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SPITFIRE - Spitfire Solo Strings NEW Virtuoso Violin Total Performance Patch

Alex Niedt said:
Are you having trouble with the legatos altogether, or just on fast passages? If you have trouble with even the slower legato and find my demo (posted above) any better than what you're able to achieve, I'd be glad to describe how I work with it.


Thank you very much! Do you have any particular things you'd like to know about how I handled the MIDI that I could simply explain here for the benefit of anyone interested?
Click to expand...
Thanks for your offer. Maybe I don't understand the whole concept of the palettes. My main issues:1) the transitions in the longs in all the combined articulation palettes sound unnatural and tin like.(of course in the single articulation as well).
It does not matter if the tempo is slow or fast although it will get worse at faster tempos. Starting at low dynamics there is this "scratchy attack bump" in the beginning which sounds just fake to my ears. This will get more prominent and more disturbing as I increase the dynamic slider. How I can create a credible long legato line using the palette sounds of the respective violins and other instruments?
2)The (performance?) legatos are much better but it just sounds weird if I try to play a faster line no matter at which dynamic level. Also if I try a trill manually this will result in volume drop as if the engine cannot keep up with required speed. I agree that in a contextual placement this could probably all be hidden but again I would love to have a nice real SOLO performance.[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]
 
So, any more insight with this one?
I am still on the fence about upgrading, and I haven´t heard a single long legato lyrical line that shows what it can do...
 
Pablocrespo said:
So, any more insight with this one?
I am still on the fence about upgrading, and I haven´t heard a single long legato lyrical line that shows what it can do...
Click to expand...
If my legato demo doesn't do it for you, could you post an example of exactly the type of thing you'd like to hear? Maybe someone could cook something up for you.
 
a long violin or cello line, your legato demo is beautiful, but I was thinking more of a Schindler´s List kind of melody.

I don´t think this library can handle something like JNH "the village" but that would be a good measure too.

Just long connected melodies playing solo.

Thanks!
 
GuitarG said:
Couldn´t help myself to record a quick play along over the first part of the original Schindler´s list theme.
This is using only the Violin Legato Patch using close and tree mics and a tad of Valhalla room
The SsS Violin is panned hard left.
Really having fun using this library, it sounds really good to my ears.
Suppose the performance could be improved with some more detailed midi editing, but I hope I do it justice anyway

https://rcrft.co/reel/GiscardRasquin/SsSViolin
Click to expand...


Hey Pablo,

Here’s me playing along with Schindler’s List with the SSS violin legato patch
Some people were asking for a stand-alone version, which I’ll try to upload in the next couple of days
 
Thanks, I have listened that and it sounds good! but I need something more exposed to make the choice before the presale ends.
 
Pablocrespo said:
Thanks, I have listened that and it sounds good! but I need something more exposed to make the choice before the presale ends.
Click to expand...

Got some free time in the next couple of days so should be able to upload that piece without the original recording. I’ll let you know when it’s online
 
So I´ve included now the SsS Violin legato recording on it´s own. As I mentioned before, this was a quick play along so I suppose it could benefit from some more detailed editing but I hope it´s gives an idea of how it sounds by itself. Bit of unfortunate timing at some points of the re-bowing which I tried to get rid of by playing softer but that didn´t seem to help so if somebody knows how to deal with that in a better way, I´m all ears!
Anyway, here it is:

https://rcrft.co/reel/GiscardRasquin/SsSViolin
 
B.Karloff said:
Thanks for your offer. Maybe I don't understand the whole concept of the palettes. My main issues:1) the transitions in the longs in all the combined articulation palettes sound unnatural and tin like.(of course in the single articulation as well).
It does not matter if the tempo is slow or fast although it will get worse at faster tempos. Starting at low dynamics there is this "scratchy attack bump" in the beginning which sounds just fake to my ears. This will get more prominent and more disturbing as I increase the dynamic slider. How I can create a credible long legato line using the palette sounds of the respective violins and other instruments?
2)The (performance?) legatos are much better but it just sounds weird if I try to play a faster line no matter at which dynamic level. Also if I try a trill manually this will result in volume drop as if the engine cannot keep up with required speed. I agree that in a contextual placement this could probably all be hidden but again I would love to have a nice real SOLO performance.
Click to expand...
[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

Perhaps I'm misreading your post but are you trying to get legato transitions from the basic long articulations? You're not going to be able to get a credible long legato line (especially at fast tempos) if you're trying using articulations that don't have recorded transitions.

With respect to the performance legatos (which ARE designed for legato lines) there is going to be a limit at which any library will fail. For example, I don't know of any solo library outside of sample modeling that can effectively perform a trill within a generic monophonic legato patch. That's why they have separately recorded trills.
 
prodigalson said:
For example, I don't know of any solo library outside of sample modeling that can effectively perform a trill within a generic monophonic legato patch. That's why they have separately recorded trills.
Click to expand...

Actually a certain other burnt wood named dev library named after a campanologist can do it.
 
GuitarG said:
Hey Pablo,

Here’s me playing along with Schindler’s List with the SSS violin legato patch
Some people were asking for a stand-alone version, which I’ll try to upload in the next couple of days
Click to expand...

I'm still not quite sold on the sound of SSS, as I like it with certain pieces, but others not so much. I just don't know which way to go with it, but regardless, great job on the piece. :)
 
Alex Niedt said:
Do you have any particular things you'd like to know about how I handled the MIDI that I could simply explain here for the benefit of anyone interested?
Click to expand...

I've been thinking about this. And yes, any insight you'd care to share would be very welcome (up to and including an 15 hour scoreclub style lecture series on how to create compositions like that :) )


Trying to be concrete, I'd love to hear your thoughts on managing the vibrato transitions, and what articulations you're using (sul pont?), how much you had to tweak the crossfades between the dynamic layers.

But in general, I think you've really hit a sweet spot of this library. This library has of course quite a number of sweet spots, but I think, for this particular sweet spot, you've perhaps managed to capture it more than anything else I've heard to date.

So at risk of being a bit vague, I'd be interested if you might care to share insights on how you approached composition with regards to the inherent strengths of this library. You're mixing the longs and the legatos (to great effect). And managed to get a certain sweetness out the violin. And it all comes out as ... well more than the sum of its parts ...

... as I said ... maybe that's a bit vague. But again, this is a library that repays investment in understanding its nuances (and conversely , is unforgiving to anyone who would just copy and paste midi data from the internet). And I think its unlikely that you've got that quality of result by just written on paper and transcribed it into Sibelius without any though to the nuances of the library ..

.. so basically any insight you'd care to share would be very welcome.


Although maybe we could start a new thread to focus on this kind of nuance over the more general conversation?

Thanks!
 
Crossposting from the new BDT thread, another bit of noodling...

The point here being to see how well SsS servers at adding some fine detail to more textural/ambient background layer. The uses 4 solo violin patches here, 1 from BDT, the rest from SsS, and occasional bits of Tundra and Olafur Chamber evos.



And I think I would conclude from this experiment that a real sweet spot of SsS is the kind of delicate, but well defined foreground layer - which can really rescue a composition that ,however gorgeous it's textural soundscapes, risks descend into ambient mush.

Add a touch of counterpoint in this layer and we're on the road the chamber music end of the neoclassic spectrum. And that is where I really expect things to get interesting.
 
'New Thread' _ Hope not, as this has been instructive and helpful. Now just past Intro price deadline.
Even as neophyte in orchestral domain, this has been a perplexing SF product, with notable strengths, and specific 'weaknesses' for some capable Users.
Quite surprised, and will now wait for expected updates and 2018 holiday promotions. Focus is on Solo, and permanent deletion of its predecessor.
I was so anticipating this product and now in a sort of limbo …..
 
Even with the few shortcomings some folks have mentioned and the sale deadline over, I might still take the plunge on this shortly if only for the Air-factor. Though Sacconni is beautifully sampled, I've never been able to get it to fit well on top of the other SSO libs because of the Wigmore sound (plus this price point is much better than what I paid for Sacconi - not sure why this one is so much cheaper but I'll leave that economical conundrum in Senior Thomson's head). You simply can't beat a bit of Lyndhurst.
 
sostenuto said:
'New Thread' _ Hope not, as this has been instructive and helpful. Now just past Intro price deadline.
Even as neophyte in orchestral domain, this has been a perplexing SF product, with notable strengths, and specific 'weaknesses' for some capable Users.
Quite surprised, and will now wait for expected updates and 2018 holiday promotions. Focus is on Solo, and permanent deletion of its predecessor.
I was so anticipating this product and now in a sort of limbo …..
Click to expand...
^^^ What he said...

I'm all in with Spitfire products but this one just seems a bit more of a challenge to tame than my skills can muster at this time...

we'll see what the Holiday season brings...
 
[/QUOTE]

"Perhaps I'm misreading your post but are you trying to get legato transitions from the basic long articulations? You're not going to be able to get a credible long legato line (especially at fast tempos) if you're trying using articulations that don't have recorded transitions.

With respect to the performance legatos (which ARE designed for legato lines) there is going to be a limit at which any library will fail. For example, I don't know of any solo library outside of sample modeling that can effectively perform a trill within a generic monophonic legato patch. That's why they have separately recorded trills."


Sorry to reply a little delayed...I think I understand what you're saying. The longs are just longs with NO script for inserting any recorded transitions which on the other hand DO get utilized in the performance legatos.
Now my question is: what is the use of these "raw" long articulations if I cannot play consecutive long notes which have convincing transition connections?
Shouldn't then there be a performance legato for that purpose for EVERY instrument including the bass? Maybe I'm missing something again, any clarification would be appreciated.
 
B.Karloff said:
Sorry to reply a little delayed...I think I understand what you're saying. The longs are just longs with NO script for inserting any recorded transitions which on the other hand DO get utilized in the performance legatos.
Now my question is: what is the use of these "raw" long articulations if I cannot play consecutive long notes which have convincing transition connections?
Shouldn't then there be a performance legato for that purpose for EVERY instrument including the bass? Maybe I'm missing something again, any clarification would be appreciated.
Click to expand...

well there are a variety of reasons to use basic long articulations. 1) instruments with prerecorded transitions are more resource hungry so in large templates having every long articulation be "true legato" would be undesirable and unrealistic. 2) In many cases, when writing less polyphonic or intricate music a patch that is not monophonic and can be played more than one note at a time is more desirable. 3) this is arguable but many composers don't believe true legato is all it's hyped up to be.

With regard to your second question, I believe SF simply decided true legato on the bass was less necessary than on the other instruments. With bass, basic long articulations can get you far enough.
 
you don't have to have legato transitions in order to Play legato - in many cases no Transition is better than a not convincing transition. you just have to know how to make best use of the dynamic crosfading since the attacks in lower dynamic layers are less sudden and hard. There are no Performance legatos in Spitfire solo strings. there only are legato Patches with Velocity switched Transition types. These should be used with care - you don't want the Portamento too often and in many cases the fingered legato might not match the required Speed for quicker melodies. Spitfire never did scripted legato, only true legato which they decided not to do on every Instrument for every Long articulation. If I am not mistaken 'Performance legato' Patches in the Spitfire universe mean that there is Kind-of-intelligent switching even to short articulations and timestretching legato transitions, but I'm not shure About that since I don't have any library that includes Performance legatos. In order to get a convincing expressive solo line you are supposed to switch between different articulations anyway. that's been the case since forever and that won't be changing anytime soon with the Kinds of libraries in which you can Control almost anything with midi CCs.
 
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