# I am an utter fool.



## Karl Feuerstake (Nov 8, 2020)

I've been thinking deeply lately, and more recently ended up thinking it was my duty to help others, even those who were not asking for it. This breeds all sorts of trouble. I am thinking now it may be better just to help those who ask for it, and help them sincerely towards the way they request.

As someone who wants to help film composers, directors and other people involved in the media industry realize their visions with the skills I may have, especially striving for a very high level of professionalism, how can I place myself somewhere where I can hear and answer more of the appropriate calls for help which I could tackle? Or is there a deeper challenge that you may see me facing? Thanks for any help.


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## el-bo (Nov 8, 2020)

Karl Feuerstake said:


> I've been thinking deeply lately, and more recently ended up thinking it was my duty to help others, even those who were not asking for it. This breeds all sorts of trouble. I am thinking now it may be better just to help those who ask for it, and help them sincerely towards the way they request.
> 
> As someone who wants to help film composers, directors and other people involved in the media industry realize their visions with the skills I may have, especially striving for a very high level of professionalism, how can I place myself somewhere where I can hear and answer more of the appropriate calls for help which I could tackle? Or is there a deeper challenge that you may see me facing? Thanks for any help.






Karl Feuerstake said:


> *"I am an utter fool."*




Perhaps it'd be best to not put that on your business-card 

Seriously, though: Why not just start an "Ask Me..." thread on one of the forums, on VI-C? 

Here, perhaps:






Composition, Orchestration & Technique


Discussions on composing and scoring music. Tips and suggestions on how to improve your orchestral mockups and midi techniques. Feel free to post unfinished or experimental works and get feedback.




vi-control.net





Or here:






Newbie Questions


New to this virtual instruments game? Not even sure what "virtual instruments" means? Here's your place to ask questions.




vi-control.net


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## Crowe (Nov 8, 2020)

Basically you want to be a teacher then, I think.

Maybe a consultant.

But yeah. Only helping those who ask for help is definitely the first step to maintaining your sanity.


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## Karl Feuerstake (Nov 8, 2020)

el-bo said:


> Perhaps it'd be best to not put that on your business-card
> 
> Seriously, though: Why not just start an "Ask Me..." thread on one of the forums, on VI-C?
> 
> ...



Well, as I said, I am an utter fool! Thank you for the reply.

I've observed that these other sections appear to be about the basics of learning to create music; I feel more confident in that aspect. I'm interested now in helping people with the skills that I think I may have. I guess I mean to say I'm an utter fool regarding the business, or the industry!



Shiirai said:


> Basically you want to be a teacher then, I think.
> 
> Maybe a consultant.
> 
> But yeah. Only helping those who ask for help is definitely the first step to maintaining your sanity.



Hmm, I don't know. Isn't everyone something of a teacher if they follow that model? I'm looking to help people realize their artistic visions.


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## Crowe (Nov 8, 2020)

I don't think so. Teaching requires a pretty specific mindset. On the other hand, maybe 'teacher' was wrong in this case. Maybe 'coach' would fit better.


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## Karl Feuerstake (Nov 8, 2020)

Shiirai said:


> I don't think so. Teaching requires a pretty specific mindset. On the other hand, maybe 'teacher' was wrong in this case. Maybe 'coach' would fit better.



Hmm, I don't know. At some point, I would like to write some music for film directors and other media creators as a service, and to turn this into a sustainable profession by some kind of means. That may be decades away. But I have heard from others that to get there, it helps to assist bigger composers out. So I think - but don't know - that I'm looking to serve any person in that kind of way that would fulfill me as well. What are your thoughts on this?

Coaching, or teaching, seems similar to this if it is done from a perspective of "here is something that I discovered or read which works for a lot of people, and if you would like to know how to do it, I would like to serve you with that knowledge as well." Essentially all jobs really help people grow, I guess. Naturally, I would think this would be a part of any person's life, then, so long as they don't turn away people who ask for it. So it could be involved, too.

Edit: I think I may be refining my problem more. I guess, I don't know how to knock or where to go to make an offer saying "I would like to help you, if you would be interested in my help." And while there are certain people who I would like to help with whatever skills I may have (maybe a better fool would say I don't have any?), I don't know where the doors are.


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## Crowe (Nov 8, 2020)

Well. Considering you don't seem interested in the jobs that let you do that, I really don't know what to tell you other than "wherever people go to ask for help".


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## el-bo (Nov 8, 2020)

Karl Feuerstake said:


> I've observed that these other sections appear to be about the basics of learning to create music; I feel more confident in that aspect. I'm interested now in helping people with the skills that I think I may have. I guess I mean to say I'm an utter fool regarding the business, or the industry!



I was more responding to the following sentiment:



Karl Feuerstake said:


> I am thinking now it may be better just to help those who ask for it, and help them sincerely towards the way they request.



But given subsequent replies, I can see you aren't yet quite sure what you want to offer, how you wish to offer it and for whom you wish it to be offered. All the best in your journey


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## d.healey (Nov 8, 2020)

Karl Feuerstake said:


> skills that I think I may have.


That won't inspire confidence in your prospective students.



> "here is something that I discovered or read which works for a lot of people


Make some video tutorials, see if you have a market, if so make a video course.


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## Crowe (Nov 8, 2020)

d.healey said:


> Make some video tutorials, see if you have a market, if so make a video course.



...But that would make them a teacher.


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## dcoscina (Nov 8, 2020)

Karl Feuerstake said:


> I've been thinking deeply lately, and more recently ended up thinking it was my duty to help others, even those who were not asking for it. This breeds all sorts of trouble. I am thinking now it may be better just to help those who ask for it, and help them sincerely towards the way they request.
> 
> As someone who wants to help film composers, directors and other people involved in the media industry realize their visions with the skills I may have, especially striving for a very high level of professionalism, how can I place myself somewhere where I can hear and answer more of the appropriate calls for help which I could tackle? Or is there a deeper challenge that you may see me facing? Thanks for any help.


so I have to ask, what do you bring to the table? What is your background? What kind of help are you wanting to provide?


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## Karl Feuerstake (Nov 8, 2020)

dcoscina said:


> so I have to ask, what do you bring to the table? What is your background? What kind of help are you wanting to provide?



Thank you for asking! This might be a bit wordy so forgive me for indulging.

I believe I have some sense in terms of writing music to someone else's media. Generally the reactions from others for the projects I have done were very positive, but I've also tried to listen to the negative feedback more and more, making concessions to improve myself or my music in the way being communicated to me, in pursuit of a better audience experience.

If I were to humble myself, I'd probably be better off saying something like Shiirai's profile discription - "I am utterly certain I've no idea what I'm doing" - but I guess I'm a liar, I feel like I do know a _few_ things, maybe that's only human and lately I've been a bit out of balance. I have the desire to help improve the lives of others through entertaining them with media music.

Some of the above replies have told me to be certain, that I would logically want to communicate this to instill confidence. I am a bit lost in the woods on that subject and this is where I think people are seeing this conflict within me - the desire to be humble versus the desire to want something in life. Do I want it enough? Yes.. so then I can only hope it won't destroy me. I could live with rationalizing it as "I want to serve a greater composer or director to help them entertain other people, until if ever I become worthy enough to participate more in that creation myself."

My background is in writing some music for video games and short films and I believe I've attentively listened to those genres for a good deal of my life. For fun I almost exclusively turn on movie soundtracks these days, though I have had a bit of exposure to classical orchestral music, and grew up with a bit of pop and jazz.

I believe that all people have an ear for interpreting what kind of music works in a scene to convey certain emotions or ideas, and on top of this, that I have the skills to be able to craft that myself - and wherever I may draw a blank, that I would still have a good baseline to work with in terms of how to experiment and/or research filling it in.

The help I would like to provide would be anything that some higher authority, able to help me in bettering myself, may need (short of the absurd.) I could only hope this would be things related to any point in the process of scoring music for media.

I don't know if I will ever achieve such a dream, but that's essentially what I would like.
I think I've prepared myself reasonably well skill-wise and am confident I could quickly pick up anything that I'd be lacking in - so now I feel ready to give back and contribute as a team player. I _do_ have a bit of paint on my canvas, but I am willing to paint over it with someone else's guidance (again, short of the absurd.)

So my question is - where could I go knocking (electronically or otherwise) to say "hey, this is who I happen to be, is there something I could help with?"


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## d.healey (Nov 8, 2020)

So you want to be a media composer's assistant and work your way up to being a media composer?


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## Karl Feuerstake (Nov 8, 2020)

d.healey said:


> So you want to be a media composer's assistant and work your way up to being a media composer?



Yes.


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## Jay Panikkar (Nov 8, 2020)

Put out video tutorials. Put out your portfolio. You'll use these to pitch your services while also potentially reaching out to a wide audience along the way.

Educational videos have higher than average CPM on YouTube. It's decent earnings, if you can keep the content flowing. You can rotate the earnings back into your productions to grow your channel, or expand to other platforms.


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## Cathbad (Nov 8, 2020)

Karl Feuerstake said:


> Yes.



There's a guy on YouTube who, when not sampling flautandos with 19 mic positions, talks about routes into and through the profession. It's somewhat useful advice and well-meant, but not necessarily applicable to everyone. Much of it is about the gopher -> composer's assistant -> additional composer -> composer career path.

When asked about their entry into the business, lots of composers speak of a lucky break: hitting it off with some guy at a party who just happens to be looking for someone who makes the kind of music the composer just happens to write. I suppose this is why people move to LA, to attend these parties (or did I just read that in a Raymond Chandler story?). Many were also personal friends since student days with directors who went on to be successful. Not really something you can organise at will, especially after the fact.

In years gone by, composers would pay their dues in a variety of musical roles until the skill acquired along the way allowed them to rise to meet career-making challenges. John Williams, Alan Menken and Jerry Goldsmith come to mind. Hans Zimmer, too.


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## synergy543 (Nov 8, 2020)

Karl Feuerstake said:


> So my question is - where could I go knocking (electronically or otherwise) to say "hey, this is who I happen to be, is there something I could help with?"


Why not look to someone whom you respect and ask them something that may be of interest to them as well? I have met many interesting composers this way. IOW, instead of approaching as an assistant or teacher, bring some gems to the table that might be of interest to you both which you can have a discussion and build a friendship over.


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## Karl Feuerstake (Nov 8, 2020)

synergy543 said:


> Why not look to someone whom you respect and ask them something that may be of interest to them as well? I have met many interesting composers this way. IOW, instead of approaching as an assistant or teacher, bring some gems to the table that might be of interest to you both which you can have a discussion and build a friendship over.



That sounds like a good idea


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## MartinH. (Nov 8, 2020)

Karl Feuerstake said:


> So my question is - where could I go knocking (electronically or otherwise) to say "hey, this is who I happen to be, is there something I could help with?"



I've seen a hand full of people do that on other forums, and I always thought "get the fuck outa here with your stealth marketing". Those people never stuck around for long either. 

You can look on reddit and other places if you see people actively looking for help. 

But really I think the best way is to connect with people first and then look for the opportunities, instead of the other way around.


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## asherpope (Nov 8, 2020)

MartinH. said:


> I've seen a hand full of people do that on other forums, and I always thought "get the fuck outa here with your stealth marketing". Those people never stuck around for long either.


Alternatively the replies consist of comments like "Bro do me sum sick beats for free"


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## Karl Feuerstake (Nov 8, 2020)

MartinH. said:


> I've seen a hand full of people do that on other forums, and I always thought "get the fuck outa here with your stealth marketing". Those people never stuck around for long either.
> 
> You can look on reddit and other places if you see people actively looking for help.
> 
> But really I think the best way is to connect with people first and then look for the opportunities, instead of the other way around.



I guess you can't make everyone happy when you exercise your will to ask for help and offer it too; I can understand that.

Thanks for the advice. My challenge now may be how to better connect with the people I might prospect as wanting to help.


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## MartinH. (Nov 9, 2020)

asherpope said:


> Alternatively the replies consist of comments like "Bro do me sum sick beats for free"



If you offer help as a composer, that's probably among the most common replies. :-/




Karl Feuerstake said:


> I guess you can't make everyone happy when you exercise your will to ask for help and offer it too; I can understand that.
> 
> Thanks for the advice. My challenge now may be how to better connect with the people I might prospect as wanting to help.



I've gotten a couple collaboration offers just by being engaged in the gamedev community and occasionally demonstrating some of my skills in some way. I turned them all down because I don't believe in that kind of collaboration. I think "hiring freelancers", is the sane way for professionals to collaborate on such high-risk projects as games. If you're offering anything for free, without being very clear about what _you _are getting out of it, you seem suspect, because usually no one gives out quality work for free. You could try offering mentorships for an affordable price (maybe with a satisfied of money back guarantuee if you or others are too unsure about the value of your service) and guide fledgeling composers on their way up. Or you could try to offer "music-consulting" as a way to get a foot in the door for more composing work. If someone is paying, you can be 100% certain they want your help, and they don't have to question your motives for offering help in the first place. You could start with low commitment offers like a single track review and skype/zoom session to get to know each other, and apply all those standard marketing funnel techniques to get people lined up for a full 8-week mentorship course. 

In the world of illustrators it's not too uncommon for people to turn mentoring and teaching into a proper business. These two come to my mind: 



About







FAQS — WELCOME TO YOUR PRIVATE ART MENTORSHIP







www.lucidpixul.com





Of course they are very present on youtube to build the reach for getting enough students to make that business work.


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## Saxer (Nov 9, 2020)

I also think YT tutorials are a good way to go. Little snippets of wisdom you were happy someone would have told you one or two a decades ago.


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