Spitfire Westworld - Winner Announced!

[fish_hoof]

I said it before and I’ll say it again. Opinions are like butt holes... we all have one.

Time to turn the page and keep moving forward all. I have my thoughts, but at the end of the day, the only thing I can control is writing music I enjoy and let the chips fall where they may. People should be proud of what they wrote for this, there was some dang good stuff. So lets all keep practicing cause someone has to replace replace HZ, Williams, Sylvesti, Newman, etc.

I would love to be one of those guys that takes the torch, which is one of many reasons I keep practicing. If that never happens, I’ve at least enjoyed writing music for my life, impacting others in the projects I do get and keep getting better. Win win.

 

[Dirtgrain]

Congratulations to the winner. I hope this opens up some doors for you.

I liked a lot of the winning entry. The opening is great: soft sounds and then that weaaoorr sound to the orchestral stuff.

Like some others, I did not see how the chiptune fit, especially at the "point and shoot" part and after he fires the missile (there it felt like Loony Tunes or something). My reaction initially was pretty strong against it, thinking how could it win. But I don't watch the show. Maybe this fits how it is sometimes scored? And one can't assume the other entries were better. At least he went radical reflecting the genre change. The Westworld movie from back in the day had robotic cowboys at a theme park, right? Maybe chiptune is a nice nod to that.

I am concerned about the drastic reactions and them having to shut down their social media chat. I was hoping they would do more such competitions (I didn't do this one--took me too long to figure out how to set up Ableton to play the video).

 

[Michaelt]

Go away from my YouTube window
Leave at your own chosen speed
I'm not the one you want, JJ
I'm not the one you need

You say you're lookin' for someone
Who's never meek but always bold
Someone to tell your story
But who’ll also break the mold
Somebody who ain’t gonna make you snore,
But it ain't me, JJ
No, no, no, it ain't me, JJ
It ain't me you're lookin' for, JJ

Go lightly from this tab, JJ
To others you have found
I'm not the one you want, JJ
I will only let you down

You say you're lookin' for someone
Who’s got music right at the start
Someone to change the genre for you
Someone who’s off the chart
Someone who’ll get a smile from you and more
But it ain't me, JJ
No, no, no, it ain't me JJ
It ain't me you're lookin' for, JJ

(last verse is a little too vindictive to adapt in good fun)

Lighten up, everybody!

 

[Dewdman42]

Congratulations David! Well done! I didn't particularly love the game music myself...but I did love the music leading up to it which I feel respresented the tone and theme of the story better then any of the runners up. They wanted inventiveness and you delivered that in spades... Sometimes ya just gotta be different. I mean if they got 10,999 entries that all sounded like people trying to mimic hanz zimmer, how do you choose?

 

[rt09]

The question at the heart of this for me is very simple:

Was this reaction avoidable *while having the exact same winner* or was this always inevitable?

If one argues the latter, I think one makes a sweeping derisory statement about a huge swathe of participants. To me that is a riskier proposition and I would not feel informed enough to draw that judgement, it requires many more assumptions. I choose Occam's Razor and go with the former.

 

[Will Wilson]

I really enjoyed the track. It really did stand apart. I got bored of listening to submissions, they all started to sound the same but this one really stood out.

Well done.

This whole thing has become far to salty though. As Hans said. This isn’t a job. It’s a calling.

 

[ThomCSounds]

Hi, I am an old fart. But I haven’t lost the passion of writing scores or inventing new sounds and bits of technology for my music. But I so agree with everything I’ve read in your post above. The road of rejection teaches you nothing. It makes you hard and cynical - the antithesis to music. Nor does too much applause. I’ve got my Oscar. It didn’t make me a better composer, or change my career. Just for one night I could be insane and giddy and think it was all relevant. it was fun, but that’s it. ...who can even remember who won for what last year or the year before?
I know everyone involved with the competition - not the composers, but I’m old enough to have worked for J.J.‘s father, and actually done a film with him. And we’re both synth geeks. Ramin really got his start with me, and met the Nolan’s through our working together - which - through his enormous talent - led directly to “Westworld”. The “Spitfire” guys I consider as personal friends and more than once have we helped each other out. ...so, why am I writing this? Just to name -drop? No, actually I secretly stayed away from listening to anything that was being submitted. I thought - once the dust settles, there will be an amazing amount of music and talent that should be recognized and given an opportunity at furthering their careers. I’ve done that a lot. I don’t think that Harry G-H, or John Powell, Lorne Balfe or JunkieXL and Ben Wallfisch - as just a few examples, will think of me holding them back in forging their careers. Our whole ”Blue Planet” and all the other things ‘Bleeding Fingers’ does comes from the idea that there is an unbelievable pool of talent out there that should be given a chance.
But then I started to read the comments and the bitterness and bitchyness in most of the responses to the winner (whom I’ve never met or heard off). And I thought, why even bother with this lot. They’ve already lost. They think music is a business when it’s a passion, they forget that putting hours or days in, is a luxury you’ll never have again when you’re on a deadline on a ‘proper’ job...
but, mostly, it’s the lack of respect for someone’s moment of joy - where they should be celebrated - that got me.
so - carry on with your uninformed small minded criticism. it’s all here now in black and white for ever. The beauty of the internet. And as a reference of how i wouldn’t ever want to work with a single one of you. Nor you with me. Bad fit. It doesn’t even ever matter how good your music is or how smart you are... And since music and film-making are inherently collaborative, I can’t really see how any director will want to deal with that amount of entitlement and hubris.
hz

I like what you said about the fact of doing music day in and day out being a luxury. It reminds me of this great quote by Jose Mujica criticising our modern way of living :

"When I buy something, when you buy something, you are not paying money for it.
You are paying with the hours of life you had to spend earning that money.

The difference is that life is one thing money can’t buy.
Life only gets shorter. And it is pitiful to waste one’s life and freedom that way."

 

[Zedcars]

It seems that all but creative inventiveness was thrown aside in the judging process

I believe this is what everybody has a problem with, which has absolutely nothing to do with the music itself which was musically fantastic as nobody is trashing the piece (or I hope they wouldn't as it truly is a great piece), they're just asking why it was picked when it...

adds no emotion to the scene it was scoring,

...it doesn't enhance the viewing experience

...nor does it add to the story,

...it's completely jarring to the scene being played with it.

See now, my opinion is different to yours. For me it did all of those things and I didn’t really find it jarring, just unusual. The emotion, for me, was a mixture of nostalgia for 80s video games (which I lived through), humour (made me smile and laugh), and a sense of playfulness, creativity and intelligence.

My viewing experience was most certainly enhanced which kind of ties into the emotions I felt. Definitely more fun than the tired old music that usually get dialled in with this kind of cue.

It adds to the story because he took a genre changing pill, and so the story was enhanced by the music and it took you somewhere slightly left field.

This idea that an opinion about art is the right one because it is your own, or it is most popular, or it is only valid if it falls within narrow artificially constructed parameters of what is good and bad is bogus. Subjective opinions reign supreme here over and above the objective arguments about what is a good cue and what is a bad cue. And those subjective opinions are the judges alone.

[Edited for spelling mistake]

 

[Mike Greene]

Obviously it must have worked for the judges, but it clearly didn't connect for a massive amount of the viewership.

So I guess you're more of a People's Choice guy than a Grammys guy?

Seems to me a whole lot of people liked David's submission. I sure did. I could see going either way on whether the winner should have been this or something more traditional, and lo and behold, that's reflected in the runners up. (The complaint on why the runners up were not also quirky is silly, as if the judges have only one dimension.)

Why was adding some 8 bit sounds over some of the score deemed the most creative idea ...

This notion that all David did was to add some 8 bit stuff is what bugs me the most with some of the comments I'm reading. Watch that score carefully and you'll see that what he did was waaayyy deeper than just his 8 bit idea. In fact, I'll bet there were other entires that attempted an 8 bit direction, but were dismissed by the judges because they didn't work.

David's score went way beyond "adding some 8 bit sounds." My hat's off to the craft that went into it. Craft on all levels, not just the 8 bit elements. If I had a time machine and go back and submit an entry like David's, knowing the judges would be impressed by it, I would still lose, simply because he did it so damn well. I still keep finding, "Whoa, I didn't notice that before!" moments in there.

One last thought - Although we keep referring to this as "The 8 Bit Score," most any director sees beyond that, and not to jinx anything, but I'll bet something comes of it for David. No director is looking for 8 bit scores, of course (a lot of people take all this way too literally), but they are looking for inventiveness, combined with clear legit compositional skills. This is why Tim Burton hired Danny Elfman. He wasn't looking for Oingo Boingo music, he was looking for the imagination that Elfman has in spades. Burton already has Elfman, of course, and JJ Abrams already has Giacchino, but I'll bet some rising director or TV producer sees this and David's resume goes a lot higher on the stack than mine does.

But again, I don't want to jinx anything ...

 

[Cathbad]

I thought - once the dust settles, there will be an amazing amount of music and talent that should be recognized and given an opportunity at furthering their careers.

That's how I'd prefer to see these competitions: a chance to swap favourites and discover new music and musicians. Especially since we can't all go through 11k views.

I liked this version from Mark Petrie, who I'd not heard of but is a successful Kiwi composer mainly of trailer music.


Stuff I like
- very exciting and thrilling
- the synth ticking away in the texture keeps the tension up and adds a sense of speed to the cars
- it's very well paced and synchronised with the picture
- the harmonies support the visuals sympathetically (1:13)
- the brass writing and harmonic language have a grandeur to them that reminds me of Wagner (2:20)
- the sound design elements add a feeling of menace
- I like the way he also scored the W logo at the end

 

[Beluga]

Indeed. For example someone just posted this in another thread:



If some rule breaking/bending was allowed and they wanted something comedic and entertaining that one ^ is surely a million times more hilarious/different/bold .

Totally with you here! If the selection is so random and „outside of the box“ why not make this guy the winner. That was outlandish good and funny. Masterpiece! :D

 

[Giudan]

<DELETED>

 

[Mark Evans]

Totally with you here! If the selection is so random and „outside of the box“ why not make this guy the winner. That was outlandish good and funny. Masterpiece! :D

Sigh. It may indeed be very funny but the number of subtitles floating around definitely disqualifies it on the 'mucking about with the clip' rule, however you slice it.

 

[asherpope]

Marketing experience gone terribly wrong. Rather than attracting thousands of potential customers it pissed them off. Will need some new clever marketing to straighten that out. I’m sure they will figure it out.

I'm guessing a lot of these disgruntled folks don't even use Spitfire products "this isn't EPIC enough!"

 

[Michael Stibor]

Sigh. It may indeed be very funny but the number of subtitles floating around definitely disqualifies it on the 'mucking about with the clip' rule, however you slice it.

Yeah, but they could’ve fudged a few rules if they wanted to. They’ve done it before.

 

[Beluga]

Sigh. It may indeed be very funny but the number of subtitles floating around definitely disqualifies it on the 'mucking about with the clip' rule, however you slice it.

Yeah I know but I still watched it 4 times already! I don’t think anyone should pick on the winner anyway he did his best and won. Good for him! I believe the request about rules and technicalities are legit though and should not be put into the „whining loser category“. It’s not enough to say grow up that’s how the business works. On the other hand IF there is nepotism involved this IS how the business works and this would indeed be a lesson for all participants and one every composer will eventually make.

 

[Cathbad]

Does anyone know of a Bollywood Bhangra version?

I'd like to see that.

 

[Rasoul Morteza]

Artistic hooliganism at its best with little sign of humility.

As someone whose considerable part of youth was wasted in one of the worst 3rd world countries to be living right now, I know how easy it is for competition and rivalry to turn into a toxic free for all elimination, when people set themselves on survival mode that is. Do not ever underestimate the mental struggle of one when singled out, like what many did to David.

I was there when they presented the winners. I saw what happened in the live chat when they announced the top contenders. Here is just one comment someone posted on David’s video:

“Too bad i didnt win. I submitted 4 min of silence! Definitely more unique than this !”

Then the composer hooligans repeatedly claimed that many submissions were not listened to, whilst Paul and others repeatedly said, before and after, that every submission is listened to in its entirety. Nevertheless the claims persisted. That’s called accusing someone of lying, and it’s very easy doing so in this modern age. Some are truly out of their minds.

And what good is brought forth when some flock to his IMDB profile spreading rumors about the whole process being rigged.

But the online composer hooligans kept going. And I understand there are some who are trying to discuss the results in a civil manner, and regardless of who’s right or wrong, or if the winners deserved it or not, I wonder, why all of this trouble? Do you expect some form of justice in a contest like this? If Spitfire announces another winner right now, how would that make you feel and what would you make of that feeling of yours? Is it healthy?

And how hard is it for some to sum up their view points in a post or two rather than going on for eternity… There’s no reason to ruin your own argument by attacking it, simply defend it poorly.

If anything, which is something I just did, is to ask the team behind the contest for feedback if they have written notes. Try to perfect your craft to the point where all admire it, otherwise it is futile to throw away precious time convincing everyone that somehow you are right. Co-existence of ideas could be a valid idea.

The world doesn’t operate the way you want it to, and there is no other option but to keep striving with humility, and I know many know this but yet they do not practice it. From someone who has recently shifted away from science and engineering into this domain of media composition, I must say, the culture isn’t very pleasant when you hear people express themselves immaturely. For those aware of some baroque history, work on your craft as if you were to end up like Bach.

Cheers

 

[asherpope]

I didn't enter so I don't have a dog in the fight, but here's a suggestion for Spitfire: take a leaf out of OT's book and offer a small prize to all participants, and a store voucher.

Everyone comes away with more than they brought. Entrants get the new Triple Felt GamechangingBoy library with 109 articulations and 27 mic positions (terrible legato on the D-Pad, though). Spitfire gets some goodwill and new customers

Yeah I guess LABS and Christian's Pianobook aren't enough.

 

[Michael Stibor]

Artistic hooliganism at its best with little sign of humility.

As someone whose considerable part of youth was wasted in one of the worst 3rd world countries to be living right now, I know how easy it is for competition and rivalry to turn into a toxic free for all elimination, when people set themselves on survival mode that is. Do not ever underestimate the mental struggle of one when singled out, like what many did to David.

I was there when they presented the winners. I saw what happened in the live chat when they announced the top contenders. Here is just one comment someone posted on David’s video:

“Too bad i didnt win. I submitted 4 min of silence! Definitely more unique than this !”

Then the composer hooligans repeatedly claimed that many submissions were not listened to, whilst Paul and others repeatedly said, before and after, that every submission is listened to in its entirety. Nevertheless the claims persisted. That’s called accusing someone of lying, and it’s very easy doing so in this modern age. Some are truly out of their minds.

And what good is brought forth when some flock to his IMDB profile spreading rumors about the whole process being rigged.

But the online composer hooligans kept going. And I understand there are some who are trying to discuss the results in a civil manner, and regardless of who’s right or wrong, or if the winners deserved it or not, I wonder, why all of this trouble? Do you expect some form of justice in a contest like this? If Spitfire announces another winner right now, how would that make you feel and what would you make of that feeling of yours? Is it healthy?

And how hard is it for some to sum up their view points in a post or two rather than going on for eternity… There’s no reason to ruin your own argument by attacking it, simply defend it poorly.

If anything, which is something I just did, is to ask the team behind the contest for feedback if they have written notes. Try to perfect your craft to the point where all admire it, otherwise it is futile to throw away precious time convincing everyone that somehow you are right. Co-existence of ideas could be a valid idea.

The world doesn’t operate the way you want it to, and there is no other option but to keep striving with humility, and I know many know this but yet they do not practice it. From someone who has recently shifted away from science and engineering into this domain of media composition, I must say, the culture isn’t very pleasant when you hear people express themselves immaturely. For those aware of some baroque history, work on your craft as if you were to end up like Bach.

Cheers

But where did this happen? On YouTube? I feel that the conversation here has been very respectful so I think it’s important to make a distinction from the usual garbage that is the YouTube comments section, and a healthy discussion among adults here.

And nothing was said that was any worse than Christian’s own remarks here. And even then, who’s offended? At this point, the dust is settling, everyone has gone home, and there’s just us stragglers here talking about this. And why not? It IS after all, a discussion forum. It makes sense for us to discuss the contest results. So long as it’s kept in a respectful manner, go for it.