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Solo woodwinds for orchestral music?

This is just a side thought, because I'm not even at the stage where I could play a convincing WW line, still studying string articulations. I have a course by Groove3.com called Orchestral Library Toolbox which is two German guys (w/voiceover translator) doing an 11-hour course on orchestration with Cubase. It's insanely good for new guys like me. At one point they play in some WW lines using I think VSL and/or Cinesamples woodwinds, can't remember. The WW lines were first played on a keyboard (on purpose) and they sounded good but you were still convincing yourself it was real. Then they showed what it sounds like with a breath controller where you blow in but still choose the notes on the keyboard, and THAT sounded much more realistic, using the same library. Then they pulled out the Akai EWI and handed it to someone who can play a woodwind and it was like a real instrument, off the chart. No change in library. if anything, once I get to woodwinds in my late-night study which is moving at glacier speed, I'm going to at least consider the breath controller, even THAT seems to make a huge difference over keys. Having said that I'm quite sure there are seasoned composers who have the feel of the expression slider down so well that a breath controller isn't necessary. I was just amazed what a difference it seemed to make and might be something to consider if you're in Freshman year like me.
 
Wolfie2112 said:
I also recommend the Fluffy Audio WW. I also love Spitfire Studio Woodwinds, I find them very expressive.
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Could you point me to any examples of the Studio woodwinds going into lyrical territory?

My sense so far has been that SSW is better at lyrical lines that SStW.
 
Wolfie2112 said:
I also recommend the Fluffy Audio WW. I also love Spitfire Studio Woodwinds, I find them very expressive.
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I actually have Spitfire Studio woodwinds, I forgot to mention it because while it's decent for shorts and effects, I personally don't think it's very useable for lead lines. But I will definitely look into Fluffy Audio Woodwinds!
 
Unless you're really hurrying, I'd just wait for CSW. They're hoping for a late 2019 release, so around the same time as CSB last year. As a bassoonist and saxophonist myself, I can't say that any of the woodwind libraries stand out to me as being "the one to go for" for any specific aspects. If I had the money I'd invest in the berlin series woodwinds and/or expansions, but for now I'd rather wait and see what we get from CS.
 
purple said:
but for now I'd rather wait and see what we get from CS.
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So much pressure for Alex, so many people with high expectations (not excluding myself :D )

I'm currently using the NI Symphony Series Solo Woodwinds. Can I recommend them? Hm, not really when you don't own Komplete Ultimate. Full Price is too expensive imo. But you gotta work with what you own.
Also I'm missing a piccolo. Makes me sad.
 
Wolfie2112 said:
I also love Spitfire Studio Woodwinds, I find them very expressive.
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I've also gotten some nice use from the Pro version of that library, including some great lead lines (I'm not entirely wild about the shorts but I've found uses for them already in four different compositions since buying the library so that says something).

It's interesting though, when I went back and edited some of my old projects the Hein sounded and behaved quite well (so well that I really didn't have to replace them with the SStWW).

I have noticed also that SStWW Pro are significantly easier to mix than the Hein...in fact, I've noticed more than a few members here selling their Hein woodwinds bizarrely fast, and now I understand why. The Hein wws are a library that gives what you put into it, and you have to put the time and focus into those instruments, otherwise you're going to have a way-too-up-front-and-flat sound.

So, at this point I can no longer rec the Hein for people basically starting out. They're an excellent library I've gotten a LOT of use out of, however they're concurrently more for those whom already have good engineering chops (even moreso than the EWH series). You have to put in the work and patience to get an outstanding sound...but you'll be happy once you get there.

So, I recommend noobs (with extra bucks laying around) to pick up the Berlin woodwinds first, as they're easiest to deal with out of the box. Libs like SStWWs would be a great choice, too (any discomfort with those dry samples can be greatly eased by getting nice and acquainted with the mics). But forget going with the cheaper, Core version of the Spitfire, as that can be aggravatingly limiting and...well, just don't sound as good imo.
 
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purple said:
As a bassoonist and saxophonist myself, I can't say that any of the woodwind libraries stand out to me as being "the one to go for" for any specific aspects.
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have you checked out 8Dio's Claire woodwinds? When I compare the sound of them to the Orchestral Tools series by David Newman, the tone is quite similar.
 
jaketanner said:
have you checked out 8Dio's Claire woodwinds? When I compare the sound of them to the Orchestral Tools series by David Newman, the tone is quite similar.
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Yeah I think the tone of the instruments from 8dio is similar but to me it just doesn't seem to be as consistent or smooth. It's a bit disjointed mostly, and although I actually quite like their tone I don't think it can be quite as convincing. To each their own, especially with solo woodwind libraries, but that's my two cents. I don't have the 8dio libraries so I can't speak fully on them but I do remember the trailers and demos leaving a fairly positive impression on me.
 
purple said:
Yeah I think the tone of the instruments from 8dio is similar but to me it just doesn't seem to be as consistent or smooth. It's a bit disjointed mostly, and although I actually quite like their tone I don't think it can be quite as convincing. To each their own, especially with solo woodwind libraries, but that's my two cents. I don't have the 8dio libraries so I can't speak fully on them but I do remember the trailers and demos leaving a fairly positive impression on me.
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I haven’t used them much yet, but things like this is subjective. Compared to the tone of SStW it’s a step above. I have both. What I actually like better on the Claire, is their second tone. So they have a main, then a different tone switchable by a button. What I’m really waiting for is their Century winds. Should be pretty awesome once they’re released.
 
purple said:
Unless you're really hurrying, I'd just wait for CSW. They're hoping for a late 2019 release, so around the same time as CSB last year. As a bassoonist and saxophonist myself, I can't say that any of the woodwind libraries stand out to me as being "the one to go for" for any specific aspects. If I had the money I'd invest in the berlin series woodwinds and/or expansions, but for now I'd rather wait and see what we get from CS.
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Either way, I'll likely get CSW when it comes out. In the mean time, there is music to be made, and I'm not sure I can hold out for the end of the year at the earliest. I'm submitting a project this Saturday and am expecting a significant amount of cash from it, and I always like to invest some of it back into gear or libraries which is why I'm looking now. But yeah, I feel like I'm in woodwind limbo waiting for CSW. :)
 
PaulieDC said:
This is just a side thought, because I'm not even at the stage where I could play a convincing WW line, still studying string articulations. I have a course by Groove3.com called Orchestral Library Toolbox which is two German guys (w/voiceover translator) doing an 11-hour course on orchestration with Cubase. It's insanely good for new guys like me. At one point they play in some WW lines using I think VSL and/or Cinesamples woodwinds, can't remember. The WW lines were first played on a keyboard (on purpose) and they sounded good but you were still convincing yourself it was real. Then they showed what it sounds like with a breath controller where you blow in but still choose the notes on the keyboard, and THAT sounded much more realistic, using the same library. Then they pulled out the Akai EWI and handed it to someone who can play a woodwind and it was like a real instrument, off the chart. No change in library. if anything, once I get to woodwinds in my late-night study which is moving at glacier speed, I'm going to at least consider the breath controller, even THAT seems to make a huge difference over keys. Having said that I'm quite sure there are seasoned composers who have the feel of the expression slider down so well that a breath controller isn't necessary. I was just amazed what a difference it seemed to make and might be something to consider if you're in Freshman year like me.
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This is very interesting. So basically, the libraries are good already, it's all about our skills to create believable lines.
 
PaulieDC said:
This is just a side thought, because I'm not even at the stage where I could play a convincing WW line, still studying string articulations. I have a course by Groove3.com called Orchestral Library Toolbox which is two German guys (w/voiceover translator) doing an 11-hour course on orchestration with Cubase. It's insanely good for new guys like me. At one point they play in some WW lines using I think VSL and/or Cinesamples woodwinds, can't remember. The WW lines were first played on a keyboard (on purpose) and they sounded good but you were still convincing yourself it was real. Then they showed what it sounds like with a breath controller where you blow in but still choose the notes on the keyboard, and THAT sounded much more realistic, using the same library. Then they pulled out the Akai EWI and handed it to someone who can play a woodwind and it was like a real instrument, off the chart. No change in library. if anything, once I get to woodwinds in my late-night study which is moving at glacier speed, I'm going to at least consider the breath controller, even THAT seems to make a huge difference over keys. Having said that I'm quite sure there are seasoned composers who have the feel of the expression slider down so well that a breath controller isn't necessary. I was just amazed what a difference it seemed to make and might be something to consider if you're in Freshman year like me.
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Yes breath controllers make the process a lot faster, but no library is anywhere close to the real thing, at least not yet i guess.
 
I'm gonna second the claire series by 8dio with a caveat:

These are great soloists, but blending into something and not sounding like a featured instrument is asking them to perform in their weakest capacity.

Also, you kind of have to let them guide you a bit as there are little quirks that you have to roll with if you want to get the most out of them.

If you are the type of person that could give someone some music and be excited when they add their personality to it then you'll love this collection. If the slightest inflection outside of what you envisioned bothers you then you should avoid this library, there are lots of little inflections and slides into notes that if you role with give a great performance, but if you can't go with the flow you'll find nothing but frustration.
 
Meetyhtan said:
So much pressure for Alex, so many people with high expectations (not excluding myself :D )

I'm currently using the NI Symphony Series Solo Woodwinds. Can I recommend them? Hm, not really when you don't own Komplete Ultimate. Full Price is too expensive imo. But you gotta work with what you own.
Also I'm missing a piccolo. Makes me sad.
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pressure is good.....so that it'll be a polished product. =)
 
by the way, sorry about this but i'll like to ask about BWW. How many of you actually load up the individual woodwinds to create woodwinds ensemble? for example, load up flute 1, flute 2 and flute 3 to create flute ensemble a3? Do you find the sound muffled?
 
constaneum said:
I'll like to recommend Auddict solo Woodwinds....I particularly like the flute a lot. very beautifully sampled.
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Do you still use your Berlin Expansion B for solos, or are you now using Auddict?

mikefrommontreal said:
Either way, I'll likely get CSW when it comes out. In the mean time, there is music to be made, and I'm not sure I can hold out for the end of the year at the earliest. I'm submitting a project this Saturday and am expecting a significant amount of cash from it, and I always like to invest some of it back into gear or libraries which is why I'm looking now. But yeah, I feel like I'm in woodwind limbo waiting for CSW. :)
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Also, I just want to male sure the OP knows Berlin Woodwinds Expansions are almost certainly going on sale this month as part of the Completion Days Sale. Hope you didn't buy it days before it went on discount!
 
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