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Consona

Consona

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The ultimate edition was waaaayyyy better than the theatrical cut. I’m a fan of Snyder for sure. MoS is one of my all time favorite movies. And that Junkie XL song is incredible btw! Usually not a fan of that style song, but I’ve been listening to it on repeat.

If you have an open mind, the depth of Snyder’s stories are incredible. It is the Powers that be that try to censor his stories... that is what it is really about. He presents really deep stories in a way for the masses to injest... but the execs don’t want that, so they handicap His theatrical releases. Sucker Punch is a good example. The directors cut tells an entirely different story than the theatrical cut. And, if you truly understand the depth and spiritual meaning he has throughout the film, it really is a “sucker punch” to those that think it is a chauvinistic video game type of a movie. That particular story is a piece of art that 99% of the world won’t get. Kinda like how Dante published his works as a “Divine Comedy” to escape persecution of heresy.
Exactly!
Reading your post I was about to mention Sucker Punch, but you did it yourself. :) And btw, Snyder said we are getting his original version of Sucker Punch this year as well! :thumbsup:

Internet is so meme based. Some youtubers who are incapable of appreciating his films started this "Snyder's films are style over substance" and I'm always like "WTF??? turn your brain on and pay some attention!!!". :mad: :laugh: People over-praise all those bland Disney flicks so heavily and yet say Snyder's films have little substance and I'm like, guys, Batman v Superman alone had more substance than all those 23+ MCU films combined. :roflmao:

Also funny you mentioned Dante. As someone who studied Dante (and Shakespeare) at an university, BvS really reminded me of their complex and interesting works.

Btw, Snyder is developing a king Arthur film now. 1981 Excalibur is one of his fave films ever.

Thinking about his films, I haven't seen the owls animated film yet, should do something about it. :)
 
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Consona

Consona

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Shame Warner Bros also botched the distribution up. Hope someone from HBO/WarnerMedia helps with that. But they have only a month until the premiere.
Today, WarnerMedia and Zack Snyder announced they were able to make ZSJL available worldwide day one except for 3 countries!!!
 
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Consona

Consona

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Lol, and those 3 countries get a theatrical release, lucky bastards. :grin:
 

Ahmad Ali

New Member
What's the length of the upcoming soundtrack?
Zack Snyder said there will be about 4 hour of music released (including a ten minute intermission piece). We'll know for sure next month.

I'm beyond excited to finally be able to see this Snyder's vision.

I remember being so excited to see JL in 2017 and then the news about Snyder stepping down then Holkenborg getting replaced by Elfman was a huge red flag. I literally went to see it twice in IMAX because I was so invested in it but it was clear that it was a botched movie by a studio who is so reactive. I still don't understand how they looked at that cut and went: Yup! This is worth releasing. The opening scene alone was a reason to can it or just set it on fire.
 

storyteller

Senior Member
Just saw this. Absolutely incredible. The way Superman lifts Batman, out of darkness... the nod they give to each other... :emoji_ok_hand:
And Superman is wearing his black suit!! I missed that the first couple of times i watched it.

This movie could flop, but sonically, we are in for a 4hr Junkie XL treat. And, visually it looks soooooo much better than Whedon’s version. I was baffled at the choice of lenses in the first movie... faces looked warped and overall it was as if the cinematographer forgot how to choose an aesthically pleasing lens. But when you see the same scenes side by side without the zoom and crop, the lens choices were perfect. this is one of my gripes with high res digital cinematography... the whole ”oh we can crop and zoom in post” does NOT work like they think since a lens is chosen based on the framing of a shot and the distance the subject is from the camera.


 

NoamL

Winter <3
This movie could flop
Reportedly it cost $70m to "undo" the Josstice League version. Which feels like a lot by the standards of this unprecedentedly weird redo-a-movie concept, but not a lot by the standards of comic book movie budgets from square one. So doesn't the film have a pretty reasonable chance to make back its "redo" budget?.... depends on how expensive the marketing is.... there sure seems like a lot of marketing but part of it is organic WOM.

Anyway, larger point: the thing is 4 hours long and has everything you would expect from "Zack Snyder passion project" right down to The Joker doing a Christ allegory. I don't think there's really a question that the Snyder version wouldn't have flopped every bit as hard as the WB/Whedon version, if released theatrically at the time. This grimdark version of superheroes is so expired. DC's biggest successes so far were WW and Aquaman.
 
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marclawsonmusic

Senior Member
I don't understand why people aren't sick of superhero movies already.

Judas f'kin Priest, it's been years and years of this stuff. Same music (ok, debatable... but always BIG), same stories, same drama, same FX, same 'I'm a common man, but still a superhero', same bullshit.

Yeah yeah, I know there is Marvel vs DC, but really it's the same stories with different heroes.

This stuff still sells? Good grief, humanity must be desperate.
 
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Reportedly it cost $70m to "undo" the Josstice League version.
Not undo. Snyder's film was finished first. Then WB spent money to redo that. Those $70m HBO gave to Snyder was to finish all VFX and stuff in the original film. Not to "undo" anything from Josstice League. There won't be a frame from that 2017 film in ZSJL.

This grimdark version of superheroes is so expired.
Good movies never expire.

DC's biggest successes so far were WW and Aquaman.
And those films ranged from mediocre (WW) to borderline crap (Aquaman). I'm so baffled people love the blandest comicbook films like Aquaman, Black Panther or Thor Ragnarok.

I wish we could get more stuff from Nolan, Snyder or Mangold. I don't need anything from the whole MCU or Warner Bros' DCEU 2.0.

I don't understand why people aren't sick of superhero movies already.

Judas f'kin Priest, it's been years and years of this stuff. Same music (ok, debatable... but always BIG), same stories, same drama, same FX, same 'I'm a common man, but still a superhero', same bullshit.

Yeah yeah, I know there is Marvel vs DC, but really it's the same stories with different heroes.

This stuff still sells? Good grief, humanity must be desperate.
The last thing Snyder's film is going to be is just another run-of-the-mill comicbook flick.
 

Ahmad Ali

New Member
Not undo. Snyder's film was finished first. Then WB spent money to redo that. Those $70m HBO gave to Snyder was to finish all VFX and stuff in the original film. Not to "undo" anything from Josstice League. There won't be a frame from that 2017 film in ZSJL.
Yeah... the whole "undo" thing is tricky. From what I understand, Zack had his 214 minute cut and a studio mandated 2-hour cut (this is the version Holkenborg originally scored in 2017). Nothing was finished as that cut probably didn't please WB. Then Snyder stepped away.

They spent money on the original shoot, then spent more money on unnecessary reshoots.
 

storyteller

Senior Member
How do I watch it? Is it available to stream?
The ultimate edition was on the 4k disc. The blu-ray in the same package was just the theatrical cut (at least in the USA). The digital redeem codes unlocked both versions on VUDU iirc. If you can’t find an ultimate edition 4k disc in your area, maybe try iTunes or vudu for streaming. I genuinely don’t know what is available if you didn’t buy the disc.
 

NoamL

Winter <3
I don't understand why people aren't sick of superhero movies already.

Judas f'kin Priest, it's been years and years of this stuff. Same music (ok, debatable... but always BIG), same stories, same drama, same FX, same 'I'm a common man, but still a superhero', same bullshit.

Yeah yeah, I know there is Marvel vs DC, but really it's the same stories with different heroes.

This stuff still sells? Good grief, humanity must be desperate.
Well, here's a big theory-dump... ;) IMO "superheroes" are just the wrapper for spectacle movies. Wondering when people are gonna be tired of superheroes is like people in the 50s wondering when moviegoers will finally be sick of Biblical epics. Plenty of the audience for those films were not going just because of the content but because that was the most spectacular thing you could see on screen ("Cast of Thousands" etc). Just like they liked cowboy movies in the 60s and disaster movies in the 70s.

When movies can animate any element you want photorealistically into real life, or vice versa, then you essentially have erased the lines between film and animation. After the first-gen experiments with this in the 90s and early 00s, Avatar and Transformers really blew it open. As soon as we reached a world where the studio doesn't have to carefully husband the CGI's time on screen because of budget reasons or because of scenarios where it would pop out as fake, then superheroes had a big competitive advantage over monster movies like Kong Skull Island (or Transformers if you see it as a sort of monster movie). Instead of a movie where you spend 1/3rd of the time with the CGI and 2/3rds of the time with a cast of human characters talking into their walkie-talkies about what the CGI will do next, you can just have a story with a protagonist who turns into CGI whenever the story needs.

That's why the two Marvel movies people like the least are: Thor 2 with the very Godzilla-esque tag-along cast of normal and boring human characters; and Iron Man 3 where he has to solve problems without his suit (although I liked that movie).

And on the flip-side this is also why Marvel was able to launch their cinematic universe with the supposed "D-list" character of Iron Man, and why they weren't really taking as much of a risk as people thought at the time with movies like Guardians and Dr. Strange and Ant-Man. As long as you put original and exciting spectacle in the movie, you're keeping the main element that is actually attracting audiences. Same reason why DC had a huge success with a movie starring supposedly the least liked character in their main lineup with Aquaman.

Anyway I legitimately think Zack Snyder doesn't understand this. I don't think he gets that superheroes are just a convenient vehicle to have an animated bash-up spectacle-em-up on screen. I believe he thinks these movies mean the dorks have inherited the earth and comic books are cool now. And yeah, that's true to the extent that people like JJ Abrams, Zack Snyder and Joss Whedon get to make big movies. But it's not true that people are going to see these movies because they love the "iconic" or "forever" version of these characters. Just poll a random group of people on the street and ask them if Iron Man is dead or alive. He's perfectly alive in the comics.... just like Batman didn't die or retire just because the Dark Knight Rises version of him did so... but in this case, very unlike Batman, the appeal is the specific incarnation of the character. What's interesting is that despite the "cosmic" stakes of the godlike characters of DC, right now Marvel has higher stakes! people actually cared more if Captain America or Iron Man would die in Endgame than they cared if Batman dies in any movie, ever. Maybe Marvel will eventually ruin this with reincarnations of their characters, but I doubt they will.

And this is why DC isn't getting as many people as Marvel. Leaving aside Aquaman, the DC version of a spectacle movie actually isn't as spectacular as a Marvel film. It's people getting thrown back-first horizontally through concrete for forty minutes. Just look at the big statue fight in Justice League where Superman fights the other heroes. It's a snoozefest, literally half the moves in the fight are people getting punched [quick cut] reaction shot of them flying 40 feet and making a little concrete crater when they land. Just the fight between Iron Man & Hulk in Age Of Ultron (which was a mediocre Marvel movie!) has more creativity and real spectacle than all of DC. A lot of which comes from the carefully planned transition of the action sequence through a bunch of different settings and locations which create "mini stories" inside the action sequence like Iron Man trying to save the elevator full of people. DC mostly lacks this.
 
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chillbot

Sock Muppet
Wow gnnoamers with some insight! I think your post is spot-on aside from this:

When movies can animate any element you want photorealistically into real life, or vice versa, then you essentially have erased the lines between film and animation.
Hasn't happened yet, not for me anyway. (EDIT: I have no doubt that it will, eventually. When we are as far into the future as we are now from Jar Jar...)
 

NoamL

Winter <3
As one more thought on the end of this huge theory post, this is also why "Marvel Humor" is an essential part of the formula. No matter how much people hate it, "Marvel Humor" is a sort of bubble-poping tension-release mechanism for the normal people in the audience. Part of your brain wants to indulge in goofy popcorn action and part of your brain worries that you're a dork for seeing "Iron Man 3" alone on a Tuesday night. When the movie makes fun of itself in a wry and self aware way then it kind of beats to the punch any anxiety and self-consciousness the audience may be having about watching 90 minutes of a guy in a robot suit punching people who breathe fire. This is different from DC who very very much wants you to be "into" Batman for the sake of Batman (and more so in Snyder films, where Snyder wants you to unironically admire the Jesus symbolism of Superman). Anyway as Marvel became more and more cool and mainstream-accepted this is also why the humor went down a bit as they went from the Whedon era of films into the Russo era; it wasn't needed as much.
 

kmaster

Sleepy Member
Anyway as Marvel became more and more cool and mainstream-accepted this is also why the humor went down a bit as they went from the Whedon era of films into the Russo era; it wasn't needed as much.
Interesting thought. I've always thought that the earlier films were *trying* to be funny (and sometimes were successful, even) and the later films (and WV!) *are actually* funny.
 
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