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Why so much hate against USB security dongles (like iLok and Steinberg key)

d.healey

Music Monkey
but does anyone really suspect PACE or Yamaha of spying on musicians?
If you have a dongle that requires a live connection to run a piece of software then the server that the dongle is talking to is aware of every time you use that piece of software, how long you use it for, the hours you use it most often, and when you're not using it. If you bought a toilet and the manufacturer kept track of your use of it in this manner I think you would call it spying, certainly an invasion of privacy.
 

Nick Batzdorf

Moderator
Moderator
If you have a dongle that requires a live connection to run a piece of software then the server that the dongle is talking to is aware of every time you use that piece of software, how long you use it for, the hours you use it most often, and when you're not using it. If you bought a toilet and the manufacturer kept track of your use of it in this manner I think you would call it spying, certainly an invasion of privacy.
If anyone is interested in when I use the toilet, please let me know and I'll be happy to text you.
 

Quasar

Senior Member
If you have a dongle that requires a live connection to run a piece of software then the server that the dongle is talking to is aware of every time you use that piece of software, how long you use it for, the hours you use it most often, and when you're not using it. If you bought a toilet and the manufacturer kept track of your use of it in this manner I think you would call it spying, certainly an invasion of privacy.
Is that why I've been seeing so many ads for laxatives when I browse the web? Despite the fact that I never search for them?
 

dzilizzi

I just hang around pretending I know something
Oh - do I have to purchase Zero Dookertime insurance?
Um, yes if you are expecting your commode to suddenly crash, I mean back up.

It does seem funny that backing up your computer is good, but backing up your toilet isn't a good idea.
Okay, probably not good to get me started. LOL! I'm not crazy about the fact that Facebook and MS "spy" on me. I already have Google and Amazon doing it. And now iLok, elicenser and who knows who else. Though I guess if they want to steal my amazing music? It won't do them much good.
 

James H

01001000 01101001
I've got both USB offerings. Slate Digital and ReFx provided them for free so I can't grumble. I'd rather not have them as loss/theft is always on my mind.

Piracy argument always interests me though. NI must be one of the biggest devs surely? And their products are acquired by theft considerably.
So why haven't they gone down that route, but chose a simple and easy method. Maybe an easy to use method, good pricing, trust to existing users and a relatively painless transfer policy isn't so bad after all?
 

MartinH.

Senior Member
If you have a dongle that requires a live connection to run a piece of software then the server that the dongle is talking to is aware of every time you use that piece of software, how long you use it for, the hours you use it most often, and when you're not using it. If you bought a toilet and the manufacturer kept track of your use of it in this manner I think you would call it spying, certainly an invasion of privacy.
Couldn't you send a GDPR request to them and have a look at the data they are collecting about you?
 

Per Boysen

New Member
Since I moved my studio space one and a half year ago the iLook is still not found. Missing the GRM Tools but for most other stuff I have worked out other solutions. I think people dislike dongles because life as a musician is a constant struggle to make optimal space for music within your daily available 24 hours, and a risk to have your creative flow stopped is making it hard to focus for some.
 

pk-1

New Member
I'm not sure what it is about music production software that requires a dongle when virtually every other type of software in existence doesn't. I've never been required to buy a dongle to use Word, Quicken, or countless other software apps from developers large and small.
These are mass market products, running on a completely different business model.

In small/specialized/vertical markets, dongles are actually quite common.

(Just earlier this week, I installed one for Heidelberg Prinect Signa Station, a software system for page impositioning and sheet assembly. If you would be working in the printing industry, you would know it ... like you know ProTools if you're into music production.)

Taking a broader view on software license management, you'll see that Pace, being kind of the number one in the music production arena, is really a niche provider in a niche market.
 

David Chappell

Active Member
from what steinberg support states, it is an EW issue. it's down to then how they implement the CP. and as per your first post, what are the other plug-ins? sorry for blaming your computer, that was wrong. but i'm still interested in learning if this is one plug-in or many.
No worries! Ones I identified - spaces/ play, adaptiverb, blackhole, soundtoys panman/ decapitator. That was just trial and error disabling plugins until the project loaded again. That's pretty much every ilok based dev I have plugins from. Not an exhaustive list either, those are just the ones that were identified in the months until Steinberg pointed to it being an ilok issue. Since stopping use of ilok plugins, I've not had a repeat of the issue - that's coming up on 2 years since I first experienced it.
 

Geocranium

Active Member
These are mass market products, running on a completely different business model.

In small/specialized/vertical markets, dongles are actually quite common.

(Just earlier this week, I installed one for Heidelberg Prinect Signa Station, a software system for page impositioning and sheet assembly. If you would be working in the printing industry, you would know it ... like you know ProTools if you're into music production.)

Taking a broader view on software license management, you'll see that Pace, being kind of the number one in the music production arena, is really a niche provider in a niche market.
But is this true for other creative fields? For example, Adobe and Autodesk don't require the use of dongles. In film, animation, design, or illustration I can't think of one piece of mainstream software that requires a dongle. I told one of my coworkers about using a dongle to use Cubase, and he was a little floored. It seems like the music software business is lagging way behind in terms of DRM.
 

pk-1

New Member
Adobe and Autodesk don't require the use of dongles.
Never dealt with Autodesk, but Adobe requires online validation of the Creative Cloud subscription.

As I said above, this is indeed an alternative to hardware protection, but not viable in application domains where a significant amount of systems is operated offline.
 

MartinH.

Senior Member
But is this true for other creative fields? For example, Adobe and Autodesk don't require the use of dongles. In film, animation, design, or illustration I can't think of one piece of mainstream software that requires a dongle. I told one of my coworkers about using a dongle to use Cubase, and he was a little floored. It seems like the music software business is lagging way behind in terms of DRM.
Autodesk is a different kind of evil, not really a lesser one from what I've heard.
 
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