# What is Reaper bad at?



## ComposerWannabe

I know it lacks a native workflow and needs a lots of customization. But once you get past that initial part... What does Reaper sucks at?

Only thing I'm hearing about his DAW is that how it's good at EVERYTHING. And thats why it seems to me like it's a bunch of hype and never you get the bad parts of it.

For startes It does look kind of bad compared the other DAWs even with nice templates. But that's highly debatable and subjective.


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## rvb

I actually downloaded the demo yesterday, and since I am quite used to ableton I downloaded the ableton theme with it. So far it's pretty solid! I'll have to use it a bit more, and can not seem to get rid of the recording latency when trying to record guitars or mics. Even with an extreme low buffersize, but I reckon I am overlooking something and doing something wrong here. The midi editor seems quite intuitive. And it really is like a 12 mb file when installing haha. That really blew my mind right there!

EDIT: the only thing I actually wanted to say I forgot to type: download the demo it's a really quick install and go check it out!


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## d.healey

I think I'm the only person who likes the default Reaper theme  Reaper is excellent for a ton a stuff, the bad point for me is that the devs often add new features but then get side tracked by another feature so we end up with quite a few areas that feel a bit half finished.


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## oxo

the only bad thing is that new features come constantly quickly before you have learned all the previous ones :D


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## Saxer

I miss simultaneously open editors. Either score or list or piano roll. But I'm probably spoiled by Logic.


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## nulautre

Personally the only thing that bugs me is that mod wheel information is a series of bars and not a line that i can add points to (what i'm used to)... (if there is some sort of way to fix/change this please let me know)


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## ComposerWannabe

nulautre said:


> Personally the only thing that bugs me is that mod wheel information is a series of bars and not a line that i can add points to (what i'm used to)... (if there is some sort of way to fix/change this please let me know)



Isn't that mostly visual representation? It would probably work the same even if it was a continuous line.


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## nulautre

ComposerWannabe said:


> Isn't that mostly visual representation? It would probably work the same even if it was a continuous line.


It does, and i'm adjusting to it... BUT I DON'T WANT TO!!!!


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## sazema

d.healey said:


> I think I'm the only person who likes the default Reaper theme



No, you're not


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## sazema

Like any other software, it has good and bad moments and there is no mystery in that...

And, it not requires *a lot of configuration* at all. People here mostly mix inserting custom scripts with configuration. Configuration = setting preferences like in any other software. Any other sequencer has preferences where you can tweak how bars act, how midi act, how bla bla...

Also, a lot of configuration means some keys mapping to some actions. Yes, it's customized, but it's not needed if you don't want that  For example, instead of going to Edit menu and choosing some option I like to map that option to key "H", so I'm going into key mapper to map that key to that option. 

Mostly, after installing Reaper you should only set VST/AU folder, setup audio/midi interface and that's the first step.
After that I like to turn off looping option for all items and that's all.
Also, I set metronome pre-count (2 bars) like with any other seq.
Right click in TCP new instrument -> choose instrument and you're ready to go.

Mostly people complains about using Kontakt as multi-out is painful etc.
It is not! But you can't that magically with eyes closed, sorry  
Tell me how easy is to use multiple-out instrument in Ableton Live or Logic when you opened sequencer for first time? 
You should consult YouTube for sure (or manual). 
So, once you consult Kontakt multi-out with Reaper (YT) you can save that as track preset.


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## ComposerWannabe

sazema said:


> Like any other software, it has good and bad moments and there is no mystery in that...
> 
> And, it not requires *a lot of configuration* at all. People here mostly mix inserting custom scripts with configuration. Configuration = setting preferences like in any other software. Any other sequencer has preferences where you can tweak how bars act, how midi act, how bla bla...
> 
> Also, a lot of configuration means some keys mapping to some actions. Yes, it's customized, but it's not needed if you don't want that  For example, instead of going to Edit menu and choosing some option I like to map that option to key "H", so I'm going into key mapper to map that key to that option.
> 
> Mostly, after installing Reaper you should only set VST/AU folder, setup audio/midi interface and that's the first step.
> After that I like to turn off looping option for all items and that's all.
> Also, I set metronome pre-count (2 bars) like with any other seq.
> Right click in TCP new instrument -> choose instrument and you're ready to go.
> 
> Mostly people complains about using Kontakt as multi-out is painful etc.
> It is not! But you can't that magically with eyes closed, sorry
> Tell me how easy is to use multiple-out instrument in Ableton Live or Logic when you opened sequencer for first time?
> You should consult YouTube for sure (or manual).
> So, once you consult Kontakt multi-out with Reaper (YT) you can save that as track preset.


Isn't multi-out configuration in Reaper especially easy? Reaper routs the new tracks for you AFAIK.


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## sazema

ComposerWannabe said:


> Isn't multi-out configuration in Reaper especially easy? Reaper routs the new tracks for you AFAIK.



Absolutely.


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## novaburst

ComposerWannabe said:


> What does Reaper sucks at?



Reaper is bad at nothing is does what every other Daw does if not better, if you want to nit pick then you can find a thousand things wrong with every DAW,

I am a hard core Cubase user, but purchased reaper a few years ago at the lower price,

What people forget is that reaper is a premium priced Daw, it has two prices one at over $200.00 if you make a certain amount out of commercial use, and a smaller price for small commercial use under a certain amount so be careful, a lot of user feel because its so cheap it must be crap but they often over look its premium price that brings it up to a lot of other DAW prices.

Again reaper is bad at nothing, its been used for film score, commercial sound design, and every other thing the common DAW is used for.

It attracts a lot of users because it is very customisable and that appeals to a lot, its very stable, and has great updates.

Sorry for saying this but I hate threads that encourage developer slamming and negativity.


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## tack

d.healey said:


> the bad point for me is that the devs often add new features but then get side tracked by another feature so we end up with quite a few areas that feel a bit half finished.


This, to me, is a symptom (or perhaps even the cause) of what I feel is Reaper's biggest problem: it doesn't feel like _designed_ software. It feels evolved in terms of its features and capabilities, and the implementations of those things oftentimes just don't seem terribly polished.

The most recent squirrel moment (at least that I've been paying attention to) was that articulation maps were abruptly dropped on the floor for automation items. Both of them seemed to have generated quite a lot of excitement, and perhaps if I actually cared about automation items and/or didn't care about articulation maps I wouldn't have noticed or cared.

The lack of design in Reaper is also apparent in its API. You can tell that APIs were added based on the needs of the moment and it doesn't actually seem like anyone sat down and gave a good think about what capabilities should be exposed in an API. I've lost count of the number of times that the APIs that do exist have gotten me _so close_ but lack some very basic capability that seems baffling. (Random example: if get_action_context() returned a couple extra things for MIDI triggered actions, namely the MIDI event and channel, it would be immediately more useful and allow for more script reuse.)

SWS ends up filling a lot of these holes, but SWS actually has the same evolved-not-designed problem. That's a lot more forgivable, because the motivation of SWS has to have been to fill in some of these glaring omissions in what I can only imagine as fits of whisky-fueled evenings of rage-coding. (Which I have done just recently in trying to find a solution to focus the MIDI editor -- and don't even get me started on focus bugs.)

So after all that complaining, I still use Reaper. It's the devil I know, and with enough blood, sweat, and therapy sessions, I can usually accomplish whatever workflow I can conceive.

Still, for someone who just wants to make music and is willing to adapt to any DAW rather than the other way around, I feel there are better alternatives than Reaper (ignoring price of course, at which Reaper is quite hard to beat). If you're not too fussed about wasting a few days on the technicals (even more technical than building your average orchestral template) in exchange for improved workflow, then Reaper gives you a fair bit of power. But the deeper you get down that customization rabbit hole, you'll very likely also experience boundless facepalm moments over inscrutable limitations.

</rant>


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## ComposerWannabe

novaburst said:


> Sorry for saying this but I hate threads that encourage developer slamming and negativity.



If for some reason the thread itself looks this way to you, you're wrong. I've clearly stated that Reaper is getting a hype to a degree that no other DAW does. I was just curious what is it's weak points are.


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## pmcrockett

When I run into bizarre API limitations I always remind myself that I used to code in Sonar's CAL, which allowed me to open windows that weren't even supposed to exist in Sonar anymore, forced me to send each MIDI out event 16+ times then parse it on the other end to get around random event drops, had a DLL access function that no one understood, occasionally went haywire if I didn't have arbitrary whitespace in my code, used prefix notation for math, and hadn't been updated in fifteen years. I was using Pure Data to literally write CAL code in realtime with hardcoded input values to get around the limitations of user input prompts.

Those were the days.


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## novaburst

ComposerWannabe said:


> hype to a degree that no other DAW does.



Its not hype, when users are able to get satisfaction from there DAW why not big it up.

dissatisfaction comes from a lack of knowledge about you DAW, in this case you will get a lot of slamming because of unwillingness to learn.



ComposerWannabe said:


> If for some reason the thread itself looks this way to you, you're wrong



To me the title says it all and normally the in between does not mean much,

All DAWs have there short coming's most of the short comings are a drop in the ocean compared to what you can accomplish with them.


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## kitekrazy

I've had a license ever since it was released. I think the lack of documentation stunted its growth in the early days. I remember setting up Kontakt was a rocket science. There was also a lack of 3rd party tutorial support and people would do those annoying youtube tutorials without dialogue using notepad. Today since it's popular there are so many quality "how to's". Sure it's a great DAW but people use certain DAWs because the workflow agrees with them for what they do.


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## Phillip

The weakest point of Reaper that you can't use it right out of the box like some other DAWs. It requires a lot of learning, YouTube watching, forum diving etc. for some people it is few days, for some it is few months.


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## Vik

"What is Reaper bad at?"
Producing a non-cluttered user interface?


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## MarcelM

some of the reaper expert fans here could just save and share their reaper configuration to give a starting point for newcomers.

it gets usable after quite a bit of tweaking, but still after that the piano roll was still the weakest point for me and the reason why i stopped using the trial. maybe displaying CC data as bars isnt just for me while having smooth cc curves in cubase or studio one.


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## sazema

Phillip said:


> The weakest point of Reaper that you can't use it right out of the box like some other DAWs. It requires a lot of learning, YouTube watching, forum diving etc. for some people it is few days, for some it is few months.



Ohh, c'mon man ... really??? And now you will tell me that you will install PT right out of the box and start using it without some readings, or Logic or whatever ... Or you're new in music world and you'll install Cubase and just start using it... But why then many manuals (paper/video) available? Any software has some tutorials, user manuals for meeting and knowing how to do routing and other stuff.

And yes, that's why Cockos has specialized learning camps for 5 months for new users (in the Schwartzwald mid-wood) 

After all, if you like Logic, Cubase, Samplitude, PT - then why switch to Reaper at all? Just use weapon you know best.

After some time here I just realized, and I don't why is that, but for many Cubase users here Reaper is like a torn ?!?? But especially Cubase users. 
Why do you care at all? I'm Reaper user but Cubase is not torn for me, it's also software with some advantages and disadvantages, and if I get next job with specified sequencer as Cubase - who cares... I will do my job.

Why is it matter if you compose some nice piece even with Reason? or Renoise? or Traction?


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## EvilDragon

Heroix said:


> maybe displaying CC data as bars isnt just for me



It's what CCs actually are. They are not continuous data - they are discrete events. I find smooth curves completely counterintuitive for CC editing - and also misdirecting as well, since they don't exactly show WHEN an event happens because they're interpolating the whole deal. Not good at all.

In other news, you can pretty much edit even those CC bars in Reaper as if they were "curves", with some nifty scripts.

http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=177058


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## sazema

Heroix said:


> some of the reaper expert fans here could just save and share their reaper configuration to give a starting point for newcomers.
> 
> it gets usable after quite a bit of tweaking, but still after that the piano roll was still the weakest point for me and the reason why i stopped using the trial. maybe displaying CC data as bars isnt just for me while having smooth cc curves in cubase or studio one.



But, you're Cubase user as you explained before, right? Then why looking at Reaper at all if is torn for you? Enjoy in your sequencer.


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## sazema

I was curious and just found this on YT

*Edirol + Renoise*


*
EWQL + Renoise*



Very interesting... just shame we have no preview on sequencer works... It's interesting specially because of effort you have to put into one tracker software. And it's challenging for sure.


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## Jaybee

nulautre said:


> Personally the only thing that bugs me is that mod wheel information is a series of bars and not a line that i can add points to (what i'm used to)... (if there is some sort of way to fix/change this please let me know)



If you want to go the CC in Envelopes route it's a bit of a workaround but it does work. It uses two plugins on each track, one in the Input FX channel to stop CC1 & CC11 being written to "the bars" and one as the first plug on the track to take that data and let it write to an envelope *if* you are in one of the envelope write modes (touch/latch/write) on the track. 

Read this thread to the end: http://vi-control.net/community/threads/how-can-i-get-smooth-midi-cc-automation-in-reaper.54554/ 

Here's the plugins on the Reaper Stash http://stash.reaper.fm/v/23747/reaper_ccenv_v0.1.zip *Make sure to read the comments to see which code to change *as the original code had a bug which was fixed here on VI Control and so I added it to the comments. * 
*
This does work (I'm using it successfully). It's not as elegant a solution as if it were native but needs must. Once your CC data is drawing those CC1 & CC11 envelope points you can then manipulate those with all the other Envelope scripts already in Reaper etc. 

This solution only recognises CC1 & CC11 but there's no reason (I don't think) why it couldn't be expanded to cover more by anyone who can script (I can't - hence the help on VI!).


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## Kaan Guner

EvilDragon said:


> It's what CCs actually are. They are not continuous data - they are discrete events. I find smooth curves completely counterintuitive for CC editing - and also misdirecting as well, since they don't exactly show WHEN an event happens because they're interpolating the whole deal. Not good at all.
> 
> In other news, you can pretty much edit even those CC bars in Reaper as if they were "curves", with some nifty scripts.
> 
> http://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=177058



Isn't it possible to change the resolution of the CC data? So it becomes as if it's continuous.


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## sazema

Kaan Guner said:


> Isn't it possible to change the resolution of the CC data? So it becomes as if it's continuous.


Yes, by changing resolution to 1/64, or 1/128 you can set density, of course.


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## EgM

I love everything about Reaper except its inability to remember zoom levels in the piano roll... Once that is fixed I'll go back to it.


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## EvilDragon

Kaan Guner said:


> Isn't it possible to change the resolution of the CC data? So it becomes as if it's continuous.



Sure is, just draw them with snap disabled (or use a mouse modifier to draw/edit them without snapping). So you can easily get stuff looking like this:









EgM said:


> I love everything about Reaper except its inability to remember zoom levels in the piano roll... Once that is fixed I'll go back to it.



I have no problems with that - use one MIDI editor per project, instead of per-track or per-item.


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## EgM

EvilDragon said:


> I have no problems with that - use one MIDI editor per project, instead of per-track or per-item.



Of course I use one midi editor per project... No dice.


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## EvilDragon

Not sure. I never got any zooming issues. :/


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## gregh

Kaan Guner said:


> Isn't it possible to change the resolution of the CC data? So it becomes as if it's continuous.


the best way to do this would be to use something like a standard bezier style curve editor overlaid onto the bars - edit using the bezier curve tools but realise in the discrete bars. There may even be a method like this that you can rig up using a bunch of different modifiers and scripts - but a native version would be much better.
Which brings to mind what I think is the major fault of Reaper - the reliance on non-native functionality and the proliferation of specific solutions. Creative flow can be hindered by wanting a particular function which is available only through setting up scripts / macros etc. This requires stopping, researching, tweaking, bug fixing, testing and so on. The usual criticisms one receives to this sort of comment are - you are just too stupid to use Reaper, you are too lazy to use Reaper and, once you set things up you are fine. The first two criticisms are just the IT arrogance thing that used to be really common from sys admins and support in the 90s and early 2000s. The latter is more substantial but misses the issue of cognitive load and creative freedom and reminds me of the anthropology of toolsets / philosophy of technology.
Typically technologies follow a process of introduction of a small set of tools, proliferation of those tools into myriads of specialised tools, then a final collapse into a smaller set of tools that are versatile. Reaper is at the stage of zillions of tools [dinner calls so I cut this mercifully short but the philosophy and anthropology of technology is incredibly interesting]


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## Flaneurette

It is kind of technical... and that puts a lot of people off I guess... Once you know how everything works, it's nice. I can't imagine ever going back to Cubase, with that newly found freedom.

I wonder how Reaper will evolve. I think something has to change though... especially GUI wise, to keep up with the times. It seems to be stuck in 2005 with regards to the GUI, and it's probably coded on top of the Windows 32 DOS/XP shell, which is clunky to say the least. I hope it doesn't turn into another ProTools though... because overturning all that code and bring it into Visual Studio 2017 is probably difficult if not undoable for such a small team, unless they already started to rewrite everything.

I think in a few years we won't have Desktop DAW's anymore. It's going to go Virtual and everything is done/rendered server side. HTML5 browsers are very powerful these days. I am thinking of writing a Virtual DAW myself, which will run in the browser. Technically it is possible.


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## EvilDragon

Flaneurette said:


> and it's probably coded on top of the Windows 32 DOS/XP



That's a wrong way to put it. It just uses a lot of default OS elements (part of win32 API). Has nothing to do with DOS or XP, really.



Flaneurette said:


> It's going to go Virtual and everything is done/rendered server side. HTML5 browsers are very powerful these days.



Oh god the latency! Definitely not going to happen for any REAL WORLD tracking scenarios. No matter how fast your broadband is, it still has worse latency than even the crappiest audio interface. And then, on top of that, you need OS and the browser to process stuff, which adds more latency. If it happens it's gonna be for shits and giggles, not any real studio work.


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## d.healey

Flaneurette said:


> It seems to be stuck in 2005 with regards to the GUI, and it's probably coded on top of the Windows 32 DOS/XP shell, which is clunky to say the least.


Well we still only had WinXP in 2005, YouTube had only just popped into existence, Facebook didn't exist, and web 2.0 hadn't happened - I think Reaper's GUI is a long way from then... but I really like the GUI so I'm completely biased. I like a minimal interface. Reaper runs on Mac and Linux btw so there's no Windows shell thing going on.



> I think in a few years we won't have Desktop DAW's anymore. It's going to go Virtual and everything is done/rendered server side. HTML5 browsers are very powerful these days. I am thinking of writing a Virtual DAW myself, which will run in the browser. Technically it is possible.


No way I'm handing over my music computing to some anonymous server!


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## meaks

Hi all !
I'll share my experience with Reaper, and for me the weakest point is delay compensation, when you use an external DAW for your sound library with multiple outputs (in my case 80), especially with Vienna Ensemble Pro !, i tried but never could solve the latency problem between my Daw's in Reaper, but i remember it is a known problem that has not been solved yet between Reaper and the Vienna Ensemble Plug-in. Except that problem, it's an incredible DAW for the price, and i could end up with Reaper but unfortunately, those latency problems kept me from using it. I switched from Pro Tools to Cubase 9.
Meaks


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## EvilDragon

Hmm, might be a very specific issue between VEPro and Reaper then, as delay compensation otherwise works just fine in Reaper... Might be even something wrong with how VEPro does things?


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## robgb

ComposerWannabe said:


> I know it lacks a native workflow and needs a lots of customization. But once you get past that initial part... What does Reaper sucks at?


I wouldn't say it lacks native workflow. If you're coming in fresh and have never used a DAW before and you watch Kenny Gioia's tutorial videos on Youtube, Reaper works just fine right out of the box. The problem is that many of us have migrated from other DAWs and it takes a bit of time to get Reaper working the way we're used to. Fortunately, it's possible to customize Reaper to work EXACTLY how you want it to. Which is refreshing.


tack said:


> So after all that complaining, I still use Reaper. It's the devil I know, and with enough blood, sweat, and therapy sessions, I can usually accomplish whatever workflow I can conceive.


The devil? Really? I've actually found Reaper to be heaven sent. And I think all this talk of it being difficult to master is completely overblown. It took me, literally, a day to get up and running at full speed. That's much faster than some DAWs, believe me, because I've used them all.


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## robgb

Heroix said:


> smooth cc curves in cubase or studio one.


I personally can't stand the way Studio One draws CC curves. It was one of my biggest beefs with the program. I much prefer Reaper's method. I guess it comes down to personal preference.


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## robgb

EgM said:


> I love everything about Reaper except its inability to remember zoom levels in the piano roll... Once that is fixed I'll go back to it.


Have you tried saving it as a screen set? I don't have any problem with the piano roll, so I've never tried. I've found that if you simply double click the item on the track it centers perfectly in the piano roll, and that's all I need.


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## gregh

"And I think all this talk of it being difficult to master is completely overblown. It took me, literally, a day to get up and running at full speed."

this comes across to me as a variation of the "people who don't like/have trouble with Reaper are stupid" response I mentioned above.


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## Ctd

I love reaper for 90% of what I do but there's two things that still bug me:
1: tempo maps. It changes the size of the bars and in the arrange view rather than say Logics way which just moves the playhead faster\slower
2: if you then bounce midi to import to another program with the tempo map there, it moves the midi position of the notes relative to beats and bars. As a result you have to remove the tempo no before exporting midi.


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## EvilDragon

You don't have to remove tempo before exporting MIDI. Just disable the checkbox to "Embed project tempo/time signature changes" in Export Project MIDI dialog.


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## robgb

gregh said:


> "And I think all this talk of it being difficult to master is completely overblown. It took me, literally, a day to get up and running at full speed."
> 
> this comes across to me as a variation of the "people who don't like/have trouble with Reaper are stupid" response I mentioned above.


That may be how it came across to you, but it isn't how it was intended. Reaper is not difficult to master. I watched about a dozen tutorials in a row and got to work. Really, ANY software program takes time to learn. You can't expect to just jump in and know how to work everything. And Reaper is no more difficult to learn than Cubase or Studio One or Pro Tools or Logic. You dig in, watch tutorials, ask questions, and go to work. Stupidity has nothing to do with it.


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## pmcrockett

The thing that drove me away the first time I looked at Reaper was the fact that the piano roll editor distinguishes among clips on a track instead of just visually lumping all of a track's clips together (like Sonar does). I still find it obnoxious, but I can live with it.


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## EvilDragon

Well, you can set the MIDI editor to show all project MIDI (or all track MIDI) now, so you get all the MIDI information displayed. However, only one MIDI item can be designated as ACTIVE for all edits (although others can be marked as editable) and for note entry.






As you can see here from this random example, we have three tracks (red, green, blue), each with multiple items. Only one item is active (third item on red track), but all of them are editable, which means if I select notes across them, I can do whatever to them.


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## sazema

robgb said:


> That may be how it came across to you, but it isn't how it was intended. Reaper is not difficult to master. I watched about a dozen tutorials in a row and got to work. Really, ANY software program takes time to learn. You can't expect to just jump in and know how to work everything. And Reaper is no more difficult to learn than Cubase or Studio One or Pro Tools or Logic. You dig in, watch tutorials, ask questions, and go to work. Stupidity has nothing to do with it.



Exactly, I tried to explain that before... Constant speak about massive configuring, and I have no idea what is massive there? Like any other software on market.
And to be honest, most annoying comments are: I would switch to R from Sonar or Cubase just if R has ability to show that like Sonar or Cubase or Live.

So, I have two questions:

1) Why would R shown that like xyx, it's R and it will show in its own way - take it or leave it
2) Why you would like to switch to R, after "10 years" with xyx? What is the desire? Of course if you switch from Ford to Opel you can't expect some Ford's stuff than Opel's stuff... but besides tires, breaks and s.wheel you will get some cool Opel stuff for sure 

Common thesis here in VI, I'm using Cubase for 10 years and I tried to switch to Reaper? Why, you're not satisfied with Cubase anymore, or? (or is just an empty talk, R is not good it hasn't space GUI)

Many smart people here already wrote down:
*
(mr.)R is like any other software, it has own weaknesses and superiority.*

Also, what kind of talk is this: Ahhh, R is not good because it shows CCs not like S1?
Or Sonar is not good because it shows channel strip not like Pro Tools.
And just because of that is not good? Who are you guys? Kids?

I could say: I never feel any vibe with Sonar even if I try to do some job with it and because of that I'm not Sonar user, but I will never say: Sonar is not good.


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## gregh

" who are you guys? Kids?"
Again with the defensive interpretation of criticism leading to " too stupid / not good enough for Reaper" Reaper is just some software, it's not a friend or a family member. If someone says S1 has better CC editing then consider that criticism on its merits. I have proposed a specific solution for that issue that caters to both bars and curve editing preferences. Have you?


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## pmcrockett

EvilDragon said:


> Well, you can set the MIDI editor to show all project MIDI (or all track MIDI) now, so you get all the MIDI information displayed. However, only one MIDI item can be designated as ACTIVE for all edits (although others can be marked as editable) and for note entry.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As you can see here from this random example, we have three tracks (red, green, blue), each with multiple items. Only one item is active (third item on red track), but all of them are editable, which means if I select notes across them, I can do whatever to them.


Yeah, it's a fairly minor inconvenience, to be sure, and I do understand why some people might prefer this style of MIDI editor. I just hate having to fool with three separate visibility toggle buttons for each track, two of which have partial-on states, in order to see what I want to see. It also makes visibility management from scripts slightly more difficult, though again, not a huge deal.


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## gregh

robgb said:


> What exactly is your point? Are you being contrary simply to be contrary? As I said, Reaper, like any other software, takes time to learn, but it ain't rocket science. I see nothing "defensive" in that statement, and really have no idea what you're going on about.


Wasn't responding to you


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## robgb

gregh said:


> Wasn't responding to you


I just realized that and deleted my response. My apologies. But really, I'm not sure what you're arguing about.


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## MarcelM

i cant really believe some people are serious. reaper is far away from beeing easy to learn.

cubase or studio one are more easy to learn and they work out of the box without endless menus, hundreds of hidden action or all that scripts you might need for your workflow.

also if someone says reaper is bad or it looks ugly - so be it. we live in a free world (atleast i do), and we are free to speak out what we think. and yes, its my opinion that reaper is ugly and looks like a shareware programm from the previous decade. also its too complicated and out of the box it lacks quite alot of functions. its not very beginner friendly and if i take a look at the bug list or the requested features at the reaper forums. ohwell... 

also i think most of those fan boys havent worked really alot with cubase pro,s1 or logic. thats really the only explanation why they say reaper could compete with those daws.

i wouldnt recommend reaper to anyone atleast and i tried all of the daws out there.


----------



## robgb

Heroix said:


> i cant really believe some people are serious. reaper is far away from beeing easy to learn.


Start here. It's all spelled out very concisely. 

http://reaper.fm/videos.php

As for working with logic and cubase, I was raised on Nuendo, used it for many years, then moved to Logic when I bought a Mac, and used IT for years. I'm not a Reaper fan boy, just a realist. Reaper works better for me than any other DAW I've used. There's nothing wrong with those DAWs at all. But for MY use, Reaper surpasses them in many ways.


----------



## robgb

Heroix said:


> yes, its my opinion that reaper is ugly


Oh, and I don't consider this ugly. This is only one of many themes you can attach to Reaper:


----------



## tack

I'm also not a fan of the out-of-the-box appearance. I think this isn't quite as polished as it could be (e.g. as Logic Pro X) but it's at least, in my opinion, tolerable.


----------



## Ctd

EvilDragon said:


> You don't have to remove tempo before exporting MIDI. Just disable the checkbox to "Embed project tempo/time signature changes" in Export Project MIDI dialog.



Still does it every time I've tried whether I've ticked that box or not.


----------



## gregh

Reaper could do with improvements to the interface. I mentioned above Reaper has many different tools that could be simplified with consequent improvements to the user experience. For example windows can be resized far beyond their usable range , the crossfade editor for example can be extended to the right way past any of the usable functions. But this seems to be standard for many windows- although not always to the right. Curve drawing / setting could be improved by reducing redundancy in envelope point default shapes. All that is needed is bezier and perhaps a user pattern editor where users might define a shape they want in the menu to use frequently. Then there are more universal accessibility issues in the default theme but I when I have mentioned those the typical responses have been along the lines of " don't care I use keystrokes" or the incredibly harsh indifference of "dont care my eyes are fine" . There's a reason so many people dislike Reaper and one of them is the aggressive nature of some Reaper users. And if you want to use Reaper you will encounter that aggression as you try and learn the program. It isn't a good look and not one I encounter to anything like that extent in other software. Nor was it prevelant in the early days- although there has always been possibly more enthusiasm than usual for a commercial software product


----------



## robgb

gregh said:


> There's a reason so many people dislike Reaper and one of them is the aggressive nature of some Reaper users.


Sorry, but this is ludicrous.


----------



## chimuelo

Reapers price is why it's incomplete.
For 5 more bucks everything would work better.


----------



## EvilDragon

pmcrockett said:


> I just hate having to fool with three separate visibility toggle buttons for each track, two of which have partial-on states, in order to see what I want to see.



This is why I link arrange view item selection to visibility and editability. Works great.



Heroix said:


> and if i take a look at the bug list or the requested features at the reaper forums. ohwell..



That is a pretty daft argument because the same deal is found on any other DAW's forums (and with much more bug reports and shit), only other forums can have a much worse general atmosphere (Steiny, DUC, Cakewalk).


----------



## gregh

EvilDragon said:


> This is why I link arrange view item selection to visibility and editability. Works great.
> 
> 
> 
> That is a pretty daft argument because the same deal is found on any other DAW's forums (and with much more bug reports and shit), only other forums can have a much worse general atmosphere (Steiny, DUC, Cakewalk).


I thought cakewalk forum was nicer than reapers but did not use it for that long, flstudio is much nicer. No idea about steinberg and duc. All forums tend to be dominated by a small number of heavy posters and that can skew the experience quite a bit. I find the reaper forum suffers fromquite a bit of sexism as well as the other (fanbois) stuff I, and many many others, mentioned earlier. The sexist jokes and references and so on are probably the most unpleasant aspect of the reaper forum.
Ther are also some very nice and helpful people on the reaper forums, as with kvr, etc


----------



## d.healey

Heroix said:


> we live in a free world (atleast i do).


I highly doubt that 



chimuelo said:


> Reapers price is why it's incomplete.
> For 5 more bucks everything would work better.


I assume this is meant sarcastically... but if you are serious then maybe you don't realise that Reaper is developed by two guys who are doing it for themselves as much as anyone else and more money isn't going to change the way they develop Reaper.


----------



## MarcelM

d.healey said:


> I highly doubt that
> 
> 
> I assume this is meant sarcastically... but if you are serious then maybe you don't realise that Reaper is developed by two guys who are doing it for themselves as much as anyone else and more money isn't going to change the way they develop Reaper.



actually only one guy is developing it if i remember right. its justin who sold winamp and doesnt care much about money as i heard.

but this may be the point. they are developing it for themself and thats wrong if you release a product to public. 
people request a better midi editor for ages and havent got one so far.

presonus for example has a wishlist for costumers, and they implement the features which are requested.
cockos doesnt do that. they implement whatever they want. best example was the build in articulation map. it just got dumped because the dev wanted some other things.

no thx, i prefer a company which cares about the customers.

and about the look. it is just the main theme which can be skinned. all popup windows will still have the windows look and doesnt really fit to the theme then. fixing/skinning those windows looks is actually quite simple (yes, iam a programmer and know for sure), but it hasnt been done.


----------



## MarcelM

gregh said:


> I thought cakewalk forum was nicer than reapers but did not use it for that long, flstudio is much nicer. No idea about steinberg and duc. All forums tend to be dominated by a small number of heavy posters and that can skew the experience quite a bit. I find the reaper forum suffers fromquite a bit of sexism as well as the other (fanbois) stuff I, and many many others, mentioned earlier. The sexist jokes and references and so on are probably the most unpleasant aspect of the reaper forum.
> Ther are also some very nice and helpful people on the reaper forums, as with kvr, etc



steinberg and presonus forums are fine. 

not sure but compared to the reaper forums they feel a bit more mature.


----------



## James Marshall

I knew looking at the title of this thread it wouldn't take long for it to descend into unadulterated Reaper bashing.

For the people who don't get along with Reaper, you are well within your rights to not like using it and enjoy whichever DAW suits you 

To say Reaper is incomplete, or the developers don't care about their users, or that the users themselves are fanboys and are defensive and hostile people, just isn't fair and is quite nasty to be honest. It's a fully functioning DAW, the size of the user base speaks for itself. The fact that it's even considered an option amongst the big names of Cubase, Logic, Studio One etc created by much larger companies with big development teams, is a testament to the Reaper devs, how such a small team with zero advertising have created a competitive product. 

Is it so difficult to accept that people prefer different tools? And having such a wide choice of excellent DAWs to choose from these days is awesome  I suppose I'm getting a bit tired of the "My DAW is better than your DAW" conversations.

I'm of the opinion that a 'What is Reaper good at' list would far far outweigh it's shortcomings.

@robgb Looking at your screenshot, what is that track 16 on your mixer? How did you achieve that layout with all those parameter controls - looks cool!!


----------



## d.healey

Heroix said:


> actually only one guy is developing it if i remember right. its justin who sold winamp and doesnt care much about money as i heard.
> 
> but this may be the point. they are developing it for themself and thats wrong if you release a product to public.


Don't forget Schwa!

I've always thought Reaper would be better as a GPL project so others could contribute and I remember reading that Justin has thought about doing this - so maybe one day they will  But the devs do listen to the customers too, they have a massive list of features to develop and they pick the ones that they want to work on and let user feedback guide it. They are also very responsive to fixing bugs, I reported a bug last week and it was fixed yesterday.

I'm a defensive fanboy  but then again I was a dedicated Cubase user for 10 years


----------



## robgb

Heroix said:


> they implement whatever they want. best example was the build in articulation map. it just got dumped because the dev wanted some other things.


It hasn't been dumped. It's been postponed. They have the mechanics but haven't yet worked out the gui and have hinted that it will appear in version 6. That said, Blake Robinson's articulation script is a perfectly good substitute. Which is one of things that makes Reaper great: the users' ability to write their own scripts and give them to the community. That may exist in other DAWs, but I haven't seen it.


----------



## robgb

James Marshall said:


> Looking at your screenshot, what is that track 16 on your mixer? How did you achieve that layout with all those parameter controls - looks cool!!


The screen shot comes from the White Tie website, but I believe that track is set to FX mode.


----------



## EvilDragon

Heroix said:


> steinberg and presonus forums are fine.
> 
> not sure but compared to the reaper forums they feel a bit more mature.



Yeah, right. Especially when mods ban you for absolutely no valid reason just because they feel like it or your (respectfully stated) opinion clashes with theirs (Steiny). Seen it happen there far too many times. Mature, yeah right.


----------



## robgb

Heroix said:


> and about the look. it is just the main theme which can be skinned. all popup windows will still have the windows look and doesnt really fit to the theme then. fixing/skinning those windows looks is actually quite simple (yes, iam a programmer and know for sure), but it hasnt been done.


It's clear you haven't spent much time in Reaper. The look of the popup windows changes from theme to theme, depending on how much work the theme developer chose to do. The only thing that doesn't change are the onboard plug-ins, which look very basic but are extremely good plugins. If you're making your choices based on how the plugin looks, I'd suggest you're concentrating on the wrong thing. Third party plugins, by the way, look exactly how they were designed.

All that said, there is an action in Reaper that allows you to go in and make multiple changes to the theme yourself without ever leaving Reaper.


----------



## robgb

gregh said:


> I thought cakewalk forum was nicer than reapers but did not use it for that long, flstudio is much nicer. No idea about steinberg and duc. All forums tend to be dominated by a small number of heavy posters and that can skew the experience quite a bit. I find the reaper forum suffers fromquite a bit of sexism as well as the other (fanbois) stuff I, and many many others, mentioned earlier. The sexist jokes and references and so on are probably the most unpleasant aspect of the reaper forum.
> Ther are also some very nice and helpful people on the reaper forums, as with kvr, etc


I haven't seen this on the Reaper forums, but I've only been there for awhile. But, let's face it, everything you've just mentioned pretty much describes the entire Internet.


----------



## Phryq

Oh, I didn't realize it was made by the Winamp developer. Now I want to download WinAmp (used to use it all the time as a kid).

Reaper is perfect, except I wish I could click and drag on the notation staff, and merge-unmerge staffs. And I wish the Linux version would complete soon


----------



## dtonthept

I loved a lot about Reaper, the only things I found that really bugged me was that I couldn't figure out how to just nudge a region / event / note backwards or forwards and to set a value to do so... 

Note I said **I** couldn't figure out, not that Reaper couldn't do it. I'd love to have another run at it with a bit more fiddle time on my hands. Fired it up again recently and decided to totally ignore all the customisability that I spent ages tweaking with last time around, this almost felt like a better approach to get going, just play with what's there and get comfortable, then get a sense of where to start customizing, rather than spinning all the plates the second you walk in....


----------



## EvilDragon

dtonthept said:


> I couldn't figure out how to just nudge a region / event / note backwards or forwards and to set a value to do so...



For items in the arrange view, you can use Nudge dialog, it's pretty flexible. In MIDI editor, there are actions to move notes just a pixel, or by grid size. So you could make custom actions if you want to move actions by a specific note value, or better, have some shortcuts for grid size, and then just have left-right keys move notes by grid size.


----------



## sazema

Heroix said:


> also i think most of those fan boys havent worked really alot with cubase pro,s1 or logic. thats really the only explanation why they say reaper could compete with those daws.



Heh you see... *you're totally wrong!*

Besides *Reaper* I have *Logic* on my Mac Mini + I have *Cubase Elements* (just for fun).
A friend of mine has _Nuendo + Pro Tools_ in his studio (he is a big fan of Nuendo), where I'm mostly by weekends (mans cave, escape from my wife and kids).

I'm actually Cubase boy (Cubase SX3, sometimes in past).
Then after I while, I bought Mac machine and I'm Logic fan also from version 7 I believe. As software developer I'm working on this Mac Mini, and I always find a way to longer Logic licence  through company expenses (Logic is important for our business) 

Now days, I'm mostly on my primary Windows machine in front of Reaper and sometimes in front of Mac Mini and Logic. 

I can't really find any aspect where Logic is better than Reaper, or vice versa. Or even Cubase vs both.
Logic has this as plus, Cubase has this as plus, Reaper has this as plus... *But all of them do the main job!*
All of them are BEST.

(As you asked "if we're serious") I can't really understand you and your points of looking at GUI and making decisions about software is good or not! It's a bit childish, especially for one software developer (as you said, you are developer too).
Some plugin is *bad* if is ugly ?!?? Really?

I can't understand that, and at the end this is not how PROs acting.
Ask any PRO user "what is most important" to him or her in front of sequencer.


----------



## dtonthept

EvilDragon said:


> For items in the arrange view, you can use Nudge dialog, it's pretty flexible. In MIDI editor, there are actions to move notes just a pixel, or by grid size. So you could make custom actions if you want to move actions by a specific note value, or better, have some shortcuts for grid size, and then just have left-right keys move notes by grid size.



Perfect, I'll have a look at that. I was actually doing some online live Skype lessons and my tutor didn't know why I would even want to nudge, let alone how!


----------



## robgb

dtonthept said:


> Perfect, I'll have a look at that. I was actually doing some online live Skype lessons and my tutor didn't know why I would even want to nudge, let alone how!


Time to get a new tutor.


----------



## sazema

This overall talk reminds me to talk about which sequencer has best sound.


----------



## MarcelM

sazema said:


> This overall talk reminds me to talk about which sequencer has best sound.



some polish the 0 and 1 alot better


----------



## sazema

Heroix said:


> and about the look. it is just the main theme which can be skinned. all popup windows will still have the windows look and doesnt really fit to the theme then. fixing/skinning those windows looks is actually quite simple (yes, iam a programmer and know for sure), but it hasnt been done.



So, you want to say: if they make skinned windows you are in game?


----------



## sazema

Heroix said:


> some polish the 0 and 1 alot better



I believe this is just a provocation... But sadly if it isn't.


----------



## MarcelM

sazema said:


> I believe this is just a provocation... But sadly if it isn't.



you saw the smiley, right?

iam in if they polish the UI and give us a better piano roll.


----------



## PeterKorcek

tack said:


> I'm also not a fan of the out-of-the-box appearance. I think this isn't quite as polished as it could be (e.g. as Logic Pro X) but it's at least, in my opinion, tolerable.



Hi tack, which theme is this? Is it your customisation or someone else's? 
It reminds me of Janne theme from Reaper stash, looks good

PK


----------



## tack

PeterKorcek said:


> Hi tack, which theme is this? Is it your customisation or someone else's?


It's a customized WT Imperial. I can make it available if you're interested.


----------



## ResSerp

tack said:


> It's a customized WT Imperial. I can make it available if you're interested.



I'd be interested in you sharing that theme, if you don't mind. Is that a custom colormap for the piano roll?


----------



## tack

ResSerp said:


> I'd be interested in you sharing that theme, if you don't mind. Is that a custom colormap for the piano roll?


Yep, custom colormap. I don't think I've quite settled on it yet though. 

Here's the theme.


----------



## sostenuto

Longtime Reaper user and agree fairly strongly. Some incredible contributors and tutors .... (near the top of pyramid). Surprising number of 'aggressive others' always lurking. Any Forum attracts.
Threads of 'opinions' get 100's of posts. Ask an important question and see how many .
Personally received great help ..... from ~~ 1% ??

Look at current Forum ! Most activity is '*Low Pass? High Pass? Gobbledygook!*'
Will provide valuable info for the multitudes ... 

Hope Justin figures how to stay being Justin, and steer things to more civility.


----------



## ResSerp

tack said:


> Yep, custom colormap. I don't think I've quite settled on it yet though.
> 
> Here's the theme.



Thank you!


----------



## Sekkle

tack said:


> Yep, custom colormap. I don't think I've quite settled on it yet though.
> 
> Here's the theme.



Thanks heaps for this, it's the best theme I've used by far!


----------



## robgb

omiroad said:


>


Some people are easily frightened. LOL.


----------



## sostenuto

.... or disgusted.


----------



## resonate

Tack, i'm very interested in your "Syncing midi CC's to a control surface" tutorial on youtube. I managed to get my Avid Command 8 surface working with Reaper and Js CC sync script, and now trying to get my head around the Bome Midi Translator. It's a bit painful to read the script from the video. Could you share some example that works? Along with the Reaper settings, please. Another question - is it possible to use 14bit CC data in Reaper / BMT for additional precision? Thanks!


----------



## tack

resonate said:


> Another question - is it possible to use 14bit CC data in Reaper / BMT for additional precision? Thanks!


Since doing that video, I've actually switched my controller to the default Mackie mode (away from custom mode which sends CCs). I mainly did that for improved precision on volume controls. MCP sends pitch bend events (which are 14 bit), so my BMT script passes those through to RME TotalMix FX and Reaper for track volume control, translating where necessary. (My far left fader controls the volume on the currently selected track in Reaper, and the master fader is sent to TotalMix FX to control my monitoring volume. The other faders are used for CC performance.)

For the faders I want to control CCs, my BMT script just translates the 14-bit pitch bend to a standard 7-bit CC that's sent into Reaper. It actually didn't occur to me to try to use 14-bit CCs there. Yes it technically would be possible to do without a huge amount of effort -- but is there a benefit to it? I don't think Kontakt supports 14-bit CCs, does it? I wonder if any of my soft synths do (e.g. Diva, Omnisphere).

My BMT script does a huge pile of unrelated stuff, so I'll try to scrounge some time tonight to distill it down to a minimum set of rules to do the translation and will share it here.


----------



## robgb

sostenuto said:


> .... or disgusted.


Yeah, I am pretty disgusted. It's amazing to me that someone who sings the praises of his DAW on this forum is suddenly an "aggressive Reaper user," or that an entire user base is libeled over it. Projection much?
We get it. Your DAW is superior to Reaper. So go use it and enjoy. All that really matters in the end is the final product.


----------



## burp182

I'm amazed at what Reaper will do. I used DP (and Performer before that) for almost 30 years and I still use it for certain things. But I'm so impressed that a program that shows such a featherweight load to the CPU can do what it does. 
BUT...
The issue is getting it to do it. Not that the program is balky - it's just not always very apparent or intuitive in its process to perform some functions. Thank heavens for the wonderful videos that folks have done across the years. Without them I'd still be in the weeds. But the lack of a customer support center makes some things tougher than they should be. For example, I have a Tascam US-2400 control surface that I'd love to be using with Reaper as I do with DP. I've tried every setting I can find and watched the available videos to no avail. I've asked the forums and pretty much received radio silence, other than a few kind folks that tried to help but kept recommending a PC helper file that isn't much help for a Mac user (which I had made clear from the beginning).

Having said all that, I'm still very impressed with Reaper. So what is it bad at? Not much, IMHO. And if you can write a little bit of code (I can't), it's customizable to a degree that is unimaginable for any other DAW. A million themes from users allow you to find a look and feel that suits your workflow and sensibilities. And rock solid basic timing (a longtime DP issue) is not to be minimized.

Just my two cents in a long thread...


----------



## resonate

tack said:


> For the faders I want to control CCs, my BMT script just translates the 14-bit pitch bend to a standard 7-bit CC that's sent into Reaper.



If i understand correctly, you use 14bit fader information for volume control in Reaper? Do you also use bome for that as an intermediate? Command 8 also can send 14bit information (I think - it has an option for double precision in the settings, and i get the whole 0 -16384 values shebang)
edit: I just tested AudioMulch under OS X, and it works in 14bit mode without problems. 

Looking forward for the script to get started, thank you very much!


----------



## tack

resonate said:


> If i understand correctly, you use 14bit fader information for volume control in Reaper? Do you also use bome for that as an intermediate?


I do. I use it to convert the 14-bit pitch bend value to something compatible with the FaderPort protocol.

I've put together a significantly stripped down version of my BMT script, which is available here:

https://helix.urandom.ca/public/Mackie_Control.bmtp

I mostly removed the pieces unrelated to my control surface (all my articulation management stuff and other specifics about my workflow) but I still left quite a bit of complexity in there, so it bears some explaining.

I'm not sure how BMT will present my project on your side, since of course your MIDI devices are going to be different than mine. But here are the salient devices for my setup:

Platform-M (an alias of Platform-M V1.00) - my control surface set in Mackie mode.
BMT - RME TotalMix (an alias of Bome MIDI Virtual Translator 1) - the virtual device provided by BMT that the RME TotalMix FX uses for MIDI control.
BMT - DAW Track Select (an alias of Bome MIDI Virtual Translator 3) - this device is configured in Reaper as a FaderPort control surface and is used for the track volume control (and it's bidirectional, so my control surface syncs to the currently selected track's volume)
BMT - DAW General (an alias of Bome MIDI Virtual Translator 4) - used for controlling Reaper actions (in Reaper this device is set to Control Only), and also is used by my CC Sync script to receive current CC values when a track is selected. i.e. in Reaper, I have the output device aliased as "Bome MIDI Virtual Translator 4 - Track Control" according to the (arbitrary) requirement of my CC Sync script.

LoopBe - this is provided by the free LoopBe1 virtual driver and is the primary MIDI performance interface -- it's the only interface that Reaper listens on for non-control events. It's really similar in spirit to the Bome MIDI Virtual Translator devices except, unlike BMT, it allows multiple applications to open the device for MIDI input (which is important for other stuff I do).
In the BMT project, there are 3 sections (presets):

init - run at startup just to initialize some global variables -- notably, the desired initial values of my DAW channel and system (OS) channel in RME TotalMix FX. Ideally these would sync with TotalMix on startup but in practice it has to wait for the next volume change. So I'd rather initialize to some sensible default rather than zero.
Modifier Detect - the rules in here watch for shift and alt keys, and sync a couple global variables to the current shift and alt key states. This can be checked by rules to combine keyboard modifiers with MIDI events. So for example I can hold the shift key on my keyboard and then strike a note on my MIDI controller and have that trigger some special action instead of sending the note event to Reaper. (I use this approach for changing articulations.) I left it in because there's an example where it's used.
iCON MCP - this is where all the fun is.
The iCON MCP preset expects the control surface to be configured to use the Mackie protocol, and is divided into a few categories:

RME Integration - this probably isn't of interest to you (unless you have an RME interface) but I left it in as an example of doing some moderately sophisticated stuff. My master fader on the control surface is setup to control the master volume in TotalMix, but I also have overloaded the read and write buttons on the master strip to change the context of that master fader. If I press the read button the fader context switches to the system volume channel -- the button lights up to indicate the new context, and now the fader controls a different channel in TotalMix. If I press it again, it turns off and switches back to the main volume. Similarly, if I press the write button, the context switches to my DAW volume. I also use one of the encoders on the control surface to control the headphone volume in TotalMix.

Control Surface Faders to DAW CCs - this is the main thing we've been talking about: takes the pitch bend events from the control surface and sends CCs to the LoopBe MIDI output (because these aren't DAW control messages, they're actual performance events). You'll notice the MIDI channel for the outgoing event is the variable 'gc' -- this is the "global MIDI channel" (see #5 below)

DAW CCs to Control Surface Faders - these listen to the events the CC Sync JSFX plugin sends out (on MIDI bus 16 -- or value 15 in the JSFX) and translates them to pitch bend events for the control surface. Essentially the reverse of #2 above.
Current DAW Track Volume (FaderPort) - as mentioned, in Reaper I add a FaderPort control surface and have it send/receive from the BMT - Daw Track Select device. The rules in this section handle translating from the control surface (fader 1) to the FaderPort protocol and back again. So I get bidirectional sync for the currently selected track volume, and as well syncing the mute and solo states coming from Reaper. (For the control surface to Reaper direction, nothing particularly special is needed except to bind the mute / solo buttons, which send note events, in Reaper's actions. See later about this.)
Global MIDI Channel Control - This is really meant to be paired with some passthrough rules that aren't included in this stripped down project. These rules handle the record buttons on faders 1 through 4 and set the "global MIDI channel" to 1 through 4 respectively. The "global MIDI channel" sets the context for all notes that are sent to the LoopBe device, and is done through the global 'gc' variable which indicates the current global channel. The record buttons stay lit to indicate the current channel (or if I press the lit button again the light turns off without affecting the current channel, just because the light can sometimes be annoying ). You can see an example of this in the rules that translate pitch bends from the control surface to Reaper as CCs -- the CCs are sent out to LoopBe on channel 'gc'

Misc custom commands - here's an example of the keyboard modifier thing I mentioned earlier. The jog wheel on my control surface sends out CC 60. If the shift key is pressed while receiving CC60, then this rule sends out CC61 to Reaper instead. In Reaper, I bind this to the scrub action (by default it's jog).
Catch-all redirection of CCs/notes - I just take any notes or CCs on any channel from the control surface and pass it through to the DAW General MIDI device on channel 15. Channel 15 is my personal designated channel for Reaper control actions. Kinda arbitrary.

Whew, that was some essay! I hope that made even the slightest bit of sense?

If I wasn't at all coherent, I could do a video if it would help.


----------



## resonate

tack said:


> Whew, that was some essay! I hope that made even the slightest bit of sense?
> 
> If I wasn't at all coherent, I could do a video if it would help.



Tack, that is amazing. Very well thought out, and totally coherent. Will need a while to digest and test this, as I have some work to do first, but will definately try it first thing in the next week... thank you very much!


----------



## Grim_Universe

@tack
Hi, Tack. I wonder if you have finished your work with expression maps.. And can you share it with us? Or any good alternatives?


----------



## ghostnote

"What is Reaper bad at?"

Selling it.


----------



## tack

Grim_Universe said:


> Hi, Tack. I wonder if you have finished you work with expression maps.. And can you share it with us?


Not yet I'm afraid. I had hoped to have a beta out by now but then life found a way to keep me busy the past couple weeks. Still plugging along.


----------



## Knomes

I don't know if this is the right place to ask but has any of you ever encountered this bug?
Everytime I try to add a point to the tempo map it adds another point after the time signature change and that messes up all of the MIDI tracks.

At first, it started to do this when I was approaching the first time signature change of the piece.
Then, I turned off and on the computer and I got past the first time signature change, to get blocked 3 minutes later on the next one.


----------



## JEPA

nulautre said:


> Personally the only thing that bugs me is that mod wheel information is a series of bars and not a line that i can add points to (what i'm used to)... (if there is some sort of way to fix/change this please let me know)


i know some video in internet or here in the forum explaining how to customise this... sorry but now i haven't the right information


----------



## MartinH.

JEPA said:


> i know some video in internet or here in the forum explaining how to customise this... sorry but now i haven't the right information



Most of the thread is from 2017, including the comment you quoted.


But in case you still care, you can do this:
















And then you can draw lines with anchor points in the automation envelope for the modwheel slider of the ReaControlMidi plugin under the midi track (but not from the midi editor). I would rather work with the admittadly kinda clunky CC editing in the midi editor, but maybe this workaround would be more useful to you or someone else for something.


----------



## TomislavEP

A while ago, I would say the lack of ability to display and edit CC's in MIDI editor with curves and points is the biggest flaw of REAPER. But I've recently discovered fantastic CC editing tools created by Julian Sader. After some time of learning and practice, these became the standard part of my workflow, so if Cockos by some chance introduces MIDI editor that support CC curves at some point, I would perhaps find it even more cumbersome and non-intuitive to work with in comparison to editing of current CC steps using these scripts. But the developers should definitely offer similar functionality by default, not limited to drawing simple linear ramps. Also, trying to edit these CC events by freehand is a pain.

In any case, I would be very happy to see some improvements in this department by the REAPER team in the future, but I also hope Mr. Sader will continue working on his tools too.


----------



## gregh

TomislavEP said:


> A while ago, I would say the lack of ability to display and edit CC's in MIDI editor with curves and points is the biggest flaw of REAPER. But I've recently discovered fantastic CC editing tools created by Julian Sader. After some time of learning and practice, these became the standard part of my workflow, so if Cockos by some chance introduces MIDI editor that support CC curves at some point, I would perhaps find it even more cumbersome and non-intuitive to work with in comparison to editing of current CC steps using these scripts. But the developers should definitely offer similar functionality by default, not limited to drawing simple linear ramps. Also, trying to edit these CC events by freehand is a pain.
> 
> In any case, I would be very happy to see some improvements in this department by the REAPER team in the future, but I also hope Mr. Sader will continue working on his tools too.


the devs are playing with this at the moment - might be 6 months before released but finally they are going to do curves. Has been huge resistance from a lot of the fan base for years so it is great seeig some action on that front


----------



## MartinH.

gregh said:


> the devs are playing with this at the moment - might be 6 months before released but finally they are going to do curves. Has been huge resistance from a lot of the fan base for years so it is great seeig some action on that front



Will that be an optional alternative way, or just a straight replacement of the old system? I'm asking because I got kinda used to freehand drawing the modwheel curve.


----------



## gregh

MartinH. said:


> Will that be an optional alternative way, or just a straight replacement of the old system? I'm asking because I got kinda used to freehand drawing the modwheel curve.


dunno - Reaper tends to always keep old systems and add in options - but I am not sure that will be the case this time. I imagine it will be a clever solution as they are putting a bit of effort into it


----------



## Rasmus Hartvig

I too am skeptical about curves. It looks nice, but CCs are single events, and there are numerous times where it's most practical to visualize them like that so I do hope they keep the option around.
My main gripe with the bars are that they are bulky and imprecise, so just a visual brush up to bring them up to date would do wonders. I like thin bars with at handle on top, but ideally the Reaper way would be to extend the theming possibilities of CC data.

Julian Sader's CC manipulation scripts are indeed amazing, and are finally bringing the warping and stretching that's the only feature I've been missing from Cubase, to Reaper. 
In general, it feels like a good time to be a Reaper fan.


----------



## Audio Birdi

gregh said:


> dunno - Reaper tends to always keep old systems and add in options - but I am not sure that will be the case this time. I imagine it will be a clever solution as they are putting a bit of effort into it


The devs have said that they're just sticking with the new system, as managing 2 at the same time will be cumbersome for CC editing .


----------



## gregh

Audio Birdi said:


> The devs have said that they're just sticking with the new system, as managing 2 at the same time will be cumbersome for CC editing .


fine by me - I have argued for a curve based system for years


----------



## Bansaw

I use Reaper and think its wonderful. Its very well programmed and never even squeaked not matter how many tracks I lay down.
What is Reaper "bad at" ? I would say the stock plugins. The user interfaces are awful. I encourage Cockos to employ a graphic designer.
Also their default skin I find unattractive. Thank God for the Solaris skin!


----------



## EvilDragon

Bansaw said:


> I encourage Cockos to employ a graphic designer.



They actually do that. 

http://www.houseofwhitetie.com/reaper/imperial/wt_imperial.html

And he did the default skin, too.


----------



## gregh

EvilDragon said:


> They actually do that.
> 
> http://www.houseofwhitetie.com/reaper/imperial/wt_imperial.html
> 
> And he did the default skin, too.


people confuse graphic designer with interaction or interface designer


----------



## EvilDragon

Yeah. Not nearly the same thing, although some good graphic designers are also good UX designers.


----------



## artmanjam

Reaper has some nice features I don't have in Cubase. It's rather time consuming to setup so as to get a desired graphic interface. Stock plugins are... I don't know how to say that, let's say very, extremely basic and awful.

That said, not talking about midi I didn't use, it has a couple of terrible features I couldn't figure out:

- It looks like they wanted to re-invent computer thing. Since the early Mac ages, a simple & basic operation on a computer is selecting several files or folders by clic+drag mouse. 1+1=2. You have to be stuck to the 'Alt' key to do that here in Reaper. Can't understand this. This is a 'hundred times a day' action. Why not letting it as simple as it was?

- The cursor/play management is Prehistorical, no way to have a true ffw or rew. Feeling so free when going back to Cub and ffw or rew with my console remote to the desired spot...

- If ever you change from stereo balance to stereo pan, change width let's say to mono then, go back to stereo balance later, not paying attention: track stays mono now without letting you know it, unless you revert to stereo pan to check. Hopefully ears are there to alert...

- The infinite item. Is there a way to avoid this? I know there's a setup to avoid sound to loop, hopefully. But this infinite item frame which doesn't stop at the end of the audio file, non sense. It's cool for a tempo based item but in any other case it's just doesn't make sense.

That said, maybe I missed something so if ever anyone has a fix for these features, he'll be my saver!


----------



## EvilDragon

artmanjam said:


> let's say very, extremely basic and awful.



You obviously didn't give ReaFIR a shot. Or ReaGate  Nothing awful about those.



artmanjam said:


> - The cursor/play management is Prehistorical, no way to have a true ffw or rew.



There's ways to jog or scrub with the edit cursor, and these actions can be assigned to MIDI CCs. If that's what you mean.



artmanjam said:


> - The infinite item. Is there a way to avoid this?



AFAIK, no. But I can't see how would that be a dealbreaker.


----------



## Bansaw

EvilDragon said:


> Yeah. Not nearly the same thing, although some good graphic designers are also good UX designers.


A graphic designer is a very key player on an interface design team. You don't create an interface design team without including a graphic designer - someone skilled in visuals. 
Houseofwhitie may (or may not, who knows) have been frustrated and went away and created a collection of skins that are really much more visually pleasing.


----------



## Quasar

MartinH. said:


> But in case you still care, you can do this:...
> 
> 
> ...And then you can draw lines with anchor points in the automation envelope for the modwheel slider of the ReaControlMidi plugin under the midi track (but not from the midi editor). I would rather work with the admittadly kinda clunky CC editing in the midi editor, but maybe this workaround would be more useful to you or someone else for something.



Yeah, this works, but besides (as you point out) not being able to work from the MIDI editor, it's a bunch of extra PIA steps.

The option to be able to draw lines for CC input is a very old feature request, the one that more than anything else I wish would be implemented. But if it hasn't been added by now it's a virtual certainty that it won't ever be.

To return to the original title of the thread, this is what Reaper is bad at. The vertical bars suck.


----------



## Audio Birdi

Quasar said:


> Yeah, this works, but besides (as you point out) not being able to work from the MIDI editor, it's a bunch of extra PIA steps.
> 
> The option to be able to draw lines for CC input is a very old feature request, the one that more than anything else I wish would be implemented. But if it hasn't been added by now it's a virtual certainty that it won't ever be.
> 
> To return to the original title of the thread, this is what Reaper is bad at. The vertical bars suck.


It's going to be added, they're testing and implementing it in the pre-release builds right now :D


----------



## Quasar

Audio Birdi said:


> It's going to be added, they're testing and implementing it in the pre-release builds right now :D


Really!? That would be bloody awesome... Going to go to Cockos and look in the pre-release area.


----------



## StephenForsyth

artmanjam said:


> Stock plugins are... I don't know how to say that, let's say very, extremely basic and awful.



We all make the mistake of underrating the JS effects at the start don't worry


----------



## TomislavEP

gregh said:


> the devs are playing with this at the moment - might be 6 months before released but finally they are going to do curves. Has been huge resistance from a lot of the fan base for years so it is great seeig some action on that front



Thanks for the heads-up!

I'm happy to hear they're working on it since this was always one of the more popular requests that still hasn't been fulfilled despite the fact REAPER is updated with new features quite regularly. On the other hand, it will probably take quite some time to get accustomed to it when it finally arrives. As I've said earlier, once you get comfortable using scripts and tools, editing CC events in MIDI editor is actually quite intuitive and fluid, almost as when using curves and points. But the current out-of-the-box abilities for editing CC events in MIDI editor is definitely too limited and cumbersome, so it would be great to see some improvements in this field in any way.


----------



## artmanjam

EvilDragon said:


> You obviously didn't give ReaFIR a shot. Or ReaGate  Nothing awful about those.



I conceide you're right, I'm just talking about ReaEQ which does the job, nothing more, actually a bit less. I'm mostly using Vienna Suite EQ which works quite similar, the difference is huge.

Just had a look to one or two here and there, and the verbs then, ouch, no way for me. So you're right, my judgement is uncomplete indeed. One day I'll explore the rest, maybe (not sure, the UIs are terribly not exciting).


----------



## EvilDragon

ReaVerb is an ok convolver, so reverb quality there will depend on the quality of IRs you put into it...


----------



## artmanjam

EvilDragon said:


> artmanjam said: ↑ - The infinite item. Is there a way to avoid this?
> AFAIK, no. But I can't see how would that be a dealbreaker.



Actually it's a terrible feature when working with picture and for post. That means you can immediately loose the exact item start (and end) point. If ever you extend item snap disabled (assuming you had a safe 1 frame snap) and move the item then, you just loose the sync of this item. Just try this with, let's say two mono items of a stereo sound. How to recover phase then, sample accurate, to go back to normal...

This is an uncomprehensible and unsafe feature imo. I can get its utility for some kind of uses but it should be an option only, at least.

The infinite item, the 'time selection'-drag thing, the cursor concept. These 3 are the worst features of Reaper and they aren't secondary ones.

Apart from that, many nice features in the app, versatility of the tracks etc. But not the most evident workflow, still talking about audio and post, not midi I didn't check


----------



## EvilDragon

Well there's undo if you accidentally move an item...  You could also use the Nudge dialog to move the contents of selected items to the same position, bringing them back to sync?

Also... right click the Lock button in the default toolbar, there are options to lock all sorts of stuff, including item edges, if you don't want to accidentally resize items. Might be useful?


----------



## robgb

artmanjam said:


> I don't know how to say that, let's say very, extremely basic and awful.


Uhh, not even close.


----------



## artmanjam

EvilDragon said:


> Well there's undo if you accidentally move an item...  You could also use the Nudge dialog to move the contents of selected items to the same position, bringing them back to sync?
> 
> Also... right click the Lock button in the default toolbar, there are options to lock all sorts of stuff, including item edges, if you don't want to accidentally resize items. Might be useful?



Sure, I implemented a script to setup the nudge to + or - 1 frame (one for 25fps, another for 30fps) as it was not naturally available 
About nudging to recover the sync, it works as long as you didn't quit the snap mode meanwhile. If you did, good luck, game's over, for critical phase material I mean.

BTW, the best DAW is the one you're using and you have skills on. I'm working on another one and indeed, we all try to replicate what we're doing with our usual DAW.

That said, I have to say that when I discovered Nuendo (and Cubase following) in the early 2000's, I was very suspicious first. I had a huge one year 1/2 long upcoming Disney project including thousands of files were I couldn't have even a single 1 frame mistake somewhere, no way. After having a serious look to Nuendo, I knew I could trust it. And it worked, with confidence. Talking about post, I wouldn't say the same for Reaper. But I'm just talking about some particular use in post, nothing more 

I've been very sensitive to safe workflow in DAWs. Actually, I've been working (in an ancient century...) on a station called Sonic Solution in the mid-nineties. The edit & crossfade pages were revolutionnary, unbelievable for that time and it would still hold the line yet I guess. All the rest in this software was crappy garbage and it gave me the most terrible professional nightmares I ever had. So I like softwares which make you forget about computer a bit. It frees the mind and the ears!


----------



## artmanjam

Ok, I knew there was still another boring feature, I missed it, sorry 

When importing a video, you don't get a dedicated video track but an audio track displaying the audio of the video. Never mind, it works. The only little problem is that if ever you mute the audio, whatever the track or the item... the image gets muted too. 

As you don't wish to hear the sound of the video (let's say the last audio version) while working indeed, the only way is to turn down track's volume. If ever you wish to compare the current work to the last one on the video, double-click on volume + solo track. And then, again unsolo and turn down volume.


----------



## robgb

artmanjam said:


> When importing a video, you don't get a dedicated video track but an audio track displaying the audio of the video.


View > Video Window.
Problem solved.


----------



## MexicanBreed

I am thankful to the designers and owners of Reaper as well as Kenny Gioia and others, for an inexpensive DAW. Unlike most here, I am not a composer, not even a good musician. Yet, Reaper gives me the chance to have a go at something I didn't even know was possible 20 years ago. I can learn a bit of music production thanks to it and free plugins, vstis and a few amp simulators (I do own S-Gear). I also hope to use it my translation business by doing voice-over.

Since I lack any experience with other DAWs, I can't know for sure if others are easier or not. I often go back to the tutorials and, though it's frustrating, it is a capable tool, according to many. The fact that it's affordable should not be easily dismissed either. The world of music production is highly forbidding to so many, yet it is better than it has ever been. But when I see the prices of some of these pieces of software or libraries... Yikes! 

Anyone can dislike what they dislike for any reason, but it seems odd to me that this thread is 2 years old. It was also odd to me that Joey Sturgis made a video on Reaper basically trashing it because he couldn't use it immediately after installing it. I am sure that for many who are starting any DAW would be a challenge.

Anyway, glad to be here. Please, continue bashing things other people use and like.


----------



## artmanjam

robgb said:


> View > Video Window.
> Problem solved.



Problem solved? Mmmm... I don't see how. Video is already checked (window opened) and docked here.

Muting video track doesn' close video window, it actually mutes audio AND video, displaying a black screen thereby. Nothing to see with video window visible or not. It's been related and requested some 6 years ago already. There's some annoying unlogical workaround but it remains a weird and problematic feature.


----------



## artmanjam

MexicanBreed said:


> Please, continue bashing things other people use and like.



Speaking for myself, no bashing intent. Reaper is an interesting and affordable DAW. I'm just pointing some weak features for postproduction use. Nothing more, nothing less


----------



## robgb

artmanjam said:


> Muting video track doesn' close video window, it actually mutes audio AND video, displaying a black screen thereby. Nothing to see with video window visible or not. It's been related and requested some 6 years ago already. There's some annoying unlogical workaround but it remains a weird and problematic feature.


I'm honestly not sure why this is a problem. Yes, muting the track mutes both audio and video, but you can easily lower the volume to zero on the video track, then Command click and drag the audio to a new Audio only track and mute and unmute it to your heart's content without affecting the video at all. It's a simple process that can undoubtedly be reduced to a custom action that requires a single keystroke. Or, if you don't want to do the click and drag thing, you can render the audio out to a separate stem with another keystroke. What am I missing that you're trying to do?






Another way to simply mute the track is to option/alt click the I/O routing button on that track to kill the sound going to the master track. There's also an action for this that can be reduced to a keystroke. I don't find any of these "workarounds" illogical or annoying.


----------



## artmanjam

Yep, the first one is the right one, copying the audio to a new track, having the video track's gain turned down. Video's audio can be easily muted/soloed then. The second one is the one I called the 'annoying one', it's better and way safer to have the enlighted 'M' for mute status visible 

Great for the easy workaround!


----------



## Diablo IV

That it looks fugly, like a toy, that it's menu after menu after menu, that is very customizable you get lost at it... that you need SWS for certain actions, that Midi scks ballz so bad is unbelievable (edit a midi track and just lags so bad and nope, my machine is excellent add to that the project is not big), that I have to squint to read anything. 

I tried Cubase Elements 10... what a piece of crap still is Cubase, performance is so bad ... Reaper wins here... but I changed to SO4 Pro now and I am happy (not in ecstasy but I can read everything very well and actually looks good and modern). 

If Reaper 6 doesn't look properly (layout, it needs an inspector section a la Cubase or SO4, which yes, you can get it as an add on some user made, or this "great" theme I bought from Albertxxxxxxx who actually made a layout with track inspector)... then prob. will stick to SO4... 

it's very disappointing that at 2019 no DAW takes the cake.... I find it so absurd... 

Don't get me started on Pro Tools... that's a long gone dog... I still have hopes for Reaper in version 6... Layout wise Cubase and SO4 win by a mile. 

The other DAWs are just an intent to make one... (Ok, Idk anything about Ableton Live and well, Fruity Loops has its use I guess). I wish I was a Mac fanboy and just used Logic X seems the best option (not because it's better but because it seems programs are for some reason made to run better in Apple stuff (Macs). But I won't support a phone company that is a mess right now (and has been for a while, google it, youtube it, whatever).

Just forget about egos and get all together and make the ultimate daw (I know bugs will always exist we are all humans). Grrr I had to vent here....


----------



## EvilDragon

Diablo3 said:


> that Midi scks ballz so bad is unbelievable (edit a midi track and just lags so bad



There's an option for that 






There's no need for anticipative processing to be 200 ms, can reduce it to like 50-75 and it'll still be great for utilizing your CPU, and will reduce note preview latency (in case you have the checkbox in second red frame enabled). In case you have that checkbox disabled, do note that the whole track you're editing along with all the sends from it will be placed on a single CPU core... you know what can happen if there's lots of heavy effects in the send chain, right?


----------



## Diablo IV

EvilDragon said:


> There's an option for that
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> There's no need for anticipative processing to be 200 ms, can reduce it to like 50-75 and it'll still be great for utilizing your CPU, and will reduce note preview latency (in case you have the checkbox in second red frame enabled). In case you have that checkbox disabled, do note that the whole track you're editing along with all the sends from it will be placed on a single CPU core... you know what can happen if there's lots of heavy effects in the send chain, right?




Thank you dear ED, as I've always said, you are such a gentleman. Not like me, lol. Cheers.


----------



## EvilDragon

I try to help when I can. Lemme know if the above works out for you.


----------



## Fredeke

I miss the piano roll from Cubase (I mean Cubase 2.0 on Atari ST - the PC editions just hurt my eyes).
The piano roll in Reaper is ok from a logical point of view, but would need a lot of tweaking to allow for quick, precise and intuitive work. Editing CC, in particular, is such a nightmare, I find it almost useless for that.

If I could still stomach Apple's nonsense, I would try Logic. The MIDI editor there seems excellent. Alas, I left their ecosystem with no intention of return, after spending $3000 on a laptop that worked no better than a $500 PC. And I'm fed up with version compatibility issues. (Otoh, I run software from 20 years ago on Win10 without any problem.)


----------



## EvilDragon

Fredeke said:


> Editing CC, in particular, is such a nightmare, I find it almost useless for that.



https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=176878








Also adjusting the mouse modifiers helps in making the MIDI editor work a lot quicker. The default setup is not very good, for whatever reason.


----------



## Fredeke

EvilDragon said:


> https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=176878
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also adjusting the mouse modifiers helps in making the MIDI editor work a lot quicker. The default setup is not very good, for whatever reason.



Waw ! I kinda expected something like this to exist, but this is beyond expectations!
(In fact, I confess I posted my rant in the hope of such a reply...) Thanks


----------



## EvilDragon

With those scripts, Reaper can do stuff with CCs other DAWs can't (like the "reveal nodes/insert ramps" thing, I don't think I saw that anywhere else).


----------



## Erick - BVA

tack said:


> This, to me, is a symptom (or perhaps even the cause) of what I feel is Reaper's biggest problem: it doesn't feel like _designed_ software. It feels evolved in terms of its features and capabilities, and the implementations of those things oftentimes just don't seem terribly polished.
> 
> The most recent squirrel moment (at least that I've been paying attention to) was that articulation maps were abruptly dropped on the floor for automation items. Both of them seemed to have generated quite a lot of excitement, and perhaps if I actually cared about automation items and/or didn't care about articulation maps I wouldn't have noticed or cared.
> 
> The lack of design in Reaper is also apparent in its API. You can tell that APIs were added based on the needs of the moment and it doesn't actually seem like anyone sat down and gave a good think about what capabilities should be exposed in an API. I've lost count of the number of times that the APIs that do exist have gotten me _so close_ but lack some very basic capability that seems baffling. (Random example: if get_action_context() returned a couple extra things for MIDI triggered actions, namely the MIDI event and channel, it would be immediately more useful and allow for more script reuse.)
> 
> SWS ends up filling a lot of these holes, but SWS actually has the same evolved-not-designed problem. That's a lot more forgivable, because the motivation of SWS has to have been to fill in some of these glaring omissions in what I can only imagine as fits of whisky-fueled evenings of rage-coding. (Which I have done just recently in trying to find a solution to focus the MIDI editor -- and don't even get me started on focus bugs.)
> 
> So after all that complaining, I still use Reaper. It's the devil I know, and with enough blood, sweat, and therapy sessions, I can usually accomplish whatever workflow I can conceive.
> 
> Still, for someone who just wants to make music and is willing to adapt to any DAW rather than the other way around, I feel there are better alternatives than Reaper (ignoring price of course, at which Reaper is quite hard to beat). If you're not too fussed about wasting a few days on the technicals (even more technical than building your average orchestral template) in exchange for improved workflow, then Reaper gives you a fair bit of power. But the deeper you get down that customization rabbit hole, you'll very likely also experience boundless facepalm moments over inscrutable limitations.
> 
> </rant>


I think ultimately it's about workflow and what we are used to. I don't see glaring omissions probably because I don't know about them and so never knew that I'd miss them (you don't know what you don't know). I've tried alternatives - Ableton, Cubase, Sonar, FL Studios, Samplitude, Studio One, etc. I just keep coming back to Reaper. I think I like the "evolved" design precisely because that's what works best with my approach. I'm more about function over design/ergonomics. Cubase seems very well designed, but I could never get it to work without having crashes, freezes, and the registration process was always a pain. It would always revert back to an unregistered version and I'd have to re-register... and it would never work so I gave up. Support was also awful so there's that. So it's more than just the software itself. I've never needed to contact Cuckos support. Maybe they're awful, too. But luckily I haven't had to find out yet.


----------



## Fredeke

Sibelius19 said:


> I think ultimately it's about workflow and what we are used to. I don't see glaring omissions probably because I don't know about them and so never knew that I'd miss them (you don't know what you don't know). I've tried alternatives - Ableton, Cubase, Sonar, FL Studios, Samplitude, Studio One, etc. I just keep coming back to Reaper. I think I like the "evolved" design precisely because that's what works best with my approach. I'm more about function over design/ergonomics. Cubase seems very well designed, but I could never get it to work without having crashes, freezes, and the registration process was always a pain. It would always revert back to an unregistered version and I'd have to re-register... and it would never work so I gave up. Support was also awful so there's that. So it's more than just the software itself. I've never needed to contact Cuckos support. Maybe they're awful, too. But luckily I haven't had to find out yet.


I second this. It is all a matter of taste.

Softwares that let you start composing intuitively right out of the box, with no sound engineering knowledge, drive me crazy, because the first things I want to do are usually hidden behind the things _they assume_ I'd want to do first.

Interfaces that try to be more intuitive than logical (the worse offenders being smartphones, in my opinion) drive me crazy, because I, personally, need to understand technology rather than intuite it. (But then again I work rather slowly)

But it's good that Ableton and Logic and Garage Band exist for those whose creativity can't get along with technical finicking.


----------



## rudi

artmanjam said:


> I conceide you're right, I'm just talking about ReaEQ which does the job, nothing more, actually a bit less. I'm mostly using Vienna Suite EQ which works quite similar, the difference is huge.
> 
> Just had a look to one or two here and there, and the verbs then, ouch, no way for me. So you're right, my judgement is uncomplete indeed. One day I'll explore the rest, maybe (not sure, the UIs are terribly not exciting).



I came across this comparison of ReaEQ and Pro-Q3 a few weeks ago...
It makes for a rather interesting listening


----------



## Akarin

It's extremely bad at looking good. 

(I'll show myself out)


----------



## rudi

The default interface can feel a bit dated, but the beauty of Reaper (besides its powerful facilities) is that you can customise it quite extensively...


----------



## stfciu

rudi said:


> The default interface can feel a bit dated, but the beauty of Reaper (besides its powerful facilities) is that you can customise it quite extensively...



What theme is that?


----------



## rudi

The theme is called i Logic v2.5, it's donationware (you choose how much to donate):

https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=187971

There is also a free version called i Logic v2 Public at:

https://stash.reaper.fm/theme/1964/I Logic V2 Public.ReaperThemeZip


----------



## InLight-Tone

It's a jack of all trades master of none mess really...


----------



## tack

rudi said:


> The theme is called i Logic v2.5, it's donationware (you choose how much to donate):


From your screenshot I couldn't help but notice you paid for a Reaper theme but not Reaper itself?


----------



## MexicanBreed

InLight-Tone said:


> It's a jack of all trades master of none mess really...


So, in other words, it does many things but badly. Would you care to back that up? I'd really like to know if making the investment to another DAW is really worthwhile.


----------



## rudi

tack said:


> From your screenshot I couldn't help but notice you paid for a Reaper theme but not Reaper itself?


I am still in the evaluation period, but I am definitively going to buy a license - it's very reasonably priced and the more I use Reaper the more I like it . I am currently using Cubase Pro 9.5 (I've been a Steinberg user since the Pro 24 version back in the Atari ST days ).


----------



## rudi

PS @tack I didn't make the connection between Reaticulate and you. I was recently looking for a good articulation manager (I am not fond of the one built into Cubase) and came across your video: It looks _really_ good. I had never heard of Reaper until then and decided to give it go! I am still in the learning phase and getting used to it but getting more and more fluent with.


----------



## tack

rudi said:


> I was recently looking for a good articulation manager (I am not fond of the one built into Cubase) and came across your video: It looks _really_ good. I had never heard of Reaper until then and decided to give it go!


Thanks for the kind words. I'm always pleased and a little surprised when people say they're looking at Reaper because of Reaticulate. Hope it works out for you, and feel free to ask on thread if you have any questions. The usability will eventually improve once I finally finish the bank editor GUI.


----------



## Fredeke

rudi said:


> The theme is called i Logic v2.5, it's donationware (you choose how much to donate):
> 
> https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=187971
> 
> There is also a free version called i Logic v2 Public at:
> 
> https://stash.reaper.fm/theme/1964/I Logic V2 Public.ReaperThemeZip



Thanks for the tip. I should get it.


----------



## Fredeke

EvilDragon said:


> https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=176878
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Also adjusting the mouse modifiers helps in making the MIDI editor work a lot quicker. The default setup is not very good, for whatever reason.



It's the firs time I try to customize Reaper (a task long overdue), and the forum at the link you provide confuses me a bit. I am right in understanding that I must install ReaPack.dll, and that ReaPack will download the scripts directly into Reaper ? A bit like a package manager does for a Linux system?

I see the advantages of this, but my main concern is that I never connect the studio's computer to the internet. Never have and never want to. The network adapter is actually disabled. I download everything on another computer and then USB-sticks it to the studio's computer. I see the hassle as the price for stability: no viruses, no hacks, no antivirus interrupting realtime processes, and by god no updates breaking my tools while I'm working. (Apps that absolutely require online activation, I just do without.)

So anyway, isn't there a way of downloading the scripts from another computer?
Perhaps to another instance of Reaper, and then transfering them from one instance to the other?


----------



## EvilDragon

Yes, you get ReaPack first, which is a package manager. You can install stuff on your network computer and just copy the Scripts folder from Reaper's resource folder (there's an action to open it, search Action list for "resource path") over to your DAW computer.


----------



## Fredeke

EvilDragon said:


> Yes, you get ReaPack first, which is a package manager. You can install stuff on your network computer and just copy the Scripts folder from Reaper's resource folder (there's an action to open it, search Action list for "resource path") over to your DAW computer.


Great! I'll get to it, as soon as I can spare the patience and concentration. Thanks again.


----------



## rudi

@Fredeke in my short time with Reaper I found that there are many, many options and at times it can be overwhelming.

I started simply and gradually went deeper into customising Reaper.

*Backup your current configuration*
You may already know this, but before anything else I would backup your current configuration:

1) Select the Option menu
2) Select Preferences
3) From the Preferences dialog box:
4) Click on the first option on the left: General
5) On the panel on the right click on Export Configuration - a list of all the configuration items will appear after a few seconds
6) Click on Save
7) A file selection box will appear - enter a filename for your backup e.g "My Config Backup 01"
8) Click on Save and your current config will be saved so you can always revert back to it. For extra safety I tend to save mine in my user document folders.


*Install a simple theme*
I would start with a simple theme to get a feel for it.
_My system is Windows 10, so I don't know if the following steps work the same way on MacOS:_

1) Go to:
https://stash.reaper.fm/tag/Themes

2) Select a theme you like the look of e.g
https://stash.reaper.fm/theme/2293/JanneVThemes.zip

3) Find the file you downloaded, and unzip it
4) inside the unzipped folder you'll find two files:

JanneV.ReaperThemeZip
JanneV2.ReaperThemeZip

4) Next open Reaper
5) Drag one of the files above onto the Reaper window
6) Reaper will automatically install the file for you and change theme

*Switching Themes*
To switch between installed themes:

1) Select the Options menu
2) Select the Themes entry
3) You should see a list of installed themes
4) Select one
5) That's it

*Where does Reaper store its Theme files?*
Reaper makes a copy of any new theme it installs automatically.
To find the location on your machine:

1) Select the Options menu
2) Select the Show REAPER resource path in explorer/finder...
3) Explorer / Finder will open that location
4) There should be a folder called ColorThemes - that's where the theme files are stored
5) You can install themes manually by copying them to that folder directly and using the Switching Themes steps above to select them

I hope that helps as a start. Let us know how you get on


----------



## rudi

tack said:


> Thanks for the kind words. I'm always pleased and a little surprised when people say they're looking at Reaper because of Reaticulate. Hope it works out for you, and feel free to ask on thread if you have any questions. The usability will eventually improve once I finally finish the bank editor GUI.



Thank you for the link. I was indeed very impressed with your work, and wishing it were available as a Cubase plugin . 

I went a bit crazy with all the sales/deals available recently (Albion II, Spitfire Chamber Strings, Noire Piano, Blackhole) my credit card needs a wee rest until the end of the month!

I have also been getting to grips with Reaper (like any DAW there are plenty of "how do I..." moments) but I am rapidly finding my feet and using customised shortcuts for those commands ingrained in my fingers in Cubase (F3 -> Mixer).

I intend on using your plugin - I like the way it is organised into libraries, and it's clear GUI (esp. compared to the expression maps in Cubase and Dorico). Thank you for all your hard work!!


----------



## Fredeke

rudi said:


> @Fredeke in my short time with Reaper I found that there are many, many options and at times it can be overwhelming.
> 
> I started simply and gradually went deeper into customising Reaper.
> 
> *Backup your current configuration*
> You may already know this, but before anything else I would backup your current configuration:
> 
> 1) Select the Option menu
> 2) Select Preferences
> 3) From the Preferences dialog box:
> 4) Click on the first option on the left: General
> 5) On the panel on the right click on Export Configuration - a list of all the configuration items will appear after a few seconds
> 6) Click on Save
> 7) A file selection box will appear - enter a filename for your backup e.g "My Config Backup 01"
> 8) Click on Save and your current config will be saved so you can always revert back to it. For extra safety I tend to save mine in my user document folders.
> 
> 
> *Install a simple theme*
> I would start with a simple theme to get a feel for it.
> _My system is Windows 10, so I don't know if the following steps work the same way on MacOS:_
> 
> 1) Go to:
> https://stash.reaper.fm/tag/Themes
> 
> 2) Select a theme you like the look of e.g
> https://stash.reaper.fm/theme/2293/JanneVThemes.zip
> 
> 3) Find the file you downloaded, and unzip it
> 4) inside the unzipped folder you'll find two files:
> 
> JanneV.ReaperThemeZip
> JanneV2.ReaperThemeZip
> 
> 4) Next open Reaper
> 5) Drag the one of the files above onto the Reaper window
> 6) Reaper will automatically install the file for you and change theme
> 
> *Switching Themes*
> To switch between installed themes:
> 
> 1) Select the Options menu
> 2) Select the Themes entry
> 3) You should see a list of installed themes
> 4) Select one
> 5) That's it
> 
> *Where does Reaper store its Theme files?*
> Reaper makes a copy of any new theme it install automatically.
> To find the location on your machine:
> 
> 1) Select the Options menu
> 2) Select the Show REAPER resource path in explorer/finder...
> 3) Explorer / Finder will open that location
> 4) There should be a folder called ColorThemes - that's where the theme files are stored
> 5) You can install themes manually by copying them to that folder directly and using the Switching Themes steps above to select them
> 
> I hope that helps as a start. Let us know how you get on



Thanks a lot. I'll follow those steps. 

(I'm an unrepenting Windowsian myself - or rather, a repented Appler, but that's another story)


----------



## tack

rudi said:


> like any DAW there are plenty of "how do I..." moments


I think the interesting thing about Reaper is that those "how do I do X" questions, once you appreciate Reaper's flexibility, naturally evolve into "how do I make Reaper work like Y." This is a rather sharp double-edged sword, especially if you're a relatively sophisticated user (for instance not afraid of some scripting), because whereas with other DAWs you figure X out and you move onto music, with Reaper there is a greater danger of devising highly customized Ys. And once you know a thing to be possible, with a bit of elbow grease, you spend a lot more time making it behave according to the workflow you have in your head, rather than making the music you have in your head.

At least this is the trap I regularly fall into. Fortunately I can afford to let myself fall into that trap, because this is my hobby rather than paying my bills. I have fun with it in any case.


----------



## Fredeke

tack said:


> I think the interesting thing about Reaper is that those "how do I do X" questions, once you appreciate Reaper's flexibility, naturally evolve into "how do I make Reaper work like Y." This is a rather sharp double-edged sword, especially if you're a relatively sophisticated user (for instance not afraid of some scripting), because whereas with other DAWs you figure X out and you move onto music, with Reaper there is a greater danger of devising highly customized Ys and once you know a thing to be possible. And with a bit of elbow grease, you spend a lot more time making it behave according to the workflow you have in your head, rather than making the music you have in your head.
> 
> At least this is the trap I regularly fall into. Fortunately I can afford to let myself fall into that trap, because this is my hobby rather than paying my bills. I have fun with it in any case.


I find the perspective both appealing and scary


----------



## MatFluor

That's the reason I initially didn't go with reaper and stayed away for quite some time.

Since I am still a programmer/scientific researcher to pay my bills, I felt that if I get reaper, I wouldn't make music, but instead, get sucked into creating workflow optimization for a workflow not there yet.

The turning point for me personally was when OTR by storyteller went the donationware route. I got it, embraced the philosophy of the workflow he lined out, and applied some tweaks. I still from time to time optimize my workflow, but I have a solid jumping off point now - to maximize my productivity, while keeping me a backdoor for some scripts should I need them 

That little story aside - the literally only thing that I still miss in reaper is this:
DP style VI-Racks. I work with VEP, and when you work with subprojects for a film or other uses, and your subprojects employ VEP - it's a hassle to switch between subprojects since a VEP instance only accepts a connection from one plugin at a time. DP handled that with those VI-Racks, which were "above" the chunks (subprojects so to speak), meaning all chunks would use the stuff in those VI-Racks - hence only one connection. With Reaper, each subproject is its own, encapsulated entity. Which has advantages (every reaper projects can be dragged into a master project and become a subproject). But when I want to switch, I have to either disable all VEP plugins before I do or close the subprojects.

That's what I currently "struggle" with. Yes, I've written some custom actions etc that disable the plugins before I switch to another subproject tab (Reaper FTW in that regard again) - but apparently, there is no other way to do that.


----------



## artmanjam

rudi said:


> I came across this comparison of ReaEQ and Pro-Q3 a few weeks ago...It makes for a rather interesting listening




Really interesting and detailed analytic comparison 
I was talking about Vienna Suite EQ as it's very similar to ReaEQ, a simpel EQ with no extra features. The main difference is the Q, way narrower in VS EQ, which allows to achieve a better result on undesired frequencies.

That said, and to get back to the thread, I'm considering some surface control for Reaper and what I've read until now doesn't help me that much. Looks like Reaper setup is not that easy, am I wrong, any idea about?


----------



## MexicanBreed

artmanjam said:


> Really interesting and detailed analytic comparison
> I was talking about Vienna Suite EQ as it's very similar to ReaEQ, a simpel EQ with no extra features. The main difference is the Q, way narrower in VS EQ, which allows to achieve a better result on undesired frequencies.
> 
> That said, and to get back to the thread, I'm considering some surface control for Reaper and what I've read until now doesn't help me that much. Looks like Reaper setup is not that easy, am I wrong, any idea about?



I got a cheap Faderport v1 from ebay afew months back. One of the reasons that made me go for it is that there is a specially tweaked driver for it written by some members of the Reaper forums.


----------



## rudi

artmanjam said:


> Really interesting and detailed analytic comparison
> That said, and to get back to the thread, I'm considering some surface control for Reaper and what I've read until now doesn't help me that much. Looks like Reaper setup is not that easy, am I wrong, any idea about?


I am on day 42 of my 60 evaluation license of Reaper, so I am not the best qualified person to chip in, but I looked-up Reaper automation on the web and I am quite impressed by how simple it is (once you know how to do it, like most DAWs or notation programs )

*Set your MIDI device as a controller*
Your MIDI keyboard/control surface needs to be set as a control device.
_(I use an Oxygen 61 keyboard with sliders, knobs and switches)_

1) Make sure your MIDI device is plugged in
2) In Reaper select the Options menu
3) Select Preferences - the preferences panel will appear
4) Scroll down on the left panel to Audio Devices
5) On the the right side MIDI Input panel select your MIDI device
6) Make sure that both the options for:
"Enable input from this device" and 
"Enable input for control messages" are checked.

Reaper is now set-up to let you use your MIDI device as a controller.

*Assign Reaper commands to your MIDI device*
To assign a command to respond to your MIDI controller - e.g to assign the Play button on your device to the Play command in Reaper:

1) From the Actions menu select Show Action List, or type the ? shortcut
2) Enter the name of the command you want to control: 

e.g "transport play"
_(it doesn't have to be the literral command, just a few keywords)_

3) Select Transport: Play
_(there are several variations depending on whether you want to use the button as a just Play or a Play/Stop toggle, or make the cursor to return to its previous position on Stop etc.)_

4) Click Add
5) Press the control you want to use on your MIDI device
6) Press OK
7) Test it works
8) Repeat as needed

_This works for buttons, knobs and sliders._

I hope that helps.


*Here are some useful links:*

There are lots of Youtube videos on that subject, particularly by Kenny Gioia:

*Transport*



*Sliders*



*There is also one using the Faderport V1*


----------



## rudi

MatFluor said:


> Since I am still a programmer/scientific researcher to pay my bills, I felt that if I get reaper, I wouldn't make music, but instead, get sucked into creating workflow optimization for a workflow not there yet.


Like several other users here I fall into the same category - music is a wonderful (and expensive) hobby for me at the moment, but one I hugely enjoy.

With Reaper there is a huge temptation to dive in and make it do things exactly the way you want it to do it - which is both a strength and a possible distraction. Maybe a bit like Linux vs Windows or MacOS... Linuxes can be used as they are, but you can also customise them ad-infinitum


----------



## rudi

Fredeke said:


> (I'm an unrepenting Windowsian myself - or rather, a repented Appler, but that's another story)



I always cast an envious eye towards Apple's hardware, but the cost of their PCs, especially here in Europe makes it hard to justify. Another factor is the way Apple makes it difficult to upgrade your hardware. If I made a living out of my music I'd definitely switch over.


----------



## Fredeke

rudi said:


> I always cast an envious eye towards Apple's hardware, but the cost of their PCs, especially here in Europe makes it hard to justify. Another factor is the way Apple makes it difficult to upgrade your hardware. If I made a living out of my music I'd definitely switch over.


Here's my (possibly biased) impression: while Apple Macs have become less reliable since the passing of Steve Jobs, Microsoft Windows has become more reliable since the departure of Bill Gates. At the present, I consider them of equivalent quality. For example, I had just as many glitches on my 2015 Macbook Pro (while I had none with my 2005 one), and I could achieve the same latencies with Windows 10 out of the box, last year. I'm still using the same audio interface btw. If that trend continues, by the time you'll want to get a Mac, it probably won't be worth the steep expense anymore. (Unless you really want to use Apple-specific software, like Logic or Final Cut, and assuming they remain as good as they are now.)

Apparently I'm not alone:


----------



## averystemmler

rudi said:


> Maybe a bit like Linux vs Windows or MacOS... Linuxes can be used as they are, but you can also customise them ad-infinitu



And Reaper has (experimental but seemingly stable) native Linux versions available now too, which strengthens that analogy. 

I personally won't be satisfied until I can use my kitchen appliances as some kind of unholy slave cluster.


----------



## rudi

Fredeke said:


> ... Microsoft Windows has become more reliable since the departure of Bill Gates. At the present, I consider them of equivalent quality...



I'am a long, long time Windows user, and I have to say that since Win10 I have pleasantly surprised by its performance and improved user interface (there are still clunky bit, e.g when you go from the modern UI to old Windows style dialogues, such as Power Settings).

Latency on my Scarlett USB interface is also very good and stable.

I have only been tinkering with music until now. My laptop is a Sony VAIO (no longer part of the Sony line now) and is seven years old. The addition of an SSD made a HUGE difference, but I am thinking about something more powerful (basically any decent PC nowadays).

What attracts me to the Apple hardware is the things like the iMac 27" 5K display. It is so clear and vibrant, and the performance of the updated i9 processor has garnered some good reviews. I also like the design of the OS and apps.

The downsides is the huge premium for buying into the Apple ecosystem, which I could justify, but the cost of upgrading to even a modest 512GB/1TB SSD (which can only be done at the point of purchase) is exhorbitant. 

I also looked at the iMini, but once you add upgrades starts to reach iMac territory, especially if you factor in buying a 4K or better display... especially as I don't make any money out of my music.

The other thing which puts me off, is the prospect of having to re-install all my music related software... not so much the DAWs, or sample libraries, but all the VST effects I have accumulated over the years.

On a different note, I had just watched the Christian Henson / Rick Beato interview on which the video you enclosed above is referenced... serendipity!


----------



## rudi

averystemmler said:


> And Reaper has (experimental but seemingly stable) native Linux versions available now too, which strengthens that analogy.
> 
> I personally won't be satisfied until I can use my kitchen appliances as some kind of unholy slave cluster.



Yes, the analogy feels very relevant. I have just dipped my toes (fingers?) into the SWS extensions to tailor Reaper to my preferences, and I am already extremely impressed with things like the Cycle and Startup Actions. More time recording, less adjusting settings


----------



## Fredeke

rudi said:


> I'am a long, long time Windows user, and I have to say that since Win10 I have pleasantly surprised by its performance and improved user interface (there are still clunky bit, e.g when you go from the modern UI to old Windows style dialogues, such as Power Settings).
> 
> Latency on my Scarlett USB interface is also very good and stable.
> 
> I have only been tinkering with music until now. My laptop is a Sony VAIO (no longer part of the Sony line now) and is seven years old. The addition of an SSD made a HUGE difference, but I am thinking about something more powerful (basically any decent PC nowadays).
> 
> What attracts me to the Apple hardware is the things like the iMac 27" 5K display. It is so clear and vibrant, and the performance of the updated i9 processor has garnered some good reviews. I also like the design of the OS and apps.
> 
> The downsides is the huge premium for buying into the Apple ecosystem, which I could justify, but the cost of upgrading to even a modest 512GB/1TB SSD (which can only be done at the point of purchase) is exhorbitant.
> 
> I also looked at the iMini, but once you add upgrades starts to reach iMac territory, especially if you factor in buying a 4K or better display... especially as I don't make any money out of my music.
> 
> The other thing which puts me off, is the prospect of having to re-install all my music related software... not so much the DAWs, or sample libraries, but all the VST effects I have accumulated over the years.
> 
> On a different note, I had just watched the Christian Henson / Rick Beato interview on which the video you enclosed above is referenced... serendipity!



The problem with "buying into" the Apple ecosystem (I love that phrase btw) is that not only do you pay 2x to 3x worth of what you get, but you can hardly update your hardware afterwards. Apple is making increasing efforts to prevent you from opening the case and tinkering inside. And their own tech support doesn't always do a great job either (when they don't flat out reply 'impossible' to a very simple and reasonable request)

As for displays, all workstations' displays are great now. I have a Lenovo Thinkpad P70 laptop with a 17'' IPS screen, on which I can tell the difference between a 4Gb and a 8Gb x264 feature-length video ! (Plus, it's anti-glare - something Apple has abandonned, along with other conveniences)

Yes, according to some, hackintosh is the way to go if you want to run OSX without paying Apple's price for the hardware. But I have no first (or even second) hand experience in the matter.

Now, when I went from Mac to Win10, the migration wasn't too painful. Activation processes are the worst (I try to use as little online-activating software as I can, because it feels like paying for the right to be bothered), but after that, export/import your Reaper config, and most plugins will be recognized and found by Reaper on the new machine. For the plugins that aren't, this is what I did: open my projects one by one on the new computer, and whenever a plugin was "missing" (of which you'll be clearly warned), I would open the project on the old computer, save the plugin's preset, and transfer it to the unrecognized instance of the same plugin on the new computer. For about 60 projects, this took me less than half a day.

I suppose your experience the other way around would be the same as mine.


----------



## Stanoli

I heard Reaper is especially bad at cooking Spaghetti.


----------



## ProfoundSilence

reaper is especially bad at sowing I'd imagine.


----------



## Rasmus Hartvig

Stanoli said:


> I heard Reaper is especially bad at cooking Spaghetti.



There's a script for that.


----------



## Fredeke

Rasmus Hartvig said:


> There's a script for that.


Ah! That's the Reaper community's equivalent to "there's an app for that"


----------



## Fredeke

More seriously,..

Does anybody know how to exclude some tracks from being paired with the control surface ?

Say I have groups, and I only want the parent tracks to be surface controllable, in order to minimize fader page browsing?


----------



## EvilDragon

Hmmm I'm not sure if that's possible. Control surfaces only really care about track number, not if it's a folder or not.


----------



## Quasar

Rasmus Hartvig said:


> There's a script for that.


Just use the action list and create a custom key command. I use Ctrl+SHift+S for spaghetti, but usually settle on Ctrl+Shift+L because I prefer the linguini.


----------



## Stanoli

Do not forget alt+n+t for al dente.


----------



## rudi

Thank you for your insights. 

The more I look at the cost of Apple hardware and especially the ever more difficult self-upgrades, the more I am setting aside the idea of going Apple. One example: I am upgrading my laptop's SSD. A 1Tb drive is around £140, inc. VAT, from Crucial... versus a breath taking £630 on Apple's website. Ok, it might be that Apple's SSD is superior, but that's still a huge premium. 

I looked-up some Hackintosh websites and guides, but the complexity of the process and the fact that future upgrades could be problematic puts me off.  

I think I'll stick with the Windows eco-system for now.


----------



## EvilDragon

rudi said:


> Ok, it might be that Apple's SSD is superior



It really isn't.


----------



## givemenoughrope

Can Reaper run on Linux?


----------



## tack

givemenoughrope said:


> Can Reaper run on Linux?


There are experimental builds for Linux on Reaper's download page.


----------



## Fredeke

Apple is jacking up prices to compensate for waning sales... The opposite of what another brand would do. (Because... they're brave, I guess?)



tack said:


> There are experimental builds for Linux on Reaper's download page.


I've heard it runs quite well already.


----------



## EvilDragon

Fredeke said:


> (Because... they're brave, I guess?)



Because they can get away with it since they're basically a cult


----------



## Fredeke

EvilDragon said:


> Because they can get away with it since they're basically a cult


Yeah. Maybe it was too obscure a reference, but _being brave_ is their excuse for removing the phone jack from the iPhone 7 (Or was it the X? Or the Z? I can't keep up.)

This is getting a tad off topic, but to add water to your mill: 

Me, I feel like liberated from a cult, or, to further the video's analogy, fled from the USSR: I could just be content, but I have to constently tell everybody how awful it was (or rather had become), to the point of derailing unrelated threads like this one  - no, actually I'm just pissed off after falling for a scam.

I'm surprised I don't get more pushback from Apple fans, though. 
People here are patient and well behaved.


----------



## Dewdman42

Thanks for sharing that video. That dude is the one who figured out how to fix my 2010 macbookpro gpu problem ( flakey capacitor ), which i still haven’t fixed but I might send it to him. He is 100% right on all counts.

That being said I can’t stand using ms windows so I will personally still be suffering with apple hardware and hoping it does better then my MBP did. I won’t buy another laptop from them any time soon. Thank god my cheese grater is still running strong and could be the best pc hardware I’ve ever seen. Anyone who reads my posts about Apple or vsl will know I am not shy to criticize manufacturers for abhorrent behavior and I think we all should. Unfortunately OS X is still the best os in existence as far as I’m concerned. Can’t leave it yet. Maybe someday I will have to though if they screw up the next macpro generation, which is quite possible they will.


----------



## Dewdman42

Regarding Microsoft Windows, i do not think there is a user cult mentality like soviet Russia and Apple, but having lived in Seattle for a decade I can tell you with a certainty that Microsoft employees have a take-over-the-world imperialist arrogance that Microsoft is the best company ever and that the whole world will be a better place if everyone in the world uses their operating system, office products, development platforms and everything else. It’s no coincidence that they have been sued and lost over anti trust violations. And as far as I’m concerned ms Windows is still layer over layer of bad architecture with pretty translucent window eye candy on top.


----------



## EvilDragon

Dewdman42 said:


> And as far as I’m concerned ms Windows is still layer over layer of bad architecture with pretty translucent window eye candy on top.



Backwards compatibility matters when you have over a billion users (medical facilities, military, ATMs, trains, yaddayadda), yo. Not something Apple ever had to worry about, and apparently not something they'll have to worry about because it doesn't seem likely they'll reach those numbers of users any time soon, or possibly ever.


----------



## Dewdman42

I'm well aware of the justifications for the bad architecture, but its still in the end, bad architecture. I think MS windows is a pile of garbage, I loathe the day Apple forces me to use it because of their crappy hardware


----------



## Fredeke

Dewdman42 said:


> Regarding Microsoft Windows, i do not think there is a user cult mentality like soviet Russia and Apple, but having lived in Seattle for a decade I can tell you with a certainty that Microsoft employees have a take-over-the-world imperialist arrogance that Microsoft is the best company ever and that the whole world will be a better place if everyone in the world uses their operating system, office products, development platforms and everything else. It’s no coincidence that they have been sued and lost over anti trust violations. And as far as I’m concerned ms Windows is still layer over layer of bad architecture with pretty translucent window eye candy on top.


I don't *know* how they deal with antiquated and bad architecture, but it *feels* like they're replacing one basemant beam at a time, in a random order. Windows will allways be a hodgepodge of new and old stuff on every level, but it is also slowly evolving on all levels. Took them years to get DOS emulated in Windows instead of Windows running on DOS, but they got there. It's an erratic progress, but it's progress.

Now, I would never have believed I would defend a microsoft product. I still don't like the company and their ways, but it's just the least bad option for me (though I respect your like for OSX, I used to use a Mac because of reliability, despite my dislike for the interface ). As for Linux, well... While I want to support free software, which I see as the only socially responsible solution, on the other hand I want to make music in this lifetime, not spend it compiling drivers. (Btw, the reason OSX has a good architecture is because they took a free-software OS, slapped a layer of locked down varnish over it, and branded it as their own (thanks to a very intentional "loophole" in the BSD license)).


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## Dewdman42

OSX is mainly a great os because of UNIX yes. UNIX was around before MS DOS and was always a superior operating system in every way. But it never had a decent desktop user experience until OSX. 

Unlike MS Windows, OS X is NOT lipstick on a pig.

Apple has also created insanely good frameworks such as Core Audio and Core Midi that out perform anything Microsoft has done for literally decades. And are particularly beneficial to us. There is really no comparison. And don't get me started on the Windows bloody Registry.

Microsoft mostly has stayed out of the hardware game, they have a few hits with the Surface, as Apple did in the past with many famous pieces of hardware too, but right now Apple its literally pissing it all away with the crap hardware they've been making. Since their software only officially comes if you get their hardware, that puts us in a dilemma.


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## robgb

I used PCs for 20 years before I switched to Mac because of Logic. Whatever you might think of their hardware or cultish folks who are more concerned with fashion than substance, OSX is a much more pleasant user experience, and setting up to record is flawless compared to the PC. I know things have vastly improved on PCs, and I currently use a Windows 10 laptop to run my business software, but honestly, if I had to deal with Windows 10 as my main music operating system I'd probably slit my wrists. That said, like anything else, like the choice of DAW, it all comes down to personal preference. But sometimes we have to be realistic. If Macs get out of my price range, I will undoubtedly bite the bullet and go back to PCs. Fortunately, now that I use Reaper, maybe the transition wouldn't be that painful.


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## Fredeke

Dewdman42 said:


> Apple has also created insanely good frameworks such as Core Audio and Core Midi that out perform anything Microsoft has done for literally decades. And are particularly beneficial to us. There is really no comparison. And don't get me started on the Windows bloody Registry.


OSX also comes bundled with some pretty decent Apple plugins.



robgb said:


> Fortunately, now that I use Reaper, maybe the transition wouldn't be that painful.


Thanks for getting the thread back on track! I plead guilty for the digression


----------



## Fredeke

Is there a way of setting a cue point within a wav, that will act as items' handle as far as snapping and positioning is concerned, like in PT?


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## Rasmus Hartvig

Yes! Drag the bottom left corner of an item to set its snap offset to somewhere else than the item edge.


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## Tim_Wells

I see this has degenerated into a Mac vs Windows thing. Macs are wonderful. But IMO, there is absolutely no reason to fear or dread using a Windows based DAW. I turn mine on every morning and it works perfectly and has for many years. Just take some time to pick out the right hardware.


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## Zoot_Rollo

ReaVisiting Reaper here.

since i got a new Midi controller (Arturia KEYLab 49/61 mk2), i'm finally able to play with control surfaces in my DAWs.

i've had Reaper for years, but haven't used it - i've been using Studio One Pro and more recently Cubase.

I wanted to try the Arturia as a control surface in Reaper.

I installed the latest Reaper (5.979), set up some tracks, searched and found a theme i liked and 4 hours later...

I was back in the saddle with a full mix.

I didn't even get around to configuring the KEYLab i was enjoying it so much.

For me, the interface is key. I've always had a bit of Logic envy, i won't get into the Windows/Mac thing, other than ALL my 3D CAD/Analysis tools are Windows based.






A couple of questions:

1. Since Reaper is known for efficient CPU/RAM usage, what's the best way to monitor this? Task Manager, i would think.

Is the Performance Meter accurate?

2. one of the main ReaSons i grabbed Cubase Pro for the recent crossgrade deal was for the expression maps.

How is Reaticulate these days? i never got up to speed with it, but with my newfound Reaper interest, i'm ready to spend some time with it.

the developer sure seems active with it, fantastic sign.

-

going through a few DAWs (Sonar and Fruity as well), has given me a newfound appreciation for Reaper.

any good resources other than the Reaper site (which is very good)?.

bottom line, it really pays not to be married to specific software and be open to it all.

hardware?

different story.







*reaticulate*


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## Fredeke

Zoot_Rollo said:


> since i got a new Midi controller (Arturia KEYLab 49/61 mk2)


Can I ask a question not related to Reaper?

How sensitive is the Keylab mk2's aftertouch?
Because I had an mk1 a while ago, and the aftertouch was so sensitive it was almost impossible not to play it... and I loved it !!! 
Would you say the mk2 is like that too?


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## Zoot_Rollo

Fredeke said:


> Can I ask a question not related to Reaper?
> 
> How sensitive is the Keylab mk2's aftertouch?
> Because I had an mk1 a while ago, and the aftertouch was so sensitive it was almost impossible not to play it... and I loved it !!!
> Would you say the mk2 is like that too?



i will check and let you know.


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## Zoot_Rollo

Reaticulate update:

got further with it this morning than i have before.

RTFM!


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## tack

Zoot_Rollo said:


> How is Reaticulate these days? i never got up to speed with it, but with my newfound Reaper interest, i'm ready to spend some time with it.


It solves a problem for me and apparently several others seem to get on with it. I think it's pretty powerful, but currently it does require a bit of fiddling with a text editor to craft your banks, so a bit of elbow grease may be required. (Questions happily answered over in the Reaticulate thread.) Things will improve drastically in that area as of 0.5.0 which will introduce more GUI hand-holding.



Zoot_Rollo said:


> the developer sure seems active with it, fantastic sign.


Not as active as I'd like, but more active in recent weeks, happily. I have some pretty ambitious internal design changes in the oven at the moment (or probably more accurately to say in the mixing bowl) which will open the door to a bunch of features and ideas I was previously constrained with. The goal now is to complete the internal overhaul and then get the GUI polish going.


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## Zoot_Rollo

tack said:


> It solves a problem for me and apparently several others seem to get on with it. I think it's pretty powerful, but currently it does require a bit of fiddling with a text editor to craft your banks, so a bit of elbow grease may be required. (Questions happily answered over in the Reaticulate thread.) Things will improve drastically in that area as of 0.5.0 which will introduce more GUI hand-holding.
> 
> 
> Not as active as I'd like, but more active in recent weeks, happily. I have some pretty ambitious internal design changes in the oven at the moment (or probably more accurately to say in the mixing bowl) which will open the door to a bunch of features and ideas I was previously constrained with. The goal now is to complete the internal overhaul and then get the GUI polish going.




i don't mind digging in at this point, might benefit seeing what's under the hood before the polished UI is released.

i set it up on my work PC, no libraries available.

anxious to get into my studio tonight to run it.


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## ManicMiner

TomislavEP said:


> A while ago, I would say the lack of ability to display and edit CC's in MIDI editor with curves and points is the biggest flaw of REAPER. But I've recently discovered fantastic CC editing tools created by Julian Sader.


Tom, I am looking at Julian Sader's addons in ReaPack right now and there are over 85 scripts he's written. How did you know which ones to add from ReaPack?
And, when these scripts are installed, do they add shortcut icons in the toolbar of the Midi-editor?
I'd like to add his scripts but don't know exactly which ones to link in.


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## TomislavEP

ManicMiner said:


> Tom, I am looking at Julian Sader's addons in ReaPack right now and there are over 85 scripts he's written. How did you know which ones to add from ReaPack?
> And, when these scripts are installed, do they add shortcut icons in the toolbar of the Midi-editor?
> I'd like to add his scripts but don't know exactly which ones to link in.



I think that the most important ones are linear and sine curves, remove redundant CC events, arch/tilt, and stretch/compress. Frequently, I use only linear and sine curve tools for correcting the events recorded by my physical controllers (including the breath), but I also find this a quick way to manually draw CC automation when needed. 

When you add these scripts through ReaPack (I also recommend using the newest SWS extension), you need to assign them a custom keystroke through the Actions panel. You should also add an icon for the MIDI editor toolbar under Menu Editor of the Actions panel. It's important to note that you need to open the Actions list whilst in the MIDI editor mode, otherwise you won't see these scripts after you install them. For the icons, you can use plain text labels as I do (C for curves, L for linear, etc) or even graphic icons.

BTW, I've recently learned that the REAPER team will definitely add the ability to display and edit CC events in the MIDI editor as dots and curves in REAPER 6. Maybe they will even enable us to use both systems according to preference or specific needs.


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## artmanjam

I won't say Reaper is bad at something but...

It has one major terrible feature I couldn't find any turnaround.

Imagine a brand releases a new car (I like computer/car comparison...). Nice, good looking, doing many things. You go to test it on the road, you drive straight away and while wanting to go up to the second gear with the shifter, the car turns right. You stop and the seller tells you, ah yes, there's something totally new here: the steering wheel is used to shift and please use the shift stick to turn.

That's what happens with Reaper. The universel basics of a computer desktop is that you click and drag several folders or files to select them on the desktop or in a window. That's true for most applications too. If you wish to select several items in a project window, you just have to click and drag. Easy, fast, and you do that 100 times a day.

Now on Reaper, it looks like they wanted to reinvent the wheel. You have to use the Alt key to do that. This is a total non-sense and a dramatic workflow slower, especially when you work on post. I can't count the hundreds of times I changed the Time Selection when I wished to select items. As soon as you want to go fast, a micro-second late pushing the Alt key makes you change the Time Selection, have to Undo and again then.

The pure logic is: use the easiest and function to do the action you're using the most often in a day. Not reversed. That's insane.

I could add another stupid feature. When you extend an item start or end, Reaper doesn't stop at the sound's start or end. This is extremely annoying, particularly when you want to apply a fade in or out as you have to zoom and care about where the item starts, or you fade on nothing first and the sound appears cut then if ever it doesn't have a self fade in it.

Believe me, the drag feature is a pain in the ass when working on post. I experience it every day and it dramatically slows the workflow.


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## tack

artmanjam said:


> As soon as you want to go fast, a micro-second late pushing the Alt key makes you change the Time Selection, have to Undo and again then.


You could try using right-click drag instead. This works in the MIDI editor as well. I agree with your point about left-click dragging being the most familiar idiom, but fortunately I found developing an instinct for right-click drag to marquee select didn't take me very long.



artmanjam said:


> When you extend an item start or end, Reaper doesn't stop at the sound's start or end.


I suspect you're referring to source looping which is enabled by default. You can turn that off for new items by going to Preferences | Project | Media Item Defaults and unchecking the "Loop source" options. That doesn't change _existing _items that were added when those options enabled though, but you can select any existing items (via right-click drag  or perhaps ctrl-a to select all items) and opening Item Properties (via context menu or F2) and unchecking Loop source there.


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## snattack

4 biggest drawbacks with Reaper:

1. It's seems not possible to view more than one mixer window. This is for me a deal breaker since it means I can't have a mixer window and a single channel strip on the left side at the same time. I'm hoping this will be fixed.

2. It's still super ugly and looks like an OpenSource software.

3. Steep learning curve.

4. Not as good articulation handling as Logic or Cubase.

I will switch from Logic eventually since it's nice being able to customize the DAW exactly as I wish, but not yet.


----------



## robgb

artmanjam said:


> I won't say Reaper is bad at something but...
> 
> Now on Reaper, it looks like they wanted to reinvent the wheel. You have to use the Alt key to do that. This is a total non-sense and a dramatic workflow slower, especially when you work on post. I can't count the hundreds of times I changed the Time Selection when I wished to select items. As soon as you want to go fast, a micro-second late pushing the Alt key makes you change the Time Selection, have to Undo and again then.



Pretty much anything you don't like about Reaper can be changed in preferences and using actions. I haven't looked into this particular "quirk," but mouse modifiers are your friend.


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## robgb

snattack said:


> 4 biggest drawbacks with Reaper:
> 
> 1. It's seems not possible to view more than one mixer window. This is for me a deal breaker since it means I can't have a mixer window and a single channel strip on the left side at the same time. I'm hoping this will be fixed.



If you have the mixer open, why do you need a single channel strip on the left side at the same time? Not sure how that's a benefit.



snattack said:


> 2. It's still super ugly and looks like an OpenSource software.



Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but there a hundreds of themes you can change it to and many of them are quite nice. To my mind none of the other DAWs win any prizes for beauty either.



snattack said:


> 3. Steep learning curve.



This depends. Every DAW has a steep learning curve if you're a beginner. There's a lot to understand. If you're already experienced with DAWs, Reaper's learning curve is fairly insignificant, but I can see how its abundance of customizable options could be overwhelming. That said, they have an entire video series on their website, created by Kenny Gioia, that will get you up to speed in a matter of hours. Kenny's videos are a goldmine.



snattack said:


> 4. Not as good articulation handling as Logic or Cubase.



On this we can agree, but you merely need to look at @tack's free Reaticulate utility that can be downloaded via Reapack. It is a brilliant articulation switching utility that I use daily. You can find more information about it here:






Reaticulate | a free articulation management system for REAPER


Reaticulate | a free articulation management system for REAPER




reaticulate.com


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## lucor

I've mostly switched over to REAPER from Cubase, but I still have huge issues with the PERFORMANCE of the UI (not the look).
On a normal 1080p monitor things are fine, but on my 4k screen things can get pretty atrocious very fast (as in the UI gets very laggy and slow).
Other than that I love REAPER to death, but that one single issue is such a big one that I still can't commit 100% to it. :(


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## Stevie

Reaticulate is far superior to VST expression. And yes, mouse modifiers are the way to go to customize the mouse behavior.

@lucor this still hasn’t been solved for you? I would catch up on the REAPER forums.


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## robgb

One thing you REALLY have to love about Reaper are the updates. I JUST updated and when I look at the forum I see that another update is already in the release candidate stage and about to be released. What other DAW developer listens to their users and updates their software every couple weeks?


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## averystemmler

robgb said:


> If you have the mixer open, why do you need a single channel strip on the left side at the same time? Not sure how that's a benefit.



I'd actually like this too. I keep an "inspector" (a la Cubase) channel strip docked on the left side of my arrange view, synced to the selected track, but I'd like to be able to pull up a full mixer view without losing it.

I suppose I could just save a screenset with the mixer popped out and toggle back and forth, but multiple mixer windows can be great for dividing things in multi monitor setups too


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## robgb

averystemmler said:


> I'd actually like this too. I keep an "inspector" (a la Cubase) channel strip docked on the left side of my arrange view, synced to the selected track, but I'd like to be able to pull up a full mixer view without losing it.
> 
> I suppose I could just save a screenset with the mixer popped out and toggle back and forth, but multiple mixer windows can be great for dividing things in multi monitor setups too


To each his own. I just don't see the benefit.


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## Stevie

You guys really should take a look at track inspector from https://reaper.hector-corcin.com/
and he also features a mixer script.


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## artmanjam

tack said:


> You could try using right-click drag instead. This works in the MIDI editor as well. I agree with your point about left-click dragging being the most familiar idiom, but fortunately I found developing an instinct for right-click drag to marquee select didn't take me very long.



I know but I don't use any mouse here, Wacom tablet only. Right-click is a button --> longer and tiring when doing this hundred times a day, not speaking about finger joint pain...




tack said:


> I suspect you're referring to source looping which is enabled by default. You can turn that off for new items by going to Preferences | Project | Media Item Defaults and unchecking the "Loop source" options. That doesn't change _existing _items that were added when those options enabled though, but you can select any existing items (via right-click drag  or perhaps ctrl-a to select all items) and opening Item Properties (via context menu or F2) and unchecking Loop source there.



Yes I know too, sound is not looped then but it doesn't prevent the end of the item from being extended beyond the file's very end. And here's the problem with fades in or out. I'm teaching to students and I can see such issues every day...


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## artmanjam

robgb said:


> Pretty much anything you don't like about Reaper can be changed in preferences and using actions. I haven't looked into this particular "quirk," but mouse modifiers are your friend.



Not totally true, sorry...

Regarding the 'Click and Drag', I did it. Switched for Drag to select items, and 'Right-click' for Time Selection. Issue: THIS implies I can't Right-click on item to open the context menu, this feature doesn't work anymore then. I have to open the context menu for any take envelope feature etc.

About loop, I couldn't find anything which could prevent from extending item duration beyond the real end of the file. The only thing I could was to avoid item's sound loop then.


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## lucor

Stevie said:


> Reaticulate is far superior to VST expression. And yes, mouse modifiers are the way to go to customize the mouse behavior.
> 
> @lucor this still hasn’t been solved for you? I would catch up on the REAPER forums.


Unfortunately not. There was an update a few months back that made things better in the TCP but still not a really smooth experience. The midi editor is as bad as ever once you activate several tracks to be shown. That's what I really miss about Cubase, doesn't matter if you have 1 track or 5000, the UI always stays smooth as silk.
Maybe the often mentioned GPU acceleration would be the answer? But Schwa and Justin seem to show very little interest in that.


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## Stevie

Yeah, I have to agree on the MIDI Editor experience. I think a lot of this is coming from the fact that the ME is a dll and not implemented into REAPER from the beginning on.
The GPU support seems to be a can of worms for the devs.


----------



## robgb

artmanjam said:


> Regarding the 'Click and Drag', I did it. Switched for Drag to select items, and 'Right-click' for Time Selection. Issue: THIS implies I can't Right-click on item to open the context menu, this feature doesn't work anymore then. I have to open the context menu for any take envelope feature etc.


I'm curious. If, in the default configuration, you can right click drag to use the marquee tool, why not simply do it that way? It's not as if it's an earth-shattering extra chore to use a different finger. Every DAW has differences. This seems like an extremely minor one to me.



lucor said:


> The midi editor is as bad as ever once you activate several tracks to be shown.


What is bad about it? If you have multiple tracks activated in the midi editor and use the track list, it behaves perfectly fine. I suspect that most of the gripes about Reaper come from people who are used to doing something one way and haven't allowed themselves to get used to doing it the Reaper way (or bothered exploring ways to customize it).

Or maybe the reason I'm having a "better" experience is because I use Reaper for Mac. Maybe the Windows experience isn't quite as smooth.



Stevie said:


> You guys really should take a look at track inspector from https://reaper.hector-corcin.com/
> and he also features a mixer script.


I took a look at this, figured I'd try it out, and couldn't figure out how to make it work. Kept getting an error.


----------



## artmanjam

robgb said:


> I'm curious. If, in the default configuration, you can right click drag to use the marquee tool, why not simply do it that way? It's not as if it's an earth-shattering extra chore to use a different finger. Every DAW has differences. This seems like an extremely minor one to me.



Because I'm doing that hundreds of times a day. Up button on pen is slower than just dragging so it slows the workflow down. And I can tell you about fingers joints pain while having ultra-repetitive actions. I had severe pain with a jog wheel in the 90's, working day and night. It lasted several years.

And furthermore, it's just pure logic. And definitely not a minor thing when you're working on post.

Imo


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## lucor

robgb said:


> What is bad about it? If you have multiple tracks activated in the midi editor and use the track list, it behaves perfectly fine. I suspect that most of the gripes about Reaper come from people who are used to doing something one way and haven't allowed themselves to get used to doing it the Reaper way (or bothered exploring ways to customize it).


Ah yes, there just can't be a valid criticism of REAPER without robgb chiming in and saying that it's not that bad or just the users fault.  I love REAPER just as much as you, but I feel you sometimes need to take off your rose tinted glasses and see that even REAPER isn't perfect.
And no, it has nothing to do with me, the midi editor performance just plain sucks on higher resolutions.


----------



## Stevie

lucor said:


> Ah yes, there just can't be a valid criticism of REAPER without robgb chiming in and saying that it's not that bad or just the users fault.  I love REAPER just as much as you, but I feel you sometimes need to take off your rose tinted glasses and see that even REAPER isn't perfect.
> And no, it has nothing to do with me, the midi editor performance just plain sucks on higher resolutions.



That's really something you should bring up again. We need to get this fixed.
Post the link and I'll jump on.


----------



## MartinH.

artmanjam said:


> Because I'm doing that hundreds of times a day. Up button on pen is slower than just dragging so it's slows the workflow down. And I can tell you about fingers joints pain while having ultra-repetitive actions.



I used to have trouble with pain from computer work. What was a gamechanger for me is stretching in a certain way. Short version: stretch the muscles that you are contracting most often during work, hold the stretch for _at least_ 90 seconds. It's ok if it hurts a little, in fact it's supposed to, but just a little.


----------



## robgb

lucor said:


> Ah yes, there just can't be a valid criticism of REAPER without robgb chiming in and saying that it's not that bad or just the users fault.  I love REAPER just as much as you, but I feel you sometimes need to take off your rose tinted glasses and see that even REAPER isn't perfect.
> And no, it has nothing to do with me, the midi editor performance just plain sucks on higher resolutions.



Uh, how old is that version of Reaper? The CC lanes were revamped for version 6 and now use envelopes. Maybe if you try a newer version you'll have more success. They address many issues and update almost daily.

Like any DAW, of course Reaper has problems. But in my experience—which is the only experience I can rely on—the midi editor is not even remotely as bad as some people make it out to be.


----------



## robgb

artmanjam said:


> Because I'm doing that hundreds of times a day. Up button on pen is slower than just dragging so it slows the workflow down. And I can tell you about fingers joints pain while having ultra-repetitive actions. I had severe pain with a jog wheel in the 90's, working day and night. It lasted several years.
> 
> And furthermore, it's just pure logic. And definitely not a minor thing when you're working on post.
> 
> Imo


Okay. I just went in and changed Left Drag in the Track view to Marquee select. I changed Right Drag in Arrange View to Time Selection. All works fine. If you want to open up a context menu, you simply have to DOUBLE right click and voila, the menu opens.

Maybe that's a compromise that will work for you.


----------



## tack

robgb said:


> I just went in and changed Left Drag in the Track view to Marquee select.


Oh, indeed, this is possible after all. I was looking in the Arrange view when I replied to artmanjam. I think this is what they were asking for.

I find I'm not entirely sure what the difference is between Track and Arrange view in the mouse modifiers, though.


----------



## tack

robgb said:


> Uh, how old is that version of Reaper? The CC lanes were revamped for version 6 and now use envelopes. Maybe if you try a newer version you'll have more success.


New versions not much (or any) better in that regard. When you have many tracks enabled for visibility in the MIDI editor, inserting MIDI events (whether CCs or notes) remains quite sluggish.


----------



## robgb

tack said:


> I find I'm not entirely sure what the difference is between Track and Arrange view in the mouse modifiers, though.


Track View has the left click/drag mouse options and Arrange view has the right click/drag options. That's the only difference I can see.


----------



## tack

robgb said:


> Track View has the left click/drag mouse options and Arrange view has the right click/drag options. That's the only difference I can see.


Yeah, same here. Looks like a UX wart to me. (I mean, I'm not exactly a Reaper newb, but I was confident enough in what I saw in Arrange view modifiers to conclude that remapping left-drag in the arrange view wasn't possible.)

BTW artmanjam you would want to remap left drag in the MIDI piano roll context as well, and probably also MIDI CC lane, assuming you wanted marquee select to work consistently.


----------



## ProfoundSilence

I cant say I really understand somebody complaining about reaper's usability when they are using a waycom instead of a mouse. If you have an unorthodox workflow that you enjoy that's fine.. if you want to try to make it work, that's fine too... but no reason to disrespect the software because of your odd use-case.


----------



## snattack

robgb said:


> If you have the mixer open, why do you need a single channel strip on the left side at the same time? Not sure how that's a benefit.



Because it’s faster, a more convenient of working with individual channels, still having access to buses, routing and sends on a dual monitor setup. It’s a very common way of working, and a frequent complaint on Reaper in forums.



robgb said:


> Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but there a hundreds of themes you can change it to and many of them are quite nice. To my mind none of the other DAWs win any prizes for beauty either.



I suppose that’s fair, but I still think visuals and design is much more polished in other DAWs, including antialiasing and other stuff that helps a bit. It’s not always an advantage, Logic’s gui is instanely slow. One of the reasons I’m considering switching. Anyway, can’t argue with your point.




robgb said:


> This depends. Every DAW has a steep learning curve if you're a beginner. There's a lot to understand. If you're already experienced with DAWs, Reaper's learning curve is fairly insignificant, but I can see how its abundance of customizable options could be overwhelming. That said, they have an entire video series on their website, created by Kenny Gioia, that will get you up to speed in a matter of hours. Kenny's videos are a goldmine.



Sure. But, I’ve gone from Cubase to Logic one time. And for me at least, it’s a bigger step with Reaper. Partly thanks to what you’re mentioning - excellent potential in customization, but also that I find that the customization is necessary to establish a good workflow. But I’ll check out your tip, thanks.

[[/QUOTE]


robgb said:


> On this we can agree, but you merely need to look at @tack's free Reaticulate utility that can be downloaded via Reapack. It is a brilliant articulation switching utility that I use daily. You can find more information about it here:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Reaticulate | a free articulation management system for REAPER
> 
> 
> Reaticulate | a free articulation management system for REAPER
> 
> 
> 
> 
> reaticulate.com



I’ve investigated and tried this of course. It’s good in some ways. But for me it has a major flaw: the articulations are not tied directly to the note events. I would argue that Logic’s Articulation handling nowdays is superior to any other due to the fact that articulations are tied directly to the note events, and have great customization possibilities through the Scripter plugin.

As long as keyswitches are on a separate lane, I’ll stay in Logic.


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## John Longley

I apologize I didn't have time to read this whole thread, in case these points were made...

- terrible control surface support for anybody seriously relying on one. User developed hacks for eucon were even happening, but if you live on a controller... Avoid beyond a faderport. 

- poor touch screen integration (single point mouse emulation only)

- comping could use some work, although it's mostly fine. You can end up with a mess if you aren't careful. 

- MIDI routing can get weird (using a maschine with midi routing for example) when feedback is enabled.

- engine can act oddly under heavy ASIO strain, though this was apparently addressed in v6 updates.


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## DS_Joost

I have to add something that Reaper is actually really, really good at. CPU.

Last night I had an instance of Pigments send to an H-Reverb (both can destroy DAWs) and it literally destroyed both Reason and Studio One. Crackles, distortion, the lot.

Loading that same combination in Reaper gave me 8% CPU. Same buffer size as the other two. 12% when I maximized the voice count and unison, and put the reverb to 12 seconds.

I was completely surprised, to say the least.


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## Tim_Wells

DS_Joost said:


> I have to add something that Reaper is actually really, really good at. CPU.


I'll tell you another thing Reaper's good at. In Cubase 10/Win 10, I can't get the GUI for Izotope Tonal Balance Control to display. It's a blank-white box.

Shows up great in Reaper on the same PC.

In fairness to Cubase... my PC is getting long in the tooth.


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## artmanjam

robgb said:


> Okay. I just went in and changed Left Drag in the Track view to Marquee select. I changed Right Drag in Arrange View to Time Selection. All works fine. If you want to open up a context menu, you simply have to DOUBLE right click and voila, the menu opens.
> 
> Maybe that's a compromise that will work for you.



Yes I finally got it. The first try was unsuccessful, I had to rool back. The only change now is that right-clicking on item doesn't open the context menu, I can have it done with Ctrl-Right click so that's great yet.
Good thing and what a relief...


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## artmanjam

ProfoundSilence said:


> I cant say I really understand somebody complaining about reaper's usability when they are using a waycom instead of a mouse. If you have an unorthodox workflow that you enjoy that's fine.. if you want to try to make it work, that's fine too... but no reason to disrespect the software because of your odd use-case.


Unorthodox and odd... Enroll the army and do what others do buddy, you'll love that.


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## Rasmus Hartvig

Yeah, why doesn't Cockos accomodate all us DataHand users? Reaper SUXX!


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## pmcrockett

artmanjam said:


> Yes I finally got it. The first try was unsuccessful, I had to rool back. The only change now is that right-clicking on item doesn't open the context menu, I can have it done with Ctrl-Right click so that's great yet.
> Good thing and what a relief...


Another thing that works is instead of setting right drag in arrange to _Select time_, which messes up the right click menus, you can set it to _Marquee select items > Set time selection_, which for some reason doesn't mess up the right click menus (but it does add item selection to time selection, which may or may not be a problem).


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## Fredeke

I LOVE Reaper. I love the light weight, I love the customizability, the reliability, the community, the fair pricing and the absence of obnoxious protection (I can't stress this last point enough: I love the trust between the company and its users). But there's ONE thing I have to admit I find Reaper horrible at: hardware MIDI.

You see, my whole studio consists in hardware synths - mostly vintage, but not exclusively. And it's very unreliable. The worst and most consistent inconstency is when playing a rack synth from a USB master keyboard going through Reaper, I get unbelievable timing bugs: nothing will get through for a few seconds to... a few hours, and then all notes get played at once ! Then it may play normally for a few seconds (or hours), and then start acting up again. Some other times, there's just constant latency. Some days it's just unplayable.

I've checked every other possible cause for the problem because I couldn't believe Reaper was at fault: I tried different MIDI interfaces. I removed all USB hubs from my system. I tried both Mac and Windows. I tried many different synths and keyboards. The only commonality left is Reaper.

I'm still working with Reaper even though this is a super sour thumb, because I love it for everything else, but some days all I do is looking for workarounds or defaulting to advance some other project because Reaper just won't let me play my synths. I play less and mouse-compose more.

I've been doing MIDI since 1990, and I like to think I know MIDI 1.0 pretty well. I've had a couple of home studios in different countries (just to rule out geography as a factor ). I never experienced anything like this.
And I'm still wondering whether I missed something because it's hard to believe Reaper has this one but super obvious flaw.

Does anyone here use Reaper in a hardware MIDI environment? Does anyone else experience this?

(Now that I think of it, I never did a systematic test of different brands of MIDI cables... But anyway I don't have the present issue with my other DAW, Renoise - even though it's less MIDI-oriented, it works better.)


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## Sunny Schramm

Tim_Wells said:


> I'll tell you another thing Reaper's good at. In Cubase 10/Win 10, I can't get the GUI for Izotope Tonal Balance Control to display. It's a blank-white box.
> 
> Shows up great in Reaper on the same PC.
> 
> In fairness to Cubase... my PC is getting long in the tooth.



but thats something izotope has to remedy. happens also with other plugins. NI already shipped out new version which work fine.


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## ProfoundSilence

Fredeke said:


> I LOVE Reaper. I love the light weight, I love the customizability, the reliability, the fair price and the absence of obnoxious protection (I can't stress this last point enough: I love the trust between the company and its users). But there's ONE thing I have to admit Reaper is horrible at: dealing with MIDI hardware.
> 
> You see, my whole studio consists in hardware synths - mostly vintage, but not exclusively. And it's very unreliable. The worst and most consistent inconstency is when playing a rack synth from a USB master keyboard going through Reaper, I get unbelievable timing bugs: nothing will get through for a few seconds to... a few hours, and then all notes get played at once ! Then it may play normally for a few seconds (or hours), and then start acting up again. Some days it's just unplayable.
> 
> I've checked every other possible cause for the problem because I couldn't believe Reaper was at fault: I tried 3 different MIDI interfaces. I removed all USB hubs from my system. I tried both Mac and Windows. I tried many different synths and keyboards. The only commonality left is Reaper.
> 
> I'm still working with Reaper even though this is a super sour thumb, because I love it for everything else, but some days all I do is looking for workarounds or trying to advance some other project because Reaper just won't let me play my synths. I play less and mouse-compose more.
> 
> I've been doing MIDI since the 90s on Atari, and I like to think I know MIDI 1.0 pretty well. I've had a couple of home studios in different countries (just to rule out geography as a factor ).
> And I'm still wondering whether I missed something because it's hard to believe Reaper has this one but super obvious flaw.
> 
> Does anyone here use Reaper in a hardware MIDI environment? Does anyone else experience this?
> 
> (Now that I think of it, I never did a systematic test of different brands of MIDI cables... But anyway I don't have the present issue with my 2nd DAW, Renoise)



I have never in my entire life had an issue with any midi device on any DAW, which leads me to believe something is actually causing an issue within your setup. 

You said you use a lot of old synths, I'm not a hardware person - but are you sure some of the hardware you're using is only trying to transmit actual midi data? Maybe somebody brilliant like @tack can suggest some kind of midi monitor to see that actual messages your hardware is sending, to make sure it's not sending a bunch of glitchy data or something.


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## Fredeke

ProfoundSilence said:


> I have never in my entire life had an issue with any midi device on any DAW, which leads me to believe something is actually causing an issue within your setup.
> 
> You said you use a lot of old synths, I'm not a hardware person - but are you sure some of the hardware you're using is only trying to transmit actual midi data? Maybe somebody brilliant like @tack can suggest some kind of midi monitor to see that actual messages your hardware is sending, to make sure it's not sending a bunch of glitchy data or something.


I've had the same problem with too many different synths for this to be the case, and hardware MIDI used to be a pretty reliable protocol (because it's rather basic), usually correctly implemented. Yes I've been monitoring the hell out of MIDI communications. But I'll keep looking...


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## ProfoundSilence

Fredeke said:


> I've had the same problem with too many different synths for this to be the case, and hardware MIDI used to be a pretty reliable protocol (because it's rather basic). Yes I've been monitoring the hell out of MIDI communications. But I'll keep looking...


what midi monitoring software were you using?


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## Per Boysen

I've been away from Reaper for a decade and now I'm in the process to set it up as my main DAW. Here's a question: Can I export my Reaper preferences (including actions, tweaks etc) from my studio PC to a laptop? 

(I remember back in Logic you were fried if you forgot to "Export Key Commands", so I kept several backups of that crucial file  )

With the time-consuming Reaper set-up procedure, I hope I won't have to lose those hours again for the laptop. 

Before my current Reaper return I used Cubase for a year, before that Bitwig for two years and Logic from version 2.0 to X. Before Logic was the monochrome Atari era when I used Steinberg Pro-24, Cubeat (later to be Cubase).


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## Fredeke

ProfoundSilence said:


> what midi monitoring software were you using?


Renoise's verbose MIDI monitor. Bome's little message (pseudo-) LED. My MIDI interfaces' displays (usually LEDs). I've been routing signals externally (one hardware out into another hardware in) and internally (some virtual MIDI driver - i've tried a couple)



Per Boysen said:


> I've been away from Reaper for a decade and now I'm in the process to set it up as my main DAW. Here's a question: Can I export my Reaper preferences (including actions, tweaks etc) from my studio PC to a laptop?


Yes, and it's super easy.

(Just don't ask me how. I only did it once. I just remember that it worked at the first attempt and took less than a minute.)


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## ProfoundSilence

Fredeke said:


> Renoise's verbose MIDI monitor. Bome's little message (pseudo-) LED. My MIDI interfaces' displays (usually LEDs). I've been routing signals externally (one hardware out into another hardware in) and internally (some virtual MIDI driver - i've tried a couple)
> 
> 
> Yes, and it's super easy.
> 
> (Just don't ask me how. I only did it once. I just remember that it worked at the first attempt and took less than a minute.)


maybe I clicked the wrong link, but that looks like it's a lot more than a midi monitor, can you link me the proper software?


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## vitocorleone123

I'm pretty savvy. Pretty smart. A professional UX guy. I spent 5 min with Reaper and couldn't accomplish anything, like getting a single soft synth going, because I found it so unintuitive. Hated it and will never use it. More power to those that do, though, as it sounds very technically efficient. It just wasn't for me.


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## Fredeke

ProfoundSilence said:


> maybe I clicked the wrong link, but that looks like it's a lot more than a midi monitor, can you link me the proper software?


Yes, the MIDI monitor is just a secondary feature, but it's quite extensive. Renoise fancies itself a full-fledged DAW (though that's a bit overstated, imho), based on a tracker view instead of a virtual tape. Anyway, it displays every incoming byte, along with MIDI messages in English. The free demo should be functional enough.
Now I'd welcome your suggestion for a dedicated MIDI monitor for Windows. A quick Google search returned MIDI-OX... How about it?
(PS: MIDI monitoring is a pain under Windows, because two apps can't access the same device at the same time. So you need to loop your signal through either a virtual interface or a cable connecting a pair of hardware sockets - which can potentially create its own problems in addition to the one you're trying to diagnose !)
Anyway, I've been monitoring the signal both before and after Reaper, and the problem seems to come from within Reaper.
I'm still ready to accept I'm doing something wrong, but I really wonder what. MIDI ain't that complicated.


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## Ivan M.

Per Boysen said:


> Can I export my Reaper preferences



Yes, you can export everything custom, and choose what to export, preferences->general. Just remember to install extensions before importing the config in the new installation. (For example, if an action from an extension is missing, an imported key mapping will fallback to a default one)


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## ProfoundSilence

I wouldn't use something with so many moving parts as a source to diagnose the problem, I thought maybe they had a slim down piece(verbose sounds like a good name for a midi monitor)

based on what i was reading, are you using software to correct delays with midi out instead of just correcting in reaper? is that were you're having issues maybe?


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## Fredeke

ProfoundSilence said:


> based on what i was reading, are you using software to correct delays with midi out instead of just correcting in reaper? is that were you're having issues maybe?


I'm really not doing anything special. I could correct the timing in Reaper's MIDI editor afterwards - at least those days when the delay is constant, except I don't record in the first place, because I can't play with a delay.

Today I've been recording my playing and everything was fine. Sometimes it does that too 
Now that I think of it, it hasn't happened since I upgraded to Reaper 6. But it hasn't been long enough to be sure it solved the problem.


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## ProfoundSilence

Fredeke said:


> I'm really not doing anything special. I could correct the timing in Reaper's MIDI editor afterwards - at least those days when the delay is constant, except I don't record in the first place, because I can't play with a delay.
> 
> Today I've been recording my playing and everything was fine. Sometimes it does that too
> Now that I think of it, it hasn't happened since I upgraded to Reaper 6. But it hasn't been long enough to be sure it solved the problem.


you can set delays on tracks(even negative ones) in reaper... maybe using fancy software to calculate the compensation needed and then manually adding that into reaper instead of adding midi software in between might give you some more stability overall? then you could just save track templates for your various synths


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## MartinH.

Per Boysen said:


> I've been away from Reaper for a decade and now I'm in the process to set it up as my main DAW. Here's a question: Can I export my Reaper preferences (including actions, tweaks etc) from my studio PC to a laptop?
> 
> (I remember back in Logic you were fried if you forgot to "Export Key Commands", so I kept several backups of that crucial file  )
> 
> With the time-consuming Reaper set-up procedure, I hope I won't have to lose those hours again for the laptop.
> 
> Before my current Reaper return I used Cubase for a year, before that Bitwig for two years and Logic from version 2.0 to X. Before Logic was the monochrome Atari era when I used Steinberg Pro-24, Cubeat (later to be Cubase).



I recommend installing reaper in "portable" mode. That way you can just copy the reaper folder to your laptop and everything is like you're used to. It also helps when trying out different update versions - just duplicate your folder, install the update there and if it isn't to your liking, just delete the folder and keep using your old stable version. It's one of the coolest features of reaper that you are able to move it around this freely and that is only possible because they chose trusting their users over implementing restrictive DRM mechanisms. 

But of course you can also export all kinds of settings and import them again, if you prefer it that way.


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## Per Boysen

MartinH. said:


> I recommend installing reaper in "portable" mode.



That is really a great feature! Unfortunately, my studio desktop machine doesn't run a portable install. I'll read up on portable and maybe reinstall that way when a time window comes around.


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## MartinH.

Per Boysen said:


> That is really a great feature! Unfortunately, my studio desktop machine doesn't run a portable install. I'll read up on portable and maybe reinstall that way when a time window comes around.



Ah, I see. Then you should try this button:





A menu will open that allows you to select what specifically you want to export. You can then import that with either a portable or a regular version. 

Also this thread about how to make a regular version portable may help you:





From "regular" Reaper install to portable install ? - Cockos Incorporated Forums


From "regular" Reaper install to portable install ? REAPER for macOS



forum.cockos.com





It's a little outdated but I doubt it has changed.


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## Per Boysen

MartinH. said:


> Ah, I see. Then you should try this button:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> A menu will open that allows you to select what specifically you want to export. You can then import that with either a portable or a regular version.
> 
> Also this thread about how to make a regular version portable may help you:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From "regular" Reaper install to portable install ? - Cockos Incorporated Forums
> 
> 
> From "regular" Reaper install to portable install ? REAPER for macOS
> 
> 
> 
> forum.cockos.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's a little outdated but I doubt it has changed.


Great idea, thanks for telling! THen I can install as portable on the lappy and import the desktop exported config.


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## Fredeke

Another thing that would be nice is Undo/Redo while playing, without audible glitch.


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## vicontrolu

Oh yeah. Coming from Cubase that glitch made the program seem very poor, not in the same league as other MIDI Daws. 

I am surprised they haven't fixed it yet so I am afraid this is one of those really hard things to change for the devs.


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## Fredeke

vicontrolu said:


> Oh yeah. Coming from Cubase that glitch made the program seem very poor, not in the same league as other MIDI Daws.
> 
> I am surprised they haven't fixed it yet so I am afraid this is one of those really hard things to change for the devs.


Yes, it's surprising for a tool of Reaper's otherwise quality, and a mild yet constant pain in the lower back.

(Frankly: while disabling the function during playback would be even more bothersome, it would also be cleaner. You know, the way PT stops at the slightless glitch: less practical, but cleaner. (i don't have a point here, just flapping my mouth ))


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## szczaw

Last time I checked, Reaper's Lua scripting API documentation was very sparse.


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## Fredeke

Another thing I find Reaper bad at, is displaying a grid in the MIDI editor that is actually a visual aid at all zoom levels.

How difficult is it to display only lines for every ((multiple of a power of 2) + 1)'th grid division?
They managed it fine in the virtual tape view...

The outlook of the MIDI grid changes radically every time I change zoom level, and at some, it is just unusable: just 5 minutes ago, I had to endure a grid that showed every 4 beats - so, every bar, would you think? Oh no! Because there was an offset of 2 beats ( = half a bar), so the lines fell in the middle of bars instead of between them -- but it gets worse because, meanwhile, the header was displaying the bar number for every *three* bar !!! One mess didn't even line up with the other! How usable is that? And then, zoom in or out just a tad, and you get a completely different mess!!! (Just in case I didn't drive my point with enough exclamation marks, here are some more: !!!!!!!!!!!!!!) Or maybe is it because I had the audacity of setting my project in 4/4 with no tempo or signature change whatsoever from start to end?

Anyone telling me I just need to adjust the division in the GRID combo box every time I zoom in or out has probably not used a computer since mouses exist.

I've had this problem with versions 5 and 6, on both PC and Mac. -What the bleep???


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## pisskeule

John Longley said:


> I apologize I didn't have time to read this whole thread, in case these points were made...
> 
> - terrible control surface support for anybody seriously relying on one. User developed hacks for eucon were even happening, but if you live on a controller... Avoid beyond a faderport.
> 
> - poor touch screen integration (single point mouse emulation only)
> 
> - comping could use some work, although it's mostly fine. You can end up with a mess if you aren't careful.
> 
> - MIDI routing can get weird (using a maschine with midi routing for example) when feedback is enabled.
> 
> - engine can act oddly under heavy ASIO strain, though this was apparently addressed in v6 updates.



Thank fuck my mate is currently building the uber controller for it. He's literally been studying EVERY manual for ANY controller from the early 90s to the present day. Stay tuned.


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## fakemaxwell

lucor said:


> And no, it has nothing to do with me, the midi editor performance just plain sucks on higher resolutions.




Try toggling "disable media buffering for tracks with open MIDI editors." Solved a similar issue for me, I have it on a toggle button for different use cases.


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