# Broadway Big Band update soon?



## ag75 (Mar 26, 2016)

I wrote on the Fable Sound Facebook wall yesterday asking if the update would be coming soon and they replied: 

"Making new features videos right now. Release date will be announced shortly after."

Getting excited.


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## NYC Composer (Mar 26, 2016)

Might be wise to curb your enthusiasm  Still, you never know.


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## Ben H (Mar 27, 2016)

Some of us remember when it was "coming soon" 3 years ago


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## Guy Rowland (Mar 27, 2016)

Well, as it's a free update, all will swiftly be forgiven and forgotten if it's really great...


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## rgarber (Mar 28, 2016)

Free would sure help me out, just bought a house a couple of months ago. - Rich


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## autopilot (May 23, 2016)

*checks watch* 
*shakes watch*


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## Prockamanisc (May 23, 2016)

autopilot said:


> *checks watch*
> *shakes watch*


*asks for the time*
*gets yelled at and is told to just be patient*
*says a quiet prayer that the update will come soon*
*goes back to forgetting about update*


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## rgarber (May 25, 2016)

Considering how much the library cost, it's disappointing to see this happen. Sure makes you appreciate EVERYBODY else that doesn't have exorbitant costing libraries and still deliver a great product. I'm not complaining though, I still haven't used this library for anything yet. Mostly I use Warp IV, Chris Hein and Sample Modeling for my horns.


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## ag75 (May 25, 2016)

I asked on their Facebook page a few days ago and got this response: "Making new features videos right now. Release date will be announced shortly after." So hopefully soon!


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## autopilot (May 25, 2016)

That's exactly what they said in March.

Man - rendering those videos must be slow.


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## Udo (May 26, 2016)

As I said on an other forum, Yuval Shrem's (Fable Sound) definition of "imminent" appears to be "this decade".

There may be valid reasons, but there's no excuse for the way he's handling it. Repeated announcements over 3 years saying it's "imminent", without follow-up info in case of delays ...., not even a comment on the website ....


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## jamwerks (May 26, 2016)

The word of this guy has permanently lost any credibility....


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## Ah_dziz (May 27, 2016)

To be fair to the guy. He did say that they had run into major bugs in the update. Also the latest is that NI have the library for encoding. To be unfair to him he acted towards me like the arranger multiscript would be available for Broadway Lites users and has explicitly told others that it won't be. Also the upgrade to the full library (which is very steeply priced, like maybe he charges per sample) is just new mic positions and drums and banjos and stuff which gives me nothing I want. I would pay good money for just the multiscript though.


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## Udo (May 27, 2016)

Ah_dziz said:


> ........ Also the latest is that NI have the library for encoding.......


That was in February!

As I said before, there may be valid reasons, but there's no excuse for the way he's handling it. Repeated announcements over 3 years saying it's "imminent", without follow-up info in case of delays ...., not even a comment on the website ....


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## gjelul (May 27, 2016)

Guy Rowland said:


> Well, as it's a free update, all will swiftly be forgiven and forgotten if it's really great...



Very cynical way of seeing things. You either have a product and you support it, or you don't. If there is an update after 3 years, and if it is good indeed, he's doing a favor to himself and his product first and then to the buyer.

My 2cents, anyways


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## Rasmus Hartvig (Jun 10, 2016)

Paging @Fable Sounds ... Is the update ever gonna be released?


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## Guy Rowland (Jun 10, 2016)

gjelul said:


> Very cynical way of seeing things. You either have a product and you support it, or you don't. If there is an update after 3 years, and if it is good indeed, he's doing a favor to himself and his product first and then to the buyer.
> 
> My 2cents, anyways



Eh? Just seen this - struggling to see how saying "once it's out, if it's good then we'll all forget about the delay" is cynical, but there we are. The opposite, if anything. I probably misunderstand your post, but I've read it three times and drawn a blank.


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## rgarber (Jun 10, 2016)

I still find it so peculiar that BBB was the library to have even as it was introduced. It was and still is very expensive. Yet, I never, ever, seen anybody put out a clip using the thing except what's on the BBB website. And I have said this other times, even earlier in this thread, I think. And somebody will say, oh yeah, I used it... but still no music clip. Maybe this thread tells us the secret. You'd think the cream of the crop for a Big Band library would have more of an outcry except for the occasional lament like this thread. Maybe the library didn't sell well or hardly at all - to make any effort to do the update worth it. Or maybe.... If I didn't own a copy of the library myself I'd say the whole BBB thing is like that movie where the lunar landings are staged in some hangar and hence there is no BBB! <g> - Rich


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## gjelul (Jul 1, 2016)

Guy Rowland said:


> Eh? Just seen this - struggling to see how saying "once it's out, if it's good then we'll all forget about the delay" is cynical, but there we are. The opposite, if anything. I probably misunderstand your post, but I've read it three times and drawn a blank.




Bottom line:
Release the update!.... if there is an actual one and the talking would stop.


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## Brendon Williams (Jul 1, 2016)

rgarber said:


> I never, ever, seen anybody put out a clip using the thing except what's on the BBB website.



I have Broadway Lites, and I still think there are some real gems in it. Depending on the context, I find the saxes and clarinet to be more convincing than Sample Modeling. 

Here's a little example of a composition of mine that uses the clarinet very briefly. The saxes that follow are actually live, since I play saxophone (minus the bari, which is Broadway Lites). 



As for the update, I'm a bit confused. I talked to Yuval at NAMM for the last two years, and both times he demonstrated the update in what seemed to be a ready-to-go state, so I have no idea what the delay is.


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## rgarber (Jul 3, 2016)

Hey Brendon! I have the full version of BBB but I bought it more like a collector's thing (I'm weird like that) as I continually keep using Warp IV, Chris Hein, Sample Modeling for my stuff. But with BBB, it was touted as the best of the "all in one" package and that's just it, I've never heard or seen anything of BBB where the mock-up was all or mostly, BBB. Now don't get me wrong, this is not a criticism. I love BBB, (sheepishly) just never used it. I mean if you go to Chris' site or Warp IV, there's a ton of demos that I feel is a great way to get familiar with what the library can do. With BBB, there's just a smattering of demos. And I just don't get it. With that kind of price tag, I thought it was like the best for big band like Miraslov, at the time or maybe still is, was for strings and everybody wishing they had it. I did however always thought it was a marketing flaw, for Yuval, at the time to not offer various packages like just the brass or just the saxes, whatever. But you know what I'm saying? With so few demos, even from Yuval, I get the sense even he doesn't like to use BBB! Just being silly there. The demos or other people's work inspire me and/or give me incentive to do even better than I am (I fault a competitive music streak). And I'm not losing sleep over this or the upgrade, BBB, and why we paid so much money for it is a mystery to me. Well, let me walk some of this back. I remembered very briefly trying out the trumpet with a WX5 controller and I was like Wow! And I thought, BBB must be good, but then why doesn't anybody use it? Maybe they're too busy making money? - Rich


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## Fable Sounds (Jul 3, 2016)

Hi Rich,

Most of the official demos, as well as most of the user demos of Broadway Big Band on the Fable Sounds website are indeed either exclusively made with Broadway Big Band, or almost exclusively using Broadway Big Band (there are details regarding each demo and its instrumentation).

Most of the users we are aware of, who are using Broadway Big Band on a daily basis, are doing so in high-profile projects, which they can't share online, since the rights for the master belong to the client (usually a TV network or a major movie studio), which is why so few of those tracks surface online as demos.

Regardless, you already have the product, why not give it a try? Most of our users who have both Broadway and the other products you mentioned, told us they pretty much stopped using the other products once the started using Broadway, even if their initial intention was to mix and match, because of the significant gaps in quality. I am not making my own judgement here, but rather conveying what I was told my a multitude of users.

To answer your "who's using it?" question:

Broadway Big Band and Broadway Lites users have have been and/or are using it on many many projects including:

TV (very partial list):
The CONAN show
Saturday Night Live
Wow! Wow! Wubbzy!
Ape Escape

Movies (very partial list):
Despicable Me 2
The Smurfs 2
It's Complicated
Unbeatable Harold
High-School Musical 3

Live concerts and tours (very partial list):
Alicia Keys
The Commodores
Barry Manilow
Bobby Kimball
Dr. Lonnie Smith
Paul McCartney
Paul Simon

Musical theater and other theatrical shows (very partial list):
Dirty Rotten Scoundrels (Broadway national tour)
Fiddler On The Roof (award winning Israeli production)
Cirque Du Soleil (France)

And these are just a few of the ones that I'm personally aware of.

I hope this answers your question....

Best,

Yuval Shrem
Fable Sounds


P.S.

Expect official announcements about 2.0 in the next 24 hours...


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## rgarber (Jul 3, 2016)

Hi Yuval,

Alright! There's the man! Good to see you here. You wrote:

"Regardless, you already have the product, why not give it a try?"

That's a good question. The answer is simple and somewhat embarrassing, just not enough time. I'm not organized like I would like to be. Plus I'm just now getting more proficient at mixing than I was previously. In a way it's a blessing I didn't experiment with BBB before just cause my mixes wouldn't have sounded very good and I would have blamed the library. I used to think I couldn't get a better sound than I got out of the midi.

But through it all I'm better suited now to experiment with libraries than I was before. I'll be getting the update or experimenting with BBB shortly as I'm closing in on getting caught up.


Rich


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## NYC Composer (Jul 3, 2016)

Make it beyond fabulous, retail it for under a grand and all sins of late deliverance will be forgiven. (Well, at least by me, a potential but not present client.  )

Make it $2500 again, good luck with the launch!


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## Fable Sounds (Jul 4, 2016)

NYC Composer said:


> Make it beyond fabulous, retail it for under a grand and all sins of late deliverance will be forgiven. (Well, at least by me, a potential but not present client.  )
> 
> Make it $2500 again, good luck with the launch!




You're in luck!

Check THIS out!


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## NYC Composer (Jul 4, 2016)

Fable Sounds said:


> You're in luck!
> 
> Check THIS out!


Well, I agree that it's a ton better than $2500-just not quite under 1k. You've had BBB on sale for $1k at least once in the past, I believe.

The fabulous new and improved BBB is a bit of a joker, and the time frame- honestly, because of past history I have to put it in the TBD category. Still, I agree, a step in the right direction.


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## vicontrolu (Jul 4, 2016)

Fable Sounds said:


> Regardless, you already have the product, why not give it a try? Most of our users who have both Broadway and the other products you mentioned, told us they pretty much stopped using the other products once the started using Broadway, even if their initial intention was to mix and match, because of the significant gaps in quality.




I am using BBB Lites on every jazz/big band project i get. Its a great library overall but the xfades between layers when using CC are just not good enough. That makes it very very hard to use as a main brass library, cause you know..its all about the swells. You can use the swell aritculations but they are locked in time so they almost never never fit in.

For this reason, i mainly use other brass libraries (Samplemodelling or even Session horns Pro) and use BBB to complement the other.


I do wish the new update inlcudes better xfade between dynamic layers. I think just that would make the library stand out against competitors. Go Fable!


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## FriFlo (Jul 4, 2016)

I could be interested, but I don't like rushed decisions for buying something in that price range ... Maybe you could give a somewhat larger timeframe for the discount and make some walkthroughs with v2 before the offer ends, Yuval? I find the current sale price rather ok for the content provided, but as for its usual sale price I have to admit it seems a little bit against the trend how libraries are priced these days.


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## Fable Sounds (Jul 4, 2016)

Even through we did so a few times in the past, this time we are not going to extend the time-frame of this 48-hours special, so if you are interested in this special price you may need to make a decision rather quickly. That said, I am finalizing a walk-through video of the 2.0 main new features, and will try to release it before the end of this offer, so you hopefully this should help you make your purchasing decision. 

We are well aware of the pricing trends of the market, and are pricing our upcoming products accordingly, however, this product was priced a while ago, and has not really lost any of its value since. Frankly, it hasn't slowed down in sales either. It is a product that is a true long-term investment. Many of the newer lower-priced products that have been coming out lately, are unfortunately also a part of a trend of products that haven't been developed as deeply and carefully, and end up having much shorter shelf-lives. Broadway Big Band is a work-horse that you will keep coming back to for many years to come, sometimes not even just for its wind instruments, but for its rhythm section instruments. There's a wealth of content in this library that is hard to fully realize until you really start to dig in, and I'm confident that if you make music for a living, it will be an investment that pays for itself rather quickly. 

Best,

Yuval Shrem
Fable Sounds


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## NYC Composer (Jul 4, 2016)

It's silly to argue pricing, as each product manufacturer decides their own and if it works for you, I'm pleased. Speaking only for myself, I've always admired your product but found it a bit richly priced. Like FriFlo, I don't like nailbiting pressurized sales, but again, your marketing is up to you. I don't know if I could call my participation in the music game "a living" these days, but my big band vocalist songs and smaller horn quartets and quintets have been and are presently on television quite a bit using some "lower priced products" so I guess it's possible.

Maybe your walkthrough will make me lose the will to resist!


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## HardyP (Jul 4, 2016)

I only have BBB Lite, but I'm loving the sound and the concept (KS is komplex, but I found it surprisingly fast to learn, and the possibilities are nearly endless...).
What I do not like:
- not enough velocity layers/no top notch x-fade programming (Trombone for ex.: amazing sound, but the velocity programming is killing me)
- the pricing strategy is like Apple's: 10% more value for 100% higher price...
- the gap between Lite and Full. There should be 1-2 medium sized products with all winds/brass, nothing else. Upgrade from Lite <<500$


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## Fable Sounds (Jul 5, 2016)

HardyP said:


> I only have BBB Lite, but I'm loving the sound and the concept (KS is komplex, but I found it surprisingly fast to learn, and the possibilities are nearly endless...).
> What I do not like:
> - not enough velocity layers/no top notch x-fade programming (Trombone for ex.: amazing sound, but the velocity programming is killing me)
> - the pricing strategy is like Apple's: 10% more value for 100% higher price...
> - the gap between Lite and Full. There should be 1-2 medium sized products with all winds/brass, nothing else. Upgrade from Lite <<500$




Hi Hardy,

I'd like to respond to some of your observations:

The velocity of the trombone is "killing you" because the dynamic range of a trombone is far wider than that of a midi keyboard. This is addressed in the user manual, where we recommend either using the mod-wheel only mode, where dynamics can be safely controlled by the modulation wheel (or any other midi controller you choose), or using midi compressor in your DAW on the trombone track. That is definitely NOT due to lack of dynamic layers, but rather the inclusion of the naturally very wide dynamic range of the sampled instrument.

As a user of Broadway Lites only, I'm not sure you're in a perfect position to make a fair judgement call about the differences between Broadway Big Band and Broadway Lites. Broadway Lites offers 15GB of audio content in 8 legato instruments. Broadway Big Band offers 100GB of audio content (that's 8 times more content for less than 5 times the price) and includes many more instruments and much more sonic flexibility, which makes a very big difference in music production. Broadway Lites is very capable, but the price difference does accurately reflect the difference in value. To claim that it's a 10% improvement is not an observation based on reality. Frankly, I'm not sure what that observation is based on, but it simply isn't true.

There are not going to be products in the Broadway series, positioned between Broadway Big Band and Broadway Lites. This is just not going to happen. There is however, one more product in the series, which is specifically aimed at live-show keyboardists on a budget. That upcoming product will offer less content for a lower price, and is very task-specific. More on that in the near future...

For now, if you'd like to expand Broadway Lites, and get more articulations, more instruments and more sonic flexibility, as well as early access to the 2.0 public beta, *you have 24 hours to get it for 48% discount*.

Cheers,

Yuval Shrem
Fable Sounds


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## vicontrolu (Jul 5, 2016)

Yuval,

Thanks for all the detailed answers you are giving on this thread. I think you are making some pretty valid points.


You havent mentioned anything about the xfade issues though. You suggest using modwheel only in the trombone but if you ever tried this, you'd agree with me that is not usable at all. Layers come in and out in a strange fashion, not natural. Its definitely not a phase issue here and there, but something bigger.

You have the layers so its just about fine tunning the crossfades, putting a bit of time into this, not KSP programming involved...i honestly dont think its that hard to fix (i think i'd have done it myself if i had the wrench button available in kontakt).

So, letme ask you straight: Is there a plan for improving the xfades in this update?

Thanks a lot


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## Fable Sounds (Jul 5, 2016)

vicontrolu said:


> Yuval,
> 
> Thanks for all the detailed answers you are giving on this thread. I think you are making some pretty valid points.
> 
> ...



I would not at all agree with you when you say that "it is not usable at all". Frankly, it sounds to me a lot like you are using it incorrectly. To switch to mod-wheel only, you need to either click the "Midi CC only" button, or use the key switch on A-1. If you try to use the mod-wheel for dynamics otherwise, you'll get a lot of out-of-control cross-fades. Personally, I play the parts in normally and edit the velocity later in the DAW. If I want to more easily play in a specific portion of the range throughout an entire part, I engage a Midi compressor as a midi plug-in, which makes it easy to play using the keyboard velocity in a more controlled manner. In the rare occasion I use the "Midi CC only" mode, I can control the dynamics with precision without worrying about hitting the right dynamics through the keyboard velocity or needing to edit it later or using it in a DAW. 

As for crescendo and diminuendo cross-fades, some of them are better than other, and many of them are being improved with the 2.0 update. That said, as a heavy user of Broadway Big Band myself, I can tell you I rarely need to use those. I always try to use the pre-recorded crescendos when possible, and other various articulations for diminuendo purposes, before I even touch the modulation wheel. In Broadway Big Band there are often better ways to achieve the effect without resorting to cross-fade manipulation, through pre-recorded articulations that convey the changes in dynamics, which are much more realistic and musically expressive.

It is a really good idea to read the manual for details.

Best,

Yuval Shrem


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## NYC Composer (Jul 5, 2016)

I think that's a no.


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## vicontrolu (Jul 5, 2016)

I have been using the library since it came out and the first thing i did was reading the manual, specially with those multikey press keyswitches. But thanks for the suggestion anyway.

I agree with you that its always best to find a pre recorded articulation whenever its possible but decent CC xfades are needed and not there currently imho. I think i remember trombones were the least good, but i might be wrong.

I'll add a simple example when i am in front of the computer.

Thanks for the quick aswer!


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## Fable Sounds (Jul 5, 2016)

NYC Composer said:


> I think that's a no.



Think again after you READ my post. I specifically said that we made improvements to the cross-fades with the 2.0 update.


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## Fable Sounds (Jul 5, 2016)

vicontrolu said:


> I have been using the library since it came out and the first thing i did was reading the manual, specially with those multikey press keyswitches. But thanks for the suggestion anyway.
> 
> I agree with you that its always best to find a pre recorded articulation whenever its possible but decent CC xfades are needed and not there currently imho. I think i remember trombones were the least good, but i might be wrong.
> 
> ...




Hi, Thank you for being an early adapter of our product!
The Midi-CC only mode is a function we've added in Kontakt Edition, so reading the manual of the original HALion powered release wouldn't have covered it. Regardless, we know that the cross-fades aren't perfect in some cases, and we have made and are making improvements on that front as part of the upcoming 2.0 update.


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## NYC Composer (Jul 5, 2016)

Fable Sounds said:


> Think again after you READ my post. I specifically said that we made improvements to the cross-fades with the 2.0 update.


You're right, I missed it. My apologies.


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## Fleer (Jul 5, 2016)

BBB Lites is €99 over at VSTBuzz


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## NYC Composer (Jul 5, 2016)

I surrender to the great deal! Buying now.

Hmmm...did anyone else do this deal? I have a serial but no links-I wonder does VST Buzz have to send them out manually...


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## theXbucket (Jul 5, 2016)

i did it too! no links for me too. i think they will come later. don´t know if we have to wait until the deal is over to get the links.


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## NYC Composer (Jul 6, 2016)

I wrote to them and got my dl instructions, suggest you do the same if it hasn't shown up in your account yet. Cheers.


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## Vovique (Jul 6, 2016)

NYC Composer said:


> I surrender to the great deal! Buying now.


Surrended right away myself. Awesome.
Download is via Continuata - just use your serial number. But first register your serial at http://continuata.net/register/


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## HardyP (Jul 6, 2016)

Hi Yuval,

thanks for taking the time to answer!!



Fable Sounds said:


> ... we recommend either using the mod-wheel only mode, where dynamics can be safely controlled by the modulation wheel (or any other midi controller you choose), or using midi compressor in your DAW on the trombone track. That is definitely NOT due to lack of dynamic layers, but rather the inclusion of the naturally very wide dynamic range of the sampled instrument.


That´s what I did. I am allways trying to play in live, depending on the library using vel. or CC, and then I am tweaking afterwards in my DAW. But specifically in the trombone, I would like to have a smoother x-fade between the two top dynamic levels. It´s such a great sound, I fell in love with the creamy emotion it can bring - but when I was tweaking the CCs to have just a tiny little bit more swell, suddenly the "brassy storm" set in. 
In my personal opinion, everything relates to your approach: delivering the premium product (see also comments below). And if I understand http://fablesounds.com/B-Lites-about.html (this comparison) right, there is no difference in programming/velocity layers, just more instruments and the mic positions.
But hey, let´s see what 2.0 will unveil !



Fable Sounds said:


> As a user of Broadway Lites only, I'm not sure you're in a perfect position to make a fair judgement call about the differences between Broadway Big Band and Broadway Lites...To claim that it's a 10% improvement is not an observation based on reality. Frankly, I'm not sure what that observation is based on, but it simply isn't true.


Sorry for not beeing specific enough: The "10%" comparison was in no way meant to describe the Lite to Full difference, but your business approach...!! It is my (subjective) feeling, that BBB is really top notch, having the edge towards the capabilities of _other products_ (lets say CH Horns and CH Winds). But your price increase is much more than this advantage. Now it´s to the customer, if we think the advantage is worth it.
As you allready said, for some it is - and as we could read, for some it is not.

I hope I was a little bit more understandable right now (not being a native speaker) - kind regards,
Hardy


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## vicontrolu (Jul 6, 2016)

Btw guys...does anybody have some Expression Maps ready for BBB Lites?


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## rgarber (Jul 6, 2016)

vicontrolu said:


> Btw guys...does anybody have some Expression Maps ready for BBB Lites?



Don't laugh, but what's an expression map? - Rich


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## Ashermusic (Jul 6, 2016)

rgarber said:


> Don't laugh, but what's an expression map? - Rich



Articulation switching in Cubase.


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## rgarber (Jul 6, 2016)

Thanks, I find that interesting though cause I one time suggested to the Studio One folks if a feature could be added that would remember certain expression changes I made where I use them to change the inflection (maybe not the best choice of word there) of an instrument. I end up having to keep drawing the things over and over or copy and paste. But they made a suggestion that works just as well. I was just wondering if that was the same thing or not. - Rich


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## autopilot (Jul 6, 2016)

Fable Sounds said:


> Hi Rich,
> 
> Best,
> 
> ...



*Looks at watch*

*shakes watch*


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## rgarber (Jul 6, 2016)

Don't quote me Auto, but I think Yuval was talking about the sale price thingy he has or had going. Regarding the update I believe he wrote this.... if I can find it.... here... "That said, I am finalizing a walk-through video of the 2.0 main new features, and will try to release it before the end of this offer, so you hopefully this should help you make your purchasing decision." - Rich


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## autopilot (Jul 6, 2016)

"P.S.

Expect official announcements about 2.0 in the next 24 hours..."

Vids have been "coming soon" since March  (See page one of this thread)


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## rgarber (Jul 6, 2016)

Well, at least you didn't quote me.  Yeah, I get what you're saying. But what I'm saying is that the only thing that came of it was the announcement for the sale so maybe he was talking about that or for whatever reason, again, the update is still in orbit.


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## devonmyles (Jul 6, 2016)

rgarber said:


> Thanks, I find that interesting though cause I one time suggested to the Studio One folks if a feature could be added that would remember certain expression changes I made where I use them to change the inflection (maybe not the best choice of word there) of an instrument. I end up having to keep drawing the things over and over or copy and paste. But they made a suggestion that works just as well. I was just wondering if that was the same thing or not. - Rich



Out of interest, what was the suggestion that they made ?


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## rgarber (Jul 7, 2016)

devonmyles said:


> Out of interest, what was the suggestion that they made ?



I've not had much success with wind controllers so I input mostly by hand. I'm not very good at keyboards, especially if a cat is laying on it, either. So I proposed the question to the tech and he basically said to try creating a reference track to import/load into a new worksheet. It does gets a bit cumbersome if you do like I did and create a reference track for each instrument. I wound up limiting the number of expressions on each track just because it becomes a heck of a lot of scrolling to locate the expression you want and there's no way to annotate what each expression is for. I created it's own folder so I wouldn't lose my "templates" either. Hope this helps! - Rich


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## ohernie (Jul 11, 2016)

Fable Sounds said:


> ... There is however, one more product in the series, which is specifically aimed at live-show keyboardists on a budget. That upcoming product will offer less content for a lower price, and is very task-specific. More on that in the near future...



Given this, is it worthwhile for a musician who will be using it live to pick up Broadway Lites via the current VSTBuzz sale?


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## bcarwell (Jul 11, 2016)

What does this bargain bin Broadway Lites have that isn't in JABB3 ?


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## Fable Sounds (Jul 12, 2016)

vicontrolu said:


> Btw guys...does anybody have some Expression Maps ready for BBB Lites?



To use expression maps effectively, you will need to work in the new notation mode, which will be included in the 2.0 update.


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## Fable Sounds (Jul 12, 2016)

autopilot said:


> "P.S.
> 
> Expect official announcements about 2.0 in the next 24 hours..."
> 
> Vids have been "coming soon" since March  (See page one of this thread)



The announcement did come in the commercial announcements section:

A public beta of 2.0 for Broadway Big Band (only) by early next month, followed by an official release for both Broadway Big Band and Broadway Lites a month or two later.


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## PhilP28 (Jul 12, 2016)

Brendon Williams said:


> I have Broadway Lites, and I still think there are some real gems in it. Depending on the context, I find the saxes and clarinet to be more convincing than Sample Modeling.
> 
> Here's a little example of a composition of mine that uses the clarinet very briefly. The saxes that follow are actually live, since I play saxophone (minus the bari, which is Broadway Lites).
> 
> As for the update, I'm a bit confused. I talked to Yuval at NAMM for the last two years, and both times he demonstrated the update in what seemed to be a ready-to-go state, so I have no idea what the delay is.



Hi Brendon,
Could you tell me what String library you used in that piece?
Thanks


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## Brendon Williams (Jul 12, 2016)

PhilP28 said:


> Hi Brendon,
> Could you tell me what String library you used in that piece?
> Thanks



It's all Hollywood strings.


----------



## PhilP28 (Jul 12, 2016)

Thanks.EastWest never offered something that I was interested in but your intro reminded me of Sam Cooke's - A change is gonna come.It's not even that expensive so I guess I'm gonna buy it.


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## Brendon Williams (Jul 12, 2016)

PhilP28 said:


> Thanks.EastWest never offered something that I was interested in but your intro reminded me of Sam Cooke's - A change is gonna come.It's not even that expensive so I guess I'm gonna buy it.



It's still my favorite string library that I've used. I just love the sound, and I love how deeply they've sampled everything (so many articulations!). That said, I've been eyeing the new CSS, just to have more options!


----------



## PhilP28 (Jul 12, 2016)

Ok but I guess we use these libraries for different genres. I'm more interested in creating that vocal Jazz, early soul type of sound while most people on this board seem to be into film composing. The string sections sound very similar, especially your example which was the reason why I signed up to this forum.


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## jon wayne (Jul 13, 2016)

BBB lite says sample content is 15 gigs. The first download was 11 gigs and the second was 12. Can someone tell me if you are getting the same results?


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## Przemek K. (Jul 13, 2016)

My download shows 12,6 gb. After extracting all files its 11,8. Although I believe that the 15gb is original wav files, and then was encoded with NI lossless compression algo to make the lib smaller in size.


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## Grizzlymv (Jul 13, 2016)

what do you think of it so far guys? do you find it easy to use with just the keyswitches/modwheel? The sound really convince me. But I'm uncertain about the ease of use and time it would require to program it to obtain a convincing phrase.


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## Lassi Tani (Jul 15, 2016)

Grizzlymv said:


> what do you think of it so far guys? do you find it easy to use with just the keyswitches/modwheel? The sound really convince me. But I'm uncertain about the ease of use and time it would require to program it to obtain a convincing phrase.



I grabbed Broadway Lites, because of the crazy deal, and so far it's easy to use. You don't have to have many patches, because you can change the articulation while playing a note, e.g. from normal to flutter, or from sustain to fall.


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## Grizzlymv (Jul 15, 2016)

sekkosiki said:


> I grabbed Broadway Lites, because of the crazy deal, and so far it's easy to use. You don't have to have many patches, because you can change the articulation while playing a note, e.g. from normal to flutter, or from sustain to fall.


Thanks. I finally decided to grab it given the crazy deal. Not disappointed. The sound is there. It is easier to use than what I was expecting. I was afraid it would require a Breath controller to be able to achieve convincing phrases live, but I'm pleased with how quickly and easily I can achieve something convincing with just the modwheel and keyboard. I can definitely see the benefits to upgrade to the full version for someone who need this kind of sound a lot. But for the kind of need I have at the moment, the content in the Lites version will be more than enough to cover it. Great addition in the toolbox.


----------



## vicontrolu (Aug 14, 2016)

No update yet?


----------



## Rasmus Hartvig (Aug 17, 2016)

vicontrolu said:


> No update yet?



The public beta was supposed to be "early this month". Not once in the history of the BBB 2.0 update has Fable Sounds kept a promised date, so why start now?


----------



## Rob Elliott (Aug 17, 2016)

Have a possible feature (period piece 1900-1910) - would this BBB get er done? The director is thinking early Jazz / ragtime - but with a 'looking forward vibe' (whatever that means  )


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## jamwerks (Aug 17, 2016)

Rob Elliott said:


> Have a possible feature (period piece 1900-1910) - would this BBB get er done? The director is thinking early Jazz / ragtime - but with a 'looking forward vibe' (whatever that means  )


Sounds like typical Director speak! To add-in that period vibe, maybe replicating 1940's recording technics would help, like panning, tape noise, eq, etc. ??


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## Rob Elliott (Aug 17, 2016)

Good idea for sure jamwerks.


----------



## Fable Sounds (Aug 17, 2016)

Rasmus Hartvig said:


> The public beta was supposed to be "early this month". Not once in the history of the BBB 2.0 update has Fable Sounds kept a promised date, so why start now?



Hi, we had a few last minute bug corrections, but if there are no new issues, we should be releasing the public beta within the next 48 hours, maybe even sooner. 

The public beta is for Broadway Big Band users only. 

Cheers, 
Yuval


----------



## Fable Sounds (Aug 17, 2016)

Rob Elliott said:


> Have a possible feature (period piece 1900-1910) - would this BBB get er done? The director is thinking early Jazz / ragtime - but with a 'looking forward vibe' (whatever that means  )



Hi, 

Broadway Big Band can do this. You will have to choose the right combination of instruments, mic setups and articulations, but it can certainly be done. Broadway Lites is not going to be the right choice, because it is a collection geared toward a more modern sound. 

For an oldie sound I usually make heavy use of the deep vibrato of the Tenor Sax 2 (played by the amazing Eli Degibri), and use the room mic (only) on the Bari Sax, and a combination of tight mics and room mics on the rest, with panning suggestive of old recording techniques. Then some additional processing on the master completes the illusion. Also, using mutes and plunger patterns on the brass helps a lot. Finally, the rhythm section Instruments in Broadway Big Band also lend themselves very well to that oldie sound. 

Cheers, 
Yuval


----------



## FriFlo (Aug 17, 2016)

Fable Sounds said:


> Hi, we had a few last minute bug corrections, but if there are no new issues, we should be releasing the public beta within the next 48 hours, maybe even sooner.
> 
> The public beta is for Broadway Big Band users only.
> 
> ...


Didn't you recently mention some video walkthroughs of v.2.0? Did I miss something?


----------



## Rob Elliott (Aug 17, 2016)

Fable Sounds said:


> Hi,
> 
> Broadway Big Band can do this. You will have to choose the right combination of instruments, mic setups and articulations, but it can certainly be done. Broadway Lites is not going to be the right choice, because it is a collection geared toward a more modern sound.
> 
> ...


Thanks Yuval - just so I don't misunderstand - what 'panning' specifically do you recommend (narrow width on individual instruments - almost a 'mono' sound?)


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## jamwerks (Sep 6, 2016)

Did the public beta ever make it out?


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## Rasmus Hartvig (Sep 7, 2016)

I didn't get an e-mail, so my guess is no. Unless it's only some users that are invited.


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## cAudio (Sep 7, 2016)

I'm going to buy this library today. Or within the next 48 hours. Definitely by the end the/(a) month.


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## lumcas (Sep 7, 2016)

cAudio said:


> I'm going to buy this library today. Or within the next 48 hours. Definitely by the end the/(a) month.


Why are you even bothering to let us know


----------



## autopilot (Sep 7, 2016)

looks at watch ...


----------



## Zookes (Sep 7, 2016)

*shakes head*


----------



## jamwerks (Sep 8, 2016)

"sighs in disbelief"...


----------



## HardyP (Sep 8, 2016)

*ponders about déjà vu*...


----------



## midiman (Sep 8, 2016)

*Someday....Someday*


----------



## reddognoyz (Sep 8, 2016)

YETI


----------



## lumcas (Sep 8, 2016)

Kojak's wife...


----------



## vicontrolu (Sep 12, 2016)




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## Ashermusic (Sep 12, 2016)

I talked to Yuval but I am not even going to repeat what he told me as there is no point. He will, apparently, release it when he releases it.


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## Rasmus Hartvig (Sep 15, 2016)

This has to be the most frustrating communication from a developer I have encountered. The update has been teased for years. Always "next week", "next month", "almost there". Each and every thing Fable Sounds has said about the release has turned out not to be true. Years of false promises, and now we're waiting for a public beta that somehow keeps getting delayed because of "elusive bugs" or whatever. Well, it's a friggin' BETA! The whole point of having a public beta is to weed out the last bugs, so why hold it back? 
By now the check has been in the mail for more than three years. If this ever sees the light of day I shall be very surprised indeed.


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## rgarber (Sep 15, 2016)

Seriously? You're really that upset? I'm the opposite, if anything I'm almost ready to offer a reward to anybody in the whole wide world to admit they have even used BBB AND THEN, post the song to prove it. I'll offer a cash reward of a million dollars in Monopoly money. For a library so world renowned, NOBODY, but nobody, posts a song and admits they've used BBB in it. It's always "I use..." Sample Modeling (I have this and they are awesome), Chris Hein (I have this too and they got a great raw sound; Chris is a great guy to boot), Warp IV (my favorite library btw and Jeff is great), or Sessions Pro (I use this alot in smaller lite-rock stuff). Nobody, but nobody ever posts anything and says "guess what!? BBB is in it," (pause for effect)...(wait for it...)... *EVER!* Nothing against Yuval or BBB, great guy, great product (I guess). A month ago I sat down and twisted some knobs, pushed some buttons to do a song with BBB (I have the full version btw), when one my cats distracted me and I ended up playing with it for an hour instead of BBB. The most awesome if not influential mix I EVER heard is our own Saxer's Blusen and Blazer, and he doesn't say he used BBB in his song either. What Yuval should do is offer the upgrade for a fee and then let us watch how fast that update gets delivered. No greater incentive to get something done than when money involved, it pays the bills. BBB goes against all the rules of nature, renowned and nobody besides Yuval has a public beta. I don't get it. - Rich


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## Zookes (Sep 15, 2016)

rgarber said:


> Warp IV (my favorite library btw and Jeff is great)


This one is new to me.

This bears investigation.


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## rgarber (Sep 15, 2016)

Warp IV is http://www.warpivmusic.com/


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## Zookes (Sep 15, 2016)

rgarber said:


> Warp IV is http://www.warpivmusic.com/


ty ty ty


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## Rasmus Hartvig (Sep 15, 2016)

@rgarber Well, I'm mostly disappointed. I bought Broadway Lites and thought it would be a true workhorse library, but it turned out to be too cumbersome and technically stuck in the past. When I bought the full BBB it was largely because Fable Sounds had been very adamant with many announcements that BBB 2.0 was just around the corner. This is now one and a half years ago, and by now there has been an endless parade of promised dates for release, none of which has come true. So yeah, I'm a bit upset about the dishonesty of it all. I can't for the life of me imagine why anyone would run a company that way. Heck, I could forgive just about any delay if the company would just be upfront about the reasons.

As for using BBB, I have done so on exactly one project. The samples are full of character, but in the end I tend to go for Sample Modeling because it's that much easier to sculpt the lines I want.


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## wpc982 (Sep 15, 2016)

Count me as another user who bought the full BBB and never, not once, not ever, never, has used it.

(edit) -- that's not to say I will not use it, some day, in the future -- some of the brass mutes are the only versions I own of those mutes. But it was a huge waste of money.


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## autopilot (Sep 15, 2016)

I too am frustrated / trying to be amused by the "coming soon" 

But I do use it regularly - partic for inner voices in my sax writing, my lead trumpet up high, the trombone shorts (and trombones generally) and Bari about 50/50. Everything is used with SampleModelling. But I use multiple libraries for everything. I think I get pretty good results. You can send the monopoly money to a charity of your choice  

http://hornsbyberowraeagles.com/images/Batty%20Lair%2011%20Inst.mp3

I have never used the rhythm section, (and really must have a look at it to tell you the truth) or utilised the mic positions. But the mic position thing is true of most things. 

So though I am first to jump on the "come on - get it out there" train (Usually by checking my watch) I reckon it's unfair to fully diss it, as it is an excellent slightly idiosyncratic product.


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## Zookes (Sep 15, 2016)

wpc982 said:


> Count me as another user who bought the full BBB and never, not once, not ever, never, has used it.



Using SampleModeling and Chris Hein here mostly, this is what you use also?


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## Ashermusic (Sep 16, 2016)

So coincidental, but I am about to begin work on music for featurettes for the 30th anniversary "Dirty Dancing" BluRay where I am asked to....err.... "write sideways" ....some of the songs, sans vocals.

After years of owning BBB and rarely actually _needing_ to use it for paid work, I will on this one.


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## autopilot (Sep 16, 2016)

I hope you .... have the time of your life.


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## Mike Greene (Sep 16, 2016)

It's the perfect gig for this, because nobody puts BBB in a corner.


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## autopilot (Sep 16, 2016)

Mike wins the Internets for today. Go home everyone else. It's done. 

Genuine Bravo.


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## Rasmus Hartvig (Oct 10, 2016)

Just my monthly check-in to note that still, no beta is in sight, just as expected.
The BBB 2.0 update is a scam. Plain and simple.


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## Ashermusic (Oct 10, 2016)

Rasmus Hartvig said:


> Just my monthly check-in to note that still, no beta is in sight, just as expected.
> The BBB 2.0 update is a scam. Plain and simple.




Did you pay money for the update? If not, it is not a scam.

it is however, ridiculous, and I no longer can believe what Yuval tells me, which saddens me.


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## rgarber (Oct 10, 2016)

Rasmus Hartvig said:


> Just my monthly check-in to note that still, no beta is in sight, just as expected. The BBB 2.0 update is a scam. Plain and simple.



Ha! You think you got it bad? I'm sitting here with this useless $1,000,000 in Monopoly money I offered up as a reward for a link to even ONE tune that uses BBB, outside of Fables own demos (see my previous post http://vi-control.net/community/threads/broadway-big-band-update-soon.52562/page-5#post-3991985 ) posted somewhere, anywhere, on the web. But alas I have to confess I haven't tried BBB yet cause other things came up again (yeah, the cats again... sorry Yuval). But I'm gonna! I will. And when I'm done, I will have climbed the Mt. Everest of libraries and in my small world view - will be the ONLY person... ALIVE... that ever used or tried BBB... (pause for effect)... and dared to admit it. I know. Sure is one expensive library to keep on the shelf all this time... - Rich


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## Ashermusic (Oct 10, 2016)

I am presently enjoying using it for composing music for the featurettes for the Blu-ray re-release of "Dirty Dancing". And no, I will not post it because my client would not permit it and because when music is under dialog I don't get as picky as I would if it was in the clear.


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## gjelul (Oct 10, 2016)

I actually met the developer recently at an Augsperger / Soyuz party in Malibu. And I did ask him about the update!
He said that they've run into software problems and are almost wrapped up with the final tests. The first update would be for the full BBB followed by the update for Lite and it's coming by in a couple of months, by New Years. Still no date though 

I'd be very surprised if we hear anything before the NAMM 2017 though... and that's a big IF. Nevertheless, I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt since he was looking me in the eye while he was talking about it


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## jamwerks (Oct 10, 2016)

gjelul said:


> He said that they've run into software problems


What software? BBB is just samples and minimal Kontakt scripting. Sounds maybe a little bogus. Was he doing bong hits when he told you that?


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## autopilot (Oct 10, 2016)

rgarber said:


> Ha! You think you got it bad? I'm sitting here with this useless $1,000,000 in Monopoly money I offered up as a reward for a link to even ONE tune that uses BBB, outside of Fables own demos (see my previous post http://vi-control.net/community/threads/broadway-big-band-update-soon.52562/page-5#post-3991985 ) posted somewhere, anywhere, on the web. But alas I have to confess I haven't tried BBB yet cause other things came up again (yeah, the cats again... sorry Yuval). But I'm gonna! I will. And when I'm done, I will have climbed the Mt. Everest of libraries and in my small world view - will be the ONLY person... ALIVE... that ever used or tried BBB... (pause for effect)... and dared to admit it. I know. Sure is one expensive library to keep on the shelf all this time... - Rich



I left a track on the previous page of this thread.


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## rgarber (Oct 10, 2016)

autopilot said:


> I left a track on the previous page of this thread.



Maybe I misunderstood but I thought you wrote you used Sample Modeling and other libraries in with what you posted and what I'm looking to see/hear is a posted track with all horns (BBB). I liked your track btw, are you saying it's all BBB (understood it's not rhythm)?

Rich


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## Guy Rowland (Oct 10, 2016)

I used it in anger today too, the only brass in several cues that all got accepted right away. Can't post them, sadly. It's far far far from perfect, but it is still pretty handy. I suspect Sample Modelling has the lead in at last some instruments, mind.

This 2.0 thing is crazy.


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## Ashermusic (Oct 10, 2016)

jamwerks said:


> What software? BBB is just samples and minimal Kontakt scripting. Sounds maybe a little bogus. Was he doing bong hits when he told you that?



Classy response.


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## autopilot (Oct 10, 2016)

I read your comment to want an example of BBB being used outside of a Fable Demo - so that's why I posted it. 

BBB = all of the Bones - Lead Trumpet and T3 + half of the saxes - sometimes the top line, sometimes not. From memory the track is more BBB than SampleModelling but both are in there.

Sample Modelling is better for somethings. BBB is better for others. I use both regularly.

That's how it is in a gig for me (as opposed to a library demo) ... But like I said - although the way the updates are vapourware is frustrating (and bordering on hilarious), but I think writing it off as a crap, or unusable, or unused tool is inaccurate and unfair. When I do horns it's one of the first sample sets I load.


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## SoNowWhat? (Oct 10, 2016)

The thing that attracted me to it was some of the more unusual artics/flourishes. I'm not unhappy with it though the key switching is a little tricky at times. 

Oh and I have Lite, not full BBB.


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## Rasmus Hartvig (Oct 11, 2016)

Ashermusic said:


> Did you pay money for the update? If not, it is not a scam.


I may have tripped over a language barrier when I chose the word "scam". It doesn't seem like Fable Sounds being deceitful for monetary gain - at least on the face of it. But the "BBB 2.0 is right around the corner" HAS for years been a hook to sell a dated and very expensive product to prospective buyers, so that at least puts it in the ballpark for me.

Also, the "we've run into software problems" is a statement we've seen a number of times for years now. All it would take is to be honest with their customers but Fable Sounds has failed spectacularly in that regard.


----------



## Ashermusic (Oct 11, 2016)

Rasmus Hartvig said:


> I may have tripped over a language barrier when I chose the word "scam". It doesn't seem like Fable Sounds being deceitful for monetary gain - at least on the face of it. But the "BBB 2.0 is right around the corner" HAS for years been a hook to sell a dated and very expensive product to prospective buyers, so that at least puts it in the ballpark for me.
> 
> Also, the "we've run into software problems" is a statement we've seen a number of times for years now. All it would take is to be honest with their customers but Fable Sounds has failed spectacularly in that regard.




I can no longer defend Yuval. He has told me on the phone, in person, and in PMs for so long now that I would have the update "in a couple of days" or "next week" or "very soon." He is a good guy and very talented, but I no longer can believe anything he tells me, sadly.


----------



## jamwerks (Oct 11, 2016)

Well, a lot of people purchased it a few months back during a $99 sale, and the developer was here talking about the update. So "scam" really doesn't seem that far off!


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## rgarber (Oct 11, 2016)

Well, there is one silver lining in this "whatever it is." It's not that often jazz is talked about here - that I'm aware of. - Rich


----------



## Ah_dziz (Oct 20, 2016)

rgarber said:


> Seriously? You're really that upset? I'm the opposite, if anything I'm almost ready to offer a reward to anybody in the whole wide world to admit they have even used BBB AND THEN, post the song to prove it. I'll offer a cash reward of a million dollars in Monopoly money. For a library so world renowned, NOBODY, but nobody, posts a song and admits they've used BBB in it. It's always "I use..." Sample Modeling (I have this and they are awesome), Chris Hein (I have this too and they got a great raw sound; Chris is a great guy to boot), Warp IV (my favorite library btw and Jeff is great), or Sessions Pro (I use this alot in smaller lite-rock stuff). Nobody, but nobody ever posts anything and says "guess what!? BBB is in it," (pause for effect)...(wait for it...)... *EVER!* Nothing against Yuval or BBB, great guy, great product (I guess). A month ago I sat down and twisted some knobs, pushed some buttons to do a song with BBB (I have the full version btw), when one my cats distracted me and I ended up playing with it for an hour instead of BBB. The most awesome if not influential mix I EVER heard is our own Saxer's Blusen and Blazer, and he doesn't say he used BBB in his song either. What Yuval should do is offer the upgrade for a fee and then let us watch how fast that update gets delivered. No greater incentive to get something done than when money involved, it pays the bills. BBB goes against all the rules of nature, renowned and nobody besides Yuval has a public beta. I don't get it. - Rich


I've used the library extensively. I used it in a television theme that airs all the time and streams on a couple Big streaming sites.


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## Ah_dziz (Oct 20, 2016)

Hand over the Monopoly money.


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## rgarber (Oct 20, 2016)

Nice try.

Next!!!!


----------



## Udo (Oct 20, 2016)

I've checked obituaries, but didn't see Yuval listed. 
Discovered Amit Itzkovich is a Fable Sounds co-founder. He's apparently the technical guy.

Jay/Ashermusic do you know him?


----------



## Ashermusic (Oct 20, 2016)

Udo said:


> I've checked obituaries, but didn't see Yuval listed.
> Discovered Amit Itzkovich is a Fable Sounds co-founder. He's apparently the technical guy.
> 
> Jay/Ashermusic do you know him?




I think I talked to him on the phone once while he was in LA years ago.. He lives in Israel now, though.


----------



## Maestro77 (Oct 20, 2016)

I met him at NAMM last year. He was living here in LA as far as I remember.


----------



## Ashermusic (Oct 20, 2016)

Maestro77 said:


> I met him at NAMM last year. He was living here in LA as far as I remember.



He moved back and he and his wife had a child.


----------



## wpc982 (Oct 20, 2016)

Imo a great update would be trivially simple: an annoucement from those cheats that they have unlocked the instruments so users can at least fix some of the horrible issues.


----------



## Rasmus Hartvig (Nov 3, 2016)

Posted today. Wanna take bets whether the BBB 2.0 beta will actually arrive this year?


----------



## jamwerks (Nov 3, 2016)

Well there's a generous dose of BS in that statement, but if we'll let it pass if the update really happens!


----------



## Rasmus Hartvig (Nov 16, 2016)

"Encoding was done wrong at NI" is the new "We found a last minute bug". This thing is SO dead in the water.


----------



## Ben H (Nov 16, 2016)

It's almost like a running gag. :/


----------



## nordicguy (Nov 16, 2016)

Ben H said:


> It's almost like a running gag. :/


Too bad it's not even funny...


----------



## Prockamanisc (Jan 20, 2017)

Not to get anyone excited, but Fable said they had big news coming and they're at NAMM. Does anyone have any info on this? I can't seem to find any more details.


----------



## Brendon Williams (Jan 20, 2017)

Prockamanisc said:


> Not to get anyone excited, but Fable said they had big news coming and they're at NAMM. Does anyone have any info on this? I can't seem to find any more details.


Considering that the last two years I went to NAMM I was told by them that it was "just about to be released," I wouldn't get your hopes up.


----------



## rgarber (Jan 20, 2017)

I got a question on BBB btw. I'm not getting the instrument setup. For instance there's a Alto Sax 2 but hardly any articulations for it while the Alto Sax 1 has plenty. So why doesn't Alto Sax 2 have the same articulations? Sorry for being off topic. - Rich


----------



## NYC Composer (Jan 20, 2017)

Big news: "It's about to be released."


----------



## Ben H (Jan 20, 2017)

LOL


----------



## ohernie (Jan 20, 2017)

Ben H said:


> It's almost like a running gag. :/


What do you mean "almost"? I actually look forward to the next "update" post for forum comedy relief. In fact, I think we should all draw straws to see who has to do it next. We need to put into place some kind of a round robin system so over the course of a year, everyone gets to ask: "When's the update coming out?".


----------



## Vovique (Jan 20, 2017)

rgarber said:


> I got a question on BBB btw. I'm not getting the instrument setup. For instance there's a Alto Sax 2 but hardly any articulations for it while the Alto Sax 1 has plenty. So why doesn't Alto Sax 2 have the same articulations? Sorry for being off topic. - Rich


Yep, this library is quite perplexing, to the point of me thinking I got something wrong. Someone mentioned versatility of the clarinet , but what I see is a couple of regular articulations and the sound is not that much better than Kontakt stock one.


----------



## rgarber (Jan 20, 2017)

Vovique said:


> Yep, this library is quite perplexing, to the point of me thinking I got something wrong. Someone mentioned versatility of the clarinet , but what I see is a couple of regular articulations and the sound is not that much better than Kontakt stock one.



I printed and read through the manual but I didn't see anything that explained the duplicated instruments and why the articulations are different. And like you I saw the few articulations for the clarinet thinking I must be missing something. - Rich


----------



## Ah_dziz (Jan 30, 2017)

They claim that the website is being relaunched today with "big news"........................ I shot a PM to them on here asking if they needed testers for the update or if there was any concrete news about it and he said it was happening. 
"Today" doesn't have too much "today" left in it though. If the update ever does come out it could make this library quite impressive. With the current state of the patch programming and the fact that nothing is user editable this thing mostly is only useful for layering along with something more expressive to add a bit of realness/ instability to a sound. I hope the update is a big success for the company. They've made themselves look a bit silly by this point.


----------



## SoNowWhat? (Jan 30, 2017)

See Commercial section...
http://vi-control.net/community/threads/broadway-2-0-release-date-announced.59517/


----------



## trumpoz (Jan 31, 2017)

I might install it again......


----------



## NYC Composer (Jan 31, 2017)

Yes, the new "unison" mode where you can DETUNE and DELAY various bones to get a more realistic UNISON sound with only 18 key clicks-groundbreaking stuff.


To me, the most impressive thing about BBB happened about 9 years ago, and it consists of two words: Amit Poznansky. Lord knows how long it took him to do this with the Halion version of BBB, but theoretically he did:

http://www.fablesounds.com/bbb/audiodemos/AmitPoznansky_DiabolicCall.mp3


----------



## rgarber (Jan 31, 2017)

Unison mode would certainly solve the issue I got with BBB right now for sure. Been working on my first piece with BBB and the 'one' trumpet and 'one' trombone thing when they're in unison is what I'm running up against. Yuval did come through though. I wonder what the new software is he made mention of. - Rich


----------



## NYC Composer (Jan 31, 2017)

SM = 4 bones.


----------



## Guy Rowland (Jan 31, 2017)

NYC Composer said:


> Yes, the new "unison" mode where you can DETUNE and DELAY various bones to get a more realistic UNISON sound with only 18 key clicks-groundbreaking stuff.



To be fair, that misses the most important part of it - those instruments use adjacent samples, certainly not the case that it's just detune and delay (those are embellishments). It does seem alarmingly clumsy to set up though. Maybe they needed another 3 or 4 years.


----------



## Ashermusic (Jan 31, 2017)

Guy Rowland said:


> To be fair, that misses the most important part of it - those instruments use adjacent samples, certainly not the case that it's just detune and delay (those are embellishments). It does seem alarmingly clumsy to set up though. Maybe they needed another 3 or 4 years.



Nah, you set each section up once and save each multi, it would take me all of 15 minutes.

The bigger issue for me is since it is using the same samples, will there still be a sense that it is phasing?


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## Fable Sounds (Jan 31, 2017)

Ashermusic said:


> Nah, you set each section up once and save each multi, it would take me all of 15 minutes.
> 
> The bigger issue for me is since it is using the same samples, will there still be a sense that it is phasing?




No, you are vastly misunderstanding the way Unison Section works. Unison Section does NOT use the same samples, and sounds realistic even with no delay or detune. The delay and detuning options are just to help determine how tight or loose the virtual section should sound.

Also, unless you are performing live or only playing in Unison for the entire song, Unison Section is meant to be used on each of the solo instruments participating in the Unison section, and only while playing in unison. It takes about 2-3 mouse clicks.

The way Unison Section works also makes the various instances of the instrument, not only use different samples, but also makes them sound and behave slightly differently from one another in tone, attack speed and more.

I hope this adds some clarity.

Best,

Yuval Shrem
Fable Sounds


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## Ashermusic (Jan 31, 2017)

Fable Sounds said:


> No, you are vastly misunderstanding the way Unison Section works. Unison Section does NOT use the same samples, and sounds realistic even with no delay or detune. The delay and detuning options are just to help determine how tight or loose the virtual section should sound.
> 
> Also, unless you are performing live or only playing in Unison for the entire song, Unison Section is meant to be used on each of the solo instruments participating in the Unison section, and only while playing in unison. It takes about 2-3 mouse clicks.
> 
> ...



Ah, good to know Yuval, thanks for the clarification. That sounds great.


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## autopilot (Mar 1, 2017)

*Checks Watch*

*Shakes Watch*

*Shakes Head*


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## HardyP (Apr 7, 2017)

Aaaaand Action!!
How to get the 2.0 update?


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## Ah_dziz (Apr 7, 2017)

3$ fee to get the free update. That's just silly.


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## Ashermusic (Apr 7, 2017)

Ah_dziz said:


> 3$ fee to get the free update. That's just silly.




To my mind, what is silly is for anyone to complain about paying $3 to help subsidize a major free update.

Just me, I am sure.


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## HardyP (Apr 7, 2017)

--> therefore my "aaaand action"… 
Let the arguing battle begin


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## Ah_dziz (Apr 7, 2017)

Ashermusic said:


> To my mind, what is silly is for anyone to complain about paying $3 to help subsidize a major free update.
> 
> Just me, I am sure.


Not complaining. It's silly. I would have paid a real upgrade price happily provided all the new features work. I gave him three bucks. Just thought it was silly is all.


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## Ah_dziz (Apr 7, 2017)

So is anybody else getting weird crashes in the downloader program on windows? It worked, but only by constantly restarting and crashing numerous times.


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## autopilot (Apr 7, 2017)

Paid my $3 - Can't even get a link - page just times out with a "roundy roundy" wait for it graphic on the "My Products Page" 

Makes me think of checking my watch 

Will contact support later I guess.


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## reddognoyz (Apr 7, 2017)

I believe the update is on it's way, Bigfoot has it and he's walking it over to NI


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## rgarber (Apr 7, 2017)

autopilot said:


> Paid my $3 - Can't even get a link - page just times out with a "roundy roundy" wait for it graphic on the "My Products Page"
> 
> Makes me think of checking my watch
> 
> Will contact support later I guess.



I had this same problem earlier today and contacted Fable who got me my download code pretty quick (same day and in a couple of hours) and I downloaded the files (not really that big) pretty quickly. - Rich


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## Ah_dziz (Apr 8, 2017)

I got everything downloaded with a bit of hassle from the downloader/ watermarking program. I'm playing around with the RTO and I can't seem to get poly legato to work once I've reached the max number of voices. I'd like to just be able to play legato over some chords. I suppose that means I might need to make another voice setup with an extra voice for my highest instrument to jump to. I dunno. Its working amazingly well for big horn rhythm stuff. Between this and SAJH with a dash of Samplemodeling I may finally have my non orchestral brass covered.


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