# Hodl?



## Brobdingnagian (Jan 17, 2018)

Anyone here knee deep in Crypto trading? What a few days it has been...

-B


----------



## Greg (Jan 17, 2018)

Yep! Been having a lot of fun doing research and trying to understand the market. Takes a lot of time away from music but almost have enough profit for a sweet api lunchbox setup even with the recent bloodbath.


----------



## givemenoughrope (Jan 17, 2018)

I never got in and wished I had a couple years ago (like everyone and their mother). Maybe now is good? Or awful.


----------



## Brobdingnagian (Jan 17, 2018)

Greg said:


> Yep! Been having a lot of fun doing research and trying to understand the market. Takes a lot of time away from music but almost have enough profit for a sweet api lunchbox setup even with the recent bloodbath.



So pleased for you! Well done!


----------



## Brobdingnagian (Jan 17, 2018)

givemenoughrope said:


> I never got in and wished I had a couple years ago (like everyone and their mother). Maybe now is good? Or awful.



A bit of both. There is still lots of opportunity....but again, room for disaster. It will be interesting to see how various countries deal with regulating this universal approach to currency. Caveat emptor.


----------



## givemenoughrope (Jan 17, 2018)

My buddy has gotten sucked into the rabbit hole of crypto, mostly Bitcoin. I believe he got in at the price it stands at currently. He sees this as a correction and that it'll be up to $30,000 by the end of the year. Makes it pretty tempting. 

I also read somewhere that maintaining the ledger for the blockchain will require the same amount of electricity it takes to power Ireland or something. Not exactly saving the world. Maybe I'm watching too much Black Mirror but a solar-only crypto would make me feel like less of a creepto.


----------



## Greg (Jan 17, 2018)

givemenoughrope said:


> Makes it pretty tempting.



Everyone will tell you this but only invest as much as you wouldn't care to lose. You need to set yourself up to be able to HODL even when it looks like the market will certainly tumble to $0. So many people over invest, freak out, and sell at a loss which causes the tumble we've had this week. 

I personally think bitcoin is old news. There are many more interesting crypto coins and startups out there doing cool things with the technology. One even applicable to composers, a blockchain for proof of copyright and licensing - https://po.et/


----------



## NoamL (Jan 17, 2018)

Isn't being a composer crazy enough without gambling your savings too?  ICOs are just dotcoms, like from 20 years ago. Maybe one or two will be the next Amazon. I do not think that justifies the risk of gambling on what are essentially penny stocks for businesses that scarcely/don't exist yet in a totally unregulated stockmarket.

I also think I, like most people, qualify as "the dumb money." If I'm hearing about what a great opportunity it is, that means the growth is done - and anything further is a bubble likely to pop. I didn't get into BTC despite the latest round of media about it in Nov-Dec, and it looks like I was smart to stay away from something I don't really understand  Although, if I'd bought BTC two or three years ago...

Anyway. I looked a little into the community and there are _so many people_ saying "Don't sell, HOLD HOLD HOLD, you don't realize losses unless you sell, only people who sell are driving down the price, don't be one of them!" Isn't that.... really dumb? That's like saying Jeff Bezos has no net worth because it's all tied up in Amazon stock that he hasn't sold. Losses and gains realize whether we want them to or not. HODLing through a dip only makes sense if it's a dip. Lots of people "HODLed" on Pets.Com, it still went to zero.


----------



## Jake (Jan 17, 2018)

There's a lot of wisdom in NoamL's post, and I can say this from experience.

I've been in the markets for almost 20 years now. I've made a lot of money and I've lost a good bit too. Yes, I'm ahead, but the cost of tuition in this game is very high. Few ever make any real money trading. Investing is a different thing, and it is yet to be seen if crypto currencies are going to be an investment or a trade.

There's a saying about trading sardines and eating sardines. Right now crypto's are trading sardines. And if that makes no sense to you then that should be a clue that you are in over your head.

There's an acronym, FOMO. Don't be a victim of it. Again, if you don't know what it means..............


----------



## Zhao Shen (Jan 17, 2018)

Greg said:


> I personally think bitcoin is old news. There are many more interesting crypto coins and startups out there doing cool things with the technology. One even applicable to composers, a blockchain for proof of copyright and licensing - https://po.et/



Hell, _Litecoin _is a better currency if you're just looking at usefulness. The fees aren't egregious, and the transactions confirm much quicker too. I think there are 2 main issues with crypto right now: 1) Most people are treating it as a get-rich-quick scheme rather than a legitimate currency, and 2) No one knows jack shit about the market, no matter what they claim to the contrary.


----------



## NoamL (Jan 17, 2018)

Zhao Shen said:


> 1) Most people are treating it as a get-rich-quick scheme rather than a legitimate currency



I noticed that as well Zhao. Back in the day Bitcoin was about anarcho-capitalists & techno-libertarians daydreaming about the day Bitcoin would kill off all "fiat currency." But now cryptocurrency seems to be about how much you can trade and flip to make money (with money of course meaning dollars). If everyone is in crypto with an exit plan to make fiat money, what's the underlying value of crypto? I don't understand it very well.


----------



## synergy543 (Jan 17, 2018)

NoamL said:


> what's the underlying value of crypto? I don't understand it very well.


Mining it. There is zero downside risk when you can mint money from your computers. Computers just keep working 24/7 regardless of the markets. Its like growing tulips back in the day.


----------



## JJP (Jan 17, 2018)

NoamL said:


> Maybe one or two will be the next Amazon...
> Lots of people "HODLed" on Pets.Com, it still went to zero.



LOL! I was just about to post, "The trick now is figuring out which one of these is the crypto version of Amazon and which is Pets.com...That is if there is an Amazon among these. "

Somebody tossed a bitcoin out on a poker table full of programmers and game developers a few years ago before most people knew what it was. When he explained it I remember thinking it might be fun to buy a few and see what happens. At the time I thought it was cheap and the odds were better than the lottery. Never got around to it. Now we have all these goofy public offerings and companies announcing blockchain to send their stocks up and it's just a mess and wouldn't be any fun.

Remember when companies would add .com to their names and their stock prices would jump? That was the beginning of the end of the internet bubble.


----------



## oliverd (Jan 18, 2018)

synergy543 said:


> Mining it. There is zero downside risk when you can mint money from your computers. Computers just keep working 24/7 regardless of the markets. Its like growing tulips back in the day.



Except for the cost. A mining computer on 24 hours a day is like running an electro shower for 12 hours a day. The electricity cost adds up pretty quick and the potential returns are diminishing each year as the more valuable coins become more difficult to mine


----------



## chillbot (Jan 20, 2018)

How do taxes in the US work on crypto? Does anyone know? Dare I ask?

I bought into bitcoin a bit too late... lost a tiny bit... but have since taken it all out and got into ETH cheap. I can transfer money pretty easily to and from my bank account and into coinbase and have made a bit of a profit and stand to make a lot more if ETH holds up... but they have never asked for my social security number or anything?


----------



## Gerhard Westphalen (Jan 20, 2018)

I've been mining with Nicehash. Running on 3 computers but only my main DAW PC can do the GPU mining so I run that at night and then CPU mining the rest of the time. Most of the time I can work without any issues. I usually just have to turn it off to run mastering plugins. Computer are all very efficient and since I'm not running any fancy graphics cards the power usage is negligible. Cheap electricity here too. 

First payout will be at the end of the month. Had a mishap with Coinbase as it doesn't support withdrawls in Canada (and they didn't warn me before I transferred by bitcoins in).


----------



## Greg (Jan 20, 2018)

chillbot said:


> How do taxes in the US work on crypto? Does anyone know? Dare I ask?



You have to calculate and pay tax on every trade even crypto to crypto. Coinbase is already cooperating with the feds so I wouldn't risk it. If you just buy a few coins with USD and let them sit you wont have to pay until you cash out or buy another coin with it.


----------



## Desire Inspires (Feb 22, 2018)

It’s all about Ethos: https://www.ethos.io/


----------

