# Remic plugins?



## muk (Jun 19, 2014)

Does anybody know of any plugins that offer remic capabilities? I'd like to try it on the Dimension Strings, which in some situation might benefit from a different miced sound. It's just a guess though that it might help shape it's sound to my taste, so it would be nice if the plugin doesn't break the bank.
I know that Tascam's GigaPulse had such a feature, but that's out of production. Another very interesting plugin would be UAD Ocean Way Studios, but here you need UAD hardware to use it. Are there any other options?


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## R. Soul (Jun 19, 2014)

Antares Mic modeler efx. 
http://www.antarestech.com/products/det ... _Mod_EFX_5


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## Hannes_F (Jun 19, 2014)

There are lots of nebula libraries, the Henry Olonga libraries come to mind.

http://www.acustica-audio.com/
http://www.nebulapresets.com/

Not at all self-explaining though, you need much resilience


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## muk (Jun 19, 2014)

Thanks for the suggestions, I'll check these out.


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## wst3 (Jun 19, 2014)

it does much more than just re-mic, but have you considered the Ocean Way plugin from UA?

If you do not have a UAD card then I'd probably start with the Antares Mic Modeler. It does a great job of coloring a track, although I was never convinced that it sounded like the named microphone. That is not, necessarily, a complaint<G>!

And keep in mind that any of these tools are going to react differently to different libraries...


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## EastWest Lurker (Jun 19, 2014)

wst3 @ Thu Jun 19 said:


> it does much more than just re-mic, but have you considered the Ocean Way plugin from UA?
> 
> If you do not have a UAD card then I'd probably start with the Antares Mic Modeler. It does a great job of coloring a track, although I was never convinced that it sounded like the named microphone. That is not, necessarily, a complaint<G>!
> 
> And keep in mind that any of these tools are going to react differently to different libraries...



Mic Modeler is just an EQ but Ocean Way is the real deal IMHO.


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## muk (Jun 19, 2014)

The Ocean Way Studios plugin looks very interesting. But I'm not sure whether it justifies having to buy a UAD card as well.


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## wst3 (Jun 19, 2014)

(warning - this might come off wrong!!!!)

I think Ocean Way Studios is a fantastic reason to buy a UAD card. It is, by far, one of the most useful, and usable plug-ins I've had the good luck to stumble across!

The problem - such as it is - is that they have a number of plug-ins that fall into that category, and much like the potato chip of old... bet you can't buy just one.

Which is my way of letting you know that you may face temptations to buy additional plug-ins once you have the card...


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## Rob (Jun 19, 2014)

Does Ocean Way work with my old UAD1 card?


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## EastWest Lurker (Jun 19, 2014)

Rob @ Thu Jun 19 said:


> Does Ocean Way work with my old UAD1 card?



No.


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## wst3 (Jun 19, 2014)

Jay says "no"...

Bill says "sadly not"... 

the original card was pretty remarkable when it was released (mine was badged "Mackie"), but it ran its course. Back then they used a specialty graphics processor because none of the general purpose DSP chips would do what they wanted (probably a price point issue as well, I didn't work there, so I don't know the whole story.)

Anyway, the UAD-1 did a LOT, but I am certain that most of the recently developed plug-ins would cause it to scream in pain, might even let the magic smoke out<G>!

There was a deal, a while ago now, where you could trade your UAD-1 in on a UAD-2, you might call to see if they'd consider extending the offer. I kinda doubt it, but it might be worth at least an email???


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## re-peat (Jun 19, 2014)

Muk,

I suppose you’re still looking for ways to make the Dimension Strings sound a bit warmer, smoother and more ‘classical’, and less thin and rasping? And having explored most avenues available to you, you are now interested in finding out if, perhaps, mic modeling might be the answer?

You do what you have to of course, but if I may: bad idea (with a hint of desperation thrown in there as well, it seems to me, no?). 
And an even worse idea, I feel, is to listen to anyone who suggests that UAD’s OceanWay plugin is the way to go here. In my view and experience (granted, limited by the length of the trial period), this plugin is completely useless for the thing you hope to achieve.
(If I were you, I’d ask the people who swear by OceanWay’s power and magic, for an audio example which clearly illustrates in which way the OceanWay modeler can be beneficial to the sound sampled strings. I very much doubt that they’ll be able to come up with anything that will raise your hopes with regard to having found a solution to your DS-related problems.)

In my opinion, if you’re not happy with the sound of a stringslibrary, and remain unhappy after doing everything you can to master the library and make it your own, you have to accept that maybe you have purchased something which isn’t quite what you hoped it would be. And subsequently limit your use of the library to those things which you feel it does well, rather than keep trying to do everything with it (and thus increase your disappointment and frustrations).

Believe me, virtually re-mic-ing the DimensionStrings ― no matter how accomplished the remic software may be ― isn’t going to bring you one billionth of an inch closer to the sound which you hope to get from these strings.
The OceanWay plugin may have some uses ― though, frankly, I still haven’t heard any which supports the idea that it is an appealing proposition for orchestral mock-up purposes ― but narrowing the gap between dead, thin and harsh-sounding sampled strings, on the one hand, and lively, rich, warm and smooth-sounding real strings, on the other, definitely isn’t one of them.
Trying to remove some of the artificiality from samples by submitting them to yet another pass of artificiality (virtual mic modeling) may result in an interesting sound, yes, but certainly not a less artificial one.

_


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## muk (Jun 20, 2014)

Thanks for the words of caution Piet. Actually I find the sound of the Dimension Strings to be pretty shapable with reverb and eq. I'm just wondering if a remic plugin could support it. I'm still tweaking eq and reverb settings frequently, and this idea came to mind.

At this stage id doesn't make sense for me to buy an expensive plugin for this goal alone, though. I'm better off investing my time in the performances, learning the library, tweaking midi etc. It will make a bigger difference. And at some point I'll have to buy another strings library to have more flexibility soundwise. But if there was an inexpensive plugin I wouldn't have minded trying that as well.
It's true, I haven't heard the Ocean Way plugin on strings. I found some demos on drums where it sounds great. So that got me interested. But strings are a different matter of course. And the pricepoint is prohibiting at my stage.


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## EastWest Lurker (Jun 20, 2014)

I don't have any VSL strings other than those that come with the Kontakt library but here is what I have done:

I dragged in 5 Apple Loops for Vln 1, Vln 2, Vla, Cellos, and Basses. I swapped out the Logic plugins for Kontakts and loaded the old VSL strings. I then bounced them without the Ocean Way remic and with.

I am not going to post these on Soundcloud but if anyone wants to hear them, use their own ears and make their own assessment, email me at [email protected] and I will email them to you.

Maybe not night and day but at least "a billionth of an inch"  You decide.


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## muk (Jun 20, 2014)

Thank you Jay, I'm sure curious to hear the comparison. Sent you an email.


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## givemenoughrope (Jun 20, 2014)

I don't have DS nor any of these re-mic software packages (except for briefly trying the free Nebula version). I'm not trying to derail the thread or side with anyone when I say that I'm starting to realize (again) that when working with samples and plugins it is very difficult if not impossible to get the sound you want if it isn't there in its purest form from the start. All the re-micing, eq, saturation, parallel mult-buss compression, etc in the world can't inject life or fundamentally transform the sound of anything for the most part. Those are mixing tools to glue things together. Like a lot of things in life, they just are what they are. You can duct tape them together or sell them together as a lot, the good and the not so good (layering). And I'm not trying to bum you out on the expensive sample package you've purchased. I've heard some great demos from it (saxer). But, I've come to the same conclusion about LASS, Embertone, Adagio, EW solo strings, etc. They fit where they fit. I admit that I am no genius with eq, compression or reverb and I'm very eager to be shown what “magic” can be done with these kinds of tools (Nebula is very different and LASS's stage and color tool is pretty good too) as well as the re-micing stuff but for now I know that I’ve have spent (wasted?) way too much time trying to make a duck not a duck. It’s really the source that matters most especially if you are working quickly (as I should be right at this moment). 

I’m very ready and willing to have my mind changed even a little bit about this.


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## José Herring (Jun 20, 2014)

muk @ Thu Jun 19 said:


> Thanks for the words of caution Piet. Actually I find the sound of the Dimension Strings to be pretty shapable with reverb and eq. I'm just wondering if a remic plugin could support it. I'm still tweaking eq and reverb settings frequently, and this idea came to mind.
> 
> At this stage id doesn't make sense for me to buy an expensive plugin for this goal alone, though. I'm better off investing my time in the performances, learning the library, tweaking midi etc. It will make a bigger difference. And at some point I'll have to buy another strings library to have more flexibility soundwise. But if there was an inexpensive plugin I wouldn't have minded trying that as well.
> It's true, I haven't heard the Ocean Way plugin on strings. I found some demos on drums where it sounds great. So that got me interested. But strings are a different matter of course. And the pricepoint is prohibiting at my stage.



Though I haven't tried it, I think the best course for you would be to try to use impulse modeling to alter the sound of the strings.

It did work well for LASS in changing the sound of that library (for the record I find nothing wrong with original LASS if used well). 

Though using covolution and IRs does give a bit of a cloudy film to the sound. That being said though, only a few seem to notice it.

Research products like Forti/Serti and Ernest Cholakis impulses.

You could probably change the sound of the strings, but as Piet said you'll never get rid of the bland, expressionless sampling. :mrgreen: 

* Disclaimer. I stay away from almost all VSL samples so am no expert.

http://www.numericalsound.com/FortiSerti.html


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## EastWest Lurker (Jun 20, 2014)

I frequently write that comparing orchestral samples to an actual Orchestra is like comparing a picture of an attractive woman to the actual woman and that is true. That said, we can bring that picture into Photoshop and improve it greatly if we know how to use the tools and I am finding the Oceanway a useful tool for this.


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## woodsdenis (Jun 20, 2014)

I would also try the Melda AutodynamicEq. It's dynamic eq is a great tone shaping tool that is much more natural sounding than a simple eq. The Antares mic modeller was just eq curves right ? Also it will do a matching eq surprising well with a few tweaks, there is a demo for a couple of weeks I think.

I say this as a general observation as I don't own Dimension or Ocean way, however any plugin will only get you some of the way there, the sound of a sample is fundamentally what it is, and no amount of convolution processing at this point in time will instantly transform it.


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## re-peat (Jun 20, 2014)

I’m entirely with Givemeenoughrope and Denis' last sentence. I don’t believe in any of these things. Well, for narrowing the gap between artificial and real, I mean. (I fully embrace them for other purposes.) And until presented with an audio example that clearly shows a substantial improvement ― towards a more ‘believable’ sound, that is ― between the pre- and the post-processed sound, when applying any of these techniques or plug-ins, I’ll keep considering them the playground of self-delusional amateurs, deaf hacks and gullible people led astray by false claims, hype, misguiding endorsements or, saddest of all, opportunistic salesmen.

I’ve heard the Cholakis-treatment on samples. One word: awful. Two words: bloody awful. And I find LASS with its Stage&Colour-module a worse sounding product than the original naked LASS. I use LASS on occasion, and the first thing I do is switch off anything that tampers with its raw sound. All the quality and appeal which LASS has, for me, is entirely captured in its raw sound. Anything that messes with that (and impulse responses do just that), diminishes its appeal, I find.

Samples ― and I'm talking about their mediocre soundquality, and whatever faint traces of realism that they might still contain ― are fragile enough artificialities already, I find. Submitting them to yet more agressive and identity-robbing processing is, in my view, the quickest way to remove even the last hint of believablity that might still be there. Very, very careful EQ’ing is the farthest I would ever go (when remaining in the domain of hoping to have them sound ‘real’, that is).



EastWest Lurker @ Fri Jun 20 said:


> I frequently write that comparing orchestral samples to an actual Orchestra is like comparing a picture of an attractive woman to the actual woman and that is true.(...)


No, it isn’t. Very, very bad metaphor actually. A much better one would be: a stop-motion animation made with 72dpi images of 3D-rendered female (doesn’t have to be an attractive one) versus a highres 48 frames-per-second video of a flesh-and-blood female, with both females going through the same motions.
Leaving aside the intrinsic artificiality of the 3D-rendering itself and, in complete contrast, the obvious realism of the real woman, the key here is the huge difference in image-resolution, image data and fluent motion dynamic. A difference that just can be processed ‘away’ with even the most sophisticated techniques. In order to narrow the gap between the artificial and the real, you would have to have software which magically invents all those huge amounts of missing data (and we're talking hugely huge amounts), and is able to do that in a completely believable way, and such software simply doesn’t exist. And even assuming that it does exist (in some top-secret high-tech military research facility or something), it certainly isn’t available in a plug-in.

Again, if a sample-library disappoints timbrally and keeps doing so after thorough studying it and, maybe, expert EQ’ing, you have to accept that it is what it is. Because there’s nothing you can do about it.
I find myself in the same situation with Spitfire’s Mural. Bought it blindly ― after having bought so much excellence from Spitfire, I just assumed it would be another triumphant bull’s eye (and I don’t doubt that for many people it is) ―, but discovered, after installation and thorough familiarization, that it is just not quite my kind of stringslibrary. It’s spitfirishly great and all that, of course it is, but there is something about its sound and character that makes it, alas, somewhat ill-suited for most of my music. And there’s nothing I can do about that. Cause Mural is Mural and no impulse modeling or re-mic-ing or whatever can change that (and whatever change these processes bring about are all for the worse anyway.) So now, I keep Mural aside for those jobs where I know its sound and its identity will fit.

Which is what I suggest Muk should do with the Dimension Strings: get to know its identity and its naked strengths and wait for those moments when these strengths can be applied to the benefit of the music. But don’t hope to change the Dimension Strings into something which they’re not. It’s impossible. And every attempt at doing so will result in a worse sound. And the timbral territory that these strings don’t cover, you’ll have to try and conquer with other samples.

_


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## José Herring (Jun 21, 2014)

Like I said. I've never tried any of that stuff. Don't believe in it. But, am curious if any of it works.

I do think though that, though LASS stage sounded pretty bad, if you turn the stage part off and just had the color part, there are a few impulses that caught my ear.


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## EastWest Lurker (Jun 21, 2014)

There is no point in my responding respond to most of Piet's comments, because he lives in a world where everything is either _great_ or _awful_ and I do not. But I never said Oceanway in anyway is useful for "narrowing the gap between artificial and real" because when it comes to composing with samples, I don't worry about that because they are _not_ real. They just are _not_, regardless of which metaphor one thinks is apt. I will stick with mine.

I _do_ think that frequently Oceanway makes the samples sound better.


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## wst3 (Jun 21, 2014)

While it is obvious this has become an exercise in "it is either perfect of bloody awful", I'd suggest that those who are interested read Jay's post carefully.

And I'm guilty of hyperbole - with respect to this thread as well, so let me re-state...

I find that the Ocean Way Studios plugin, in either mode, can add a very pleasant color to many different recordings.

It was many months before I thought to try it on sample library tracks, the basic concept seemed flawed. And my first attempts were in fact quite disappointing.

Eventually I did stumble across a working combination, and I think it's nice.

Does it sound like A-list players in the Ocean Way rooms? I don't know, because I never recorded A-list players at Ocean Way.

Does it sound 'cool'? Absolutely. I'm not sure I'd use the term "realistic" since my experiences suggests that recordings made with sample libraries always have a tell - and it is up to the composer, arranger/orchestrator, mixer, and producer to create a recording that is so compelling that I don't bother to pay attention to the factors that might otherwise give it away.

As to the physics of why some tracks are more convincing (note I did not say realistic) when processed with Ocean Way Studios, well, that remains a mystery to me.

To those that are still reading... 

one of the 'tricks' that I find helpful when using Ocean Way Studios is to start with a track that has little or no ambiance. Sometimes that is as simple as turning off the built in reverb. Sometimes it requires a plug-in like Zynaptiq Unveil - which is an entirely different bit of magic.

the other 'trick' is to place the entire ensemble in the room at once (this also saves on CPU usage<G>). And use the plug-in as an insert instead of a send.

I think you'll find the results useful, but it may take a few passes before you get the hang of it. Be patient.

post-script: I believe that Jay will confirm that he was initially very skeptical - and I had to badger him a bit to give it another try. And actually, I don't think he ever believed me, but rather another friend of his changed his mind. I hope I remembered that accurately.


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## re-peat (Jun 21, 2014)

EastWest Lurker @ Sat Jun 21 said:


> There is no point in my responding respond to most of Piet's comments, because he lives in a world where everything is either _great_ or _awful_ and I do not. (...)


Jay, you still reading me so poorly, and that after all these years since the Gods of the World Wide Web have decided to make our online paths cross, is a bit of disappointment, I have to say. With me it is NOT “either great or awful” (anyone who thinks that way using samples is a complete idiot, as far as I’m concerned, and in urgent need of medical attention) and I’m even less of a believer in mock-reality than you are. I thought you knew that.

The sole reason for my presence in this thread and for saying what I said, is because I think I know what Muk is looking for: believable strings that work (and convince) in a sort of classical or neo-classical idiom. That’s what most of his recent threads have been about anyway: is it possible, with samples and in-the-box-processing, to create convincing strings in ‘the classical style’.
And with that in mind, and ONLY with that, I feel it makes sense to warn him against re-micing, impulseresponsifying or any suchlike trickery (even if it is called UAD Ocean Way), cause my experience tells me that that sure isn’t the way to get anywhere near a convincing ‘powdered wig’ kind of timbre and/or performance with sampled strings. If anything, it makes the distance even bigger.

I don’t doubt that OceanWay has its uses, I’m even willing to imagine, though it requires a gargantuan effort on my part, some possible use for the poor-sounding IR’s that Mr. Cholakis keeps turning up with, but neither of those, nor anything else based on similar techniques, is going to be of any help to Muk. (If I’m wrong, prove it. And, please, be courageous and confident enough to prove it in public, instead of through private channels.)

Trying to help Muk in a thread started by Muk concerning a very specific problem clearly outlined by Muk, AND knowing what Muk is hoping to achieve with his Dimension Strings, means to me: going against anyone who is trying to lure him the ocean way. And that’s all there is to it, as far as I'm concerned.
How I (or you) feel about samples is entirely irrelevant here, it's how Muk hopes to be able to feel, which matters.

_


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## EastWest Lurker (Jun 21, 2014)

It might be more helpful, Piet, if you responded to what he actually asked:

_"Does anybody know of any plugins that offer remic capabilities? I'd like to try it on the Dimension Strings, which in some situation might benefit from a different miced sound. It's just a guess though that it might help shape it's sound to my taste."_

Nowhere does he say _"make it believable strings that work (and convince) in a sort of classical or neo-classical idiom."_

Had he said that, I would not have responded with my suggestion because the plugin does indeed _not_ accomplish that.

But "shape its sound more to his taste" it might very well do. Which is why I created an example for him to listen to.


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## givemenoughrope (Jun 21, 2014)

So, we're talking about injecting life into something (samples) OR using re-micing, eq, etc. for mixing purposes. I'm saying that I (not a scientist) can't get them to liven up samples (they are as alive and limiting (Adagio) or dead and versatile (the others) as they are already) nor can I (not a mix wizard) get them to fundamentally transform the sound. I can back add or back off 4k, low cut, parallel limit(?), etc. to get things to fit better but that's it really. I can pump them through a spring reverb or through a speaker to give them some real room. I can use them where they fit and not where they don't. I can actually write well and program well (jury is out on that still). I can SOMETIMES blend/layer them. (I did this recently with Adagio and LASS divisi's when the former sounded great but was a bit sluggish for the part). That is all I can do really atm. When someone posts a tutorial or how to re-mic, eq and blend any string library in order to play to the strengths of them all then I'll be interested. 

I thought LASS stage and color was a great idea. I never use stage and color was ok but dropped the volume too much in addition to being a cpu hog.


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## EastWest Lurker (Jun 21, 2014)

"We" may all be talking about different things. I am no scientist "but "injecting life into" is way too vague and subjective a term for even me to deal with.

I talk about, and I ONLY talk about, making them sound better to my ears, and by extension, to my clients' That's it. All. Finito. End of tale.


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## givemenoughrope (Jun 21, 2014)

By that I mean dynamics, subtleties, "air" frequencies. I guess the last one is where it would crossover into changing the sound. 

I'm all for anything that makes for things sounding better or to blend. I'm not saying that anyone trying these plugins is barking up the wrong tree entirely. I think they have their place. For instance, if there is a way to get Adagio to blend with Sprifire Solo Strings or Embertone not only in timbre but in the close reflections of the wettest room (SF) then out with it ffs! I can't get that to happen so I've given up.


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## EastWest Lurker (Jun 21, 2014)

givemenoughrope @ Sat Jun 21 said:


> By that I mean dynamics, subtleties, "air" frequencies. I guess the last one is where it would crossover into changing the sound.
> 
> I'm all for anything that makes for things sounding better or to blend. I'm not saying that anyone trying these plugins is barking up the wrong tree entirely. I think they have their place. For instance, if there is a way to get Adagio to blend with Sprifire Solo Strings or Embertone not only in timbre but in the close reflections of the wettest room (SF) then out with it ffs! I can't get that to happen so I've given up.



Maybe you are more exacting than I am. I take a good reverb like QL Spaces (or two, adding UAD Plate 140 for gloss) send all my string libraries (HS KH CSII, and/or Sonic Implants and/or Spotlight Stings and/or Embertone Vln and Cello, and/or EWQLSO on occasion) to them. If the library is wetter I send very little. If it is drier, I send more. 

For my taste, it blends fine and as far as sampled strings go, it sounds fine. Sometimes I add some analog patches from Solid State Symphony or Omnisphere. The Ocean Way re-micing is the latest addition to the process but I am going to beta test Spat 64 it as well.

The main thing that i like is that the end result, which some might like and some might hate, is that my sampled string sound is MY sampled string sound and does not suffer from the (for me) dreaded "it sounds like everyone else."


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## re-peat (Jun 21, 2014)

EastWest Lurker @ Sat Jun 21 said:


> It might be more helpful, Piet, if you responded to what he actually asked.


I'm responding based on what I know Muk is looking for. Perhaps they failed to grab your attention or interest, but most of Muk's threads of the past few months, including one where he presented a piece of his in the Members Composition section, have all been indicative of a strong desire to be able to create convincing 'classical sounding' strings, and if possible find a solution which includes the Dimension Strings. Unless I'm very much mistaken, this thread is only the latest avenue of many he has been exploring.
I don't know which is more helpful: me taking all of this in consideration and expressing an informed word of caution, or you singing the praises of a plug-in which is of no use whatsoever to bring Muk closer to his goal.

_


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## EastWest Lurker (Jun 21, 2014)

re-peat @ Sat Jun 21 said:


> EastWest Lurker @ Sat Jun 21 said:
> 
> 
> > It might be more helpful, Piet, if you responded to what he actually asked.
> ...



I have not been paying attention to and cataloguing his desires. I don't know him from an apple strudel. I responded to a _specific_ question he asked with a _specific_ answer, which is best because perhaps the only thing you and I will ever agree on is the lack of attainability of anything significantly broader.


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## renegade (Jun 21, 2014)

Not exactly what you are asking for...but, if you haven't got it already, Fabfilters EQ is excellent for modifying color. It's MS capabilities are particularly useful IMO. I use it all the time


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## muk (Jun 22, 2014)

Jay, I'll bring you an apple strudel with vanilla sauce next time I'm in LA.
Thanks all, some interesting suggestions and warnings here. By the way, I liked what the Ocean Way plugin did on Jay's little demo. But for now, I'll go with the tools I have, and use my money towards more samples eventually. I've just realize that there's a remic tool in Magix Indepence. I'm experimenting with that to see what it can and cannot do.


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## Peter Alexander (Jun 22, 2014)

I have DS, so here are my observations.

First, Piet is right in the sense that DS has their own sound. But then, as Piet wrote about Mural some place, they have their own sound, too, as do all the libraries. 

1. If you have VI Pro, Load the L1_Art Control matrix for Violins. 

2. After it loads click the Advanced tab.

3. Select pLeV

4. On the right side of the VIP, click the Mixer tab if it's not highlighted first.

5. Now look at the pan settings per slot. The pattern is narrow, wider, wider, and wider for the 8 violins. By taking this approach, 8 VSL violins sound thicker and larger than 8 violins. 

6. As an experiment, set the pan knobs for that one program to C (center).

Play the keyboard and you'll hear a thinner sound. 

I don't have a mic modeling program, but I have done some experiments in shaping the sound. 

If you have FORTI/SERTI, the brighter 01 tilt filters will thin the sound a bit and move them back slightly from stage front. You can then add an early reflection to put more room into it. For panning, use power pan in the Vienna Ensemble. 

That's one approach.

A second approach, and the one I favor at this point, is using DS with Spat. I created a room called Bab's Place based on the Sony/MGM scoring stage. I spatially place by distance, Violins through Cellos at 3.25 meters (based on benchmarking DS to a Goldsmith recording of the Salamander theme). I set the basses at 3.5. 

I now have a close to the recording string positioning.

I then use Aperture in Spat to further narrow the stereo width. Then under Perceptual Factors work with Source Brilliance and Room Presence. I then turn OFF the reverb in Spat and then add B2 Medium Wide Hall which has a similar dimension to Abby Road Studio 1. I've also tried using from FORTI/SERTI the Darker 01 Tilt Filter which I find adds a little more depth to the string sound. 

I'm sorry, I don't have the UAD card and at this point have no need for it, as Spat covers a lot of need for me.

HTH


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## g.c. (Jun 25, 2014)

Off the topic, with nothing implied but considerable interest to hear, is there a means, a link , a web page, through which to hear some of "Re-peats" sample recordings. Have tried googling the Vi name without success. 
Thank you
g.c.


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