Cheesegrater mac is back!

Dewdman42

Senior Member
^ That assumes the beta compatibility list is the same as the release one will be.

I'm not going to put the next macOS on my 5,1 anyway, because it doesn't support 32-bit programs. Too expensive to update them all, and not worth it.

But with iPhones it's different, because most server-based apps (my bank, DirecTV, etc.) require constant updates to work, and they often break when you don't have the latest iOS. You can't just freeze the system, or create different startup partitions with older OS versions.
definitely some folks are hoping that the final release will allow the 5,1. But I think that is highly unlikely. Official statements have been made about it. I don't think Apple will back away from this, but I hope I'm wrong!

I also don't plan to update past Mojave either. At least any time soon. I have some apps that I like using which are a bit obscure and may NEVER get to 64bit frankly. Eventually though, it will come down to whether I want the latest LogicPro update or not..and I will have to update my OS version to get it. That will be the moment of truth.
 

azeteg

Active Member
I've also noticed that LPX has issues with dense midi through a channel. You won't necessarily see the CPU meters max out, but you'll get dropped events. Would a faster CPU help? Not sure since I don't have one to compare. Logic may have architectural issues in that area frankly.
Last time I checked into this, there was a limit of 127 events per buffer and track in Logic. Perhaps you're running into this?
 

Dewdman42

Senior Member
Where do you get your information about 127 events per buffer? I hrard similar rumors. I also hear a rumor it was increased to a much larger value. But anyway midi can be subject to dropouts just like audio if the cpu can’t keep up
 

azeteg

Active Member
Where do you get your information about 127 events per buffer? I hrard similar rumors. I also hear a rumor it was increased to a much larger value. But anyway midi can be subject to dropouts just like audio if the cpu can’t keep up
I tested it, filed an Apple bug report and also confirmed it with Apple engineers. They ended up adding a workaround to increase the buffer for VEPro plug-ins. (Since we use more MIDI ports, the number of MIDI events can really add up).

I recall something about the buffer being increased in general with some revision, but I haven't tested this yet.
 
OP
gsilbers

gsilbers

Part of Pulsesetter-Sounds.com
^ That assumes the beta compatibility list is the same as the release one will be.

I'm not going to put the next macOS on my 5,1 anyway, because it doesn't support 32-bit programs. Too expensive to update them all, and not worth it.

But with iPhones it's different, because most server-based apps (my bank, DirecTV, etc.) require constant updates to work, and they often break when you don't have the latest iOS. You can't just freeze the system, or create different startup partitions with older OS versions.
i lost my Soul Calibur game on one of the iOs updates... im still very resentfull about it
 

Nick Batzdorf

Moderator
Moderator
i lost my Soul Calibur game on one of the iOs updates... im still very resentfull about it
The one that I resent is DirecTV requiring an update that didn't support the original iPad I'd bought brand new at full price in the Apple Store only six months before.

As I said, with desktop/laptop computers the old saw about your not being forced to update is true - you just freeze your system and everything still works. Not true with apps that talk to a server.
 

fiction

Member
So, production finally started and I’m thinking about getting one. I can’t really go back to windows after so many years working with macOS and the new Mac mini doesn’t seem like a future-proof option to me.. is anyone considering upgrading to this machine also?

I’m wondering what CPU model will be best for Logic Pro/pro tools. I have no experience with Xeon processors but I see many studios using the iMac pro with great success. I'm wondering the difference between the 8/12 core versions in terms of performance...
 

Prockamanisc

Senior Member
Think long-game. This computer is an investment for at least 5-8 years, hopefully more like 10. By the time it's been 10 years, many more processors will be coming out that we can put into this machine, and off the shelf, they'll cost something like 70% of what Apple would charge us for them. So assume that in 2027 you'll buy a 48-core processor for like $3K. What will hold you over until then?

If you buy an 8-core, and then spend $1K on a 12-core in 2 years, then $2K on a 24-core, then that's $3K right there. I would put those future spendings into your first purchase, and just own the results for the next 5 years, and be content that you have a beast.

So I would push the limits as far as processors are concerned. I'm waiting to see the prices on all of them, but I'll likely go up to the 16-core. I think that will be a good compromise between cores and clock speed.
 

Patrick9152

France
Mmm, I do not want to criticize Apple, because they produce beautiful machines reliable and friendly, and that last a long time.
But I think that if Steve Jobs was still in this world, he might not accept the path that Apple has taken for some time.
Apple has always priced quite high (even if they give a lot of satisfaction too), but here I think the designers were pleased, because this new MacPro is surely a great machine, but who can buy it, because with the essential options, it will far exceed $ 15,000 and more, so apart from the big structures or the few artists who manage to live comfortably their music .... and they are not so many, but I may be wrong ?.
They have already set the bar very high with the IMac Pro, which with a minimum of options (Indispensables) go up to more than 6000/7000 $, but there ...
I think that old models still have a bright future ahead of them, and my faithful IMac too, unless he lets me go!.
The worst thing is that I will not be able to do without osx and Logic x, I already thought about going back into the world of pc, but no, now it's too late, I became addict, Apple me holds chained !. :sad:

PS: Maybe an Imac Pro, but I will not be able to buy more, unless I find oil digging in my garden.:)
 
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OP
gsilbers

gsilbers

Part of Pulsesetter-Sounds.com
Mmm, I do not want to criticize Apple, because they produce beautiful machines reliable and friendly, and that last a long time.
But I think that if Steve Jobs was still in this world, he might not accept the path that Apple has taken for some time.
Apple has always priced quite high (even if they give a lot of satisfaction too), but here I think the designers were pleased, because this new MacPro is surely a great machine, but who can buy it, because with the essential options, it will far exceed $ 15,000 and more, so apart from the big structures or the few artists who manage to live comfortably their music .... and they are not so many, but I may be wrong ?.
They have already set the bar very high with the IMac Pro, which with a minimum of options (Indispensables) go up to more than 6000/7000 $, but there ...
I think that old models still have a bright future ahead of them, and my faithful IMac too, unless he lets me go!.
The worst thing is that I will not be able to do without osx and Logic x, I already thought about going back into the world of pc, but no, now it's too late, I became addict, Apple me holds chained !. :sad:

PS: Maybe an Imac Pro, but I will not be able to buy more, unless I find oil digging in my
Mmm, I do not want to criticize Apple, because they produce beautiful machines reliable and friendly, and that last a long time.
But I think that if Steve Jobs was still in this world, he might not accept the path that Apple has taken for some time.
Apple has always priced quite high (even if they give a lot of satisfaction too), but here I think the designers were pleased, because this new MacPro is surely a great machine, but who can buy it, because with the essential options, it will far exceed $ 15,000 and more, so apart from the big structures or the few artists who manage to live comfortably their music .... and they are not so many, but I may be wrong ?.
They have already set the bar very high with the IMac Pro, which with a minimum of options (Indispensables) go up to more than 6000/7000 $, but there ...
I think that old models still have a bright future ahead of them, and my faithful IMac too, unless he lets me go!.
The worst thing is that I will not be able to do without osx and Logic x, I already thought about going back into the world of pc, but no, now it's too late, I became addict, Apple me holds chained !. :sad:

PS: Maybe an Imac Pro, but I will not be able to buy more, unless I find oil digging in my garden.:)
garden.:)
who can buy?

the answer lies in the big picture. They are getting into services. They are getting into televisión filmaking. They have the number one file deliverable for big entertainment studios which’s is also the same file sent to broadcasters around the world.
Who can buy it? Well, the same guys buying hp z series which costs about the same or more with Xeon processors. Who are editing in avid the top shows.
who can buy it? Every technicolor /deluxe studio that have to make a gazillion files using really expensive encoder machine from digital rapids and amberfin. And they use monitors way more expensive than what they have. And the studio I worked at bought 30 older Mac Pros when they announced the non pcie trashcan. Yep 30 at once to have it because that’s what they used and kept using for 10 years later. $6k-10k is basically about two movie files or about 4 tv episodes In that world and that’s just one day worth of work!
Why sell to those guys? If you see Micheal bay using it then every tv producer will use it. And every studio in Los Angeles will use it and every mastering video studio will use it and ripple into Europe’s high end market. see junkie xl using it loading 265gb of sample in ram then every tv composer will use it.
So this is not for the gaming crowd and guys who buy a bunch of components and make their own big rig. It’s not for composers fretting for budgets and prices. But having pro tools hd and load all that session shown in the keynote is enough for most stages in LA to buy it with the top specs.
we see it from our point of view... sometimes we forgot how massive other industries are. We are way more than comfortable with one of those iMacs and even the new MacBook Pro which already blows my macpro 2009 out the water.
We wish these where less expensive but keep in mind that I have my Mac Pro for over a decade and paid the same. So if you are making money out of your computer, paying $6k with $150 a month payments that’ll take 3-6 years to pay depending on the situation, then it’s not that much. Some cable bills are about that price ;)
 

Wunderhorn

Active Member
If what you are doing is sit in front of a computer and making money with it all this discussion is futile. Get the best you can possibly afford and let it work FOR you. Some people may think their car is more important but consider where you spend most of your time!
 

Wolfie2112

Senior Member
If what you are doing is sit in front of a computer and making money with it all this discussion is futile. Get the best you can possibly afford and let it work FOR you. Some people may think their car is more important but consider where you spend most of your time!
That's right. Many people finance a $40K new car that depreciates like crazy. If I spend (of finance) a $7K MacPro that earns me, say, $10K in the first year of owning it....it already paid for itself and owes me nothing.
 

Wunderhorn

Active Member
That's right. Many people finance a $40K new car that depreciates like crazy. If I spend (of finance) a $7K MacPro that earns me, say, $10K in the first year of owning it....it already paid for itself and owes me nothing.
Exactly. Even if I have to take out a loan at the moment, I will get a new Mac Pro. It makes me money every month and since I sit in front of it all day long I am just worth it... plus, in comparison all these iMacs etc are aging so badly... a cheesegrater lasts so much longer with all the expandability
 

Dewdman42

Senior Member
Like the video post by JEPA above, I will absolutely not be buying one of the new macpros as currently priced. The words "don't be a schmuck", come to mind. Apple is out of their mind. We shall see how many working pros fork over the money. Some of you seem to be able to justify the price, but I most definitely cannot, and just like stated in that video, if it comes down to it I will switch to PC...(or perhaps Hackintosh for a while).

It is true that a lot of us lose more per year on our car's depreciation then the cost of that new MacPro, but still its just too out of line with the rest of the market. I do think there are many pros that will justify this expenditure. I think there are many others that will switch to PC to continue or make due with minis and iMacs.

As always, Apple is doing something a bit controversial and we shall see how it shakes out.
 
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Prockamanisc

Senior Member
Like the video post by JEPA above, I will absolutely not be buying one of the new macpros as currently priced. The words "don't be a schmuck", come to mind. Apple is out of their mind. We shall see how many working pros fork over the money. Some of you seem to be able to justify the price, but I most definitely cannot, and just like stated in that video, if it comes down to it I will switch to PC...(or perhaps Hackintosh for a while).

It is true that a lot of us lose more per year on our car's depreciation then the cost of that new MacPro, but still its just too out of line with the rest of the market. I do think there are many pros that will justify this expenditure. I think there are many others that will switch to PC to continue to make due with minis and iMacs.

As always, Apple is doing something a bit controversial and we shall see how it shakes out.
This was my exact attitude when the last Mac Pro came out. "Eff them, they're screwing me on price". So I ended up spending an equivalent amount of money on a PC and ended up hating it and selling it, and buying a Mac Pro anyway. This time I'm going to just suck it up, pay the extra $1000 above what I was hoping to spend, and thoroughly, thoroughly enjoy my computer for years and years and years.