# Favorite plugin to "sweeten" harsh strings



## maestro2be (Nov 27, 2014)

Hi all,

Just curious what is your favorite plugin to "sweeten" up the sound of dry libraries like VSL/LASS to sweeten the sound of the string sections.

Sweeten as in, creating that romantic, lush sounding section sound without losing the quality of the sample (drowning it in reverb or sending it 100 miles back in the mix isn't what I am looking for) .

Thanks as Black Friday is coming!


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## Dryden.Chambers (Nov 27, 2014)

UA Massive Passive


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## maestro2be (Nov 27, 2014)

Thanks Dryden, I have never heard of that one. Going to check that out!


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## Marius Masalar (Nov 27, 2014)

Lots of options!

An interesting one is Brainworx Refinement, which is designed as something of a general harshness remover.

Normally I attack this problem with some EQ to kill the ugliest resonances and then a harmonic enhancer of some sort to warm things up and give it a lush sound. Waves Vitamin is excellent for this, as is PSP Vintage Warmer (especially in fat mode).

Kush makes a plugin version of their Klariphonic hardware EQ and that thing is terrific for putting sparkle on sounds, as is Softube's amazing Trident-A EQ. Hard to get that one to sound bad.

Another approach is running it through some sort of tape emulation. The combination of gentle distortion and reduced highs can do wonderful things for strings.


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## RiffWraith (Nov 27, 2014)

*Favorite plugin to "sweeten" harsh strings*

Any EQ.

Cheers.


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## woodsdenis (Nov 28, 2014)

Melda Spectral Dynamics


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## Matt Hawken (Nov 28, 2014)

First, EQ. Depends entirely on the line/style being performed, but a small boost from 200-500 is something I do a lot. Don't be tempted to high-pass - you'll lose the rosin-meets string realism.

Then tape emulation. It's easy to go overboard and kill the 'life' in the sound but used wisely, it's the best thing for warming a sound. A very (very!) mild distortion can work surprisingly well sometimes too.

I often add a harmonic exciter as well - gives the sound an overall sparkle.

The best thing would be to run it through a beautiful outboard tube compressor but I don't have one of those... yet!


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## Firstfewbars (Nov 28, 2014)

If you have the Fabfilter Pro-MB you could try the "Rich Piano bM" preset. Change the mix to 30-50%.


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## Saxer (Nov 28, 2014)

normally i do a broad -5dB cut at 2KHz for lass violins and a bit less for vsl dimension and orchestral (not for appassionata). if it's too much eq it tends to sound like fake-muted strings.

detuning the divisi sections in lass against each other (up to +/- 4cent) brings some 'lush softness' too, same with a higher 'humanize tuning' factor for dimension strings or other stacked vsl sections (i.e. orchestral and appassionata stacked). 
btw: i programmed my dimension section to 'more detuning when playing faster' in vienna instrument pro. gives more blur when playing runs etc.

good IR's can help for a sweet sound too. but at the moment it's VSS2 for me.

all in all: good strings are my never ending story...


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## Michael Barry (Nov 28, 2014)

This will mostly be done with subtracting frequencies - not adding them.

If you are good at EQ'ing stuff get something like the Fabfilter Pro Q 

If you need help and presets I'd say get one with few knobs with preset frequencies.


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## Walid F. (Nov 28, 2014)

RiffWraith @ Fri Nov 28 said:


> *Favorite plugin to "sweeten" harsh strings*
> 
> Any EQ.
> 
> Cheers.



+1

W.


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## chibear (Nov 28, 2014)

Walid F. @ Fri Nov 28 said:


> RiffWraith @ Fri Nov 28 said:
> 
> 
> > *Favorite plugin to "sweeten" harsh strings*
> ...



++1

Personally I find a little roll off at the top end of the violins and violas does the trick. I've also been playing with GSonique FAT+ and a couple of analog preamp simulations that are showing promise when added to the eq when used very sparingly.

Hannes_F IMO gets the loveliest string sound I've heard from libraries. Maybe he'll share :wink:


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## JohnG (Nov 28, 2014)

Hi there,

If you haven't already done so, consider updating your LASS library to 2.5 or whatever the latest version is. This comes with excellent presets that allow one to change the colour and timbre in all kinds of ways. 

For me, this update has been a significant improvement in LASS.


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 28, 2014)

If I'm sweetening in post, I like working with a lot of Nebula effects. If I have to be able to run it in real-time, it varies a bit more but certainly subtractive EQ is a first choice.

Get the sound as sweet as you can but then also look at the role your reverb is playing. Some can sound very metallic so you may want to EQ the verb, too.

Long story short, depending on the context, I might use any of the following: mic modeling, pre-amp saturation, tape saturation, console, emulation, verb changes and EQ.

But try just using EQ cuts before you try anything else.


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## Markus Kohlprath (Nov 28, 2014)

For Lass one of the best thing for me so far are the numerical sound timbral impulses. I prefer them over stage and Color. Very delicate and musical to my ears. There is a black friday sale currently. I wonder why it hasn't been mentioned by anybody before.
Btw at the site of their sordino impulses there is one of the greatest String library comparisons I found so far. There are examples of almost every library out there also non sordino!
Hope that helps.
Cheers
Markus


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 28, 2014)

@Markus Kohlprath Glad the TIs are working well for you. I like them a lot and use them tons, but I don't mention them as often since I did some of the presentations for them when they were released and don't want anyone to accuse me of showing excessive favoritism. 

I made some of the strings library examples at that site and David Howarth did a ton of the rest, so I'm glad they are helpful to you.


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## Black Light Recordings (Nov 29, 2014)

Per Lichtman @ Fri Nov 28 said:


> @Markus Kohlprath Glad the TIs are working well for you. I like them a lot and use them tons, but I don't mention them as often since I did some of the presentations for them when they were released and don't want anyone to accuse me of showing excessive favoritism.
> 
> I made some of the strings library examples at that site and David Howarth did a ton of the rest, so I'm glad they are helpful to you.




I have no affiliation with Numerical Sounds and I too can vouch. Working some of their impulse responses into my LASS template did wonders. I even did a video about it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSbEBCBRQo4

Great products indeed.


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## Hannes_F (Nov 29, 2014)

chibear @ Fri Nov 28 said:


> Hannes_F IMO gets the loveliest string sound I've heard from libraries. Maybe he'll share :wink:



Thank you chibear. I do live strings, sampled strings, sometimes I mix them. So I don't know which one you heard.

When I work with libraries I almost always work with an automated EQ. The rationale behind this is that I have given up to find 'the one' setting that is right for the whole track and rather decide for every moment.

I have two ways of working with it.:
#1. I have an XY tablet where the one axis is volume and the other is the EQ gain. I write on that tablet while I play or in a second take.

#2: After recording the notes and the volume automation I grab the parametric EQ with the mouse, hit record for another take, and wiggle it in realtime. The DAW is set to record the midi data here.

The center frequency is around 3.1 kHz but I might change that. The overall idea is to 'play' the EQ like you would play an instrument. Because - after all - our studio is our instrument nowadays. 

Hope that helps, Hannes


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## chibear (Nov 29, 2014)

> .........I do live strings, sampled strings, sometimes I mix them. So I don't know which one you heard.


OK this is very embarassing :oops: 

I looked up the post and it was Rob who did the Dvorak. My apologies. :oops: I'm sure you do superb work also. I just don't recall it at the moment. I'm old, you know....and with the pills.... ~o) 

Anyway I will be sure to try your suggestions as they make musical sense.

Meanwhile. IMO that Dvorak excerpt is some of the finest string programming I have heard since my research began and directly addresses the OP. Now if ROB could share his approach ????? Please :D


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## Hannes_F (Nov 29, 2014)

No problem chibear, Rob is a real master in this.


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## Malo (Nov 30, 2014)

> If you are good at EQ'ing stuff get something like the Fabfilter Pro Q
> 
> If you need help and presets I'd say get one with few knobs with preset frequencies.



Yes! I like help and presets. :oops: Any non-UAD suggestions?


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 30, 2014)

@Malo I think only one of the two suggestions were using UAD - none of the Numerical Sound ones were, for sure. 

What do you use for your convolution at the moment?


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## Malo (Nov 30, 2014)

@Per Lichtman: I have to admit I was a bit off-topic here, and was just fishing for Mike Barry's favorite non-UAD EQ with fixed frequencies. Sorry! :oops:


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 30, 2014)

@Malo Ahh, okay.  For what it's worth, many of my favorites (in terms of sound) that are still available are either Nebula plugs or Nebula libraries. The one I have in mind are accurately sampled in a dynamic way (so input level makes a difference) and the only downside is that they add latency.

For instance, I use the library version of Silk on practically every mix I do for Joanna St. Claire these days. Here's a link to the plug-in version, in case you don't use the Nebula sampler.

http://www.acustica-audio.com/index.php?option=com_virtuemart&page=shop.browse&category_id=60&Itemid=189 (http://www.acustica-audio.com/index.php ... Itemid=189)


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## Malo (Nov 30, 2014)

Thank you, Per! I haven't checked out those Nebula plugs, although I have read good things about their Cooltec EQP-1. Is Silk also a model of a hardware unit?


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 30, 2014)

@Malo Yes, the Silk is sampled from the Siemens W295B.

Also, the Magenta EQ is sampled from the same Manley Passive design as the UAD that was mentioned earlier. But it's split up into two parts (the Magenta EQ and the two additional band bundle).

Note that the UAD and Nebula approaches each have pros and cons. The UAD plugs are algorithmic and the Nebula ones are actually sampled from the gear. For compression, I find UAD easier to use. For EQs, I prefer the Nebula sound in most comparisons I've done in the past.


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## Malo (Nov 30, 2014)

Thank you very much, Per!


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 30, 2014)

@Malo My pleasure!


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## Hannes_F (Nov 30, 2014)

Per Lichtman @ Sun Nov 30 said:


> For instance, I use the library version of Silk



Per, if you don't mind ... I've been interested in Silk since a while. What has kept me away so far was that the gains are quite coarse (3 dB for the shelves, 2 dB for the mids). No problems with this?


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 30, 2014)

@Hannes_F Honestly, it usually hasn't been a problem for me. I tend to use Silk more for tone-shaping than for fine-tuning. It's typically the very first shelf I try on anything. If you want, I'll post a few quick examples that show a 3dB cut and boost for both the lows and highs.

If you have the full version of Nebula, then there are several alternatives available. For instance, CDSoundmaster also sampled the same device earlier and included interpolation (so you can use smaller values). Tim Petherick (who did the sampling for Silk) also sampled the ELC24, which has a different but related sound and also doesn't use stepped gain.


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## Hannes_F (Nov 30, 2014)

Per Lichtman @ Sun Nov 30 said:


> @Hannes_F Honestly, it usually hasn't been a problem for me. I tend to use Silk more for tone-shaping than for fine-tuning. It's typically the very first shelf I try on anything. If you want, I'll post a few quick examples that show a 3dB cut and boost for both the lows and highs.



Per, thanks for the info and I would appreciate the examples.


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 30, 2014)

Okay, uploading a short example now. Will post the link in a minute.


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 30, 2014)

Here's a short example of using the Silk EQ nebula library at 48 KHz. The examples are 48 KHz 24-bit to try to present them as accurately as possible.

http://perlichtman.com/media/2014/vic/silk/man_the_dishwashers_silk-eq_test.zip

"Man the Dishwashers!" is a very early sketch and there are a ton of things I would do differently if I were going to release it - but since the odds of that weren't high, I figured it was fine for this example.


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## Hannes_F (Nov 30, 2014)

Thank you Per, much appreciated!
The difference between the flat and the +3 dB High example is quite small indeed. Maybe I need my ears to be checked because I even can hardly hear any between the 0 and the - 3 dB High example. 

In any case the effect is subtle and the 3 dB grid will be no problem, thank you!


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 30, 2014)

@Hannes_F Mea culpa - the neutral example wasn't neutral. Thanks for the catch. I'll re-upload now.


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 30, 2014)

Okay, the link is now fixed. Sorry about the first time. 

Here it is again.
http://perlichtman.com/media/2014/vic/silk/man_the_dishwashers_silk-eq_test.zip (http://perlichtman.com/media/2014/vic/s ... q_test.zip)


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## Hannes_F (Nov 30, 2014)

OK I can hear it better now  Thanks again for your time, Per.


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## Per Lichtman (Nov 30, 2014)

@Hannes_F Glad to help.


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## maestro2be (Dec 5, 2014)

Thanks all for the information, I am going through all the suggestions as we speak. I am sure I will have more questions that are specific soon, but I need to wrap my head around a few new concepts and things I have learned from my latest 2-3 posts to see how my results finalize.


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## Cinesamples (Dec 5, 2014)

Here's a tutorial that may be of some help?


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## tokatila (Dec 5, 2014)

CineSamples @ Fri Dec 05 said:


> Here's a tutorial that may be of some help?




That's a nice tutorial, thanks for sharing! To my ears, the most "sweetening" thing was actually the reverb. 8)


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## richinmusic (Dec 5, 2014)

I have to chime in and cast my praise for Nebula/Acqua technology. I come from an analog background, and this is the first "plugin" technology that blows me away. Yes, analog has it's "flaws", but my ears prefer the non-linearity of those flaws, I guess. There are enough free plugin and library demos out there now to try it. If it makes it any easier, feel free to PM me and I'd be happy to run some of your audio through some amazing gear emulations. I am not employed by Acustica and do not receive any "perks" for this. I am truly spreading the word, it sounds THAT much better to me than anything else in the digital realm. And NO MAINTENANCE!!


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## everbeatz (Dec 10, 2014)

maestro2be @ Thu Nov 27 said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Just curious what is your favorite plugin to "sweeten" up the sound of dry libraries like VSL/LASS to sweeten the sound of the string sections.
> 
> ...



I think that's a main struggle actually  To me, it's better to find strings that sound that way, meaning not all string libraries are the same or fits the same category of taste. 

Either way, by processing, you'll get to the point it's gonna sound "passable", but finding a library of strings that have inherent quality to them, of what you looking for, it's something that will do the job. I don't know why library developers are recording strings this way, but it's seems to be the norm these days - it's usually strident, overhyped, played overly aggressive and so on.

To get back on practical - try HF-limiting and adding a bit of reverb that can push sounds a bit back in the sound field. I usually use frequency dependent compression aka multiband for tasks like this as it calms down certain portions of the spectrum by reducing the energy and dynamics selectively as opposed to eqing which is also helpful, but ends up giving you different results. After you're done with taming upper mids and highs you can further shape the sound with some eq such as Massive Passive (which has been mentioned).

Cheers
Aleksandar


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