# Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings - the Sample Talk release thread



## Evans (Dec 7, 2021)

Anyone downloading? Impressions on the demos? Any commentary that's not suitable for the paid board?



> The library is available for the very special introductory price of €199.99 until the end of the 12 days of Christmas (19th December). The price will then rise to €249.90 until 7th January after which the price will be €333.33.



Don't forget about VAT!

*Website:*
https://www.sonokinetic.net/products/classical/orchestral-strings/?ref=vic

*VI-Control Commercial thread (page 41 for day of release):*
https://vi-control.net/community/th...-released-special-intro-price-€199-99.105121/

*VI-Control "12 days of Christmas" Deals thread:*
https://vi-control.net/community/th...-released-€199-99-special-intro-price.117721/


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## Nuno (Dec 7, 2021)

Sounds lovely!

What woodwinds and brass libraries would blend well with Sonokinetic strings?


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## Jeremy Spencer (Dec 7, 2021)

Nuno said:


> Sounds lovely!
> 
> What woodwinds and brass libraries would blend well with Sonokinetic strings?


Probably Da Capo.


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## NekujaK (Dec 7, 2021)

Nuno said:


> Sounds lovely!
> 
> What woodwinds and brass libraries would blend well with Sonokinetic strings?


No doubt their very own woodwinds library, plus all of their orchestral phrase libraries. My understanding is they're all recorded in the same hall.


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

Nuno said:


> Sounds lovely!
> 
> What woodwinds and brass libraries would blend well with Sonokinetic strings?


Very Good Question. 

I just purchased the Sonokinetic Strings, and was thinking about this.


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

NekujaK said:


> No doubt their very own woodwinds library, plus all of their orchestral phrase libraries. My understanding is they're all recorded in the same hall.


Not interested in their phrase libraries. I think their woodwinds is sections only, and are not phrase based. But I really think other non Sonokinetic libraries might work well as well, provided you use the right acoustical processing to make them blend. But which specific libraries is what I'm going to have to figure out, I might just have to experiment with the various libraries I have.


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## doctoremmet (Dec 7, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Very Good Question.
> 
> I just purchased the Sonokinetic Strings, and was thinking about this.


Their own woodwinds? Also recorded at Zlin?


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## Sonokinetic BV (Dec 7, 2021)

With the mic positions available, they blend well with many libraries, our phrase libraries were recorded in the same way and mix well with many orchestral libraries too


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## doctoremmet (Dec 7, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Not interested in their phrase libraries. I think their woodwinds is sections only, and are not phrase based. But I really don't think other non Sonokinetic libraries might work well as well, provided you use the right acoustical processing to make them blend. But which specific libraries is what I'm going to have to figure out, I might just have to experiment with the various libraries I have.


They have the Zlin IRs ready for free download. I created an MConvolutionMB preset with those for mixing / matching other libraries with my own Zlin recorded 8Dio libraries.


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> They have the Zlin IRs ready for free download. I created an MConvolutionMB preset with those for mixing / matching other libraries with my own Zlin recorded 8Dio libraries.


Oh. That's so useful. 

Thanks for letting me know. It's on their site for download ?


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## doctoremmet (Dec 7, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Oh. That's so useful.
> 
> Thanks for letting me know. It's on their site for download ?











Zlin Impulse Responses


The attachment below provides the IR's for the Zlin Concert Hall where we recorded our orchestral libraries. Please note that these are not the same as those provided by Altiverb. If you have Altiverb, please use those instead.




support.sonokinetic.net


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## doctoremmet (Dec 7, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> They have the Zlin IRs ready for free download. I created an MConvolutionMB preset with those for mixing / matching other libraries with my own Zlin recorded 8Dio libraries.


So, Century Brass was recorded in the same hall


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## prodigalson (Dec 7, 2021)

I've generally found it pretty straightforward to blend the SK phrase libraries to other libraries in larger spaces but haven't done it the other way around. 

Altiverb 7 has an IR for Zlin Concert hall too. Easy to miss as it's new and there are so many


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

prodigalson said:


> Altiverb 7 has an IR for Zlin Concert hall too. Easy to miss as it's new and there are so many


Oh.. That's awesome. I purchased Altiverb 7 last week, I have to check the Zlin Concert Hall IR. 

This would be so useful. I love the Altiverb 7 Teledex Stage to add to OT libraries.


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## chrisav (Dec 7, 2021)

I've gotten really good results in the past blending the Sonokinetic phrase libraries with CineSamples with a natural sounding balance after virtually no tweaking 👌


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

chrisav said:


> I've gotten really good results in the past blending the Sonokinetic phrase libraries with CineSamples with a natural sounding balance after virtually no tweaking 👌


THANKS  

I have many CineSamples libraries, Brass, Perc., Woodwinds (not installed yet). So, if they work well with Sonokinetic Strings, that would be a fantastic.


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## Nuno (Dec 7, 2021)

doctoremmet said:


> Their own woodwinds? Also recorded at Zlin?


I am sorry, i meant woodwinds and brass from other developers.

I am pretty sure any Sonokinetic will blend well with the new strings library.


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

@Sonokinetic BV ,

Would *Sonokinetic Da Capo* be a good complement for *Sonokinetic Strings* , are they also recorded in the Zlin hall ? 

I see them on discount today, at 199 Euros. 

Thanks.


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## Justin L. Franks (Dec 7, 2021)

Nuno said:


> Sounds lovely!
> 
> What woodwinds and brass libraries would blend well with Sonokinetic strings?


I don't own it (yet), so I'm only going off of the videos and demos from Sonokinetic, but on first listen, I think this will be quite easy to blend with other libraries. The overall sound is pretty "neutral" IMO, and the hall sounds great and is not too wet, so blending with libraries recorded in other spaces should be a cinch.


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## dzilizzi (Dec 7, 2021)

I really like the location they use - it is wet enough to sound good, but not too wet to be a pain to work with. I normally have just thrown phrases in with other libraries without a problem. 

But I also realize that I am a hobbyist that is new to orchestral mixing, so I may not mind things not matching too much. 

It is currently downloading pretty quick with the manual downloads.


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## Markrs (Dec 7, 2021)

Just watched the videos and it sounds really good. At the moment it feels like it wouldn’t as anything over HO Opus Strings Diamond, as that has Divisi and runs, similar mic positions plus a lot of articulations. Plus with having Century Strings for a smaller more aggressive sound also recorded in Zlin Hall.


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

Markrs said:


> Plus with having Century Strings for a smaller more aggressive sound also recorded in Zlin Hall.


I don't think Century Strings were recorded in Zlin Hall.


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

I like the way Sonokinetic Strings sound much better than Century Strings, which I'm not a big fan of.


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## Markrs (Dec 7, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> I don't think Century Strings were recorded in Zlin Hall.


This is from an email sent out form the release of Century Strings

"We hope you enjoy this labor of love. The Century String Bundle contains over 287GB and 313.909 samples of easy playable and truly realistic world-class strings recorded in the modern *Zlin hall* (same players used by Two Steps from Hell).

We think it is one of our finest and most polished releases till date - and we designed it all around improving the sound, playability and workflow.

With appreciations - Colin O'Malley, Tawnia Knox & Troels Folmann"


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

Markrs said:


> This is from an email sent out form the release of Century Strings
> 
> "We hope you enjoy this labor of love. The Century String Bundle contains over 287GB and 313.909 samples of easy playable and truly realistic world-class strings recorded in the modern *Zlin hall* (same players used by Two Steps from Hell).
> 
> ...


OH. Sorry about that. I was almost certain it was not produced in Zlin Hall, not sure why. So, I stand corrected. I might have mixed things up, maybe their Adagio, Agitato, ..line was not recorded in Zlin. 

Thanks.


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## szurcio (Dec 7, 2021)

Are there ways to control vibrato? is it possible to play non vibrato?


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## doctoremmet (Dec 7, 2021)

The following 8Dio libraries were in fact recorded at Zlin:

- Century range
- Majestica / 8W Eighth Wonder
- CAGE range
- Acoustic Grand Ensembles
- Extreme Ensembles
- the Legion 66 series


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## Symfoniq (Dec 7, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> OH. Sorry about that. I was almost certain it was not produced in Zlin Hall, not sure why. So, I stand corrected. I might have mixed things up, maybe their Adagio, Agitato, ..line was not recorded in Zlin.
> 
> Thanks.


Correct, Adagio and family were recorded in a church.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 7, 2021)

Is there any info on how many dynamic layers and round robins were recorded for each articulation? Seems vibrato is baked in and not controllable?


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## Frederick (Dec 7, 2021)

szurcio said:


> Are there ways to control vibrato? is it possible to play non vibrato?


You can crossfade from regular sustains to espressivo - you can morph/stack any articulations. My guess is no non vibrato, but don't quote me on that.


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

Frederick said:


> You can crossfade from regular sustains to espressivo - you can morph/stack any articulations.


Interestng. Is that shown in any of the videos ?


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## Frederick (Dec 7, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Interestng. Is that shown in any of the videos ?


Yes. Dedicated video if I remember correctly.


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## Sonokinetic BV (Dec 7, 2021)

It's explained in the Stack and Morph video


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## Evans (Dec 7, 2021)

Sonokinetic BV said:


> It's explained in the Stack and Morph video


Are all those still in mono? I know this sucks for y'all, but they're not really worth watching (in my opinion) during busy days until they're corrected.


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## jbuhler (Dec 7, 2021)

Which longs do the legatos attach to? That wasn't clear to me in the videos. All of them or just the main sustain?


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## Sonokinetic BV (Dec 7, 2021)

we have identified the issue with the tutorials and will be correcting them


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

Sonokinetic BV said:


> It's explained in the Stack and Morph video


Awesome ! 

Thank You Very Much.


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## Sonokinetic BV (Dec 7, 2021)

jbuhler said:


> Which longs do the legatos attach to? That wasn't clear to me in the videos. All of them or just the main sustain?


Sustain straight, expressive, sul tasto, sul ponticello and the slurred short articulations


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## dts_marin (Dec 7, 2021)

Non vibrato wouldn't be so kinetic


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## Kevperry777 (Dec 7, 2021)

Congrats.....great sound plus an inspired interface with 'way beyond its price point' features.


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## jbuhler (Dec 7, 2021)

Sonokinetic BV said:


> Sustain straight, expressive, sul tasto, sul ponticello and the slurred short articulations


Thank you!


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## gst98 (Dec 7, 2021)

@Sonokinetic BV So are the sustains 4 dynamics, with crossfades to 2 for the legatos? or do the legatos only utilise 2 dynamic layers on the sustains as well? Is there any sort of filtering applied to the legatos when you pair them with sul pont and sul tasto? And are there dynamics and RR on the marcatos? I appreciate the attention to the varying lengths of marcatos that are always underlooked!


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## muk (Dec 7, 2021)

There seems to be a bug with portamento on my system. When I load a patch into Kontakt, legato and portamento play as they should. In the legato configuration menu, as soon as I click on one of the options (auto, short, slurred, portamento), portamento will then not playback anymore. Even if I select portamento, it will only play slurred legato. I'm in Cubase 11, using the latest version of Kontakt 6. Anybody else got this bug?


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## Casiquire (Dec 7, 2021)

Markrs said:


> Just watched the videos and it sounds really good. At the moment it feels like it wouldn’t as anything over HO Opus Strings Diamond, as that has Divisi and runs, similar mic positions plus a lot of articulations. Plus with having Century Strings for a smaller more aggressive sound also recorded in Zlin Hall.


One thing that it would add: Hollywood Strings "divisi" is really just a mono spot mic from their close mics. You don't get full mic choices and it isn't a real divisi. Here you actually get divisi sections with mic choices. I may be wrong but Audiobro (MSS and whatever library they made for NI) and Spitfire Studio Strings are about the only true recorded divisi libraries with multiple mics i can think of


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

Casiquire said:


> One thing that it would add: Hollywood Strings "divisi" is really just a mono spot mic from their close mics. You don't get full mic choices and it isn't a real divisi. Here you actually get divisi sections with mic choices. I may be wrong but Audiobro (MSS and whatever library they made for NI) and Spitfire Studio Strings are about the only true recorded divisi libraries with multiple mics i can think of


Plus.. imho. The Zlin Concert Hall sound is much more flattering than EW-Studio.


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## AndyP (Dec 7, 2021)

Is there anyone who has the library who can make a short demo of how much vibrato is available? I'm missing a bit of the vibes ...


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## Henning (Dec 7, 2021)

AndyP said:


> Is there anyone who has the library who can make a short demo of how much vibrato is available? I'm missing a bit of the vibes ...


My demo uses only the espressivo strings through their whole dynamics. You can hear all the vib that the lib has and whether it's enough for you.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 7, 2021)

Demos and walkthroughs sound better to me than TSS. Intriguing.


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## Evans (Dec 7, 2021)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Demos and walkthroughs sound better to me than TSS. Intriguing.


How so? Just based on recording locations and the number of players, they seem to cover pretty different use cases. I wouldn't compare, for example, Spitfire Studio Strings with Berlin Symphonic Strings.


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## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 7, 2021)

Evans said:


> How so? Just based on recording locations and the number of players, they seem to cover pretty different use cases. I wouldn't compare, for example, Spitfire Studio Strings with Berlin Symphonic Strings.


Tone. You can compare tone. Use cases tend to be quite...flexible, when using sample libraries.


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## Evans (Dec 7, 2021)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Tone. You can compare tone. Use cases tend to be quiet...flexible, when using sample libraries.


That's fair, if that's how you feel! Happy that you feel like you can make a decision between them instead of pining for both, perhaps!


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## Henning (Dec 7, 2021)

Having beta tested both libs and witnessed how they have developed over the months I can say they are both very good string libraries. They have a decidedly different sound. So if I had to choose I would go with the one that would cover the most use cases for me.


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## Trash Panda (Dec 7, 2021)

Are we really all the way to page 3 without a criticism or question on the quality of the legatos in a string library thread? I am so proud of y'all.


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## Evans (Dec 7, 2021)

Henning said:


> Having beta tested both libs and witnessed how they have developed over the months I can say they are both very good string libraries. They have a decidedly different sound. So if I had to choose I would go with the one that would cover the most use cases for me.


Creeping on your post history, is that your custom built viola in the Sonokinetic demo?


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## Zanshin (Dec 7, 2021)

Trash Panda said:


> Are we really all the way to page 3 without a criticism or question on the quality of the legatos in a string library thread? I am so proud of y'all.


So about those legatos....


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## AndyP (Dec 7, 2021)

I think I'll pass for now. With the Synchron Strings Bundle I see my needs covered, and with LASS 3 I have additional smaller Divisi at hand and first chairs.
Sonically I find the Sonokinetic Strings go in a similar direction like the Synchron and Cinestrings. In the videos I hear at least these typical bow strokes with the side noises that I also like with the other libraries. Doesn't sound overpolished which I think is good. 
I'll wait and see if there will be more user demos and reviews, especially of the individual sections.

This does not represent a criticism, rather a what do I have and what do I need decision (as with TSS which I am also not taking for now).


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## Sonokinetic BV (Dec 7, 2021)

muk said:


> There seems to be a bug with portamento on my system. When I load a patch into Kontakt, legato and portamento play as they should. In the legato configuration menu, as soon as I click on one of the options (auto, short, slurred, portamento), portamento will then not playback anymore. Even if I select portamento, it will only play slurred legato. I'm in Cubase 11, using the latest version of Kontakt 6. Anybody else got this bug?


I have not heard this before - then again we just released  Portamentos should be there in auto mode at velocities below the threshold, and in Portamento mode obviously! 
Can you send us a support ticket with some examples?


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## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 7, 2021)

Is “short” legato type the same thing as fingered legato? Are there bow repetitions / rebows in this?


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## Sonokinetic BV (Dec 7, 2021)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> Is “short” legato type the same thing as fingered legato? Are there bow repetitions in this?


- yes
- if you mean repeated note transitions? these are there when you play with the sustain pedal


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

Awesome video, and I love the way the Sonokinetic Strings sound. So Epic sounding here !


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## ALittleNightMusic (Dec 7, 2021)

muziksculp said:


> Awesome video, and I love the way the Sonokinetic Strings sound. So Epic sounding here !



You have this and TSS right? Care to share your thoughts / musical comparisons of the two of them?


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## muziksculp (Dec 7, 2021)

ALittleNightMusic said:


> You have this and TSS right? Care to share your thoughts / musical comparisons of the two of them?


None of the two is installed. 

Sure, I can share my thoughts on both after having them installed, and using them for a while. But note that they are very different size string libraries, with totally different acoustics. So, they will sound very different. That I can guarantee without having used either one of them.


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## Henning (Dec 7, 2021)

Evans said:


> Creeping on your post history, is that your custom built viola in the Sonokinetic demo?


No, it's the violin I inherited from my granddad. It is a bit on the harsh side so it's great for fiddle work  But the demo for Sonokinetic's Ibrido Favola has the octave viola in it.


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## bfreepro (Dec 7, 2021)

Can you trigger a rebow with this library on the legatos?


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## dmw (Dec 8, 2021)

> Can you trigger a rebow with this library on the legatos?







__





Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings - the Sample Talk release thread


Sustain straight, expressive, sul tasto, sul ponticello and the slurred short articulations :) Thank you!




vi-control.net


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## ricoderks (Dec 8, 2021)

bfreepro said:


> Can you trigger a rebow with this library on the legatos?


Yes, its mentioned on the previous page


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## Piotrek K. (Dec 8, 2021)

I'm really interested in isolated sound of divisi sections (close mic), character and consistency of those and vibrato intensity on them (I expect more detailed vibrato per divisi section vs two sections playing at once). I would love to see more detailed videos on those topics from Sono. While current videos are nice (I love aesthetics), they are not that detailed (only 2:51 minutes on divisi?).


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## Drumdude2112 (Dec 10, 2021)

Soooooo i won’t ask do i ‘NEED’ these , as need is certainly a relative term lol .
But as one that owns all the usual marquis string libraries (SCS,SSS,Afflatus,BS,BSS,NSS,SSP, SSE etc) is there much to ‘gained here’ with this library ?…It sounds lovely on first listen and the intro price is certainly attractive…any thoughts ?


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## Remnant (Dec 10, 2021)

I am really liking this library and will be using it as my main bread and butter library, but given what you already have, I would say this would not add too much for you. You already have a variety of orchestra sizes. The only really new things that maybe this library would have for you is the auto divisi and ability to morph between articulations. The auto divisi to my ears is pretty subtle but good and the morphing works pretty well. The price for what you get is excellent, but only you can decide if these incremental changes are worth it for you.


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## Evans (Dec 10, 2021)

I'll add that if that was the group of strings libraries I had, that my next strings purchase would be something "_different_."

I'm talking about a product like Ólafur Arnalds Chamber Evolutions or Sunset Strings for more unique, textural elements. Or perhaps Modern Scoring Strings, due to its ostinato, runs, and aleatoric features.

Otherwise, that's quite a bit of bread-and-butter (and more!) strings across five recording spaces and multiple section sizes, with a lot of layering possibilities (not even counting what's implied in the "etc" at the end!).


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## Remnant (Dec 10, 2021)

Evans said:


> I'll add that if that was the group of strings libraries I had, that my next strings purchase would be something "_different_."
> 
> I'm talking about a product like Ólafur Arnalds Chamber Evolutions or Sunset Strings for more unique, textural elements. Or perhaps Modern Scoring Strings, due to its ostinato, runs, and aleatoric features.
> 
> Otherwise, that's quite a bit of bread-and-butter (and more!) strings across five recording spaces and multiple section sizes, with a lot of layering possibilities (not even counting what's implied in the "etc" at the end!).


Exactly. This library was perfect for me because I really went backwards and have a ton of great textural libraries, like SF ensemble stuff (Neo, Solstice) and OACE and a bunch of others, but have always kind of avoided a proper section divided bread and butter library, because I am not a great orchestrator. So for me this is perfect and probably necessary, but I agree, some variety and movement away from a standard library would likely serve you a bit better to get those creative juices flowing.


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## Drumdude2112 (Dec 10, 2021)

Evans said:


> I'll add that if that was the group of strings libraries I had, that my next strings purchase would be something "_different_."
> 
> I'm talking about a product like Ólafur Arnalds Chamber Evolutions or Sunset Strings for more unique, textural elements. Or perhaps Modern Scoring Strings, due to its ostinato, runs, and aleatoric features.
> 
> Otherwise, that's quite a bit of bread-and-butter (and more!) strings across five recording spaces and multiple section sizes, with a lot of layering possibilities (not even counting what's implied in the "etc" at the end!).


all great points indeed…i do have OACE and SS , love em’ both …was actually considering adding LASS being its a radically different tone then anything else i have (perhaps trying lite first) so its interesting you mentioned MSS.


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## Casiquire (Dec 10, 2021)

Drumdude2112 said:


> Soooooo i won’t ask do i ‘NEED’ these , as need is certainly a relative term lol .
> But as one that owns all the usual marquis string libraries (SCS,SSS,Afflatus,BS,BSS,NSS,SSP, SSE etc) is there much to ‘gained here’ with this library ?…It sounds lovely on first listen and the intro price is certainly attractive…any thoughts ?


Looks like this would be your first true divisi library


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## axb312 (Dec 10, 2021)

Sonokinetic BV said:


> - yes
> - if you mean repeated note transitions? these are there when you play with the sustain pedal


How many RRs on the rebows?


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## Drumdude2112 (Dec 10, 2021)

Casiquire said:


> Looks like this would be your first true divisi library


Was actually Gonna buy LASS 3 for that lol


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## Casiquire (Dec 10, 2021)

Drumdude2112 said:


> Was actually Gonna buy LASS 3 for that lol


I'd vote MSS, unless you plan to get Sonokinetic. Sonokinetic is a bigger tonal difference from LASS. But otherwise MSS would give you all the runs and ostinato, etc.


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## bfreepro (Dec 10, 2021)

Casiquire said:


> I'd vote MSS, unless you plan to get Sonokinetic. Sonokinetic is a bigger tonal difference from LASS. But otherwise MSS would give you all the runs and ostinato, etc.


Yeah I came here to say the same lol


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## muk (Dec 11, 2021)

Anybody managed to apply the Pixelpoet trick to Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings? I'm trying, but can't find the legato interval samples in the group editor.


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## Casiquire (Dec 11, 2021)

muk said:


> Anybody managed to apply the Pixelpoet trick to Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings? I'm trying, but can't find the legato interval samples in the group editor.


Why did i think it came with a Lookahead function? Does it not?


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## muk (Dec 11, 2021)

Casiquire said:


> Why did i think it came with a Lookahead function? Does it not?


No lookahead. It has short and slurred legato, and an 'auto' feature to select the appropriate one based on playing speed. You can also adjust a parameter called 'smear', and the transition level. To my knowledge only Modern Scoring Strings, LASS 3, and Tokyo Scoring Strings have lookahead.


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## Supremo (Dec 11, 2021)

muk said:


> Anybody managed to apply the Pixelpoet trick to Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings? I'm trying, but can't find the legato interval samples in the group editor.


Did you try searching those samples through the “Expert” tab on the left side of Kontakt?


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## muk (Dec 11, 2021)

For those of you wondering how the divisi sections sound on their own, here is a small test with just the B sections (the smaller ones) being used.

View attachment Sonokinetic Elgar Serenade Larghetto beginning.mp3


I must say I pretty like that tone!

I have been using Light & Sound Chamber Strings for such tasks so far. They were the closest to my ideal sound so far. Here is the same excerpt with Light & Sound if you'd like to compare:






Concertgebouw Kamerorkest - a gorgeous strings sound


****Edit February 2022********************************** added two new versions. First one with Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings: Apart from the obvious tuning issue, I like this version. It has depth, and a natural concert strings sound. The tuning issue should get corrected with the next...




vi-control.net





I prefer the Sonokinetic version now. It is livelier and closer to the recording soundwise (disregarding the out of tune transition in the Vl 1 in the beginning).

For those who'd like a comparison to Cinematic Studio Strings, here is NoamL's rendition of the same piece with CSS:





__





CSS + Elgar = magic


Edward Elgar, Serenade For Strings in E Minor, Op. 20, Movement II (Larghetto) performed by Cinematic Studio Strings.




vi-control.net





Very different interpretation. Much more romantic, slower, with more vibrato. Bear in mind that I am using only the smaller divisi section here. Sonokinetic OS can sound larger if needed. But here, I actually prefer the smaller, more intimate sound.

For reference, here is the same with the A groups from Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings:

View attachment Sonokinetic Elgar Serenade Larghetto A groups.mp3


It's the same midi, just copied over to the A groups. Works very well here, and gives a slightly larger sound than the B sections.

And here is the tutti version with both groups playing:

View attachment Sonokinetic Elgar Serenade Larghetto tutti.mp3


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## Casiquire (Dec 11, 2021)

muk said:


> No lookahead. It has short and slurred legato, and an 'auto' feature to select the appropriate one based on playing speed. You can also adjust a parameter called 'smear', and the transition level. To my knowledge only Modern Scoring Strings, LASS 3, and Tokyo Scoring Strings have lookahead.


I wonder if "smear" performs the same function?


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## handz (Dec 11, 2021)

WTF, why are all the libs recorded around me and I never know about it? Zlin Jihlava :O


doctoremmet said:


> So, Century Brass was recorded in the same hall


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## Evans (Dec 11, 2021)

Casiquire said:


> I wonder if "smear" performs the same function?


To my ears (after watching the SK video on Legato), it sounds similar to the Legato Blur control from VSL's Synchron libraries. It affects how much the two notes of a transition overlap. But it always still feels more "snipped" to me than the Pixelpoet trick's "bumpiness" (which can be preferred in some use cases), for example.


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## muk (Dec 12, 2021)

Supremo said:


> Did you try searching those samples through the “Expert” tab on the left side of Kontakt?


Yes. I selected all the ones that have a loudspeaker icon next to them when playing legato. But the option to select 'sample start' doesn't come up. I can only select either 'volume' or 'pitch'.


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## Drumdude2112 (Dec 12, 2021)

It does octotonic runs......I'm buying it lol !


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## Supremo (Dec 12, 2021)

muk said:


> Yes. I selected all the ones that have a loudspeaker icon next to them when playing legato. But the option to select 'sample start' doesn't come up. I can only select either 'volume' or 'pitch'.



You can add a 'sample start' by clicking on a Mod tab in the Source section and choosing 'midi CC' from the External Sources menu. Like in the attached picture.


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## Evans (Dec 12, 2021)

Anyone else pick this up?


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## NekujaK (Dec 12, 2021)

I got the strings... and the woodwinds! I had accumulated an obscene amount of loyalty points, so it was a complete no-brainer. But I probably would've bought them anyway - I'm a fan of Sonokinetic's products.

Sadly, I haven't had any time to play with either yet. But soon...


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## djb78 (Dec 13, 2021)

I'm keeping my eye on this library - looks very impressive. By the way, they have just posted some new videos covering the sordino patches....good stuff I think


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## djb78 (Dec 13, 2021)

https://www.youtube.com/c/SonokineticNetsampling


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## Steve Lum (Dec 13, 2021)

I'm not sure I can tell from looking at videos - what is the memory consumption like on loading all five sections, please if anyone can comment.


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## bfreepro (Dec 13, 2021)

Steve Lum said:


> I'm not sure I can tell from looking at videos - what is the memory consumption like on loading all five sections, please if anyone can comment.


I’ll check in a bit and post a screenshot


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## Andrew Qualls (Dec 15, 2021)

Hello All, I am currently on the hunt for a new Symphonic Strings Library and have come across Sonokinetic's Orchestral Strings.. I currently only have Spitfire Symphonic Strings, and have had it for about 6 years, which and want to replace. Do any of you think that this one can replace SSS when it comes to tone, legato transitions, and vibrato control?


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## bfreepro (Dec 15, 2021)

Andrew Qualls said:


> Hello All, I am currently on the hunt for a new Symphonic Strings Library and have come across Sonokinetic's Orchestral Strings.. I currently only have Spitfire Symphonic Strings, and have had it for about 6 years, which and want to replace. Do any of you think that this one can replace SSS when it comes to tone, legato transitions, and vibrato control?


No, it can't replace SSS in those regards but it would compliment it very, very nicely. SSS is more deeply sampled in regards to articulations and legato transitions. The tone of Sonokinetic Strings is incredible and, along with auto divisi and the more advanced features, is easily the biggest selling point for me personally. The tone and ease of use, for the most part, are better in Sonokinetic's offering. However, there is no vibrato control in the way SSS has, but there is the option to morph between regular sustains and expressive sustains, which will add in more vibrato as you transition to the expressive samples.

SSS basically has patches for almost anything you can think of, but it's not as intuitive and malleable IMO, so there's more "patch surfing" to find the right articulations for the job, and it can be quite inconsistent. Sonokinetic is not trying to compete with it though, it offers more features such as runs, phrases, polyphonic legato, auto divisi, things like this which are more advanced and unique to this library only. I think Sonokinetic is more consistent across the board too, besides the celli legato which has some bumpy transitions (which support is aware of and working to fix).

As mentioned above, Sonokinetic just released this one and has been VERY active in listening to user feedback and taking user suggestions into considerations. The library is already good, but will only get better with time. SSS is basically what you see/hear is what you get, it's been out for years and besides offering more microphone positions (lol), I don't see Spitfire clamoring to update their oldest string ensemble library when they're focusing so much on newer and better things like BBCSO, Abbey Road, etc.


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## Andrew Qualls (Dec 15, 2021)

bfreepro said:


> No, it can't replace SSS in those regards but it would compliment it very, very nicely. SSS is more deeply sampled in regards to articulations and legato transitions. The tone of Sonokinetic Strings is incredible and, along with auto divisi and the more advanced features, is easily the biggest selling point for me personally. The tone and ease of use, for the most part, are better in Sonokinetic's offering. However, there is no vibrato control in the way SSS has, but there is the option to morph between regular sustains and expressive sustains, which will add in more vibrato as you transition to the expressive samples.
> 
> SSS basically has patches for almost anything you can think of, but it's not as intuitive and malleable IMO, so there's more "patch surfing" to find the right articulations for the job, and it can be quite inconsistent. Sonokinetic is not trying to compete with it though, it offers more features such as runs, phrases, polyphonic legato, auto divisi, things like this which are more advanced and unique to this library only. I think Sonokinetic is more consistent across the board too, besides the celli legato which has some bumpy transitions (which support is aware of and working to fix).
> 
> As mentioned above, Sonokinetic just released this one and has been VERY active in listening to user feedback and taking user suggestions into considerations. The library is already good, but will only get better with time. SSS is basically what you see/hear is what you get, it's been out for years and besides offering more microphone positions (lol), I don't see Spitfire clamoring to update their oldest string ensemble library when they're focusing so much on newer and better things like BBCSO, Abbey Road, etc.


Thank You for your reply, so to clarify, you think it has a better ''Tone" than SSS but thats about it?

Is there any Symphonic String Libraries that you would recommend that you feel is better than Spitfire Symphonic Strings in all three aspects that I mentioned?


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## bfreepro (Dec 15, 2021)

Andrew Qualls said:


> Thank You for your reply, so to clarify, you think it has a better ''Tone" than SSS but thats about it?
> 
> Is there any Symphonic String Libraries that you would recommend that you feel is better than Spitfire Symphonic Strings in all three aspects that I mentioned?


I honestly wouldn't go so far as to say one is better than the other honestly, because they both are just so different. They both offer things that the other simply can't do, so it really depends on your usage I think. I have both of them, but I really only use spitfire libraries for the performance legato patches these days, because they're so easy to use (able to play shorts, legato, runs, etc all with one patch). Sonokinetic I use for playing polyphonically like for chords, string beds, evolving textures, that sort of thing. I haven't made much use of the phrases yet, but then again I rarely make use of phrases at all. I don't use either for dedicated expressive legato lines, for that I use Berlin Strings, Hollywood Strings, or CSS. I think there are so many good libraries on the market, the only reason I don't use spitfire's AIR studios stuff anymore is it's just so darn wet and gets muddy quickly IMO. I own basically every string library on the market and I use a variety of them every day, for very different reasons. If I had to pick just one to be my "bread and butter" string library for cinematic film scoring, there are a few I'd consider, in this order (and highly depending on budget, CSS is easily the best value here): 

Hollywood Strings - Amazing tone, instant Hollywood sound that has yet to be matched IMO. It can be dry or wet, mic positions offer a ton of flexibility, and the amount of articulations is truly staggering. OPUS edition is the way to go though, not the old PLAY version.
Berlin Strings- Smaller sound, more detailed, beautiful room tone, and also very exhaustive with the number of articulations. I prefer the Kontakt version to the newer SINE version though, and it's damn expensive and can be inconsistent, the SINE version has some annoying issues that need to be ironed out.
CSS- Amazing legato, much less expensive, basic articulations but it's all that you'd need for a wide variety of uses. The tone is too dark and warm for me, but I EQ them and it's an easy fix. It's very consistent and realistic, with a closer, more intimate sound, but can still be lush and Hollywood-esque with the room mics. 
Spitfire Symphonic would also be one of them, it is a great library, just not without its inconsistencies, quirks, and shortcomings (like all of them have). Super realistic and the performance legato patches are some of the best things I've ever used. Super wet though and there is no getting rid of that room tone. 

For the price, the Sonokinetic strings are very good, just not as exhaustive and deeply sampled as some of the others I mentioned, but the price reflects this and it's a great package IMO. If you want the best, smoothest, and most consistent monophonic legato though, CSS wins hands down.


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## Evans (Dec 15, 2021)

bfreepro said:


> Hollywood Strings


Yes. For vibrato control, pretty good legato, a good overall sound, flexibility of mics, and fairly good number of articulations, Hollywood Strings is going to be hard to beat.


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## Andrew Qualls (Dec 15, 2021)

bfreepro said:


> I honestly wouldn't go so far as to say one is better than the other honestly, because they both are just so different. They both offer things that the other simply can't do, so it really depends on your usage I think. I have both of them, but I really only use spitfire libraries for the performance legato patches these days, because they're so easy to use (able to play shorts, legato, runs, etc all with one patch). Sonokinetic I use for playing polyphonically like for chords, string beds, evolving textures, that sort of thing. I haven't made much use of the phrases yet, but then again I rarely make use of phrases at all. I don't use either for dedicated expressive legato lines, for that I use Berlin Strings, Hollywood Strings, or CSS. I think there are so many good libraries on the market, the only reason I don't use spitfire's AIR studios stuff anymore is it's just so darn wet and gets muddy quickly IMO. I own basically every string library on the market and I use a variety of them every day, for very different reasons. If I had to pick just one to be my "bread and butter" string library for cinematic film scoring, there are a few I'd consider, in this order (and highly depending on budget, CSS is easily the best value here):
> 
> Hollywood Strings - Amazing tone, instant Hollywood sound that has yet to be matched IMO. It can be dry or wet, mic positions offer a ton of flexibility, and the amount of articulations is truly staggering. OPUS edition is the way to go though, not the old PLAY version.
> Berlin Strings- Smaller sound, more detailed, beautiful room tone, and also very exhaustive with the number of articulations. I prefer the Kontakt version to the newer SINE version though, and it's damn expensive and can be inconsistent, the SINE version has some annoying issues that need to be ironed out.
> ...


Thank You for your feedback, I will consider these things


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## Nando Florestan (Dec 15, 2021)

As always, I agree with everything bfreepro just wrote. Basically you'll never replace SSS and as far as timbre is concerned, SSS has one of the best sounds out there, so you can't get anything better, you can get something different.

CSS will give you vibrato control similar to Sonokinetic -- a slider crossfading between non vibrato and vibratissimo. It works well. Another inexpensive option with a great sound is Nashville Scoring Strings, however in it there's no vibrato control and no legato control -- very useful nevertheless. I think it's a little boxy but easy enough to EQ.

If CPU usage is important to you at all, I have added Sonokinetic to my list.


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## djb78 (Dec 15, 2021)

Personally I really don't like Hollywood Strings... Spitfire Strings is very deeply sampled but in my opinion sounds TOO good (not much human element). I have Performance Samples Vista (which is just legatos) and now use this exclusively for string lines as it purposely has imperfections built in. 

I don't have CSS but have always been really impressed with the demos. I do think the demos for Sonokinetic could have been better though and exposed the strings a bit more to be honest...


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## djb78 (Dec 16, 2021)

... But hopefully without sounding too negative, I think the Sonokinetic has big potential and some great features!


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## Nando Florestan (Dec 16, 2021)

The legato in Vista is fingered, with frequent glides -- too frequent for any standard string writing. I wouldn't use Vista exclusively, in fact I haven't found a place for it yet. The vibratissimo sound is also not always appropriate. I cannot understand why the previous library, Con Moto, was retired -- it is the best library by Performance Samples so far. Pacific will not replace it either -- the ensemble sizes in Con Moto are appropriate for divisi with the transposition trick, Pacific won't allow this.


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## bfreepro (Dec 16, 2021)

Nando Florestan said:


> The legato in Vista is fingered, with frequent glides -- too frequent for any standard string writing. I wouldn't use Vista exclusively, in fact I haven't found a place for it yet. The vibratissimo sound is also not always appropriate. I cannot understand why the previous library, Con Moto, was retired -- it is the best library by Performance Samples so far. Pacific will not replace it either -- the ensemble sizes in Con Moto are appropriate for divisi with the transposition trick, Pacific won't allow this.





djb78 said:


> Personally I really don't like Hollywood Strings... Spitfire Strings is very deeply sampled but in my opinion sounds TOO good (not much human element). I have Performance Samples Vista (which is just legatos) and now use this exclusively for string lines as it purposely has imperfections built in.
> 
> I don't have CSS but have always been really impressed with the demos. I do think the demos for Sonokinetic could have been better though and exposed the strings a bit more to be honest...


That's surprising! I actually find SSS to be quite imperfect with a quite lot of chair noises, rustling, little things here and there (which is not a complaint, I too appreciate the imperfections). I like Nashville Scoring Strings for this reason as well. Feels real and imperfect. I got Vista and NSS at the same time and actually use NSS the vast majority of the time when I want a more imperfect and human-sounding layer of string playing. The drawback is the lack of options because everything (like vibrato) is all baked in. 

I practically begged Jasper to let me buy the Con Moto bundle even though it's discontinued and he just told me Pacific is right around the corner and recorded in the same room. I got the freebies he's released but I still like the Con Moto Celli sound and vibe much better. Just missing the rest of the sections lol


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## djb78 (Dec 16, 2021)

Nando Florestan said:


> The legato in Vista is fingered, with frequent glides -- too frequent for any standard string writing.  I wouldn't use Vista exclusively, in fact I haven't found a place for it yet. The vibratissimo sound is also not always appropriate. I cannot understand why the previous library, Con Moto, was retired -- it is the best library by Performance Samples so far. Pacific will not replace it either -- the ensemble sizes in Con Moto are appropriate for divisi with the transposition trick, Pacific won't allow this.


I hadn't thought about that before but you're spot on - I should say that I use Vista for all big melodies but for quieter for intimate stuff it's not appropriate so I use SSS. Apparently SoundonSound will be doing a review on the Sonokinetic library very soon - hopefully before the intro price cut-off as I'm very near to pulling the trigger and buying it!...

If anyone already has it an isolated legato demo of the celli and violas would be much appreciated!!


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## Evans (Dec 16, 2021)

Any further user impressions or audio examples? The intro pricing ends soon!


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## djb78 (Dec 16, 2021)

Evans said:


> Any further user impressions or audio examples? The intro pricing ends soon!


...I'm re-watching the videos on their website and think I'll just go ahead and buy it. I think it sounds amazing, and a bargain at the intro price. I love the GUI as well - looks so easy to transition between articulations.


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## Jackdaw (Dec 16, 2021)

Evans said:


> Any further user impressions or audio examples? The intro pricing ends soon!


This is exactly what I've been waiting for: some objective review/walkthrough. Intro is going to end soon and no-one has done any videos about this. They have all been doing only TSS videos :/


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## djb78 (Dec 16, 2021)

Jackdaw said:


> This is exactly what I've been waiting for: some objective review/walkthrough. Intro is going to end soon and no-one has done any videos about this. They have all been doing only TSS videos :/


SoundonSound are due to do a review but their next issue is not published until 23rd Dec!! Surprised no reviews online yet...


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## muk (Dec 16, 2021)

Evans said:


> Any further user impressions or audio examples? The intro pricing ends soon!



Maybe I can share another audio example on the weekend. But probably you are looking for other people to chime in, since I've already shared some examples?


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## Evans (Dec 16, 2021)

muk said:


> Maybe I can share another audio example on the weekend. But probably you are looking for other people to chime in, since I've already shared some examples?


I mostly just want to stir up some interest, since it seems like a product that has good potential.

Can't rely only on you and Rico, but I imagine anything further that you care to share would be welcome.


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## djb78 (Dec 16, 2021)

I'm downloading it now but is taking a while - should be able to post some very basic demos tomorrow...


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## Evans (Dec 16, 2021)

Boom. Dirk is going live soon.




EDIT: Sorry, Markrs, I know you were about to make an entirely different purchase and this could mess things up for you!


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## Kalli (Dec 16, 2021)

Evans said:


> Any further user impressions or audio examples? The intro pricing ends soon!



Not sure this helps, but here's a quick and dirty little snippet I made to test how the library handles a gentle and intimate sound at low dynamics. The first half of the clip uses the sul tasto articulation, which then fades into the expressive articulation for all sections. You'll notice that at these low dynamics even the expressive articulation has very little vibrato. The example uses the Decca tree blended with quite a bit of the close mics.

I post two versions, one with subtle room positioning and reverb (Precedence + Breeze 2) and one completely dry. I haven't applied EQ or any other effects on either version.

Overall, I quite like the tone of the library, although I have admittedly only scratched the surface so far.

Wet version:

View attachment Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings (Wet).mp3


Dry version:

View attachment Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings (Dry).mp3


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## Markrs (Dec 16, 2021)

Evans said:


> Boom. Dirk is going live soon.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Been watching it, it does sound amazing and at such a good price!


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## bfreepro (Dec 16, 2021)

Just a quick 30 minute noodling session. All sections play mostly expressive sustains, the chords are polyphonic legato/auto divisi, and a tiny bit of the short pizz and spiccato here and there.


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## bfreepro (Dec 16, 2021)

Markrs said:


> Been watching it, it does sound amazing and at such a good price!


The tone truly is special... the more I use it, the more I like it. I love the open, airy quality, without being too dense and congested.


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## dzilizzi (Dec 16, 2021)

bfreepro said:


> Just a quick 30 minute noodling session. All sections play mostly expressive sustains, the chords are polyphonic legato/auto divisi, and a tiny bit of the short pizz and spiccato here and there.


That sounds really good.


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Dec 16, 2021)

Doesn’t this library sound a lot like Hollywood Strings?

I have trouble hearing what’s so special about it.


----------



## QuiteAlright (Dec 16, 2021)

bfreepro said:


> I honestly wouldn't go so far as to say one is better than the other honestly, because they both are just so different. They both offer things that the other simply can't do, so it really depends on your usage I think. I have both of them, but I really only use spitfire libraries for the performance legato patches these days, because they're so easy to use (able to play shorts, legato, runs, etc all with one patch). Sonokinetic I use for playing polyphonically like for chords, string beds, evolving textures, that sort of thing. I haven't made much use of the phrases yet, but then again I rarely make use of phrases at all. I don't use either for dedicated expressive legato lines, for that I use Berlin Strings, Hollywood Strings, or CSS. I think there are so many good libraries on the market, the only reason I don't use spitfire's AIR studios stuff anymore is it's just so darn wet and gets muddy quickly IMO. I own basically every string library on the market and I use a variety of them every day, for very different reasons. If I had to pick just one to be my "bread and butter" string library for cinematic film scoring, there are a few I'd consider, in this order (and highly depending on budget, CSS is easily the best value here):
> 
> Hollywood Strings - Amazing tone, instant Hollywood sound that has yet to be matched IMO. It can be dry or wet, mic positions offer a ton of flexibility, and the amount of articulations is truly staggering. OPUS edition is the way to go though, not the old PLAY version.
> Berlin Strings- Smaller sound, more detailed, beautiful room tone, and also very exhaustive with the number of articulations. I prefer the Kontakt version to the newer SINE version though, and it's damn expensive and can be inconsistent, the SINE version has some annoying issues that need to be ironed out.
> ...


Thank you, this is a wonderful summary.


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## Sonokinetic BV (Dec 16, 2021)

Markrs said:


> Been watching it, it does sound amazing and at such a good price!


added something to the upcoming update based on Dirk's stream 
update 1.1 almost done now!


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## Dirk Ehlert (Dec 17, 2021)

Sonokinetic BV said:


> added something to the upcoming update based on Dirk's stream
> update 1.1 almost done now!


❤️


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## bfreepro (Dec 17, 2021)

Henrik B. Jensen said:


> Doesn’t this library sound a lot like Hollywood Strings?
> 
> I have trouble hearing what’s so special about it.


I definitely don’t think so. Quite a different character and timbre.


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## markleake (Dec 17, 2021)

Thought I would post an example, given not many have been posted yet.
It's not polished - I only started it today after work. But it should wet the appetite for some maybe.

Strings are all SOS.

Can I just say that these strings are stunning, I'm in love.


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## markleake (Dec 17, 2021)

Henrik B. Jensen said:


> This sounds fantastic. Thanks for posting!


Thanks, and no worries. I think this is all due to the library. It's super easy to write with, the divisi works great & allows complicated lines without being muddy, everything just works and sounds fantastic... there's not much more I could ask for in a string library.

I literally haven't even looked at the mic mixer page yet!


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## djb78 (Dec 17, 2021)

I finally installed the library after me faffing around with the download files...I wasn't sure at first but in the space of a couple of hours absolutely love this library. For example, I initially didn't think the spiccatos were snappy enough for certain uses - but then I merged in a little bartok pizz (only about 5%) and this transformed them - plus I believe you can control the articulation mix with cc#11. It's clear this library has been very well thought out and has some lovely programming in it.


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## Evans (Dec 17, 2021)

Does anyone recall examples of fast repetitions of shorts on the same note(s)?


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## djb78 (Dec 17, 2021)

Evans said:


> Does anyone recall examples of fast repetitions of shorts on the same note(s)?


Like a round robin do you mean? I can't see anything in the manual but when playing it seems to change samples...


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## Evans (Dec 17, 2021)

djb78 said:


> Like a round robin do you mean? I can't see anything in the manual but when playing it seems to change samples...


Yes, but about more than just knowing how many RRs it has. Are they timed well, are the dynamic layers smooth or does it jump a lot, blah blah blah.

I won't post any MIDI, because a simple copy/paste from one library to another won't do well and I want to avoid that. But I'm talking about something like this.






It's a bit soft (Pacific is wild for its range), but the attached audio is the Pacific Strings cello spiccato freebie patch.


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## Henning (Dec 17, 2021)

Evans said:


> Does anyone recall examples of fast repetitions of shorts on the same note(s)?


My demo from 1:00.


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## Evans (Dec 17, 2021)

Henning said:


> My demo from 1:00.


Thank you for calling that out. I listened to it before, but golly there's just so much content out there for so many products it's hard to remember what's what.

Sounds like "Ascent of the Rum Doodle" does around :42, as well.


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## Simon Ravn (Dec 17, 2021)

Not sure I understand... Is this a library recorded section by section, or only a full strings ensemble? It sort of states both on the website.


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## muziksculp (Dec 17, 2021)

Simon Ravn said:


> Not sure I understand... Is this a library recorded section by section, or only a full strings ensemble? It sort of states both on the website.


Section by Section, and Divisi Sections as well.


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## muziksculp (Dec 17, 2021)

I like the acronym posted above for the library : SOS


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## Evans (Dec 17, 2021)

Simon Ravn said:


> Not sure I understand... Is this a library recorded section by section, or only a full strings ensemble? It sort of states both on the website.



These are the total sizes w/the individual splits that you have full access to:

16 Violins I (9+7)
12 Violins II (7+5)
10 Violas (6+4)
10 Celli (6+4)
8 Basses (5+3)


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## djb78 (Dec 17, 2021)

Simon Ravn said:


> Not sure I understand... Is this a library recorded section by section, or only a full strings ensemble? It sort of states both on the website.


One of the great things is that it automatically splits out to divisi when you play polyphonic legato.


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## Henning (Dec 17, 2021)

Simon Ravn said:


> Not sure I understand... Is this a library recorded section by section, or only a full strings ensemble? It sort of states both on the website.


Hey Simon, it's a regular strings lib. If you like the sound, well, it's quite a steal for the price, mate  (of course, take this with a grain of salt as I did beta testing on this one).


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## djb78 (Dec 18, 2021)

Sonokinetic BV said:


> added something to the upcoming update based on Dirk's stream
> update 1.1 almost done now!


Congrats on a fabulous library  What's your preferred way for us to report any bugs or "nice to have" requests please?


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## Mistro (Dec 18, 2021)

While watching that stream my wallet found it's way in front of me. This is not right! I don't think I'm strong enough...

But seriously, if I get this it would be my first premium/upgrade string library. Seems good for a beginner.


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## Jackdaw (Dec 18, 2021)

Mistro said:


> But seriously, if I get this it would be my first premium/upgrade string library. Seems good for a beginner.


It is very good especially for the price. When I started I bought shit ton of crap libraries because I didn't want to spend too much money. Which ended spending way more money: first buying the crap libraries and then the good ones.
And this one is not expensive nor crap. Go for it. I'd say there is no other like it for this money (intro price which ends very soon).


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## Sonokinetic BV (Dec 18, 2021)

djb78 said:


> Congrats on a fabulous library  What's your preferred way for us to report any bugs or "nice to have" requests please?


Please create a ticket at support.sonokinetic.net. We will log all bugs/feature requests directly from there


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## djb78 (Dec 18, 2021)

Sonokinetic BV said:


> Please create a ticket at support.sonokinetic.net. We will log all bugs/feature requests directly from there


Cheers!


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## Marko Cifer (Dec 18, 2021)

I absolutely love how it seems I can use this library (once the room sample groups are reduced a bit via back-end tweaks - again, hopefully we'll get official support for this if there's enough interest) in a lot of scenarios as a piece onto which I can bolt-on other libraries since it appears to be nicely centred almost perfectly in between my existing libraries, or use it to "tame"/enhance some of the extreme points from these other libraries.

These are my findings so far, with the various Long patches:

Layering it with NI Symphonic Series gives me full-sounding Divisi with one library providing a lighter, more nimble and the other providing a darker, more meaty tone, and gives NISS a much-needed coat of fresh paint.
Layering it with Areia results in a bright patch that still feels like it wants to run all over the place (and probably will be able to quite a bit, once Areia gets its legato patches in a better place) but also gives the resulting sound more "body".
Layering it using the Sul Tasto patch with Areia & Novo's Intimate Textures results in a much more full-sounding ST that doesn't seem like overkill. Really, really liking this combination.
Layering it using the Sul Pont patch from Novo's Intimate Textures makes for another great combination - it's like SOS grounds the patch from Novo's expansion, and has an interesting tone.
Layering it with Symphobia gives the resulting combination an instant wide-feeling Movie Scoring vibe, with SOS giving Symphobia a better feel in dynamic range on its longs.
Layering it using the Sul Tasto patch (again) with Symphobia's Sul Tasto sections results in a more "vulnerable" yet fuller sound, they seem to complement each-other very nicely.
Layering it with Novo (not the expansions, using the Traditional content) is the trickiest (that doesn't outright fail) and I'll have to do a bunch of tweaking & experimentation here, but I'm kind of doubting this pairing will work. As much as I love Novo, it can be a stubborn brute sometimes.
Layering it with Threnody is what I think surprised me the most - I usually don't touch the "vanilla" longs there as they sound artificial to me, but adding SOS to it... _wow_. It adds whatever it needed to its sound to make it seem way more organic, and the way the longs' releases synergize... Gonna use this. A lot.
Layering it with Albion One... doesn't work at all. :D If the releases from SOS and Threnody synergize, these are in conflict. And even on close mics, there's just way too much _room_ from AO.
I haven't tried combining it with solo instruments yet - just the per-section or (non-chamber-ish) ensemble stuff. Also haven't tried layering shorts - that will probably be a lot trickier due to timings and room presence being critical.

*Even ignoring the excellent price-point right now that made this a steal/really great value, this was such a good purchase for me.* I had some (what I thought were) great sounding combinations, but this just enhances almost every library I own, and is able to stand on its own too when I feel like its own tone fits the context of what I'm trying to do, and seems to work with other tones really well if I feel like darkening or lightening it a bit - so it's incredibly extendable. For me, this truly is a "meat and potatoes" library - or in some cases, "duct tape and glue".

Very, _very_ happy right now. Thank you again @Sonokinetic BV for confirming its back-end structure similarity to your Sordino Strings, giving me that final push to pick it up knowing that I can use my workaround if needed. I truly believe that you're resting on a killer feature for anyone with other libraries since the room tone isn't fully baked in - when the room is tamed, the strings are capable of _incredible_ synergy in my humble opinion (of course, this isn't exactly something you can put into your marketing material...).

(tl;dr layering works when done right, who knew, hyuk)

((I wrote this up to document my thoughts while doing the layering experiments, and to give the library's developer an idea why I think having the ability to duck the room/wetness can be incredibly valuable - didn't feel right to do it in the other thread since I'm mentioning a lot of other devs' products)).


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## Mistro (Dec 18, 2021)

Well, I pulled the trigger. No regrets. I actually feel good about this one. I know some people don't like Sessions Strings Pro 2 but I look forward to seeing if I can have fun with these 2.....or is it like putting ketchup on spaghetti? I do that sometimes...don't judge me.


----------



## jon wayne (Dec 18, 2021)

More like mayonnaise on ice cream,


----------



## moon (Dec 28, 2021)

Just finding out about this now… Now that people have had it for a few weeks, any additional impressions?


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## AllanH (Dec 28, 2021)

I love the sound. I found that if I add the "stage wide" mic it sounds even more to my liking than just the tree. It's a subtle improvement but an improvement nonetheless. Each additional set of microphones is about 2 G, so I may have temper my enthusiasm at some point.

On my system, the morph feature seems CPU intensive, so I'll likely submit a ticket with my observations.

Other than the morph "issue" I have no clicks/pops on my older i6700 CPU. It runs smoothly standalone and in Cubase 11 Pro at 48k/256 samples.


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## bfreepro (Dec 28, 2021)

moon said:


> Just finding out about this now… Now that people have had it for a few weeks, any additional impressions?


I quite like it. I basically always like to have ensemble string patches with polyphonic legato in my template, and so far the options were pretty limited: Afflatus (which introduced me to the idea and made me realize how convenient it is), modern scoring strings, VSL synchron pro/elite, 8dio century, I think that’s about it (maybe Venice Scoring Strings, I don’t own it though).

The only one that could do auto divisi though, was modern scoring strings, which I do like overall, but there’s also something about it I really dislike (overall boxy and closed sound) and I find myself using it less and less honestly.

So now Afflatus “minimalist ensemble” and now Sonokinetic are easily my favorites for this application. I like a more wide, lush string sound, and so many string libs can’t achieve this the way I’d like, or they do initially but then in a working scenario, they just get too dense and cluttered and take up too much space in a mix. I like them to sit back when needed but still be detailed and not too washy and muddy, which very often happens when just using surround or ambient mics.

So basically I’ll have a room/surround mic’d full string ensemble for sketching and quick writing/laying a foundation, and then I layer in shorts and legato patches as needed for the dedicated string sections like 1st and 2nd violins, etc.

Basically this library could do it all in one. I think the timbre and tone are stunning. This and SSS are my favorite symphonic size string libs for tone and timbre. Roomy but still detailed and feathery. Hollywood strings is a close third.

BUT It’s definitely not perfect and some things actually feel or sound pretty weak IMO.

I don’t like the marcatos at all, they don’t sound convincing to me, because they are created by altering the adsr of the long notes I believe. Short notes are good, but could use an extra FFF layer maybe. I think this library excels at the softer textures, and I’d insta-buy any expansion they release that focuses on more unique/dynamic playing styles (like tundra, evos, or sunset strings, that sort of thing).

I was really hoping this library could also replace century strings and light and sound chamber strings for the long dynamic “arcs” or swells, but it’s lacking in that department IMO. I like the thought they had of including dynamic movement automatically, but it just doesn’t sound as realistic as naturally recorded swells or arcs and they only give you two options for length: since it’s basically just modulating cc01 in real time as you hold the keys, I just fail to see the use in this, but that’s just me

Wish list: full ensemble patch (with auto divisi if possible, if it’s not possible I’d happily take a full ensemble with polyphonic legato, that would be insanely helpful).

Better implemented (or naturally performed) marcatos and swells.


It’s unique and can sound truly amazing, but it’s also a bit inconsistent here and there, for instance, the longs are absolutely stunning, and the marcatos feel like an afterthought and sound quite fake to me. I’m glad I purchased it though, it’s very fair price-wise and it has more positives than negatives. I haven’t made use of the runs or phrases at all yet, so can’t comment on their usefulness yet.


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## Flyo (Dec 29, 2021)

It would make very helpful if someone could make a video (no talk) for show this strings.
There is no one


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## muk (Dec 29, 2021)

moon said:


> Just finding out about this now… Now that people have had it for a few weeks, any additional impressions?



Yes, I still like it. I like the sound quite a bit. It's a bit on the wet side on the decca tree. Maybe it was placed a bit high up? I don't know. Anyway, with the close mic and the wide mic you get some options to dial in the sound to your taste.

I like the playability of the library as well. Many of the functionality I don't even use, but what I use does work well for me. I have no need for the dynamics section, for example. What is the use of a crescendo, if it hasn't been recorded? It is being simulated the same way as when using the modwheel. So I simply use the modwheel instead and have more control. It's the same with the runs part. Runs haven't been recorded. When using the runs part, it creates runs from the normal sample pool. So I don't use the runs 'builder', but just play them with the other articulations.

As an aside, in the video about the runs, Son mentions that the trills articulation works well for runs. Doesn't work for me at all. Neither in play mode, nor in runs mode. It always plays two notes of the trill, resulting in a blurry mess. No idea what Son did in the tutorial video to make it work.

What I really find impressive about the library is that with a good orchestration, the mockup will sound really nice. And if there are problems in the orchestration, they will be audible in the mockup. I don't always have that with other strings libraries, where no matter the orchestration, good or bad, all sounds a bit same-ish. Like a particular library sound, that always comes through no matter what you give it to play. Not so with Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings. This library will sound very different depending on the orchestration.
A side effect of this is that you need to know what you are doing with the volume of each group and section. These will not be perfect out of the box. For example, I find the group A of violins 1 to be too loud by approximately 3db. Depending on the music. So you have to work on the balance. Once you get that right, you'll be rewarded with a natural and transparent sound.

For the short notes, at least on the balcony mics, the release tails seem to have been shortened drastically. I would like to have the option to add back at least some of the natural release. A control for the volume of the release samples has already been added by Sonokinetic. I would love to have a cc controllable slider for the length as well.

Just a few rambling thought after working for the library for some time now.


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## markleake (Dec 29, 2021)

I'm really liking this library also. I've been experimenting with the mics, and I find I like a combination of the close and wide, similar to what muk says above. So far I find I like it better when I pull the stereo width in on the wide mics though. Which makes me really wish there was a way of just turning off the stereo width control and have the natural sound of the wide mics. I also push the slider on the left on the mic page all the way up to remove the tone filter (I assume that's what it's doing).

Once you get those adjustments done, it's wonderful. Well, even just out of the box with no tweaking it's wonderful actually. It has a very natural tone that allows you to hear quite a lot of detail in what you write. For symphonic strings, this is very different to what you get compared to other libraries. Comparing it to Spitfire Symphonic Stings, for example: SSS gives a big lush feathery sound (which I adore); whereas SOS gives a detailed natural sound that is better for part writing, with a great hall sound that gives it a very good spaciousness.

I find it to be a very easy to use library so far. The divisi is fantastic, and works extreemly well.... you can write more complex string parts without thinking too much about it, and avoid the usual overly thick sound that results from doing this with other libraries.

Just be aware there are some bugs still. Sonokinetic have been very reposive here, but I think a lot of their engine is still new and a bit untested. Mainly the bugs I've found so far are when I turn off legato on the longs. I get dropped notes fairly often, for which I was able to track down the cause - see my post to them in the commercial thread. And if you play legato style with the legato off, the release tails stop working, which is quite annoying. There's other problems with mod wheel cross fades not working correctly on the violins 1 patch of the sordino strings (doesn't affect the main library, just sordinos on V1).

Bottom line is I wouldn't recommend the library for live playing yet. All these bugs seem fixable though, and Sonokinetic have given every indication so far they can and will fix these kind of things. So I'd expect some updates coming soon.


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## filipjonathan (Dec 29, 2021)

I really like the tone of this library. How intuitive are the runs?


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## markleake (Dec 29, 2021)

filipjonathan said:


> I really like the tone of this library. How intuitive are the runs?


All I can see that they do is automatically lay out the notes for you. It's fairly simple to use, although you need to wait a second or so between trying to enter and reenter a run in the interface. I really haven't played much with this side of the library, because to me it's easier just to enter runs into the DAW.


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## markleake (Dec 29, 2021)

@Sonokinetic BV. I have another request... there's no mute or solo button on the mic options... not that I can find anyway. This means when I'm playing around with mic settings I need to constantly load and unload the mics by turning them on/off. Could you please add some way to mute & solo the mics?


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## moon (Dec 30, 2021)

Well, I just bit the bullet.


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## djb78 (Dec 31, 2021)

muk said:


> For those of you wondering how the divisi sections sound on their own, here is a small test with just the B sections (the smaller ones) being used.
> 
> View attachment Sonokinetic Elgar Serenade Larghetto beginning.mp3
> 
> ...


Thanks for the comparisons, all sound great. I've now got Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings - great library but wouldn't mind blending it with another (if it makes a positive impact). Imho doesn't blend that well with SSS - do you think it blends well generally with Cinematic Studio Strings?...


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## Casiquire (Dec 31, 2021)

djb78 said:


> Thanks for the comparisons, all sound great. I've now got Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings - great library but wouldn't mind blending it with another (if it makes a positive impact). Imho doesn't blend that well with SSS - do you think it blends well generally with Cinematic Studio Strings?...


I think a better question is, what are you hoping to achieve by blending? Then work backwards to find the right library from there 😁 SSS and Sonokinetic are fairly similar with the exception of the room which is, in my opinion, the hardest thing to blend between libraries so I'm not surprised it's not making your ears happy. So as far as CSS, if you want more vibrato and a warmer tone that would probably work, depending on the project. It may be a matter of experimenting and trusting your ears


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## djb78 (Dec 31, 2021)

Casiquire said:


> I think a better question is, what are you hoping to achieve by blending? Then work backwards to find the right library from there 😁 SSS and Sonokinetic are fairly similar with the exception of the room which is, in my opinion, the hardest thing to blend between libraries so I'm not surprised it's not making your ears happy. So as far as CSS, if you want more vibrato and a warmer tone that would probably work, depending on the project. It may be a matter of experimenting and trusting your ears


Although I really like the Orchestral Strings for my taste I would prefer that extra notch of vibrato which it seems the CSS has. I don't want to blend just for the sake of it though as I think everything else in the Orchestral Strings works very well by itself


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## djb78 (Jan 1, 2022)

djb78 said:


> Although I really like the Orchestral Strings for my taste I would prefer that extra notch of vibrato which it seems the CSS has. I don't want to blend just for the sake of it though as I think everything else in the Orchestral Strings works very well by itself


Just to add to this I've been experimenting with the default '4' mic position (decca + balcony) and this seems to bring out the vibrato (at least to my ears!) in a very controlled way. I'm also using a touch of Cinematic Rooms. I take back what I said before of needing that extra notch of vibrato - lots of depth to this library!


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## Marsen (Jan 5, 2022)

AllanH said:


> On my system, the morph feature seems CPU intensive, so I'll likely submit a ticket with my observations.


The morph function doubles the voice count, so it doubles your cpu-stress.


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## djb78 (Jan 5, 2022)

Henrik B. Jensen said:


> I'm in the middle of watching Dirk's stream with SOS - this one:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I'm not as qualified as others to comment as I only have a couple of string libraries - Spitfire Symphonic Strings, Vista, Spitfire Symphonic Motions - but I think it is a very good quality library that is excellent value for money, well thought out and very professional sounding. I think it needs a few tweaks, eg to the legato, but nothing major and can probably be achieved by either the gui settings or a minor update.


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## Marko Cifer (Jan 5, 2022)

Henrik B. Jensen said:


> I'm seriously tempted to get it before the intro price stops on Jan 7, but what's the general impression of it so far - is there anything one should be aware of?


So far my experience has been that it's fantastic for layering, really great for softer/lush yet defined lines & runs thanks to the tone & actually useful mic options, really takes well to your own verbs thanks to going pretty much dry being an option after an update, and great for most shorts (with plenty to choose from).

But the marcatos are very ehh and some of the other shorts need massaging if you want to get more punch/energy out of them. The basses especially feel reserved, even with the internal processing maxed out. Doesn't do too well if you need bombastic overall. There are still some bugs to iron out too.

I'd say it's still very much worth picking up, unless it would be your only library while you'd expect it to be able to do loud/epic, or any remaining bugs would seriously hinder you in the short term (the devs have been great so far with updates & taking feedback into account tho).


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## jadedsean (Jan 6, 2022)

Is it me or does this library need some noise reduction? First of, i find the legatos very breathy and the when playing the shorts i notice a lot of room build up, of course this is most probably due to the fact that i have to increase the volume of the library as it is very quite. Anyone else notice this?


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## constaneum (Jan 17, 2022)

how's the library so far?


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## djb78 (Jan 19, 2022)

constaneum said:


> how's the library so far?


Still enjoying it - have replaced a few articulations that I've previously used Spitfire Symphonic Strings for but not (as expected) the only library I use for legato. Gui and key-switching is dead easy.


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## MelodicAdagio (Jan 19, 2022)

jadedsean said:


> Is it me or does this library need some noise reduction? First of, i find the legatos very breathy and the when playing the shorts i notice a lot of room build up, of course this is most probably due to the fact that i have to increase the volume of the library as it is very quite. Anyone else notice this?


I don't know about the noise reduction, but the library is definitely quieter than all my other string libraries. I initially went through and boosted the Kontakt volume on each instrument to bring it in line with the rest of the libraries on my template. Unfortunately I found that once you save and disable a track that has an SOS instrument, the volume reverts back to the original factory setting. So when I would reenable an SOS track to use it, it was too quiet once again. I wound up having to boost and save the Cubase mixer volume on each so that I don't have to reset it each time I start anew.

I contacted them about it. They said it was intentional but that they would see what they could do. All my other Kontakt string libraries--even going clear back to the ancient Sonic Implants--allow you to set and save the volume level.


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## djb78 (Jan 19, 2022)

One way around that may be to set the volume in the midi track itself (cc7 I think)?


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## MelodicAdagio (Jan 20, 2022)

djb78 said:


> One way around that may be to set the volume in the midi track itself (cc7 I think)?


Right. I often preset CC7 on the MIDI control section on tracks to 90. It could be bumped up or the mixer could be increased on the track, which is what I wound up doing. The prior setting will be retained with either approach.


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## muziksculp (Jan 24, 2022)




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## muziksculp (Feb 5, 2022)

Looks like Sonokinetic is cooking something new, I wonder what it is ?


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## constaneum (Feb 7, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Looks like Sonokinetic is cooking something new, I wonder what it is ?



Expansion to the existing ? More articulations? another vibrato layer perhaps ?


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## muk (Feb 7, 2022)

constaneum said:


> Expansion to the existing ? More articulations? another vibrato layer perhaps ?


If you are talking about Orchestral Strings, then probably not. That would have to be recorded section by section, and on the picture it's the whole strings orchestra at the same time. Unless the picture is just a teaser.


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## Casiquire (Feb 7, 2022)

muk said:


> If you are talking about Orchestral Strings, then probably not. That would have to be recorded section by section, and on the picture it's the whole strings orchestra at the same time. Unless the picture is just a teaser.


I was thinking the same thing, we're looking at a full ensemble. I wonder why


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## jbuhler (Feb 7, 2022)

muk said:


> If you are talking about Orchestral Strings, then probably not. That would have to be recorded section by section, and on the picture it's the whole strings orchestra at the same time. Unless the picture is just a teaser.


Yeah, because it was the full strings, I assumed it was a new phrase library.


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## muziksculp (Feb 7, 2022)

constaneum said:


> Expansion to the existing ? More articulations? another vibrato layer perhaps ?


The pic shows the entire Strings Section, so it's not too far fetched that they could still be developing an expansion for SOS.


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## Mistro (Feb 7, 2022)

An ensemble patch was requested for SOS a few times and I think it might come in an update. Maybe that?


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## constaneum (Feb 7, 2022)

Ensemble patch doesn't require new recording right ? it's just puzzling up the existing sections. that's what i thought.


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## muziksculp (Feb 7, 2022)

constaneum said:


> Ensemble patch doesn't require new recording right ? it's just puzzling up the existing sections. that's what i thought.


I think it depends on the developer. Puzzling up can work, but is not optimal.

I'm also not sure if full ensemble patches end up in a final production, i.e. I use them mostly for sketching, as another option to using a Piano. So they are handy to have.


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## constaneum (Feb 7, 2022)

how do you guys find the orchestral strings ? How would you compare it with Spitfire Audio's SSS ?


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## constaneum (Feb 8, 2022)

any user demos featuring sonokinetic's orchestral strings thus far?


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## muk (Feb 9, 2022)

constaneum said:


> any user demos featuring sonokinetic's orchestral strings thus far?




Thought I'd already shared this somewhere. But I can't find it, so maybe I didn't. This one makes use of all the divisi sections:

View attachment Sonokinetic divisi Test.mp3



A short introduction I wrote in the classical idiom. The celli in this example are Berlin Symphonic Strings. All other Strings are Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings.

View attachment Ouvertüre Eigenes.mp3



And a work in progress. This one is still a little rough around the edges. Strings are all Sonokinetic OS, and making use of the divisi sections again:

View attachment WIP2.mp3



I hope this helps.


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## constaneum (Feb 9, 2022)

muk said:


> Thought I'd already shared this somewhere. But I can't find it, so maybe I didn't. This one makes use of all the divisi sections:
> 
> View attachment Sonokinetic divisi Test.mp3
> 
> ...


sounds not bad.... curious. why 2nd example you've decided to use BSS for the celli ?

Also how would you compare the wetness of Sonokinetic OS with Spitfire Audio's SSS recorded at Air?


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## muk (Feb 9, 2022)

constaneum said:


> why 2nd example you've decided to use BSS for the celli ?


The BSS celli are more romantic and openly expressive. The Sonokinetic OS celli are more controlled. That makes SOS more versatile overall, but for this phrase I wanted a highly expressive sound with a lot of vibrato. And that's CSS and BSS territory. 

I don't own Spitfire Symphonic Strings. Sonokinetic OS can sound pretty wet too though. I think it shouldn't be too difficult to blend them.


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## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

Hi,

I just started using SOS. For some reason, I can't seem to trigger any portamentos when playing at low velocities, I did set it in the legato settings to around 50 to make sure it gets triggered, but I hear no portamento. Any idea what could be the issue ?

@muk ,
Are you able to hear a long, and clear portamento when playing the legato at the lower velocities that trigger the portamento ? Can you post a short audio showing how the portamento sounds, i.e. using vlns 1. 

Thanks.


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## Marko Cifer (Feb 10, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> I just started using SOS. For some reason, I can't seem to trigger any portamentos when playing at low velocities, I did set it in the legato settings to around 50 to make sure it gets triggered, but I hear no portamento. Any idea what could be the issue ?
> 
> Thanks.


Are you sure you're still in Auto mode with Legato and haven't changed the mode to a fixed legato type via key switches by accident? Gonna guess yes if you kept on going to change your portamento trigger level, but double-check just in case.

Also, try raising the Transition level in the Legato settings to make the legato type more obvious - it might just be a bit too subtle for portamento for your tastes out of the box. I like to raise it a bit when utilizing portamento, and if that's too strong for the other two types elsewhere - you have CC9 to automate the transition level.


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## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

Marko Cifer said:


> Are you sure you're still in Auto mode with Legato and haven't changed the mode to a fixed legato type via key switches by accident? Gonna guess yes if you kept on going to change your portamento trigger level, but double-check just in case.
> 
> Also, try raising the Transition level in the Legato settings to make the legato type more obvious - it might just be a bit too subtle for portamento for your tastes out of the box. I like to raise it a bit when utilizing portamento, and if that's too strong for the other two types elsewhere - you have CC9 to automate the transition level.


Hi @Marko Cifer ,

Thanks for the tips.

I decided to batch-resave the library first to make sure there are no missing sample issue.

During the Batch-Resave process I got a message of some not found sample files, I pointed to the folder, and all went fine after that. So, I'm not sure if this has anything to do with the Portamento issue I was having.

I increased the Transition Level, and now I can hear the Portamento when playing at below the threshold setting for them to be triggered. So, I think all is working as it should now. I think the portamento length is not very long, but more of medium, more of subtle portamento, which I think is very good, and tasteful for most musical scenarios. Oh.. I also find that increasing the Smear value makes the Portamentos more pronounced. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


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## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

OK, so the short articulations are automatically triggered via velocity, but the mod wheel does effect the overall dynamics as well. 

Is there a setting for the velocity dynamics of the shorts ?


----------



## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

Could someone tell me if this setting menu is for the latest update, or maybe I have an earlier version not showing all the newer option of the latest update, especially for dynamics controls ?


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## Marko Cifer (Feb 10, 2022)

That seems to be an older version, this is what I see:






You can also identify if it's an older version of the NKI by how many options you have under the Legato configuration window - if you're not seeing the release volume options and CC14/15 defaults for those, it's an older version.


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## Marko Cifer (Feb 10, 2022)

Let me give you a screenshot of that window too:


----------



## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

Marko Cifer said:


> Let me give you a screenshot of that window too:


Hmmm.. It looks like I have an older version, and not the latest version 1.2 installed, although the Sonokinetic Manger shows me that it is 1.2 (strange), what's the best way to update to the latest version ?


----------



## Marko Cifer (Feb 10, 2022)

In my case since I installed the library manually (a whole lot of links to over 50 .rar files), I still had the Download URL live and working as the update was released while my downloads were still within that time limit and just re-downloaded the file "Sonokinetic.Orchestral.Strings.Instruments.rar" from the list of links I had access to in the Download Area, then overwrote the NICINT/NKI/etc. files in the library's location with the updated content from that Instruments file.

For reference, it's about 10MB larger than the file I originally got when I purchased the library (~30MB originally, the update is very close to 40MB).

If you'd go the manual route, you might need to burn one of the Download URL time limit resets (the site tells me I have three left), but since there's a finite number of them, maybe get in touch with the Sonokinetic support if they can give you access to just an updated version of that file without wasting one of your download resets?


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## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

Marko Cifer said:


> In my case since I installed the library manually (a whole lot of links to over 50 .rar files), I still had the Download URL live and working as the update was released while my downloads were still within that time limit and just re-downloaded the file "Sonokinetic.Orchestral.Strings.Instruments.rar" from the list of links I had access to in the Download Area, then overwrote the NICINT/NKI/etc. files in the library's location with the updated content from that Instruments file.
> 
> For reference, it's about 10MB larger than the file I originally got when I purchased the library (~30MB originally, the update is very close to 40MB).
> 
> If you'd go the manual route, you might need to burn one of the Download URL time limit resets (the site tells me I have three left), but since there's a finite number of them, maybe get in touch with the Sonokinetic support if they can give you access to just an updated version of that file without wasting one of your download resets?


OK, I decided to delete my current old version of SOS, and re-download the full library again via Sonokinetic Manager. I think this is the easiest way to sort the issues, and get the latest version (1.2). Hopefully it will install the latest version. 

Thanks.


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## jazzman7 (Feb 10, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Hi @Marko Cifer ,
> 
> Thanks for the tips.
> 
> ...


Yep. I found that the portamento was all but invisible until I cranked up the transition level pretty high. You're right. The port is pretty restrained


----------



## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

jazzman7 said:


> Yep. I found that the portamento was all but invisible until I cranked up the transition level pretty high. You're right. The port is pretty restrained


Hi @jazzman7 ,

OK, Thanks for the feedback, confirming that the Portamento is restrained, and more audible when one boosts the transition level. That was exactly what I experienced.

Now I'm re-downloading the library to get the latest version. For some odd reason, I still had the old version, but the Sonokinetic Manager indicated that I had the 1.2 update, which was not true.

I didn't have much time to discover, this library, but I plan to do so as soon as it is installed again. From my very limited time with it, I like the sound, and character of the library quite a bit.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


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## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

Hi,

OK, I now have a fresh version 2.1 that is showing the additional controls, and actually the portamento sounds better, than the previous older version that was installed on my system, also more of the settings for the shorts dynamics.


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## jazzman7 (Feb 10, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Hi @jazzman7 ,
> 
> OK, Thanks for the feedback, confirming that the Portamento is restrained, and more audible when one boosts the transition level. That was exactly what I experienced.
> 
> ...


My Sonokinetic manager is acting up and will not complete download of the Sordino update. I'll check it again shortly, but there may some issues with it right now.


----------



## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

jazzman7 said:


> My Sonokinetic manager is acting up and will not complete download of the Sordino update. I'll check it again shortly, but there may some issues with it right now.


I deleted the older version I had installed, re-downloading the full Sordino Strings library again. I think it's the easiest, and safest method to sort my issue. 

Did the downloader show you have a Sordino Update available ? It didn't show me that there is an update, so I thought I must have the latest version, but that was not true.


----------



## jazzman7 (Feb 10, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> I deleted the older version I had installed, re-downloading the full Sordino Strings library again. I think it's the easiest, and safest method to sort my issue.
> 
> Did the downloader show you have a Sordino Update available ? It didn't show me that there is an update, so I thought I must have the latest version, but that was not true.


It showed an update available but gave me repeated error messages when trying to complete the download. Not in a big hurry, so I waited hoping they will clear up the problem. I might re-download manually as well. I'd rather not if I can help it tho.


----------



## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

jazzman7 said:


> I might re-download manually as well. I'd rather not if I can help it tho.


Do you download it manually from your Sonokinetic User Account downloads ? 

I'm using the Download Manager to download the full library, not a manual download. Why do you not use the Download Manager to download the full library, instead of using the manual download method ?


----------



## jazzman7 (Feb 10, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Do you download it manually from your Sonokinetic User Account downloads ?
> 
> I'm using the Download Manager to download the full library, not a manual download. Why do you not use the Download Manager to download the full library, instead of using the manual download method ?


The manager itself said in the error message if the download failed, I would have that option. It pointed to the link to do so also. Decided to hold my horses. I might redownload the manager first if it screws up again.


----------



## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

jazzman7 said:


> The manager itself said in the error message if the download failed, I would have that option. It pointed to the link to do so also. Decided to hold my horses. I might redownload the manager first if it screws up again.


I see. Yeah, it might be a good idea to redownload the manager just in case it is an older version. 

Good luck, hope you get it installed. I'm still waiting for the Sordino Strings download to complete, it's kind of slow.


----------



## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

The downloader seems to have stalled at %74.5 of the download. I tried Pausing, then re-downloading it, but that didn't help. I'm starting the download again from scratch. Hopefully it will continue without stalling this time around.


----------



## jazzman7 (Feb 10, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> The downloader seems to have stalled at %74.5 of the download. I tried Pausing, then re-downloading it, but that didn't help. I'm starting the download again from scratch. Hopefully it will continue without stalling this time around.


Pretty late in Euroland. Figure if I contacted support, help prob won't be had till tomorrow


----------



## muziksculp (Feb 10, 2022)

jazzman7 said:


> Pretty late in Euroland. Figure if I contacted support, help prob won't be had till tomorrow


Yes, you might have to wait for them until tomorrow morning. 

Regarding my issue with Installing the latest issue of the Sordino Strings. I un-installed my current version of the Sonokinetic Manager App. , and re-installed it again from their website. Then started a fresh complete download of the Sordino Strings library. All went fine Finally ! I have it installed.


----------



## muziksculp (Mar 10, 2022)

Sonokinetic YT channel posted this video today :


----------



## muziksculp (Mar 19, 2022)

Hi,

I came across these issues using Sonokinetic Orch. Strings. It would be very helpful if these issues can be confirmed by other forum users of this library, so I can report them to Sonokinetic Support.

*Issue #1 *
Basically using the *Staccato Articulation* in the *Vlns 2 Mix Preset*, the *(Divisi A)* section has no audio, so maybe it's missing the samples ? or ... ? although I get no error message that samples are missing. The (Divisi B) section has audio. so when using Auto Divisi you only hear (Divisi B) playing, and not (Divisi A)

Any feedback, or confirmation of this issue would be appreciated, I will be reporting it to Sonokinetic Support if it is confirmed.

*Issue #2*
One more issue I should add to the above, when playing the *Marcato articulations*, especially the espressivo, and/or Straight Marcato articulations, and having more than one mic option enabled, I experience some *clicks/pops* when I play a note while moving the Mod-Wheel (CC#1).

I'm not sure if this is something other users are experiencing with this library. If I move the Mod-Wheel during the sustained portion of the note, I don't get any clicks/pops, but when I have a changing value for CC1 and play a marc. note the pops/clicks happen. So, I basically avoid changing CC1 values during the note-On midi event.

So far, I'm loving the rich timbre, realism, and character of this Strings Library. I just wish it gets some of these rough edges smoothed out via update/s .

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## muziksculp (Mar 21, 2022)

Hi,

I'm loving *Sonokinetic Orch. Strings*. It has a gorgeous sound. One of the best Strings Libraries I own, and I have a lot of them. This one is very special ! 

It also has some bugs that I reported to Sonokinetic Support, so hopefully they will be able to fix these issues shortly. 

I would love to read more feedback from users of SOS, audio clips of the library in action, ..etc. 

Thanks,
Muziksculp


----------



## [email protected] (Mar 25, 2022)

I bought the library when it was released and now have finally the time to set it up properly. So it seems that dynamics haven't been separately recorded, correct? Even the _sfz_ and _fp_ seem to be designed with the velocity layers.
Also: Is there a way to switch off legato without going to the settings?


----------



## Casiquire (Mar 25, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Hi,
> 
> I'm loving *Sonokinetic Orch. Strings*. It has a gorgeous sound. One of the best Strings Libraries I own, and I have a lot of them. This one is very special !
> 
> ...


Oh? Is it the new go-to?


----------



## muziksculp (Mar 25, 2022)

Casiquire said:


> Oh? Is it the new go-to?


SOS is one of them. I don't have one strings library that I designate as my Go-To. 

I have a few favorites/go-to strings libraries, and SOS is one of them. Believe it or not, I'm still not done discovering my strings libraries.


----------



## muziksculp (Mar 25, 2022)

[email protected] said:


> Also: Is there a way to switch off legato without going to the settings?


You can use Midi Learn by Right-Clicking on Legato OFF and assign it to a CC # on your controller.


----------



## [email protected] (Mar 25, 2022)

Thank you very much for the tip! I dragged CC16 on there but it doesn't work. Maybe because this is already reserved for something else?


----------



## muziksculp (Mar 25, 2022)

[email protected] said:


> Thank you very much for the tip! I dragged CC16 on there but it doesn't work. Maybe because this is already reserved for something else?
> View attachment 73174


Sorry about that. I tried it as well, and it looks like these settings do not change via Midi-Learn, and need to be manually clicked on in the Settings GUI to be changed. Maybe @Sonokinetic BV can provide us with some feedback on this detail if this post gets his attention. My guess he is busy with some development project.


----------



## [email protected] (Mar 25, 2022)

It would be great if midi learn would work here. Quite irritating that legato has to be klicked in the UI. If one would like to solve it via expression maps one would have load two patches with one having legato turned off and then trigger the different channels.


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## muziksculp (Mar 25, 2022)

[email protected] said:


> It would be great if midi learn would work here. Quite irritating that legato has to be klicked in the UI. If one would like to solve it via expression maps one would have load two patches with one having legato turned off and then trigger the different channels.


Yes, it would make more sense to change these settings via MIDI-CC # values. Not sure why it's not working, maybe it was disabled intentionally for some technical reason.


----------



## Casiquire (Mar 25, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> SOS is one of them. I don't have one strings library that I designate as my Go-To.
> 
> I have a few favorites/go-to strings libraries, and SOS is one of them. Believe it or not, I'm still not done discovering my strings libraries.


I very much believe it, because you have a lot of them (ok i admit i do too lol) and i feel like it takes a long time to learn the nitty gritty of even just one string library. I bought Berlin Strings over a year ago and I'm still finding new things to explore. Like the really pretty way the first violins play melodies low on their D string with strong vibrato, or how the cutoff filter can help me soften up articulations that are meant to sound strong and that might not have a recorded pianissimo layer. And don't get me started on mic positions. I could kill an entire week just playing with those if i were so inclined.

Adults still play with toys, we just call them tools 😁

Curious also, do you find SOS works better for some material than others? or I guess you could say, some situations where you want to use SOS and other situations where it makes you want to send one


----------



## constaneum (Mar 25, 2022)

How good is the legato? I like the tone but so far I've not heard any convincing legato line yet.


----------



## muziksculp (Mar 25, 2022)

constaneum said:


> I've not heard any convincing legato line yet.


----------



## muziksculp (Mar 25, 2022)

Casiquire said:


> Curious also, do you find SOS works better for some material than others? or I guess you could say, some situations where you want to use SOS and other situations where it makes you want to send one


I haven't gotten that far yet, to figure out what SOS is best used for. 

But in general it has a very rich timbre, especially when using the auto-divisi sections (A & B), each of the divisi sections has a different tone, together they complement each other very nicely, and the acoustics of the space are flattering, so I wouldn't want to use this library bone dry, and add reverb, that's not what they spent a lot of effort, and time capturing, the hall it was recorded in is an integral part of the charm, and rich timbre SOS offers. 

I will post more feedback about it in the coming days, and weeks. I just have too much to absorb, and digest as far as strings libraries are concerned, but I do enjoy having a lot of options, and experimenting with them.


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## muziksculp (Mar 25, 2022)

@constaneum ,

I was just teasing with the legato gif I posted earlier. 

SOS has very good legatos, which can also be adjusted to taste using the 'Smear', and 'Transition Level' parameters, they can be assigned to CC#s.to automate them if needed. I usually set them to values that make them sound good to my ears, and keep them constant. I'm not sure if they re meant to be dynamically automated, but one can experiment with them to see if that is useful.

The portamento is triggered via note velocity threshold that you set i.e. low velocities i.e. 24, My first experience was that the portamento transition wasn't very audible, or a bit hard to hear if the 'Transition Level' is set low, so, I had to boost the 'Transition Level' parameter to hear the portamento clearer/more exposed.

I will post some audio clips of the legatos, during this weekend, so you get an idea of their quality.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


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## [email protected] (Mar 26, 2022)

I still struggle to find the correct value for the two parameters of "smear" and "transition level". I set the "transition level"to 100% and then went down but it seems to me it's not perfectly balanced. The portamentos are often too loud when the short legatos are fine. I then copied my CC1-data also to CC9 (which is assigned to "transiltion level") so it matches the dynamics - but then all transitions were too liud. When I lowered the whole CC9-data it worked but that would be very fiddly. So I set the "transition level" to 33 and boosted the portamento transitions manually with CC9. Still a very fiddly solution. But I don't give up trying!


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## [email protected] (Mar 26, 2022)

Since people asked for legato examples I put together this short test. As you can hear the room is very present in the out-of-the-box-mix which I used here. I laid out all different legatos in my expression map and wrote a short melody where I switch between _legato straight _and _legato espressivo _for the longer notes. I used only the _short legato_ and _portamento_ (the marked notes are _legato espressivo_, the dark blue notes are _portamento espressivo_). I auditioned this test to my girlfriend who is a violin player and she requested the notes before the _portamento espressivo_ be changed to _legato espressivo_ to smoothen out the change of room reflection since it "sizzles" stronger with the _espressivo_ recordings. Having shorter _legato straight_ notes switching to _portamento/legato espressivo _changes the room reflection too suddenly.
The "smear" is set to 0 because I wanted to have the full transitions without them being blurred, the "transition level" is set to 33.





The melody is played by each divisi section and then performed in unsion, so: Violin I A, Violin I B, Violin I A+B etc. Each section plays an octave lower than the one before. At the end all violins and violas play together as well as the celli and basses afterwards.
I used the same file for all tracks but adjusted the CC1-settings for the basses since they respond very differently.
It's interesting that often the B-sections have smoother transitions than the A-sections. This is very obvious in the violas and celli. When performing together, the divisi sections compliment each other very well. I also like that the _portamento_ is not that exposed and is tastefully done.

View attachment Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings legato.mp3


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## Loïc D (Mar 26, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> @constaneum ,
> 
> I was just teasing with the legato gif I posted earlier.
> 
> ...


To my understanding, portamento is proportional to dynamics (CC1), so the bigger the dynamics, the louder the portamento. Transition level helps you rebalance Portamento to your needs.


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## muziksculp (Mar 26, 2022)

Loïc D said:


> To my understanding, portamento is proportional to dynamics (CC1), so the bigger the dynamics, the louder the portamento. Transition level helps you rebalance Portamento to your needs.


Hi @Loïc D ,

Thanks for the helpful feedback. I wasn't aware of that. I will test this detail.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


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## jbuhler (Mar 26, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> @constaneum ,
> 
> I was just teasing with the legato gif I posted earlier.
> 
> ...


This is my sense too. The legato transition is set very low, really too low for the portamento to be heard as such. And that also makes the legato quite transparent, which I don’t mind so much but I prefer the transition level set quite a lot higher than the default.


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## constaneum (Mar 26, 2022)

Too bad the legato doesn't sound as good as CSS. The timbre is great though


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## muziksculp (Mar 28, 2022)

constaneum said:


> Too bad the legato doesn't sound as good as CSS. The timbre is great though


Hi @constaneum ,

I did a bit of legato beautification for SOS using the Pixelpoet edit. The Legatos sound much smoother now. Maybe you change your mind when you hear them after the edit. I will post an audio clip later today. Comparing the before, and after legatos. 

Cheers,
Muziksculp


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## muziksculp (Mar 28, 2022)

Hi @constaneum ,

OK, so here is SOS Vlns1 Legato Espres. Stock patch played first, then you will hear a bell sound to signal the beginning of the Improved Legato using PixelPoet Edit, then two bells to signal the Improved Legato with some added Pitchbend data emulating a more passionate vibrato performance, it is subtle, but you will hear it if you focus a bit. No EQ used, just a bit of an Algorithmic Reverb, and a Limiter on the Master Output.

Cheers,
Muziksculp

View attachment SOS Legato Imp Test.mp3


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## [email protected] (Mar 30, 2022)

@muziksculp could you maybe post screenshots of the settings here? I tried to use the Pixelpoet Trick myself but I couldn't edit the correct samples in the legato backend.


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## muziksculp (Mar 30, 2022)

@[email protected] ,

I will post a video later today, showing how to get all the right samples for SOS Strings, so you can apply the PixelPoet edit. It should also work for the rest of the legato strings (VLs 2, VLAs, Celli, DBs) .

Cheers,
Muziksculp


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## muziksculp (Mar 31, 2022)

They posted this pic on their Instagram , I wonder if they are recording more content for SOS ?


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## muziksculp (Mar 31, 2022)

[email protected] said:


> @muziksculp could you maybe post screenshots of the settings here? I tried to use the Pixelpoet Trick myself but I couldn't edit the correct samples in the legato backend.


Here you go : My video showing the Pixelpoet Edit for Sonokinetic Orch. Strings Legato.

I should also add one more tip, I find setting the Legato Transition Level, and Smear to 75 produces good results.


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## [email protected] (Mar 31, 2022)

Great, I will apply it to my legato example on the weekend!


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## jbuhler (Mar 31, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> They posted this pic on their Instagram , I wonder if they are recording more content for SOS ?



Full strings, so more likely a new phrase library.


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## muziksculp (Mar 31, 2022)

jbuhler said:


> Full strings, so more likely a new phrase library.


Well, that will make my wallet very happy, since I don't use any phrase libraries.


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## jbuhler (Mar 31, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Well, that will make my wallet very happy, since I don't use any phrase libraries.


Phrase libraries have their uses.


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## muziksculp (Mar 31, 2022)

jbuhler said:


> Phrase libraries have their uses.


Not for me. No thanks.


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## jbuhler (Mar 31, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Not for me. No thanks.


Really. Not everything is about you.


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## muziksculp (Mar 31, 2022)

jbuhler said:


> Really. Not everything is about you.


I find that an odd comment, and not very tasteful. 

Nothing I said implied that. All I said I don't use phrase libraries, if others like them then please go ahead, and enjoy using them. I really don't get your comment.


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## Casiquire (Mar 31, 2022)

I wonder if it's the age-old trick of of "sit everyone down together for the pictures and videos, then striping"


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## muziksculp (Mar 31, 2022)

Here is a *Sound On Sound* review of Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings in their March 2022 issue.

https://www.soundonsound.com/review...P_uGXVfOEnfYb3fFm1TbcZgikazSnzM5iVTWeO3R9Y7T0


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## [email protected] (Apr 1, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Here you go : My video showing the Pixelpoet Edit for Sonokinetic Orch. Strings Legato.
> 
> I should also add one more tip, I find setting the Legato Transition Level, and Smear to 75 produces good results.



Thank you very much for the video! I always run into some problems when I want to apply the Pixelpoet Trick so having videos dedicated to individual libraries is very helpful. I will try to apply it on the weekend to all instruments. Is there a reason why you also purged _sustain straight_ and only edited _espressivo_?


----------



## muziksculp (Apr 1, 2022)

[email protected] said:


> Thank you very much for the video! I always run into some problems when I want to apply the Pixelpoet Trick so having videos dedicated to individual libraries is very helpful. I will try to apply it on the weekend to all instruments. Is there a reason why you also purged _sustain straight_ and only edited _espressivo_?


You're very welcome. 



[email protected] said:


> Is there a reason why you also purged _sustain straight_ and only edited _espressivo_?


No, I just chose to apply it on the espressivo first, you surely can apply it to the straight version as well. I will do so as well.


----------



## mgaewsj (Apr 2, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> I should also add one more tip, I find setting the Legato Transition Level, and Smear to 75 produces good results.


👍 This makes a huge difference!
Using the default values it sounds horrible when CC#1 is > 70%


----------



## mgaewsj (Apr 2, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> You're very welcome.
> 
> 
> No, I just chose to apply it on the espressivo first, you surely can apply it to the straight version as well. I will do so as well.


can this be done on the same preset? (I mean having both espressivo and straight treated with the trick?)


----------



## muziksculp (Apr 2, 2022)

mgaewsj said:


> can this be done on the same preset? (I mean having both espressivo and straight treated with the trick?)


Yes.


----------



## muziksculp (Apr 2, 2022)

Hi @mgaewsj ,

I replied to your questions on the YouTube video. Hope that helps.

Cheers,
Muziksculp


----------



## mgaewsj (Apr 2, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Hi @mgaewsj ,
> 
> I replied to your questions on the YouTube video. Hope that helps.
> 
> ...


thanks!


----------



## odod (Jun 20, 2022)

anyone experiencing cpu hog using this library?


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## muziksculp (Jun 20, 2022)

odod said:


> anyone experiencing cpu hog using this library?


Hi @odod,

If I enable more than two mic options, playing the legato articulations. I get clicks in the audio, but my CPU meter is quite low, I'm not sure what's causing the clicks in the audio, so I try to limit the number of enable mics to two.

I would like to see this fixed by @Sonokinetic BV . It's quite annoying, not sure if it is their scripting, or something else, I feel the Legatos are not efficiently programmed when I have more than 2 mic options enabled. I get no clicks when playing the shorts using multiple mics.


----------



## odod (Jun 21, 2022)

muziksculp said:


> Hi @odod,
> 
> If I enable more than two mic options, playing the legato articulations. I get clicks in the audio, but my CPU meter is quite low, I'm not sure what's causing the clicks in the audio, so I try to limit the number of enable mics to two.
> 
> I would like to see this fixed by @Sonokinetic BV . It's quite annoying, not sure if it is their scripting, or something else, I feel the Legatos are not efficiently programmed when I have more than 2 mic options enabled. I get no clicks when playing the shorts using multiple mics.


I am only enabling one mic .. but using v1,v2,va,ce,ba, ... all soo heavy :( could not even playing and crashes


----------



## muziksculp (Jun 21, 2022)

odod said:


> I am only enabling one mic .. but using v1,v2,va,ce,ba, ... all soo heavy :( could not even playing and crashes


That's strange, I don't have this issue. 

Oh.. are you using one instance of Kontakt for each section of the strings ? or using them in one instance as a multi ? 

You might want to email their tech-support. They are very responsive, explain to them in detail what's happening, and your DAW, and computer Specs. Hopefully they can help you zero in on the cause of the issue, and I also wish they can improve the multi-mic clicks issue when using legato articulations.


----------



## odod (Jun 21, 2022)

i am using it as multi .. i am trying to contact them, but i don't know what receipt button is for? should i take a screenshot or send them my receipt?


----------



## muziksculp (Jun 21, 2022)

odod said:


> i am using it as multi .. i am trying to contact them, but i don't know what receipt button is for? should i take a screenshot or send them my receipt?


Why not try using one Kontakt instance for each section, and see how that goes. 

I don't remember the exact process of submitting a ticket to their support. I think you just login to your account, and select Submit a Ticket from their support page, fill in the contact form, describing your issue, I don't remember the receipt button, but you should receive an email confirming your support ticket.


----------



## odod (Jun 21, 2022)

ok i will try that alternative method now .. thanks for the suggestion, I will update soon


----------



## Trash Panda (Dec 5, 2022)

So right now (12/5/2022) this is on sale for about 36 more hours at an insane price of €99: https://www.sonokinetic.net/products/classical/orchestral-strings/

Tone and performance-wise it sounds great
Feature-wise (divisi, stack and morph, runs, phrases, etc.) it's up there or higher with the flagship libraries that cost many times more (Berlin, AudioBro, Spitfire Symphonic, etc.)
Sample depth seems to be among the heavyweights at 97 gigs compressed/300k+ samples
Seems to have the legato police stamp of approval
They provide Zlin Hall IRs to blend dry libraries from other vendors with these strings
The overall reaction in this thread is almost exclusively positive outside of a few minor bugs.

So why isn't everyone preaching from the mountaintops about this library like they do with CSS/Berlin/Spitfire/VSL?

Is it because Sonokinetic priced it too cheap to seem as premium as its peers?


----------



## Marko Cifer (Dec 5, 2022)

My guess is it's because of the more quirky, sometimes pretty opaque UI and workflow, it needs a bigger time investment to learn to play and program the library and some of its features are hidden so people don't realize everything it offers or how to do some of the things it can (unless they actually read the manual and/or watch the walkthroughs).

And judging from reading chat in another Discord when this library was talked about, some people are just afraid of its Sonokineticness (basically, the UI).

edit: Oh, and the first walkthrough videos were bugged/in mono, so I guess some people got a bad first impression and just wrote it off entirely.


----------



## Trash Panda (Dec 5, 2022)

Marko Cifer said:


> My guess is it's because of the more quirky, sometimes pretty opaque UI and workflow, it needs a bigger time investment to learn to play and program the library and some of its features are hidden so people don't realize everything it offers or how to do some of the things it can (unless they actually read the manual and/or watch the walkthroughs).
> 
> And judging from reading chat in another Discord when this library was talked about, some people are just afraid of its Sonokineticness (basically, the UI).
> 
> edit: Oh, and the first walkthrough videos were bugged/in mono, so I guess some people got a bad first impression and just wrote it off entirely.


So it's not a knock on the sound or capabilities, people just have a hard time with the workflow and convincing themselves it's not a bunch of loops?


----------



## dzilizzi (Dec 5, 2022)

Trash Panda said:


> So it's not a knock on the sound or capabilities, people just have a hard time with the workflow and convincing themselves it's not a bunch of loops?


Most people don't know they made a really lovely woodwind library either.


----------



## Henrik B. Jensen (Dec 5, 2022)

Trash Panda said:


> So right now (12/5/2022) this is on sale for about 36 more hours at an insane price of €99: https://www.sonokinetic.net/products/classical/orchestral-strings/
> 
> Tone and performance-wise it sounds great
> Feature-wise (divisi, stack and morph, runs, phrases, etc.) it's up there or higher with the flagship libraries that cost many times more (Berlin, AudioBro, Spitfire Symphonic, etc.)
> ...


I just finished watching Dirk's walkthrough: I absolutely love both the sound of this library and the room sound in it


----------



## Marko Cifer (Dec 5, 2022)

Trash Panda said:


> So it's not a knock on the sound or capabilities, people just have a hard time with the workflow and convincing themselves it's not a bunch of loops?


That's my guess. Aside from it just not being everyone's cup of tea, but that's self-evident.

I think the free version of Sordino strings might have backfired and pushed away a certain crowd purely from the perspective of the interface, I know of at least two instances of such a thing happening.

"I hate using Sordino strings, so I won't even consider getting SOS".

I remember it also took a while for the review videos to pop up, so a lot of people didn't want to invest without one of those, then just... might have forgotten about the library.


----------



## Marko Cifer (Dec 5, 2022)

dzilizzi said:


> Most people don't know they made a really lovely woodwind library either.


It's actually kind of funny because its interface feels like a beta version of the interface used by Sordino Strings and Orchestral Strings.

I do have that WW library, and while it can sound great, I have a bunch of technical issues with it and barely touch it now because of that.


----------



## MarcelM (Dec 5, 2022)

i will be honest, the interface is really a matter of taste and a new interface designer would be a start 

besides that, lovely tone. still watching and listening the videos.


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## Markrs (Dec 5, 2022)

To be honest if I hadn't just bought Audiobro MSS I probably would have got this, but at the same time MSS feels more feature packed


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## Jeremy Spencer (Dec 5, 2022)

Trash Panda said:


> So right now (12/5/2022) this is on sale for about 36 more hours at an insane price of €99: https://www.sonokinetic.net/products/classical/orchestral-strings/
> 
> Tone and performance-wise it sounds great
> Feature-wise (divisi, stack and morph, runs, phrases, etc.) it's up there or higher with the flagship libraries that cost many times more (Berlin, AudioBro, Spitfire Symphonic, etc.)
> ...


If it's anything like the Con Sordino Strings, I wouldn't even consider it. I appreciate the attempt by Sonokinetic (I own and love several products), but the CS strings are just plain awkward to use IMO...and the legatos are quite clunky.


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## Trash Panda (Dec 5, 2022)

Jeremy Spencer said:


> If it's anything like the Con Sordino Strings, I wouldn't even consider it. I appreciate the attempt by Sonokinetic (I own and love several products), but the CS strings are just plain awkward to use IMO...and the legatos are quite clunky.


For context, what about it is awkward to use? Are we talking hard to use it as a play-it-in library, a set up expression maps and draw it library? Trying to do anything whatsoever is about as tedious as wrangling Majestica into a line it doesn't want to do?


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## Marko Cifer (Dec 5, 2022)

Trash Panda said:


> For context, what about it is awkward to use? Are we talking hard to use it as a play-it-in library, a set up expression maps and draw it library? Trying to do anything whatsoever is about as tedious as wrangling Majestica into a line it doesn't want to do?


Let me give you an example that I think perfectly captures its "uniqueness".

You want to do a vanilla legato passage, with vibrato control. To do this, you don't select an articulation and just go ham. You stack the straight and expressive sustain articulations on top of each other, then use the Morph (it's just a cross-fade, really) function. It doesn't outright tell you it's Legato-capable (all the sustains have Legato capability IIRC, as well as the shorts if you use the sustain pedal, but this is stuff you need to learn from the manual and/or the walkthrough). You have to know how to stack articulations and cross-fade between them. 

Also, for best results, you need to dig into the menu and set the Legato controls (Smear & Transition Level) and in my experience you also need to automate both (each has its own CC set!) for best results, because one passage where both are set higher will work great, but the next passage won't.

Oh, and the Portamento feature? It's set to be very, very subtle unless you expose the transition sample a bit more. So you might see "Portamento" in the settings but not hear it.

One other thing would be how it does keyswitching. You don't have a set key per articulation, instead you have to first select the Articulation Group, then you select the Articulation from that group. Which, honestly, takes like a minute or two to grasp (especially because all sections have all the articulations, which I absolutely love - no thinking about what is available to me and what isn't, it's amazingly uniform), but might throw someone off.


Or even another example - does this look like a button to open the mixer to you:






So, yeah. _It has a learning curve._

But once you do invest the time to learn its quirks I do think it's worth it for the results you can get, even though sometimes you hit a wall, or have to fiddle around with memory management (I wrote up about that in the Sale thread - due to some technical things being done in the background, memory consumption can seem weird).


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## Jeremy Spencer (Dec 5, 2022)

Marko Cifer said:


> Let me give you an example that I think perfectly captures its "uniqueness".
> 
> You want to do a vanilla legato passage, with vibrato control. To do this, you don't select an articulation and just go ham. You stack the straight and expressive sustain articulations on top of each other, then use the Morph (it's just a cross-fade, really) function. It doesn't outright tell you it's Legato-capable (all the sustains have Legato capability IIRC, as well as the shorts if you use the sustain pedal, but this is stuff you need to learn from the manual and/or the walkthrough). You have to know how to stack articulations and cross-fade between them.
> 
> ...


Nailed it!


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## Evans (Dec 5, 2022)

Marko Cifer said:


> for best results, you need to dig into the menu and set the Legato controls (Smear & Transition Level) and in my experience you also need to automate both (each has its own CC set!) for best results, because one passage where both are set higher will work great, but the next passage won't.


I hear you, but this also kinda reads like, "It can do multiple types of passages, because it gives you two controls that let you dial into each performance need."

EDIT: Only commenting this because it _feels _like the default interpretation is that this is a negative (though you were fair in your post).


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## Marko Cifer (Dec 5, 2022)

Evans said:


> I hear you, but this also kinda reads like, "It can do multiple types of passages, because it gives you two controls that let you dial into each performance need."


Exactly, that's the thing - something being set up awkwardly at first glance can actually result in a lot of control over things you otherwise wouldn't have control over, or if we look at the ability to stack articulations and cross-fade between them - sure it's clunky for vibrato control setup, but it also pushes you into trying to cross-fade between combinations you wouldn't think of otherwise!


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## Obi-Wan Spaghetti (Dec 5, 2022)

Evans said:


> I hear you, but this also kinda reads like, "It can do multiple types of passages, because it gives you two controls that let you dial into each performance need."
> 
> EDIT: Only commenting this because it _feels _like the default interpretation is that this is a negative (though you were fair in your post).


And that's something i wish more devellopers would do. What Sonokitetic should do imo is make a second patch they could call easy patch or live patch where you have a MW legato with marcato overlay when you hit the key hard and a couple of keyswitch for staccato etc. Something like that. That way everyone is happy.


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## MelodicAdagio (Dec 5, 2022)

Trash Panda said:


> So right now (12/5/2022) this is on sale for about 36 more hours at an insane price of €99: https://www.sonokinetic.net/products/classical/orchestral-strings/
> 
> Tone and performance-wise it sounds great
> Feature-wise (divisi, stack and morph, runs, phrases, etc.) it's up there or higher with the flagship libraries that cost many times more (Berlin, AudioBro, Spitfire Symphonic, etc.)
> ...


I've had this library for a while and use it occasionally, so it's definitely not my go-to. The UI isn't the greatest and it takes some time to learn how to use all the features. I'll admit that there are a few things it can do that I haven't even explored because how to do them is not always real evident and I haven't devoted enough research time to figure out some of the more obscure things. But I was able to make it do what I wanted to do, so I've been satisfied from that perspective.

Overall it is a nice sounding library, though not always the sound I'm looking for. Because of the divisi sections, it sits in my template, and if I need divisi strings, I almost invariably reach for this and have gotten some lovely results with it. I've also paired it with other string libraries to good effect.

One time not long after its release I had an issue. I don't even remember what it was but support responded quickly and addressed my problem. So at a good price it could be worthwhile picking up. But it probably won't end up being your flagship string library.


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## mussnig (Dec 5, 2022)

I've got the CS Strings as a freebie last year. Found the GUI and settings sometimes a bit too cumbersome to use but I think in general the features are great. But most of all, I personally don't really like the sound of most Sonokinetic strings. I really tried to like them especially after reading so many positive things but it just doesn't click with me.

I also have Ostinato Strings and used them once. Had a very hard time mixing them together with my other stuff. I'm sure some strong EQ cuts would have helped but my skills are not good enough to determine where to make them. And unfortunately it's basically the only library where I have this problem (at least everything else I can mix and match together good enough for my ears). And unfortunately I can hear the same things I didn't like in the Ostinato Strings in their Orchestral Strings ...


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## Robert_G (Dec 5, 2022)

As others have said....even at $99....the amount of time needed to use these strings will eat away at any savings you'll get. Here in 2022 when you have Cinematic Studios and Synchron Player that are so efficient at workflow and UI....why would I put myself through that?


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## Marko Cifer (Dec 5, 2022)

Here's some more thoughts on the library, outside of the UI / technical stuff:

I've written about it before in this very thread, but to me, this library feels like glue which you can stick other libraries on top of. It feels very, how do I put it... not obtrusive to other tones and timbres via layering with other stuff. The room just doesn't seem to clash too much and the tone is natural and neutral enough to my ears that it seems to be willing to take on quirks of other libraries without distorting too much or sounding weird (at least to me).
After a bunch of experimenting with long/legato patch layering I did end up trying layering various shorts on top of the available ones in this library, and I feel it does work quite well. The shorts in SOS, to me, feel snappy enough, well playable and orderly but not too robotic or surgical (there is some variation baked into the RRs - to me it feels like just the right amount of humanization). For someone used to the almost precision timings of Areia and similar libraries it might feel a bit random but not overwhelmingly so. I quite like the shorts.
One of my favourite ways of using SOS is to put a couple of soloists or a smaller chamber-ish ensemble on top of it. I've played around with adding LCO, Alternative Solo, AI's Solo, the Cremona Quartett, etc... It's not exactly an attempt at a first chair like setup, it's more like because SOS is so reserved and can be bit remote-sounding on Decca, it acts as great support while leaving room for other players which sit in front of it.
I feel like the Violins and Violas is where this library shines at. The Cellos and Basses aren't quite as solid, but I still like them. Usually I expect a bit more bite out of the latter two, so I usually feel like I have to supplement something on top.
Because they added release sample volume controls, you can duck the room a bit and your own reverb will stick better to the library without it feeling too overwhelmingly room-y. Very useful if you're trying to match it to something else.
Lately I've been experimenting with using the room tone of SOS and the close mics of MSS to add some sharpness, definition, bite and proximity to the former. It's kind of funny - the nature of the shorts in MSS and SOS are actually rather similar in how they were performed, so they work quite well together. I generally like the combination so far, but I have to tweak and experiment some more. Adding SOS's own close mics and using the tonal slider also helps, sure, but I feel like if you want to bring out even more aggression out of SOS, you need to use external help.
I do think this is an awesome and underappreciated library. But I also think that it takes time, effort, experimentation and a certain willingness to put up with its quirks to fully utilize and appreciate it. It's probably not for someone who needs easy feature-and-capability readability, ease-of-use and can't afford to spend the time to learn how to use its features and UI by studying its manual, because otherwise they wouldn't know about some pretty damn important features of it.

I'd rather be open about its more stinky qualities (to some people) than to have them impulse-buy it because it's cheap and then realize they hate using it.

For the people who aren't turned off by the UI and workflow, I do think it's a worthwhile investment and an invitation to experiment. Especially now when it's discounted by so much. For me it was one of my best library purchases for how much I got out of them.


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## carlc (Dec 5, 2022)

Trash Panda said:


> For context, what about it is awkward to use? Are we talking hard to use it as a play-it-in library, a set up expression maps and draw it library? Trying to do anything whatsoever is about as tedious as wrangling Majestica into a line it doesn't want to do?





Marko Cifer said:


> ...
> One other thing would be how it does keyswitching. You don't have a set key per articulation, instead you have to first select the Articulation Group, then you select the Articulation from that group. Which, honestly, takes like a minute or two to grasp (especially because all sections have all the articulations, which I absolutely love - no thinking about what is available to me and what isn't, it's amazingly uniform), but might throw someone off.
> ...


This was it for me as well. I purchased several Sonokinetic libraries after hearing the demos. The sound is fantastic, and the UIs do look visually appealing until you try and use them. The multi-level grouping of articulations and sectioning of the UIs was confusing, and I had to reread the manual every time to recall how it worked. They now collect virtual dust on my SSD, but I have told myself that someday I will study the manuals and truly learn the workflow. Someday.


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## Marko Cifer (Dec 5, 2022)

carlc said:


> The multi-level grouping of articulations and sectioning of the UIs was confusing, and I had to reread the manual every time to recall how it worked. They now collect virtual dust on my SSD, but I have told myself that someday I will study the manuals and truly learn the workflow. Someday.


I do think the Articulation Switching system is one of the lesser sins it does UX-wise, and actually like it, but I fully understand why some don't - when you're actually working and inputting data/playing, I can see it being cumbersome, especially if you're used to a more simpler keyswitching system from pretty much any other library.

But just to point it out to future owners - the tooltips actually tell you what the keys do when you hover over the keyswitches. I'm not sure if it always did that, but at least in version 1.3 it does. White keys are for group switching, black keys are for articulations.










So that does help with remembering at least this aspect of the library.

edit: I just checked in their Woodwinds library, which has a similar UI (feels like a Beta version of this one). The tooltips over there tell you about the Articulation Groups, but not the articulations.


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## NekujaK (Dec 5, 2022)

I really like Sonokinetic's libraries and their overall aesthetic, but I must admit, disappontingly, that both the Orch Strings and Woodwinds are rather cumbersome to use - for all the reasons already stated in this thread.

These libraries are loaded with articulations and useful options to craft a performance, but it's at the expense of usability and approachability.

Also, there are no ensemble patches, which is another barrier to usability. I realize many folks scoff at ensemble patches, but they are useful in many situations, especially sketching. I feel if I were able to noodle around with an ensemble patch, I'd get to know this library much better and more quickly.

I think it's still a steal at $99, but it's not a must buy, especially in such a crowded category with so many other great choices out there.


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## Mistro (Dec 5, 2022)

I don't know if it's just me, but what gives me pause using SOS is the volume out the box. It's been reported from day one and they said they will look into it. I can barely hear it compared to everything else when loaded up. I found myself putting a limiter on it last time I used it. Did I miss an update?

Also was hoping for that ensemble patch they also said they would look into.

If it makes anyone feel better, last year we got it at $199 intro price. You're getting it $100 cheaper this year so there's that. It sounds good too.


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## rrichard63 (Dec 5, 2022)

NekujaK said:


> there are no ensemble patches, which is another barrier to usability.





Mistro said:


> Also was hoping for that ensemble patch they also said they would look into.


If I recall correctly, they said there would (someday) be an Strings Ensembles library as a separate product.


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## markleake (Dec 5, 2022)

I'll echo some of the statements above. I really do like Sonokinetic products, but I think they've failed a bit with this one for these reasons:

*Bugs.* One of these is a deal breaker, where you can't play normal longs (no legato) without it glitching when changing notes. Wot!!?? 

*Hard to use - microphones.* I could never get past just the mic setup interface. I think I know what they were going for, but man... just give me an interface that turns off all the stupid processing that messes up the sound, and has a simple slider for each mic volume. Even if they release a separate patch just for this, it would improve the experience significantly. Please Sonokinetic!!
*Hard to use - longs/legatos/keyswitching.* Like others have said, this really breaks the experience from what we are used to in other top-tier string products. Switching between articulations, and the issues with the legato switching / GUI, legato bugs, etc... it really is a blocker that slows you down a lot.
*Sound.* It does have a nice sound, but not without problems. I think the blending of the half sections makes it lose a lot of definition (they even say they deliberately de-tune the sections a bit to make this effect, and I'm still not sure it really works overall though). And then because the mic page is so hard to use, you can't easily address it. Plus I'd agree it lacks a bit of body/fullness to the sound, which I put down to them sampling half sections. Plus the processing they add I think degrades the sound also, IMO.
These are issues I think Sonokinetic can fix (some more than others). But it's been pretty much radio silence from them. They initially seemed to listen to feedback, but then just... nothing. A lot of common feedback from people that they just haven't addressed at all, bugs and annoying decisions are still there (although I admittedly have moved on, so maybe they are fixed now).

I prefer their woodwinds library over the strings. That to me is the real sleeper library. Still some of the same issues (including having teeny tiny sliders for mics, which is unforgivable from a UI point of view), but great sound and large number of articulations. Not always very consistent, but still love it.


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## bfreepro (Dec 5, 2022)

Trash Panda said:


> So right now (12/5/2022) this is on sale for about 36 more hours at an insane price of €99: https://www.sonokinetic.net/products/classical/orchestral-strings/
> 
> Tone and performance-wise it sounds great
> Feature-wise (divisi, stack and morph, runs, phrases, etc.) it's up there or higher with the flagship libraries that cost many times more (Berlin, AudioBro, Spitfire Symphonic, etc.)
> ...


Edit: apologies in advance, I’m gonna get into some basic psychology here because I’m a nerd and this is the kind of things that fascinate me 😂

_*TL;DR: Public image, cluttered market, and the fact most people who really buy this stuff already have their needs covered elsewhere, that’s my hypothesis. SOS is just not as good in todays market as it could have been.*_ I’ll also mention, the official thread, there were a LOT of people singing its praises. Sonokinetic was super active on this thread. They replied to a significant number of user comments. Even if people deny it, it’s simply impossible to overlook, at least the idea, that some people may not have pointed out negative things because the Sonokinetic account was incredible kind, helpful, and responsive. It’s MUCH easier to pick apart a massive company like spitfire and orchestral tools. They have reps here who act like reps- a bit robotic and soulless (not an insult, just observation). The Sonokinetic account replied as a real human being, someone who could be a friend as opposed to more corporate-style of answering questions. Add to that they, as a company, don’t normally focus on deep sampled libraries like this, and this is their first actual strings library-I believe people were not as critical as they would be if this was released by a different company.


I think some of this also really has to do with the listed libraries being a product of their times-

CSS- easier to use, literally almost no fuss. It rode a wave- cheaper than the rest and sounded better out of the box. It shook things up when it was released IMO. It didn’t break the bank or offer too many articulations that some will never use. Simplified and consistent.

Spitfire and Berlin- stood the test of time and offer significantly more content, probably among the top 3 for list of techniques and articulations. Easier to pick up and play than VSL. These came out and had that orchestral hall sound baked in… and they sounded much better and more expressive than VSL or EWSO right out of the box.

VSL- for a while this was literally all you could get for realistic samples. I like some of their stuff but now they’ve been easily bested when it comes to strings IMO.

The thing is, these were all sort of pioneering libraries. They didn’t just release into a mass of strings, like we have now. They are always going to be icons in the eyes of many, and for good reason. It just has a snowball effect and also, groupthink is very real and active in the somewhat small and niche market of composing with samples. Regardless of what is released after, these will be the standards they’re compared to for a very long time.

Memories and initial perception are incredibly powerful, even if the facts behind these memories no longer apply or remain as strong, the feelings do. Brand longevity and visibility is a massive influence.

Sonokinetic Orchestral Strings is not bad. If it released maybe 5 years ago, it would be much better received. An orchestral string library with auto divisi?? Sign me up!

Compared to todays market- it’s limited with articulations, features, and workflow. Modern Scoring Strings broke new ground with its auto divisi function, even though others did this in the past, it made it so simple and smooth, and also included a ridiculous amount of articulations and content. People who appreciate the older VSL philosophy (complete control and the most comprehensive collection, but takes much more work to program and learn) would choose this I believe. Therefor, in order for SOS to REALLY shine, the one highly sought after, unique and high-tech feature they touted (auto divisi) would have to do better than the competition: and it didn’t. Again, not bad. But not the best.

People who prefer the other philosophy/spectrum of sampling - something that sounds incredibly realistic right out of the box but offer much less control and possibly less articulations- would lean to something like Performance samples, spitfire appasionata, etc.

The people who don’t spend a lot on samples and already bought CSS probably don’t want anything new. I see all the time people need to fill a gap with strings, then they buy CSS, and they’re good. Often for a very long time.

Add to this, Sonokinetic is simply not on the same level of prestige as those others you mentioned. I’m not saying it’s right or wrong, it’s just simply undeniable. I’ve seen, honestly, COUNTLESS comments from people who just will never consider using a phrase library. Orchestral Strings is not a phrase library. It’s not bad either, not at all. But in the back of all of our minds, Sonokinetic makes phrase libraries. This is undeniable. People who maybe own a few sample libraries and are getting into it, probably at some point saw a Sonokinetic add on social media , or even a thread on this very forum, and the comments were filled with “nope sorry I write my own music I don’t use phrases!” Or “real composers don’t need to use phrases, pass!” Even if there’s a plethora of other, positive comments, stuff like this is powerful. I think this is even more powerful than just saying it doesn’t sound good: we can listen with our ears to see if it sounds good. But the initial, overly simplified idea that some may take away from this interaction: the perceived opinion that “ real composers don’t use libraries form this company”, well… that’s powerful. No matter how absurd and false it may be… there’s always a little bit of initial shame and fear to go against the public perception, especially for someone new to the craft. Add to that- that’s their first impression of the company… well, it’s hard to shake.

Add these all together and it starts to make more sense, for me, at least. It’s a good sounding library that functions just fine in a sea of outstanding sounding libraries that function either much more easily, or with more depth and precision.


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## markleake (Dec 5, 2022)

bfreepro said:


> Edit: apologies in advance, I’m gonna get into some basic psychology here because I’m a nerd and this is the kind of things that fascinate me 😂
> 
> _*TL;DR: Public image, cluttered market, and the fact most people who really buy this stuff already have their needs covered elsewhere, that’s my hypothesis. SOS is just not as good in todays market as it could have been.*_ I’ll also mention, the official thread, there were a LOT of people singing its praises. Sonokinetic is super active on this forum. They replied to a significant number of user comments. Even if people deny it, it’s simply impossible to overlook, at least the idea, that some people may not have pointed out negative things because the Sonokinetic account was incredible kind, helpful, and responsive. It’s MUCH easier to pick apart a massive company like spitfire and orchestral tools. They have reps here who act like reps- a bit robotic and soulless (not an insult, just observation). The Sonokinetic account replied as a real human being, someone who could be a friend as opposed to more corporate-style of answering questions. Add to that they, as a company, don’t normally focus on deep sampled libraries like this, and this is their first actual strings library-I believe people were not as critical as they would be if this was released by a different company.
> 
> ...


You make some great points. Only thing I'd point out is VSL do have good string libraries. There is Synchron Strings Pro, and they are great. Easy to use, one of the best players IMO, lots of articulations, works better in some situations than a few other brands you metioned.


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## Jrides (Dec 5, 2022)

bfreepro said:


> Edit: apologies in advance, I’m gonna get into some basic psychology here because I’m a nerd and this is the kind of things that fascinate me 😂
> 
> _*TL;DR: Public image, cluttered market, and the fact most people who really buy this stuff already have their needs covered elsewhere, that’s my hypothesis. SOS is just not as good in todays market as it could have been.*_ I’ll also mention, the official thread, there were a LOT of people singing its praises. Sonokinetic was super active on this thread. They replied to a significant number of user comments. Even if people deny it, it’s simply impossible to overlook, at least the idea, that some people may not have pointed out negative things because the Sonokinetic account was incredible kind, helpful, and responsive. It’s MUCH easier to pick apart a massive company like spitfire and orchestral tools. They have reps here who act like reps- a bit robotic and soulless (not an insult, just observation). The Sonokinetic account replied as a real human being, someone who could be a friend as opposed to more corporate-style of answering questions. Add to that they, as a company, don’t normally focus on deep sampled libraries like this, and this is their first actual strings library-I believe people were not as critical as they would be if this was released by a different company.
> 
> ...


Well put. I guess I will have to pass on this one.


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## Flyo (Dec 5, 2022)

The Mic setting for levels and placement field is a step back really. Even any numbers are there to inform you how much are you tweaking, or for reach same exact settings for other section?

Undeniable... it is hard to approach for work it. The concept it is good, but seems unfinished there. 
I guess you could get all the mic levels with fader under the Kontakt player console?


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## woafmann (Dec 5, 2022)

Just pulled the trigger on SOS.

For ensemble/section strings, I already have HOO Diamond, De Capo, Sonokinetic's Ostinato strings, several VSL libs, "The Orchestra" and some Spitfire string texture libs, as well as some others I can't remember.

Do I need another strings library? Probably not, but the sound of SOS is just so enhanting. I think it's really beautiful.


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## jbuhler (Dec 5, 2022)

I loaded SKOS today for the first time in awhile, and I liked the sound quite a lot, more than I remember. It's a big ensemble but not too sluggish, and not dull like I remember it. Using Logic and Babylon Waves articulation sets, it's been relatively easy to put a simple track together. The UI is still far from ideal, but with articulation sets you can avoid much of that. I forgot that the library defaults to 442 tuning, so once I put that back to 440, it sat better with my other libraries. 

As noted above the legato can be wonky. Sometimes the polylegato doesn't engage when playing at the keyboard, and that causes issues. But playing back midi from a track didn't generate any miscues, so long as I was careful to properly overlap and such. But the legato itself often seems inaudible, even after you go into the details and adjust it. I can't for the life of me get it to sound like portamento, even when I set it to portamento, unless I also set the legato to monophonic. Indeed, the legato transitions often sound almost absent, even when I set the transition at 100%. 

I didn't get much into the full capabilities of the library today, things like runs and such. And I've still not mastered the phrases engine. I'm also still working with 1.2 because last time I updated from Native Access I had to completely rebuild the instrument.


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## odod (Dec 5, 2022)

I have this one, but it's a cpu hog for my old machine


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## mussnig (Dec 5, 2022)

markleake said:


> I'll echo some of the statements above. I really do like Sonokinetic products, but I think they've failed a bit with this one for these reasons:
> 
> *Bugs.* One of these is a deal breaker, where you can't play normal longs (no legato) without it glitching when changing notes. Wot!!??
> 
> ...


Completely forgot about the mic situation. I really appreciate what they did - I think it can be fun to mess around and for some people with less experience or who don't want to use external processing, the GUI and options are for sure helpful.
But for people who want more/precise control it would have been nice to have an option to switch to a more standard mic mixer. I remember I found it quite tedious if I just wanted to adjust the mic levels - I always needed to pay attention not to pan anything by accident.


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## Marko Cifer (Dec 6, 2022)

By the way, going back to Keyswitching in this one, I completely forgot that there's actually a secondary workflow for that, which ignores Groups. From the manual:



> SWITCH ARTICULATION BY VELOCITY
> 
> There is a way to switch articulations with a single key, mostly useful for sequencing purposes and to use the different ways you can visualise articulation switching in DAWs. The key for this is midi key 0 or C-2


Then you have a list of articulations and the required velocity level to trigger a switch to it.

I probably forgot about it because while it does eliminate the need to use two keyswitches, it felt like I'd need a cheat-sheet with the velocity list at all times, even though the list just follows the articulation layout in the library and just adds +1 when it moves to the next one (and you have to skip a blank field).

edit: Made a quick image which illustrates the values.


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## bfreepro (Dec 6, 2022)

markleake said:


> You make some great points. Only thing I'd point out is VSL do have good string libraries. There is Synchron Strings Pro, and they are great. Easy to use, one of the best players IMO, lots of articulations, works better in some situations than a few other brands you metioned.


Yes I agree and I guess I should've phrased that differently, I didn't mean to imply they aren't good. I personally am not the biggest fan of the overall tone of their recent string libraries but they are not bad by any means, they have great flexibility and are easy to use and the Synchron player is amazing. (I had both Synchron strings pro and elite strings and sold them simply due to the overall sound signature causing me to reach for others over them in many cases)


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## Living Fossil (Dec 6, 2022)

Marko Cifer said:


> I do think this is an awesome and underappreciated library. But I also think that it takes time, effort, experimentation and a certain willingness to put up with its quirks to fully utilize and appreciate it.


Thanks you (and other contributors) very much for your detailed answers!

I guess I will pass on this library, even if the prize makes it almost a freebie.

But things like "pattern generators" or that "scale/run creator" in combination with lots of crossfading stuff etc. are diametrically opposed to my way of thinking and so I guess working with this library would probably upset me...
[if i need a run, I want to play the notes. If i need a "phrase" I will record it by playing it)

(2 or 3 years ago I bought Sonokinetic's "Ostinato". I openend it in one project, played around with it a bit. Lost interest after 5 minutes. Didn't continue that track for months. Finally I realized what I had to do: I opened the project and removed "Ostinato". Afterwards it was a blast finishing that track.
But I guess it's important avoid stuff that blocks me.
A pricey plugin isn't one that costs much, but one that hinders me to get things done.


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Dec 6, 2022)

Having just bought this and played with it for a bit, I don't think I'm gonna use it much tbh. The sound, the interface...it's not my cup of tea.


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## Jrides (Dec 6, 2022)

I thought perhaps at the price the phrase builder might be fun to play around with. However, this things sounds like kind of a nightmare. The portamento issues alone SMH. Just a number of things that I shouldn’t have to tweak right out of the box, it seems. A shame really. But now it makes sense why they are giving it away at this price point. It sounds like instead of maybe one day trying to fix all the stuff, they might be better off just redoing the engine from scratch.

I would be surprised if the bigger issues in this library ever gets fixed.


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## Loïc D (Dec 6, 2022)

I did the keyswitching by CC and it works (this is the way I’m always working since I’ve based my original template & control surface on Spitfire UACC).

Ok it works but… I found no way to select 2 arts at the same time and crossfade them.
I’m using SOS only for layering, it’s definitely not a bread&butter lib because of the workflow behind it.

Quite the opposite of a library like TSS.


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## Remnant (Dec 6, 2022)

For me it is just all about the sound, and I love the sound of these and Zlin. There is certainly a learning curve to dialing in the legato settings (and the pixel poet trick under the hood), determining when to use auto divisi or the different band sizes, some mic adjusting, reverb, etc., but I feel like I am better for having spent the time doing it. It did two things for me: (1) really made me learn the library and (2) made me feel like I had something that was really my own. And strangely, I really like the interface. I think the color scheme just relaxes me. And once I was there, it all just lives in my template and while there is some tweaking from project to project, really not much at all. I just call it up and play it.


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## Flyo (Dec 6, 2022)

I contact support and they told that their will continue to update the Strings, but don’t have right now a release time frame.

I really hope they adopt some more traditional way in Mic page settings, besides that they give you additional control of sound field (advantage) but for me it is not well implement if there are any number indicator on any control! This terrifying me, I cannot see how could I work with it. That is the most let down side, and the fixed parameters for Keyswitches. 
I’m still on the fence to get it or just pass and wait future updates and if they implements all this. 😅

Edit I guess I will just get it jaja


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## jbuhler (Dec 6, 2022)

Marko Cifer said:


> By the way, going back to Keyswitching in this one, I completely forgot that there's actually a secondary workflow for that, which ignores Groups. From the manual:
> 
> 
> Then you have a list of articulations and the required velocity level to trigger a switch to it.
> ...


I wish they’d included the divisi switches in this as well as turning off legato for straight sustains. I know there are other keyswitches for divisi options and for legato options, but there doesn’t seem to be a keyswitch for turning the legato off.


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## AllanH (Dec 6, 2022)

I really like the sound/tone of the Sonokinetic Orch Strings. I've used it on several tracks and it has sweet melodic tone that fits what I write. I find the articulation set good and I only really have a few things I wish were different:

* I would have preferred that vibrato/non-vib was offered via e.g. CC2 or CC21 in a unified Legato patch
* The Morph feature seems unnecessarily CPU intensive on my system
* The microphone setup is seemingly very interesting and flexible but (imo) easily muddies the sound. My guess is that whatever algorithm they use for panning/widening and microphone placement does not adjust signal phase and delay. I just leave the microphones "as is" and it sounds good.

I realize I wrote more words about what I don't like vs. what I like, but overall I am very positive on the library.

If Sonokinetic releases a brass library recorded in the same hall, I'll likely get it.


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## holywilly (Dec 7, 2022)

Just purchased and downloaded this library. I found the two notes (Eb1 and E1) from Contrabass' pizzicato produced stutter sound. I have updated the library to version 1.3.0 (2022-05-18). Does anyone here encounter this issue?


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## Remnant (Dec 8, 2022)

AllanH said:


> I really like the sound/tone of the Sonokinetic Orch Strings. I've used it on several tracks and it has sweet melodic tone that fits what I write. I find the articulation set good and I only really have a few things I wish were different:
> 
> * I would have preferred that vibrato/non-vib was offered via e.g. CC2 or CC21 in a unified Legato patch
> * The Morph feature seems unnecessarily CPU intensive on my system
> ...


I mostly stick with close and decca mics since it can get a bit washy once you start adding external reverbs. Note the decca default is artificially widened and to my ears is much improved if you undo the artificial widening. I also love the tone of this library.


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## Nando Florestan (Dec 30, 2022)

@Sonokinetic BV 

There are 2 main problems with the Sordino strings (and the main Strings too) that are hurting my workflow:

1. The script loads all the samples whenever my project is loaded. It won't let me work purged. Please let me work purged!

2. The script resets the patch volume to -1.3. Therefore I cannot set my own volume. If every developer did this, the user would lose the ability to have 2 different libraries in the same Kontakt instance and set their volumes. And this is exactly what I do: I save some RAM (and maybe CPU) by having 2 or 3 libraries in the same Kontakt instance, especially when I know they won't play at the same time.

Both Kontakt features are for the user to set, not the developer. Please stop doing these things in the script!

Is v1.2 the latest for the Sordino Strings?


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## Nando Florestan (Jan 2, 2023)

I've just decided to drop Sonokinetic Sordino from my template due to quite a few unrelated headaches:

- Voicing bugs. In violins 1, close mic, the F at the top of G clef is almost missing.
- Too heavy on RAM; purge is only temporary, resets on project load.
- I can set the patch volume but when I reload the project it gets overwritten, causing problems when I return to a project.
- Cumbersome UI, unnecessarily large and imprecise.
- Thin but stereo-hyped sound; actually prefer fake sordini from a couple of other libraries, even though I was impressed by the sound when I bought it.
- I don't feel I am being heard by the developer. Some of these complaints can have a birthday soon.


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