# Which synth do you think produces the best bass?



## germancomponist (Nov 26, 2018)

A question for all synth programmers: Which synth do you think produces the best bass?

I am not asking only about the sound, but the deep frequencies. Many synthesizers break off on this topic. Suddenly the pressure falls away... .

What is your experience?

Edit: *I would like to compare audio examples.*


----------



## studiostuff (Nov 26, 2018)

I've got some h'ware stuff I like. But if we're talking s'ware... 

I like (in no special order) Zebra (2 and HZ), Omni and Monark. 

All of those will move some low air. Who doesn't like that?


----------



## germancomponist (Nov 26, 2018)

I would like to compare some audio examples .... .


----------



## studiostuff (Nov 26, 2018)

Achh... Is that productive? Isn't it very contextual?


----------



## Tiggerdyret (Nov 29, 2018)

Comparing samples is rather ridiculous. There are too many options to cover. Sure, if you made hundred of sounds and tried to get them as close as possible you could get a usable comparison, but then there is the element of playing into the synths strengths and make something that sounds good on that particular synth.

I personally mostly use Omnisphere for my basses, but I mostly use Omnisphere for everything 
Monark is great too, but doesn't do anything I can't do with Omnisphere, but I haven't compared them. Serum and Massive are great for modern bass stuff. Serum sounds very clean and Massive is very aggressive, but Serum can probably get aggresive too I you wanted it to. If you are considering any NI products get the Komplete Bundle instead.

I think most synths can make a good sounding bass, if you use them right. It all depends on the song and how you use it. I do put a good saturation plugin like Kush Omega N on most of my synth basses which gives them that warm low frequency harmonics. So experiment with that.


----------



## gamma-ut (Nov 29, 2018)

If anything, many softsynths produce way too much bass. Stick a spectrum analyser on any of them - they will easily push out plenty below 100Hz, which eats up a lot of dynamic range, and there really is no reason why they shouldn't do that. So, are we talking about actual bass or the psychoacoustic perception of bass? Which is often more about what's happening between 100 and 300Hz and the shape of the attack.

If you use something like Sylenth1, working with the phase, envelopes and distortion has a dramatic effect on bass perception. I think what happens with hardware is that the circuits get tuned to accentuate some behaviours that people associated with "beefier bass".

In general, you're going to get better results with something that has an EQ in the output section, maybe a compressor and lots of control over phase and envelopes.


----------



## studiostuff (Nov 29, 2018)

gamma-ut said:


> ... which eats up a lot of dynamic range...



What...?


----------



## Saxer (Nov 29, 2018)

germancomponist said:


> *I would like to compare audio examples.*


So what are you looking for? Pure waveforms? Filtered waveforms? Bass patches? Included FX or dry?

I think it's comparing apples and oranges if there's no reference patch. And not all bass heavy sounds work great in a mix. I just removed a synth bass from a (kind of) dancefloor and replaced it by a sample bass guitar because it was too fat and dark. I really like those synth basses but most of the time I remove them from the mix except for drones.

I got the Roland SE-02 a while ago and it's a really cool bass machine. I have a few more hardware synths (Peak, MicrowaveXT, MiniBrute, Matrix1000) but I rarely use them in projects. It's more of a hobby inside the music job.


----------



## sostenuto (Nov 29, 2018)

I use Omni2.5 for almost everything, yet Repro1 /5 is cool for Bass …. and u-he does provide a Demo.


----------



## germancomponist (Nov 29, 2018)

Saxer said:


> So what are you looking for? Pure waveforms? Filtered waveforms? Bass patches? Included FX or dry?
> 
> I think it's comparing apples and oranges if there's no reference patch. And not all bass heavy sounds work great in a mix. I just removed a synth bass from a (kind of) dancefloor and replaced it by a sample bass guitar because it was too fat and dark. I really like those synth basses but most of the time I remove them from the mix except for drones.
> 
> I got the Roland SE-02 a while ago and it's a really cool bass machine. I have a few more hardware synths (Peak, MicrowaveXT, MiniBrute, Matrix1000) but I rarely use them in projects. It's more of a hobby inside the music job.


I think a short bass line, from high notes to low notes. Give me some time and I will start it and post also the midi-file, so we all can compare.


----------



## gsilbers (Nov 29, 2018)

sometimes is the different parts that complete a whole. a best bass would be different to different poeple. if you are producing trap music then its that 808 style bass with pitch information. and thats using low low end and then higher mid 1k freq to give it tone. so the bass is really not much but adding the higher freq info will help define it. this is kinda why that moog sound and moog filter etc is famous, brings in very muscial tones on basses in that sawtooth type of basses. so it helps to have the type of sound in mind, the synth architwcture to do it, and a patch that has both bass and upper freq information to make a good bass. i like a lot avenger for example, it has layers, which is kinda what im talking about. there is a main bass layer, then other components that create this huge bass. like playing with the notion of harmonic sequence. so imo, any synth that lets you do layers , it will be the best. omni 2.5 now has 8 layers so thats very cool. and it has onboard synth oscillators as well as sampled ones so mixing them created a bigger bass due to layer and the way a user percived them. 
and of course, the question is what type of bass. in what genre and what subgenre.


----------



## Tiggerdyret (Nov 29, 2018)

What you are asking for is kinda like asking a painter to paint 10 different pictures with 10 different brushes to see what brush you like the most. What picture you like probably doesn't have anything to do with the tools used to create them. You either have to to try them out yourself or read review and trust that the recommendation also goes for you.


----------



## germancomponist (Nov 29, 2018)

Tiggerdyret said:


> What picture you like probably doesn't have anything to do with the tools used to create them.


Huh???
I am talking only about the tools .... .


----------



## j_kranz (Nov 29, 2018)

I still love Sylenth... I know its a little older but there's some sort of magic warmth there in the filter drive that just nails it for me. Diva is good too and of course Omni/Zebra will get you pretty far too. Unfortunately I still think Analog is best however, hard to beat Moog in the phatness department.


----------



## germancomponist (Nov 29, 2018)

To be clear, I am not talking about romplers what play back samples from synth's, I am only talking about synthesizers.


----------



## Tiggerdyret (Nov 30, 2018)

Hearing bass lines is like viewing pictures. There are an infinite number of sounds you can create with the synths. Just like there is an infinite number of pictures you can paint with a brush. The only thing a couple of bass lines comparisons will do is tell what sound of bassline you like. Not what is actually the best tool. Or maybe at best what synth is best suited for this one particular sound out of a million possible options.


----------



## Jonathan Sharp (Dec 4, 2018)

Anything U-he is where the bass is at....


----------



## TW5011 (Dec 5, 2018)

I like u-he Repro-1 for bass. For audio examples, here's a video where someone is going through the factory presets and adjusting parameters, so you can get a good feel for how it sounds. I haven't run it through an analyzer to see just how low it goes, but there's a demo of it and that's easy enough. It sounds good, though. (And if a patch doesn't have enough at the very bottom, I sometimes layer some in with another synth or using subharmonic generators like MBassador or bx_subsynth.)



Ironically, I wasn't even looking to buy Repro-1, but because so many people were talking about how great it was, I listened to this preset walkthrough while paying bills one day. I wasn't interested in an emulation, but thought it sounded really good and I could use it in my music.

When I want a pure bass, I sometimes use a sine wave patch in Dimension Pro (although I figure most synths could do this). I've created bass below 20 Hz with it. (I've worked on some "bass music" where it's required to have lots of bass below 50 Hz.)


----------



## clisma (Dec 5, 2018)

Saxer said:


> I have a few more hardware synths (Peak, MicrowaveXT, MiniBrute, Matrix1000) but I rarely use them in projects.


Don’t use the Novation Peak much? Looking to possibly pick one up before the year is over. Either that or maybe DSI Rev2 8 voice. Grateful for your opinion.


----------



## studiostuff (Dec 6, 2018)

TW5011 said:


> I've created bass below 20 Hz with it.



I guess we'll all have to take your word for that...


----------



## dgburns (Dec 6, 2018)

@germancomponist

A tricky question and I think we need to seperate the brands from the theory. We would maybe all agree that alot of synths can do bass fairly well. But how we percieve bass is a whole other enchilada, methinks. Pure low frequency sound is one way to think about it, or how is it combined with higher sounds to make it richer and easier to hear in context. The bass reproduction is tricky because playback in bad rooms can cause all sorts of dips and peaks. I’m currently trying to tame a rather nasty 100 hz dip in my control room.blah :(

So what comes to mind is that a good quality sine wave is the essence of the extreme low end. It’s pure and I think it’s what I would try to use if I was looking for sound in the sub 125hz area. The tricky thing when using bass in context is phase issues with other sources. It’s possible that sounds blend and cut the bass, or add and causes a result you didn’t expect>>>> less is more. I would try and isolate the instrument sources that reproduce bass and decide which one is king. Extreme bass doesn’t sound like it comes from anywhere in particular, so I’d suggest keeping it mono, even if it plays out of more then one speaker.

All this means that with a decent source, just about any synth can get you a great bass sound. But if you want a bass synth sound with attitude, it might be that you want richer elements that combine and can be heard above the lower ones to create a sound>>>> that’s a personal choice.

As to sub bass, my experience tells me that you need to think of the playback target. If someone listens on an iphone, it’s just a waste of headroom and won’t be heard. To be able to add near 20hz in my experience means you have to balance the range from 125 to 50 well or it doesn’t come across. And it’s also uncomfortable to the body in loud amounts after awhile. And it is difficult to hear actual notes down there.
I think the only real difference between a hardware synth and a software one would be the randomness of the sound, and I wonder if there is any value in that in determining the value of a sound source over another.

The waves lo-air and the dbx subharmonic synth are good at generating bass from a source that has little. And most of the time, I turn them off.


----------



## Cinebient (Dec 8, 2018)

For me it´s P900, Dagger and Repro. But P900 is my goto.


----------



## KallumS (Dec 8, 2018)

Mini-moog / Monark


----------



## TheSteven (Dec 29, 2018)

For me the perfect synth bass depends on context - i.e. type of music, competing orchestration/instruments, etc. and as such I've used many - FM7, Sylenth by Lennard Digital, Minimoog emulators, IK Multimedia's Modo, Trillian and others.

Also it depends on the range that bass will be performing in on the song/composition. If the bass is only going to be playing within a limited range then who cares if the synth patch gets too thin or too muddy outside that range? As long as it kicks ass where it's needed.
Context is critical otherwise your request is as invalid as asking for a piccolo that can cover the entire audio range.


----------



## DS_Joost (Dec 30, 2018)

Europa by Reason. Don't overlook this one folks, it can produce hell of a lot of bass, and beautifully round too!


----------



## Dietz (Dec 30, 2018)

I've never heard better synth-basses than the ones derived from original (i.e. analog) Minimoogs. Apart from the appeal and weight they exhibit when listened to in solo, there is a certain dimensionality and grip to their sound that just stays "there" without using too much space in the mix at the same time. 

_... sorry that I can't provide a proper audio example, because I don't have access to one ATM (let alone owning one)._


----------



## Vin (Dec 30, 2018)




----------



## sostenuto (Dec 30, 2018)

Oh Yeh !! And if budget intereferes __ some great choices in Trillian /Omni 2.5


----------



## DS_Joost (Dec 30, 2018)

Vin said:


>


They were talking about the best, not the sexiest


----------



## Daniel James (Dec 30, 2018)

I have always liked either Diva or Zebra. Although I should give Repro more of a go.

So in short...u-he

-DJ


----------



## Russ-Sounds (Jan 31, 2019)

For basses I often use Spire and Rob Papen's SubBoomBass 2 that produce what I want, but of course it's all a question of what kind of bass you are looking for...


----------



## DS_Joost (Jan 31, 2019)

I recently found out to my surprise that the standard oscillator combined with a resonant svf filter in Falcon makes my room shake like nothing else. It's not only extremely versatile, it makes heck of a lot of noise too! Goddamn love that synth to death more and more each day!


----------



## CarlLofgren (Feb 7, 2019)

My vote also goes for anything u-he. Repro 1/5 makes my furniture shake!

/C


----------



## Living Fossil (Feb 7, 2019)

germancomponist said:


> A question for all synth programmers: Which synth do you think produces the best bass?



I'm not using my Pulse II (Waldorf) that much, but each time i do i'm fascinated about the pressure it produces in the bass area. It's not a very charismatic synth, but an incredible bass monster.


----------



## sostenuto (Feb 7, 2019)

Trilian is a solid option for huge set of Bass tones /genres.


----------



## bengoss (Feb 7, 2019)

+1 U-he


----------



## Greg (Feb 7, 2019)

Sequential pro one


----------



## webs (Feb 7, 2019)

A lot of spot-on comments in here about the variables of context, environment, and preference.
With that, my current personal favorites are u-he zebra (don't own it, but have had several "ooh, what is that bass sound!" moments listening to demos and often learned they were zebra/hz), with a very close second to Spectrasonics (which I do own, including, for a fun shout-out, patches from our own @Vin / midissonance).


----------



## ed buller (Feb 7, 2019)

I like my synth best..Original Moog 901's.....Dangerous Bastards that stay in tune for a minute at a time but oh what a minute !




Falling that a minimoog or Zebra

best

ed


----------



## germancomponist (Feb 7, 2019)

Ed, could you please do some audio examples, bass sounds out of the box with this great synth?


----------



## ed buller (Feb 7, 2019)

Hi

this is Zebra:

Ricochet Sequencer Part 1.mp3

Nothing added Built in FX

Autobahn.mp3

Just a patch I made for fooling around before bed. You can split the Keyboard On Zebra so this patch is all live. Albeit Quantized......fuck knows how they did it by hand but they did !!

best

ed

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/ricochet-sequencer-part-1-mp3.18349/][/AUDIOPLUS]

[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/autobahn-mp3.18350/][/AUDIOPLUS]


----------



## Dietz (Feb 8, 2019)

An extra-big "LIKE!" for the Autobahn-riff. For a good reason Kraftwerk is the only act*) I've seen/heard on stage eight times in my life. 8-)

_*) ... the only act I'm not involved with, of course._


----------



## Cinebient (Feb 10, 2019)

I think different synths for different bass. Digital for that sharp and sterile and some of the better analog emulations for some really juicy and fat stuff.
My favorite stays still P900 for bass. Playing a bit with it and live tweaking (soundcloud makes it sound a bit crap, sorry).


----------

