# Con Moto - Complete Bundle (sale through mid-April)



## DeactivatedAcc (Apr 28, 2018)

I wanted to post some information about a string library I've been building called Con Moto.

*Active-Bowing*
Con Moto features “active-bow” sustains which are “breathing,” non-static longs that move and evolve while simultaneously maintaining dynamic/timbre – via both performance and creative editing. They create a feeling of constant “re-phrasing,” musical restlessness, and emotive adjustment in the bowing. You can play with a tech demo of this concept by clicking https://performancesamples.com/activebowtechdemo/ (here).

Here's a short article I wrote on the 'active-bow sustain' approach used in Con Moto.

*Legato Con Moto*
The legato in Con Moto is recorded “in motion,” with musical movement and expressive vibrato.

*Performance Attacks and Releases*
Similarly to Oceania and Caspian, Con Moto’s attacks and releases are pulled from performance phrases, for better ensemble cohesion and playability/flexibility. Alongside this is the functionality to play both short and long notes naturally, purely based on note duration (like Oceania and Caspian).

*The Hall*
Con Moto is recorded in the same hall as Fluid Shorts and Caspian, and features four mic positions: close 1st chair, close section, decca, and wide.

Con Moto – Cellos: available
Con Moto – Violins A: available
Con Moto – Violins B: available
Con Moto – Violas: available
Con Moto – Basses: available
*Con Moto - Complete Bundle: **available*


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## Montisquirrel (Apr 28, 2018)

I'm following the Demos on Soundcloud for a while. Sounds beautiful! Looking forward for more informations (price, date, etc..)


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## midi-et-quart (Apr 28, 2018)

Very nice ! I'm wondering, about how many hours did you spend recording the library?
I guess the editing and programming have been even longer, but I'm very curious...

Looking forward to its release.


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## EvgenyEmelyanov (Apr 28, 2018)

Good luck with the release!


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## midiman (Apr 29, 2018)

Look forward to more information. I am sure it will be a very good library. I loved Oceania and Caspian.


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## midiman (Apr 29, 2018)

Any ETA on the release date?


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## Brendon Williams (Apr 29, 2018)

Interesting choice to release all the sections individually!


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## axb312 (Apr 30, 2018)

Does this have samples recorded with and without vibrato? Will the amount of vibrato be adjustable?

What are the section sizes?

When is the rest of the ensemble going to be released?

Does the inherent delay mean a track compensation of 140 ms will keep the attack of the note on the beat?

Also, what does optimized for hard attacks mean?


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## muk (Apr 30, 2018)

Sounds very nice. What is the complete articulation list for this library? The demos sound very good. But in the last one, 'Variable Attacks/Playing Types' there are two slightly odd attacks at around 0:09 and 0:15. It almost sounds like a double attack.


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## DeactivatedAcc (Apr 30, 2018)

Thank you everyone.



midi-et-quart said:


> Very nice ! I'm wondering, about how many hours did you spend recording the library?
> I guess the editing and programming have been even longer, but I'm very curious...
> 
> Looking forward to its release.



I recorded most of the library around the middle of 2017, though I did a follow-up session this year (there will be more on that coming up). Edits/programming can take a while as well, with the way the release samples are setup in this one and other aspects.



axb312 said:


> Does this have samples recorded with and without vibrato? Will the amount of vibrato be adjustable?
> 
> What are the section sizes?
> 
> ...



Dear axb312,

The libraries are recorded with vibrato only (non adjustable). The section sizes are 8-6-6-6 (violins/violas/cellos/basses). I have the other sections in production, but likely won’t have release dates until they’re through beta. As far as the delay, you’re absolutely right - the instrument is setup so that you can put your track delay at -140.1 ms, quantize, and the attacks and legatos will be on the beat. In this case, 'optimized for hard attacks' means that for shorter note-lengths, the hard attacks will be more responsive than the soft attacks, because the hard attacks don’t have a little crescendo like the soft attacks (the hard attacks + release samples are more on an equal playing field amplitude-wise). The hard attacks aren’t really marcato-hard, and are fairly general usage (the soft attacks were an afterthought in editing and mostly aimed at opening phrases and pad writing).



muk said:


> Sounds very nice. What is the complete articulation list for this library? The demos sound very good. But in the last one, 'Variable Attacks/Playing Types' there are two slightly odd attacks at around 0:09 and 0:15. It almost sounds like a double attack.



There's one patch per section (though things may be a bit different for one of the upcoming unreleased sections) - containing the active-bow sustains, the attack/rel stuff, and legato (KS on/off). You're hearing some of the tail from the room bleeding into the attack (more prominent on the farther mics), since it's pulled from performances in a particularly ambient room. In context it doesn't really bother me personally.


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## axb312 (Apr 30, 2018)

Thank you!


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## Vita Et Musica (Apr 30, 2018)

Just delicious. Sounding awesome, Jasper! Can't wait to try them out!


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## BL (May 3, 2018)

Now available: Con Moto - Cellos


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## Eptesicus (May 3, 2018)

BL said:


> Now available: Con Moto - Cellos



Hm, bit pricey for me i think, even at the intro, as that would be $400 for all the sections or $600 full price. It seems a lot for just legato/longs. 

They sound great though but for people with fatter wallets than me!


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## BL (May 3, 2018)

Jasper Blunk said:


> I recorded most of the library around the middle of 2017, though I did a follow-up session this year (there will be more on that coming up).



I'm guessing that means the library will be further polished with additional content? It plays really well though the legato doesn't sound so fluid or connected when repeating the same note in repetition. Hoping that is something that will be worked on. The tone is gorgeous though. The active bow is really great and I can see it saving a lot of time. Overall this is a wonderful Cello sample library. Thanks Jasper!


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## X-Bassist (May 3, 2018)

Eptesicus said:


> Hm, bit pricey for me i think, even at the intro, as that would be $400 for all the sections or $600 full price. It seems a lot for just legato/longs.
> 
> They sound great though but for people with fatter wallets than me!



Actually they state on the site that the different sections will be priced differently- that basses would be less than violins. But the entire set could be $350 or more on intro price. Which they mention will be cheaper than the bundle price. But the bundle price on sale during christmas 2019? It might be worth waiting for.

Considering how much I use their other instruments (besides Oceania, I really don’t get projects needing giant, epic choir) I will probably jump on this and hope for a “complete your bundle” down the line. Buying them at full price would seem a bit steep.


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## Eptesicus (May 3, 2018)

X-Bassist said:


> Actually they state on the site that the different sections will be priced differently- that basses would be less than violins. But the entire set could be $350 or more on intro price. Which they mention will be cheaper than the bundle price. But the bundle price on sale during christmas 2019? It might be worth waiting for.
> 
> Considering how much I use their other instruments (besides Oceania, I really don’t get projects needing giant, epic choir) I will probably jump on this and hope for a “complete your bundle” down the line. Buying them at full price would seem a bit steep.



Yeh, i think i may wait for the first sale on the bundle. Shame as i was looking forward to these, but that's what i get for being poor :(. If i am honest i thought $99 would be the full price of each section, not the intro price. wishful thinking it would seem!

I will still be interested on hearing on what those that buy it say as the demos do sound really lovely.


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## kimarnesen (May 3, 2018)

ka00 said:


> From the site:
> "*Con Moto – Cellos* should be avoided if you are a Logic AU user and/or Vienna Ensemble PRO AU user.
> 
> At this point, there are no plans for a fix, as the elements appearing to cause issues (modulators, filters, etc) are critical for the functionality of the library."
> ...



But what does that really mean, that it’s fine as long as it’s VST and not AU?


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## NathanTiemeyer (May 3, 2018)

Bummer about the Logic issues! Congrats on another amazing release Jasper!


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## Nmargiotta (May 3, 2018)

Loving the demos! Its killing me I can't pick it up as I use logic. If AU support comes later ill pull the trigger ASAP


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## muziksculp (May 3, 2018)

Conmoto-Cellos sound great !

When are the Con Moto Violins expected ?


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## lucky909091 (May 3, 2018)

Well, this is a library made by Jasper Blunk, an innovative composer and library producer who offers some libraries that other developers do not offer.

First, I had to accustom myself to his approach of "delays" of the sounds and these "no purist" kind of sounds.

But the more I got used to his philosophy of sample libraries, the more I am able to work with his products.

His products are really outstanding and they are always an "ear-catcher" on top of a composition. 
I like it.


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## clisma (May 3, 2018)

Nmargiotta said:


> Loving the demos! Its killing me I can't pick it up as I use logic. If AU support comes later ill pull the trigger ASAP


As a Logic user, I'm waiting a moment but will definitely purchase this. It's the same disclaimer Jasper put up for Caspian Brass, and that is completely workable in Logic, especially if you use only one mic position until mixing.


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## clisma (May 3, 2018)

ka00 said:


> Well, hoping Logic users who take the plunge will let us know how it's performing.
> 
> A disclaimer suggesting it's resource hungry is one thing, but to say it should be avoided by Logic users on the product page is another.
> 
> And I know it says "Logic AU" users, so if there's an obvious workaround to using this as a VST in Logic with the same functionality and performance as would be achieved by non-Logic users, it would be good to mention that right after the disclaimer. But there's nothing like that mentioned.


Fair enough, actually.


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## Wally Garten (May 3, 2018)

Yeah -- disappointed that it seems to be Logic-unfriendly, but glad that Jasper is just upfront about it. I appreciate the warning, even as I wish it weren't necessary.


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## muziksculp (May 3, 2018)

Purchased* Con Moto Cellos *! 

Looking forward to discovering these tasty sounding cellos 

I'm hoping Con Moto Violins will be out next.

Many Thanks to _Performance Samples_.


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## Sid Francis (May 3, 2018)

My question too since i use VE Pro, but only VST.


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## Saxer (May 3, 2018)

For all Logic users please look here:
https://vi-control.net/community/th...samples-not-want-my-money.71262/#post-4226813


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## midiman (May 3, 2018)

Definitely picking this up today.


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## fretti (May 3, 2018)

Will wait and see what happens till 9th of may from OT and their 30% sales. If there isn‘t something for me, I think this looks great to complete my setup for now


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## NoamL (May 3, 2018)

What is the actual issue created for Logic users? Clicks, dropouts?

On a positive note, as a cellist these are some of the best VI cellos I've ever heard. It is just one more home run for the "significant preroll sampling" approach. First CSS, then Fluid Shorts, now Con Moto, are all showing that this approach pays dividends that far exceed the minor hassle of programming a compensating negative track delay.


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## midiman (May 3, 2018)

NoamL said:


> What is the actual issue created for Logic users? Clicks, dropouts?
> 
> First CSS, then Fluid Shorts, now Con Moto, are all showing that this approach pays dividends that far exceed the minor hassle of programming a compensating negative track delay.



Exactly, I agree the hassle is minor, considering the benefits.


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## Vik (May 4, 2018)

midiman said:


> Exactly, I agree the hassle is minor


I'm not sure that's what he wrote... CPU spikes can cause serious problems. The library seems too sound great, too bad if there's something with Logic/the AU format which causes spikes. I hope Apple will address this.


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## IvanP (May 4, 2018)

Just picked it. Amazing programming. Worth every penny. 

Love the sound, tonal blend and the overall, addictive and fun playability. Can't wait for the rest of the library.


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## Ned Bouhalassa (May 4, 2018)

ka00 said:


> And I know it says "Logic AU" users, so if there's an obvious workaround to using this as a VST in Logic with the same functionality and performance as would be achieved by non-Logic users, it would be good to mention that right after the disclaimer. But there's nothing like that mentioned.



Not so obvious, actually, since one cannot load VSTs in Logic. Seriously, AU only.


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## X-Bassist (May 4, 2018)

This new review might help some decide...
https://vi-control.net/community/threads/con-moto-chapter-i-cellos.71285/

I just wish it had a little more bite at the top dynamic, but kudos to Jasper and PerfSamp.


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## vicontrolu (May 4, 2018)

X-Bassist said:


> This new review might help some decide...
> https://vi-control.net/community/threads/con-moto-chapter-i-cellos.71285/
> 
> I just wish it had a little more bite at the top dynamic, but kudos to Jasper and PerfSamp.



Agree. Would be nice to listen to clear marcato bite when hitting hard velocities. I guess this and Adventure Strings in 2 keyswitches should cover these kinda phrases well. Still, 500$ for a legato/sustain patch only orchestra is a bit too much for me.


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## midiman (May 4, 2018)

Vik said:


> I'm not sure that's what he wrote... CPU spikes can cause serious problems. The library seems too sound great, too bad if there's something with Logic/the AU format which causes spikes. I hope Apple will address this.



@NoamL wrote the following "What is the actual issue created for Logic users? Clicks, dropouts?

On a positive note, as a cellist these are some of the best VI cellos I've ever heard. It is just one more home run for the "significant preroll sampling" approach. First CSS, then Fluid Shorts, *now Con Moto, are all showing that this approach pays dividends that far exceed the minor hassle of programming a compensating negative track delay."*


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## Vik (May 4, 2018)

Sure, that was about the stuff that could be compensated with negative delay. I just don't think the negative aspect of using this with Logic necessarily can be summed up by saying that there's only minor hassle associated with using this lib with Logic, based on the warnings on their site. But I see that that maybe that wasn't you claimed either... I talked about clicks/pops/CPU spikes, you were maybe focusing on the negative track delay thing (which isn't Logic specific pf course).


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## midiman (May 4, 2018)

Vik said:


> Sure, that was about the stuff that could be compensated with negative delay. I just don't think the negative aspect of using this with Logic necessarily can be summed up by saying that there's only minor hassle associated with using this lib with Logic, based on the warnings on their site. But I see that that maybe that wasn't you claimed either... I talked about clicks/pops/CPU spikes, you were maybe focusing on the negative track delay thing (which isn't Logic specific pf course).



@Vik - Me and @NoamL were only referring to the delay on the legato transitions and how that allows for samples to have a higher quality legato transition realism. Like we've seen on such libraries as Cinematic Studio Strings. The Logic problems do not seem to be minor problems, and I did not refer to those at all, as I am not even on Logic myself. Again what NoamL and I were referring to is that we think the hassle of having to pull notes before the beat in order to have it all in sync up in tempo, is a minor one, given how much better and real the legato transitions sound.


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## ka00 (May 4, 2018)

midiman said:


> I did not refer to those at all, as I am not even on Logic myself


You may already know this, but I recently discovered you can select the exact part of the text you want to quote, just by highlighting it with your cursor, and the forum pops up the word "Reply", which you can click. That way you can quote only the part of someone's message you are focussing on to avoid confusion. I, like Vik, wasn't so sure which part of Noam's post you were referring to.


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## midiman (May 4, 2018)

ka00 said:


> just by highlighting it with your cursor, and the forum pops up the word "Reply", which you can click


Thanks for the tip @ka00 . It is useful and I did not know about it.


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## garylionelli (May 6, 2018)

Just purchased. They are fantastic! Thank you Jasper.


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## Nyran (May 6, 2018)

Just purchased and tested. Great library if you know what you are getting. I find it very easy to compensate for the delay while playing. I would have liked more detail on the close mics but I appreciate the dry sound you can get from it.

I would also like to point out that on my system I have absolutely no problems with Logic AU after some heavy testing with all the mics on. 
I already own the fluid shorts and I will test them together tomorrow.
Let's hope for a low price on violins 2 violas and basses (I guess violins 1 will be the same)


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## Pedro Camacho (May 7, 2018)

Fabulous library, programmed/edited by Jasper, the best guy in the business for orchestral sampling.

I say this with all my heart. Just like Tari, on ethnic libraries, I am yet to see someone with so much passion and drive for perfection as Jasper on orchestral sampling.
Both work solo on the editing and the endless tweaking and THAT makes a huge difference, imo.
I was blessed by Jasper's talent two years ago with the private SE library and a private 20 violins library I sampled just for myself. Nothing beats those, yet.
Having his talent for this price range is a must buy...


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## Nmargiotta (May 7, 2018)

Nyran said:


> Just purchased and tested. Great library if you know what you are getting. I find it very easy to compensate for the delay while playing. I would have liked more detail on the close mics but I appreciate the dry sound you can get from it.
> 
> I would also like to point out that on my system I have absolutely no problems with Logic AU after some heavy testing with all the mics on.
> I already own the fluid shorts and I will test them together tomorrow.
> Let's hope for a low price on violins 2 violas and basses (I guess violins 1 will be the same)




I have been weary because of the disclaimer for Logic but I, like you, have been using fluid shorts for 6 months or so and have had very minor issues. Its nice to hear you went for it and it hasn't caused chaos on your end. I think I'm going to pick it up as well and go for it. There are always workarounds (bounce in place, track freeze, etc.) Id really like a library to room match with the FS because I use them all the time. 

Keep us updated if things change on your end!


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## Mike Greene (Feb 18, 2019)

Mis-posted. Sorry.


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## DeactivatedAcc (Mar 27, 2019)

With *Violins B* around the corner, here are some audio examples. I'll put links in the first post upon release.


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## Eptesicus (Mar 28, 2019)

What happened to Violins A?


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## Daniel (Mar 28, 2019)

Eptesicus said:


> What happened to Violins A?


It will be released also, maybe after Violins B released


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## Wolf68 (Mar 28, 2019)

"Demonstration 1 + 2 " Sound superb to my ears. any info about the pricing?


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## IvanP (Mar 29, 2019)

Sounds great! What's the difference between Violins A and B?

Are we talking about Violins 1 and 2 or a different concept?


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## DeactivatedAcc (Mar 29, 2019)

IvanP said:


> Sounds great! What's the difference between Violins A and B?
> 
> Are we talking about Violins 1 and 2 or a different concept?



The original violins (Violins B) were recorded initially with the rest of the sections. Seating was divided between 1st & 2nd violin positions. Later on I wanted to do a re-record (Violins A), which was recorded in 1st violins position. The timbre between A & B is along similar lines, but there's some variation in the player selection between the two. I'd say Violins A is a bit more "upfront" sounding, and Violins B has a bit more dynamic range in the lower dynamic. 

My aim at this point is to release Violins A after Violins B, Violas, and Basses. They can serve as a supplement and layer - or first violins if you want to divide things like that.

Here's a playlist that demonstrates the sound of Violins A.


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## IvanP (Mar 29, 2019)

Thanks! Both concepts sound very good.


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## X-Bassist (Mar 29, 2019)

Jasper Blunk said:


> The original violins (Violins B) were recorded initially with the rest of the sections. Seating was divided between 1st & 2nd violin positions. Later on I wanted to do a re-record (Violins A), which was recorded in 1st violins position. The timbre between A & B is along similar lines, but there's some variation in the player selection between the two. I'd say Violins A is a bit more "upfront" sounding, and Violins B has a bit more dynamic range in the lower dynamic.
> 
> My aim at this point is to release Violins A after Violins B, Violas, and Basses. They can serve as a supplement and layer - or first violins if you want to divide things like that.
> 
> Here's a playlist that demonstrates the sound of Violins A.




What a long strange trip it's been... so far. Thanks for the info! Looking forward to them. What is the status of my favorite section, the Violas?

Thank you for your innovative work. It's worth the wait when you're constantly raising the bar.


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## DeactivatedAcc (Apr 4, 2019)

X-Bassist said:


> What is the status of my favorite section, the Violas?



These are likely the next release in the Con Moto series.

Violins B are now available.


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## midiman (Apr 5, 2019)

Bought it just minutes after being released. It is incredible. Low footprint - amazing quality. You feel the players. Matches perfectly the Con Moto Cellos. I look forward to the violas and Basses. And I hope very much there will be a "Solos of the Sea" Cello, and Viola! That would be wonderful. The Solos of the Sea Violin Solo is one of my favorite instruments.


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## jaketanner (Apr 5, 2019)

Jasper Blunk said:


> The original violins (Violins B) were recorded initially with the rest of the sections. Seating was divided between 1st & 2nd violin positions. Later on I wanted to do a re-record (Violins A), which was recorded in 1st violins position. The timbre between A & B is along similar lines, but there's some variation in the player selection between the two. I'd say Violins A is a bit more "upfront" sounding, and Violins B has a bit more dynamic range in the lower dynamic.
> 
> My aim at this point is to release Violins A after Violins B, Violas, and Basses. They can serve as a supplement and layer - or first violins if you want to divide things like that.
> 
> Here's a playlist that demonstrates the sound of Violins A.




jasper, is there more vibrato in Violins A? It sounds lovely, but I do not hear that same expression with the B...am I wrong?


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## jaketanner (Apr 5, 2019)

I truly wish that there were other formas of legato. For a truly realistic performance, sometimes you also need some marcato, detache and arcs as well...I mean for a complete legato patch.


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## WhiteNoiz (Apr 5, 2019)

Loved the sound and approach and couldn't resist the intro pricing, even if it's just legato sustains. Not quite sure what I'll do with it but hopefully this will motivate Jasper to produce more goodies. Waiting to see what will come next. Will try it in a bit.

*Edit*: Ok, played with it for a while. It's decent, it adds some nice movement and drama. A bit quirky to program, lag can be a bit problematic but workable. Could probably use a bit wider dynamics, you'll prob need a filter for very low dynamics and probably some EQ or volume ride for pretty high dynamics (mic volumes too). The releases seem to conflict with the attacks at some points for some reason. A fade to silence would be a nice addition. Can work solo for calmer pieces, for others it's probably better for layering (or at least with the rest of the sections). It's likely I'll complete the bundle, probably on some sale. Still curious for the next releases though; keep 'em coming.

Here's some messing around in some more examples (they're the longer notes; violins B only, in a few different settings):
https://instaud.io/private/cf09e90788ebfc3d9c485223aceddf908695171d

https://instaud.io/private/b66a7858a2376c399d42d58a3118f1f32dbb2403


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## jaketanner (Apr 7, 2019)

@Jasper Blunk , I think you mentioned in a another thread that the violas were next. Any ideas even if rough as to when? Need to make some decisions, and would like to wait if possible. Thanks!!!


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## prodigalson (Apr 11, 2019)

Now that folks have had the violins for a while and the last day of the intro price is tomorrow, whats the verdict? Any thoughts, pros, cons?


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## constaneum (Apr 11, 2019)

can it really play fast lines ?


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## midiman (Apr 15, 2019)

prodigalson said:


> Now that folks have had the violins for a while and the last day of the intro price is tomorrow, whats the verdict? Any thoughts, pros, cons?



In my opinion there are no Cons. It is an amazing library. Jasper's libraries have a kind of musicality there I rarely find anywhere else. It is beautiful and raw. And the price is right. One amazing patch with low footprint, and amazing sound quality.

I only wish there was maybe a patch for slower/smother passages. This patch is vibrant and expressive. but it'be nice to have a a patch tailored to softer passages. But that may be a future release.


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## midiman (Apr 15, 2019)

constaneum said:


> can it really play fast lines ?



yes it plays very well fast passages. It does that amazingly well. And it also plays very well slow passages. You just have to start the notes before the beat because of the delay of the legato. 

I'd like to see a future release focused on more lyrical softer, slower passages. Perhaps a PP to MP patch.


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## constaneum (Apr 15, 2019)

midiman said:


> yes it plays very well fast passages. It does that amazingly well. And it also plays very well slow passages. You just have to start the notes before the beat because of the delay of the legato.
> 
> I'd like to see a future release focused on more lyrical softer, slower passages. Perhaps a PP to MP patch.



Care to share the demo of fast passages ? Thanks


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## midiman (Apr 15, 2019)

constaneum said:


> Care to share the demo of fast passages ? Thanks



Constaneum, here is a quick passage I improvised live without putting any thought to it, as I am busy working on project. No editing whatsoever. No preparation. No processing, except for the master hall reverb. I think it does well on fast passages. It is not a library intended to play only runs per say, but it does "speak" pretty fast, and even runs kind of work. But the strength of the library is doing emotive and passionate passages that can feature quite fast notes. What do you think?

Con Moto Violins - Passionate passage featuring faster notes. 
https://picosong.com/wQtzJ/


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## constaneum (Apr 15, 2019)

midiman said:


> Constaneum, here is a quick passage I improvised live without putting any thought to it, as I am busy working on project. No editing whatsoever. No preparation. No processing, except for the master hall reverb. I think it does well on fast passages. It is not a library intended to play only runs per say, but it does "speak" pretty fast, and even runs kind of work. But the strength of the library is doing emotive and passionate passages that can feature quite fast notes. What do you think?
> 
> Con Moto Violins - Passionate passage featuring faster notes.
> https://picosong.com/wQtzJ/



not bad overall but definitely not for runs. haha


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## Sovereign (Jul 20, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> @Jasper Blunk , I think you mentioned in a another thread that the violas were next. Any ideas even if rough as to when? Need to make some decisions, and would like to wait if possible. Thanks!!!


These violas sure are taking a long time!


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## jaketanner (Jul 20, 2019)

Sovereign said:


> These violas sure are taking a long time!


I’m waiting for them as well and to have the cellos go on sale so they’re a decent price. They seem to not understand people would buy them much more if they priced them reasonably for what they do.


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## Sovereign (Jul 20, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> I’m waiting for them as well and to have the cellos go on sale so they’re a decent price. They seem to not understand people would buy them much more if they priced them reasonably for what they do.


Yep, the price is rather high. Better to sell way more at a lower price, than not sell a lot due to pricing it unreasonably.


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## jaketanner (Jul 20, 2019)

Sovereign said:


> Yep, the price is rather high. Better to sell way more at a lower price, than not sell a lot due to pricing it unreasonably.



Exactly my thoughts. Especially when there are tons of great options that offer far more. But what PS does, they do exceptionally well


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## midiman (Jul 20, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Exactly my thoughts. Especially when there are tons of great options that offer far more. But what PS does, they do exceptionally well



I disagree about the pricing. I think the price is very reasonable. Especially considering that the quality or Performance Samples library is paralleled in many ways. And he always offers an intro pricing. I have complete trust and confidence that when I am buying a PS library it will get a lot of mileage. There are other string libraries out there that offer all ARTS, but in the end I use much more often PS than others. Then when I need other ARTS I go get them from other libs. I love the approach of PS. Create one Patch that is amazing at what it does, feels very musical and playable, and sounds amazing, still covering good ground with wonderful dynamics and musicality. I can't wait for the rest of the Con Moto Series.


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## Sovereign (Jul 20, 2019)

midiman said:


> I disagree about the pricing. I think the price is very reasonable. Especially considering that the quality or Performance Samples library is paralleled in many ways. And he always offers an intro pricing. I have complete trust and confidence that when I am buying a PS library it will get a lot of mileage. There are other string libraries out there that offer all ARTS, but in the end I use much more often PS than others. Then when I need other ARTS I go get them from other libs. I love the approach of PS. Create one Patch that is amazing at what it does, feels very musical and playable, and sounds amazing, still covering good ground with wonderful dynamics and musicality. I can't wait for the rest of the Con Moto Series.


Sorry but as far as pricing goes, it's way expensive compared to other strings. Soaring Strings is 129 bucks when on offer or $ 249 regularly, has all sections, and plays just as well and even has repetition legato. Objectively, it offers much more for less. Even with the intro pricing it seems the whole Con Moto set will easily cost $400 for only legato strings. That is overly expensive compared to other libraries, no matter how you cut it.


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## chapbot (Jul 20, 2019)

Sovereign said:


> Sorry but as far as pricing goes, it's way expensive compared to other strings. Soaring Strings is 129 bucks when on offer or $ 249 regularly, has all sections, and plays just as well and even has repetition legato. Objectively, it offers much more for less. Even with the intro pricing it seems the whole Con Moto set will easily cost $400 for only legato strings. That is overly expensive compared to other libraries, no matter how you cut it.


It doesn't matter anyway because they are nowhere close to finishing the full ensemble. I was really interested in this library when it first started but it has taken so unbelievably long that I've just put it out of my mind.


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## midiman (Jul 20, 2019)

Sovereign said:


> Sorry but as far as pricing goes, it's way expensive compared to other strings. Soaring Strings is 129 bucks when on offer or $ 249 regularly, has all sections, and plays just as well and even has repetition legato. Objectively, it offers much more for less. Even with the intro pricing it seems the whole Con Moto set will easily cost $400 for only legato strings. That is overly expensive compared to other libraries, no matter how you cut it.



You are entitled to your opinion, and I am to mine. IMO there is nobody else in the field making better legato string patches then PS. It is a boutique library. I think that $400 for unparalleled string samples is not expensive pricing. It is professional pricing. 
When you get a box of many average tools it is cheaper then getting each of those tools separately, especially if you buy the best individual tools available. 

Anyway, I respect your opinion, and your point is valid. But I think that the word expensive is usually understood as overpriced, which I truly don't think is the case with Performance Samples. I heard the same arguments regarding Afflatus Strings, and I also don't think Afflatus is overpriced. Because libraries cannot be compared by number of ARTS or number of Patches offered.

For me I think of the Mileage I will get out of a library. Sometimes I bought a string library that had 200 or more patches, and I rarely use any of it. So if I use a PS library every day, even though it has only one patch that really does not matter. PS libraries have real value cause they get used a whole lot, and they inspire me to write new music every day


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## midiman (Jul 20, 2019)

Sovereign said:


> Sorry but as far as pricing goes, it's way expensive compared to other strings. Soaring Strings is 129 bucks when on offer or $ 249 regularly, has all sections, and plays just as well and even has repetition legato. Objectively, it offers much more for less. Even with the intro pricing it seems the whole Con Moto set will easily cost $400 for only legato strings. That is overly expensive compared to other libraries, no matter how you cut it.



BTW I have Soaring Strings and I like that library too. But it does not get used every day. Performance Samples con moto is the superior one IMO. But Soaring Strings at $129 is a catch for sure.


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## erica-grace (Jul 20, 2019)

Sovereign said:


> Yep, the price is rather high. Better to sell way more at a lower price, than not sell a lot due to pricing it unreasonably.



Well, it's better for the developer (and I am just throwing out #s here) to sell 2,000 copies @ $149 than to sell 4,000 copies @ $74.50.

Same money, less support.


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## Sovereign (Jul 20, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> Well, it's better for the developer (and I am just throwing out #s here) to sell 2,000 copies @ $149 than to sell 4,000 copies @ $74.50.
> 
> Same money, less support.


That would be a rather flawed example as the idea is not to make the same amount of money, but to sell a lot more at a lower price (there is something called the law of demand in economics). So there's, in my opinion, a good reason to doubt their revenue model, especially since competitors (even small other boutique ones) seem to be able to do more for less. As for support, seems like a non-issue to me unless the product is so crappy there's a huge need for it. PS products are not crappy.


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## erica-grace (Jul 20, 2019)

And how many more copies do you think they would sell at half the price point? 4x? 5x? I submit to you that that's not going to happen, regardless of what the sales figures are at the higher price point.


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## Sovereign (Jul 20, 2019)

midiman said:


> And how many more copies do you think they would sell at half the price point? 4x? 5x? I submit to you that that's not going to happen, regardless of what the sales figures are at the higher price point.


That depends, I have no global figures of string library sales, neither do you. But I do know one thing, which is basic economics, and that is that a higher price will result in lower demand. And at this point, it is way overpriced compared to other offerings (399 for the complete CSS, for example). And there's a good reason the others are priced that way, few people are going to plonk down $149 for not more than a single legato patch, period. Oh and hey, I don't even care about the price myself. I'm a string library whore, I'd buy them regardless even if I think they're overpriced.


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## erica-grace (Jul 20, 2019)

Sovereign said:


> I have no global figures of string library sales, neither do you.



Correct!


Maybe some developers WANT lower demand. Especially if the money is going to be about the same. Higher demand does not always = more money. Maybe some developers know that their customers like the fact that not everyone has this library, that library. Maybe some developers aren't in it for the money.


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## erica-grace (Jul 20, 2019)

ka00 said:


> If a developer drastically cuts the price on a product and attracts let’s say for example twice as many new customers, then they just got the email address and attention of a whole slew of new customers who just might be persuaded over time to buy other items from the product line.



Right - but now most of these people are going to be expecting low-cost libraries from you from now on. And if you don't deliver - you have lost them. So you are now stuck with selling low cost libraries from that point forward?


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## jaketanner (Jul 20, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> Right - but now most of these people are going to be expecting low-cost libraries from you from now on. And if you don't deliver - you have lost them. So you are now stuck with selling low cost libraries from that point forward?



I don't think that $79 for ONE articulation per string instrument is "low-cost". I think it is more reasonable a price to pay for what you get. Yes..I know they're fantastic at what they do, but are they that much better? I mean it's one thing if we can actually build a damn string ensemble, but so far it's coming in drips and drabs. The price might be more attractive once there is a solid 4 instruments/ I did buy the Violin B and their Fluid Shorts...I am waiting for the viola...hopefully there will be a sale on the cellos at some point. People keep mentioning CSS, and I have it as well, and it's a close sound to PS...so it's a good base for comparison, as well as CSS is regarded as one of the best legato's on the market. So at $149, for one single articulation and instrument seems a bit off, especially since they aren't perfect. If there is no choice, and I really want the cello one day, I'll get it...


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## Vik (Jul 20, 2019)

The only real risk I see for Performance Samples here is that if they wait too long before releasing the viola and the Violin A, other companies may produce and sell a similar kind of library before PS can deliver what their users have been wanting to buy from them for quite some time now.


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## Sid Francis (Jul 20, 2019)

and 2000 less people highly interested in his next library because the first one satisfied them so much


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## midiman (Jul 21, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Yes..I know they're fantastic at what they do, but are they that much better?



Yes, they are that much better...


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## jaketanner (Jul 21, 2019)

midiman said:


> Yes, they are that much better...



Well unless you’re writing expressly for legato, they’re very limited. I but them at I trobprice but wouldn’t spend it at full when I have other options.


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## Tekkera (Jul 21, 2019)

Buy them on intro sale, or 50% sale and it is totally worth it. I use these all the time, especially for layering when I need a bit more detail or expressivity. 

The difference between this and real string libraries, is that these are designed for one very specific purpose. And no other library will get it done as well as these can. These are not string libraries, these are for expanding your options where others fall flat.


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## chocobitz825 (Jul 21, 2019)

It is a lot to spend on an expansion pack essentially, but the shorts are always my go to. Also when I really want to add some beauty and weight to certain areas con moto just do something other libraries dont. Are they priced high/overpriced? Maybe, but at the same time, I’d say I’m getting my money’s worth.


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## jaketanner (Jul 22, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> I’d say I’m getting my money’s worth.



best if purchased on intro sale. That's what I'm waiting for..but I really want the cellos, but not at full price. I don't absolutely need them for anything specific. But would like them either way.


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## Tekkera (Jul 22, 2019)

I never buy stuff not on sale unless it need it immediately. Not sure why others don't do the same. Performance samples has big intro sales and big sales overall


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## jaketanner (Jul 22, 2019)

Tekkera said:


> I never buy stuff not on sale unless it need it immediately. Not sure why others don't do the same. Performance samples has big intro sales and big sales overall



They haven’t had a decent sale on the cello in a very long time.


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## axb312 (Jul 22, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> Well, it's better for the developer (and I am just throwing out #s here) to sell 2,000 copies @ $149 than to sell 4,000 copies @ $74.50.
> 
> Same money, less support.



Performance samples explicitly states in its EULA that customer support is not included. 

And yes, the Con moto series is too expensive. No other way to look at it.


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## Vik (Jul 22, 2019)

axb312 said:


> And yes, the Con moto series is too expensive.


Personally, I'd rather pay more for a single instruments that I know I'm going to use than have to buy a full string library even if all I need from that library is one of the instruments, or only the shorts, or only a legato cello. And among the many sampled string sections I've heard, the Con Moto cello (and the CSS cello and V1, the Soaring Strings viola, the SCS V1 and some more) are among those who stick out as particularly playable and 'believable'. 

Seen in that context, $150 isn't that bad (especially compared with buying a number of string libraries and ending up with only using one of the instruments). My guess is that more companies will start to sell single instruments, and that the price per instrument bought one by one will be higher if buying the whole section.


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## jaketanner (Jul 22, 2019)

Vik said:


> My guess is that more companies will start to sell single instruments, and that the price per instrument bought one by one will be higher if buying the whole section.



I have no issues with the one by one thing. OT is going that route I believe later this year, but I'll bet you it's not going to be limited to one articulation.

So you're not really buying a single instrument library, you're buying a single articulation, from a single instrument. I mean let's price out a solo instrument like Joshua Bell for instance. It's regarded as one of the best solo violin libraries out right? It's price is currently $199. It has 11 different articulations, and then a slew of different varieties of those articulations...something in total along the lines of 30+? now I am well aware that a single violin will cost less than hiring 8 musicians, and there is more time involved...but if they're just playing one articulation, how long could it possibly take in the studio? My point is that the price point may have worked years ago when choices were far less. I also appreciate that PS might be feeling that they're treading that elite status like Apple...where they can price a metal stand for $1k, but that's a whole different topic...LOL

I am also not taking anything away from Performance Samples with their incredible sound and playability that they achieve. But to price their cello at $149 in comparison only, is steep. Their intro price is totally fair, and that's when I buy. One can also argue that there are no comparisons, as PS is in a league of their own...and again, they may very well be. I truly truly love the sound of their recordings, but once I have all their instruments of the Con Moto series, I am still left with only one articulation, and using them only for legato. I have their Fluid Shorts...not the same recording or amount of players, so it's not like Fluid is the SHORT articulations that are missing. 

What I am looking forward to however, is their joint venture with a Nashville chamber strings orchestra. Apparently it will be more complete...but that can take years.

For now, I can only hope that the cello goes on sale soon, and that they release the violas in a reasonable time.


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## Tekkera (Jul 22, 2019)

I don't think it's fair to compare *any* company to Embertone's product prices


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## jaketanner (Jul 22, 2019)

I also want to add this little kid bit of information. So confirmed, is the cello library has additional articulations/attacks, because it was a by product of the recording, and was not planned. The violin B does NOT have this same attack adjustment and flexibility, so it does not play the same...it's like they're from two totally different libraries. To me, there isn't even any congruity to these samples to work as a whole. It's frustrating because the sound is so good, yet it's so lacking :(


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## midiman (Jul 22, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> I have no issues with the one by one thing. OT is going that route I believe later this year, but I'll bet you it's not going to be limited to one articulation.
> 
> So you're not really buying a single instrument library, you're buying a single articulation, from a single instrument. I mean let's price out a solo instrument like Joshua Bell for instance. It's regarded as one of the best solo violin libraries out right? It's price is currently $199. It has 11 different articulations, and then a slew of different varieties of those articulations...something in total along the lines of 30+? now I am well aware that a single violin will cost less than hiring 8 musicians, and there is more time involved...but if they're just playing one articulation, how long could it possibly take in the studio? My point is that the price point may have worked years ago when choices were far less. I also appreciate that PS might be feeling that they're treading that elite status like Apple...where they can price a metal stand for $1k, but that's a whole different topic...LOL
> 
> ...



Forgive me if I am misreading your message, but what I hear is a contradiction: You say their Price point does not work in today's market. But you are looking forward to their release of the violas. Sorry but it is confusing and contradicting.

Furthermore, your comparison with the Joshua Bell Violin is also not fair. The PS Cellos and Violins B are both amazing. I don't know how long it took them to record it in the studio, but they have spent a stupid amount of hours of programming on these to make it as perfect and as musical as possible. You complain about them taking too long to release new instruments, but the reason for that is exactly the insane amount of time it takes to program these, and the perfectionism they put into it. I am just thankful that they put them out when they get to finishing them into perfection.

It is simple - If you think they are too expensive when comparing to other libraries, then it is a free market, go buy those libraries. I am sticking with Performance Samples because I think they are better than any other, and I do not find them expensive, given they get used EVERY single day at my studio. I have the Joshua Bell violin. It is good. But I do not use it often. It is not so easy to use. But I use the Solos Of the Sea Solo Violin very often (Yes, even though it has only Legato) because It brings my ideas to life better than other libraries do.

I said it before and I'll say it again - Libraries should not be measured by number of articulations or patches. They should be measured by how often they get used, and how they lead you to write better music and produce that music to higher standards.

Too many people complaining about the price here. We are all rather lucky that Jasper is devoting time to create amazing libraries for us composers. We should be thankful for it. And for some, if they find it too expensive because it is only one articulation, then don't buy. But please do not start to question the amount of hours of work that goes into making one of these libraries, and comparing apples to pears. Sorry for the rant. But I don't enjoy seeing this kind of criticism to an indie company that is making some of the most amazing libraries ever produced.


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## jaketanner (Jul 22, 2019)

midiman said:


> You say their Price point does not work in today's market. But you are looking forward to their release of the violas. Sorry but it is confusing and contradicting.



Their price works for their intro price...it's like half off their regular price. totally worth it...but if people are 2 days late (that's another ridiculous time frame, but another topic), it's full price...



midiman said:


> I am just thankful that they put them out when they get to finishing them into perfection.



I am thankful too, but not as much as you are...LOL ...but for me it's their sound that got me. But it's like anything else, if you want something bad enough someone will pay for it. I have all the time in the world to wait for sales...I am not hurting for their library, but I like it because it is a different animal. But I don't need this now for any particular gig, so the urgency on my end isn't there.



midiman said:


> I use the Solos Of the Sea Solo Violin very often (Yes, even though it has only Legato) because It brings my ideas to life better than other libraries do.



So after you have your legato idea and you want to have the solo violin play a short note, you switch to another library? Or a marcato, or portamento?
I would love to have their solo violin...their free violin is what got me hooked on to them in the first place. Again, limited...BUT, this one I feel is worth it for whatever strange reason, I would pay the $139 for the solo violin. Why? because it will probably get used more often, as you said, you use it every day and it's worth having. I use tons of other complete libraries, so it's not absolutely necessary to have the cello right now. Not like I can do anything with it anyway, it's a cello and violin...I like to write for a complete section, so I'd be waiting anyway for their other releases.



midiman said:


> I don't enjoy seeing this kind of criticism to an indie company that is making some of the most amazing libraries ever produced.



PS have their competition too, and other developers are making incredible libraries as well. I am not disagreeing with you, I am saying that they're not the only game in town. The complaints about the prices are not for lack of money, it's again, what you are getting for the price compared to what you can get with other ALSO great libraries. 
If you feel that PS is the best of the best, that's all good...it's debatable, and that's what makes these arguments relative. I do agree that it does come down to use. Will their con moto cello spark some creativity that I Haden't thought of???, maybe, but then I'd be stuck using half a string section. At least with the violas release, I can use CSS CB to make up for it, as they sound similar and in the context of an orchestration, I can get away with it.

I agree on most things with you except that they're a steal for the price. On sale, in a heartbeat, they're worth it for sure...at full price, I'd need more thought into it. But I am glad that you are this passionate about a library...and will wait years for them to complete..I think it's been at least a year or more since the cello and their Violin. At this rate, a complete library will be 4 year in the making.

I will probably pick up the solo violin, because I do feel that I can get use out of it. So maybe it is a straight up use issue.


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## midiman (Jul 22, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Their price works for their intro price...it's like half off their regular price. totally worth it...but if people are 2 days late (that's another ridiculous time frame, but another topic), it's full price...
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Fair points you make. I don't think I ever said they were a steal, or please quote me if I'm wrong. I said they are worth it, or not expensive. That is different than saying it is a steal. 

I have been able to very effectively use the Cellos and Violins to bring out more important lines, whilst using other string libraries for the violas and basses. And I am still happy to have these. I look forward to the violas and Violins A. But having these ones for the past year was amazing and very useful to blend with other libraries. But if you only like to use a full string library from ONE developer I can understand that and you should wait the complete thing to be available. Maybe at that time there might even be a bundle pricing... 
For me it is OK in the meantime to use what they released so far. The Solo violin Solos of the sea is by far my favorite violin. It has a low footprint, but it plays so beautifully.

My two favorite string libraries right now are Con Moto, and the Afflatus, which coincidentally both have been attacked by some in the forum as being too expensive. But the reality is that they offer something that takes me to places that no other library was able to before. It's all relative. For me they have been worth it for sure.


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## jaketanner (Jul 22, 2019)

midiman said:


> I said they are worth it, or not expensive. That is different than saying it is a steal.



True but wasn’t quoting per se, just as I perceived it. And I think the most frustrating part about this is that I DO want it so bad, but to limit my writing to work within the library is frustrating. However, sale days are ahead of us and I’m sure come the holiday season, those cellos will be mine. Lol

Great talk. Best of luck.


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## midiman (Jul 22, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> True but wasn’t quoting per se, just as I perceived it. And I think the most frustrating part about this is that I DO want it so bad, but to limit my writing to work within the library is frustrating. However, sale days are ahead of us and I’m sure come the holiday season, those cellos will be mine. Lol
> 
> Great talk. Best of luck.



I'm sure you'll get lucky in the Holiday season. Those Cellos are worth the wait  
Best of luck to you too.


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## Saxer (Jul 22, 2019)

I'm rather sure when the Con Moto string section will be complete (whenever that will be) it will get a good section price. I personally don't find incomplete sections useful. So I'll wait.


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## Vik (Jul 23, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> if they're just playing one articulation, how long could it possibly take in the studio?


That depends on whether that one articulation is legato or not, and also: on whether it's a playable, convincing legato or a legato which easily is recognised as sampled. Making a legato instrument is of course so much more work (recording, coding) than recording non-legato long notes or any of the short articulations – there are probably hundreds of samples per note. 

Maybe PS would make more money if they lowered the price... I wouldn't know. And I'm not comparing Con Moto with the Joshua Bell solo violin (haven't tried it, but it sounds great in demos). I only disagree in "the Con moto series is too expensive. No other way to look at it" – especially the last part.


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## Sovereign (Jul 23, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> Correct!
> 
> 
> Maybe some developers WANT lower demand. Especially if the money is going to be about the same. Higher demand does not always = more money. Maybe some developers know that their customers like the fact that not everyone has this library, that library. Maybe some developers aren't in it for the money.


Every developer is in it for the money, no one claims or pretends to be a charitable organization. So you're giving quite unacceptable and strange rationalizations here why they price their stuff so high. No matter how you slice it, there is no other company charging this much for a single[!] legato articulation. None, zero. Neither small, nor large. Does the patch sound great? Sure, I think it does, that's why I bought it. Is it super duper special? Hell no, it's not necessarily 'better' than most of the legato patches I own. It's even missing a simple rebow/repetition function. Based on how others are pricing their products I'd say $75 per legato articulation would be 'fair', and even that would be stretching it a bit.


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## Sovereign (Jul 23, 2019)

Vik said:


> That depends on whether that one articulation is legato or not, and also: on whether it's a playable, convincing legato or a legato which easily is recognised as sampled. Making a legato instrument is of course so much more work (recording, coding) than recording non-legato long notes or any of the short articulations – there are probably hundreds of samples per note.


24 intervals per note, per dynamic. I had a look at the samples they recorded, their patch is not closed and you can easily go into the Kontakt editor to check this. What they recorded and how they do it seems to be pretty standard compared to how other libraries are doing their legatos.


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## chocobitz825 (Jul 23, 2019)

Vik said:


> "the Con moto series is too expensive. No other way to look at it" – especially the last part.



It costs what it costs, so there is no other way to look at it. It’s fine of course to disagree about various factors, but they price it for whatever they need to price it at. Whether it be profit incentive, or for branding or just for breaking even. You can say if you felt you wouldn't pay so much for what you got, but that doesn't mean they're wrong for pricing it the way they do. Many users feel they got the value from the product and the price for it was fair.

There’s a weird thing about the arguments on price. Accessibility isn’t a right. There’s no obligation for them to price things at a price point we like. We don’t even know exactly what factors go into that kind of pricing. We can reference other lower priced libraries but we don’t know how that pricing was determined or if it’s even working for the developers. The price is what it is, and you choose to buy it, or wait for a sale or skip it all together. Developers are not responsible for pricing low enough so that we can have the budget to buy all the libraries we want without feeling a financial crunch. They’re only concerned with their product and the needs of their brand. 

It was noted as an example that afflatus was priced extremely high, compared to broader featured libraries like orchestral tools or spitfire. I’ve dropped money in all of them and comparison is really pointless because they’re not the same product. The same class of product maybe, but they all are different doing different things and you have to decide if that cost is worth the risk/investment or not. This is really just an old and tiring back and forth about the entitlement toward affordability we begin to feel when temptation and curiosity are put before us.


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## jaketanner (Jul 23, 2019)

Saxer said:


> I'm rather sure when the Con Moto string section will be complete (whenever that will be) it will get a good section price. I personally don't find incomplete sections useful. So I'll wait.



They made a point in saying on their site, that the sum of the intro priced instruments will be LESS than the discount on the completed library. So at least it will be around the $$450-500 range? Judging by the intro sales. And for one articulation, I think they're going to have a hard time selling.


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## jaketanner (Jul 23, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> It costs what it costs, so there is no other way to look at it.



I've accepted that PS will not consider more reasonable pricing. I will continue to buy them on sale, or wait. But most of the arguments are about what you get for the price...which in turn makes it look like it's expensive. Is Afflatus expensive? It's priced similar to SF Symphonic Strings and Berlin Strings and also VSL. Afflatus has an actual GUI with tons of tweaks, and auto divisi plus 25 different legato bowing and various other articulations...etc, etc...so their price point seems to be on par for what you get. The differences are minimal between the libraries at that price point, not worlds apart like PS. Who here would pay $799 for Afflatus if it were just one legato patch and nothing else? Furthermore, it's not even a Kontakt NI library, so people that have the free version can't even buy it. 

I do agree that it's futile to try and justify why a developer does what they do, and for the choices they make. I mean look at the stupid Apple monitor stand that costs $1k...for a STAND. It's insanity...truly insane. LOL 

One thing that we ALL agree upon here is that they sound awesome. And I guess the value of this library seems to be personal.


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## chocobitz825 (Jul 23, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> I've accepted that PS will not consider more reasonable pricing. I will continue to buy them on sale, or wait. But most of the arguments are about what you get for the price...which in turn makes it look like it's expensive. Is Afflatus expensive? It's priced similar to SF Symphonic Strings and Berlin Strings and also VSL. Afflatus has an actual GUI with tons of tweaks, and auto divisi plus 25 different legato bowing and various other articulations...etc, etc...so their price point seems to be on par for what you get. The differences are minimal between the libraries at that price point, not worlds apart like PS. Who here would pay $799 for Afflatus if it were just one legato patch and nothing else? Furthermore, it's not even a Kontakt NI library, so people that have the free version can't even buy it.
> 
> I do agree that it's futile to try and justify why a developer does what they do, and for the choices they make. I mean look at the stupid Apple monitor stand that costs $1k...for a STAND. It's insanity...truly insane. LOL
> 
> One thing that we ALL agree upon here is that they sound awesome. And I guess the value of this library seems to be personal.



I think since its rare to pay section by section these prices seem a bit off. Assuming every section was $149 (though It’s said this is not a standard price for all of them), to get 4 sections would be about $600, plus $79 for fluid shorts Which includes various sections. $679 for that quality is actually fine with me, and seems comparable to afflatus. While afflatus has more unique patches, it doesn’t necessarily provide the same variety as OT Berlin strings. So again this I why the comparison is difficult. If Con Moto came as a series that included fluid shorts priced at $600, I still think that’s reasonable given the versatility and playability of Con Moto’s Legato.


----------



## jaketanner (Jul 23, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> I still think that’s reasonable given the versatility and playability of Con Moto’s Legato.



Well here’s the other issue. Seems like the instruments are all going to even have the same flexibility. So the cello has different attacks, while the violin does not. I asked PS about this, and they just said they got luck with the cello and found those extra samples. So they included them in. But now you have instruments that are all going to okay differently than each other? It just seems like congruity isn’t something they’re even concerned with.


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## chocobitz825 (Jul 23, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Well here’s the other issue. Seems like the instruments are all going to even have the same flexibility. So the cello has different attacks, while the violin does not. I asked PS about this, and they just said they got luck with the cello and found those extra samples. So they included them in. But now you have instruments that are all going to okay differently than each other? It just seems like congruity isn’t something they’re even concerned with.


I could see why that could be an issue if one wanted to use them in place of another full library. I never really got the impression that Con Moto was supposed to be a full ensemble for these purposes. The icing on the cake right? Less a standalone library and more-so a library to work in concert with others to enhance certain lines. I don't get the feeling this was designed to be a complete solution for anyone. their disclaimers on each library’s shortcomings kind of cemented that for me.


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## jaketanner (Jul 23, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> I could see why that could be an issue if one wanted to use them in place of another full library. I never really got the impression that Con Moto was supposed to be a full ensemble for these purposes. The icing on the cake right? Less a standalone library and more-so a library to work in concert with others to enhance certain lines. I don't get the feeling this was designed to be a complete solution for anyone. their disclaimers on each library’s shortcomings kind of cemented that for me.



Well if that’s the case, and they’re supplemental, it makes their price even worse. Lol. But I definitely see why you’d feel that way.


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## chocobitz825 (Jul 23, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Well if that’s the case, and they’re supplemental, it makes their price even worse. Lol. But I definitely see why you’d feel that way.



There’s definitely no way to say its on the low end in cost. It also depends on the type of writing you do as to how far these libraries go for people. For me Metropolis Ark was supplemental and prices around $550. It’s got a different set of tools and articulations, but at its cost its an expensive supplemental library. So I mean, its just the wild west out there for pricing. As long as I can make the money back from work, I try not to think too much about it.


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## jaketanner (Jul 23, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> There’s definitely no way to say its on the low end in cost. It also depends on the type of writing you do as to how far these libraries go for people. For me Metropolis Ark was supplemental and prices around $550. It’s got a different set of tools and articulations, but at its cost its an expensive supplemental library. So I mean, its just the wild west out there for pricing. As long as I can make the money back from work, I try not to think too much about it.



That’s the thing. No work at the moment to justify buying it. Need is not urgent.


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## Tekkera (Jul 28, 2019)

Performance Samples is having a sale on a large selection of their products until 31st 🙃


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## jaketanner (Jul 28, 2019)

Tekkera said:


> Performance Samples is having a sale on a large selection of their products until 31st 🙃



Awesome. Cellos are mine then.


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## Kony (Jul 28, 2019)

Tekkera said:


> Performance Samples is having a sale on a large selection of their products until 31st 🙃


Shame Caspian isn't on sale though :(


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## jaketanner (Jul 28, 2019)

Kony said:


> Shame Caspian isn't on sale though :(



I can only assume because the complaints some (including myself) were having was the price point of the strings versus what you get.


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## Kony (Jul 28, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> I can only assume because the complaints some (including myself) were having was the price point of the strings versus what you get.


I thought so too. Having said that, Oceania goes on sale frequently even though it's a highly-rated library (I have it btw - and love it). If Oceania drops in price, one would think Caspian could too?


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## Sovereign (Jul 29, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Awesome. Cellos are mine then.


Just got them as well.


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## jaketanner (Jul 29, 2019)

Sovereign said:


> Just got them as well.



I think together with the violin B I have, and their free legacy violin, that can act as a VLN2, is a good combination. Eagerly awaiting their viola..and either they were listening to our complaints here for the flash sale, or they are getting ready to release the other strings. 

How are you liking them so far? I know there used to be an issue with double bowing on certain notes, but I haven't heard any yet.


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## Sovereign (Jul 29, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> I think together with the violin B I have, and their free legacy violin, that can act as a VLN2, is a good combination. Eagerly awaiting their viola..and either they were listening to our complaints here for the flash sale, or they are getting ready to release the other strings.
> 
> How are you liking them so far? I know there used to be an issue with double bowing on certain notes, but I haven't heard any yet.


Tried these just for 15 mins or so, but it is excellent, very playable and the tone is just great and lively. Just as I expected. Haven't had any issues yet. I really want the violas.


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## jaketanner (Sep 23, 2019)

@Jasper Blunk , can we expect the con Moto violas any time soon or any new instrument? Hope you can offer us some ETA, thanks


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## midiman (Sep 23, 2019)

@Jasper Blunk 
Yes, would love an update about the violas ETA! 

In the meantime I am enjoying angry brass 2, fluid shorts II, and the LA modern perc.
Thanks!


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## jaketanner (Sep 23, 2019)

midiman said:


> @Jasper Blunk
> Yes, would love an update about the violas ETA!
> 
> In the meantime I am enjoying angry brass 2, fluid shorts II, and the LA modern perc.
> Thanks!


At the moment, can't do anything with the strings really until at least the violas. I can get ideas sure, but Jasper needs to give us at least the violas soon. 

Sounds like you're doing trailer music?


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## DeactivatedAcc (Sep 25, 2019)

'Violins A' will be released first. They're in beta right now.

Best,
JB


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## jaketanner (Sep 25, 2019)

Jasper Blunk said:


> 'Violins A' will be released first. They're in beta right now.
> 
> Best,
> JB


Cool thanks. Reason I asked about violas is because I believe you had once mentioned they’d be next. But I’ll take anything. Lol


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## midiman (Sep 25, 2019)

Jasper Blunk said:


> 'Violins A' will be released first. They're in beta right now.
> 
> Best,
> JB


Wonderful to hear! Look forward to it, as always.


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## midiman (Sep 25, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> At the moment, can't do anything with the strings really until at least the violas. I can get ideas sure, but Jasper needs to give us at least the violas soon.
> 
> Sounds like you're doing trailer music?


I hear what you are saying, but, I politely and respectfully disagree with your assessment.

I have been using non-stop the Con Moto Cellos and Violins B, and I am in love with them. Obviously I would love to have the violas too, but I use these two con moto ALL the time, and blend it with other libs to great effect. I recommend you try it out instead of waiting for the violas. PF is a small company and Jasper is a perfectionist. That is why it takes him time to release it. I am very happy he releases these strings as a one by one section, because the alternative of having to wait for the whole sections to be complete before releasing it all would mean I could not start to use them as I have been. String libraries in general blend well with other string libraries, so there is really no reason not to start using the Con Moto cellos and violins. Believe me, if you use these con moto to bring out more important lines, and use other libraries to create a base, you will be very happy with the result. Also the Solos of the sea violin is one of my all time favorite libraries - Period. I use it as a "concert master" for the violin section, and it brings wonderful bite and details and expression to the violin section. Can't wait for Solos of the Sea Cello, viola, etc!!!!!!

By the way, I am not doing Trailer music. I do full soundtracks for films, and the Con Moto has been on virtually every film I have scored since the Con Moto came out. They are so good, that they often are blended in even after I record the live orchestra for the film to give it some extra body and definition in certain lines that may not have been 100% to my satisfaction in the live recording.


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## jaketanner (Sep 25, 2019)

midiman said:


> I hear what you are saying, but, I politely and respectfully disagree with your assessment.
> 
> I have been using non-stop the Con Moto Cellos and Violins B, and I am in love with them. Obviously I would love to have the violas too, but I use these two con moto ALL the time, and blend it with other libs to great effect. I recommend you try it out instead of waiting for the violas. PF is a small company and Jasper is a perfectionist. That is why it takes him time to release it. I am very happy he releases these strings as a one by one section, because the alternative of having to wait for the whole sections to be complete before releasing it all would mean I could not start to use them as I have been. String libraries in general blend well with other string libraries, so there is really no reason not to start using the Con Moto cellos and violins. Believe me, if you use these con moto to bring out more important lines, and use other libraries to create a base, you will be very happy with the result. Also the Solos of the sea violin is one of my all time favorite libraries - Period. I use it as a "concert master" for the violin section, and it brings wonderful bite and details and expression to the violin section. Can't wait for Solos of the Sea Cello, viola, etc!!!!!!
> 
> By the way, I am not doing Trailer music. I do full soundtracks for films, and the Con Moto has been on virtually every film I have scored since the Con Moto came out. They are so good, that they often are blended in even after I record the live orchestra for the film to give it some extra body and definition in certain lines that may not have been 100% to my satisfaction in the live recording.


Funny you mention blending with other libraries, because I recently tried the con Moto violin with SStS divisi sections...sounded really nice...made the entire section much fuller...so I get what you're saying. I just like to have a complete section to work with most of the time. I also have the SOS violin to add in there.


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## ism (Sep 25, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> Funny you mention blending with other libraries, because I recently tried the con Moto violin with SStS divisi sections...sounded really nice...made the entire section much fuller...so I get what you're saying. I just like to have a complete section to work with most of the time. I also have the SOS violin to add in there.



I was perfectly happy not having con moto ... until you wrote that.


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## jaketanner (Sep 30, 2019)

@Jasper Blunk , any ETA on the Violin A? I know you mentioned in beta, but if you can elaborate how close you think, I'd appreciate it.


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## GingerMaestro (Oct 1, 2019)

Does anyone know if the logic issue refered to in this post got fixed, or if they still don't work very well. I would love to pick up the celli for a project I'm working on..Thanks


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## pipedr (Nov 10, 2019)

WhiteNoiz said:


> Loved the sound and approach and couldn't resist the intro pricing, even if it's just legato sustains. Not quite sure what I'll do with it but hopefully this will motivate Jasper to produce more goodies. Waiting to see what will come next. Will try it in a bit.
> 
> *Edit*: Ok, played with it for a while. It's decent, it adds some nice movement and drama. A bit quirky to program, lag can be a bit problematic but workable. Could probably use a bit wider dynamics, you'll prob need a filter for very low dynamics and probably some EQ or volume ride for pretty high dynamics (mic volumes too). The releases seem to conflict with the attacks at some points for some reason. A fade to silence would be a nice addition. Can work solo for calmer pieces, for others it's probably better for layering (or at least with the rest of the sections). It's likely I'll complete the bundle, probably on some sale. Still curious for the next releases though; keep 'em coming.
> 
> ...


After a few months with Con Moto violins, how are you liking them? Care to post any more examples showing strengths and weaknesses?


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## DeactivatedAcc (Nov 25, 2019)

"Con Moto - Violins A" is up next. Here are some examples.


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## jaketanner (Nov 25, 2019)

Jasper Blunk said:


> "Con Moto - Violins A" is up next. Here are some examples.



I am hoping this will be out within a week? I'm holding off on finishing a project. Currently using violin B and the free sustain patch, but have a feeling violin A will be slightly better for this application.


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## artomatic (Nov 25, 2019)

If I knew when the release is, it would prevent me from spending all of my BF budget...


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## jaketanner (Nov 25, 2019)

artomatic said:


> If I knew when the release is, it would prevent me from spending all of my BF budget...


When they come out, it's only gonna be something like $79 anyway...hardly a BF budget in these parts of the woods.. LOL.


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## AndyP (Nov 27, 2019)

I'm totally hot on mega symphony & choir. If this has the usual quality it is a must have without having heard it before.


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## X-Bassist (Dec 4, 2019)

AndyP said:


> I'm totally hot on mega symphony & choir. If this has the usual quality it is a must have without having heard it before.


I have an orchestra on the Brooklyn Bridge I want to sell you.


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## AndyP (Dec 4, 2019)

X-Bassist said:


> I have an orchestra on the Brooklyn Bridge I want to sell you.


Cool! From there I can drive straight after that to Williamsburg Bridge and watch St. Pauli in the East River Bar. And drink 1 or 2 or 3 or ... Brooklyn Lager.


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## DeactivatedAcc (Dec 4, 2019)

Violins A is now available: http://www.performancesamples.com/conmoto-violins-a


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## Geocranium (Dec 4, 2019)

Would love to hear a line A/B'd against Violins B. I have Violins B and enjoy them a lot and am wondering if there's a big enough difference in sonic quality to also pick this one up. 

Is this purely meant to be a change in timbre/positioning from Violins B, or does it have additional features? Basically is this like an upgraded version of B, or a variation on it?


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## artomatic (Dec 4, 2019)

jaketanner said:


> When they come out, it's only gonna be something like $79 anyway...hardly a BF budget in these parts of the woods.. LOL.




Well, that figure doubled!!


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## jaketanner (Dec 4, 2019)

artomatic said:


> Well, that figure doubled!!


I mean, I can see it being worth the $119 it is now for loyalty users...but man, $209 for full price is a hard sell I think. But come Friday, it's mine.. LOL It's already close to $500 for 3 legato only instruments...I am now scared as to the price of the chamber strings to be released...


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## Daniel (Dec 5, 2019)

Jasper Blunk said:


> Violins A is now available: http://www.performancesamples.com/conmoto-violins-a



Really beautiful!


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## Ric4001 (Dec 5, 2019)

How do you enter the loyalty discount coupon code? I see no coupon code box on the purchase page.


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## midiman (Dec 5, 2019)

Ric4001 said:


> How do you enter the loyalty discount coupon code? I see no coupon code box on the purchase page.



It is not on the purchase page, it is after you input the payment information, just before completing the order there is a place to put the code. I purchased, and it works.


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## DeactivatedAcc (Feb 17, 2020)

Sale on Violins A, Violins B, and Cellos - through March 10th, 2020

Con Moto - Violins A is on sale for $179 (reg. $209)
Con Moto - Violins B is on sale for $99 (reg. $149)
Con Moto - Cellos is on sale for $99 (reg. $149)

A short article I wrote on the 'active-bow sustain' approach used in Con Moto: https://performancesamples.com/techniques-creating-movement-in-strings/


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## jaketanner (Feb 17, 2020)

So how soon for the rest of the series??


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## DeactivatedAcc (Feb 17, 2020)

jaketanner said:


> So how soon for the rest of the series??


Violas will be the next Performance Samples release. Basses are quite far along as well.

JB


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## jaketanner (Feb 17, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> Violas will be the next Performance Samples release. Basses are quite far along as well.
> 
> JB


You think before Nashville release?


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## DeactivatedAcc (Feb 17, 2020)

That's the plan - Nashville still has a bit to go, but most of the work is done. Legatos to finish, some noise reduction to do, and KSP/scripting and graphics still in the pipeline. All the shorts rep timing and finesse is complete (thankfully), and those patches are all built, as well as the other content. 

At this point, I don't see Nashville being released anywhere before 3 months from now.


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## jaketanner (Feb 17, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> That's the plan - Nashville still has a bit to do, but most of the work is done. Legatos to finish, some noise reduction to do, and KSP/scripting and graphics still in the pipeline. At this point, I don't see Nashville being released anywhere before 3 months from now.


ck, thanks for the update. Can't wait to complete con Moto.


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## NickDorito (Mar 10, 2020)

For you all who aren't on Facebook:


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## Jon W (Mar 10, 2020)

Their site says they are not obligated to support their products, per EULA. If you want to deal with privacy you have to contact giant monolithic non-helpful organizations such as Network Advertising Initiative and Digital Advertising Alliance.


----------



## anjwilson (Mar 10, 2020)

Jon W said:


> Their site says they are not obligated to support their products, per EULA. If you want to deal with privacy you have to contact giant monolithic non-helpful organizations such as Network Advertising Initiative and Digital Advertising Alliance.



Please keep in mind that the company Performance Samples is essentially a one-man show, Jasper Blunk. See his recent discussion regarding your concerns here: 

https://vi-control.net/community/threads/oceania-oceania-ii-initial-demos.61160/page-7#post-4506484


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## Jon W (Mar 10, 2020)

anjwilson said:


> Please keep in mind that the company Performance Samples is essentially a one-man show, Jasper Blunk. See his recent discussion regarding your concerns here:
> 
> https://vi-control.net/community/threads/oceania-oceania-ii-initial-demos.61160/page-7#post-4506484



Okay. Explains why his EULA says no obligation for support. But his site's marriage to Big Data? Nope.


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## DeactivatedAcc (Mar 12, 2020)

Hi all,

I finally finished Violas and they're available now at this link: www.performancesamples.com/conmoto-violas

I have also attached some photographs from the session.


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## stargazer (Mar 12, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I finally finished Violas and they're available now at this link: www.performancesamples.com/conmoto-violas
> 
> I have also attached some photographs from the session.



Sounds great!


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## AndyP (Mar 12, 2020)

Wow!


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## Geocranium (Mar 12, 2020)

$60 intro price for owners of the other existing products in the series... Violas here I come.


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## jaketanner (Mar 12, 2020)

Awesome!!


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## artinro (Mar 12, 2020)

As with everything Jasper touches, these are stellar.


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## Vik (Mar 13, 2020)

At that price I don't expect the violas to be as stellar as the cello/violin A in terms of single line legato demos, but I'm very curious about hearing them.


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## Land of Missing Parts (Mar 13, 2020)

Since legato is the selling point, it'd be nice to have a demo/example of a single viola line, instead of chords.


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## AndyP (Mar 13, 2020)

I will license the violas, then I have almost completed the ConMoto series.
The sound is just great and my anticipation and curiosity about the Nashville Chamber Strings is growing.


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## jaketanner (Mar 13, 2020)

AndyP said:


> my anticipation and curiosity about the Nashville Chamber Strings is growing.


Mine too, with worry about cost. Lol. Will be worth it I’m sure. Meantime can’t wait to complete con Moto.


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## Guffy (Mar 13, 2020)

How do I get the loyalty discount?
Am i supposed to recieve an email with it or is there something else i've missed?
Edit: Nvm, just noticed the code on the product page itself!


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## Land of Missing Parts (Mar 13, 2020)

Guffy said:


> How do I get the loyalty discount?
> Am i supposed to recieve an email with it or is there something else i've missed?


From the website.


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## Guffy (Mar 13, 2020)

So you don't really have to own anything to get the loyalty discount.
Cool for those who don't i guess


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## Land of Missing Parts (Mar 13, 2020)

Guffy said:


> So you don't really have to own anything to get the loyalty discount.
> Cool for those who don't i guess


Maybe...but something tells me that Jasper has a brain and has thought of this. I'm guessing that it checks your info when ringing out.


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## jaketanner (Mar 13, 2020)

Land of Missing Parts said:


> Maybe...but something tells me that Jasper has a brain and has thought of this. I'm guessing that it checks your info when ringing out.


Funny thing, I thought of this many times...I own all of them, so for me it's not a worry, but I didn't get any inclination that there is a check of sorts...but could be wrong. Maybe if goes by your email? Not sure...but I think Jasper is also a trusting person and perhaps leaves it to our morals to do the right thing. Man, can't wait for the basses..


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## Fry777 (Mar 13, 2020)

Anyone willing to post a lyrical line made with these Violas ?


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## AndyP (Mar 13, 2020)

Where do I enter the code? When I click order I will be taken directly to PayPal at the normal introductory price ... confused ...
Edit: ok, it was mentioned in this thread ... downloading ...


----------



## AndyP (Mar 13, 2020)

Fry777 said:


> Anyone willing to post a lyrical line made with these Violas ?


I'd be glad to. When my download is finished and I have recorded something.


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## AndyP (Mar 13, 2020)

Out of the box ... a quick one ...
actually this thing is longer but somehow stops here after 1:01... Hmm...
I love the beautiful tone of these violas.


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## Vladimir Bulaev (Mar 14, 2020)

Can anyone post a faster and more melodic line? I am surprised that there are no such lirical demos for violas. Like these:


----------



## Vik (Mar 14, 2020)

Agree, that would be interesting. And/or something like this:


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## Vik (Mar 16, 2020)

Btw - have any of you with both violin A and violin B any opinions about how they compare for instance for the kind of phrase that is used in the uppermost demo in the post above?


----------



## jaketanner (Mar 16, 2020)

Vik said:


> Btw - have any of you with both violin A and violin B any opinions about how they compare for instance for the kind of phrase that is used in the uppermost demo in the post above?


Not exactly sure what you mean in terms of comparison, but I have both...I use them as Vin 1 and Vin 2...interchangeably, since they each have a different character in tone...so depending on what I am after, one will be feature. But Violin A, I believe is the overall "better" of the two...a bit brighter and better legato. Once the basses are released, it's a nice complete legato string section.


----------



## Gerbil (Mar 16, 2020)

Downloaded. Here's a quick play through. First impression: I love it, just like the other libraries of Jasper's that I've purchased. You can always tell there is a keen-eared musician crafting these. Feels similar to the cellos to play.


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## jaketanner (Mar 16, 2020)

Gerbil said:


> Downloaded. Here's a quick play through. First impression: I love it, just like the other libraries of Jasper's that I've purchased. You can always tell there is a keen-eared musician crafting these. Feels similar to the cellos to play.


Sounds good. Haven't had the chance to play around with it yet after downloading. So do you feel it has the extra attacks that the cellos have? It does sound great.


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## Obi-Wan Spaghetti (Mar 16, 2020)

jaketanner said:


> Not exactly sure what you mean in terms of comparison, but I have both...I use them as Vin 1 and Vin 2...interchangeably, since they each have a different character in tone...so depending on what I am after, one will be feature. But Violin A, I believe is the overall "better" of the two...a bit brighter and better legato. Once the basses are released, it's a nice complete legato string section.



I think describing this library as legato is a mistake. Seems to me it can do a lot more when i listen to the Violin B active bow sus. inprov. demo like short notes(none sus.) etc. Con moto Cello demo 9, 10 and 13 show similar possibilities. I assume violin A and violas can do the same? At least i hope it does.


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## Gerbil (Mar 16, 2020)

jaketanner said:


> Sounds good. Haven't had the chance to play around with it yet after downloading. So do you feel it has the extra attacks that the cellos have? It does sound great.



They do have some digging in at the higher dynamics. Very playable.


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## Lionel Schmitt (Mar 16, 2020)

Here is some random playing around with the library, straight out of the box. 








CM Violas Random Rough Playing (5 sec. of silence at start) - Clyp


Listen to CM Violas Random Rough Playing (5 sec. of silence at start) | Clyp is the easiest way to record, upload and share audio.




clyp.it


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## jaketanner (Mar 19, 2020)

@Jasper Blunk ...is there any delay due to the coronavirus on the CM basses release?


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## DeactivatedAcc (Mar 25, 2020)

Hi everyone:

I've just released Basses, the last section of Con Moto. There's also a 'Complete Bundle' available https://performancesamples.com/conmoto-completebundle (here).

Unrelated to Con Moto, but I also released some free https://performancesamples.com/abpsoloiststestsession/ (test session patches) recently.







More info: http://www.performancesamples.com/conmoto-basses


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## dbudimir (Mar 25, 2020)

Thanks Jasper!!! Collection complete!! Great stuff! Also thanks for the freebie.


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## jaketanner (Mar 25, 2020)

I’m complete as well.


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## Obi-Wan Spaghetti (Mar 25, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> Hi everyone:
> 
> I've just released Basses, the last section of Con Moto.
> 
> ...



Please prolong the loyalty offer for violas up to apr. 8 as well. Reason= Covid 19.


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## NickDorito (Mar 26, 2020)

Obi-Wan Spaghetti said:


> Please prolong the loyalty offer for violas up to apr. 8 as well. Reason= Covid 19.



Come on bro let’s not get crazy

The bundle is out now btw.


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## Marco_D (Mar 26, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> There's also a 'Complete Bundle' available https://performancesamples.com/conmoto-completebundle (here).



Hello Jasper, if I already own one of the libraries in the bundle, do I still get the same price?


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## Wolf68 (Mar 26, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> Hi everyone:
> 
> I've just released Basses, the last section of Con Moto. There's also a 'Complete Bundle' available https://performancesamples.com/conmoto-completebundle (here).
> 
> ...




these octaves sound sweet & smooth!


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## lucor (Mar 26, 2020)

First off, I really love Con Moto and everything Performance Samples does, but I can't help but feel a bit fooled by the bundle price.
I own all sections except the Cellos (missed the sale on that one, currently waiting until the next), but haven't really used them much yet, because I was waiting for the whole String section to be completed. I still purchased them all at Intro price because I'm a huge fan of Jasper's work + it always said buying the individual sections at intro price will be cheaper than the bundle price.
I'm not 100% sure about these prices anymore, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I think it was something like Basses (49$) + Violas (59$) + Violins B (79$) + Violins A (129$) + Cellos (99$) = 415$ while the current bundle price is 329$ and you even get River Piano for free on top of that.
It would still all be good if there was a "Complete Your Bundle" so I could purchase the Cellos for 13$, but doesn't look like that's possible either?


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## davidson (Mar 26, 2020)

I'm still unclear on what the con-motos actually are. Are they legato libraries with some kind of re-bowing? Are they all-in-one performance legato patches that can also play runs and shorts without keyswitches (up to a point - I know there are the dedicated fluid shorts libraries).

I 'get' where Jasper is coming from with his attitude to his products, but it doesn't make it any less confusing trying to sort through the products.


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## Land of Missing Parts (Mar 26, 2020)

davidson said:


> Are they legato libraries with some kind of re-bowing?


Yes legato patches. They re-bow (rather than slur) each time you play a note.


davidson said:


> Are they all-in-one performance legato patches that can also play runs and shorts without keyswitches


No. They don't do runs or fast playing all that well.


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## johanholmstrom (Mar 26, 2020)

Marco_D said:


> Hello Jasper, if I already own one of the libraries in the bundle, do I still get the same price?


Wonder the same thing...


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## davidson (Mar 26, 2020)

Land of Missing Parts said:


> Yes legato patches. They re-bow (rather than slur) each time you play a note.
> 
> No. They don't do runs or fast playing all that well.



Thanks for that. If you've used both, how do they compare to soaring strings in concept and use? They seem similar but again, I might off the mark.


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## Geocranium (Mar 26, 2020)

davidson said:


> Thanks for that. If you've used both, how do they compare to soaring strings in concept and use? They seem similar but again, I might off the mark.



In concept, they're very similar. Just purely legato patches from each section. IMO, Con Moto sounds a lot better and more natural. Soaring is really good for like FF passage that cuts through a mix because the samples are a lot more "hyped" sounding. That is, it feels like they've already been EQ'd and have a lot of highs in them already.

Con Moto on the other hand is darker and more wet. The sound and feel of the library is also much better in my opinion. It just feels really good to play and you get amazing results will little editing. What Jasper captures I think is truly unique and musically inspiring.


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## davidson (Mar 26, 2020)

Thanks @Geocranium. 

@Jasper Blunk short walkthroughs for your products would be really helpful, and the difference between purchasing or not, for me at least.


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## Land of Missing Parts (Mar 26, 2020)

Con Moto sounds really good, but only if you write in a slow-to-medium paced bowed-legato mode for solid chunks, without breaking that up with shorts or fast legato. Which isn't uncommon.

Personally, I don't find myself using the Con Moto Violins B I got a few months ago, because I need to be able to do those other things too, which means I need to mix it with my other strings library. And then transitioning from one to the other becomes a pain.


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## DeactivatedAcc (Mar 26, 2020)

lucor said:


> First off, I really love Con Moto and everything Performance Samples does, but I can't help but feel a bit fooled by the bundle price.
> I own all sections except the Cellos (missed the sale on that one, currently waiting until the next), but haven't really used them much yet, because I was waiting for the whole String section to be completed. I still purchased them all at Intro price because I'm a huge fan of Jasper's work + it always said buying the individual sections at intro price will be cheaper than the bundle price.
> I'm not 100% sure about these prices anymore, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I think it was something like Basses (49$) + Violas (59$) + Violins B (79$) + Violins A (129$) + Cellos (99$) = 415$ while the current bundle price is 329$ and you even get River Piano for free on top of that.
> It would still all be good if there was a "Complete Your Bundle" so I could purchase the Cellos for 13$, but doesn't look like that's possible either?



Dear Lucor,
I really appreciate your support. Unfortunately, aside from the basic loyalty codes thus far, there isn't a non-manual system in place for the complete bundle that can account for prorate algorithms (i.e. specific discounts if you already own one of the libraries). As originally stated on the product pages, the bundle pricing at full price is less discounted than the sum of the intro prices of the individual sections.

Best,
Jasper


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## Land of Missing Parts (Mar 26, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> Dear Lucor,
> I really appreciate your support. Unfortunately, aside from the basic loyalty codes thus far, there isn't a non-manual system in place for the complete bundle that can account for prorate algorithms (i.e. specific discounts if you already own one of the libraries). As originally stated on the product pages, the bundle pricing at full price is less discounted than the sum of the intro prices of the individual sections.
> 
> Best,
> Jasper


Any chance you'll add the dynamic range expansion/compression feature to Con Moto Violins B? It would help Con Moto mix with other strings libraries.


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## Obi-Wan Spaghetti (Mar 26, 2020)

davidson said:


> I'm still unclear on what the con-motos actually are. Are they legato libraries with some kind of re-bowing? Are they all-in-one performance legato patches that can also play runs and shorts without keyswitches (up to a point - I know there are the dedicated fluid shorts libraries).
> 
> I 'get' where Jasper is coming from with his attitude to his products, but it doesn't make it any less confusing trying to sort through the products.



There are 2 patchs. Legato and sus. The leg is what set Con Moto apart from the others imo. The thing is because it was taken from real performances it's sounds alive and consistent throughout the whole range. Alternating bow up and down with attitude makes it very expressive. You can listen to the best demos I've heard by DarkestShadow that shows off what Violin A can do in this link below .

https://vi-control.net/community/threads/performance-samples-con-moto-violins-a.87064/page-3

I've never hear anything that sounds as real as this. As for the sustain patch, it seems it can be pretty versatile judging from the 1st demo of the Violin B. But i bet it takes a lot of fiddling in the pianroll editor...


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## TomaeusD (Mar 28, 2020)

I hopped on the bundle against my better judgment. 

The tone and playability is some of the best in this style of strings. Obviously it just has one legato speed (quick) and it sounds to me like there is only one round-robin, but these are apparently overcome with the performance recording techniques. I do have an issue in every section where it will occasionally cut out mid transition to another note. Also don't hit multiple keys at once in legato mode.

Overall I'm impressed with Con Moto's quality and ease of use. Yet it may seem pricey because of its lack of articulations and might not be justifiable if you already own a solid string library like CSS. I can see why Nashville Chamber Strings will cost a pretty penny, but I am looking forward to hearing that when it is completed. The pizzicato demo is lovely.


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## jaketanner (Mar 28, 2020)

I am hoping that owners of the complete Con Moto library will have a better discount on the Nashville strings


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## X-Bassist (Mar 31, 2020)

jaketanner said:


> I am hoping that owners of the complete Con Moto library will have a better discount on the Nashville strings


Considering Nash is a co-release (really an Ollie release that PS is working on) I wouldn’t expect any crossover price with Con Moto. I don’t think PS has any influence on the release or pricing of Nash (I think Jasper is a hired hand). But, yes, it doesn’t hurt to ask.


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## jaketanner (Mar 31, 2020)

X-Bassist said:


> Considering Nash is a co-release (really an Ollie release that PS is working on) I wouldn’t expect any crossover price with Con Moto. I don’t think PS has any influence on the release or pricing of Nash (I think Jasper is a hired hand). But, yes, it doesn’t hurt to ask.


Yeah thought about that after. Let’s hope anyway.


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## X-Bassist (Apr 6, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> Dear Lucor,
> I really appreciate your support. Unfortunately, aside from the basic loyalty codes thus far, there isn't a non-manual system in place for the complete bundle that can account for prorate algorithms (i.e. specific discounts if you already own one of the libraries). As originally stated on the product pages, the bundle pricing at full price is less discounted than the sum of the intro prices of the individual sections.
> 
> Best,
> Jasper


Hey Jasper, I'm trying to pick up the basses to add to the Cello I own, but I can't figure out how to use Paypal AND the discount code, which can only be entered on your credit card page. Please help before your intro price ends. Thank you.


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## DeactivatedAcc (Apr 6, 2020)

X-Bassist said:


> Hey Jasper, I'm trying to pick up the basses to add to the Cello I own, but I can't figure out how to use Paypal AND the discount code, which can only be entered on your credit card page. Please help before your intro price ends. Thank you.


Dear X-Bassist,
After entering details into Paypal, it should send you back to FastSpring, which will allow you to enter the code (on the FastSpring page) before you confirm the purchase.

Best,
JB


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## X-Bassist (Apr 6, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> Dear X-Bassist,
> After entering details into Paypal, it should send you back to FastSpring, which will allow you to enter the code (on the FastSpring page) before you confirm the purchase.
> 
> Best,
> JB


Thanks, I'll try it. Just weird to pay $59 on Paypal then after go back to add a discount code. I've never seen Paypal work that way. Thanks again for the quick response.


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## AndyP (Apr 6, 2020)

I used the Con Moto Strings today with the Spaggetti Western library ... I love them again and again. The sound is simply unbeatable.


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## jaketanner (Apr 6, 2020)

AndyP said:


> I used the Con Moto Strings today with the Spaggetti Western library ... I love them again and again. The sound is simply unbeatable.


I agree the sound is excellent...just wish they were recorded wider. When I use the entire section, as a whole it's a bit narrower than say SF. Sure I can use the pan, but I don't like using the close mics too much, and panning the Decca and ambient mic is weird. however, layered with CSS it's fantastic!


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## R.Cato (Apr 7, 2020)

I had a quick play with the complete Con Moto bundle yesterday and have some thoughts I would like to share here:

1) The sound of these recordings is great. I played along some soundtracks recorded at AIR and surprisingly the sound comes close. Based on the available demos I never expected it to work so well as an ambient library. For me this a stand out feature and based on my preferences makes it way more attractive than CSS, which has been my main library for string legatos so far. If someone asked me to describe the sound of Con Moto I would say: It sounds like a modern classical recording. If you are looking for a sound like that there is now a library out there.

2) The crossfades between the dynamic layers is really smooth. The transitions of intensity of vibrato and bow pressure feel organic and allow performing melodies in a lyrical way. That's also its biggest strength in my opinion: Singing melodies.
The only downside I have here is that you don't get a lot of room for performing quieter more intimate lines. CC11 is an absolute must to get the most out of the lower dynamics presented here. Performance Samples share that with every potential customer on their webstore. So this wasn't a surprise. For me that's ok. It's no dealbreaker at all, because the dynamics included are imo perfectly chosen for what this library was designed for. 

3) I enjoy the bowed legato way more than the standard slurs you get in most libraries. To me this is more like how the string orchestras I recorded with would sound in 95% of the cases. Most mockups I hear feature exaggerated slurs, which you'd not get out of a session orchestra unless you specifically write that down. Also the legato is very consistent in timing and performance. I won't say it's 100% consistent, but a real musician also isn't 100% consistent in every legato transition. This brings me to the point I like most about this collection:

4) These strings are predictable in how they are going to perform the midi you throw at them. No sudden bumps or early/late sample edits. Yes you need 140 ms of negative delay to make them sit on the grid, but it's always 140 ms (except the additional articulations of the basses). To me that's how it should be and that's my biggest issue with CSS or other string libraries out there. Developers either decide to include the complete natural attack and then often end up with uneven sample edits, or they don't include them and the samples start to sound like a synth stab. Or you have different delays per legato type and another one for the basic sustains, which again makes performing not enjoyable.

Con Moto is my new favourite legato collection atm. Now pls let's add some tremolos and maybe a marcato (I haven't tried layering fluid shorts and con moto together does it work?).


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## Nyran (Apr 7, 2020)

R.Cato said:


> I had a quick play with the complete Con Moto bundle yesterday and have some thoughts I would like to share here:
> 
> 1) The sound of these recordings is great. I played along some soundtracks recorded at AIR and surprisingly the sound comes close. Based on the available demos I never expected it to work so well as an ambient library. For me this a stand out feature and based on my preferences makes it way more attractive than CSS, which has been my main library for string legatos so far. If someone asked me to describe the sound of Con Moto I would say: It sounds like a modern classical recording. If you are looking for a sound like that there is now a library out there.
> 
> ...



I own the Cellos, violas and violin B (Which I use for both violin sections, violin A seems too pricey - I might go for it on a next sale, atm using scs basses with it). I just completed a full piece using it (layered with scs) and I agree on everything you said. I haven’t found another library that sounds and plays like that so far!
I have tried it in the past (cellos and violins at the time) with fluid shorts with mixed results, it can blend but the shorts are pretty limited. I would love a Con Moto expansion with full section patches of pizz, trem, marc, stac and maybe a soft sus (so it matches the hall and sound). It would be superb and pretty much complete.


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## DeactivatedAcc (Apr 7, 2020)

Nyran said:


> I would love a Con Moto expansion with full section patches of pizz, trem, marc, stac and maybe a soft sus (so it matches the hall and sound). It would be superb and pretty much complete.


A 'Con Moto II' follow-up could be in the books at some point. But likely symphonic-sized (16-0-12-10-8), with more romantic, slurry legato, more dynamics, and a handful of performance-sourced articulations covering most of the standard stuff.

For now I'm wrapping up 'Solos of the Sea - Solo Violin B' and Oceania II. After that, (in no particular order) there will be things like Angry Brass Pro - Soloists, Angry Winds Pro, other Solos of the Sea string releases, a fast-phrase-esque chamber string lib that's been in production a while, and probably around a dozen+ other projects I have in various stages of production.


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## jaketanner (Apr 7, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> A 'Con Moto II' follow-up could be in the books at some point. But likely symphonic-sized (16-0-12-10-8), with more romantic, slurry legato, more dynamics, and a handful of performance-sourced articulations covering most of the standard stuff.
> 
> For now I'm wrapping up 'Solos of the Sea - Solo Violin B' and Oceania II. After that, (in no particular order) there will be things like Angry Brass Pro - Soloists, Angry Winds Pro, other Solos of the Sea string releases, a fast-phrase-esque chamber string lib that's been in production a while, and probably around a dozen+ other projects I have in various stages of production.



Awesome can't wait!!! And I'd love a symphonic Con Moto...but this sounds like it's years away.


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## axb312 (Apr 7, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> A 'Con Moto II' follow-up could be in the books at some point. But likely symphonic-sized (16-0-12-10-8), with more romantic, slurry legato, more dynamics, and a handful of performance-sourced articulations covering most of the standard stuff.
> 
> For now I'm wrapping up 'Solos of the Sea - Solo Violin B' and Oceania II. After that, (in no particular order) there will be things like Angry Brass Pro - Soloists, Angry Winds Pro, other Solos of the Sea string releases, a fast-phrase-esque chamber string lib that's been in production a while, and probably around a dozen+ other projects I have in various stages of production.



Hope you don't mind me asking....Angry Winds Pro?


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## José Herring (Apr 7, 2020)

I love the PS libraries I have. They shine where all my other libraries fall down.


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## DeactivatedAcc (Apr 7, 2020)

axb312 said:


> Hope you don't mind me asking....Angry Winds Pro?



It's a set of solo ww sampled in the style of Angry Brass Pro - oboe, clarinet, bassoon, flute, and piccolo.

Best,
Jasper


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## AndyP (Apr 7, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> It's a set of solo ww sampled in the style of Angry Brass Pro - oboe, clarinet, bassoon, flute, and piccolo.
> 
> Best,
> Jasper


Well I don't want to push, but a complete PS orchestra library with all instruments and the most important articulations is what we are all waiting for!


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## axb312 (Apr 7, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> It's a set of solo ww sampled in the style of Angry Brass Pro - oboe, clarinet, bassoon, flute, and piccolo.
> 
> Best,
> Jasper



Thanks. What does in the style of angry brass pro mean though?


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## prodigalson (Apr 7, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> A 'Con Moto II' follow-up could be in the books at some point. But likely symphonic-sized (16-0-12-10-8), with more romantic, slurry legato, more dynamics, and a handful of performance-sourced articulations covering most of the standard stuff.
> 
> For now I'm wrapping up 'Solos of the Sea - Solo Violin B' and Oceania II. After that, (in no particular order) there will be things like Angry Brass Pro - Soloists, Angry Winds Pro, other Solos of the Sea string releases, a fast-phrase-esque chamber string lib that's been in production a while, and probably around a dozen+ other projects I have in various stages of production.
> 
> ...




Question for those of us considering the Con Moto bundle: Is it fair to assume the upcoming Nashville Chamber Strings library will have similar legato response and playability to the Con Moto series? in other words, is the NCS library essentially a drier, smaller version of Con Moto but with additional articulations or is there something dramatically different about how you approached programming the legatos of the different libraries? Thx


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## DeactivatedAcc (Apr 8, 2020)

axb312 said:


> Thanks. What does in the style of angry brass pro mean though?


It will have the same/similar type of playability/function, i.e. you should be able to write similar lines to ABP.



prodigalson said:


> Question for those of us considering the Con Moto bundle: Is it fair to assume the upcoming Nashville Chamber Strings library will have similar legato response and playability to the Con Moto series? in other words, is the NCS library essentially a drier, smaller version of Con Moto but with additional articulations or is there something dramatically different about how you approached programming the legatos of the different libraries? Thx



The sampling approach (and ens. size) was very similar, while the resulting sound & vibe wholly different. CM leans toward symphonic and classical - NCS is a very dry studio sound with a practically insignificant tail.


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## prodigalson (Apr 8, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> NCS is a very dry studio sound with a practically insignificant tail.



This with the quality of legatos from CM means you'll have me as a customer


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## Geocranium (Apr 9, 2020)

Jasper Blunk said:


> It's a set of solo ww sampled in the style of Angry Brass Pro - oboe, clarinet, bassoon, flute, and piccolo.
> 
> Best,
> Jasper



This sounds like a dream come true. I've been so excited to see how woodwinds get the Performance Samples love. From your Angry Brass Pro Solos freebies, that finished library is already a guaranteed purchase from me. Woodwinds definitely could use the same attention to detail that only you can bring!


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## artomatic (Apr 10, 2020)

Are there no portamento patches?


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## Obi-Wan Spaghetti (Apr 10, 2020)

artomatic said:


> Are there no portamento patches?


Legato only with a slight protamento on the biggest interval like 7th interval, octave. Like good legato should be.


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## Vik (Apr 14, 2020)

Just a short note about the Con Moto violins A, which I had a chance to try for the first time today (and I'm impressed so far). I plan to make a violin comparison with 7-8 (or max 9) libraries – containing at least 4 different examples played by the involved libraries, just like I recently did with cellos. Pease let me know, here or in a PM, if you happen to have any suggestions in terms of what kind of material you want me to test these violins with. Thanks.


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## LamaRose (Apr 15, 2020)

Thinking of picking up the bundle before coming across posts regarding Logic X cpu issues in Kontakt 5... is this still ongoing or would I have to get Kontakt 6? Forking out for K6 would be a dealbreaker for me.


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