# Aliens?



## Nick Batzdorf (May 26, 2009)

Lux wrote:

"there's no link to actual scientific evidence, aliens do not exist and for sure they will not look like northamericans with some makeup on their face."

Wilx wrote (in the context of suspension of disbelief in a sci-fi movie):


"Surely the existence of aliens is about as plausible as the existence of humans, no? 

It's less likely that any other life in the universe is at a similar level of evolution to us, and even less likely that they're whizzing to Earth every few months to analy probe someone, but I think it's a bit arrogant to assume that humanity, or Earth, is any more special than any other potential sentient species/planet. Just to make it clear - I don't believe in aliens in the little grey men visiting us in flying saucers sense, and I accept that Earth may be the only planet in the history of the universe which will ever produce and sustain sentient life. I just think that's unlikely."

I'm not sure you can apply the odds of us being here - which are either 100% or else a number so small that the negative exponents would go for miles, depending on how you look at it - as evidence for or against there being life anywhere else.

Since planets are common, it turns out, I think the odds of there being others with life-supporting conditions are good. But does that mean the evolution of life is "normal" on a planet with the right conditions? I've looked at Jupiter and its moons through a telescope and had the sense that that whole entourage moving through space is itself something like life.

Maybe life is unique, or maybe something different but equal is normal on other planets out there in the distance[/quote]. To us it feels like the ultimate "goal" of "creation," but maybe there's something else going on that we can't even conceive.


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## lux (May 26, 2009)

oh c'mon i explained, don t quote me, thats not my opinion i was doing mimics.

Need coffee?


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## lux (May 26, 2009)

a bit like northerndisclosure, just cant reach that website anymore...perhaps someone saved the strips


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## synthetic (May 26, 2009)

Aliens look like us because they populated the planet millions of years ago. 

[where's the ironic eybrow emoticon?]


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## Alex W (May 26, 2009)

Statistically speaking, it makes sense to say that aliens probably exist.

But saying that they've visited earth is a much bigger claim and requires much better evidence than what has been presented thus far.


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## synthetic (May 26, 2009)

Agree with that. Stars are really, really, really far apart.


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## Alex W (May 26, 2009)

Not to mention galaxies. Sad thing is, they're only getting further away too. Apart from Andromeda, which our galaxy will collide with in a few billion years. That'll be fun.


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## PolarBear (May 26, 2009)

Alex W @ Wed May 27 said:


> Not to mention galaxies. Sad thing is, they're only getting further away too. Apart from Andromeda, which our galaxy will collide with in a few billion years. That'll be fun.


It'll look like a shooting star to some of the aliens, and some of who saw it may make a wish on it. And then... well  They gotta answer that god question first 

Actually I'm 100% sure the "alien" question nobody of us nor any human will solve within the next 10 years. So why discuss it endlessly?


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## Alex W (May 26, 2009)

PolarBear @ Wed May 27 said:


> Actually I'm 100% sure the "alien" question nobody of us nor any human will solve within the next 10 years. So why discuss it endlessly?



Pfft.


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 26, 2009)

"So why discuss it endlessly?"

Because it's fun to speculate - although an endless discussion would be pretty long.


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## sbkp (May 26, 2009)

PolarBear @ Tue May 26 said:


> Actually I'm 100% sure the "alien" question nobody of us nor any human will solve within the next 10 years. So why discuss it endlessly?



What else is there to do? ~o)


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## Alex W (May 27, 2009)

Interesting points Christian. It's safe to say that if we do find evidence of life on Mars, then life is common throughout the universe.

The problem is how to find it.


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## wqaxsz (May 27, 2009)

Aliens aren't fools...

They know what we want...
They have it and they are aware we 'll do anything to get it from them...
That 's why they don't come over here...

You know exactly what i am talking about,
you can feel it right now,
it can wake you up at night,
it can make your body shiver, 
just thinking one day it 'll be in your very own hands...

Yes those perfect legati strings !

~o)


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## Rodney Glenn (May 27, 2009)

wqaxsz @ Wed May 27 said:


> Aliens aren't fools...
> 
> They know what we want...
> They have it and they are aware we 'll do anything to get it from them...
> ...



So what you're basically saying is that Andrew K is an alien?  

But seriously, lots of other planets sure...but then the question of life...and if its intelligent (which can be debated whether it even exists on our own planet)...and then if they have means for spacetravel...in which case the question arises whether they have been visiting us or not etc etc.

Not impossible that we've been visited, but perhaps not very likely considering all of the criterias it requires.

Then again, this is exactly what you'd expect an alien being here under cover to say...right? (o) 

Cheers

Rodney


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## nikolas (May 27, 2009)

Rodney Glenn @ Wed May 27 said:


> So what you're basically saying is that Andrew K is an alien?


"THO.NE.X is his codename.

How did you know? >8o


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## hbuus (May 27, 2009)

Aliens do exist - in fact one of them have just been President of the United States!


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## Christian Marcussen (May 27, 2009)

Alex W @ Wed May 27 said:


> Interesting points Christian. It's safe to say that if we do find evidence of life on Mars, then life is common throughout the universe.



Thanks. I was about to type that, but it's not quite that simple. To my mind it depends on the answer to question two. If the life we find is DNA based, then there is still the possibility of common origin (of which we do not know how likely was). If however we find that we do not have common ancestry, then it's true - life common and bound to rise given the right circumstances. I actually ascribe to this view, although it's speculative.

Of all the possibilities - the most mindblowing is if we are alone. The most illuminating obviously is if we find something.


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## TheoKrueger (May 27, 2009)

as long as there are atoms all over the universe, there's chances there is life too, wherever god cared to bestow upon them some intellect


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## nikolas (May 27, 2009)

TheoKrueger @ Wed May 27 said:


> as long as there are atoms all over the universe, there's chances there is life too, wherever god cared to bestow upon them some intellect


Who? :lol:


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## TheoKrueger (May 27, 2009)

nikolas @ Wed May 27 said:


> TheoKrueger @ Wed May 27 said:
> 
> 
> > as long as there are atoms all over the universe, there's chances there is life too, wherever god cared to bestow upon them some intellect
> ...



God. You know, our maker, omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent and the giver of qualities like humour and intelligence so we can question his existence


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## Fernando Warez (May 27, 2009)

It's the Jew!







Borat. :mrgreen:


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## Richard Wilkinson (May 27, 2009)

TheoKrueger @ Wed May 27 said:


> nikolas @ Wed May 27 said:
> 
> 
> > TheoKrueger @ Wed May 27 said:
> ...



...oh dear.

:roll:


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## nikolas (May 27, 2009)

TheoKrueger @ Wed May 27 said:


> God. You know, our maker, omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent and the giver of qualities like humour and intelligence so we can question his existence


Theo... Συγνώμη ρε συ. Κάνω λιγο πλάκα, αλλά προς Θεού όχι σε βάρος οτιδήποτε, έτσι; 

(Theo is Greek... )

You mean God, god, gawd, or someone else? 

Dangerous turn this topic has taken... Beware! =o


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## TheoKrueger (May 27, 2009)

nikolas @ Wed May 27 said:


> TheoKrueger @ Wed May 27 said:
> 
> 
> > God. You know, our maker, omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent and the giver of qualities like humour and intelligence so we can question his existence
> ...



Δέν υπάρχει πρόβλημα φίλε Νικόλα, και εγώ χιουμοριστικά το έκανα το σχόλιο μου (απο ότι φαίνεται, μάλλον δέν μου έδωσε και πολύ χιούμορ ο Θεός τελικά :lol: είναι αυτο που λένε "όταν ο Θεός μοίραζε μυαλά εγώ κρατούσα ομπρέλα" 

I have one more philosophical question for today:

Oh God, why do i always get myself in such confusing situations? 

it's all good o-[][]-o

Cheers,
Theo


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## lux (May 27, 2009)

thats so cool reading Greek again, i made ancient greek at high school (even if i forgot almost everything except being able to speak whats written) and i've been so many times there, great place.


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## Waywyn (May 27, 2009)

It's a really interesting topic. I like it and every article regarding this matter let's me get carried away. Wether it's conspiracy, science facs or just belief ...

I think there is life out for sure. Why? Because all of our elements we have in the periodic table are just elements which were created out of other elements (helium and hydrogen).
All other elements are the results of certain fusions at certain temperatures at a certain pressure at a certain place at a certain time. So the gold in one of your filled tooth could probably be the result of a supernova, which happened a few billion years back then .. and the produced material got part when the earth formed around 4 billion years back.

... and so can be a part of your arm, leg, bone, hair or whatever.

So in the end all these elements in combination with the optimal conditions of a planet and the distance to it's sun could be a potential place for life. So look up at the sky and see almost every shining star being a sunlike star. There could be millions of life hosting planet in our galaxy only ... and then if you look up Google sky, there are thousand of discovered galaxies out there ...

Another good point Nikolas brought up. Not IF there is life, but WHEN it happened. Light travels with 300.000 km per second. This is really not imaginable if someone tells you that e.g. the crab nebula spans about 10 light years in size. It means the light would need 10 years to travel from e.g. the upper to the lower end ... so if we today see a galaxy or a nebula which is like 50.000 lightyears away, we actually see that place as it looked 50.000 years ago. One cool thing for scientists of course is that you could literally look back in time. Simply observe all kinds of galaxies and you can kind of compare how our galaxy looked to that time.

So the percentage of potential life increases even more since you can not only see the place (the universe in general) but also our forth dimension, which is time.


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## Waywyn (May 27, 2009)

Alex W @ Wed May 27 said:


> Not to mention galaxies. Sad thing is, they're only getting further away too. Apart from Andromeda, which our galaxy will collide with in a few billion years. That'll be fun.



Yeh, .. and the funny thing is Andromeda plus the Milky Way moves towards another big pile of galaxies which is called the great attractor ... imagine what that would look like when all those galaxies eat up themself and more or less take part of the gravity of each other.


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 27, 2009)

The scales are unimaginable. Our galaxy is 100,000 light years across, and the sun is a mediocre star - one of maybe 100 billion in our galaxy. There are more than 80 billion galaxies in the known universe.

And the scales are similarly unimaginable at the subatomic level.


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## Illuminati (May 27, 2009)

Oopps double post.. Cool


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## Niah (May 27, 2009)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihjfZAza ... re=related


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## Alex W (May 27, 2009)

I like the way Richard Dawkins puts it; we've grown up and evolved in what he calls "the middle world."

To sum up a speech he gave about it, our brains can comfortably navigate and comprehend things that are around our size - a rock looks like a solid object to us. But if we had evolved in the subatomic world, a rock would look like a matrix of atoms, and we would be able to fly straight through it. Then at the other end of the spectrum, comprehending star maps at the galactic scale is impossible.


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## Alex W (May 27, 2009)

Waywyn @ Thu May 28 said:


> Alex W @ Wed May 27 said:
> 
> 
> > Not to mention galaxies. Sad thing is, they're only getting further away too. Apart from Andromeda, which our galaxy will collide with in a few billion years. That'll be fun.
> ...



And even beyond that, we have heat death of the universe to look forward to. Trillions of years into the future, all the energy will have become heat, and nothing will exist apart from heat and black holes. Well, it's just a possible fate of the universe. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fate_of_the_universe


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 27, 2009)

Of course, there's no reason to assume there's only one universe - whatever that actually means.


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## Alex W (May 27, 2009)

Yeah, then there's the whole "multiverse" theory. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse
It's pretty much the ultimate mindfuck.


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## Thonex (May 27, 2009)

Πώς ήξερες ότι ήμουν ένας αλλοδαπός; Ακόμη χειρότερο ... ξενόφοβο ένα αλλοδαπό. :lol:


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## Waywyn (May 28, 2009)

Alex W @ Thu May 28 said:


> Yeah, then there's the whole "multiverse" theory. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse
> It's pretty much the ultimate mindfuck.



Yeh it's hardcore.
I made up another theory just out of fun, which I think could be quite possible 

Currently the universe is expanding and expanding. Currently noone knows what's going on. Will it be further expanding, getting colder and colder or will it "bounce back"?

I think this, if this would be possible, the universe might expand to a certain point and then moves back until it finally collapses again, which would to me another big bang like the one 13,7 billion years ago.

No see it in combination with time. We just experience time as we experience it. An hour is an hour to us etc. ... but see it from the mind of a fly. A flies reaction is much much much faster than a human. So if you would see through the eyes of a fly a human being tries to smash, it would look like kind of a scene from Matrix. Fly looks up, laughs, thinks "oh my, another idiot tries again and then simply fly away" .. most of the time 

So if you think time might go much much faster as we can imagine, it might be that the time from the big bang to the collapse might be just a pulse of like a few milliseconds and it repeats continuously ...


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## Waywyn (May 28, 2009)

Folmann @ Thu May 28 said:


> I love the Big Bang theory. The brightest minds in the world concluding it just HAD to start with a BIG explosion.



Yeh, you just have to google "cosmic background radiation". There is a certain light or energy visible at the "end" of the universe no matter where you look at, which just varies in like a few 1/10000 degrees in temperature. This background radiation is like the result of a very massive explosion which happened more or less 13.7 billion years ago. Kinda interesting.


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## Rodney Glenn (May 28, 2009)

Then you have the "dark matter" and "dark energy", which apparently constitutes the majority of the mass of the universe and yet we know close to nothing about it. (o)


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## artsoundz (May 28, 2009)

I know!- that guy is a total nut job.

For example, The reptilians will eat children of ALL sizes.


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## Alex W (May 28, 2009)

Folmann @ Thu May 28 said:


> I love the Big Bang theory. The brightest minds in the world concluding it just HAD to start with a BIG explosion.



Actually, the Big Bang theory came from a catholic priest .


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## Nick Batzdorf (May 28, 2009)

I hate to break this to you, Alex, but you aren't the first person to wonder whether the universe will contract. Stephen Hawking talks about "the current expansion" in A Brief History of Time, for example, and the question of whether or not there's enough matter for gravity to stop the universe from expanding forever is in every book about theoretical physics (a "closed" or "open" universe). I forget which author talks about the universe possibly breathing - expanding and contracting.

Folmann, Stephen Hawking talks about a no-boundary condition of time. The basic thoery is that the way we experience it - linearly - is only one way of looking at it; it's really "imaginary," and therefore has no boundary. So in a sense all time exists at once.

If you look at the universe that way, the matter "just is" - it was always there (even though he does believe in a singularity at the big bang).

Or if you look at it our way, you can say that there literally was no time before time began.


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## Ned Bouhalassa (May 28, 2009)

The universe is like the seasons that come around year after year after year. It's a big circle that keeps repeating its steps forever. Meanwhile, we just wait, and wait for Godot. Now who's been hogging the bong all this time?


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## JB78 (May 28, 2009)

artsoundz @ Thu May 28 said:


> I know!- that guy is a total nut job.
> 
> For example, The reptilians will eat children of ALL sizes.



Nope, you got it all wrong, that's the republicans not the reptilians...the lizards stick to small children.
(o)


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## nikolas (May 28, 2009)

Thonex @ Thu May 28 said:


> Πώς ήξερες ότι ήμουν ένας αλλοδαπός; Ακόμη χειρότερο ... ξενόφοβο ένα αλλοδαπό. :lol:


αλλοδαπός: illegal immegrant! ξενόφοβο: xenophobic...

something went wrong with babelfish, right?  hahahaha!

And a guy whose opinions I value very much (and I was a member of various organisations when I was a bit younger):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MnFMrNdj1yY&feature=fvst

Carl Sagan


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## Waywyn (May 28, 2009)

Sorry guys I have to kinda disagree, the "big bang" theory is not just something which is made up by a conspiracy guy, but it derives from lots of facts/experiments and observations from almost every scientist around the world (excluding the conspiracy guys here)

Of course I am not stating that this all 100% true or fact and scientists can only falsify what's going on ...., but if someone explains me 5+5=10 and I can kinda comprehend what my math teacher is telling me, I wouldn't believe that it could actually also be 9 or 11 or 10,3675497 

Again, I am not saying that this is 100% the absolute all knowing truth but there are some thing which are just obvious.

Google about: Cosmic background radiation, Planck world, Sachs-Wolfe effect, Hiubble effect (red and bueshift of light), Dark matter etc.


Anyway, what I initially wanted to really say, is that you can find all those elements we are made of and find on this planet are spread over the whole universe. If its gold, helium, hydrogen and everything else you can find in the periodic table. It's everywhere ... and if those elements and materials are everywhere, then everywhere life is possible


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## Waywyn (May 28, 2009)

Nick Batzdorf @ Thu May 28 said:


> I hate to break this to you, Alex, but you aren't the first person to wonder whether the universe will contract. Stephen Hawking talks about "the current expansion" in A Brief History of Time, for example, and the question of whether or not there's enough matter for gravity to stop the universe from expanding forever is in every book about theoretical physics (a "closed" or "open" universe). I forget which author talks about the universe possibly breathing - expanding and contracting.
> 
> Folmann, Stephen Hawking talks about a no-boundary condition of time. The basic thoery is that the way we experience it - linearly - is only one way of looking at it; it's really "imaginary," and therefore has no boundary. So in a sense all time exists at once.
> 
> ...



Yeh Nick, I didn't mean to say I invented it *lol*
But I am a real freak when it comes to the universe. So I get into all those scientist documentaries etc. an just imagined that thus expanding/collapsing thing is really happening all the time. We humans maybe measure 13,7 billion light years, but maybe it's just 10ms or even less.


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## Waywyn (May 28, 2009)

Folmann @ Thu May 28 said:


> Anybody really into wild Alien conspiracy theories should youtube "alex collier" - who hands down - have the wildest theories I have ever heard.
> 
> Example: "The bible was written by aliens", "Earth has a colony on Mars", "There is a hole in the north pole", "Reptilians live in huge underground complexes around the world and eat small children", "The moon is a space ship", "The greys are trying to breed with humans, since they don't have soul like we have".



.. and yes you are right. Those wild conspiracies are really funny to read and watch, ... but some are that wild, it's not even worth thinking about it


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## choc0thrax (May 28, 2009)

oops wrong thread


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## ceam (May 28, 2009)

Folmann @ Thu May 28 said:


> Anybody really into wild Alien conspiracy theories should youtube "alex collier" - who hands down - have the wildest theories I have ever heard.
> 
> Example: "The bible was written by aliens", "Earth has a colony on Mars", "There is a hole in the north pole", "Reptilians live in huge underground complexes around the world and eat small children", "The moon is a space ship", "The greys are trying to breed with humans, since they don't have soul like we have".



Is this like the chicken or the egg? Who came first Alex Collier or David Icke? I guess it is good reading/watching in time for the new V series reboot. Off to you tube for a good laugh.

Pete


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## PolarBear (May 28, 2009)

Alex W @ Thu May 28 said:


> Folmann @ Thu May 28 said:
> 
> 
> > I love the Big Bang theory. The brightest minds in the world concluding it just HAD to start with a BIG explosion.
> ...


And what was aroudn the Big Bang, where it was banging into? And what was there before it banged out? :D Was it a gang bang of Hancocks? 

Yet I think the word "start" is way too humanly thought here.  Plus... it implies an "end" also. Which probably the catholic priest was thinking about?


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## Thonex (May 28, 2009)

nikolas @ Thu May 28 said:


> Thonex @ Thu May 28 said:
> 
> 
> > Πώς ήξερες ότι ήμουν ένας αλλοδαπός; Ακόμη χειρότερο ... ξενόφοβο ένα αλλοδαπό. :lol:
> ...



Fun with Google translate: http://translate.google.com/translate_t?hl=en#

:D


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## Christian Marcussen (May 28, 2009)

Woa... Alex... who said BB was a conspiracy? I missed that


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## Ed (May 28, 2009)

Folmann @ Thu May 28 said:


> No, no Alex... What I meant is that the Big Bang theory is such a guy theory ... It just HAD to start with a BIG explosion ... .



The Big Bang is not talking about an "explosion" its about an expansion of space time. "The Big Bang" term was coined by Sir Fredrick Hoyle used in a derogatory sence. He never excepted the theory.


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## Christian Marcussen (May 28, 2009)

I sense Folmann is trying to make a little joke - nothing more. In that respect I think it's beside the point if it's technically an explostion or not.


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## Ed (May 29, 2009)

Christian Marcussen @ Thu May 28 said:


> I sense Folmann is trying to make a little joke - nothing more. In that respect I think it's beside the point if it's technically an explostion or not.



That makes more sence. heh. Im so used to dealing with Creationists that actually think the big bang theorises an explosion like a bomb. :lol:


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