# Hans zimmer - mix with the masters



## ed buller (Jul 17, 2020)

Mix With The Masters:





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Various Score composition with Hans Zimmer - Videos - Mix With The Masters


Learn the entire process of music production, mixing and mastering from the world’s top engineers and producers through seminars and online videos.



mixwiththemasters.com









best


ed


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## robgb (Jul 17, 2020)

This strikes me as something similar to the Masterclass videos, where it's basically an interview with Mr. Zimmer. While they can certainly be inspiring, I'm much more interested in classes that emphasize the nuts and bolts of midi-based composing. And based on what he says here, that's his main approach. I just hope he gives us concrete, hands-on examples.


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## ed buller (Jul 17, 2020)

yes that seems to be a constant complaint about Hans's video classes. I'm lucky..I have watched him program midi but I learned a lot more watching him take a meeting and discussing the film in tiny detail. He really has an intellectual approach to things that I homestly feel is far more valubale than how he constructs an action cue. For one there's a wealth of information out there about that !.......it's always in D minor too.....and he's very fond of the Perfect cadence !.....but the other stuff....to me........is what I really want to learn

best

ed


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## MauroPantin (Jul 17, 2020)

I don't know man. Same as Rob, I got the Masterclass but expected more technical instruction on it. It is still super-interesting as an interview, but when I purchase educational material on the subject of composing I want to see craft, explained in-depth or with over the shoulder examples. Preferrably both.


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## ed buller (Jul 17, 2020)

MauroPantin said:


> I don't know man. Same as Rob, I got the Masterclass but expected more technical instruction on it. It is still super-interesting as an interview, but when I purchase educational material on the subject of composing I want to see craft, explained in-depth or with over the shoulder examples. Preferrably both.



yes...i understand. I doubt Hans will ever do that.....have you tried scoreclub ?

best

ed


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## jononotbono (Jul 17, 2020)

I've watched it. Loved it. No , he doesn't show people how he literally wrote Batman. I'm sure that's what many people expect!  Recently joined Mix with the Masters. Definitely worth the money for me.


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## Zanshin (Jul 17, 2020)

I thought this interview was awesome. I don't need details, I love when people try to communicate their process. I have not seen the master class so cannot comment, I'm waiting until there's like 10 classes I want to watch then I will subscribe haha.


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## MauroPantin (Jul 17, 2020)

ed buller said:


> yes...i understand. I doubt Hans will ever do that.....have you tried scoreclub ?
> 
> best
> 
> ed



Yeah, I imagine. Still, I would pay a handsome amount of money to get to see Hans in action at his workstation for an hour just writing and explaining his thinking. 

I am actually taking ScoreClub right now since (like most of the planet) I am stuck at home. So I took the opportunity to brush up on a few skills I haven't practiced in a while. Alain is a great teacher. Not sure how long I am gonna be on it, when things open back up I fear I will simply not have enough time to make use of it. But for right now, this is one of the most fantastic education resources I've ever purchased, exactly what I expected. I only wish I could have the option to purchase the courses for good instead of the subscription thing. I imagine it works for some but if you have a tight schedule it is difficult to justify.


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## patrick76 (Jul 17, 2020)

Stephen Limbaugh said:


> What is cultural imperialism in music? Which notes or sounds?


Are you familiar with the synthesizer sound in the song, "Tom Sawyer" by the band Rush? Not many know this, but Canada has been the world's true superpower for the past 50 years. They are masters of psychological manipulation, and have been slowly imposing their will through artists like Rush and Neil Young onto unsuspecting schlubs in the U.S. and around the globe. Don't fall for that nice guy image BS they try to peddle. Beware!


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## robgb (Jul 17, 2020)

Actually Hans wouldn't need to say a word. Just having a couple cameras over his shoulder while he worked would be a treat.


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## jononotbono (Jul 17, 2020)

Zanshin said:


> I'm waiting until there's like 10 classes I want to watch then I will subscribe haha.



Don't bother waiting. Just get a subscription and watch it. 
The knowledge and wisdom HZ gives in this MWTM is far beyond the asking price of submission. I can't believe we live in a time where people like HZ actually share so much of their musical lives and we have to pay pennies for decades of experience and knowledge. It's incredible. 

And then watch John Powell's MWTM. Loved that as well!


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## Keith Theodosiou (Jul 17, 2020)

I did his Master Class too and i thoroughly enjoyed it. I love the way he talks, to me he has got one of them voices like Morgan Freeman or David Attenborough, i could listen to it for hours lol.

As for watching him write in midi, isn't that what we all do? We have all seen 'how' he writes sitting at his keyboard and just playing, working out. Most of us do the same.

I just enjoy watching his videos for what they are weather it's him alone talking to the camera or sitting on a sofa talking to other composers about their views and how they go about things.

And to think the first time i saw him was on TOTP standing at a synth doing a pop song lol


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## ed buller (Jul 18, 2020)

robgb said:


> Actually Hans wouldn't need to say a word. Just having a couple cameras over his shoulder while he worked would be a treat.


well..i'm lucky to have seen this many times...he does what you do...........the thing that makes Hans such a great composer is NOT his midi. He is a very good programmer . Lot's of CC detail...pretty much all CC11 and where used CC1 . But it's the way he thinks and works on the story and the drama that set's him apart. 

best


ed


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## Keith Theodosiou (Jul 18, 2020)

ed buller said:


> well..i'm lucky to have seen this many times...he does what you do...........the thing that makes Hans such a great composer is NOT his midi. He is a very good programmer . Lot's of CC detail...pretty much all CC11 and where used CC1 . But it's the way he thinks and works on the story and the drama that set's him apart.
> 
> best
> 
> ...


That's 100% correct. We all do the same thing in our DAWS but it's what he comes up with that makes the difference. I don't think that is something you can teach. That come from within you.

I would still like to watch him doing it but he can't make me a better composer, that's down to me and me only.

Some of his music is so simple yet so beautiful, it prooves you don't have to be a technical genius to write great music.
That is why he is where he is now


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## GNP (Jul 18, 2020)

*"I make absolutely sure that we don't go and steal all the cliches of a culture."*

That is DAMN RIGHT. That's something I often try to avoid doing myself. It's not to much about cultural appropriation, as opposed to just not leaning on any culture's harmonic/scale cliche.


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## GNP (Jul 18, 2020)

*"I'm extremely wary of ending up doing a parody of a culture."*

Exactly.


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## Tice (Jul 18, 2020)

I just watched the video. I also followed his Masterclass. I get the impression that he doesn't focus on individual scoring techniques because part of what he does is to invent new techniques for each picture. So teaching you his techniques for writing the Dark Knight will only help you if you're doing a Dark Knight type of score. But I think he'd much rather you have the mindset that'll set you on the path to inventing something new. That's why he takes on the view of over-arching strategy of invention and experimentation. Anything he could teach you about techniques he's already applied is already useless.


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## robgb (Jul 18, 2020)

Keith Theodosiou said:


> As for watching him write in midi, isn't that what we all do?


Absolutely. But I think there's value in watching others do it, especially those who are highly successful. YouTube is full of composers who show their score building process via midi and I always find it fascinating. How do they approach certain tasks that's different than the way I do it? Is it more effective? Guy Michelmore is the perfect example of how educational this can be.

Watching Hans build a cue, step by step, would also be HIGHLY educational IMO.


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## Keith Theodosiou (Jul 18, 2020)

robgb said:


> Absolutely. But I think there's value in watching others do it, especially those who are highly successful. YouTube is full of composers who show their score building process via midi and I always find it fascinating. How do they approach certain tasks that's different than the way I do it? Is it more effective? Guy Michelmore is the perfect example of how educational this can be.
> 
> Watching Hans build a cue, step by step, would also be HIGHLY educational IMO.


Yes you do have a very good point, i do love watching Guy's videos and he really makes me laugh too lol


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## robgb (Jul 18, 2020)

GNP said:


> It's not to much about cultural appropriation, as opposed to just not leaning on any culture's harmonic/scale cliche.



I've never understood the disdain for cliches. Cliches are cliches because they've proven to work time and time again. Most rock songs are built on the same three chords. Yet there's some pretty amazing music built on that cliche.


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## GNP (Jul 19, 2020)

robgb said:


> I've never understood the disdain for cliches. Cliches are cliches because they've proven to work time and time again. Most rock songs are built on the same three chords. Yet there's some pretty amazing music built on that cliche.



If you say so, lol


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## MartinH. (Jul 19, 2020)

I'm still waiting for the crossover masterclass where Hans visits Mike Verta and sits down at the piano next to him, and they go over his influences from classical music etc.. And maybe also get drunk and rant about Hollywood, but that'd just be the cherry on top.


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## davidson (Jul 19, 2020)

MartinH. said:


> I'm still waiting for the crossover masterclass where Hans visits Mike Verta and sits down at the piano next to him, and they go over his influences from classical music etc.. And maybe also get drunk and rant about Hollywood, but that'd just be the cherry on top.



This is the video the internet needs.


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## Consona (Jul 19, 2020)

Please, correct the title, names start with capital letters.



MartinH. said:


> I'm still waiting for the crossover masterclass where Hans visits Mike Verta and sits down at the piano next to him, and they go over his influences from classical music etc.. And maybe also get drunk and rant about Hollywood, but that'd just be the cherry on top.


Yes, we need a "proper" Hans Zimmer class, not these pseudo-interviews about "being inspired" and "loving storytelling" and whatnot. Same with these Spitfire roundtables with Remote Control guys sitting around, talking about how cool it was making Batman Begins...

Mike making a HZ class with the man himself present sounds like the best case scenario. Give me 7 hours of these two madmen listening to HZ's music, sitting next to the piano talking about the compositions and ranting about whetever comes across their minds!


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## NoamL (Jul 19, 2020)

Consona said:


> "loving storytelling" and whatnot.



well, storytelling is the job....


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## Consona (Jul 19, 2020)

NoamL said:


> well, storytelling is the job....


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## NoamL (Jul 19, 2020)

Not at all. That's the composer's #1 job. Getting that mind meld with the director. Everything else is a task, it can be delegated, not saying it _should_ be, but the only thing that cannot be delegated is the composer as storyteller.


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## patrick76 (Jul 19, 2020)

MartinH. said:


> I'm still waiting for the crossover masterclass where Hans visits Mike Verta and sits down at the piano next to him, and they go over his influences from classical music etc.. And maybe also get drunk and rant about Hollywood, but that'd just be the cherry on top.


Somehow I don't see that happening. Of course, I have been known to be wrong from time to time.... Fairly often actually..


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## robgb (Jul 19, 2020)

MartinH. said:


> I'm still waiting for the crossover masterclass where Hans visits Mike Verta and sits down at the piano next to him, and they go over his influences from classical music etc.. And maybe also get drunk and rant about Hollywood, but that'd just be the cherry on top.


Hopefully it wouldn't turn into a discussion about whether or not the Corona virus is a hoax.


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## GNP (Jul 21, 2020)

Hi Kung Fu Master! Hi Snake Charmer! Hi Terrorist! Hi Sushi Chef! Hi Rapper!

Let's all make music using only y'all!

Great musical vocabulary that makes us "truly global"! Very very very "high end"! What's wrong with cliches, right???


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## jononotbono (Jul 21, 2020)

ed buller said:


> pretty much all CC11 and where used CC1



Thats interesting. Assuming CC11 is Expression and CC1 is Mod in his sampler.


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## Gene Pool (Jul 21, 2020)

GNP said:


> Hi Kung Fu Master! Hi Snake Charmer! Hi Terrorist! Hi Sushi Chef! Hi Rapper!




*Kung Fu Master*

Nipple gong hit every time he enters the scene (or _she_, if long-awaited sequel to _Girl Ghostbusters_ comes to fruition);
Dialog: parallel 4ths on Koto;
When scene intensifies: Koto tremolos in 4ths + unmetered random temple block hits;
Action scene: beat Chinese tom-toms fastly and furiously (taiko substitute acceptable, cuz no one will know or care, and Guitar Center has those).

*Snake Charmer*

Underscore background: Tabla employing _ad libitum_ procedures;
Village Sage speaking: Shehnai on raga scale (english horn substitute acceptable, cuz no one will know or care).
Sitar TACET to avoid confusion with late-Beatles-era self-enlightenment phase.

*Terrorist*

Underscore background: Darabuka employing _ad libitum_ procedures;
For no apparent reason, use breathy, flinty, ethnic-sounding woman's voice singing random vowels in dorian mode with the odd augmented 2nd thrown in for good measure (equal-tempered intervals acceptable cuz no one will know or care). Reverb send at 110% and turned up to 11.

*Sushi Chef*

Major pentatonic for happy scenes; Minor pentatonic for unhappy ones;
Instrumentation = the unused Shakuhachi left over from the _Kung Fu Master_ score (alto flute played with exaggerated chiff, alternate fingerings for detuning, and close-miked acceptable cuz no one will know or care).

*Rapper*

Sample Rex Harrison rap from _My Fair Lady > Why Can't a Woman be More Like a Man_ (Kanye West Presidential inauguration speech acceptable cuz no one will know or care).


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## I like music (Jul 21, 2020)

Gene Pool said:


> *Kung Fu Master*
> 
> Nipple gong hit every time he enters the scene (or _she_, if long-awaited sequel to _Girl Ghostbusters_ comes to fruition);
> Dialog: parallel 4ths on Koto;
> ...



Lol and wow. I'm actually going to try some of these!


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## muk (Aug 3, 2020)

What I would love to see was how Hans Zimmer achieves the sonic sound that he does, especially on the strings. Everything he does just sounds amazing from a sonic perspective. Listen to the strings in the Planet Earth Theme for example:



It just draws you in how good this sounds, every aspect of it (the synth pulse is amazing too). I have no idea how he achieves that. I only know that if I were to record a string orchestra, it would not sound like that.

With Blue Planet II it's the same:



With Hans Zimmer I get the impression that the sound itself is very much part of the composition. And that's an aspect I would love to know more about.


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## Henrik B. Jensen (Aug 3, 2020)

muk said:


> (...)
> With Hans Zimmer I get the impression that the sound itself is very much part of the composition. And that's an aspect I would love to know more about.


Forgive me if this is too simplistic, but isn't it just a matter of taking a sound you made yourself and then testing at the keyboard how it sounds to you in various registers and different ways of playing, all the time noting down at each "test run" what emotion(s) the sound triggers in you?

For example: "When I play this particular sound on key C1, it makes me feel sad" (or whatever).

Then for the next unique sound it could be: "When I alternate between C4 and E4, it sounds like something from a horror movie".

etc.

EDIT:
Then of course keep track of this somehow - by adding tags to your sounds in a sound manager for example.

Thus when you need to create music for a scene with tension, you have all these "suggestions" in your sound manager for sounds and/or playing styles that you - via your previous experimentation as described above - found to be suitable for the task.


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## GNP (Aug 3, 2020)

muk said:


> What I would love to see was how Hans Zimmer achieves the sonic sound that he does, especially on the strings. Everything he does just sounds amazing from a sonic perspective. Listen to the strings in the Planet Earth Theme for example:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




The sound is everything. This is the difference between a DAW-experimenter and a guy who only uses pencil and paper.

Not to knock pencil and paper so much, but the problem is that Pencil and Paperlers do not tend to put that much attention into the sound production in of itself. They're just there thinking that live players will do all the magic - which is obviously just a gamble.


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## muk (Aug 4, 2020)

hbjdk said:


> all the time noting down at each "test run" what emotion(s) the sound triggers in you?



That's not quite what I meant. Rather it feels to me like Hans Zimmer thinks and composes along the lines: I am going to record these specific musicians, in this studio, placed like this. XY is going to be the recording engineer, these microphones are going to be used. If I treat the resulting sound like this, layer it with custom synth patch xy, it will sound dark and full. Or something like that. It seems like every step of the production is meticulously planned and factored into the composition. It's like Hans Zimmer does not compose for string orchestra, for example, but for string orchestra consisting of these exact musicians, recorded in venue xy and mixed in a very specific way, and afterwards treated in wonderful ways I don't quite understand. Every step pre-planned and informing the way he composes a piece.



GNP said:


> The sound is everything. This is the difference between a DAW-experimenter and a guy who only uses pencil and paper.



There might be something to that. The specific sound definitely seems to play a much larger part in his music than for other composers. His music seems to be written and produced very specifically. The way it is recorded and produced seem to play an important part. John Williams music, for example, can be played by any good orchestra to good effect. It is written for orchestra. Hans Zimmer's music on the other hand I feel would loose some of it's sonic quality if it was played in concert by an unrelated orchestra. It doesn't seem to be written for orchestra as much, but for a specific orchestra recorded and treated in specific ways. The outstanding production quality is part of the end result. I would love to hear how he achieves these results. Max Richter is another composer who comes to mind where I can get a similar feeling.



Stephen Limbaugh said:


> Air Studios and VSL's Synchron Stage.



That's probably part of the equation, but only one part. I have heard other soundtracks recorded at Air Studios and Synchron Stage. The orchestra never sounds quite like in Hans Zimmer's tracks, even if recorded in the same venues.


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