# TSLabs2 by IRCAM an alternative to Paulstretch



## Markus Kohlprath (Sep 20, 2020)

For those who work with Paulstretch this might be an interesting alternative with a bit more feeling like being in 2020. With the current update you are able to stretch the audio up to 100x. And a lot of possibilities to tweak furthermore.
For me TS2 Labs by IRCAM is one of the best time stretching softwares.
On sale for 49,90€.
TS Labs 2 by IRCAM


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## el-bo (Sep 21, 2020)

PaulStretch has been updated in recent years. 

https://xenakios.wordpress.com/paulxstretch-plugin/
TS2 is aiming more for better quality, shorter stretches rather than the creative blurred ambiences of PS. I haven't tried the latest version, but I'm oretty sure I read from those that did that it really doesn't get close to the kinds of results one would use PS to achieve. Do you have some examples of larger stretch amounts?


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## Markus Kohlprath (Sep 21, 2020)

el-bo said:


> PaulStretch has been updated in recent years.
> 
> https://xenakios.wordpress.com/paulxstretch-plugin/
> TS2 is aiming more for better quality, shorter stretches rather than the creative blurred ambiences of PS. I haven't tried the latest version, but I'm oretty sure I read from those that did that it really doesn't get close to the kinds of results one would use PS to achieve. Do you have some examples of larger stretch amounts?


I'll try to make some. But don't count on it. I didn't have time to compare to Paulstretch until now. And I'm by no means at home with this technique. Only discovered it recently. But I mean 100x stretch is Paulstretch territory isn't it? And there are some parameters to tweak which can shape the sound considerably. What kind of audio would you like to get stretched?


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## el-bo (Sep 21, 2020)

Markus Kohlprath said:


> I'll try to make some. But don't count on it. I didn't have time to compare to Paulstretch until now. And I'm by no means at home with this technique. Only discovered it recently. But I mean 100x stretch is Paulstretch territory isn't it? And there are some parameters to tweak which can shape the sound considerably. What kind of audio would you like to get stretched?



Thanks for the reply!

I was only asking in case you'd already made some examples. Please don't do anything, on my account. It would be easy for me to give it a demo to satisfy my curiosity 

Thanks again.


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## Rob (Sep 21, 2020)

I have both, and tried to compare the two.. You can get similar results, PS seems to sound a bit smoother though.


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## Markus Kohlprath (Sep 29, 2020)

el-bo said:


> PaulStretch has been updated in recent years.
> 
> https://xenakios.wordpress.com/paulxstretch-plugin/
> TS2 is aiming more for better quality, shorter stretches rather than the creative blurred ambiences of PS. I haven't tried the latest version, but I'm oretty sure I read from those that did that it really doesn't get close to the kinds of results one would use PS to achieve. Do you have some examples of larger stretch amounts?


Thank you for providing this link for the vst and AU plugin. That's very useful and I didn't know about it. 
After comparing a bit more TSLabs cannot replace PS I would say. Nevertheless a very good piece of software for certain tasks IMO.


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## el-bo (Sep 30, 2020)

Markus Kohlprath said:


> Thank you for providing this link for the vst and AU plugin. That's very useful and I didn't know about it.
> After comparing a bit more TSLabs cannot replace PS I would say. Nevertheless a very good piece of software for certain tasks IMO.



No probs!

The consensus seems to be that TSLabs is what you'd reach for if you needed a top-quality algorithm to achieve smaller, artefact-less, stretches. Paulstretch was the original 'extreme' algorithm, much more suited to sound-design, where detail is not prioritised and artefacts are welcome 

By the way, Xenakios seems to have lost all interest in MacOS development (He doesn't have a Catalina-compatible Mac). I did try to contact him (May even try again) to see whether it was just the issue of not wanting to/not being able to buy another computer, or whether on principal he was no longer willing to code for Apple products. If it's because of not being able to buy another computer, I wanted to suggest that we/us/the public crowdfund a second-hand Mac :D

Anyway, until then...






Paulstretch on Mac OS Catalina!


I found a version of Paulstretch that works on Catalina, and thought it might be useful to some people here, so here you go: https://github.com/akx/paulstretch/releases/tag/v2.2-3 Cheers!




vi-control.net


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## Rob (Sep 30, 2020)

as an example, here is the same track slowed down 8X both in PS and TS:


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## el-bo (Sep 30, 2020)

Rob said:


> as an example, here is the same track slowed down 8X both in PS and TS:



Thanks for doing this. I much prefer the Paulstretch version. The TS version has a really pronounced Beating/warbling modulation going on, which PS seems to to smooth out.


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## Rob (Sep 30, 2020)

el-bo said:


> Thanks for doing this. I much prefer the Paulstretch version. The TS version has a really pronounced Beating/warbling modulation going on, which PS seems to to smooth out.


yes, my reaction exactly... also, PS seems to have a more detailed sound to me


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## el-bo (Sep 30, 2020)

Rob said:


> yes, my reaction exactly... also, PS seems to have a more detailed sound to me



Will give it another listen, this afternoon, with detail in mind.


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## mscp (Sep 30, 2020)

IRCAM has an amazing staff. My 2c is: Try it. Also, but also download Paulstretch. See what gets you going.


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## Markus Kohlprath (Sep 30, 2020)

Rob said:


> as an example, here is the same track slowed down 8X both in PS and TS:


Thanks for providing this. The difference becomes even more dramatic if you stretch into the 100x area. Far too many artifacts with TS.


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## heisenberg (May 28, 2021)

IRCAM TS 2 was updated earlier this month. Anyone had a chance to put it through its paces yet?


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## Technostica (Oct 9, 2022)

Anyone have more feedback on this?
Currently $24 at JRRShop.
I'm playing with the demo but not compared it with the free Paulstretch yet, which has the advantage of having a VST version I think! 

Having fun playing gong samples with it.
Just setting it up to scan so it can be a host for VSTs, which will obviously extend the functionality dramatically. 
Not sure how the automation feature works yet, which should also add a lot.


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## Alchemedia (Oct 9, 2022)

I have both PxS is more powerful and it's free.


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## scoplunk (Oct 9, 2022)

I don't think it's just as simple as PS is better than TS2 or the other way around. I've had some material that sounded better on one and other material that sounded better on the other. Also, sometimes "better" is hard to define. If I'm after something smeared and, for instance, TS2 gives me a more detailed sound, then I'm going to go with the smeared version from PS. There are other times where that smeared sound isn't what I'm looking for, so I'll go the other way. I like them both and I'm sometimes surprised at what I get from each of them. Which one I'm going to like isn't always as predictable as I expect.


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## Living Fossil (Oct 10, 2022)

Technostica said:


> Anyone have more feedback on this?


First of all, I don't see it as a "replacement" or "alternative" to PaulStretch.

It's great for Timestretching and Pitchshifting in usual (not too big) ranges.
And it gives you full control on where in a file you want these (and other) functions applied to which extent.

For me, it's usually between this one or RX for "normal" cases and PaulXstretch for the famous soundscapes.

Edit: I've added a screenshot that shows automation within TS.


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## timprebble (Oct 12, 2022)

scoplunk said:


> I don't think it's just as simple as PS is better than TS2 or the other way around. I've had some material that sounded better on one and other material that sounded better on the other. Also, sometimes "better" is hard to define. If I'm after something smeared and, for instance, TS2 gives me a more detailed sound, then I'm going to go with the smeared version from PS. There are other times where that smeared sound isn't what I'm looking for, so I'll go the other way. I like them both and I'm sometimes surprised at what I get from each of them. Which one I'm going to like isn't always as predictable as I expect.


A predecessor to both is/was IRCAM AudioSculpt (although it has an annoying license/subscription) and just as you say, the context of use matters, especially when you want 'clean' stretches. This is something Audiosculpt also excels at.
Also similarly GRM Freeze is a granular plugin (was one of the first) and it is also capable of much cleaner freezes than many of the granular plugs that came after it. Smeared is a good term - 'more' is not always more.


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