# Orchestral Tools Duplex Saxophones



## chrisav (Jul 19, 2021)

What's this all about then? 👀

Clicking the link takes me back to the full list of products, so maybe this was put up too early? 

(feel free to delete if this was already announced, couldn't find anything by searching on VI-C or on OT's social media)


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## Getsumen (Jul 19, 2021)

chrisav said:


> What's this all about then? 👀
> 
> Clicking the link takes me back to the full list of products, so maybe this was put up too early?
> 
> (feel free to delete if this was already announced, couldn't find anything by searching on VI-C or on OT's social media)


Oh wow OT diving into the saxophone field. Curious how it'll turn out given how saxes are notoriously difficult.

The two moods is interesting. Might it be both a jazz context and a more traditional band / orchestral use? 

Never used Glory Days. Does anyone know how they sounded?


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## Getsumen (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> As some of you may know I’m still hoarding saxophone samples. I’m kind of tempted to buy the VSL VI collection that’s on sale at the moment. But this sparks my interest as well. Part of the SINE subscription maybe?


I don't think it's Sine Factory because of the possible overlap with Rotary. Plus 4 soloists sounds a little too much for a free instrument. Won't complain if it's factory tho!


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## chrisav (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I just glanced at the original post earlier and thought it said free somewhere! So my reply was a bit misinformed. 4 soloists sound more like a solid competitor for Xsample Contemporary Saxophones!


Well it does have the same "free of charge" label that the free Layers library has, without being part of the Factory range, so who knows!


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## Tralen (Jul 19, 2021)

On this topic, what is the state of the current offerings of saxes? I know of Chris Hein, VSL, Aaron Venture, SWAM, Xsample...

Can someone compare them?


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## Tralen (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I am still planning to do just that.


Thanks, Doc.

I'm waiting eagerly for a view from someone more experienced.


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## VSriHarsha (Jul 19, 2021)

Why the hell I don’t see this on their page? It’s not yet visible on iPhone or something? Oh I also doubt if it’s for Kontakt. Well if they change in between for selected libraries, that’s really appreciated. But this is weird it won’t show up on mobile haven’t checked on laptop, yet. Well it’s free & maybe I can give a shot at.


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## chrisav (Jul 19, 2021)

VSriHarsha said:


> Why the hell I don’t see this on their page? It’s not yet visible on iPhone or something? Oh I also doubt if it’s for Kontakt. Well if they change in between for selected libraries, that’s really appreciated. But this is weird it won’t show up on mobile haven’t checked on laptop, yet. Well it’s free & maybe I can give a shot at.


It's no longer showing there for me either, so they most definitely put it up by mistake and swiftly took it down to await an official announcement. But not quick enough to avoid my obsessive browsing!


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## chrisav (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Well, I don’t know if I’m qualified then hehe. Here are the sax libraries I currently own, including some of the more “out there” instruments:
> 
> Xsample Alto sax (older release)
> Xsample Contemporary Saxophones (2021 release)
> ...


If you've got Session Horns Pro there's some decent solo saxes in there too!


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## Tralen (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Well, I don’t know if I’m qualified then hehe. Here are the sax libraries I currently own, including some of the more “out there” instruments:
> 
> Xsample Alto sax (older release)
> Xsample Contemporary Saxophones (2021 release)
> ...


A lot of libraries I didn't know of. Thanks for the list.

My only experience with sax VIs is VSL. I really enjoy the Bari Sax, but I'm looking for something that is more playable with an EWI. I'm afraid most libraries will be similar, so I should be looking at SWAM or Aaron Venture. Can you comment on the playability of Xsample and Aaron Venture?

Apologies to the OP for the persistent derailing.


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## chrisav (Jul 19, 2021)

No worries about the derailing guys! There's not all that much to discuss yet here until more info's available anyway, so it's as good a place as any to be a haven for nerding out over sax libraries.

About this mystery product though, I wouldn't be surprised if it ends up not being free, considering it contains four solo instruments. Maybe "free of charge" is just a placeholder price that appears on their internal listing system until they've added an actual final price? Just speculation of course, but it seems too good to be free haha


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## JDK88 (Jul 19, 2021)

Reduce the samples, round robins, dynamic layers. Free isn't far fetched.


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## jamwerks (Jul 19, 2021)

This might be à repackaging of Glory Days


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## re-peat (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Any other contenders



There’s also the saxophones in Broadway Big band. Bloody expensive, yes, and limited in stylistic scope, true, but not entirely without possibilities.

In 2007, not very long after I've got the library, I did this little test, just for myself, called ‘*ReBop*’, with the BBB Tenor Saxophone. Well, actually, it started out as a test for the _Arturia_ Brass Trumpet — that's from a library of modelled brass that Arturia has since abandoned — which had a solo in this piece as well, but I’ve cut it out because it never sounded very good. (You can still hear it as the second voice during the theme.)

The bass in this piece doesn’t sound very good either, _je sais_, but as I was just testing things that day, I thought of trying out the _Synful_ pizz bass and see whether it could walk at this pace. Barely, was the answer. (Normally, at that time anyway, I’d have used the _Bardstown Audio_ bass. Remember, this is 2007.)

Anyway, the reason I dug this piece up (and blew the dust and cobwebs from its wrinkled surface), is because, while this recording is pretty awful and the BBB saxophone is clearly flawed, clumsy, shouting-samples and what-have-you-not, I must say that I have never come across a saxophone library since — and we’re talking a period of 14 years here — that I consider even remotely capable of something similar. Isn't that weird? In 14 years, nothing.

(And in BBB’s defense: its saxophones were never intended, nor sampled to be used in the way I used the tenor in this little test.)

While on the subject: avoid BBB Lite.

And to give Doc another library to chew on: check out the Bariton saxophone ‘*Stac & Slap*’ library from _Inoui Samples_*.* Pretty useful thing to have around, I find, if one is doing virtual saxophone work.

On the whole though, I deeply-deeply-deeply-deeply-deeply dislike ALL sampled saxophones. All of them. Deeply.

_


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## Kirk1701 (Jul 19, 2021)

ahorsewhocandrive said:


> glory days is suuuuper wet with teldex in a way that is not really idiomatic imo... there's also a very, very narrow range of material you can write that doesn't sound overly MIDI. i used them in one tune recently-ish below (the brass + saxes in this are all glory days) but don't see myself reaching for them again



From what I've heard, Glory Days is specifically for swing music. From your example, my impressions are correct. I've not heard any other library even attempt this style of legato. If it's a one-trick pony, it does that trick very well.


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## Wally Garten (Jul 19, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Yes I am aware of this one and seem to like it based on the demos. The developer sort of doubled the price not that long ago, which was sort of weirdly triggering something just of-putting enough for me not to bite. Yet.


Yeah -- it's a little expensive for what it is. But it's pretty cool for squeaky and percussive ultra-shorts! You couldn't play "Careless Whisper" with it -- but, as with Sax Fury, that's sort of beside the point.


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## Artemi (Jul 19, 2021)

but does is it (djent) Careless Whisper though?
I like the example of BBB saxophone, but I couldn't find any info, what's the company?


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## ScarletJerry (Jul 19, 2021)

You want Careless Whisper. Here you go, courtesy of Embertone’s Sensual Sax! Also available for Kontakt.

Scarlet Jerry


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## givemenoughrope (Jul 19, 2021)

re-peat said:


> On the whole though, I deeply-deeply-deeply-deeply-deeply dislike ALL sampled saxophones. All of them. Deeply.
> 
> _


yes


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## Martin S (Jul 20, 2021)

Artemi said:


> but does is it (djent) Careless Whisper though?
> I like the example of BBB saxophone, but I couldn't find any info, what's the company?


Fable sounds - Broadway Big Band :

https://fablesounds.com/broadway-big-band/

I agree with Re-Peat; currently there are no offerings in sax libraries that comes even close to BBB.


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## Artemi (Jul 20, 2021)

Martin S said:


> Fable sounds - Broadway Big Band :
> 
> https://fablesounds.com/broadway-big-band/
> 
> I agree with Re-Peat; currently there are no offerings in sax libraries that comes even close to BBB.


the price is $2295​are you serious? 

guys I just went into the time maschine,
the prices for libraries in 2000's were something else. phew


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## jimjazzuk (Jul 20, 2021)

Artemi said:


> the price is $2295​are you serious?
> 
> guys I just went into time maschine,
> the prices for libraries in 2000's were something else. phew


They would have made so much more money by reducing the price. Nothing in the library world costs that much these days


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## OrchestralTools (Jul 20, 2021)

Hey folks! OK, you got us: We accidentally published this new product for a few minutes yesterday. We're impressed and humbled once again by the fact that you people are so interested in what we're doing that the error was noticed! So kudos to you, @chrisav —you get a free license when the product is released (DM us for the logistics).

One important point to clarify: It's not going to be part of SINEfactory, and it's not going to be free. But there will be an intro offer—the usual two weeks. Keep your eyes peeled for the official release, coming soon.

And in the meantime, I want to share one of the audio demos for the product in advance, so you can hear what these instruments are capable of. It's an 'in-context' cinematic demo by the inimitable Benjamin Botkin. And it's prophetically titled 'Caught Snooping'... yes, really.

All the best from the whole OT team!


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## Artemi (Jul 20, 2021)

for some reason when I read the OT post it sounded like Sascha or Henrik were reading it in my head,
I've probably watched too many OT walkthroughs
lol


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## chrisav (Jul 20, 2021)

OrchestralTools said:


> Hey folks! OK, you got us: We accidentally published this new product for a few minutes yesterday. We're impressed and humbled once again by the fact that you people are so interested in what we're doing that the error was noticed! So kudos to you, @chrisav —you get a free license when the product is released (DM us for the logistics).
> 
> One important point to clarify: It's not going to be part of SINEfactory, and it's not going to be free. But there will be an intro offer—the usual two weeks. Keep your eyes peeled for the official release, coming soon.
> 
> ...



Thank you guys so much, that's so generous! 😲 Seems my snooping paid off ❤️


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## jimjazzuk (Jul 20, 2021)

OrchestralTools said:


> Hey folks! OK, you got us: We accidentally published this new product for a few minutes yesterday. We're impressed and humbled once again by the fact that you people are so interested in what we're doing that the error was noticed! So kudos to you, @chrisav —you get a free license when the product is released (DM us for the logistics).
> 
> One important point to clarify: It's not going to be part of SINEfactory, and it's not going to be free. But there will be an intro offer—the usual two weeks. Keep your eyes peeled for the official release, coming soon.
> 
> ...



Sounds nice! It has that classical sound that you can hear in John Williams' Catch Me If You Can, which I suspect was the influence here


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## holywilly (Jul 20, 2021)

I wish those saxes are recorded dry, not as wet as Glory Days.


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## N.Caffrey (Jul 20, 2021)

OrchestralTools said:


> Hey folks! OK, you got us: We accidentally published this new product for a few minutes yesterday. We're impressed and humbled once again by the fact that you people are so interested in what we're doing that the error was noticed! So kudos to you, @chrisav —you get a free license when the product is released (DM us for the logistics).
> 
> One important point to clarify: It's not going to be part of SINEfactory, and it's not going to be free. But there will be an intro offer—the usual two weeks. Keep your eyes peeled for the official release, coming soon.
> 
> ...



sounds awesome! I immediately thought about The Adventure of Tin Tin by John Williams listening to this


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## Hendrik-Schwarzer (Jul 20, 2021)

holywilly said:


> I wish those saxes are recorded dry, not as wet as Glory Days.


We made the recordings at the Teldex Solo Booth. So you'll get a rather focused and dry sound.
For comparison you can check out our Woodwind Soloists, which were recorded in the same space.


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## holywilly (Jul 20, 2021)

Hendrik-Schwarzer said:


> We made the recordings at the Teldex Solo Booth. So you'll get a rather focused and dry sound.
> For comparison you can check out our Woodwind Soloists, which were recorded in the same space.


That’s fantastic, I’m SOLD! I’m highly anticipated on this one.


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## BenBotkin (Jul 20, 2021)

jimjazzuk said:


> Sounds nice! It has that classical sound that you can hear in John Williams' Catch Me If You Can, which I suspect was the influence here


Shoot, they noticed!


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## Martin S (Jul 20, 2021)

I really like the sound in the demo  I hope their demo’s will show whether these saxes could also be used for jazz combo and Big Band (post-swing-era) stuff as well.


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## Wally Garten (Jul 20, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I have to say though that I have an even deeper hate for shakuhachi samples. Especially THE sample, that much to my horror was prominently featured in a number of 1990s hits that were all over the radio. The keyboard player that thought it was a good idea to play 8th and 16th note melodies with a shakuhachi patch with a really slow attack, should go before a VI tribunal. Even thinking about Enigma, makes my stomach hurt.


Hey, it's fun to play VIs in a patently unrealistic way! (And I remember liking Enigma -- must now go listen to see if that's still the case.... )


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## Wally Garten (Jul 20, 2021)

Wally Garten said:


> (And I remember liking Enigma -- must now go listen to see if that's still the case.... )


UPDATE: I am now remembering that "Gregorian chant" was vastly overused during a certain period....


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## Wally Garten (Jul 20, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Those producers were working with… formulaic approaches. Shakuhachi. Gregorian chants. And something I considered a “Soul II Soul” beat back then (I think).
> 
> Raking in the cash.


What's the moneymaking formula today? (Asking for a friend.)


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## Wally Garten (Jul 20, 2021)

OrchestralTools said:


> Hey folks! OK, you got us: We accidentally published this new product for a few minutes yesterday. We're impressed and humbled once again by the fact that you people are so interested in what we're doing that the error was noticed! So kudos to you, @chrisav —you get a free license when the product is released (DM us for the logistics).
> 
> One important point to clarify: It's not going to be part of SINEfactory, and it's not going to be free. But there will be an intro offer—the usual two weeks. Keep your eyes peeled for the official release, coming soon.
> 
> ...



Sounds really good! Look forward to the announcement.


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## CeDur (Jul 20, 2021)

ScarletJerry said:


> You want Careless Whisper. Here you go, courtesy of Embertone’s Sensual Sax! Also available for Kontakt.
> 
> Scarlet Jerry



This is such a gem! I discovered it last weekend and spent around 3-4 hours playing with big smile on my face. Maybe not the most 'HD' library around, but a lot of fun to play with for just 20$.


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## Braveheart (Jul 20, 2021)

I can’t wait to spot Ark5 before the announcement to get it free!


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## Toecutter (Jul 20, 2021)

wow awesome demo, great samples, great music... please more of that in the future. Kudos to OP, OT and Ben


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## BenBotkin (Jul 20, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> wow awesome demo, great samples, great music... please more of that in the future. Kudos to OP, OT and Ben


Thanks so much! I mostly worked with the alto sax, which is super playable and easy to work with. There were a number of places in the main melodic line where I needed to adjust timing or smooth out dynamics, but that was mostly to compensate for human error, not sampling inconsistencies. Like the BWW soloists libraries, you can play slow smooth AND fast smooth w/ the same legato patch. (Again, speaking particularly to the alto sax, which I focused the demo on. I'm less familiar with the other patches).


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## Geoff Grace (Jul 20, 2021)

Wally Garten said:


> What's the moneymaking formula today? (Asking for a friend.)


Buy low. Sell high.

Best,

Geoff


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## Geoff Grace (Jul 20, 2021)

Then there’s this old gem: _Wanna know how to make a million dollars in the music business? Start with ten million._

Best,

Geoff


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## soulofsound (Jul 20, 2021)

BenBotkin said:


> Thanks so much! I mostly worked with the alto sax, which is super playable and easy to work with. There were a number of places in the main melodic line where I needed to adjust timing or smooth out dynamics, but that was mostly to compensate for human error, not sampling inconsistencies. Like the BWW soloists libraries, you can play slow smooth AND fast smooth w/ the same legato patch. (Again, speaking particularly to the alto sax, which I focused the demo on. I'm less familiar with the other patches).


As a (mostly alto) sax player I find this sounds convincing, which is exceptional to very rare for sax libraries. Thanks so much for this beautiful demo with lush Catch Me feel.


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## IdealSequenceG (Jul 21, 2021)

Embertone - Sensual Saxophone Test



View attachment SaxophoneTest.mp3


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## CeDur (Jul 21, 2021)

IdealSequenceG said:


> Embertone - Sensual Saxophone Test
> 
> 
> 
> View attachment SaxophoneTest.mp3



Great little demo. You were switching Sensual/Straight during playing, or just adjusting SEX levels on the fly?


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## IdealSequenceG (Jul 21, 2021)

CeDur said:


> Great little demo. You were switching Sensual/Straight during playing, or just adjusting SEX levels on the fly?


From 0:00 to 0:03, it's pure Straight, and the rest is Sensual.


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## Toecutter (Jul 21, 2021)

BenBotkin said:


> Thanks so much! I mostly worked with the alto sax, which is super playable and easy to work with. There were a number of places in the main melodic line where I needed to adjust timing or smooth out dynamics, but that was mostly to compensate for human error, not sampling inconsistencies. Like the BWW soloists libraries, you can play slow smooth AND fast smooth w/ the same legato patch. (Again, speaking particularly to the alto sax, which I focused the demo on. I'm less familiar with the other patches).


You're welcome! Thanks for the quick breakdown of the track, you did a really great job and most certainly sold me the library. Can't wait for more details and a walkthrough, do we have a release date and price yet?


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## OrchestralTools (Jul 23, 2021)

Toecutter said:


> Can't wait for more details and a walkthrough, do we have a release date and price yet?


We don't want to do any more damage to the release surprise, but we can say it's coming in *just a few days*.


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## Wally Garten (Jul 26, 2021)

OMG IT'S BEEN SEVERAL DAYS I HAVE TO KNOW


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## Flyo (Jul 26, 2021)

@OrchestralTools Hello team, im waiting months for an update for Sine to bring compatibility for AAX format, when this could happen? Thanks


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## Geoff Grace (Jul 26, 2021)

Flyo said:


> @OrchestralTools Hello team, im waiting months for an update for Sine to bring compatibility for AAX format, when this could happen? Thanks


I think they're waiting for winter in Hades, but I could be wrong...

Best,

Geoff


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## ugerhard (Jul 28, 2021)

Looks like Sonic State have spoiled the surprise a bit, incl. price information:









Orchestral Tools Announces Duplex Saxophones


Sampled soprano, alto, tenor, and baritone instruments




sonicstate.com


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## holywilly (Jul 28, 2021)

Awesome, credit card is ready.


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## tritonely (Jul 28, 2021)

ugerhard said:


> Looks like Sonic State have spoiled the surprise a bit, incl. price information:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Nice find, really excited for this one! Maybe SonicState will give you now a 'free license when the product is released'


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## jamwerks (Jul 28, 2021)

I wonder if these are just 1 dynamic layer like the other Woodwinds?


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## Geoff Grace (Jul 28, 2021)

jamwerks said:


> I wonder if these are just 1 dynamic layer like the other Woodwinds?


If that level is forte or greater, I wouldn’t mind. My use case would be for funk, rock, and blues styles, none of which are often played at lower dynamic levels.

Dry works for this as well, by the way. 

Best,

Geoff


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## Martin S (Jul 28, 2021)

It‘s now official on OT’s site:

https://www.orchestraltools.com/store/collections/duplex-saxophones

It sounds great! - I’m so gonna get this


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## Wally Garten (Jul 28, 2021)

"While higher velocity leads the instrument to play a subtle crescendo, playing more softly results in a slight decrescendo. By using a single velocity layer, we reduce any phasing effect to a minimum."

I don't want to be dumb, but if it's playing different samples at high and low velocities... is that not more than one velocity layer?


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## Getsumen (Jul 28, 2021)

Wally Garten said:


> "While higher velocity leads the instrument to play a subtle crescendo, playing more softly results in a slight decrescendo. By using a single velocity layer, we reduce any phasing effect to a minimum."
> 
> I don't want to be dumb, but if it's playing different samples at high and low velocities... is that not more than one velocity layer?


No crossfading. It's either soft --> loud, loud --> soft.

Similar to what the Woodwind soloists had. It's not an extreme amount of diff


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## soulofsound (Jul 28, 2021)

For the regular legato and stac like in Botkin's demo it sounds great. The red-hot growl doesn't convince i think. I know it is difficult to sample, so no shame in that.


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## MaxOctane (Jul 29, 2021)

If you've never experienced the beauty of a Philip Glass saxophone quartet, here you go and you're welcome:


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## giedrius (Jul 29, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I love this piece. If you’re into this, I also highly recommend these:
> 
> All Ciudades pieces by Dutch composer Guillaume Lago:
> 
> ...



This is some really beautiful music, thank you!


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## biomuse (Jul 29, 2021)

Love the tone of DS, but on many transitions the crossfades really sound badly obvious to my ears. There's very definitely a way to write and a way not to write to this lib.


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## MaxOctane (Jul 29, 2021)




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## bill5 (Jul 29, 2021)

chrisav said:


> It's no longer showing there for me either, so they most definitely put it up by mistake and swiftly took it down to await an official announcement.


Or maybe it was a slick "accident" that wasn't an accident to draw attention...


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## bill5 (Jul 29, 2021)

Martin S said:


> Fable sounds - Broadway Big Band :
> 
> https://fablesounds.com/broadway-big-band/


Holy ####. For that money I could hire a sax player for far (far) less. Hell for that money I could buy my own sax and figure it out myself.


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## Martin S (Jul 30, 2021)

bill5 said:


> Holy ####. For that money I could hire a sax player for far (far) less. Hell for that money I could buy my own sax and figure it out myself.


Yup, it’s well out of my price range. As some one posted earlier, they should’ve lowered the price and would have sold a lot more.


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## ChrisSiuMusic (Aug 3, 2021)




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## muziksculp (Aug 3, 2021)

soulofsound said:


> As a (mostly alto) sax player I find this sounds convincing, which is exceptional to very rare for sax libraries. Thanks so much for this beautiful demo with lush Catch Me feel.


Hi @soulofsound ,

That's very, interesting, and encouraging to hear that from a sax player. 

So, would you recommend OT: Duplex Saxophones library ?

Thanks,
Muziksculp


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## soulofsound (Aug 3, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Hi @soulofsound ,
> 
> That's very, interesting, and encouraging to hear that from a sax player.
> 
> ...


Hi @muziksculp,

If you only use the legato and staccato/tenuto like in Botkin's demo, i think the library sounds really good. However they also say you can do bends and what not, but i don't think these sound in any way as convincing.


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## muziksculp (Aug 3, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Agreed. I have yet do play bends with any of my sax libraries and have convincing results…


Have you tried doing bends with IW Saxes ?


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## muziksculp (Aug 3, 2021)

Actually, I wonder how OT Duplex saxes compare to AV IW Saxes ?


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## soulofsound (Aug 3, 2021)

I had some good jazz results with Tenor Colossus. But that library is really suited to the kind of Stan Getz bossa nova i want to play. I don't know yet if you can do Gerry Rafferty (Ravenscroft) or even Ben Webster or Dick Parry with it, but i doubt it.


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## muziksculp (Aug 3, 2021)

I just decided to test NI's Session Horns Pro's *T**enor Sax*, and played a bit using the Pitch-wheel to perform some bends, and depending on how one uses the pitch-bend wheel, some decent bends can be emulated.


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## muziksculp (Aug 3, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Decent. Yes.


Yeah.. exactly that, but it does the job. I'm not a sax player, and having some sax libraries like Session Horns Pro, and possibly Duplex Saxes is good enough, I also don't write a lot of Jazz, or Sax based tracks.

Are there any demos showing bends using the OT Duplex Saxophones library ?


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## Martin S (Aug 3, 2021)

I just watched the walkthrough and I’m generally quite pleased with it. One thing that I’ve noticed in both the demos and the walkthrough, is some sort of random..I dunno … phasing/chorus-like sound in the transitions between notes, particularly in the legato patches. Is it just me, or am I being overly critical/picky? In the walkthrough‘s mic overview it sounds more pronounced in the 2 spot mics, and less so in the ‘presence’ mics.

That said, I do like the library and will definitely get it (waited for the walkthrough); just wondering if other people are hearing the same ‘chorusy’ sound, too?


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## muziksculp (Aug 3, 2021)

Martin S said:


> One thing that I’ve noticed in both the demos and the walkthrough, is some sort of random..I dunno … phasing/chorus-like sound in the transitions between notes, particularly in the legato patches.


Phasing/Chorusing with one Dynamic Layer ? how is that possible ?


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## Martin S (Aug 3, 2021)

Yes, I know…It shouldn’t, but that’s what I hear, nonetheless… Could it be a video compression thing?


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## muziksculp (Aug 3, 2021)

Martin S said:


> Yes, I know…It shouldn’t, but that’s what I hear, nonetheless…


Must be some ghost layers you are hearing, are you monitoring with headphones, or studio monitors ?


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## Martin S (Aug 3, 2021)

Headphones. You’re probably right…I’ll give it a listen through my monitors


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## Germain B (Aug 3, 2021)

Definitely gonna pick this up. I want saxes in the OT woodwinds family for a long time but this release was quite unexpected !
Sounds great and I love how just one sax can bring a whole new and interesting color to a full orchestra.

And this short little quartet at the end of the walkthrough is exquisite and inspiring to my ears.


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## Martin S (Aug 3, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Must be some ghost layers you are hearing, are you monitoring with headphones, or studio monitors ?


I’m sorry to report that I hear it on 3 different pair of headphones and my monitors as well, both when played via my Mac and via IPad Pro and iPhone. It sounds like some notes have chorus on them, others not. And only on the long articulations.


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## muziksculp (Aug 3, 2021)

Germain B said:


> And this short little quartet at the end of the walkthrough is exquisite and inspiring to my ears.


Yes, That made me smile


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## muziksculp (Aug 3, 2021)

Martin S said:


> I’m sorry to report that I hear it on 3 different pair of headphones and my monitors as well, both when played via my Mac and via IPad Pro and iPhone. It sounds like some notes have chorus on them, others not. And only on the long articulations.


Hmmm... I'm glad to report that I don't hear any phasing, or anything that resembles phasing that annoys me, or makes me hear something that's not natural sounding.


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## Drjay (Aug 3, 2021)

Martin S said:


> I’m sorry to report that I hear it on 3 different pair of headphones and my monitors as well, both when played via my Mac and via IPad Pro and iPhone. It sounds like some notes have chorus on them, others not. And only on the long articulations.


Be assured you are not going mad; I also hear a chorus like effect!  
But since I am no sax expert, I dunno whether this is normal or not.


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## muziksculp (Aug 3, 2021)

Drjay said:


> Be assured you are not going mad; I also hear a chorus like effect!
> But since I am no sax expert, I dunno whether this is normal or not.


Where do you hear that ? can you be a bit more specific, so I can check if I hear it.


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## Martin S (Aug 3, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Where do you hear that ? can you be a bit more specific, so I can check if I hear it.


It’s actually hard to describe, other than what I’ve mentioned already, but I just had a listen to the individual instrument examples on OT’s website and it is more pronounced in the RED examples, yet it’s still there in the BLUE examples.

I think the best way to describe it is like an unnatural timbre change from note to note; or sudden cross fade from ‘close’ mic to ‘room(ier)’ mic from note to note - if that makes any sense? It’s mainly the timbre change between notes that I notice sounds ‘unnatural/uneven’ and creates this chorus-like effect. Otherwise, the saxes sound great and is a huge improvement to what has been on offer so far in a sax lib.


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## galactic orange (Aug 3, 2021)

Martin S said:


> or sudden cross fade from ‘close’ mic to ‘room(ier)’ mic from note to note - if that makes any sense? It’s mainly the timbre change between notes that I notice sounds ‘unnatural/uneven’


I heard this in the instrument demos too, but it’s not so pronounced to make me think it’s anything other than a mic issue. And it still sounds good enough (I don’t like the term ‘convincing’) to make some great tracks with as evidenced by the demos.


----------



## muziksculp (Aug 3, 2021)

Martin S said:


> It’s actually hard to describe, other than what I’ve mentioned already, but I just had a listen to the individual instrument examples on OT’s website and it is more pronounced in the RED examples, yet it’s still there in the BLUE examples.
> 
> I think the best way to describe it is like an unnatural timbre change from note to note; or sudden cross fade from ‘close’ mic to ‘room(ier)’ mic from note to note - if that makes any sense? It’s mainly the timbre change between notes that I notice sounds ‘unnatural/uneven’ and creates this chorus-like effect. Otherwise, the saxes sound great and is a huge improvement to what has been on offer so far in a sax lib.


My guess is since they recorded these sax players in a quite dry booth type environment, you are hearing some of the early reflections bouncing back from the booth/enclosure they recorded in, and is being captured by the mics.

Once you add some reverb to the instruments that phase type sound will not be audible anymore. I think they expect one to add reverb to the out of the box sound.


----------



## soulofsound (Aug 3, 2021)

Martin S said:


> It’s actually hard to describe, other than what I’ve mentioned already, but I just had a listen to the individual instrument examples on OT’s website and it is more pronounced in the RED examples, yet it’s still there in the BLUE examples.
> 
> I think the best way to describe it is like an unnatural timbre change from note to note; or sudden cross fade from ‘close’ mic to ‘room(ier)’ mic from note to note - if that makes any sense? It’s mainly the timbre change between notes that I notice sounds ‘unnatural/uneven’ and creates this chorus-like effect. Otherwise, the saxes sound great and is a huge improvement to what has been on offer so far in a sax lib.


The timbre shift is definitely there. I don't know why it happens but it is not natural. I thought it acceptable though, given how bad many other sax libraries sound, but if i would have written a nice melody with it and the phasing distracts, that would suck.


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## sumskilz (Aug 3, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Phasing/Chorusing with one Dynamic Layer ? how is that possible ?


There is still a crossfade happening. I have noticed the problem when editing live performances, and have found that it's necessary to shift the files to make sure that they are both in phase and the exact same pitch at the edit point, and then it's still necessary to keep the fade length short. I assume they did minimal editing on these samples in order to keep them natural sounding, but the chorusing could be solved by using pitch correction (like Melodyne for example) at just the points where the crossfades happen.

Most of the time with a live performance, you can avoid the issue by only making edits where the player takes a breath, but with legato samples that's not possible.


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## Martin S (Aug 4, 2021)

Well, this isn’t going to be a dealbreaker for me, anyway. I think with a good mic mix with the spot and presence mics, this library outperforms any sax lib available so far and sounds great for big band stuff, as the little example at the end of the walkthrough shows. Well done, Orchestral Tools


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## holywilly (Aug 4, 2021)

I love the sounds of duplex sax, bought it since launch and I think it’s perfect to use in context of orchestral music.


----------



## madfloyd (Aug 4, 2021)

Has anyone compared this with Tenor Colussus?


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## madfloyd (Aug 4, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> I have. Different concepts, different sounds. Still in the process of creating comparison audio clips for a review. Both are great, but Duplex of course offers more instruments and does not come with the smart delay system that Straightahead Samples offers.


Great to hear about the upcoming review! I don't remember hearing about Straighahead Samples' smart delay system, but in any case I'll wait for your review. Thanks!


----------



## madfloyd (Aug 4, 2021)

I appreciated this video, thank you. The smart delay sounds very convincing for faster passages but the slow scoop seems to really limit it's use (and the famous riff in this video does NOT sound very convincing at all unfortunately). 

So a comparison type review will be very helpful, thanks again.


----------



## constaneum (Aug 5, 2021)

i love the sound of these instruments but the quality of the samples which i've heard in the solo walkthrough video has quite a few sizzling noise sound. did anyone notice that???


----------



## sumskilz (Aug 5, 2021)

constaneum said:


> i love the sound of these instruments but the quality of the samples which i've heard in the solo walkthrough video has quite a few sizzling noise sound. did anyone notice that???


Maybe, not sure I know what you're talking about. I did hear some stuff that could be described as "sizzling noise sounds" which sound like the noises a saxophone makes that you can hear when you close mic it, which is a good thing in my opinion.


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## Germain B (Aug 5, 2021)

I just found there's a noise on the Blue Alto, Sustains (+Leg), C#4 and D4, in every microphones.
Same with the Sustains Accented articulation.


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## constaneum (Aug 5, 2021)

sumskilz said:


> Maybe, not sure I know what you're talking about. I did hear some stuff that could be described as "sizzling noise sounds" which sound like the noises a saxophone makes that you can hear when you close mic it, which is a good thing in my opinion.


you can hear them here. seems like only the Tenor sax has this issue. hmm.


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## sumskilz (Aug 5, 2021)

Germain B said:


> I just found there's a noise on the Blue Alto, Sustains (+Leg), C#4 and D4, in every microphones.
> Same with the Sustains Accented articulation.


Does it sound like both notes are the same recording with one of them repitched?


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## sumskilz (Aug 5, 2021)

constaneum said:


> you can here them here. seems like only the Tenor sax has this issue. hmm.



Okay yeah, I can hear some noise there that is definitely not from the saxophone.


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## Germain B (Aug 5, 2021)

sumskilz said:


> Does it sound like both notes are the same recording with one of them repitched?


Not sure but the noise is exactly the same. So I would say yes.


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## Germain B (Aug 5, 2021)

It's the same kind of noise we hear in the examples given by @constaneum.


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## Martin S (Aug 5, 2021)

If you’ve ever been real close to a sax player in action, it’s not uncommon to hear a little occasional sizzle from the mouthpiece; most likely a tiny amount of saliva forming between the lips and the mouthpiece. Since these saxophones are recorded in a small booth and up close, it’s likely to have been captured during recordings. I have 30 years experience playing with saxophone players and I’ve noticed this, particularly with Tenor sax. And more noticeable at higher volume/intensity/velocity.


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## holywilly (Aug 5, 2021)

Kudos to OT by releasing this wonderful saxophone library. Noodling around the first time wasn’t impressed, after using in context in my cues, I’d say this library is easy to use, blend very well with anything and sounds extremely nice.


----------



## constaneum (Aug 5, 2021)

Martin S said:


> If you’ve ever been real close to a sax player in action, it’s not uncommon to hear a little occasional sizzle from the mouthpiece; most likely a tiny amount of saliva forming between the lips and the mouthpiece. Since these saxophones are recorded in a small booth and up close, it’s likely to have been captured during recordings. I have 30 years experience playing with saxophone players and I’ve noticed this, particularly with Tenor sax. And more noticeable at higher volume/intensity/velocity.


occasional in live recordings i think still ok but imagine you playing the same note in samples. haha. can be a bit annoying.


----------



## Laurin Lenschow (Aug 5, 2021)

Just downloaded the library and I am utterly in love with the sound. 
The only downside so far is that the Alto Sax does not go quite high enough for the small 'Catch me if you can' mockup I wanted to do with this library - I will have to figure out a way around that...


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## madfloyd (Aug 5, 2021)

sumskilz said:


> Okay yeah, I can hear some noise there that is definitely not from the saxophone.


I am not hearing anything wrong. I hear more 'artifacts' from many of my jazz records, lol.


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## Martin S (Aug 5, 2021)

constaneum said:


> occasional in live recordings i think still ok but imagine you playing the same note in samples. haha. can be a bit annoying.


Haha, yeah you’re right..I’d like to view it as adding ‘character’ and ‘realism’ to the performance


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## sumskilz (Aug 5, 2021)

madfloyd said:


> I am not hearing anything wrong. I hear more 'artifacts' from many of my jazz records, lol.


In retrospect, I don't think the noise in the walkthrough that I heard is even from the samples, because it's only on the left when the sax isn't in stereo. So I don't know if it's what others seem to dislike. Most everything I hear are proper saxophone noises.


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## Chungus (Aug 5, 2021)

Laurin Lenschow said:


> Just downloaded the library and I am utterly in love with the sound.
> The only downside so far is that the Alto Sax does not go quite high enough for the small 'Catch me if you can' mockup I wanted to do with this library - I will have to figure out a way around that...


You can extend the range of an instrument in the SINE player. Simply drag the GUI element shown here.


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## Laurin Lenschow (Aug 5, 2021)

Chungus said:


> You can extend the range of an instrument in the SINE player. Simply drag the GUI element shown here.


That is awesome, I did not know that (never worked with the SINE player before). Thanks for telling me, you saved me a lot of work and made me really happy


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## Geoff Grace (Aug 5, 2021)

Martin S said:


> Otherwise, the saxes sound great and is a huge improvement to what has been on offer so far in a sax lib.


How about libraries that include saxes, like Broadway Big Band or Mojo 2?

Best,

Geoff


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## Martin S (Aug 6, 2021)

Geoff Grace said:


> How about libraries that include saxes, like Broadway Big Band or Mojo 2?
> 
> Best,
> 
> Geoff


In terms of saxes, Broadway Big Band is certainly a (the only, IMO) contender to Duplex Saxophones, sound wise. However, the price is so ridiculous that it’ll never find a place in my setup; even the Lites version is 600$  Their demos w/saxes sound really great, but I’ve also seen some reporting a rather clunky (old?) interface, although I can’t verify that since I never got to try BBB due the outrageous pricing.

Mojo 2 saxes is definitely not bad, either…But the saxes still sound too artificial for me, especially compared to Duplex. Small niggles apart, the sound you get with Duplex is (so far) the closest to the real thing I’ve ever heard in a sample library. If you’re in a small room next to a real saxophone player, the sound you get is similar to what Duplex provides. And it’s also brand new, so any small bugs will hopefully be ironed out in future updates. It also sounds great as a sax section, where other sax libraries has a tendency to quickly veer into the ‘accordion realm’.

Oh, and Glory Days (OT) isn’t bad at all either, but sounds way too wet (Teldex Scoring Stage) to be used for more intimate stuff.


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## CatOrchestra (Aug 6, 2021)

Are there any Dorico expression templates for Duplex Saxophones? Would be very handy (for some users I guess) if companies released more expression templates for Dorico-Sibelius imo.


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## constaneum (Aug 6, 2021)

i have Broadway Big Band lite and i have to say the amount of articulations offered isn't as comprehensive as OT's. Its interface is kinda old and its CC1 control sometimes has hiccups here and there an doesn't go according to the way you draw the CC1 patterns. I've just spent on Infinite Brass and AAS Chromaphone 3 so those are enough spend for time being. limited budget for now else i'll grab this library since i'm working on big band music for a current game.


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## doctoremmet (Aug 6, 2021)

In my aim to make my saxophone research as broad as humanly possible I came across this deal:

https://vgtrumpet.com/product/deal-saxophone-bundle/
(There is also a $85 bundle that includes the Soul Tenor and the Tenor Plus. For now I have opted for the cheapest one, as I don’t really have a clue how good or bad these samples really are. 1.4 Gb for an SATB quartet seems to imply there won’t be many articulations or much deep sampling going on. But I have been amazed by some other “low specs” VIs in the past, so we’ll see).


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## Martin S (Aug 6, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> In my aim to make my saxophone research as broad as humanly possible I came across this deal:
> 
> https://vgtrumpet.com/product/deal-saxophone-bundle/
> (There is also a $85 bundle that includes the Soul Tenor and the Tenor Plus. For now I have opted for the cheapest one, as I don’t really have a clue how good or bad these samples really are. 1.4 Gb for an SATB quartet seems to imply there won’t be many articulations or much deep sampling going on. But I have been amazed by some other “low specs” VIs in the past, so we’ll see).


I had a look at their website yesterday, and the Soul Tenor actually sounds quite good, me thinks. Although probably not as versatile as Duplex. I really liked the Flugelhorn and soft trumpet which I think would work great with softer/mellower passages of modern big band writing. And the prices are also quite reasonable.


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## doctoremmet (Aug 6, 2021)

Martin S said:


> I had a look at their website yesterday, and the Soul Tenor actually sounds quite good, me thinks. Although probably not as versatile as Duplex. I really liked the Flugelhorn and soft trumpet which I think would work great with softer/mellower passages of modern big band writing. And the prices are also quite reasonable.


Yes. Reason to do some testing. Duplex really does sound good. A really cool forum member (and saxophone player) was very kind and shared a whole bunch of his own SATB arrangements with me, so next to the chamber music scores I’m already working on (mockups) I can now also add some more jazzy and cinematic flavours to the test. I am very curious how these VG instruments behave, but since they seem to be conceived with the TEControl and EWI in mind, I wouldn’t be surprised at all if they are very playable.


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## Martin S (Aug 6, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Yes. Reason to do some testing. Duplex really does sound good. A really cool forum member (and saxophone player) was very kind and shared a whole bunch of his own SATB arrangements with me, so next to the chamber music scores I’m already working on (mockups) I can now also add some more jazzy and cinematic flavours to the test. I am very curious how these VG instruments behave, but since they seem to be conceived with the TEControl and EWI in mind, I wouldn’t be surprised at all if they are very playable.


I really like your approach to this with such a variety of different libs, and I’m looking forward to the results of your testing. And it certainly helps to have some ‘certified’ proven SATB arrangements to judge them all by 

Yes, the VG instruments may turn out to be a joker/hidden gem. Just had a listen to the Jazz bass clarinet; not bad actually…and generally his demos with breath controller sounds quite ok.


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## doctoremmet (Aug 6, 2021)

Martin S said:


> Yes, the VG instruments may turn out to be a joker/hidden gem. Just had a listen to the Jazz bass clarinet; not bad actually…and generally his demos with breath controller sounds quite ok.


First impression: they will absolutely not end up being the laughing stock of this test. In a way they’re ALL a big joke, because honestly… after a while everything starts to sound like I’m playing the Pink Panther tune in the cheesiest way… just FAKE as f*ck  That’s the beauty of this whole endeavour hehe. I may end up liking “woodwind-like” PM synths the best. That Reaktor Silverwood ensemble stuff is free and in a sense more flexible and dynamically interesting than all samples so far…


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## Martin S (Aug 6, 2021)

I hear ya  That fake saxophone almost became Joe Zawinul’s trademark sound after Wayne Shorter left Weather Report:


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## jimjazzuk (Aug 6, 2021)

I really want some saxes to write big band tracks, but I'm not convinced these are the ones. It's so so hard to get saxes right, and these somehow don't sound convincingly agile enough to me. When there is a switch between articulations it sounds clunky too. I will hold out for V.2 or see how the Sine port of Glory Days sounds first.


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## doctoremmet (Aug 6, 2021)

Martin S said:


> I hear ya  That fake saxophone almost became Joe Zawinul’s trademark sound after Wayne Shorter left Weather Report:



Have to say: he owns it haha.


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## Martin S (Aug 6, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Have to say: he owns it haha.


Oh yes, if anybody could get away with that fake sax sound, it’s definitely him


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## Martin S (Aug 6, 2021)

jimjazzuk said:


> I really want some saxes to write big band tracks, but I'm not convinced these are the ones. It's so so hard to get saxes right, and these somehow don't sound convincingly agile enough to me. When there is a switch between articulations it sounds clunky too. I will hold out for V.2 or see how the Sine port of Glory Days sounds first.


You got a valid point; the agility is probably the hardest thing to get right when it comes to saxes and although these aren’t perfect, I still think they’re better than most other libs. Judging from the demos it seems that faster (legato) passages aren’t their strength and are probably best suited for slow and medium tempo stuff. But the programming may also have something to do with it..


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## kgdrum (Aug 6, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> First impression: they will absolutely not end up being the laughing stock of this test. In a way they’re ALL a big joke, because honestly… after a while everything starts to sound like I’m playing the Pink Panther tune in the cheesiest way… just FAKE as f*ck  That’s the beauty of this whole endeavour hehe. I may end up liking “woodwind-like” PM synths the best. That Reaktor Silverwood ensemble stuff is free and in a sense more flexible and dynamically interesting than all samples so far…


You just made me laugh 😂,my 1st reaction when I heard Duplex Saxophones was the 🎶Pink Panther! 🎶
It sound pretty nice though………………


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## emilio_n (Aug 11, 2021)

Martin S said:


> In terms of saxes, Broadway Big Band is certainly a (the only, IMO) contender to Duplex Saxophones, sound wise. However, the price is so ridiculous that it’ll never find a place in my setup; even the Lites version is 600$  Their demos w/saxes sound really great, but I’ve also seen some reporting a rather clunky (old?) interface, although I can’t verify that since I never got to try BBB due the outrageous pricing.
> 
> Mojo 2 saxes is definitely not bad, either…But the saxes still sound too artificial for me, especially compared to Duplex. Small niggles apart, the sound you get with Duplex is (so far) the closest to the real thing I’ve ever heard in a sample library. If you’re in a small room next to a real saxophone player, the sound you get is similar to what Duplex provides. And it’s also brand new, so any small bugs will hopefully be ironed out in future updates. It also sounds great as a sax section, where other sax libraries has a tendency to quickly veer into the ‘accordion realm’.
> 
> Oh, and Glory Days (OT) isn’t bad at all either, but sounds way too wet (Teldex Scoring Stage) to be used for more intimate stuff.


about the saxes on Infinite Woodwinds?
Is comparable or playing in a different league?

I want to buy Infinite Woodwinds in the future, this is the reason I ask.


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## Martin S (Aug 11, 2021)

emilio_n said:


> about the saxes on Infinite Woodwinds?
> Is comparable or playing in a different league?
> 
> I want to buy Infinite Woodwinds in the future, this is the reason I ask.


Hi Emilio, I don’t have Infinite WW yet (waiting for Infinite Strings), but judging from demos the saxes are probably the weak spot of Infinite Woodwinds, and to my ears Duplex sounds much better.

PerryD recently posted a short piece, where he’s using the saxes (post # 5.264)

https://vi-control.net/community/threads/infinite-series-aaron-venture-thread.86499/post-4886081

The saxes still need some work, and hopefully they’ll be better in the next update of Infinite WW


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## emilio_n (Aug 11, 2021)

Martin S said:


> Hi Emilio, I don’t have Infinite WW yet (waiting for Infinite Strings), but judging from demos the saxes are probably the weak spot of Infinite Woodwinds, and to my ears Duplex sounds much better.
> 
> PerryD recently posted a short piece, where he’s using the saxes (post # 5.264)
> 
> ...


Thanks for your answer, Martin!
I have only Infinite Brass, and it is quite nice. But you are right. The saxes look like the weakest instruments on IW.

Did you get Duplex? Do you think worth it? I have also Swing! and Swing More! of ProjecSAM, but Duplex sounds... I am not sure if better, but for sure easier to program.


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## Martin S (Aug 11, 2021)

I haven’t got Duplex yet, as my old Mac Mini is giving me a lot of trouble (not enough RAM) and is about to be replaced with a new M1. So the funds I’d put aside for various libraries (incl. Duplex) has gone to the M1 instead…Quite annoying, ’cause I was really looking forward to play around with Duplex. But I will definitely get it, just not as soon as I’d hoped.


----------



## emilio_n (Aug 11, 2021)

Martin S said:


> I haven’t got Duplex yet, as my old Mac Mini is giving me a lot of trouble (not enough RAM) and is about to be replaced with a new M1. So the funds I’d put aside for various libraries (incl. Duplex) has gone to the M1 instead…Quite annoying, ’cause I was really looking forward to play around with Duplex. But I will definitely get it, just not as soon as I’d hoped.


My ancient iMac is dying too. I want to replace it a long time ago, but with the current Apple transition, I am just waiting and spending the money for the new computer in new libraries... (Sometime I really hate the GAS)


----------



## Laurin Lenschow (Aug 11, 2021)

emilio_n said:


> Did you get Duplex? Do you think worth it? I have also Swing! and Swing More! of ProjecSAM, but Duplex sounds... I am not sure if better, but for sure easier to program.


I own Swing!, Swing More! and Duplex, and now that I have the latter I would not even consider reaching for the ProjectSAM saxes. I agree with you - the ProjcectSAM ones sound good as well, but the ones from Duplex are just way easier to play and program. 
If you are looking for additional demos of Duplex, here is a short mockup I just did: 




I think the library is absolutely worth it and I'm glad that I got it!


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## MtB1 (Aug 11, 2021)

I've just purchased duplex, but didnot have the time to play around with it by now. I absolutely love the tone of these saxes! The only ones that come close (but are totally different to play and program), especially for solo playing, are the ones from Audio Modeling.


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## doctoremmet (Aug 11, 2021)

MtB1 said:


> I've just purchased duplex, but didnot have the time to play around with it by now. I absolutely love the tone of these saxes! The only ones that come close (but are totally different to play and program), especially for solo playing, are the ones from Audio Modeling.


And VSL. And Xsample Contemporary Saxophones. Those are the holy trinity… well whatever’s the variant with four


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## Soundbed (Aug 18, 2021)

Artemi said:


> the price is $2295​are you serious?
> 
> guys I just went into the time maschine,
> the prices for libraries in 2000's were something else. phew


There’s currently a Lite version on sale for $99 at VST Buzz









78% off "Broadway Lites" by Fable Sounds


Broadway Lites is a virtual instrument with an attitude. A fusion of sound, music and technology. It features 15GB of multi-sample content, with over 20,000 unique samples of saxophones, trumpets, trombone and clarinet.




vstbuzz.com


----------



## kgdrum (Aug 18, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> There’s currently a Lite version on sale for $99 at VST Buzz
> 
> 
> 
> ...


in my opinion even for $99 this library is overpriced.
I’ve bought more libraries than I can probably count over the years and this gem that I bought in 2006 is still the most useless library I’ve ever had.
I dislike it so much when I lost a hard drive that it was installed on I didn’t even consider or bother trying to obtain and re-install Bwday lite on a new SSD.


----------



## Soundbed (Aug 18, 2021)

kgdrum said:


> in my opinion even for $99 this library is overpriced.
> I’ve bought more libraries than I can probably count over the years and this gem that I bought in 2006 is still the most useless library I’ve ever had.
> I dislike it so much when I lost a hard drive that it was installed on I didn’t even consider or bother trying to obtain and re-install Bwday lite on a new SSD.


Really? I wouldn’t have mentioned it if I thought it wasn’t quality. The demo I worked on showed a lot of great aspects. It’s a ton of cool instrument sounds for $99. Granted I got an NFR so I’m not in the best position to be objective. But I think some people would have a very different opinion.


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## kgdrum (Aug 18, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> Really? I wouldn’t have mentioned it if I thought it wasn’t quality. The demo I worked on showed a lot of great aspects. It’s a ton of cool instrument sounds for $99. Granted I got an NFR so I’m not in the best position to be objective. But I think some people would have a very different opinion.


Yeah maybe my midi skills weren’t up to the task 15 years ago.
I’m probably biased on the other end of the purchasing spectrum,
back-in the day this was on sale at the time for $499.
So I might have also had higher expectations for a library in the $500 range on sale.


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## Soundbed (Aug 18, 2021)

kgdrum said:


> Yeah maybe my midi skills weren’t up to the task 15 years ago.
> I’m probably biased on the other end of the purchasing spectrum,
> back-in the day this was on sale at the time for $499.
> So I might have also had higher expectations for a library in the $500 range on sale.


Ah that makes sense then. Considering 8dio sells Fire Sax 🎷 on sale for $50 or so I’d think this deal at $99 would make some people very happy.


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## kgdrum (Aug 18, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> Ah that makes sense then. Considering 8dio sells Fire Sax 🎷 on sale for $50 or so I’d think this deal at $99 would make some people very happy.


I agree the pricing might also be playing a part of the equation of my admittedly extreme bias.
regarding: Fire Sax for $50,lol 
I’m one of the lucky people that pounced on the 8dio Anniversary glitch-a-rama sale a few months ago and bought the entire Afro-Cuban Latin Bible bundle which included all of the Fire horns for $74! 
So yeah extreme price differences are probably part of the my reaction.
*Well I just looked at the website and I see there’s a version 2 which I’m not familiar with. Do you happen to know what version 2 brought to the table? *I was mistaken on when I purchased B-lite it was actually 2011.
So now I’m curious to see if version 2 combined with hopefully my improved skill-set might make this better than I thought it was 10 years ago.
So if I get bored I might try reinstalling B-lite version 2 to see if it is better than I thought. Seeing this involves Continuata which always seems to give me problems, I’m going to have to think about this………………

👍


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## Flyo (Aug 18, 2021)

What about saxes included on Infinite Brass comparing the newest on OT? Anybody having this 2?


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## Soundbed (Aug 18, 2021)

kgdrum said:


> I agree the pricing might also be playing a part of the equation of my admittedly extreme bias.
> regarding: Fire Sax for $50,lol
> I’m one of the lucky people that pounced on the 8dio Anniversary glitch-a-rama sale a few months ago and bought the entire Afro-Cuban Latin Bible bundle which included all of the Fire horns for $74!
> So yeah extreme price differences are probably part of the my reaction.
> ...


I’m sorry I did not take the time to look at what changed in version 2.x of Broadway Lites. I only know I was impressed, and thought that — for the deal at VST Buzz right now — I wanted more people to know about it. Continuata installed perfectly for me. Mac Mavericks 10.14, used the download and install option. Still need to register it with NI of course. (But it should work with the free player at least, for those who don’t own Kontakt.)


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## kgdrum (Aug 18, 2021)

Soundbed said:


> I’m sorry I did not take the time to look at what changed in version 2.x of Broadway Lites. I only know I was impressed, and thought that — for the deal at VST Buzz right now — I wanted more people to know about it. Continuata installed perfectly for me. Mac Mavericks 10.14, used the download and install option. Still need to register it with NI of course. (But it should work with the free player at least, for those who don’t own Kontakt.)


It’s strange how different users have extremely different experiences with different installers. I love Pulse,I’ve never had a problem with it and it give some people fits!
I on the other hand always seem to have issues with Continuata/Connect.
When I have an install with Continuata & have a choice I will always install the old fashioned way(numerous rar files) and install myself.
Is it some preference on different users systems,pilot error,I really don’t know but Continuata makes me queasy,lol 😱


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## Soundbed (Aug 18, 2021)

kgdrum said:


> It’s strange how different users have extremely different experiences with different installers. I love Pulse,I’ve never had a problem with it and it give some people fits!
> I on the other hand always seem to have issues with Continuata/Connect.
> When I have an install with Continuata & have a choice I will always install the old fashioned way(numerous rar files) and install myself.
> Is it some preference on different users systems,pilot error,I really don’t know but Continuata makes me queasy,lol 😱


On the whole I’ve had fewer issues with Pulse vs Continuata over the years.


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