# UAD & Waves Plugins



## mariothemist (Apr 3, 2016)

What are your go-to mixing plugins? I can't decide on whether to go with waves or UAD. UAD has the hardware acceleration but it costs extra to get. What is your opinion on this?


----------



## Baron Greuner (Apr 3, 2016)

I use a thunderbolt Apollo Twin so UAD plugs are obviously part and parcel of that setup. I don't have a huge amount of UAD plugins but the ones I like are things like Pultec EQ, Helios EQ, Teletronix Compression and also like the Marshall Bluesbreaker 1962 plugin. I usually wait for UA sales or vouchers before I buy anything provided that I really want it.

Other 3rd party plugins recommended would be stuff like Fabfilter.

There are a lot of good mixing plugins that come with Logic X Pro.


----------



## Gerhard Westphalen (Apr 3, 2016)

For a long time I was wanting to go UAD to get things like the Massive Passive. With an octo card and the plugins I wanted on sale (Black Friday I think has their lowest prices), I was looking at spending over $3000.

I recently decided to instead go with native plugins. I mostly got Waves on their recent Easter sale ($50 for $300 plugins) and Slate Digital with 50% off for student discount. I also got the transient designer 50% off. So for a set of plugins similar to what I wanted from UAD I spent less than $1000. I've heard that the UAD tend to be superior to most other plugins and sure, I don't get exact replicates of hardware models, but I think it was worth saving the $2000 difference. Money that can go towards Spitfire libraries  

The only major downside that I see is that some of the plugins I got are resource intensive which you don't need to worry about as much with the UAD (although things like the Massive Passive take up an entire core). In the future if I really want to get some UAD to supplement what I already have I could always pick up a used duo card.


----------



## emid (Apr 5, 2016)

I have spent lot of money on plugins in the past to finally regret I could go the UAD route easily. Recently I tried some Acqua nebula plugins and was simply blown away. They are resource hog but if you are after that analogue sound in your mixes you won't go wrong with them. However, between UAD and Waves I will still pick and choose, mostly Waves.


----------



## wst3 (Apr 5, 2016)

For hardware emulations I turn to UAD. I have and Apollo Twin and a Quad PCIe card, so horsepower has not (yet) been a problem<G>!

For everything else I have a small stable of native plug-ins that I really like - I have all the PSP effects, the SoundToys Bundle, and odds and ends from FabFilter, AudioDamage, Voxengo, Rob Papen, and probably a couple others.

I also have Waves Gold Bundle - I've had it since it was called something else and used a parallel port dongle<G>! They are darned good plug-ins. I especially like their more sound design-y stuff, and the C4 compressor. It doesn't sound like a dBX or Urei, but that's not why I use it. It is just an super flexible compressor that can fix things. Same goes for their parametric equalizers.

On the other hand, I dislike their wrapper, it makes things so cluttered, and difficult to manage. It's a little better with VST3, so maybe they are listening? And the annual maintenance thing gets expensive, I guess it is working for them, but I find it a bit annoying - I'll let it go for a while, but it still stings a bit - especially when I remember what I paid for them way back when. On the third hand, I have gotten a LOT of use out of them.

I've also tossed more plugins than I use - some got tossed because they did not live up to my expectations, some because I just didn't use them enough to justify having to dig to find them, and couple were actually bad (for my tastes).

Sometimes I think I should trim the collection some more, and then I'll use the AudioDamage Bi-Phase or Ronin, or the Papen delay or whatever, stuff I don't use every day, and I'm reminded why I keep them - they sound cool!!!<G>

When asked


----------



## Chandler (Apr 5, 2016)

I think the UAD stuff is really good but expensive. I think you're better off buying from smaller developers if you know how to shop around. Smaller developers are often cheaper and many times their products are superior to bigger companies like waves. I'd check out Melda productions, Sknote, Acon digital, klanghelm and vallhalla. IMO these companies have higher quality products and their prices are lower.


----------



## wst3 (Apr 6, 2016)

I think superior is a bit of a stretch, in fact I'm not sure one can really say one plug-in is superior to another anymore - at least not at the level of developers we're talking about.

Different? Absolutely.

More well suited to a particular workflow or taste? Yup.

But blanket better? Nah... for the most part they are different, but after you get past noise problems, cpu hogs, and other things you just don't find much it comes down to what the developer thought a specific plug-in ought to do, or sound like.

In this corner the dBX 160 as implemented by UA... nothing I've heard from any other developer captures the 160 as well, for me. In fact I like the plug-in better than the hardware<G>... go find two 160s that sound the same in 2016. Good luck. The other emulations sound great, but they just don't sound like what I remember. Silly I know, we all could not wait to get rid of our 160s back then.

In this corner the AKG BX-20 spring reverb, again as implemented by UA. Frankly I just can't make it fit. I also have the Softtube and PSP spring reverbs. Very different animals, but I can't pick one, so I use them both. I think I probably use the Softtube version a bit more for guitar tracks, but they both beat the UA plug-in for my ears. Then again I don't remember liking the AKG springs all that much<G>.

Which reminds me - in my previous post I left out my other favorite developer - Plugin-alliance is a collection of some of the most talented developers on earth! I have a lot of their stuff in UAD format, but I've been picking up some of them in native format as well. Really good stuff!


----------



## Baron Greuner (Apr 6, 2016)

For any guitarists that like to record ahhhem... real guitars, I would recommend a great chap on YouTube called Pete Thorn. He demonstrates UAD plugins fairly specific to the guitar and he's an 
excellent guitarist too.


----------



## mariothemist (Apr 17, 2016)

I do agree that the UAD plugins are a bit overpriced. I will recommend the complete Fabfilter range especially Pro Q 2 which is my go-to EQ plugin but thet are all really good. I have recently used dbx 160 from waves and i will recommend it as well, it is beyond anything that i have ever used but i haven't used any other emulations of it. As far as guitarists, the new marshall amplifier emulator from UAD sounds good (there is an overview of it from Daniel James on Youtube) but i am not sure whether it is worth getting since you get much more content from Ik Multimedia's AmpliTube for a similar price(excluding the cost of hardware).


----------



## trumpoz (Apr 18, 2016)

I picked up Waves Gold on the Black Friday Sales..... about $200. Its been great - reasonably easy to use and get around. Now to just increase my own skill in using them.......


----------



## Blackster (Apr 18, 2016)

I am using mostly UAD plugins. Yes, they are expensive, but the quality is great as well! The only thing which totally annoys me is that they can't handle VAT correctly lately! You have to pay VAT no matter what, which is totally incorrect according to the law in Austria and Europe .... I tried to communicate with them about that topic a few times but they seem to defend their ignorance. Well, ...


----------



## gsilbers (Apr 18, 2016)

im not blown away by uad plugins. they are good. waves is also good.
if you sign up for newsletters from waves or plugindiscount youll get amazing prices.

try also the steven slate plugins. those seems to be the fad nowadays.

btw- uad adds latency. not sure if this known to everyone. it was not known to me.
for mixing its not an issue. but if you are composing it will.

uad has a lot of happy customers who are engineers who looking for hardware emulation. or at least a GUI that looks like the hardware and has a similar sound. its obvious from blind tests at gearslutz that the hardware and UAD dont sound a alike and also that most coudnt tell them apart. 

which is not a bad thing as if you know the hardware its easy to go the plugin counterpart, already know the controls and know what type of sound it can do. at the end its on the individuals experience how to use these tools. but both uad and waves will get you to the same place. UAd its an easier transition for engineers. 

you also get demo periods with waves without a hardware involved so you can check it out. try the analog classics. ssl, api, neve. I say just try those vs steven slate and call it at day until you feel you need more.


----------



## higgs (Apr 18, 2016)

Para mi, Waves plugins since the late 90's, UAD for the last 6 years or so, then Slate and Acustica for the last few months and those last two are both really great!

I'm conflicted with regard to UAD plugins and being tied to that whole ecosystem for who-knows how long. Freeing up cpu resources is nice, but being tied to the ever-changing thunderbolt or USB landscape to run the plugins is a tough call. The nice thing about Waves stuff is that my licenses are still good many moons later!


----------



## zacnelson (Apr 18, 2016)

I strongly recommend the Slate plugins. Also, check out the Kush Audio stuff, reasonably priced and often on sale, plus you can buy them at plugindiscounts for cheaper. I've been very impressed with stuff I bought from Plugin Alliance, especially the ProAudioDSP DSM V2. There seem to be a variety of developers focussing on niche products, which are unbeatable, such as Celemony's Melodyne and SynchroArts Revoice Pro 3.


----------



## Ashermusic (Apr 19, 2016)

Love my UAD plug-ins.


----------



## prodigalson (Apr 19, 2016)

Also use a combination of UAD and Waves among others. Love the UAD I have, Studer A800, SSL G-buss compressor, Neve 1073, EMT 140 etc. they just sound great. Besides while UAD is def expensive they're constantly doing some kind of sale. I don't think I paid full price for any of my plugs.


----------



## Mihkel Zilmer (Apr 19, 2016)

I personally swear by Fabfilter plugins. Their range has almost everything I need except for a good reverb or two.

I find Fabfilter GUI's extremely intuitive and fast to work with, and the sound quality is exceptional to my ears.


----------



## Ashermusic (Apr 19, 2016)

Mihkel Zilmer said:


> I personally swear by Fabfilter plugins. Their range has almost everything I need except for a good reverb or two.
> 
> I find Fabfilter GUI's extremely intuitive and fast to work with, and the sound quality is exceptional to my ears.


I must say, a lot of people whose opinion I value think highly of the Fabfilter stuff.


----------



## jononotbono (Apr 19, 2016)

I can't wait to buy the Fab Filter Bundle. I tried the demos. They are incredible plugs.


----------



## wst3 (Apr 19, 2016)

FabFilter stuff sounds great - User interfaces are extremely well thought out. They are not emulations, which is a distinction, not a comment one way or the other.

If I were starting out today would I start with emulations or not? I really don't know. Each has a place.

Two factors that I know influenced me: (1) I started with the UAD-1, at the time the additional DSP horsepower was a real benefit, and I was curious<G>. (2) I grew up with a lot of the equipment they are modeling. I have a pretty good idea of what I expect to hear if I turn this knob this way - and they get it right (well, in some cases it appears the gear I was using was not perfect<G>). This familiarity is wonderful when one is thinking about 20 things at once (which was not the case in the bad old days, but that's a different topic.) Of course familiarity is a double-edged sword, and sometimes I will use a non-emulation specifically to spark something.

It's all good, and if I had infinite money - and time - maybe I'd own them all???


----------



## Baron Greuner (Apr 20, 2016)

FabFilters saturation plugin is great when used carefully.


----------



## Mojo Bone (Apr 23, 2016)

I theenk I want some UAD stuff; the bread and butter Pultecs and 1176s and whatnot, but I keep finding cheaper, cooler stuff elsewhere that gets me where I want to go, faster than the strictly-vintage stuff. Kush Audio's UBK-1 and Boz' T-bone are just two examples. I thought I needed UAD's Studer A800 plugin, but I'm finding that the much simpler (and cheaper) WaveArts Tube Saturator gets me most of the way there with far fewer complications/calculations. (if I need authentic tape hiss, there's a Portastudio for that) 

So I guess in theory, I love UAD's stuff and I actually _thought_ I had a couple of Waves' plugs, but it turns out I don't. I'm pretty heavily invested in a system that can run scads of native plugs and VIs, so at the moment, I'm not missing the additional acceleration. I love learning about orchestration, so I'm sure the time is gonna come where I'll need the speed/performance boost, but with 12 multi-threaded cores and 40G of RAM, I have room to grow _without_ dedicated bandwidth for plugins.


----------



## Greg (Apr 23, 2016)

UAD! I haven't used a waves plug since buying my Apollo.


----------



## KEnK (Apr 23, 2016)

A little ot-
but I just wanna say that those of you thining of getting FF ProQ,
owe it to yourselves to look at DMG's Equilibrium.
Similar interface,(if you like that- or knobs if you don't)
but it does more.
It's become my go-to when I don't want an emulation-
but it has lots of vintage eq curve emulations.
I don't use it for "vintage", but I'd be lost w/o it.

I love the "butterworth curve"-
An adjustable cross between a shelf and a peak!
I use it all the time.
(oops- in case Jay is watching "very much" of the time) 

k


----------



## Fleer (Oct 15, 2016)

FabFilter and SoundToys bundles, Slate VMR plugins, iZotope Ozone 7 Advanced and a number of great ones from IK and Klanghelm to Waves.
UAD plugins remain way too expensive, even on sale, considering you need a Quad or Octo to run a few instances of their plugins like tape emulations. I'll take Slate VTM anytime.
And I opted for an Antelope Zen Tour, a similarly powered set up comparable to an UAD Apollo Quad, but with an interesting difference: all its powered plugins are free.
Edit: here's the Zen Tour link: http://antelopeaudio.com/products/zen-tour/


----------



## givemenoughrope (Oct 15, 2016)

Any Acustica Audio fans here? I finally got around to demoing them and I can't go back now.


----------



## muk (Oct 16, 2016)

givemenoughrope said:


> Any Acustica Audio fans here?



Nebula is my main choice for hardware emulation, i. e. if I want to colour the sound. For transparent eq, limiter, compressor etc. I use VSL Vienna Suite mostly. But for things like tape saturation, consoles, exciter, preamp, Nebula is great.


----------



## emid (Oct 16, 2016)

givemenoughrope said:


> Any Acustica Audio fans here? I finally got around to demoing them and I can't go back now.



Same as muk. Acustica plugins give most closest sound to analog hardware. AlexB flagship console is actually recommended for orchestral music.


----------



## synthpunk (Oct 16, 2016)

Not a fan of Acustica. Buggy plugins, high cpu, high latency, flakey webpage, and rude customer service. On top of that the hype about the sound does not live up to expectations IMO.

Hopefully you grabbed the free Soundtoys Sie-q EQ. (free offer ended Oct. 13). Just wonderful.

UAD, Fab Filter, Soundtoys, UBK here.

I am on the fence on Slate still. Subscription is intriguing. I have a few Waves but pretty much stopped when they started charging for updated versions.


----------



## zacnelson (Oct 16, 2016)

synthpunk said:


> I am on the fence on Slate still. Subscription is intriguing.



I understand your hesitation, personally I have no regrets about doing the Slate subscription, I use them for everything now. Immaculate plugins, wonderful sound and variety, and very very low CPU, never cause crashes or problems for me, nice layout, easy to automate, thumbs up all round.


----------



## muk (Oct 16, 2016)

I am certainly no expert on plugins, but for eqs and stuff I look for transparency. If it has all the features you need, chances are the eq in your DAW is just fine for that. Apart from features, I don't see why any one eq should be better than the next if it is transparency you want. That's why I chose VSL Suite. It's a company I trust to make no nonsense high quality plugins. All I really need in one bundle.

@synthpunk True, Nebula plugins can be more finicky than the more polished commercial releases out there. But mostly they work fine for me, and if you compare Nebula prices to UAD... CPU load and latency are there, so definitely not the plugins for tracking. For mixing/mastering it hasn't been much of an issue for me.

@emid I don't have the modern flagship console, but it's supposed to be good. For smaller scale and intimate music I often go to the STN L-401 vintage console. The CdSoundmaster Vintage BBC console is said to be great for orchestral music as well.


----------



## jononotbono (Oct 16, 2016)

I recently bought Fabfilter ProQ-2 and Pro-C. They are incredible tools. My favourite so far (including coloration Compressors and EQs) The rest of the bundle will soon follow. Its only a matter of time before I also get an Apollo and start buying UAD2 plugins. Really look forward to not only the quality but having the plugins run off dedicated hardware.


----------



## Fleer (Oct 16, 2016)

jononotbono said:


> I recently bought Fabfilter ProQ-2 and Pro-C. They are incredible tools. My favourite so far (including coloration Compressors and EQs) The rest of the bundle will soon follow. Its only a matter of time before I also get an Apollo and start buying UAD2 plugins. Really look forward to not only the quality but having the plugins run off dedicated hardware.


FabFilter have the best native plugins indeed, together with Soundtoys and Slate. 
Be prepared to buy the Quad version, or higher, if you're going UAD. Some of these plugins are able to eat an Apollo Duo in no time.


----------



## Baron Greuner (Oct 16, 2016)

jononotbono said:


> Its only a matter of time before I also get an Apollo and start buying UAD2 plugins. Really look forward to not only the quality but having the plugins run off dedicated hardware.



http://vi-control.net/community/threads/apollo-twin-duo-deal.56510/


----------



## Baron Greuner (Oct 16, 2016)




----------



## emid (Oct 16, 2016)

muk said:


> I don't have the modern flagship console, but it's supposed to be good. For smaller scale and intimate music I often go to the STN L-401 vintage console. The CdSoundmaster Vintage BBC console is said to be great for orchestral music as well.



Yes Muk if you go to http://www.alessandroboschi.eu/html/alexb/mfc_modern_flagship_console.htm, there is an audio demo "Symphonic mix" at the end of the page. People at nebula forum also recommend it as well as Alex himself. I will have a look of STN, thanks for the tip.


----------



## jononotbono (Oct 16, 2016)

Fleer said:


> FabFilter have the best native plugins indeed, together with Soundtoys and Slate.
> Be prepared to buy the Quad version, or higher, if you're going UAD. Some of these plugins are able to eat an Apollo Duo in no time.



Yes I also have the SOund Toys bundle and Rent Slate stuff.

I am curious as to how the Slate VTM compares to the UAD2 Tape Emulations?

In regards to buying an Apollo, I was thinking about buying a Twin to begin with and then get an 8P but it all depends on what Apple does next really as I want Thunderbolt so the MP 6,1 needs to come first but it's a bit of a waiting game for me (and probably a lot of other people too) at the minute.


----------



## Fleer (Oct 16, 2016)

As for tape emus, some people even prefer the new non-branded Oxide to their Ampex and Studer versions. But I guess Slate VTM still rules. It's quite magical.
As for the Apollo and Apple, well that's one of the reasons why I just ordered the Thunderbolt and USB covering Antelope Zen Tour, apart from the fact that their powered plugins remain free. And they're from reputable houses like BAE Audio and Overloud.
Guess UA and Apogee are waiting this one out. Thunderbolt 3 could be the next magic wand, paired with USB 3.1 at TB speeds.
So it's Antelope for now. In three years or so I'll have a look at Apollo32 with free UAD-3 plugins and the third iteration of Apogee's Ensemble or their second Quartet 
Edit: here's a thread from the UAD forum on the free Oxide plugin:
http://uadforum.com/general-discussion/20686-thoughts-oxide-release-simplicity-argument.html


----------



## Ashermusic (Oct 16, 2016)

Fleer said:


> As for tape emus, some people even prefer the new non-branded Oxide to their Ampeg and Studier versions. But I guess Slate VTM still rules. It's quite magical.




i tried the Slate VTM. It is fine but I prefer the UAD Ampex.


----------



## Fleer (Oct 16, 2016)

Ampex is quite expensive :(
Here's an interesting thread on the new Oxide that comes free with the Twin interface:
http://uadforum.com/general-discussion/20686-thoughts-oxide-release-simplicity-argument.html


----------



## jononotbono (Oct 16, 2016)

So it's just a subjective state of affairs then. Probably best to own both.


----------



## Ashermusic (Oct 16, 2016)

jononotbono said:


> So it's just a subjective state of affairs then. Probably best to own both.



Not if you already own one and are happy with it. The grass is seldom actually greener in the neighbor's yard. We like what we like.


----------



## Fleer (Oct 16, 2016)

Here's an interesting link about UAD pricing these last years. Seems things are evolving.


----------



## jononotbono (Oct 16, 2016)

Ashermusic said:


> Not if you already own one and are happy with it. The grass is seldom actually greener in the neighbor's yard. We like what we like.



Well that's like saying "I'm never going to get a different amp than my Fender Twin as I like it". Yeah, well, sometimes a Marshall or a Mesa are absolutely necessary depending on the job. Having a choice of great tools is never a bad thing and yes, I do agree that we like what we like. So far nobody has given me any reason not to want both Slate and UAD2 Tape Ems which is why I have said it's subjective.


----------



## Fleer (Oct 16, 2016)

My wife is not going to like this, Luke. As far as women are concerned.


----------



## jononotbono (Oct 16, 2016)

Haha! VI Control is out of control. I'm already trying to get my partner to understand that I absolutely must buy the Albion Bundle. "But you already have some Violin sounds"...


----------



## Baron Greuner (Oct 16, 2016)

Guitars! Yeah! 

I use this one when going direct into the Apollo Twin duo.


----------



## Fleer (Oct 16, 2016)

OK, definitely OT, but it's what it is. Always wanted to ask the following.
With all these amp sims, does it still matter which guitar you're using.
I'm sure the answer is YES, but why, if not only for way it handles?


----------



## givemenoughrope (Oct 16, 2016)

synthpunk said:


> high cpu, high latency, flakey webpage, and rude customer service. On top of that the hype about the sound does not live up to expectations IMO.



It totally strangles my laptop once I start getting into it seriously so I just render tracks and have them in lanes to flip back to. I also save the channel strip so I can load it back up. Not the fastest way to work but faster than hardware and I am totally sold on the sound especially for live instruments (non-samples) and hw synths. My jaw dropped when I demo'ed these. I feel like I can get very musical results very quickly. I'm sure a real mixer can do just as well or better with anything but these work for me. It doesn't do surgical eq or comp but I have Flux plugins for that.



synthpunk said:


> Hopefully you grabbed the free Soundtoys Sie-q EQ. (free offer ended Oct. 13). Just wonderful.



I did grab it at the 11th hour thanks to you but haven't tried it yet.


----------



## jononotbono (Oct 16, 2016)

Baron Greuner said:


> Guitars! Yeah!
> 
> I use this one when going direct into the Apollo Twin duo.




Nice. Sounds fantastic! Have you seen those Kemper Profiling amps? I was skeptical at first (mainly because I can't stand Line 6 stuff and thought it was much of the same) but man, they look like a winner! Love where technology is headed.

Going back to UAD-2, how many Quads or Octo cards can you have connected to one Mac Pro 6,1?


----------



## synthpunk (Oct 16, 2016)

Saturn is useful and unique, agreed. (another ThomasM recommendation)



Baron Greuner said:


> FabFilters saturation plugin is great when used carefully.




I find UAD Studer and Ampex both more useful than Oxide. They all do a different things though. As for UAD prices... sales, coupons, bundles, is always the way to go to get the best costing.



Fleer said:


> Ampex is quite expensive :(
> Here's an interesting thread on the new Oxide that comes free with the Twin interface:
> http://uadforum.com/general-discussion/20686-thoughts-oxide-release-simplicity-argument.html


----------



## synthpunk (Oct 16, 2016)

Commit, freeze, and bounce is the way to go to get more mileage.



givemenoughrope said:


> It totally strangles my laptop once I start getting into it seriously so I just render tracks and have them in lanes to flip back to. I also save the channel strip so I can load it back up. Not the fastest way to work but faster than hardware and I am totally sold on the sound especially for live instruments (non-samples) and hw synths. My jaw dropped when I demo'ed these. I feel like I can get very musical results very quickly. I'm sure a real mixer can do just as well or better with anything but these work for me. It doesn't do surgical eq or comp but I have Flux plugins for that.
> 
> 
> 
> I did grab it at the 11th hour thanks to you but haven't tried it yet.


----------



## Carbs (Oct 16, 2016)

synthpunk said:


> Saturn is useful and unique, agreed. (another ThomasM recommendation)
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Definitely, UAD plugins themselves are cheap if one buys smartly. The current bundle offers are the best I've ever seen, normally they only attach a deal like that to a hardware purchase. $1000 worth of plugins for $375 (with coupon) is a good deal in my book!


----------



## synthpunk (Oct 16, 2016)

I have a Apollo Thunderbolt Quad and Satellite TB Quad. I probably need one more quad to do everything I want (A800 & UAD eq on all channels, effects, and stereo buss etc.)



jononotbono said:


> Going back to UAD-2, how many Quads or Octo cards can you have connected to one Mac Pro 6,1?


----------



## jononotbono (Oct 16, 2016)

Is it possible to get an Octo Satellite?


----------



## Carbs (Oct 16, 2016)

jononotbono said:


> Is it possible to get an Octo Satellite?



http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/UAD2SatTB8

Yes, they offer various connection types as well. (USB and TB).


----------



## jononotbono (Oct 16, 2016)

Carbs said:


> http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/UAD2SatTB8
> 
> Yes, they offer various connection types as well. (USB and TB).



Thanks. I should have searched myself but I figured here would be quicker!


----------



## Baron Greuner (Oct 16, 2016)

Fleer said:


> OK, definitely OT, but it's what it is. Always wanted to ask the following.
> With all these amp sims, does it still matter which guitar you're using.
> I'm sure the answer is YES, but why, if not only for way it handles?



That's a good question and I knew it would come up.

As soon as I posted the video, I thought that I maybe should have mentioned I generally play a Gibson Les Paul 1958 VOS through it. If I put a Fender Strat through it, naturally it's a totally different sound and then it's just about personal preferences. Lot of good guitarists here and each one will come up with different takes.

But it doesn't matter, you can stick anything through it and you will get the sound you want more or less. There are many other effects you would maybe stick in the line like delays, etc etc.

Re: use of and purchase of UAD plug. I don't use that many of them all at once and if I run out of processing power it's not a problem because you just get around it other ways. Never bought a UAD plug without using a coupon.

It's also forgotten somewhat in plug debates, but the actual sound you get through your monitors/headphones from an Apollo is really good. Prefer it to my old Apogee.


----------



## Fleer (Oct 16, 2016)

Thanks BG. I asked because I'm more of a keyboards (and flute) guy but I love my acoustic guitars too and would like to play an electric guitar once in a while. Now my kids have some really cheap ones ($99 or so) and I wonder if amp sims would give me a similar sound on those as when I (could and) would use a Les Paul.


----------



## Baron Greuner (Oct 16, 2016)

I'm not really a guitarist either but a keyboard player. 

Guitars are more of a hobby TBH.


----------



## Ashermusic (Oct 16, 2016)

synthpunk said:


> Commit, freeze, and bounce is the way to go to get more mileage.




I think it has been 7 years since I froze a track  I do however sometimes bounce everything to audio before doing a final mix with UAD plugins.


----------



## wst3 (Oct 16, 2016)

Fleer said:


> OK, definitely OT, but it's what it is. Always wanted to ask the following.
> With all these amp sims, does it still matter which guitar you're using.
> I'm sure the answer is YES, but why, if not only for way it handles?


Guitarists are strange beasts! I think I can say that, since I consider myself a guitarist<G>...

It's all about that search for the perfect sound, which sounds like it ought to be easy, but the perfect sound will be different for every track<G>!

I find myself using the Fender 5E3 and Marshall Bluesbreaker sims together a lot lately. Haven't found the perfect mix yet, but it is so much fun playing with them! I play a variety of guitar through them (68 Les Paul with stock humbuckers, 68 Les Paul with P-90s, late 80s Strat Ultra, Bill Lawrence Tele with Lollar pups for now, Yamaha SA800).

I'm still not completely sold on amplifier emulations, but the latest crop from UA do something new, at least for me. These simulations react differently to my different guitars. It might sound silly, or like a small thing, but it isn't for me.

My studio amplifiers at the moment include a Mesa Boogie 22+, an Orange Tiny Terror, and a Fender Blues Deville. I like all three of them, and for different reasons. The Boogie is the most responsive amplifier I've ever owned - when I got it I discovered I was a really sloppy player - it didn't hide my flaws. I kept it anyway...

Anyway, all three behave differently with different guitars, and that's important. It's a lot of the reason why I still drag out microphone stands and cables and plug everything up to record most of my guitar tracks. I still sounds or feels or somethings better to me.

BUT, I have to admit I've recorded some pretty decent tones with the Marshall and Fender, and especially the Chandler UAD plugins. I won't be selling my microphones, preamplifiers, and stands anytime soon, but they may start to collect a little bit of dust!

As far as tape simulation plugins go, I am sticking with UAD Studer and Ampex plugins for now. I tried the Oxide, mostly hoping it would be a lot easier on CPU use, but it wasn't different enough, and it wasn't easy enough on the CPU to rationalize the purchase.


----------



## Baron Greuner (Oct 17, 2016)

Here's a good video describing some of the basic tones etc you can get using UAD guitar plugs.


----------



## DHousden (Oct 17, 2016)

I have the Apollo Twin and it's a great bit of hardware, however I find myself reaching for my Soundtoys and Fabfilter plugins far more frequently than my UAD ones. Having no prior experience with the hardware units UAD emulate so well, I guess I just find the native effects interfaces a little easier and more intuitive to work with.


----------



## wst3 (Oct 17, 2016)

DHousden said:


> I have the Apollo Twin and it's a great bit of hardware, however I find myself reaching for my Soundtoys and Fabfilter plugins far more frequently than my UAD ones. Having no prior experience with the hardware units UAD emulate so well, I guess I just find the native effects interfaces a little easier and more intuitive to work with.



Well said David!

I really need to remember to include that bit of advice when I type, it almost always comes up in conversation... odd!

In any case, UA excels at emulations, at least to my ears, monitoring system, and tastes. Heck they can even emulate tape and a room... they have the emulation thing down! They have published several surveys over several years, and one of the common queries is how faithful they should remain to the devices that they emulate. I'd have to guess, but I would guess that the results favor (rather heavily) sticking to the original device.

Personally (a community of one I'm afraid), I'd love to see them emulate the sound, and the interactions, but extend the controls. Stereo linking, Mid/Side matrices, extended ranges, nothing too dramatic, just enough to cover territory that folks did anyway. (in every survey I've tried to underscore that!)

I'm not looking for a Waves or FabFilter interface! They are brilliant, and when I need that level of control or flexibility I use them. But I'm not about to spend the hours it would take (if it is possible at all) to get close to an emulation I can drop in, if that makes sense.

IF you are familiar with specific hardware I think UA has it nailed. If you aren't, and you don't need the extra horsepower (and not a lot of folks do) then stick with native, you'll learn more about the processing using plugins that have detailed GUIs, and LOTS of controls.

That's my yardstick, and I try to remember to outline it when asked about plug-ins.


----------



## synthpunk (Oct 17, 2016)

Might be a good time to mention that rumors are Softube Console 1 will work with UAD plugins soon. Again rumors, but way cool if true to have hardware control of UAD plugins.


----------



## frontline (Oct 17, 2016)

Fleer said:


> FabFilter and SoundToys bundles, Slate VMR plugins, iZotope Ozone 7 Advanced and a number of great ones from IK and Klanghelm to Waves.
> UAD plugins remain way too expensive, even on sale, considering you need a Quad or Octo to run a few instances of their plugins like tape emulations. I'll take Slate VTM anytime.
> And I opted for an Antelope Zen Tour, a similarly powered set up comparable to an UAD Apollo Quad, but with an interesting difference: all its powered plugins are free.
> Edit: here's the Zen Tour link: http://antelopeaudio.com/products/zen-tour/




For what it's worth, I was planning to go with UAD but after some additional research decided to order the Zen Tour. All things considered I believe it best suits my needs. We'll see...


----------



## Fleer (Oct 17, 2016)

Join the club, frontline. I did some comparisons, looked into:
- UA (Apollo Twin Duo with only 2 mic pre / Apollo 8 Quad) but considered the UAD-2 approach somewhat old, the Twin underpowered and the Quad expensive;
- Motu (828x only 2 mic pre / 1248) but questioned mic pre and converter quality as well as the latter's price;
- Apogee (Quartet only USB / Ensemble 2) but found the latter too expensive;
- RME (UFX+ / Madiface Pro) but didn't like their price nor the looks or the new converter chips;
- Focusrite (Red 4 Pre) but also quite expensive for less proven converters. 

So, happy to say my Zen Tour is on the way, with its great specs and looks, as well as a sweet price tag, similar to Apogee's Quartet.


----------



## Lindon (Oct 18, 2016)

Fleer said:


> Join the club, frontline. I did some comparisons, looked into:
> - UA (Apollo Twin Duo with only 2 mic pre / Apollo 8 Quad) but considered the UAD-2 approach somewhat old, the Twin underpowered and the Quad expensive;
> - Motu (828x only 2 mic pre / 1248) but questioned mic pre and converter quality as well as the latter's price;
> - Apogee (Quartet only USB / Ensemble 2) but found the latter too expensive;
> ...



The MOTU with a Black Lion Audio upgrade is a nice option.... but then again any Black Lion product is pretty good in my experience.


----------



## Fleer (Oct 18, 2016)

True, but Black Lion will set you back another $600 on the 828x or $750 on the 1248, on top of the price of the interfaces.
The way I see it, a quality Thunderbolt interface with 4 mic pres will normally cost you $2500, unless you're going for the no-frills Apogee Element, but the Antelope Zen Tour has you covered for $1500, adding USB2 and an expanding collection of free powered plugins to boot.


----------

