# External SSD Drive



## Yogevs (May 29, 2020)

I have a question as I'm not sure I understand.
People keep saying we can use an SSD drive as a replacement for RAM because it's fast enough.
Then I hear people say I can use an external SSD drive and load all the libraries from that.
BUT - the SSD drive is connected via USB-C. Does the speed of reading from an SSD drive through USB-C is still fast enough and comparable to RAM?


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## mybadmemory (May 29, 2020)

Ssd’s are generally considered fast enough to use sample libraries from even when external. Most players still load the samples into ram though, so the ssd is mostly there to load them into the ram at a high enough speed.


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## BassClef (May 29, 2020)

Anyone saying SSD is a replacement for RAM is poorly educated not the subject. Most VI users that have SSDs use external ones, where the SSD drive itself is a SATA3 type, connected to the pc via USB or Thunderbolt. I use a USB3 connection to my iMAC which is approximately the same transfer speed of my SATA3 SSDs, so I am getting "close to" as fast as I can get from the SSD drives. This loads my samples very quickly, plenty fast enough for nearly any VI use. 

Now if you want to get the samples into your pc RAM even faster, you must give up SATA3 SSDs and get NVMe type SSD drives. These are more expensive but can transfer data up to 7 times faster than SATAe drives. However, you must have the propers NVMe sockets inside your pc to use them. (or you can get external ones and Thunderbolt III which is even more expensive) Most folks consider the NMVe SSDs as "overkill" when working with samples in a DAW and therefore purchase the SATA3 SSDs. 

Hope this helps.


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## MarcHedenberg (May 29, 2020)

I upgraded to the x570 Aorus Ultra and got myself a couple of NVME M.2s from Sabrent and addlink. While I wouldn't say I'm 'disappointed' because my OS does run faster, I really haven't noticed that much of a speed bump when working with libraries. Kontakt still loads in samples about the same rate it did before and it's all sitting on the same M.2 drive, including the DAW itself.


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## Wunderhorn (May 29, 2020)

MarcHedenberg said:


> I upgraded to the x570 Aorus Ultra and got myself a couple of NVME M.2s from Sabrent and addlink. While I wouldn't say I'm 'disappointed' because my OS does run faster, I really haven't noticed that much of a speed bump when working with libraries. Kontakt still loads in samples about the same rate it did before and it's all sitting on the same M.2 drive, including the DAW itself.



If you are connecting this external NVMe via USB you won't see much difference because there won't be enough bandwidth to go through that bottleneck. There are only few solutions out there to get NVMe speed - for example the TB3 Thunderblade by OWC.


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## Technostica (May 29, 2020)

Wunderhorn said:


> If you are connecting this external NVMe via USB you won't see much difference because there won't be enough bandwidth to go through that bottleneck. There are only few solutions out there to get NVMe speed - for example the TB3 Thunderblade by OWC.


He's upgraded to a motherboard that supports multiple PCIe *4.0* NVMe SSDs so presumably he's using internal drives and I'm guessing PCIe 4.0 ones at that.

I've heard people say that the jump from SATA to PCIe 3.0 4x is only noticeable with certain libraries, so the jump from PCIe 3.0 4x to PCIe 4.0 4x is likely to be even less noticeable. Especially as the current 4.0 drives aren't getting close to saturating the buss yet. So even the headline best case gains are 50% or less which is dramatically less than the jump from SATA to 3.0 x4.


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## MarcHedenberg (May 29, 2020)

Technostica said:


> He's upgraded to a motherboard that supports multiple PCIe *4.0* NVMe SSDs so presumably he's using internal drives and I'm guessing PCIe 4.0 ones at that.
> 
> I've heard people say that the jump from SATA to PCIe 3.0 4x is only noticeable with certain libraries, so the jump from PCIe 3.0 4x to PCIe 4.0 4x is likely to be even less noticeable. Especially as the current 4.0 drives aren't getting close to saturating the buss yet. So even the headline best case gains are 50% or less which is dramatically less than the jump from SATA to 3.0 x4.



Yup. Using internal drives. About the only library I think that has benefitted is BBCSO, which does load in almost instantly now, but Kontakt still feels about the same.


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## jbuhler (May 29, 2020)

BassClef said:


> Anyone saying SSD is a replacement for RAM is poorly educated not the subject. Most VI users that have SSDs use external ones, where the SSD drive itself is a SATA3 type, connected to the pc via USB or Thunderbolt. I use a USB3 connection to my iMAC which is approximately the same transfer speed of my SATA3 SSDs, so I am getting "close to" as fast as I can get from the SSD drives. This loads my samples very quickly, plenty fast enough for nearly any VI use.
> 
> Now if you want to get the samples into your pc RAM even faster, you must give up SATA3 SSDs and get NVMe type SSD drives. These are more expensive but can transfer data up to 7 times faster than SATAe drives. However, you must have the propers NVMe sockets inside your pc to use them. (or you can get external ones and Thunderbolt III which is even more expensive) Most folks consider the NMVe SSDs as "overkill" when working with samples in a DAW and therefore purchase the SATA3 SSDs.
> 
> Hope this helps.


This is more or less my set up. Have you experienced any bottlenecks as you've increased the size of the SSDs? I haven't benchmarked it, but it seems that since I've moved from 1TB SSDs to 2TB SSDs that I occasionally have issues, especially if I'm drawing too many instruments from the same SSD. It's not anything like the old HD days but just occasional dropouts and the disk indicator in Kontakt hitting red. This doesn't happen with libraries on my 1 TB drives.


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## easyrider (May 29, 2020)

MarcHedenberg said:


> Yup. Using internal drives. About the only library I think that has benefitted is BBCSO, which does load in almost instantly now, but Kontakt still feels about the same.



Kontakt won’t see a speed increase in loading with Nvme drives...

@EvilDragon can explain it further....


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## babylonwaves (May 29, 2020)

BassClef said:


> (or you can get external ones and Thunderbolt III which is even more expensive)




i'm in the market. anybody has checked out those?






OWC Express 4M2


Four M.2 SSD bays with pure adrenaline inducing Thunderbolt 3 performance.




eshop.macsales.com


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## babylonwaves (May 29, 2020)

easyrider said:


> Kontakt won’t see a speed increase in loading with Nvme drives...


yes and no. instruments won't load faster, that's correct. but you can have more instruments from a single drive using a very small DFD buffer.


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## EvilDragon (May 29, 2020)

You could have that with a regular SSD too.


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## BassClef (May 29, 2020)

jbuhler said:


> This is more or less my set up. Have you experienced any bottlenecks as you've increased the size of the SSDs? I haven't benchmarked it, but it seems that since I've moved from 1TB SSDs to 2TB SSDs that I occasionally have issues, especially if I'm drawing too many instruments from the same SSD. It's not anything like the old HD days but just occasional dropouts and the disk indicator in Kontakt hitting red. This doesn't happen with libraries on my 1 TB drives.



I have not gone to larger SSDs but will likely soon.


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## babylonwaves (May 30, 2020)

EvilDragon said:


> You could have that with a regular SSD too.


yes, i guess so too. what I find attracting is that i wouldn't need a fan and it's smaller and lighter which is great for traveling.


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## EvilDragon (May 30, 2020)

Regular SSDs don't need a fan either (good ones).


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## BassClef (May 30, 2020)

Here's what I'm using... holds two 2-TB SATAIII SSDs... 4-TB total... no fan needed... small enough to be portable. https://eshop.macsales.com/item/OWC/MEMDC2KIT/


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## babylonwaves (May 30, 2020)

EvilDragon said:


> Regular SSDs don't need a fan either (good ones).


i'm not sure what a good one is but samsung 860s like a fan and sandisk SSDs even more. i have a thunder bay mini with 4x 2GB EVOs 860. the fan is off but those get fairly hot in summer, a bit to hot i'm afraid


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## EvilDragon (May 31, 2020)

If it's not over 70°C it is just fine really.


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## Traz (Mar 21, 2021)

Would anyone have suggestions on what external ssd's to buy?

Are the Samsung T5's worth it?


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## Jeremy Spencer (Mar 22, 2021)

Traz said:


> Would anyone have suggestions on what external ssd's to buy?
> 
> Are the Samsung T5's worth it?


Yes, they are great in my experience. I have two of them connected to USB 3 (just ordered a third unit), and they are very fast and reliable.


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## Nimrod7 (Mar 22, 2021)

Traz said:


> Would anyone have suggestions on what external ssd's to buy?
> 
> Are the Samsung T5's worth it?


If you're looking for speeds and you've Thunderbolt 3 go for the https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07GL8NF14/ref=twister_B07HFFFKW9?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1 (X5's) instead. 
Price is high tho...


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## Traz (Mar 22, 2021)

Nimrod7 said:


> If you're looking for speeds and you've Thunderbolt 3 go for the https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07GL8NF14/ref=twister_B07HFFFKW9?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1 (X5's) instead.
> Price is high tho...


Thanks for putting that on my radar, I had no idea about the X5.

Price is definitely a bit high for me at the moment but it might be something worth saving for after I get a T5 or T7 first. 

I'm in dire need of more drive space immediately because I'm running out of room quick.


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## jbuhler (Mar 22, 2021)

My experience has been the SATA SSDs running through USB 3 are more like commodities than any appreciable difference in quality. My expensive ones run great, but so do my cheap ones. (I've never gone for the ultra cheap, so can't speak to that.) And I haven't noticed any difference in speed among the various drives under the use for sample libraries. Samples are almost entirely reads, so that cuts down on potential issues. If you are doing video work or using the SSD for recording—anything that requires regular writing to the drive—the calculus might be different, but for sample libraries, I just haven't noticed any real difference.


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## Neutron Star (Mar 22, 2021)

BassClef said:


> Anyone saying SSD is a replacement for RAM is poorly educated not the subject. Most VI users that have SSDs use external ones, where the SSD drive itself is a SATA3 type, connected to the pc via USB or Thunderbolt. I use a USB3 connection to my iMAC which is approximately the same transfer speed of my SATA3 SSDs, so I am getting "close to" as fast as I can get from the SSD drives. This loads my samples very quickly, plenty fast enough for nearly any VI use.
> 
> Now if you want to get the samples into your pc RAM even faster, you must give up SATA3 SSDs and get NVMe type SSD drives. These are more expensive but can transfer data up to 7 times faster than SATAe drives. However, you must have the propers NVMe sockets inside your pc to use them. (or you can get external ones and Thunderbolt III which is even more expensive) Most folks consider the NMVe SSDs as "overkill" when working with samples in a DAW and therefore purchase the SATA3 SSDs.
> 
> Hope this helps.


I have NVME PCIE 4 and SATA 3 drives running internally and through USB3. Absolutely no detectable difference in load times. The software bottle necks load times. ( Kontakt and your DAW ) And Kontakt batch batch resave makes zero difference.


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