# How do I create LFO movements on automation parameters on Logic Pro X?



## shaimaestro (Mar 29, 2020)

And Specifically panning automation on audio regions (not midi)
Thanks
S


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## Nick Batzdorf (Mar 29, 2020)

Are you saying you want a fast auto-pan, i.e. you want to modulate the pan position?

You can put the track in Write and wiggle the Pan control while it's playing, but that's kinda weird.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Mar 29, 2020)

You can also draw the pan movements in.

Would the rotor cabinet plug-in that comes with Logic do what you want? Or the stereo spread plug-in?


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## shaimaestro (Mar 29, 2020)

Well, MIDI tracks have an LFO option in the modulator that can be assigned to many different parameters and I'm just wondering if there is a similar thing for audio regions


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## Nick Batzdorf (Mar 29, 2020)

That MIDI plug-in modulates Continuous Controllers that affect synth or FX parameters.

I haven't tried it, but I don't think you can route its output to the Logic mixer. However, you should be able to route it to any plug-in. So if you MIDI Learn, say, CC1 (mod wheel), that should work. Should.


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## anp27 (Mar 29, 2020)

shaimaestro said:


> Well, MIDI tracks have an LFO option in the modulator that can be assigned to many different parameters and I'm just wondering if there is a similar thing for audio regions


Like this: 


You can achieve what you're asking using only Logic stock plugins. So in your case you would use the Test Osc and Compressor plugins as shown in the video I linked, then:

1. Insert a Modulator in the MIDI FX plugin slot. Then insert an instance of the Direction Mixer plugin. Open up both the Modulator plugin and the Direction Mixer plugin windows.
2. On the Modulator plugin, place the Smoothing fader somewhere in the middle and directly under Smoothing, where it says "To", click "-Learn Plug-in Parameter-".
3. On the Direction Mixer plugin click on the 'Direction' knob. You should immediately start seeing that knob moving Left to Right. DONE!

Honestly though if all you want is auto panning on an audio track you can simply use Logic's Tremolo plugin, that's it. Use these settings as a start: Offset: 0 degrees, Symmetry: 50%, Phase: -170 degrees, Depth: 100% (or to taste), Smoothing (to taste) and set the Rate to whichever note rate you desire, and this rate will sync to your project.


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## Dewdman42 (Mar 29, 2020)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> That MIDI plug-in modulates Continuous Controllers that affect synth or FX parameters.
> 
> I haven't tried it, but I don't think you can route its output to the Logic mixer. However, you should be able to route it to any plug-in. So if you MIDI Learn, say, CC1 (mod wheel), that should work. Should.



MidiFX cannot be routed from inside one mixer channel to another mixer channel in LogicPro.

You can create an instrument channel with the MidiFX and send its output to IAC. Then it will come into the environment through the Physical Inputs...and from there you can do various things to get, for example, a CC sine wave LFO to be sent to any mixer channel you want...possibly use transformer in the environment as needed. There is a way to use Fader events in the environment; convert midiCC to smart control, for example, probably other parameters too.

It might also be possible to use midi learn...based on that incoming midi CC from IAC. I'm not sure if Logic's mixer PAN be be controlled with midi learn though. Might be.

You could also try to create a custom logic controller device (don't ask me details, I don't know how)...which basically takes the CC of your choice and assigns it to the Logic Pan control. Then send the CC over IAC as noted above.

You could also use a third party panning plugin if you have to in order to make the automation more accessible.


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## A.G (Mar 29, 2020)

shaimaestro said:


> Well, MIDI tracks have an LFO option in the modulator that can be assigned to many different parameters and I'm just wondering if there is a similar thing for audio regions


There are tons of Instrument Side Chain, MIDI FX, IAC Bus and Environment complicated workarounds...

I guess you need a direct Audio LFO processing plugin. For example, insert Logic "Tremolo" audio plugin and load the "Hard Panning" plugin preset. Adjust the "Rate" parameter accordingly and use the "Smoothing " parameter if you need a special LFO shape. .


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## Dewdman42 (Mar 29, 2020)

here is one way to do it, no environment needed. There are probably variations of this using midi learn or smart controls in some way. But maybe this can get you started:


Create Audio Track and Instrument Track. 









On the instrument track insert the midi modifier MidiFX and external instrument. Assign the External Instrument to an IAC port









Setup the Modifier plugin for the LFO style you want. 









At this point, the modifier will be outputting its LFO wave, even though the transport is not playing, which I find a little annoying and I'm not sure if there is a way to make it only start at zero on play or what, but anyway, for now....at least you can see its working.



Go to the Automation Preferences. There is a learn button. Click on that... the above LFO should now be coming into LogicPro and detected as the thing you are learning. I think you also need to go to the audio track now and put it into automation mode and select the PAN item. Not entirely sure exact instructions but you're LEARNING a CC (in this case CC20), to be used for automation. Click on Done in the preferences.









You will now see when you have the audio track selected, the pan knob is moving up and down in sync with the midi being sent from that other midifx track. Now just put the track into TOUCH mode, and hit play... there you go.....sine wave pan.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Mar 29, 2020)

I was thinking you could just route its output to automate a plug-in on the same channel strip.

Another thought: the free Cherry Audio Voltage Modular "Eurorack." It has an audio input.


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## Dewdman42 (Mar 29, 2020)

the problem here is that the midifx can only be used on an instrument track. The OP needs to automate Pan of an audio track with recorded audio on it.


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## Living Fossil (Mar 29, 2020)

An easy workaround is working by region automation.
You draw a segment you want on the region automation, then copy that region.

If you are normally working with the track automation, you can convert the events back.

You can also use the midi region as dummies and delete them afterwards.

The plus side is you don't have to worry about syncing modulators or being stuck with a pattern.


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## Dewdman42 (Mar 29, 2020)

what's a good way to draw a sine wave?


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## Living Fossil (Mar 29, 2020)

@Dewdman42 : if it's about the approximate shape, i'd use two points (one in the middle) and the curve tool. (which i do with shift-control-mouse). You also can adjust the curvature by modifying the shape of the curve. However, you won't get a completely exact sine this way most likely (what often, e.g. with pan modulations, which are extremely sensitive anyway, isn't a real problem).


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## Dewdman42 (Mar 29, 2020)

Here's another way to do it... This involves the environment, but not too hard. The nice thing about this approach, is that instead of having to actually write the automation into the automation lane of the audio track, the midifx can just control the pan control in real time. You could additionally automate the midifx plugin itself in order to change the LFO parameters if you need or want to.


First make sure to delete any midi learn you had in effect from the previous experiment. 


Create audio track and inst track as above.


Put Modulator plugin and external instrument on the Instrument track.


Configure Modulator. In this case using CC20. Notice also its set to SINGLE mode, not free. That makes it sync I think.









Open the environment and create a transformer object that will convert CC20 to Fader10 events.








cable up the IAC port through the transformer to the audio channel for the audio track in question.







That's it, the CC20 will now be hitting LogicPro, converting to PAN knob on the correct audio channel. Now control the midifx to manipulate the LFO and automate that if you wish to. 

In this configuration I could not find a good way to convert this LFO curve into automation for the audio track directly. But may not be necessary. There may be a way though for the track to get that info and save in the automation lane one the audio track, I'm just not sure how right now.


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## Dewdman42 (Mar 29, 2020)

My main beef with the modulator plugin is that its always sending the LFO midi even when the transport is stopped. I wish there was a way to set it to only send the LFO during play..maybe there is, but I don't know it. Its just kind of annoying because as long as the environment is cabled up, you will be watching the pan knob moving back and forth even while stopped. Bleh.

The other annoying thing about modulator is that it always starts the curve at zero instead of peak to peak. If you wanted to have positive and negative peaks land on the beat....no can do...that I can see.

So those are some advantages to drawing them by hand as LivingFossil and Nick have suggested above.

Its also possible to use Scripter to generate an LFO curve exactly as you wish.

And there are some third party midifx that might work better too. Such as https://xferrecords.com/products/lfo-tool. PlogueBidule could do it. Possibly Reaktor's mfx plugin.


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## charlieclouser (Mar 29, 2020)

Use the stock Tremolo plugin. It's an excellent autopanner with tempo sync and very morphable shapes. Takes 2 seconds to set up. No automation needed.


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## Living Fossil (Mar 30, 2020)

charlieclouser said:


> Use the stock Tremolo plugin. It's an excellent autopanner with tempo sync and very morphable shapes. Takes 2 seconds to set up. No automation needed.



Of course in the case of tremolos or autopans that's the usualy way.
The solution with automation has the advantage that it's freely addressable to any parameter inside of a plugin.


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## shaimaestro (Mar 30, 2020)

Thanks for the detailed response guys. Will try everything out!
Very weird that logic doesn't have a built in LFO for this already.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Mar 30, 2020)

Dewdman42 said:


> the problem here is that the midifx can only be used on an instrument track. The OP needs to automate Pan of an audio track with recorded audio on it.



...hence my suggestion for the Cherry Audio download.

But Charlie's solution is obviously better. I didn't know the Tremolo plug-in has an autopanner.


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## Living Fossil (Mar 30, 2020)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> I didn't know the Tremolo plug-in has an autopanner.



One thing to be kept in mind is the following:

Logic's Tremolo acts in the same way as Logic's "Pan" knob traditionally does (the latter with more options since some versions):
This means, when the audio is panned hard left, it means that only the left portion of a stereo file is played at that time. I.e. the stuff from the right is muted for that period of time.
That means: there is *no* movement in space, just a offsetted levelling of both channels.

If you want to keep your signal stereo, which means you hear both channels all the time, just with a changed panning, you need a different kind of treatment.
E.g. you can automate Logic's Direction meter.

I've set up a small test to provide some screenshots.
I made a Zebra patch with 2 oscillators: one 16' Square - panned hard left
and one 4' Saw - panned hard right.
So you can keep better apart what's shown in the pics:
A) the static sound
B) panned with Logic's Tremolo
C) panned with Logic's Direction meter via automation
(for the automation i used a little dummy region which i copied then and merged with the region)


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## charlieclouser (Mar 30, 2020)

Nick Batzdorf said:


> ...hence my suggestion for the Cherry Audio download.
> 
> But Charlie's solution is obviously better. I didn't know the Tremolo plug-in has an autopanner.



To use the Tremolo plugin as an autopanner, you can start with the factory preset "Slow Panning" and tweak it to taste. The Phase control in the lower right will determine if it's acting as a panner or as a basic tremolo - phase at 180 makes the volume tremolo operate oppositely in the L+R channels, phase at 0 makes it operate as a normal tremolo. The Smoothing control morphs the LFO shape from square to triangle, and the Symmetry control controls pulse width - with a square LFO it operates as normal PW control and with a triangle LFO it will morph it to a sawtooth. Use depth control to get less than total modulation. Easy.

I also use this plugin as a basic trance-gate. Set Phase and Smoothing to 0, Rate synced to 16th notes, and away you go. If I automate anything it's usually the depth control.


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## Dewdman42 (Mar 30, 2020)

shaimaestro said:


> Thanks for the detailed response guys. Will try everything out!
> Very weird that logic doesn't have a built in LFO for this already.



I wish they would add some options to the line drawing collection to add sine ways, square waves, triangles, etc..to any CC or parameter automation with quick tools. Agreed.

Another suggestion, it just occurred to me that LFOTool I mentioned earlier has an audio version of the plugin which might work directly on the audio track in question without any crazy routing... That would be worth a look also.


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## Living Fossil (Mar 30, 2020)

I just checked the behaviour of two other panners to see if they actually do pan or just level the auto with an offset:

Soundtoys' PanMan only does tremolos with an offset (i.e. no panning)

However, Melda's MAutopan, which comes with the free bundle, indeed does real panning.
Fun thing is, i always prefered it to my other options without ever having exactly checked the behaviour of PanMan...

As a small overview there are screenshots of all waveforms, as the settings in PanMan and Autopan.


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## Dewdman42 (Mar 30, 2020)

There is always Cableguys stuff too.


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## Dewdman42 (Mar 30, 2020)

I forgot about this one too... free: 

http://www.cableguys.com/pancake.html


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## charlieclouser (Mar 30, 2020)

Yes, CableGuys stuff is awesome. Def can draw and bezier-manipulate crazy curves.


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