# Orchestral library for 1000€



## lutzek (May 18, 2019)

Hello,

I'm starting my journey with orchestral arrangements and I would like to buy my first orchestral VST. I read your opinions, went through a "basic guide" and I still have some doubts. This is my first attempt to this topic, so I'd like to spend no more than 1000€ for this. So first - I am interested in creating "pure" symphonic music (at least for first months, to learn how to do it good).

I thought about *NI Symphony Series* (full version), but I see, that - in general - people don't have a good opinion about it (especially woodwinds). One of things that I'm interested in is an access to each instrument section (this is not a "must have", but it would be good to have this possibility).

*Albion *series from Spitfire Audio sounds great, but it is 5 packs, 450€ each, so that exceeds my budget.

*EastWest *- i watched some tutorials and it looks really complicated to me. Also (for me) - strings sounds a little bit rough.

*Berlin Orchestra Inspire - *I don't have an opinion about that one. Is one mic position a big problem? 

*Metropolis Ark series* - also exceeds my budget.

Maybe i should use different vst's for each section?

Thank you for support


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## erica-grace (May 18, 2019)

lutzek said:


> I'm starting my journey with orchestral arrangements



Then you should start with libraries that have individual sections, and NOT with Albion, ARk, etc. Those can come later.

You should check this out, it is pretty simple, and straighforward, with a limited amount of articulations, but good for the price.

https://www.bestservice.com/the_orchestra.html



lutzek said:


> Also (for me) - strings (EW) sounds a little bit rough.



The strings sound _really good_. As close to what real strings sound like as you are ever going to get, as with some other libraries, like Spitfire and Cinesamples and Orchestral Tools..


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## Stanoli (May 18, 2019)

Why don`t you start first with a affordable greatsounding Ensemblepatch instrument like Adagietto:

https://8dio.com/instrument/adagietto-vst-au-aax-kontakt-instruments-samples/

And after that if you see you need more you can build other libraries around it.


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## Manaberry (May 18, 2019)

Hi! Happy to see another composer diving into the orchestral world!

My very first advice will be this one: Wait until summer for possible sales. 
There is "Ensemble ready" vst like Albion One from Spitfire Audio or Inspire from Berlin. They are both very great. Usually, for those kind of product, only your personal preference (and I'm talking about the sound of the library) will be decisive for the final checkout.

Metropolis ARK series is very pricey but it's top quality product. Most of the time, libraries in this price range are considered as "specialized library". So you usually get a lot of articulations, sounds, mic positions and FX to play with.

Anyway, take your time to carefully review each library that would fill your needs. And remember, trust your sound preference


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## Ben (May 18, 2019)

May I suggest the VSL Special Editions? (https://www.vsl.co.at/en/Starter_Editions/Special_Edition_Complete_Bundle)
At the moment there is a 30% discount sale for upgrades going on. So you can buy the cheapest of the sections (https://www.vsl.co.at/en/Special_Edition_Vol1/SE_Vol1_Percussion_More) for 50€ and then upgrade the rest for additional ~1010€.

Or just get Vol 1+2: Get the Percussion from Vol1 and the Guitars and Keyboards from Vol2 for 50€ each + upgrade to full volume = ~800€.
Of course you can also get just Vol1.

Vol 1 has the most basic instruments for orchestral music, with Vol 2 you get additional instruments for chamber and ensemble. Vol3 adds hollywood sized strings + muted strings.

You can upgrade from SE to the Full Instruments if you want; the SE volumes are imo the best value for such a complete orchestra.
(Also VSL has a 30 days return policy. So if you are not happy with this library, just contact them.)


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## CologneScoring (May 18, 2019)

8dio just started releasing their renewed Adagio Strings. The Violins are on sale right now (48 USD), and they claimed to realease the other sections during the next weeks, I assume for the same price. So if you like their sound it‘s worth to take a look there.


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## Normqn (May 18, 2019)

If you don't need any percussions or anything other than just Woods, Brass and Strings, you can go for this :
https://www.spitfireaudio.com/shop/ranges/collections/spitfire-studio-orchestra-professional/


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## Zee (May 18, 2019)

if i were you i'd start with something like Amadeus Symphonic Orchestra, it has both solo and Ensemble (small and full Section), covers all the standard orchestral instruments and it sounds alright out of the box


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## ism (May 18, 2019)

Stanoli said:


> Why don`t you start first with a affordable greatsounding Ensemblepatch instrument like Adagietto:
> 
> https://8dio.com/instrument/adagietto-vst-au-aax-kontakt-instruments-samples/
> 
> And after that if you see you need more you can build other libraries around it.




My experience, while there is lots to love about Adagietto and Adagio, is that it’s a terrible place to start. I’d think out it to fill out a pallet later, but it would be a frustrating place to start.


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## Sarah Mancuso (May 18, 2019)

Rather than Albion, I'd suggest this since you're wanting access to each instrument section (Albion is ensembles only):
https://www.spitfireaudio.com/shop/a-z/spitfire-studio-orchestra-professional/


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## Niah2 (May 18, 2019)

You don't have to buy all the Albions, they are very different from one another. Example: albion IV is dedicated to mostly effects, and dissonant textures.

I assume that by "pure symphonic music" you mean pure sounding orchestral music with no sound design sounds, synths, or other hybrid stuff. But what exactly type of orchestral music are you aiming for? There are libraries that are after a certain specific style or sound. example: EW hollywood series.


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## Shredoverdrive (May 18, 2019)

My advice :
- Don't buy anything full price. Wait for sales (summer or better, black friday or christmas)
- Try what you can try (like try sound for the Chris Hein and the VSL SE libraries : https://www.bestservice.com/try-sound.html, or the Composer Cloud for one month for East West - 20 bucks and you can cancel it afterwards).
- Decide whether you want dry samples you can place and assemble as you please but that will take some work (Chris Hein, VSL - because Mirx will be out of your budget...) or wet samples that sound very good straight away but will give you less flexibility (Spitfire, Orchestral Tools...)
- Think about the protection policies (the horrible VSL dongle, Iloks for some)
- Think about no resale policies (most companies, like Spitfire, East West or Orchestral Tools).
- And last but not least, check your technical abilities : Orchestral Tools products sound amazing but the Berlin series (apart from the Inspire 1 and 2) are CPU and RAM hogs.
- Ah and consider the Cinesamples series also. I don't know much about them but they sound good and people seem to like them around here.


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## muk (May 18, 2019)

+1 to what @erica-grace wrote. I wouldn't start with ensemble libraries that don't give you control over each individual instrument or section. I would not advise to buy 8dio either, because a) it is difficult to build a complete orchestra (you need quite a bit of knowledge about the orchestra and 8dio's offerings to do that), b) they are not beginner friendly in my opinion c) their quality control is shoddy, and you need to knowledge to program around that (if at all possible).

Instead I would recommend one of these options:

1) VSL Special 1 bundle for 535€. Gives you all the bread and butter instruments and articulations. I'd especially recommend it if you want to write in classical styles and/or want to write chamber music as well as full symphonic. It has a bit of a learning curve (but nothing unmanageable), and you either need to have/acquire some mixing skills, or buy Mirx on top of it. 

2) If you want to write in a cinematic style, go for Cinematic Studio Series Strings and Brass. Complete your orchestra with VSL Special Edition Woodwinds, and a percussion library of your choice. The Cinematic Studio Series should be very well suited for beginners, as their libraries are laid out nicely and consistently. The downside is that the tone is geared towards cinematic music and won't be as well suited for other tasks.

3) Steinberg Iconica. I haven't read much about this package. But it's another complete orchestra with consistent programming, and hopefully high quality samples.


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## robgb (May 18, 2019)

If you're just getting started with orchestral arrangements, I STRONGLY suggest you consider getting Sonic Scores's AMADEUS SYMPHONIC ORCHESTRA, which has all the basics at a price ($150) that is far, far lower than it should be, considering what you get. It also sounds damn good and was scripted by Tracy Collins of Indiginus.


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## ism (May 18, 2019)

If I had to do it over again, I wouldn’t mess around with ensembles like Albion 1, or the Arks or cheap libraries like Adagietto. I’d go straight for best in class libraries like Spitfire Symphonic Winds, then the chamber strings, then some specialty libraries like the Olafur Chamber Evo, Tundra, maybe Time Macro. Then add more detail with some solo strings, and woodwind soloists - Berlin WW Exp B probably.


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## Bluemount Score (May 18, 2019)

erica-grace said:


> Then you should start with libraries that have individual sections, and NOT with Albion, ARk, etc. Those can come later.


Why though? I prefer individual sections as well, for flexibility and a "more classical" workflow, but as a beginner it's easier to start with something like Albion, which in fact is a library made for bloody beginners.
It depends on what style you are going for. The classical orchestral setup, or something that isn't exactly organized like that, but sounds good in it's own way.

And, as said before, definitely look out for sales and better be a little patient instead of buying at full price


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## robgb (May 18, 2019)

ism said:


> cheap libraries like Adagietto


Adagietto is only cheap in price. It sounds excellent.



Meetyhtan said:


> but as a beginner it's easier to start with something like Albion, which in fact is a library made for bloody beginners.



I think it's a mistake to buy the Albions. If you want to learn orchestration, you need separate ensembles.


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## ism (May 18, 2019)

Meetyhtan said:


> Why though? I prefer individual sections as well, for flexibility and a "more classical" workflow, but as a beginner it's easier to start with something like Albion, which in fact is a library made for bloody beginners.
> It depends on what style you are going for. The classical orchestral setup, or something that isn't exactly organized like that, but sounds good in it's own way.
> 
> And, as said before, definitely look out for sales and better be a little patient instead of buying at full price




Totally valid preference of course. But there’s also an orthodoxy inherent in it of learning to compose for the full orchestra first. Historically, it’s always been the case that composers start with solo instruments, then graduate to small ensembles, and only attempt to write symphonies with a great deal of technical mastery behind them. 

If you want to write big thonking trailers, then by all means start with Albion or Ark 1.

But some of the logic of starting with the full symphony also quietly assumes that affordable sampled instruments sounded so bad that you needed the full orchestra to cover up all the flaws in the individual instruments. For instance, no one ever wrote any half way listenable chamber music with GPO 1, I’d wager. 

With at least some current best in class libraries being more or less affordable (SSW on a wishlist sale being my go-to example), I think the logic of starting with a full orchestra is not nearly as strong as it once was. At the very least the underlying assumptions should be foregrounded and reconsidered.


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## ism (May 18, 2019)

robgb said:


> Adagietto is only cheap in price. It sounds excellent.



Agreed - or at least it certainly can be made to sound nice. And I would certainly pick it up now. But it was a terrible, frustrating, first string library, in my experience. And the money I ‘saved’ wasn’t worth the headaches.


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## ridgero (May 18, 2019)

CSS / CSB / Woodwinds of your choice

Its a pity that you missed the great deal on Spitfire Studio Orchestra - it would have been the perfect package for you.


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## oxo (May 18, 2019)

i tend to recommend absolute beginners once a good cheap library like this (on sale at the moment $ 199):
https://www.bestservice.com/the_orchestra.html

why? only when you have some experience with orchestra libraries, you will get a sense of what you really need and which of the expensive libraries will suit you. because only in the practical work do you realize which library concepts match your music, your workflow and what is personally important for you.
because no matter how you decide. i guarantee you, your first library will not be the last. after a few months you will want to buy additional libraries. so it can happen to you, you are now investing $ 1000 and realize in a few months that this library does not suit you and your working style. because what you really need, you know only when you have collected practical experience. you can also earn this experience with this $ 199 library. ... and if you know exactly what you need after a few months, you have not lost $ 1000 (in the worst case).


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## Reid Rosefelt (May 18, 2019)

robgb said:


> If you're just getting started with orchestral arrangements, I STRONGLY suggest you consider getting Sonic Scores's AMADEUS SYMPHONIC ORCHESTRA, which has all the basics at a price ($150) that is far, far lower than it should be, considering what you get. It also sounds damn good and was scripted by Tracy Collins of Indiginus.



+1000 to this.
The Amadeus Symphonic Orchestra has everything you need to learn. And it has some fun extras like the Symphony feature. If you wait a bit it's possible it will be even less than $150, as it was cheaper when it was introduced.



And do consider The Orchestra because it is half off now, the cheapest it's ever been. But The Orchestra has no solo instruments.

The NI sale should be here any minute. If percussion is important to you, you could pick up their excellent percussion library. There are other great percussion libraries from other companies that don't cost much, including ones from Impact Soundworks and Strezov Sampling.

While you learn on Amadeus, listen to the demos and watch YouTube videos of the Cinematic Studio series and Spitfire Studio series. These two are arguably the least expensive libraries that have the best reviews. Once you purchase one CS library, the others are deeply discounted.

Don't buy retail! Wait until Black Friday to buy the Cinematic Studio series and wait until Spitfire Christmas Wish List to buy anything Spitfire, as you will get 40% off then.

Finally, if you stick with this, you are going to have to spend a lot of money on computer power, SSDs, etc. If your setup is not so powerful now, then there is a huge advantage to starting with Amadeus and The Orchestra. The two Inspire Libraries also work great on small systems, but again, they sound great but do not have all the instruments and articulations you can get from other libraries.

One more thing: buy full Kontakt in the NI sale. Once you have this you will be able to get hundreds of great free or cheap instruments. Also a lot of the best paid libraries are only available with full Kontakt.


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## robgb (May 18, 2019)

TigerTheFrog said:


> One more thing: buy full Kontakt in the NI sale.


Yes. Full Kontakt is, to my mind, a must. But then I've been using it since version 1.


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## AlexanderSchiborr (May 18, 2019)

lutzek said:


> Hello,
> 
> I'm starting my journey with orchestral arrangements and I would like to buy my first orchestral VST. I read your opinions, went through a "basic guide" and I still have some doubts. This is my first attempt to this topic, so I'd like to spend no more than 1000€ for this. So first - I am interested in creating "pure" symphonic music (at least for first months, to learn how to do it good).
> 
> ...



Edirol orchestra probably fits your needs and it has sections,also sonatina symphonic orchestra is even free. Maybe you check it out


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## Zero&One (May 18, 2019)

lutzek said:


> *EastWest *- i watched some tutorials and it looks really complicated to me. Also (for me) - strings sounds a little bit rough.



Also put me off, but after getting Hollywood Orchestra and playing with it I found it very simple too use and also sounds great.

I love Spitfire, but be careful as that's a rabbit hole that can hurt your wallet. All good however.

Agree with previous comments, wait for sales as they happen every week these days. NI will have one in the summer...


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## ism (May 18, 2019)

James H said:


> I love Spitfire, but be careful as that's a rabbit hole that can hurt your wallet. All good however.



Definitely a rabbit hole. Rather a nice one though.


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## Reid Rosefelt (May 18, 2019)

ridgero said:


> CSS / CSB / Woodwinds of your choice
> 
> Its a pity that you missed the great deal on Spitfire Studio Orchestra - it would have been the perfect package for you.



FYI, if you feel the need to get quality libraries without waiting for sales, you will need to go over your budget:

Cinematic Studio Strings $399
Cinematic Studio Brass $279 (discount for owning CSS)
Spitfire Studio Woodwinds Core $200

That's already $878 without a percussion or piano library. If you get Kontakt, you can get a good free piano, and tons of other free stuff. Check out HERE and HERE.

During the Christmas Wish List, you can upgrade the Spitfire Woodwinds to Pro for $120.
If memory serves, you could also get the rest of the Spitfire Studio core series for around $220.


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## robgb (May 18, 2019)

TigerTheFrog said:


> FYI, if you feel the need to get quality libraries without waiting for sales, you will need to go over your budget:
> 
> Cinematic Studio Strings $399
> Cinematic Studio Brass $279 (discount for owning CSS)
> ...


Get Spitfire Studio Strings and you'll save a bit.


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## toomanynotes (May 18, 2019)

Hi in ref to Alexander's post 'sonatina symphonic orchestra' here's a couple of links to my mock ups using the sonatina. It was done 8 years ago all by ear, I prefer a real orchestra cos im quite lousy at computer music.

The Godfather 2 
Jaws 'montage'


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## ed buller (May 18, 2019)

lutzek said:


> Hello,
> 
> I'm starting my journey with orchestral arrangements and I would like to buy my first orchestral VST. I read your opinions, went through a "basic guide" and I still have some doubts. This is my first attempt to this topic, so I'd like to spend no more than 1000€ for this. So first - I am interested in creating "pure" symphonic music (at least for first months, to learn how to do it good).
> 
> ...




questions:


1. What type of music are you wanting to write, give some examples .

2. How knowledgeable are you about, music theory and orchestration .

3. can you read and write music

4. what is your DAW of choice and what OS

best

ed


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## EgM (May 18, 2019)

AlexanderSchiborr said:


> Edirol orchestra probably fits your needs and it has sections,also sonatina symphonic orchestra is even free. Maybe you check it out



As much as I loved Edirol Orchestral in the past, it has been discontinued for over 10 years.


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## EgM (May 18, 2019)

lutzek said:


> I thought about *NI Symphony Series* (full version), but I see, that - in general - people don't have a good opinion about it (especially woodwinds). One of things that I'm interested in is an access to each instrument section (this is not a "must have", but it would be good to have this possibility).



I personally would pass on this one, for the opinions you've seen here and elsewhere...



> *Albion *series from Spitfire Audio sounds great, but it is 5 packs, 450€ each, so that exceeds my budget.



I don't have any of the Albion series but like @robgb said, for that budget I would go for a library that has more articulations with separate instruments. 



> *EastWest *- i watched some tutorials and it looks really complicated to me. Also (for me) - strings sounds a little bit rough.



Strings are FAR from rough, you need to read the manual and control velocity layers and vibrato with CC11 and CC1 respectively. Once you learn how it works, it can sound pretty awesome!



> *Berlin Orchestra Inspire - *I don't have an opinion about that one. Is one mic position a big problem?



Again, combined orchestra patches. Quite expensive for what it is in my honest opinion.



> *Metropolis Ark series* - also exceeds my budget.



No opinion, also don't have it.

If I had to invest that budget, I'd try to get libraries that have individual patches for each instrument. Also, you'll have to get Kontakt Full if you want to have full control on your instruments.


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## SoNowWhat? (May 18, 2019)

@TigerTheFrog said it above but if you decide to go the Cinematic Studio route then get CSS first as a one off purchase and not everything at once. You will then be entitled to the loyalty discount if you get CSB. And I dare say there’ll be loyalty discounts if CSW is released.

One more heads up on VSL options check the details on what happens with lost or damaged dongles and replacing your library. Search VI-C for threads on the topic. Just so your eyes are fully open before making a decision.

Lots of good advice in this thread.


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## rottoy (May 18, 2019)

Anyone dipping their toes into making orchestral mockups these days, on a section-by-section basis,
would be a fool not to look at Alex Wallbank's Cinematic Studio series.
Top notch quality control and extremely generous loyalty discounts foster a strong and happy customer base.


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## rocking.xmas.man (May 18, 2019)

If you re eligible for edu discounts you should have a Look at cinesamples cinesymphony core bundle.


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## jbuhler (May 18, 2019)

ridgero said:


> CSS / CSB / Woodwinds of your choice
> 
> Its a pity that you missed the great deal on Spitfire Studio Orchestra - it would have been the perfect package for you.


I think CSS/CSB/Woodwinds of choice is a good option for the $1000 orchestra, and it's one I've suggested to others as an alternative to SStO Pro. Another that I might think about at around $1000 is SF BHCT and Studio Orchestra Core. I do think there is a value to using an ensemble library as a base and individual sections for detail, especially when first learning to work with samples.


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## dsblais (May 18, 2019)

lutzek said:


> Hello,
> 
> I'm starting my journey with orchestral arrangements and I would like to buy my first orchestral VST. I read your opinions, went through a "basic guide" and I still have some doubts. This is my first attempt to this topic, so I'd like to spend no more than 1000€ for this. So first - I am interested in creating "pure" symphonic music (at least for first months, to learn how to do it good).
> 
> ...


Hi, lutzek. I was looking very much for the same thing when I started looking into VIs a year ago. The challenge with this is that so many orchestral libraries are not geared towards traditional symphonic music, but film scoring, trailers, pop music, etc. In particular, a lot of the playing in the more popular genres is much simpler, requiring relatively few articulations and depth in the VI. If all you are looking for is some samples that do a good job sounding a particular way, there are potentially scores of libraries to consider. In particular, if your wants are some nice-sounding swells and staccato ostinato notes or similar, you'll find tons that will do the trick. But, if you want a more traditional expression, most of these libraries are _not_ well suited.

In particular, I've found the following unsuitable for classical music:

EastWest Symphonic and Hollywood Orchestras/Choirs
Symphobia series
Cinema Studio Strings and CSSS
Sonuscore The Orchestra
Sonokinetic products
Most other products
On the other hand, the VIs that seem, in my humble opinion, to work best for classical are:

VSL
Orchestral Tools (but not the Arks -- although their choirs are very nice)
Iconica (so far; still getting a feel for it)
I suspect some Spitfire libraries would be another good option, but for "reasons" I haven't gone that route so I can't say first hand.

If you went the VSL path (which is my favorite), I would recommend VI Pro, a MIRx venue, and SE Bundle Vol 1 (you may want Vol 2 for ensembles and rarities, but you likely won't need the Plus articulations). Best Service is a great place to get these and you should do the upgrade stepped purchase. VSL takes a little practice, but is incredibly good at handling some traditional playing styles.

Orchestral Tools Inspire is a nice library to start, although the sound isn't on par with the larger kits from OT. I don't mind the single microphone. You will likely mostly miss the individual instruments, but you could potentially pick up Berlin Strings or whatever you'd prefer using the 150€ off from the Inspire. The out of the box sound of OT is very nice and the playability is usually pretty good.

Iconica is new, but you could get the whole enchilada within your budget. I like the sound, but it is much improved with a good reverb. The playability is reasonably good, although it's a resource hog. Most people haven't given a lot of love towards Iconica yet, but I think that's because the out of the box sound (like VSL) is too dry for most folk's taste.

Obviously these are just opinions, but I think it is undeniably true that most libraries out there aren't geared towards traditional music, partly because there's not much career there for most folks. Whatever you decide, I hope you enjoy it and have fun creating music!


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## cadenzajon (May 18, 2019)

Red Room Audio is another recent introduction to the sampled orchestra landscape to consider. It comes at a very reasonable price point and has seen a fairly positive reception.


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## Dex (May 18, 2019)

It's already been said but I want to reinforce this idea: Never ever ever pay full price for an instrument (or other plugin). You can get most things for 50-90% off if you're patient.


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## Michael Antrum (May 18, 2019)

Steinberg’s Iconica Sections & Players has been mentioned already a couple of times here. It was made in partnership with orchestral tools, so it comes from good parentage. However, there are a couple of things that push it up the list in my opinion as a great value entry point for someone just starting out.

1). There is a 30 day trial available.
2). Unlike virtually everything else you can sell it if you decide this hobby is not for you.
3). All the sections levels are balanced to each other. This is a biggie when you are just starting - getting the relative levels balanced takes experience and makes your work sound much more realistic.
4) if you use Cubase the Expression Maps are self generating (articulation management).
5) Sounds great right out of the box.

However, it does require the use of a dongle (elicneser) which some people have a pathological hatred of.

The other good thing is that Steinberg is having a 30th anniversary sale. Currently Iconica Ensembles is on sale for 30% off (ends today) Now this is not the product you are needing as it is, as it’s name suggests, only ensembles, but it is expected that Iconica Sections and Players will go on the same offer this month, which would bring it in at around £400 or so (depending on where you are) which would be insane value.

You can pick up an Elicenser for a s little as £16.00, so if I were you I’d be getting that trial downloaded (150gb !!!)

Otherwise I’d be going with East West composer cloud until Black Friday....


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## NYC Composer (May 18, 2019)

I like the Amadeus idea. Start small with a decent sounding library with Big Bang for the buck.


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## GtrString (May 19, 2019)

EW composer cloud to develop a taste for what you like. Then after a while, look to buy individual libraries.


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## lutzek (May 19, 2019)

Hoooolly Cow, I didn’t expect to see so many replies :o. So first of all thank you for all your answers 

I’m sorry for late response – yesterday we had Eurovision and that’s a big deal in Europe :D.

So maybe I’ll start from these questions:




ed buller said:


> questions:
> 1. What type of music are you wanting to write, give some examples .
> 
> 2. How knowledgeable are you about, music theory and orchestration .
> ...




Ad 1. At the end of the day I would like to write some kind of symphonic… psychedelic… rock :o. I’d like to combine more “classical” sound with rough old guitars, but… There is a long and winding road to do this, so I’d like to be focused on learning for first 8-12. My plan is to try to recreate some movie soundtracks to understand how it works.

Ad 2. My only knowledge from orchestration is what I read in “Principles of Orchestration” by Nikolay Rimsky-Korsakov (by the way – great book… for me).

Ad 3. Yes I can read and write music. I have 24 years of experience in playing on piano.

Ad 4. I’m using Reaper on Win 10. Additional information about my computer: Intel I7 8 gen, 6 cores, 32GB RAM, Nvidia GeForce GTX 1050 Ti, SSD + HDD




erica-grace said:


> Then you should start with libraries that have individual sections, […]



I definitely agree with this. First thing is to learn how to lead the part of each section.



Manaberry said:


> Hi! Happy to see another composer diving into the orchestral world!




Thank you, I’m happy too . Thank you for a lot of useful information.




Manaberry said:


> My very first advice will be this one: Wait until summer for possible sales.




That’s a good idea. So while going through all the posts I came up with a plan to try EastWest first, because it can be subscribed and meanwhile do a deeper research and wait for possible sales.



august80 said:


> Just a note - you wouldn't need the whole Albion series if you're just getting in orchestrating. Albion II is discontinued, Albion 3-5 are fairly specific in their purpose, and just kind of expand a bit into more niche areas of the orchestra that Albion ONE already covers at a general level. […]




Thank you – I didn’t know about that.




august80 said:


> Honestly, if you're just getting into this, I think having a subscription option for a quality product is a smart way to go.




It sounds really reasonable.



Niah2 said:


> I assume that by "pure symphonic music" you mean pure sounding orchestral music with no sound design sounds, synths, or other hybrid stuff.




That’s right – for first few months no more additional instruments.




Shredoverdrive said:


> My advice :
> 
> […]




Thank you – that is really helpful




TigerTheFrog said:


> One more thing: buy full Kontakt in the NI sale. Once you have this you will be able to get hundreds of great free or cheap instruments. Also a lot of the best paid libraries are only available with full Kontakt.




I didn’t think about it before, I have to check it.




dsblais said:


> Hi, lutzek. I was looking very much for the same thing when I started looking into VIs a year ago. [...]




Also thank you - a lot of interesting and useful information


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## Syneast (May 19, 2019)

lutzek said:


> *Berlin Orchestra Inspire - *I don't have an opinion about that one. Is one mic position a big problem?


Sometimes the strings are too close miced for my taste, especially the spiccatos. I like a bit of blur on my spiccatos when writing fast lines. You can get them to sound more distant by cranking up the Attack, thus eliminating the transient and leaving the room sound, but that trick will not work on sustains, so the strings will not sound consistent if you do that.


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## Sarah Mancuso (May 19, 2019)

If you're looking at getting an orchestral library _and_ getting full Kontakt, your best bet is probably to get the library first, and then later on get a crossgrade price to full Kontakt from that. The crossgrade generally goes on sale once or a couple times per year, too, which all in all means you can potentially pay something like $130 for Kontakt instead of $500.


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## ed buller (May 19, 2019)

lutzek said:


> Ad 1. At the end of the day I would like to write some kind of symphonic… psychedelic… rock :o. I’d like to combine more “classical” sound with rough old guitars, but… There is a long and winding road to do this, so I’d like to be focused on learning for first 8-12. My plan is to try to recreate some movie soundtracks to understand how it works.
> 
> Ad 2. My only knowledge from orchestration is what I read in “Principles of Orchestration” by Nikolay Rimsky-Korsakov (by the way – great book… for me).
> 
> ...




well I would suggest getting Dorico or Sibeluis with noteperformer to start with. Easy to write quickly and hear it back. Noteperformer is perfectly good enough to get a handle on how things will sound. Then for the Sample Libraries i'd recommend spitfire symphonic strings. The new studio woodwind and brass are great too but very dry. I prefer this for a lot of things but Still use Cinebrass a lot ( both libraries ) for full on Hollywood. Their perc is great too. 

for studying Hollywood orchestration get the omnimusic scores( https://omnimusicpublishing.com/ ) and just pick a few cues and enter them in your Scoring software . Then save as a midi file. Import the WAV from the soundtrack CD...and try and copy it in the DAW with good samples. You'll learn heaps !

best


ed


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## Mike Fox (May 19, 2019)

Hollywood Orchestra is still the best library for the price. Quality, quantity, and affordability are all there. Play is the only hangup for some.


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## muk (May 20, 2019)

Mike Fox said:


> Hollywood Orchestra is still the best library for the price. Quality, quantity, and affordability are all there. Play is the only hangup for some.



That's true, but with its complicated setup and inconsistent programming it is not a good choice for beginners. It's complicated and difficult to use well. The Cinematic Studio Series have a much more beginner friendly learning curve.


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## Mike Fox (May 20, 2019)

muk said:


> That's true, but with its complicated setup and inconsistent programming it is not a good choice for beginners. It's complicated and difficult to use well. The Cinematic Studio Series have a much more beginner friendly learning curve.


There's certanly a learning curve, but there's a learning curve with any software (the legato in CSS is a nightmare to learn, which is probably why they include a basic version?). I just wouldn't let that stop a beginner from using it, escpecially now that there's a ton of youtube tutorials now. After a couple of hours, i think someone could have Play figured out pretty well, no?

EWQLSO was actually my first real orchestral library, and the only real difficult thing i remember was the installation, "WARNING! Your software is out of date". Anyone who purchased the boxed versions back in the day will know what im talking about!


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## Uiroo (May 20, 2019)

Until you decided what to buy i can recommend the free Sonatina Symphonic Orchestra.
It's not great, but it's a full orchestra with sustain, staccato and pizzicato articulations. I used it before i had any money and i'm extremy grateful it exists


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## Illico (May 20, 2019)

Mike Fox said:


> EWQLSO was actually my first real orchestral library


+1, It's also my main orchestral library. Like all complete libraries, there is a learning curve...all instruments are present. The only negative point of EWQLSO remains the absence of legato / portamento. For Strings, I usually put an 8Dio Adagietto overlay.


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## muk (May 20, 2019)

@Mike Fox the problem I see for beginners is not with Play, but with the Hollywood Orchestra libraries. The problem with Play is that it's horribly rigid and inflexible to set up (custom keyswitching not possible without external software...). But that could be overcome.

The layout of the libraries however, with their wealth of patches to choose from, will certainly be overwhelming for any beginner. You need a very good understanding of all the instruments and their playing techniques to understand what half of these patches are doing (the nonsensical naming doesn't make it any easier). Even if you got that it's an arduous task to try each of these and decide on which ones you want to use in your template. Add the inconsistent programming (why the heck are dynamics sometimes controlled by cc11, and sometimes by cc1?) and you get the very ingredients for a complete overload of anybody who is not already very firm with samplers, sample libraries, daws, and orchestration.

Setting up and controlling Cinematic Studio Series - even with the legato lag - is a breeze in comparison.


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## handz (May 20, 2019)

Hollywood Orchestra is for the money definitely the best option - nothing complicated about it, you load a patch, you write/play. Same as any other standard lib. And I would start with gold which is super cheap - listen to some demos ppl did with it, it can still sound really good! The only thing that sucks is, that it uses PLAY, but if you do not have Kontakt, then it is actually plus, as many libs need full Kontakt which cost like the library itself. 


I would definitely not go for any ensemble libs like Albion as my only library.


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## handz (May 20, 2019)

muk said:


> That's true, but with its complicated setup and inconsistent programming it is not a good choice for beginners. It's complicated and difficult to use well. The Cinematic Studio Series have a much more beginner friendly learning curve.




Sorry but that's absolutely not true. It is as easy to use as any other library. Most of the libs out there which were released during a longer period of time have some small inconsistencies. And BTW I hate the way CSS is made, that you need to load ALL articulations section and then KS between them instead of having the option for loading specific arts separately. Also, CSS has super limited articulation option. The sound of the library is very nice, but I won't be buying it as my only String lib.


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## kessel (May 20, 2019)

august80 said:


> Just a note - you wouldn't need the whole Albion series if you're just getting in orchestrating. Albion II is discontinued, Albion 3-5 are fairly specific in their purpose, and just kind of expand a bit into more niche areas of the orchestra that Albion ONE already covers at a general level.
> 
> Also - you could get the Composer Cloud from East West for like $30 / month, and that gives you every product they have while your subscription is active. It might be safer way to get into learning, since it's a modest investment you can cancel. And plenty of very good composers use East West Hollywood series and get amazing results.
> 
> ...



That's exactly what I did this weekend but took the 1 year subscription for 19$ a month, I think I will need at least one year to get used to some of the instruments I want to learn and after that decide if they're worth the purchase or stay in subscription mode or even look other libraries around in the case I find out these don't give me what I need.

I like subscription plans when they're not the only choice for users.


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## muk (May 20, 2019)

handz said:


> It is as easy to use as any other library.



Erm, no.



handz said:


> And BTW I hate the way CSS is made,



That's personal preference and has nothing to do with the ease of use.



handz said:


> that you need to load ALL articulations section and then KS between them instead of having the option for loading specific arts separately.



Actually you can do that. Load all the articulations, then deactivate all but one. You can now set it up with individual patches just like Hollywood Orchestra.



handz said:


> Also, CSS has super limited articulation option.



For a beginner that is a good thing. It has all the necessary articulations to get you going. But good luck finding the right patch in Hollywood Strings if you don't know exactly what you are looking for.

If you are not sure about the difference between portato and portamento, with Hollywood Strings you are completely lost. And we are not even talking the difference between '1st Violins Leg Slur + Port RR LT 12 Ni', '1st Violins Sus 13 RR KSFP Ni', '1st Violins NV NV VB MV RR Ni', and '1st Violins Marc Sus 9 RR 4th pos Ni'.

If you are a power user it is great to have all these options. If you are just starting, they are unnecessarily confusing. A beginner will not know how fingerings on string instruments work, nor will they know what effect they have. Thus they don't need all these patches.

Compare that to 'Sustain', 'Staccato', 'Tremolo', etc. of Cinematic Studio Strings. Are very precise, all very simple to learn. So yes, it's a quite obvious fact that Cinematic Studio Strings are much easier to learn than Hollywood Strings, and thus, in my opinion, a better choice for any beginner.


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## ism (May 20, 2019)

muk said:


> For a beginner that is a good thing.



Very often, yes. But I'd argue that the breadth of articulations in SCS, or SStS would, in retrospect, have be best for myself as a beginner, given the type of music I want to write, and given how much I struggled in getting the right sound.

Libraries like Light and Sound and CSS gives you a fairly basic, and highly consistent palette, which is great if that's what you're looking for. But libraries like SCS and SStS (maybe hollywood string? ), let you hit the ground running and compose in a more painterly fashion from a broader palette. 

Traditionally, I think learning to write starts with being restricted to what ever ensemble/ spaces is available to perform your work. Or, more realistically, writing within a simple palette since it's more likely that your student works will never be performed. So it makes sense that a traditional approach is maybe a bit less painterly, and on a somewhat more neutral palette.

But here's another place where modern libraries let us challenge some of the assumptions of how to learn composition.

And modern libraries give you the option of starting with a broader pallet and a more painterly approach. Which is a perfectly reasonably (also, really fun) place to start also.


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## jbuhler (May 20, 2019)

muk said:


> Erm, no.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yes. The same line of argument can be used to suggest why ensemble libraries can be so helpful when getting started, with individual instruments being drawn in initially for detail. Personally I came to VIs with lots of training and experience with live players and traditional orchestration and I found ensemble libraries initially much easier to work with once I got my head around what they were doing. Eventually I had to move away from ensemble libraries to gain more control (though I still find them exceptionally useful for sketching and if I need to work fast). Undoubtedly some of this, probably even a lot of it, is personal preference.


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## handz (May 20, 2019)

> For a beginner that is a good thing. It has all the necessary articulations to get you going. But good luck finding the right patch in Hollywood Strings if you don't know exactly what you are looking for.



No, this is not a good thing, being beginner with VST libs does not mean you do not know what you want to compose. This is like the worst argument ever. How do you not know what you are looking for? Problem is that you usually know what sound you want, but it's not there...



> If you are not sure about the difference between portato and portamento, with Hollywood Strings you are completely lost. And we are not even talking the difference between '1st Violins Leg Slur + Port RR LT 12 Ni', '1st Violins Sus 13 RR KSFP Ni', '1st Violins NV NV VB MV RR Ni', and '1st Violins Marc Sus 9 RR 4th pos Ni'.



If you are not sure, you will once load the patch and test it. Rest is clearly stated in the manual. If you are "beginner" you will simply start with the simple legato patches. Nothing hard about that. But you still have the option for going more detailed. Which you will need soon when you are making progress



> If you are a power user it is great to have all these options. If you are just starting, they are unnecessarily confusing. A beginner will not know how fingerings on string instruments work, nor will they know what effect they have. Thus they don't need all these patches.



There are not any fingering specific patches in GOLD. Even if they were, you still have the option to not use them. But even if you are a beginner you still know that you sometimes want a cluster, string FX, run, etc. And these are not there in CSS and if you can afford only one lib, I would go for the one that has as many options as possible. Having them does not mean you have to be using them all the time. Still, don't understand your point of view. 



> Compare that to 'Sustain', 'Staccato', 'Tremolo', etc. of Cinematic Studio Strings. Are very precise, all very simple to learn. So yes, it's a quite obvious fact that Cinematic Studio Strings are much easier to learn than Hollywood Strings, and thus, in my opinion, a better choice for any beginner.



What is there to learn about tremolo or sustain patch? These are the simplest patches with no extra programming, you just use the modwheel for dynamics. 

Beginner in computer composing does not mean someone who knows nothing about music.


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## ism (May 20, 2019)

jbuhler said:


> Yes. The same line of argument can be used to suggest why ensemble libraries can be so helpful when getting started, with individual instruments being drawn in initially for detail. Personally I came to VIs with lots of training and experience with live players and traditional orchestration and I found ensemble libraries initially much easier to work with once I got my head around what they were doing. Eventually I had to move away from ensemble libraries to gain more control (though I still find them exceptionally useful for sketching and if I need to work fast). Undoubtedly some of this, probably even a lot of it, is personal preference.




This makes sense.

Coming to samples without already knowing how to write orchestral music, I found that a lot of I was coming up with via ensemble libraries was at best kind of bland, and at worst, derivative mush. (Admittedly this might not be entirely the fault to the ensemble libraries themselves  ).

If solo instruments were good enough (and a few of them are starting to be, though they're can be prohibitively expensive to a beginner) I would advocate starting with learning how to compositions around detailed individual solo lines, and building from there.


But lacking adequately expressive solo instruments, I think that something like SStS has enough expressiveness, on a broad enough palette that learning I link learning how to craft individual lines.

I would distinguish this from 'texture' libraries - Tundra or OACE being the ultimate examples. Which are fantastic for a particular 'painterly' approach. But unless you're writing ambient music, I'd argue this should be coupled with a library that lets you write in some finer detail.



Undoubtedly personal preference though. I'm sure the whatever the pedagogical theory implicit in the Albion One "Start writing film music *now*" is is perfectly valid also.


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## handz (May 20, 2019)

ism said:


> Very often, yes. But I'd argue that the breadth of articulations in SCS, or SStS would, in retrospect, have be best for myself as a beginner, given the type of music I want to write, and given how much I struggled in getting the right sound.
> 
> Libraries like Light and Sound and CSS gives you a fairly basic, and highly consistent palette, which is great if that's what you're looking for. But libraries like SCS and SStS (maybe hollywood string? ), let you hit the ground running and compose in a more painterly fashion from a broader palette.
> 
> ...





If you start to compose, limiting yourself from doing what you really want just because your library cant do it is the most frustrating thing ever. I remember the times when writing some passages with runs and fast legatos was almost impossible because there was no library capable of it. And I hated it. Having as most options as possible is a good thing. You always have the option not to use them at once but you still have them.


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## Zero&One (May 20, 2019)

It’s on sale anyway


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## Mike Fox (May 20, 2019)

@muk Maybe it all comes down to personal preference? I never found SO, HO to be complicated (even when i was starting out). I just had issues with the engine itself. Also, I LOVED having a ton of articulations. It was actually a really good way to learn about the multitude of different arts! It was also a ton of fun trying to incorporate that stuff into my compositions.

Anyway, we (thankfully) live in a world where just about every library sounds good, so it will be hard for the OP to go wrong with any of the suggestions offered in this thread.


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## Mike Fox (May 20, 2019)

robgb said:


> If you're just getting started with orchestral arrangements, I STRONGLY suggest you consider getting Sonic Scores's AMADEUS SYMPHONIC ORCHESTRA, which has all the basics at a price ($150) that is far, far lower than it should be, considering what you get. It also sounds damn good and was scripted by Tracy Collins of Indiginus.



I have just about every effing orchestral library out there, but i'm tempted to buy this, lol! The library seems like a freakin no brainer if you're just starting out. It seems to be flooding with options! Part of me wishes i could just return everything ive purchased over the years and just bought something simple like this and could use it for decades to come.


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## robgb (May 20, 2019)

Mike Fox said:


> I have just about every effing orchestral library out there, but i'm tempted to buy this, lol!


Same here and I bought it. Love it.


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## Dex (May 20, 2019)

Mike Fox said:


> I have just about every effing orchestral library out there, but i'm tempted to buy this, lol! The library seems like a freakin no brainer if you're just starting out. It seems to be flooding with options! Part of me wishes i could just return everything ive purchased over the years and just bought something simple like this and could use it for decades to come.



I have Amadeus. After listening to demos I think The Orchestra (for $199) blows Amadeus (at $149) out of the water.


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## handz (May 20, 2019)

Mike Fox said:


> @muk Maybe it all comes down to personal preference? I never found SO, HO to be complicated (even when i was starting out). I just had issues with the engine itself. Also, I LOVED having a ton of articulations. It was actually a really good way to learn about the multitude of different arts! It was also a ton of fun trying to incorporate that stuff into my compositions.
> 
> Anyway, we (thankfully) live in a world where just about every library sounds good, so it will be hard for the OP to go wrong with any of the suggestions offered in this thread.




Same here. 

It would, but the budget is obviously an issue here. You can get the whole Orchestra for like USD 600? Then he has another 400 to spare for buying stuff like a choir or maybe Albion or...


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## robgb (May 20, 2019)

Dex said:


> I have Amadeus. After listening to demos I think The Orchestra (for $199) blows Amadeus (at $149) out of the water.


I disagree. A friend has The Orchestra and I got a chance to play with it a bit. I much prefer Amadeus.


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## Dex (May 20, 2019)

robgb said:


> I disagree. A friend has The Orchestra and I got a chance to play with it a bit. I much prefer Amadeus.



Why? Like I said I was just basing my opinion on The Orchestra off of demos (which in my case was an hour and a half of youtube videos).


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## robgb (May 20, 2019)

Dex said:


> Why? Like I said I was just basing my opinion on The Orchestra off of demos (which in my case was an hour and a half of youtube videos).


It's been awhile, but it The Orchestra sounded a little vanilla to me. I'm sure it's just a matter of personal preference.


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## Reid Rosefelt (May 20, 2019)

I've had Amadeus since it came out and I've had The Orchestra a few days. They are two totally different kinds of libraries and very unique. I don't think it's possible to compare them head-to-head.

The Orchestra does not offer any solo instruments at all, while Amadeus has 2 flutes, 4 different French Horns, 3 trumpets, etc. Amadeus has many instruments not found in The Orchestra at all, including 2 guitars, a piano, pipe organ, harpsichord, celesta, tubular bells, etc. Amadeus also has a cool feature called Symphony, similar to Indiginus' Solid State Symphony ($59),

The selling point of The Orchestra is its arp engine, which is amazing, fun, and to me, very inspiring. If you want that, then there's nothing to discuss. No orchestral library has anything like it at any price. $200 is a very good price, the lowest to date, and I don't think it will ever sell for less.

It depends on what you want. How much you like the sound of the orchestral instruments should certainly factor into that decision.

If what a beginner composer wants to do is learn how to compose with ALL the main instruments in a full orchestra, they have what they need to get started in Amadeus. They simply don't with The Orchestra or lots of other fine libraries like the Albions, Inspire, and the Palette series, that lack all solo instruments.


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## kessel (May 21, 2019)

TigerTheFrog said:


> I've had Amadeus since it came out and I've had The Orchestra a few days. They are two totally different kinds of libraries and very unique. I don't think it's possible to compare them head-to-head.
> 
> The Orchestra does not offer any solo instruments at all, while Amadeus has 2 flutes, 4 different French Horns, 3 trumpets, etc. Amadeus has many, many instruments not found in The Orchestra at all, including 2 guitars, a piano, pipe organ, harpsichord, celesta, tubular bells, etc. Amadeus also has a cool feature called Symphony, similar to Indiginus' Solid State Symphony ($59),
> 
> ...



That's good to know, I actually like the sound of the orchestra way more than Amadeus as well but not having any single instrument is really a point down for that library. I guess I'll keep buying dedicated libraries for now.


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## thevisi0nary (May 23, 2019)

There are people here who are far better than me who know a great deal more. But the most important thing is knowing what kind of composer YOU are and what YOU like to use.

I don’t have it, but I would get EW composer cloud for $30 a month until you’ve written enough songs to know exactly what you want out of a library and how they play into your song writing style.

You could easily spend several hundred $$ on any of the proven libraries mentioned here and you’ll most likely have a good time. But you could also get something and realize it is not optimal for the style you want to go with. Better in my opinion to go with something that is cheap, refundable, comes with excellent libraries, and then branch out as you have a better understanding of sample libraries.


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## ScoreFace (May 24, 2019)

kessel said:


> That's good to know, I actually like the sound of the orchestra way more than Amadeus as well but not having any single instrument is really a point down for that library. I guess I'll keep buying dedicated libraries for now.



Just one thing for clarification: in The Orchestra, there are tons of single nkis with lots of different articulations. You can play these without the engine and use the whole lbrary like a normal orchestral sample lib.

There is one nki "The Orchestra.nki", which works with the engine and contains all instruments in slots - I would say this is the "special" thing about TO.

But aside, you'll find folders with all sections (Strings, Brass, Wood, Percussion, Choir), containing all instruments as "normal" single nkis.

To be honest, I work very often with the "all articulations" single nkis. With these I can change articulations via keyswitch and even assign several articulations at the same time. When I play French Horn motifs, I chose stacc, marc and sustain at the same time to get a really punching sound.

What TO doesn't have, are SOLO instruments - they don't offer 4 single French Horns, for example, and they don't have a solo violins. Maybe in a future update? I'd like that.


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## Harzmusic (May 24, 2019)

ScoreFace said:


> What TO doesn't have, are SOLO instruments - they don't offer 4 single French Horns, for example, and they don't have a solo violins.


Actually the woodwinds are solo instruments - in return there are no recorded ensembles for the woodwinds though.


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## ScoreFace (May 24, 2019)

Harzmusic said:


> Actually the woodwinds are solo instruments - in return there are no recorded ensembles for the woodwinds though.



Really? Wow, I didn't notice - but you seem to be right :D

Makes sense in a way, as orchestrators sometimes advice to not double woodwinds too often in unisono...


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## Hanu_H (May 24, 2019)

I don't have The Orchestra or Amadeus, but when listening the demos, The Orchestra sounds a lot better to me. With that sale price it's pretty hard to beat... It is just unbelievable that you can get with such a little money these days. When I started out and bought EWQLSO the price was totally in a different league. It's happy days for those who are just starting out, so many great tools available with such a low price.


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## kessel (May 24, 2019)

I started a subscription plan on EastWest, mainly because of choirs and RA, but I've seen they have both orchestra and solo libraries included in the subscription plan as well, that might be an affordable option as well, and it sounds pretty good in my opinion too:


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## MarcusD (May 24, 2019)

Personally I'd start with Hollywood Orchestra. It litterally has everything you need to cover all bases and then some. Very generous amount of patches and some of the FX patches are incredible (noteably brass) + it's on offer ATM until the end this month. Sure it's not as quick to work with as some other libraries and takes a little time to set up, but well worth every penny.

Dimond Edition RRP $932 Sale price $466
Gold Edition RRP $665 Sale price $332
Link: http://www.soundsonline.com/hollywood-orchestra

Then with the spare $ left over you can wait for the other sales and pick up anything else you need. Like choirs, solo instruments or epic cinematic perc stuff... Or you could just use composer cloud (like others have mentioned) and use everything East West have.


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## SchnookyPants (May 24, 2019)

lutzek said:


> ...... at least for first months, to learn how to do it good.....




Bless your heart. Good luck with that.


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## handz (May 24, 2019)

I was just playing with my GOLD version of HO and.... sorry, there is nothing as good for the money, even the woodwinds are really nice, great tone. My only issue are the bones, which has a bit muffled tone but horns and Cellos - wow. The cellos have the best lush Hollywood tone, loved them since first demos.


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## handz (May 24, 2019)

MarcusD said:


> Personally I'd start with Hollywood Orchestra. It litterally has everything you need to cover all bases and then some. Very generous amount of patches and some of the FX patches are incredible (noteably brass) + it's on offer ATM until the end this month. Sure it's not as quick to work with as some other libraries and takes a little time to set up, but well worth every penny.
> 
> Dimond Edition RRP $932 Sale price $466
> Gold Edition RRP $665 Sale price $332
> ...




Wow $332... that's a steal... 
I have gold - but not percussions (they were not available when I was shopping) I Would like to upgrade them to diamond. And... am I getting something wrong or the update really cost $188??! per section?! 
the whole Diamond is $466 so the upgrade from gold to diamond should be like $35 per section now, right?


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## Zero&One (May 24, 2019)

handz said:


> Wow $332... that's a steal...
> I have gold - but not percussions (they were not available when I was shopping) I Would like to upgrade them to diamond. And... am I getting something wrong or the update really cost $188??! per section?!
> the whole Diamond is $466 so the upgrade from gold to diamond should be like $35 per section now, right?



The upgrades are not included in this 50% sale. Hopefully an upgrade sale around summer


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## schrodinger1612 (Nov 25, 2019)

Mike Fox said:


> I have just about every effing orchestral library out there, but i'm tempted to buy this, lol! The library seems like a freakin no brainer if you're just starting out. It seems to be flooding with options! Part of me wishes i could just return everything ive purchased over the years and just bought something simple like this and could use it for decades to come.


I have a question for you...

If you could start again what libraries would you buy and limit yourself to for the rest of your scoring life?


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## Mike Fox (Nov 25, 2019)

schrodinger1612 said:


> I have a question for you...
> 
> If you could start again what libraries would you buy and limit yourself to for the rest of your scoring life?


Hm...dang, good question! Probably these...

Afflatus
Soaring Strings
CAGE
Symphobia (all of them!)
ProjectSAM's orchestral harp
Cineperc
Cinepiano
Cineharpsichord
Joby Burgess perc
Arva
Damage
Thrill
Omnisphere
APE
Ark 1 & 3
Dark Matter

I'm totally undecided on brass and choir at this point, as I've yet to find a "go-to", but the brass and choir in the Arks are outstanding, I also compose mostly modern horror, hence the aleatoric stuff and lack of a standalone woodwind library on my list.

If i was forced to making only 1 purchase it would probably be the Orchestral Essentials or Inspire bundle.


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