# Looking At Buying My First Analog Synth



## ryanstrong (Apr 23, 2016)

Hi all, I'm looking at getting my first analog synth, probably a Juno 60, and just had a few 'beginner' questions...

I understand so far that to make the Juno 60 work with MIDI I would need something like the "Kenton Pro DCB MK3 MIDI to DCB"? What is this and how does it work? Like does it record JUST the MIDI keyboard notes from the synth or does it intercept all CCs if you move any slider on the Juno? IE.

Second how big of a difference does the preamp make. I know this could get into a VERY long conversation, I know preamps can make or break vocal chains etc. I have a Neve 1073 preamp but just one channel, and I would want the Juno to be stereo so I would be forced to use my RME Fireface's inputs - am I losing anything there? Or is it perfectly acceptable for most?

Lastly... anyone selling a Juno 60?


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## mc_deli (Apr 23, 2016)

Can't help you with the Juno 60 but have had similar thoughts over the last few weeks. Decided to get first analogue synth (strictly speaking have a Polysix but anyway...) and start to buy some hardware rather than just libraries. Spent a lot of time on *big forum*'s electronic threads, looked at the new releases as well as some old stuff. Space is at a premium, and I didn't want to go crazy, so I got a Minitaur and MS20 mini (and vow to service my Polysix). Got the Minitaur on Thursday and it is super fun. The editor software is really good. Instant on screen patch control, knobs move mimicking real life moves etc. Really impressed. MS20 should arrive next week.

Very nearly also got the Roland Boutique JU-06. I know it is VA and sacrilege etc. TBH I would have bought it as well now if they hadn't made a mess of the CCs and made the DAW integration a bit of a pain - and if there was editor software (third party WIN only if I understand correctly at the moment).

Price size convenience maintenance factors make the JU-06 a no-brainer for me over the original. Horses for courses though of course.


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## chimuelo (Apr 23, 2016)

I was really impressed with the Roland GAIA.
While it isn't discrete audio, used they go for 350 USD and will teach you everything about subtractive synthesis.
Filters are excellent and motion sequencing can also control external hardware.

Might be a great way to see how much you get from subtractive before dropping a load.
And if you do, what a great little controller for analog hardware that isn't up to snuff with MIDI.


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## Greg (Apr 23, 2016)

I've always wanted a Juno 60 too but ended up getting a Prophet 6 instead and I am sooo happy I did. I love running it through a Revox tape machine, UAD Space Echo, or UAD Dimension D to make a more controllable old school vibe. Prophet 8 is also awesome for something cheaper.

If you can find a juno 60 under $1100 in good condition, I would probably buy it just as an investment! And I wouldn't let "being realistic" sway you too much. Nothing can match the inspiration you get from playing your dream synth. 

A cool setup to try would be running it thru the 1073 and into an analog roland space echo. But I personally don't think the pre matters nearly as much on synths as it does with mics.

Are you based in LA? They pop up for sale really often on craigslist. I almost got one for 900 a few weeks ago but another buyer had less traffic between him and the sale hahaha. :(

Heres one in really shit cosmetic condition but 'tested' that Ive been on the fence about.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Roland-Juno...661389?hash=item43eb9bbe4d:g:D2MAAOSwpIdW8J0E


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## doctornine (Apr 23, 2016)

ryanstrong said:


> Hi all, I'm looking at getting my first analog synth, probably a Juno 60, and just had a few 'beginner' questions...
> 
> I understand so far that to make the Juno 60 work with MIDI I would need something like the "Kenton Pro DCB MK3 MIDI to DCB"? What is this and how does it work? Like does it record JUST the MIDI keyboard notes from the synth or does it intercept all CCs if you move any slider on the Juno? IE.
> 
> ...



I have had a Juno 60 in the past. I don't have experience with that particular kenton, but i'd suspect it uses pretty basic midi and not CC's if you use the sliders. In fact I'd be surprised if such a thing existed. "Vintage" analog synths do not transmit CC from their sliders. 

Preamp, uh, you could spend more on a preamp than on the synth, would it make it "better", I doubt it.

I sold my 60 for *peanuts* years ago, do I miss it ? No.


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## PJMorgan (Apr 23, 2016)

I Honestly don't think I'd start with getting a Juno 60, even though it's a really great synth it's pretty ancient now & more susceptible to damage. It did make more sense when there weren't any analogues being made anymore but now there so many to choose from.

My 1st analogue was the Moog Sub Phatty, got it not long after it came out, still have it & love it. Thinking of getting a Korg Minilogue or the Roland JD XA next. Others to look at especially if poly is what your after are the DSI Prophet 6, Prophet 8 & OB6.


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## Gabriel Oliveira (Apr 23, 2016)

Ob6


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## Baron Greuner (Apr 24, 2016)

I sort of remember when the Juno series came out and never had any personally but they sounded good from memory. The only two Roland's I had was a Jupiter 8 and and JV90 and they were pretty good. I can't remember if the JV90 was analogue or not. Perhaps not.
These days the only synthesizers I have are sort of analogue but a lot of the time software synthesizers can be good too, but obviously a lot less tactile.


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## dgburns (Apr 24, 2016)

ryanstrong said:


> Hi all, I'm looking at getting my first analog synth, probably a Juno 60, and just had a few 'beginner' questions...
> 
> I understand so far that to make the Juno 60 work with MIDI I would need something like the "Kenton Pro DCB MK3 MIDI to DCB"? What is this and how does it work? Like does it record JUST the MIDI keyboard notes from the synth or does it intercept all CCs if you move any slider on the Juno? IE.
> 
> ...



I would personally look for a synth that is not yet in software form.I feel the juno sound is recreatable in software,diva especially.Not saying the tactile side isn't a boon,but you could have ten or twenty pulled up rather then the one.
Preamp can be done in software too,if that's important.
I'd also concentrate my search for old analogs looking for the unloved,inexpensive and unique.After all,before this modular craze took off,that's exactly what the old moog's etc were,old unloved and cheap.In a few years,we'll look back on this modular craze and shake our heads citing the lack of recall and repair costs as a bad thing.No way to explain fashion trends while you're in them.Remember wide leg Lee denims? 70's are back in style now.

I guess I'm suggesting you be a contrarian.Let the world catch up to you.

All that said,and I must confess a rather large craving for a dx7ii fd.Don't know why...


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## gsilbers (Apr 24, 2016)




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## ryanstrong (Apr 24, 2016)

gsilbers said:


>



Yeah I was looking at it. It sounds good, but for me defeats the purpose. Here is why for me...



Having recently watched this video by SPITFIRE AUDIO interviewing Olafur Arnalds, an artist who I respect and appreciate his music, made me really want to take a look at the Juno 60. Olafur articulates it so very well as to why hardware vs. software.

I think everyone would agree that soft/digital emulations have gotten fantastic, but for me this isn't the discussion for me. I appreciate everyone's thoughtfulness but I really am interested in the synth. There is a sort of magic that can happen that I am really interested in.

That said to go back to my original question that I'm not sure was entirely answered yet...

_I understand so far that to make the Juno 60 work with MIDI I would need something like the "Kenton Pro DCB MK3 MIDI to DCB"? What is this and how does it work? Like does it record JUST the MIDI keyboard notes from the synth or does it intercept all CCs if you move any slider on the Juno? IE.
_​How does the MIDI integration work with analog units?


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## higgs (Apr 24, 2016)

ryanstrong said:


> Second how big of a difference does the preamp make. I know this could get into a VERY long conversation, I know preamps can make or break vocal chains etc. I have a Neve 1073 preamp but just one channel, and I would want the Juno to be stereo so I would be forced to use my RME Fireface's inputs - am I losing anything there? Or is it perfectly acceptable for most?


Hey Ryan, I'll speak to the preamp part. It's really nice to have a couple/few hardware pre's, and there is no shortage of opinions out there on which is best and makes gold... But the Fireface is a decent box, and you can always add pre's at a later date. I know you really want to go stereo with the synth, but if I were you I'd slum it in mono with the 1073. Get another one of those down the line for a nice stereo pair. I think that's an approach that would be endorsed by a good number of gear slutz.


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## chimuelo (Apr 24, 2016)




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## chimuelo (Apr 24, 2016)




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## chimuelo (Apr 24, 2016)

For folks who are NAMMed out with the big guys cutting corners the 2 synths above smoke that plastic stuff.


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## ryanstrong (Apr 24, 2016)

chimuelo said:


>



Hmmmmm this is interesting! I'm surprised there are not more of things like this.


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## chimuelo (Apr 24, 2016)

There's plenty more.
I figured 2 discrete audio examples.
One monophonic with incredible routing tricks similar to old VCS synths.
One polyphonic that has great sounds.
Digitally controlled analog was great on big Jim Gamble console in the 90s.
Always wanted that for a powerful polyphonic.
But I spend every spare dime on getting better sounds in software and hardware.
Too bad I often have to sell them for some new venture.
But my ancient OBX and FS1r got me 4 large for new Modular addictions.
Im hopeless but well informed.....


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## chimuelo (Apr 24, 2016)

A Roland GAIA and both units above would cost 2400 new.
That's an impressive digital and analog collection.


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## chimuelo (Apr 24, 2016)

Good analog sounds from this 6 voice beast.
It's Digital Wavetables and discrete audio CCS.
So it's basically a Waldorf style synth circa 80s.


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## SymphonicSamples (Apr 24, 2016)

Chimuelo , the Futuresonus Parva sounds sweet, I'll keep my eye on that one. Thanks for the head's up, website bookmarked


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## chimuelo (Apr 24, 2016)

I'll get mine in June.
Definitely do a demo here.
Developers like this deserve success.
Did you check out the fat Amnika?


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## SymphonicSamples (Apr 24, 2016)

chimuelo said:


> I'll get mine in June.
> Definitely do a demo here.
> Developers like this deserve success.
> Did you check out the fat Amnika?


Good to hear Chim, man your killing my non existent hardware budget !! Indeed a developer like this does deserve success, I might try sell my soul to the analog devil for the 3rd time this year and do a pre order


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## Greg (Apr 24, 2016)

chimuelo said:


>




Thanks for the heads up! Looks really awesome


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## chimuelo (Apr 25, 2016)

ETA is June.
They have an honest forum where early kick starter guys are just now getting firmware fixes.
So after the next batch is released check out the forum and see what's up.
I am concerned about MultiMode working as described.
But everyone that owns one seem in agreement on fat buzzy sound with twice the punch of 1s and 0s.


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## Andreas Moisa (Apr 25, 2016)

I just ordered a Moog Sub 37!!!! Yeah! :-D


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## Astronaut FX (Apr 25, 2016)

This is such a great time for hardware synths. Perhaps better than at any other time in history. There are still great deals to be had on good condition vintage synths. But there is also a resurgence of new hardware synths that have been hitting the market over the past several years. 

Some made by long time recognizable builders (Moog, Korg, Roland, DSI), and others by newcomers, including some smaller boutique builders. And seemingly for the first time ever, there are plenty in the budget friendly/cheap end of the spectrum that are more than serviceable (Volcas, Mini/Microbrutes, Minilogue, Rocket, etc). 

And if none of that scratches where you itch, the eurorack format has put modular synths right back into the thick of things. 

The only downside is the difficulty of making decisions and/or where the hell to put them all.


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## mc_deli (Apr 25, 2016)

Andreas Moisa said:


> I just ordered a Moog Sub 37!!!! Yeah! :-D


My MS20 mini is in the post... but I am jealous


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## chimuelo (Apr 26, 2016)

Well the GAIA is a great introduction to subtractive synthesis.
But as an Umpire I gotta call them like I see them.


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## EvilDragon (Apr 26, 2016)

I'd definitely suggest the Parva, seems like a great introduction plus it's very flexible. If cash to spare, definitely DSI OB6. Not very flexible modulation-wise, but DAT FILTER OMFG O_O!


Moog Sub 37 oozes class. I played it for hours in the audio store that I frequent. They had to chase me away from it so they can close up! This is the one modern monosynth anybody serious about outboard gear should have, IMHO.


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## SymphonicSamples (Apr 26, 2016)

The Sub 37 indeed. Great synth with a lot of character and you can certainly get some crazy cool sounds out of it and rather unique at the same time, with a personalty of it's own. Whenever I turn mine on I spend more time just exploring sounds than writing


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## higgs (Apr 26, 2016)

SymphonicSamples said:


> The Sub 37 indeed. Great synth with a lot of character and you can certainly get some crazy cool sounds out of it and rather unique at the same time, with a personalty of it's own. Whenever I turn mine on I spend more time just exploring sounds than writing



Some of my own favorite songs materialized from Moog Voyager...voyages, because I either: A) pushed the record button right as I started exploring sounds, or B) because I forgot to push the stop button as I continued exploring sounds.

Come to think of it, I wrote more music _because_ of those exploratory/noodling analog synth sessions than I ever wrote treating the synth as another instrument. ....if that makes sense.


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## Wes Antczak (Apr 26, 2016)

The Sub 37 would make an excellent first synth, but is also a lot of fun if you have played with other synths. What's nice about it is that it's self contained in that you don't need an additional controller keyboard, etc. and what is also nice is that the majority of the controls are 1:1 right in front of you. So it's easy to feel your way around the sound if you're a beginner. The sequence is a lot of fun as well.

I haven't yet tried the newly released editor, but I expect that it is going to be a wonderful way of bridging into the computer world. Which means that you get the best of both worlds.

Imo it doesn't exactly sound like the vintage Moogs (the Mother 32 is better for that), but it does have its own 'more modern' character if you will, and it definitely has that Moog vibe going on. I highly recommend it.

An OB-6 would be my next choice and I think is going to make a nice pair with the Sub37. Hopefully they are not going to be discontinued before I have the chance to save up for one!

Whichever way you decide to go, get something that speaks to your creativity and have fun with it!


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## Baron Greuner (Apr 27, 2016)

The Mini Moog was my first synthesizer and because it's monophonic, at the time the emphasis was more on figuring out what everything did, as opposed to playing. In other words, I remember it being more about sound creation more than anything else.


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## chimuelo (Apr 28, 2016)

True.
I recall many songs where I heard a single sustained note where the sound being modulated had the most dramatic effect.
Even an ARP String Ensemble holding a single note could glue sections of songs together nicely.

One of the most inspiring shows I saw as a kid was Gino Vanelli at the Fontablue in Miami.
His brother Joe pushed bass on a Minimoog, while playing a Rhodes and glueing parts together with sustained ARP String Ensemble notes.

It was when Minimmogs were just starting to show up on albums. But live in that massive marble basement with Pillars it was when I knew I was a synthesizer addict.


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## Baron Greuner (Apr 28, 2016)

Back in 71 no one knew what ASDR meant or what filters were or envelopes or anything like that. They knew what drawbars and a waterfall keyboard was. And no one except guitarists knew what going out of tune was until the Moog came along.
But that thing could cut through anything!


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