Soundpaint

Stringtree

Senior Member
The tingling around my temples, then spreading to my arms and then the back of the neck. This feeling is never wrong. It means something is happening that is special.

I think I get the idea. It seems to be transformative, but also perceptive. It sure looks fun to play.

It reminded me of Gavin Bryars' Sinking of the Titanic, a miasma of dreamlike fragments evolving.

Unexpected. What an interesting choice of seed material. And interesting results.
 

colony nofi

Senior Member
This is a really interesting idea. You've piqued my interest for sure. It for sure reminds me of some experimentations and performances I've done with live strings here in Australia - where I augment them through re-sampling in realtime - with VERY similar results.

Now to have this all in one place... can it take real-time input I wonder? :)
 

unclecheeks

Active Member
Will SoundPaint also become your own 8dio player @Troels Folmann ? I very much hope so! The 8dio quality level of beautiful samples deserve their own environment / platform.
All the different bespoke library players remind me of the segmentation that's happening with Amazon/Netflix/Hulu/etc/etc... spend 30 mins trying to find a show, and then give up. Part of the reason why I'm no longer interested in anything in the new Spitfire or OT players, even though there are some great products. So my vote is stick to Kontakt!
 

doctoremmet

Senior Member
All the different bespoke library players remind me of the segmentation that's happening with Amazon/Netflix/Hulu/etc/etc... spend 30 mins trying to find a show, and then give up. Part of the reason why I'm no longer interested in anything in the new Spitfire or OT players, even though there are some great products. So my vote is stick to Kontakt!
It’s like having a Jupiter 8, a DX7 and a Korg DW8000 on top of a Yamaha CP70M piano in the early eighties. Annoyingly, all instruments came with their own interfaces, knobs- and fader layouts (or tiny LCDs and value sliders) and each one had its own keybed! So I guess I may have a slightly higher tolerance level hahaha ;)
 
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unclecheeks

Active Member
It’s like having a Jupiter 8, a DX7 and a Korg DW8000 on top of a Yamaha CP70M piano in the early eighties. Annoyingly enough all instruments came with their own interfaces, knobs- and fader layouts (or tiny LCDs and value sliders) and each one had its own keybed! So I guess I may have a slightly higher tolerance level hahaha ;)
Sure, but you're talking hardware, which imo is quite different. What software a library runs in is sort of irrelevant imo, since there are no physical controls (or actual electronics). If anything, there are more things that could break with people "going their own way". And it's not like Kontakt was limited in some tech way that hamstrings developers... so it's just about profit, not end-user experience. Speaking of which, I question whether the savings from not giving NI a cut of their profits is worth the engineering costs of developing/supporting the OT and SF players. And there are some creatures of habit, like myself, who'll be left out so I'm not even sure it makes sense from a marketing/sales perspective.
 

doctoremmet

Senior Member
And it's not like Kontakt was limited in some tech way that hamstrings developers... so it's just about profit, not end-user experience.
I can relate to your sentiments somewhat, but I do not agree “it’s all about profit”.

First of all, there‘s obviously a strategic objective for developers to make a profit. Nothing wrong with that and also the sole reason we get new instruments all the time.

Secondly, I seriously doubt it’s ALL about profit. Watching a man like Troels demonstrating his libraries comes across as him doing all of this first and foremost as a totally passion-driven endeavour.

Kontakt is a platform that has both advantages and disadvantages. For instance, I personally like Falcon 2 WAY better. However I can see that building a VI on one’s own software platform and having total control over functions and UI/UX is a major CREATIVE factor that is probably the driving force behind all of this. I doubt this new 8dio tool could have been built “on” or “in” Kontakt?

So -to me at least- in a sense it is a lot like the old hardware days. Which does imply drawbacks as well, because one has to “learn and adapt” to more than just one familiar interface. Definitely a drawback. On the plus side, and again I stress: this may be just me, it also implies that every vendor can truly bring their own “flavour” to the instruments in ways that are new and exciting, creating a more diverse market place.

Then of course, all of this comes with growing pains, early adopters feeling like they’re beta testers and all of that painful stuff. Looking at you SINE! ;)
 

doctoremmet

Senior Member
I hope you are kidding - who in the world would think all this proprietary chaos (more incompatibilities, instabilities and workflow headaches) is doing us composers any good!
Well, who? At least me. But why care what my preferences are... it’s not like I have ANY influence in this domain hahaha
 

doctoremmet

Senior Member
Speaking of which, I question whether the savings from not giving NI a cut of their profits is worth the engineering costs of developing/supporting the OT and SF players.
My sentiments exactly. I think it is actually WAY more expensive -at least initially- to be developing and maintaining one’s own platform. So it may actually cut into the profitability, at least for a couple of years.

But really, noone should be bothered about this, because it was a sincere question that popped up in my mind. It’s not like 8dio has confirmed my highly speculative suggestion or anything. So, sorry for my derailing this thread. Let’s discuss SoundPaint!
 

doctoremmet

Senior Member
Haha is this really love for Kontakt? Or just fear of change. Because what makes Kontakt this good? It makes me browse my libraries in a tiny “quick load” window while about 25% of its screen real estate displays NI stuff I actually never use. But ever since 6.0 I can’t add libraries. Very cool software indeed hahaha. But before I inadvertently start a sample player war, I’ll let myself out.

Again, sorry to have unwillingly started this. It was mere enthusiasm for the cool stuff that SoundPaint looks capable of... Proceed! ;)
 

doctoremmet

Senior Member
I also really really hope 8dio stays Kontakt.
No new player please......Kontakt is 6.3 now...and very very good....
Loving 8dio products.
Loving their polyphonic legato. Awesome.
The legato is indeed awesome, isn’t it! I am also very fond of them recording arcs. They just sound gorgeous to me.
 

Wunderhorn

Senior Member
Haha is this really love for Kontakt? Or just fear of change.
Nobody said it has to be Kontakt though at the moment this is what works well. Change is great as soon as there is reason for it.
If someone comes up with a new open platform that is super stable and easy to use (and observing privacy!), that change becomes and upgrade. Perhaps if Apple were to release the Logic Sampler in an open plugin format it could be interesting. But we are not there.
None of the proprietary players that I have come in contact with have offered any significant improvements that would - at this time - make me want to embrace them. Not one of them. PLAY, Engine, SINE, Spitfire Player... nuisance! Most of them were designed to give the developer more control over their libraries as well as over their customers, not to provide a better software experience. You want change that makes sense? Then you need to make them better than what we have as a standard right now. And especially open them up for other developers so a new - upgraded and better - standard can emerge.
 

doctoremmet

Senior Member
We’ll see. Platforms come and go. And with that ebb and flood motion new innovative stuff typically emerges. I for one am excited by SoundPaint and whatever it may entail or bring to the table! Let’s bring it on!
 

unclecheeks

Active Member
However I can see that building a VI on one’s own software platform and having total control over functions and UI/UX is a major CREATIVE factor that is probably the driving force behind all of this.
If developers did something to IMPROVE the UI/UX, then sure, I might be more inclined to jump... But look at the UI/UX design of the Spitfire player. It's just bad imo. Not only from a visual perspective, with those weird distracting backgrounds, but even functionally the designers made poor use of real estate.

We’ll see. Platforms come and go. And with that ebb and flood motion new innovative stuff typically emerges. I for one am excited by SoundPaint and whatever it may entail or bring to the table! Let’s bring it on!
You hit the problem on the head, indeed! A proprietary player is much more likely to become defunct in the future, than one that's used by 95% (99?) of developers. And what happens to these expensive libraries then?... NI takes a cut of all Player-compatible libraries, IN ADDITION to developing and selling their own; much less likely that in a few years time they decide to close up Kontakt shop.
 

unclecheeks

Active Member
We’ll see. Platforms come and go. And with that ebb and flood motion new innovative stuff typically emerges. I for one am excited by SoundPaint and whatever it may entail or bring to the table! Let’s bring it on!
And this also a major difference from your hardware analogy. If you still have those synths, i bet you can still turn them on and make some noise. Developer decides that it's not in their interest to support a product anymore?... next OS update rolls around and you're hosed.