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What are Your Desert Island Piano Libraries?

Rory said:
Still taking C. Bechstein's Digital Grand to the island, though :)


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I've had my eye on that Bechstein for ages but have been unsure how flexible the mics are. How close/dry/intimate can the sound get? (example demos welcome from any owners!)
 
Noire.

It can do many different styles decently and some styles GREAT. It’s tweakability really makes it fun. Playability and sound are gorgeous.

Having that said, it’s not perfect and I find the Garritan CFX better for more nimble solo piano stuff, with the VI Modern Upright great for some pop songs.

But we are talking one desert piano, so Noire is my for sure choice :)
 
SupremeFist said:
I've had my eye on that Bechstein for ages but have been unsure how flexible the mics are. How close/dry/intimate can the sound get? (example demos welcome from any owners!)
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Very close & dry. I wouldn't say intimate - it's just not that kind of piano character-wise. It's extremely well sampled & scripted, with probably the deepest amount of control in shaping the sound (within a natural acoustic range, as per the developer's intention) of any Kontakt based sampled piano. Happy to render a MIDI file for you if you'd like to send me a PM.
 
I'm not a pianist but I LOVE pianos, worked for a few weeks in a music store bazillion years ago where we had in the upper floor a large hall with many pianos. the king there - on its own little stage - was this majestic grand white Yamaha C7... which no one in the store was allowed to touch... specifically(!!!) not the guys with the long hair that demo and sell those "hideous" pointy and noisy electric guitars and distortion pedals (read METAL ZONE!!!) all day :)
Well, every time I had the opportunity, as in store managers went home early, I was running upstairs to that Yamaha, playing on it just soft chords and watching and feeling how my body, the other pianos in the hall... and the whole damn floor... all resonate together "on command"... almost like "God has spoken" lol

Well that's how I remember things... and no I wasn't doing drugs... well... not that I remember:speechless:

OK, so from the pianos I own and those I have access in a studio, the best 2 (in that order) for my ears are:

Hammersmith for stainway - I don't care if some sample here or there is not perfect, or if real pianists think the pedal behavior is not perfect?... but man... some of the mics there give an amazing sound with TONS of resonance... it just gives the illusion that you play a "live" piano... it has soul:thumbsup:
The space (Mark Knofler's own insane studio), the mics, the mics positions, that's as good as it can be.

Pearl Concert Grand for Yamaha - amazing how with just 8 layers it sound that good. a bit of eq boost at around 60Hz and it sounds massive, like a grand should be!
With just 8 layers and ONLY 12GB (at 16bit), I think ISW should get some music tech industry prize, cause the Pearl puts to shame other libs with x10 the sample pool.


Here are some pianos that are regarded and disappointed me:

Garritan CFX (too noisy, too spiky, a bit too much room, couldn't eq it enough to get a soul out of it) <- and its like 100GB?!

Embertone Walker (35GB per microphone, and for me, none of them sound good) <- didn't try to eq it, with 150GB sample base it should be perfect out of the box.

Noire (something in the layers is off, top layers have way to much gap and bottom layers are just masked with an aggressive dynamic low shelf that you can't disable or tune out enough. its like an auto wah pedal, why???)

Pianoteq (no thanks! the high registers are ok, i'll give it that, but as you go down? sound at the low end gets more and more like lifeless rubber. really who cares that it **technically** plays the best, when the sound is like that)

Honestly? with some tasteful eq and instrument tweaks, even the other NI pianos (Gentleman, Giant, Granduer, Maveric) are nicer than all those "regarded".

Cheers
 
It’s such a subjective thing. Mike Lang, one of the finest pianists in LA, only likes Steinway, did not like Chick Correa’s Bosendorfer at Mad Hatter studios, which I loved. I loved Mason Hamlin pianos when I was in Boston, but I never see them here in L.A.

Could not disagree more about the sound of the Walker, it’s gorgeous.
 
With these "desert island scenarios" one is never certain about the allowed quantity. If this was not an issue, I'd go with all the pianos from Galaxy / Native Instruments (minus Alicia's Keys) + abt. a dozen of my favorite uprights and grands from Pianobook.
 
Hendrixon said:
I'm not a pianist but I LOVE pianos, worked for a few weeks in a music store bazillion years ago where we had in the upper floor a large hall with many pianos. the king there - on its own little stage - was this majestic grand white Yamaha C7... which no one in the store was allowed to touch... specifically(!!!) not the guys with the long hair that demo and sell those "hideous" pointy and noisy electric guitars and distortion pedals (read METAL ZONE!!!) all day :)
Well, every time I had the opportunity, as in store managers went home early, I was running upstairs to that Yamaha, playing on it just soft chords and watching and feeling how my body, the other pianos in the hall... and the whole damn floor... all resonate together "on command"... almost like "God has spoken" lol

Well that's how I remember things... and no I wasn't doing drugs... well... not that I remember:speechless:

OK, so from the pianos I own and those I have access in a studio, the best 2 (in that order) for my ears are:

Hammersmith for stainway - I don't care if some sample here or there is not perfect, or if real pianists think the pedal behavior is not perfect?... but man... some of the mics there give an amazing sound with TONS of resonance... it just gives the illusion that you play a "live" piano... it has soul:thumbsup:
The space (Mark Knofler's own insane studio), the mics, the mics positions, that's as good as it can be.

Pearl Concert Grand for Yamaha - amazing how with just 8 layers it sound that good. a bit of eq boost at around 60Hz and it sounds massive, like a grand should be!
With just 8 layers and ONLY 12GB (at 16bit), I think ISW should get some music tech industry prize, cause the Pearl puts to shame other libs with x10 the sample pool.


Here are some pianos that are regarded and disappointed me:

Garritan CFX (too noisy, too spiky, a bit too much room, couldn't eq it enough to get a soul out of it) <- and its like 100GB?!

Embertone Walker (35GB per microphone, and for me, none of them sound good) <- didn't try to eq it, with 150GB sample base it should be perfect out of the box.

Noire (something in the layers is off, top layers have way to much gap and bottom layers are just masked with an aggressive dynamic low shelf that you can't disable or tune out enough. its like an auto wah pedal, why???)

Pianoteq (no thanks! the high registers are ok, i'll give it that, but as you go down? sound at the low end gets more and more like lifeless rubber. really who cares that it **technically** plays the best, when the sound is like that)

Honestly? with some tasteful eq and instrument tweaks, even the other NI pianos (Gentleman, Giant, Granduer, Maveric) are nicer than all those "regarded".

Cheers
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Funny how taste can differ so much. I have the Hammersmith pro and it sounds like the real recorded grand had a dry and lifeless flat soundboard. No singing sustain ....just awfull. By comparison i think the Embertone Walker is Steinway heaven for those after a more older Steinway sound. Best sustain of any vst. Yes it has it quirks ...but all of them have.

And i have tuned/played hundreds of Yamaha C7’s. They can sound quite good but nowhere near any top concert grand.

But i like it that we all prefer something different for various reasons and that Pearl grand still gets me intrigued.
 
pianistje said:
Funny how taste can differ so much. I have the Hammersmith pro and it sounds like the real recorded grand had a dry and lifeless flat soundboard. No singing sustain ....just awfull. By comparison i think the Embertone Walker is Steinway heaven for those after a more older Steinway sound. Best sustain of any vst. Yes it has it quirks ...but all of them have.
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That's why its called "your desert island piano" :thumbsup:

Regarding the Hammersmith, if you don't mind please try my mic setup, would love to hear (pun?) what real pianists think of it.
For this I use two kontakt instances.

Kontakt 1:
Set Hammersmith output to -7.9dB (I would set it to -8 round but I don't know how to make micro changes, it seems kontakt has its own steps)
All FX (Comp, Master EQ, Space) set to off
Close mic > choose Neumman M49 Pair > EQ off > set volume to +12dB
Mid mic > disabled
Room mic > choose Neumman M50 Decca Tree > EQ off > set volume to -1dB

Kontakt 2:
Set Hammersmith output to -6.3dB (again, that's what kontakt gives)
All FX (Comp, Master EQ, Space) set to off
Close mic > disabled
Mid mic > disabled
Room mic > choose Neumman KU-100 Head > EQ off > set volume to +2.8dB

** Important: in kontakt 2>options disable all "noises" (key off, dampers, pedal noise etc) or else all this will double with kontakt 1.

For room/verb I like my Lexicons boxes but with the plugin try something like:
Concert Hall (from large halls), early Level at 0dB (max volume), room size 60 meters, reverb time 1.8sec, chorus at 7, chorus depth at 70%

There are few more fine tunings here and there, but this is like 90% of my setup:2thumbs:
 
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Thank you for your efforts Hendrixon !!... but sorry ...I gave up on the Hammersmith and never use it or planning to do so. I DO think the Hammersmith sounds very realistic on a recording . I chose it over the Galaxy Vintage D by comparing the same recording over and over again. But it’s the default dry sound (not talking about reverb or close vs wet mics) when playing myself that turned me off. Just like I love the Garritan CFX for playing but not recording.

The VSL BI gives me fantastic playability and Embertone and Sam Samples give me the preferred Steinway sound in recordings.

I am very happy right now with my fav. Piano vsts.... and gladly you like yours.
 
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