# Not sure what to do...



## mouse_anon (Oct 1, 2018)

Guys and gals, I am in over my head.

I've been in LA for over a year, came here with a good degree, and have worked on some prestigious projects (and many of my own ). I've been making an increasingly strong network of friends and collaborators.

I've got a wonderful wife and beautiful kids, but the prohibitive cost of childcare means that she's at home taking care of them while I am feeding four mouths on one income.

I work as an assistant and have some side-jobs that bring in a little extra money, but we finally got our financial brains turned around and realized just how unsustainable our current trajectory is:

*We'll burn out before the end of the year.*

We don't even live extravagantly, but LA is expensive, and so are student loans!

Thus, I need a better-paying job. By at least double.

I'm not averse to working in other fields and relegating my growing music career to a nights-and-weekends thing for a few years until it can stand on its own, but I'm not even sure how I could be qualified for anything that could pay well enough that isn't in this field.

For those of you who have experienced or witnessed something similar, how did you tackle the problem? Did you change career direction? Move to flyover country? Did the magical gig fairy bless you with 7 seasons of network television out of the blue? ()

Any and all advice would be appreciated. Thanks!


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## Desire Inspires (Oct 1, 2018)

Move to flyover country, get a steady day job with benefits, and take care of your family.

To hell with music. Family comes first.


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## mouse_anon (Oct 1, 2018)

I appreciate that.

Also looking into something like a full buyout of some tracks for ads and such. I have the chops to be competitive, and therefore buyable, but I am not sure where to look for something like that. 

Any ideas?


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## Desire Inspires (Oct 1, 2018)

mouse_anon said:


> I appreciate that.
> 
> Also looking into something like a full buyout of some tracks for ads and such. I have the chops to be competitive, and therefore buyable, but I am not sure where to look for something like that.
> 
> Any ideas?



Nope.

Take care of your family, though. They are counting on you to provide for them. Do not let them down. That is your sole priority in life.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Oct 11, 2018)

Desire Inspires said:


> Nope.
> 
> Take care of your family, though. They are counting on you to provide for them. Do not let them down. That is your sole priority in life.



I agree with Desire Inspires, I wouldn't even have considered taking such a risk when I raised my family. Find a solid career (even non-musical) that is steady and reliable, you need to take care of the family first and foremost. Once that's established, pursue your musical dream on the side. Even if it takes many years to achieve, it will happen if you are persistent. Sorry to sound like a jerk, but what you're attempting is pure insanity...especially in the US where the healthcare sucks. If you continue on the same path, you will be left divorced and bankrupt.


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## InLight-Tone (Oct 11, 2018)

The problem is, if you don't take care of YOURSELF, and I'm talking about what you feel inside is right for you and what truly excites you, you will end up being a miserable human being and thus in the process of compromise, NOT taking care of your family. 

Lining up with what and who you truly are INSIDE, your inner blueprint, is the most important thing in LIFE, yet most turn their backs on it as they are told to do as a child to become responsible cogs in the inhumane wheel of "civilization" thus giving rise to the abundant abuse of prescription meds, alcohol and other coping mechanisms to mask the broken child we all try to hide from...


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## Jeremy Spencer (Oct 11, 2018)

InLight-Tone said:


> The problem is, if you don't take care of YOURSELF, and I'm talking about what you feel inside is right for you and what truly excites you, you will end up being a miserable human being and thus in the process of compromise, NOT taking care of your family.
> 
> Lining up with what and who you truly are INSIDE, your inner blueprint, is the most important thing in LIFE, yet most turn their backs on it as they are told to do as a child to become responsible cogs in the inhumane wheel of "civilization" thus giving rise to the abundant abuse of prescription meds, alcohol and other coping mechanisms to mask the broken child we all try to hide from...



Absolutely, but that doesn't pay the bills. That's why one needs to find a solid career to fall back on while pursuing their passion(s).


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## InLight-Tone (Oct 11, 2018)

Wolfie2112 said:


> Absolutely, but that doesn't pay the bills. That's why one needs to find a solid career to fall back on while pursuing their passion(s).


They are not mutually exclusive, that's a lie like being a starving artist, and you have to suffer to succeed, or that your passion doesn't pay the bills...


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## MChangoM (Oct 11, 2018)

In addition to what the others have advised, approach your existing employer and explain the situation. If you are valuable enough; they may be able to increase your wages, give you more responsibilities, flexible hours, etc. If you are not valuable enough now, find out what you need to do to get there.


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## Desire Inspires (Oct 11, 2018)

MChangoM said:


> In addition to what the others have advised, approach your existing employer and explain the situation. If you are valuable enough; they may be able to increase your wages, give you more responsibilities, flexible hours, etc. If you are not valuable enough now, find out what you need to do to get there.



That sounds good, but the OP said they will burn through money before the end of the year. I think he and his family should move now instead of waiting on a miracle.


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## gsilbers (Oct 11, 2018)

mouse_anon said:


> I appreciate that.
> 
> Also looking into something like a full buyout of some tracks for ads and such. I have the chops to be competitive, and therefore buyable, but I am not sure where to look for something like that.
> 
> Any ideas?



BMG


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## MChangoM (Oct 11, 2018)

Desire Inspires said:


> That sounds good, but the OP said they will burn through money before the end of the year. I think he and his family should move now instead of waiting on a miracle.



Then what does it cost OP to have a chat with the current employer? I had one of my most valuable employees resign without her ever having given me the slightest hint of financial difficulties. The tension between the balance sheet and the well-being of the employees is a constant struggle and it can be easy to overlook such things. I found a way to create a new, much higher-paying position for her. She stayed and thrived. I subsequently paid more attention to retaining valuable people. Not a miracle.


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## Jeremy Spencer (Oct 11, 2018)

InLight-Tone said:


> They are not mutually exclusive, that's a lie like being a starving artist, and you have to suffer to succeed, or that your passion doesn't pay the bills...



So are you saying to simply work in the field you are passionate about, even if it means losing everything?


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## gsilbers (Oct 11, 2018)

mouse_anon said:


> Guys and gals, I am in over my head.
> 
> I've been in LA for over a year, came here with a good degree, and have worked on some prestigious projects (and many of my own ). I've been making an increasingly strong network of friends and collaborators.
> 
> ...



A year is EXTREMLY short amount of time in LA for establishing a carreer in music. but seems you are doing fine though. also, good composers w good chops are a dime a dozen in LA.. so its even harder. and any real job usually goes to remote control and a few others. its very limited. of course there are oportunities but in general , it takes time.

thats the little secret to hollywood that makes things a lot more sense when poeple complain about hollywood.
most poeple in film (composers, actors, prodcuers etc) have a solid back end of family money that they can just do a few projects here and there while maybe working a part time job or whatever. 
a lot of poeple work on one of the distributors or editors or sfx guys in those bigger companies that offer 401k, health and benefits and then do music on the side. but thats 8 hours a day to them come home and do another 6 hours of music. which is what i did. so basicallt two jobs.
Also a few composers stories are about setting a side business like rental equipment, rental income , or any business that generate passive income.
i had a friend who bought a 2 unit house when the housing market when bust so he got it cheap and now the rest covers the mortage and living expenses.
housing is so expensive. and also child care. plus insurance. its gotten out of hand and LA is not really doing much about it. so your situation is similar to hundred of thousand of poeple in the LA area. all that traffic you seeon the 10 and 405 is basically that. poeple move to the east side... uplland, south gate etc and drive like 2 hours to work.
its crazy.
if child care is and family is an issue maybe have them live somewhere else where its cheap and you pay for your studio/bedroom and see them once in a while until the situation gets better.
or live somehwere else and see if you get enough business from your existing contacts.


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## InLight-Tone (Oct 11, 2018)

Wolfie2112 said:


> So are you saying to simply work in the field you are passionate about, even if it means losing everything?


Working a job you HATE IS losing everything. This brief LIFE is invaluable beyond measure to spend it squandering in meaningless toil...


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## JEPA (Oct 11, 2018)

I have done EVERYTHING when my children were kids. Everything is everything. Worked in a fabric, call center, traductor, 5 musical bands parallel, radio station as technician, recording studio, composing, arranging, directing kids orchestra, teaching music in school, private lessons, for Dell computers, for MAN trucks, giving flyers brochures at the street, moving furnitures for the police, music school director, etc... writing musicological articles (less). This is true, is my life. And i keep making music and following my dream. Now i have an office and working independent for documentary films, art museum, independent projects, and starting out my own music library. BUT I NEVER LET MY KIDS SUFFER. My highest priority was is and will be my family. So.. the world is open, do what you need to do, nothing lasts for ever, you can make a one year pause and start again where you left, meanwhile collecting ideas for your next step or enterprise. *THE MOST IMPORTANT IS YOUR OWN STABILITY AND THE STABILITY OF YOUR FAMILY (HEALTH= psychological, physical and mental)!!!!*


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## StevenMcDonald (Oct 11, 2018)

InLight-Tone said:


> Working a job you HATE IS losing everything. This brief LIFE is invaluable beyond measure to spend it squandering in meaningless toil...



This is poetic and all, but not good advice for the original poster. 

Don't whine about work being meaningless or whatever. Do what you have to do to survive long enough to keep trying to reach your goal. Especially if your family depending on you.


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## InLight-Tone (Oct 12, 2018)

StevenMcDonald said:


> This is poetic and all, but not good advice for the original poster.
> 
> Don't whine about work being meaningless or whatever. Do what you have to do to survive long enough to keep trying to reach your goal. Especially if your family depending on you.


The biggest regret that people have at the end of LIFE are the things they DIDN'T DO! You are arguing for your limitations...


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## Jeremy Spencer (Oct 12, 2018)

InLight-Tone said:


> The biggest regret that people have at the end of LIFE are the things they DIDN'T DO! You are arguing for your limitations...



I don't think anyone is saying that having a regular job is crushing one's dreams, you can't simply dive in head first and expect everything to work out from day one....that's not reality, and is a perfect way to end up broke and depressed. I am following my dream, and have already realized many milestones over the past number of years. And by having a primary career (even non-musical, like in my case), one can still do all the things they want in life. Why not? I would rather have the money to properly build a musical career in "baby steps" as opposed to living some dark basement suite writing jingles for peanuts, with no light at the end of the tunnel. Frankly, your posts are insulting to those of us that actually get out there and bust our asses without whining about how it's degrading to Humanity.

Have you been a composer for your entire life? Did it buy you a house and raise a family? If you did, congratulations, but I highly doubt it.


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## StevenMcDonald (Oct 12, 2018)

InLight-Tone said:


> The biggest regret that people have at the end of LIFE are the things they DIDN'T DO! You are arguing for your limitations...



I don't disagree with that. But if you have to get a job to pay the bills, then that's what you need to do.

If I hadn't worked a normal job I hated for 3 years while I built up my music catalog, I would have been homeless. That's just life.


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## InLight-Tone (Oct 12, 2018)

I believe even Zimmer had his electricity turned off in his beginning pursuits while being married and just think what would have been the trajectory of his life if he had doubted himself, compromised and went and resigned to working a "job".


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## InLight-Tone (Oct 12, 2018)

Wolfie2112 said:


> I don't think anyone is saying that having a regular job is crushing one's dreams, you can't simply dive in head first and expect everything to work out from day one....that's not reality, and is a perfect way to end up broke and depressed. I am following my dream, and have already realized many milestones over the past number of years. And by having a primary career (even non-musical, like in my case), one can still do all the things they want in life. Why not? I would rather have the money to properly build a musical career in "baby steps" as opposed to living some dark basement suite writing jingles for peanuts, with no light at the end of the tunnel. Frankly, your posts are insulting to those of us that actually get out there and bust our asses without whining about how it's degrading to Humanity.
> 
> Have you been a composer for your entire life? Did it buy you a house and raise a family? If you did, congratulations, but I highly doubt it.


Ha, I wouldn't even compromise my LIFE by working a job that confined me PERIOD. I also believe that a LIFE AWAY from nature(LIFE) is a TRAGEDY, and a recipe for depression and existential angst. I mean look at Chester Bennington and Chris Cornell, they had fame, adoration, big $$$, and yet they offed themselves. Clearly happiness doesn't lie in those things we tend to covet...

The minute the internet appeared and the ability to make money through it, I went head first into getting out of the job scene. Over the years my wife and I have created a number of things to financially sustain ourselves including YouTube, a web site that makes money through affiliate links, composing library music etc. Music is one egg in the basket which I am still growing.

Subsequently, to stay close to nature, we also are fulltime RVers/Nomads that live/thrive in an RV complete with a built in music studio that travels. My backdrop is the ever changing tapestry of nature, I would NEVER want to own a house nor a studio of any kind. That's a box/prison in my eyes. I have no ambition to try and be a film composer and live in LA, please kill me now, no offense to my idol Zimmer. 

"Despite all my rage, I am still just a rat in a cage"...


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## jhughes (Oct 12, 2018)

mouse_anon said:


> Guys and gals, I am in over my head.
> I've got a wonderful wife and beautiful kids, but the prohibitive cost of childcare means that she's at home taking care of them while I am feeding four mouths on one income.
> 
> I work as an assistant and have some side-jobs that bring in a little extra money, but we finally got our financial brains turned around and realized just how unsustainable our current trajectory is:
> ...



I'm going to tell you what I told a friend a few months ago when they were faced with a career-job decision. The first thing I asked them was:
What would a company do if it was in the same position as you?

Choices:
1)Work more, try to generate more income
Problem with this-what would you feel and look like at the end of it? How would relationship with your family be? Sometimes you don't have any choice but long-term I don't think it's a good idea.

2)Start cutting expenses.
Most likely, a company would start cutting costs, instead of throwing money after more workers, items, etc, hoping they eventually get some return on it. It's truly amazing how many expenses a person can cut. Do you know how much money you spend a month? Itemized? That's exactly where I would start. Know it down to the dime.
Part of that is where you choose to live. I would move somewhere you could live affordably and perhaps afford childcare. L.A is definitely not the only place you can find work.

It sounds like you already have a career, resume; use that to get work remotely via the internet. Use your knowledge, offer services, anything that would help you with income during such a move. Start saving up.

You have a wife and kids, you can't just say, "well, I'm going to follow my dream right into the ground and if I go broke and homeless doing it, so be it." That's simply ridiculous.


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## Henu (Oct 13, 2018)

I completely agree with @jhughes. You can always work half-time in a "regular" job and still have time for composing afterwards, if the case is that you are having extra time on your hands while not getting any gigs. Pretty much everyone who ever managed to get a full-time career with music did that first. 

Your contacts aren't also going anywhere- this is 2018. The base work you have already done within the last year with networking is worth gold for you, and you can easily continue sustaining it via internet. Besides, it's not like you drive personally to bring an USB stick to anyone nowadays, as pretty much all ideas, revisions, final files and whatnot travel via internet anyway. What difference does it _really_ make if the file is sent from LA than from, say, Oklahoma, as long as you just have those people asking for the files? 

As a bit off- topic (not related to you): I understand that people want to move to LA because I've heard that that's the place where you are supposed to be if you want to make it "big"....but what I don't get is that why it has to always be "I'm gonna be the next Hans Zimmer and work with blockbusters and earn a zillion or I die trying". There has to be a middle ground too, and I guess that 99% of all the media/ screen composers aren't the abovementioned anyway. 
Besides, I'm also pretty sure that for any of those X amount of people who _can actually do music for living_ without being the next Hans Zimmer, there are a zillion of people who would kill to just being able to music for living instead of driving a truck/ selling computers/repairing various machines. I just don't get it why the human mind is never happy for what it already has. :D


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## Vik (Oct 13, 2018)

mouse_anon said:


> For those of you who have experienced or witnessed something similar, how did you tackle the problem? Did you change career direction? Move to flyover country? Did the magical gig fairy bless you with 7 seasons of network television out of the blue?


I have done all that, and actually got some of my most important work after having moved away from where my market is. 
When you take your last breath (and now, I believe), you'll be more happy about having been there for those you care for than having been on some some cool company's payroll. So will your family. 
Plus, you can make music anywhere. If you do that, and come up with something good, there are always ways to expose that music to people who may want to use it.


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## Joshua Campbell (Oct 13, 2018)

Your main income doesn't have to come directly from what you are most passionate about. Perhaps a good example is Charles Ives... Insurance Salesman right?

There are music jobs and music related jobs out there that can help pay the bills as well... Teach private lessons, work in a music store, take a few gigs... Cruise Ships are a good gig, but you'd be away from your family... The military is always hiring musicians as well... 

Best of luck to you!


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## givemenoughrope (Oct 13, 2018)

Do NOT get on a cruise ship.

Make most of your coffee at home and most of your food at home. Save time and money.

Get a laptop for editing and pushing basic files/sessions around (not neccesarily for the heavy lifting although I use one as my main machine along with a bunch of minis and pcs) so you get work done while bouncing the little bugger in his/her bouncy chair thing.


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## chillbot (Oct 13, 2018)

I have good advice for you:

Internet forums are a less-than-ideal source of meaningful information for life decisions.

But don't take my advice (internet forum).


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## Desire Inspires (Oct 14, 2018)

Henu said:


> I just don't get it why the human mind is never happy for what it already has. :D


 
I do.


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## Henu (Oct 14, 2018)

So does the Wikipedia, but that really isn't the point. It's more about recognizing the pattern, the risk and the behavioural expectation.


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## martincraneV (Oct 19, 2018)

I was in a similar situation 2 years ago, albeit without any connections or assistantships bringing in regular $ and no student loans, having never studied music. I decided to do a coding bootcamp at Flatiron. 3 months of prep and 4 months of intense study and you come out with a 70k / year markable skill if you are decent at it. It was around 15k 2 years ago. It scratched a similar itch as music - systems, repetition, patterns, and the almost cathartic feeling of building something from scratch. Bootcamps take a lot of musicians in because they tend to be decent at coding. My friends in the industry also spoke highly of Flatiron.

Literally the week I started to look for a coding job, I got a large scoring job and have been working on shorts and ads since. The bootcamp did give me a sense of ease knowing that I had a skillset that was in demand, though. My goal at that time was to grind, get some real world experience, and then go freelance or part time and make music. I still try to keep up with it knowing how fickle music can be.

Might be worth looking into.


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## Desire Inspires (Oct 19, 2018)

Henu said:


> So does the Wikipedia, but that really isn't the point. It's more about recognizing the pattern, the risk and the behavioural expectation.



Nope, not at all.


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## LamaRose (Oct 19, 2018)

The days of getting a secure 9 to 5 - actually 7 to 6 is more accurate - are largely over. It's an idea/information/self-employment economy. Either direction you choose, you're basically working for yourself from now on. I think you already grasp this. _If_ I were going back to school/back in time, and wanted a backup career to fall on, I would choose coding and/or nursing... both offer great money, flexible hours/work environments/locations, and solid futures.

I've been in your position... many times, in fact! I actually chose _not to choose_. My "career" path would look like a continual sine wave of doing shite that I don't like doing whilst making good bread vs doing what I want to be doing, but usually requiring that I revert back to the next wave... each wave/cycle would be measured in years, and yes, I always had multiple mouths to feed. 

A few things seem brutally clear: lacking some near-term serendipity, LA is just too expensive for you. Understandable for most of us with families. But you have connections, along with some talent, so take advantage of both. I would lay my situation on the line with everyone I know... maybe someone can make a bit of that serendipity happen for you. Just as important, maybe your contacts have contacts in other areas with more affordable cost of living.

I live in NM. Albuquerque & Sante Fe have turned into a major hub(s) for film/TV production. Far more affordable COL. Lot's of upstart indie productions. And both areas seem to be drawing in younger, entrepreneurial types, so there may be other opportunities lurking about in other fields.

So, if you must move, why not move to an area that at least keeps you within arms length of getting your foot back in the door? Good fortunes to you and your family!


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