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Embertone Releases: Walker 1955 Steinway 'D'

Is it possible to simple have the release decay triggered by CC?

Using the down-pedal only samples, wouldn't this sound perfectly real? Can't we do this by just going into the 'wrench' icon section? Full pedal is just an infinite release and half is just... longer release, no?
 
Most probably, yes -
but that doesn´t mean hat it will be availlable in the foreseeable future :whistling:...
So if you like "as it is", buy it. If not - don´t buy it, it´s as simple as that...

The problem is, you can never know how "it is" without buying it.

Harmaes, with the current issues, I will advice you absolutely not to buy the Walker.
The problem is not only half-pedaling but also pedaling issues in general which makes the piano absolutely unusable, atleast for classical repertoire. I have other piano's without half pedaling with better pedaling behaviour.
However, I think the issue is a hit-and-miss one, as I can not believe that people are enthousiastic about this piano if they have the issues I am experiencing (and multiple other users with me).
Maybe it has to do something with the controller/piano one is using, the repertoire one is playing, if someone is playing 'live' or using it in mixes, I don't know.
 
Maybe it is more clear with an example. I just recorded a small excerpt of a Nocturne of Chopin in which pedaling is quite essential. Garritan CFX versus Embertone Walker D. To even things out I disabled half-pedaling in the CFX.

Links on Soundcloud:
Garritan CFX
Embertone Walker D
Please beware, I have not set up the Embertone for the best musical output / dynamics etc. And also not my own best musical output but whatever, this is just a quick comparison for pedaling behaviour. ;)

There are obvious flaws in the Embertone where the pedal suddenly 'disappears' / does not catch properly.
 
Maybe it is more clear with an example. I just recorded a small excerpt of a Nocturne of Chopin in which pedaling is quite essential. Garritan CFX versus Embertone Walker D. To even things out I disabled half-pedaling in the CFX.

Links on Soundcloud:
Garritan CFX
Embertone Walker D
Please beware, I have not set up the Embertone for the best musical output / dynamics etc. And also not my own best musical output but whatever, this is just a quick comparison for pedaling behaviour. ;)

There are obvious flaws in the Embertone where the pedal suddenly 'disappears' / does not catch properly.

I have the Walker and the CFX, and, like you, I love my half pedaling (and the CFX in general). I think the problem with the pedal not “catching” occurs because a piano VI has been set up to require a relatively high controller 64 value and/or deep pedal depression to toggle the sustain on. When I analyze the MIDI of my piano tracks with missed sustains, I can see this every time and easily remedy it by shifting the sustain controller curve data that came too late to the left so that the “on” value comes early enough for the VI. Not that that’s a workable solution, but it does suggest a programming solution. Interestingly, while the Walker is very unforgiving this way — especially, perhaps, for pianists who have been spoiled by the ability to trigger a touch of sustain with any amount of pedal, so no need to use your foot like a plunger every time you want to refresh the sustain — some other sampled pianos without half pedal can be much more tolerant of a light pedal touch (including, judging by your example, the CFX when it’s not in half pedal mode), presumably because they’re programmed to turn the sustain on with a lighter application of pedal.
 
...
... the pedal suddenly 'disappears' / does not catch properly.

Yes! It has nothing to do with your controller or anything. As soon as the harmony gets thicker, notes -in particular low notes- get cut off or completely drop out. I reported the issue couple of months ago.
The library itself sounds great and I love the interface. This is the only problem that I noticed.
 
...When I analyze the MIDI of my piano tracks with missed sustains, I can see this every time and easily remedy it by shifting the sustain controller curve data that came too late to the left so that the “on” value comes early enough for the VI. ...

I can confirm this is not what's causing the cut off and drop outs. I did a number of tests. I even drew the sustain manually with pencil tool on problematic notes to make sure. Hopefully this will be addressed in the update as it's a great piano otherwise.
 
I can confirm this is not what's causing the cut off and drop outs. I did a number of tests. I even drew the sustain manually with pencil tool on problematic notes to make sure. Hopefully this will be addressed in the update as it's a great piano otherwise.

Then my bad. I thought I'd done that trick with Walker tracks, too, but it's been quite some time since I recorded anything with it.
 
I have the Walker and the CFX, and, like you, I love my half pedaling (and the CFX in general)....

Another angle is, if you don't use a lot of sustain pedal, the problem on the Walker is less of a drawback. But it is one, for sure!
 
The reason for the abrupt cutoff is due to the programming. The sustain notes do not transition properly to the release samples with the note off signal. This library is a mess in terms of programming, partly because the dev created separate groups of six velocity layers to allow users to select the number of velocity layers they wanted to use. Normally you put all the velocity layers in a single map. Then, just create a lite version as a separate nki. Also, repedalling is poorly scripted and is hit and miss whether it catches or not and tends to unnaturally swell in. Some conditions have two key off sounds. People may like the overall sound of the library, but it needs a lot of improvement in terms of programming.
 
The reason for the abrupt cutoff is due to the programming. The sustain notes do not transition properly to the release samples with the note off signal. This library is a mess in terms of programming, partly because the dev created separate groups of six velocity layers to allow users to select the number of velocity layers they wanted to use. Normally you put all the velocity layers in a single map. Then, just create a lite version as a separate nki. Also, repedalling is poorly scripted and is hit and miss whether it catches or not and tends to unnaturally swell in. Some conditions have two key off sounds. People may like the overall sound of the library, but it needs a lot of improvement in terms of programming.

That very well may explain the delay.
 
There are obvious flaws in the Embertone where the pedal suddenly 'disappears' / does not catch properly.
Your example is exactly my experience playing the Walker, and not even just with this type of classical music. I'm afraid I haven't touched it since my post 7 months ago for this reason. Eagerly anticipating the update when it's released in 2035.

On a more positive note, I'm struck by how much more I like the sound of the Walker compared to the CFX in your example.
 
Yes, an update about the update would be nice. I have problems with the sustain pedal, and I love the sound and the feel of this piano.
 
Not that it helps any but checking out their twitter account they responded to someone on Jan 2
Hey Mac,
We’re sorry for the delay for the half pedaling update, but it will be coming soon! We appreciate your patience.
So at least a response this year, though coming soon doesn't give any idea of what their idea of soon is.

I'm just starting out and picked up their library as I liked the sounds from the demos I watched and the price of the library seemed reasonable for what you get. It sounds funny but I'm thankful that I'm not experienced enough to have had this issue impact me, so in my case I only hope the release the update before it does.
 
Not that it helps any but checking out their twitter account they responded to someone on Jan 2

So at least a response this year, though coming soon doesn't give any idea of what their idea of soon is.

I'm just starting out and picked up their library as I liked the sounds from the demos I watched and the price of the library seemed reasonable for what you get. It sounds funny but I'm thankful that I'm not experienced enough to have had this issue impact me, so in my case I only hope the release the update before it does.
I hope that update doesn`t mean only half pedal patch. There is more to fix. We already discuss about it. I don`t know why is so hard to respond to users. What if product will need more updates after this one ? Whenever I go to VSL forum I see that VSL team respond on daily basis and from the moment they release VSL CFX and Steinway they update their product at least 20 times to fulfill all wishes from users. Yeah, I know that also cost three times more. Too bad I like the sound of Embertone more than VSL pianos. But Embertone must work hard to arrive at least close to their playability.
 
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