What's new

Pond5 announces PR collection, makes other changes

Sibelius19

Music is just color and rhythm --Debussy
I wonder if Pond5 seriously considered an Exclusive Option for Music Contributors, similar to what they offer to their Video Artists:


There are a number of clients that won't take Non-Exclusive music tracks, no matter how good they are, because of the risks (perceived and actual) involved. That may not be P5's core client base, but it's definitely a segment of the marketplace that could be a significant area of growth for them.

What are your thoughts about P5 offering an Exclusive Option for Music Artists with a 60/40 split (60% to Artists, 40% to P5)? The curation/review process might change to ensure quality content, but that's to be expected. Any other ideas about this?
I have had conversations with Mike Pace in which he mentioned them considering this option. I think his hands are kind of tied. I think it's something he would like to see. I did express with him the desire to have this option in place. But I guess they opted to go in a different direction for now.
I wouldn't rule it out at some point (at least I hope so).
I also think it's really the only way to curb the over-saturation. I actually think that at some point for the health of the industry, libraries need get have a tougher process involved in accepting new artists and get a lot more picky with their track acceptances. The pie slices are getting smaller and smaller for each person.
It sucks for newcomers, but I was a later comer (libraries started some 15-20 years ago?). It's already hard enough now. There are over 1,000,000 music tracks on Pond5. How many I wonder on Audiosparx (a place I won't touch with a 10 foot pole)?
 

Yellow Studio

New Member
I think they at least could have offered an exclusive deal with a 50/50 split. That would have been fine for me.
The old statement don’t put all eggs in the same basket has become true for me, ha ha
I started out on Pond5 2012.
I quit my day job 2017 and made a living from P5 since then. About 80-85% of my income.
And now they want me to spend a year or 2 just to get back to where I am today.
That’s crazy.

When they did the survey I was so sure that they would offer exclusive music on the marketplace. I couldn’t imagine this move.

But it’s not the end of the world.

Time to go exclusive I guess and try new paths where I can make up to those 30% of loss of income instead of writing new music for Pond5.
 

jcrosby

Senior Member
I don't think people should get too upset.

Most contributors are not making a living from Pond 5.

Let these things play out and don't worry.

Besides, Pump Audio/Getty Images did the same thing back in '09.
There's a reason why its called a race to the bottom.

One company undercuts everyone and offers a low percentage artist split.
Competing companies respond by lowering percentages.

After enough of the competition has dropped to a competitive margin, how will the initial undercutting company respond? By either lowering their margin again, possibly dropping their pricing, or perhaps converting to an unlimited use subscription service. Rinse and repeat until we have a 99 cent RF licensing market.

Lets look at a worse scenario: AudioSparx has a perpetuity clause for your catalog. Everything you upload stays with them for life. So what happens if AudioSparx eventually follows suit by lowering your cut to 35%? Or they feel inclined to get more aggressive and bump down to 30%? Maybe they decide to force a price reduction or do unlimited use subscriptions.. What are you going to do about it if you can't remove your music because of that clause in perpetuity?

More importantly what happens if a scenario plays out where and other companies respond the same way; requiring distribution of your music in perpetuity while taking more of your cut, and dropping prices?

If you don't opt out of each before their perpetuity clause goes into effect you may find yourself in 10 years in a market where your music is perpetually being licensed for 99 cents with no way to pull it down...

Hypothetical? Maybe. However many companies that were previously respected have moved to subscription. So AFAIC, although hypothetical, something like this is also likely.

Supporting companies that do this only contributes to the inevitability of some kind of scenario similar in some way to this playing out at some point in the future.
 
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Desire Inspires

To the stars through desire....
There's a reason why its called a race to the bottom.

One company undercuts everyone and offers a low percentage artist split.
Competing companies respond by lowering percentages.

After enough of the competition has dropped to a competitive margin, how will the initial undercutting company respond? By either lowering their margin again, possibly dropping their pricing, or perhaps converting to an unlimited use subscription service. Rinse and repeat until we have a 99 cent RF licensing market.

Lets look at a worse scenario: AudioSparx has a perpetuity clause for your catalog. Everything you upload stays with them for life. So what happens if AudioSparx eventually follows suit by lowering your cut to 35%? Or they feel inclined to get more aggressive and bump down to 30%? Maybe they decide to force a price reduction or do unlimited use subscriptions.. What are you going to do about it if you can't remove your music because of that clause in perpetuity?

More importantly what happens if a scenario plays out where and other companies respond the same way; requiring distribution of your music in perpetuity while taking more of your cut, and dropping prices?

If you don't opt out of each before their perpetuity clause goes into effect you may find yourself in 10 years in a market where your music is perpetually being licensed for 99 cents with no way to pull it down...

Hypothetical? Maybe. However many companies that were previously respected have moved to subscription. So AFAIC, although hypothetical, something like this is also likely.

Supporting companies that do this only contributes to the inevitability of some kind of scenario similar in some way to this playing out at some point in the future.
Scary thoughts.

Thankfully I have another source of income.
 

jcrosby

Senior Member
Scary thoughts.

Thankfully I have another source of income.
Me as well, but scary all the same... The real bummer is Pond5 always did right by me until this, and it was abrupt an shift... Honestly it's kind of a bummer, the only RF/NE library I had any faith left in ... 6-10k extra annual income gone in a snap of the fingers.
 
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MatFluor

Senior Member
Time to create a Union.
In the European sense, not the American sense. As far as I know (and that's not much in that area), the European model is far less "hardcore" than the US model where it seems that the Union are just the opposition to the employers, no matter what.

Well, I would be in - basic contracts, minimum "wage" and whatnot - but my simple guess is that most people are not comfortable discussing what a reasonable rate is (granted, it is hard to define, very hard).

But mainly - screw ripping off us. Rather do a Kevin MacLeod and go full RF than this. I bet other RF sites want to follow suit - or bait the leaving folks with their "better" conditions...
 

Sibelius19

Music is just color and rhythm --Debussy
But mainly - screw ripping off us. Rather do a Kevin MacLeod and go full RF than this. I bet other RF sites want to follow suit - or bait the leaving folks with their "better" conditions...
He basically gives ALL of his music away for free, and I think the only thing he charges is like $50 for a pack of thousands of his tracks. Some of it okay, but most of it fairly generic. But I hear it in youtube videos all over the place. And he's got a relatively big fan base on youtube. I've had some critical comments about some of his music and the wolves descended upon me or they don't get my humor.
 

SBK

Active Member
after this long time I think we all got used to this right? like there is anything to do about it...
 

Sibelius19

Music is just color and rhythm --Debussy
Poor Peleton may need to get some music from Pond5.

Sounds more like they're using music licensing as a scapegoat for their failing business.
 

gtrwll

Member
Just sent a request to remove all my files and delete my account. According to their forums, there are tens of thousands tracks being removed, and I very much suspect that they ain't the worst quality tracks going out the window. I see only one way this leads.
 

Sibelius19

Music is just color and rhythm --Debussy
Have some self respect for your music. Don`t let them bully you by taking 75% of the cut. Only true motivation they have is greed. Step 1) Hike up your prices-way up. Step 2) Remove your contents from them. Step 3) Do nothing and let the greedy CEO take more from you-hey why don`t you just work for free? F$%& Pond5 and all other sites is what any self respecting person should do. You will not be making any money from them. That`s ok. Most importantly, they will go bankrupt and that should be perfectly fine with any self respecting person. Or, let yourself be screwed. You all have a choice.
Easy for you to say. Why are you spamming dude?
They don't take 75%. It would be 65%, non-exclusive and adding administrative work to help with PRO publishing.
It's really not that unreasonable. You are right, we have the freedom to do what we want. We don't have to sell through them. For me I've built up a good working relationship with them and it would be foolish for me to quit working with them since I get a significant amount of money from them, and if you read carefully, I am not in a position to.
I am part of their "select" music and sounds (indemnified), as well as part of the "membership" collection. I've worked too hard and have gotten too far to just up and quit Pond5. I makes no sense for me in my circumstance at this current time.
 
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Mike Greene

Senior Member
Moderator
I deleted the 10 Pond5GreedyBastard posts and banned him. I don't know anything about Pond5, so complaints about them may or may not be warranted, but obviously someone chooses a screen name like Pond5GreedyBastard is joining for the purposes of carrying out a vendetta, which is not what the forum is for.
 
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