# Tantra 2 - Coming to a bundle near you



## el-bo (Sep 29, 2021)

Seems it'll hit Plugin Alliance's MEGA yearly bundle, from September 30th









PA MEGA XXL yearly


Industry-leading subscription plan! 180 Plugins & Modular FX, and keep your 10 favorites every year! ALL our products incl. Gig Performer, PA MEGA Sampler & BX Mastering App. New! Access to PA BETA!




www.plugin-alliance.com


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## doctoremmet (Sep 29, 2021)

Yes, very cool.


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## Alchemedia (Sep 29, 2021)

Dmitry is an excellent dev & sound designer. All his plugins are top-notch (Thorn, Diversion, Tantra, Garbage LSD) and he's a good egg. He also created some of U-He's factory presets.


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## Pier (Sep 30, 2021)

DS Audio TANTRA 2


Turn any sound into a complex rhythmic progression with this intuitive multi-effects plugin that has 8 powerful effect stages including filter, distortion, delay, lo-fi, glitch and more.




www.plugin-alliance.com


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## el-bo (Sep 30, 2021)

Pier said:


> DS Audio TANTRA 2
> 
> 
> Turn any sound into a complex rhythmic progression with this intuitive multi-effects plugin that has 8 powerful effect stages including filter, distortion, delay, lo-fi, glitch and more.
> ...



Thanks for posting this. Will give the demo a spin when I can devote some attention to it


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## Pier (Sep 30, 2021)

What do you think of the new UI?

Lots of people at KVR are disliking it.

Personally I'm not feeling it either. The UI of Trantra 1 looks outdated, but this one looks like an early design of a WIP.


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## el-bo (Sep 30, 2021)

Pier said:


> What do you think of the new UI?
> 
> Lots of people at KVR are disliking it.
> 
> Personally I'm not feeling it either. The UI of Trantra 1 looks outdated, but this one looks like an early design of a WIP.


From the screenshots and video, I'm not diggin' it. The first iteration is lively and colourful, but this just seems 'cold'. Definitely could've taken a touch of modernisation, without it becoming so drab and utilitarian :(

I think Dmitry is a great developer, and I've had very positive experiences communicating with him, behind-the-scenes (Nothing regarding this). So I do feel a little bad to talk negatively about it. I guess those who Alpha/Beta tested it had no real issues, in this regard, so perhaps it's something that one quickly gets used to.

In the end, it'll all come down to the sound and workflow, but i can't say I'm not a little disappointed.


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## Alchemedia (Sep 30, 2021)

GUI aside, how exactly does ver2 improve upon ver1?


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## Alchemedia (Oct 1, 2021)

I just had a chance to quickly demo Tantra 2 and noticed that the presets are identical to those in Tantra 1. So I did a quick A/B and despite the difference in UI design (I prefer the original) the presets sound virtually the same to me. Haven't had a chance to read the manual, so perhaps there are more parameters to mess around with. Still prefer the original so sad to say as much as I like Dmitry and own all his other creations this one's a pass for me.


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## el-bo (Oct 1, 2021)

Alchemedia said:


> Still prefer the original so it's a pass for me.


I'm guessing you'll only be able to hold out dor so long, as presumably all future updates will be rolled out via PA


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## Alchemedia (Oct 1, 2021)

el-bo said:


> I'm guessing you'll only be able to hold out dor so long, as presumably all future updates will be rolled out via PA


That's true. PA should offer an upgrade path like they did for Thorn, but I'm not diggin' the new UI so I don't think I'd use it. It was pretty unique when first released in 2015 it but there are similar tools now including Shade, Infiltrator, ShaperBox, Movement, etc.


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## doctoremmet (Oct 1, 2021)

With an honourable mention to Meldaproduction MRythmizerMB. By the way, their v15 engine has just been released and the UI changes are remarkable.


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## gamma-ut (Oct 1, 2021)

Pier said:


> What do you think of the new UI?
> 
> Lots of people at KVR are disliking it.
> 
> Personally I'm not feeling it either. The UI of Trantra 1 looks outdated, but this one looks like an early design of a WIP.


It's a little bit Le Corbusier brutalist. But people whine about UIs on KVR all the time: there are quite a few skeuomorphism fetishists over there and it just gets tiresome after a while. Hanging around there, you'd think the only two things that matter are "does it look purty?" and "can I resell it?"

The unfortunate thing is that the animations, though some of the work is being handed off to the GPU, do chew up CPU on the Mac Mini. So, it's one of those plugins where it makes a big difference if you have the GUI open or not.


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## Monkberry (Oct 1, 2021)

I'm fine with the new GUI and and prefer it (moderately) over the old version, but you need some real estate on your monitor to get comfortable with the smaller fonts. You do get six GUI sizes from micro to huge and in addition you can scale from 75% to 125%. But for the long anticipation period, it's essentially the same plugin. I haven't had time to compare everything between Tantra 1 & 2 ( filter options and fx etc.) but on a brief run through, they seem pretty close. I got this free with the PA Mix & Master Bundle so I'm not complaining. I probably wouldn't pay for the upgrade unless it was a fairly reasonable price as the old GUI is fine, but then again, I like supporting Dmitry and his pricing has been quite fair.


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## gamma-ut (Oct 1, 2021)

There are more filters, hence the "Legacy" filters. I think there are more modulation destinations as well though haven't double-check against v1. But there don't seem to be major differences in terms of architecture.


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## el-bo (Oct 1, 2021)

gamma-ut said:


> It's a little bit Le Corbusier brutalist. But people whine about UIs on KVR all the time: there are quite a few skeuomorphism fetishists over there and it just gets tiresome after a while. Hanging around there, you'd think the only two things that matter are "does it look purty?" and "can I resell it?"
> 
> The unfortunate thing is that the animations, though some of the work is being handed off to the GPU, do chew up CPU on the Mac Mini. So, it's one of those plugins where it makes a big difference if you have the GUI open or not.


I like both the ultra-real hardware look of some plugins, and the ultra-spartan looks of others (Valhalla etc. I just think this has gone a little bit too far. Perhaps I'll feel better when I try it


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## gamma-ut (Oct 1, 2021)

To continue the architecture analogies, I think it suffers from some poorly chosen proportions, which makes it look like a big concrete slab. It's just not a big issue for me. 

I'm more concerned about the fan kicking in whenever it's open, which is becoming an increasingly common problem on OS X, apparently because of the way rendering has changed. I'm guessing it's to nudge developers into using Metal (and by extension the GPU) but it's crippling a lot of Juce-based plugins. I don't know if this one is Juce, but it seems to suffer from the same issues as those that are.


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## el-bo (Oct 1, 2021)

Seeing it in action, I don't think the GUI is a complete write-off (There is at least some colour in use). In fact, side-by-side with T1 it does make the first iteration look very toy-like. I'd imagine there exists a happy medium between the two, and perhaps there'll be enough negative feedback impetus towards some modifications.


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## Dirtgrain (Oct 1, 2021)

el-bo said:


>



My favorite Data Broth video yet--I dig these sounds and the directions he went. I'm sold (don't have old Tantra), but I'll play it cool and wait for a sale down the road.


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## Bee_Abney (Oct 5, 2021)

DS Audio TANTRA 2


Turn any sound into a complex rhythmic progression with this intuitive multi-effects plugin that has 8 powerful effect stages including filter, distortion, delay, lo-fi, glitch and more.




www.plugin-alliance.com





And now it is for sale as a perpetual license.


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## Markrs (Oct 5, 2021)

If you have DS Audio Thorn V1.2, Knif Audio Knifonium, Brainworx bx_oberhausen, bx_rooMS, bx_crispytuner, Unfiltered Audio LION, BYOME, TRIAD, G8, Zip, SILO or Bass-Mint you get Trantra 2 for $99

Which is a good price if you have $50 voucher. Which might be a good option for you @doctoremmet


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## galactic orange (Oct 5, 2021)

Also: “Upgrade Path from Tantra 1
Tantra 1 owners can upgrade to Tantra 2 for only $49.99. Please get in touch with the DS Audio Customer Support”


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## ghobii (Oct 5, 2021)

galactic orange said:


> Also: “Upgrade Path from Tantra 1
> Tantra 1 owners can upgrade to Tantra 2 for only $49.99. Please get in touch with the DS Audio Customer Support”


Should I do that, or just wait till it's eventually on sale for $29? It doesn't seem that different to Tantra 1.


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## Alchemedia (Oct 5, 2021)

Bee_Abney said:


> DS Audio TANTRA 2
> 
> 
> Turn any sound into a complex rhythmic progression with this intuitive multi-effects plugin that has 8 powerful effect stages including filter, distortion, delay, lo-fi, glitch and more.
> ...


Don't pay $149!


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## Bee_Abney (Oct 5, 2021)

Alchemedia said:


> Don't pay $149!


That is very excellent advice! Thank you. 

I shan't. I can wait, as intrigued as I am!


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## sostenuto (Oct 5, 2021)

galactic orange said:


> Also: “Upgrade Path from Tantra 1
> Tantra 1 owners can upgrade to Tantra 2 for only $49.99. Please get in touch with the DS Audio Customer Support”


Had just sent Dmitry Sches a Tantra 2 congratulatory note, days ago, as long time, happy Tantra User. Cool if this $50. Upgrade is valid. Waiting now for Reply. THX ! 👏🏻


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## Alchemedia (Oct 5, 2021)

ghobii said:


> Should I do that, or just wait till it's eventually on sale for $29? It doesn't seem that different to Tantra 1.


I still use it occasionally but if you have version one the presets are identical (I A/B'd them) and so you are paying for a new UI + a couple new filters? Has anything else been changed? If you want to "upgrade" I'd wait for the inevitable PA BOOM!


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## Alchemedia (Oct 5, 2021)

Same deal with Thorn. PA took over, added a meaningless incremental ver upgrade (only diff was added presets) and charged existing owners to upgrade (although iirc it was less than the Tantra "upgrade" price).


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## el-bo (Oct 5, 2021)

Alchemedia said:


> Same deal with Thorn. PA took over, added a meaningless incremental ver upgrade (only diff was added presets) and charged existing owners to upgrade (although iirc it was less than the Tantra "upgrade" price).


The price to transfer to PA's version of Thorn was $20, as far as I remember. But in that case, there was no new version upgrade. This is a new iteration/upgrade, which perhaps explains the price difference. Not had time to try the demo yet, so can't confirm whether or not there any huge differences.

Has nobody stumbled upon a new features/fixes list?


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## JamelaBanderson (Oct 5, 2021)

Markrs said:


> If you have DS Audio Thorn V1.2, Knif Audio Knifonium, Brainworx bx_oberhausen, bx_rooMS, bx_crispytuner, Unfiltered Audio LION, BYOME, TRIAD, G8, Zip, SILO or Bass-Mint you get Trantra 2 for $99
> 
> Which is a good price if you have $50 voucher. Which might be a good option for you @doctoremmet


If you don't have any of those, you can get it for $119.99 by using code: *TANTRA2-INTRO-11999*


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## sostenuto (Oct 5, 2021)

Keeping comment low-level, and supportive, as bx flood disaster remains painful for extended time. 😢
Dmitry has been personally interactive and supportive throughout Tantra and Thorn releases. 
Trusting Tantra2 will add sufficient incremental enjoyment to support this $50. Upgrade ? 🤷🏻‍♂️


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## el-bo (Oct 5, 2021)

ghobii said:


> Should I do that, or just wait till it's eventually on sale for $29? It doesn't seem that different to Tantra 1.


If you want to go for it, I can donate my $25


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## ghobii (Oct 6, 2021)

el-bo said:


> If you want to go for it, I can donate my $25


Thanks, I have a voucher, but i wonder if you could use it for the upgrade deal. 
And honestly I used to use Tantra a lot but I've gotten so many similar plugins, plus all the modulation options of Bitwig I only occasionally use it. Was kind of hoping Tantra2 might bring some fresh ideas but it doesn't appear to be the case. I think it's more of just a refresh for the wider Plugin Alliance audience.


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## Alchemedia (Oct 24, 2021)

Here's the scoop from Dmitry:


> In short, we rewrote code base for Tantra 2 and thanks to that it consumes less CPU than Tantra 1. The main feature of V2 is the new randomizer, which is a smart algorithm that generates presets based on sound design patterns we programmed for Tantra. As well Tantra 2 have new filter models, controls and formats, include Apple Silicon binaries. Additionally, you could check the full changelog here: http://dmitrysches.com/changelog-tantra


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## sostenuto (Oct 24, 2021)

Alchemedia said:


> Here's the scoop from Dmitry:


THX for this reminder ! Had in Cart at PA with attractive pricing as Tantra user. 
Went for WF-Keemun 'deal', but now have xtra Code. (yeah @ Bee_Abney ..... caved in 😳) Randomize makes sense !


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## Bee_Abney (Oct 24, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> THX for this reminder ! Had in Cart at PA with attractive pricing as Tantra user.
> Went for WF-Keemun 'deal', but now have xtra Code. (yeah @ Bee_Abney ..... caved in 😳) Randomize makes sense !


Hey, who hasn't instantly caved in for a lower price? I have bought many things I've never yet used that way...


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## KEM (Oct 24, 2021)

Tantra 2 is awesome, while not quite as amazing as Stutter Edit 2 it definitely does wonders and sometimes I even use both together, highly recommend it


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## sostenuto (Oct 24, 2021)

KEM said:


> Tantra 2 is awesome, while not quite as amazing as Stutter Edit 2 it definitely does wonders and sometimes I even use both together, highly recommend it


Cool insight ! Have Stutter Edit 2 + Tantra. Will be instructive to use together. 
Gotta add Tantra 2 now. 👍🏻


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## KEM (Oct 24, 2021)

sostenuto said:


> Cool insight ! Have Stutter Edit 2 + Tantra. Will be instructive to use together.
> Gotta add Tantra 2 now. 👍🏻



I’ll put Tantra 2 as an insert on a track so it’s effecting the entire thing, and then I’ll use Stutter Edit 2 on a separate MIDI channel to trigger different effects when I want to, it’s a great way to get really glitchy textures


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## Alchemedia (Oct 24, 2021)

@Bee_Abney Let it Bee random!
@KEM What's your glitch? 
😎🤘


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## KEM (Oct 24, 2021)

Alchemedia said:


> @Bee_Abney Let it Bee random!
> @KEM What's your glitch?
> 😎🤘



Skip to 4:43 and find out…


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## Bee_Abney (Oct 24, 2021)

KEM said:


> Skip to 4:43 and find out…



I couldn't bring myself to skip ahead. It's all really good and sets the stage for the glitchageddon at the end. Loved it!


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## KEM (Oct 24, 2021)

Bee_Abney said:


> I couldn't bring myself to skip ahead. It's all really good and sets the stage for the glitchageddon at the end. Loved it!



Thank you! I should mention I have a track in the works right now that makes good use of my Tantra/Stutter Edit technique, I'll make sure post it here for reference as to what you can get out of both


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## Alchemedia (Oct 24, 2021)

@KEM 
Bravo! Great track! 
Btw, have you compared Tantra 2 to version 1?


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## KEM (Oct 24, 2021)

Alchemedia said:


> @KEM
> Bravo! Great track!
> Btw, have you compared Tantra 2 to version 1?



I’d actually never heard of Tantra until like a week ago when my friend (who also has the Plugin Alliance subscription) told me about it!!


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## KEM (Oct 29, 2021)

Here's the track I mentioned that makes use of Tantra 2 and Stutter Edit 2, it's the glitchy textures and loops that are all over the guitar section at the end


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## Bee_Abney (Oct 29, 2021)

KEM said:


> Here's the track I mentioned that makes use of Tantra 2 and Stutter Edit 2, it's the glitchy textures and loops that are all over the guitar section at the end



Very nice! I really enjoyed that. Good use of those tools!


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## MLaudio (Aug 11, 2022)

Random bump, but i just noticed that Tantra 2 got a GUI update. Its much better now and very easy to read. Thought id share . You can snag the binaries from the actual DS site for this and Thorns latest update.


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## Pier (Aug 11, 2022)

MLaudio said:


> Random bump, but i just noticed that Tantra 2 got a GUI update. Its much better now and very easy to read. Thought id share . You can snag the binaries from the actual DS site for this and Thorns latest update.


Can you post a screenshot?

The PA and DS websites still show this one which I think is the old one?


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## MLaudio (Aug 11, 2022)

Pier said:


> Can you post a screenshot?
> 
> The PA and DS websites still show this one which I think is the old one?


Yep no problem, here you go!


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## Pier (Aug 11, 2022)

MLaudio said:


> Yep no problem, here you go!


Isn't this the regular Tantra 2 GUI?


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## MLaudio (Aug 11, 2022)

Pier said:


> Isn't this the regular Tantra 2 GUI?


The general theme is the same, but the text is much more clear and enlarged. As is the grid / sequencer. It's just a lot easier to look at now and follow. The prior state put me off from using it.

And sorry if my initial post came off as if it was a different GUI.


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## Pier (Aug 11, 2022)

MLaudio said:


> The general theme is the same, but the text is much more clear and enlarged. As is the grid / sequencer. It's just a lot easier to look at now and follow. The prior state put me off from using it.


Oh I see it now! I was expecting something more drastic


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## holywilly (Aug 14, 2022)

I can’t get Tantra 2 running smooth on my machine (Mac Pro 6,1 MacOS Catalina, Cubase 12 Pro). Whatever move I make result beachball spinning. (Took me minutes to browse the presets).


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## MLaudio (Aug 15, 2022)

holywilly said:


> I can’t get Tantra 2 running smooth on my machine (Mac Pro 6,1 MacOS Catalina, Cubase 12 Pro). Whatever move I make result beachball spinning. (Took me minutes to browse the presets).


Im also on Catalina but working in Reason and Pro Tools.. Working good here. Maybe its a VST3 thing. Hit Dmitry (the developer) up, he is really responsive to issues.


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## holywilly (Aug 16, 2022)

Kudos to Dmitry, we have sorted things out, one of the best plugin developers out there.


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## MLaudio (Aug 16, 2022)

holywilly said:


> Kudos to Dmitry, we have sorted things out, one of the best plugin developers out there.


Agreed, I still think Thorn is one of the most unique sounding and easy to use synths out there. The Harmonic Filter yields such cool textures with not a lot of effort. I see most describe it as a "modern" sounding synth, but honestly i find it one of my best for lo-fi, ambient, chillwave type stuff.

Glad you got it worked out! I have really been enjoying Tantra 2 since the update. The randomizer feature can be a lot of fun.


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## Russell Anderson (Sep 30, 2022)

MLaudio said:


> Agreed, I still think Thorn is one of the most unique sounding and easy to use synths out there. The Harmonic Filter yields such cool textures with not a lot of effort. I see most describe it as a "modern" sounding synth, but honestly i find it one of my best for lo-fi, ambient, chillwave type stuff.
> 
> Glad you got it worked out! I have really been enjoying Tantra 2 since the update. The randomizer feature can be a lot of fun.


Indeed, you actually got me to try it out (I had been turning my nose up at it as a user of Harmor/Padshop/all the other supersynths like Phase Plant), and I'm immediately pleased. I wish I could say I liked Harmor better but the harmonic filter implementation in Thorn takes my favorite part of Harmor and improves on it quite a lot... so I'm kind of sold. Besides width/cutoff, there are no other moving parameters in Harmor's additive filter and no interesting brush options for harmonic selection. At least you can capture a harmonic profile from a sound, too bad not a moving one.

The only thing that is making Thorn difficult to use is the latency, by that I mean when adjusting the filters, there is quite a bit of activity happening after I release the mouse. It takes almost a full _two seconds_ later for the filter to "settle", running at 44.1khz. Is that normal behavior in your experience?

I'm not sure who you're working with up in Seattle, but I just went up to a game audio meetup up there as part of the discord server Akash Thakkar and some others formed. I wonder if you were there!? Or someone you know?


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## MLaudio (Sep 30, 2022)

Russell Anderson said:


> Indeed, you actually got me to try it out (I had been turning my nose up at it as a user of Harmor/Padshop/all the other supersynths like Phase Plant), and I'm immediately pleased. I wish I could say I liked Harmor better but the harmonic filter implementation in Thorn takes my favorite part of Harmor and improves on it quite a lot... so I'm kind of sold. Besides width/cutoff, there are no other moving parameters in Harmor's additive filter and no interesting brush options for harmonic selection. At least you can capture a harmonic profile from a sound, too bad not a moving one.
> 
> The only thing that is making Thorn difficult to use is the latency, by that I mean when adjusting the filters, there is quite a bit of activity happening after I release the mouse. It takes almost a full _two seconds_ later for the filter to "settle", running at 44.1khz. Is that normal behavior in your experience?
> 
> I'm not sure who you're working with up in Seattle, but I just went up to a game audio meetup up there as part of the discord server Akash Thakkar and some others formed. I wonder if you were there!? Or someone you know?


Im not sure if im responding to the same issue you are having but I did ask Dmitry about the laggy scrolling of the envelopes. I didn't get a direct response to that question, but it was one of many i asked him about in an email. It has no effect on the actual sound but its more just off an annoyance when adjusting parameters. If thats not what you are referring to, maybe post of up a video so i can compare it to my experience.

As for the Seattle game audio meetup i was not there. I do however work in DT Seattle as the Director of Sound Design at a gaming company. Been there for the last 10 years.

I own a lot of the "super synths" yet I find myself reaching for things like Thorn, Europa and Obsession over them. I just prefer the simplicity and easy to look at aesthetic . Dune 3 is the exception of a super synth i do always use. Phase Plant, Pigments, Hive 2 and a few others tend to collect a lot of dust.


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## Russell Anderson (Sep 30, 2022)

MLaudio said:


> If thats not what you are referring to, maybe post of up a video so i can compare it to my experience.


I ended up switching my sound driver and I can't seem to replicate the problem now, thankfully. If by scrolling of the envelopes only affecting the sound during manual adjustment, you're referring to the stuttering sound of e.g. filter movement during adjustment, ...I hear that also. Not too bad but slightly irksome. I'm grateful to have run across your post and finally given Thorn a try, this has been a fun afternoon.

There has been a personal movement towards simplicity for me as well, though manifesting mostly in FX plugins so far (and strongly so). I still make pretty frequent use of Pigments et al but U-he synths have been sneaking in more and more.

Congratulations on your establishment in Seattle! I guess after 10 years the novelty probably starts to wear off, but coming from below, getting involved is something I'm still looking forward to. Maybe sometime in coming years we'll cross paths in person. Have a good one!


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## MLaudio (Sep 30, 2022)

Russell Anderson said:


> I ended up switching my sound driver and I can't seem to replicate the problem now, thankfully. If by scrolling of the envelopes only affecting the sound during manual adjustment, you're referring to the stuttering sound of e.g. filter movement during adjustment, ...I hear that also. Not too bad but slightly irksome. I'm grateful to have run across your post and finally given Thorn a try, this has been a fun afternoon.
> 
> There has been a personal movement towards simplicity for me as well, though manifesting mostly in FX plugins so far (and strongly so). I still make pretty frequent use of Pigments et al but U-he synths have been sneaking in more and more.
> 
> Congratulations on your establishment in Seattle! I guess after 10 years the novelty probably starts to wear off, but coming from below, getting involved is something I'm still looking forward to. Maybe sometime in coming years we'll cross paths in person. Have a good one!


There is truth to the novelty wearing off a bit, but i never take it for granted. I love what I do.

And the same thing goes for me and FX. For game design I rarely step out from whats included with Pro Tools. Now that almost all the Kilohearts stuff is free, i use that quite a bit to for my game production (always did for my music). I love the simplicity but powerful nature of it all, especially within SnapHeap. 

For personal stuff more things find there way in, but for the most part, all share similar characteristics, simple design and good sound (Kilohearts and Toneboosters being examples). 

Anyways, if you ever have questions on industry stuff feel free to reach out. I always like chatting with other engineers.


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