Studio One users, how do you find S1 for big orchestral projects?

Discussion in 'Your DAW (Digital Audio Workstation)' started by Arise, Feb 2, 2019.

  1. Fanarik

    Fanarik New Member

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    I'm fairly new to the S1 but I experience the same issue here...

    Correct me if I'm wrong but you are referring to the problem related to the configuration of the Event Automation Lanes (Lane) within a given Instrument Part in the Edit Window, I believe.

    By default for each Lane S1 offers Velocity, Modulation, Pitch Bend, After Touch as Parameters. Based on your needs and the offered Parameters by the assigned Instrument (via the Instrument Track) to be automated, you can add additional Parameters to the Lanes. In order to view/edit multiple Parameters at once you need to create multiple instances of Lanes and select the relevant Parameter for each Lane separately.

    Screenshot 2019-05-15 at 13.53.47.png

    Issue: for whatever reason, whatever you set up, S1 does not persist correctly the selected state of the Parameters in the Lanes. Whenever you e.g. add a new Instrument Track or even sometimes just change the selection of an Instrument Part/Instrument Track, S1 falls back some default Parameter selection across all the Instrument Tracks i.e. you can start the selection exercise from the scratch.

    Do I miss something?
     
  2. Lukas

    Lukas Keyboardist / composer

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    The main question is: When does this happen and what did you do to make it happen? Did you change the instrument of one track, did you duplicate a track or what exactly did you do?

    I never had problems like that nor have heard of it. But if there are issues I'm very interested in the steps that are needed to reproduce it. Or a video that shows it. I just tried to make it happen by replacing instruments but all controllers/parameters that I had added to the controller lane stayed where they are (even if there were parameters that the new instrument doesn't have at all).
     
  3. Fanarik

    Fanarik New Member

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    Sep 19, 2018
    Zürich
    Quick and dirty:
    • 4 Instrument Tracks, Kontakt 5 instances have assigned
    • Each Kontakt 5 runs a CSSS patch (Violin I., Violin II., Viola, Cello)
    • Besides the default parameters the Sustain Pedal OnOff, Control 58 are added to the Lanes
    • S1 v4.1.4.51719
    • macOS Mojave, v10.14.4



    I hope it helps.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2019
  4. jonathanwright

    jonathanwright Senior Member

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    If you add a new CC parameter part way into a project, only the track you've added it to will automatically display that CC lane. Other tracks will still display the default set without your new parameter.
     
  5. Lukas

    Lukas Keyboardist / composer

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    @Fanarik: What you show in the video is totally correct behaviour: Each automation lane will show you the same parameter for every track. Maybe you have overseen that in one track you added Control 58 and Sustain Pedal in the opposite order. That's why the selected tab will be different.

    If you look at it again you will see that it recalls the exact parameter that you've selected. In track 1 (Violin I) you've added Control 58 before Sustain Pedal. So if you remove and re-add Control 58 to bring it into the same order as the other tracks it will behave as you want ;)
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2019
  6. Fanarik

    Fanarik New Member

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    Sep 19, 2018
    Zürich
    Tested again, so the newly added parameters are not inherited across the tracks and the order adding them eventually defines if I can maintain the visual consistency of the lanes and the respective parameters across the tracks.

    @Lukas and @jonathanwright thanks for the clarification!
     
    jonathanwright likes this.
  7. jbuhler

    jbuhler Senior Member

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    I have a similar issue and it's a hard issue to isolate because I only notice it after it's happened and I've never been able to determine a sequence to trigger it. Some of it might indeed be due to the fact that S1 remembers the set up for each track and I've forgotten that I had that track set up differently, but sometimes S1 does seem to revert to something like a default state, because I had just been working on that track and the automation lanes suddenly aren't at all what I was just using. And often the aftertouch lane is open even though I never use it.

    Does anyone else have a problem with S1 hanging on quit? I've been having this issue since S1 3, and it's gotten worse with version 4. If I work on a S1 project for more than 15 minutes, it will hang on close 99% of the time. I can force quit it and the file is saved and all, but it's still disconcerting, and I've no luck with Presonus help on the issue. (Admittedly, I haven't gone back to them about it after several failed attempts to fix it with version 3.)
     
  8. Lukas

    Lukas Keyboardist / composer

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    Of course not. Because basically each track (= instrument) may have a totally different set of available parameters. If I have one track with a NI FM8 and you add one parameter for FM Operator offset, whould should that be available on a track with KONTAKT 5? :)

    We must not forget that not everything in S1 is MIDI which means that most plugin parameters we see in the automation lanes (like cutoff in Mai Tai) are not MIDI CCs but rather rather real host automation (a distinct connection to one plugin parameter).

    @jbuhler:
    Not often... it is always open because it's part of the basic parameters (Velocity, Pitchband, Modwheel and After Touch) which can't be removed.

    Only if there's a buggy plugin involved which hangs during quit and won't respond anymore. So you mean S1 will never quit and it's not a crash with a system message and a resulting crash log?
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2019
    jbuhler likes this.
  9. Fanarik

    Fanarik New Member

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    Sep 19, 2018
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    Ok, understood :) then one more question: is there a way to maintain different number of lanes across the instrument parts which are not on the same track? As you correctly said the actual instruments might be different and need a different number of parameters to be adjusted.
     
  10. Lukas

    Lukas Keyboardist / composer

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    Yes, you could "Duplicate (complete)" the track including the instrument (right-click on the track). So the plugin and the automation will be duplicated as well.
     
  11. jbuhler

    jbuhler Senior Member

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    By “open,” I mean visible in the automation lane even though that lane had been set to display CC21, say. Sometimes the lanes seem to revert to the initial state, like S1 can’t find the settings for the track.

    The only commonality I’ve found is projects that use Kontakt hang on close. And by hang I mean I can leave it closing for an hour and it’s still there until I force quit. So no not a crash. With S1 I usually use the VST version of Kontakt with 16 outs.
     
  12. Fanarik

    Fanarik New Member

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    Sep 19, 2018
    Zürich
    Ok, I might be misunderstood so let me rephrase my question:

    If Part A1 on Track A with Plugin 1 has 5 parameters and Part B2 on Track B with Plugin 2 has only 2 parameters then can I have 5 Lanes on Part A1 and 2 Lanes on Part B2?

    I have tried the "Duplicate (complete)" but the end result is always the same number of lanes on all parts in the project regardless of its track...

    P.S.: kudos to you guys for helping me with such fundamental topics, I have never thought that I will find such vibrant, knowledgable and helpful community here!
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2019
  13. Phillip Dixon

    Phillip Dixon Air on a shoestring

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    just got mail from presonus
    big annoncement on tuesday 21st may
    live web cast.. latest inovation.based on users feedback.......so they say
     
  14. rrichard63

    rrichard63 Perpetual Novice

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    Yes. As far as I know this is not at all rare. Since it always seems to save my work and close all its windows before issuing the standard Windows "this program has stopped responding" message, I have always assumed that the problem is basically cosmetic, and that this is why Presonus doesn't bother to fix it.
     
    jbuhler likes this.
  15. Lukas

    Lukas Keyboardist / composer

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    Yeah, sorry, I did not get that. What you want is currently not possible in S1. The exact lanes configuration won't be saved and recalled for each track. So if you have five visible lanes this will be the same for each track.

    But I think that's a good feature request. Maybe you have a Sample Modelling instrument on one track which needs many different MIDI CCs ... but when editing (VSTi) drums you only need to see velocity.

    Not that easy to say what should happen if there are multiple parts from several tracks opened in the editor. Hard to save that state. It's a bit like the editor zoom which is stored per track since Studio One 4. What this setting is gone as soon as you do multi track note editing.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2019
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  16. Fanarik

    Fanarik New Member

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    Sep 19, 2018
    Zürich
    Thanks Lukas.
     
  17. Genki

    Genki New Member

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    Yeah..hopefully they will finally add NKS integration...
     
  18. Lukas

    Lukas Keyboardist / composer

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    ...which is not really an inovation though :)
     
  19. OP
    OP
    Arise

    Arise Member

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    I don't recall Presonus mentioning "innovation" but it will be something to do with their biggest user requests. And for several years now the most voted request has been NKS integration. As well as CPU improvements.
     
    Lukas likes this.
  20. petec

    petec New Member

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    Jun 19, 2018
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    Disconcerting is somewhat of an understatement. Similarly my setup (orchestral) locks up on close almost every save. I don't have many tracks at all with the projects I'm working with. I've tried removing/deleting tracks in the mixer that I'm no longer using, eg Kontakt instances. Unfortunately windows Task Manager is my only method of shut down in these instances.

    Sorry but I don't, as yet, have an answer to this. But like you, we persevere and hope someone at Presonus notices. Now I have to say that I really like using Studio 1 for my orchestral projects, and have found the software to be superb. It's just that the niggles bite.
     

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