Smart Controls in Logic (and Berlin Strings)

[Vik]

I generally have lots if problems with Logic's Smart Controls workflow.
And with Berlin Strings, it seems more complicated than with other libs. When looking at this list (in Kontakt) when using BS, it is totally empty:


As you can see in the Kontakt window, BS comes with CC3 assigned to vibrato. But CC3 doesn't look assigned to anything in the list to the left. And AFAIK, one needs to have something in that list in order to make Smart Controls work. The usual suggestion is to drag the word "not assigned" onto the parameter you want, but that doesn't do something in Berlin Strings.

So - how do you guys set this up with Berlin Strings or other libraries where the drag-and-drop thing is non-functioning?

Click to read more...

 

[OT_Tobias]

Hi Vik,

it should work the same way as with other instruments; the only difference is that you don't assign a CC by right clicking on the option to automate, but Alt-click. That will take you to that function's entry in the Controller Table where you can assign the CC. From then on all you need to do is assign the Quick Control in Logic to the correct CC.

best

Tobias

 

[Vik]

Thanks for your reply! I actually know how to assign them internally in Kontakt, but the difference between Berlin strings and the other libraries I use is that the list you see in the left part of the image above isn't populated with info about which CCs that control what parameters.
That creates a problem when using Smart Controls in Logic.
And I don't really like how Smart Controls are implemented - so if there's a better way to deal with this, I'd be really happy.

Just to use another product as an example: It also comes with a number of 'pre-assignments' - but unlike Berlin Strings, the values show up in this Kontakt list:



This means that the first 8 parameters on that list also automatically shows up in Smart Controls - with obscure names, but nevertheless:


And talking about obscure solutions, the names also show up in this list, you just need to scroll some seconds to find them:


That was the other product - with Berlin Strings, none of this happens.

And due to how BS/Capsule is programmed, I can't use the built in function in Kontakt which allows us to grab an empty 'item' on that list in order to assign that value to a parameter in Berlin Strings.

Maybe there are workarounds for this or better methods than I'm aware of?

 

[mc_deli]

...I came here today to ask a question about this... I only just noticed that some of my libs show the CC names in the CC editor window - but some don't - and I have never noticed it before - has something changed in Logic or do devs need to do something in Kontakt - how does this work?

(All I know is that with SCS it shows the CC names, just like this example of CSS, and that makes working in the piano roll/CC editor so much easier! All libs should do this please!)

 

[Vik]

I'm pretty sure that either the developers or the users have to create that list (and wish I knew how to do it with Berlin Strings).

 

[mac]

I think it's something to do with the way they've coded the capsule engine. It's also the reason OT libraries will likely never be NKS compatible.

 

[OT_Tobias]

Hi Vik,

aah, your first screenshot from BST shows MIDI Automation, which works as usual.
Your second implies that Host Automation is needed. That does indeed not work, to my knowledge.
Possibly dumb question: Why don't you use MIDI CCs instead of Host automation? If I recall Logic correctly, it can automate MIDI CCs in its automation lanes.

 

[Vik]

Hi Tobias,


First, a disclaimer: I may be wrong about all this. My brain isn't really compatible with how deling with CCs and automations is done in Logic, and I certainly hope that I'm wrong in some of my statements. So the following is about how I assume things work.

"aah, your first screenshot from BST shows MIDI Automation, which works as usual."

Well, in neither cases things work the same way with Berlin Strings as it does with other libraries: there's no list of assigned parameters in either of the two Kontakt columns (Host Automation and MIDI automation), which again means that working with automaton will be a different process than we have with other libraries. Smart Controls or using the 512 item long list may be possible (it seems). We can't drag "not assigned" onto a parameter in the Capsule UI. And when I automate eg Vibrato, it only says "Ctrl 3" with Berling Strings, not vibrato.


In Mural the relevant parameter names pop up automatically both when using Host and MIDI automation (but we have do to do drag-and-drop-ing to assign the Host automation stuff).

CSS come with host automation parameters preassigned.

Berlin with neither.

One reason to use Smart Controls is that some libraries come with Host automation parameters preassigned, while none of the MIDI automation parameters are preassigned. So we need to assign them manually, for the lists in Logic to understand which parameters we are working on.


Another reason for using track automation instead of region automation in Logic is that if you have entered and worked out automation for a section, you can in a simple way delete the actual region and rerecord the MIDI notes, because the automation for the various parameters are still intact; they reside in the track and not in the region.

The one with getting access to the various automation modes (Touch etc) maybe the most obvious of these.

"Your second implies that Host Automation is needed. That does indeed not work, to my knowledge."
That's why I hope you guys can improve this, or let me know about another equally good method.

"Possibly dumb question: Why don't you use MIDI CCs instead of Host automation?"
See above!

Edit: here's a few quick dummy tracks showing how things look with these three libraries. And again: I hope there's already a way to get that functionality with Berlin Strings as well - I'm just not aware of it.

 

[jtromburg]

I found a way to assign a custom CC Midi event to a Host Automation event (and even name them whatever you want). This lets you use them for Smart Controls in Logic or as Komplete Kontrol parameter.

It requires loading one of the preset Kontakt Scripts called "6 Midi Controllers". This script gives you 6 customizable Midi CC knobs where you can drag/drop the Host Automation name. Naming them requires editing the script (its really straight forward), but is not required to get it working.

One caveat is that the "6 midi Controllers" script must be ordered to the left (before) the C.A.P.S.U.L.E. script, and you need to save the instrument to keep the revised scripts. but once set up it works pretty well.

I have some step by step instructions below:

(1) Save the C.A.P.S.U.L.E. Script as a preset as you may need to reload it to an empty script to the right of the midi cc script. There are also sometimes empty C.A.P.S.U.L.E. scripts. I'm not sure what they are for, but saving over them doesn't affect the instrument.

(2) Load the "6 Midi Controllers" script. Assign your midi CC (you can name them in the script so they show up on the Smart Controls named).

(3) Load the C.A.P.S.U.L.E. script to the right of the Midi CC script.
(4) Drag/Drop host Automation to that midi CC
(5) Save the instrument

This now shows up on the Smart Control, with your CC Midi assigned:

 

[Gingerbread]

I found a way to assign a custom CC Midi event to a Host Automation event (and even name them whatever you want). This lets you use them for Smart Controls in Logic or as Komplete Kontrol parameter.

It requires loading one of the preset Kontakt Scripts called "6 Midi Controllers". This script gives you 6 customizable Midi CC knobs where you can drag/drop the Host Automation name. Naming them requires editing the script (its really straight forward), but is not required to get it working.

One caveat is that the "6 midi Controllers" script must be ordered to the left (before) the C.A.P.S.U.L.E. script, and you need to save the instrument to keep the revised scripts. but once set up it works pretty well.

I have some step by step instructions below:

(1) Save the C.A.P.S.U.L.E. Script as a preset as you may need to reload it to an empty script to the right of the midi cc script. There are also sometimes empty C.A.P.S.U.L.E. scripts. I'm not sure what they are for, but saving over them doesn't affect the instrument.

(2) Load the "6 Midi Controllers" script. Assign your midi CC (you can name them in the script so they show up on the Smart Controls named).

(3) Load the C.A.P.S.U.L.E. script to the right of the Midi CC script.
(4) Drag/Drop host Automation to that midi CC
(5) Save the instrument

This now shows up on the Smart Control, with your CC Midi assigned:

Thank you so much for posting this, I've been going crazy trying to figure out how to assign smart controls to OT instruments, so this is very appreciated!

I am confused about step 3; what do you mean by loading the C.A.P.S.U.L.E. script "to the right of the Midi CC script"? Admittedly, I know absolutely nothing about scripting, or using the script editor, and am a total, total noob when it comes to that stuff. Could you elaborate that step please?

(First post, by the way. Hi VI Control!)

 

[Gingerbread]

Thank you so much for posting this, I've been going crazy trying to figure out how to assign smart controls to OT instruments, so this is very appreciated!

I am confused about step 3; what do you mean by loading the C.A.P.S.U.L.E. script "to the right of the Midi CC script"? Admittedly, I know absolutely nothing about scripting, or using the script editor, and am a total, total noob when it comes to that stuff. Could you elaborate that step please?

(First post, by the way. Hi VI Control!)

As a follow-up, I now understand what you meant. You were referring to the tabs in the Script Editor, and that the '6 Midi Controller" tab needs to be to the left of the CAPSULE tab. Thanks to your post, I've now gotten it working, and am really thrilled. I'd been dealing with this for the last 2 weeks, and had given up hope of connecting OT instruments to my controller. Thank you!!

 

[jtromburg]

Excellent! I'm glad you figured it out

 

[Vik]

I found a way to assign a custom CC Midi event to a Host Automation event (and even name them whatever you want). This lets you use them for Smart Controls in Logic or as Komplete Kontrol parameter.

It requires loading one of the preset Kontakt Scripts called "6 Midi Controllers". This script gives you 6 customizable Midi CC knobs where you can drag/drop the Host Automation name. Naming them requires editing the script (its really straight forward), but is not required to get it working.

One caveat is that the "6 midi Controllers" script must be ordered to the left (before) the C.A.P.S.U.L.E. script, and you need to save the instrument to keep the revised scripts. but once set up it works pretty well.

I have some step by step instructions below:

(1) Save the C.A.P.S.U.L.E. Script as a preset as you may need to reload it to an empty script to the right of the midi cc script. There are also sometimes empty C.A.P.S.U.L.E. scripts. I'm not sure what they are for, but saving over them doesn't affect the instrument.

(2) Load the "6 Midi Controllers" script. Assign your midi CC (you can name them in the script so they show up on the Smart Controls named).

(3) Load the C.A.P.S.U.L.E. script to the right of the Midi CC script.
(4) Drag/Drop host Automation to that midi CC
(5) Save the instrument

This now shows up on the Smart Control, with your CC Midi assigned:

There has been some improvements in Logic since I started this thread. Is the above workaround still needed? I guess the answer is yes, since it seems to be Berlin Strings which has the main limitation here, and not Logic?

When I try your suggestion here, @jtromburg things look different btw (in this pic I did insert 6 MIDI controllers in the first slot):



I really hope there will be an update to Berlin Strings which means that this lib will behave the same way other libraries do.

 

[Olfirf]

This is actually a big topic for me, too! I want to rework my template in a way that all mic settings are handled by host automation inside VEpro and Orchestral tools seems to be the only major library, where using host automation vs midi CC automation isn't working. Unfortunately, orchestral tools is making up most of my orchestral template. Hmmm ...
@OT_Tobias : haven't I read somewhere that Inspire 2 (which I do not own) is the first library to be Komplet Kontrol compatible? Wouldn't host automation be necessary for it to work with KK? And do we have the chance of getting all other capsule libraries to be updated as well? Maybe even soon?

 

[Olfirf]

There has been some improvements in Logic since I started this thread. Is the above workaround still needed? I guess the answer is yes, since it seems to be Berlin Strings which has the main limitation here, and not Logic?

When I try your suggestion here, @jtromburg things look different btw (in this pic I did insert 6 MIDI controllers in the first slot):



I really hope there will be an update to Berlin Strings which means that this lib will behave the same way other libraries do.

It looks like you have used a multi instrument (shorts), while jtromburg used a single patch. That is why you have more Capsule scripts loaded. However, I don't think this is a good idea: who wants to manually move all of those script pages per patch? In case there is always a free script page left, this should work without problems, but I would not want to rework all those patches manually! As soon as an update arrives, you have to do it again ...

 

[Vik]

I don't think this is a good idea: who wants to manually move all of those script pages per patch? In case there is always a free script page left, this should work without problems, but I would not want to rework all those patches manually! As soon as an update arrives, you have to do it again ...

This is actually a big topic for me, too! I want to rework my template in a way that all mic settings are handled by host automation inside VEpro and Orchestral tools seems to be the only major library, where using host automation vs midi CC automation isn't working. Unfortunately, orchestral tools is making up most of my orchestral template. Hmmm ...
@OT_Tobias : haven't I read somewhere that Inspire 2 (which I do not own) is the first library to be Komplet Kontrol compatible? Wouldn't host automation be necessary for it to work with KK? And do we have the chance of getting all other capsule libraries to be updated as well? Maybe even soon?

Any improvement in this area, anyone? Any improvements in Logic which makes all this easer?