Is it legal to release or sell samples made using VSTs you bought?

iobaaboi

Member
Depends on the EULA of each instrument.

The general rule of thumb would be that is not permitted if the instrument is sample-based but permitted if the instrument is DSP.

For example: with Omnisphere, you can create and sell your own samples/sfx using the “synth” oscillators but not the “sample” oscillators.

Re-sampling samples leads to what they call a “derivative work”. The fact that samples are sound recordings means they are governed by a different set of copyright laws than something that is code-only (IP law).
 

gsilbers

Part of Pulsesetter-Sounds.com
Grey area.

You are not allowed to use a dev's sample content to make another sample library - I think that's clear to everyone.

But a Splice pack? I am sure the devs would all argue no, but is it really no?

You are allowed to use a dev's sample content to make a musical composition, that can be sold to a TV Production Co., to an ad agency, to a film maker, etc. But you are disallowed from selling that musical composition to another composer? Not sure how much sense that makes, or if that's even legal.

you mean loop libraries. splice is just a random company like thousands out there like big fish etc. that sell loops to musicians/composers/producers.

and no, its not a grey area. its very clear cut in all EULAS. You cannot sell sample libraries, loops, sound design whatever anyone wants to call it...using content from sample libraries and loops libraries, or stuff that you didn't record yourself. (or hired someone to record)

The EULA for sample libraries and loops libraries is to make music, not loops, not splice stuff or music related stuff that will be used for other composers to make music. the idea is that the samples are for the end user: the composer/music maker.
not a competing company/person making a product for other composers/musicans/remixer etc.
the term is derivative work in some EULAS.

Extremely clear cut and no grey area at all.
 
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gsilbers

Part of Pulsesetter-Sounds.com
This is certainly admirable to see from a company, and I admit I'm more likely to spend money on VSL than other companies because of it. Just so I'm not mistaken, does "music library" mean the same thing as "sample library"? As in, recording VSL sounds, exporting it to a synthesizer and making unique tones from it?

the only company that doesn't allow music libraries is big fish a while ago. all other sound ware companies have no issues. literally all.
and big fish released a statements saying its ok to use the loops in music libraries as long as its not the demo track.

the idea behind it is because it seems a lot of people where just grabbing the demo recording, changing the name and submitting it to 20 music libraries.
so big fish said no music libraries unless you have a specific license... which everyone got pissed about so big fish decided to not be so hard and allow for music libraries but not use the demo or recreate the demo track.

but all of this is about loops. not multisample libraries like spitfire etc. everything multisample is ok to use for music libraries but not competition loops or sample libraries.
or normally called derivatives.
 

gsilbers

Part of Pulsesetter-Sounds.com
Thanks. On the musical context part, does that mean it has to be part of a composition or musical phrase? Because a sound library would be more about a unique synth preset, that users could compose music with. The sound preset could be considered musical, but it's more of an instrument.
I personally think there should not be a problem. specially since every company is releasing its own sample library player that has a lot of parameters.
kinda like Omnisphere that so many out there make presets for.
 

Bman70

Membery Member
I personally think there should not be a problem. specially since every company is releasing its own sample library player that has a lot of parameters.
kinda like Omnisphere that so many out there make presets for.
Right so there's a distinction between "music libraries" and "sound (sample) libraries," I was a little confused since Ben shared VSL's quote:

Can I use these samples to make "Music Libraries"?
YES, unlike some soundware companies, this is fully allowed with all of our products. The sounds have to be used within a musical context, however, and cannot be presented isolated or "solo'ed".


"Make music libraries" doesn't seem to mean submitting to libraries like Audiojungle; submitting doesn't involve 'making' a library. I took it to mean making sound libraries, as in a VI pack of pads, textures, etc.
I'm still not sure if VSL's reply is merely saying it's OK to submit your composition to music libraries, of course that's permitted by any VI company. I wrote to their customer service, and the reply was that derivative samples / sound libraries cannot be sold. So you can't tweak some VSL sounds in Omnisphere and then sell it as a sound library.

The OP was asking about loops though. If you compose a musical loop using your licensed Spitfire instrument, then you're allowed to sell that since it's a short composition... Like a 'sting' or 'bumper' composition which is several seconds long. The loop can't be just an unchanged portion of a Spitfire sound though, it has to be something you wrote that's unique.

p.s. Omnisphere presets can be sold since you're not selling a competing instrument, the buyer has to own Omnisphere and you're simply helping them use it.
 

tiago

Active Member
The OP was asking about loops though. If you compose a musical loop using your licensed Spitfire instrument, then you're allowed to sell that since it's a short composition... Like a 'sting' or 'bumper' composition which is several seconds long. The loop can't be just an unchanged portion of a Spitfire sound though, it has to be something you wrote that's unique.
I do remember in a quite older thread someone stating that it was not possible to sell loops using Spitfire products. It had something to do with someone having done that on Splice and that it was doing it illegally...
Nonetheless I am very curious about the possibility of using Vienna to produce commercial loops. I don't own any VSL stuff yet and rarely go out of the Kontakt sphere, but I would probably end up buying VSL products if there was confirmation about the legality of loop-making with it.
Maybe someone from the VSL staff can give a clear opinion on this?
 
I had understood that sample libraries were a no-no, but as a hobbiest I never even thought about selling stuff for licensing for jingles, etc. Is there a thread anywhere that someone could point me to about getting started with stuff like that? Is there any particular company out there that is more reputable to deal with than others? I would want to keep everything completely aboveboard, so something that would be considered legally OK for musical compositions that include VSTs.

Sorry to hijack your thread! I hope you don’t mind me asking here.
 

robgb

I was young once
What is a loop if not a very short, repeating musical composition? And if that's true, why are loops made with sample libraries verboten?
 

d.healey

Senior Member
What is a loop if not a very short, repeating musical composition? And if that's true, why are loops made with sample libraries verboten?
Context is also important, is a loop meant to be a final standalone piece of music or is it a building block of a larger piece?