Wordclock and samples - Hmmmm...

[guydoingmusic]

This is something I've been pondering for a long time. I know people who swear by it. I also know people who say it's useless.

I have been in many studios that have a Big Ben (or the likes) integrated into their system. But these studios were primarily recorded bands/artist with live musicians - with no sample based production going on. But... in the world of sample based productions, I wonder how vital having an external clock such as a Big Ben or an Antelope could be.

I also wonder what benefit it would bring for the following:

• 1 computer using VEPro
  Multiple computer using VEPro
  Multiple computer using hardware to transfer audio

The last setup to me would be the ideal setup to use an external clock with. I'm curious to hear anyone else's thoughts or uses.

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[EastWest Lurker]

This is something I've been pondering for a long time. I know people who swear by it. I also know people who say it's useless.

I have been in many studios that have a Big Ben (or the likes) integrated into their system. But these studios were primarily recorded bands/artist with live musicians - with no sample based production going on. But... in the world of sample based productions, I wonder how vital having an external clock such as a Big Ben or an Antelope could be.

I also wonder what benefit it would bring for the following:

• 1 computer using VEPro
  Multiple computer using VEPro
  Multiple computer using hardware to transfer audio

The last setup to me would be the ideal setup to use an external clock with. I'm curious to hear anyone else's thoughts or uses.

The purpose of external clocks is to decrease jitter when using multiple devices. According to Dan Lavry, the famous converter designer, if you are only using one audio interface it is impossible to decrease jitter from the internal crystal unless it is very poorly created, which is rare these days. The external clock actually will introduce more jitter.

A guy at Apogee tried to say to me re: Big Ben, "Yes, it is true it would add more jitter to a single device but it might be perceived as less jitter because of where it is introduced and that is our "special sauce."

I told him that if I was going to approach audio that way I might as well spin dead cats around my head at Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil

He did not appreciate that, but I think I was not far off.

 

[dgburns]

This is something I've been pondering for a long time. I know people who swear by it. I also know people who say it's useless.

I have been in many studios that have a Big Ben (or the likes) integrated into their system. But these studios were primarily recorded bands/artist with live musicians - with no sample based production going on. But... in the world of sample based productions, I wonder how vital having an external clock such as a Big Ben or an Antelope could be.

I also wonder what benefit it would bring for the following:

• 1 computer using VEPro
  Multiple computer using VEPro
  Multiple computer using hardware to transfer audio

The last setup to me would be the ideal setup to use an external clock with. I'm curious to hear anyone else's thoughts or uses.

The purpose of external clocks is to decrease jitter when using multiple devices. According to Dan Lavry, the famous converter designer, if you are only using one audio interface it is impossible to decrease jitter from the internal crystal unless it is very poorly created, which is rare these days. The external clock actually will introduce more jitter.

A guy at Apogee tried to say to me re: Big Ben, "Yes, it is true it would add more jitter to a single device but it might be perceived as less jitter because of where it is introduced and that is our "special sauce."

I told him that if I was going to approach audio that way I might as well spin dead cats around my head at Midnight in the Garden of Good and Evil

He did not appreciate that, but I think I was not far off.

Well I do have a Big Ben in my work rig,running wordclock for the studio and I can tell you there IS a difference in the sound coming out the speakers.I would say it has alot more bass and a softer high end then when running the Avid Sync I/O,which sounds more flat,perhaps more sterile(totally subjective words,but there is a difference)
What you say about clocks is correct,the internal clock will be the most accurate.I find that the Big Ben adds something that's good for rock or beat based music,and it adds size to perc in orchestral music.But you have to sum outside the box to gain the effect.No difference summing in the box.But I do get one word signal going to many boxes in the studio,kinda like a black burst generator.
I think the difference makes me happy,so I use it.At home I run a SSL alphalink converter,and it sounds good,but the Big Ben makes the 192's sound more pleasing to my ears.
Totally subjective I guess.

 

[EastWest Lurker]

Yes it adds smearing, which some will prefer. I prefer accurate.

 

[guydoingmusic]

Yes it adds smearing, which some will prefer. I prefer accurate.

Kinda like playing the bar scene... some bands sound better drunk. o-[][]-o

 

[dgburns]

Yes it adds smearing, which some will prefer. I prefer accurate.

Don't knock it till you try it.But it is a personal thing.Accuracy can sound like ass too :mrgreen:

 

[Simplesly]

I also wonder what benefit it would bring for the following:

• 1 computer using VEPro
  Multiple computer using VEPro
  Multiple computer using hardware to transfer audio

The last setup to me would be the ideal setup to use an external clock with. I'm curious to hear anyone else's thoughts or uses.

That is correct. Keep in mind that the Big Ben is a little old hat at this point. Doesn't mean it's bad or anything, just consider that newer interfaces' clocks may be superior or at least comparable.

for example if you're feeding let's say an RME FF UCX downstream from a couple HDSP cards or whatever and you run clock off the UCX to each card, is a Big Ben's clock so much better than the UCX that you're going to notice a difference in D/A? Maybe, but you also may be pissed that you just spent $1200 for such a minuscule difference. I will say I used to sell 'em all the time to people who would clock their Digi 003's and SWEAR that the the bottom end was so much huger and the mix SO much more transparent.. If you're happy, I'm happy, I would say. 8)

 

[EastWest Lurker]

I can think of a whole bunch of $1200 purchases that I believe would make a bigger difference but whatever people want to spend their money on is fine with me.