# Cubase 10.5.20 - Independent Edit/Undo History no more?



## Blakus (Jul 1, 2020)

In the past, one of my favourite Cubase features was the fact that each midi event had its own independent undo/edit history. This meant that you could reopen a midi event in the key editor that you'd worked on earlier and ctrl+z to undo your last action ONLY in that event.

I've just upgraded to Cubase 10.5 and it appears that this is no longer the case? Ctrl+Z is now always undoing the very last action, even if I have an earlier midi event open in the key editor. The Ctrl+Z command is blatantly undoing the last immediate action regardless.

This is a pretty huge workflow thing for me, and it's causing me to undo many things that I don't want to undo. Am I the only one? It seems like a pretty big feature for Steinberg to obliterate? Any ideas?


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## zolhof (Jul 1, 2020)

The key editor undo function used to be "local", as you described, and its behavior has changed after 10.5, which is very unfortunate for us who rely on it. This issue has been discussed and reported on the Steinberg forums but no official response so far.

Maybe @Guillermo Navarrete can help?


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## labornvain (Jul 1, 2020)

Yes, another master stroke from the brain trust at steinburg.

Independent histories for various components within the application is something that should be expanded on. This is clearly a move in the wrong direction.


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## Blakus (Jul 1, 2020)

zolhof said:


> The key editor undo function used to be "local", as you described, and its behavior has changed after 10.5, which is very unfortunate for us who rely on it. This issue has been discussed and reported on the Steinberg forums but no official response so far.
> 
> Maybe @Guillermo Navarrete can help?


Wow, I really hope they roll this back - it's almost a bit of a deal-breaker for me.


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## Bender-offender (Jul 1, 2020)

labornvain said:


> Yes, another master stroke from the brain trust at steinburg.
> 
> Independent histories for various components within the application is something that should be expanded on. This is clearly a move in the wrong direction.


I agree, but it’s not just this “undo” issue. Steinberg continuously breaks / alters / changes / f’d-up functions with nearly each update and/or upgrade ever since they went to releasing a new Cubase version every year. And it’s become absolutely pointless trying to mention this crap to them because attempting to use every avenue of communication possible falls on deaf ears.


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## Buddy (Jul 1, 2020)

I wish, everytime they make one of these seismic workflow decisions for us, that they'd include an option in preferences to be able to alternately select the original way we've come to rely on.


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## Jdiggity1 (Jul 1, 2020)

it's ultimately the one thing holding me back from upgrading


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## labornvain (Jul 2, 2020)

Bender-offender said:


> I agree, but it’s not just this “undo” issue. Steinberg continuously breaks / alters / changes / f’d-up functions with nearly each update and/or upgrade ever since they went to releasing a new Cubase version every year. And it’s become absolutely pointless trying to mention this crap to them because attempting to use every avenue of communication possible falls on deaf ears.


Yes. It's truly unbearable. Every single update screws up something. At one point I began to wonder what one has to do to get fired at Steinberg. I mean seriously, who's making these decisions that have such a profound effect on their users in an entirely negative way. In every update.


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## lucor (Jul 2, 2020)

Bender-offender said:


> I agree, but it’s not just this “undo” issue. Steinberg continuously breaks / alters / changes / f’d-up functions with nearly each update and/or upgrade ever since they went to releasing a new Cubase version every year. And it’s become absolutely pointless trying to mention this crap to them because attempting to use every avenue of communication possible falls on deaf ears.


And then they re-release those removed functions as a 'new and groundbreaking' new feature in a later version and charge money for it, like they did with Video Export in 10.5. Wouldn't be surprised if they did the same thing with independent histories.


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## Rasoul Morteza (Jul 2, 2020)

lucor said:


> And then they re-release those removed functions as a 'new and groundbreaking' new feature in a later version and charge money for it, like they did with Video Export in 10.5. Wouldn't be surprised if they did the same thing with independent histories.


Wait they had video export before?


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## Patrick de Caumette (Jul 2, 2020)

Rasoul Morteza said:


> Wait they had video export before?


no


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## Pablocrespo (Jul 2, 2020)

Don´t forget the genius of exporting 1gb video files because we cannot change any settings in the video export menu.

I end up with videos ten times larger than the video I imported the first time around.


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## Pablocrespo (Jul 2, 2020)

Rasoul Morteza said:


> Wait they had video export before?


They had replace video´s audio, but I think was based in quicktime, so they I have to scrap that and now reintroduced the (limited) video export.


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## Patrick de Caumette (Jul 2, 2020)

Pablocrespo said:


> Don´t forget the genius of exporting 1gb video files because we cannot change any settings in the video export menu.
> 
> I end up with videos ten times larger than the video I imported the first time around.


I would be nice to have options, for sure, but in this day and age, having a video editor to deliver video assets is kind of a must


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## Pablocrespo (Jul 2, 2020)

Yes, but then it defeats its purpose, I rather then export an audiofile and use a video editor (as I am doing, or exporting the huge video file and replacing audio with ERmedia).

What I am saying is that this is usual Steinberg flashy "new" feature but half baked and not very useable.


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## Bender-offender (Jul 2, 2020)

lucor said:


> And then they re-release those removed functions as a 'new and groundbreaking' new feature in a later version and charge money for it, like they did with Video Export in 10.5. Wouldn't be surprised if they did the same thing with independent histories.


Yup, spot-on. Another example is how they’re advertising (to an extent) Retrospective Record as if it’s (I’m guessing) new? Yes, it behaves a bit differently, but I’ve found it to be far worse than it was in C10 and earlier; so bad so that I went back to 10, and it already sucks in 10 (something they literally broke way back in 7.5.30).


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## Mike Bonta (Jul 5, 2020)

Blakus said:


> In the past, one of my favourite Cubase features was the fact that each midi event had its own independent undo/edit history. This meant that you could reopen a midi event in the key editor that you'd worked on earlier and ctrl+z to undo your last action ONLY in that event.
> 
> I've just upgraded to Cubase 10.5 and it appears that this is no longer the case? Ctrl+Z is now always undoing the very last action, even if I have an earlier midi event open in the key editor. The Ctrl+Z command is blatantly undoing the last immediate action regardless.
> 
> This is a pretty huge workflow thing for me, and it's causing me to undo many things that I don't want to undo. Am I the only one? It seems like a pretty big feature for Steinberg to obliterate? Any ideas?





The only workaround I found is this:

1.Open Undo History window.
2. Go back in history to the desired point.
3. Select & Copy the midi event (Ctrl+C)
4. Go back again to the last event in undo history.
5. Delete the present midi event
6. Paste (Ctrl+V) the old event from clipboard.

This may not be usable to you but just in case my half cent.


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## SomeGuy (Jul 5, 2020)

Wow! Yet another reason I’m glad I have not, and will not, upgrade to 10.5! Unfortunately, given steingbergs history, this will probably never going to be fixed in any future version! It’s issues like this, removing workflow seemingly at random, that is truly making me consider going back to Logic. At least there I know where I stand.


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## NYC Composer (Jul 7, 2020)

Pablocrespo said:


> Don´t forget the genius of exporting 1gb video files because we cannot change any settings in the video export menu.
> 
> I end up with videos ten times larger than the video I imported the first time around.


Mine are 4 times bigger, but it’s the same freakin deal.


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## JT3_Jon (Jul 18, 2020)

Ok, this is ridiculous! Why would they remove this feature?! Is there a way we can all band together and make sure Steinberg fixes this?!


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## labornvain (Jul 18, 2020)

JT3_Jon said:


> Ok, this is ridiculous! Why would they remove this feature?! Is there a way we can all band together and make sure Steinberg fixes this?!


This is a good idea. Some kind of consumer advocacy group. I've always believed that the user should have a lot more say in bold design decisions which will appear to have been made without consideration the end user at all.

It's like there's just some dude, sitting there messing with things that has a huge impact on a lot of people's lives and work. He must be stopped.


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## SimonCharlesHanna (Jul 18, 2020)

Yeah Cubase is going backwards - I downgraded to 10 and I have no idea what my next steps in DAW world are going to be because Cubase is becoming too unreliable as a professional tool.


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## pisskeule (Aug 14, 2020)

I fucking hate Steinbug. Actually, what I hate even more than them is the dick heads paying them money for their useless, inferior crap. The company should be dismantled, it's fraudulent above all.


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## pisskeule (Aug 14, 2020)

labornvain said:


> Yes. It's truly unbearable. Every single update screws up something. At one point I began to wonder what one has to do to get fired at Steinberg. I mean seriously, who's making these decisions that have such a profound effect on their users in an entirely negative way. In every update.



Oh, that's an easy one to answer: YOU CAN'T GET FIRED. It's well know in the industry as being the most dreadful company there is in the field. A truly soul eating shit hole of a workplace.


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## labornvain (Aug 14, 2020)

pisskeule said:


> Oh, that's an easy one to answer: YOU CAN'T GET FIRED. It's well know in the industry as being the most dreadful company there is in the field. A truly soul eating shit hole of a workplace.


Yeah, I've long suspected as much. That there are a lot of talented coders there but they're always being supressed buy a few corporate tools.

They're the reason, I suspect, that so many new features that have been added to Cubase over the years have been either half-assed or downright defective.

I encountered one of these geniuses on the Steinberg forum once. I had been complaining about a "feature" where when you open a project file and then close it without doing anything to it, incredibly, it deletes your backup files for that project.

On one of the many occasions that I showed up to the forum to complain about this stupidity, one of the manager types chimed in to explain how "this is how it should be."

Then he locked the thread.

So this is a case of a supervisor at Steinberg defending the removal of MY content from MY computer.

With people like that guy in charge I'm surprised the software works as well as it does.


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## novaburst (Aug 15, 2020)

if i did not see the title of the thread i would have thought you were talking about Microsoft and windows 10 crazy updates


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## artinro (Jun 25, 2021)

Blakus said:


> In the past, one of my favourite Cubase features was the fact that each midi event had its own independent undo/edit history. This meant that you could reopen a midi event in the key editor that you'd worked on earlier and ctrl+z to undo your last action ONLY in that event.
> 
> I've just upgraded to Cubase 10.5 and it appears that this is no longer the case? Ctrl+Z is now always undoing the very last action, even if I have an earlier midi event open in the key editor. The Ctrl+Z command is blatantly undoing the last immediate action regardless.
> 
> This is a pretty huge workflow thing for me, and it's causing me to undo many things that I don't want to undo. Am I the only one? It seems like a pretty big feature for Steinberg to obliterate? Any ideas?


@Blakus Hate to disturb old wounds, but have you or anyone else on this thread had any contact with the powers that be at Steinberg over this issue? I just added a Cubase 11 template to my system only to discover this absolutely critical feature missing, which led me to this thread. I now see it's been an issue for quite some time (over a year??). Thankfully, I still have an earlier version of 10 on my system which still has the local undo functionality but, my goodness....what a massive fail to get rid of this. As you said, it's as close to a deal breaker as I can imagine for the kind of work most of us on this forum do.


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## Henu (Jun 28, 2021)

You gotta be kidding me. I've been using Cubase since 2003 almost on daily basis (and am very prolificient with it) and this is the FIRST TIME I hear about this...uhm, missed opportunity. :D


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## artinro (Jun 28, 2021)

Henu said:


> You gotta be kidding me. I've been using Cubase since 2003 almost on daily basis (and am very prolificient with it) and this is the FIRST TIME I hear about this...uhm, missed opportunity. :D


I got working easily in C11 and took the time to port over a large template. Then got started on a project. Spent hours trying to figure out why local undo just wouldn’t work, and why I couldn’t find the obvious toggle on/off in the prefs. Needless to say, I was extremely angry when I found @Blakus post here. It’s mind bogglingly stupid that they cut this feature. I’ve gone back to a pre-10.5 build as a result. None of the 10.5 or 11 features are remotely worth losing that one thing. Hope they bring it back immediately, but I’m not expecting it.


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## Emmanuel Rousseau (Jun 28, 2021)

It was super useful to test variations of an arrangement easily to figure, for instance, the best voice leading. 

Now I'm relying mostly on track versions for dense orchestrations when I'm testing things but it's nowhere as convenient. 

Big red flag for Steinberg on this one :(


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## MarcusD (Jul 1, 2021)

Even if Sample Jesus descended from the sky and said unto Steinberg "You shalt fix thy independent undo, or I shall deep sample your screams of eternal pain" - they still wouldn't fix it... 😋


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