# Can You Recognize John Williams?



## NoamL (May 22, 2021)

Here are 18 musical excerpts. Guess which ones were written by John Williams. You may cast *9 votes MAXIMUM* but you don't have to use them all. Ready set go!

If composers can consistently guess which pieces were composed by John Williams, then he has an original and recognizable voice. I chose excerpts from the non-JWs that sounded to me like they _could_ be his writing. But... I still reckon this is an easy challenge.

BTW - all of these examples have been put in* mono & mp3 *degrading the audio quality. There's a reason I did that, just know that none of these examples will sound like a pristine recording.

*Here are all the excerpts in a zip file, or you can download them individually below. *


----------



## NoamL (May 22, 2021)

The first 5 excerpts


----------



## NoamL (May 22, 2021)

Excerpts 6 through 10...


----------



## NoamL (May 22, 2021)

Eleven through fifteen...


----------



## NoamL (May 22, 2021)

And the last three.


----------



## NoamL (May 22, 2021)

Bonus points if you can name the composers who aren't JW among these excerpts. But please don't give away the names & identities of individual pieces of music, even if you recognize them (e.g. it's okay to say "I see there's a Mozart piece here..." but please don't say "#9 is Mozart")

The identities of all pieces will be revealed on May 26.


----------



## tack (May 22, 2021)

NoamL said:


> all of these examples have been put in* mono & mp3*


I think mono is a good idea to level the playing field, but these definitely aren't mono.


----------



## NoamL (May 22, 2021)

tack said:


> I think mono is a good idea to level the playing field, but these definitely aren't mono.


er yes.... I mono'd the mix bus but my daw was still set to stereo out 

Well the audio is degraded enough that I think it's a level playing field. I won't give away any more details but if people try to guess just based on recognizing a scoring stage sound, that may not be a good strategy.

I was gonna bandpass filter the examples too but that's just mean making people listen to crappy audio. 

OK no more comments until the 26th - I'll keep my mouth shut and see how this contest develops


----------



## dcoscina (May 22, 2021)

I heard Nixon and The Fury in there.. Nice. 

Also Ratatouille from Giacchino.


----------



## Gingerbread (May 22, 2021)

One of them sounds very James Horner-ish to me.


----------



## Saxer (May 22, 2021)

I think I heard some B. Hermann...


----------



## Land of Missing Parts (May 22, 2021)

Hanson, Prokofiev...


----------



## Land of Missing Parts (May 22, 2021)

I like the spirit of this trivia!

I think there's some stuff in here that's not actually Williams, but other composers who are consciously or unconsciously channeling him. (Maybe responding to temp music. Or scoring for Star Wars media or some other franchise.)

Which would also make a case for William's voice even if it's not literally him. And obviously there's repertory stuff in here that pre-dates Williams, which Williams himself is channeling.


----------



## Leon Willett (May 22, 2021)

I only hear John Williams in one of these excerpts.

If any of the others are actually him, it seems to me they would have to be from a very young, pre-jaws (so early 70s or before) John Williams, when his voice had not fully developed.


----------



## ed buller (May 22, 2021)

there is some Williams...some Walton , Holst , Bear McCreary ,Dave Arnold ,Jackman..........a well chosen selection. Although the Walton could be Williams it's too well known. But to be honest one is very obviously him IMHO


----------



## jeremyr (May 22, 2021)

One of these is Howard Hanson


----------



## Gingerbread (May 22, 2021)

Tchaikovsky in the house!!


----------



## CT (May 22, 2021)




----------



## Illico (May 23, 2021)

Great challenge initiative! I don't know if I discover my miss-knowledge of JW scores or probably because I only recognize one, I know him well! waiting the 26th.


----------



## robcs (May 23, 2021)

I thought I heard some Vaughan (The Other) Williams, Prokofiev, Rimsky Korsakov, Irgens-Jensen, Hanson (or Holst?), some trying-desperately-to-behave Stravinsky, Borodin, and from the cine world maybe some Desplat or James Horner.

BTW even if there isn't any Irgens-Jensen in there, thanks for reminding me to listen more often to his stuff. I just pulled up Symphony #2 and the Symphony in D Min. He really deserves to be much better known, especially among this crowd - just listen to the first couple of minutes of the D Minor Symphony!


----------



## purple (May 23, 2021)

tack said:


> I think mono is a good idea to level the playing field, but these definitely aren't mono.


No they are... they've got this new thing called _dual mono_... It plays sound out of both speakers! It's totally awesome.


----------



## re-peat (May 24, 2021)

It’s an entertaining challenge and a clever selection of material, Noam — I think I recognize quite a few fragments but I’m fairly sure I’d fail on the whole thing — but I have rather a big problem with this conclusion you want to draw from it, because, well, none of the Williams fragments, not even the excerpt from “The Fury”, show the composer at his most singular and unique best.

In order to raise the difficulty level of this test somewhat, you were forced — entirely understandably — to pick material from Williams that is, shall we say, fairly run-of-the-mill and undistinguished, _lacking precisely the very thing you want to put to the test: Williams’ unique voice_.

If you want to prove whether Williams has an instantly recognizeable and unique voice or not, you *have* to include that voice in your selection. Otherwise, what are we testing here? But, of course, including Williams at his most characterstic best is precisely what you can’t do. Cause if you did, there would be no challenge at all as it would be immediately glaringly obvious which music is Williams’ and which isn’t. For the simple reason that … his best and most defining work is that of a composer with an instantly recognizeable and unique voice.

The only way you could make a test like this work AND draw meaningful conclusions from it, is if you somehow had access to top-quality Williams music which the rest of us don’t know about.

Also: it’s not because Williams’ style can be imitated that the uniqueness and originality of his voice can or ought to be questioned. (Picasso and hundreds of great painters with him, have been imitated, copied and forged too, often to the complete and quite embarrassing bewilderment of the art world. But do we have to revise our opinion on the unqiue genius of these great masters because of it? I don’t think so.)
And people can imitate the Williams style all they want, and some have become *very* good at it, no doubt, but what they can’t imitate — never have, never will — are Williams’ best ideas. I’m sure someone like Conrad Pope can write hours of Williamsoïd music that is virtually indistinguishable from Williams’ own music except for the fact ... that it won’t contain a single idea that matches Williams’ most inspired moments. (And this isn’t meant as a put down of Pope’s amazing abilities and stellar work, I only mention it to say how truly special and unique Williams-at-his-best really is. Something I’m sure Pope will agree with.)

But thanks for doing this. It’s interesting. And I am curious about one or two fragments.

_


----------



## ProfoundSilence (May 24, 2021)

I haven't done this yet, not reading the comments(don't want to be influenced) but I think this'll be fun. 

Norrmally I find myself listening to dead composers and going "AH HA! THATS WHAT HE GOT THAT FROM" so if any of those examples are in the mix I'll be excited to find out more pieces that might have influenced him.


----------



## MauroPantin (May 24, 2021)

Tried this out with the wife, who's not a musician but is a fan of film music. Some very sneaky selections here.

Still, while this is a super interesting experiment, to me what makes him so special are the memorable themes that are masterfully woven in the fabric of the films he scores. Williams is as great a storyteller as he is a composer, he has amazing dramatic timing. Obviously those elements can't be included as excerpts because then the exercise becomes pointless. 

However, it's a cool exercise and I look forward to see how I failed miserably.


----------



## lux (May 24, 2021)

just listened very quickly so I'm probably wrong 100%, but...thats a game...other names who came in mind were Ed Shearmour, John Debney, Bernard Hermann, Horner and maybe JNH


----------



## NoamL (May 25, 2021)

1 day left to get your guesses in...


----------



## purple (May 25, 2021)

I'll probably be less shocked by the result than I was when I found out there was a JW score I haven't heard before!


----------



## NoamL (May 26, 2021)

And here's the answers… 

*Music By John Williams*
02 - The Mission Suite - Fugue For Changing Times
07 - JFK - Arlington 
09 - The Fury - Vision On The Stairs
12 - Minority Report - Anderton's Great Escape
18 - Tintin - Clash Of The Cranes

*Composers That He Steals From (According To Very Smart YouTube Commenters)*
06 - Richard Wagner - Rheingold - Interludes
11 - Pyotr Tchaikovsky - Symphony 2 Mvt III
13 - Gustav Holst - The Cloud Messenger

*Composers That I Believe Actually Influenced Him*
05 - Howard Hanson - Symphony No 2. Mvt III
10 - William Walton - Battle Of Britain Suite
17 - Sergei Prokofiev - Symphony No. 5 Mvt II 

*Some Film Music That I Think Is Influenced By Williams*
01 - David Arnold - Stargate - The Quartz Shipment
03 - Henry Jackman - Big Hero 6
08 - Joby Talbot - The Hitch-Hiker's Guide To The Galaxy
14 - Alexandre Desplat - Girl With A Pearl Earring - Griet's Theme
16 - Basil Poledouris - Starship Troopers - Carmen's Test Flight

*Some Film Music That Doesn't Really Sound Like Williams*
04 - Michael Giacchino - Ratatouille - The Paper Chase
15 - Bear McCreary - Cloverfield Paradox - Message For Ava


----------



## Ivan M. (May 26, 2021)

5 hit, 4 miss for me


----------



## Traz (May 26, 2021)

I guessed 3, 9, 12, 16, and 18.

Only got two of them correct. Dangit..

Btw @NoamL, which one was 9? I don't see it on the list.


----------



## NoamL (May 26, 2021)

9 was John Williams as well! Added line breaks so the answers are clearer...


----------



## Traz (May 26, 2021)

Oh nice, I guess I actually got three of them correct!

I feel a little better about myself now.


----------



## JDK88 (May 26, 2021)

It's about one's life experience listening to their favorite composers while studying and taking elements from each to create a new, unique sound recipe. That's what makes Williams recognizable.


----------



## jeremiahpena (May 26, 2021)

Got 4 out of 5, only missed #9. I recognized 15 as Bear McCreary since I'm a fan of that score, and mistakenly thought 16 was by James Horner.





The Joby Talbot piece actually feels way more influenced by John Adams than John Williams to me.

The frenetic action sound in #12 is something I've never heard from anybody else. If I had to pick the most Williamsy sound, that would be it.


----------



## Ivan M. (May 26, 2021)

NoamL said:


> 9 was John Williams as well! Added line breaks so the answers are clearer...


so it's 5 hit for me, yay! :D


----------



## lux (May 26, 2021)

...what an epic fail I had


----------



## CT (May 26, 2021)

Got them all except 2. Thought it was similar to JW in Jaws fugue mode, but wasn't confident enough.


----------



## robcs (May 26, 2021)

I got 4 of the 5 JW's correct. Plus Holst, Prokofiev, Hansen and Desplat. I thought the Walton piece was RVW, and I thought 1, 3, 8, and 16 were by JW (but at least they're 'influenced' by him, so I feel better about that lol)


----------



## Dave Connor (May 26, 2021)

I missed one: 18 Tin Tin. But I was barely listening at that point.

I did recognize a number of others but was focused on what was JW or not.


----------



## MauroPantin (May 26, 2021)

Got 4 out of 5. 

Surprisingly my wife, who's not a composer (but has to endure one at home and likes film music), got 4/5 as well. We both got one wrong that the other guessed correctly, though.


----------



## Jorgakis (May 27, 2021)

Ok I picked 8, but I wanted to make it as intuitive as possible and without hearing twice.
The ones I picked were 4/5 Williams (and I don't know all the tracks). The others were Hanson, Walton and Holst and Henry Jackman, which is also interesting I think.
I don't know Hanson and Walton at all, but this shows that there are other influences that are not the usual youtube comment as you said:D.
I missed the mission suite, strangely...


----------



## mikeh-375 (May 27, 2021)

Noam's right about Hanson, especially the 'Romantic Symphony'. There's a few lifts from that in E.T.


----------



## NoamL (May 27, 2021)

This would be fun to do with another composer. Anyone else wanna be host?


----------



## chillbot (May 27, 2021)

NoamL said:


> This would be fun to do with another composer. Anyone else wanna be host?


Gotta do ZimZAM next!


----------

