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Orchestration Recipes Discussion Thread

PhilipJohnston

PhilipJohnston

Orchestration Recipes
OR3_BoxCrop.png




Launch sale: 40% off
Get your recipes at orchestrationrecipes.com

2 hours of fully narrated videos
Walkthroughs, illustrations and loads of fresh musical examples to explore, in a new, brisk, fully narrated format.

Packed with orchestrated examples & ideas to try
Start with the videos. Practice building versions of your own, until you don’t need the videos. Then the sound is yours, to summon, whenever you need it.

Your sample libraries are fine
VSL, Spitfire, EastWest, OrchestralTools, Cinesamples, Samplemodelling, Cinematic Studio Series...it doesn't matter. The whole point of recipes is that they work with whatever you've got.

Questions?
Email Philip Johnston

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Well, your initial burst about the questionable impulse to load up on samples libraries had me nodding vigorously in agreement :).

On the idea of orchestration recipes... It seems to me probably a decent enough pedagogic tool, like products that I've seen where you can buy a whole bunch of MIDI chord progressions off the shelf - eg. a good way to get started if you have limited musical knowledge and resources. Beyond that point, once you have a certain amount of confidence, it's difficult for me to imagine needing to reach for these, as with the chord progressions example.

Also, the examples are, well... very conservative. This forum is obviously mainly composers writing for or looking to write for media (where, for better or worse, a solo woodwind line is typically about as welcome as a fart in a spacesuit these days), and I think the templates are poorly oriented to this market. They sound like examples for learning in a conservatory environment. But obviously that's a comment about particular templates, not the idea itself.

But I think to really sell people on the idea, the templates showcasing the concept need to be more compelling and useful seeming.
 
What a great learning tool! And so well-presented. Perfect for a newb, such as myself :2thumbs:

Edit: Have you considered perhaps offering one complete recipe as a freebie/demo? It needn't be one from the upcoming pack. Just something as a proof-of-concept, to see if the workflow 'clicks'. Just an idea.
 
There is one point in orchestration... It starts in your head and then you are aiming the conclusion of your imagination. Sure, Sample Libraries could bring you to the point, where you say... Thats it...
But the truth is, that you arrange your tracks to get the best, the real result like an orchester...
Today the possibilities are breathtaking... I think, there is today a library for every specific use...
VSL,SFA,OT,PS... and more and more...

And its amazing to work with all these libraries...
But I personally start with a piano and a piece of paper and a pencil... If you only compose for a specific library, cause in this case, it sounds real and wonderful and more... you are doing it, cause of the library, you are using...

And i say no, really no... Cause when i write down my composition on paper...there is it... What i do on the computer with all this virtual orchestras is another thing, but this little composition on paper is more worth, than any super duper excessiv sampling library out there...
And you know what... I like to orchestrate with all the great sample libraries out there... but if its important, i give the notes to every player of a real orchester...And at last what can be more "REAL". than a real orchester with 1 2 Violins,Violas,Celli,Basses...the whole set of brass and woodwinds and percussion...
I know, such sessions are very expensive, but if the budget of a TV,Film and more is there...No regret to use the real deal...:)

But I love Sample Libraries and i am consumer of all the great orchestral instruments recordings...

To have it at home as a guide for the next steps in production is wonderful....
but remember if you are composing... and being a slave of a library... thats not the goal, i think...

End of communication :)

PS: This my personal opinion and does not reflect any other...Please no offence, cause of my personal thoughts; thanks
 
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PhilipJohnston said:
I’m launching this as an idea to share, as much as a product:





The collection itself will be available in November, but it’s almost not the point:

I want other composers to create their own recipes too, and then to make them available (independent of me or my website is fine!).

If the Orchestration Recipe concept seems useful, share the video, get other composers fired up about releasing their own collections, so we can all have them as desk references as we compose. (I'm serious...I want my shelves filled with these things, it would be a game changer for getting the most out of the sample libraries I already have).

Let me know what you think...who else would love to have hundreds of these to hand, in a concise, browsable format?
Click to expand...

THANK You for this!
 
PhilipJohnston said:
I’m launching this as an idea to share, as much as a product:





The collection itself will be available in November, but it’s almost not the point:

I want other composers to create their own recipes too, and then to make them available (independent of me or my website is fine!).

If the Orchestration Recipe concept seems useful, share the video, get other composers fired up about releasing their own collections, so we can all have them as desk references as we compose. (I'm serious...I want my shelves filled with these things, it would be a game changer for getting the most out of the sample libraries I already have).

Let me know what you think...who else would love to have hundreds of these to hand, from dozens of very different composers, in a concise, browsable format?
Click to expand...


Brilliant. I have a prosonal project where I am doing exactly this but for the Giacchino, Williams and Powell "sound". I am in.

Consider them bought and now I have a great standard to conform to. Please make a template (text, midi etc available as a basic standard to follow)
 
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This is awesome. Great presentation style - aesthetically pleasing and concise and to the point. I am really curious to see the supporting text material as well. I'll definitely get the initial package and do hope that lots of recipes for various styles, moods, composers etc. will follow.
 
PhilipJohnston said:
I’m launching this as an idea to share, as much as a product:





The collection itself will be available in November, but it’s almost not the point:

I want other composers to create their own recipes too, and then to make them available (independent of me or my website is fine!).

If the Orchestration Recipe concept seems useful, share the video, get other composers fired up about releasing their own collections, so we can all have them as desk references as we compose. (I'm serious...I want my shelves filled with these things, it would be a game changer for getting the most out of the sample libraries I already have).

Let me know what you think...who else would love to have hundreds of these to hand, from dozens of very different composers, in a concise, browsable format?
Click to expand...

Love this concept and I think the analogy works well. I like the idea that as with recipes you start with following and then learn to adapt it as you know how to make it. This means you can start tailoring things to your tastes or to what you are trying to achieve.
 
Fantastic Idea and presentation. Looking forward to showcasing this concept on my channel. This is the missing link. VSL call a board meeting this concept is too good.
 
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Brilliant idea - love the format, and the little videos demonstrating the concepts. Bravo.

I think each recipe should get a name rather than a number (I watched a couple of examples and could not see any, apologies if its just me on a Sunday)

Like "Creeping Terror" or " Epic Lava Battle " etc (But with better names that describes the recipe than my attempts ! )
 
Thank you very much for this post. I totally agree about a concept.
Running for new and huge libraries is not worth our time. Better to cook a cookie with tools we have, know and trust!
P.S. I tried to replicate your example (at 3:57 in your video) with Sonuscore The Orchestra only and after adding a little multiband compression it surprisingly sounds the same good.
 
OMG This is a brilliant idea. I am SO in. I'll get to work making a bunch of these with examples. Thanks for this concept, I think this will help everyone, including those who make these recipes.
 
if you want to approach this with the rigor of a Hollywood orchestrator, I think you need to think about articulations, as you've done, but also about 2 concepts that seriously affect sound: dynamics and register. This is especially important for woodwinds that sound different in different registers, and the registers affect what dynamics they can play.

I'll throw this in here for you. Happy to see you use it however you like. In your chef metaphor, think of this chart as a reduced sauce... it is based on numerous interviews with members of the Seattle Symphony, musicians online, and condensing down the same concepts tackled in various orchestration books. There is not always agreement among authors which is why these are more "crossfades" than perfectly segmented registers.

NoamWoodwindChart.png
 
I am intrigued by this. This is an excellent take from a unique perspective.

It's early days for me and music as a hobbyist.

The "recipe" approach fits my learning style where "ideas are hooks in your mind that you hang ideas on which become hooks to hang ideas on ...".
 
Great idea, I hope it stimulates lots of activity. I remember proposing something similar a few years back but not as fully developed as you have. I would recommend that those people producing recipes, or any user in fact, share lots of examples because sometimes we are drawn to a particular texture or structure precisely because of the actual harmonic or thematic material used. Also check out the orchestration exercises posted here from time to time like the “10 Examples” thread by Mattia Chiappa.
 
Excellent idea and very well executed (nice sound quality, clear, sharp graphics).
It is almost like a mini conservatory orchestration course: practial learning about pairings, sound combinations, ranges, foreground and background material. It looks very promising.
Looking forward to the release (and future ones).
 
This is really great! It's feels to me like I've been looking for something like this without even knowing. Especially, I sometimes find it tedious to study scores and find myself overwhelmed and not able to filter out the essentials. I am really looking forward to the (first) release.

Also, good point about buying new libs!
 
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