# Microsoft Surface Pro 7, what version and is it worth it?



## DANIELE (Jul 15, 2019)

Hi all,

after trying different tablet and because I want a tablet with a very good digitizer (for StaffPad for example) I ended up my long investigation on Microsoft Surface Pro 6.

Now, obviously, because there are many different models and many different prices do you think it will be better (from a quality price ratio point of view) to buy...


Microsoft Surface Pro 6 Tablet, Core i5 8250U, 8 GB RAM, SSD 128 GB (now on sale for prime day on Amazon);
Microsoft Surface Pro 6 Tablet, Core i5 8250U, 8 GB RAM, SSD 256 GB (costs a lot more of the previous one);
Microsoft Surface Pro 6 Tablet, Core i7 8650U, 8 GB RAM, SSD 256 GB (almost double the cost of the first one);

I should wait for better times.

Consider that I have to buy the pen and the keyboard too and I know they are pretty pricey (I don't know exactly what model to buy).

I'd like this to work with stuff like staff pad, to take notes, for work and other similar purposes. I don't think I'll use it for heavy orchestral projects or similar, I have the main workstation for this.

Any advice from you would be very appreciated.

Thank you.


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## Denkii (Jul 16, 2019)

I got the i7 16gb Ram 500gb SSD version last year. Although I'd say it's a super handy device that you can always fit in whatever bag you're traveling with and even do light orchestral Work on it, I would suggest that now is not the best time to buy.

If I were you, I'd wait for the next version, hoping that it will feature either a second USB port and/or a USB-C port. It's a pain to always have a POWERED USB-hub with you, if you want to work on something where you need an interface, a hard drive and a keyboard.


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## DANIELE (Jul 16, 2019)

Denkii said:


> I got the i7 16gb Ram 500gb SSD version last year. Although I'd say it's a super handy device that you can always fit in whatever bag you're traveling with and even do light orchestral Work on it, I would suggest that now is not the best time to buy.
> 
> If I were you, I'd wait for the next version, hoping that it will feature either a second USB port and/or a USB-C port. It's a pain to always have a POWERED USB-hub with you, if you want to work on something where you need an interface, a hard drive and a keyboard.



Thank you for the advice. Very useful.

So except for the "waiting advice" that I may will follow (most likely), you would buy the top version that it is very very pricey. What would you advice being more important? i7, 16GB RAM or 500 GB SSD?


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## Denkii (Jul 16, 2019)

I7 16gb Ram is top priority. You can always work with external hard drives but no such thing as external RAM 

If you're really really really only doing office work on it, then i5 8gb should be fine.


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## Denkii (Jul 16, 2019)

PS: I say "i7 16gb" because to my knowledge there is no i5 version with 16gb.


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## DANIELE (Nov 25, 2019)

I changed the title of the thread from "_Microsoft Surface 6 pro i5, i7 or wait for a new version of it?_" to
"_Microsoft Surface Pro 7, what version and is it worth it?_" because of the new Microsoft Surfaces Pro 7 and because of the discounts on them for the Black bla bla bla.

Do you think it is worth the money? I think it is a bit expensive from what it is, considering that you have to buy the keyboard and the pen to have a complete package in your hands.

But...if you say me that this 2 in 1 is so powerful that could bend the energy of the universe I could think about buying it (it is a metaphor but I hope it's understandable).

Thank you.


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## Denkii (Nov 25, 2019)

DANIELE said:


> I changed the title of the thread from "_Microsoft Surface 6 pro i5, i7 or wait for a new version of it?_" to
> "_Microsoft Surface Pro 7, what version and is it worth it?_" because of the new Microsoft Surfaces Pro 7 and because of the discounts on them for the Black bla bla bla.
> 
> Do you think it is worth the money? I think it is a bit expensive from what it is, considering that you have to buy the keyboard and the pen to have a complete package in your hands.
> ...


My opinion is still the same.
If you want to do DAW stuff, you'll need a version with 16 GB RAM which automatically puts you into the version that has an i7. From there on its your choice if you want to go with 256 or more SSD space.

It's expensive for what it is, yes but it is a little mobile workhorse.

Another contender would be the razer blade stealth 13" with similar specs if you want something of similar quality and portability. Benefit of the razer would be a dedicated GPU and more USB A slots.
Though the surface pro 7 finally has a USB C nowadays but so does the razer.

Either way you'll probably want to have a powered USB 3.1 hub (Amazon basics has a great one) for dongles, sound interface, keyboard and an external SSD.

Regarding the pen: depends on your workflow. Cubase handles it meh in some regions and GREAT in others (drawing in automation is a blast!!!) But it takes time to get used to it.
E.g. Ableton Live handles it very well.
It's definitely not a necessity.

There are apps for creating your own keyboard shortcuts that you can put on screen as an icon-bar. With this you can eliminate the use of actually using keyboard shortcuts and improve the workflow with the pen. I have shortcuts for play, pause, stop, delete, undo etc. So I never have to put away the pen. Again: this does need time to set it up and getting used to but once it works, it's a rather playful way of working which grew to enjoy.

Ultimately even those 16gb ram limit what you can do with these systems and if you have a beast workstation at home you'll find yourself freezing tracks way more than you are used to but it definitely works.
Nucleus or inspires run just fine.
When youre going into full SCS/CSS/CSB/BBCSO/whatever abbreviation territory, you'll end up freezing tracks of course.
But it does allow you to have an ultra portable way of at least sketching stuff out that you can pick up working on at home.

My portable rig always comes with inspire 1+2, BBCSO, FORZO, NOVO, gravity, true strike, damage, action strikes, all tarilonte ERAs except dark era (because I don't own it). I have always been able to put together something with this stuff and my trusted surface pro 6.


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## DANIELE (Nov 25, 2019)

Denkii said:


> My opinion is still the same.
> If you want to do DAW stuff, you'll need a version with 16 GB RAM which automatically puts you into the version that has an i7. From there on its your choice if you want to go with 256 or more SSD space.
> 
> It's expensive for what it is, yes but it is a little mobile workhorse.
> ...



The pen is a must have for me, I use it a lot on my main PC, exactly to draw automations (I have a graphic tablet).
I'd like to use it to write some music in staff pad and also on simple digital staff paper.

I could also use it to read some e-book etc..so I need to use it as a tablet too.

I may consider some cheaper alternatives but I don't know exactly how to move and actually I'm thinking if should I take it with black friday discount.


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## Denkii (Nov 25, 2019)

DANIELE said:


> The pen is a must have for me, I use it a lot on my main PC, exactly to draw automations (I have a graphic tablet).
> I'd like to use it to write some music in staff pad and also on simple digital staff paper.
> 
> I could also use it to read some e-book etc..so I need to use it as a tablet too.
> ...


Well if you want my honest opinion if you only want to put something together in GM and read e books I wouldn't be willing to spend that amount of money.
But it's your money after all.


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## DANIELE (Nov 25, 2019)

Denkii said:


> Well if you want my honest opinion if you only want to put something together in GM and read e books I wouldn't be willing to spend that amount of money.
> But it's your money after all.



Well I meant to do that other than do some music production and maybe some Photoshop and After Effects working.


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## Denkii (Nov 25, 2019)

DANIELE said:


> Well I meant to do that other than do some music production and maybe some Photoshop and After Effects working.


Sounds like you want a surface to me


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## DANIELE (Nov 25, 2019)

Denkii said:


> Sounds like you want a surface to me



It sounds the same to me, damn!!


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## dzilizzi (Nov 25, 2019)

Years ago I had a 13" Yoga to try to do the same thing. Never could do much, but the touchscreen wasn't as good. My Flex 15" touchscreen is better but at 15" it is a little large to carry around. I've thought about getting a surface but am concerned they aren't as good as they seem. I'd like to use it more for photo editing but I'm concerned the pen won't keep up. Or maybe I need a better pen?

So, I'm kind of interested in this as well. Something I can throw in a large purse sort of thing. Oh and as an FYI, Reason will run on an underpowered Yoga, though I didn't do big template pieces. So it should run on the 8gb/128 surface without a problem.


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## Denkii (Nov 25, 2019)

dzilizzi said:


> Years ago I had a 13" Yoga to try to do the same thing. Never could do much, but the touchscreen wasn't as good. My Flex 15" touchscreen is better but at 15" it is a little large to carry around. I've thought about getting a surface but am concerned they aren't as good as they seem. I'd like to use it more for photo editing but I'm concerned the pen won't keep up. Or maybe I need a better pen?
> 
> So, I'm kind of interested in this as well. Something I can throw in a large purse sort of thing. Oh and as an FYI, Reason will run on an underpowered Yoga, though I didn't do big template pieces. So it should run on the 8gb/128 surface without a problem.


As long as you're in the windows realm, the surface pen is as good as it gets as a native solution without getting into Wacom third party tablets.
If your priority is the quality of the pen for drawing and editing there really is no way around the iPad pro at the moment. But we are obviously comparing apples and oranges by then.


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## dzilizzi (Nov 25, 2019)

I have an iPad pro but haven't wanted to shell out the $100 for what was, at the time, an iffy pen. My non apple pen works okay, probably as good as the Apple one. It is also a pain to put projects onto and out of the iPad. Everything is so locked down.


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## Denkii (Nov 25, 2019)

dzilizzi said:


> I have an iPad pro but haven't wanted to shell out the $100 for what was, at the time, an iffy pen. My non apple pen works okay, probably as good as the Apple one. It is also a pain to put projects onto and out of the iPad. Everything is so locked down.


I only know about the original pen so I cannot speak for third party ones. And the opinion I state is backed up by a close professional animator.
It's nice that you can work on real PSDs now on your iPad pro for example but you are totally correct about the wacky workflow between machines.

Anyway: as a portable windows machine that should be capable of making use of pens rather well, I would not look for anything else than a surface right now.


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## dzilizzi (Nov 25, 2019)

Denkii said:


> I only know about the original pen so I cannot speak for third party ones. And the opinion I state is backed up by a close professional animator.
> It's nice that you can work on real PSDs now on your iPad pro for example but you are totally correct about the wacky workflow between machines.
> 
> Anyway: as a portable windows machine that should be capable of making use of pens rather well, I would not look for anything else than a surface right now.


Maybe I will try the Apple pen then. I was going by some online reviews and YouTube videos where they didn't look that great. 

Thanks! I'm going to keep looking at the surface but it will probably be another year. I just bought a laptop.


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## Denkii (Nov 25, 2019)

dzilizzi said:


> Maybe I will try the Apple pen then. I was going by some online reviews and YouTube videos where they didn't look that great.
> 
> Thanks! I'm going to keep looking at the surface but it will probably be another year. I just bought a laptop.


The iPad Pro with apple pen and procreate is the closest you can get to drawing on real paper according to a lot of people in the animation industry. I trust that notion.

Edit: You can also get specific screen shields that imitate the surface of paper more rather than just swiping on the bare glass. According to my source you should be careful and not cheap out on that though since the cheap ones mess up the recognition of your strokes a bit. But she is having a blast with that stuff and prefers drawing on that over her much more expensive wacom monitor-tablet.
Oh no...now I brought that topic up during dinner and I am getting pounded with info although I am not a pro with this stuff by any means. If you need more info let me know and I will gladly forward your questions XD


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## DANIELE (Nov 26, 2019)

I was thinking about apple too but I really don't like their closed ecosystem.

With the surface I'll use windows so I could possibly install and use every software I'm using on my main PC, the real problem is the same...too much money for the complete package.

I should see some videos about the pen, if I have to put so much money in it I want it to work flawlessly.

@Denkii there is also a model with i5 and 16 GB of ram with the Surface Pro 7.


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## Denkii (Nov 26, 2019)

DANIELE said:


> I should see some videos about the pen, if I have to put so much money in it I want it to work flawlessly.
> 
> @Denkii there is also a model with i5 and 16 GB of ram with the Surface Pro 7.


pen: there are still world's between the apple pen and the surface pen due to the technology they use. But like I said: the surface pen is as good as it gets in native windows world without third party tablets.

Surface i5 16gb RAM: I did not know that, sorry! That version is definitely new. There was no such version for the sixth generation of surfaces.


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## DANIELE (Nov 26, 2019)

I'm looking at some reviews, like this: 

WTF, the pen is very laggy, for the price it is a very bad pen, the one on my NOTE9 works better.


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## Philip Vasta (Nov 29, 2019)

Denkii said:


> pen: there are still world's between the apple pen and the surface pen due to the technology they use. But like I said: the surface pen is as good as it gets in native windows world without third party tablets.



Sorry, I have to question this. The abilities of the pens themselves are very similar, as is the latency. Whether you prefer the app ecosystem of Windows or iOS is one thing, but... Saying the pen experience is worlds apart is misleading.


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## Denkii (Nov 29, 2019)

Philip Vasta said:


> Sorry, I have to question this. The abilities of the pens themselves are very similar, as is the latency. Whether you prefer the app ecosystem of Windows or iOS is one thing, but... Saying the pen experience is worlds apart is misleading.


Then we agree to disagree. The Apple pencil is still a lot ahead in my opinion.


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## Philip Vasta (Nov 29, 2019)

Denkii said:


> Then we agree to disagree. The Apple pencil is still a lot ahead in my opinion.



May I ask in what regard? I will say that I'm not an artist, but even so I thought they were about on par with each other.


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## Denkii (Nov 29, 2019)

Philip Vasta said:


> May I ask in what regard? I will say that I'm not an artist, but even so I thought they were about on par with each other.


I am talking about the experience that I and a professional artist have.
At home we have a surface pro 6, an iPad Pro and a Wacom Cintiq.

Me personally, I do not care as much as she does. I use the Surface pen for basic input like drawing in automation or using it instead of the trackpad when I am not at home. I don't draw, I don't edit stuff in Photoshop.

She uses the Cintiq and iPad Pro professionally mostly for drawing, animating, editing. She prefers the iPad Pro over the Cintiq, Surface Pro comes last for her.

I think the best way to describe it is something like: If you rely on the pen simply as a substitute for a mouse, all of them are ok. If you rely on your pen to be capable of expression, the surface pen is simply lacking compared to the apple pencil. Doesn't mean it is bad, just not as good (and that still by a lot).

Of course I did try using all of them for drawing and editing and while I suck at both of those things, it felt way better to work with the apple pencil. And it just feels...different.
Your best bet is probably to check it out in a store for yourself where they have Surface and iPad Pro.
The only problem then is, that's a bad comparison from the get go because Surface only comes with paint and paint 3d which are both very "meh" while the normal notebook-app on the iPad pro lets you do pretty cool stuff already. And when it's a good store, they have Procreate on their iPads and that stuff just rips anything you could install on a Surface a second...USB-A port.

Edit: Like I said, she is a professional. People in her industry generally share her opinion (that includes NA and the EU).


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## jason.d (Nov 29, 2019)

I’ll chime in and share my thoughts on the pen for my Surface Pro 6 (i7 with 16GB if RAM)

The pen works well for most day to day tasks. I usually pull it out when I’m using software with lots of crammed buttons or menus that requires that precision. Unfortunately the latency is an issue for me when using it for anything drawing/painting related. Oddly enough the latency is much improved when using Microsoft’s own OneNote app, but every other app I’ve used for painting is laggy and is not a pleasure to use for art.


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## Philip Vasta (Nov 29, 2019)

Thanks for taking the time to detail all of that Denkill. My suspicion is you're probably using them in apps that, for whatever reason, are less than optimized. Or perhaps more likely, the graphics abilities on the Intel-based Surface are much weaker than Apple's ARM-based chips (because they are). I say that because my experience has been similar to jason.d. On my Surface Pro 4, the pen works great in OneNote. That's simple notetaking of course, but there's virtually no lag, and my understanding is it's even better on newer Surface Pro devices due to a dedicated processor they introduced. But when I use it in Affinity Designer, the larger the brush, the worse the performance. I suspect this isn't Designer's fault, but has more to do with either the poor integrated graphics performance on the Surface, and/or the fact that on Windows, professional apps like Affinity Designer or Photoshop are not built on modern development platforms. This is all speculation, since I'm neither a graphic artist nor a programmer. But I do wonder if the pen tech itself is what's at fault. Of course, in the end, the results are what ultimately matter, and I'm not trying to be obtuse or misrepresent anything.


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