# Trailers again, my first synth, Zebra or Omnisphere 2?



## Valérie_D (Oct 7, 2015)

Ok so, discussed to death I know, but I'm late to the game Omnisphere 2 or Zebra for trailers?


----------



## Rctec (Oct 7, 2015)

Both


----------



## sleepy hollow (Oct 7, 2015)

So much for that.

Move along folks, nothing to see here (anymore).


----------



## Valérie_D (Oct 7, 2015)

Haha, thanks Hans.


----------



## chimuelo (Oct 7, 2015)

First rule of Government Spending.
Why have one when you have two for twice the price.


----------



## kunst91 (Oct 7, 2015)

Valérie_D said:


> Ok so, discussed to death I know, but I'm late to the game Omnisphere 2 or Zebra for trailers?



Both (+diva!)


----------



## AlexandreSafi (Oct 7, 2015)

I'd suggest getting the one you feel you'll get the most from! Put in your hours studying what all your own sense of pros & cons are for these 2 beasts, seek every recommendations you can find on the web, here, Youtube, do lots of it! Slow and deep will help you triumph over the risk of insatisfaction! It's like choosing a woman, or a man i'd assume in your case... after enough time, you just know better! But yes in this case, i too would recommend eventually Polygamy! And with synths it usually becomes a harem! I think you'd be in safer hands with the immediacy you get with Omnisphere 2, BUT btw, try Zebra in demo mode of course, but again always put your hours in...
-A.-


----------



## kunst91 (Oct 7, 2015)

AlexandreSafi said:


> I'd suggest getting the one you feel you'll get the most from! Put in your hours studying what all your own sense of pros & cons are for these 2 beasts, seek every recommendations you can find on the web, here, Youtube, do lots of it! Slow and deep will help you triumph over the risk of insatisfaction! It's like choosing a woman, or a man i'd assume in your case... after enough time, you just know better! But yes in this case, i too would recommend eventually Polygamy! And with synths it usually becomes a harem! I think you'd be in safer hands with the immediacy you get with Omnisphere 2, BUT btw, try Zebra in demo mode of course, but again always put your hours in...
> -A.-



I actually think the immediacy of omnisphere can hinder the long-term creative process. Often one tends to "rely" on the omnisphere presets and avoid actually learning the inner workings of the synthesizer, at least that's what happened to me until I got into Zebra and Diva! (although one can surely make the same case for HZ's presents in Dark Zebra).

Omnisphere is still great though, so I remain firmly in the both/all three camp!


----------



## Guy Rowland (Oct 7, 2015)

FWIW...

Omnisphere 2. While Zebra has specific depths that many love to mine and sounds incredible, IMO all the broad territory you'll need to cover is there in Omni, while the reverse isn't the case imo. It's also much, much, much quicker to work with when getting started - although Spectrasonics made the tags way too overcomplicated in Omni 2, it's still pretty quick to use musically meaningful terms, for example. Need a warm sound? Disturbing? Pure? Aggressive? They're there by name and a click away, and it's easier than ever to put your own stamp on it by editing, morphing with other sounds, or rolling the dice on the Orb. By contrast, Zebra's browser is... well, very 1981, like all U-he's browsers. It's a synth for programmers - which many love of course, but you need to be aware of that going in.

As for getting deeper in it with editing or programming from scratch, I very much like the Omni approach too - it doesn't try to emulate hardware, it plays to a computer's strengths instead. It's a myth still propagated by some that Omni is just as preset machine, and it couldn't be further from the truth. 

But Zebra is cheaper....


----------



## Daniel James (Oct 7, 2015)

I think you will get alot more mileage out of Omnisphere 2 for what you are looking to do. The built in synth engine can get nice and aggressive these days. Plus all the extra sample based content and ability to import your own samples if you want to get extra creative. Also unless you are already familiar with how synths work already to a pretty advanced level you wont be getting out of Zebra what sets it apart from other synths.

-DJ


----------



## playz123 (Oct 7, 2015)

Tough, tough call...and who can argue with Mr. Zimmer.  How much do enjoy tweaking sounds? Probably a lot more bang for the buck ready-to-go sounds in Omnisphere, that can then be tweaked if one wishes. Zebra, on the other hand, is probably more for those who like to tweak and program (sorry Guy, just saw you said the same thing)...and yes, it is less expensive. Omnisphere though has been in the forefront for a very long time, and just has so much to offer, that I guess, if I had to choose only one, that would it.


----------



## AlexandreSafi (Oct 7, 2015)

kunst91 said:


> I actually think the immediacy of omnisphere can hinder the long-term creative process. Often one tends to "rely" on the omnisphere presets and avoid actually learning the inner workings of the synthesizer



Which is why I trust Valerie to know herself & her own work better than anyone, that's key to every choice one makes, and here "how" you use these magnificent tools! 
You do make a very good point Kunst91 which is not repeated enough though! 
_Know thy skills or lack of..._

James Newton Howard & Thomas Newman use loads of Omni presets, but i'm always amazed at how still amazing those sound integrations can be when not used randomly! I love those earlier & timeless "Atmostphere" Sounds by Eric Persing, and BTW he would probably rightfully come in and remind everyone that Omnisphere is a REAL synth for sound design, so again, it's back to the individual, his/her aesthetic and his/her deep-observation skills that will make all the difference! U-he has a reputation for making some of the "deepest-nerdiest-yet-friendly" synth capabilities you can find on the market! Both are great investments! Synthesis wise, i think u-he products have the edge! Omnisphere, i feel has the "all-in-one: heavy electronic to-organic-acoustic" sound at your fingertips" edge! 
_-Know thyself-_
-A.-


----------



## Vastman (Oct 7, 2015)

Omnisphere 2, without question.... I own a huge raft of vsts and if I had to give up O2 or most of my other sound engines I would choose to keep O2...I agree with Guy... additionally, Omnisphere2 is just HUGE... endlessly modifyable and as deap as you might ever want to go or as simple and quick as you may need... it is, in my humble opinion the best, single sound package created to date...and I've spent most of my discretionary income over the past couple decades acquiring them... I can't imagine using Z2 as a main trailer synth... I have both Z2 and the HZ Dark Zebra... love them both but there is just NO COMPARISON to the depth and breadth of the instruments.

I have all Uhe...and love Urs... Zebra is very dated, soon to be replaced with a new not-compatible version and while powerful, you'll sink a lot of time into each patch...

Suggest you spend some time on Skippie's website... he has done a lot of vids and work with O2... far more than ANYONE ELSE ON THE PLANET...and you'll learn a lot... don't miss the "airwave" walk thru... it will blow your mind what can be done with O2...this will be the best time you could spend to get a flavor of the power and depth of O2... there are many more Guru vids on O2 than I listed...

BTW, the only engine I would also retain if I could have two is Kontakt... although it requires an endless purchase of sound packages... I've spent _*many *_thousands on such packs... with O2 you get so much in one very flexible, multitimbral instrument...the most amazing combination sample synthesis engine ever devised.





list of vids: https://www.youtube.com/user/thepluginguru/videos


----------



## InLight-Tone (Oct 7, 2015)

I say both as well, but I love Zebra for which I have purchased a huge number of presets including Mr. Zimmers excellent Dark Zebra series; it covers such a huge range of the audio spectrum and synthesis types I hardly look at other VST's, though Reaktor 6 has piqued my interest with it's blocks upgrade and Euro rack approach...


----------



## Vastman (Oct 7, 2015)

AlexandreSafi said:


> Which is why I trust Valerie to know herself & her own work better than anyone, that's key to every choice one makes, and here "how" you use these magnificent tools!
> You do make a very good point Kunst91 which is not repeated enough though!
> _Know thy skills or lack of..._
> 
> ...


very good thoughts... I think what sets O2 apart is that while it includes a HUGE array of absolutely beautiful and stunningly crafted sample sets (covering the entire range of music), it also includes one of the deepest and broadest collection of synthesis engines which are packaged in a user friendly GUI... The GUI is just exquisite...as simple or deep as you might want to go...Wrap that all up in a fantastic collection of "effects" and you have pretty much a one shop platform of sound effects, instruments, rhythmic pulses, and...whatever you can imagine; resulting in things no other vst can achieve... I could get lost in just playing the guitars....forever! Eric and his team are a gift to any aspiring artist desiring a collection of tools that will take them pretty much anywhere they might want to go...

BTW, you can download Zebra and try it out... that is the nice thing about Uhe... I do love the HZ dark zebra package but for trailer stuff... imo you'll get way more milage from O2 as ur first purchase.


----------



## doctornine (Oct 7, 2015)

What that HZ bloke said. +1 and all that ….


----------



## Ollie (Oct 7, 2015)

My vote would have to go with Omnisphere. 

I'm not sure how familiar you are with general synth programming but I feel it's very visual, easy to understand and it's the synth I learnt the basics on.

The best of both worlds, with a plethora of presets/soundsources and the tools to create the sounds in your head with little hassle.


----------



## kunst91 (Oct 7, 2015)

AlexandreSafi said:


> Which is why I trust Valerie to know herself & her own work better than anyone, that's key to every choice one makes, and here "how" you use these magnificent tools!
> You do make a very good point Kunst91 which is not repeated enough though!
> _Know thy skills or lack of..._
> 
> ...



I can only speak from my limited experience in trailers. In this case the u-he stuff works better for me and my writing process, but then again I have only written for almost purely "electronic" releases. People create fantastic music for films, trailers, TV, documentaries, etc. with omnisphere, zebra, diva, reaktor, kontakt, the list goes on. As Alexandre said, what's most important is what fits your process.

For me understanding synthesis was the "key" in unlocking sound design (and when it comes to synthesis Urs is king!) but omnisphere 2 is still an essential part of my toolkit


----------



## synthpunk (Oct 7, 2015)

Valerie, Think of it as two different colors on the palette to use. Also, the Zebra HZ version is worth the extra IMO, and gives you good taste of Diva filters, check out the demo's on the U-he page. I would say Omni2 is more versatile and ready to roll, Zebra has more personality and sound design possibilities but both are allot of fun. If you happen to use Logic X, Alchemy can be very useful, then do not get me started about Serum


----------



## Rctec (Oct 7, 2015)

...actually, rather than being flippant, and just saying "both", let me explain my reasoning a bit... I think they are very different beasts, obviously. But both synths will inspire you to learn (I hope!) how to create your own sounds. Your question was very narrow and specific, wanting to only know what was the right tool for 'Trailer-music'. But I don't think you'll be spending the rest of your life writing for trailers, and both these synth open up the possibilities of really learning how to program, and therefore give you a life-long basis of inspiration and musical adventure (...and I'd put 'Serum' into the mix as well...).
You have two ways of dealing with synths these days: hunt through the presets, or treat them with the same seriousness you've treated learning your piano. There is some instant gratification that comes with all synth, but a good bit of head-scratching and exploring weird and daunting territory is ultimately much more satisfying. There is something fun about not just having written the music, but actually made your own sounds that bring that music to live.
On a side-note, I noticed a trend - no, it's more like an epidemic - at Remote Control (probably started by JunkiXL...) of all the composers investing heavily in new analog modular synth. There is a whole new music happening and it's very exciting! ...and, to circle back 'round to your original question: there is a clarity and sonic power - and not just in the bass-frequencies - that comes from some of these systems that no virtual instrument can quite do yet.
...and then there is the new N.I. Reaktor, which looks really great!
Confused? I hope so!

-Hz-


----------



## kunst91 (Oct 7, 2015)

Rctec said:


> ...actually, rather than being flippant, and just saying "both", let me explain my reasoning a bit... I think they are very different beasts, obviously. But both synths will inspire you to learn (I hope!) how to create your own sounds. Your question was very narrow and specific, wanting to only know what was the right tool for 'Trailer-music'. But I don't think you'll be spending the rest of your life writing for trailers, and both these synth open up the possibilities of really learning how to program, and therefore give you a life-long basis of inspiration and musical adventure (...and I'd put 'Serum' into the mix as well...).
> You have two ways of dealing with synths these days: hunt through the presets, or treat them with the same seriousness you've treated learning your piano. There is some instant gratification that comes with all synth, but a good bit of head-scratching and exploring weird and daunting territory is ultimately much more satisfying. There is something fun about not just having written the music, but actually made your own sounds that bring that music to live.
> On a side-note, I noticed a trend - no, it's more like an epidemic - at Remote Control (probably started by JunkiXL...) of all the composers investing heavily in new analog modular synth. There is a whole new music happening and it's very exciting! ...and, to circle back 'round to your original question: there is a clarity and sonic power - and not just in the bass-frequencies - that comes from some of these systems that no virtual instrument can quite do yet.
> ...and then there is the new N.I. Reaktor, which looks really great!
> ...



Reaktor 6 is very exciting indeed, especially after looking at what a decent analog modular system would cost!


----------



## kurtvanzo (Oct 7, 2015)

Guy Rowland said:


> FWIW...
> 
> Omnisphere 2. While Zebra has specific depths that many love to mine and sounds incredible, IMO all the broad territory you'll need to cover is there in Omni, while the reverse isn't the case imo. It's also much, much, much quicker to work with when getting started - although Spectrasonics made the tags way too overcomplicated in Omni 2, it's still pretty quick to use musically meaningful terms, for example. Need a warm sound? Disturbing? Pure? Aggressive? They're there by name and a click away, and it's easier than ever to put your own stamp on it by editing, morphing with other sounds, or rolling the dice on the Orb. By contrast, Zebra's browser is... well, very 1981, like all U-he's browsers. It's a synth for programmers - which many love of course, but you need to be aware of that going in.
> 
> ...



+1 Omni 2 first- check out the unfinished patches for Omni as well- best investment for trailer or soundtrack work. Omni also is easier to learn how to tweak, then when you want to expand -go for the others. 

Horizon 1-4 are excellent (£20 each). http://www.theunfinished.co.uk/shop-items/omnisphere-horizon/


----------



## AlexandreSafi (Oct 7, 2015)

Rctec said:


> ...actually, rather than being flippant, and just saying "both", let me explain my reasoning a bit... I think they are very different beasts, obviously. But both synths will inspire you to learn (I hope!) how to create your own sounds. Your question was very narrow and specific, wanting to only know what was the right tool for 'Trailer-music'. But I don't think you'll be spending the rest of your life writing for trailers, and both these synth open up the possibilities of really learning how to program, and therefore give you a life-long basis of inspiration and musical adventure (...and I'd put 'Serum' into the mix as well...).
> You have two ways of dealing with synths these days: hunt through the presets, or treat them with the same seriousness you've treated learning your piano. There is some instant gratification that comes with all synth, but a good bit of head-scratching and exploring weird and daunting territory is ultimately much more satisfying. There is something fun about not just having written the music, but actually made your own sounds that bring that music to live.
> On a side-note, I noticed a trend - no, it's more like an epidemic - at Remote Control (probably started by JunkiXL...) of all the composers investing heavily in new analog modular synth. There is a whole new music happening and it's very exciting! ...and, to circle back 'round to your original question: there is a clarity and sonic power - and not just in the bass-frequencies - that comes from some of these systems that no virtual instrument can quite do yet.
> ...and then there is the new N.I. Reaktor, which looks really great!
> ...


Great advice H.! You've changed u-he's future and a lot of musicians's lives since you mentioned both Zebra & Inception in the same sentence! If I may dare ask: What is it about Omnisphere 2 that changed your mind into getting it, and how does it fit in your workflow now?


----------



## rJames (Oct 7, 2015)

I love Zebra. I've owned it since just after it was announced thanks to Ned. (not going to attempt his last name)
But if you are buying just one... Omni. IMHO its a lot easier to program. And it is full of presets to start you on a path to learning how to program. (always tweak to make it do something special for your cue)


----------



## Valérie_D (Oct 7, 2015)

Thanks Hans, yes of course I won't do trailers for ever, I am just starting out this new venue and trying to stick at something. I am used to playing around with sounds, coming from an electroacoustic background, but not so much with synths besides Cecilia which is great and open-source but a bit annoying tu use at times. Maybe my questions should have been which synths do you find the most intuitive and inspiring to use, presets and custom sounds possibilities included.


----------



## Rctec (Oct 7, 2015)

AlexandreSafi said:


> Great advice H.! You've changed u-he's future and a lot of musicians's lives since you mentioned both Zebra & Inception in the same sentence! If I may dare ask: What is it about Omnisphere 2 that changed your mind into getting it, and how does it fit in your workflow now?


I still don't use it, but I just bought it last week! I just didn't really need it, but I want to spend some solid time exploring that and Reaktor 6 for my next project....


----------



## Rctec (Oct 7, 2015)

Valérie_D said:


> Thanks Hans, yes of course I won't do trailers for ever, I am just starting out this new venue and trying to stick at something. I am used to playing around with sounds, coming from an electroacoustic background, but not so much with synths besides Cecilia which is great and open-source but a bit annoying tu use at times. Maybe my questions should have been which synths do you find the most intuitive and inspiring to use, presets and custom sounds possibilities included.


I started on an EMS VCS III, which came without a keyboard or an instruction manual. But I had spent every penny I had on the damn thing, so I had to learn it! And once you can get something out of that beast, everything else is pretty self-explanatory (there is a Synthi 100 going for 70k on eBay at the moment. Good luck ! )
But really, my dilemma with most synth these days that there are too many presets. By the time I listened - and learned - how to use all of those, I might as well have learned how to program from scratch... But than, conversely, on something like "Diva", you get presets for synth Templates (of course, you can do that with any synth) which makes starting out much more efficient....


----------



## AlexandreSafi (Oct 7, 2015)

Rctec said:


> I still don't use it, but I just bought it last week! I just didn't really need it, but I want to spend some solid time exploring that and Reaktor 6 for my next project....


Thank you for that reply, I thought i might ask since I also heard a few sounds, like that Glass harp Preset you seemed to be fond of from "Spectrasonics-Atmosphere" such as in your N.Myers "Something's Gotta Give" score, that's how geeky i can get! 
Best to you Hans! 
-A.-


----------



## tmm (Oct 7, 2015)

Zebra / HZ was my first soft synth, and I love it. That said, I'm writing a lot right now... I have nearly all the soft synths available, and I find myself reaching for 3 of them WAY more than the rest:
- Bazille - for those interesting, massively modulating, ethereal tones
- Serum - for hyper clean, crisp, modern tones (and for sample integration)
- Diva - for everything else

I choose these over all the other options because a) they all have phenomenal sound quality, and b) I can get what I'm looking for faster than with any other soft synths. I don't know if that's just because their workflows match the way I think, or if they're actually easier to work with.

Another bit of food for thought - adding a high quality effects suite on top of any one of these synths massively expands your palette without you needing to learn a new instrument. For example, adding the SoundToys Native Effects bundle to any one of these synths is like multiplying your possible sound and modulation capabilities x5, x10, etc. I use at least one of the ST plugins in just about everything I write.


----------



## Valérie_D (Oct 7, 2015)

[QUOTE="Rctec, post: 3901032, (there is a Synthi 100 going for 70k on eBay at the moment. Good luck ! )
....[/QUOTE]

So with no flying pigs in sight, I decided to pass on the 70k Synthi 
Knowing myself, I will probably end up with Omni, Diva and Zebra in the next year, and yes, learning to program is always satisfying, thanks for chiming in Hans.


----------



## Zhao Shen (Oct 7, 2015)

Rctec said:


> I noticed a trend - no, it's more like an epidemic - at Remote Control (probably started by JunkiXL...)


Hahahahaha!! So good to see the teasing camaraderie


----------



## Rctec (Oct 7, 2015)

One other thought: we didn't really think about this when we gave Urs (U-He) our presets for 'The Dark Zebra', but what makes them different is that they sit really well in a track - because that's how they where made, as part of a piece of music. So they organically fit in and around other instruments. Most presets are made to show off the synth, so they have to sound great and amazing in isolation. But that is usually the problem: they are too shiny, too "opinionated", take up too much sonic space to actually play nice in the context of a production or an arrangement...


----------



## Ryan (Oct 8, 2015)

Hi
Very interesting thread. Since I got Zebra2 and put it on a slave-PC I haven't used my moogs or my DSI since. The ability to really dig under the hood and create sounds with Zebra is fun. I've done things on Zebra that sounds insane but again beautiful in the right context. What's important to me is the "direct" opportunity to create a sound while I'm composing. If I hear something in my head that could have fit the score, I need to get it out as fast as possible. Zebra is a cool toy!
I haven't tried Diva and Omni2 yet. They are most likely very good! all off the synths and vst's got their own strengths and 

Best
Ryan


----------



## Christof (Oct 8, 2015)

I own and use both Zebra and Omnisphere, but what drives me crazy in Omnisphere 2 is the vast amount of presets and sound sources, literally thousands.
So it can happen that you spend hours navigating through the sound browser (which is very good structured) looking for what you need.
Once you have found a sound that pleases your ears and fits well into your piece you still have this very strange feeling that there may be some hundreds of similar sounds in this beast that may sound even better.


----------



## X-Bassist (Oct 8, 2015)

Christof said:


> I own and use both Zebra and Omnisphere, but what drives me crazy in Omnisphere 2 is the vast amount of presets and sound sources, literally thousands.
> So it can happen that you spend hours navigating through the sound browser (which is very good structured) looking for what you need.
> Once you have found a sound that pleases your ears and fits well into your piece you still have this very strange feeling that there may be some hundreds of similar sounds in this beast that may sound even better.



I think this is why it's good to spend some time with Omni and use the rating system. Took me a few long days to get through all the presets, but now my five star favorites come up first and I have an idea of what's in there- it also weeds out sounds I'm 99 percent sure I won't use (a decent amount) and makes scoring with it faster on a deadline.


----------



## Baron Greuner (Oct 8, 2015)

First synthesizer I bought was in 1971 and a Mini Moog. Cost about 850 quid. Could buy a house for that then. Not a very good house I agree, but try living in a Moog. Never stayed in tune. The VCS3 didn't come with a keyboard which was no good to me, coming from a piano and Hammond background through the 60s. Kind of synth that would appeal to sound guys like Hans and Brian Eno to name but a small few.

If I was getting a soft synth today and could only get the one for the purposes stated thus far, I would get Omnisphere probably. But if I was getting synth, I would look at maybe the Prophet 6 or the the Moog Sub 37 and use them to get a hands on feel of synthesisers in general.


----------



## Guy Rowland (Oct 8, 2015)

Christof said:


> I own and use both Zebra and Omnisphere, but what drives me crazy in Omnisphere 2 is the vast amount of presets and sound sources, literally thousands.
> So it can happen that you spend hours navigating through the sound browser (which is very good structured) looking for what you need.
> Once you have found a sound that pleases your ears and fits well into your piece you still have this very strange feeling that there may be some hundreds of similar sounds in this beast that may sound even better.



I've never really got the whole "nightmare of 10,000 patches". It's rather like complaining about the internet because "I'd never get through it all". The point of a system like Spectrasonics' is not to start on Monday morning on patch 1 and catalogue each one til you emerge a fortnight later like the creature from the black lagoon.

I never star rate patches. Each time I approach the synth I'm looking for something new. While the tagging in Omni 2 has got way out of hand, some of the other tools at least partially compensate. It's fascinating to find a patch quickly that is close, then sound lock all, sound match and start getting new textures into your sound from similarish patches. And of course thats just one of many options... some people don't use patches at all, and good luck to them. It's one of the real joys of the synth that I guess almost everyone works with it differently. With most other synths, you don't get that luxury of choice.


----------



## catsass (Oct 8, 2015)

Guy Rowland said:


> creature from the black lagoon.


Or from the unfinished tune.


----------



## Greg (Oct 8, 2015)

Just playing with Reaktor 6 now and wow... such inspiring software! Lots to learn


----------



## chimuelo (Oct 8, 2015)

The big standout Zebra2 has that no other VI synth I have tried has is those killer Looping Envelopes.

When folks use an Arpeggiator it's monophonic in nature.
Looping EGs/Envelopes allow one to hold down a Root/Note, then trigger notes above in rapid rhythms like Pete Townsend on the intro to Baba O'Riley.

I know, nobody cares, but analog synths using Looping EGs are just viscious and powerful.
Zebra2 does this very well and even allows me to do a filter sweep/wah-wah using an expression while playing the licks.

And when someone says Zebra2 is "dated" I remember hearing that about the MiniMoog in the 90s when I got a pair of SE-1s from Studio Electronics.
But fads in the virtual world have some relevance I suppose.
In the analog world, people just can't seem to escape it.


----------



## zvenx (Oct 8, 2015)

Rctec said:


> One other thought: we didn't really think about this when we gave Urs (U-He) our presets for 'The Dark Zebra', but what makes them different is that they sit really well in a track - because that's how they where made, as part of a piece of music. So they organically fit in and around other instruments. Most presets are made to show off the synth, so they have to sound great and amazing in isolation. But that is usually the problem: they are too shiny, too "opinionated", take up too much sonic space to actually play nice in the context of a production or an arrangement...




You know, and yes I am mostly a preset player (burn me at the stake ), that would be my biggest criticism of omnisphere presets in general....they do demand attention. And Zebra I took awhile to really 'get' and it is for that very same reason, it fits nicely in what else is going on, but by itself it didn't stand out as much.
rsp


----------



## synthpunk (Oct 8, 2015)

I believe rctec and team does pre programming sessions and sets a sonic goal before he starts a project, using that philosophy with complex instruments such as Omni, Zebra, etc. can go a long way IMHO in helping.


----------



## NYC Composer (Oct 8, 2015)

I want a team in my next life.

To the subject, Omni 1 is so vast I haven't quite imagined taking on Omni 2 yet, but I feel pretty synthed with Omni 1 and Komplete. FM8 is underutilized and not talked about enough-it has some excellent sounds. Reaktor is just insane, so is Absynth. Massive is pretty fabulous too. What a wealth of stuff.


----------



## Rctec (Oct 8, 2015)

chimuelo said:


> The big standout Zebra2 has that no other VI synth I have tried has is those killer Looping Envelopes.
> 
> When folks use an Arpeggiator it's monophonic in nature.
> Looping EGs/Envelopes allow one to hold down a Root/Note, then trigger notes above in rapid rhythms like Pete Townsend on the intro to Baba O'Riley.
> ...


Love the MSEGs!


----------



## Guy Rowland (Oct 8, 2015)

chimuelo said:


> And when someone says Zebra2 is "dated"



I don't think anyone in all history has called Zebra 2 dated (someone will prove me wrong now...). You might be confusing it with my comment about u-he's browsers being dated, which is a quite different and specific criticism. And those browsers sure are dated, along with at the very least 80% of all other soft synths, which all belong to a bygone era when tags were just something you put on your suitcase at the airport. U-he's specific quirk is to prefix (and thus arrange) all patches by author, something I find particularly obtuse.

If you don't use presets, of course none of this matters a jot.

In general it's a fair comment that many Omni sounds can be a bit over-hyped sonically. Stylus has a "simplify" control for its patterns (which is awesome), it might be a cute idea to do the same for Omni on the main tab for each patch, which progressively roll back some of the fx, mod routings, unisons etc. As it is, a lot of the fx and mod routings get turned off pretty quick.


----------



## Ivan Mayboroda (Oct 9, 2015)

Serum? Reaktor 6? Hans, are you going to release new EDM album and is your secret stage name - Deadmau5? Because he uses the same stuff.
BTW Deadmau5's last name is Zimmerman... coincidence?


----------



## dgburns (Oct 9, 2015)

Christof said:


> I own and use both Zebra and Omnisphere, but what drives me crazy in Omnisphere 2 is the vast amount of presets and sound sources, literally thousands.
> So it can happen that you spend hours navigating through the sound browser (which is very good structured) looking for what you need.
> Once you have found a sound that pleases your ears and fits well into your piece you still have this very strange feeling that there may be some hundreds of similar sounds in this beast that may sound even better.



I apologize if a bit off topic,but to add to your point(which I wholeheartedly agree with)

I really miss the old days of "sound diver",where you could create "libraries" which were collections of stuff,like patches combis whatever and list them in one doc as you wanted.
Now a days I find the menu systems of most synths so limiting in window size,in some cases,like Ni stuff(why can't we have a full screen menu??) or different tagging systems that are organized across all our synths?I thought kore was the answer,but they killed it in favour of Komplete,which I admit I've avoided,I'd rather go right to the synth and look for or make a sound.

I've also been playing with the new Midiquest app,but it's only for hardware synths.Wish there was a universal system out there.I use Midiquest mostly for the Virus TI as it can open the midifles you create in the plugin and collate your patches.

menu diving is the worst thing for creativity imho.yuk.


----------



## ryanstrong (Oct 9, 2015)

Rctec said:


> One other thought: we didn't really think about this when we gave Urs (U-He) our presets for 'The Dark Zebra', but what makes them different is that they sit really well in a track - because that's how they where made, as part of a piece of music. So they organically fit in and around other instruments. Most presets are made to show off the synth, so they have to sound great and amazing in isolation. But that is usually the problem: they are too shiny, too "opinionated", take up too much sonic space to actually play nice in the context of a production or an arrangement...


I wish more synth developers would take note of this. Can't stand wild presets. I mean some of them are fine but 90% of the time I take a preset and find ways to "tame" it.


----------



## Ivan Mayboroda (Oct 9, 2015)

ryanstrong said:


> I wish more synth developers would take note of this. Can't stand wild presets. I mean some of them are fine but 90% of the time I take a preset and find ways to "tame" it.


ye its like trying to stop a loudness war. good luck with that.


----------



## Daniel James (Oct 9, 2015)

ryanstrong said:


> I wish more synth developers would take note of this. Can't stand wild presets. I mean some of them are fine but 90% of the time I take a preset and find ways to "tame" it.



I have always seen synth presets as a learning tool, looking through how they made it crazy and how I can apply that technique to my own patches....fill in some analogy of giving a man a fish and teaching him here. So yeah I wouldn't want the preset designers to make their presets any less flashy than they do, because they are not only showing me what the synth is capible of when turned up to 11 but also giving me a manual on how to approach the more complex elements of its engine. Making your own synth patches is half the fun. But if you dont have the time, Omni 2 has the feature lock which lets you pick something out of a wild preset you like and apply it to a new patch. Like the perfect blend of custom sounds and exploration. 

-DJ


----------



## jacobthestupendous (Oct 9, 2015)

Daniel James said:


> I have always seen synth presets as a learning tool, looking through how they made it crazy and how I can apply that technique to my own patches....fill in some analogy of giving a man a fish and teaching him here. So yeah I wouldn't want the preset designers to make their presets any less flashy than they do, because they are not only showing me what the synth is capible of when turned up to 11 but also giving me a manual on how to approach the more complex elements of its engine. Making your own synth patches is half the fun. But if you dont have the time, Omni 2 has the feature lock which lets you pick something out of a wild preset you like and apply it to a new patch. Like the perfect blend of custom sounds and exploration.
> 
> -DJ


My current favorite variation on that saying: 
_Light a fire for a man, and he'll be warm for a day; set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life._


----------



## Daniel James (Oct 9, 2015)

jacobthestupendous said:


> My current favorite variation on that saying:
> _Light a fire for a man, and he'll be warm for a day; set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life._



Wow thats dark!


----------



## NYC Composer (Oct 9, 2015)

Daniel James said:


> Wow thats dark!



Nah, the guy on fire illuminates the room.


----------



## germancomponist (Oct 16, 2015)

Rctec said:


> ... but what makes them different is that they sit really well in a track - because that's how they where made, as part of a piece of music. So they organically fit in and around other instruments. Most presets are made to show off the synth, so they have to sound great and amazing in isolation. But that is usually the problem: they are too shiny, too "opinionated", take up too much sonic space to actually play nice in the context of a production or an arrangement...


Exactly this.
In the 80s when I worked as a programmer selling synth sounds, most people were not interested in bread and butter sounds, but big, bigger, biggest bombastic sounds.


----------

