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Announcing: LA Modern Percussion - Recorded & Mixed By Alan Meyerson At Warner Bros Eastwood Stage

NoamL

Winter <3
Just to avoid confusion. There are "traditional" RR patches for the following drum ensembles; in each case, this is in addition to a Dynamics Hit patch.
  • Bass Drum Ensemble
  • Daiko Ensemble
  • Shaker Ensemble
  • Taiko Ensemble
  • Taiko Soloist #1
  • Toms Ensemble
  • Toms Ensemble played with Puilli Sticks
  • Tom Soloist #1
for many of these to be honest I don't feel there's a big difference between playing the RR or the DH patches. They both sound great. The one instrument where the RR have been indispensable so far is the shakers. ;)
 

axb312

Senior Member
I mean, the patch list, as well as video walk through explicitly stating there were no RR, but instead more dynamic layers was available... The choice to do it this way sounds like it might very well have came out of Alan's own mouth, referencing the headache of mixing something with inconsistent hits. Infact I know damn well with live recordings even - performances are often times copy + pasted. have a massive flam hit at the start of the measure? copy the stronger hit and paste it over the others... This is quite common. When you hear triple platinum pop productions - you're literally listening to the same hook pieced together from all the best takes. Even if it repeats 20 times in the song, there is no "round robin". Drums in particular for decades and decades were often times samples with 0 round robin. Often layered over real drums arguably, but still. There are plenty of demos on the website, all of which sound exquisite - So ask yourself what you're doing differently, or why you're going to buy a product that gave you every piece of information you don't like about it before you bought it.


I get buyers remorse is an issue - but not having RR or snares was NOT something that's a surprise... it's mentioned directly in the walkthrough, with an explaination of why they made that choice. It's not like they swept it under the rug and hoped to trick you into buying it... So why get outraged?

If I had sold any of my libraries I have listed in classifieds I'd probably have picked this up(even though I don't need it at all) just because it's sonically impressive.
I agree it is sonically impressive. This also makes it more disappointing.

I don't think any high end drum libs today are sampled with round robins.

Yes, I did see the patch list and walk through but these did not confirm or deny expectations.

So we (or I) am used to making beats a certain way and those don't sound so great with this lib.

Question is when you have a great environment and possibly the greatest score mixer, why not make full use of it?
 

ProfoundSilence

Senior Member
I agree it is sonically impressive. This also makes it more disappointing.

I don't think any high end drum libs today are sampled with round robins.

Yes, I did see the patch list and walk through but these did not confirm or deny expectations.

So we (or I) am used to making beats a certain way and those don't sound so great with this lib.

Question is when you have a great environment and possibly the greatest score mixer, why not make full use of it?
well you're also paying these people, which happens to be a great environment($$$$$) and possible the greatest score mixer($$$$$) and when the greatest mixer makes a suggestion on how he wants to do it - you generally listen.

The walkthroughs and patch list tell you both of your biggest issues, did you not pay attention to them? I feel like I shouldn't have to pull the video up, but as someone who had no plan to buy the product I still remembered that part because I thought it was a pretty stand out design choice. I also spent time in this thread correcting the dummies who kept saying this was a comprehensive library - because it's very clearly not a complete solution for percussion, and yet some people who dont read patch lists just assume instead? If you listened to them instead of reading the patch list, again - that's on you.

I probably wont buy the new spitfire organ(despite the fact that it sounds awesome) because it doesnt have individual stops sampled. I'm not a magician or anything - I just read the patch list and notice what I want in the library isnt there.
 

axb312

Senior Member
well you're also paying these people, which happens to be a great environment($$$$$) and possible the greatest score mixer($$$$$) and when the greatest mixer makes a suggestion on how he wants to do it - you generally listen.

The walkthroughs and patch list tell you both of your biggest issues, did you not pay attention to them? I feel like I shouldn't have to pull the video up, but as someone who had no plan to buy the product I still remembered that part because I thought it was a pretty stand out design choice. I also spent time in this thread correcting the dummies who kept saying this was a comprehensive library - because it's very clearly not a complete solution for percussion, and yet some people who dont read patch lists just assume instead? If you listened to them instead of reading the patch list, again - that's on you.

I probably wont buy the new spitfire organ(despite the fact that it sounds awesome) because it doesnt have individual stops sampled. I'm not a magician or anything - I just read the patch list and notice what I want in the library isnt there.
Yes, you are right.
 

DarkestShadow

Senior Member
It looks like I may be out due to the lack of round robin thing... I was first like: "This is the best drum library ever" but based on what I'm hearing in Daniel James' video now I hear waaaay too much machine gunning. The explanation doesn't work for me, since you can just pay attention on how the hits sound like while recording and discard somewhat weaker or "flammier" ones.
Although I realize there are RR patches as well, but not for all instruments as it seems.
I hope Daniel goes through them as well, only could watch half of the stream - continue later.
Or perhaps it's in the Walkthrough video and I forgot...
 

babylonwaves

Senior Member
i wonder if @Audio Ollie would be able to provide an alternative set of kontakt patches which show off the library a bit more. for instance, I'd love to see EQ/compressor settings made by Alan. from what I remember they said in one of the videos that the didn't want to bake in EQ/Sat etc because they want things as flexible as possible. that's certainly true. Nevertheless I feel that the first impression you get would be a different one if a beefed up version of the standard patches would be available. The multis are great but IMO those serve a different purpose.
 

zimm83

Senior Member
I love this library so much.
As for round robins, there are in the principal patches .
For the others, you have on the high octaves the dynamic velocity switch mode. I use this and it sounds very good as it has so many velocity layer samples on one key.
No gun effect.
Then you have the jxl mode spread across octaves. One dyn per key. So you have to play a différent key each time. No problem. This mode is made for that.
Then you have the fills.Great.
Then you have the impros...oh god... excellent
And the best : the multis.!!!
Nothing to say : Fantastic....
And ....one more : the sound design . ..Just try the alt_rough ....bladerunner 2042...
That's it.
Great library....takes time to discover.
But best ever .
 

DANIELE

Active Member
Is there something truly special that makes this library a must buy? I don't understand if I need it or not...
 

Manaberry

Active Member
Is there something truly special that makes this library a must buy? I don't understand if I need it or not...

- Recorded in Burbank, at a scoring stage that brings another sound to the percussion: sounds warmer than AIR (no reverb bleeding in the close mics)
- Velocity across the keyboard keys
- LOT of mics (for someone like me who loves tweaking everything, it's perfect)
- Built-in - easy to use - transient, compressor, modulation
- Align and Note Int
- Mixing preset export/import
- Oh and... Alan Meyerson input.


You should check the walkthrough video.
To me, this library is more shaped for modern scoring. It's more accurate, punchy.
 
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Jack Weaver

Senior Member
totally agree that this library is incomplete and should be upgraded !
Hey In.sight,

I can't help but notice that you only joined here 10 days ago and that pretty much every post is an attempted putdown of any percussion library that's not Toontracks SDX Orchestral perc - on this and other threads.

Is there some agenda going on?

Perhaps you might want to go off and enjoy that other library since you have said that pretty much every instrument that's in that library is the very best. No sense in you looking for anything beyond that.

.
 

axb312

Senior Member
You can at any time become a developer and create libraries how you think they should be done. If you think this one is incomplete, you can simply not buy. Kinda funny you telling Alan Meyerson how to make a percussion library...
Can't a customer tell a supplier how he/ she wants something or provide feedback?
 

axb312

Senior Member
If a library contains everything that the developer intended it to contain, how can it be "incomplete"? Just because you had expectations otherwise? This is silly. Don't buy it then.
No. Incomplete because it is lacking a little (imo) of what it needs to fulfill it's function.

Donno why so many people attack critics of devs on here. If the dev listens and acts, we all benefit. If you keep attacking me, well, not much happens....

Anyway, I've gone as far as I can with trying to express myself on this here. Daniel James, who makes a lot of cinematic music, did apparently point out the lack of RR issue to them during beta testing. Good to know nothing was done with his feedback either.
 

ProfoundSilence

Senior Member
No. Incomplete because it is lacking a little (imo) of what it needs to fulfill it's function.

Donno why so many people attack critics of devs on here. If the dev listens and acts, we all benefit. If you keep attacking me, well, not much happens....

Anyway, I've gone as far as I can with trying to express myself on this here. Daniel James, who makes a lot of cinematic music, did apparently point out the lack of RR issue to them during beta testing. Good to know nothing was done with his feedback either.
If im choosing between Daniel James and Alan Myerson on this - I'd like to think Myerson has the edge here, although Daniel does use vsti more - I'm sure Daniel agrees that there might very well be a method to the madness. It's such a specific/intentional thing to have 0 round robins, as literally hitting the drum 1 more time would provide little to no recording time + editing ect. Keep in mind, Ollie literally sampled synths in a room, with room mics - that's how intentional his work is.

That said, in this case - it sounds like you must intentionally decide excactly where the heaviest beat is - with purpose. If I absolutely had to recreate round robins - I'd either 1.) layer it with another library or 2.) use a midi channel round robin plugin, create a 2nd output, and run that output through a doubler with 0% dry signal. 3.) create 2 more instances of the instrument, use time machine to shorten one slightly, pitch it slightly down + add an EQ with a dip and a boost somewhere other than the fundamental+attack maybe adjust the asdr a little. 2nd one lengthened, the tail reduced with asdr a little to bring it back closer to the original duration - pitched slightly up, and an EQ with boost + dip in a similar area but reversed.

again, using a midi plugin that sent each midi note round robin between ch 1-3. Might be convoluted, but if you're going to bypass AM's design, you'll have to work for it.

Plus, the idea that you feel attacked is seems to be based on the fact that you think we're standing up for the developer's idea, rather than you had ample information - and bought it despite missing instruments you should have known it didnt have, and sampled in a way that you know will bother you. I personally think it's a very interesting decision to sample this way, and given the reasoning I think it's an interesting step. Especially from a mixing/mastering perspective it makes perfect sense why they'd do that.


Metal productions often re-inforced with samples that had 0 round robins forever... and the bit of variation is purely the bleed from the actual drum. That's why I think layering with another library for round robins is entirely possible.

Productions for decades would have been reinforced with one shot samples, or again - pieced together from the best "takes".

All that said, calling the product incomplete only makes sense if it released a product that didnt contain something it said it did. If for instance 2-3 patches were missing, or gave an error and made no sound, I'd say sure, it's incomplete. In this case - it has exactly what it says on the tin, you just wanted more than it said it had. Again, this is why despite not owning the library - I felt the need to correct the idiots who said this was a complete percussion solution. It's like they saw the word percussion and decide it would have everything from kalimba to quiros and glockenspeil???
 

erica-grace

Senior Member
There shouldn't be any choosing between Daniel James and Alan Myerson. One is a composer, who has developed three sample libraries, and contributed to a few others, and one is a recording and mixing engineer.

Two different fields. And I am sure AM did not say to Ollie and Jasper, "hey - let's organize the samples this way". I am sure it was Ollie and Jasper who said, "we want to organize the samples this way - Alan, record in such a way that wil make that happen, please."

Kinda funny you telling Alan Meyerson how to make a percussion library...

Nobody is telling Alan Meyerson how to make a percussion library, and I am not saying AM had 0 input, but decisions like mapping, RRs. which drums to use, performances, were not Alan's. That's the developer, not the hired engineer.
 

VinRice

... i am a robot ...
This is a great sounding library. I can't say that any perceived limitations have effected my usage of it in any way. My overriding impression is how well it sits in a track and how flexible the mic options are.
 

Ran Zhou

Member
This a very versatile product! There are a lot parts to dig in, but I just post my first impression on it.
The default sound (premix??What is the term?) can be shaped in any ways you can think of to reach your goal. Skills will be required and learning curve is steep for me as a beginner who is unfamiliar with processing percussion samples. Hey, if you are good at sound shaping, you won't regret about this flexibility provided.
To me, a short-cut is to directly load their presets designed according to Alan Meyerson's workflow. When I'm lazy, just load different mix presets, wah-lah, from intimate hit to epic boom. They are there.

Things I like about this lib:
1. Detailed instruments collection.
2. Alan Meyerson mix presets.
3. Easy control on dynamics (for arrangement mode) and traditional key mapping for performance mode
4. Flexibility on sound shaping
5. Student friendly

Things I think should be improved:
several points as be mentioned by NoamL in earlier pages like:
1. Easy switch between default mix and mix presets. Try to use snapshots might be an alternative? Or just generate a default preset, so we can load?
2. Order of patches in the folder. An rename of 1 ->01, 2->02 etc should solve this easily.
3. I got problems in master patches. Please either have the articulation labeled by words or have a figure in the GUI to show what articulates of those colored keys in future. I don't really think I'm going to remember the map purely based on colors.

Anyway, I think this is definitely a bang for my money this year. And thanks Ollie for the generosity of student discount on top of the current price. This is a great product!
 
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In.sight

New Member
You can at any time become a developer and create libraries how you think they should be done. If you think this one is incomplete, you can simply not buy. Kinda funny you telling Alan Meyerson how to make a percussion library...
It looks this post should be named from the beginning like "LA Modern Percussion With Alan Meyerson *INTRO PERIOD ENDS IN 1 WEEK!* (only positive feedbacks are allowed)" :2thumbs:

Why you so painfully accepting a critics ? :) Every member here is free to share the own experience with that library. And yes, it will be good if Alan will re-record this library from the beginning. Because it still incomplete as I said before ;)
 
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