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Spitfire Studio Brass

sostenuto

Big NKS Fan !
Was headed for SStOrch, but waters are surely muddied at this point. Even muddier given talents of most posters vs personal limitations.
Gonna back off to the fun stuff …… OACE, WW EVO, maybe LCO Textures.
Appreciate these candid conversations and clarifications affecting notable dinero.
 

Paul Cardon

Ninja Otter Music
Well, then Will should do a good deal more off-loading, cause The Studio Series aren’t exactly evidence of there having been much focus on dev and recording at all.

And we can't be harsh and damning enough, as far as I'm concerned. I don’t care who does what at Spitfire these days. The fact that is that Paul and Christian gave these libraries the thumbs up for release. It's none of my business, I know (except that it affects my business), but I would humbly, politely and respectfully suggest that they both take a moment, well, more than a moment, to review the seriousness of the situation and spend some quality time with their former selves, because those former selves would never ever ever have released anything anywhere near as bad as the libraries under discussion here. Never.

_
Oh sure, I don't think patting anyone on the back and saying "good job mates, you tried your best" when you're disappointed with a product is the only option. But there's definitely a weird fire in this thread that's pointed to take aim at the souls of other people. It's incredibly disheartening to see these threads continually turn into these big damning personal dissections of character and intent. So many devs rightfully scared away from this place.
 

Paul Cardon

Ninja Otter Music
I think you are reading into my words a little bit, and I think calling them harsh is a bit much. I have a professional relationship with Will as well as a few other employees at Spitfire. I know a bit about their process, especially the development side of things. Paul and Christian play a vital role as co-founders, I'm not diminishing that at all. They oversee the direction the company goes as far as products but the overall business side of how those products are marketed, shipped, managed, produced, etc, is run by Will and a few others (obviously), such as their product manager, Stanley Gabriel. Stanley isn't mentioned or talked about much in the public eye of Spitfire. But, he's a composer, producer, etc who has worked with Paul and Christian for a very long time. It's people like Stanley who help inform someone like Will.

Paul and Christian have taken a step back from that role to simply enjoy life a lot more. Both of them write music more because of it and Paul, well, he's building his own studio at his place and has been creating videos of his own now for a few months. They are a for profit endeavor so to think that their mindset hasn't changed from the days of old would be fairly ignorant, not that I'm implying that about you. We're clearly seeing a trend with the level of quality of Spitfire's products diminishing with each new release. I've followed their company very closely for a number of years now as I used to run my own reviewing series on sample libraries. I use their libraries a lot in my work and I've come to find that their newer products are quite inferior to their older ones and their older libraries aren't without issues as well. Those issues are just worse in their newer products.

I'm not wearing a tin foil hat over here. I'm simply stating observable issues and problems that have developed out of Spitfire in the last few years. Ever since the rebranding of the BML series into SSO, we've seen a steady dip in quality by Spitfire. It sucks. I like their style and concepts they approach but I would really like those concepts to be executed with better precision. They have a lot of employees now, there is no reason why they can't have a higher caliber of output from here on out, especially when these issues are being brought up by all users. Especially Spitfire fans.
I reckon you're right. I think the comments just hit me off-kilter, and that's my fault.
 

Parsifal666

I don't even own a DAW, I'm just a troll.
I honestly don't mean any offense whatsoever to anyone. However, does it seem as if some folks have a bigger problem with SA than just the recent libraries? I keep reading all this invective and yet still am not hearing anything woefully wrong with the grand majority of this series. I could be wrong but this kind of conscientiously bilious denunciation seems largely unnecessary and to a good extent erroneous. I've liked what I've heard from these libraries again and again and I'm glad the final decision is down to me. I think young people are getting unnecessarily confused...again, no offense but it sounds more as if SA somehow pissed in a couple of individuals' corn flakes in the past months, and seemingly for reasons having only a modicum to do with what seem to me fine and desirable libraries. I could be completely wrong, forgive me if so. Looking forward to hearing more of use about the libraries...re-peat I do respect you but to be honest your audio was the ultimate reason I bought SStWW. For that I'm grateful. Really.
 
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Denkii

Active Member
For what it's worth: I got SStWW, which got a lot of flack, during the sale that's going on right now and for the price tag it is absolutely phenomenal.
I repeat it is phenomenal for the pricetag.
It is a statement where the causal determination needs to be taken into account which I feel often gets lost within these posts.
Granted, when we listen to people with a lot of experience in here, it probably also means we are listening to people who have heard a lot of libraries, who know how well individual instruments and patches CAN sound thus raising their own standard when they look at a new library.
But for the price tag it is absolutely lovely.
It offers a lot of content, a lot of flexibility and yes - it needs work to make it sound good and sit well in a mix. It is not an Afflatus Woodwinds. But it certainly is a good entry point.
 

The Darris

Senior Member
Oh sure, I don't think patting anyone on the back and saying "good job mates, you tried your best" when you're disappointed with a product is the only option. But there's definitely a weird fire in this thread that's pointed to take aim at the souls of other people. It's incredibly disheartening to see these threads continually turn into these big damning personal dissections of character and intent. So many devs rightfully scared away from this place.
Well, my counter argument to your assessment as well as @Parsifal666 is there is nothing wrong to criticize the issues we discover and find, in these cases, very bad. @re-peat has been a very long time customer of Spitfire's before they were a commercial entity. I started buying their products when all they had was the Joby Burgess Percussion and Albion 1 Legacy. We've both grown to know Spitfire's sound and style and have watched it developed for years, the good and the bad. We are both recognizing a trend in their new products that concerns us. @re-peat has demonstrated those concerns that aren't limited to just one library but the entire series in question. I can no-longer demonstrate similar issues because I'd prefer not having a 200+ gb library that is full of major issues sitting unused on a perfectly good hard drive that helps drive my main template.

I am not bashing or attacking any individual's soul who likes what they purchased but simply defending my position that the noticeably bad issues with these latest libraries aren't a minor blip on Spitfire's buggy radar. These are issues that have continued to snowball for the last few years. One can speculate as to why, which is what I've been doing. Based on the limited information I have, it simply lies within their QA department. The people in charge of making sure these things get ironed out before release either don't think these are problems or they are n't adept to working in those positions. That's the simplest answer to the pressing question but, despite the odds, it could just simply be an accident that managed to slip through the cracks. Oh well, like I said, one can only speculate.

-C
 

Paul Cardon

Ninja Otter Music
Well, my counter argument to your assessment as well as @Parsifal666 is there is nothing wrong to criticize the issues we discover and find, in these cases, very bad. @re-peat has been a very long time customer of Spitfire's before they were a commercial entity. I started buying their products when all they had was the Joby Burgess Percussion and Albion 1 Legacy. We've both grown to know Spitfire's sound and style and have watched it developed for years, the good and the bad. We are both recognizing a trend in their new products that concerns us. @re-peat has demonstrated those concerns that aren't limited to just one library but the entire series in question. I can no-longer demonstrate similar issues because I'd prefer not having a 200+ gb library that is full of major issues sitting unused on a perfectly good hard drive that helps drive my main template.

I am not bashing or attacking any individual's soul who likes what they purchased but simply defending my position that the noticeably bad issues with these latest libraries aren't a minor blip on Spitfire's buggy radar. These are issues that have continued to snowball for the last few years. One can speculate as to why, which is what I've been doing. Based on the limited information I have, it simply lies within their QA department. The people in charge of making sure these things get ironed out before release either don't think these are problems or they are n't adept to working in those positions. That's the simplest answer to the pressing question but, despite the odds, it could just simply be an accident that managed to slip through the cracks. Oh well, like I said, one can only speculate.

-C
Oh yeah, I can respect that entirely! (not like you need my permission haha)

There's just a weird vitriol that keeps spreading in these divisive threads rather than a truthful pursuit for honest help and exploration and critique. I know I'm not the only one that's been feeling it.
 

dzilizzi

I know nothing
I actually didn't see Re-peat say anything bad about the library until someone asked him his honest opinion. Then he got attacked for it, which wasn't really fair.

I find every library out there has flaws. And a lot of times it is personal opinion and personal music style that makes the difference as to whether or not something is an actual problem. I think the biggest issue is that there is no demo for a lot of these orchestral samples. So you have to buy it to find out whether it works for you. Then you are stuck with it. And if this is how you make a living, or you are on a limited income, it can be a problem. I have a whole bunch of libraries I've bought that I'm not sure I will ever use. But I don't say anything because I think it may be my inexperience and not the libraries.

But from a business perspective, there are too many sample companies out there now and they are all rushing to make more product to sell because there is a limited audience for the product. I think the time of being able to take longer and make it perfect is pretty much gone. You have the people and space for a short time and if you can't get a good take from your oboe player, you don't have time to get another one in to redo it. I don't know what the answer is because having a single oboe player come in won't necessarily work because the space sound will be different. Plus the customers want Power Legato when you can't even get a good regular legato from your tuba player.

I don't know what the answer is other than letting others have their opinion and not getting personal about it.
 

James H

01001000 01101001
To be fair, having read the comments I don't feel anything bad was said. Honest and blunt, yes.
But I have learnt so much from both sides. And as pointed out, unless someone takes the negative stance (always the unpopular one on forums) nothing will ever get sorted from the devs.

There's certainly an air of "wow, all these goodies are so cheap (I'll forgive basic QA) and I'm grabbing them all!" in the threads. I personally don't want to spend good money and have to use workarounds and avoid certain or even whole sections! So I welcome these comments/examples, otherwise these same users are failing fellow peers by NOT saying something.
 

Alex Fraser

Senior Member
Actually, I find the negativity quite wearing. It follows and appears in every thread about the Studio Series. I'm all for discussing the pros and cons of any given library, but there's a line where a constructive conversation crosses into tedious axe grinding and insults. And that line has been crossed a lot. For 18 pages. Front and back.
 

re-peat

Senior Member
Nobody finds it more wearing than I do, Alex. Do you seriously think I enjoy spending — or rather wasting — several hours a day on problems such as these?
If only developers would do their job better and have some more respect for their customers, none of these 18 pages would have been written. But as it is, I'm of the strongest opinion that there's great necessity that they *are* written.

_
 

Alex Fraser

Senior Member
Nobody finds it more wearing than I do, Alex. Do you seriously think I enjoy spending — or rather wasting — several hours a day on problems such as these?
If only developers would do their job better and have some more respect for their customers, none of these 18 pages would have been written. But as it is, I'm of the strongest opinion that there's great necessity that they *are* written.

_
Have you aired your concerns to Spitfire directly? And if so, did you receive a reply? Genuine question.
 

AllanH

Senior Member
I much appreciate @re-peat and @The Darris taking the time to write out their experiences, whether negative or positive. I find it very helpful reading informed opinions especially when they are well-argued.
 

handz

Senior Member
Hi,
Herewith a few examples I made with different brass products, based on the Airport theme from Herrmann's North by Northwest. Made with 8DIO Century Brass (x4) - Orchestral Tools Brass - Spitfire Symphonic Brass (x4) - VSL Triple horn (x4) and VSL Dimension Brass Synchronized.

I also added a version from the movie: Streets with the same notes , but this time very fast and very soft (pp indicated).

And sorry.....I don't have SSB on my HD yet, so no example of this library.
PM me for a midi-file if you want!

I hope you'll enjoy the offered overview

8DIO
[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/herrmannnbnw8dio-mp3.17430/][/AUDIOPLUS]

Orchestral Tools Brass
[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/herrmannnbnw_ot-mp3.17431/][/AUDIOPLUS]

Spitfire Symphonic Brass
[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/herrmannnbnw_ssb-mp3.17432/][/AUDIOPLUS]

VSL Triple horn (x4)
[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/herrmannnbnwvsl_triplehorn-mp3.17433/][/AUDIOPLUS]

VSL Dimension Brass Synchronized
[AUDIOPLUS=https://vi-control.net/community/attachments/herrmannnbnwvsldb_synchr-mp3.17435/][/AUDIOPLUS]

So after all these years, hate to say, I am still Spitfire hater it seems, their brass sounds absolutely worst from all the examples.
 
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