"To Spitfire" or not "To Spitfire"

Discussion in 'Newbie Questions' started by M0rdechai, Jun 12, 2018.

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  1. OP
    OP
    M0rdechai

    M0rdechai Member

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    ow yeah and on the EWCC:

    I don't know why I don't want that.
    Maybe it's because I'm renting a house for double the monthly costs of buying the same house, but not being allowed to buy it because 'I don't make enough money'
    OR maybe it's because I'm for some reason not inspired by the sounds of EW. I mean they are good, really good, but to me not inspiring, just 'representing the real thing' (if that makes any sense)
     
  2. Shredoverdrive

    Shredoverdrive Senior Member

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    This makes sense and if you really think this sound is not for you, fair enough. But keep in mind that you can get a first month subscription for 14.99 dollars, try everything and then cancel it. If you do that at a time when their stuff is on sale, it can be very interesting. That's what I did during the very auspicious "VST Buzz EW Hollywood Orchestra Gold sale / Memorial day sale" combo. I ended up with EWHO and Spaces and cancelled my subscription (and they really work well with my few VSL (Winds) and Chris Hein (Solo strings and winds) instruments). But I could also have bought nothing at all and lost only 15 bucks.
    My point is OT and SA make truly wonderful products but they have flaws, as everyone said before, and they don't allow resale (neither does EW, by the way) . They don't have demos, either if I'm not mistaken. Think hard before spending that kind of money.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2018
  3. Henu

    Henu Senior Member

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    Thanks for the tip! So I guess SCS isn't really cutting as the "only" string section in the orchestral string section, but seems to work nicely layered with other libraries to give them the detail they might lack.
     
  4. MatFluor

    MatFluor Senior Member

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    I would say it can do that - being as the only string section. But of course it depends on the stuff you make. SCS alone have a lovely sound, and I made stuff with them only and was happy with it. Great if you want a more "old-school" sound.
    So, it can definitely pull it off - but it depends what you want.
     
    Henu likes this.
  5. Karma

    Karma Spitfire Audio

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    It absolutely can, check out the demos for a good example of that :thumbsup:
     
  6. Henu

    Henu Senior Member

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    Old-school, you say? Count me in! That's totally my biggest love in orchestral music and most of the stuff I do tends desperately to sound like that (only worse, haha!), both in orchestration and in the sound. So I definitely need to try those out then!!!

    EDIT: Thanks Karma, I will revisit those demos again! The more I think of this, the more I start also to think that it's not about the library but the limitations I personally possess to not make it sound as I want. :D
     
  7. JohnG

    JohnG Senior Member

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    SCS was recorded with a very small section. You can't quite do "big" with it, really, even though it's lovely.

    I mean, these days there's the whole faux baroque concept and the Scandi thing and all that, so for that kind of thing SCS is certainly A-plus, but if you want "major military confrontation / video game mightiness," I'd opt for SSS or HS or any number of bigger sections. HZ Strings.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2018
  8. nas

    nas Senior Member

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    First off, as has been mentioned, you don't need to stick to just one library developer. I have different sections from several different developers and blend them very effectively without any problems really. Go with a sound that inspires you and is close to what your going for stylistically.

    That being said, I would strongly recommend that you not go on a buying spree just yet. Choose a couple of libraries that you feel you really need (as opposed to want), perhaps a solid string library to do the heavy lifting and one other section - from any manufacturer that inspires you and you can afford. Then spend a lot of time learning the library inside and out and listening to lots of music. Get a feel for the library and learn to work with it's strengths and identify it's weaknesses. The more practice and experience you have - not only in general, but with a specific library, the more you will be able to squeeze out a more musically satisfying result... and that does take some time.

    I find that buying too many libraries all at once can be overwhelming and can dilute your ability to really focus on a single library and get the most out of it. With Komplete 11 you already have quite a bit of great sounds to work with, the Kontakt Factory library in particular has excellent quality orchestral sounds (especially the percussion and woodwinds IMHO) and although they may be slim on articulations you can still really get a lot out of them.

    So work with what you have and build on that gradually.

    Just my 2 cents. Good luck.
     
    GearNostalgia likes this.
  9. How can you know if they aren't inspiring? You won't know until you actually load them up and try them. It's the same with any developer, but unfortunately we can be sold purely on the demos they post for their products. I fell for that one a few times, just make sure you make educated decisions. And don't make price a factor; if you're serious about getting into this, invest in some top notch libraries. Don't bother with any "starter" libraries, they will kill your inspiration right out of the gate. I cheaped out years ago and bought Garriton Personal Orchestra and it was just plain awful (and still is IMO). Granted, they weren't a lot of options in 2006, but after that I caved and spent $1200 on the old EW Complete Composers Collection (I think there were 40 DVD's in the box!), but it literally paid for itself in spades over the following year. I think you have it narrowed down to some good options though!
     
  10. tehreal

    tehreal Senior Member

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    Nice balanced approach. I like it. Additional +1 for Colossus. Matt Bowdler is a ridiculously talented sound designer.
     
  11. desert

    desert Just here so I don't get fined

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    I dont think hollywood strings is a weak library at all and it’s cheap.

    Why buy a porche, if you can’t drive a car?

    For a person who has very minimal knowledge of orchestration, they’re not going to learn by spend $$$$ on spitfire cause it sounds better. How would they know what it’s supposed to sound like?

    Jeremy soule was composing beautiful soundtracks years ago with shitty samples.

    Thomas bergerson could make shit samples sound great.

    This forum loves promoting samples before we tell them to invest in the theory/foundation first.

    Too many hobbyists just give up cause they thought buying the best would make their music sound better
     
    GearNostalgia likes this.
  12. GearNostalgia

    GearNostalgia Senior Member

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    That is true about everything. I am an utter sinner in the department of not using my gear to their full potential. Good rule, hard to follow.
     
    nas likes this.
  13. Parsifal666

    Parsifal666 I don't even own a DAW, I'm just a troll.

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    Excellent post! Please don't blow your money yet. EW Composer Cloud beckons...it gives you time to

    a) figure out whether you're mostly just content with what EW is offering (which is quite possible as some of the favorite composers around here still use EW), plus if you read up on their manuals and check out the videos you'll be better capable of making (as Jimmy mentioned) an educated decision.

    b) figure out whether you really want to be a composer or are just dying to spend money.

    There are more bs around vi-control then you might expect btw. Either way, you won't be alone.
     
    GearNostalgia likes this.
  14. GearNostalgia

    GearNostalgia Senior Member

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    Well I thought the same when I should renovate my house. "I am a beginner. I can not use pro tools. So I will just get cheap DIY stuff". After a weeks of cursing "how the f**k do they get this to fit together I realised my tablesaw could not cut perfect angles and my screwdriver was too weak to drive in big enough screws". So I had to buy the pro tools after I had gotten the cheap stuff. So it was just even more costly. Now I agree that is not perfectly true about music, Depeche Mode could make songs with ping pong balls and I guess Freddy Mercury could have rocked any stage just singing and stomping his foot. But I still thing that in general it is better to buy the good stuff you really want rather than cheap stuff in the start that you end up discarding. As for sample libraries this sadly does apply even harder since your can buy expensive stuff from 8Dio and others that sounds great in the demos but suck when you play them. And also you have a legal bond that prevent you from recovering any off that purchase. So choose with great care.
     
    desert likes this.
  15. Consona

    Consona Senior Member

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    Yea.

    This is 18 years old, done with some old version of Garritan iirc. Sounds great.

    But I have to say, for some things, you just need a specific/more modern library. Like playable runs patches in CS2, I don't know any other way how to make that sound unless I have this particular library. So while I agree you can make some very well sounding music with older cheaper stuff, sometimes it can be very limiting when you want to use techniques those older or any other libs won't handle.

    Like this runs thing. You can buy some very modern quite expensive string libraries but not many will sound as good as CS2 when it comes to this specific articulation.
     
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  16. Parsifal666

    Parsifal666 I don't even own a DAW, I'm just a troll.

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    This is so cool! Thank you.
     
    Consona likes this.
  17. JohnG

    JohnG Senior Member

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    I didn't write that. On the contrary, I'm a huge fan of East West and use their stuff constantly. In fact, one mystery to me is their pricing, given that the sound of their samples is equal to or better than that of some more recent libraries.

    Moreover, PLAY seems to have settled down. I am not saying it's better than / not better than, Kontakt or some other player, but it works fine for me. (actually, it always has worked fine here but I don't want to revive that debate).

    That said, the key in choosing a library is to listen, using good speakers or at least very good headphones, to the finest resolution (WAV if possible) demos of any library before buying. But for sure get a really good one with multiple mic positions.

    And remember: the most expensive library out there costs less than 1/3 of one semester at a private university in the USA. Plus, you can run a pretty good amount of it on a computer that costs $2-5k, so the entire thing is actually a bargain these days.

    Your time is at stake, the one thing you can't get more of; if you really want to be a composer and need these tools to do it (to persuade a producer to hire you, for example), don't "save money" if you have it.

    Naturally, there's no reason waste money either; if you like East West, you can write awesome music with it.

    [note: I have received free products from East West]
     
    Parsifal666 likes this.
  18. robgb

    robgb I Have Strong Opinions

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    The answer comes down to this question: how much time do you want to spend learning to mix/engineer your compositions? If the answer is "not much," then you're much better off staying with a single developer's ecosystem, especially one like Spitfire's with its built-in Air Studios room sound. If the answer is "I want to learn to mix also," then there's absolutely nothing wrong with mixing and matching and layering various developers' libraries, because if you learn to mix properly, most of the problems of mixing and matching can be solved in one way or another.

    I opt toward learning how to mix because that's a big part of the job these days. If not for the final mix, then for a mix you'd present to whoever is hiring you, which you'd want to sound really good.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2018
  19. Parsifal666

    Parsifal666 I don't even own a DAW, I'm just a troll.

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    It's true, the orchestral libraries from EW are timelessly great. They're one of the reasons there are a few big name libraries I own but never use, like Albion II, Met Ark 1, and Strezov (no reason to not pick up any of those fine libraries though, as any one or all of them might suit your vision and personal composition needs more).
     
  20. bigcat1969

    bigcat1969 Senior Member

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