The Music of 2001: A Space Odyssey (Video)
- Thread starter ashtongleckman
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Kyle Preston
I Think, Therefore I Ambient
Good stuff man, thank you for sharing your analysis! Amazing that everything, EVERYTHING, in this film still holds up so well 50 years later.
Maximvs
Senior Member
With all the outmost respect I have to all the composers music used in this film, not for Mr. Kubrick though...The original music composed by maestro Alex North, and outrageously discarded by Kubrick, is on a different league and was conceived specifically to work with the picture but at the same time stands on its own as well.
My two cents,
Max
My two cents,
Max
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ashtongleckman
Active Member
Paul T McGraw
Senior Member
Interesting @ashtongleckman thanks for posting this. And in a larger thank you, I really appreciate the videos you do helping all of us better understand film scores. Good job!
PeterN
ⵣ
Yea, great guy. Young, motivated and talented.
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Makes me think, I just wish technology was this advanced when I was sitting as 16 year old in front of piano and doing first compositions. No Youtube, no Mike Vertas, no Logic Pro not even Kontakt. Oh man, where would we be now if all this had been available when we were young.
Contrary to popular belief Mr. Kubrick decision to use other music that had been recorded for the film was not to save money since he already paid Alex North for his work. However, Mr. Kubrick never did told Alex that he was not going to use his music and Alex North only found this out during the movie premier. Totally different goals. I have the Jerry Goldsmith recording of the original Alex North score for the movie.
Maximvs
Senior Member
Exactly so... and this event created great grief to Alex North that staid with him for all of his life...
Maximvs
Senior Member
I respect your opinion but disagree with your statement. It was a different area of movie scoring and as you well know there are infinite ways to score a scene; even now a days ten composers will approach a movie or scene differently with various results which may work or not... in he end what may work for you may not do so for another.
Cheers, Max
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ashtongleckman
Active Member
Alex North made the film feel like it was a 60s movie. The classical music made it feel like it was a timeless movie. It added a weightlessness and eerieness to everything. North’s approach (while it was great musically) took away the mystery and told the viewer exactly what was happening, while the classical pieces ended up being more atmospheric, and left things more open to thought and interpretation.
I realize it might have been difficult for North, and I definitely think he should have been notified before the premiere (as rejected scores aren’t totally uncommon, but figuring out at the premiere is), but after listening to the original North soundtrack, I think Kubrick made the right decision going the other direction.
fixxer49
Bouncing Consultant
+1. 100%
charlieclouser
Senior Member
Yup. I also have the Alex North score, and it's... a movie score. It's okay I guess, but it doesn't feel iconic or timeless or anything.
The Darris
Senior Member
Yeah, I have to agree that North's original score was good music, it was just not the music this movie needed. But like Zimmer has said, you've not made it as a film composer until you've been fired and replaced. Alex North will certainly go down as a truly remarkable composer in my book so let's let his legacy speak for himself versus one gig that turned out to suck for him.
@ashtongleckman I am glad you made this video. It's one of my all time favorite movies and certainly an icon score. Kubrick was a master at placing existing music in his films better than any director in my opinion.
Cheers,
C
@ashtongleckman I am glad you made this video. It's one of my all time favorite movies and certainly an icon score. Kubrick was a master at placing existing music in his films better than any director in my opinion.
Cheers,
C
Bill the Lesser
Active Member
Well done piece Ashton! That movie launched me into my career for next 40 years.
But wait...fifty years old? FIFTY? Come on, didn't I just see this premier at the Warner on Sunset like maybe 10 years ago or something? And is something burning?
I dunno, all I could think of during the North piece was Miklós Rózsa's "Ben Hur" score from a decade previous, which is a fine piece of Hollywood scoring in its own right. Very different score than North's, but of the same genre.
But I have to say, those symphonic pieces rip "2001" right off the evolutionary moviescore timeline and put it somewhere no mainstream score of that time could possibly reach. The sunrise intro went from a very dramatic moment to a heart-pounding adrenaline rush, all thanks to Mr. Strauss's short and fast punches, while North's score took too much time to develop, which I suppose is not entirely his fault given the cut. And invoking recognition from quoting known classic pieces added a sort of evolutionary feel to the score in line with the theme of the script, and drew the audience more personally into the experience, since at that time many people still listened to classic music or at least knew what is was about. Known music comes from reality, made-for-movies music is from fantasy.
Bill
https://www.unit16.net
But wait...fifty years old? FIFTY? Come on, didn't I just see this premier at the Warner on Sunset like maybe 10 years ago or something? And is something burning?
I dunno, all I could think of during the North piece was Miklós Rózsa's "Ben Hur" score from a decade previous, which is a fine piece of Hollywood scoring in its own right. Very different score than North's, but of the same genre.
But I have to say, those symphonic pieces rip "2001" right off the evolutionary moviescore timeline and put it somewhere no mainstream score of that time could possibly reach. The sunrise intro went from a very dramatic moment to a heart-pounding adrenaline rush, all thanks to Mr. Strauss's short and fast punches, while North's score took too much time to develop, which I suppose is not entirely his fault given the cut. And invoking recognition from quoting known classic pieces added a sort of evolutionary feel to the score in line with the theme of the script, and drew the audience more personally into the experience, since at that time many people still listened to classic music or at least knew what is was about. Known music comes from reality, made-for-movies music is from fantasy.
Bill
https://www.unit16.net
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ashtongleckman
Active Member
I could only imagine that initial reaction in 1968 when people first saw this film! It’s so revolutionary, and not only broke boundaries in visual effects, and storytelling/direction, but also as you mention, it’s musical approach. I agree about Ben Hur. It’s an amazing score, and works so well for that film, which was also a tremendous film, but something about these classical pieces reinvented the way music is used in films. Helped to add that otherworldly quality that 2001 is so known and praised for.
The Alex North score didn’t match the film. It suited forbidden planet rather than the weird odyssey that became a classic master piece. No strings attached to floppy spaceships. The film techniques used it weren’t used again until the advent of Star Wars. I believe George Lucas asked Kubrick how it was done. The classical music itself was just pure coincidenc. When cutting the scene from the transition from the bone to warships in orbit around the planet the crew who edited had been listening to the beautiful blue Danube and when finished the crew had assumed that is what Kubrick wanted and he said no. So the matched the music to scene and it worked. The Ligeti pieces were actually used without the composer’s permission. When Ligeti fled to the west the first film he saw was 2001 and was shocked to hear his requiem and atmospheres in the original soundtrack. The Hungarian communists sold their people short by taking the profits from composers by selling the works as though the composer had agreed. I believe Ligeti was eventually paid the proper fee by Kubrick when he heard what had happene. I have heard the fanfare to 2001 by North and it is brash. Strauss’ thus spake is a better choice for the opening.
Markrs
Complete Beginner
Just had a check and Ligeti composed all the music used in 2001 (Atmosphères (1961), Lux Aeterna (1966), Requiem (1965) and Aventures (1962)) after he had emigrated to Austria in 1956, so nothing was paid to Hungarian govenment. Simply put Kubrick and the film studio just failed to license the use and alteration of his music. Ligeti sued them, and it was settled out of court.
Wow ... One of my favorite films, and soundtracks of all times.
Anyhow I admit I never heard or knew about the North score.
(I should really study some extra film soundtrack history....)
Must have been a tragedy on a personal level, I would have kicked myself to discover this at the premier...
Anyhow his score, although beautiful, made the movie become "Ben Hur in Space" to my ears, so Mr. Kubrik did the right choice I believe.
Anyhow I admit I never heard or knew about the North score.
(I should really study some extra film soundtrack history....)
Must have been a tragedy on a personal level, I would have kicked myself to discover this at the premier...
Anyhow his score, although beautiful, made the movie become "Ben Hur in Space" to my ears, so Mr. Kubrik did the right choice I believe.
