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Valentine's Day Promotion - Scoring Tools MasterClass 701 with more than 80% off

Soniq

New Member
I am not going into comparison with other courses because I don't think it is possible. Scoring Tools MasterClass is far from being the same thing as what the other schools are offering.
However, if you think the other schools will teach you, for just few bucks, how to sound like, or even better than what is shown in the trailer of Scoring Tools MasterClass go ahead and buy their courses then.
You're absolutely right! It's your product and you can charge whatever you want. Considering that not too long ago you were offering it for free.
 

agarner32

Active Member
The investment for units 701, 702 and 703 is respectively $550, $620 and $690. However a substantial discount will the offered for those who take advantage of the Valentine's Day promotion.
Perhaps I'm just not seeing it, but I couldn't find any links to purchase all three on your site.
 
OP
leogardini

leogardini

Senior Member
Perhaps I'm just not seeing it, but I couldn't find any links to purchase all three on your site.
Enrollments for the complete course are closed now. They will open soon but those who enroll in the Valentine's Day promotion will have an special offer for the remaining units.
 

5Lives

Senior Member
Are you able to give us some info on what 702 and 703 will cost if we take advantage of the V'day offer?
 

FriFlo

Senior Member
Hey Leo. I think your mockups are very good and you obviously have much to offer. That is why I would not want to complain about how you set prices for your service, as it is of course your decision and only you will know if the price is right to attract enough customers. However, when I looked at your website, I found some things a bit confusing ...
Looking at this special offer, I initially had the impression you would get the full course schedule for that price (or the usual 500 bucks after the sale). Only due to posters here I got aware that it is only a third of the content presented in the schedule. That is easy to misunderstand as there is no buying options and prices for 702 and 703 (except in this thread, which I saw later). These would make it more obvious what you actually pay for.
Also, I find it a bit unfortunate to get the first part for under 100 bucks and the other parts will be more than 500 each, only with the vague idea to get some undefined discount. I would clearly prefer to know the price of a full course, before I decided to try out a volume of it.
And there are lots of other details, that were mentioned, that are not specified. E.g., there are private Skype sessions with you included in the course, but only for premium customers? Who are these premium customers? That alone makes a big difference, as of course private lessons are rightfully much more expensive than video content alone.
Lastly, I am rather skeptical when there are limited time offers with discounts that steep. I then imagine how much I would be put off by an offer like that, had I payed the full amount a little earlier. Of course that is kind of the spirit of todays world of sales. I just don't like that to be honest.
I just wanted to give you my honest opinion how I felt visiting your web site, because I think there could be the potentially a lot more people just by improving information and transparency. Maybe that information is valuable for you?! If not, feel free to ignore me! ;)
 
OP
leogardini

leogardini

Senior Member
Hey Leo. I think your mockups are very good and you obviously have much to offer. That is why I would not want to complain about how you set prices for your service, as it is of course your decision and only you will know if the price is right to attract enough customers. However, when I looked at your website, I found some things a bit confusing ...
Looking at this special offer, I initially had the impression you would get the full course schedule for that price (or the usual 500 bucks after the sale). Only due to posters here I got aware that it is only a third of the content presented in the schedule. That is easy to misunderstand as there is no buying options and prices for 702 and 703 (except in this thread, which I saw later). These would make it more obvious what you actually pay for.
Also, I find it a bit unfortunate to get the first part for under 100 bucks and the other parts will be more than 500 each, only with the vague idea to get some undefined discount. I would clearly prefer to know the price of a full course, before I decided to try out a volume of it.
And there are lots of other details, that were mentioned, that are not specified. E.g., there are private Skype sessions with you included in the course, but only for premium customers? Who are these premium customers? That alone makes a big difference, as of course private lessons are rightfully much more expensive than video content alone.
Lastly, I am rather skeptical when there are limited time offers with discounts that steep. I then imagine how much I would be put off by an offer like that, had I payed the full amount a little earlier. Of course that is kind of the spirit of todays world of sales. I just don't like that to be honest.
I just wanted to give you my honest opinion how I felt visiting your web site, because I think there could be the potentially a lot more people just by improving information and transparency. Maybe that information is valuable for you?! If not, feel free to ignore me! ;)
No problem at all. Actually I have already responded to this same question before in this thread and here is a quote from the previous page for you and 5Lives.

"We have been thinking of selling the parts separately but this is not a good idea. For most advanced midi orchestrators 701 and 702 seems to be something they already know but this is not the case.
What I teach in Scoring Tools Masterclass is not generic techniques of midi orchestration but instead my own philosophy and approach to it. Having said that, you will only be able to get the full scope and benefit of the idea is you study it thoroughly.
The investment for units 701, 702 and 703 are respectively $550, $620 and $690. However a substantial discount will the offered for those who take advantage of the Valentine's Day promotion.
Typically people are investing much more in libraries and equipment that are not capable of making them better composers. What I offer is way beyond midi techniques because the idea is to improve you as a composer and not your equipment."
 

5Lives

Senior Member
So since you haven’t told us what the “substantial discount” will be, all we can go on is $80+$620+$690 = $1390 for the full course.
 
OP
leogardini

leogardini

Senior Member
So since you haven’t told us what the “substantial discount” will be, all we can go on is $80+$620+$690 = $1390 for the full course.
The discount will be based on the amount of people enrolled in unit 701 and it can range from 40% up to 80%.
Anyway, the promotion is over now and enrollments are closed.
 

5Lives

Senior Member
At 80% discount, the total cost of the course would be closer to $300 - I think you’d have a lot of interest at that price if you choose to do another sale in the future.
 

agarner32

Active Member
No disrespect here and perhaps it's just me, but I found the marketing strategy a bit odd. Now you can't even buy anything at full price and the future discount for 702-703 is tied to the number of people who enrolled in 701. If a specific number of 701 enrollees is dictating the level of discounts then maybe a group buy would have been a better option. At any rate, the music examples are very good, so I'm sure you have much to offer.
 

prodigalson

Senior Member
i would be very skeptical about anything promised here. On the website, there promises to be a John Williams book coming back in 2017. If you read the blogs there are constant references to "chapter 3 in the book" etc. yet no book exists. I suspect the creator of this material suffers from a common misconception about what is actually involved in providing these kinds of things.
 

TigerTheFrog

Amateur
I took advantage of Leandro's recent offer on this forum to take some of 701 for free. The course is too advanced for me right now, but once I reach a higher level in my musical development, I intend to pay. This is not a course for beginners. This is a course for people who are already creating orchestral music on computers, and want to take their mockups to another level.

You absolutely can't get the information in this class anywhere else, because this is about creating MIDI mockups the way Leandro does it. Nobody else can teach that course any more than they could teach Mike Verta's courses. It's personal, and it's based on a foundation of what they have learned in their lives, the lessons they've taken from that, and their skills at teaching. They are both wonderful and inspiring teachers, albeit in completely different ways.

Everybody can decide for themselves whether Leandro's course is worth the money. In my case it was life-changing.

  • I totally changed the way my studio was set up after watching his very long and extremely detailed video on how and why he sets up his studio the way he does. He gets down to the inches. I spent an entire day moving everything around, and now I enjoy making music more. And I'm not done. He has inspired some future plans.
  • I changed my template completely. In his videos, he breaks down why he has certain virtual instruments in his template. He gets into detail on the strengths and weaknesses. You could watch five or six videos from other companies covering topics of all sorts in the time that Leandro spends on the various flutes in his template from various developers. Which ones are strong and weak for different kinds of music or articulations. Which ones he uses the most and why. Some of these instruments cost a fortune and some of these are free. Again, these are all choices that are unique to him. My template is very modest, and there is zero chance that I will ever own as many libraries as he does, but I found every second of this to be fascinating. I went back to my own little template with renewed enthusiasm, and tore it apart and built it up again, just as I had with my studio. This is a process that will continue forever, but it will always be guided by his example.

As an assignment, he asked people to send in a composition to the forum so that he and everybody else could see it. Not a lot of people did (certainly not me), but still, as far as I could tell, he gave his helpful analyses to everybody. If Leandro intends to keep doing that kind of thing as his course grows, I can understand why he might want to keep the enrollment limited.

IMHO he can price it any way he wants as long as it works out for him. If he can close enrollment, that would suggest he is doing just fine. If people feel they get good value, they will say so on forums like this one.

I agree with him that it makes no sense for people to take one class rather than taking the whole thing. It's not about the topics in the syllabus, it's about the approach. He's going to have to figure how to get people to do that. But that's marketing.

As a marketing man myself, I would suggest that Leandro put up a few samples of his course for free on his YouTube channel. There are trailers for the class up there now but IMHO that is not enough to make the sale or to make people on a thread like this understand what I'm talking about. I think, for example, a video on how and why he sets up the woodwinds in his template would be more effective.

People will then see exactly what he is all about and decide if they want more, and whether the price is worth it to them. But again, if he is happy with the way things are going, who am I to tell him what to do? :) Anyway, I wish him the best of luck.
 
OP
leogardini

leogardini

Senior Member
I took advantage of Leandro's recent offer on this forum to take some of 701 for free. The course is too advanced for me right now, but once I reach a higher level in my musical development, I intend to pay. This is not a course for beginners. This is a course for people who are already creating orchestral music on computers, and want to take their mockups to another level.

You absolutely can't get the information in this class anywhere else, because this is about creating MIDI mockups the way Leandro does it. Nobody else can teach that course any more than they could teach Mike Verta's courses. It's personal, and it's based on a foundation of what they have learned in their lives, the lessons they've taken from that, and their skills at teaching. They are both wonderful and inspiring teachers, albeit in completely different ways.

Everybody can decide for themselves whether Leandro's course is worth the money. In my case it was life-changing.

  • I totally changed the way my studio was set up after watching his very long and extremely detailed video on how and why he sets up his studio the way he does. He gets down to the inches. I spent an entire day moving everything around, and now I enjoy making music more. And I'm not done. He has inspired some future plans.
  • I changed my template completely. In his videos, he breaks down why he has certain virtual instruments in his template. He gets into detail on the strengths and weaknesses. You could watch five or six videos from other companies covering topics of all sorts in the time that Leandro spends on the various flutes in his template from various developers. Which ones are strong and weak for different kinds of music or articulations. Which ones he uses the most and why. Some of these instruments cost a fortune and some of these are free. Again, these are all choices that are unique to him. My template is very modest, and there is zero chance that I will ever own as many libraries as he does, but I found every second of this to be fascinating. I went back to my own little template with renewed enthusiasm, and tore it apart and built it up again, just as I had with my studio. This is a process that will continue forever, but it will always be guided by his example.
As an assignment, he asked people to send in a composition to the forum so that he and everybody else could see it. Not a lot of people did (certainly not me), but still, as far as I could tell, he gave his helpful analyses to everybody. If Leandro intends to keep doing that kind of thing as his course grows, I can understand why he might want to keep the enrollment limited.

IMHO he can price it any way he wants as long as it works out for him. If he can close enrollment, that would suggest he is doing just fine. If people feel they get good value, they will say so on forums like this one.

I agree with him that it makes no sense for people to take one class rather than taking the whole thing. It's not about the topics in the syllabus, it's about the approach. He's going to have to figure how to get people to do that. But that's marketing.

As a marketing man myself, I would suggest that Leandro put up a few samples of his course for free on his YouTube channel. There are trailers for the class up there now but IMHO that is not enough to make the sale or to make people on a thread like this understand what I'm talking about. I think, for example, a video on how and why he sets up the woodwinds in his template would be more effective.

People will then see exactly what he is all about and decide if they want more, and whether the price is worth it to them. But again, if he is happy with the way things are going, who am I to tell him what to do? :) Anyway, I wish him the best of luck.
That's an accurate point of view and I am happy to read such thing specially because I didn't ask you to write anything in my favor.
As far as I can see, people get the philosophy and aim of the course right from the beginning and they see the importance of the layout and sequence of the course. Scoring Tools Masterclass is definitely not a course for consultation of the topics that you think are the most relevant for you. It is my approach to midi orchestration that I have been developing for more than 15 years and it can literally transform your music like never before.
However, my goal is to teach from absolute beginners to very advanced midi orchestrators. I really don't care what is your level but I do care if you think the course can be improved in any way.
Please feel free to leave your comment on our private forum. This thread is open for everybody and you can leave your comment as a guest if you don't want to identify yourself.

P.S. (for everybody) Even though this is a course designed for every level, it is not a course for everybody. If you are happy with your midi mockups and know how I make everything in my music and don't want to change your approach, Scoring Tools Masterclass is not for you. On the other hand, if you like the sound of my mockups and want to be able to do it yourself then it is going to be one of your best investments you will ever make in yourself.
Scoring Tools Masterclass won't be sold for few bucks in order to compete on the market. First because I am not competing with any other school. I am creating a "never seen" new product based on my experience. And second because I know that my knowledge is valuable and it is what makes me able to sound like I do. No one should ever sell such knowledge for a cheap price.
If you can't afford a single payment we have payment plans. But if you think you can sound like or even better than I do by studying any of the other course or free stuff on the internet then do it. I am just offering something for you. If you think it is expensive or don't like it then don't buy it.
I am not the best, I am just doing my best!
Thank you for reading until here.
 
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jonathanparham

Active Member
Good to know. Will the course be helpful if say you only on one are two bread and butter libraries or Amadeus? Do you have to have enough libraries for are use VEP? What if you don't on a particular plug in?
 
OP
leogardini

leogardini

Senior Member
Good to know. Will the course be helpful if say you only on one are two bread and butter libraries or Amadeus? Do you have to have enough libraries for are use VEP? What if you don't on a particular plug in?
I don't teach tutorials about how to use certain plugins but instead I teach my approach and mindset to midi orchestration. Therefore, with few adaptations you can apply the teachings to your own tools.
Some students are creating a perfect replica of my template in their own systems which is fine but not necessary. In the end what matter is how you use the tools!
 

jonathanparham

Active Member
I don't teach tutorials about how to use certain plugins but instead I teach my approach and mindset to midi orchestration. Therefore, with few adaptations you can apply the teachings to your own tools.
Some students are creating a perfect replica of my template in their own systems which is fine but not necessary. In the end what matter is how you use the tools!
Thanks for the clarification
 

jadedsean

Active Member
I forgot about this course and now i wanted to checked it out but all the videos are locked. Is the time up for the free content?
 

Digivolt

Active Member
I forgot about this course and now i wanted to checked it out but all the videos are locked. Is the time up for the free content?
I didn't have the time either to do the course so was saving it, but I just logged in to check and the vids can still be unlocked
 
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