Studio One - Why no professional endorsements?

Akarin

composingtips.com
Expression maps is the name of the articulation management in Cubase.

Studio One 5 has its own articulation management based on keyswitches.
Is it only keyswitch based or can it switch between MIDI channels as well? (I use a lot of that to control Kontakt and Play multis).
 

Lukas

Keyboardist / composer
Yes, I know. That's why it makes no sense at all to include them in the piano roll. They are there in their somehow special red lanes and not affected by some, but not all, actions. What Presonus did was actually the worst imaginable solution. Why not lock the keyswitches in the piano roll?
Because you need to have a way to select and move them somehow (with or without the notes). It's a pretty good solution imo.

Oh yeah, talking about braindead decisions: why do tools in the arranger view an the edit views have different keycommands (pencil is '5' with tracks and '3' in the piano roll editor and '2' in the score view, split tool is either '2' or '3')? Why does the order of tools change too (eraser is between knife and pencil in the arranger view and after pencil in the editor)?
Yep. Indeed a weird decision :) I guess nobody can deny that.
 
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Lukas

Keyboardist / composer
Is it only keyswitch based or can it switch between MIDI channels as well? (I use a lot of that to control Kontakt and Play multis).
Hey Nicolas,
yes, right now it's only keyswitch based. But there are already feature requests for that because PLAY (as far as I know) does not allow to configure keyswitches, and for using Kontakt it would be helpful too to access different instruments on different MIDI channels. So I'm sure this will be added at some point (hopefully sooner than later).
 

ReleaseCandidate

Active Member

Lukas

Keyboardist / composer
You can select them and copy and paste them. You only can't drag and move them. But when you select them together with notes and you move these notes, the keyswitches follow.

To be honest, I find it pretty convenient. But I agree that the keyswitches still need a couple of enhancements.
 

Sean J

Noise Maker
What Presonus did was actually the worst imaginable solution... talking about braindead decisions
PreSonus devs aren't braindead.

I begged most developers (software & samples) for a decade, to give up Expression Maps and instead add an in-app store w/ pre-mapped samples, or at least think about UX instead. Anyone who does would realize there's only one right answer here. Most said it was lightyears away from anything in the industry, then StaffPad did exactly this. I didn't tell David Hearn. He just did it, exactly what I said. Why? Cause it makes sense to do it. When I compare that to the fact that smarter instruments (Infinite Brass, Spitfire's solo violin) don't need complex maps, it's obvious that complex mapping features are yet again... the wrong answer.

What DAW is doing it right? Technically none are.

Studio One is the closest in many ways. I've added a feature request to improve the notation and piano roll here, partially related to keyswitches. I've posted it on VI-Control a few times this week. It's an important need. Sure. But I still prefer S1's notation and handling of this over using Expression Maps, Articulation Sets, or half the other convoluted options out there. So is Studio One perfect? No, and for more reasons than one.

But 1) it isn't Cubase and 2) my USB key sits in a draw I never feel the need to open. ;)

I'll take PreSonus any day.
 

Sean J

Noise Maker
I forgot why I came here.

To the OP...

If Alan Silvestri said he likes using Cubase while sitting in a pool full of Jello to channel his writing energy, I wouldn't copy him. Just try it out. ;) Workflow wins hands down for most folks. It's just missing film features, though they are a few of the top-voted requests right now, so they are coming soon. They are great about adding the user voted requests and listening.
 

dcoscina

Senior Member
So a couple quick first impressions

1. Notation- doesn't seem to like staggered notes over sustained notes. It will ignore the sustained pitch and just interpret the new notes.

2. Retro Record- great addition but I feel it's truncating note lengths. I tried it on Cubase which seems to play back all of the notes accurately. Will continue to try this out however.
 

Lukas

Keyboardist / composer
2. Retro Record- great addition but I feel it's truncating note lengths. I tried it on Cubase which seems to play back all of the notes accurately. Will continue to try this out however.
Can't see this here. Which notes are trancated?
 

Akarin

composingtips.com
Hey Nicolas,
yes, right now it's only keyswitch based. But there are already feature requests for that because PLAY (as far as I know) does not allow to configure keyswitches, and for using Kontakt it would be helpful too to access different instruments on different MIDI channels. So I'm sure this will be added at some point (hopefully sooner than later).
Ok. Thanks for that. It's maybe a part of the answer why S1 is not that used by A-lister composers. Many have a multi-computers setup and the ability to use MIDI-channel articulation switches is part of the workflow.
 

Sean J

Noise Maker
Ok. Thanks for that. It's maybe a part of the answer why S1 is not that used by A-lister composers. Many have a multi-computers setup and the ability to use MIDI-channel articulation switches is part of the workflow.
The biggest reason isn't features. It's that it's a young DAW. Many A-list composers have 1,000 tracks and never touch maps.

Developers left Steinberg to create Studio One, a dev manager, the creator of VST3, and I believe some non managerial devs did after this. Then PreSonus hired devs from the Pro Tools and Logic dev teams from AVID and Apple. Put that up against how old many well known composers are. Will Hans Zimmer and the best selling composer in 2040 both use the same DAW?

Geez, I hope not. ;)

I suspect the biggest reason why is that people tend to stay put. Another reason is that some companies don't want big names influencing them. I've seen a software developer say no to big money, based on the mentality that they should please 80% of their customer base, not their single richest customer, as that would do more to keep them in business. A developer shouldn't listen to a bigshot composer as much as the people (plural) wrestling with their program who want something better.

I'll make it big someday. I'll endorse PreSonus, and we'll call this a moot point. Problem solved.
 

CATDAD

New Member
It's young, and even younger if you consider it's true "birth" to be when it gained feature parity with some other popular DAWs. Even if there were to be minor workflow improvements compared to the tools established people are already using, familiarity has a bigger impact on speed (and thus creative flow) for the most part. If you're an A-lister or studio owner, you already have an established workflow that has been proven to meet the demand of the work you have coming in, why change it when money is on the line? And when people are new to the game, the first thing they're gonna ask is "what do the pros use?" and emulate that, because well, how else are they going to decide when they don't know what they want?

Sometimes endorsements are just paid-for blurbs and/or videos from the companies themselves too, so I wouldn't take too much stock in to them. If you were comfortable with any old DAW, only with one of them a company would pay you money or give you free stuff to use? Of course you would pick that one!

If Presonus keeps going the way they have been with it so far, I'm sure you'll start to see it more often when the B and C-listers getting comfy with it now gain popularity down the line. I personally think Studio One will have no problem keeping steady in the long run, as Presonus is already making money elsewhere with hardware, so they're really in no rush to get more people on board with their software.

I feel like Bitwig is in a similar situation too. It really takes Ableton's "sound-design playground" aspect a step further. It's still missing some bits and pieces from Ableton though, and it doesn't necessarily give enough incentive to move when you already use and are comfortable with Ableton.

If you like it and it does things you need it to, use it!
 

ennbr

New Member
Several good reasons why established pros have not moved over would be the time to learn a new DAW expense of recreating working templates and getting the outboard gear configured and running. Plus if there really busy schedules factor into a changing to a new DAW.
 

Sean J

Noise Maker
Where did you get this? :) PSL never hired developers from Avid and Apple.
If you're asking me to remember a URL from sometime in 2019-2020.............? I know I read it on a site that talked about the dev, which also had referenced the original creators of S1. As they had enough 'right', I trusted what I read. If it's wrong, it's wrong.
 

jonathanwright

Senior Member
I can't help but think it's a bit academic really. The big AAA composers also have huge teams behind them, custom samplers, sound engineers, the worlds best mixers, the world best orchestras and soundstages.

Which DAW they use, while very important to their own personal workflow (after all, workflow and enjoyment of use is what it's all about) is a tiny part of their overall 'sound'.
 

Jimmy Hellfire

Senior Member
I like S1, but it would take an astronomic quantum leap in the realm of DAWs to make me switch from Cubase to something else. There's just no way I'm re-learning everything from scratch unless it's something that made my life 7000% better (which it won't).

Now considering that AAA type guys have tons of shit going on and are most probably in the middle of something anyways, and they have all these other people connected to the process, they'd be crazy to switch DAWs. I wouldn't put much stock into who uses which DAW and how many celebrities approve of my personal choices.