because it is not worth more


----------



## Mike Fox (Nov 5, 2018)

Does EastWest ever offer sales on their upgrades? I'm really not understanding the lack of customer loyalty here. It should have been no more than $50 for previous Spaces owners to upgrade.


----------



## Breaker (Nov 5, 2018)

Mike Fox said:


> Does EastWest ever offer sales on their upgrades? I'm really not understanding the lack of customer loyalty here. It should have been no more than $50 for previous Spaces owners to upgrade.



I don't think they do. I don't think they have had any products before like Spaces, where newer version contains the content from the older one as well.
But at least the upgrade path for Hollywood Series is just as (il)logical now during the sales:
HS Diamond full license - 159$
HS Gold -> Diamond upgrade - 184$
HS Silver -> Diamond upgrade - 317$


----------



## Audio Birdi (Nov 5, 2018)

Just checked prices again, it appears all the 3rd party sellers have upped their prices to full price again! JRR, Audiodeluxe and Everyplugin all have removed the discounted price for Spaces II :(


----------



## SoNowWhat? (Nov 5, 2018)

Audio Birdi said:


> Just checked prices again, it appears all the 3rd party sellers have upped their prices to full price again! JRR, Audiodeluxe and Everyplugin all have removed the discounted price for Spaces II :(


Just came to post the same. Was originally up til end of November. Big promo for East-West.


----------



## Audio Birdi (Nov 5, 2018)

SoNowWhat? said:


> Just came to post the same. Was originally up til end of November. Big promo for East-West.


They must have told others to not adjust prices for Spaces II, voices of Empire and Voices of Soul, since they're classed as new libraries still. Still feel the $150 upgrade price is a bit steep.


----------



## SoNowWhat? (Nov 5, 2018)

Audio Birdi said:


> They must have told others to not adjust prices for Spaces II, voices of Empire and Voices of Soul, since they're classed as new libraries still. Still feel the $150 upgrade price is a bit steep.


Just got email from JRR and Empire and Soul are still discounted. ???
Is this just Spaces II?


----------



## Henu (Nov 5, 2018)

Well, that kind of settles it for me then. :/


----------



## Breaker (Nov 5, 2018)

This was not really the solution I was looking, although it makes sense.
And JRR site also has still Empire and Soul -60%. Probably will be taken down at some point.


----------



## samplestuff (Nov 5, 2018)

If anyone is looking for a Spaces II License (not upgrade) PM me. I have one I am selling. It's 300 now, but I am open to offers. I'll take the highest offer. I only have one available.


----------



## good (Nov 7, 2018)

Best Service is currently selling Spaces II for € 159 and.. $159. 
What's happening?


----------



## Henu (Nov 7, 2018)

Clear your browser cache? Mine shows € 299 since yesterday morning. Before that it was that 159 € for some hours.


----------



## SoNowWhat? (Nov 7, 2018)

I haven’t looked tonight but it was definitely still 159 euro at Best Service today.

Edit - But now is 299.


----------



## pmountford (Nov 7, 2018)

Not a cache issue because I purchased this morning when @good mentioned it. But looks like its gone now..  still its not usually too long before the next EW sale.


----------



## Audio Birdi (Nov 7, 2018)

pmountford said:


> Not a cache issue because I purchased this morning when @good mentioned it. But looks like its gone now..  still its not usually too long before the next EW sale.



That's true! hopefully the next sale won't class Spaces II as "new" and exclude it from the sale itself! and hopefully includes the upgrade in the sale!


----------



## Henu (Nov 7, 2018)

Goddamnit. :( If anyone still sees Spaces II sold somewhere with the discount, please let us others know!


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## axb312 (Nov 18, 2018)

@Quantum Leap 

A few questions about Spaces 2:

1. Is there at least one instrument specific impulse each for a small, medium and big sized room/ hall? I am referring to the following instruments: Piano, Winds, Strings, Brass, Perc and Choir.

2. Anyone know of any plans to update the impulse library? Will these updates be free or...?

3. How soon can one realistically expect Spaces 2 to be on sale?


----------



## zolhof (Dec 8, 2018)

Just a quick heads-up, Spaces 2 is currently on sale for $159,60 @ Time+Space and Sweetwater. @Henu 

And still no discounted upgrade for Spaces 1 owners.


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## IFM (Jan 21, 2019)

I know I'm a little late to the party but I got it during the New Years sales. I am in love with the Reynolds hall. Just a little bit of tweaking on the levels brought the EWHO to life. It's a little bit of a CPU hog if not running in high latency mode but workable. Sounds stellar!


----------



## constaneum (Jan 21, 2019)

yes. the hall is quite nice. lots of nice new spaces as well. However, i wonder how would Spaces 2 compared with Seventh Heaven


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## JamieLang (Jan 21, 2019)

constaneum said:


> yes. the hall is quite nice. lots of nice new spaces as well. However, i wonder how would Spaces 2 compared with Seventh Heaven



As someone who recently compared the two head to head in real world mixes I happened to be doing when I pulled the demos...I bought SpacesII. I don't think they're comparable at all. For better or worse, I suppose. To me, 7th Heaven was a typical mono summing "lexi sounding" lush reverb. Nice...but, is there someone who doesn't HAVE that at this point? Meanwhile, the EW has a real stereo input matrix. I could finally outdo my old Kurzweil hardware for "band" ambience. Strings on the Hollywood scoring stages was just lovely.

Do keep in mind...I'm a "band" guy....not an orchestral guy....obviously YMMV.


----------



## jamwerks (Jan 22, 2019)

I don't think 7th Heaven is mono summing.


----------



## JamieLang (Jan 22, 2019)

jamwerks said:


> I don't think 7th Heaven is mono summing.



While youre right, technically, in order to explain what I mean: its like every Lexicon Ive ever used. Feeds left and right into a sausage maker on the beginning of the algorithm which respects nearly none of the stereo placement its sent. We used to not waste a second aux send on the board for units like that. Back when those kinds of resources were so finite.  

That is a majority of software reverbs, yet, I dont think Ive ever met a hardware reverb that wasnt Lexicon that worked that way. Maybe some inexpensive 1980s boxes....but, not for a long time. 

I shouldnt causally toss out terms that arent strictly true. Since there may be reverbs that literally sum the two inputs completely.


----------



## JamieLang (Jan 22, 2019)

Also, it should be noted due to thread title, I didnt own SpacesI....so, I dont know how it compares-didnt “upgrade” strictly speaking.


----------



## tehreal (Jan 22, 2019)

IFM said:


> I know I'm a little late to the party but I got it during the New Years sales. I am in love with the Reynolds hall. Just a little bit of tweaking on the levels brought the EWHO to life. It's a little bit of a CPU hog if not running in high latency mode but workable. Sounds stellar!



Wait, what New Years Sale? How much did it cost during this New Years Sale?


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## dzilizzi (Jan 22, 2019)

tehreal said:


> Wait, what New Years Sale? How much did it cost during this New Years Sale?


Same as during the Christmas sale. They just extended it a week or so.


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## tehreal (Jan 22, 2019)

dzilizzi said:


> Same as during the Christmas sale. They just extended it a week or so.



I thought it was $299 over Christmas (same as it is now). Was it a different price?


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## dzilizzi (Jan 22, 2019)

tehreal said:


> I thought it was $299 over Christmas (same as it is now). Was it a different price?


Wasn’t there an up to 60% off sale? I know it wasn’t that much off, but maybe 40%? I do remember comments on how it was on sale so soon after release.

Edit: okay, I can’t find a sale announcement with specifics but I know the EW sale seemed to continue from Black Friday thru the end of the year. I was thinking of buying a few items, but spent too much on OT and I own Spaces II, so it wasn’t one of the ones I was watching. The sale didn’t appear to change throughout the entire holiday based on the ones I was watching. Spaces II was $159.50 during the BF sale.


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## JamieLang (Jan 22, 2019)

Yeah, I think I got it for $159? Something like that. Sweetwater--not direct.


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## pmcrockett (Jan 22, 2019)

IIRC some people lucked out and got it for the ~$150 price over Black Friday from third party retailers, but then EW made them raise the price because it was a new product and wasn't actually supposed to have been discounted that much.


----------



## IFM (Jan 23, 2019)

JamieLang said:


> Yeah, I think I got it for $159? Something like that. Sweetwater--not direct.


Ya me too.


----------



## Pablocrespo (Jan 23, 2019)

EW could make the upgrade a little more enticing for v1 owners, it is one of the worst companies regarding customer loyalty.


----------



## Henu (Jan 23, 2019)

zolhof said:


> Just a quick heads-up, Spaces 2 is currently on sale for $159,60 @ Time+Space and Sweetwater. @Henu



Goddamn, you tagged me and all but somehow I didn't see that alert and the deal passed by. :( Thanks anyway, appreciated!!! 

I got it second-hand for 220 € which was an ok deal- and holy crap this sounds GOOD. 
And after some more fiddling, I just had to sell the idea to my boss that we need to upgrade our (obsolete) Space 1 licence as soon as possible so we can have Spaces 2 at work too. :D


----------



## PapaG (Jun 15, 2019)

This is heavily discounted at the moment for a couple of days. I have a ton of reverbs; how does this one compare to the usual suspects?


----------



## Ashermusic (Jun 15, 2019)

PapaG said:


> This is heavily discounted at the moment for a couple of days. I have a ton of reverbs; how does this one compare to the usual suspects?



It just sounds great IMHO.


----------



## Sid Francis (Jun 15, 2019)

Whatever I try in my armada: in 95% of all times I am coming back to Spaces when it is about finding the right orchestral reverb. For solo instruments choices may vary since they sometimes have special needs.


----------



## AllanH (Jun 15, 2019)

PapaG said:


> This is heavily discounted at the moment for a couple of days. I have a ton of reverbs; how does this one compare to the usual suspects?



I think it's important to recognize what Spaces is: It's a reverb engine comprised of impulse responses from a large number of actual halls, churches, rooms, studios, caverns, etc. The engine itself is very well done and operates with low latency and CPU. 

As you would expect, the presents sound different and as such there is no "magic" preset. I love the huge variety and will often audition several presets if I'm looking for a particular sound. I highly recommend it and use Spaces II for something on pretty much all my tracks.


----------



## PapaG (Jun 15, 2019)

Given that it's a convulsion verb, does it have anymore special sauce than Altiverb?


----------



## dzilizzi (Jun 15, 2019)

PapaG said:


> Given that it's a convulsion verb, does it have anymore special sauce than Altiverb?


If you have Altiverb, you probably don't need Spaces. It has different locations but I think you can get a similar sound with Altiverb. 

However it is a whole lot cheaper.


----------



## 5Lives (Jun 15, 2019)

$149 for the upgrade seems like the lowest it has / will be. May finally jump on it.


----------



## Shredoverdrive (Jun 15, 2019)

5Lives said:


> $149 for the upgrade seems like the lowest it has / will be. May finally jump on it.


10 bucks less than usual isn't it? Wow!


----------



## quantum7 (Jun 15, 2019)

Only a $10 price discount for people who already own Spaces 1? Wow! You would think a loyalty discount would be a bit more, but oh well, I guess it's better than nothing.


----------



## Mucusman (Jun 15, 2019)

quantum7 said:


> Only a $10 price discount for owner to upgrade from spaces 1 to spaces 2? Wow!



Yup. I'm willing to upgrade, but not north of $100. Just voting with my wallet.


----------



## Shredoverdrive (Jun 15, 2019)

Mucusman said:


> Yup. I'm willing to upgrade, but not north of $100. Just voting with my wallet.


Same here. This is a disgrace.


----------



## Pablocrespo (Jun 15, 2019)

Me too, if anyone of EW is reading...

learn how other developers gain the loyalty of their customers. I have a lot of EW products and would buy Spaces II in a moment if the upgrade price was right. 

No more EW for me for the time being


----------



## Audio Birdi (Jun 15, 2019)

They do 50% off upgrades once a year I think, it's a rarity for upgrade prices to be discounted annoyingly.


----------



## 5Lives (Jun 15, 2019)

I haven’t seen a lower upgrade price for spaces II since it came out unfortunately.


----------



## Shredoverdrive (Jun 15, 2019)

Audio Birdi said:


> They do 50% off upgrades once a year I think, it's a rarity for upgrade prices to be discounted annoyingly.


Really? I never saw that.


----------



## fretti (Jun 15, 2019)

Well technically it already/still is discounted, though was the Upgrade actually ever sold for $265??


----------



## paulmatthew (Jun 15, 2019)

It's cheaper to buy than the upgrade right now. Disappointing to say the least.


----------



## 5Lives (Jun 15, 2019)

paulmatthew said:


> It's cheaper to buy than the upgrade right now. Disappointing to say the least.



Where are you seeing that? It is $10 cheaper to upgrade.


----------



## jtnyc (Jun 15, 2019)

At AudioDeluxe it's $134.99 in the cart


----------



## paulmatthew (Jun 15, 2019)

5Lives said:


> Where are you seeing that? It is $10 cheaper to upgrade.


Jrr shop $135


----------



## ChristianM (Jun 15, 2019)

Same also. I want an update at a good price…


----------



## CGR (Jun 15, 2019)

$135 upgrade price for an updated GUI and some extra IRs is a hard pill to swallow. I'll stick with Spaces v1 for now.


----------



## 5Lives (Jun 15, 2019)

CGR said:


> $135 upgrade price for an updated GUI and some extra IRs is a hard pill to swallow. I'll stick with Spaces v1 for now.



What else would you expect from a convolution reverb though? You pay for the IRs. Look at how expensive Altiverb is.


----------



## CGR (Jun 16, 2019)

5Lives said:


> What else would you expect from a convolution reverb though? You pay for the IRs. Look at how expensive Altiverb is.


Fair enough argument - producing IRs is a costly exercise. It's just that having paid $199 for Spaces v1, and then to pay an additional $135 upgrade for Spaces v2, stings a bit ($334 as an existing customer vs first time buyer @ $159). A better deal for an existing customer - that's what I'd expect - and it seems I'm not the only one who feels this way.


----------



## dzilizzi (Jun 16, 2019)

But you can still buy Spaces 1. Are there any Spaces in 1 that aren't in 2? I haven't checked. I'm not disagreeing with you this since I bought the upgrade when it came out. Making us pay so much would make better sense if it was almost a different instrument. So as usual, early adopters get hit with higher prices.


----------



## pmcrockett (Jun 16, 2019)

dzilizzi said:


> But you can still buy Spaces 1. Are there any Spaces in 1 that aren't in 2? I haven't checked. I'm not disagreeing with you this since I bought the upgrade when it came out. Making us pay so much would make better sense if it was almost a different instrument. So as usual, early adopters get hit with higher prices.


Pretty sure Spaces 2 has everything 1 has. I remember Nick Phoenix talking about how there were a handful of IRs from 1 that he thought weren't up to scratch but they left them 2 in because they knew people would complain if they got rid of them.


----------



## dzilizzi (Jun 16, 2019)

pmcrockett said:


> Pretty sure Spaces 2 has everything 1 has. I remember Nick Phoenix talking about how there were a handful of IRs from 1 that he thought weren't up to scratch but they left them 2 in because they knew people would complain if they got rid of them.


Then it makes no sense to continue to sell 1. It's just confusing to customers and potentially angering if they get the wrong one. Unless they are getting rid of old boxed editions. 

Sometimes I don't understand the way these companies think.


----------



## pmcrockett (Jun 16, 2019)

dzilizzi said:


> Then it makes no sense to continue to sell 1. It's just confusing to customers and potentially angering if they get the wrong one. Unless they are getting rid of old boxed editions.
> 
> Sometimes I don't understand the way these companies think.



I think it must be retailers liquidating existing keys or something. Spaces 1 doesn't seem to be on the EastWest site anymore, and what would have been the web address for it contains only a note that the product is no longer available.


----------



## Fleer (Jun 16, 2019)

CGR said:


> $135 upgrade price for an updated GUI and some extra IRs is a hard pill to swallow. I'll stick with Spaces v1 for now.


+1
Also, am I the only one preferring the original’s GUI?


----------



## pmcrockett (Jun 16, 2019)

Fleer said:


> +1
> Also, am I the only one preferring the original’s GUI?


I like that the new one has actual images of the IR locations. It gives some context as to why an IR sounds the way it does.


----------



## Grilled Cheese (Jun 16, 2019)

Fleer said:


> +1
> Also, am I the only one preferring the original’s GUI?


Not concerned at all about price but the GUI is a bit disappointing in that it’s unnecessarily cramped. The layout and colours are good but gee it’s hard to read (43 inch 4K monitor). That’s my one gripe.


----------



## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 16, 2019)

a few days with it, it hasn't moved from my FX Group.

i really like this one.


----------



## Mucusman (Nov 4, 2019)

5Lives said:


> I haven’t seen a lower upgrade price for spaces II since it came out unfortunately.



I saw today that a new user can buy Spaces II cheaper than the upgrade price offered when it was released _or currently available today_ ($132 for new users today via discount etailers, $159 from EW direct; $149 to upgrade through East West!). 

Massive customer loyalty!


----------



## brenneisen (Nov 4, 2019)

Mucusman said:


> I saw today that a new user can buy Spaces II cheaper than the upgrade price offered when it was released _or currently available today_ ($132 for new users today via discount etailers, $159 from EW direct; $149 to upgrade through East West!).
> 
> Massive customer loyalty!



gotta pay those lambos...


----------



## Mike Fox (Nov 4, 2019)

Mucusman said:


> I saw today that a new user can buy Spaces II cheaper than the upgrade price offered when it was released _or currently available today_ ($132 for new users today via discount etailers, $159 from EW direct; $149 to upgrade through East West!).
> 
> Massive customer loyalty!


Yep. I waited forever in hopes that EW would eventually show some love. Never happened, so i caved in and paid the $150 to upgrade.


----------



## good (Nov 4, 2019)

$159 for new users! $149 for upgrade!
well done, EW! very nice company.....


----------



## Zero&One (Nov 4, 2019)

good said:


> $159 for new users! $149 for upgrade!
> well done, EW! very nice company.....



Try...
Hollywood Strings Diamond
$159 new user
$184 upgrade


----------



## NoamL (Nov 4, 2019)

Sorry guys. I canceled Cloud the other week and EW is scrambling to right their finances.


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## Audio Birdi (Nov 4, 2019)

They only do 50% off upgrades once a year which is frustrating. It hasn’t happened yet either this year.


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## Braveheart (Nov 5, 2019)

Audio Birdi said:


> They only do 50% off upgrades once a year which is frustrating. It hasn’t happened yet either this year.


It never happened to Spaces II yet.


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## Shredoverdrive (Nov 5, 2019)

NoamL said:


> Sorry guys. I canceled Cloud the other week and EW is scrambling to right their finances.


Same here, they must be on the verge of bankruptcy with our two cancelations.
In fact, I've tried all they had with my CCX subscription and I realized I really needed HO (that I have), Spaces (I have Spaces I, not buying Spaces II unless I get a DECENT upgrade price) and Hollywood Choirs (that I will buy eventually). I will miss the close mics, though...


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## Audio Birdi (Nov 5, 2019)

Braveheart said:


> It never happened to Spaces II yet.


That's true which is a pain, I hope it does soon, as I'd love to finally have the ability to shorten the IR's finally to essentially have only the ER without the tail :D


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## Eptesicus (Nov 5, 2019)

good said:


> $159 for new users! $149 for upgrade!
> well done, EW! very nice company.....



I don't understand why they keep doing this!?

I want Spaces 2, but i refuse to buy it until they let existing Sapces users have it for a resonable price and not just basically the same price as new users!


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## Mark Schmieder (Nov 6, 2019)

I can't remember what I paid for it when it came out, but do recall complaints, which were addressed by the explanation that it's a completely new product with lots of development costs.

I understand how frustrating it can be for developers, and that they also don't want to change the name (usually), so I swallowed the bait and was not disappointed; this quickly became one of my three preferred reverbs for acoustic music of all types (classical, broadway, etc.). It's very easy and quick to dial up.


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## Mystic (Nov 6, 2019)

People are really becoming conditioned to expect rock bottom prices on everything. I bought this when it came out and it was well worth the money. Hands down my favourite product EW makes. For what it is, it's priced correctly and I'd put it in the same category as Seventh Heaven as far as quality on projects.


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## Dewdman42 (Nov 6, 2019)

of course we want rock bottom prices, no duh. That is how this industry works now. Everyone prices their stuff in the stratosphere knowing full well the most of us aren't going to buy until they sell it for 50%. The 50% price is actually the real price everyone is expecting to trade for. Let's be real.

There is no way I will pay $150 for upgrade to SpacesII. Hopefully EW will do the right thing there eventually, but current upgrade pricing is ridiculous. 

Anyway, I hardly use SpacesI anymore, if I was more dependent on Spaces, maybe I would fork over for it, but I'm not and the upgrade pricing is insane. So forget it.

I did pickup EW Symphonic Choirs this week.. On sale of course...


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## emid (Nov 6, 2019)

Just picked up for £110 from inta audio with 10% extra discount.


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## milliontown (Feb 12, 2020)

Finally a better discount on the Spaces 2 upgrade - now $92.


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## Audio Birdi (Feb 12, 2020)

milliontown said:


> Finally a better discount on the Spaces 2 upgrade - now $92.


Glad they've given a better upgrade price. Wish they did 60% off for Valentine's Day so they would potentially give it for $75 instead. But still better than $150 upgrade price.

Took them quite a long while to offer 50% off upgrades this time around.


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## Dewdman42 (Feb 12, 2020)

I don't need it now. They waited too long. Maybe I'll grab it at some kind of future super discount.


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## Mark Schmieder (Feb 12, 2020)

If you wait long enough, you might get really lucky and buy it a day before Spaces III is released, with a lucky loyalty upgrade offer of $499 sitting in your inbox.


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## Robert_G (Feb 12, 2020)

Upgrade from Spaces 1 to Spaces 2 is currently $92


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## ProfoundSilence (Feb 15, 2020)

I upgraded but havent downloaded it yet. 

interested in some of the techniques used to capture the instrument specific ones.


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## ChristianM (Feb 15, 2020)

not $92 but $92 + VAT !!!


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## Geoff Grace (Feb 20, 2020)

FYI, the upgrade deal expires in just over 24 hours: at the stroke of midnight PST.

Best,

Geoff


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## Gerbil (Feb 21, 2020)

Geoff Grace said:


> FYI, the upgrade deal expires in just over 24 hours: at the stroke of midnight PST.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Geoff


I was about to buy it last night. Then I thought, I have the original Spaces, the Lex PCM bundle, the Valhallas and Pro-R. If I can't make something decent from that lot then what the hell am I doing? lol


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## CGR (Feb 21, 2020)

Gerbil said:


> I was about to buy it last night. Then I thought, I have the original Spaces, the Lex PCM bundle, the Valhallas and Pro-R. If I can't make something decent from that lot then what the hell am I doing? lol


Ditto!


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## awaey (Feb 21, 2020)

Gerbil said:


> I was about to buy it last night. Then I thought, I have the original Spaces, the Lex PCM bundle, the Valhallas and Pro-R. If I can't make something decent from that lot then what the hell am I doing? lol


I am in the same boat...


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## Geoff Grace (Feb 21, 2020)

I certainly can understand not spending more if your needs are already covered.

As a Mac user, my concern at this point is the transition Apple is going through. They've already purged 32-bit support in Catalina, and it's rumored that they will migrate to ARM processors in the near future. I'd be surprised if the original Spaces were to be upgraded for both transitions.

Does anyone know whether the original Spaces is Catalina compliant?

Best,

Geoff


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## synergy543 (Feb 22, 2020)

OK, I finally got Spaces II and testing it with piano chords, it sounds like I'm floating in the ocean without any dramamine. The modulation I guess is what everyone likes (makes that beautiful swirly sound). However it absolutely doesn't work with piano sustained chords. Even using the S. Cal Hall for piano, you can hear as it steps through the modulation. Cool space trip. However, I'd like to reduce the modulation amount. Is there a way to do that?

I'm hoping there's some sort of an internal trim (like the U-he software) that lets you adjust the modulation amount and maybe even the mod LFO type so I don't have to hear the steps. I can't believe people haven't mentioned this yet. Please tell me that I'm wrong. Please? Or I just wasted a few hundred bucks.


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## Paul Cardon (Feb 22, 2020)

synergy543 said:


> OK, I finally got Spaces II and testing it with piano chords, it sounds like I'm floating in the ocean without any dramamine. The modulation I guess is what everyone likes (makes that beautiful swirly sound). However it absolutely doesn't work with piano sustained chords. Even using the S. Cal Hall for piano, you can hear as it steps through the modulation. Cool space trip. However, I'd like to reduce the modulation amount. Is there a way to do that?
> 
> I'm hoping there's some sort of an internal trim (like the U-he software) that lets you adjust the modulation amount and maybe even the mod LFO type so I don't have to hear the steps. I can't believe people haven't mentioned this yet. Please tell me that I'm wrong. Please? Or I just wasted a few hundred bucks.


I'm actually not sure what you mean by modulation? I'm pretty sure all the real space IRs are gonna be totally static, and I wasn't aware that there was even any modulation in any of the verbs. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I've never noticed any either.


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## synergy543 (Feb 22, 2020)

Paul Cardon said:


> I'm actually not sure what you mean by modulation? I'm pretty sure all the real space IRs are gonna be totally static, and I wasn't aware that there was even any modulation in any of the verbs. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I've never noticed any either.


Paul, you're right! Thank goodness, I apparently had Softube tape plugin inline which was doing the modulation. Great to know too, as if you want that effect, Softube Tape is a great way to achieve it! 

My apologies for the mistake.


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## Zero&One (Feb 22, 2020)

I want wow and flutter added to Spaces now


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## Ashermusic (Feb 22, 2020)

I was going to say that can’t be because it is a convolution reverb, not an algorithmic reverb, but others beat me to it.


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## synergy543 (Feb 22, 2020)

Many convolutions (such as Altiverb and Liquid Audio) have modulation built-in exactly because convolution sounds very static. I have to say, that now I have Spaces II set up properly, it really does sound as spectacular as everyone's comments suggested. They did a magnificent job sampling these spaces!


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## Fleer (Feb 22, 2020)

CGR said:


> Ditto!


Thritto!


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## Paul Cardon (Feb 22, 2020)

synergy543 said:


> Many convolutions (such as Altiverb and Liquid Audio) have modulation built-in exactly because convolution sounds very static. I have to say, that now I have Spaces II set up properly, it really does sound as spectacular as everyone's comments suggested. They did a magnificent job sampling these spaces!


While you can do some modulation in convolution reverbs, it's still a bit limited. Modulation in a good algo reverb is definitely going to be king because the diffusion engine can interact with itself as the scale of the grains are pushed and pulled. The king of modulated tails, Eventide's Blackhole reverb, is something that could never be recreated with a pure convolution-based reverb. (Though there are some cool hybrid reverbs that use both techniques in tandem to recreate algo characteristics, such as LiquidSonics' "Seventh Heaven")


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## Ashermusic (Feb 23, 2020)

Paul Cardon said:


> While you can do some modulation in convolution reverbs, it's still a bit limited. Modulation in a good algo reverb is definitely going to be king because the diffusion engine can interact with itself as the scale of the grains are pushed and pulled. The king of modulated tails, Eventide's Blackhole reverb, is something that could never be re-created with a pure convolution-based reverb. (Though there are some cool hybrid reverbs that use both techniques in tandem to recreate algo characteristics, such as LiquidSonics' "Seventh Heaven")



Bingo.


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## Audio Birdi (Feb 23, 2020)

The upgrade price has now gone to $184.

The original crossed out price was $299 before the sale. So ended up being $150 for the upgrade. now the crossed out value is $399 and $184 for the upgrade  The upgrade was $92 during the sale.... otherwise it would have been $75 for the sale. which I guess the marketing / sales team didn't want to go down at that price at the time unfortunately! 

Such a pain but will wait patiently for another upgrade sale, whenever that may be!


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## paul (Feb 24, 2020)

EW Spaces 2 - lovely workhorse - use it all the time - _independent comment from a very independent composer!_


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## Guffy (Feb 24, 2020)

I didn't find much reason to upgrade from Spaces 1 tbh. Sure, adjusting the decay is nice enough but i'd probably leave them as they come 99 % of the time anyway.


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## good (Feb 24, 2020)

Spaces I is enough to me but I upgraded just because of the decay function and Reynolds Hall. Though $92 is a bit of a waste to me, I don't regret it. The decay function is essential and Reynolds hall is quite good.


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## Mike Fox (Feb 25, 2020)

It's funny how so many of us (including myself) upgraded just for the decay feature, which is something that should have been included in the first place.


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## Sid Francis (Feb 25, 2020)

I can top this: I bought it only for the new impulses, and....I use mainly the old ones.. Only St.Dominics Church with its (in the mix) unperceivable 8 seconds or so is Gold for delicate acoustic instruments.


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## Stewart Kirwan (Aug 13, 2020)

Hi everyone, just wondering if someone could me a message when the Spaces 2 upgrade goes on sale again? 

(I'm following this thread, but just in case the alert doesn't work.....) 

Cheers, 
Stewart
[email protected]


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## dzilizzi (Aug 14, 2020)

Stewart Kirwan said:


> Hi everyone, just wondering if someone could me a message when the Spaces 2 upgrade goes on sale again?
> 
> (I'm following this thread, but just in case the alert doesn't work.....)
> 
> ...


It is usually cheaper just to buy the new Spaces when they have a 60% off sale than pay the upgrade price. Even on sale.


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## dcoscina (Aug 14, 2020)

quantum7 said:


> http://www.soundsonline.com/spaces-...tter&utm_campaign=spaces-ii-gen-now-available
> 
> I used to use Spaces all the time, but over the years have gravitated to other choices such as Altiverb 7 and SeventhHeaven for my convolution reverb needs. Spaces II looks intriguing though, but for $149 (the upgrade price) I'm not quite sure it is worth it now. Opinions welcome.


I upgraded last year when it finally dropped for SPACES 1 users. I'm glad I did too because it sounds better.


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## ChristianM (Aug 14, 2020)

I gave up since the old v1 buyers are forgotten… it allowed me to put on the LiquidSonoc Seven Heaven and frankly, the Seven sounds so much better than even at $50 for Space II, I leave them!


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## cqd (Aug 14, 2020)

I think the upgrade sale is January/February direction..


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## dzilizzi (Aug 14, 2020)

cqd said:


> I think the upgrade sale is January/February direction..


I want to say it is every other year? I just don't see it that often.


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## cqd (Aug 14, 2020)

dzilizzi said:


> I want to say it is every other year? I just don't see it that often.



I think it's been the last two years anyway..


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## dzilizzi (Aug 14, 2020)

cqd said:


> I think it's been the last two years anyway..


I must have missed one year. I was watching for an upgrade sale, then gave up and bought whatever it was (I think it was EWHO Diamond) I know it was over a year that I watched.


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## cqd (Aug 14, 2020)

dzilizzi said:


> I must have missed one year. I was watching for an upgrade sale, then gave up and bought whatever it was (I think it was EWHO Diamond) I know it was over a year that I watched.



I could have missed a year too I suppose..


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## Stewart Kirwan (Aug 14, 2020)

dzilizzi said:


> It is usually cheaper just to buy the new Spaces when they have a 60% off sale than pay the upgrade price. Even on sale.



Cheers!


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## Stewart Kirwan (Aug 14, 2020)

cqd said:


> I think the upgrade sale is January/February direction..



Thanks, I'll keep an eye out


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## paulmatthew (Aug 14, 2020)

When the upgrade is more than a new buy, no thanks. I don't really have no need for it anymore now that I have Liquidsonics Cinematic Rooms.


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## Stewart Kirwan (Jan 29, 2021)

The new price for Spaces 2 has just moved to $299 (up from the "sale" price of $159).
Upgrade price is still $184 though...


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## Breaker (Jan 29, 2021)

At least now the upgrade is cheaper than the full license like it should be.
But it seems that now every upgrade except Spaces II is on sale


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## BasariStudios (Jan 29, 2021)

Breaker said:


> At least now the upgrade is cheaper than the full license like it should be.
> But it seems that now every upgrade except Spaces II is on sale


Its almost 200$, lol.


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## BasariStudios (Jan 29, 2021)

paulmatthew said:


> When the upgrade is more than a new buy, no thanks. I don't really have no need for it anymore now that I have Liquidsonics Cinematic Rooms.


LS CR and Reverberate here plus R4 and Nimbus.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Jan 29, 2021)

Stewart Kirwan said:


> The new price for Spaces 2 has just moved to $299 (up from the "sale" price of $159).
> Upgrade price is still $184 though...


I gave up on Spaces II (as much as I like it), as there’s no way I’m shelling out for a second license. Bought Cinematic Rooms, comes with two licenses.


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## Stewart Kirwan (Feb 13, 2021)

Valentines sale is on but no Spaces 2 upgrade.


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## CGR (Feb 13, 2021)

Stewart Kirwan said:


> Valentines sale is on but no Spaces 2 upgrade.


My feeling is that East West are missing out on a substantial number of customers who own Spaces 1 passing on the upgrade to Spaces 2 due to their illogical pricing structure (ie. in a recent sale it was about $30 cheaper to buy Spaces 2 than to upgrade from v1 to v2).

If East West don't address this in the coming months, my money will be going elsewhere (maybe the new, innovative and beautiful sounding Inspirata Reverb - if they can iron out the bugs!)


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## BasariStudios (Feb 13, 2021)

CGR said:


> My feeling is that East West are missing out on a substantial number of customers who own Spaces 1 passing on the upgrade to Spaces 2 due to their illogical pricing structure (ie. in a recent sale it was about $30 cheaper to buy Spaces 2 than to upgrade from v1 to v2).
> 
> If East West don't address this in the coming months, my money will be going elsewhere (maybe the new, innovative and beautiful sounding Inspirata Reverb - if they can iron out the bugs!)


My Money already went elsewhere, Reverberate 3, Cinematic Rooms.


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## dzilizzi (Feb 13, 2021)

I think they think Spaces 2 is not so much an upgrade but a new product with different locations. 

That said, their upgrade pricing never made sense.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Feb 13, 2021)

CGR said:


> My feeling is that East West are missing out on a substantial number of customers who own Spaces 1 passing on the upgrade to Spaces 2 due to their illogical pricing structure (ie. in a recent sale it was about $30 cheaper to buy Spaces 2 than to upgrade from v1 to v2).
> 
> If East West don't address this in the coming months, my money will be going elsewhere (maybe the new, innovative and beautiful sounding Inspirata Reverb - if they can iron out the bugs!)


Seriously, check out Cinematic Rooms and Seventh Heaven.


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## lettucehat (Feb 13, 2021)

If they offer an upgrade path, it's an upgrade, and the upgrade for people who already spent $150-200 on Spaces is several times more expensive than some very excellent competitors (~$180). Having used both Spaces and Spaces II, II adds a lot, but the upgrade price doesn't make sense.


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## mopsiflopsi (Apr 15, 2021)

Noob question here. I recently got CC and thought I'd give Spaces II a shot. I'm using Studio One. I put the plugin as an insert onto Mix FX Main. It seems to produce no sound at all when I play anything. I can see the instrument has an output and it plays fine when I disable Spaces, but the reverb plugin seems to just consume the input without outputting anything. Am I missing something here?


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## Fleer (Oct 2, 2021)

Just got it in and it works well with Hollywood orchestra Opus edition, particularly those instrument specific presets (and the new halls like Hamburg and Reynolds).


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## BasariStudios (Mar 23, 2022)

This company is still so Sad and Pathetic.
I don't even know why i said that...


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## Sid Francis (Mar 23, 2022)

Sad and pathetic then and now or not: Spaces still is a wonderfull solution for orchestral purposes and acoustic instruments. Very natural.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Mar 24, 2022)

BasariStudios said:


> This company is still so Sad and Pathetic.
> I don't even know why i said that...


Sad and pathetic? Fair enough, but Spaces 1&2 are IMO two of the best reverbs for orchestral work. We all know you have some sort of chip on your shoulder with EW, but that shouldn't reflect on their actual products.


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## BasariStudios (Mar 24, 2022)

Jeremy Spencer said:


> Sad and pathetic? Fair enough, but Spaces 1&2 are IMO two of the best reverbs for orchestral work. We all know you have some sort of chip on your shoulder with EW, but that shouldn't reflect on their actual products.


Well you are right and we never disagree about the Quality but you know what i mean.


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