New 16" Macbook Pro goes up to 64GB RAM!

jiten

Member
The T2 chip cannot be "disabled" in any way. You can reduce the security restrictions but it has no effect on the issue he's talking about for two reasons. (I've been dealing with this issue for a year now.)

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Thanks for sharing this. I keep going back and forth on upgrading my 2014 MBP. Based on what I read, it seemed like the T2 audio issues were resolved for RME interfaces specifically (as of mid-2019 I think).

The amount of errors and glitches you were getting in that video is crazy! Out of curiosity, what audio interface were you using when experiencing these issues? Also have you tried latest Mojave and/or Catalina? Apparently 10.14.4 and 10.14.5 updates "fixed" this for most people according to some threads on Gearslutz.

I may just go for the 2.3 i9 / 64GB / 1TB config which I think will be more than sufficient for travel/dev work, and then try to test it thoroughly while within the return period.
 
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jcrosby

Senior Member
Thanks for sharing this. I keep going back and forth on upgrading my 2014 MBP. Based on what I read, it seemed like the T2 audio issues were resolved for RME interfaces specifically (as of mid-2019 I think).

The amount of errors and glitches you were getting in that video is crazy! Out of curiousity, what audio interface were you using when experiencing these issues? Also have you tried latest Mojave and/or Catalina? Apparently 10.14.4 and 10.14.5 updates "fixed" this for most people according to some threads on Gearslutz.

I may just go for the 2.3 i9 / 64GB / 1TB config which I think will be more than sufficient for travel/dev work, and then try to test it throughly while within the return period.
I'd at least be weary if you're thinking of a refurb 2018 or 2019. Not sure about the 16 inch, may not be an issue.

I was using built in audio. This is a big deal for me as the MacBook as always been something I take with me to get out of the house. Since the headphone jack sounds decent enough it's always been a great all-in-one solution... That said I have plugged my D-Box+ into it, regular dropouts every minute or so.

For people who do use the headphone jack, or use it on occasion - The other thing to be aware of is Apple have mucked up auto-switching. (When you unplug/plug in the phones and it switches from the speakers to phones or vice versa...)

I often used the speakers for a quick mix 'reality check', now you have to manually switch outputs in your DAW, as creating an aggregate behaves differently from DAW to DAW. In some DAWs this solves it, others it doesn't... it can also put you in the awkward position of unintentionally playing sound out of the speakers if they were the last selected device and you don't switch devices manually before resuming playback. Had this happen at a neighborhood cafe twice and it was jarring since the speakers on this thing are pretty loud for a laptop.

Not only that, in some DAWs this means your entire project has to reload before it switches devices. In Bitwig and Logic for example changing devices means I have to wait for it to unload all of my kontakt instances then reload them again before I can use the cans or do a quick mix check.

Personally I find this to be a real let down as I've always done about half of my writing on a MacBook. I'll move things to my studio computer if needed, but if I can keep everything inside the same machine it's a lot less moving parts to keep track of... Anyway between this and the glitch that won't die it's knocked the MBP down a few pegs for me... I've gone through a lot of MacBooks, not even sure if my next laptop will be a mac at this point... If you use an interface you'll probably get better mileage... but if you use it with the built-in jack it's a pretty big nuissance...

As far as the glitching that's what blows my mind... You'd think that addressing an issue with the built-in hardware would be an easy fix, and something they'd Address relatively quickly.

Also it's pretty darned safe to assume to two issues are tied, (if not stemming from the same place.) The glitching / popping showed up in the same update as when people started to complaining about USB dropouts.

I haven't upgraded to 10.14 because the issue was still reported as happening in late November in the thread below, (last dot update of Mojave.). I'm skeptical to say the least that it's been resolved. I'll test it out at some point, but only when I have time to test the ever living **** out of it for a few days...


EDIT: According to the thread below there are still some audio issues on the 16 inch.

The popping that happens in the second part of the video on page 1 is identical to popping I still get. (While I was able to get the glitching go away by restoring from a backup, the popping on playback never went away.) I stick to my theory that bridgeOS has SERIOUS core audio issues Apple have yet to address...

Personally I'd do some serious homework or deep testing before assuming it's all roses...

Thread Title:

"Apple Investigating 16-Inch MacBook Pro Popping Sound Issue, Fix Planned in Future Software Updates"



 
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AndyP

Senior Member
I assume that the audio problems do not occur when I use the MacBook as VEP slave over ethernet?
Standalone the internal audio output is enough for me, so i would not get into the problem with usb2 audio interfaces.
 

apollinaire

New Member
Ok, so I figured out my question about downgrading OS X.

it’s the drivers for the graphics that’s not available on Mojave installers.

And seems someone was able to grab the kext from the Catalina disk but others didn’t have luck.

for previous models, that came out when Mojave was out can easily be downgraded. So the 15 inch model is fine.

not sure the new Mac Pro.

I’m still afraid of all the 32 bit plugins I have and using Catalina so that’s a bummer.
I heard from an Apple rep that it's the same with the Mac Pro, it only works with Catalina and upwards.
 

jcrosby

Senior Member
I assume that the audio problems do not occur when I use the MacBook as VEP slave over ethernet?
Standalone the internal audio output is enough for me, so i would not get into the problem with usb2 audio interfaces.
No idea. I can say from dealing with this issue however that it is not just a USB issue. As far as the popping it happens to me in everything from Logic to itunes to chrome. It's not tied to any specific app, it's across the entire OS. And it only happens on the speakers. Buffering issues however happen on both the speakers and headphone jack... And as I said, when I hooked up my D Box I was getting dropouts.

Basically the real source of the issue is either a macOS or bridgeOS issue that's been happening since the 1st release of Mojave, (and a security patch issued that same day for High Sierra.) In other words the crackling and popping began for me the same exact day the mini launched with its drop out issues so I'm positive they are in fact the same issue...

And pretty sure the reason the crackling/popping's not reported on the mini is because you're more likely to use the mini with an interface, whereas there's a decent chance you'll use the MacBook with the built in audio. So it "looks" and behaves differently with the built-in hardware, but stems from the same issue. The odds of these issues all showing up on the same day without being related seems insanely low...

I'd recommend visiting some of the threads above and either do some reading or post a question... There are alot of composers in those mac rumors threads so you might turn up someone using one with VEP.
 
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jiten

Member
No idea. I can say from dealing with this issue however that it is not just a USB issue. As far as the popping it happens to me in everything from Logic to itunes to chrome. It's not tied to any specific app, it's across the entire OS. And it only happens on the speakers. Buffering issues however happen on both the speakers and headphone jack... And as I said, when I hooked up my D Box I was getting dropouts.

Basically the real source of the issue is either a macOS or bridgeOS issue that's been happening since the 1st release of Mojave, (and a security patch issued that same day for High Sierra.) In other words the crackling and popping began for me the same exact day the mini launched with its drop out issues so I'm positive they are in fact the same issue...

And pretty sure the reason the crackling/popping's not reported on the mini is because you're more likely to use the mini with an interface, whereas there's a decent chance you'll use the MacBook with the built in audio. So it "looks" and behaves differently with the built-in hardware, but stems from the same issue. The odds of these issues all showing up on the same day without being related seems insanely low...

I'd recommend visiting some of the threads above and either do some reading or post a question... There are alot of composers in those mac rumors threads so you might turn up someone using one with VEP.
I think there are several issues that may or may not be related (and may or may not stem from T2) spanning several MBP models. I'm trying to focus specifically on reports on the 16" since that's what's most relevant to this thread and what I'm interested in.

I was aware of the built-in speakers popping issue when scrubbing videos on the 16" models. I don't know if this affects DAW work though as most people cited having problems in safari/chrome or FCP when scrubbing videos and not in other apps. In any case, this can apparently be fixed in software and is in Apple's hands at this point. It's not a big deal for me anyway as I rarely ever use laptop speakers (only to occasionally check a mix or for casual listening). I do use the headphone jack a lot more but as you said, looks like reports indicate this only being a problem with the built-in speakers.

There was a also separate issue then with USB2 interfaces glitching and dropping that was tied to the T2 chip. As far as I can tell, this was resolved for the RME interfaces. I didn't research or look into other USB2 interfaces specifically, but think it was fixed with a Mojave update.

At this point, I have probably gleaned all the info I could hope to from scouring gearslutz and macrumor threads. Though it would be helpful to hear accounts from anyone who is using the 16" MBP on their experiences with any pops/clicks/artifacts using (1) built-in speakers (2) headphone jack and (3) a USB audio interface.
 
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jcrosby

Senior Member
I think there are several issues that may or may not be related (and may or may not stem from T2) spanning several MBP models. I'm trying to focus specifically on reports on the 16" since that's what's most relevant to this thread and what I'm interested in.

I was aware of the built-in speakers popping issue when scrubbing videos on the 16" models. I don't know if this affects DAW work though as most people cited having problems in safari/chrome or FCP when scrubbing videos and not in other apps. In any case, this can apparently be fixed in software and is in Apple's hands at this point. It's not a big deal for me anyway as I rarely ever use laptop speakers (only to ocasionally check a mix or for casual listening). I do use the headphone jack a lot more but as you said, looks like reports indicate this only being a problem with the built-in speakers.

There was a also separate issue then with USB2 interfaces glitching and dropping that was tied to the T2 chip. As far as I can tell, this was resolved for the RME interfaces. I didn't research or look into other USB2 interfaces specifically, but think it was fixed with a Mojave update.

At this point, I have probably gleaned all the info I could hope to from scouring gearslutz and macrumor threads. Though it would be helpful to hear accounts from anyone who is using the 16" MBP on their experiences with any pops/clicks/artifacts using (1) built-in speakers (2) headphone jack and (3) a USB audio interface.
You must not have read my previous post.

This all showed up at the same time, in the same update; the same day Apple released Mojave, the mini, and patched high Sierra.

If you have the pleasure of dealing with them the dropouts and glitching are systemwide, and show up in tandem with the RME issue.

They are the same issue, and yes they do all tie to the T2 chip. T1/T2 chip models are the only apple machines that have had ongoing audio issues that reach back to 2016 (<- T1 chip). Not to mention that all issues show up all over again on the same day.

Not to mention that the sole purpose of the T2 chip is that it replaces what used to be the SMC, and handles the majority of firmware. I.e. The T2 manages internal audio, the SSD Controller, the camera, acts as the middle before it approves anything plugged into USB/thunderbolt, including audio devices. Almost all hardware on the MacBook Pro has to negotiate some kind of connection via the T2 chip. (On other machines not quite as much, the MacBook however is a different story...)



Past Apple notebooks have suffered from similar issues, including the 2016 MacBook Pro with Touch Bar. In 2017, a small number of users reported hearing a "pinging" or "popping" noise coming from within the chassis during periods of heavy use. Similar sounds caused alarm for MacBook Pro owners in 2016.Dec 6, 2019




As for the popping, again the behavior on my machine is identical to the 16 inch in the Video on the linked article. And if you take the time to watch it you see Logic being used - it’s not program dependent, it happens DAWs, browsers, video players, itunes.

As I said it’s system wide, and if you do a little research you’ll see that relying Apple for an honest explanation is generally bad advice, at least currently.

And FYI I did the same thing ;) I waited for Apple to patch the 2018 MBP before I pulled the trigger; which they did in August of 2018 . The fix they out out (Supplemental Update 2) worked... Just a few short months later they broke it all over again with a later update, this time the issue's lingered around in some form or another for over a year now.

Also no I'm not suggesting anyone not to buy one. That'd be ridiculous ... I'm just saying that doing a little research before emptying your wallet might spare you some pretty expensive grief...
 
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jiten

Member
You must not have read my previous post.

This all showed up at the same time, in the same update; the same day Apple released Mojave, the mini, and patched high Sierra.

If you have the pleasure of dealing with them the dropouts and glitching are systemwide, and show up in tandem with the RME issue.

....
I did read your posts, but it seemed to me that the issue you were experiencing in your video was different than what is being reported on the new 16" models. Your video demonstrated glitching every 1-2 seconds during continuous playback. The new 16" models pop when starting/stopping playback or scrubbing. I haven't seen recent reports of USB interface dropouts or anything affecting the headphone jack on the 16" though. But fair enough on both/all these issues being tied to T2.

If you ever get around to it, I'd definitely be interested to hear if you are still having the buffering problem that affected the headphone out or your DBox under the latest Mojave or Catalina updates.

And yes you are right I spoke too hastily, some users have experienced the speaker pop in Logic or Ableton. But others have reported no pops in Logic or Apple Music or Spotify. It seems random and app-specific on some people's systems. There are also some interesting workarounds posted that apparently solve this by running MP3s of silence or QT in the background.

I'm just going off of most user reports in this thread:

And of course, I really appreciate you sharing your experience with all this. I haven't really been plugged in to all the problems plaguing the latest MBP models as I haven't been in the market for a new macbook until recently. At the very least, I now know what to test for and if it turns out worse than I expected or if it affects the headphone port or USB interfaces, then that would be more of a deal-breaker for me. Will also look out for the auto-switching issue you mentioned (though I can probably live with that too as I'm not switching that often or at all really...)
 
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