# Pop Film?



## Dan Mott (Feb 16, 2011)

So, (work in progress) I decided I wanted a pop structure (verse chorus blah bah) but have a filmy epic feel to it and ofcourse have those dynamics!. Just imagine it with lyrics which i will add to make it more poppy and i still need to create a bridge to the final outro. So I hope u like.

http://soundcloud.com/destaana/hmm-cool-1


The name is strange, but I didn't know what to call it so. I thought it was kinda cool.


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## Dan Mott (Feb 16, 2011)

87 people listened and didnt like it  oh well....


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## Dan Mott (Feb 17, 2011)

still don't know what to think from ther listner point of view. I mean... 175 people listen.. 2 people comment. Not sure if it's good or... Maybe people just don't like this sort of style.

Either way it's ok. I'm hoping I'll get some more comments when it's fully done.

I'm learning alot from doing this project.


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## bryla (Feb 18, 2011)

Just give people a chance to see your threads and time to respond - just like the other thread you recently started.


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## Dan Mott (Feb 19, 2011)

bryla @ Sat Feb 19 said:


> Just give people a chance to see your threads and time to respond - just like the other thread you recently started.





Yes thanks I'll do that.

You come here though to comment on the track and since you just came here to say that and ignore the track then I'd say that's kind of rude. Just saying.


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## Ed (Feb 19, 2011)

I can't listen as the tracks gone, but the Song About Joss was LMAO, didn't expect that
http://soundcloud.com/destaana/haha :lol:


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## Dan Mott (Feb 19, 2011)

http://soundcloud.com/destaana/pop-film

Here you go guys, I re-uploaded it. So feel free to listen.

Ed -  hehe.


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## Ed (Feb 19, 2011)

Hey Dan, I really like it!

My criticism is I felt the bass the starts at the beginning was weak yet could really give the track more impact. Either needs to be louder or maybe run through an amp sim of some kind that can beef up those low frequencies. I would also try something with the drums to "phatten" them up. Mainly its the bass though. Otherwise really nice!

I feel in the right advert it would work really well, obviously the arrangement would be different but the idea is solid to me. Stuff like this seems to be quite popular in ads, the kind of half pop song format without vocals sound if that makes sense.

Anyway blah blah stream of consciousness


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## Dan Mott (Feb 19, 2011)

Ed @ Sun Feb 20 said:


> Hey Dan, I really like it!
> 
> My criticism is I felt the bass the starts at the beginning was weak yet could really give the track more impact. Either needs to be louder or maybe run through an amp sim of some kind that can beef up those low frequencies. I would also try something with the drums to "phatten" them up. Mainly its the bass though. Otherwise really nice!
> 
> ...




Ahh, thanks so much Ed. This is exactly what I needed. 

A couple of questions.

The drums could be fatter - Do you mean during the verses, or the chorus bit??

Weak bass - I agree and I'm going to try and play around and see what I can do.

Thanks!


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## Ed (Feb 20, 2011)

Dan-Jay @ Sat Feb 19 said:


> Ahh, thanks so much Ed. This is exactly what I needed.
> 
> A couple of questions.
> 
> ...



I think anything you could do to fatten it all up would be good, this is kind of my problem as well. With orchestral even hybrid stuff it doesn't matter quite as much but once you start getting into more "pop" styles I think making sure its "produced" is quite important as it seems more noticeable. Like people everywhere knows what pop or rock music sounds like so if you make a guitar track people will be a lot more critical than if you made an orchestral track (my experience anyway)

I guess all the drums could be fatter, maybe try compression? But maybe not, maybe some other kinds of fattening plugins might be a good thing to check, maybe check EQ as well? This is just my ideas of course, if it sounds wrong to you don't keep it sounding wrong. I would suggest work on the bass sound first that starts at about 5 seconds and (presumably) goes throughout and then maybe check your EQ's to make stuff cut through a bit more, then check compression and see if there's anything else you can do.


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## Dan Mott (Feb 20, 2011)

Ed @ Mon Feb 21 said:


> Dan-Jay @ Sat Feb 19 said:
> 
> 
> > Ahh, thanks so much Ed. This is exactly what I needed.
> ...




Ed, what do you think of this mix compared to the last? Do you think the bass is too loud this time, or??? http://soundcloud.com/destaana/mix-2


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## Jem7 (Feb 21, 2011)

Bass is ok I guess but strings are not bright enough.


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## Dan Mott (Feb 21, 2011)

Jem7 @ Mon Feb 21 said:


> Bass is ok I guess but strings are not bright enough.



The strings aren't bright enough? Gosh.... So I pretty much need to boost high end on everything because it seems that everything is bright enough?

I'm trying to go for an unprossesed sound more so because EQ just starts to ruin things, but I guess I do need to EQ.

Ah... I'm getting so sick of this track now


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## Jem7 (Feb 21, 2011)

Well EQ doesn't make it sound processed alone. What I hear is not well mixed track than an unprocessed sound. Overusing of EQ can be make things sound worse.


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## Dan Mott (Feb 21, 2011)

Jem7 @ Mon Feb 21 said:


> Well EQ doesn't make it sound processed alone. What I hear is not well mixed track than an unprocessed sound. Overusing of EQ can be make things sound worse.



Could you please tell me why it's not well mixed and the reasons for it so I can work out what I'm doing wrong?? This would help alot!


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## Dan Mott (Feb 21, 2011)

Oh and I'm not being sarcastic or anything if you think I am, I just need to learn how to mix well. If anybody could put in some input on this, would be great.


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## Jem7 (Feb 21, 2011)

Because basically it doesn't sounds like it's finished. In the mix every instrument should compliment each other. When you have that bright bell kinda instrument in front of strings. It makes you to think like they are not bright enough to compared the whole mix. Also I tend to like more bright stuff than usual.
If you like to put the tracks in wav format for that 50 second. I can make a mix for you and you can compare it with yours.


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## Ed (Feb 21, 2011)

I don't agree with Jem7 I think its nearly there mix wise. Sure you can make it more produced than that which is probably what he is thinking but it seems perfectly fine to me in most regards.

Just work on the bass sound and try and maybe EQ out frequencies in some instruments that don't need to be there.

Or just move on and learn from it for next time


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## TheUnfinished (Feb 21, 2011)

The overall sound of it (and instrument choices) give a good feel for a melding of film soundtrack and pop song to me - like a soundtrack specific mix of an existing song, if that makes sense? Perfect for a good indie romcom.

The one thing I would say though, and I think that Poseur was alluding to this, is that it doesn't really burst into life. What you have currently as the chorus sounds more like a bridge to a chorus to me... you're building the pace of the song but it doesn't hit maximum velocity (where a nice swoop of higher strings can come in).

Just my thoughts anyway. feel free to file them under 'Bin'!

Matt


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## Dan Mott (Feb 21, 2011)

There's no chance I'm moving on from this track even though I'm starting to hate it 

I need to learn more and I need to feel I actually got somewhere, so I suppose I'm not going to leave this track untill it's right for me and from an audience perspective 

Ed - Did you still not like the bass sound in the new mix? I did a bit of tweaking on it, do you think it needs more? I'm starting to realise that maybe it isn't the right bass sound. Sadly I do not have many good bass sounds and also bass sounds I like. I really want to get Trillian though. Also, when you say cut frequencies that don't need to be there...I'm not sure what you are saying... are you saying the mix is kind of muddy?? Or?

I agree with what everyone has said here. I think that the structure needs to be tweaked a little, so that the chorus can feel like it's actually the chorus. I was thinking to extend the intro verse to 16 bars instead of 8 so I can add more melodic features for that bit and then introduce the bridge to the chorus which I think would be more effective and more poppy. I also think I singer could make this more poppy aswell.

Now, about the chorus not feeling big? Do you guys think this is because the stuff before it is kinda the same level, or the fact that the drums and such just don't feel like they're playing loud?? IMO, the drums in the chorus right now sound too big to me..... eh, but maybe it isn't just the drums?

As far as I can here, pop songs aren't very dynamic so I'm guessing that a better structure, or should I say 'bigger build up lead in' would make a massive difference yeah??

I'm glad you guys like it though, aside from it does need alot of work. This is a good experiment for me. It's a pretty typical notation, but I think if I get this right and with vocals it could be a cool track.


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## Ed (Feb 21, 2011)

hey Dan,

Sorry I totally forgot to listen to the new mix before I sent that last message.

I like the new mix a lot better! (apart from the hiss at the start, if thats from an AMP sim maybe fade up the fx just as the music starts) the bass for me as improved it a lot. I wouldn't say you need more bass plugins just learning how to process what you have, it could be improved upon more but this is fine imo. In the last one it wasn't really doing anything for the track whereas I feel its moving the track along.

*For me* this mix is fine now, sure things can be improved upon and probably more ways of making things even "fatter" and there's always an issue of how to do the arrangement and structure. For me the base ideas is always the hardest part to come up with, so if you wanted to create a proper full piece out of this I think you've got the hardest part out of the way.


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