NI Session Guitarist: Acoustic Sunburst Deluxe is disappointing
- Thread starter the_pro
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Most guitar VIs don’t sound much like an actual guitar unless you’re only playing very simple melodies. The strum patches in the NI Session Guitarist series actually do sound like real guitars, at the cost of being limited. There are ways to make the patterns more versatile, but there is still a limit to the range of possibilities. The melody patches were something NI added later in the development of the series because people were asking for them, but they aren’t really the main point.
Op. 67
Member
I think you can still achieve this by using key switches.
QuiteAlright
Gastronomer
This is incorrect. It does include those techniques:
This library is mainly focused on strumming, so of course you need to change between patterns for a realistic sound. You wouldn't just put a monotonous single strumming pattern on a part for a real guitarist, would you?
Id recommended looking at the walkthrough, which probably explains better how to use it. As for the strumming patterns, they're very realistic if you program them correctly.
AceAudioHQ
Senior Member
Well, you can make a custom pattern by using the pattern offset and keyswitches in combinations, but it was probably not meant for that and is pretty tedious work. Also has some limitations because of this.
rezoneight
Active Member
Sounds like you need a real guitar player. Less tedious but they cost more money unless you know someone.
All the NI Session Guitarists are like that, I use them as a starting point to build a track around. If you are trying to retro-fit the patterns into an existing track you might not find any useful patterns that fit. If you use the "Melody" version you can play your own rhythm using the keyboard.
I liked the sound and the patterns, but was disappointed by extremely limited number of presets. Few strums, few arpeggios, a couple of hard riffs. I understand that it's a series instrument intended for future models/expansions, but honestly expected a couple of hundred rather than a couple of dozen presets.
For acoustic guitars I prefer Orange Tree hands down. For actually playing parts in they are a lot smoother. And even for strumming, I just do this manually, which obviously requires more practice than using pre-recorded parts but once you get it down it sounds a lot more expressive.
Jim@StrumTracks
Member
The comparative lack of variations within a style is the biggest limitation of the Session Guitarist series. A number of people have commented on the fact that you can adjust the existing patterns (by changing the start and end points), but it is time-consuming, and I suspect most people don't bother using that capability too much. I wonder if those who make the Session Guitarist series would consider using this capacity themselves to provide a ready-made list of a large multitude of the variations which are theoretically possible and have them available for simple selection? Perhaps group them under the existing styles as sub-variations. I presume this would only require some more programming and UI work, since the patterns are already there.
I used to own all the NI guitars but have since sold them all after getting into OTS guitars. Miles ahead in versatility and realism. The Session series are meant to be used as support/ backing layers in a track, not lead solos. Also the highest strings are rarely sampled above the 12th fret so the top octave is always missing in the NI libs. Who approved that decision???
Adam Takacs
Active Member
Unfortunately, once you hold a real guitar in your hand, all vi guitars sound like shit.
d4vec4rter
Senior Member
I own most of the NI Session guitars. They come in handy from time to time, mostly when I'm after a rhythm I'd find a little tricky to do myself or for pure convenience but I'm a reasonably proficient rhythm guitarist so 9 times out of 10, I'll do it myself. They may also have a particular sound I would find difficult to reproduce also. In general though, I find them quite limited. You can use standard MIDI chords with the latest one which is a serious improvement. I just wish they could have implemented this feature for the rest.
As has already been mentioned, OTS Guitars are by far the best for lead/solo work. The depth of realism that can be achieved is quite exceptional. However, I find their strumming engine horrendously cumbersome and awkward.
In my opinion, the best designed Guitar VIs are Amplesound's collection. For usability and features, these are brilliant. Probably not quite as authentic sounding as OTS but quite OK for backing tracks.
As has already been mentioned, OTS Guitars are by far the best for lead/solo work. The depth of realism that can be achieved is quite exceptional. However, I find their strumming engine horrendously cumbersome and awkward.
In my opinion, the best designed Guitar VIs are Amplesound's collection. For usability and features, these are brilliant. Probably not quite as authentic sounding as OTS but quite OK for backing tracks.
AceAudioHQ
Senior Member
This is false, I got a real guitar and it sounds like shit compared to sample libraries! Not the guitar’s fault.
The problem with such strumming engines in general is that individually plucked strings really don’t sound like a strum performed in a single fluid motion which often includes some sympathetic resonance. The attack of the pick against the string tends to be quite different with one versus the other.
My personal experience is that melody parts on a guitar VI only sound good when they are simple enough that they’re something I could play on a real guitar myself, and I’m not much of a guitar player. That being said, a VI can still be useful in that case, in that it’s easier to get a good acoustic sound with a VI compared to miking up a real guitar in my apartment.
Tremendouz
Senior Member
I do struggle with realism in fast, shredding solos but moderately paced passages can be fairly realistic in a mix. The solos at 2 mins and 3:30 show some faster playing, as well as the main rhythm guitar riff (shameless self plug)
The rhythm here is Ample AME and AMH, lead is AGVC
Tremendouz
Senior Member
That's interesting. Is it only for guitars or are other instruments mentioned?
Kerryman
Active Member
I've had several telephone conversations with the library director and I'm working on my third album for them now.
While they prefer 'organic instrumentation' (as opposed to synths), sampled organic instruments are acceptable. I only use sampled instruments, other than some percussion and saxophones. But guitars must be 'real' and played/recorded live.
Jim@StrumTracks
Member
I have been experimenting for some time trying to develop a good acoustic strumming VI, leaning towards emulated strums because its easier and less time-consuming, and allowing any chord type or voicing, yet toying with the idea of trying to do one with real strums because of the more realistic sound. I've hesitated though because of the amount of time and effort involved to get a reasonable number of chord types and voicings, and there are still challenges regarding the great variability of tone. Just for interest I've included a couple of audio files to demonstrate emulated and real strums done with the same guitar. The first alternates emulated and real, and the second uses both for doubled guitars. I've just used what I had ready to hand so it is just one chord, but it illustrates the point.
View attachment Emulated_v_Real_Cmaj_120_mp3.wav
View attachment Emulated_Real_Dbl_Cmaj_120_mp3.wav
I think the doubled one shows that emulated strums can still work well in the right setting.
