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LogicPro + VEP and AU3

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Dewdman42

Dewdman42

Senior Member
Ok - it looks like the absolute limit was 8 ports and 16 channels minus 1. In total 127 channels possible. Creating the object for port 8 and channel 16, causes the environment to break down, all channels losing their GUI.
I see thanks for the clarification. Now that you mention that, I did notice the template was missing port 8 channel 16 and wondered wy and when I tried it add it, the GUI broke down, so there you have it.

So anyway from my end, the track inspector shows 16 possible ports, not 48. But now I see that what you are saying we should not use more than 127 mid channels, probably nothing past port 8 either. For now.

it doesn't surprise me that the enviornment breaks down at 127 and it will not surprise me if that is very difficult for Apple to fix. Its in the guts of the enviornment which was coded decades ago using low level stuff to make it perform in real time. I would presume lots of bit operations on 8 bit bytes..

Still, 127 channels into a single instance of VEP is still an improvement compared to before, and like I said, it played back 90 tracks for me perfectly that way.

I hope Apple can improve LPX to be better than 127, but we shall see, I won't hold my breathe on that, but they are increasing the channel count to 1000, so who knows...
 
OP
Dewdman42

Dewdman42

Senior Member
No I want one Channel Strip per instrument, not separate tracks feeding through the same one. Violinists in an orchestra don't sit on each others laps.
So if you want to do all the mixing in the LPX mixer, you could still use 16 channel multis with up to 16 instruments per VEP instance and get a mixer channel for each instrument, all in LPX.

for more mixer channels then that, you'd ahve to mix the stems in VEP, which some of us actually prefer. This is where it comes down to workflow choice more than anything and I don't think there is a right or wrong answer her, its personal preference.
 
OP
Dewdman42

Dewdman42

Senior Member
That statement is out of date.
yea ok, well I don't work at Apple so how could I possibly know you are right about that, but still we can see its evident in the enviornment all the numerical limitations it has that this is most likely the case. I will love to see them bump up the limits on things like that, particularly as the enviornment is concerned, but as I said, I'm not holding my breath and will continue to have my hypothesis as to why.
 

Ashermusic

Senior Member
yea ok, well I don't work at Apple so how could I possibly know you are right about that, but still we can see its evident in the enviornment all the numerical limitations it has that this is most likely the case. I will love to see them bump up the limits on things like that, particularly as the enviornment is concerned, but as I said, I'm not holding my breath and will continue to have my hypothesis as to why.
You can, but you might consider the possibility that someone has info you do not. Either way, it is what it is, right?
 

Shad0wLandsUK

Senior Member
I don’t get it. The multi port AU3 just doesn’t show up if I insert it. It shows a red ! meaning that it’s missing.

The stereo one works fine.
Are you using the latest version of the plugin Nick?
I had this issue as well, which I mentioned to Dewdman42 earlier on this thread
Not sure whether it was installing the application again, an update or a re-validation of my plugins, but I eventually got it to work...
 
OP
Dewdman42

Dewdman42

Senior Member
You can, but you might consider the possibility that someone has info you do not. Either way, it is what it is, right?
What makes you think I haven’t? And yes it is irrelevant about why, simple truth is that there are many aspects of LPX Limited by small numbers. I have my theory about why you don’t have to agree with me
 

Nick Batzdorf

Moderator
Moderator
Screen Shot 2019-06-12 at 12.25.13 PM.png
Make sure you are using the AU3 templates as a starting point provided by VSL. They are acually using the multi-out version of the plugin already by default.
They give me the red ! thing. No use on my system.

The stereo one works absolutely fine.
 
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Nick Batzdorf

Moderator
Moderator
Are you using the latest version of the plugin Nick?
I had this issue as well, which I mentioned to Dewdman42 earlier on this thread
Not sure whether it was installing the application again, an update or a re-validation of my plugins, but I eventually got it to work...
That occurred to me too. Thanks.

I've never been confident the installer was replacing it with the latest one, in fact I'd considered asking someone to email me the AU3 plug-in on its own.

But while the version is 7.0, it was created May 23 - same date as the VE Pro program - so I think it's the current one.
 
OP
Dewdman42

Dewdman42

Senior Member
Very strange. I had the same problem a few weeks ago when I tried it, then this week I tried it again, it flashed orange briefly and then started working, have no idea why it would not work before and now it does. Well it’s still beta and probably not worth spending a lot of time on it now but I do think It works very well when it works and I like the future direction once all the kinks are worked out
 
OP
Dewdman42

Dewdman42

Senior Member
I can see all 48 ports (VE Pro limit) in Logic Pro. Do you have your VE Pro preferences set to 16 ports?

I am running MacOS Catalina. Maybe that is a difference.
So after I reconfigured the VEP plugin to 48 ports AND RESTARTED LPX, I see 48 ports also. But note Martin's comments above...LPX is limited to 127 midi channels, which means don't use more than 8 ports, and can't use channel 16 on port8 either.
 

studioj

Active Member
I am quite fond of my Pro Tools VEP template where I can easily have separate instrument tracks / io for EVERY instrument/ MIDI channel coming out of VEP into PT. I generally use multi out kontakt instruments within VEP and create input objects in VEP to route to separate instrument tracks in PT. So I may have 6 VEP instances but hundreds of stereo instrument tracks in PT receiving the audio signal and sending the MIDI.

Is there a way to achieve this with Logic and VEP7 now using only a few instances? Does it feel like something like this will be possible? Or is the only way to use multi ports in VEP / Logic still with just MIDI tracks? (as opposed to instrument tracks plus aux objects). Hopefully I'm making sense! thx!
 

dgburns

summer of pickles and IPA beer
So after I reconfigured the VEP plugin to 48 ports AND RESTARTED LPX, I see 48 ports also. But note Martin's comments above...LPX is limited to 127 midi channels, which means don't use more than 8 ports, and can't use channel 16 on port8 either.
Here’s a crazy thought-has anyone thought of using the old multiport with the au3 to get 8x16 ports?
 
OP
Dewdman42

Dewdman42

Senior Member
Here’s a crazy thought-has anyone thought of using the old multiport with the au3 to get 8x16 ports?
The old multiport relied on functionality built into the AU2 plugin to intepret cc99 message and convert them into port assignments. No I don't thinking combining the two would work, nor makes any sense. Just send feature requests to Apple to get more than 127 midi channels!
 
OP
Dewdman42

Dewdman42

Senior Member
I am quite fond of my Pro Tools VEP template where I can easily have separate instrument tracks / io for EVERY instrument/ MIDI channel coming out of VEP into PT. I generally use multi out kontakt instruments within VEP and create input objects in VEP to route to separate instrument tracks in PT. So I may have 6 VEP instances but hundreds of stereo instrument tracks in PT receiving the audio signal and sending the MIDI.

Is there a way to achieve this with Logic and VEP7 now using only a few instances? Does it feel like something like this will be possible? Or is the only way to use multi ports in VEP / Logic still with just MIDI tracks? (as opposed to instrument tracks plus aux objects). Hopefully I'm making sense! thx!
LPX is limited to 16 stereo channels coming from any instrument plugin. So you'd be limited to 16 stereo channels per VEP instance.
 

agarner32

Active Member
The old multiport relied on functionality built into the AU2 plugin to intepret cc99 message and convert them into port assignments.
Is this the method you are referring to? So far it seems to work okay although I do get some glitches like losing core audio once in awhile. I got this off a youtube tutorial.

Thanks,
Aaron

Edit: I forgot the screenshot and a typo.
 

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OP
Dewdman42

Dewdman42

Senior Member
more or less yes. I have done extensive work on this, you can read more here: https://www.logicprohelp.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=9

The CC99 macro can work ok and I have been using it, but every once in a while there can be issues, dropped midi events sometimes. Its also more complicated to setup and use. The new AU3 is going to be the way to go as long as you can live with 127 midi channels per VEP instance. If you want bigger templates into a single VEP instance, then by all means the CC99 macro might still work for you, or if we're lucky Apple will update LPX to handle more midi channels but somehow I doubt they will do that anytime soon.

In any case, I do not think the CC99 trick can be combined with AU3 because the AU3 likely does not have the ability to convert CC99 messages into VEP port assignments, nor would it make any sense to do that, when it can do its own port assignments, but unfortunately Logic can only assign up to 8 ports. I can't think of any way the two approaches could be combined.
 
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OP
Dewdman42

Dewdman42

Senior Member
also, I got MUCH better cpu performance with the AU3 plugin compared to using CC99 trick into AU2. FWIW.
 

gsilbers

Part of Pulsesetter-Sounds.com
View attachment 20635

They give me the red ! thing. No use on my system.

The stereo one works absolutely fine.

sorry.. im a bit behind .. but can someone tell me if with the new VEP AU3 is suppose show something like this image but 48 tracks instead of 16 (au limit)?
i see several folks referencing the environment tinkering the ports vs tracks is gtting to me.
 
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