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Orchestral vst recommendations for hybrid/experimental modern orchestral/film score

rmak

Active Member
Greetings everyone,

I am new to this forum and posted in the wrong discussion channel. I thank you for taking the time to read this post and appreciate any input you may have.

I like Ludwig Göransson music in Mandalorian and new movie Tenet; I also like scores like Bear McCreary in the show "See" on Apple TV . If I am going for these hybrid/experiemental types of film scores with synths, 808s, but also your traditional orchestral instruments, does anyone have any recommendations for library vst s I should keep my eyes out for as Black Friday approaches? I don't really have any orchestral libraries other than the ones in NI Komplete 11. Currently, I am trying to learn dark zebra vst via putting together a short composition with generated sounds from the synth. I attached a 45 sec clip of what I have from my arrangement efforts in case you wanted to hear what I naturally gravitated towards. I am also considering some courses in orchestration on evenant for instance; I think they use a lot of audio imperia's nucleus vst in the course. I am a keyboard player, grew up playing classical, and I currently play more pop improvisation with chords. I use logic pro X.

I do like some of the smaller and intimate libraries out there with more detail and warmth like Strezov's inspiring Afflatus Ch 1 Strings and Spitfire Audio's Chamber Strings, but I am also wondering if a library like Orchestral Tools Metropolis Ark 1 with that epic big sound is necessary for this genre of composition. Afflatus is also nice because you get more flexibility from small ensemble to a 50 piece, but I don't think the library is as well equipped for tension and action themed music because I don't think it has as many dynamic layers. There are also of course libraries that are just inspiring and evocative like Albion Tundra and quiet Neo which I am keeping my eyes on. I do very much like that close detailed sound more so than the loud/epic sounds, and I also enjoy very dynamic compositions but I want to make sure that I cover my bases and not just buy the sounds I like. There's also a chance that I am not correctly identifying that an epic sound is an "epic sound" is some of the tracks I hear; sometimes it is hard for me to differentiate between the sound a full orchestra and a smaller ensemble. I hear a lot of good things about Cinematic Studio libraries, and a lot of composers use it for their bread and butter. I don't like most of the cinematic studio demos; I don't know if it is because of the song choice and how the library is being chosen to be used.

One more thing is I am new to this, so ease of use also helps but that is not the most important requirement for me. I know there is also that drier versus wet libraries, but really whatever libraries will get me closest to Ludwig or Bear's sounds without too much mixing of reverbs and processing. I learned from one of Satoshi Nagochi's YouTube videos that you can send your mix on two buses to two reverbs, one for the tail and one for the room (ideally a convolution impulse response) and that helps the overall mix. There is of course brass and woodwinds which I haven't done as much research into yet. I am more excited about woodwinds than I am brass; it seems that the brass sound can potentially be synthesized more easily than strings. But I also hear the NI session brass instrument is pretty nice; I haven't checked it out yet.



Any input you may have would be greatly appreciated. Best,
Ricky
 

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Henrik B. Jensen

Senior Member
Heavyocity makes stuff tailor-made for this, for example:




They have mangled, electronic drums here:




They also have "mangled" / hard-hitting brass:




For transitions (whoosh, slam etc.), check out this stuff by UVI:




Disclaimer: I own none of the products mentioned here and have no experience using them. But Heavyocity is pretty much the first name everyone mentions when it comes to trailer music, and UVI (I think?) have a good name/brand on this board too.
 
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rmak

rmak

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Thank you hbjdk for the information. I'll look into those links. When you say trailer music, is that interchangeable with music on film scores? I know the link I put is from trailer music, maybe that wasn't my intention. My understanding of trailer music is sometimes condensed snippets derived from the film score. I am new to this orchestration and film scoring and do not know if there is a clear line drawn between trailer music and film scores. I think more accurately I should have put this link instead of the above for Ludwig Gorannson -
 

jcrosby

Senior Member
Greetings everyone,

I am new to this forum and posted in the wrong discussion channel. I thank you for taking the time to read this post and appreciate any input you may have.

I like Ludwig Göransson music in Mandalorian and new movie Tenet; I also like scores like Bear McCreary in the show "See" on Apple TV . If I am going for these hybrid/experiemental types of film scores with synths, 808s, but also your traditional orchestral instruments, does anyone have any recommendations for library vst s I should keep my eyes out for as Black Friday approaches? I don't really have any orchestral libraries other than the ones in NI Komplete 11. Currently, I am trying to learn dark zebra vst via putting together a short composition with generated sounds from the synth. I attached a 45 sec clip of what I have from my arrangement efforts in case you wanted to hear what I naturally gravitated towards. I am also considering some courses in orchestration on evenant for instance; I think they use a lot of audio imperia's nucleus vst in the course. I am a keyboard player, grew up playing classical, and I currently play more pop improvisation with chords. I use logic pro X.

I do like some of the smaller and intimate libraries out there with more detail and warmth like Strezov's inspiring Afflatus Ch 1 Strings and Spitfire Audio's Chamber Strings, but I am also wondering if a library like Orchestral Tools Metropolis Ark 1 with that epic big sound is necessary for this genre of composition. Afflatus is also nice because you get more flexibility from small ensemble to a 50 piece, but I don't think the library is as well equipped for tension and action themed music because I don't think it has as many dynamic layers. There are also of course libraries that are just inspiring and evocative like Albion Tundra and quiet Neo which I am keeping my eyes on. I do very much like that close detailed sound more so than the loud/epic sounds, and I also enjoy very dynamic compositions but I want to make sure that I cover my bases and not just buy the sounds I like. There's also a chance that I am not correctly identifying that an epic sound is an "epic sound" is some of the tracks I hear; sometimes it is hard for me to differentiate between the sound a full orchestra and a smaller ensemble. I hear a lot of good things about Cinematic Studio libraries, and a lot of composers use it for their bread and butter. I don't like most of the cinematic studio demos; I don't know if it is because of the song choice and how the library is being chosen to be used.

One more thing is I am new to this, so ease of use also helps but that is not the most important requirement for me. I know there is also that drier versus wet libraries, but really whatever libraries will get me closest to Ludwig or Bear's sounds without too much mixing of reverbs and processing. I learned from one of Satoshi Nagochi's YouTube videos that you can send your mix on two buses to two reverbs, one for the tail and one for the room (ideally a convolution impulse response) and that helps the overall mix. There is of course brass and woodwinds which I haven't done as much research into yet. I am more excited about woodwinds than I am brass; it seems that the brass sound can potentially be synthesized more easily than strings. But I also hear the NI session brass instrument is pretty nice; I haven't checked it out yet.



Any input you may have would be greatly appreciated. Best,
Ricky
Ark's popular for trailer writing but CSS is used just as frequently... Ark's great for a big sound but a bit shy when it comes to detailed strings. Ark 1's strings are broken into high and low, CSS is divided into each section...

I wouldn't recommend UVI XFX for trailer effects. It's really not tailored to that. XFX is much more tailored toward traditional film effects, very little of the stuttering, fluttering and aggressive style whooshes used in trailers. Meteor would be a much better choice. (Meteor's also very easy program and incredibly quick as a sound design tool. It's also a lot more versatile than just being rise and impact engine, you can make braams, sirens, downers, whooshes, and subs... Pretty much all of your nuts and bolts...)

There are also a ton of other options by an absolute ton of developers... Heavyocity, Keepforest, 8Dio, etc. Not to mention tons of lesser know and less expensive developers who's stuff is equally as awesome...

Forzo's pretty cool. I wouldn't recommend it as a standalone brass solution though, it doesn't have to high dynamics that are pretty important for that larger than life trailer-wall-of-sound. Great for sound design, making your own braams, pulses, 'hybrid' synthesis, etc... Also very cool for using to doubling organic brass with some of its 'synth' patches.

DM307's pretty solid. But it is very processed. basically it's great if you want synthetic/processed/industrial sounding percussion and a somewhat small collection of fx menus, but doesn't give you very much in the way of organic percussion. (The effects are pretty sparse as well... It's mainly focused on electronic and processed drums that are laid out in kits.)

Damage 1's pretty dated by now. Damage 2 would be a much better choice. If you have damage 1 however and D2's not in your budget use it... It will definitely get the job done if you stack patches together. If you have it try stacking Armageddon with Studio Plastics... You could then layer in one of the hit patches as well to fill out the sub...

Damage 2 is probably the best one stop shop currently. It does organic really well, but has tons of processed and 'trailerized' percussion as well. (Also some whooshes, reverses, and great bowed percussion effects.) And it has a ton of processing options, lets you build your own ensembles, kits, and has tempo synced rolls which are really useful. Basically you can shape Damage to be as organic or inorganic as you want... If you want something where you're not re-using the same sounds over and over it lets you go quite deep.

You wrote a lot! (As did I :P) What exactly are you currently looking for? Orchestral libraries well suited to trailer music? FX libraries? Hybrid orchestra/synth instruments? A little bit of all of the above?
 
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rmak

rmak

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Thanks Crosby for your reply. I will look into some of those vst s. At this point, I am not sure what direction I am taking or what I need in terms of vst s; I just know that I like some of the compositions similar to Ludwig where it is contemporary/hybrid and captures orchestral elements. It seems from some of the forums I've read, a lot of people recommend studying the classical composers instead of studying film music if I am interested in this genre. So right now, I am looking into some self studying of some of the orchestral pieces mentioned by Thomas Goss YouTube channel including Ravel's une barque sur l'ocean. I don't want to get stuck in this perpetual need to learn and never getting a chance to apply or write on my own, so right now I am considering purchasing or trying out Sibelius notation program and attempt to copy/notate the entire sheet music for the orchestra onto the program. This way I'll at least have some "hands on" experience, and I hear that the note performer is a good option for playback. I don't have much knowledge of orchestral instruments, and I think I need to have some understanding of their idiosyncrasies and how they are played. And then maybe down the road, I'll have a better understanding of the actual sounds I am looking for. I'll continue to mess around occasionally in Logic and attempt to reverse engineer some presets in Zebra 2 in conjunction to learning some orchestration using Sibelius and online resources like Thomas Goss, maybe only Thomas Goss to keep things simple!
 
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