# Speaker/Headphones calibration on the entire system?



## Uiroo (Dec 27, 2019)

Hey there,

I really like the idea of calibrating your speakers via sonarworks or morphit, but it's a no-no if it's only in the DAW. 
It should be on everything, YouTube, MediaPlayer, DAW, everything that leaves the speakers. 
The reason why that is so important to me is, that my ears get educated by everything I listen to. If there's a "fundamental" difference between what I'm doing in the DAW and what I listened to yesterday on YouTube, that just doesn't work for me. I'd try to match something with correction that I was digging without correction. 

So does anyone know how you would set that up?
I have a RME Fireface with Total Mix, I believe it is not possible to get correction software in there. And i'm on Windows 10.
Thanks!


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## Gerhard Westphalen (Dec 27, 2019)

Sonarworks has their systemwide although I've never used it. You can also just use the loopback in RME to run all of your audio through your DAW. I did that for a while before my speakers all had DSP. You can also get something external like a miniDSP, DEQX, or Trinnov.


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## josephspirits (Dec 27, 2019)

Uiroo said:


> Hey there,
> 
> I really like the idea of calibrating your speakers via sonarworks or morphit, but it's a no-no if it's only in the DAW.
> It should be on everything, YouTube, MediaPlayer, DAW, everything that leaves the speakers.
> ...



I'm on a Mac and use Sonarworks. I either use Sonarworks as a plugin on the master channel when working in logic, or I use it as it's own application in system wide mode that calibrates anything else playing on the computer. When I activate system wide it deactivates the sonarworks instance in logic, and vice versa. Works very smoothly.


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## anp27 (Dec 27, 2019)

Uiroo said:


> So does anyone know how you would set that up?



I use Soundsource https://rogueamoeba.com/soundsource/ and it works great  Not much to do in terms of setting up really. All audio from my computer runs through it... I don't need to use the Sonarworks Reference 4 plugin in my Logic projects, and I don't even need to use the Reference 4 app. I run the Reference 4 plugin via Soundsource, placed after the fantastic Waves Abbey Road Studio 3 plugin in the chain which is switched on when I'm using headphones.


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## rrichard63 (Dec 27, 2019)

anp27 said:


> I use Soundsource https://rogueamoeba.com/soundsource/ and it works great  Not much to do in terms of setting up really. All audio from my computer runs through it... I don't need to use the Sonarworks Reference 4 plugin in my Logic projects, and I don't even need to use the Reference 4 app. I run the Reference 4 plugin via Soundsource, placed after the fantastic Waves Abbey Road Studio 3 plugin in the chain which is switched on when I'm using headphones.


@*Uiroo* didn't say whether he is on a Mac or Windows. Soundsource is Mac only. I have spent a lot of time looking for something like it for Windows, to no avail.


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## anp27 (Dec 27, 2019)

rrichard63 said:


> @*Uiroo* didn't say whether he is on a Mac or Windows. Soundsource is Mac only. I have spent a lot of time looking for something like it for Windows, to no avail.



Oh he said he's on Windows 10 :( Didn't know that Soundsource was Mac only. That's a pity.


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## tebling (Dec 27, 2019)

I don't have Sonarworks, but right on their web page it says "*Systemwide calibration - *Our software calibrates audio across your entire system, so you can hear a flat, accurate sound when using streaming music apps, your web browser, or any other software. Works on Windows and Mac."


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## Diablo IV (Dec 27, 2019)

I wish I could have just an EQ for my Windows audio output. Sonarworks forces me to use a profile, I'd love to use just its low pass filter.


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## rrichard63 (Dec 27, 2019)

tebling said:


> I don't have Sonarworks, but right on their web page it says "*Systemwide calibration - *Our software calibrates audio across your entire system, so you can hear a flat, accurate sound when using streaming music apps, your web browser, or any other software. Works on Windows and Mac."


True, and for Windows it might be the best compromise available. But compared with SoundSource for the Mac, it's not very convenient. Because of the way Windows audio and ASIO are designed, you need two "instances" of Sonarworks, one on your DAW's control room outs and the other (Systemwide) on Windows' default audio output. The two do communicate with each other satisfactorily, but the whole arrangement is fiddly to set up and difficult to understand. At least I find it difficult to grasp what I am doing.


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## tebling (Dec 27, 2019)

There are alternatives out there. I've used Equalizer APO with decent results. For headphones, AutoEQ is an interesting project that makes use of it.


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## Vin (Dec 28, 2019)

Sonarworks Systemwide is fantastic, easiest to setup and best results in my experience.


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## Jaybee (Dec 28, 2019)

Vin said:


> Sonarworks Systemwide is fantastic, easiest to setup and best results in my experience.



+1. Systemwide working fine on Win 7 x64. I have the Sonarworks correction plugin on my Monitor EQ FX in Reaper and for general listening the Systemwide handles all other PC audio so it has the same correction dialled in (with the ability to select speaker or headphone EQ curves applied). No issues here.


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## Uiroo (Dec 28, 2019)

Thanks guys! I somehow thought sonarworks doesn't work system wide.



Vin said:


> Sonarworks Systemwide is fantastic, easiest to setup and best results in my experience.


I'll probably try that. Is latency an issue?

Another question just came to my mind: If I have systemwide calibration I'd have the same calibration when switching from speakers to headphones right? Is there a way to deal with that?

I just wished you could put the correction on the output in RME'S TotalMix.


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## Jaybee (Dec 28, 2019)

Uiroo said:


> Thanks guys! I somehow thought sonarworks doesn't work system wide.
> 
> 
> I'll probably try that. Is latency an issue?
> ...



My Systemwide reports Latency of 36ms but in practice I don't notice anything when playing YouTube videos etc, everything syncs and of course, in the DAW it's compensated for so no issues there. 

The Systemwide app sits in the tray at the bottom of your OS screen and lets you choose whether to have it set to the Speaker calibration curve or the Headphone calibration curve, or indeed multiple variants of your choice and/or whether to turn the calibration off/on. It's one click away.


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## Uiroo (Dec 28, 2019)

Jaybee said:


> My Systemwide reports Latency of 36ms but in practice I don't notice anything when playing YouTube videos etc, everything syncs and of course, in the DAW it's compensated for so no issues there.
> 
> The Systemwide app sits in the tray at the bottom of your OS screen and lets you choose whether to have it set to the Speaker calibration curve or the Headphone calibration curve, or indeed multiple variants of your choice and/or whether to turn the calibration off/on. It's one click away.


Ah, that sounds good. Not perfect, but good enough for me.


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## rrichard63 (Dec 28, 2019)

Uiroo said:


> I'd have the same calibration when switching from speakers to headphones right? Is there a way to deal with that?


You just click on the preset for the headphones or speaker system you are listening through. You do have to open the plugin UI or systemwide UI (as the case may be) first.


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## anp27 (Dec 28, 2019)

Uiroo said:


> I'll probably try that. Is latency an issue?



I personally experienced major latency issues with Sonarworks Systemwide (this was last year I think), that's why I seeked out Soundsource in the first place. After Soundsource all of the issues went away. I haven't checked out the latest version of Systemwide, it might have addressed the latency issue but I now run Abbey Road Studio 3 in conjunction with Reference 4 so I have no choice but to stick with Soundsource


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## SBK (Dec 28, 2019)

There is the pedalboard2 too its free http://www.niallmoody.com/apps/pedalboard2

I used to use it before systemwide was out, but suddenly it stopped working at some time. A friend though uses it without problems.


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## rrichard63 (Dec 28, 2019)

anp27 said:


> I haven't checked out the latest version of Systemwide, it might have addressed the latency issue ...


Yes, they have. You can now choose an ASIO driver instead of WASAPI. But I have been having problems with it. What they're trying to do to bypass Windows audio processing is complicated and I'm not surprised that it isn't completely reliable.


anp27 said:


> ... I now run Abbey Road Studio 3 in conjunction with Reference 4 so I have no choice but to stick with Soundsource.


This is indeed an important limitation of Systemwide. The Sonarworks plugin is often part of a chain on your DAW's control room output. You'd like to have the same chain on Windows' default output and Systemwide doesn't accomplish that.


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## SBK (Dec 28, 2019)

when you use this kind of plugins on the output you must accept the latency issues


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## tav.one (Dec 29, 2019)

rrichard63 said:


> You do have to open the plugin UI or systemwide UI (as the case may be) first.



You can actually change it straight from the menubar (mac) / tray (win) without opening Systemwide app. Very convenient.



SBK said:


> when you use this kind of plugins on the output you must accept the latency issues


You can choose Zero Latency mode, Linear Phase or Mixed mode in Sonarworks.


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## rrichard63 (Dec 29, 2019)

tav.one said:


> SBK said:
> 
> 
> > when you use this kind of plugins on the output you must accept the latency issues
> ...


The Windows latency issue we're talking about has to do with ASIO versus WASAPI rather than with EQ filters. I don't know for sure, but I'm under the impression this is much less of a problem on Macs.


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