# Catalina - yes or no?



## greentuga (Oct 29, 2019)

Hi MAC composers,
Do you update the macOS Catalina?

Clean install or update?

And if so, for Logic Pro x users, do you have problems with kontakt and other plugins?

Tanks.


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## Minko (Oct 29, 2019)

Nope. Not everyhing is compatible yet. 

And when I go to a new OS I always do a clean install. (And make images so I can go back).


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 29, 2019)

no


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## greentuga (Oct 29, 2019)

Thanks. 
I use to do a clean install when i have time. 
Last update I don’t.


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## Wunderhorn (Oct 29, 2019)

In the recent years it proved to become recommendable to stay a whole MacOS version behind.
Generally Apple's quality control simply is not what it used to be.

You can make the math: Mojave after six rounds of improvements over a whole year is much safer to use than Catalina that just got its first bugfix.
Not to speak of all the 32-bit software that won't run anymore. And this can end up being more complicated than you think. Not only applications but also plug-ins and hardware drivers will be affected. Often we don't even think of such a particular component until it no longer works. Also, the new security layer that results in a never-ending orgy of nagging windows prompting you for permission has not been thought through properly in terms of workflow. I hope Apple is improving that in future iterations of Catalina - especially for pro users who know what this is about and are aware of the possible implications.


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## ptram (Oct 29, 2019)

I'll wait. I'm sure Catalina will try our patience, but how long?

Paolo


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## Anevis (Oct 30, 2019)

Me personally haven't updated to Catallina yet due to some rumors plugins not compatible and it came out to be true. My friend actually did update and he couldn't use Record box (that should be fixed now) and he also had few issues with Logic Pro X. So yeah it is a bit buggy. And as @Wunderhorn has pointed out, it probably is a good idea to stay at least a few updates behind before you are certain that the next update won't ruin your system.


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## Ashermusic (Oct 30, 2019)

Call me crazy but when the developers of my critical hardware and software send me an email specifically advising me not to update, I don't.


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## richard kurek (Oct 30, 2019)

i have zero issues i use nuendo all my plugins work


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## Matt Riley (Oct 30, 2019)

I might not be updating for years because of the changes to compatibility. I’m pretty happy with Mojave.


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## ChristianM (Oct 30, 2019)

No : NVidia for exmple doesnt work since mojave…
A new Mac Pro with Catalina, no
A new Mac Pro with high Sierra, yes (but how ?)
Apple kill the new Mac Pro with Catalina for me…


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## reutunes (Oct 30, 2019)

No


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## Ashermusic (Oct 30, 2019)

Matt Riley said:


> I might not be updating for years because of the changes to compatibility. I’m pretty happy with Mojave.



I will update as soon as my critical stuff is compatible so I can say goodbye to the bloated hot mess that is iTunes.

But right now, Apogee says no, Native Instruments says no, and Spectrasonics say no.

Maybe we should start a Catalina compatibility thread?


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## richard kurek (Oct 30, 2019)

Ashermusic said:


> I will update as soon as my critical stuff is compatible so I can say goodbye to the bloated hot mess that is iTunes.
> 
> But right now, Apogee says no, Native Instruments says no, and Spectrasonics say no.
> 
> Maybe we should start a Catalina compatibility thread?


native works


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 30, 2019)

I don’t really see why anyone would be in a rush to go Catalina. Mojave is fine. Just wait.


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## richard kurek (Oct 30, 2019)

Dewdman42 said:


> I don’t really see why anyone would be in a rush to go Catalina. Mojave is fine. Just wait.


in my case no choice my home security app needed it also Dorico 3 needed new system (i was on sierra couldnt install mojave not available)


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## Nick Batzdorf (Oct 30, 2019)

Hard no.



Ashermusic said:


> I will update as soon as my critical stuff is compatible so I can say goodbye to the bloated hot mess that is iTunes.



The one in iTunes makes you want to throw a tantrum. What a pile of shit.

I couldn't get it to stop shuffling movements in the Beethoven piano concertos. And I wasn't about to play with my damn iPhone while traveling at 80MPH on the open highway.

Apple is usually great at software, but iTunes... oy gevalt.


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## tmhuud (Oct 30, 2019)

ChristianM said:


> A new Mac Pro with high Sierra, yes (but how ?)
> Apple kill the new Mac Pro with Catalina



You know, I never thought of that. They probably killed it for me too since MOTU is often slow out the gates with updates for their Audio stuff. 🤔


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 30, 2019)

richard kurek said:


> in my case no choice my home security app needed it also Dorico 3 needed new system (i was on sierra couldnt install mojave not available)



Not being able to obtain Mojave would be the only solid reason I can think of. I am not aware of any apps yet that are requiring catalina. 

Are you sure you can't obtain mojave? I think you can get it here: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 30, 2019)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> Apple is usually great at software, but iTunes... oy gevalt.



iTunes was a train wreck, good riddance. I never use it except to put songs on my ancient iPod for the car.

Anyway, there are lots of other options for music and even for managing iPod and iPhone, besides having to use iTunes.,..me personally....as of today...I would not upgrade to Catalina just for an iTunes alternative.


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 30, 2019)

Dewdman42 said:


> Are you sure you can't obtain mojave? I think you can get it here: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372



So when I click the various links they provide above, it basically sends to a page in the app store where I can download mojave, I'm downloading it right now (even though I already have it). I will not choose to run it at the end.

If you have trouble getting to that same link, let us know, I can get you a copy of it after I download it. It used to be in the past that the app store would cut off downloads of old OS (IF and ONLY IF you never downloaded it before). So maybe I am able to press the GET button to download it because I had already "purchased" it in the past. That is why I usually make a rule of doing what I'm doing right now for every new OSX version when it comes out, even if I don't install it yet, I download it and quit the installer before installing it. Then later in the future the app store will consider me to be someone that already so called "purchased" it and needs to download it again, then no problem they let me do it. Even though I have no plans to install Catalina, I plan to do that....so that let's say in 2 years from now I may finally try to install Catalina and don't want to go past Catalina, I will be able to...but I don't want it now... I just want the ability to get it later.. So that's why I do that and I recommend everyone do that.

Burt in any case, Mojave is downloading to my machine as we speak...and I can easily zip it up for anyone that wants it. There are other dark net places to get it too but you always have to worry about security when doing that. The best thing is to get a friend that has already downloaded Mojave in the past to download it for you and save it to a DVD or USB device, then just run the installer and you'll be good to go.


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 30, 2019)

You can apparently also use this little tool to directly download Mojave installer

http://dosdude1.com/mojave/
Though you are trusting a third party source to do it, but this guy has been around a long time helping people run new OSX on old macs that don't officially support it and I would regard him a trusted source...so his little helper tool has a menu option to just download Mojave directly. I just started that little helper too and am downloading Mojave again that way... works fine...

no excuses! Run Mojave for now.


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 30, 2019)

So actually I can't "purchase" Catalina at this time, because app store blocks me since I'm on 5,1 MacPro. Bleh. So in the future I will have no choice but alternative means should I decide I want to try to upgrade it to Catalina, which is doubtful, but you never know.


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## richard kurek (Oct 30, 2019)

Dewdman42 said:


> Not being able to obtain Mojave would be the only solid reason I can think of. I am not aware of any apps yet that are requiring catalina.
> 
> Are you sure you can't obtain mojave? I think you can get it here: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT201372


couldnt find it , as far as catalina required no its just i was on sierra needed to be at least on high sierra, and also getting my software ready will be buying new mac pro sort of a heads up, at the end catalina is flawless with me , my motu 828es also perfect


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 30, 2019)

You can get it with the second link I posted above, called Mojave Patcher. Try that.

http://dosdude1.com/mojave/










I highly recommend you avoid Catalina for now. Way too many warnings came out about this in the past couple months, especially in the audio community. There are some other threads on the forum getting into the technical mumbo jumbo about why.

You can obtain High Sierra too...but I really recommend Mojave as long as you have Metal video card. You do have a metal card right?


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## greentuga (Oct 30, 2019)

I don’t have two computers, So, I use my MacBook Pro to all my stuff - áudio, vídeo, photo and... for school (I’m teacher)
since I’m not a professional, I ask and I guess I have more than arguments to stay Mojave 

for my professional work I do something like this video and more. When I have permissions to share with you, I give more links for áudios and videos.

I work with disassembled people and make shows for sensibilization. I can explain my work if you’re interested. I make all the work by myself. 
here’s an example


thank you all, you save me


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## Nick Batzdorf (Oct 30, 2019)

Dewdman42 said:


> iTunes was a train wreck, good riddance. I never use it except to put songs on my ancient iPod for the car.
> 
> Anyway, there are lots of other options for music and even for managing iPod and iPhone, besides having to use iTunes.,..me personally....as of today...I would not upgrade to Catalina just for an iTunes alternative.



Someone told me the solution: tell it that your piano concerto is an audiobook!

I'm going to do that with all my albums. For all their good qualities, Apple just doesn't seem to get the concept of the album being a unique artform, not just a collection of songs.


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## scoringdreams (Oct 30, 2019)

iTunes is indeed a horrible mess. Not sure if anyone experiences this, but iTunes messes up my meta-data tags every single time I attempt to re-tag them; just because the Apple Music Gracenote meta-data catalogue is viewed as absolute. Can't wait to see how the new music application would fair...

Any guesses how long developers would take to get software playing nice with Catalina OS?


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 30, 2019)

I personally think within a few months some people will say it works fine but other people will have problems and there will be a lot of contention on the net about whether its fine or not...but if I were even remotely considering Catalina, which I'm not, I would wait a year or until 99.9% of everyone out there is running it and shouting from the rooftops how glorious it is and we're all missing out without it. Until then, Mojave runs great and I see no reason whatsoever to be an early adopter. Don't let Apple upgrade fever get you... Catalina has a lot of big changes and they were not planned well from the sounds of it. Its going to be a rough transition. If you want to be a beta tester for apple, then go for it.


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 30, 2019)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> Someone told me the solution: tell it that your piano concerto is an audiobook!
> 
> I'm going to do that with all my albums. For all their good qualities, Apple just doesn't seem to get the concept of the album being a unique artform, not just a collection of songs.



For just listening, you might want to check out *PLEX*. It's free. Once it scans your collection you can listen by album and it automatically grabs poster artwork and all that to make your browsing experience a little nicer. 

You have to run it on a mac or pc (or linux) like a kind of server. (So don't run it on your DAW computer). Then you can run the client version on every other device you can imagine, including Sonos, Roku, AppleTV, iPhones, etc.. just about everything...or connect through a web browser in or out of your home...and listen to your collection by album if you like...







Plex also can manage TV shows, podcasts, movies, etc..if you're into that. But the music aspect is what makes it a much nicer way to listen to your music instead of iTunes. 

The only downside, maybe, is that you need to set it up on a machine like a server that is kind of running all the time. I actually have it setup on my NAS device, but any spare mac or pc will do just fine.

They also added some kind of capability that I haven't tried yet, where it can scan all your music and then sync up with the Tidal music service, which provides lossless streaming anywhere you happen to be...something like that..I haven't tried it yet though.

There are other solutions too, but I really like Plex


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## lpuser (Oct 30, 2019)

Ashermusic said:


> so I can say goodbye to the bloated hot mess that is iTunes.



Having to run x different apps and sync in the finder does not seem fun either. In the early days of computing, we had applications which were huge and could do the tasks. All this stripping down into single apps (which started with iOS) is nothing but a workflow killer. Having to open an app for podcast, another for music, another for books is neither fun nor efficient. So apart from abandoning 32-bit apps, this is one of the major dislikes I have with Catalina (it is already weird enough on Mojave to look into the App Store for app updates and then the system perferences for OS updates).


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## hdsmile (Oct 31, 2019)

I upgraded all my system to latest Catalina 10.15.1 until everything works just fine, Logic, Kontakt 6, Vienna Ensemble etc...


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## Ashermusic (Oct 31, 2019)

It appears that most software that is already installed continues to work. New installation mostly seems to be the issue.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Oct 31, 2019)

Dewdman42 said:


> you might want to check out *PLEX*.



Looks pretty good, but I don't want to deal with another thing in the car (i.e. on my iPhone, connected to a lighter charger/FM broadcaster).

On a computer, iTunes does suck, but you're sitting in front of the screen and not worrying about getting nasty dents in your car when you hit pedestrians.


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 31, 2019)

How does iTunes help you in the car? And I agree plex is not the right solution for when you’re driving. Myself I just have an iPod and unfortunately I suffer through iTunes for syncing it, but not often because it’s a PITA.

unfortunately Apple is probably going to reduce our ability to manage a device like that including our iPhone because now they want us all to subscribe to Apple Music instead


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## Virtuoso (Oct 31, 2019)

I just don't see any compelling reason to switch from Mojave to Catalina.

- Updates to minor apps like Notes, Reminders, Find my Friends/Phone, Screen Time? I don't care.
- Sidecar? Might be useful for Photoshop, but I have a Wacom tablet anyway.

On the negative side, some major apps that I depend on like Aperture (where I have 10 years of photos), ScanSnap and Final Draft (which I don't want to update), will cease to work. And I'm sure there will be unexpected issues for a few months with other critical apps while problems are ironed out.

I'm still hanging on to my iMac from 2014 and I REALLY want a new Mac Pro or iMac Pro, but the Catalina requirement is is a major sticking point.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Oct 31, 2019)

Dewdman42 said:


> How does iTunes help you in the car?



It's just called Music on the iPhone. Their app for playing music.


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## Dewdman42 (Oct 31, 2019)

technically speaking, the iPhone Music app is entirely separate from iTunes. You can copy your music files to your iPhone a number of different ways, though the only way officially supported by Apple is through iTunes. once its on your iPhone, iTunes has nothing to do with anything. But I don't understand your comment about albums, because my iPhone music app can play by album....

The real annoyance it sounds like you were complaining about, and I don't disgree, is that iTunes sync is a train wreck and I agree. Like I said, there are some other apps out there you can use to load up your iPhone with songs....,. I personally just suffer through iTunes sync as infrequently as possible so I can't make any reccomendations.


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## jonnybutter (Nov 1, 2019)

scoringdreams said:


> iTunes is indeed a horrible mess. Not sure if anyone experiences this, but iTunes messes up my meta-data tags every single time I attempt to re-tag them; just because the Apple Music Gracenote meta-data catalogue is viewed as absolute. Can't wait to see how the new music application would fair...
> 
> Any guesses how long developers would take to get software playing nice with Catalina OS?



iTunes has been a mess for years and years. I think it's been a mess for longer than it ever wasn't a mess.

I've been waiting about a year to move to new mac OSes, even if all my stuff is theoretically compatible before that, and there hasn't been much downside. I don't use my music rig for much of anything other than music production, so I just never have to open iTunes. (iTunes does auto-launch on my wife's Air when she plugs the iPad into it - you have to opt OUT of that happening. gee Thanks Apple.) 

I think Apple keeps you on a tighter OS leash on the video side, but thankfully that doesn't affect me so much anymore. Nor many other people since FCPX is now an also-ran in the video editing world. But then there's Motion. 

Just wait.


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## paulmatthew (Nov 1, 2019)

The last update of Mojave has fixed major issues for me. I'm staying put as long as I can.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 1, 2019)

jonnybutter said:


> iTunes has been a mess for years and years



That's right, and it was really good at first. Apple is brilliant at user interfaces, but when they screw up - as in this case - it's invariably because they're being user-patronizing rather than -friendly.


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## hdsmile (Nov 1, 2019)

I like speedy on Catalina finally my Slave is also with Catalina on board Asus Z10PE-D16 WS /2x Xeon E5+128gb DDR4 Ram / SSD's 970 Pro M.2 and all of my music Software: Logic Pro X, UAD drivers, Isotope and many other plugins, NI Kontakt, etc... just works fine on Catalina no problems at all


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## tmhuud (Nov 1, 2019)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> That's right, and it was really good at first. Apple is brilliant at user interfaces, but when they screw up - as in this case - it's invariably because they're being user-patronizing rather than -friendly.


It’s so bad now. All of my playlist icons are scrambled. I wish they would fix that. As far as Catalina, I doubt MOTU will update their audio interfaces anytime soon. I have to check but iirc , MOJAVE is still not 100% copacetic w/MOTU.


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## WaveRider (Nov 1, 2019)

Ever since Steve Jobs passed, Apple is a runaway train....

Sad and scary, but true.

The problem is, what are the alternatives?


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## paulmatthew (Nov 2, 2019)

WaveRider said:


> Ever since Steve Jobs passed, Apple is a runaway train....
> 
> Sad and scary, but true.
> 
> The problem is, what are the alternatives?


I think a lot of us Mac users feel the same way. While I love my Mac and using it for music , I can't help but think that Apple is pushing themselves into a corner. Melda Production actually has a page setup to try to persuade Mac users to switch to PC. It seems that developers are fed up with Apple.
https://www.meldaproduction.com/text-tutorials/switching-from-osx-to-windows


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## Ashermusic (Nov 2, 2019)

I m a Logic Pro user and the DAW is more important to me than the platform. Also, I use an iPhone and an iPad. So I am a Mac user.


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## JohnG (Nov 2, 2019)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> Hard no.



Letterkenny fan, Nick?

Also a "hard no" from me.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 2, 2019)

JohnG said:


> Letterkenny fan, Nick?
> 
> Also a "hard no" from me.



I hadn't heard about Letterkenny! Is it good?


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## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 2, 2019)

Dewdman42 said:


> How does iTunes help you in the car? And I agree plex is not the right solution for when you’re driving. Myself I just have an iPod and unfortunately I suffer



iTunes is just called Music in iOS now. I have a $10 thing from ebay that plugs into the iPhone's Lightning port and charges it while transmitting the audio to your FM radio.

(My car is 15 years old, predating Bluetooth.)


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## JohnG (Nov 2, 2019)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> I hadn't heard about Letterkenny! Is it good?



Letterkenny is superb. Pretty light on production values.


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## tmhuud (Nov 2, 2019)

Ashermusic said:


> I m a Logic Pro user and the DAW is more important to me than the platform. Also, I use an iPhone and an iPad. So I am a Mac user.



Lol Jay. You made me think of the AA intros. Hi, I'm Jay and I'm a mac addict (er- user).


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## dflood (Nov 2, 2019)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> Apple is usually great at software, but iTunes... oy gevalt.


If you think it’s bad on a Mac you should try it on a Windows machine. Every time I fire up that machine, Apple has pushed out yet another update requiring a full reboot. Then it usually hangs while checking the library. So I mostly just play downloaded songs with Media Player pointed to my iTunes library.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Nov 2, 2019)

dflood said:


> you should try it on a Windows machine



No thanks!


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## dflood (Nov 2, 2019)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> No thanks!


It really is the worst of both worlds.


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## dflood (Nov 2, 2019)

I’m not sure Catalina will bring anything noticeably better to my 2013 iMac, so I’ll just wait patiently till I get the all clear from my software vendors, particularly Native Instruments.


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## danbo (Nov 3, 2019)

Really annoying that they now have a nag indicator in System Preferences "Upgrade to Catalina". That kind of insistence is poor UI design Apple.


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## jbuhler (Nov 3, 2019)

danbo said:


> Really annoying that they now have a nag indicator in System Preferences "Upgrade to Catalina". That kind of insistence is poor UI design Apple.


You can turn the notifications off in terminal: https://macreports.com/how-to-turn-off-catalina-update-notifications-prompts-badges/


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## Zedcars (Nov 3, 2019)

I nearly always wait 1 year for the dust to settle for major macOS upgrades. Seems like Catalina could break lots of things I use, so why go through the hassle?


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## jbuhler (Nov 3, 2019)

Zedcars said:


> I nearly always wait 1 year for the dust to settle. Seems like one of those 'upgrades' where lots of things could break, so why go through the hassle?


I have a lot of software that won’t run on the new system and another set that will require paid upgrades. Mojave is very stable for me, so I’ll stay put until something I need requires the new system. Then I’ll face the complications.


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## prodigalson (Nov 13, 2019)

I need to replace my MacBook Pro and now the only non 13-inch machine available (other than buying used or refurbished) forces me to use Catalina. 

So far the additional anticipated cost of updating to Catalina for me is $300 and I’m still assessing.

Finale v26 - $149
Sibelius v2019 - $149

Both companies have announced they won’t be providing support for Catalina for any versions before the very latest version and charge those prices for upgrading. And unfortunately for my work I need both. 

I think it is absolutely unconscionable for developers to charge such extreme upgrade fees just so users can keep using their software AT ALL. I’m happy with the versions I’m on. Both work great and don’t feel any desire to upgrade. However, now I need to pay $300 just so the software I already paid for will continue to work at all.

I understand they can’t keep supporting legacy versions but how about ONE version before the latest? I just paid to upgrade this software within the last two years. 

It’s criminal and makes me long for the day I can abandon AVID and MakeMusic completely


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## jonnybutter (Nov 14, 2019)

prodigalson said:


> It’s criminal and makes me long for the day I can abandon AVID and MakeMusic completely



I wouldn't send $300 to AVID and MakeMusic. I am typing this on a refurbished MBP which I don't plan on replacing with a new one anytime soon, if ever. I've had very good luck with refurbished macs, esp the older MBPs. They are built like tanks.

Here's hoping you can move to Dorico (cross-grade for less than $300) sooner rather than later. That's what I will do when the time comes.


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## prodigalson (Nov 14, 2019)

I


jonnybutter said:


> I wouldn't send $300 to AVID and MakeMusic. I am typing this on a refurbished MBP which I don't plan on replacing with a new one anytime soon, if ever. I've had very good luck with refurbished macs, esp the older MBPs. They are built like tanks.
> 
> Here's hoping you can move to Dorico (cross-grade for less than $300) sooner rather than later. That's what I will do when the time comes.



I do actually use Dorico and love it. However, I work in an industry where I have to collaborate via notation daily and Finale (and to a lesser extent Sibelius) still dominate. Unfortunately continuing to use Finale or Sibelius is an absolute necessity


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## robgb (Nov 15, 2019)

The question I have is why? What benefit is there to upgrading to Catalina? I see none at this point. So I'll hold off until there is one.


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## Ashermusic (Nov 16, 2019)

robgb said:


> The question I have is why? What benefit is there to upgrading to Catalina? I see none at this point. So I'll hold off until there is one.



The appeal for Me is to lose the hot bloated mess that is iTunes.


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## Dewdman42 (Nov 16, 2019)

My advice is find third party alternatives for tools like that.


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## Ashermusic (Nov 16, 2019)

Dewdman42 said:


> My advice is find third party alternatives for tools like that.



I did for a while but I think it is risky.


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## Dewdman42 (Nov 16, 2019)

What is risky?


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## Ashermusic (Nov 16, 2019)

Losing music you bought from Apple.


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## Dewdman42 (Nov 16, 2019)

Oic. I myself boycotted the Apple iTunes Store from the minute it opened so I don’t have any purchased music from there, lucky me. But are the downloaded files just standalone playable files you can play in just about any player?


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## Ashermusic (Nov 16, 2019)

Dewdman42 said:


> Oic. I myself boycotted the Apple iTunes Store from the minute it opened so I don’t have any purchased music from there, lucky me. But are the downloaded files just standalone playable files you can play in just about any player?



Yes but most of them are in iCloud.


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## Dewdman42 (Nov 16, 2019)

Well me personally I’d get a copy of them from iCloud and save it somewhere safe just like you would if you bought the cd’s. Then no risk. You might be losing some convenience though. If iTunes is the only way you can stream the music they are remembering for you in their cloud.

but check out tidal and other similar solutions. There are lots of alternatives. I’m sure glad I’m not beholden to Apple to keep having to buy a new Mac so I can play the music I previously bought. Wow.


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## Ashermusic (Nov 16, 2019)

Dewdman42 said:


> Well me personally I’d get a copy of them from iCloud and save it somewhere safe just like you would if you bought the cd’s. Then no risk. You might be losing some convenience though. If iTunes is the only way you can stream the music they are remembering for you in their cloud.
> 
> but check out tidal and other similar solutions. There are lots of alternatives. I’m sure glad I’m not beholden to Apple to keep having to buy a new Mac so I can play the music I previously bought. Wow.




I have no problem being beholden to Apple, I just hate iTunes


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## Wunderhorn (Nov 16, 2019)

Ashermusic said:


> I have no problem being beholden to Apple, I just hate iTunes



No need to jump to Catalina just because of iTunes... Do yourself a favor and check out Swinsian. Best offline music player, hands down. It acts just like the iTunes from the (g)olden times and handles large collections with ease and speed. Oh, and it actually can play surround flacs...


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## edhamilton (Nov 16, 2019)

Ashermusic said:


> The appeal for Me is to lose the hot bloated mess that is iTunes.


Jay, please stop saying this. My neck is hurting because I involuntarily and vigorously nod in agreement with you each time I read it.


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## robgb (Nov 16, 2019)

Ashermusic said:


> The appeal for Me is to lose the hot bloated mess that is iTunes.


I use Tiny Player, so iTunes isn't an issue for me.


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## ashura (Dec 15, 2019)

Hi, guys I was dumb enough to jump right away to Catalina, I am trying to install Kontakt but unsuccessful. What are my options? .... Pura Vida from Costa Rica!


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## dflood (Dec 15, 2019)

ashura said:


> Hi, guys I was dumb enough to jump right away to Catalina, I am trying to install Kontakt but unsuccessful. What are my options? .... Pura Vida from Costa Rica!


I just did the Catalina update last night. I haven’t checked everything thoroughly, but no problems with my preexisting installation of Kontakt 6 so far. Make sure you have the latest update of Kontakt 6.


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## ashura (Dec 15, 2019)

dflood said:


> I just did the Catalina update last night. I haven’t checked everything thoroughly, but no problems with my preexisting installation of Kontakt 6 so far. Make sure you have the latest update of Kontakt 6.



Worked! Thank you so much!


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