# Sonar Users what are you switching to? (If you switch)



## Brian2112 (Dec 17, 2017)

I've been using Cakewalk since before it even had audio. I think Pro Audio 7 was my first actual DAW (wasn't just midi).
The news that Sonar may be done has been quite upsetting. Fortunately last year I got a head start and switched to Cubase (which I have really liked). Since I am not yet totally committed, I have tried a few others (Reaper and Studio One). After learning Cubase pretty well and using VE Pro, I have been mostly satisfied although, to my great surprise Studio One is seducing me more and more.
I am wondering where other Sonar refugees are turning for their DAWs and why. And what will we really miss about Sonar?

Thanks for your input.


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## dathyr1 (Dec 18, 2017)

Few months before Sonar went under, I purchased Studio One Pro and really like how it works. i find it is much more user friendly than my Sonar Platinum far as setting up tracks, instruments, etc. So all in all, i am very happy with the program and find i can work with it very well. I am a Windows user and installed the 64 bit version of Studio one. i have allot of 32 bit VSTs, but still decided to go 64 bit cause of giving me more RAM and other things.

But i would also say most the big name DAWs now are very very good, it is kinda what DAW fits your workflow and production needs(how easy you can do things) and if you need certain features and plugin tools they offer.

I also just bought Ableton Live DAW just to get into another venue of music operations and to do Live stuff. Another Cool program for what it does, but my Studio One DAW is my goto for creating Compostions. With Studio One if i want to I can Rewire Ableton Live to Studio one and have the best of both worlds. Probably most DAWs can do this now.

Note: Now I am just using my Sonar Platinum to convert most my real old .wrk files and projects of songs I had in the past years to MIDI format. I will still use Sonar until it does not work in Windows updates. i love some of the instrument plugins it has.

Good luck in your choice,
Dave


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## Farkle (Dec 18, 2017)

I was a beta tester for Studio One, so I have a copy of Professional Ver 3. It's really similar to Sonar, and in general, I like Studio One a lot. However, I decided to move back (?) to Digital Performer. I used it years ago in television, and only stopped because I switched to PC.

Now that DP is on PC, I upgraded to 9.5, and am going to spend the holidays rebuilding my rig and loading it. I find DP to be very intuitive for midi composition; actually, both it and Sonar feel the most "midi friendly", more so than Studio One (for me). 

RIP Sonar: You are/were a good DAW. 

Mike


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## pmcrockett (Dec 18, 2017)

I started moving away from Sonar before Gibson pulled the plug, and I'm now on Reaper, 100% because of its scripting capabilities. My Sonar workflow had become extremely CAL oriented, and I'd reached the limits of what CAL could reasonably do, so scripting was really my only consideration when looking for another DAW. If I didn't need the scripting, I'd probably be on Cubase (everyone's doing it) or Digital Performer (fond memories from my school days).


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## chillbot (Dec 18, 2017)

Never switching. Ever. Never ever. Probably to Cubase though. But most likely never. I was one of the very first Cakewalk users and I will be one of the very last. Most likely. Unless Cubase.

The fun thing is going to be if/when I hire an assistant that doesn't know Sonar... convincing them it makes more sense for them to learn a dead program than for me to switch to a live one.


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## synthpunk (Dec 18, 2017)

Is this a hint you are in negotiations ? 



chillbot said:


> Never switching. Ever. Never ever. Probably to Cubase though. But most likely never. I was one of the very first Cakewalk users and I will be one of the very last. Most likely. Unless Cubase.
> 
> The fun thing is going to be if/when I hire an assistant that doesn't know Sonar... convincing them it makes more sense for them to learn a dead program than for me to switch to a live one.


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## Brian2112 (Dec 18, 2017)

One of the things I miss the most is being able to save a bundle file. Everything else seems to create a lot of files that you have to keep track of. Some are easier than others but still I guess it was one of the many things I took for granted with Sonar.


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## kitekrazy (Dec 18, 2017)

I left Sonar after S5 but bought the upgrades to Sonar 4 Life. I still like how you can use it to audition Synth patches and midi files. I'm getting deeper into FL Studio. I have other DAWs and just got Samplitude. I like FL for dance genres.


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## Chandler (Dec 18, 2017)

I've moved to Reaper. It is different, but so far it can do everything I've needed it to do. Midi isn't as bad as people made it out to be. They even have notation.


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## MatFluor (Dec 18, 2017)

I've moved to Digital Performer. I found a guy who sold his DP for a very good price and I'm loving it so far (I'm on PC).


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## EvilDragon (Dec 19, 2017)

Yeah, we're seeing a number of Sonar refugees over at Reaper forum...


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## Brian2112 (Dec 19, 2017)

EvilDragon said:


> Yeah, we're seeing a number of Sonar refugees over at Reaper forum...


You might see me there pretty soon. I'd like to learn about it.
Also, I have seen you (Evil Dragon) at about every forum I've ever visited. You are always so helpful. I hope you know that you are appreciated. I feel like we should all chip in and give you a consulting fee.


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## EvilDragon (Dec 19, 2017)

Thanks. 

I _do_ have a paypal.me link, though (put my username after paypal.me/). I'm just not plastering it everywhere.


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## Brian2112 (Dec 19, 2017)

EvilDragon said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I'm just not plastering it everywhere.


Done and done.

A lot of times when I have a problem and I look it up, you've already sussed it. Thanks!


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## MichaelM (Dec 19, 2017)

Will be hard to leave...been with Cakewalk since DOS days. But I have done some projects in Cubase, so at some point, not now, will move to Cubase. Not looking forward to it. As of now everything is working fine. I'll probably do a system image of my PC more often now. 
For a minute on their site, I thought they were still selling it, until I clicked the links to their affiliates, and see that they all have it as out of stock.


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## dzilizzi (Dec 19, 2017)

I've always been a multi DAW kind of person. Mostly switching between ProTools and Sonar, with a bit of Reason thrown in. But a couple years ago, I was getting frustrated with ProTools' annual fee - Sonar didn't increase it to full price if you decided not to update every year. So I picked up Cubase. Now it seems Cubase will be replacing Sonar, and I'm still using ProTools. And Reason.

DP is starting to look interesting too.


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## Brian2112 (Dec 19, 2017)

Studio One seriously needs track presets. That's been the most obvious really big downer.


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## Giscard Rasquin (Dec 20, 2017)

Cubase. Very happy


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## Kuusniemi (Dec 21, 2017)

Bitwig Studio and Studio One.


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## Vastman (Dec 24, 2017)

Cubase... has track templates, called presets... which i just loved about Sonar...very big time saver. Haven't had time to explore much yet but have an open ended life in the new year with no remaining commitments so I'll be able to go hog wild!


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## teclark7 (Dec 24, 2017)

Trying both Cubase and Studio One for different things


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## joebaggan (Dec 24, 2017)

I'd say try Cubase. It will have all the Midi features and more that Sonar had. IMO, other DAWs like Studio One or Reaper aren't up to snuff in that department.


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## Mystic (Dec 24, 2017)

Giving both Cubase and Studio One a run to see which I like better. I might just use both since Studio One feels much more solid on the audio end of things and Cubase much more solid in MIDI. Neither are as good as Sonar IMO. :(


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## Brian2112 (Dec 24, 2017)

For midi editing, Studio One and Reaper have Bézier curve editing of controller data (although Studio One is a flaky implementation). Actually FL studio might have the best implementation but I'm not going there
Cubase has expression maps and the editor is easier on the eyes IMO. It also has the logical editor and a lot of useful midi functions. Also, hidden away in the Cubase score editor is an explode track feature which lets you play a chord progression on a piano (say) and explode each voice to a different track (a quick start orchestration tool). 
Studio One has the best Freeze implementation I've seen, and an awesome scratch pad, but no track presets. 

I mean seriously, why can't we have it all?
Interestingly, Reaper might get there first. 
So for now, I think I might throw down ideas in Studio One and use Cubase to finish them off, all the while studying about Reaper, and to a lesser extent DP. 

Thanks for the input guys!


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## Brian2112 (Dec 24, 2017)

Well, I stand corrected. Studio One DOES have Track presets - it just does them in a different and arguably better way. Multi Instruments!
Doesn't even have to be multi instruments. It even stores VE Pro - and the settings and instruments inside. Don't even have to brows for files on your disk - just drag them over from your right side bar. Pretty cool!!!


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## eboats (Dec 24, 2017)

Cubase has Bezier curves in most recent version


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## Brian2112 (Dec 24, 2017)

eboats said:


> Cubase has Bezier curves in most recent version


Yea but isn't it only for automation? What about midi controller data?


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## gregh (Dec 24, 2017)

Brian2112 said:


> For midi editing, Studio One and Reaper have Bézier curve editing of controller data (although Studio One is a flaky implementation). Actually FL studio might have the best implementation but I'm not going there
> Cubase has expression maps and the editor is easier on the eyes IMO. It also has the logical editor and a lot of useful midi functions. Also, hidden away in the Cubase score editor is an explode track feature which lets you play a chord progression on a piano (say) and explode each voice to a different track (a quick start orchestration tool).
> Studio One has the best Freeze implementation I've seen, and an awesome scratch pad, but no track presets.
> 
> ...


Are you sure Reaper has bezier for cc data? For audio automation definitely, but I did not think so for midi cc


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## eboats (Dec 24, 2017)

Brian2112 said:


> Yea but isn't it only for automation? What about midi controller data?


You can do any midi c.c work in either automation lanes or key editor. You can use Bezier curves if you do it in automation lanes


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## Brian2112 (Dec 24, 2017)

gregh said:


> Are you sure Reaper has bezier for cc data? For audio automation definitely, but I did not think so for midi cc


No. Not sure ill have to ask Evil Dragon.


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## Quasar (Dec 24, 2017)

Brian2112 said:


> No. Not sure ill have to ask Evil Dragon.


This has been a long standing feature request. There are workarounds. You can use ReaControlMIDI, but nothing native and easy to implement for this.

It's the ONE feature I'm really pining to see. I can live happily with every other aspect of Reaper exactly the way it is now.


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## gregh (Dec 24, 2017)

Brian2112 said:


> No. Not sure ill have to ask Evil Dragon.


My memory is users were hostile to using curves for discrete data even if it was useful as a visual guide


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## Carles (Dec 24, 2017)

IMO, the key on Bezier curves is having proper handles. Vector-based programs like Adobe Illustrator allow two handles per point and these can go from the softer possible curve to purely straight lines, so with the proper amount of points you can draw whatever you need with absolute precision.


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## Carles (Dec 24, 2017)

just a quick example


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## Brian2112 (Dec 24, 2017)

eboats said:


> You can do any midi c.c work in either automation lanes or key editor. You can use Bezier curves if you do it in automation lanes


Thanks! I did in fact just try it out. Right clicking on the instrument knobs on the right will open up the lane for any supported midi cc. 


Carles said:


> IMO, the key on Bezier curves is having proper handles. Vector-based programs like Adobe Illustrator allow two handles per point and these can go from the softer possible curve to purely straight lines, so with the proper amount of points you can draw whatever you need with absolute precision.


Yea the test I just did with Cubase was similar in result to Studio One in that it can be tricky to get what you want. Maybe even Bézier curves is not the best way to go unless implemented like Illustrator. So far I have gotten the best results with Reapers drawing tools because it doesn't just load it up with hundreds of points (just like 25 points) for a ramp which might not give me the resolution but I seem to get closer to the desired effect. 
Interesting stuff. Different approaches taken on a lot of things.


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## EvilDragon (Dec 25, 2017)

Dual-point Beziers would create a possibility for the curve to overlap itself, which is not good for DAWs, which are strictly linear. So that is probably never going to happen in any DAW.


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## EvilDragon (Dec 25, 2017)

gregh said:


> My memory is users were hostile to using curves for discrete data even if it was useful as a visual guide



https://forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=177058

Here are your curves but drawn discretely, as it should be.  (also, "hostile" is the wrong word to use here.)


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## Vastman (Dec 25, 2017)

Brian2112 said:


> Well, I stand corrected. Studio One DOES have Track presets - it just does them in a different and arguably better way. Multi Instruments!
> Doesn't even have to be multi instruments. It even stores VE Pro - and the settings and instruments inside. Don't even have to brows for files on your disk - just drag them over from your right side bar. Pretty cool!!!



Brian... this is no where near what sonar does...you cannot set up multiple instruments like kontakt and their routing, effects, etc like sonar or cubase. I considered and even bought S3 a long time ago and found their system really clugy. I spent days trying to make things work and finally gave up...maybe I'm dumb, but a Studio One expert,who was always hanging around the cakewalk forum, couldn't help me do what sonar can, quick setup wise with track templates... if u've found things have gotten better, please post a link...right now Studio one is just gathering dust on my drive


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## Brian2112 (Dec 25, 2017)

Vastman,
No Effect sends but for me that comes near the end and saves with the project:
Inserts:yes. Most other channel routing is there
Fast Forward to around 5:50 Or or 7:00 unfortunately lots of useless obvious stuff to. Not very concise but it does show you.


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## Brian2112 (Dec 25, 2017)

EvilDragon said:


> Dual-point Beziers would create a possibility for the curve to overlap itself, which is not good for DAWs, which are strictly linear. So that is probably never going to happen in any DAW.


Yea but I'd sure like to hear that 
Relativity strikes again. Music that breaks time&space is what I want. 
I would argue that J.S. Bach and the crazy time signatures in Rush music come close.


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## Carles (Dec 25, 2017)

EvilDragon said:


> Dual-point Beziers would create a possibility for the curve to overlap itself, which is not good for DAWs, which are strictly linear. So that is probably never going to happen in any DAW.


I guess that depends on how the implementation would be programmed. If a handle is constrained to don't cross the "axis" (the point itself) it shouldn't ever overlap.
In these vector programs the handles behavior can be restricted using a key/s combination so I'm not coder but sounds like it should be perfectly doable by just keeping some restrictions locked to the user.
In fact, quite a while back when I used to be a graphic designer I did always tend to avoid overlaps because the by then too early PostScript language (Adobe) could print out undesired results if so (unwanted filled up areas), and even like this (drawing specifically to avoid overlapping) the workflow speed and precision you can get with handles is amazing and learning curve is very easy (talking about graphical work I mean. No idea about precision if the curve has to be rendered to values that a DAW can understand).


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## robgb (Dec 25, 2017)

Brian2112 said:


> I've been using Cakewalk since before it even had audio. I think Pro Audio 7 was my first actual DAW (wasn't just midi).
> The news that Sonar may be done has been quite upsetting. Fortunately last year I got a head start and switched to Cubase (which I have really liked). Since I am not yet totally committed, I have tried a few others (Reaper and Studio One). After learning Cubase pretty well and using VE Pro, I have been mostly satisfied although, to my great surprise Studio One is seducing me more and more.
> I am wondering where other Sonar refugees are turning for their DAWs and why. And what will we really miss about Sonar?
> 
> Thanks for your input.


I'm not an evangelist for Reaper. I think any DAW you choose and learn and feel comfortable with is right for you. But I started with Cakewalk, grabbed Sonar when it was an infant, migrated to Cubase, then to Logic, then to Studio One. I finally landed on Reaper and find it to be, for me, the best DAW I've ever used. I was intimidated by it at first, but then I watched Kenny Gioia's tutorial series on YouTube and have been loving it ever since. Plus you can use it forever for "free," although most of us eventually break down and pay the $60 small business fee, which gives you two major updates. Meaning I started with Reaper 5, and I'm good until Reaper 7.

One of the things I love about Reaper is the ability to set up a track exactly how I want it and save it as a template. Then when I start a project and need to add, say, a piano track, or a violin ensemble track, I simply right click, choose the template and it automatically loads with my pre-configured setup. 

Another thing I love are the hundreds of themes available, allowing me to choose the look of Reaper that suits my personality...


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## Carles (Dec 25, 2017)

robgb said:


> Another thing I love are the hundreds of themes available, allowing me to choose the look of Reaper that suits my personality...


Not only themes, within my little research I also found tools created by users shared for free or at least inexpensive.
My demo is expired now with no time for testing anymore (as usual), but not a drama by having the chance to grab it for only 60 bucks


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## EvilDragon (Dec 25, 2017)

Reaper's demo doesn't expire. You can keep using it without *any* limitations, but you are _kindly asked to purchase a license. You don't have to, but please, do. _


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## robgb (Dec 25, 2017)

Carles said:


> My demo is expired now with no time for testing anymore (as usual)


I had Reaper on my system for two years before I even took a serious look at it. The demo still worked. I found I loved it so much I popped for the $60 within a couple days.


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## AllanH (Dec 25, 2017)

I chose Cubase and I'm about half-way done migrating last year's projects. I find the Audio engine in Cubase superior to Cakewalk's with lower latency and cleaner sound. I have no idea why it sounds better; it could also be that I'm importing just midi and re-implementing all settings and that I historically had a "messed up" setting or two in Sonar.

I am definitely clicking and selecting more in Cubase. Sonar's PRV edit controls are superior with fewer clicks required.


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## Brian2112 (Dec 25, 2017)

robgb said:


> I had Reaper on my system for two years before I even took a serious look at it. The demo still worked. I found I loved it so much I popped for the $60 within a couple days.


Yea, I just went ahead and payed the 60 bucks. I figured even if I didn't use it, I wanted to support these guys who obviously have spent a lot of time and effort on the project. Right now, I'm still happy with Cubase, but more and more, I boot up and play around with musical ideas in Studio One. I expect at some point, I might settle on Reaper though because being scriptable and fully customizable is a huge thing. It's really been fun messing with all this stuff. I still will miss Sonar (mostly because of the mass amount of musical ideas I have done over the years that I may not have time to convert). I have found that there are a lot of things that many of these other programs do better imo. Still, Sonar had almost no omissions with regards to the feature set. Everything else has a bit of "yea, but...".


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## eboats (Dec 25, 2017)

Creating key commands and macros in cubase will help you avoid a lot of clicking


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## Carles (Dec 25, 2017)

EvilDragon said:


> Reaper's demo doesn't expire. You can keep using it without *any* limitations, but you are _kindly asked to purchase a license. You don't have to, but please, do. _


Is just $60 anyway  I wish all the stuff I have gathering dust was only 60 each.


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## heliosequence (Dec 25, 2017)

Vintage Sonar (Since Cakewalk 3.0... not to be confused with Sonar 3.0) and PT user here. I also have Live but it isn’t a replacement for a proper DAW. I’m a bit tired with each program and am currently searching to see if I can replace both with just one DAW. Doing everything from scoring and video commercial work (lots of midi) to classic band recording, mixing and mastering. I’ve already messed with Studio One and Samplitude, but have narrowed it down to the latest version of Cubase and Reaper.

I didn’t know DP had migrated to PC... is this something I should take a look at?

So far I’m loving Cubase’s extended midi features (honestly surprised to be considering Cubase... better midi than Sonar even) and Reaper’s incredibly efficient programming (best CPU performance on heavy mixing and mastering sessions). Currently hit a timing snag with hardware midi in Reaper and I still need to test scoring to video in each program. I can’t say I’m finder either DAW super intuitive so far, but I’m assuming I’d get used to either? Would love to hear anyone’s thoughts on these two or if I should take another at Samplitude or a first look at DP? Thanks for any input!


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## synthpunk (Dec 25, 2017)

I think you will see the midi end of Studio One improve, I mean there are former members of the Logic programming team working on One now.

When the smoke clears I could see Reaper being on top just because of great community.

I'm on Logic, Ableton, PT because I do not want learn another DAW 



Mystic said:


> Giving both Cubase and Studio One a run to see which I like better. I might just use both since Studio One feels much more solid on the audio end of things and Cubase much more solid in MIDI. Neither are as good as Sonar IMO. :(


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## Shad0wLandsUK (Dec 26, 2017)

synthpunk said:


> I think you will see the midi end of Studio One improve, I mean there are former members of the Logic programming team working on One now.
> 
> When the smoke clears I could see Reaper being on top just because of great community.
> 
> I'm on Logic, Ableton, PT because I do not want learn another DAW


Almost the same, same and saaame.

Keep skipping between Cubase Pro and Logic, but always going back to Logic Pro X, because that audio engine in Cubase still does not handle what Logic does on macOS :/

Not to mention my love for patches for instruments and channel strip settings.

Being able to just drag in a channel strip already setup with ARTzID scripts and VE PRO, or a Track Folder of instruments all ready to go as a patch...just makes life simpler


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## Brian2112 (Dec 26, 2017)

heliosequence said:


> I can’t say I’m finder either DAW super intuitive so far, but I’m assuming I’d get used to either? Would love to hear anyone’s thoughts on these two or if I should take another at Samplitude or a first look at DP? Thanks for any input!


As far as transition, my experience with Cubase and Studio One is SSDM (Same Shit Different Menu). 
Reaper is going to take a little longer but will really be worth the time invested as I go.
DP - a little daunting at first but I've seen that a lot of people who do video on a timeline swear by it. It's just very different from what I was used to with Sonar. 
Samplitude - have no idea.


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## Leandro Marcos (Dec 26, 2017)

I moved to Cubase 2 weeks ago. Been a Sonar user since version 7 Producer. What I'll miss from Sonar is that it was very intuitive to use. I guess I never had to read the manual.


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## heliosequence (Dec 26, 2017)

Leandro Marcos said:


> I moved to Cubase 2 weeks ago. Been a Sonar user since version 7 Producer. What I'll miss from Sonar is that it was very intuitive to use. I guess I never had to read the manual.



Yeah, I agree... Sonar is pretty easy to use and is very intuitive... although I was starting to get frustrated with the comping system... which is pretty awful compared to Pro Tools playlist system. That's another thing I need to try out with both Cubase and Reaper.


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## electona (Jan 2, 2018)

I just signed up for this forum, and then I read this disturbing announcement. Like many, I have been a Cakewalk user forever, so the demise of Sonar is greatly upsetting. I'm currently in shock, but I guess I'll have to start looking for an alternative. BTW, a courtesy email from Gibson to Cakewalk customers would have been nice.

What I don't understand is why hardware companies acquire software companies and then dis them. Same happened after Tascam took over Gigastudio. As consumers we are really powerless.


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## Brian2112 (Jan 2, 2018)

electona said:


> I just signed up for this forum, and then I read this disturbing announcement. Like many, I have been a Cakewalk user forever, so the demise of Sonar is greatly upsetting. I'm currently in shock, but I guess I'll have to start looking for an alternative.


First, welcome to the forum!

I hear ya. A lot of us are pretty upset. The good news is that there are some *good* alternatives (though nothing may check all the boxes right away). The bad news, of course, is having to find ways to archive/move our projects over that some of us have had for years.
The learning curves are not too bad for most alternatives. It literally took me about a week to get reasonably proficient with Cubase. Most things are there, it's just a different keystroke or menu.

After spending years with the same software, any transition is tough, but I also have found it fun. I have even discovered some things I like better in other software, and learned about better workflows.

Good luck! Check back and let us know how it goes!
Best,
Brian


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## Leandro Marcos (Jan 3, 2018)

electona said:


> I just signed up for this forum, and then I read this disturbing announcement. Like many, I have been a Cakewalk user forever, so the demise of Sonar is greatly upsetting. I'm currently in shock, but I guess I'll have to start looking for an alternative. BTW, a courtesy email from Gibson to Cakewalk customers would have been nice.
> 
> What I don't understand is why hardware companies acquire software companies and then dis them. Same happened after Tascam took over Gigastudio. As consumers we are really powerless.



Welcome to the forums! I've been a long time Sonar user as well. Now learning Cubase. Please feel free to contact me if you need any help. Cheers.


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## electona (Jan 9, 2018)

@Brian, Leandro: Thank you for the welcome. I didn't use Sonar on a daily basis, as my main creative endeavors have shifted towards making animated movies over the past 10 years or so. It seems that moving to another form of creativity has put making music a bit on the back-burner.

My main interest would be composing music for my own films, so in a DAW I need something with steady video playback and a good MIDI support. I also want to upgrade my keyboard. I have an X-board 61, which is very noisy (mechanically), and I have been looking at 88-key alternatives. I'm interested in the Nektar Impact LX-88+, which seems to have good integration with several DAWs and is reasonably priced. I like the idea of being able to control more from the MIDI keyboard rather than using the mouse.


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## Leandro Marcos (Jan 10, 2018)

electona said:


> @Brian, Leandro: Thank you for the welcome. I didn't use Sonar on a daily basis, as my main creative endeavors have shifted towards making animated movies over the past 10 years or so. It seems that moving to another form of creativity has put making music a bit on the back-burner.
> 
> My main interest would be composing music for my own films, so in a DAW I need something with steady video playback and a good MIDI support. I also want to upgrade my keyboard. I have an X-board 61, which is very noisy (mechanically), and I have been looking at 88-key alternatives. I'm interested in the Nektar Impact LX-88+, which seems to have good integration with several DAWs and is reasonably priced. I like the idea of being able to control more from the MIDI keyboard rather than using the mouse.



Given your needs, I would go for Cubase (I don't know if their especial crossgrade price is still on). Cubase is your best bet for scoring to picture on Windows (also has a Mac version if you ever happen to change systems or you have a macbook pro to continue work when travelling).


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## AllanH (Jan 10, 2018)

I have now migrated all of 2017's bigger projects to Cubase 9.5 Pro. I'm pleased with the transition, and I'm getting used to the somewhat different workflow. I am not sure I've even touched most of Cubase, but the pieces I've used are well-done and essentially work as expected. Midi recording and editing seem better and more complete in Cubase.


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## Leandro Marcos (Jan 10, 2018)

AllanH said:


> I have now migrated all of 2017's bigger projects to Cubase 9.5 Pro. I'm pleased with the transition, and I'm getting used to the somewhat different workflow. I am not sure I've even touched most of Cubase, but the pieces I've used are well-done and essentially work as expected. Midi recording and editing seem better and more complete in Cubase.


How did you migrate the projects?? You had to manually re-do all the VSTs routing? Or you have some kind of Sonar to Cubase project file converter?


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## AllanH (Jan 10, 2018)

The migration from Sonar to Cubase was a bit involved and time consuming.

I had to learn Cubase as I went, so the first few projects were by far the slowest. I wanted to start with a “fresh” Cubase project and not just try to duplicate my Sonar setup. I thought there would be beneficial to determine “best practices” for Cubase from the get-go. I also chose to not automatically add all the effects (e.g. Neutron2) back on all the tracks. I only added effects back when I thought they were truly missing.

I created Group Tracks for all the major instrument groups matching what I had in Sonar and configured all the routing and sends as I went.

I started in Sonar with the smallest project:


Noted all instruments, their settings, and midi-offets.
Exported everything as midi
Captured screenshots of the tempo maps and fader settings
Imported the midi in Cubase and added instruments to match.
Moved each individual midi track into its new corresponding instrument track and made sure automation had come over correctly.
Added a tempo track, markers, etc.
Saved “as template” as I went.
I repeated this for every single project and built my template as part of the migration.

Here is what I found


Cubase loads projects faster, has lower real-time latency, and sounds better. Maybe I had overdone the effects, but especially removing Neutron made everything come to life.
Cubase is fairly “self-consistent” and quickly felt natural to work with.
Google was a good friend. I will need to read the manual at some point!

I will redo my template at some point as I experimented with different approaches.

The first project took about 8 hours to migrate, but it was “blank sheet” and no Cubase experience. The last project migrated in ~ 2 hours and it was much bigger.

I’m still learning Cubase and taking the opportunity to revisit all the tracks.

I hope this helps.


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## Brian2112 (Jan 10, 2018)

Makes me wish we had VE Pro for the past 20 years or so. Might have made these transitions a lot easier. Then again, it puts a lot of dependency on one thing (again again)


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## Leandro Marcos (Jan 10, 2018)

AllanH said:


> The migration from Sonar to Cubase was a bit involved and time consuming.
> I had to learn Cubase as I went, so the first few projects were by far the slowest. I wanted to start with a “fresh” Cubase project and not just try to duplicate my Sonar setup. I thought there would be benefits to determine “best practices” for Cubase from the get-go. I also chose to not automatically add all the effects (e.g. Neutron2) back on all the tracks. I only added effects back when I thought they were truly missing.
> 
> I created Group Tracks for all the major instrument groups matching what I had in Sonar and configured all the routing and sends as I went.
> ...



very valuable explanation. Thank you for taking the time to explain your approach in so much detail.


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## FinGael (Jan 16, 2018)

I still don't want to switch. The force is strong with this one.


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## joebaggan (Jan 16, 2018)

AllanH said:


> Google was a good friend. I will need to read the manual at some point!



Yep, I started with Cubase Pro about 3 months ago mainly for Midi work. Before I got too far into it, I spent a good deal of time reading the sections of the manual I thought I'd be using. Cubase is a very powerful beast, often with more than one way of doing things, so the manual helped with the lay of the land and no doubt saved a lot of aimless thrashing around in the program before I had an idea what I was doing. Beyond that, the Steinberg Cubase forum is a great place to learn and ask questions.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Jan 19, 2018)

joebaggan said:


> Beyond that, the Steinberg Cubase forum is a great place to learn and ask questions.



There's good help on there, but it's mostly made up of Lynch Mob's that chronically whine and complain about alleged bugs, etc. Really annoying. There are a few legit complaints I've read, but most are posts like "Cubase 9.5 is buggy as hell, I can never properly playback video and large templates with my 2013 MacBook Air and 4GB Ram".  Or stuff like "Come on Cubase, get with the program! Please add more sidechain inserts, I need at least 50 for my production work".

For PC users, Cubase is an awesome DAW.


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## esencia (Mar 6, 2018)

Quasar said:


> This has been a long standing feature request. There are workarounds. You can use ReaControlMIDI, but nothing native and easy to implement for this.
> 
> It's the ONE feature I'm really pining to see. I can live happily with every other aspect of Reaper exactly the way it is now.


ReaControlMidi it´s my blocker.. I'm unable to make it work properly without CC glitches. It´s like my Midi Modwheel movements are driving kontakt crazy :(


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## Inductance (Mar 6, 2018)

I've been using Cakewalk since the Pro Audio days in the late 90s (it was one of their Guitar Tracks or Guitar Studios, actually). I'll probably be moving on to Cubase... but I'm also toying with the idea of getting a Mac and trying out Logic, we'll see. At the moment I don't know what I'll miss about it. It's the only DAW I've ever used, so I don't know what perks it has compared to other programs! I'll probably find out when I switch...


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