# New string library -- announcing la scoring strings (lass)



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

Hi Everyone,

I am pleased to announce that *LA Scoring Strings*, a new paradigm in string libraries, will be exhibited at the Art Vista booth (booth # 6427) at the NAMM show from January 15th -18th.

I’ll be demonstrating the library myself and look forward to seeing many of you there. 

Below is a description of the library... it will be released in Kontakt format (unlocked editing, but locked samples and scripts). This library is in its final stages of development and demos will be posted soon after the NAMM show. Also, the price has yet to be determined... that too will be determined soon after the NAMM show.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


*LA Scoring Strings* (LASS) brings a whole new level of expressiveness, realism and real-time playability to sampled strings. 

At the heart of its revolutionary sound are Real Legato performance sample patches and a unique "layered ensemble" approach. These ensembles were all recorded individually in a large film scoring studio. Because they're made up of different players (avoiding the dreaded "same player" sound), the ensembles combine seamlessly to produce entirely cohesive small, medium, or large sections with the right divisi ratios. 

LASS also features solo instruments performed by the section leaders. Rather than sounding like "guest soloists," these instruments sound like the first chair players they actually are, blending perfectly with the sections they come from. 

The players are recorded in position on the scoring stage and mixed in the traditional orchestral seating perspective, making it simple to get a magnificent string mix out of the box. Meanwhile we took the utmost care to ensure that the instruments can be panned anywhere with virtually no phasing problems should you need to do that. 

And to make it easy to get just the right sound, all LASS patches and programming are consistent from the first chair to the full mix. If a part sounds right using the first chair patch, the same sequence will sound right with the full ensemble—no MIDI reprogramming should be required. 

The result is unprecedented control over dynamics, performance, and section size.

*
Featured LASS Scripts*
_Note that these are just 3 of many scripts._

*LASS Real Legato* — REAL legato performance samples — meticulously programmed and scripted for non repetitive legato transitions and real-time control of legato articulations.
*A.R.T. *(Auto Rhythm Tool) — an advanced (yet simple to use) rhythm and accents script with humanization features.
*Trill Script* — the script intelligently triggers trills diatonically in any key with just 1 Key Switch.


*List of articulations:*
_There will be over 40+ legato patches (different performances) that in-and-of-themselves are like premium virtual instruments. Note that “L” means Legato, “P” means Portamento and “G” means Glissando. All dynamic layers are controllable in real-time via mod wheel (CC1)._


Espressivo Real Legato LPG 
Espressivo Real Legato LP
Espressivo Real Legato L
Espressivo Real Legato P
Espressivo Real Legato G
Espressivo Sustains
Non Vibrato Sustains
Staccatos (with Intelligent 4 x round robin and random modes as well as A.R.T. — Automatic Rhythm Tool)
Spiccatos (with Intelligent 4 x round robin and random modes as well as A.R.T. — Automatic Rhythm Tool)
Pizzicato (with Intelligent round robin as well as A.R.T. — Automatic Rhythm Tool)
Tremolos (with multiple dynamics)
Trills Maj/Min (with multiple dynamics and Trill Tool that allows diatonic performance of trills in any key)
Con Sordino (with "formant correct" legato)
Harmonics (Natural and Artificial)
Bartok Pizzicatos for Basses


*Instruments and sections:*


*Violins*
1 player First Chair
4 players ensemble A
4 players ensemble B
8 players ensemble C
16 players full section mix

*Violas*
1 player First Chair
3 players ensemble A
3 players ensemble B
6 players ensemble C
12 players full section mix

*Cellos*
1 player First Chair
3 players ensemble A
3 players ensemble B
4 players ensemble C
10 players full section mix

*Basses*
1 player First Chair
2 players ensemble A
2 players ensemble B
4 players ensemble C
8 player full section mix


----------



## rJames (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

I assume this is the lib that Craig has been talking about.

How much is this baby gonna set us back?


----------



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*



rJames @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> I assume this is the lib that Craig has been talking about.
> 
> How much is this baby gonna set us back?



Yeah... Craig mentioned this library.

This will be very fairly priced... the pricing still has to be determined, it won't be a dirt cheep library, but it won't have an an elitist pricing either. I'll know more in the weeks to come after the NAMM show.


----------



## John DeBorde (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

$? format? (K2 I would assume).

congrats! can't wait to check them out.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*



John DeBorde @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> $? format? (K2 I would assume).
> 
> congrats! can't wait to check them out.



ooops... yeah... Kontakt format.. will update the announcement.


----------



## rJames (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*



Thonex @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> I'll know more in the weeks to come after the NAMM show.



I guess this answers my next question as to whether it is ready for shipment or not. :cry:


----------



## TheoKrueger (Jan 10, 2009)

Thank you very much for the heads up, this is very good news.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*



rJames @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> Thonex @ Sat Jan 10 said:
> 
> 
> > I'll know more in the weeks to come after the NAMM show.
> ...



Not yet... but soon... and I don't mean "like in 1 year soon" :D


----------



## José Herring (Jan 10, 2009)

I can finally talk.

Great Job Andrew. Look forward to checking it out at NAMM.

Jose


----------



## wqaxsz (Jan 10, 2009)

Hi Thonex,

can't wait to hear demos of it in 2 or 3 weeks !!!

cheers

Laurent


----------



## Fernando Warez (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

The concept sounds perfect, T. ...Almost like a dream come true.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*



Folmann @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> Hail to the King! This is amazing and coming from you ... We should expect the very best!
> 
> Any FX?



Thanks Troels :D 

Re: FX... There are no FX except for Bartok Pizzicatos. I had to draw the line somewhere... if I was going to do FX it would have been comprehensive.... and I didn't want to take any focus away from the legato, portamento, and glissando session schedule. Also, other libraries cover that pretty well.

Basically, I created this library based on what I felt I was missing in my own string template. I pretty much own all the major libraries but have always felt the need for more expressive strings and better/tighter spics and stacs... the real meat if you will. So that's pretty much how I came up with my articulation list. I'm guessing if I needed these.. that probably most other midi composers would.


----------



## synthetic (Jan 10, 2009)

Looks good, can't wait to hear it. Any divisi?


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

*faints*

*wakes up*

Sweet. I look forward to hearing it. 

What will distribution be like for us here in Europe?

[EDIT] Arg... demos AFTER namm... :(

How dare you announce it now!


----------



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

synthetic @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> Any divisi?



Yes... the whole concept is based on recording 2 quarter sections and a half section... which combined created a whole section.

So, for example, violins are 4+4+8 = 16. All the articulations listed are programmed for EACH smaller ensemble... so you can create the size ensemble you want by layering patches (with all *different* players.... I can't emphasize enough the importance of that)... or if you want a full section... you'll have a full mix patch.

Let's not forget about the First Chair too.


----------



## Sovereign (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

How will you be distributing the lib? Could you give any indication of the price range? I'm especially interested in the cellos and violins, demos please. :mrgreen:


----------



## Justus (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

Sounds like the lib we all are looking for.


----------



## tfishbein82 (Jan 10, 2009)

Thonex @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> synthetic @ Sat Jan 10 said:
> 
> 
> > Any divisi?
> ...


Any auto-divisi scripting though?

Also, will the samples be locked? Programming locked? What access will we have to configure the instruments?


----------



## Przemek K. (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

Congratulations are in order 

Any demos ?...apart the demo from Craig, which sounded fantastic.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*



Sovereign @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> How will you be distributing the lib? Could you give any indication of the price range? I'm especially interested in the cellos and violins, demos please. :mrgreen:



I know how eager all of you are for price ranges. But your answer is in fact in your question. I'm not 100% sure what the distribution will be until after NAMM... and therefor the pricing is still up in the air. 

Distribution will be via DVDs.. if that's your question. I think the library is hovering around 30 gigs of sample data. But again... I'll know more after NAMM.


----------



## sevaels (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

o-[][]-o 

Yes man, and by Thonex? Can't wait to hear it.

Congrats man!


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*



Przemek K. @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> Congratulations are in order
> 
> Any demos ?...*apart the demo from Craig, which sounded fantastic.*



link?


----------



## wqaxsz (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

hi, 

i think here
http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11178


and there 

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11245

regards


----------



## Simon Ravn (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

Interesting 8) I wonder how this'll sound. Hard to judge really from Craigs demo, but hopefully it'll be good.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*



Simon Ravn @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> Interesting 8) I wonder how this'll sound. Hard to judge really from Craigs demo, but hopefully it'll be good.



yeah... those are not official demos by any means... especially since not all the patches have been given out yet. but I reckon in the next few weeks you'll start to hear things.


----------



## Przemek K. (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

Thats good to hear. I like how the "sordinos" sounded in the Soprano Sax demo
by Craig, so I'm eager to listen to the rest of this library. Very eager.


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*



Simon Ravn @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> Interesting 8) I wonder how this'll sound. Hard to judge really from Craigs demo, but hopefully it'll be good.



Using LASS has been great but it still was (is) not ready for prime time demos so I put these up just for a taste of it. As you can see it is a real working library even at this stage.


----------



## synergy543 (Jan 10, 2009)

Sounds like nice intimate divisi on Craig's demo.

Congratulations guys!


----------



## FireGS (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

Any mention of Dynamics and being able to control them?


----------



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*



FireGS @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> Any mention of Dynamics and being able to control them?




There is full control of dynamics. This has been a very important thing for me. There are 4 layers of dynamics for all legato patches (except 3 for basses). You can control the actual performed dynamics via CC1. Of course you have additional control of volume with CC11... and further with CC7.

One thing I did not mention is these patches were specially programmed to not have the x-fade layer "build-up" affect you have on traditional x-fade patches. In other words, when you play the solo violin and you ride CC1 to control ppp through fff samples, you will virtually not hear any phasing or doubling. The same holds true for all ensemble patches, so the patches retain a natural open sound without sounding like they're being doubled or phasing. 

This is not done with any "sample modeling" technique... all the samples and recordings are left pristine and "au naturale".


----------



## handz (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

This looks like great lib! lòº­   ÞÝº­   ÞÞº­   Þßº­


----------



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

Leon Willett @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> Hi Thonex  So, how did it turn out? Are you happy with your samples?
> 
> Exciting stuff!


_
"So, how did it turn out? "_

Great. I was fairly sure the concept was going to work before the sessions... and then after the sessions as I started creating the patches... I had a big smile on my face because it was meeting (if not exceeding) my expectations.

"Are you happy with your samples? "

Very. You'll see in a few weeks :D


----------



## Rob Elliott (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*

Congrats Thonex - very exciting for you (and us). 

Might I make one suggestion on the 'demos' - For sure have a full blown one or two but I get more out of 'out of the box' - SOLO'd patches. This is where the rubber hits the road for me. From there I'll be able to determine how much programming, EQ, doubling, etc. to get various sounds/styles, etc.

If they are stark naked dry (no verb or EQ) even better (sorry for the reference - I know this is a family friendly forum) :oops: .


I think your buying public is at a very mature stage of the product cycle (string samples) - hearing solo'd demos such as this, IMHO - will result in more sales. (I can't tell you on how many libraries I passed on this year becuase I could hear a brilliant demo maker 'writing around the libraries' weaknesses) 

Like you, I have many of the major string libraries and know what they all sound like with NO eq, hours of programming, etc.

Of course, this strategy can be a bit risky if the product is average at best, but from what I hear on Craig's demo - I think it will be well above (in expressiveness and tone) than the existing libraries available.

Just something to consider.

All the best fortunes for you and yours.


Rob


----------



## Rob Elliott (Jan 10, 2009)

*Re: NEW STRING LIBRARY -- announcing LA Scoring Strings*



Thonex @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> Rob Elliott @ Sat Jan 10 said:
> 
> 
> > Congrats Thonex - very exciting for you (and us).
> ...




Thanks for the reply Andrew. Looking forward to hearing them.


Rob


----------



## Hannes_F (Jan 10, 2009)

Looking forward to it!


----------



## Jack Weaver (Jan 10, 2009)

Look forward to seeing both you & your great new product @ NAMM.

Finally, what looks to be a luscious-sounding string lib. 

Congrats for what looks like an overnite success (based upon years of hard work)!

Is brass next?


----------



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

Thanks Jack... thanks for the kind words.



Jack Weaver @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> Is brass next?



:lol: yeah.. I'll have that for you tomorrow morning :wink:


----------



## Jack Weaver (Jan 10, 2009)

No that's fine. 

I can wait for NAMM. I won't have time to install brass before then.


----------



## clonewar (Jan 10, 2009)

I'm really interested in this announcement. I know that there's a lot more information to come but am very curious about the function and playability of the legato and the overall sound of the library. I've been thinking about getting the VSL Appassionata library, I want the big lush strings with recorded legato to blend with EWQLSO. Is LASS capable of that same kind of sound? 

Hmm.... I was really getting close to pulling the trigger on Appassionata.. I might just have to wait and see what interesting things come out of NAMM first..


----------



## Hal (Jan 10, 2009)

i beleive am getting this for the LPG feature and the divisi two good reason..
there isnt much articulations/dynamics sampled tho my decision will be based on the

Price and demos then

this is crazy i just bought two string librarys this might be the third in a month !


----------



## Thonex (Jan 10, 2009)

Hi Clonewar,

The playability of the legato patches are one of the highlights of this library IMO. A lot of thought went into the script to intelligently trigger the varying legato performances based on the velocity with which you play the legato notes. 




clonewar @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> I want the big lush strings with recorded legato to blend with EWQLSO. Is LASS capable of that same kind of sound?



Lushness was one of the things I was going after... in addition to the recorded legato. Because of the varying sizes of the ensembles, I think it will be ideal for layering with anything... although, I designed this library to, in essence, to layer with itself... and great effort was put into consistency from 1 patch to the next... so they would all play well together as a section.

Cheers,

T


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jan 10, 2009)

Is there any kind of RR in the legato? I mean if I play the same two of three notes continuosly. 

4 layer legato sounds great. I'm REALLY looking forward to hearing it. In addition to dry and live recordings be sure to also make some 'final' tracks so we can hear what they sound like in a well produced track. 

I wish I was going to namm!  Someone record something!


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Hal @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> i beleive am getting this for the LPG feature and the divisi two good reason..



Thanks Hal.. much appreciated.




Hal @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> there isnt much articulations/dynamics sampled tho



I'm not sure I follow you. There are lots of dynamics (all patches have multiple dynamics.. and all short articulations have multiple dynamics and multiple Round Robins)... maybe I'm not understanding you though... could you explain a little more so perhaps I can answer a little more clearly?

Cheers,

T


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Christian Marcussen @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Is there any kind of RR in the legato? I mean if I play the same two of three notes continuosly.
> 
> 4 layer legato sounds great. I'm REALLY looking forward to hearing it. In addition to dry and live recordings be sure to also make some 'final' tracks so we can hear what they sound like in a well produced track.



There is intelligent randomization of the legato if the user wants. So, the legato samples will not be the same consecutively. There are various settings that can be enabled and disabled in real-time.. this is one of them.. so is legato on/off (among other things). 

Also, you can play chords in legato mode if the notes are played within a user definable window of time (default 25 ms). So you can play double-stop violin parts (for example) and then seamlessly transition into a legato line and the script intelligently does it without you doing anything.

Of course when the official demos are released... there will be finished demos and featured patch demos so you'll be able to hear things in isolation and mixed.


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jan 11, 2009)

Great stuff Andrew. Seems like you thought of it all :D

How long have you been at this? Who are you collaborating with - Hans?


----------



## midphase (Jan 11, 2009)

Is this a DVZ killer?


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Christian Marcussen @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Great stuff Andrew. Seems like you thought of it all :D



It's impossible to think of it all... but I tried to address the things that were missing in my orchestral string template... which brings up a point I didn't mention. I intend this library to be a "living" library... in other words, as I do shows or come up with new patches, I intend on posting the patches. I'm always coming up with new ideas... and by posting the new patches I think it will make the library a living/growing one.



Christian Marcussen @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> How long have you been at this? Who are you collaborating with - Hans?


 :lol: heh... too long. I had to fit it in between gigs. This is my production and was not a collaboration, although the testers were great in feedback and support, so I really felt like I had a team with me.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

midphase @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Is this a DVZ killer?



C'mon midphase  I can't comment on that. 

This is a completely different concept. And to be 100% honest, I have never heard the DVZ library. There is no "auto divisi" in LASS. I did not even want to tackle that. Plus that's not the way I write. I tend to play the lines in 1 at a time for divisi type writing.

Also, this library is heavily focused on legato samples, staccato RR and spiccato RR with lots of dynamics, and expressive sustains with 4 dynamic layers. Good ol' fashioned sampling with a few tricks up my sleeve.


----------



## Sovereign (Jan 11, 2009)

Hi Thonex,

A question here. How did you implement the legato samples? Are recorded intervals layered beneath sustains, or did you record the full destination notes like VSL? As for legato samples not being the same consecutively, are these actual different recordings or is it just switching between the nearest recorded sample?


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Sovereign @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Hi Thonex,
> 
> A question here. How did you implement the legato samples? Are recorded intervals layered beneath sustains, or did you record the full destination notes like VSL?



Hi soverign, :D 

for obvious reason, I can't say "how" I did things. But I'll say that it's not done in the same way you described VSL doing it. But that's all I'll say. :wink: Although, I'm not sure how VSL has done things in their most recent releases.


ok... I'm off to bed. I'm glad I announced this during the weekend before NAMM... this way I can answer any questions before I'm gone for NAMM. I'll be less available during NAMM so Ill try to check in here the next few days.

Cheers,

T


----------



## germancomponist (Jan 11, 2009)

Great news, Congratulation!

...amd a great concept, too! I will look forward to it. 

Gunther


----------



## Dynamitec (Jan 11, 2009)

> for obvious reason, I can't say "how" I did things.










Andrew, i waited so long to use this in your thread, too 
:mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:


----------



## IvanP (Jan 11, 2009)

Excellent news, Andrew, really looking forward to it


----------



## dogforester (Jan 11, 2009)

Sorry to go somewhat off topic here, but Thonex you have the most annoying signature, I fall for it every time ! :oops: :mrgreen: Fingerprints all over my screen.LOL.

Anyway congrats on the new library, Looking forward to it.


----------



## TheoKrueger (Jan 11, 2009)

I really like the divisi idea!! 8+4+4 = 18. Awesome!


----------



## Rodney Glenn (Jan 11, 2009)

Congratulations Andrew! o-[][]-o 

This exciting news indeed. Considering the specs/concept mentioned and the fact that Thonex is the developer, this lib has huge potential.

Can't wait to hear the demos.  

Cheers

Rodney


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Dynamitec @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> > for obvious reason, I can't say "how" I did things.
> 
> 
> Andrew, i waited so long to use this in your thread, too
> :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen:



:lol: I only quote the best :mrgreen: 






Rodney Glenn @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Congratulations Andrew! o-[][]-o
> 
> This exciting news indeed. Considering the specs/concept mentioned and the fact that Thonex is the developer, this lib has huge potential.
> 
> ...



Thanks for the kind words Rodney... no pressure right??? :lol: 





Ashermusic @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Good luck with this Andrew. My only reservation is that it is yet another Kontakt based library, but perhaps when Kontkat goes 64 bit, it will be better behaved.




Thanks Jay  

With regards to Kontakt, I have no choice but to use Kontakt because the LASS Real Legato patches are very deeply scripted. I'm not aware of any other platform that would be able to deliver what I need. 

Also,for example, even for something as simple as trills, I wrote a script that will trigger the appropriate diatonic trill (major or minor) in any key. Even something as simple as that (but I've never seen anyone else do it) I would only be able to do in Kontakt.

What other choice do I have?


Cheers,

T


----------



## Ashermusic (Jan 11, 2009)

Andrew, I fully understand that for what you are doing at this point, there is no alternative to Kontakt.

Which is not a healthy situation IMHO.


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Jan 11, 2009)

It really is no different than its ever been. You could only put one giga on a machine or one Kontakt pretty full before the machine gave out. The problem is we see the potential for much more and it has not happened. fortunately we can use Play,VSL or EXS if you are logic based to handle some of the load but software samplers have yet to be memory friendly. It still is multiple machines till Native figures this out if they even want to.


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jan 11, 2009)

Can you elaborate a bit on the full section mix, as opposed to the 8+4+4 mix?


----------



## rJames (Jan 11, 2009)

Did you record up and down strokes?


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Christian Marcussen @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Can you elaborate a bit on the full section mix, as opposed to the 8+4+4 mix?



Yes.... and good question. The full mix patches are a stereo mix-down of the smaller ensembles that constitute the section. Obviously it doesn't afford you the control and variety of sound that you'd get from the simultaneously played individual smaller ensembles, but many people will like to have 1 full mix patch.

[EDIT] Just to be clear, the First Chair is not mixed into the Full mix patches. This could cause phasing if you wanted to add a First Chair player to double/accentuate the part.



rJames @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Did you record up and down strokes?



Yes. 2 of each.


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jan 11, 2009)

Fantastic... Btw... regarding my question about RR legato. If I play two notes back an forth, will I be playing the same two samples?


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Christian Marcussen @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Fantastic... Btw... regarding my question about RR legato. If I play two notes back an forth, will I be playing the same two samples?



Not if you don't want to. That's a user selectable option that can be switched in real-time.


----------



## mikebarry (Jan 11, 2009)

I cannot wait to hear the demos. Best of luck.


----------



## Niah (Jan 11, 2009)

This looks very promising Thonex, I'm looking forward to it.

How about system specs? How demanding are these patches, CPU and RAM wise? Do you have an idea?

Thanks


----------



## Angel (Jan 11, 2009)

TheoKrueger @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> I really like the divisi idea!! 8+4+4 = 18. Awesome!



lol :lol: 

Thonex... I wish I could be at NAMM. A friend of mine will be there selling guitar switchers. I will kick him to your booth with a Zoom H2-Recorder 

Cheers, Angel


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jan 11, 2009)

Thonex @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Christian Marcussen @ Sun Jan 11 said:
> 
> 
> > Fantastic... Btw... regarding my question about RR legato. If I play two notes back an forth, will I be playing the same two samples?
> ...



Right. So just to make sure I understand you. If I play C -#C - C - #C I can set things so I don't play the same samples even if I play at the same velocity? This is oneof the things that annoys be about VSL that the same interval always plays the same sample.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Niah @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> This looks very promising Thonex, I'm looking forward to it.
> 
> How about system specs? How demanding are these patches, CPU and RAM wise? Do you have an idea?
> 
> Thanks



Hi Niah,

Thanks.

Regarding system specs. So far everything is coded for K2 but I'd like to take advantage of K3.5 if possible:



> - Full 64-bit compatibility and 64bit-memory adressing on Windows and Mac
> - New DFD engine with drastically reduced memory footprint
> - Optimized sampling engine with substantial performance increase
> - Advanced multiprocessor support
> ...



here is the link: http://www.nativeinstruments.de/forum_u ... hp?t=72114

So clearly a 64 bit solution would be ideal. So as of now, I cannot be specific about CPU usage because I'm not sure if it will be release in K2 or K3. One thing I'm fairly sure of though, is that if I do release in K3.5, I will also have a K2 folder of patches so legacy users can still use Kontakt 2 as their main player. As a composer, I know what a PITA it would be to change all farm computers because of 1 library. So, I'm trying to cover all angles here.

The Real Legato Patches are ram hungry... but there will be reduced versions of them where you don;'t have to load the full compliment of samples. 

But all my computers are pretty old... all 4 years or more (except for 1) -- if it ain't broke... don't fix it right? :lol: 

But as release date get's closer I'll be able to give much better data.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Christian Marcussen @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Thonex @ Sun Jan 11 said:
> 
> 
> > Christian Marcussen @ Sun Jan 11 said:
> ...



:lol: LOL... yes Christian... you are 100% correct. Even at the same velocity, if you wish, a different legato sample will be intelligently randomly selected as to avoid any consecutive duplicate samples.


----------



## Fernando Warez (Jan 11, 2009)

> The Real Legato Patches are ram hungry... but there will be reduced versions of them where you don;'t have to load the full compliment of samples.





But did you record legato for all sections and solo? I'm asking cause that would make it a huge library.


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jan 11, 2009)

Great stuff... I just had to make sure so I wouldnt be dissapointed :D

How come every answer you give is the 'right' one? 

No one commented on the 'living library'... So I just wanted to say that I think it's a great idea. It's great knowing that when you come up with a grea patch you make it available.


----------



## midphase (Jan 11, 2009)

"There is no "auto divisi" in LASS. I did not even want to tackle that."

But the library certainly lends itself to that. It's nice to know that it would be a future option if you decide to tackle it.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Fernando Warez @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> But did you record legato for all sections and solo? I'm asking cause that would make it a huge library.



Hi Fernando, 

Yes, I did record legato for all ensembles for all instruments including the First Chair players. I had to... it's part of the whole concept... which didn't make it easy to edit and program :shock: >8o ~o) 

But it's not as huge as you might think though. I'm guessing it will be about 30 gigs.


----------



## dcoscina (Jan 11, 2009)

Sounds very promising Thonex. Strings are such as hard beast to tame in the sampling world because of all the minute variations (and number of players) happening. I like your ideology of getting tighter spiccs and staccs because I usually find them wanting in some way. Must thirst for awesome strings led me to buy a plethora of different libs over the years. Some have been better than others at doing I what I hear in my head. Still, I continue my quest for the ultimate strings like many others on this forum. 

Cannot wait to hear this. Also, if you have the wherewithall, you might entertain the notion of putting this up at that site TrySounds.com. That's how I caved in and bought Symphobia. 

Dave


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

midphase @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> "There is no "auto divisi" in LASS. I did not even want to tackle that."
> 
> But the library certainly lends itself to that. It's nice to know that it would be a future option if you decide to tackle it.



yeah... certainly the samples and patches are there to do something like that. But that opens up a whole new can of worms in programming/scripting. Since LASS's patches won't be locked for editing, people will be able to insert their own scripts... perhaps some VERY enterprising individual would want to tackle that... but not me :lol:


----------



## Fernando Warez (Jan 11, 2009)

Thonex @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Fernando Warez @ Sun Jan 11 said:
> 
> 
> > But did you record legato for all sections and solo? I'm asking cause that would make it a huge library.
> ...



Actually i don't care about the size. I was more concern about all the programming as you said. 

I'm hoping all the payers were sitting in their position when you recorded the soloist? ...to absorb the sound a bit? It wouldn't be very realistic if you didn't. :lol: :wink: 

Man! Too bad I'm broke cause, on paper, your lib is everything i wished for. 

P.S. Perhaps you could have a ''get it today and pay later sale''? Then the government could come and bail you out if we cant pay? 0oD


----------



## chrisharang (Jan 11, 2009)

You have clearly put an immense amount of effort into the planning and design of this, which couldn't be more awesome. Everything seems very carefully considered and thought through, and as someone else put it, it sounds like you've "thought of everything". Congratulations on what has obviously been an enormous amount of work. Like everyone else, I can't wait to see/hear more. Also, knowing that there will be a developer-user presence (w.r.t. your "living library" comments) with potential improvements and/or additions down the road is HUGE. Thanks

- Chris


----------



## lee (Jan 11, 2009)

I join the choir singing "Looks promising!!"



Thonex @ Sat Jan 10 said:


> I tend to use prerecorded runs myself (I have a ton of them from various sources) along with a script for Time Machine in Kontakt and this yields great results.



I know maybe I`m asking too much, and forgive me for being OT, but would you be willing to share that script for time machine? 

/Johnny


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Fernando and Chrisharang,

Thanks for the kind words. With regards to it being a "living library", I think that's the only way I can do it. There are far too many possibilities with LASS to cover them with a single release. It simply would never get released because I could go on forever. So.. as I tweak stuff... and write new patches..I'll make them available to the users. Some have asked "aren't you worried about giving away all your secrets?" I won't be giving away all my secrets... just patches. Plus it's all in the writing anyways... and I certainly don't have a lock on that :lol: 





lee @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> I join the choir singing "Looks promising!!"
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Hi Johnny  

Since in some capacity it may be included with LASS, I can't share it. But you can already cover a lot of it with Time Machine without any script at all. Just set the tempo of Time Machine to follow 1/4 or 1/8 note values.

Cheers,

T


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Jan 11, 2009)

> "There is no "auto divisi" in LASS. I did not even want to tackle that."
> 
> But the library certainly lends itself to that. It's nice to know that it would be a future option if you decide to tackle it.



Kays, that's not difficult to do in the Logic Environment using splitter objects.


----------



## Sovereign (Jan 11, 2009)

Hi Andrew,

Two important questions, I think.

One, has testing been done using K3? I think this might be important.

Second, do the patches use release trails to preserve the ambience at the end of a phrase?


----------



## Thonex (Jan 11, 2009)

Sovereign @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Hi Andrew,
> 
> Two important questions, I think.
> 
> ...



There has been limited testing in K3, since in K3.5 the DFD has been rewritten (among many other things), we are waiting for integration to K3.5.

http://www.nativeinstruments.de/forum_u ... hp?t=72114

Otherwise.. all code has been written in K2 so for those who use K2, there will be a K2 folder in the event they don't want to upgrade (perhaps all their other libraries are K2).

Re RT's: Yes, all sustain patches, (Esp Sus, non vib sus, trems, trills, sordinos) and legato patches have RTs with a RT bypass button in the event you want to bypass them for any reason.


----------



## dogforester (Jan 11, 2009)

Forgive me if this has already been covered but whats the reverb like built into the samples ?


----------



## choc0thrax (Jan 11, 2009)

Perhaps this has already been mentioned but any idea how many GB this thing will be? Preferably like under 4GB cuz that's how much space I have left on my HD.


----------



## Fernando Warez (Jan 11, 2009)

choc0thrax @ Sun Jan 11 said:


> Perhaps this has already been mentioned but any idea how many GB this thing will be? Preferably like under 4GB cuz that's how much space I have left on my HD.





> But it's not as huge as you might think though. I'm guessing it will be about 30 gigs.



Time to get a new hard drive. Ain't that fun? :lol:


----------



## synthetic (Jan 11, 2009)

Who recorded it, where and how? (What mics, etc.) I can understand if the names have to stay secret. 

I'm excited about this. I'm gonna have to learn how to use Kontakt now. There you go, there's your first quote to put on the box. I'm "switching" for this library.


----------



## Patrick de Caumette (Jan 11, 2009)

Congrats Andrew!

This is exciting for sure and it doesn't surprise me that you made the move!

Make us proud! =o


----------



## Blackster (Jan 12, 2009)

Very interesting news !! Looking forward to this library!


----------



## nikolas (Jan 12, 2009)

Let me echo everyone else with 2 small comments:

Best of luck, good job, etc...  (really, dispite the "etc" in the end).

I'm looking forward to it, really am. And I'm also looking forward to:
i. Price info
ii. demos! 



Good job mate, I'm sure of it and Craigs demos were very well made (what did I expect either way? :D)


----------



## Garlu (Jan 12, 2009)

nikolas @ Mon Jan 12 said:


> I'm looking forward to it, really am. And I'm also looking forward to:
> i. Price info
> ii. demos!



+1

Congrats Thonex... You paid attention to all details and I am sure you did!

All the best!


----------



## TheoKrueger (Jan 12, 2009)

Thonex @ Mon Jan 12 said:


> TheoKrueger @ Sun Jan 11 said:
> 
> 
> > I really like the divisi idea!! 8+4+4 = *18*. Awesome!
> ...



OOps! :D

I'm so used to using the 18 violins patches from EW that I have the number 18 as a "full violin section" in my mind. 

I guess the new standard should be 16 from now on!


----------



## dannthr (Jan 12, 2009)

Okay, you got me excited, my nose smells what the Thonex is cooking and it likes what it smells, now I want a taste.

If it's good, when the morsel touches my tongue my mouth will water and my brain will say: Eat!

Sorry for the metaphor, I'm actually quite hungry.

Hungry for breakfast and hungry for new strings.


----------



## Journeyman (Jan 12, 2009)

Thanks.....


----------



## careyford (Jan 12, 2009)

Andrew,

I'm not a professional developer or market analyst, but I think there may be some interest in your new string library. Good job on creating a buzz!

Richard


----------



## Thonex (Jan 12, 2009)

Thanks Sean, Blackster, Nikolas, Garlu, Dannthr (you got me hungry :lol: ) Rob and everyone else... thanks for the support and interest!!

ok... to answer 

Nikolas: pricing... I'll have a much better handle on that after NAMM... there are some parties I need to finalize things with before I can announce a price range.

And demos... :mrgreen: me too... I'm looking forward to them. They should start to trickle in a couple weeks after NAMM. 

I'm putting a lot of the final touches on a lot of these patches... then... I come back and "hear" something.. and tweak some more. But I'm almost there. :lol: The good news is that a lot of the patches are a BLAST to play.. and when I catch myself noodling and playing around with patches (instead of programming!!!!) that's actually a good sign. 


And just a general note and thanks: I want to thank all of you for the outpouring of support and enthusiasm you guys are showing... I'm truly humbled -- especially considering the level of expertise that can be found here at VI-Control. We're like a family here and all this goodwill only makes me want to put out an even better library.

I kind of feel like you're my family cheering me on from the sidelines while I'm about to run a school track-and-field race. I hope I can make you proud.


Cheers,

T


----------



## KingIdiot (Jan 12, 2009)

*gives thonex noogies*


----------



## artinro (Jan 12, 2009)

Thonex,
Let me add my line of support too. It's clear that you've really poured a lot of time, energy and passion into this project. All the best wishes for a successful launch. I'm very excited about this library!

Cheers,
-Ron


----------



## jc5 (Jan 12, 2009)

Congratulations Thonex  

I haven't been around much lately (busy to no end), and return to this news

It seems you've narrowed down what is needed most in sampled strings. I have just about all the existing ones, and what would entice me most about any new library would be quality real legatos and useable divisi sections. I also appreciate that these features are available for the sordinos as well.

I do hope it will fall into the affordable range :wink: 
Looking forward to hearing the fruits of your labours!


----------



## Thonex (Jan 12, 2009)

jc5 @ Mon Jan 12 said:


> Congratulations Thonex
> 
> I haven't been around much lately (busy to no end), and return to this news
> 
> ...



Hi jc5, :D 

Thanks for the support.

You brought up something that I need to clarify.. and I should figure out how to make it clearer on the announcement. The Sordinos will have a " formant correct" scripted legatos not Real Legato. All other strings and ensembles are Real Legato. Because of the sheer amount of Real Legato for all the instruments, a Con Sordino library with 1/4, 1/4, 1/2 ensembles for all sections would have been prohibitive... at least for this library. Thanks for bringing this to my attention so I can set this straight.


Cheers,

T


----------



## Thonex (Jan 12, 2009)

Rob Elliott @ Mon Jan 12 said:


> Regarding RT's - will I be able to assign them to a controller (pedal or slider)?
> 
> 
> All the best,
> ...



Sorry... I forgot to answer this one Rob,

Currently, all RTs have a button on the scripted GUI. But it wouldn't be hard at all to make it CC controllable... just a few lines of code.

So... I guess this is my first feature request post :lol: :lol: .... We need to avoid CC1, 11, 19-24,64 and 79 (don't ask why... just trust me :lol: ) and the default uses selectable CCs of 110 and 111... so what *other* CC should we use??

The scripts already gives you the option to choose your own CC for selecting things... like Legato on/off... Legato randomization, velocity attenuation (a cool thing to be discussed later)... so it would be nice to consider a dedicated CC for RTs On/off...

any preferences?

Cheers,

T


----------



## Rob Elliott (Jan 12, 2009)

Thonex @ Mon Jan 12 said:


> Rob Elliott @ Mon Jan 12 said:
> 
> 
> > Regarding RT's - will I be able to assign them to a controller (pedal or slider)?
> ...




Wonderful. Honestly in my work flow a midi assignable button (that can give a variable release time) would be all I would need. On the slow lush stuff this is tempo dependent (slower the tempo - the longer I want to set the release time, etc.)


Right now I have the "Brightness" CC74 controlling this for the VSL strings (assigned to one of my Yahama s90es sliders).

I vote for CC74. :D


----------



## Thonex (Jan 12, 2009)

Rob Elliott @ Mon Jan 12 said:


> On the slow lush stuff this is tempo dependent (slower the tempo - the longer I want to set the release time, etc.)



ahh... ok... this is different than RTs on/off. Currently, all the short articulations (spics, stacs, Pizzes for all sections etc) already have real-time control of release durations.. so nothing needs to be changed there. But for the sustains, the RT samples are not really supposed to be shorter than they are.. because they are mainly the natural decay of the instruments.... But for various people may want to CC bypass them... so I think adding some code might be beneficial if we don't get too messy with CC usage.




Rob Elliott @ Mon Jan 12 said:


> Wonderful. Honestly in my work flow a midi assignable button (that can give a variable release time) would be all I would need. On the slow lush stuff this is tempo dependent (slower the tempo - the longer I want to set the release time, etc.)
> 
> 
> Right now I have the "Brightness" CC74 controlling this for the VSL strings (assigned to one of my Yahama s90es sliders).
> ...



ok... one vote 74 :lol: 

Cheers,

T


----------



## Rob Elliott (Jan 12, 2009)

Yea Andrew I never see a need to be 'shorter' on sustains - only longer.


My twin brother from another Mother casts his vote for CC 74 as well. :wink: 


Rob


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Jan 12, 2009)

"My twin brother from another Mother"

Is this a Utah thing?


----------



## Mike Greene (Jan 12, 2009)

I'm excited about this! Now I have a reason to do a NAMM review post! (Besides just making fun of the morons at Realitone.)


----------



## Rob Elliott (Jan 12, 2009)

Nick Batzdorf @ Mon Jan 12 said:


> "My twin brother from another Mother"
> 
> Is this a Utah thing?




Of course Nick - now you know why I don't have to drink and smoke to be happy :D 


There are a couple of times duing some of these schedules that I have to hook up to a Lortab drip - but aside from that......



o


----------



## Sovereign (Jan 13, 2009)

Is it out yet?



PS keyswitch control of RT woul be fine with me.


----------



## Pietro (Jan 13, 2009)

Good luck at NAMM and with the release (quick release, you know ).

Hope to hear some real demos soon .

- Piotr


----------



## drasticmeasures (Jan 13, 2009)

Thonex,

This is a very interesting concept, and the Timbre sounds really nice from what I can tell from Craig's demos. 

Excited to learn more....

Congrats!


----------



## Ed (Jan 13, 2009)

Wow. 

I cant imagine how long it took you to program and edit all that!!

Cant wait to hear it.

Tell me, how much "air" did you sample? Because this is usually the downfall of commercial developers as I know you know!


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Jan 13, 2009)

Ed,

Having the library here I can assure you there is at least 2 pounds of air in the samples not accounting for LA smog.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 13, 2009)

Craig Sharmat @ Tue Jan 13 said:


> Ed,
> 
> Having the library here I can assure you there is at least 2 pounds of air in the samples not accounting for LA smog.



:lol: I like Craig's answer.

Yeah... I caught a lot of air... but not at the expense of body. One thing that stands out (IMO) is the amount of detail.

I'll be more absent in the next few days because of NAMM. I'll try to see if I can get back here to answer anymore questions... if there are any.

Cheers,

T


----------



## Niah (Jan 13, 2009)

air ! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O5x9HXwlkBo


----------



## synthetic (Jan 13, 2009)

The reason I asked about mics is because it seems that ALL film scores are recorded with three M50s (or M150s) in Decca tree as the main sound of the orchestra and NONE of the sample libraries are recorded this way.


----------



## Ned Bouhalassa (Jan 14, 2009)

I leave for 10 days and I come back to this? FANTASTIC! Congratulations Andrew. I can't wait to hear/buy it. o-[][]-o


----------



## zvenx (Jan 14, 2009)

How does it fit in the dry/wet(real space) spectrum of things?..... personally I like very close micing that I can tweak.....

rsp


----------



## Thonex (Jan 14, 2009)

Thanks Ned! :D 


@ Zvenx



zvenx @ Wed Jan 14 said:


> How does it fit in the dry/wet(real space) spectrum of things?..... personally I like very close micing that I can tweak.....



Then I think you'll be happy. I wanted to create a library that had a detailed sound without sounding strident or "too" up-close. I wanted a good 1rst reflection of the stage sound without a long tail so as not to hand-cuff you to a particularly "overly" ambient sound. 

So, tis library is designed to be used with your own reverb giving you control of the space, with the benefits of a detailed sound.

Cheers,

T


----------



## zvenx (Jan 14, 2009)

thanks Andrew, sounds like my cup of tea.
thanks also for not making me feel like a heretic when, God forbid, I don't appreciate the wet sound that I get every striking time I play a note and not appreciate that it was recorded in a world famous hall that I could never afford to record in and should be damn grateful that the hall is VERY much a big part of the sound, that I could never simulate with the best of IR's....... whatever 
rsp


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Jan 14, 2009)

you will find the library will not be as dry as VSL, there is definitely more air in the samples, but well drier than QLSO.


----------



## zvenx (Jan 14, 2009)

ok thanks for that Craig.. I guess I will wait to hear it... but vsl for me is where I like my dryness. Sadly apart from what comes with Kontakt I can't afford their libraries or at least currently justify the expense.
rsp


----------



## PolarBear (Jan 14, 2009)

Looks nice. Just do me one favor please: Please do not put that running bug on the software screen or the retail box, that would be much appreciated! Thanks a lot, Sir.


----------



## tmhuud (Jan 16, 2009)

Where are you guys at NAMM? Anyone have a HALL and booth number. CAnt seem to find ya.

Cheers,


----------



## PolarBear (Jan 16, 2009)

Terry, have a look at the ArtVista booth (booth #6427, see also first line of the first post in this topic for reference).


----------



## tmhuud (Jan 16, 2009)

Thanks Polar Bear. THe roving bug distracted me. I think I'll slap thonex up on the forehead for that little guy.


----------



## JFB (Jan 16, 2009)

I just got back from NAMM and got a thorough demo of LASS. I think, at least among those of us who make our living with these things, he hit a home run. The level of detail is borderline OCD - type "A" programming that could be easily used by a type "B" personality composer (i.e., me). For those of you in search of so-called "realism", this is a big step closer to your holy grail.

Anyway, to start, the Staccato/spiccato articulations are the clearest, tightest and "un-scratchiest" I've heard in any library. And he's done this wild "beat box-like" script for stac/spic repetitions that is off the hook. You can program patterns a la "ultrabeat" - hold the notes and it plays tempo-locked to your sequence and sounds absolutely real. When faster tempos cause samples to "stack up" and get muddy, you can move the mod wheel and the durations shorten. His random round-robin programming is on the money. I forget what that articulation is called where there are hash marks in the note stems for strings, (that note-value tremolo thing), but you can do that with this library really well.

If this guy's legato doesn't satisfy you, then I don't know what will (besides the obvious). And the fast-run stuff plays very well. I'm a very proficient keyboard player and this stuff played smooth and responsive.

The way he laid out the section sizes for divisi also works great. This library really had "problem solving" in mind and getting work done with as much attention to efficiency without compromising artistry.

The tone - in that horrible listening environment that is NAMM, I could really "hear the wood". I know that sounds like "make it sound orange", but I don't know how else to put it. My biggest gripe with sampled strings is the Cellos always sounded harsh, strident, and honky around middle C and above. Not the case with these. The low-mids also don't have those annoying modal buildups where I have to dip 130 and 250hz. They aren't "big hall" samples, but running them through something like Altiverb with the Acousticas Lexicon 300 impluses, and they'll be plenty big.

While no doubt there will be people complaining about something, I think he filled that hole he was talking about. I never got a sense of overlap between his library and others, and I have almost all of them.

If I was at all rambling, I apologize. I'm a bit beat from walking and standing all day. Cheers!


----------



## Fernando Warez (Jan 16, 2009)

JFB @ Fri Jan 16 said:


> I just got back from NAMM and got a thorough demo of LASS. I think, at least among those of us who make our living with these things, he hit a home run....
> 
> ....If I was at all rambling, I apologize. I'm a bit beat from walking and standing all day. Cheers!



Thanks for review JFB.


----------



## Dave Connor (Jan 16, 2009)

Excellent review JFB and sounds like an excellent product. Thanks.


----------



## nikolas (Jan 16, 2009)

JFB: Thanks for the review as well. 

Damnit! One more library to get! (and I thought I had stoped wishing for more...). Now all that remains is the price question! :D (unless being answered previously in this thread and didn't take notice. 5 pages is long in this forum!


----------



## Waywyn (Jan 17, 2009)

Hey Thonex,

sorry I didn't reply earlier, but I wish you all the best luck for your lib and really looking forward to it!! =o 

Can't wait to hear it ...


----------



## dcoscina (Jan 17, 2009)

JFB, thanks for the review. I hope these strings won't be too expensive. Sounds like they deserve to be though from the accolades. It gives me something to save towards. Like everyone, I'm always searching for better string sounds.


----------



## Justus (Jan 17, 2009)

JFB and Thonex,

I wonder how this seamless velocity blend is supposed to work and how it sounds.
Can you give us more information about it?

Best,
Justus


----------



## wqaxsz (Jan 17, 2009)

Hi,

who has heard it at Namm ?

thank you.

I read something about an "estimation" of a "possible" price:

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/3823644-post35.html

Regards


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Jan 17, 2009)

Justus @ Sat Jan 17 said:


> JFB and Thonex,
> 
> I wonder how this seamless velocity blend is supposed to work and how it sounds.
> Can you give us more information about it?
> ...



this is certainly a strength of the library. The biggest factor for making the library was the need for more expressive strings so xfading and adding expression are 2 of the most important factors for creating LASS. While LASS does a lot of things what you are asking for is the focal point of the lib.


----------



## dcoscina (Jan 17, 2009)

Well, $1500 sounds pricey to me but then again, like Symphobia, this is a specialty item and one that pros will definitely get. The strings on Craig's demo sound lovely Thonex and I wish you all the success on the launch of your new product. 

Looking forward to hearing those demos!


----------



## Fernando Warez (Jan 17, 2009)

$1500 is out of reach for me. Although I'm sure it's worth every penny!  ... There for i vote for group buy for VI users?  ...Just kidding!


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Jan 17, 2009)

I can assure you Andrew does not want to charge 1500.00 for the lib. If it reaches that price point it will because there are factors beyond his control pushing the price up.


----------



## Fernando Warez (Jan 17, 2009)

Craig Sharmat @ Sat Jan 17 said:


> I can assure you Andrew does not want to charge 1500.00 for the lib. If it reaches that price point it will because there are factors beyond his control pushing the price up.



I believe you. I never understood why people complain so much about prices anyway....


----------



## dcoscina (Jan 17, 2009)

I hope my post did not come off as complaining. I totally understand the costs that go into making such a library. I do hope it's a little less for my own sake but I would not hold it against Thonex if he lists it for higher. As Craig said, it's not something he would want to do.


----------



## choc0thrax (Jan 17, 2009)

It's an ok price as long as it mops the floor with Symphobia.


----------



## Fernando Warez (Jan 17, 2009)

dcoscina @ Sat Jan 17 said:


> I hope my post did not come off as complaining. I totally understand the costs that go into making such a library. I do hope it's a little less for my own sake but I would not hold it against Thonex if he lists it for higher. As Craig said, it's not something he would want to do.



I just want to say i was not pointing figure at you.

:lol: Edited : I meant finger!...


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Jan 17, 2009)

I was not seeing this as a complaint, just a wish and I think we all want to see a lower price.




choc0thrax @ Sat Jan 17 said:


> It's an ok price as long as it mops the floor with Symphobia.



well Symphobia is a broad stroke library. LASS is more detailed. I think you already know they are quite different. We could attach long wooden poles to both libraries boxes and clean the floor at the same time, that way it could mop the floor with Symphobia.


----------



## JFB (Jan 17, 2009)

I talked to him about the price. He's still working out his deal with NI and wants to keep the price under $1500USD. 

My perspective, FWIW - in 1996 I paid over $3k USD for the Miroslav Vitous library for the Emulator IV, and it was only Strings, Brass and Winds. But there was NOTHING else like it. By a long shot. It says a lot about those samples that they could be re-issued in today's market, albeit with more content at 1/6 the price. Anyway...

As someone who makes his living with this stuff, the only consideration I can rationally make regarding price is whether or not I have the cash to pay for it. If I see a tool that will greatly improve the sound of my work without making me work twice as hard or bogging down my system resources to get that improvement, $1500 is nothing. I paid $6400.00 for an Emulator II+ in 1986 - 8bit companded resolution with a then-whopping two banks of 17 seconds of sample memory. Plus having to shlep around cases full of 5.25" floppy disks.

My previous quick and positive review doesn't mean I'll buy this, not because of the price, but do I need what it does enough to go through the learning curve of its very deep and detailed programming.

Note to Andrew re: documentation: In some of your less-conventional programming choices, it would be great if you would explain not just what the controller/KS, etc. does, but specifically why you chose to do it that way. That way, instead of scratching my head going "WTF?" I can say "oh - I get it! Never would've thought of that myself." Much more pleasant experience.


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Jan 17, 2009)

JFB,

You will find majority of the patches work quite simply, a mod wheel and expression fader will get you through most of the patches. Andrew is also making memory friendly patches to help with K2's current memory limitation but K2's memory is of course an issue for just about all of us.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 18, 2009)

Hi guys,

First off... thanks for all of you that showed up to the various demos during the last 3 days (one more day left :D )!!!! It was great to see all of you as well as many many new faces. And thanks to Hans for being so awesome and making me feel right at home exhibiting my library at the Art Vista booth. Also, Mike Green for lending me his headset microphone... thanks bro!

The doors opened at 10 am... and at 10:01 rJames walks up (in all his 6'7" glory) and asks.... "so... do I get the 'first customer' free copy???" :lol: 

It was great to see Craig, Aaron, Gabe (thanks for the fruit salad and drink!!!), Jack, Jose, Marteen from SAM and the Sonivox people and Chris Heinz (whom I got to know really well).... and all the rest of you guys that came out and said hello!!!

Doing demos at NAMM is so tough... it's virtually impossible to hear anything in detail... so I appreciate all of your patience during the demos.



@JFB,

Wow!!!! Thanks for the really kind words and the wonderful review. I remember who you are because of your "cellos in the higher register" observations... and yes.. you are a very proficient player!! :D It's nice when players actually play my library as opposed to me :lol: And don't worry, the documentation (as well as the patches) will be easy and straight forward. Patches that are easy to play (yet expressive) are fundamental to my approach to programming. 

Regarding the price, again.. I 'm new to this and although I'm sure I haven't factored everything into my calculations, I am fairly confident that this library will be below $1500. I'm reticent to even give a ballpark figure... but I know people want an idea... and I think this is a number I can protect.. and probably beat (make cheaper).

Again, I want to thank all of you who came to check out the library. The response has been great and all of you have made this NAMM show a blast for me!!!

cheers,

T


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jan 18, 2009)

> Chris Heinz (whom I got to know really well)....



There is a something quite ironic and amusing about that sentance  I'll let it hang for a bit :D



> I am fairly confident that this library will be below $1500. I'm reticent to even give a ballpark figure... but I know people want an idea... and I think this is a number I can protect.. and probably beat (make cheaper).



Great. Crossing fingers. Unfortunately I'm a power buyer anymore after I got a house and kid. Add to that that I have a UK client which means my salary just dropped 40% due to the pound... kill me :D

I remember the time where I would buy everything. Oh happy days.


----------



## Thonex (Jan 18, 2009)

Christian Marcussen @ Sun Jan 18 said:


> > Chris Heinz (whom I got to know really well)....
> 
> 
> 
> There is a something quite ironic and amusing about that sentance  I'll let it hang for a bit :D



I'm not too smart... you'll probably have to enlighten me :lol:


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jan 18, 2009)

hehe... well. Perhaps I'm just a smart-ass and his name actually IS Heinz... But his products atleast are named Hein :D


----------



## Thonex (Jan 18, 2009)

Christian Marcussen @ Sun Jan 18 said:


> hehe... well. Perhaps I'm just a smart-ass and his name actually IS Heinz... But his products atleast are named Hein :D



Ooops... nope... that would be me :oops: 

But what a great person.. really nice... and gave me lots of great advice.

Cheers,

T


----------



## bryla (Jan 18, 2009)

Heinz isn't that the ketchup??

Thonex this is a great product! Can't wait


----------



## artinro (Jan 18, 2009)

Thonex @ Sun Jan 18 said:


> Again, I want to thank all of you who came to check out the library. The response has been great and all of you have made this NAMM show a blast for me!!!
> 
> cheers,
> 
> T



Congratulations on what sounds like a great NAMM for you, Thonex. Really excited about this library. Looking forward to more information (Demos, website, availability) in the coming weeks after NAMM.

Cheers,
-Ron


----------



## nikolas (Jan 18, 2009)

Just a tiny note (a further tiny note):

Andrew: If this is what I'm assuming a huge thanks from all those people who refuse to get Kontakt, the sampler. Since you are making a deal with NI, I'm assuming you're talking about a player, right? Which is more awesome news!


----------



## Thonex (Jan 18, 2009)

nikolas @ Sun Jan 18 said:


> Just a tiny note (a further tiny note):
> 
> Andrew: If this is what I'm assuming a huge thanks from all those people who refuse to get Kontakt, the sampler. Since you are making a deal with NI, I'm assuming you're talking about a player, right? Which is more awesome news!



Hi Nikolas,

Yes... this will be released as a Kontakt Player library, but it will be supported by the Kontakt sampler and will be unlocked for programming (however the scripts and samples will be locked). 

But, I highly recommend getting the Kontakt sampler also. Why? Because I intend on being quite active in uploading new patches as I tweak them for my own projects and shows... and this way you'd be able to benefit frm those patches. If you only own the Player, AFAIK, you'd only be able to use the patches that came with the player.

Cheers,

T


----------



## Rob Elliott (Jan 18, 2009)

Watching this thread closely Andrew. I must say you have really thought this out. The idea of constantly breathing life into the release with new patches really is key.


Best of fortunes to you in this effort.


Rob


----------



## Jackull (Jan 18, 2009)

Thonex @ Sun Jan 18 said:


> The doors opened at 10 am... and at 10:01 rJames walks up (in all his 6'7" glory) and asks.... "so... do I get the 'first customer' free copy???" :lol:
> 
> ......
> 
> ...



[OT] i thought craig was kidding bout rJames being a giant (6'7")  wow you can guard Yao Ming.

[back-to-topic] thonex, i hope the price isn't $1,499.00 which is below 1500  . nevertheless, i will get it on the 1st update as i already fulfilled my wish list during the holidays. good luck on your LASS sales.


----------



## Dave Connor (Jan 18, 2009)

bryla @ Sun Jan 18 said:


> Heinz isn't that the ketchup??
> 
> Thonex this is a great product! Can't wait



Oh yeah I agree! Heinz Ketchup has always been great!


----------



## drasticmeasures (Jan 18, 2009)

Hey Thonex,

From what I can tell from Craig's posted demos, this sounds like a great lib!

Congrats!


(Do you have a release date set?)


----------



## FireGS (Jan 18, 2009)

Thonex, will you have a dedicated website for LASS, or will it be through ArtVista, or some other distributor? I bet you could come up with a really classy site with demos, forum, place to get new patches, etc... Like the SampleModeling site.

Woot, page 6.


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Jan 18, 2009)

LASS or whatever the company is called will have its own site.


----------



## Niah (Jan 18, 2009)

FireGS @ Sun Jan 18 said:


> Thonex, will you have a dedicated website for LASS, or will it be through ArtVista, or some other distributor? I bet you could come up with a really classy site with demos, forum, place to get new patches, etc... Like the SampleModeling site.
> 
> Woot, page 6.



http://www.lascoringstrings.com/


----------



## artsoundz (Jan 18, 2009)

nice...class...


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Jan 18, 2009)

well there you go!

Was not aware he had finished a site yet. well not finished but had something up.


----------



## FireGS (Jan 18, 2009)

Wow. Exactly.


----------



## PolarBear (Jan 18, 2009)

I'm silently still hoping for that $899 figure. WHich would translate to a €699 something... well... dreaming here? Did you consider smaller sets for a second? I know this is about getting everything and what not, but maybe there is a chance to get parts of this (and/or whole-tone sampled) without paying the price equal to 200 Bloody Marys and half a year of insobriety? :D


----------



## artinro (Jan 18, 2009)

Niah @ Sun Jan 18 said:


> http://www.lascoringstrings.com/



Beautiful site! Pretty psyched about this library!


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Jan 18, 2009)

Does the library include muted French horn or other ethnic instruments?


----------



## Fernando Warez (Jan 18, 2009)

Nick Batzdorf @ Sun Jan 18 said:


> Does the library include muted French horn or other ethnic instruments?



:lol: What have you been smoking?


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Jan 18, 2009)

Nick has just finished 4 days of NAMM and has yet to enter Decompression. Give him a week until he starts to reassemble his old self.


----------



## Fernando Warez (Jan 18, 2009)

Aha! That explains a lot! :mrgreen:


----------



## Thonex (Jan 19, 2009)

Hi guys,

NAMM is over ~o) Talk about sensory overload... and thanks again to all who braved the noise of NAMM and listened to (or tried to listen to) the LASS demos. It was great meeting all of you.



Nick Batzdorf said:


> Does the library include muted French horn or other ethnic instruments?



:lol: :lol: heh... no... but I'm not sure if I mentioned this yet or not, I will be including a bonus Solo Violin Real Legato LPG patch in the library... so now there will be 2 solo violins. :D 

Ok.... I'm exhausted from NAMM... going to head to bed.

Cheers,

T


----------



## Pedro Camacho (Jan 19, 2009)

Hello Thonex

I my opinion strings are the "Soul" of an orchestra. I love writing for string orchestras and I can't tell you how excited I am about this library.

I have been following it since you posted from day 0 so please keep us informed at all times!

Is there a website for it already? If not please check your messages.


----------



## artinro (Jan 19, 2009)

Pedro Camacho @ Mon Jan 19 said:


> Is there a website for it already?



http://www.lascoringstrings.com/


----------



## kotori (Jan 19, 2009)

Hello Andrew,
Congratuations! I'm sure this will be a great library. Beautiful web site too. :D 
Extra nice to someone who is so deeply rooted within this community take such a step. I wish you the best of luck.

Cheers,
Nils


----------



## Lex (Jan 19, 2009)

cant wait to hear it...web looks cool too..

aLex


----------



## clonewar (Jan 19, 2009)

Nice website.... except for this part: 

*D E M O S :

Demos coming soon. *


Booooooo!! 

:D :D


----------



## Dr.Quest (Jan 19, 2009)

clonewar @ Mon Jan 19 said:


> Nice website.... except for this part:
> 
> *D E M O S :
> 
> ...



So you don't want demos? /\~O 
J


----------



## Thonex (Jan 20, 2009)

kotori @ Mon Jan 19 said:


> Hello Andrew,
> Congratuations! I'm sure this will be a great library. Beautiful web site too. :D
> Extra nice to see someone who is so deeply rooted within this community take such a step. I wish you the best of luck.
> 
> ...



Thanks Nils :D Thanks for the kind words.

It's a lot of work (as I know you know) but satisfying at the same time.


Cheers,

Andrew


----------



## nikolas (Jan 20, 2009)

clonewar @ Tue Jan 20 said:


> Nice website.... except for this part:
> 
> *D E M O S :
> 
> ...


I'm not missing the demos anymore. I'm missing the BUY button! 

Come on! :D

(ok, honestly I will listen to the demos, but it is probably the first library to buy after changing my computer system 110%)


----------



## Simon Ravn (Jan 20, 2009)

C'mon give us some demos now!


----------



## Blackster (Jan 20, 2009)

And now all together in huge choir: 

De - mos - please ..... De - mos - please ...... De - mos - please .....


----------



## dogforester (Jan 20, 2009)

Do you think wE should Mark Our post with Secret messages ? 

~o) SOMED/ SOMED/ SOMED/ SOMED/ :shock:


----------



## ComposerDude (Jan 20, 2009)

I know Thonex's level of quality and am quite happy to place my order for these strings even without demos.


----------



## synthetic (Jan 20, 2009)

OK, it's been almost 48 hours since NAMM closed, where are the demos? 

The library sounded incredible, it really nailed the scoring sound and looks fun to play. I tried a few licks that always sound weird on VSL (soft to loud legato and vice versa) and they sounded great. The arpeggiated programs sounded good as well. 

How did you like your first NAMM show? Is your voice back yet?


----------



## Thonex (Jan 20, 2009)

synthetic @ Tue Jan 20 said:


> OK, it's been almost 48 hours since NAMM closed, where are the demos?



:lol: :lol: I still have to get half of the NAMM show equipment back into my studio and hook it up. Then I need to finish some patches... but in a couple of weeks :wink: 




synthetic @ Tue Jan 20 said:


> The library sounded incredible, it really nailed the scoring sound and looks fun to play. I tried a few licks that always sound weird on VSL (soft to loud legato and vice versa) and they sounded great. The arpeggiated programs sounded good as well.
> 
> How did you like your first NAMM show? Is your voice back yet?



Thanks Synth. Glad you got a chance to mess with it and get a feel for it. Yeah... being able to do leg, port or gliss during crescendos and diminuendos smoothly was very important to me. I'm glad you picked up on that.

My voice is back... well... almost.  

Thanks,

T


----------



## kdm (Jan 20, 2009)

Thonex @ Tue Jan 20 said:


> Yeah... being able to do leg, port or gliss during crescendos and diminuendos smoothly was very important to me. I'm glad you picked up on that.



Sounds great Thonex - can't wait. (I'm banging my head against the wall with some cresc/dec legato lines and runs at this very moment, with less than preferable alternatives).


----------



## Ned Bouhalassa (Jan 20, 2009)

Oh please can we have LASS scoring stage IRs to go with that order? 

Greedy little b*st*rds, aren't we?! :twisted:


----------



## lee (Jan 22, 2009)

*Identify the LASS-man at NAMM*

*GUESSING CONTEST*

Who in this picture is Thonex (Andrew Keresztes)?







The other fellows are supposed to be Chris Hein, Christ Stone and some other NAMM-guys.

/Johnny


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Jan 22, 2009)

Gotta love Hans' body language :D


----------



## TheoKrueger (Jan 22, 2009)

Looking forward to all the demos as well


----------



## Thonex (Jan 22, 2009)

*Re: Identify the LASS-man at NAMM*



lee @ Thu Jan 22 said:


> *GUESSING CONTEST*
> 
> Who in this picture is Thonex (Andrew Keresztes)?



The one hiding :lol: 

Chris Stone was giving me and Chris Hein a run through of his DVZ... and in walks Gary and Gary... before we knew it we were lined up for a pic. Pretty much the same at every booth... except no luck with the Seimore Duncan girls :mrgreen:


----------



## koolkeys (Jan 22, 2009)

Thonex, it was great to hear the library at NAMM. Cool stuff! You should be receiving an email from me with some questions!

Brent


----------



## lee (Jan 31, 2009)

bump


----------



## synergy543 (Jan 31, 2009)

Gary sure knows how to win friends and influence his enemies....you betcha!

I mean.....what's he doing paling around with all of these "unauthorized" developers?


----------



## koolkeys (Jan 31, 2009)

I'm not sure I follow? Did you see him here, I take it?

Brent


----------



## AR (Feb 1, 2009)

Every day I check for demos on LASS page twice. 

I can't wait to hear them...

As far as I can tell from guys who tested it already, this is going to be the next step after Symphobia, huh?


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Feb 1, 2009)

Lass has very little in common with Symphobia. The only similarities is they both contain strings.


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Feb 1, 2009)

And that they allegedly are great


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Feb 1, 2009)

Only one is allegedly at this point...


----------



## AR (Feb 1, 2009)

So what's the difference between LASS and Symphobia string section?

While SAM was more interested in capturing the Hollywood sound, LASS is going to be another string library with focus on playing better legato lines?


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Feb 1, 2009)

that's not quite it.

Look at the articulation list of LASS

http://www.lascoringstrings.com/details.html

Lass was actually recorded in LA with LA players so I doubt you can get more Hollywood than that. Symphobia was recorded across the ocean and it still gets a film score sound. Its not the players or the place that's important but the direction the players are given, the techniques used recording them and the execution of the library. The Hollywood sound is a mythical ideal. Both libraries do things very well and only occasionally cross paths which make it redundant.


----------



## AR (Feb 1, 2009)

Haha, yeah thats right Troels.


But I think you didn't understand my question.

My question was: Did Andrew also sampled the strings sections in the way you would record a complete string orchestra? I mean, when he sampled the violins...where those celli/contrabass microphones also switched on? 
Cause this is the thing that gives Symphobia that "big Hollywood" sound. SAM handled the violin section as if the complete orchestra was playing.


----------



## Thonex (Feb 1, 2009)

AR @ Sun Feb 01 said:


> My question was: Did Andrew also sampled the strings sections in the way you would record a complete string orchestra? I mean, when he sampled the violins...where those celli/contrabass microphones also switched on?
> Cause this is the thing that gives Symphobia that "big Hollywood" sound. SAM handled the violin section as if the complete orchestra was playing.



We thought about that, but after careful consideration this was not done because of phasing issues that would become apparent especially when panning. Since I wanted a library that could afford to be panned *and* be recorded in position, We opted not to do this. There is also a noise floor issue when you leave on many "unused" mics during the mix.. and since I'm against using NR whenever possible.. this was also factored in.

And finally, since the scoring stage was rather large, those "other" mics would have introduced a lot more ambiance, that may have hand-cuffed peoples mixes if they didn't want "that" sound.

This library is designed to be used with your own reverbs. Typically, I recommend a stage (1st reflection shorter reverb) and a longer "hall" tail reverb.

T


----------



## wqaxsz (Feb 1, 2009)

Hi,

i am really impatient to listen to demos.

Good luck.

Regards

Lorenzo


----------



## Thonex (Feb 1, 2009)

wqaxsz @ Sun Feb 01 said:


> Hi,
> 
> i am really impatient to listen to demos.
> 
> ...



me too  

I'm still in the final stretches of finishing up patches... so it's going to be a little while yet. But rest assured... when the patches are ready we'll get demos up asap... And VI-Control will be the first to know about it. :D 

As good as the patches sound right now and sounded at NAMM, there are still issues and patches that need to be addressed. I appreciate all of your patience.

Cheers,

T


----------



## AR (Feb 1, 2009)

Thank you Thonex for the clarification.


So LASS is probably more comparable to VSL strings, but with a more customized articulations. I think your library will change in some way one or another guy's compositions.

Still, it would be nice, if somebody adopt your concept to the SAM sampling method some day.

Theoratically it's no problem. Of course a big stage is needed. And even you record tutti, nevertheless you can program it so you can choose between "diverse group mics muted"/"ambience muted"/"all mics unmuted" just by writing different programs therefor.
Of course you can't change the pan anymore which isn't a big issue (in my opinion).
The phase issue is also a problem where the recording engineer shows how good he is in his job 
The noise problem: Well, I remember when I sampled my string library...since then I only use Neumanns (the newer generation). But I can tell you, a slightly little bit of noises coming from the environment, players, instruments, bows makes the whole recording so much more authentic. First a got angry, when I heard a clack during the sampling (the bassist scratch his contrabass with the button of his shirt), but then I started to like it. It's a little bit reality. That's what I love in Symphobia. It has all that. 

I'mòÈy   ”ãÈy   ”äÈy   ”åÈy   ”æÈy   ”çÈy   ”èÈy   ”


----------



## Jack Weaver (Feb 1, 2009)

Hi AR,

I can't authoritatively speak for Thonex, but I don't think that equating the panning and ambience to VSL is quite accurate. 

I've heard LASS albeit in the terrible NAMM atmosphere. I think I would compare its panning and natural reverb qualities a little more closely to Sonivox. LASS was recorded on a large soundstage. (I believe Sonivox was recorded in a medium sized studio environment - still even it has a lot more air than VSL.) 

In LASS, there is some room and the instruments seem to be recorded more 'in-place' than VSL, using a traditional orchestral seating arrangement. Also he recorded different instrumentalists in his sections. For example, his two groupings of four are completely different players. 

He does explain his reasoning on these things in some thread - it might be in this forum or it could be in Gearslutz.


----------



## Niah (Feb 1, 2009)

Not really sure if I understand the reason for another symphobia.

Project Sam put in pratice a very simple concept that worked marvelously.

The ensembles in symphobia are lush, full, powerful and sound quality is amazing.

But now that symphobia is out, and we have the "backbone" of the orchestra covered what I am eager to see is more control and more performance capabilities within sections with the same sound quality as symphobia.

That's pretty much what I am hoping for LASS and future orchestral libraries, something that has a natural sound like symphobia but also with performance capabilities like legato and portamento that sound good.


----------



## AR (Feb 1, 2009)

That's what I thought, too.


I want some "Upgrade" of Symphobia (few more articulations, etc.) . Cause after all libraries I had (including mine) I got tired always having "total control". Today I just wanna write simply out of the box. Its all about workflow and time.


----------



## dcoscina (Feb 2, 2009)

I hope Thonex is prepared for a stream of posts complaining about how over-priced LASS will be. I'm sure the boys at Project SAM are a little tired of it by now.


----------



## Pedro Camacho (Feb 2, 2009)

Craig Sharmat @ Sun Feb 01 said:


> The Hollywood sound is a mythical ideal.



Yep


----------



## Christian Marcussen (Feb 2, 2009)

And yet... not quite


----------



## zvenx (Feb 2, 2009)

did we figure out how much is this going to cost beyond under $1500?
rsp


----------



## PolarBear (Feb 2, 2009)

I'm saying $699. A ballpark figure. A dream to come true. Well, maybe the lite version. with half the strings, hahaha (pun intended)


----------



## Ned Bouhalassa (Feb 3, 2009)

Welcome to The VI Price is Right! And the actual retail price of LASS is...


----------



## dannthr (Feb 3, 2009)

A price point is not going to help us understand the product better than demos.

If I were making a sample library, especially an anticipated one, I would NOT release pricing details until demos were out--it's just bad business savvy. People will write off a product for the price without even understanding the product.


----------



## Ned Bouhalassa (Feb 3, 2009)

And those people are not the clients that one should be aiming for. Then again, in these times... >8o


----------



## Fernando Warez (Feb 3, 2009)

Ned Bouhalassa @ Tue Feb 03 said:


> Welcome to The VI Price is Right! And the actual retail price of LASS is...



The price is right ladies use to give me a B when i was young. :lol: 



Here's an idea: Lets try to bring the price down by trashing LASS before it even comes out! ~o)


----------



## dannthr (Feb 4, 2009)

I had a dream that LASS released at $1795 with a 30 day opening sale of $1500 just so he wouldn't piss anyone off directly.

Do you realize what that means?


It means I've been spending too much time on the vi-control.net forums.


----------



## Hal (Feb 4, 2009)

1795 $ ! never mention that again lol 
this will help u sleep better here

http://www.lascoringstrings.com/demos.html

coming soon
refresh
coming soon..
go on..


----------



## Pedro Camacho (Feb 4, 2009)

dannthr @ Wed Feb 04 said:


> LASS released at $1795




I am sorry but that price is WAY overpriced.

This library should priced in a similar way as symphobia.

Symphobia = all orchestra instruments (ensembles only), tons of effects, strange articulations, clusters, etc (specialty library)

LASS = Strings only, completely sampled.

Sounds more than fair to me.


----------



## Ashermusic (Feb 4, 2009)

Small developers do not get rich on these things. Only Andrew knows what his costs, development hours, licensing and marketing fees, et. are. I am sure he will price it as reasonably as he feels he can.

He is under no moral obligation to market it at a price that everybody can afford.


----------



## zvenx (Feb 4, 2009)

Ashermusic @ Wed Feb 04 said:


> Small developers do not get rich on these things. Only Andrew knows what his costs, development hours, licensing and marketing fees, et. are. I am sure he will price it as reasonably as he feels he can.
> 
> He is under no moral obligation to market it at a price that everybody can afford.



+1.....
But of course he should give discounts to fellow Nuendo users who he has known online for years 
rsp


----------



## Ashermusic (Feb 4, 2009)

Oh, he's a Nuendo guy?

Then I have no interest in any library from the likes of him.


----------



## zvenx (Feb 4, 2009)

lol
rsp


----------



## rJames (Feb 4, 2009)

I was hoping for a VI-Control group buy...


----------



## Niah (Feb 4, 2009)

who cares, as long as the price is in dollars...


----------



## Justus (Feb 4, 2009)

rJames @ Wed Feb 04 said:


> I was hoping for a VI-Control group buy...



=o


----------



## careyford (Feb 4, 2009)

+ 1 on the VI Group Buy


----------



## sbkp (Feb 4, 2009)

/hopes those group buy posts are sarcasm...


----------



## Fernando Warez (Feb 4, 2009)

sbkp @ Wed Feb 04 said:


> /hopes those group buy posts are sarcasm...



I know it was on my part!


----------



## NYC Composer (Feb 6, 2009)

Ashermusic @ Wed Feb 04 said:


> Small developers do not get rich on these things. Only Andrew knows what his costs, development hours, licensing and marketing fees, et. are. I am sure he will price it as reasonably as he feels he can.
> 
> He is under no moral obligation to market it at a price that everybody can afford.



This is true, of course. The manufacturers/developers put in much time, incur much expense, and can set any price they like. However, from a marketing point of view, I really wonder how many more copies of BBB and Symphobia would sell at half their present prices. Times are tough for composers, professionals and hobbyists alike.If, for example, these fine professional products sold three times as many units at half their prices, obviously both the developers and the customers would benefit. I'm one of those who has bought neither and lust after both. The price point has kept me away.

I assume these developers are doing marketing studies, so, maybe they have it right. Still, it's not about morality...it's about bidness.


----------



## dcoscina (Feb 7, 2009)

I sort of agree. I just got Digidesign's VELVET for $75 from my local music store. I never would have bought this for its original $300 list price though.

That said, I did shell out my dough for Symphobia.


----------



## PolarBear (Feb 7, 2009)

A 50% off groupbuy doesn't double the customers number usually. So I doubt it will be more sales let alone three times as much if you go for a half decent price. With QLSO you essentially had that price model exercised... they went down more and more to get people buying it. But it only worked because they initially claimed double the price of what it was worth to some... because anything is only worth as much as it costs at a certain time.

My phrase alarm goes off with this: " Times are tough for composers" - they've never been better, financially and technologically. It's always just a very few that can make a living out of it, all others are just exchangable supplementary staff.


----------



## NYC Composer (Feb 8, 2009)

PolarBear @ Sat Feb 07 said:


> A 50% off groupbuy doesn't double the customers number usually. So I doubt it will be more sales let alone three times as much if you go for a half decent price. With QLSO you essentially had that price model exercised... they went down more and more to get people buying it. But it only worked because they initially claimed double the price of what it was worth to some... because anything is only worth as much as it costs at a certain time.
> 
> My phrase alarm goes off with this: " Times are tough for composers" - they've never been better, financially and technologically. It's always just a very few that can make a living out of it, all others are just exchangable supplementary staff.



I was speaking financially. I'd like to see statistics backing up your point of view, which I find interesting, odd, and maybe a little sneering?


----------



## Ashermusic (Feb 8, 2009)

NYC Composer @ Sun Feb 08 said:


> PolarBear @ Sat Feb 07 said:
> 
> 
> > A 50% off groupbuy doesn't double the customers number usually. So I doubt it will be more sales let alone three times as much if you go for a half decent price. With QLSO you essentially had that price model exercised... they went down more and more to get people buying it. But it only worked because they initially claimed double the price of what it was worth to some... because anything is only worth as much as it costs at a certain time.
> ...



Larry, Polar Bear, by his own admission, does not do this for a living, so that explains why (sorry, Polar Bear) he is a little clueless about how non A-List composers have been affected in the last few years.


----------



## careyford (Feb 8, 2009)

A group buy wouldn't have to be 50% for me. In fact, you could offer it for an amount slightly less than what the dealers sell it for and the manufacturer can keep the dealers' share. Then the library's maker does the same or better, right? Of course, I'll probably buy it either way...


----------



## synthetic (Feb 8, 2009)

This library is very reasonably priced. It's a bit tacky to be asking for a group buy in the announcement thread of a library that isn't even available. I can't think of any reason for a developer to have a group buy of a brand new, hot library except to lose a bunch of money.


----------



## tfishbein82 (Feb 8, 2009)

EDIT: This thread got way off track.

Best of luck with the library. Looking forward to demos.


----------



## John DeBorde (Feb 8, 2009)

You gotta keep in mind too that a string library involves a lot more players and therefore cost than a solo woodwind lib for example. Not to mention the countless hours of editing that must be involved.

can't wait to check it out Thonex! =o =o =o


----------



## dannthr (Feb 8, 2009)

Let the man price his product--opening prices should always aim high and lower later, that's just the way it goes.

Why?

There are two reasons to price a product high:

1) Psychological.

There are, believe it or not, people who prejudge the quality of a product by its price. It's an elitist BS psycho-crap way of looking at things, but it's not something people have control over. Bargain bin products are sometimes ignored completely.

2) Pure Sales Tech

If you release a product at a high price, there are people who will pay that price, no matter what, for a new product, especially if it means that they have exclusive access to something others don't--another psychological technique, but frankly it's true. If he released the product cheap then he'd be missing out on the opportunity to take advantage of the high-rollers right out of the gate (which is the only time you can do that). Ideally, this would be a high priced product for an indefinite time while other companies prepare competing products. Once other companies release competing products, then the price should go down to draw in people who are undecided and the price should continue to drop until his product has saturated the marketplace.



Frankly, I really want this thing, but if Andrew releases it at a price I can afford, he's a BAD marketer.


----------



## NYC Composer (Feb 8, 2009)

dannthr @ Sun Feb 08 said:


> Let the man price his product--opening prices should always aim high and lower later, that's just the way it goes.
> 
> Why?
> 
> ...



I disagree.

In my opinion,placing a product within the price range of hobbyists, struggling professionals and high end professionals alike will generate the most sales. Any upgrades and chanòËE   ”˜pËE   ”˜qËE   ”˜rËE   ”˜sËE   ”˜tËE   ”˜uËE   ”˜vËE   ”˜wËE   ”˜xËE   ”˜yËE   ”˜zËE   ”˜{ËE   ”˜|ËE   ”˜}ËE   ”˜~ËE   ”˜ËE   ”˜€ËE   ”˜ËE   ”˜‚ËE   ”˜ƒËE   ”˜„ËE   ”˜…ËE   ”˜†ËE   ”˜‡ËE   ”˜ˆËE   ”˜‰ËE   ”˜ŠËE   ”˜‹ËE   ”˜ŒËE   ”˜ËE   ”˜ŽËE   ”˜ËE   ”˜ËE   ”˜‘ËE   ”˜’ËE   ”˜“ËE   ”˜”ËE   ”˜•ËE   ”˜–ËE   ”˜—ËE   ”˜˜ËE   ”˜™ËE   ”˜šËE   ”˜›ËE   ”˜œËE   ”˜ËE   ”˜žËE   ”˜ŸËE   ”˜ ËE   ”˜¡ËE   ”˜¢ËE   ”˜£ËE   ”˜¤ËE   ”˜¥ËE   ”˜¦ËE   ”˜§ËE   ”˜¨ËE   ”˜©ËE   ”˜ªËE   ”˜«ËE   ”˜¬ËE   ”˜­ËE   ”˜®ËE   ”˜¯ËE   ”˜°ËE   ”˜±ËE   ”˜²ËE   ”˜³ËE   ”˜´ËE   ”˜µËE   ”˜¶ËE   ”˜·ËE   ”˜¸ËE   ”˜¹ËE   ”˜ºËE   ”˜»ËE   ”˜¼ËE   ”˜½ËE   ”˜¾ËE   ”˜¿ËE   ”˜ÀËE   ”˜ÁËE   ”˜ÂËE   ”˜ÃËE   ”˜ÄËE   ”˜ÅËE   ”˜ÆËE   ”˜ÇËE   ”˜ÈËE   ”˜ÉËE   ”˜ÊËE   ”˜ËËE   ”˜ÌËE   ”˜ÍËE   ”˜ÎËE   ”˜ÏËE   ”˜ÐËE   ”˜ÑËE   ”˜ÒËE   ”˜ÓËE   ”˜ÔËE   ”˜ÕËE   ”˜ÖËE   ”˜×ËE   ”˜ØËE   ”˜ÙËE   ”˜ÚËE   ”˜ÛËE   ”˜ÜËE   ”˜ÝËE   ”˜ÞËE   ”˜ß              òËE   ”˜áËE   ”˜âËE   ”˜ãËE   ”˜äËE   ”˜åËE   ”˜æËE   ”˜çËE   ”˜èËE   ”˜éËE   ”˜êËE   ”˜ëËE   ”˜ìËE   ”˜íËE   ”˜îËF   ”˜ïËF   ”˜ðËF   ”˜ñËF   ”˜òËF   ”˜óËF   ”˜ôËF   ”˜õËF   ”˜öËF   ”˜÷ËF


----------



## NYC Composer (Feb 9, 2009)

Polar, professionals or hobbyists, we all share a common interest here, and sometimes have differing points of view. In this case, I was simply disagreeing with yours....no worries...let there be peace in the valley!

I am a veteran of the 'jingle' business, having written hundreds of radio and tv jingles and underscores. That business has almost totally collapsed due to licensing and library music. I have friends who are film scorers who are struggling much more than they once were as budgets for smaller films shrink. They spend much more time self promoting and marketing and less time writing. I think times are pretty tough. Not for the A list composers, obviously, but that's a very small and elite group.


----------



## dannthr (Feb 9, 2009)

GROUP HUG--valentine's day is coming up, let's make it happen people!


----------



## Ashermusic (Feb 9, 2009)

PolarBear @ Sun Feb 08 said:


> NYC Composer @ Sun Feb 08 said:
> 
> 
> > PolarBear @ Sat Feb 07 said:
> ...



I don't have stats either, but I have lived in LA since 1972 and I have seen more and more gigs vanish to Canada, budgets cut to almost nothing, etc. and I can tell you there are now fewer decent paying composer jobs for pros than ever in my memory. I recently was hired and then un-hired because another composer offered to do the job for free as long as he kept his back end royalties.

So when a new library comes along that is not inexpensive, even a great one, if I do not have a decent paying gig to use it on that amortizes the cost, I simply cannot justify buying it, especially if I already have tools that can do the job adequately.

And Polar Bear, you need to understand that when you discuss in what comes across as a cavalier manner an issue in which you have little or no financial stake with people whose careers and families are very much impacted, you may be met with some hostility. 

I would not, i.e., participate in a conversation with someone who works for an auto company and say to him, "People always need cars but after all the Japanese have been making better, more fuel efficient cars for a long time, so that is why you are in danger of losing your job."

Perhaps, a little more sensitivity to that might be in order.


----------



## PolarBear (Feb 9, 2009)

Well, you may be right, but call me bloody honest, I would probably do that, but however not just speak out with blind prejudice, but more a considered opinion, and I mean opinion, you may differ of course. It may be a philosphical approach at that because I'm always trying to lift my focus from the individual point of view to a more broader image of things. However I know that some simply aren't capable or willing to do that (nor do I deny them to do so) simply because their personal experience is another or has recently shifted.

Just one more thing on this - do you think that getting a job is more difficult because there is actually less work overall or because more work is spread to even more composers? In the latter case the bigger cake analogy would perfectly fit IMHO. As of sensitivity in order, not being involved in a business doesn't mean not knowing how some business is going to work, please keep that also in mind. The products may differ, the principles stay valid most of the time.

That being said my personal opinion is, that in such a small business the library is heading to spreading the good word is the most effective marketing tool and I think the most impact of that with LASS could be achieved with a 3-figure-US-$-price. Now aiming for that in the long term it's considered good business to "overprice" it a bit at first, which would result in "something below the $1500" mark, I'm sure it's not meant too far off here, which is quite much for "just" strings if you ask me.


----------



## Mr. Anxiety (Feb 9, 2009)

Guys, take it outside (of this forum) please.

Give Andrew some respect!


----------



## choc0thrax (Feb 9, 2009)

Ashermusic @ Mon Feb 09 said:


> I have lived in LA since 1972 and I have seen more and more gigs vanish to Canada



Nothin wrong with that!


----------



## Niah (Feb 9, 2009)

another win for rick moranis


----------



## artsoundz (Feb 9, 2009)

Mr. Anxiety @ Mon Feb 09 said:


> Guys, take it outside (of this forum) please.
> 
> Give Andrew some respect!



then what's the point of a forum? 

also, no one is disrespecting Andrew. This conversation isn't really significantly important however. Andrew may take note, but only he has the info needed to determine price. I imagine he is aware of the hurting economy.

after all, while LASS may be fantastic, it wont really be the determining factor if one gets work or not. It's either money or talent or a crap shoot.


----------



## NYC Composer (Feb 9, 2009)

Polar....I think there is less DECENT PAYING work because in this market, it is now possible to find someone to do _anything_ for _any_ price, as Jay indicated.
I don't to make this contentious, but I really don't think you get it.

Here's a rather specific case in point. Some guys I work with bid on a movie score. They are also a post production facility, so their budget included doing all Foley, sound design and effects, and post production sound, which is a lot of time and work. Theyagreed to do the whole thing in 4 weeks, which is nearly impossible. They started out with a 60k bid. They ended up accepting 14.5k.

A week later, after doing two rather good sounding cues, they were told that, despite their good work, the producers decided to do the score in India( they are Indian, as is my composer friend). It was 'more convenient' ( read...cheaper) to do so.I've also heard of small films being scored completely with library tracks. My own attempts to recreate myself in the industry have been largely thwarted by hungry people offering to 'do it for free'.

Trust me, it's tough out there.


----------



## NYC Composer (Feb 9, 2009)

Addendum....of course, Andrew will set the price for his product wherever he chooses. I guess this thread has gotten off course, and I'll stop my rant here.


----------



## Hannes_F (Feb 9, 2009)

My 2 cents:

Andrew should calculate what he would need to continue this sort of work with the same quality without bleeding out. Then add the margin for marketing and retailers ... and this would be the absolute minimum price. A reasonable price would be somewhat higher of course. But going below the minimum would be a nice gift given to his clients (us) but irresponsible towards himself, towards the trade of sample developers, towards alternatives like real orchestras and so on.

Basically if he made it too cheap it would be the same like being a composer working for too cheap. If you don't like the one you cannot like the other.

I feel with those members that have lost jobs but the answer can not be just to forward the price pressure to your suppliers. Well, it can help a little for short time before everything goes even worse because it does not really solve the problems. What you really need is to establish a counterpressure that goes upwards towards your clients and that is a totally different field.


----------



## Hannes_F (Feb 9, 2009)

That all being said I wonder about one thing:

Since I have been a member in this forum there have been comments by composers that would do/pay anything _if only_ somebody would release a library that could solve their strings problems. And I am sure they have been there before a long time.

Even the crazy price for AI has been considered a reasonable option by some _if it only could deliver ... _

Now there seems to be a library around the corner that could have the potential to do all that ... and be much less expensive than AI ... and people are complaining about the price even before a first demo is released. Wow.

I guess the only solution to this problem will be if finally somebody comes along that delivers _everything _for _free_.


----------



## NYC Composer (Feb 9, 2009)

Maybe I missed something...who was complaining?


----------



## Hannes_F (Feb 9, 2009)

NYC Composer @ Mon Feb 09 said:


> Maybe I missed something...who was complaining?



I thought, you were, and also Jay Asher. Pardon me if I misinterpreted your posts.


----------



## Jack Weaver (Feb 9, 2009)

My hope is that he charges enough & gets enough units sold to feel that it's exciting and not so debilitating to him so that he will continue and grow in this field.

I can't pretend to know what that exact sweet spot price shoud be. 

But I do know that if he continues to upgrade this product as time goes on that I'll have a product with continuously more value to me. If he's even more excited by his income and starts to create new libraries (hint, hint - Brass) then I'll have more quality libraries in the future. 

In some ways I worry that those software products with huge installed bases i.e., Spectrasonics and Logic that have distorted the price point and the customers' emotional response to pricing have left the smaller guys - many of whom are very, very good - with little wiggle room. Sure they can go on but it's not as compelling for them to continue to innovate. 

Thonex definitely has my support after hearing and seeing his stuff at NAMM. Anybody out there who _really _wants it (no matter what price it ends up at) can get it - it's one of those laws of the universe.


----------



## dcoscina (Feb 9, 2009)

I wish Thonex the best on his library. Looking forward to the demos.


----------



## dannthr (Feb 9, 2009)

Yes, let's return this discussion to its rightful place--with forks slamming down upon the tabletops and us screaming DEMOS DEMOS DEMOS, DEMOS DEMOS DEMOS.


----------



## Ashermusic (Feb 9, 2009)

Hannes_F @ Mon Feb 09 said:


> NYC Composer @ Mon Feb 09 said:
> 
> 
> > Maybe I missed something...who was complaining?
> ...



I was not complaining, just describing the reality as I see it. (Oh OK, I guess I was complaining also

None of which obligates Andrew to factor any of this into his pricing decisions.


----------



## PolarBear (Feb 9, 2009)

Hannes_F @ Mon Feb 09 said:


> Basically if he made it too cheap it would be the same like being a composer working for too cheap. If you don't like the one you cannot like the other.


_Finally_ someone trying to shift focus from an individual point of view a bit and looking through these arguemnts that seem to be valid only on one side for some. I almost thought it would never happen. Now I can give it a rest I think. Thank you.


----------



## PolarBear (Feb 9, 2009)

Oh and: DEMONS DEMOS DEMONS DEMOS DEMONS DEMOS


----------



## dcoscina (Feb 9, 2009)

I think this banter about pricing is just to keep this thread alive in a subconscious way in which we can nag Thonex until he releases demos anyhow. 

IS IT WORKING??? :lol:


----------



## Thonex (Feb 10, 2009)

Hi Guys,

I'm not offended at all by the pricing banter going on. For many of us, pricing is as valid a consideration as the quality and usefulness of a library when considering it's purchase. 



dcoscina @ Mon Feb 09 said:


> I think this banter about pricing is just to keep this thread alive in a subconscious way in which we can nag Thonex until he releases demos anyhow.
> 
> IS IT WORKING??? :lol:



@ Dcoscina :D 

I'll quote myself  



> I'm still in the final stretches of finishing up patches... so it's going to be a little while yet. But rest assured... when the patches are ready we'll get demos up asap... And VI-Control will be the first to know about it. :D
> 
> As good as the patches sound right now and sounded at NAMM, there are still issues and patches that need to be addressed. I appreciate all of your patience.
> 
> ...



Maybe I should have a special "Patient Customer" discount when I release this :D ... all of you have been very supportive and patient. 

Cheers,

T


----------



## dcoscina (Feb 10, 2009)

Thonex, in all seriousness, when you get this released, you ought to consider throwing it up at TrySound.com like Project SAM did with Symphobia. If the outlay of cash will indeed be over $1000 then it would be useful to those buyers on the financial fence to decide if the expenditure is worth it.


----------



## ComposerDude (Feb 10, 2009)

Of course it will be great. Thonex = Tonal Excellence.


----------



## Hans Adamson (Feb 10, 2009)

dcoscina @ Tue Feb 10 said:


> Thonex, in all seriousness, when you get this released, you ought to consider throwing it up at TrySound.com like Project SAM did with Symphobia. If the outlay of cash will indeed be over $1000 then it would be useful to those buyers on the financial fence to decide if the expenditure is worth it.


Isn't Trysound.com Best Service's demo station for the software they sell? My understanding was that it is for products sold by Best Service only. ? (o) ?


----------



## Niah (Feb 10, 2009)

Hans Adamson @ Tue Feb 10 said:


> dcoscina @ Tue Feb 10 said:
> 
> 
> > Thonex, in all seriousness, when you get this released, you ought to consider throwing it up at TrySound.com like Project SAM did with Symphobia. If the outlay of cash will indeed be over $1000 then it would be useful to those buyers on the financial fence to decide if the expenditure is worth it.
> ...



you can try at try-sound symphobia, so I guess any product they have in store can be featured on try-sound.com

I would love this too, it was through try-sound that I saw the potential of symphobia

demos are nice and all put there's nothing like playing the thing under your fingers


----------



## dcoscina (Feb 10, 2009)

Try Sound works off of any Kontakt format libraries. LASS should be compatible


----------



## Audun Jemtland (Feb 10, 2009)

Price it what you want,I would even gladly donate money to keep thonex' wheels going (other orchestra sections) It will be a superb library,it's a step in the right direction
This fella pretty much sums it up^^
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HCt1BwWE ... re=related


----------



## StrangeCat (Feb 10, 2009)

I would think it would have to be at least $1400 dollars 
maybe $1200. You have solo strings and string ensembles in the lib and your going to want to compete with say VSL and Symphobia, and SSI strings. All those are in $1000 dollar range.


----------



## Jack Weaver (Feb 10, 2009)

For the record and to place things in perspective, the VSL full string package is $8,598/USD.

Possibly $1,500 for LASS? Not really a big problem. 

Even AI with the 2 computers and all the extra software included is only about $6,500.


----------



## PolarBear (Feb 11, 2009)

For the record and to keep things even more in perspective I'd not quote apple and oranges comparisons. Guys. Please do not fall for marketing tricks like posting the number of bytes and bits per dollar/cent. At these GPO would always win (btw. also featuring section and solos plus quite a bit more). It's not about that, it's about the flexibility and ease of use that it has to offer when having that special sound. And... afterall, we'll have to see that. I'm sure it won't do bad at $1500, the question just is how much better it would do at below $1000... not that it makes marketing any simpler.


----------



## Craig Sharmat (Feb 11, 2009)

Ease of use yes, but the main reason the library was formed was to create great sounding strings. How many gbs it is and how many cool tools is not on the radar if the library does not sound exceptional.

So

u need demos...


----------



## dannthr (Feb 11, 2009)

DOMES EDMOS ODEMS SEDMO DESMO MODES ODESM DEMOS!!!!!!!111111111


----------



## Mihkel Zilmer (Feb 11, 2009)

dannthr @ Thu Feb 12 said:


> DOMES EDMOS ODEMS SEDMO DESMO MODES ODESM DEMOS!!!!!!!111111111



Aye, agreed!


----------



## Nick Batzdorf (Feb 11, 2009)

Yeah, come on Thonex! Let's hear some demos before the library is ready so that they can be torn apart and people can throw rotten fruits!


----------



## NYC Composer (Feb 12, 2009)

I support individual pricing. For everyone else, $1500. For me ( and ONLY me) $795.00

Hey, I'm from New York...you gotta problem wit' dat??


( wait...additionally,Polar has to pay two grand :wink: )


----------



## Ashermusic (Feb 12, 2009)

NYC Composer @ Thu Feb 12 said:


> Hey, I'm from New York...you gotta problem wit' dat??
> 
> 
> ( wait...additionally,Polar has to pay two grand :wink: )



YANKEES SUCK, go Sox!


----------



## PolarBear (Feb 12, 2009)

I'll do a demo or even three if he hands me over a prerelease version for free... in 2015 :D


----------



## NYC Composer (Feb 12, 2009)

Ashermusic @ Thu Feb 12 said:


> NYC Composer @ Thu Feb 12 said:
> 
> 
> > Hey, I'm from New York...you gotta problem wit' dat??
> ...



Cool wit' me, I'm a Mets fan! Bill Buckner is a God in my world.

( still, if it's Yankees vs Sox....)


----------



## Thonex (Feb 20, 2009)

A teaser demo is posted on this thread:

http://www.vi-control.net/forum/viewtopic.php?p=147719

Cheers,

T


----------



## PolarBear (Feb 20, 2009)

We can only hope for a good price. If you ask me, people will pay anything for it. Almost anything.


----------



## dcoscina (Feb 20, 2009)

my wife teaches Grade 6 elementary school and she's been doing some basic music with her class. She wanted to bridge examples of classical orchestral instruments with their use in contemporary music. So she pulled a couple songs out like Coldplay's Viva whatever and The Verve's Bittersweet Symphony for strings. She also used a Pink song but I told her that those were sampled strings not real. She asked me how I could tell and I said the bowing gives it away. It's so hard to accurately reproduce the complexities and variations in bowing by a group of string players. Also, the addition of vibrato is another give away. Based on the demo of LASS, I would say that sampled strings have gotten that much closer to the real thing. Good job Thonex. Some day I will spring for this library too as it sounds rich, clear, and realistic.


----------



## NYC Composer (Feb 22, 2009)

PolarBear @ Fri Feb 20 said:


> We can only hope for a good price. If you ask me, people will pay anything for it. Almost anything.



Really?? $10,000? First born child?


----------

