# I wish there was an NI Keyboard alternative



## Studio E (Sep 17, 2022)

I don't own one, but just reading the reviews, it just seems way too sketchy to buy. I pretty much love the feel of my S90xs as my main controller, but would really LOVE those key-switch lights. I wonder if there would ever be an alternative. If there was a light strip that I could tape onto my keys, I'd do it in a heart beat and pay a decent amount for it, if it lit-up the different keyswitches properly for the 12,487 different key-switch based libraries I own. Just saying. It's gotta be a game changer, especially when learning newer libraries. I bought the Sonokinetic bundle and whew-boy, that's a LOT of different stuff going on. I do think I'm going to love these libraries, but between them, my Synchron libs, Spitfire, and everything else...... If anyone is aware of a company working on this, I'd love to hear about it.


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## Double Helix (Sep 17, 2022)

Studio E said:


> I don't own one, but just reading the reviews, *it just seems way too sketchy to buy*. . .


This is the reason I have held back; having inquired of the various retailers, not a single salesperson I've spoken to has had the faintest idea about the unit(s) and no one has seemed inclined to provide any sort of support
Therefore, if I *were* to encounter any glitches, I'm under the impression that the keyboard would have to be boxed up for return to NI for repair/adjustment/reprogramming

That said, I am comfortable with my current midi controller, but I am in agreement with Eric that the features on the 61- and 88-key controllers would be convenient, indeed. I have the space and would have no objection to having a second controller. It is the retailers' seeming utter lack of interest that gives me pause


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## dylanmixer (Sep 17, 2022)

The keyboard is good, but it is outdated. Native Instruments, once the kings of innovation, now only cater to the lowest common denominator (bedroom producers and beat makers). It's been way too long without a new a new Komplete Kontrol model, but I'm hoping that the upcoming overhaul of Kontakt means that it may be in the pipeline. Having to use the clunky Komplete wrapper to utilize the best features of the keyboard is a pain, and I gave up a long time ago.

Basically, don't waste your money on the MK1 or MK2. I have enjoyed my time with them, but they are LONG overdue for some new tech and new innovation.


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## Elrik Settee (Sep 17, 2022)

Studio E said:


> I don't own one, but just reading the reviews, it just seems way too sketchy to buy. I pretty much love the feel of my S90xs as my main controller, but would really LOVE those key-switch lights. I wonder if there would ever be an alternative. If there was a light strip that I could tape onto my keys, I'd do it in a heart beat and pay a decent amount for it, if it lit-up the different keyswitches properly for the 12,487 different key-switch based libraries I own. Just saying. It's gotta be a game changer, especially when learning newer libraries. I bought the Sonokinetic bundle and whew-boy, that's a LOT of different stuff going on. I do think I'm going to love these libraries, but between them, my Synchron libs, Spitfire, and everything else...... If anyone is aware of a company working on this, I'd love to hear about it.





Studio E said:


> I don't own one, but just reading the reviews, it just seems way too sketchy to buy. I pretty much love the feel of my S90xs as my main controller, but would really LOVE those key-switch lights. I wonder if there would ever be an alternative. If there was a light strip that I could tape onto my keys, I'd do it in a heart beat and pay a decent amount for it, if it lit-up the different keyswitches properly for the 12,487 different key-switch based libraries I own. Just saying. It's gotta be a game changer, especially when learning newer libraries. I bought the Sonokinetic bundle and whew-boy, that's a LOT of different stuff going on. I do think I'm going to love these libraries, but between them, my Synchron libs, Spitfire, and everything else...... If anyone is aware of a company working on this, I'd love to hear about it.








Almost hit its goal, looks perfect if like me you want lights on your grand piano of choice, keyed to scales like NI S-series


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## Elrik Settee (Sep 17, 2022)

88 lights for any kb!


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## lpuser (Sep 17, 2022)

Studio E said:


> but would really LOVE those key-switch lights.


My issue here is that the light guide system *only* works, when you are loading Kontakt into the Komplete Kontrol plugin - which is utter nonsense and not advertised by NI.
When I bought the S61, I was under the impression that Kontakt could natively send the light commands to the keyboard (which certainly would not be wizardry), but no - probably it would have been too easy for NI to make their flagship product compatible.
Since loading KK beforehand is not only using up additional memory and puts additonal load onto the system, it is also prone to crashing - not to speak of reloading older stuff.

So there you go: Great idea, but very bad implementation, which means I am using my keyboard 100% without light guide.


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## Daren Audio (Sep 17, 2022)

Doesn't hurt to try to get Komplete Kontrol keyboard for free!

YouTuber Sanjay C is giving away up to $20K of gear backed by major brands such as Native Instruments, Beyerdynamics Pro X line, Soundtheory Gulfoss, Roli 2, etc. The list is long.


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## Elrik Settee (Sep 17, 2022)

lpuser said:


> My issue here is that the light guide system *only* works, when you are loading Kontakt into the Komplete Kontrol plugin - which is utter nonsense and not advertised by NI.
> When I bought the S61, I was under the impression that Kontakt could natively send the light commands to the keyboard (which certainly would not be wizardry), but no - probably it would have been too easy for NI to make their flagship product compatible.
> Since loading KK beforehand is not only using up additional memory and puts additonal load onto the system, it is also prone to crashing - not to speak of reloading older stuff.
> 
> So there you go: Great idea, but very bad implementation, which means I am using my keyboard 100% without light guide.


What i was trying to say is that the Aurora on Indiegogo is an 88 LED light strip that attaches to any kb that has usb or midi and provides scale based lighting for ANY KB in any DAW and here's the link. £150 ish.

Www.indiegogo.com/projects/aurora-match-your-mood-with-the-smartest-light


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## Elrik Settee (Sep 17, 2022)




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## Daren Audio (Sep 17, 2022)

Elrik Settee said:


> What i was trying to say is that the Aurora on Indiegogo is an 88 LED light strip that attaches to any kb that has usb or midi and provides scale based lighting for ANY KB in any DAW and here's the link. £150 ish.
> 
> Www.indiegogo.com/projects/aurora-match-your-mood-with-the-smartest-light



This is product is excellent for YouTube channel demostration, livestreaming and learning scales but there's no option for lighting up keyswitches for using sample libraries that are encoded to NKS standard. Unfortunately, The Indiegogo product can't do that.


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## HeliaVox (Sep 17, 2022)

I'm not an NI apologist by any means, but reading online opinions on products is kinda skewed. People post in forums when things go wrong. Posts aren't randomly made just to say how wonderful things are going. So it may seem like the KK keyboard series is sketchy. For me personally, I have had the S88MKI, an S61MKII, and a S88MKII and used them with no issues at all. I agree that NI needs to make it abundantly clear that all the chordal, arpeggiated, and light guide bells and whistles only work from within the KK software itself.


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## HCMarkus (Sep 17, 2022)

Do you really need the lights?









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## StillLife (Sep 18, 2022)

Had one since 2014 (first s25, then s61, which I sold to get a s61 mk2. They have been very reliable and inspirational to me. One of my Studio One templates contains a large number of empty komplete kontrol-tracks, as it is SO easy to browse my libraries with it.
When I use the keyboard with Maschine, it is a dream of hardware-software integration. GREAT fun!

It is a great product in itself, though it might not suit everybody's use-case - which goes for most products that are not toothbrushes.


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## HeliaVox (Sep 18, 2022)

HCMarkus said:


> Do you really need the lights?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


For me the Lightguide is almost essential when using Kontakt Libraries. Is is very convienent to have the keyswitches color coded and laid out on the keyboard. No more hunting and pecking at the bottom of the keyboard trying to pick the correct keyswitch. And all the colors sure do impress my non-musician friends, lol.


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## Daren Audio (Sep 18, 2022)

HeliaVox said:


> For me the Lightguide is almost essential when using Kontakt Libraries. Is is very convienent to have the keyswitches color coded and laid out on the keyboard. No more hunting and pecking at the bottom of the keyboard trying to pick the correct keyswitch. And all the colors sure do impress my non-musician friends, lol.


...And clients, too!

Yes, Many of the libraries encoded in NKS standard are quite complex and the light-guide helps out a lot without needing to stop/start your workflow.


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## EanS (Sep 19, 2022)

Sorry for not reading while thread, but do notice (or debunk) that lights only work via Komplete. If you load only Kontakt, no controller features (like the chords one).


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## davidson (Sep 19, 2022)

EanS said:


> Sorry for not reading while thread, but do notice (or debunk) that lights only work via Komplete. If you load only Kontakt, no controller features (like the chords one).


But that _may_ change with kontakt 7...


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## Elrik Settee (Sep 19, 2022)

davidson said:


> But that _may_ change with kontakt 7...


In our dreams.

all we're getting in K7 is resizable dpi thingy in the browser but not in the instruments!!!


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## HeliaVox (Sep 19, 2022)

EanS said:


> Sorry for not reading while thread, but do notice (or debunk) that lights only work via Komplete. If you load only Kontakt, no controller features (like the chords one).


I already mentioned that earlier in the thread, how NI needs to make it *abundantly* clear that all the "bells and whistles" only work in Komplete Kontrol


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## macmac (Sep 19, 2022)

I don't know why NI made it KK only. In KK you don't even see the light guides in the software like you do in the Kontakt GUI, from what I can tell. Makes no sense. I want to see them in both places.

However I just got the S61 on sale and really like it. Definitely worth the couple hundred bucks, love the action.


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## AudioLoco (Sep 19, 2022)

HeliaVox said:


> I already mentioned that earlier in the thread, how NI needs to make it *abundantly* clear that all the "bells and whistles" only work in Komplete Kontrol


was eyeing one of those actually JUST for the lights thingy.... Luckily I went for a generic MUCH cheaper one, as I would have been really disappointed to say the least...


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## proxima (Sep 19, 2022)

HeliaVox said:


> I'm not an NI apologist by any means, but reading online opinions on products is kinda skewed. People post in forums when things go wrong. Posts aren't randomly made just to say how wonderful things are going. So it may seem like the KK keyboard series is sketchy. For me personally, I have had the S88MKI, an S61MKII, and a S88MKII and used them with no issues at all. I agree that NI needs to make it abundantly clear that all the chordal, arpeggiated, and light guide bells and whistles only work from within the KK software itself.


This. The NI products appear to be _massively _popular, so you're going to hear more of their problems. 

I don't own any of their keyboards, but if I had to do it over I'd probably choose the S88 over my Kawai MP11 because while the Kawai action is magnificent, it requires unreasonable repairs to deal with a design flaw on the keys themselves.


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## HeliaVox (Sep 20, 2022)

macmac said:


> In KK you don't even see the light guides in the software like you do in the Kontakt GUI, from what I can tell. Makes no sense. I want to see them in both places.


Select Edit View


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## macmac (Sep 20, 2022)

HeliaVox said:


> Select Edit View


Oh I will have to do that, thank you!!! It made no sense to me to have to guess what the keyboard lights were referring to if not visible in KK.


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## MrMPO (Sep 20, 2022)

I do love my S88, however, not a fan that they are not true Midi Complaint and therefore cannot operate like a midi complaint keyboard without the needed software layer to do the midi operations. Learned the hard way trying to connect to my StudioLogic MixFace to the S88.


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## Daren Audio (Sep 20, 2022)

Also note that many non-Kontakt libraries are also encoded to NKS standard. 
If you use the Komplete Kontrol light-guide as part of your workflow, Spitfire Player , VSL Synchron Player & VSL Synchron Piano Player also light up your keyboard. Below are the list for libraries that have NKS integration:

https://spitfireaudio.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/115002212463

https://www.vsl.co.at/en/News/NKS_Integration






VSL NKS integration requires you to downlaod their NKS installer (Mac/Win) from your account (MyVSL).


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## Reid Rosefelt (Sep 20, 2022)

lpuser said:


> My issue here is that the light guide system *only* works, when you are loading Kontakt into the Komplete Kontrol plugin - which is utter nonsense and not advertised by NI.


Komplete Kontrol is software that integrates with NI keyboards. It sends a handshake to the keyboard which lights the light guides, maps the knobs, and so on. You can't get the lightguides lit without KK.

Hundreds of non-Kontakt libraries trigger the lights in Komplete Kontrol. Kontakt is just one of the things that Komplete Kontrol can run. Arturia synths aren't Kontakt. neither are AAS, ujam, Korg Gadget, Go2, etc. But they do work in KK. Hundreds of libraries that aren't officially NKS trigger the lights and map the knobs. I have Sforzando instruments that light my lightguides when they are loaded in KK. There is no technical reason why every library or synth in existence could not light the lightsguides. A lot of companies just don't want to give money to NI to make it so.

Komplete Kontrol is a software wrapper. It can wrap everything. The only way they could make Kontakt run the lightguides is if NI stopped selling Kontakt and made everybody buy some kind of KK/Kontakt hybrid. Oh boy, would people scream!

Not advertised by NI? They put a paragraph about NKS on every library and instrument they sell and in all the sales they do for third party companies with NKS. There are thousands of places where this has been explicitly explained, and they relentlessly keep explaining it. Each of these regular NI sales of third-party NKS instruments are opportunities for NI to explain what NKS and Komplete Kontrol is. I'm sorry if you didn't read any of this, but it's simply not accurate that they don't advertise it.


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## lpuser (Oct 6, 2022)

Reid Rosefelt said:


> Hundreds of non-Kontakt libraries trigger the lights in Komplete Kontrol. Kontakt is just one of the things that Komplete Kontrol can run.


I am not an NI developer, but let me put it this way:
When a library runs inside Kontakt and uses the Light Guide system, then this library must trigger the required events via a software command. KK does not know what to do unless the library tells it.

Given that a library trigger the lights from C1 to C3, then this request is - most likely - received by Komplete Kontrol and then forwarded to the keyboard.

So when the library itself triggers the lights, then why do these trigger commands have to be picked up by KK first and then sent to the keyboard instead of allowing Kontakt to do this directly? For sure that is no rocket science (but of course it is easier for NI to have general wrapper doing this than coding it into Kontakt).

KK is (in my eyes) like "bloatware" and I have no intention using it. Having to always instantiate KK prior to loading Kontakt is unnecessary and has caused a lot of problems, crashes slowdowns etc. during my testing (the list of changes and fixes says it all).

P.S.: Not sure what you mean with "not advertised by NI"? My point was that NI does _not_ tell customers that KK is required in order to use Light Guide with Kontakt. Yesterday, a professional reviewer of K7 did just mention on YT that there is still no way to use Light Guide with Kontakt alone and like myself, many people were under the impression that Kontakt libraries would support it out of the box without having to add KK.


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