A call to Sample Developers Spinoff - Mike Verta's mocking the seriousness of Coronanavirus

ProfoundSilence

Senior Member
t's better to let ProfoundSilence get his censorship complaints out of his system here
No complaints here really, Just appreciate the hesitation. Though you do bring up a good point about containment to one thread. More or less a cautionary discussion - and was in no way a criticism of how you're handling/planning on handling it.
 

Mike Fox

Button Masher
Closing threads is rarely a good idea, because then the topic, especially a hot topic like this one, invariably resurfaces in a new thread later. In this particular case and at this particular moment, for instance, it's better to let ProfoundSilence get his censorship complaints out of his system here, rather than let it fester, in which case I'd have to deal with it later. It's already in the Drama Zone, so other than tedium, I don't see any harm in letting the thread continue.

Bear in mind that my intention was not to end discussion. My only move was to put a stop to MaintainLowTone's repeating of provably false claims. I also made mention of homophobic and racist posts, but I should have clarified that those aren't in this thread. Those were just recent examples of why I'm thinking I should take a less tolerant stance on nonsense posts (for lack of a better term), even in the Drama Zone or Political section.
Thanks for your response.

I just need to learn to stay away from this part of the forum, as I don't think it generally brings out the best in people, including myself.

It's called the Drama Zone for a reason. ;)

Cheers.
 

ProfoundSilence

Senior Member
Thanks for your response.

I just need to learn to stay away from this part of the forum, as I don't think it generally brings out the best in people, including myself.

It's called the Drama Zone for a reason. ;)

Cheers.
yeah, its definitely not worth it... I get sucked in occasionally, but on a forum dedicated to virtual instruments by default you share atleast some common interests... and yet discussing political can ONLY cause you to lose relationships fostered over the craft itself. Sometimes I cant resist, but I almost always regret it.
 

chillbot

Sock Muppet
That desk had the worst GUI. Really I should post pics on the frankenstein job I did on the desk AFTER the desk :tm: it is held together with the spit of a dragonfly (possibly hummingbird who knows) and the rat that ate my golf cart. I have a very strong message to share with the youth of our world about the possible outcomes of mixing several bottles of (white) wine with power tools (no). Well at least jdiggity is still using it (no idea). Man v desk, we are just trying to outlast covid for a verdict.
 

NYC Composer

Senior Member
“After” titles are great. “After the Fall”, “AfterWorld”, “Afterlife” etc. Maybe you have something here:

“AFTER THE DESK-A GRAPHIC NOVEL”

No payment necessary, a simple credit will suffice.
 

chillbot

Sock Muppet
"The desk after the desk."

A horror story or redemption story (?) by chillbot. Associate possible non-executive production supervisor producer: NYC Composer.

Will work on it. The title alone gives me jitters.
 

Consona

Senior Member
Some new data on covid are in.

Guys, don't wear masks! Wear ffp2 or ffp3 respirators without a valve! Introduce some social distancing and wash your hands.
And don't listen to people who trivialize the problem.

• Patients with extremely MILD form of covid were tested 1-3 months after their recovery from the illness.
Around 90% of them had chronic complications of various forms, from shortness of breath to chronic fatigue.
Around 10-30% of them, even young people, had damaged heart, lungs, nervous system or kidneys in a nontrivial way!

One specific case mentioned was a 20-something tennis player girl, who had a very mild covid, now can't even climb stairs, after an examination they discovered her heart is in a state like being after a severe heartattack!
Search for "long covid".

• Undergoing covid gives you roughly 3-5 months immunity to it. Which means you can catch it and get sick multiple times in one year.
This also means there's no natural herd immunity to covid, that can happen only with a good enough vaccine.

• This coronavirus does not mutate as much as some other viruses, so getting a vaccine could be a huge deal, since it would protect without the need for researching new and new variations that would be effective.



• A thing some people don't understand is, the numbers grow exponentially.
One real example of what this means:
The first week you have on average 125 dead people in 1 day.
That's 250 in 2 weeks, 500 in 3 weeks, 1000 in 4 weeks, etc.!
That's why even basic hygiene, masks (preferably respirators ffp2 or ffp3) and social distancing help. It reduces the rapid growth once people are not getting infected.

• A huge problem with an outbreak is its effect on public health care. Not only the capacity cannot cover all the people who need help (any medical help!, not just covid cases) per se, but the hospital staff is exposed to very high concentrations of the virus in closed spaces of their hospitals. Even with extreme caution they become infected, and there's no qualified personnel to operate the medical devices, to take care of the ill.
So all it takes to be in a deep trouble is not infecting whole nations, but just a large enough number of the hospital stuff. And not even infect, those people are just people, they get exhausted, when there's a lockdown someone has to take care of their children, etc.


• So it doesn't matter the majority of people have mild covid and need no medical help. Once enough people get sick, those who need help over-saturate hospitals to the state any medical problem that needs treatment won't get any.
This of course depends on the country you live in. Health care capacities differ, but also, the bigger the population, the bigger the problem can become.
Remember, without restrictions, it all grows exponentially!

So be rational, and pay attention to math and the worrisome predictions (those are the predictions we don't want to come true), because due to the nature of the illness (the incubation period is 2-14 days, the sickness lasts for 2-5 weeks) the true nature of the situation today will be seen in 3 to 4 weeks!
You have to think in this time horizon, which is quite un-intuitive and a lot of people is not capable to switch to this mindset, even a lot of educated and otherwise intelligent people, as was shown in the past.
As always, better safe than sorry.
 
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Erick - BVA

Music is more than just color and rhythm
I'm not a Covid denier, but I think we need to find a way to live our "normal" lives whilst still dealing with the virus. I'm curious about places like Japan where not much was locked down, and the spread was minimal. I think we also need to consider the psychological and emotional impacts of perpetual lockdown, and the power of the mind to weaken us (and even lead to illness) when in a state of anxiety and fear.
My statement here is from a place of compassion and love. I am not the kind of person to wish ill on anyone, nor minimize a serious issue. But I think we need to consider all angles - consider experts from all aspects of life. Not just medical experts.

There was a study by the WHO I believe, where they found that the ramifications of the lock-down would lead to the death of millions of children worldwide, and would be worse than COVID itself.

If you're going to call me a covid denier or minimizer, that's your right. But I am merely trying to not ignore other factors involved in this, and looking at it as a broader issue, not just a medical issue.
I am actually stunned that some are so unwilling to question the approach we take to this.
I think one thing it does is make things seem more simple and manageable. However, it's not so cut and dry, or black and white. And the weight our actions carry on a nationwide and worldwide scale affect countless lives. Not questioning our methods of traversing this virus I think is one of the worst things we can do.
 

creativeforge

the plumber
Lots of health professionals have indicated there are issues with the PCR tests, with prolonged lockdowns, death counts directly attributable to Covid, the use of medications already existing including vitamins, the heavy toll on people mental health, and delayed or cancelled surgeries, etc. Look for the Barrington Declaration.

Not considering these realities, and how they got politicized, would be irresponsible, imho. Simply put: making right choices and washing our hands, and keeping our eyes on the ball for possible slippage into weirdness...

IMG_20201018_112802.jpg
 
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Consona

Senior Member
Could you share your sources for the figures and anecdotes? Besides "Covid long" I mean.

Thanks!
Asking for sources is the most reasonable thing to do. My bad I did not include them. The post was a digest from various articles I read during the last 2 months.

Some are here:

Of course, if my numbers or information are wrong, feel free to quote me and correct or update it.

I'm not a Covid denier, but I think we need to find a way to live our "normal" lives whilst still dealing with the virus. I'm curious about places like Japan where not much was locked down, and the spread was minimal. I think we also need to consider the psychological and emotional impacts of perpetual lockdown, and the power of the mind to weaken us (and even lead to illness) when in a state of anxiety and fear.
My statement here is from a place of compassion and love. I am not the kind of person to wish ill on anyone, nor minimize a serious issue. But I think we need to consider all angles - consider experts from all aspects of life. Not just medical experts.

There was a study by the WHO I believe, where they found that the ramifications of the lock-down would lead to the death of millions of children worldwide, and would be worse than COVID itself.

If you're going to call me a covid denier or minimizer, that's your right. But I am merely trying to not ignore other factors involved in this, and looking at it as a broader issue, not just a medical issue.
I am actually stunned that some are so unwilling to question the approach we take to this.
I think one thing it does is make things seem more simple and manageable. However, it's not so cut and dry, or black and white. And the weight our actions carry on a nationwide and worldwide scale affect countless lives. Not questioning our methods of traversing this virus I think is one of the worst things we can do.
I'm all for finding the most efficient and least stressful way to deal with covid and the virus.

Every post is just a part of the overall picture.

Covid lockdowns can cause problems in the future we did not expected at all. Yea, but if you don't have to do lockdowns, then you won't have those problems.
Of course now, when a lockdown is one of the options to deal with the current situation, we have to face these new moral, humanitarian, etc., questions.

→ One thing stays, wearing masks, washing your hands and seeing fewer people will help no matter what and can help tremendously, actually.
I'm talking about a "normal" first world situation, not living in a slum.


Some asian countries has dealt with covid really well, they had experience with SARS and MERS, but most importantly because people there abide all the necessary measures and they can understand sometimes government need to do things that restricts them in some way.
They know what they have to do to stop it. Meanwhile here, we have mass demonstrations against wearing masks!
People perpetually violate the rules government laid down, unless the police is near.
And even those rules are not strict enough and did not come in the right time.
 

Erick - BVA

Music is more than just color and rhythm
Asking for sources is the most reasonable thing to do. My bad I did not include them. The post was a digest from various articles I read during the last 2 months.

Some are here:

Of course, if my numbers or information are wrong, feel free to quote me and correct or update it.


I'm all for finding the most efficient and least stressful way to deal with covid and the virus.

Every post is just a part of the overall picture.

Covid lockdowns can cause problems in the future we did not expected at all. Yea, but if you don't have to do lockdowns, then you won't have those problems.
Of course now, when a lockdown is one of the options to deal with the current situation, we have to face these new moral, humanitarian, etc., questions.

→ One thing stays, wearing masks, washing your hands and seeing fewer people will help no matter what and can help tremendously, actually.
I'm talking about a "normal" first world situation, not living in a slum.


Some asian countries has dealt with covid really well, they had experience with SARS and MERS, but most importantly because people there abide all the necessary measures and they can understand sometimes government need to do things that restricts them in some way.
They know what they have to do to stop it. Meanwhile here, we have mass demonstrations against wearing masks!
People perpetually violate the rules government laid down, unless the police is near.
And even those rules are not strict enough and did not come in the right time.
Good points all around.
 

Consona

Senior Member
IMHO

the best we can do is:
- wear masks (preferably respirators ffp2 or ffp3)
- wash hands (meticulously with a soap for at least 30 seconds)
- disinfect things we touch a lot
- do social distancing!

until the vaccine comes


The one from Oxford looks very promising! If everything continues well, we can have it in 2 months.
 

Andrew Aversa

Lead Developer
@creativeforge the death count from COVID is, if anything, undercounted, according to broad studies of expected vs. actual death rates. Is that what you meant?

Or are you actually implying conspiratorial, anti-science nonsense like the kind peddled by InfoWars and Breitbart?

Per the Washington Post, regarding new European lockdowns:

“In the end, [a lockdown] is a failure of the recommendation of restricting people’s contacts,” Belgian state virologist Steven Van Gucht told the Brussels Times on Friday. “If that system fails, a lockdown is the only thing left.”
 

Gingerbread

Active Member
I'm curious about places like Japan where not much was locked down, and the spread was minimal.
As far as Japan goes, Japan is a society where mask-wearing for ANY illness (including just the common cold) is part of everyday life. When I visited 20 years ago, it was a curious sight to see so many people walking down the street wearing a mask! But they've done that for even the mildest illnesses for generations, so it was no "burden" for them to do it with Covid. Masks remain the #1 best defense against getting Covid.

I understand lockdown fatigue, but the alternative is worse--much worse. Frankly, the resistance to wearing masks and curtailing certain businesses is only prolonging this further. If, like New Zealand, we'd been more serious about it in the first place, and REALLY locked down properly for several months, we'd likely have been able to more fully open up now. But some people's "INFRINGIN' MUH FREEDUMBS!!" attitude is ironically only making it worse, and last longer.