# 2C Audio B2 or Perfect Storm 3.0



## Phillip996 (Jun 20, 2018)

2C audio has a sale, and thinking of getting their reverb. Any point having B2, Aether and Breeze 2.0 or will just the B2 be more than enough?


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 20, 2018)

haven't tried B2.

but i am a HUGE Aether and Breeze 2 fanboy.

the only reverbs i use besides MIRx.


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## HeliaVox (Jun 21, 2018)

B2 is quite possibly the best software reverb I have ever heard.


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## whinecellar (Jun 21, 2018)

HeliaVox said:


> B2 is quite possibly the best software reverb I have ever heard.



I second this. I have just about every software verb on the market. I like a lot of them, and I might even love a small handful. B2 is one of those. It just drops my jaw. It is a stunning and inspiring sound design tool.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 21, 2018)

whinecellar said:


> I second this. I have just about every software verb on the market. I like a lot of them, and I might even love a small handful. B2 is one of those. It just drops my jaw. It is a stunning and inspiring sound design tool.



How would you compare B2 to Aether? if you've tried Aether.

-

update, just checking out B2 - quite the powerhouse.

i'm surprised 2CAudio isn't talked about more in these parts.


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## TGV (Jun 22, 2018)

I have B2, but I find it difficult to use. I browse the presets (I've got some extra packs), but it's hard to make them a smaller or drier by more than a tiny bit. I find e.g. Reverberate, a different beast, easier to manipulate. Perhaps it's the graphics or the implicitness in B2's signal chain. It does sound freaking good, though, when you find what you're looking for. Perhaps even too good.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 22, 2018)

TGV said:


> I have B2, but I find it difficult to use. I browse the presets (I've got some extra packs), but it's hard to make them a smaller or drier by more than a tiny bit. I find e.g. Reverberate, a different beast, easier to manipulate. Perhaps it's the graphics or the implicitness in B2's signal chain. It does sound freaking good, though, when you find what you're looking for. Perhaps even too good.



that's why i like Breeze 2 so much.

simple and "pristine".


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## whinecellar (Jun 22, 2018)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> How would you compare B2 to Aether? if you've tried Aether.



Their website did a great job of describing & differentiating them last I was there... Aether is more of a sound designer’s tool I think. At least that’s how it was originally marketed. So is B2 in a lot of ways with its dual engine. But in terms of immediate gorgeousness, B2 just mops the floor for me. I love all their products - I still use Breeze quite a bit, and they claim the new version of that might be their best yet!


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 22, 2018)

whinecellar said:


> Their website did a great job of describing & differentiating them last I was there... Aether is more of a sound designer’s tool I think. At least that’s how it was originally marketed. So is B2 in a lot of ways with its dual engine. But in terms of immediate gorgeousness, B2 just mops the floor for me. I love all their products - I still use Breeze quite a bit, and they claim the new version of that might be their best yet!



i may spring for B2 shortly.

thanks for the response.


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## Phillip996 (Jun 22, 2018)

I ended up buying all of them. I love B2 so far, such a great sounding reverb. I don't think I'll need another algorithmic reverb for a long while.


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## Andrew Souter (Jun 22, 2018)

Yes, B2 has only one real weakness: CPU usage. It takes an extreme approach to get an extreme result. CPU usage can go way up with some presets. Not all of them, but the temptation of course is to explore the most extreme things it offers. However, I also don't know anything else that sounds better and I have checked everything I could, and tried to be objective in my analysis. (except now Breeze 2 in SOME usage cases -- but it can't reach everything that B2 does, and/but also covers other territory -- they are very complimentary) Of course given the obvious bias, statements like this from me are usually disregarded, so I try not to make them despite my own personal enthusiasm for the products.

But your compliments have tempted me to concur, so, ya, I do also think we did something rather magical with B2. And Breeze 2.  Sometimes you just get lucky (after tens of thousands of hours.  )

My current personal fav is Breeze 2 for small to medium size stuff and even "normal use" hall things, and B2 for the huge uber magical stuff. I think many Breeze 2 instances direct on tracks or groups, and a couple B2's on sends is about as close to heaven as we'll get.

anyway, we have other things up our sleeves as well.

there will be a free minor update to Breeze 2 next month or so with a couple new extras.

it's not a bad time to be discovering these btw: 

https://2caudio.com/promo/2018bigsplash/

If you have Breeze 1 (or Aether or B2) you really, really, should have Breeze 2. It's offered at a crazy upgrade/crossgrade deal at the moment as explained in the link...


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## Andrew Souter (Jun 22, 2018)

TGV said:


> I have B2, but I find it difficult to use. I browse the presets (I've got some extra packs), but it's hard to make them a smaller or drier by more than a tiny bit. I find e.g. Reverberate, a different beast, easier to manipulate. Perhaps it's the graphics or the implicitness in B2's signal chain. It does sound freaking good, though, when you find what you're looking for. Perhaps even too good.





Zoot_Rollo said:


> that's why i like Breeze 2 so much.
> simple and "pristine".



Yes this is the differentiation between them, and it will grow even more so as we evolve them more. B2 is a complex beast where maximum flexibility is the goal and we want to offer everything and anything that might be interesting to throw into the equation to create some kind of new novel space with little concern about physical reality. AFAIK B2 was the first to offer wave-shaping/distortion in an algo verb for example, and it turns out to be quite cool for electronic music and action/sci-fi/game scoring work etc.

In B2 we keep parameters a little "closer to metal" as they say in coding language, or "closer to math" perhaps better. Parameters are defined in more raw terms. It makes it feel unusual at first exposure bc usually most people are not DSP experts or reverb designers. B2 parameter space is therefore for explorers and adventurous sound designers in some ways. We'll add more stuff like this to it over time. We don't intend to ever dumb it down. B2 might have 100 different filter options for example, which could be complete overkill for the average user, but might be heaven for sound-desginers. B2 is where I personally get to have the most fun exposing my most weird and wild ideas about spatial processing.

But we also have a great peer groups of very talented sound designers and such designers of course make presets in the factory bank and the expansions, so its absolutely not necessary to have a phd or whatever to use it. Tweaking simple things like size/time/mix etc on these existing presets is of course easy. Keeping the entire parameter space of B2 in mind and mastering all the different ways it can be configured is not so easy. But that makes it fun to explore.

Breeze 2 is the opposite. It must be simple. Simple. Light. Pristine. That is it's identity. But it's a big mistake to underestimate it. It does indeed sound really, really good, and does so while maintaining incredible efficiency.

A fairly accurate summary might be you should use Breeze 2 when you want the reverb to effectively disappear keeping focus on the music, and you should use B2 when you want the reverb to basically be a 5th band member where it might make a very large contribution to sound and may even help guide the composition and stylistic direction of the piece.

These are really the design goals for both. Of course over the years people have managed to do the exact opposite as well, and B2 is used for subtlety quite effectively as well, and Breeze 2 definitely has some creative uses as well as Simon in particular explored in his Glacier Breeze expansion.

Ultimately, it's art, and there is no one "right way". Use any technique that works.


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## whinecellar (Jun 22, 2018)

Andrew Souter said:


> ...A fairly accurate summary might be you should use Breeze 2 when you want the reverb to effectively disappear keeping focus on the music, and you should use B2 when you want the reverb to basically be a 5th band member where it might make a very large contribution to sound and may even help guide the composition and stylistic direction of the piece...



Couldn’t have said it better. B2 is what I reach for when I want it to make a primary or fundamental contribution to whatever soundscape I’m trying to create. It can certainly do “real” spaces stunningly well too, and either way, it’s just so dang high resolution and ridiculously beautiful!


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 22, 2018)

i still have a soft spot for Aether.

it was my first "serious" software reverb after going completely ITB a few years ago.


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## HeliaVox (Jun 22, 2018)

Well, you talked me into it. I got Breeze 2. I'm thinking with Breeze 2 and B2, I may have all the reverbs I'll ever need.


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## TGV (Jun 23, 2018)

Andrew talked me into buying Breeze 2 as well. I had already demoed it, it sounded good, but I still had some qualms. The fact that he says it's more intuitive did the trick. The extra discount I got as an B2 owner allowed me to get a whole bunch of presets for free, which is really nice.


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## MarcelM (Jun 23, 2018)

i bought breeze 2 aswell with the discount, and its really a steal for the money. i like it alot!

one question though. the web pages now says i have 4 downloads left? i can only download it 5 times at all? what happens if there is a new version out for example etc?


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## aaronventure (Jun 23, 2018)

B2 has the silkiest highs and the sexiest dampening filters for high freqs. They truly shine at 4x oversample, but that's where it has one of the most insane CPU loads I've experienced in a reverb.

Luckily, it has the option to have a global 1x in Realtime, and 4x for Offline, so you can monitor and mix with 1x (do try and check how 4x sounds), and then it will switch to 4x for Offline Rendering. Wonderful.


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## Andrew Souter (Jun 23, 2018)

Heroix said:


> i bought breeze 2 aswell with the discount, and its really a steal for the money. i like it alot!



thanks.



Heroix said:


> one question though. the web pages now says i have 4 downloads left? i can only download it 5 times at all? what happens if there is a new version out for example etc?



it's just a default setting of the web store that was retained for "security" reasons. It prevents someone from downloading the file 1000 times, which would probably be "suspicious activity" for example. It's not a hard limit. If you reach it, you simply email us and we can increase it for you.

And whenever there is any kind of new file for a product such as 2.0.0, 2.0.1, 2.0.3 etc each new version gets the full default of 5 anyway. I could easily increase the default from 5 to 10 for example, but usually 5 is enough for 99% of the people.


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## Andrew Souter (Jun 23, 2018)

TGV said:


> Andrew talked me into buying Breeze 2 as well. I had already demoed it, it sounded good, but I still had some qualms.



just for my own info, what kind of qualms?



TGV said:


> The fact that he says it's more intuitive did the trick. The extra discount I got as an B2 owner allowed me to get a whole bunch of presets for free, which is really nice.



thanks,


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## Andrew Souter (Jun 23, 2018)

aaronventure said:


> B2 has the silkiest highs and the sexiest dampening filters for high freqs. They truly shine at 4x oversample, but that's where it has one of the most insane CPU loads I've experienced in a reverb.
> 
> Luckily, it has the option to have a global 1x in Realtime, and 4x for Offline, so you can monitor and mix with 1x (do try and check how 4x sounds), and then it will switch to 4x for Offline Rendering. Wonderful.



yes, 4x OS is literally processing 4x the number of samples, so it is literally 4x the amount of work PLUS the work to do the oversampling (sample rate conversion) process at extreme quality (two long filters, zero stuffing, decimation etc). Worse, it ends up using a ton of memory/cache which is really the main limit to performance.

But it does indeed sound sublime.

Filters most certainly gain some benefit from oversampling. Moving from 1x to 2x gets you 90% of the benefit, and moving from 2x to 4x gets only the last 10% or so. 2x is a reasonable compromise. If your host rate is 44.1, and you switch between 1x and 2x you can notice the curve changes some. This is accurate do to the way digital filters work (BLT wraps analog freq response from 0 to inf, to digital freq response of 0 to Pi (half sample rate), so digital hiCut/loPass filters always have exactly 0.0 magnitude at half sample rate even if you have a high cut (low pass) filter set to 20,000hz. the analog version would be quite different. Oversampling helps this a lot as well as other things.)

Note if you are already running at a host rate of 96K, you might not need 2x, and you certainly don't need 4x. And personally IMHO you should NEVER run your host higher than 96k. 192 etc host sample rates and audio files is complete marketing stuff. Some dsp processes certainly benefit from 192 and even much higher, but running the whole host that way and keeping things on disk at such rates is crazy. Oversample only what is needed and if the base SR is 96k, this is already enough wiggle room to maintain perfection even with extreme dsp happening.

btw, regarding "sexiest dampening filters" do you have any particular favorites in terms of the filter options in B2. I've been making some more in the past week actually...


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## aaronventure (Jun 23, 2018)

Andrew Souter said:


> yes, 4x OS is literally processing 4x the number of samples, so it is literally 4x the amount of work PLUS the work to do the oversampling (sample rate conversion) process at extreme quality (two long filters, zero stuffing, decimation etc). Worse, it ends up using a ton of memory/cache which is really the main limit to performance.
> 
> But it does indeed sound sublime.
> 
> ...



I run at 48k. I'll only go to 96k if I'm specifically asked. True, 2x at 96k is the most anyone would ever need. But that's why there's the offline setting which is just great. 

I absolutely love Air II A and Air II B.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 23, 2018)

wow, the expansions are lovely

bought the 4 pack

https://www.designersound.com/breeze-expansions/228-breeze-expansions-pack.html


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 23, 2018)

amazing deal

https://www.designersound.com/breeze/225-breeze-20-pack.html

<checking out the Aether expansions>


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## Michel Simons (Jun 23, 2018)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> amazing deal
> 
> https://www.designersound.com/breeze/225-breeze-20-pack.html
> 
> <checking out the Aether expansions>



I have my eye (and both my ears) on Breeze 2.0 and I would appreciate it if you don't push me over the edge with these kind of posts.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 23, 2018)

michelsimons said:


> I have my eye (and both my ears) on Breeze 2.0 and I would appreciate it if you don't push me over the edge with these kind of posts.




sorry about that...


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## MarcelM (Jun 23, 2018)

so after playing with it almost the whole day i can really only recommend this one.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 23, 2018)

Heroix said:


> so after playing with it almost the whole day i can really only recommend this one.



which one?


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## MarcelM (Jun 23, 2018)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> which one?



breeze 2

i do believe they learned alot the past years 

just play around with the demo for a little time, and you will end up buying it... it happend to me


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## zvenx (Jun 23, 2018)

This thread encouraged me to try it again (Breeze 2, i think I had tried a pre release version).
Whilst I find the GUI superb, it once again reminds me how personal sound is.
I have only had two reverb developers who work I really love... exponential audio and relab.... why? for me, I love a reverb that sounds like it is part of the sound, that it blends in vs just being on top of the sound. Almost like the difference between the sugar used to bake a cake vs, the sugar used for the icing... Alas Breeze 2 hasn't changed that opinion that for me there are only two developers who have the reverb being part of the sound right...

Good luck on the sale.
rsp


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 23, 2018)

zvenx said:


> This thread encouraged me to try it again (Breeze 2, i think I had tried a pre release version).
> Whilst I find the GUI superb, it once again reminds me how personal sound is.
> I have only had two reverb developers who work I really love... exponential audio and relab.... why? for me, I love a reverb that sounds like it is part of the sound, that it blends in vs just being on top of the sound. Almost like the difference between the sugar used to bake a cake vs, the cake used for the icing... Alas Breeze 2 hasn't changed that opinion that for me there are only two developers who have the reverb being part of the sound right...
> 
> ...



with Exponential i would say Phoenix would be the closest match to Breeze 2.

for me, Breeze 2 wins out.

now, R4 is a different beast altogether - possibly closest to B2, not sure - B2 having a "dual engine" seems unique in reverb offerings.

CPU usage may be key between R4 and B2.


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## zvenx (Jun 23, 2018)

I a/b;ed it with R4 actually because Phoenix/Nimbus are invisible.... I figure it would have a better chance vs R4.
I actually use Nimbus much more than R4........ Also I meant software developer in my post two up.
But let me stop talking about EA in the midst of a 2C thread..

rsp


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 23, 2018)

zvenx said:


> I a/b;ed it with R4 actually because Phoenix/Nimbus are invisible.... I figure it would have a better chance vs R4.
> I actually use Nimbus much more than R4........ Also I meant software developer in my post two up.
> But let me stop talking about EA in the midst of a 2C thread..
> 
> rsp



you know what "they" say about being too thin,

or having too many reverbs.


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## Andrew Souter (Jun 23, 2018)

zvenx said:


> I a/b;ed it with R4 actually because Phoenix/Nimbus are invisible.... I figure it would have a better chance vs R4.
> I actually use Nimbus much more than R4........ Also I meant software developer in my post two up.
> But let me stop talking about EA in the midst of a 2C thread..
> 
> rsp



First, EA and Relab and others make cool stuff. No prob to enjoy their efforts of course. It's great to have so many great options these days!

Second, if you are willing, do you have a favorite preset or few from Phoenix, and do you have some example of the type of material you are working with? I'd be curious to explore the topic to see if I can hear what you are hearing. Just for my personal experience/experimentation.

Also, check the Balance/Mix switch feature in Breeze 2. This is a bit of a semi-hidden easter egg. It can definitely glue the source with the tail more and recess the source back into the sound-field if that is the goal. Sometimes this works wonderfully, and sometimes its actually better to have the dry signal sound quite dry and upfront and center.

The kind of perception you mention can be controlled by the amount of pre-delay and the balance between dry, early energy and late/diffuse energy. For example if you put an instrument and a mic 2 meters apart from each other and put them in the center of the Taj Mahal, the tail may be quite extreme in length by normal standards, but there will be a large pre-delay before the onset of the tail, which will make the result sound still fairly close perceptually. If you want the source to sound farther back there needs to be some kind of energy with little to no delay compared to the dry signal. 

In Breeze 1 there is always some degree of natural pre-delay which is dependent on the Size parameter. Physically this means the model is something similar to both the instrument and the virtual mic/listener being close the center of the room. This works great on things such a sample libraries that were already recorded with ERs from the natural room they were recorded in. For very dry libraries some form of early spatialization can be useful. Aether can accomplish this with its ER engine. B2 can accomplish it by using one engine to function as ERs and the other to function as the tail. 

In Breeze 2, the Classic Modes still have this degree of natural pre-delay, to maintain preset compatibility with 1.0. But the Hall, Chamber, Hyper-Plater, and Colored modes can have very little to zero pre-delay which will have the effect of moving the sound perceptually back into the space more.

Additionally the "Balance" mode will apply spatialization to the dry signal if desired to further glue it into the space. This works quite magically with the Chamber modes in particular. But again, it should not be an "always on" scenario. Sometimes we would indeed like the sound to be sitting front and center in front of the diffuse tail. It depends on the needs of the mix.

This is an area I have spent more time on in the past few months as well....


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## zvenx (Jun 23, 2018)

Hi Andrew.
Mostly I use reverb on 1) Voices 2) Acoustic Guitars/ukele 3) some string and percussion libraries in a supportive role just to help glue the stuff together. 4) Drum Libraries like Superior Drummer 3 etc. 5) Sometimes melodica, but by far I use them mostly on vocals. I tend not to like to hear reverb more feel if it it makes sense. Since Nimbus and R4 are out, I only end up 'using' Phoenix and R2 if they are already on older projects and I need to do a quick edit to send to a client. 

Hard to tell you my favourites.... There were as an update from EA that basically killed all the presets you had in your Favourites and I haven't had to rebuild them, but for Nimbus I usually start for Neutral Hall and on R4 Med Hall 2....For voice overs anyway those are the ones I usually start with.
I of course tried to match them in Breeze 2, unsuccessfully....using pre-delays etc.... but in fairness I didnt' touch the Balance/Mix parameters. I always use Reverbs as Sends (old habits die hard  ).....

thanks for responding.
rsp


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## MarcelM (Jun 24, 2018)

is it possible to turn off early reflections actually? ive read the manual a bit but couldnt find out how yet sadly 

probably i just didnt read enough yet.

one last side note... the "depth" in breeze 2 is fantastic 
also the cpu usage is worth a comment. you can really use a different reverb (as insert) for every instrument in your template probably.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 24, 2018)

Heroix said:


> is it possible to turn off early reflections actually? ive read the manual a bit but couldnt find out how yet sadly
> 
> probably i just didnt read enough yet.
> 
> ...




from the manual:

Tip: Since Breeze 2 is ultra efficient on modern CPUs, we actually recommend considering using it as an insert directly on tracks. Breeze 2 also has a special Mix Mode called “Balance” mode, where the “dry signal” will be spatialized as well as the wet signal, and in this mode the numerical mix value will control the balance between this early spatialization and the late energy of the tail. This mode special mode works best when Breeze 2 is used as an insert, and is explained in more detail later in the manua

-

took me some time to get used to using Breeze 2 as an insert rather than a effects send.

bought the expansion packs - yow!


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## MarcelM (Jun 24, 2018)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> from the manual:
> 
> Tip: Since Breeze 2 is ultra efficient on modern CPUs, we actually recommend considering using it as an insert directly on tracks. Breeze 2 also has a special Mix Mode called “Balance” mode, where the “dry signal” will be spatialized as well as the wet signal, and in this mode the numerical mix value will control the balance between this early spatialization and the late energy of the tail. This mode special mode works best when Breeze 2 is used as an insert, and is explained in more detail later in the manua
> 
> ...



yeah i found that one. its simply impressing and i have no clue how they did it, but you can run way more instances than any other reverb plugin i know off.

i just wonder if i also can only add a reverb tail without any ER somehow.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 24, 2018)

Heroix said:


> yeah i found that one. its simply impressing and i have no clue how they did it, but you can run way more instances than any other reverb plugin i know off.
> 
> i just wonder if i also can only add a reverb tail without any ER somehow.



Balance: the special feature setting where a spatialization process is applied to the dry signal in a subtle manner to give it an instantaneous spatial impression and sense of audio source width. The Mix/Balance control then mixes between the instantaneous spatial impression (ambience or AMB for short) and the normal reverb engine (labeled LATE here).


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## MarcelM (Jun 24, 2018)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> Balance: the special feature setting where a spatialization process is applied to the dry signal in a subtle manner to give it an instantaneous spatial impression and sense of audio source width. The Mix/Balance control then mixes between the instantaneous spatial impression (ambience or AMB for short) and the normal reverb engine (labeled LATE here).



hmmm... i guess i quite dont get it. so the balance up to max will just send a tail? i want to disable early reflections completely for some stuff.


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 24, 2018)

Heroix said:


> hmmm... i guess i quite dont get it. so the balance up to max will just send a tail? i want to disable early reflections completely for some stuff.



if you set the BALANCE to LATE, it's all "tail" from what i understand.

On the other end, AMB is all ER.

that's why it is so great as an insert.


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## MarcelM (Jun 24, 2018)

Zoot_Rollo said:


> if you set the BALANCE to LATE, it's all "tail" from what i understand.
> 
> On the other end, AMB is all ER.
> 
> that's why it is so great as an insert.



thx. i will try that tomorrow since iam already on my couch


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## Zoot_Rollo (Jun 24, 2018)

Heroix said:


> thx. i will try that tomorrow since iam already on my couch



right there with ya today.

it took Herculean effort to get off mine to verify the LATE/AMB settings in Breeze 2.


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## Michel Simons (Jun 24, 2018)

I succumbed…

I played around with the demo version of Breeze 2.0 and the new Embertone piano and it was a real joy. I also like that you can use it as a special fx in stead of just as a "normal" reverb. I went for the whole package with all the expansions.


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## Andrew Souter (Jun 25, 2018)

regarding "turning off ERs" here is something I wrote previously on that topic:



> Regarding ER/LR balance in Breeze: there is not technically any way to
> completely remove the ER's from Breeze as there is with Aether. However,
> there are ways to minimize the perception of the ERs so much that there
> electively becomes no ERs and the tail simply starts at full density.
> ...


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## MarcelM (Jul 17, 2018)

unfortunately breeze 2 crashes on my ryzen hackintosh. when i insert the plugin logic pro x will just close. tried also on studio one and reaper. same thing :/
all other plugins i have (eventide, lexicon, relab, plugin alliance... and more) work without a problem on that machine, so my question is if you can do something here. if you cant i do understand, since it works just fine on windows.

sadly, iam working mostly on osx so if you cannot fix this i might be able to sell/trade the license with someone?

i really like breeze 2 alot, and it would be my goto reverb but i wont build an intel hackintish for it. the ryzen really just works fine on everything.

i have read you are using this new intel command set, so this might be the problem maybe? not sure if this can be removed in some "special version" or something.

please help @Andrew Souter 

regards


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## Andrew Souter (Jul 17, 2018)

>ryzen hackintosh

 ?

This is the first time I've heard of such a thing? Is there a community of people using such machines?

How does that even work since Apple has never released any machines using AMD CPUs? We don't know much about Hackintoshes, and I have no idea what the interactions with various drivers etc are on an unsupported CPU running on OSX.

If you get crash logs, send them to us via email please, and maybe there is some kind of info that is helpful, but I can't really promise anything as this is a pretty alien machine  that is unsupported by Apple.

Of course if you run Win on it, I bet you should be fine. And we'd be able to test that.

wish I had better news...


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## MarcelM (Jul 17, 2018)

Andrew Souter said:


> >ryzen hackintosh
> 
> ?
> 
> ...



thx for the offered help 

well, hackintosh is in general not supported by apple, and i guess even less is a ryzen then 

some clever guy made a custom ryzen kernel for osx, and it really works like a charm. its a little bit more complicated to setup compared to an intel system, but not that much. there is an amd osx community. if you google for amd osx you can quickly find it 


breeze 2 is really the only plugin yet which crashes on that machine, and tomorrow i will check if i get some crash logs. breeze runs between fine on my intel based hackintosh laptop, so iam pretty sure its because of the ryzen.


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## Andrew Souter (Jul 17, 2018)

Heroix said:


> i have read you are using this new intel command set, so this might be the problem maybe? not sure if this can be removed in some "special version" or something.



You mean "AVX-512" I suppose? We also provide "AVX-2", "AVX-1" and "SSE" versions already. There is code to detect your CPU and select the correct one to use for your system. Ryzen (on windows at least) should be able to use any of the last three -- just not "AVX-512"

It is possible the CPU-detection code doesn't recognize your CPU and tries to use an inappropriate version. Email us and we can tell you how to force it to try to use one of the earlier instruction sets.


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## MarcelM (Jul 17, 2018)

Andrew Souter said:


> You mean "AVX-512" I suppose? We also provide "AVX-2", "AVX-1" and "SSE" versions already. There is code to detect your CPU and select the correct one to use for your system. Ryzen (on windows at least) should be able to use any of the last three -- just not "AVX-512"
> 
> It is possible the CPU-detection code doesn't recognize your CPU and tries to use an inappropriate version. Email us and we can tell you how to force it to try to use one of the earlier instruction sets.



great news. i think thats exactly the thing. it wont detect my cpu correctly and uses instructions the cpu simply doesnt have. should i write a support ticket on your homepage or write an email to which adress? oh and yes, breeze2 on ryzen/win 10 works.

thx btw... it would be soooo cool for me to get this running.


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## Andrew Souter (Jul 17, 2018)

Heroix said:


> great news. i think thats exactly the thing. it wont detect my cpu correctly and uses instructions the cpu simply doesnt have.



It's possible. who knows on this mutant. 



Heroix said:


> should i write a support ticket on your homepage or write an email to which adress?



use this

https://www.2caudio.com/support/contact


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## MarcelM (Jul 17, 2018)

Andrew Souter said:


> It's possible. who knows on this mutant.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



i just did. thx alot for atleast trying to help. i didnt expect this tbh. great customer support 

oh, and that "mutant" outperforms quite alot of apple machines


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## Andrew Souter (Jul 17, 2018)

Heroix said:


> oh, and that "mutant" outperforms quite alot of apple machines



I don't doubt that. Mac Pro's are long over due for an update. I am writing from one. And I am also about to build some new Win systems, but I will use Intel Skylake-X i9 Extreme Edition, and also some Xeons.

I even partially thought about trying to see if I could get OSX running on the Skylake i9. I have seen successful systems based on this. But this is a system that is almost identical to the iMac Pro in hardware, so it's more likely to work. I did not know anyone ever built an AMD hackintosh. That seems much more risky since there is no existing Mac similar to this.

AMD is definitely bring back some competition into the market though, and that's a good thing for progress. I'm excited to see what Intel does next.


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## MarcelM (Jul 17, 2018)

Andrew Souter said:


> I don't doubt that. Mac Pro's are long over due for an update. I am writing from one. And I am also about to build some new Win systems, but I will use Intel Skylake-X i9 Extreme Edition, and also some Xeons.
> 
> I even partially thought about trying to see if I could get OSX running on the Skylake i9. I have seen successful systems based on this. But this is a system that is almost identical to the iMac Pro in hardware, so it's more likely to work. I did not know anyone ever built an AMD hackintosh. That seems much more risky since there is no existing Mac similar to this.
> 
> AMD is definitely bring back some competition into the market though, and that's a good thing for progress.



osx/hackintosh will run just fine on the skylake i9. cpu doesnt really matter too much. more important is the right mainboard. Asus ROG Rampage VI Apex Intel X299 for example works like a charm except for wlan.

i sold my mac pro 5.1 between and never looked back. had a skylake hackintosh aswell but went with ryzen now. 

actually you can get most x299 boards to work and hackintosh is really a good option. it might take a bit of work if you are no too experienced with it, but there are a couple of good community forums which will help you.

edit: thx for the email. i will try it tomorrow. iam not on the ryzen machine right now. iam gonna report back.


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## MarcelM (Jul 18, 2018)

gotta report that nothing helps. tried everything you suggested. ryzen isnt the best option for hackintosh. also i used cubase for the first time today on ryzen/osx and it crashes once i enable control room. very annoying, and iam gonna build an intel system again 

thx for the help though.


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## Andrew Souter (Jul 18, 2018)

sorry to hear there's no luck with ryzen hackintosh. I'm not completely surprised though as the CPU detection code depends on the OS for some things, and if OSX has no knowledge of Ryzen, well, seems highly unlikely to work.

I'm a big fan of Intel Skylake-X 7xxx series (or Xeon W, if you prefer, but they are basically almost the same thing):

https://ark.intel.com/products/series/123588/Intel-Core-X-series-Processors

These are the fastest current CPUs for our products.

I loaded >1000 Breeze 2 instances on the 8 core version from this series! I am currently setting up a system with the 18-core variant! Intel even demo'd a 28-core monster recently for potential release later this year.

Breeze and all of our future products/updates will be able to use AVX-512, which is quite speedy!


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## MarcelM (Aug 19, 2018)

Andrew Souter said:


> sorry to hear there's no luck with ryzen hackintosh. I'm not completely surprised though as the CPU detection code depends on the OS for some things, and if OSX has no knowledge of Ryzen, well, seems highly unlikely to work.
> 
> I'm a big fan of Intel Skylake-X 7xxx series (or Xeon W, if you prefer, but they are basically almost the same thing):
> 
> ...



i tried between the b2 demo and it works just fine on my hackintosh. i tried to the the dylib from b2 and put it in the breeze folder, but it sadly doesnt work. i also heard there was a NOAVX version for b2. is there something like this maybe for breeze 2.0? 

iam really sad a bit since i like breeze ALOT and its really the only plugin which doesnt work on my ryzen :/ 

ofcourse not your fault.


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## martinjuenke (Sep 7, 2018)

Last year I bought in an extreme rush of GAS the Perfect Storm. And I don‘t regret it. It‘s top quality.


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## paulmatthew (Oct 19, 2018)

I'm a happy owner of both Breeze 2.1 (just purchased ) and B2 . At first , for whatever reason , I was turned off by the sound of the breeze 2 demo for whatever reason when I tried it a while back . I decided to try it again yesterday with fresh ears and was immediately immersed in using it and finding to be versatile and a very clean sounding reverb with great depth giving it a rich sound. It's simple , easy to dial in your sound , resizeable which is beyond awesome , able to get in to the eq and damp settings for very detailed precision . It would be great to see a tempo sync or sidechain feature in the future , but I somehow can't help but think that it may compromise it's great CPU usage. Well done Andrew!


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## whinecellar (Oct 19, 2018)

@Andrew Souter , you mentioned earlier in the thread that “In Breeze 2, the Classic Modes still have this degree of natural pre-delay, to maintain preset compatibility with 1.0.”

I haven’t had time to read through the whole thread, but I’m a massive fan of Breeze and B2... it looks like Breeze has undergone a fundamental rewrite, so this caught my eye… I want to be sure that existing projects using Breeze would recall and sound the same before upgrading to Breeze 2?

Thanks! Can’t say enough good stuff about your products… I think I own every software reverb known to man and these two are consistently my favorites!


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## Andrew Souter (Oct 20, 2018)

paulmatthew said:


> I'm a happy owner of both Breeze 2.1 (just purchased ) and B2 . At first , for whatever reason , I was turned off by the sound of the breeze 2 demo for whatever reason when I tried it a while back . I decided to try it again yesterday with fresh ears and was immediately immersed in using it and finding to be versatile and a very clean sounding reverb with great depth giving it a rich sound. It's simple , easy to dial in your sound , resizeable which is beyond awesome , able to get in to the eq and damp settings for very detailed precision . It would be great to see a tempo sync or sidechain feature in the future , but I somehow can't help but think that it may compromise it's great CPU usage. Well done Andrew!



Thanks kindly. 

Tempo sync of predelay is something we will probably add. It has zero impact on cpu usage. 

Side-chain topics will likely remain reserved for B2, where it is already available. We don’t want breeze to become too complicated. It’s motto is “Simple. Light. Pristine.” 2.0 and now 2.1 already start to add lots of features which eveually would make it morph into B2 if we are not careful and B2 is too complicated for some users. We want breeze to remain simple.


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## Andrew Souter (Oct 20, 2018)

whinecellar said:


> @Andrew Souter , you mentioned earlier in the thread that “In Breeze 2, the Classic Modes still have this degree of natural pre-delay, to maintain preset compatibility with 1.0.”
> 
> I haven’t had time to read through the whole thread, but I’m a massive fan of Breeze and B2... it looks like Breeze has undergone a fundamental rewrite, so this caught my eye… I want to be sure that existing projects using Breeze would recall and sound the same before upgrading to Breeze 2?
> 
> Thanks! Can’t say enough good stuff about your products… I think I own every software reverb known to man and these two are consistently my favorites!



Thanks kindly Jim. 

Yes Breeze 2.0 was basicallly a completely rewrite. We could have easily named it something else and changed the control layout and had a new product to sell you all. There are very major extensive changes from 1.x. We wanted to preserve existing customers’ investments however so we did it as a 2.0 upgrade with a minor upgrade fee. And now we just did 2.1 as a free upgrade from 2.0 with even more features including:

P-Link
Sub-Zero suspend on silence cpu saver
Chameleon color
And more...

The first two items are aimed straight at this forum and everyone here. 

1.x presets will load in 2.x yes. The sound will be very close in most cases but not exactly 100% the same. We’d expect mixes to translate without adjusting breeze settings but if you have something where it is ultra critical that the sound remain exactly the same you can finish these projects with 1.x. 1.x and 2.x can be installed at the same time. 2.x will not replace 1.x instances in your projects. You can even use 1.x and 2.x in the same project.


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## whinecellar (Oct 20, 2018)

Andrew Souter said:


> ...1.x and 2.x can be installed at the same time. 2.x will not replace 1.x instances in your projects. You can even use 1.x and 2.x in the same project.



Ah, that’s great news! Thanks so much Andrew. I look forward to checking out Breeze 2!


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