# Cable Brands



## Pudge (Feb 21, 2019)

Who do you use? Why do you use them? Was there a major difference in sound quality?


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## chrisr (Feb 21, 2019)

I was taught by people who know more about these things that Van Damme cables are what any self respecting studio should use. I have no compelling answer as to why that should be - just like you vacuumed with a hoover and sang live with an sm58, you made cables with Van Damme. We weren't about to start comparing different runs of competing brands so I've no idea if there's any benefit in doing so - although I strongly suspect it's simply just about manufacturing quality (and therefore longevity) as opposed to any signal quality considerations. Cables can end up in some awfully hard to reach places!


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## Pudge (Feb 21, 2019)

chrisr said:


> I was taught by people who know more about these things that Van Damme cables are what any self respecting studio should use. I have no compelling answer as to why that should be - just like you vacuumed with a hoover and sang live with an sm58, you made cables with Van Damme. We weren't about to start comparing different runs of competing brands so I've no idea if there's any benefit in doing so - although I strongly suspect it's simply just about manufacturing quality (and therefore longevity) as opposed to any signal quality considerations. Cables can end up in some awfully hard to reach places!



Its not so much a question of "who's the best brand" theres no "best" for anything we use different brands and manufacturers for everything in anything. Personal preference.

Just interested to see if there is THAT much of a sonic difference between brands (that ive heard people say) Obviously shielding and build quality are a thing, but some say they have a different sound characteristic (EQ if you will, no idea if that's true or just placebo) is there a limit where all cables can sound / perform the same and we just pay extra £££ for branding?


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## chrisr (Feb 21, 2019)

Well, I would get down on my knees and thank the Lord when the correct signal arrived at the correct destination, so you'll probably find more discerning answers.


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## Pudge (Feb 21, 2019)

chrisr said:


> Well, I would get down on my knees and thank the Lord when the correct signal arrived at the correct destination



I get the feeling you have a funny story to tell in relation to this. Any memorable disasters?


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## chrisr (Feb 21, 2019)

Not with cabling I'm afraid, but many many terrible, cringe-worthy moments with remote link-ups for broadcast and ADR when the wrong feed has been sent down the line. Goodness I could have made thousands over the years if I'd gone to the british tabloids with some of the stuff that famous people stupidly talk about when there are mics in the room! Would have been a very short career though.

Other than that, I've probably made most of the mistakes it's possible to make in a studio over the years, from straight-out failing to record something, to mounting mics the wrong way, creating feedback loops, pulling out the wrong patch leads, making phantom fx adjustments, losing backups (I know...) Fortunately most of those things happened very early on in my career on very low-profile jobs, when I could _just about_ get away with it, people were more understanding, and nobody got electrocuted.


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## Saxer (Feb 23, 2019)

The German term "Kabel-Brand" means cable fire. One of the few things I'm afraid of in the studio (beside damaged backups, vandalism or natural desasters).


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## Pudge (Feb 23, 2019)

chrisr said:


> Not with cabling I'm afraid, but many many terrible, cringe-worthy moments with remote link-ups for broadcast and ADR when the wrong feed has been sent down the line. Goodness I could have made thousands over the years if I'd gone to the british tabloids with some of the stuff that famous people stupidly talk about when there are mics in the room! Would have been a very short career though.
> 
> Other than that, I've probably made most of the mistakes it's possible to make in a studio over the years, from straight-out failing to record something, to mounting mics the wrong way, creating feedback loops, pulling out the wrong patch leads, making phantom fx adjustments, losing backups (I know...) Fortunately most of those things happened very early on in my career on very low-profile jobs, when I could _just about_ get away with it, people were more understanding, and nobody got electrocuted.



Sounds like youve had a really interesting career! Far more so than I can say about myself.. one of the worst thing I've done (not that bad though...) was forget to remove a couple profanities from a fairly bad-worded song for a morning broadcast.
Worst part is the two words I missed were the most offensive... laugh about it now. Was mortified when I was listening and those two slipped the net.


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## Pudge (Feb 23, 2019)

Saxer said:


> The German term "Kabel-Brand" means cable fire. One of the few things I'm afraid of in the studio (beside damaged backups, vandalism or natural desasters).



Just learnt something new. Thanks!


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## studiostuff (Feb 23, 2019)

Pudge said:


> Who do you use? Why do you use them? Was there a major difference in sound quality?



I recommend making your own cables. Buy the best connectors you can find. Research appropriate cable and buy the best you can afford. Buy a nice soldering station (hold the cooler end of the soldering iron, that's what the pros do). Crack a cold beer. Check polarity two or three times. Crack another beer. Did you check polarity?

You'll be miles ahead financially. You'll have nice cables, made to the perfect length. You may have a few 2nd degree burns (nothing serious). You'll have watched two or three soccer matches. And have a reasonable buzz.


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## Pudge (Feb 23, 2019)

studiostuff said:


> I recommend making your own cables. Buy the best connectors you can find. Research appropriate cable and buy the best you can afford. Buy a nice soldering station (hold the cooler end of the soldering iron, that's what the pros do). Crack a cold beer. Check polarity two or three times. Crack another beer. Did you check polarity?
> 
> You'll be miles ahead financially. You'll have nice cables, made to the perfect length. You may have a few 2nd degree burns (nothing serious). You'll have watched two or three soccer matches. And have a reasonable buzz.



Are spools of quality cable / connectors fairly cheap? Or is it one of those things why you pay £££ for all the stuff but in the long run you save and never need to buy anything again?


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## studiostuff (Feb 23, 2019)

Pudge said:


> Are spools of quality cable / connectors fairly cheap? Or is it one of those things why you pay £££ for all the stuff but in the long run you save and never need to buy anything again?



I'm not sure I understand your question. But, no. Spools of quality cable and the best connectors are not "cheap". 

And, I guess, yeah. You pay for the best, and save in the long run because you are not paying for the labor cost of putting the cables together.

If you're in a jam and need one cable right now, buy that cable. If you are putting a studio together, you will save money and probably have much better cables if you buy the parts and put cables together yourself.

The "long run" seems like the only way to look at this. And if I am using reasonably high quality parts, I can't hear hear any difference. But then, I don't subscribe to any hi-fi magazines...


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## Pudge (Feb 23, 2019)

studiostuff said:


> I'm not sure I understand your question. But, no. Spools of quality cable and the best connectors are



The original post my response to your previous post?

Original post was just a poorly worded general question to see if anyone has a preference in brand or believe there is any tangible difference in sound quality ( other then better shielding and lower noise) between brands that charge silly money.

In regards to my response to your original post. I was making an assumption that you make cables and know a few things about costs when making your own vs going a maker and getting custom made ones. (which is why I asked about cost)

Sorry to be confusing... Not my best thread. I can be unintentionally vague sometimes.


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## studiostuff (Feb 23, 2019)

No worries. That was the reason for my hi-fi comment. 

Once upon a time, I read an ad for "Solid Walnut" volume pot knobs for your hi-fi amp. They were stupid spendy...! Hundreds for each walnut knob. Promised MUCH better fidelity and performance from ANY amp!

I must have read that ad fifty times to try to figure out the part I was missing or failing to understand. But, no. I was reading and understanding correctly. Walnut wood knobs that would improve the sound of your amp. 

I think we can sometimes talk ourselves into believing anything. And I like building my own gear, cables and etc., so I have some idea of what is really happening and what the real cost is. 

Best of luck with tracking down quality cables for your studio!


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## BGvanRens (Feb 23, 2019)

Saxer said:


> The German term "Kabel-Brand" means cable fire. One of the few things I'm afraid of in the studio (beside damaged backups, vandalism or natural desasters).


You meant to say Dutch? because to me as a dutchman it makes perfect sense. As far as I know ' feuer' is German for fire.

I used anything from 5 euro cables all the way to Vovox +- 100 euro cables. Whilst I did hear a difference. The cables I used as reference are my first cables ever (probably 5-10 euro each). So it was to be expected.
Now I use some 20-30 euro Procab cables and feel fine. Though at some point I'd probably swap them out for proper cable length.


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## wst3 (Feb 24, 2019)

while it ought not to be, cable turns out to be a somewhat interesting, and complex topic.

I prefer Gotham Audio Cable when I can get it. I like the construction, I find it very easy to work with, and I think it sounds good.

OK, just kidding on that last part. Mostly.

I had the opportunity to listen to different microphone cables in a really quiet, really well designed control room several years ago. I was pretty surprised, but everyone could tell the differences between the cables, and these were all good brands (Belden, Canare, Gotham, etc). It was a case where we could tell when they changed a cable, not that we could pick out cable A vs cable B, and there were no preferences. We just heard tiny differences.

The same was not true for line level signals. I'm not sure why.

Gotham is great, Canare is great, and really, if they have what you need you can't beat Belden.

What you really want to think about is characteristics!

Wire gauge is probably not a big deal, but it can affect ease of handling, and as cables get long thinner cables will present a different, possibly challenging impedance.

Speaking of impedance, nothing we do in the analog domain is going to qualify for transmission line status, but when you are connecting digital ins and outs you should pay attention to "characteristic impedance" - it is a standard specification.

Conststruction is a big deal. For example, you'd think a foil shield would be best, but in fact it has a lot of disadvantages, that drain wire causes all sorts of problems. And the type of (non foil) shield matters too - mostly for ease of cable making, most of us do not have enough RF interference to need shielding.

What we do need is twisted pairs! Twisting is the thing that helps you reject power line noise and other magnetically coupled noise sources.

And what's better than a twisted pair? Why two twisted pairs of course! Star Quad cables provide tremendous noise immunity but are a real pain to work with.

TL;DR - my favorite cable is Gotham Audio star quad with the double Reussen shield. I think the part number is GAC4/1. For a star quad it is remarkably easy to work with.


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