# Tokyo Scoring Strings: Patch 1.0.5 available (fixed sample offsets)



## Andrew Aversa

Impact Soundworks is thrilled to present our first flagship orchestral string library, *Tokyo Scoring Strings* - available now!








*THE STORY*

Our goal with Tokyo Scoring Strings is to give you the orchestral string sound that has been heard across innumerable world-famous Japanese productions. It features five independently recorded sections (Violins 1, Violins 2, Viola, Cello, Bass) in a typical Japanese ensemble size (8/6/4/4/3) suitable for small and large productions alike.

We began this project in 2019, setting out to work with the finest musicians, engineer, and scoring studio in Japan. Due to both the language barrier & COVID, we had to find the right partners to help manage the project overseas. We connected with some incredible collaborators who have been with us through every step of the journey: our Japanese distributors *Crypton Future Media* and *Sonicwire*, plus the renowned composer *Masaru Yokoyama*.

Mr. Yokoyama, in addition to running a music production company (*MiracleBus*) and orchestral recording contractor (*PlugNote*), has composed for over 100 Japanese films, dramas, and anime series, bringing invaluable experience to the project.

*THE MUSICIANS*

_The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, Attack on Titan, Super Mario Odyssey, My Hero Academia, Final Fantasy XV, The Seven Deadly Sins, Fate/Grand Order, Octopath Traveler, Persona 5, Haikyuu, Xenoblade Chronicles, Tokyo Ghoul_.

All of these incredible scores, and over 600 more, have one thing in common: *Koichiro Muroya Strings*, led by its eponymous founder, violinist Koichiro Muroya. Their exquisite playing can be heard soaring across genres ranging from quiet, emotional anime moments to epic hybrid tracks by composers like Hiroyuki Sawano. Not surprisingly, Muroya Strings is the most in-demand session ensemble in all of Japan - and we were truly honored to record them for this project.

*THE ENGINEER*

The sound of these blockbuster Japanese soundtracks is not _just _superb musicianship and technique. The approach to recording and mixing orchestral scores is fundamentally unique as well. That's why we were equally privileged to work with Japan's top engineer, *Mitsunori Aizawa*, who is responsible for recording & mixing hundreds of world-famous anime, film, TV and video game productions.

Mr. Aizawa is a frequent collaborator of composer Hiroyuki Sawano, and his work can be heard on soundtracks like _Final Fantasy VII Remake, The Promised Neverland, Fruits Basket, Mobile Suit Gundam, Kill la Kill, Monster Hunter, Street Fighter V_, and many of the same soundtracks listed above!

*THE STUDIO*

Of course, the final element in an unforgettable score is an incredible recording space. For that reason, Tokyo Scoring Strings was recorded at *SOUND CITY*. With a truly legendary 60-year history, SOUND CITY has been home to countless beloved recordings for albums and soundtracks alike.

Here are just a small handful of the artists & composers who have returned time and time again to record at SOUND CITY:

Joe Hisaishi, Yoko Kanno, Nobuo Uematsu, Hiroyuki Sawano, Yuki Kajiura, Masashi Hamauzu, Kenji Kawai, Kohei Tanaka, Tatsuro Yamashita, JAM Project, Yasunori Nishiki, Hiroki Kikuta, Miki Higashino, and Jackie Chan (yes, that Jackie Chan!).

Unlike the larger halls and studios of the U.S. and Europe, studios in Japan tend to be built smaller, with rooms that offer a full-bodied sound without excessive reverb tails. SOUND CITY is no exception, giving Tokyo Scoring Strings a tighter, more focused sound that lends itself extremely well to more agile playing.

*THE LIBRARY*

Tokyo Studio Strings will include a well-rounded set of core articulations captured at 24/96 with superb detail. You'll be able to write and mock-up a wide variety of parts from slow & intimate to aggressive & agile, with a particular focus on excellent legato and short notes.

To help record even more authentic performances over the 90+ hours of sessions, we developed some new sampling techniques specifically for this library based on our 11 years of experience. The results should speak for themselves!

*FULL WALKTHROUGH*



*ARTICULATION CONTROL*



*BEHIND THE SCENES - THE STORY*



*THE RECORDINGS*

To give you maximum mix flexibility, the ensemble was captured with over a dozen mics, which have been mixed down to five stereo positions: Close, Decca, Side, Back, and Surround. We’ve also included a Board Mix which features Mr. Aizawa’s own console mix, and is an excellent, efficient way to get that authentic sound instantly.

The library will ship with our latest *Console* FX rack & mixer too, with built-in snapshots to give you a wide range of pre-mixed tones!

*THE ENGINE*

Tokyo Scoring Strings will feature a new Kontakt Player-based engine built from our “Agility” script (see our Ventus libraries to get an idea of what to expect).

There’s lots in store here to help you get great results fast. For example, you’ll be able to use two modes of playing: “real-time” with low-latency, and “lookahead,” which adds a slight latency in exchange for more realistic and idiomatic playback.

You'll also be able to suit TSS to your workflow via our latest iteration of TACT (*Total Articulation Control Technology*) supporting totally custom articulation mapping using any combination of velocity, keyswitch, MIDI CC, note range, pedal, or even multiple rules at once.

*AUDIO DEMOS*



*FULL ARTICULATION LIST*

All sections have identical articulations, dynamic layers, and round robins!

Note too that the Legato & Portamento articulations have *3 actual dynamics*, not simulated (as in many libraries). This goes for ALL dynamics below.

Arco (Sustain) - 5 dynamics, 3 vibrato levels (senza, con, molto)
Bowed Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
Slurred Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
Bowed Portamento - 3 dynamics
Slurred Portamento - 3 dynamics
Rebow - 3 dynamics, 5x rr
Staccato - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
Staccatissimo - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
Spiccato - 4 dynamics, 6x rr
Crisp Spiccato - 2 dynamics, 6x rr
Sforzando - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
Decrescendo - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
Pizzicato - 3 dynamics, 4x rr
Tremolo - 4 dynamics
Trills - 2 dynamics, whole tone & half tone
Releases - natural, excited, and staccato
Harmonics

*PRICING & AVAILABILITY*

*Tokyo Scoring Strings* is available now for Kontakt 6 Player w/ full NKS compatibility!

Intro pricing of $399 will last through December 22, 2021, with $449 MSRP.


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## Sarah Mancuso

My hype levels are at maximum. So excited for this one.


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## David Kudell

Congrats on this project Andrew! A big fan here obviously of the Shreddage and Super Audio Cart libraries and if those are any indication, your first big string library should be awesome as well. And having the string sound of all of those wonderful scores from Japan will be pretty sweet!


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## ChrisSiuMusic

Wait wait wait wait. WHAT??

As a big Nintendo guy growing up with Super Mario scores, I’m hyped.


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## Trash Panda

Love it! Anxiously awaiting Q3.


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## Floris

Interesting! Very curious to hear some audio demos.


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## mybadmemory

Dream come true! 😍


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## Drundfunk

Woaaahh.......


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## mybadmemory

Already hoping for TSW, TSB, and TSP in 2022... 😬


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## Land of Missing Parts

Andrew Aversa said:


> poly legato





Andrew Aversa said:


> “lookahead,”


Polyphonic Legato + Lookahead (a la Birth of Trumpet) is a _formidable _combination!


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## chimuelo

Awesome. Now I‘ll have strings from most major Cities.
Tokyo will sit well with LA, Hollywood, Berlin, London, etc.


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## Crowe

I'm very, very interested in how this one is going to turn out!


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## Peros

holy sh****t...very excited for this. I know it's very early but any chance of an estimated price point?


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## Robert_G

I do not need another string library, but i will absolutely make an exception for this one. This is my favorite style of orchestra bar none. Japanese videogames and anime have had their music orchestrated in Japan for over 30 years and there is no other music in the world like it.

My hype level is maxed out on this one


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## Tom Ferguson

It's going to be awesome Andrew! The library so many of us have been waiting for (whether we realised it or not). GG!


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## Toecutter

I can't take it, was just commenting in another thread about all these new awesome releases. Please keep em coming but wow just wow I need a 5 minute break XD


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## CorgiKing

All of my favorite people are involved with this production. I cannot wait.


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## gtrwll

What's with the sudden influx of great sounding (well, in this case in paper so far) libraries? This does sound promising, as some more recent JRPG games that use the same string orchestra have a really distinct sound (most notably Xenoblade Chronicles 2, which has the most sublime strings).

If you can nail that sound, well...I'm definitely interested.


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## Mr Sakitumi

Very exciting to hear! Was just watching SAO a few nights ago and thinking this very idea!
All these developers coming up with amazing niche libraries and you’re one of them.
I’m sure it will have many other uses, but the initial idea behind this is so good.
Can’t wait to hear this when it comes out! 🙌


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## Consona

Demos or GTFO


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## José Herring

Very intrigued that's for sure. Just wondering why so many sample developers go for smaller sections. I always hope for at least a medium sized 12/10/8/6/4-5 configuration. Is it a cost issue?


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## Tom Ferguson

José Herring said:


> Very intrigued that's for sure. Just wondering why so many sample developers go for smaller sections. I always hope for at least a medium sized 12/10/8/6/4-5 configuration. Is it a cost issue?


Maybe for other libraries, but in this case it is the standard size for Japanese soundtracks. Also the studio is rather small, so a larger section might not even make sense for the studio. 

If you are looking for a more traditional/more symphonic library, this is probably not going to be for you.


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## José Herring

Tom Ferguson said:


> Maybe for other libraries, but in this case it is the standard size for Japanese soundtracks. Also the studio is rather small, so a larger section might not even make sense for the studio.
> 
> If you are looking for a more traditional/more symphonic library, this is probably not going to be for you.


I have about a 1/2 dozen symphonic sized string libraries. But, this library is intriguing because it might just be a different sound. Maybe more TV type sound, I don't know. looking forward to it.


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## M_Helder

Nice.

Finally something new to the table! Hyped.


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## Getsumen

Consona said:


> Demos or GTFO


I don't even think they finished recording yet lol (Or they just finished) 

It's a Q3 release so you might be waiting for a bit


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## Robert_G

Hopefully Brass and Woodwinds will follow. Japanese vgame and anime music love their winds


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## Tom Ferguson

José Herring said:


> I have about a 1/2 dozen symphonic sized string libraries. But, this library is intriguing because it might just be a different sound. Maybe more TV type sound, I don't know. looking forward to it.


Yep, basically a tight and dry, nimble/agile and emotionally immediate sounding string section (at least that's how I interpret the sound of the idiom). The kind of thing that will sound just as great mixed into a pop track (without being so big it's stepping all over the mix) as it does on it's own.


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## Andrew Aversa

José Herring said:


> Very intrigued that's for sure. Just wondering why so many sample developers go for smaller sections. I always hope for at least a medium sized 12/10/8/6/4-5 configuration. Is it a cost issue?


Good question! Japanese productions tend to use smaller ensembles. Part of that is the generally smaller size of studios there, but I think also composers tend to favor a more agile and focused sound. Our team's consensus (both US & Japan) was that this section size was best for the characteristic Japanese string sound. 

If you look at this comparison of library section sizes, the larger sizes are represented pretty well. I count 17 libraries with more than 25 players. On the other hand, there is also a decent cluster of libraries with LESS than 25. But that mid-20 range is not super-well represented!


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## Andrew Aversa

Consona said:


> Demos or GTFO


We'll release our first audio once we have a playable Violins 1 patch. Since we already recorded a prototype in Bulgaria to test our sampling/editing/scripting approach, I don't think you will have to wait terribly long for that. I'm optimistic about being able to play something by end of May. 



Peros said:


> holy sh****t...very excited for this. I know it's very early but any chance of an estimated price point?


Targeting $399 MSRP, intro price $349. We feel this should be spot on given the amount of content and what it delivers in terms of sound and playability.


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## mybadmemory

José Herring said:


> Very intrigued that's for sure. Just wondering why so many sample developers go for smaller sections. I always hope for at least a medium sized 12/10/8/6/4-5 configuration. Is it a cost issue?


I believe it’s also partly to counter the 100 virtual string players you easily end up with while composing with a keyboard and DAW, since few people stay within the one part per section or proper voice leading paradigms.

We often play full chords, write more parts that what is possible for a section without true divisi, and so on. People often use cellos for ostinatos, pads, and legato lines at the same time, so smaller sections kind of counter all of this in a way?


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## Pokestir

There is no string library on the market yet that is like this yet, I am very excited!


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## Haakond

Awesome! I thought I had enough string libraries, but this will be a nice addition. Looking forward to hear more


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## chocobitz825

Brilliant! I’m glad to see someone jump out to capture the Japanese string sound. We use smaller sections in general which often leads to a tighter and more intimate feel. I will definitely support this. Sure I need another string library like a teen needs a pimple, but this I believe will be special!


sound city studio is a fantastic studio. It’s sound is deceptively good, despite what you might think when you first see it. Honestly it wouldn’t have been the first studio I would have thought of but it’s got a great build and squeezing a small section in there no doubt resulted in a close sound with lots of control. I can see why Yokoyama and Muroya seems to favor it.


I’ve done some band, vocal and quartet recordings there and they were all just classic.

Can’t wait to hear more about this!


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## dzilizzi

Can't wait to see how this turns out!


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## Andrew Aversa

Our top three picks for studio were Victor, Sound City, and Bunkamura. All of them have incredible legacies and history and can support an ensemble like this. When we did a blind test, comparing some previous recordings from these studios, our team liked Sound City a bit more. (Even though it's just a bit smaller, and the basses end up centered in Mr. Aizawa's typical recording setup. But hey, it sounds great that way.)

However, most importantly for sampling, Sound City has superb isolation. Under normal circumstances, a little bit of bleed from another room is not going to drown out a full string section. But when you are recording pianissimo dynamics, one note at a time, with at most 8 players in unison, suddenly isolation REALLY REALLY matters. And thankfully Sound City is whisper quiet in that department.


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## chocobitz825

Andrew Aversa said:


> Our top three picks for studio were Victor, Sound City, and Bunkamura. All of them have incredible legacies and history and can support an ensemble like this. When we did a blind test, comparing some previous recordings from these studios, our team liked Sound City a bit more. (Even though it's just a bit smaller, and the basses end up centered in Mr. Aizawa's typical recording setup. But hey, it sounds great that way.)
> 
> However, most importantly for sampling, Sound City has superb isolation. Under normal circumstances, a little bit of bleed from another room is not going to drown out a full string section. But when you are recording pianissimo dynamics, one note at a time, with at most 8 players in unison, suddenly isolation REALLY REALLY matters. And thankfully Sound City is whisper quiet in that department.


Exactly the two that would have come to mind for a slightly larger section. No doubt you guys made the right choice with sound city. While victor and bunkamura are also great for recording, for the needs of recording a library you hit it on the head! I’ve been enthusiastic about some attacking japanese strings, and I’m overjoyed that crypton helped play a part in this.

instabuy from me!


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## ChrisSiuMusic

Andrew Aversa said:


> Our top three picks for studio were Victor, Sound City, and Bunkamura. All of them have incredible legacies and history and can support an ensemble like this. When we did a blind test, comparing some previous recordings from these studios, our team liked Sound City a bit more. (Even though it's just a bit smaller, and the basses end up centered in Mr. Aizawa's typical recording setup. But hey, it sounds great that way.)
> 
> However, most importantly for sampling, Sound City has superb isolation. Under normal circumstances, a little bit of bleed from another room is not going to drown out a full string section. But when you are recording pianissimo dynamics, one note at a time, with at most 8 players in unison, suddenly isolation REALLY REALLY matters. And thankfully Sound City is whisper quiet in that department.


Lovely Andrew! Would you say this library can handle sweeping romantic lines as easily as the nimble and agile?


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## filipjonathan

Ooo I love that it's a smaller ensemble!!


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## mybadmemory

ChrisSiuMusic said:


> Lovely Andrew! Would you say this library can handle sweeping romantic lines as easily as the nimble and agile?


No sweeping romantic = no Chris Siu. 😁


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## ChrisSiuMusic

mybadmemory said:


> No sweeping romantic = no Chris Siu. 😁


I've been exposed


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## Tom Ferguson

ChrisSiuMusic said:


> I've been exposed


This is being created in collaboration with the composer of Your Lie in April. I think you'll be alright 

If any string library has a chance of making you cry, this is likely to be the ONE! haha


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## Ihnoc

I am very excited.


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## constaneum

Can't wait. !!!!


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## muziksculp

@Andrew Aversa ,

*Congratulations ! *

I'm so excited, and eager to use *TSS* once it's released.

Looking forward to hear some demos, and please keep updating us here.  

Cheers,
Muziksculp


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## JDK88

I hope it sounds like what I'm hoping it sounds like.


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## Kristoben

Ever since you first talked about this library I've been so excited for it. A true dream! Hyped for the demos!


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## AEF

Wow really excited for this. Any info on specific articulations? Variety of shorts? Thanks!


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## Tom Ferguson

AEF said:


> Wow really excited for this. Any info on specific articulations? Variety of shorts? Thanks!


You can just read through the last few pages of this thread and you'll see most of the specs : )






String libraries: Do you prefer having true recordings of violins 1 + 2? (Tokyo Scoring Strings pre-discussion)


A common technique for string libraries is to use offline repitching/EQ and the RR pool to generate a set of second violins samples, which saves a lot of recording time. This time can then be spent on recording other content. I'm curious to hear opinions on what you value most: taking the time...




vi-control.net


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## sostenuto

Tom Ferguson said:


> Just read through the last few pages of this thread and you'll see most of the specs : )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> String libraries: Do you prefer having true recordings of violins 1 + 2? (Tokyo Scoring Strings pre-discussion)
> 
> 
> A common technique for string libraries is to use offline repitching/EQ and the RR pool to generate a set of second violins samples, which saves a lot of recording time. This time can then be spent on recording other content. I'm curious to hear opinions on what you value most: taking the time...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vi-control.net


Just deleted several current 'leanings' 'til TSS release. Also deleted major GAS for few months !


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## AEF

Tom Ferguson said:


> You can just read through the last few pages of this thread and you'll see most of the specs : )
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> String libraries: Do you prefer having true recordings of violins 1 + 2? (Tokyo Scoring Strings pre-discussion)
> 
> 
> A common technique for string libraries is to use offline repitching/EQ and the RR pool to generate a set of second violins samples, which saves a lot of recording time. This time can then be spent on recording other content. I'm curious to hear opinions on what you value most: taking the time...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vi-control.net


Thanks for this!


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## IdealSequenceG




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## holywilly

I'm hoping Tokyo Scoring Strings can achieve the tone like this!


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## oooooooooooooooooh

Welp, this has quickly become my most anticipated sample library release. Very _very_ excited to hear more!

Side note, also very excited to support fellow Marylanders


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## AndreBoulard

this should be a hit man. huge fan of all of it!


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## tcb

looking forward!


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## mostexcellent

This looks awesome! It’s probably too early to speculate but I’m hoping that there’re plans to record brass and winds in this style as well.


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## Ian Dorsch

Sounds amazing. I'm so excited for you guys!


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## thestickman8

I have absolutely never been more excited for a single library before!! The soundtracks that Koichiro Muroya Strings and Mitsunori Aizawa have worked on have been, by far, the most impactful on my development as a composer. Wow, I cannot wait.


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## jason3.14

Been waiting for this news!!!! So hyped! Would be even more hyped if we can get some demos of Attack on Titan / Sawano covers!


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## Jk86

YES YES YES!! 🙌


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## Pixelpoet1985

Sounds interesting! I don’t really need more libraries, but it’s always exciting what other developers’ approaches are (recording- and scripting-wise), especially if it’s new to them. Looking forward to hearing it!

But, please, don’t use “bowed” legatos exclusively! 😅


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## mybadmemory

Pixelpoet1985 said:


> Sounds interesting! I don’t really need more libraries, but it’s always exciting what other developers’ approaches are (recording- and scripting-wise), especially if it’s new to them. Looking forward to hearing it!
> 
> But, please, don’t use “bowed” legatos exclusively! 😅


One of the main things with this library is nice slurred legatos.


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## Piotrek K.

Andrew Aversa said:


> Targeting $399 MSRP, intro price $349. We feel this should be spot on given the amount of content and what it delivers in terms of sound and playability.


350$? Sounds beyond awesome!

@Andrew Aversa I love how open you are about development, all those names involved etc. It's really interesting to read about and all those details make it really worth waiting for. Plus it truly sounds like a dream come true to a person who grown up on Uematsu, Kanno, Hisaishi and tons of other Japanese composers. If you nail it you've got my dollars!


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## GNP

JOE HISASHIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII


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## Tom Ferguson

Pixelpoet1985 said:


> Sounds interesting! I don’t really need more libraries, but it’s always exciting what other developers’ approaches are (recording- and scripting-wise), especially if it’s new to them. Looking forward to hearing it!
> 
> But, please, don’t use “bowed” legatos exclusively! 😅


Both down AND up bow legato for bowed and slurs! (+portamento)


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## Sovereign

Tom Ferguson said:


> Both down AND up bow legato for bowed and slurs!


Out of curiosity, will the transitions be sampled like CSS, meaning the transitions are captured longer than usual?


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## KallumS

This is probably the most excited I’ve been for a string library. Can’t wait.


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## Alex Fraser

As someone who's put hours into BOTW recently, this sounds very, very cool.


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## chrisav

Wooo finally an official thread for this 😁 Really looking forward to the first demo...


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## Tom Ferguson

Sovereign said:


> Out of curiosity, will the transitions be sampled like CSS, meaning the transitions are captured longer than usual?


You'll have to ask Andrew about that but... probably? I mean he has a look ahead feature to select the best legato type for the transition intelligently, considering that I doubt he'll be deleting any transition he doesn't need to.


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## mybadmemory

The two modes for recording and playback, with minimum and maximum delay is something I wish everyone adopted. That in conjunction with having the maximum delay consistent across everything so you just have to compensate with one value across the entire library is fantastic.

The only thing missing then is for our DAWs to be able to turn all this on and off *automatically* at recording and playback, so it's truly 100% automated. That would be the future.


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## Tom Ferguson

mybadmemory said:


> The two modes for recording and playback, with minimum and maximum delay is something I wish everyone adopted. That in conjunction with having the maximum delay consistent across everything so you just have to compensate with one value across the entire library is fantastic.
> 
> The only thing missing then is for our DAWs to be able to turn all this on and off *automatically* at recording and playback, so it's truly 100% automated. That would be the future.


Agreed!


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## mybadmemory

Tom Ferguson said:


> Agreed!


I'm gonna keep repeating this in every thread about sample delay until it happens.


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## dariusofwest

So excited for this!!! :D


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## Go To 11

Andrew Aversa said:


> We'll release our first audio once we have a playable Violins 1 patch. Since we already recorded a prototype in Bulgaria to test our sampling/editing/scripting approach, I don't think you will have to wait terribly long for that. I'm optimistic about being able to play something by end of May.
> 
> 
> Targeting $399 MSRP, intro price $349. We feel this should be spot on given the amount of content and what it delivers in terms of sound and playability.


Thank you for the transparency! And congrats - this looks like a great project.


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## Go To 11

Studio info and pics here. Reminds me of the size of British Grove in the UK where Spitfire Orchestral Swarm was recorded. Centre basses sounds cool!






スタジオ｜SoundCity サウンド・シティ｜オーディオ・ビデオの総合ポストプロダクション


オーディオ・ビデオの総合ポストプロダクションサウンド・シティ




www.soundcity-w.com


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## chocobitz825

Go To 11 said:


> Studio info and pics here. Reminds me of the size of British Grove in the UK where Spitfire Orchestral Swarm was recorded. Centre basses sounds cool!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> スタジオ｜SoundCity サウンド・シティ｜オーディオ・ビデオの総合ポストプロダクション
> 
> 
> オーディオ・ビデオの総合ポストプロダクションサウンド・シティ
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.soundcity-w.com


haha this actually requires clarification. Which SoundCity studio did Impact go with? there are a few locations and a few rooms within the various studios. I had assumed perhaps it was the Setagaya studio, but Sound City has a few locations. Would be nice to find out which location and which room was used.


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## Go To 11

chocobitz825 said:


> haha this actually requires clarification. Which SoundCity studio did Impact go with? there are a few locations and a few rooms within the various studios. I had assumed perhaps it was the Setagaya studio, but Sound City has a few locations. Would be nice to find out which location and which room was used.


Great point! I'd love them to chime in.


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## Andrew Aversa

The guess above is correct


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## Go To 11

Andrew Aversa said:


> The guess above is correct


Lovely!


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## chocobitz825

Andrew Aversa said:


> The guess above is correct


A-Studio, excellent!


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## Drundfunk

Does it come with a waifu or a catgirl?............Ok sry, I'll see myself out...... .


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## maestro2be

All I can say is this is super cool. Just reading the first post talking about the Legend of Zelda and all the others gave me an incredible flashback to my life. I can't wait to see how successful these turn out to be. This might be a release day purchase for me.

I also have a hunch my brother who is an anime obsessive guru will probably buy me these just to make him music. I should send him the link to this thread .

Game making musicians will be singing praise on this if it's successful. Can't wait!


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## Ruffian Price

mybadmemory said:


> The only thing missing then is for our DAWs to be able to turn all this on and off *automatically* at recording and playback, so it's truly 100% automated. That would be the future.


Plugins can change their reported delay at runtime, so in theory all you'd need is for NI to add an appropriate function to the Kontakt scripting system 🤔


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## Toecutter

Andrew Aversa said:


> Targeting $399 MSRP, intro price $349. We feel this should be spot on given the amount of content and what it delivers in terms of sound and playability.


If the sound is right, that's a fair deal! Take your time and make it happen, I've been bummed out with some new strings that don't live up to promises on paper. TSS can THE one


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## VSriHarsha

Sarah Mancuso said:


> My hype levels are at maximum. So excited for this one.


I am sure the library sounds beautiful. I use one of their products & I love it.


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## VSriHarsha

Andrew Aversa said:


> Impact Soundworks is thrilled to officially announce our first flagship orchestral string library:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *THE STORY*
> 
> Our goal with Tokyo Scoring Strings is to give you the orchestral string sound that has been heard across innumerable world-famous Japanese productions. It features five independently recorded sections (Violins 1, Violins 2, Viola, Cello, Bass) in a typical Japanese ensemble size (8/6/4/4/3) suitable for small and large productions alike.
> 
> We began this project in 2019, setting out to work with the finest musicians, engineer, and scoring studio in Japan. Due to both the language barrier & COVID, we had to find the right partners to help manage the project overseas. We connected with some incredible collaborators who have been with us through every step of the journey: our Japanese distributors *Crypton Future Media* and *Sonicwire*, plus the renowned composer *Masaru Yokoyama*.
> 
> Mr. Yokoyama, in addition to running a music production company (*MiracleBus*) and orchestral recording contractor (*PlugNote*), has composed for over 100 Japanese films, dramas, and anime series, bringing invaluable experience to the project.
> 
> *THE MUSICIANS*
> 
> _The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, Attack on Titan, Super Mario Odyssey, My Hero Academia, Final Fantasy XV, The Seven Deadly Sins, Fate/Grand Order, Octopath Traveler, Persona 5, Haikyuu, Xenoblade Chronicles, Tokyo Ghoul_.
> 
> All of these incredible scores, and over 600 more, have one thing in common: *Koichiro Muroya Strings*, led by its eponymous founder, violinist Koichiro Muroya. Their exquisite playing can be heard soaring across genres ranging from quiet, emotional anime moments to epic hybrid tracks by composers like Hiroyuki Sawano. Not surprisingly, Muroya Strings is the most in-demand session ensemble in all of Japan - and we were truly honored to record them for this project.
> 
> *THE ENGINEER*
> 
> The sound of these blockbuster Japanese soundtracks is not _just _superb musicianship and technique. The approach to recording and mixing orchestral scores is fundamentally unique as well. That's why we were equally privileged to work with Japan's top engineer, *Mitsunori Aizawa*, who is responsible for recording & mixing hundreds of world-famous anime, film, TV and video game productions.
> 
> Mr. Aizawa is a frequent collaborator of composer Hiroyuki Sawano, and his work can be heard on soundtracks like _Final Fantasy VII Remake, The Promised Neverland, Fruits Basket, Mobile Suit Gundam, Kill la Kill, Monster Hunter, Street Fighter V_, and many of the same soundtracks listed above!
> 
> *THE STUDIO*
> 
> Of course, the final element in an unforgettable score is an incredible recording space. For that reason, Tokyo Scoring Strings was recorded at *SOUND CITY*. With a truly legendary 60-year history, SOUND CITY has been home to countless beloved recordings for albums and soundtracks alike.
> 
> Here are just a small handful of the artists & composers who have returned time and time again to record at SOUND CITY:
> 
> Joe Hisaishi, Yoko Kanno, Nobuo Uematsu, Hiroyuki Sawano, Yuki Kajiura, Masashi Hamauzu, Kenji Kawai, Kohei Tanaka, Tatsuro Yamashita, JAM Project, Yasunori Nishiki, Hiroki Kikuta, Miki Higashino, and Jackie Chan (yes, that Jackie Chan!).
> 
> Unlike the larger halls and studios of the U.S. and Europe, studios in Japan tend to be built smaller, with rooms that offer a full-bodied sound without excessive reverb tails. SOUND CITY is no exception, giving Tokyo Scoring Strings a tighter, more focused sound that lends itself extremely well to more agile playing.
> 
> *THE LIBRARY*
> 
> Tokyo Studio Strings will include a well-rounded set of core articulations captured at 24/96 with superb detail. You'll be able to write and mock-up a wide variety of parts from slow & intimate to aggressive & agile, with a particular focus on excellent legato and short notes.
> 
> To help record even more authentic performances over the 90+ hours of sessions, we developed some new sampling techniques specifically for this library based on our 11 years of experience. The results should speak for themselves!
> 
> We'll provide specific information about articulations, dynamics, RR, and more soon.
> 
> *THE RECORDINGS*
> 
> To give you maximum mix flexibility, the ensemble was captured with over a dozen mics, which have been mixed down to five stereo positions: Close, Decca, Side, Back, and Surround. We’ve also included a Board Mix which features Mr. Aizawa’s own console mix, and is an excellent, efficient way to get that authentic sound instantly.
> 
> The library will ship with our latest *Console* FX rack & mixer too, with built-in snapshots to give you a wide range of pre-mixed tones!
> 
> *THE ENGINE*
> 
> Tokyo Scoring Strings will feature a new Kontakt Player-based engine built from our “Agility” script (see our Ventus libraries to get an idea of what to expect).
> 
> That means you’ll have poly legato, microtuning, scale locking, and multi-part harmony generation out of the box!
> 
> But there’s much more in store here to help you get great results fast. For example, you’ll be able to use two modes of playing: “real-time” with low-latency, and “lookahead,” which adds a slight latency in exchange for more realistic and idiomatic playback.
> 
> You'll also be able to suit TSS to your workflow via our latest iteration of TACT (*Total Articulation Control Technology*) supporting totally custom articulation mapping using any combination of velocity, keyswitch, MIDI CC, note range, pedal, or even multiple rules at once.
> 
> *WHEN!?*
> 
> We're shooting for a release no later than Q3 2021, but watch this space - we've expanded our team _solely to work on this project_, and we're as excited about it as anyone!
> 
> As of this post we've just wrapped up principal recording, with over 90 hours of studio time logged, and one _very tired Andrew_.


Irrespective of the ensemble size, I am pretty sure people love the library. The tone of ISW libraries, in the context of the Orchestral line, is quite pleasing & ISW embraced it with full functionality, technically & mechanically. Despite the price, I think it stands within the customer taste & the pouring line of libraries by other devs.


----------



## icecoolpool

Sounds great, a lot of us were talking about how best to capture that sound "in-the-box" so there is a clear market for this. I can´t help but think this will make a killer combination alongside BBCSO Pro.


----------



## hessproject

Looking forward to this!


----------



## lgmcben

Sold. 

This should be as close to Uematsu Strings as I'll ever get


----------



## chocobitz825

Probably just a good time to remind people to keep their expectations realistic. I absolutely expect a great product, but I hope people will be able to enjoy the product for what it is and not what we imagine it could be based on the composers being referenced here.

My most realistic expectations are a unique tone/sound quality compared to the alternatives, and a solid workable interface. Everything else, I’m welcome to be surprised.


----------



## mybadmemory

chocobitz825 said:


> Probably just a good time to remind people to keep their expectations realistic. I absolutely expect a great product, but I hope people will be able to enjoy the product for what it is and not what we imagine it could be based on the composers being referenced here.
> 
> My most realistic expectations are a unique tone/sound quality compared to the alternatives, and a solid workable interface. Everything else, I’m welcome to be surprised.


I'm totally expecting it to instantly transform myself and my skills into Yasunori Nishiki.


----------



## jason3.14

chocobitz825 said:


> Probably just a good time to remind people to keep their expectations realistic. I absolutely expect a great product, but I hope people will be able to enjoy the product for what it is and not what we imagine it could be based on the composers being referenced here.
> 
> My most realistic expectations are a unique tone/sound quality compared to the alternatives, and a solid workable interface. Everything else, I’m welcome to be surprised.


Wise words!


----------



## maestro2be

jason3.14 said:


> Wise words!


That shall be ignored! 😁


----------



## jason3.14

maestro2be said:


> That shall be ignored! 😁


Probably!


----------



## Eduardo Lopez

Super Saiyan 3 hype achieved! I really want the tone of that room and a simple UI, with simple polished articulations and a great legato. I´d rather have 4-5 simple articulations than 17 molto Sul tasto under the bridge with a felt ice cream cone articulations... 🤹‍♂️


----------



## chapbot

Impact Soundworks!!! I am so excited about this library I could pass out! What I'm hoping for is a hyper realistic studio string sound so please don't put on any noise reduction LOL ...or if you must, how about a version with and a version without, kind of like Nashville scoring strings does it.

It seems like when companies apply so much noise reduction it sucks the realism out of a string library and makes it sound synthy.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Eduardo Lopez said:


> Super Saiyan 3 hype achieved! I really want the tone of that room and a simple UI, with simple polished articulations and a great legato. I´d rather have 4-5 simple articulations than 17 molto Sul tasto under the bridge with a felt ice cream cone articulations... 🤹‍♂️


We're still going through everything but the core set is looking like: sustain vib, sustain non vib, tremolo, trills HT, trills WT, spiccato, staccato, staccatissimo, slurred legato, slurred portamento, bow change legato, bow change portamento, pizzicato, sforzando (2 lengths), and ff decrescendo (2 lengths). 



chapbot said:


> Impact Soundworks!!! I am so excited about this library I could pass out! What I'm hoping for is a hyper realistic studio string sound so please don't put on any noise reduction LOL ...or if you must, how about a version with and a version without, kind of like Nashville scoring strings does it.
> 
> It seems like when companies apply so much noise reduction it sucks the realism out of a string library and makes it sound synthy.


My findings so far is that not much noise reduction is necessary. ~10dB or so of broadband removal is giving us good results (that's not a whole lot) so that's what we are running with for the first sample cutting iteration.


----------



## chocobitz825

heres a nice video of a jazz ensemble in the room.


----------



## Tom Ferguson

chocobitz825 said:


> heres a nice video of a jazz ensemble in the room.



Makes me think it would be REALLY cool to get some drum kit recordings in there the same way they would for a recording like this or octopath etc!


----------



## jason3.14

Tom Ferguson said:


> Makes me think it would be REALLY cool to get some drum kit recordings in there the same way they would for a recording like this or octopath etc!


Completely agree! I've been struggling a lot getting drums to sit in that kind of space on my mockups (although probably my fault).


----------



## Oakran

I'm eager to try this library !
A cool thing would be to have some nice RR Tenutos (x3 or more if possible) or playable loure patches. A lot of strings libraries focus on hyper realistic legatos but I think we still seriously lack some usable supporting strings articulations.
For me that would be a plus considering how crowded the market is right now.


----------



## Eptesicus

Sounds very cool. I am excited to hear what it is like.


----------



## RMH

Amazing!! It’s great news!

I'm looking forward to it!


----------



## RMH

chocobitz825 said:


> heres a nice video of a jazz ensemble in the room.



cool!!
@Andrew Aversa 
Andrew! Do you have a plan for a band brass like this video? Ask me out of curiosity. I wish I had this, too...

Oh, and I'm sure the news about the string will create more amazing sounds in my string library already enough!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

If TSS is successful, we would probably tackle orchestral brass oriented toward scoring before we did big band/jazz band-style brass, but I wouldn't rule it out. I DO love Japanese jazz music especially J-fusion.


----------



## DimensionsTomorrow

Andrew Aversa said:


> If TSS is successful, we would probably tackle orchestral brass oriented toward scoring before we did big band/jazz band-style brass, but I wouldn't rule it out. I DO love Japanese jazz music especially J-fusion.


I’d be interested in that as well! By the way, I’m an American based in Tokyo (22 years now, most of that working as a translator). Reach out if you find yourself in the neighborhood post-pandemic.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

日本に行ったことが一回あります！でもその時、全然日本語が話せませんでした。十年間前に奥さんはコンサートで歌って、一緒に観光しました。TSSのために、私は行きたかったけど、コロナだから、行けませんでした。しょうがないね。。。


----------



## chocobitz825

Andrew Aversa said:


> 日本に行ったことが一回あります！でもその時、全然日本語が話せませんでした。十年間前に奥さんはコンサートで歌って、一緒に観光しました。TSSのために、私は行きたかったけど、コロナだから、行けませんでした。しょうがないね。。。


仕方ないな。。


----------



## holywilly

すべてが大丈夫になります


----------



## Andrew Aversa

chocobitz825 said:


> 仕方ないな。。


Oops, I meant to write it in kanji :D 

I've been studying for about 2 years, not nearly enough since I only have a couple hours a week. But I know about ~650 kanji, and should be at JLPT N4 by the end of the year...


----------



## Tfis

私のホバークラフトはうなぎで満たされています


----------



## constaneum

Andrew Aversa said:


> If TSS is successful, we would probably tackle orchestral brass oriented toward scoring before we did big band/jazz band-style brass, but I wouldn't rule it out. I DO love Japanese jazz music especially J-fusion.


we're lacking that brass sound of Japanese game and animation music. the brass libraries available in the current market are more focusing on Hollywood sound.


----------



## constaneum

Tfis said:


> 私のホバークラフトはうなぎで満たされています


何 ？ haha


----------



## Trash Panda

Nani???


----------



## galactic orange

何でやねん！


----------



## mybadmemory

But when will we get to hear something? :D

(Anxiously listening to Octopath Traveler in the meantime)


----------



## Toecutter

mybadmemory said:


> But when will we get to hear something? :D
> 
> (Anxiously listening to Octopath Traveler in the meantime)


Soon™


Andrew Aversa said:


> We'll release our first audio once we have a playable Violins 1 patch. Since we already recorded a prototype in Bulgaria to test our sampling/editing/scripting approach, I don't think you will have to wait terribly long for that. I'm optimistic about being able to play something by end of May.


----------



## Sovereign

Andrew Aversa said:


> We'll release our first audio once we have a playable Violins 1 patch. Since we already recorded a prototype in Bulgaria to test our sampling/editing/scripting approach, I don't think you will have to wait terribly long for that. I'm optimistic about being able to play something by end of May.


When implementing the legatos please also include an option to retain as much from before and after the transitions, similar to CSS (CSS for example includes a minimum of 2-3s after the transition before any crossfade happens, but I'm not sure how much you guys recorded).


----------



## DimensionsTomorrow

Andrew Aversa said:


> It features five independently recorded sections (Violins 1, Violins 2, Viola, Cello, Bass) in a typical Japanese ensemble size (8/6/4/4/3) suitable for small and large productions alike.


I found this information really interesting. Does anyone know the typical setups for woodwinds and brass in Japanese ensembles?


----------



## mybadmemory

DimensionsTomorrow said:


> I found this information really interesting. Does anyone know the typical setups for woodwinds and brass in Japanese ensembles?


From my understanding woodwinds are usually used in a more soloistic way rather than as a full section, and the brass section follow a smaller approach similar to the strings.

I’ll let someone who actually knows chime in though. I’m mostly guessing.


----------



## jason3.14

Hopefully not too premature, but wonder what kind of reverb setting you'd choose for the genre, or that you predict you'd use with TSS? Say, if you were trying to go for music in FF7 Remake. Some kind of medium hall reverb, or large chamber?


----------



## EvilDragon

constaneum said:


> we're lacking that brass sound of Japanese game and animation music. the brass libraries available in the current market are more focusing on Hollywood sound.


Actually, you could probably get relatively close to that dry brass sound that Japanese composers like to use with ISW's Bravura library.

But surely, having the whole orchestra recorded in the same setting as TSS would most certainly be next level awesome.



jason3.14 said:


> Hopefully not too premature, but wonder what kind of reverb setting you'd choose for the genre, or that you predict you'd use with TSS? Say, if you were trying to go for music in FF7 Remake. Some kind of medium hall reverb, or large chamber?



Mr. Aizawa likes to use Bricasti M7 reverb unit. Not sure which setting on it, but I bet @Andrew Aversa can chip in. So, for full immersion, you should probably get Seventh Heaven if you haven't already.


----------



## Markrs

EvilDragon said:


> you should probably get Seventh Heaven if you haven't already.


You can also use the free Bricasti M7 IRs done by Samplicity





Samplicity's Bricasti M7 Impulse Response Library v1.1 - Samplicity


Samplicity has created a new and FREE Impulse Response Library, based on the immensely popular and highly acclaimed Bricasti M7 reverb unit.



web.archive.org


----------



## Jacob Cadmus

This is the most excited I’ve ever been for a library. Hoping to get that Yoko Kanno Wolf’s Rain tone that I’ve always wanted.


----------



## EvilDragon

Markrs said:


> You can also use the free Bricasti M7 IRs done by Samplicity
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Samplicity's Bricasti M7 Impulse Response Library v1.1 - Samplicity
> 
> 
> Samplicity has created a new and FREE Impulse Response Library, based on the immensely popular and highly acclaimed Bricasti M7 reverb unit.
> 
> 
> 
> web.archive.org


You could, but Seventh Heaven gets way closer, because what Bricasti does cannot be fully captured solely with IRs.


----------



## muziksculp

Hi,

Will TSS be able to get very close to Joe Hisaishi's Orchestral Anime scores strings ? or is TSS aiming for a different type of sound of Japanese Anime Strings sound character ?

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## Kurosawa

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> Will TSS be able to get very close to Joe Hisaishi's Orchestral Anime scores strings ? or is TSS aiming for a different type of sound of Japanese Anime Strings sound character ?
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp


I think for Hisaishi Symphonic Strings recorded in a hall should be suitable, as Spirited Away was recorded in a concert hall for example


----------



## muziksculp

Kurosawa said:


> I think for Hisaishi Symphonic Strings recorded in a hall should be suitable, as Spirited Away was recorded in a concert hall for example


Yes, I agree. His Strings are more on the Symphonic Size. So I guess something like Spitfire Symphonic Strings, or Berlin Symphonic Strings, VSL Synchron Strings Pro, will be more suitable for the Hisaishi Strings Style. 

Thanks.


----------



## EvilDragon

Depends which era Hisaishi. 

But as mentioned, Sound City studio is not an orchestral hall, and ensemble size recorded is in post #1. You can deduce what this will be appropriate for.


----------



## jason3.14

EvilDragon said:


> Actually, you could probably get relatively close to that dry brass sound that Japanese composers like to use with ISW's Bravura library.
> 
> But surely, having the whole orchestra recorded in the same setting as TSS would most certainly be next level awesome.
> 
> 
> 
> Mr. Aizawa likes to use Bricasti M7 reverb unit. Not sure which setting on it, but I bet @Andrew Aversa can chip in. So, for full immersion, you should probably get Seventh Heaven if you haven't already.


Thanks @EvilDragon for the great info! The GAS is building... :O


----------



## RMH

@Andrew Aversa 
Andrew! When will it be possible to watch short demo music or trailer videos?


----------



## Trash Panda

jason3.14 said:


> Thanks @EvilDragon for the great info! The GAS is building... :O


You might want to look into some GAS-X or you might be in for a rough night.


----------



## constaneum

we may hear some samples in a month time i guess. hehe


----------



## EvilDragon

Perhaps even sooner!


----------



## constaneum

EvilDragon said:


> Perhaps even sooner!


You have some insights? Heheh


----------



## Toecutter

EvilDragon said:


> Perhaps even sooner!


Can we negotiate more details? How about... page 15? 

You know what you have to do vic!


----------



## FireGS

Toecutter said:


> Can we negotiate more details? How about... page 15?
> 
> You know what you have to do vic!


----------



## Trash Panda

EvilDragon said:


> Perhaps even sooner!


Or perhaps later!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

We have a playable Violins1 patch now! I posted some very very early examples on the VI Discord but we'd like to keep working on it. Here's our to-do list:

1. Add more parameters to adjust legato and portamento. The legato right now already sounds really good to me, especially if I A/B the same MIDI against other libraries. However it can be even better if we adjust the fade logic more granularly.

2. Manual volume adjustments to match articulations, so that "f" staccato doesn't sound way quieter or way louder than "f" sustain (a peeve of ours when using other libraries - the dynamics should have consistent output levels). But I say "manual" because we're not normalizing the whole library.

3. Implement rebow samples (8x RR) and trigger logic

After that I'll feel comfortable posting some demos. So maybe about.. a week?


----------



## davidnaroth

Cant explain how excited I am for these :O


----------



## Toecutter

Andrew Aversa said:


> We have a playable Violins1 patch now! I posted some very very early examples on the VI Discord but we'd like to keep working on it. Here's our to-do list:
> 
> 1. Add more parameters to adjust legato and portamento. The legato right now already sounds really good to me, especially if I A/B the same MIDI against other libraries. However it can be even better if we adjust the fade logic more granularly.
> 
> 2. Manual volume adjustments to match articulations, so that "f" staccato doesn't sound way quieter or way louder than "f" sustain (a peeve of ours when using other libraries - the dynamics should have consistent output levels). But I say "manual" because we're not normalizing the whole library.
> 
> 3. Implement rebow samples (8x RR) and trigger logic
> 
> After that I'll feel comfortable posting some demos. So maybe about.. a week?


Just heard the snippets and damn they sound good! Even more excited now, ISW libraries (the ones I own ofc) have that instantaneous gratification thing, they sound and play excellent out of the box 

This example feels like I'm right next to the KMS and I heard A LOT of recordings by them in the past 6 months (imagine my excitement when you announced TSS) most of my briefs have tracks from a series they have done and even in this early early early first example I already can tell you nailed their essence. Impressive transitions, the KMS have a very peculiar way of playing
View attachment tss_scale.mp3


Keep up the good work, this is promising!


----------



## jason3.14

Andrew Aversa said:


> We have a playable Violins1 patch now! I posted some very very early examples on the VI Discord but we'd like to keep working on it. Here's our to-do list:
> 
> 1. Add more parameters to adjust legato and portamento. The legato right now already sounds really good to me, especially if I A/B the same MIDI against other libraries. However it can be even better if we adjust the fade logic more granularly.
> 
> 2. Manual volume adjustments to match articulations, so that "f" staccato doesn't sound way quieter or way louder than "f" sustain (a peeve of ours when using other libraries - the dynamics should have consistent output levels). But I say "manual" because we're not normalizing the whole library.
> 
> 3. Implement rebow samples (8x RR) and trigger logic
> 
> After that I'll feel comfortable posting some demos. So maybe about.. a week?


Loved what I heard so far, and hyped for more!


----------



## muziksculp

Where on Discord can I find Andrew's posts about TSS ?


----------



## jason3.14

muziksculp said:


> Where on Discord can I find Andrew's posts about TSS ?


You can find the discord server here:






Chat Room


Click the link below to be redirected to the Discord chat room. https://discord.gg/0vF7cfyHaTDLf8YB This is a chat server used and maintained by VIC members, composers and music industry folks who sometimes prefer the more 'conversational' experience of instant messaging. Everyone welcome!




vi-control.net





Once you get to VI Composer Discord, after looking around, I found the posts under the #software category.


----------



## chapbot

Andrew Aversa said:


> We have a playable Violins1 patch now! I posted some very very early examples on the VI Discord but we'd like to keep working on it. Here's our to-do list:
> 
> 1. Add more parameters to adjust legato and portamento. The legato right now already sounds really good to me, especially if I A/B the same MIDI against other libraries. However it can be even better if we adjust the fade logic more granularly.
> 
> 2. Manual volume adjustments to match articulations, so that "f" staccato doesn't sound way quieter or way louder than "f" sustain (a peeve of ours when using other libraries - the dynamics should have consistent output levels). But I say "manual" because we're not normalizing the whole library.
> 
> 3. Implement rebow samples (8x RR) and trigger logic
> 
> After that I'll feel comfortable posting some demos. So maybe about.. a week?


I just wanted to say how much I appreciate you giving updates, explaining the process and posting little sound clip snippets. Unlike other developers (who I'm really fed up with) who tease a release, tease info, then never give any info and keep delaying releases lol


----------



## jason3.14

EvilDragon said:


> Actually, you could probably get relatively close to that dry brass sound that Japanese composers like to use with ISW's Bravura library.


I've really been struggling with french horn particularly for anime/video game music covers. Mainly I use Jaeger, but in general I haven't come across an option which I felt was suited to what I was making.

For example in FF7 Remake: 
Or particularly here in Xenoblade Chronicles X: 

The horns I've used tends to "evolve" too much, usually opening up and becoming too... bleaty? Not sure if that makes sense. Though to clarify, I think I want the sound to cut through, but to do that without change over time. Maybe I just need a good marcato, or a good synth brass to layer ? Lol.

Attached is my version of this Theme X climax, and I tried to deal with it by curbing with mod wheel, but then it loses its intensity and doesn't cut through. Maybe you can hear this evolution particularly at 0:51s in). Wonder if Bravura could work like you said, or if people have other thoughts... while waiting for TSB of course.


----------



## Toecutter

Was it mentioned if TSS will have user-defined bowed AND slurred legatos? Or the legato is chosen by the script automatically? (hope not) Can we control the speed/duration of transitions?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Yes, slurred and bowed legato are separate articulations that you can map however you'd like (keyswitch, CC, velocity, etc.) The legato settings are also adjustable per-articulation; if you've used anything in our Shreddage 3 or Ventus series, you can see the controls available (origin note fade out time, transition time, transition fade in time, transition fade out time, destination fade in time). However, we're working on adding more fine-tuning here too.


----------



## Toecutter

Andrew Aversa said:


> Yes, slurred and bowed legato are separate articulations that you can map however you'd like (keyswitch, CC, velocity, etc.) The legato settings are also adjustable per-articulation; if you've used anything in our Shreddage 3 or Ventus series, you can see the controls available (origin note fade out time, transition time, transition fade in time, transition fade out time, destination fade in time). However, we're working on adding more fine-tuning here too.


Yes I have a few Shreddage instruments and the Ventus collection! That's exciting to hear, TACT is awesome, you have a solid engine for TSS 

Will vibrato control work like Ventus? Natural (recorded) *and *smooth (Kontakt generated)? Or one or the other? I don't think it was mentioned if you have non-vib and vib samples. Either way, I hope you keep the smooth one, it works really well on Ventus when I need more expression.


----------



## RMH

Toecutter said:


> your_browser_is_not_able_to_play_this_audio
> 
> Keep up the good work, this is promising!


Where was this demo sound released?


----------



## Getsumen

RMH said:


> Where was this demo sound released?


Discord.
There's a new one by the way as well.

Higher quality version in the discord. (Had to compress this one down to mp3 to upload)


----------



## Tom Ferguson

Getsumen said:


> Discord.
> There's a new one by the way as well.
> 
> Higher quality version in the discord. (Had to compress this one down to mp3 to upload)


If you are going to post stuff that was specifically only sent to discord so far (probably for a reason), it would be good to at least mention the context of this test:










If you want to keep up with the short test clips that Andrew (Zircon on discord) is uploading, join the 'VI Composers' discord and search (top right hand corner) for: "from: zircon#5011 has: sound" (without the quotes*)!


----------



## chrisav

Oh my


----------



## dzilizzi

Wow, that is sounding good.


----------



## Trash Panda

Getsumen said:


> Discord.
> There's a new one by the way as well.
> 
> Higher quality version in the discord. (Had to compress this one down to mp3 to upload)


Sweet merciful crap, that sounds good!


----------



## NathanTiemeyer

Getsumen said:


> Discord.
> There's a new one by the way as well.
> 
> Higher quality version in the discord. (Had to compress this one down to mp3 to upload)


My poor WALLET!


----------



## Dmitry

maybe worth to create individual channels for developers in Discord, it will be easier to navigate, write admins


----------



## lettucehat

Very nice example of violins that are still relatively restrained but sound convincing. Smooth top end!


----------



## Will Blackburn

Can someone link the discord?


----------



## Getsumen

Will Blackburn said:


> Can someone link the discord?


 https://discordapp.com/invite/0vF7cfyHaTDLf8YB


----------



## just2high

Writing some anime style orchestral music right now and this can't come soon enough!


----------



## RMH

What is the Discord ?


----------



## Getsumen

RMH said:


> What is the Discord ?


Linked it 2 posts above you


----------



## tcb

RMH said:


> What is the Discord ?


Like LINE


----------



## RMH

tcb said:


> Like LINE


Thank you!


----------



## ToadsworthLP

Those little snippets already sound amazing! Will there be a mode that gives every articulation an equally high amount of delay so that it's possible to use the same negative track delay value in the DAW at all times while keeping the notes on the grid, similar to that CSS delay fix Kontakt script? It could be a real timesaver, especially when lining up legato lines with other articulations without using multiple tracks.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Yes, our goal is to have totally synchronized output latency so that you can set one negative track delay and forget about it. ALSO, legato gets its own specific lookahead correction. In other words, you can write a half note, and then another half note right after, and thanks to our lookahead, those will correctly be connected with legato *in time* so the transition finishes on the downbeat.


----------



## icecoolpool

Andrew Aversa said:


> Yes, our goal is to have totally synchronized output latency so that you can set one negative track delay and forget about it. ALSO, legato gets its own specific lookahead correction. In other words, you can write a half note, and then another half note right after, and thanks to our lookahead, those will correctly be connected with legato *in time* so the transition finishes on the downbeat.


Well, it´s looking like a must-buy at this point.


----------



## muziksculp

Andrew Aversa said:


> ALSO, legato gets its own specific lookahead correction. In other words, you can write a half note, and then another half note right after, and thanks to our lookahead, those will correctly be connected with legato *in time* so the transition finishes on the downbeat.


Hi Andrew,

Interesting, this is very new to me. I don't think I know of any other Strings Library that uses this Legato Lookahead technique. 

I'm happy you are moving forward at a good pace developing this very special strings library, and look forward to it's release. 

Wish You all the best, and Thanks for updating us. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Mukar

I know this is pretty early to ask this but is there any word on how much the library will cost? Will it be along the lines ISW's other libraries ($150-$200 USD) or will it be more? Gotta make sure I save up!


----------



## doctoremmet

Mukar said:


> Will it be along the lines ISW's other libraries ($150-$200 USD)


Not a chance - imho. It costs more to record a string band than do field recordings or record a single instrument


----------



## Toecutter

Mukar said:


> I know this is pretty early to ask this but is there any word on how much the library will cost? Will it be along the lines ISW's other libraries ($150-$200 USD) or will it be more? Gotta make sure I save up!


Targeting $399 MSRP, intro price $349 (second page of this thread)


----------



## doctoremmet

Toecutter said:


> Targeting $399 MSRP, intro price $349 (second page of this thread)


🙏


----------



## Batrawi

well since am not planning to buy it, I hope it won't cost less than $699..


----------



## puremusic

Sigh. Now that I've heard a small sample of these strings I already want the rest of the orchestra done this way.


----------



## Casiquire

Wish there was a way to hear them if you don't have a Discord!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

The snippets I've posted on the VI Discord server are pre-alpha scratch, I haven't posted them here because they're not fully representative of the final product since the script is nowhere near done. In a few weeks, hopefully the patches will be in good enough shape to produce some proper teaser audio.

(Speaking of, all 5 sections + full ensemble have in theory been fully edited, barring any spot fixes!)


----------



## chapbot

Casiquire said:


> Wish there was a way to hear them if you don't have a Discord!


It's free! Go download it and set up an account! https://discord.com/


----------



## Casiquire

chapbot said:


> It's free! Go download it and set up an account! https://discord.com/


Well sure but i don't want to lol i try to limit how many random accounts i have and how many places my email is signed up with


----------



## dzilizzi

Casiquire said:


> Well sure but i don't want to lol i try to limit how many random accounts i have and how many places my email is signed up with


this is where you go to Google and set up a gmail account just for things like discord.


----------



## Casiquire

dzilizzi said:


> this is where you go to Google and set up a gmail account just for things like discord.


I can log into discord with my Gmail without making a new account?


----------



## dzilizzi

Casiquire said:


> I can log into discord with my Gmail without making a new account?


I don't know. You might be able to. I just meant have a second email account that you only use for things like Discord. Then you get junk mail to that account and not to your main account.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

You shouldn't be getting junk mail from Discord...


----------



## CT

Sarah Mancuso said:


> You shouldn't be getting junk mail from Discord...


What if they get notifications about my posts?


----------



## Mukar

Toecutter said:


> Targeting $399 MSRP, intro price $349 (second page of this thread)


That's actually a pretty good price.


----------



## Toecutter

Mukar said:


> That's actually a pretty good price.


Yep, can't wait for better audio teasers


----------



## dzilizzi

Sarah Mancuso said:


> You shouldn't be getting junk mail from Discord...


As long as it doesn't get sold.


----------



## Getsumen

dzilizzi said:


> As long as it doesn't get sold.


Kinda off topic but imo it getting sold is the best possible option. (Depending on who it's sold to of course) 

The truth of the matter is Discord isn't profitable, and eventually, they will need to start doing something to raise profit and please their shareholders (If they go public) 

Which entails some annoying stuff. At least if it's sold to another company there's a chance that they would be willing to absorb it on a loss.


----------



## Mukar

Getsumen said:


> Kinda off topic but imo it getting sold is the best possible option. (Depending on who it's sold to of course)
> 
> The truth of the matter is Discord isn't profitable, and eventually, they will need to start doing something to raise profit and please their shareholders (If they go public)
> 
> Which entails some annoying stuff. At least if it's sold to another company there's a chance that they would be willing to absorb it on a loss.


They do have premium services, but then again, that's a topic for another place lol.


----------



## jason3.14

EvilDragon said:


> Mr. Aizawa likes to use Bricasti M7 reverb unit. Not sure which setting on it, but I bet @Andrew Aversa can chip in. So, for full immersion, you should probably get Seventh Heaven if you haven't already.


I guess this is covered in another thread, but in your opinion, is Seventh Heaven Core probably sufficient (rather than Pro)? I imagine so anyway...


----------



## EvilDragon

Yeah it should be fine!


----------



## Seycara

Andrew Aversa said:


> The snippets I've posted on the VI Discord server are pre-alpha scratch, I haven't posted them here because they're not fully representative of the final product since the script is nowhere near done. In a few weeks, hopefully the patches will be in good enough shape to produce some proper teaser audio.
> 
> (Speaking of, all 5 sections + full ensemble have in theory been fully edited, barring any spot fixes!)


Exciting 

Any info on dynamic layers for legato and shorts?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

There are 5 dynamics for shorts, 3 dynamics for legato + portamento, for all sections.


----------



## Mr Greg G

This sounds very promising Andrew.

Please don't make the same mistake other developers did and make the *release samples of legatos stop* as soon as another note is played. You can unfortunately hear this double note or chord issue in almost every String library out there.

I also cross my fingers so that the highest dynamic for the legato preset has been *recorded with a fast and harsh attack*. I always found that stacking a staccato or spiccato patch to give the impression of fast attack legato sounded bad. You can always hear the stacked articulations and it doesn't feel natural.


----------



## Casiquire

dzilizzi said:


> As long as it doesn't get sold.


Or hacked, which happens all the dang time


----------



## EvilDragon

Mr Pringles said:


> Please don't make the same mistake other developers did and make the *release samples of legatos stop* as soon as another note is played. You can unfortunately hear this double note or chord issue in almost every String library out there.



Ha there's no easy solutions here, especially for more ambient libraries, stopping release samples would sound highly unnatural. However considering this is a rather dry room, it might not even be a problem.


----------



## Mr Greg G

EvilDragon said:


> Ha there's no easy solutions here, especially for more ambient libraries, stopping release samples would sound highly unnatural. However considering this is a rather dry room, it might not even be a problem.


I understand, even though hearing this double note effect does also sound very unnatural. A solution could be to have a different set of release samples triggered if it's a legato followed by another note (very short RS) or if it's not (long RS)?

It's just impossible to hear, let's say a C and D of the same octave play at the same time... yet I hear this in most String libraries. It's even more amusing/puzzling when it's supposed to be a solo or First chair instrument.


----------



## EvilDragon

Most string libraries are ambient, hence they need to play the release tail on legatos otherwise you'd have the room sound disappear and it would sound sucky.


----------



## emdas

Andrew Aversa said:


> Impact Soundworks is thrilled to officially announce our first flagship orchestral string library:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *THE STORY*
> 
> Our goal with Tokyo Scoring Strings is to give you the orchestral string sound that has been heard across innumerable world-famous Japanese productions. It features five independently recorded sections (Violins 1, Violins 2, Viola, Cello, Bass) in a typical Japanese ensemble size (8/6/4/4/3) suitable for small and large productions alike.
> 
> We began this project in 2019, setting out to work with the finest musicians, engineer, and scoring studio in Japan. Due to both the language barrier & COVID, we had to find the right partners to help manage the project overseas. We connected with some incredible collaborators who have been with us through every step of the journey: our Japanese distributors *Crypton Future Media* and *Sonicwire*, plus the renowned composer *Masaru Yokoyama*.
> 
> Mr. Yokoyama, in addition to running a music production company (*MiracleBus*) and orchestral recording contractor (*PlugNote*), has composed for over 100 Japanese films, dramas, and anime series, bringing invaluable experience to the project.
> 
> *THE MUSICIANS*
> 
> _The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, Attack on Titan, Super Mario Odyssey, My Hero Academia, Final Fantasy XV, The Seven Deadly Sins, Fate/Grand Order, Octopath Traveler, Persona 5, Haikyuu, Xenoblade Chronicles, Tokyo Ghoul_.
> 
> All of these incredible scores, and over 600 more, have one thing in common: *Koichiro Muroya Strings*, led by its eponymous founder, violinist Koichiro Muroya. Their exquisite playing can be heard soaring across genres ranging from quiet, emotional anime moments to epic hybrid tracks by composers like Hiroyuki Sawano. Not surprisingly, Muroya Strings is the most in-demand session ensemble in all of Japan - and we were truly honored to record them for this project.
> 
> *THE ENGINEER*
> 
> The sound of these blockbuster Japanese soundtracks is not _just _superb musicianship and technique. The approach to recording and mixing orchestral scores is fundamentally unique as well. That's why we were equally privileged to work with Japan's top engineer, *Mitsunori Aizawa*, who is responsible for recording & mixing hundreds of world-famous anime, film, TV and video game productions.
> 
> Mr. Aizawa is a frequent collaborator of composer Hiroyuki Sawano, and his work can be heard on soundtracks like _Final Fantasy VII Remake, The Promised Neverland, Fruits Basket, Mobile Suit Gundam, Kill la Kill, Monster Hunter, Street Fighter V_, and many of the same soundtracks listed above!
> 
> *THE STUDIO*
> 
> Of course, the final element in an unforgettable score is an incredible recording space. For that reason, Tokyo Scoring Strings was recorded at *SOUND CITY*. With a truly legendary 60-year history, SOUND CITY has been home to countless beloved recordings for albums and soundtracks alike.
> 
> Here are just a small handful of the artists & composers who have returned time and time again to record at SOUND CITY:
> 
> Joe Hisaishi, Yoko Kanno, Nobuo Uematsu, Hiroyuki Sawano, Yuki Kajiura, Masashi Hamauzu, Kenji Kawai, Kohei Tanaka, Tatsuro Yamashita, JAM Project, Yasunori Nishiki, Hiroki Kikuta, Miki Higashino, and Jackie Chan (yes, that Jackie Chan!).
> 
> Unlike the larger halls and studios of the U.S. and Europe, studios in Japan tend to be built smaller, with rooms that offer a full-bodied sound without excessive reverb tails. SOUND CITY is no exception, giving Tokyo Scoring Strings a tighter, more focused sound that lends itself extremely well to more agile playing.
> 
> *THE LIBRARY*
> 
> Tokyo Studio Strings will include a well-rounded set of core articulations captured at 24/96 with superb detail. You'll be able to write and mock-up a wide variety of parts from slow & intimate to aggressive & agile, with a particular focus on excellent legato and short notes.
> 
> To help record even more authentic performances over the 90+ hours of sessions, we developed some new sampling techniques specifically for this library based on our 11 years of experience. The results should speak for themselves!
> 
> We'll provide specific information about articulations, dynamics, RR, and more soon.
> 
> *THE RECORDINGS*
> 
> To give you maximum mix flexibility, the ensemble was captured with over a dozen mics, which have been mixed down to five stereo positions: Close, Decca, Side, Back, and Surround. We’ve also included a Board Mix which features Mr. Aizawa’s own console mix, and is an excellent, efficient way to get that authentic sound instantly.
> 
> The library will ship with our latest *Console* FX rack & mixer too, with built-in snapshots to give you a wide range of pre-mixed tones!
> 
> *THE ENGINE*
> 
> Tokyo Scoring Strings will feature a new Kontakt Player-based engine built from our “Agility” script (see our Ventus libraries to get an idea of what to expect).
> 
> That means you’ll have poly legato, microtuning, scale locking, and multi-part harmony generation out of the box!
> 
> But there’s much more in store here to help you get great results fast. For example, you’ll be able to use two modes of playing: “real-time” with low-latency, and “lookahead,” which adds a slight latency in exchange for more realistic and idiomatic playback.
> 
> You'll also be able to suit TSS to your workflow via our latest iteration of TACT (*Total Articulation Control Technology*) supporting totally custom articulation mapping using any combination of velocity, keyswitch, MIDI CC, note range, pedal, or even multiple rules at once.
> 
> *WHEN!?*
> 
> We're shooting for a release no later than Q3 2021, but watch this space - we've expanded our team _solely to work on this project_, and we're as excited about it as anyone!
> 
> As of this post we've just wrapped up principal recording, with over 90 hours of studio time logged, and one _very tired Andrew_.


Looks great, although Audiobro Modern Scoring Strings will be difficult to beat. They released a few months ago and it's by far the best goddamn string library I have come across.


----------



## EvilDragon

Depends which sound aesthetic you're looking for. You won't get the sound of Japanese orchestra with MSS I don't think.


----------



## Mr Greg G

EvilDragon said:


> Most string libraries are ambient, hence they need to play the release tail on legatos otherwise you'd have the room sound disappear and it would sound sucky.


I understand, unfortunately this makes the library sound synthy and definitely not like real strings. Some are able to do it like Audioimperial, why can’t every dev do the same? This also means it´s actually feasible


----------



## KEM

Very intrigued by this, will definitely be on the lookout!!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Please don't  I don't want people to get the wrong idea from pre-pre alpha stuff. That said hopefully in the next 2 weeks we will have some better examples after a full pass massaging the dynamics and adjusting legato/rebow parameters.


----------



## antames

Ah, no problemo!!! I will delete my comment. :D


----------



## Trash Panda

Andrew Aversa said:


> Please don't  I don't want people to get the wrong idea from pre-pre alpha stuff. That said hopefully in the next 2 weeks we will have some better examples after a full pass massaging the dynamics and adjusting legato/rebow parameters.


You’re far too modest. What was already shared was fantastic. If that’s selling the library short, then


----------



## VSriHarsha

dzilizzi said:


> I don't know. You might be able to. I just meant have a second email account that you only use for things like Discord. Then you get junk mail to that account and not to your main account.


Yes, it’s possible. I logged in Discord using just my gmail account. Although, I think it first asks you to sign up & you can choose gmail, if I remember. But if I comment or post on the websites which address the community thru Discord, yes, that’s how I think I do.

Btw, Discord sends junk mail? I never had any but that’s good.


----------



## dzilizzi

VSriHarsha said:


> Yes, it’s possible. I logged in Discord using just my gmail account. Although, I think it first asks you to sign up & you can choose gmail, if I remember. But if I comment or post on the websites which address the community thru Discord, yes, that’s how I think I do.
> 
> Btw, Discord sends junk mail? I never had any but that’s good.


Any time you give your email address out, you take the chance that it will eventually be sold. Most never will, but some do.


----------



## VSriHarsha

dzilizzi said:


> Any time you give your email address out, you take the chance that it will eventually be sold. Most never will, but some do.


Wow! I didn’t know that. That’s really helpful @dzilizzi !


----------



## EvilDragon

Mr Pringles said:


> Some are able to do it like Audioimperial, why can’t every dev do the same? This also means it´s actually feasible



Nobody questions if it's feasible or not. It's all "just code". But if it sounds good or not it highly highly HIGHLY depends on how much room is there in the samples. And cutting away that room on transitions makes it sound fake, not even synthy.


----------



## Mr Greg G

EvilDragon said:


> Nobody questions if it's feasible or not. It's all "just code". But if it sounds good or not it highly highly HIGHLY depends on how much room is there in the samples. And cutting away that room on transitions makes it sound fake, not even synthy.


Sure, if this is what it takes to not have this fake double note / impossible chord issue, then so be it! I don't care how it's done under the hood. I'm always having a forced laugh when I hear chords triggered by a legato transition making this whole preset unreliable and unusable.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

Can you provide an audio example of the problem you're describing? Immediately cutting off releases during legato transitions sounds terrible in my experience.


----------



## Soundbed

muziksculp said:


> I don't think I know of any other Strings Library that uses this Legato Lookahead technique


MSS


----------



## Casiquire

This is an interesting topic. Slight tangent up ahead. I think for ambient libraries, long-form legato is the only way to go due to release issues. But that doesn't fix everything. For example fast runs and quick moves that are shorter than the length of the room sound. You could just have the script splice in a release tail, but that could actually interfere with the true legato because the tail sound of the previous note CANNOT be avoided. So for example, you play a quick run A B C# D E, all within the time of the room tail. When you hit the B, you hear the natural recorded sound of that A still lingering in the air captured within the legato transition and everything sounds great. But when you hit the C# note, you lose the sound of the A still ringing in the air. The script now needs to add back a release sample for A, from two notes ago, and it needs to cut the sample at the right timing and dynamic level from two notes ago as well. 

With all this in mind, I'm surprised our ambient libraries sound as good as they do!

On topic though, I'm excited to hear the polished examples coming out! As many string libraries as there are out there, there's still a lot of new ground to cover


----------



## Toecutter

Casiquire said:


> On topic though, I'm excited to hear the polished examples coming out! As many string libraries as there are out there, there's still a lot of new ground to cover


Yep the new stuff I heard so far (not counting TSS, still waiting for proper examples) is fine but nothing we couldn't achieve with current libraries tbh.


----------



## constaneum

with reference to this...Since it's mentioned before that once it's more ready, some demos will be made to showcase the capability of TSS. I'm hoping Andrew can show how TSS is able to do such slur transition (which you can hear at 17s, 23s, 25s,). probably a short mockup of this Octopath Traveler's ending theme.


----------



## mybadmemory

constaneum said:


> with reference to this...Since it's mentioned before that once it's more ready, some demos will be made to showcase the capability of TSS. I'm hoping Andrew can show how TSS is able to do such slur transition (which you can hear at 17s, 23s, 25s,). probably a short mockup of this Octopath Traveler's ending theme.



Isn’t 17,23, and 25 portamento rather than regular slur? He said those would be included right?


----------



## constaneum

mybadmemory said:


> Isn’t 17,23, and 25 portamento rather than regular slur? He said those would be included right?


i dont know. some people call it slur, some call it portamento. in LASS context, it's portamento and gliss (longer slide). i know included. lots of people include that but whether it works well or not, i'm curious about it. Can't wait to have a better listen to TSS !! HYPE ! HYPE !


----------



## Mr Greg G

Aren't you mistaking "slur" (which is just a legato) with bow pressure, bow speed and hand position change?

I think @mybadmemory is right, these are portamentos with a dynamic change.


----------



## constaneum

Mr Pringles said:


> Aren't you mistaking "slur" (which is just a legato) with bow pressure, bow speed and hand position change?
> 
> I think @mybadmemory is right, these are portamentos with a dynamic change.


probably i've mistaken. i'm a noob...pardon my lack of knowledge but ya. looking forward how TSS gonna nail this kind of transition. haha


----------



## chapbot

constaneum said:


> with reference to this...Since it's mentioned before that once it's more ready, some demos will be made to showcase the capability of TSS. I'm hoping Andrew can show how TSS is able to do such slur transition (which you can hear at 17s, 23s, 25s,). probably a short mockup of this Octopath Traveler's ending theme.



Is this the sound TSS is trying to capture? If so this is exactly the tone I want a string library to have!


----------



## Toecutter

chapbot said:


> Is this the sound TSS is trying to capture? If so this is exactly the tone I want a string library to have!


Octopath Traveler was recorded by the Koichiro Muroya Strings so TSS will be as close as you will get.


----------



## chapbot

Toecutter said:


> Octopath Traveler was recorded by the Koichiro Muroya Strings so TSS will be as close as you will get.


Wow thanks for the info! This is my dream studio string sound.


----------



## Toecutter

chapbot said:


> Wow thanks for the info! This is my dream studio string sound.


The show I'm doing gets temped by KMS scores all the time, not sure if it's a blessing or a curse, but I know what you mean... they have a very peculiar way of playing that *IS* the sound


I'm hoping ISW managed to capture this essence (hence why I keep asking about vibrato and legato control) we have too many similar string libraries that weren't recorded with this sound in mind. TSS can be the odd one of the bunch!

If you want to hear more stuff recorded by Koichiro








Koichiro Muroya Strings - VGMdb


室屋光一郎ストリングス (むろやこういちろうストリングス), credited in 881 albums and 23 products.




vgmdb.net


----------



## Jish

chapbot said:


> Wow thanks for the info! This is my dream studio string sound.


So much of what 'sounds' lovely and great (to me) in that Octopath ending theme goes well beyond a sense of room/tone (ala Spitfire's Abbey Road). That's a great foundational step/goal, but it's pretty much everything after where the high wire act begins for this kind of material.

Just taking that part starting at 0:33 in the clip...I mean, something like that is almost always the doom/danger zone for any string library trying to attain and subsequently maintain a high level of realism for string part's...because more than the room it's about subtle fluctuations in vibrato, dynamics and bowing that thru-line's into a variety of transitions. If TSS can somehow get us closer to all that, it would exceed any string expectations I had going into this year- and certainly an instant buy. If it's just more somewhat nice samples in an appropriate sounding room, I likely would pass.


----------



## chapbot

Toecutter said:


> The show I'm doing gets temped by KMS scores all the time, not sure if it's a blessing or a curse, but I know what you mean... they have a very peculiar way of playing that *IS* the sound
> 
> 
> I'm hoping ISW managed to capture this essence (hence why I keep asking about vibrato and legato control) we have too many similar string libraries that weren't recorded with this sound in mind. TSS can be the odd one of the bunch!
> 
> If you want to hear more stuff recorded by Koichiro
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Koichiro Muroya Strings - VGMdb
> 
> 
> 室屋光一郎ストリングス (むろやこういちろうストリングス), credited in 881 albums and 23 products.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vgmdb.net



Elaborate if you will on describing what you mean by their peculiar way of playing.


----------



## constaneum

chapbot said:


> Is this the sound TSS is trying to capture? If so this is exactly the tone I want a string library to have!


Andrew did post a reference to this piece previously. so yea...i'm looking forward to TSS nailing this kind of sound


----------



## muziksculp

I hear a warm, and velvety smooth timbre in the Strings of the Octapath Traveler soundtrack.

I'm guessing this is what makes them very pleasing to the ear, they have a nice texture, not too mellow, and not harsh, or gritty sounding.

I hope Andrew can get this type of timbre captured in TSS. Not sure what is contributing to this timbre, Maybe it's the unique characteristics of the hall, or recording techniques/mics/gear, ..etc. being used.


----------



## constaneum

muziksculp said:


> I hear a warm, and velvety smooth timbre in the Strings of the Octapath Traveler soundtrack.
> 
> I'm guessing this is what makes them very pleasing to the ear, they have a nice texture, not too mellow, and not harsh, or gritty sounding.
> 
> I hope Andrew can get this type of timbre captured in TSS. Not sure what is contributing to this timbre, Maybe it's the unique characteristics of the hall, or recording techniques/mics/gear, ..etc. being used.


probably mixing skill too. So far, i didn't hear such sound from the pre-alpha stage samples but i'll like to be proven wrong and corrected with a more polished sounding demos once the product is more ready for show.


----------



## Umi_Yu

I worked with Mr.Masaru Yokoyama as well as Mr.Mitsunori Aizawa before and also went to Sound City Studio several times. I can be sure it must be genuine Japanese orchestral sound!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Alpha starts today  

This will be a test of the core sound & features of the library. The lookahead functionality is not done yet, but we did implement a new and really unique feature that I don't think anyone else has: a *dynamic range* slider.

When this slider is at 100%, the natural dynamics of the ensemble & performances are preserved, with the relative volume manually tuned to be consistent across all articulations and WITHIN each dynamic. This way, an "ff" sustain is perceptibly as loud as an "ff" spiccato.

By increasing or decreasing the slider, you can increase or decrease the dynamic range... dynamically! For a pop track, you might want a more narrow dynamic range - in other words, the distance between pp and ff is reduced, while maintaining the timbral differences. Whereas a more classical track might enjoy a much larger range.


----------



## jason3.14

Andrew Aversa said:


> Alpha starts today
> 
> This will be a test of the core sound & features of the library. The lookahead functionality is not done yet, but we did implement a new and really unique feature that I don't think anyone else has: a *dynamic range* slider.
> 
> When this slider is at 100%, the natural dynamics of the ensemble & performances are preserved, with the relative volume manually tuned to be consistent across all articulations and WITHIN each dynamic. This way, an "ff" sustain is perceptibly as loud as an "ff" spiccato.
> 
> By increasing or decreasing the slider, you can increase or decrease the dynamic range... dynamically! For a pop track, you might want a more narrow dynamic range - in other words, the distance between pp and ff is reduced, while maintaining the timbral differences. Whereas a more classical track might enjoy a much larger range.


Sounds great! Would this be similar to Audio Imperia's Dynamics knob, such as on Jaeger/Nucleus?


----------



## constaneum

Andrew Aversa said:


> Alpha starts today
> 
> This will be a test of the core sound & features of the library. The lookahead functionality is not done yet, but we did implement a new and really unique feature that I don't think anyone else has: a *dynamic range* slider.
> 
> When this slider is at 100%, the natural dynamics of the ensemble & performances are preserved, with the relative volume manually tuned to be consistent across all articulations and WITHIN each dynamic. This way, an "ff" sustain is perceptibly as loud as an "ff" spiccato.
> 
> By increasing or decreasing the slider, you can increase or decrease the dynamic range... dynamically! For a pop track, you might want a more narrow dynamic range - in other words, the distance between pp and ff is reduced, while maintaining the timbral differences. Whereas a more classical track might enjoy a much larger range.


Can't wait for the demos!!


----------



## Trash Panda

Andrew Aversa said:


> Alpha starts today
> 
> This will be a test of the core sound & features of the library. The lookahead functionality is not done yet, but we did implement a new and really unique feature that I don't think anyone else has: a *dynamic range* slider.
> 
> When this slider is at 100%, the natural dynamics of the ensemble & performances are preserved, with the relative volume manually tuned to be consistent across all articulations and WITHIN each dynamic. This way, an "ff" sustain is perceptibly as loud as an "ff" spiccato.
> 
> By increasing or decreasing the slider, you can increase or decrease the dynamic range... dynamically! For a pop track, you might want a more narrow dynamic range - in other words, the distance between pp and ff is reduced, while maintaining the timbral differences. Whereas a more classical track might enjoy a much larger range.


Well, no one else but Audio Imperia and Aaron Venture, but you’re one of a few.


----------



## EvilDragon

Dynamic Range feature in TSS will be a bit more advanced.


----------



## Casiquire

Hmm i can think of a handful of libraries that have something that sounds like that. I'm really interested in the Lookahead feature now that I've seen the kind of wonders it can do. It's definitely creating a shift in libraries in my opinion


----------



## constaneum

is it there yet? is it there yet?? demos demos plz.


----------



## constaneum

* bump *....i'm just too excited.


----------



## WinterEmerald

I'm guessing the alpha is a closed invitation sort of deal? Does anyone know?


----------



## constaneum

WinterEmerald said:


> I'm guessing the alpha is a closed invitation sort of deal? Does anyone know?


Isn't that Beta ? Not sure..but I'm so eagerly to hear the alpha demos.


----------



## Soundbed

Trash Panda said:


> Well, no one else but Audio Imperia and Aaron Venture, but you’re one of a few.


There are others as well (MSS) but not sure if they map across articulations per dynamic the way ISW describes above.


----------



## Soundbed

constaneum said:


> Isn't that Beta ? Not sure..but I'm so eagerly to hear the alpha demos.


Alpha is before beta in software development & testing and indicates it may be unstable (data loss risk) and not quite feature locked.









Software release life cycle - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org


----------



## Getsumen

Another demo in the discord for ya'll that are interested


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Lots of meticulous patch tweaks and iteration at this stage but we're very close to publishing the official announce/teaser trailer which will have real actual audio. :D

Also @Soundbed is correct; the alpha (which is just a small invite team) is less stable and users may not be able to update to a new build without messing up settings in existing projects.


----------



## galactic orange

I’m very close to plonking down the cash for this! Thanks for the update, Andrew. And thanks to the ISW team for making one of my most hoped for libraries ever a reality.


----------



## constaneum

Andrew Aversa said:


> Lots of meticulous patch tweaks and iteration at this stage but we're very close to publishing the official announce/teaser trailer which will have real actual audio. :D
> 
> Also @Soundbed is correct; the alpha (which is just a small invite team) is less stable and users may not be able to update to a new build without messing up settings in existing projects.


The sound is indeed there.  looking forward to portamento showcase once more ready. is that the sound of Mr. Aizawa’s own console mix in that latest demo?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Yes, it is! The official teaser will release this coming week on Tuesday, so everyone will hear full audio of the instrument.

In other news, we've secured one more day in the studio to really go the extra mile with the library. We'll be adding another sustain variation (romantic, molto vibrato) and will hopefully have time to do some other short note variations, which are always fun and useful :D


----------



## muziksculp

Andrew Aversa said:


> We'll be adding another sustain variation (romantic, molto vibrato) and will hopefully have time to do some other short note variations, which are always fun and useful :D


That's very wise ! These are the kind of articulations that other String libraries seem to skip, or offer very little of. Short note variations, and Romantic Molto Vibrato with some nice and smooth portamentos. Would be super. 

Looking forward to the official teaser next Tuesday, and eventually the official release of the library.

Thanks.


----------



## Soundbed

Andrew Aversa said:


> romantic, molto vibrato


ooh nice!


----------



## constaneum

Andrew Aversa said:


> Yes, it is! The official teaser will release this coming week on Tuesday, so everyone will hear full audio of the instrument.
> 
> In other news, we've secured one more day in the studio to really go the extra mile with the library. We'll be adding another sustain variation (romantic, molto vibrato) and will hopefully have time to do some other short note variations, which are always fun and useful :D


Can't wait. Heheh


----------



## RMH

Andrew Aversa said:


> The official teaser will release this coming week on Tuesday,


Finally!!


----------



## Mukar

Welp, guess I should start putting parts of my paychecks aside because the most recent discord demo made me dislocate my jaw. It sounds insane!


----------



## mscp

Every time this thread comes up to the top of the list, my heart skips a beat. haha.


----------



## muziksculp

Henrik B. Jensen said:


> Where can one hear it without using Discord?


The official TSS Teaser will be posted tomorrow. I'm so excited about that.


----------



## Mukar

Henrik B. Jensen said:


> Where can one hear it without using Discord?


I imagine a variation of the discord demo will be released officially tomorrow. Unless ISW decides to bless our ears with something totally different.


----------



## constaneum

muziksculp said:


> The official TSS Teaser will be posted tomorrow. I'm so excited about that.


Same here same here.


----------



## Soundbed

It's Tuesday somewhere...


----------



## RMH

Soundbed said:


> It's Tuesday somewhere...


I'm waiting for... 🤣


----------



## Soundbed

RMH said:


> I'm waiting for... 🤣


I mean c'mon it's already afternoon... in Tokyo.  

Tokyo Tuesday!


----------



## RMH

Soundbed said:


> I mean c'mon it's already afternoon... in Tokyo.
> 
> Tokyo Tuesday!


That's right, they probably aren't ready yet. So the post hasn't been updated.


----------



## muziksculp

TSS Teaser will be posted at 1:00 PM (EST), 10:00 AM (PST).


----------



## Mukar

muziksculp said:


> TSS Teaser will be posted at 1:00 PM (EST), 10:00 AM (PST).


14 minutes!


----------



## puremusic

5.. 4..


----------



## muziksculp




----------



## tcb

GOGOGO


----------



## muziksculp




----------



## Andrew Aversa

muziksculp said:


>



You beat me to it 

I hope you'll all enjoy this first listen to the library, and a little sneak peek behind the scenes! We're very, very proud of how it sounds already and can't wait to show even more.

Now, in contrast to the demo heard in the video, composer and violinist Jeff Ball has written a beautiful piece called "Paper Boat Journey" - which, along with the teaser piece, is on our SoundCloud - showing a completely different side of the library in total isolation (just a bit of reverb, of course.)



What do you think? Let us know!


----------



## tcb

I have prepared the money


----------



## Mukar

Yep. This will be the library that kills my wallet.


----------



## sostenuto

tcb said:


> I have prepared the money


~~ 40000



?? 🤦‍♂️


----------



## Casiquire

That sounds really good! Exactly the kind of sound I expected from the description.


----------



## muziksculp

@Andrew Aversa ,

Congratulations on the wonderful Teaser Video release. TSS sounds superb.  

The contrasting demo by Jeff Ball sounds great as well, and reveals more of the timbre of the strings. Looking forward to listen to more TSS demos as the project evolves, and to the release of TSS this year. Please keep updating us on this thread on the progress of TSS. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## pcohen12

Well that was beautiful.


----------



## Saxer

I really like what I hear! Especially the tight and not over-romanced long notes.


----------



## muziksculp

I can't recall what is the size of the string sections of TSS. Anyone have that info. handy ?


----------



## AndyP

The demos sound convincing and promising. The main track has a bit of Sakamoto, the Japanese influence is clearly audible. I like that extraordinarily well.


----------



## ChickenAndARoll

muziksculp said:


> I can't recall what is the size of the string sections of TSS. Anyone have that info. handy ?


8/6/4/4/3


----------



## muziksculp

ChickenAndARoll said:


> 8/6/4/4/3


Thanks


----------



## Trash Panda

Yup. That’s the JRPG/anime sound that was promised. Phenomenal job!


----------



## Toecutter

I was afraid this could end up being another hollywoodish string library, we have so many already, but ISW nailed the KMS vibe, impressive! This is such a specific sound, TSS will make my life a lot easier  A lot of composer friends that work on anime stuff and rejoicing XD

@Andrew Aversa do we have a release date? I can't remember


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Toecutter said:


> I was afraid this could end up being another hollywoodish string library, we have so many already, but ISW nailed the KMS vibe, impressive! This is such a specific sound, TSS will make my life a lot easier  A lot of composer friends that work on anime stuff and rejoicing XD
> 
> @Andrew Aversa do we have a release date? I can't remember



Thank you, I'm glad you like it!

We're looking at late October / early November.


----------



## MarcusD




----------



## Toecutter

Andrew Aversa said:


> Thank you, I'm glad you like it!
> 
> We're looking at late October / early November.


Thanks! And before ppl freak out (aka me) IT'S NOT A RELEASE DATE SET IN STONE XD I do hope it gets released before the holidays, TSS will probably replace a lot of stuff in my template. I can't remember if we got information about articulations, dynamics, RR yet?


----------



## Getsumen

Toecutter said:


> Thanks! And before ppl freak out (aka me) IT'S NOT A RELEASE DATE SET IN STONE XD I do hope it gets released before the holidays, TSS will probably replace a lot of stuff in my template. I can't remember if we got information about articulations, dynamics, RR yet?
















I believe there's still one more recording date planned. I forget the exact thing that was being added but from what I recall I think it was a molto vibrato layer? Not sure.


The articulation, dynamics, and RR amount are pretty damn impressive for the price.


----------



## muziksculp

Tokyo Scoring Strings: Patch 1.0.5 available (fixed sample offsets)


Well, no one else but Audio Imperia and Aaron Venture, but you’re one of a few. :2thumbs: There are others as well (MSS) but not sure if they map across articulations per dynamic the way ISW describes above.




vi-control.net


----------



## Zanshin

Getsumen said:


> The articulation, dynamics, and RR amount are pretty damn impressive for the price.


What's the price?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Zanshin said:


> What's the price?


We are targeting $349 as an intro price and $399 MSRP.


----------



## Toecutter

Getsumen said:


> I believe there's still one more recording date planned. I forget the exact thing that was being added but from what I recall I think it was a molto vibrato layer? Not sure.
> 
> 
> The articulation, dynamics, and RR amount are pretty damn impressive for the price.


----------



## gtrwll

That's an absolutely gorgeous sound right there. Eagerly awaiting for more demos and walkthroughs in the coming months, but this does seem promising already.


----------



## mybadmemory

Sounds fantastic! Will there be a pre-baked mix too, besides the individual mic positions?


----------



## maestro2be

I believe unless I am remember from another strings release thread that it was going to be a "molto vibrato" style long/legato that's going to be added.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

maestro2be said:


> I believe unless I am remember from another strings release thread that it was going to be a "molto vibrato" style long/legato that's going to be added.


Yep! We're doing one more session in the studio to add another vibrato layer (so the choices will be medium vibrato vs. heavy/molto vibrato) plus a few other bonus things - whatever we have time for. For example, I'm interested in capturing another spiccato-style articulation, and possibly harmonics as well.



mybadmemory said:


> Sounds fantastic! Will there be a pre-baked mix too, besides the individual mic positions?



Yes! In fact, everything you hear in these two demos is from the "Board Mix", which was created by Mr. Aizawa using his signature mix & processing. (No baked reverb of course.)


----------



## CatOrchestra

This is really exciting!
I wonder what Piano VST to pair with this?


----------



## Evans

You should open up pre-orders now. In case it's delayed beyond the current estimate, I don't want to have spent all my budget on Black Friday deals.

EDIT: Just take my money, okay?


----------



## Sovereign

Andrew Aversa said:


> Yep! We're doing one more session in the studio to add another vibrato layer (so the choices will be medium vibrato vs. heavy/molto vibrato) plus a few other bonus things - whatever we have time for. For example, I'm interested in capturing another spiccato-style articulation, and possibly harmonics as


Will the Molto vibrato recordings be integrated into the legato patches?


----------



## dzilizzi

I am really looking forward to this one. It sounds lovely.


----------



## Haakond

I have already put away 349$ to buy this library. It has "that JRPG sound"


----------



## Robert_G

My goodness.....it has JRPG written all over it. This sound is so overdue.


----------



## Jackdnp121

Yep that’s the sound that we are expecting , congratulations! I can already imagine the nice Japanese woodwind run and brass too. Now take my money please. 

DÔZO YOROSHIKU ONEGAI SHIMASU.

🙇🏻‍♂️


----------



## paularthur

omg


----------



## chapbot

Fantastic! I appreciate you keeping us updated!


----------



## Tremendouz

Well this library definitely has a unique sound and I love it.


----------



## artomatic

That deserves an Olympic Gold!


----------



## constaneum

Nice. Looking forward to the video walkthrough on handling portamento. Wonder how this library handles slow expressive passage like the ones we always hear in games and animes. A demo on that will be great to hear what this library is capable of and also curious on the sounds of other mics. Hehe


----------



## Kristoben

This sounds just like I'd hoped it would! Really nailed that great studio strings sound. Looking forward to hearing more.


----------



## jason3.14

Awesome, especially since I'm currently playing Octopath Traveler right now!


----------



## CatOrchestra

What piano samples would pair well with this?

Hope there will be a piano release later on


----------



## djDarkX

This will be amazing and I CAN'T WAIT to get my hands on these beautiful strings. You can never have too many strings libraries.


----------



## N.Caffrey

Sounds awesome well done!


----------



## Drundfunk

The demos sound exactly as the product was advertised and promised. Really looking forward to it!


----------



## Batrawi

Getsumen said:


>


looks very good. didn't know there's such a thing as bowed portamento! how's that even possible?


----------



## Trash Panda

Batrawi said:


> looks very good. didn't know there's such a thing as bowed portamento! how's that even possible?


You change bow directions at the beginning/during the finger slide of the portamento?


----------



## Batrawi

The tone sounds awesome, but the transitions feel a bit sterile, i.e can't really hear any movement in them (yes I'm that legato obsessed guy you see ranting about these things in almost every thread but I can't help it XD).... Hopefully there are legato parameters that can be set to taste which I think ISW usually provide in their libraries


----------



## Batrawi

Trash Panda said:


> You change bow directions at the beginning/during the finger slide of the portamento?


yea maybe "beginning" which I imagine would be like folk/fiddle gliding sound with a bow at the beginning. you can't bow "during" a glide though or it would be interrupted... but I'm not a string player so maybe I'm incorrect


----------



## muziksculp

Batrawi said:


> Hopefully there are legato parameters that can be set to taste which I think ISW usually provide in their libraries


Hi @Batrawi ,

I just posted this question on Discord asking Andrew about the legato parameters :

QUOTE : " Hi , will you have any type of control/s in the TSS GUI to tweak/customize the legato transitions in TSS to taste when that is needed ? Thanks. "


----------



## Dr.Quest

Batrawi said:


> yea maybe "beginning" which I imagine would be like folk/fiddle gliding sound with a bow at the beginning. you can't bow "during" a glide though or it would be interrupted... but I'm not a string player so maybe I'm incorrect


----------



## muziksculp

@Batrawi ,

Reply from Andrew : 

Quote : "Yes, there are a variety of parameters... we are deciding how to make it as user friendly as we can. For example we want to have an easy way to switch between legato presets for fast vs slow playing "


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Batrawi said:


> looks very good. didn't know there's such a thing as bowed portamento! how's that even possible?



In what we call "slurred" legato, the player is going from, say, C3 to G3, on the same bow stroke. So they start playing C3 with a downbow, then shift to G3, without changing the bow.

In our "bowed" legato, they would start playing C3 with a downbow, but then bow up when they shift to G3.

Keep in mind that legato is often an understated technique. We had the players perform actual music at various dynamics (of course!) so we could compare our mockups of that music vs. the real performance. And in the real performance, the time it takes to go from one note to another is extremely short unless they are intentionally sliding w/ portamento. It's subtle. Maybe I'll post some examples soon!

To get specific regarding the legato settings, there are lot of interesting parameters to play with at the moment which can yield very different results for real-time playing vs. MIDI playback, and at different tempos. Fades, timing, relative release noise volumes, etc.


----------



## mybadmemory

Andrew Aversa said:


> In what we call "slurred" legato, the player is going from, say, C3 to G3, on the same bow stroke. So they start playing C3 with a downbow, then shift to G3, without changing the bow.
> 
> In our "bowed" legato, they would start playing C3 with a downbow, but then bow up when they shift to G3.
> 
> Keep in mind that legato is often an understated technique. We had the players perform actual music at various dynamics (of course!) so we could compare our mockups of that music vs. the real performance. And in the real performance, the time it takes to go from one note to another is extremely short unless they are intentionally sliding w/ portamento. It's subtle. Maybe I'll post some examples soon!
> 
> To get specific regarding the legato settings, there are lot of interesting parameters to play with at the moment which can yield very different results for real-time playing vs. MIDI playback, and at different tempos. Fades, timing, relative release noise volumes, etc.



Will there be a low latency recording mode and a full latency playback mode (with the lookahead)? And a simple way to switch between the two?


----------



## Go To 11

Andrew Aversa said:


> Yep! We're doing one more session in the studio to add another vibrato layer (so the choices will be medium vibrato vs. heavy/molto vibrato) plus a few other bonus things - whatever we have time for. For example, I'm interested in capturing another spiccato-style articulation, and possibly harmonics as well.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes! In fact, everything you hear in these two demos is from the "Board Mix", which was created by Mr. Aizawa using his signature mix & processing. (No baked reverb of course.)


Flautando and col legno pickups?


----------



## Go To 11

mybadmemory said:


> Will there be a low latency recording mode and a full latency playback mode (with the lookahead)? And a simple way to switch between the two?


I'm so looking forward to a library that embraces fast real time playing in, and slower more nuanced, intelligent playback.


----------



## mybadmemory

Go To 11 said:


> I'm so looking forward to a library that embraces fast real time playing in, and slower more nuanced, intelligent playback.


That must be the future!


----------



## neblix

Hi, programmer of the Tokyo Scoring engine here!

Real-time is always the hardest thing, and the most sensible thing to do is to split the approaches.

We can definitely add a low-latency "Recording Mode" if we deem it necessary, where everything will be reduced or as 0-latency as possible for the sake of recording in time. It is important to understand though, that the shorter you make legato transitions, the quality of their effect diminishes rapidly. For this reason, we would essentially encourage people to adopt a workflow of using this mode for recording only, and switching to the intelli-playback to get the proper curated sound that we've spent the last several months tweaking.

We are going to have two completely separate systems of intelli-playback: *Latency Compensation*, and *Lookahead*. These may not be the final names of these features, but they are how we are referring to them during development.

The tl;dr of this post is that *Latency Compensation* more easily adaptable to regular composing workflow and solves the main problem, which is the legato transitions are always late. *Lookahead* adds some more intelligent analysis like artic switching and internal param adjustments, but creates a new kind of workflow that won't drop into existing templates since the delay is super long.

Now for the nitty-gritty.

------

*Latency Compensation* reports a simple number on the GUI that you punch into your DAW's track as an offset. Its entire purpose is just alignment. This system also already works and is live in some of our products, such as Ventus Duduk.

For example, the GUI may report to me "320 ms", and then I simply type "-320" into my track's offset parameter in Studio One. Now writing on the grid, every legato transition regardless of type (bowed, slur, porta), along with every regular articulation (arco, staccato, etc.) will be aligned so they all land exactly 320 ms late, which after punching in our negative offset, is now essentially 0 deviation from the grid.

Yes, you read correctly; *no more nudging MIDI notes to get stuff in time*. Any desired humanization from this point can just be slight nudges off the grid, instead of nudges that are already vague and nebulous. If you write on the grid for speed, or you import MIDI from sheet music, or even use integrated DAW sheet notation, you will *flourish* with this feature.

It additionally works regardless of tempo and even regardless of tempo automation; something that is a colossal pain to deal with when sequencing manual nudging. And yes, it works with poly legato.

Depending on DAW this can be more or less feasible; people working in less traditional DAW's would have to manually move their MIDI backward by hand, and this would screw up when automating tempo since the MIDI position is beat-based and not time-based. In other words, if your DAW doesn't have a built-in track offset, it may not be a perfect solution to the alignment problem.

Before anyone asks, Kontakt does not allow us to change the VST's reported latency, so unfortunately we can not get rid of the requirement to edit the track offset by attempting to rely on a DAW's plugin delay compensation. Though this feature is probably the most ideal case for getting NI to consider it down the line.

------

Our in-development *Lookahead *is a more advanced and unorthodox workflow. It hasn't been fully decided, but the current proposition is to delay by an entire bar (tempo-synced), and during this bar delay, the playback will be analyzed to try and augment the sequencing quality. We have also floated the idea of automatic CC phrasing, but this is an even bigger challenge that may not make it into the first version release of the library (but may be introduced over the course of brass, winds, etc.)

We're playing with ideas like adjusting legato parameters depending on the speed of the phrase (melodic vs. run), switching or layering articulations on short or unconnected notes (sfz, dec, staccato, spiccato). Needless to say, the *Lookahead* system is well-equipped to include all the same benefits of *Latency Compensation*, but your alignment is just moving the music backward by a bar instead of punching in a track offset. Great for DAW's that don't have a negative track delay implemented, but now since it is bar-based, the challenge is also making it work if the tempo is automated. My current approach to solving this is "I have no idea, but I can probably figure it out eventually."

Our proposed best-organization workflow for *Lookahead* is that utilizing shared-duplicate MIDI clips across two separate tracks is the way to go.

For example, let's say I am writing a Violins I track. I am writing the part at the correct measure number on a track that is not hooked up to TSS, and doesn't make sound. A 2nd track with the shared MIDI clips will have them moved backward by 1 measure, and that one is the track sending to TSS. This lets me write at the correct spot in the music on the silent track, and when I hit "play" in the DAW, the final sound is correctly in time as the shared MIDI clips took care of transferring to the 2nd track.

I'm sure people have their own preferred solutions to the main track being silent, like hooking it up to a sketch piano sound, or even loading TSS again in some 0-latency state (perhaps turning legato off). Perhaps some even cleverer people will use something like Muteomatic so that when the DAW transport begins, the sketch track isn't outputting any sound. This kind of long-term Lookahead has really barely been done before except in very recent times, so we have to be creative to find best practices.


----------



## Germain B

It's so cool to have such insights before and during the development of an ambitious library.
Thank you @Andrew Aversa and @neblix !


----------



## lucky909091

Please do not mind me asking for a comparison to the 8Dio"Anthology Strings" and the Audiobro "LASS".
I am not entirely clear about the advantages of the "Tokyo Strings" - although I like the sound very much.


----------



## mybadmemory

Just wow! I cannot wait for this library (and the rest of the series) to come out. Both the sound and the feature ambition is ❤️❤️❤️.


----------



## mybadmemory

neblix said:


> Hi, programmer of the Tokyo Scoring engine here!
> 
> Real-time is always the hardest thing, and the most sensible thing to do is to split the approaches.
> 
> We can definitely add a low-latency "Recording Mode" if we deem it necessary, where everything will be reduced or as 0-latency as possible for the sake of recording in time. It is important to understand though, that the shorter you make legato transitions, the quality of their effect diminishes rapidly. For this reason, we would essentially encourage people to adopt a workflow of using this mode for recording only, and switching to the intelli-playback to get the proper curated sound that we've spent the last several months tweaking.
> 
> We are going to have two completely separate systems of intelli-playback: *Latency Compensation*, and *Lookahead*. These may not be the final names of these features, but they are how we are referring to them during development.
> 
> The tl;dr of this post is that *Latency Compensation* more easily adaptable to regular composing workflow and solves the main problem, which is the legato transitions are always late. *Lookahead* adds some more intelligent analysis like artic switching and internal param adjustments, but creates a new kind of workflow that won't drop into existing templates since the delay is super long.
> 
> Now for the nitty-gritty.
> 
> ------
> 
> *Latency Compensation* reports a simple number on the GUI that you punch into your DAW's track as an offset. It's entire purpose is just alignment. This system also already works and is live in some of our products, such as Ventus Duduk.
> 
> For example, the GUI may report to me "320 ms", and then I simply type "-320" into my track's offset parameter in Studio One. Now writing on the grid, every legato transition regardless of type (bowed, slur, porta), along with every regular articulation (arco, staccato, etc.) will be aligned so they all land exactly 320 ms late, which after punching in our negative offset, is now essentially 0 deviation from the grid.
> 
> Yes, you read correctly; *no more nudging MIDI notes to get stuff in time*. Any desired humanization from this point can just be slight nudges off the grid, instead of nudges that are already vague and nebulous. If you write on the grid for speed, or you import MIDI from sheet music, or even use integrated DAW sheet notation, you will *flourish* with this feature.
> 
> It additionally works regardless of tempo and even regardless of tempo automation; something that is a colossal pain to deal with when sequencing manual nudging. And yes, it works with poly legato.
> 
> Depending on DAW this can be more or less feasible; people working in less traditional DAW's would have to manually move their MIDI backward by hand, and this would screw up when automating tempo since the MIDI position is beat-based and not time-based. In other words, if your DAW doesn't have a built-in track offset, it may not be a perfect solution to the alignment problem.
> 
> Before anyone asks, Kontakt does not allow us to change the VST's reported latency, so unfortunately we can not get rid of the requirement to edit the track offset by attempting to rely on a DAW's plugin delay compensation. Though this feature is probably the most ideal case for getting NI to consider it down the line.
> 
> ------
> 
> Our in-development *Lookahead *is a more advanced and unorthodox workflow. It hasn't been fully decided, but the current proposition is to delay by an entire bar (tempo-synced), and during this bar delay, the playback will be analyzed to try and augment the sequencing quality. We have also floated the idea of automatic CC phrasing, but this is an even bigger challenge that may not make it into the first version release of the library (but may be introduced over the course of brass, winds, etc.)
> 
> We're playing with ideas like adjusting legato parameters depending on the speed of the phrase (melodic vs. run), switching or layering articulations on short or unconnected notes (sfz, dec, staccato, spiccato). Needless to say, the *Lookahead* system is well-equipped to include all the same benefits of *Latency Compensation*, but your alignment is just moving the music backward by a bar instead of punching in a track offset. Great for DAW's that don't have a negative track delay implemented, but now since it is bar-based, the challenge is also making it work if the tempo is automated. My current approach to solving this is "I have no idea, but I can probably figure it out eventually."
> 
> Our proposed best-organization workflow for *Lookahead* is that utilizing shared-duplicate MIDI clips across two separate tracks is the way to go.
> 
> For example, let's say I am writing a Violins I track. I am writing the part at the correct measure number on a track that is not hooked up to TSS, and doesn't make sound. A 2nd track with the shared MIDI clips will have them moved backward by 1 measure, and that one is the track sending to TSS. This lets me write at the correct spot in the music on the silent track, and when I hit "play" in the DAW, the final sound is correctly in time as the shared MIDI clips took care of transferring to the 2nd track.
> 
> I'm sure people have their own preferred solutions to the main track being silent, like hooking it up to a sketch piano sound, or even loading TSS again in some 0-latency state (perhaps turning legato off). Perhaps some even cleverer people will use something like Muteomatic so that when the DAW transport begins, the sketch track isn't outputting any sound. This kind of long-term Lookahead has really barely been done before except in very recent times, so we have to be creative to find best practices.


Thanks for the transparency! I’ve been waiting a long time for a library that makes it easy to switch between low latency recording and full preroll/transition playback (with one fixed delay for everything so track delay compensation can be used instead of individual midi note nudging).

The next step would be to have the plug-in automatically know if you’re recording or playing back so you don’t even have to switch this on/off yourself but I guess that’s impossible still, until DAWs and plugins have this line of communication open?


----------



## neblix

mybadmemory said:


> Thanks for the transparency! I’ve been waiting a long time for a library that makes it easy to switch between low latency recording and full preroll/transition playback (with one fixed delay for everything so track delay compensation can be used instead of individual midi note nudging).
> 
> The next step would be to have the plug-in automatically know if you’re recording or playing back so you don’t even have to switch this on/off yourself but I guess that’s impossible still, until DAWs and plugins have this line of communication open?


Unfortunately such a thing isn't currently possible with the current state of the platform! Though having composed music myself using our Latency Compensation system and having produced string mockups in the past with my other favorite string libraries, I guarantee that our current system in its current state saves an incredible amount of time and effort in producing string tracks. And it can't be overstated that the ability for the library to sound at ideal quality without nudging notes off the grid opens up dramatic workflow improvements for composers who work from notation conversions or sketch tracks. It also simplifies transferring MIDI parts between instruments without having to resequence them based on particular library timing quirks!


----------



## ShidoStrife

@neblix thank you for sharing! No doubt they would be great timesavers for a lot of us!

Is it not possible to simply make lookahead mode have much higher delay than latency compensation mode, instead of a bar? Haven't checked how high I can go in cubase though


----------



## darkmagi250

I just saw the trailer, and it took my hype to another level! 
I can't wait to hear it in a 'battle theme' context.


----------



## neblix

ShidoStrife said:


> @neblix thank you for sharing! No doubt they would be great timesavers for a lot of us!
> 
> Is it not possible to simply make lookahead mode have much higher delay than latency compensation mode, instead of a bar? Haven't checked how high I can go in cubase though


The problem is that track offsets in DAW's may not allow values in that excess. For instance, Studio One caps at -1000ms. So it solves 1 problem and creates another!


----------



## ShidoStrife

neblix said:


> The problem is that track offsets in DAW's may not allow values in that excess. For instance, Studio One caps at -1000ms. So it solves 1 problem and creates another!


I see, yeah that could be a problem. I guess the shared midi workaround would work best in this case.


----------



## Daniel

I really like this TSS sound


----------



## Simon Ravn

Very interesting! Not the immediate lush, soothing "Hollywood sound" but I believe because it is recorded in a smaller studio this can be sculped in many directions. EQ and reverb will go a long way. It seems not much post processing has been done so the sound is almost "too full" (a bit like East West Hollywood Strings actually), so carving out the low and mids from violins etc. will help to make this thing sing, I think. I also like the size of the sections which gives us new possibilities. Can't wait to hear more


----------



## mybadmemory

@Andrew Aversa If TSS will sell well so you make it a full orchestral series, in what order would you tackle the other sections? And would the woodwinds be focusing on upfront soloistic performances rather than orchestral seating of a2s a3s etc?


----------



## HM_Music

I support the question about the orchestra series. I would like to have instruments that match each other better and are recorded in the same room. That everything would sound close to what I hear in similar music without unnecessary fiddling with mixing.


----------



## mybadmemory

I also think it would be fantastic if it focused on the instruments and performance types that are ubiquitous in this genre rather than trying to cover a traditional orchestra.

Apart from the unique string and brass sound, to focus on really soloistic woodwinds, with some ethnic ones as well. And traditional tonal percussion with instruments like Celtic harp.


----------



## constaneum

if i'm not mistaken, Andrew mentioned it's in the plan for the rest of the series. He mentioned either in discord or this thread that the next focus will be the drum sound of Hiroyuki Sawano


----------



## HM_Music

The brass horn sound of Hiroyuki Sawano would be great, too.
But a drum sound would be good, too. I hope it will be a drum kit + orchestral percussion, including taiko. That's probably a lot more work.
I would also like solo strings in the future...


----------



## Trash Panda

constaneum said:


> if i'm not mistaken, Andrew mentioned it's in the plan for the rest of the series. He mentioned either in discord or this thread that the next focus will be the drum sound of Hiroyuki Sawano


Paging @jason3.14


----------



## Denkii

neblix said:


> Hi, programmer of the Tokyo Scoring engine here!
> 
> Real-time is always the hardest thing, and the most sensible thing to do is to split the approaches.
> 
> We can definitely add a low-latency "Recording Mode" if we deem it necessary, where everything will be reduced or as 0-latency as possible for the sake of recording in time. It is important to understand though, that the shorter you make legato transitions, the quality of their effect diminishes rapidly. For this reason, we would essentially encourage people to adopt a workflow of using this mode for recording only, and switching to the intelli-playback to get the proper curated sound that we've spent the last several months tweaking.
> 
> We are going to have two completely separate systems of intelli-playback: *Latency Compensation*, and *Lookahead*. These may not be the final names of these features, but they are how we are referring to them during development.
> 
> The tl;dr of this post is that *Latency Compensation* more easily adaptable to regular composing workflow and solves the main problem, which is the legato transitions are always late. *Lookahead* adds some more intelligent analysis like artic switching and internal param adjustments, but creates a new kind of workflow that won't drop into existing templates since the delay is super long.
> 
> Now for the nitty-gritty.
> 
> ------
> 
> *Latency Compensation* reports a simple number on the GUI that you punch into your DAW's track as an offset. Its entire purpose is just alignment. This system also already works and is live in some of our products, such as Ventus Duduk.
> 
> For example, the GUI may report to me "320 ms", and then I simply type "-320" into my track's offset parameter in Studio One. Now writing on the grid, every legato transition regardless of type (bowed, slur, porta), along with every regular articulation (arco, staccato, etc.) will be aligned so they all land exactly 320 ms late, which after punching in our negative offset, is now essentially 0 deviation from the grid.
> 
> Yes, you read correctly; *no more nudging MIDI notes to get stuff in time*. Any desired humanization from this point can just be slight nudges off the grid, instead of nudges that are already vague and nebulous. If you write on the grid for speed, or you import MIDI from sheet music, or even use integrated DAW sheet notation, you will *flourish* with this feature.
> 
> It additionally works regardless of tempo and even regardless of tempo automation; something that is a colossal pain to deal with when sequencing manual nudging. And yes, it works with poly legato.
> 
> Depending on DAW this can be more or less feasible; people working in less traditional DAW's would have to manually move their MIDI backward by hand, and this would screw up when automating tempo since the MIDI position is beat-based and not time-based. In other words, if your DAW doesn't have a built-in track offset, it may not be a perfect solution to the alignment problem.
> 
> Before anyone asks, Kontakt does not allow us to change the VST's reported latency, so unfortunately we can not get rid of the requirement to edit the track offset by attempting to rely on a DAW's plugin delay compensation. Though this feature is probably the most ideal case for getting NI to consider it down the line.
> 
> ------
> 
> Our in-development *Lookahead *is a more advanced and unorthodox workflow. It hasn't been fully decided, but the current proposition is to delay by an entire bar (tempo-synced), and during this bar delay, the playback will be analyzed to try and augment the sequencing quality. We have also floated the idea of automatic CC phrasing, but this is an even bigger challenge that may not make it into the first version release of the library (but may be introduced over the course of brass, winds, etc.)
> 
> We're playing with ideas like adjusting legato parameters depending on the speed of the phrase (melodic vs. run), switching or layering articulations on short or unconnected notes (sfz, dec, staccato, spiccato). Needless to say, the *Lookahead* system is well-equipped to include all the same benefits of *Latency Compensation*, but your alignment is just moving the music backward by a bar instead of punching in a track offset. Great for DAW's that don't have a negative track delay implemented, but now since it is bar-based, the challenge is also making it work if the tempo is automated. My current approach to solving this is "I have no idea, but I can probably figure it out eventually."
> 
> Our proposed best-organization workflow for *Lookahead* is that utilizing shared-duplicate MIDI clips across two separate tracks is the way to go.
> 
> For example, let's say I am writing a Violins I track. I am writing the part at the correct measure number on a track that is not hooked up to TSS, and doesn't make sound. A 2nd track with the shared MIDI clips will have them moved backward by 1 measure, and that one is the track sending to TSS. This lets me write at the correct spot in the music on the silent track, and when I hit "play" in the DAW, the final sound is correctly in time as the shared MIDI clips took care of transferring to the 2nd track.
> 
> I'm sure people have their own preferred solutions to the main track being silent, like hooking it up to a sketch piano sound, or even loading TSS again in some 0-latency state (perhaps turning legato off). Perhaps some even cleverer people will use something like Muteomatic so that when the DAW transport begins, the sketch track isn't outputting any sound. This kind of long-term Lookahead has really barely been done before except in very recent times, so we have to be creative to find best practices.


Some thoughts:
1. Please be very careful about how you communicate and distinguish between latency mode and lookahead mode. Recent examples come to mind where people had a hard time figuring out why the library doesn't do what they would expect.
2. NGL the two tracks per instrument sounds awful workflow-wise but if it was good enough to eliminate the need for keyswitching, I would still be interested in trying it out. I'd be interested in how you'd still give users the ability to influence what articulations would be used if the lookahead is deciding something that the user doesn't agree with.
3. I hope that the chosen latency for latency mode will be long enough to allow me to basically only work with this mode in terms of legato quality. I am however very grateful that you don't seem to be planning on incorporating different offsets within the same patch (looking at you, widely beloved library who should not be named here that I personally absolutely hate having to work with).
4. Did I read correctly? Polylegato? Will TSS support Polylegato? :O


----------



## ToadsworthLP

Sounds incredibly helpful! About the alignment when using lookahead: couldn't we just simply route every instrument other than TSS through a delay set to 1 bar/0% feedback/100% wet to synchronize everything?

Also, how does lookahead behave when playback is started in the middle of a bar? Will it start its analysis from there or will it wait for the start of the next bar (thus causing desynchronization issues if the track is moved back by a fixed amount) ?


----------



## Sovereign

Please make the poly legato optional with an on/off toggle.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Sovereign said:


> Please make the poly legato optional with an on/off toggle.



It is, there is a mono/poly switch for that. (Automatable, too!)



mybadmemory said:


> @Andrew Aversa If TSS will sell well so you make it a full orchestral series, in what order would you tackle the other sections? And would the woodwinds be focusing on upfront soloistic performances rather than orchestral seating of a2s a3s etc?



We're dealing with pre-production territory here, but as mentioned the next instrument to be recorded is acoustic drums (kits & drum ensemble). Not really orchestral percussion per se, but acoustic kits are extremely common in a wide range of Japanese anime & game music, both for epic scores and J-pop, rock / OPs etc. Recording dates are being set up for this now, hopefully in October.

After that we have a reasonably solid layout for winds. The plan here would be to focus on soloists exclusively with a range of beautiful and expressive instruments; both traditional orchestral ones (flute, oboe, clarinet...) plus commonly-used world instruments like tin whistle, and native Japanese sounds like shakuhachi.

Even though we've sampled some winds before for Ventus (and that series will still continue), this is different because it's recorded in the same studio as TSS - so, more room than Ventus which is quite dry - with totally different players and a different engineer. So, we're doing it to be consistent and to have it all in one package.


----------



## neblix

Denkii said:


> Some thoughts:
> 1. Please be very careful about how you communicate and distinguish between latency mode and lookahead mode. Recent examples come to mind where people had a hard time figuring out why the library doesn't do what they would expect.
> 2. NGL the two tracks per instrument sounds awful workflow-wise but if it was good enough to eliminate the need for keyswitching, I would still be interested in trying it out. I'd be interested in how you'd still give users the ability to influence what articulations would be used if the lookahead is deciding something that the user doesn't agree with.
> 3. I hope that the chosen latency for latency mode will be long enough to allow me to basically only work with this mode in terms of legato quality. I am however very grateful that you don't seem to be planning on incorporating different offsets within the same patch (looking at you, widely beloved library who should not be named here that I personally absolutely hate having to work with).
> 4. Did I read correctly? Polylegato? Will TSS support Polylegato? :O


1. Yes, the presentation of this is very important to us, not to worry! As I also said, they will not be the final names of the features either.

2. Of course anyone can simply move their MIDI clips backward by a bar, if they prefer not to use an double track approach. To me, it screws up the composition process significantly if I move MIDI around, now my strings are completely misaligned from the piano and can not evaluate anything musical when looking at their shared MIDI data in the piano roll. As for artic switching, it's mainly for longs and shorts, and if you use keyswitches during lookahead, it will manually override to them to respect user choice.

3. I'm not quite certain I understand the concern here, but I can reiterate that there is only a *single* reported latency, and it is calculated based on the absolute longest time it would need to be ahead (in 99% cases, this is the longest portamento transition). The offsets are different per section, though we are considering delaying them all to a standard number (like 250ms or 300ms) even if a few sections don't need that long, just for template simplicity. In the dev state of things, Violins II is 164ms, whereas Contrabasses is 220ms; this can just be probably be made simpler by every patch having the same maximum.

The idea is, once you punch the number into the track, there will no longer be any alignment issues. Even shorts will be offset backwards in time a little bit to account for their pre-roll and initial bow noise!

4. Our poly legato tech is already fleshed out and in the wild; check out Ventus Duduk. The AGILITY engine introduced poly legato and the latency compensation. Poly legato for performance and recording is based on a latency window that the user can set; say it's 100ms, as long as you let go of voices and engage new voices within a window's distance of each other, it calculates voiceleading for them and uses legato transitions. You can even hold a G and legato a 2nd voice between a D below and an A above. Because it is timing based, it recognizes the G is a held middle voice and processes D -> A -> D -> etc.

Check here at 9:20:

​


For sequencing, the latency can be set to 0 and "Split-Point Legato" can be turned on instead. Split-Point Legato eliminates the need for overlap for quantized MIDI. so as long as a the note starts and ends are directly the same timestamp (on the grid or off), it will process legato. It includes the poly processing as well. Poly legato, fully in time, no nudging, no overlaps. And it's not some lofty ambitious promise; it already works, just check out the video!

What we're focusing on is making it very easy for the user to understand what is happening. There are lots of things we need to convey in a very simple way. Poly legato works using a latency, and it needs that latency in order to catch a human legato transition. It'll add to the reported latency for latency compensation if this latency is used. You could then turn the latency off if you wanted, but then you'd have to align and quantize what you had performed (or turn the latency very low and still utilize a bit of overlap). This is all confusing for the uninitiated so we're talking about how to do away with the complications of it.

This is why the latency and latency comp verbiage may be retired in favor of things like "Recording Mode" and "Sequencing Mode", to better convey to the user where these features actually come into play.




ToadsworthLP said:


> Sounds incredibly helpful! About the alignment when using lookahead: couldn't we just simply route every instrument other than TSS through a delay set to 1 bar/0% feedback/100% wet to synchronize everything?
> 
> Also, how does lookahead behave when playback is started in the middle of a bar? Will it start its analysis from there or will it wait for the start of the next bar (thus causing desynchronization issues if the track is moved back by a fixed amount) ?



A delay would add a bar, not subtract one. This means you've made TSS that sounded 1 bar late now sound 2 bars late! The track offset is to move the MIDI clip backwards (earlier) in time, not forwards. The double-track approach is just suggested to keep one visually correct for writing and another to actually playback.

EDIT: Unless you mean adding a VST that reports a negative delay to the DAW's PDC. That is actually incredibly clever and I'll discuss that with the team.

The lookahead is not actually synced to literal bars, it's just the length of the latency. Analysis begins wherever and whenever MIDI is received, and lasts 1 bar (or different if we decide).


----------



## Germain B

Andrew Aversa said:


> After that we have a reasonably solid layout for winds. The plan here would be to focus on soloists exclusively with a range of beautiful and expressive instruments; both traditional orchestral ones (flute, oboe, clarinet...) plus commonly-used world instruments like tin whistle, and native Japanese sounds like shakuhachi.


Ooooooh yes !!


----------



## mybadmemory

neblix said:


> The offsets are different per section, though we are considering delaying them all to a standard number (like 250ms or 300ms) even if a few sections don't need that long, just for template simplicity.


I’m definitely in favor for one consistent delay value across the whole library or even library range!


----------



## neblix

mybadmemory said:


> I’m definitely in favor for one consistent delay value across the whole library or even library range!


The wrench that gets thrown in is the Poly Legato, since it's user definable. If not using poly legato, we can certainly have a consistent value. But with poly legato, even in a low-latency "recording mode", it requires the latency in order to react to your playing. This is why we're taking a while to figure out the best user experience.

With recent talks, we are also thinking of unifying our two systems into just one that has selectable options, like disabling artic switching.


----------



## Trash Panda

@neblix I would recommend checking out Audio Imperia’s products if you’re not already familiar with them. They do a number of the technical things you speak of (consistent pre-transient cuts, a tight mode toggle that cuts the pre-transient and poly legato).


----------



## CatOrchestra

Hope you will make a Piano VST that fits into this series : )


----------



## Andrew Aversa

CatOrchestra said:


> Hope you will make a Piano VST that fits into this series : )



I would not rule that out. Compared to some of these other projects it would be nice to do something "simple"...


----------



## constaneum

Why you guys keep mentioning only piano, brass , woodwinds and percussion? Where's the love for harp ? Ahah


----------



## HM_Music

constaneum said:


> Why you guys keep mentioning only piano, brass , woodwinds and percussion? Where's the love for harp ? Ahah


I would like to have a separate library with pianos (preferably some stainway, yamaha), electro piano, harp, celeste, glockenspiel, harpsichord, vibraphone and traditional Japanese instruments of the type.
But I doubt they will release that many, at best a couple of them will be stuffed into a percussion library.
Honestly, yeah, I'd like to get a harp as well, maybe separately.

What's frustrating, it looks like it will take a very long time to release all the libraries in that style, at best it will all be available in 2025.


----------



## Toecutter

neblix said:


> We have also floated the idea of automatic CC phrasing


This sounds intriguing, care to elaborate? If it's what it sounds like it is... wow this will be hard to do, will you do it by analyzing traditional repertoire? How many variations for the user to pick... dozens, hundreds, thousands? Sounds like a ton of work but potentially a game changer! Thanks for the excellent post and good luck on finishing TSS


----------



## Toecutter

Andrew Aversa said:


> After that we have a reasonably solid layout for winds. The plan here would be to focus on soloists exclusively with a range of beautiful and expressive instruments; both traditional orchestral ones (flute, oboe, clarinet...) plus commonly-used world instruments like tin whistle, and native Japanese sounds like shakuhachi.
> 
> Even though we've sampled some winds before for Ventus (and that series will still continue), this is different because it's recorded in the same studio as TSS - so, more room than Ventus which is quite dry - with totally different players and a different engineer. So, we're doing it to be consistent and to have it all in one package.


I'd pre-order TSW now, don't even need to hear it based on my experience with Ventus (thanks for keeping the series alive btw). Woodwinds at Sound City... just take my money!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

HM_Music said:


> I would like to have a separate library with pianos (preferably some stainway, yamaha), electro piano, harp, celeste, glockenspiel, harpsichord, vibraphone and traditional Japanese instruments of the type.
> But I doubt they will release that many, at best a couple of them will be stuffed into a percussion library.
> Honestly, yeah, I'd like to get a harp as well, maybe separately.
> 
> What's frustrating, it looks like it will take a very long time to release all the libraries in that style, at best it will all be available in 2025.



Of course I can't promise release schedules - certainly not this early - but I doubt it would take us that long. Strings are arguably the hardest to schedule due to the sheer number of people. Nothing else requires ensembles this big, so provided sales are good with TSS and the rest of our product line, we should be able to overlap phases of the production process for these libraries.


----------



## blaggins

The teaser sounds incredible, immediately conjures memories of Spirited Away and various other Ghibli movies I've watched and loved (though I have a feeling the composition has a lot to do with that, not predominantly the "sound" per se). Regardless, I can basically hear an anime movie or a JRPG playing in my head just listening to it, incredible. 

But this actually leaves me with a nagging beginner's question. Why does Tokyo Scoring Strings sound so different than say Spitfire Chamber Strings with the Close mics turned up and the Tree down a bit (and the Ambient off). OR even say SCS Pro with mostly just the Close Stereo Pair mic or one of either the Fine or Medium mixes? The Tokyo Scoring Strings teaser sounds pretty dry to me, so I would think it should be possible to approximate the sound with an string ensemble of roughly the same configuration so long as the reverberance and tail of the larger recording space was "contained" through the use of close mics. Although I have a feeling I'm wrong about this, I don't know why.

For example, Tokyo Scoring Strings (is it too early to start abbreviating to TSS?) is (8/6/4/4/3) while SCS is (4,3,3,3,3). That feels "reasonably" close to me, close enough that I would think I should be able to get that sound if I knew what I was doing (which as stated before, I don't). 

Can someone enlighten me about the nuances of recording and space that leads to such diversity in the resulting sound of say TSS vs. SCS? Is it really impossible to take the AIR out of SCS?


----------



## Jish

tpoots said:


> Is it really impossible to take the AIR out of SCS?


The very notion of somehow 'taking' AIR out of SCS should be punishable by something truly awful....like reading the entire thread history of Sonokinetic's alleged upcoming Orchestral Strings Library and being quizzed in rapid succession on the timeline of the release dates. Miss one, and you gotta read back from page one.

Really though, the question of why TSS so far appears to sound very different from SCS for example is likely for many reasons, though of course the massive difference in both spaces is a big one. Also the players, how they were likely instructed to play, equipment and techniques used during the entire process, ect. The only thing that immediately comes to mind, is that whenever I was going for my own little take on this general 'sound' I frequently used MS' Soaring Strings as a foundation for the strings. It's very specific and even limited in it's own way, but whatever Aaron did specifically for that one got me closer than anything prior to this new release being discussed (which sounds highly promising, so far).


----------



## mybadmemory

constaneum said:


> Why you guys keep mentioning only piano, brass , woodwinds and percussion? Where's the love for harp ? Ahah


I did mention harp! Celtic harp even! 🥳


----------



## Go To 11

HM_Music said:


> I would like to have a separate library with pianos (preferably some stainway, yamaha), electro piano, harp, celeste, glockenspiel, harpsichord, vibraphone and traditional Japanese instruments of the type.
> But I doubt they will release that many, at best a couple of them will be stuffed into a percussion library.
> Honestly, yeah, I'd like to get a harp as well, maybe separately.
> 
> What's frustrating, it looks like it will take a very long time to release all the libraries in that style, at best it will all be available in 2025.


Only on VI-C would someone invent a product lineup for a company, and then express their frustration at their own proposed release schedule for said completely made up products.


----------



## muziksculp

Will TSS have Sordino versions for the Legato Sections ?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

muziksculp said:


> Will TSS have Sordino versions for the Legato Sections ?



We did not record sordino because we felt (and it seems people agreed) that was a lower priority than various other things (like a real violins 2 instead of a "faked" vlns2, more dynamics, etc.) 

However we're going to experiment with carefully modeled EQ to simulate sordino. This has been done well in other libraries and I think we could do it well here.


----------



## muziksculp

Andrew Aversa said:


> However we're going to experiment with carefully modeled EQ to simulate sordino. This has been done well in other libraries and I think we could do it well here.


That would be good enough if you can get a really good sounding modeled EQ to simulate the Sordinos. Which can be enabled for any articulation of TSS. 

Thanks.


----------



## mybadmemory

@muziksculp *really* loves his sordinos. 😁


----------



## muziksculp

mybadmemory said:


> @muziksculp *really* loves his sordinos. 😁


Who ?


----------



## muziksculp

Hi,

I know that TSS will be very close to the sound of the strings in the Octapath Traveler Soundtrack. What other soundtracks can you recommend that sound similar to the Octapath Traveler ? 

I'm also curious if TSS can also sound close to some of the Studio Ghibli Soundtracks composed by Joe Hisaishi i.e. Princess Mononoke, Spirited Away ? I can hear some of resemblance to these soundtracks in the TSS Teaser video. 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## constaneum

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> I know that TSS will be very close to the sound of the strings in the Octapath Traveler Soundtrack. What other soundtracks can you recommend that sound similar to the Octapath Traveler ?
> 
> I'm also curious if TSS can also sound close to some of the Studio Ghibli Soundtracks composed by Joe Hisaishi i.e. Princess Mononoke, Spirited Away ? I can hear some of resemblance to these soundtracks in the TSS Teaser video.
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp


If you're referring to the same strings group, then i'll say Final Fantasay Brave Exvius.


If you're referring to that similar Japanese strings sound (different strings group), i'll say Bravely Default.


----------



## MA-Simon

Very glad you are recording another vib sustain! For me the vib was a bit missing in the demos. For me that japanese string sound is very much vib heavy and silky. Mostly featuring very slow, but heavy vibrato. Hope you get some nice, slow transitons.


----------



## jaketanner

Had no idea this sound was so sought after by you guys...I don't follow any Japanese game, I don't even play games or follow anime...so is this what they're basically used for? Are they tuned differently?


----------



## mybadmemory

jaketanner said:


> Had no idea this sound was so sought after by you guys...I don't follow any Japanese game, I don't even play games or follow anime...so is this what they're basically used for? Are they tuned differently?



Japanese game music is what got me interested in orchestras in the first place in the early 90s. My musical schooling is basically analyzing midi files of Japanese composers downloaded on dial-up connections from vgmusic.com in junior high.

It’s also why ended up in the games industry some 15 years ago, even though my career have been in art and design rather than music since.

This Japanese game / anime-sound is obviously part musical / compositional and part musicianship, ensemble and room size, and recording / engineering. It has also evolved over the years, but for me personally it’s always been what I’ve been striving for.


----------



## jaketanner

mybadmemory said:


> Japanese game music is what got me interested in orchestras in the first place in the early 90s. My musical schooling is basically analyzing midi files of Japanese composers downloaded on dial-up connections from vgmusic.com in junior high.
> 
> It’s also why ended up in the games industry some 15 years ago, even though my career have been in art and design rather than music since.
> 
> This Japanese game / anime-sound is obviously part musical / compositional and part musicianship, ensemble and room size, and recording / engineering. It has also evolved over the years, but for me personally it’s always been what I’ve been striving for.


interesting.


----------



## Trash Panda

jaketanner said:


> interesting.


Rude!  






Is "interesting" a euphemism for "sucks"?


I've noted over the years, when someone says, "interesting piece" or something similar, it inevitably precedes a lot of negative commentary. I've heard the word thrown around as a the only comment, as in, "interesting," which also feels like a subtle indication that the person either doesn't...




vi-control.net


----------



## Vlzmusic

jaketanner said:


> Had no idea this sound was so sought after by you guys...I don't follow any Japanese game, I don't even play games or follow anime...so is this what they're basically used for? Are they tuned differently?


They are entirely regular strings, nothing ethnic. It's the certain style of melody writing, the medium size, the particular studio sound and, of course, specific orchestration tricks that make that "Mario Galaxy" vibe. 

Interesting that there were some Japanese projects recorded in Moscow during 90ies, in the wonderful Mosfilm recording studio, with the Soviet Cinematography Orchestra. They were fine, but sound differently from the Japanese.

Or if you dive deeper into the past, there was a Soviet-Japanese animation co-production titled "The adventures of Lolo the Penguin". It was recorded in Japan, if I recall correctly, and while it's not the sound we discuss here, still you can track the aesthetic that later transformed into games etc.


----------



## muziksculp

So, once TSS is released, I was wondering, which Libraries would you use for the other sections of the orchestra that will blend nicely with the sound of TSS, until Andrew/ISW releases the other sections of the orchestra ?


----------



## Germain B

I guess still OT Berlin's libraries. The individual players make it so comfortable to craft one orchestration to taste.


----------



## muziksculp

Germain B said:


> I guess still OT Berlin's libraries. The individual players make it so comfortable to craft one orchestration to taste.


Yes, I think that's a very good choice. 

Thanks


----------



## Trash Panda

muziksculp said:


> So, once TSS is released, I was wondering, which Libraries would you use for the other sections of the orchestra that will blend nicely with the sound of TSS, until Andrew/ISW releases the other sections of the orchestra ?


Infinite Brass and Winds can blend to any space. Not sure what the RT60 is off the room this was recorded in, but I’m sure the Studio or Bersa Hall would work nicely with it and you can tailor your section size accordingly.


----------



## Casiquire

mybadmemory said:


> @muziksculp *really* loves his sordinos. 😁


So do i, to be fair!


----------



## mybadmemory

muziksculp said:


> So, once TSS is released, I was wondering, which Libraries would you use for the other sections of the orchestra that will blend nicely with the sound of TSS, until Andrew/ISW releases the other sections of the orchestra ?


CSW + CSB because of the slightly smaller sections perhaps? I’ve heard demos where they sound very much on brand for this sound. Or Berlin Soloists or AI Solo for those really lyrical melodies?


----------



## muziksculp

mybadmemory said:


> CSW + CSB because of the slightly smaller sections perhaps? I’ve heard demos where they sound very much on brand for this sound. Or Berlin Soloists or AI Solo for those really lyrical melodies?


Yes, I would think that all of these libraries would be suitable choices.


----------



## jaketanner

Trash Panda said:


> Rude!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is "interesting" a euphemism for "sucks"?
> 
> 
> I've noted over the years, when someone says, "interesting piece" or something similar, it inevitably precedes a lot of negative commentary. I've heard the word thrown around as a the only comment, as in, "interesting," which also feels like a subtle indication that the person either doesn't...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vi-control.net


since when? I can't tell if you are joking or kidding.


----------



## jaketanner

Vlzmusic said:


> They are entirely regular strings, nothing ethnic. It's the certain style of melody writing, the medium size, the particular studio sound and, of course, specific orchestration tricks that make that "Mario Galaxy" vibe.
> 
> Interesting that there were some Japanese projects recorded in Moscow during 90ies, in the wonderful Mosfilm recording studio, with the Soviet Cinematography Orchestra. They were fine, but sound differently from the Japanese.
> 
> Or if you dive deeper into the past, there was a Soviet-Japanese animation co-production titled "The adventures of Lolo the Penguin". It was recorded in Japan, if I recall correctly, and while it's not the sound we discuss here, still you can track the aesthetic that later transformed into games etc.


Got it...thanks for the explanation. I wasn't sure if they were something like the Sultan Strings.


----------



## jaketanner

Trash Panda said:


> Rude!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Is "interesting" a euphemism for "sucks"?
> 
> 
> I've noted over the years, when someone says, "interesting piece" or something similar, it inevitably precedes a lot of negative commentary. I've heard the word thrown around as a the only comment, as in, "interesting," which also feels like a subtle indication that the person either doesn't...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vi-control.net


incase you are wondering, I really did just mean interesting..LOL That thread was wild...LOL There are so many words that have become a P.C. issue it's ridiculous.


----------



## muziksculp

LOL.. What happened to Uninteresting ?


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

jaketanner said:


> incase you are wondering, I really did just mean interesting..LOL That thread was wild...LOL There are so many words that have become a P.C. issue it's ridiculous.


It's a joke, not a "PC issue". Maybe turn off your own PC once in a while and go outside


----------



## jeremyr

Vlzmusic said:


> Interesting that there were some Japanese projects recorded in Moscow during 90ies, in the wonderful Mosfilm recording studio, with the Soviet Cinematography Orchestra. They were fine, but sound differently from the Japanese.


Also Warsaw, particularly for Yoko Kanno and Masamichi Amano. In Kanno's case she'd record some tracks in Japan with a small studio orchestra while others with a huge orchestra in Warsaw. You can hear the disparity in her amazing soundtrack to Brain Powerd:

Studio orchestra (ignore the description, it's wrong according to vgmdb) :




Warsaw Philharmonic:


----------



## Trash Panda

jaketanner said:


> incase you are wondering, I really did just mean interesting..LOL That thread was wild...LOL There are so many words that have become a P.C. issue it's ridiculous.


It’s just a joke. Last time I checked, there’s no racist undertones to the word “interesting” so it’s not a PC issue.


----------



## jaketanner

Trash Panda said:


> It’s just a joke. Last time I checked, there’s no racist undertones to the word “interesting” so it’s not a PC issue.


You never know nowadays...LOL. I thought you were, but I've seen some FB posts where the simplest words are being changed..LOl. but that's a whole different thread.


----------



## tcb

Could not wait TSS release any more!
And I have an idea suddenly,as TSS is a J-Game/Anime style string library ,I want an Anime wife Kontakt wallpaper 🙃!And GUI …


----------



## Zanshin

TSS waifu


----------



## chrisav

Please no


----------



## Jackdnp121

tcb said:


> Could not wait TSS release any more!
> And I have an idea suddenly,as TSS is a J-Game/Anime style string library ,I want an Anime wife Kontakt wallpaper 🙃!And GUI …


I would like a Totoro kontakt wallpaper 🤣


----------



## brenneisen

tcb said:


> Could not wait TSS release any more!
> And I have an idea suddenly,as TSS is a J-Game/Anime style string library ,I want an Anime wife Kontakt wallpaper 🙃!And GUI …


I think you might love this


----------



## HM_Music

brenneisen said:


> I think you might love this


If the plugin was better... I would even buy a stereo imager like this, just for fun.


----------



## Drundfunk

brenneisen said:


> I think you might love this


Everyday we stray further from god...... . Bought!


----------



## VSriHarsha

tcb said:


> Could not wait TSS release any more!
> And I have an idea suddenly,as TSS is a J-Game/Anime style string library ,I want an Anime wife Kontakt wallpaper 🙃!And GUI …


Is that true? It’s meant for Japanese Animation kinda scores? Yea am aware of the title of the library but thought could be used for multi purposes.


----------



## dzilizzi

VSriHarsha said:


> Is that true? It’s meant for Japanese Animation kinda scores? Yea am aware of the title of the library but thought could be used for multi purposes.


It can. It just has a different style/sound from other strings. I don't do Japanese anime, but I will probably pick it up because I like the sound that I've heard so far.


----------



## Gaffable

dzilizzi said:


> It can. It just has a different style/sound from other strings. I don't do Japanese anime, but I will probably pick it up because I like the sound that I've heard so far.


I'm the same. I don't have any interest in writing music for anime but I am very keen to buy Tokyo Scoring Strings. The library has a sound that is so different to every other string library I have heard. It has a sound that evokes happiness and lightness of spirit.

A couple of years ago I was on holiday in Japan. One day I was shopping for groceries at a supermarket and my passport accidentally fell out of my coat pocket at the checkout counter. I paid for my groceries and left the store without realising what had happened. When I got back to my accommodation I discovered that my passport was missing. I wasn't sure where I had lost the passport but I thought that the most likely place was probably at the supermarket, so I hurried back.

On my way there I was feeling anxious because I only know a handful of very basic Japanese words and I was concerned that I would not be able to communicate the loss of my passport to the supermarket staff. I need not have worried. Within 10 seconds of walking into the store, the woman who had served me at the checkout sprinted 20 metres towards me, bowed deeply and then extended her arms out before her with my passport held in both hands.

I was completely overwhelmed and filled with extreme gratitude.

As I was trying to thank her in my limited Japanese, five or six other staff gathered in a semi-circle behind her and bowed to me. The woman who returned my passport started crying tears of joy.

I relate this story because the emotions I felt after this experience are similar to the emotions I feel when listening to the TSS demos. The demos evoke in me a sense of childlike joy and lightness of being.


----------



## Oliver

Gaffable said:


> I'm the same. I don't have any interest in writing music for anime but I am very keen to buy Tokyo Scoring Strings. The library has a sound that is so different to every other string library I have heard. It has a sound that evokes happiness and lightness of spirit.
> 
> A couple of years ago I was on holiday in Japan. One day I was shopping for groceries at a supermarket and my passport accidentally fell out of my coat pocket at the checkout counter. I paid for my groceries and left the store without realising what had happened. When I got back to my accommodation I discovered that my passport was missing. I wasn't sure where I had lost the passport but I thought that the most likely place was probably at the supermarket, so I hurried back.
> 
> On my way there I was feeling anxious because I only know a handful of very basic Japanese words and I was concerned that I would not be able to communicate the loss of my passport to the supermarket staff. I need not have worried. Within 10 seconds of walking into the store, the woman who had served me at the checkout sprinted 20 metres towards me, bowed deeply and then extended her arms out before her with my passport held in both hands.
> 
> I was completely overwhelmed and filled with extreme gratitude.
> 
> As I was trying to thank her in my limited Japanese, five or six other staff gathered in a semi-circle behind her and bowed to me. The woman who returned my passport started crying tears of joy.
> 
> I relate this story because the emotions I felt after this experience are similar to the emotions I feel when listening to the TSS demos. The demos evoke in me a sense of childlike joy and lightness of being.


what a lovely heartwarming story...bow!


----------



## mybadmemory

When I was in Tokyo in 2009, I was astonished by how clean and tidy everything was. No signs of graffiti, vandalism, or trash anywhere despite it being a dense city of over 14 million people. This had me and my friends starting to deliberately look for imperfections in the perfect scenery just because we couldn’t really find any.

One of the last days around we stumbled across a missing stone in the pavement which resulted in a small gap. Almost lyrical over the fact that we finally found something off, we started taking pictures of this rare gem of a discovery.

While standing there a car parked right next to us. Out jumped two community workers, one carrying a stone and the other carrying a brush and a rubber hammer. They kneeled before us, brushed away some dirt and pebbles from the ground, put the new stone down, hammered it in place, jumped back into car and vanished. In a matter of seconds, right before our eyes, perfection was restored. We just stood there laughing for a while.

This has absolutely nothing to do with why I will buy TSS on day one, but boy do I love Japan. ❤️


----------



## constaneum

There's a new audio demo on discord


----------



## muziksculp

mybadmemory said:


> When I was in Tokyo in 2009, I was astonished by how clean and tidy everything was. No signs of graffiti, vandalism, or trash anywhere despite it being a dense city of over 14 million people. This had me and my friends starting to deliberately look for imperfections in the perfect scenery just because we couldn’t really find any.
> 
> One of the last days around we stumbled across a missing stone in the pavement which resulted in a small gap. Almost lyrical over the fact that we finally found something off, we started taking pictures of this rare gem of a discovery.
> 
> While standing there a car parked right next to us. Out jumped two community workers, one carrying a stone and the other carrying a brush and a rubber hammer. They kneeled before us, brushed away some dirt and pebbles from the ground, put the new stone down, hammered it in place, jumped back into car and vanished. In a matter of seconds, right before our eyes, perfection was restored. We just stood there laughing for a while.
> 
> This has absolutely nothing to do with why I will buy TSS on day one, but boy do I love Japan. ❤️


Thanks for sharing this. 

I have been to Japan 4 times, the first time I was 4 years old. 

I had a fantastic experience in my trips as an adult to Japan, and fascinated by their rich culture, cuisine, music, and how clean and tidy everything is. 

I would love to visit Japan again, I also have a very dear Japanese friend who lives in Tokyo. 🧡

Looking forward to the release of TSS. 

Cheer,
Muziksculp


----------



## muziksculp

constaneum said:


> There's a new audio demo on discord


Thanks for the heads up. 

Lovely demo.


----------



## VSriHarsha

dzilizzi said:


> It can. It just has a different style/sound from other strings. I don't do Japanese anime, but I will probably pick it up because I like the sound that I've heard so far.


Cool! Thanks @dzilizzi !
Well, anything with legato goes in my list lol! I haven’t heard the demos I would watch some Walkthrus & yes, this totally IS geared towards a different target genre(s) & yes, it seems any toon-ish kinda score IS pretty much manageable with this. On top of it, I really like ISW & yes, absolutely this gonna be impressive.


----------



## jason3.14

Can't wait to do some octopath traveler mockups once this is out!


----------



## muziksculp

I don't feel TSS is restricted to producing Japanese Anime style tracks, imho. it can be used just like any other Strings library for various scoring applications, it just has a special character. i.e. it could be used to score a Drama series, or any other media project.


----------



## chapbot

muziksculp said:


> I don't feel TSS is restricted to producing Japanese Anime style tracks, imho. it can be used just like any other Strings library for various scoring applications, it just has a special character. i.e. it could be used to score a Drama series, or any other media project.


I have been loling: I DON'T DO ANIME BUT...

Huh? These strings sound great lol


----------



## dzilizzi

chapbot said:


> I have been loling: I DON'T DO ANIME BUT...
> 
> Huh? These strings sound great lol


Well, someone asked if they were only for Japanese anime music......


----------



## Toecutter

New audio demo is really good, glad we're getting different examples other than the anime stuff. Whoever was worried about TSS being a one trick pony have nothing to sweat about. Can't wait to hear the molto vibrato recordings!


----------



## mybadmemory

When TSS is out, before we have a full series covering everything, what would your top picks be for winds, brass, percussion, piano and harp considering the sound signature of the references TSS and the rest of the series will try to replicate?

For winds I’m thinking Berlin Soloists, CSW, or AI Solo, but for brass, perc, piano, and harp, I’d love to hear some suggestions!


----------



## constaneum

mybadmemory said:


> When TSS is out, before we have a full series covering everything, what would your top picks be for winds, brass, percussion, piano and harp considering the sound signature of the references TSS and the rest of the series will try to replicate?
> 
> For winds I’m thinking Berlin Soloists, CSW, or AI Solo, but for brass, perc, piano, and harp, I’d love to hear some suggestions!


Wind CSW.

Brass can go for Berlin Brass, CSB or even IB (can shape smaller sized ensemble)

Percussion probably Berlin, Rhapsody, Cinesamples.

Piano and harp pretty much anything


----------



## holywilly

brenneisen said:


> I think you might love this


I bought this and fail to activate….NANI!!!!


----------



## jeremyr

I'm getting some really good anime OST-like results with Infinite Brass, especially the trumpets and horns. The Sample Modeling solo trumpet is also useful because of its highly controllable vibrato, so you can get a real Code Geass sound out of it.

For winds I'm also using Infinite but I doubt the legato is as lush as CSW or Berlin so I've been eying one of them for some time now. I have the discount for CSW but I've not heard very good demos so far. My fear is I buy one of them and then Aaron releases an update for winds and I end up going back, just like I did the brass (I don't touch the SM horn/trombone/tuba anymore.)

Tomoyuki Asakawa harp library when?


----------



## Zanshin

Yeah my immediate thought was Infinite as well.


----------



## william81723

These are the newest demos from discord.
I'm already in.

Edit：It's real performance.



muziksculp said:


> Quote from Andrew regarding these last two demos :
> 
> "the second one, Conflict, also live, but just to illustrate that it really depends on what they are playing
> like at a soft dynamic they tend to de-emphasize the transitions and almost crescendo out of them
> at a forte or ff, they keep pretty much constant volume/pressure
> so that means the same exact legato settings in TSS for ff dont work for mf
> and mf doesnt work for pp
> its a puzzle"


----------



## muziksculp

william81723 said:


> These are the newest demos from discord.
> I'm already in.


Didn't Andrew mention that these demos were performed live by the string orchestra ? Are you sure these are TSS demos ?


----------



## muziksculp

Quote from Andrew regarding these last two demos :

"the second one, Conflict, also live, but just to illustrate that it really depends on what they are playing
like at a soft dynamic they tend to de-emphasize the transitions and almost crescendo out of them
at a forte or ff, they keep pretty much constant volume/pressure
so that means the same exact legato settings in TSS for ff dont work for mf
and mf doesnt work for pp
its a puzzle"


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

Those are not demos of the library. Those are real performances.


----------



## muziksculp

Sarah Mancuso said:


> Those are not demos of the library. Those are real performances.


Yes, that's what Andrew wrote about them.


----------



## mybadmemory

Fantastic to hear real isolated lines like this, as a comparison to the samples!


----------



## muziksculp

mybadmemory said:


> Fantastic to hear real isolated lines like this, as a comparison to the samples!


Yes, but he didn't post any TSS midi performance of the live orchestra played parts so we can compare the two versions.


----------



## mybadmemory

muziksculp said:


> Yes, but he didn't post any TSS midi performance of the live orchestra played parts so we can compare the two versions.


But we can compare it ourselves later when the library is out. Or compare it to the libraries we already have right now! It's a little rare to hear a full section play a longer melody isolated like this. And a great reference to have while crafting your lines!


----------



## william81723

Sarah Mancuso said:


> Those are not demos of the library. Those are real performances.


Ooooops! My fault~


----------



## constaneum

The live one has a tastier vibrato sound compared to the sampled. Is it becoz live one is molto vibrato which TSS gonna sample the extra vibrato?


----------



## william81723

constaneum said:


> The live one has a tastier vibrato sound compared to the sampled. Is it becoz live one is molto vibrato which TSS gonna sample the extra vibrato?


My thought as well!!


----------



## odod

i hope they would included the piano and drums in the youtube demo .. sounds soo damn good


----------



## muziksculp

odod said:


> i hope they would included the piano and drums in the youtube demo .. sounds soo damn good


I recall Andrew mention they have plans to release a separate TSS Perc. library, that would be more geared toward drum kits, not orchestral perc. , not sure about the Piano, but that could also be another library release for ISW.


----------



## constaneum

this is Muroya Strings also. Looking forward to Violin strings section to sound like this


----------



## holywilly

Yuki Hayashi just finished his live stream concert minutes ago. Lovely sound.


----------



## muziksculp

Latest TSS test demo posted by Andrew. (TSS_Octapath Battle)

View attachment TSS_Octopath_Battle_1.mp3


----------



## william81723

muziksculp said:


> Latest TSS test demo posted by Andrew. (TSS_Octapath Battle)
> 
> View attachment TSS_Octopath_Battle_1.mp3


Wowwwwwwwwwwwww........................


----------



## mybadmemory

muziksculp said:


> Latest TSS test demo posted by Andrew. (TSS_Octapath Battle)
> 
> View attachment TSS_Octopath_Battle_1.mp3


That sounds absolutely unbelievable! 😍


----------



## muziksculp

william81723 said:


> Wowwwwwwwwwwwww........................


Yes, They sound beautiful, and so agile, the legatos, and portamentos playing this fast tempo passage and it sounds so natural, this isn't an easy task for your average strings library. Nothng sticks out as odd sounding. Amazing.


----------



## william81723

muziksculp said:


> Yes, They sound beautiful, and so agile, the legatos, and portamentos playing this fast tempo passage and it sounds so natural, this isn't an easy task for your average strings library. Nothng sticks out as odd sounding. Amazing.


Agree with you. What a lovely sound I dream of. The transitions are also clear and perform with emotion.


----------



## muziksculp

Also loving the silky timbre of these violins. Just like the strings in the Octapath Traveler Soundtrack. Which was Andrew's focus for this library. I'm very impressed by the results so far, and very happy to see so much progress happening with this project. It's just going to get better, and better from here until it is released.


----------



## MA-Simon

Sounds awesome!

Something which could be cool, is like a accented layer with stronger attack/vib playing on high velocities, like almost sforzando but with faster vib only right at the beginning. Like a punch. To get that Da-da-da-da melody effect. Just to get some more bite on important melody notes.


----------



## Tremendouz

Fast legato that doesn't sound sloppy? Sign me up


----------



## muziksculp

MA-Simon said:


> Sounds awesome!
> 
> Something which could be cool, is like a accented layer with stronger attack/vib playing on high velocities, like almost sforzando but with faster vib only right at the beginning. Like a punch. To get that Da-da-da-da melody effect. Just to get some more bite on important melody notes.


Quote from Andrew (He just posted this on Discord) 

Quote : "we'll have some useful script additions soon, for example being able to layer short notes in during legato, which is important for runs and really aggressive stuff like this"


----------



## MA-Simon

muziksculp said:


> "we'll have some useful script additions soon, for example being able to layer short notes in during legato, which is important for runs and really aggressive stuff like this"


Awesome! Gets better and better.


----------



## muziksculp

MA-Simon said:


> Awesome! Gets better and better.


Yes, absolutely. I'm so excited about this library. It's going to be super special.


----------



## AndyP

Sounds fantastic!


----------



## Drundfunk

Super excited for this one.


----------



## mybadmemory

I can’t stop listening to this latest demo. It sounds so good. Would love to hear some shorts soon! Demoed with the opening of the Octopath main theme perhaps? 😍


----------



## Evans

I'm looking forward to the screencasts. What I'm curious about is, how playable is this library? I appreciate what some competitor libraries can do, but the number of keyswitchable articulations needed to stitch together something emotionally resonant can be a bit much.


----------



## smoothielova

muziksculp said:


> Latest TSS test demo posted by Andrew. (TSS_Octapath Battle)
> 
> View attachment TSS_Octopath_Battle_1.mp3


Wow


----------



## jason3.14

muziksculp said:


> Latest TSS test demo posted by Andrew. (TSS_Octapath Battle)
> 
> View attachment TSS_Octopath_Battle_1.mp3


octopath demo is exactly what i wanted!


----------



## chapbot

muziksculp said:


> Latest TSS test demo posted by Andrew. (TSS_Octapath Battle)
> 
> View attachment TSS_Octopath_Battle_1.mp3


I'm faint. This is my dream library ♥️


----------



## Toecutter

william81723 said:


> These are the newest demos from discord.
> I'm already in.
> 
> Edit：It's real performance.


Damn, heard before reading the edit.... I was ready to storm ISW headquarters and secure my TSS copy. Don't do this to me!


----------



## filipjonathan

Imagine if they gave us a free demo legato patch like Jasper once did 😱


----------



## Toecutter

muziksculp said:


> Latest TSS test demo posted by Andrew. (TSS_Octapath Battle)
> 
> View attachment TSS_Octopath_Battle_1.mp3





muziksculp said:


> Quote : "we'll have some useful script additions soon, for example being able to layer short notes in during legato, which is important for runs and really aggressive stuff like this"


 This is too good!

Thanks muzik for the updates, haven't had much time to follow stuff so I appreciate you posting the news here!


----------



## Batrawi

The more I hear these demos, the more am leaning to the "gonna buy" camp. Even though the legatos still sound a bit "direct" to me and lack some of that "roundness" that adds more liveliness/movement to the performance like in CSSS. Assuming the script is still being worked on and what we're hearing so far is just one variant (out of lots of tweakabilities that we can adjust to taste) then I'm not really concerned about the end state & trust more will be revealed in the walkthroughs.

@Andrew Aversa, sorry am unsure if this was discussed before, but are there real recorded attack variations (soft/medium/hard) for the sustains prior legato transition?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

We're working on legato pretty much every day. It's obviously extremely important to us and needs to sound top-of-the-line. It is not enough for us to have a really unique and beautiful sound; it also needs to stand toe-to-toe with the very best, established orchestral libraries out there.

One thing we are working on is moving the legato transition start point earlier. It extends the total transition time, meaning more delay compensation is needed (a la CSS) but it does produce an even more musical result particularly for slower passages. 

But it's also fair to say that everyone has their own taste for an ideal legato sound in a sampled instrument, which is why we'll be exposing all sorts of interesting parameters if you really want to go under-the-hood.


----------



## constaneum

Andrew Aversa said:


> We're working on legato pretty much every day. It's obviously extremely important to us and needs to sound top-of-the-line. It is not enough for us to have a really unique and beautiful sound; it also needs to stand toe-to-toe with the very best, established orchestral libraries out there.
> 
> One thing we are working on is moving the legato transition start point earlier. It extends the total transition time, meaning more delay compensation is needed (a la CSS) but it does produce an even more musical result particularly for slower passages.
> 
> But it's also fair to say that everyone has their own taste for an ideal legato sound in a sampled instrument, which is why we'll be exposing all sorts of interesting parameters if you really want to go under-the-hood.


Are you confirming molto vibrato ? hehe


----------



## Batrawi

Andrew Aversa said:


> We're working on legato pretty much every day. It's obviously extremely important to us and needs to sound top-of-the-line. It is not enough for us to have a really unique and beautiful sound; it also needs to stand toe-to-toe with the very best, established orchestral libraries out there.
> 
> One thing we are working on is moving the legato transition start point earlier. It extends the total transition time, meaning more delay compensation is needed (a la CSS) but it does produce an even more musical result particularly for slower passages.
> 
> But it's also fair to say that everyone has their own taste for an ideal legato sound in a sampled instrument, which is why we'll be exposing all sorts of interesting parameters if you really want to go under-the-hood.


thanks Andrew this sounds very very promising. From no interest, now TSS has become one of my highest anticipated libraries! Sorry to ask again, but what about the bow attack at the beginning of a sustain note? Has there been multiple real velocities recorded for that (soft/medium/hard bow attacks) or maybe that will be scripted/done by short notes overlay?


----------



## Toecutter

constaneum said:


> Are you confirming molto vibrato ? hehe


COnfirmed 3 weeks ago https://vi-control.net/community/th...ks-new-teaser-video-demos.108670/post-4887712


----------



## Evans

Evans said:


> You should open up pre-orders now. In case it's delayed beyond the current estimate, I don't want to have spent all my budget on Black Friday deals.
> 
> EDIT: Just take my money, okay?


Update: my money is now gone, mostly on home projects (some emergency). Whoops.


----------



## constaneum

I hope TSS will offer shorts of such length. This is what i did for a fantasy themed podcast using one of my favourite symphonic strings libraries.


----------



## Getsumen

constaneum said:


> I hope TSS will offer shorts of such length. This is what i did for a fantasy themed podcast using one of my favourite symphonic strings libraries.


Pizzicato - 3 dynamics, 4 rr Staccato - 5 dynamics, 6 rr Staccatissimo - 5 dynamics, 6 rr Spiccato - 3 dynamics, 6 rr Sforzando quarter note - 3 rr Sforzando eighth note - 3 rr Decrescendo quarter note - 3 rr Decrescendo eighth note - 3rr


----------



## Henning

In the full version of my demo for ISW new Hammerklavier I snug in some TSS at the beginning (early alpha). It's basically background chords but perhaps of interest nevertheless. Apart from that - if you have not checked it out already - the Hammerklavier is really lovely


----------



## constaneum

Henning said:


> In the full version of my demo for ISW new Hammerklavier I snug in some TSS at the beginning (early alpha). It's basically background chords but perhaps of interest nevertheless. Apart from that - if you have not checked it out already - the Hammerklavier is really lovely



sounds great here, TSS.


----------



## constaneum

@Henning This is the Board mix right ?


----------



## Henning

constaneum said:


> @Henning This is the Board mix right ?


Yep. There's also only a very little amount of verb I sprinkled onto it. And it is no ensemble patch but the seperate five section sustain patches.


----------



## Peter Satera

muziksculp said:


> Latest TSS test demo posted by Andrew. (TSS_Octapath Battle)
> 
> View attachment TSS_Octopath_Battle_1.mp3


That is...fkn awesome. Very impressed. The transitions sound really comfortable and natural.


----------



## Batrawi

Peter Satera said:


> The transitions sound really comfortable and natural.



They do indeed. In comparison to the original track though, I think this demo lacks some re-bowing in a few (couple of?) notes here and there. I don't know if that's because same-note-rebows haven't yet been integrated into this (pre-alpha?) patch, or if they haven't make use of them, or if they aren't/won't be included in this library in the first place.


----------



## ShikiSuen

Consona said:


> Demos or GTFO


Here are two demos posted at the end of the 1st post of this thread:








大预告！Impact Soundworks 即将发布 Tokyo Scoring Strings！


喜欢经典的日本动漫弦乐配乐音色？来看看首款东京的配乐弦乐音源！Impact SoundWorks非常兴奋地发布了Tokyo Scoring Strings声色， 这是Impact SoundWorks的第一个管弦乐的弦乐音色库。 通过Tokyo Scoring Strings，我们希望能为世界各地的作曲家带来好评如潮的日本风格管弦乐音色。这个音色库有五个独立录制的声部(小提琴1组，小提琴2组，中提琴，大提琴，低音提琴)， 采用典型的日本合奏编制(8/6/6/4/3)，适合小型和大型制作。我们录制了日本最顶尖的弦乐团，盛泽光一郎(Koichiro Muroya...




flying-daw.com


----------



## ShikiSuen

Another promotion video of this sound library:


https://www.bilibili.com/video/BV17Q4y1275v?zw


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Batrawi said:


> They do indeed. In comparison to the original track though, I think this demo lacks some re-bowing in a few (couple of?) notes here and there. I don't know if that's because same-note-rebows haven't yet been integrated into this (pre-alpha?) patch, or if they haven't make use of them, or if they aren't/won't be included in this library in the first place.



We have rebows, I don't think they were used there as we're still massaging them. Anyway, we just finished another round of legato processing, expect to hear some results from that soon!


----------



## constaneum

Andrew Aversa said:


> We have rebows, I don't think they were used there as we're still massaging them. Anyway, we just finished another round of legato processing, expect to hear some results from that soon!


can't wait. excited. excited.


----------



## neblix

Here's a preliminary test of our new lyrical legato! Still many settings to play with, after having reprocessed our transition samples.

Combined with our advanced alignment feature, even though the latency for this special slow legato is in excess of 370ms, *this MIDI is hard-quantized on the grid with no overlaps *(not for the piano, of course)*.*

There's just *one *midi note I nudged because the arco had a slow attack, but I can improve the tech to account for this.

For those who are wondering, it's our *Board Mix *mic, unprocessed (except a tiny treble-focused stereo widen) and with some Seventh Heaven reverb.

[Dragonsong Melody by Nobuo Uematsu, supporting parts by me]


----------



## chapbot

neblix said:


> Here's a preliminary test of our new lyrical legato! Still many settings to play with, after having reprocessed our transition samples.
> 
> Combined with our advanced alignment feature, even though the latency for this special slow legato is in excess of 370ms, *this MIDI is hard-quantized on the grid with no overlaps *(not for the piano, of course)*.*
> 
> There's just *one *midi note I nudged because the arco had a slow attack, but I can improve the tech to account for this.
> 
> For those who are wondering, it's our *Board Mix *mic, unprocessed (except a tiny treble-focused stereo widen) and with some Seventh Heaven reverb.
> 
> [Dragonsong Melody by Nobuo Uematsu, supporting parts by me]


TBH not liking it. Sounds static. Previous demos showcase the sound much better.


----------



## neblix

chapbot said:


> TBH not liking it. Sounds static. Previous demos showcase the sound much better.


Ah yes, there wasn't any dynamic tweaking here; this is showing off the latency compensation for the legato alignment.


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> Ah yes, there wasn't any dynamic tweaking here; this is showing off the latency compensation for the legato alignment.


Thanks for the feedback.


----------



## william81723

neblix said:


> Here's a preliminary test of our new lyrical legato! Still many settings to play with, after having reprocessed our transition samples.
> 
> Combined with our advanced alignment feature, even though the latency for this special slow legato is in excess of 370ms, *this MIDI is hard-quantized on the grid with no overlaps *(not for the piano, of course)*.*
> 
> There's just *one *midi note I nudged because the arco had a slow attack, but I can improve the tech to account for this.
> 
> For those who are wondering, it's our *Board Mix *mic, unprocessed (except a tiny treble-focused stereo widen) and with some Seventh Heaven reverb.
> 
> [Dragonsong Melody by Nobuo Uematsu, supporting parts by me]


The legato is really super emotional and realistic to my ear... 
Of course we can tweak the dynamic of the performance by ourselves,so it doesn't matter.
Just focus on the legato!!!

I would like to know how many types of legato you've planned for TSS now?
As far as I know now there are ：bow change,finger,portamento.
But it seems like that TSS also has different types of legato for different speeds?
The previous demo shows fast and accent legatos,and this one shows slow and lyrical legato.


----------



## neblix

william81723 said:


> But it seems like that TSS also has different types of legato for different speeds?
> The previous demo shows fast and accent legatos,and this one shows slow and lyrical legato.


For transition sample sets, our unique offering is:

-Bowed Transitions
-Slurred (where possible, certain interval situations did not allow it, but overall are smoother than explicit bows)
-Portamento Bowed (a porta slide with a bow attack on the note resulting note)
-Portamento Slurred (a porta slide with no extra bow attack)

Beyond this, our legato algorithm will have profiles for different situations, like fast, even & agile vs. slow and indulgent. Our lookahead will do a lot of legwork in analyzing phrases to apply the settings automatically, but we will also expose some kind of "Speed" control if the composer wants to manage it themselves.

The reason we need different profiles is because our slow legato utilizes long crossfades with delayed note changes to get very smooth playing in/out of the change, whereas these same settings would cause all kinds of horrible effects if played fast (late notes, "sucking" effects, blurry overlaps, etc.)


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> The reason we need different profiles is because our slow legato utilizes long crossfades with delayed note changes to get very smooth playing in/out of the change, whereas these same settings would cause all kinds of horrible effects if played fast (late notes, "sucking" effects, blurry overlaps, etc.)


I'm guessing you will have a switch option on the GUI to select the slow legato, which can be automated via CC, also for some of the other legato options ? 

Maybe a bit more of an in-depth description of how the various legato options are enabled/triggered. Whenever you are comfortable with discussing this detail. 

Thanks.


----------



## neblix

muziksculp said:


> I'm guessing you will have a switch option on the GUI to select the slow legato, which can be automated via CC, also for some of the other legato options ?
> 
> Maybe a bit more of an in-depth description of how the various legato options are enabled/triggered. Whenever you are comfortable with discussing this detail.
> 
> Thanks.


We could have CC, or velocity-based, everything is on the table right now and nothing is set in stone. We are open to suggestions!

For all other in-depth legato settings (like fade times), we would discourage users from playing with them as they are very finnicky (and would invisibly be affected by the different profiles) but with our new TACT 3.0 articulation ui, our goal is that everything should be MIDI Learnable (and NKS-able, if it comes to that). So for the most adventurous and technical users, they will be able to play with it.


----------



## ShikiSuen

Hi, Neblix,

Could you please tell me whether this library will also be purchasable through Native Instruments official webstore? They have download CDN inside the China Mainland.

I previously purchased some libraries from other companies but having download issues due to their CDN being blocked or choked by the Great Firewall. VPN is not an option in such cases due to limited streamable data amount.

Sincerely,
Shiki


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> We could have CC, or velocity-based, everything is on the table right now and nothing is set in stone. We are open to suggestions!
> 
> For all other in-depth legato settings (like fade times), we would discourage users from playing with them as they are very finnicky (and would invisibly be affected by the different profiles) but with our new TACT 3.0 articulation ui, our goal is that everything should be MIDI Learnable (and NKS-able, if it comes to that). So for the most adventurous and technical users, they will be able to play with it.


Thanks. 

Maybe you can post a pic of the GUI showing the TACT 3.0 articulations, controls, ..etc. when you are closer to finalizing the GUI design.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Hi Shiki, do you know Flying-Daw? We plan on working with them for distribution in China.


----------



## ShikiSuen

Andrew Aversa said:


> Hi Shiki, do you know Flying-Daw? We plan on working with them for distribution in China.


1) Flying is the best local VST reseller in Mainland China in the recent decade.

2) Whoever you are going to work with, you have to make sure your download CDN network has nodes inside Mainland China to make sure the download speed. Otherwise I am afraid that *you* may need to end up with delivering common (encrypted) sample files through P2P network (and user-specific watermarked NKI files through your standalone delivery system).

Steinberg Download Assistant uses P2P technology (ARIA2c) to boost their download speed at this moment.


----------



## mybadmemory

neblix said:


> Here's a preliminary test of our new lyrical legato! Still many settings to play with, after having reprocessed our transition samples.
> 
> Combined with our advanced alignment feature, even though the latency for this special slow legato is in excess of 370ms, *this MIDI is hard-quantized on the grid with no overlaps *(not for the piano, of course)*.*
> 
> There's just *one *midi note I nudged because the arco had a slow attack, but I can improve the tech to account for this.
> 
> For those who are wondering, it's our *Board Mix *mic, unprocessed (except a tiny treble-focused stereo widen) and with some Seventh Heaven reverb.
> 
> [Dragonsong Melody by Nobuo Uematsu, supporting parts by me]


This sounds absolutely fabolous! Especially considering it’s just the raw notes without any programmed dynamics. Can’t wait to try it out!


----------



## Batrawi

neblix said:


> Here's a preliminary test of our new lyrical legato! Still many settings to play with, after having reprocessed our transition samples.
> 
> Combined with our advanced alignment feature, even though the latency for this special slow legato is in excess of 370ms, *this MIDI is hard-quantized on the grid with no overlaps *(not for the piano, of course)*.*
> 
> There's just *one *midi note I nudged because the arco had a slow attack, but I can improve the tech to account for this.
> 
> For those who are wondering, it's our *Board Mix *mic, unprocessed (except a tiny treble-focused stereo widen) and with some Seventh Heaven reverb.
> 
> [Dragonsong Melody by Nobuo Uematsu, supporting parts by me]


That was mostly bow change legato, correct?


----------



## Obi-Wan Spaghetti

Batrawi said:


> That was mostly bow change legato, correct?


I noticed that too. And they sound promessing imo, but not perfect. Maybe adding a solo portamento on top would be enough to glue those transition together.


----------



## Batrawi

Obi-Wan Spaghetti said:


> . And they sound promessing imo, but not perfect


Yes, I think they sound very good too but the static dynamics (as @neblix clarified) did not do them justice, but I understand that shouldn't be a problem though as this was only just for demonstration purpose of the transitions. Am also looking forward to how the slurred legato sounds in lyrical context + some bowed portamentos as I expect those would sound much more natural than slurred portamentos that are commonly recorded in other libraries.


----------



## Tremendouz

neblix said:


> We could have CC, or velocity-based, everything is on the table right now and nothing is set in stone. We are open to suggestions!


The way I'd personally like to have it would be having the velocity of the destination note decide the legato speed (eg. three different velocity ranges for slow, medium, fast) while the legato type is controlled by keyswitching. I'm thinking that you could choose if the keyswitches are latching or non-latching so that you could have a "default" legato type that you can temporarily override with a non-latching KS.

In addition to that, the fast legato range could introduce a short note overlay (I think Andrew mentioned something like that earlier in this thread?) above a certain velocity (eg. 110) that gradually gets louder when approaching 127 to add some extra definition to the transitions.

This might not be optimal for playabilibty with keyboard because it's hard to hit the exact velocity you want but I think it would work fine for piano roll work where you have more precise control over the velocities.

There are as many different workflows as there are users, meaning others might not agree with me at all so optimally this all would be customizable via TACT.


----------



## Faruh Al-Baghdadi

ShikiSuen said:


> Here are two demos posted at the end of the 1st post of this thread:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 大预告！Impact Soundworks 即将发布 Tokyo Scoring Strings！
> 
> 
> 喜欢经典的日本动漫弦乐配乐音色？来看看首款东京的配乐弦乐音源！Impact SoundWorks非常兴奋地发布了Tokyo Scoring Strings声色， 这是Impact SoundWorks的第一个管弦乐的弦乐音色库。 通过Tokyo Scoring Strings，我们希望能为世界各地的作曲家带来好评如潮的日本风格管弦乐音色。这个音色库有五个独立录制的声部(小提琴1组，小提琴2组，中提琴，大提琴，低音提琴)， 采用典型的日本合奏编制(8/6/6/4/3)，适合小型和大型制作。我们录制了日本最顶尖的弦乐团，盛泽光一郎(Koichiro Muroya...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> flying-daw.com


Wait, are these the actual, real examples of the library or they are just records of orchestra for promo videos?


----------



## Tom Ferguson

Faruh Al-Baghdadi said:


> Wait, are these the actual, real examples of the library or they are just records of orchestra for promo videos?


The tangledeep and paper boat journey demos are both the samples.


----------



## Faruh Al-Baghdadi

Tom Ferguson said:


> The tangledeep and paper boat journey demos are both the samples.


Damn, they sound great.


----------



## ShikiSuen

Faruh Al-Baghdadi said:


> Wait, are these the actual, real examples of the library or they are just records of orchestra for promo videos?


MIDI. These sound MIDI to me.

Real orchestral recordings have decisive soundmass difference, comparatively.


----------



## Getsumen

Faruh Al-Baghdadi said:


> Damn, they sound great.


If you want more demos there's a lot in the VIC discord. Some have been reposted to this thread


----------



## Faruh Al-Baghdadi

Getsumen said:


> If you want more demos there's a lot in the VIC discord. Some have been reposted to this thread


Thx, will check it out.


----------



## antames

I like the way CineSample's gives you the choice of either using velocity or CC based programming. They also have a knob that controls the legato speed. It would be cool if TSS could have something similar that gives the user the option to choose how they want to program their sounds. Velocity is a lot easier to change between articulations in one Kontakt instance.


----------



## mybadmemory

Perhaps this has already been mentioned but will TSS include ensemble patches? I hope it will, they are so useful!


----------



## neblix

antames said:


> I like the way CineSample's gives you the choice of either using velocity or CC based programming. They also have a knob that controls the legato speed. It would be cool if TSS could have something similar that gives the user the option to choose how they want to program their sounds. Velocity is a lot easier to change between articulations in one Kontakt instance.


Impact Soundworks has had one of (if not) the most advanced articulation switching systems in this industry for years now (called TACT, check our Shreddage 3 products or our recent Ventus Duduk). You can have up to 3 simultaneous rules on a single articulation, with types supported being MIDI CC, pitch bend wheel, keyswitches (latching and nonlatching), velocity, and keyrange, and features an automap function that spreads articulations on keyswitches or evenly across velocities and CC.

The biggest flaw is that it has a learning curve, which is why in TSS we're designing a new UI. It's now our 3rd attempt since debuting the system 5 years ago. We're really trying to focus on making it easier to look at this time so it isn't so overwhelming.


----------



## constaneum

neblix said:


> Impact Soundworks has had one of (if not) the most advanced articulation switching systems in this industry for years now (called TACT, check our Shreddage 3 products or our recent Ventus Duduk). You can have up to 3 simultaneous rules on a single articulation, with types supported being MIDI CC, pitch bend wheel, keyswitches (latching and nonlatching), velocity, and keyrange, and features an automap function that spreads articulations on keyswitches or evenly across velocities and CC.
> 
> The biggest flaw is that it has a learning curve, which is why in TSS we're designing a new UI. It's now our 3rd attempt since debuting the system 5 years ago. We're really trying to focus on making it easier to look at this time so it isn't so overwhelming.


Having advance switching articulation system with lots of tweaking capabilities / options is great but may not suit everyone. To me, apart from sound realism, ease of use is definitely the thing. Not everyone is pro and some prefers simplicity. I'll suggest having everything on the easy / simple mode by default. If you wanna tweak further (for those hardcore who likes to tweak this and that), there's an "advance" mode option which allows to tweak things to their liking.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Yeah, we are working hard to revamp the articulation UI and make it easy-to-use with great default settings.

For everyone else, the complete power to set up whatever mapping you want will be available.

Regarding our final recording session, we were able to record molto vibrato for all sections, an extra aggressive spiccato dynamic, plus a bouncier spiccato with a tighter sound (maybe we'll call it flying spiccato?) and harmonics for each section. Very pleased with how it turned out!


----------



## muziksculp

Andrew Aversa said:


> Yeah, we are working hard to revamp the articulation UI and make it easy-to-use with great default settings.
> 
> For everyone else, the complete power to set up whatever mapping you want will be available.
> 
> Regarding our final recording session, we were able to record molto vibrato for all sections, an extra aggressive spiccato dynamic, plus a bouncier spiccato with a tighter sound (maybe we'll call it flying spiccato?) and harmonics for each section. Very pleased with how it turned out!


Hi Andrew,

That's Awesome News ! 

Thanks for the feedback. I'm buying a bottle of Champaign to pop open on the release day of TSS. 

So excited about this library.  

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## mixedmoods

muziksculp said:


> Thanks for the feedback. I'm buying a bottle of Champaign to pop open on the release day of TSS.


Let's make it a bottle of Sake ...


----------



## Saxer

mixedmoods said:


> Let's make it a bottle of Sake ...


For heavens Sake


----------



## Futchibon




----------



## muziksculp

mixedmoods said:


> Let's make it a bottle of Sake ...


Sure. Sake it is. 

Kampay


----------



## constaneum

i can't wait to hear the molto vibrato sound !! cant wait ! cant wait !!


----------



## Jackdnp121

A bit of Pre Tokyo String Mockup - Can't Wait !

Main theme - Octopath Traveler


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Happy Monday, everyone! Now that we are coming down the home stretch, I've officially added the full articulation list to the original post (and below) so you can see what is included with the library.

Also, we have announced our final pricing for the library:

*Preorders *will be* $349*, and available this month. Preorders will close before the library is released. More info to come when the preorders go live.

*Intro pricing *when the library launches will be* $399.

MSRP* is *$449*.

*FULL ARTICULATION LIST

Note: *All sections have identical articulations, dynamic layers, and round robins!

Arco (Sustain) - 5 dynamics, 3 vibrato levels (senza, con, molto)
Bowed Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
Slurred Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
Bowed Portamento - 3 dynamics
Slurred Portamento - 3 dynamics
Rebow - 3 dynamics, 5x rr
Staccato - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
Staccatissimo - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
Spiccato - 4 dynamics, 6x rr
Crisp Spiccato - 2 dynamics, 6x rr
Sforzando - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
Decrescendo - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
Pizzicato - 3 dynamics, 4x rr
Tremolo - 4 dynamics
Trills - 2 dynamics, whole tone & half tone
Releases - natural, excited, and staccato
Harmonics


----------



## axb312

Andrew Aversa said:


> Happy Monday, everyone! Now that we are coming down the home stretch, I've officially added the full articulation list to the original post (and below) so you can see what is included with the library.
> 
> Also, we have announced our final pricing for the library:
> 
> *Preorders *will be* $349*, and available this month. Preorders will close before the library is released. More info to come when the preorders go live.
> 
> *Intro pricing *when the library launches will be* $399.
> 
> MSRP* is *$449*.
> 
> *FULL ARTICULATION LIST
> 
> Note: *All sections have identical articulations, dynamic layers, and round robins!
> 
> Arco (Sustain) - 5 dynamics, 3 vibrato levels (senza, con, molto)
> Bowed Legato - 3 dynamics
> Slurred Legato - 3 dynamics
> Bowed Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Slurred Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Rebow - 3 dynamics, 5x rr
> Staccato - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Staccatissimo - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Spiccato - 4 dynamics, 6x rr
> Crisp Spiccato - 2 dynamics, 6x rr
> Sforzando - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Decrescendo - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Pizzicato - 3 dynamics, 4x rr
> Tremolo - 4 dynamics
> Trills - 2 dynamics, whole tone & half tone
> Releases - natural, excited, and staccato
> Harmonics


Nice. Will we get to hear some more demos and possibly a walkthrough in the pre-order period?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Yep, but we will also allow refunds prior to launch in case for some reason you don't like what you hear/see in any new audio/video etc.


----------



## Denkii

Give me that preorder button now.


----------



## muziksculp

So, could a TSS October release be possible ?


----------



## holywilly

Do 3 vibrato levels apply to all legatos?


----------



## MA-Simon

Andrew Aversa said:


> Rebow - 3 dynamics, 5x rr


YESSSSS!


----------



## ism

Andrew Aversa said:


> Releases - natural, excited, and staccato


This sounds very promising. It there anything similar in the attacks, perhaps analogous to what OT call Sustain Immediate and Sustain Soft?


----------



## Paul Jelfs

Andrew Aversa said:


> Happy Monday, everyone! Now that we are coming down the home stretch, I've officially added the full articulation list to the original post (and below) so you can see what is included with the library.
> 
> Also, we have announced our final pricing for the library:
> 
> *Preorders *will be* $349*, and available this month. Preorders will close before the library is released. More info to come when the preorders go live.
> 
> *Intro pricing *when the library launches will be* $399.
> 
> MSRP* is *$449*.
> 
> *FULL ARTICULATION LIST
> 
> Note: *All sections have identical articulations, dynamic layers, and round robins!
> 
> Arco (Sustain) - 5 dynamics, 3 vibrato levels (senza, con, molto)
> Bowed Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Slurred Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Bowed Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Slurred Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Rebow - 3 dynamics, 5x rr
> Staccato - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Staccatissimo - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Spiccato - 4 dynamics, 6x rr
> Crisp Spiccato - 2 dynamics, 6x rr
> Sforzando - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Decrescendo - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Pizzicato - 3 dynamics, 4x rr
> Tremolo - 4 dynamics
> Trills - 2 dynamics, whole tone & half tone
> Releases - natural, excited, and staccato
> Harmonics


Does it also include Koji Kondo's ability? Please....


----------



## Paul Jelfs

In all seriousness, looks like you got a winner on your hands there  

Can you give us a rough idea of the size at release , or we not there yet ?


----------



## neblix

muziksculp said:


> So, could a TSS October release be possible ?


No.


----------



## Tremendouz

Round robin legato, that's interesting. I can't think of other string libraries that have this but they probably exist?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Paul Jelfs said:


> In all seriousness, looks like you got a winner on your hands there
> 
> Can you give us a rough idea of the size at release , or we not there yet ?


The wide ballpark is 50-100gb right now; it could end up smaller, but NCW compression is one of the very last steps and we'll see how that does!


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> No.


OK. Thanks. 

Whenever its ready works for me.


----------



## Denkii

muziksculp said:


> OK. Thanks.
> 
> Whenever its ready works for me.


Can I put my order on your tab?


----------



## Mr Greg G

Andrew Aversa said:


> Happy Monday, everyone! Now that we are coming down the home stretch, I've officially added the full articulation list to the original post (and below) so you can see what is included with the library.
> 
> Also, we have announced our final pricing for the library:
> 
> *Preorders *will be* $349*, and available this month. Preorders will close before the library is released. More info to come when the preorders go live.
> 
> *Intro pricing *when the library launches will be* $399.
> 
> MSRP* is *$449*.
> 
> *FULL ARTICULATION LIST
> 
> Note: *All sections have identical articulations, dynamic layers, and round robins!
> 
> Arco (Sustain) - 5 dynamics, 3 vibrato levels (senza, con, molto)
> Bowed Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Slurred Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Bowed Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Slurred Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Rebow - 3 dynamics, 5x rr
> Staccato - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Staccatissimo - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Spiccato - 4 dynamics, 6x rr
> Crisp Spiccato - 2 dynamics, 6x rr
> Sforzando - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Decrescendo - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Pizzicato - 3 dynamics, 4x rr
> Tremolo - 4 dynamics
> Trills - 2 dynamics, whole tone & half tone
> Releases - natural, excited, and staccato
> Harmonics


Sounds very promising indeed, all the articulations I need are in there. What is the difference here between bowed legato and slurred legato? It's a bit confusing as a "bowed legato" is actually a slur.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Mr Pringles said:


> Sounds very promising indeed, all the articulations I need are in there. What is the difference here between bowed legato and slurred legato? It's a bit confusing as a "bowed legato" is actually a slur.



Imagine in the score you have C4 and then E4. The C4 is being played on a down bow.

For *bowed legato*, the players played the E4 and changed bow direction at the same time.

For *slurred legato*, the players played the E4 without changing bows (or, if bow changing was necessary, they de-emphasized the change as much as possible)


----------



## Jackdnp121

Andrew Aversa said:


> Happy Monday, everyone! Now that we are coming down the home stretch, I've officially added the full articulation list to the original post (and below) so you can see what is included with the library.
> 
> Also, we have announced our final pricing for the library:
> 
> *Preorders *will be* $349*, and available this month. Preorders will close before the library is released. More info to come when the preorders go live.
> 
> *Intro pricing *when the library launches will be* $399.
> 
> MSRP* is *$449*.
> 
> *FULL ARTICULATION LIST
> 
> Note: *All sections have identical articulations, dynamic layers, and round robins!
> 
> Arco (Sustain) - 5 dynamics, 3 vibrato levels (senza, con, molto)
> Bowed Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Slurred Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Bowed Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Slurred Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Rebow - 3 dynamics, 5x rr
> Staccato - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Staccatissimo - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Spiccato - 4 dynamics, 6x rr
> Crisp Spiccato - 2 dynamics, 6x rr
> Sforzando - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Decrescendo - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Pizzicato - 3 dynamics, 4x rr
> Tremolo - 4 dynamics
> Trills - 2 dynamics, whole tone & half tone
> Releases - natural, excited, and staccato
> Harmonics


Hoorayyyyy 🎉🎉🎉


----------



## Nimrod7

Thank you for sharing more details Andrew, I am really looking forward for the release!
We have learned the story behind the project, we have heard how it sounds, and we learn more about the articulations and the pricing today!

Now, 
Any chance to tease a screenshoot of the UI?


----------



## Denkii

Top notch communication on ISW's end by the way. Much appreciated.


----------



## Mr Greg G

Andrew Aversa said:


> Imagine in the score you have C4 and then E4. The C4 is being played on a down bow.
> 
> For *bowed legato*, the players played the E4 and changed bow direction at the same time.
> 
> For *slurred legato*, the players played the E4 without changing bows (or, if bow changing was necessary, they de-emphasized the change as much as possible)


Thanks for clarifying. So if I got this right, the bowed legato is actually not a legato but a rebow. Now the question is, what is the difference between this “bowed legato” and the “rebow” articulation?


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

Rebow articulation is a rebow on the same note. "Bowed legato" is a transition between two different notes.


----------



## RonOrchComp

Andrew Aversa said:


> Happy Monday, everyone! Now that we are coming down the home stretch, I've officially added the full articulation list to the original post (and below) so you can see what is included with the library.
> 
> Also, we have announced our final pricing for the library:
> 
> *Preorders *will be* $349*, and available this month. Preorders will close before the library is released. More info to come when the preorders go live.
> 
> *Intro pricing *when the library launches will be* $399.
> 
> MSRP* is *$449*.
> 
> *FULL ARTICULATION LIST
> 
> Note: *All sections have identical articulations, dynamic layers, and round robins!
> 
> Arco (Sustain) - 5 dynamics, 3 vibrato levels (senza, con, molto)
> Bowed Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Slurred Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Bowed Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Slurred Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Rebow - 3 dynamics, 5x rr
> Staccato - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Staccatissimo - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Spiccato - 4 dynamics, 6x rr
> Crisp Spiccato - 2 dynamics, 6x rr
> Sforzando - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Decrescendo - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Pizzicato - 3 dynamics, 4x rr
> Tremolo - 4 dynamics
> Trills - 2 dynamics, whole tone & half tone
> Releases - natural, excited, and staccato
> Harmonics


Nice!

Would love to hear a quick ex of staccatissimo vs. spiccato, vs. crisp spiccato. And is the latter played that way, or is it the regular spic, in TM mode?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

More audio examples will be coming for sure. We're editing those crisp spiccatos now (along with molto vib & harmonics). All articulations, dynamics, and RR listed are actual unique recordings. Not TM Pro / faked etc.


----------



## constaneum

Andrew Aversa said:


> More audio examples will be coming for sure. We're editing those crisp spiccatos now (along with molto vib & harmonics). All articulations, dynamics, and RR listed are actual unique recordings. Not TM Pro / faked etc.


can't wait to hear the molto vib !!


----------



## RonOrchComp

Andrew Aversa said:


> More audio examples will be coming for sure. We're editing those crisp spiccatos now (along with molto vib & harmonics).



Wait - you added an articulation to the list before you have finished editing that articulation?

NOOOOOOOO - YOU JUST JINXED IT!!!!


Andrew Aversa said:


> All articulations, dynamics, and RR listed are actual unique recordings. Not TM Pro / faked etc.


Cool!


----------



## Mr Greg G

Sarah Mancuso said:


> Rebow articulation is a rebow on the same note. "Bowed legato" is a transition between two different notes.


Got it. As a string player, it’s a bit confusing to have 2 different articulations for the same thing (bow change, no leg).


----------



## constaneum

Mr Pringles said:


> Got it. As a string player, it’s a bit confusing to have 2 different articulations for the same thing (bow change, no leg).


i wish rebow can be triggered with a non-latch keyswitch.


----------



## Denkii

constaneum said:


> i wish rebow can be triggered with a non-latch keyswitch.


Preferably without doing anything...at least if you engage lookahead and trigger the same note.


----------



## Go To 11

constaneum said:


> i wish rebow can be triggered with a non-latch keyswitch.


In the libraries I have that do it, you hold the note with the sustain pedal and then hit the same note again. We'll see what their strategy is though!


----------



## constaneum

Go To 11 said:


> In the libraries I have that do it, you hold the note with the sustain pedal and then hit the same note again. We'll see what their strategy is though!


yup. see what's for TSS.


----------



## Brasart

Andrew Aversa said:


> More audio examples will be coming for sure. We're editing those crisp spiccatos now (along with molto vib & harmonics). All articulations, dynamics, and RR listed are actual unique recordings. Not TM Pro / faked etc.


Will there be a thorough video walkthrough - or at least in-depth audio examples - before the pre-order offer ends?


----------



## AndyP

constaneum said:


> i wish rebow can be triggered with a non-latch keyswitch.


And even better up and downbows like Fluffy's simple violin!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Brasart said:


> Will there be a thorough video walkthrough - or at least in-depth audio examples - before the pre-order offer ends?


More audio for sure. Video walkthrough: probably!


----------



## ShidoStrife

Go To 11 said:


> In the libraries I have that do it, you hold the note with the sustain pedal and then hit the same note again. We'll see what their strategy is though!


I hate this method, might be great for keyboard players, but an unnecessary hoop for those who aren't. Non-latching keyswitch is way better imho.


----------



## Go To 11

ShidoStrife said:


> I hate this method, might be great for keyboard players, but an unnecessary hoop for those who aren't. Non-latching keyswitch is way better imho.


I agree! Why not use a single key as the pedal that you play with a finger. Much easier.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

TACT allows you to map articulations to basically anything, including pedal and keyswitches.


----------



## holywilly

Maybe it’s time for Impact Soundworks to develop its sampler for ultimate customization, especially with TSS.


----------



## Denkii

Sarah Mancuso said:


> TACT allows you to map articulations to basically anything, including pedal and keyswitches.


Does that include retriggering the same note?
Like I said I'd love to be able to trigger rebow just by playing the same note twice. At least with lookahead engaged if not always.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

holywilly said:


> Maybe it’s time for Impact Soundworks to develop its sampler for ultimate customization, especially with TSS.


Don't give us any ideas...


Denkii said:


> Does that include retriggering the same note?
> Like I said I'd love to be able to trigger rebow just by playing the same note twice. At least with lookahead engaged if not always.


At the moment we do use the sustain pedal method but in lookahead mode, it should be handled automatically.


----------



## holywilly

I wish each patch is able to control in 3-dimension, velocity, playing speed and one additional CC (not CC1), for TSS as a super deep library. Another idea.


----------



## Denkii

Andrew Aversa said:


> At the moment we do use the sustain pedal method but in lookahead mode, it should be handled automatically.


Thanks for the info!
Like someone else mentioned: the sustain paddle is the least user friendly option for non keyboard players and a pita to add later on (compared to a keyswitch).
Of course that's subjective but I'm glad we could change it with tact anyways and even more glad that it will automatically trigger rebow in lookahead mode.


----------



## constaneum

When you have more ideas, release gonna get push back


----------



## chapbot

ShidoStrife said:


> I hate this method, might be great for keyboard players, but an unnecessary hoop for those who aren't. Non-latching keyswitch is way better imho.


LOL might be great for keyboard players? You mean the 99.9% of people who are constructing MIDI tracks? Are you entering data with a MIDI kazoo or something?


----------



## Zanshin

chapbot said:


> LOL might be great for keyboard players? You mean the 99.9% of people who are constructing MIDI tracks? Are you entering data with a MIDI kazoo or something?


Worse than a midi kazoo... a mouse.


----------



## muziksculp

Zanshin said:


> Worse than a midi kazoo... a mouse.


It surprised me that quite a few pro composers use mouse entry to compose full scores, and they are pretty fast at performing with the mouse, (Mouse Ninjas) 

I use my keyboard, no mouse entry for me. So, there is no rule, use what is more suitable for you.


----------



## Zanshin

Yeah I'm no virtuoso, but I like to play things in and then edit (with mouse haha) after. Whatever works!


----------



## constaneum

muziksculp said:


> It surprised me that quite a few pro composers use mouse entry to compose full scores, and they are pretty fast at performing with the mouse, (Mouse Ninjas)
> 
> I use my keyboard, no mouse entry for me. So, there is no rule, use what is more suitable for you.


I'm not pro but I used mouse too. Used to it. Ahha


----------



## TonyZem

Zanshin said:


> Yeah I'm no virtuoso, but I like to play things in and then edit (with mouse haha) after. Whatever works!





muziksculp said:


> It surprised me that quite a few pro composers use mouse entry to compose full scores, and they are pretty fast at performing with the mouse, (Mouse Ninjas)
> 
> I use my keyboard, no mouse entry for me. So, there is no rule, use what is more suitable for you.


I gave up using keyboard a long time ago, since I have to end up editing with the mouse anyway. So, I'd like to join in unity with the mouse ninjas, lol.


----------



## ShidoStrife

chapbot said:


> LOL might be great for keyboard players? You mean the 99.9% of people who are constructing MIDI tracks? Are you entering data with a MIDI kazoo or something?


I use notation software


----------



## Casiquire

chapbot said:


> LOL might be great for keyboard players? You mean the 99.9% of people who are constructing MIDI tracks? Are you entering data with a MIDI kazoo or something?


I think you'd be surprised how many people pencil it in or export midi from notation software


----------



## muziksculp

ShidoStrife said:


> I use notation software


I think this qualifies you as a Mouse-Ninja as well.


----------



## constaneum

let's be part of the Mouse-Ninja clan. haha


----------



## Trash Panda

Mouse ninjas strike from the shadows and live to see another day while the keyboard samurais whine about honor.


----------



## Batrawi

Can't wait for the demos/walkthroughs. Everything's reminding me of it:


----------



## tonio_

Can't wait for the preorders to become available! Quick question @Andrew Aversa will the student discount be applicable to the preorders? Thanks!


----------



## odod

i already spend my money for OPUS upgrade .. i guess i am going to pass this beautiful library, 

damn .. i really love this TSS sound


----------



## windwolf666

Andrew Aversa said:


> Happy Monday, everyone! Now that we are coming down the home stretch, I've officially added the full articulation list to the original post (and below) so you can see what is included with the library.
> 
> Also, we have announced our final pricing for the library:
> 
> *Preorders *will be* $349*, and available this month. Preorders will close before the library is released. More info to come when the preorders go live.
> 
> *Intro pricing *when the library launches will be* $399.
> 
> MSRP* is *$449*.
> 
> *FULL ARTICULATION LIST
> 
> Note: *All sections have identical articulations, dynamic layers, and round robins!
> 
> Arco (Sustain) - 5 dynamics, 3 vibrato levels (senza, con, molto)
> Bowed Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Slurred Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Bowed Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Slurred Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Rebow - 3 dynamics, 5x rr
> Staccato - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Staccatissimo - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Spiccato - 4 dynamics, 6x rr
> Crisp Spiccato - 2 dynamics, 6x rr
> Sforzando - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Decrescendo - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Pizzicato - 3 dynamics, 4x rr
> Tremolo - 4 dynamics
> Trills - 2 dynamics, whole tone & half tone
> Releases - natural, excited, and staccato
> Harmonics


Thanks for the information! I would like to ask how many mics the TSS have? Hope the close mic is dry enough to fit other genres.


----------



## RMH

Andrew Aversa said:


> *Preorders *will be* $349*, and available this month. Preorders will close before the library is released. More info to come when the preorders go live.


When does it start?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

tonio_ said:


> Can't wait for the preorders to become available! Quick question @Andrew Aversa will the student discount be applicable to the preorders? Thanks!


We're considering that now!


windwolf666 said:


> Thanks for the information! I would like to ask how many mics the TSS have? Hope the close mic is dry enough to fit other genres.


The mic positions are Close, Decca, Side/Rear (combo), and Surround. The 5th "position", which gets its own patch, is the Board Mix which is Aizawa's custom mix of those mics plus outboard processing. (That is what you've been hearing in all the demos.)


RMH said:


> When does it start?


As soon as we get serial numbers from NI


----------



## windwolf666

Andrew Aversa said:


> The mic positions are Close, Decca, Side/Rear (combo), and Surround. The 5th "position", which gets its own patch, is the Board Mix which is Aizawa's custom mix of those mics plus outboard processing. (That is what you've been hearing in all the demos.)


Nice!! Thanks for replying! Can't wait to use it


----------



## mohsohsenshi

Happy to hear such a good news from TSS, I can't wait to meet its release date!

@Andrew Aversa 
A little request about payment method:
Would you mind adding the "Alipay" as payment method on ISW's shop? It's very popular for Eastern Asian musicians those who don't have any foreign currency credit card to buy software oversea. As I known, musicians from China can check out with "Alipay" on Native Instrument's website.


----------



## SpiralFlip

Anime strings Anime strings


----------



## Jackdnp121

mohsohsenshi said:


> Happy to hear such a good news from TSS, I can't wait to meet its release date!
> 
> @Andrew Aversa
> A little request about payment method:
> Would you mind adding the "Alipay" as payment method on ISW's shop? It's very popular for Eastern Asian musicians those who don't have any foreign currency credit card to buy software oversea. As I known, musicians from China can check out with "Alipay" on Native Instrument's website.


second that , I know a bunch of ppl use Alipay, should def looking into it


----------



## Ihnoc

Andrew Aversa said:


> The mic positions are Close, Decca, Side/Rear (combo), and Surround. The 5th "position", which gets its own patch, is the Board Mix which is Aizawa's custom mix of those mics plus outboard processing. (That is what you've been hearing in all the demos.)


In much the same vein as other developers, getting some insight from Aizawa-sensei on their approach to the board mix and recording the strings and other members of the ensemble would be fantastic too. I often feel like this part of production is well covered in English speaking scores but we generally hear only from some composers in Japan.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Jackdnp121 said:


> second that , I know a bunch of ppl use Alipay, should def looking into it


We're looking into this now. I applied to be a merchant partner but the experience has been a bit opaque.


----------



## Jackdnp121

Andrew Aversa said:


> We're looking into this now. I applied to be a merchant partner but the experience has been a bit opaque.


I’m not sure if this will work but perhaps you can ask a experienced native Chinese speaking person to help. Adding Alipay is definitely gonna help promoting your string library to those people who are interested. I can already imagine a lot of people will be using them in Asian POP Ballard song 🤣 anyway good luck Andrew


----------



## Faruh Al-Baghdadi

Listen, guys, while you're there, maybe you'll make a brass library as well?

I've heard that Hiroyuki Sawano's works can serve as a good reference👀


----------



## Wes Antczak

In the meantime, I really like their current legacy brass library Bravura. Might be worth looking at. But yes a matching brass library would be really nice.

I am really excited about Tokyo Scoring Strings. In fact, I have stopped paying attention to other string library threads on here.


----------



## FireGS

Wes Antczak said:


> But yes a matching brass library would be really nice.


As long as the trumpets don't sound super close and harsh like a lot of recent Japanese video game OST's....


----------



## AMBi

FireGS said:


> As long as the trumpets don't sound super close and harsh like a lot of recent Japanese video game OST's....


Yeah Dragon Quest’s 11’s brass made me stop playing the game.


----------



## FireGS

AMBi said:


> Yeah Dragon Quest’s 11’s brass made me stop playing the game.


I really don't get why the producers think that's a good sound. Brass needs room to breathe. There's a reason the greatest sounding recordings of brass don't use a dynamic mic clipped to the bell, ffs.


----------



## Jackdnp121

I’ll be a very happy person if the brass can do something like this as well 

😂🤟


----------



## Faruh Al-Baghdadi

Jackdnp121 said:


> I’ll be a very happy person if the brass can do something like this as well
> 
> 😂🤟



Yeah, but this is more like big band stuff. Orchestral Tools has such library. Don't know if it is good or bad - haven't tried it.


----------



## Jackdnp121

Faruh Al-Baghdadi said:


> Yeah, but this is more like big band stuff. Orchestral Tools has such library. Don't know if it is good or bad - haven't tried it.


Yeah nah I was joking 🥲

don’t think we are there yet 

nothing like a angry human saxophone player ripping the solo …


----------



## FireGS

Jackdnp121 said:


> I’ll be a very happy person if the brass can do something like this as well
> 
> 😂🤟



Bass player's timing is off. >.<


----------



## Jackdnp121

FireGS said:


> Bass player's timing is off. >.<


I can’t tell 🥲
Maybe I’ve been listening to too much neo soul these days and everything is layback 😅 …


----------



## FireGS

Jackdnp121 said:


> I can’t tell 🥲
> Maybe I’ve been listening to too much neo soul these days and everything is layback 😅 …


He's actually a hair early. I think it's an editing issue, because he's consistently early.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Faruh Al-Baghdadi said:


> Listen, guys, while you're there, maybe you'll make a brass library as well?
> 
> I've heard that Hiroyuki Sawano's works can serve as a good reference👀


Yes, though likely it will be the final one after Drums and Winds.


----------



## TonyZem

FireGS said:


> Bass player's timing is off. >.<


Nothing that affects the overall performance. As a matter of fact what he is playing is not that easy to accomplish if he is not concentrated on what he is doing, because the brass guys are playing in a different rythm cel most of the time. I'm bass player too.


----------



## robgb

Wes Antczak said:


> In the meantime, I really like their current legacy brass library Bravura. Might be worth looking at. But yes a matching brass library would be really nice.


My review.


----------



## Faruh Al-Baghdadi

Andrew Aversa said:


> Yes, though likely it will be the final one after Drums and Winds.


Can we ask you why in this particular order? Strings, Brass, WW, Percussion seems like a classic approach. 
But we will be waiting anyway...


----------



## Wes Antczak

Rob, your review was actually one of the videos that I looked at before making my purchase via VST Buzz. I wound up paying 69 Euro as they were running a promotion at the time. I've been very happy with my purchase and as you said, one doesn't always need the latest and greatest (or the most expensive) to be very useful. As you also said, this library gives the user lots of choices.

Definitely kudos to Andrew's team for really putting a lot of thought into this product!

Which is yet another reason that I am so excited about Tokyo Strings. Based on my experience with ISW products I am sure that the bar is set very high and it will be well worth the extra wait.


----------



## Getsumen

Using my ability to see in the future I predict a new demo soon. 

And also because there's a new demo in the discord featuring the molto vib samples


----------



## muziksculp

Getsumen said:


> And also because there's a new demo in the discord featuring the molto vib samples


I don't see that on VI-C Discord, is it posted somewhere else on Discord ?


----------



## Robert_G

AMBi said:


> Yeah Dragon Quest’s 11’s brass made me stop playing the game.


Nothing makes anyone stop playing DQ11 for any reason. That game is an impeccable flawless masterpiece.


----------



## Getsumen

muziksculp said:


> I don't see that on VI-C Discord, is it posted somewhere else on Discord ?


Oh sorry, it's located in the TSS thread. (It's a semi new feature discord added). All the TSS discussion is in that thread now.

Navigate to the software channel, then locate the thread symbol in the top right corner. Click on it and open the TSS thread. Once you join the thread (I think if you just type anything in the thread it counts as joining) it'll show up on the lefthand channel list like normal.


----------



## Zanshin

Getsumen said:


> Oh sorry, it's located in the TSS thread. (It's a semi new feature discord added). All the TSS discussion is in that thread now.


Did someone say they wanted to run TSS through Nani plugin and yall were kicked to a separate thread?!
(https://www.naniplugin.com/)

EDIT: New demo is great


----------



## gedlig

Sorry if I missed the info somewhere in the thread, but is this ensembles only or also solo violins, viola, cello and bass?

(getting it regardless, just curious)


----------



## constaneum

gedlig said:


> Sorry if I missed the info somewhere in the thread, but is this ensembles only or also solo violins, viola, cello and bass?
> 
> (getting it regardless, just curious)


It was mentioned that TSS shall feature five independently recorded sections (Violins 1, Violins 2, Viola, Cello, Bass) in a typical Japanese ensemble size (8/6/4/4/3). No solo.


----------



## gedlig

constaneum said:


> It was mentioned that TSS shall feature five independently recorded sections (Violins 1, Violins 2, Viola, Cello, Bass) in a typical Japanese ensemble size (8/6/4/4/3). No solo.


Oh ok, thanks. My brain thought that maybe there could be soloists/leaders, cause they're part of those sections :D

Edit: btw, preorders aren't live yet, right?


----------



## constaneum

gedlig said:


> Oh ok, thanks. My brain thought that maybe there could be soloists/leaders, cause they're part of those sections :D
> 
> Edit: btw, preorders aren't live yet, right?


Not yet live.


----------



## muziksculp

Getsumen said:


> Oh sorry, it's located in the TSS thread. (It's a semi new feature discord added). All the TSS discussion is in that thread now.
> 
> Navigate to the software channel, then locate the thread symbol in the top right corner. Click on it and open the TSS thread. Once you join the thread (I think if you just type anything in the thread it counts as joining) it'll show up on the lefthand channel list like normal.


THANKS  Got it. 

I didn't know about the thread symbol.


----------



## Akora

I am *really* interested in this, but can someone with more musical and orchestral knowledge than me explain what exactly makes the sound of this library more japanese, or better suited for making mockups of anime, games, etc. - than other string libraries?

Is it the specific section sizes? From what I hear in the demos, it don't sound like something you can't already do (and lots of people have done already on Youtube) with libraries like Spitfire Chamber Strings for example. I might be missing something obvious, but I just want to get the doubt out of the way which would make me jump on the early bird offer...


----------



## Batrawi

Akora said:


> what exactly makes the sound of this library more japanese


it's all explained in the first post. it's designed to sound japanese out of the box. sure you may achieve this with other libraries but for most of us this is not possible unless spending countless hours of mix and match torture rather than just composing..


----------



## Akora

Batrawi said:


> it's all explained in the first post. it's designed to sound japanese out of the box. sure you may achieve this with other libraries but for most of us this is not possible unless spending countless hours of mix and match torture rather than just composing..


I did read it all and check the demos and such, but all I could find about the sound is:


> Our goal with Tokyo Scoring Strings is to give you the orchestral string sound that has been heard across innumerable world-famous Japanese productions. It features five independently recorded sections (Violins 1, Violins 2, Viola, Cello, Bass) in a typical Japanese ensemble size (8/6/4/4/3) suitable for small and large productions alike.


I'm just trying to understand what the "japanese orchestral string sound" specifically is. Is it because the players play their instruments in a different way to western players?


----------



## lettucehat

Akora said:


> I did read it all and check the demos and such, but all I could find about the sound is:
> 
> I'm just trying to understand what the "japanese orchestral string sound" specifically is. Is it because the players play their instruments in a different way to western players?


I've been wondering this since the beginning as well. I guess it's not necessarily easy to articulate, but combining the actual players/venue/mixer that many famous Japanese games used just works?


----------



## muziksculp

Akora said:


> I'm just trying to understand what the "japanese orchestral string sound" specifically is. Is it because the players play their instruments in a different way to western players?


It's a good question, I would like to know more about this detail as well. I know there is a certain sound character the library is aiming for, which is heard in these Japanese Game Scores, but what's the special sauce that makes the strings sound the way they do ? 

I don't think it has anything to do with the way they play their string instruments, but possibly the engineering part of the production, i.e. gear used in the recording sessions, and other factors, that I'm also interested in knowing what they are, that makes them different sounding from other Strings libraries. Could also be the acoustics of the room/hall, and other contributing factors. 

Maybe @Andrew Aversa can contribute a bit more on this detail.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

We asked several of the Japanese team their opinion on this also, so I will summarize their views & mine:


In general, Japanese players are *very accurate* & precise in their technique, even among other high-caliber musicians.
Japanese recording studios tend to be much smaller on average than those in other countries. It's common for studios in LA, London, Eastern Europe (etc) to be quite large with lots of natural reverb. Of course, this affects the natural reverb tail and overall tone, but also...
Since studios are smaller, and larger ensembles generally can't fit, ensembles like Muroya Strings have learned to create a _larger_ sound simply through their playing technique. (This is something Mr. Aizawa, the engineer, specifically noted.) 
The more compact studio size also leads to different micing techniques and mixing. Plus, Mr. Aizawa has his own special blend of outboard gear and signature sound.


----------



## FireGS

Andrew Aversa said:


> ensembles like Muroya Strings have learned to create a _larger_ sound simply through their playing technique.


Any idea *how* they do this?


----------



## chapbot

FireGS said:


> Any idea *how* they do this?


I would bet they slightly detune themselves for a fatter sound.


----------



## FireGS

chapbot said:


> I would bet they slightly detune themselves for a fatter sound.


Kind of a "beauty at all tunings" kinda thing.


----------



## muziksculp

chapbot said:


> I would bet they slightly detune themselves for a fatter sound.


That's how you get Natural Chorus effect for the strings.


----------



## Akora

Andrew Aversa said:


> We asked several of the Japanese team their opinion on this also, so I will summarize their views & mine:
> 
> 
> In general, Japanese players are *very accurate* & precise in their technique, even among other high-caliber musicians.
> Japanese recording studios tend to be much smaller on average than those in other countries. It's common for studios in LA, London, Eastern Europe (etc) to be quite large with lots of natural reverb. Of course, this affects the natural reverb tail and overall tone, but also...
> Since studios are smaller, and larger ensembles generally can't fit, ensembles like Muroya Strings have learned to create a _larger_ sound simply through their playing technique. (This is something Mr. Aizawa, the engineer, specifically noted.)
> The more compact studio size also leads to different micing techniques and mixing. Plus, Mr. Aizawa has his own special blend of outboard gear and signature sound.


Thanks a lot for the clarification! I've always loved their sound, so it's great to get an understanding of how they achieve it. Can't wait to play around with it!


----------



## DJiLAND

View attachment Victor_Tokyo_Str.mp3


It's not recorded in Sound City, but it's part of my music with strings recorded at another famous studio, Victor Studio Tokyo.
Like TSS, It's a small chamber size string recording, and I was very impressed by emotional and appealing sound.
Listening to the demo of TSS, I think that's the feeling I knew! I hope it will be released soon. I am very much looking forward to it. take my money!


----------



## mybadmemory

For me the japanese sound (that I’ve loved for over 25 years by now) is not only a matter of section size, room size, and recording/engineering, but even more than that in different preferences in playing style.

It’s very exact and extremely emotional. It’s almost over pronounced in some ways and very subtle in others, just in the same way as Japanese acting and animation can vary from precisely controlled to exessively emotive in seconds.

I might be projecting stuff here that really has more to do with composition, arrangement, orchestration, and even context, but I feel their staccatos is sharper, their legatos smoother, and their vibratos stronger.

And they use portamento more vividly than western music.


----------



## windwolf666

Will there be any image of library interface or demonstration video before the pre-order starts?
Hope it will be tomorrow, can't wait to see it


----------



## Denkii

mybadmemory said:


> And they use portamento more vividly than western music.


This is the the first and only thing that would come to my mind.
Other than that, it's all just magic to me and I will gladly embrace it.


----------



## filipjonathan

Have I said already that it would be amazing if we got a little demo legato patch before we order it?


----------



## Getsumen

windwolf666 said:


> Will there be any image of library interface or demonstration video before the pre-order starts?
> Hope it will be tomorrow, can't wait to see it


Couple images of the new TACT used for TSS were shown in the discord. You could also give some feedback there and there's been some good discussion on that end since it seems nothing is finalized.






I'd recommend giving the discord thread a read.


----------



## Saxer

Beside the tightness the style of "Japanese western music" reminds me to early 70s American fusion music. At that time lot of funky elements came into scoring, syncopated rhythms into the orchestral sections. A cross over of jazz, funk and classical was modern in TV scoring. I remember that time here in Germany when it was nearly impossible for classical musicians to play 16th off beats. The never did that and they avoided any influence from the pop/jazz/rock/funk world to keep their classical style "clean and holy". That changed a lot in the last 40 years. The newer generations grew up with pop/rock music and DAWs and click tracks. The fusion elements of the 70s that became out of style in US and Europe are still present in Japanese music. For that string players need to adapt to a kind of pop brass section articulation. It's quite the opposite to the Spitfire long pumping notes with their slow attacks and expression crescendo. This style needs a tight and immediate attack, more like a sfz than a crescendo for the long notes. It's less airy and lyrical but more controlled and centered. If all that makes sense...


----------



## muziksculp

Saxer said:


> Beside the tightness the style of "Japanese western music" reminds me to early 70s American fusion music. At that time lot of funky elements came into scoring, syncopated rhythms into the orchestral sections. A cross over of jazz, funk and classical was modern in TV scoring. I remember that time here in Germany when it was nearly impossible for classical musicians to play 16th off beats. The never did that and they avoided any influence from the pop/jazz/rock/funk world to keep their classical style "clean and holy". That changed a lot in the last 40 years. The newer generations grew up with pop/rock music and DAWs and click tracks. The fusion elements of the 70s that became out of style in US and Europe are still present in Japanese music. For that string players need to adapt to a kind of pop brass section articulation. It's quite the opposite to the Spitfire long pumping notes with their slow attacks and expression crescendo. This style needs a tight and immediate attack, more like a sfz than a crescendo for the long notes. It's less airy and lyrical but more controlled and centered. If all that makes sense...


Thanks for the interesting feedback. I didn't realize this influence from the 70's Pop/Jazz/Funk world on the Japanese style of music. Which remains with them until today.


----------



## muziksculp

Getsumen said:


> Couple images of the new TACT used for TSS were shown in the discord. You could also give some feedback there and there's been some good discussion on that end since it seems nothing is finalized.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd recommend giving the discord thread a read.


THANKS  

Here are the Articulations a bit clearer than shown in the TACT table above :

C-2: Sustain
C#-2: Harmonics
D-2: Tremolo
D#-2: TrillsHT
E-2: TrillsWt
F-2: Sforz Quarter
F#-2: Sforz Eighth
G-2: Dec Quarter
G#-2: Dec Eighth
A-2: Staccato
A#-2: Staccatissimo
B-2: Spiccato
C-1: Secco
C#-1: Pizzicato


----------



## muziksculp

Is the 'Secco' articulation a Damped Pizz. ?


----------



## Jackdnp121

Saxer said:


> Beside the tightness the style of "Japanese western music" reminds me to early 70s American fusion music. At that time lot of funky elements came into scoring, syncopated rhythms into the orchestral sections. A cross over of jazz, funk and classical was modern in TV scoring. I remember that time here in Germany when it was nearly impossible for classical musicians to play 16th off beats. The never did that and they avoided any influence from the pop/jazz/rock/funk world to keep their classical style "clean and holy". That changed a lot in the last 40 years. The newer generations grew up with pop/rock music and DAWs and click tracks. The fusion elements of the 70s that became out of style in US and Europe are still present in Japanese music. For that string players need to adapt to a kind of pop brass section articulation. It's quite the opposite to the Spitfire long pumping notes with their slow attacks and expression crescendo. This style needs a tight and immediate attack, more like a sfz than a crescendo for the long notes. It's less airy and lyrical but more controlled and centered. If all that makes sense...


 casiopea , t square … I love them .. they have manager to create their own style of Japanese fusion too … very cool


----------



## moon

Jackdnp121 said:


> casiopea , t square … I love them .. they have manager to create their own style of Japanese fusion too … very cool


And Dimension as well. Most people have heard them in some capacity on the most recent Mario Kart soundtrack.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

muziksculp said:


> Is the 'Secco' articulation a Damped Pizz. ?


No, it is a type of spiccato that is very agile!


----------



## muziksculp

Andrew Aversa said:


> No, it is a type of spiccato that is very agile!


THANKS  

That's great to know, I'm sure this agile spiccato will be more useful than a damped Pizz.  

I'm happy to know that you are providing a wide assortment of shorts in TSS. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## windwolf666

Getsumen said:


> Couple images of the new TACT used for TSS were shown in the discord. You could also give some feedback there and there's been some good discussion on that end since it seems nothing is finalized.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd recommend giving the discord thread a read.


That's cool!! Thanks a lot! I already saw you mentioned before, but I really couldn't find the thread in discord...(search for software channel, but don't see TSS)
Is there any other keyword or url to join in straight?


----------



## Getsumen

windwolf666 said:


> That's cool!! Thanks a lot! I already saw you mentioned before, but I really couldn't find the thread in discord...(search for software channel, but don't see TSS)
> Is there any other keyword or url to join in straight?


Yeah there's a bit of an extra step.


Getsumen said:


> Oh sorry, it's located in the TSS thread. (It's a semi new feature discord added). All the TSS discussion is in that thread now.
> 
> Navigate to the software channel, then locate the thread symbol in the top right corner. Click on it and open the TSS thread. Once you join the thread (I think if you just type anything in the thread it counts as joining) it'll show up on the lefthand channel list like normal.


Try following those instructions and see if you can find it ^


----------



## windwolf666

Getsumen said:


> Yeah there's a bit of an extra step.
> 
> Try following those instructions and see if you can find it ^


Oh! I find it eventually!! Thank you again!!


----------



## Terry93D

Getsumen said:


> Couple images of the new TACT used for TSS were shown in the discord. You could also give some feedback there and there's been some good discussion on that end since it seems nothing is finalized.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd recommend giving the discord thread a read.


This looks nice. Seems like TACT is going to provide just the right amount of customizability so I can set things up precisely the way I want them without any trouble.


----------



## Toecutter

DJiLAND said:


> View attachment Victor_Tokyo_Str.mp3
> 
> 
> It's not recorded in Sound City, but it's part of my music with strings recorded at another famous studio, Victor Studio Tokyo.
> Like TSS, It's a small chamber size string recording, and I was very impressed by emotional and appealing sound.
> Listening to the demo of TSS, I think that's the feeling I knew! I hope it will be released soon. I am very much looking forward to it. take my money!


That's awesome! I don't get the luxury of recording often but yea I had the same feeling the first time I heard TSS... high expectations


----------



## markleake

robgb said:


> My review.



I like your review Rob. And I agree, it's quite a good library.

I like the solo instruments better than the ensembles. The solos are right up there with the "usual suspects" we discuss around here.

I haven't yet found a solo flugelhorn or solo horn that works so well for me for specific softer purposes. People say they like the 8dio flugelhorn - well, they need to play the ISW one, it's wonderful! A hidden gem.


----------



## AEF

i really love the tone of this library. its very raw and aggressive yet sweet too. looking forward to seeing some walkthroughs of the legatos in action. the articulations list looks perfect too!


----------



## robgb

markleake said:


> I like your review Rob. And I agree, it's quite a good library.
> 
> I like the solo instruments better than the ensembles. The solos are right up there with the "usual suspects" we discuss around here.
> 
> I haven't yet found a solo flugelhorn or solo horn that works so well for me for specific softer purposes. People say they like the 8dio flugelhorn - well, they need to play the ISW one, it's wonderful! A hidden gem.


Try the Sample Modeling (Not Audio Modeling) flugelhorn. It's pretty terrific.


----------



## Zanshin

Is there information on the room these were recorded in somewhere? I tried google but nothing fell out for me.


----------



## Batrawi

Zanshin said:


> Is there information on the room these were recorded in somewhere? I tried google but nothing fell out for me.


Mentioned in the first post. This one I guess but Andrew can correct me if I'm wrong









Sound City Studios - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org





Edit: This link says the studio is in LA but first post says Tokyo🤷‍♂️


----------



## Zanshin

Yeah there was a Sound City LA, there’s a good film doc about it.

The Tokyo Sound City is different.


----------



## muziksculp




----------



## MusiquedeReve

Andrew Aversa said:


> Impact Soundworks is thrilled to officially announce our first flagship orchestral string library:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *THE STORY*
> 
> Our goal with Tokyo Scoring Strings is to give you the orchestral string sound that has been heard across innumerable world-famous Japanese productions. It features five independently recorded sections (Violins 1, Violins 2, Viola, Cello, Bass) in a typical Japanese ensemble size (8/6/4/4/3) suitable for small and large productions alike.
> 
> We began this project in 2019, setting out to work with the finest musicians, engineer, and scoring studio in Japan. Due to both the language barrier & COVID, we had to find the right partners to help manage the project overseas. We connected with some incredible collaborators who have been with us through every step of the journey: our Japanese distributors *Crypton Future Media* and *Sonicwire*, plus the renowned composer *Masaru Yokoyama*.
> 
> Mr. Yokoyama, in addition to running a music production company (*MiracleBus*) and orchestral recording contractor (*PlugNote*), has composed for over 100 Japanese films, dramas, and anime series, bringing invaluable experience to the project.
> 
> *THE MUSICIANS*
> 
> _The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild, Attack on Titan, Super Mario Odyssey, My Hero Academia, Final Fantasy XV, The Seven Deadly Sins, Fate/Grand Order, Octopath Traveler, Persona 5, Haikyuu, Xenoblade Chronicles, Tokyo Ghoul_.
> 
> All of these incredible scores, and over 600 more, have one thing in common: *Koichiro Muroya Strings*, led by its eponymous founder, violinist Koichiro Muroya. Their exquisite playing can be heard soaring across genres ranging from quiet, emotional anime moments to epic hybrid tracks by composers like Hiroyuki Sawano. Not surprisingly, Muroya Strings is the most in-demand session ensemble in all of Japan - and we were truly honored to record them for this project.
> 
> *THE ENGINEER*
> 
> The sound of these blockbuster Japanese soundtracks is not _just _superb musicianship and technique. The approach to recording and mixing orchestral scores is fundamentally unique as well. That's why we were equally privileged to work with Japan's top engineer, *Mitsunori Aizawa*, who is responsible for recording & mixing hundreds of world-famous anime, film, TV and video game productions.
> 
> Mr. Aizawa is a frequent collaborator of composer Hiroyuki Sawano, and his work can be heard on soundtracks like _Final Fantasy VII Remake, The Promised Neverland, Fruits Basket, Mobile Suit Gundam, Kill la Kill, Monster Hunter, Street Fighter V_, and many of the same soundtracks listed above!
> 
> *THE STUDIO*
> 
> Of course, the final element in an unforgettable score is an incredible recording space. For that reason, Tokyo Scoring Strings was recorded at *SOUND CITY*. With a truly legendary 60-year history, SOUND CITY has been home to countless beloved recordings for albums and soundtracks alike.
> 
> Here are just a small handful of the artists & composers who have returned time and time again to record at SOUND CITY:
> 
> Joe Hisaishi, Yoko Kanno, Nobuo Uematsu, Hiroyuki Sawano, Yuki Kajiura, Masashi Hamauzu, Kenji Kawai, Kohei Tanaka, Tatsuro Yamashita, JAM Project, Yasunori Nishiki, Hiroki Kikuta, Miki Higashino, and Jackie Chan (yes, that Jackie Chan!).
> 
> Unlike the larger halls and studios of the U.S. and Europe, studios in Japan tend to be built smaller, with rooms that offer a full-bodied sound without excessive reverb tails. SOUND CITY is no exception, giving Tokyo Scoring Strings a tighter, more focused sound that lends itself extremely well to more agile playing.
> 
> *THE LIBRARY*
> 
> Tokyo Studio Strings will include a well-rounded set of core articulations captured at 24/96 with superb detail. You'll be able to write and mock-up a wide variety of parts from slow & intimate to aggressive & agile, with a particular focus on excellent legato and short notes.
> 
> To help record even more authentic performances over the 90+ hours of sessions, we developed some new sampling techniques specifically for this library based on our 11 years of experience. The results should speak for themselves!
> 
> We'll provide specific information about articulations, dynamics, RR, and more soon.
> 
> *THE RECORDINGS*
> 
> To give you maximum mix flexibility, the ensemble was captured with over a dozen mics, which have been mixed down to five stereo positions: Close, Decca, Side, Back, and Surround. We’ve also included a Board Mix which features Mr. Aizawa’s own console mix, and is an excellent, efficient way to get that authentic sound instantly.
> 
> The library will ship with our latest *Console* FX rack & mixer too, with built-in snapshots to give you a wide range of pre-mixed tones!
> 
> *THE ENGINE*
> 
> Tokyo Scoring Strings will feature a new Kontakt Player-based engine built from our “Agility” script (see our Ventus libraries to get an idea of what to expect).
> 
> There’s lots in store here to help you get great results fast. For example, you’ll be able to use two modes of playing: “real-time” with low-latency, and “lookahead,” which adds a slight latency in exchange for more realistic and idiomatic playback.
> 
> You'll also be able to suit TSS to your workflow via our latest iteration of TACT (*Total Articulation Control Technology*) supporting totally custom articulation mapping using any combination of velocity, keyswitch, MIDI CC, note range, pedal, or even multiple rules at once.
> 
> *AUDIO DEMOS*
> 
> There will be plenty of demos coming by the time the library launches, but for now please enjoy two pieces: one as featured in the teaser video, and another by composer & violinist Jeff Ball, showing a completely different side of the library with plenty of light, feathery playing across multiple articulations & dynamics.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *FULL ARTICULATION LIST*
> 
> All sections have identical articulations, dynamic layers, and round robins!
> 
> Note too that the Legato & Portamento articulations have *3 actual dynamics*, not simulated (as in many libraries). This goes for ALL dynamics below.
> 
> Arco (Sustain) - 5 dynamics, 3 vibrato levels (senza, con, molto)
> Bowed Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Slurred Legato - 3 dynamics, 2x rr
> Bowed Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Slurred Portamento - 3 dynamics
> Rebow - 3 dynamics, 5x rr
> Staccato - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Staccatissimo - 5 dynamics, 6x rr
> Spiccato - 4 dynamics, 6x rr
> Crisp Spiccato - 2 dynamics, 6x rr
> Sforzando - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Decrescendo - Dotted eighth & dotted quarter lengths, 3x rr
> Pizzicato - 3 dynamics, 4x rr
> Tremolo - 4 dynamics
> Trills - 2 dynamics, whole tone & half tone
> Releases - natural, excited, and staccato
> Harmonics
> 
> *PRICING & AVAILABILITY*
> 
> We are planning for a full release of Tokyo Scoring Strings in late October to early November.
> 
> *Preorders *will be available in* September *and will run for one month, at special early bird pricing of $349.
> 
> *Intro pricing*, once the library is released, will be $399 for two weeks. (List MSRP: $449)
> 
> Tokyo Scoring Strings will be compatible with the free Kontakt 6 Player and will be fully NKS compatible.



Trying to preorder but do not see it on the Impact Soundworks website


----------



## Zanshin

muziksculp said:


>



That's a cool video. I was kinda hoping some otaku would chime in with the exact dimensions and maybe even floor plans haha. We get to see some trumpets a3 and horns a6 action going on in the room though.

From the videos I've seen, maybe something like the Recording Studio Weiler in Mir Pro would be a good approximation. The ORF Funkhaus Wien Studio 2/3 would appear at first glance to be too big.


----------



## muziksculp

MorphineNoir said:


> Trying to preorder but do not see it on the Impact Soundworks website


They haven't started the Pre-Orders yet. 

I'm guessing it will happen soon.


----------



## Wedge

muziksculp said:


> They haven't started the Pre-Orders yet.
> 
> I'm guessing it will happen soon.


It states at the beginning of the post Pre-Orders were starting in September so I reckon a few of us have been confused. Thank you.


----------



## CatOrchestra

How friendly is Impact Soundworks on license transfers?


----------



## Denkii

FAQ - Impact Soundworks


Frequently Asked Questions Purchase & Delivery What payment methods do you accept? We accept payment via all major credit & debit cards, PayPal, Bancontact, SOFORT, iDeal, Giropay, and Multibanco. Your payment information is securely processed with maximum encryption, and we never store any of...




impactsoundworks.com


----------



## CatOrchestra

Denkii said:


> FAQ - Impact Soundworks
> 
> 
> Frequently Asked Questions Purchase & Delivery What payment methods do you accept? We accept payment via all major credit & debit cards, PayPal, Bancontact, SOFORT, iDeal, Giropay, and Multibanco. Your payment information is securely processed with maximum encryption, and we never store any of...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> impactsoundworks.com


It is a case-by-case basis, so I was wondering what experience people have had when they want to transfer their purchases.


----------



## Limeopolis

CatOrchestra said:


> It is a case-by-case basis, so I was wondering what experience people have had when they want to transfer their purchases.


I sent them an email to license transfer a handful of items a couple of months ago and they allowed it with no issues.


----------



## neblix

Pre-orders can only begin when we have serial numbers, and we are not yet ready to submit to NI this week (we are doing it next week). I'm not sure of the timeline of serial delivery, but I would update everyone's expectation that the earliest possible pre-order launch next week, or the second half of October in general.

We are aiming for completion of the main GUI end of this week. To be clear, the orchestral engine itself --so playback of the articulations, legato/poly legato, TACT, etc. -- is completed, it is just a matter of hooking up a shiny new frontend to control the parameters inside, as we have been using a temp GUI to test the library the past several months.

Our last and heftiest engine feature, the lookahead system, will still require several more weeks of scripting and testing. This will not delay pre-orders as it isn't required for serial delivery, nor will our projected library release be delayed, as we will simply opt to withhold unfinished features to release in a timely manner. As of now, we have decided automatic CC phrasing will not appear in v1.0, but will appear in a future update as more Tokyo products are developed.

We're sorry for the delay in pre-orders! This is our team's largest project and we have to take care of ourselves as well. Andrew is expecting a 2nd child very soon.

A 2nd post incoming with details on the status of our engine development.


----------



## neblix

After more time testing and brainstorming, we have decided the product's user experience will be divided into 3 modes:

*-Classic *mode, the *default* mode, will be how everyone is familiar with sample libraries. The shorts have a small bit of pre-roll, the legatos have latency, and you manage the speed setting yourself. This is orchestral sample libraries as we know and use in the present day. This is for composers who take comfort in using the library the same way they use all others. It's a 50/50 compromise of familiar programming work combined with pretty good sound quality. For those who feel the extra systems and features are a bother, you will probably use this 95% of the time. The classic mode will have our (optional) latency-based polyphonic legato as well, so that isn't locked behind the Lookahead system.

-*Zero-Latency* mode will diminish sound quality heavily by employing enormous samples offsets to cut any and all pre-roll. Legato transitions will sound nearly non-existent as well. This is a mode purely for those who want to record on the click, with the intention of activating the *Lookahead* mode afterwards.

-*Lookahead *mode, combined with activating the companion VST on the relevant track, will employ the analysis features listed further below. You should only use this mode after you have recorded with *Zero-Latency* mode or you are sequencing the MIDI on the grid in the piano roll. This gives the best sound quality with the smallest programming work.

The features for *certain* the lookahead system will have are:

-*Primitive long vs. short articulation switching (on a toggle): *there are too many articulations to account for with simple length analysis, but in future updates, we can attempt more advanced analysis. At the end of the day, it's extremely subjective and arbitrary what a composer can intend with just basic MIDI data. Only the aid of integrating with a notation software (such as how NotePerformer does) can improve this area of using samples. The toggle will allow you to turn this off if you wish to trigger your articulations as normal with keyswitches or other maps (designable in TACT!).

-*Articulation alignment (with an "ignore offset" toggle)*: everything will be perfectly aligned in time on a quantized MIDI. shorts, longs, legatos, everything. Even the pre-rolls in articulations like spiccatos will be corrected! Turning off the "ignore offset" toggle will prevent the system from undoing your articulation sample offsets, if you had for example preferred the sound of the shorts being "cut" into instead of having their full attacks from silence.

-*Legato speed analysis (on a toggle): *auto adjusts legato speed setting based on phrase. Turning the toggle off will restore user control of legato speed selection.

-*Polyphonic legato*: the easiest promise to make because it is an existing feature ported from our AGILITY products. 

-*Companion Latency-Correction VST*: this will allow the DAW itself to synchronize the parts and not require any track offsets or manual midi clip shifting. Toggling it on/off should trigger any DAW with plugin delay compensation to align all other tracks to wait for the Tokyo products to catch up.

That sums up our plan for v1.0 of the library's lookahead features.


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> As of now, we have decided automatic CC phrasing will not appear in v1.0, but will appear in a future update as more Tokyo products are developed.


Hi @neblix ,

What is Automatic CC phrasing ? I have no clue what this does. 

Could you elaborate on this feature a bit. 

Thanks.


----------



## neblix

muziksculp said:


> Hi @neblix ,
> 
> What is Automatic CC phrasing ? I have no clue what this does.
> 
> Could you elaborate on this feature a bit.
> 
> Thanks.


This is the feature mentioned months ago that would analyze the phrase and create curves for the dynamics to mimic a real performance. We have ideas on how to do it, but we simply don't have time on the current schedule to pull the resources together developing it.


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> This is the feature mentioned months ago that would analyze the phrase and create curves for the dynamics to mimic a real performance. We have ideas on how to do it, but we simply don't have time on the current schedule to pull the resources together developing it.


Interesting. So.. these are Smart Dynamics generated by some type of analysis of the note data, I'm guessing. So the results will be more realistic than if one manually inputs the CC data, i.e. via mod-wheel, or breath controller, ...etc. ? 

Have you used this in type of feature in your existing libraries ? or it is a very new feature you are working on ? 

Thanks.


----------



## neblix

muziksculp said:


> Interesting. So.. these are Smart Dynamics generated by some type of analysis of the note data, I'm guessing. So the results will be more realistic than if one manually inputs the CC data, i.e. via mod-wheel, or breath controller, ...etc. ?
> 
> Have you used this in type of feature in your existing libraries ? or it is a very new feature you are working on ?
> 
> Thanks.


It would be a brand new feature for us. It has been done before in other realms; this is a selling point of NotePerformer, a lookahead-based playback system for notation software like Sibelius. The notation software StaffPad I believe also employs their own engine to accomplish it.


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> It would be a brand new feature for us. It has been done before in other realms; this is a selling point of NotePerformer, a lookahead-based playback system for notation software like Sibelius. The notation software StaffPad I believe also employs their own engine to accomplish it.


Very interesting. Thanks for the helpful feedback. 

Wish you all the Best, and lots of Success in implementing this type of advanced feature/s in future updates of TSS and your other Libraries.


----------



## Kabuki

neblix said:


> This is the feature mentioned months ago that would analyze the phrase and create curves for the dynamics to mimic a real performance.


Insta-buy the day you guys pull this off. Good luck, ISW!


----------



## Batrawi

neblix said:


> This is the feature mentioned months ago that would analyze the phrase and create curves for the dynamics to mimic a real performance. We have ideas on how to do it, but we simply don't have time on the current schedule to pull the resources together developing it.


WOW! I've been dreaming of a similar feature but for automating vibrato curves instead of dynamics... I find one of the main reasons why legato in samples still sounds different from what we usually hear in reality is that real performances tend to have a sudden dip in vibrato (almost goes to complete no vib) just at the very end of a note before it transitions into the next note. So can this feature be also used to emulate such nuance? totally understood if the answer is no given the script is mainly designed for dynamic curves as opposed to vib. but still something worth considering while you're at it / if its possible to make another variant/rules for vibrato


----------



## Henning

If you have not already you mighr check out the brandnew Impact Soundworks Kageyawa Taikos. Very dry and natural sounding Taikos. You might also find some testdriving of the latest TSS version in my demo for this lib.

https://vi-control.net/community/th...solo-taiko-library-ever-available-now.115321/


----------



## muziksculp

Henning said:


> If you have not already you mighr check out the brandnew Impact Soundworks Kageyawa Taikos. Very dry and natural sounding Taikos. You might also find some tesdriving of the latest TSS version in my demo for this
> 
> https://vi-control.net/community/th...solo-taiko-library-ever-available-now.115321/


I'm glad you mentioned it. 

hehe.. I purchased the Kageyawa Taikos this morning, after it appeared on my Youtube notifications. 

But, haven't installed it yet, loved what I heard in the walkthrough, and demos.


----------



## Henning

muziksculp said:


> I'm glad you mentioned it.
> 
> hehe.. I purchased the Kageyawa Taikos this morning, after it appeared on my Youtube notifications.
> 
> But, haven't installed it yet, loved what I heard in the walkthrough, and demos.


Tell us what you think of it when you have checked it out. I personally find it very versatile.


----------



## Inventio

Henning said:


> Tell us what you think of it when you have checked it out. I personally find it very versatile.


I think so, too. I like this dry detailed sound, which can be turned into something else, and I was also surprised by the number of dynamic layers, which makes the library quite expressive, almost "singing".


----------



## HM_Music

When will the TSS pre-order be available?
It is also interesting, since the TSS pre-order date has been moved from September, will the release date also be moved?


----------



## Henning

Inventio said:


> I think so, too. I like this dry detailed sound, which can be turned into something else, and I was also surprised by the number of dynamic layers, which makes the library quite expressive, almost "singing".


Cool demo of yours, Alessandro!


----------



## Inventio

Henning said:


> Cool demo of yours, Alessandro!


Thank you!


----------



## tonio_

neblix said:


> After more time testing and brainstorming, we have decided the product's user experience will be divided into 3 modes:
> 
> *-Classic *mode, the *default* mode, will be how everyone is familiar with sample libraries. The shorts have a small bit of pre-roll, the legatos have latency, and you manage the speed setting yourself. This is orchestral sample libraries as we know and use in the present day. This is for composers who take comfort in using the library the same way they use all others. It's a 50/50 compromise of familiar programming work combined with pretty good sound quality. For those who feel the extra systems and features are a bother, you will probably use this 95% of the time. The classic mode will have our (optional) latency-based polyphonic legato as well, so that isn't locked behind the Lookahead system.
> 
> -*Zero-Latency* mode will diminish sound quality heavily by employing enormous samples offsets to cut any and all pre-roll. Legato transitions will sound nearly non-existent as well. This is a mode purely for those who want to record on the click, with the intention of activating the *Lookahead* mode afterwards.
> 
> -*Lookahead *mode, combined with activating the companion VST on the relevant track, will employ the analysis features listed further below. You should only use this mode after you have recorded with *Zero-Latency* mode or you are sequencing the MIDI on the grid in the piano roll. This gives the best sound quality with the smallest programming work.
> 
> The features for *certain* the lookahead system will have are:
> 
> -*Primitive long vs. short articulation switching (on a toggle): *there are too many articulations to account for with simple length analysis, but in future updates, we can attempt more advanced analysis. At the end of the day, it's extremely subjective and arbitrary what a composer can intend with just basic MIDI data. Only the aid of integrating with a notation software (such as how NotePerformer does) can improve this area of using samples. The toggle will allow you to turn this off if you wish to trigger your articulations as normal with keyswitches or other maps (designable in TACT!).
> 
> -*Articulation alignment (with an "ignore offset" toggle)*: everything will be perfectly aligned in time on a quantized MIDI. shorts, longs, legatos, everything. Even the pre-rolls in articulations like spiccatos will be corrected! Turning off the "ignore offset" toggle will prevent the system from undoing your articulation sample offsets, if you had for example preferred the sound of the shorts being "cut" into instead of having their full attacks from silence.
> 
> -*Legato speed analysis (on a toggle): *auto adjusts legato speed setting based on phrase. Turning the toggle off will restore user control of legato speed selection.
> 
> -*Polyphonic legato*: the easiest promise to make because it is an existing feature ported from our AGILITY products.
> 
> -*Companion Latency-Correction VST*: this will allow the DAW itself to synchronize the parts and not require any track offsets or manual midi clip shifting. Toggling it on/off should trigger any DAW with plugin delay compensation to align all other tracks to wait for the Tokyo products to catch up.
> 
> That sums up our plan for v1.0 of the library's lookahead features.


Hey, this sounds great!

Could you go into a bit more detail about the Lookahead mode and Companion VST? I'm not sure I understood how this works :D

Also, in terms of the quality, you mentioned that the Classic mode is a compromise and that it's quality is slightly subpar when compared to the Lookahead mode, what are the actual differences that are to be expected? Aside from the whole offset situation that is


----------



## constaneum

I may be wrong but maybe like CSS classic and non classic mode ?


----------



## neblix

tonio_ said:


> Hey, this sounds great!
> 
> Could you go into a bit more detail about the Lookahead mode and Companion VST? I'm not sure I understood how this works :D
> 
> Also, in terms of the quality, you mentioned that the Classic mode is a compromise and that it's quality is slightly subpar when compared to the Lookahead mode, what are the actual differences that are to be expected? Aside from the whole offset situation that is


The companion VST is placed on the same track as your Tokyo Scoring product and if it is switched "ON" when your product is in Lookahead mode, the DAW will synchronize it so your notes play at the correct time in the music. To be ultra-clear, there is nothing to *do* in this VST, no controls or configuration is required. It doesn't have fancy system code to talk to other plugins. It is the act of just placing it in and turning it on that does the trick. Its entire purpose is just to communicate to the DAW that the track will be late.

The difference in quality is probably the difference between the numbers 98 and 100. The manual programming work to get stuff like legato aligned correctly (especially tedious in tempo changes), combined with the subtle sample offsets we added to shorts to increase their playability, it's less that Classic mode doesn't sound as good as Lookahead, and more that we feel it's becoming an outdated way to use sample libraries because of the work required.

Of course, everyone is different, so that is why the modes are an option. We are also planning to develop the Lookahead system over time and its first iteration will likely see some changes sooner than later once we have user feedback. We aren't comfortable asserting that Lookahead mode is the *definitive* way to use the product until it can be shown that it's easy enough to setup that using Classic mode seems like more of a hassle. It's easy for me to use it because I envisioned and developed it; the same doesn't go for people who've never seen it before.




> I may be wrong but maybe like CSS classic and non classic mode ?



CSS Classic is a patch that uses their legato programming from CS2 as opposed to their higher latency and speed-controlled legato engine. There isn't any comparable concept here. Our library from the getgo features legato speeds that do go down to higher latency, so in a way, our "Classic" mode is what the regular CSS is like, if you want to think of it that way. Off the back of this, we may consider updating the name of the mode to something else to avoid confusion.


----------



## Denkii

neblix said:


> The companion VST is placed on the same track as your Tokyo Scoring product and if it is switched "ON" when your product is in Lookahead mode, the DAW will synchronize it so your notes play at the correct time in the music. To be ultra-clear, there is nothing to *do* in this VST, no controls or configuration is required. It doesn't have fancy system code to talk to other plugins. It is the act of just placing it in and turning it on that does the trick. Its entire purpose is just to communicate to the DAW that the track will be late.
> 
> The difference in quality is probably the difference between the numbers 98 and 100. Combining the manual programming work to get stuff like legato aligned correctly (especially tedious in tempo changes), combined with the subtle sample offsets, we added to shorts to increase their playability, it's less that Classic mode doesn't sound as good as Lookahead, and more that we feel it's becoming an outdated way to use sample libraries because of the work required.
> 
> Of course, everyone is different, so that is why the modes are an option. We are also planning to develop the Lookahead system over time and its first iteration will likely see some changes sooner than later once we have user feedback. We aren't comfortable asserting that Lookahead mode is the *definitive* way to use the product until it can be shown that it's easy enough to setup that using Classic mode seems like more of a hassle. It's easy for me to use it because I envisioned and developed it; the same doesn't go for people who've never seen it before.


If uhhh...you need someone to test that for you in studio one or live, let me know.
If you need proper "dumbest customer" feedback, I am your man.
If *insert reason for you sending me TSS asap here* you know where to find me.


----------



## Trash Panda

Yes, I can also provide lowest common denominator idiocy testing.


----------



## tonio_

neblix said:


> The companion VST is placed on the same track as your Tokyo Scoring product and if it is switched "ON" when your product is in Lookahead mode, the DAW will synchronize it so your notes play at the correct time in the music. To be ultra-clear, there is nothing to *do* in this VST, no controls or configuration is required. It doesn't have fancy system code to talk to other plugins. It is the act of just placing it in and turning it on that does the trick. Its entire purpose is just to communicate to the DAW that the track will be late.
> 
> The difference in quality is probably the difference between the numbers 98 and 100. The manual programming work to get stuff like legato aligned correctly (especially tedious in tempo changes), combined with the subtle sample offsets we added to shorts to increase their playability, it's less that Classic mode doesn't sound as good as Lookahead, and more that we feel it's becoming an outdated way to use sample libraries because of the work required.
> 
> Of course, everyone is different, so that is why the modes are an option. We are also planning to develop the Lookahead system over time and its first iteration will likely see some changes sooner than later once we have user feedback. We aren't comfortable asserting that Lookahead mode is the *definitive* way to use the product until it can be shown that it's easy enough to setup that using Classic mode seems like more of a hassle. It's easy for me to use it because I envisioned and developed it; the same doesn't go for people who've never seen it before.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CSS Classic is a patch that uses their legato programming from CS2 as opposed to their higher latency and speed-controlled legato engine. There isn't any comparable concept here. Our library from the getgo features legato speeds that do go down to higher latency, so in a way, our "Classic" mode is what the regular CSS is like, if you want to think of it that way. Off the back of this, we may consider updating the name of the mode to something else to avoid confusion.


Okay, this sounds so cool, I want it yesterday!

Another question (sorry I need my TSS dose of the day): what would be the difference between just using a MIDI offset while on the Lookahead mode (or dragging the MIDI part ahead of the beat, but that's kinda messy) and using the Companion VST? As I understand, the Companion delays every other track in the DAW and the offset makes the MIDI play earlier by a set amount, but would the end result be the same or would there be differences?


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

tonio_ said:


> Okay, this sounds so cool, I want it yesterday!
> 
> Another question (sorry I need my TSS dose of the day): what would be the difference between just using a MIDI offset while on the Lookahead mode (or dragging the MIDI part ahead of the beat, but that's kinda messy) and using the Companion VST? As I understand, the Companion delays every other track in the DAW and the offset makes the MIDI play earlier by a set amount, but would the end result be the same or would there be differences?


To my understanding, there is no difference -- the companion VST is just there to assist users who may not know how to do it otherwise, or whose DAW might not have a built-in way to do it.


----------



## neblix

tonio_ said:


> Okay, this sounds so cool, I want it yesterday!
> 
> Another question (sorry I need my TSS dose of the day): what would be the difference between just using a MIDI offset while on the Lookahead mode (or dragging the MIDI part ahead of the beat, but that's kinda messy) and using the Companion VST? As I understand, the Companion delays every other track in the DAW and the offset makes the MIDI play earlier by a set amount, but would the end result be the same or would there be differences?


It depends if your DAW even supports track offsets in excess of 1 second.


----------



## Ihnoc

neblix said:


> The companion VST is placed on the same track as your Tokyo Scoring product and if it is switched "ON" when your product is in Lookahead mode, the DAW will synchronize it so your notes play at the correct time in the music. To be ultra-clear, there is nothing to *do* in this VST, no controls or configuration is required. It doesn't have fancy system code to talk to other plugins. It is the act of just placing it in and turning it on that does the trick. Its entire purpose is just to communicate to the DAW that the track will be late.


So this is a VST plugin (not Instrument) that reports a set latency to the DAW? Therefore the DAW handles the sync by way of latency compensation or something?


----------



## aka70

neblix said:


> The companion VST is placed on the same track as your Tokyo Scoring product and if it is switched "ON" when your product is in Lookahead mode, the DAW will synchronize it so your notes play at the correct time in the music. To be ultra-clear, there is nothing to *do* in this VST, no controls or configuration is required. It doesn't have fancy system code to talk to other plugins. It is the act of just placing it in and turning it on that does the trick. Its entire purpose is just to communicate to the DAW that the track will be late.
> 
> The difference in quality is probably the difference between the numbers 98 and 100. The manual programming work to get stuff like legato aligned correctly (especially tedious in tempo changes), combined with the subtle sample offsets we added to shorts to increase their playability, it's less that Classic mode doesn't sound as good as Lookahead, and more that we feel it's becoming an outdated way to use sample libraries because of the work required.
> 
> Of course, everyone is different, so that is why the modes are an option. We are also planning to develop the Lookahead system over time and its first iteration will likely see some changes sooner than later once we have user feedback. We aren't comfortable asserting that Lookahead mode is the *definitive* way to use the product until it can be shown that it's easy enough to setup that using Classic mode seems like more of a hassle. It's easy for me to use it because I envisioned and developed it; the same doesn't go for people who've never seen it before.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> CSS Classic is a patch that uses their legato programming from CS2 as opposed to their higher latency and speed-controlled legato engine. There isn't any comparable concept here. Our library from the getgo features legato speeds that do go down to higher latency, so in a way, our "Classic" mode is what the regular CSS is like, if you want to think of it that way. Off the back of this, we may consider updating the name of the mode to something else to avoid confusion.


Make it adjustable, make it a product to sell. It will be useful for everyone to have a plugin like this with all the libraries. It would be awesome


----------



## Brasart

(Woops, deleted my post because I was responding to something else entirely)


----------



## aka70

Brasart said:


> Pretty much every orchestral library reacts differently to their own vibrato and dynamics layers, I'm not sure how useful a plugin like this would be to a widespread application of different libraries from different companies


That's true, but in the end everything comes down to milliseconds. Only CSS has velocity speeds in one patch that affect the delay. All the others as I know, have one patch for velocity (longs -250, shorts 60 etc) For people who uses splits artic it's easy but for people like me that want one instrument with all the articulation it's a pain in the ass. Anyway my idea it's a "multiscript" that controls every channels inside Kontakt independently with different values, or something like that


----------



## neblix

aka70 said:


> That's true, but in the end everything comes down to milliseconds. Only CSS has velocity speeds in one patch that affect the delay. All the others as I know, have one patch for velocity (longs -250, shorts 60 etc) For people who uses splits artic it's easy but for people like me that want one instrument with all the articulation it's a pain in the ass. Anyway my idea it's a "multiscript" that controls every channels inside Kontakt independently with different values, or something like that


It isn't possible for any library to benefit from external compensation unless it is internally programmed to align all articulations to a static amount. CSS has varying latencies for every legato speed and little to no latency for other articulations, so nothing applies here.

Even if you designed a workflow for it, there's no reason for us to attempt to sell something like that. It can be found in small free plugins with a simple google search, like this one from Voxengo: https://www.voxengo.com/product/latencydelay/



Ihnoc said:


> So this is a VST plugin (not Instrument) that reports a set latency to the DAW? Therefore the DAW handles the sync by way of latency compensation or something?


Correct!


----------



## Brasart

aka70 said:


> That's true, but in the end everything comes down to milliseconds. Only CSS has velocity speeds in one patch that affect the delay. All the others as I know, have one patch for velocity (longs -250, shorts 60 etc) For people who uses splits artic it's easy but for people like me that want one instrument with all the articulation it's a pain in the ass. Anyway my idea it's a "multiscript" that controls every channels inside Kontakt independently with different values, or something like that


Sorry, I thought you were responding to the "CC companion" idea where they would automatically do automation curve for dynamics & vibrato (hence my deleted post)!


----------



## Batuer

Andrew Aversa said:


> We're looking into this now. I applied to be a merchant partner but the experience has been a bit opaque.


Bestservice offers different options in payment. It's a nice choice.


----------



## muziksculp

Hi,

I just read this post by Zircon/Andrew on Discord :

Quote : 

" Preorders should be going live tomorrow "


----------



## Limeopolis

How long will the preorder window be when they go live?


----------



## gedlig

Limeopolis said:


> How long will the preorder window be when they go live?


Said to last for one month. If it starts today, I hope it'll last till the 11th of november.


----------



## william81723

Hey guys~ I'm sorry...but... I think I'm the first.





I madly pressed F5 and I got it.


----------



## HM_Music

I bought TSS and Kogeyama taikos. I hope TSS comes out before the end of October


----------



## FireGS

HM_Music said:


> I bought TSS and Kogeyama taikos. I hope TSS comes out before the end of October


This is a preorder for an UPCOMING product. The serial number you receive will NOT be usable until the library is released by the *end of 2021*.


----------



## Nimrod7

Sorry, might have been mentioned before, but for how long the preorder will be open? 
Is that until the product is released?


----------



## Haakond

I have pre-ordered now! 
Never been this excited for a new library. Now I just have to....wait


----------



## Batuer

FireGS said:


> by the *end of 2021*


 long wait


----------



## MA-Simon

Haakond said:


> I have pre-ordered now!


+1 . Something to look forward to.


----------



## HM_Music

FireGS said:


> This is a preorder for an UPCOMING product. The serial number you receive will NOT be usable until the library is released by the *end of 2021*.


I know, that's why I'm hope for a release at the end of October.

" We are planning for a full release of Tokyo Scoring Strings in late October to early November."


----------



## Evans

Nimrod7 said:


> Sorry, might have been mentioned before, but for how long the preorder will be open?


Yes, this is the big question for me at the moment. I usually don't pick up sales or pre-orders until the second-to-last day they run.


----------



## constaneum

Pre ordered too. Excited !


----------



## Sovereign

Pre-ordered.


----------



## chrisav

Oh my God IT'S HAPPENING 😱🙌


----------



## Marsen

Nimrod7 said:


> Sorry, might have been mentioned before, but for how long the preorder will be open?
> Is that until the product is released?



..."To thank you for supporting the library and believing in us, we are offering a special preorder-only price of $349 available now until November 5."


----------



## SZK-Max

Japanese music is likely to be full of this strings.
Pre ordered


----------



## constaneum

Marsen said:


> ..."To thank you for supporting the library and believing in us, we are offering a special preorder-only price of $349 available now until November 5."


So the library gonna be released on my birthday??? 6th Nov ? Heheh


----------



## laurentheflute

Hi folks! I'm the new ISW marketing manager (this means I'm the person who's been in charge of a lot of the emails you've received the past few months, among other things) — Andrew is currently less available than usual, so I'll try to answer what questions I can. I am not a developer, so I'll leave your technical questions for others on the team who can help with that!

Regarding the preorders, we cannot at this time guarantee a particular release date, but we will keep communication open as much as possible over the next few weeks so you know what to expect. We are guaranteeing release *by the end of 2021*. And the team is working hard make it so you don't have to wait too much longer 

Preorders are scheduled to be open until *November 5*. You'll be able to cancel your preorder for a full refund up until the release day, in case something comes up or you change your mind. (I'm about to edit Andrew's original post to reflect the most up-to-date information.)

Thank you all so much for your enthusiasm about this project — it has been a _lot _of work for the team, but I think it helps everybody keep pushing through to see how excited you all are to get your hands on it!


----------



## MikeLG

Pre Ordered! Very excited.


----------



## muziksculp

Now that the TSS Pre-Order is available until Nov. 5th, it would be very helpful if ISW can post more demos, videos, ..etc. showing TSS in action during the Pre-Order period, if that is feasible. Otherwise, I'm sure more audio demos, and videos will be posted once it is released. 

Thanks.


----------



## muziksculp

Pre-Ordered TSS


----------



## Evans

There are approximately 20 more standard business days before the pre-order period is expected to end. I'm sure they know that prospective buyers are looking for more audio and video. There's plenty of time.


----------



## dzilizzi

I'll probably wait until my credit card resets on the 25th. Otherwise, I will be over my budget for the month the next time I go grocery shopping. Wasn't expecting that sale on the other string library that I also don't need but got anyway. 

Truthfully, though, I'm not sure there is much to buy this BF/holiday sale season for me, so I should be okay getting it later this month.


----------



## mohsohsenshi

laurentheflute said:


> Hi folks! I'm the new ISW marketing manager (this means I'm the person who's been in charge of a lot of the emails you've received the past few months, among other things) — Andrew is currently less available than usual, so I'll try to answer what questions I can. I am not a developer, so I'll leave your technical questions for others on the team who can help with that!
> 
> Regarding the preorders, we cannot at this time guarantee a particular release date, but we will keep communication open as much as possible over the next few weeks so you know what to expect. We are guaranteeing release *by the end of 2021*. And the team is working hard make it so you don't have to wait too much longer
> 
> Preorders are scheduled to be open until *November 5*. You'll be able to cancel your preorder for a full refund up until the release day, in case something comes up or you change your mind. (I'm about to edit Andrew's original post to reflect the most up-to-date information.)
> 
> Thank you all so much for your enthusiasm about this project — it has been a _lot _of work for the team, but I think it helps everybody keep pushing through to see how excited you all are to get your hands on it!


Dear Laurent,
So here's again a little request from Asian composers: 
Will there be any chance to have "Alipay" as payment method on your site just as on Bestservice?
We are so in love with this project and don't want to miss the preorder period.
A thousand thanks!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

mohsohsenshi said:


> Dear Laurent,
> So here's again a little request from Asian composers:
> Will there be any chance to have "Alipay" as payment method on your site just as on Bestservice?
> We are so in love with this project and don't want to miss the preorder period.
> A thousand thanks!



I'm still investigating this but it seems very complicated. AliPay does not work with US companies directly, as far as I can tell.


----------



## Batrawi

laurentheflute said:


> Andrew is currently less available than usual,


We understand he's now blessed with a new baby❤. But what worries me if this also means that there won't be in-action/walkthrough videos coming out during the pre-order period (since Andrew is also the one always presenting those) in order to make an informed decision.


----------



## Casiquire

Evans said:


> There are approximately 20 more standard business days before the pre-order period is expected to end. I'm sure they know that prospective buyers are looking for more audio and video. There's plenty of time.


Right! I'm shocked by how many people are buying in already. Though i don't doubt the quality, given my fantastic experience with their other libraries


----------



## chapbot

Casiquire said:


> Right! I'm shocked by how many people are buying in already. Though i don't doubt the quality, given my fantastic experience with their other libraries


Yep, I'll preorder since I love the tone of their other libraries I own plus I love what I'm hearing so far in the few demos available. I've rediscovered Pearl and wow is it amazing. Their bass is my favorite vst bass when I can't get a live player.


----------



## ism

Casiquire said:


> Right! I'm shocked by how many people are buying in already. Though i don't doubt the quality, given my fantastic experience with their other libraries



Sometimes you just know


----------



## bvaughn0402

I hate to be "that guy" but ... although this sounds great ... can we get a sneak peek walk through during this introductory price? Even if just a screen cast of a song showing the library playing?


----------



## Rudianos

Close to the buy on this one - but I really need to know how it feels to work on this one. How much of the musicality am I in control of? The vibrato? Lets see a walkthrough.


----------



## odod

Rudianos said:


> Close to the buy on this one - but I really need to know how it feels to work on this one. How much of the musicality am I in control of? The vibrato? Lets see a walkthrough.


yess .. me too


----------



## Raphioli

bvaughn0402 said:


> I hate to be "that guy" but ... although this sounds great ... can we get a sneak peek walk through during this introductory price? Even if just a screen cast of a song showing the library playing?


Definitely would love to see a walkthrough. 
Especially the legatos of course 
The transitions of course, but I'd also like to listen to the vibrato crossfades in the legato patches (how smooth and intense it can get).

So a walkthrough with something like playing legato passages while riding the mod wheel and also what ever controls the vibrato would be great!


----------



## Drundfunk

@laurentheflute Did you think about if edu discount is applicable for the pre-order price?


----------



## Alchemedia

+1 for a walkthrough.


----------



## Obi-Wan Spaghetti

Strange that they would record tow portamento. But I'll wait to heat before i pass judgement. Have a really good feeling about this library.


----------



## Jackdnp121

Yep I’ve Just pre ordered it too …. I have faith in these guys … let’s make it happen … 👌❤️


----------



## filipjonathan

Drundfunk said:


> @laurentheflute Did you think about if edu discount is applicable for the pre-order price?


It would just be $12 less so not a big deal imo.


----------



## Simon Ravn

Very interested in this. The current (few) demos don't reveal that much about the library though, I think. The "Paper boat" demo (which is the most naked one) certainly doesn't do anything good for the library....

So... waiting for some walkthrough or more naked demos.


----------



## RMH

Half expectation and half concern.
I will wait for more workthrough and demos to be announced.


----------



## tonio_

filipjonathan said:


> It would just be $12 less so not a big deal imo.


Umm... 25% off the preorder price isn't just $12. Which is what @Drundfunk was asking


----------



## tonio_

Simon Ravn said:


> Very interested in this. The current (few) demos don't reveal that much about the library though, I think. The "Paper boat" demo (which is the most naked one) certainly doesn't do anything good for the library....
> 
> So... waiting for some walkthrough or more naked demos.


I'm quite inexperienced when it comes to spotting unrealistic things in anything other than drums, bass and guitar... So would you mind sharing what you've found wrong with that demo? I thought it sounded great


----------



## Batrawi

tonio_ said:


> I'm quite inexperienced when it comes to spotting unrealistic things in anything other than drums, bass and guitar... So would you mind sharing what you've found wrong with that demo? I thought it sounded great


Like Simon I was not at all impressed with this demo. from my side everything except the legato sounded "Ok'ish". (I'm sure I said this earlier here)But again there is not enough musical movement that I could hear in those legato transitions. They sound very short/dead in the way they immediately snap into the sustains. The sustains themselves sound static: just immediate vibrato- with almost no progression. barely audible as if it's non vib/ or lacking the width & depth you would usually hear in smaller sections. But again that's not to bash the library since I reckon most of these examples were done at pre-alpha/alpha stages when they were still working on improving the legatos. besides, this could just be the demoer's preferred settings in this example where he just wanted to demonstrate playability as opposed to expressiveness. On paper (and with the TACT engine) the library seems tweakable enough to be more expressive/with more pronounced & lively transitions for those who want it. That's why walkthough videos to demonstrate this are very important at the moment and should do justice to the library before it does to those who are still reluctant to push the pre-order button.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

FWIW, the legato has been overhauled significantly since that demo was posted. Longer note transitions and a molto vibrato layer make a big difference.


----------



## constaneum

For those who follow TSS closely, you'll hear some new demos showcasing a bit of this and that even though the official demos are only 3. Andrew did demo molto vibrato on the latest piece on Discord


----------



## windwolf666

Walkthrough+1, I would like to know how dry the sound is(only close mic), whether it is suitable for pop song.(Like J-pop)

For reference,

(at 2m35s)

or does anyone know which library can achieve similar sound in the string of the song?

because as far as I know, many top string libraries sound more western style...(like SF, OT, CSS... products)
That's why I am very excited about TSS, but still I want to see some walkthrough videos before pre-order.


----------



## Peter Satera

Drundfunk said:


> @laurentheflute Did you think about if edu discount is applicable for the pre-order price?


I'd also be interested to know this, thanks!


----------



## Zanshin

The website says "This discount may not be combined with any other offers or sales." 

That is pretty clear.


----------



## RMH

windwolf666 said:


> Walkthrough+1, I would like to know how dry the sound is(only close mic), whether it is suitable for pop song.(Like J-pop)
> 
> For reference,
> 
> (at 2m35s)
> 
> or does anyone know which library can achieve similar sound in the string of the song?
> 
> because as far as I know, many top string libraries sound more western style...(like SF, OT, CSS... products)
> That's why I am very excited about TSS, but still I want to see some walkthrough videos before pre-order.



Maybe SF Chamber Strings ?


----------



## filipjonathan

RMH said:


> Maybe SF Chamber Strings ?


They're definitely not dry.


----------



## RMH

filipjonathan said:


> They're definitely not dry.


Yes. But It's possible.
Tansa only use CS close mic.


----------



## filipjonathan

RMH said:


> Yes. But It's possible.
> Tansa only use CS close mic.



Oh ok. That actually sounds really nice


----------



## laurentheflute

Drundfunk said:


> @laurentheflute Did you think about if edu discount is applicable for the pre-order price?


I'm sorry, but because the pre-order price is so heavily discounted already, we will not be applying the edu discount on top of that.


----------



## laurentheflute

For everyone who is asking about a walkthrough or additional sneak peeks — we are working on those! We have other team members who are going to step up and help make that happen, even if Andrew isn't fully available right now. We opened preorders this early because folks were already asking about them, but we fully understand that many of you will want to see more about the library in action before you're comfortable preordering. We will share more information and examples as soon as they're ready!


----------



## RMH

laurentheflute said:


> For everyone who is asking about a walkthrough or additional sneak peeks — we are working on those! We have other team members who are going to step up and help make that happen, even if Andrew isn't fully available right now. We opened preorders this early because folks were already asking about them, but we fully understand that many of you will want to see more about the library in action before you're comfortable preordering. We will share more information and examples as soon as they're ready!


Thank you


----------



## windwolf666

RMH said:


> Maybe SF Chamber Strings ?


I have thought about SCS before, but I feel the sound is too classic, typically the western style. Also, the first note trigger is not my favorite.(fast-paced is fine, but slow-paced is not quite good IMO)


----------



## filipjonathan

Can anyone tell me how to access the IS Discord? Or the TSS one? I'm new to Discord so I have no idea how it works.


----------



## Kent

filipjonathan said:


> Can anyone tell me how to access the IS Discord? Or the TSS one? I'm new to Discord so I have no idea how it works.


Chick 'Chatroom' at the top of https://vi-control.net


----------



## Henning

windwolf666 said:


> Walkthrough+1, I would like to know how dry the sound is(only close mic), whether it is suitable for pop song.(Like J-pop)
> 
> For reference,
> 
> (at 2m35s)
> 
> or does anyone know which library can achieve similar sound in the string of the song?
> 
> because as far as I know, many top string libraries sound more western style...(like SF, OT, CSS... products)
> That's why I am very excited about TSS, but still I want to see some walkthrough videos before pre-order.



TSS is a rather close and dry sounding library but not so dry it becomes uncomfortable. The right kind of dry if you get my meaning  I feel you could pull off something like the stuff in your example video with TSS. So far I have only used TSS in the background of demos for other ISW products and I'm still experimenting with it. Personally I think the current sound is really lovely and there's so many things to change in TACT so that you can really make it your own.


----------



## chapbot

windwolf666 said:


> Walkthrough+1, I would like to know how dry the sound is(only close mic), whether it is suitable for pop song.(Like J-pop)
> 
> For reference,
> 
> (at 2m35s)
> 
> or does anyone know which library can achieve similar sound in the string of the song?
> 
> because as far as I know, many top string libraries sound more western style...(like SF, OT, CSS... products)
> That's why I am very excited about TSS, but still I want to see some walkthrough videos before pre-order.



There's a new violin legato demo on discord and I think it will replicate this sound perfectly. That's why I'm so excited about TSS I really want a dry, realistic studio string sound.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Hi all, and thanks @laurentheflute for covering for me; I'm still on parental leave but I decided to tweak and finish a couple demos to help showcase more of the library. As with the rest of the demos, these show the _current, work-in-progress _state of *Tokyo Scoring Strings *and as we continue to work, we may update/re-render anything in the player with improvements!

First is "Kouyou" which focuses exclusively on legato & portamento, at multiple dynamics and with all three vibrato types (no vibrato, regular vibrato, molto vibrato.) Since the piece is 90bpm, I used the slowest legato speed the whole way through. A little bit of Seventh Heaven is used for space, but otherwise no processing/EQ.




Next is a simple "Short Showcase" which is 100% dry. Personally, the second thing I check after getting a string library is the collection of short note types so this seemed like a good thing to demo next! You'll hear spiccato, spiccato secco, staccato, staccatissimo, and a bit of sforzando dotted eighths toward the end.

I think the relative dryness of the library makes it exceptionally useful for agile short notes, and the variety of lengths/styles included will give you lots of inspiration.


----------



## Ihnoc

Andrew Aversa said:


> Hi all, and thanks @laurentheflute for covering for me; I'm still on parental leave but I decided to tweak and finish a couple demos to help showcase more of the library. As with the rest of the demos, these show the _current, work-in-progress _state of *Tokyo Scoring Strings *and as we continue to work, we may update/re-render anything in the player with improvements!
> 
> First is "Kouyou" which focuses exclusively on legato & portamento, at multiple dynamics and with all three vibrato types (no vibrato, regular vibrato, molto vibrato.) Since the piece is 90bpm, I used the slowest legato speed the whole way through. A little bit of Seventh Heaven is used for space, but otherwise no processing/EQ.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Next is a simple "Short Showcase" which is 100% dry. Personally, the second thing I check after getting a string library is the collection of short note types so this seemed like a good thing to demo next! You'll hear spiccato, spiccato secco, staccato, staccatissimo, and a bit of sforzando dotted eighths toward the end.
> 
> I think the relative dryness of the library makes it exceptionally useful for agile short notes, and the variety of lengths/styles included will give you lots of inspiration.



Sounds cool. Commenting less on legato transitions and vibrato etc., the distance and perspective are quite refreshing as alternatives to other products and I'm really excited to have just this particular quality available - it _feels _like studio stems and not some grand hall.

Having said that, I certainly feel half of what makes these demos so good are the chops. You know the idiom you're emulating well and it makes these demos shine. Mind throwing a tutorial into TSS on writing in this style? Get me beyond Royal Road, Mario Cadence and descending bass line clichés! Help us Andrew, you're our only hope!


----------



## filipjonathan

Andrew Aversa said:


> Next is a simple "Short Showcase" which is 100% dry. Personally, the second thing I check after getting a string library is the collection of short note types so this seemed like a good thing to demo next! You'll hear spiccato, spiccato secco, staccato, staccatissimo, and a bit of sforzando dotted eighths toward the end.


Oh gosh.... I'm not sure how much longer I'll be able to resist pre-ordering this thing


----------



## windwolf666

Henning said:


> TSS is a rather close and dry sounding library but not so dry it becomes uncomfortable. The right kind of dry if you get my meaning  I feel you could pull off something like the stuff in your example video with TSS. So far I have only used TSS in the background of demos for other ISW products and I'm still experimenting with it. Personally I think the current sound is really lovely and there's so many things to change in TACT so that you can really make it your own.


Thanks for sharing your thought  I'm looking forward to TSS too!


chapbot said:


> There's a new violin legato demo on discord and I think it will replicate this sound perfectly. That's why I'm so excited about TSS I really want a dry, realistic studio string sound.


Heh--I just heard it! It really sounds great and I fall in love with the tone. However, in the demo of "Kouyou", it sounds a little bit wet, not sure because of the 7Hreverb or adding other mics position. I'm sure that it is very suitable for game or cinematic composing, but for pop song might be still under consideration.


----------



## ChickenAndARoll

Ihnoc said:


> Get me beyond Royal Road, Mario Cadence and descending bass line clichés


I am now realizing that I use these all the time in my own writing and was hoping that no one would notice  Don't forget about ii-V-I as well


----------



## filipjonathan

windwolf666 said:


> Heh--I just heard it! It really sounds great and I fall in love with the tone. However, in the demo of "Kouyou", it sounds a little bit wet, not sure because of the 7Hreverb or adding other mics position. I'm sure that it is very suitable for game or cinematic composing, but for pop song might be still under consideration.


I don't find it _that _wet, but I would however like to hear a completely dry close mic version.


----------



## AEF

This library will probably sound astoundingly good when mixed and reverbed. It has an ideal "dry" tone for really sculpting IMO. Wow might not be able to hold off on preordering ugggh.


----------



## muziksculp

For those who are still undecided, and holding back on Pre-Ordering TSS.

Allow me to enlighten you.

You will surely feel much better once you Pre-Order it, just do it, and feel the difference, Instant GAS relief


----------



## RMH

windwolf666 said:


> I have thought about SCS before, but I feel the sound is too classic, typically the western style. Also, the first note trigger is not my favorite.(fast-paced is fine, but slow-paced is not quite good IMO)


It could be a little classic. I can't guarantee anything until apply it directly to the song.

Alternatives include Chris Hein-Ensemble Strings and OT LA Sessions Strings.


----------



## bvaughn0402

muziksculp said:


> For those who are still undecided, and holding back on Pre-Ordering TSS.
> 
> Allow me to enlighten you.
> 
> You will surely feel much better once you Pre-Order it, just do it, and feel the difference, Instant GAS relief


I'm sure in the first 5-min of some type of walk through video, I'll be buying this!


----------



## muziksculp

bvaughn0402 said:


> I'm sure in the first 5-min of some type of walk through video, I'll be buying this!


Fair enough, but I don't think they will be posting any walk through videos until it is released, or almost ready for release. So, most likely during Nov. But who knows, I might be wrong.


----------



## bvaughn0402

muziksculp said:


> Fair enough, but I don't think they will be posting any walk through videos until it is released, or almost ready for release. So, most likely during Nov. But who knows, I might be wrong.


Ugh ... I hope not the case. I don't even need an hour walk through (although would be cool). Just give me a screen cast of a 3 min song showing me the player and actual song.


----------



## Akora

muziksculp said:


> For those who are still undecided, and holding back on Pre-Ordering TSS.
> 
> Allow me to enlighten you.
> 
> You will surely feel much better once you Pre-Order it, just do it, and feel the difference, Instant GAS relief


You sound like Emperor Palpatine trying to lure someone to the dark side.







I have now joined the dark side, by the way.


----------



## windwolf666

filipjonathan said:


> I don't find it _that _wet, but I would however like to hear a completely dry close mic version.


My feeling of the wet is compared to the reference song. I'm waiting for 100% dry sound too.


RMH said:


> It could be a little classic. I can't guarantee anything until apply it directly to the song.
> 
> Alternatives include Chris Hein-Ensemble Strings and OT LA Sessions Strings.


Exactly I am amazed by that song too.

Chris Hen ES seems like a good option! The tone is a little bit dark though.(Someone used it for pop song before?)
OT LA is quite similar to SCS, but it has lack of portamento. However, I really love its swells!! Very amazing.


----------



## muziksculp

Hi TSS Fans,

Here is another bit of exciting info. from Andrew/ISW. about TSS. 

He posted this on Discord. 

Quote : " We should have the tentatively final UI to show this week "


----------



## chapbot

muziksculp said:


> Hi TSS Fans,
> 
> Here is another bit of exciting info. from Andrew/ISW. about TSS.
> 
> He posted this on Discord.
> 
> Quote : " We should have the tentatively final UI to show this week "


Don't you think you're fancy, posting intel from Discord ♥️😂


----------



## rottoy

chapbot said:


> Don't you think you're fancy, posting intel from Discord ♥️😂


Don't sow discord now, it takes _intel_ligence to be a sleuth.


----------



## Cormast

Holy mother of the big green grass's hill ! What a sound. I'M IN.


----------



## neblix

If you're wondering why we haven't shown visually anything yet, it's because I just got the new GUI asset delivery in on Monday, and it has been implemented as of last night.

I understand if people want to wait to pre-order until they see more, but we've been pretty transparent about the state of the library, so there is no real reason for concern. I have wrist problems so I have to pace myself when scripting.  To put it more concretely, pre-order window basically outpaced me and the UI designer by about 2 weeks, and if we were better in sync with marketing schedule, it would've been a lot easier to have had screenshots and short video material at this moment, so ultimately they're trickling in with a bit of a delay in the current circumstance.

As Lauren said, we're preparing the first broad (and short) video which is coming soon, just going over basics. It will show off some articulations and the bread and butter sound morphing (dynamics, vibrato, etc.). You won't see our Lookahead system in action here, it's deserving of its own video, and we're still in the process of development and testing.

Given the time from final submission to NI to our release date, we'll have a good amount of time to make more and more snippets of material (audio, video) and a good amount of that time will overlap with the pre-order window. And because NI won't allow any changes to the library once we deliver, that is the point script development will basically come to an end for a bit, and I can switch over to help with audio/video.



Batrawi said:


> Like Simon I was not at all impressed with this demo. from my side everything except the legato sounded "Ok'ish". (I'm sure I said this earlier here)But again there is not enough musical movement that I could hear in those legato transitions. They sound very short/dead in the way they immediately snap into the sustains. The sustains themselves sound static: just immediate vibrato- with almost no progression. barely audible as if it's non vib/ or lacking the width & depth you would usually hear in smaller sections. But again that's not to bash the library since I reckon most of these examples were done at pre-alpha/alpha stages when they were still working on improving the legatos. besides, this could just be the demoer's preferred settings in this example where he just wanted to demonstrate playability as opposed to expressiveness. On paper (and with the TACT engine) the library seems tweakable enough to be more expressive/with more pronounced & lively transitions for those who want it. That's why walkthough videos to demonstrate this are very important at the moment and should do justice to the library before it does to those who are still reluctant to push the pre-order button.


As Sarah (one of our QA team members) said, Paper Boat Journey was made with one of the first alpha builds of the library several months ago; the legato algorithm has been redone and sample pool was reprocessed since then. Additionally, it was also made before we recorded molto vib.

Here is some context for the timeline of our legato development. Our initial development was directed by Andrew to achieve as snappy legato as possible, as this is one of the weak points in many string libraries, and it is the sound our japanese customer base are going to be desiring the most. One of the esteemed JP composers we sent it to at the time even had remarked he was worried it wasn't snappy enough! Regardless, it was also before the legato speed could be modulated, so essentially the sound designed to handle 16th note passages in contexts like say, the rock battle music of Octopath, was the only sound we were getting from the library. Responsive and tight, but not super organic. I write more slow music myself, so even I was impatient to work out slow legato settings.

At a point in development in the last couple months, we then switched to focus on slow legato after restoring an additional 200ms of lead-in we were omitting from the transitions, and that's been the main library configuration (slow only, so fast was gone) until the last few weeks where we finally implemented multiple speed profiles.

*Legato Speeds: *They'll be selectable on a knob (NKS and midi learn) and also optionally linked to velocity. Any edits you do to legato crossfade settings will only modify that particular speed. Which means if you like our slow legato but dislike our fast legato, you can just set the speed to fast, make your changes, and resave the patch.

We're still set to do a new pass soon on getting each speed sounding its best on its own, and the goal is for the user to not want to bother editing them.


----------



## filipjonathan

@Andrew Aversa I'm not sure if someone has asked this already, but how well will it handle runs? I assume quite easily since you're saying it will be agile.


----------



## muziksculp

I'm not sure if this was asked before, will TSS have Legato-Sordino articulations ? 

Be it Real, or Simulated Sordino ?

Thanks


----------



## BL

muziksculp said:


> I'm not sure if this was asked before, will TSS have Legato-Sordino articulations ?
> 
> Be it Real, or Simulated Sordino ?
> 
> Thanks


You asked this before lol 

Aug 15, 2021



muziksculp said:


> Will TSS have Sordino versions for the Legato Sections ?


We did not record sordino because we felt (and it seems people agreed) that was a lower priority than various other things (like a real violins 2 instead of a "faked" vlns2, more dynamics, etc.)

However we're going to experiment with carefully modeled EQ to simulate sordino. This has been done well in other libraries and I think we could do it well here.


----------



## Obi-Wan Spaghetti

Henrik B. Jensen said:


> Re: wrist problems, I have that too. I can recommend Ergorest:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Products – Ergorest
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.ergorest.fi
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Been using those for 20 years, makes a world of difference.


Where have you been all my life?


----------



## muziksculp

BL said:


> You asked this before lol
> 
> Aug 15, 2021
> 
> 
> We did not record sordino because we felt (and it seems people agreed) that was a lower priority than various other things (like a real violins 2 instead of a "faked" vlns2, more dynamics, etc.)
> 
> However we're going to experiment with carefully modeled EQ to simulate sordino. This has been done well in other libraries and I think we could do it well here.


LOL.. I felt a bit of a dejavu moment, asking about Sordino options for TSS, sadly my memory isn't helping much.  

Thanks for the helpful feedback. I think a simulated sordino via EQ would be a good enough option.


----------



## Bear Lew

Pre-ordered!


----------



## filipjonathan

Bear Lew said:


> Pre-ordered!


I'm so close to do the same! I'm just waiting for any kind of video play through/demo. Really hoping it meets my expectations. 🤞🏻


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> I'm so close to do the same! I'm just waiting for any kind of video play through/demo. Really hoping it meets my expectations. 🤞🏻


Let the GAS out. Don't torture yourself, just go for it, you know you're going to buy it.


----------



## Saxer

muziksculp said:


> Let the GAS out. Don't torture yourself, just go for it, you know you're going to buy it.


Did you sell cars in your earlier life?


----------



## Bear Lew

filipjonathan said:


> I'm so close to do the same! I'm just waiting for any kind of video play through/demo. Really hoping it meets my expectations. 🤞🏻


currently using BBSCO and UAD Luna version of SCS, TSS is really something special for me by just listening to the demo. Maybe because of i used to watch anime and j drama while young.


----------



## RMH

filipjonathan said:


> I'm so close to do the same! I'm just waiting for any kind of video play through/demo. Really hoping it meets my expectations. 🤞🏻


me too!


----------



## filipjonathan

Any news????


----------



## Andrew Aversa

We've written the outline for the first walkthrough video. It won't be a complete walkthrough since the UI isn't 100% done, but it will show things like the dynamic range, vibrato types, several articulations, legato types, and just generally playing in real-time to give you an accurate sense of how the library works and sounds out-of-the-box.


----------



## filipjonathan

Andrew Aversa said:


> We've written the outline for the first walkthrough video. It won't be a complete walkthrough since the UI isn't 100% done, but it will show things like the dynamic range, vibrato types, several articulations, legato types, and just generally playing in real-time to give you an accurate sense of how the library works and sounds out-of-the-box.


Yes!!


----------



## filipjonathan

Btw, there's a new demo on Discord.


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> Btw, there's a new demo on Discord.


and here is the demo if you are not on Discord.

Lovely rich string timbre, and very expressive, smooth as butter legatos, Tremolos sound very natural, and the Violins high-dynamics sound great.

View attachment AP_TSS_Draft_cantabile_v1.mp3


----------



## filipjonathan

muziksculp said:


> and here is the demo if you are not on Discord.
> 
> Lovely rich string timbre, and very expressive, smooth as butter legatos, Tremolos sound very natural, and the Violins high-dynamics sound great.
> 
> View attachment AP_TSS_Draft_cantabile_v1.mp3


I don't know if I'm more excited about this library coming out or more scared about my wife seeing the credit card balance 😅


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> I don't know if I'm more excited about this library coming out or more scared about my wife seeing the credit card balance 😅




Did you not Pre-Order yet ? 

Remember. The regular price of the library is $449.


----------



## ChickenAndARoll

muziksculp said:


> Did you not Pre-Order yet ?
> 
> Remember. The regular price of the library is $449.


Peer pressure at its finest right here


----------



## filipjonathan

muziksculp said:


> Did you not Pre-Order yet ?
> 
> Remember. The regular price of the library is $449.


I know, I know @muziksculp! I promise I'll do it soon! 😅


----------



## muziksculp

ChickenAndARoll said:


> Peer pressure at its finest right here


Pressure ? What Pressure ? This Library is hard to resist. I'm just making it easier on everyone's High Pressure GAS buildup situation. I know it wasn't easy for me, until I Pre-Ordered. Do the same, and feel the wonderful feeling of relief.


----------



## Futchibon

Peter Satera said:


> I'd also be interested to know this, thanks!





Zanshin said:


> The website says "This discount may not be combined with any other offers or sales."
> 
> That is pretty clear.


It's coming up as $262 for me with EDU code! The irony is that I don't even know if I want the library!


----------



## filipjonathan

Futchibon said:


> It's coming up as $262 for me with EDU code! The irony is that I don't even know if I want the library!


I'd pre-order it straight away for that amount 😂


----------



## filipjonathan

Futchibon said:


> It's coming up as $262 for me with EDU code! The irony is that I don't even know if I want the library!


But didn't someone from IS say the EDU discount won't be applicable for this pre-order? 🤔


----------



## ChickenAndARoll

Futchibon said:


> It's coming up as $262 for me with EDU code! The irony is that I don't even know if I want the library!


I go to VI-Control University, does that count?


----------



## Zanshin

filipjonathan said:


> But didn't someone from IS say the EDU discount won't be applicable for this pre-order? 🤔


LOL yep. I wouldn't be surprised if they just refund it and fix the issue. The EDU discount is suppose to be off the full price, not sale prices or intro prices.


----------



## filipjonathan

Zanshin said:


> LOL yep. I wouldn't be surprised if they just refund it and fix the issue. The EDU discount is suppose to be off the full price, not sale prices or intro prices.


That's what I thought. Otherwise, as I am a student, I would jump on that discount straight away 😂


----------



## constaneum

muziksculp said:


> Did you not Pre-Order yet ?
> 
> Remember. The regular price of the library is $449.


We have a spokesperson here. Ahahha


----------



## RMH

muziksculp said:


> and here is the demo if you are not on Discord.
> 
> Lovely rich string timbre, and very expressive, smooth as butter legatos, Tremolos sound very natural, and the Violins high-dynamics sound great.
> 
> View attachment AP_TSS_Draft_cantabile_v1.mp3


Amazing!! It’s real demo?


----------



## muziksculp

RMH said:


> Amazing!! It’s real demo?


Yes, it's a demo of TSS posted by Andrew of ISW on Discord. I just reposted it here for those that do not subscribe to Discord so they can hear it.


----------



## RMH

muziksculp said:


> Yes, it's a demo of TSS posted by Andrew of ISW on Discord. I just reposted it here for those that do not subscribe to Discord so they can hear it.


Thank you! The sound is little symphonic!


----------



## muziksculp

RMH said:


> Thank you! The sound is little symphonic!


Andrew mentioned that he used a bit of Reverb on this track. Maybe that's what you hear that is making it sound a tad symphonic like.


----------



## RMH

muziksculp said:


> Andrew mentioned that he used a bit of Reverb on this track. Maybe that's what you hear that is making it sound a tad symphonic like.


Sooner or later, when the walk-through comes out, I will decide to buy it.😉


----------



## neblix

Just to clarify, that demo was written by Alessandro Ponti. It would be nice if the post was updated to have the credit. And in his words regarding the reverb: "Yes, a touch of Exponential Audio R4."


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> Just to clarify, that demo was written by Alessandro Ponti. It would be nice if the post was updated to have the credit. And in his words regarding the reverb: "Yes, a touch of Exponential Audio R4."


Thanks for letting us know. 

I thought the demos was written, and produced by Andrew. 

Exponential Audio R4 is a great sounding Reverb. Good choice.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Regarding EDU codes for the TSS preorder, that coupon _shouldn't _technically work. The exclusion logic just isn't working for a subset of existing coupon codes. We'll have it sorted out shortly...


----------



## Futchibon

Andrew Aversa said:


> Regarding EDU codes for the TSS preorder, that coupon _shouldn't _technically work. The exclusion logic just isn't working for a subset of existing coupon codes. We'll have it sorted out shortly...


No worries, I didn't purchase it as I thought it was an error.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Here's a brief demo today from our esteemed tester Henning Nugel. This short but lovely piece is performed by one instance of the Cellos section in Poly mode. No keyswitching is used - everything is on a single articulation. The nuance in the attacks of each note is done using the attack overlay feature, velocity-sensitive. Two release types are used with velocity switching between them (staccato release, decrescendo release). No reverb or processing so you can get a sense of the bare sound. Please enjoy!


----------



## filipjonathan

Andrew Aversa said:


> Here's a brief demo today from our esteemed tester Henning Nugel. This short but lovely piece is performed by one instance of the Cellos section in Poly mode. No keyswitching is used - everything is on a single articulation. The nuance in the attacks of each note is done using the attack overlay feature, velocity-sensitive. Two release types are used with velocity switching between them (staccato release, decrescendo release). No reverb or processing so you can get a sense of the bare sound. Please enjoy!



Gosh, Andrew, this is amazing!


----------



## Inventio

muziksculp said:


> Thanks for letting us know.
> 
> I thought the demos was written, and produced by Andrew.
> 
> Exponential Audio R4 is a great sounding Reverb. Good choice.


I can chime in to add that the molto vibrato inspired me to try and get a more symphonic sound, which I did by orchestrating with two more sections of violins. In other words, I duplicated the violins tracks and orchestrated the rising line for them. 

In any case, I was very pleased by how lines can be sustained and made singable even at a slow tempo. 
Rebow also helps on this.


----------



## Henning

filipjonathan said:


> Gosh, Andrew, this is amazing!


It's really cool how you can tailor TSS to your needs. I'm quite sure that all of you guys will be quite happy with it.


----------



## muziksculp

When will we have a peek at the TSS GUI ?


----------



## neblix

If I see tomorrow that the video work will take the longer part of the week, I'll post some screenshots to hold people over.


----------



## neblix

As our beta walkthrough video is only getting started with filming (hopefully drops late this week), here is a main GUI screenshot to tide people over. This is the designer test screenshot only because mine is full of unskinned controls, but it looks exactly the same, just our nki names will actually be of the relevant section. This design is actually a WIP, speaking aesthetically; our designer is spending further time on visual tweaks to the wallpaper, but in terms of the controls, this is what you will see in v1.0.






I'm sure everyone is dying to see the articulation selection and editing, and it will have to wait for a bit. My dev UI is still slightly cluttered, and the designer's screenshot has a somewhat random layout of articulations so it wouldn't look as pretty to release on the internet. Rest assured you will get a peak at that during the video!

A visual guide:

-Starting from upper left, an *Articulation Display *on top showing the last thing you played, with a *Con Sord. *simulation (automatable button) on the lower left of it.

-*Dynamics* and *Vibrato* knobs. Self-explanatory, and the imagery contained responds to the knobs as you expect. Our designer did a wonderful job with the aesthetics here.

-*Legato Mode*, when using Standard engine mode, will toggle between Monophonic and Polyphonic legato. When using poly legato, the knob to the right of it controls the latency window. As long as you press and release notes within that time window of each other, it will intelligently process transitions for them. You can even hold a central note and have a voice going above and below with the center note intact. There is no "guessing" in our algorithm except when multiple voices transition at the same time, where it then says "I guess you don't want random voice crossing". 

-*Dynamic Range* slider controls the dynamic range between loudest and softest layers of the library. The middle value "100%" is configured so that the articulations of the library align to the 5 sustain dynamics recorded by the Muroya ensemble (levels straight from the session, which should be around -5 dB at the loudest layer). The 200% side simply doubles the distance between loudest and softest layer, and the 0% side flattens the dynamic range so that pp and FF are the same loudness (though still perceptually different, due to timbre). This is really useful when mixing strings into harder styles like rock or metal, where the perceptual effects of dynamic changes are desired but the actual signal loudness can be more of a mix hindrance than anything else. And to be clear, this knob is continuous (so you can do 32%, 50%, 69%, 125%, etc.)

-*Legato Speed* controls; the knob selects from our legato speed profiles (from slow to fast) which are configured to change the amount of transition used in order to control latency and tighten or loosen note-change clarity. We're still working on these profiles and the finals may change; I found we could get 100ms more out of our transitions, so we may even have some kind of "ultra-slow" for those really indulgent emotional slow melodies. 

The "keyboard" button on the side of it maps the knob to the velocity of your playing. The knob itself is learnable, as are almost all controls in the Tokyo Scoring engine.

-*Engine Mode* allows you to select playback style.

As described in earlier posts, "Standard" mode is sample libraries behaving as you expect.

"Zero-Latency" diminishes the attack qualities of all articulations to make them sound as instantly as possible for timing purposes as you record. It would only be used if followed with...

"Lookahead" mode, which introduces a 1 second latency to DAW playback in exchange for the ability to analyze portions of the MIDI data to automatically perform various mundane things composers can lose significant time on (automating legato speed, offsetting delayed shorts, manually nudging legato phrases, etc.). In the future Tokyo Scoring products, we would like to update this system to include optional automatic dynamic/vibrato phrasing as well. It's an ongoing development.

The *Advanced* tab underneath is still WIP, but it will have things like enabling niente, re-assigned Expression CC, activating neighbor RR (diminished sound quality), our older latency compensation system (for those who prefer less latency but still want legato alignment), and more.


----------



## filipjonathan

neblix said:


> As our beta walkthrough video is only getting started with filming (hopefully drops late this week), here is a main GUI screenshot to tide people over. This is the designer test screenshot only because mine is full of unskinned controls, but it looks exactly the same, just our nki names will actually be of the relevant section. This design is actually a WIP, speaking aesthetically; our designer is spending further time on visual tweaks to the wallpaper, but in terms of the controls, this is what you will see in v1.0.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'm sure everyone is dying to see the articulation selection and editing, and it will have to wait for a bit. My dev UI is still slightly cluttered, and the designer's screenshot has a somewhat random layout of articulations so it wouldn't look as pretty to release on the internet. Rest assured you will get a peak at that during the video!
> 
> A visual guide:
> 
> -Starting from upper left, an *Articulation Display *on top showing the last thing you played, with a *Con Sord. *simulation (automatable button) on the lower left of it.
> 
> -*Dynamics* and *Vibrato* knobs. Self-explanatory, and the imagery contained responds to the knobs as you expect. Our designer did a wonderful job with the aesthetics here.
> 
> -*Legato Mode*, when using Standard engine mode, will toggle between Monophonic and Polyphonic legato. When using poly legato, the knob to the right of it controls the latency window. As long as you press and release notes within that time window of each other, it will intelligently process transitions for them. You can even hold a central note and have a voice going above and below with the center note intact. There is no "guessing" in our algorithm except when multiple voices transition at the same time, where it then says "I guess you don't want random voice crossing".
> 
> -*Dynamic Range* slider controls the dynamic range between loudest and softest layers of the library. The middle value "100%" is configured so that the articulations of the library align to the 5 sustain dynamics recorded by the Muroya ensemble. The 200% side simply doubles the distance between loudest and softest layer, and the 0% side flattens the dynamic range so that pp and FF are the same loudness (though still perceptually different, due to timbre). This is really useful when mixing strings into harder styles like rock or metal, where the perceptual effects of dynamic changes are desired but the actual signal loudness can be more of a mix hindrance than anything else. And to be clear, this knob is continuous (so you can do 32%, 50%, 69%, 125%, etc.)
> 
> -*Legato Speed* controls; the knob selects from our legato speed profiles (from slow to fast) which are configured to change the amount of transition used in order to control latency and tighten or loosen note-change clarity. We're still working on these profiles and the finals may change; I found we could get 100ms more out of our transitions, so we may even have some kind of "ultra-slow" for those really indulgent emotional slow melodies.
> 
> The "keyboard" button on the side of it maps the knob to the velocity of your playing. The knob itself is learnable, as are almost all controls in the Tokyo Scoring engine.
> 
> -*Engine Mode* allows you to select playback style.
> 
> As described in earlier posts, "Standard" mode is sample libraries behaving as you expect.
> 
> "Zero-Latency" diminishes the attack qualities of all articulations to make them sound as instantly as possible for timing purposes as you record. It would only be used if followed with...
> 
> "Lookahead" mode, which introduces a 1 second latency to DAW playback in exchange for the ability to analyze portions of the MIDI data to automatically perform various mundane things composers can lose significant time on (automating legato speed, offsetting delayed shorts, manually nudging legato phrases, etc.). In the future Tokyo Scoring products, we would like to update this system to include optional automatic dynamic/vibrato phrasing as well. It's an ongoing development.
> 
> The *Advanced* tab underneath is still WIP, but it will have things like enabling niente, re-assigned Expression CC, activating neighbor RR (diminished sound quality), our older latency compensation system (for those who prefer less latency but still want legato alignment), and more.


I just wanted to say how exciting it is!!!! Now I'm gonna read your whole post 😂


----------



## AndyP

Huh, I like the portamentos. Most of the time I find them rather half-baked, here I actually find them just right.


----------



## Denkii

neblix said:


> The *Advanced* tab underneath is still WIP, but it will have things like enabling niente [...]


Thank you SO MUCH for this.

Even though this entire engine seems to be very powerful and sandboxy, I'm very interested in how (easily) usable everything is pretty much right out of the box.
Your instruments can be awesome but due to the nature of everything being customizable they often come with a comparatively high learning curve.


----------



## neblix

Denkii said:


> Thank you SO MUCH for this.
> 
> Even though this entire engine seems to be very powerful and sandboxy, I'm very interested in how (easily) usable everything is pretty much right out of the box.
> Your instruments can be awesome but due to the nature of everything being customizable they often come with a comparatively high learning curve.


The Tokyo Scoring engine can be seen as a huge departure from that typical expectation of our products, and does a much better job than engines like Shreddage 3 of hiding advanced features away from the user. Our default settings are designed so that you don't really have to reach for them. Unlike a guitar which can unfortunately just be used and performed in so many different ways (which demands ultra-high engine flexibility), our orchestral engine design can rely on conventions of how orchestral instrument sections are used by composers and our design is based on familiar tropes.

In general, as Andrew is in charge of supervising the user experience, and his background is in electronic music and sound design, he has a higher tolerance for programming and tweaking than many, and it's taken a few years of user feedback for us to decide the "programmery" direction can hurt our appeal with newer and less experienced producers when it comes to acoustic instruments or otherwise highly expressive instruments played by humans (as opposed to synths, where their strength and appeal is in how big of a sandbox they let you have).

The question of "how does one make something simple and easy while also making it completely flexible" is harder to answer than finding a unicorn. To an outside perspective, it might seem as simple as "just make it sound good by default, and stuff the parameters on another page", but doing so can actually hurt the product's ease of use significantly. For example, because TACT allows you to map articulations to velocity, this means if you were to click on a velocity mapped articulation (the same way you would click in Cinematic Studio, OT, or Spitfire), it wouldn't actually be able to switch to that articulation via the act of you clicking it. This is because it can't tell what articulation you want until it reads your input velocity. It's things like this where complex power that people may want gets in the way of simpler usage, and requires more creative thought to fix.


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> -Starting from upper left, an *Articulation Display *on top showing the last thing you played, with a *Con Sord. *simulation (automatable button) on the lower left of it.


Hi @neblix ,

I'm happy you included a simulated Sord button, I love the sound of Sordino Strings (THANKS). 



neblix said:


> -*Legato Mode*, when using Standard engine mode, will toggle between Monophonic and Polyphonic legato. When using poly legato, the knob to the right of it controls the latency window. As long as you press and release notes within that time window of each other, it will intelligently process transitions for them. You can even hold a central note and have a voice going above and below with the center note intact. There is no "guessing" in our algorithm except when multiple voices transition at the same time, where it then says "I guess you don't want random voice crossing".


Q1. How does the engine switch between Monophonic, and Polyphonic Legato ? is it automatically done ? or there is a way to select which legato mode you want to enable via CC, or other option ? 

Q2. How are Legato Portamento transitions triggered ? 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## MikeLG

Apologies if this has been asked already, but is there any estimate of how much disk space the library will require?


----------



## Getsumen

MikeLG said:


> Apologies if this has been asked already, but is there any estimate of how much disk space the library will require?


A little over 100 if memory serves, but iirc they are packaging it so each mic is separated during encoding, so you can choose to delete everything but the mix mic for example and just play with a mixed mic patch if space is a problem.


----------



## MikeLG

Getsumen said:


> A little over 100 if memory serves, but iirc they are packaging it so each mic is separated during encoding, so you can choose to delete everything but the mix mic for example and just play with a mixed mic patch if space is a problem.


Awesome, sounds good. Thank you!


----------



## Henning

muziksculp said:


> Hi @neblix ,
> 
> I'm happy you included a simulated Sord button, I love the sound of Sordino Strings (THANKS).
> 
> 
> Q1. How does the engine switch between Monophonic, and Polyphonic Legato ? is it automatically done ? or there is a way to select which legato mode you want to enable via CC, or other option ?
> 
> Q2. How are Legato Portamento transitions triggered ?
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp


Q1: there's a switch which is also cc learnable.

Q2: triggered on lower velocities by default. But you can change that any way you like.


----------



## filipjonathan

Henning said:


> Q1: there's a switch which is also cc learnable.
> 
> Q2: triggered on lower velocities by default. But you can change that any way you like.


Sweet!


----------



## ChickenAndARoll

Why I love simulated sordinos: you can use them on ANY articulation so you're not limited to only having sordino on 1 short articulation, for instance. The whole library will be able to used as con sordino, and you save a ton of SSD space as well. Perfect!


----------



## karender

Can we use legato transitions between articulations ?


----------



## Ihnoc

Do shorts dynamics have the option to react to velocity _or_ dynamics control CC? This is my favourite feature in Bravura and how I set all my libraries up for consistency (and shun those that don't allow me to do it!).


----------



## neblix

MikeLG said:


> Apologies if this has been asked already, but is there any estimate of how much disk space the library will require?


The library should be less than 80 GB after it's encoded.


karender said:


> Can we use legato transitions between articulations ?


Technically the engine supports this, but to preserve the user experience we've locked it to Arco, Tremolo, and Trill, where by default Arco uses legato but Tremolo and Trill have to optionally enable legato manually.

Triggering legato transitions on short articulations or other dynamic articulations like Sforzandos can often sound buggy and glitchy in many situations because designing a good legato sound requires a lot of sample consistency between the "normal" articulations and the transitions. This is why we prefer not to open up the ability, as it can misrepresent the sound and cause the user to assume the library has been crafted inconsistently.



muziksculp said:


> Q1. How does the engine switch between Monophonic, and Polyphonic Legato ? is it automatically done ? or there is a way to select which legato mode you want to enable via CC, or other option ?
> 
> Q2. How are Legato Portamento transitions triggered ?
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp


1. As Henning said, the switch is learnable and will also be available as an NKS param.

2. Portamentos by default are lower velocities, but can be triggered however you like if you adjust the mapping in TACT.



Ihnoc said:


> Do shorts dynamics have the option to react to velocity _or_ dynamics control CC? This is my favourite feature in Bravura and how I set all my libraries up for consistency (and shun those that don't allow me to do it!).


We do have plans for a controller blend which will let you steer between CC and velocity control (the max and min values being "CC only" and "vel only"), and it may be left up to chance if there is enough time for me to finish implementing it. It can always appear in the first update in the event I don't get to it.


----------



## filipjonathan

@neblix I noticed there's no marcato in the arts list. I assume this will be achievable with different attacks in the sustains, am I right?


----------



## EvilDragon

Yes.


----------



## filipjonathan

EvilDragon said:


> Yes.


Yes to my question or "Yes. This is an amazing library, can't wait for it to be released!"?


----------



## muziksculp

I was listening to the TSS demos posted, and what really grabbed my attention was how wonderful the Violins sounded, especially at their higher range, and at mf, and ff dynamics. 

They just sound so rich, and detailed, but not metallic/shrieky at all.


----------



## lzcmusic

neblix said:


> The library should be less than 80 GB after it's encoded.
> 
> Technically the engine supports this, but to preserve the user experience we've locked it to Arco, Tremolo, and Trill, where by default Arco uses legato but Tremolo and Trill have to optionally enable legato manually.
> 
> Triggering legato transitions on short articulations or other dynamic articulations like Sforzandos can often sound buggy and glitchy in many situations because designing a good legato sound requires a lot of sample consistency between the "normal" articulations and the transitions. This is why we prefer not to open up the ability, as it can misrepresent the sound and cause the user to assume the library has been crafted inconsistently.
> 
> 
> 1. As Henning said, the switch is learnable and will also be available as an NKS param.
> 
> 2. Portamentos by default are lower velocities, but can be triggered however you like if you adjust the mapping in TACT.
> 
> 
> We do have plans for a controller blend which will let you steer between CC and velocity control (the max and min values being "CC only" and "vel only"), and it may be left up to chance if there is enough time for me to finish implementing it. It can always appear in the first update in the event I don't get to it.


The sound is good, this GUI is too ugly, can't it be a little bit color? Please refer to CSS, Fluffy Audio Venice Modern Strings, Soaring Strings


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

I really love the look of the GUI, personally…


----------



## jbuhler

Sarah Mancuso said:


> I really love the look of the GUI, personally…


Me, too.


----------



## Getsumen

The GUI is stylish as hell. Loving the ink style aesthetic. 

I've always disliked UI's with random images for no reason. Adds visual clutter that I could do without (matter of taste of course.)


----------



## neblix

Rather than copy the look of other libraries, the strength of Tokyo Scoring Strings is that it looks bright and open in a sea of dark and saturated orchestral libraries. Our subtle highlight colors (in the strings' case, red) will match the branding of each library section, so expect to see different highlight colors in future installments. We are tremendously happy with the hard work of our designer, Paulo Nunes, balancing aesthetic and functionality as well as he could muster. He designed both this UI and the UI of the articulation system (to be shown) in just under 2 months, which is an incredibly productive pace.


----------



## axb312

I like the GUI but think the articulations and their respective keyswitches should be listed on the main page itself (which is not the case now unless I'm missing something...)


----------



## rottoy

I really like the ink minimalism, so far away from the skeumorphism of yesteryear.


----------



## Batuer

neblix said:


>



Well done. Not bad, but it could be better.

This is what I feel about the GUI:

1. I like this simple design of the GUI, people can focus on music production not on parameters.

2. The color of the GUI is a bit too monotonous to attract user’s interest and inspire people’s passion for use.

3. Can the articulations be all listed directly? So people see at a glance what articulations being offered in this library.

4. Maybe the big knobs take up too much space? It seems the three knobs has no other functions besides showing the states according the GUI. Especially the vibrato knob is kind of useless when making music. Meanwhile, other libraries have big knobs but with useful functions and more beautiful

That’s my personal opinion and thanks for sharing the GUI.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

axb312 said:


> I like the GUI but think the articulations and their respective keyswitches should be listed on the main page itself (which is not the case now unless I'm missing something...)


Articulation management is done on the Artic tab. Keyswitch, velocity, and CC triggering is completely customizable, and you can get an overview of how everything is currently mapped there. It fills the entire page, there's not really room to stuff it all into the Home tab.


----------



## axb312

Sarah Mancuso said:


> Articulation management is done on the Artic tab. Keyswitch, velocity, and CC triggering is completely customizable, and you can get an overview of how everything is currently mapped there. It fills the entire page, there's not really room to stuff it all into the Home tab.


Just a list with the notes assigned and the currently active keyswitch could be helpful no?


----------



## Getsumen

axb312 said:


> Just a list with the notes assigned and the currently active keyswitch could be helpful no?


That would be on the artics tab.

Do you need to see your vibrato and dynamic level while looking at articulations? You can just swap to the artic tab and stay there.


----------



## Bear Lew

Cool GUI, love it!


----------



## constaneum

lzcmusic said:


> The sound is good, this GUI is too ugly, can't it be a little bit color? Please refer to CSS, Fluffy Audio Venice Modern Strings, Soaring Strings


I think it's pretty "Simple & Clean". Fine with me. Not that i gonna spend hours looking and adoring GUIs though ...straight dipping into the sound and start working the music.


----------



## gedlig

Batuer said:


> The color of the GUI is a bit too monotonous to attract user’s interest and inspire people’s passion for use


If people need a colourful UI to inspire writing, there are other problems with them than a UI.


----------



## filipjonathan

I think the GUI is fine. Very different to what we're used to. But that's good. It would, however, be neat if there was an option for a "dark mode" of some sorts, for people that prefer it but either way, it's the sound that matters most.


----------



## Voider

No matter what people say about the UI,
it's all compensated by this little guy smiling at you.








Imagine you start composing music on a rainy autumn day, you ran out of coffee and of course it's sunday - how could it not be - so buying new one isn't an option. You play back the first 10 seconds of music you came up with after half an hour, which sounds like the whole orchestra had a simultaneous epileptical attack and on top of that none of their instruments were tuned, and it's one of these days where you think to yourself:

"_K, how did I lose my composing skills over night_" and then the UI be like:






Kinda makes your day good again, innit?


----------



## lzcmusic

neblix said:


> Rather than copy the look of other libraries, the strength of Tokyo Scoring Strings is that it looks bright and open in a sea of dark and saturated orchestral libraries. Our subtle highlight colors (in the strings' case, red) will match the branding of each library section, so expect to see different highlight colors in future installments. We are tremendously happy with the hard work of our designer, Paulo Nunes, balancing aesthetic and functionality as well as he could muster. He designed both this UI and the UI of the articulation system (to be shown) in just under 2 months, which is an incredibly productive pace.


I don’t know why the flagship product with such excellent sound is designed into such a simple GUI. The GUI of all Impact Soundwork products is very good, such as the Shreddage 3 Stratus series of guitars. The interface art design is very good, and the World series is also very good. Well, including the recently released 3D GUI of Kageyama Taikos is even more exciting. Only the GUI of Tokyo Scoring Strings...I don’t know if this is a finalized image. The color scheme looks too depressing. The lower part of the main page is okay. The black ripples around the large Dynamics knob on the upper side are really It's too ugly, it's really unacceptable. Shouldn't the knob rotation have some color? For example, the iconic red color of TSS... I hope that developers will provide a traditional-style graphic for the large Dynamics knob.，This should be accepted by more people, even if a toggle switch is provided... I hope that the final finalized GUI will be perfect. To be honest, I Like this library, please make it better, thank you


----------



## lzcmusic

neblix said:


> Rather than copy the look of other libraries, the strength of Tokyo Scoring Strings is that it looks bright and open in a sea of dark and saturated orchestral libraries. Our subtle highlight colors (in the strings' case, red) will match the branding of each library section, so expect to see different highlight colors in future installments. We are tremendously happy with the hard work of our designer, Paulo Nunes, balancing aesthetic and functionality as well as he could muster. He designed both this UI and the UI of the articulation system (to be shown) in just under 2 months, which is an incredibly productive pace.








Imaginary picture, for reference only, thanks


----------



## Evans

I'm sad to say that this GUI looks horribly depressing to me, because it reminds me of the movie Arrival, which was a pretty tough watch (for personal reasons I think were not in the trailer, so I'll stop there). I really don't want to be reminded of it.






Would have been an entirely different movie if the characters found out that these beings were just trying to ask for more vibrato.


----------



## Drundfunk

The GUI obviously needs more waifus and catgirls..... I kinda don't mind it as is tho. I'd mind it more if you would release the library with a beautiful GUI and library tab picture, just to replace it with something depressing a few months later... Looking at you Audio Imperia with your Areia and Jaeger overhaul. I will never get over this... . Areia had such a beautiful library art. A violin on a bed of roses. The inner goth in me really loved it. And don't get me started on the Jaeger GUI. Always felt like an epic Kaiju hunter using the library xD. All taken away from me with a simple update.... . Anyway, looking forward to the walkthrough.


----------



## ism

The ink evokes a sense of the elegance of Japanese calligraphy. There’s a beautiful minimalism to it. 5 stars.


----------



## filipjonathan

I don't think we all are ever going to agree on the same thing. They should release what they think is best and that's it. Anyways, can't wait for the walkthrough!!!


----------



## gedlig

Drundfunk said:


> And don't get me started on the Jaeger GUI


I hate the original Jaeger UI. It's an ugly mess xD (which I still see, because they didn't update the seperate Hangar 4) I only wish the new UI had a different shade per library, but otherwise for me it was an improvement 

Either way, I like this TSS interface (though maybe a more prominent contrast between white and red would be better to resemble the usual colouring of some japanese objects and paintings)


----------



## Drundfunk

gedlig said:


> I hate the original Jaeger UI. It's an ugly mess xD (which I still see, because they didn't update the seperate Hangar 4) I only wish the new UI had a different shade per library, but otherwise for me it was an improvement
> 
> Either way, I like this TSS interface (though maybe a more prominent contrast between white and red would be better to resemble the usual colouring of some japanese objects and paintings)


Well, you are obviously free to have that opinion. To me using the library always felt like controlling a Jaeger (if you know the movie Pacific Rim you'll know what I'm talking about or why the library has the name, or had that specific GUI in the first place ). I guess there are always advocates for both sides. But in the end I buy a library for the sound it provides and a good user experience while using it is always welcome. I like having something which is easy and fast to use (the endless mic scrolling in the Spitfire player isn't for example), but over that I prefer things which are FUN to use, even if that means having to "learn" it. The Jaeger GUI did that for me, but I can understand, that if someone doesn't know or like Pacific Rim, they probably don't get the same kick out of it. As long as TSS is fast & easy to use I'm good.


----------



## gedlig

Drundfunk said:


> Well, you are obviously free to have that opinion. To me using the library always felt like controlling a Jaeger (if you know the movie Pacific Rim you'll know what I'm talking about or why the library has the name, or had that specific GUI in the first place ). I guess there are always advocates for both sides. But in the end I buy a library for the sound it provides and a good user experience while using it is always welcome. I like having something which is easy and fast to use (the endless mic scrolling in the Spitfire player isn't for example), but over that I prefer things which are FUN to use, even if that means having to "learn" it. The Jaeger GUI did that for me, but I can understand, that if someone doesn't know or like Pacific Rim, they probably don't get the same kick out of it. As long as TSS is fast & easy to use I'm good.


Oh I know Pacific Rim and did like it. It's just the UI that was terrible for me xD Anyway, that's off topic :D

Where are the school uniform catgirls in the TSS UI? 😠


----------



## Crowe

Drundfunk said:


> The GUI obviously needs more waifus and catgirls..... I kinda don't mind it as is tho. I'd mind it more if you would release the library with a beautiful GUI and library tab picture, just to replace it with something depressing a few months later... Looking at you Audio Imperia with your Areia and Jaeger overhaul. I will never get over this... . Areia had such a beautiful library art. A violin on a bed of roses. The inner goth in me really loved it. And don't get me started on the Jaeger GUI. Always felt like an epic Kaiju hunter using the library xD. All taken away from me with a simple update.... . Anyway, looking forward to the walkthrough.


I knew there were more of us out there.

Audio Imperia lost all future sales they could've had with me with that awful decision. I actually had the money ready to go and had been waiting for half a year for that Native Instruments sale. AI is dead to me.

EDIT: Yes, I will beat this horse whenever the opportunity arises for the rest of my musical life.

EDIT 2: TSS UI looks great and kinda has the sort of personality I imagine when I think of Japanese String Sections.


----------



## Kent

Crowe said:


> AI is dead to me.


Don’t let Roko’s Basilisk see this. 

(It’s too late, btw)


----------



## EvilDragon

Evans said:


> because it reminds me of the movie Arrival, which was a pretty tough watch


It was a spectacularly great movie. One of the best in recent times, in fact.





lzcmusic said:


> Imaginary picture, for reference only, thanks


Not gonna happen, drop it.



ism said:


> The ink evokes a sense of the elegance of Japanese calligraphy. There’s a beautiful minimalism to it. 5 stars.


At least some people over here get it. Thanks!


----------



## dzilizzi

I mostly don't have a problem with the GUI. My usual issue is grey writing on white. I can't always see it. Or worse, grey writing on grey background. Sometimes funky colors aren't any better. If I can't read it, I won't use it.


----------



## Evans

EvilDragon said:


> At least some people over here get it.


What makes you think people don't "get" what they were going for?


----------



## EvilDragon

I did not imply that you specifically don't get it - but some definitely don't.


----------



## Crowe

*changed my mind, not getting involved*


----------



## EvilDragon

dzilizzi said:


> I mostly don't have a problem with the GUI. My usual issue is grey writing on white. I can't always see it. Or worse, grey writing on grey background. Sometimes funky colors aren't any better. If I can't read it, I won't use it.



Any particular areas on the showcased screenshot which you find troubling to read?


----------



## dzilizzi

EvilDragon said:


> Any particular areas on the showcased screenshot which you find troubling to read?


Mostly the grey writing is dark enough. The Latency button may be a problem. It is a little light but it is big enough I can read it. Someone with worse vision than me may have problems. 

The con sord is a little hard to read, but it is just the sord part is squashed together. 

Otherwise, I do like the Japanese calligraphy look. I normally think of Japanese style as clean and minimalist, so this fits.


----------



## neblix

dzilizzi said:


> Mostly the grey writing is dark enough. The Latency button may be a problem. It is a little light but it is big enough I can read it. Someone with worse vision than me may have problems.
> 
> The con sord is a little hard to read, but it is just the sord part is squashed together.
> 
> Otherwise, I do like the Japanese calligraphy look. I normally think of Japanese style as clean and minimalist, so this fits.


Thank you for the readability feedback, we will try and address these. I should mention the latency knob is “greyed out”, meaning it is an inactive knob. It’s only active in poly legato where it appears as normal (same as the speed knob on the right).


----------



## dzilizzi

neblix said:


> Thank you for the readability feedback, we will try and address these. I should mention the latency knob is “greyed out”, meaning it is an inactive knob. It’s only active in poly legato where it appears as normal (same as the speed knob on the right).


I was wondering if that was the case. Mostly it is very readable, at least for me. So I am looking forward to using it.


----------



## Terry93D

neblix said:


> ~snip
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ~snip


This is quite nice! It's a lovely, user-friendly GUI. However, I would second that the background greys should be lightened a touch and text greys should be darkened a touch (excepting that top area with Artic and Console, where the inverse needs to happen). I also think that there should be a couple other places where red is in use - there's something visually unbalanced about it only being present at the top left and the mid-bottom right.


----------



## Brasart

Love the UI, the ink circles make me think of how the aliens communicate in Arrival — very cool stuff!


----------



## Jackdnp121

To me … A good looking GUI doesn’t make me write better music . the most important thing is that it works and sounds good , that’s really all I care TBH …


----------



## Evans

Jackdnp121 said:


> To me … A good looking GUI doesn’t make me write better music . the most important thing is that it works and sounds good , that’s really all I care TBH …


Easy access to the controls that matter most are part of the GUI decisions and are *very *important (readability comes close, or is perhaps tied hand-in-hand).

They seem to have done well here on providing the right controls, regardless of any opinions about the actual aesthetic choices.


----------



## neblix

Evans said:


> Easy access to the controls that matter most are part of the GUI decisions and are *very *important (readability comes close, or is perhaps tied hand-in-hand).
> 
> They seem to have done well here on providing the right controls, regardless of any opinions about the actual aesthetic choices.


The simplicity of the front page is a response to user feedback that our products have high learning curves, and partially this is due to information and control density.

Of course, experienced power users and mockup veterans may find it wanting for more single-page density because they can understand more intricacies of sample products easily, but we have multiple audiences to cater to, including people who may be purchasing this as their first orchestral library.

At the end of the day, there is just too much offered in this product to have dense pages of parameters. We tried the parameter-dense approach in previous products like Shreddage and Ventus with our TACT v2 system for articulation mapping, and despite the power offered, many people did not know how to do basic things like change the keyswitches. Sometimes the more you display to a user, the less they understand what to do with it.


----------



## Trash Panda

Jackdnp121 said:


> To me … A good looking GUI doesn’t make me write better music . the most important thing is that it works and sounds good , that’s really all I care TBH …


Same. This is usually what I see when Kontakt is even open (which isn't often outside of the initial instrument load up when straying from a template).


----------



## filipjonathan

Jackdnp121 said:


> To me … A good looking GUI doesn’t make me write better music . the most important thing is that it works and sounds good , that’s really all I care TBH …


Exactly.


----------



## Crowe

Companies do not spend millions upon millions on UI design research because GUI's don't matter. I promise.

Anyway TSS looks fine so as long as they don't suddenly pointlessly start changing it halfway through its lifecycle I don't see a problem XD.


----------



## MSutherlandComp

I'm hearing that it can do the 90s anime OP/ED sound, but I'm more interested in the genre fusion etc that's being done nowadays etc. Interested to hear how it sounds in these sorts of contexts!







Or as a Sawano mockup like this


----------



## neblix

Crowe said:


> Companies do not spend millions upon millions on UI design research because GUI's don't matter. I promise.
> 
> Anyway TSS looks fine so as long as they don't suddenly pointlessly start changing it halfway through its lifecycle I don't see a problem XD.


Rest assured, the "it only needs to sound good, I don't care about anything else" is a sentiment being posted by users here, but not by us. The GUI absolutely matters to us.

We also have no reason to change it. Unless we were to move off of Kontakt, we only redesign GUI's for remakes of older, dated products, and it's usually to give them new basic features that the rest of our products have, or in the case of Super Audio Cart or Shreddage 3, we have new systems and user experiences to try and innovate with.

As far as our orchestral engine, it is as advanced as it needs to be and should be a timeless product, receiving updates and upgrades but never requiring us to redo the core of it.


----------



## chapbot

I literally never, ever, ever look at the GUI when I'm writing music. It's nice that they care about it, but are there people who are staring hypnotically at GUIs while they're composing lol?


----------



## Evans

chapbot said:


> I literally never, ever, ever look at the GUI when I'm writing music. It's nice that they care about it, but are there people who are staring hypnotically at GUIs while they're composing lol?


I'm staring at the GUIs because these are virtual instruments, not sheet music. 

Though I suppose in that case I'm also sort of staring at the "GUI," too. Huh.


----------



## Zanshin

Evans said:


> I'm staring at the GUIs because these are virtual instruments, not sheet music.
> 
> Though I suppose in that case I'm also sort of staring at the "GUI," too. Huh.


*“Close your eyes. Feel it."*


----------



## ShidoStrife

GUI is fine by me, though as people have said, it could use a bit more contrast.

I personally would've preferred textured background over flat colors, but not a dealbreaker ofc

Edit: I looked again and it does have spiral pattern. I was blind lol


----------



## Saxer

You can't get things done when everybody has an opinion and you listen to it. I'd rather prefer leaving the GUI as it is and releasing the library sooner.


----------



## filipjonathan

Saxer said:


> You can't get things done when everybody has an opinion and you listen to it. I'd rather prefer leaving the GUI as it is and releasing the library sooner.


Yes please!


----------



## Crowe

If I'm working on Sound Design or programming in lines and am supposed to use everything the programming of a plugin has to offer, you're damn right I'll be staring at the GUI for extended amounts of time. There really is no other way to configure Mics, ADSR and the plethora of other variables modern plugins support.


----------



## Simon Ravn

I caved in after hearing Henning's demo


----------



## filipjonathan

Thought I'd just stop by, see what's going on, check on that walkthrough video, and of course, say I'm very excited!


----------



## Henning

Simon Ravn said:


> I caved in after hearing Henning's demo


Thanks mate! I'm sure you will like how you can tweak everything to your taste.


----------



## ism

chapbot said:


> I literally never, ever, ever look at the GUI when I'm writing music. It's nice that they care about it, but are there people who are staring hypnotically at GUIs while they're composing lol?


Yes, I feel that 99.9% User Experience is only what comes out of the interaction of my fingers and the keyboard.

Pretty guis are nice though. So there's that.


----------



## Pier-V

First, congratulations to the whole team. I have a strong feeling TSS will set a new standard in the years to come. This will be the first string library that will make ACTUAL COUNTERPOINT sound realistic (bow change portamento - finally!!!).
Second, I don't know if this is the right time and place, but I have a suggestion for a possible future product.
Saxophone sections playing in unison, and by that I mean not just another "sax emsemble" but rather a "saxophone choir": for example, a 3/3/3/3/1 SATB with a contrabass saxophone playing exactly like a string orchestra, with classical reeds and a classical tone.
That would be not only incredibily japanese (I mean this in the best way possible) but also something different and fresh - in other words, that would be in line with the concept behind TSS.
The thing is, a saxophone choir has two remarkable characteristics: it is capable of an incredible palette of tones while sounding like a perfectly homogeneous mass at the same time.
Below is an example performed by the amazing japanese Mi Bemol ensemble - even though these are exclusively saxophones, you can occasionally hear an echo of other instruments like french horns, strings and clarinets while still retaining the typical saxophone sound.
Realistically speaking I know this would be a huge risk considering that there is no guarantee such a library would find a place for commercial use, but at the same time woodwinds library are risky by nature - I have never heard anything that comes even close to recreate a musical solo line in classical style at the time of writing, and yes I know Samplemodeling/Audiomodeling and Berlin Soloists exist.


----------



## neblix

I love this! No guarantees, but it's a wonderful idea.


----------



## Trash Panda

Andrew Aversa said:


> It features five independently recorded sections (Violins 1, Violins 2, Viola, Cello, Bass) *in a typical Japanese ensemble size (8/6/4/4/3)* suitable for small and large productions alike.


Out of curiosity, does anyone know what the typical Japanese ensemble size is for brass, woodwinds and percussion? My Google-fu has failed me in finding these answers.


----------



## Zanshin

Trash Panda said:


> Out of curiosity, does anyone know what the typical Japanese ensemble size is for brass, woodwinds and percussion? My Google-fu has failed me in finding these answers.


Here's some footage from Octopath recording anyway:




I see trumpets a3, trombones a3, horns a6...


----------



## constaneum

Zanshin said:


> Here's some footage from Octopath recording anyway:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I see trumpets a3, trombones a3, horns a6...



And yet the sounds of the brass aren't the ones we commonly hear, Hollywood-ish brass. Apart from being studio like sound, it seems they hardly play FF and FFF. More like mf ? Hmm.


----------



## muziksculp

@Pier-V 

Thanks for sharing the video, I would have not guessed this was an all Saxophone Ensemble if I just heard it. 

It sounds so wonderful. 🧡

Yes, ISW should seriously think about developing an all Saxophone Ensemble. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Duncan Krummel

If we’re requesting saxophones, can we _please_ have a developer create a comprehensive saxophone library with a focus on a classical timbre, play style, and articulations list? I have yet to hear a single one convince me, and nearly all of them are jazz-oriented.


----------



## Zanshin

Duncan Krummel said:


> If we’re requesting saxophones, can we _please_ have a developer create a comprehensive saxophone library with a focus on a classical timbre, play style, and articulations list? I have yet to hear a single one convince me, and nearly all of them are jazz-oriented.


I'm not the VI sax expert, that is someone else around here. But the VSL Saxophones cover the orchestral side of saxophones pretty well. Have a listen to Rhapsody for Alto Saxophone by Debussy demo. I don't really want to say more because this is a commercial thread.

It goes without saying I'd love if ISW did a sax ensemble library like the video posted!


----------



## Duncan Krummel

Zanshin said:


> I'm not the VI sax expert, that is someone else around here. But the VSL Saxophones cover the orchestral side of saxophones pretty well. Have a listen to Rhapsody for Alto Saxophone by Debussy demo. I don't really want to say more because this is a commercial thread.
> 
> It goes without saying I'd love if ISW did a sax ensemble library like the video posted!


Dongle aside, since that’ll be moot eventually, all I’ll say is I remain… unimpressed…


----------



## tonio_

This UI looks sooo good! Really elegant


----------



## tonio_

Zanshin said:


> Here's some footage from Octopath recording anyway:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I see trumpets a3, trombones a3, horns a6...



Hmm this means that JXL brass might actually go well with TSS me thinks


----------



## Zanshin

tonio_ said:


> Hmm this means that JXL brass might actually go well with TSS me thinks


If we are talking about Octopath style - I disagree, group sizes are only one part of the equation, the room is way different. Plus we can assume recording style, and setup is vastly different too. That is not to say you couldn't get JXL Brass to sound good with TSS, you probably could. I'd start with turning off the top 1-2 dynamic layers, and then dig in to the mic mixer... I have a large chunk of JXL, it's a great library!

Until ISW comes out with the matching brass library, I'm going to try Infinite Brass in MIR Pro (one of the studios should get close). I kind of wish I had Dimension Brass, that might work great too (with a MIR studio setup).


----------



## neblix

Because of its size, you can blend TSS quite easily with your other libraries if you employ some quality early reflections to get them to share a common tone. However, what you are doing is morphing TSS to share a broader space with your other libraries. Going the other way around is quite difficult, and you'd have better luck with our future installments if you wanted the tighter sound. Even close mics of hall/stage-recorded libraries have noticeable tails in the background; mic positions are not enough to change the room reflections themselves.


----------



## Zanshin

I think that tighter sound is a good sized chunk of the charm of TSW! Thank you Nabeel.


----------



## filipjonathan

Zanshin said:


> I think that tighter sound is a good sized chunk of the charm of TSW! Thank you Nabeel.


Every time I question myself if I really need this library, I just think of that shorts demo and the releases in it and I feel better


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> Every time I question myself if I really need this library, I just think of that shorts demo and the releases in it and I feel better


Pre-Order it, and Relax, I can sense you are restless, do your self a favor. Listen to my advice


----------



## filipjonathan

muziksculp said:


> Pre-Order it, and Relax, I can sense you are restless, do your self a favor. Listen to my advice


Damn you @muziksculp !!!!!!


----------



## laurentheflute

filipjonathan said:


> Thought I'd just stop by, see what's going on, check on that walkthrough video, and of course, say I'm very excited!


Hello! The walkthrough video is still in progress, sorry! It will most likely be shared Monday or Tuesday of next week, which is a little later than we hoped, but it should answer many of your questions and give you a good sense of what the library can do. I appreciate your patience (and your enthusiasm!) and ask that you bear with us just a little longer. 😊


----------



## filipjonathan

laurentheflute said:


> Hello! The walkthrough video is still in progress, sorry! It will most likely be shared Monday or Tuesday of next week, which is a little later than we hoped, but it should answer many of your questions and give you a good sense of what the library can do. I appreciate your patience (and your enthusiasm!) and ask that you bear with us just a little longer. 😊


Looking forward to it!


----------



## Evans

laurentheflute said:


> Hello! The walkthrough video is still in progress, sorry! It will most likely be shared Monday or Tuesday of next week, which is a little later than we hoped, but it should answer many of your questions and give you a good sense of what the library can do. I appreciate your patience (and your enthusiasm!) and ask that you bear with us just a little longer. 😊


I imagine the vast majority of people are totally cool with this so long as a walkthrough comes before the pre-order period ends (which y'all have already confirmed). I've only really seen people get snippy here if the price adjusts before more than a few audio clips are out!


----------



## neblix

Evans said:


> I imagine the vast majority of people are totally cool with this so long as a walkthrough comes before the pre-order period ends (which y'all have already confirmed). I've only really seen people get snippy here if the price adjusts before more than a few audio clips are out!


The pre-order period still has a long while to go, so the walkthrough will absolutely drop long before then. The filming is happening right now, it just got delayed because we adjusted the UI contrast a little bit in response to feedback.


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> Damn you @muziksculp !!!!!!


There you go  

Now, tell me... How do you feel ? Much better ? Right ? Take a deep breath, and enjoy the feeling. 

You will enjoy TSS when it is released, so will I.


----------



## scoringdreams

PURCHASED! - Was hesitant considering that I had almost all of Spitfire's products, but these do sound very different from the standard chamber or studio strings we get from the more popular sample library developers. Feels like a cross between studio and pop strings to me.

It reminded me of this track:  

And I had to look it up, and found that it was really recorded in the same space as TSS! - though a different engineer.


----------



## RMH

filipjonathan said:


> Damn you @muziksculp !!!!!!


Wow! You did it!


----------



## constaneum

scoringdreams said:


> PURCHASED! - Was hesitant considering that I had almost all of Spitfire's products, but these do sound very different from the standard chamber or studio strings we get from the more popular sample library developers. Feels like a cross between studio and pop strings to me.
> 
> It reminded me of this track:
> 
> And I had to look it up, and found that it was really recorded in the same space as TSS! - though a different engineer.



Sounds quite similar to one of the tracks from Nier.


----------



## darcvision

constaneum said:


> Sounds quite similar to one of the tracks from Nier.


nier composed by Keichii Okabe
yuusha no shou track 10 composed by Keigo Hoashi which is part of MONACA. Keichii Okabe also part of MONACA









PCCG-01438 | Yuki Yuna wa Yuusha de Aru Original Soundtrack - VGMdb


Commercial (CD) published by PONY CANYON on Dec 10, 2014 containing original soundtrack, vocal from Yuki Yuna is a Hero




vgmdb.net


----------



## Pier-V

@scoringdreams Oh yeah, baby! Emi Evans, the legendary singer who is able to convey deep emotions using only gibberish lyrics and without using any dynamic with an f whatsoever!

Sorry for the fanboying.

Now, in all seriousness: I think TSS should be able to handle this kind of style without any problems in terms of timbre AND, most importantly, in terms of phrasing, thanks to the four kind of legatos and the 3/5 dynamic layers.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Today we have another new demo from esteemed composer Ben Hicks, who places TSS in the context of a full orchestral mockup. The violas here are particularly sonorous. Please enjoy "Ikigai" below!


----------



## mybadmemory

Andrew Aversa said:


> Today we have another new demo from esteemed composer Ben Hicks, who places TSS in the context of a full orchestral mockup. The violas here are particularly sonorous. Please enjoy "Ikigai" below!



I just love how this library not only hits the sound profile, but also seem to ooze of the exact kind of musicality that is the very reason I'm so fond of Japanese soundtracks in the first place. Lovely!

You really seem to have captured the perfect articulations and performances for this style. <3


----------



## RMH

Andrew Aversa said:


> Today we have another new demo from esteemed composer Ben Hicks, who places TSS in the context of a full orchestral mockup. The violas here are particularly sonorous. Please enjoy "Ikigai" below!



I Love it!


----------



## Henning

Andrew Aversa said:


> Today we have another new demo from esteemed composer Ben Hicks, who places TSS in the context of a full orchestral mockup. The violas here are particularly sonorous. Please enjoy "Ikigai" below!



Way to go, Ben! Just lovely!


----------



## Evans

This one might have sold me. Almost definitely. Very lovely.

I'd _love _to have a screencap of some of the MIDI control data so we can see how much massaging there needs to be versus raw playability. It seems like you are going for a middle ground, which I think is ideal.

Funny enough, a competitor demo popped up on Soundcloud autoplay immediately afterward, and my complaint of that specific product is that there's far too much required stitching of articulations, extremely delicate CC movement, and frequent nudging of note start times in order to not completely break suspension of disbelief for the listener.

EDIT: Yeah, on my third listen, now.


----------



## muziksculp

Andrew Aversa said:


> Today we have another new demo from esteemed composer Ben Hicks, who places TSS in the context of a full orchestral mockup. The violas here are particularly sonorous. Please enjoy "Ikigai" below!




@Andrew Aversa. 

What a Beautiful demo showing TSS, 🧡👍

Thanks.


----------



## Evans

Andrew Aversa said:


> Today we have another new demo from esteemed composer Ben Hicks, who places TSS in the context of a full orchestral mockup. The violas here are particularly sonorous. Please enjoy "Ikigai" below!



Do you have information on what additional processing was done here?


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> Looking forward to it!


Hi @filipjonathan, 

Congratulations ! 

And listen to what TSS can deliver, I'm so excited about this library, I hope you are too. 

New TSS demo : 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## filipjonathan

muziksculp said:


> Hi @filipjonathan,
> 
> Congratulations !
> 
> And listen to what TSS can deliver, I'm so excited about this library, I hope you are too.
> 
> New TSS demo :
> 
> Cheers,
> Muziksculp



Oh wow


----------



## gedlig

Andrew Aversa said:


> Today we have another new demo from esteemed composer Ben Hicks, who places TSS in the context of a full orchestral mockup. The violas here are particularly sonorous. Please enjoy "Ikigai" below!



This is super lovely


----------



## prodigalson

neblix said:


> The filming is happening right now, it just got delayed because we adjusted the UI contrast a little bit in response to feedback.


VI-CONTROL: "CHANGE THINGS!"

ALSO VI-CONTROL: "RELEASE IT IMMEDIATELY!"


----------



## neblix

Evans said:


> This one might have sold me. Almost definitely. Very lovely.
> 
> I'd _love _to have a screencap of some of the MIDI control data so we can see how much massaging there needs to be versus raw playability. It seems like you are going for a middle ground, which I think is ideal.
> 
> Funny enough, a competitor demo popped up on Soundcloud autoplay immediately afterward, and my complaint of that specific product is that there's far too much required stitching of articulations, extremely delicate CC movement, and frequent nudging of note start times in order to not completely break suspension of disbelief for the listener.
> 
> EDIT: Yeah, on my third listen, now.


I'm not sure about the level of MIDI massaging, but I did recommend to Ben that he adjust one of the legato parameters to get some passages like at 0:34 to sound a bit smoother. I did think it sounded fine without the adjustment, and I'd rather not recommend everyone really go in and change those settings as it's incredibly easy to produce glitches and pops with the wrong settings. I just wanted to answer this point to the best of my knowledge.

As for nudging of start times, this would be an advantage of using our lookahead. We haven't posted any demo of that in action though (with the exception of the tech demo I posted a while back where people were very distracted by me not automating the CC).


----------



## Evans

neblix said:


> I'm not sure about the level of MIDI massaging, but I did recommend to Ben that he adjust one of the legato parameters to get some passages like at 0:34 to sound a bit smoother. I did think it sounded fine without the adjustment, and I'd rather not recommend everyone really go in and change those settings as it's incredibly easy to produce glitches and pops with the wrong settings. I just wanted to answer this point to the best of my knowledge.


Ha! I was thinking through my current libraries and which would be okay and which would severely struggle. That exact section.

I really appreciate the transparency. That's good enough for me.


----------



## BenHicks

Evans said:


> I'd _love _to have a screencap of some of the MIDI control data so we can see how much massaging there needs to be versus raw playability. It seems like you are going for a middle ground, which I think is ideal.


Here you go! A lot of the CC1 and CC11 jumps you see are me probably trying too hard to simulate added bow pressure (and even subtle imperfections and note timing between violins 1 and 2 when playing in unison) in order to help the melody line feel more alive.

That being said, this is one of the easiest string libraries I've ever programmed for as far as CC data goes. Right there with CSS and Performance samples in regards to ease of use, but with added flexibility in legato types, vibrato types, speed control, etc. I've had a LOT of fun messing with these. Keep in mind that my demo was written with an alpha version from last month, so I'm sure the commercial release will sound/play even better.


----------



## filipjonathan

BenHicks said:


> Here you go! A lot of the CC1 and CC11 jumps you see are me probably trying too hard to simulate added bow pressure (and even subtle imperfections and note timing between violins 1 and 2 when playing in unison) in order to help the melody line feel more alive.
> 
> That being said, this is one of the easiest string libraries I've ever programmed for. Right there with CSS and Performance samples, but with added flexibility in legato types, vibrato types, speed control, etc. I've had a LOT of fun messing with these. Keep in mind that my demo was written with an alpha version from last month, so I'm sure the commercial release will sound/play even better.


Can I ask which percussion library did you use in that demo?


----------



## BenHicks

Evans said:


> Do you have information on what additional processing was done here?


Nothing too crazy. I first decided to place them on the stage using Parallax Audio's VSS2 in order to better create some separation between the sections. On my "High Longs" string bus, I have some EQ and on the "Low Longs" bus, I have some multiband compression controlling some of the lows. Nothing for the shorts except for some compression on the bass pizzicatos, because in basically every orchestral recording I like, the bass pizz sounds nice and full and round. 

Finally, on the full "Strings" bus, it's a mixture of some subtle EQ, some light tape saturation for a little extra warmth, a *very* small amount of Gullfoss to help smooth things out a bit more, and finally some light bus compression. 

Reverbs used were Seventh Heaven, Cinematic Rooms and some B2.



filipjonathan said:


> Can I ask which percussion library did you use in that demo?


Cymbals:
Albion One
SF HZ01 Tamtam
Berlin Percussion Piatti

Tuned Perc:
Berlin Percussion Glock
Berlin Percussion Celesta

Timpani:
Project Sam Pandora

Kind of a weird mixture of libraries, I know, but I auditioned a bunch and these seemed to fit best in this piece for whatever reason.


----------



## filipjonathan

BenHicks said:


> Nothing too crazy. I first decided to place them on the stage using Parallax Audio's VSS2 in order to better create some separation between the sections. On my "High Longs" string bus, I have some EQ and on the "Low Longs" bus, I have some multiband compression controlling some of the lows. Nothing for the shorts except for some compression on the bass pizzicatos, because in basically every orchestral recording I like, the bass pizz sounds nice and full and round.
> 
> Finally, on the full "Strings" bus, it's a mixture of some subtle EQ, some light tape saturation for a little extra warmth, a *very* small amount of Gullfoss to help smooth things out a bit more, and finally some light bus compression.
> 
> Reverbs used were Seventh Heaven, Cinematic Rooms and some B2.
> 
> 
> Cymbals:
> Albion One
> SF HZ01 Tamtam
> Berlin Percussion Piatti
> 
> Tuned Perc:
> Berlin Percussion Glock
> Berlin Percussion Celesta
> 
> Timpani:
> Project Sam Pandora
> 
> Kind of a weird mixture of libraries, I know, but I auditioned a bunch and these seemed to fit best in this piece for whatever reason.


Thanks! Sounds wonderful!


----------



## Evans

BenHicks said:


> Nothing too crazy. I first decided to place them on the stage using Parallax Audio's VSS2 in order to better create some separation between the sections. On my "High Longs" string bus, I have some EQ and on the "Low Longs" bus, I have some multiband compression controlling some of the lows. Nothing for the shorts except for some compression on the bass pizzicatos, because in basically every orchestral recording I like, the bass pizz sounds nice and full and round.
> 
> Finally, on the full "Strings" bus, it's a mixture of some subtle EQ, some light tape saturation for a little extra warmth, a *very* small amount of Gullfoss to help smooth things out a bit more, and finally some light bus compression.
> 
> Reverbs used were Seventh Heaven, Cinematic Rooms and some B2.


Wonderful, thanks for the explanation. It's nice to know what I was hearing that was a bit different than some of the other audio clips, and now it's clear.

Lovely job, thanks again.


----------



## Mukar

BenHicks said:


> Nothing too crazy. I first decided to place them on the stage using Parallax Audio's VSS2 in order to better create some separation between the sections. On my "High Longs" string bus, I have some EQ and on the "Low Longs" bus, I have some multiband compression controlling some of the lows. Nothing for the shorts except for some compression on the bass pizzicatos, because in basically every orchestral recording I like, the bass pizz sounds nice and full and round.
> 
> Finally, on the full "Strings" bus, it's a mixture of some subtle EQ, some light tape saturation for a little extra warmth, a *very* small amount of Gullfoss to help smooth things out a bit more, and finally some light bus compression.
> 
> Reverbs used were Seventh Heaven, Cinematic Rooms and some B2.
> 
> 
> Cymbals:
> Albion One
> SF HZ01 Tamtam
> Berlin Percussion Piatti
> 
> Tuned Perc:
> Berlin Percussion Glock
> Berlin Percussion Celesta
> 
> Timpani:
> Project Sam Pandora
> 
> Kind of a weird mixture of libraries, I know, but I auditioned a bunch and these seemed to fit best in this piece for whatever reason.


The demo was absolutely gorgeous. Mind if I ask what that woodwind(oboe?) was? It has such a crisp sound and complimented TSS really well. Everything considered, I got a very legitimate Final Fantasy vibe.


----------



## BenHicks

Mukar said:


> Mind if I ask what that woodwind(oboe?) was?


Of course. Just Oboe 1 from Berlin Woodwinds (version 2.2, not revive). I kinda wish I tried the solo oboe from BWW first, but oh well.


----------



## Denkii

I'd be so interested in how that demo sounds without VSS :(

But lovely piece. I already listened to it multiple times...brings me back to I don't even know where. You hit some spot.


----------



## BenHicks

Denkii said:


> I'd be so interested in how that demo sounds without VSS :(
> 
> But lovely piece. I already listened to it multiple times...brings me back to I don't even know where. You hit some spot.


It still sounds great without VSS2. All it's really doing is some minor panning and narrowing of the sound (no early reflections or anything of that sort was used from VSS2). I'm glad you liked it!


----------



## filipjonathan

@BenHicks Hey Ben, I'm interested, which mode did you use for the demo? Lookahead or standard? I noticed that all of your midi is pretty much right on the grid.


----------



## neblix

filipjonathan said:


> @BenHicks Hey Ben, I'm interested, which mode did you use for the demo? Lookahead or standard? I noticed that all of your midi is pretty much right on the grid.


Lookahead mode has not yet been made available to the demo writers. So far all TSS demos have been made with manual programming!


----------



## Trash Panda

@neblix will there be any of these features at release?
Dynamic range slider
Niente toggle
Range extension


----------



## neblix

Trash Panda said:


> @neblix will there be any of these features at release?
> Dynamic range slider
> Niente toggle
> Range extension


Range Extension is not available, but the other two are.


----------



## Terry93D

Think that might be the finest demo yet. I'm so pumped to have this library on hand.


----------



## Jackdnp121

Andrew Aversa said:


> Today we have another new demo from esteemed composer Ben Hicks, who places TSS in the context of a full orchestral mockup. The violas here are particularly sonorous. Please enjoy "Ikigai" below!



Love it man … I knew it that it is gonna be a killer studio strings library … can’t wait !


----------



## Jackdnp121

BenHicks said:


> Here you go! A lot of the CC1 and CC11 jumps you see are me probably trying too hard to simulate added bow pressure (and even subtle imperfections and note timing between violins 1 and 2 when playing in unison) in order to help the melody line feel more alive.
> 
> That being said, this is one of the easiest string libraries I've ever programmed for. Right there with CSS and Performance samples, but with added flexibility in legato types, vibrato types, speed control, etc. I've had a LOT of fun messing with these. Keep in mind that my demo was written with an alpha version from last month, so I'm sure the commercial release will sound/play even better.


Sounded amazing Ben … well done 🎉


----------



## AEF

Wow the new demo sounds great. I'm still not 100% certain about the legatos, but I say that only bc the rest of the library sounds so fantastic. Looking forward to the walkthrough.


----------



## muziksculp

AEF said:


> Wow the new demo sounds great. I'm still not 100% certain about the legatos, but I say that only bc the rest of the library sounds so fantastic. Looking forward to the walkthrough.


Do you want me to call the VI-C Legato Police ?


----------



## muziksculp

BenHicks said:


> this is one of the easiest string libraries I've ever programmed for. Right there with CSS and Performance samples, but with added flexibility in legato types, vibrato types, speed control, etc. I've had a LOT of fun messing with these.


@BenHicks , 

THANKS for the wonderful demo, and interesting feedback.


----------



## timbit2006

The Ikegai demo showed me exactly what I wanted to hear from this library, beautiful soaring strings. I can't wait to use it alongside Bravura Brass. 
I'm really glad to see the advanced features as well, the extreme control is one of my favourite parts about Bravura Brass.


----------



## filipjonathan

neblix said:


> Lookahead mode has not yet been made available to the demo writers. So far all TSS demos have been made with manual programming!


Thanks!


----------



## Mukar

BenHicks said:


> Of course. Just Oboe 1 from Berlin Woodwinds (version 2.2, not revive). I kinda wish I tried the solo oboe from BWW first, but oh well.


Thank you! Again, fantastic work


----------



## RMH

@BenHicks 
Ben, I have a question. I wonder what kind of vibrato transition is. Is it espressivo control like vsl or on/off like spitfire audio?


----------



## ShidoStrife

Would love to hear TSS in rock context like Octopath's battle themes.

That said, the Ikigai demo is truly amazing! :o


----------



## Jonathan Moray

ShidoStrife said:


> Would love to hear TSS in rock context like Octopath's battle themes.
> 
> That said, the Ikigai demo is truly amazing! :o


There's an older demo from a couple of months ago (I do believe this was even before the molto vibrato was recorded and implemented) where they ran one of the Octopath battle themes through the library. I'll let you be the judge of if it would fit within the context of a rock battle theme.


----------



## Henning

Jonathan Moray said:


> There's an older demo from a couple of months ago (I do believe this was even before the molto vibrato was recorded and implemented) where they ran one of the Octopath battle themes through the library. I'll let you be the judge of if it would fit within the context of a rock battle theme.


Hmm, as I have not yet made plans regarding a demo, I might do a more Rock'n'Roll one if there's interest


----------



## Vladimir Bulaev

Andrew Aversa said:


> Today we have another new demo from esteemed composer Ben Hicks, who places TSS in the context of a full orchestral mockup. The violas here are particularly sonorous. Please enjoy "Ikigai" below!



Beautiful composition! I think the soloist of Berlin would fit in well here. This is a revealing thing for TOKYO SCORING STRINGS, I'm starting to think it's a good string library!


----------



## filipjonathan

Vladimir Bulaev said:


> I'm starting to think it's a good string library!


Just now??! 😂


----------



## Vladimir Bulaev

filipjonathan said:


> Just now??! 😂


I have too many string libraries.


----------



## BenHicks

RMH said:


> @BenHicks
> Ben, I have a question. I wonder what kind of vibrato transition is. Is it espressivo control like vsl or on/off like spitfire audio?


I'm not really familiar with VSL stuff, so I can't really compare. It doesn't seem like it's on/off between the vibrato types, but I don't know exactly how it all works. You'd probably be better off directing that question to Andrew or @neblix, tbh.

I'm basically Hansel and Derek Zoolander during that scene towards the end of the first movie where they're trying to figure out how to turn on the computer. Just mindlessly slapping at it, like some kind of caveman, not really comprehending anything. That's pretty much representative of my knowledge about the inner workings of sample libraries in general.


----------



## timbit2006

Jonathan Moray said:


> There's an older demo from a couple of months ago (I do believe this was even before the molto vibrato was recorded and implemented) where they ran one of the Octopath battle themes through the library. I'll let you be the judge of if it would fit within the context of a rock battle theme.


Whoa.


----------



## Henning

BenHicks said:


> I'm not really familiar with VSL stuff, so I can't really compare. It doesn't seem like it's on/off between the vibrato types, but I don't know exactly how it all works. You'd probably be better off directing that question to Andrew or @neblix, tbh.
> 
> I'm basically Hansel and Derek Zoolander during that scene towards the end of the first movie where they're trying to figure out how to turn on the computer. Just mindlessly slapping at it, like some kind of caveman, not really comprehending anything. That's pretty much representative of my knowledge about the inner workings of sample libraries in general.


You know, compared to @neblix we are all Zoolanders, mate


----------



## BenHicks

Henning said:


> You know, compared to @neblix we are all Zoolanders, mate


Accurate.


----------



## neblix

The vibrato control is a continuous 3-way blend between senza vibrato (CC2 at 0%) con vibrato (CC2 at 50%) and molto vibrato (CC2 at 100%).

As it stands, with 3 vibrato levels and 5 dynamic levels, this would put you at 15 voices per Arco note on the BoardMix, and 60 voices if you used all 4 mic positions. We do want to improve this in the future, but optimizing this is quite complex with how our engine works so it may require time to show up in our 1.1 update.


----------



## RMH

neblix said:


> The vibrato control is a continuous 3-way blend between senza vibrato (CC2 at 0%) con vibrato (CC2 at 50%) and molto vibrato (CC2 at 100%).
> 
> As it stands, with 3 vibrato levels and 5 dynamic levels, this would put you at 15 voices per Arco note on the BoardMix, and 60 voices if you used all 4 mic positions. We do want to improve this in the future, but optimizing this is quite complex with how our engine works so it may require time to show up in our 1.1 update.


Thank you!!!


----------



## constaneum

Vladimir Bulaev said:


> I have too many string libraries.


Just buy....you have the Muroya strings sounds which others don't offer...Calling @muziksculp ....he's very persuasive.🤣


----------



## muziksculp

constaneum said:


> Just buy....you have the Muroya strings sounds which others don't offer...Calling @muziksculp ....he's very persuasive.🤣


I need to begin getting commissions from ISW.


----------



## muziksculp

Vladimir Bulaev said:


> I have too many string libraries.


Are you seriously saying that ? 

TSS is a gem of a Strings library, man.. How can you ignore it ? and at the Intro Discount Price, It's a no-brainer. You won't regret it, believe me, you will Thank me for pushing you to buy it.

Just Do it ... and Relax


----------



## filipjonathan

muziksculp said:


> Are you seriously saying that ?
> 
> TSS is a gem of a Strings library, man.. How can you ignore it ? and at the Intro Discount Price, It's a no-brainer. You won't regret it, believe me, you will Thank me for pushing you to buy it.
> 
> Just Do it ... and Relax


This sounds oddly familiar...


----------



## RMH

muziksculp said:


> Are you seriously saying that ?
> 
> TSS is a gem of a Strings library, man.. How can you ignore it ? and at the Intro Discount Price, It's a no-brainer. You won't regret it, believe me, you will Thank me for pushing you to buy it.
> 
> Just Do it ... and Relax


The last decision will made after watching "workthrough".🤣


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> This sounds oddly familiar...


I sense you are super relaxed


----------



## AMBi

Was pretty on the fence for a while but the new demo has just about convinced me it's so pretty

Excited to see the walkthrough video hoping it can give me that final nudge..and if so than no black friday budget for me!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

The intro walkthrough is coming tomorrow or Monday. BUT! Keep in mind, this won't be a FULL overview of every single articulation, mic, and feature. There is way too much for just a single video. The one that is about to be released will instead give you a very straightforward impression of:

* What the library looks like when you load it up
* Dynamics and vibrato types
* Selecting articulations and modifying parameters
* Legato types & portamento
* Legato speed control
* Most importantly: "Out of the box" sound and playability (i.e. no full mockups, no reverb, no EQ, single track)


----------



## filipjonathan

Andrew Aversa said:


> The intro walkthrough is coming tomorrow or Monday. BUT! Keep in mind, this won't be a FULL overview of every single articulation, mic, and feature. There is way too much for just a single video. The one that is about to be released will instead give you a very straightforward impression of:
> 
> * What the library looks like when you load it up
> * Dynamics and vibrato types
> * Selecting articulations and modifying parameters
> * Legato types & portamento
> * Legato speed control
> * Most importantly: "Out of the box" sound and playability (i.e. no full mockups, no reverb, no EQ, single track)


So looking forward to it!


----------



## bvaughn0402

Andrew Aversa said:


> The intro walkthrough is coming tomorrow or Monday. BUT! Keep in mind, this won't be a FULL overview of every single articulation, mic, and feature. There is way too much for just a single video. The one that is about to be released will instead give you a very straightforward impression of:
> 
> * What the library looks like when you load it up
> * Dynamics and vibrato types
> * Selecting articulations and modifying parameters
> * Legato types & portamento
> * Legato speed control
> * Most importantly: "Out of the box" sound and playability (i.e. no full mockups, no reverb, no EQ, single track)


YES! Thanks ... I'm sure just a bit of a peak into it will be enough to buy into it.


----------



## ShidoStrife

Jonathan Moray said:


> There's an older demo from a couple of months ago (I do believe this was even before the molto vibrato was recorded and implemented) where they ran one of the Octopath battle themes through the library. I'll let you be the judge of if it would fit within the context of a rock battle theme.


Thanks. That sounds very good by itself. Just wondering how it would sound in a mix :D


----------



## Nantho Valentine

Can't wait to watch and hear the walkthrough as I have a lot of expectations that this library will suit my strings needs 

One of my ultimate reference is Shi No Koshin from the Cobra Space Adventure OST :



I'm also literally in love with this song from Noir, but it's more about solo strings so TSS won't do the trick :



By the way, if someone knows about good solo string libraries that can fit this style of music, I'm all ears


----------



## Drundfunk

Nantho Valentine said:


> [...]
> 
> By the way, if someone knows about good solo string libraries that can fit this style of music, I'm all ears


Probably best to wait for TSS (Tokyo Solo Strings)........... But you could check out Joshua Bell Violin from Embertone. Always good to have.


----------



## Nantho Valentine

Thanks a lot ! 
I didn't know there might be a Tokyo Solo Strings in the pipeline, this indeed could be perfect 

I already have the Joshua Bell Violin and it's truly a gem for this kind of "extra romantic" melodic lines ^^ Now I'm looking for cello and viola in the same vein. Hope the Tokyo Solo Strings library is reallY coming sooner than later 🤞


----------



## constaneum

Nantho Valentine said:


> Thanks a lot !
> I didn't know there might be a Tokyo Solo Strings in the pipeline, this indeed could be perfect
> 
> I already have the Joshua Bell Violin and it's truly a gem for this kind of "extra romantic" melodic lines ^^ Now I'm looking for cello and viola in the same vein. Hope the Tokyo Solo Strings library is reallY coming sooner than later 🤞


i dont think Tokyo Solo Strings is in the pipeline based on what's declared. Unless there's a sudden change in the pipeline due to demand. Nobody knows but as for now, based on what's mentioned previously, it's not.


----------



## neblix

Solo strings are not currently in the schedule and we still have the other instrument families to cover (Wind & Brass) for the next few years. Maybe someday!


----------



## Drundfunk

Nantho Valentine said:


> Thanks a lot !
> I didn't know there might be a Tokyo Solo Strings in the pipeline, this indeed could be perfect
> 
> I already have the Joshua Bell Violin and it's truly a gem for this kind of "extra romantic" melodic lines ^^ Now I'm looking for cello and viola in the same vein. Hope the Tokyo Solo Strings library is reallY coming sooner than later 🤞


Sry, that was a joke based on the shared acronym. Maybe I should have made that more clear 


neblix said:


> Solo strings are not currently in the schedule and we still have the other instrument families to cover (Wind & Brass) for the next few years. Maybe someday!


Yes please. And don't forget the piano!


----------



## filipjonathan

Drundfunk said:


> And don't forget the piano!


Ooo a piano would be super nice!


----------



## laurentheflute

Hello, everyone! I'm very excited to report that the "first look" walkthrough video should be going live tomorrow at 10 am EDT!

ETA: I've taken down the link because we need to make a last-minute change and reupload! I will let you know when the new link is up!

I hope you'll join us for the premiere and let us know your thoughts! Please remember that this is the _prerelease _version, so there may be some changes to the final version, but I think you will get a good idea of how the library will sound and feel right out of the box. I know you've all been eager to see it in action and I hope this answers your questions! Thank you again for your patience and your support.

(We'll also be sending this out in an email tomorrow so even folks who aren't here on VI-C will get the news, but: you heard it here first! 😊)


----------



## filipjonathan

laurentheflute said:


> Hello, everyone! I'm very excited to report that the "first look" walkthrough video will be going live tomorrow at 10 am EDT:
> 
> 
> 
> I hope you'll join us for the premiere and let us know your thoughts! Please remember that this is the _prerelease _version, so there may be some changes to the final version, but I think you will get a good idea of how the library will sound and feel right out of the box. I know you've all been eager to see it in action and I hope this answers your questions! Thank you again for your patience and your support.
> 
> (We'll also be sending this out in an email tomorrow so even folks who aren't here on VI-C will get the news, but: you heard it here first! 😊)



My heart stopped when I saw it on YT. But then I realized it premiers tomorrow 😂


----------



## Zanshin

filipjonathan said:


> My heart stopped when I saw it on YT. But then I realized it premiers tomorrow 😂


Haha mine too. I was out on an errand, sitting in the car, hit play...


----------



## Hendrixon

Nabeel/Andrew
What is the size (GB) of the library?


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> My heart stopped when I saw it on YT. But then I realized it premiers tomorrow 😂


LOL.. I had the same experience


----------



## windwolf666

It seems like the walkthrough video being cancelled?


----------



## Zanshin

laurentheflute said:


> ETA: I've taken down the link because we need to make a last-minute change and reupload! I will let you know when the new link is up!


----------



## RMH

laurentheflute said:


> walkthrough video should be going live tomorrow at 10 am EDT!


2021/10/27 ?


----------



## filipjonathan

RMH said:


> 2021/10/27 ?


Still 1.5 hrs to it.


----------



## neblix

We only just got in touch with the video editor to re-export (voiceover rendering error), so the walkthrough drop may be delayed 1-2 hours or more. I don't expect everyone to be logged on and working at this time in the morning, so it's whenever folks are able to get the replacement video up.


----------



## Drundfunk

neblix said:


> We only just got in touch with the video editor to re-export (voiceover rendering error), so the walkthrough drop may be delayed 1-2 hours or more. I don't expect everyone to be logged on and working at this time in the morning, so it's whenever folks are able to get the replacement video up.


Love that communication!


----------



## laurentheflute

Hello there! Thanks for bearing with us. As Nabeel said, there was a problem with the voiceover. It has now been fixed and reuploaded!

The new link is here:


The premiere will take place in about half an hour, to try to be as close as possible to our original launch time.


----------



## filipjonathan

Sooo....what do we think?


----------



## Duncan Krummel

filipjonathan said:


> Sooo....what do we think?


I'm pretty disappointed and upset. I was hoping I would hate it despite the great sounding demos, but it sounds fantastic and has a rich feature set. Now I need to budget, damn it...

I _do _hear, all joking aside, a very slight sucking between legatos near the end of the video, but with a speed control this may be easily fixed.


----------



## Trash Panda

filipjonathan said:


> Sooo....what do we think?


The slowdown in the perceived speed of time passing between now and release day is going to be agonizing.


----------



## jeremyr

The RAM usage seems fairly high, 2.5 GB per instrument (~12.5 GB total). Can articulations be unloaded easily? Can instruments be loaded with minimal articulations to reduce load time? I apologize if this has already been addressed. I tried to search the discussion but nothing comes up.


----------



## filipjonathan

Duncan Krummel said:


> I _do _hear, all joking aside, a very slight sucking between legatos near the end of the video, but with a speed control this may be easily fixed.


I think it was in the celli.


----------



## filipjonathan

Oh, I love what you guys have done with the dynamics wheel and the color! Looks very nice!


----------



## Trash Panda

jeremyr said:


> The RAM usage seems fairly high, 2.5 GB per instrument (~12.5 GB total). Can articulations be unloaded easily? Can instruments be loaded with minimal articulations to reduce load time? I apologize if this has already been addressed. I tried to search the discussion but nothing comes up.


When you watch the section walkthroughs, it appears all 5 instruments are loaded into a single Kontakt instance, so 2.5 GB for all 5 sections loaded with whichever articulations were loaded to memory.


----------



## filipjonathan

And is there going to be an ensemble patch with all sections?


----------



## Henning

jeremyr said:


> The RAM usage seems fairly high, 2.5 GB per instrument (~12.5 GB total). Can articulations be unloaded easily? Can instruments be loaded with minimal articulations to reduce load time? I apologize if this has already been addressed. I tried to search the discussion but nothing comes up.


You can unload articulations from RAM by pressing the on/off button on each articulation.


----------



## muziksculp

Hi,

After watching the First Look Video of TSS.

I like the GUI design.

I noticed that the Articulation page doesn't show the Key-Switch Note assigned to the articulation in the video, where you would change the Note assignment. (it only shows the note in the small keyboard in the bottom of the GUI). 

A bit more real time playing of the legatos in a lyrical/musical phrase would be nice to listen to.

It would be nice if each rectangle representing an articulation also showed the Keyswitch-Note assigned to it, maybe I missed something here, so some more clarification by ISW on this detail would be helpful. I'm guessing there is much more to the TACT feature of the library that was not shown in the video.

The sound is dry, so that makes this library suitable for many genres, not just Japanese Game Soundtrack applications.

Looking forward to more in-depth videos of TSS, also when a bit of reverb is added, showing more of its features, and a bit more focus on the short articulations.

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## Henrik B. Jensen

I may have missed it but can you crossfade from no vibrato to vibrato?


----------



## Trash Panda

Henrik B. Jensen said:


> I may have missed it but can you crossfade from no vibrato to vibrato?


Yeah, they showed it crossfading from no vibrato to vibrato to molto vibrato.


----------



## jeremyr

Trash Panda said:


> When you watch the section walkthroughs, it appears all 5 instruments are loaded into a single Kontakt instance, so 2.5 GB for all 5 sections loaded with whichever articulations were loaded to memory.


Ah, I was confused by the video editing. I thought he was switching between instruments quickly, didn't see they are all playing in output A-1. That makes much more sense.


----------



## Henrik B. Jensen

jeremyr said:


> Ah, I was confused by the video editing. I thought he was switching between instruments quickly, didn't see they are all playing in output A-1. That makes much more sense.


Same here. Thanks for clearing it up, Trash Panda


----------



## grandgooroo

Really good, but on the fast legato passages, I still hear the same problem as on many virtual instruments where the harmonics/spectrum seem to open up quickly on the attack and close up on the transitions.
at 6:07


----------



## muziksculp

Oh, and I should add that I like that it's possible to select from various types of overlays for the Arco articulations, I'm not sure if the overlays work with both the Legato, and Sustains, or just the Sustains ?


----------



## dzilizzi

Sounds really good to me. Looking forward to playing with this.


----------



## muziksculp

I also see a Sustain-Attack Time knob, with 'Swell' options in a box. Some info on this feature would be interesting to read.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

muziksculp said:


> I also see a Sustain-Attack Time knob, with 'Swell' options in a box. Some info on this feature would be interesting to read.


When starting a musical phrase, you can optionally get slower/softer attacks at lower velocities, and sharper attacks at higher velocities.


----------



## Cuelist

Any plan to provide ensemble patches in the release version?


----------



## muziksculp

Sarah Mancuso said:


> When starting a musical phrase, you can optionally get slower/softer attacks at lower velocities, and sharper attacks at higher velocities.


I see. 

THANKS


----------



## Pier-V

Ok, I'll try to be as constructive as possible:
The samples: outstanding!
The programming/GUI structure: solid and flexible, really shows all the care that has been put into.
However, about the actual programming itself: unfortunately I hear the usual "hiccups" or "sobbing" on certain legato transitions, especially when playing medium legato transitions and cello legato in general.
Now, I remember how the developers explained that a lot of time and effort went into the programming part, and I trust them so I guess the timings on the legato/sustain envelopes (or whatever has been used, like AET filters and time stretching) are spot on. The problem is problably on the "tension" of the attack and release of said envelopes. What follows is unrefined but gives a rough explanation:
I hear:

Legato Release / Sustain Attack

OOOooo---___ (+) ___---oooOOO

which results in: OOOooo-oooOOO (volume inconsistencies)

This:

OOOOOOoo-_ (+) _-ooOOOOOO

May solve the problem, maybe? Anyways, defective samples would be a real problem, while sample programming can always be patched, so this is actually good news!
Also, keep in mind that the walkthrough showcases a beta version, I'm just analyzing what I have access to.
All in all, CONGRATULATIONS!!


----------



## AMBi

Really appreciate them showing it off in it’s driest state since the tone is so lovely

The GUI is super pleasing to the eyes and communicates everything so well and never seems cluttered and absolutely loving the overlay feature!
The demos gave a great impression on it’s longs and shorts which have been great and they sounded just as fantastic out of the box.

I had a few niggles with some legato in certain sections but mostly to a small degree, though in drier contexts like that I’d probably say that about most string libraries so reverb + being layered up with the other sections would negate it pretty easily so it’s not really a complaint.

Hoping for an ensemble patch since that’s my favorite way of sketching and it’d be really amazing to have with the polylegato
Definitely gonna pre order now, looking forward to release!


----------



## Loerpert

Sounds nice, I don't think I can find any use for it personally though, since it's not really for my style of music. The sound is great though! Great UI as well.


----------



## tonio_

I NEED IT


----------



## artomatic

Love the tone!


----------



## muziksculp

tonio_ said:


> I NEED IT


BUY IT


----------



## Trash Panda

tonio_ said:


> I NEED IT





muziksculp said:


> BUY IT


Well that sums up VI-C in a nutshell, now doesn’t it?


----------



## axb312

I heard a bit of the sucking effect as well for the legatos..

Also, @neblix are the different legato speeds actual transitions at various speeds or different lengths of the same transition?


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

axb312 said:


> I heard a bit of the sucking effect as well for the legatos..
> 
> Also, @neblix are the different legato speeds actual transitions at various speeds or different lengths of the same transition?


They're different settings for the same transitions. There are four styles of legato recorded (bow, slur, bow portamento, and slur portamento).


----------



## muziksculp

I'm a bit surprised the *VI-C Legato Police* has not commented on the TSS Legatos yet.


----------



## Henning

muziksculp said:


> I'm a bit surprised the *VI-C Legato Police* has not commented on the TSS Legatos yet.


Guys, this was just a basic walkthrough to show the GUI and the overall sound of the library. It was no in-depth legato phrasing video. I personally think the legato is top notch and really versatile with its different speeds. Listen again to Ben's demo, this sounds cool, right? Right


----------



## AEF

I really enjoyed the tone. It sounds how I wished several other libraries sounded when I foolishly bought them on a whim.


----------



## neblix

There won't be an ensemble patch in 1.0 unfortunately, but we want to follow up soon after with one in the coming months.

After you see the insane multi-part multi-artic writing the Lookahead engine can do with just one MIDI track, you'll be dying to use it in a patch with the whole range available.


----------



## Sovereign

muziksculp said:


> I'm a bit surprised the *VI-C Legato Police* has not commented on the TSS Legatos yet.


Really? Well let me say this. The slow legato sounds generally fine though I am liking the 'bowed legato' a bit less in the example played. And I am also not a fan of creating faster legatos by merely shortening the existing legato transitions, rather than recording and using actual faster ones.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

Sovereign said:


> Really? Well let me say this. The slow legato sounds generally fine though I am liking the 'bowed legato' a bit less in the example played. And I am also not a fan of creating faster legatos by merely shortening the existing legato transitions, rather than recording actual faster ones.


They were recorded at a quite fast tempo. The slowest transitions use the entire animal, squeezing out every bit of performance between transitions.


----------



## neblix

Sovereign said:


> Really? Well let me say this. The slow legato sounds generally fine though I am liking the 'bowed legato' a bit less in the example played. And I am also not a fan of creating faster legatos by merely shortening the existing legato transitions, rather than recording and using actual faster ones.


There isn't such a thing as "faster legato". Note changes are instantaneous. The only speed you can control in performance is of portamentos. You could record legato at a faster tempo so the players are "in the zone" for that speed, but the room tail would bleed into the transitions, rendering them unusable.


----------



## Sovereign

neblix said:


> There isn't such a thing as "faster legato". Note changes are instantaneous. The only speed you can control in performance is of portamentos. You could record legato at a faster tempo so the players are "in the zone" for that speed, but the room tail would bleed into the transitions, rendering them unusable.


In such a small room as this? Nah, libraries like Synchron have these faster recordings in a far bigger hall and they sound just fine.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

Sovereign said:


> In such a small room as this? Nah, libraries like Synchron have these faster recordings in a far bigger hall and they sound just fine.


These were recorded as quickly as was possible without note bleed from the room rendering the recordings unusable.


----------



## neblix

The note bleed did render a lot of them unusable at this tempo, which is why we had to have someone de-bleed them, and that was just one note per at this tempo. Faster notes would have more notes to de-bleed, probably resulting in some noticeable artifacts after attempting to fix.


----------



## Trash Panda

@neblix @Sarah Mancuso @EvilDragon (and any other KSP experts/aficionados) on the subject of legato (which sounds wonderful to me in TSS), it seems most devs take an approach of either cutting into the beginning of a transition sample or recording different speeds for different transition paces to handle fast versus slow transitions.

I have not heard of any devs using a time stretching approach to handle this though. Does such an approach sound unnatural, cause an audible amount of artifacts or require too much CPU to be a viable option?

Pure curiosity question, but I intend to experiment with it on bounced audio as well.


----------



## AMBi

neblix said:


> There won't be an ensemble patch in 1.0 unfortunately, but we want to follow up soon after with one in the coming months.
> 
> After you see the insane multi-part multi-artic writing the Lookahead engine can do with just one MIDI track, you'll be dying to use it in a patch with the whole range available.


That's fine, looking forward to it though! Making do by mapping the sections to the same MIDI track should be fine in the meantime.

Having that attack knob is such a *huge* plus to me especially when sketching for smooth arcs which is weirdly absent in some other string libraries


----------



## Go To 11

I hope this video is okay with the ISW team! Yousef mentions that a Bricasti M7 style reverb would take to the samples particularly well. So, other than the introduction, I cut out all the talking and played around with Seventh Heaven reverb in real time - the best Bricasti M7 emulation there is. I only adjusted the Decay Time and Mix settings, going through various Halls1 presets, so you can get a feel for how the samples take to reverb. Beautifully, I think! Looking forward to the release. (Apologies for the clicks and pops, they're the cost of adjusting the reverb in real time).


----------



## Sovereign

Sarah Mancuso said:


> They were recorded at a quite fast tempo. The slowest transitions use the entire animal, squeezing out every bit of performance between transitions.


Yeah I understand "slow" uses most of the recorded intervals. But my point was that I am not a huge fan of recording intervals at just one particular speed and shortening the transitions for faster playing. And if they do few libraries get it "right". Out of curiosity, do you know at what BPM the intervals were recorded?



neblix said:


> The note bleed did render a lot of them unusable at this tempo, which is why we had to have someone de-bleed them, and that was just one note per at this tempo.


I really don't know what "this tempo" is. First time I've read this library needed "de-bleeding", for the legato release samples when going from one note to the next. Would I be correct in assuming this 'de-bleeding' removes (much or all? of) the room release for any given interval? Could you clarify a bit how and what was "de-bleeded"?

CSS for example circumvents such issues by crossfading very very late for any interval into a regular sustain (transitions are three or four seconds long). I guess TS didn't take this approach?


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

Sovereign said:


> Yeah I understand "slow" uses most of the recorded intervals. But my point was that I am not a huge fan of recording intervals at just one particular speed and shortening the transitions for faster playing. And if they do few libraries get it "right". Out of curiosity, do you know at what BPM the intervals were recorded?
> 
> 
> I really don't know what "this tempo" is. First time I've read this library needed "de-bleeding", for the legato release samples when going from one note to the next. Would I be correct in assuming this 'de-bleeding' removes (much or all? of) the room release for any given interval? Could you clarify a bit how and what was "de-bleeded"?
> 
> CSS for example circumvents such issues by crossfading very very late for any interval into a regular sustain (transitions are three or four seconds long). I guess TS didn't take this approach?


You can’t simultaneously do something faster and slower. If you want legato recorded at an even faster tempo than this, where bleed would be more of an issue, you can’t do that while also waiting 4 seconds between notes. That would be recording at a vastly _slower_, not faster, tempo.


----------



## AEF

If the VSL way of handling legato transitions is an opposite approach to this, that puts another point in favor of TSS for me…..


----------



## windwolf666

First of all, thanks for the walkthrough video. It's really impressive!
However, I hear some weird/harsh sound while the TSS plays short or long notes, and I find that it is around 3.5k.
Please refer to the following picture.
I also attach the audio file I exaggerated that certain frequency, so you can hear more clearly.






Not sure it is a bug or it is one of the characteristic in TSS.


----------



## FireGS

What happened to the Viola pizz at the end? The stereo image completely collapsed into mono.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Regarding the frequency balance, a couple things: one is that you are hearing the sound through video AND YouTube compression, which could be creating artifacts. Two, this is the Board Mix being demonstrated, which has some gentle (but still present) processing, part of Aizawa's signature sound. I can't disclose specifically what he used but it does color the sound (and is part of why we all love that sound.) That said, if you find it a bit harsh, you can always use your own EQ to tame a bit, or make your own mic mix.

Regarding the viola pizz, that seems to have been caused by an error during video editing/rendering. The real samples are not mono. Sorry about that 😅


----------



## filipjonathan

Legato sounded really good imo, except for the celli at the end but I'm sure that can be smoothed out with tweaking the settings. And I _love _that there's a runs mode!


----------



## neblix

The cellos are on my to-do list to look at as I noticed for some reason they were save with transition volumes 4-5 dB beyond where they should be, this was probably a mistake on my end, getting builds to the video producer was kind of a hectic flurry of unexpected fixes.


----------



## neblix

AMBi said:


> That's fine, looking forward to it though! Making do by mapping the sections to the same MIDI track should be fine in the meantime.


I don't see why we couldn't provide an .nkm (Kontakt multi) that sets all the patches up on the same midi channel with Lookahead engaged, so thank you for this idea. It should be a fantastic substitute in the meantime, though not as RAM-efficient as a dedicated ensemble patch. I will put it on my to-do list.


----------



## bvaughn0402

Thank you for the video! Ok, now time to plan out when to purchase this!

Any chance you might be able to create a rough ensemble patch for quick sketching using the strings?

EDIT: Nevermind ... I see an ensemble patch is planned just not in Ver 1.0.


----------



## filipjonathan

neblix said:


> The cellos are on my to-do list to look at as I noticed for some reason they were save with transition volumes 4-5 dB beyond where they should be, this was probably a mistake on my end, getting builds to the video producer was kind of a hectic flurry of unexpected fixes.


Do we have a rough release date?


----------



## timbit2006

Andrew Aversa said:


> Regarding the frequency balance, a couple things: one is that you are hearing the sound through video AND YouTube compression, which could be creating artifacts. Two, this is the Board Mix being demonstrated, which has some gentle (but still present) processing, part of Aizawa's signature sound. I can't disclose specifically what he used but it does color the sound (and is part of why we all love that sound.) That said, if you find it a bit harsh, you can always use your own EQ to tame a bit, or make your own mic mix.
> 
> Regarding the viola pizz, that seems to have been caused by an error during video editing/rendering. The real samples are not mono. Sorry about that 😅


Well now it's time for everyone to start forensic levels of analysis to figure out exactly what makes a mix have that sound!

EDIT: I think I figured it out. 1-2grand worth of rack gear can confirm my suspicions


----------



## neblix

filipjonathan said:


> Do we have a rough release date?


"Before the end of the year" is a reasonable and confident guarantee, a specific date is not (not at this time, anyway). The library is nearly done, it's a matter of gathering the required materials for NKS, passing NI's inspection practices (which we receive no concrete timeframe on) and getting our branding/marketing set up.

That being said, you can expect more walkthrough material in November; I should have time to produce a demonstration of the Lookahead engine, walking through how it's used and the sheer magnitude of time and effort it can save while producing.


----------



## Nimrod7

Thank you very much for releasing the walkthrough before the preorder offer expires. 
I really hope more companies do that, giving a chance to their customers to see what they are buying. 

I absolutely loved the demos. The sound, the UI, the articulations, really impressed by it.
After watching the intro, immediately preordered.


----------



## Nimrod7

bvaughn0402 said:


> Any chance you might be able to create a rough ensemble patch for quick sketching using the strings?


I was actually thinking the same. 
Voting +1.


----------



## EvilDragon

Trash Panda said:


> @neblix @Sarah Mancuso @EvilDragon (and any other KSP experts/aficionados) on the subject of legato (which sounds wonderful to me in TSS), it seems most devs take an approach of either cutting into the beginning of a transition sample or recording different speeds for different transition paces to handle fast versus slow transitions.
> 
> I have not heard of any devs using a time stretching approach to handle this though. Does such an approach sound unnatural, cause an audible amount of artifacts or require too much CPU to be a viable option?
> 
> Pure curiosity question, but I intend to experiment with it on bounced audio as well.



That would result in increased CPU usage and artifacts, yeah. Especially lots of artifacts and phase smearing for more ambienet recordings (it would also compress or expand the room sound along with the sample, quite unnatural).


----------



## chapbot

neblix said:


> There won't be an ensemble patch in 1.0 unfortunately, but we want to follow up soon after with one in the coming months.
> 
> After you see the insane multi-part multi-artic writing the Lookahead engine can do with just one MIDI track, you'll be dying to use it in a patch with the whole range available.


Thank you for getting the library out NOW instead of delaying it to include more features ♥️


----------



## zedmaster

Great first impressions! Love the UI, and am curious what the different releases (natural, excited, staccato) sound like. 

I also noticed that Cello legato sounding wonky and hope this will get improved until launch. I'd love to hear some phrases with switching articulations, legato speeds etc. within the phrase to really show the amount of musicality the library is capable of. While seeing the settings in the UI and understand what you did


----------



## gum

Are there any plans for the Performance Legato Patch?
I'm probably an addict of it.


----------



## Henning

Well, the arco articulation is the performance patch as far as I'm concerned. It has bowed and fingered legato on different velocities. Portamento on the lower velocities. There's an attack overlay with 4 different attack types to choose from. 4 release types that you can dial in. Check out my cello polylegato demo. Just one patch. I tinkered here and there with the settings but it's all quite straight forward. Best is that you can change everything in TACT. Don't want the attack layer, just click of a button and turn it off. Want releases to change via velocity, just make the adjustments in TACT. So, you could make your own performance patch with your settings super easily.


----------



## RMH

Thank you. The work-through video helped me to some extent.
@Andrew Aversa @neblix 
How many mics do we have for tss?


----------



## filipjonathan

RMH said:


> Thank you. The work-through video helped me to some extent.
> @Andrew Aversa @neblix
> How many mics do we have for tss?


I think that info is available on the product page on their website.


----------



## FrozenIcicle

Man, that cello legato was very spitfire like. Hopefully it was just the video and not in the final product!


----------



## RMH

filipjonathan said:


> I think that info is available on the product page on their website.


I didn't see it. I thought it wasn't there. Thank you!


----------



## Evans

I'm not sure if the developer would be super pumped about a full conversation in their Commercial thread about another developer, even if many comments are favorable.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

FrozenIcicle said:


> Man, that cello legato was very spitfire like. Hopefully it was just the video and not in the final product!


Not at all final, and will be improved!


----------



## Akora

molemac said:


> Can someone convince me that I need TSS given that I have Elite . ie what would I be missing and not be able to do with Elite. Playing around with the close presets on Elite I can make it sound pretty close to TSS . So apart from the sound, is it the legato which makes it a must have . Over to you legato people.


There is only *one* person on here that wields powers of persuasion strong enough to sway you, and break this seemingly unbreakable barrier of yours. I'm talking about the High Lord @muziksculp


----------



## filipjonathan

Akora said:


> There is only *one* person on here that wields powers of persuasion strong enough to sway you, and break this seemingly unbreakable barrier of yours. I'm talking about the High Lord @muziksculp


I second this.


----------



## neblix

Hi all, just to answer some of the specific questions we've been getting, we can not give exact RAM or hard drive counts because the library has not yet been release-optimized. We are still working on uncompressed WAV, and the process of encoding the library through NI (or even creating ncw's in unlicensed libraries) drastically reduces the size.

All I can promise is that the *final library size will be under 80 GB *and the final RAM of a patch like Violins I Board Mix to be *around or under 1.5GB of RAM*. Multiply that by 4 if you load all mics in the Mic Mix patch variation.


----------



## molemac

Evans said:


> I'm not sure if the developer would be super pumped about a full conversation in their Commercial thread about another developer, even if many comments are favorable.


Oops. Fair enough, sorry. Should I delete and message @muziksculp privately . No criticism intended just after some xtra persuasion as I am in the I own a thousand string libraries camp.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

As of today, Tokyo Scoring Strings is officially in beta - this means the UI, all patches, all features, and all samples are complete. There will no doubt be tweaks and bug fixes to do, but it's still a major milestone!

... By the way, if you're reading this, you're invited to join the soft launch of the official Impact Soundworks Discord. It's a place to talk to other composers, ISW users, and developers. We'll see you there!


----------



## Nimrod7

Thank you Andrew and team. I remember not long ago TSS to be without UI and now it’s in beta. That means everyone is working at full throttle!


----------



## jason3.14

Been looking forward to this for nearly a year, and am so excited! Congrats on the beta!


----------



## windwolf666

Andrew Aversa said:


> As of today, Tokyo Scoring Strings is officially in beta - this means the UI, all patches, all features, and all samples are complete. There will no doubt be tweaks and bug fixes to do, but it's still a major milestone!


Congratulation!! I wonder it is possible to see the second walkthrough video before the end of pre-order? Want to learn more about TSS.


----------



## laurentheflute

windwolf666 said:


> Congratulation!! I wonder it is possible to see the second walkthrough video before the end of pre-order? Want to learn more about TSS.


We are working on this! We know many of you would like to see more before you can decide to preorder or not, so watch this space — we'll have more as soon as we can. 😊


----------



## windwolf666

laurentheflute said:


> We are working on this! We know many of you would like to see more before you can decide to preorder or not, so watch this space — we'll have more as soon as we can. 😊


I'm glad to hear that!! Thank you very much!


----------



## MonadoLink

Will updates be free to those purchasing now?


----------



## EvilDragon

ISW usually does free updates within a single major point version.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

If memory serves, the only time in our entire 12+ year history history we have charged for an update was going from Shreddage 2 to Shreddage 3. In that case, the new instruments included not only 100% completely new patches, scripts/UIs, and NKS compatibility, but were actually separate entries in the libraries tab and in Native Access. Even then it was just a $20 update to help cover the cost of the new license. Before that, we had 5+ years of free updates for Shreddage 2.


----------



## laurentheflute

Hi, folks! Quick update.

Basically, since things have taken a little longer than we anticipated and we've only been able to share one walkthrough video with you so far, we have decided to *extend the preorder period through November 12*, one week later than originally planned. This will give us time to show you more of the library in action before preorders close.

Again, summarized: *preorders* are now open through *Friday, November 12*, and we'll continue offering the *preorder-only price of $349 *during that time.

I hope this will help some of you feel a little more comfortable making a decision!

We don't have a release date yet, but we will keep you posted as soon as we know more.

Thank you!


----------



## Evans

laurentheflute said:


> until November 12





laurentheflute said:


> through Friday, November 12


A relatively minor quibble, but I believe these mean two different things ("until" = not inclusive; "through" = inclusive).


----------



## laurentheflute

Evans said:


> A relatively minor quibble, but I believe these mean two different things ("until" = not inclusive; "through" = inclusive).


Good catch! I do mean "through" (inclusive) but I realize I used both. I've updated my post so it's just "through"... sorry about that. 😅


----------



## tcb

As the preorder date extended to November 12 due to longer time beta test,does it means the release date is dalayed too?
Form ISW discord's chat,it should release before December 15(2 weeks for beta test and 1months for NI package)
I have preordered TSS.Can't wait


----------



## neblix

It’s not that it’s delayed, it’s that we literally can not choose a specific date due to the contractual nature of QA from NI. We are required to give them up to a certain time to verify it’s ready, so the earliest date would be after that time estimate. As we haven’t yet handed it over (still testing and fixing last-minute things), that time is in flux. But yes, there shouldn’t be any reason it would be after Dec 15th (the common assumption internally is before then), unless something catastrophic happens in QA.


----------



## MonadoLink

Are we charged when it releases or when we place the preorder? I kind of wish I had waited now since the time was extended


----------



## filipjonathan

MonadoLink said:


> Are we charged when it releases or when we place the preorder? I kind of wish I had waited now since the time was extended


You're charged when you pre-order.


----------



## Loerpert

Guys, I was wondering, why not also keep the preorder discount going for a bit when the product is released? The way it's done now feels a bit like you don't have the confidence that people will like the product when it released. Please help me understand the strategy here.


----------



## Brasart

Loerpert said:


> Guys, I was wondering, why not also keep the preorder discount going for a bit when the product is released? The way it's done now feels a bit like you don't have the confidence that people will like the product when it released. Please help me understand the strategy here.


^Weird post.
It's the same strategy used by billions of others products; a discount that only exists before the product is released, which generates interest and only works when there is trust between the user and the company doing the discount.
There's no point doing a "release pre-order discount" because... it's not pre-ordering anymore, and you want to sell your product at its base value.


----------



## gedlig

Also certain german and english developers do preorder pricing, so it's nothing unique and out of the ordinary in this industry


----------



## Evans

I think what Loerpert is hoping for is pre-order *and* intro period pricing, which is something we've seen before but not frequently.

We can probably save opinions on the concept of pre-orders for another thread.


----------



## prodigalson

Loerpert said:


> The way it's done now feels a bit like you don't have the confidence that people will like the product when it released.


it feels like you're looking at pre-order pricing as being a way to trick customers when actually its an incentive to customers to buy in and the discount is a reward for that trust.


----------



## gedlig

Evans said:


> I think what Loerpert is hoping for is pre-order *and* intro period pricing, which is something we've seen before but not frequently.


You mean the same price for preorder and intro?


----------



## Evans

gedlig said:


> You mean the same price for preorder and intro?


Sure, I guess? I was just commenting on what the phases themselves are typically called. I'm not asking for one or the other.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

The idea of the special preorder period is to reward early adopters, those who are most excited for the library, with the lowest price in exchange for them paying in advance of the library releasing. I believe that preorders should _always_ offer something beyond just a guaranteed purchase of the product.

We are as confident as ever in the quality of TSS and as mentioned, if at any point _after_ preordering but before the release you would like to cancel your preorder, we are offering unconditional refunds. (After all, I understand that people's financial situation can change month-to-month or even week-to-week).


----------



## Loerpert

Brasart said:


> ^Weird post.
> It's the same strategy used by billions of others products; a discount that only exists before the product is released, which generates interest and only works when there is trust between the user and the company doing the discount.
> There's no point doing a "release pre-order discount" because... it's not pre-ordering anymore, and you want to sell your product at its base value.



Well thanks for your kind enlightenment. In the future I will keep my "weird" posts to myself .


----------



## Loerpert

Andrew Aversa said:


> The idea of the special preorder period is to reward early adopters, those who are most excited for the library, with the lowest price in exchange for them paying in advance of the library releasing. I believe that preorders should _always_ offer something beyond just a guaranteed purchase of the product.
> 
> We are as confident as ever in the quality of TSS and as mentioned, if at any point _after_ preordering but before the release you would like to cancel your preorder, we are offering unconditional refunds. (After all, I understand that people's financial situation can change month-to-month or even week-to-week).



Thanks for your explanation.


----------



## Batrawi

Loerpert said:


> Well thanks for your kind enlightenment. In the future I will keep my "weird" posts to myself .


you won't know they're weird until someone tells you so... so you still need to post them


----------



## Trash Panda

Batrawi said:


> you won't know they're weird until someone tells you so... so you still need to post them


Schroedingers Weirdness Paradox!


----------



## Brasart

Loerpert said:


> Well thanks for your kind enlightenment. In the future I will keep my "weird" posts to myself .


Well you did weirdly imply the company was trying to sell a flawed product by lowering its price when it's not available yet, if you want plain answers you could try to go with plain questions


----------



## Loerpert

Brasart said:


> Well you did weirdly imply the company was trying to sell a flawed product by lowering its price when it's not available yet, if you want plain answers you could try to go with plain questions



I said that's how it felt to me as a potential customer. I got a plain answer actually; From the developer, but not from you. I think your answer was salty where it wasn't necessary. Bye now.


----------



## scoringdreams

Are there more video walkthroughs and demo pieces on their way?


----------



## filipjonathan

scoringdreams said:


> Are there more video walkthroughs and demo pieces on their way?


Yes.


----------



## neblix

The road to submission has gone smoothly, so hopefully the library is handed off in the next couple days.

Many, many things were reviewed and tweaked (legato, articulation sync, GUI contrast & fonts), especially based on feedback to the alpha preview video. We are pretty proud of what's come together, and are still committed to improving and tweaking for further updates in the future. And as mentioned earlier, we'll be seeing some new videos very, very soon!



*UPDATE ON LOOKAHEAD*

The feature is now completed to the specification I posted earlier in the thread, and I'm pretty pleased with its operation as a version 1 of the algorithm, and it's already saving me a lot of time in speed writing. It sounds great, works great, and I couldn't be happier. Future updates may drill down on even tighter sync, especially with variances across sections or dynamics; for now I've decided the slight variation is healthy for a more human sound, and we'll see what users think before reacting further.

That being said, we discovered a snag that is almost for certain out of our hands; depending on if a DAW's plugin delay compensation is reliable or actually even works, the included compensator VST won't be able to get your midi data playing in sync with the rest of your song, and you'll have to offset the track back by 1 second manually.

So far we've seen it working fine in a handful of popular DAW's, but when we tested it in the latest version of FL Studio, the delay compensation just flat out did not work, and the compensator VST did nothing. We even tried FL Studio's native mixer "track latency" setting instead of using our VST, and it still didn't do anything, so it seems like FL Studio's own handling of delay compensation is possibly broken. Unfortunately, it's up to the DAW's developer to implement plugin delay compensation or negative track delay reliably, so this is a case where our Lookahead system will have to settle with a "Supported DAW's" list of some sort. It still works, but if the midi is out of time with the rest of your tracks, then it just introduces a new workflow headache.

Later this month (but most definitely *after* the pre-order period ends), I will be producing a Lookahead system walkthrough explaining the system's features, so hopefully by then I'll be able to include a list of DAW's that we tried it out in. That being said, anyone can test if it works by downloading Voxengo Latency Delay, setting it to 1000ms, and seeing if the DAW properly holds playback for 1 second.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

At 4PM EST today (11/5), join us for the live premiere of the TSS "Sonic Overview" and patch walkthrough video! I'll be demonstrating a variety of sounds out-of-the-box, playing live parts with no FX (except for testing some external reverbs later). You'll hear all sections individually, plus as an ensemble, with multiple articulations, dynamics, vibrato types, and even the mic comparison from the "Mic Mixer" patches.


----------



## lzcmusic

GUI looks much better


----------



## filipjonathan

Andrew Aversa said:


> At 4PM EST today (11/5), join us for the live premiere of the TSS "Sonic Overview" and patch walkthrough video! I'll be demonstrating a variety of sounds out-of-the-box, playing live parts with no FX (except for testing some external reverbs later). You'll hear all sections individually, plus as an ensemble, with multiple articulations, dynamics, vibrato types, and even the mic comparison from the "Mic Mixer" patches.



Thank you for the video Andrew! I really enjoyed hearing more of the library! I do have a question though. I noticed that regardless of the speed of the passages you played, the legato speed was always on 'slow'. Wouldn't have those faster passages sound better if the speed was switched to fast or runs? Thanks!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

filipjonathan said:


> Thank you for the video Andrew! I really enjoyed hearing more of the library! I do have a question though. I noticed that regardless of the speed of the passages you played, the legato speed was always on 'slow'. Wouldn't have those faster passages sound better if the speed was switched to fast or runs? Thanks!


Well, _slow_ doesn't necessarily mean that the players are performing slow. It's the same performance in all cases, since the length of the actual transition is extremely fast (just the time it takes for the players to move their fingers without sliding). So what that knob really controls is how much space _around_ the transition you hear.

In my experience, as long as you can live with a little latency/note anticipation in Standard Mode (it's a non-issue in Lookahead Mode) then Slow sounds really good for MOST purposes. Of course, it depends on exactly what you're writing. *Very *fast parts will definitely sound better with the faster speeds.


----------



## filipjonathan

Andrew Aversa said:


> Well, _slow_ doesn't necessarily mean that the players are performing slow. It's the same performance in all cases, since the length of the actual transition is extremely fast (just the time it takes for the players to move their fingers without sliding). So what that knob really controls is how much space _around_ the transition you hear.
> 
> In my experience, as long as you can live with a little latency/note anticipation in Standard Mode (it's a non-issue in Lookahead Mode) then Slow sounds really good for MOST purposes. Of course, it depends on exactly what you're writing. *Very *fast parts will definitely sound better with the faster speeds.


I see. Thanks! Can't wait to play around with it.


----------



## Daren Audio

Can't wait for this library!


----------



## Trash Panda

Andrew Aversa said:


> At 4PM EST today (11/5), join us for the live premiere of the TSS "Sonic Overview" and patch walkthrough video! I'll be demonstrating a variety of sounds out-of-the-box, playing live parts with no FX (except for testing some external reverbs later). You'll hear all sections individually, plus as an ensemble, with multiple articulations, dynamics, vibrato types, and even the mic comparison from the "Mic Mixer" patches.



I can only assume this thread got quiet after this video posted because everyone literally died from anticipation.


----------



## zedmaster

I liked what I saw and heard  Can't wait to see more on Lookahead.


----------



## muziksculp

Hi,

I think TSS is not limited at all to be used for Japanese Animation soundtrack applications.

I think from the last video posted, it sounds very versatile, and able to be sonically morphed via reverb or other sonic treatments to sound big and lush, for a more cinematic sound if that's needed.

I love the shorts, especially the way the Spicc. Secco articulation sounds. The Legatos are also very smooth, and expressive. The one thing I couldn't get to hear in detail is the Vibrato, maybe some of the future videos will focus on the quality, and character of the Vibrato when it is set to full value, also the Molto Vibrato.

The Sordino Switch did a great job, I like that they implemented it in this library.

The Violas sounded very nice and rich.

The Spicc-Overlay for the Legatos is another very useful feature. I didn't notice where that can be enabled in the GUI, so maybe a bit more detailed videos on the GUI, without rushing threw it would be helpful.

The Narration volume was way too loud, compared to the DAW playing TSS in the last video, I had to keep lowering, and boosting the volume. Maybe keeping levels more equal for both audio streams would be possible in future videos.

The Lookahead Mode showed three buttons : Pure Attack , Easy Artic , Legato Speed , so I'm looking forward to know more about the Lookahead feature, and what these buttons do.

Poly-Legato sounded nice, a useful feature to have, more videos on this detail would be helpful as well.

The Mic Options sounded very good, but I didn't notice a huge difference between them, so I'm guessing there won't be a need to use more than two of them, at least for my needs, given I can add reverb to taste to get the desired result.

Thanks to ISW for the video, looking forward to watch more TSS videos before the official release.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Thanks for the kind words, although I apologize if my voice was too loud. To me it sounded OK but then again, we're not the best judge of our own voices sometimes... I'll keep that in mind for future video(s)


----------



## muziksculp

Andrew Aversa said:


> Thanks for the kind words, although I apologize if my voice was too loud. To me it sounded OK but then again, we're not the best judge of our own voices sometimes... I'll keep that in mind for future video(s)


You're very welcome Andrew.

OH, or you could boost the TSS cast audio, and leave your voice level as is, just so they both match each other.

I would also like to listen to more audio demos, that are more cinematic using TSS, I know that's not the primary focus of TSS, but one of the demos posted earlier sounded so nice, and was more cinematic, i.e. more lush sounding, rather than close, and tight. I feel TSS is great for both applications.

Also some demos showing the Molto-Vibrato would be appreciated.

Thanks


----------



## neblix

muziksculp said:


> The Mic Options sounded very good, but I didn't notice a huge difference between them, so I'm guessing there won't be a need to use more than two of them, at least for my needs, given I can add reverb to taste to get the desired result.


Many people think of mic positions as degrees of reverberation and splash. The nature of a small studio just inherently means there isn't a huge difference of reverb between them.

In the future, we could possibly mix down a separate "Spot" position to get the individual ensemble mono mic positions from the sessions. It'll take some experimenting, and perhaps be a separate NKI. Too many mic positions in the same NKI can cause high zone counts which can hang on loading for some people, so it's a decision to be made carefully.

I find the mic positions in TSS are more about dimension than reverb. It's the same sound, but a different "flavor". I especially like the room mic, it's somewhat darker, and feels more spread out in a 3D stereo sense. Probably the best candidate if you want to turn the library into a Hollywood sound.

But 99% of the time, I would just use Board Mix, because it's the signature Aizawa sound on many scores, it takes additional reverb really well, and the patch just loads faster.


----------



## filipjonathan

I'm watching the video for the third time and I just can't get enough of the room sound. Its soooo good!!

I do have to say though, that I still find the cello legato the weakest point out of everything. Something just doesn't sound as good as the rest of the sections. It's probably the phrase that was used in the demo.


----------



## AEF

There are many things I like about what Im hearing.

That Japanese sound seems to really come across via the style of vibrato and the portamento. 

I too think the Celli legato is subpar. The basses sound fierce though!


----------



## tonio_

filipjonathan said:


> I'm watching the video for the third time and I just can't get enough of the room sound. Its soooo good!!
> 
> I do have to say though, that I still find the cello legato the weakest point out of everything. Something just doesn't sound as good as the rest of the sections. It's probably the phrase that was used in the demo.


The cellos were WAY lower in volume compared to the other instruments in this new video, so that may be a contributing factor, considering the fact that for us humans whatever is louder will sound better


----------



## Pier-V

This Vst's phrasing capabilities are definetly starting to take shape!
Also, I'm more of a "legato guy" and it's very difficult for shorts to capture my attention, but I must admit the ones I heard in the latest walkthough are simply out of this world.

@Andrew Aversa from what I've seen in the video, you're suggesting beetwen the lines to crossfade between vibrato layers in a very fast and decise way to avoid phasing issues... Am I reading the situation right?



Spoiler: Nerdy stuff, please don't mind



_Basically it's like Muffet's bossfight in Underatle..._


----------



## muziksculp

Maybe a TSS demo of the Cellos only performing (to expose them for detailed evaluation) would be a good way to evaluate them. Playing various legato passages, shorts, ..etc.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Pier-V said:


> This Vst's phrasing capabilities are definetly starting to take shape!
> Also, I'm more of a "legato guy" and it's very difficult for shorts to capture my attention, but I must admit the ones I heard in the latest walkthough are simply out of this world.
> 
> @Andrew Aversa from what I've seen in the video, you're suggesting beetwen the lines to crossfade between vibrato layers in a very fast and decise way to avoid phasing issues... Am I reading the situation right?
> 
> 
> 
> Spoiler: Nerdy stuff, please don't mind
> 
> 
> 
> _Basically it's like Muffet's bossfight in Underatle..._



Well, it's my own personal preference, but probably _generally_ good advice to not linger on in-between values. This would be true for any library that lets you xfade between multiple things, since if you're 50% between two levels, you're hearing two sets of samples blended, which is slightly less natural. Of course that might not matter depending on what you're doing, in the context of a mix, with reverb, etc.


----------



## Pier-V

Thanks for your reply! Today I read my question again and realized it sounded a bit aggressive. I actually think there's nothing wrong with that (in fact, it's the best possible way to preserve realism) - I was surpised more that anything else to see that other people came to the same conclusion regarding vibrato crossfades.


----------



## jason3.14

Finally preordered today! Excited to hear see the upcoming dedicated Lookahead mode video.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Hello! Today we've released two new pieces of content. The first is a video by Yousef Mousavi demonstrating the articulation control system of Tokyo Scoring Strings in more depth. We're really proud of the power, flexibility, and ease-of-use of this system (which is an evolution of our earlier TACT framework). 

In less than 10 minutes you'll learn how to adjust keyswitches, create multi-rule mappings, assign all shorts to modwheel, and other useful features.



Next, we've published the product manual if you want to really get in depth about what is included in the library. This is a bit of a living document as we're continuing to clean up and refine some text, but it's 99% complete and final:



https://impactsoundworks.com/Manuals/Tokyo%20Scoring%20Strings%20Manual.pdf


----------



## filipjonathan

Andrew Aversa said:


> Hello! Today we've released two new pieces of content. The first is a video by Yousef Mousavi demonstrating the articulation control system of Tokyo Scoring Strings in more depth. We're really proud of the power, flexibility, and ease-of-use of this system (which is an evolution of our earlier TACT framework).
> 
> In less than 10 minutes you'll learn how to adjust keyswitches, create multi-rule mappings, assign all shorts to modwheel, and other useful features.
> 
> 
> 
> Next, we've published the product manual if you want to really get in depth about what is included in the library. This is a bit of a living document as we're continuing to clean up and refine some text, but it's 99% complete and final:
> 
> 
> 
> https://impactsoundworks.com/Manuals/Tokyo%20Scoring%20Strings%20Manual.pdf



Have to admit, I was a bit confused at moments. Took me back to maths class  Definitely need to watch it a few more times to understand everything but I love the fact that you can customize it however you like. So neat!


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> Have to admit, I was a bit confused at moments. Took me back to maths class  Definitely need to watch it a few more times to understand everything but I love the fact that you can customize it however you like. So neat!


I think the pace of explaining is too fast to digest the info.

@Andrew Aversa ,

Can you please tell the video producers to slow the pace down when explaining things, It's a bit too fast for my brain to digest info at the speed the video is moving at, (Why is he Rushing ?) 

I even missed the arrows showing the tabs, ..etc. That would be appreciated for future video tutorials.

TACT is a very flexible system, looking forward to more videos, demos, tutorials, ..etc. and before the official release of TSS.

THANKS


----------



## gst98

muziksculp said:


> I think the pace of explaining is too fast to digest the info.
> 
> @Andrew Aversa ,
> 
> Can you please tell the video producers to slow the pace down when explaining things, It's a bit too fast for my brain to digest info at the speed the video is moving at, (Why is he Rushing ?)
> 
> I even missed the arrows showing the tabs, ..etc. That would be appreciated for future video tutorials.
> 
> TACT is a very flexible system, looking forward to more videos, demos, tutorials, ..etc. and before the official release of TSS.
> 
> THANKS


Could you not rewind it?


----------



## muziksculp

gst98 said:


> Could you not rewind it?


Could the pace of the video not be slower ? 

Why the rush ? Is YouTube running out of Disc Space on their Servers ?


----------



## chrisav

Press the cogwheel icon on the video and choose slower playback speed


----------



## muziksculp

chrisav said:


> Press the cogwheel icon on the video and choose slower playback speed


That pitch shifts the audio down. What's the problem with slowing down the pace of explaining in the first place ? Why fix a problem if it can be fixed properly, by doing it right the in the first place ?

Sorry, don't get it.


----------



## gst98

muziksculp said:


> Could the pace of the video not be slower ?
> 
> Why the rush ? Is YouTube running out of Disc Space on their Servers ?


Didn't seem rushed to me, but if you don't get it just rewind and listen again. Better than bloated videos that have to be skipped through.


----------



## muziksculp

gst98 said:


> Didn't seem rushed to me, but if you don't get it just rewind and listen again. Better than bloated videos that have to be skipped through.


It seemed rushed to me. It's such a simple thing to improve, just slow down the pace of explanation a bit. That's all I'm suggesting they improve in future videos.


----------



## gst98

muziksculp said:


> It seemed rushed to me. It's such a simple thing to improve, just slow down the pace of explanation a bit. That's all I'm suggesting they improve in future videos.


yeah but I don't see how dragging out the video improves it... all you have to do is press the left arrow on your keyboard and re-listen to it.


----------



## Drundfunk

muziksculp said:


> Could the pace of the video not be slower ?
> 
> Why the rush ? Is YouTube running out of Disc Space on their Servers ?


Different perspective: I enjoy fast explanations. I find it cumbersome to sit through an overlong video where everything is overexplained in a slow pace. Ain't nobody got time for that!


----------



## Loïc D

Perfect pace for me.
Indeed your clever articulation & overlay management opens a world of possibilities !


----------



## muziksculp

A hard crowd to convince here. 

All I'm asking is to slow down the pace a bit, not to go overboard with prolonging the video time.


----------



## gedlig

Pace is fine (as someone who usually plays similar type of videos at 1,5x speed)


----------



## filipjonathan

muziksculp said:


> A hard crowd to convince here.
> 
> All I'm asking is to slow down the pace a bit, not to go overboard with prolonging the video time.


I'm totally with you on this one but it seems we're in the minority here.


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> I'm totally with you on this one but it seems we're in the minority here.


No worries, Andrew A. has already replied to my request to slow the pace of future videos on Discord, and wrote that will be done for the future videos. 

Quote @zircon/Andrew A. : "Noted, we will keep it in mind for the next ones!"


----------



## gedlig

muziksculp said:


> No worries, Alex A. has already replied to my request to slow the pace of future videos on Discord, and wrote that will be done for the future videos.
> 
> Quote @zircon/Alex A. : "Noted, we will keep it in mind for the next ones!"


He's not "Alex"


----------



## muziksculp

gedlig said:


> He's not "Alex"


LOL... Sorry, I meant Andrew A.  

Fixed it.


----------



## chapbot

muziksculp said:


> I think the pace of explaining is too fast to digest the info.
> 
> @Andrew Aversa ,
> 
> Can you please tell the video producers to slow the pace down when explaining things, It's a bit too fast for my brain to digest info at the speed the video is moving at, (Why is he Rushing ?)
> 
> I even missed the arrows showing the tabs, ..etc. That would be appreciated for future video tutorials.
> 
> TACT is a very flexible system, looking forward to more videos, demos, tutorials, ..etc. and before the official release of TSS.
> 
> THANKS


Play the video at half speed on YouTube 😆


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Don't worry, we're very open to feedback on these things. Yousef and I will be mindful of how fast we're speaking, and will build in some extra time when we are showing something on the screen; maybe an extra example here and there going forward.


----------



## muziksculp

Andrew Aversa said:


> Don't worry, we're very open to feedback on these things. Yousef and I will be mindful of how fast we're speaking, and will build in some extra time when we are showing something on the screen; maybe an extra example here and there going forward.


Thank You  

Very appreciated, you guys are wonderful.


----------



## MA-Simon

Looking forward to this! :D Hope it is not too far off now.


----------



## Saxer

Great system to customize!


----------



## neblix

I don't think it's the speed of speech, per se, but how little space there is between sentences and subject changes. I can agree there's very little "punctuation" which can make it difficult for someone to process what they just heard before listening to even more narration.

We won't drag the videos out, we'll just make sure things are spaced a bit better and there's some more time to parse the visuals.



> Looking forward to this! :D Hope it is not too far off now.


It's in NI's hands as we speak for QA, so we are on track for our intended release timing.


----------



## AMBi

Andrew Aversa said:


> Preorders are fully refundable up until the day of release.


Would the preorder discount be refundable after the day of release as long as I don't download/activate the license?

Since it seems not too far off now I'm hoping to hold out a bit to see user feedback and more demos before I fully commit to activating it.


----------



## timbit2006

AMBi said:


> Would the preorder discount be refundable after the day of release as long as I don't download/activate the license?
> 
> Since it seems not too far off now I'm hoping to hold out a bit to see user feedback and more demos before I fully commit to activating it.


That would go against the whole reasons as to why developers even have preorder sales although at least in video games that's now no longer the case.

The risk is you maybe prebought a library that sucks, the reward is that you saved 50 bucks.


----------



## AMBi

timbit2006 said:


> That would go against the whole reasons as to why developers even have preorder sales although at least in video games that's now no longer the case.
> 
> The risk is you maybe prebought a library that sucks, the reward is that you saved 50 bucks.


Ok if that's the case just wanted to check first, thanks

Might change my plan and hold out for the intro price than, since the extra $50 may be worth it if it makes me more comfortable with my choice


----------



## MA-Simon

I might be that guy, but any library that ends up beeing unter 300€... for me is just spending money. Like... if you can not afford to spend 300 a month on a hobby, you should just not do it.

So regardless if I may be dissapointed or delighted by this library, it was just 300€ well spent?
Regardless if I like it, I might do a youtube walktrough, I just got one of those Shure SM7B's for voice recording. So it better be good.  I have to say though, that short snipped, played live in the beginning of the last video was 200% more lively then all the snippets played in the previous videos. That just goes to show, that live is best.


----------



## filipjonathan

MA-Simon said:


> Like... if you can not afford to spend 300 a month on a hobby, you should just not do it.


You do realize that in some countries that's an average monthly salary?


----------



## MA-Simon

filipjonathan said:


> average monthly salary?


D:... that is to bad.


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> I don't think it's the speed of speech, per se, but how little space there is between sentences and subject changes. I can agree there's very little "punctuation" which can make it difficult for someone to process what they just heard before listening to even more narration.
> 
> We won't drag the videos out, we'll just make sure things are spaced a bit better and there's some more time to parse the visuals.


Exactly what I should have suggested, but you got exactly what I meant.

The narration needs to pause for a moment, so one can digest the main idea/s explained. Then move to the next one. Although very fast speech is not very helpful either. So, both are important factors that will help make it more enjoyable to watch, and learn from watching these video tutorials.

Thank You.


----------



## filipjonathan

MA-Simon said:


> D:... that is to bad. Also, let me know if you want to work for me. I can pay... 350 a month?


What an ass


----------



## MA-Simon

muziksculp said:


> The narration needs to pause for a moment, so one can digest the main idea/s explained


It was okay, but I noticed stuff were I was a bit lost.


filipjonathan said:


> What an ass


/: I did not mean it like that, sorry if it seemed like a negative comment.


----------



## filipjonathan

MA-Simon said:


> /: I did not mean it like that, sorry if it seemed like a negative comment.


It seemed like a very rude comment.


----------



## gedlig

German people will never understand that eastern EU's (not Europe's in general, specifically EU) average salaries are half of Germany's, usually even less.


----------



## Marsen

Weird Berlin Guy: This was a racist commentar. Stop it!


----------



## MA-Simon

filipjonathan said:


> It seemed like a very rude comment.


I don't want to continue this, I am very sorry, I can not relate to your country or the realities of your jobs. I want to appologize. I did not mean it negatively. Please, I am sorry. ): This was is bad taste, it seems.


----------



## Marsen

gedlig said:


> German people will never understand that eastern EU's (not Europe's in general, specifically EU) average salaries are half of Germany's, usually even less.


I'm german, and i'm not like that.
Absolutely not like that.


----------



## gst98

That got disgusting real quickly... even the apology seems like another insult


----------



## MA-Simon

I have no Idea where these comments are coming from. Sorry ): Maybe pm me? I really have no idea?


----------



## AMBi

So ummm.. yeah
about that Tokyo Scoring Strings

Pretty cool so far huh?


----------



## gedlig

Sounds nice, should be able to use for some orchestral thall. Only a bit sad there's no sul tasto and flautando ('tis a meme, but I do like that sound)


----------



## gedlig

Marsen said:


> Weird Berlin Guy: This was a racist commentar. Stop it!


It really wasn't (I enjoy really offensive to the extreme jokes and comments, so take this statement with a lake of salt)


----------



## Marsen

gedlig said:


> It really wasn't (I enjoy really offensive to the extreme jokes and comments, so take this statement with a lake of salt)


No, I´m not. This was really bad. Don´t excuse it. 
I like black humor and good jokes. 
This was pointing in an absolute wrong direction.


----------



## bfreepro

AMBi said:


> So ummm.. yeah
> about that Tokyo Scoring Strings
> 
> Pretty cool so far huh?


Looks fuckin awesome! I pre-ordered last night. Glad they extended the pre-order window. Finally, a flexible, playable, dry library!


----------



## filipjonathan

MA-Simon said:


> I don't want to continue this, I am very sorry, I can not relate to your country or the realities of your jobs. I want to appologize. I did not mean it negatively. Please, I am sorry. ): This was is bad taste, it seems.


Apology excepted. Just think twice before you make potentially triggering jokes in the future. Now, TSS!


----------



## gedlig

Dammit, now there's basically a whole page of non TSS nonsense xD


----------



## MA-Simon

Basically, what I was saying was, I liked that last video.


----------



## molemac

Sorry if this has been already mentioned but when does the preorder end ?
ps good video


----------



## AMBi

molemac said:


> Sorry if this has been already mentioned but when does the preorder end ?
> ps good video


Through to Friday November 12th


----------



## chapbot

AMBi said:


> Through to Friday November 12th


Whew! I almost forgot to preorder! I JUST DID!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## zedmaster

I love the fact that I can customize so many articulation settings to both velocities and MIDI CC. I found the tutorial quite clear  Great job!


----------



## jason3.14

These shorts really are surpassing my expectations, haha.


----------



## Loïc D

What is the average RAM usage per instrument using the Mix Board ?


----------



## filipjonathan

Loïc D said:


> What is the average RAM usage per instrument using the Mix Board ?


With all artics loaded I think it's around 1.7gb. At least that's what it is in the latest video.


----------



## Loïc D

filipjonathan said:


> With all artics loaded I think it's around 1.7gb. At least that's what it is in the latest video.


Yes I saw this too but was wondering if it’s the mix board or the multi-mics instances. My current system is struggling with RAM hence the question.


----------



## filipjonathan

Loïc D said:


> Yes I saw this too but was wondering if it’s the mix board or the multi-mics instances. My current system is struggling with RAM hence the question.


Oh I hear ya. Only have 16gb on my MBP.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Each position is about 1.75gb total. Loading all positions in the mic mixer patch with all articulations will bring you to just under 7gb, using Violins 1 as a reference. This IS very chunky, which we mention in the manual, and it's why we generally recommend using the board mix (or just 1 or 2 mics at a time from the mic mixer patch) if you want to keep RAM load under control.

That said, the legato and portamento groups are what take up the most memory. If for example you are not using BOTH portamento slur AND bow, disabling one of those will shave off nearly a full gigabyte from the all mic patch. Disabling a legato type will save you more like 1.8gb. (Again, with all mics loaded.)

One thing we are working on which _might _make it into v1.0 - no promises - is the ability to disable legato RRs. This would cut the RAM usage of legato groups in half, saving quite a bit of memory.

The only other thing we could do is consider 16-bit patches, but the difficulty there is that it requires more HD space and more bandwidth to deliver. But maybe if there's enough demand for it...


----------



## gedlig

Or just purge samples, it's Kontakt (not a certain british sample player )


----------



## neblix

gedlig said:


> Or just purge samples, it's Kontakt (not a certain british sample player )


According to what I've seen before, our instruments don't support the Kontakt "purge samples" function as we have purge controls on multiple script tabs, which requires a purge "synchronization" on every load to make sure the purge state of the samples matches both the microphone positions you have turned off or on (on tab 2) and the articulations off or on (on tab 1).

This is because if you were to load a Kontakt snapshot that only affected the mic mixer, it would necessitate a re-purge of the articulations and mic positions based on the new values in that preset.

Theoretically we could see about adding an option to remove this auto-purge specifically on patch load in the 1.1 update, however, keep in mind if you were to manually purge any articulations or mics on the GUI, it would again re-synchronize, and you would have to run the "purge samples" function again.

@EvilDragon can correct anything here that's not accurate.


----------



## gedlig

neblix said:


> According to what I've seen before, our instruments don't support the Kontakt "purge samples" function as we have purge controls on multiple script tabs, which requires a purge "synchronization" on every load to make sure the purge state of the samples matches both the microphone positions you have turned off or on (on tab 2) and the articulations off or on (on tab 1).
> 
> This is because if you were to load a Kontakt snapshot that only affected the mic mixer, it would necessitate a re-purge of the articulations and mic positions based on the new values in that preset.
> 
> Theoretically we could see about adding an option to remove this auto-purge specifically on patch load in the 1.1 update, however, keep in mind if you were to manually purge any articulations or mics on the GUI, it would again re-synchronize, and you would have to run the "purge samples" function again.


Oh for the love of Hatsune Miku... 🤬

Understood. Thought that's just a general Kontakt feature, not something you have to properly implement in the library.


----------



## neblix

gedlig said:


> Oh for the love of Hatsune Miku... 🤬
> 
> Understood. Thought that's just a general Kontakt feature, not something you have to properly implement in the library.


You _don't_ have to implement it; it's the reverse, we have implemented our own purge system that *overrides* the default purge system.

Our library supports letting you isolate what snapshots affect (articulations vs. mic mixing/FX in separate preset files). But regardless of what our code does, Kontakt snapshots will always save whatever purge states were there when the snapshot was saved. It's very difficult to explain the technical details, but basically, you could have circumstances where the user loads some preset, and trying to trigger certain articulations would output silence, or some mic positions they had on would be silent (or they would hear mic positions the GUI says are turned off).

So basically, we have to do our purge synchronization (overriding user purge) in order to make our preset isolation feature work reliably, so on every snapshot load the GUI controls are read to "re-purge" every group in Kontakt. And unfortunately, the section of code that runs on snapshot loads is also run when the instrument is first-loaded, which happens every time you open the DAW project.

There may be a way for me to not run this particular code on the first/DAW load so at least if you don't touch any controls, your user purge will always work, I will post in the thread if I have managed to fix it before the library releases.


----------



## AlbertSmithers

Something I would like to see more of fast and expressive passages, to see how it compares with CSS and Vista (as well as to hear more of what it sounds like with the lookahead mode - that's really the only thing that's keeping me from preordering.

Something like this with the raw legato (without layering the spiccatos on top of the legato) would be cool:


----------



## AlbertSmithers

Also what are people's thoughts so far on using this as a general orchestral strings replacement? I was thinking of getting CSS to replace everything currently in my template, but I might end up getting this instead if it's very expressive and works well with fast paced passages. It might just have the precision I need for my template.

My only concern is how it sounds as an ensemble. CSS sounds very convincing in an ensemble context, but I feel like with TSS you can still hear the individual sections. Maybe I need to get better at mixing reverb to get a similar sound.

Or perhaps the solution is to just mix TSS with CSS.


----------



## neblix

AlbertSmithers said:


> Something I would like to see more of fast and expressive passages, to see how it compares with CSS and Vista (as well as to hear more of what it sounds like with the lookahead mode - that's really the only thing that's keeping me from preordering.


I will say the Lookahead video is not scheduled to release before pre-order period ends. I am aiming for it end of next week.


----------



## axb312

MA-Simon said:


> I might be that guy, but any library that ends up beeing unter 300€... for me is just spending money. Like... if you can not afford to spend 300 a month on a hobby, you should just not do it.
> 
> So regardless if I may be dissapointed or delighted by this library, it was just 300€ well spent?
> Regardless if I like it, I might do a youtube walktrough, I just got one of those Shure SM7B's for voice recording. So it better be good.  I have to say though, that short snipped, played live in the beginning of the last video was 200% more lively then all the snippets played in the previous videos. That just goes to show, that live is best.


300 Euros is a lot of money in many places of the world like Africa, The Middle East and Asia.

A little more sensitivity would go a long way....


----------



## Andrew Aversa

AlbertSmithers said:


> Something I would like to see more of fast and expressive passages, to see how it compares with CSS and Vista (as well as to hear more of what it sounds like with the lookahead mode - that's really the only thing that's keeping me from preordering.
> 
> Something like this with the raw legato (without layering the spiccatos on top of the legato) would be cool:



Great question. TSS sounds fantastic for faster passages in my humble opinion. Here's a short video with some 100% quantized MIDI in Lookahead mode. This is with no keyswitching or automation whatsoever, just showing the result of 30 seconds of MIDI sequencing.

I genuinely do not think any other library can do this without manually adjusting note timings and expression.


----------



## AlbertSmithers

Andrew Aversa said:


> Great question. TSS sounds fantastic for faster passages in my humble opinion. Here's a short video with some 100% quantized MIDI in Lookahead mode. This is with no keyswitching or automation whatsoever, just showing the result of 30 seconds of MIDI sequencing.
> 
> I genuinely do not think any other library can do this without manually adjusting note timings and expression.



Wow this is great, and will definitely save time on programming things. Thank you for posting this video! I think with this, I'll be able to orchestrate things much quicker than I am right now, so I can spend more time on composing. More libraries should do lookahead. 

I have one more question which is about how much you can tweak the performance in lookahead mode.

Would it be out of the question to move one note slightly off-grid? This would be for if I wanted to delay part of the playing (as if I wanted to make a slight tweak to the lookahead performance). To me it makes sense that it works best on quantized notes, but I suppose my question is to what extent can I "change" that and still achieve a good sound?

I hope this question makes sense and thanks for all that you do.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

AlbertSmithers said:


> Wow this is great, and will definitely save time on programming things. Thank you for posting this video! I think with this, I'll be able to orchestrate things much quicker than I am right now, so I can spend more time on composing. More libraries should do lookahead.
> 
> I have one more question which is about how much you can tweak the performance in lookahead mode.
> 
> Would it be out of the question to move one note slightly off-grid? This would be for if I wanted to delay part of the playing (as if I wanted to make a slight tweak to the lookahead performance). To me it makes sense that it works best on quantized notes, but I suppose my question is to what extent can I "change" that and still achieve a good sound?
> 
> I hope this question makes sense and thanks for all that you do.


You can still realign notes manually if you like, as long as legato notes' edges are kept touching.


----------



## gedlig

neblix said:


> You _don't_ have to implement it; it's the reverse, we have implemented our own purge system that *overrides* the default purge system.
> 
> Our library supports letting you isolate what snapshots affect (articulations vs. mic mixing/FX in separate preset files). But regardless of what our code does, Kontakt snapshots will always save whatever purge states were there when the snapshot was saved. It's very difficult to explain the technical details, but basically, you could have circumstances where the user loads some preset, and trying to trigger certain articulations would output silence, or some mic positions they had on would be silent (or they would hear mic positions the GUI says are turned off).
> 
> So basically, we have to do our purge synchronization (overriding user purge) in order to make our preset isolation feature work reliably, so on every snapshot load the GUI controls are read to "re-purge" every group in Kontakt. And unfortunately, the section of code that runs on snapshot loads is also run when the instrument is first-loaded, which happens every time you open the DAW project.
> 
> There may be a way for me to not run this particular code on the first/DAW load so at least if you don't touch any controls, your user purge will always work, I will post in the thread if I have managed to fix it before the library releases.


Thanks for the explanation, think I understand how things will work. Can't really digest it now, cause I'm a bit sleep deprived. Gonna reread it in the morning.


----------



## AlbertSmithers

Sarah Mancuso said:


> You can still realign notes manually if you like, as long as legato notes' edges are kept touching.


Ahhh so great! Thanks!


----------



## neblix

AlbertSmithers said:


> Ahhh so great! Thanks!


I recommend using a DAW's hotkey to move the note start and ends together as one unit, if your DAW does it.

That being said, if you want to globally change the lookahead alignment for legatos, every legato profile has a "sync offset" knob. Turning to the right would make that legato type occur later by some number of ms and left earlier, etc.

Part of the difficulty in explaining Lookahead's capability is the use of the term "grid". Really, the lookahead system has nothing to do with observing the grid, and notes can occur wherever you'd like at any timing.

What Lookahead ensures is that the samples actually play *when they are written to play*. If you have a legato occurring halfway between beats 2 and 3, you will hear the note halfway between 2 and 3. That's the idea. The idea is not to quantize your MIDI to the grid, but rather we simply like to demonstrate that when music is written on the grid, what you write and see is what you hear, and you don't have to adjust anything _just to hear what you intend_.

For any purpose beyond that, of course you can move things around, as many people do off the grid to "humanize" them. Still, what you have written will sound as intended, so if you move a note 30ms behind beat 1, you will hear it as such. Of course, personally I do not recommend humanizing ensemble patches substantially, because what you are doing is creating the impression that the entire ensemble made the same "mistake". Though you could nudge for reasons of anticipation or mimicking certain instruments' sluggishness, changing the feeling of the music itself, perhaps drawing on ideas of how ensembles behave when conducted live, etc.

To me the draw is forward-looking; this synchronization will occur on all future Tokyo Scoring products, so timing will be entirely preserved and accurate even across different families. What this will allow is an unprecedented level of orchestration auditioning in the DAW. Moving existing MIDI clips to different instruments in strings, brass, and winds without having to carefully re-sequence for each library's quirk is a huge advantage in speed-writing. Also makes exploding sketch tracks or notation export to sample mockups that much easier as well.


----------



## EvilDragon

neblix said:


> @EvilDragon can correct anything here that's not accurate.


It's accurate!


----------



## ka00

I hope it's okay that I post this here. I took the audio examples from the articulation walkthrough and added some Cinematic Rooms reverb to taste. Just to give a rough idea of what it sounds like with more lush reverb before the pre-order period ends.

EDIT: please note that from 0:49-1:01 look-ahead mode in off position is being demonstrated, immediately following that the same line is played with look-ahead on.


----------



## Igorianych

Sorry... I seem to have missed the most important thing! What is look-ahead mode
Or where can you read about it?
Thanks!


----------



## Nantho Valentine

Ok, pre-order is done ! Can't wait to play with this little gem now 🤘


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Igorianych said:


> Sorry... I seem to have missed the most important thing! What is look-ahead mode
> Or where can you read about it?
> Thanks!


If you watch the "Patch Walkthrough" video on this page, you'll see it previewed at 3:18.









Impact Soundworks Tokyo Scoring Strings (Kontakt Player VST, AU, AAX)


Our flagship orchestral string library featuring Koichiro Muroya Strings, Japan's top string ensemble heard on countless anime and game OSTs.




impactsoundworks.com





It's described in more detail in the manual (available on that page) too.



https://impactsoundworks.com/Manuals/Tokyo%20Scoring%20Strings%20Manual.pdf



We'll be making a dedicated video on it, but that won't be available in the preorder period.


----------



## Igorianych

Andrew Aversa said:


> If you watch the "Patch Walkthrough" video on this page, you'll see it previewed at 3:18.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Impact Soundworks Tokyo Scoring Strings (Kontakt Player VST, AU, AAX)
> 
> 
> Our flagship orchestral string library featuring Koichiro Muroya Strings, Japan's top string ensemble heard on countless anime and game OSTs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> impactsoundworks.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> It's described in more detail in the manual (available on that page) too.
> 
> 
> 
> https://impactsoundworks.com/Manuals/Tokyo%20Scoring%20Strings%20Manual.pdf
> 
> 
> 
> We'll be making a dedicated video on it, but that won't be available in the preorder period.


Thank you Andrew!


----------



## muziksculp




----------



## José Herring

I'm a real big fan of sliced bread, but I have a feeling that these strings may just be the greatest invention since then.


----------



## amorphosynthesis

neblix said:


> It’s not that it’s delayed, it’s that we literally can not choose a specific date due to the contractual nature of QA from NI. We are required to give them up to a certain time to verify it’s ready, so the earliest date would be after that time estimate. As we haven’t yet handed it over (still testing and fixing last-minute things), that time is in flux. But yes, there shouldn’t be any reason it would be after Dec 15th (the common assumption internally is before then), unless something catastrophic happens in QA.


what I don't understand is this;why not extend the preorder period until before it's released-from what I understand,the preorder ends today-and the product is released in mid december! Am I right?


----------



## thorwald

amorphosynthesis said:


> what I don't understand is this;why not extend the preorder period until before it's released-from what I understand,the preorder ends today-and the product is released in mid december! Am I right?


You quoted the reason. The release date is an estimate, it might take one week for NI, it might take two or even more, and depending on the result, it might take some more time to resubmit, etc.


----------



## Igorianych

Done

waiting for the strings...


----------



## laurentheflute

thorwald said:


> You quoted the reason. The release date is an estimate, it might take one week for NI, it might take two or even more, and depending on the result, it might take some more time to resubmit, etc.


This is correct; we had to choose a date for the preorders to end, without knowing what our specific release date would be!

Please also bear in mind that the holiday season is almost upon us (Black Friday is just a couple weeks away!) so there's a lot to juggle on our end right now. So we've tried to find the best balance for everybody when it comes to preorders. Thank you all for your understanding!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

muziksculp said:


>



Thanks for linking this! 

We're very proud of this video, and in particular the beautiful score composed with TSS by composer Jeff Ball!


----------



## muziksculp

Andrew Aversa said:


> Thanks for linking this!
> 
> We're very proud of this video, and in particular the beautiful score composed with TSS by composer Jeff Ball!


Hi @Andrew Aversa ,

My pleasure 

Looking forward to more videos, and TSS demos. while we wait for it's official release.

I loved the video, and got a better picture of the room, the development team, the players, and what makes TSS a very special Strings Library. (THANKS).

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## galactic orange

The score in that video is fabulous. Well done! And what a great look at the studio and team. It almost seems like too much to expect from them, but a nice surprise nonetheless. I really enjoyed that.


----------



## ansthenia

I'm not getting this, don't see the big deal, and I already have enough strin lib.....what the hell I just preordered it. 

ISW using some sort of black magic on me.


----------



## timbit2006

This was the background of Brave browser just now, this picture is Kyoto but it made me want to try TSS even more.
I've always been interested in Japanese culture since I was young, we had homestay exchange students from Japan live with us during the summer and since then I've had a deep respect for them and the Japanese history.


----------



## Trash Panda

ansthenia said:


> I'm not getting this, don't see the big deal, and I already have enough strin lib.....what the hell I just preordered it.
> 
> ISW using some sort of black magic on me.


The power of anime and friendship is strong.


----------



## Terry93D

I'm just burning up in anticipation for this library. It can't come soon enough!


----------



## ChickenAndARoll

Andrew Aversa said:


> We're very proud of this video, and in particular the beautiful score composed with TSS by composer Jeff Ball!


...I genuinely thought I was listening to live strings in that video. That is incredible


----------



## artomatic

Well, I caved...


----------



## Drundfunk

I need a new string library as much as I need a third kidney, but I actually pre-ordered as well. Just really like what I'm hearing.


----------



## lzcmusic

@laurentheflute

Already submitted, right?


----------



## neblix

lzcmusic said:


> Already submitted, right?


Yes, the library is actually already encoded by NI as of yesterday! We are waiting for their approval on NKS compatibility checks (mandatory for Kontakt Player libraries).

While we're waiting, we're actually spending the waiting time looking at the legatos again and digging deeper into specific profiles and articulations (as many people have noticed, our Cello Legato Slur is a bit of a weak link). We figure if there is time, it should be spent.

So the legatos on release day should sound even better than what you hear in the "Sonic Overview". And at this rate, an early December release is basically 100% guaranteed, we just can't give a 100% specific day until we're fully in the clear.


----------



## muziksculp

ChickenAndARoll said:


> ...I genuinely thought I was listening to live strings in that video. That is incredible


I'm a little confused, was that musical piece in the video, which was composed by Jeff Ball, played by the Studio Players ? or was it actually produced using TSS the library ?


----------



## neblix

muziksculp said:


> I'm a little confused, was that musical piece in the video, which was composed by Jeff Ball, played by the Studio Players ? or was it actually produced using TSS the library ?


The documentary score was entirely TSS, no live recordings.


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> The documentary score was entirely TSS, no live recordings.


WOW ! 

Holy Sh.t, 

I couldn't tell these were samples. You guys have broken a realism sonic barrier for String Libraries.


----------



## EvilDragon

Drundfunk said:


> I need a new string library as much as I need a third kidney


What are you talking about, third kidney can come EXTREMELY well in handy. Unless you're a teetotaller


----------



## amorphosynthesis

neblix said:


> The documentary score was entirely TSS


This made me pull the trigger.....damn(it's only literaly the 30th string library I purchased)


----------



## timbit2006

I've honestly never felt more confident about preordering something in my life. In that short documentary you can see the pure amount of passion that went into this.


----------



## Vladimir Bulaev

neblix said:


> The documentary score was entirely TSS, no live recordings.


It would be great to listen to music in its pure form out of context by including TSS as an audio demo.


----------



## Drundfunk

EvilDragon said:


> What are you talking about, third kidney can come EXTREMELY well in handy. Unless you're a teetotaller


I kinda am....My hangovers just last way too long  . But you're right. I could always sell the third kidney, so maybe it wasn't the best comparison.


----------



## Denkii

I was confused what I was listening to.
In the beginning I thought this was a live recording for sure. In between I thought oh that's nice they worked the library in there as well and it sounds very close. Later I just couldn't tell any more.
Very well done.

I second what Vladimir Bulaev suggested. It would be nice to be able to listen to the score only if possible.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Well, isn't this a good problem to have?! I'll be sure to post a video that shows all of Jeff's demo w/ MIDI data so everyone can see for themselves!

In the meantime, I've uploaded a few new demos including Jeff's complete score, a lovely new piece by Steven Cravis that really makes use of the lower strings, and then some alternate versions of Ben Hicks' incredible "Ikigai" using the very agile close mics.


----------



## star.keys

neblix said:


> The documentary score was entirely TSS, no live recordings.


Sorry which score are we referring to? Can’t locate any links within a few posts prior to this one…


----------



## muziksculp

star.keys said:


> Sorry which score are we referring to? Can’t locate any links within a few posts prior to this one…


----------



## muziksculp

amorphosynthesis said:


> This made me pull the trigger.....damn(it's only literaly the 30th string library I purchased)


Congrats ! 

At least you are keeping count, I lost count already


----------



## star.keys

muziksculp said:


>



Very nice 👍🏻


----------



## timbit2006

Andrew Aversa said:


> Well, isn't this a good problem to have?! I'll be sure to post a video that shows all of Jeff's demo w/ MIDI data so everyone can see for themselves!
> 
> In the meantime, I've uploaded a few new demos including Jeff's complete score, a lovely new piece by Steven Cravis that really makes use of the lower strings, and then some alternate versions of Ben Hicks' incredible "Ikigai" using the very agile close mics.



Whoa the close mics sound even better! I'm pretty excited to see how this one works out with virtual spatialization.
That marble room is pretty unique, it'd be really cool to have an IR of it!


----------



## Zoot_Rollo

looks like the pre-order offer is still up.

how long is this good for?


----------



## AEF

Close mics sound awesome. I am glad to hear that legatos are being finessed, as I think they have some room to improve across the board.


----------



## Pier-V

After listening to the latest demos and walkthroughs, I've decided to preorder the library! I don't know how I'll find enough room in my ssd but who cares lol, I'm happier than ever 

I have a question though: should I redeem the codes right now, or is it better to wait the official launch? Sorry if these are trivial questions, but this is the first time I've preordered a Vst...



AEF said:


> Close mics sound awesome


+1 That's exactly what convinced me


----------



## Denkii

You can't redeem them. You'll just get an error in NI Access.
That will work once it's properly released.


----------



## filipjonathan

Pier-V said:


> I have a question though: should I redeem the codes right now, or is it better to wait the official launch? Sorry if these are trivial questions, but this is the first time I've preordered a Vst...




It says it on the product page.


----------



## Pier-V

@filipjonathan Oh yeah, right! I was in a bit of a hurry because I feared the preorder offer would disappear all of a sudden, and I'm also quite sleep deprived at the moment which surely doesn't help thinking straight, so I totally forgot . Thanks for helping!


----------



## filipjonathan

Pier-V said:


> @filipjonathan Oh yeah, right! I was in a bit of a hurry because I feared the preorder offer would disappear all of a sudden, and I'm also quite sleep deprived at the moment which surely doesn't help thinking straight, so I totally forgot . Thanks for helping!


Congrats on preordering it


----------



## timbit2006

Pier-V said:


> @filipjonathan Oh yeah, right! I was in a bit of a hurry because I feared the preorder offer would disappear all of a sudden, and I'm also quite sleep deprived at the moment which surely doesn't help thinking straight, so I totally forgot . Thanks for helping!


Haha you're not alone. I was in such a rush right before 12PM pacific that I forgot to add Mega Brass into my cart before checking out, luckily support fixed my mistake.


----------



## AMBi

The extra detail from the close mic mix on Ben Hicks' Ikigai demo track and soaring nature near the end reminded me a lot of Leftherian Archipelago which was performed by Muroya Strings as well and the library certainly captures the tone.



Ever since this library got announced I've been addicted to revisiting soundtracks they performed for and makes the wait even more exciting!


----------



## muziksculp

AMBi said:


> The extra detail from the close mic mix on Ben Hicks' Ikigai demo track and soaring nature near the end reminded me a lot of Leftherian Archipelago which was performed by Muroya Strings as well and the library certainly captures the tone.
> 
> 
> 
> Ever since this library got announced I've been addicted to revisiting soundtracks they performed for and makes the wait even more exciting!



Hi @AMBi,

Is there an official soundtrack for Xeonoblade Chronicles 2 ? I didn't find it on Amazon, Spotify, or Apple Music. Who is the composer I should search for if it is one composer ? or is there no soundtrack for the game ?

OH..Update : I found the album playlist on YouTube. 

Thanks.


----------



## bfreepro

muziksculp said:


> Hi @AMBi,
> 
> Is there an official soundtrack for Xeonoblade Chronicles 2 ? I didn't find it on Amazon, Spotify, or Apple Music. Who is the composer I should search for if it is one composer ? or is there no soundtrack for the game ?
> 
> Thanks.


I’ve never been able to find it on any of those platforms either, it’s simply unavailable in the US on those platforms (and many other regions I’m assuming). I literally purchased the physical CDs from Amazon. They have multiple versions of it. It’s one of the best scores I’ve heard and absolutely worth it. There are also multiple composers for this OST. It was pretty difficult to find available for purchase.



https://www.ebay.com/itm/115055893645?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=115055893645&targetid=1263104805766&device=m&mktype=&googleloc=9007911&poi=&campaignid=14859008593&mkgroupid=130497710760&rlsatarget=pla-1263104805766&abcId=9300678&merchantid=6296724&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIs9jT4IeZ9AIVGYzICh19UgQqEAQYASABEgL7b_D_BwE








Xenoblade 2 Chronicles Original Soundtrack 5-CD Box Game Music CD NEW nintendo 4582179010166 | eBay


5-CD Box Set.



www.ebay.com






I posted a link you can listen to but of course I highly recommend purchasing either the “selections” album or the full 5 disc anthology to support the artists


----------



## muziksculp

bfreepro said:


> I’ve never been able to find it on any of those platforms either, it’s simply unavailable in the US on those platforms (and many other regions I’m assuming). I literally purchased the physical CDs from Amazon. They have multiple versions of it. It’s one of the best scores I’ve heard and absolutely worth it. There are also multiple composers for this OST. It was pretty difficult to find available for purchase.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/115055893645?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=115055893645&targetid=1263104805766&device=m&mktype=&googleloc=9007911&poi=&campaignid=14859008593&mkgroupid=130497710760&rlsatarget=pla-1263104805766&abcId=9300678&merchantid=6296724&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIs9jT4IeZ9AIVGYzICh19UgQqEAQYASABEgL7b_D_BwE
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Xenoblade 2 Chronicles Original Soundtrack 5-CD Box Game Music CD NEW nintendo 4582179010166 | eBay
> 
> 
> 5-CD Box Set.
> 
> 
> 
> www.ebay.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I posted a link you can listen to but of course I highly recommend purchasing either the “selections” album or the full 5 disc anthology to support the artists



Thanks  

I haven't listened to CD's for a long time, I listen to most of the music streaming these days on my old 2013 Yoga Pro Lenovo Laptop. The HD is pretty tight on space, only 128 GB drive, and it doesn't have a built in CD Drive, so It's not feasible to buy CDs for me at this time, I'm thinking of buying a new Laptop next year. I have an external CD USB drive that I could use to transfer CDs, but again space is tight.


----------



## AMBi

muziksculp said:


> Hi @AMBi,
> 
> Is there an official soundtrack for Xeonoblade Chronicles 2 ? I didn't find it on Amazon, Spotify, or Apple Music. Who is the composer I should search for if it is one composer ? or is there no soundtrack for the game ?
> 
> OH..Update : I found the album playlist on YouTube.
> 
> Thanks.


As Bfree said, there were a lot of composers involved but Yasunori Mitsuda (Chrono Trigger composer) composed most of the bigger cinematic pieces for cutscenes and bosses, while ACE+, Manami Kiyota, and Kenji Hiramatsu composed the area themes, cutscenes and more.
Definitely my favorite soundtrack for it’s strings and is one of the main reasons TSS has been such a dream come true so far

I bought the 5 disc soundtrack on the iTunes store digitally which is still available for $40


----------



## constaneum

Just that Xenoblade Chronicles 2 music is recorded and mixed by different person. Different place also. We'll need to play with the Mic settings as well as reverb to get the similar XC2 sound.


----------



## dhmusic

Andrew Aversa said:


> if you're 50% between two levels, you're hearing two sets of samples blended, which is slightly less natural


I feel so heard and I never even said anything *heart*


----------



## AMBi

constaneum said:


> Just that Xenoblade Chronicles 2 music is recorded and mixed by different person. Different place also. We'll need to play with the Mic settings as well as reverb to get the similar XC2 sound.


Oh I didn’t realize that! Forgot to take the studio into account but yeah some settings and room experimenting can probably get closer

XC2 also uses CSS in some of the tracks blended with live playing for a lusher sound which will help too.


----------



## constaneum

AMBi said:


> Oh I didn’t realize that! Forgot to take the studio into account but yeah some settings and room experimenting can probably get closer
> 
> XC2 also uses CSS in some of the tracks blended with live playing for a lusher sound which will help too.


CSS was layered for XC2? where did you get that source?


----------



## AMBi

constaneum said:


> CSS was layered for XC2? where did you get that source?


Not every song but I remember stumbling upon a google doc somewhere on this forum with a massive source of composer equipment for games. I'll let you know if I can find it!
I wasn’t sure how accurate it was since it didn’t have a citation but I tried comparing the samples with CSS side by side and they lined up really well

Later on it got cited with CSS with an audio example of the library playing a line from the game and they were identical samples.
Gormott (Day) and Gormott (Night) were the confirmed ones on the document though I’ve tried other
songs with legato patches that sounded pretty similar to ones in-game but I could be wrong.

Gormott (Day) has some particularly agile string lines for transitions which CSS sometimes struggles with which is why I suspect some live playing was incorporated too


----------



## Getsumen

AMBi said:


> Not every song but I remember stumbling upon a google doc somewhere on this forum with a massive source of composer equipment for games. I'll let you know if I can find it!
> I wasn’t sure how accurate it was since it didn’t have a citation but I tried comparing the samples with CSS side by side and they lined up really well
> 
> Later on it got cited with CSS with an audio example of the library playing a line from the game and they were identical samples.
> Gormott (Day) and Gormott (Night) were the confirmed ones on the document though I’ve tried other
> songs with legato patches that sounded pretty similar to ones in-game but I could be wrong.
> 
> Gormott (Day) has some particularly agile string lines for transitions which CSS sometimes struggles with which is why I suspect some live playing was incorporated too


Any chance you remember that forum or thread?
Seems like a very interesting resource to look at.


----------



## constaneum

Getsumen said:


> Any chance you remember that forum or thread?
> Seems like a very interesting resource to look at.


indeed. Strings layering is pretty common after all. I wont be surprised if it's done so but Gormott indeed has a strings sound which is different from other tracks. when i first hear the soundtrack months back, i also recognise the CSS similarity sound (the marcato patch) and that piece does sounds like "sample strings". Listening back, i'll say definitely sounds like samples. Makes me wonder why dont use recorded strings for this piece.


----------



## AMBi

Getsumen said:


> Any chance you remember that forum or thread?
> Seems like a very interesting resource to look at.





constaneum said:


> indeed. Strings layering is pretty common after all. I wont be surprised if it's done so but Gormott indeed has a strings sound which is different from other tracks. when i first hear the soundtrack months back, i also recognise the CSS similarity sound (the marcato patch) and that piece does sounds like "sample strings". Listening back, i'll say definitely sounds like samples. Makes me wonder why dont use recorded strings for this piece.


Okay I found the doc in my history!
It has the nighttime variant under Marcato as well but uses the Violin 1 legato patch instead as the lead melody.

[Edit: Oops didn't think it would display like that and I'm not sure how to make it a bare link]


----------



## constaneum

AMBi said:


> Okay I found the doc in my history!
> It has the nighttime variant under Marcato as well but uses the Violin 1 legato patch instead as the lead melody.
> 
> [Edit: Oops didn't think it would display like that and I'm not sure how to make it a bare link]



the night variant sounds purely live recordings. really curious why not use live for day variant too. haha


----------



## storyteller

AMBi said:


> Okay I found the doc in my history!
> It has the nighttime variant under Marcato as well but uses the Violin 1 legato patch instead as the lead melody.
> 
> [Edit: Oops didn't think it would display like that and I'm not sure how to make it a bare link]



For anyone looking for the URL... https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JJBlHHDc65fhZmKUGLrDTLCm6rfUU83-kbuD8Y0zU0o/edit#gid=957135822


----------



## Drundfunk

AMBi said:


> The extra detail from the close mic mix on Ben Hicks' Ikigai demo track and soaring nature near the end reminded me a lot of Leftherian Archipelago which was performed by Muroya Strings as well and the library certainly captures the tone.
> 
> 
> 
> Ever since this library got announced I've been addicted to revisiting soundtracks they performed for and makes the wait even more exciting!



Is it just me or is the flute in this really high? I mean, uncomfortably high? My ears kinda don't like that.


----------



## constaneum

Drundfunk said:


> Is it just me or is the flute in this really high? I mean, uncomfortably high? My ears kinda don't like that.


ironically, somehow this is the flute sound i like. this is what i call the Japanese Flute sound.


----------



## constaneum

This is the same flute sound you hear in FF13 soundtrack.


----------



## Drundfunk

constaneum said:


> ironically, somehow this is the flute sound i like. this is what i call the Japanese Flute sound.


I really don't mind it in the lower register . I don't know, maybe my ears are kinda oversensitive today. It just sounds so ear piercingly high.


----------



## amorphosynthesis

Is it me or that thread has been completely derailed?


----------



## dzilizzi

No. It has gotten off topic. But it started out talking about the potential sound/uses for this library. So a Japanese style game music discussion does fit. 

Now talking about how much we like sushi, would be way off topic. And, until it's released, it is likely there will be more off topic discussions to keep the thread current.


----------



## gedlig

Sushi scoring strings does sound like an enticing project 😅


----------



## thorwald

gedlig said:


> Sushi scoring strings does sound like an enticing project 😅


I mean, who wouldn't love sushi in Tokyo, especially with strings attached? 😀 I bet you anything it would have a huge impact.

TSS being my first preorder, I realize that the wait is the worst, especially when you preorder right when it starts, but there's nothing more comforting than the fact that the longer you wait, the better it will sound in the end. For that, I'm fine with months of sushi too ☺️


----------



## bfreepro

amorphosynthesis said:


> Is it me or that thread has been completely derailed?


Welcome to VI Control


----------



## EvilDragon

thorwald said:


> For that, I'm fine with months of sushi too


You mean months of ramen.


----------



## Trash Panda

EvilDragon said:


> You mean months of ramen.


Sushi-flavored Ramen. 















*vomits*


----------



## Andrew Aversa

As mentioned, we are really happy to have @Sarah Mancuso on our development team going forward and are doing an upgrade of the legato performances. _Most_ of our code and work isn't going anywhere; the samples/recordings are the same, and the fundamentals of speed profiles, offsets, etc. are all intact. 

To get a little technical, what we (mostly Sarah!) are specifically doing now is:

* Fine-tuning the curvature of the crossfades (rather than default linear fades)
* Adjusting group and zone-level volume to make sure transitions sound good at all dynamics and vibrato types
* Adjusting EQ for certain groups to blend better with transitions
* Repeated testing at different tempos, and with different styles, to make sure it all sounds good in real-world usage


----------



## Trash Panda

Andrew Aversa said:


> As mentioned, we are really happy to have @Sarah Mancuso on our development team going forward and are doing an upgrade of the legato performances. _Most_ of our code and work isn't going anywhere; the samples/recordings are the same, and the fundamentals of speed profiles, offsets, etc. are all intact.
> 
> To get a little technical, what we (mostly Sarah!) are specifically doing now is:
> 
> * Fine-tuning the curvature of the crossfades (rather than default linear fades)
> * Adjusting group and zone-level volume to make sure transitions sound good at all dynamics and vibrato types
> * Adjusting EQ for certain groups to blend better with transitions
> * Repeated testing at different tempos, and with different styles, to make sure it all sounds good in real-world usage


----------



## molemac

Trash Panda said:


> Sushi-flavored Ramen.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *vomits*


I always thought Sashimi Scoring Strings sounded better


----------



## Denkii

Midnight Diner Scoring Tools


----------



## molemac

molemac said:


> I always thought Sashimi Scoring Strings sounded better


Sticking with SSS , this was my original suggestion, Samurai Scoring Strings, although might be better for a Brass library , Samurai Soaring (or Swording ) Brass , a bit more butch.


----------



## ism

Andrew Aversa said:


> As mentioned, we are really happy to have @Sarah Mancuso on our development team going forward and are doing an upgrade of the legato performances. _Most_ of our code and work isn't going anywhere; the samples/recordings are the same, and the fundamentals of speed profiles, offsets, etc. are all intact.
> 
> To get a little technical, what we (mostly Sarah!) are specifically doing now is:
> 
> * Fine-tuning the curvature of the crossfades (rather than default linear fades)
> * Adjusting group and zone-level volume to make sure transitions sound good at all dynamics and vibrato types
> * Adjusting EQ for certain groups to blend better with transitions
> * Repeated testing at different tempos, and with different styles, to make sure it all sounds good in real-world usage


Very excited to hear this. Sarah's work entirely speaks for itself of course, and I've personally found it transformative, specifically with regards to a certain other product, but more generally in how I even think about the expressive possibilities of legato. (And not just on a technical level.)

TSS was already sounding great, but ISW really has my attention now.


----------



## Loïc D

Andrew Aversa said:


> As mentioned, we are really happy to have @Sarah Mancuso on our development team going forward and are doing an upgrade of the legato performances. _Most_ of our code and work isn't going anywhere; the samples/recordings are the same, and the fundamentals of speed profiles, offsets, etc. are all intact.
> 
> To get a little technical, what we (mostly Sarah!) are specifically doing now is:
> 
> * Fine-tuning the curvature of the crossfades (rather than default linear fades)
> * Adjusting group and zone-level volume to make sure transitions sound good at all dynamics and vibrato types
> * Adjusting EQ for certain groups to blend better with transitions
> * Repeated testing at different tempos, and with different styles, to make sure it all sounds good in real-world usage


That’s super good for you and us since Sarah has supernatural scripting powers 
Can’t wait, can’t wait


----------



## dzilizzi

molemac said:


> Sticking with SSS , this was my original suggestion, Samurai Scoring Strings, although might be better for a Brass library , Samurai Soaring (or Swording ) Brass , a bit more butch.


Hmmm SSS sounds oddly familiar. I'm thinking Tokyo Sushi Strings would be better.....


----------



## jason3.14

dzilizzi said:


> Hmmm SSS sounds oddly familiar. I'm thinking Tokyo Sushi Strings would be better.....


I think as long as we don't go with *A*nime *S*coring *S*trings, we will be OK...


----------



## gedlig

jason3.14 said:


> I think as long as we don't go with *A*nime *S*coring *S*trings, we will be OK...


何？？


----------



## Trash Panda

jason3.14 said:


> I think as long as we don't go with *A*nime *S*coring *S*trings, we will be OK...


NANI???


----------



## moon

I’ve always found it weird how people gravitate towards sushi, ramen, samurai, ninjas, and anime for suggesting names for anything related to Japan (or Asia in general sometimes). I think we should rename other libraries based on where they’re made. Hot chicken scoring strings. Spitfire colonialism strings. Eminent domain brass. Lederhosen winds.


----------



## Getsumen

moon said:


> I’ve always found it weird how people gravitate towards sushi, ramen, samurai, ninjas, and anime for suggesting names for anything related to Japan (or Asia in general sometimes). I think we should rename other libraries based on where they’re made. Hot chicken scoring strings. Spitfire colonialism strings. Eminent domain brass. Lederhosen winds.


ok but in this case TSS makes sense because the whole point was using the players and the room that are commonly used in Japanese game and animation.

The rest of the people is just them having good fun (I mean the whole chain started from someone commenting how the thread had gone off-topic). Just people occupying themselves so they can ignore the crushing existential dread of not having TSS on their SSD.


----------



## moon

Getsumen said:


> ok but in this case TSS makes sense because the whole point was using the players and the room that are commonly used in Japanese game and animation.
> 
> The rest of the people is just them having good fun (I mean the whole chain started from someone commenting how the thread had gone off-topic). Just people occupying themselves so they can ignore the crushing existential dread of not having TSS on their SSD.


I have no problem with the name TSS, it just tells you where it’s made. And of course I’m hyped to have it, it sounds incredible. I’ve just grown really weary of everything Japan related being drawn back to what I said earlier.


----------



## neblix

It mostly certainly is a valid point that a lot of japanese culture portrayal around the world is often fantastical in that way, yes.

We prefer to draw more on the traditional japanese aesthetic rather than drawing on ideas from games or anime, which is why we had our logo (that violin you see in a lot of our branding) designed by Natalie Seki, who was trained in calligraphy. Previously, the idea was floated that we could style the logo like a Final Fantasy title and I was on the side of voting "no".

While games and anime are essentially responsible for the appeal of the sound we're capturing with TSS, this library is still somewhat of a matter of national pride for Japan as the first major VI representation of their orchestral sound on the world stage. So if we were to market the library with, say, its entire branding being a game reference, or having an anime character mascot, I think it would undermine the seriousness of putting the Japanese orchestral studio sound (specifically, Tokyo) as a serious contender up against the likes of Hollywood, London, Berlin, etc.

My own personal view of the situation, anyway.


----------



## Loïc D

I’m very glad the way TSS is done.
I’ve always been fond of that sound of japanese orchestra and especially strings. There’s something very special not found in other countries.
I was wondering why there’s no sample library on the market for this.
But to be honest I was a bit afraid that such a product would suffer of the « made by Japanese for Japanese » syndrom often found in the Japanese culture in innovations.

So to me TSS is the ideal breeding of that Japanese sound with Western engineering.
Can’t wait to get my hands on this, I’ve already a couple of tracks crying for it (for example : a 80s vintage asian pop mockup I’m writing for a musical).


----------



## moon

neblix said:


> It mostly certainly is a valid point that a lot of japanese culture portrayal around the world is often fantastical in that way, yes.
> 
> We prefer to draw more on the traditional japanese aesthetic rather than drawing on ideas from games or anime, which is why we had our logo (that violin you see in a lot of our branding) designed by Natalie Seki, who was trained in calligraphy. Previously, the idea was floated that we could style the logo like a Final Fantasy title and I was on the side of voting "no".
> 
> While games and anime are essentially responsible for the appeal of the sound we're capturing with TSS, this library is still somewhat of a matter of national pride for Japan as the first major VI representation of their orchestral sound on the world stage. So if we were to market the library with, say, its entire branding being a game reference, or having an anime character mascot, I think it would undermine the seriousness of putting the Japanese orchestral studio sound (specifically, Tokyo) as a serious contender up against the likes of Hollywood, London, Berlin, etc.
> 
> My own personal view of the situation, anyway.


Thank you for your explanation and mindfulness. I do want to clarify that my beef is not with ISW in the slightest, just with those that comment things that can come across poorly. I hate seeing Asian culture treated as a novelty, so ISW approaching this library with respect and seriousness is really a great thing to see.


----------



## dzilizzi

moon said:


> I’ve always found it weird how people gravitate towards sushi, ramen, samurai, ninjas, and anime for suggesting names for anything related to Japan (or Asia in general sometimes). I think we should rename other libraries based on where they’re made. Hot chicken scoring strings. Spitfire colonialism strings. Eminent domain brass. Lederhosen winds.


There was another big library that came out 2 years ago. While waiting for it, there was probably 10 pages of discussion on Christmas chocolates that regularly show up in British households. So food, as a discussion during waiting for a library to show up, is normal here at VI-C


----------



## moon

dzilizzi said:


> There was another big library that came out 2 years ago. While waiting for it, there was probably 10 pages of discussion on Christmas chocolates that regularly show up in British households. So food, as a discussion during waiting for a library to show up, is normal here at VI-C


I think there's a bit of a difference between Brits chatting about their own food and non-Japanese people chatting about the most stereotypical aspects of Japanese culture.


----------



## Pier-V

@neblix As much as I love all of the great things listed above, the idea of portraying TSS the way you chose is wise and respectful.


neblix said:


> we had our logo (that violin you see in a lot of our branding) designed by Natalie Seki, who was trained in calligraphy


For those who might not be familiar with Japanese calligraphy, let me just say it isn't just cool writing(/drawing). It's a serious discipline that requires years of training, where every little gesture is a statement. Very fascinating topic.


----------



## dzilizzi

Pier-V said:


> @neblix As much as I love all of the great things listed above, the idea of portraying TSS the way you chose is wise and respectful.
> 
> For those who might not be familiar with Japanese calligraphy, let me just say it isn't just cool writing(/drawing). It's a serious discipline that requires years of training, where every little gesture is a statement. Very fascinating topic.


It is very beautiful and done with a brush, which is not as easy as using a calligraphy pen. More like painting the letters.


----------



## Saxer

moon said:


> Lederhosen winds.


I experienced Lederhosen winds live. It's nothing you should wait for...

It's always a thin line between a good connection and an insult when using clichés. The difference is mostly defined by the viewing angle. Though I really love clichés when used in a self ironic context.


----------



## molemac

moon said:


> I think there's a bit of a difference between Brits chatting about their own food and non-Japanese people chatting about the most stereotypical aspects of Japanese culture.


The best version of that was when the Kumars did a spoof on the British obsessing about curry. Five bored Indians around the table on a Sunday night ‘ shall we go for an English?’ 

Having said that what about a new thread starter Bollywood string library name suggestions.


----------



## thorwald

moon said:


> Thank you for your explanation and mindfulness. I do want to clarify that my beef is not with ISW in the slightest, just with those that comment things that can come across poorly. I hate seeing Asian culture treated as a novelty, so ISW approaching this library with respect and seriousness is really a great thing to see.


I think the moment you stop experiencing a culture as a novelty is when you start treating it like it's for granted.

Every single culture is like waking up to a new day, it should be treated with awe and respect.

On the other hand, there is a huge difference between novelty and stereotypes, as well as how stereotypes are interpreted, i.e. the way a comedian might use self-deprecating humor, or as an insult to suggest that another, non-stereotypical way is less inferior.

I think if anyone is interested in this library, and there are quite a lot of people, they are certainly aware that such a release exists not to bring the Japanese string sound closer in an imagined way, but rather to bring it closer as is, the way it's meant to be experienced. In a few years, or even less, it's very likely that this sound will be a stereotypical one among western composers, but that's how popular things end up for people who don't have much exposure to anything else, e.g. the cimbalom for non-Hungarians.

In this context, neither sushi, samurai, or ramen is projecting a disrespectful view of any Asian culture, nor was this the aim of "those that comment things that can come across poorly" in my humble opinion. Not to mention that this would be quite hypocritical on the grounds of using a product imbued with the very same culture.


----------



## moon

thorwald said:


> I think the moment you stop experiencing a culture as a novelty is when you start treating it like it's for granted.
> 
> Every single culture is like waking up to a new day, it should be treated with awe and respect.
> 
> On the other hand, there is a huge difference between novelty and stereotypes, as well as how stereotypes are interpreted, i.e. the way a comedian might use self-deprecating humor, or as an insult to suggest that another, non-stereotypical way is less inferior.
> 
> I think if anyone is interested in this library, and there are quite a lot of people, they are certainly aware that such a release exists not to bring the Japanese string sound closer in an imagined way, but rather to bring it closer as is, the way it's meant to be experienced. In a few years, or even less, it's very likely that this sound will be a stereotypical one among western composers, but that's how popular things end up for people who don't have much exposure to anything else, e.g. the cimbalom for non-Hungarians.
> 
> In this context, neither sushi, samurai, or ramen is projecting a disrespectful view of any Asian culture, nor was this the aim of "those that comment things that can come across poorly" in my humble opinion. Not to mention that this would be quite hypocritical on the grounds of using a product imbued with the very same culture.


I don't think there's a link between treating a culture as a novelty and taking it for granted, and there's certainly no link between novelty and respect. I've lived in a "novel" culture and location for basically my whole life. The sheer ridiculousness, callousness, and disrespect of people who visit never ceases to astound me. They treat my home as some sort of playground, like a virtual reality that they escape to where their choices don't have consequences. When I'm not home and people learn where I'm from, I get asked the most ridiculous questions. "Do you have electricity?" "Do you all live in grass huts?" Of course, these people don't mean it in a malicious way, but that's what their impression of the place is - an uncivilized (but beautiful!) land filled with uncivilized people.

Similarly, I've always been an "other". I'm ethnically east Asian (as you may have gathered), and once again, the amount of bigotry and innocent stereotyping my compatriots and I have to endure is ridiculous. What has my culture been reduced to? Ramen, sushi, ninjas, samurai, anime, JRPG video games, and being the kid who's good at math. And those are the nice ones. Never mind the other east Asian cultures, since no one knows much of anything about them anyway. So comments like these, while not intended as disrespect, are still damaging to people and their perception in modern culture.

Anyway, I don't mean to keep clogging up this thread with this topic. I'm very excited about the release of TSS, and as I said before, I'm incredibly grateful that ISW has approached this library with the respect that it deserves.


----------



## thorwald

moon said:


> So comments like these, while not intended as disrespect, are still damaging to people and their perception in modern culture.


Perhaps not on this level, but I have had similar encounters. Without derailing this topic, novelty is the cause of why people see a culture as something new, rather than putting it under the rug of stereotypes that they are aware of, thus taking it for granted.

The problem is when someone accepts that stereotypes define a culture, i.e. if to anyone Japanese culture is all about the samurai, or it is about nothing else but sushi.

Had these comments suggested such a view, which I don't believe they did, they could be damaging if one believes them. But of course credibility is always an important factor, so is anyone's wish to stay ignorant rather than expose themselves to authentic information. Sometimes even documentaries fail to do this unfortunately.

Based on just this topic, for example, I could have a false perception that in Japan, the only string sound you will find is what Tokyo Scoring Strings has.



moon said:


> I'm very excited about the release of TSS, and as I said before, I'm incredibly grateful that ISW has approached this library with the respect that it deserves.


The same here, but of course that's what I expected from ISW. 😀


----------



## gedlig

Well, for what it's worth, I have a long lasting interest in Japan, I've been learning japanese for a pretty long time, am really interested in old japanese that was written in manyougana, do know a fair bit regarding historic, economic, political, musical, cultural things (have also written a few term papers in university when I could choose my own topic (and not only Japan, but east and southeast Asia)). And where I'm from, making jokes inserting our national foods is pretty common place, so [Food] Scoring Strings wouldn't be something completely out of place here (I could've written Natto Scoring Strings for all I care, it's just a natural type of joke that comes to mind following up previous posts). Doesn't mean a whole country is reduced to a couple of foodstuffs. Joking doesn't mean disrespect (like some like to believe)  and nobody is stopping you from making counter jokes. It's all just banter at the end of the day.

Also I do believe in jokes without limits, and if someone gets offended, it's basically their own problem, so YMMV. At one point we had the highest um.. cease to exist rate in the world and we still make jokes on that topic, lol.


----------



## EvilDragon

gedlig said:


> At one point we had the highest um.. cease to exist rate in the world and we still make jokes on that topic,



They say there's safety in numbers...

[/JIMMYCARR]


----------



## Pier-V

I'm curious about an important detail I think nobody has mentioned yet. From TSS product page on ISW ofiicial site:



> _Note: All articulations below are true, unique recordings, not created by re-pitching or processing other samples!_


Then a looong list starts and at the bottom we have this:



> Releases - natural, excited, and staccato


I guess it's safe to assume these are real recorded samples? Having three different release types can be easily overlooked, but for a series of reasons this could be EXTREMELY useful in some circumstances.
If I remember correctly one of the walkthroughs mentioned the releases but didn't go into all the details - in what they differ exactly?


----------



## Zelos

So, I pre-ordered the library and was wondering if you're planning to have some presets in there that are kind of close to existing soundtracks. Since you're already marketing the library with a long list of video games, it might make sense to have presets to replicate those right off the bat.


----------



## neblix

Pier-V said:


> I'm curious about an important detail I think nobody has mentioned yet. From TSS product page on ISW ofiicial site:
> 
> 
> Then a looong list starts and at the bottom we have this:
> 
> 
> I guess it's safe to assume these are real recorded samples? Having three different release types can be easily overlooked, but for a series of reasons this could be EXTREMELY useful in some circumstances.
> If I remember correctly one of the walkthroughs mentioned the releases but didn't go into all the details - in what they differ exactly?


This is probably a formatting mistake they overlooked. The Release types are created by cutting different articulations, so in this case, they are made from other samples. This is always the case with release triggers, as normal release noises are always cut from the ending of the standard notes (in the case of strings, the arco). In this case, we just cut a few different types for you to make use of.

So they are completely different sample sets, but sourced from the existing articulations we have (i.e. it's not 4 sets of the same samples with processing or envelopes but 4 distinct sets of release noises).


----------



## amorphosynthesis

So....any news on the eta and the time line? Any new videos? Anything? I have seen the preorder price has gone up to 399$.


----------



## scoringdreams

Not sure if this has been covered in the many pages of the thread, but will there be a solo strings release following TSS?


----------



## AMBi

scoringdreams said:


> Not sure if this has been covered in the many pages of the thread, but will there be a solo strings release following TSS?


----------



## bfreepro

amorphosynthesis said:


> So....any news on the eta and the time line? Any new videos? Anything? I have seen the preorder price has gone up to 399$.





neblix said:


> Yes, the library is actually already encoded by NI as of yesterday! We are waiting for their approval on NKS compatibility checks (mandatory for Kontakt Player libraries).
> 
> While we're waiting, we're actually spending the waiting time looking at the legatos again and digging deeper into specific profiles and articulations (as many people have noticed, our Cello Legato Slur is a bit of a weak link). We figure if there is time, it should be spent.
> 
> So the legatos on release day should sound even better than what you hear in the "Sonic Overview". And at this rate, an early December release is basically 100% guaranteed, we just can't give a 100% specific day until we're fully in the clear.


Says right here. The library has been passed on to NI, so everyone is at their mercy while they do what they do to ensure quality for NKS. From what I’ve gathered working with devs, they (Native Instruments) don’t just come and say “okay it will be ready on this date”, it’s just… whenever they’re done lol.

There are at least three amazing videos on this library already, which are super in-depth and informative.

The pre order price was supposed to end like a week ago as well, so everyone actually got some extra time there. Not a bad thing if you ask me. Now the pre order price period has ended, hence the $399.


----------



## neblix

NI did just send us a feedback report with some small approval blockers (things like negative values displaying as “0.-2 instead of -0.2” for a control or the keyrange having one extra note than it’s supposed to) and the issues have been fixed, so we’re sending back a new build for final approval. If it’s not clear, these issues were quite easy to fix, and if they were the only ones in the way, we’re basically set.

Sarah is on track to finish her new legato profiles pretty soon.

The date will be posted whenever Andrew feels it’s ready to post. But if you want my off-the-cuff answer, it’s probably no later than December 8th (but likely earlier).


----------



## filipjonathan

neblix said:


> NI did just send us a feedback report with some small approval blockers (things like negative values displaying as “0.-2 instead of -0.2” for a control or the keyrange having one extra note than it’s supposed to) and the issues have been fixed, so we’re sending back a new build for final approval. If it’s not clear, these issues were quite easy to fix, and if they were the only ones in the way, we’re basically set.
> 
> Sarah is on track to finish her new legato profiles pretty soon.
> 
> The date will be posted whenever Andrew feels it’s ready to post. But if you want my off-the-cuff answer, it’s probably no later than December 8th (but likely earlier).


Such good news!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

For clarity: We decided to leave preorders open leading up to release date, just with regular intro pricing ($399) as opposed to the 'early bird' pricing ($349) that many here enjoyed.

As soon as we hear back from NI again I'll have enough confidence to post the specific release date.

Otherwise, we've added a number of demos to the player, and as soon as Sarah finishes her legato pass (aided by Nabeel's excellent feature and bugfix work) we'll be re-rendering some existing works (including the Sonic Overview video) and new videos will go underway too.


----------



## neblix

I don't think people are quite fully prepared for how much better she has gotten the legatos to sound. With these in place, I'm ready to start drafting the script for and then recording the Lookahead tutorial (I may have been greedily delaying my work on it until the new legato update).


----------



## chrisav

neblix said:


> I don't think people are quite fully prepared for how much better she has gotten the legatos to sound. With these in place, I'm ready to start drafting the script for and then recording the Lookahead tutorial (I may have been greedily delaying my work on it until the new legato update).


After Adachi, I'm not surprised to hear you say that, but oh Lord am I ready to hear it in action!!


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> I don't think people are quite fully prepared for how much better she has gotten the legatos to sound.


Exactly why I was so excited, and happy she joined your team.

Yes, her Legato work on the ADACHI version of 8dio's strings speaks for itself as to how much her work improved these old libraries.

Now with TSS, I'm expecting nothing short of seeing my Jaw drop to the floor, once I hear some of the new TSS legatos in demos. I know you will end up having one of the best sounding string libraries on the market, not just the legatos, but everything else it offers.


----------



## RMH

@Andrew Aversa @neblix 
It's the library I'm looking forward to the most this year.
*I need more a demo or walkthrough in the style of Fast run*. 
Legato has already fully explained its value with a demo.

ex)


----------



## Zanshin

Maybe it would be in better taste to link some actual real string passages you want to emulate instead of competing products?


----------



## rottoy

neblix said:


> In the future, we could possibly mix down a separate "Spot" position to get the individual ensemble mono mic positions from the sessions. It'll take some experimenting, and perhaps be a separate NKI.


----------



## lzcmusic

neblix said:


> I don't think people are quite fully prepared for how much better she has gotten the legatos to sound. With these in place, I'm ready to start drafting the script for and then recording the Lookahead tutorial (I may have been greedily delaying my work on it until the new legato update).


Will ISW upgrade Bravura Scoring Brass in the future? For example, adding NKS and Console.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

lzcmusic said:


> Will ISW upgrade Bravura Scoring Brass in the future? For example, adding NKS and Console.


Yes, that's the plan.


----------



## neblix

Exciting news for our 1.1 update; we began experimenting with a new method of creating *much more authentic runs*, with all the minor inconsistencies, wavers and blurs that give live runs such a huge edge over sampled attempts.

After 1.0 is launched, we'll be happy to keep updating the thread with progress, and we'll show some teasers of the new Runs sound. Please look forward to it!


----------



## Trash Panda

neblix said:


> Exciting news for our 1.1 update; we began experimenting with a new method of creating *much more authentic runs*, with all the minor inconsistencies, wavers and blurs that give live runs such a huge edge over sampled attempts.
> 
> After 1.0 is launched, we'll be happy to keep updating the thread with progress, and we'll show some teasers of the new Runs sound. Please look forward to it!


@muziksculp will now add you to his spreadsheet of updates to chase you on at a regular basis and the library isn't even out yet.


----------



## Trash Panda

On a more serious note, is there any consideration of building in a button for the "transposition trick" should we want to have the effect of doubling the ensemble size for a future update?


----------



## jason3.14

Best VI control thread! :D


----------



## filipjonathan

neblix said:


> Exciting news for our 1.1 update; we began experimenting with a new method of creating *much more authentic runs*, with all the minor inconsistencies, wavers and blurs that give live runs such a huge edge over sampled attempts.
> 
> After 1.0 is launched, we'll be happy to keep updating the thread with progress, and we'll show some teasers of the new Runs sound. Please look forward to it!


Oh gosh, the library isn't even out and I'm already looking forward to the update


----------



## neblix

Trash Panda said:


> On a more serious note, is there any consideration of building in a button for the "transposition trick" should we want to have the effect of doubling the ensemble size for a future update?


I would say such a feature kinda goes against the mission of the library (which showcases the specific size and dimension of Muroya strings in Sound City), but it isn’t impossible to script. We already have an optional neighbor RR for arcos (which imo, doesn’t sound very good by itself) so we could reuse the note borrow code from that. We’ll consider it in the future. It certainly would be an easy way to turn TSS into a “Hollywood” sound, making the library even more versatile.


----------



## mybadmemory

So which accompanying libraries will you guys here use for the rest of the orchestra and other instruments, until the Tokyo series is completed? :D


----------



## Trash Panda

mybadmemory said:


> So which accompanying libraries will you guys here use for the rest of the orchestra and other instruments, until the Tokyo series is completed? :D









Which Brass Library to pair with Tokyo Scoring Strings?


Hey guys! I know TSS isn't released yet, but the Japanese sound has been around for a while and judging by the demos, it really does capture that sound. I'm getting this library as soon as pre-orders become available and it will be my first string library. After some (too much) time spent...




vi-control.net


----------



## mybadmemory

Trash Panda said:


> Which Brass Library to pair with Tokyo Scoring Strings?
> 
> 
> Hey guys! I know TSS isn't released yet, but the Japanese sound has been around for a while and judging by the demos, it really does capture that sound. I'm getting this library as soon as pre-orders become available and it will be my first string library. After some (too much) time spent...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vi-control.net


Right! Forgot about that one!


----------



## tonio_

Trash Panda said:


> Which Brass Library to pair with Tokyo Scoring Strings?
> 
> 
> Hey guys! I know TSS isn't released yet, but the Japanese sound has been around for a while and judging by the demos, it really does capture that sound. I'm getting this library as soon as pre-orders become available and it will be my first string library. After some (too much) time spent...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> vi-control.net


My thread! :D


----------



## Terry93D

Undoubtedly I'll be pairing it with the Infinite Brass and Winds.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Native Instruments has fully encoded the library and we've passed QA, so...

*We're pleased to announce Tokyo Scoring Strings will release on December 8th!*


----------



## Nimrod7

Andrew Aversa said:


> *We're pleased to announce Tokyo Scoring Strings will release on December 8th!*


Exciting news! Congrats!!
Not for me, that's the day I return to work, and now my mind will not be there for sure!


----------



## tonio_

Andrew Aversa said:


> Native Instruments has fully encoded the library and we've passed QA, so...
> 
> *We're pleased to announce Tokyo Scoring Strings will release on December 8th!*


Can't wait!


----------



## Terry93D

HYPE! I'm very, very excited.


----------



## filipjonathan

Yaaaay!


----------



## mohsohsenshi

Andrew Aversa said:


> Native Instruments has fully encoded the library and we've passed QA, so...
> 
> *We're pleased to announce Tokyo Scoring Strings will release on December 8th!*


Hoooooray!!!


----------



## muziksculp

December 8th 

@Andrew Aversa _*Congratulations ! *_


----------



## jason3.14

Andrew Aversa said:


> Native Instruments has fully encoded the library and we've passed QA, so...
> 
> *We're pleased to announce Tokyo Scoring Strings will release on December 8th!*


Congratulations Andrew!! Monstrous Turtles represent! (Will be very happy if anyone understands the reference)


----------



## neblix

jason3.14 said:


> Congratulations Andrew!! Monstrous Turtles represent! (Will be very happy if anyone understands the reference)


I do.


----------



## Brasart

I'll probably pick up TSS in the next year or so, but I can't wait to hear what you guys do with it, I'm quite jealous of those of you who get to play with it starting december 8!


----------



## TonyZem

Brasart said:


> I'll probably pick up TSS in the next year or so, but I can't wait to hear what you guys do with it, I'm quite jealous of those of you who get to play with it starting december 8!


+1


----------



## moon

I see the release has been changed to December 8th now.


----------



## MikeLG

Andrew Aversa said:


> Native Instruments has fully encoded the library and we've passed QA, so...
> 
> *We're pleased to announce Tokyo Scoring Strings will release on December 8th!*


Hooray! I've been looking forward to this one for a while. Can't wait!


----------



## muziksculp

moon said:


> I see the release has been changed to December 8th now.


Good catch. I hope they don't keep moving it forward to drive us crazy.


----------



## jason3.14

muziksculp said:


> Good catch. I hope they don't keep moving it forward to drive us crazy.


----------



## Zanshin

muziksculp said:


> Good catch. I hope they don't keep moving it forward to drive us crazy.


Well the Pearl Harbor thing was an unfortunate coincidence, better optics to move it a day. No big really.


----------



## biggiantcircles

jason3.14 said:


> Congratulations Andrew!! Monstrous Turtles represent! (Will be very happy if anyone understands the reference)


----------



## jason3.14

Zanshin said:


> Well the Pearl Harbor thing was an unfortunate coincidence, better optics to move it a day. No big really.


Oh... didn't realize until you mentioned that that's what previous comments were alluding to.


----------



## Futchibon

Andrew Aversa said:


> Native Instruments has fully encoded the library and we've passed QA, so...
> 
> *We're pleased to announce Tokyo Scoring Strings will release on December 8th!*


@Andrew Aversa will the EDU code work when the intro price ends and it goes to $449? Isn't working atm for the current price. Cheers


----------



## muziksculp

@Andrew Aversa ,

While we wait for the official release of TSS on Dec. 8th, how about posting a few new demos, if that is possible, especially showing the new Legato articulations that you were working on enhancing with Sarah, and the rest of your team, plus more demos of the other articulations, shorts, trems, pizz, harmonics, ..etc. 

Thanks


----------



## timbit2006

Hmmm what a strange coincidence. This is a good omen for sure.


----------



## constaneum

moon said:


> I see the release has been changed to December 8th now.


is it a Chinese thingy? Us Chinese loves 8. 8 means 发财 (get rich). haha


----------



## jason3.14

constaneum said:


> is it a Chinese thingy? Us Chinese loves 8. 8 means 发财 (get rich). haha


While also nice, I'd suspect it's maybe more the unfortunate coincidence Zanshin mentioned? :/ Although if it were 8/8 I'd be convinced!


----------



## muziksculp

jason3.14 said:


> While also nice, I'd suspect it's maybe more the unfortunate coincidence Zanshin mentioned? :/ Although if it were 8/8 I'd be convinced!


Yes, that happened on Dec. 7th, so the 8th would be more considerate with respect to that. Especially that it's only a 1 day delay.


----------



## filipjonathan

jason3.14 said:


> Although if it were 8/8


Ooo my birthday! :D


----------



## jason3.14

Anyone else wanna join me in rereading this thread from page 1 to help pass the time until Dec. 8?


----------



## timbit2006

jason3.14 said:


> Anyone else wanna join me in rereading this thread from page 1 to help pass the time until Dec. 8?


someone should make an audiobook of the thread


----------



## MikeLG

One week to go! What's everyone going to do with the library as their first project? I'm probably going to try my hand at some mock ups of existing pieces in the Japanese style and see what I can do.


----------



## jason3.14

MikeLG said:


> One week to go! What's everyone going to do with the library as their first project? I'm probably going to try my hand at some mock ups of existing pieces in the Japanese style and see what I can do.


Yea that's my plan! Maybe Octopath.


----------



## jason3.14

constaneum said:


> if i'm not mistaken, Andrew mentioned it's in the plan for the rest of the series. He mentioned either in discord or this thread that the next focus will be the drum sound of Hiroyuki Sawano





Trash Panda said:


> Paging @jason3.14



and good thing i'm re-reading so i can finally see your page almost 4 months late LOL


----------



## constaneum

timbit2006 said:


> someone should make an audiobook of the thread


Are we going to start with "Once upon a time...?"


----------



## jeremyr

timbit2006 said:


> someone should make an audiobook of the thread


Or a light novel: That Time I Got Reincarnated as a String Library


----------



## EvilDragon

jeremyr said:


> That Time I Got Reincarnated as a String Library


Hilarious


----------



## Getsumen

jeremyr said:


> Or a light novel: That Time I Got Reincarnated as a String Library


The number of string libs will soon outpace the amount of isekai LN


----------



## tonio_

MikeLG said:


> One week to go! What's everyone going to do with the library as their first project? I'm probably going to try my hand at some mock ups of existing pieces in the Japanese style and see what I can do.


I'm going to do some weird hybrid cover of Duel of the Fates with some big fat 808s, synths and Polyphia style guitars... And an hybrid orchestral cover of Playground from Arcane in more or less the same style probably. Definitely.


----------



## filipjonathan

tonio_ said:


> I'm going to do some weird hybrid cover of Duel of the Fates with some big fat 808s, synths and Polyphia style guitars... And an hybrid orchestral cover of Playground from Arcane in more or less the same style probably. Definitely.


I'd like to hear that.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

We've just updated our Sonic Overview/Patch Walkthrough video to reflect the revised legatos! (Also, adjusted the voice/music volume to be a bit better)


----------



## rottoy

Andrew Aversa said:


> We've just updated our Sonic Overview/Patch Walkthrough video to reflect the revised legatos! (Also, adjusted the voice/music volume to be a bit better)



Hell yeah, that's what I'm talking about!
Well done on the legato profile revision, @Sarah Mancuso!
And well done, team! <3


----------



## filipjonathan

Andrew Aversa said:


> We've just updated our Sonic Overview/Patch Walkthrough video to reflect the revised legatos! (Also, adjusted the voice/music volume to be a bit better)



Niceee!


----------



## MA-Simon

Imho still not very musical. Was hoping for more flowing, warm strings. Maybe just the demo phrases though. Still looking forward to the release on the 8. A bit of trepidation remains.


----------



## antames

Curious how others will find this library. Not sure I'm sold yet on the sound of the legato. It sounds more like sustains between notes. Anyway, great work by all involved and still excited by it nonetheless.


----------



## muziksculp

New TSS DEMOS would be very appreciated.


----------



## muziksculp

I was expecting a warmer, more flowing violins sound that I hear in Japanese Anime scores, what I heard in the video was very different.

I think posting a few new Audio Demos that show how TSS sounds in some compositions would be a very wise step at this time.

Thanks.


----------



## Evans

muziksculp said:


> I was expecting a warmer, more flowing violins sound that I hear in Japanese Anime scores


Got an example of what you have in mind?


----------



## muziksculp

Evans said:


> Got an example of what you have in mind?


Well, this is a TSS demo, but listen to how warm, and flowing the violins, violas sound. More of this type of demos, with some comments on the reverb/s used. Reverb plays a huge role in adding the right sound of the Japanese Anime sound. Without it, it's more a pop/rock type of string sound, which isn't what I want to use TSS for. 

The last video posted above, has none of the sound in the demo below. It's like a totally different library.


----------



## MA-Simon

Probably this for flowing strings. Just such a lovely sound. Especially that vibrato.


----------



## neblix

It should be mentioned ISW does not have any dedicated demo writers on staff, so it's probably not likely before Dec 8 (all demos currently available are from people who tested and shared their results). Just providing context, while we agree that more demos is a good way to showcase the library more. My own schedule leading to Dec 8 is packed with preparing the Lookahead tutorial, and also exploring a last optimization we can do to considerably drop the RAM load of the patches.

I do know there are some unrevealed demos that have yet to be revealed, and some old demos will be re-rendered, but I don't know specifics beyond!


----------



## muziksculp

neblix said:


> It should be mentioned ISW does not have any dedicated demo writers on staff, so it's probably not likely before Dec 8 (all demos currently available are from people who tested and shared their results). Just providing context, while we agree that more demos is a good way to showcase the library more. My own schedule leading to Dec 8 is packed with preparing the Lookahead tutorial, and also exploring a last optimization we can do to considerably drop the RAM load of the patches.


No problem. More demos after the release is good enough if that's not possible before the release.

You already have some wonderful sounding TSS demos, even before the latest legato, and other improvements. So, the newer demos will sound even better.

Actually, it would be nice if some of the future demos are video tutorials as well, showing the way the library was used to create the demo, which reverbs applied, and any other dsp treatments, plus the articulations used, ..etc. Those types of videos would be super helpful for TSS users.

Looking forward to more video tutorials.

Thanks.


----------



## muziksculp

It would also be helpful if we can hear the vibrato amount in more detail, going from none to full vibrato. Also more demos of the Molto-Vibrato. Without, and then With a nice amount of Reverb applied.

I wasn't able to hear the full Vibrato in the video, it was very hard to detect it, I'm not sure why, but a Molto Vibrato sound should sound very different from little or no vibrato to my ears, and easily heard.

Thanks


----------



## filipjonathan

muziksculp said:


> Actually, it would be nice if some of the future demos are video tutorials as well, showing the way the library was used to create the demo, which reverbs applied, and any other dsp treatments, plus the articulations used, ..etc. Those types of videos would be super helpful for TSS users.


I second this! Or even just a regular screencast of a demo would be helpful.


----------



## moon

MA-Simon said:


> Imho still not very musical. Was hoping for more flowing, warm strings. Maybe just the demo phrases though. Still looking forward to the release on the 8. A bit of trepidation remains.


It did seem to me like the video made heavy use of bowed legato rather than fingered. Not sure if it was like that previously, I don't remember, but it might have something to do with the lack of a flowing sound.


----------



## chrisav

Just a question, I've noticed in the video you say there's three celli, whereas the op in this thread says there's four of them in the section... So which one's correct? I could've sworn it was always supposed to be four according to earlier posts too, but I just want to make sure.


----------



## muziksculp

chrisav said:


> Just a question, I've noticed in the video you say there's three celli, whereas the op in this thread says there's four of them in the section... So which one's correct? I could've sworn it was always supposed to be four according to earlier posts too, but I just want to make sure.


 (Violins 1, Violins 2, Viola, Cello, Bass) in a typical Japanese ensemble size (8/6/6/4/3)


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Of course, the Soundcloud demos are great examples of how TSS sounds with reverb (which we highly recommend using, since that is what Mr. Aizawa does), and with proper composition. But the purpose of the overview video is to show the unaltered sound you get out-of-the-box, played live, which is the most honest way to demonstrate a library (IMO). 

On release day we will have a longer & more comprehensive walkthrough of *all *features (save lookahead, which will be a separate video), which will also clearly show the vibrato levels (senza, con, molto). Believe me, they do sound different  

Also, I've re-rendered my Kouyou demo with the latest patches for quite a nice improvement!



And the Tangledeep one as well, which sounds *QUITE *a bit better than the original (which I was already happy with). What a difference molto vibrato + vastly improved legato makes. You can compare to the original teaser video audio.


----------



## RMH

Andrew Aversa said:


> Also, I've re-rendered my Kouyou demo with the latest patches for quite a nice improvement!



Is there no release after C#5 note(0:30)? I thought it got better from the previous version, but it still feels like it's suddenly cutting off.


----------



## Henning

muziksculp said:


> I was expecting a warmer, more flowing violins sound that I hear in Japanese Anime scores, what I heard in the video was very different.
> 
> I think posting a few new Audio Demos that show how TSS sounds in some compositions would be a very wise step at this time.
> 
> Thanks.


I think the current set of demos show quite a lot of what the lib is capable of. I especially like Ben's, Jeff's and Andrew's demos.


----------



## muziksculp

Henning said:


> I think the current set of demos show quite a lot of what the lib is capable of. I especially like Ben's, Jeff's and Andrew's demos.


Yes, I agree. But the initial group of demos posted didn't use the updated legatos, a new demo was posted by Andrew showing the new version, anyways.. More demos showing the newest official release version of TSS would be very welcome.


----------



## Henning

muziksculp said:


> Yes, I agree. But the initial group of demos posted didn't use the updated legatos, a new demo was posted by Andrew showing the new version, anyways.. More demos showing the newest official release version of TSS would be very welcome.


I just got the new legato version today and will take it for a spin for my upcoming demo. That being said the overall sound of the lib will not change with the new legatos. But I thought you had already preordered anyway?


----------



## muziksculp

Henning said:


> I just got the new legato version today and will take it for a spin for my upcoming demo. That being said the overall sound of the lib will not change with the new legatos. But I thought you had already preordered anyway?


I know the sound of the library won't change, but the new tweaks they did to the library should make it sound/behave even better in terms of smoother legatos, and more expressive phrasing. I'm not sure what else they tweaked in the library, but in general they have improved it, and made it ready for release on Dec. 8th.

Enjoy the latest version with the new legatos, and I look forward to listening to your upcoming demo using the latest TSS version.

Yes, I pre-ordered it when it was first announced.


----------



## timbit2006

In less than 6 days we can all make our own personal demos of TSS


----------



## grandgooroo

Good work, nice update on the fast legato passages ! I am reassured .


----------



## MA-Simon

Andrew Aversa said:


> Of course, the Soundcloud demos are great examples of how TSS sounds with reverb (which we highly recommend using, since that is what Mr. Aizawa does), and with proper composition. But the purpose of the overview video is to show the unaltered sound you get out-of-the-box, played live, which is the most honest way to demonstrate a library (IMO).
> 
> On release day we will have a longer & more comprehensive walkthrough of *all *features (save lookahead, which will be a separate video), which will also clearly show the vibrato levels (senza, con, molto). Believe me, they do sound different
> 
> Also, I've re-rendered my Kouyou demo with the latest patches for quite a nice improvement!
> 
> 
> 
> And the Tangledeep one as well, which sounds *QUITE *a bit better than the original (which I was already happy with). What a difference molto vibrato + vastly improved legato makes. You can compare to the original teaser video audio.



Ah, very nice. Here the vib does sound a lot better, thank you!


----------



## muziksculp

MA-Simon said:


> Ah, very nice. Here the vib does sound a lot better, thank you!


By the way, Andrew posted these new demo version in .wav format on Discord, and they sound so much better than what you hear on Soundcloud, so you are not hearing the full potential, and details of these demos via Soundcloud.


----------



## tonio_

filipjonathan said:


> I'd like to hear that.


Me too haha! I've gotten started on the brass, synths, drums and just the transcription/preparation of the project file in general. Will get to the guitars next


----------



## Andrew Aversa

I've been having a ton of fun writing with TSS, so here is another demo representing the sort of JRPG battle style heard in games like Octopath Traveler!


----------



## muziksculp

You can hear the .wav version of the'Flowstone Battle' here. It was posted on Discord, I uploaded it to my dropbox. so you can appreciate the higher quality audio version of this demo.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/18dtm9fm73rcxj1/Flowstone_Battle.wav?dl=0


----------



## doctoremmet




----------



## Andrew Aversa

Oh, and @Sarah Mancuso has also written a lovely new demo featuring the quieter dynamics and improved legatos!


----------



## muziksculp

Here is @Sarah Mancuso demo 'Grave' in .wav format. 

https://www.dropbox.com/s/upvv98ujkxopb0r/TSS_Grave_120321_2.wav?dl=0


----------



## jvms

Andrew Aversa said:


> Of course, the Soundcloud demos are great examples of how TSS sounds with reverb (which we highly recommend using, since that is what Mr. Aizawa does), and with proper composition. But the purpose of the overview video is to show the unaltered sound you get out-of-the-box, played live, which is the most honest way to demonstrate a library (IMO).
> 
> On release day we will have a longer & more comprehensive walkthrough of *all *features (save lookahead, which will be a separate video), which will also clearly show the vibrato levels (senza, con, molto). Believe me, they do sound different
> 
> Also, I've re-rendered my Kouyou demo with the latest patches for quite a nice improvement!
> 
> 
> 
> And the Tangledeep one as well, which sounds *QUITE *a bit better than the original (which I was already happy with). What a difference molto vibrato + vastly improved legato makes. You can compare to the original teaser video audio.



Could you guys go into a bit of detail into his mixing? I'd love some tips on mixing orchestral music. If you can't share much on the topic, could you tell us at leas how and what kinds of reverbs he uses with strings that are recorded in small rooms?


----------



## neblix

Aizawa-san uses the Bricasti M7, a hardware reverb unit that is pretty renowned and appears in many major recording studios.

A very popular VST emulation of the Bricasti goes by the name of "Seventh Heaven", which sounds gorgeous and has 2 pricing tiers (I believe $70 and $300) depending how much you want. It's sort of half-convolution half-algorithmic, so while it uses impulse spaces, you still get key features like early and late reflection control. I think many other modern convolution reverbs also let you do stuff like that, but once I bought Seventh Heaven, I basically stopped shopping for reverbs forever.

I don't know if he himself uses Seventh Heaven, but if you want the reverb he uses (the Bricasti), Seventh Heaven is your best shot at it.


----------



## jvms

neblix said:


> Aizawa-san uses the Bricasti M7, a hardware reverb unit that is pretty renowned and appears in many major recording studios.
> 
> A very popular VST emulation of the Bricasti goes by the name of "Seventh Heaven", which sounds gorgeous and has 2 pricing tiers (I believe $70 and $300) depending how much you want. It's sort of half-convolution half-algorithmic, so while it uses impulse spaces, you still get key features like early and late reflection control. I think many other modern convolution reverbs also let you do stuff like that, but once I bought Seventh Heaven, I basically stopped shopping for reverbs forever.
> 
> I don't know if he himself uses Seventh Heaven, but if you want the reverb he uses (the Bricasti), Seventh Heaven is your best shot at it.


Thank you so much for the reply! I'll look into it! Also, can't wait for TSS to come out! Gonna be a hit!


----------



## mohsohsenshi

jvms said:


> Thank you so much for the reply! I'll look into it! Also, can't wait for TSS to come out! Gonna be a hit!




I was sold last year by Cory's review. Even the basic version has most control you want, though the pro version has more presets and parameters.


----------



## jason3.14

TSS is recorded in in situ position, is that right? Though notably with the bass centered in configuration?


----------



## grandgooroo

"Illusion reverb" sounds verry good too.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

jason3.14 said:


> TSS is recorded in in situ position, is that right? Though notably with the bass centered in configuration?


Yes, TSS was recorded in situ.


----------



## EvilDragon

neblix said:


> which sounds gorgeous and has 2 pricing tiers (I believe $70 and $300)


...and they're running a prolonged BF sale at the moment, so it's $49 and $179... a steal.


----------



## jvms

Hope I don't hijack the thread, but how are you guys usually using 7th Heaven or simillar reverbs? Do you use it on room mics or only on close mics to simulate a new recording room/hall/stuido? Does Aizawa-san use it to make up for the small room?


----------



## neblix

jvms said:


> Hope I don't hijack the thread, but how are you guys usually using 7th Heaven or simillar reverbs? Do you use it on room mics or only on close mics to simulate a new recording room/hall/stuido? Does Aizawa-san use it to make up for the small room?


I'm using it on the Board Mix for my demo which will be released within the week (and also appear in the Lookahead tutorial).


----------



## Batrawi

it seems like the thread is now turning people into buying 7H istead


----------



## neblix

ElysiumSky said:


> I messaged support for a refund on my preorder a few days ago and still haven't heard back.
> I don't mind waiting a little but I just don't want to get locked in to buying it since the release date is soon and that's what seems to be the cut off date so hopefully they respond in time


It would be absurd for the support team to base your eligibility on their own response time instead of the time you sent your initial email; I assure you no one at ISW is evil enough to pull something like that on you!


----------



## galactic orange

Batrawi said:


> it seems like the thread is now turning people into buying 7H istead


I just bought 7H standard thanks to this thread. Was looking at CR for a week, but 7H costs less and anyway there went the last of my budget for samples and effects this year. It will be nice to try it out on TSS to see if an upgrade is in the cards next year.


----------



## Trash Panda

@Andrew Aversa @neblix @Sarah Mancuso which Seventh Heaven presets does TSS seem to take to the best? Are you using it as a send or insert?

There! Thread back on topic.


----------



## Henning

So, my demo is added. It's mainly an experiment how TSS holds up in a very fast, punk rock context


----------



## Haakond

Batrawi said:


> it seems like the thread is now turning people into buying 7H istead


Just bought it!


----------



## filipjonathan

Henning said:


> So, my demo is added. It's mainly an experiment how TSS holds up in a very fast, punk rock context


Nice!


----------



## Henning

filipjonathan said:


> Nice!


Thanks. As I don't see myself writing for anything remotely Japanese sounding anytime soon, a Rock/Pop context is where I see myself using it more regularly. The close mics up with the decca tree a few db lower gives a good focussed sound. No need for much reverb either.


----------



## timbit2006

I can hardly believe it's only 2 days until Christmas!.... err I mean until Tokyo Scoring Strings releases!


----------



## lucky909091

Late to the party, but the videos convinced me to pre-order.


----------



## jason3.14

I'm working tomorrow evening until Wednesday 12AM PT. Wonder if I should expect to be rewarded by a midnight Dec 8 release, or should I expect for TSS to be available later in the day?


----------



## neblix

I think usually with ISW, product launches are silently right at midnight, but the announcement doesn't go out until around noon?

That being said, we're on Eastern Time, not Pacific. (Though that means it's midnight for us sooner, so you'll likely have access. No guarantees though!)


----------



## jason3.14

neblix said:


> I think usually with ISW, product launches are silently right at midnight, but the announcement doesn't go out until around noon?
> 
> That being said, we're on Eastern Time, not Pacific. (Though that means it's midnight for us sooner, so you'll likely have access. No guarantees though!)


Haha, that sounds good! I won't expect it necessarily, but will consider myself fortunate if it is!


----------



## dzilizzi

neblix said:


> I think usually with ISW, product launches are silently right at midnight, but the announcement doesn't go out until around noon?
> 
> That being said, we're on Eastern Time, not Pacific. (Though that means it's midnight for us sooner, so you'll likely have access. No guarantees though!)


So around 9 pm Pacific time on the 7th????


----------



## tonio_

neblix said:


> I think usually with ISW, product launches are silently right at midnight, but the announcement doesn't go out until around noon?
> 
> That being said, we're on Eastern Time, not Pacific. (Though that means it's midnight for us sooner, so you'll likely have access. No guarantees though!)


So that 6 am French time, so I can totally start the download before I leave to uni in the morning! I think it will be one of those rare times where I'm actually excited to get out of bed before the last possible minute!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Midnight tonight (EST) is in theory the release date. I say "in theory" because of course, the universe has a sense of humor, and Amazon S3 (where we need to upload + host files) is having worldwide outages at the moment.

That said, please check out the full walkthrough video going live at 3PM EST!


----------



## Trash Panda




----------



## mostexcellent

Awesome to see this come to fruition, congrats!


----------



## jason3.14

Congratulations!! Been waiting a year for this!!

By the way, is the Large and Near preset on the Seventh Heaven Standard version? Or in general I wonder if there's documentation on what presets Standard has compared to Professional.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

jason3.14 said:


> Congratulations!! Been waiting a year for this!!
> 
> By the way, is the Large and Near preset on the Seventh Heaven Standard version? Or in general I wonder if there's documentation on what presets Standard has compared to Professional.


It’s in the standard version, yes.


----------



## Manuel Stumpf

jason3.14 said:


> Congratulations!! Been waiting a year for this!!
> 
> By the way, is the Large and Near preset on the Seventh Heaven Standard version? Or in general I wonder if there's documentation on what presets Standard has compared to Professional.


Preset lists are available for download at the bottom of the product homepage of Seventh Heaven Standard / Pro.


----------



## Igorianych

Downloading......


----------



## mybadmemory

Bring on the user demos!! 😍


----------



## jason3.14

Sarah Mancuso said:


> It’s in the standard version, yes.





Manuel Stumpf said:


> Preset lists are available for download at the bottom of the product homepage of Seventh Heaven Standard / Pro.


Thanks you two! If anyone else wants it for reference, here it is:

Standard:


https://downloads.liquidsonics.com/software/seventh-heaven/manual/Seventh_Heaven_Presets.pdf



Professional:


https://us-east-1.linodeobjects.com/liquidsonics/software/seventh-heaven-professional/manual/Seventh_Heaven_Professional_Presets.pdf


----------



## Nimrod7

Andrew Aversa said:


> Amazon S3 (where we need to upload + host files) is having worldwide outages at the moment.


There was a time I was an incident commander in AWS. 
I would have woken up every single engineer employed in AWS by now...


----------



## Zanshin

Nimrod7 said:


> There was a time I was an incident commander in AWS.
> I would have woken up every single engineer employed in AWS by now...


Commander Nimrod to the rescue! (Sounds like a stressful job actually lol)


----------



## jason3.14

Andrew Aversa said:


> Midnight tonight (EST) is in theory the release date. I say "in theory" because of course, the universe has a sense of humor, and Amazon S3 (where we need to upload + host files) is having worldwide outages at the moment.
> 
> That said, please check out the full walkthrough video going live at 3PM EST!



Great video!

The manual describes that "In Monophonic mode, arco can play only one voice at a time, and legato is triggered by overlapping notes. In Polyphonic mode, multiple voices can be played, and legato is detected based on non-overlapping notes played within a ‘latency’ window." Additionally, the video mentions that in Polyphonic mode, non-overlapping quantized notes can still trigger legato even when the latency is set to 0, due to the introduction of a very small, unnoticeable amount of latency to catch the notes.

Could you clarify how the use of Split Point Legato works with the above? It sounds like Polyphonic mode set to a latency of 0 is basically like Split Point Legato already, so is the latter feature mainly for Monophonic Legato Mode? And, to make sure I understand correctly, Monophonic vs. Polyphonic Legato Mode applies to Standard Playback Mode only (as Zero Latency Playback Mode does not have legato, and Lookahead Playback Mode basically handles everything automatically (?) haha).

Lastly, if we end up fiddling around with controls, is there a button to reset to default setting?

Thanks!


----------



## dhmusic

mybadmemory said:


> Bring on the user demos!! 😍


Let The Battles Begin


----------



## Trash Panda

dhmusic said:


> Let The Battles Begin


You joke, but this is top of my list. At least one of the 70 FF7R versions.


----------



## Scamper

Andrew Aversa said:


> That said, please check out the full walkthrough video going live at 3PM EST!



Looks like we got another stellar string library!
I can't reasonably afford it looking at my other string libraries, but otherwise I'd get it.

Love the in-depth legato sampling including the vibrato layers, legato types and all, love all the different shorts (very useful to have), it sounds great and there are so many handy and unique features included.

For playability, it seems like Zero Latency live recording followed by lookahead mode would be the way to go.
I'd still like to see various different shorts used in a single passage to see how they work together. Also I'm curious how the legato holds up for really fast runs.

Congrats.


----------



## dhmusic

Trash Panda said:


> You joke, but this is top of my list. At least one of the 70 FF7R versions.


I'm just working on the original atm. Could be a fun shootout / stress test for TSS though!


----------



## jason3.14

Trash Panda said:


> You joke, but this is top of my list. At least one of the 70 FF7R versions.


agreed I had tried this recently but may be good to have a go at it again with TSS haha


----------



## Trash Panda

Andrew Aversa said:


> Midnight tonight (EST) is in theory the release date. I say "in theory" because of course, the universe has a sense of humor, and Amazon S3 (where we need to upload + host files) is having worldwide outages at the moment.
> 
> That said, please check out the full walkthrough video going live at 3PM EST!



Excellent walkthrough video, Andrew! I'm stoked for tomorrow's release. 

A few questions that I am left with after watching the full video:

If I want to have a marcato type of articulation that can be held out after the attack, would the arco + decrescendo as an overlay be the best approach for that?
Can the release samples be tied to release velocity or is this only assignable to normal velocity and traditional CCs?
How fast can the runs version of the legato speed work at common tempos? Are 32nd note runs and trills doable?


----------



## Nimrod7

Zanshin said:


> Commander Nimrod to the rescue! (Sounds like a stressful job actually lol)


It was, really glad I am out. Lots to sleepless nights.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Trash Panda said:


> Excellent walkthrough video, Andrew! I'm stoked for tomorrow's release.
> 
> A few questions that I am left with after watching the full video:
> 
> If I want to have a marcato type of articulation that can be held out after the attack, would the arco + decrescendo as an overlay be the best approach for that?
> Can the release samples be tied to release velocity or is this only assignable to normal velocity and traditional CCs?
> How fast can the runs version of the legato speed work at common tempos? Are 32nd note runs and trills doable?


1. I think the decrescendo overlay should fit what you're looking for there, yeah. The dec overlay will follow the same ADSR settings as the decrescendo articulation, so you can always adjust the release time there. (Or even MIDI learn and automate it!)

2. Release velocity isn't widely supported (and I think only recently in Kontakt itself), so if you assign releases to velocity it will use the note-on velocity. This is actually how @Henning did his polyphonic cello legato demo in a single track with lots of expression; different releases based on velocity.

3. I think how well the V.Fast profile works probably depends on tempo, mix, and your own taste... Very fast simulated runs are quite tricky, one of the hardest things for sampled strings to do 100% convincingly. That being said we've been experimenting with a new technique for v1.1, likely to be offered as a separate articulation, specifically for those ultra fast, glissando-like blurry runs.


----------



## filipjonathan

Andrew Aversa said:


> specifically for those ultra fast, glissando-like blurry runs.


Ooo I'm looking forward to that!!!


----------



## tonio_

Downloading now! This is a very special library for me (on top of already being special) since its a birthday present from my friends. They've been sneakily asking me about what I've set my eyes in terms of gear and my replies have always been: "There's this String Ensemble virtual instrument with Japanese musicians, recorded in Tokyo by this absolute legend of an engineer... etc. etc." and I probably went into way too much detail and got overly excited when showing some of the demos every time 🙄 They are pretty into video games, anime and have a substantial appreciation for Japan, so I probably didn't bore them out of their brains too much (I totally did)

I don't think I need to say too much about my reaction when my hungover friends told me (just as hungover and barely awake) to check my emails 😅

...and it's also my first pro string library!

So massive thanks and an equally massive congrats @Andrew Aversa , @neblix and all the rest of you beautiful ISW guys and gals! ❤


----------



## RMH

tonio_ said:


> Downloading now! This is a very special library for me (on top of already being special) since its a birthday present from my friends. They've been sneakily asking me about what I've set my eyes in terms of gear and my replies have always been: "There's this String Ensemble virtual instrument with Japanese musicians, recorded in Tokyo by this absolute legend of an engineer... etc. etc." and I probably went into way too much detail and got overly excited when showing some of the demos every time 🙄 They are pretty into video games, anime and have a substantial appreciation for Japan, so I probably didn't bore them out of their brains too much (I totally did)
> 
> I don't think I need to say too much about my reaction when my hungover friends told me (just as hungover and barely awake) to check my emails 😅
> 
> ...and it's also my first pro string library!
> 
> So massive thanks and an equally massive congrats @Andrew Aversa , @neblix and all the rest of you beautiful ISW guys and gals! ❤


You're download right now? I haven't activated the product download yet. As far as I know, it's not time yet..?


----------



## Bear Lew

200+gb!?


----------



## BenHicks

Bear Lew said:


> 200+gb!?


I mean, if you decide to download it twice, sure.


----------



## timbit2006

Bear Lew said:


> 200+gb!?


mine said 206gb


----------



## timbit2006

RMH said:


> You're download right now? I haven't activated the product download yet. As far as I know, it's not time yet..?


Pulse Downloader says its up


----------



## Trash Panda

How are y’all getting serials and downloads already?


----------



## timbit2006

Trash Panda said:


> How are y’all getting serials and downloads already?


pulse downloader


----------



## timbit2006




----------



## galactic orange

Yeah it’s 200+ gb for the download and install. Downloading now!


----------



## BenHicks

timbit2006 said:


> mine said 206gb


Ah, I see. Just part of the install. Nvm.


----------



## RMH

timbit2006 said:


>


OH! I SEE!


----------



## galactic orange

Trash Panda said:


> How are y’all getting serials and downloads already?


My serial was in my order invoice email from way back when. I just never entered it into pulse or NA until today.


----------



## Trash Panda

galactic orange said:


> My serial was in my order invoice email from way back when. I just never entered it into pulse or NA until today.


*!*


----------



## timbit2006

RMH said:


>


This looks like an error on your PC end of things, shouldn't it show you the free space available?


----------



## RMH

timbit2006 said:


> This looks like an error on your PC end of things, shouldn't it show you the free space available?


That's weird. I have enough hard disk space but I can't download it


----------



## timbit2006

maybe I should've let my download finish before posting about it here hahaha. 1 extra hour just added to the timer. It'd be really cool to have a download manager that also allows p2p seeding


----------



## RMH

timbit2006 said:


> maybe I should've let my download finish before posting about it here hahaha. 1 extra hour just added to the timer


finally. It's working now.


----------



## neblix

Hi everyone,

If you are downloading currently or have already downloaded, you will notice an issue with notes cutting out, and the hotfix going up within a few hours is for that. You can still download the library, the patch will be very small on top (not a redownload).

(This was just a mistake I made in a code update this very morning, sorry)


----------



## RMH

neblix said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> If you are downloading currently or have already downloaded, you will notice an issue with notes cutting out, and the hotfix going up within a few hours is for that. If you haven't yet downloaded, I just recommend not doing so until it's fixed.


Then it's useless to download it now, right?


----------



## timbit2006

neblix said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> If you are downloading currently or have already downloaded, you will notice an issue with notes cutting out, and the hotfix going up within a few hours is for that. If you haven't yet downloaded, I just recommend not doing so until it's fixed.


is the hotfix the full download size?


----------



## neblix

The fix will just be the nkr/nkc file, which is around 50mb.



RMH said:


> Then it's useless to download it now, right?


I just got corrected info; you can download it now, the patch will be a small additional file when it's uploaded.


----------



## timbit2006

neblix said:


> The fix will just be the nkr/nkc file, which is around 50mb.


Okay thanks, I'll continue my download to save my SSD life instead of deleting now and redownloading the whole thing.

BTW for those that had their speed randomly cut in half, pausing/resuming seems to have fixed my speed back to 177mb/s


----------



## neblix

The fix is uploaded!


----------



## RMH

neblix said:


> The fix will just be the nkr/nkc file, which is around 50mb.
> 
> 
> I just got corrected info; you can download it now, the patch will be a small additional file when it's uploaded.


Thank you!


----------



## Bear Lew

BenHicks said:


> I mean, if you decide to download it twice, sure.


what do you mean ?


----------



## MikeLG

Downloading! I found my serial on the Impact Soundworks website. If you view your order details in the orders page - It was there for me.


----------



## Keith Levenson

Is the fix included in the download now?


----------



## bfreepro

Keith Levenson said:


> Is the fix included in the download now?


Yes


----------



## BenHicks

Bear Lew said:


> what do you mean ?


I though we were talking about the size of the library after install, so I was just making a joke. The library requires 83GB of hard drive space, so downloading it twice would bring it closer to that 200GB mentioned.


----------



## bfreepro

If you are unsure (if you started the download before the hotfix was up) it should show up here as your version number within Pulse, in the Library panel when you click on TSS


----------



## jason3.14

Woot.


----------



## Henning

Andrew Aversa said:


> 1. I think the decrescendo overlay should fit what you're looking for there, yeah. The dec overlay will follow the same ADSR settings as the decrescendo articulation, so you can always adjust the release time there. (Or even MIDI learn and automate it!)
> 
> 2. Release velocity isn't widely supported (and I think only recently in Kontakt itself), so if you assign releases to velocity it will use the note-on velocity. This is actually how @Henning did his polyphonic cello legato demo in a single track with lots of expression; different releases based on velocity.
> 
> 3. I think how well the V.Fast profile works probably depends on tempo, mix, and your own taste... Very fast simulated runs are quite tricky, one of the hardest things for sampled strings to do 100% convincingly. That being said we've been experimenting with a new technique for v1.1, likely to be offered as a separate articulation, specifically for those ultra fast, glissando-like blurry runs.


I really like the 8th Sfz as overlay on the arcos. They have a good bite to bring out a line nicely and if you use the stacc releases you can pull of a really nice marcato without using the regular marcato patches. For the cello demo I had the stacc releases on vel 80-127 and below the decresc releases. Just experiment with all the settings especially the ADSR. You can really make this your own.


----------



## jason3.14

Keep needing to remind myself that Lookahead mode is already available, even though the Lookahead walkthrough is not out yet haha. Look forward to trying it out when download finishes.


----------



## neblix

The Lookahead walkthrough is currently being constructed, but the release might have to bleed into later today (Wednesday) or even Thursday. It's projected to be around 18 minutes long and it's a lot of information to cover and demonstrate!


----------



## RMH

neblix said:


> The Lookahead walkthrough is currently being constructed, but the release might have to bleed into later today (Wednesday) or even Thursday. It's projected to be around 18 minutes long and it's a lot of information to cover and demonstrate!


Looking forward to it.


----------



## HM_Music

There is a Delay compensation plugin (vst3) in the tss folder.
Do you need to do anything with it? because it is in a zip archive.


----------



## Ephora

Is anyone else stuck without the nicnt file? Is the only option to redownload everything through pulse if that happens?


----------



## bfreepro

Ephora said:


> Is anyone else stuck without the nicnt file? Is the only option to redownload everything through pulse if that happens?


hmm, that didn't happen to me


----------



## Jdiggity1

RMH said:


> Looking forward to it.


i see what you did there


----------



## Ephora

bfreepro said:


> hmm, that didn't happen to me


Yeah I'm always the unlucky one lol. Hopefully I can just get the file somehow


----------



## Nantho Valentine

I don't understand one thing : the library is 84Gb but the download is about 200Gb ?!


----------



## Piotrek K.

Nantho Valentine said:


> I don't understand one thing : the library is 84Gb but the download is about 200Gb ?!


I'm gonna guess here, but most likely you need 200GB to download compressed file and then unpack it (after unpacking the first file most likely will disappear from your drive, but you still need to have both of them for some amount of time).


----------



## pulsedownloader

Piotrek K. said:


> I'm gonna guess here, but most likely you need 200GB to download compressed file and then unpack it (after unpacking the first file most likely will disappear from your drive, but you still need to have both of them for some amount of time).


Correct. Allow around approx 2x the final file size for the download


----------



## Nantho Valentine

Thanks Guys 😊 
But that means the donwloaded file itself is just 100Gb and I just need 200 for the install, am I right ?


----------



## pulsedownloader

Nantho Valentine said:


> Thanks Guys 😊
> But that means the donwloaded file itself is just 100Gb and I just need 200 for the install, am I right ?


The final file will be under 100GB (I believe around 80GB). We reserve around 2.3X the final file size for the full download just to be safe


----------



## timbit2006

This may help some people. Only 83GB.

I'm really enjoying the sound of TSS so far.


----------



## Ephora

pulsedownloader said:


> The final file will be under 100GB (I believe around 80GB). We reserve around 2.3X the final file size for the full download just to be safe


Wow that's a lot of extra space needed! Could that be related if I didn't get all the files? I'm missing the .nicnt only which is kinda weird.


----------



## Nantho Valentine

pulsedownloader said:


> The final file will be under 100GB (I believe around 80GB). We reserve around 2.3X the final file size for the full download just to be safe


Ok, thank you very much 😊 
So now, I've got another question : my internet connection at home is unfortunately very slow. Can I download the compressed files on my laptop at my friend's home who has a killer connection and then decompress the files on another hard drive when I'm back to my place ?


----------



## pulsedownloader

Nantho Valentine said:


> Ok, thank you very much 😊
> So now, I've got another question : my internet connection at home is unfortunately very slow. Can I download the compressed files on my laptop at my friend's home who has a killer connection and then decompress the files on another hard drive when I'm back to my place ?


Sure you can download to an external drive then just move across to your own drive later


----------



## Nantho Valentine

Great !

Thanks again 😊 
Have a nice day !


----------



## MartinH.

All around impressive! Congrats to all involved in making it!


----------



## EvilDragon

HM_Music said:


> There is a Delay compensation plugin (vst3) in the tss folder.
> Do you need to do anything with it? because it is in a zip archive.



If your DAW doesn't have track-level MIDI delay feature, you would load this plugin after Kontakt on a track to force the host's plugin delay compensation to provide the one second of latency that lookahead feature needs.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

RELEASE DAY WOOHOO!!!!

If you are missing any files, that sounds like a Pulse extraction issue, but just ping our support and we're happy to send you the nicnt. (Or if I'm available on our *Discord server*, I can do it.)


----------



## pulsedownloader

If anyone is having any extraction issues at all please ensure you're on the latest version of Pulse (40.1.7 or 40.1.8) and if so email us at [email protected] and we can take a look


----------



## Denkii

If only keeping it updated would be easy


----------



## pulsedownloader

Denkii said:


> If only keeping it updated would be easy


Youre using a very old version of Pulse from a long time ago that didn't have auto update built in. Please reinstall from our website and your issue will be resolved


----------



## Igorianych

Where can I see the version of the library? I downloaded the update, but I do not understand whether it was installed or not


----------



## pulsedownloader

Igorianych said:


> Where can I see the version of the library? I downloaded the update, but I do not understand whether it was installed or not


Click the product image in your library and it will show you the versions


----------



## Trash Panda

Igorianych said:


> Where can I see the version of the library? I downloaded the update, but I do not understand whether it was installed or not


Open Pulse > Click on Library in left-hand navigation > Click on TSS picture

There will be an update button on this page if you're not on the latest version.


----------



## muziksculp

Hi,

Just want to check before I download TSS. So, Is TSS all ready for download via PULSE, without any missing files, or issues ? or should I wait for another day or two before I download it ? 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## Trash Panda

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> Just want to check before I download TSS. So, Is TSS all ready for download via PULSE, without any missing files, or issues ? or should I wait for another day or two before I download it ?
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp


Worked fine for me last night. 👍🏻


----------



## Evans

Same, works.


----------



## Drundfunk

I had Pulse 40.1.7 installed on my computer but couldn't log into Pulse for some reason. Uninstalled it and then installed the newest version. Then the login wasn't a problem... .


----------



## pulsedownloader

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> Just want to check before I download TSS. So, Is TSS all ready for download via PULSE, without any missing files, or issues ? or should I wait for another day or two before I download it ?
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp


Just ensure you're on the latest version of Pulse (v40.1.7 or higher) and it's working fine


----------



## tonio_

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> Just want to check before I download TSS. So, Is TSS all ready for download via PULSE, without any missing files, or issues ? or should I wait for another day or two before I download it ?
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp


Works perfectly fine for me!


----------



## MonadoLink

OK, so I remember them saying we would get an email with instructions on how to make a pulse account and download the library, but I never got such an email. I have no idea how to download this. I have pulse installed, now what?
EDIT: I can't create an account either. It seems my email has been used somehow


----------



## pulsedownloader

MonadoLink said:


> OK, so I remember them saying we would get an email with instructions on how to make a pulse account and download the library, but I never got such an email. I have no idea how to download this. I have pulse installed, now what?


If you have received your serial number from Impact Soundworks, just create a Pulse account (open the app and click on "Register" on the login screen), then login, click on "Add a Product", enter your key and begin downloading.


----------



## MonadoLink

pulsedownloader said:


> If you have received your serial number from Impact Soundworks, just create a Pulse account (open the app and click on "Register" on the login screen), then login, click on "Add a Product", enter your key and begin downloading.


I can't though. It seems my email has been used. I don't know if that means Impact registered me for me, but I assume they have and I should have a password?


----------



## pulsedownloader

MonadoLink said:


> I can't though. It seems my email has been used. I don't know if that means Impact registered me for me, but I assume they have and I should have a password?


In that case you'll find your Pulse login info in your order confirmation email from Impact Soundworks. 

If you can't find that, you can just reset your password here and login use the new password:





__





Reset Password - Pulse Downloader


Reset your password Reset Request received! We will shortly send the reset link to your inbox.




pulsedownloader.com


----------



## MonadoLink

pulsedownloader said:


> In that case you'll find your Pulse login info in your order confirmation email from Impact Soundworks.
> 
> If you can't find that, you can just reset your password here and login use the new password:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> __
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Reset Password - Pulse Downloader
> 
> 
> Reset your password Reset Request received! We will shortly send the reset link to your inbox.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pulsedownloader.com


Ah, ok. Thank you!


----------



## Trash Panda

Based on a quick test from the Octopath Traveler ending theme thread, I think this library is definitely going to be something special. Hats off to ISW on this one!





__





Strings Test - Getting that Octopath Traveler sound


Though CSS Series are designed for making Hollywood cinematic music, i found that it is now the best to do video game mockups. Here's another piece that I did about half a year ago using CSS and BBC percussions. I found that the library sounded like Hollywood but can be much smaller and denser...




vi-control.net





View attachment Ending Theme - Octopath Traveler OST TSS.mp3


----------



## jason3.14

I got started on Octopath Traveler's Ophilia theme last night!


----------



## Piano Pete

@Andrew Aversa

Congrats ISW on the release! It's not often that I am impressed with a library out of the box, but I immediately took out around 60gigs worth of older string samples out of my template and replaced them with this.

The samples remind me of a past gig that was recorded in the studio, and the mic options in this library lend a lot the final tone. Usually when there is a library recorded at venues that I have worked at, I never feel I get the same tonal changes when tweaking the samples' microphones. I had to chuckle, because after around 30 minutes of playing with the instrument, I realized I did not have a burning urge to reach for an EQ or Reverb. It more or less handles and sounds the way I would expect.

Regarding reverb, the biggest thing I remember about Sound City was how well it took to external verbs and treatment—although not entirely necessary for a tighter studio sound. I guess my memory hasnt completely failed me, because the library is handling the way I remember the stems did.

Thank you for finally producing a library for this ensemble size and space.

Finally, the addition of various shorts is greatly received, at least from this happy composer. The combinations created from layering the various articulations are exactly what I was hoping this library could achieve. Yes, I'm one of those people who still keep separate midi tracks per articulation to achieve this, but all the base building blocks are there.

Kudos across the board, and hopefully you and the team can get some deserved rest!

Looking forward to future releases and editions. You guys have done a fantastic job.


----------



## Jackdnp121

so far the Legato is pretty playable and expressive ...well done ... and I'm loving the studio sound ... it really does reminds me of Spitfire studio strings .. except the Legato is WAYYYYYYY better ....gonna try it afew more days and see ... but so far it is pretty good ...


----------



## BL

Keyswitches work without issues for everyone playing on a keyboard? Or do they only activate in a piano roll?


----------



## EvilDragon

I'm not even sure how that would be discerned - it's just MIDI...


----------



## BL

EvilDragon said:


> I'm not even sure how that would be discerned - it's just MIDI...


Odd because all other libraries work fine like, but this doesn't...


----------



## neblix

It seems to be working here, and like Mario said, MIDI is MIDI. Are you sure this isn't more tied to say, if your DAW is playing or paused?


----------



## BL

I'll probably need to reboot or something. It's been a good month without doing so.


----------



## BL

Any plans for a Violins octave patch?


----------



## neblix

BL said:


> Any plans for a Violins octave patch?


Our only plans for additional patches currently would be to address the common request for a full ensemble patch. That in and of itself is a massive undertaking (mixing down from 5 sections to 1), and is going to probably to be a pretty hefty job for Sarah to make sure the legato sounds good.

Keep in mind it would also raise the library's size by roughly 17 GB or so. Adding a Violins Octave patch would do the same.

We plan to introduce a lot of RAM saving features in 1.1 to reduce footprint of loaded patches. I really would rather people use the 5 main patches, rather than specially-mixed down and consolidated versions. This is because Sarah worked hard on the individual sections to get their legato up to par; mixing down multiple sections into one would make it really hard for the legato tweaking process to go smoothly at all.

If we can get the Board Mix patches to be *close to or* *less than 1GB of RAM *by offering additional purges, I'm sure people will feel the pain much less!


----------



## Trash Panda

Ensemble patch requests for Kontakt instruments are a curious thing. Is adding two instruments to the same MIDI channel in the same Kontakt instance and setting transposition in the options really that big of a hassle?

Edit: The above is a question for the end users. I understand where @neblix is coming from.


----------



## EvilDragon

And you could always just... process your MIDI to automatically produce an octave...


----------



## neblix

Trash Panda said:


> Ensemble patch requests for Kontakt instruments are a curious thing. Is adding two instruments to the same MIDI channel in the same Kontakt instance and setting transposition in the options really that big of a hassle?


It's a RAM and CPU thing. Loading 7-8 GB and multiplying voice counts for a full ensemble is much worse than having the full ensemble itself be as CPU and RAM heavy as 1 section.


----------



## Trash Panda

neblix said:


> It's a RAM and CPU thing. Loading 7-8 GB and multiplying voice counts for a full ensemble is much worse than having the full ensemble itself be as CPU and RAM heavy as 1 section.


Looking at some of my other string libraries, the developers are either just doing what I outlined above as a single patch, with the combined single patches still take up the same amount of RAM and CPU as the ensemble patch, or they disable the individual mic options so you're only getting the mixed mic levels for each section.


----------



## neblix

Trash Panda said:


> Looking at some of my other string libraries, the developers are either just doing what I outlined above as a single patch, with the combined single patches still take up the same amount of RAM and CPU as the ensemble patch, or they disable the individual mic options so you're only getting the mixed mic levels for each section.


That is true, yes, in which case, there's no real reason to use it, because you can just route them on the same channel.

If we do it, we'll do it in a way that it provides meaningful value; in this case, it would be the sections completely mixed down into a tutti sample set, and you would indeed save a ton of RAM and CPU this way.

P.S. The library ships with Full Ensemble multis that do exactly what I described (all sections on 1 channel).






EDIT: Except I just noticed they're all broken... *sigh*, more for the hotfix this Friday.


----------



## mybadmemory

I never even thought of an ensemble patch with legato. Just one with a selection of non legato articulations longs and shorts would be great though!


----------



## chapbot

BL said:


> Any plans for a Violins octave patch?


You could always, like, play a violin 1 patch an octave higher than the violin 2 patch.


----------



## Trash Panda

neblix said:


> That is true, yes, in which case, there's no real reason to use it, because you can just route them on the same channel.
> 
> If we do it, we'll do it in a way that it provides meaningful value; in this case, it would be the sections completely mixed down into a tutti sample set, and you would indeed save a ton of RAM and CPU this way.
> 
> P.S. The library ships with Full Ensemble multis that do exactly what I described (all sections on 1 channel).
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EDIT: Except I just noticed they're all broken... *sigh*, more for the hotfix this Friday.


That all sounds good to me! Just trying to help those who need something in the short term.

BTW, I don't think the library likes it when you poke around in the wrench to mess with instrument options (ala the transposition setting referenced). You get stuck on the console without the button to go back to Tokyo Strings main tab when you close the wrench. Best to submit an email to support?

Edit: Hitting the force Restart button (the '!' icon) fixes the issue.


----------



## neblix

That is actually a Kontakt bug we have no control over, and we have had to deal with on our end too. Because we use the "performance view", a new method of creating GUI's in the recent year, opening the wrench can do this. There isn't a way for us to fix it currently.


----------



## Piano Pete

@neblix Could you check on your end for the violin 2 mic mixer patch handles the Decca and close mic correctly?

On my end, if I load the decca position, it pipes it through the close mic channel, so it looks like the close and decca are summing together.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

Piano Pete said:


> @neblix Could you check on your end for the violin 2 mic mixer patch handles the Decca and close mic correctly?
> 
> On my end, if I load the decca position, it pipes it through the close mic channel, so it looks like the close and decca are summing together.


This has been reported to us earlier today and will be fixed for the next update. Sorry about that!


----------



## Piano Pete

Sarah Mancuso said:


> This has been reported to us earlier today and will be fixed for the next update. Sorry about that!


HOW DARE YOU!

No, haha, in all seriousness no sweat. I still stand by what I said previously, so I'm as happy as a clam.


----------



## neblix

We're hoping for the fixes of currently reported issues to be out this Friday!


----------



## gpax

Piano Pete said:


> @neblix Could you check on your end for the violin 2 mic mixer patch handles the Decca and close mic correctly?
> 
> On my end, if I load the decca position, it pipes it through the close mic channel, so it looks like the close and decca are summing together.


Would you believe this was the very first thing I encountered right after downloading this morning? Went straight for the Violin 2 patch, and then clicked on the mic mixer to compare. Clearly not the first impression I was hoping for, but which I soon after realized was simply zeroing in on a bug right away. Glad it has been noted, and clearly it is not indicative of the product - now that I'm running through everything else.


----------



## thestickman8

Absolutely loving the library and having been playing around with it all day. It's everything that I've dreamed of!! Since it looks there's plans for some bug fixes this Friday, I did want to toss something out there to see if anyone else has experienced the same thing. On the cello spiccato patch, from the notes B2-D3 it sounds like there is an extra sample layered in there that is playing a fifth above the sample. I can't tell if my ears are just deceiving me or not. Has anyone else heard that as well?


----------



## Batuer

@Andrew Aversa
Thanks for this great string library. I like it so much. I'm a bit confused about the legato:
1. In look-ahead mode, split point legato enabled, under slow tempo, the notes are quantized without overlapping. But it doesn't sound like right legato, also some attack sounds with every note.
2. When I change the tempo fast it sounds like legato and the endnote portamento can be heard now.
3. Back to slow tempo and do some note overlapping, still doesn't sound like right legato.
4. Change the mode to standard, notes with overlapping, it finally sounds right smooth legato and portamento.

Am I missing something or is this a bug in look-ahead mode? 
Thanks.
View attachment TSS Legato.mp4


----------



## MonadoLink

How do I open the library in Kontakt?


----------



## neblix

Batuer said:


> @Andrew Aversa
> Thanks for this great string library. I like it so much. I'm a bit confused about the legato:
> 1. In look-ahead mode, split point legato enabled, under slow tempo, the notes are quantized without overlapping. But it doesn't sound like right legato, also some attack sounds with every note.
> 2. When I change the tempo fast it sounds like legato and the endnote portamento can be heard now.
> 3. Back to slow tempo and do some note overlapping, still doesn't sound like right legato.
> 4. Change the mode to standard, notes with overlapping, it finally sounds right smooth legato and portamento.
> 
> Am I missing something or is this a bug in look-ahead mode?
> Thanks.
> View attachment TSS Legato.mp4


Very strange, Lookahead works both at slow and fast tempos on my end here.

Which DAW is this? Also, can you send this MIDI so I can test if it works here?


----------



## bfreepro

MonadoLink said:


> How do I open the library in Kontakt?


Add it within Native Access using your serial number provided when you purchased the library


----------



## bfreepro

I was playing around with this library for hours last night. The features and attention to detail are incredible. I finally have a rich and super-playable string library that's actually recorded dry... then you add in all the attacks, releases, legato types, man... *chefs kiss*

I found that for what I do, I actually like the decca mic mixes the best (opposed to the board mix) most of the time, though you can hear the board mix makes it a bit thicker and closer. The overall sound is dry but also rich and slightly warm, a really nice mix between detail/intimacy and lushness. Instant spot in the template. Kudos to (fellow MD residents) Impact Soundworks for delivering something truly unique and exciting to the sample game.


----------



## Batuer

neblix said:


> Very strange, Lookahead works both at slow and fast tempos on my end here.
> 
> Which DAW is this? Also, can you send this MIDI so I can test if it works here?


Cubase 10.5
Here is the midi file.

===========
PS: I time-stretch 5 bars to 10 bars, double the tempo, it sounds legato and portamento with the endnote.


----------



## neblix

Batuer said:


> Cubase 10.5
> Here is the midi file.


I will have to test this in Cubase next week when I'm back at the office computer. Unfortunately, your MIDI is working here in Studio One (at all tempos slow and fast), so it may be a DAW specific issue. There is still a possibility TSS can account for it, but no guarantees. I will try to keep you updated on this!

Though, your MIDI did expose an unrelated bug that can be included in this friday's fixes, which is that it seems like releasing the sustain pedal automation (used for your rebow there) is causing it to release notes in the performance 1 second earlier.

That being said, in Lookahead, rebows are automatic, so there is no need for sustain pedal automation. It's only used if you have "Easy Artic" on and want to change legatos to portamentos.


--


As an update for everyone, the Lookahead Tutorial is nearing completion, and should be ready to go live tomorrow (Dec 9th) afternoon!


----------



## Batuer

neblix said:


> I will have to test this in Cubase next week when I'm back at the office computer. Unfortunately, your MIDI is working here in Studio One (at all tempos slow and fast), so it may be a DAW specific issue. There is still a possibility TSS can account for it, but no guarantees. I will try to keep you updated on this!
> 
> Though, your MIDI did expose an unrelated bug that can be included in this friday's fixes, which is that it seems like releasing the sustain pedal automation (used for your rebow there) is causing it to release notes in the performance 1 second earlier.
> 
> That being said, in Lookahead, rebows are automatic, so no need for sustain pedal automation. It's only used if you have "Easy Artic" on and want to change legatos to portamentos.
> 
> 
> --
> 
> 
> As an update for everyone, the Lookahead Tutorial is nearing completion, and should be ready to go live tomorrow (Dec 9th) afternoon!


Thanks for the quick and detailed reply.


----------



## jason3.14

Having fun with TSS so far!

One issue I've noticed so far is that, intermittently my instruments will drop out and not make any more sound whether in playback or when pressing a key on kontakt or in my piano roll. I'm only using the respective board mixes for each instrument, and only have a couple other VSTs open, so it doesn't feel like a pure RAM issue (?), as I've not had this happen with other much larger projects. The only solution I've found so far is to drag in a new patch again, replacing the one with issues, but it's happened fairly frequently. I've only used Lookahead Mode so far, and haven't tested if it happens with other modes yet. I'm using Reaper, btw. Happy to provide other details as necessary.

Your advice/help would be appreciated!


----------



## neblix

jason3.14 said:


> Having fun with TSS so far!
> 
> One issue I've noticed so far is that, intermittently my instruments will drop out and not make any more sound whether in playback or when pressing a key on kontakt or in my piano roll. I'm only using the respective board mixes for each instrument, and only have a couple other VSTs open, so it doesn't feel like a pure RAM issue (?), as I've not had this happen with other much larger projects. The only solution I've found so far is to drag in a new patch again, replacing the one with issues, but it's happened fairly frequently. I've only used Lookahead Mode so far, and haven't tested if it happens with other modes yet. I'm using Reaper, btw. Happy to provide other details as necessary.
> 
> Your advice/help would be appreciated!








Does the voice count here at the top show anything, or is it also 0?


----------



## thorwald

Congrats for the release. I am really happy to see that most parameters are mapped to NKS, especially being able to load/unload microphones is amazing.

A few things:

1. The slow legato in standard mode sounds less natural to me than medium. It's definitely not as detailed, but it might be just my ears.
2. Portamento for the celli is very subtle, compared to the violin or viola patches.
3. Some of the notes have a somewhat unnatural release, as if the notes are fading out. I assume that this can be tweaked via the ADSR controls, but unfortunately I don't see these exposed via NKS.
4. This is possibly very obvious by looking at the UI, which I don't have access to, but is there a way to access the different legato types? It seems like the sustain key switch, I believe on C0, uses only two legato types. It would be nice if the available types were mapped to velocity, or have a separate key switch.
5. It sounds like the vibrato control is also linked to the mod wheel by default, is there a way to unlink it through NKS?
6. Thank you very much for adding a velocity-dependent legato speed option, this makes it really nice to use the library, especially after one very famous "cinematic" one 😀


----------



## EvilDragon

3. We did not want to overdo the NKS controller pages and have dozens of them. NI's recommendation is keeping it around 8 pages, and we already have more than that.
4. You can edit the mappings however you want when you go to Longs/Shorts tabs. This is not via NKS, so you set it up once with mouse and save a snapshot and you're good.
5. You need to use the mouse, right click the Vibrato knob on the GUI and clear the mapping or set it to something else. This is not stored in snapshots, you would have to resave the NKI.


----------



## thorwald

EvilDragon said:


> 3. We did not want to overdo the NKS controller pages and have dozens of them. NI's recommendation is keeping it around 8 pages, and we already have more than that.


This is unfortunately a misconception, and a somewhat contradictory topic even between NI employees. The people who recommend this from NI do not consider that there are users who cannot access any UI control without NKS. For these users, exposing as many parameters as possible through NKS can be a lifesaver. To avoid clutter, parameters that are not used frequently can be moved to later pages, but first they need to be available. This affects one in twenty Komplete Kontrol users, see here: https://blog.native-instruments.com...ed-and-how-its-changing-how-software-is-made/

I unfortunately cannot follow your instructions in step 4 and 5, but it would be wonderful if you could consider exposing these through NKS (or map them to key switches), having them even on later NKS pages would really make a huge difference.


----------



## EvilDragon

Unfortunately nothing can be done regarding point 5, Kontakt's internal MIDI mapping facilities just cannot be transferred to NKS. I suppose you would need a bit of help from a sighted person in order to set that one up. But I just checked and it looks like the vibrato control is NOT mapped to modwheel (CC #1), it is mapped to CC #2 instead. Dynamics control is mapped to modwheel (as is the usual norm).

As for legato types, you can actually access all of them already, I've just checked. So for sustain (C-2) you have bowed legato on velocities 80-127, slurred legato on velocities 20-79. Then for portamentos there's a separate keyswitch group (G-1, G#-1) which decides if the lowest velocities (1-19) use bowed (G-1) or slurred (G#-1) portamento.


----------



## thorwald

EvilDragon said:


> Unfortunately nothing can be done regarding point 5, Kontakt's internal MIDI mapping facilities just cannot be transferred to NKS. I suppose you would need a bit of help from a sighted person in order to set that one up. But I just checked and it looks like the vibrato control is NOT mapped to modwheel (CC #1), it is mapped to CC #2 instead. Dynamics control is mapped to modwheel (as is the usual norm).


Ah yes, NKS can be quite limited sometimes, so it's perfectly understandable that this is out of your control.

Interesting regarding the vibrato control, To me, it sounds like on the highest dynamics there's quite a bit more vibrato than on lower ones, but perhaps this is how the musicians played those notes.



EvilDragon said:


> As for legato types, you can actually access all of them already, I've just checked. So for sustain (C-2) you have bowed legato on velocities 80-127, slurred legato on velocities 20-79. Then for portamentos there's a separate keyswitch group (G-1, G#-1) which decides if the lowest velocities (1-19) use bowed (G-1) or slurred (G#-1) portamento.


This is super helpful, thank you! Is there any chance these key switches could be mentioned in the manual? I know these are quite obvious when looking at the UI, just in case someone's lazy or can't see ☺️

In this case please disregard my portamento comment, it could have happened easily that I accidentally switched them when exploring key switches, hence I wasn't getting the bolder portamento sound I was expecting.

Thanks again, and I'm sorry for derailing the topic slightly 🤭


----------



## Batuer

@neblix
I made expressionmap in Cubase for TSS but it's not working, especially for legato type changing. But the key switch function is working fine.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

thorwald said:


> Ah yes, NKS can be quite limited sometimes, so it's perfectly understandable that this is out of your control.
> 
> Interesting regarding the vibrato control, To me, it sounds like on the highest dynamics there's quite a bit more vibrato than on lower ones, but perhaps this is how the musicians played those notes.
> 
> This is super helpful, thank you! Is there any chance these key switches could be mentioned in the manual? I know these are quite obvious when looking at the UI, just in case someone's lazy or can't see ☺️
> 
> In this case please disregard my portamento comment, it could have happened easily that I accidentally switched them when exploring key switches, hence I wasn't getting the bolder portamento sound I was expecting.
> 
> Thanks again, and I'm sorry for derailing the topic slightly 🤭



Regarding the amount of vibrato based on dynamics, yes, this was exactly as the ensemble performed those notes. Our direction was to play naturally. To that end, we did not simply have them perform single notes in a vacuum. We wrote musical scores and backing tracks. That way we could capture more of the expression and emotion they would have when playing 'real' music.

Regarding the default keyswitches, I think we could put that in the manual, but we'd have to specify that these are just defaults - users can change them anytime!


----------



## thorwald

Andrew Aversa said:


> Regarding the amount of vibrato based on dynamics, yes, this was exactly as the ensemble performed those notes. Our direction was to play naturally. To that end, we did not simply have them perform single notes in a vacuum. We wrote musical scores and backing tracks. That way we could capture more of the expression and emotion they would have when playing 'real' music.
> 
> Regarding the default keyswitches, I think we could put that in the manual, but we'd have to specify that these are just defaults - users can change them anytime!


Thanks for explaining this, the musicality of the library is certainly appreciated, in fact I have a client who specifically waited for the TSS release so that their product could have this very specific string sound. This also makes it clear why the vibrato control does not affect the vibrato as much on higher dynamics.

Regarding the manual, I think the possibility of being able to customise the key switches is mentioned, but you are absolutely right of course, this needs to be clear.


----------



## Trash Panda

@Andrew Aversa @neblix I am absolutely loving this so far. The sound is exactly what I've been looking for and the way Lookahead mode is implemented is amazing for draw-it-in users like me. 

I have a few quick questions that I wasn't able to answer reading the manual or watching the videos. Apologies if I missed something in the documentation.


Legato transition and release options are only applied to Arco, correct?
If I'm creating snapshots, will these still work when an update is applied to the library?
Is the Overlay slider on each Long articulation intended to be independently assignable to different CC's (e.g. CC16 for Arco, CC17 for Tremolo)?


----------



## EvilDragon

thorwald said:


> Ah yes, NKS can be quite limited sometimes, so it's perfectly understandable that this is out of your control.


It's more about: NKS only works with parameters that are host automatable. And you cannot assign a dropdown menu entry in Kontakt to a host automation slot (nor does that even make sense).


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

Trash Panda said:


> Legato transition and release options are only applied to Arco, correct?


You can use legato with tremolo or trills by clicking the "..." button under them in TACT to change it to the connected-notes symbol. The optional release types also work with other long artics.


----------



## Trash Panda

Sarah Mancuso said:


> You can use legato with tremolo or trills by clicking the "..." button under them in TACT to change it to the connected-notes symbol. The optional release types also work with other long artics.


Amazing. Y'all seem to have thought of everything.


----------



## pebble

(*spongebob narrator voice*) many hours later.........


----------



## ansthenia

i'm stupid why can't I get legato to work. Arco articulation with legato on, set to mono legato mode, but there is no legato, the previous note just carries on sustaining over the new note.


----------



## Trash Panda

ansthenia said:


> i'm stupid why can't I get legato to work. Arco articulation with legato on, set to mono legato mode, but there is no legato, the previous note just carries on sustaining over the new note.


Which mode are you in at the bottom of the Perform tab?

Zero latency disables legato.

Lookahead requires notes touching, but not overlapping.

Standard is the typical scenario with overlapping notes triggering legato in mono mode.


----------



## ansthenia

Trash Panda said:


> Which mode are you in at the bottom of the Perform tab?
> 
> Zero latency disables legato.
> 
> Lookahead requires notes touching, but not overlapping.
> 
> Standard is the typical scenario with overlapping notes triggering legato in mono mode.


Ahh I see, thank you! I had it on look ahead. I was too impatient to watch walkthrough video before trying legato out, aha....


----------



## lucky909091

After playing around with the "Tokyo Scoring Strings", I fell in love with the library (although I bought two other great string libraries at the same time. You can guess which ones...). 

Just the look-ahead function seems to be not self-explaining to me. 
Is there any detailed explanation of this function in the internet?


----------



## Trash Panda

lucky909091 said:


> After playing around with the "Tokyo Scoring Strings", I fell in love with the library (although I bought two other great string libraries at the same time. You can guess which ones...).
> 
> Just the look-ahead function seems to be not self-explaining to me.
> Is there any detailed explanation of this function in the internet?





https://impactsoundworks.com/Manuals/Tokyo%20Scoring%20Strings%20Manual.pdf



Page 17 is where it starts. I think there's a video coming too.


----------



## filipjonathan

lucky909091 said:


> After playing around with the "Tokyo Scoring Strings", I fell in love with the library (although I bought two other great string libraries at the same time. You can guess which ones...).
> 
> Just the look-ahead function seems to be not self-explaining to me.
> Is there any detailed explanation of this function in the internet?


The lookahead walkthrough video should be up very soon (today)


----------



## Andrew Aversa

The Lookahead full tutorial by @neblix premieres on YouTube at 3pm EST!


----------



## neblix

Batuer said:


> @neblix
> I made expressionmap in Cubase for TSS but it's not working, especially for legato type changing. But the key switch function is working fine.


I'm not sure I know how Cubase Expression Maps work or if I could help with that. Let me get back to you next week after installing Cubase. I know that @babylonwaves intends to support TSS in Art Conductor, which does use Cubase Expression Maps, maybe he can shed some light if I can't figure it out.



lucky909091 said:


> Just the look-ahead function seems to be not self-explaining to me.
> Is there any detailed explanation of this function in the internet?


So sorry about this; the unfortunate thing is, Lookahead is such a radically different way to use sample libraries that there's no way for it at all to be self-explanatory, especially because it doesn't do anything when playing at the keyboard while DAW is paused (only activates when DAW is playing).

I highly recommend watching the tutorial video, which is dropping in about half an hour!


----------



## biggiantcircles

Great info, now I completely get how the look-ahead works, easy mode!


----------



## thorwald

Thanks @neblix for the tutorial, and for mentioning that more automation might come our way ☺️


----------



## neblix

thorwald said:


> Thanks @neblix for the tutorial, and for mentioning that more automation might come our way ☺️


So sorry; in fact, when I was writing the script, I realized the Lookahead Option buttons were not host automatable at all. Almost every parameter in TSS is host automatable and midi learnable, even stuff like articulation ADSR -- most are just not listed in NKS.

So at the time, I quickly enabled them for automation, and tried it, but it didn't seem to work. Library was already released and video was due, so I decided to amend the script to say we'll get it in later.


----------



## jason3.14

neblix said:


> Does the voice count here at the top show anything, or is it also 0?


I believe it showed voice count of 0. Midi input seemed to be triggering but then no sound would come out, if that helps clarify. I can double check again on Saturday though at the very latest if it happens again. Thanks!


----------



## neblix

jason3.14 said:


> I believe it showed voice count of 0. Midi input seemed to be triggering but then no sound would come out, if that helps clarify. I can double check again on Saturday though at the very latest if it happens again. Thanks!


I'll have to see! In the meantime, there is no need to reload your patch when this happens. Just click the " ! " button at the top of Kontakt, which resets the engine, and the playback should come back.


----------



## thorwald

neblix said:


> Library was already released and video was due, so I decided to amend the script to say we'll get it in later.


No worries. Later is a lot better than never, I can imagine that these few months were quite hectic too. A company which shall not be named taught us that quality comes with time. 😀


----------



## jason3.14

neblix said:


> I'll have to see! In the meantime, there is no need to reload your patch when this happens. Just click the " ! " button at the top of Kontakt, which resets the engine, and the playback should come back.


Ah thanks for the tip! Will try that out in the meantime and let you know if I notice anything else. Looking forward to catching up on the rest of the thread/walkthrough, library seems great so far!


----------



## AndyP

Finally I spontaneously decided in favor of TSS. They just sound so damn good. Since I have saved a lot of money on the BF was still a little bit left to buy the library.


----------



## ansthenia

Playing around with this library, and i haven't been this inspired in a loooong time.


----------



## ALittleNightMusic

Let's hear some user demos!


----------



## N.Caffrey

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Let's hear some user demos!


Exactly!!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Join us for a live Q&A and showcase about the library, plus a bit of talk about future plans, at 9PM EST!


----------



## jason3.14

neblix said:


> Does the voice count here at the top show anything, or is it also 0?


I checked on my project just now, which I had left open and hadn't touched since about 2:30PM PT yesterday. It seems that all the Board Mix patches (Violins 1 through Contrabasses) had gone silent in the interim since using it yesterday (looks visually like it's playing/activating, but no audio coming out), similar to as mentioned previously. But it does show a nonzero voice count number: here's an example.






That said, clicking the "!" at the top right of Kontakt does temporarily solve the issue like you mentioned, until it happens again.

Thanks for looking into it!


----------



## AndyP

TSS + LASS3 ... 
They layer so well together, and are so agile to play. Great.

I'll probably be busy with this for a while.

TSS sounds great on its own. Very well done.


----------



## lzcmusic

First of all, congratulations on the TSS release. It’s good everywhere. I like sound very much. I have done design work before and may have strict visual requirements.

Allow me to make a very, very small comment:

1. The font of the library label picture is not clear, especially the Japanese font. I don't know what caused it.

2. The background of the label picture can put a light-colored violin picture, so as to highlight that this is a string sound library.

I hope ISW can improve it after seeing it, it shouldn't be very troublesome.


I think the two pictures on the right are ideal for reference：






Thanks for ISW for making such an excellent string library.


----------



## EvilDragon

Personally, I don't like how the violin backdrop gets cut off in both of the examples to the right. It also makes it busier for no real need IMO. I think readability is fine.


----------



## lzcmusic

The leftmost font is blurred, and the Japanese details are incomplete


Maybe you don’t know how to write Kanji



Increase the brightness of the display and compare carefully.............


----------



## zedmaster

I think the original is perfectly fine. Let's go write some actual music with this gem?


----------



## EvilDragon

Agreed on that account!


----------



## filipjonathan

I mean, it says _strings_ right there in the picture so I don't see the need for a picture of a violin.


----------



## N.Caffrey

So much better as it is now, not even comparable in my opinion


----------



## Cheezus

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Let's hear some user demos!


I wrote this one in anticipation of TSS a couple months ago using CSS. Was very satisfying to finally put TSS through its paces with this.

I've attached both versions here. I think CSS might actually fit the piece slightly better (maybe because I'm also using CSW and CSB, plus I wrote it with CSS), but TSS stacks up very well against it and was MUCH easier to use with fully quantized MIDI data.


----------



## Drumdude2112

These sound great….sorry i didn’t pre order them…what was the pre-order price (ie…..what did i miss lol ?)


----------



## RMH

Cheezus said:


> I wrote this one in anticipation of TSS a couple months ago using CSS. Was very satisfying to finally put TSS through its paces with this.
> 
> I've attached both versions here. I think CSS might actually fit the piece slightly better (maybe because I'm also using CSW and CSB, plus I wrote it with CSS), but TSS stacks up very well against it and was MUCH easier to use with fully quantized MIDI data.


The song's idea is good and the balance is good, too! TSS feels more rush than CSS.
I'm curious about the midi file. Can I get it if I ask for it personally?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

lzcmusic said:


> The leftmost font is blurred, and the Japanese details are incomplete
> 
> Maybe you don’t know how to write Kanji
> 
> Increase the brightness of the display and compare carefully.............



I think the font issue is because of the image size in Kontakt. Unfortunately, we cannot control the image scaling in the library tab. The original image and font is very high resolution... ごめんなさい。。。


----------



## tcb

Talk Japanese character only,the kanji 東京 and katakanas excepe コン are incomplete,the lowest parts are partly cut.


----------



## filipjonathan

Cheezus said:


> I wrote this one in anticipation of TSS a couple months ago using CSS. Was very satisfying to finally put TSS through its paces with this.
> 
> I've attached both versions here. I think CSS might actually fit the piece slightly better (maybe because I'm also using CSW and CSB, plus I wrote it with CSS), but TSS stacks up very well against it and was MUCH easier to use with fully quantized MIDI data.


Ahh this is so good! The 0:33 part is everything! I prefer TSS timbre here.


----------



## filipjonathan

@Cheezus Actually a screencast of the piece would be amazing!


----------



## Loïc D

Andrew Aversa said:


> I think the font issue is because of the image size in Kontakt. Unfortunately, we cannot control the image scaling in the library tab. The original image and font is very high resolution... ごめんなさい。。。


大丈夫ですよ！


----------



## mybadmemory

Cheezus said:


> I wrote this one in anticipation of TSS a couple months ago using CSS. Was very satisfying to finally put TSS through its paces with this.
> 
> I've attached both versions here. I think CSS might actually fit the piece slightly better (maybe because I'm also using CSW and CSB, plus I wrote it with CSS), but TSS stacks up very well against it and was MUCH easier to use with fully quantized MIDI data.


Wonderful piece of music!


----------



## Cheezus

filipjonathan said:


> @Cheezus Actually a screencast of the piece would be amazing!


I might do it! Just need to figure out how to do a screencast first


----------



## filipjonathan

Cheezus said:


> I might do it! Just need to figure out how to do a screencast first


Record screen + add the wav of the song et voila!


----------



## mohsohsenshi

Just got my serial numbers and download it! Very excited to try it. A short test to get an impression of its board mix and then a mix with 7thHeaven reverb.

Sounds lovely and I can say it's as good as any top strings libraries in the market, and I prefer its studio sound which is versatile to any scene.

Board mix:

With reverb:


----------



## Trash Panda

mohsohsenshi said:


> Just got my serial numbers and download it! Very excited to try it. A short test to get an impression of its board mix and then a mix with 7thHeaven reverb.
> 
> Sounds lovely and I can say it's as good as any top strings libraries in the market, and I prefer its studio sound which is versatile to any scene.
> 
> Board mix:
> 
> With reverb:


Sounds like a game over screen straight out of a JRPG.


----------



## muziksculp

Can we expect the update to be released at the end of the day today ?


----------



## Evans

mohsohsenshi said:


> Just got my serial numbers and download it! Very excited to try it. A short test to get an impression of its board mix and then a mix with 7thHeaven reverb.
> 
> Sounds lovely and I can say it's as good as any top strings libraries in the market, and I prefer its studio sound which is versatile to any scene.


Awesome! That last chord is totally bringing me back to Masashi Hamauzu. Rich and _well placed._


----------



## neblix

Pairing TSS in Lookahead with other wind and brass libraries introduces some challenges people may not expect; traditional orchestral libraries have a lot of lag to them, even the shorts. Even some piano libraries have a slight bit of lead-up to the notes. I tried to find a middle ground for TSS's sync by syncing it to the piano I use (Keyscape) while writing my Lookahead demo.

In the end, you can always adjust the global sync of TSS by using your "track delay" in the DAW, usually values up to +/- 50ms are sufficient. For really sluggish orchestral libraries, you ideally should be templating their tracks to have their own negative delay. For example I usually moved CSS back by around 40-50ms whenever I used their shorts in the past.

And of course, TSS lets you adjust the Lookahead timing of the legatos and portas individually in the articulation tabs when you click on their names, if you want to finetune.






When the full orchestra is available with Lookahead, we will have ensured that TSS, TSW, and TSB all sound great together, with a realistic sync. We will also consult orchestrators experienced in concert music to help everything feel more realistic.


----------



## re-peat

Can I make one small suggestion: add a parameter to allow control of the attack of the shorts (spicc’s especially) with velocity. Makes them infinitely more versatile: you can go from delicately ‘brushed’ to snappily affirmative, all with one articulation.
(I can set it up like that already by doing some under-the-hood editing in Kontakt, but it would be more convenient of course to be able to configure it on the GUI. Besides, user-editing in Kontakt is a bit limited because it is often overridden by the scripts.)

Oh, and separate patches, one for the longs and one for the shorts, would indeed be most welcome. If you're doing parts that only require the latter, there's no need to have the former loaded as well (or vice versa), I feel.

But: a *very* fine library. Thanks!

_


----------



## neblix

lzcmusic said:


> First of all, congratulations on the TSS release. It’s good everywhere. I like sound very much. I have done design work before and may have strict visual requirements.
> 
> Allow me to make a very, very small comment:
> 
> 1. The font of the library label picture is not clear, especially the Japanese font. I don't know what caused it.
> 
> 2. The background of the label picture can put a light-colored violin picture, so as to highlight that this is a string sound library.
> 
> I hope ISW can improve it after seeing it, it shouldn't be very troublesome.
> 
> 
> I think the two pictures on the right are ideal for reference：
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for ISW for making such an excellent string library.


We have been discussing this internally and are trying to think of a solution. Unfortunately, like Andrew said, it's a scaling issue from the original logo. We may have to manually edit it.


----------



## filipjonathan

Here is a part of a piece I wrote earlier this year with CSS. I really like how TSS sounds on this. Very lush and romantic but that's also due to the writing.
Lookahead mode on, easy artics off. Dynamic range 131%. A tiny bit of EQ plus Seventh Heaven.
Vln 1 plays in octaves while vln 2 plays 3 and 4 voice chords. Poly legato is such a time and resource saver!

*Edit* It's called Reminiscing not Remiscing 😂


----------



## neblix

re-peat said:


> Oh, and separate patches, one for the longs and one for the shorts, would indeed be most welcome. If you're doing parts that only require the latter, there's no need to have the former loaded as well (or vice versa), I feel.
> 
> But: a *very* fine library. Thanks!
> 
> _


It's very difficult to maintain a library when you distribute it with separated patches. This means any update you make to the main patches, you also must duplicate those changes to the other patches.

In the case of your suggestion, a longs vs. short for all 5 sections and both mic mixer variants would take our nki count from 10 to 30.

However, we might be able to explore using the "Snapshots" feature in Kontakt for this purpose instead! In the meantime, "alt-click" on the articulation panels you want to purge is a band-aid solution.



re-peat said:


> Can I make one small suggestion: add a parameter to allow control of the attack of the shorts (spicc’s especially) with velocity. Makes them infinitely more versatile: you can go from delicately ‘brushed’ to snappily affirmative, all with one articulation.


Interesting! This is essentially what the "Swell" option does on Longs, I never thought of doing it on the shorts as well. We'll talk to the UI designer about where the option could be put.


----------



## jvms

Hey guys, I was just checking the QnA that happened last night and a book used to teach music in Japan was mentioned. Did anyone happen to catch it's name? I'd love to check it out.


----------



## filipjonathan

jvms said:


> Hey guys, I was just checking the QnA that happened last night and a book used to teach music in Japan was mentioned. Did anyone happen to catch it's name? I'd love to check it out.


Check the ISW discord


----------



## Trash Panda

filipjonathan said:


> Check the ISW discord


Where does one find the address for it?


----------



## muziksculp

I'm guessing the book mentioned is in Japanese.


----------



## tonio_

filipjonathan said:


> Check the ISW discord


Could you throw me an invite please?


----------



## filipjonathan

tonio_ said:


> Could you throw me an invite please?











Discord - A New Way to Chat with Friends & Communities


Discord is the easiest way to communicate over voice, video, and text. Chat, hang out, and stay close with your friends and communities.




discord.gg


----------



## averystemmler

Loving the library so far!

Does anyone happen to know the (precise or approximate) latency of the legato transitions at each speed in Standard mode? And for the attack of the shorts (at -0ms offset)? I don't see this in the manual.

I ask because, while I think the Lookahead mode is fantastic and should be a new standard for orchestral libraries, I'm exploring various ways to integrate TSS into my workflow, alongside less forward-thinking libraries. I have some scripts I use to shift note-ons around, and I'd like to have a sense for how TSS's natural latencies line up.


----------



## Evans

Is anyone noticing that the room sometimes gets excited with either a high "ping" sound or with something that occasionally sounds like a high pitched, heavily EQ'd jaw harp (there's a twang to it)?

I'm starting to test Violins 1 at around F#3 and up about an octave, and hearing it on both the tremolo and spiccato patches. No other effects turned on in Cubase, totally empty chain.

F#3 on spiccato, B3 on trem are some of the loudest instances of it.


----------



## muziksculp

By the way, TSS version 1.0.2 is up on PULSE Downloader. (It was posted on Discord by Andrew A. )

I will finally go ahead with installing TSS. I was waiting for this update to be posted before downloading the library.


----------



## filipjonathan

Evans said:


> Is anyone noticing that the room sometimes gets excited with either a high "ping" sound or with something that occasionally sounds like a high pitched, heavily EQ'd jaw harp (there's a twang to it)?
> 
> I'm starting to test Violins 1 at around F#3 and up about an octave, and hearing it on both the tremolo and spiccato patches. No other effects turned on in Cubase, totally empty chain.
> 
> F#3 on spiccato, B3 on trem are some of the loudest instances of it.


Is the thing you hear similar to what can be heard here at 0:26?


----------



## Evans

filipjonathan said:


> Is the thing you hear similar to what can be heard here at 0:26?


Pretty close, yes! Must be known? Sometimes, it's a ping. Sometimes, it has more _twang_ than a simple ping. Caught it earlier, forgot to post, will share audio tonight or this weekend but should be easy to replicate.


----------



## Batuer

Here is a short taste sound out of the box just with a little reverb. Love this library.  

View attachment Princess Mononok(TSS).mp3


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

averystemmler said:


> Does anyone happen to know the (precise or approximate) latency of the legato transitions at each speed in Standard mode?


Somewhere between 225 and 240 milliseconds should work for slow legato, and subtract 50 for each step of speed increase from there.


----------



## neblix

Sarah Mancuso said:


> Somewhere between 225 and 240 milliseconds should work for slow legato, and subtract 25 for each step of speed increase from there.


But the offset differences are 50ms each?



Evans said:


> Is anyone noticing that the room sometimes gets excited with either a high "ping" sound or with something that occasionally sounds like a high pitched, heavily EQ'd jaw harp (there's a twang to it)?
> 
> I'm starting to test Violins 1 at around F#3 and up about an octave, and hearing it on both the tremolo and spiccato patches. No other effects turned on in Cubase, totally empty chain.
> 
> F#3 on spiccato, B3 on trem are some of the loudest instances of it.


Yup, it's been reported!


----------



## Trash Panda

At the risk of sounding fanboyish, I think it's telling at just how much was done right with this product if the strongest criticism is leveled at the Kontakt Library tab logo.


----------



## filipjonathan

Trash Panda said:


> At the risk of sounding fanboyish, I think it's telling at just how much was done right with this product if the strongest criticism is leveled at the Kontakt Library tab logo.


I mean, people gotta complain about _something _right?


----------



## synergy543

jvms said:


> Hey guys, I was just checking the QnA that happened last night and a book used to teach music in Japan was mentioned. Did anyone happen to catch it's name? I'd love to check it out.


It a Japanese translation of the Widor Technique of Modern Orchestration. Here is a link to the English version:








The technique of the modern orchestra; a manual of practical instrumentation : Widor, Charles Marie, 1844-1937 : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive


The metadata below describe the original scanning. Follow the All Files: HTTP link in the View the book box to the left to find XML files that contain more...



archive.org


----------



## Tim Clarke

tonio_ said:


> Could you throw me an invite please?


I would like one too.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

neblix said:


> But the offset differences are 50ms each?



You’re right, my mistake. Fixed!


----------



## filipjonathan

Tim Clarke said:


> I would like one too.











Discord - A New Way to Chat with Friends & Communities


Discord is the easiest way to communicate over voice, video, and text. Chat, hang out, and stay close with your friends and communities.




discord.gg


----------



## tonio_

Evans said:


> Is anyone noticing that the room sometimes gets excited with either a high "ping" sound or with something that occasionally sounds like a high pitched, heavily EQ'd jaw harp (there's a twang to it)?
> 
> I'm starting to test Violins 1 at around F#3 and up about an octave, and hearing it on both the tremolo and spiccato patches. No other effects turned on in Cubase, totally empty chain.
> 
> F#3 on spiccato, B3 on trem are some of the loudest instances of it.


Yep, I'm getting that too, I was wondering whether my ears were playing tricks on me


----------



## lzcmusic

Andrew Aversa said:


> I think the font issue is because of the image size in Kontakt. Unfortunately, we cannot control the image scaling in the library tab. The original image and font is very high resolution... ごめんなさい。。。


Don't use large resolution to zoom directly to small, just create the size of the library picture and type text on it, the text will be clear and bright.Pictures from other manufacturers do not have this problem






As an oriental, I cannot accept that kanji has incomplete strokes, and the bottom of the library label Japanese text is truncated. Please correct it, thank you.


Or give me the correct font and I will regenerate a clear nicnt embedded picture for you.








ありがとう


----------



## Jackdnp121

lzcmusic said:


> Don't use large resolution to zoom directly to small, just create the size of the library picture and type text on it, the text will be clear and bright.Pictures from other manufacturers do not have this problem
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As an oriental, I cannot accept that kanji has incomplete strokes, and the bottom of the library label Japanese text is truncated. Please correct it, thank you.
> 
> 
> Or give me the correct font and I will regenerate a clear nicnt embedded picture for you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ありがとう


Calm down mate ... 

sure it is a tiny scaling problem 

but it is a strings library not commercial poster ... don't worry is ok ... they will eventually fix it 

now go write some beautiful music


----------



## neblix

We're happy to look at the feedback, no need to tell them to calm down. It's a valid point, the kanji is actually cut off.


----------



## Jackdnp121

neblix said:


> We're happy to look at the feedback, no need to tell them to calm down. It's a valid point, the kanji is actually cut off.


Yo , I'm actually speaking more for myself .. feedbacks are great and maybe it is just me feeling strange seeing people focusing so much on tiny font problem on a string library that just launched ... when developer can actually spent more time on fixing some bugs and improve on the Virtual instrument ... and also " Calm down mate " is actually pretty chill word over here ... 

thanks .. take care


----------



## dhmusic

Jackdnp121 said:


> now go write some beautiful music


Do you think you'll do another Octopath track with TSS?


----------



## jvms

synergy543 said:


> It a Japanese translation of the Widor Technique of Modern Orchestration. Here is a link to the English version:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The technique of the modern orchestra; a manual of practical instrumentation : Widor, Charles Marie, 1844-1937 : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive
> 
> 
> The metadata below describe the original scanning. Follow the All Files: HTTP link in the View the book box to the left to find XML files that contain more...
> 
> 
> 
> archive.org


Thanks a bunch! I'll give it a read!


----------



## averystemmler

Sarah Mancuso said:


> Somewhere between 225 and 240 milliseconds should work for slow legato, and subtract 50 for each step of speed increase from there.





neblix said:


> But the offset differences are 50ms each?



Thank you both!


----------



## Zelos

neblix said:


> Yup, it's been reported!


So this "ping" sound... is that something that can be fixed? Or is that in the recording? Because I'm listening to the soundcloud example linked a few posts above yours and, to be honest, that's terrible. It makes those notes completely unusable for me. There can't just be an additional high pitched sound when certain notes are played - that destroys the entire mix.


----------



## filipjonathan

Zelos said:


> So this "ping" sound... is that something that can be fixed? Or is that in the recording? Because I'm listening to the soundcloud example linked a few posts above yours and, to be honest, that's terrible. It makes those notes completely unusable for me. There can't just be an additional high pitched sound when certain notes are played - that destroys the entire mix.


The developers are aware of the issue and have pinpointed the specific rr that contains the problematic noise and will address it in a future update.


----------



## william81723

@neblix I was setting my template, and I found I love the shorts' sounds the best when their offsets time are at 0(that means they have full length).
But....I would like to have the same offset's decrease on sustain articulations,because I want to quantize them and shift their positions together. TSS's sustains' default offset now is already set to 0 and it can't be lower.
As for legato,I use velocity mode and I made Cubase's logical editor presets to deal with it,so no any problem with legato's offset.
It's the best and fastest method for me to compose music!!!
So if possible~~I want to set "sustain articulations and its overlayed shorts" and all shorts articulations' offets can have same time values.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso

william81723 said:


> @neblix I was setting my template, and I found I love the shorts' sounds the best when their offsets time are at 0(that means they have full length).
> But....I would like to have the same offset's decrease on sustain articulations,because I want to quantize them and shift their positions together. TSS's sustains' default offset now is already set to 0 and it can't be lower.
> As for legato,I use velocity mode and I made Cubase's logical editor presets to deal with it,so no any problem with legato's offset.
> It's the best and fastest method for me to compose music!!!
> So if possible~~I want to set "sustain articulations and its overlayed shorts" and all shorts articulations' offets can have same time values.


For this, I would recommend engaging Lookahead mode with "Pure Attack" enabled in order to draw neatly on the grid while getting the full pre-transient of every note. It's exactly what the Pure Attack feature is for.


----------



## Raphioli

mohsohsenshi said:


> Just got my serial numbers and download it! Very excited to try it. A short test to get an impression of its board mix and then a mix with 7thHeaven reverb.
> 
> Sounds lovely and I can say it's as good as any top strings libraries in the market, and I prefer its studio sound which is versatile to any scene.
> 
> Board mix:
> 
> With reverb:


wow, I felt like I saw/heard a different dimension/side of TSS. Great short piece!


----------



## william81723

Sarah Mancuso said:


> For this, I would recommend engaging Lookahead mode with "Pure Attack" enabled in order to draw neatly on the grid while getting the full pre-transient of every note. It's exactly what the Pure Attack feature is for.


The reason I don't like using Lookahead mode is because that makes too quantized feelings... I can't let the legato's transients random a bit because it can't overlap the note..
I would rather use me logical editor to deal with legato.
In that way,I just need to press my shortcut key on legato notes and other articulations can just be quantized(with some random parameters).
But in Lookahead mode, I have to clear all the tails of the overlap notes.It's really not my habit~~
That's why I love the previous way to compose my music~~

I really need that feature I mentioned~ I just feel smooth in that way personally!!!
Thanks for making Lookahead mode.That give me more options!! I won't give up trying it,but I just want the standard mode can be more perfect!!


----------



## Loïc D

william81723 said:


> The reason I don't like using Lookahead mode is because that makes too quantized feelings... I can't let the legato's transients random a bit because it can't overlap the note..
> I would rather use me logical editor to deal with legato.
> In that way,I just need to press my shortcut key on legato notes and other articulations can just be quantized(with some random parameters).
> But in Lookahead mode, I have to clear all the tails of the overlap notes.It's really not my habit~~
> That's why I love the previous way to compose my music~~
> 
> I really need that feature I mentioned~ I just feel smooth in that way personally!!!
> Thanks for making Lookahead mode.That give me more options!! I won't give up trying it,but I just want the standard mode can be more perfect!!


I don’t know which DAW you’re using but most of them have functions to coean overlaps or connect notes.


----------



## william81723

Loïc D said:


> I don’t know which DAW you’re using but most of them have functions to coean overlaps or connect notes.


Oh yeah! I think you are right~
Maybe I’m just not used to it.
However I still love standard mode at this time.
Thanks for the reminder!


----------



## Cheezus

Andrew Qualls said:


> Hello all! I am new here to this thread of TSS and am considering buying this before the promotional period ends but just want to waiting for more feedback or final conclusions near that time.
> 
> I know it might be to early to ask this but does anyone have any thoughts of this library compared to CSS in terms of sound, flexibility, etc?


I personally think TSS is the new standard. From sound to depth of sampling to ease of use, it’s just better in every way.


----------



## Trash Panda

Andrew Qualls said:


> Hello all! I am new here to this thread of TSS and am considering buying this before the promotional period ends but just want to waiting for more feedback or final conclusions near that time.
> 
> I know it might be to early to ask this but does anyone have any thoughts of this library compared to CSS in terms of sound, flexibility, etc?


Apples and hand grenades really. It would be better to start a new thread in Sample Talk for such discussion than to do that in a commercial announcement thread.


----------



## Evans

Andrew Qualls said:


> I know it might be to early to ask this but does anyone have any thoughts of this library compared to CSS in terms of sound, flexibility, etc?


Hey! Good question.

First, I am going to be "that guy" as well and call out that competitor discussion in the Commercial Announcements board (where developers pay for the privilege to post) is usually frowned upon (even if the ISW crew is nice about it and lets this keep going). I think people would be super welcome to a conversation like this in the Sample Talk board, as I don't think one is there yet.

Second, without outright comparing quality to each other, I'll say they are _wildly_ different libraries that share very little overlap except for the fact that violins, violas, cellos, and basses were recorded. The raw sound is different. The articulations are different. The legato approach is different. And then TSS includes a Lookahead feature that is very rare for the industry. Among many other differences.

Just listening to the demos and reading about the features and what was recorded should help you at least disqualify one from your search, I think. They're simply so darn different.

So, yeah, apples and hand grenades indeed.


----------



## neblix

william81723 said:


> The reason I don't like using Lookahead mode is because that makes too quantized feelings... I can't let the legato's transients random a bit because it can't overlap the note..


The overlap constraint was really the only way to process polyphonic legato, and I'm not 100% happy with making everyone quantize this way, but the value of what could be done with poly legato was too important! If you want polyphonic legato in Standard mode, it does support overlaps using the "Latency" knob, next to the Legato Mode button.

This is why Lookahead is optional. The library was entirely tested and demo'd with Standard mode for a majority of the timeline, and all the work ensured that it was pleasant to use and sounded good in that sense. Lookahead is just a bonus on top; even if you don't use it, TSS will still sound great and, imo, still be easier to use, more powerful, and behave more consistently than competitors.


----------



## jason3.14

I've been working on the Octopath Traveler theme "Ophilia, The Cleric". Used the board mix, Lookahead Mode with Pure Attack, but w/o Easy Artic (no particular reason), Con Sordino on Violins 1/2 and Violas. Only other instruments are some flute and horn instances from Nucleus, and a free harp. There is processing on board but wonder if it was for the better or for the worse? 

Hope you like it, and appreciate feedback too!



@Adam Hooper


----------



## Adam Hooper

I love this! Showcases the library off well!


----------



## mybadmemory

jason3.14 said:


> I've been working on the Octopath Traveler theme "Ophilia, The Cleric". Used the board mix, Lookahead Mode with Pure Attack, but w/o Easy Artic (no particular reason), Con Sordino on Violins 1/2 and Violas. Only other instruments are some flute and horn instances from Nucleus, and a free harp. There is processing on board but wonder if it was for the better or for the worse?
> 
> Hope you like it, and appreciate feedback too!
> 
> 
> 
> @Adam Hooper


Beautiful rendition! If anything, the strings might sound a little loud while entering, drowning out the flute somewhat, but overall it’s great! 🥰


----------



## jason3.14

Adam Hooper said:


> I love this! Showcases the library off well!





mybadmemory said:


> Beautiful rendition! If anything, the strings might sound a little loud while entering, drowning out the flute somewhat, but overall it’s great! 🥰


Thank you guys!  Yea I agree, probably was loud particularly compared to the original haha. Perhaps I'll be on to another Octopath cover soon!


----------



## william81723

neblix said:


> The overlap constraint was really the only way to process polyphonic legato, and I'm not 100% happy with making everyone quantize this way, but the value of what could be done with poly legato was too important! If you want polyphonic legato in Standard mode, it does support overlaps using the "Latency" knob, next to the Legato Mode button.
> 
> This is why Lookahead is optional. The library was entirely tested and demo'd with Standard mode for a majority of the timeline, and all the work ensured that it was pleasant to use and sounded good in that sense. Lookahead is just a bonus on top; even if you don't use it, TSS will still sound great and, imo, still be easier to use, more powerful, and behave more consistently than competitors.


I can understand it~ but the problem in standard mode now is when we set shorts' offset to 0,we would hear "ARCO's head" first before we hear the overlay "Shorts' transient".
That's not natural.
So what I request and I need is an option to set ARCO(or sustain)'s samples start time delay a bit more(More offset).


----------



## neblix

william81723 said:


> I can understand it~ but the problem in standard mode now is when we set shorts' offset to 0,we would hear "ARCO's head" first before we hear the overlay "Shorts' transient".
> That's not natural.
> So what I request and I need is an option to set ARCO(or sustain)'s samples start time delay a bit more(More offset).


I understand the issue now.

I'm not sure we will look at this, it's an extremely specific use case. 0ms offset for the shorts is really far too much latency for them in normal playing, and Pure Attack was put in Lookahead because it was understood the user would only tolerate 0 offset (full sample) in playback, but not in recording.

Adding a dynamic delay in Standard mode that is based on the timing of shorts, I am really nervous about making the code unstable. Try to understand, we don't want to put out a patch that has hanging notes and such.

I will add this as a ticket for 1.1; perhaps instead, we can simply pad some silence to the beginning of the arcos so that at 0ms, the arco sample behaves like the shorts at 0ms. So this would solve your request, but it may only come later in a few months.


----------



## lzcmusic

neblix said:


> I understand the issue now.
> 
> I'm not sure we will look at this, it's an extremely specific use case. 0ms offset for the shorts is really far too much latency for them in normal playing, and Pure Attack was put in Lookahead because it was understood the user would only tolerate 0 offset (full sample) in playback, but not in recording.
> 
> Adding a dynamic delay in Standard mode that is based on the timing of shorts, I am really nervous about making the code unstable. Try to understand, we don't want to put out a patch that has hanging notes and such.
> 
> I will add this as a ticket for 1.1; perhaps instead, we can simply pad some silence to the beginning of the arcos so that at 0ms, the arco sample behaves like the shorts at 0ms. So this would solve your request, but it may only come later in a few months.


I hope the 1.1 update will improve the clarity of library tags Picture and the kanji cutoff problem

Thanks


----------



## william81723

neblix said:


> I will add this as a ticket for 1.1; perhaps instead, we can simply pad some silence to the beginning of the arcos so that at 0ms, the arco sample behaves like the shorts at 0ms. So this would solve your request, but it may only come later in a few months.


That sounds GREAT!!! Thanks~


----------



## Jackdnp121

dhmusic said:


> Do you think you'll do another Octopath track with TSS?


still testing on the library to see what works ... gonna use it on original first then maybe mock up


----------



## Batuer

@neblix 
Hi, I updated the 1.0.2 to test lookahead mode, it can play the legato in Cubase 10.5 now. But after I make notes setting according to the manual, it still does not trigger the portamento. Am I doing wrong or missing something?


----------



## bfreepro

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Let's hear some user demos!


I really love the tone, openness, and detail, plus the dryness which lets you sculpt it how you see fit. The sound is very rich and thick. The variety of shorts are really nice, as are the advanced options for attacks and releases, multiple legato types, they just seem to have put so much care and effort into the content and features of this library, it’s very impressive. I gotta mention though, this library takes up a TON of ram. Like, more than any other library I own. I had to bounce down sections for the first time in years since I used to write with only 16gb of ram in 2014 (have 64 now). Granted there are ways to save ram as well, but I think it’s worth mentioning to those who have lower pc specs, it’s definitely not lightweight as far as resources are concerned. I used a convolution plus another hall reverb for TSS here.


----------



## ResidentSmeagol

Trying this out for the first time tonight and I'm hearing a 5th in one of the cello samples? The shorts - I think spiccato, the B an octave below middle C plays a 5th. The other shorts seem to play a single note correctly but the spiccato plays a 5th.

I haven't checked the other string's shorts so I have no idea if any of them have anything like that in the shorts. At the moment the 5th in cello spiccato is the only one I've heard.


----------



## mohsohsenshi

bfreepro said:


> I really love the tone, openness, and detail, plus the dryness which lets you sculpt it how you see fit. The sound is very rich and thick. The variety of shorts is really nice, as are the advanced options for attacks and releases. I gotta mention though, this library takes up a TON of ram though. Like, more than any other library I own. I had to bounce down sections for the first time in years since I used to write with only 16gb of ram in 2014 (have 64 now). I used a convolution plus another hall reverb for TSS here.


Beautifully done!
I really like how you mix the sound and the way you automate dynamic of TSS.
It will be very kind if there could be a little sharing of your approach.


----------



## Jackdnp121

my time to contribute to the user demos … still Haven’t use the full potential ( especially look ahead ) … but loving the library … 👌


----------



## ansthenia

This has become my favorite single sample library purchase I've ever made. Thanks Impact Soundworks!

So like, Tokyo Scoring Brass is releasing next week yeah? Next week right? Coming out next week?


----------



## mybadmemory

Which additional libraries in this series is planned? Winds and brass I assume, but apart from that? Can we expect percussion? Plucked instruments? Anything else?


----------



## bfreepro

mohsohsenshi said:


> Beautifully done!
> I really like how you mix the sound and the way you automate dynamic of TSS.
> It will be very kind if there could be a little sharing of your approach.


I use the decca and room mics for the violins, and added some close mic on the cellos. I like violins to be more airy and the cellos more detailed and textured. I just automated cc01 in the DAW, adding slow swells as the melody lines were played. Shorts were doubled up… one full ensemble with staccatissimo and spiccato alternating for a few measures at a time, decca mics only, and one with the board mix using the secco spiccatos. I never had all the shorts playing at the same velocity, so for instance one measure the secco spiccato would take the lead and the stacatissimo would play at a much lower velocity, and vice versa. Layering the seccos added a lot of definition and crispness, adding some extra bow sound and detail, while the regular spiccatos and staccatissimo added a more feathery, loose texture. I actually panned the first violins and second violins left a bit within my daw to make them sound bigger and match the roomy brass sound (JXL brass for bones and horns and Hollywood brass for trumpets). Also EW spaces 2 for the IR for dry sounds including TSS, and cinematic rooms as a send for all instruments for the tail.


----------



## Drumdude2112

i like what i’m hearing alot…I’ll definitely be picking these up…If i wasnt recouping from BF (or if the intro price was a bit more ‘agressive’ ) i’d jump on em now…soon though….definitely has its own ‘thing’ going and very well conceived and layed out…Well done !


----------



## Evans

mybadmemory said:


> Which additional libraries in this series is planned? Winds and brass I assume, but apart from that? Can we expect percussion? Plucked instruments? Anything else?


I believe up next are some acoustic drumkits and other ensemble percussion in the same recording space. It's not traditional orchestral percussion. Unless memory fails me, they've already had at least one recording session on this next release.

Other priorities seem to be brass and woodwinds, per Discord chat. People have requested solo strings, but if they do those they would come after these higher priorities.


----------



## Evans

Jackdnp121 said:


> my time to contribute to the user demos … still Haven’t use the full potential ( especially look ahead ) … but loving the library … 👌



Great job! Those violins that come in at around 1:00 and 1:55 sound like something I'd be happy to hear in a Castlevania game.


----------



## Evans

bfreepro said:


> I really love the tone, openness, and detail, plus the dryness which lets you sculpt it how you see fit. The sound is very rich and thick. The variety of shorts are really nice, as are the advanced options for attacks and releases, multiple legato types, they just seem to have put so much care and effort into the content and features of this library, it’s very impressive. I gotta mention though, this library takes up a TON of ram. Like, more than any other library I own. I had to bounce down sections for the first time in years since I used to write with only 16gb of ram in 2014 (have 64 now). Granted there are ways to save ram as well, but I think it’s worth mentioning to those who have lower pc specs, it’s definitely not lightweight as far as resources are concerned. I used a convolution plus another hall reverb for TSS here.


What a fantastically strong start here with the strings and brass! I mean, the whole thing is good, but that really perked me up.


----------



## Jackdnp121

Evans said:


> Great job! Those violins that come in at around 1:00 and 1:55 sound like something I'd be happy to hear in a Castlevania game.


thanks man 🙂 the style inspiration actually came from a good old band - X Japan - where they have slow strings line playing on top of a heavy beat ( in their case is the drummer Yoshiki playing heavy/speed metal )


----------



## Tom Ferguson

Jackdnp121 said:


> my time to contribute to the user demos … still Haven’t use the full potential ( especially look ahead ) … but loving the library … 👌



Banging track dude. I think your demo sells this library more than any other demo I've heard so for IMO! Great stuff!


----------



## mohsohsenshi

bfreepro said:


> I use the decca and room mics for the violins, and added some close mic on the cellos. I like violins to be more airy and the cellos more detailed and textured. I just automated cc01 in the DAW, adding slow swells as the melody lines were played. Shorts were doubled up… one full ensemble with staccatissimo and spiccato alternating for a few measures at a time, decca mics only, and one with the board mix using the secco spiccatos. I never had all the shorts playing at the same velocity, so for instance one measure the secco spiccato would take the lead and the stacatissimo would play at a much lower velocity, and vice versa. Layering the seccos added a lot of definition and crispness, adding some extra bow sound and detail, while the regular spiccatos and staccatissimo added a more feathery, loose texture. I actually panned the first violins and second violins left a bit within my daw to make them sound bigger and match the roomy brass sound (JXL brass for bones and horns and Hollywood brass for trumpets). Also EW spaces 2 for the IR for dry sounds including TSS, and cinematic rooms as a send for all instruments for the tail.


Very inspiring! Glad to see such a valuable sharing tips. That's how we make this instrument library shine.


----------



## neblix

Batuer said:


> @neblix
> Hi, I updated the 1.0.2 to test lookahead mode, it can play the legato in Cubase 10.5 now. But after I make notes setting according to the manual, it still does not trigger the portamento. Am I doing wrong or missing something?


Just to clarify, do you have "Easy Artic" turned on?


----------



## chrisav

Jackdnp121 said:


> X Japan


Now that's a name I haven't heard in a long time... Blue Blood forever!!


----------



## Batuer

neblix said:


> Just to clarify, do you have "Easy Artic" turned on?


Yes, the "Easy Artic" button is turned on. I think this issue is still related to the tempo(in Cubase 10.5). When I change tempo fast (e.g. 120 bpm ) the portamento can be triggered.


----------



## jason3.14

bfreepro said:


> I use the decca and room mics for the violins, and added some close mic on the cellos. I like violins to be more airy and the cellos more detailed and textured. I just automated cc01 in the DAW, adding slow swells as the melody lines were played. Shorts were doubled up… one full ensemble with staccatissimo and spiccato alternating for a few measures at a time, decca mics only, and one with the board mix using the secco spiccatos. I never had all the shorts playing at the same velocity, so for instance one measure the secco spiccato would take the lead and the stacatissimo would play at a much lower velocity, and vice versa. Layering the seccos added a lot of definition and crispness, adding some extra bow sound and detail, while the regular spiccatos and staccatissimo added a more feathery, loose texture. I actually panned the first violins and second violins left a bit within my daw to make them sound bigger and match the roomy brass sound (JXL brass for bones and horns and Hollywood brass for trumpets). Also EW spaces 2 for the IR for dry sounds including TSS, and cinematic rooms as a send for all instruments for the tail.


Really liked the shorts in this track, and thanks for the breakdown! It also reminded me that there are multis to consider trying.


----------



## neblix

Batuer said:


> Yes, the "Easy Artic" button is turned on. I think this issue is still related to the tempo(in Cubase 10.5). When I change tempo fast (e.g. 120 bpm ) the portamento can be triggered.


The only thing I can think of is that perhaps Cubase is delaying your CC64 automation to account for the 1000ms latency. Can you see if there is an option in Cubase that would turn this off? Or see if moving your CC64 automation 1 second earlier triggers the portamento correctly? It's not a solution, just trying to diagnose.


----------



## jason3.14

Jackdnp121 said:


> my time to contribute to the user demos … still Haven’t use the full potential ( especially look ahead ) … but loving the library … 👌



Oh niiiiice, really liking this! I think I'd like a Slavic/Bulgarian choir substitution at 0:17 like Vocalisa or Rhodope, but I'm extremely partial to that sound hehe. I'm curious how you automated vibrato on the violins that come in initially. Did you do a slow ramp-up for longer notes, or kind of like an on-off switch?


----------



## Batuer

neblix said:


> The only thing I can think of is that perhaps Cubase is delaying your CC64 automation to account for the 1000ms latency. Can you see if there is an option in Cubase that would turn this off? Or see if moving your CC64 automation 1 second earlier triggers the portamento correctly? It's not a solution, just trying to diagnose.


I have moved the CC64 1 second earlier, but still the same, no portamento. Meanwhile, I found another thing. When I play in standard mode everything is fine and normal, but when I play in lookahead mode, I always feel the volume is quite different. I did some tests and found why I always have the feelings: the CCs are offset earlier. This video should show what I mean. My wrong setting? or bugs in lookahead mode? For now, I just use standard mode.

View attachment Untitled.mp4


----------



## Jackdnp121

jason3.14 said:


> Oh niiiiice, really liking this! I think I'd like a Slavic/Bulgarian choir substitution at 0:17 like Vocalisa or Rhodope, but I'm extremely partial to that sound hehe. I'm curious how you automated vibrato on the violins that come in initially. Did you do a slow ramp-up for longer notes, or kind of like an on-off switch?


Hey , i am not entirely sure how I automated it 😅 because I Perform/play the automation into it but if you are like me who likes to play in the line , what I find it useful for me is to maximum the range and turn on the auto legato speed and try to feel it … I thought the strings reacts better with my playing more that way ( for both long and short ) ... Hope it helps ... thanks


----------



## neblix

Batuer said:


> I have moved the CC64 1 second earlier, but still the same, no portamento. Meanwhile, I found another thing. When I play in standard mode everything is fine and normal, but when I play in lookahead mode, I always feel the volume is quite different. I did some tests and found why I always have the feelings: the CCs are offset earlier. This video should show what I mean. My wrong setting? or bugs in lookahead mode? For now, I just use standard mode.
> 
> View attachment Untitled.mp4


Is your "UI Parameter Sync" turned on?






If it is turned on, I fear this might be a Cubase bug, I can not test for sure until tomorrow. The automation is automatically delayed correctly by TSS if you have "UI Paramter Sync" turned on. If it is happening 1 second earlier still, I'm afraid to discover if Cubase's PDC is working backwards (where it should be delaying the automation, but it's pulling it up sooner).

Just to make sure; how are you compensating the TSS latency? Are you using the VST3/AU we provided, or are you using the Cubase track offset/manual latency?

In the meantime, yes, I recommend using Standard mode. I had feared that Lookahead would have a rocky start with some DAW's...


----------



## EvilDragon

ResidentSmeagol said:


> Trying this out for the first time tonight and I'm hearing a 5th in one of the cello samples? The shorts - I think spiccato, the B an octave below middle C plays a 5th. The other shorts seem to play a single note correctly but the spiccato plays a 5th.
> 
> I haven't checked the other string's shorts so I have no idea if any of them have anything like that in the shorts. At the moment the 5th in cello spiccato is the only one I've heard.


Yeah, some of the loudest dynamic spiccatos do have a 5th in there (players brushed two strings by accident). I noticed a few of these and that issue is tracked.


----------



## EvilDragon

Jackdnp121 said:


> the style inspiration actually came from a good old band - X Japan - where they have slow strings line playing on top of a heavy beat ( in their case is the drummer Yoshiki playing heavy/speed metal )



Awesome! Always been a fan of X Japan


----------



## filipjonathan

neblix said:


> Is your "UI Parameter Sync" turned on?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If it is turned on, I fear this might be a Cubase bug, I can not test for sure until tomorrow. The automation is automatically delayed correctly by TSS if you have "UI Paramter Sync" turned on. If it is happening 1 second earlier still, I'm afraid to discover if Cubase's PDC is working backwards (where it should be delaying the automation, but it's pulling it up sooner).
> 
> Just to make sure; how are you compensating the TSS latency? Are you using the VST3/AU we provided, or are you using the Cubase track offset/manual latency?
> 
> In the meantime, yes, I recommend using Standard mode. I had feared that Lookahead would have a rocky start with some DAW's...


If it's worth mentioning, I'm using Cubase and everything works fine for me. Although it might be the version he's using. I'm on the latest, 11.0.41.


----------



## tonio_

william81723 said:


> The reason I don't like using Lookahead mode is because that makes too quantized feelings... I can't let the legato's transients random a bit because it can't overlap the note..
> I would rather use me logical editor to deal with legato.
> In that way,I just need to press my shortcut key on legato notes and other articulations can just be quantized(with some random parameters).
> But in Lookahead mode, I have to clear all the tails of the overlap notes.It's really not my habit~~
> That's why I love the previous way to compose my music~~
> 
> I really need that feature I mentioned~ I just feel smooth in that way personally!!!
> Thanks for making Lookahead mode.That give me more options!! I won't give up trying it,but I just want the standard mode can be more perfect!!


One thing you can do in Cubase with Lookahead:
1. Click in the part
2. Quantize with randomizer for the position of the notes between 0 and 15 ticks
3. Select "Delete note overlaps" mono and poly (which will clear ALL overlaps for the entire MIDI part)

So that's quite literally 3 clicks (or 2 if you're playing in the part on a keyboard since you can just skip the 2nd step) and you will retain the inconsistencies in note placements and have all the benefits of Lookahead. So if you're on Cubase, then I think you should give this a try


----------



## jeremyr

Mockup of a track from Kaoru Wada's Samurai 7 OST (WIP)


----------



## Batuer

neblix said:


> Is your "UI Parameter Sync" turned on?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> If it is turned on, I fear this might be a Cubase bug, I can not test for sure until tomorrow. The automation is automatically delayed correctly by TSS if you have "UI Paramter Sync" turned on. If it is happening 1 second earlier still, I'm afraid to discover if Cubase's PDC is working backwards (wher


Yes, I use the VST3 provided with the library. I followed your instructions and checked the "UI Parameter Sync" on, the CCs are correct now. Thanks for your kind reply and patient to explain more information of the library using.

I’m pretty satisfied with this library in standard mode and I feel more flexible on finger playing on keyboard after 1.0.2 update. Do you guys do some magic?

===============
ADD: Is the sample-start earlier than 1.0.1? In standard mode, my project is on beat by latency -155ms, but in 1.0.2 it sounds a little earlier than in 1.0.1. Also zero-latency mode feels like having more attack than in 1.0.1


----------



## Batuer

filipjonathan said:


> If it's worth mentioning, I'm using Cubase and everything works fine for me. Although it might be the version he's using. I'm on the latest, 11.0.41.


I haven’t upgraded yet but I will try after I upgrade Cubase 11.


----------



## Jackdnp121

Just a quick question , was it just me or the V1 doesn't seems to sit in on the far left , for example when you play the cello it is obvious is from the right ... but the V1 is kind of middle-ish ... I did the octopath traveler main theme mockup before noticing the violin sitting position was way left ... ? 
Thank you


----------



## bfreepro

Jackdnp121 said:


> Just a quick question , was it just me or the V1 doesn't seems to sit in on the far left , for example when you play the cello it is obvious is from the right ... but the V1 is kind of middle-ish ... I did the octopath traveler main theme mockup before noticing the violin sitting position was way left ... ?
> Thank you


I noticed this too, both violins seem more centered than I'm used to, I think by design based on the recording space and desired sound. I just panned mine a bit more to the left and used the decca mics to enhance the sense of space a bit.


----------



## Jackdnp121

bfreepro said:


> I noticed this too, both violins seem more centered than I'm used to, I think by design based on the recording space and desired sound. I just panned mine a bit more to the left and used the decca mics to enhance the sense of space a bit.


thanks man , great advice … !


----------



## Jackdnp121

and also I think writing a strings part for a studio strings is certainly different from writing for a hall library ... you can kind of hide behind the reverb in hall strings but studio library is so naked that you really have to push yourself for better voicing and harmony ...

love it ... lol


----------



## ansthenia

Done a little something with this library, not added much modwheel movement to it yet though so the dynamic is kinda static. Could not be happier with the sound of these strings, I've wanted this sound for a long time. When I've finished the piece and sequenced them properly with dynamic changes/automation I'll upload again.


----------



## jason3.14

ansthenia said:


> Done a little something with this library, not added much modwheel movement to it yet though so the dynamic is kinda static. Could not be happier with the sound of these strings, I've wanted this sound for a long time. When I've finished the piece and sequenced them properly with dynamic changes/automation I'll upload again.


Great sound! What settings or processing did you use?


----------



## ansthenia

I just threw a cinematic rooms reverb on the master. That's it, didn't touch anything else, no EQ or anything, no additional panning.


----------



## jason3.14

ansthenia said:


> I just threw a cinematic rooms reverb on the master. That's it, didn't touch anything else, no EQ or anything, no additional panning.


That'ss the answer I wanted to hear! X'D look forward to hearing more


----------



## ansthenia

jason3.14 said:


> That'ss the answer I wanted to hear! X'D look forward to hearing more


Oh I forgot to mention I'm using the board mix.


----------



## Jackdnp121

ansthenia said:


> Done a little something with this library, not added much modwheel movement to it yet though so the dynamic is kinda static. Could not be happier with the sound of these strings, I've wanted this sound for a long time. When I've finished the piece and sequenced them properly with dynamic changes/automation I'll upload again.


sounded great , very Japanese ...


----------



## ism

ansthenia said:


> Done a little something with this library, not added much modwheel movement to it yet though so the dynamic is kinda static. Could not be happier with the sound of these strings, I've wanted this sound for a long time. When I've finished the piece and sequenced them properly with dynamic changes/automation I'll upload again.



Part of it might be that I'm just starting to understand whatever it is that this library is about. But that is really, strikingly lovely.


----------



## mohsohsenshi

ansthenia said:


> Done a little something with this library, not added much modwheel movement to it yet though so the dynamic is kinda static. Could not be happier with the sound of these strings, I've wanted this sound for a long time. When I've finished the piece and sequenced them properly with dynamic changes/automation I'll upload again.


Although heard some negative point view of TSS from sample talk, your test prove that it has something different from well known western cinematic style libraries. You nailed the sound here, exactly the Japanese impression and deep sentiment in those films/animes.


----------



## Jackdnp121

mohsohsenshi said:


> Although heard some negative point view of TSS from sample talk, your test prove that it has something different from well known western cinematic style libraries. You nailed the sound here, exactly the Japanese impression and deep sentiment in those films/animes.


as the librarys ”honey moon” period fades away , im sure more criticism will come … I believe the real hard challenge for TSS is actually the programming … all the good strings library out there have manage to capture the soul of the musician and the atmosphere … I reckon the soul of TSS is actually as advertised “ the precise of Japanese musician “ … how to programs it so the user can feel the precise of Japanese musician will be the key for popularity… lastly it is important for us user to not only give positive feedback and also the negative one for the best for this wonderful library we love …


----------



## jeffthatnoise

Hello everyone! I've just uploaded a DAW playback video in 4K of my score for the 'The Story of Tokyo Scoring Strings' documentary. Consider this my apology for convincing many of you that the score was played by live musicians. All the sequencing data is visible, with additional details in the description.


----------



## Jackdnp121

jeffthatnoise said:


> Hello everyone! I've just uploaded a DAW playback video in 4K of my score for the 'The Story of Tokyo Scoring Strings' documentary. Consider this my apology for convincing many of you that the score was played by live musicians. All the sequencing data is visible, with additional details in the description.



This is great !! Great demonstrations


----------



## davidnaroth

Anybody else having an issue like this?

When cubase transport isnt playing, all my TSS patches are having notes cutoff randomly if I try to play something in. Max voices at 512 and nothing in Kontakts settings out of the ordinary.


----------



## bfreepro

davidnaroth said:


> Anybody else having an issue like this?
> 
> When cubase transport isnt playing, all my TSS patches are having notes cutoff randomly if I try to play something in. Max voices at 512 and nothing in Kontakts settings out of the ordinary.


I noticed this with the polyphonic legato sometimes and especially with the multis. When I had one or two instances of kontakt setup with only one patch loaded in each, I didn’t notice any note dropouts, but they would start happening when I had 5 instances, one for each section (along with the rest of my orchestral template, which honestly very rarely maxes out my ram or causes audio dropouts with the libraries I had been using). My system reallllly started to struggle when playing back a track that had seven instances of TSS loaded (a track I shared earlier, it really wasn’t too overly complex IMO, but I was kind of testing to see how resource heavy TSS is). Basically on my mobile setup with windows 11, Ryzen 7 and 64 gb of ram, I noticed TSS seems very resource heavy, more so than any other library I currently own. Thats the only real hiccup I’ve noticed so far as far as technical performance, and it’s definitely noticeable. Haven’t gotten to test it on my desktop yet though


----------



## muziksculp

jeffthatnoise said:


> Hello everyone! I've just uploaded a DAW playback video in 4K of my score for the 'The Story of Tokyo Scoring Strings' documentary. Consider this my apology for convincing many of you that the score was played by live musicians. All the sequencing data is visible, with additional details in the description.



Hi @jeffthatnoise ,

Thanks for sharing this video. Your Score for 'The Story of Tokyo Scoring Strings' documentary fooled me that it was the real string players I'm listening to when I watched the video for the first time. 

Impressive score. It showcases a little bit of all the articulations TSS has to offer. A big round of applause for you.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## davidnaroth

bfreepro said:


> I noticed this with the polyphonic legato sometimes and especially with the multis. When I had one or two instances of kontakt setup with only one patch loaded in each, I didn’t notice any note dropouts, but they would start happening when I had 5 instances, one for each section (along with the rest of my orchestral template, which honestly very rarely maxes out my ram or causes audio dropouts with the libraries I had been using). My system reallllly started to struggle when playing back a track that had seven instances of TSS loaded (a track I shared earlier, it really wasn’t too overly complex IMO, but I was kind of testing to see how resource heavy TSS is). Basically on my mobile setup with windows 11, Ryzen 5 and 64 gb of ram, I noticed TSS seems very resource heavy, more so than any other library I currently own. Thats the only real hiccup I’ve noticed so far as far as technical performance, and it’s definitely noticeable. Haven’t gotten to test it on my desktop yet though


Yeah its strange, Im on my desktop with 8core intel and 64GB ram, blank cubase session with just one Kontakt and one TSS instance, I dont think it has something to do with resources, especially being if that I have the transport playing the issue doesnt happen. Something strange going on since other than you I dont see anybody posting about this issue either.


----------



## jason3.14

jeffthatnoise said:


> Hello everyone! I've just uploaded a DAW playback video in 4K of my score for the 'The Story of Tokyo Scoring Strings' documentary. Consider this my apology for convincing many of you that the score was played by live musicians. All the sequencing data is visible, with additional details in the description.



Thanks so much for this video! I'll be learning from it!


----------



## jason3.14

jeffthatnoise said:


> Hello everyone! I've just uploaded a DAW playback video in 4K of my score for the 'The Story of Tokyo Scoring Strings' documentary. Consider this my apology for convincing many of you that the score was played by live musicians. All the sequencing data is visible, with additional details in the description.



Also... I don't suppose you'd be able/willing to provide the MIDI data? I'd be very happy to be able to look at it in more detail!


----------



## ChrisSiuMusic

Lots of fun using this :D


----------



## Loïc D

In lookahead mode (Easy Artic off, Pure Attack on, Legato Speed on) on Arco, I can’t manage to trigger portamento with lower velocity.

I must have done something wrong…


----------



## Jackdnp121

Loïc D said:


> In lookahead mode (Easy Artic off, Pure Attack on, Legato Speed on) on Arco, I can’t manage to trigger portamento with lower velocity.
> 
> I must have done something wrong







I think you have to Press the Sustain Pedal ... 

saw it on the TSS Manuel

*


https://impactsoundworks.com/Manuals/Tokyo%20Scoring%20Strings%20Manual.pdf


*


----------



## Jackdnp121

Loïc D said:


> In lookahead mode (Easy Artic off, Pure Attack on, Legato Speed on) on Arco, I can’t manage to trigger portamento with lower velocity.
> 
> I must have done something wrong…


oh wait , just saw you have Easy arctic off .... in that case you might have to ask other Lookahead mode expert over here ... sorry !


----------



## Loïc D

Yup, Easy Artic is off.
Even if I switch it on, I have no porta with the sustain pedal.
I’ll try again, maybe I missed something.
I trigger them when I play on my keyboard, but not when DAW is playing.
The only other setting I changed is activating Niente.

Otherwise I’m pretty impressed. 
Whatever the situation so far, I always managed to find a proper articulation.
I can even render pretty nice measured trems with Spicatto Secco.

The only missing stuff to me is :
- Sul pont/Sul tasto/Flautando artics
- I wish Logic/Kontakt supports Release Velocity to switch release
- Con Sordino emulation could be better (especially with Viola/Cello)
- And some quirks on the shorts but that’s already getting fixed.

Good work Andrew & team !!!


----------



## EvilDragon

Loïc D said:


> - I wish Logic/Kontakt supports Release Velocity to switch release



Kontakt supports release velocity, and this can be added to TACT for release articulations only. It's a tracked feature request.


----------



## YuyaoSG

I have already found a problem.

Sometimes, the legato mode won't change when I use different velocity. Such as I want slur legato, I set up the velocity of the notes lower than 40. But, the engine shows arco. The same problem happened when I wrote some fast notes, such as 16th notes.


----------



## tonio_

YuyaoSG said:


> I have already found a problem.
> 
> Sometimes, the legato mode won't change when I use different velocity. Such as I want slur legato, I set up the velocity of the notes lower than 40. But, the engine shows arco. The same problem happened when I wrote some fast notes, such as 16th notes.


Was this in lookahead mode? I had something like that happen to me once, but next time I opened the project it wasn't happening anymore in the exact same passage.


----------



## YuyaoSG

tonio_ said:


> Was this in lookahead mode? I had something like that happen to me once, but next time I opened the project it wasn't happening anymore in the exact same passage.


Yes, it happened in the lookahead mode. Another problems are 1) It seems like the Contrabass can't trigger slur legato. 2) If I set up the maximized dynamic range. The volume of violins 2 is louder than violins 1 at least 3db.


----------



## neblix

We can look into bugs with legato articulations and lookahead soon. I request some patience from everyone as my apartment has flooded and I am temporarily homeless (writing this from a hotel atm). Since I am the only KSP developer on the Tokyo engine, this means there will be some delay in the next patch until this is sorted out. ISW does have a small external office I can work at, so once things stabilize and I have decompressed, I can head there and continue working until my home is habitable again.


----------



## rottoy

I have to commend ISW for making the first _truly_ polished studio strings sample library.
An absolute joy to work with so far.


----------



## AEF

This is one of the most well thought out, well recorded, easy to use libraries I have EVER bought.

ISW has an instant classic here IMO.


----------



## Nantho Valentine

neblix said:


> We can look into bugs with legato articulations and lookahead soon. I request some patience from everyone as my apartment has flooded and I am temporarily homeless (writing this from a hotel atm). Since I am the only KSP developer on the Tokyo engine, this means there will be some delay in the next patch until this is sorted out. ISW does have a small external office I can work at, so once things stabilize and I have decompressed, I can head there and continue working until my home is habitable again.


Oh Man, hope everything is going to be ok for you as soon as possible 🤞 Don't worry about the bugs right now, we can wait 😊 Take care of yourself and your loved ones 🤘


----------



## Loïc D

neblix said:


> We can look into bugs with legato articulations and lookahead soon. I request some patience from everyone as my apartment has flooded and I am temporarily homeless (writing this from a hotel atm). Since I am the only KSP developer on the Tokyo engine, this means there will be some delay in the next patch until this is sorted out. ISW does have a small external office I can work at, so once things stabilize and I have decompressed, I can head there and continue working until my home is habitable again.


Wow, shit !
I feel very sorry for you.
Take care of yourself first, we can wait for the update, don’t worry, take your time.
There’s already plenty of nice features to play with.


----------



## doctoremmet

@neblix sorry to hear this! I wish you the best of luck and hope you’ll get sorted soon! Hang in there! ❤️


----------



## thorwald

neblix said:


> We can look into bugs with legato articulations and lookahead soon.


No worries, patience is free and we have plenty 😀
Best of luck with your situation, hopefully it'll be sorted soon as staying in a hotel is definitely not fun.


----------



## MrHassanSan

I love this library so much! Made a mockup of one of my favorite strings-only tracks from anime, Kawara nai Mono (opb Joe Kato Group / Hiroyuki Koike Group).

Though this is mostly TSS, the original track has instances where individual instruments stick out a bit more, so I wound up sometimes layering it with Audio Imperia Solo (or Joshua Bell Violin for the first violins).

(original for reference)


----------



## ism

Yep ... it's been taking me a while to get my head around it, but definitely starting to want TSS.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

MrHassanSan said:


> I love this library so much! Made a mockup of one of my favorite strings-only tracks from anime, Kawara nai Mono (opb Joe Kato Group / Hiroyuki Koike Group).
> 
> Though this is mostly TSS, the original track has instances where individual instruments stick out a bit more, so I wound up sometimes layering it with Audio Imperia Solo (or Joshua Bell Violin for the first violins).
> 
> (original for reference)




Wow, absolutely beautiful work. I love this!


----------



## zedmaster

Stunning sound, @MrHassanSan !

I made a review video on TSS. Workflow power, customization and a great tone make this one a winner for me


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Very pleased to have received a new testimonial from Yasunori Nishiki, composer of Octopath Traveler and the main inspiration for this library :D

_"It sounds exactly like what I'm used to hearing, Muroya Strings x Sound City x Mitsunori Aizawa! The staccato and pizzicato reverberation in particular gave me a sense of Sound City's unique reverb, and I felt like I was in the Sound City control room. The sound definitely has the sense of Japanese strings and studio, making it easy to use for any kind of music. I believe this library delivers the sound of Japan to the world!"_


----------



## Jackdnp121

Andrew Aversa said:


> Very pleased to have received a new testimonial from Yasunori Nishiki, composer of Octopath Traveler and the main inspiration for this library :D
> 
> _"It sounds exactly like what I'm used to hearing, Muroya Strings x Sound City x Mitsunori Aizawa! The staccato and pizzicato reverberation in particular gave me a sense of Sound City's unique reverb, and I felt like I was in the Sound City control room. The sound definitely has the sense of Japanese strings and studio, making it easy to use for any kind of music. I believe this library delivers the sound of Japan to the world!"_


Great job … TSS indeed is amazing …


----------



## RMH

Hello, Everyone TSS users.
@Andrew Aversa @neblix 

I need a help.

I'm arranging the string instrument with Cubase, and I registered delay composition plugin on the track and activated lookahead.

According to the tutorial and manual's explanation, it's normal to be legato even if the midi notes don't overlap, but if you don't overlap a little, it won't be legato.

If it overlaps too long, it's just arco. What's the problem?

What should I do?


----------



## filipjonathan

RMH said:


> Hello, Everyone TSS users.
> @Andrew Aversa @neblix
> 
> I need a help.
> 
> I'm arranging the string instrument with Cubase, and I registered delay composition plugin on the track and activated lookahead.
> 
> According to the tutorial and manual's explanation, it's normal to be legato even if the midi notes don't overlap, but if you don't overlap a little, it won't be legato.
> 
> If it overlaps too long, it's just arco. What's the problem?
> 
> What should I do?



No, in the lookahead mode it's not supposed to overlap at all. It will still be legato.


----------



## RMH

filipjonathan said:


> No, in the lookahead mode it's not supposed to overlap at all. It will still be legato.


If you saw the attached video, you can see that it is not applicable. That's why I need help. I've worked on it for that convenience, but I'm sure it won't work.


----------



## EvilDragon

Zoom in more and see if the notes really are touching each other or not. If they are overlapped even by a little bit, or detached just a little bit, legato in lookahead won't work. They need to be 100% quantized.


----------



## RMH

EvilDragon said:


> Zoom in more and see if the notes really are touching each other or not. If they are overlapped even by a little bit, or detached just a little bit, legato in lookahead won't work. They need to be 100% quantized.


For now, it's first to complete the work, so I'll check after I'm done. 

Aren't notes drawn just right when activate the snap on the grid 100% of the length of the note without having to touch them?


----------



## YuyaoSG

RMH said:


> Hello, Everyone TSS users.
> @Andrew Aversa @neblix
> 
> I need a help.
> 
> I'm arranging the string instrument with Cubase, and I registered delay composition plugin on the track and activated lookahead.
> 
> According to the tutorial and manual's explanation, it's normal to be legato even if the midi notes don't overlap, but if you don't overlap a little, it won't be legato.
> 
> If it overlaps too long, it's just arco. What's the problem?
> 
> What should I do?



Please check out the velocity. 127=marcato, mid-high velocity= bow legato, mid-low=slur. Low=portamento.


----------



## zedmaster

At least with Easy Artic on, it's:

- upper half of velocities = shorts (depending on note length),

- lower half = Legato:
... lower half of lower half = slurred,
... upper half of lower half = bowed.
... portamento need the sustain pedal.

Legato notes must not overlap at all, they must line directly next to each other, touching but not overlapping. Best to quantize both the note starts *and* ends, or use a "remove overlap" feature (not sure Cubase has this specifically).


----------



## RMH

YuyaoSG said:


> Please check out the velocity. 127=marcato, mid-high velocity= bow legato, mid-low=slur. Low=portamento.


I’m not use Easy Artic…


----------



## neblix

I’m a bit speechless that this is the 2nd time a Cubase user has reported issues with legato detection. TSS is just parsing MIDI as it comes in, so the issue can only lie in how Cubase is sending MIDI to Kontakt. If extending to a tiny overlap fixes it, then my only hypothesis is that Cubase for some reason is sending Note Offs several ms prior to Note Ons, even at the same timestamp?

And judging from the other user’s issue (which mysteriously disappeared), the issue can be tempo dependent?

I guess I’ll have to debug this specifically with Cubase.


----------



## filipjonathan

neblix said:


> I’m a bit speechless that this is the 2nd time a Cubase user has reported issues with legato detection. TSS is just parsing MIDI as it comes in, so the issue can only lie in how Cubase is sending MIDI to Kontakt. If extending to a tiny overlap fixes it, then my only hypothesis is that Cubase for some reason is sending Note Offs several ms prior to Note Ons, even at the same timestamp?
> 
> And judging from the other user’s issue (which mysteriously disappeared), the issue can be tempo dependent?
> 
> I guess I’ll have to debug this specifically with Cubase.


I'll play around with different tempos since I'm also in Cubase. But haven't had any issues so far.


----------



## RMH

filipjonathan said:


> I'll play around with different tempos since I'm also in Cubase. But haven't had any issues so far.


I'm glad there's no problem. Hmm... Why am I like that?


neblix said:


> I’m a bit speechless that this is the 2nd time a Cubase user has reported issues with legato detection. TSS is just parsing MIDI as it comes in, so the issue can only lie in how Cubase is sending MIDI to Kontakt. If extending to a tiny overlap fixes it, then my only hypothesis is that Cubase for some reason is sending Note Offs several ms prior to Note Ons, even at the same timestamp?
> 
> And judging from the other user’s issue (which mysteriously disappeared), the issue can be tempo dependent?
> 
> I guess I’ll have to debug this specifically with Cubase.


It seems that there was a case where Cubase users talked about the problem. 

Is it a problem that the Cubase side needs to solve? In fact, if the lookahead function does not work well, it is natural that working hours will increase.


----------



## YuyaoSG

RMH said:


> I’m not use Easy Artic…


This is not Easy Artic. The velocity will effect the legato mode. 80-127 is Bow, 20-79 is Slur, Portamento is 1-19.


----------



## Loïc D

The thing is… I can’t really trigger this.
It seems to be influenced by modulation as well. I’ll investigate further since I really dig portamento.


----------



## jason3.14

Day #5 WIP of Octopath Traveler Battle Theme 1, including spending most of Xmas/post Xmas on it (worth)!

View attachment Octopath Traveler - Battle I.mp3


I'm using Lookahead Mode with Pure Attack and Legato Speed on. I started out with Easy Artic on, but am still having difficulty with it, and decided to turn it off (at least for Violins 1/2 and Viola at the moment). Between layering Legato with the various Shorts articulations (and a lot of automation lol), I feel like TSS can deliver very agile, lively, and convincing passages - hope this meets that expectation!

Very excited to continue with filling out the rest of the arrangement (teaser near the end), and hope you like it! 🙏🥳


----------



## Jackdnp121

jason3.14 said:


> Day #5 WIP of Octopath Traveler Battle Theme 1, including spending most of Xmas/post Xmas on it (worth)!
> 
> View attachment Octopath Traveler - Battle I.mp3
> 
> 
> I'm using Lookahead Mode with Pure Attack and Legato Speed on. I started out with Easy Artic on, but am still been having difficulty with it, and decided to turn it off (at least for Violins 1/2 and Viola at the moment). Between layering Legato with the various Shorts articulations (and a lot of automation lol), I feel like TSS can deliver very agile, lively, convincing passages - hope this meets that expectation!
> 
> Very excited to continue with filling out the rest of the arrangement (teaser near the end), and hope you like it! 🙏🥳



Sounded great !


----------



## hessproject

Not sure if anyone mentioned this before but one (and pretty much the only major) issue I've noticed with the library is for the violas, one of the spiccato D3 high velocity round robins is a C


----------



## zedmaster

Yup I can replicate it.


----------



## jason3.14

Oh yea... you're right! Haha yea I've noticed a few other things like that, am keeping a (hopefully short) list.


----------



## tonio_

neblix said:


> I’m a bit speechless that this is the 2nd time a Cubase user has reported issues with legato detection. TSS is just parsing MIDI as it comes in, so the issue can only lie in how Cubase is sending MIDI to Kontakt. If extending to a tiny overlap fixes it, then my only hypothesis is that Cubase for some reason is sending Note Offs several ms prior to Note Ons, even at the same timestamp?
> 
> And judging from the other user’s issue (which mysteriously disappeared), the issue can be tempo dependent?
> 
> I guess I’ll have to debug this specifically with Cubase.


I haven't had any issues at all in Cubase Pro 11 with Lookahead! I've been testing it across various tempos, dynamics and all sorts of stupid things and so far it's pretty flawless.
I use Expression maps instead of Easy Artic however, so maybe that's where the problems lie for other people


----------



## neblix

tonio_ said:


> I use Expression maps instead of Easy Artic however, so maybe that's where the problems lie for other people


Legato detection isn't affected by Easy Artic, and the user reporting wasn't using Easy Artic either.


----------



## Diorama Sky

Could someone please level with me: 

Would I struggle using this on a 2.6GHz 6-Core Intel Core i7 MacBook Pro (2019) with 16 GB RAM? Assuming I'd also be trying to run instances of a few other orchestral libraries? (I realize it depends what else I'm running)

Thanks in advance!


----------



## YuyaoSG

Diorama Sky said:


> Could someone please level with me:
> 
> Would I struggle using this on a 2.6GHz 6-Core Intel Core i7 MacBook Pro (2019) with 16 GB RAM? Assuming I'd also be trying to run instances of a few other orchestral libraries? (I realize it depends what else I'm running)
> 
> Thanks in advance!


Yes, don't use the all-mics version.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Keep in mind you will reduce the RAM load by unloading unused articulations, ESPECIALLY one of the portamento types. For example, Violins 1 Board Mix is 1.73gb on my system by default. Disabling one of the portamento types alone saves 220mb from that!


----------



## Jackdnp121

Diorama Sky said:


> Could someone please level with me:
> 
> Would I struggle using this on a 2.6GHz 6-Core Intel Core i7 MacBook Pro (2019) with 16 GB RAM? Assuming I'd also be trying to run instances of a few other orchestral libraries? (I realize it depends what else I'm running)
> 
> Thanks in advance!


you probably will be struggle to run multi mic ….However …. The ”Freeze” function is your good friend … you should look into it …


----------



## filipjonathan

Diorama Sky said:


> Could someone please level with me:
> 
> Would I struggle using this on a 2.6GHz 6-Core Intel Core i7 MacBook Pro (2019) with 16 GB RAM? Assuming I'd also be trying to run instances of a few other orchestral libraries? (I realize it depends what else I'm running)
> 
> Thanks in advance!


I can run all five sections at once on my 2017, 2.9 GHz, i7, 16 GB RAM MacBook Pro with no problems. But as someone has mentioned above, purge and freeze options are your friends


----------



## Trash Panda

Tokyo Scoring Strings and the Infinite Series are going to drive me to replace my Surface Book 2 with something beefier before my wallet is ready.


----------



## jason3.14

Yea, since I currently like using 2 instances of a TSS instrument in the same Kontakt to layer Longs and Shorts together, it helps to be able to unload the Shorts on the first and Longs on the second, so it doesn't really feel like substantially more RAM usage


----------



## ChickenAndARoll

View attachment Welcome to the World of Pokemon.mp3


Just did a transcription and mockup of a piece from Pokémon and used Tokyo Scoring Strings with the lookahead and easy artic engaged on all instruments (I'm in Cubase 11 and have had no issues with it). My verdict: The lookahead mode makes everything SO much easier, especially when it comes to copying MIDI CC data which can be annoying when everything isn't right on the grid. 

The strings are being sent to both 7th Heaven and Cinematic Rooms, with light compression on the group, and I used iZotope Ozone on the master (Coming from a notation software background, I'm a total noob when it comes to the production aspect of DAWs so don't roast me too hard ). Other libraries used: Trilian for upright bass, VSL Synchron Brass and Cinematic Studio Brass layered for trumpets, Synchron Harp, Synchron CFX, and Synchron Percussion.

This is what the original sounded like, endearing Nintendo DS soundfont and all:


----------



## Diorama Sky

Andrew Aversa said:


> Keep in mind you will reduce the RAM load by unloading unused articulations, ESPECIALLY one of the portamento types. For example, Violins 1 Board Mix is 1.73gb on my system by default. Disabling one of the portamento types alone saves 220mb from that!


Thank you, always a good reminder!


----------



## Diorama Sky

filipjonathan said:


> I can run all five sections at once on my 2017, 2.9 GHz, i7, 16 GB RAM MacBook Pro with no problems. But as someone has mentioned above, purge and freeze options are your friends


Thanks. They're more like my frenemies, but point definitely taken haha.


----------



## filipjonathan

Diorama Sky said:


> Thanks. They're more like my frenemies, but point definitely taken haha.


Oh I hear ya 😅


----------



## mybadmemory

Trash Panda said:


> Tokyo Scoring Strings and the Infinite Series are going to drive me to replace my Surface Book 2 with something beefier before my wallet is ready.


Are TSS + Infinite your new main orchestra?


----------



## Loïc D

mybadmemory said:


> Are TSS + Infinite your new main orchestra?


It’s the backbone of my orchestra along with SCS & JXL.

I can run the full TSS sections (board mix) on my MBP late 2013 16GB without hassle and without freezing, all articulations loaded.


----------



## RMH

This is the string arrangement that I recently worked on.

Lookahead is speculating that it may be a problem related to quantize, and I think there will be an answer because I have handed over the midi file to the developer.

This song is a Korean gospel song.

Originally, there was no string instrument, but I made it.

In fact, I bought an instrument for the purpose of general use rather than game music, but the sound was better than expected and it was so impressive that it came out to the desired purpose when controlled.

I hope you listen to it until the end. And experience the ability of TSS.😉

I'll have to prepare a piano roll cast video soon.

View attachment Jesus J-US Strings Arrenged.mp3


----------



## chrisav

Sounds wonderful! Is that the board mix or a custom mix of mics?


----------



## RMH

chrisav said:


> Sounds wonderful! Is that the board mix or a custom mix of mics?


It's Board mix.
And add group track, I used the plug-in to set all other articulations to sordino.
I felt that a single track alone was weak.


----------



## Trash Panda

mybadmemory said:


> Are TSS + Infinite your new main orchestra?


TSS + CinePerc + CSP are steady for Japanese style stuff. The woodwinds and brass still get swapped out depending on the project.


----------



## Batuer

neblix said:


> I’m a bit speechless that this is the 2nd time a Cubase user has reported issues with legato detection. TSS is just parsing MIDI as it comes in, so the issue can only lie in how Cubase is sending MIDI to Kontakt. If extending to a tiny overlap fixes it, then my only hypothesis is that Cubase for some reason is sending Note Offs several ms prior to Note Ons, even at the same timestamp?
> 
> And judging from the other user’s issue (which mysteriously disappeared), the issue can be tempo dependent?
> 
> I guess I’ll have to debug this specifically with Cubase.


Love TSS so much.
I use Cubase but have issues with the lookahead mode, already reported the issues. I now use TSS in standard mode, but the CCs will start earlier before notes. Hope these will be solved soon.


----------



## jason3.14

RMH said:


> It's Board mix.
> And add group track, I used the plug-in to set all other articulations to sordino.
> I felt that a single track alone was weak.


Amazing! That's a great sound you achieved.  To clarify, do you mean that you layered non con-sordino and consordino patches playing the same thing, to make it sound thicker? If so, that sounds like an interesting thing to try!


----------



## muziksculp

RMH said:


> It's Board mix.
> And add group track, I used the plug-in to set all other articulations to sordino.
> I felt that a single track alone was weak.


Hi @RMH 

TSS sounds so rich, and lush here, great job, and it's not the typical Japanese Anime sound, that's what I was saying about TSS, that they are not restricted to the Japanese Anime Sound, but can do a great job in many other applications/genres, depending on how they are used, and processed. 

So, you used the Board mix in this track, but I don't understand what you mean by 

Quote "And add group track, I used the plug-in to set all other articulations to sordino." 

Can you elaborate a bit in more detail about this. I'm not clear about what you did. 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## jason3.14

muziksculp said:


> Quote "And add group track, I used the plug-in to set all other articulations to sordino."
> 
> Can you elaborate a bit in more detail about this. I'm not clear about what you did.
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp


Great minds


----------



## neblix

Batuer said:


> I now use TSS in standard mode, but the CCs will start earlier before notes.


I'm not sure what you mean by this, the engine doesn't do anything with CC in Standard mode.


@Batuer and @RMH, can you confirm that you are on update 1.0.2? Do not check Pulse, since that doesn't tell me what files you actually have. You want to check the compile message on the bottom of the screen, you can hit "!" at the top of Kontakt to make it show up.

It should say Dec 10, 2021.


----------



## RMH

jason3.14 said:


> To clarify, do you mean that you layered non con-sordino and consordino patches playing the same thing, to make it sound thicker? If


@muziksculp

As Jason said.

In the past, I used to duplication all the tracks, but suddenly I thought I didn't have to. I thought it would be a good way to send the sound in Sendro because I use a plug-in for the sordino effect.

That's why I sent all the strings to the group sound track and sent them to another group track.
Legato already has sordino on this own, but there are no other articulations, so I did this.


----------



## RMH

neblix said:


> @Batuer and @RMH, can you confirm that you are on update 1.0.2? Do not check Pulse, since that doesn't tell me what files you actually have. You want to check the compile message on the bottom of the screen, you can hit "!" at the top of Kontakt to make it show up.
> 
> It should say Dec 10, 2021.


Yes. 1.0.2 version.


----------



## jason3.14

RMH said:


> @muziksculp
> 
> As Jason said.
> 
> In the past, I used to duplication all the tracks, but suddenly I thought I didn't have to. I thought it would be a good way to send the sound in Sendro because I use a plug-in for the sordino effect.
> 
> View attachment 67064
> View attachment 67065
> 
> That's why I sent all the strings to the group sound track and sent them to another group track.
> Legato already has sordino on this own, but there are no other articulations, so I did this.


Ohh I see, sounds like you didn't add duplicate instances of TSS set with the con sordino button on then. But maybe I will try that anyway now that you've given me the idea! Since I don't happen to have another plugin for sordino effect lol


----------



## RMH

jason3.14 said:


> Ohh I see, sounds like you didn't add duplicate instances of TSS set with the con sordino button on then. But maybe I will try that anyway now that you've given me the idea! Since I don't happen to have another plugin for sordino effect lol


I hope you get a good effect.

Maybe I'm mistaken about sordino.

When sordino is activated, all articulations laws may apply.
If so, you can duplicate and use the tracks.









PS. I just checked the sound and the sordino works for all the articulations!🤣


----------



## jason3.14

RMH said:


> I hope you get a good effect.
> 
> Maybe I'm mistaken about sordino.
> 
> When sordino is activated, all articulations laws may apply.
> If so, you can duplicate and use the tracks.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> PS. I just checked the sound and the sordino works for all the articulations!🤣


Yea that's my plan! Haha. Ive used one or the other but not both together yet


----------



## Zanshin

What’s the 3rd party sordino plug-in?


----------



## RMH

Zanshin said:


> What’s the 3rd party sordino plug-in?


I've already confirmed that sordino is working on all articulations, so I don't think I have to use the plug-in. I thought it was only in arco.


----------



## Zanshin

RMH said:


> I've already confirmed that sordino is working on all articulations, so I don't think I have to use the plug-in. I thought it was only in arco.


I was curious what the plug-in you were using was.


----------



## RMH

Zanshin said:


> I was curious what the plug-in you were using was.



It's called Brainworks Refinement. Originally, it was not used for that purpose, but I learned that it can be used depending on the purpose.


----------



## muziksculp

RMH said:


> It's called Brainworks Refinement. Originally, it was not intended to be used for that purpose, but I learned that it depends on the use.


I have this plugin. Never tried using it for emulating sordino. Thanks for the tip


----------



## RMH

muziksculp said:


> I have this plugin. Never tried using it for emulating sordino. Thanks for the tip


I don't think there are many strings with Sordino in all articulations.
These instruments are the only instruments I have.

8DIO Century Strings Series.
CSS
TSS

Sonokinetic Sordino Strings are just a few articulations...

If you want to see the effects of other instruments, it would be okay.


----------



## muziksculp

RMH said:


> I don't think there are many strings with Sordino in all articulations.
> These instruments are the only instruments I have.
> 
> 8DIO Century Strings Series.
> CSS
> TSS
> 
> Sonokinetic Sordino Strings are just a few articulations...
> 
> If you want to see the effects of other instruments, it would be okay.


Yes, there are not that many string libraries with Sordino. I think it is worth testing the Bx Refinement on other non-sordino libraries, and see how they sound. 

Audio Bro LASS 3 has legato sordino, and they have an expanded library for MSS that also offers Sordino, plus sul pont, and sul tasto Legato. I think Spifire Chamber strings has Sordino as well, and maybe their Symphonic Strings.


----------



## RMH

muziksculp said:


> I think Spifire Chamber strings has Sordino as well, and maybe their Symphonic Strings.


As far as I know, SCS only provides LONG CS. There's no other articulations.🤣


----------



## muziksculp

RMH said:


> As far as I know, SCS only provides LONG CS. There's no other articulations.🤣


Yes, I think so.


----------



## ism

RMH said:


> As far as I know, SCS only provides LONG CS. There's no other articulations.🤣


Except that according to the SCS web page, for con sord, SCS has longs, legato, including portamento, and shorts. So not a full library, but far from a trivial single long.


----------



## muziksculp

Sample Modeling Solo & Ensemble Strings emulates Sordino via Impulse Responses. They still sound convincing, and close to real sordino.


----------



## muziksculp

ism said:


> Except that according to the SCS web page, for con sord, SCS has longs, legato, including portamento, and shorts. So not a full library, but far from a trivial single long.


Yeah.. I was in doubt about SCS, I remember there was more than just legato. Thanks for the correction.


----------



## ism

Also, tremolo CS and tremolo CS sul pont.


----------



## muziksculp

Also Chris Hein Strings has Sordino Emulation via a special filter. Not actual sordino samples. EW-HOOPUS Strings has a Sordino emulation as well.


----------



## muziksculp

Sorry, I just realized this is the commercial forum section. 

We should discuss other libraries in Sample Forum section.


----------



## RMH

It's okay. It looks natural. That's possible if you follow the flow of the story.😉


----------



## AndyP

I am somehow still not clear about how this lookahead mode works (Cubase 11).

Somewhere I read that there will also be expression maps, but I can't find it anymore. Are there already, or will it remain with the lookahead function?


----------



## EvilDragon

You would make your own expression maps, TSS doesn't come supplied with them. Either that, or you use Easy Artic option in Lookahead, which was explained in Nabeel's overview video.


----------



## constaneum

Rearrangement of one of my old works using Shreddage 3 Rogue and TSS in this simple strings sustain context.


----------



## RMH

constaneum said:


> Rearrangement of one of my old works using Shreddage 3 Rogue and TSS in this simple strings sustain context.



It's like a scene from a western movie.
Very nice!


----------



## filipjonathan

constaneum said:


> Rearrangement of one of my old works using Shreddage 3 Rogue and TSS in this simple strings sustain context.



Are any of the guitars played live?


----------



## Batuer

neblix said:


> I'm not sure what you mean by this, the engine doesn't do anything with CC in Standard mode.


*No, this is NOT an issue with the TSS engine. 

I mean*: Because of the *lookahead *issue with *Cubase*, I have to use standard mode. And in this mode, in order to make legato notes on the beat, I have to set track delay like -150ms in Cubase, *but meanwhile*, this could also bring the CC earlier before the actual right position supposed to be (Maybe I haven't found a better way). This picture can show what I mean.

So, I would love to see some improvements in lookahead mode with Cubase in the future. Maybe you guys could have a chance to test it in Cubase?


----------



## constaneum

RMH said:


> It's like a scene from a western movie.
> Very nice!


Thanks.


----------



## EvilDragon

@Batuer Did you try NOT using track delay feature in Cubase, but loading the delay compensator plugin instead?


----------



## constaneum

filipjonathan said:


> Are any of the guitars played live?


Nope. All are samples
1. Strummed acoustic 
2. Amplesound AGL
3. Evolution Jumbo 12
4. Shreddage 3 Rogue


----------



## Batuer

EvilDragon said:


> @Batuer Did you try NOT using track delay feature in Cubase, but loading the delay compensator plugin instead?


Yes I tried LookAhead with the VST3 plugin in Cubase. But it did not trigger the portamento on some slow tempo like 60,80... LookAhead is normal in Studio One. So someone says maybe this is an issue with Cubase.


View attachment TT.mp4


----------



## RMH

Batuer said:


> this could also cause the CC earlier before the actual on-beat transition sounds


I know that the notes overlap to switch to legato in standard mode, but what does this sentence mean?
What is assigned to the cc?


----------



## filipjonathan

constaneum said:


> Nope. All are samples
> 1. Strummed acoustic
> 2. Amplesound AGL
> 3. Evolution Jumbo 12
> 4. Shreddage 3 Rogue


Very impressive!


----------



## constaneum

filipjonathan said:


> Very impressive!


Thanks


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Two quick things:

1. Intro pricing ends tomorrow (Dec 31st!)

2. Our esteemed beta tester & composer Ian Dorsch just sent us this _beautiful _piece called "Sunrise at the Bramble", check it out!


----------



## Jackdnp121

constaneum said:


> Rearrangement of one of my old works using Shreddage 3 Rogue and TSS in this simple strings sustain context.



sounded beautiful my friend ..!


----------



## filipjonathan

Andrew Aversa said:


> Two quick things:
> 
> 1. Intro pricing ends tomorrow (Dec 31st!)
> 
> 2. Our esteemed beta tester & composer Ian Dorsch just sent us this _beautiful _piece called "Sunrise at the Bramble", check it out!



Amazing. Can you share more about his settings? Did he use standard or lookahead?


----------



## constaneum

Jackdnp121 said:


> sounded beautiful my friend ..!


Thanks man


----------



## Ian Dorsch

filipjonathan said:


> Amazing. Can you share more about his settings? Did he use standard or lookahead?


It's standard, super old school: mod wheel, expression pedal, and a slider assigned to vibrato. I used the board mix for everything, vanilla out of the box, no EQ. Cinematic Rooms and Valhalla Room are both feathered in for reverb. I used an additional instance of violins 2 for some divisi stuff and I used the TSS console to apply one of the factory IRs for additional verb on that, to give it a little different color. That's pretty much it!


----------



## neblix

We are testing a new obscure memory optimization technique that @Sarah Mancuso and @EvilDragon brought to our attention, and have been able to significantly drop the RAM usage of all the patches. The effect of this is that the RAM load of Mic Mixer patches have *dropped to around ~5 GB* from *previously ~7 GB*.

We simply need to discuss the best way to make sure existing DAW projects don't break before pushing out the update. The new approach could be incompatible with how DAW's recall Kontakt NKI states and we need to be ready to communicate that to customers if that is the case.


----------



## jeremyr

Here's an orchestral arrangement of a J-pop-ish song I did recently using TSS and some other libs:


----------



## jason3.14

constaneum said:


> Rearrangement of one of my old works using Shreddage 3 Rogue and TSS in this simple strings sustain context.



Sounds great!! Beginning reminded me of 
Octopath Traveler, Bolderfall town vibes:


----------



## jason3.14

jeremyr said:


> Here's an orchestral arrangement of a J-pop-ish song I did recently using TSS and some other libs:



this was fun to listen to! what did you use for brass?


----------



## filipjonathan

Ian Dorsch said:


> It's standard, super old school: mod wheel, expression pedal, and a slider assigned to vibrato. I used the board mix for everything, vanilla out of the box, no EQ. Cinematic Rooms and Valhalla Room are both feathered in for reverb. I used an additional instance of violins 2 for some divisi stuff and I used the TSS console to apply one of the factory IRs for additional verb on that, to give it a little different color. That's pretty much it!


Thank you!


----------



## RMH

Hey guys.
I have a question, but I wonder if I didn't find it in the manual. 

In TSS standard mode, there is a delay value that occurs when the speed is determined to be slow, medium, or fast by velocity, right?

Is it the same as CSS?

It's a little uncomfortable to record while playing the keyboard.


----------



## filipjonathan

RMH said:


> Hey guys.
> I have a question, but I wonder if I didn't find it in the manual.
> 
> In TSS standard mode, there is a delay value that occurs when the speed is determined to be slow, medium, or fast by velocity, right?
> 
> Is it the same as CSS?
> 
> It's a little uncomfortable to record while playing the keyboard.


If I recall correctly it's something like 440ms but you need to check with someone from ISW. @neblix?


----------



## neblix

I’m not sure where this 440 value came from. Our slowest legato speed is around ~220 ms. If you are comparing it to CSS, it’s actually 80ms quicker than CSS’s slow legato.


----------



## RMH

neblix said:


> I’m not sure where this 440 value came from. Our slowest legato speed is around ~220 ms. If you are comparing it to CSS, it’s actually 80ms quicker than CSS’s slow legato.


Thank you, Neblix.
The reason why I asked if it was similar to css was that I wondered if I should move the notes in advance to match the tempo.


----------



## filipjonathan

neblix said:


> I’m not sure where this 440 value came from. Our slowest legato speed is around ~220 ms. If you are comparing it to CSS, it’s actually 80ms quicker than CSS’s slow legato.


Sorry 😅 At last my,number was exactly double 😃


----------



## neblix

RMH said:


> Thank you, Neblix.
> The reason why I asked if it was similar to css was that I wondered if I should move the notes in advance to match the tempo.


Yes, this is a given for many orchestral sample libraries. It is just that CSS was the first to popularize use of such a large delay. Ours isn't as big, but still acknowledges the importance of a long transition in obtaining a quality sound.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Also, if you find the delay too long, you can simply use a faster legato profile - that's what the speed knob is there for!


----------



## jeremyr

jason3.14 said:


> this was fun to listen to! what did you use for brass?


Thanks! I use both Infinite Brass and Winds here.


----------



## AndyP

What do I do if I see the delay compensation plug in but it doesn't load when I try to load it as an insert?
Yesterday it worked once, today it doesn't load anymore.
Cubase 11 Mac.

Ah, and happy new year! 

Edit: Ok, it loads again ... no idea why it just didn't work all the time.


----------



## AndyP

Why is the first note when I play a staccato always a long note?
I deactivate the delay compensator plug in for the recording, played with zero latency.

I'm trying to get to grips with the Easy Artics, but I'm having a hard time creating a usable result. At least when I play the notes live and then switch to Easy Artic mode.


----------



## neblix

AndyP said:


> Why is the first note when I play a staccato always a long note?
> I deactivate the delay compensator plug in for the recording, played with zero latency.
> 
> I'm trying to get to grips with the Easy Artics, but I'm having a hard time creating a usable result. At least when I play the notes live and then switch to Easy Artic mode.


I interpret the problem as, you are playing a note fast with your hands on the keyboard but it records a long note?

If that is the case, I would contact Steinberg support, as this is something we are not really qualified to help with. It has nothing to do with TSS or even Kontakt.


----------



## AndyP

neblix said:


> I interpret the problem as, you are playing a note fast with your hands on the keyboard but it records a long note?
> 
> If that is the case, I would contact Steinberg support, as this is something we are not really qualified to help with. It has nothing to do with TSS or even Kontakt.





neblix said:


> I interpret the problem as, you are playing a note fast with your hands on the keyboard but it records a long note?
> 
> If that is the case, I would contact Steinberg support, as this is something we are not really qualified to help with. It has nothing to do with TSS or even Kontakt.


Hi neblix, thanks for the reply.

I have this effect only with TSS.

It's a complete mystery to me how this happens, and I'm a bit suspicious of the delay compensation plugin, as if it's still active in the background even though it's turned off.

Meanwhile, the first track in this project is another library with short articulation, which I use to play in to move the track to TSS afterwards. 

With my expressionmap there are also timing problems with the first note. It's always that first bar that refuses to be under my control.

It could be Cubase, of course, but in this form the phenomenon only occurs with TSS.

I will keep trying this until I get closer to solving the mystery, at least to recreate the operation under which it happens or no longer happens. First I will remove the delay compensation plugin from the plugin folder.

Maybe another user has had a similar experience? Cubase 11, Mac.


----------



## filipjonathan

AndyP said:


> Maybe another user has had a similar experience? Cubase 11, Mac


Sorry, I'm on Cubase 11, Mac, but haven't had that issue.


----------



## AndyP

filipjonathan said:


> Sorry, I'm on Cubase 11, Mac, but haven't had that issue.


After I replaced the delay compensator component and vst3 in the plugin folder the problem is gone.
I have no idea what went wrong, or if something went wrong before, but it fixed my problem. My assumption was correct that it was due to the components.
The expressionmap problem is also gone since then.


----------



## AndyP

If anyone is interested in a simple TSS expression map, I have it here with a Cubase test project for download.

Edit: 
The portamento slur in the test project has too much dynamic, cc1 should be below 19, then it will work. I have set it too high ... (small mistake).

Works with all sections, that's what I like about TSS, very easy to use.


----------



## constaneum

Here's another test with TSS in full orchestra context. I used CSB and IB for brass as well as CSW for woodwinds. Thought that probably you folks may be interested in how CSB, IB and CSW blends with TSS.


----------



## SimonCharlesHanna

I picked this up recently and absolutely love it. Fantastic sound and the editing is really tight. 

Since this lib is fixing many issues that have existed in previous libraries, I wonder if I could suggest 2 others.

not sure how possible this would be but considering we have look-ahead mode, perhaps possible. Whole-tone sampling brings up a bit issue when playing clusters or notes that are m2 apart - phasing. I wonder if it would be possible to build in some sort of intelligent system that could detect this and play a sub neighbour RR instead? Of course there are work arounds but I think the beauty of this library is the possibility to not need multiples of the same instrument.

Another smaller issue I have (with this and most other sample libs) the Trems have a wonderful attack but it's really prominent compared to the sustaining texture - it would be great for a way to mitigate this
View attachment 2022-01-07_15-51-37.mp4


----------



## ALittleNightMusic

When does ISW usually do sales? Spent too much money in Nov / Dec so wasn't able to grab TSS then.


----------



## Pier-V

SimonCharlesHanna said:


> I picked this up recently and absolutely love it. Fantastic sound and the editing is really tight.
> 
> Since this lib is fixing many issues that have existed in previous libraries, I wonder if I could suggest 2 others.
> 
> not sure how possible this would be but considering we have look-ahead mode, perhaps possible. Whole-tone sampling brings up a bit issue when playing clusters or notes that are m2 apart - phasing. I wonder if it would be possible to build in some sort of intelligent system that could detect this and play a sub neighbour RR instead? Of course there are work arounds but I think the beauty of this library is the possibility to not need multiples of the same instrument.
> 
> Another smaller issue I have (with this and most other sample libs) the Trems have a wonderful attack but it's really prominent compared to the sustaining texture - it would be great for a way to mitigate this
> View attachment 2022-01-07_15-51-37.mp4


I must admit the idea for the +1 note borrowing (instead of the usual -1 transposition trick) specifically for clusters and minor seconds is really really clever. I don't know if it's easy to program but I second this.

About tremolos, I've noticed that too. I like that the samples have a strong attack for the simple reason that, out of the two possible scenarios, it's the easiest one to "tame". Imagine if you wanted a strong attack but the samples start with a swelling...
Of course I agree that sometimes you may need the exact opposite, in fact I've been in that situation. Every articulation in TSS has envelope control, maybe reducing the attack could help in that regard? I got decent results using the envelope for some experimental stuff, for example to emulate accented runs ending on a staccato target note.


----------



## constaneum

SimonCharlesHanna said:


> I picked this up recently and absolutely love it. Fantastic sound and the editing is really tight.
> 
> Since this lib is fixing many issues that have existed in previous libraries, I wonder if I could suggest 2 others.
> 
> not sure how possible this would be but considering we have look-ahead mode, perhaps possible. Whole-tone sampling brings up a bit issue when playing clusters or notes that are m2 apart - phasing. I wonder if it would be possible to build in some sort of intelligent system that could detect this and play a sub neighbour RR instead? Of course there are work arounds but I think the beauty of this library is the possibility to not need multiples of the same instrument.
> 
> Another smaller issue I have (with this and most other sample libs) the Trems have a wonderful attack but it's really prominent compared to the sustaining texture - it would be great for a way to mitigate this
> View attachment 2022-01-07_15-51-37.mp4


pertaining the attacks for trems, have you explored on lower velocity note? BUT...i do notice you dont have the overlay set....so a bit weird....hmm.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Thanks for the kind words! Have you tried just nudging up the Attack time for the Tremolo articulation?


----------



## Andrew Aversa

TSS v1.0.3 is now available via the Pulse Downloader!


RAM usage reduced by about 25% across the board thanks to clever optimizations in legato groups
Improved attack overlay behavior to be more audible at lower dynamics; fixed bugs when overlay was enabled with niente enabled
Tweaked lookahead timings
Fixed viola high dynamic spiccato on D3 (wrong root note)
Improved fast legato release behavior (i.e. short legato notes)


----------



## Jackdnp121

Sweet …and thank u 🙏


----------



## MartinH.

Andrew Aversa said:


> TSS v1.0.3 is now available via the Pulse Downloader!
> 
> 
> RAM usage reduced by about 25% across the board thanks to clever optimizations in legato groups
> Improved attack overlay behavior to be more audible at lower dynamics; fixed bugs when overlay was enabled with niente enabled
> Tweaked lookahead timings
> Fixed viola high dynamic spiccato on D3 (wrong root note)
> Improved fast legato release behavior (i.e. short legato notes)



Just wanted to say that I really appreciate you and the rest of the team fixing issues, and improving the library even further!


----------



## muziksculp

Thanks for the Update


----------



## RMH

Is it possible to change the installation location in pulse?


----------



## Haakond

RMH said:


> Is it possible to change the installation location in pulse?


Yes. You either do it when you start downloading, or you can move the library after install and relocate in Pulse


----------



## Bee_Abney

25% improvement in RAM useage? Wow. These are all really great updates.


----------



## neblix

Bee_Abney said:


> 25% improvement in RAM useage? Wow. These are all really great updates.


It's a new optimization technique made possible by the most recent versions of Kontakt. We essentially cut the DFD-chunks in half for all the samples, which translated to that big drop in RAM.

For point of comparison, the Violins I Mic Mixer nki was *previously 6.93 GB* at stock DFD setting, and the new update *brings it down to 5.16 GB*.

That being said, for people running the library on a fast SSD, you definitely should go into Kontakt and activate the DFD override to bring it down even more.






On my system, setting an *18 kB override* brings the new Violins I Board Mix nki down *from 1.29 GB to 1.01 GB*, with Mic Mixer dropping to *4.04 GB*.

Of course, dropping this override value too low can cause stutters if the SSD isn't fast enough or there's too much throughput being demanded. 18 kB feels right on my setup, otherwise the stock TSS release is configured to 30 kB if you have not chosen your own.


----------



## jason3.14

Thanks for the explanation, and the tip on DFD override!


----------



## Bee_Abney

neblix said:


> It's a new optimization technique made possible by the most recent versions of Kontakt. We essentially cut the DFD-chunks in half for all the samples, which translated to that big drop in RAM.
> 
> For point of comparison, the Violins I Mic Mixer nki was *previously 6.93 GB* at stock DFD setting, and the new update *brings it down to 5.16 GB*.
> 
> That being said, for people running the library on a fast SSD, you definitely should go into Kontakt and activate the DFD override to bring it down even more.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On my system, setting an *18 kB override* brings the new Violins I Board Mix nki down *from 1.29 GB to 1.01 GB*, with Mic Mixer dropping to *4.04 GB*.
> 
> Of course, dropping this override value too low can cause stutters if the SSD isn't fast enough or there's too much throughput being demanded. 18 kB feels right on my setup, otherwise the stock TSS release is configured to 30 kB if you have not chosen your own.


That’s really helpful. I’ll have to make an adjustment there. This will be a big help!


----------



## lzcmusic

neblix said:


> It's a new optimization technique made possible by the most recent versions of Kontakt. We essentially cut the DFD-chunks in half for all the samples, which translated to that big drop in RAM.
> 
> For point of comparison, the Violins I Mic Mixer nki was *previously 6.93 GB* at stock DFD setting, and the new update *brings it down to 5.16 GB*.
> 
> That being said, for people running the library on a fast SSD, you definitely should go into Kontakt and activate the DFD override to bring it down even more.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On my system, setting an *18 kB override* brings the new Violins I Board Mix nki down *from 1.29 GB to 1.01 GB*, with Mic Mixer dropping to *4.04 GB*.
> 
> Of course, dropping this override value too low can cause stutters if the SSD isn't fast enough or there's too much throughput being demanded. 18 kB feels right on my setup, otherwise the stock TSS release is configured to 30 kB if you have not chosen your own.


Dear Developer：

When will Kontakt Library label logo image clarity issues be fixed?


----------



## filipjonathan

lzcmusic said:


> Dear Developer：
> 
> When will Kontakt Library label logo image clarity issues be fixed?


No offense, but imo, library playability and efficiency are more important than the look of the logo. I'm sure they'll address that when they get a chance.


----------



## Trash Panda

lzcmusic said:


> Dear Developer：
> 
> When will Kontakt Library label logo image clarity issues be fixed?


Are you for real or just a really good sock puppet account?


----------



## Zanshin

filipjonathan said:


> No offense, but imo, library playability and efficiency are more important than the look of the logo. I'm sure they'll address that when they get a chance.


I agree, it’s such a bizarre complaint. I mean I know we have library collectors around here but this ... LOL.


----------



## rottoy

lzcmusic said:


> Dear Developer：
> 
> When will Kontakt Library label logo image clarity issues be fixed?


Fixed it.


----------



## lzcmusic

Guys, I'm not complaining, I just want the developers to make Library better...


----------



## Jackdnp121

Which they are indeed making it better , they just released …. some good nice update …. And as ppl and I mentioned before Im sure they will fix it soon or later … hold on there …


----------



## Trash Panda

lzcmusic said:


> Guys, I'm not complaining, I just want the developers to make Library better...


They are making it better where it matters: how it plays, how it sounds.


----------



## jason3.14

rottoy said:


> Fixed it.


That's like... Actually a really awesome drawing :'O


----------



## neblix

lzcmusic said:


> Dear Developer：
> 
> When will Kontakt Library label logo image clarity issues be fixed?


Our graphic designer has had several concerning family matters in the past month that required him to step away from work.

Your patience on editing the logo is appreciated.


----------



## lzcmusic

neblix said:


> Our graphic designer has had several concerning family matters in the past month that required him to step away from work.
> 
> Your patience on editing the logo is appreciated.


Thank you for your reply!


----------



## Batuer

@neblix For now we have separate nkis for board mix and mic mix. Are there some reasons for this? Is it possible to combine board mix and other mics in one nki? So we can switch between them more easily.

Thanks.


----------



## neblix

Batuer said:


> @neblix For now we have separate nkis for board mix and mic mix. Are there some reasons for this? Is it possible to combine board mix and other mics in one nki? So we can switch between them more easily.
> 
> Thanks.


NKI's become unstable at high zone counts. This one's on Native Instruments. 



lzcmusic said:


> Thank you for your reply!








@lzcmusic The Kanji have now been corrected. This will appear in a future patch when we have another library update to share which should be in the next couple weeks.

In the meantime, if you download this image that I posted right there, and save it as "wallpaper.png" in the Tokyo Scoring Strings folder (the same folder as the "Tokyo Scoring Strings.nicnt" file), it will appear corrected for you in the browser.

Like so:






Which leads to:






I should also mention, this actually looks more blurry on VI-Control because the forum seems to be blowing it up. If you save the file and do the "wallpaper.png" trick, you will notice it's actually quite crisp when it appears in Kontakt.


----------



## ism

Life with graphic designers means accepting that they just really, really care about such things.


----------



## EvilDragon

neblix said:


> NKI's become unstable at high zone counts.



I think it really depends on what's being done, tbh. There are a number of products out in the wild that are close to the zone limit and there are no stability issues (some I could list from the top of my head are In Session Audio Taiko and Drumatic Creator libraries).

This is worth retesting with newer versions of Kontakt.


----------



## Jackdnp121

now that’s some great customer service examples …..right there ….


----------



## lzcmusic

neblix said:


> NKI's become unstable at high zone counts. This one's on Native Instruments.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> @lzcmusic The Kanji have now been corrected. This will appear in a future patch when we have another library update to share which should be in the next couple weeks.
> 
> In the meantime, if you download this image that I posted right there, and save it as "wallpaper.png" in the Tokyo Scoring Strings folder (the same folder as the "Tokyo Scoring Strings.nicnt" file), it will appear corrected for you in the browser.
> 
> Like so:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Which leads to:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I should also mention, this actually looks more blurry on VI-Control because the forum seems to be blowing it up. If you save the file and do the "wallpaper.png" trick, you will notice it's actually quite crisp when it appears in Kontakt.


Thank you and the team for your hard work


----------



## Batuer

neblix said:


> NKI's become unstable at high zone counts. This one's on Native Instruments.


Thanks. Now I get it.


----------



## neblix

Update Concerning TSS & Cubase 11

==

So I have installed the latest version of Cubase 11, and I can to report that Lookahead is working as expected, including on a MIDI sent by a customer who recorded a screencap video showing clearly that it wasn't working.

In other words, given the same MIDI data, and ostensibly same version of Cubase, I'm getting different results on my machine than the customer, and our customer support rep who also tried it in Cubase confirmed it was working too.

This is, well, bad news, because this means there's no clear path to investigating the bug. If the customers reporting the issue are indeed on the latest version of Cubase, then it would appear it's some kind of issue local to a specific installation, and not Cubase itself.

It could perhaps be some stray setting in Cubase's Preferences, that is somehow causing it to mess with MIDI data, maybe in response to PDC.

A request for the users afflicted: could you try using Lookahead WITHOUT any compensation at all? No Compensator VST3, no negative track offset, etc.

Yes, you will hear the sound delayed 1 second away from the playback cursor, but listen for if the legato works. If the legato works without any compensation, we can trace it to having something to do with delay compensation.

Additionally, any users who are having issues with TSS Lookahead and Cubase 11, could you please send Cubase project files (not MIDI) with the issue isolated? You can DM them to me or drop them right here in the thread.

-Nabeel A.


----------



## neblix

Another Cubase 11 investigation update:






Can the afflicted users navigate to this MIDI settings page? It would be in *Edit -> Preferences -> MIDI*.
*
Please try setting the "Length Adjustment" to 0 ticks, and see if this fixes your Legato in Lookahead.*


----------



## RMH

neblix said:


> Update Concerning TSS & Cubase 11
> 
> ==
> 
> So I have installed the latest version of Cubase 11, and I can to report that Lookahead is working as expected, including on a MIDI sent by a customer who recorded a screencap video showing clearly that it wasn't working.
> 
> In other words, given the same MIDI data, and ostensibly same version of Cubase, I'm getting different results on my machine than the customer, and our customer support rep who also tried it in Cubase confirmed it was working too.
> 
> This is, well, bad news, because this means there's no clear path to investigating the bug. If the customers reporting the issue are indeed on the latest version of Cubase, then it would appear it's some kind of issue local to a specific installation, and not Cubase itself.
> 
> It could perhaps be some stray setting in Cubase's Preferences, that is somehow causing it to mess with MIDI data, maybe in response to PDC.
> 
> A request for the users afflicted: could you try using Lookahead WITHOUT any compensation at all? No Compensator VST3, no negative track offset, etc.
> 
> Yes, you will hear the sound delayed 1 second away from the playback cursor, but listen for if the legato works. If the legato works without any compensation, we can trace it to having something to do with delay compensation.
> 
> Additionally, any users who are having issues with TSS Lookahead and Cubase 11, could you please send Cubase project files (not MIDI) with the issue isolated? You can DM them to me or drop them right here in the thread.
> 
> -Nabeel A.


Thank you Nabeel A.
As soon as other arrangements are completed, I will prepare a file. 

Although you directly put an e-mail inquiry into ISW, it is confirmed that lookahead is still not working when you enter the midi in a straight line and use the delay plug-in you provided without touching the new project. Other Daw, LPX and S1 pro, work well under the same conditions. Perhaps it is a matter of individual Cubase.


----------



## RMH

neblix said:


> Another update:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Can the afflicted users navigate to this MIDI settings page? It would be in *Edit -> Preferences -> MIDI*.
> 
> Please try setting the "Length Adjustment" to 0 ticks, and see if this fixes your Legato in Lookahead.


Thank you. I'll set it up like this.


----------



## Batuer

Thanks for your help and feedback for Cubase users. @neblix


----------



## neblix

Can you guys confirm if the "Length Adjustment" fixes the issue?


----------



## Geomir

Sorry if this have been mentioned in some of the previous 93 pages and I lost it, but I need to ask:

Does anyone knows if Impact Soundworks has any active plans to continue this "Tokyo Scoring" series with Tokyo Scoring Woodwinds, Tokyo Scoring Brass and Tokyo Scoring Percussion, also recorded in Sound City Studio?


----------



## Tom Ferguson

Geomir said:


> Sorry if this have been mentioned in some of the previous 93 pages and I lost it, but I need to ask:
> 
> Does anyone knows if Impact Soundworks has any active plans to continue this "Tokyo Scoring" series with Tokyo Scoring Woodwinds, Tokyo Scoring Brass and Tokyo Scoring Percussion, also recorded in Sound City Studio?


They do


----------



## jason3.14

jason3.14 said:


> Day #5 WIP of Octopath Traveler Battle Theme 1, including spending most of Xmas/post Xmas on it (worth)!
> 
> View attachment Octopath Traveler - Battle I.mp3
> 
> 
> I'm using Lookahead Mode with Pure Attack and Legato Speed on. I started out with Easy Artic on, but am still having difficulty with it, and decided to turn it off (at least for Violins 1/2 and Viola at the moment). Between layering Legato with the various Shorts articulations (and a lot of automation lol), I feel like TSS can deliver very agile, lively, and convincing passages - hope this meets that expectation!
> 
> Very excited to continue with filling out the rest of the arrangement (teaser near the end), and hope you like it! 🙏🥳



Day #??? of Octopath Traveler Battle Theme 1, spending Xmas, New Year, and (gasp) Chinese New Year 😅 working on it:

View attachment Octopath Traveler - Battle I.mp3


Here's the strings bus as well so you can hear what TSS is doing (though postprocessed).

View attachment Octopath Traveler - Battle I (TSS).mp3


Hope you enjoy the development, and appreciate your thoughts/suggestions! 🙏🥳


----------



## ender7

This library is really something special. I preordered it and so happy I do so! This is now one of my favorite libraries ever, great job ISW~~!

I'm still trying to wrap my head around Lookahead Mode and how to fit it into my workflow, specifically with *Logic Pro*.

I'm aware of the Delay Compensation plugin, but I really prefer not to use a plugin for this, as I'm normally using the DAW built-in track and region delay features for orchestral samples. I find that it keeps my project simpler (transferring work from desktop to laptop, the fewer plugins the better) and just less for things to go wrong. I can't figure out how to get this playing nicely with Logic Pro's track/region delay though, and also I'm having issues with overlapping notes.

1. I've tried using Logic Pro's track delay but it seems the max delay is -500ms? Can anyone else confirm this? So that means it's impossible to use track delay of -1000ms then. I also tried region delay, but it doesn't seem to let you manually enter ms delay time, only "ticks", and also getting a -1000ms delay seems impossible here also. So has anyone got this to work in Logic Pro without using the plugin?

2. Logic Pro has a feature to trim adjacent notes to prevent overlapping, but from what I can tell it actually introduces a small gap in between the notes, which doesn't conform to them being right next to each other but not overlapping. Does anyone know an easy way in Logic Pro to make two notes adjacent, with no gaps, but not overlapping?


----------



## Brasart

jason3.14 said:


> Day #??? of Octopath Traveler Battle Theme 1, spending Xmas, New Year, and (gasp) Chinese New Year 😅 working on it:
> 
> View attachment Octopath Traveler - Battle I.mp3
> 
> 
> Here's the strings bus as well so you can hear what TSS is doing (though postprocessed).
> 
> View attachment Octopath Traveler - Battle I (TSS).mp3
> 
> 
> Hope you enjoy the development, and appreciate your thoughts/suggestions! 🙏🥳


I'm really blown away by the quality of your mockup, not just the strings, but the whole thing!


----------



## jason3.14

Brasart said:


> I'm really blown away by the quality of your mockup, not just the strings, but the whole thing!


I'm flattered! Glad that you liked it, and thanks for listening!


----------



## Loïc D

ender7 said:


> This library is really something special. I preordered it and so happy I do so! This is now one of my favorite libraries ever, great job ISW~~!
> 
> I'm still trying to wrap my head around Lookahead Mode and how to fit it into my workflow, specifically with *Logic Pro*.
> 
> I'm aware of the Delay Compensation plugin, but I really prefer not to use a plugin for this, as I'm normally using the DAW built-in track and region delay features for orchestral samples. I find that it keeps my project simpler (transferring work from desktop to laptop, the fewer plugins the better) and just less for things to go wrong. I can't figure out how to get this playing nicely with Logic Pro's track/region delay though, and also I'm having issues with overlapping notes.
> 
> 1. I've tried using Logic Pro's track delay but it seems the max delay is -500ms? Can anyone else confirm this? So that means it's impossible to use track delay of -1000ms then. I also tried region delay, but it doesn't seem to let you manually enter ms delay time, only "ticks", and also getting a -1000ms delay seems impossible here also. So has anyone got this to work in Logic Pro without using the plugin?
> 
> 2. Logic Pro has a feature to trim adjacent notes to prevent overlapping, but from what I can tell it actually introduces a small gap in between the notes, which doesn't conform to them being right next to each other but not overlapping. Does anyone know an easy way in Logic Pro to make two notes adjacent, with no gaps, but not overlapping?


Point 2 : no settings and indeed LPX creates a gap of exactly 8 ticks.
So, I’ve created a keyboard shortcut to add 8 ticks.
Next move : create a macro in StreamDeck to do both actions. 1 button to have true legato. I’ll implement this in Open Stage Control/Keyboard Maestro as well


----------



## Bee_Abney

jason3.14 said:


> Day #??? of Octopath Traveler Battle Theme 1, spending Xmas, New Year, and (gasp) Chinese New Year 😅 working on it:
> 
> View attachment Octopath Traveler - Battle I.mp3
> 
> 
> Here's the strings bus as well so you can hear what TSS is doing (though postprocessed).
> 
> View attachment Octopath Traveler - Battle I (TSS).mp3
> 
> 
> Hope you enjoy the development, and appreciate your thoughts/suggestions! 🙏🥳



That's a little bit of awesome you've made there! Well done and thanks for sharing. It's very inspiring.


----------



## jason3.14

Bee_Abney said:


> That's a little bit of awesome you've made there! Well done and thanks for sharing. It's very inspiring.


Thank you for your kind words! 😊


----------



## MonadoLink

I got this thing when it came out. I kind of regret it because I can't figure out how to use it. I have Cubase but I'm supposed to use this and Kontakt too? I just wanted to hear what sounds I could make with the library but can't even find a way to make the softwares connect. I can hardly play piano, I was going to just try and click the notes in like you'd do in Logic or similar programs but I'm lost


----------



## Getsumen

MonadoLink said:


> I got this thing when it came out. I kind of regret it because I can't figure out how to use it. I have Cubase but I'm supposed to use this and Kontakt too? I just wanted to hear what sounds I could make with the library but can't even find a way to make the softwares connect. I can hardly play piano, I was going to just try and click the notes in like you'd do in Logic or similar programs but I'm lost


Hey, you can certainly write in parts without needing to play them in on the piano.

TSS is a Kontakt Player Library. What this means is that you will need to install a few third-party programs. Have you read the install instructions on the manual?







If Kontakt is not showing up in Cubase you may need to add the path to it in your Cubase VST Plug-In manager. (Although I believe Kontakt should default install itself to a spot that Cubase can find it in)

I might be totally misunderstanding what you're having trouble with here though, so some additional info would go a long ways


----------



## liquidlino

MonadoLink said:


> I got this thing when it came out. I kind of regret it because I can't figure out how to use it. I have Cubase but I'm supposed to use this and Kontakt too? I just wanted to hear what sounds I could make with the library but can't even find a way to make the softwares connect. I can hardly play piano, I was going to just try and click the notes in like you'd do in Logic or similar programs but I'm lost


Hi, first few hours are always the hardest! Persevere, it'll suddenly click and you'll wonder what you were struggling with 

1. Add the instrument (Kontakt) in Cubase: 

2. In Kontakt, open up the TSS library on the left, and double click a patch, it should load the patch into Kontakt

3. Open midi editor on the track and enter some notes, should start working - noting that you have to enter notes that are within the playing range of the patch you chose. Good to start with ensemble patches that cover most of the keyboard.


----------



## jason3.14

MonadoLink said:


> I got this thing when it came out. I kind of regret it because I can't figure out how to use it. I have Cubase but I'm supposed to use this and Kontakt too? I just wanted to hear what sounds I could make with the library but can't even find a way to make the softwares connect. I can hardly play piano, I was going to just try and click the notes in like you'd do in Logic or similar programs but I'm lost


Agree with the other responses! Even though I do play piano, I still choose to primarily click in notes when working on a track, rather than play it in


----------



## william81723

I just finished a mock-up of Tressa by Yasunori Nishiki.



Original music：


Instrument List：
TSS
Chris Hein Harmonica
CinePerc
CineHarp
SWAM Clarinet
Noire


----------



## Tom Ferguson

william81723 said:


> I just finished a mock-up of Tressa by Yasunori Nishiki.
> 
> 
> 
> Original music：
> 
> 
> Instrument List：
> TSS
> Chris Hein Harmonica
> CinePerc
> CineHarp
> SWAM Clarinet
> Noire



Very good mockup! The strings are just a touch close and dry compared to the original and I think chord at 0m15s-0m16s-ish is wrong, but that's basically it. The harmonica is especially on point!


----------



## william81723

Tom Ferguson said:


> Very good mockup! The strings are just a touch close and dry compared to the original and I think chord at 0m15s-0m16s-ish is wrong, but that's basically it. The harmonica is especially on point!


Thanks for your compliment and reminding.I'll check that.
And I found that my strings are a bit too loud in the beginning..ha


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Wow! Incredible work. I have listened to the Octopath soundtrack many, many times and this is very close to the original. Really, really nice. Can we share this on social media? If so, let us know your handles/accounts so we c credit you!


----------



## william81723

Andrew Aversa said:


> Wow! Incredible work. I have listened to the Octopath soundtrack many, many times and this is very close to the original. Really, really nice. Can we share this on social media? If so, let us know your handles/accounts so we c credit you!


Hi Andrew,

Sure!! I'm glad to hear that!!
Can we do it a little later? I have to make a little more adjustment.....but I left my project in my office ha....


----------



## RMH

Hello, Every One.
Right, in another arrangement, I used TSS. This is played a great sound again this time. In fact, I like to arrange pop music rather than game music, but I'm very satisfied. It's different from your preferred genre, but it depends on your use. Please enjoy it.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Hi all, we have just published patch 1.0.4 via Pulse. You should see the update appear within about 15 minutes as of this post. Here's the log!

FIXED: 'Cello Spiccato Secco D1 V2 RR01' Late Start-time has been corrected.
FIXED: Inconsistent Velocity -> Volume behavior on some articulations. Corrected for the current intended behavior, all Longs + Sfz/Dec are controlled by Dynamics (CC1), and all Shorts are controlled by Velocity.
FIXED: We discovered Cubase users by default have a 2-tick gap between touching MIDI Notes, which prevented Lookahead's legato detection from working properly. Lookahead now accounts for an extra 2 ticks.
FIXED: Attack overlays now properly are faded out when playing legato lines. Before, long overlays like the Sfz 1/4 would continue ringing long after notes transitioned.
FIXED: Previous Library Pane graphic had corrupted Kanji in the logo.


----------



## pulsedownloader

In case you don't see the update right away, just go into Preferences then Check for Product Updates to force it to check for the update


----------



## rottoy

Andrew Aversa said:


> Hi all, we have just published patch 1.0.4 via Pulse. You should see the update appear within about 15 minutes as of this post. Here's the log!
> 
> FIXED: 'Cello Spiccato Secco D1 V2 RR01' Late Start-time has been corrected.
> FIXED: Inconsistent Velocity -> Volume behavior on some articulations. Corrected for the current intended behavior, all Longs + Sfz/Dec are controlled by Dynamics (CC1), and all Shorts are controlled by Velocity.
> FIXED: We discovered Cubase users by default have a 2-tick gap between touching MIDI Notes, which prevented Lookahead's legato detection from working properly. Lookahead now accounts for an extra 2 ticks.
> FIXED: Attack overlays now properly are faded out when playing legato lines. Before, long overlays like the Sfz 1/4 would continue ringing long after notes transitioned.
> FIXED: Previous Library Pane graphic had corrupted Kanji in the logo.


Massive thanks for the latest update, much appreciated!
I have one question, though: I was led to believe that you would also add functionality 
to enable the Sfz/Dec articulations to also be controlled by Velocity, 
based on conversations in your official Discord server. 

I might've been reading that wrong, so feel free to set the record straight.


----------



## RMH

Andrew Aversa said:


> FIXED: We discovered Cubase users by default have a 2-tick gap between touching MIDI Notes, which prevented Lookahead's legato detection from working properly. Lookahead now accounts for an extra 2 ticks.


Thank you😭 I've been waiting this!


----------



## muziksculp

@Andrew Aversa ,

Thanks for the TSS ver 1.0.4 Update 

@pulsedownloader ,

Updated super fast. All working great in PULSE Downloader for me. 







Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Andrew Aversa

rottoy said:


> Massive thanks for the latest update, much appreciated!
> I have one question, though: I was led to believe that you would also add functionality
> to enable the Sfz/Dec articulations to also be controlled by Velocity,
> based on conversations in your official Discord server.
> 
> I might've been reading that wrong, so feel free to set the record straight.



We have this feature request logged for our 1.1.0 update, which will include a bunch of other feature and sample updates. 1.1.0 will be a pretty enormous update so it will take longer to implement everything (we're looking at Q2, maybe Q3) but it should be worth it. 

In the meantime, we'll continue to address any minor issues, fixes, and optimizations!


----------



## Andrew Aversa

Please enjoy this new demo, "Part of the Creation", by Fredrik Hathen, one of our esteemed customer support specialists and a fantastic composer at that!











Impact Soundworks Tokyo Scoring Strings (Kontakt Player VST, AU, AAX)


Our flagship orchestral string library featuring Koichiro Muroya Strings, Japan's top string ensemble heard on countless anime and game OSTs.




impactsoundworks.com


----------



## Henrik B. Jensen

Andrew Aversa said:


> Please enjoy this new demo, "Part of the Creation", by Fredrik Hathen, one of our esteemed customer support specialists and a fantastic composer at that!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Impact Soundworks Tokyo Scoring Strings (Kontakt Player VST, AU, AAX)
> 
> 
> Our flagship orchestral string library featuring Koichiro Muroya Strings, Japan's top string ensemble heard on countless anime and game OSTs.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> impactsoundworks.com



Reminds me of Mark Snow's music for the X-Files series


----------



## HM_Music

Any news about "tokyo scoring brass\perc"?
The only libraries I'm thinking about, and considering I'm from the Ukraine, I'm a little more serious about budget planning right now.


----------



## Andrew Aversa

HM_Music said:


> Any news about "tokyo scoring brass\perc"?
> The only libraries I'm thinking about, and considering I'm from the Ukraine, I'm a little more serious about budget planning right now.


At the moment, Tokyo Scoring Drums are in editing. We are planning a Q3 release. Tokyo Scoring Brass is 2023-2024; it looks like we _may _be recording Solo Strings this year and winds either this year or early 2023.

Please stay safe!


----------



## muziksculp

Andrew Aversa said:


> it looks like we _may _be recording Solo Strings this year


I'm very happy you decided to record solo strings this year. 

As you might already know, New String libraries announcements, will surely make Muziksculp very happy 

Thanks for giving us some feedback on your future development efforts road map.


----------



## Denkii

muziksculp said:


> As you might already know, New String libraries announcements, will surely make Muziksculp very happy


No way 🤯


----------



## Jackdnp121

The woodwind will be sexy


----------



## Trash Panda

Andrew Aversa said:


> it looks like we _may _be recording Solo Strings this year


Yes please.


----------



## Nantho Valentine

Can't wait to work with the upcoming libraries of this serie !


----------



## Geomir

To be honest, nothing would make me more excited to see Tokyo Scoring Woodwinds before anything else. Whenever Nobuo Uematsu is using a flute or an oboe, real magic happens.


----------



## jason3.14

Yu-Peng Chen (Genshin Impact) winds are amazing!


----------



## Bee_Abney

I have a terrible, terrible secret. I'm not actually that fond of Japanese animation. Sure, I've seen a reasonable amount, but it isn't quite for me. But I really do love the music, and I really do love Tokyo Scoring Strings. The anticipation for the additions to the orchestral line will be buzzing away in me for the next few years.


----------



## Germain B

Strings, Muziksculp happy.
Woodwinds, me happy.


----------



## muziksculp

Germain B said:


> Strings, Muziksculp happy.
> Woodwinds, me happy.


OH.. Maybe you were not aware of this, but Muziksculp is also a big Woodwinds fan, so you can include him with you in the Woodwinds camp. Looking forward to enjoy some Tokyo Woodwinds.


----------



## muziksculp

Bee_Abney said:


> I have a terrible, terrible secret. I'm not actually that fond of Japanese animation. Sure, I've seen a reasonable amount, but it isn't quite for me. But I really do love the music, and I really do love Tokyo Scoring Strings. The anticipation for the additions to the orchestral line will be buzzing away in me for the next few years.


Same here, although I love some of the Studio Ghibli movies. i.e. Princess Mononokee, and Spirited Away, Howl's Moving Castle. But the music of these Japanese Animations is what I love, and am a big fan of.

The music of the Genshin Impact anime is Awesome !


----------



## Bee_Abney

muziksculp said:


> Same here, although I love some of the Studio Ghibli movies. i.e. Princess Mononokee, and Spirited Away, Howl's Moving Castle. But the music of these Japanese Animations is what I love, and am a big fan of.
> 
> The music of the Genshin Impact anime is Awesome !


The Genshin Impact game? Or have I missed something.

It's actually Chinese, but is very much the same sort of appeal and beauty.


----------



## tonio_

Did I read that correctly? Solo Strings?

I NEED IT NOW.


----------



## mybadmemory

Will we ever get Tokyo Scoring Plucks and Tokyo Scoring Keys? Besides the strings, winds, brass, and drums, we’ll also need the harps, guitars, pianos and celestas for our Japanese scoring! 😬


----------



## Getsumen

Bee_Abney said:


> The Genshin Impact game? Or have I missed something.
> 
> It's actually Chinese, but is very much the same sort of appeal and beauty.


Some of the OST is recorded in Japan (The Inazuma tracks) although those don't really have the traditional western woodwinds. The traditional western woodwind stuff I believe were done by the London Symphony Orch? Or at least most of it since if I recall the Mondstadt tracks were done in London


----------



## Bee_Abney

Getsumen said:


> Some of the OST is recorded in Japan (The Inazuma tracks) although those don't really have the traditional western woodwinds. The traditional western woodwind stuff I believe were done by the London Symphony Orch? Or at least most of it since if I recall the Mondstadt tracks were done in London


That's fascinating. I'm a big fan of incorporating non-western instruments in the arrangement.


----------



## Zhao Shen

Just bought TSS and am really impressed by what I'm hearing!

One thing - does anyone else get really unnatural initial attacks when using viola and cello arco? It's my one complaint from initial noodling.


----------



## timbit2006

Andrew Aversa said:


> we _may _be recording Solo Strings this year


On all levels except physical, I've already pre-ordered this.


----------



## jason3.14

I submitted a track to the MiHoYo music composition contest, and am honored to have made it to the voting stage (top 30)! I used TSS for the strings. Didn't necessarily expect it to work out, but I was happy with its performance in the cinematic/trailer context, even. I hope I was able to demonstrate TSS's versatility somewhat!

Feel free to check the contest out here, and vote for your favorite:





HoYoLAB - Official Community


HoYoLAB is the community forum for Genshin Impact and Honkai Impact 3rd, with official information about game events, perks, fan art, and other exciting content.




www.hoyolab.com





Here's my submission:





HoYoLAB - Official Community


HoYoLAB is the community forum for Genshin Impact and Honkai Impact 3rd, with official information about game events, perks, fan art, and other exciting content.




www.hoyolab.com





And version on youtube:


----------



## Bee_Abney

jason3.14 said:


> I submitted a track to the MiHoYo music composition contest, and am honored to have made it to the voting stage (top 30)! I used TSS for the strings. Didn't necessarily expect it to work out, but I was happy with its performance in the cinematic/trailer context, even. I hope I was able to demonstrate TSS's versatility somewhat!
> 
> Feel free to check the contest out here, and vote for your favorite:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HoYoLAB - Official Community
> 
> 
> HoYoLAB is the community forum for Genshin Impact and Honkai Impact 3rd, with official information about game events, perks, fan art, and other exciting content.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.hoyolab.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Here's my submission:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HoYoLAB - Official Community
> 
> 
> HoYoLAB is the community forum for Genshin Impact and Honkai Impact 3rd, with official information about game events, perks, fan art, and other exciting content.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> www.hoyolab.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And version on youtube:




Congratulations on making it so far already! Well done. Your piece is very inspiring.


----------



## jason3.14

Bee_Abney said:


> Congratulations on making it so far already! Well done. Your piece is very inspiring.


Thank you, I really appreciate it!  I think I am currently in 2nd place, though 2 days left to go!


----------



## Bee_Abney

jason3.14 said:


> Thank you, I really appreciate it!  I think I am currently in 2nd place, though 2 days left to go!


That's amazing! I hope you win!


----------



## eggspls

Loïc D said:


> Point 2 : no settings and indeed LPX creates a gap of exactly 8 ticks.
> So, I’ve created a keyboard shortcut to add 8 ticks.
> Next move : create a macro in StreamDeck to do both actions. 1 button to have true legato. I’ll implement this in Open Stage Control/Keyboard Maestro as well


hey, i just grabbed TSS and didn't realize this functionality of LPX's force legato. Could you walk me through how you set a key command to add 8 ticks (i guess 6 now since 1.0.4 release) to all selected notes to trigger the polyphonic legato in lookahead mode?


----------



## eggspls

Andrew Aversa said:


> Hi all, we have just published patch 1.0.4 via Pulse. You should see the update appear within about 15 minutes as of this post. Here's the log!
> 
> FIXED: 'Cello Spiccato Secco D1 V2 RR01' Late Start-time has been corrected.
> FIXED: Inconsistent Velocity -> Volume behavior on some articulations. Corrected for the current intended behavior, all Longs + Sfz/Dec are controlled by Dynamics (CC1), and all Shorts are controlled by Velocity.
> FIXED: We discovered Cubase users by default have a 2-tick gap between touching MIDI Notes, which prevented Lookahead's legato detection from working properly. Lookahead now accounts for an extra 2 ticks.
> FIXED: Attack overlays now properly are faded out when playing legato lines. Before, long overlays like the Sfz 1/4 would continue ringing long after notes transitioned.
> FIXED: Previous Library Pane graphic had corrupted Kanji in the logo.


On the topic of Cubase users having a 2-tick gap between touching midil notes, it's been mentioned that Logic Pro X has an 8-tick gap when using the force legato key command. Could Lookahead be updated to account for an extra 8 tickets instead?


----------



## stigbn

Zhao Shen said:


> Just bought TSS and am really impressed by what I'm hearing!
> 
> One thing - does anyone else get really unnatural initial attacks when using viola and cello arco? It's my one complaint from initial noodling.


Be sure to check: Longs - Sound - Overlay - here is a spiccato overlay , maybe that's what you are hearing? You can remove it completely by setting volume to zero.


----------



## cloudrunner92

Andrew Aversa said:


> We have this feature request logged for our 1.1.0 update, which will include a bunch of other feature and sample updates. 1.1.0 will be a pretty enormous update so it will take longer to implement everything (we're looking at Q2, maybe Q3) but it should be worth it.
> 
> In the meantime, we'll continue to address any minor issues, fixes, and optimizations!


I was wondering if there are any news about this 1.1.0 update? ☺️


----------



## tonio_

Trash Panda said:


> IIRC, Tokyo Sporting Drums (not Perc) is coming in October and Solo strings are scheduled for recording in Q4, so likely next year for a release.


Wait, whaaaaaat drums are coming in October?! I haven't planned for that damn it


----------



## EvilDragon




----------



## tonio_

EvilDragon said:


>


This could mean so many different things, I have so many questions aaaargh


----------



## Bee_Abney

tonio_ said:


> This could mean so many different things, I have so many questions aaaargh


The dude is evil.


----------



## muziksculp

Hi,

I just started working with TSS. So far.. Loving it.

One little tip for TSS users. I was trying to get a warmer, and less nasal timbre, which led me to try inserting one of the built-in EQ in the library via the Console Tab. I inserted the Parametric EQ, and tweaked the knobs a slight bit for the three frequency bands. and Bingo ! I heard the pleasing timbre I was looking for. Very rich, and warm, and nothing sounding nasal or muffled about it. This was working with the Celli Shorts.

Here is a pic of my Para.EQ settings. I used Liquid Sonics Seventh Heaven reverb. I might post an audio clip later.





I highly recommend you check the console, and what you can achieve using the builtin plugins.

Hope this is helpful.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## muziksculp

Hi,

Here is a short audio clip showing the timbre of the Stacc. Celli after inserting the Parametric EQ as shown above. I also have a bit of 7th Heaven Reverb on the Celli, and a Limiter on the master bus. 

View attachment TSS Celli Stacc Para EQ .mp3


----------



## Bee_Abney

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> Here is a short audio clip showing the timbre of the Stacc. Celli after inserting the Parametric EQ as shown above. I also have a bit of 7th Heaven Reverb on the Celli, and a Limiter on the master bus.
> 
> View attachment TSS Celli Stacc Para EQ .mp3


My new headphones just arrived in the post - Fostex T50RP mk3 with Regular Phase technology (Planar headphones). I mention this because the very first thing I listened to with them was your demo. So, when I say it sounds absolutely stunningly amazing, don't let it go to your head!

You have really transformed the sound though, in a very naturalistic and convincing way.


----------



## muziksculp

Bee_Abney said:


> My new headphones just arrived in the post - Fostex T50RP mk3 with Regular Phase technology (Planar headphones). I mention this because the very first thing I listened to with them was your demo. So, when I say it sounds absolutely stunningly amazing, don't let it go to your head!
> 
> You have really transformed the sound though, in a very naturalistic and convincing way.


Hi @Bee_Abney ,

This is a very flattering comment. Thank You so much. I really appreciate it.

I'm glad you like the sound via the little edit, a little bit goes a long way. This is exactly what happened here. Funny thing is, I was not at all expecting this, actually I thought I'm going to ruin the un-edited sound, but being an experimenter by nature, I was totally surprised when I heard the change the simple Parametric EQ edit did to the Celli.

I will be applying this type of edit to the other sections, to tweak them to my taste, for both shorts, longs, and legato articulations.

TSS is fantastic sounding strings library. I also think it is way more versatile, and is not restricted to the Japanese Anime character. I plan to use it quite a bit once I'm done discovering all of it's sections, making custom presets, and adding them to my Standard Orch. Template.

Enjoy your new Fostex T50RP mk3 headphones, I will also check them out on line. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Trash Panda

Can we hear both versions (with and without EQ) without the reverb?


----------



## muziksculp

Trash Panda said:


> Can we hear both versions (with and without EQ) without the reverb?


Sure. I will post a version showing both with and without the EQ edit.


----------



## Bee_Abney

muziksculp said:


> Hi @Bee_Abney ,
> 
> This is a very flattering comment. Thank You so much. I really appreciate it.
> 
> I'm glad you like the sound via the little edit, a little bit goes a long way. This is exactly what happened here. Funny thing is, I was not at all expecting this, actually I thought I'm going to ruin the un-edited sound, but being an experimenter by nature, I was totally surprised when I heard the change the simple Parametric EQ edit did to the Celli.
> 
> I will be applying this type of edit to the other sections, to tweak them to my taste, for both shorts, longs, and legato articulations.
> 
> TSS is fantastic sounding strings library. I also think it is way more versatile, and is not restricted to the Japanese Anime character. I plan to use it quite a bit once I'm done discovering all of it's sections, making custom presets, and adding them to my Standard Orch. Template.
> 
> Enjoy your new Fostex T50RP mk3 headphones, I will also check them out on line.
> 
> Cheers,
> Muziksculp


Being very familiar with the Tokyo Scoring Strings sound I was really shocked how different you made it sound.

Since I don't do orchestral composing (yet), I picked TSS for its sound, thinking it would work really well in poppier contexts. But as so much of the music I write is pretty textural or at least very layered, I found that they didn't fit so well.

Thanks to you I'll be back to playing with the EQ on TSS to see what I can come with. Your version is much better suited to orchestral and Western Cinematic styles, and it is less shiny and thin sounding that the out of the box sound.

Thanks!


----------



## muziksculp

Trash Panda said:


> Can we hear both versions (with and without EQ) without the reverb?


Here you go, first phrase played without the Parametric EQ, then with the Parametric EQ enabled in the Console. 

View attachment TSS Celli Stacc Without Para EQ Then With EQ(2).mp3


----------



## Trash Panda

muziksculp said:


> Here you go, first phrase played without the Parametric EQ, then with the Parametric EQ enabled in the Console.
> 
> View attachment TSS Celli Stacc Without Para EQ Then With EQ(2).mp3


Can you do the EQ comparison without the reverb? Trying to hear the EQ differences and Seventh Heaven adds quite a bit of its own color.


----------



## muziksculp

Trash Panda said:


> Can you do the EQ comparison without the reverb? Trying to hear the EQ differences and Seventh Heaven adds quite a bit of its own color.


Sure, no problem. Will post another clip without 7th heaven reverb so you can hear what the Parametric EQ did more accurately.


----------



## Loïc D

Funny, I did exactly the same a while ago when working on a piece.
To be honest, while I praise TSS in general, I don’t really like some resonances on all instruments (I guess it comes from the room acoustics).
And I was amazed at how well this library reacts to EQing, opening it to a broader range than the anime sound.


----------



## muziksculp

Trash Panda said:


> Can you do the EQ comparison without the reverb? Trying to hear the EQ differences and Seventh Heaven adds quite a bit of its own color.


OK, here is the audio clip without the 7th heaven reverb, first without the Parametric EQ, then With the Parametric EQ. 

View attachment TSS Celli Stac. Without then With PARAM EQ NO REVERB.mp3


----------



## muziksculp

Back to discover more, and enjoy the sound of TSS. 

Wishing you all a wonderful weekend. ❤️


----------



## Trash Panda

muziksculp said:


> OK, here is the audio clip without the 7th heaven reverb, first without the Parametric EQ, then With the Parametric EQ.
> 
> View attachment TSS Celli Stac. Without then With PARAM EQ NO REVERB.mp3


Thank you, good sir! I was suspecting a wide Q dip around the 1k'ish range, which Pro Q3 confirmed. Looks like that about lines up with the same area the Soothe 2 preset I typically use on the TSS strings bus targets (Orchestral Nose Job).


----------



## filipjonathan

I am really looking forward to that runs patch!!!


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> I am really looking forward to that runs patch!!!


What is that ? something they plan to add via an update ?


----------



## muziksculp

Trash Panda said:


> Looks like that about lines up with the same area the Soothe 2 preset I typically use on the TSS strings bus targets (Orchestral Nose Job).


You're very welcome sir. 

LOL.. (Orchestral Nose Job)  Love that term. First time I hear it. I think you coined it.


----------



## Trash Panda

muziksculp said:


> You're very welcome sir.
> 
> LOL.. (Orchestral Nose Job)  Love that term. First time I hear it. I think you coined it.


I'd love to take credit for it, but it's a factory preset in Soothe2.


----------



## filipjonathan

muziksculp said:


> What is that ? something they plan to add via an update ?


Yep. They said it's coming in the 1.0 version.


----------



## muziksculp

Trash Panda said:


> I'd love to take credit for it, but it's a factory preset in Soothe2.


Soothe 2 is one of the plugins I don't have, I might buy it during BF if it is discounted generously.


----------



## muziksculp

filipjonathan said:


> Yep. They said it's coming in the 1.0 version.


Interesting, but isn't this the 1.04 version we are using (latest version) ?


----------



## filipjonathan

muziksculp said:


> Interesting, but isn't this the 1.04 version we are using (latest version) ?


The next big number. Not sure which one. *EDIT* It's 1.1, thanks @Trash Panda


----------



## Trash Panda

filipjonathan said:


> The next big number. Not sure which one.


I believe it's v1.1 that will have the runs, denoising applied to the unpleasant room harmonics on certain notes, and other improvements.


----------



## muziksculp

Trash Panda said:


> I believe it's v1.1 that will have the runs, denoising applied to the unpleasant room harmonics on certain notes, and other improvements.


Thanks for the feedback.


----------



## muziksculp

Hi, 

A simple Question for TSS users. 

So, with regards to using the Short Articulations, what are you using to switch the short articulations ?

i.e. Key-Switches ? CC ? Pitchwheel ? ... ? 

So far really loving the sound of TSS. 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## muziksculp

Hi,

Here is another nice discovery form my experimental work with TSS. 

I'm getting a very nice, and rich intimate sound from TSS, using a combo of the Close, and Decca mics, (more close, less Decca). Then adding some LiquidSonics : *Lustrous Plates* Reverb, instead of Seventh Heaven, and it sounds wonderful, very intimate, detailed, and rich timbre, without any harshness. 

If you have Lustrous Plates Reverb, give it a try. Edit the Reverb Time Damper, Freq. Dispersion, and Wet/Dry Mix, and EQs to taste. I'm sure you will love what you hear. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## chapbot

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> Here is another nice discovery form my experimental work with TSS.
> 
> I'm getting a very nice, and rich intimate sound from TSS, using a combo of the Close, and Decca mics, (more close, less Decca). Then adding some LiquidSonics : *Lustrous Plates* Reverb, instead of Seventh Heaven, and it sounds wonderful, very intimate, detailed, and rich timbre, without any harshness.
> 
> If you have Lustrous Plates Reverb, give it a try. Edit the Reverb Time Damper, Freq. Dispersion, and Wet/Dry Mix, and EQs to taste. I'm sure you will love what you hear.
> 
> Cheers,
> Muziksculp


Perhaps you'd be so kind as to post an example of your new discovery


----------



## muziksculp

chapbot said:


> Perhaps you'd be so kind as to post an example of your new discovery


Haha .. I knew that was coming.


----------



## Bee_Abney

chapbot said:


> Perhaps you'd be so kind as to post an example of your new discovery


It might be worth trying any plate reverb. There are a lot of wonderful emulations.


----------



## Trash Panda

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> Here is another nice discovery form my experimental work with TSS.
> 
> I'm getting a very nice, and rich intimate sound from TSS, using a combo of the Close, and Decca mics, (more close, less Decca). Then adding some LiquidSonics : *Lustrous Plates* Reverb, instead of Seventh Heaven, and it sounds wonderful, very intimate, detailed, and rich timbre, without any harshness.
> 
> If you have Lustrous Plates Reverb, give it a try. Edit the Reverb Time Damper, Freq. Dispersion, and Wet/Dry Mix, and EQs to taste. I'm sure you will love what you hear.
> 
> Cheers,
> Muziksculp


These kinds of descriptions without audio examples are like…like…something not good!


----------



## muziksculp

Trash Panda said:


> These kinds of descriptions without audio examples are like…like…something not good!


LOL .. I will give you an example as soon as I have some time to make one. No worries. 

Kind of busy with other things at the moment. Please bare with me.


----------



## muziksculp

Bee_Abney said:


> It might be worth trying any plate reverb. There are a lot of wonderful emulations.


Yes, a wise idea. Why not.


----------



## muziksculp

Hi @Trash Panda ,

Here is a short midi test clip first showing the Celli Pizz. Without any reverb, just using the Close, and Decca Mics, (more Close than Decca). Then the same midi with some LiquidSonics Lustrous Plates sent to it.

Notice how the reverbed version is very transparent, and has more depth to it. Yet it is not very noticeable. This is not something that I can achieve using Seventh Heaven reverb, so it is a good option if you want to achieve a very intimate, dry sounding yet not too dry/flat sounding character.

I chose the Pizz. because you can hear the reverb tails on the transient much more accurately, compared to using a legato, or other type of articulation.

View attachment TSS Celli Pizz w_o then with Lust. Plates.mp3


Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## Trash Panda

Interesting. That reverb is indeed very subtle. Do you have the regular or Pro version of 7H?

Which plate and mix level were you using in this example?


----------



## muziksculp

Trash Panda said:


> Interesting. That reverb is indeed very subtle. Do you have the regular or Pro version of 7H?
> 
> Which plate and mix level were you using in this example?


Hi @Trash Panda ,

OK, here is more info.

*TSS Console Mics and their Levels :*





*LiquidSonics Lustrous Plate Reverb Settings :*





*LiquidSonics Lustrous Plate Reverb EQ Settings :*





*Lustrous Plate selected :* Chrome Plate (It was just the first one that came up, I didn't test the others).

*Lustrous Plate Send Level to TSS :* -3.6 dbs

I hope this is helpful.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## muziksculp

Here is the same test using TSS Staccatisimo articulation. (Celli). 

First without any Reverb, then with Lustrous Plate same settings and mix as above 

View attachment TSS Celli Stacctisimo w_o then with Lust. Plates.mp3


----------



## GGaca

I know that TSS is recorded in situ but do you use extra panning on the intruments?


----------



## thorwald

Not really, since as you said it has been recorded in situ, but I can imagine the bass being panned to the far right to work better with other, similarly recorded libraries.


----------



## muziksculp

Hi TSS Users. I have a Question for you, and for the Developers of TSS, 

Basically when I play a the Legato articulation, If I have the Mod-Wheel CC1 dialed in a bit, i.e. a value of 20 or above, I hear a string attack sound on the first note of the legato phrase. I'm not really liking the way that attack of the bow sounds, so I tend to have to use a lot of CC 1 Gymnastics to avoid hearing that attack note. 

Is this normal ? I would love it if there was some attack sound control for sculpting that first note, before playing the Legato Lines to my taste, or to make it less audible. The only way I can do that now is to Lower CC1 all the way down to get a smoother less interruptive attack sound the first note of a legato phrase. 

Any feedback on this would be very appreciated, and helpful. 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## AMBi

muziksculp said:


> Basically when I play a the Legato articulation, If I have the Mod-Wheel CC1 dialed in a bit, i.e. a value of 20 or above, I hear a string attack sound on the first note of the legato phrase. I'm not really liking the way that attack of the bow sounds, so I tend to have to use a lot of CC 1 Gymnastics to avoid hearing that attack note.
> 
> Is this normal ? I would love it if there was some attack sound control for sculpting that first note, before playing the Legato Lines to my taste, or to make it less audible. The only way I can do that now is to Lower CC1 all the way down to get a smoother less interruptive attack sound the first note of a legato phrase.


Do you have Overlay enabled? That has the biggest impact on the initial note in a phrase.

There’s also Attack and Release controls to shape to your liking too, though I’m not sure how much that would effect the legato articulation.


----------



## muziksculp

AMBi said:


> Do you have Overlay enabled? That has the biggest impact on the initial note in a phrase.
> 
> There’s also Attack and Release controls to shape to your liking too, though I’m not sure how much that would effect the legato articulation.


Thanks. 

I don't have the 'Extra Legato Bow' box checked, so I'm guessing that means I don't have the overlay enabled. 

What I'm finding out is that is I have 'Latency Compensation' box enabled in the Advanced Engine Settings, which introduces a bit of Latency, I don't get that annoying attack sound, and playability of the legato is smoother from the first note of the phrase, to the following legato (connected notes). So, I think that's the solution. 





Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## EvilDragon

Extra Legato Bow is something else. Go to Longs tab and select Arco articulation, there's attack overlay settings there on the bottom.


----------



## muziksculp

Loving the Contrabasses of TSS.


----------



## Trash Panda

muziksculp said:


> Thanks.
> 
> I don't have the 'Extra Legato Bow' box checked, so I'm guessing that means I don't have the overlay enabled.
> 
> What I'm finding out is that is I have 'Latency Compensation' box enabled in the Advanced Engine Settings, which introduces a bit of Latency, I don't get that annoying attack sound, and playability of the legato is smoother from the first note of the phrase, to the following legato (connected notes). So, I think that's the solution.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Cheers,
> Muziksculp


Turn off the longs overlay (not extra bite legato) or stop hitting the keyboard so damn hard. 😉


----------



## muziksculp

EvilDragon said:


> Extra Legato Bow is something else. Go to Longs tab and select Arco articulation, there's attack overlay settings there on the bottom.


OK. That did the trick. Thanks 

One more question, there is an Arco Sample Start Offset know. How would you recommend using this edit parameter. What exactly does increasing the sample offset value (max is 150 ms). Is the highest value offset giving me less of the legato transition or the opposite ? A bit confused about this parameter. 

Thanks.


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## Sarah Mancuso

muziksculp said:


> OK. That did the trick. Thanks
> 
> One more question, there is an Arco Sample Start Offset know. How would you recommend using this edit parameter. What exactly does increasing the sample offset value (max is 150 ms). Is the highest value offset giving me less of the legato transition or the opposite ? A bit confused about this parameter.
> 
> Thanks.


The arco settings don't affect legato. It affects the sample offset for the arco notes, so in a legato phrase it'd just be the first note.

If you want to experiment with the legato settings, you can select one of the legato types in the Longs tab to edit it there.


----------



## muziksculp

Sarah Mancuso said:


> The arco settings don't affect legato. It affects the sample offset for the arco notes, so in a legato phrase it'd just be the first note.


Thanks. Yes, the first note of the Legato Phrase is what I'm trying to edit/sculpt here to sound more to my taste. So, I will experiment with the sample offset a bit. 



Sarah Mancuso said:


> If you want to experiment with the legato settings, you can select one of the legato types in the Longs tab to edit it there.


OK. Thanks. I will do so. 

One more question (sorry) of too many questions. 

How are these release release type articulations for the longs best used ? and are they relevant for the Legatos ? 





Thanks


----------



## Bee_Abney

muziksculp said:


> Thanks. Yes, the first note of the Legato Phrase is what I'm trying to edit/sculpt here to sound more to my taste. So, I will experiment with the sample offset a bit.
> 
> 
> OK. Thanks. I will do so.
> 
> One more question (sorry) of too many questions.
> 
> How are these release release type articulations for the longs best used ? and are they relevant for the Legatos ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks


This is all really helpful to me. I just reach too quickly to external sound shaping - whether transient shapers, EQ or whatever. It's better if the sound source can be shaped directly.


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## ChickenAndARoll

Random thought but damn, I'm working on a project with TSS right now utilizing the lookahead mode plus expression maps in Cubase, keeping everything all in one track for each string instrument, and it is such a breath of fresh air! Not having to nudge notes around is simply fantastic


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## muziksculp

ChickenAndARoll said:


> Random thought but damn, I'm working on a project with TSS right now utilizing the lookahead mode plus expression maps in Cubase, keeping everything all in one track for each string instrument, and it is such a breath of fresh air! Not having to nudge notes around is simply fantastic


Hi @ChickenAndARoll ,

Super cool. I haven't gotten to that level of using TSS yet. But it's surely an amazing feature. 

So you are changing articulations via Cubase's Exp. Map, (not using the Look Ahead 'Easy Artic.' features, and you have the 'Legato Speed', and the 'Pure Attack' buttons enabled, then set you track -delays to 1000 ms. 

I have to refer to the manual, but if you know, what does enabling 'Pure Attack' do when using the Look-Ahead feature ? 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


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## chrisav

I still haven't given the lookahead mode a try 🙈 find it a bit intimidating to learn a new workflow after being so used to the "normal way"


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## muziksculp

chrisav said:


> I still haven't given the lookahead mode a try 🙈 find it a bit intimidating to learn a new workflow after being so used to the "normal way"


Yeah.. It's like going from driving a stick shift, to a full automatic all of a sudden.


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## ChickenAndARoll

muziksculp said:


> Hi @ChickenAndARoll ,
> 
> Super cool. I haven't gotten to that level of using TSS yet. But it's surely an amazing feature.
> 
> So you are changing articulations via Cubase's Exp. Map, (not using the Look Ahead 'Easy Artic.' features, and you have the 'Legato Speed', and the 'Pure Attack' buttons enabled, then set you track -delays to 1000 ms.
> 
> I have to refer to the manual, but if you know, what does enabling 'Pure Attack' do when using the Look-Ahead feature ?
> 
> Thanks,
> Muziksculp


I'm using Impact Soundwork's "Delay Compensation" plugin rather than adding it with Cubase's track delay, and correct, I'm not using the easy artic. feature and simply just using the lookahead to handle the variable delays and then using the expression maps for choosing articulations. The reason for this is so that I can clearly see what articulation is being used at any given moment rather than adjusting the lengths to select my short note articulations. That's another reason I love this library, they give you so many options for workflow! 

I'd always leave pure attack enabled if you're using lookahead, because pure attack when enabled leaves the full transient of the note intact at the cost of creating delay, but since using lookahead is literally designed to handle those variable delays, that solves the issue!


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## ChickenAndARoll

chrisav said:


> I still haven't given the lookahead mode a try 🙈 find it a bit intimidating to learn a new workflow after being so used to the "normal way"


If you don't use the "easy artic" part of lookahead, you can actually just treat it like a normal sample library but instead just keep everything on the grid, with the exception that you DON'T overlap your legato notes. My muscle memory at this point is to overlap legatos so that's the only thing I consciously need to remind myself 

Before trying my expression map way of using the library, I was using individual articulations per track with every single instance having lookahead enabled. Because I'm stupid, I didn't realize that lookahead was able to account for the delay of ALL articulations on the track regardless of your method of changing articulations, I assumed it would only work with "easy artic" enabled.


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## muziksculp

ChickenAndARoll said:


> I'm using Impact Soundwork's "Delay Compensation" plugin rather than adding it with Cubase's track delay, and correct, I'm not using the easy artic. feature and simply just using the lookahead to handle the variable delays and then using the expression maps for choosing articulations. The reason for this is so that I can clearly see what articulation is being used at any given moment rather than adjusting the lengths to select my short note articulations. That's another reason I love this library, they give you so many options for workflow!
> 
> I'd always leave pure attack enabled if you're using lookahead, because pure attack when enabled leaves the full transient of the note intact at the cost of creating delay, but since using lookahead is literally designed to handle those variable delays, that solves the issue!


Thank You very much for the helpful feedback. 

I will most likely use Studio One Pro 6 (Sound-Variations) to control the articulations, and not use the Easy Artic. feature of Look-ahead mode. 

Yes, this library offers a lot of options, and sounds great too, and it has 2nd Violins


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## ChickenAndARoll

muziksculp said:


> Thank You very much for the helpful feedback.
> 
> I will most likely use Studio One Pro 6 (Sound-Variations) to control the articulations, and not use the Easy Artic. feature of Look-ahead mode.
> 
> Yes, this library offers a lot of options, and sounds great too, and it has 2nd Violins


I'm honestly jealous of you Studio One users and the Sound Variations, those things look fantastic and I wish Steinberg would emulate that for our expression maps


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## muziksculp

ChickenAndARoll said:


> I'm honestly jealous of you Studio One users and the Sound Variations, those things look fantastic and I wish Steinberg would emulate that for our expression maps


An Easy Solution. Subscribe to the Presonus Sphere, for $14.95 /month. You get everything Presonus offers in software, plus a lot more that comes with being a Sphere member. I used to be a Cubase user. I'm so glad I decided to move to S1Pro a few years ago, One of the best decisions I made at the time.


----------



## Trash Panda

muziksculp said:


> Thank You very much for the helpful feedback.
> 
> I will most likely use Studio One Pro 6 (Sound-Variations) to control the articulations, and not use the Easy Artic. feature of Look-ahead mode.
> 
> Yes, this library offers a lot of options, and sounds great too, and it has 2nd Violins


There is a good Sound Variation on the Exchange that can speed up the setup process.


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## DJiLAND

When using Lookahead, it doesn't seem to work properly if the DAW tempo is below 83.
Legato or Portamento should be triggered, but Arco is triggered unintentionally.
Setting the tempo to 84 or higher makes Lookahead work as intended.
Can someone please check this issue?
I'm using Windows 11, Nuendo 12.0.5, TSS 1.0.4, and this problem seems to happen with or without the Delay Compensation plugin.


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## jason3.14

DJiLAND said:


> When using Lookahead, it doesn't seem to work properly if the DAW tempo is below 83.
> Legato or Portamento should be triggered, but Arco is triggered unintentionally.
> Setting the tempo to 84 or higher makes Lookahead work as intended.
> Can someone please check this issue?
> I'm using Windows 11, Nuendo 12, and this problem seems to happen with or without the Delay Compensation plugin.


That's strange, I haven't had any issue like that with Lookahead, and I'm currently working on a project with some tempos as low as the 50s/60s. I'm on Reaper, on Windows 10. If it helps anyone to know.


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## DJiLAND

View attachment TSS_LA.mp3


The first has the tempo set to 84 and the second has the exact same MIDI event set to the tempo 82.
Easy Artic is disabled, Pure Attack and Legato Speed Auto are enabled. But regardless of enabling it, the problem occurs.
(I wanted to capture a video, but I can't now. Please pardon me 😂)


----------



## EvilDragon

Cubase has an option where it's automatically changing duration of notes that should be connected, maybe Nuendo is the same? It's a value in milliseconds. Should probably reduce it to 0 for TSS. It was mentioned earlier in this thread somewhere...


----------



## DJiLAND

EvilDragon said:


> Cubase has an option where it's automatically changing duration of notes that should be connected, maybe Nuendo is the same? It's a value in milliseconds. Should probably reduce it to 0 for TSS. It was mentioned earlier in this thread somewhere...


I thought that tick offset was resolved in 1.0.4.
i'll try that


----------



## Ricgus3

Hello! Wanted to ask if TSS can do trills between intervals? Like a minor/major 2nd/3rds


----------



## rottoy

Ricgus3 said:


> Hello! Wanted to ask if TSS can do trills between intervals? Like a minor/major 2nd/3rds


Unless you play it in yourself using the legato or any of the shorts, no.
Only the classic minor/major 2nd trills have been sampled for TSS.


----------



## Ricgus3

rottoy said:


> Unless you play it in yourself using the legato or any of the shorts, no.
> Only the classic minor/major 2nd trills have been sampled for TSS.


Can it handle big intervals in fast trill fashion?


----------



## rottoy

Ricgus3 said:


> Can it handle big intervals in fast trill fashion?


In my opinion, no.
As excellent as TSS is in other regards, that's simply not a thing it can pull off in it's current iteration.


----------



## Ricgus3

rottoy said:


> In my opinion, no.
> As excellent as TSS is in other regards, that's simply not a thing it can pull off in it's current iteration.


Thank you for your answer


----------



## Ricgus3

jason3.14 said:


> Day #??? of Octopath Traveler Battle Theme 1, spending Xmas, New Year, and (gasp) Chinese New Year 😅 working on it:
> 
> View attachment Octopath Traveler - Battle I.mp3
> 
> 
> Here's the strings bus as well so you can hear what TSS is doing (though postprocessed).
> 
> View attachment Octopath Traveler - Battle I (TSS).mp3
> 
> 
> Hope you enjoy the development, and appreciate your thoughts/suggestions! 🙏🥳


Been reading through the thread now that there is a sale going and i am thinking of getting it. I just wanted to post and say that this mockup has blown me away! Sounds so amazing! Really great job @jason3.14 . Sounds like it could be the game soundtrack! Listening to original music it sounds just abit "darker" softer but other than that this is brilliant!


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## Andrew Aversa

We've just pushed a TSS patch (1.0.5) via Pulse! This one fixes some issues with sample offsets in various patches, which was causing cut-off sample attacks. You do not need to reload your NKI for the patch to work.


----------



## Bee_Abney

Andrew Aversa said:


> We've just pushed a TSS patch (1.0.5) via Pulse! This one fixes some issues with sample offsets in various patches, which was causing cut-off sample attacks. You do not need to reload your NKI for the patch to work.


Thank you kindly!


----------



## Bee_Abney

It's not there yet; but I imagine it will be along soon.


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## jason3.14

Ricgus3 said:


> Been reading through the thread now that there is a sale going and i am thinking of getting it. I just wanted to post and say that this mockup has blown me away! Sounds so amazing! Really great job @jason3.14 . Sounds like it could be the game soundtrack! Listening to original music it sounds just abit "darker" softer but other than that this is brilliant!


Thank you, much appreciated! Glad you liked it!! Working on something else currently, though realizing how painful it is to work on something longer... 🤦‍♂️

Regarding trills, here's a quick test with 4ths I did using legatos + spiccato, for reference. Screenshot is legato on left, spiccato on right. I think it sounds reasonable? Though I don't used trills often to know for sure.


----------



## Ricgus3

jason3.14 said:


> Thank you, much appreciated! Glad you liked it!! Working on something else currently, though realizing how painful it is to work on something longer... 🤦‍♂️
> 
> Regarding trills, here's a quick test with 4ths I did using legatos + spiccato, for reference. Screenshot is legato on left, spiccato on right. I think it sounds reasonable? Though I don't used trills often to know for sure.


Be sure to post it when your new stuff is done ! 

Have you been happy with TSS since you got it? 

The trills sounds abit aggressive, I was thinking of a sound where you come one from pp - mf -pp and trill to create chords in divisi or vi1 and vi2.

Like if violin 2 trill between G and B and violin 1 trill between D and F# to create a swelling moving major7th chord


----------



## Trash Panda

Andrew Aversa said:


> We've just pushed a TSS patch (1.0.5) via Pulse! This one fixes some issues with sample offsets in various patches, which was causing cut-off sample attacks. You do not need to reload your NKI for the patch to work.


Looks real nice in my Pulse downloader queue next to the new acquisitions of Super Audio Cart, Pearl Concert Grand and Rhapsody Percussion.


----------



## rottoy

jason3.14 said:


> Thank you, much appreciated! Glad you liked it!! Working on something else currently, though realizing how painful it is to work on something longer... 🤦‍♂️
> 
> Regarding trills, here's a quick test with 4ths I did using legatos + spiccato, for reference. Screenshot is legato on left, spiccato on right. I think it sounds reasonable? Though I don't used trills often to know for sure.


I'm glad you stepped up with an example, when I messed around with TSS to fix an example I honestly couldn't abide the sound of it enough to warrant a posting.


----------



## jason3.14

Ricgus3 said:


> Be sure to post it when your new stuff is done !
> 
> Have you been happy with TSS since you got it?
> 
> The trills sounds abit aggressive, I was thinking of a sound where you come one from pp - mf -pp and trill to create chords in divisi or vi1 and vi2.
> 
> Like if violin 2 trill between G and B and violin 1 trill between D and F# to create a swelling moving major7th chord


Will do! Yes, overall I've been very happy with it.  Lookahead mode is just great, even if you only use it in it's most basic form (align to grid).

Re: trills, hmm I guess something like this maybe? Lol, this one is spiccato only, at Velocity 1 and 32nd notes throughout, just modulating Expression. Lemme know if you want something else :D


----------



## Ricgus3

rottoy said:


> I'm glad you stepped up with an example, when I messed around with TSS to fix an example I honestly couldn't abide the sound of it enough to warrant a posting.


Do you enjoy the sound of the strings normaly? Just the trills that were harsh?


----------



## Ricgus3

jason3.14 said:


> Will do! Yes, overall I've been very happy with it.  Lookahead mode is just great, even if you only use it in it's most basic form (align to grid).
> 
> Re: trills, hmm I guess something like this maybe? Lol, this one is spiccato only, at Velocity 1 and 32nd notes throughout, just modulating Expression. Lemme know if you want something else :D


Yes that is more inline with what I had in mind! I'll post an example here of whatI hoped TSS could dO: I am using another library from another vendor. Using this articulations in a piece I am working on. Was thinking if I could swapp it all out for TSS. 

View attachment SStS Trill Gmaj.mp3


The trills here are from D-F# and also G-A forming a Gmaj9/D chord


----------



## rottoy

Ricgus3 said:


> Do you enjoy the sound of the strings normaly? Just the trills that were harsh?


Yeah, only the simulated trills that I didn't like. Love the sound otherwise.


----------



## jason3.14

Finally finished a Genshin medley using TSS (and Fluid Shorts for layering). Appreciate your listen!


----------

