Studio One users, how do you find S1 for big orchestral projects?

jbuhler

Senior Member
If you by accident scroll with your scroll wheel while hovering over the color bar you will scroll through the colors.
Thanks for the reply! Yes, I know that behavior when the color bar is open, but the weird thing is that the color bar never appears on screen.
 

jbuhler

Senior Member
Ok, another strange behavior I'm getting right now in S1. I'm working in the scratchpad. I have the piano roll open on a second monitor. I have the loop set for 8 measures starting in m. 17. In the arrange window, I click on one of the regions to edit the midi at m. 17. But rather than going to the selected region or even staying in the loop, the editor instead goes to the unselected region at the beginning of the scratchpad and it turns off autoscroll. Any idea why it is doing this and how I can get it to stop?

A second strange behavior. Sometimes when I'm scrolling in the piano roll, the scrolling becomes painfully slow and lags 5-10 second behind the movements I'm making with the scroll functions of my mouse (this is using the scroll functions of the Apple magic mouse). (I have to stop and wait for it to catch up.) This doesn't happen all the time, but once it starts happening after I open a project the more it will continue to happen. Again, does anyone know what might be going on?
 

jbuhler

Senior Member
So I've now been working with SO4 for about a month on a largish orchestral project, and really I'm having all sorts of problems that seem as best I can tell related to the size of the project. The music editor is excruciatingly slow to respond both in editing automation and navigation. (Scrolling from one part of the music to another part is barely functional at all.) Quantize is only working intermittently. It is slow to output mixdowns and stems, frequently pausing for as long as 30 seconds several times while creating in a 6 minute wav file for no reason I can figure out.

It shouldn't be a memory issue as the iMac has 64GB of memory and is only using 35GB of it on this project. (The project is using about 100 tracks and another 10GB of memory is being used by the system and other programs.) But the machine behaving a lot like when I only had 32GB and would be using all of it. I have none of these issues in Logic.

So I continue to think the S04 is really just not yet suited to deal with the complexity of large templates of VIs and I will be reverting to Logic for large projects after this. Beyond the performance issues I'm having, I also think the midi editing remains inadequate. The automation lanes continue to be a mess imho and only have one window for music editing remains a pain. Also the manual is completely inadequate, leaving much of the functionality of the program undocumented.
 

chocobitz825

Senior Member
So I've now been working with SO4 for about a month on a largish orchestral project, and really I'm having all sorts of problems that seem as best I can tell related to the size of the project. The music editor is excruciatingly slow to respond both in editing automation and navigation. (Scrolling from one part of the music to another part is barely functional at all.) Quantize is only working intermittently. It is slow to output mixdowns and stems, frequently pausing for as long as 30 seconds several times while creating in a 6 minute wav file for no reason I can figure out.

It shouldn't be a memory issue as the iMac has 64GB of memory and is only using 35GB of it on this project. (The project is using about 100 tracks and another 10GB of memory is being used by the system and other programs.) But the machine behaving a lot like when I only had 32GB and would be using all of it. I have none of these issues in Logic.

So I continue to think the S04 is really just not yet suited to deal with the complexity of large templates of VIs and I will be reverting to Logic for large projects after this. Beyond the performance issues I'm having, I also think the midi editing remains inadequate. The automation lanes continue to be a mess imho and only have one window for music editing remains a pain. Also the manual is completely inadequate, leaving much of the functionality of the program undocumented.
Some points I agree with but by everything I’ve seen so far, it seems like Studio One is not a match for your preferred workflow. No doubt more changes will come to later versions as people keep contributing to the forums, but for whatever reason it seems like S1 is not a great match for your system/workflow. Logic is great though. If it works, why change?
 

jbuhler

Senior Member
Some points I agree with but by everything I’ve seen so far, it seems like Studio One is not a match for your preferred workflow. No doubt more changes will come to later versions as people keep contributing to the forums, but for whatever reason it seems like S1 is not a great match for your system/workflow. Logic is great though. If it works, why change?
Why change? Good question. Because there are things about SO I like a lot, such as the scratch pads and how the arrangement track works, and even though I don’t like the fact that the music editor is limited to one window I do like the way it works in other respects. I also find SO works really well for me on modest sized projects. And the reason I chose to work with Studio One on this project is I was curious how well it could handle a large project now and I knew I’d want to be using the scratch pads. (And indeed I have 32 of them at the moment.)

But really the thing that is making SO unworkable for this project is the sluggishness, and within the sluggishness the scrolling is driving me batty. I scroll with one swipe on the mouse (Apple Magic Mouse) and it takes a good 15 seconds before the screen stops moving and of course it’s not at all positioned properly. Similar problem in the automation lanes. I click to create an edit point and the dot shows up 3 seconds later. I move the dot and the dot moves 3 seconds later. This makes for very tedious editing and I’m not sure what’s making everything so unresponsive except the size of the project since I don’t have these issues in other SO projects.

Today quantization stopped working too until I restarted. But about an hour later it stopped working again. I have no idea what’s up with this and as far as I’m aware it’s new behavior. (It started before I updated though so it wasn’t the update.)

Also when I click on a region in the arrange window the music editor is not opening to that region but is instead opening to a different place on the track.

The music editor follow cursor button keeps automatically disengaging and I’m not sure why. Like the quantization issue this one is new behavior for me.

I bring this up not to complain but to report on my experience with a large orchestral template since that’s the topic of the thread. Though if anyone has ideas about why it’s so unresponsive or how to address the issue I’d be happy to hear them.
 

chocobitz825

Senior Member
Why change? Good question. Because there are things about SO I like a lot, such as the scratch pads and how the arrangement track works, and even though I don’t like the fact that the music editor is limited to one window I do like the way it works in other respects. I also find SO works really well for me on modest sized projects. And the reason I chose to work with Studio One on this project is I was curious how well it could handle a large project now and I knew I’d want to be using the scratch pads. (And indeed I have 32 of them at the moment.)

But really the thing that is making SO unworkable for this project is the sluggishness, and within the sluggishness the scrolling is driving me batty. I scroll with one swipe on the mouse (Apple Magic Mouse) and it takes a good 15 seconds before the screen stops moving and of course it’s not at all positioned properly. Similar problem in the automation lanes. I click to create an edit point and the dot shows up 3 seconds later. I move the dot and the dot moves 3 seconds later. This makes for very tedious editing and I’m not sure what’s making everything so unresponsive except the size of the project since I don’t have these issues in other SO projects.

Today quantization stopped working too until I restarted. But about an hour later it stopped working again. I have no idea what’s up with this and as far as I’m aware it’s new behavior. (It started before I updated though so it wasn’t the update.)

Also when I click on a region in the arrange window the music editor is not opening to that region but is instead opening to a different place on the track.

The music editor follow cursor button keeps automatically disengaging and I’m not sure why. Like the quantization issue this one is new behavior for me.

I bring this up not to complain but to report on my experience with a large orchestral template since that’s the topic of the thread. Though if anyone has ideas about why it’s so unresponsive or how to address the issue I’d be happy to hear them.

no criticism intended. Its very unusual, and its hard to sort out why you're having such problems. I cant say its large projects, because my system with 128GB RAM has never stuttered like that...so perhaps its a matter of project size, and resource management within your system. Its very possible there are some Studio One resource management problems that people may experience depending on their system. Its very perplexing.
 

jbuhler

Senior Member
Maybe it’s a macOS related issue? It also depends if VEP is involved and if the instruments used inside s1 are vst or au?
No VEP. All instruments are running VST. It may be a MacOS issue but if so it's manifesting only with S1 since the machine has no issue with Logic. Besides losing quantization, it's also acting strangely with merge events. When I tried to merge regions, S1 instead deleted them. This happened on four tracks, while all the other tracks behaved normally. It's all very strange.

On the other hand, S1 crashed so hard earlier tonight that it crashed the whole machine. It's really behaving as though it is running out of memory even though the activity monitor says the machine has 20GB free. I would think it might be faulty RAM, except I haven't had an issue with Logic. I may well test it tomorrow.
 

jonathanwright

Senior Member
Many moons ago (so it may be different now), I found that S1 was far more stable on my system when I always used VST plugins, rather than AU.

When I used AU, it crashed constantly.
 

Gunvor

Member
No VEP. All instruments are running VST. It may be a MacOS issue but if so it's manifesting only with S1 since the machine has no issue with Logic. Besides losing quantization, it's also acting strangely with merge events. When I tried to merge regions, S1 instead deleted them. This happened on four tracks, while all the other tracks behaved normally. It's all very strange.

On the other hand, S1 crashed so hard earlier tonight that it crashed the whole machine. It's really behaving as though it is running out of memory even though the activity monitor says the machine has 20GB free. I would think it might be faulty RAM, except I haven't had an issue with Logic. I may well test it tomorrow.
I don't run my SO on a mac but a win 7 machine. I encountered a similar behavior with sluggishness and crashes when using vst3 instead of vst2 with certain plugins.
 

jbuhler

Senior Member
I don't run my SO on a mac but a win 7 machine. I encountered a similar behavior with sluggishness and crashes when using vst3 instead of vst2 with certain plugins.
They are almost all Kontakt VST2. I think the Spitfire player is VST3. I may try disabling those and seeing if it improves performance. Thanks!
 

samphony

Senior Member
No VEP. All instruments are running VST. It may be a MacOS issue but if so it's manifesting only with S1 since the machine has no issue with Logic. Besides losing quantization, it's also acting strangely with merge events. When I tried to merge regions, S1 instead deleted them. This happened on four tracks, while all the other tracks behaved normally. It's all very strange.

On the other hand, S1 crashed so hard earlier tonight that it crashed the whole machine. It's really behaving as though it is running out of memory even though the activity monitor says the machine has 20GB free. I would think it might be faulty RAM, except I haven't had an issue with Logic. I may well test it tomorrow.
Did you test your song = template/project with the newest 4.5.2?
 

jbuhler

Senior Member
Did you test your song = template/project with the newest 4.5.2?
Yes. No change in basic behavior.

Besides testing the RAM and stripping out the VST3 instruments I may try removing the scratch pads and opening a new large template and see if I have the same kinds of issues.
 

Minko

New Member
Quick two cents: VST3 is most stable in S1 for me. My instruments are in VePro. My sessions are pretty small. I found the updates from this year more stable en enjoy working in S1. If you keep having problems, then switch.