# Hello I am a MAC! :)



## dcoscina (May 9, 2007)

Here's a couple things I don't like about Macs (and I own two Intel Macs and love them most of the time)

1/ Mighty Mouse- a design flaw renders it weird when the iMac or Macbook is plugged into an outlet that isn't properly grounded. The result is that your Mighty Mouse will make clicking noises repeatedly, will open up Expose even when you didn't mean to, and make bleeping sounds on the desktop when it cannot open up something. 

*The cure*- Ensure the outlet is properly grounded, or else use a non-static mouse pad to defeat any electrical charges that you the user transmit from normal static build-up.

2/ iSight Camera- Works fine on my Macbook, stopped working on my iMac 17" a while back. I believe it was due to a firmware upgrade but I cannot prove it. Everytime I open up any program that requires the iSight, I get a message "no USB camera device is present or it is in use by another program". 

these two problems aren't significant mind you but annoying nonetheless. Many others have encountered these issues which actually makes me feel better.

In spite of this, I do enjoy using Logic Express 7.2 (DP 5.12 is just too finicky to rely on for serious projects at the moment- which is too bad since I really like it). I also love how everything interacts with everything else. I often will save a PDF rather than print off a receipt. Much more environmentally friendly and I can always print it off at a later date if I so choose to.

My fiance' marvelled at the fact that the CPU was built-in to the iMac display. While I would love to upgrade to a Mac Pro with 32" Cinema Display, I'm happy with my little 17" iMac (I might spring for a 24" after the wedding )

-Dave


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## tobyond (May 9, 2007)

Hey Alex, welcome!
Just really quick, hold down the control and the apple key and the D key whilst moving the mouse over some text in safari. Whoa!


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## misterbee (May 9, 2007)

dcoscina @ Wed May 09 said:


> these two problems aren't significant mind you but annoying nonetheless. Many others have encountered these issues which actually makes me feel better.



Better? It should make you feel worse. It means that chances are good there's some kind of design fault or compatibility and if it ain't fixed, it means Apple refuses to do anything about it. Just like the Powerbook G4 lower memory slot problem that I face. Good job I only use it for reading e-mail, but it'd be nice if they actualyl admitted that the problem went beyond the scope of their recall. Over 2700 signatures and they still won't admit that its a design flaw.

Oh, and I can't believe anyone would use the Mac commercials in a positive way. :roll: 




R.


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## Waywyn (May 9, 2007)

Hey and thanks guys, for your input.

Hmm no hardware problems here so far. Everything runs smooth.
The only thing which made me mad was some kind of a vibrating part (cooler, HD .. I dunno) which was in contact with the case. So I had a loud buzz or humm.

I put some noise reducing material in there and now it is at least 50% more silent than my most silent PC was 

What really asthonishes me is the easy workflow of installing things and/or deinstall them again. There is no much hassle like a registry on the PC etc.

Of course I don't want to use this thread for a flame war, but I was working with PCs since 10 years now and by getting more and more into the MAC world, I can see how easy it could be.

... but just to stop myself from flying away ... I know there will be some sessions where I curse this computer like every other too  (let's hope not)


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 9, 2007)

That's way too hip for me to follow...


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## Mike Greene (May 9, 2007)

John DeBorde @ Wed May 09 said:


> Don't know if any of you guys have seen this, but I got a chuckle out of it:
> 
> http://www.macrumors.com/2007/05/04/sou ... -a-mac-ad/
> 
> -john


John, that's really funny! :mrgreen:


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## Waywyn (May 10, 2007)

Nick Batzdorf @ Thu May 10 said:


> That's way to hip for me to follow...



Hi Nick,

just to make it short. I've been waiting for about 10 years to buy a computer or a MAC like this. Sometimes more sometimes less, but PC was always my solution because it was a cheap computer system. I learned a lot about Windows - in my opinion a little bit too much 

I just created this thread because 1. I am just a bit happy. Some people are a bit happier about "little toys", some not.
2. is, that the world of IntelMAC is pretty new, not only for me but for all. There might be people who want to buy an IntelMAC too and might be happy to have a few people in their contacs to ask a few things about the new system. Tho I was happy that Simon Ravn had his first and I was the one asking wholes in his belly 

So I am no dork nor I was posting this because I feel hip now or want to brag and do penis comparison with other member here, ok? We are supporting each other and honestly I could have ignored your post, but imagine you feel just happy about a situation and then someone just makes it the most normal thing on the world.
Therefore the comparison with your magazine.


@John: hehe, that was a cool one. I honestly find the MAC - PC ads of MAC kinda funny, but well, not really true  PCs are not just machines for doing Exel stuff etc.

@Frederick: thanks a lot. Hope it will make my workflow much more easy.


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## Marsdy (May 10, 2007)

Nick Batzdorf @ Wed 09 May said:


> Repeat after me: I bought a fun new toy. It is a mass-produced machine produced for profit by a huge corporation and marketed very skillfully. It is not me; I have not undergone a soul transplant.



HERETIC!!!!!!!! :evil: 

You get stoned for this sort of talk in Saudi Arabia.


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## Hannes_F (May 10, 2007)

I have been considering this as well since a while. I have read somewhere that a MAC seems to be a good way to use more RAM than 4 GB on one computer (different instances of Kontakt) and this makes it very attractive currently.


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## Waywyn (May 10, 2007)

Frederick Russ @ Thu May 10 said:


> Hannes_F @ Thu May 10 said:
> 
> 
> > I have been considering this as well since a while. I have read somewhere that a MAC seems to be a good way to use more RAM than 4 GB on one computer (different instances of Kontakt) and this makes it very attractive currently.
> ...



Hi Frederick,

okay, I will try that as soon as I got some time.
Hopefully NI will fix that soon, I thought by releasing the IntelMAC updates, this issue have been fixed. If not I have to try the workaround by opening a standalone instance and using virtual MIDI stuff and wormhole or something. Hopefully that will work, but first I will test K2 in Cubase 4 and try to load as much as I can.


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## Moonchilde (May 10, 2007)

Since K2 is still a 32 bit app, it will only 32 bit memory addressing. It isn't 64 bit yet.


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## Frederick Russ (May 10, 2007)

Moonchilde @ Thu May 10 said:


> Since K2 is still a 32 bit app, it will only 32 bit memory addressing. It isn't 64 bit yet.



Good point. It would be fantastic to be able to, for instance, call up 4-6 complete instances of K2 in a single machine. Mac can do its part - just hoping that NI can do theirs.


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 10, 2007)

Hey Waywyn, my entire post got lost in the translation. Sorry about that. I was only kidding you about the reference to those annoying commercials.

Just so you know: I've been working on Macs all day long since 1986, and all my body parts are within adequate range for a human.

And I'm totally hip.


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 10, 2007)

"You get stoned for this sort of talk in Saudi Arabia."

It's okay, I'm not stoned. And I never go out without wearing a burka.


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## Waywyn (May 10, 2007)

Nick Batzdorf @ Thu May 10 said:


> Hey Waywyn, my entire post got lost in the translation. Sorry about that. I was only kidding you about the reference to those annoying commercials.
> 
> Just so you know: I've been working on Macs all day long since 1986, and all my body parts are within adequate range for a human.
> 
> And I'm totally hip.



Oops .. :oops: ... seems like a language issue ... I thought you are trying to ruin my day ... :lol:


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 10, 2007)

Not at all, and I'd be interested in hearing how your Mac Pro performs.


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## Waywyn (May 10, 2007)

Hehe okay,

well all what I can tell that Cubase 4 runs stable and smooth like a charm.

I did some tests with Roomworks, by opening 8 channels and applied 8 plugins on each channel, so I got 64 instances. Since Roomwork only uses RAM when playing back audio through, I set up some string patches etc. The funny thing was, when I was using one channel it actually ran up to 70% of usage (with 256 buffers), but as soon as I opened more channels with 8 instances each, it wouldn't go over 70% ... and so by using 8 channels with 8 instances each.

Another test with Guitar Rig 2 in Hi Res mode.
I really won't compare to my old PCs, because this is just not possible, but on the MAC Pro I was able to open 11 instances in Hi Res mode and I couldn't get over 30% and 256 buffer size.


But here is also the next question to you guys. How I am able to max out my RAM for samplers.
I remember that there was a discussion about using most of the RAM by using standalone Kontakt2 and rewire it with virtual MIDI and Soundflower or some other programs.

How would I get the most out of 8GB until Leopard is there (and obviously all the apps are rewritten for 64 bit)?

EDIT:
besides that, wasn't it you, Nick, who did some test by sending out virtual MIDI commands to slaves and routing back the sound via soundflower?
I remember there was also a problem with latency etc.
It's been a while and my head is a filter sometimes


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 10, 2007)

No, the latency is okay with Soundflower, in fact it works really well. The article is actually in the free sample issue we put up at www.VirtualInstrumentsMag.com.

"Since K2 is still a 32 bit app, it will only 32 bit memory addressing. It isn't 64 bit yet."

Yes, but you can run multiple instances and each one has its own memory space. Fewer instances running in a 64-bit OS would probably use less CPU, but in the meantime you can load a lot into a single machine. Please see that same article: 7GB on One Mac.

In other words, 64-bit sampling isn't holy a grail as it used to be.


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 10, 2007)

Maybe you were thinking about Wormhole (which is now off the market)? Audio over ethernet is not a happening thing on Macs yet; the latency and reliability are still unacceptable.


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## Waywyn (May 11, 2007)

Hey Nick,

thanks a lot for your help and I will definitely read that article again!
That's where I was reading it first time but couldn't remember where it was


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## Hannes_F (May 11, 2007)

Maybe VStack and a second sequencer could help?

http://www.steinberg.de/29+M54a708de802.html


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 11, 2007)

Can you explain, Hannes? V-Stack is a host, of course.


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## Hannes_F (May 11, 2007)

Nick Batzdorf @ Fri May 11 said:


> Can you explain, Hannes? V-Stack is a host, of course.



I do not know V-Stack first hand but there are people that run a host on a MAC and use a PC for playing samples via V-Stack. So if this works then I would try do the same within one MAC and hope that V-Stack uses different resources than the original host.

Looking at the specs I realize that V-Stack really seems to be a host and can be remoted by MidiYoke etc. It just a speculation that I wanted to throw in this maybe stupid idea in case anybody could use it, and before spending money on it I personally would ask in a Steinberg forum.

Hannes


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## Marsdy (May 12, 2007)

V-Stack on the Mac is a joke! I don't know anyone who tried and got it to work.

It looks like Steinborg have dropped the OSX version anyway. It doesn't show up on their Universal Binary roadmap.


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## Frederick Russ (May 12, 2007)

RAX - http://plasq.com/rax/ - does for Mac what VSTACK did for PC (with no timeout issue) plus its compatible with Audio Units. Its far more successful and solid than their wormhole attempt.


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## Waywyn (May 12, 2007)

Frederick Russ @ Sat May 12 said:


> RAX - http://plasq.com/rax/ - does for Mac what VSTACK did for PC (with no timeout issue) plus its compatible with Audio Units. Its far more successful and solid than their wormhole attempt.



Hey Frederick, can't access the site for some reason, but somehow it worked for a few seconds. I could read something like ... this product is no longer for sale?

... and another question, is it also for sending out MIDI? I checked the IAC driver in the OSX and I always have to put in a port besides the IP adress. Problem is, that I definitely don't know which ports are the PCs are using, or is it a brainfart I am having?


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## Marsdy (May 12, 2007)

Unfortunately they've dropped Rax!


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## Waywyn (May 12, 2007)

Marsdy @ Sat May 12 said:


> Unfortunately they've dropped Rax!



Ah, okay, so there is just Soundflower ... but this supports only Audio right?
So as for MIDI, there is Midi over Lan only?

Sorry, but I had only FXT and it seems that FXT2 will take a few years from now until finally released


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## Marsdy (May 12, 2007)

Call me a Luddite but I've stuck with hardware MIDI. It always works and there's no latency.

Everyone's going virtual so you see lot of Emagic AMT8s on eBay going very cheap. I've got 4 of them now. One of them was only $100 and in mint condition.


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## Waywyn (May 12, 2007)

Marsdy @ Sat May 12 said:


> Call me a Luddite but I've stuck with hardware MIDI. It always works and there's no latency.
> 
> Everyone's going virtual so you see lot of Emagic AMT8s on eBay going very cheap. I've got 4 of them now. One of them was only $100 and in mint condition.



Hi Luddite! :lol: 
No seriously, the problem is, that I currently can't afford to 1. buy 4 additonal soundcards plus the MIDI device, nor do I have the space to place the slaves in my room here. I am quite happy that the only computers are the main DAWs (currently still have to finish all old projects on PC and then start on MAC).

So I might look into MOL (didn't know that it's that expensive, even tho I can save money on soundcards) or something else, plus Soundflower. I can't quite get warm with the IAC setup somehow.


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## Frederick Russ (May 12, 2007)

Amazing that they pulled RAX! My version works flawlessly which I have on two Mac G5 slaves. It was Wormhole2 which did not work for me. Oh well.


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 12, 2007)

> Ah, okay, so there is just Soundflower ... but this supports only Audio right?
> So as for MIDI, there is Midi over Lan only?



Soundflower is a virtual audio interface that works on one machine only. You use it to route audio out of one program into another.

IAC MIDI is the virtual MIDI interface equivalent. You access it in Audio MIDI Setup.

MOL is the only Mac/PC MIDI-over-ethernet program I know of, but Network MIDI is built into OS X 10.4 (which means that all the machines must be running it).


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## José Herring (May 12, 2007)

Waywyn @ Sat May 12 said:


> Marsdy @ Sat May 12 said:
> 
> 
> > Call me a Luddite but I've stuck with hardware MIDI. It always works and there's no latency.
> ...



There is a way to use FXT with mac if you use your current DAW as the link between Mac and your farm. That way you only have to use one sound card. Check the back issue of Virtual Instruments for that data. It didn't seem too hard and that way you don't have to redo your current setup. All you really need to do is then route midi and audio from your main PC to your new Mac.

Jose


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## Mike Greene (May 12, 2007)

Marsdy @ Sat May 12 said:


> Call me a Luddite but I've stuck with hardware MIDI. It always works and there's no latency.


Me too. But there is some latency involved. Especially with dense data since MIDI can only send one note at a time per millisecond.

Still, I'll happily use MIDI cables and interfaces over yet one more software item in my computer house of cards.


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 12, 2007)

Nah, real men and women use MOL. It works very well.

What Jose is saying is a good set-up, but false advertising.  In other words, he's suggesting that you use one PC as a submixer for all the others connected by FX-T, and then stick an interface on it to connect to your Mac.


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## Frederick Russ (May 12, 2007)

Mike - you've got such a cool studio that it made me wonder why you never considered MidiOverLAN. Its a great tool. Let me qualify that - I ran midi cables for years which worked fine so when the push came to start in on Midi over LAN they had to drag me into the arena kicking and screaming - I didn't want change. But MOL worked better than my midi hardware box and made a believer out of me. 

MOL 3 PRO has 64 ports in and 64 out - for roughly the same price as a single 8 port midi hardware machine you get 8 times the midi routing _with no latency_. To me its not only a better solution than hardware - its economical as well and the software is rock solid. I love it. Therefore I definitely recommend MOL especially if you're running an all Mac Farm.


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## Mike Greene (May 12, 2007)

Well, I guess I should take a look if it's really that rock solid.

But today is the wrong day to talk me into adding any new software on my system. Today has been a nightmare as VSL's VI keeps crashing ever since I added the SE version. The Orchestral Cube version always worked fine, but once I added SE, yikes! The only way I finally got it working was to remove the Orchestral Cube dongle and hard drive completely. But now I only have SE.

Don't ask why I want both versions on the same computer . . . :roll:


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 12, 2007)

Mike, have you run the utility that shows VSL where everything is? Sorry if that's baby talk.

The other possibility is that it could be getting confused by programs with the same names.

I've just installed it here, and I hope it's not going to do the same to me - although I did put its auth on the same dongle as the other VSL stuff.


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## Frederick Russ (May 12, 2007)

Mike Greene @ Sat May 12 said:


> Don't ask why I want both versions on the same computer . . . :roll:



So - why do you want both versions on the same computer? *ducks* :o 

Seriously, sorry for the troubles Mike. Did you try tech support at VSL? I mean - how can you get any work done with that happening?


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## Mike Greene (May 12, 2007)

Nick, if you mean the Directory Manager, then yes. As many restarts as I've done, I always go back to the Directory Manager because it's about the only thing I can tweak.

I think my problem is that I keep the Symphonic Cube data on an external firewire drive (stupid G5s don't allow enough internal drives) and SE on an internal drive. I don't like firing up the external drives for various reasons, so I got SE which will fit on an internal drive. That way I can use SE for everyday stuff, and when I need the heavy artillery, turn on the firewire drive.

I think VSL VI doesn't like the combination of drives. Plus I'm using two separate dongles, but I don't think that's the problem.

It took a couple hours of correcting my own mistakes, but I actually had both libraries working together last week when I was testing them. But today, when I _need_ them to work is of course when they go into crash mode.

I'm running OK now. I just deleted all the Orchestral Cube stuff from the Directory Manager and the VI is running fine. In hind sight, that was kind of stupid because I should have just deleted SE, which would be much easier to put back. Especially since I've just discovered SE doesn't have a marcato solo violin patch. All the Symphonic Cube stuff is still on the drive, but it's a tedious process pointing the Directory Manager back to all the individual folders.

Ah, the joys of software. I'm going back to MIDI cables and my trusty Akai samplers with the Siedlecek Orchestra! Although now that I think about it, I seem to recall them stalling and even crashing from time to time when loading CDRoms . . . sigh . . .


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 12, 2007)

Did you know about this guy, Mike?

http://www.g5drivebracket.com/

I have it and a Sonnet 4+4 eSata card in my G5, and it just works. There are other brackets available too, but that was the only one other than the $900 Wiebetech when I got mine a year and a half ago.


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## Mike Greene (May 12, 2007)

Yeah, but with HD Accel 3, I don't have the PCI space.

I guess I could swap out the two 500 gig drives for a couple 750 gig drives, but that's a chunk of change, considering it won't be that long before I'll be moving to the Intel Macs.


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## Waywyn (May 13, 2007)

josejherring @ Sat May 12 said:


> Waywyn @ Sat May 12 said:
> 
> 
> > Marsdy @ Sat May 12 said:
> ...




Hey Jose,

ah, yes I remember, we talked about that issue a while ago. Thanks again!
Of course it would be much more comfortable if FXT2 would be released 

If I would have the budget right now I would definitely get a MADI system and rewire my slaves with optical or adat cables. Hm, so hopefully there will be something soon - either a big budget coming along or FXT2 release day :lol:


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## PaulR (May 14, 2007)

Waywyn @ Wed May 09 said:


> No I am not hip and I never was, but the MAC makes me hip now. I even have a sign on my forehead when I walk through the city saying that I am on MAC now ... and people throw flowers at me and hail me as their new saviour. Isn't that beautiful?



Do try to remember you're German, dear boy. There are no hip Germans - ever. This is the way it should be of course - we don't want any hip Germans in the world thank you. :lol: 

You will have a great time with your new unit. It will change your soul.

I am about to buy a new German car - again. An Audi RS4. This is down to mid-life crisis probably. I don't want my car, my kitchen, my bathroom designed by hip people. I want them designed by Germans.  :D


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## Waywyn (May 14, 2007)

PaulR @ Mon May 14 said:


> Waywyn @ Wed May 09 said:
> 
> 
> > No I am not hip and I never was, but the MAC makes me hip now. I even have a sign on my forehead when I walk through the city saying that I am on MAC now ... and people throw flowers at me and hail me as their new saviour. Isn't that beautiful?
> ...



... but don't forget you won't get no hip car ;P


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## PaulR (May 14, 2007)

Waywyn @ Mon May 14 said:


> ... but don't forget you won't get no hip car ;P




Maybe not - but it will go like sh1t off a shovel.


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 14, 2007)

"Does MOL work OK in conjuction with hardware interfaces? "

Jawohl - it just looks like another MIDI interface in Audio MIDI Setup. But I haven't used Sysex over it and can't attest to that; I just use it to replace 50 billion MIDI cables.


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## Waywyn (May 31, 2007)

Okay, I just had some time to do some more hardcore testing 

On my AMD 3,8 GHZ I was able to open 3-6 Rayspace instances with 256 ray counts.

I know you really can't compare that PC to a new Mac Pro, but it's quite funny to see the actual power and I am always surprised that it's that much.

Now with the Mac I was at around 50% CPU and I already had 40 (!!!!) instances open with a soundcard buffer set to 512! 

No bragging around, but just always astonished that there is so much power available.

Oh my, I hope that Leopard will be released soon (October, so far) so the actual limit of 2GB per application will be past.


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## Evan Gamble (Jun 5, 2007)

Well I just took the plunge and bought a Macbook Pro with 4 GB RAM for going to Juilliard with!

I feel so hip now :wink:


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## Nick Batzdorf (Jun 5, 2007)

Juilliard, eh? Congratulations.

And 4GB. Yeah, that's now in the "replacing Windows machine" range.


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## Nick Batzdorf (Jun 5, 2007)

...although I saw that it's a $750 add-on at the Apple Store, meaning that it's $350/GB. Ow! Ouch! Ooh! Ow ow ow!


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## Evan Gamble (Jun 5, 2007)

Nick Batzdorf @ Wed Jun 06 said:


> ...although I saw that it's a $750 add-on at the Apple Store, meaning that it's $350/GB. Ow! Ouch! Ooh! Ow ow ow!



Well $675 with my student discount-but yeah it hurt the wallet. :evil: 

Debated trying to find 3rd party RAM that was capatable, but decided it was worth it to get it straight from apple so that it's gauranteed to work.


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## synergy543 (Jun 5, 2007)

Evan Gamble @ Tue Jun 05 said:


> Well I just took the plunge and bought a Macbook Pro with 4 GB RAM for going to Juilliard with!
> 
> I feel so hip now :wink:


Evan, don't you hate it the day after you buy something it becomes obsolete?

http://www.macworld.com/news/2007/06/05/macbookpro/index.php (http://www.macworld.com/news/2007/06/05 ... /index.php)

:twisted:

Maybe you can return it still? Maybe you can find a dead pixel or something to complain about. 5400 rpm drive to slow or something....

Well, I'm using an old PowerBook G4 and I'm still happy.


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## Evan Gamble (Jun 5, 2007)

synergy543 @ Wed Jun 06 said:


> Evan Gamble @ Tue Jun 05 said:
> 
> 
> > Well I just took the plunge and bought a Macbook Pro with 4 GB RAM for going to Juilliard with!
> ...



Haha-no this is the update I waited for to buy it. So I'm ok at least until tommorow when they come out with the 6 GHz models :wink:


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## synergy543 (Jun 5, 2007)

OK Good news. Otherwise I was afraid that Vega guy might re-apper blaring his trumpet again on NS 

btw, that G6 is a pretty damn fast chip!

You can go back to feeling really cool now....


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