# Orchestral Sample Libraries from Asian Developers



## GingerMaestro (May 14, 2019)

Having worked in South Korea and Japan a little in the past, the standard of orchestral playing particularly Strings is very high over there. Most of the libraries discussed here are from European, Australian or European developers. I was wondering if anyone has come across good orchestral sample libraries from any Asian developers ? Or perhaps many libraries that we use are recorded in Asia. Thanks


----------



## ProfoundSilence (May 14, 2019)

That's a good question. I suppose it probably has a lot to do with availability of equipment, venue, expertise(recording these groups is not the same as actually playing a concert, or even playing an instrument)

The better question is, are there any renowned scoring stages/studios in that neck of the woods?

Also, I'm really not sure if wages are cheaper or more expensive in SK/Japan... so that could factor into cost/reward. 

Are they culturally willing to take an excellent group of musicians and force them to painstakingly and mindnumbingly record samples for a string library? Maybe this isn't something discussed enough, but it is quite literally like hiring some of the best chefs in the world to make 100,000 PB and J's. 

and lastly, if what you say is true - and the standard of orchestral playing is particularly high for strings, then that means there is probably an abundance of string players looking for work - and might factor in the fact that it's easier to just hire a group that could track your piece in record time, or some session players to do a few takes to layer with samples. 

I don't know the answer to any of this, I'm just guessing factors that might account for the lack of libraries.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso (May 14, 2019)

I'd be curious to know this as well. I know there are Japanese sample library developers like Prominy, so there's probably at least someone there doing orchestral libraries. I think composers over there also use libraries from a lot of developers we're already familiar with, though — I recall a poster on this forum suggesting that there's a lot of Symphobia in Hiroyuki Sawano's soundtracks.


----------



## ProfoundSilence (May 14, 2019)

I know my favorite Tchaikovsky's 6th on youtube is a group from SK <3


----------



## dsblais (May 14, 2019)

GingerMaestro said:


> Having worked in South Korea and Japan a little in the past, the standard of orchestral playing particularly Strings is very high over there. Most of the libraries discussed here are from European, Australian or European developers. I was wondering if anyone has come across good orchestral sample libraries from any Asian developers ? Or perhaps many libraries that we use are recorded in Asia. Thanks



Historically, software programming from Asia has been well behind Europe in quality. Plenty of brilliant hardware engineers, but my understanding is that software development was given rather short shrift in the education systems in Japan and Korea. China has been deliberately making very fast gains in this field, and so the balance may shift in 5-10 years.

I would imagine this has reduced the development of VIs as well. An exception is perhaps VOCALOID, which is a very interesting and creative product but not exactly the most elegant example of software engineering.


----------



## constaneum (May 14, 2019)

I do notice lots of the Japanese Game Music composers are using softwares like East West SO or Hollywood series, Cinebrass , Garritan and even ProjectSAM. lots of familiar sounds from the game soundtracks. But they do tend to layer the ensemble with live soloists, especially strings.


----------



## thesteelydane (May 14, 2019)

Well, I live in Hanoi, does that count? While I'm not Asian, I do at least operate out of here most of the time. That said my (for now...) only product was recorded in Copenhagen, but I am now recording a bunch of traditional Việt instruments in ways they were never meant to be played. Nothing orchestral though.


----------



## MWMelis (May 14, 2019)

I can't comment on Asia developers but, in reference to ProfoundSilence's question, I know of only one scoring stage in Singapore that has experience and capability in recording string players. I'm not affiliated with the studio in any way so I'll share the details by PM if anyone is interested. That said, there are several fantastic theaters in Singapore which regularly host small recitals and large performances, and the facilities, sound and lighting equipment, and musicians are very high caliber. I'm involved with an arts organisation that regularly hosts events at these venues and I can attest to the fact that there is a deep pool of skilled musicians in Singapore that are available for work. Local support for live performance is unfortunately not quite to the level where these shows are sold out but support is building.

I have been considering arranging scoring sessions for my own works, as well as for others who may want to take advantage of the talent here through remote scoring sessions. Would anyone be interested in this?

FYI, I am long-time lurker but new member here. I will get around to submitting an introduction via the New Members section in due course (I promise).


----------



## Ihnoc (May 14, 2019)

There's some good threads on libraries of Japanese instruments (for example here) but, I've personally yet to find much outside of Vocaloid to the scale of what companies in the English speaking world are doing.

I'd really be interested in orchestral libraries and locations that have been made in Asia (for me Japan specifically). We can always use more ways of looking at orchestral.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

dsblais said:


> Historically, software programming from Asia has been well behind Europe in quality. Plenty of brilliant hardware engineers, but my understanding is that software development was given rather short shrift in the education systems in Japan and Korea. China has been deliberately making very fast gains in this field, and so the balance may shift in 5-10 years.
> 
> I would imagine this has reduced the development of VIs as well. An exception is perhaps VOCALOID, which is a very interesting and creative product but not exactly the most elegant example of software engineering.




This is absolutely true. Japan in particular has been great for hardware, but our programming is terrible. Most system design is just awful and the few focusing on virtual instruments tend to sound great but are programmed so poorly they become overly complicated to use.

As for venues, this is an east vs west thing. Asia has great venues of course but no venues westerners care about. However speaking only from the perspective of japan, we have fabulous players and I want to at some point get them into the biz of VI.


----------



## DSmolken (May 15, 2019)

There doesn't seem to be much happening with orchestral samples that I'm aware of. But in additionto what's already been mentioned, I think Ample Sound is based in China. In Japan, TK Drums is a developer doing some very detailed kits - just finished a Gretsch and started on a Ludwig that's 82 GB of raw sample recordings so far, if machine translation is telling me the truth. Unreal Instruments also has some excellent free stuff, from traditional to metal guitar, but again nothing orchestral.

In addition to having a high standard for string players, the mandolin orchestra tradition is possibly also possibly more alive in Japan than anywhere else in the world. I know (and have sampled) a Polish cellist who's done a contract on Hokkaido a few years ago, I could ask her if she knows anything about the national standards, or what the "holy grail" venues are.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

DSmolken said:


> There doesn't seem to be much happening with orchestral samples that I'm aware of. But in additionto what's already been mentioned, I think Ample Sound is based in China. In Japan, TK Drums is a developer doing some very detailed kits - just finished a Gretsch and started on a Ludwig that's 82 GB of raw sample recordings so far, if machine translation is telling me the truth. Unreal Instruments also has some excellent free stuff, from traditional to metal guitar, but again nothing orchestral.
> 
> In addition to having a high standard for string players, the mandolin orchestra tradition is possibly also possibly more alive in Japan than anywhere else in the world. I know (and have sampled) a Polish cellist who's done a contract on Hokkaido a few years ago, I could ask her if she knows anything about the national standards, or what the "holy grail" venues are.



https://enjp.blouinartinfo.com/news/story/911885/tokyos-top-6-concert-halls

there are tons of great unique halls around the country. we don't lack in that respect. while japan values orchestral sounds in its scores and pop music, the market for VI's is mostly for pop and scores that don't have the budget for real strings. Most TV networks have in house music departments with go-to orchestras, so there isn't always a need to really do things with VI. If they can do it with real strings, they will, and its not hard to do. The players are top notch. Japan itself may not have a need for Japanese orchestral VIs, but i think the world could benefit from it. So if there are any programmers and developers out there looking to jump on it, we can make it happen, but not with japanese developers...they just cant get it done in a way that is practical, intuitive and playable.

I hate to be harsh because prominy has great sounding guitars, but they are so ridiculously difficult to program for no particular reason that i can tell. Ample Sounds and perhaps Heavier 7 string are examples of i believe chinese programmers who are better at it..maybe its the english/programming level is different. I think for japan, Vocaloids are another example of TERRIBLE programming for such a good concept.


----------



## DSmolken (May 15, 2019)

Would the real strings for pop and TV there be recorded in a concert hall, or in a studio? That might be a sound a lot of people across the world would pay good money for in VI form.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

DSmolken said:


> Would the real strings for pop and TV there be recorded in a concert hall, or in a studio? That might be a sound a lot of people across the world would pay good money for in VI form.



depends entirely on the project. Both are commonly used. there are great recording studios, scoring studios and concert halls that I think people would benefit from having access to in both IR and in players creating libraries in those venues.


----------



## composerdk (May 15, 2019)

Before adding my opinion, I’d like to mention that I’m an Asian(South Korean).
I think there are 4 main skills that are required to run a sample library development business successfully; understanding of music(recording, orchestration, etc)/sampling technology/sample library market and English.
And actually, without English skills, one may not understand sampling technologies and sample library market, because the newest information of those are all in English.
Because Asians are generally not good at English, it’s unlikely to be or find a person who has all the 4 skills above.
If the market were huge, one could just hire many people and split the work, but it’s not, so I guess that’s the reason it’s hard to find Asian sample library developers.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

composerdk said:


> Before adding my opinion, I’d like to mention that I’m an Asian(South Korean).
> I think there are 4 main skills that are required to run a sample library development business successfully; understanding of music(recording, orchestration, etc)/sampling technology/sample library market and English.
> And actually, without English skills, one may not understand sampling technologies and sample library market, because the newest information of those are all in English.
> Because Asians are generally not good at English, it’s unlikely to be or find a person who has all the 4 skills above.
> If the market were huge, one could just hire many people and split the work, but it’s not, so I guess that’s the reason it’s hard to find Asian sample library developers.



The english is a major factor. Even if you wanted to hire the project out to another programmer from outside of asia, the communication between them would be hard enough. We need more english speakers to be in the middle to handle the logistics and the marketing on such libraries.


----------



## VgsA (May 15, 2019)

Maybe it has something to do with the tendency they have to make music that sounds ''retro''. Like in this recent release, Dragon Quest XI:



I also spoke in the past to several AAA Japanese composers who think that VIs are not really important. I even got a ''that's not music'' when I showed them my work back in the day, and they added ''music comes from real musicians, not computers, so that's not music'' (I'm not going to say who, obviously, but I can assure they're very well known).

I don't know, they have this tendency to use retro sounds on their productions, then release outstanding CDs with recordings from real orchestras (that very same game I showed before is a perfect example):



Of course, this is not 100% of the cases, but it's something I see often.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

VgsA said:


> Maybe it has something to do with the tendency they have to make music that sounds ''retro''. Like in this recent release, Dragon Quest XI:
> 
> 
> I also spoke in the past to several AAA Japanese composers who think that VIs are not really important. I even got a ''that's not music'' when I showed them my work back in the day, and they added ''music comes from real musicians, not computers, so that's not music'' (I'm not going to say who, obviously, but I can assure they're very well known).
> ...




I think from the western perspective its valid to say retro. From the Japanese perspective, its a case of being stuck. Without embracing anything new, music has mostly not changed for almost 20 years. The arrangements, the types of instruments and the software are painfully stuck. The more adventurous people who use VI will occasionally use the libraries that don't need much english to get them..like some spitfire, 8dio, and most stock libraries like NI stuff. The rest are pretty much stuck to legacy stuff. It is no surprise that AAA composers generally don't think they need anything more than software sufficient for a mockup before using a real orchestra. Part of that also has to do with the fact that they're AAA composers, and the biz here will give top tier creators whatever they want. It's terribly bad for the future of Japenese media, not because it cant keep up with the west, but because it cant innovate a unique and new Japanese sound.


----------



## ism (May 15, 2019)

This is an Indian sample company, I've used them they're quite good.

http://www.swarsystems.com/SwarShala/


----------



## VgsA (May 15, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> I think from the western perspective its valid to say retro. From the Japanese perspective, its a case of being stuck. Without embracing anything new, music has mostly not changed for almost 20 years. The arrangements, the types of instruments and the software are painfully stuck. The more adventurous people who use VI will occasionally use the libraries that don't need much english to get them..like some spitfire, 8dio, and most stock libraries like NI stuff. The rest are pretty much stuck to legacy stuff. It is no surprise that AAA composers generally don't think they need anything more than software sufficient for a mockup before using a real orchestra. Part of that also has to do with the fact that they're AAA composers, and the biz here will give top tier creators whatever they want. It's terribly bad for the future of Japenese media, not because it cant keep up with the west, but because it cant innovate a unique and new Japanese sound.



Then you have this:



And it's like wow... (NieR:Automata has an outstanding soundtrack, and I think it sounds very genuine).


----------



## VgsA (May 15, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> The rest are pretty much stuck to legacy stuff.



Specifically Logic stock stuff, which I see often.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

VgsA said:


> Then you have this:
> 
> 
> 
> And it's like wow... (NieR:Automata has an outstanding soundtrack, and I think it sounds very genuine).



this is beautiful, but totally standard japanese/anime music. There are a number of pop artists, anime singers and game music that pretty much is like this in Japan. Even the strings style, while gorgeous, is so lacking in individuality for this market, that it doesnt even really stand out as much to me. I think you could compare this to a lot of the AAA RPG soundtracks from the late 90s to early 2000s and you'd find a lot of the similar.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

VgsA said:


> Specifically Logic stock stuff, which I see often.



I see a lot of people in the Digital Performer or Cubase pocket here. Logic also makes sense because they all have better Japanese language support than many other DAWs.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

I should add that a flaw of composition in japan is that its focused less on innovation and more on maintaining the quality of whats there. I know that many composers end up coming out of basic apprenticeships with the top name creators from the generation before. So they're not focused on making new music, as much as preserving the tradition of what came from the composers that taught them. The most innovative things in Japan happen on the indie level where Japanese creators are allowed to be shamelessly "weird".


----------



## VgsA (May 15, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> I think you could compare this to a lot of the AAA RPG soundtracks from the late 90s to early 2000s and you'd find a lot of the similar.



Ummm so there is a sense of individuality, right? I mean, you can recognize the Japanese music style there, so that makes it special, right? I think I missed something, sorry. Oh, and when you say RPGs, you mean JRPGs, right?


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

VgsA said:


> Ummm so there is a sense of individuality, right? I mean, you can recognize the Japanese music style there, so that makes it special, right? I think I missed something, sorry. Oh, and when you say RPGs, you mean JRPGs, right?


yes JRPGs. 


Sorry what i mean to say is, that from the outside perspective, there is an iconic Japanese sound. From the japanese internal perspective, that sound is so standard that there is little variation between composers. Quite often these composers who get big gig after big gig are not valued because they are unique, but because they are consistent and predictable. Theres a sense of hierarchy so when you become the top player, you get all the work, and more often than not, your apprentice or someone in your circle will get the work after you're gone.

As a standard, japanese music is high quality and unique from western music. However, its a bit redundant when you consider how many people are here doing the exact same things. If we had the quality, and the variety, it'd be great. Nonetheless, I would love to have VI with Japanese players that could break in the western markets.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

pop examples of good but typical orchestration in japan. a great string sound I have had a hard time emulating with VI, but is obviously not impossible.


----------



## VgsA (May 15, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> pop examples of good but typical orchestration in japan. a great string sound I have had a hard time emulating with VI, but is obviously not impossible.




Oops, both videos not available it says, but I totally get what you mean. Thanks for the insight! Much appreciated, and really interesting point of view!


----------



## DSmolken (May 15, 2019)

I got the first video to play, solo strings in that well-trained classical players playing pop where they understand what's supposed to be happening and aren't just sightreading and collecting a paycheck way. Not an easy sound to get with VIs, as expressive solo strings never are, but nothing non-standard, either.


chocobitz825 said:


> The most innovative things in Japan happen on the indie level where Japanese creators are allowed to be shamelessly "weird".


There are some, though - about 20% of my sales are from Japan, mainly thanks to articles on the computermusic.jp site. Kind of funny that people over there would want, say, a 1970s Soviet Bloc guitar, but apparently some do.


----------



## Genki (May 15, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> I see a lot of people in the Digital Performer or Cubase pocket here. Logic also makes sense because they all have better Japanese language support than many other DAWs.



Studio One has also apparently become one of the top 3 DAWs used in Japan.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

Genki said:


> Studio One has also apparently become one of the top 3 DAWs used in Japan.



thats what i prefer. Its japanese support is great. I imagine ex-cubase users can transition easily


----------



## Genki (May 15, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> thats what i prefer. Its japanese support is great. I imagine ex-cubase users can transition easily



I love it, it's also what I use as my main DAW. And yeah I saw I think it has a whole Japanese manual for download


----------



## Loïc D (May 15, 2019)

@chocobitz825 : all your posts are exactly the conclusion I came to after talking to japanese musicians, Sony PR in Taiwan, indie studio owners, music shops.

I remember that once I asked a music shop clerk about Japanese VI. He was surprised and smiled and said to me : here we use this, pointing at an EastWest Symphonic Orchestra box on the shelf.
It also seems that most shops don’t even know that there are also VI companies in Japan (or maybe they don’t want to talk about them).

Very interesting thread indeed


----------



## Will Blackburn (May 15, 2019)

Sonica have some really nice expressive libraries. Hope they do more in the Kontakt realm. 

http://www.sonica.jp/instruments/index.php/en/


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

LowweeK said:


> @chocobitz825 : all your posts are exactly the conclusion I came to after talking to japanese musicians, Sony PR in Taiwan, indie studio owners, music shops.
> 
> I remember that once I asked a music shop clerk about Japanese VI. He was surprised and smiled and said to me : here we use this, pointing at an EastWest Symphonic Orchestra box on the shelf.
> It also seems that most shops don’t even know that there are also VI companies in Japan (or maybe they don’t want to talk about them).
> ...



Honestly, the only major shift I've seen toward VI is in the pop world that still demands strings but cant afford it anymore. Everyone else, I wouldn't be surprised if they figured yamaha was the only japanese developer.


----------



## constaneum (May 15, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> this is beautiful, but totally standard japanese/anime music. There are a number of pop artists, anime singers and game music that pretty much is like this in Japan. Even the strings style, while gorgeous, is so lacking in individuality for this market, that it doesnt even really stand out as much to me. I think you could compare this to a lot of the AAA RPG soundtracks from the late 90s to early 2000s and you'd find a lot of the similar.



I'm a Malaysian Chinese but hmmm...there's nothing wrong with being standard japanese /anime music. They're just great !! I'm a big fan of japanese music. Final Fantasy's Nobuo Uematsu is the reason why i've ventured into music composition as a hobbyist initially (back in my uni days).


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

constaneum said:


> I'm a Malaysian Chinese but hmmm...there's nothing wrong with being standard japanese /anime music. They're just great !! I'm a big fan of japanese music. Final Fantasy's Nobuo Uematsu is the reason why i've ventured into music composition as a hobbyist initially (back in my uni days).



Again, there’s nothing wrong with the quality of the music, the problem is in the lack of variety within this scene. You have Uematsu and then 5000 composers who try to be him on a budget. No one comes in and says “I’m gonna do what hasn’t been done before and take this to a new level.” As much as I respect uematsu’s style, it should be cause for alarm that after 20+ years that’s still the only person people reference overall for the Japanese JRPG scoring scene. It’s bad for the future of our industry if we can’t evolve what’s good and make it better. How many more western composers could you reference who have unique style they have contributed? For better or worse japan has no Hans Zimmer. I’d say the most popular names people recognize from Japan are Joe Hisaishi and Uematsu... and after that the entirety of this industry might as well be non existent.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso (May 15, 2019)

I definitely wouldn’t say the Nier: Automata soundtrack on the whole is much like others I’ve heard...

As far as other noteworthy Japanese composers go, Yuki Kajiura and Yoko Kanno are two who immediately come to mind as having pretty distinctive voices. I could recognize Kajiura’s work anywhere.


----------



## constaneum (May 15, 2019)

Joe Hisaishi....my favourite too. I labeled him as Asian version of John Williams....

Why Hans Zimmer? coz it's the latest trend??? Dont get me wrong, i do like some of his works, like Pirates of the Caribbean. However, he's like Nobuo Uematsu as well. Everyone looks up to him and wanna be like him. He brings in interesting things for orchestra but lots of movie soundtracks , i'm hearing Hans Zimmer style music every where. Same thing isn't it at the end? ahaha


----------



## constaneum (May 15, 2019)

Sarah Mancuso said:


> I definitely wouldn’t say the Nier: Automata soundtrack on the whole is much like others I’ve heard...
> 
> As far as other noteworthy Japanese composers go, Yuki Kajiura and Yoko Kanno are two who immediately come to mind as having pretty distinctive voices. I could recognize Kajiura’s work anywhere.



Yuki Kajiura indeed but not Yoko Kanno. Yuki is mainly her strings and the vocalists.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

constaneum said:


> Joe Hisaishi....my favourite too. I labeled him as Asian version of John Williams....
> 
> Why Hans Zimmer? coz it's the latest trend??? Dont get me wrong, i do like some of his works, like Pirates of the Caribbean. However, he's like Nobuo Uematsu as well. Everyone looks up to him and wanna be like him. He brings in interesting things for orchestra but lots of movie soundtracks , i'm hearing Hans Zimmer style music every where. Same thing isn't it at the end? ahaha



Haha yeah thats why i say for better or worse. For better in that fact that he was new blood that offered some new elements and approaches, but for worse because as you say he has become somewhat of a trendsetter that too many tried to imitate. It’s hard to find an equivalent songwriter, producer or composer from the last 10-15 years and thats a dry spell that isn’t good for progress. This even shows itself in how rare it is to get standout anime, games and movies at level of the things out of the 90s and 80s in Japan. Everything has become scaled down and less imaginative. You got a few rare exceptions of course, but overall the world of imagination in Japan has gone smaller rather than bigger.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso (May 15, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> This even shows itself in how rare it is to get standout anime, games and movies at level of the things out of the 90s and 80s in Japan. Everything has become scaled down and less imaginative. You got a few rare exceptions of course, but overall the world of imagination in Japan has gone smaller rather than bigger.


I couldn't disagree more.

Nostalgia is a poison.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

Sarah Mancuso said:


> I couldn't disagree more.
> 
> Nostalgia is a poison.




I'm not saying it needs to return to what it was, I'm saying its current state of being is less the result of inspiration, and moreso the result of restrictions in resources, budget and opportunity. In response, much of japanese media has take one of two paths. Give up and focus on a limited scale release aimed at Japan only, or the other side which attempts futile superficial attempts at mimicking western media often at the expense of its "japanesey-ness". Neither has shown to be more profitable, and neither has shown to help encourage creators to try more. Also because of this, consumption of Japanese media is down and is often lost to other markets. Jpop and its other popular forms of media have been replaced with KPOP in the public eye. Anime has moved away from Japanese studios to non-japanese studios that do "anime-ish" productions for less than Japanese studios cost. Gaming companies that have attempted to keep up with the international market have underperformed. Japan's overall market value is decreasing and the only reason it still makes noise is because of the japanese markets unique consumerism that favors physical media. 

Don't get me wrong, Japanese media, composition and the market overall can be better without trying to be what it was. My issue is with an uninspired Japanese market, despite its incredible potential for international success and unique identity.


----------



## Sarah Mancuso (May 15, 2019)

Outsourcing has been a thing for decades to reduce the labor burden, but as far as animation production goes, Japanese productions are still primarily made in Japan. There are even English-language sites like Sakugablog that get as deep as chronicling the contributions of individual animators and other staff members in the industry, so all this information is readily accessible.

Meanwhile, Japanese media’s international streaming revenues from China, the west, and elsewhere aren’t insignificant and are continuing to grow, so while Japan doesn’t have Kpop it’s still putting out a lot of media that the outside world cares about. There’s real innovation that hasn’t gone unnoticed, too: Houseki no Kuni was used as reference material for the advanced CG animation techniques in Into The Spiderverse.

And now being entirely subjective here, I’ve frequently been awed by the creativity, versatility, and pure skill of many of the composers and other creators coming out of Japan, and reducing that to “90s JRPG music” is missing a lot.


----------



## DSmolken (May 15, 2019)

Can we come back to the idea that there are great string players in Japan, and money in sampling those players well, making user-friendly VIs, and selling those globally?

What would be the best sound to market - standard orchestra-size sections in a concert hall, or smaller sections perhaps in a studio? If any classic high-budget JPRGs used real strings, how were those recorded? Sorry, I have no clue... I remember knowing somebody who played Final Fantasy maybe 15 years ago, and I remember the "stop fisting android girls" meme from Nier two years ago, and that's all my knowledge of those things.

I'm in contact with Unreal Instruments via machine-translated English, helping get GUIs set up for that free stuff, which will hopefully help make it more popular globally. Will post that in the freebies thread when it's ready. That's a looooong way from sampling orchestral strings, but it might well lead to smaller commercial instruments, which might then lead to bigger instruments. Insert "I'm doing my part" meme here, haha.


----------



## chocobitz825 (May 15, 2019)

Sarah Mancuso said:


> Outsourcing has been a thing for decades to reduce the labor burden, but as far as animation production goes, Japanese productions are still primarily made in Japan. There are even English-language sites like Sakugablog that get as deep as chronicling the contributions of individual animators and other staff members in the industry, so all this information is readily accessible.
> 
> Meanwhile, Japanese media’s international streaming revenues from China, the west, and elsewhere aren’t insignificant and are continuing to grow, so while Japan doesn’t have Kpop it’s still putting out a lot of media that the outside world cares about. There’s real innovation that hasn’t gone unnoticed, too: Houseki no Kuni was used as reference material for the advanced CG animation techniques in Into The Spiderverse.
> 
> And now being entirely subjective here, I’ve frequently been awed by the creativity, versatility, and pure skill of many of the composers and other creators coming out of Japan, and reducing that to “90s JRPG music” is missing a lot.




So for clarification, I don't mean that Japanese studios are en masse flocking to foreign studios to save costs. What I mean is that anime reached such a level of popularity that many non-japanese properties came about to make anime-like new IP. This is cases where western cartoons or comics are made to look like japanese style, and for the user-end the difference of is irrelevant. It doesnt matter if its "made in japan" or not. those new products in japanese style don't create revenue for the japanese market. Its not, at this point, a complete takeover of any kind, but the problem lies in Japan's inability to make products that serve the general international market, outside of the niche otaku-anime fan market. So in the long run, non-japanese entities can resell japanese style products that better suit foreign markets, decreasing the need for authentic japanese products.

Anyways, I had it in my mind to responsd to everything, but it would have been long and off topic from what this thread was about. Conversations for another place and time.




DSmolken said:


> Can we come back to the idea that there are great string players in Japan, and money in sampling those players well, making user-friendly VIs, and selling those globally?
> 
> What would be the best sound to market - standard orchestra-size sections in a concert hall, or smaller sections perhaps in a studio? If any classic high-budget JPRGs used real strings, how were those recorded? Sorry, I have no clue... I remember knowing somebody who played Final Fantasy maybe 15 years ago, and I remember the "stop fisting android girls" meme from Nier two years ago, and that's all my knowledge of those things.
> 
> I'm in contact with Unreal Instruments via machine-translated English, helping get GUIs set up for that free stuff, which will hopefully help make it more popular globally. Will post that in the freebies thread when it's ready. That's a looooong way from sampling orchestral strings, but it might well lead to smaller commercial instruments, which might then lead to bigger instruments. Insert "I'm doing my part" meme here, haha.



I definitely think that a first step is intimate solo/quartet-to-chamber size strings. The detail that can be had in that size can better showcase the quality of Japanese players, as well as some of the common ways in which a lot of Japanese productions are done. So again I reference prominy which sound INCREDIBLE but is totally unplayable. This is everything I want to avoid. It's a hard thing to say if the most natural way is to take the most expressive performance and let users enjoy that like Tina Guo's Cello V1, that is full of character at the expense of versatility, or if its better to go along the CSS route and try and make the most playable library that gets as close as possible to the expressiveness available from the players. I've worked with a number of players who commonly are involved in the recordings of strings, piano and other instruments on anime, pop and gaming projects (final fantasy included) but my issue here with making such a library is the programming.


----------



## DivingInSpace (May 15, 2019)

thesteelydane said:


> Well, I live in Hanoi, does that count? While I'm not Asian, I do at least operate out of here most of the time. That said my (for now...) only product was recorded in Copenhagen, but I am now recording a bunch of traditional Việt instruments in ways they were never meant to be played. Nothing orchestral though.


So bunker strings was recorded in Copenhagen? Care to elaborate on which stage/studio? I am not aware of any other libraries recorded in Denmark, so it could be fun to know.


----------



## thesteelydane (May 16, 2019)

DivingInSpace said:


> So bunker strings was recorded in Copenhagen? Care to elaborate on which stage/studio? I am not aware of any other libraries recorded in Denmark, so it could be fun to know.



A private studio inside a bunker. More in this thread: https://vi-control.net/community/threads/bunker-strings-vol-1-playable-modern-string-textures.79438/


----------



## DSmolken (May 16, 2019)

chocobitz825 said:


> I definitely think that a first step is intimate solo/quartet-to-chamber size strings. The detail that can be had in that size can better showcase the quality of Japanese players, as well as some of the common ways in which a lot of Japanese productions are done. So again I reference prominy which sound INCREDIBLE but is totally unplayable. This is everything I want to avoid. It's a hard thing to say if the most natural way is to take the most expressive performance and let users enjoy that like Tina Guo's Cello V1, that is full of character at the expense of versatility, or if its better to go along the CSS route and try and make the most playable library that gets as close as possible to the expressiveness available from the players. I've worked with a number of players who commonly are involved in the recordings of strings, piano and other instruments on anime, pop and gaming projects (final fantasy included) but my issue here with making such a library is the programming.


Yeah, I agree that something smaller would be more practical to start with. Also easier to arrange the people and space to record. Chamber might be easier than solo because things aren't quite as exposed. Say, a 3-cello or 4-violin ensemble.

A developer might jump on the opportunity to partner with you on something like that. Not me, I got too much recorded already and want to get a choir recorded in Ghana on top of it, but seems like there is money to be made here. Either a foreign developer who can handle the scripting and interface and everything, or a Japanese developer who's willing to implement your ideas of ease of use. If you know players who can do this right, that's already a big step.


----------



## DSmolken (May 18, 2019)

Also, hey, there's a few orchestral instruments here:

https://mentsuyu-roll.wixsite.com/tofutosample/japanesemalletgirl

Only 1.49 GB and only 3000 yen, so not a deluxe string library, but...


----------



## Sarah Mancuso (May 18, 2019)

Their branding and GUIs are adorable, I love them! Nice sounds too 

I like the exclamation on the Celeste's GUI that it's not really a mallet instrument.

edit: I just saw the VN-style narrated guitar tutorial. Life would be brighter if every Kontakt instrument was like this.


----------



## Loïc D (May 18, 2019)

Excellent tutorial !
I wish too that editors make their tutorials so straightforward & funny


----------



## kessel (Aug 2, 2019)

Premier Sound Factory has some keys and an acoustic bass in HQ to offer, if I'm right they're recorded in Japan: 








PREMIER SOUND FACTORY


productsproducts




www.premiersoundfactory.com





If you're interested in traditional japanese instruments as well, I made a list of what I've found so far here:





List of Japanese Instruments VSTs


Hi, I'm going to copy/paste a post I did on a different forum just in case someone is interested in japanese instruments as VST and if you do know some more to add to this list For those interested in japanese VSTs, I did some research on Japanese VSTs months ago, I ended up buying some of...




vi-control.net


----------



## kessel (Aug 2, 2019)

Will Blackburn said:


> Sonica have some really nice expressive libraries. Hope they do more in the Kontakt realm.
> 
> http://www.sonica.jp/instruments/index.php/en/




They're going to release a new Kontakt library for Kabuki & Noh sounds this month, and offering some deals on pre-sale as well as in their existing libraries as well...









Blog - Sonica Instruments







sonica.jp


----------



## Denkii (Aug 2, 2019)

Three body technology is based in China as well.


----------



## Will Blackburn (Aug 2, 2019)

How do you actually buy those Libs on Tofuto Sample? I see the price but there's no transaction button ?


----------



## chocobitz825 (Aug 2, 2019)

Will Blackburn said:


> How do you actually buy those Libs on Tofuto Sample? I see the price but there's no transaction button ?



click on the name of the product just above the price and it will take you to a page to add the item to your cart


----------



## Will Blackburn (Aug 2, 2019)

Literally can't click on anything on that page apart from the Link to the free version Zip File at the bottom and a symbol at the top that gives you the whole library without the samples. Turned adblock off and same thing. I presume you mean this bit but can't click anything.


----------



## DSmolken (Aug 2, 2019)

The link on the mallets page doesn't seem to work for me either but the one the guitars page did, so try https://touhutomentsuyu.booth.pm/ for a link to the main store page.


----------



## kessel (Aug 2, 2019)

In case it might be of help, when you buy something on booth.pm you can switch the language to English at the very bottom of their website:






If I remember correctly you might need to make a second account for payment on pixiv, at least this is how I make my purchases on booth.pm... hope it helps


----------



## TomaeusD (Aug 3, 2019)

VgsA said:


> Maybe it has something to do with the tendency they have to make music that sounds ''retro''. Like in this recent release, Dragon Quest XI:
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Sugiyama is the exception, from what I've seen and heard, and he's also not well regarded in many circles now. Composers like Ryuichi Sakamoto, Masashi Hamauzu, Hitoshi Sakamoto, and many others are far more experimental and open to VIs. Sample libraries are more widely used in game music from the east now, even if some still incorporate older sound modules because of familiarity or to capture that retro sound, but even that isn't just straight midi. As far as production and development of prominent sample libraries, that's a different story. But I think there are many in Japan that have been at the forefront of utilizing breath control tech, physical modeling, synthesis (Korg and Roland), etc. It would be interesting to get some solid polling data, though, as a lot of what I've said is anecdotal.

And now this gives me a chance to share a couple underrated YouTube channels I've followed recently:
t 1 (https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC_0-BSftBO_vPHNxN40XSMQ/videos)
Mizuki Tachibana (https://www.youtube.com/user/124aska/videos)


----------



## DSmolken (Apr 9, 2020)

FWIW everything at Tofuto is 50% off until April 30th, 2020. That includes the piano, orchestral mallets, and the rest.









Tofuto Sample - BOOTH


主にKONTAKT向けライブラリを置いています。Japanese Mallet Girl [DL版](¥ 4,000), 翡翠のピアノ [DL版](¥ 5,000), 48Margin Power Girl [DL版](¥ 4,500), HandMadeDrummerPro [DL版](¥ 7,500), 48Margin Aco [DL版](¥ 7,000)




touhutomentsuyu.booth.pm


----------



## darcvision (Apr 9, 2020)

from what i know
1. yuka kitamura using berlin brass for her composition (bloodborne, dark souls )
2. kawai kenji using KOMPLETE collection ( i saw his documentary )
3. joe hisaishi using lexicon reverb in princess mononoke( not sure if this is true )
4. yasutaka nakata (famous edm producer) using MASSIVE and some old KOMPLETE drum and cubase 5 (source gearslutz)
edit:
5. keichi okabe using logic pro x (source :  )


----------



## MSutherlandComp (Apr 10, 2020)

stefandy31 said:


> from what i know
> 1. yuka kitamura using berlin brass for her composition (bloodborne, dark souls )
> 2. kawai kenji using KOMPLETE collection ( i saw his documentary )
> 3. joe hisaishi using lexicon reverb in princess mononoke( not sure if this is true )
> ...




I have no actual source or confirmation for this, but I've been studying the Nier OST + orchestral arrangement albums for a couple of months now. It seems to me that Okabe uses presets from NI's Una Corda pretty frequently. (i.e. the reverse preset sounds _identical_ to the reversed piano in the loading screen.) So I think it's more than likely that he uses a few elements from Komplete et cetera.

(Slightly off topic, but I've mocked-up a couple of his tracks from the game (Memories of Dust, etc.) and what he's done in terms of orchestration is quite something.)

As a side note, I saw a post on Sonica's website a few years ago stating that they had sampled a Hichiriki as well, but haven't seen any updates on it since then. Slightly disappointing, as I would love to have something to pair up with their Shō. Legatone has one, but it's extremely artificial sounding.

Also highly tangential, here is a blog post that I found that details the VI's used by several prominent Japanese composers, including Hiroyuki Sawano, Yuki Hayashi, et cetera. They're basically all from western developers. Many of them write a lot of stuff using traditional Japanese instrumentation, so it's odd to me that there are so few sample libraries available, even when parsing the web in Japanese. I wonder what they're using to mock them ... I have a theory that it's still a lot of old Roland modules, Akai sample disks, etc.


----------



## darcvision (Apr 10, 2020)

MSutherlandComp said:


> I have no actual source or confirmation for this, but I've been studying the Nier OST + orchestral arrangement albums for a couple of months now. It seems to me that Okabe uses presets from NI's Una Corda pretty frequently. (i.e. the reverse preset sounds _identical_ to the reversed piano in the loading screen.) So I think it's more than likely that he uses a few elements from Komplete et cetera.
> 
> (Slightly off topic, but I've mocked-up a couple of his tracks from the game (Memories of Dust, etc.) and what he's done in terms of orchestration is quite something.)
> 
> ...


thanks for sharing.... so many composer in japan using LASS and 8dio majestica....
found another source, so yuka kitamura using 8dio century strings and cubase


----------



## Ruffian Price (Apr 11, 2020)

Here's a collaborative list of composer equipment if you'd like to contribute: http://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1JJBlHHDc65fhZmKUGLrDTLCm6rfUU83-kbuD8Y0zU0o/edit#gid=797601028


----------



## bryla (Apr 11, 2020)

Sawano uses stuff like 8dio for strings and choir at least but records live strings and rhythm section.


----------



## MSutherlandComp (Apr 11, 2020)

bryla said:


> Sawano uses stuff like 8dio for strings and choir at least but records live strings and rhythm section.


You're absolutely correct. I was more pointing towards them as some of the mockup tools that he uses. I think he usually ends up tracking/recording almost everything, judging by his frequent twitter posts with pictures of recording sessions etc.

Edit: He's also pretty infamous for layering synths in underneath live recordings.


----------



## baofu (Apr 12, 2020)

It's hard to find a manufacturer that deals in Okinawan musical instruments (sanshin).








Versus Audio


KONTAKT音源を製作・販売する、VersusAudio公式サイト




versusaudio.com


----------



## DSmolken (Apr 29, 2020)

Went and bought the Tofuto Japanese Mallet Girl. Not super-deep but nice and consistent in feel. Two dynamic layers, no choice of beaters or articulations, three mics, nice tone. I just need something simple for pop tracks, and it's less than $15 at the 50% off, sooo...


----------



## Johnny (Apr 29, 2020)

Sarah Mancuso said:


> I definitely wouldn’t say the Nier: Automata soundtrack on the whole is much like others I’ve heard...
> 
> As far as other noteworthy Japanese composers go, Yuki Kajiura and Yoko Kanno are two who immediately come to mind as having pretty distinctive voices. I could recognize Kajiura’s work anywhere.


A soundtrack that won best original score 2 years consecutively- Best Score/*Soundtrack* Square Enix Company Platinum Games, Best Score/*Soundtrack* Keiichi Okabe Keigo Hoashi. Before someone bashes any composer, they should acknowledge that there just might be a planet of humans that controversially voted against their opinion, maybe even finding that particular composer (in this instance for Nier Automata) to probably be the best choice for the provided situation. Can you or myself score this game better and make it sound less generic? I challenge anyone to play the game themselves, and tell us in your experience how good or bad you felt the music was for this particular AAA title? Take note of the music integration system as well, including all scored Cinematics and explain why it didn't work for you in musical terms, and why it felt generic?  (Friendly shots fired, don't worry  I come in peace!)


----------



## Sarah Mancuso (Apr 29, 2020)

Johnny said:


> A soundtrack that won best original score 2 years consecutively- Best Score/*Soundtrack* Square Enix Company Platinum Games, Best Score/*Soundtrack* Keiichi Okabe Keigo Hoashi. Before someone bashes any composer, they should acknowledge that there just might be a planet of humans that controversially voted against their opinion, maybe even finding that particular composer (in this instance for Nier Automata) to probably be the best choice for the provided situation. Can you or myself score this game better and make it sound less generic? I challenge anyone to play the game themselves, and tell us in your experience how good or bad you felt the music was for this particular AAA title? Take note of the music integration system as well, including all scored Cinematics and explain why it didn't work for you in musical terms, and why it felt generic?  (Friendly shots fired, don't worry  I come in peace!)


Oh absolutely, it's a great soundtrack. I don't think it's generic at all -- I was responding to another poster's questionable claim that all Japanese soundtracks were Uematsu knockoffs, which I certainly don't think is true!


----------



## Johnny (Apr 29, 2020)

Sarah Mancuso said:


> Oh absolutely, it's a great soundtrack. I don't think it's generic at all -- I was responding to another poster's questionable claim that all Japanese soundtracks were Uematsu knockoffs, which I certainly don't think is true!


Exactly! Listen to any Hamauzu piece outside of Final Fantasy and one will find that he has his own voice, unique style which is often attributed or slandered as being "textural" writing if you will... Then go listen to Debussy and Ravel and you might notice the same? (And they were not from Japan unless they had a time machine and were actually from the future? Hmmm...)  Uematsu didn't give enough credit to Hamauzu either, for composing the majority of the more less famous songs from the FFX score (Wandering, Besaid, Macalania Woods, Thunder Plains etc...) these were all actually written by Masashi while he was an understudy at Square, and all of these pieces sounding completely different from Uematsu's contributions on FFX- even on the same game soundtrack, from the same part of the world! (Who's have thunk!!! ) Anywho, I listen to a lot of Japanese composer's work, in no particular order: Yoko Shimomura, Yasunori Mitsuda, Joe Hisaishi, Ryuichi Sakamoto, Hiroyuki Sawano and of course Junya Nakano, Hitoshi Sakimoto, Koji Kondo and even work by Keiichi Okabe Keigo Hoashi- all have their unique styles are representative and in some way shaped by their own influences and surrounding interpretation of the world in which they live : )


----------



## Andrew Aversa (Apr 29, 2020)

DSmolken said:


> Can we come back to the idea that there are great string players in Japan, and money in sampling those players well, making user-friendly VIs, and selling those globally?
> 
> What would be the best sound to market - standard orchestra-size sections in a concert hall, or smaller sections perhaps in a studio? If any classic high-budget JPRGs used real strings, how were those recorded? Sorry, I have no clue... I remember knowing somebody who played Final Fantasy maybe 15 years ago, and I remember the "stop fisting android girls" meme from Nier two years ago, and that's all my knowledge of those things.
> 
> I'm in contact with Unreal Instruments via machine-translated English, helping get GUIs set up for that free stuff, which will hopefully help make it more popular globally. Will post that in the freebies thread when it's ready. That's a looooong way from sampling orchestral strings, but it might well lead to smaller commercial instruments, which might then lead to bigger instruments. Insert "I'm doing my part" meme here, haha.



We're on it.


----------



## constaneum (Apr 29, 2020)

zircon_st said:


> We're on it.



a more Japanese sounding kind of string library??


----------



## DSmolken (Apr 29, 2020)

zircon_st said:


> We're on it.


In the VI-C tradition of making wild speculations based on a small hint dropped by a developer, I'm going to guess this is already recorded, because it's not likely you're flying over there and gathering dozens of string players in a studio.


----------



## purple (Apr 30, 2020)

Part of it may be that the recording industry in the countries where a lot of these big sample libraries come from (Germany, the US, UK) have been big in those countries since the birth of the recording industry and have had many decades to mature, while equivalents in asian countries are still growing.


----------



## chocobitz825 (Apr 30, 2020)

DSmolken said:


> In the VI-C tradition of making wild speculations based on a small hint dropped by a developer, I'm going to guess this is already recorded, because it's not likely you're flying over there and gathering dozens of string players in a studio.





well its not impossible to sample players right now lol...


----------



## chocobitz825 (Apr 30, 2020)

purple said:


> Part of it may be that the recording industry in the countries where a lot of these big sample libraries come from (Germany, the US, UK) have been big in those countries since the birth of the recording industry and have had many decades to mature, while equivalents in asian countries are still growing.



japan's market share places it in more than just the "growing" market area. I would imagine the issue is more about the unity of western music and the things that western music considers to be standards. Western music is recorded in the west at historically relevant and well recognized western studios and halls. The fact that the west isn't familiar with equivalent Asian venues and players really doesn't mean that the Asian market is lacking.

Record an orchestral library with the tokyo philharmonic orchestra in NHK Hall or Suntory Hall, or Victor Studios and you would get just as much quality. You'd have a harder time marketing it because western buyers don't place importance on those venues or the players involved. The problem with japanese developers making these libraries is that they're just pretty poor at programming. Kick ass at hardware synths, poor at design and programming.


----------



## bryla (Apr 30, 2020)

chocobitz825 said:


> The fact that the west isn't familiar with equivalent Asian venues and players really doesn't mean that the Asian market is lacking.


Prague, Budapest and Sofia server MANY Asian productions. Some of the contractors mention that they represent more than half of their sessions. Western composers probably don't hear about it because they are not interested in the Asian catalogue just like a French composer might not notice the Dutch soundtracks that are recorded live. Okja and Parasite were recorded at Budapest for example.

Personally I can say that the Chinese and Japanese productions I've orchestrated for were also recorded in said venues.


----------



## chocobitz825 (Apr 30, 2020)

bryla said:


> Prague, Budapest and Sofia server MANY Asian productions. Some of the contractors mention that they represent more than half of their sessions. Western composers probably don't hear about it because they are not interested in the Asian catalogue just like a French composer might not notice the Dutch soundtracks that are recorded live. Okja and Parasite were recorded at Budapest for example.
> 
> Personally I can say that the Chinese and Japanese productions I've orchestrated for were also recorded in said venues.





bryla said:


> Prague, Budapest and Sofia server MANY Asian productions. Some of the contractors mention that they represent more than half of their sessions. Western composers probably don't hear about it because they are not interested in the Asian catalogue just like a French composer might not notice the Dutch soundtracks that are recorded live. Okja and Parasite were recorded at Budapest for example.
> 
> Personally I can say that the Chinese and Japanese productions I've orchestrated for were also recorded in said venues.



I can’t speak for all cases but I’ve found that most times when projects in japan source outside of japan it’s either a creative choice for the theme of the project or just because it’s cheaper than domestic players.


----------



## Andrew Aversa (Apr 30, 2020)

constaneum said:


> a more Japanese sounding kind of string library??





DSmolken said:


> In the VI-C tradition of making wild speculations based on a small hint dropped by a developer, I'm going to guess this is already recorded, because it's not likely you're flying over there and gathering dozens of string players in a studio.



I have a great fondness for Japanese string players. All I want to say for now is that it's in the works.


----------



## constaneum (Apr 30, 2020)

zircon_st said:


> I have a great fondness for Japanese string players. All I want to say for now is that it's in the works.



Cant wait


----------



## galactic orange (May 1, 2020)

zircon_st said:


> I have a great fondness for Japanese string players. All I want to say for now is that it's in the works.


This made my day.


----------



## DSmolken (Feb 17, 2021)

Not orchestral, but this electric guitar just dropped a few minutes ago. Only 332 MB, but sounds very convincing at what it does.









Carino LINEs【KONTAKT用エレキギター素材音源】 - カガリ鳥 on BOOTH - BOOTH


【　Carino LINEs　】




kagaridori.booth.pm


----------



## Thorgod10 (Mar 2, 2021)

What you seem to be looking for...if anyone for that matter still is...is an intimate, "studio" sound, for this is most common in the more melodically demanding work of Japanese style scoring (You DEFINITELY hear this in anime/games.)

CSS will serve you very well, BUT you will want to really envelope it with reverb, cut those mid ranges, and then bring the highs up quite a bit. This will bring you that high vibrato, close, intimate sound you hear from quality studio recordings. 

I also highly recommend the following: 
SWAM. 
Sample Modeling strings. 
Noteperformer for when sound quality isn't as crucial, but humanization is priority. (You will get amazing results)
8dio Intimate Studio Strings, and their other offerings that focus on Hybrid. 

These are the VSTS and plugins that are ACTUALLY used to create mockups in the style of music you are thinking of.


----------



## chocobitz825 (Mar 2, 2021)

Though not very popular, Auddicts United strings of Europe have a very lyrical sound for japanese music. Their portamento is fantastic and blended with a more bread and butter library, I think it’s possible to get near the Japanese sound.


----------



## muziksculp (Mar 2, 2021)

chocobitz825 said:


> Though not very popular, Auddicts United strings of Europe have a very lyrical sound for japanese music. Their portamento is fantastic and blended with a more bread and butter library, I think it’s possible to get near the Japanese sound.


I have them, and like these strings a lot. I'm not sure about the Japanese sound, since I'm not an expert on that genre, they have an intimate, and very nice sound.


----------



## RightOnTime (Mar 2, 2021)

Sound Magic are a Chinese developer, aren't they? There's something ever-so-slightly off about the phrasing in their descriptions etc which reminds me of Chinese companies.

They seem to post here regularly but with no replies or discussion which got me curious about em. The demos are a bit of a mixed bag, but they're asking very serious money for the libraries ($499 for ensemble strings, for example). The cheap generic looking box art doesn't really inspire confidence either. They have a lot of Oriental instruments though.


----------

